WEBVTT - The iHeart Podcast Union Episode 0:00:01.720 --> 0:00:04.960 All Zone Media. 0:00:05.920 --> 0:00:08.920 Welcome to it could Happen Here podcast about things falling 0:00:08.920 --> 0:00:11.080 apart how to put it back together again, made by 0:00:11.080 --> 0:00:14.680 iHeartMedia and I am your host, Nia Wong. So we 0:00:14.720 --> 0:00:16.680 have been you know, this is our This is going 0:00:16.720 --> 0:00:19.720 to be our first union doubleheader. We have two union 0:00:19.720 --> 0:00:22.639 episodes in a row. And part of why we're doing 0:00:22.680 --> 0:00:25.400 this is that we've we've been covering a lot of 0:00:25.920 --> 0:00:29.120 very sort of very fast drives, very low to the 0:00:29.160 --> 0:00:33.000 ground drives in small shops recently, and today we are 0:00:33.000 --> 0:00:35.879 going to be covering a shop that is not like that. 0:00:35.920 --> 0:00:38.280 It is very large, it is quite geographically diverse, and 0:00:38.320 --> 0:00:41.199 it has been organizing for a very long time. And 0:00:41.760 --> 0:00:44.800 that union is the iHeart Podcast Union. And with me 0:00:44.880 --> 0:00:48.640 to talk about this is Tracy Wilson from Suffie Missing 0:00:48.680 --> 0:00:51.599 History Class and Nomes Griffin, who is a producer on 0:00:51.960 --> 0:00:59.400 many staggeringly too many shows. And yeah, they are both 0:00:59.440 --> 0:01:02.720 on the bargaining committee of the iHeart Podcast Union. So yeah, 0:01:02.760 --> 0:01:04.080 Tracy Nolmes, welcome to the show. 0:01:04.520 --> 0:01:09.039 No, thank you, We're glad to be here. 0:01:09.640 --> 0:01:11.520 Yeah, I'm excited. I'm excited to talk to you too. 0:01:11.680 --> 0:01:15.520 So all right, first thing, first thing about this iHeart 0:01:15.520 --> 0:01:20.679 Podcast Union. We haven't covered many media unions on this podcast. 0:01:21.160 --> 0:01:23.760 We probably should do more, but it's been a sort 0:01:23.760 --> 0:01:28.240 of product of of what kind I don't know, there's certa, 0:01:28.240 --> 0:01:30.200 there are certain kinds of stuff that we've been focusing on, 0:01:30.360 --> 0:01:33.199 but now now we're doing media unions. So the place 0:01:33.240 --> 0:01:36.280 I wanted to start talking about the iHeart Podcast union 0:01:36.680 --> 0:01:39.800 is the sort of scale of it. I mean, there's 0:01:39.920 --> 0:01:42.960 people everywhere, like there are there are there are people 0:01:42.959 --> 0:01:45.280 who are where there there's one union member in the 0:01:45.440 --> 0:01:48.480 entire city, so you know, can we And it's also 0:01:48.520 --> 0:01:50.920 been going on for a very very long time, so 0:01:50.960 --> 0:01:53.280 I wanted to sort of ask, can you talk about 0:01:53.320 --> 0:01:55.520 how this whole process started and kind of how long 0:01:55.560 --> 0:01:56.320 it's been going on? 0:01:57.200 --> 0:02:01.320 So long? So long? I I was scrolling through my 0:02:01.480 --> 0:02:05.600 phone today trying to remember when when was the first 0:02:05.640 --> 0:02:10.360 time that I was contacted about unionizing, because the first 0:02:10.360 --> 0:02:13.320 thing that happened for me was being organized into the 0:02:13.480 --> 0:02:18.119 union before I Heart recognized us, and that was in 0:02:18.520 --> 0:02:24.760 the fall of twenty twenty. In the fall of twenty twenty, 0:02:24.800 --> 0:02:27.360 I got a text from my friend Lauren that was like, 0:02:27.440 --> 0:02:29.280 can I talk to you about a kind of a 0:02:29.320 --> 0:02:33.480 work thing. It's a kind of work. And I said sure. 0:02:33.720 --> 0:02:37.440 And the question that Lauren had to ask me was 0:02:38.280 --> 0:02:40.639 some of us are talking about unionizing, how would you 0:02:40.680 --> 0:02:44.400 feel about that? And I said, okay, I need to 0:02:44.720 --> 0:02:47.560 check my agreement that I already have with iHeart, because 0:02:47.560 --> 0:02:49.639 a lot of us that I have individual agreements with 