1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:08,800 Speaker 1: M Crime Stories with Nancy Grace on Sirius x M 2 00:00:08,840 --> 00:00:13,520 Speaker 1: Triumph Channel one two. The body of one of four 3 00:00:13,560 --> 00:00:17,000 Speaker 1: Pennsylvania men missing since last week has been found. We 4 00:00:17,120 --> 00:00:21,119 Speaker 1: have found the human remains in an approximately twelve and 5 00:00:21,200 --> 00:00:27,600 Speaker 1: a half foot common grave. We can now identify the Pinocchiaro, 6 00:00:28,240 --> 00:00:31,600 Speaker 1: nineteen years old as one of the people found buried 7 00:00:31,640 --> 00:00:34,280 Speaker 1: in that grade. He and three other men went missing 8 00:00:34,320 --> 00:00:36,560 Speaker 1: within miles of each other over the course of several 9 00:00:36,600 --> 00:00:39,960 Speaker 1: days last week. This is a homicide. Make no mistake about. 10 00:00:40,159 --> 00:00:43,560 Speaker 1: There are additional human remains inside that grave, So this 11 00:00:43,680 --> 00:00:53,720 Speaker 1: painstaking process will go on. We're not done yet. We 12 00:00:53,960 --> 00:00:57,200 Speaker 1: all knew in the middle of the night when a 13 00:00:57,360 --> 00:01:03,440 Speaker 1: late night press conference is called that it couldn't be good. 14 00:01:03,560 --> 00:01:09,360 Speaker 1: We we knew. I'm Matt Wintrow, Bucks County District Attorney. 15 00:01:10,720 --> 00:01:14,480 Speaker 1: I'm here to make an announcement about a significant development 16 00:01:15,600 --> 00:01:18,440 Speaker 1: in the investigation that you've all been following so patiently, 17 00:01:19,120 --> 00:01:25,360 Speaker 1: so diligently. We have found human remains in an approximately 18 00:01:25,520 --> 00:01:30,600 Speaker 1: twelve and a half foot deep common grave that we 19 00:01:30,680 --> 00:01:34,960 Speaker 1: have painstakingly dug with a lot of care so as 20 00:01:34,959 --> 00:01:39,399 Speaker 1: not to damage any potential evidence. And I'm very, very 21 00:01:39,440 --> 00:01:44,840 Speaker 1: sad to say that we can now identify Deem Finocchio, 22 00:01:45,520 --> 00:01:49,520 Speaker 1: nineteen years old of Middletown as one of the people 23 00:01:50,400 --> 00:01:54,400 Speaker 1: that was found buried in that grave. He's been missing 24 00:01:54,400 --> 00:02:00,600 Speaker 1: since Friday. We notified his family that we have recovered 25 00:02:00,720 --> 00:02:05,080 Speaker 1: his body. There are additional human remains inside that grave, 26 00:02:06,680 --> 00:02:11,040 Speaker 1: so this painstaking process will go on. We're not done yet. 27 00:02:12,560 --> 00:02:16,000 Speaker 1: This is a homicide, make no mistake about it. We 28 00:02:16,160 --> 00:02:20,280 Speaker 1: just don't know how many homicides. We are yet to 29 00:02:20,360 --> 00:02:23,760 Speaker 1: know the answer to that question. And I want to 30 00:02:23,800 --> 00:02:26,960 Speaker 1: let you know that we reiterated over and over again, 31 00:02:27,000 --> 00:02:30,600 Speaker 1: and it goes to say one more time to the 32 00:02:30,680 --> 00:02:35,519 Speaker 1: families that we're strong, and we're gonna remain strong, and 33 00:02:35,600 --> 00:02:39,280 Speaker 1: we're going to see this investigation to the end. We're 34 00:02:39,280 --> 00:02:41,560 Speaker 1: gonna bring each and every one of these lost boys 35 00:02:41,639 --> 00:02:47,120 Speaker 1: home to their families, one way or another, and we 36 00:02:47,160 --> 00:02:50,480 Speaker 1: will not rest until we do that. I will take 37 00:02:50,680 --> 00:02:56,079 Speaker 1: a few questions and then I'll see you tomorrow and eleven. 38 00:02:56,639 --> 00:03:00,880 Speaker 1: I can't comment on the type of homicide that it 39 00:03:00,960 --> 00:03:04,480 Speaker 1: is at this point, but I am comfortable classifying as homicide. Dan, 40 00:03:04,880 --> 00:03:06,919 Speaker 1: do you have enough to pilot one I've learned to 41 00:03:06,960 --> 00:03:10,440 Speaker 1: tell at least for the Monday. That is something that 42 00:03:10,480 --> 00:03:15,360 Speaker 1: we're going to look at very very closely. I feel 43 00:03:15,360 --> 00:03:17,280 Speaker 1: that we bought ourselves a little bit of time in 44 00:03:17,360 --> 00:03:23,280 Speaker 1: charging uh Mr DeNardo with the stolen car case today 45 00:03:23,480 --> 00:03:26,800 Speaker 1: and getting that five million dollar bail. Uh. It is 46 00:03:26,840 --> 00:03:29,119 Speaker 1: my hope that he does not post that, but that's 47 00:03:29,160 --> 00:03:31,880 Speaker 1: his prerogative of course, if he could post it. But 48 00:03:32,000 --> 00:03:34,880 Speaker 1: we're going to start looking seriously at the homicide charges, 49 00:03:34,920 --> 00:03:38,520 Speaker 1: and in fact, we already have pursued that option. We 50 00:03:38,680 --> 00:03:43,600 Speaker 1: hoped for the best, but a sence of foreboding hung. 51 00:03:44,840 --> 00:03:48,120 Speaker 1: In the late nine hours, we now know that one 52 00:03:48,840 --> 00:03:55,200 Speaker 1: of four missing young Bucks County boys body has been found. 53 00:03:55,840 --> 00:04:02,160 Speaker 1: Intriguing it is stated by authorities that one body has 54 00:04:02,200 --> 00:04:06,760 Speaker 1: been found among quote multiple bodies and a twelve and 55 00:04:06,760 --> 00:04:13,520 Speaker 1: a half foot deep grave at a five million dollar farm. 56 00:04:13,600 --> 00:04:22,279 Speaker 1: The family of this young boy, Dean Vinegario, just devastated. 57 00:04:24,520 --> 00:04:30,680 Speaker 1: Our prayers and thoughts out to those families now joining 58 00:04:30,680 --> 00:04:35,160 Speaker 1: me right now, special guests from Bucks County. Jamie Stover 59 00:04:35,440 --> 00:04:38,880 Speaker 1: from w f m Z TV, please tell us what happened. 60 00:04:39,240 --> 00:04:43,799 Speaker 1: So it was just several hours um after the person 61 00:04:43,800 --> 00:04:47,920 Speaker 1: of interest in this whole case was rearrested h on 62 00:04:47,960 --> 00:04:52,680 Speaker 1: a charge that had directly uh connected him to these 63 00:04:52,760 --> 00:04:56,880 Speaker 1: four individuals that the district attorney uh alerted the price 64 00:04:56,960 --> 00:05:02,440 Speaker 1: that he mean the the the car charge, Yes, directly 65 00:05:02,760 --> 00:05:05,560 Speaker 1: connecting him to to one of the four men that 66 00:05:05,600 --> 00:05:08,560 Speaker 1: had gone missing. Let's catch that back up, James, Sure, 67 00:05:08,839 --> 00:05:13,760 Speaker 1: Um what what? What I learned in the evening yesterday 68 00:05:14,120 --> 00:05:19,240 Speaker 1: is that the heir to this vast real estate. UM, 69 00:05:20,360 --> 00:05:22,880 Speaker 1: I don't even know what to call it, because there's 70 00:05:22,880 --> 00:05:30,280 Speaker 1: a five million dollar farm, there are multiple property holdings, 71 00:05:30,320 --> 00:05:34,120 Speaker 1: there are homes scattered around, but the area from what 72 00:05:34,200 --> 00:05:39,360 Speaker 1: we've been told, and he DeNardo Cosmo di Nardo is 73 00:05:39,560 --> 00:05:44,480 Speaker 1: the heir to all that. He had been under suspicion unspoken, 74 00:05:45,360 --> 00:05:49,200 Speaker 1: and he had first been arrested on a gun charge 75 00:05:49,520 --> 00:05:54,880 Speaker 1: regarding a twenty gauge Savage Arms shotgun and ammo that 76 00:05:54,960 --> 00:05:57,960 Speaker 1: had been found months ago. It had been dropped, then 77 00:05:58,000 --> 00:06:02,200 Speaker 1: they revived it re arrested him, which in my mind 78 00:06:02,279 --> 00:06:04,359 Speaker 1: was just a pretense to get him behind bars. If 79 00:06:04,400 --> 00:06:08,240 Speaker 1: you talked about where these four boys are, then he 80 00:06:08,320 --> 00:06:11,520 Speaker 1: gets a million dollar bond. That's a big clue that 81 00:06:11,600 --> 00:06:15,880 Speaker 1: they suspect him of more than just one shotgun possession. 