Speaker 1: Hi, Steve Fishman here, creator of The Burden as well
Speaker 1: as the number one true crime podcast, My Friend The
Speaker 1: Serial Killer. For those of you who liked The Burden,
Speaker 1: I have good news. Season two starts August seventh. It's
Speaker 1: a series called The Burden Empire on Blood and it's
Speaker 1: the director's cut of the true crime classic Empire on Blood,
Speaker 1: which reached number one on the charts when it debuted
Speaker 1: half a dozen years ago. Then the fat cat funders
Speaker 1: abandon it. I wrangled it back and now I'm thrilled
Speaker 1: to share this story of a man who fought the
Speaker 1: law for two decades, fought against the Bronx's top homicide
Speaker 1: prosecutor and a detective sometimes known as the Louis Scarcela
Speaker 1: of the Bronx. It's all coming to you August seventh,
Speaker 1: wherever you get your podcasts.
Speaker 2: Previously on The Burden.
Speaker 3: So the judge said it right there, somebody's planning on
Speaker 3: corner Scarsella.
Speaker 4: And he made that decision that I did, which is preposterous.
Speaker 2: Holy shit.
Speaker 1: We won.
Speaker 5: I'm sure in Derek fifty five report in the bottom
Speaker 5: of this that has Detective Scarseller Lewis Scarseller.
Speaker 6: I can't run off in the sunset. I get the
Speaker 6: souls left behind, right, I know nothing? Who was innocent?
Speaker 5: You can't tell me, isn't you gotta be serious there,
Speaker 5: there's no games here. This is freedom here.
Speaker 6: I look forward, whooping yell ass in court.
Speaker 1: The floodgates had opened. Many of those convicted, with the
Speaker 1: help of Detective Scarcella, were back in court. They wanted
Speaker 1: their convictions overturned. In each hearing, Scarcella testified, and in
Speaker 1: each hearing Derek Hamilton sat quietly in the back of
Speaker 1: the courtroom until one day in twenty sixteen.
Speaker 6: I was very upset when I came to the courtroom
Speaker 6: that day and he was sitting in there like he
Speaker 6: was a star. He was proud of who he was
Speaker 6: as a detective.
Speaker 7: He way, hey, Bob and Joe and now like all
Speaker 7: his friends were here and this was a joke. I
Speaker 7: went up to a massine, why the fuck did he
Speaker 7: framed me for this murder? And he said, this is
Speaker 7: not the place, not now.
Speaker 6: What is the fucking done? If I ever could have
Speaker 6: killed the man? That was the day.
Speaker 1: Scarcella's attorneys hustled Louis out of harm's way, But a
Speaker 1: blow of a different sort did land on Scarsella. This
Speaker 1: one came from the judge in the case.
Speaker 2: That judge's decision contained a scathing attack on Scarcella, his
Speaker 2: police work, his attitude, his morals. Judge Sean Dia Simpson
Speaker 2: trashed him personally. He showed no ris expect for the rules.
Speaker 2: She wrote.
Speaker 8: Scarcela has been regarded as a legend in the NYPD
Speaker 8: for his number of homicide arrests, and there is a saying,
Speaker 8: when it's too good to be true, it usually is.
Speaker 2: Then came the hearing to free one of Derek's closest
Speaker 2: friends and one of those supposed victims of Scarcella, an
Speaker 2: AI team law partner named Nelson Cruz.
Speaker 5: Derrick. He always told me before he went home, He's
Speaker 5: telling me, listen, don't worry about it. I'm gonna comfort you.
Speaker 5: Trust me. He kept telling me that I'm gonna comf
Speaker 5: for you. When I make it home, I'm gonna come
Speaker 5: for you.
Speaker 9: He kept his.
Speaker 5: Words, and he's here if I need anything, he's there.
Speaker 5: And she got me while I'm at today. I'm in
Speaker 5: court today with my case. Hopefully I'm hoping to go
Speaker 5: home in a week.
Speaker 1: Nelson may have good reason to be optimistic. Guess who
Speaker 1: the judge is in his case.
Speaker 2: That's right, Judge seande As Simpson.
Speaker 10: I'm a sinner, baby, I'm all the power you need
Speaker 10: now I'm out of the bottom.
Speaker 2: I'm gonna set you free.
Speaker 1: Welcome to the burden. I'm Steve Fishman.
Speaker 2: And I'm DA's Devin Ross. In this episode, judgment.
Speaker 9: Nobody's got any fucking balls.
Speaker 11: Nobody we knew something was wrong in that damn courtroom.
Speaker 9: Murder literally pays.
Speaker 5: I've been fighting for my freedom for the longer. Dinner
Speaker 5: with a lot of people.
Speaker 9: She destroyed me on three cases.
Speaker 12: Never never, never, never count your chickens before they atch.
Speaker 2: You gotta hold all time.
Speaker 1: Judge on Dia Simpson's decision had changed everything. She'd concluded
Speaker 1: that Scarcella's investigative practices were corrupt. This was a huge deal.
Speaker 1: Now all a convicted person had to do is proof
Speaker 1: Scarcela had played a meaningful role in the investigation, and
Speaker 1: then their conviction could be thrown out.
Speaker 2: The appeals court upheld her decision, and that meant the
Speaker 2: bar had officially been lowered. The burden to reverse a
Speaker 2: conviction had now become much easier to clear.
