WEBVTT - Getting Semantical with Big Citrus 0:00:02.040 --> 0:00:04.160 Welcome to Good Game with Sarah Spain, where we just 0:00:04.320 --> 0:00:06.600 know all the young hoopers out there are practicing a 0:00:06.640 --> 0:00:08.560 spin in fades so they can pull off a buzzer 0:00:08.560 --> 0:00:12.000 beater like neco Ogumakay. It's Tuesday, August twenty sixth. Then 0:00:12.000 --> 0:00:14.680 on today's show, Big Citrus is jumping on to discuss 0:00:14.720 --> 0:00:17.880 the state of the WNBA MVP race, the behind the 0:00:17.920 --> 0:00:20.439 scenes of how the voting process works, and how the 0:00:20.560 --> 0:00:24.079 term MVP is even defined. Plus winning on your Home 0:00:24.120 --> 0:00:27.240 green a thirty point return. How could we have forgotten 0:00:27.240 --> 0:00:30.320 that the sky is falling? It's all coming up right 0:00:30.360 --> 0:00:38.240 after this welcome back slicays, here's what you need to 0:00:38.280 --> 0:00:43.320 know today. Let's start with the WNBA and that aforementioned 0:00:43.479 --> 0:00:46.559 buzzer beater. Neko ogum Makay led the Seattle Storm to 0:00:46.560 --> 0:00:48.840 an eighty four eighty two win over the Washington Mystic 0:00:48.880 --> 0:00:52.320 Sunday Night, scoring thirty points, including a career high six 0:00:52.479 --> 0:00:55.880 three pointers and that last second clutch jumper to seal 0:00:55.920 --> 0:00:59.279 the win. French phenom Dominique Malonga also had a stellar night, 0:00:59.320 --> 0:01:01.200 coming off the bench to put up her fourth double 0:01:01.200 --> 0:01:03.800 double of the season. The win was Seattle's fourth in 0:01:03.840 --> 0:01:06.920 its last five games, a nice bounce back after they'd 0:01:06.920 --> 0:01:10.440 suffered a six game skid. Continuing this hot streak could 0:01:10.440 --> 0:01:12.520 be crucial for the seventh place Storm heading into the 0:01:12.520 --> 0:01:15.640 final stretch of the regular season. Meantime, the Mystics are 0:01:15.640 --> 0:01:18.520 sitting in tenth after losing four straight and seven of 0:01:18.520 --> 0:01:22.320 their last ten. More WNBA Sunday night also saw the 0:01:22.400 --> 0:01:25.600 highly anticipated return of the Minnesota Lynx's defeast A Collier, 0:01:25.800 --> 0:01:28.479 who had been out since August second, missing seven games 0:01:28.480 --> 0:01:31.240 with an ankle injury. Collier wasted no time in her 0:01:31.280 --> 0:01:34.360 return to the court, picking up her MVP campaign season 0:01:34.480 --> 0:01:37.160 with an eleven of sixteen shooting night for thirty two 0:01:37.200 --> 0:01:39.960 points plus nine rebounds to lead the Links to a 0:01:40.040 --> 0:01:42.160 ninety seven to eighty four winner for the Indiana Fever. 0:01:42.480 --> 0:01:44.840 We'll have plenty more to say on her return and 0:01:44.920 --> 0:01:49.120 the other WNBA MVP contenders later in the show. One 0:01:49.160 --> 0:01:52.000 final w highlight, this one involving the newest member of 0:01:52.040 --> 0:01:55.280 the Good Game Hall of Fame, Page Beckers, and perhaps 0:01:55.320 --> 0:01:58.160 that honor we gave Beckers Jinxter because she saw one 0:01:58.160 --> 0:02:01.680 of her streaks and shortly after we recorded yesterday's episode, 0:02:01.880 --> 0:02:04.120 during the Dallas Wings ninety to eighty one loss to 0:02:04.160 --> 0:02:07.760 the Golden State Valkyrie. Sunday, Becker scored just nine points, 0:02:07.760 --> 0:02:09.920 marking the first game of her pro career that she 0:02:09.960 --> 0:02:12.800 didn't score in double digits. Up until now, Beckers had 0:02:12.800 --> 0:02:14.760 recorded at least ten or more points in her first 0:02:14.800 --> 0:02:17.919 thirty games as a pro, including, of course, last week's 0:02:17.960 --> 0:02:22.079 rookie record forty four point contest. Still, becker streak ranks 0:02:22.120 --> 0:02:25.800 pretty high in WNBA