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Speaker 1: Warning.

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Speaker 2: Today's episode Canadian spoilers from Marvel's The Fantastic Four First Steps.

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Speaker 3: Fun post four. I'm not gonna be able to stop.

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Speaker 3: Guys killed it that way.

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Speaker 4: Hello.

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Speaker 2: My name is Jason Concepcion and I'm Rosie Night and

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Speaker 2: welcome back to Text Revision, the podcast where we don

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Speaker 2: gee be doing your favorite shows movies is currently some

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Speaker 2: pop culture. We're coming you from my art podcast, where

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Speaker 2: we're bringing you episodes every Tuesday and Thursday. Plus we're

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Speaker 2: discussing the summer's biggest movies every Friday and on Saturday.

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Speaker 1: It's on Saturday.

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Speaker 5: In today's episode, we are calling in our very own

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Speaker 5: Heralds of Galactus.

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Speaker 3: They do a great job, wouldn't they?

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Speaker 5: Joel and Aaron super producers to talk about Fantastic four

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Speaker 5: First Steps. But we are gonna be doing a very

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Speaker 5: fun Ryan Table. I can't wait to hear what the

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Speaker 5: people are saying, because this one's gonna be a controversial one.

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Speaker 5: And programming note for you listeners out there for our

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Speaker 5: X ray Vision babes, we are recording this early because

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Speaker 5: we were lucky to see the movie pre Comic Con.

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Speaker 5: So if we do not address any kind of like

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Speaker 5: giant Kevin fie G statements that we haven't heard, or

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Speaker 5: staggering box office numbers in either direction. That is why

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Speaker 5: we are getting this to you so you can have

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Speaker 5: it and listen to it while the movie is out,

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Speaker 5: because we are gonna be at San Diego basically from

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Speaker 5: now till Sunday. So yeah, check in for us to

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Speaker 5: be talking about that in our post SDCC roundup, when

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Speaker 5: we will surely have more news about the success or

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Speaker 5: lack of success of Fantastic four.

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Speaker 2: Okay, let's start first. Let's welcome our roundtable participants. First

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Speaker 2: of all, we have super producer Joel Joel, how are you?

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Speaker 4: I am flum mixed. There is so much perfect, so

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Speaker 4: much happening on my head around this movie. I really

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Speaker 4: really can't wait to talk to you guys about it.

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Speaker 4: I'm not a huge Fantastic forehead, so I went in

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Speaker 4: with almost no expectations and I left more confused than ever.

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Speaker 6: Uh oh, I own it.

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Speaker 2: And then up next super producer Aaron Aaron, how are

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Speaker 2: you well?

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Speaker 7: I'm still singing the post credits song let Us Be Devoured.

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Speaker 7: I love love that little acoustic number at the end

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Speaker 7: during the credits.

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Speaker 1: Again.

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Speaker 7: Yeah, pretty low expectations going into this, but excited to

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Speaker 7: hear how Joel feels.

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Speaker 1: And then I'll get into a well, let's.

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Speaker 6: Get into that.

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Speaker 2: Okay, so we know how Rosie and I feel your

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Speaker 2: initial top level headline reactions to Fantastic four First Steps.

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Speaker 2: Let's start with you, Joelle.

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Speaker 4: Okay, my reaction. This is the craziest thing I've ever said.

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Speaker 4: But y'all remember when we saw Turnles and we were like, Wow,

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Speaker 4: the scale of this movie. It dwarfs me. I am

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Speaker 4: in awe at the size of these cash. Yes, I

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Speaker 4: can remember that Galactus, what happened? That's all you had

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Speaker 4: to do was just be like, let's just bring up

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Speaker 4: our little files and now Galactus, who is also one

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Speaker 4: of these beings? If I'm not incorrect, I don't know

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Speaker 4: what happened. And that is basically the for everything. That

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Speaker 4: is how I feel about all of the things. Why

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Speaker 4: did this happen? You used to be so good at

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Speaker 4: like family dramas led by complicated men. Not here. Don't

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Speaker 4: know why. I feel like we used to understand New

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Speaker 4: York is a city. There were neighborhoods, and they had

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Speaker 4: different feelings and vibes, and it was great not here.

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Speaker 4: Not so when a glossal impact used to happen in

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Speaker 4: a superhero movie, we visit like a monument on every continent,

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Speaker 4: just so you knew that they knew what the world

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Speaker 4: looked like. Not so here. They're like the whole world

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Speaker 4: in danger, but mostly this little corner of New York.

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Speaker 4: Why is this movie so small when you have such

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Speaker 4: a large budget. What is going on? And what I really, truly,

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Speaker 4: truly don't understand is how Marvel has forgotten to tell full,

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Speaker 4: complete stories of characters. To get full Tony used to

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Speaker 4: go on a journey of just Oh my god, even

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Speaker 4: Black Panthers journey in Civil War alone is monumental. It's

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Speaker 4: so huge. He's like the fifth most important character in

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Speaker 4: that movie. I have no arc for any of these characters.

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Speaker 4: Nothing changes, nothing happens to like things happen to them,

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Speaker 4: but nothing happens inside of them. You're left so bereft

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Speaker 4: by the end of this movie that being said, Oh

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Speaker 4: my god, when they were surfing through that black hole, Wow,

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Speaker 4: that's really cool. And black Hole was breathtaking. It was beautiful.

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Speaker 4: They really put their like whole mojo into that. And

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Speaker 4: I also did like a lot of the Galactys' final fight.

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Speaker 4: It's the first time they emotionally connected. But the film

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Speaker 4: isn't stylized enough to survive on emotional vibes, and it's

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Speaker 4: not saying anything specific enough to justify how grounded it

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Speaker 4: is in reality. I have no idea where we are

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Speaker 4: or why to your guys's points earlier, it just feels safe,

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Speaker 4: and I'm I'm disappointed.

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Speaker 7: Aaron, So, I have no formal film training. I did

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Speaker 7: not study film. I you know, like you all are

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Speaker 7: so much more knowledgeable.

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Speaker 3: When I didn't even go to college, Like I'm going

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Speaker 3: to sell yourself.

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Speaker 7: You're you're all so much more knowledgeable when it comes

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Speaker 7: to the art of cinema.

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Speaker 1: I loved this movie. I thought, yeah, let him go,

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Speaker 1: let him go.

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Speaker 4: Okay, I'm so excited.

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Speaker 7: I'm not gonna say this is like a great movie,

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Speaker 7: and I'm not going to say it's necessarily the top

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Speaker 7: five in MCU by any means.

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Speaker 1: I had so much fun.

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Speaker 7: I mean, maybe it's because my my expectations were so low,

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Speaker 7: but I there are multiple times when watching Shala Balls

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Speaker 7: like surfing through lava, surfing through a black hole, I

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Speaker 7: was like, this is a fucking great showcase of Superpowers, Like,

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Speaker 7: we haven't had a scene in a long time in

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Speaker 7: any sort of comic book movie that hit me in

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Speaker 7: the same way that like Nightcrawlers open in X two

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Speaker 7: where it's just like, WHOA, what a unique way of

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Speaker 7: doing that. And we've had multiple Silver Server iterations. But

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Speaker 7: her surfing that like made me think she was on waves.

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Speaker 7: I was just like, and he got me, I'm in

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Speaker 7: it and yeah, And I mean, listening to all three

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Speaker 7: of you, how much you dis liked it, how much

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Speaker 7: Ian didn't like it, I was kind of surprised because

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Speaker 7: I was really happy the whole time.

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Speaker 5: I love this so much is making me very excited

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Speaker 5: because I always want people to love a superhero movie.

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Speaker 3: And honestly, guess what, you are basically.

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Speaker 5: Talking about the Fantastic Four in the same way that

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Speaker 5: we now talk about the movies that came out in

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Speaker 5: the Zeros. They were fun, they showcased something different. They're

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Speaker 5: actually kind of campy and great. So it makes me

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Speaker 5: very happy that someone with zero interest in the Fantastic

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Speaker 5: Four actually came out of this movie enjoying it. And

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Speaker 5: I do think that you highlight some of the most

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Speaker 5: interesting sequences, like the Charla bal stuff. Again, I thought

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Speaker 5: that looked better than the trailer. I think even though

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Speaker 5: the CG wasn't great, who doesn't want to see like

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Speaker 5: a cool alien something through a lava? Like, I love

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Speaker 5: that those big kind of epic moments worked for you.

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Speaker 5: What did you think about like Galactus as someone who

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Speaker 5: has zero knowledge of like that character, Like, did that

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Speaker 5: all kind of make sense and work for you? Did

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Speaker 5: it add to the kind of fun of the movie

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Speaker 5: to have this like totally craziest, biggest stakes we've ever

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Speaker 5: had kind of creature.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 7: I when when he emerges for the first time with

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Speaker 7: the voice and the eyes, it felt immense to me.

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Speaker 7: Within the ship, the ship itself felt immense, and then

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Speaker 7: it was like he appeared in space to talk to them,

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Speaker 7: and like, is this hulking thing now? Granted, when he

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Speaker 7: comes to Earth he feels much smaller. It feels like

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Speaker 7: he lost a little juice there. But I understood too,

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Speaker 7: Like you've got to have him like actively pursuing Franklin,

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Speaker 7: holding Franklin, like so that we can have this moment

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Speaker 7: of tension with like can we save him as he's

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Speaker 7: pulling him? But that intro of him both both Silver

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Speaker 7: Surfer and Galactus I thought were introd in such a

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Speaker 7: powerful way, like we've all seen the clip. We'd all

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Speaker 7: seen the clip of Shalli Baal already coming down, and

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Speaker 7: like I herald your end, I herald his beginning. I

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Speaker 7: held Galactus like that was a really powerful age.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and I thought she was incredible like it.

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Speaker 7: I actually last night was like looking through her IMDb

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Speaker 7: to be like, what other things can I watch her

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Speaker 7: in that are not horror movies. She's like only an

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Speaker 7: Ozark or horror movies. It feels like like, oh the Americans, Yeah, Americans,

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Speaker 7: that's right.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. But I thought she was incredible.

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Speaker 7: I loved her interplay with Johnny, and Galactys felt menacing

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Speaker 7: to him, like I I hope he comes back in

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Speaker 7: some way. Who knows if he ever really will. Like obviously,

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Speaker 7: this is you know, another major Marvel villain that could

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Speaker 7: just be a one off and who knows how long

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Speaker 7: this universe exists. But I thought it was good and

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Speaker 7: I actually really enjoyed. You know, we get what not

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Speaker 7: a great movie to compare it to, but you know,

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Speaker 7: like Love and Thunder, we have the god Butcher and

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Speaker 7: we see Gore kill one god and that's really and like, yeah, galack,

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Speaker 7: this only kills one planet, but it's a pretty cool

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Speaker 7: set piece to watch.

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Speaker 3: And we learned that he you know, he has been

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Speaker 3: killed five.

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Speaker 1: Dude.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm glad Karen's so controversial.

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Speaker 2: I'm glad to hear this. I also think, you know

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Speaker 2: what a death knell. Aaron likes your movie?

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Speaker 3: Oh my god.

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Speaker 2: At the edge of his seat, fucking blown away.

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Speaker 3: Dude, When Aaron.

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Speaker 5: Likes your movie, does that mean that your movie is

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Speaker 5: gonna play.

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Speaker 3: Less or play more? We gotta stop paying.

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Speaker 2: But this is good because I do hope that people listen.

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Speaker 2: I think you make a good point, which is, like,

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Speaker 2: not everybody comes to a movie with this like intense

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Speaker 2: like background in the lore and a deep relationship with

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Speaker 2: the characters and just wants to Like I would argue

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Speaker 2: that despite the fact that, like I have a deep

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Speaker 2: relationship with many of the characters that have depicted in

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Speaker 2: recent movies, that I too, just want to eat popcorn

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Speaker 2: and see a good movie.

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Speaker 6: That said, I.

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Speaker 2: Hope that people share your perspective and that this movie

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Speaker 2: is successful because I think I think we're better. I

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Speaker 2: love these movies. I want them to continue, and so

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Speaker 2: I hope people like the movie in the same way

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Speaker 2: you did.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, I would say, just like because I didn't necessarily

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Speaker 5: touch on this and not chat.

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Speaker 3: It's like, I think the.

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Speaker 5: Reason I struggled was like the first forty five minutes

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Speaker 5: set a very high bar for me. I just was

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Speaker 5: vibing with whatever that version was, which I guess was

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Speaker 5: the stuff that felt a lot closer to one division.

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Speaker 5: But like, at the same time, I also understood as

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Speaker 5: a somebody who watches a lot of movies, I was like,

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Speaker 5: how do you keep that momentum and that stylistic editing

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Speaker 5: and that kind of notion going on when you broaden

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Speaker 5: out of this TV setup? And in my opinion, they

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Speaker 5: weren't able to do it. But that drop off for

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Speaker 5: me was big, and they.

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Speaker 4: Either should have or they should have just removed that,

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Speaker 4: because that's what really killed the movie for me. It's like,

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Speaker 4: it's not that those first few minutes are bad by

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Speaker 4: any stretch of the imagine. I agree with you, They're

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Speaker 4: really well done. They tell like a somewhat interesting you

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Speaker 4: feel like you're getting immersed into the world in an

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Speaker 4: interesting way, but it also feels so redundant to everything

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Speaker 4: that happens after it that you're kind of like, why

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Speaker 4: is this here? Like we've sort of set up like, oh,

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Speaker 4: Ben's really beloved in his community, but he also has

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Speaker 4: some trepidation about like how he looks, but then we

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Speaker 4: never really get into that. It's always just kind of

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Speaker 4: like some out of the corner looks. No one is

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Speaker 4: ever afraid of Ben or has a weird reaction to

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Speaker 4: him or anything like that, and it's fine if they

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Speaker 4: don't want to go the monster route. But then I

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Speaker 4: just think, like, why did we spend so much time

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Speaker 4: showing that dichotomy at that He's like, I just moved

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Speaker 4: back to the neighborhood. I thought it's because I feel

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Speaker 4: safe and good here and outside of this space, maybe

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Speaker 4: I don't, but we don't get into that before the

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Speaker 4: shows start talking to Jason about how like frustrating it is,

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Speaker 4: Like I love this iteration of Sue and I thought

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Speaker 4: like her being a like un world leader with such

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Speaker 4: a dope angle on the character, but they just tell

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Speaker 4: us that and we don't get to see it, and

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Speaker 4: I would have loved to have seen, like how do

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Speaker 4: you get Moman to trust you? What is it about

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Speaker 4: Sue's approach to this job that makes her like so

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Speaker 4: different than everybody else. I think I would have loved

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Speaker 4: to have seen read watching Sue at work, because you know,

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Speaker 4: I feel like when you really love your bay and

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Speaker 4: they're the best of their job, you're like, oh my god,

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Speaker 4: that's my girl, like look at her. Like you get

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Speaker 4: to see like the moments where you're like, oh, this

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Speaker 4: is what connects them, This is what the binding tissue

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Speaker 4: of these characters is. And they just keep telling us

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Speaker 4: they're a family, joking a little bit, but you never

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Speaker 4: get to experience them as a family. I think families

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Speaker 4: yell at each other. I think the families are getting

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Speaker 4: angry and walk away and we don't get that.

