WEBVTT - Screen Time: Brave New World 0:00:04.680 --> 0:00:07.360 So when you're talking about books being adapted into movies 0:00:07.400 --> 0:00:10.080 and TV shows, the cliche that always comes to mind 0:00:10.200 --> 0:00:12.920 is the book was better. But if you've listened to 0:00:12.920 --> 0:00:16.919 our last couple episodes about Alvie Huxley's Brave New World intent, 0:00:17.160 --> 0:00:20.079 you should do that. If you haven't, you've heard our 0:00:20.840 --> 0:00:24.200 myriad issues with it. Well, this week we are getting 0:00:24.200 --> 0:00:28.880 into the adaptation for NBC's Peacock, and now you'll want 0:00:28.920 --> 0:00:32.239 to hear our myriad issues with that as well. It 0:00:32.320 --> 0:00:35.239 doesn't lend itself very well to adaptation, which is why 0:00:35.240 --> 0:00:37.199 when I finished reading it, I was like, what they 0:00:37.280 --> 0:00:40.120 made this into a show, And it turns out they didn't. 0:00:40.440 --> 0:00:44.880 So Welcome back to Popcorn Book Club. I'm Danis Schwartz, 0:00:45.000 --> 0:00:48.080 joined as always by Jennifer Wright, Tan Tran, Melissa Hunter, 0:00:48.120 --> 0:00:51.640 and caramadan Qua, and today we are back on screen 0:00:51.680 --> 0:00:55.840 time the name for the segment that I have unilaterally 0:00:55.880 --> 0:01:01.000 decided to move forward of it? You did. I just 0:01:01.080 --> 0:01:04.679 made this decisions for the moment with such confidence that 0:01:04.720 --> 0:01:06.920 we all were like, yes that is the name. Yeah, 0:01:07.560 --> 0:01:09.360 you said it with such confidence that it made me 0:01:09.360 --> 0:01:11.520 feel like I did vote for it. Yes you did. 0:01:11.640 --> 0:01:13.759 You just all forgot. I just assumed that I missed. 0:01:15.040 --> 0:01:18.120 I thought it like Mr. I Heart Radio told us 0:01:18.120 --> 0:01:22.960 it had to be called that. I am Mr Karama. 0:01:23.040 --> 0:01:29.000 His name is I Heart Radio, Ivan Heart Radio. It's 0:01:29.040 --> 0:01:35.640 like a haunted mansion to Stone. So we are back 0:01:35.640 --> 0:01:38.720 on the segment that Mr. The president of I Heart 0:01:38.760 --> 0:01:41.839 Radio told us had to be called screen time talking 0:01:41.840 --> 0:01:46.280 about Brave New World. The I want to say adaptation, 0:01:46.360 --> 0:01:52.880 but not even really adaptations. It a title and very 0:01:52.920 --> 0:01:59.600 little and some characters people keep making fun of Bernards 0:01:59.600 --> 0:02:03.520 like c W West World. I maybe say that is 0:02:03.560 --> 0:02:08.160 such a yeah, have we said the name yet? It's 0:02:08.200 --> 0:02:13.000 Brave New World on NBC's streaming series Peacock. Again a 0:02:13.120 --> 0:02:16.720 very loose adaptation, and that they picked a few elements 0:02:16.760 --> 0:02:19.240 that I think they liked. But before we dive in, 0:02:19.280 --> 0:02:22.000 because I think we're gonna have a lot to say, Jennifer, 0:02:22.440 --> 0:02:24.400 you're you're a defender of the show, and so I 0:02:24.440 --> 0:02:28.000 want to start with you on just in your own words, 0:02:28.160 --> 0:02:30.040 what you think the show is about and what you 0:02:30.120 --> 0:02:33.720 enjoy about it. Okay, So first of all, um, not 0:02:33.919 --> 0:02:36.840 that you need a defense for enjoying anything, because we 0:02:36.880 --> 0:02:38.800 would never be afraid to like things that we'd like. 0:02:39.480 --> 0:02:44.799 But um, A note is that I watched the first 0:02:45.160 --> 0:02:48.520 i'm gonna say four episodes of this after having a 0:02:48.600 --> 0:02:53.520 very minor operation and I was on painkillers. So I 0:02:53.680 --> 0:03:01.400 have a sense that henced my my enjoyment of at 0:03:01.480 --> 0:03:05.040 least the first portion of the show, because I did 0:03:05.160 --> 0:03:10.080 notice a guarantee reason quality. I was no longer on 0:03:10.280 --> 0:03:13.160 thank killer. But I just thought, like, I guess it 0:03:13.240 --> 0:03:16.040 really ran out of ideas, like two and a half hours. 0:03:16.280 --> 0:03:19.679 It might have been something else. I mean, I kind 0:03:19.760 --> 0:03:22.360 of thought it came together towards the end. I think 0:03:22.360 --> 0:03:25.880 because I let go of all of my expectations, I 0:03:25.919 --> 0:03:28.120 was gonna say, did we watch the same show? Because 0:03:28.160 --> 0:03:30.640 it did not come together. It came together kind of 0:03:30.680 --> 0:03:32.680 the same way that when a kid makes you a 0:03:32.680 --> 0:03:36.640 little mudpie and then here you go, it's like together 0:03:37.920 --> 0:03:44.240 only for a second, crumbling watch the entire show. No 0:03:44.360 --> 0:03:48.840 I didn't. I did, Karama did see And how far 0:03:48.960 --> 0:03:52.840 could you get? I only got I only got three 0:03:52.880 --> 0:03:56.120 episodes in when he just starts, he just got back, 0:03:56.360 --> 0:03:59.800 or John just is in the room. That's very freaking out, 0:04:00.280 --> 0:04:05.040 like I can't can you put in? You put in exactly? 0:04:07.400 --> 0:04:09.200 This is this brings up one of my gripes. So 0:04:09.240 --> 0:04:11.200 you got a third of the way through. Because the 0:04:11.280 --> 0:04:13.880 series is nine episodes, which is not a thing that 0:04:13.960 --> 0:04:18.040 I've ever heard of anyone ever doing. And I'm all 0:04:18.120 --> 0:04:22.120 for the fact that we now have this streaming ability 0:04:22.160 --> 0:04:23.760 which makes it so that we don't need to follow 0:04:23.800 --> 0:04:26.640 the conventions of network television. And I think that's great, 0:04:26.640 --> 0:04:29.480 and I think innovation is cool. But because the show 0:04:29.640 --> 0:04:32.920 was also not great, I don't know why they didn't 0:04:33.279 --> 0:04:36.440 do more or less episodes. I don't know what it 0:04:36.480 --> 0:04:39.400 would have benefited from one more or one few. The 0:04:39.640 --> 0:04:42.760 more I think in terms of episodes, it's kind of 0:04:42.800 --> 0:04:46.440 my rule about movies that no movie should be over 0:04:46.520 --> 0:04:50.880 two hours unless it's very very good. If it's very very, 0:04:51.000 --> 0:04:53.200 very very good, I don't care how long it is. 0:04:53.240 --> 0:04:56.159 But if some movie is like a B plus and 0:04:56.240 --> 0:04:58.760 it's two hours and one minute, I'm like, what's happening? 0:04:58.880 --> 0:05:01.680 Why are generate? I feel like a minus? Get that 0:05:01.720 --> 0:05:04.800 ship out of here. And I think it's the same 0:05:04.839 --> 0:05:06.960 with episodes. It's like, if it's going to be more 0:05:07.000 --> 0:05:09.480 than eight these days, you got to prove your ninth, 0:05:09.600 --> 0:05:16.640 you know, prove your ninth. Nine. We listen, that's the 0:05:16.720 --> 0:05:19.719 name of your TV writing school. Prove your ninth, your 0:05:19.839 --> 0:05:26.200 nine seminar no sense to like half of the whatever. Yeah, 0:05:26.920 --> 0:05:30.440 it'll make sense on the ninth class. Yes, it's intriguing. 0:05:30.640 --> 0:05:32.520 You have to have a title that makes you want 0:05:32.600 --> 0:05:36.080 to ask questions and and find out more. Well the 0:05:36.200 --> 0:05:39.599 well the classes eight sessions, and then you have to 0:05:39.640 --> 0:05:42.520 pay for the nights. So I'm proving my ninth. You know, 0:05:43.200 --> 0:05:49.839 I type the class. So let's talk about the similarities 0:05:50.120 --> 0:05:53.760 with the book. First, I got that there's a character 0:05:53.880 --> 0:06:01.360 named Bernard. It's Bernard, It's Bernard. There's a people say 0:06:01.560 --> 0:06:05.280 they're British. That's a British people. Really, okay. I was 0:06:05.320 --> 0:06:08.359 just like, this is a fun one. Actually did not 0:06:08.520 --> 0:06:12.240 like the fact that John kept saying Bernard when everybody 0:06:12.240 --> 0:06:14.880 else is saying Bernard, And I'm like, you can say Bernard. 0:06:14.920 --> 0:06:18.640 Like if that part I would say weird, I would 0:06:18.680 --> 0:06:23.240 feel weird saying Bernard to a British person. I have 0:06:23.320 --> 0:06:26.120 an uncle Bernard who's American, and we've just always called 0:06:26.200 --> 0:06:30.720 him Bernard because that's I like that. Yeah, that's better, 0:06:30.920 --> 0:06:33.279 it's objectively better. I just thought this an American. I 0:06:33.320 --> 0:06:36.200 was forced to always say Bernard Bernard. That was like 0:06:36.240 --> 0:06:40.360 the British one pounce their name in a different way. 0:06:40.800 --> 0:06:43.359 Probably just go with that. I just keep thinking of 0:06:43.440 --> 0:06:45.279 him as Bernard because I read it that way. Yeah, 0:06:45.320 --> 0:06:49.119 me too. Yeah. Well, the fun fact I learned about 0:06:49.120 --> 0:06:53.320 the actor playing Bernard is that he's Charles Dickens, like 0:06:53.440 --> 0:06:57.479 great great great grandson, which is just one he does. 0:06:58.160 --> 0:07:01.560 I don't look like he's Else Dickens, great great great 0:07:01.600 --> 0:07:04.560 pants and totally. I also just want to point out 0:07:04.640 --> 0:07:07.719 that Charles Dickens tried to get his wife institutionalize so 0:07:07.720 --> 0:07:09.800 he could run off with a teenage mistress. And I've 0:07:09.840 --> 0:07:19.920 never forgiven him for that. She was she was an actress, 0:07:20.080 --> 0:07:23.160 She was very very young, and his wife had something 0:07:23.400 --> 0:07:26.040 like nine children, might have been six sowhere in that 0:07:26.240 --> 0:07:33.240 six to nine range of children. Yeah, and then he 0:07:33.280 --> 0:07:37.360 tried to get her institutionalized, and that's a horrible, horrible 0:07:37.400 --> 0:07:39.800 thing to do. Well, one of those six to nine 0:07:40.080 --> 0:07:43.680 babies had some more babies, and one of them became 0:07:43.720 --> 0:07:49.000 an actor. Who is good. He was great, She did 0:07:49.040 --> 0:07:51.560 a good job. Everybody. I think everybody did a very 0:07:51.640 --> 0:07:56.800 nice job. I thought the costumes were delightful. The Weasley 0:07:56.840 --> 0:07:59.120 man that you that is your type, okay, because I 0:07:59.120 --> 0:08:03.440 was like John is also We's John is not my type. 0:08:03.480 --> 0:08:06.360 Though I don't like like cowboys. I don't think he 0:08:06.480 --> 0:08:09.440 might like a cowboy. I don't think he as a cowboy. 