history. Her thirty straight games marked 0:02:25.840 --> 0:02:28.359 the fourth longest stretch of double digit points to start 0:02:28.400 --> 0:02:32.040 a WNBA career, behind only Candae Parker with thirty two straight, 0:02:32.360 --> 0:02:37.840 Asia Wilson with thirty seven, and Cynthia Cooper with ninety two. Yes, 0:02:38.320 --> 0:02:42.480 Cynthia Cooper recorded double digit points for ninety two straight games, 0:02:42.520 --> 0:02:45.160 a streak that lasted from her WNBA debut in nineteen 0:02:45.200 --> 0:02:49.079 ninety seven until two thousand now. As we mentioned yesterday's show, 0:02:49.280 --> 0:02:51.640 Cooper already had a lot of pro basketball experience by 0:02:51.639 --> 0:02:54.000 the time she made her WNBA debut in the league's 0:02:54.000 --> 0:02:57.079 inaugural season, but those ninety two games still marked the 0:02:57.160 --> 0:03:00.560 longest double digit streak of all WNBA Pais players. 0:03:00.320 --> 0:03:02.440 Regardless of years of experience. The great. 0:03:02.440 --> 0:03:04.920 Simone Augustus is number two on that version of the list, 0:03:04.960 --> 0:03:07.560 having recorded eighty eight straight double digit games with the 0:03:07.600 --> 0:03:11.000 Minnesota Lynx from six to eight. So while Becker's maybe 0:03:11.080 --> 0:03:13.840 back to zero with the start of a career streak, 0:03:14.120 --> 0:03:16.000 we do have a feeling she'll start a new streak 0:03:16.120 --> 0:03:16.520 very soon. 0:03:17.160 --> 0:03:17.600 To golf. 0:03:17.639 --> 0:03:21.080 The LPGA's Canadian Women's Open wrapped up on Sunday in Ontario, 0:03:21.320 --> 0:03:24.120 with Canadian player Brooke Henderson winning her first victory on 0:03:24.160 --> 0:03:26.639 tour in more than two and a half years. Henderson 0:03:26.680 --> 0:03:29.280 took the win by defeating Minji Lee by one stroke. 0:03:29.720 --> 0:03:32.880 Henderson has won fourteen times in her LPGA career, but 0:03:32.960 --> 0:03:35.360 her last win came back in January of twenty twenty three. 0:03:35.680 --> 0:03:38.000 She said after the tournament, quote, this year has not 0:03:38.120 --> 0:03:40.040 gone very well up to this point, and it just 0:03:40.080 --> 0:03:42.800 feels like this was meant to be. She added, Honestly, 0:03:42.800 --> 0:03:44.960 I'm surprised I'm not crying right now because it just 0:03:45.040 --> 0:03:45.760 means so much. 0:03:46.120 --> 0:03:49.760 End quote. There's nothing like winning at home to hockey. 0:03:49.800 --> 0:03:52.640 The pwatails Minnesota Frost has announced the hiring of Brienna 0:03:52.640 --> 0:03:55.200 Decker as an assistant coach to ken Clee. Decker a 0:03:55.240 --> 0:03:58.440 three time Olympic medalist for Team USA, officially retired in 0:03:58.480 --> 0:04:01.480 twenty twenty three following a devastating leg injury at the 0:04:01.520 --> 0:04:04.600 twenty twenty two Beijing Winter Games. Earlier this summer, she 0:04:04.640 --> 0:04:06.680 was named the Hockey Hall of Fame's Class of twenty 0:04:06.720 --> 0:04:08.800 twenty five and will be officially. 0:04:08.320 --> 0:04:09.600 Inducted in November. 0:04:09.760 --> 0:04:11.960 She spent the last few years as an assistant coach 0:04:12.000 --> 0:04:14.920 with both Team USA's U eighteen team and at famed 0:04:14.960 --> 0:04:17.919 hockey prep school shatt At Saint Mary's. In a statement, 0:04:17.960 --> 0:04:20.280 Decker said, quote, it's inspiring to be part of a 0:04:20.360 --> 0:04:23.159 league that sets the standard for women's hockey and a 0:04:23.200 --> 0:04:24.800 team that has been at the top of the league 0:04:24.800 --> 0:04:27.240 two years in a row. I'm excited for what's ahead 0:04:27.320 --> 0:04:29.839 and proud to contribute to a culture of excellence. 0:04:30.240 --> 0:04:30.880 End quote. 