82 00:06:17,000 --> 00:06:21,120 Speaker 1: And from what I've been told to the anger or 83 00:06:21,240 --> 00:06:23,920 Speaker 1: the irritation of the d A, and I don't blame him. 84 00:06:24,400 --> 00:06:30,239 Speaker 1: DeNardo makes a million dollar bond. Then they discover that 85 00:06:30,880 --> 00:06:34,520 Speaker 1: he has tried to sell DeNardo has tried to sell 86 00:06:35,240 --> 00:06:40,040 Speaker 1: one of the Missing Boys cars and in the car 87 00:06:40,960 --> 00:06:45,640 Speaker 1: telling Lee is the boys, the Missing Boys diabetic kit 88 00:06:45,800 --> 00:06:49,839 Speaker 1: he has to have with him. So you've got Cosmo 89 00:06:49,920 --> 00:06:54,640 Speaker 1: DeNardo trying to hawk the car of a missing boy 90 00:06:55,080 --> 00:06:59,120 Speaker 1: and that just blew everything wide open. Okay, take it on, Jamie. 91 00:06:59,320 --> 00:07:02,880 Speaker 1: So so from there, just hours after you know, that 92 00:07:02,960 --> 00:07:05,920 Speaker 1: came down, it was the first time we finally heard 93 00:07:05,960 --> 00:07:08,720 Speaker 1: anything or got any clues as to what exactly it 94 00:07:08,760 --> 00:07:13,720 Speaker 1: was about Gernardo that raised alarm with investigators. Hours after that, 95 00:07:13,800 --> 00:07:16,160 Speaker 1: hours after he's put back into jail on this now 96 00:07:16,240 --> 00:07:20,240 Speaker 1: five million dollars bail, uh, the district attorney calls this 97 00:07:20,480 --> 00:07:24,680 Speaker 1: midnight news conference for a major update, and of course 98 00:07:24,720 --> 00:07:27,640 Speaker 1: everyone's wondering at that point, you know, what are we 99 00:07:27,680 --> 00:07:29,960 Speaker 1: going to hear? What are we going to learn? Um? 100 00:07:30,000 --> 00:07:32,520 Speaker 1: And the district attorney didn't didn't spend a whole lot 101 00:07:32,520 --> 00:07:34,720 Speaker 1: of time up there, but he didn't have to um 102 00:07:34,720 --> 00:07:38,160 Speaker 1: because he had some pretty bombshell news um in which 103 00:07:38,200 --> 00:07:41,680 Speaker 1: he announced that they found a twelve and a half 104 00:07:41,720 --> 00:07:45,480 Speaker 1: foot deep common grave uh that that he claims they 105 00:07:45,480 --> 00:07:49,800 Speaker 1: have been slowly trying to uncover to to try not 106 00:07:49,840 --> 00:07:53,360 Speaker 1: to disturb any of this evidence. Uh And he did 107 00:07:53,360 --> 00:07:57,800 Speaker 1: say that there were multiple human remains and in that 108 00:07:58,040 --> 00:08:02,480 Speaker 1: in that grave on um a DiNardo family farm where 109 00:08:02,480 --> 00:08:05,680 Speaker 1: they've been searching for days um and and at this 110 00:08:05,760 --> 00:08:09,480 Speaker 1: point they have been able to identify one of them, 111 00:08:09,640 --> 00:08:12,400 Speaker 1: and it is in fact one of those young men 112 00:08:12,440 --> 00:08:14,480 Speaker 1: who have been who have been missing since last week, 113 00:08:14,600 --> 00:08:19,480 Speaker 1: nineteen nineteen year old Dean Finocciario uh and and and 114 00:08:19,600 --> 00:08:23,600 Speaker 1: the district attorney UH made no hesitation about it to 115 00:08:23,640 --> 00:08:26,760 Speaker 1: say that they are investigating this as a homicide. The 116 00:08:26,840 --> 00:08:30,520 Speaker 1: question though, is, uh, you know how many homicides are there, 117 00:08:31,000 --> 00:08:34,559 Speaker 1: um and and and what was the nature of these homicide? 118 00:08:34,640 --> 00:08:38,160 Speaker 1: We we don't know how this how this young man 119 00:08:38,320 --> 00:08:42,400 Speaker 1: was killed. The district attorney chose not to UM dive 120 00:08:42,440 --> 00:08:44,680 Speaker 1: into that if if they in fact know that answer 121 00:08:44,720 --> 00:08:47,640 Speaker 1: at this point, that is something we we are of 122 00:08:47,679 --> 00:08:50,800 Speaker 1: course going to the right now. When they say multiple bodies, 123 00:08:51,200 --> 00:08:53,800 Speaker 1: they don't we don't know if they're just the four 124 00:08:53,880 --> 00:08:57,240 Speaker 1: missing boys. If all four missing boys are in this 125 00:08:57,559 --> 00:09:00,400 Speaker 1: so called common grave, that's a nice way of putting 126 00:09:00,400 --> 00:09:03,320 Speaker 1: in a common grave. It's a mass grave. There are 127 00:09:03,320 --> 00:09:06,280 Speaker 1: many bodies in there. Under the law, more than one 128 00:09:06,360 --> 00:09:11,200 Speaker 1: body equals mass as in mass killing. It leads me 129 00:09:11,320 --> 00:09:16,000 Speaker 1: to think that there are more homicide victims in that 130 00:09:16,200 --> 00:09:20,880 Speaker 1: so called common grave. Mass grave authorities are in the process, 131 00:09:21,040 --> 00:09:24,480 Speaker 1: as Jamie Stover from w f m Z TV is 132 00:09:24,520 --> 00:09:29,160 Speaker 1: telling us of identifying further remains which were found by 133 00:09:29,200 --> 00:09:32,400 Speaker 1: the use of cadaver dogs that they had deployed in 134 00:09:32,440 --> 00:09:37,040 Speaker 1: the search of this property belonging to DiNardo's family and 135 00:09:37,080 --> 00:09:40,360 Speaker 1: according to a friend of Mayo, one of the missing boys, 136 00:09:41,280 --> 00:09:45,559 Speaker 1: Denardos sold guns and marijuana and in the past has 137 00:09:45,679 --> 00:09:52,000 Speaker 1: bragged about killing somebody over some money. And I found 138 00:09:52,080 --> 00:09:57,520 Speaker 1: another connection. We have said in the past that DiNardo 139 00:09:57,720 --> 00:10:01,080 Speaker 1: was the Facebook friend of one of the missing boys, 140 00:10:01,160 --> 00:10:07,160 Speaker 1: Patrick Um. Jamie advised us they both attended school together 141 00:10:07,200 --> 00:10:10,640 Speaker 1: it was Holy Ghost Prep School and been sale them. 142 00:10:10,679 --> 00:10:14,280 Speaker 1: But this almost broke my heart. We we learned that Patrick, 143 00:10:14,320 --> 00:10:19,239 Speaker 1: who had just finished his freshman year at Loyola in Baltimore, 144 00:10:19,760 --> 00:10:23,280 Speaker 1: just finished his first year of college. He and DiNardo 145 00:10:23,760 --> 00:10:27,520 Speaker 1: were both members of a public Facebook group for buying 146 00:10:27,600 --> 00:10:33,400 Speaker 1: and selling sneakers. If you look on de Nardo's flicker account, 147 00:10:33,400 --> 00:10:36,040 Speaker 1: what we believe to be his flicker account, there are 148 00:10:36,040 --> 00:10:40,960 Speaker 1: a hundred and eighty seven photos of shoes. Okay, he 149 00:10:41,040 --> 00:10:44,680 Speaker 1: had plenty of time to do that, including very expensive 150 00:10:44,720 --> 00:10:50,760 Speaker 1: air Jordan's and Nikes. UM. Interesting some of those images. 151 00:10:50,800 --> 00:10:54,800 Speaker 1: Some of those pictures of tennis shoes show bullets set 152 00:10:54,880 --> 00:11:00,800 Speaker 1: up next to the shoes. What if pennything is leading 153 00:11:00,840 --> 00:11:06,720 Speaker 1: you to believe, Jamie Stover that all four boys, all 154 00:11:06,800 --> 00:11:10,760 Speaker 1: four missing Bucks County boys, are in that mass grave. Well, 155 00:11:10,800 --> 00:11:14,040 Speaker 1: we don't have any confirmation of that. UM. The only 156 00:11:14,080 --> 00:11:17,320 Speaker 1: connection there is that they've been looking for four young men. 157 00:11:17,559 --> 00:11:21,560 Speaker 1: They've been looking for four young men UM on that 158 00:11:21,679 --> 00:11:26,000 Speaker 1: property UM, and they have found multiple human remains, as 159 00:11:26,000 --> 00:11:29,199 Speaker 1: the district attorney put it, and one of them UM 160 00:11:29,400 --> 00:11:32,320 Speaker 1: did match the one of the young men who was missing. 