0:08:09.960 --> 0:08:14.400 My my theory about Aldan Aarnich, who is uh the 0:08:14.480 --> 0:08:18.560 actor who played John John in this series um is 0:08:18.600 --> 0:08:21.880 that everything about him to me reads as a British 0:08:21.920 --> 0:08:25.880 actor playing American even though he's like born in l A. H. 0:08:26.160 --> 0:08:28.480 I don't know why. He just seems very like he's 0:08:28.480 --> 0:08:30.920 a British guy, like doing that American accent that's very 0:08:31.000 --> 0:08:33.760 like we have to go, we have to go to 0:08:33.800 --> 0:08:39.240 get us. Like he British, he is a person who 0:08:39.280 --> 0:08:41.680 grew up in l a and went to theater school 0:08:41.679 --> 0:08:44.520 and college. He just seems like exactly that, like an 0:08:44.679 --> 0:08:48.520 l A kid who took some like voice classes, non 0:08:48.679 --> 0:08:53.680 singing voice voice actor he did like Alexander method, and 0:08:53.720 --> 0:08:59.040 now he's like very into his front palette. Honestly, I 0:08:59.120 --> 0:09:01.959 like him. I think it's kind of a bummer that 0:09:02.080 --> 0:09:05.880 he's gotten these high level roles that people don't turn 0:09:05.920 --> 0:09:09.880 out to like. Like Solo he played, I liked it too. 0:09:10.280 --> 0:09:12.679 I thought it was like a super fun movie, but 0:09:12.760 --> 0:09:16.400 super intense fans did not like it. And it's really 0:09:17.080 --> 0:09:22.800 I liked this record. Yeah, I'm saying I really like 0:09:22.920 --> 0:09:25.720 him In Hail Caesar. I think that's a really good movie. 0:09:26.880 --> 0:09:30.680 That movie that had like George Clooney and a bunch 0:09:30.720 --> 0:09:35.080 of white people. It was like all white people. All 0:09:35.120 --> 0:09:39.840 white people didn't it's yeah, it's all white, but everyone 0:09:40.400 --> 0:09:43.040 is good in it. As a white person. He's he's 0:09:43.080 --> 0:09:45.920 everyone is great. I like all the actors for the 0:09:45.960 --> 0:09:49.120 most part. I thought everyone was like very compelling, interesting 0:09:49.120 --> 0:09:55.200 to watch. Love Sybil from down Down Nabby. I like 0:09:55.280 --> 0:09:57.200 didn't recognize her at first, and then I was like, 0:09:57.640 --> 0:10:03.280 who is this stunning woman? I recognize it as like wait, 0:10:03.559 --> 0:10:07.120 could it be it is? I'm so excited and like 0:10:07.280 --> 0:10:10.880 she's great. She is not usually in starring roles, so 0:10:10.920 --> 0:10:12.760 I think that it's nice to have her in this 0:10:12.840 --> 0:10:15.000 starring role. I think that it's very well acted. I 0:10:15.040 --> 0:10:17.760 think that the set, dressing and the special effects. There's 0:10:17.800 --> 0:10:20.640 a lot that's good about the show. It's just that 0:10:20.720 --> 0:10:25.280 the show wasn't like there are many good elements, but 0:10:25.320 --> 0:10:27.200 it is not greater than the sum. It's not like 0:10:27.520 --> 0:10:30.480 so in writing, you have something learned Like TV writing, 0:10:30.520 --> 0:10:32.920 you have something called like a sandbox, right, Melissa, this 0:10:33.040 --> 0:10:37.560 is this isn't earned the dime freeby is all right? 0:10:38.080 --> 0:10:40.800 So this is like in the beginning of writing, writer's 0:10:40.840 --> 0:10:43.439 rooms usually like here's our sandbox of ideas and we're 0:10:43.440 --> 0:10:45.000 just gonna like throw it all out. I'm sure it's 0:10:45.000 --> 0:10:47.800 a term borrowed from business that I don't know about, 0:10:48.080 --> 0:10:50.640 but you just throw writers throw out all the ideas 0:10:50.679 --> 0:10:53.400 possible and then you kind of skimmed through see which 0:10:53.400 --> 0:10:55.560 ones you like. It feels like they just are like, well, 0:10:55.559 --> 0:11:00.800 we have the sandbox, let's dump it all into the show. Well. 0:11:00.840 --> 0:11:04.840 I think part of the problem for me is, um, 0:11:04.880 --> 0:11:08.000 it's not a very action packed book. Like there's there's 0:11:08.000 --> 0:11:11.120 a lot of great emotional up people, but if you 0:11:11.200 --> 0:11:14.760 had to come up with any kind of like real action, 0:11:14.880 --> 0:11:17.360 it's not really there. And they clearly want us to 0:11:17.400 --> 0:11:21.760 be an action packed show. So instead of just getting 0:11:21.920 --> 0:11:27.240 found by people from New London and vacating with his mother, um, yeah, 0:11:27.720 --> 0:11:32.760 they have to escape the reservation and break their way 0:11:32.800 --> 0:11:39.480 through a smirkling magnetic field that myous, yeah, and then 0:11:39.520 --> 0:11:42.720 she gets shot in the process, and then They're gonna 0:11:42.840 --> 0:11:45.240 kill all of the people from New London. They're like, 0:11:45.320 --> 0:11:47.600 none of that happens in the book. It's like, as 0:11:47.600 --> 0:11:51.080 I understand it, it's like a minor bureaucratic discussion that 0:11:51.320 --> 0:11:55.120 does not lead to any car chases and clearly is 0:11:55.840 --> 0:12:01.440 mostly quiet philosophical discussions. It. Yeah, they could have gone that. 0:12:01.559 --> 0:12:04.520 It could have been how Normal People. I remember thinking like, 0:12:04.559 --> 0:12:06.440 how is normal People are going to be adapted into 0:12:06.440 --> 0:12:08.880 a show? It's so internal and like, oh they did that. 0:12:08.960 --> 0:12:11.880 They did that very successfully on screen. I think that 0:12:12.080 --> 0:12:15.959 Normal People also is about two people, and that's the thing. 0:12:15.960 --> 0:12:18.240 We get to see those two people interact, and I 0:12:18.280 --> 0:12:21.160 feel like we talked in our episode on the book 0:12:21.160 --> 0:12:26.440 Brave New World. There is not a protagonist, so it's 0:12:26.480 --> 0:12:30.000 not It doesn't lend itself very well to adaptation, which 0:12:30.000 --> 0:12:31.600 is why when I finished reading it, I was like, 0:12:31.720 --> 0:12:34.360 what they made this into a show, And it turns 0:12:34.400 --> 0:12:39.200 out they didn't, so you know, Like I mean, it 0:12:39.240 --> 0:12:42.319 focuses so much on the monogamy aspect and the next 0:12:42.360 --> 0:12:45.840 aspect of it that is not that prevalent in the 0:12:45.880 --> 0:12:48.120 book in the way that I was like, this is 0:12:48.160 --> 0:12:50.560 such a like made for TV thing. That they're trying 0:12:50.559 --> 0:12:54.839 to do, like opening with her talking about monogamy and 0:12:54.880 --> 0:12:58.120 like having those like three rules. At the very beginning, 0:12:58.160 --> 0:13:00.800 I was like, oh god, this is going to be 0:13:00.840 --> 0:13:04.480 all about sex, isn't it? And then when the orgies 0:13:04.600 --> 0:13:09.760 can we talk? I only saw one or I need 0:13:09.760 --> 0:13:12.559 to I need to say a story about watching the orgy. 0:13:12.679 --> 0:13:15.400 So I thought it was going to be a personal orgy. Sorry, 0:13:17.080 --> 0:13:20.960 but I live in a small apartment with my fiance 0:13:22.880 --> 0:13:25.520 and we have this little device on our TV that 0:13:25.600 --> 0:13:29.280 you can um you can listen to like bluetooth it 0:13:29.320 --> 0:13:31.080 because we don't have like an update TV whatever, So 0:13:31.160 --> 0:13:33.079 I will listen to TV on our headphones a lot 0:13:33.120 --> 0:13:35.520 of time to when the other one isn't watching. I 0:13:35.559 --> 0:13:38.640 was watching it the other day during the day and 0:13:38.679 --> 0:13:41.520 he was where he was working, and he was just like, 0:13:41.679 --> 0:13:45.600 what are you what? Like he literally turned up right 0:13:45.920 --> 0:13:48.600 when the orgy had started. I'm like, it's not it's 0:13:48.840 --> 0:13:54.200 it's a classic literature pod, just like I was watching 0:13:54.400 --> 0:14:00.080 porn in the afternoon on a Monday. I want to 0:14:00.080 --> 0:14:02.640 say the record, I think that the problem with this 0:14:02.800 --> 0:14:06.360 adaptation isn't that they added action, which is fine to me. 0:14:06.559 --> 0:14:09.040 I thought they made the costumes boring and like they 0:14:09.120 --> 0:14:11.840 decided that, like, oh, the aesthetic is just boring. Futures 0:14:11.840 --> 0:14:16.200 that coast or cost that store case which I had 0:14:16.280 --> 0:14:18.680 never heard of before you sent something about it. The 0:14:18.679 --> 0:14:25.320 group that is where they shopped. It's like boxy neutral colors, 0:14:26.120 --> 0:14:34.760 uh like very clean. They have like beautiful indescent panel costume. 0:14:35.040 --> 0:14:38.160 But I wanted like like kicky little green outfits with 0:14:38.200 --> 0:14:44.040 like little belts, and they described all these like little outsay, 0:14:44.080 --> 0:14:48.200 because it's very important. It sounds like all Lenina's outfits 0:14:48.240 --> 0:14:54.520 in the book her spectacular pointed. Okay, the green outfit 0:14:54.640 --> 0:14:56.640 where she goes to the new I just kept thinking about, 0:14:56.640 --> 0:14:58.600 like that's gonna look so cool on screen, and then 0:14:58.600 --> 0:15:01.480 she just wore like a jumpsuit. So that's what I found. 0:15:02.480 --> 0:15:05.280 That's what I found most disappointing is that they fundamentally 0:15:05.320 --> 0:15:09.000 seem to misunderstand the message of the book Brave New World, 0:15:09.080 --> 0:15:12.480 which is so relevant, which is that like consumerism and 0:15:12.520 --> 0:15:17.360 wanting more more fashioned, more more toys, more experiences, more 0:15:17.400 --> 0:15:20.960 like based like um frivolous human pleasures, which is so 0:15:21.040 --> 0:15:24.000 relevant than distracts people from wondering like is our life 0:15:24.040 --> 0:15:28.320 even worth living? Where in this they were like everyone 0:15:28.360 --> 0:15:31.640 just wears a boring utilitarian jumpsuit. Also, the House of 0:15:31.760 --> 0:15:36.240 Want is some like savage land idea. We're no, the 0:15:36.240 --> 0:15:38.720 House of Want is supposed to be New London. Everyone 0:15:38.840 --> 0:15:43.800 is up. It's a capitalist was like the Emperor, yea, 0:15:44.760 --> 0:15:47.920 this isn't this isn't about like for the book. Like 0:15:47.960 --> 0:15:49.520 the sex in the book was just like a fun 0:15:49.560 --> 0:15:54.680 little added thing, that fun distraction that wasn't like not 0:15:55.000 --> 0:15:58.560 like undulating orgy scene that made me laugh so loud 0:15:58.560 --> 0:16:01.600 because like, I'm sorry, in this world everyone is on rhythm. 