1
00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:02,360
Speaker 1: What are the big problems that they're facing when it

2
00:00:02,400 --> 00:00:03,360
Speaker 1: comes to building wealth.

3
00:00:03,480 --> 00:00:05,880
Speaker 2: A lot of people think that guiding wealth is you know,

4
00:00:05,960 --> 00:00:09,120
Speaker 2: the hot pot and kp Itzazy. Personally, from my experience,

5
00:00:09,320 --> 00:00:10,280
Speaker 2: it's the complaint.

6
00:00:10,000 --> 00:00:12,280
Speaker 1: Opposite when it comes to building wealth. I like to

7
00:00:12,320 --> 00:00:14,880
Speaker 1: call it the game of money, and you might imagine

8
00:00:14,880 --> 00:00:16,480
Speaker 1: that people that have been playing a game a lot

9
00:00:16,520 --> 00:00:18,880
Speaker 1: longer than you probably have some tips and tricks and

10
00:00:18,920 --> 00:00:21,800
Speaker 1: strategies that they could use to probably beat you pretty quickly.

11
00:00:22,120 --> 00:00:24,160
Speaker 1: So in the game of building wealth, you might imagine

12
00:00:24,160 --> 00:00:27,320
Speaker 1: that the wealthy, the billionaires have access to tips and

13
00:00:27,360 --> 00:00:30,600
Speaker 1: tools and strategies that you don't know about. But there's

14
00:00:30,640 --> 00:00:32,159
Speaker 1: ways we can change that. So today I'm going to

15
00:00:32,200 --> 00:00:35,320
Speaker 1: sit down with Peter Dunworth. He's the founder of the

16
00:00:35,320 --> 00:00:38,520
Speaker 1: Bitcoin Advisor, So he works with high net worth individuals

17
00:00:38,560 --> 00:00:43,360
Speaker 1: family offices to help them build generational wealth and incorporate

18
00:00:43,400 --> 00:00:45,159
Speaker 1: bitcoin into that strategy. So, if you want to know

19
00:00:45,280 --> 00:00:48,239
Speaker 1: the tips, tricks and strategies the high net worth individuals

20
00:00:48,280 --> 00:00:50,000
Speaker 1: are using so you can win the game of money

21
00:00:50,000 --> 00:00:53,920
Speaker 1: as well, pay attention in regards to preserving that wealth

22
00:00:54,000 --> 00:00:58,080
Speaker 1: and then thinking about that wealth generationally. Who outright think

23
00:00:58,160 --> 00:01:01,080
Speaker 1: it's bad to leave wealth for your kids.

24
00:01:01,320 --> 00:01:03,600
Speaker 2: Now I completely disagree with Okay, you know, I look

25
00:01:03,600 --> 00:01:07,040
Speaker 2: at my responsibility to my family, to my legacy. Sadly,

26
00:01:07,080 --> 00:01:09,520
Speaker 2: there's no real out of the benchmarking society that we

27
00:01:09,600 --> 00:01:13,720
Speaker 2: have that's universally accepted other than how wealth are you out?

28
00:01:13,760 --> 00:01:16,360
Speaker 2: It's a school board that everyone understands what the school

29
00:01:16,360 --> 00:01:18,880
Speaker 2: board is. There's no intangible around it. It's a number

30
00:01:18,920 --> 00:01:21,600
Speaker 2: that you can look at. It's the only objective measure

31
00:01:21,640 --> 00:01:23,240
Speaker 2: we have of success.

32
00:01:25,200 --> 00:01:26,479
Speaker 3: Peter, thanks for joining me today.

33
00:01:26,480 --> 00:01:28,360
Speaker 2: Pleasure to be here with you. Matt, thanks for having me.

34
00:01:28,440 --> 00:01:29,839
Speaker 3: Yeah, what a great opportunity.

35
00:01:29,920 --> 00:01:32,720
Speaker 1: Just happened to be in my neighborhood and so swinging

36
00:01:32,720 --> 00:01:36,360
Speaker 1: by for an interview. So I'm excited about that. You know,

37
00:01:36,600 --> 00:01:38,479
Speaker 1: there's a lot of overlap on what we do talking

38
00:01:38,480 --> 00:01:40,720
Speaker 1: about wealth just overall, which is a pretty big topic.

39
00:01:40,800 --> 00:01:43,840
Speaker 1: So I want to dig into problems that high net

40
00:01:43,840 --> 00:01:48,320
Speaker 1: worth families individuals have, specifically around keeping wealth.

41
00:01:48,440 --> 00:01:49,960
Speaker 3: There's a lot of attacks on keeping wealth.

42
00:01:49,960 --> 00:01:53,200
Speaker 1: It's very hard to keep it. It drains away from us.

43
00:01:53,240 --> 00:01:54,840
Speaker 1: Governments are trying to take it from us. So how

44
00:01:54,880 --> 00:01:58,360
Speaker 1: do we keep it? We talked briefly about some potential taxes.

45
00:01:58,400 --> 00:02:01,960
Speaker 1: I want to get into that how bigcoin can help

46
00:02:02,000 --> 00:02:05,960
Speaker 1: fix all of this, keep build wealth, keep from losing wealth,

47
00:02:05,960 --> 00:02:09,560
Speaker 1: build into the future. I want to think, since you're

48
00:02:09,600 --> 00:02:13,679
Speaker 1: international from Australia, sort of what Trump's announcement means to

49
00:02:13,720 --> 00:02:15,840
Speaker 1: the rest of the world. And then I want to

50
00:02:15,880 --> 00:02:18,960
Speaker 1: go through some different strategies that high net worth individuals have.

51
00:02:19,040 --> 00:02:21,360
Speaker 1: So hopefully we have time for all that. So let's

52
00:02:21,400 --> 00:02:23,560
Speaker 1: just frame it up here really quickly. So you work

53
00:02:23,560 --> 00:02:26,960
Speaker 1: with high net worth individuals family offices. Family offices offices

54
00:02:27,040 --> 00:02:30,640
Speaker 1: typically would be you can define it for me, but

55
00:02:30,840 --> 00:02:34,520
Speaker 1: define what family offices are and define with me for us,

56
00:02:34,960 --> 00:02:37,240
Speaker 1: what are the big problems that they're facing when it

57
00:02:37,280 --> 00:02:38,280
Speaker 1: comes to building wealth.

58
00:02:39,080 --> 00:02:42,840
Speaker 2: Great question. Family offices in my definition of families who

59
00:02:42,880 --> 00:02:46,600
Speaker 2: have generated substantial little significant amounts of wealth that want

60
00:02:46,639 --> 00:02:48,480
Speaker 2: to be managing those assets themselves.

61
00:02:48,520 --> 00:02:50,840
Speaker 1: So what would that number be, Like, what's that threshold?

62
00:02:51,280 --> 00:02:53,280
Speaker 2: It can start at twenty five I would have thought,

63
00:02:53,360 --> 00:02:56,440
Speaker 2: and twenty five millions to billions of dollars twenty five

64
00:02:56,440 --> 00:02:58,520
Speaker 2: million or more. I think that's a starting point that

65
00:02:58,680 --> 00:03:01,040
Speaker 2: you know, you can start looking at that. Under that

66
00:03:01,040 --> 00:03:03,720
Speaker 2: you're probably working with a multi family office where you're

67
00:03:03,800 --> 00:03:07,240
Speaker 2: leveraging off a number of other families to generate investment

68
00:03:07,280 --> 00:03:10,840
Speaker 2: ideas and returns and then leverage that in two further ideas.

69
00:03:11,280 --> 00:03:13,520
Speaker 2: And from my experience, a lot of the families that

70
00:03:13,560 --> 00:03:16,200
Speaker 2: we work with, the number one issue that they've got

71
00:03:16,240 --> 00:03:19,280
Speaker 2: is keeping their wealth. The families that we work with

72
00:03:19,360 --> 00:03:23,480
Speaker 2: are not interested on a return on capital. They're interested

73
00:03:23,600 --> 00:03:27,280
Speaker 2: in a return of capital, meaning they're not focused on

74
00:03:28,000 --> 00:03:30,760
Speaker 2: the percentage gains that they're making. They've made the pile,

75
00:03:30,760 --> 00:03:32,640
Speaker 2: they've made their wealth. They want to make sure that

76
00:03:32,680 --> 00:03:35,360
Speaker 2: it's secure. So the first thing they look at when

77
00:03:35,440 --> 00:03:38,280
Speaker 2: it comes to any investment, whether it's real estate, whether

78
00:03:38,320 --> 00:03:41,960
Speaker 2: it's stocks, properties, bonds, or even bitcoin, is they want

79
00:03:42,000 --> 00:03:44,800
Speaker 2: to make sure that the ownership the custody is locked

80
00:03:44,840 --> 00:03:47,720
Speaker 2: down and they can't be subject to a number of

81
00:03:47,800 --> 00:03:53,200
Speaker 2: different attacks on that absolute base layer. So ensuring that

82
00:03:53,680 --> 00:03:56,320
Speaker 2: you own what you think you own is probably the

83
00:03:56,360 --> 00:03:58,640
Speaker 2: first port of call that you need to look at,

84
00:03:59,040 --> 00:04:01,840
Speaker 2: and probably so something preliminary to that is what are

85
00:04:01,840 --> 00:04:05,240
Speaker 2: the structures from a legal perspective that you have access

86
00:04:05,280 --> 00:04:08,000
Speaker 2: to to maximize the outcomes that you want to get

87
00:04:08,040 --> 00:04:11,240
Speaker 2: from the investments that you're putting that money into So

88
00:04:11,720 --> 00:04:13,720
Speaker 2: I think it starts with the structures.

89
00:04:13,280 --> 00:04:15,200
Speaker 3: Then got it.

90
00:04:15,280 --> 00:04:17,280
Speaker 1: So that's an interesting way to think about it. And

91
00:04:17,360 --> 00:04:21,120
Speaker 1: you know, I've often said, and this is unfortunately from

92
00:04:21,120 --> 00:04:23,480
Speaker 1: a personal experience, that keeping money is a lot harder

93
00:04:23,520 --> 00:04:26,400
Speaker 1: than making it, which sounds crazy for most people who

94
00:04:26,440 --> 00:04:29,479
Speaker 1: haven't made money. But once you've made it, as I

95
00:04:29,520 --> 00:04:32,200
Speaker 1: found out the hard way of losing it all, keeping

96
00:04:32,279 --> 00:04:34,360
Speaker 1: it is much harder. So and then the more you

97
00:04:34,400 --> 00:04:37,039
Speaker 1: have of it probably the bigger problem or challenge that

98
00:04:37,080 --> 00:04:38,120
Speaker 1: becomes agreed.

99
00:04:38,440 --> 00:04:40,480
Speaker 2: And this is where a lot of people think, oh,

100
00:04:40,480 --> 00:04:43,279
Speaker 2: it's so easy being wealthy, and to a certain extent,

101
00:04:43,720 --> 00:04:45,480
Speaker 2: there are a lot of problems that go away when

102
00:04:45,520 --> 00:04:48,880
Speaker 2: you're wealthy. But with great wealth comes great responsibility, and

103
00:04:49,040 --> 00:04:51,839
Speaker 2: there's a responsibility that's put on you to not only

104
00:04:51,880 --> 00:04:54,680
Speaker 2: maintain it, but to preserve it. And then the questions

105
00:04:54,720 --> 00:04:57,120
Speaker 2: around legacy start entering your mind, around how do I

106
00:04:57,160 --> 00:04:59,240
Speaker 2: preserve this for the people I love into the future.

107
00:04:59,360 --> 00:05:01,800
Speaker 2: So a lot of people think that gaining wealth is,

108
00:05:02,080 --> 00:05:05,240
Speaker 2: you know, the hard part, and keeping it's easy. Personally,

109
00:05:05,279 --> 00:05:08,080
Speaker 2: from my experience, it's the complete opposite. It's it's the

110
00:05:08,160 --> 00:05:09,320
Speaker 2: keeping it that's the tough part.

111
00:05:10,160 --> 00:05:12,279
Speaker 1: I want to get into the generational wealth. That's something

112
00:05:12,320 --> 00:05:13,920
Speaker 1: I think about a lot. That's kind of the stage

113
00:05:13,920 --> 00:05:17,040
Speaker 1: that I'm in right now, so I want to come

114
00:05:17,080 --> 00:05:17,320
Speaker 1: to that.

115
00:05:17,360 --> 00:05:18,279
Speaker 3: But before we get.

116
00:05:18,120 --> 00:05:20,440
Speaker 1: Into that, let's just talk through some of the major

117
00:05:20,520 --> 00:05:25,680
Speaker 1: asset classes that people can invest into. You mentioned real estate, bonds, bitcoin,

118
00:05:25,800 --> 00:05:29,440
Speaker 1: things like that, and Michael Saylor sort of laid out

119
00:05:29,480 --> 00:05:30,960
Speaker 1: sort of some of the flaws in each one and

120
00:05:30,960 --> 00:05:33,600
Speaker 1: how they cost you money. But one of the biggest

121
00:05:33,600 --> 00:05:37,080
Speaker 1: problems is also taxes. So you were mentioning before we

122
00:05:37,080 --> 00:05:40,240
Speaker 1: started recording that in Australia they wanted to launch I

123
00:05:40,240 --> 00:05:44,920
Speaker 1: believe a tax on unrealized wealth at three percent I'm sorry,

124
00:05:44,960 --> 00:05:46,880
Speaker 1: at three million correct.

125
00:05:46,520 --> 00:05:49,360
Speaker 2: In our pension system. There's legislation going through on the

126
00:05:49,360 --> 00:05:53,080
Speaker 2: first of July that if nothing changes then that legislation

127
00:05:53,200 --> 00:05:55,120
Speaker 2: will go through first of July and they go into

128
00:05:55,160 --> 00:05:58,279
Speaker 2: tax at a right of thirty percent unrealized capital guiins

129
00:05:58,360 --> 00:06:01,880
Speaker 2: tax on pension balance over three million dollars. So if

130
00:06:01,880 --> 00:06:04,720
Speaker 2: you have a ten x return in bitcoin and you're

131
00:06:04,760 --> 00:06:07,160
Speaker 2: all in bitcoin with a three million dollar fund, you're

132
00:06:07,160 --> 00:06:09,360
Speaker 2: going to make twenty seven million dollars in a year.

133
00:06:09,680 --> 00:06:11,359
Speaker 2: They're going to send you a bill for eight point

134
00:06:11,360 --> 00:06:14,800
Speaker 2: one million dollars of unrealized tax gains. And now in

135
00:06:14,880 --> 00:06:16,359
Speaker 2: order to pay that bill, you're going to have to

136
00:06:16,400 --> 00:06:19,160
Speaker 2: sell down some bitcoin, and you're going to incur a

137
00:06:19,200 --> 00:06:22,479
Speaker 2: further eight hundred thousand realized capital gains tax to pay

138
00:06:22,480 --> 00:06:24,520
Speaker 2: the bill. You pay nine million dollars on that gain,

139
00:06:24,680 --> 00:06:27,640
Speaker 2: even though and it's an oxymoron to say an unrealized

140
00:06:27,680 --> 00:06:30,760
Speaker 2: capital gain, because the very definition of capital gains means

141
00:06:30,760 --> 00:06:33,880
Speaker 2: that you've disposed of an asset. So they've just redefined

142
00:06:33,880 --> 00:06:36,560
Speaker 2: the English language to suit an agenda that they want

143
00:06:36,600 --> 00:06:39,800
Speaker 2: to take your assets before you've you've gone full circle

144
00:06:39,839 --> 00:06:40,520
Speaker 2: on the investment.

145
00:06:41,040 --> 00:06:41,200
Speaker 3: Now.

146
00:06:41,240 --> 00:06:42,480
Speaker 1: The reason why I want to dig into this and

147
00:06:42,680 --> 00:06:44,640
Speaker 1: talk about it a little bit is because I think

148
00:06:44,680 --> 00:06:46,920
Speaker 1: both of you and I probably agree that whatever is

149
00:06:46,960 --> 00:06:49,520
Speaker 1: probably happening in the G seven, if you want to

150
00:06:49,560 --> 00:06:53,039
Speaker 1: call it the West Canada, Australia is probably a test

151
00:06:53,120 --> 00:06:54,520
Speaker 1: bed for what may be coming for the rest of

152
00:06:54,560 --> 00:06:56,760
Speaker 1: the world. So if it's happening in Australia, it's probably

153
00:06:56,800 --> 00:06:58,800
Speaker 1: coming into Canada, it's probably come into Europe, and it's

154
00:06:58,839 --> 00:06:59,880
Speaker 1: probably going to be come into the.

155
00:06:59,920 --> 00:07:02,599
Speaker 3: U at some level. So if we talk about this.

156
00:07:02,680 --> 00:07:05,479
Speaker 1: Now, you said it's in people's pension accounts, correct, So

157
00:07:05,720 --> 00:07:08,200
Speaker 1: if I hold it in a personal account, if I

158
00:07:08,279 --> 00:07:11,440
Speaker 1: own the stocks or whatever assets personally, that's not subject

159
00:07:11,520 --> 00:07:11,720
Speaker 1: to that.

