Speaker 1: So when you're talking about books being adapted into movies
Speaker 1: and TV shows, the cliche that always comes to mind
Speaker 1: is the book was better. But if you've listened to
Speaker 1: our last couple episodes about Alvie Huxley's Brave New World intent,
Speaker 1: you should do that. If you haven't, you've heard our
Speaker 1: myriad issues with it. Well, this week we are getting
Speaker 1: into the adaptation for NBC's Peacock, and now you'll want
Speaker 1: to hear our myriad issues with that as well. It
Speaker 1: doesn't lend itself very well to adaptation, which is why
Speaker 1: when I finished reading it, I was like, what they
Speaker 1: made this into a show, And it turns out they didn't.
Speaker 1: So Welcome back to Popcorn Book Club. I'm Danis Schwartz,
Speaker 1: joined as always by Jennifer Wright, Tan Tran, Melissa Hunter,
Speaker 1: and caramadan Qua, and today we are back on screen
Speaker 1: time the name for the segment that I have unilaterally
Speaker 1: decided to move forward of it? You did. I just
Speaker 1: made this decisions for the moment with such confidence that
Speaker 1: we all were like, yes that is the name. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you said it with such confidence that it made me
Speaker 1: feel like I did vote for it. Yes you did.
Speaker 1: You just all forgot. I just assumed that I missed.
Speaker 1: I thought it like Mr. I Heart Radio told us
Speaker 1: it had to be called that. I am Mr Karama.
Speaker 1: His name is I Heart Radio, Ivan Heart Radio. It's
Speaker 1: like a haunted mansion to Stone. So we are back
Speaker 1: on the segment that Mr. The president of I Heart
Speaker 1: Radio told us had to be called screen time talking
Speaker 1: about Brave New World. The I want to say adaptation,
Speaker 1: but not even really adaptations. It a title and very
Speaker 1: little and some characters people keep making fun of Bernards
Speaker 1: like c W West World. I maybe say that is
Speaker 1: such a yeah, have we said the name yet? It's
Speaker 1: Brave New World on NBC's streaming series Peacock. Again a
Speaker 1: very loose adaptation, and that they picked a few elements
Speaker 1: that I think they liked. But before we dive in,
Speaker 1: because I think we're gonna have a lot to say, Jennifer,
Speaker 1: you're you're a defender of the show, and so I
Speaker 1: want to start with you on just in your own words,
Speaker 1: what you think the show is about and what you
Speaker 1: enjoy about it. Okay, So first of all, um, not
Speaker 1: that you need a defense for enjoying anything, because we
Speaker 1: would never be afraid to like things that we'd like.
Speaker 1: But um, A note is that I watched the first
Speaker 1: i'm gonna say four episodes of this after having a
Speaker 1: very minor operation and I was on painkillers. So I
Speaker 1: have a sense that henced my my enjoyment of at
Speaker 1: least the first portion of the show, because I did
Speaker 1: notice a guarantee reason quality. I was no longer on
Speaker 1: thank killer. But I just thought, like, I guess it
Speaker 1: really ran out of ideas, like two and a half hours.
Speaker 1: It might have been something else. I mean, I kind
Speaker 1: of thought it came together towards the end. I think
Speaker 1: because I let go of all of my expectations, I
Speaker 1: was gonna say, did we watch the same show? Because
Speaker 1: it did not come together. It came together kind of
Speaker 1: the same way that when a kid makes you a
Speaker 1: little mudpie and then here you go, it's like together
Speaker 1: only for a second, crumbling watch the entire show. No
Speaker 1: I didn't. I did, Karama did see And how far
Speaker 1: could you get? I only got I only got three
Speaker 1: episodes in when he just starts, he just got back,
Speaker 1: or John just is in the room. That's very freaking out,
Speaker 1: like I can't can you put in? You put in exactly?
Speaker 1: This is this brings up one of my gripes. So
Speaker 1: you got a third of the way through. Because the
Speaker 1: series is nine episodes, which is not a thing that
Speaker 1: I've ever heard of anyone ever doing. And I'm all
Speaker 1: for the fact that we now have this streaming ability
Speaker 1: which makes it so that we don't need to follow
Speaker 1: the conventions of network television. And I think that's great,
Speaker 1: and I think innovation is cool. But because the show
Speaker 1: was also not great, I don't know why they didn't
Speaker 1: do more or less episodes. I don't know what it
Speaker 1: would have benefited from one more or one few. The
Speaker 1: more I think in terms of episodes, it's kind of
Speaker 1: my rule about movies that no movie should be over
Speaker 1: two hours unless it's very very good. If it's very very,
Speaker 1: very very good, I don't care how long it is.
Speaker 1: But if some movie is like a B plus and
Speaker 1: it's two hours and one minute, I'm like, what's happening?
Speaker 1: Why are generate? I feel like a minus? Get that
Speaker 1: ship out of here. And I think it's the same
Speaker 1: with episodes. It's like, if it's going to be more
Speaker 1: than eight these days, you got to prove your ninth,
Speaker 1: you know, prove your ninth. Nine. We listen, that's the
Speaker 1: name of your TV writing school. Prove your ninth, your
Speaker 1: nine seminar no sense to like half of the whatever. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it'll make sense on the ninth class. Yes, it's intriguing.
Speaker 1: You have to have a title that makes you want
Speaker 1: to ask questions and and find out more. Well the
Speaker 1: well the classes eight sessions, and then you have to
Speaker 1: pay for the nights. So I'm proving my ninth. You know,
Speaker 1: I type the class. So let's talk about the similarities
Speaker 1: with the book. First, I got that there's a character
Speaker 1: named Bernard. It's Bernard, It's Bernard. There's a people say
Speaker 1: they're British. That's a British people. Really, okay. I was
Speaker 1: just like, this is a fun one. Actually did not
Speaker 1: like the fact that John kept saying Bernard when everybody
Speaker 1: else is saying Bernard, And I'm like, you can say Bernard.
Speaker 1: Like if that part I would say weird, I would
Speaker 1: feel weird saying Bernard to a British person. I have
Speaker 1: an uncle Bernard who's American, and we've just always called
Speaker 1: him Bernard because that's I like that. Yeah, that's better,
Speaker 1: it's objectively better. I just thought this an American. I
Speaker 1: was forced to always say Bernard Bernard. That was like
Speaker 1: the British one pounce their name in a different way.
Speaker 1: Probably just go with that. I just keep thinking of
Speaker 1: him as Bernard because I read it that way. Yeah,
Speaker 1: me too. Yeah. Well, the fun fact I learned about
Speaker 1: the actor playing Bernard is that he's Charles Dickens, like
Speaker 1: great great great grandson, which is just one he does.
Speaker 1: I don't look like he's Else Dickens, great great great
Speaker 1: pants and totally. I also just want to point out
Speaker 1: that Charles Dickens tried to get his wife institutionalize so
Speaker 1: he could run off with a teenage mistress. And I've
Speaker 1: never forgiven him for that. She was she was an actress,
Speaker 1: She was very very young, and his wife had something
Speaker 1: like nine children, might have been six sowhere in that
Speaker 1: six to nine range of children. Yeah, and then he
Speaker 1: tried to get her institutionalized, and that's a horrible, horrible
Speaker 1: thing to do. Well, one of those six to nine
Speaker 1: babies had some more babies, and one of them became
Speaker 1: an actor. Who is good. He was great, She did
Speaker 1: a good job. Everybody. I think everybody did a very
Speaker 1: nice job. I thought the costumes were delightful. The Weasley
Speaker 1: man that you that is your type, okay, because I
Speaker 1: was like John is also We's John is not my type.
Speaker 1: Though I don't like like cowboys. I don't think he
Speaker 1: might like a cowboy. I don't think he as a cowboy.
Speaker 1: My my theory about Aldan Aarnich, who is uh the
Speaker 1: actor who played John John in this series um is
Speaker 1: that everything about him to me reads as a British
Speaker 1: actor playing American even though he's like born in l A. H.
Speaker 1: I don't know why. He just seems very like he's
Speaker 1: a British guy, like doing that American accent that's very
Speaker 1: like we have to go, we have to go to
Speaker 1: get us. Like he British, he is a person who
Speaker 1: grew up in l a and went to theater school
Speaker 1: and college. He just seems like exactly that, like an
Speaker 1: l A kid who took some like voice classes, non
Speaker 1: singing voice voice actor he did like Alexander method, and
Speaker 1: now he's like very into his front palette. Honestly, I
Speaker 1: like him. I think it's kind of a bummer that
Speaker 1: he's gotten these high level roles that people don't turn
Speaker 1: out to like. Like Solo he played, I liked it too.
Speaker 1: I thought it was like a super fun movie, but
Speaker 1: super intense fans did not like it. And it's really
Speaker 1: I liked this record. Yeah, I'm saying I really like
Speaker 1: him In Hail Caesar. I think that's a really good movie.
Speaker 1: That movie that had like George Clooney and a bunch
Speaker 1: of white people. It was like all white people. All
Speaker 1: white people didn't it's yeah, it's all white, but everyone
Speaker 1: is good in it. As a white person. He's he's
Speaker 1: everyone is great. I like all the actors for the
Speaker 1: most part. I thought everyone was like very compelling, interesting
Speaker 1: to watch. Love Sybil from down Down Nabby. I like
Speaker 1: didn't recognize her at first, and then I was like,
Speaker 1: who is this stunning woman? I recognize it as like wait,
Speaker 1: could it be it is? I'm so excited and like
Speaker 1: she's great. She is not usually in starring roles, so
Speaker 1: I think that it's nice to have her in this
Speaker 1: starring role. I think that it's very well acted. I
Speaker 1: think that the set, dressing and the special effects. There's
Speaker 1: a lot that's good about the show. It's just that
Speaker 1: the show wasn't like there are many good elements, but
Speaker 1: it is not greater than the sum. It's not like
Speaker 1: so in writing, you have something learned Like TV writing,
Speaker 1: you have something called like a sandbox, right, Melissa, this
Speaker 1: is this isn't earned the dime freeby is all right?