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Speaker 1: I see. I disagree.

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Speaker 7: I think that they connected as a family quite well.

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Speaker 7: They have the family meal, which I think is a

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Speaker 7: really nice scene them coming.

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Speaker 1: They do this every week.

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Speaker 7: But Sue and Reid, regardless of whether there's heated sexual chemistry,

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Speaker 7: like like Clark and Lois, this is a lived in relationship.

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Speaker 7: These are people who've been together for years. They've done

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Speaker 7: this I meant space trip and concocted special powers from it.

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Speaker 7: They've tried to have a child for years. They've abandoned

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Speaker 7: that hope after they couldn't have a child. They're now

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Speaker 7: at a point where they know what the other one

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Speaker 7: is going to say. They fight, they argue, they yell

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Speaker 7: at each other because they're not living up to what

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Speaker 7: the other one what they want the other one to do,

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Speaker 7: and then they still come together Like this is a

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Speaker 7: This to me felt like a relationship that has lived

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Speaker 7: in This is not like a fresh new thing.

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Speaker 1: And I like that.

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Speaker 4: I sort of agree with you, Eric, Like I sort

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Speaker 4: of agree with like, this is an adult relationship. I

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Speaker 4: don't need all relationships to be seen me. I do

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Speaker 4: need the relationships I need to understand, like what it

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Speaker 4: is that has bound these two to each other for life? Right?

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Speaker 4: And I think that's what's missing for me, Like there

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Speaker 4: is a level of like, oh I like you and

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Speaker 4: you do good work that's not binding for life material

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Speaker 4: I need your work has fundamentally allowed me to do

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Speaker 4: my work, or like we've come up together through this

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Speaker 4: really difficult thing, and like you're the only person I trust.

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Speaker 4: You're the only person who understands me. Like if we

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Speaker 4: had seen Read try to communicate his ideas to other

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Speaker 4: people and constantly fail, but she gets it and she's

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Speaker 4: the person then I understand, like, oh, these who are

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Speaker 4: a strong couple and I get.

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Speaker 3: It read translater. That's fun. I like that way Sue

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Speaker 3: essentially is the one who gets his ideas. That's cute.

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Speaker 4: Like he's so intelligent he can't communicate with other people.

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Speaker 4: I just think there's a lot of different things they

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Speaker 4: could have done, and it's it's small, ticky tac things.

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Speaker 4: And that's why I think we're gonna have such like

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Speaker 4: an interesting conversation here and why this might be like

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Speaker 4: one of those teased out conversations like I could see

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Speaker 4: twenty years downline and we like it's my favorite Marvel film,

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Speaker 4: Like this really out for being weird and different for me.

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Speaker 2: It's like every scene is about the scene, you know,

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Speaker 2: and that is why it feels kind of flat to me.

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Speaker 2: Then you know, read and read and see her together

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Speaker 2: and he wants to check up on the baby, and

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Speaker 2: that's what that scene is about. You know, they're having dinner,

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Speaker 2: and it's about them having dinner. I was talking before

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Speaker 2: we turn the MIC's on, like I was thinking about

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Speaker 2: this moment from the first Avengers movie, right where Colson

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Speaker 2: brings the Avengers iPad to Tony Stark and he's just

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Speaker 2: turned you know, he's hooked up the Stark Arc reactor

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Speaker 2: to the Avengers Tower and Colson comes in and it's

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Speaker 2: clear that Pepper and Coulson know each other, and that

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Speaker 2: throws Tony off. He's like, why are you calling him

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Speaker 2: by this like nickname? And then he's you know, ostensibly

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Speaker 2: that scene is about I want you to join the Avengers,

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Speaker 2: I want you to manage this thing, but it's also

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Speaker 2: about like the relationship of all these three characters and

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Speaker 2: why do you know Colson?

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Speaker 6: Like wait, where where do you know him from?

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Speaker 2: And by the way, like, I'm going to give you

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Speaker 2: a twelve percent of the credit for managing the Stark Tower,

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Speaker 2: and Pepper's like the twelve percent, What the fuck.

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Speaker 6: Is that about?

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Speaker 2: Like I did this whole thing and like and so

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Speaker 2: you kind of get why they're together, Like they're jousting

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Speaker 2: on an intellectual level. On an emotional level, Tony's a

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Speaker 2: little jealous. He's pretending he's not jealous, but he is, like,

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Speaker 2: why do you know this fucking Shield agent? When did

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Speaker 2: you meet this Shield agent? And there's none of that

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Speaker 2: jealous Yeah, who's the Who's you feel like you walked

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Speaker 2: into the middle of a conversation where there's all these

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Speaker 2: other things that you don't necessarily get that makes it

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Speaker 2: feel like a lived in full world, right, a full relationship.

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Speaker 2: And I get what you're saying, arin like the things

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Speaker 2: have died down, but still to me, part of the

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Speaker 2: flatness of this movie, specifically around the relationships, is every

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Speaker 2: scene is about the thing that is happening. She walks

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Speaker 2: into Johnny's room and it's about Johnny decoding Schallibah's language.

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Speaker 2: Ben goes to see Read and it's about the relationship

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Speaker 2: between Ben and Reid and why Read won't open up

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Speaker 2: to him. Johnny goes to see Read, and it's about

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Speaker 2: the space suits. You know, it's there's no other okay

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Speaker 2: thing that intersects with it to make you feel like, oh,

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Speaker 2: I you know, you ever walk into somebody's house and

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Speaker 2: like the mom is like yelling from the other room

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Speaker 2: and the dad's talking about something, and somebody walks in

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Speaker 2: and says, oh, this person called. You don't know who

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Speaker 2: that person is. There's none of that like dangling threads

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Speaker 2: that make you feel like it's a life And I

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Speaker 2: felt like I was really missing that.

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Speaker 5: I think that's a great point. Let me ask you,

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Speaker 5: guys this, how much do you think that some of

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Speaker 5: these issues, even you're from the outside hour and as

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Speaker 5: someone did enjoy it and maybe doesn't see it as issues,

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Speaker 5: how many of these choices. I felt like they really

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Speaker 5: wanted this to not be like quippy Marvel, like you know.

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Speaker 3: How everyone kind of complains about that.

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Speaker 5: And I also wonder if like they went too far

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Speaker 5: in the other direction where we don't get a lot

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Speaker 5: of bantering scenes.

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Speaker 3: In my opinion, we.

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Speaker 5: Don't get a lot of the that kind of texture

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Speaker 5: and in jokes and all those things that you know

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Speaker 5: families do have. And I do think that part of

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Speaker 5: that comes from they don't want to do the Origin again.

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Speaker 5: They want to be like but the irony is they

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Speaker 5: say they don't want to do the Origin again Alah Superman,

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Speaker 5: which did that very well, But then they also do

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Speaker 5: the Origin at the beginning for forty five minutes, which

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Speaker 5: ironically my favorite part. I think if a story's great

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Speaker 5: and has a good origin, you can do it as

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Speaker 5: many times as you want. But I wanted I feel

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Speaker 5: like the opening had the energy, the wildness, the weirdness.

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Speaker 5: I want to see them fighting all these villains.

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Speaker 3: Why are they in New York.

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Speaker 5: Why in this version of New York or they're like

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Speaker 5: fifty million hilarious themed villains. How did you guys feel

385
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Speaker 5: do you feel like they were trying to step away

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Speaker 5: or do a new direction for.

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Speaker 3: The mcu joelle, What about you?

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Speaker 8: I'm gonna answer that question when we come back from

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Speaker 8: this break A.

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Speaker 3: She's so profecid.

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Speaker 4: Yay, we're back, Okay. I we were talking a little

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Speaker 4: bit about how afraid Marvel is. It's from a corporate perspective,

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Speaker 4: we can understand. I mean, if we again compare like Superman,

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Speaker 4: it's struggling worldwide, like at home Gangbusters worldwide. People are

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Speaker 4: not so high on people Americans right now.

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Speaker 6: So we get it.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, understandably, Understandably.

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Speaker 5: I was looking at these numbers yesterday. It's just not

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Speaker 5: doing like crazy big superhero numbers.

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Speaker 3: It's still like.

401
00:19:57,440 --> 00:20:00,960
Speaker 5: Performing pretty well. It's just domestically it's really hanging.

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Speaker 3: I think those.

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Speaker 4: Margins make a difference to a corporation. So from a

404
00:20:04,680 --> 00:20:08,280
Speaker 4: corporate standpoint, I understand wanting to play it safe. I

405
00:20:08,359 --> 00:20:10,600
Speaker 4: think we're and this is the thing. You know, if

406
00:20:10,640 --> 00:20:12,879
Speaker 4: you've been tracking Hollywood news for a while, so thing

407
00:20:12,880 --> 00:20:14,439
Speaker 4: you we've been talking about for a long time like

408
00:20:14,760 --> 00:20:17,840
Speaker 4: this is not how art works. You can't play it

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Speaker 4: safe and hope to succeed in art. It just doesn't

410
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Speaker 4: ever work. You have to you really have to pick side.

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Speaker 4: You have to make difficult choices. It's what makes art

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Speaker 4: pop and connect to an audience. It's what grips people

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Speaker 4: to it. So you know, Superman may have detractors, but

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Speaker 4: it's making very strong, bold statements and it's connecting with

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Speaker 4: the people it was made for. I think Disney has

416
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Speaker 4: to release this idea of we need to be for

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Speaker 4: everybody and just pick somebody you want to appeal to.

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Speaker 4: I think, like, for example, if you want to keep

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Speaker 4: this squeaky clean, cool, but then this should be a

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Speaker 4: fun ass Avengers movie, like it big, like more time

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Speaker 4: with your villain who's more dastardly, and like in your face,

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Speaker 4: Like there is a way that you can keep this

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Speaker 4: very Disney, very like high polish. If you want to

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Speaker 4: do the grounded story, then we need the darkness. And

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Speaker 4: the darkness can't be hinted at. It can't be a suggestion.

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Speaker 4: It has to be that real for us. If you

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Speaker 4: want us to be in a real New York, then

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Speaker 4: we need to feel the real things we would feel

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Speaker 4: as adults. Like, it's a problem for me, and I

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Speaker 4: just think I also think there's recently, Kevin Figi did

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Speaker 4: a big like sit down with a bunch of different

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Speaker 4: press members. I read the Variety article on it, and

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Speaker 4: in it he was like, you know, we're always trying

434
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Speaker 4: to plus scenes, We're always trying to add more. So

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00:21:38,320 --> 00:21:40,560
Speaker 4: we're never done, and I'm never satisfied with a script

436
00:21:40,600 --> 00:21:44,080
Speaker 4: or a film, Kevin gently love. That's a problem. It

437
00:21:44,200 --> 00:21:45,800
Speaker 4: is a big problem.

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Speaker 3: It is a problem.

439
00:21:48,320 --> 00:21:52,000
Speaker 4: I've never finished or satisfied. It's a problem to.

440
00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:52,680
Speaker 1: Say that's why.

441
00:21:55,119 --> 00:21:57,960
Speaker 4: We can never feel grounded or landed in a decision,

442
00:21:58,040 --> 00:22:00,000
Speaker 4: because in a couple of weeks you might change your mind.

443
00:22:00,280 --> 00:22:04,200
Speaker 4: And for I think performers and artists specifically, they base

444
00:22:04,280 --> 00:22:06,760
Speaker 4: so much of like this hand gesture is because sixty

445
00:22:06,760 --> 00:22:08,119
Speaker 4: pages from now, this is going to happen. Like they

446
00:22:08,160 --> 00:22:10,160
Speaker 4: try to connect all that stuff that's part of their training,

447
00:22:10,480 --> 00:22:12,280
Speaker 4: and so when you don't have a grounded world to

448
00:22:12,280 --> 00:22:15,600
Speaker 4: build off of, you struggle. And I think that's sort

449
00:22:15,640 --> 00:22:17,399
Speaker 4: of where Disney is at right now. They're trying so

450
00:22:17,440 --> 00:22:20,320
Speaker 4: hard to a please everybody, b make sure that their

451
00:22:20,320 --> 00:22:23,280
Speaker 4: movies can perform at their highest top rank that they

452
00:22:23,280 --> 00:22:27,960
Speaker 4: have completely like negated story and arc and saying anything

453
00:22:28,160 --> 00:22:30,639
Speaker 4: for a chance to get some cash, and it's it

454
00:22:30,760 --> 00:22:32,960
Speaker 4: reads and to me, it's not enjoyable.

455
00:22:33,800 --> 00:22:34,840
Speaker 3: I think as well.

456
00:22:34,880 --> 00:22:38,240
Speaker 5: The issue comes when it's the idea of like not

457
00:22:38,320 --> 00:22:40,800
Speaker 5: making a whole movie because guess what, guys, and you

458
00:22:40,880 --> 00:22:43,639
Speaker 5: know that with the conversation around this movie, Eternals is

459
00:22:43,680 --> 00:22:45,920
Speaker 5: going to be making a return to the discourse even

460
00:22:46,720 --> 00:22:57,000
Speaker 5: outside podcast a. Sandy Eternals actually, uh, you know over

461
00:22:57,040 --> 00:22:58,520
Speaker 5: hate it underrated and I.

462
00:22:58,440 --> 00:23:01,679
Speaker 3: Said, oh, of course, but say this one thing, it.

463
00:23:01,480 --> 00:23:04,760
Speaker 5: Is gonna be like people are gonna be talking about

464
00:23:04,800 --> 00:23:05,920
Speaker 5: that feels like a whole movie.

465
00:23:05,960 --> 00:23:08,240
Speaker 3: Babe. You watch the movie. You seen the movie, you

466
00:23:08,320 --> 00:23:13,440
Speaker 3: understand what happens. This can't help to me but feel

467
00:23:13,480 --> 00:23:16,879
Speaker 3: like a little bit. It doesn't make enough of a

468
00:23:16,960 --> 00:23:19,960
Speaker 3: leap away from the MCU is established.