161 00:11:32,440 --> 00:11:34,920 Speaker 1: So you know, at this point it's it's a bit 162 00:11:34,920 --> 00:11:39,120 Speaker 1: of a waiting game. We don't know. The DA was asked, 163 00:11:39,200 --> 00:11:43,320 Speaker 1: were there potentially other people that we haven't been reporting 164 00:11:43,320 --> 00:11:46,600 Speaker 1: on that may have been in that grave? UM, and 165 00:11:46,840 --> 00:11:50,559 Speaker 1: the district attorney did say yesterday after a quick slip 166 00:11:50,640 --> 00:11:53,240 Speaker 1: up that they don't believe so um that they don't 167 00:11:53,280 --> 00:11:57,319 Speaker 1: believe that there are other individuals, but it's it. They 168 00:11:57,320 --> 00:12:00,440 Speaker 1: are looking into it of course. Um and and uh, 169 00:12:01,040 --> 00:12:03,080 Speaker 1: I mean that's basically where it stands. I mean they're 170 00:12:03,120 --> 00:12:07,120 Speaker 1: saying they don't know how many bodies are in this 171 00:12:07,200 --> 00:12:12,400 Speaker 1: mass grade. Now, this family began to a mass a 172 00:12:12,480 --> 00:12:17,800 Speaker 1: commercial and residential real estate holding empire thanks to Cosmo 173 00:12:17,880 --> 00:12:22,360 Speaker 1: di Nardo's late a grandfather. He started buying real estate 174 00:12:22,400 --> 00:12:25,360 Speaker 1: all the way back in the seventies. They have family 175 00:12:25,400 --> 00:12:29,600 Speaker 1: properties in Philadelphia. They have a multi unit apartment building, 176 00:12:30,040 --> 00:12:35,360 Speaker 1: another building least to a nonprofit organization. There is a 177 00:12:35,400 --> 00:12:40,440 Speaker 1: home and Ben Salem, where his grandson, Cosmo di Nardo 178 00:12:40,720 --> 00:12:48,199 Speaker 1: was twice arrested this week. What more do we know about? Well, 179 00:12:48,320 --> 00:12:53,320 Speaker 1: hold on, that's not even the end. Um. Denardo's dad 180 00:12:54,440 --> 00:13:01,880 Speaker 1: also purchased commercial properties in Montgomery. There's a strip of storefronts. Um, 181 00:13:01,880 --> 00:13:06,000 Speaker 1: it goes on and on, and they use this main 182 00:13:06,160 --> 00:13:11,600 Speaker 1: family residence where they control their business empire. There's a 183 00:13:11,640 --> 00:13:17,760 Speaker 1: Philadelphia home. Um for more properties in Philadelphia to in 184 00:13:17,880 --> 00:13:22,560 Speaker 1: Ben Salem. My point is this is a really rich 185 00:13:22,679 --> 00:13:29,199 Speaker 1: family probably never would have suspected anything like this going 186 00:13:29,320 --> 00:13:33,240 Speaker 1: on on their property. And I just wonder how the 187 00:13:33,360 --> 00:13:38,240 Speaker 1: parents I didn't know something odd was going on. Well 188 00:13:38,320 --> 00:13:42,760 Speaker 1: that the district attorney is um hoping to speak to them, UM. 189 00:13:42,880 --> 00:13:48,199 Speaker 1: And yesterday the DiNardo family UH their their attorney that 190 00:13:48,240 --> 00:13:53,080 Speaker 1: they've retained UH did really statements saying that they are UM, 191 00:13:53,160 --> 00:13:57,040 Speaker 1: they are cooperating. But the district attorney did say in 192 00:13:57,080 --> 00:14:00,560 Speaker 1: one of his news conferences yesterday that it could really 193 00:14:00,960 --> 00:14:06,560 Speaker 1: uh used uh anyone really to help them out um 194 00:14:06,600 --> 00:14:11,120 Speaker 1: with this investigation. Although it is clear that the district 195 00:14:11,120 --> 00:14:14,280 Speaker 1: attorney does believe that you spoke a little bit about 196 00:14:14,320 --> 00:14:19,800 Speaker 1: family finances, that the family could afford to bail him 197 00:14:19,840 --> 00:14:24,240 Speaker 1: out again, um, even given that DiNardo on that car 198 00:14:24,360 --> 00:14:27,120 Speaker 1: charge of stolen car charge. The judge set his bail 199 00:14:27,160 --> 00:14:30,800 Speaker 1: at five million dollars straight and the district attorney made 200 00:14:30,840 --> 00:14:33,400 Speaker 1: a point in the courtroom to say that he believes 201 00:14:33,440 --> 00:14:36,160 Speaker 1: that the family probably could afford to cover that five 202 00:14:36,160 --> 00:14:40,840 Speaker 1: million dollars to to get DeNardo out of prison. That 203 00:14:40,920 --> 00:14:44,480 Speaker 1: has not happened at this point. UM. The district attorney 204 00:14:44,600 --> 00:14:48,400 Speaker 1: UH said last night that they had hoped that this 205 00:14:48,600 --> 00:14:53,360 Speaker 1: made buy them some time. Um, you know, not really 206 00:14:53,640 --> 00:14:57,600 Speaker 1: entirely sure what that means. There have been no homicide 207 00:14:57,680 --> 00:15:01,680 Speaker 1: charges filed against anyone at this point, but that the 208 00:15:01,760 --> 00:15:05,920 Speaker 1: d A is working toward that. Whether or not, um 209 00:15:05,960 --> 00:15:07,640 Speaker 1: you know, what kind of time they think they need 210 00:15:07,680 --> 00:15:10,160 Speaker 1: for that remains to be seen. But what do we 211 00:15:10,320 --> 00:15:14,160 Speaker 1: know about the grand jury proceedings in that jurisdiction. In 212 00:15:14,240 --> 00:15:17,040 Speaker 1: a lot of large jurisdictions, for instance, the one where 213 00:15:17,040 --> 00:15:20,120 Speaker 1: I prosecuted, there was a grand jury. The same grand 214 00:15:20,200 --> 00:15:23,680 Speaker 1: jury was summoned twice a week. As I recall, it 215 00:15:23,720 --> 00:15:27,120 Speaker 1: was Tuesday and Thursday, and they would start early in 216 00:15:27,160 --> 00:15:30,600 Speaker 1: the morning, early early, like seven thirty eight o'clock. We 217 00:15:30,640 --> 00:15:33,320 Speaker 1: would start presenting to the grand jury, and it would 218 00:15:33,320 --> 00:15:37,240 Speaker 1: go past lunchtime or later if they had to, and 219 00:15:37,280 --> 00:15:42,000 Speaker 1: then they reconvene on Thursday, and there would be around 220 00:15:42,440 --> 00:15:46,400 Speaker 1: hundred fifty cases to two hundred cases and dieted each day, 221 00:15:47,840 --> 00:15:52,560 Speaker 1: which would be four hundred cases at least a week essentially, 222 00:15:53,160 --> 00:15:58,120 Speaker 1: and we would have multiple prosecutors presenting to the grand jury. 223 00:15:58,920 --> 00:16:02,480 Speaker 1: It only takes typically one witness to present a case 224 00:16:02,480 --> 00:16:05,640 Speaker 1: to a grand jury, because hearsay is allowed at a 225 00:16:05,640 --> 00:16:10,240 Speaker 1: grand jury proceeding. It's not an issue of guilt or innocence. 226 00:16:10,720 --> 00:16:14,800 Speaker 1: It's simply is there enough evidence for this case to 227 00:16:14,800 --> 00:16:18,720 Speaker 1: go to a jury to determine. So one witness can 228 00:16:18,760 --> 00:16:23,520 Speaker 1: come in i e. The lead investigator and state what 229 00:16:23,680 --> 00:16:27,200 Speaker 1: has been found so far, including heresay, and the grand 230 00:16:27,280 --> 00:16:31,520 Speaker 1: jury decides they simply do ya or nay? Build true 231 00:16:31,560 --> 00:16:35,600 Speaker 1: bill or no bill. True Bill goes on to a 232 00:16:35,680 --> 00:16:39,480 Speaker 1: Pettit jury, a jury of twelve. No Bill, It's over, 233 00:16:39,640 --> 00:16:44,480 Speaker 1: It's dropped. We also were learning, as we now know, 234 00:16:44,720 --> 00:16:51,160 Speaker 1: human remains found on the DeNardo estate, reports that his 235 00:16:51,360 --> 00:16:56,120 Speaker 1: parents are facing a grand jury on Thursday. This is 236 00:16:56,200 --> 00:16:59,240 Speaker 1: one week after the first of four young men in 237 00:16:59,280 --> 00:17:02,800 Speaker 1: Bucks County go is missing. Reports are that Antonio and 238 00:17:02,800 --> 00:17:07,200 Speaker 1: Sandra DeNardo will face a grand jury on Thursday morning. 239 00:17:08,080 --> 00:17:12,760 Speaker 1: The grand jury investigation may help get answers in the case, 240 00:17:12,840 --> 00:17:18,639 Speaker 1: including details on Cosmo Denardo's their son's location in movements 241 00:17:19,280 --> 00:17:22,840 Speaker 1: during the week the four boys go missing. Now they've 242 00:17:22,840 --> 00:17:26,720 Speaker 1: got a great lawyer. His name is Fortunato Perry Jr. 243 00:17:27,200 --> 00:17:31,320 Speaker 1: Issued a statement saying the family sympathizes with the families 244 00:17:31,320 --> 00:17:35,240 Speaker 1: of the missing men in our cooperating m hmmm. It's 245 00:17:35,280 --> 00:17:38,600 Speaker 1: gonna be a toughie to cooperate fully when it may 246 00:17:38,680 --> 00:17:42,080 Speaker 1: cost your son life behind bars. Is there a death 247 00:17:42,080 --> 00:17:48,000 Speaker 1: penalty in Pennsylvania, Jamie, I assume death lethal injection, death 248 00:17:48,000 --> 00:17:51,280 Speaker 1: by needles. While we haven't had one actually in Pennsylvania 249 00:17:51,320 --> 00:17:53,560 Speaker 1: in a very long time, even though they do have 250 00:17:53,640 --> 00:17:56,880 Speaker 1: that sentence, it's been more than a decade since there 251 00:17:56,920 --> 00:18:02,200 Speaker 1: has actually been an execution um in Pennsylvania. Um And 252 00:18:02,320 --> 00:18:05,560 Speaker 1: and you know, and not all would would stem from 253 00:18:05,600 --> 00:18:08,120 Speaker 1: you know, that's uh getting way ahead, but that would 254 00:18:08,119 --> 00:18:10,639 