Speaker 1: I needed to talk to Judge Simpson about her momentous ruling.
Speaker 1: But judges don't usually talk to reporters. It's not considered
Speaker 1: proper conduct for an impartial arbiter. I emailed, phoned her office,
Speaker 1: didn't respond. So I did what any journalists would do.
Speaker 1: I sent her flowers. The day before the hearing was
Speaker 1: to start, I showed up at her chambers unannounced, and
Speaker 1: she appeared in her black robe. She met me in
Speaker 1: the lobby and she seemed delighted the flower guys. She
Speaker 1: called me. She promised to sit down with me for
Speaker 1: an interview that day. We spoke for four minutes. I
Speaker 1: had a recorder in my pocket. ABR always be recording.
Speaker 6: You think Scot's Owa did it on purpose? Well, yeah,
Speaker 6: but you know what he had to do, what he
Speaker 6: had to do.
Speaker 13: He did a lot of frickod things, a lot that
Speaker 13: was just plain.
Speaker 2: Eva, just plain evil. I don't know. I hear that,
Speaker 2: and I think, how can a judge, a sitting judge,
Speaker 2: say this about a detective, a cop, someone who's also
Speaker 2: on the side of the system. I mean, I have
Speaker 2: to be honest. I don't think I've ever heard something
Speaker 2: like this before.
Speaker 1: And Scarcela is about to appear before her in court
Speaker 1: at Nelson's hearing. For Nelson, this is great news. I
Speaker 1: mean she thinks that star detective in his case has
Speaker 1: done evil for Derek too. Let's face it, this looks
Speaker 1: like fantastic.
Speaker 6: Luck Nelson's case. It's personal.
Speaker 11: He's a young man at the system fucked around, and
Speaker 11: you remember it happened to you.
Speaker 3: I heard for that kid every day, every fucking day.
Speaker 3: Here's a kid who lost it's mother, like I lost one.
Speaker 3: You gonna give that becks.
Speaker 14: Can't get it back.
Speaker 1: Derek's known Nelson crew since their days on the actual
Speaker 1: innocence team. Remember Nelson was like an intern. He's the
Speaker 1: one who'd make Derek's coffee through a sock. As Nelson's
Speaker 1: hearing approaches, I check in with the key players by phone,
Speaker 1: Like Louis.
Speaker 12: I think that you're probably don't have the luckiest judge.
Speaker 9: I would bet, I would bet get the judge overtur
Speaker 9: into this. She destroyed me on three cases. I am
Speaker 9: the oppressor of the minority community.
Speaker 14: This is nothing new.
Speaker 9: No one has the balls because she's a woman and
Speaker 9: she's black. No one has the bulls to put this
Speaker 9: woman in her place.
Speaker 1: I also talked to Nelson's lawyer, Justin Bonus, on the
Speaker 1: eve of the hearing. He's psyching himself up, so you're there.
Speaker 11: Yeah, I'm here.
Speaker 12: I'm actually strapping right now for them all with bed.
Speaker 12: Keep the pressure on and stay focused.
Speaker 15: Honorable Jeg Sipson is residing.
Speaker 2: It's March twenty six, twenty nineteen. Nelson Cruz is best
Speaker 2: shot at freedom begins today far.
Speaker 15: Diping number three six six, nineteen ninety eight. The matter
Speaker 15: of Nelson scruise.
Speaker 2: So, Steve, you were there.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I'm sitting about a dozen feet from the
Speaker 1: judge so I can see them lead Nelson Cruz in.
Speaker 1: The officer unlocks his shackles, which gives me the chills.
Speaker 1: Nelson is tall and thin. He wears a knit cap
Speaker 1: a white shirt. He's been in prison for over two decades,
Speaker 1: since he was seventeen years old.
Speaker 16: Justin Bonus on behalf and Nelson threw his good morning office.
Speaker 1: Justin Bonus is a newbie. Law school had not been
Speaker 1: easy for him. He'd flunked out after his first year,
Speaker 1: lived in his car for a while. He hadn't been
Speaker 1: practicing for very long when he stepped into judge Simpson's courtroom,
Speaker 1: but Derek believes in him.
Speaker 11: Justin will stand up in front of a judge and
Speaker 11: state judge, you're run and be upset and angry and argue.
Speaker 6: And he's young enough to be bothered.
Speaker 1: And maybe it's okay that Justin is a novice. Derek
Speaker 1: is sitting in the back of the courtroom, handing out
Speaker 1: black caps that say victims of Detective Scarcella and texting
Speaker 1: Justin instructions.
Speaker 5: Derek is literally Google Legal.
Speaker 12: That's what my nickname is. So let me talk to
Speaker 12: Google Legal real fast.
Speaker 1: You know, the hearing is packed with reporters. We've taken
Speaker 1: over the jury box. Judge Sandia Simpson shows up late,
Speaker 1: oddly late. During breaks, she jots with me, calls me
Speaker 1: the flower guy, even gives me her cell number.
Speaker 2: Wait a minute, she actually gave you her phone number.
Speaker 17: Wrote it down on a scrap of paper and pushed
Speaker 17: it across the desk to the flower guy.
Speaker 1: Bonus went first.
Speaker 18: Oh, Louis Barcella's involved in this investigation, because this is
Speaker 18: like Louis Barsola.