160
00:07:12,000 --> 00:07:15,800
Speaker 2: Correct. So you can hold it in trust, company or

161
00:07:15,840 --> 00:07:18,560
Speaker 2: personal and it won't be subject to an unrealized capital

162
00:07:18,560 --> 00:07:21,440
Speaker 2: gains tax. I think for the moment, the way it

163
00:07:21,480 --> 00:07:24,840
Speaker 2: was proposed, it was ill thought out legislation that was proposed.

164
00:07:25,240 --> 00:07:27,200
Speaker 2: No one really picked it up, no one really cared

165
00:07:27,240 --> 00:07:29,680
Speaker 2: about it. The feedback I've had from the industry is

166
00:07:29,720 --> 00:07:32,760
Speaker 2: that no one really cares about rich people getting tax more.

167
00:07:33,120 --> 00:07:35,920
Speaker 2: But what they don't understand is the downstream consequences of that.

168
00:07:36,080 --> 00:07:39,240
Speaker 2: And anyone who's holding bitcoin in that pension system will

169
00:07:39,360 --> 00:07:42,040
Speaker 2: very quickly reach that three million dollar threshold and then

170
00:07:42,280 --> 00:07:44,400
Speaker 2: we'll all be subject to the tag. So it's a

171
00:07:44,480 --> 00:07:47,560
Speaker 2: slow creep that has no indexation as well. So you're

172
00:07:47,600 --> 00:07:51,080
Speaker 2: going to be suffering that regardless. And if we think

173
00:07:51,960 --> 00:07:55,320
Speaker 2: probably long lines similarly, from a hyperinflationary type event, or

174
00:07:55,360 --> 00:07:57,920
Speaker 2: at least an inflationary event, three million is not a

175
00:07:57,960 --> 00:07:59,600
Speaker 2: lot of money. Yeah, we're going to be there in

176
00:08:00,480 --> 00:08:01,280
Speaker 2: the next dickide.

177
00:08:01,520 --> 00:08:01,760
Speaker 3: Yeah.

178
00:08:01,840 --> 00:08:03,720
Speaker 1: I mean the crazy thing with that to your point,

179
00:08:03,720 --> 00:08:05,080
Speaker 1: it's not a lot of money, and because of the

180
00:08:05,120 --> 00:08:07,080
Speaker 1: inflation when you think about I mean, here we are

181
00:08:07,080 --> 00:08:09,640
Speaker 1: in this beach town in southern California, and I know

182
00:08:10,600 --> 00:08:14,000
Speaker 1: my neighbor across the street from me house is probably

183
00:08:14,000 --> 00:08:17,600
Speaker 1: worth I'm guessing four million, four and a half million dollars,

184
00:08:18,000 --> 00:08:20,400
Speaker 1: and he bought the house for three hundred and thirty

185
00:08:20,440 --> 00:08:24,600
Speaker 1: thousand dollars I believe in like around the early nineties,

186
00:08:24,960 --> 00:08:28,760
Speaker 1: so that's twenty five years ago. So they bought the

187
00:08:28,800 --> 00:08:31,200
Speaker 1: house for four hundred grand twenty years ago, and now

188
00:08:31,240 --> 00:08:33,640
Speaker 1: it's worth four and a half million. So basically, through

189
00:08:33,679 --> 00:08:36,640
Speaker 1: the money printing, through the inflation, they've artificially pushed the

190
00:08:36,679 --> 00:08:39,760
Speaker 1: asset price up and then they do want to take money,

191
00:08:39,760 --> 00:08:41,400
Speaker 1: so you're actually worse off.

192
00:08:41,520 --> 00:08:45,720
Speaker 2: Right, This is the problem that that creditory event, which

193
00:08:45,760 --> 00:08:49,200
Speaker 2: is sort of pushes inflation, makes everyone feel like they're

194
00:08:49,200 --> 00:08:51,640
Speaker 2: wealthy and they're richer than they are. But the problem

195
00:08:51,760 --> 00:08:54,439
Speaker 2: is Yo Naiba, if he wants to monitize that in

196
00:08:54,480 --> 00:08:57,040
Speaker 2: any white hypo form other than debt, needs to sell

197
00:08:57,080 --> 00:09:00,760
Speaker 2: that asset. Pibwaeva taxes are revivable on it. Whatever's left,

198
00:09:00,800 --> 00:09:03,560
Speaker 2: he still has to find a home yeah, and guess what,

199
00:09:03,679 --> 00:09:06,240
Speaker 2: everything else has gone up around him, so he'll probably

200
00:09:06,640 --> 00:09:09,640
Speaker 2: be buying an inferior asset. And this is where to me,

201
00:09:10,720 --> 00:09:14,840
Speaker 2: bitcoin plays a huge part, particularly for those real estate investors,

202
00:09:15,280 --> 00:09:18,840
Speaker 2: of diversifying a portfolio and adding in an asset that

203
00:09:18,880 --> 00:09:22,040
Speaker 2: they can understand or easily understand that is very similar

204
00:09:22,080 --> 00:09:25,160
Speaker 2: and acts very similarly to real estate. But to me,

205
00:09:25,240 --> 00:09:28,520
Speaker 2: it has a significant upside over and above what real

206
00:09:28,600 --> 00:09:30,920
Speaker 2: estate does, even with the leverage that you can get there.

207
00:09:31,200 --> 00:09:34,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, before we get into that though, we're just kind

208
00:09:34,000 --> 00:09:37,480
Speaker 1: of sticking on this for a minute. I mean, why

209
00:09:37,520 --> 00:09:39,600
Speaker 1: would anybody keep money in a pension account. If that's

210
00:09:39,600 --> 00:09:41,959
Speaker 1: the case, would everybody just close their pension accounts out

211
00:09:41,960 --> 00:09:43,160
Speaker 1: and move them into other assets.

212
00:09:43,559 --> 00:09:45,800
Speaker 2: Well, the problem is this is captive for anyone under

213
00:09:45,840 --> 00:09:47,199
Speaker 2: sixty two or sixty.

214
00:09:46,920 --> 00:09:47,640
Speaker 3: Five years of age.

215
00:09:47,640 --> 00:09:49,600
Speaker 2: They're allowed to sell, they're not allowed to sell, well,

216
00:09:49,600 --> 00:09:51,439
Speaker 2: they're allowed to sell their assets, but they're not allowed

217
00:09:51,440 --> 00:09:54,199
Speaker 2: to take the assets out of the pension system until

218
00:09:54,200 --> 00:09:57,760
Speaker 2: they reach what's called preservation age, which is around between

219
00:09:57,760 --> 00:10:01,280
Speaker 2: sixty and sixty five. Time we get there, they'll push

220
00:10:01,320 --> 00:10:04,199
Speaker 2: that to sixty five to seventy and it's kind of

221
00:10:04,240 --> 00:10:07,320
Speaker 2: a hotel California for capital that can go in, but

222
00:10:07,600 --> 00:10:09,679
Speaker 2: unless you're retired, you can't take that money out.

223
00:10:09,880 --> 00:10:13,560
Speaker 1: Now, is this only for government workers the captured pension

224
00:10:13,600 --> 00:10:15,319
Speaker 1: system or is it like private businesses?

225
00:10:15,320 --> 00:10:17,800
Speaker 2: Also peed into that this is for everyone in Australia.

226
00:10:18,160 --> 00:10:24,600
Speaker 2: But just the absolute duplicitous event that happens on this

227
00:10:24,760 --> 00:10:27,800
Speaker 2: is that most government pensions are not subject to this

228
00:10:27,920 --> 00:10:30,760
Speaker 2: tax because they have something different different called a defined

229
00:10:30,800 --> 00:10:34,360
Speaker 2: benefits scheme. So fortunately for the politicians who are making

230
00:10:34,400 --> 00:10:37,480
Speaker 2: decisions for the rest of us, their superannuation scheme or

231
00:10:37,520 --> 00:10:40,520
Speaker 2: pension scheme is not affected, so they will not suffer

232
00:10:40,520 --> 00:10:42,440
Speaker 2: the tax consequences that everyone else will.

233
00:10:42,520 --> 00:10:43,600
Speaker 3: Sure, it's what it always is.

234
00:10:44,000 --> 00:10:46,760
Speaker 1: Recently, I saw Larry Fink from Blackrock was over I

235
00:10:46,760 --> 00:10:50,040
Speaker 1: believe in India, and he was talking about how Blackrock

236
00:10:50,120 --> 00:10:52,760
Speaker 1: wants to help these other countries build up capital markets.

237
00:10:52,920 --> 00:10:54,760
Speaker 1: So the US sort of has it unfair advantage because

238
00:10:54,800 --> 00:10:56,760
Speaker 1: we have these capital markets that attracts all his capital.

239
00:10:56,800 --> 00:10:59,040
Speaker 1: But he wants these other countries like India that are

240
00:10:59,120 --> 00:11:01,560
Speaker 1: rapidly growing to us of capital markets and maybe try

241
00:11:01,559 --> 00:11:03,720
Speaker 1: to kind of bring them up. And he talked about

242
00:11:03,760 --> 00:11:06,679
Speaker 1: the problem that India has because most people down their

243
00:11:06,760 --> 00:11:09,560
Speaker 1: own gold, so they keep it as jewelry and they

244
00:11:09,640 --> 00:11:13,160
Speaker 1: keep their wealth in that gold. And he talked about

245
00:11:13,480 --> 00:11:16,839
Speaker 1: in a roundabout way where basically India should sort of

246
00:11:16,960 --> 00:11:20,400
Speaker 1: make that illegal because they need all that wealth in

247
00:11:20,440 --> 00:11:22,680
Speaker 1: the system, right, So that's kind of the point that

248
00:11:22,720 --> 00:11:25,079
Speaker 1: you're making. They want that money in the pension and

249
00:11:25,120 --> 00:11:27,280
Speaker 1: then they want to probably continue to raise that pension

250
00:11:27,360 --> 00:11:29,240
Speaker 1: age because they need that money to stay in there.

251
00:11:29,280 --> 00:11:31,360
Speaker 1: And that's exactly what Fink was saying. He's like, no, no,

252
00:11:31,400 --> 00:11:34,040
Speaker 1: we need all that gold to go into the system

253
00:11:34,080 --> 00:11:36,240
Speaker 1: so we can have it. And he even did talk

254
00:11:36,280 --> 00:11:40,840
Speaker 1: about the age at which you could withdraw it, but

255
00:11:41,000 --> 00:11:43,840
Speaker 1: even more specifically what he talked about was the way,

256
00:11:44,080 --> 00:11:47,440
Speaker 1: meaning the schedule, the time, how much you could withdraw

257
00:11:47,559 --> 00:11:52,679
Speaker 1: at a certain time, because again, they want the money,

258
00:11:54,120 --> 00:11:56,600
Speaker 1: and you know, with governments going broke, I mean, they're

259
00:11:56,640 --> 00:11:57,600
Speaker 1: just going to be coming for everything.

260
00:11:57,600 --> 00:11:58,800
Speaker 3: We just have to sort of expect that.

261
00:11:59,200 --> 00:12:01,040
Speaker 2: And sadly, this is why I bring it up, and

262
00:12:01,360 --> 00:12:04,160
Speaker 2: it's a cautionary tale because Australia is a test net

263
00:12:04,320 --> 00:12:06,320
Speaker 2: for the rest of the world when it comes to this.

264
00:12:06,400 --> 00:12:10,000
Speaker 2: If there's very little pushback in Australia, then other governments

265
00:12:10,040 --> 00:12:11,760
Speaker 2: will look at that and think, well, the Australians did

266
00:12:11,920 --> 00:12:14,320
Speaker 2: knock up about it, why don't we test it, And

267
00:12:14,360 --> 00:12:17,319
Speaker 2: so it will just proliferate amongst those G seven countries

268
00:12:17,679 --> 00:12:18,320
Speaker 2: that you talk of.

269
00:12:18,640 --> 00:12:20,720
Speaker 1: You know, I just went to Australia for the first time.

270
00:12:20,760 --> 00:12:23,319
Speaker 1: I was down there just a couple months ago, and

271
00:12:23,640 --> 00:12:26,360
Speaker 1: I grew up, you know whatever, watching Crocodile than the

272
00:12:26,600 --> 00:12:29,040
Speaker 1: and you know Stever, when I just had this vision

273
00:12:29,120 --> 00:12:33,080
Speaker 1: of these these Australians being these rugged and burly kind

274
00:12:33,080 --> 00:12:35,520
Speaker 1: of kind of people, like that's not a knife, this

275
00:12:35,600 --> 00:12:38,160
Speaker 1: is a knife, right, or the Foster's like this is

276
00:12:38,200 --> 00:12:39,199
Speaker 1: a beer or whatever it.

277
00:12:39,200 --> 00:12:39,600
Speaker 3: Is, right.

278
00:12:41,400 --> 00:12:43,839
Speaker 1: But yeah, sure seems like the Australians are pushovers these days.

279
00:12:44,040 --> 00:12:45,480
Speaker 2: Sadly, I hate to say that, right.

280
00:12:45,800 --> 00:12:47,559
Speaker 3: It all started when he gave up your guns.

281
00:12:47,800 --> 00:12:51,960
Speaker 2: Yep, and I think there was it was an opportunity

282
00:12:51,960 --> 00:12:54,080
Speaker 2: time for the government to have that gun buy back

283
00:12:54,120 --> 00:12:57,880
Speaker 2: and seizure of the guns, and Australia hasn't really pushed

284
00:12:57,880 --> 00:13:01,440
Speaker 2: back on that whatsoever. Gun liscense is very different to

285
00:13:01,800 --> 00:13:03,360
Speaker 2: what it is in the US. The US it is

286
00:13:03,360 --> 00:13:05,920
Speaker 2: a right. In Australia it's a privilege that the government

287
00:13:05,920 --> 00:13:09,240
Speaker 2: bestows on you if you meet the certain hurdles. You

288
00:13:09,320 --> 00:13:13,199
Speaker 2: need to go through all sorts of licensing and training

289
00:13:13,320 --> 00:13:15,680
Speaker 2: in order to get that. There are some exemptions for

290
00:13:15,760 --> 00:13:18,960
Speaker 2: farmers and the like who need that for maintenance of property.

291
00:13:19,000 --> 00:13:23,080
Speaker 2: But it's been a it's a very different culture in

292
00:13:23,120 --> 00:13:28,160
Speaker 2: Australia to America, and I think there has been a

293
00:13:28,200 --> 00:13:32,560
Speaker 2: whittling away of that oka Australian who pushes back on

294
00:13:32,600 --> 00:13:34,520
Speaker 2: authority to say, hey, we don't want to deal with that,

295
00:13:35,240 --> 00:13:39,600
Speaker 2: leave us alone, and probably highlighted by the reaction the

296
00:13:39,640 --> 00:13:42,640
Speaker 2: behavior around the vaccine mandates and lockdowns that we went through,

297
00:13:42,640 --> 00:13:45,679
Speaker 2: which I think we're probably globally the most raconian out

298
00:13:45,720 --> 00:13:48,520
Speaker 2: of anywhere. And I live in New South Wales or Sydney,

299
00:13:48,880 --> 00:13:52,200
Speaker 2: south of US as Victoria which had arguably the world's

300
00:13:52,480 --> 00:13:54,720
Speaker 2: long well it did have the world's longest lockdown, and

301
00:13:54,760 --> 00:13:57,120
Speaker 2: so I had a lot of friends down there who know,

302
00:13:57,280 --> 00:14:00,520
Speaker 2: just walking in the street, they were stopped the police

303
00:14:00,559 --> 00:14:03,040
Speaker 2: decide what are you doing? Where are you going? You're

304
00:14:03,080 --> 00:14:04,640
Speaker 2: not allowed to be out and you've got to go home.

305
00:14:04,720 --> 00:14:07,760
Speaker 2: It's like I'm walking the adult like. There was some

306
00:14:08,480 --> 00:14:11,520
Speaker 2: I think some serious concerns rised, and I think we're

307
00:14:11,640 --> 00:14:14,040
Speaker 2: very quick to memory haul that and not not for

308
00:14:14,200 --> 00:14:16,760
Speaker 2: attention to it, Forget it never happened, and move on

309
00:14:17,200 --> 00:14:17,959
Speaker 2: until the next one.

310
00:14:18,040 --> 00:14:22,000
Speaker 1: Run sidetracked into this little conversation. But just for a minute,

311
00:14:22,280 --> 00:14:24,120
Speaker 1: we'll get back to the generational wealth question I want

312
00:14:24,120 --> 00:14:27,120
Speaker 1: to get to. But what's going on in Venezuela right now?

313
00:14:27,320 --> 00:14:30,680
Speaker 1: I mean, is a perfect example of where things eventually

314
00:14:31,200 --> 00:14:34,520
Speaker 1: devolve too, right, and so in Venezuela, Now, did Maduro

315
00:14:34,560 --> 00:14:36,880
Speaker 1: win the election? Is was there some sort of a

316
00:14:36,920 --> 00:14:39,280
Speaker 1: coup that's going on? Like what's going on down there?