0:04:31.279 --> 0:04:34.400 Finally, some NWSL news, Sophia Fuerta is now the all 0:04:34.440 --> 0:04:37.320 time assists leader in the NWSL, moving into first with 0:04:37.360 --> 0:04:40.599 her thirty second career assist, a dish to Jordan Heidema 0:04:40.640 --> 0:04:42.800 in the Seattle Rains won one draw with the Houston 0:04:42.880 --> 0:04:43.839 Dash on Sunday. 0:04:44.440 --> 0:04:45.360 And some more soccer. 0:04:45.560 --> 0:04:47.839 The Orlando Pride announced Monday that the team is loaning 0:04:47.839 --> 0:04:50.800 two time World Cup winner Morgan Gatraw to Newcastle United 0:04:50.839 --> 0:04:52.840 through the end of twenty twenty five. As part of 0:04:52.839 --> 0:04:55.320 the same release, Gatraw, a key member of the Pride 0:04:55.400 --> 0:04:59.000 Shield and Championship wins last season, announced her retirement from 0:04:59.040 --> 0:05:02.120 the NWSL. In an interview with The Athletic, which we'll 0:05:02.160 --> 0:05:04.520 link to in the show notes, Gatra said she's excited 0:05:04.520 --> 0:05:06.240 for the challenge that will come with joining a new 0:05:06.279 --> 0:05:08.800 team as Newcastle looks to get promoted from the second 0:05:08.800 --> 0:05:10.239 tier of the Women's Super League. 0:05:10.400 --> 0:05:10.679 Quote. 0:05:10.720 --> 0:05:12.760 I've always loved joining places that I could help make 0:05:12.800 --> 0:05:15.120 better and where I could leave a lasting impact, and 0:05:15.200 --> 0:05:17.839 this is going to be no different hopefully end quote. 0:05:19.960 --> 0:05:22.679 All right, Selica's it's time to introduce a new segment called. 0:05:22.520 --> 0:05:25.400 God, Damn It, freaking Shit Mother for Blind. 0:05:25.800 --> 0:05:28.640 You may recall that in yesterday's episode, I started daydreaming 0:05:28.680 --> 0:05:31.040 about how easy Fud might end up with the Dallas 0:05:31.040 --> 0:05:34.080 Wings given their brutal record this year, or maybe the 0:05:34.080 --> 0:05:37.280 Wings might select Lauren Betts, leaving Asy available for my 0:05:37.400 --> 0:05:39.960 Chicago Sky, also not doing great this year. 0:05:40.640 --> 0:05:40.960 Well. 0:05:41.000 --> 0:05:43.360 Shout out to Slice Alexa for bringing me back down 0:05:43.400 --> 0:05:47.360 to earth hard. She wrote, quote, I regret to inform 0:05:47.440 --> 0:05:51.320 you that the Links own Chicago's twenty twenty six first 0:05:51.400 --> 0:05:54.600 round pick. I know it's absolutely ridiculous, but with an 0:05:54.640 --> 0:05:57.080 absolutely stacked draft class, I'm sure there will be plenty 0:05:57.120 --> 0:05:59.320 of depth in the first round. But no way Aisy 0:05:59.440 --> 0:06:01.800 is dropping that big fan of the show so quick. 0:06:01.839 --> 0:06:03.560 Thank you for all you do and for the great 0:06:03.600 --> 0:06:05.560 lengths you go to ensuring the values of the show. 0:06:05.640 --> 0:06:08.920 A favorite episode of mine is the Marina Maybrey interview. Sincerely, 0:06:08.960 --> 0:06:11.240 a longtime Dallas Wings fan who is hoping for Lauren 0:06:11.240 --> 0:06:14.200 Betts over Asy because our front court situation is dire. 0:06:14.680 --> 0:06:17.640 I am loyal till death to our current shooting guard. 0:06:17.800 --> 0:06:18.320 All up to. 0:06:18.360 --> 0:06:20.880 Paisy, but not being an a Rique fan is homophobic, 0:06:21.120 --> 0:06:22.719 and we all know love stories are better with a 0:06:22.720 --> 0:06:23.880 little tension and angst. 0:06:24.200 --> 0:06:28.080 Imagine a Paisy in the finals on different teams. End quote. 0:06:28.640 --> 0:06:30.880 You know what, Alexa, I swear. 0:06:30.640 --> 0:06:33.200 I am preventing my brain from acknowledging the truth about 0:06:33.200 --> 0:06:33.920 that draft pick. 0:06:35.440 --> 0:06:37.520 If y'all are blocking it out or never knew about it, 0:06:37.680 --> 0:06:38.480 here's a refresher. 