Speaker 16: Isn't just He's not just here and and mom and
Speaker 16: this this is his case.
Speaker 1: Over the phone, I described the scene to Louis.
Speaker 12: First thing he does is he gets up and it's
Speaker 12: like he delivers an opening state. Basically, he says his
Speaker 12: argument is it's a scar seller case. Oh god, this
Speaker 12: will not make you happy. But Judge Simpson journs the
Speaker 12: hearing for the morning, and before everybody leaves the courtroom,
Speaker 12: she picks out Derek Hamilton, walks up and gives him
Speaker 12: a big hug.
Speaker 9: I don't believe it. I don't believe it, Derek. Oh
Speaker 9: my god.
Speaker 1: I caught Simpson talking to Derek on my handy recorder.
Speaker 11: He said, I believe in you. Then I believe in you.
Speaker 1: Know I asked Derek about this moment.
Speaker 12: She believed in the changes that operate.
Speaker 5: I mean she believes him in this fight.
Speaker 12: Back to Louis, do you have any other good news?
Speaker 9: I mean, it's it's over. It's over. Before it started.
Speaker 1: I also called bonus.
Speaker 12: If I'm justin bonus, something wants a good thing.
Speaker 4: Yeah, never never, never, never count your chicken.
Speaker 1: Before that, Nelson's wife was feeling so optimistic she brought
Speaker 1: him a change of clothes like she was expecting him
Speaker 1: to be freed straight from the court room.
Speaker 2: Okay, so what is the evidence in this case, just
Speaker 2: lay it all out for us.
Speaker 1: The crux is probably this. There was actually a cop
Speaker 1: at the scene of the crime and he arrested the
Speaker 1: man holding the murder weapon.
Speaker 5: Do you swear or from the testimony you are about
Speaker 5: to give this court will be the truth, the whole truth,
Speaker 5: and nothing but the truth.
Speaker 1: I do, thank you very much, you seated. This is
Speaker 1: the cop at the scene. He doesn't remember anything from
Speaker 1: the night of the murder, after all, it was about
Speaker 1: twenty years ago. So the prosecutor hands him the report
Speaker 1: he wrote that night. He reads from it.
Speaker 15: I was inside the car when I heard the gunshots
Speaker 15: coming from the left of our patrol car. I exited
Speaker 15: the car and I saw a number of muzzle blasts
Speaker 15: coming in front of me.
Speaker 2: People started running in every direction.
Speaker 15: My attention was drawn to a male Hispanic pointing a
Speaker 15: black gun towards Bradford Avenue. I yelled at him a
Speaker 15: number of times to put the gun down.
Speaker 1: The officer arrested a male Hispanic, but that male Hispanic
Speaker 1: was not Nelson Cruz. It was a man named Eduardo Rodriguez.
Speaker 17: So just this time the people call Eduardo Rodriguez.
Speaker 1: Eduardo Rodriguez comes in wearing what looks like a maitred
Speaker 1: D's outfit. The prosecutor asks him his first question, a
Speaker 1: really simple one.
Speaker 16: Back in March of nineteen ninety eight.
Speaker 1: How tall was Nelson Cruz? He was? He was really
Speaker 1: ta kid, he mumbles. Even the court reporter can't understand him.
Speaker 2: He was, I was.
Speaker 16: And how tall are you?
Speaker 19: Six six five?
Speaker 17: I'm sorry, you're you are six ' five. I'm sitting
Speaker 17: really close to Eduardo Rodriguez.
Speaker 1: Is he hallucinating? He's not nearly six foot five. Even
Speaker 1: the prosecutor is surprised.
Speaker 2: You're six feet five inches tall, he said.
Speaker 1: From the bench. Judge Simpson instructs Eduardo to stand back
Speaker 1: to back with the prosecutor.
Speaker 15: Fair to say that.
Speaker 20: The witness is about Friday Fidy.
Speaker 2: Okay, I drink from.
Speaker 1: Repeat that, Eduardo says, I kind of shrunk as I
Speaker 1: got older, apparently afoot.
Speaker 2: So you're in this jury box with all these other reporters.
Speaker 2: What is going on in your head?
Speaker 1: I'm thinking, I'm not gonna believe anything this guy says.
Speaker 1: And this guy is a crucial witness for the prosecution.
Speaker 1: The night of the murder, he was initially arrested and
Speaker 1: taken to the precinct. After all, he was found with
Speaker 1: the murder weapon in his hand, but somehow he walked
Speaker 1: out a witness. Then Scarcella and another detective drive Rodriguez
Speaker 1: to the apartment where Nelson lived with his mother. Scarcella
Speaker 1: obtained a photo back in the car, he showed the
Speaker 1: photo to Rodriguez. Scarcella says Rodriguez picked out Nelson as
Speaker 1: the person who fired the gun.
Speaker 2: Bonus would seem to have a lot to work with.
Speaker 2: I mean, he's got a witness who doesn't know his height,
Speaker 2: and the same witness who had the murder weapon in
Speaker 2: his hand the night of the murder.
Speaker 1: But in his cross examination, Bonus struggles.
Speaker 18: Why do you think, and this is just if you know,
Speaker 18: why do you think an officer would believe that you
Speaker 18: had a weapon in your hands?
Speaker 2: I mean, this is basic, basic criminal law. You can
Speaker 2: only ask a witness about things they know.