Speaker 1: all depend on on whether prosecutors think that there are 255 00:18:10,680 --> 00:18:14,280 Speaker 1: aggravating circumstances here or that they could go after that 256 00:18:14,480 --> 00:18:16,880 Speaker 1: sort of sort of sentence. And at this point we're 257 00:18:16,920 --> 00:18:19,560 Speaker 1: still waiting to see of you know, if a homicide 258 00:18:19,760 --> 00:18:22,720 Speaker 1: charge comes into play, and and and who that charge 259 00:18:22,720 --> 00:18:26,320 Speaker 1: is against at this point, well, I can guarantee you this. 260 00:18:27,000 --> 00:18:31,560 Speaker 1: You know, I'm certainly no um clairvoyant, but there's going 261 00:18:31,600 --> 00:18:34,160 Speaker 1: to be a homicide charge. There will be at least 262 00:18:34,200 --> 00:18:37,720 Speaker 1: one homicide charge, because you don't just fall over by 263 00:18:37,760 --> 00:18:42,359 Speaker 1: accident into a mass grave and bury yourself. Also, what 264 00:18:42,520 --> 00:18:46,440 Speaker 1: they have been through law enforcement and finding these four 265 00:18:46,480 --> 00:18:50,919 Speaker 1: boys has been painstaking using heavy equipment to dig a 266 00:18:51,000 --> 00:18:55,159 Speaker 1: deep ditch on the property and then sifting through each 267 00:18:55,640 --> 00:19:03,639 Speaker 1: bucket of dirt by hand. That's how painstakingly they have 268 00:19:03,760 --> 00:19:09,359 Speaker 1: searched this property, searching through each bucket of dirt by hand. 269 00:19:14,720 --> 00:19:18,440 Speaker 1: Still with me, Jamie Stover from w f m Z TV, 270 00:19:18,760 --> 00:19:22,800 Speaker 1: and we were talking about the four missing Bucks County boys. 271 00:19:23,359 --> 00:19:27,199 Speaker 1: One body now discovered. Jamie, what can you tell me 272 00:19:27,240 --> 00:19:32,200 Speaker 1: about allegations the person of interest, Cosmo di Nardo, had 273 00:19:32,320 --> 00:19:36,400 Speaker 1: not just been selling sneakers online, but guns and marijuana 274 00:19:36,600 --> 00:19:40,800 Speaker 1: and even bragging about having somebody killed over money. I 275 00:19:40,840 --> 00:19:43,520 Speaker 1: can't tell you anything about that. Of course, there are 276 00:19:44,280 --> 00:19:47,080 Speaker 1: if you go on any any news site or our 277 00:19:47,200 --> 00:19:50,640 Speaker 1: social media where where the story has been tracked, UM, 278 00:19:51,040 --> 00:19:54,680 Speaker 1: you may find a thousand different theories on this. But 279 00:19:54,680 --> 00:19:58,919 Speaker 1: but the reality is at this point, UM investcuators have 280 00:19:59,000 --> 00:20:01,879 Speaker 1: given no indication asian on on what exactly may have 281 00:20:01,960 --> 00:20:07,600 Speaker 1: been going on here, what may have led um what? How? Uh? 282 00:20:07,840 --> 00:20:11,440 Speaker 1: Dean Fernucciario the only one of these males who has 283 00:20:11,640 --> 00:20:15,600 Speaker 1: um been located. Of course, as we mentioned, um found 284 00:20:15,760 --> 00:20:18,399 Speaker 1: found dead. We don't know how we got to that property. 285 00:20:18,480 --> 00:20:21,240 Speaker 1: We don't know why, we don't know the extent of 286 00:20:21,280 --> 00:20:24,160 Speaker 1: that relationship. These are all the details that we're still 287 00:20:24,600 --> 00:20:28,720 Speaker 1: waiting for prosecutors to answer, um as as we try 288 00:20:28,760 --> 00:20:32,480 Speaker 1: to understand really what happened in this whole thing. Um. 289 00:20:32,520 --> 00:20:35,359 Speaker 1: You know, how how how four young men and you know, 290 00:20:35,359 --> 00:20:37,679 Speaker 1: all around the same age, and four from parts of 291 00:20:37,720 --> 00:20:40,680 Speaker 1: the county go missing. Well, it's amazing to me if 292 00:20:40,760 --> 00:20:44,280 Speaker 1: this is true, that he had been selling marijuana and 293 00:20:44,480 --> 00:20:48,520 Speaker 1: guns and he was already under some type of provi 294 00:20:48,840 --> 00:20:52,560 Speaker 1: provisor not to have that weapon, the Savage Arms twenty 295 00:20:52,640 --> 00:20:55,119 Speaker 1: gage and the mm O that had to be a 296 00:20:55,119 --> 00:20:58,840 Speaker 1: place for a reason that he was still at it. 297 00:20:59,440 --> 00:21:02,479 Speaker 1: If these allegations are true, Jamie, what do we know 298 00:21:02,760 --> 00:21:06,400 Speaker 1: about the four boys themselves? I know one was a 299 00:21:06,440 --> 00:21:11,000 Speaker 1: freshman at Loyola and upcoming sophomore. What else do we know? Well, 300 00:21:11,000 --> 00:21:16,040 Speaker 1: we know Thomas Mio, the young man whom whose car 301 00:21:16,119 --> 00:21:21,040 Speaker 1: was found on the DiNardo property. I've heard him described 302 00:21:21,080 --> 00:21:24,480 Speaker 1: as as nothing but a good kid. Um. And and 303 00:21:24,600 --> 00:21:28,760 Speaker 1: that goes from from family, Uh, that goes to two friends, 304 00:21:29,080 --> 00:21:34,439 Speaker 1: UM and his best friend, UM Mark Sturgis, who is 305 00:21:34,480 --> 00:21:38,959 Speaker 1: also one of the four young missing men. UM was 306 00:21:39,040 --> 00:21:43,400 Speaker 1: his best friend. They worked together for Sturgis's dad's construction company. 307 00:21:43,400 --> 00:21:47,280 Speaker 1: In fact, that is the last time that they were 308 00:21:47,920 --> 00:21:51,920 Speaker 1: seen together. It was the Sturgis family understanding that their 309 00:21:52,040 --> 00:21:54,560 Speaker 1: son was going to be meeting with his best friend, 310 00:21:54,640 --> 00:21:59,240 Speaker 1: which wouldn't seem out of the ordinary to um for 311 00:21:59,240 --> 00:22:01,120 Speaker 1: for a young for a young man do to want 312 00:22:01,119 --> 00:22:03,280 Speaker 1: to hang out with his friend. But what stuck out 313 00:22:03,280 --> 00:22:07,080 Speaker 1: to them is when when their son's car after he 314 00:22:07,160 --> 00:22:09,640 Speaker 1: went missing, turned up at a at a shopping centers. 315 00:22:09,720 --> 00:22:13,920 Speaker 1: As you and I spoke yesterday, that wouldn't really scream 316 00:22:14,240 --> 00:22:17,120 Speaker 1: young young man in his twenties. It's just not that 317 00:22:17,720 --> 00:22:22,000 Speaker 1: uh kind of environment um most likely. But really we've 318 00:22:22,000 --> 00:22:24,479 Speaker 1: heard nothing but good thing again. I saw all the 319 00:22:24,520 --> 00:22:27,840 Speaker 1: pictures look like middle aged ladies walking around in a 320 00:22:27,920 --> 00:22:30,879 Speaker 1: Talbot's outfit. That's what it looked like. You know, one 321 00:22:30,920 --> 00:22:34,800 Speaker 1: of those Yankee candles shop type centers where they have, 322 00:22:35,440 --> 00:22:39,120 Speaker 1: you know, stuff you'd sit around on your your coffee 323 00:22:39,119 --> 00:22:45,240 Speaker 1: table or on a shelf, upscale shopping for do dad's. 324 00:22:45,400 --> 00:22:48,480 Speaker 1: I guess you'd say it's what it looked like. Maybe 325 00:22:48,760 --> 00:22:52,280 Speaker 1: very very touristy and very very upscale. Just didn't make 326 00:22:52,480 --> 00:22:55,879 Speaker 1: sense to me. So I know that one of them 327 00:22:56,200 --> 00:23:02,320 Speaker 1: went to Loyola. I know that Um, some of them 328 00:23:02,320 --> 00:23:06,120 Speaker 1: were friends. We don't know how one third one, one 329 00:23:06,200 --> 00:23:10,399 Speaker 1: fourth one was actually connected. Now what do we know 330 00:23:10,680 --> 00:23:15,480 Speaker 1: about one of them? Mayo, being a talented wrestler, had 331 00:23:15,520 --> 00:23:20,200 Speaker 1: been friends since uh grade school with some of the 332 00:23:20,240 --> 00:23:25,080 Speaker 1: missing boys, but graduated from Ben Salem High School. Described 333 00:23:25,119 --> 00:23:30,520 Speaker 1: as good hearted, hard working, a great athlete. I mean 334 00:23:30,560 --> 00:23:33,560 Speaker 1: it just goes on from there. It sounds like these 335 00:23:33,720 --> 00:23:38,000 Speaker 1: four missing boys, we're just scrubbed in sunshine. I don't 336 00:23:38,000 --> 00:23:41,080 Speaker 1: know how they got mixed up in all of this. 337 00:23:41,960 --> 00:23:45,560 Speaker 1: And that's what everyone's wondering is, you know what is UM? 338 00:23:45,600 --> 00:23:48,240 Speaker 1: And that's been a question from the beginning that I think, 339 00:23:48,400 --> 00:23:51,880 Speaker 1: you know, the community is still uh waiting to hear 340 00:23:51,960 --> 00:23:56,000 Speaker 1: that hear that answer on on how exactly UM did 341 00:23:56,040 --> 00:23:59,320 Speaker 1: this all unfold? Were their conversations leading up to this 342 00:23:59,800 --> 00:24:03,639 Speaker 1: and other thing? Jamie, I don't understand why there's any bond, 343 00:24:04,200 --> 00:24:07,439 Speaker 1: any bond at all. Do you have to grant bond 344 00:24:07,600 --> 00:24:10,800 Speaker 1: on a murder charge in that jurisdiction? I mean, he 345 00:24:10,920 --> 00:24:14,159 Speaker 1: made bond on a million dollars. His parents have millions 346 00:24:14,200 --> 00:24:19,359 Speaker 1: at their fingertips, apparently with all all their holdings, so 347 00:24:19,760 --> 00:24:22,359 Speaker 1: it seems like almost no matter what bond they're gonna 348 00:24:22,400 --> 00:24:25,080 Speaker 1: give di Nardo, he's going to make it. They only 349 00:24:25,080 --> 00:24:29,280 Speaker 1: have to put up ten of the bond, so not 350 00:24:29,400 --> 00:24:33,399 Speaker 1: only is it cash, but they could use collateral h 351 00:24:33,480 --> 00:24:36,320 Speaker 1: such as you know, sign over their house note that 352 00:24:36,560 --> 00:24:40,960 Speaker 1: equals the bond steak. So no matter what they put 353 00:24:41,000 --> 00:24:44,280 Speaker 1: in as a bond amount on murder, this family can 354 00:24:44,359 --> 00:24:49,520 Speaker 1: probably make it. Is there any possibility of no bond 355 00:24:49,880 --> 00:24:52,280 Speaker 1: that that's my curiosity right now? Why does he have 356 00:24:52,359 --> 00:24:56,440 Speaker 1: to get out? And it is my understanding in Pennsylvania 357 00:24:56,800 --> 00:25:00,280 Speaker 1: from all that I've ever seen. UM and obviously an 358 00:25:00,280 --> 00:25:03,520 Speaker 1: attorney would probably the best to ask that question too, 359 00:25:03,520 --> 00:25:08,000 Speaker 1: But it's my understanding that homicide charge is the only 360 00:25:08,119 --> 00:25:11,560 Speaker 1: charge in which a judge could set no bail. But 361 00:25:11,640 --> 00:25:15,440 Speaker 1: that was a big, big point of Uh. I think 362 00:25:15,440 --> 00:25:19,400 Speaker 1: you're right because that's true in many jurisdictions there can 363 00:25:19,440 --> 00:25:24,040 Speaker 1: be no bond and for many reasons. A that he 364 00:25:24,080 --> 00:25:26,879 Speaker 1: could be a flight risk. With a passport and money, 365 00:25:26,920 --> 00:25:29,480 Speaker 1: he could be gone if in fact, he has been 366 00:25:29,480 --> 00:25:34,920 Speaker 1: selling marijuana. Uh, if he has been bragging about other deaths, 367 00:25:35,800 --> 00:25:38,679 Speaker 1: then he's not only a flight risk, but he's a 368 00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:42,600 Speaker 1: danger to the community. We also know that he's allegedly 369 00:25:42,720 --> 00:25:46,120 Speaker 1: had mental issues that makes him a danger to himself. 370 00:25:46,600 --> 00:25:51,200 Speaker 1: So there are many reasons he should not get bond. 371 00:25:51,960 --> 00:25:55,080 Speaker 1: And this is what's so scary right now to parents 372 00:25:55,160 --> 00:25:58,439 Speaker 1: all over the country hearing this. He couldn't ask for 373 00:25:58,480 --> 00:26:01,959 Speaker 1: four better boys than these boys that have gone missing. 374 00:26:02,000 --> 00:26:08,000 Speaker 1: Now one we know dead. You never know who your 375 00:26:08,320 --> 00:26:12,400 Speaker 1: children are coming in contact with, who their families really are, 376 00:26:12,520 --> 00:26:16,879 Speaker 1: who they really are on something as tenuous as a 377 00:26:17,080 --> 00:26:24,120 Speaker 1: sneaker exchange Facebook group. It's just it's very, very scary 378 00:26:24,160 --> 00:26:27,280 Speaker 1: to me as a parent. We are bringing you the 379 00:26:27,440 --> 00:26:31,080 Speaker 1: very latest here on crime stories and joining me Jamie 380 00:26:31,840 --> 00:26:35,760 Speaker 1: Jamie Stover from w f m Z TV. Jamie is 381 00:26:35,800 --> 00:26:39,440 Speaker 1: headed out right now for more on this. Jamie. Thank 382 00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:41,880 Speaker 1: you so much for being with us, friend, and thank 383 00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:45,560 Speaker 1: you for having me. We are expecting more from authorities 384 00:26:45,960 --> 00:26:50,760 Speaker 1: as they continue to search, but at this hour, our 385 00:26:50,800 --> 00:26:56,280 Speaker 1: thoughts and prayers with the families of these four boys, 386 00:26:56,359 --> 00:27:00,399 Speaker 1: the Bucks County Boys. Thank you again for being with us. 387 00:27:01,600 --> 00:27:04,960 Speaker 1: Mother Anna Schroeder comes home from work to her Morris 388 00:27:05,000 --> 00:27:08,840 Speaker 1: and Illinois home to see her daughter Anna, who was 389 00:27:08,960 --> 00:27:12,639 Speaker 1: waiting on her, or so she thought, but instead of 390 00:27:12,760 --> 00:27:17,720 Speaker 1: meeting her loving daughter at the door. Mom Peggy has 391 00:27:17,800 --> 00:27:20,960 Speaker 1: a towel thrown over her face and then she is 392 00:27:21,080 --> 00:27:26,160 Speaker 1: shot in the head in her own living room. After that, 393 00:27:26,680 --> 00:27:31,160 Speaker 1: the home was burned down in an effort to cover 394 00:27:31,280 --> 00:27:35,680 Speaker 1: up the crime. I'm Nancy, Grace, this is crime stories. 395 00:27:35,680 --> 00:27:39,879 Speaker 1: Thank you for being with us. But now her little girl, 396 00:27:40,520 --> 00:27:46,119 Speaker 1: what has become of Anna Schroder. She's charged with murder. 397 00:27:46,480 --> 00:27:49,639 Speaker 1: That's what's happened to Anna Schroeder, the little girl that 398 00:27:49,680 --> 00:27:54,720 Speaker 1: mommy rushed home from work to see. Yes, according to prosecutors, 399 00:27:54,760 --> 00:27:59,400 Speaker 1: it was little Anna, mommy's little girl, that covered her 400 00:27:59,440 --> 00:28:03,960 Speaker 1: own mother's face with a towel before shooting her dead. 401 00:28:04,480 --> 00:28:07,240 Speaker 1: I'm I'm overwhelmed, you know. I think of all the 402 00:28:07,280 --> 00:28:11,960 Speaker 1: times I race, race, I nearly kill myself, trying to 403 00:28:12,000 --> 00:28:14,800 Speaker 1: get home to the twins, trying to get the twins 404 00:28:14,800 --> 00:28:17,040 Speaker 1: to school, trying to get there to pick them up 405 00:28:17,080 --> 00:28:19,760 Speaker 1: on time, trying to get them to soccer or to piano, 406 00:28:19,920 --> 00:28:23,600 Speaker 1: to Oh. It's a constant race to do everything for 407 00:28:23,840 --> 00:28:27,760 Speaker 1: your children, to be that mom in the Hallmark movie 408 00:28:27,800 --> 00:28:31,480 Speaker 1: and the Hallmark card, that perfect mom, that perfect family. 409 00:28:31,560 --> 00:28:35,720 Speaker 1: And that's what Peggy Schroeder was trying to do racing 410 00:28:35,760 --> 00:28:39,440 Speaker 1: home to get dinner ready for her little girl. She's dead. 411 00:28:40,040 --> 00:28:43,760 Speaker 1: Joining me right now is a very special guest, a 412 00:28:43,880 --> 00:28:50,840 Speaker 1: longtime friend and colleague, Dr Bethany Marshall, psychoanalyst out of 413 00:28:50,880 --> 00:28:55,120 Speaker 1: the l A area. Bethany is so great to hear 414 00:28:55,160 --> 00:28:59,040 Speaker 1: your voice, even if it's over the airwaves. Fancy, it 415 00:28:59,160 --> 00:29:01,600 Speaker 1: is wonderful to be on air with you, and I'm 416 00:29:01,800 --> 00:29:04,640 Speaker 1: feel so privileged to be talking about this story. It's 417 00:29:04,720 --> 00:29:06,960 Speaker 1: it's horrific, but I'm glad we're going to be able 418 00:29:07,000 --> 00:29:10,680 Speaker 1: to get into the details. You know, matricide as it's 419 00:29:10,760 --> 00:29:14,600 Speaker 1: called or parenticide, which is slang, a slang term for 420 00:29:14,680 --> 00:29:19,920 Speaker 1: when a child kills a parent is extremely rare. Less 421 00:29:19,920 --> 00:29:25,480 Speaker 1: than one percent of all murders are killing your mother, 422 00:29:26,040 --> 00:29:31,600 Speaker 1: less than one percent. But there's really no doubt in 423 00:29:31,640 --> 00:29:35,680 Speaker 1: my mind that Little Anna did