0:06:38.880 --> 0:06:40.760 Last season, the Sky made a deal with the Links 0:06:40.760 --> 0:06:42.840 to acquire the number seven overall pick in the twenty 0:06:42.880 --> 0:06:45.840 twenty four draft in exchange for the number eight overall pick, 0:06:46.160 --> 0:06:48.279 a second round pick in twenty twenty five, and a 0:06:48.320 --> 0:06:51.440 first round pick swap in twenty twenty six. Then this 0:06:51.560 --> 0:06:53.599 year they made a trade to acquire the number eleven 0:06:53.640 --> 0:06:56.040 pick in the twenty twenty five draft, ceding the rights 0:06:56.080 --> 0:06:59.520 to that twenty twenty six pickswap instead giving Minnesota outright 0:06:59.560 --> 0:07:02.440 ownership of their first rounder next year. This guy used 0:07:02.440 --> 0:07:04.440 all those moves to grab Angel Rees at seven in 0:07:04.440 --> 0:07:07.000 twenty twenty four and Hailey Benlitth at eleven in twenty 0:07:07.040 --> 0:07:10.360 twenty five. Good moves, but despite talent on the roster, 0:07:10.520 --> 0:07:13.240 they're still near the bottom of the standings, and now 0:07:13.280 --> 0:07:16.640 the links are poised to benefit. No matter how many 0:07:16.720 --> 0:07:19.760 times I reminded of this, I still let myself daydream 0:07:19.800 --> 0:07:22.440 about this shitburger of a season paying off in the 0:07:22.480 --> 0:07:24.480 form of an exciting young star joining my team at 0:07:24.480 --> 0:07:25.200 fixing everything. 0:07:26.120 --> 0:07:32.240 Instead the rich get richer. Damn, damn, damn. We got 0:07:32.240 --> 0:07:34.400 to take a quick break. When we come back, it's 0:07:34.440 --> 0:07:35.280 time for Big. 0:07:35.080 --> 0:07:42.680 Citrus Welcome back slices. 0:07:42.800 --> 0:07:45.400 It's time to reconvene. Big Citrus, get in here. 0:07:45.440 --> 0:07:48.680 Alex and meish, what's up, Hey, y Let's talk some 0:07:48.920 --> 0:07:52.920 WNBA MVP, and let's start with what the hell even 0:07:53.000 --> 0:07:53.600 is at MVP? 0:07:53.880 --> 0:07:55.280 Because I feel like this is. 0:07:55.240 --> 0:07:58.560 The problem that we have in every sport anytime an 0:07:58.640 --> 0:08:01.680 MVP conversation comes up. Is it the best player on 0:08:01.880 --> 0:08:04.280 the best team. Is it the player that means the 0:08:04.320 --> 0:08:06.920 most to their team? Is it the best player on 0:08:07.040 --> 0:08:09.560 the best team who also wasn't recently named the MVP 0:08:09.680 --> 0:08:11.560 because we like to switch the rules around and tell 0:08:11.600 --> 0:08:12.760 you that you can't win it over and over to 0:08:12.760 --> 0:08:14.760 even if you deserve it, Like, what the hell is 0:08:14.800 --> 0:08:15.640 even an MVP? 0:08:15.800 --> 0:08:22.480 Mache Oh well, that's t okay, Clockett. That's t For 0:08:22.520 --> 0:08:26.000 me personally, I've gravitated towards a combination of, like what 0:08:26.200 --> 0:08:28.360 you just said, a player that a team would absolutely 0:08:28.360 --> 0:08:32.280 fall apart without and a player who's just got the 0:08:32.320 --> 0:08:34.760 most unbelievable stats. I think if you try to do 0:08:34.800 --> 0:08:36.560 it one way, you're always going to run into an 0:08:36.559 --> 0:08:39.600 issue where two people are well qualified because of the 0:08:39.600 --> 0:08:40.160 same things. 0:08:40.320 --> 0:08:42.640 So for me, it's helpful to have two tiers. 0:08:43.840 --> 0:08:46.600 Yeah, I mean, think about the name of the award 0:08:46.720 --> 0:08:49.920 most valuable player, literally the most valuable player to any 0:08:49.920 --> 0:08:53.160 particular team, and the more stat heavy people. I'm not 0:08:53.200 --> 0:08:55.280 one of those people, but they can do the stats 0:08:55.280 --> 0:08:58.040 on what makes a player valuable, like plus minus and 0:08:58.160 --> 0:09:01.000 offensive rating and defensive rating and all that, and that 0:09:01.040 --> 0:09:03.160 stuff matters. But I hear a lot of like the 0:09:03.160 --> 0:09:05.160 