Speaker 21: Well, Judge, Judge, he's asking to speculate as to someone
Speaker 21: else's state of mind.
Speaker 16: You can't do.
Speaker 2: I take it, Bonus couldn't reach Google legal.
Speaker 1: Let's rephrase it.
Speaker 17: I know where you're getting at.
Speaker 14: Just take it. Tom tick about.
Speaker 1: Judge Simpson would like to help Bonus rephrase, but she's
Speaker 1: forgotten the question.
Speaker 22: We had just the court report to read that because
Speaker 22: I lost some words.
Speaker 23: You did that last part sing it.
Speaker 2: This is not normal. What are you thinking? Just talk
Speaker 2: to me about what's going through your mind.
Speaker 1: Hey, I can sum it up. I'm thinking, what the
Speaker 1: hell is going on in the halls of justice? This
Speaker 1: whole thing is painful to listen to. Had to check
Speaker 1: in with Bonus.
Speaker 23: I'm a young guy, you know what I mean. I
Speaker 23: gotta work out some of my kinks.
Speaker 1: I asked him about Eduardo Rodriguez.
Speaker 12: I'm not gonna think about it anymore. I mean, this
Speaker 12: guy is just you know, she's a lion, suck as shit.
Speaker 1: But in any case, Rodriguez's testimony shouldn't matter all that
Speaker 1: much to the fate of Nelson Cruz.
Speaker 2: Right, because the burden of proof is simple. Simpson laid
Speaker 2: it out in her prior decision show that Scarcilla had
Speaker 2: a consequential role in Nelson's case, and all should be good.
Speaker 2: Nelson's conviction should be overturned, and.
Speaker 16: So defense call detective Scarcelo.
Speaker 2: That's in a minute.
Speaker 17: Scarcella arrives in the corporate in the jury box, photographers,
Speaker 17: leaning cameras go wild.
Speaker 1: Scarcella is sixty nine now, his hair is thinning. He's
Speaker 1: wearing a suit. To my eye, he looks a big
Speaker 1: rum book, but he's smiling. He's confident.
Speaker 2: We have the tape, and finally we get to hear
Speaker 2: Louis Scarcella under oath on the stand.
Speaker 17: I do yeah, and listen. I'm hoping for fireworks. This
Speaker 17: is a showdown.
Speaker 18: Good morning, Detective Scarcella. Is it all right if I
Speaker 18: call you Detective Scarcella?
Speaker 16: Sure, it's comfortable. I've seen that term enough.
Speaker 1: Justin's referring to his notes. There are long pauses between questions.
Speaker 1: Scarcella on the stand appears calm. He's really relaxed. He's
Speaker 1: also flanked by his two lawyers. Bonus eases into the examination.
Speaker 1: This might be a showdown, but Justin Bonus is playing nice.
Speaker 1: He knows Louis served in the Navy.
Speaker 18: Yeah, my father was in the Marines, Douglas, God bless
Speaker 18: you too for your.
Speaker 2: Safe So they've God blessed each other. Okay, great, beautiful, beautiful, beautiful,
Speaker 2: on with it already.
Speaker 1: So Bonus does shift gears. He asks Scarcela about his
Speaker 1: hundreds of arrests.
Speaker 16: How many of those arrests resulted in convictions? You know,
Speaker 16: I have no idea, no idea.
Speaker 1: I think all of them.
Speaker 16: All of the night, I didn't possibly well, I don't remember.
Speaker 15: I don't remember.
Speaker 16: Do you stand by all the investigations you've conducted.
Speaker 1: Louis had gone into the hearing thinking it was over
Speaker 1: before it began. Now he's feeling like Bonus gave him
Speaker 1: the chance to say just what he wanted. I did
Speaker 1: nothing wrong.
Speaker 4: I was disappointed. I wanted to say for another two hours,
Speaker 4: I think I would have given him enough more wealth
Speaker 4: to hang himself. And I gave him the thumbs up time.
Speaker 1: When I walked out and Dax, there was something else surprising.
Speaker 1: This judge, the same judge who told me that Scarcella
Speaker 1: was basically an evildoer, seemed kind of nice to him.
Speaker 1: She waved past objections. He won't ask, She was solicitous,
Speaker 1: she was patient.
Speaker 19: I guess he's thinking.
Speaker 1: Bonus asked about doctor Phil. The judge was like a fangirl?
Speaker 1: Did you sorry? Did they shared a lad.
Speaker 6: You do?
Speaker 12: What did you like of the judge?
Speaker 14: She was so nice to you. I think she has
Speaker 14: a crush on me.
Speaker 4: I think even she's saying this, there's a lot of bullshit.
Speaker 14: It was a zero for the defense.
Speaker 9: I should have fucking.
Speaker 23: Hugged us, son of a bitch, A son of a pitch.
Speaker 14: I should have fucking.
Speaker 1: Hugged us like Derek hugged her. But guess what, Derek
Speaker 1: doesn't think any of that matters. He likes what he
Speaker 1: heard in the courtroom. From my point of view, we've
Speaker 1: met that burden of proof.
Speaker 5: Were right.
Speaker 1: I kind of agree. I think Louis is misunderstanding the
Speaker 1: legal dynamics. Yeah, Bonus's command of procedure is inexpert, but
Speaker 1: justin elicited certain important admissions.