0:02:49.680 --> 0:02:53.160 the company. I have worked in the job that I 0:02:53.240 --> 0:02:56.360 have now in some capacity for almost nineteen years, so 0:02:56.400 --> 0:02:58.360 I've been here forever and I already had this. I 0:02:58.440 --> 0:03:00.480 was like, I need to find out does disagreement prohibit 0:03:00.520 --> 0:03:03.639 me from doing this? It did not, And so I said, 0:03:03.639 --> 0:03:06.320 all right, if I'm eligible to be in the union, 0:03:06.760 --> 0:03:08.799 I'm on board. If I'm not eligible to be in 0:03:08.840 --> 0:03:10.800 the union, you have my full support. And that was 0:03:10.840 --> 0:03:16.760 in like November of twenty twenty, which is eons i'd 0:03:16.760 --> 0:03:17.360 go at this. 0:03:17.400 --> 0:03:22.160 Point, Yeah, it's been I came on to the company 0:03:22.440 --> 0:03:26.800 and the union was already in negotiations, Like, yeah, it 0:03:26.840 --> 0:03:29.440 had been a union already. I started in January of 0:03:29.600 --> 0:03:32.560 twenty twenty three, and I came like straight into the 0:03:32.760 --> 0:03:34.920 we're in bargaining sessions process. 0:03:35.160 --> 0:03:40.440 Yeah. So the organizing process took definitely more than a year. 0:03:41.040 --> 0:03:43.880 And that was more than a year of people talking 0:03:43.920 --> 0:03:46.840 to all of their colleagues about whether they wanted to 0:03:46.880 --> 0:03:49.120 form a union, what would be the benefits of forming 0:03:49.360 --> 0:03:52.200 a union, all of that stuff. And so we have 0:03:52.360 --> 0:03:56.760 three main offices at iHeart, there's New York, LA and Atlanta, 0:03:57.280 --> 0:03:59.560 So there were people who were doing things on the 0:03:59.560 --> 0:04:02.480 ground with people locally to them. But then also I 0:04:02.520 --> 0:04:04.640 think it's something like a third of our unit is 0:04:04.680 --> 0:04:06.880 not actually local to one of these offices. I'm not 0:04:06.960 --> 0:04:09.480 local to in office. I live north of Boston. We 0:04:09.560 --> 0:04:12.760 have like three unit members in the entire Commonwealth of Massachusetts. 0:04:13.120 --> 0:04:15.280 So this is like a really long process of getting 0:04:15.280 --> 0:04:18.279 everybody on board and getting everybody to commit to saying 0:04:18.320 --> 0:04:20.440 they wanted to be in the union, and then eventually 0:04:20.520 --> 0:04:24.520 to sign union cards after all of that, that took 0:04:24.560 --> 0:04:27.839 more than a year. We informed management of our intent 0:04:27.920 --> 0:04:30.760 to unionize in December of twenty twenty one, and they 0:04:30.800 --> 0:04:33.640 recognized us about six weeks later in February of twenty 0:04:33.640 --> 0:04:36.479 twenty two. That took longer than we would have wanted. 0:04:36.520 --> 0:04:38.800 There was some back and forth about exactly what roles 0:04:38.800 --> 0:04:42.360 would be included in the union, and then also the 0:04:42.600 --> 0:04:44.800 winter holidays happened in the middle of that, which, yes, 0:04:45.040 --> 0:04:47.719 like those weeks don't exist for business purposes in a 0:04:47.720 --> 0:04:50.120 lot of ways. We still got to do podcasts for them, 0:04:51.680 --> 0:04:55.240 but nobody's at work, and so, you know, we were 0:04:55.320 --> 0:04:59.400 recognized without having to go through an election with the NLRB, 0:04:59.560 --> 0:05:02.280 which was great, but it did sort of feel like 0:05:02.360 --> 0:05:05.240 it took a little bit to finally get the recognition 0:05:05.320 --> 0:05:09.559 and then we started bargaining in May, so a couple 0:05:09.560 --> 0:05:12.320 of months after that, and that was two years ago 0:05:12.400 --> 0:05:13.520 that we started bargaining. 0:05:14.520 --> 0:05:17.000 Oh my god, yeah it's May now, it is May. 0:05:17.480 --> 0:05:19.200 It is almost June today. 