best player on the best team approach, and I hear 0:09:05.240 --> 0:09:07.720 a lot of the person who would be most valuable 0:09:07.720 --> 0:09:09.480 to any team you place them on, and those are 0:09:09.480 --> 0:09:11.640 hard for me. Those are hard for me. I don't 0:09:11.640 --> 0:09:14.599 know if those agree with my logic. And at the 0:09:14.640 --> 0:09:16.920 same time, it's really difficult because I feel like no 0:09:17.000 --> 0:09:19.080 matter what approach you take, there's always going to be 0:09:19.120 --> 0:09:22.000 some disagreement in discussion, Like we just have to concede 0:09:22.040 --> 0:09:23.839 that point at the beginning. 0:09:23.679 --> 0:09:26.280 Alex, do you use a different tier or set of 0:09:26.320 --> 0:09:27.600 tiers to decide? Well. 0:09:27.640 --> 0:09:30.160 It's so funny because as I was preparing for this conversation, 0:09:30.320 --> 0:09:33.440 I was reminiscing back on high school and my field 0:09:33.440 --> 0:09:37.040 hockey coach didn't believe in MVP awards, and so every year, 0:09:37.120 --> 0:09:40.520 at like the annual False School Sports Assembly, when they 0:09:40.520 --> 0:09:43.440 would award all the MVP trophies, it would go to 0:09:44.280 --> 0:09:46.560 the field hockey team like literally just the team as 0:09:46.559 --> 0:09:50.839 a whole, and so like in the school auditorium there 0:09:50.840 --> 0:09:52.600 were just all these plaques where a year after year 0:09:52.640 --> 0:09:54.800 the field hockey MVP was just the team and. 0:09:55.280 --> 0:09:57.559 As a multi time field hockey MVP, that would have 0:09:57.600 --> 0:09:58.160 pissed me the. 0:09:58.120 --> 0:10:01.880 Hell off exactly because if you did the work, if 0:10:01.920 --> 0:10:03.600 you did the work, you beout to give me my ward, 0:10:04.200 --> 0:10:04.800 give me my war. 0:10:05.640 --> 0:10:08.480 Was the most valuable as somebody that was never close 0:10:08.520 --> 0:10:12.040 to being named MVPs like this seems right. 0:10:13.280 --> 0:10:15.200 Yeah, I mean me, I agree with what you said. 0:10:15.240 --> 0:10:19.520 I do think for me, m VP has lost its 0:10:19.559 --> 0:10:20.720 semantical meaning. 0:10:21.640 --> 0:10:22.480 Semantical a word. 0:10:22.880 --> 0:10:26.600 It's a weird thing to ask, I know, semantics, but 0:10:26.800 --> 0:10:31.120 semantical anyway, it has lost its meaning to me in 0:10:31.160 --> 0:10:34.199 the sense of like nitpicking word by word. I think 0:10:34.280 --> 0:10:36.280 what it has come to mean across pretty much all 0:10:36.320 --> 0:10:40.200 sports is the best player. That's how we seem to 0:10:40.280 --> 0:10:44.320 talk about it, not who is the most valuable, because 0:10:44.360 --> 0:10:46.959 we've seen players on teams who have other great players 0:10:47.000 --> 0:10:49.680 who probably would step up, but they're still the best player. 0:10:49.920 --> 0:10:53.800 Asia Wilson last season was probably one of the least debated. 0:10:53.440 --> 0:10:56.120 Us of the m v P s in the w 0:10:56.320 --> 0:10:57.240 n B a of late. 0:10:57.280 --> 0:11:02.280 Because she just dominated and it was of course valuable 0:11:02.280 --> 0:11:04.679 for her team, and also just the best player, who 0:11:04.679 --> 0:11:06.600 had the best season, who scored the most points, who 0:11:06.600 --> 0:11:09.400 did the best things. So yes, I think the tears 0:11:09.440 --> 0:11:12.520 can help in moments where it feels real head to head, 0:11:12.520 --> 0:11:13.720 where it's hard to decide. 0:11:14.400 --> 0:11:17.800 But ultimately, to me, it's sort of a little bit 0:11:17.800 --> 0:11:19.880 of vibes. I mean a thousand percent. 0:11:19.960 --> 0:11:21.720 Yeah, Vib's definitely factor in there. 