Speaker 16: So you were the detective organized the surrender of mister
Speaker 16: Kruz if you want, if you want to say that
Speaker 16: should why would you? Why did you take the photo?
Speaker 16: Did you show what Edward Rodriguez I did?
Speaker 17: I certainly did so.
Speaker 16: Is it fair to say you did something right?
Speaker 9: Yes?
Speaker 1: Derek believes that something is enough. Scarcella had a lot
Speaker 1: of chances to do is evil, and in Derek's mind,
Speaker 1: that should meet the burden to overturn the conviction. It's
Speaker 1: Derek who drafts the briefs or Bonus and He's already
Speaker 1: thinking about what he wants to write.
Speaker 11: I'll planned to the judge and plain English, what the
Speaker 11: issues is that? What the bird approval? Oh, I'm sure
Speaker 11: that that would be, you know, case closed, The closes.
Speaker 2: That both sides rest. Everyone waits for the decision. Five
Speaker 2: months past, and then finally the day comes.
Speaker 1: We had a mic near the judge and overheard bits
Speaker 1: of her conversation. A clerk tells her the press is
Speaker 1: coming with cameras. She applies. Judge Simpson's court attorney reviews
Speaker 1: the decision with her, the one she's about to deliver.
Speaker 16: A tough one.
Speaker 1: This is tough one, she says, The case is a
Speaker 1: tough one. Then, weirdly, right before the court is called
Speaker 1: to order, she asks her court attorney a question.
Speaker 2: Would you grant the motion? So Judge Simpson, with cameras
Speaker 2: worrying and people's lives hanging in the balance, wants to
Speaker 2: note if her court attorney would grant the motion to
Speaker 2: free Nelson. What something is terribly off right now?
Speaker 1: The court attorney demurves.
Speaker 2: I thought, what, I don't know on what basis? And
Speaker 2: this seems like this is news to the judge and
Speaker 2: she's about to read this decision out loud.
Speaker 20: Anything you want to say beforehand, excuse me, Rol, anything
Speaker 20: you want to say beforehand.
Speaker 16: No, I think we're all right.
Speaker 20: The defendant was granted the hearing giving the relations of
Speaker 20: compromise police practices. It was a difficult case. Substantial testimony
Speaker 20: was taken in this hearing. Eighteen witnesses were called. Significant
Speaker 20: issues were raised in the course of the testimony taken.
Speaker 20: Although the involvement of detectives Garstella was a great concern
Speaker 20: as to the reliability of the investigation. In this case,
Speaker 20: the defense failed to effectively undermine the evidence upon which
Speaker 20: the defendant was committed. The defendant's motion to vacate, he's
Speaker 20: denied and accomplish. That's Nelson's wife, sobbing, shock and sadness
Speaker 20: rocked a Brooklyn courtroom.
Speaker 1: A family left heartbroken. Justin jumps up from his seat.
Speaker 1: He's outraged. He's about the same age as Nelson Cruz.
Speaker 1: He thinks of Nelson, who turned seventeen on the day
Speaker 1: of the murder.
Speaker 18: These little kids, we're gonna believe that on the day
Speaker 18: of his birthday. He chise, somebody, let's think about that
Speaker 18: for a Second's.
Speaker 1: Sixteen Judge Simpson listens and then and this is bizarre,
Speaker 1: gets up, turns and walks.
Speaker 9: Out through.
Speaker 2: Normally a judge calls a recessor will adjourn the hearing
Speaker 2: before leaving. But that's not what happens right in this
Speaker 2: instant Steve. She gets up from the bench, turns on
Speaker 2: her heels, and exits exactly.
Speaker 1: And the reporters we have no idea what's going on.
Speaker 20: In all of my years as a reporter, I've never
Speaker 20: seen anything quite like this. The judge stood up in
Speaker 20: silence and walked out of the court room.
Speaker 1: Finally, a clerk announces that court is adjourned until the afternoon.
Speaker 1: When court resumes, there's another strange turn. Judge Simpson calls
Speaker 1: Justin Bonus to the bench. She wants to have a word,
Speaker 1: she whispers. And Mike was there so they.
Speaker 13: Might the little turn of things. And I know you
Speaker 13: put your heart on something of your case. I know
Speaker 13: I know your passion, I know you're dry. It's a
Speaker 13: tough one. There may be some more work to be done.
Speaker 13: They were doing some research ourselves.
Speaker 6: I'm going to clean some stuff up and.
Speaker 13: Reread off the records. I'm gonna vacation your so I
Speaker 13: got it refreshed, recollectious.
Speaker 2: Okay, hold up, Hold up. She confesses that she is
Speaker 2: not sure she got it right, that she hasn't read
Speaker 2: the record. Could be a little turn. She's saying that
Speaker 2: she might change her ruling.
Speaker 1: I broke news of the decision to Luis Scarcela by phone.
Speaker 14: But did she She did not vacate.
Speaker 9: Correct, she did not vake cake.
Speaker 14: He is in shackle all right, Steeve. I don't you know, Steve,
Speaker 14: I gotta tell you something. This is very fucking hard
Speaker 14: for me. I'm over here in Maryland on the beach
Speaker 14: with my whole family, and to day she just likes
Speaker 14: to do this, and you know, it's just fucking look,
Speaker 14: you know what fucking shecause. I mean, I'm happy. I'm happy, Steve.