317
00:14:39,320 --> 00:14:42,360
Speaker 1: But more importantly, without getting into the facts, because we

318
00:14:42,360 --> 00:14:44,840
Speaker 1: don't know the facts, but we do know that's facts.

319
00:14:44,880 --> 00:14:45,440
Speaker 3: Is like you have the.

320
00:14:45,440 --> 00:14:49,360
Speaker 1: Military opening fire on innocent civilians. We do know that

321
00:14:49,360 --> 00:14:51,560
Speaker 1: that's a fact. Now we don't know the circumstances behind that.

322
00:14:52,040 --> 00:14:53,920
Speaker 1: And I saw I think I retweeted. I think it

323
00:14:53,920 --> 00:14:58,000
Speaker 1: was Spike Cohen said that socialism is one of the

324
00:14:58,000 --> 00:15:00,360
Speaker 1: things that you can vote your way into, but you

325
00:15:00,440 --> 00:15:01,760
Speaker 1: got to shoot your way out.

326
00:15:01,560 --> 00:15:04,640
Speaker 2: Of strying's done. How many guns left? That's a problem

327
00:15:04,720 --> 00:15:08,080
Speaker 2: for ye try Yeah, in America, not so much.

328
00:15:08,320 --> 00:15:11,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, although Kamala Harris is already talking about trying to

329
00:15:11,520 --> 00:15:14,280
Speaker 1: change that as soon as you can, so we'll see.

330
00:15:14,080 --> 00:15:14,480
Speaker 3: How that goes.

331
00:15:14,520 --> 00:15:16,520
Speaker 1: Anyway, let's get back to the top of a hand here.

332
00:15:17,360 --> 00:15:20,560
Speaker 1: So high net worth individuals they think more about preserving

333
00:15:20,640 --> 00:15:23,600
Speaker 1: wealth than acquiring because they've already made it, so how

334
00:15:23,600 --> 00:15:26,240
Speaker 1: do we keep it? They think about what types of

335
00:15:26,240 --> 00:15:28,880
Speaker 1: assets they could buy that they could keep that, taxes

336
00:15:28,960 --> 00:15:33,480
Speaker 1: being one thing that they have to navigate, but in

337
00:15:33,520 --> 00:15:36,680
Speaker 1: regards to preserving that wealth, and then thinking about that

338
00:15:36,760 --> 00:15:39,040
Speaker 1: wealth generationally. And as I said, this is something I've

339
00:15:39,080 --> 00:15:40,920
Speaker 1: been thinking a lot about because at the stage I'm

340
00:15:40,960 --> 00:15:43,120
Speaker 1: at with my kids, I just went through setting up

341
00:15:43,320 --> 00:15:47,000
Speaker 1: trust structures. We went new trust structures and building like

342
00:15:47,080 --> 00:15:50,600
Speaker 1: family constitutions so that there's like a set of rules

343
00:15:50,600 --> 00:15:52,800
Speaker 1: like a US Constitution around that wealth as it goes

344
00:15:52,800 --> 00:15:54,880
Speaker 1: down generationally. So that's sort of where my head's been.

345
00:15:55,440 --> 00:15:58,400
Speaker 1: And I've been sort of battling some people on Twitter

346
00:15:59,280 --> 00:16:02,040
Speaker 1: because there's this whole seemingly movement or maybe it's just

347
00:16:02,080 --> 00:16:05,119
Speaker 1: caught my attention of people. A lot of prominent bitcoinners,

348
00:16:05,200 --> 00:16:09,800
Speaker 1: even who outright think it's bad to leave wealth for

349
00:16:09,840 --> 00:16:10,400
Speaker 1: your kids.

350
00:16:12,960 --> 00:16:14,600
Speaker 2: They're entitled to their own opinions.

351
00:16:15,600 --> 00:16:16,400
Speaker 3: What do you think about it?

352
00:16:16,400 --> 00:16:18,640
Speaker 2: I have, and I completely disagree with it. You know,

353
00:16:18,680 --> 00:16:21,880
Speaker 2: I look at my responsibility to my family, to my legacy,

354
00:16:22,120 --> 00:16:27,680
Speaker 2: not only to my children, but to know my lineage.

355
00:16:27,960 --> 00:16:30,160
Speaker 2: I need to honor their lineage and the sacrifices that

356
00:16:30,200 --> 00:16:32,640
Speaker 2: they've made to be as successful as I can be,

357
00:16:33,120 --> 00:16:35,600
Speaker 2: and then to ensure that not only AREM a success,

358
00:16:35,640 --> 00:16:39,360
Speaker 2: but my children are success. And sadly, there's no real

359
00:16:39,400 --> 00:16:43,200
Speaker 2: other benchmark in society that we have that's universally accepted

360
00:16:43,480 --> 00:16:46,040
Speaker 2: other than how wealthy you are. It's a school board

361
00:16:46,040 --> 00:16:48,840
Speaker 2: that everyone understands what the school board is. There's no

362
00:16:48,920 --> 00:16:51,280
Speaker 2: intangible around it. It's a number that you can look at.

363
00:16:51,680 --> 00:16:54,440
Speaker 2: It's the only objective measure we have of success.

364
00:16:54,720 --> 00:16:54,840
Speaker 1: Now.

365
00:16:54,840 --> 00:16:57,200
Speaker 2: It's not the only way to define success, but it's

366
00:16:57,680 --> 00:16:59,520
Speaker 2: the universally accepted way of that.

367
00:16:59,640 --> 00:16:59,880
Speaker 3: Now.

368
00:17:00,080 --> 00:17:02,160
Speaker 2: I look at that and think, why would you want

369
00:17:02,200 --> 00:17:05,199
Speaker 2: to rob your children of the ability to leverage that

370
00:17:05,280 --> 00:17:07,639
Speaker 2: and further the legacy of everyone who's come before you,

371
00:17:08,000 --> 00:17:10,359
Speaker 2: And you think about all of the sacrifices that you

372
00:17:10,480 --> 00:17:14,679
Speaker 2: make as a bitcoiner. I personally look at my children,

373
00:17:14,720 --> 00:17:16,199
Speaker 2: I think I want them to go on and be

374
00:17:16,240 --> 00:17:19,560
Speaker 2: productive parts of society. And I think if they've got capital,

375
00:17:19,760 --> 00:17:22,720
Speaker 2: and I think it will be an indictment on myself

376
00:17:22,760 --> 00:17:25,120
Speaker 2: and my skills as a parent if they don't make

377
00:17:25,160 --> 00:17:27,879
Speaker 2: a contribution to society. I want them to go on

378
00:17:28,000 --> 00:17:31,320
Speaker 2: and do great things. And having access and access to

379
00:17:31,359 --> 00:17:35,800
Speaker 2: resources enables them to further the family legacy into the

380
00:17:35,840 --> 00:17:38,959
Speaker 2: future and become meaningful contributors to society.

381
00:17:40,480 --> 00:17:40,960
Speaker 3: I think of it.

382
00:17:41,040 --> 00:17:43,000
Speaker 1: I think there's two different ways. I think, you know,

383
00:17:43,040 --> 00:17:45,160
Speaker 1: because we went into you know, from an equity based

384
00:17:45,119 --> 00:17:47,879
Speaker 1: system to a debt based monetary system sort of officially

385
00:17:47,880 --> 00:17:50,520
Speaker 1: in nineteen seventy one, severing the tays to God. In

386
00:17:50,600 --> 00:17:54,160
Speaker 1: a debt based minetary system, we're basically stealing value from

387
00:17:54,160 --> 00:17:57,360
Speaker 1: the future, yes, And so we're literally stealing value from

388
00:17:57,359 --> 00:17:59,480
Speaker 1: our you know, for our kids and grandkids, et cetera.

389
00:18:00,400 --> 00:18:02,400
Speaker 1: I just think that's like the direction of the world.

390
00:18:02,640 --> 00:18:06,199
Speaker 1: But as a bitcoiner, I think about flipping that and like,

391
00:18:06,280 --> 00:18:08,399
Speaker 1: our money should buy us more goods and services in

392
00:18:08,480 --> 00:18:10,520
Speaker 1: the future, and we should be building value into the future,

393
00:18:10,600 --> 00:18:12,760
Speaker 1: not stealing from it. And I've been sort of using

394
00:18:12,760 --> 00:18:14,919
Speaker 1: this analogy and this way to look at it as

395
00:18:15,000 --> 00:18:18,119
Speaker 1: like a blockchain where it's like, my life is proof

396
00:18:18,160 --> 00:18:21,200
Speaker 1: of work, and I'm building a block and I want

397
00:18:21,240 --> 00:18:23,639
Speaker 1: my kids to be able to attach their block onto

398
00:18:23,680 --> 00:18:25,920
Speaker 1: my block, and my grandkids to attach the block onto

399
00:18:25,920 --> 00:18:28,400
Speaker 1: a block, and to continue to build this like blockchain

400
00:18:28,440 --> 00:18:30,840
Speaker 1: of life, and like why wouldn't we push value into

401
00:18:30,880 --> 00:18:33,520
Speaker 1: the future as opposed to stealing it from the future.

402
00:18:33,600 --> 00:18:36,240
Speaker 1: Now I could see how people would say it's bad

403
00:18:36,280 --> 00:18:39,639
Speaker 1: for kids. I suppose if you raise bad kids. But

404
00:18:39,720 --> 00:18:43,800
Speaker 1: that's more of you, not a symptom of the money, right, I.

405
00:18:43,760 --> 00:18:48,720
Speaker 2: Agree, And this is where money. You know, people say

406
00:18:48,880 --> 00:18:51,080
Speaker 2: money changes you. I don't think it does.

407
00:18:51,240 --> 00:18:51,760
Speaker 3: It just.

408
00:18:53,240 --> 00:18:57,359
Speaker 2: Exemplifies and expands on what your true nature is. If

409
00:18:57,359 --> 00:19:00,280
Speaker 2: you're a bad person, if you've got resources, you're going

410
00:19:00,320 --> 00:19:02,680
Speaker 2: to do really bad things. If you're a good person

411
00:19:02,760 --> 00:19:06,159
Speaker 2: and want to make contributions and build out and help society,

412
00:19:06,280 --> 00:19:08,840
Speaker 2: having more resources allows you to do that. I think

413
00:19:08,880 --> 00:19:12,280
Speaker 2: it's an internal struggle that's projected on to other people.

414
00:19:12,760 --> 00:19:15,760
Speaker 2: It's always an internal struggle. And this is where for me,

415
00:19:16,600 --> 00:19:19,560
Speaker 2: you want to provide optionality, whether it's to your children,

416
00:19:19,680 --> 00:19:22,879
Speaker 2: to your clients, to anyone around you. Providing options and

417
00:19:22,920 --> 00:19:26,320
Speaker 2: then giving others the choice to make I want to

418
00:19:26,320 --> 00:19:28,240
Speaker 2: be in a position that they've got all the resources

419
00:19:28,240 --> 00:19:30,800
Speaker 2: that they could ever possibly want, and then if they

420
00:19:30,840 --> 00:19:33,360
Speaker 2: decide that they want to make a contribution, their best

421
00:19:33,359 --> 00:19:36,400
Speaker 2: way to contribute to societies to make donations and give

422
00:19:36,400 --> 00:19:39,159
Speaker 2: the money away, then so be it. And to me,

423
00:19:39,280 --> 00:19:41,400
Speaker 2: and I was just talking about this with a group

424
00:19:41,440 --> 00:19:45,320
Speaker 2: of tax attorneys across the country yesterday, that to me,

425
00:19:45,440 --> 00:19:49,920
Speaker 2: bitcoin represents the best generational asset to pass on because

426
00:19:49,960 --> 00:19:52,720
Speaker 2: not only is it going to be the lastest longing, sorry,

427
00:19:52,720 --> 00:19:56,200
Speaker 2: the longest lasting, it's going to be the best performing.

428
00:19:56,640 --> 00:19:58,720
Speaker 2: But there's a very curious thing that you can do

429
00:19:58,760 --> 00:20:00,639
Speaker 2: with bitcoin that you can do with no other asset,

430
00:20:00,880 --> 00:20:03,639
Speaker 2: and that is to your point about being able to

431
00:20:03,640 --> 00:20:07,399
Speaker 2: put assets into the future. You can timelock assets for

432
00:20:07,440 --> 00:20:11,879
Speaker 2: different generations, and so you can timelock bitcoin for different generations.

433
00:20:11,880 --> 00:20:14,160
Speaker 2: And that's something I spend a lot of time thinking about.

434
00:20:14,359 --> 00:20:15,560
Speaker 3: That. You might not.

435
00:20:15,560 --> 00:20:20,600
Speaker 2: Want your children to benefit from your bitcoin or all

436
00:20:20,600 --> 00:20:23,480
Speaker 2: of your bitcoin, and you want to leave bitcoin in

437
00:20:23,880 --> 00:20:26,879
Speaker 2: for further generations, out for your grandchildren or great grandchildren,

438
00:20:27,000 --> 00:20:29,159
Speaker 2: great great great great grandchildren. All of a sudden, you

439
00:20:29,160 --> 00:20:32,040
Speaker 2: can timelock a portion of this asset today that's going

440
00:20:32,080 --> 00:20:34,679
Speaker 2: to continually grow into the future. That can only be

441
00:20:34,720 --> 00:20:37,119
Speaker 2: accessed to a future point in time, which is to

442
00:20:37,160 --> 00:20:39,119
Speaker 2: your point about the debt robbing from the future to

443
00:20:41,119 --> 00:20:44,399
Speaker 2: take now, that is the complete inverse to that. And

444
00:20:44,440 --> 00:20:48,199
Speaker 2: this is where I think Dave Bailey came up with

445
00:20:48,240 --> 00:20:51,200
Speaker 2: an innovative solution to pay off the US national debt

446
00:20:51,240 --> 00:20:54,600
Speaker 2: by buying a trillion dollars worth of bitcoin, timelocking it

447
00:20:54,640 --> 00:20:57,080
Speaker 2: for thirty or fifty years, and then have that as

448
00:20:57,119 --> 00:20:59,400
Speaker 2: a way to pay off what's currently currently here.

449
00:20:59,440 --> 00:21:01,879
Speaker 1: Now, imagine the dump on the market in twenty or

450
00:21:01,920 --> 00:21:05,399
Speaker 1: fifty years what that would look like though, So you

451
00:21:05,600 --> 00:21:07,680
Speaker 1: just made a couple of big claims. So you said

452
00:21:07,680 --> 00:21:11,280
Speaker 1: that big onin is the longest lasting, it's the best performing,

453
00:21:11,440 --> 00:21:12,760
Speaker 1: and then the ability to time lock it.

454
00:21:12,800 --> 00:21:13,520
Speaker 3: Let's just go through that.

455
00:21:13,800 --> 00:21:17,000
Speaker 1: So you said it's the longest lasting. So you talk

456
00:21:17,000 --> 00:21:20,800
Speaker 1: about high neworth individuals thinking about saving their money in

457
00:21:20,880 --> 00:21:23,840
Speaker 1: bonds or real estate or businesses or whatever. You said,

458
00:21:23,840 --> 00:21:26,439
Speaker 1: bitcoin is the longest lasting. Break that down for us.

459
00:21:26,600 --> 00:21:29,800
Speaker 2: It's ironic given it's only fifteen years old, right, and

460
00:21:30,000 --> 00:21:34,320
Speaker 2: that comes from years of studying this and you're probably

461
00:21:34,320 --> 00:21:36,040
Speaker 2: of the same mind that you know, the more time

462
00:21:36,080 --> 00:21:38,760
Speaker 2: you spend looking at an asset or an investment, the

463
00:21:38,800 --> 00:21:41,439
Speaker 2: worse it gets. You find holes in it. Oh, this

464
00:21:41,520 --> 00:21:43,919
Speaker 2: could go wrong, that could go wrong. What have you.

465
00:21:45,359 --> 00:21:47,520
Speaker 2: I've spent close to twenty thousand hours now staring at

466
00:21:47,560 --> 00:21:49,960
Speaker 2: bitcoin trying to poke holes in it, understand what I

467
00:21:49,960 --> 00:21:53,600
Speaker 2: don't understand, and I'm still an amateur even after that time.

468
00:21:53,960 --> 00:21:56,040
Speaker 2: But from what I can see, I can't find any

469
00:21:56,080 --> 00:21:58,000
Speaker 2: holes with it. It gets better every time I look

470
00:21:58,040 --> 00:22:00,639
Speaker 2: at it. And this is where it's going to be

471
00:22:00,720 --> 00:22:04,199
Speaker 2: the longest lasting asset that we've got on many different layers. Firstly,

472
00:22:04,200 --> 00:22:07,080
Speaker 2: I think it'll outlast just about everything else in the world,

473
00:22:07,119 --> 00:22:10,440
Speaker 2: whether it's stocks, bonds, properties, governments, society as a whole.