469
00:23:20,000 --> 00:23:21,800
Speaker 5: It kind of feels more in the middle, and I

470
00:23:21,840 --> 00:23:24,199
Speaker 5: think that is a problem for what they needed to

471
00:23:24,240 --> 00:23:26,560
Speaker 5: do on a corporate level, and also the fact that

472
00:23:26,600 --> 00:23:28,480
Speaker 5: I'm even thinking about what they needed to do on

473
00:23:28,520 --> 00:23:31,439
Speaker 5: a corporate level. That means the movie didn't immerse me

474
00:23:31,480 --> 00:23:35,159
Speaker 5: and make me very happy. But Aaron, what do you

475
00:23:35,280 --> 00:23:37,960
Speaker 5: think compared to, like, you know, Phase four and five.

476
00:23:38,000 --> 00:23:40,520
Speaker 5: As someone who enjoyed this, what are the things that

477
00:23:41,080 --> 00:23:43,359
Speaker 5: made it different for you, that made it something you

478
00:23:43,440 --> 00:23:44,119
Speaker 5: really enjoyed.

479
00:23:44,720 --> 00:23:48,280
Speaker 7: I likes that it felt it was detached and felt detached.

480
00:23:48,320 --> 00:23:50,520
Speaker 7: This felt like again I mean Thunderpoltz. I think I

481
00:23:50,560 --> 00:23:52,520
Speaker 7: said the exact same thing about that movie. If you

482
00:23:52,600 --> 00:23:55,879
Speaker 7: hadn't caught up with phases four and five and just

483
00:23:55,920 --> 00:23:58,160
Speaker 7: wanted a jumping off point, Thunderbolts was a good spot

484
00:23:58,200 --> 00:24:00,760
Speaker 7: to do. I think this is another good spot because

485
00:24:00,920 --> 00:24:02,679
Speaker 7: you don't have to have any connection to anything. This

486
00:24:02,760 --> 00:24:06,040
Speaker 7: is a different New York, This is a different universe.

487
00:24:06,160 --> 00:24:10,080
Speaker 7: Like the connection and how it will move into the

488
00:24:10,080 --> 00:24:14,200
Speaker 7: main MCU is not even explained in this movie, which

489
00:24:14,240 --> 00:24:15,639
Speaker 7: you know that was a bit of a bummer. I

490
00:24:15,640 --> 00:24:18,040
Speaker 7: do wish like there was something that like cleared that up.

491
00:24:18,160 --> 00:24:20,919
Speaker 7: And maybe that was too much again fan theorizing and

492
00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:22,480
Speaker 7: like how are they going to do this? Oh, they're

493
00:24:22,480 --> 00:24:24,760
Speaker 7: gonna send Franklin in the in the ship and you

494
00:24:24,840 --> 00:24:27,800
Speaker 7: know whatever. Like I was fine with this being a

495
00:24:27,800 --> 00:24:34,120
Speaker 7: little standalone thing. I did personally feel I hear all

496
00:24:34,119 --> 00:24:37,320
Speaker 7: of these complaints. I agree, Like, there are definitely moments

497
00:24:37,320 --> 00:24:39,960
Speaker 7: in this that feel, like Jason, what a good point,

498
00:24:40,080 --> 00:24:42,880
Speaker 7: Like every scene in this is the scene and there

499
00:24:42,920 --> 00:24:45,440
Speaker 7: is nothing that it's saying while we're giving you a

500
00:24:45,480 --> 00:24:49,280
Speaker 7: little extra stuff here, which again not not like a

501
00:24:49,320 --> 00:24:52,760
Speaker 7: great movie, still an enjoyable time for me because it

502
00:24:52,800 --> 00:24:55,920
Speaker 7: felt like I felt kind of immersed in it. They

503
00:24:55,920 --> 00:24:59,639
Speaker 7: got these little Fantastic Four created you know, baby monitor,

504
00:24:59,640 --> 00:25:02,280
Speaker 7: and they got the Fantastic Four created TV and like

505
00:25:02,400 --> 00:25:06,160
Speaker 7: there are all these little things that still feel in University,

506
00:25:06,800 --> 00:25:10,359
Speaker 7: and I, you know, I loved seeing Subterranea for the

507
00:25:10,400 --> 00:25:13,680
Speaker 7: brief twenty seconds. I do wish we had more Moleman, Like,

508
00:25:14,040 --> 00:25:16,760
Speaker 7: you know, I wish I got to see Malcovic.

509
00:25:17,240 --> 00:25:18,720
Speaker 3: You never thought I did hear people saying that, but

510
00:25:18,760 --> 00:25:20,000
Speaker 3: it's coming out again and again.

511
00:25:20,560 --> 00:25:23,320
Speaker 7: Yeah, yeah, I wanted him to do something molemanny ish

512
00:25:23,359 --> 00:25:25,119
Speaker 7: I would have. I would have just loved him coming

513
00:25:25,200 --> 00:25:28,159
Speaker 7: through in a big drill or something, you know. But

514
00:25:29,760 --> 00:25:35,919
Speaker 7: I like, I I thought that the their group dynamic

515
00:25:36,359 --> 00:25:41,240
Speaker 7: gave me the immersion I needed in them. And even

516
00:25:41,240 --> 00:25:44,879
Speaker 7: if I don't feel the immersion in that world, and like,

517
00:25:45,119 --> 00:25:47,879
Speaker 7: sure there's a shot of the Pyramids, Like that doesn't

518
00:25:48,640 --> 00:25:52,560
Speaker 7: give me the world, you know, feels about them or

519
00:25:52,560 --> 00:25:57,000
Speaker 7: their decision in not giving up Franklin, which is something

520
00:25:57,280 --> 00:26:01,439
Speaker 7: I have thoughts on too, But like them in the

521
00:26:01,560 --> 00:26:04,200
Speaker 7: Tower was enough for me of like, oh, yeah, here's

522
00:26:04,200 --> 00:26:08,040
Speaker 7: a little like immersive part of them and Sue appearing

523
00:26:08,080 --> 00:26:10,800
Speaker 7: out of nowhere on Ben's bed as they're just like

524
00:26:10,880 --> 00:26:13,000
Speaker 7: hanging out, and like, oh, I hate that was fun.

525
00:26:13,200 --> 00:26:13,760
Speaker 3: That was fun.

526
00:26:14,720 --> 00:26:18,240
Speaker 4: My favorite part of like, oh, there's where I felt

527
00:26:18,240 --> 00:26:21,480
Speaker 4: some texture when Ben turns to look at Sue and

528
00:26:21,520 --> 00:26:23,600
Speaker 4: he's like, are you pregnant? My whole heart left out

529
00:26:23,640 --> 00:26:26,080
Speaker 4: and I was like, this is the cutest, sweetest, like

530
00:26:26,119 --> 00:26:29,600
Speaker 4: I really understand who they are as friends. I will say, ever,

531
00:26:29,720 --> 00:26:31,680
Speaker 4: in the Tower it felt like roommates. It felt like

532
00:26:31,760 --> 00:26:33,600
Speaker 4: they're arey' all love each other so much?

533
00:26:33,720 --> 00:26:36,160
Speaker 3: Like, yeah, gang roommates, Do more of that, Do more

534
00:26:36,160 --> 00:26:36,400
Speaker 3: of that.

535
00:26:36,600 --> 00:26:38,760
Speaker 4: I felt a little less family than I wanted in

536
00:26:38,840 --> 00:26:42,880
Speaker 4: that space, but the energy in that dining scene was great. Yeah.

537
00:26:43,280 --> 00:26:46,800
Speaker 5: Can I just say as well, these are close family

538
00:26:46,880 --> 00:26:50,520
Speaker 5: because something that I was absolutely dying at is when

539
00:26:50,520 --> 00:26:52,840
Speaker 5: they're in space and she's giving birth, which I do

540
00:26:52,880 --> 00:26:56,840
Speaker 5: think is such a fantastic scene, the anti grammaty bro

541
00:26:57,240 --> 00:27:00,000
Speaker 5: bro bro thing, not just that she takes off the.

542
00:27:00,200 --> 00:27:03,400
Speaker 3: Fantastic pants and things. Head is just all up in it,

543
00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:05,480
Speaker 3: like his head is right then, I'm like that.

544
00:27:06,000 --> 00:27:07,800
Speaker 4: By the way, I like these.

545
00:27:07,520 --> 00:27:10,880
Speaker 5: Guys are really close, Like this is like I don't

546
00:27:10,880 --> 00:27:13,560
Speaker 5: know if i'd have my my bestie up in the place,

547
00:27:13,640 --> 00:27:14,760
Speaker 5: like he knows you're pregnant.

548
00:27:18,040 --> 00:27:20,720
Speaker 4: Last here we have to pause here and talk about

549
00:27:20,760 --> 00:27:24,639
Speaker 4: something really important. Okay, I really like here they set

550
00:27:24,840 --> 00:27:27,199
Speaker 4: Sue up. No no, no, because you've you've touched on

551
00:27:27,240 --> 00:27:30,920
Speaker 4: something that has I can't stop thinking about it. Sue

552
00:27:31,040 --> 00:27:33,440
Speaker 4: is an awesome woman character, and we have so few

553
00:27:33,520 --> 00:27:36,520
Speaker 4: in the MCU, and a lot of the ones who

554
00:27:36,600 --> 00:27:40,000
Speaker 4: are really cool we don't either a get enough of

555
00:27:40,640 --> 00:27:43,160
Speaker 4: or be they feel so forced cool that it almost

556
00:27:43,200 --> 00:27:46,400
Speaker 4: trips into being on for example. Okay, so like Aquay

557
00:27:46,480 --> 00:27:49,240
Speaker 4: is my favorite woman in the MCU. She's so boss,

558
00:27:49,400 --> 00:27:52,439
Speaker 4: She's the whole wag Sea like. She's great. She's supposed

559
00:27:52,440 --> 00:27:54,520
Speaker 4: to have a series that got canceled too that I like.

560
00:27:54,640 --> 00:27:57,320
Speaker 4: I like Carter, she's great. She had a TV show

561
00:27:57,320 --> 00:27:59,160
Speaker 4: but it was not treated well and didn't do great.

562
00:27:59,400 --> 00:28:02,280
Speaker 4: She kind of pops up in What If. But there again,

563
00:28:02,720 --> 00:28:05,439
Speaker 4: I think that her as like the British Captain. It

564
00:28:05,480 --> 00:28:07,879
Speaker 4: doesn't do much for me. I'm sorry personally. It feels

565
00:28:07,880 --> 00:28:09,960
Speaker 4: a little forced and it's a little wild. Here comes

566
00:28:09,960 --> 00:28:15,120
Speaker 4: Sue working for like peace and dealing with world leaders,

567
00:28:15,160 --> 00:28:17,680
Speaker 4: and she's so cool. Then she gets pregnant. I love

568
00:28:17,680 --> 00:28:19,480
Speaker 4: stories about moms. I think moms are so cool, and

569
00:28:19,480 --> 00:28:21,520
Speaker 4: we don't give them enough credit on screen and off.

570
00:28:22,359 --> 00:28:24,119
Speaker 4: When they get pregnant, they get shoved off into a

571
00:28:24,160 --> 00:28:27,320
Speaker 4: corner boring. She's like, listen on nothing, stop and bid

572
00:28:27,880 --> 00:28:33,640
Speaker 4: a great and at the top we're gonna get into it.

573
00:28:33,680 --> 00:28:35,280
Speaker 4: So at the top, I think it's really interesting, Like

574
00:28:35,320 --> 00:28:36,959
Speaker 4: we get this really tender scene of like, oh my god,

575
00:28:37,000 --> 00:28:39,480
Speaker 4: I'm pregnant. We stopped trying. That's crazy. This is very

576
00:28:39,480 --> 00:28:41,880
Speaker 4: common story for people to have trouble getting predate them

577
00:28:41,920 --> 00:28:44,440
Speaker 4: and you stop trying. That's when it happens. Lovely. They're

578
00:28:44,440 --> 00:28:46,720
Speaker 4: so excited. They're an older couple. They're a little bit nervous,

579
00:28:46,760 --> 00:28:49,440
Speaker 4: but all of this is working so well. They're like,

580
00:28:49,680 --> 00:28:51,600
Speaker 4: it's gonna be good. And then they're like, let's go

581
00:28:51,640 --> 00:28:55,840
Speaker 4: to space. I said, pause. She's a geriatric pregnancy, which

582
00:28:55,880 --> 00:29:00,840
Speaker 4: is not an offensive term. It's just the scientificiatric pregnancy.

583
00:29:01,520 --> 00:29:05,600
Speaker 4: She is way pregnant, I would guess, at least seven months,

584
00:29:05,600 --> 00:29:12,240
Speaker 4: but possibly further along. You're not even supposed to be

585
00:29:12,320 --> 00:29:14,160
Speaker 4: on an airplane at this point in time, and that

586
00:29:14,200 --> 00:29:16,880
Speaker 4: she's about to rock it off into space. This is

587
00:29:16,880 --> 00:29:18,760
Speaker 4: what I'm talking about. If you want to be grounded

588
00:29:18,760 --> 00:29:20,640
Speaker 4: in reality, then we must address that.

589
00:29:20,800 --> 00:29:22,959
Speaker 6: Joe conversations.

590
00:29:24,120 --> 00:29:25,520
Speaker 3: Joe, I couldn't.

591
00:29:25,800 --> 00:29:27,760
Speaker 2: I couldn't agree with you more because I think what

592
00:29:27,840 --> 00:29:30,360
Speaker 2: we needed in the they come back home and everybody's

593
00:29:30,360 --> 00:29:33,520
Speaker 2: mad at them scene is like read being like, Okay,

594
00:29:33,720 --> 00:29:35,880
Speaker 2: my wife went up to space to try and fucking

595
00:29:35,920 --> 00:29:38,440
Speaker 2: save the world at eight months pregnant. They you're not

596
00:29:38,480 --> 00:29:42,400
Speaker 2: even supposed to do any of this. Stuffy could have died.

597
00:29:44,040 --> 00:29:45,160
Speaker 3: Out head complaining.

598
00:29:45,360 --> 00:29:50,240
Speaker 2: But let me ask you, well within that because part

599
00:29:50,280 --> 00:29:53,720
Speaker 2: of what I felt missing in with the whole question

600
00:29:53,760 --> 00:29:55,200
Speaker 2: of why she doing this is.

601
00:29:56,720 --> 00:29:58,920
Speaker 6: She does what? On the like, what does she do?