Speaker 1: So this is like in the beginning of writing, writer's
Speaker 1: rooms usually like here's our sandbox of ideas and we're
Speaker 1: just gonna like throw it all out. I'm sure it's
Speaker 1: a term borrowed from business that I don't know about,
Speaker 1: but you just throw writers throw out all the ideas
Speaker 1: possible and then you kind of skimmed through see which
Speaker 1: ones you like. It feels like they just are like, well,
Speaker 1: we have the sandbox, let's dump it all into the show. Well.
Speaker 1: I think part of the problem for me is, um,
Speaker 1: it's not a very action packed book. Like there's there's
Speaker 1: a lot of great emotional up people, but if you
Speaker 1: had to come up with any kind of like real action,
Speaker 1: it's not really there. And they clearly want us to
Speaker 1: be an action packed show. So instead of just getting
Speaker 1: found by people from New London and vacating with his mother, um, yeah,
Speaker 1: they have to escape the reservation and break their way
Speaker 1: through a smirkling magnetic field that myous, yeah, and then
Speaker 1: she gets shot in the process, and then They're gonna
Speaker 1: kill all of the people from New London. They're like,
Speaker 1: none of that happens in the book. It's like, as
Speaker 1: I understand it, it's like a minor bureaucratic discussion that
Speaker 1: does not lead to any car chases and clearly is
Speaker 1: mostly quiet philosophical discussions. It. Yeah, they could have gone that.
Speaker 1: It could have been how Normal People. I remember thinking like,
Speaker 1: how is normal People are going to be adapted into
Speaker 1: a show? It's so internal and like, oh they did that.
Speaker 1: They did that very successfully on screen. I think that
Speaker 1: Normal People also is about two people, and that's the thing.
Speaker 1: We get to see those two people interact, and I
Speaker 1: feel like we talked in our episode on the book
Speaker 1: Brave New World. There is not a protagonist, so it's
Speaker 1: not It doesn't lend itself very well to adaptation, which
Speaker 1: is why when I finished reading it, I was like,
Speaker 1: what they made this into a show, And it turns
Speaker 1: out they didn't, so you know, Like I mean, it
Speaker 1: focuses so much on the monogamy aspect and the next
Speaker 1: aspect of it that is not that prevalent in the
Speaker 1: book in the way that I was like, this is
Speaker 1: such a like made for TV thing. That they're trying
Speaker 1: to do, like opening with her talking about monogamy and
Speaker 1: like having those like three rules. At the very beginning,
Speaker 1: I was like, oh god, this is going to be
Speaker 1: all about sex, isn't it? And then when the orgies
Speaker 1: can we talk? I only saw one or I need
Speaker 1: to I need to say a story about watching the orgy.
Speaker 1: So I thought it was going to be a personal orgy. Sorry,
Speaker 1: but I live in a small apartment with my fiance
Speaker 1: and we have this little device on our TV that
Speaker 1: you can um you can listen to like bluetooth it
Speaker 1: because we don't have like an update TV whatever, So
Speaker 1: I will listen to TV on our headphones a lot
Speaker 1: of time to when the other one isn't watching. I
Speaker 1: was watching it the other day during the day and
Speaker 1: he was where he was working, and he was just like,
Speaker 1: what are you what? Like he literally turned up right
Speaker 1: when the orgy had started. I'm like, it's not it's
Speaker 1: it's a classic literature pod, just like I was watching
Speaker 1: porn in the afternoon on a Monday. I want to
Speaker 1: say the record, I think that the problem with this
Speaker 1: adaptation isn't that they added action, which is fine to me.
Speaker 1: I thought they made the costumes boring and like they
Speaker 1: decided that, like, oh, the aesthetic is just boring. Futures
Speaker 1: that coast or cost that store case which I had
Speaker 1: never heard of before you sent something about it. The
Speaker 1: group that is where they shopped. It's like boxy neutral colors,
Speaker 1: uh like very clean. They have like beautiful indescent panel costume.
Speaker 1: But I wanted like like kicky little green outfits with
Speaker 1: like little belts, and they described all these like little outsay,
Speaker 1: because it's very important. It sounds like all Lenina's outfits
Speaker 1: in the book her spectacular pointed. Okay, the green outfit
Speaker 1: where she goes to the new I just kept thinking about,
Speaker 1: like that's gonna look so cool on screen, and then
Speaker 1: she just wore like a jumpsuit. So that's what I found.
Speaker 1: That's what I found most disappointing is that they fundamentally
Speaker 1: seem to misunderstand the message of the book Brave New World,
Speaker 1: which is so relevant, which is that like consumerism and
Speaker 1: wanting more more fashioned, more more toys, more experiences, more
Speaker 1: like based like um frivolous human pleasures, which is so
Speaker 1: relevant than distracts people from wondering like is our life
Speaker 1: even worth living? Where in this they were like everyone
Speaker 1: just wears a boring utilitarian jumpsuit. Also, the House of
Speaker 1: Want is some like savage land idea. We're no, the
Speaker 1: House of Want is supposed to be New London. Everyone
Speaker 1: is up. It's a capitalist was like the Emperor, yea,
Speaker 1: this isn't this isn't about like for the book. Like
Speaker 1: the sex in the book was just like a fun
Speaker 1: little added thing, that fun distraction that wasn't like not
Speaker 1: like undulating orgy scene that made me laugh so loud
Speaker 1: because like, I'm sorry, in this world everyone is on rhythm.
Speaker 1: There's not like one person who's just like like phrenetically
Speaker 1: like offbeat and unable to funk. Like everyone is good.
Speaker 1: I just there's so many. I just couldn't stop laughing
Speaker 1: at that. But like the fact the fact that no
Speaker 1: one the the enemy of this world is like, oh
Speaker 1: my god. The idea of monogamy that's so taboo. Look,
Speaker 1: it's so easy for people for viewers to be like, oh,
Speaker 1: I see why this world is wrong. We're in the book.
Speaker 1: I mean the book, take it, take what you will
Speaker 1: from it. But I definitely reflected I'm like, oh I
Speaker 1: see a lot of relevance and similarities in the way
Speaker 1: I structure my life and the world structures our lives
Speaker 1: and consumerism, and it wasn't as challenging in that way
Speaker 1: to me. I need to pop a few somma, So
Speaker 1: why don't we take a quick break. Okay, we're back
Speaker 1: with Popcorn book Club. The introduction of Indra really muddled
Speaker 1: things from yeah, I think, oh yeah, well the end
Speaker 1: in the end, okay, so only Karama and I can
Speaker 1: talk about this, I guess please. In the end, they
Speaker 1: find out they all live in a computer what is like, Yeah,
Speaker 1: like it's so, it's not it's not explained well enough
Speaker 1: for me to definitively say that it's a matrix. But
Speaker 1: I think it is strongly implied that they are living
Speaker 1: in a computer simulation and they just escaped at the
Speaker 1: very end, well, because like, doesn't Indra then go and
Speaker 1: live in Bernard or like the inside Bernard and go
Speaker 1: back to the Savage Lands and then they bring something
Speaker 1: but they bring with them. Yeah, yeah, I think that's
Speaker 1: what they're doing. So they're gonna tame the Savage Lands
Speaker 1: with Indra, their computer overlord who health the spirits of
Speaker 1: the nine people who created it. But no, but yeah,
Speaker 1: and C C six is a clone of one of
Speaker 1: the people who have created Indra, who is the guy
Speaker 1: that plays Klaus on The Originals. That's like straight out
Speaker 1: of West World taking that is the engine that engineer character. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's boring. They made a message this book like Brave
Speaker 1: New World, which I think is a very relevant dystopia,
Speaker 1: and just like flattened it into like the most boring
Speaker 1: Hollywood dystopia. There's nothing You're right, there's nothing about the
Speaker 1: book Brave New World that's like great jumpsuits, sleek minimalism.
Speaker 1: Nothing is minimalism. Nothing is is stimps, computer simulation. It's like,
Speaker 1: where did you get that? We all saw Minority Report.
Speaker 1: It's fine. I thought Minority Report level where it's boom
Speaker 1: boom bye, get it, take it, want it? Um? Yeah. Also,
Speaker 1: here's the thing. Everybody in this movie becomes horny for
Speaker 1: monogny immediately, yes, which I um. If everybody is super
Speaker 1: horny for monogamy, it's hard for me to belief that
Speaker 1: there would not just be like a sea change in
Speaker 1: their society where people would be like all of the
Speaker 1: population is going to be miserable if they can't like
Speaker 1: take a whack at monogamy, So let's give it a try.
Speaker 1: And I think that's only enhanced by having this tourist
Speaker 1: attraction where you get to see INDs and violence, but
Speaker 1: like a very passionate, heartfelt wedding where somebody talks about
Speaker 1: how desperately they love the woman that they're going to
Speaker 1: be monogamous with. I will set the wedding. The thing
Speaker 1: that's funny about the wedding for me is there supposed
Speaker 1: to be like a shotgun wedding and the woman is pregnant,
Speaker 1: and I love loved it on TV when you're pregnant,
Speaker 1: you're always nine months pregnant, very visibly pregnant, which is
Speaker 1: not at all how a shotgun wedding works. So I
Speaker 1: like the idea of the like park engineers from New
Speaker 1: London being like, ah, yes, she's pregnant, we must make
Speaker 1: her very very pregnant. I do. I do like that
Speaker 1: in this world too, that there's a respect for theater
Speaker 1: is still a craft that is the most date. That
Speaker 1: line where he's like live theater is the most dangerous thing.