this thing, because she 424 00:29:35,800 --> 00:29:41,160 Speaker 1: then texts to her friend Rachel Helm that she her 425 00:29:41,200 --> 00:29:44,520 Speaker 1: mom is dead, and the little friend doesn't believe it, 426 00:29:45,040 --> 00:29:51,320 Speaker 1: and she Little Anna, the daughter, texts a photo of 427 00:29:51,440 --> 00:29:56,040 Speaker 1: her mother dead to the friend Rachel, and I don't 428 00:29:56,040 --> 00:29:58,000 Speaker 1: know what's going on in Rachel's head, but then she 429 00:29:58,080 --> 00:30:01,640 Speaker 1: rushes over to her friend's house to try to dispose 430 00:30:01,720 --> 00:30:03,760 Speaker 1: of the body, and when they can't figure out what 431 00:30:03,840 --> 00:30:06,640 Speaker 1: to do, they burned the house down. You know, in 432 00:30:06,680 --> 00:30:10,120 Speaker 1: every case I ever tried Dr Bethany, there would always 433 00:30:10,160 --> 00:30:13,040 Speaker 1: be one fact that just tore my heart up, or 434 00:30:13,240 --> 00:30:16,160 Speaker 1: or made me them angriest, or made me sick to 435 00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:18,760 Speaker 1: my stomach. I remember I noticed it the first time 436 00:30:18,800 --> 00:30:21,280 Speaker 1: when I was prosecuting a carjack case. It was my 437 00:30:21,360 --> 00:30:26,120 Speaker 1: first carjack murder. And what got me threw me over 438 00:30:26,160 --> 00:30:28,479 Speaker 1: the edge. I had to leave the courtroom. By the way. 439 00:30:28,640 --> 00:30:30,440 Speaker 1: I didn't let the jury see that I was upset. 440 00:30:31,040 --> 00:30:32,960 Speaker 1: I had them excused and I left for just a 441 00:30:32,960 --> 00:30:36,960 Speaker 1: moment to compose myself. Was this fact a young guy 442 00:30:37,280 --> 00:30:42,280 Speaker 1: was carjacked and murdered. People heard the gunshot and they 443 00:30:42,400 --> 00:30:45,120 Speaker 1: ran out of their homes. It was a nice neighborhood, 444 00:30:45,760 --> 00:30:50,480 Speaker 1: and they see the young victim lying on somebody's driveway 445 00:30:50,480 --> 00:30:53,520 Speaker 1: bleeding from a head wound. Somebody rushed in and got 446 00:30:53,520 --> 00:30:56,480 Speaker 1: a pillow and came out and put it under his head. 447 00:30:56,920 --> 00:30:59,680 Speaker 1: I mean, he was dead and they put a pillow 448 00:31:00,240 --> 00:31:04,280 Speaker 1: under his head. And that act to this day, I 449 00:31:04,280 --> 00:31:09,920 Speaker 1: don't know. There's something so poignant and so evocative the 450 00:31:10,080 --> 00:31:13,600 Speaker 1: human mind and the human psyche. I got a conviction, 451 00:31:13,640 --> 00:31:16,320 Speaker 1: the guy went to jail for life. Okay, but that 452 00:31:16,400 --> 00:31:20,160 Speaker 1: pillow the act of the neighbor. And in this case, 453 00:31:20,600 --> 00:31:25,080 Speaker 1: it's a different a different emotion, Bethany, It's that the 454 00:31:25,120 --> 00:31:29,240 Speaker 1: girl not only kills her mother, but thinks so little 455 00:31:29,280 --> 00:31:33,600 Speaker 1: of her. She sends a Facebook picture of her mother 456 00:31:34,160 --> 00:31:38,960 Speaker 1: or a text of her mother's dead, bloody body. Bethany, 457 00:31:39,080 --> 00:31:42,640 Speaker 1: what what helped me? Well? And there's even more Nancy. 458 00:31:42,680 --> 00:31:46,880 Speaker 1: According to one report I read, Anna comes home and 459 00:31:47,080 --> 00:31:50,120 Speaker 1: asks her mother to put the towel over her face 460 00:31:50,200 --> 00:31:52,880 Speaker 1: before he shot. She shoots her, so I don't know 461 00:31:53,080 --> 00:31:55,600 Speaker 1: she threw it over her mother's face or she asked 462 00:31:55,640 --> 00:31:57,920 Speaker 1: her mother to put it over her face. And it 463 00:31:57,960 --> 00:32:00,880 Speaker 1: was a clean shot into the four head. So you 464 00:32:00,960 --> 00:32:05,840 Speaker 1: can imagine that this this innocent mother who actually also 465 00:32:05,920 --> 00:32:09,000 Speaker 1: happened to be deaf. This is a deaf mom who 466 00:32:09,040 --> 00:32:13,040 Speaker 1: had adopted Anna and an older sister of Anna's, so 467 00:32:13,080 --> 00:32:15,800 Speaker 1: this is an adoptive mom. Anna asked her to put 468 00:32:15,800 --> 00:32:18,520 Speaker 1: the towel over her head. There's a clean shot to 469 00:32:18,600 --> 00:32:23,280 Speaker 1: the forehead. Anna calls her friend Rachel, who actually happens 470 00:32:23,320 --> 00:32:26,520 Speaker 1: to also be Anna's lover. The two girls or girlfriends 471 00:32:26,520 --> 00:32:30,000 Speaker 1: their lovers, and Rachel doesn't believe it at first. Anna 472 00:32:30,240 --> 00:32:34,959 Speaker 1: texts a picture of her mother's bloodied body. Rachel comes 473 00:32:35,000 --> 00:32:38,600 Speaker 1: over to the house, actually helped, tries to help Anna 474 00:32:38,640 --> 00:32:42,600 Speaker 1: clean up the scene. They spend the night. They dragged 475 00:32:42,640 --> 00:32:46,480 Speaker 1: the body into the mother's bedroom. They spend the night together, 476 00:32:46,560 --> 00:32:49,800 Speaker 1: these two young lovers. He's fifteen year old, under the 477 00:32:50,080 --> 00:32:54,239 Speaker 1: same roof as Peggy Schroder, the deceased mother, under the 478 00:32:54,280 --> 00:32:58,400 Speaker 1: same roof as the corpse. And it's not until the 479 00:32:58,480 --> 00:33:00,560 Speaker 1: next day when they realize that are never going to 480 00:33:00,640 --> 00:33:03,920 Speaker 1: be able to to clean up or dispose of the remains, 481 00:33:03,920 --> 00:33:06,200 Speaker 1: that they decided to burn the house down. But you 482 00:33:06,200 --> 00:33:08,760 Speaker 1: were asking a little bit more about motive. You know, 483 00:33:09,200 --> 00:33:13,160 Speaker 1: in about fifty percent of these cases where daughters between 484 00:33:13,160 --> 00:33:15,680 Speaker 1: the ages of fifteen and seventeen killed their mothers, and 485 00:33:16,440 --> 00:33:21,080 Speaker 1: of the cases, there's extreme abuse going on in the household, 486 00:33:21,160 --> 00:33:23,640 Speaker 1: although I do not suspect that in this case, I 487 00:33:23,680 --> 00:33:26,960 Speaker 1: don't either, No, no, And the other fifty percent of cases, 488 00:33:26,960 --> 00:33:31,160 Speaker 1: what you have is something called antisocial personality disorder, where 489 00:33:31,200 --> 00:33:35,160 Speaker 1: you have a daughter that has simmering rage, resentment, lack 490 00:33:35,240 --> 00:33:39,760 Speaker 1: of conscience, detachment, abusive relationship towards a mother, and you 491 00:33:39,800 --> 00:33:44,880 Speaker 1: actually see an escalation of violence prior, prior or leading 492 00:33:44,920 --> 00:33:48,000 Speaker 1: up to the mattre side. In the cases where where 493 00:33:48,040 --> 00:33:51,520 Speaker 1: the daughter has been abused, what you see is the 494 00:33:51,600 --> 00:33:55,600 Speaker 1: daughter reaching out to maybe social workers, teachers, other types 495 00:33:55,600 --> 00:33:59,000 Speaker 1: of people outside the house, and when when they're unsuccessful, 496 00:33:59,040 --> 00:34:01,360 Speaker 1: then they'll kill the parents. But in this case you 497 00:34:01,560 --> 00:34:05,000 Speaker 1: probably see the escalating pattern of violence here there is 498 00:34:05,120 --> 00:34:09,440 Speaker 1: no indication that this mother, Peggy Schroeder, had been anything 499 00:34:09,520 --> 00:34:15,160 Speaker 1: but loving and caring and very self sacrificing for her children, 500 00:34:15,800 --> 00:34:20,680 Speaker 1: especially the daughter Anna. And then I wonder what is 501 00:34:20,719 --> 00:34:24,080 Speaker 1: in what goes on in the mind of a killer when, 502 00:34:24,520 --> 00:34:29,080 Speaker 1: for instance, Anna Schroeder, the daughter, posts a chilling message, 503 00:34:29,480 --> 00:34:33,160 Speaker 1: a very disturbing message to me anyway, on her mother's 504 00:34:33,200 --> 00:34:37,160 Speaker 1: Facebook page, telling her quote she would never forget her 505 00:34:37,600 --> 00:34:39,640 Speaker 1: and she loved her. And she goes on in the 506 00:34:39,640 --> 00:34:42,160 Speaker 1: post to say, quote, I don't even know if you 507 00:34:42,200 --> 00:34:44,960 Speaker 1: can see me right now, but if you can, I 508 00:34:45,040 --> 00:34:47,560 Speaker 1: just want you to know you were my best friend. 