0:05:19.960 --> 0:05:21.839 Yeah. 0:05:22.000 --> 0:05:25.920 Yeah, it has been a really quite long bargaining process, 0:05:25.960 --> 0:05:27.440 which I think, I mean, this is something we've talked 0:05:27.440 --> 0:05:29.800 about on the show before that this is a pretty 0:05:29.839 --> 0:05:32.279 This is a thing that happens a lot for especially 0:05:32.279 --> 0:05:35.599 for first contracts, is that companies will try to sort 0:05:35.600 --> 0:05:38.160 of just wait the union out and try to because 0:05:38.200 --> 0:05:40.200 you know, the if if you look at like the 0:05:40.240 --> 0:05:44.640 places where unions fail, it's they either fail in sort 0:05:44.680 --> 0:05:48.360 of like they okay, there's there's there's the failures where 0:05:48.680 --> 0:05:52.120 like nothing ever gets started. There's the failures where they 0:05:52.440 --> 0:05:54.880 they lose an election or they don't have enough people 0:05:54.920 --> 0:05:57.880 to sign cards. And then the third place that they 0:05:57.880 --> 0:06:02.039 fail is contract is the first contract. And so this is, 0:06:02.400 --> 0:06:06.760 you know, a situation that I guess is not unexpected, 0:06:06.800 --> 0:06:11.680 but is also negotiating a contract for two years just 0:06:12.400 --> 0:06:13.359 is not very fun. 0:06:14.720 --> 0:06:16.919 Yeah, no, it's not. 0:06:17.839 --> 0:06:21.760 Our colleagues at WGAE, when we got ready to start bargaining, 0:06:22.839 --> 0:06:25.239 tried to prepare us for the fact that eighteen months 0:06:25.279 --> 0:06:28.360 to two years is fairly normal in the world of 0:06:28.440 --> 0:06:33.200 media to bargain a first contract. I will readily acknowledge 0:06:33.279 --> 0:06:37.960 that I was overly optimistic when we started. I would 0:06:37.960 --> 0:06:40.599 not go so far as to say naive, but like 0:06:40.680 --> 0:06:43.000 I thought it was a really good sign that the 0:06:43.040 --> 0:06:46.680 company had voluntarily recognized us. I thought it was a 0:06:46.720 --> 0:06:51.360 really good sign that WGAE had successfully negotiated other contracts 0:06:51.400 --> 0:06:53.360 and that we were sort of drawing from a lot 0:06:53.360 --> 0:06:56.120 of that contract. Language is our starting point, and I 0:06:56.160 --> 0:06:59.640 feel like when you have all of the unionized podcast 0:06:59.720 --> 0:07:04.080 shops having similar language to me, that language is now 0:07:04.160 --> 0:07:07.920 becoming industry standard. So I expected less of a fight 0:07:08.080 --> 0:07:10.559 over a lot of that than what we actually got. 0:07:10.960 --> 0:07:14.840 And then also management hired an attorney that has negotiated 0:07:14.880 --> 0:07:17.200 a lot of other contracts with WGAE was just all 0:07:17.240 --> 0:07:21.080 stuff that I thought was seemed favorable, and then when 0:07:21.120 --> 0:07:25.400 we actually got into the bargaining process, it has gone 0:07:25.400 --> 0:07:27.400 on for so long and there have been so many 0:07:27.440 --> 0:07:29.640 things that it has felt like we're just going around 0:07:29.680 --> 0:07:30.840 in circles at the table. 0:07:31.720 --> 0:07:35.240 Yeah, So before we get into kind of what issues 0:07:35.240 --> 0:07:38.040 are being circled around and what management has been doing, 0:07:38.160 --> 0:07:41.720 I wanted to talk about what bargaining a contract is 0:07:41.760 --> 0:07:43.760 actually like because I think most of the people listening 0:07:43.800 --> 0:07:46.400 to this have never done it and only kind of 0:07:46.400 --> 0:07:48.960 have a vague idea of what that means. So can 0:07:49.000 --> 0:07:51.960 you sort of walk us through the I don't know. 0:07:52.120 --> 0:07:55.040 So there's a week that has a bargaining session, can 0:07:55.080 --> 0:07:57.320 you walk through the process of what goes into that. 0:07:58.120 --> 0:07:59.160 Yeah, definitely. 