Speaker 1: I was like, cool, someone who has done a lot
Speaker 1: of life, but I'm making them feel I wish it
Speaker 1: was full like waiting for Guffman, like like it was
Speaker 1: my guest as the director, because it did feel I
Speaker 1: loved how over the top it all was and it
Speaker 1: just felt like an alien trying to be like I
Speaker 1: understand marriages. I really I appreciated that part. I wish
Speaker 1: it was a whole series, that it was just a
Speaker 1: Christopher guest dile like adventure land of just like people
Speaker 1: hanging out working at the Savage nothing happens that don't
Speaker 1: just feel like George saunderstory. It just like what would
Speaker 1: do and like they make friends and there's no crazy
Speaker 1: plot and we just get to know these people. I
Speaker 1: do think that it is important to recognize, though, that
Speaker 1: there are people who want to leave the Savage Lands
Speaker 1: and then they can't write, which I think is so
Speaker 1: odd because that part of the adaptation. I get that
Speaker 1: they didn't want to have it be the weird racist
Speaker 1: thing that it was in them, the racism, but introduced
Speaker 1: a weird new like haves and have not some thing
Speaker 1: and like, oh, this is where we keep our poor
Speaker 1: people to entertain us. I kind of just read it
Speaker 1: as Americans, and um, the way America is going at
Speaker 1: the moment, I kind of feel like it's what we deserve,
Speaker 1: like we should just have to put on like terrible
Speaker 1: pantomimes of for British people. Yeah, that's that's what we deserve.
Speaker 1: I sayd appreciate that change obviously because of racism. And
Speaker 1: also that's what I thought was where it was where
Speaker 1: it was going in the book when they kept on
Speaker 1: talking about the savages, the savages, and like, Oh, it's
Speaker 1: just gonna be like what our society is now. And
Speaker 1: but then I underestimated all this hugs racism um, and
Speaker 1: then it turned out to be something entirely different. But
Speaker 1: I was like, oh, yeah, black Friday wedding, shotgun weddings,
Speaker 1: that is what you would expect. Well, they all have gone,
Speaker 1: like the guns are a very important part of their
Speaker 1: culture constantly. Everybody hasn't gone. But I also think that
Speaker 1: it's just like a fundamental misunderstanding of what the difference
Speaker 1: was between like the New World and then end quote
Speaker 1: Savage Land in the book, where it wasn't like black
Speaker 1: a Day and weddings which are like sexual and romantic
Speaker 1: and like a shotgun wedding is like an act of
Speaker 1: passion in romance where it's like I would think that
Speaker 1: a stranger thing for a New London person would be
Speaker 1: seeing like a big cathedral wedding with like religion and superstition,
Speaker 1: you know, Like I just I didn't understand the ratio
Speaker 1: where it's like, no, that the difference is New London
Speaker 1: is all about like pleasures and consumering and buying things
Speaker 1: and having sex and like get married if you get
Speaker 1: want and have a baby, where it's like no, they
Speaker 1: would be weirded out by, like yeah, I would think
Speaker 1: like a ceremony with a veil and like a virgin bride,
Speaker 1: Like they would be more scandalized by like someone waiting
Speaker 1: for marriage to have sex than a shotgun wedding. I
Speaker 1: just think the show misunderstood that where they were like, oh,
Speaker 1: shotgun wedding tacky, that's what it is. They're tacky. It's
Speaker 1: like you know, you don't that's not it, right, am
Speaker 1: I No? I said, I feel like the one thing
Speaker 1: about the shotgun wedding and the preycy is that pregnancy
Speaker 1: is such a like oh my god London and like
Speaker 1: the idea of motherhood specifically, So I think that's one
Speaker 1: of the reasons that it had to be like bail
Speaker 1: belly like Ali want. But they did such a bad
Speaker 1: job of setting that up in the New in New London,
Speaker 1: Like there was no real Like that's what I missed
Speaker 1: about what was in the book that did not make
Speaker 1: it to the TV show is that there wasn't any
Speaker 1: discussion of like how this world came to be, what
Speaker 1: like the like different factories and the cloning, and that
Speaker 1: there aren't any mothers and like we don't see the
Speaker 1: conditioning of children until like episode two, And I thought
Speaker 1: that was like the most interesting aspects of that original book.
Speaker 1: And all we get is just like monogamy or g sex,
Speaker 1: we get a little conditioning later a little And in
Speaker 1: the book it is such a layup, Like the way
Speaker 1: the book is structured, Like the first fifty pages are exposition,
Speaker 1: like a guy giving a tour, And I feel like
Speaker 1: you could have easily taken that and just adapted that
Speaker 1: to screen, Like I think that would be a fun
Speaker 1: entry point into the world. You would have loved watching that. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's a freebee. Tell us what is happening. He'll put us,
Speaker 1: give us a tour, give us the Jurassic Park. Like
Speaker 1: I'm what's I'm a d n A you know that
Speaker 1: whole one thing I also found a little confusing and
Speaker 1: maybe you guys can help what you think the appeal
Speaker 1: of this was. But um, the different inass in classes
Speaker 1: in the cast between like alpha and epsilon, I was
Speaker 1: very wildly confused about how John in the book is
Speaker 1: able to get through this wall. And they're like, oh
Speaker 1: my god, he's an alpha exotic. That's amazing, Like I
Speaker 1: think that's what they call him right there, like we've
Speaker 1: never seen this specimen. But I thought in the show,
Speaker 1: but I thought the whole point of like the alpha
Speaker 1: epsilon things was that you're like genetically made in a factory.
Speaker 1: So how it doesn't benefit doesn't make sense that he
Speaker 1: is in alpha. How would he be an alpha? Was
Speaker 1: his dad was an alpha, his mother was a beta.
Speaker 1: Here's the thing, though, I don't think it's genetic that Indra,
Speaker 1: Indra what's it called, controls the force field. So it
Speaker 1: was never about you're whether you're in alpha or not.
Speaker 1: It was about whether Indra wanted you to leave or not.
Speaker 1: But they examine him when they're when they're paying him,
Speaker 1: and they're like and they're like, he has the eyes
Speaker 1: of an of an alpha. Like whatever dumb thing they
Speaker 1: come up with but I'm like, I thought the whole
Speaker 1: point of the alpha's were the people who are like
Speaker 1: genetically engineered or not. There aren't moms and dads can
Speaker 1: How can you be an alpha if you have a
Speaker 1: mom and dad? Even if your mom is it's not
Speaker 1: like eye color, Maybe it is. Maybe maybe whatever you're
Speaker 1: supposed to determine that are like eye color, and they're
Speaker 1: passed down to me. It's dumb. But I mean, no
Speaker 1: shade to the people who wrote this. I'm sure they
Speaker 1: did a lot of really hard work and it's a
Speaker 1: difficult piece to agree. It's very good. They made nine
Speaker 1: episodes of it, nine whole episode But here's my thing
Speaker 1: about it. My understanding in the book was that alpha's
Speaker 1: were always one egg, one sperm, and every other every
Speaker 1: other cast was what's it called the splitting method? I
Speaker 1: forgot the new game. Yeah, So for me, my understanding,
Speaker 1: having read the book and then watched the show was, Okay,
Speaker 1: the reason he has an alpha eyeball is because he
Speaker 1: was actually conceived with one egg and one But then
Speaker 1: everyone everyone, everybody, Okay, really maybe it's just okay, you
Speaker 1: can't like not a blank it solved? Okay, no, but
Speaker 1: indraw was what was controlling the force field? Sure, yeah,
Speaker 1: you know fun a fact. Okay, both of my parents
Speaker 1: are Canadian, but I was born in America. But that
Speaker 1: means that I'm still a Canadian citizen because both of
Speaker 1: my parents are not Canadian. Okay, have you guys seen
Speaker 1: Gattica because I think Gatica that was really good at it? Like, Jen,
Speaker 1: does that mean you have Canadian eyeballs? Is that is
Speaker 1: that what the meaning of that is? To text that
Speaker 1: I should be allowed into Canada because I have Canadian eyeballs? Yes,
Speaker 1: that is how it would work, all right, So that
Speaker 1: that is my Those are my like big qualms where
Speaker 1: I was like, I don't think the people who understood
Speaker 1: who made this understood like the message the parable of
Speaker 1: the book. And then also I don't find the show entertaining.
Speaker 1: But again, it's very hard to make a show. So
Speaker 1: if you're listening to this and and worked on it,
Speaker 1: I'm you job. I mean, my god, it's so hard
Speaker 1: to get anything made. It is so hard to get
Speaker 1: anything made. I will say that. Like. Also glaring things
Speaker 1: to me are that, like the main characters are all white.
Speaker 1: We're just like I can't believe you're like coming out
Speaker 1: with a new like streaming service, and the characters that
Speaker 1: were mostly focused well, I've seen the first three so
Speaker 1: like it all focused, so you're correct day and that
Speaker 1: I wish it was queerer. It really isn't like everyone
Speaker 1: ends up matching very like seemingly straight, and even in
Speaker 1: the orgy scenes, I'm like, everyone is still paired up
Speaker 1: in interestingly straight couplings. And if there is there's a
Speaker 1: later orgy, how everybody is bisexual you yourself half of
Speaker 1: the population, that's yeah, but the visual of it is
Speaker 1: still very straight and very white and very character They
Speaker 1: do mean because there is the scene where Bernard is like, oh,
Speaker 1: I forgot savages are weird about dudes? Fucking dudes? Yeah,
Speaker 1: I know he explicitly says that because Bernard's like, go
Speaker 1: grab yourself a dude, and he's like no, I'm good.