Speaker 14: I'm very happy. And uh, I'm very happy for the
Speaker 14: first time, and I a Steve listened to me, Steeve, Steve,
Speaker 14: I didn't do any of these things that they said
Speaker 14: I did. Every one of these cases should have been
Speaker 14: like that.
Speaker 2: We caught up with Derek.
Speaker 1: So you must have been shattered when Judge Simpson.
Speaker 6: Devastated. I remember being him, Steve. I remember sitting to.
Speaker 1: See Yeah, I'd sat through that hearing for days and
Speaker 1: I still didn't understand. I had so many questions. Judge
Speaker 1: Simpson had given me her cell phone number. I called
Speaker 1: it and guess what she invited me for that interview,
Speaker 1: the one she promised me when I sent the flowers.
Speaker 23: I respect you wholeheartedly, always had and the first time
Speaker 23: I met you.
Speaker 22: That's in a minute.
Speaker 21: I am nervous.
Speaker 1: I get into my car with our producer Saxon. It's
Speaker 1: several months after the decision, so let's review the chronology.
Speaker 17: So yesterday we go out from Brooklyn to where she
Speaker 17: lives in South Orange. We run in a little late,
Speaker 17: so I text her and say we're running about fifteen
Speaker 17: minutes late.
Speaker 1: We have a noon meeting with her, and she texts backs.
Speaker 17: Saying, Oh, I just have to run into the city
Speaker 17: running to DMV.
Speaker 1: I'll be back soon.
Speaker 2: You and I both know that no one runs into
Speaker 2: the DMV, especially from South Oreg, New Jersey, and is
Speaker 2: back soon. That's at least a two hour round trip.
Speaker 1: You are right, I mean it's baffling. So wait, do
Speaker 1: we dig around?
Speaker 6: Do we cancel?
Speaker 1: I really wanted to push your head. So Saxon and
Speaker 1: I set up at a local cafe.
Speaker 2: So two o'clock comes around, we're drinking coffee.
Speaker 17: You get a text message, I am on my way back.
Speaker 17: Now we're driving back to her house and we're like
Speaker 17: five minutes away and the phone rings. It's a woman
Speaker 17: named Anna who says she is Sean DIA's assistant. One
Speaker 17: of Seanda's kids has gotten very sick and Shendya has
Speaker 17: to reschedule.
Speaker 2: So now it's back to New York.
Speaker 9: Okay.
Speaker 21: So an hour later, we're just crossed through the Holland
Speaker 21: Tunnel and there's a Raleigh, North Carolina number on the phone.
Speaker 12: Okay, I'm at a red light.
Speaker 24: Hello, Okay, this is Steve Fischman.
Speaker 9: Correct, Yes it is.
Speaker 24: Yes, I'm reaching out on behalf of my client, Shandy
Speaker 24: a symptom. I'm just going to as you know that
Speaker 24: you need to cease communication with her directly. Any further
Speaker 24: communication needs to come through week.
Speaker 9: Oh okay, could you tell me why.
Speaker 12: I mean we were just invited to her place today.
Speaker 24: I will be contacting you via text matches or we
Speaker 24: conduction any further communications.
Speaker 10: Thank you so much.
Speaker 24: Do you have a great day.
Speaker 6: A half hour later, we're in Brooklyn. Are you about
Speaker 6: to drop me off?
Speaker 2: And who calls Judge Sean Dia Simpson.
Speaker 12: Sorry, I'm just driving. I just pulled over.
Speaker 23: Oh that's okay. No, I had to. I had to
Speaker 23: get my driver's license renews. So I had to go
Speaker 23: downtown and get that done, which was great because it's
Speaker 23: like I got to check that off the list.
Speaker 12: Yeah, yeah, that's really good. I actually I felt bad
Speaker 12: because we could have just met here in uh New York. Oh,
Speaker 12: that's true.
Speaker 5: I know.
Speaker 12: I thought about it AFTERCA. I was really eager to
Speaker 12: talk because I feel like you're really pivotal in that,
Speaker 12: you know, whole narrative of the change of the justice system.
Speaker 23: Oh that makes me feel so well. One, I respect
Speaker 23: you wholeheartedly, always had from the first time I met you.
Speaker 23: The best thing I remember about you is bringing me flowers.
Speaker 12: Well, I'll bring you to remind you.
Speaker 23: Yeah, let's get together. We got to make this happen
Speaker 23: because you know I'm here for you.
Speaker 1: We set a date.
Speaker 12: Okay, so we'll see you tomorrow.
Speaker 19: It's one.
Speaker 1: Thanks.
Speaker 9: That sounds gay.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 20: Bye.
Speaker 25: So where we are now on the New Jersey Turnpike
Speaker 25: repeating le groundhog Day what we did yesterday.
Speaker 17: And still wondering if at the end of our drive
Speaker 17: she's gonna be there.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Oh my god, I'm nervous now.
Speaker 1: Thankfully, Judge Simpson is at her house. She's been on
Speaker 1: Leaf for a few months. Actually, the Leaf started right
Speaker 1: after Nelson's decision. She told me it was the first
Speaker 1: break in her professional life. She's wearing jeans, a gray sweater, uggs.
Speaker 1: A couple of dogs are running around. She's a gracious host.