0:16:01.680 --> 0:16:05.600 There's not like one person who's just like like phrenetically 0:16:05.880 --> 0:16:09.200 like offbeat and unable to funk. Like everyone is good. 0:16:09.240 --> 0:16:12.600 I just there's so many. I just couldn't stop laughing 0:16:12.640 --> 0:16:15.600 at that. But like the fact the fact that no 0:16:15.640 --> 0:16:19.320 one the the enemy of this world is like, oh 0:16:19.360 --> 0:16:22.320 my god. The idea of monogamy that's so taboo. Look, 0:16:22.440 --> 0:16:25.640 it's so easy for people for viewers to be like, oh, 0:16:25.720 --> 0:16:28.200 I see why this world is wrong. We're in the book. 0:16:28.360 --> 0:16:30.080 I mean the book, take it, take what you will 0:16:30.160 --> 0:16:32.600 from it. But I definitely reflected I'm like, oh I 0:16:32.640 --> 0:16:35.120 see a lot of relevance and similarities in the way 0:16:35.440 --> 0:16:38.240 I structure my life and the world structures our lives 0:16:38.240 --> 0:16:42.200 and consumerism, and it wasn't as challenging in that way 0:16:42.280 --> 0:16:44.680 to me. I need to pop a few somma, So 0:16:44.680 --> 0:17:00.240 why don't we take a quick break. Okay, we're back 0:17:00.360 --> 0:17:06.040 with Popcorn book Club. The introduction of Indra really muddled 0:17:06.040 --> 0:17:10.920 things from yeah, I think, oh yeah, well the end 0:17:11.400 --> 0:17:13.639 in the end, okay, so only Karama and I can 0:17:13.680 --> 0:17:15.840 talk about this, I guess please. In the end, they 0:17:15.840 --> 0:17:23.680 find out they all live in a computer what is like, Yeah, 0:17:23.960 --> 0:17:28.520 like it's so, it's not it's not explained well enough 0:17:28.560 --> 0:17:33.000 for me to definitively say that it's a matrix. But 0:17:33.119 --> 0:17:35.240 I think it is strongly implied that they are living 0:17:35.240 --> 0:17:37.800 in a computer simulation and they just escaped at the 0:17:37.920 --> 0:17:41.440 very end, well, because like, doesn't Indra then go and 0:17:41.480 --> 0:17:46.320 live in Bernard or like the inside Bernard and go 0:17:46.440 --> 0:17:49.439 back to the Savage Lands and then they bring something 0:17:49.480 --> 0:17:52.800 but they bring with them. Yeah, yeah, I think that's 0:17:52.840 --> 0:17:56.480 what they're doing. So they're gonna tame the Savage Lands 0:17:56.960 --> 0:18:01.560 with Indra, their computer overlord who health the spirits of 0:18:01.640 --> 0:18:08.520 the nine people who created it. But no, but yeah, 0:18:08.560 --> 0:18:13.000 and C C six is a clone of one of 0:18:13.000 --> 0:18:15.720 the people who have created Indra, who is the guy 0:18:15.760 --> 0:18:19.239 that plays Klaus on The Originals. That's like straight out 0:18:19.280 --> 0:18:24.879 of West World taking that is the engine that engineer character. Yeah, 0:18:25.359 --> 0:18:31.880 that's boring. They made a message this book like Brave 0:18:31.920 --> 0:18:34.480 New World, which I think is a very relevant dystopia, 0:18:34.560 --> 0:18:37.480 and just like flattened it into like the most boring 0:18:37.640 --> 0:18:43.960 Hollywood dystopia. There's nothing You're right, there's nothing about the 0:18:44.000 --> 0:18:48.760 book Brave New World that's like great jumpsuits, sleek minimalism. 0:18:48.800 --> 0:18:53.840 Nothing is minimalism. Nothing is is stimps, computer simulation. It's like, 0:18:54.400 --> 0:18:56.600 where did you get that? We all saw Minority Report. 0:18:56.640 --> 0:19:00.520 It's fine. I thought Minority Report level where it's boom 0:19:00.560 --> 0:19:06.919 boom bye, get it, take it, want it? Um? Yeah. Also, 0:19:07.119 --> 0:19:10.080 here's the thing. Everybody in this movie becomes horny for 0:19:10.240 --> 0:19:17.320 monogny immediately, yes, which I um. If everybody is super 0:19:17.359 --> 0:19:20.639 horny for monogamy, it's hard for me to belief that 0:19:20.680 --> 0:19:23.359 there would not just be like a sea change in 0:19:23.440 --> 0:19:26.760 their society where people would be like all of the 0:19:26.760 --> 0:19:28.959 population is going to be miserable if they can't like 0:19:29.400 --> 0:19:32.360 take a whack at monogamy, So let's give it a try. 0:19:32.440 --> 0:19:36.640 And I think that's only enhanced by having this tourist 0:19:36.680 --> 0:19:41.159 attraction where you get to see INDs and violence, but 0:19:41.240 --> 0:19:45.920 like a very passionate, heartfelt wedding where somebody talks about 0:19:45.920 --> 0:19:49.800 how desperately they love the woman that they're going to 0:19:49.840 --> 0:19:53.800 be monogamous with. I will set the wedding. The thing 0:19:53.840 --> 0:19:55.679 that's funny about the wedding for me is there supposed 0:19:55.680 --> 0:19:58.359 to be like a shotgun wedding and the woman is pregnant, 0:19:58.920 --> 0:20:02.040 and I love loved it on TV when you're pregnant, 0:20:02.080 --> 0:20:07.199 you're always nine months pregnant, very visibly pregnant, which is 0:20:07.240 --> 0:20:09.240 not at all how a shotgun wedding works. So I 0:20:09.280 --> 0:20:13.000 like the idea of the like park engineers from New 0:20:13.040 --> 0:20:16.280 London being like, ah, yes, she's pregnant, we must make 0:20:16.280 --> 0:20:20.639 her very very pregnant. I do. I do like that 0:20:20.760 --> 0:20:23.600 in this world too, that there's a respect for theater 0:20:26.440 --> 0:20:30.199 is still a craft that is the most date. That 0:20:30.280 --> 0:20:33.240 line where he's like live theater is the most dangerous thing. 0:20:33.840 --> 0:20:37.480 I was like, cool, someone who has done a lot 0:20:37.520 --> 0:20:42.760 of life, but I'm making them feel I wish it 0:20:42.840 --> 0:20:46.199 was full like waiting for Guffman, like like it was 0:20:46.320 --> 0:20:50.960 my guest as the director, because it did feel I 0:20:51.560 --> 0:20:55.000 loved how over the top it all was and it 0:20:55.119 --> 0:20:58.159 just felt like an alien trying to be like I 0:20:58.359 --> 0:21:01.760 understand marriages. I really I appreciated that part. I wish 0:21:01.800 --> 0:21:03.800 it was a whole series, that it was just a 0:21:03.880 --> 0:21:07.080 Christopher guest dile like adventure land of just like people 0:21:07.200 --> 0:21:10.400 hanging out working at the Savage nothing happens that don't 0:21:10.480 --> 0:21:14.600 just feel like George saunderstory. It just like what would 0:21:14.600 --> 0:21:17.600 do and like they make friends and there's no crazy 0:21:17.880 --> 0:21:20.320 plot and we just get to know these people. I 0:21:20.359 --> 0:21:22.840 do think that it is important to recognize, though, that 0:21:23.000 --> 0:21:25.840 there are people who want to leave the Savage Lands 0:21:25.920 --> 0:21:28.399 and then they can't write, which I think is so 0:21:28.480 --> 0:21:31.199 odd because that part of the adaptation. I get that 0:21:31.240 --> 0:21:33.800 they didn't want to have it be the weird racist 0:21:33.920 --> 0:21:44.080 thing that it was in them, the racism, but introduced 0:21:44.119 --> 0:21:46.800 a weird new like haves and have not some thing 0:21:46.960 --> 0:21:49.080 and like, oh, this is where we keep our poor 0:21:49.119 --> 0:21:52.000 people to entertain us. I kind of just read it 0:21:52.040 --> 0:21:55.479 as Americans, and um, the way America is going at 0:21:55.480 --> 0:21:57.560 the moment, I kind of feel like it's what we deserve, 0:21:58.280 --> 0:22:00.520 like we should just have to put on like terrible 0:22:00.600 --> 0:22:07.359 pantomimes of for British people. Yeah, that's that's what we deserve. 0:22:07.600 --> 0:22:12.400 I sayd appreciate that change obviously because of racism. And 0:22:12.440 --> 0:22:16.240 also that's what I thought was where it was where 0:22:16.240 --> 0:22:17.800 it was going in the book when they kept on 0:22:17.920 --> 0:22:19.960 talking about the savages, the savages, and like, Oh, it's 0:22:20.000 --> 0:22:24.200 just gonna be like what our society is now. And 0:22:24.640 --> 0:22:29.480 but then I underestimated all this hugs racism um, and 0:22:29.520 --> 0:22:31.560 then it turned out to be something entirely different. But 0:22:31.600 --> 0:22:37.160 I was like, oh, yeah, black Friday wedding, shotgun weddings, 0:22:37.200 --> 0:22:41.400 that is what you would expect. Well, they all have gone, 0:22:41.640 --> 0:22:45.920 like the guns are a very important part of their 0:22:45.960 --> 0:22:50.560 culture constantly. Everybody hasn't gone. But I also think that 0:22:50.600 --> 0:22:53.840 it's just like a fundamental misunderstanding of what the difference 0:22:53.960 --> 0:22:57.040 was between like the New World and then end quote 0:22:57.080 --> 0:22:59.760 Savage Land in the book, where it wasn't like black 0:23:00.000 --> 0:23:02.840 a Day and weddings which are like sexual and romantic 0:23:02.840 --> 0:23:06.199 and like a shotgun wedding is like an act of 0:23:06.240 --> 0:23:09.080 passion in romance where it's like I would think that 0:23:09.560 --> 0:23:12.119 a stranger thing for a New London person would be 0:23:12.160 --> 0:23:17.200 seeing like a big cathedral wedding with like religion and superstition, 0:23:17.480 --> 0:23:21.199 you know, Like I just I didn't understand the ratio 0:23:21.240 --> 0:23:23.520 where it's like, no, that the difference is New London 0:23:23.640 --> 0:23:27.000 is all about like pleasures and consumering and buying things 0:23:27.000 --> 0:23:29.520 and having sex and like get married if you get 0:23:29.640 --> 0:23:32.240 want and have a baby, where it's like no, they 0:23:32.280 --> 0:23:35.280 would be weirded out by, like yeah, I would think 0:23:35.320 --> 0:23:38.400 like a ceremony with a veil and like a virgin bride, 0:23:38.400 --> 0:23:42.400 Like they would be more scandalized by like someone waiting 0:23:42.440 --> 0:23:45.639 for marriage to have sex than a shotgun wedding. I 0:23:45.680 --> 0:23:48.679 just think the show misunderstood that where they were like, oh, 0:23:48.800 --> 0:23:52.720 shotgun wedding tacky, that's what it is. They're tacky. It's 0:23:52.720 --> 0:23:55.880 like you know, you don't that's not it, right, am 0:23:55.920 --> 0:23:58.400 I No? I said, I feel like the one thing 0:23:58.440 --> 0:24:01.439 about the shotgun wedding and the preycy is that pregnancy 0:24:01.560 --> 0:24:05.600 is such a like oh my god London and like 0:24:05.640 --> 0:24:09.359 the idea of motherhood specifically, So I think that's one 0:24:09.359 --> 0:24:11.159 of the reasons that it had to be like bail 0:24:11.320 --> 0:24:14.920 belly like Ali want. But they did such a bad 0:24:15.000 --> 0:24:18.000 job of setting that up in the New in New