602
00:29:59,160 --> 00:30:03,880
Speaker 2: I get that she is an incredible communicator and her

603
00:30:04,920 --> 00:30:08,640
Speaker 2: ability to build bridges with Harvey the Moullman and his

604
00:30:08,760 --> 00:30:10,760
Speaker 2: entire society is like what brought piece of the planet

605
00:30:10,800 --> 00:30:13,800
Speaker 2: and there's other variations of this, but like I felt

606
00:30:13,840 --> 00:30:15,880
Speaker 2: like they needed to put that on front Street. She

607
00:30:16,040 --> 00:30:18,240
Speaker 2: is going on the mission why.

608
00:30:18,280 --> 00:30:21,840
Speaker 5: To communicate with Galactus? Right, that's what the immedia aunts,

609
00:30:21,880 --> 00:30:23,280
Speaker 5: so would be like she is the.

610
00:30:23,240 --> 00:30:25,720
Speaker 3: One to say that I agree with you.

611
00:30:28,400 --> 00:30:31,120
Speaker 4: So really what she does other is like she tactically

612
00:30:31,120 --> 00:30:33,920
Speaker 4: makes them invisible when it's called for, which is not

613
00:30:34,000 --> 00:30:38,240
Speaker 4: something you could aid plan for. And b we can

614
00:30:38,280 --> 00:30:40,200
Speaker 4: go back and to read a little bit here. If

615
00:30:40,280 --> 00:30:42,440
Speaker 4: Reid is a genius, then I believe that he is

616
00:30:43,360 --> 00:30:45,680
Speaker 4: a genius. Is like, we need to attack a problem

617
00:30:45,680 --> 00:30:48,040
Speaker 4: on multiple points because we are now at a ticking clock.

618
00:30:48,080 --> 00:30:49,640
Speaker 4: They're like, hey, your end is coming. You don't have

619
00:30:49,640 --> 00:30:51,240
Speaker 4: a lot of time. Okay, what if I said my

620
00:30:51,240 --> 00:30:55,400
Speaker 4: whole team into space explorationally? No, absolutely not. Ben, get

621
00:30:55,480 --> 00:30:58,280
Speaker 4: up there, Johnny, you're gonna work on this language thing.

622
00:30:58,360 --> 00:31:01,120
Speaker 4: I'm gonna try to figure out the transportation sue. You

623
00:31:01,200 --> 00:31:03,080
Speaker 4: go be a diplomats and people don't hate us. We

624
00:31:03,160 --> 00:31:06,360
Speaker 4: have different roles that need to be inactive, and we

625
00:31:06,440 --> 00:31:08,720
Speaker 4: need back up plans to our play through, like we

626
00:31:08,760 --> 00:31:10,800
Speaker 4: have one Hail Mary. I'm like, this is driving me crazy.

627
00:31:10,800 --> 00:31:13,360
Speaker 4: There's no person would approach a problem this way.

628
00:31:14,200 --> 00:31:18,120
Speaker 3: I think that the biggest issue I'm realizing.

629
00:31:18,240 --> 00:31:20,600
Speaker 5: I love having these roundtables because Aaron, a lot of

630
00:31:20,640 --> 00:31:22,959
Speaker 5: what you're saying is true. There was moments when I

631
00:31:23,000 --> 00:31:26,200
Speaker 5: was just vibing. I think for me, I just this

632
00:31:26,360 --> 00:31:30,000
Speaker 5: version of Read is at the center of my issues

633
00:31:30,040 --> 00:31:32,840
Speaker 5: with the movie. I don't think he's clever enough. I

634
00:31:32,880 --> 00:31:35,760
Speaker 5: don't think he's inventive enough. I don't think that he's

635
00:31:36,040 --> 00:31:39,720
Speaker 5: taking enough risks. Ironically, he takes a huge risk with

636
00:31:39,800 --> 00:31:42,480
Speaker 5: Sue going to space, but like they don't even really

637
00:31:42,520 --> 00:31:45,280
Speaker 5: have a conversation about it, and then he doesn't really

638
00:31:45,320 --> 00:31:48,000
Speaker 5: take risks when it comes to like, I truly believe

639
00:31:48,040 --> 00:31:51,719
Speaker 5: that Read Richard's incredible mind would be so obsessed with

640
00:31:51,800 --> 00:31:54,320
Speaker 5: Galactus and the way that he works and the things

641
00:31:54,360 --> 00:31:57,360
Speaker 5: he needs, why wouldn't he try and come up with

642
00:31:57,400 --> 00:31:59,920
Speaker 5: a different idea? And I get you just gave birth

643
00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:02,240
Speaker 5: in space, very like stressful situation.

644
00:32:02,560 --> 00:32:03,760
Speaker 3: But I do feel like for.

645
00:32:03,800 --> 00:32:08,120
Speaker 5: Me that kind of lack of Read being the smartest

646
00:32:08,280 --> 00:32:12,040
Speaker 5: or being so smart, being so scientific. It was very

647
00:32:12,400 --> 00:32:15,040
Speaker 5: drawn back here, It was very introverted here, and he

648
00:32:15,080 --> 00:32:17,480
Speaker 5: didn't even do like something me and Jason talked about

649
00:32:17,520 --> 00:32:18,280
Speaker 5: that I thought would have been.

650
00:32:18,240 --> 00:32:18,840
Speaker 3: A great call.

651
00:32:19,480 --> 00:32:23,120
Speaker 5: Is he didn't even like do something really risky by

652
00:32:23,240 --> 00:32:26,320
Speaker 5: himself that would have proven that he thought he knew

653
00:32:26,440 --> 00:32:28,800
Speaker 5: better than everyone, and that causes like a conflict.

654
00:32:29,320 --> 00:32:30,680
Speaker 3: And then I'm sorry, guys.

655
00:32:30,960 --> 00:32:34,240
Speaker 5: I think you guys are having such a good, sensible, interesting,

656
00:32:34,800 --> 00:32:37,640
Speaker 5: diverse conversation, but I got to bring it up the

657
00:32:37,720 --> 00:32:41,600
Speaker 5: fucking baby, Like I'm sorry, guys, Like why couldn't they

658
00:32:41,720 --> 00:32:44,400
Speaker 5: get a real baby? Like, I mean, there is a

659
00:32:44,440 --> 00:32:47,040
Speaker 5: real baby, but like, why did they see gi.

660
00:32:47,000 --> 00:32:47,760
Speaker 3: The baby's face?

661
00:32:47,840 --> 00:32:50,560
Speaker 5: It's so distracting, especially if you're sitting at the front

662
00:32:50,600 --> 00:32:53,160
Speaker 5: like me, especially if you have brain rot like me.

663
00:32:53,480 --> 00:32:55,800
Speaker 5: As soon as that happened, I started thinking, oh shit,

664
00:32:56,080 --> 00:32:59,600
Speaker 5: it's the Twilight Baby. It's frank zmey. This is gonna

665
00:32:59,600 --> 00:33:01,680
Speaker 5: be one of the things that becomes a meme. Not

666
00:33:01,800 --> 00:33:03,840
Speaker 5: just that, guys, this is my other thing I just

667
00:33:03,880 --> 00:33:05,160
Speaker 5: have to say, because they didn't say it on the

668
00:33:05,160 --> 00:33:08,200
Speaker 5: other podcast. I have now realized that Bellis One has

669
00:33:08,280 --> 00:33:10,480
Speaker 5: exactly the same powers as Sue Storm, And once I

670
00:33:10,520 --> 00:33:12,360
Speaker 5: started thinking about it, the whole.

671
00:33:12,120 --> 00:33:14,120
Speaker 3: Movie was completely derailed for me.

672
00:33:14,400 --> 00:33:17,320
Speaker 5: Dude, powers that they can control where they protect their

673
00:33:17,320 --> 00:33:20,680
Speaker 5: family by putting out a shield like she gets worn

674
00:33:20,720 --> 00:33:23,840
Speaker 5: down by it. The baby is a talking baby that

675
00:33:23,880 --> 00:33:26,360
Speaker 5: can emotionally talk to Stephanie Meyers. I don't know if

676
00:33:26,360 --> 00:33:30,040
Speaker 5: you ever read a comic of The Fantastic Four, but

677
00:33:30,080 --> 00:33:33,160
Speaker 5: you either have exactly the same brain as Jack Kirby unlikely,

678
00:33:33,680 --> 00:33:36,760
Speaker 5: or you definitely stole all of those powers the baby.

679
00:33:36,960 --> 00:33:39,960
Speaker 5: Once that happened, the movie was on a downward swing

680
00:33:40,000 --> 00:33:42,960
Speaker 5: for me. Even though I love Galactus, I love Look.

681
00:33:43,240 --> 00:33:46,040
Speaker 5: I've been pitching for a long time, guys, this idea

682
00:33:46,160 --> 00:33:49,280
Speaker 5: that this year is hot Kaiju summer. Every movie has

683
00:33:49,280 --> 00:33:52,400
Speaker 5: a fucking Kaiju. They made Galactus into a Kaiju. They

684
00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:55,560
Speaker 5: scaled him down, they had him walk through. Michael Giacchino

685
00:33:55,680 --> 00:33:58,840
Speaker 5: even did the dunt dunt dum like it was gonna

686
00:33:58,880 --> 00:34:02,120
Speaker 5: be Godzilla's the and I thought that was really fun.

687
00:34:02,720 --> 00:34:06,840
Speaker 5: But then I started the baby looks weird. Galactus isn't

688
00:34:06,840 --> 00:34:09,759
Speaker 5: the right scale. He's changing size, like we're watching later

689
00:34:09,880 --> 00:34:12,719
Speaker 5: Jurassic World movies where the dinosaurs would always changed size.

690
00:34:12,840 --> 00:34:15,560
Speaker 5: And I think that's where it started to get muddy

691
00:34:15,600 --> 00:34:17,840
Speaker 5: for me. It was all began with Frank Zme and

692
00:34:17,840 --> 00:34:20,440
Speaker 5: from there it was it was it was downhill. Let's

693
00:34:20,480 --> 00:34:23,960
Speaker 5: talk about before I went on that tangent Pedro Pascal.

694
00:34:24,120 --> 00:34:26,240
Speaker 5: I believe the man. I'm not gonna say the question.

695
00:34:26,320 --> 00:34:28,680
Speaker 5: Does Pedro have the juice? I believe he has the juice.

696
00:34:28,719 --> 00:34:31,239
Speaker 5: We've seen him have the juice. Did they make the

697
00:34:31,239 --> 00:34:35,040
Speaker 5: most of having the most famous actor in the world

698
00:34:35,080 --> 00:34:39,279
Speaker 5: as read Richards? In my opinion, no, Aaron, did the

699
00:34:39,360 --> 00:34:42,879
Speaker 5: read Richard's characterization as someone who doesn't necessarily know him?

700
00:34:43,160 --> 00:34:44,719
Speaker 3: Was that a character you were interested in?

701
00:34:45,280 --> 00:34:48,520
Speaker 7: I mean, I know I have a basic understanding. Yeah, really,

702
00:34:48,600 --> 00:34:50,880
Speaker 7: you know, I read you know, fraction comics and stuff.

703
00:34:50,920 --> 00:34:52,920
Speaker 7: I just don't have like a huge He was never

704
00:34:52,960 --> 00:34:55,759
Speaker 7: one of my favorites, and I think honestly he's very

705
00:34:55,760 --> 00:35:00,160
Speaker 7: few people's favorites because we have this constant comparison and

706
00:35:00,239 --> 00:35:03,960
Speaker 7: obviously to Superman, and I have been shocked this whole

707
00:35:04,000 --> 00:35:06,160
Speaker 7: time that you've thought this would be bigger than Superman

708
00:35:06,239 --> 00:35:08,320
Speaker 7: because Superman is just a bigger brand.

709
00:35:08,600 --> 00:35:11,800
Speaker 3: But don't always do crazy well.

710
00:35:12,200 --> 00:35:17,839
Speaker 7: And it also anyways, Yes, but for Reid, I think

711
00:35:18,080 --> 00:35:19,800
Speaker 7: reads not the main character of this movie.

712
00:35:19,800 --> 00:35:23,680
Speaker 5: It's a s Johnny, That's what I'm saying. That's a problem.

713
00:35:23,719 --> 00:35:25,760
Speaker 5: It is a Swing Johnny movie and they are better.

714
00:35:26,320 --> 00:35:28,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, but he that shouldn't.

715
00:35:28,000 --> 00:35:30,239
Speaker 5: Be the case when you have Pedro pascal as read

716
00:35:30,320 --> 00:35:32,080
Speaker 5: Joe Al what was your read on read?

717
00:35:33,640 --> 00:35:36,080
Speaker 4: Okay, I have a controversial opinion to this groups here

718
00:35:36,120 --> 00:35:39,160
Speaker 4: I read I like this version of reading, but I

719
00:35:39,200 --> 00:35:41,600
Speaker 4: love a worry dad. Like a worried dad is like

720
00:35:41,880 --> 00:35:42,879
Speaker 4: for me, like, I'm like.

721
00:35:42,880 --> 00:35:43,960
Speaker 6: This is so sweet.

722
00:35:44,040 --> 00:35:45,719
Speaker 4: He's like literally was like, what if I took down

723
00:35:45,760 --> 00:35:49,319
Speaker 4: every gang at once? Like the ambition to baby proof

724
00:35:49,360 --> 00:35:53,239
Speaker 4: of the World is It's what endeared me most to Read.

725
00:35:53,320 --> 00:35:56,239
Speaker 4: And simultaneously the fact that didn't pass on to his

726
00:35:56,280 --> 00:35:58,280
Speaker 4: wife at all, which I think is really where usually

727
00:35:58,280 --> 00:36:00,239
Speaker 4: it's like you're the carrying case and now I'm like,

728
00:36:00,280 --> 00:36:02,200
Speaker 4: protect you at all, colle He's like, watch you out

729
00:36:02,200 --> 00:36:03,879
Speaker 4: here doing whatever? But how do I make this world

730
00:36:03,920 --> 00:36:06,160
Speaker 4: safe for my baby? I love this element of him.

731
00:36:06,360 --> 00:36:09,720
Speaker 4: I think there's a lack of dichotomy between Read before

732
00:36:09,760 --> 00:36:11,239
Speaker 4: he found out he was going to become a dad

733
00:36:11,280 --> 00:36:13,439
Speaker 4: and Read once he found out he became a father.