474
00:22:10,880 --> 00:22:14,560
Speaker 2: That is the substrate of our structure moving forward. It's

475
00:22:14,600 --> 00:22:17,280
Speaker 2: just that that information isn't evenly distributed, so not too

476
00:22:17,320 --> 00:22:20,360
Speaker 2: many people understand that. If they did, we'd have bitcoin

477
00:22:20,400 --> 00:22:24,960
Speaker 2: in the millions or billions of dollars per value. When

478
00:22:25,160 --> 00:22:28,240
Speaker 2: I talk about bitcoin being the longest lasting, all you

479
00:22:28,320 --> 00:22:31,119
Speaker 2: have to do is buy it and hold it, and

480
00:22:31,160 --> 00:22:34,600
Speaker 2: if you self custody it, that can last essentially for

481
00:22:35,400 --> 00:22:38,360
Speaker 2: ten hundred thousand years into the future, however long society

482
00:22:38,400 --> 00:22:42,159
Speaker 2: is going to last. However, I'm very doubtful that you

483
00:22:42,200 --> 00:22:47,200
Speaker 2: can achieve that same outcome with property or bonds or shares.

484
00:22:47,560 --> 00:22:50,520
Speaker 2: You look at the average length of a company across

485
00:22:51,240 --> 00:22:54,880
Speaker 2: our countries, and if you include startups, the average length

486
00:22:54,920 --> 00:22:57,520
Speaker 2: of the company would be about five years. No, most

487
00:22:57,560 --> 00:23:00,200
Speaker 2: businesses fail within five years. Now, if you're fortunate enough

488
00:23:00,240 --> 00:23:01,920
Speaker 2: to own a big company like one of the big

489
00:23:01,960 --> 00:23:04,480
Speaker 2: banks or insurance companies, they may be going now for

490
00:23:04,520 --> 00:23:06,920
Speaker 2: one hundred hundred and fifty years, but they are you know,

491
00:23:07,080 --> 00:23:09,840
Speaker 2: the pointy point zero zero one of a percent of

492
00:23:09,880 --> 00:23:12,959
Speaker 2: companies that have ever been established. So do I have

493
00:23:13,000 --> 00:23:14,960
Speaker 2: the skills to figure out what companies are going to

494
00:23:14,960 --> 00:23:16,879
Speaker 2: be around at that point in time in the future.

495
00:23:18,240 --> 00:23:20,919
Speaker 2: Absolutely not. And this is where the whole idea of

496
00:23:20,960 --> 00:23:24,040
Speaker 2: index investing, which I disagree with, but it's been a

497
00:23:24,160 --> 00:23:28,280
Speaker 2: very palatable format for people to invest in. This is

498
00:23:28,280 --> 00:23:32,320
Speaker 2: why people invest in passive index funds because they don't

499
00:23:32,320 --> 00:23:34,160
Speaker 2: have to pick the winners. They just have to pick

500
00:23:34,240 --> 00:23:36,720
Speaker 2: the exposure to whatever the market is going to be

501
00:23:36,760 --> 00:23:39,280
Speaker 2: at that point in time. Now, that's a great way

502
00:23:39,320 --> 00:23:41,800
Speaker 2: for preserving wealth, but you're not going to outperform anything,

503
00:23:41,840 --> 00:23:44,920
Speaker 2: You're just going to keep it stagnant, and over time

504
00:23:45,280 --> 00:23:49,160
Speaker 2: your wealth is going to deteriorate relative to the winners

505
00:23:49,560 --> 00:23:51,800
Speaker 2: who pick the best assets. So I look at that

506
00:23:51,840 --> 00:23:54,960
Speaker 2: and think that's not going to make your wealth last long.

507
00:23:55,400 --> 00:23:58,480
Speaker 2: And this is where to me, bitcoin is a complete

508
00:23:58,520 --> 00:24:03,800
Speaker 2: anomaly because I believe bitcoin is our first risk free asset.

509
00:24:04,240 --> 00:24:06,880
Speaker 2: It's not our volatility free asset. And there's a key

510
00:24:06,920 --> 00:24:10,959
Speaker 2: distinction between that. But if you're thinking in generational terms,

511
00:24:11,600 --> 00:24:14,160
Speaker 2: you can buy bitcoin and know that, Okay, you can

512
00:24:14,200 --> 00:24:16,480
Speaker 2: deal with a bad two or three years because you

513
00:24:16,520 --> 00:24:19,800
Speaker 2: know we're planning for thirty fifty eighty, one hundred, two

514
00:24:19,880 --> 00:24:22,399
Speaker 2: hundred years. In fact, we've got one client who's planning

515
00:24:22,440 --> 00:24:25,840
Speaker 2: for trying to have a two hundred year plan for

516
00:24:26,000 --> 00:24:29,480
Speaker 2: his legacy, and it revolves around his business and bitcoin

517
00:24:29,600 --> 00:24:32,520
Speaker 2: backing it and funding his vision for the future. Now,

518
00:24:32,720 --> 00:24:36,800
Speaker 2: no other asset would I have confidence in to fund

519
00:24:36,800 --> 00:24:40,520
Speaker 2: a two hundred year plan With bitcoin, I certainly believe it.

520
00:24:42,280 --> 00:24:43,479
Speaker 3: Let's dig into that a little bit.

521
00:24:43,560 --> 00:24:47,119
Speaker 1: So it's the longest lasting Like obviously a house is

522
00:24:47,160 --> 00:24:48,800
Speaker 1: probably not going to last that long. I mean, there

523
00:24:48,800 --> 00:24:50,840
Speaker 1: are some that are a few several hundre years old,

524
00:24:50,840 --> 00:24:52,800
Speaker 1: that they have to be rebuilt and whatnot rate. So

525
00:24:53,480 --> 00:24:56,639
Speaker 1: obviously a car, you know, businesses most likely are not

526
00:24:56,760 --> 00:24:57,120
Speaker 1: that long.

527
00:24:57,160 --> 00:24:57,760
Speaker 3: So I get that.

528
00:24:57,840 --> 00:25:01,600
Speaker 1: However, does that assume and that means that it's an

529
00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:03,600
Speaker 1: asset that you could just buy it and never touch

530
00:25:03,640 --> 00:25:06,520
Speaker 1: it again for twnity years Because I could just sell

531
00:25:06,560 --> 00:25:10,119
Speaker 1: one property for another, I could rehab the property, I

532
00:25:10,160 --> 00:25:14,560
Speaker 1: could sell this business buy a different business, So I

533
00:25:14,600 --> 00:25:17,800
Speaker 1: could manage that well through real estate and businesses. But

534
00:25:17,840 --> 00:25:19,440
Speaker 1: bitcoin is more like a hands.

535
00:25:19,160 --> 00:25:20,879
Speaker 2: Off approach completely.

536
00:25:21,280 --> 00:25:22,880
Speaker 3: And what I mean is that a big deal?

537
00:25:23,440 --> 00:25:26,160
Speaker 2: No? I think it's a huge deal because every time

538
00:25:26,200 --> 00:25:30,080
Speaker 2: you transact, you're subjecting yourself to a number of different things. Firstly,

539
00:25:30,119 --> 00:25:33,000
Speaker 2: your personal judgment to outperform the market, that you're going

540
00:25:33,040 --> 00:25:36,720
Speaker 2: to improve the capital allocation. Secondly, and a big one

541
00:25:36,760 --> 00:25:39,760
Speaker 2: is typically there's a tax consequence for every transaction that

542
00:25:39,800 --> 00:25:42,919
Speaker 2: you make, and if you're making multiple transactions in that

543
00:25:42,920 --> 00:25:46,280
Speaker 2: two hundred year period, you're going to be taxed multiple times.

544
00:25:46,720 --> 00:25:51,080
Speaker 2: So if you look at say, typical tax regime in

545
00:25:51,160 --> 00:25:54,199
Speaker 2: the US on capital gains would be circa thirty percent.

546
00:25:54,840 --> 00:25:57,960
Speaker 2: Now if you do that four times in one hundred years.

547
00:25:58,000 --> 00:26:01,080
Speaker 2: That's only one transaction every fifty years, you're going to

548
00:26:01,119 --> 00:26:03,120
Speaker 2: end up with less than forty percent of the original

549
00:26:03,160 --> 00:26:04,000
Speaker 2: capital that you had.

550
00:26:06,440 --> 00:26:09,560
Speaker 1: That's well, I mean, assuming the capital doesn't grow, yes,

551
00:26:09,720 --> 00:26:10,520
Speaker 1: but let's look.

552
00:26:10,400 --> 00:26:13,240
Speaker 2: At it in bitcoin terms. If you bought and solid

553
00:26:13,280 --> 00:26:16,879
Speaker 2: bitcoin four times and incurred that thirty percent fight four times,

554
00:26:17,400 --> 00:26:20,480
Speaker 2: you'd have less than forty percent of the original bitcoin

555
00:26:20,480 --> 00:26:21,320
Speaker 2: that you started with.

556
00:26:21,720 --> 00:26:24,000
Speaker 1: You can think of that tax almost as volatility, right,

557
00:26:24,080 --> 00:26:27,480
Speaker 1: So when when an asset draws down by thirty percent,

558
00:26:27,600 --> 00:26:29,560
Speaker 1: it has to make a sixty percent just to get

559
00:26:29,560 --> 00:26:32,240
Speaker 1: back to even So if you make that transaction, thirty

560
00:26:32,240 --> 00:26:35,600
Speaker 1: percent goes to taxes, Now that next transaction has to

561
00:26:35,720 --> 00:26:37,640
Speaker 1: go up by at least sixty percent just to get

562
00:26:37,680 --> 00:26:40,000
Speaker 1: you back to where you were. Right. So that's sort

563
00:26:40,040 --> 00:26:42,120
Speaker 1: of how that that volatility, if you want to call

564
00:26:42,160 --> 00:26:45,760
Speaker 1: it that of the tax taxation will really draw down

565
00:26:45,800 --> 00:26:48,840
Speaker 1: on your long term gains correct plus to your point,

566
00:26:48,960 --> 00:26:50,520
Speaker 1: I did like that, I mean, then that draws on

567
00:26:50,520 --> 00:26:52,359
Speaker 1: your own judgment. And so when you're thinking about two

568
00:26:52,400 --> 00:26:55,240
Speaker 1: hundred years now, you're depending on the judgment of all

569
00:26:55,320 --> 00:26:57,639
Speaker 1: those errors down the line that they're going to make

570
00:26:57,640 --> 00:27:02,359
Speaker 1: good judgment, which is probably probably pretty hard to view. Okay,

571
00:27:02,440 --> 00:27:05,040
Speaker 1: so that's the longest lasting meaning. I can set it

572
00:27:05,040 --> 00:27:08,040
Speaker 1: and forget it. I'm not subject to all the different transactions,

573
00:27:07,400 --> 00:27:11,480
Speaker 1: the subjection of people's interpretation of markets at that time

574
00:27:11,520 --> 00:27:15,560
Speaker 1: and whatever. Then you said it's the best performing asset.

575
00:27:15,640 --> 00:27:18,560
Speaker 1: Now we certainly know factually it has been the best

576
00:27:18,560 --> 00:27:21,320
Speaker 1: performing asset in the world. Some people still think it's

577
00:27:21,320 --> 00:27:24,600
Speaker 1: a magic Internet money. You said that pretty matter of factly.

578
00:27:24,680 --> 00:27:26,280
Speaker 1: So why do you think it's going to be continue

579
00:27:26,320 --> 00:27:28,880
Speaker 1: to be the best performing asset in the world.

580
00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:32,879
Speaker 2: On the most basic of premises, I believe in humanity,

581
00:27:33,119 --> 00:27:36,040
Speaker 2: and I think we will evolve, not to evolve. If

582
00:27:36,080 --> 00:27:37,600
Speaker 2: you believe that we are going to improve and our

583
00:27:37,640 --> 00:27:40,760
Speaker 2: lives are going to get better, then Bitcoin is going

584
00:27:40,760 --> 00:27:43,680
Speaker 2: to fundamentally accrue more value and grow into the future.

585
00:27:44,119 --> 00:27:47,760
Speaker 2: If I look at all of the avenues of capital

586
00:27:48,160 --> 00:27:51,159
Speaker 2: and the places of capital where they are stored, and

587
00:27:51,200 --> 00:27:54,480
Speaker 2: how they move, how they are used, Bitcoin is an

588
00:27:54,520 --> 00:27:58,560
Speaker 2: insignificant market in relative terms to the bond market, stock market,

589
00:27:58,560 --> 00:28:02,959
Speaker 2: property market. Look at with a deep understanding across all

590
00:28:03,000 --> 00:28:05,920
Speaker 2: of those asset classes and how that compares to bitcoin,

591
00:28:06,480 --> 00:28:09,000
Speaker 2: and it will be a one way valve, there'll be

592
00:28:09,080 --> 00:28:13,119
Speaker 2: a drain of capital from each of those large assets

593
00:28:13,400 --> 00:28:16,119
Speaker 2: into bitcoin. And so what does that do at a

594
00:28:16,160 --> 00:28:18,800
Speaker 2: time when Bitcoin is becoming more and more scarce, so

595
00:28:18,840 --> 00:28:22,480
Speaker 2: there's less and less coins on exchange. Bitcoin will as

596
00:28:22,520 --> 00:28:25,159
Speaker 2: the market cap grows, we'll be able to access bigger

597
00:28:25,200 --> 00:28:28,600
Speaker 2: and bigger capital pools. So you have larger capital pools

598
00:28:28,880 --> 00:28:30,840
Speaker 2: trying to find less bitcoin. And I look at this

599
00:28:30,920 --> 00:28:35,719
Speaker 2: and think, this capital appreciation in bitcoin hasn't yet started.

600
00:28:35,760 --> 00:28:37,679
Speaker 2: A lot of people think, oh, well, it's been the

601
00:28:37,720 --> 00:28:40,040
Speaker 2: best over the last fifteen years, it can't go any further,

602
00:28:40,320 --> 00:28:43,880
Speaker 2: but they fail to understand that there's a host of

603
00:28:43,880 --> 00:28:48,560
Speaker 2: reasons why this little asset cooled bitcoin that is inconsequential

604
00:28:48,600 --> 00:28:52,240
Speaker 2: in global terms, can take on an infinite infinite amount

605
00:28:52,280 --> 00:28:55,040
Speaker 2: of capital. And to me, I look at the future

606
00:28:55,040 --> 00:28:56,680
Speaker 2: and think, there's no other asset that I want to

607
00:28:56,680 --> 00:28:59,480
Speaker 2: be holding other than bitcoin. If you want to capture

608
00:28:59,520 --> 00:29:02,560
Speaker 2: that upside and bring this full circle to one of

609
00:29:02,600 --> 00:29:06,120
Speaker 2: the points you made earlier, this is really one of

610
00:29:06,160 --> 00:29:11,320
Speaker 2: the It's a real dichotomy because you have what people

611
00:29:11,320 --> 00:29:14,040
Speaker 2: think is a volatile asset, which is actually a risk

612
00:29:14,040 --> 00:29:16,840
Speaker 2: free asset when you understand it and it's the best

613
00:29:16,840 --> 00:29:19,120
Speaker 2: performing asset that you want to put in a portfolio

614
00:29:19,240 --> 00:29:21,480
Speaker 2: that is going to preserve your wealth. So a lot

615
00:29:21,480 --> 00:29:25,360
Speaker 2: of those things just do not marry up to what

616
00:29:25,400 --> 00:29:28,240
Speaker 2: you would think is a sensible investment decision. And this

617
00:29:28,360 --> 00:29:31,080
Speaker 2: is where when people look at it without studying, I

618
00:29:31,120 --> 00:29:34,360
Speaker 2: think they suffer cognitive dissonance because a lot of those

619
00:29:34,400 --> 00:29:37,080
Speaker 2: things can't be true at the same time, and bitcoin

620
00:29:37,200 --> 00:29:38,760
Speaker 2: is the first time that those things are true.

621
00:29:38,920 --> 00:29:40,480
Speaker 1: I want to take a second, just real quick, to

622
00:29:40,480 --> 00:29:44,200
Speaker 1: just give you a reminder. The reminder is take control

623
00:29:44,440 --> 00:29:47,040
Speaker 1: of your bitcoin. Look, for the first time in history,

624
00:29:47,080 --> 00:29:50,040
Speaker 1: we have a way to preserve our property, take custody

625
00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:52,400
Speaker 1: of our property and protect it with no cost. You

626
00:29:52,480 --> 00:29:53,920
Speaker 1: can't do that with gold, you can't do it with

627
00:29:53,920 --> 00:29:56,240
Speaker 1: your stocks, and so we can do with bitcoin.

628
00:29:56,280 --> 00:29:56,959
Speaker 3: And you should.

629
00:29:57,040 --> 00:29:59,280
Speaker 1: Now don't store it on an app on your phone

630
00:29:59,320 --> 00:30:01,280
Speaker 1: that can get half. What you want to do is

631
00:30:01,400 --> 00:30:04,760
Speaker 1: use a hardware device something like this treasure right here.