Speaker 1: Like He's like, no, homo, but and Bernard's like, don't
Speaker 1: do that. What's your problem? Dude? But I'm yeah, and
Speaker 1: miss listen. I only got through episode two. But in
Speaker 1: that episode, when they're talking about how like the new
Speaker 1: London or stole our land and all that stuff, it's
Speaker 1: a lot of like mapping over Native issues, real Native issues,
Speaker 1: and it's a bunch of white people saying that I
Speaker 1: guess correct, And I was like, oh, I don't I
Speaker 1: don't love that. Uh, you know, it felt tricky and
Speaker 1: like a little bit disappointing. I couldn't agree more. I
Speaker 1: agree with you. There is a way to successfully out
Speaker 1: of orically talk about issues without including those people. Like
Speaker 1: the movie pleasant Bill, which is a movie about segregation
Speaker 1: and race that hasn't marry a black person, And I
Speaker 1: love that movie. I think it's great. It has one
Speaker 1: of my favorite lines in the world where she's talking
Speaker 1: to Reese Spoon is talking to her friend and she's like,
Speaker 1: you can't believe you guys are twins. You must have
Speaker 1: been from the cool side of the uterus, which is
Speaker 1: truly the dumbest thing I've ever heard. My favorite, my favorite.
Speaker 1: I love Pleasantville because it's my favorite movie in which
Speaker 1: a woman. Yeah, but I think that they dropped the
Speaker 1: ball on being able to allegorically talk about the issues
Speaker 1: of land thievery and not include Native voices. I think
Speaker 1: that there might have been a way to do it,
Speaker 1: but they didn't figure it out. And I don't know
Speaker 1: what that way is either. I'm not saying they should
Speaker 1: have done this. I don't know what that way either is,
Speaker 1: but like, yeah, having that one woman keep saying like
Speaker 1: they stole our land. She said like a million times,
Speaker 1: and I'm like, you got stop saying. I don't know
Speaker 1: if that even made sense for they're British. They're British
Speaker 1: and they're just coming to visit this. I think a
Speaker 1: computer simulation. Yeah, like, what is this white lady who
Speaker 1: lives in America. You're in America, right, what is what
Speaker 1: are you accusing them of the land? And they made
Speaker 1: it into a theme park? But it's a big land.
Speaker 1: I mean, it seems very very big. It's not like
Speaker 1: they're using that, you know. I don't know. I felt
Speaker 1: like that wasn't the message that it could have been.
Speaker 1: It could have been like there the halves and where
Speaker 1: they have not and they have this technology and bro
Speaker 1: whatever they were saying. I just don't think her grievance
Speaker 1: like made the most sense emotionally to me. Okay, another
Speaker 1: thing that bothered me a lot um. One of the
Speaker 1: things that I think is really interesting in the book,
Speaker 1: and that he's one of the downsides of their society
Speaker 1: that the really clear about is that entertainment is not
Speaker 1: very good, Like theater is not very good. They can't
Speaker 1: do Shakespeare there. But they're taking all these eleven year
Speaker 1: old children to see what is like. It's not a
Speaker 1: great theatrical productionant at least one, but the people involved
Speaker 1: in care about a lot that has like legitimate emotions
Speaker 1: involved and and gonna shoot out and like a lot
Speaker 1: of people are yelling and saying lives and there's a
Speaker 1: little poetic bit in the middle. But the bonything they're
Speaker 1: seeing is like, not great theater, but it certainly qualifies
Speaker 1: in my mind just to see it. Um, these are
Speaker 1: all very very smart people seeing it. Are you really
Speaker 1: telling me that everyone would see this and be like, well,
Speaker 1: the only thing we can make is pornographic movie. That
Speaker 1: is what we're gonna do. Not all pornographic though, But
Speaker 1: like Jennifer, you're right where it's like they make it
Speaker 1: very clear that there's an upper limit to the amount
Speaker 1: of art you can achieve in in this world where
Speaker 1: everything is preordained and there's no suffering. But they there
Speaker 1: there are there are no barriers in this they should
Speaker 1: be no. I mean, they have shadowed the ceiling that
Speaker 1: has been said in the book for one of theatrical experience. Um,
Speaker 1: that insane guy who just starts dealing at Bernard about
Speaker 1: how he is an actor. He's working without a net
Speaker 1: all the time, is in fact correct by the standards
Speaker 1: and play a new world. He is the greatest actor
Speaker 1: in the world and he should be respected. But none
Speaker 1: of them take that back, none of them like. I
Speaker 1: like how they told lies. But it felt true. Oh, emotions,
Speaker 1: when we have emotions, that's interesting, that's something for us.
Speaker 1: Why aren't they just all doing like a little historic
Speaker 1: place about what they think monogamy is. I love that.
Speaker 1: I would watch that. I also think it's very It
Speaker 1: was also a little disappointing that the whole point of
Speaker 1: the book was like to criticize Forward and the what's
Speaker 1: an assembly line? Assembly line the mechanization of the workforce,
Speaker 1: which is a legitimate thing worth criticizing. And then uh Lenina,
Speaker 1: who's a factory worker. She's working at like a at
Speaker 1: a at a desk in her own little microscope. There's
Speaker 1: no factory, there's no assembly line. This is a universe.
Speaker 1: There was a thing, there was a conveyor belt. I
Speaker 1: did not think that there was a factory vibe vibe
Speaker 1: that I was like, this isn't it. This doesn't feel
Speaker 1: like a universe devoted to Ford. Um. I am also
Speaker 1: fascinated by, uh, what gammas are in this book because
Speaker 1: Gamma is my favorite character. I think. I think it's
Speaker 1: hard to read a book like this and not on
Speaker 1: some level being like, I wonder what social class I
Speaker 1: would fit into Gamma all the way we need talk,
Speaker 1: but also like the little Historians, there's a Gamma on
Speaker 1: the tour but I love that. Yeah, who got to
Speaker 1: wear a little hat? I'm telling you people, Yeah, and
Speaker 1: I told him about Gary the Gamma. Okay, So Gary
Speaker 1: the Gamma is a gamma that is assigned to John
Speaker 1: the Savage when he comes to New London and basically
Speaker 1: he's his confidante and his butler, and Um. It also
Speaker 1: shows to me that John, while he's criticizing this world,
Speaker 1: is very much into the lifestyle that he immediately because
Speaker 1: there is a moment where, um, oh my god, there's
Speaker 1: this moment where Bernard just totally crushes Gary in his
Speaker 1: conditioning and it is so weird and fun to watch
Speaker 1: because he knows that John and Lenina have been having sex,
Speaker 1: which happens in the show like a lot. He doesn't
Speaker 1: call her a strumpet, so it's still bad their relationship,
Speaker 1: it's not. Yeah. But so then Arry the Gamma is
Speaker 1: like shamed because he has broken his confidence for John.
Speaker 1: He's like, I thought that I was being a good
Speaker 1: Gamma and Bernard's like, you're not a very good gamma
Speaker 1: after all, are you. So Gry runs off feeling all
Speaker 1: of his feelings and has no soma, and and then
Speaker 1: m Garry's always baking for them. Everything Gary bakes is wonderful.
Speaker 1: I mean, Gammas are basically housewives. It seems it seems like, yeah,
Speaker 1: it seems like everybody's problems. You can't say that you
Speaker 1: don't have a family stretcher if everybody gets assigned a
Speaker 1: servant who is wildly devoted to you and the benefits
Speaker 1: about Yeah. So then he John comes out of the
Speaker 1: shower and he's like Gary, Gary, and then Gary's not there,
Speaker 1: And then he comes out and sees Bernard and he's like,
Speaker 1: where is Gary? I had to dry myself. Garry's been
Speaker 1: drying him. Gary is gently chalming him off like a baby.
Speaker 1: So there is monogamy, And yeah, I think that Gary
Speaker 1: was like a little bit in love with John. I
Speaker 1: think that's a gamma's role. I think they are essentially housewives.
Speaker 1: People are like deeply no, um no. It seems like
Speaker 1: if you were an upperclass person, you all get your
Speaker 1: own Gamma and they're just gonna take care of you. Man,
Speaker 1: They're just gonna stroke your hair you go sleep and
Speaker 1: make little shift shish noises. They're like a household. Yeah, Gamma,
Speaker 1: and they like look really good. And I think they
Speaker 1: are like a salmon color, unless like a nice pinkish color. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I loved Gary the Gamma and he was by far
Speaker 1: my favorite character because he seemed like one of the
Speaker 1: more complex characters. I know, what do Gammas do on
Speaker 1: their days off? Because they seem like the only people
Speaker 1: who are deeply feeling their feelings? Like do they just
Speaker 1: all get together and have coffee and like, okay, if
Speaker 1: you won't believe what my alfa did, I've got some
Speaker 1: stuff to talk about. Another great spin another great spin off,
Speaker 1: which which feels like it's a multicam you know, just
Speaker 1: like a Gamma multicam sitcom. Yeah you get the break room,
Speaker 1: you know. Yeah, they all baked like a special ext
Speaker 1: retreat for this, because that's what they like doing I
Speaker 1: would love like a I would love a series that's
Speaker 1: for women who are all Gammas and they like hang
Speaker 1: out together on their days off and their friends and
Speaker 1: it's like the Gamma Girls, Pitt Check, Karama, Pitch. Are
Speaker 1: you listening to the show? Sorry, we're to have opinions.