0:08:00.200 --> 0:08:02.280 In a week where we might have a bargaining session, 0:08:02.280 --> 0:08:05.600 say we have a bargaining session on Wednesday and Thursday 0:08:06.240 --> 0:08:10.000 as a committee will meet probably the Monday the Tuesday 0:08:10.200 --> 0:08:15.119 to prepare whatever our counter proposals will be. So whether 0:08:15.240 --> 0:08:17.800 or not that's on economics. So we're getting back and 0:08:17.840 --> 0:08:20.360 we're adjusting our salary proposals that are going to go 0:08:20.400 --> 0:08:24.480 across the table or we're adjusting what we're asking for 0:08:24.920 --> 0:08:27.920 in severance, how many weeks of severance we're asking for. 0:08:28.080 --> 0:08:30.920 So we'll spend some time as a committee going through 0:08:30.920 --> 0:08:35.280 those proposals and basing our decisions off of like, this 0:08:35.360 --> 0:08:38.319 is where we have an intention of landing, this is 0:08:38.360 --> 0:08:41.079 where management is right now, this is what in our 0:08:41.120 --> 0:08:45.560 conversations with the other unit members we've figured out is 0:08:45.640 --> 0:08:46.880 most important. 0:08:46.400 --> 0:08:49.200 To people, So we'll make counters based on that. 0:08:50.080 --> 0:08:53.400 Lately, our sessions have those sessions have looked like preparing 0:08:53.559 --> 0:08:57.160 to who in the committee is going to be presenting 0:08:57.240 --> 0:09:01.080 that contract language across the table, So we'll divvy up 0:09:01.120 --> 0:09:04.559 those presentations and Tracy might present on diversity, I might 0:09:04.600 --> 0:09:08.240 present about the salary minimums. We might have another committee 0:09:08.240 --> 0:09:12.080 member present on severans and things like that. So we'll 0:09:12.240 --> 0:09:14.400 sort out who is going to say what, and we'll 0:09:14.400 --> 0:09:17.719 also plan out any other sort of editorializing that we're 0:09:17.720 --> 0:09:20.080 going to do across the table, like this is why 0:09:20.120 --> 0:09:23.720 we're making a move here, because it's important to our 0:09:24.520 --> 0:09:29.280 unit for this reason, We've also planned out actions that 0:09:29.320 --> 0:09:31.880 we're going to do across the table and having unit 0:09:31.920 --> 0:09:37.040 members read testimonials about certain contract items. So those are 0:09:37.080 --> 0:09:40.840 all of the things that we might prepare for ahead 0:09:41.000 --> 0:09:44.400 of the bargaining session, and then on the actual day 0:09:44.559 --> 0:09:48.400 of bargaining session, we'll go in and we'll meet as 0:09:48.400 --> 0:09:51.560 a committee in the morning. We're either presenting first our 0:09:51.600 --> 0:09:56.600 proposals or management is presenting to us. As a bargaining 0:09:56.600 --> 0:09:58.920 committee will be there to hear the proposals. There may 0:09:58.960 --> 0:10:01.400 be some session that are more important than others, so 0:10:01.440 --> 0:10:05.200 we'll invite the whole unit to hear those proposals, and 0:10:05.679 --> 0:10:08.120 we will over those two days sort of go back 0:10:08.120 --> 0:10:11.400 and forth, presenting across the table what our proposals are 0:10:11.400 --> 0:10:15.200 and the counter proposals, and with the idea of like 0:10:15.280 --> 0:10:19.200 getting closer to a contract that is fair and like 0:10:19.280 --> 0:10:21.679 Tracy said earlier, industry standard. 0:10:21.760 --> 0:10:22.600 That sums it up. 0:10:23.280 --> 0:10:25.920 Yeah, And I guess this leads us to the second 0:10:26.000 --> 0:10:32.000 part of contract negotiations, which is management's counter proposals. So, 0:10:33.600 --> 0:10:37.640 you know something, something I think is kind of surprising 0:10:38.520 --> 0:10:40.320 when when you do this for the first time, is 0:10:40.320 --> 0:10:42.520 the extent to which management simply will not show up 0:10:42.520 --> 0:10:49.320 on time. Yeah, yeah, So, how has it actually been 0:10:49.400 --> 0:10:52.880 sitting across the table from management and you know, hearing 0:10:52.920 --> 0:10:57.120 their counter proposals and dealing with whenever they show up. 0:10:59.520 --> 0:11:03.160 All of my bargaining so far has been happening on 0:11:03.200 --> 0:11:07.160 the other side of a zoom or a team's screen, 0:11:07.840 --> 0:11:12.120 since I'm remote to everybody else, which is a blessing 0:11:12.160 --> 0:11:14.280 and a curse, right, I have kind of a buffer. 