734
00:36:13,840 --> 00:36:15,120
Speaker 4: I think it would have been really interesting to see

735
00:36:15,120 --> 00:36:18,520
Speaker 4: this read that everybody knows as a top like adventurer, headstrong,

736
00:36:18,560 --> 00:36:21,120
Speaker 4: like confident in all of his thoughts like really like

737
00:36:21,320 --> 00:36:23,120
Speaker 4: loving the event, and again we get it in a speech,

738
00:36:24,320 --> 00:36:26,080
Speaker 4: see exactly.

739
00:36:26,120 --> 00:36:27,200
Speaker 3: That's the problem.

740
00:36:27,280 --> 00:36:29,320
Speaker 4: But that's what I'm saying, Like if you had given

741
00:36:29,400 --> 00:36:32,200
Speaker 4: us a moment instead of telling us, oh, we were

742
00:36:32,280 --> 00:36:34,520
Speaker 4: like really adventuring and now I'm a dad, it's different.

743
00:36:34,600 --> 00:36:37,200
Speaker 4: Show me, show me, like okay, here he is like

744
00:36:37,520 --> 00:36:40,919
Speaker 4: taking risks, not listening to everybody, like really on his own,

745
00:36:41,239 --> 00:36:43,160
Speaker 4: and the minute he finds out he's a dad, all

746
00:36:43,239 --> 00:36:47,360
Speaker 4: his confidence is gone. He's concerned about everything he's he's

747
00:36:47,440 --> 00:36:49,759
Speaker 4: isolating a little more because he's putting all of his

748
00:36:49,800 --> 00:36:52,799
Speaker 4: time and effort into these new inventions. Like there's that

749
00:36:52,840 --> 00:36:55,239
Speaker 4: gives you an arc, but instead what you get is like, oh,

750
00:36:55,280 --> 00:36:56,840
Speaker 4: this guy's become a dad and he's worried about it,

751
00:36:56,880 --> 00:36:58,760
Speaker 4: which doesn't give me a lot to connect to the character.

752
00:36:58,800 --> 00:37:00,759
Speaker 4: Everybody worries when they find outther becoming apparent. That's like

753
00:37:00,760 --> 00:37:03,279
Speaker 4: the universal thing about becoming a parent. But this guy

754
00:37:03,280 --> 00:37:05,920
Speaker 4: has changed dramatically and now his wife is like where's

755
00:37:05,960 --> 00:37:08,000
Speaker 4: my husband at? And the world is like, where is

756
00:37:08,040 --> 00:37:10,440
Speaker 4: our leader at? That's how we get into a story.

757
00:37:10,480 --> 00:37:13,640
Speaker 4: There isn't enough dichotomy between who were you before this

758
00:37:13,760 --> 00:37:16,120
Speaker 4: inciting incident and who are you now? And there's not

759
00:37:16,239 --> 00:37:18,239
Speaker 4: enough character in the who are you now for us

760
00:37:18,280 --> 00:37:20,960
Speaker 4: to infer who he was before, and so it's just

761
00:37:21,400 --> 00:37:23,960
Speaker 4: it lays kind of flat. I think Patron's giving his all.

762
00:37:23,960 --> 00:37:25,799
Speaker 4: I thought when he's been the calculations, when he's talking

763
00:37:25,840 --> 00:37:27,480
Speaker 4: to the kids and he gets too lofty's like, let's

764
00:37:27,480 --> 00:37:30,799
Speaker 4: explode something like there's so much like where you're like, oh,

765
00:37:30,800 --> 00:37:34,719
Speaker 4: I get the personality leader on TV type it. It's

766
00:37:34,760 --> 00:37:37,200
Speaker 4: almost there, but the writing just doesn't give us enough

767
00:37:37,280 --> 00:37:39,080
Speaker 4: to understand the man fully.

768
00:37:39,760 --> 00:37:44,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, for me, it's very simple of middle aged genius,

769
00:37:45,719 --> 00:37:49,319
Speaker 2: super genius who lives with his family and has no

770
00:37:49,480 --> 00:37:55,640
Speaker 2: secrets from them is not interesting period. What is his

771
00:37:55,760 --> 00:37:58,960
Speaker 2: internal life like? Like, what is he not telling them?

772
00:37:59,200 --> 00:38:01,719
Speaker 2: What is he not the world? He literally tells them

773
00:38:01,920 --> 00:38:05,480
Speaker 2: immediately he lands thirty seconds after the galactus thing, and

774
00:38:05,560 --> 00:38:05,920
Speaker 2: it's like.

775
00:38:05,920 --> 00:38:08,680
Speaker 6: Here's every here's the here's the absolute.

776
00:38:08,200 --> 00:38:10,719
Speaker 2: Most crucial shit that happened. That, by the way, I

777
00:38:10,719 --> 00:38:13,080
Speaker 2: should keep to myself. I'm gonna tell you everything, and

778
00:38:13,239 --> 00:38:16,040
Speaker 2: that is I agree with you everything you said. You well,

779
00:38:16,080 --> 00:38:17,520
Speaker 2: But I think part of the reason it's flat is

780
00:38:17,560 --> 00:38:20,000
Speaker 2: like everybody in this is an open book that has

781
00:38:20,040 --> 00:38:24,560
Speaker 2: no secrets from anybody else, like what Rosie hinted at.

782
00:38:24,400 --> 00:38:25,480
Speaker 6: It and talked about it.

783
00:38:25,520 --> 00:38:27,479
Speaker 2: We did mention it in the pod. But like part

784
00:38:27,520 --> 00:38:30,720
Speaker 2: of being that smart is you see around the corner

785
00:38:30,719 --> 00:38:33,319
Speaker 2: and you see what's coming. Do you want to let

786
00:38:33,360 --> 00:38:36,600
Speaker 2: people know about how bad it's going to be? Maybe

787
00:38:36,600 --> 00:38:39,600
Speaker 2: he doesn't. And now it's interesting.

788
00:38:39,160 --> 00:38:41,759
Speaker 3: Right, imagine if he had been the only.

789
00:38:41,480 --> 00:38:44,560
Speaker 2: One this is much worse than everybody thinks, and I

790
00:38:44,640 --> 00:38:47,920
Speaker 2: know it, And how do I break that to everybody?

791
00:38:48,280 --> 00:38:50,919
Speaker 2: Or do I even break it to everybody? Now I'm

792
00:38:51,000 --> 00:38:53,920
Speaker 2: leaning in and I just felt like the fact that

793
00:38:54,320 --> 00:38:57,200
Speaker 2: it's just read telling you, I'm just here's everything that's

794
00:38:57,200 --> 00:38:59,319
Speaker 2: going on, and here's everything that I'm thinking, and here's

795
00:38:59,360 --> 00:39:04,160
Speaker 2: what happened with and him being such an open book

796
00:39:05,080 --> 00:39:08,160
Speaker 2: is part of why it didn't why it felt a

797
00:39:08,160 --> 00:39:11,040
Speaker 2: little swagless to me, Like I love that he was

798
00:39:11,239 --> 00:39:14,640
Speaker 2: a caring father, but he had a he almost had

799
00:39:14,719 --> 00:39:17,640
Speaker 2: there was like he was kind of personality less in

800
00:39:17,680 --> 00:39:19,320
Speaker 2: a way that felt a little drab.

801
00:39:20,040 --> 00:39:23,719
Speaker 7: Again, not a bad movie, not to invoke Marvel at

802
00:39:23,719 --> 00:39:26,600
Speaker 7: its peak, but it would have been amazing to have

803
00:39:26,640 --> 00:39:30,239
Speaker 7: had a scene reminiscent of Doctor Strange saying there's one

804
00:39:30,440 --> 00:39:33,319
Speaker 7: there's one universe, there's one path where this works out.

805
00:39:33,719 --> 00:39:35,720
Speaker 3: So I seen it.

806
00:39:35,880 --> 00:39:37,120
Speaker 1: Yea been very cool.

807
00:39:37,200 --> 00:39:39,120
Speaker 4: They started hinting at it when she's like what you

808
00:39:39,239 --> 00:39:42,439
Speaker 4: do hurts me sometimes, and that Jason was talking about

809
00:39:42,440 --> 00:39:44,560
Speaker 4: like that being the most interesting part to him. I

810
00:39:44,600 --> 00:39:46,640
Speaker 4: think that like if they had actually went and had

811
00:39:46,640 --> 00:39:49,880
Speaker 4: that fight instead of like the hard cut Disney decided

812
00:39:49,920 --> 00:39:52,120
Speaker 4: to make where he's really like, yes it does. I'm

813
00:39:52,160 --> 00:39:54,360
Speaker 4: gonna hurt your babe, Like I'm stupid smart, and I

814
00:39:54,440 --> 00:39:56,759
Speaker 4: have to see all of the options and if this

815
00:39:56,800 --> 00:39:58,719
Speaker 4: is part of being with me, and she could be

816
00:39:58,760 --> 00:40:01,560
Speaker 4: like you terrified, I mean, this world for our child again.

817
00:40:01,800 --> 00:40:03,680
Speaker 4: Now we have conflict, Now we have something to go

818
00:40:03,800 --> 00:40:06,279
Speaker 4: off of. But like the immediate return to the side

819
00:40:06,320 --> 00:40:08,360
Speaker 4: of like I'm sorry, I'll try to be better at that.

820
00:40:08,360 --> 00:40:10,239
Speaker 4: You're just like this is not storytelling.

821
00:40:10,800 --> 00:40:27,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, we're gonna go to a break. We'll be right back, Okay.

822
00:40:28,520 --> 00:40:31,440
Speaker 2: It's the it's the comparison that it's not a comparison,

823
00:40:31,520 --> 00:40:35,719
Speaker 2: it's not a competition, but it is a competition because

824
00:40:35,760 --> 00:40:39,960
Speaker 2: they are competing companies. Superman versus Fantastic four.

825
00:40:40,000 --> 00:40:40,560
Speaker 4: Do we care?

826
00:40:40,920 --> 00:40:45,839
Speaker 2: Is it like, do we acknowledge it? What do we

827
00:40:45,920 --> 00:40:48,600
Speaker 2: think if this movie comes out on its own with

828
00:40:48,640 --> 00:40:50,680
Speaker 2: no Superman? Do we feel differently?

829
00:40:51,239 --> 00:40:53,800
Speaker 4: In Arrival? Read this old you cannot help but compare.

830
00:40:53,920 --> 00:40:57,000
Speaker 4: I absolutely think we would have a different perspective. I

831
00:40:57,000 --> 00:40:59,560
Speaker 4: also think we'd have a term perspective. If Marvel's last one,

832
00:40:59,640 --> 00:41:03,160
Speaker 4: two or three movies had been hit, then it wouldn't

833
00:41:03,200 --> 00:41:06,080
Speaker 4: matter as much. But because they were like, this is

834
00:41:06,120 --> 00:41:08,759
Speaker 4: so new and so different, because it's a property they've

835
00:41:08,800 --> 00:41:11,359
Speaker 4: been trying to get back, and everybody's very curious about

836
00:41:11,360 --> 00:41:15,439
Speaker 4: what's gonna happen with the formerly Fox characters. I think,

837
00:41:15,480 --> 00:41:17,640
Speaker 4: of course, like we can because they had James Gunn

838
00:41:17,640 --> 00:41:20,080
Speaker 4: and lost him. I think you can't help but look

839
00:41:20,160 --> 00:41:22,520
Speaker 4: and compare and like contrast and see, like, hey, what's

840
00:41:22,560 --> 00:41:25,640
Speaker 4: going on here? And when you look at DC hitting

841
00:41:25,680 --> 00:41:27,759
Speaker 4: it so hard out of the park, making it completely

842
00:41:27,840 --> 00:41:31,840
Speaker 4: their own, and to have Marvel hit you with another

843
00:41:32,000 --> 00:41:35,400
Speaker 4: like me like that's it's almost worse than if it

844
00:41:35,440 --> 00:41:37,400
Speaker 4: had been bad, because if it had just been straight

845
00:41:37,480 --> 00:41:39,080
Speaker 4: up bad, then you could be like, well, at least

846
00:41:39,080 --> 00:41:41,719
Speaker 4: they were trying something, and they're trying to shake off

847
00:41:41,800 --> 00:41:45,200
Speaker 4: this like dust and get back to something but the

848
00:41:45,360 --> 00:41:48,000
Speaker 4: men and the safety of it all. I mean, I'm

849
00:41:48,040 --> 00:41:51,719
Speaker 4: hearing life long like since eight Marvel fans be like,

850
00:41:51,719 --> 00:41:54,640
Speaker 4: I just don't care anymore. Like it's not superhero fatigue,

851
00:41:54,680 --> 00:41:57,279
Speaker 4: it's Marvel fatigue, and it's because you're not giving us

852
00:41:57,520 --> 00:42:01,120
Speaker 4: stuff to be excited about and to connect with. I

853
00:42:01,160 --> 00:42:03,320
Speaker 4: really like like the idea of Galactus. Again, I'm not

854
00:42:03,320 --> 00:42:05,040
Speaker 4: a big Fantastic four person, but Galactus is one of

855
00:42:05,080 --> 00:42:06,959
Speaker 4: those creatures that whenever seen me be like, holy shit,

856
00:42:07,480 --> 00:42:10,880
Speaker 4: Like he's a world eater. He's a world eater. She

857
00:42:10,960 --> 00:42:14,759
Speaker 4: pushed him back with magical rainbow forces. I just what

858
00:42:14,920 --> 00:42:18,239
Speaker 4: are we doing? Like why why did that happen? We're

859
00:42:18,400 --> 00:42:21,239
Speaker 4: we have tactical geniuses on the ground and they're not

860
00:42:21,280 --> 00:42:23,799
Speaker 4: at their tech Like typically what happens when you get

861
00:42:23,800 --> 00:42:26,200
Speaker 4: an emotional pushback like that where it's like one person

862
00:42:26,680 --> 00:42:28,359
Speaker 4: just giving it. They're all until they died on the field.