Speaker 1: The thing is, I mean we have said that there's
Speaker 1: many there are many things that are good about the show.
Speaker 1: They just don't all come together in a way that
Speaker 1: I think makes it the best show I've ever seen.
Speaker 1: But there is somebody out there who thinks this is
Speaker 1: the best show they've ever seen. Actually, somebody's favorite show. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think we should all take a break, check in
Speaker 1: with our Gammas, and then come back. So we're back
Speaker 1: with Popcorn Book Club for My Heart Radio, Melissa. I
Speaker 1: think he mentioned earlier when we were talking about this adaptation,
Speaker 1: it's so hard to make things in Hollywood that like
Speaker 1: you just need I p and they were like, Brave
Speaker 1: New World, that's the thing we've heard of. We can
Speaker 1: turn that into a West World where it was less
Speaker 1: about like the interest in what the book was than
Speaker 1: the fact that this book that people have heard of existed,
Speaker 1: which you know, kind you can in this book with
Speaker 1: the four people sitting in a room and discussing for
Speaker 1: seventeen pages, has said they heard that they can't do Shakespeare,
Speaker 1: and then and then they go to an island, and
Speaker 1: then they go off to an island and it's fine.
Speaker 1: There's bad weather, if you know, if they're doing like
Speaker 1: you said, was the c WS where I wish they
Speaker 1: would have like leaned in even more than to all
Speaker 1: like the weird romance and relationships that like I didn't get.
Speaker 1: I didn't, I wasn't rooting for I didn't. I was like,
Speaker 1: I'm not rooting for anyone. And I don't know what
Speaker 1: you're trying to say. With this version of Brave New World,
Speaker 1: it does feel like, as I was reading it and
Speaker 1: knowing there was a show and having seen the poster
Speaker 1: and stuff, it feels like a development and marketing super
Speaker 1: challenge to be true to the book or like true
Speaker 1: to the tone and the like sort of dark nature
Speaker 1: of the book and the slowness of the book. While
Speaker 1: starring a bunch of sexy twenty year twenty something year olds,
Speaker 1: it feels like it's always going to veer in the
Speaker 1: c W direction. I feel like the only show that
Speaker 1: I've seen that does not do that in recent history.
Speaker 1: Is Euphoria right, Like it does go darker and pushes
Speaker 1: darker and or like transgressive. But I think you Euphoria
Speaker 1: benefit from being like a trojan Horse and the other
Speaker 1: drab looks. It looks like a teen show, and then
Speaker 1: secretly it's a prestig show. Where this they were like, look,
Speaker 1: it's so Prestigie, and then they try to like sneak
Speaker 1: it in to be pulpy, and then you have to
Speaker 1: go the other way. I agree. I disagree with the
Speaker 1: categorization of this as a c W show one just
Speaker 1: because I really like c W shows and I feel
Speaker 1: like you're using it pejoratively and I don't appreciate it. Well,
Speaker 1: I am a big fan of a lot of c
Speaker 1: W shows, Okay, I love Laying the Virgin, I love
Speaker 1: Um Craziest Girlfriend and Buffy. Ye I can't believe Supernatural
Speaker 1: is ending this year, like that's that's half my life over.
Speaker 1: But I do think that I feel like the c
Speaker 1: W for all of its dramatic interpretations of I p
Speaker 1: like I mean Riverdale, which we have mentioned many times
Speaker 1: on this podcast for a good reason. Yeah, I mean
Speaker 1: and it is an adaptation um so Riverdale, It's still
Speaker 1: is grounded in the relationships between people. I feel like like,
Speaker 1: at the end of the day, I know the Jugead
Speaker 1: and Betty care about each other and that's what why
Speaker 1: the choices were made, but I don't see that here.
Speaker 1: And like Supernatural, it's the relationship between Sam and Dean
Speaker 1: and their brotherhood that makes the show move forward and
Speaker 1: why people have been watching it for fifteen years. Yeah, totally.
Speaker 1: I mean that's what I mean from like the seat,
Speaker 1: not pejorative, but like the seat. What people love and
Speaker 1: what I love is those relationships. Like it felt like
Speaker 1: this show was attempting to do that, like with the
Speaker 1: with the even the poster of the three of them,
Speaker 1: you're like, oh, is this going to be like a
Speaker 1: love triangle thing that you're going to have to try
Speaker 1: to figure out and like root for someone to win
Speaker 1: someone over. Not that that is a part of the
Speaker 1: book at all, but like it's kind of a set
Speaker 1: up like that, or or even like it looks like
Speaker 1: it could be that in the night there was I
Speaker 1: was reading for no one. I didn't care about anyone's relationship,
Speaker 1: but it's like, did anyone have a crush on anyone
Speaker 1: where it's like the pilot of Riverdale. Do you understand
Speaker 1: right away Betty has a crush on Archie and then
Speaker 1: this hot girl Veronica arrives an now Archie likes Veronica. Simple,
Speaker 1: we know who the conflict where it's like in this
Speaker 1: who does Bernard like Lanina more than anyone else in
Speaker 1: any meaningful way? And you also kind of have to
Speaker 1: bank on the fact that in a society with your monogamy,
Speaker 1: you found three people who were incredibly committed to the
Speaker 1: idea of monogamy. People weren't being like, all right, let's
Speaker 1: all fun. We don't believe in like not being bisexual.
Speaker 1: So here we go. Well, I do think it. Just
Speaker 1: to be clear, I did sort of mean as a pejorative,
Speaker 1: but I didn't mean that the c W is a
Speaker 1: bad thing. I mean that people try at being that,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, and do not succeed. I
Speaker 1: feel like the only one I've seen recently that succeeded
Speaker 1: as you on Netflix. I feel like it was Life.
Speaker 1: Nobody watched people that talk to me about it when
Speaker 1: it was on Lifetime. Everybody would I do to Lifetime
Speaker 1: because they've been creating amazing content they did unreal which
Speaker 1: wassib I watched. I watched you on Lifetime and was like,
Speaker 1: is this good? Is this secretly really good? Good? It's
Speaker 1: really good. But I will say it is such a
Speaker 1: challenge when you think about this book, because every good
Speaker 1: TV show is about relationships, and we care about relationships,
Speaker 1: and this is a book that's like people don't care
Speaker 1: about relationships any one person. That's the whole freaking thing,
Speaker 1: you know. And even in the book, you're like, oh,
Speaker 1: they're going to fall in love. John's going to come
Speaker 1: around to with Lenny and it's like no, he just
Speaker 1: was like, you're a strumpet and her like. That's why
Speaker 1: Gary's the most interesting character. He's the only person who
Speaker 1: has a strong and ever present emotional tie to someone.
Speaker 1: The other person who I think is a very fascinating
Speaker 1: character is Franny. Yeah, very interesting in her competitive friendship
Speaker 1: with Lanina. I think that. I think it's also very sexful,
Speaker 1: Like I definitely sex with each other. Yeah, that's what
Speaker 1: I meant. I didn't want to spoil it for people.
Speaker 1: Why is that not in the first three episodes because
Speaker 1: they have the Trojan the queer stuff. Because I don't
Speaker 1: I don't think they show the sex itself. There is
Speaker 1: a moment where Franny comes into Lenina's room and like yeah,
Speaker 1: and then Lanina this isn't the point where Lenina is like, no,
Speaker 1: I believe in monogamy, but hasn't told people because so
Speaker 1: they don't sleep with each other they have, they haven't
Speaker 1: and they implied that because you don't want to tickle
Speaker 1: or something the word tick, which he definitely uses tickle.
Speaker 1: She goes, I know how you like tick. They're using
Speaker 1: the lesbian vernacular. Great? Is it just me? Or In
Speaker 1: the book Brave New World, which the Dystopia was like
Speaker 1: bad and I get totally get that, but was the
Speaker 1: one thing where I was like, oh that, actually this
Speaker 1: is kind of a good thing was that people were
Speaker 1: like less puritanical about sex, and this show was like
Speaker 1: that is the worst thing about it. Like I thought
Speaker 1: that the one good thing about the Dystopia was like
Speaker 1: at least people didn't like sledge shame and like people
Speaker 1: could just sleep with people when they want, which is
Speaker 1: like a pretty I think monogamy is great, but I
Speaker 1: also think if you want a sexual relationship, go for it.
Speaker 1: And I was like, Okay, this this Utopia. Dystopia has
Speaker 1: some goods and some bads, but the TV show went
Speaker 1: hard on that it is the worst thing about this dystopia.
Speaker 1: The most evil thing is I think we are having
Speaker 1: when when Bernard and Lena are at the when they
Speaker 1: first get to the hotel or whatever at the Savage Lands,
Speaker 1: and it was hot, it was really hot, but it
Speaker 1: also made it like I laughed out loud because for
Speaker 1: them to stop and be like, let's save ourselves, it's
Speaker 1: like extreme edging. I was like, Wow, what is the
Speaker 1: message of this show? What are we Yeah, I think
Speaker 1: that one of the things about the show is the
Speaker 1: introduction of the lack of privacy, and that's supposed to
Speaker 1: speak to sort of our interconnected social networking and social
Speaker 1: media world. And I don't think that that landed like
Speaker 1: the idea have no privacy, And it was actually deeply
Speaker 1: alarming to the point where I mean, in the very
Speaker 1: first ten minutes, Lenina walks into his office and he's like,
Speaker 1: here's some imagery of you getting railed over the last
Speaker 1: couple of months. Did you know that you've only been
Speaker 1: sleeping with one man? Because I know because I can
Speaker 1: watch you. Like that was deeply alarming to be more
Speaker 1: into that, and it would have been interesting. But instead
Speaker 1: they were just like, all these people fuck all the
Speaker 1: time and then John comes and teaches them how to
Speaker 1: be good. Yeah, it seems like the thesis of the
Speaker 1: of the film. The film. The show was very Twilight
Speaker 1: and that it's like, wouldn't it be sexy if we waited?