632
00:30:04,880 --> 00:30:07,320
Speaker 1: So basically your private key sits here. When you want

633
00:30:07,320 --> 00:30:09,400
Speaker 1: to do a transaction, you plug it into your computer,

634
00:30:09,600 --> 00:30:11,800
Speaker 1: sign the transaction. When you're done, you unplug it and

635
00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:14,080
Speaker 1: put it back into your safe. I've used Treasure for now,

636
00:30:14,120 --> 00:30:15,960
Speaker 1: I don't know six seven years, because I think it's

637
00:30:15,960 --> 00:30:18,040
Speaker 1: the easiest one to use. I've tried, I think pretty

638
00:30:18,120 --> 00:30:20,880
Speaker 1: much all of them. And it's also open source so

639
00:30:21,000 --> 00:30:24,480
Speaker 1: you can trust the code. And again it's easy. Why easy,

640
00:30:24,520 --> 00:30:26,840
Speaker 1: Because if it's too complex, it makes me think of

641
00:30:26,880 --> 00:30:29,360
Speaker 1: how many potential holes and risk there could be, not

642
00:30:29,440 --> 00:30:31,480
Speaker 1: just in the device itself, but even in my own

643
00:30:31,520 --> 00:30:33,880
Speaker 1: ability to secure it. So I want something fast, I

644
00:30:33,920 --> 00:30:36,320
Speaker 1: want something easy. I don't want something safe. That's why

645
00:30:36,320 --> 00:30:39,440
Speaker 1: I use Treasure. And if you don't use Treasure, use something.

646
00:30:39,520 --> 00:30:43,160
Speaker 1: Please get your bitcoin off the exchange, use a hardware

647
00:30:43,160 --> 00:30:45,880
Speaker 1: device to secure your private key, and if you like Treasure,

648
00:30:45,960 --> 00:30:48,680
Speaker 1: check out the link down below. What do you think

649
00:30:48,720 --> 00:30:51,680
Speaker 1: about somebody like Larry Fink who went on TV a

650
00:30:51,680 --> 00:30:55,840
Speaker 1: couple of weeks ago and said, hey, I I think

651
00:30:55,840 --> 00:30:58,040
Speaker 1: that bitcoin's a legit asset. Everyone should take another look

652
00:30:58,080 --> 00:31:00,000
Speaker 1: at it for example, right, and we've seen many examples

653
00:31:00,280 --> 00:31:03,040
Speaker 1: of that. Trump was just speaking about bitcoin and the

654
00:31:03,040 --> 00:31:05,880
Speaker 1: importance of bitcoin after a couple of years ago, seeing

655
00:31:05,880 --> 00:31:07,840
Speaker 1: that he thought it was a scam and whatever rate

656
00:31:09,760 --> 00:31:12,080
Speaker 1: are those people just changing their mind to jump on

657
00:31:12,120 --> 00:31:15,040
Speaker 1: the bandwagon providing a lip service. Does Larry Fink, you know,

658
00:31:15,200 --> 00:31:18,000
Speaker 1: just want to pump up his own book or do

659
00:31:18,040 --> 00:31:20,280
Speaker 1: you think it's possible that people can actually do research

660
00:31:20,280 --> 00:31:21,040
Speaker 1: and change their owner.

661
00:31:22,800 --> 00:31:26,280
Speaker 2: I think Larry has found something. I think Larry is

662
00:31:26,280 --> 00:31:29,600
Speaker 2: sincere in the interviews that you're referring to. I think

663
00:31:29,640 --> 00:31:32,920
Speaker 2: he has done an enormous amount of work that as

664
00:31:32,960 --> 00:31:35,880
Speaker 2: bitcoiners were not privy to, and I think he's got

665
00:31:36,160 --> 00:31:38,960
Speaker 2: a huge amount like a huge team around him with

666
00:31:39,080 --> 00:31:42,520
Speaker 2: really smart people who are giving him arguably the best information.

667
00:31:42,880 --> 00:31:45,280
Speaker 2: Now Wall Street are full of really smart guys. But

668
00:31:45,280 --> 00:31:48,120
Speaker 2: if you look at Larry Fink's genesis story, you realize

669
00:31:48,120 --> 00:31:49,800
Speaker 2: that he wanted to token ask the world back in

670
00:31:49,880 --> 00:31:53,320
Speaker 2: nineteen eighty and it started with residential mortgage backed securities.

671
00:31:53,680 --> 00:31:55,320
Speaker 2: Now I look at the work that he's doing with

672
00:31:55,360 --> 00:32:01,040
Speaker 2: the ETF and there's an opportunity for Larry to, I believe,

673
00:32:01,280 --> 00:32:04,960
Speaker 2: create the world's greatest investment product, which he tried to

674
00:32:04,960 --> 00:32:07,080
Speaker 2: do with the residential mortgage backed securities. That was an

675
00:32:07,120 --> 00:32:12,120
Speaker 2: attempt to tokenize real estate or real estate globally. That

676
00:32:12,200 --> 00:32:15,920
Speaker 2: led to a catastrophic failure in the GFC because, as

677
00:32:16,000 --> 00:32:19,160
Speaker 2: you and the prelude to that was you had the

678
00:32:19,200 --> 00:32:23,600
Speaker 2: investment banks wanting to monetize that product upfront and then

679
00:32:23,720 --> 00:32:28,480
Speaker 2: export the risk to main street and pension funds globally. Sadly,

680
00:32:29,160 --> 00:32:31,760
Speaker 2: this led to a credit boom, This led to the GFC.

681
00:32:31,840 --> 00:32:34,160
Speaker 2: But what happened with that credit boom and GFC was

682
00:32:34,960 --> 00:32:38,080
Speaker 2: there was an insatiable demand from Wall Street to create

683
00:32:38,120 --> 00:32:41,800
Speaker 2: more products of that mortgage back security then on sell it, however,

684
00:32:42,520 --> 00:32:45,400
Speaker 2: and that meant that the main street lenders had to

685
00:32:45,440 --> 00:32:47,840
Speaker 2: go out the risk curve to find poorer and poorer

686
00:32:47,920 --> 00:32:51,320
Speaker 2: quality borrowers to fulfill that need. And this is what

687
00:32:51,400 --> 00:32:53,520
Speaker 2: led to the ninja lines and no income, no job

688
00:32:53,560 --> 00:32:57,560
Speaker 2: applicant line fabulous. We loved it until we didn't. And

689
00:32:58,000 --> 00:33:01,160
Speaker 2: this is the problem is that Wall Street monetized it

690
00:33:01,400 --> 00:33:03,280
Speaker 2: and took all the profits and no risk, and they

691
00:33:03,320 --> 00:33:08,160
Speaker 2: exported all the risk. And then when the poor retail

692
00:33:08,160 --> 00:33:12,080
Speaker 2: borrower who couldn't afford a million dollar mortgage on the

693
00:33:12,080 --> 00:33:15,320
Speaker 2: salary of someone stacking shells led to the underpinning of

694
00:33:15,640 --> 00:33:19,720
Speaker 2: and the cascading of values across the world. Now I

695
00:33:19,760 --> 00:33:21,760
Speaker 2: look at that and I think what happens if we

696
00:33:21,920 --> 00:33:25,680
Speaker 2: get a principal protected note and Larry starts issuing that

697
00:33:25,720 --> 00:33:29,960
Speaker 2: where he marries up a five year US treasury with bitcoin,

698
00:33:30,520 --> 00:33:33,600
Speaker 2: and so you get a capital guaranteed note where they

699
00:33:33,600 --> 00:33:36,160
Speaker 2: issue a ten billion dollar note. Eight billion goes into

700
00:33:36,200 --> 00:33:39,160
Speaker 2: a five year treasury. That five year treasury grows from

701
00:33:39,160 --> 00:33:41,680
Speaker 2: eight billion to ten billion in the five years, and

702
00:33:41,720 --> 00:33:44,520
Speaker 2: then they get to then invest two billion dollars into bitcoin.

703
00:33:45,080 --> 00:33:47,360
Speaker 2: And that way, if you put in a million dollars,

704
00:33:47,400 --> 00:33:49,640
Speaker 2: the worst result you can achieve in five years is

705
00:33:49,640 --> 00:33:52,520
Speaker 2: five is your million dollars back. But this gives an

706
00:33:52,520 --> 00:33:55,960
Speaker 2: opportunity for Larry to effectively tokenize the world, and this

707
00:33:56,080 --> 00:33:58,200
Speaker 2: is ultimately what he wants, and he can achieve that

708
00:33:58,360 --> 00:34:02,680
Speaker 2: with US backed US government BACKDT and coupling that to Bitcoin,

709
00:34:03,000 --> 00:34:05,479
Speaker 2: both of which are risk free. And then that takes

710
00:34:05,560 --> 00:34:09,240
Speaker 2: all of the risk away from retail, retail investors, retail

711
00:34:09,239 --> 00:34:11,840
Speaker 2: moms and dads, and it puts it firmly and squarely

712
00:34:11,920 --> 00:34:13,920
Speaker 2: on the shoulders of the two risk free assets in

713
00:34:13,920 --> 00:34:16,680
Speaker 2: the world that we've got, which is US government treasuries

714
00:34:17,040 --> 00:34:17,640
Speaker 2: and bitcoin.

715
00:34:17,840 --> 00:34:22,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, a small business owner, are you buried in all

716
00:34:22,640 --> 00:34:24,920
Speaker 1: types of work keeping you from the real thing that

717
00:34:24,960 --> 00:34:27,600
Speaker 1: makes you money. Well, that's where just works comes in.

718
00:34:27,600 --> 00:34:30,640
Speaker 1: They're the all in one platform that supports small business growth.

719
00:34:30,840 --> 00:34:32,000
Speaker 3: You can get all.

720
00:34:31,800 --> 00:34:35,040
Speaker 1: Their tools that help with benefits like payroll and HR

721
00:34:35,120 --> 00:34:39,160
Speaker 1: and compliance with transparent pricing. Now they help you hire

722
00:34:39,200 --> 00:34:43,880
Speaker 1: top talent internationally, internew markets, quickly scale international operations without

723
00:34:43,920 --> 00:34:46,120
Speaker 1: the workload, and for every how.

724
00:34:46,000 --> 00:34:46,960
Speaker 3: Do I do it? Question?

725
00:34:47,160 --> 00:34:49,480
Speaker 1: You can reach out to their expert staff from sole

726
00:34:49,560 --> 00:34:50,800
Speaker 1: proprietor or.

727
00:34:50,760 --> 00:34:51,560
Speaker 3: A team of twenty.

728
00:34:51,960 --> 00:34:55,560
Speaker 1: Just Works empowers all kinds of small businesses with real

729
00:34:55,640 --> 00:34:59,880
Speaker 1: human support. So visit justwors dot com slash podcast to

730
00:35:00,000 --> 00:35:02,640
Speaker 1: and joined the thousands of small businesses that trust just

731
00:35:02,719 --> 00:35:06,239
Speaker 1: Works to take care of payroll, benefits, compliance and more.

732
00:35:06,280 --> 00:35:09,920
Speaker 1: Again that's Justworks dot com slash podcast.

733
00:35:11,320 --> 00:35:11,760
Speaker 3: I agree.

734
00:35:11,800 --> 00:35:14,200
Speaker 1: I mean when I listened to Larry Fink, he doesn't

735
00:35:14,239 --> 00:35:15,759
Speaker 1: just say, oh I like it, you should buy it.

736
00:35:15,960 --> 00:35:19,320
Speaker 1: He gives the reasons, like the mechanisms, the supply demand mechanisms,

737
00:35:19,320 --> 00:35:21,759
Speaker 1: of why it makes sense, of what it protects you from,

738
00:35:21,840 --> 00:35:24,000
Speaker 1: of why it goes up. And so to me, that

739
00:35:24,080 --> 00:35:27,520
Speaker 1: gives me like a level I think he shows demonstrates

740
00:35:27,560 --> 00:35:29,400
Speaker 1: that he has a level of understanding about it, not

741
00:35:29,440 --> 00:35:31,840
Speaker 1: just lip service. I think it's crazy for people to

742
00:35:31,880 --> 00:35:33,839
Speaker 1: think that you just can't change your mind. I mean,

743
00:35:34,080 --> 00:35:36,280
Speaker 1: the smartest people in the world change their mind, probably

744
00:35:36,320 --> 00:35:38,719
Speaker 1: the most right. I think a sign of intelligence is

745
00:35:39,120 --> 00:35:41,239
Speaker 1: how quickly you can change your mind based off of

746
00:35:41,280 --> 00:35:42,879
Speaker 1: new information that you've received.

747
00:35:43,520 --> 00:35:44,200
Speaker 3: So it.

748
00:35:46,120 --> 00:35:47,759
Speaker 1: It never ceases to amaze me. And I suppose this

749
00:35:47,800 --> 00:35:50,080
Speaker 1: is an example of how closed minded some people are.

750
00:35:50,239 --> 00:35:52,719
Speaker 1: It's like, oh, but he said that five years ago.

751
00:35:53,640 --> 00:35:56,279
Speaker 2: Well, I think credit to Larry. He has done a

752
00:35:56,280 --> 00:35:59,360
Speaker 2: great job in changing tackle that. I think it's very difficult.

753
00:35:59,560 --> 00:36:01,839
Speaker 2: One of the touring points he most recently made where

754
00:36:01,880 --> 00:36:06,040
Speaker 2: I genuinely feel like he understands the problem. I haven't

755
00:36:06,120 --> 00:36:09,080
Speaker 2: heard him talking about debasement of the dollar now. He

756
00:36:09,120 --> 00:36:11,799
Speaker 2: talked about the devisement of the dollar in America. He

757
00:36:11,840 --> 00:36:14,080
Speaker 2: talked about the de basement of dollars around the world.

758
00:36:14,440 --> 00:36:18,359
Speaker 2: He clearly understands the problem of the money printing and

759
00:36:18,400 --> 00:36:21,360
Speaker 2: how bitcoin solves it. So hats off to Larry, like

760
00:36:21,480 --> 00:36:23,920
Speaker 2: one of the smartest people in the world and arguably

761
00:36:23,960 --> 00:36:24,800
Speaker 2: the greatest salesman.

762
00:36:25,239 --> 00:36:27,279
Speaker 1: Now getting back to the question that kind of that

763
00:36:27,640 --> 00:36:29,600
Speaker 1: led into this, which was I was just asking sort

764
00:36:29,600 --> 00:36:31,239
Speaker 1: of you had made a statement that it's the best

765
00:36:31,280 --> 00:36:34,120
Speaker 1: performing asset, and so again I said it's the best.

766
00:36:34,160 --> 00:36:36,399
Speaker 1: It has been the best performing. Let's think about the

767
00:36:36,400 --> 00:36:39,600
Speaker 1: forward projection of this. Michael Saylor laid out some math

768
00:36:40,440 --> 00:36:42,399
Speaker 1: which we're going to link to Michael Sailor's interview down

769
00:36:42,840 --> 00:36:45,680
Speaker 1: the presentation down below at the Bitcoin Conference in twenty

770
00:36:45,680 --> 00:36:49,360
Speaker 1: twenty four. It's certainly worth a watch. And Michael Saylor

771
00:36:49,400 --> 00:36:51,440
Speaker 1: sort of laid out this twenty one year projection and

772
00:36:51,480 --> 00:36:54,560
Speaker 1: he gave sort of three price models bear, bear, medium,

773
00:36:54,560 --> 00:36:55,600
Speaker 1: and bowl or whatever it was.

774
00:36:56,560 --> 00:36:57,640
Speaker 3: I thought it was pretty good.

775
00:37:00,400 --> 00:37:03,640
Speaker 1: Certainly might be conservative on the barecase over aggressive on

776
00:37:03,640 --> 00:37:06,000
Speaker 1: the ballcase. I don't know, you think maybe the math

777
00:37:06,080 --> 00:37:08,040
Speaker 1: might be a little bit off. Maybe where do you

778
00:37:08,120 --> 00:37:10,840
Speaker 1: think the math is when you're looking at the projection?

779
00:37:10,960 --> 00:37:11,120
Speaker 3: Right?

780
00:37:11,160 --> 00:37:13,400
Speaker 1: So this is where a lot of people get things wrong. Right, So,

781
00:37:13,440 --> 00:37:16,120
Speaker 1: when you're investing your money, like I always tell people, like,

782
00:37:16,560 --> 00:37:19,120
Speaker 1: you need to know what you're expecting when you get

783
00:37:19,120 --> 00:37:20,120
Speaker 1: in right, Where do.

784
00:37:20,080 --> 00:37:22,239
Speaker 3: I think it can go over what time frame? What

785
00:37:22,280 --> 00:37:23,880
Speaker 3: are my risks? You have a plan for that.

786
00:37:24,320 --> 00:37:27,080
Speaker 1: So if you're advising your high net worth individuals on

787
00:37:27,120 --> 00:37:29,480
Speaker 1: buying bitcoin, where do you lay that out? How do

788
00:37:29,520 --> 00:37:30,279
Speaker 1: you project that out?

789
00:37:31,160 --> 00:37:33,279
Speaker 2: I think it comes down to a whiting to start with.