863
00:42:28,360 --> 00:42:31,640
Speaker 4: What's usually happened is you've had nineteen failures before that. Yeah,

864
00:42:31,640 --> 00:42:33,719
Speaker 4: and it's the last hurrah and it's the only time

865
00:42:33,800 --> 00:42:35,719
Speaker 4: to save them. And it makes sense. We have like

866
00:42:35,800 --> 00:42:40,839
Speaker 4: two tries that are honestly mediocre and haphazard, and it does,

867
00:42:40,920 --> 00:42:43,879
Speaker 4: and it makes what should have been this emotionally devastating

868
00:42:43,880 --> 00:42:45,360
Speaker 4: moment for a woman he said, I will do everything

869
00:42:45,360 --> 00:42:48,800
Speaker 4: to protect my child kind of silly. You're like, he's

870
00:42:48,840 --> 00:42:52,200
Speaker 4: a world eater who's older than our universe and you

871
00:42:52,320 --> 00:42:54,840
Speaker 4: got to just push him across a lot. I don't

872
00:42:55,080 --> 00:42:57,680
Speaker 4: understand you didn't use his hubris against him. Like there's

873
00:42:57,719 --> 00:43:00,680
Speaker 4: just classic comic book tropes of how we the villains

874
00:43:00,880 --> 00:43:03,600
Speaker 4: that they just chose not to hit here, and it

875
00:43:03,719 --> 00:43:04,520
Speaker 4: really bums me up.

876
00:43:04,600 --> 00:43:06,440
Speaker 2: I just want to add before we move on that

877
00:43:06,560 --> 00:43:10,760
Speaker 2: I think this what you're talking about, Joelle, we're missing

878
00:43:10,800 --> 00:43:14,239
Speaker 2: the early movie scene that usually appears in these kind

879
00:43:14,239 --> 00:43:17,080
Speaker 2: of movies where there's some sort of fight so that

880
00:43:17,600 --> 00:43:21,160
Speaker 2: it's it's one an exciting moment for the fans, but

881
00:43:21,239 --> 00:43:25,280
Speaker 2: it's too an important load bearing structure because it tells

882
00:43:25,320 --> 00:43:28,359
Speaker 2: you how strong everybody is and how their powers work.

883
00:43:28,400 --> 00:43:30,520
Speaker 2: And the fact that we didn't get that before this

884
00:43:30,560 --> 00:43:35,120
Speaker 2: big fight, I think it makes it contributes to this

885
00:43:35,200 --> 00:43:39,719
Speaker 2: kind of murky feeling. Okay, Aaron, without Superman, you loved

886
00:43:39,760 --> 00:43:42,000
Speaker 2: the movie so like better than Superman?

887
00:43:42,160 --> 00:43:43,880
Speaker 6: Tell me, like, is it better than Superman.

888
00:43:44,520 --> 00:43:49,520
Speaker 7: Uh wow, So obviously I'm gonna say Superman's better because

889
00:43:49,600 --> 00:43:50,960
Speaker 7: I'm standing here with the three of.

890
00:43:50,920 --> 00:43:51,359
Speaker 1: You, so.

891
00:43:53,480 --> 00:43:54,879
Speaker 6: They don't be bullied by us.

892
00:43:55,280 --> 00:43:58,399
Speaker 3: I have controversial opinions all the time. Say for it's

893
00:43:58,440 --> 00:44:01,520
Speaker 3: all good, we welcome the min I.

894
00:44:01,840 --> 00:44:03,680
Speaker 7: In six months, who knows how I'll feel about the

895
00:44:03,680 --> 00:44:05,759
Speaker 7: two of these movies, Like I'll rewatch them and I

896
00:44:05,800 --> 00:44:07,399
Speaker 7: will probably like one more than the other.

897
00:44:07,480 --> 00:44:09,239
Speaker 1: At this point, I left the.

898
00:44:09,120 --> 00:44:11,640
Speaker 7: Theater for both movies very happy that I had seen

899
00:44:11,680 --> 00:44:16,200
Speaker 7: a fun comic book movie. And I think that I

900
00:44:16,239 --> 00:44:20,040
Speaker 7: think Marvel peaked with Endgame. I think Marvel right now

901
00:44:20,120 --> 00:44:22,560
Speaker 7: is Lebron on the Lakers like trying to chase his

902
00:44:22,680 --> 00:44:25,959
Speaker 7: former glory. Everyone is trying to achieve the same thing,

903
00:44:26,320 --> 00:44:30,080
Speaker 7: even Marvel, Like Marvel is trying to be what Marvel was,

904
00:44:30,160 --> 00:44:33,919
Speaker 7: and nobody's really doing it. DC is exciting, and I'm

905
00:44:34,000 --> 00:44:37,640
Speaker 7: hoping that that will lead into a nice universe and

906
00:44:37,680 --> 00:44:39,560
Speaker 7: we can get some fun Mister Terrific and some fun

907
00:44:39,600 --> 00:44:42,400
Speaker 7: howtgirl stuff. But I had fun. I had fun with

908
00:44:42,440 --> 00:44:44,880
Speaker 7: both of them, and like I left Superman, excited to

909
00:44:44,920 --> 00:44:46,879
Speaker 7: see more comic book movies, which I think is something

910
00:44:46,880 --> 00:44:49,240
Speaker 7: that hasn't been the case. Like I didn't leave Brave

911
00:44:49,280 --> 00:44:51,480
Speaker 7: New World, like Holy, I can't wait to get back

912
00:44:51,520 --> 00:44:54,239
Speaker 7: in the theater for one of these. And I left

913
00:44:54,239 --> 00:44:56,640
Speaker 7: Superman and I felt excited about stuff, and I left

914
00:44:56,640 --> 00:44:58,560
Speaker 7: this and I was like, I'm excited to see all

915
00:44:58,640 --> 00:45:00,640
Speaker 7: these people in Doomsday. I think the will be fun.

916
00:45:01,719 --> 00:45:04,880
Speaker 1: So yeah, I think it.

917
00:45:04,880 --> 00:45:08,560
Speaker 7: It will unfortunately be compared to Superman, as we have

918
00:45:08,640 --> 00:45:13,040
Speaker 7: done throughout this entire podcast episode, and everyone else will

919
00:45:13,040 --> 00:45:16,960
Speaker 7: do the exact same thing. I think it will compare unfavorably.

920
00:45:17,120 --> 00:45:20,240
Speaker 7: Everyone I think will prefer Superman to this, which is fine.

921
00:45:21,400 --> 00:45:24,359
Speaker 7: You know that's gonna happen when they are released back

922
00:45:24,360 --> 00:45:27,040
Speaker 7: to back like this. If it was on its own,

923
00:45:27,920 --> 00:45:30,160
Speaker 7: I don't know if I would have felt differently about it.

924
00:45:30,200 --> 00:45:33,279
Speaker 7: Maybe because I had such low expectations and was so

925
00:45:33,440 --> 00:45:36,040
Speaker 7: happy with Superman that that made me enjoy this one too,

926
00:45:36,239 --> 00:45:39,439
Speaker 7: And just like the residual good feelings about comic book

927
00:45:39,480 --> 00:45:41,839
Speaker 7: movies was still, I was still high on that.

928
00:45:41,960 --> 00:45:45,280
Speaker 1: But yeah, I don't know that. It's not really an answer.

929
00:45:45,320 --> 00:45:52,360
Speaker 6: I enjoyed it Rosie better. If Superman didn't exist.

930
00:45:52,040 --> 00:45:54,359
Speaker 5: I think it's different, but I don't think it would

931
00:45:54,400 --> 00:45:57,279
Speaker 5: take away the biggest problem, which I think you guys

932
00:45:57,360 --> 00:45:59,799
Speaker 5: kind of touched on, and I just I think after

933
00:45:59,840 --> 00:46:02,640
Speaker 5: this conversation, the biggest issue is they didn't know how

934
00:46:02,640 --> 00:46:04,280
Speaker 5: to bring the powers to the screen.

935
00:46:04,440 --> 00:46:05,239
Speaker 3: And I don't think that.

936
00:46:05,200 --> 00:46:10,840
Speaker 5: Would be different if Superman hadn't been released before. Agree,

937
00:46:11,000 --> 00:46:15,720
Speaker 5: I think that this I did have a feeling where

938
00:46:16,239 --> 00:46:18,799
Speaker 5: if this had come out after Endgame, even with like

939
00:46:18,840 --> 00:46:21,319
Speaker 5: a two year gap or something, I think this would

940
00:46:21,320 --> 00:46:24,760
Speaker 5: have felt like a gang buster. Hey, they're doing something different,

941
00:46:24,840 --> 00:46:27,880
Speaker 5: Like it's still flawed, but I think post everything else,

942
00:46:28,360 --> 00:46:31,000
Speaker 5: it feels kind of like the movie should be better,

943
00:46:31,480 --> 00:46:33,160
Speaker 5: and for me it is that. I think you made

944
00:46:33,160 --> 00:46:36,479
Speaker 5: a great point, Jason, and you two Aaron this note

945
00:46:36,520 --> 00:46:38,920
Speaker 5: of like power setting. I don't think they knew how

946
00:46:38,960 --> 00:46:41,280
Speaker 5: to do the powers. I think the stretching was bad.

947
00:46:41,480 --> 00:46:44,280
Speaker 5: I think there was moments where as a comic book

948
00:46:44,320 --> 00:46:47,719
Speaker 5: fan who loves this stuff like reads, so in this world,

949
00:46:47,800 --> 00:46:52,160
Speaker 5: he didn't invent unstable molecules because his costume ripped, or wait,

950
00:46:52,239 --> 00:46:54,799
Speaker 5: how far can galect Us pull him? Doesn't actually look

951
00:46:54,840 --> 00:46:57,799
Speaker 5: that far compared to other things. I think it To me,

952
00:46:57,920 --> 00:47:00,839
Speaker 5: it comes down to the powers and how they represented,

953
00:47:01,520 --> 00:47:04,200
Speaker 5: and I don't think that that would have changed with Superman.

954
00:47:04,480 --> 00:47:07,440
Speaker 5: But Superman had so many different core characters with cool

955
00:47:07,480 --> 00:47:12,160
Speaker 5: different powers, like a really inventive green lantern, that I

956
00:47:12,200 --> 00:47:15,000
Speaker 5: think that without that, maybe this would have looked a

957
00:47:15,040 --> 00:47:17,160
Speaker 5: little bit better. But yeah, I think it's gonna be

958
00:47:17,239 --> 00:47:20,160
Speaker 5: the cultural conversation. And Marvel made that choice by putting this.

959
00:47:20,160 --> 00:47:20,879
Speaker 3: This could have been.

960
00:47:20,800 --> 00:47:24,320
Speaker 5: Their main movie if it was finished, but they didn't

961
00:47:24,320 --> 00:47:26,520
Speaker 5: make that choice, and they didn't finish it in time.

962
00:47:26,840 --> 00:47:29,359
Speaker 2: I mean, Superman is and that James Gunn Era has

963
00:47:30,160 --> 00:47:33,640
Speaker 2: come out with such a bang that we we don't.

964
00:47:33,480 --> 00:47:36,560
Speaker 6: Count Blue Beetle. We're literally like that didn't.

965
00:47:36,239 --> 00:47:40,239
Speaker 5: Happen, which is also funny because the irony is it's

966
00:47:40,280 --> 00:47:43,200
Speaker 5: like a really fine made for teaching, which is what

967
00:47:43,320 --> 00:47:46,359
Speaker 5: it was made of, right, right, and but it's kind

968
00:47:46,400 --> 00:47:48,640
Speaker 5: of funny and we're just like, oh, yeah, I didn't

969
00:47:48,920 --> 00:47:52,480
Speaker 5: forget that Superman, they did it right well. James Gunn's

970
00:47:52,520 --> 00:47:55,719
Speaker 5: own suicide Squad was a huge bomb, yep, but they

971
00:47:55,800 --> 00:47:57,839
Speaker 5: still said, hey, this guy's got a vision, like, let's

972
00:47:57,840 --> 00:47:59,719
Speaker 5: see what he can do. So maybe focusing on the

973
00:47:59,800 --> 00:48:15,200
Speaker 5: vision in and not the money is the massive day.

974
00:48:18,120 --> 00:48:22,320
Speaker 2: Okay, we're heading towards Doomsday, we get a snippet of Doom,

975
00:48:22,480 --> 00:48:27,480
Speaker 2: who is surely not RDJ. It's just some guy whatever PA.

976
00:48:27,400 --> 00:48:31,279
Speaker 3: Was day Good for that good?

977
00:48:32,680 --> 00:48:35,200
Speaker 2: I have to be feeling going to Doomsday and any

978
00:48:35,320 --> 00:48:38,840
Speaker 2: predictions as we head towards Doomsday and secret with.

979
00:48:38,719 --> 00:48:44,280
Speaker 5: Rosie predictions, how am I feeling about it? Give Doctor

980
00:48:44,320 --> 00:48:47,800
Speaker 5: doomergreen coat. I don't want to see this silver cape.

981
00:48:47,840 --> 00:48:50,000
Speaker 5: I'm not interested in it. I don't know about that

982
00:48:50,120 --> 00:48:53,239
Speaker 5: sot out. That mask looks bad if you're I think

983
00:48:53,280 --> 00:48:55,239
Speaker 5: a lot of the problem with this is right now,

984
00:48:55,280 --> 00:48:58,560
Speaker 5: there is a very interesting resurgence with kids and gen

985
00:48:58,680 --> 00:49:03,640
Speaker 5: Z folks of enjoying what Zero's CG looked like. There's

986
00:49:03,640 --> 00:49:07,480
Speaker 5: been a lot of retroactive fandom of the Michael Bay movies,

987
00:49:07,600 --> 00:49:11,320
Speaker 5: the intricacy of the CG, this kind of detailed focus,

988
00:49:11,760 --> 00:49:15,759
Speaker 5: and I do think that, unfortunately, that means people are

989
00:49:15,760 --> 00:49:18,120
Speaker 5: looking back to the Odd Fantastic Four movies. They're going, hey,

990
00:49:18,120 --> 00:49:20,960
Speaker 5: this looks pretty fun, pretty camp, pretty colorful. I think

991
00:49:20,960 --> 00:49:24,080
Speaker 5: there's a lot of comparison here. I think they are

992
00:49:24,080 --> 00:49:27,160
Speaker 5: committed to doomsday. They've rushed that through their bringing back

993
00:49:27,200 --> 00:49:30,400
Speaker 5: the Russo Brothers. I don't know I would like to

994
00:49:30,400 --> 00:49:32,960
Speaker 5: see Doctor Doom dunwell, and everyone knows I was not

995
00:49:33,000 --> 00:49:37,360
Speaker 5: a huge RDG Doom fan. This doesn't necessarily fill me

996
00:49:37,400 --> 00:49:40,000
Speaker 5: with joy, but I do think, as I mentioned before,

997
00:49:40,160 --> 00:49:42,600
Speaker 5: lots of ways to change that, lots of ways to

998
00:49:42,640 --> 00:49:46,919
Speaker 5: adapt it. Shachman put in all these wonder Vision kind

999
00:49:46,920 --> 00:49:50,080
Speaker 5: of caplans, shop and all these things that made me think, well,

1000
00:49:50,120 --> 00:49:51,800
Speaker 5: you could always just say it was all a dream

1001
00:49:51,920 --> 00:49:54,759
Speaker 5: or a pocket universe or whatever version you want to do.