0:11:21.880 --> 0:11:23.640 Yeah, And I think that's how I kind of want 0:11:23.679 --> 0:11:26.240 it to be, too, Like when we look back at 0:11:26.240 --> 0:11:29.400 a previous season, so often we're not talking with the 0:11:29.400 --> 0:11:32.360 same in the moment context, and so I kind of 0:11:32.400 --> 0:11:35.160 want to know, Hey, whoever got MVP in twenty fifteen, 0:11:35.520 --> 0:11:37.440 they were the best player that year. Yes, I don't 0:11:37.480 --> 0:11:39.400 want to have to kind of take into account, oh 0:11:39.440 --> 0:11:41.840 well but their team did this and that. Like, I 0:11:41.880 --> 0:11:44.080 just want to know who was considered the best player 0:11:44.080 --> 0:11:46.200 that year. So I appreciate that definition of it. 0:11:46.679 --> 0:11:49.680 And I think it's possible to win MVP on a 0:11:49.720 --> 0:11:53.880 bad team, but you have to be so frickin' good. 0:11:54.120 --> 0:11:55.720 I don't know why, but my brain goes to, like 0:11:55.880 --> 0:11:58.079 Ernie Banks, with the Cubs, who was like an MVP 0:11:58.160 --> 0:12:00.439 on a team that didn't even make the playoffs. Easier 0:12:00.480 --> 0:12:03.720 in baseball, because your stats are so isolated and independent 0:12:03.800 --> 0:12:06.360 of all the other things that are going on in basketball, 0:12:06.800 --> 0:12:07.880 it's almost impossible. 0:12:07.920 --> 0:12:10.000 Like Paige Beckers mm hmm. 0:12:10.080 --> 0:12:12.679 Yeah, is most valuable on her team because like Ari 0:12:12.800 --> 0:12:14.840 k has been in and out, that team blows and 0:12:14.880 --> 0:12:18.040 she's still doing amazing things every night. But she's not 0:12:18.120 --> 0:12:20.400 the best player in the league. And it wouldn't tell 0:12:20.400 --> 0:12:22.520 the story of this season for Page Beckers to be 0:12:22.559 --> 0:12:22.959 the MVP. 0:12:23.320 --> 0:12:25.320 And that's that's what makes it so hard for me. 0:12:25.440 --> 0:12:27.040 I'm not I'm not advocating. 0:12:26.559 --> 0:12:28.160 For Paige to win MVP. Let me be clear. 0:12:28.200 --> 0:12:30.160 Okay, she's having a she's having a great season, great 0:12:30.200 --> 0:12:33.240 rookie season. I don't think she's the MVP. But I 0:12:33.240 --> 0:12:35.200 think what you're pointing out here is why this is 0:12:35.240 --> 0:12:37.600 so difficult for me, because I love to make space 0:12:37.600 --> 0:12:41.680 for those quote unquote underdog MVPs because there will be 0:12:41.760 --> 0:12:44.520 every once in a blue moon, somebody who statistically blows 0:12:44.559 --> 0:12:48.280 it out of the water and who frankly, like Alex, 0:12:48.400 --> 0:12:50.080 like you're saying, when you look back on the season, 0:12:50.160 --> 0:12:52.240 they are the best player, even though their team might 0:12:52.280 --> 0:12:55.160 have gone five and twenty five or whatever the case 0:12:55.200 --> 0:12:58.040 may be. And so I guess my point in saying 0:12:58.080 --> 0:13:01.240 that is whatever tier, whatever calculus people use, I just 0:13:01.240 --> 0:13:03.400 want to make sure that we're doing due diligence for 0:13:03.400 --> 0:13:05.800 folks who aren't on the Minnesota leagues or aren't on 0:13:06.120 --> 0:13:07.880 you know what I mean, top two teams in the league. 0:13:07.920 --> 0:13:08.480 It was interesting. 0:13:08.520 --> 0:13:09.960 I was trying to look back at some of the 0:13:10.000 --> 0:13:13.439 coverage of Candice Parker's MVP season in two thousand and eight, 0:13:13.440 --> 0:13:15.400 when she was named both Rookie of the Year and 0:13:15.640 --> 0:13:17.960 MVP in her first year in the league, because I 0:13:18.000 --> 0:13:20.920 really wanted to figure out, like, were people just saying like, 0:13:20.960 --> 0:13:23.520 she's a really good rookie who's like good enough that 0:13:23.559 --> 0:13:26.960 she deserves MVP. It speaks to maybe something of the 0:13:27.000 --> 0:13:28.960 media coverage that I wasn't able to come across too 0:13:29.000 --> 0:13:31.400 much that I don't want nuance and insight. So if 0:13:31.440 --> 0:13:34.040 any slices out there have anything that you think could 0:13:34.040 --> 0:13:35.960 shine a light on this for somebody that didn't pay 0:13:35.960 --> 0:13:38.240 too much attention to the WNBA back in the day, 0:13:38.559 --> 0:13:40.240 I'd love to see it, because, yeah, it was one 0:13:40.280 --> 0:13:42.760 of those things where I was like, Okay, what would 0:13:42.840 --> 0:13:45.800 Page have to do to be in the MVP conversation? 