790
00:37:33,400 --> 00:37:36,600
Speaker 2: So you need to understand what the risk profile is,

791
00:37:36,640 --> 00:37:40,399
Speaker 2: to understand what they can and can't sleep with. So

792
00:37:40,520 --> 00:37:43,840
Speaker 2: I urge any client to invest however much they can

793
00:37:44,080 --> 00:37:47,719
Speaker 2: invest without losing any sleep. Now, I typically start that

794
00:37:47,760 --> 00:37:52,280
Speaker 2: conversation at ten percent. For families, that's an inconsequential amount

795
00:37:52,320 --> 00:37:55,880
Speaker 2: of wealth. It's embarrassing if they lose it, but it

796
00:37:55,920 --> 00:37:58,239
Speaker 2: doesn't change anything in their life. It doesn't change where

797
00:37:58,280 --> 00:38:00,759
Speaker 2: the holiday, where the kids go to school, where they live.

798
00:38:01,239 --> 00:38:02,160
Speaker 2: Nothing changes now.

799
00:38:02,239 --> 00:38:03,000
Speaker 3: Just real quick.

800
00:38:03,160 --> 00:38:06,960
Speaker 1: So ten percent, Now, I could put one hundred percent

801
00:38:07,000 --> 00:38:09,080
Speaker 1: of my wealth in and have a ten percent stop loss.

802
00:38:09,120 --> 00:38:11,319
Speaker 1: It's only risking ten percent. Or I could put ten

803
00:38:11,360 --> 00:38:12,839
Speaker 1: percent of my wealth in and have a zero percent

804
00:38:12,840 --> 00:38:16,120
Speaker 1: stop loss. So I'm just curious on that because the

805
00:38:16,239 --> 00:38:19,840
Speaker 1: chance of Big one going to zero is highly unlikely.

806
00:38:19,880 --> 00:38:22,719
Speaker 1: I mean it's not even probable, right, It could draw

807
00:38:22,800 --> 00:38:25,640
Speaker 1: down fifty or seventy five percent. So if they put

808
00:38:25,680 --> 00:38:28,280
Speaker 1: ten percent in lost half of that, that's.

809
00:38:28,160 --> 00:38:29,320
Speaker 3: Kind of inconsequential.

810
00:38:29,800 --> 00:38:32,879
Speaker 2: I agree, And this is where it's a long game

811
00:38:33,200 --> 00:38:35,800
Speaker 2: and people take a long time to understand it. Because

812
00:38:36,080 --> 00:38:38,480
Speaker 2: as simple as it is, twenty one million and that's

813
00:38:38,480 --> 00:38:40,879
Speaker 2: all I really need to understand. There are so many

814
00:38:40,880 --> 00:38:42,880
Speaker 2: other factors that they need to understand in order to

815
00:38:42,880 --> 00:38:46,840
Speaker 2: get comfortable with putting in additional capital. We like clients

816
00:38:46,880 --> 00:38:48,640
Speaker 2: to hold the underlying because we think that's going to

817
00:38:48,680 --> 00:38:52,040
Speaker 2: create the greatest optionality moving forward. And we try and

818
00:38:52,120 --> 00:38:54,240
Speaker 2: veer away from ETFs and the rest of it, because

819
00:38:54,440 --> 00:38:57,760
Speaker 2: if you want maximum optionality, you want to hold the underlying. Now,

820
00:38:58,800 --> 00:39:02,279
Speaker 2: a ten percent allocation drops fifty percent. I always tell

821
00:39:02,280 --> 00:39:05,160
Speaker 2: my clients, now, whatever you put in and you make

822
00:39:05,160 --> 00:39:07,920
Speaker 2: that initial purchase, just be sure to understand that this

823
00:39:07,920 --> 00:39:10,520
Speaker 2: could drop fifty percent tomorrow, and then I'm going to

824
00:39:10,520 --> 00:39:12,680
Speaker 2: come back and ask you for another ten percent to

825
00:39:12,760 --> 00:39:14,640
Speaker 2: put in the next day when it's dropped fifty percent,

826
00:39:14,680 --> 00:39:17,719
Speaker 2: so we can dollar cost average into it now on

827
00:39:17,760 --> 00:39:21,319
Speaker 2: a new investment. I haven't met a client yet who says,

828
00:39:21,360 --> 00:39:23,600
Speaker 2: you know what, that's a great idea, here's my money,

829
00:39:23,680 --> 00:39:25,960
Speaker 2: let's do it. It takes a long time. It's takes

830
00:39:26,040 --> 00:39:28,960
Speaker 2: a lot of education to get a client comfortable with

831
00:39:29,160 --> 00:39:32,720
Speaker 2: a serious allocation. By serious, I mean anything over five percent.

832
00:39:35,440 --> 00:39:37,640
Speaker 1: And that's a really good point that I'll just hit

833
00:39:37,680 --> 00:39:38,800
Speaker 1: on for a second. I want to get back to

834
00:39:38,800 --> 00:39:40,920
Speaker 1: the price predictions. But just hit on that for a second,

835
00:39:40,960 --> 00:39:44,800
Speaker 1: which is for these high net worth individuals, family offices

836
00:39:44,800 --> 00:39:48,680
Speaker 1: and institutions to make a move, it doesn't happen quickly. Yeah,

837
00:39:49,280 --> 00:39:51,400
Speaker 1: there's big numbers, there's a lot of information they have

838
00:39:51,400 --> 00:39:52,840
Speaker 1: to take in, there's a lot of education they have

839
00:39:52,880 --> 00:39:55,319
Speaker 1: to overcome, and a lot of times there's a lot

840
00:39:55,320 --> 00:39:58,640
Speaker 1: of decision makers that have to be involved in this, right,

841
00:39:58,960 --> 00:40:00,640
Speaker 1: And I just want to hit that point. Wait, because

842
00:40:01,000 --> 00:40:04,000
Speaker 1: you know, with what's happened in the ETFs and black Rock,

843
00:40:04,120 --> 00:40:06,839
Speaker 1: and you know now President's talking about it, a lot

844
00:40:06,840 --> 00:40:09,640
Speaker 1: of questions might be we'll WHI aren't more people buying then,

845
00:40:10,040 --> 00:40:12,839
Speaker 1: and I would say they are, or more specifically, they're

846
00:40:12,880 --> 00:40:17,600
Speaker 1: getting ready to correct. Just as an antidotal piece of information.

847
00:40:17,719 --> 00:40:19,120
Speaker 1: In twenty twenty one, I went and spent the year

848
00:40:19,160 --> 00:40:22,120
Speaker 1: in Puerto Rico. In Puerto Rico sort of this Galt's gulch,

849
00:40:22,200 --> 00:40:24,160
Speaker 1: where like all the rich people are moving over there, right,

850
00:40:24,520 --> 00:40:28,200
Speaker 1: and my friends over there were some of the some

851
00:40:28,520 --> 00:40:30,120
Speaker 1: very very I'm not going to name drop them, but

852
00:40:30,320 --> 00:40:34,520
Speaker 1: very very influential, like hedge fund managers and like very

853
00:40:34,640 --> 00:40:39,439
Speaker 1: very established investors, you know, billion dollar funds, et cetera.

854
00:40:40,520 --> 00:40:42,560
Speaker 1: One of my probably best friends over there at the time.

855
00:40:44,320 --> 00:40:47,680
Speaker 1: He he doesn't believe in bitcoin.

856
00:40:48,560 --> 00:40:49,240
Speaker 3: He's a trader.

857
00:40:50,280 --> 00:40:54,520
Speaker 1: He's a very well known name, super brilliant, like amazingly brilliant.

858
00:40:54,840 --> 00:40:57,000
Speaker 1: And he bought bitcoin at like eighteen thousand in the fund,

859
00:40:57,120 --> 00:40:59,160
Speaker 1: sold it at like forty five thousand, like crushed it

860
00:40:59,200 --> 00:41:01,160
Speaker 1: for his fund, right, But he just is like, no,

861
00:41:01,280 --> 00:41:03,560
Speaker 1: I just whatever, Like I kind of like Monaro makes

862
00:41:03,600 --> 00:41:05,839
Speaker 1: sense because it's private, but like not Bitcoin whatever. He's

863
00:41:05,880 --> 00:41:07,440
Speaker 1: like to me, it's just a trading toy. That's always

864
00:41:07,480 --> 00:41:10,799
Speaker 1: been his approach to it. That being said, about a

865
00:41:10,800 --> 00:41:13,480
Speaker 1: month ago I talked to him and he's been out

866
00:41:13,480 --> 00:41:14,920
Speaker 1: since it was there in the forty five forty eight

867
00:41:14,960 --> 00:41:17,120
Speaker 1: thousand range or whatever. About a month ago he said,

868
00:41:18,040 --> 00:41:20,880
Speaker 1: Bitcoin is now the single largest position my fund has.

869
00:41:20,880 --> 00:41:23,160
Speaker 3: Amazing And I said why.

870
00:41:24,000 --> 00:41:25,680
Speaker 1: And it's not because all of a sudden he believes

871
00:41:25,680 --> 00:41:28,640
Speaker 1: in it. He's a trader, he said. If you knew

872
00:41:28,680 --> 00:41:32,040
Speaker 1: the amount of billionaires that have called me and asked

873
00:41:32,080 --> 00:41:34,920
Speaker 1: me how they can get into this and secure it

874
00:41:35,000 --> 00:41:37,279
Speaker 1: for a long period of time because of the craziness

875
00:41:37,280 --> 00:41:39,320
Speaker 1: of what's going on in the world, you would understand

876
00:41:39,360 --> 00:41:42,480
Speaker 1: why I'm so bullish, and so I just say that

877
00:41:42,600 --> 00:41:44,919
Speaker 1: story just to say, like, we do have all these

878
00:41:44,960 --> 00:41:47,000
Speaker 1: people that are trying to get in to the point

879
00:41:47,000 --> 00:41:48,600
Speaker 1: that you're making. Right, there's a lot of education have

880
00:41:48,640 --> 00:41:52,400
Speaker 1: to overcome. It's coming. Would you say that's fair? Is

881
00:41:52,400 --> 00:41:53,880
Speaker 1: that kind of what you've seen in your own experience?

882
00:41:53,960 --> 00:41:57,160
Speaker 2: Absolutely, And this is the only asset that is ex legal,

883
00:41:57,800 --> 00:42:00,680
Speaker 2: So it's outside of the purview all the US government.

884
00:42:00,880 --> 00:42:03,759
Speaker 2: It's beyond they touch. It's about the only thing that

885
00:42:03,800 --> 00:42:06,920
Speaker 2: can be other than physical gold and physical goal. We

886
00:42:07,040 --> 00:42:08,480
Speaker 2: all now has its on constraints.

887
00:42:09,080 --> 00:42:11,080
Speaker 1: Okay, so let's get back to the price prediction. So

888
00:42:11,160 --> 00:42:13,120
Speaker 1: Michael Saylor sort of laid out this twenty one year

889
00:42:13,200 --> 00:42:15,400
Speaker 1: plan by twenty forty five, and it would have a

890
00:42:15,920 --> 00:42:19,520
Speaker 1: base case of thirteen million or sorry, let's start with

891
00:42:19,520 --> 00:42:22,399
Speaker 1: a barecase of three million dollars per bitcoin, a base

892
00:42:22,440 --> 00:42:25,399
Speaker 1: case of thirteen million dollars per bitcoin, and a bowl

893
00:42:25,480 --> 00:42:29,000
Speaker 1: case of forty nine million dollars per bitcoin. I thought,

894
00:42:29,360 --> 00:42:31,880
Speaker 1: you know, it was thoughtful. He said that right now

895
00:42:31,920 --> 00:42:35,279
Speaker 1: currently bitcoins had a compoundent and a growth rate of

896
00:42:35,320 --> 00:42:37,360
Speaker 1: about one fifty but right now we're having about a

897
00:42:37,400 --> 00:42:41,440
Speaker 1: fifty five percent ar and he says, you know this,

898
00:42:41,560 --> 00:42:44,920
Speaker 1: this decelerates fifty to forty five, thirty whatever and finally

899
00:42:44,920 --> 00:42:47,440
Speaker 1: stabilizes around twenty, which is about double what the S

900
00:42:47,480 --> 00:42:49,520
Speaker 1: and P five hundred is. Now, you've mentioned the scarcity

901
00:42:49,560 --> 00:42:53,480
Speaker 1: many times. Double the S and P five hundred like

902
00:42:53,920 --> 00:42:58,759
Speaker 1: that seems super ultra conservative to me. But you think

903
00:42:58,760 --> 00:43:02,120
Speaker 1: maybe some of those numbers are off just a little.

904
00:43:02,680 --> 00:43:06,440
Speaker 2: And I think we all love Michael Saylor. I think

905
00:43:06,480 --> 00:43:08,040
Speaker 2: he's Bitcoin's greatest proponent.

906
00:43:08,360 --> 00:43:10,880
Speaker 3: We're all lane, none of us know the future. We

907
00:43:10,920 --> 00:43:11,200
Speaker 3: don't know.

908
00:43:11,480 --> 00:43:14,680
Speaker 2: That's true, But just if you look at his work

909
00:43:14,680 --> 00:43:17,239
Speaker 2: in there, one of his final comments in that speech was,

910
00:43:17,440 --> 00:43:20,239
Speaker 2: we have a thousand X from here now. The price

911
00:43:20,239 --> 00:43:22,839
Speaker 2: at sixty five thousand dollars on the day, give or take,

912
00:43:23,280 --> 00:43:25,680
Speaker 2: would mean where we've got a sixty five million dollar

913
00:43:25,719 --> 00:43:29,680
Speaker 2: bitcoin coming, not a forty nine. So I think Michael

914
00:43:29,840 --> 00:43:32,919
Speaker 2: would prefer to surprise to the upside as opposed to

915
00:43:32,960 --> 00:43:35,000
Speaker 2: put a big number out there. Not that forty nine

916
00:43:35,040 --> 00:43:37,440
Speaker 2: is not a big number. But I think there's a

917
00:43:37,640 --> 00:43:41,080
Speaker 2: host of things that I disagree with fundamentally there. And

918
00:43:42,040 --> 00:43:43,600
Speaker 2: if I look at this, and I think probably the

919
00:43:43,680 --> 00:43:46,600
Speaker 2: lynch pin for something going substantially higher than what he

920
00:43:46,680 --> 00:43:49,280
Speaker 2: lays out is the fact that we haven't had someone

921
00:43:49,320 --> 00:43:52,239
Speaker 2: with a money printer being able to buy bitcoin yet,

922
00:43:52,360 --> 00:43:55,200
Speaker 2: no one has done that. When we have someone do that,

923
00:43:55,360 --> 00:44:00,239
Speaker 2: then that can dramatically shift that playing field for to

924
00:44:00,280 --> 00:44:03,520
Speaker 2: the significant upside. When the US Federal Reserve decides to

925
00:44:03,560 --> 00:44:06,560
Speaker 2: buy some and can have the ability to hold their

926
00:44:06,560 --> 00:44:08,799
Speaker 2: finger down on the money printer, they can buy a

927
00:44:08,840 --> 00:44:10,880
Speaker 2: limitless amount and set the floor at ten million, one

928
00:44:10,960 --> 00:44:13,560
Speaker 2: hundred million, whatever they want, and now all of a sudden,

929
00:44:13,560 --> 00:44:16,520
Speaker 2: we're in a completely new paradigm. So for me, it's

930
00:44:16,600 --> 00:44:19,040
Speaker 2: very difficult to argue with what Michael says, and I

931
00:44:19,080 --> 00:44:22,400
Speaker 2: think all of it's consistent and congruent thinking that I

932
00:44:22,440 --> 00:44:25,960
Speaker 2: agree with. The only X factor that changes it to

933
00:44:26,000 --> 00:44:29,600
Speaker 2: the upside, not the downside, is a government with a

934
00:44:29,600 --> 00:44:31,799
Speaker 2: money printer that gets involved and says we're going to

935
00:44:31,800 --> 00:44:32,320
Speaker 2: set the floor.

936
00:44:32,800 --> 00:44:34,520
Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean, I think that is maybe a little

937
00:44:34,560 --> 00:44:36,480
Speaker 1: bit baked into the cake in a sense, because you're

938
00:44:36,480 --> 00:44:38,759
Speaker 1: saying that it's projected to capture seven percent of the

939
00:44:38,760 --> 00:44:42,440
Speaker 1: world's assets, and so if you think about it, I mean, really,

940
00:44:42,480 --> 00:44:44,600
Speaker 1: we have this amount of assets, so I like to

941
00:44:44,640 --> 00:44:47,359
Speaker 1: think I laid out a case that there's like three

942
00:44:47,360 --> 00:44:49,760
Speaker 1: ways I would think about valueing bitcoin in the future.