1002
00:49:55,400 --> 00:49:57,040
Speaker 5: I don't think they're going to do that, because they

1003
00:49:57,040 --> 00:50:01,080
Speaker 5: committed really hard to this. But my biggest this theory

1004
00:50:01,640 --> 00:50:06,320
Speaker 5: is that yeah, Doom wants Franklin so he can create

1005
00:50:06,440 --> 00:50:09,720
Speaker 5: World War Doom. He can create his battle world or whatever,

1006
00:50:09,960 --> 00:50:15,560
Speaker 5: and then he will use that to craft the drama of.

1007
00:50:15,560 --> 00:50:17,160
Speaker 3: Secret Wars or you know.

1008
00:50:17,280 --> 00:50:20,600
Speaker 5: Honestly, the weirdest thing is like I came out of

1009
00:50:20,600 --> 00:50:23,280
Speaker 5: this with so many more just like joke thoughts.

1010
00:50:22,880 --> 00:50:23,439
Speaker 3: In my head.

1011
00:50:23,520 --> 00:50:26,399
Speaker 5: And everyone knows I'm a theorizer, but this really left

1012
00:50:26,480 --> 00:50:29,480
Speaker 5: me more of like why did the baby look like that?

1013
00:50:29,560 --> 00:50:32,080
Speaker 5: Which is kind of crazy.

1014
00:50:33,680 --> 00:50:37,880
Speaker 4: Joelle, I really hated this post credit scene. I hate both.

1015
00:50:38,040 --> 00:50:40,920
Speaker 4: This one really upset me. I think a good post

1016
00:50:40,960 --> 00:50:45,440
Speaker 4: credit scene, as established by Marvel, informs your audience of

1017
00:50:45,560 --> 00:50:48,640
Speaker 4: something new. So like the end of the Thunderbolts credit

1018
00:50:48,640 --> 00:50:52,560
Speaker 4: scene was fucking boss. We got new outfits, we understood

1019
00:50:52,640 --> 00:50:55,200
Speaker 4: that they were. Now like there's a new conflict set

1020
00:50:55,280 --> 00:50:57,799
Speaker 4: up between these vendors and the new Avengers and then

1021
00:50:57,800 --> 00:51:00,480
Speaker 4: the fantastic for entering the papers great so much I

1022
00:51:00,480 --> 00:51:03,160
Speaker 4: can take home and work with and pick up. That's awesome.

1023
00:51:04,560 --> 00:51:06,759
Speaker 4: Doom is coming and you did a whole presentation on

1024
00:51:06,800 --> 00:51:08,560
Speaker 4: that year and a half ago. Like I I've done

1025
00:51:08,600 --> 00:51:11,080
Speaker 4: seen that. I know doom is coming. What do I

1026
00:51:11,120 --> 00:51:16,080
Speaker 4: get out of here? I don't even understand, Like I

1027
00:51:16,080 --> 00:51:19,280
Speaker 4: don't even necessarily need to know that, Like I'm working,

1028
00:51:19,360 --> 00:51:22,640
Speaker 4: like ore Read and Sue still together because they were

1029
00:51:22,680 --> 00:51:25,560
Speaker 4: having some conflict that never really got resolved, and it's

1030
00:51:25,560 --> 00:51:28,040
Speaker 4: all very vague and foggy, and he's nowhere to be

1031
00:51:28,040 --> 00:51:31,160
Speaker 4: seen in this apartment. Uh what is Sue? Is she

1032
00:51:31,239 --> 00:51:33,040
Speaker 4: stay at home mom? Now they're just chilling at home

1033
00:51:33,160 --> 00:51:35,520
Speaker 4: or like I don't understand, Like it's four years, You've

1034
00:51:35,520 --> 00:51:37,040
Speaker 4: done a four year jump, but I don't know, like

1035
00:51:37,040 --> 00:51:40,160
Speaker 4: what's happened? I don't know. They're just reading books and

1036
00:51:40,200 --> 00:51:42,040
Speaker 4: now Doom is here. This is such a waste of

1037
00:51:42,040 --> 00:51:44,800
Speaker 4: my time. I just says, of my time. Makes it

1038
00:51:44,840 --> 00:51:46,920
Speaker 4: feel so dramatic. I just feel like, if you're gonna

1039
00:51:46,960 --> 00:51:48,560
Speaker 4: do a post credit scene, like there should be a

1040
00:51:48,640 --> 00:51:51,680
Speaker 4: reason for rolling the camera. And I just don't even

1041
00:51:51,719 --> 00:51:52,920
Speaker 4: made a big deal. They were like, oh, if the

1042
00:51:52,960 --> 00:51:55,160
Speaker 4: Russo's directed, I'm like, who gives a You could put

1043
00:51:55,200 --> 00:51:57,040
Speaker 4: an interurt on this. It got the exact same shot,

1044
00:51:57,200 --> 00:51:57,960
Speaker 4: nothing happened.

1045
00:52:01,280 --> 00:52:03,399
Speaker 5: I will say as well, Joel, you're making me think

1046
00:52:03,480 --> 00:52:07,560
Speaker 5: like why as well? Like tonally, maybe don't bring the

1047
00:52:07,640 --> 00:52:12,040
Speaker 5: verses in because hilariously, my read on that post credit scene,

1048
00:52:12,200 --> 00:52:13,000
Speaker 5: so who goes into that.

1049
00:52:13,040 --> 00:52:15,840
Speaker 3: Room and there's like a sexy music and her magic

1050
00:52:15,880 --> 00:52:18,640
Speaker 3: starts and I was like, I literally was like no more.

1051
00:52:19,040 --> 00:52:20,879
Speaker 3: I was like, why they bringing him into this.

1052
00:52:20,840 --> 00:52:23,040
Speaker 4: Like they already want to five was like there'd be

1053
00:52:23,080 --> 00:52:25,280
Speaker 4: another man in this house, like he's not here anymore.

1054
00:52:25,280 --> 00:52:28,400
Speaker 5: Feel to me, it didn't feel like Fia. It didn't

1055
00:52:28,400 --> 00:52:30,359
Speaker 5: feel like Aaron, how is it for you? We're so

1056
00:52:30,400 --> 00:52:31,520
Speaker 5: happy to see doctor Doom.

1057
00:52:31,560 --> 00:52:32,240
Speaker 3: You love him.

1058
00:52:32,560 --> 00:52:33,239
Speaker 1: I loved it.

1059
00:52:33,239 --> 00:52:35,320
Speaker 7: It was There have been too many Marvel post credit

1060
00:52:35,320 --> 00:52:37,759
Speaker 7: scenes that introduced some new character that we're never going

1061
00:52:37,840 --> 00:52:40,279
Speaker 7: to see again. Are we excited that Schiros again? Are

1062
00:52:40,320 --> 00:52:42,080
Speaker 7: we going to see Clea again? Are we going to

1063
00:52:42,080 --> 00:52:44,520
Speaker 7: see Hercules? Like there have been too many of those.

1064
00:52:44,920 --> 00:52:48,440
Speaker 7: This was an in universe introduction to doctor Doom. Yes,

1065
00:52:48,480 --> 00:52:51,240
Speaker 7: we've had the comic con panels, Yes we've had news

1066
00:52:51,320 --> 00:52:54,719
Speaker 7: leaks and photos, but this was the first time in

1067
00:52:54,880 --> 00:52:58,319
Speaker 7: universe we get doomed. This is an introduction to something new.

1068
00:52:58,440 --> 00:53:02,520
Speaker 7: Like not everyone that's seeing the movie has been in

1069
00:53:02,560 --> 00:53:06,399
Speaker 7: the subreddits for three years rising about Doom, so this

1070
00:53:06,600 --> 00:53:10,239
Speaker 7: is an introduction to him. I thought that this did

1071
00:53:10,280 --> 00:53:13,080
Speaker 7: what the old post credit scenes used to do, introducing

1072
00:53:13,080 --> 00:53:18,400
Speaker 7: cap Shield, introducing Thor's hammer, introducing like a thing that

1073
00:53:18,520 --> 00:53:21,239
Speaker 7: we know is going to happen in an upcoming movie,

1074
00:53:21,320 --> 00:53:23,160
Speaker 7: as opposed to all these other ones that are just

1075
00:53:23,200 --> 00:53:27,200
Speaker 7: like expanding the universe for the universe's sake and they

1076
00:53:27,280 --> 00:53:30,400
Speaker 7: never lead to anything. So I thought this was a

1077
00:53:30,440 --> 00:53:34,680
Speaker 7: really good one, and I I I don't care if

1078
00:53:34,680 --> 00:53:37,160
Speaker 7: it was downy or not. Like the fact that there

1079
00:53:37,239 --> 00:53:40,360
Speaker 7: was just a hint of Doom. We get this iconic

1080
00:53:40,440 --> 00:53:42,719
Speaker 7: villain who's going to be there. I can't believe you're

1081
00:53:42,760 --> 00:53:45,239
Speaker 7: going off on like whether or not read his home

1082
00:53:45,280 --> 00:53:47,239
Speaker 7: and if there has to be another man in the house.

1083
00:53:47,280 --> 00:53:50,240
Speaker 7: What a silly Like it was just about introducing Doom,

1084
00:53:50,320 --> 00:53:52,080
Speaker 7: that's it, but it wasn't another man in that house.

1085
00:53:52,400 --> 00:53:55,080
Speaker 6: Doom the back of Doom, but it's not an introduction.

1086
00:53:55,400 --> 00:53:58,879
Speaker 4: Listen, wait, wait, we got Thor's hammer. Like nobody knew

1087
00:53:59,040 --> 00:54:03,120
Speaker 4: what to expect next. Really like they weren't doing large,

1088
00:54:03,160 --> 00:54:06,520
Speaker 4: like full scale announcements, and so when you uncover the shield,

1089
00:54:06,520 --> 00:54:09,280
Speaker 4: you're like, oh, that you're doing more. That's really exciting.

1090
00:54:10,000 --> 00:54:13,920
Speaker 4: Even Samuel Jackson's like, they're like, oh, here's the full character.

1091
00:54:13,960 --> 00:54:16,480
Speaker 4: He does have the eye patches. Samuel L. Jackson, we

1092
00:54:16,520 --> 00:54:18,839
Speaker 4: did the long coat, but there's enough detail in there

1093
00:54:18,880 --> 00:54:20,680
Speaker 4: that you're like, I'm starting to get an idea of

1094
00:54:20,719 --> 00:54:23,760
Speaker 4: like who this character is this And yes, the spirit

1095
00:54:23,920 --> 00:54:29,000
Speaker 4: level Halloween costume where he's on his knees and he's

1096
00:54:29,000 --> 00:54:32,759
Speaker 4: got the tape. Any action, y'all are gonna beet Ian

1097
00:54:32,840 --> 00:54:34,880
Speaker 4: on our Comic Con news episode. I'm very excited for

1098
00:54:34,920 --> 00:54:36,879
Speaker 4: the audience. It's gonna be great, lots of hot takes

1099
00:54:36,920 --> 00:54:40,600
Speaker 4: for Ian. But I just I felt like, well, if

1100
00:54:41,040 --> 00:54:43,200
Speaker 4: I'm totally fine with like, here's just a tease of

1101
00:54:43,239 --> 00:54:45,920
Speaker 4: this character, but then you need to be doing something

1102
00:54:46,600 --> 00:54:49,600
Speaker 4: And I don't understand what he's doing with the like

1103
00:54:49,600 --> 00:54:51,759
Speaker 4: what who are you here for the kiddy? Here for Sue?

1104
00:54:51,760 --> 00:54:54,440
Speaker 4: What's going It's just so out of left field and

1105
00:54:54,520 --> 00:54:55,400
Speaker 4: not enough information.

1106
00:54:55,719 --> 00:54:58,120
Speaker 1: He was he was sitting in front of Franklin and

1107
00:54:58,160 --> 00:54:58,760
Speaker 1: he taking.

1108
00:54:58,560 --> 00:55:02,880
Speaker 4: Off his mask and he's kneeling. But again that it's

1109
00:55:02,920 --> 00:55:05,879
Speaker 4: not enough information. Aaron is not I need I need

1110
00:55:05,920 --> 00:55:08,000
Speaker 4: a here's the thing I'm giving you, here's the keys,

1111
00:55:08,040 --> 00:55:10,080
Speaker 4: you're coming with me? Anything? What are we doing?

1112
00:55:10,680 --> 00:55:10,839
Speaker 1: Well?

1113
00:55:10,880 --> 00:55:12,680
Speaker 5: Also a big issue and I did bring this up

1114
00:55:12,680 --> 00:55:14,520
Speaker 5: on mine in Jason's podcast, but I think it leans

1115
00:55:14,520 --> 00:55:16,960
Speaker 5: into this, like they don't introduce Doom at any point

1116
00:55:17,440 --> 00:55:20,600
Speaker 5: in the movie, and like Victor von Doom is like

1117
00:55:20,640 --> 00:55:22,000
Speaker 5: a very important part.

1118
00:55:21,760 --> 00:55:22,520
Speaker 1: Of what there is.

1119
00:55:24,040 --> 00:55:27,160
Speaker 7: In the un with the la He's not there, but

1120
00:55:27,239 --> 00:55:28,160
Speaker 7: like so that was the.

1121
00:55:28,400 --> 00:55:31,799
Speaker 5: Well, like the implication of him being with Franklin, if

1122
00:55:31,800 --> 00:55:33,680
Speaker 5: he'd been in the movie is like, oh maybe Sumin

1123
00:55:33,760 --> 00:55:36,200
Speaker 5: Doom did hook up. That was always that like tension

1124
00:55:36,280 --> 00:55:38,799
Speaker 5: between them, is it his kid? Like this was just

1125
00:55:38,800 --> 00:55:41,279
Speaker 5: like a random guy coming to find Franklin. They did

1126
00:55:41,280 --> 00:55:42,400
Speaker 5: they go to college together.

1127
00:55:42,520 --> 00:55:43,040
Speaker 3: I don't know.