509 00:34:48,280 --> 00:34:54,160 Speaker 1: She's evil. She's evil, She's pure evil. She's a little girl, 510 00:34:54,560 --> 00:34:57,520 Speaker 1: but she is the devil Okay, Actually she looks like 511 00:34:57,520 --> 00:34:59,279 Speaker 1: it too. Did you see the photos of her? And 512 00:34:59,320 --> 00:35:02,439 Speaker 1: she's big, kind of doughey eyed, and her hair's dyed red. 513 00:35:03,040 --> 00:35:07,000 Speaker 1: Both girls dyed their hair after the crime. They changed 514 00:35:07,040 --> 00:35:09,399 Speaker 1: their hair color. What is that? I think they were 515 00:35:09,520 --> 00:35:12,480 Speaker 1: they were going to escape, but then Rachel, they were good, 516 00:35:12,600 --> 00:35:15,040 Speaker 1: I guess go on the lamb or or or try 517 00:35:15,080 --> 00:35:19,320 Speaker 1: to you know, evade consequences. But apparently Rachel went home, 518 00:35:19,800 --> 00:35:23,680 Speaker 1: told her mother. The mother drove drove Rachel straight to 519 00:35:23,719 --> 00:35:27,840 Speaker 1: the police station. Rachel confessed. It was while Rachel was 520 00:35:27,960 --> 00:35:32,719 Speaker 1: making the confession at the police station that Anna posted 521 00:35:32,719 --> 00:35:36,280 Speaker 1: the Facebook post. That's so creepy. I mean, it really 522 00:35:36,320 --> 00:35:39,520 Speaker 1: minimizes what she did to her mother. It's hard to 523 00:35:39,560 --> 00:35:41,839 Speaker 1: tell if she's trying to cover up the crime. It's, 524 00:35:42,200 --> 00:35:45,360 Speaker 1: you know, malingering that she's a good daughter who loves 525 00:35:45,400 --> 00:35:48,160 Speaker 1: her mother. If she's minimizing it. It could even be 526 00:35:48,280 --> 00:35:51,920 Speaker 1: that she's romanticizing the crime, that she's so happy that 527 00:35:52,000 --> 00:35:54,920 Speaker 1: her mother's gone that she does this. Can you talk 528 00:35:55,040 --> 00:35:59,080 Speaker 1: to us like a regular person. Police, don't throw a 529 00:35:59,080 --> 00:36:01,279 Speaker 1: lot of psychological terms on me. Now, I'm just a 530 00:36:01,360 --> 00:36:04,040 Speaker 1: j D alright, I'm just a trial lawyer, Well, what 531 00:36:04,080 --> 00:36:07,080 Speaker 1: are you saying romanticize the crime? I think that after 532 00:36:07,320 --> 00:36:11,560 Speaker 1: people in close family settings, after they commit homicide, alf 533 00:36:11,640 --> 00:36:14,759 Speaker 1: and there's what we call a relief phase where they're 534 00:36:14,760 --> 00:36:17,640 Speaker 1: actually glad that that other person is gone, that that 535 00:36:17,719 --> 00:36:20,480 Speaker 1: other person is not on this earth anymore. So the 536 00:36:21,040 --> 00:36:24,279 Speaker 1: Facebook post almost as like a love letter, sort of 537 00:36:24,320 --> 00:36:29,040 Speaker 1: glorifying dancing on her mother's grave. Mommy, I love you, 538 00:36:29,080 --> 00:36:31,759 Speaker 1: I love you. But but really what she's saying is 539 00:36:31,760 --> 00:36:35,279 Speaker 1: I'm happy you're gone. The daughter of a fifty three 540 00:36:35,320 --> 00:36:40,280 Speaker 1: year old mother, Peggy Schroeder, is now charged for shooting 541 00:36:40,320 --> 00:36:44,080 Speaker 1: her mother in the head. The mother, Peggy, whose body 542 00:36:44,160 --> 00:36:47,800 Speaker 1: was found in their burning home, home that she worked 543 00:36:47,880 --> 00:36:51,400 Speaker 1: so hard to provide for her family to her daughter's 544 00:36:52,040 --> 00:36:55,000 Speaker 1: She and a friend waited a day, tried to clean 545 00:36:55,120 --> 00:36:58,280 Speaker 1: up the crime scene, then set the house on fire 546 00:36:58,320 --> 00:37:02,880 Speaker 1: to conceal the crime of in two investigators. Now, Anna Schroeder, 547 00:37:03,160 --> 00:37:06,399 Speaker 1: the team girl, lived with her mother Peggy. She's now 548 00:37:06,520 --> 00:37:09,960 Speaker 1: charged with two counts, a first degree murder which I'm 549 00:37:10,000 --> 00:37:13,120 Speaker 1: sure is a malice murder, and a felony murder charge. 550 00:37:13,280 --> 00:37:16,680 Speaker 1: This is charging her in the alternative. That means that 551 00:37:16,760 --> 00:37:19,960 Speaker 1: if you take this to a jury. Malice murder requires 552 00:37:20,000 --> 00:37:23,200 Speaker 1: the jury finds some degree of premeditation for it. It 553 00:37:23,600 --> 00:37:25,479 Speaker 1: can be in the blink of an eye at the time. 554 00:37:25,480 --> 00:37:28,000 Speaker 1: It takes you to raise a gun and pull the trigger. 555 00:37:28,400 --> 00:37:32,759 Speaker 1: That's all that's required for malice or premeditation. There is 556 00:37:32,880 --> 00:37:36,720 Speaker 1: another form of first degree work called felony murder, which 557 00:37:36,800 --> 00:37:41,760 Speaker 1: is very simply that a death occurs during a felony. 558 00:37:42,000 --> 00:37:44,799 Speaker 1: For instance, Bethany Bethany and I go rob a bank, 559 00:37:44,920 --> 00:37:47,719 Speaker 1: Bethany gets crazy and shoots a bank teller. I can 560 00:37:47,760 --> 00:37:51,520 Speaker 1: be charged with felony murder because I'm committing a felony 561 00:37:51,600 --> 00:37:55,440 Speaker 1: and a death occurs during the felony I'm committing. Here, 562 00:37:55,560 --> 00:37:58,560 Speaker 1: it could be an aggravated assault with a weapon and 563 00:37:58,600 --> 00:38:02,760 Speaker 1: a death occurred. They're just that simple. She's also charged 564 00:38:02,800 --> 00:38:07,640 Speaker 1: with concealment of a homicidal death and arson. All of 565 00:38:07,680 --> 00:38:12,080 Speaker 1: those are felonies. Now here's the kicker, Dr Bethany Marshall. 566 00:38:12,600 --> 00:38:16,279 Speaker 1: Even though she's charged with first degree murder because she 567 00:38:16,400 --> 00:38:21,440 Speaker 1: is so young, the state law says she starts in 568 00:38:21,600 --> 00:38:25,879 Speaker 1: juvenile court. If she's convicted as a minor, she will 569 00:38:25,920 --> 00:38:30,400 Speaker 1: be out in about six years. M M. That is 570 00:38:30,480 --> 00:38:34,840 Speaker 1: so frightening, Nancy, because somebody who's this antisocial, maybe bordering 571 00:38:34,840 --> 00:38:38,720 Speaker 1: on sociopathic, They don't attach to other people, they don't 572 00:38:38,760 --> 00:38:41,839 Speaker 1: have a conscience, and when they kill, it's usually over 573 00:38:41,920 --> 00:38:46,200 Speaker 1: something very innocuous. In most cases of matricide, when you 574 00:38:46,320 --> 00:38:48,799 Speaker 1: rule out abuse, you know on the on the part 575 00:38:48,800 --> 00:38:52,320 Speaker 1: of the parent towards the child, it's something so minor, 576 00:38:52,440 --> 00:38:55,879 Speaker 1: like maybe her mother set a limit or told her 577 00:38:55,880 --> 00:38:58,080 Speaker 1: she wouldn't give her an extra twenty dollars to go 578 00:38:58,120 --> 00:39:01,240 Speaker 1: out shopping, or or or told her that she couldn't 579 00:39:01,239 --> 00:39:04,320 Speaker 1: see her girlfriend Rachel. It was probably something so minor 580 00:39:04,400 --> 00:39:09,320 Speaker 1: that spilled over into homicide. So imagine unleashing this woman 581 00:39:09,480 --> 00:39:14,160 Speaker 1: on society. Now listen to these details, Dr Bethany, and 582 00:39:14,239 --> 00:39:17,920 Speaker 1: I want to hear you shrink it. Anna Schroder allegedly 583 00:39:18,000 --> 00:39:21,359 Speaker 1: text the friend Rachel about what she did. Rachel did 584 00:39:21,400 --> 00:39:25,000 Speaker 1: not believe her, so Schroder sends her a picture of 585 00:39:25,040 --> 00:39:30,120 Speaker 1: her mother's dead body. Rachel had her mother give her 586 00:39:30,160 --> 00:39:34,200 Speaker 1: a ride to the Schroder's home that night, and the 587 00:39:34,280 --> 00:39:37,800 Speaker 1: girls try to get the blood out of the carpet. 588 00:39:38,239 --> 00:39:41,080 Speaker 1: I can't even imagine trying to get my mother's blood 589 00:39:41,200 --> 00:39:43,560 Speaker 1: out of the carpet. So they go to sleep in 590 00:39:43,600 --> 00:39:48,360 Speaker 1: Anna's room. Then they try to move Peggy's body to 591 00:39:48,440 --> 00:39:50,640 Speaker 1: her bedroom. As you said, they lay her on the 592 00:39:50,680 --> 00:39:54,640 Speaker 1: floor cover her with a bedsheet. That is interesting to me. 593 00:39:54,800 --> 00:39:59,320 Speaker 1: I've seen it so many homicides. When it's someone you know, um, 594 00:39:59,520 --> 00:40:03,279 Speaker 1: you the perpetrator will cover the face of the victim. 