943
00:44:49,800 --> 00:44:53,040
Speaker 1: So like the venture capital method. So like uber told

944
00:44:53,080 --> 00:44:55,640
Speaker 1: took money from taxis and limos and vans, So if

945
00:44:55,640 --> 00:44:57,839
Speaker 1: I got five percent from each of those, it's worth this, right,

946
00:44:57,880 --> 00:44:59,879
Speaker 1: And so then we can look at the total value

947
00:45:00,040 --> 00:45:02,560
Speaker 1: bitcoin could be pulling from. So Michael Sailor laid out

948
00:45:02,520 --> 00:45:05,680
Speaker 1: with nine hundred trillion dollars in assets effectively, so we

949
00:45:05,719 --> 00:45:08,680
Speaker 1: get seven percent of that for example, Right, I think

950
00:45:09,080 --> 00:45:12,120
Speaker 1: if if a sovereign were to buy it, it would

951
00:45:12,160 --> 00:45:17,919
Speaker 1: just get to that percentage of global assets faster. Right,

952
00:45:18,680 --> 00:45:20,880
Speaker 1: So I want to get back to that because of

953
00:45:20,920 --> 00:45:24,640
Speaker 1: what Trump's announcement was. But I also think about it

954
00:45:24,640 --> 00:45:27,200
Speaker 1: in the sense of not just if a government were

955
00:45:27,200 --> 00:45:29,239
Speaker 1: to buy it, but the rate of debasement that we're

956
00:45:29,239 --> 00:45:34,520
Speaker 1: facing in the future. So Michael Howell, in my opinion,

957
00:45:34,560 --> 00:45:38,880
Speaker 1: probably the best in mapping out global liquidity flows. And

958
00:45:38,960 --> 00:45:40,560
Speaker 1: so it's not just looking at what the FED balance

959
00:45:40,600 --> 00:45:42,600
Speaker 1: sheet is, but the major central banks of the world.

960
00:45:43,239 --> 00:45:45,160
Speaker 1: And you can see that the S and P five

961
00:45:45,239 --> 00:45:48,160
Speaker 1: hundred is basically moving in lockstep with the global liquidity. Yes,

962
00:45:48,200 --> 00:45:50,680
Speaker 1: so about twelve percent so it looks on paper you're

963
00:45:50,680 --> 00:45:53,480
Speaker 1: going up with your purchasing powers and growing. But bitcoin,

964
00:45:53,760 --> 00:45:57,080
Speaker 1: so gold has a one point four to nine sensitivity ratio.

965
00:45:57,120 --> 00:45:59,680
Speaker 1: So for every ten percent in liquidity, gold goes up

966
00:45:59,680 --> 00:46:02,360
Speaker 1: by four teen percent a little bit better. But bitcoin

967
00:46:02,440 --> 00:46:04,520
Speaker 1: has an eight point nine times since to be so

968
00:46:04,640 --> 00:46:06,680
Speaker 1: for every ten percent in liquidy, biccong goes up by

969
00:46:06,800 --> 00:46:09,760
Speaker 1: ninety percent. So you could just look at to the point,

970
00:46:09,840 --> 00:46:12,120
Speaker 1: you know, I guess if the central banks use debt,

971
00:46:12,440 --> 00:46:15,759
Speaker 1: but that expansion of the monetary base, and all we

972
00:46:15,800 --> 00:46:18,000
Speaker 1: have to do is look at the projections by the

973
00:46:18,040 --> 00:46:21,720
Speaker 1: government In the US, the Congressional Budget Office CBO tells

974
00:46:21,800 --> 00:46:25,040
Speaker 1: us what it's going to be by twenty fifty, right,

975
00:46:25,120 --> 00:46:27,000
Speaker 1: and so that's one way to look at it. So

976
00:46:27,200 --> 00:46:29,520
Speaker 1: not only could it capture seven percent of the world's assets,

977
00:46:30,000 --> 00:46:33,480
Speaker 1: but today they're at nine hundred trillion. Those assets could

978
00:46:33,560 --> 00:46:36,239
Speaker 1: be one point four quadrillion by the time it gets

979
00:46:36,239 --> 00:46:38,560
Speaker 1: set seven percent, and that's where it's probably undershot to

980
00:46:38,600 --> 00:46:39,239
Speaker 1: the downside.

981
00:46:39,280 --> 00:46:41,880
Speaker 2: That's it. And this is where I look at things

982
00:46:42,200 --> 00:46:46,040
Speaker 2: a little differently, in that if we look at the ultrawealthy,

983
00:46:46,120 --> 00:46:48,359
Speaker 2: we look at Alon, we look at Jeff Bezos. They

984
00:46:48,360 --> 00:46:50,880
Speaker 2: store their wealth in the companies that they own because

985
00:46:50,880 --> 00:46:53,080
Speaker 2: they've got the most control over it. I believe that

986
00:46:53,080 --> 00:46:57,879
Speaker 2: that has the most significant upside. They're not ninety nine

987
00:46:57,880 --> 00:47:00,560
Speaker 2: percent of their wealth would be stored in these assets

988
00:47:00,560 --> 00:47:03,200
Speaker 2: that they've built from the ground up. They're not spending

989
00:47:03,280 --> 00:47:05,880
Speaker 2: one hundred percent of their wealth perannum they would be

990
00:47:05,880 --> 00:47:08,040
Speaker 2: spending I would have thought zero point one of a

991
00:47:08,080 --> 00:47:11,839
Speaker 2: percent of the wealth parannum. That seems like a pretty

992
00:47:11,880 --> 00:47:15,520
Speaker 2: fair assessment what I look at. And this is where

993
00:47:15,560 --> 00:47:19,840
Speaker 2: I think bitcoin completely redefines this is this gives everyone

994
00:47:19,880 --> 00:47:23,040
Speaker 2: on Earth. It democratizes assets, and it gives everyone the

995
00:47:23,080 --> 00:47:26,000
Speaker 2: ability to be a Jeff Bezos or Elon Musk and

996
00:47:26,080 --> 00:47:29,800
Speaker 2: owned Tesla and Amazon themselves. It gives them a monetary

997
00:47:29,840 --> 00:47:34,640
Speaker 2: premium into the future that has no comparison in relative

998
00:47:34,719 --> 00:47:37,399
Speaker 2: terms from an investment perspective. And when you look at

999
00:47:37,400 --> 00:47:40,280
Speaker 2: that and understand that price is determined at the margin,

1000
00:47:40,920 --> 00:47:44,360
Speaker 2: we can have so much more capital stored in bitcoin.

1001
00:47:45,280 --> 00:47:48,839
Speaker 2: That's going to be in percentage terms, we could see

1002
00:47:48,880 --> 00:47:51,120
Speaker 2: ninety nine percent of the world's wealth stored in bitcoin

1003
00:47:51,480 --> 00:47:53,960
Speaker 2: and only one percent is for real world assets. Because

1004
00:47:54,000 --> 00:47:56,480
Speaker 2: people are going to want to have that premium of

1005
00:47:56,520 --> 00:47:59,200
Speaker 2: being able to move their value forward into the future

1006
00:47:59,320 --> 00:48:04,240
Speaker 2: for future person. So I'm probably the most bullish person

1007
00:48:04,239 --> 00:48:07,040
Speaker 2: when it comes to that because I understand the value

1008
00:48:07,040 --> 00:48:10,040
Speaker 2: of optionality into the future. And this is where bitcoin

1009
00:48:10,280 --> 00:48:12,560
Speaker 2: is the only asset that has that fight chuck.

1010
00:48:12,719 --> 00:48:15,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, Now, what's interesting with bitcoin is it started in

1011
00:48:15,640 --> 00:48:20,080
Speaker 1: the shadowy shadow supercoder world or whatever and sort of

1012
00:48:20,160 --> 00:48:22,440
Speaker 1: kind of spread to the people, right, a decentralized, bottom

1013
00:48:22,520 --> 00:48:25,000
Speaker 1: up approach, and so it was people, people people, and

1014
00:48:25,080 --> 00:48:27,839
Speaker 1: eventually it got to a government in l Salvador. But

1015
00:48:28,040 --> 00:48:31,040
Speaker 1: that's like probably still the bottom of the government level. Right.

1016
00:48:31,040 --> 00:48:33,640
Speaker 1: They're one of the poorest countries in the world. We're

1017
00:48:33,640 --> 00:48:35,040
Speaker 1: the most dangerous county in the world. Now one of

1018
00:48:35,080 --> 00:48:38,520
Speaker 1: the safest. They're turning around. But to that perspective, kind

1019
00:48:38,560 --> 00:48:40,440
Speaker 1: of a bottom up phenomenon.

1020
00:48:40,000 --> 00:48:42,960
Speaker 3: Yes, and Bukeley, President Bukeley.

1021
00:48:42,680 --> 00:48:44,279
Speaker 1: From L Salvador, has been around talking to a bunch

1022
00:48:44,280 --> 00:48:47,359
Speaker 1: of other government leaders, but other small government leaders about

1023
00:48:47,400 --> 00:48:49,840
Speaker 1: doing something like this, and so again a bottom up approach.

1024
00:48:50,440 --> 00:48:52,040
Speaker 1: I always thought the US would be sort of the

1025
00:48:52,120 --> 00:48:55,120
Speaker 1: last move advantage out of any country because of they

1026
00:48:55,120 --> 00:48:58,600
Speaker 1: have the dollar, they have the most to lose. So

1027
00:48:58,719 --> 00:49:01,879
Speaker 1: to see two two of three presidential candidates come out

1028
00:49:01,880 --> 00:49:04,919
Speaker 1: and announced that they would have a strategic reserve, trying

1029
00:49:04,920 --> 00:49:07,440
Speaker 1: to bring it kind of on par with gold as

1030
00:49:07,480 --> 00:49:10,000
Speaker 1: well as even if neither of them win. We also

1031
00:49:10,080 --> 00:49:13,040
Speaker 1: have Senator Loomis who put together a bill to do that.

1032
00:49:13,800 --> 00:49:16,360
Speaker 1: It seems that that switches from a bottom approach to

1033
00:49:16,400 --> 00:49:18,319
Speaker 1: a top down approach. I mean, back to game theory.

1034
00:49:18,360 --> 00:49:22,319
Speaker 1: If the US announces this, then I think all the

1035
00:49:22,360 --> 00:49:24,799
Speaker 1: other nations are sort of forced to react to that.

1036
00:49:25,320 --> 00:49:28,120
Speaker 1: Currently in the betting markets, Trump is favored to win

1037
00:49:28,239 --> 00:49:32,200
Speaker 1: by fifty six percent, and if he wins, I think

1038
00:49:32,200 --> 00:49:33,960
Speaker 1: he would probably do it, Like why wouldn't he?

1039
00:49:34,280 --> 00:49:36,480
Speaker 3: So that's basically.

1040
00:49:35,960 --> 00:49:39,000
Speaker 1: Giving us, at this point, per the betting markets, at

1041
00:49:39,080 --> 00:49:43,200
Speaker 1: fifty six percent, odds that the US will adopt this

1042
00:49:43,280 --> 00:49:47,839
Speaker 1: and other nations will be forced to I guess that's

1043
00:49:47,840 --> 00:49:49,880
Speaker 1: the way I read it, And I'm curious what your

1044
00:49:49,920 --> 00:49:53,759
Speaker 1: take is on that specifically, because we haven't really seen

1045
00:49:53,800 --> 00:49:56,320
Speaker 1: the price of bitcoin pump based off of that news.

1046
00:49:57,280 --> 00:50:00,520
Speaker 2: I think there is famal indecision in the USA voters

1047
00:50:00,760 --> 00:50:05,480
Speaker 2: mind than what the betting markets predict. I think Kamala

1048
00:50:05,640 --> 00:50:08,759
Speaker 2: Kamala Harris is a much bigger threat than people are

1049
00:50:08,760 --> 00:50:11,279
Speaker 2: making out. I think people are very dismissive of her,

1050
00:50:11,560 --> 00:50:13,760
Speaker 2: and I think the Republicans have got a huge amount

1051
00:50:13,760 --> 00:50:15,000
Speaker 2: of work to do if they want to win this.

1052
00:50:15,120 --> 00:50:18,440
Speaker 2: It's not a lay down like they know well, they'll

1053
00:50:18,440 --> 00:50:22,640
Speaker 2: have you believe that said, this puts an enormous amount

1054
00:50:22,640 --> 00:50:25,879
Speaker 2: of pressure on the rest of the world that they

1055
00:50:25,920 --> 00:50:28,719
Speaker 2: need to act really, really quickly, and we could be

1056
00:50:29,200 --> 00:50:31,680
Speaker 2: much closer to the suddenly part of the gradually then

1057
00:50:31,719 --> 00:50:35,920
Speaker 2: suddenly than we realize because you have two of the

1058
00:50:35,920 --> 00:50:39,360
Speaker 2: three presidential candidates making promises. I thought Robert F. Kennedy

1059
00:50:39,480 --> 00:50:43,160
Speaker 2: was absolutely brilliant. He showed a deep command and understanding

1060
00:50:43,200 --> 00:50:45,120
Speaker 2: of bitcoin on a very deep level, and had some

1061
00:50:45,160 --> 00:50:46,000
Speaker 2: great policies.

1062
00:50:46,520 --> 00:50:47,879
Speaker 3: He really had a good script writer for.

1063
00:50:47,840 --> 00:50:52,000
Speaker 2: Sure, phenomenal yes, and he delivered it well. Trump, on

1064
00:50:52,040 --> 00:50:53,960
Speaker 2: the other hand, he made a promise that that's all

1065
00:50:54,000 --> 00:50:56,440
Speaker 2: he needed to make. He said, Hey, I'm going to

1066
00:50:56,480 --> 00:50:58,960
Speaker 2: make sure we don't sell the bitcoin, and what's ironic,

1067
00:50:59,320 --> 00:51:03,759
Speaker 2: three days later US government sells thirty thousand bitcoin or

1068
00:51:03,760 --> 00:51:06,640
Speaker 2: whatever they've sold they've put to market. I want to

1069
00:51:06,640 --> 00:51:09,600
Speaker 2: see a competition between the Dems and the Republicans, who

1070
00:51:09,600 --> 00:51:12,560
Speaker 2: are the only two feasible candidates, and I want to

1071
00:51:12,560 --> 00:51:14,759
Speaker 2: see them fight for bitcoin. I want to see who

1072
00:51:14,840 --> 00:51:17,799
Speaker 2: can put together the most outrageous policy. But to me,

1073
00:51:18,000 --> 00:51:21,760
Speaker 2: what we saw in Nashville was enough to say, Okay, now,

1074
00:51:21,880 --> 00:51:25,000
Speaker 2: anyone dismissing bitcoin as that magic Internet money sort of

1075
00:51:25,120 --> 00:51:29,080
Speaker 2: really needs to have a look, go away, reassess, and

1076
00:51:29,120 --> 00:51:32,320
Speaker 2: realize that where at this we're standing at the forefront

1077
00:51:32,400 --> 00:51:34,960
Speaker 2: of global adoption on a government level.

1078
00:51:37,560 --> 00:51:39,680
Speaker 1: And you know, one thing about these types of things,

1079
00:51:40,200 --> 00:51:42,440
Speaker 1: when they tease a new tax thing and then it

1080
00:51:42,480 --> 00:51:44,760
Speaker 1: kind of goes away. They sort of are like seeding

1081
00:51:44,960 --> 00:51:47,960
Speaker 1: the future almost, if you will rate decensitazos to the future.

1082
00:51:48,120 --> 00:51:50,000
Speaker 1: And so even if this doesn't go through right now,

1083
00:51:50,040 --> 00:51:52,239
Speaker 1: it's the direction in which we're going. And so if

1084
00:51:52,239 --> 00:51:54,479
Speaker 1: you're a long term thinker, you should certainly be paying

1085
00:51:54,480 --> 00:51:58,160
Speaker 1: attention to these these signals right there. They're they're there,

1086
00:51:58,280 --> 00:52:00,799
Speaker 1: we're going in this direction. And I would imagine that

1087
00:52:01,120 --> 00:52:03,719
Speaker 1: even if Kamala wins, and even if the US doesn't

1088
00:52:03,760 --> 00:52:07,400
Speaker 1: go this direction now, other nations are probably paying attention

1089
00:52:07,440 --> 00:52:09,719
Speaker 1: to go, well, maybe we should try to front run that,

1090
00:52:10,800 --> 00:52:11,359
Speaker 1: would you say?

1091
00:52:11,400 --> 00:52:14,439
Speaker 2: So, it's the only logical thing to do. Yeah, there's

1092
00:52:14,480 --> 00:52:17,520
Speaker 2: only one way to Like, you can't win by not playing.

1093
00:52:18,000 --> 00:52:19,719
Speaker 2: You have to ender the field and you have to

1094
00:52:19,719 --> 00:52:23,239
Speaker 2: stop playing otherwise you completely lose. So I look at

1095
00:52:23,239 --> 00:52:26,880
Speaker 2: this and I think, effectively you've been gifted by the

1096
00:52:26,960 --> 00:52:30,800
Speaker 2: US government or their proxies in RFK, Junior and Trump

1097
00:52:31,560 --> 00:52:34,000
Speaker 2: an intent of what they are going to do. Yeah,

1098
00:52:34,120 --> 00:52:35,920
Speaker 2: if I was any other country with a money printer,

1099
00:52:36,440 --> 00:52:38,520
Speaker 2: the finger would be on the button now and I

1100
00:52:38,560 --> 00:52:40,440
Speaker 2: would be sating whatever.