Speaker 1: Which I also want to say it's a valid choice, totally, totally,
Speaker 1: but but but is it the most relevant thesis of
Speaker 1: Brady World a property? He is very relevant today. I
Speaker 1: just want to say on the record that if you
Speaker 1: think it's sexy to wait, then I am so happy
Speaker 1: for you. But it is not sexy for everyone. And
Speaker 1: that's okay. And that's sort of what we talked about
Speaker 1: in the book episode is that choice is good. Yeah,
Speaker 1: to return to that, like to the discussion that we
Speaker 1: had about the book, great did I only watched two
Speaker 1: episodes this but but if that's I thought, the more
Speaker 1: poignant message about the like non monogamy and the sort
Speaker 1: of dystopian nature of it, is less about like, oh
Speaker 1: you shouldn't have a partner. It's like, oh, you shouldn't
Speaker 1: love anyone, you shouldn't care about one person's life or
Speaker 1: relationship with one person. If someone dies, who cares? You
Speaker 1: shouldn't have a maternal, paternal or parental love, romantic love,
Speaker 1: friendship love. None of that matters. And I'm kind of
Speaker 1: disappointed that none of that seems like it's in the show.
Speaker 1: It's right about monogamy, it's good. I think a lot
Speaker 1: of the problem with that is turning turning all of
Speaker 1: these things into this George Saunders esque being park because well,
Speaker 1: obviously they at least say this is to show how
Speaker 1: bad it was back then, but there are obviously parts
Speaker 1: of it that are very alluring and enticing. Like I
Speaker 1: I don't think you could be a thirteen year old
Speaker 1: child and here a man recite a love home to
Speaker 1: a woman and not be like, oh, I'd like somebody
Speaker 1: to do that for me one day. That would be cool.
Speaker 1: Have you met thirteen year olds recently, because I'm scared
Speaker 1: of all of them. I'm thinking of thirteen year old boys,
Speaker 1: old girl. Yeah, yeah, okay, But I feel like by
Speaker 1: showing them the fascinating passions experienced by these people, you
Speaker 1: obviously make those passions alluring right away. Like, I just
Speaker 1: don't believe that you could have this theme park where
Speaker 1: you give people a guide book of like they saved
Speaker 1: themselves your marriage and it was so erotic, exciting, and
Speaker 1: they went out to see highly oiled men before the
Speaker 1: bride gave herself away, but she couldn't touch them, and
Speaker 1: nobody went back to New London. It was like, I'm
Speaker 1: going to start doing mad that's my empty thing now, Um,
Speaker 1: everybody would do that. It's just um the entire Brave
Speaker 1: New Girl Books. Society I think is built around the
Speaker 1: idea of ignorance the love could be a desirable thing,
Speaker 1: and that families and passion could be a desirable thing,
Speaker 1: and that art and theater could be desirable. Um. That
Speaker 1: society works because you've distracted people so much that they
Speaker 1: just don't think about it. And there are so many
Speaker 1: instances in the television show where like whether it's John
Speaker 1: coming back and like giving this speech up parties where
Speaker 1: he talks about how like he's never gonna love again
Speaker 1: because like the girl he loved died, um, where you
Speaker 1: make all of those emotions immediately desirable, Like you can't
Speaker 1: tell me that people don't hear him give that speech
Speaker 1: at a party and be like I think it would
Speaker 1: I love now I'm in love with Mary jeez, who
Speaker 1: I'm in love with now. It's also it looks very
Speaker 1: weird that like that you're right that the whole point
Speaker 1: of like the Brave New World Utopia is that distraction
Speaker 1: and that like we only have new games if it
Speaker 1: it capitalistically makes you need to buy more uh accessories,
Speaker 1: and all our movies are are propaganda that well is
Speaker 1: just crazy and erotic and whatever. And it's like this
Speaker 1: world is very minim list and there's nothing distracting. It's
Speaker 1: all just like modest jumpsuits that are obstacle golf. Maybe
Speaker 1: you would tell us that it showed up later it
Speaker 1: tennis like tennis with a light ball, but like a
Speaker 1: lot of empty space, a lot of minimalism, a lot
Speaker 1: of walks where someone might be alone with their thoughts. Yeah,
Speaker 1: there's not enough distraction to keep these people numb, like
Speaker 1: the soma is. That's it, and that's not good enough
Speaker 1: for this world to like keep them numb to even
Speaker 1: feeling remotely like discontent with how content I do feel
Speaker 1: like that was one of the things that really shook
Speaker 1: me in the book, was never being alone with your thoughts,
Speaker 1: because it does feel like something that I personally struggle
Speaker 1: with of like going on walks. I'll listen to a podcast.
Speaker 1: I hope you're listening to a podcast right now. It's
Speaker 1: very good. Um, but it does feel like that is
Speaker 1: things so in our culture of like where you're alone
Speaker 1: for five minutes, you check Twitter, you check Instagram, whatever,
Speaker 1: and it does feel disappointments such an opportunity to to
Speaker 1: like hit people. You know, I will say there is indra,
Speaker 1: and I know keep saying in this case, I am correct,
Speaker 1: because the whole kind of indra is you just think
Speaker 1: about a person and you're with them. But they dedicate
Speaker 1: using that, so it's like the best targeted ad. They
Speaker 1: didn't like visually convey injury. Injury was like very minimalist.
Speaker 1: Also in the eye and like very like modern and yeah,
Speaker 1: minimalist where it's like injur wasn't like distracting. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: was hoping for like times square times a million. Yeah,
Speaker 1: just like also like Versailles, like a fashion that would
Speaker 1: be fun. Yeah, like weird stuck, give me like excess.
Speaker 1: Well look it's Peacock's HBO. They didn't have that kind
Speaker 1: of budget. The budget and they didn't have money and
Speaker 1: be see universal they have a lot of money Peacock,
Speaker 1: although I will say that does speak to the model
Speaker 1: of Peacock itself, and just because this is sort of
Speaker 1: the first big property that Peacock has, I think we
Speaker 1: should talk about how they have this freemium model where
Speaker 1: Peacock itself is free to sign up for, but then
Speaker 1: they have like levels, so if you wanted to watch
Speaker 1: Brave New World, you do have to pay money for it,
Speaker 1: and they can't guarantee that everybody is going to want
Speaker 1: to pay money for things when they have free things. Also,
Speaker 1: like all of Downto Nabby, so you can still see
Speaker 1: Lady Sybil. Oh thank god. My question for the four
Speaker 1: of you, who are all intelligent, television adjacent slash in people,
Speaker 1: if you were given the book Brave New World, what
Speaker 1: would your approach to turn into a television series of
Speaker 1: nine or or fewer or more episodes? Well, first of all,
Speaker 1: we make an eight. I didn't earn the nine, and
Speaker 1: that's when Melissa Hunter said, wow, yeah, would make it eight.
Speaker 1: I don't know. I think i'd make it. I think
Speaker 1: I'd make it like a mini series sort of. Allah.
Speaker 1: I know as much as true um, and I feel
Speaker 1: like there's stuff that just needs to come out. I
Speaker 1: think that some of the things that they were trying
Speaker 1: to incorporate, like maybe we don't have world controller Mond
Speaker 1: and we can't we like mash that character up with
Speaker 1: Henry with the director and Henry because they he becomes
Speaker 1: the director whatever. I think that there were too many
Speaker 1: characters in the show, and characters that were not in
Speaker 1: the book that we're in the show, and I think
Speaker 1: that we could actually pare down the characters in the
Speaker 1: book and then focus on one person, so focus on Bernard,
Speaker 1: focus on Lenina. I would probably focus on Bernard, despite
Speaker 1: the fact that I think that Lanina as a woman
Speaker 1: is somebody that I identify more with, but Bernard in
Speaker 1: terms of fish out of water and having this sort
Speaker 1: of legacy that he's supposed live up to as an
Speaker 1: alpha that he is being questioned on. It's funny, however,
Speaker 1: dunk Son, It's funny that everyone dunk Son, Burner Rama.