London, 0:24:18.119 --> 0:24:20.760 Like there was no real Like that's what I missed 0:24:20.800 --> 0:24:24.080 about what was in the book that did not make 0:24:24.160 --> 0:24:26.040 it to the TV show is that there wasn't any 0:24:26.119 --> 0:24:28.600 discussion of like how this world came to be, what 0:24:28.840 --> 0:24:31.760 like the like different factories and the cloning, and that 0:24:31.760 --> 0:24:33.960 there aren't any mothers and like we don't see the 0:24:34.000 --> 0:24:37.720 conditioning of children until like episode two, And I thought 0:24:37.760 --> 0:24:41.520 that was like the most interesting aspects of that original book. 0:24:41.520 --> 0:24:44.760 And all we get is just like monogamy or g sex, 0:24:45.040 --> 0:24:48.080 we get a little conditioning later a little And in 0:24:48.160 --> 0:24:51.320 the book it is such a layup, Like the way 0:24:51.359 --> 0:24:55.600 the book is structured, Like the first fifty pages are exposition, 0:24:56.359 --> 0:24:58.639 like a guy giving a tour, And I feel like 0:24:58.720 --> 0:25:02.359 you could have easily taken that and just adapted that 0:25:02.440 --> 0:25:04.280 to screen, Like I think that would be a fun 0:25:04.880 --> 0:25:09.240 entry point into the world. You would have loved watching that. Yeah, yeah, 0:25:09.400 --> 0:25:12.280 it's a freebee. Tell us what is happening. He'll put us, 0:25:12.320 --> 0:25:15.600 give us a tour, give us the Jurassic Park. Like 0:25:15.840 --> 0:25:18.720 I'm what's I'm a d n A you know that 0:25:18.800 --> 0:25:27.760 whole one thing I also found a little confusing and 0:25:28.119 --> 0:25:32.280 maybe you guys can help what you think the appeal 0:25:32.359 --> 0:25:37.040 of this was. But um, the different inass in classes 0:25:37.040 --> 0:25:39.560 in the cast between like alpha and epsilon, I was 0:25:39.760 --> 0:25:44.359 very wildly confused about how John in the book is 0:25:44.400 --> 0:25:48.480 able to get through this wall. And they're like, oh 0:25:48.520 --> 0:25:52.399 my god, he's an alpha exotic. That's amazing, Like I 0:25:52.400 --> 0:25:54.040 think that's what they call him right there, like we've 0:25:54.080 --> 0:25:58.080 never seen this specimen. But I thought in the show, 0:25:58.560 --> 0:26:01.040 but I thought the whole point of like the alpha 0:26:01.119 --> 0:26:04.560 epsilon things was that you're like genetically made in a factory. 0:26:04.600 --> 0:26:08.000 So how it doesn't benefit doesn't make sense that he 0:26:08.119 --> 0:26:10.600 is in alpha. How would he be an alpha? Was 0:26:12.000 --> 0:26:13.760 his dad was an alpha, his mother was a beta. 0:26:13.880 --> 0:26:17.080 Here's the thing, though, I don't think it's genetic that Indra, 0:26:18.320 --> 0:26:21.879 Indra what's it called, controls the force field. So it 0:26:21.920 --> 0:26:25.480 was never about you're whether you're in alpha or not. 0:26:25.720 --> 0:26:28.160 It was about whether Indra wanted you to leave or not. 0:26:28.280 --> 0:26:31.000 But they examine him when they're when they're paying him, 0:26:31.600 --> 0:26:34.280 and they're like and they're like, he has the eyes 0:26:34.320 --> 0:26:38.520 of an of an alpha. Like whatever dumb thing they 0:26:38.560 --> 0:26:40.640 come up with but I'm like, I thought the whole 0:26:40.680 --> 0:26:42.600 point of the alpha's were the people who are like 0:26:42.640 --> 0:26:46.639 genetically engineered or not. There aren't moms and dads can 0:26:46.840 --> 0:26:48.399 How can you be an alpha if you have a 0:26:48.440 --> 0:26:50.639 mom and dad? Even if your mom is it's not 0:26:50.760 --> 0:26:55.360 like eye color, Maybe it is. Maybe maybe whatever you're 0:26:55.440 --> 0:26:58.800 supposed to determine that are like eye color, and they're 0:26:58.840 --> 0:27:04.960 passed down to me. It's dumb. But I mean, no 0:27:05.040 --> 0:27:06.719 shade to the people who wrote this. I'm sure they 0:27:06.760 --> 0:27:08.119 did a lot of really hard work and it's a 0:27:08.119 --> 0:27:12.000 difficult piece to agree. It's very good. They made nine 0:27:12.600 --> 0:27:17.400 episodes of it, nine whole episode But here's my thing 0:27:17.640 --> 0:27:21.399 about it. My understanding in the book was that alpha's 0:27:21.400 --> 0:27:26.720 were always one egg, one sperm, and every other every 0:27:26.760 --> 0:27:31.000 other cast was what's it called the splitting method? I 0:27:31.040 --> 0:27:38.240 forgot the new game. Yeah, So for me, my understanding, 0:27:38.440 --> 0:27:41.720 having read the book and then watched the show was, Okay, 0:27:41.880 --> 0:27:44.320 the reason he has an alpha eyeball is because he 0:27:44.359 --> 0:27:47.280 was actually conceived with one egg and one But then 0:27:47.840 --> 0:27:55.359 everyone everyone, everybody, Okay, really maybe it's just okay, you 0:27:55.440 --> 0:28:01.919 can't like not a blank it solved? Okay, no, but 0:28:02.040 --> 0:28:06.040 indraw was what was controlling the force field? Sure, yeah, 0:28:06.359 --> 0:28:08.639 you know fun a fact. Okay, both of my parents 0:28:08.640 --> 0:28:11.320 are Canadian, but I was born in America. But that 0:28:11.400 --> 0:28:14.000 means that I'm still a Canadian citizen because both of 0:28:14.040 --> 0:28:21.880 my parents are not Canadian. Okay, have you guys seen 0:28:21.920 --> 0:28:29.920 Gattica because I think Gatica that was really good at it? Like, Jen, 0:28:30.000 --> 0:28:32.639 does that mean you have Canadian eyeballs? Is that is 0:28:32.680 --> 0:28:36.159 that what the meaning of that is? To text that 0:28:36.280 --> 0:28:39.920 I should be allowed into Canada because I have Canadian eyeballs? Yes, 0:28:40.080 --> 0:28:43.480 that is how it would work, all right, So that 0:28:43.560 --> 0:28:46.000 that is my Those are my like big qualms where 0:28:46.000 --> 0:28:47.880 I was like, I don't think the people who understood 0:28:47.880 --> 0:28:51.200 who made this understood like the message the parable of 0:28:51.240 --> 0:28:54.080 the book. And then also I don't find the show entertaining. 0:28:55.000 --> 0:28:57.360 But again, it's very hard to make a show. So 0:28:57.480 --> 0:28:59.800 if you're listening to this and and worked on it, 0:28:59.840 --> 0:29:01.920 I'm you job. I mean, my god, it's so hard 0:29:01.960 --> 0:29:04.440 to get anything made. It is so hard to get 0:29:04.440 --> 0:29:08.400 anything made. I will say that. Like. Also glaring things 0:29:08.440 --> 0:29:11.800 to me are that, like the main characters are all white. 0:29:11.920 --> 0:29:14.200 We're just like I can't believe you're like coming out 0:29:14.200 --> 0:29:17.640 with a new like streaming service, and the characters that 0:29:17.680 --> 0:29:20.000 were mostly focused well, I've seen the first three so 0:29:20.080 --> 0:29:29.040 like it all focused, so you're correct day and that 0:29:30.000 --> 0:29:33.120 I wish it was queerer. It really isn't like everyone 0:29:33.280 --> 0:29:39.200 ends up matching very like seemingly straight, and even in 0:29:39.240 --> 0:29:42.240 the orgy scenes, I'm like, everyone is still paired up 0:29:42.840 --> 0:29:46.160 in interestingly straight couplings. And if there is there's a 0:29:46.280 --> 0:29:52.840 later orgy, how everybody is bisexual you yourself half of 0:29:52.880 --> 0:29:55.360 the population, that's yeah, but the visual of it is 0:29:55.400 --> 0:29:59.640 still very straight and very white and very character They 0:29:59.680 --> 0:30:02.920 do mean because there is the scene where Bernard is like, oh, 0:30:02.960 --> 0:30:08.960 I forgot savages are weird about dudes? Fucking dudes? Yeah, 0:30:08.960 --> 0:30:11.400 I know he explicitly says that because Bernard's like, go 0:30:11.480 --> 0:30:13.800 grab yourself a dude, and he's like no, I'm good. 0:30:14.040 --> 0:30:17.720 Like He's like, no, homo, but and Bernard's like, don't 0:30:17.920 --> 0:30:25.160 do that. What's your problem? Dude? But I'm yeah, and 0:30:27.040 --> 0:30:31.200 miss listen. I only got through episode two. But in 0:30:31.280 --> 0:30:34.080 that episode, when they're talking about how like the new 0:30:34.120 --> 0:30:36.920 London or stole our land and all that stuff, it's 0:30:36.920 --> 0:30:41.280 a lot of like mapping over Native issues, real Native issues, 0:30:41.320 --> 0:30:43.640 and it's a bunch of white people saying that I 0:30:43.640 --> 0:30:47.320 guess correct, And I was like, oh, I don't I 0:30:47.360 --> 0:30:52.440 don't love that. Uh, you know, it felt tricky and 0:30:52.600 --> 0:30:57.200 like a little bit disappointing. I couldn't agree more. I 0:30:57.240 --> 0:30:59.880 agree with you. There is a way to successfully out 0:30:59.840 --> 0:31:04.120 of orically talk about issues without including those people. Like 0:31:04.200 --> 0:31:07.520 the movie pleasant Bill, which is a movie about segregation 0:31:07.520 --> 0:31:12.920 and race that hasn't marry a black person, And I 0:31:12.960 --> 0:31:15.200 love that movie. I think it's great. It has one 0:31:15.200 --> 0:31:17.600 of my favorite lines in the world where she's talking 0:31:17.680 --> 0:31:21.000 to Reese Spoon is talking to her friend and she's like, 0:31:21.040 --> 0:31:22.760 you can't believe you guys are twins. You must have 0:31:22.800 --> 0:31:25.280 been from the cool side of the uterus, which is 0:31:26.240 --> 0:31:28.920 truly the dumbest thing I've ever heard. My favorite, my favorite. 