595 00:40:03,320 --> 00:40:06,760 Speaker 1: They continue with the corpse lying there, the bloody corpse 596 00:40:06,840 --> 00:40:10,600 Speaker 1: of her mother, working on the carpet. Then they walked 597 00:40:10,600 --> 00:40:14,799 Speaker 1: to subway and they spend an hour having subway sandwiches. 598 00:40:16,360 --> 00:40:20,520 Speaker 1: And that is when Schroder lawns her dad, Darryl Schroeder, 599 00:40:21,080 --> 00:40:25,239 Speaker 1: is heading to town, and she goes in the bathroom 600 00:40:25,280 --> 00:40:30,680 Speaker 1: and vomits. Just pure guilt. I guess, Well, several facts standout. 601 00:40:30,719 --> 00:40:32,759 Speaker 1: Wait a minute, I've got something else for you. Then 602 00:40:32,760 --> 00:40:36,320 Speaker 1: they walked to a story by cleaning supplies. They buy 603 00:40:36,360 --> 00:40:40,040 Speaker 1: cleaning supplies, and like you said, Rachel, who was blonde, 604 00:40:40,360 --> 00:40:46,920 Speaker 1: dyed her hair red. Schroeder, who is brunette, dyes hers black. Finally, 605 00:40:46,960 --> 00:40:49,840 Speaker 1: Saturday morning, they set the house on fire to conceal 606 00:40:50,000 --> 00:40:53,600 Speaker 1: the evidence by setting fire to the bed sheet that 607 00:40:53,760 --> 00:40:59,520 Speaker 1: is covering up the mother. Mmmm. What does that mean? 608 00:41:00,040 --> 00:41:03,000 Speaker 1: Imagine burning your own mother. Well, I you know, Nancy. 609 00:41:03,080 --> 00:41:06,160 Speaker 1: Several facts stand out. First of all, the mother was single. 610 00:41:06,320 --> 00:41:09,920 Speaker 1: She had divorced the father, and often parents who are 611 00:41:10,040 --> 00:41:13,280 Speaker 1: victims of matricide or a greater risk when they're single, 612 00:41:13,440 --> 00:41:17,480 Speaker 1: because often in households where there is an unstable child, 613 00:41:17,680 --> 00:41:20,480 Speaker 1: at least if there's two parents, one parent can protect 614 00:41:20,520 --> 00:41:23,080 Speaker 1: the other. So you remove a parent and then the 615 00:41:23,120 --> 00:41:27,520 Speaker 1: remaining parent is more vulnerable. Um. Secondly, the the idea 616 00:41:27,600 --> 00:41:31,799 Speaker 1: that probably this occurred over something seemingly innocuous. Like I 617 00:41:31,840 --> 00:41:37,279 Speaker 1: said before, often young women who commit matricide work in 618 00:41:37,440 --> 00:41:41,360 Speaker 1: concert with somebody else. They very rarely work alone. Usually 619 00:41:41,360 --> 00:41:44,480 Speaker 1: they'll have a boyfriend or a girlfriend, somebody who's under 620 00:41:44,520 --> 00:41:48,920 Speaker 1: their firm control. In this case, they again they spent 621 00:41:49,320 --> 00:41:51,800 Speaker 1: the night under the under the roof with the corpse. 622 00:41:51,920 --> 00:41:56,200 Speaker 1: I think that shows how cold blooded Anna was covering 623 00:41:56,239 --> 00:41:58,719 Speaker 1: the mother's body with the sheet, although I'd like to 624 00:41:58,760 --> 00:42:00,840 Speaker 1: think it was a sign of respect act like the 625 00:42:01,520 --> 00:42:05,759 Speaker 1: carjacking victim where the neighbor came out and put a 626 00:42:05,840 --> 00:42:08,640 Speaker 1: pillow under the victim's head. In this case, I think 627 00:42:08,680 --> 00:42:10,720 Speaker 1: she just didn't want to be disgusted by the side 628 00:42:10,719 --> 00:42:15,800 Speaker 1: of the corpse. I think that's how shallow, manipulative, cold blooded, 629 00:42:16,000 --> 00:42:20,880 Speaker 1: egocentric this perpetrator was. And and in terms of burning 630 00:42:20,920 --> 00:42:23,719 Speaker 1: down the house, she must have been enraged at her 631 00:42:23,760 --> 00:42:25,920 Speaker 1: mother because it was sort of like burned baby burn. 632 00:42:26,000 --> 00:42:28,120 Speaker 1: I mean that not only did she shoot her in 633 00:42:28,120 --> 00:42:30,200 Speaker 1: the forehead, but then she wants to burn down the 634 00:42:30,239 --> 00:42:33,080 Speaker 1: house and to meet that speaks of burning rage. But 635 00:42:33,200 --> 00:42:36,160 Speaker 1: not probably not because of abuse, as we said before, 636 00:42:36,239 --> 00:42:39,279 Speaker 1: Probably burning rage because her mother said a limit, or 637 00:42:39,320 --> 00:42:42,759 Speaker 1: her mother didn't gratify her in some way cat this. 638 00:42:44,160 --> 00:42:51,360 Speaker 1: She researched the daughter Anna Schroder, children who murder their parents, 639 00:42:52,640 --> 00:42:55,120 Speaker 1: This was so orchestrated and playing. This was not a 640 00:42:55,120 --> 00:42:59,160 Speaker 1: spur of the moment shooting. She researched it, she thought 641 00:42:59,160 --> 00:43:03,960 Speaker 1: about it. You know, it reminds me a little Casey Anthony. 642 00:43:04,040 --> 00:43:09,480 Speaker 1: Remember how she researched that breaking and asphyxiation and all 643 00:43:09,560 --> 00:43:12,600 Speaker 1: these things that top mom researched before the before her 644 00:43:12,640 --> 00:43:17,160 Speaker 1: little girl Kaylee went missing, and not really thinking that 645 00:43:17,239 --> 00:43:21,600 Speaker 1: she had, was leaving this whole trail of clues behind her. 646 00:43:21,680 --> 00:43:25,439 Speaker 1: You know, it's so obvious. And also the the pre 647 00:43:25,640 --> 00:43:29,040 Speaker 1: planning and the malice, the wish to get rid of 648 00:43:29,040 --> 00:43:31,560 Speaker 1: this person. And I wonder what else could have been 649 00:43:31,560 --> 00:43:35,239 Speaker 1: a motive besides you know, rage and hatred. I bet 650 00:43:35,280 --> 00:43:37,960 Speaker 1: there's something that Anna wanted from her mother that her 651 00:43:38,000 --> 00:43:42,479 Speaker 1: mother wasn't giving her, like money or or privileges. And 652 00:43:42,800 --> 00:43:45,360 Speaker 1: do you remember with Casey Anthony, she bragged one of 653 00:43:45,400 --> 00:43:47,760 Speaker 1: her friends that she was going to inherit her parents 654 00:43:47,800 --> 00:43:50,640 Speaker 1: house and she really thought she was going to get 655 00:43:50,840 --> 00:43:56,080 Speaker 1: these riches or this largest from uh from George and Cindy, 656 00:43:56,200 --> 00:43:58,960 Speaker 1: And I wouldn't emagine. I think it's interesting that Anna 657 00:43:59,040 --> 00:44:02,400 Speaker 1: was adopted, she her older sister adopted, And I wonder 658 00:44:02,440 --> 00:44:05,279 Speaker 1: if in her fantasy world there was all this largesse 659 00:44:05,400 --> 00:44:08,840 Speaker 1: and bank accounts and riches and that she would inherit 660 00:44:08,920 --> 00:44:11,480 Speaker 1: that It's just speculation on my part. Maybe she's not 661 00:44:11,560 --> 00:44:14,600 Speaker 1: that far sighted to think about that, but I would 662 00:44:14,640 --> 00:44:16,520 Speaker 1: wonder if this was in her fantasy. You know, she 663 00:44:16,640 --> 00:44:19,920 Speaker 1: was waiting at home for her mother, sitting in the 664 00:44:20,000 --> 00:44:23,000 Speaker 1: living room waiting for her to walk through the door 665 00:44:23,360 --> 00:44:28,560 Speaker 1: with her mother's thirty eight caliber Revolver. And the mom 666 00:44:28,640 --> 00:44:31,239 Speaker 1: gets home at about five thirty, comes straight home from 667 00:44:31,280 --> 00:44:33,960 Speaker 1: Mark to get to her daughter. When Anna meets her 668 00:44:34,000 --> 00:44:38,239 Speaker 1: in the living room and shoots her execution style in 669 00:44:38,400 --> 00:44:44,600 Speaker 1: the forehead. Well that's what I know, and I'm waiting 670 00:44:44,640 --> 00:44:48,799 Speaker 1: to find out if this girl, this killer can be, 671 00:44:49,760 --> 00:44:53,359 Speaker 1: as we say, bound over to adult court. I don't 672 00:44:53,360 --> 00:44:56,919 Speaker 1: know if that's allowed in this jurisdiction, but that would 673 00:44:57,000 --> 00:45:00,520 Speaker 1: mean that she would be treated as a all. I 674 00:45:00,560 --> 00:45:04,120 Speaker 1: want to thank Dr Bethany Marshall, my friend and colleague 675 00:45:04,640 --> 00:45:11,080 Speaker 1: Nancy Grace Crime Stories signing off goodbye friend m