0:11:14.520 --> 0:11:17.280 I'm not having to directly look at the faces of 0:11:17.320 --> 0:11:20.640 the people who are coming in with salary proposals that 0:11:20.679 --> 0:11:24.120 are dramatically less than what we proposed and what we 0:11:24.160 --> 0:11:27.439 feel as industry standard at this point. But it also 0:11:27.520 --> 0:11:30.800 means that like I'm by myself, I don't have somebody 0:11:30.920 --> 0:11:36.679 near me to when like management leaves the room personally 0:11:36.720 --> 0:11:39.920 react with. We kind of go around the circle in 0:11:40.000 --> 0:11:42.760 the whoever's in the room and on the screen to 0:11:42.840 --> 0:11:47.959 sort of say our reactions, but like it's lonely sometimes 0:11:48.000 --> 0:11:51.200 to do it from afar, I do definitely have to 0:11:51.280 --> 0:11:56.160 practice keeping my expression neutral because sometimes what we are 0:11:56.200 --> 0:12:02.840 hearing is not neutral expression territory. And I also really 0:12:03.120 --> 0:12:09.079 was not totally prepared to hear management justify their positions 0:12:09.080 --> 0:12:12.440 on things like I will feel strongly that the correct 0:12:12.480 --> 0:12:15.560 and most ethical thing to do is a particular thing, 0:12:16.160 --> 0:12:19.880 and then management will explain their position on something and 0:12:19.920 --> 0:12:23.320 I'll sort of be like, that's that's not the decision 0:12:23.360 --> 0:12:26.360 I would like you to be making at all. And 0:12:26.400 --> 0:12:28.560 I'm a little upset that I just heard you say 0:12:28.600 --> 0:12:29.280 that just now. 0:12:30.679 --> 0:12:31.640 Yeah, yeah. 0:12:31.679 --> 0:12:35.080 And I'm in Atlanta. So most of our bargaining sessions 0:12:35.120 --> 0:12:38.160 have happened in Atlanta. We have also have them in 0:12:38.440 --> 0:12:41.200 New yorker le but so I have been in person 0:12:41.360 --> 0:12:44.760 for most of the sitting down across from management and 0:12:44.840 --> 0:12:47.560 like waiting a few hours after when they said they 0:12:47.559 --> 0:12:52.160 would be ready to present their proposals, And it is 0:12:53.000 --> 0:12:56.280 like tense and frustrating to sit in that and to 0:12:56.400 --> 0:13:00.680 Tracy's point, like it is nice that we have the 0:13:00.720 --> 0:13:03.880 rest of the committee with us to or whoever is 0:13:03.920 --> 0:13:06.840 in Atlanta with us to sort of share in that together. 0:13:07.520 --> 0:13:11.160 But the energy does get really tense at times, especially 0:13:11.240 --> 0:13:15.120 in those situations where we've presented, hey, we would like, 0:13:15.760 --> 0:13:19.000 however many days of bereavement leave so we can grieve 0:13:19.080 --> 0:13:22.760 our family members, and then management comes back with an 0:13:22.760 --> 0:13:25.240 offer that's like, well, what about just a couple of 0:13:25.320 --> 0:13:28.960 days to grieve your dead family member? And so in 0:13:29.000 --> 0:13:31.560 those situations where it's like, do you think of me 0:13:31.840 --> 0:13:36.080 as a fellow human being, deserving of these like very 0:13:36.120 --> 0:13:39.080 basic things to make my life. 0:13:39.400 --> 0:13:43.239 Livable, and then their answer sort of feels. 