Speaker 10: So we have like different rooms, like like this is
Speaker 10: a great room here, this is like my piece and
Speaker 10: tranquility room.
Speaker 13: We got the Gold room and the Green room.
Speaker 1: And then then we sit down. We're bunched together at
Speaker 1: one end of a large dining room table.
Speaker 10: That one, it was back to back to back to
Speaker 10: back people.
Speaker 16: Yeah, Nelson cruise.
Speaker 2: That case Nelson cruise.
Speaker 10: That was another hard one.
Speaker 17: Yeah, what was your what was your thought on that?
Speaker 17: I had the feeling that you made up your mind,
Speaker 17: but you weren't sure.
Speaker 10: And it's a case that bothered me. It was a
Speaker 10: case that bothered me because you remember too, because there
Speaker 10: was okay, there was Nelson cruise.
Speaker 17: I remember it was what was that, Jude Simpson gathered
Speaker 17: your thoughts the phone rings.
Speaker 2: It was you know, it was tough. It was tough.
Speaker 1: We hold on, well, we hold on for less than
Speaker 1: a minute fifty seconds to be exact. She sits down
Speaker 1: with us again.
Speaker 17: You had just come back from vacation on that one,
Speaker 17: and that funds like what a way to come back
Speaker 17: from vacation, because.
Speaker 6: You know, yeah had in one place.
Speaker 17: Yeah, you were you were reading the decision and obviously
Speaker 17: a very tough case.
Speaker 2: Yeah, which one?
Speaker 16: Which one was Thelon Cruise case?
Speaker 19: Yeah?
Speaker 10: And I just that case that will always kind of
Speaker 10: bother me. It was just a lot happening in that case.
Speaker 10: And it's something like I kept reading stuff over and over.
Speaker 10: I probably have stuff more in my office. I should
Speaker 10: probably read all this stuff. That Nelson Cruiz case kind
Speaker 10: of did bother me.
Speaker 17: How about Scarcella's involved, Yeah, I just made a place
Speaker 17: like what.
Speaker 10: I think that put it this way. I don't think
Speaker 10: he's a bad man, and I think he tried to
Speaker 10: do the right thing, and I'm gonna give him credit
Speaker 10: for that. I mean, you know, you got to accept
Speaker 10: people for who they are, and I think that sometimes
Speaker 10: you see people in their mask and it's just like,
Speaker 10: oh he's a bad guy. He's a bad guy. But Scarcela,
Speaker 10: you know what, he had a nice history there and
Speaker 10: he tried to do the best that he could.
Speaker 22: Put it.
Speaker 2: That way, Steve, this is the same woman who told
Speaker 2: you just a few months earlier that Detective Scarcella had
Speaker 2: done evil things.
Speaker 1: It's confusing. Did she really change her mind? Chanced to
Speaker 1: like read and through that decision?
Speaker 21: The Nelson Cruise decision before you? You had to read
Speaker 21: it before everybody.
Speaker 10: No, I read it a couple of I read it.
Speaker 10: In fact, I still have it.
Speaker 16: Someone there's not here with me. It's probably no office.
Speaker 10: Then Nelson Cruz, that was a hard one.
Speaker 1: Well thought he was guilty.
Speaker 16: You thought he was innocent? Nelson?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I thought he.
Speaker 10: Was probably more innocent than guilty.
Speaker 11: I thought so.
Speaker 1: And around this point I turned to Saxon and scribble
Speaker 1: a question, is she high?
Speaker 9: You know?
Speaker 1: Nelson Cruise was seventeen?
Speaker 5: That bothered me.
Speaker 1: Too, Saxon wrote back, early dementia. How about a DMV yesterday?
Speaker 16: Uh, what happened to DMV yesterday?
Speaker 4: They're doing their dB yesterday.
Speaker 10: I was supposed to do something in dB something happened.
Speaker 5: What happened at DMV?
Speaker 23: I was supposed to do something at DMV.
Speaker 2: We'll come back. We're gonna let you go.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much.
Speaker 19: It's so great to see you.
Speaker 2: Appreciate you, mak your time for all.
Speaker 16: I appreciate it.
Speaker 2: Thank you, thank you.
Speaker 25: We will take care of that, all right, Thank you.
Speaker 6: I'm rolling still.
Speaker 2: That was rough.
Speaker 17: There's no way she could have really conducted that trial,
Speaker 17: like giving her currency capacity. She just disappeared from the.
Speaker 6: Bench turn half hour break, two and a half hour break.
Speaker 1: But she didn't say it was a break. She just disappeared.
Speaker 1: That kind of makes a little more sense.
Speaker 6: Now, Yeah, it all makes sense.
Speaker 19: Now.
Speaker 1: That's about the time I called you, Dex. I needed
Speaker 1: your take on this. Journals aren't supposed to take sides.
Speaker 1: We're not supposed to or.
Speaker 2: A field or one side or the other.
Speaker 6: What's going on? We're a neutral ring.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm thinking, frankly, I'm.
Speaker 16: Thinking about my duty to Nelson Cruz.
Speaker 1: I'm thinking about my duty beyond my journalistic duty.
Speaker 2: This has consequences. This is untenable.
Speaker 1: How did people let this go on?
Speaker 25: Am I going to be one of those people who
Speaker 25: let this go on?
Speaker 2: We can't just not.
Speaker 1: Do anything, Dax. I think we've got to reach out
Speaker 1: to Derek.