1101
00:52:40,120 --> 00:52:42,160
Speaker 1: It is just a money printer though, right so right

1102
00:52:42,200 --> 00:52:44,080
Speaker 1: now we have like the rise of the bricks, and

1103
00:52:44,120 --> 00:52:47,280
Speaker 1: the bricks are deciding to recycle their profits their reserves

1104
00:52:47,320 --> 00:52:50,000
Speaker 1: not in back into US treasuries, but instead of gold. Yeah,

1105
00:52:50,120 --> 00:52:52,120
Speaker 1: you got to save it something. And so like, well,

1106
00:52:52,120 --> 00:52:53,840
Speaker 1: we don't trust US treasury Moore, after you've took in

1107
00:52:53,880 --> 00:52:56,200
Speaker 1: Russia's or whatever, like you're debasing, We're not going to

1108
00:52:56,239 --> 00:52:56,360
Speaker 1: do that.

1109
00:52:56,400 --> 00:52:57,080
Speaker 3: What is by gold?

1110
00:52:57,360 --> 00:52:59,160
Speaker 1: And so it's not to say a money printer, but

1111
00:52:59,200 --> 00:53:01,040
Speaker 1: like where do they say, and so they could certainly

1112
00:53:01,080 --> 00:53:06,920
Speaker 1: do that into bitcoin. Let's sort of transition this and

1113
00:53:07,160 --> 00:53:09,960
Speaker 1: as somebody who advises hang that worth individuals and families

1114
00:53:10,000 --> 00:53:12,399
Speaker 1: on how to get into this, just how can we

1115
00:53:13,160 --> 00:53:17,080
Speaker 1: generally advise the arden. So Michael Sailor lead out sort

1116
00:53:17,120 --> 00:53:18,920
Speaker 1: of what do you call it? A normy strategy, a

1117
00:53:18,960 --> 00:53:22,360
Speaker 1: ten percent, a bitcoin maximalist strategy, and a double and

1118
00:53:22,400 --> 00:53:27,640
Speaker 1: triple maxi strategy. So what would your normy, maximalist and

1119
00:53:27,680 --> 00:53:30,560
Speaker 1: triple maxi strategies be that you would advise somebody on.

1120
00:53:31,640 --> 00:53:33,719
Speaker 2: It really comes down to a personal preference. But I

1121
00:53:33,719 --> 00:53:36,560
Speaker 2: think you've got to start with an allocation that someone

1122
00:53:36,680 --> 00:53:41,040
Speaker 2: is comfortable or willing to lose. Now, this is counterintuitive,

1123
00:53:41,080 --> 00:53:45,279
Speaker 2: but people need to learn, and Bitcoin's made around for

1124
00:53:45,320 --> 00:53:50,640
Speaker 2: fifteen years. The belief that people will voluntarily learn about

1125
00:53:50,640 --> 00:53:53,399
Speaker 2: this new asset class and spend one hundred hours going

1126
00:53:53,440 --> 00:53:55,960
Speaker 2: down the rabbit hole and figuring things out, I think

1127
00:53:56,080 --> 00:53:58,360
Speaker 2: is a complete furfee that is not going to happen.

1128
00:53:58,800 --> 00:54:01,400
Speaker 2: What I would prefer to do as an advisor is

1129
00:54:01,760 --> 00:54:04,600
Speaker 2: walk clients to the deep end, tell them to buy

1130
00:54:04,880 --> 00:54:07,279
Speaker 2: ten percent, and literally push them in the deep end,

1131
00:54:07,600 --> 00:54:11,160
Speaker 2: and then ensure that there's a life raft, a stick,

1132
00:54:11,280 --> 00:54:12,839
Speaker 2: something to pull them out and make sure that they're

1133
00:54:12,840 --> 00:54:15,239
Speaker 2: not going to hurt themselves. Because once they're in the

1134
00:54:15,239 --> 00:54:17,799
Speaker 2: deep end and they're finding for their lives and trying

1135
00:54:17,840 --> 00:54:20,000
Speaker 2: to learn as much about it. They're incentivized now they

1136
00:54:20,000 --> 00:54:22,239
Speaker 2: have skin in the game to actually go down that

1137
00:54:22,320 --> 00:54:24,680
Speaker 2: rabbit hole and start learning about it. And once they

1138
00:54:24,760 --> 00:54:27,279
Speaker 2: learn about it, they're going to apply more capital to it.

1139
00:54:27,360 --> 00:54:32,160
Speaker 2: So I think the more capital you can get someone

1140
00:54:32,239 --> 00:54:35,680
Speaker 2: to allocate at the beginning, the bigger they're incentive to learn.

1141
00:54:35,880 --> 00:54:39,000
Speaker 2: The faster they learn, the more bitcoin they'll end up having.

1142
00:54:39,160 --> 00:54:42,279
Speaker 2: And so I think the saying from GG is the

1143
00:54:42,280 --> 00:54:44,319
Speaker 2: more you know, the more you buy. Yeah, And so

1144
00:54:44,800 --> 00:54:46,960
Speaker 2: in order to get them to that stage, though, you

1145
00:54:47,080 --> 00:54:50,560
Speaker 2: just need to effectively create a safe sandbox or a

1146
00:54:51,000 --> 00:54:53,799
Speaker 2: safe place for them to invest as much capital as

1147
00:54:53,800 --> 00:54:55,759
Speaker 2: they can where they're not going to get wrecked. They're

1148
00:54:55,800 --> 00:54:57,480
Speaker 2: not going to pay tuition fees, they're not going to

1149
00:54:57,480 --> 00:55:00,279
Speaker 2: get scammed out of bitcoin, they're not going to have

1150
00:55:00,360 --> 00:55:02,800
Speaker 2: someone Robert or altatively send it to the wrong address.

1151
00:55:03,280 --> 00:55:06,920
Speaker 2: That is something that you can't do with more than

1152
00:55:06,920 --> 00:55:09,640
Speaker 2: one or two percent of someone's capital. You can't have

1153
00:55:09,680 --> 00:55:13,560
Speaker 2: an a tuition fee payable of more than two percent.

1154
00:55:13,600 --> 00:55:17,000
Speaker 2: To me, is even one percent is unacceptable. But it's

1155
00:55:17,000 --> 00:55:18,880
Speaker 2: a great lesson for the rest of your capital and

1156
00:55:18,920 --> 00:55:22,160
Speaker 2: investment decisions moving forward. So I think and what we

1157
00:55:22,239 --> 00:55:25,040
Speaker 2: try to do is create a safe framework for owning

1158
00:55:25,040 --> 00:55:28,400
Speaker 2: the underlying asset so that clients can put in fifty

1159
00:55:28,480 --> 00:55:31,680
Speaker 2: eighty percent of their capital if they was so wish to,

1160
00:55:32,160 --> 00:55:33,879
Speaker 2: in a safe way that they're never going to lose

1161
00:55:33,880 --> 00:55:36,720
Speaker 2: their bitcoin, and to me, the preservation of their bitcoin,

1162
00:55:36,760 --> 00:55:38,239
Speaker 2: and back to that thing that we talked about at

1163
00:55:38,280 --> 00:55:41,240
Speaker 2: the start, that the return of capital, not the return

1164
00:55:41,280 --> 00:55:44,960
Speaker 2: on capital, is the most critical component. Having that custody

1165
00:55:45,000 --> 00:55:47,840
Speaker 2: self custody down is arguably the most important thing you

1166
00:55:47,880 --> 00:55:49,640
Speaker 2: can do when it comes to bitcoin.

1167
00:55:49,800 --> 00:55:52,440
Speaker 1: So what are the steps to that preservation of bitcoin

1168
00:55:52,480 --> 00:55:54,960
Speaker 1: the custody self custody that they need to be aware of.

1169
00:55:55,640 --> 00:55:57,279
Speaker 2: I think you want to make sure that you have

1170
00:55:57,440 --> 00:55:59,879
Speaker 2: got that in a way that removes every single point

1171
00:55:59,880 --> 00:56:02,400
Speaker 2: of failure, So you can't have a single point of

1172
00:56:02,400 --> 00:56:06,520
Speaker 2: failure in your custody setup. To me, having a single SEK.

1173
00:56:06,840 --> 00:56:09,040
Speaker 2: A lot of people talk about, hey, let's buy a

1174
00:56:09,080 --> 00:56:12,400
Speaker 2: hardware wallet, put all your bitcoin on that, and it's

1175
00:56:13,120 --> 00:56:15,759
Speaker 2: not your keys, not your cheese, so to speak to me,

1176
00:56:15,880 --> 00:56:18,400
Speaker 2: that represents a single point of failure because what happens

1177
00:56:18,440 --> 00:56:21,440
Speaker 2: if something happens to that device, or alternatively, what happens

1178
00:56:21,440 --> 00:56:24,480
Speaker 2: if something happens to you, who is going to access that?

1179
00:56:24,719 --> 00:56:28,040
Speaker 2: So how we think about preserving that bitcoin is ensuring

1180
00:56:28,040 --> 00:56:31,000
Speaker 2: that we remove every single point of failure from everything

1181
00:56:31,520 --> 00:56:34,959
Speaker 2: in that client's bitcoin life. So that means ensuring there's

1182
00:56:34,960 --> 00:56:37,279
Speaker 2: no single point of failure from themselves, no single point

1183
00:56:37,320 --> 00:56:39,840
Speaker 2: of failure from us, no single point of failure from

1184
00:56:40,080 --> 00:56:43,160
Speaker 2: their multi seak provider. We want to have multiple options

1185
00:56:43,239 --> 00:56:46,680
Speaker 2: for everything in place. And one thing that I've had,

1186
00:56:47,080 --> 00:56:49,640
Speaker 2: I guess a very unique experience of is going through

1187
00:56:49,680 --> 00:56:52,400
Speaker 2: three probates now with clients. We've been doing this for

1188
00:56:52,920 --> 00:56:55,120
Speaker 2: the family office side of things for the last eight years.

1189
00:56:55,560 --> 00:56:58,880
Speaker 2: We've sadly had three of our clients pass away. But

1190
00:56:59,160 --> 00:57:03,160
Speaker 2: I can tell you and something I'm very proud of

1191
00:57:03,200 --> 00:57:06,759
Speaker 2: that with the collaborative security protocol that we implemented for them,

1192
00:57:07,120 --> 00:57:09,840
Speaker 2: they were self custing, they had full control, full autonomy.

1193
00:57:10,280 --> 00:57:12,919
Speaker 2: But when that day came that they were no longer here,

1194
00:57:13,239 --> 00:57:16,240
Speaker 2: there was a seamless transition to their beneficiaries. And this

1195
00:57:16,440 --> 00:57:19,360
Speaker 2: is where when you start storing significant amounts of wealth

1196
00:57:19,520 --> 00:57:23,640
Speaker 2: in bitcoin, this becomes a significant issue that needs solving.

1197
00:57:23,880 --> 00:57:26,200
Speaker 2: And so the way we get round. That is to

1198
00:57:26,840 --> 00:57:30,720
Speaker 2: have a collaborative security protocol. We hold one off the

1199
00:57:30,720 --> 00:57:32,800
Speaker 2: three keys for the client. The client holds a key

1200
00:57:32,840 --> 00:57:35,680
Speaker 2: and the multi sea provider holds a key, and then

1201
00:57:35,880 --> 00:57:39,120
Speaker 2: couple that with advice, training and education around how to

1202
00:57:39,160 --> 00:57:43,080
Speaker 2: actually move and use that bitcoin. And one of the

1203
00:57:43,120 --> 00:57:45,360
Speaker 2: key pieces that I think is really important for anyone

1204
00:57:45,400 --> 00:57:48,640
Speaker 2: with a bitcoin setup is to have an estate planned

1205
00:57:48,640 --> 00:57:52,880
Speaker 2: protocol dedicated to the physical recovery if your bitcoin, because

1206
00:57:53,040 --> 00:57:56,400
Speaker 2: if you don't have that in place, there's no legal recourse,

1207
00:57:56,440 --> 00:57:59,400
Speaker 2: there's no mandate, no legal decree that the government can

1208
00:57:59,440 --> 00:58:03,200
Speaker 2: mandate the transfer of your bitcoin from the protocol to

1209
00:58:03,280 --> 00:58:06,280
Speaker 2: your as So unless you have the pragmatic recovery of

1210
00:58:06,320 --> 00:58:10,560
Speaker 2: your bitcoin lockdown, the legal framework for the recovery is

1211
00:58:10,560 --> 00:58:11,400
Speaker 2: a bit point.

1212
00:58:12,440 --> 00:58:16,200
Speaker 1: So collaborative custody. So instead of having one single key,

1213
00:58:16,240 --> 00:58:18,440
Speaker 1: I have three keys. Two of the three have to

1214
00:58:18,480 --> 00:58:20,880
Speaker 1: be present to sign the transaction to move the bitcoin.

1215
00:58:21,520 --> 00:58:24,360
Speaker 1: But in a collaborative custody I don't keep all three keys.

1216
00:58:24,400 --> 00:58:26,840
Speaker 1: I only keep one of them, and I use other people,

1217
00:58:26,920 --> 00:58:30,160
Speaker 1: for example your company and another company to hold those keys.

1218
00:58:30,440 --> 00:58:33,560
Speaker 1: So then if I were to die or lose my key,

1219
00:58:33,760 --> 00:58:37,320
Speaker 1: hopefully the other two people have their keys correct, or

1220
00:58:37,320 --> 00:58:38,960
Speaker 1: if something happens to one of them, hopefully the other

1221
00:58:38,960 --> 00:58:40,920
Speaker 1: two parties have the keys correct. That's kind of the

1222
00:58:40,920 --> 00:58:43,200
Speaker 1: way it works. And then if I were to die,

1223
00:58:43,320 --> 00:58:46,040
Speaker 1: then my trust or whatever my will could then say, hey,

1224
00:58:46,040 --> 00:58:48,960
Speaker 1: these two people need to sign the transaction to move

1225
00:58:49,000 --> 00:58:49,480
Speaker 1: the bitcoin.

1226
00:58:49,640 --> 00:58:52,760
Speaker 2: Correct. And when you're dealing with large amounts of wealth,

1227
00:58:53,200 --> 00:58:56,440
Speaker 2: the beautiful thing about that setup is is that you

1228
00:58:56,480 --> 00:59:00,240
Speaker 2: can create some very strong asset protection strategies. I know,

1229
00:59:00,280 --> 00:59:03,320
Speaker 2: we're in the US and your legal system is out

1230
00:59:03,360 --> 00:59:07,400
Speaker 2: of control when it comes to litigation. Having keys in

1231
00:59:07,440 --> 00:59:10,960
Speaker 2: different jurisdictions gives you the strongest form of asset protection

1232
00:59:11,360 --> 00:59:13,720
Speaker 2: that you could ever have, because all of a sudden,

1233
00:59:13,800 --> 00:59:17,000
Speaker 2: now there are multiple different legal jurisdictions that if someone

1234
00:59:17,160 --> 00:59:19,880
Speaker 2: was to ever litigate you, they need to go to

1235
00:59:19,880 --> 00:59:22,760
Speaker 2: different jurisdictions in order to access that coin. Are that

1236
00:59:22,880 --> 00:59:25,920
Speaker 2: key and ask that to sign a transaction to move

1237
00:59:25,960 --> 00:59:28,160
Speaker 2: the bitcoin to where it needs to be so for

1238
00:59:28,240 --> 00:59:30,040
Speaker 2: me moving forward, And this is just one of the

1239
00:59:30,080 --> 00:59:33,880
Speaker 2: other reasons why bitcoin is the ultimate asset when it

1240
00:59:33,880 --> 00:59:37,120
Speaker 2: comes to intergenerational wealth. This is something that can't be

1241
00:59:37,160 --> 00:59:38,240
Speaker 2: done with any other asset.

1242
00:59:38,440 --> 00:59:40,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, amazing.

1243
00:59:40,760 --> 00:59:42,720
Speaker 1: All right, Peter, I think we've gone over a lot.

1244
00:59:42,760 --> 00:59:45,720
Speaker 1: That's some good information. I want to link down to

1245
00:59:45,880 --> 00:59:47,880
Speaker 1: your services down below. If anybody wants to talk to

1246
00:59:47,920 --> 00:59:50,520
Speaker 1: you about that, Lintha, anything else that you should want

1247
00:59:50,520 --> 00:59:52,280
Speaker 1: to point attention to, or that you want to kind

1248
00:59:52,280 --> 00:59:52,920
Speaker 1: of close it out with.

1249
00:59:53,720 --> 00:59:55,760
Speaker 2: I think it's just an important time if you're not

1250
00:59:55,800 --> 00:59:58,080
Speaker 2: in bitcoin, to get into bitcoin as quickly as possible.

1251
00:59:58,080 --> 01:00:01,160
Speaker 2: We've got some exciting things that are to fruition, much

1252
01:00:01,160 --> 01:00:03,640
Speaker 2: of which we talked about today, And if you need

1253
01:00:03,680 --> 01:00:07,000
Speaker 2: help getting getting started, reach out to the team. We'd

1254
01:00:07,000 --> 01:00:08,000
Speaker 2: love to help great.

1255
01:00:08,080 --> 01:00:09,480
Speaker 3: Thanks so much for appreciate it.

1256
01:00:09,520 --> 01:00:09,920
Speaker 2: Thanks Mat