0:13:43.000 --> 0:13:44.440 Like a no, and you kind of just have to 0:13:44.480 --> 0:13:46.880 like sit in that in person while they say it 0:13:46.920 --> 0:13:47.640 to your face. 0:13:49.600 --> 0:13:53.119 Yeah, and I mean, especially when it's something that personal, 0:13:53.240 --> 0:13:55.640 or it's that or if it's something that parental leave, 0:13:56.600 --> 0:14:00.880 where you know, this is your child, right, and yeah, 0:14:00.960 --> 0:14:03.800 you're sitting across the table from someone being like, oh, yeah, no, 0:14:03.960 --> 0:14:08.280 you actually you should get like two days to deal 0:14:08.360 --> 0:14:13.160 with this. It's just a brutal we had. 0:14:13.200 --> 0:14:15.480 It was a few months ago. We had a session 0:14:15.559 --> 0:14:19.120 where we had a lot of testimonials that were accompanying 0:14:19.120 --> 0:14:23.280 our actual contract proposals, and some of them were read 0:14:23.320 --> 0:14:26.040 by the person who had written the testimonial, and some 0:14:26.080 --> 0:14:28.880 of them were read by a different bargaining committee member 0:14:28.920 --> 0:14:32.000 because somebody was just more comfortable remaining anonymous and having 0:14:32.080 --> 0:14:36.440 somebody do that for them. And we had testimonials that 0:14:36.480 --> 0:14:38.440 were all over the map in terms of things that 0:14:38.440 --> 0:14:40.400 we were still in the process of bargaining, So we 0:14:40.440 --> 0:14:44.360 had diversity testimonials, we had testimonials about parental leave, all 0:14:44.440 --> 0:14:47.440 of this stuff, and one of the things that wound 0:14:47.520 --> 0:14:51.200 up being just enormously frustrating was that it felt like 0:14:51.280 --> 0:14:54.640 we went through all that and we presented so many 0:14:54.680 --> 0:14:57.320 things about why this matters so much to all of us, 0:14:57.880 --> 0:15:00.320 and the next round of counter proposals that we got 0:15:00.360 --> 0:15:04.840 we're like the same negligible movements as from before. We 0:15:04.880 --> 0:15:09.000 had all read all of the testimonials. And that was 0:15:09.040 --> 0:15:11.440 not my favorite day of bargaining by far. 0:15:12.480 --> 0:15:15.800 No, Yeah, that one was not not fun to be 0:15:15.880 --> 0:15:16.240 in on. 0:15:27.240 --> 0:15:29.800 And we are back. So, I mean, we've talked a 0:15:29.840 --> 0:15:34.200 little bit about kind of belief stuff, and you know, 0:15:35.000 --> 0:15:36.880 we've talked a little bit about some of the issues 0:15:36.920 --> 0:15:42.440 that have been stuck in negotiations for two years. But yeah, 0:15:42.480 --> 0:15:45.640 I wanted to sort of see, you know, talk talk 0:15:45.680 --> 0:15:49.840 about sort of the specifics of of where of where 0:15:49.880 --> 0:15:53.880 the contract negotiations are right now, and how far apart 0:15:54.480 --> 0:15:56.840 the company and the union is. And also just and 0:15:56.880 --> 0:15:58.560 this is something that I think has been a theme 0:15:58.800 --> 0:16:04.880 of these negotiations is the extent to which management is 0:16:05.440 --> 0:16:09.800 below industry standard. So yeah, I guess we could start 0:16:09.840 --> 0:16:12.840 with sort of wages there because that's one of the 0:16:12.840 --> 0:16:15.200 places where they're very much below standard. 0:16:16.360 --> 0:16:18.760 Yeah, I think we only have a TA on one 0:16:19.520 --> 0:16:25.200 a TA being a tentative agreement on one title and 0:16:25.320 --> 0:16:28.760 only for the rate that they're proposing in New York 0:16:28.800 --> 0:16:31.680 City in LA. Another big thing with our minimums is 0:16:31.680 --> 0:16:35.840 that they're different for producers and other titles living in 0:16:35.840 --> 0:16:39.360 New York City in LA than they are for people in. 0:16:39.280 --> 0:16:40.640 Those roles in other cities. 0:16:41.280 --> 0:16:47.600 So, yeah, we are very far apart still on our 0:16:47.640 --> 0:16:48.600 salary minimums. 