0:31:29.400 --> 0:31:31.680 I love Pleasantville because it's my favorite movie in which 0:31:31.680 --> 0:31:38.200 a woman. Yeah, but I think that they dropped the 0:31:38.240 --> 0:31:41.240 ball on being able to allegorically talk about the issues 0:31:41.280 --> 0:31:45.480 of land thievery and not include Native voices. I think 0:31:45.480 --> 0:31:46.880 that there might have been a way to do it, 0:31:46.960 --> 0:31:48.680 but they didn't figure it out. And I don't know 0:31:48.720 --> 0:31:50.680 what that way is either. I'm not saying they should 0:31:50.680 --> 0:31:53.320 have done this. I don't know what that way either is, 0:31:53.360 --> 0:31:55.880 but like, yeah, having that one woman keep saying like 0:31:56.280 --> 0:31:59.000 they stole our land. She said like a million times, 0:31:59.040 --> 0:32:02.880 and I'm like, you got stop saying. I don't know 0:32:02.920 --> 0:32:07.560 if that even made sense for they're British. They're British 0:32:07.560 --> 0:32:09.600 and they're just coming to visit this. I think a 0:32:09.680 --> 0:32:13.719 computer simulation. Yeah, like, what is this white lady who 0:32:13.800 --> 0:32:16.960 lives in America. You're in America, right, what is what 0:32:17.040 --> 0:32:20.320 are you accusing them of the land? And they made 0:32:20.320 --> 0:32:23.000 it into a theme park? But it's a big land. 0:32:23.120 --> 0:32:25.680 I mean, it seems very very big. It's not like 0:32:25.720 --> 0:32:27.640 they're using that, you know. I don't know. I felt 0:32:27.640 --> 0:32:30.680 like that wasn't the message that it could have been. 0:32:30.720 --> 0:32:32.680 It could have been like there the halves and where 0:32:32.680 --> 0:32:35.400 they have not and they have this technology and bro 0:32:35.720 --> 0:32:40.600 whatever they were saying. I just don't think her grievance 0:32:40.640 --> 0:32:44.600 like made the most sense emotionally to me. Okay, another 0:32:44.640 --> 0:32:47.920 thing that bothered me a lot um. One of the 0:32:48.040 --> 0:32:50.760 things that I think is really interesting in the book, 0:32:51.320 --> 0:32:54.000 and that he's one of the downsides of their society 0:32:54.040 --> 0:32:58.200 that the really clear about is that entertainment is not 0:32:58.440 --> 0:33:01.240 very good, Like theater is not very good. They can't 0:33:01.240 --> 0:33:04.720 do Shakespeare there. But they're taking all these eleven year 0:33:04.720 --> 0:33:08.280 old children to see what is like. It's not a 0:33:08.360 --> 0:33:11.760 great theatrical productionant at least one, but the people involved 0:33:11.800 --> 0:33:17.560 in care about a lot that has like legitimate emotions 0:33:17.680 --> 0:33:21.320 involved and and gonna shoot out and like a lot 0:33:21.360 --> 0:33:24.160 of people are yelling and saying lives and there's a 0:33:24.200 --> 0:33:27.920 little poetic bit in the middle. But the bonything they're 0:33:27.960 --> 0:33:32.600 seeing is like, not great theater, but it certainly qualifies 0:33:32.600 --> 0:33:34.720 in my mind just to see it. Um, these are 0:33:34.760 --> 0:33:37.760 all very very smart people seeing it. Are you really 0:33:37.760 --> 0:33:40.160 telling me that everyone would see this and be like, well, 0:33:40.200 --> 0:33:42.680 the only thing we can make is pornographic movie. That 0:33:44.360 --> 0:33:49.280 is what we're gonna do. Not all pornographic though, But 0:33:49.400 --> 0:33:51.920 like Jennifer, you're right where it's like they make it 0:33:52.080 --> 0:33:54.440 very clear that there's an upper limit to the amount 0:33:54.480 --> 0:33:57.080 of art you can achieve in in this world where 0:33:57.080 --> 0:34:01.840 everything is preordained and there's no suffering. But they there 0:34:01.880 --> 0:34:03.960 there are there are no barriers in this they should 0:34:03.960 --> 0:34:07.040 be no. I mean, they have shadowed the ceiling that 0:34:07.320 --> 0:34:12.520 has been said in the book for one of theatrical experience. Um, 0:34:12.560 --> 0:34:15.840 that insane guy who just starts dealing at Bernard about 0:34:15.880 --> 0:34:18.160 how he is an actor. He's working without a net 0:34:18.200 --> 0:34:21.880 all the time, is in fact correct by the standards 0:34:22.000 --> 0:34:24.640 and play a new world. He is the greatest actor 0:34:24.680 --> 0:34:29.680 in the world and he should be respected. But none 0:34:29.680 --> 0:34:32.480 of them take that back, none of them like. I 0:34:32.600 --> 0:34:37.480 like how they told lies. But it felt true. Oh, emotions, 0:34:37.520 --> 0:34:41.920 when we have emotions, that's interesting, that's something for us. 0:34:41.920 --> 0:34:44.640 Why aren't they just all doing like a little historic 0:34:44.680 --> 0:34:47.960 place about what they think monogamy is. I love that. 0:34:48.080 --> 0:34:53.360 I would watch that. I also think it's very It 0:34:53.440 --> 0:34:56.200 was also a little disappointing that the whole point of 0:34:56.560 --> 0:35:02.239 the book was like to criticize Forward and the what's 0:35:02.239 --> 0:35:05.759 an assembly line? Assembly line the mechanization of the workforce, 0:35:05.920 --> 0:35:10.720 which is a legitimate thing worth criticizing. And then uh Lenina, 0:35:10.760 --> 0:35:13.359 who's a factory worker. She's working at like a at 0:35:13.360 --> 0:35:15.600 a at a desk in her own little microscope. There's 0:35:15.640 --> 0:35:18.640 no factory, there's no assembly line. This is a universe. 0:35:18.800 --> 0:35:22.400 There was a thing, there was a conveyor belt. I 0:35:22.400 --> 0:35:26.200 did not think that there was a factory vibe vibe 0:35:26.400 --> 0:35:28.120 that I was like, this isn't it. This doesn't feel 0:35:28.160 --> 0:35:31.400 like a universe devoted to Ford. Um. I am also 0:35:31.480 --> 0:35:36.400 fascinated by, uh, what gammas are in this book because 0:35:38.800 --> 0:35:42.959 Gamma is my favorite character. I think. I think it's 0:35:42.960 --> 0:35:44.600 hard to read a book like this and not on 0:35:44.680 --> 0:35:46.840 some level being like, I wonder what social class I 0:35:46.840 --> 0:35:51.480 would fit into Gamma all the way we need talk, 0:35:55.719 --> 0:35:59.239 but also like the little Historians, there's a Gamma on 0:35:59.280 --> 0:36:02.520 the tour but I love that. Yeah, who got to 0:36:02.560 --> 0:36:08.359 wear a little hat? I'm telling you people, Yeah, and 0:36:08.440 --> 0:36:11.240 I told him about Gary the Gamma. Okay, So Gary 0:36:11.280 --> 0:36:14.240 the Gamma is a gamma that is assigned to John 0:36:14.360 --> 0:36:17.840 the Savage when he comes to New London and basically 0:36:17.840 --> 0:36:22.160 he's his confidante and his butler, and Um. It also 0:36:22.239 --> 0:36:25.920 shows to me that John, while he's criticizing this world, 0:36:26.440 --> 0:36:29.840 is very much into the lifestyle that he immediately because 0:36:29.880 --> 0:36:32.600 there is a moment where, um, oh my god, there's 0:36:32.640 --> 0:36:36.000 this moment where Bernard just totally crushes Gary in his 0:36:36.080 --> 0:36:39.560 conditioning and it is so weird and fun to watch 0:36:39.760 --> 0:36:42.920 because he knows that John and Lenina have been having sex, 0:36:43.120 --> 0:36:47.000 which happens in the show like a lot. He doesn't 0:36:47.000 --> 0:36:54.759 call her a strumpet, so it's still bad their relationship, 0:36:54.920 --> 0:37:01.480 it's not. Yeah. But so then Arry the Gamma is 0:37:01.520 --> 0:37:05.840 like shamed because he has broken his confidence for John. 0:37:05.920 --> 0:37:07.399 He's like, I thought that I was being a good 0:37:07.400 --> 0:37:09.680 Gamma and Bernard's like, you're not a very good gamma 0:37:09.760 --> 0:37:15.120 after all, are you. So Gry runs off feeling all 0:37:15.160 --> 0:37:18.399 of his feelings and has no soma, and and then 0:37:18.920 --> 0:37:23.719 m Garry's always baking for them. Everything Gary bakes is wonderful. 0:37:24.320 --> 0:37:27.600 I mean, Gammas are basically housewives. It seems it seems like, yeah, 0:37:27.719 --> 0:37:31.840 it seems like everybody's problems. You can't say that you 0:37:31.880 --> 0:37:34.920 don't have a family stretcher if everybody gets assigned a 0:37:35.040 --> 0:37:40.880 servant who is wildly devoted to you and the benefits 0:37:42.400 --> 0:37:46.319 about Yeah. So then he John comes out of the 0:37:46.320 --> 0:37:50.799 shower and he's like Gary, Gary, and then Gary's not there, 0:37:50.880 --> 0:37:53.160 And then he comes out and sees Bernard and he's like, 0:37:53.239 --> 0:37:59.200 where is Gary? I had to dry myself. Garry's been 0:37:59.280 --> 0:38:02.880 drying him. Gary is gently chalming him off like a baby. 0:38:03.600 --> 0:38:09.480 So there is monogamy, And yeah, I think that Gary 0:38:09.600 --> 0:38:12.000 was like a little bit in love with John. I 0:38:12.040 --> 0:38:16.200 think that's a gamma's role. I think they are essentially housewives. 0:38:16.680 --> 0:38:22.200 People are like deeply no, um no. It seems like 0:38:22.280 --> 0:38:24.319 if you were an upperclass person, you all get your 0:38:24.360 --> 0:38:27.080 own Gamma and they're just gonna take care of you. Man, 0:38:27.120 --> 0:38:29.239 They're just gonna stroke your hair you go sleep and 0:38:29.280 --> 0:38:36.320 make little shift shish noises. They're like a household. Yeah, Gamma, 0:38:37.400 --> 0:38:39.560 and they like look really good. And I think they 0:38:39.680 --> 0:38:43.760 are like a salmon color, unless like a nice pinkish color. Yeah. 0:38:43.960 --> 0:38:46.879 I loved Gary the Gamma and he was by far 0:38:47.000 --> 0:38:49.440 my favorite character because he seemed like one of the 0:38:49.480 --> 0:38:52.920 more complex characters. I know, what do Gammas do on 0:38:52.960 --> 0:38:55.280 their days off? Because they seem like the only people 0:38:55.280 --> 0:38:58.400 who are deeply feeling their feelings? Like do they just 0:38:58.480 --> 0:39:00.920 all get together and have coffee and like, okay, if 0:39:00.920 --> 0:39:05.520 you won't believe what my alfa did, I've got some 0:39:05.560 --> 0:39:08.560 stuff to talk about. Another great spin another great spin off, 0:39:08.560 --> 0:39:11.239 which which feels like it's a multicam you know, just 0:39:11.280 --> 0:39:15.120 like a Gamma multicam sitcom. Yeah you get the break room, 0:39:15.239 --> 0:39:18.400 you know. Yeah, they all baked like a special ext 0:39:18.440 --> 0:39:21.560 retreat for this, because that's what they like doing I 0:39:21.600 --> 0:39:24.240 would love like a I would love a series that's 0:39:24.600 --> 0:39:28.799 for women who are all Gammas and they like hang 0:39:28.840 --> 0:39:30.800 out together on their days off and their friends and 0:39:30.840 --> 0:39:37.960 it's like the Gamma Girls, Pitt Check, Karama, Pitch. Are 0:39:37.960 --> 0:39:46.320 you listening to the show? Sorry, we're to have opinions. 