0:13:46.480 --> 0:13:48.200 And part of me is like, I don't know how 0:13:48.280 --> 0:13:49.800 much of it comes down to her and how much 0:13:49.800 --> 0:13:52.360 of it just comes down to not having gotten drafted 0:13:52.400 --> 0:13:53.000 to that team. 0:13:53.840 --> 0:13:56.880 Yeah, somebody who fell in love with the WNBA around 0:13:56.960 --> 0:14:00.720 that time, range CP three was different. If anybody's got 0:14:00.720 --> 0:14:04.320 any issues, come hit my DMS we could talk about it. 0:14:04.960 --> 0:14:07.960 Please, Well, let's talk about who's a little different this year, 0:14:08.000 --> 0:14:13.360 because we are finally and belatedly really introducing Alyssa Thomas 0:14:13.360 --> 0:14:17.320 into this conversation, and I'll fully admit that we're we're late. 0:14:18.679 --> 0:14:20.440 Part of it is her style of play. 0:14:20.480 --> 0:14:23.560 It is insanely efficient and she puts up crazy numbers, 0:14:23.880 --> 0:14:26.520 but it's not really flashy in the same way or 0:14:26.520 --> 0:14:29.160 maybe as graceful as some of the players that we 0:14:29.280 --> 0:14:32.160 tend to lean towards when we're talking MVP. And also 0:14:32.360 --> 0:14:35.080 new team, we took most of our time just being 0:14:35.120 --> 0:14:37.880 surprised that the Mercury were playing so well after the 0:14:37.880 --> 0:14:41.440 retirement of Ben Tarassi the departure of Britney Grinery, were like, wait. 0:14:41.240 --> 0:14:41.840 What's happening? 0:14:42.000 --> 0:14:43.640 And then to be frank, we were also just really 0:14:43.720 --> 0:14:47.360 focused on her relationship status and her being separated from 0:14:47.400 --> 0:14:50.480 Dewana Bonner and then reunited. And meanwhile she was like, Okay, 0:14:50.520 --> 0:14:52.480 I'll just be over here just putting up crazy stats 0:14:52.520 --> 0:14:54.440 every night. You let me know when you come around 0:14:54.480 --> 0:14:57.360 to the basketball side of things, and sorry, Alyssa, but 0:14:57.400 --> 0:14:58.080 we're here now. 0:14:58.520 --> 0:14:59.880 So really, what it. 0:15:00.000 --> 0:15:02.520 Feels like to me is Asia Wilson, Nafisa Kyllier, and 0:15:02.520 --> 0:15:04.960 Alyssa Thomas. Is there anybody else that you think, within 0:15:05.000 --> 0:15:06.640 the last stretch of the season can make a true 0:15:06.680 --> 0:15:07.080 bid for this? 0:15:07.480 --> 0:15:11.640 Oh truly no, But I do think there are some people. 0:15:12.680 --> 0:15:16.040 There's always there's always benefits of being in that conversation, right, 0:15:16.120 --> 0:15:18.920 whether it's talks for your next contract, whether you know 0:15:19.040 --> 0:15:21.040 all that stuff, your own personal legacy. 0:15:21.160 --> 0:15:22.040 I think that's important. 0:15:22.040 --> 0:15:24.120 I do. Once again, you want to make space, yeah, 0:15:24.240 --> 0:15:26.800 people in the converse, and I get that. I get that, 0:15:26.840 --> 0:15:29.880 And you're right though, it is necessary to shout out 0:15:29.920 --> 0:15:32.200 the people who are on the perimeter, because to your point, 0:15:32.320 --> 0:15:34.880 if we don't sometimes put them in these articles, have 0:15:34.920 --> 0:15:37.320 them in these conversations, people really miss I think Kelsey 0:15:37.360 --> 0:15:39.800 Mitchell is a great example of that someone who is 0:15:39.880 --> 0:15:42.520 not really in these conversations and always should be even 0:15:42.520 --> 0:15:43.320 if she's not gonna win. 0:15:43.680 --> 0:15:46.760 Yeah, yeah, I definitely have Kelsey Mitchell in that bucket. 