Speaker 1: We would do a great show together because I feel
Speaker 1: like I have the same instincts I think when you
Speaker 1: think about Black Mirror, like I'm a big Black Mirror fan,
Speaker 1: and I feel like some some episodes are super strong
Speaker 1: and some aren't as strong. And I feel like the
Speaker 1: strongest ones are always a big world with a small
Speaker 1: central relationship that has like very high stakes and like
Speaker 1: the one with Lady Sybil, Yes, very I think it's
Speaker 1: a very distracting world. I think, Yes, the one that
Speaker 1: really got me, that has always stuck with me is
Speaker 1: the one where um, they everyone records things with their
Speaker 1: eyes and every memory is recorded and uh, and it's
Speaker 1: like this jealous guy who thinks his wife is cheating
Speaker 1: on him. And again it's guess simple right in a
Speaker 1: big world. And I think that's what you do with
Speaker 1: Bernard and Um and Lanina. It's like make them the
Speaker 1: central relationship. John is the one that kind of comes
Speaker 1: in between them. Um. But but it's like what is
Speaker 1: their central conflict and their dynamic and really hone in
Speaker 1: on that, and then you have John sort of like
Speaker 1: blow it all up. Yeah. My ark would be that
Speaker 1: Bernard starts feeling like a fish out of water and
Speaker 1: then in the end he goes to his island and
Speaker 1: he gets to feel like he belongs and it's like, oh,
Speaker 1: maybe sometimes it's not you, sometimes it's society, And maybe
Speaker 1: being a misfit is an okay thing in a world
Speaker 1: where everyone expects you to be a misfit. Um. But yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't know what the show was trying to do
Speaker 1: or say. Yeah, I think, um, I think it touches
Speaker 1: on something that we meant it earlier. I'd like to
Speaker 1: see them lean into these characters being antiherists. Like in
Speaker 1: the book, everybody picks on Bernard, Bernard's awful. Everybody picks
Speaker 1: on him for understandable reasons, um, and the Savage is
Speaker 1: maybe has a better knowledge of Shakespeare, but it is
Speaker 1: also awful and probably murders the central woman in the
Speaker 1: book by the end. So I think not leaning into
Speaker 1: those characteristics is what makes it feel like a c
Speaker 1: W show that it feels like they've watered this down
Speaker 1: so really gloss over the murder that he does in
Speaker 1: the show, like straight marks his dad and nobody ever
Speaker 1: brings it up ever again at all. I forget that
Speaker 1: he doesn't. Yeah, exactly my point. Yeah, yeah, it's just
Speaker 1: kind of painted as like, um, I guess, an acceptable
Speaker 1: moment of feeling. But I'm sure Gary would like help
Speaker 1: him get a passport and get him out to another
Speaker 1: country because because sports in that world. Indra in this
Speaker 1: podcast episode sponsored by Indra, what about you, Dana. I
Speaker 1: think that definitely makes it. I mean you you're all
Speaker 1: those instincts all sound right. I think like the one
Speaker 1: major thing or like the fix because of the book,
Speaker 1: racism of the Savage Land is true, like you need
Speaker 1: to fix that. But I don't know if the theme
Speaker 1: park worked for me. I do kind of like the
Speaker 1: idea that they would just go and it would just
Speaker 1: be regular America. But it's just just jet actual regular America.
Speaker 1: What I would do, which is just like not a
Speaker 1: theme park. It's just really hard to get a travel
Speaker 1: visa to go. If you're like a high ranking alpha,
Speaker 1: you can go, and it's just they just go to
Speaker 1: like the Cleve Cleveland and just like like this is
Speaker 1: kind of shitty in a different way. So that's my
Speaker 1: that would be my one. But I would spend like
Speaker 1: a week in Cleveland with no silma. Yeah you can
Speaker 1: whether they're like it's a stressful experience. They like watch
Speaker 1: a movie that's like a normal movie and they're like, Okay,
Speaker 1: it's fine. They seem like they see like a Cleveland
Speaker 1: production of like Wicked, and then they're like theatery scarbage.
Speaker 1: If they go back home and that feeling is true,
Speaker 1: It's fine. It was a little flat, like not not
Speaker 1: bad listening when you're in Cleveland, They're not. I really
Speaker 1: I enjoyed Cleveland the perspective of a of a New
Speaker 1: London asshole. They wouldn't appreciate the joys of Cleveland like
Speaker 1: I would. I've never been to Cleveland, but I think
Speaker 1: I mean regular. I only know Cleveland from the thirty
Speaker 1: Rock bit where they're like that, I love that bit.
Speaker 1: Wasn't the Drew Carey show set in Cleveland? Yes? It was?
Speaker 1: Did they just choose a spot on a map ors
Speaker 1: from Cleveland? I feel like he has feel like he
Speaker 1: has to be from Cleveland, you know what. I feel
Speaker 1: like the only reason we're thinking of Cleveland is because
Speaker 1: he's a lot of pop culture, Like Cleveland is too sophisticated.
Speaker 1: Send them to this moy Tiowa. Cleveland doesn't sound like
Speaker 1: a real word anymore. Yeah, did you tell us how
Speaker 1: you would write the show? I mean I would. I
Speaker 1: would do something similar to Melissa and Karma is just
Speaker 1: like focus on that those relationships of Bernard uh Lanina
Speaker 1: and John. I mean my dream would be too. I
Speaker 1: would clear the hell out of it and follow Lanina
Speaker 1: and maybe have Bernard to be a woman as well
Speaker 1: and have them kind of like play around with the
Speaker 1: fact that this world is what do you say, Bernard
Speaker 1: debt um, because it does seem like, you know, we
Speaker 1: still get to see these men making these decisions based
Speaker 1: on their emotions, and I want to I want to
Speaker 1: give the women in this world that opity opportunity to
Speaker 1: do that and not just have like John b Emo
Speaker 1: and Bernard b also Emo in his wheels weird Weasley way.
Speaker 1: Also in terms of people who are related to famous people.
Speaker 1: Tom Stoppard's son is also in it, and he plays
Speaker 1: the I'm forgetting his name, just the the guy in charge,
Speaker 1: Bernard's boss who shows up something to say to lecture
Speaker 1: him worked, the white guy, the one who gets pushed
Speaker 1: over the cliff. No, I didn't, I didn't finish this fathers. Yeah, sorry,
Speaker 1: I kind of do. Sometimes have white guy face blindness
Speaker 1: with really generic looking handsome guys. Were handsome in there
Speaker 1: to make it okay, but like if someone is like
Speaker 1: a certain level of handsome, they just all look the
Speaker 1: same to me, like every every like bachelor guy, every
Speaker 1: guy who's ever been on the badelor I can never
Speaker 1: I can't tell a part. I mean, I think that's
Speaker 1: done on purpose. They all, yeah, they're all casting cast
Speaker 1: to look the same the same there twice And I
Speaker 1: found it out recently and I was like, really, I
Speaker 1: would have never known if you lined them up. They
Speaker 1: should just be renaming the same guys every season with
Speaker 1: a different name and a different occupation. Like, wow, Matthi
Speaker 1: architect really looks a lot like Mark the Pilot. I
Speaker 1: just take it over it. They make them like change
Speaker 1: their whole identity every time social Security number. Also, I
Speaker 1: think for if we were to write this, I would
Speaker 1: love to see just like capitalism even grosser than what's
Speaker 1: being shown, just like they don't really gross capitalists. No
Speaker 1: person buy a thing. Do they have money? Like it
Speaker 1: doesn't it's not clear. It's certainly clear in the book
Speaker 1: that they have to keep consuming that someone guys because
Speaker 1: Lenina talks about that someone bought her like a darling
Speaker 1: Mouth Lucian belt. Yeah, and that was a gift. And
Speaker 1: the show, do they have money, It's very unclear. It's
Speaker 1: unclear they don't. It's unclear how they like have their
Speaker 1: their apartments and like how they get and their damas,
Speaker 1: just as signed the game just like you have a
Speaker 1: person that's your person, Yeah, my person, and they just
Speaker 1: love you. Yeah. I there was something that was really
Speaker 1: intriguing that I don't remember at least being explored in
Speaker 1: the book. I've blocked out the majority of the book
Speaker 1: because I was like, I don't care for this. This
Speaker 1: is racist, racist in a lot of ways. Um, but
Speaker 1: they get There's a part where Lenina and Bernard do dating,
Speaker 1: as they call it. Um. They try out doing a
Speaker 1: date like a monogamous, savage person would do, and Bernard
Speaker 1: is basically like trying to see if Lenina like likes him,
Speaker 1: which is sweet in a way, but then he gets
Speaker 1: really frustrated when she clearly is like I want to go.
Speaker 1: But then he like plays chicken with her in a
Speaker 1: way where he's like, okay, so now we fuck, and
Speaker 1: then she's like clearly not interested in it, but starts
Speaker 1: taking her clothes off because it's what she's supposed to
Speaker 1: do because she's a beta, and he does stop her,
Speaker 1: he doesn't assault her, but like the fact that he's
Speaker 1: willing to humiliate her in that way was very weird,
Speaker 1: and I don't know it sort of got into this
Speaker 1: idea like the betas are supposed to be good time
Speaker 1: girl all the time, and I are all the fascinating.
Speaker 1: Not all of the women are betas. I think in
Speaker 1: this they do have alpha's that are women. I'm pretty sure.
Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure all the women are betas because he
Speaker 1: wrote it in and women didn't develop full brains until
Speaker 1: women didn't get the right to vote in Switzerland until
Speaker 1: the nineteen seventies. Did you know that? But I found
Speaker 1: it out today. It is curious though maybe I mean, again,
Speaker 1: only watch two episodes, but in the second episode on
Speaker 1: the bus that like, there's like a shitty kid who's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: you're a beta, like and why would he say that
Speaker 1: if like every woman was a beta like that, you're
Speaker 1: a lady Helm is a I'm pretty sure. I felt
Speaker 1: the tender swopping on that was fun, was very good.
Speaker 1: She was too artistic for a dystopia. She was too cool.
Speaker 1: That ended up being her problem. And she became so
Speaker 1: fascinated by the idea of John's feelings and how she
Speaker 1: got to explore his feelings, like she downloaded his feelings
Speaker 1: and she was like, I've never seen anything like that before.
Speaker 1: And then she like takes off her wig and he's
Speaker 1: a new person, Like again giving these people full history books,
Speaker 1: why wouldn't you just do like a bunch of historical promise. Um,
Speaker 1: the the amount of information they have given them is
Speaker 1: not compatible with the art that this world is turning out.
Speaker 1: Part of a part of a dystopia is you have
Speaker 1: to restrict information, like the difference with this and they
Speaker 1: haven't at all. There's that famous essay of like the
Speaker 1: difference between comparing Brave New World with n and it's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: the dystopia in nineteen eight four is they destroy all
Speaker 1: the books and restrict it and center it. And the
Speaker 1: difference in Brave New World is they give you so
Speaker 1: much that you don't even care to read the history books.