1128
00:55:43,600 --> 00:55:48,160
Speaker 2: That was my So my takeaway on obviously the final stinger,

1129
00:55:48,440 --> 00:55:52,160
Speaker 2: I think is you wasted everybody's time with that. The

1130
00:55:52,160 --> 00:55:55,879
Speaker 2: the first stinger, I liked it, but I thought what

1131
00:55:55,920 --> 00:56:01,640
Speaker 2: you needed was one line anywhere in the movie Meeting

1132
00:56:01,680 --> 00:56:04,880
Speaker 2: of the Future Foundation, lavarious seat is empty. Somebody says

1133
00:56:04,920 --> 00:56:10,120
Speaker 2: something about that. Somebody just set the table so that

1134
00:56:10,239 --> 00:56:13,360
Speaker 2: I know if he exists or not, and if you

1135
00:56:13,560 --> 00:56:17,640
Speaker 2: know who he is or not. That's what I needed,

1136
00:56:17,920 --> 00:56:20,920
Speaker 2: because now we're heading into this. You know, after this

1137
00:56:21,440 --> 00:56:26,239
Speaker 2: the credit scene is that her first time she's met Dune.

1138
00:56:25,880 --> 00:56:27,040
Speaker 6: They fought him before.

1139
00:56:27,440 --> 00:56:28,160
Speaker 8: Does she know who?

1140
00:56:28,440 --> 00:56:29,160
Speaker 4: Like I don't want this.

1141
00:56:31,280 --> 00:56:31,480
Speaker 5: Room?

1142
00:56:34,040 --> 00:56:36,680
Speaker 6: Yes, and and any of that is fine.

1143
00:56:36,719 --> 00:56:39,160
Speaker 2: You don't know who he is? You do, like but

1144
00:56:39,239 --> 00:56:41,640
Speaker 2: I but not knowing is so weird to me.

1145
00:56:41,800 --> 00:56:44,279
Speaker 6: Just set it up.

1146
00:56:44,719 --> 00:56:47,200
Speaker 2: And then my final takeaway, just like on as we

1147
00:56:47,280 --> 00:56:49,239
Speaker 2: headed Doomsdays, we head in a Secret Wars all this

1148
00:56:49,239 --> 00:56:54,440
Speaker 2: stuff is I am left feeling that I don't know

1149
00:56:54,800 --> 00:56:57,160
Speaker 2: if Marvel has a plan, although I'm sure they say

1150
00:56:57,280 --> 00:57:00,279
Speaker 2: they do, and if they do have a plan, I'm

1151
00:57:00,320 --> 00:57:03,480
Speaker 2: not sure that Figgie will stick with it. Like I

1152
00:57:03,520 --> 00:57:07,560
Speaker 2: think that this movie has all the hallmarks of something

1153
00:57:07,560 --> 00:57:11,239
Speaker 2: that's been changed a million times, even up to the

1154
00:57:11,239 --> 00:57:15,880
Speaker 2: fact that Malcovich was surprisingly cut out of it despite

1155
00:57:15,880 --> 00:57:18,680
Speaker 2: being featured in the in the trailers right as apes

1156
00:57:18,800 --> 00:57:21,320
Speaker 2: was still bad and the apes are still there. So

1157
00:57:22,160 --> 00:57:25,040
Speaker 2: do we have a plan? Are we able to follow

1158
00:57:25,360 --> 00:57:26,000
Speaker 2: through with it?

1159
00:57:26,480 --> 00:57:30,080
Speaker 4: According to Variety.

1160
00:57:28,600 --> 00:57:32,320
Speaker 2: Can we follow Can we follow through with it in

1161
00:57:32,320 --> 00:57:36,120
Speaker 2: any substantive way? So, because like, here's what happened, you know,

1162
00:57:36,240 --> 00:57:37,720
Speaker 2: we talk about Marvel fatigue.

1163
00:57:38,600 --> 00:57:40,440
Speaker 6: What happened was Marvel ran out of story.

1164
00:57:41,240 --> 00:57:41,680
Speaker 1: That's all.

1165
00:57:42,360 --> 00:57:43,840
Speaker 2: It's really a very simple thing.

1166
00:57:43,960 --> 00:57:44,400
Speaker 4: Like it's not.

1167
00:57:45,120 --> 00:57:48,320
Speaker 2: Of course, there was some heat that drifted away and

1168
00:57:48,400 --> 00:57:52,760
Speaker 2: some uh fatigue with the genre overall, But what really

1169
00:57:52,800 --> 00:57:55,960
Speaker 2: happened is you ran out of story after endgame, the

1170
00:57:56,040 --> 00:57:59,560
Speaker 2: story was over, and yes there are these little solo

1171
00:57:59,680 --> 00:58:03,840
Speaker 2: things it happened, but the overarching story was the story

1172
00:58:04,720 --> 00:58:07,920
Speaker 2: and you ran out of that. So do we have

1173
00:58:08,000 --> 00:58:11,200
Speaker 2: that anymore? Do we have plans to create that? Or

1174
00:58:11,240 --> 00:58:14,560
Speaker 2: are we just gonna kind of go movie for movie,

1175
00:58:14,680 --> 00:58:15,640
Speaker 2: jumping moving to movie.

1176
00:58:15,840 --> 00:58:17,200
Speaker 6: And that, to me is the question.

1177
00:58:17,600 --> 00:58:19,520
Speaker 4: I have a theory. I have a theory, okay, and

1178
00:58:19,560 --> 00:58:22,000
Speaker 4: it's it's and maybe it's just what shuol thinking, because

1179
00:58:22,040 --> 00:58:23,960
Speaker 4: I've been asking Marvel to do this for a very

1180
00:58:24,080 --> 00:58:26,720
Speaker 4: long time, but you have to go younger, for the

1181
00:58:26,720 --> 00:58:30,480
Speaker 4: love of God. Look me, I agree, must go younger.

1182
00:58:30,760 --> 00:58:33,200
Speaker 4: And it's not because we don't want to see stories

1183
00:58:33,240 --> 00:58:35,120
Speaker 4: from older folks. It's just that you have stocked so

1184
00:58:35,320 --> 00:58:37,760
Speaker 4: much on the older folks that there's no space for

1185
00:58:37,800 --> 00:58:39,760
Speaker 4: the young kids to get it. We're worried about like

1186
00:58:39,760 --> 00:58:41,400
Speaker 4: a forty five year old, like having a baby for

1187
00:58:41,440 --> 00:58:44,000
Speaker 4: the first time, like a five year old, cannot connect

1188
00:58:44,120 --> 00:58:46,920
Speaker 4: on that emotional level. They don't understand. Johnny is not

1189
00:58:47,080 --> 00:58:49,120
Speaker 4: enough of a kid for the kids to connect to.

1190
00:58:49,160 --> 00:58:51,120
Speaker 4: I don't know who the children are supposed to like

1191
00:58:51,240 --> 00:58:53,320
Speaker 4: fall in love with and connect with in this movie,

1192
00:58:53,680 --> 00:58:54,000
Speaker 4: and that.

1193
00:58:54,040 --> 00:58:56,720
Speaker 1: Is Johnny eat cereal out of the box, Joelle.

1194
00:58:57,680 --> 00:59:01,280
Speaker 4: He was in that Stranger Thing movie. He's clearly the

1195
00:59:01,320 --> 00:59:04,000
Speaker 4: little brother, but it's just not quite enough. He's not

1196
00:59:04,120 --> 00:59:07,160
Speaker 4: cool or daring enough to sort of get on the

1197
00:59:07,280 --> 00:59:09,720
Speaker 4: vibe of like, oh he is like the alt outside

1198
00:59:09,840 --> 00:59:12,400
Speaker 4: kind of bad boy esque energy that we kind of

1199
00:59:12,400 --> 00:59:15,080
Speaker 4: expect from Johnny. I think that if they can lean

1200
00:59:15,160 --> 00:59:19,320
Speaker 4: into the X Men and a Young Adventures team and

1201
00:59:19,400 --> 00:59:22,480
Speaker 4: nail the consequences and the things that concern Like the

1202
00:59:22,600 --> 00:59:25,120
Speaker 4: youth are concerned about a lot of things. Pick a

1203
00:59:25,160 --> 00:59:28,480
Speaker 4: tough like is it climate change? Is it their rights?

1204
00:59:28,680 --> 00:59:29,240
Speaker 7: Is it war?

1205
00:59:29,600 --> 00:59:29,680
Speaker 2: Like?

1206
00:59:29,720 --> 00:59:32,160
Speaker 4: All of these very classic comic book things that the

1207
00:59:32,200 --> 00:59:35,480
Speaker 4: youth tries to process through these heroes. Now is the

1208
00:59:35,480 --> 00:59:38,880
Speaker 4: time Marvel to tap into those things, and then you

1209
00:59:38,880 --> 00:59:41,800
Speaker 4: can get in Avengers versus x Men build into that,

1210
00:59:41,880 --> 00:59:44,000
Speaker 4: and that's really cool because who doesn't love an Avenger

1211
00:59:44,120 --> 00:59:46,160
Speaker 4: versus X Men showdown? I certainly do.

1212
00:59:46,960 --> 00:59:49,560
Speaker 2: I think what you're getting at also is something that

1213
00:59:49,560 --> 00:59:51,920
Speaker 2: I've been Part of the reason I like Superman so

1214
00:59:52,000 --> 00:59:53,560
Speaker 2: much is because gun is subversive.

1215
00:59:53,600 --> 00:59:54,479
Speaker 6: What do we even buy someone?

1216
00:59:55,080 --> 00:59:58,360
Speaker 2: He was able to put all these themes about war,

1217
00:59:58,480 --> 01:00:01,160
Speaker 2: about immigration, about and and do them in such a

1218
01:00:01,200 --> 01:00:05,200
Speaker 2: way that, yes, some people called it out, but he's

1219
01:00:05,240 --> 01:00:09,959
Speaker 2: also like tricking a lot of people realizing that that's

1220
01:00:10,000 --> 01:00:12,040
Speaker 2: what the movie is about. So much of what I

1221
01:00:12,080 --> 01:00:16,040
Speaker 2: love about cinema from the fifties and sixties is all

1222
01:00:16,120 --> 01:00:22,600
Speaker 2: of these subversive things about race relations or or homosexuality

1223
01:00:22,840 --> 01:00:27,560
Speaker 2: that we're snuck into mainstream movies by artists who understood

1224
01:00:27,560 --> 01:00:30,920
Speaker 2: that this is part of life. But my bosses are

1225
01:00:30,960 --> 01:00:32,760
Speaker 2: going to say no, So I'm going to put this

1226
01:00:32,920 --> 01:00:36,440
Speaker 2: in there in a way that nobody could really figure

1227
01:00:36,480 --> 01:00:40,720
Speaker 2: it out, right, And we need that now. We need

1228
01:00:40,720 --> 01:00:43,640
Speaker 2: that now from our superhero movies, and we need that

1229
01:00:43,720 --> 01:00:46,560
Speaker 2: now from Marvel. And I think that The Fantastic Four

1230
01:00:46,640 --> 01:00:49,479
Speaker 2: was a movie that was completely bereft of any kind

1231
01:00:49,520 --> 01:00:54,760
Speaker 2: of subtext, and we need some subversive subtext in these movies.

1232
01:00:54,800 --> 01:00:58,720
Speaker 5: Again, I think you've touched on something really incredible that, Jason,

1233
01:00:58,760 --> 01:01:01,880
Speaker 5: because Superman and DC are generally seen as the above

1234
01:01:01,920 --> 01:01:05,360
Speaker 5: the real world. You know, they're the gods, the trinity

1235
01:01:05,520 --> 01:01:09,240
Speaker 5: that they can't connect. They're more about fantasy, and Marvel

1236
01:01:09,280 --> 01:01:11,680
Speaker 5: is always seen as grounded and talking about things in

1237
01:01:11,760 --> 01:01:14,400
Speaker 5: the real world. It's much of what made people excited

1238
01:01:14,400 --> 01:01:16,880
Speaker 5: about the comics and why they've had such a longevity.

1239
01:01:17,280 --> 01:01:19,280
Speaker 5: And I think it's pretty crazy that we're in a

1240
01:01:19,320 --> 01:01:22,480
Speaker 5: situation where we have a DC movie that's done that

1241
01:01:22,520 --> 01:01:25,560
Speaker 5: in a really kind of both subtle and on the

1242
01:01:25,600 --> 01:01:28,440
Speaker 5: noseway and works in both ways. And like you said, Jason,

1243
01:01:28,440 --> 01:01:33,200
Speaker 5: this movie has nothing to say, which is kind of crazy. Actually, Yeah,

1244
01:01:33,200 --> 01:01:34,520
Speaker 5: you make a great point.

1245
01:01:34,840 --> 01:01:39,560
Speaker 2: Well, that's been it for a roundtable of the Fantastic Fool.

1246
01:01:41,440 --> 01:01:43,520
Speaker 2: On the next episode of xtra Vision, We've got a

1247
01:01:43,520 --> 01:01:47,560
Speaker 2: special recap from our time at Comic Con featuring Alien

1248
01:01:47,600 --> 01:01:49,480
Speaker 2: Earth and Rosie's conversation.

1249
01:01:49,040 --> 01:01:51,880
Speaker 6: With Yeah, who, Rosie, Who, who might you be talking to?

1250
01:01:52,120 --> 01:01:55,000
Speaker 5: I'm going to talk to Tom McFall and legendary Spawn

1251
01:01:55,080 --> 01:01:59,160
Speaker 5: creator and Image comic superstar and one of my favorite

1252
01:01:59,200 --> 01:02:00,000
Speaker 5: comic book.

1253
01:01:59,800 --> 01:02:04,720
Speaker 2: That's it for this episode. Thanks for listening. X ray

1254
01:02:04,800 --> 01:02:07,480
Speaker 2: Vision is hosted by Jason Concepcion and Rosie Knight and

1255
01:02:07,600 --> 01:02:09,400
Speaker 2: is a production of iHeart Podcasts.

1256
01:02:09,560 --> 01:02:13,160
Speaker 5: Our executive producers are Joel Monique and Aaron Kurtman.

1257
01:02:13,400 --> 01:02:15,440
Speaker 6: Our supervising producer is Abu Zafar.

1258
01:02:15,840 --> 01:02:19,760
Speaker 5: Our producers are Common Laurent Dean Jonathan and Bay Wag.

1259
01:02:19,880 --> 01:02:22,680
Speaker 2: A theme song is by Brian Vasquez, with alternate theme

1260
01:02:22,720 --> 01:02:24,000
Speaker 2: songs by Aaron Kaufman.

1261
01:02:24,160 --> 01:02:27,560
Speaker 5: Special thanks to Soul Rubin, Chris Lord, Kenny Goodman, and

1262
01:02:27,640 --> 01:02:29,400
Speaker 5: Heidi our discord moderator.