0:39:46.400 --> 0:39:48.760 The thing is, I mean we have said that there's 0:39:49.120 --> 0:39:52.200 many there are many things that are good about the show. 0:39:52.680 --> 0:39:54.759 They just don't all come together in a way that 0:39:54.800 --> 0:39:56.560 I think makes it the best show I've ever seen. 0:39:56.600 --> 0:39:58.840 But there is somebody out there who thinks this is 0:39:58.840 --> 0:40:02.879 the best show they've ever seen. Actually, somebody's favorite show. Yeah, 0:40:03.600 --> 0:40:05.960 I think we should all take a break, check in 0:40:06.000 --> 0:40:18.640 with our Gammas, and then come back. So we're back 0:40:18.719 --> 0:40:25.759 with Popcorn Book Club for My Heart Radio, Melissa. I 0:40:25.760 --> 0:40:28.880 think he mentioned earlier when we were talking about this adaptation, 0:40:29.000 --> 0:40:31.000 it's so hard to make things in Hollywood that like 0:40:31.239 --> 0:40:33.719 you just need I p and they were like, Brave 0:40:33.760 --> 0:40:36.080 New World, that's the thing we've heard of. We can 0:40:36.239 --> 0:40:38.160 turn that into a West World where it was less 0:40:38.200 --> 0:40:41.040 about like the interest in what the book was than 0:40:41.080 --> 0:40:43.520 the fact that this book that people have heard of existed, 0:40:45.160 --> 0:40:50.120 which you know, kind you can in this book with 0:40:50.239 --> 0:40:52.319 the four people sitting in a room and discussing for 0:40:52.360 --> 0:40:55.000 seventeen pages, has said they heard that they can't do Shakespeare, 0:40:55.400 --> 0:40:58.160 and then and then they go to an island, and 0:40:58.200 --> 0:40:59.960 then they go off to an island and it's fine. 0:41:00.040 --> 0:41:02.160 There's bad weather, if you know, if they're doing like 0:41:02.200 --> 0:41:04.480 you said, was the c WS where I wish they 0:41:04.480 --> 0:41:07.919 would have like leaned in even more than to all 0:41:08.000 --> 0:41:12.839 like the weird romance and relationships that like I didn't get. 0:41:12.880 --> 0:41:14.680 I didn't, I wasn't rooting for I didn't. I was like, 0:41:14.719 --> 0:41:17.400 I'm not rooting for anyone. And I don't know what 0:41:17.440 --> 0:41:20.040 you're trying to say. With this version of Brave New World, 0:41:20.200 --> 0:41:22.359 it does feel like, as I was reading it and 0:41:22.400 --> 0:41:24.960 knowing there was a show and having seen the poster 0:41:25.160 --> 0:41:31.520 and stuff, it feels like a development and marketing super 0:41:31.680 --> 0:41:35.439 challenge to be true to the book or like true 0:41:35.480 --> 0:41:37.840 to the tone and the like sort of dark nature 0:41:37.840 --> 0:41:40.479 of the book and the slowness of the book. While 0:41:40.920 --> 0:41:45.480 starring a bunch of sexy twenty year twenty something year olds, 0:41:45.560 --> 0:41:48.120 it feels like it's always going to veer in the 0:41:48.200 --> 0:41:51.200 c W direction. I feel like the only show that 0:41:51.239 --> 0:41:54.080 I've seen that does not do that in recent history. 0:41:54.160 --> 0:41:58.240 Is Euphoria right, Like it does go darker and pushes 0:41:58.880 --> 0:42:03.200 darker and or like transgressive. But I think you Euphoria 0:42:03.280 --> 0:42:06.359 benefit from being like a trojan Horse and the other 0:42:06.440 --> 0:42:09.759 drab looks. It looks like a teen show, and then 0:42:09.880 --> 0:42:13.200 secretly it's a prestig show. Where this they were like, look, 0:42:13.239 --> 0:42:16.160 it's so Prestigie, and then they try to like sneak 0:42:16.239 --> 0:42:18.120 it in to be pulpy, and then you have to 0:42:18.120 --> 0:42:22.239 go the other way. I agree. I disagree with the 0:42:22.280 --> 0:42:25.600 categorization of this as a c W show one just 0:42:25.640 --> 0:42:27.760 because I really like c W shows and I feel 0:42:27.800 --> 0:42:31.560 like you're using it pejoratively and I don't appreciate it. Well, 0:42:31.640 --> 0:42:33.200 I am a big fan of a lot of c 0:42:33.480 --> 0:42:36.200 W shows, Okay, I love Laying the Virgin, I love 0:42:36.520 --> 0:42:45.120 Um Craziest Girlfriend and Buffy. Ye I can't believe Supernatural 0:42:45.160 --> 0:42:48.560 is ending this year, like that's that's half my life over. 0:42:49.600 --> 0:42:52.000 But I do think that I feel like the c 0:42:52.320 --> 0:42:56.000 W for all of its dramatic interpretations of I p 0:42:56.320 --> 0:42:59.320 like I mean Riverdale, which we have mentioned many times 0:42:59.360 --> 0:43:03.000 on this podcast for a good reason. Yeah, I mean 0:43:03.040 --> 0:43:07.240 and it is an adaptation um so Riverdale, It's still 0:43:07.800 --> 0:43:11.120 is grounded in the relationships between people. I feel like like, 0:43:11.239 --> 0:43:14.000 at the end of the day, I know the Jugead 0:43:14.000 --> 0:43:16.799 and Betty care about each other and that's what why 0:43:16.840 --> 0:43:19.000 the choices were made, but I don't see that here. 0:43:19.040 --> 0:43:22.960 And like Supernatural, it's the relationship between Sam and Dean 0:43:23.040 --> 0:43:27.200 and their brotherhood that makes the show move forward and 0:43:27.239 --> 0:43:29.840 why people have been watching it for fifteen years. Yeah, totally. 0:43:29.840 --> 0:43:32.120 I mean that's what I mean from like the seat, 0:43:32.280 --> 0:43:35.040 not pejorative, but like the seat. What people love and 0:43:35.040 --> 0:43:38.400 what I love is those relationships. Like it felt like 0:43:38.800 --> 0:43:42.640 this show was attempting to do that, like with the 0:43:42.760 --> 0:43:44.480 with the even the poster of the three of them, 0:43:44.480 --> 0:43:45.840 you're like, oh, is this going to be like a 0:43:45.920 --> 0:43:48.359 love triangle thing that you're going to have to try 0:43:48.400 --> 0:43:51.480 to figure out and like root for someone to win 0:43:51.600 --> 0:43:54.200 someone over. Not that that is a part of the 0:43:54.200 --> 0:43:56.880 book at all, but like it's kind of a set 0:43:57.040 --> 0:44:00.279 up like that, or or even like it looks like 0:44:00.320 --> 0:44:02.600 it could be that in the night there was I 0:44:02.640 --> 0:44:05.120 was reading for no one. I didn't care about anyone's relationship, 0:44:05.360 --> 0:44:07.720 but it's like, did anyone have a crush on anyone 0:44:07.800 --> 0:44:11.640 where it's like the pilot of Riverdale. Do you understand 0:44:11.719 --> 0:44:13.920 right away Betty has a crush on Archie and then 0:44:13.920 --> 0:44:17.920 this hot girl Veronica arrives an now Archie likes Veronica. Simple, 0:44:18.080 --> 0:44:20.399 we know who the conflict where it's like in this 0:44:20.920 --> 0:44:25.840 who does Bernard like Lanina more than anyone else in 0:44:25.880 --> 0:44:29.200 any meaningful way? And you also kind of have to 0:44:29.239 --> 0:44:31.960 bank on the fact that in a society with your monogamy, 0:44:32.080 --> 0:44:35.400 you found three people who were incredibly committed to the 0:44:35.440 --> 0:44:39.600 idea of monogamy. People weren't being like, all right, let's 0:44:39.600 --> 0:44:42.920 all fun. We don't believe in like not being bisexual. 0:44:43.120 --> 0:44:46.359 So here we go. Well, I do think it. Just 0:44:46.560 --> 0:44:50.040 to be clear, I did sort of mean as a pejorative, 0:44:50.080 --> 0:44:52.000 but I didn't mean that the c W is a 0:44:52.040 --> 0:44:55.640 bad thing. I mean that people try at being that, 0:44:56.040 --> 0:44:58.080 you know what I mean, and do not succeed. I 0:44:58.120 --> 0:45:00.760 feel like the only one I've seen recently that succeeded 0:45:00.800 --> 0:45:05.160 as you on Netflix. I feel like it was Life. 0:45:06.719 --> 0:45:10.839 Nobody watched people that talk to me about it when 0:45:10.920 --> 0:45:14.320 it was on Lifetime. Everybody would I do to Lifetime 0:45:14.360 --> 0:45:17.239 because they've been creating amazing content they did unreal which 0:45:17.280 --> 0:45:22.920 wassib I watched. I watched you on Lifetime and was like, 0:45:23.160 --> 0:45:26.520 is this good? Is this secretly really good? Good? It's 0:45:26.560 --> 0:45:29.640 really good. But I will say it is such a 0:45:29.840 --> 0:45:32.319 challenge when you think about this book, because every good 0:45:32.360 --> 0:45:35.879 TV show is about relationships, and we care about relationships, 0:45:36.160 --> 0:45:38.719 and this is a book that's like people don't care 0:45:38.760 --> 0:45:44.160 about relationships any one person. That's the whole freaking thing, 0:45:44.440 --> 0:45:46.359 you know. And even in the book, you're like, oh, 0:45:46.400 --> 0:45:48.560 they're going to fall in love. John's going to come 0:45:48.560 --> 0:45:50.560 around to with Lenny and it's like no, he just 0:45:50.760 --> 0:45:56.879 was like, you're a strumpet and her like. That's why 0:45:56.960 --> 0:46:00.880 Gary's the most interesting character. He's the only person who 0:46:01.040 --> 0:46:04.520 has a strong and ever present emotional tie to someone. 0:46:04.600 --> 0:46:07.280 The other person who I think is a very fascinating 0:46:07.360 --> 0:46:13.960 character is Franny. Yeah, very interesting in her competitive friendship 0:46:14.160 --> 0:46:17.960 with Lanina. I think that. I think it's also very sexful, 0:46:18.320 --> 0:46:22.640 Like I definitely sex with each other. Yeah, that's what 0:46:22.760 --> 0:46:25.240 I meant. I didn't want to spoil it for people. 0:46:27.200 --> 0:46:29.960 Why is that not in the first three episodes because 0:46:29.960 --> 0:46:34.160 they have the Trojan the queer stuff. Because I don't 0:46:35.880 --> 0:46:38.840 I don't think they show the sex itself. There is 0:46:38.880 --> 0:46:45.839 a moment where Franny comes into Lenina's room and like yeah, 0:46:46.120 --> 0:46:49.120 and then Lanina this isn't the point where Lenina is like, no, 0:46:49.400 --> 0:46:54.279 I believe in monogamy, but hasn't told people because so 0:46:54.360 --> 0:46:57.280 they don't sleep with each other they have, they haven't 0:46:58.680 --> 0:47:03.240 and they implied that because you don't want to tickle 0:47:03.480 --> 0:47:06.560 or something the word tick, which he definitely uses tickle. 0:47:06.640 --> 0:47:10.960 She goes, I know how you like tick. They're using 0:47:10.960 --> 0:47:14.680 the lesbian vernacular. Great? Is it just me? Or In 0:47:14.840 --> 0:47:17.640 the book Brave New World, which the Dystopia was like 0:47:17.760 --> 0:47:19.520 bad and I get totally get that, but was the 0:47:19.600 --> 0:47:21.279 one thing where I was like, oh that, actually this 0:47:21.400 --> 0:47:23.319 is kind of a good thing was that people were 0:47:23.360 --> 0:47:28.080 like less puritanical about sex, and this show was like 0:47:28.200 --> 0:47:32.520 that is the worst thing about it. Like I thought 0:47:32.600 --> 0:47:35.080 that the one good thing about the Dystopia was like 0:47:35.120 --> 0:47:37.439 at least people didn't like sledge shame and like people 0:47:37.480 --> 0:47:39.680 could just sleep with people when they want, which is 0:47:39.760 --> 0:47:42.400 like a pretty I think monogamy is great, but I 0:47:42.440 --> 0:47:45.520 also think if you want a sexual relationship, go for it. 0:47:46.000 --> 0:47:48.719 And I was like, Okay, this this Utopia. Dystopia has 0:47:48.760 --> 0:47:51.359 some goods and some bads, but the TV show went 0:47:51.560 --> 0:47:54.359 hard on that it is the worst thing about this dystopia. 