Speaker 1: So it's like they're not doing either of those things.
Speaker 1: So why is the system working in a bit of
Speaker 1: the matrix? Because that's the at the end of the series,
Speaker 1: and it's like a test. It's like to see if
Speaker 1: Indra can withstand the Savage coming in and he's like
Speaker 1: a virus. Like it's so weird. It's such a bizarre
Speaker 1: ending that came from nothing. In the book Full Scale Revolt,
Speaker 1: I forgot that part. They murder people, they murder people.
Speaker 1: The exons just completely revolt and c Jack sixty is
Speaker 1: the leader of the revolt, and then when he sees
Speaker 1: how it actually ends up happening because it's done with
Speaker 1: the use of Indra, because you can't tell anybody apart
Speaker 1: other than with Indra because they don't have their color
Speaker 1: coordinated outfits like they did in the book. So, um,
Speaker 1: if there were a couple of people who like took
Speaker 1: Indra out and he was like, oh god, this is
Speaker 1: this is not good, what's happening, and those people get
Speaker 1: to live and they're like, it's it's really interesting to
Speaker 1: see how Indra is the only way that they can
Speaker 1: tell what class anybody is. So once you take that out,
Speaker 1: everybody's the same. Maybe that maybe that is what the
Speaker 1: remake should have been, is just follow ce Jack see
Speaker 1: Jack sixty. Yeah, and not following alpha and not follow
Speaker 1: a beta, not follow someone who's like up in that society,
Speaker 1: because they start doing it a little bit where they're
Speaker 1: where he like touches the person that jumped up like
Speaker 1: touches his clone, and he has a feeling that was bizarre.
Speaker 1: But if that's what you wanted, if that is something
Speaker 1: that you wanted to explore, that like people are starting
Speaker 1: to like play with emotion and feeling. I would buy that.
Speaker 1: It's very the giver that it's like, oh, people, people
Speaker 1: are starting to have emotions. What's happening. One of the
Speaker 1: best scenes in the book, though, is the scene that
Speaker 1: makes it so clear that revolt it's impossible that John
Speaker 1: in the book tries to start a revolt, and the
Speaker 1: first of all, everybody's just really annoyed that he's growing
Speaker 1: out their soma. And then once it got so annoyed
Speaker 1: that they're willing to attack him, they just really a
Speaker 1: cloud of so mane to the air and they play
Speaker 1: a little recording saying like, why are you doing this?
Speaker 1: Please be good, just be nice to each other. Okay,
Speaker 1: all right, right right right right right right right right
Speaker 1: right right yeah, nice, right right nice? Yeah, what we
Speaker 1: do here again? I would be into that too. Yeah, absolutely, yeah.
Speaker 1: I think one of the most interesting parts of their culture,
Speaker 1: and the reason I think their culture keeps working is
Speaker 1: because you just do that every time there's an attempt
Speaker 1: at uprising. Yeah, it's a successful it's a successful dystopia.
Speaker 1: And also if someone is too smart for it, they
Speaker 1: send you to a nice island where it seems fine,
Speaker 1: where then you don't. It's not like they're murdering people
Speaker 1: and they're guillotining people and they're like, oh we have
Speaker 1: to Okay, this system is not working. This is violent.
Speaker 1: It's like, all right, if you don't work for the system,
Speaker 1: go live in like the Falkland Islands with fun. Okay,
Speaker 1: that sounds nice. I'll do that what we're saying about
Speaker 1: that though, And I wonder do they do that with
Speaker 1: gammas and absalon's or do they just do it with
Speaker 1: like alpha's and baby But I think the prob the
Speaker 1: thing in the book is it assumes that gammas and
Speaker 1: epsilons are so programmed that they would never even have
Speaker 1: the ability to see outside the box they love, that's true.
Speaker 1: And they also all have like fetal alcohol syndrome. Yeah,
Speaker 1: they're like they're like actually brain damage like on purpose, yeah,
Speaker 1: developmentally like actively stunted. Yeah, I mean bad. But aspect
Speaker 1: of it was missing from the show. Yes, yeah, the
Speaker 1: AICs was gone. Yes, said they really they flattened it out,
Speaker 1: They made it much more. They made the like questions
Speaker 1: of morality and society just like way less pressing. I mean,
Speaker 1: you could you could push all of those things to
Speaker 1: make it more relevant for to and they just flattened
Speaker 1: it out. Yeah, doing like a very eugenics heavy, um
Speaker 1: dystopian show. That would have been interesting, scary look a
Speaker 1: dystopian world about like the distraction of consumerism and social
Speaker 1: media and also eugenics and also apathy that people just
Speaker 1: don't care is very scary and I would want to
Speaker 1: see that. And I was just like disappointed that we
Speaker 1: didn't get that. And that's why I think so not
Speaker 1: to harp on the nine episodes, but I feel like
Speaker 1: if they had had episodes, if they had kind of episodes,
Speaker 1: I feel like they might have been able to figure
Speaker 1: out a way to stretch and explore all of those things.
Speaker 1: But like they went for nine, not even eight, So
Speaker 1: it doesn't feel like they were told, you only have
Speaker 1: eight episodes. I don't I don't know what happened there.
Speaker 1: I think that they like came up with the thing
Speaker 1: and they were like, Okay, we said all the things
Speaker 1: we want to say. I say all the things that
Speaker 1: the book wanted to say. I feel like the nine
Speaker 1: meant that they that the I was like, how many
Speaker 1: do you need to tell the story you want to tell?
Speaker 1: And he's like mm hmm nine, So they got exactly
Speaker 1: what they wanted. You know, it wouldn't work if John
Speaker 1: got completely absorbed into that society. Would that be a
Speaker 1: kind of tragedy if he went there and just by that,
Speaker 1: like he ended up realizing that he didn't want to
Speaker 1: towel himself off ever again, then he wanted Gary to
Speaker 1: gently towel off his wet body every time he came
Speaker 1: out of the shower for the rest of his life.
Speaker 1: I think he would have been happier. I mean maybe, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't know down into the show, so I don't
Speaker 1: know how good this toweling off is. So I can't
Speaker 1: make it. I can't make a good judgment. Very gentle
Speaker 1: Garry is very lovely him, and we're talking like what
Speaker 1: kind of what kind of really fluffy? Okay, yeah, just
Speaker 1: Gary warms it up a little bit beforehand, Pyle, Okay, well,
Speaker 1: then that would have been tragic. I would have liked
Speaker 1: to see. Yeah, they didn't include any of the good stuff.
Speaker 1: I think that they did a disservice to themselves by
Speaker 1: making the first two episodes medium good and then like
Speaker 1: making those the three episodes because we're I not watching it.
Speaker 1: I always will watch anything for three to five episodes
Speaker 1: just to test it out. I'll watch truly pretty much anything. Um.
Speaker 1: But if it weren't something that we were talking about
Speaker 1: for this show, with the first two episodes being free,
Speaker 1: I don't think I would have pushed to go further. Like,
Speaker 1: I don't think I would have signed up to get
Speaker 1: more episodes. Yeah, we had watched this for this and
Speaker 1: we only watched two and three. Yeah, it's about relationships, right.
Speaker 1: I feel like I could see a version where you
Speaker 1: just really slow it all down and like really drill
Speaker 1: into Bernard and Lenina in the first episode and like
Speaker 1: why we care about them, and then you just an
Speaker 1: episode three, you're with John and you don't know who
Speaker 1: he is, you don't know like what world the whole episode. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's very like yeah exactly, uh, and it feels like
Speaker 1: then you're just with him and then you you understand
Speaker 1: how the world's intersect. Like I'd be all in. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that sounds I want to watch that. I want to
Speaker 1: watch that show too. Yeah, Peacock, what do you think
Speaker 1: a reboot of Brave New World? At least? No, I
Speaker 1: think that we've we've done enough braving of this New
Speaker 1: World we can stick with old worlds and other new
Speaker 1: worlds that have other adjectives, so like maybe like a
Speaker 1: funky new world. I don't know. I would love a
Speaker 1: world that's just about like funk music, just like funk
Speaker 1: music and soma just like people having a good time.
Speaker 1: People would love that. I know exactly what people would
Speaker 1: love that. And they're on Somac show. I think that's
Speaker 1: just like a live concert fish. It's a fish concert,
Speaker 1: some funny music, people on drugs. Fun. Thank you so
Speaker 1: much for listening. Next week is Rebecca, So get reading
Speaker 1: if you want to read along or just watch the movie.
Speaker 1: We're doing both of them. There's one coming to Netflix
Speaker 1: with Army Hammer and Lily James. So thanks for listening.
Speaker 1: Bye bye bye. That's our show for the week. Thank
Speaker 1: you so much for listening. I'm Danish Schwartz and you
Speaker 1: can find me on Twitter at Danis Schwartz with three
Speaker 1: z s. You can follow Jennifer Wright at Jen Ashley Right, Karama,
Speaker 1: Donqua is at Karama Drama, Melissa Hunter is at Melissa
Speaker 1: f t W and Tan Tran is smart enough to
Speaker 1: have gotten off Twitter, but she is on Insta at
Speaker 1: Hank Tina Our Executive producer is Christopher Hessiotes and were
Speaker 1: produced and edited by Mike John's Special thanks to David Wasserman.
Speaker 1: Next week, we are going goth in time for Halloween.
Speaker 1: Not like dressing in black listening to the care goth Unfortunately,
Speaker 1: we're discussing the gothic novel Rebecca by Daphne Dumourier, soon
Speaker 1: to be a film on Netflix. Popcorn book Club is
Speaker 1: a production of I Heart Radio