0:16:49.280 --> 0:16:49.520 Yeah. 0:16:49.520 --> 0:16:52.760 When we put together our proposals on salary minimums, like, 0:16:52.800 --> 0:16:54.960 we didn't make them up out of nowhere. We did 0:16:54.960 --> 0:16:57.800 a lot of research on pay rates at other unionized 0:16:57.840 --> 0:17:01.480 podcast shops and other podcast businesses. We came up with 0:17:01.600 --> 0:17:04.560 numbers that felt fair and industry standard based on all 0:17:04.600 --> 0:17:08.480 of that research, and then management just came in so 0:17:08.640 --> 0:17:12.080 much lower than all that. And then as Nomes just said, 0:17:12.080 --> 0:17:15.320 there's this differential they're proposing between New York and LA 0:17:15.640 --> 0:17:19.439 and everywhere else. Most of our unit is not in 0:17:19.520 --> 0:17:21.880 New York or LA. A big chunk of the unit 0:17:22.119 --> 0:17:25.119 is in Atlanta specifically, and the cost of living in 0:17:25.160 --> 0:17:28.880 Atlanta is just not that much lower than New York 0:17:28.960 --> 0:17:32.159 or LA. At this point, we've also been way apart 0:17:32.200 --> 0:17:36.600 on annual increases. Originally management was proposing not to have 0:17:36.680 --> 0:17:40.360 annual increases in the contract at all. And they've moved 0:17:40.400 --> 0:17:43.040 past that, but the current proposals are still way way 0:17:43.160 --> 0:17:45.040 less than the rate of inflation. 0:17:45.680 --> 0:17:50.560 I mean it's about half, like half of what inflation is. Yeah, 0:17:50.600 --> 0:17:53.399 like it does, it's not even inflation amount. And I 0:17:53.440 --> 0:17:56.480 will say that, like for many of the job titles, 0:17:57.000 --> 0:18:00.639 they're so far below what industries standard is. 0:18:00.920 --> 0:18:02.680 With the like very little. 0:18:02.440 --> 0:18:05.600 Incremental movement that they make every bargaining session, it's like 0:18:05.720 --> 0:18:08.800 clear that they the company doesn't have any interest in 0:18:08.840 --> 0:18:12.640 getting the industry standard, despite the fact that it is 0:18:12.680 --> 0:18:18.120 like a large and well ranked podcasting company. 0:18:18.760 --> 0:18:20.640 Yeah. 0:18:21.080 --> 0:18:25.440 Yeah, we just got the Webby Award as Podcast Company 0:18:25.480 --> 0:18:29.880 of the Year, and we continue to be like when 0:18:29.960 --> 0:18:34.240 rankings come out of the biggest podcast networks, like we're 0:18:34.240 --> 0:18:39.360 always at or right near the top of the rankings. 0:18:39.400 --> 0:18:42.040 All of that, we have a lot of shows that 0:18:42.080 --> 0:18:47.600 are really well respected in you know, whatever subject matter 0:18:47.720 --> 0:18:52.879 they are discussing, whatever broadly speaking genre of podcasts, and 0:18:52.960 --> 0:18:58.280 so it sucks to then look at pay scales that 0:18:58.520 --> 0:19:02.480 just don't line up with that in terms of like 0:19:02.560 --> 0:19:06.719 the minimum of what the company will commit to offering people. 0:19:08.000 --> 0:19:10.360 Yeah, and I think the person increase thing is really 0:19:10.400 --> 0:19:14.360 frustrating too, because again, the way this works out with inflation. 0:19:14.520 --> 0:19:16.919 And remember, so you know, if we started bargaining in 0:19:16.960 --> 0:19:20.600 twenty twenty two, right, inflation in twenty twenty two was 0:19:20.680 --> 0:19:24.159 like three like twice what it is now. And if 0:19:24.440 --> 0:19:26.280 you're getting, if you're not getting, this is something I 0:19:26.320 --> 0:19:28.600 think that's important for everyone to understand, is that if 0:19:28.640 --> 0:19:30.600 you're not getting so for inflation right now is about 0:19:30.600 --> 0:19:32.520 three point four percent, if you're not getting a three 0:19:32.560 --> 0:19:35.560 point four percent pay increase this year, that means you, 0:19:36.000 --> 0:19:38.400 like you are taking a pay cut every single year, 0:19:39.040 --> 0:19:43.040 right And the fact that you know this is this 0:19:43.119 --> 0:19:46.320 is what my management's proposal is you take a pay 0:19:46.320 --> 0:19:49.600 cut every single year and you're supposed to be fine 0:19:49.640 --> 0:19:54.280 with this is incredibly frustrating. And I don't I don't 0:19:54.280 --> 0:19:59.600 think it's it's it's it's not really understood in in 0:19:59.680 --> 0:20:02.320 terms of you're literally taking a pay cut very much. 0:20:02.400 --> 0:20:05.840 It's just talked of like it it's something that's talked 0:20:05.840 --> 0:20:08.600 about is just like another benefit, but like, no, we're 0:20:08.640 --> 0:20:10.080 trying not to take a pay cut. 0:20:10.280 --> 0:20:13.840 But yeah, yeah, I would like to if my salary 0:20:13.960 --> 0:20:17.440 is going to not take me any further at least 0:20:17.560 --> 0:20:20.880 not take me any farther back. Yeah, I don't need 0:20:20.920 --> 0:20:24.840 to lose money every year like I've done this year 0:20:24.960 --> 0:20:26.840 in starting my second year at the company. 