0:47:55.400 --> 0:47:57.239 The most evil thing is I think we are having 0:47:59.200 --> 0:48:01.520 when when Bernard and Lena are at the when they 0:48:01.560 --> 0:48:05.440 first get to the hotel or whatever at the Savage Lands, 0:48:05.840 --> 0:48:08.719 and it was hot, it was really hot, but it 0:48:08.800 --> 0:48:11.800 also made it like I laughed out loud because for 0:48:11.920 --> 0:48:17.399 them to stop and be like, let's save ourselves, it's 0:48:17.480 --> 0:48:22.640 like extreme edging. I was like, Wow, what is the 0:48:22.840 --> 0:48:28.200 message of this show? What are we Yeah, I think 0:48:28.280 --> 0:48:30.279 that one of the things about the show is the 0:48:30.320 --> 0:48:32.600 introduction of the lack of privacy, and that's supposed to 0:48:32.600 --> 0:48:35.960 speak to sort of our interconnected social networking and social 0:48:36.000 --> 0:48:39.800 media world. And I don't think that that landed like 0:48:39.880 --> 0:48:42.480 the idea have no privacy, And it was actually deeply 0:48:42.560 --> 0:48:44.839 alarming to the point where I mean, in the very 0:48:44.960 --> 0:48:49.040 first ten minutes, Lenina walks into his office and he's like, 0:48:49.280 --> 0:48:53.760 here's some imagery of you getting railed over the last 0:48:53.880 --> 0:48:56.160 couple of months. Did you know that you've only been 0:48:56.200 --> 0:48:58.239 sleeping with one man? Because I know because I can 0:48:58.320 --> 0:49:01.759 watch you. Like that was deeply alarming to be more 0:49:01.920 --> 0:49:05.120 into that, and it would have been interesting. But instead 0:49:05.160 --> 0:49:07.200 they were just like, all these people fuck all the 0:49:07.320 --> 0:49:09.480 time and then John comes and teaches them how to 0:49:09.560 --> 0:49:13.960 be good. Yeah, it seems like the thesis of the 0:49:14.560 --> 0:49:18.000 of the film. The film. The show was very Twilight 0:49:18.160 --> 0:49:20.920 and that it's like, wouldn't it be sexy if we waited? 0:49:25.480 --> 0:49:29.840 Which I also want to say it's a valid choice, totally, totally, 0:49:30.000 --> 0:49:32.960 but but but is it the most relevant thesis of 0:49:33.040 --> 0:49:37.320 Brady World a property? He is very relevant today. I 0:49:37.440 --> 0:49:39.080 just want to say on the record that if you 0:49:39.239 --> 0:49:41.440 think it's sexy to wait, then I am so happy 0:49:41.560 --> 0:49:44.239 for you. But it is not sexy for everyone. And 0:49:44.320 --> 0:49:46.480 that's okay. And that's sort of what we talked about 0:49:46.520 --> 0:49:49.200 in the book episode is that choice is good. Yeah, 0:49:49.280 --> 0:49:51.080 to return to that, like to the discussion that we 0:49:51.120 --> 0:49:53.319 had about the book, great did I only watched two 0:49:53.360 --> 0:49:57.520 episodes this but but if that's I thought, the more 0:49:57.800 --> 0:50:02.319 poignant message about the like non monogamy and the sort 0:50:02.360 --> 0:50:05.520 of dystopian nature of it, is less about like, oh 0:50:05.640 --> 0:50:07.920 you shouldn't have a partner. It's like, oh, you shouldn't 0:50:07.960 --> 0:50:11.680 love anyone, you shouldn't care about one person's life or 0:50:11.880 --> 0:50:15.640 relationship with one person. If someone dies, who cares? You 0:50:15.680 --> 0:50:20.960 shouldn't have a maternal, paternal or parental love, romantic love, 0:50:21.080 --> 0:50:23.320 friendship love. None of that matters. And I'm kind of 0:50:23.360 --> 0:50:26.040 disappointed that none of that seems like it's in the show. 0:50:27.400 --> 0:50:32.279 It's right about monogamy, it's good. I think a lot 0:50:32.360 --> 0:50:35.680 of the problem with that is turning turning all of 0:50:35.760 --> 0:50:40.239 these things into this George Saunders esque being park because well, 0:50:40.440 --> 0:50:43.920 obviously they at least say this is to show how 0:50:44.080 --> 0:50:46.640 bad it was back then, but there are obviously parts 0:50:46.680 --> 0:50:49.640 of it that are very alluring and enticing. Like I 0:50:49.680 --> 0:50:51.799 I don't think you could be a thirteen year old 0:50:51.880 --> 0:50:54.840 child and here a man recite a love home to 0:50:54.960 --> 0:50:56.960 a woman and not be like, oh, I'd like somebody 0:50:57.000 --> 0:50:59.080 to do that for me one day. That would be cool. 0:51:00.000 --> 0:51:06.920 Have you met thirteen year olds recently, because I'm scared 0:51:07.000 --> 0:51:10.720 of all of them. I'm thinking of thirteen year old boys, 0:51:12.680 --> 0:51:17.600 old girl. Yeah, yeah, okay, But I feel like by 0:51:17.880 --> 0:51:22.920 showing them the fascinating passions experienced by these people, you 0:51:23.239 --> 0:51:26.800 obviously make those passions alluring right away. Like, I just 0:51:27.000 --> 0:51:31.319 don't believe that you could have this theme park where 0:51:31.360 --> 0:51:33.399 you give people a guide book of like they saved 0:51:33.440 --> 0:51:36.360 themselves your marriage and it was so erotic, exciting, and 0:51:36.760 --> 0:51:39.360 they went out to see highly oiled men before the 0:51:39.520 --> 0:51:42.840 bride gave herself away, but she couldn't touch them, and 0:51:43.400 --> 0:51:45.600 nobody went back to New London. It was like, I'm 0:51:45.600 --> 0:51:48.880 going to start doing mad that's my empty thing now, Um, 0:51:49.080 --> 0:51:54.719 everybody would do that. It's just um the entire Brave 0:51:54.800 --> 0:51:58.360 New Girl Books. Society I think is built around the 0:51:58.440 --> 0:52:01.759 idea of ignorance the love could be a desirable thing, 0:52:01.960 --> 0:52:05.279 and that families and passion could be a desirable thing, 0:52:05.360 --> 0:52:08.560 and that art and theater could be desirable. Um. That 0:52:08.680 --> 0:52:11.440 society works because you've distracted people so much that they 0:52:11.600 --> 0:52:15.399 just don't think about it. And there are so many 0:52:15.560 --> 0:52:19.840 instances in the television show where like whether it's John 0:52:20.080 --> 0:52:22.879 coming back and like giving this speech up parties where 0:52:22.920 --> 0:52:25.800 he talks about how like he's never gonna love again 0:52:25.920 --> 0:52:29.400 because like the girl he loved died, um, where you 0:52:29.480 --> 0:52:32.200 make all of those emotions immediately desirable, Like you can't 0:52:32.239 --> 0:52:34.280 tell me that people don't hear him give that speech 0:52:34.280 --> 0:52:36.399 at a party and be like I think it would 0:52:36.640 --> 0:52:39.200 I love now I'm in love with Mary jeez, who 0:52:39.280 --> 0:52:41.920 I'm in love with now. It's also it looks very 0:52:42.000 --> 0:52:43.919 weird that like that you're right that the whole point 0:52:44.040 --> 0:52:46.600 of like the Brave New World Utopia is that distraction 0:52:46.719 --> 0:52:48.759 and that like we only have new games if it 0:52:49.040 --> 0:52:53.319 it capitalistically makes you need to buy more uh accessories, 0:52:53.400 --> 0:52:56.239 and all our movies are are propaganda that well is 0:52:56.320 --> 0:52:58.880 just crazy and erotic and whatever. And it's like this 0:52:59.040 --> 0:53:01.799 world is very minim list and there's nothing distracting. It's 0:53:01.800 --> 0:53:10.439 all just like modest jumpsuits that are obstacle golf. Maybe 0:53:10.480 --> 0:53:12.800 you would tell us that it showed up later it 0:53:13.880 --> 0:53:16.880 tennis like tennis with a light ball, but like a 0:53:17.000 --> 0:53:19.960 lot of empty space, a lot of minimalism, a lot 0:53:20.040 --> 0:53:23.879 of walks where someone might be alone with their thoughts. Yeah, 0:53:24.120 --> 0:53:28.400 there's not enough distraction to keep these people numb, like 0:53:28.480 --> 0:53:31.040 the soma is. That's it, and that's not good enough 0:53:31.719 --> 0:53:34.319 for this world to like keep them numb to even 0:53:34.560 --> 0:53:40.319 feeling remotely like discontent with how content I do feel 0:53:40.360 --> 0:53:42.440 like that was one of the things that really shook 0:53:42.520 --> 0:53:46.480 me in the book, was never being alone with your thoughts, 0:53:46.640 --> 0:53:50.440 because it does feel like something that I personally struggle 0:53:50.480 --> 0:53:52.640 with of like going on walks. I'll listen to a podcast. 0:53:53.000 --> 0:53:55.480 I hope you're listening to a podcast right now. It's 0:53:55.600 --> 0:53:59.759 very good. Um, but it does feel like that is 0:54:00.080 --> 0:54:02.400 things so in our culture of like where you're alone 0:54:02.480 --> 0:54:05.240 for five minutes, you check Twitter, you check Instagram, whatever, 0:54:06.040 --> 0:54:09.800 and it does feel disappointments such an opportunity to to 0:54:09.920 --> 0:54:13.720 like hit people. You know, I will say there is indra, 0:54:13.960 --> 0:54:18.920 and I know keep saying in this case, I am correct, 0:54:19.160 --> 0:54:20.879 because the whole kind of indra is you just think 0:54:20.880 --> 0:54:23.640 about a person and you're with them. But they dedicate 0:54:23.800 --> 0:54:26.640 using that, so it's like the best targeted ad. They 0:54:26.719 --> 0:54:30.239 didn't like visually convey injury. Injury was like very minimalist. 0:54:30.360 --> 0:54:33.960 Also in the eye and like very like modern and yeah, 0:54:34.000 --> 0:54:37.640 minimalist where it's like injur wasn't like distracting. Yeah, I 0:54:37.760 --> 0:54:41.799 was hoping for like times square times a million. Yeah, 0:54:42.520 --> 0:54:46.520 just like also like Versailles, like a fashion that would 0:54:46.560 --> 0:54:49.920 be fun. Yeah, like weird stuck, give me like excess. 