0:15:47.000 --> 0:15:50.040 Also have Kelsey Plumb in that bucket. Both of them 0:15:50.080 --> 0:15:50.920 are among the. 0:15:50.960 --> 0:15:53.560 League's top five scorers, both leading their team in scoring. 0:15:53.960 --> 0:15:57.520 Both have carried their teams on their backs at different 0:15:57.520 --> 0:15:59.760 points during this season. And again, why I don't think 0:15:59.760 --> 0:16:03.000 this necessarily win. We got to give credit where credit 0:16:03.040 --> 0:16:05.320 is due, man, because otherwise, what are folks on other teams? 0:16:05.360 --> 0:16:07.880 I mean, you're obviously playing to win, but individually, in 0:16:08.000 --> 0:16:09.760 terms of your legacy, what else are you fighting for? 0:16:09.800 --> 0:16:13.320 Then? Ali Shagray, you could maybe argue Sabrina and Nascue 0:16:13.400 --> 0:16:16.000 with a team that's had John Quell out now Brianna 0:16:16.080 --> 0:16:17.560 out and keeping them in the mix. 0:16:17.680 --> 0:16:20.080 But I do think it's it's a three women race 0:16:20.160 --> 0:16:20.520 right now. 0:16:20.760 --> 0:16:23.440 Yeah, for sure, And honestly, this is going to ruffle 0:16:23.480 --> 0:16:28.440 some feathers following my logic, I got Asia and Alyssa 0:16:28.480 --> 0:16:30.760 ahead of fee fian A, Lissa our neck and neck, 0:16:31.160 --> 0:16:32.320 their neck and neck. 0:16:32.480 --> 0:16:33.400 Okay, walk me through that. 0:16:34.000 --> 0:16:37.320 But if we're talking about what Asia Wilson has done again. 0:16:37.400 --> 0:16:38.440 This season, the. 0:16:38.440 --> 0:16:41.680 Las Vegas Aces were bad. Okay, we don't need to 0:16:41.680 --> 0:16:45.000 sugarcoat that they were bad until two weeks ago. Pretty much, 0:16:45.520 --> 0:16:51.520 Asia Wilson has been doing her damn thing the whole time, regardless. 0:16:50.960 --> 0:16:52.280 Of what anybody else has done. 0:16:52.480 --> 0:16:55.440 If we talk again about my approach of a player 0:16:55.480 --> 0:16:57.800 that a team would actually fall apart without, imagine the 0:16:57.880 --> 0:17:01.760 Aces without Asia Wilson this season. Yeah, they're bottom five 0:17:01.800 --> 0:17:07.359 in the league to me. And then for Alyssa the 0:17:07.440 --> 0:17:09.320 reason why this is what you were alluding to earlier. 0:17:09.359 --> 0:17:11.480 It's not flashy because she doesn't score a lot of points, 0:17:11.960 --> 0:17:14.280 because she's not putting up twenty points to night. And 0:17:15.480 --> 0:17:18.080 I've never been up a person or a player, frankly 0:17:18.080 --> 0:17:20.040 who has been point centric. Because I love to pass 0:17:20.080 --> 0:17:21.439 the ball, I love to rebound the ball, I love 0:17:21.480 --> 0:17:25.639 to do all other shit, every defense everything. Okay, I 0:17:25.680 --> 0:17:28.359 took charges, all right, I took charges and I talked 0:17:28.359 --> 0:17:29.320 a lot on Yeah. 0:17:29.119 --> 0:17:30.760 Because you were too lazy to get out of the way, 0:17:31.119 --> 0:17:32.960 and that counts for something. You didn't want to move 0:17:32.960 --> 0:17:35.280 your feet on defense, either to get in position or 0:17:35.320 --> 0:17:35.679 out of it. 0:17:36.320 --> 0:17:39.600 That's my key, okay, and it is what it is. 0:17:41.040 --> 0:17:43.240 But I put Alissa a little bit ahead of Fee 0:17:43.320 --> 0:17:47.000 because and this is this is also probably controversial. Fij 0:17:47.119 --> 0:17:51.400 just missed however many games, right, and Minnesota did perfectly 0:17:51.440 --> 0:17:54.720 fine without her. They secured a number one spot in 0:17:54.760 --> 0:17:58.760 the playoffs. Imagine again the Phoenix Murky without Alyssa Thomas 0:17:59.160 --> 0:18:00.119