0:20:27.000 --> 0:20:30.000 Right, there's been a lot of people who have not 0:20:30.280 --> 0:20:36.600 had a raise since like before the pandemic started, And like, 0:20:36.680 --> 0:20:40.440 I'm incredibly lucky I have been at my job forever. 0:20:40.720 --> 0:20:42.560 I'm on one of the biggest shows that we have 0:20:42.640 --> 0:20:48.520 in the network. Like, I'm doing okay, right, But a 0:20:48.560 --> 0:20:52.280 lot of my colleagues who work on shows that don't 0:20:52.320 --> 0:20:56.000 have as much power, don't have as big of an audience, like, 0:20:56.040 --> 0:20:58.960 don't have as much much of an ad budget, People 0:20:59.000 --> 0:21:01.280 who have been with the company less time, people who 0:21:01.320 --> 0:21:05.120 are like earlier on in their careers, especially like I've 0:21:05.240 --> 0:21:11.080 watched these folks go through the last four years with 0:21:11.160 --> 0:21:13.520 no increase in their pay, and like, I can see 0:21:13.600 --> 0:21:17.080 people struggling now financially in a way that they weren't 0:21:17.080 --> 0:21:22.080 struggling financially in twenty nineteen because their pay has not 0:21:22.320 --> 0:21:25.119 changed at all. But the how much it costs to 0:21:25.240 --> 0:21:28.240 exist in the world is so much more expensive. 0:21:30.240 --> 0:21:35.399 Yeah, we have some members right now who like would 0:21:35.480 --> 0:21:41.119 receive a pay increase with what's being proposed currently, but 0:21:41.280 --> 0:21:44.399 it is nowhere near the majority. Most people are going 0:21:44.440 --> 0:21:57.960 to lose money with the numbers as they are right now. 0:21:59.160 --> 0:22:01.719 Yeah, and that's when the things that just you know, 0:22:01.800 --> 0:22:04.680 I mean, and even even the sort of industry standard 0:22:04.800 --> 0:22:07.680 in podcasting isn't great, but that's one of these things 0:22:07.760 --> 0:22:11.080 that's you know, very much below industry standard. And there's 0:22:11.080 --> 0:22:13.320 been another one of these things that I wanted to 0:22:13.320 --> 0:22:20.200 talk about that's kind of baffling that I think everyone 0:22:20.280 --> 0:22:23.600 involved thought that this would be something that there wouldn't 0:22:23.600 --> 0:22:26.200 be a huge fight over. But that's at will employment 0:22:26.920 --> 0:22:27.639 you talk about that. 0:22:28.400 --> 0:22:34.880 Yeah, yeah too, So just cause employment means your employer 0:22:34.920 --> 0:22:39.440 has to have just cause to terminate your employment. Your 0:22:39.440 --> 0:22:42.119 employer cannot just do it willy nilly. And it's a 0:22:42.320 --> 0:22:47.480 core part of like the rights that union's bargain for 0:22:48.040 --> 0:22:50.400 is to have a process for somebody to be disciplined 0:22:50.440 --> 0:22:53.800 and lose their job. It's a very basic thing, basic 0:22:53.920 --> 0:23:00.879 union protection. And the management has has held firm that 0:23:00.960 --> 0:23:05.040 they basically want to not only have at will employment standards, 0:23:05.040 --> 0:23:07.160 but like enshrine that in the contract. 0:23:08.760 --> 0:23:11.119 Yeah, meaning that they want to be able to fire 0:23:11.240 --> 0:23:14.880 us for any reason at any time, regardless of whether 0:23:15.000 --> 0:23:20.600 or not we've done something actually warrant that loss of 0:23:20.600 --> 0:23:21.159 our income. 0:23:22.520 --> 0:23:25.040