Speaker 2: I mean, he has to know.
Speaker 9: We knew something was wrong in that damn courtroom.
Speaker 12: We just couldn't get our hands on it.
Speaker 17: Derek wanted to get Justin Bonus on the line, Justin,
Speaker 17: can you hear me?
Speaker 14: Yeah?
Speaker 12: I wish I could say I was surprised.
Speaker 14: But at the same time, I'm blown away.
Speaker 9: I mean, how bad was it, Steve? I mean Derek
Speaker 9: said it.
Speaker 6: Was bad, but how bad? Oh?
Speaker 19: It was?
Speaker 14: It was?
Speaker 12: It was so striking that I felt.
Speaker 9: Guilty being there. I didn't really know who.
Speaker 12: I was talking to at that point. I don't even
Speaker 12: really know what to say.
Speaker 9: Totally.
Speaker 12: It's outrageous, Okay, it is. It's really disturbing.
Speaker 2: Everyone around her had to have known, I mean, had minimum,
Speaker 2: her assistant, the court attorney, all those clerks, I mean
Speaker 2: they're around her every single day.
Speaker 1: And her bosses. The knowledge had to be widespread. She'd
Speaker 1: previously been quote unquote disciplined for tardiness and lack of
Speaker 1: productivity in fractions, for which she was shipped to the Bronx,
Speaker 1: where they assigned her less consequential matters. Shout out to
Speaker 1: the Bronx, where Brooklyn's problems apparently go to hide.
Speaker 2: Soon after your meeting, Judge Simpson resigned. The official reason
Speaker 2: in the press release. Early onset Alzheimer's Bonus submitted an
Speaker 2: argument that Judge Simpson wasn't competent to preside over the
Speaker 2: hearing and that Nelson Cruz should get a new one.
Speaker 2: Another judge was assigned to review the record, and this
Speaker 2: judge scoffed at Bonus's arguments, basically called him incompetent. And
Speaker 2: then this judge stood by his colleague stating, quote, the
Speaker 2: record clearly demonstrates Justice Simpson was competent to preside over
Speaker 2: the hearing as well as render a decision end quote.
Speaker 1: I'm thinking of those officials who called Scarcella a rogue
Speaker 1: and blamed this rogue for so many misdeats. Really, the
Speaker 1: whole system ran over Nelson. No one spoke up, and
Speaker 1: it was clear to me at least she was not
Speaker 1: capable of making a decision on Nelson's future. Another judge
Speaker 1: had the chance to overturn Judge Simpson's ruling, but he upheld.
Speaker 11: It beside man because they know who committed that crime,
Speaker 11: they didn't care, and that kid is still in prison.
Speaker 11: I try to stay so busy that I don't think about.
Speaker 2: It next time. On The Burden, Derek Hamilton's case solved.
Speaker 1: I mean, the story just doesn't work.
Speaker 2: Could not have happened.
Speaker 1: The way she says it does.
Speaker 14: So if you couldn't be doing all the things that
Speaker 14: she said happened.
Speaker 2: It boggles the mind. It boggles the mind. It boggles
Speaker 2: the mind.
Speaker 1: All now, I'm mama.
Speaker 2: Bon I'm going to steffree.
Speaker 1: The Burden is created by Steve Fishman. That's me.
Speaker 17: It's hosted and reported by Steve Fishman and Dax Devlin Ross.
Speaker 1: Story editor is Dan Bobkoff. Our senior producer is Simon Rentner.
Speaker 1: Our producer is Sanam Skelly. Associate producer Austin Smith. Fact
Speaker 1: checking by Sona Avakian. Our production coordinator is Davon Paradise.
Speaker 1: Mixing and sound designed by Mumbo Media. Our executive producers
Speaker 1: are Fisher, Stevens, Evan Williams and me Steve Fishman. Additional
Speaker 1: production help from Josie Holtzman, Isaac Kestenbaum, Naomi Roner, Lucy Souchek,
Speaker 1: Drew Nellis, Micah Hazel, Priscilla Alabi, Saxon Baird, Katie Simon,
Speaker 1: and Katie Spranger. We give special thanks to Ellen Horn,
Speaker 1: Lizzie Jacobs, Nathan Tempe, Tobiah Black, Rachel Morrissey, Lyla Robinson,
Speaker 1: Mark Smyr and Jack Stewart Pontier, and deep appreciation to
Speaker 1: Marcy Wiseman. Special thanks to our agents Ben Davis and
Speaker 1: Marissa Hrowitz. Mona Hook provided our legal advice. She's from
Speaker 1: MKSR LP, and a very special thanks to Evan Williams,
Speaker 1: one of our executive producers and the person who made
Speaker 1: this podcast possible. We are honored to feature the song
Speaker 1: black Lightning from The Bell Rays as our theme music.
Speaker 1: The Burden is a production of Orbit Media in association
Speaker 1: with Signal Company.
Speaker 19: Number one.
Speaker 1: Season two of The Burden Empire on Blood will be
Speaker 1: available everywhere you get your podcasts on August seventh. All
Speaker 1: episodes will be available early and ad free, along with
Speaker 1: the exclusive bonus content on Orbit's newly launched True Crime
Speaker 1: Clubhouse as subscription channel on Apple Podcasts. It's only two
Speaker 1: ninety nine a month.