0:54:50.200 --> 0:54:54.120 Well look it's Peacock's HBO. They didn't have that kind 0:54:54.120 --> 0:54:59.680 of budget. The budget and they didn't have money and 0:54:59.840 --> 0:55:04.000 be see universal they have a lot of money Peacock, 0:55:06.000 --> 0:55:08.200 although I will say that does speak to the model 0:55:08.280 --> 0:55:10.759 of Peacock itself, and just because this is sort of 0:55:11.239 --> 0:55:14.080 the first big property that Peacock has, I think we 0:55:14.080 --> 0:55:17.040 should talk about how they have this freemium model where 0:55:17.520 --> 0:55:19.839 Peacock itself is free to sign up for, but then 0:55:19.880 --> 0:55:22.399 they have like levels, so if you wanted to watch 0:55:22.440 --> 0:55:24.719 Brave New World, you do have to pay money for it, 0:55:25.120 --> 0:55:27.560 and they can't guarantee that everybody is going to want 0:55:27.600 --> 0:55:30.160 to pay money for things when they have free things. Also, 0:55:30.680 --> 0:55:33.160 like all of Downto Nabby, so you can still see 0:55:33.200 --> 0:55:36.680 Lady Sybil. Oh thank god. My question for the four 0:55:36.719 --> 0:55:41.160 of you, who are all intelligent, television adjacent slash in people, 0:55:42.160 --> 0:55:44.520 if you were given the book Brave New World, what 0:55:44.600 --> 0:55:47.840 would your approach to turn into a television series of 0:55:48.000 --> 0:55:53.160 nine or or fewer or more episodes? Well, first of all, 0:55:53.400 --> 0:55:58.480 we make an eight. I didn't earn the nine, and 0:55:58.520 --> 0:56:03.160 that's when Melissa Hunter said, wow, yeah, would make it eight. 0:56:04.760 --> 0:56:07.000 I don't know. I think i'd make it. I think 0:56:07.000 --> 0:56:09.320 I'd make it like a mini series sort of. Allah. 0:56:09.640 --> 0:56:13.520 I know as much as true um, and I feel 0:56:13.560 --> 0:56:16.160 like there's stuff that just needs to come out. I 0:56:16.640 --> 0:56:19.520 think that some of the things that they were trying 0:56:19.560 --> 0:56:23.359 to incorporate, like maybe we don't have world controller Mond 0:56:23.400 --> 0:56:26.440 and we can't we like mash that character up with 0:56:26.560 --> 0:56:32.120 Henry with the director and Henry because they he becomes 0:56:32.160 --> 0:56:34.239 the director whatever. I think that there were too many 0:56:34.320 --> 0:56:37.680 characters in the show, and characters that were not in 0:56:37.760 --> 0:56:39.399 the book that we're in the show, and I think 0:56:39.440 --> 0:56:42.040 that we could actually pare down the characters in the 0:56:42.200 --> 0:56:46.360 book and then focus on one person, so focus on Bernard, 0:56:46.440 --> 0:56:50.160 focus on Lenina. I would probably focus on Bernard, despite 0:56:50.160 --> 0:56:53.120 the fact that I think that Lanina as a woman 0:56:53.239 --> 0:56:56.320 is somebody that I identify more with, but Bernard in 0:56:56.440 --> 0:56:58.799 terms of fish out of water and having this sort 0:56:58.840 --> 0:57:00.719 of legacy that he's supposed live up to as an 0:57:00.719 --> 0:57:05.320 alpha that he is being questioned on. It's funny, however, 0:57:05.560 --> 0:57:11.360 dunk Son, It's funny that everyone dunk Son, Burner Rama. 0:57:11.520 --> 0:57:14.640 We would do a great show together because I feel 0:57:14.680 --> 0:57:17.040 like I have the same instincts I think when you 0:57:17.120 --> 0:57:20.120 think about Black Mirror, like I'm a big Black Mirror fan, 0:57:20.240 --> 0:57:23.760 and I feel like some some episodes are super strong 0:57:23.920 --> 0:57:26.320 and some aren't as strong. And I feel like the 0:57:26.400 --> 0:57:30.600 strongest ones are always a big world with a small 0:57:30.880 --> 0:57:35.440 central relationship that has like very high stakes and like 0:57:35.640 --> 0:57:41.560 the one with Lady Sybil, Yes, very I think it's 0:57:41.600 --> 0:57:45.480 a very distracting world. I think, Yes, the one that 0:57:45.600 --> 0:57:47.920 really got me, that has always stuck with me is 0:57:48.040 --> 0:57:52.120 the one where um, they everyone records things with their 0:57:52.160 --> 0:57:55.240 eyes and every memory is recorded and uh, and it's 0:57:55.280 --> 0:57:58.160 like this jealous guy who thinks his wife is cheating 0:57:58.200 --> 0:58:02.080 on him. And again it's guess simple right in a 0:58:02.200 --> 0:58:04.520 big world. And I think that's what you do with 0:58:05.240 --> 0:58:10.120 Bernard and Um and Lanina. It's like make them the 0:58:10.200 --> 0:58:12.720 central relationship. John is the one that kind of comes 0:58:12.800 --> 0:58:18.440 in between them. Um. But but it's like what is 0:58:18.520 --> 0:58:22.280 their central conflict and their dynamic and really hone in 0:58:22.400 --> 0:58:25.960 on that, and then you have John sort of like 0:58:26.480 --> 0:58:29.480 blow it all up. Yeah. My ark would be that 0:58:30.440 --> 0:58:32.640 Bernard starts feeling like a fish out of water and 0:58:32.720 --> 0:58:34.600 then in the end he goes to his island and 0:58:34.720 --> 0:58:37.760 he gets to feel like he belongs and it's like, oh, 0:58:38.040 --> 0:58:42.680 maybe sometimes it's not you, sometimes it's society, And maybe 0:58:42.840 --> 0:58:45.200 being a misfit is an okay thing in a world 0:58:45.280 --> 0:58:48.960 where everyone expects you to be a misfit. Um. But yeah, 0:58:49.040 --> 0:58:50.960 I don't know what the show was trying to do 0:58:51.160 --> 0:58:58.960 or say. Yeah, I think, um, I think it touches 0:58:59.000 --> 0:59:01.560 on something that we meant it earlier. I'd like to 0:59:01.680 --> 0:59:05.040 see them lean into these characters being antiherists. Like in 0:59:05.120 --> 0:59:10.479 the book, everybody picks on Bernard, Bernard's awful. Everybody picks 0:59:10.520 --> 0:59:16.480 on him for understandable reasons, um, and the Savage is 0:59:19.560 --> 0:59:23.240 maybe has a better knowledge of Shakespeare, but it is 0:59:23.320 --> 0:59:28.960 also awful and probably murders the central woman in the 0:59:28.960 --> 0:59:33.680 book by the end. So I think not leaning into 0:59:33.760 --> 0:59:36.000 those characteristics is what makes it feel like a c 0:59:36.240 --> 0:59:39.000 W show that it feels like they've watered this down 0:59:39.320 --> 0:59:41.680 so really gloss over the murder that he does in 0:59:41.760 --> 0:59:45.480 the show, like straight marks his dad and nobody ever 0:59:45.600 --> 0:59:48.480 brings it up ever again at all. I forget that 0:59:48.600 --> 0:59:53.440 he doesn't. Yeah, exactly my point. Yeah, yeah, it's just 0:59:53.560 --> 0:59:57.120 kind of painted as like, um, I guess, an acceptable 0:59:57.280 --> 1:00:02.040 moment of feeling. But I'm sure Gary would like help 1:00:02.120 --> 1:00:03.880 him get a passport and get him out to another 1:00:03.960 --> 1:00:14.320 country because because sports in that world. Indra in this 1:00:14.760 --> 1:00:21.000 podcast episode sponsored by Indra, what about you, Dana. I 1:00:21.120 --> 1:00:23.040 think that definitely makes it. I mean you you're all 1:00:23.480 --> 1:00:25.680 those instincts all sound right. I think like the one 1:00:25.800 --> 1:00:29.600 major thing or like the fix because of the book, 1:00:29.720 --> 1:00:32.560 racism of the Savage Land is true, like you need 1:00:32.640 --> 1:00:34.600 to fix that. But I don't know if the theme 1:00:34.640 --> 1:00:36.560 park worked for me. I do kind of like the 1:00:36.640 --> 1:00:38.800 idea that they would just go and it would just 1:00:38.880 --> 1:00:43.560 be regular America. But it's just just jet actual regular America. 1:00:44.600 --> 1:00:47.080 What I would do, which is just like not a 1:00:47.200 --> 1:00:50.000 theme park. It's just really hard to get a travel 1:00:50.200 --> 1:00:53.400 visa to go. If you're like a high ranking alpha, 1:00:53.480 --> 1:00:57.720 you can go, and it's just they just go to 1:00:57.840 --> 1:01:00.760 like the Cleve Cleveland and just like like this is 1:01:00.880 --> 1:01:06.600 kind of shitty in a different way. So that's my 1:01:06.840 --> 1:01:09.280 that would be my one. But I would spend like 1:01:09.320 --> 1:01:12.120 a week in Cleveland with no silma. Yeah you can 1:01:12.800 --> 1:01:16.080 whether they're like it's a stressful experience. They like watch 1:01:16.160 --> 1:01:18.840 a movie that's like a normal movie and they're like, Okay, 1:01:19.560 --> 1:01:23.800 it's fine. They seem like they see like a Cleveland 1:01:23.920 --> 1:01:30.840 production of like Wicked, and then they're like theatery scarbage. 1:01:30.960 --> 1:01:32.880 If they go back home and that feeling is true, 1:01:33.400 --> 1:01:36.280 It's fine. It was a little flat, like not not 1:01:36.480 --> 1:01:44.000 bad listening when you're in Cleveland, They're not. I really 1:01:44.040 --> 1:01:47.640 I enjoyed Cleveland the perspective of a of a New 1:01:47.760 --> 1:01:51.880 London asshole. They wouldn't appreciate the joys of Cleveland like 1:01:51.920 --> 1:01:58.760 I would. I've never been to Cleveland, but I think 1:01:59.760 --> 1:02:04.400 I mean regular. I only know Cleveland from the thirty 1:02:04.520 --> 1:02:10.480 Rock bit where they're like that, I love that bit. 1:02:13.320 --> 1:02:16.000 Wasn't the Drew Carey show set in Cleveland? Yes? It was? 1:02:16.600 --> 1:02:18.600 Did they just choose a spot on a map ors 1:02:18.840 --> 1:02:21.560 from Cleveland? I feel like he has feel like he 1:02:21.640 --> 1:02:23.959 has to be from Cleveland, you know what. I feel 1:02:24.000 --> 1:02:26.520 like the only reason we're thinking of Cleveland is because 1:02:26.600 --> 1:02:30.240 he's a lot of pop culture, Like Cleveland is too sophisticated. 1:02:30.320 --> 1:02:34.240 Send them to this moy Tiowa. Cleveland doesn't sound like 1:02:34.280 --> 1:02:37.800 a real word anymore. Yeah, did you tell us how 1:02:37.880 --> 1:02:40.560 you would write the show? I mean I would. I 1:02:40.600 --> 1:02:43.640 would do something similar to Melissa and Karma is just 1:02:43.720 --> 1:02:48.360 like focus on that those relationships of Bernard uh Lanina 1:02:48.680 --> 1:02:51.520 and John. I mean my dream would be too. I 1:02:51.560 --> 1:02:54.040 would clear the hell out of it and follow Lanina 1:02:54.720 --> 1:02:57.880 and maybe have Bernard to be a woman as well 1:02:58.080 --> 1:03:01.800 and have them kind of like play around with the 1:03:01.920 --> 1:03:04.360 fact that this world is what do you say, Bernard 1:03:05.280 --> 1:03:09.400 debt um, because it does seem like, you know, we 1:03:09.520 --> 1:03:13.000 still get to see these men making these decisions based 1:03:13.040 --> 1:03:15.600 on their emotions, and I want to I want to 1:03:15.640 --> 1:03:18.960 give the women in this world that opity opportunity to 1:03:19.040 --> 1:03:21.720 do that and not just have like John b Emo 1:03:21.960 --> 1:03:26.720 and Bernard b also Emo in his wheels weird Weasley way. 1:03:28.160 --> 1:03:31.640 Also in terms of people who are related to famous people. 1:03:31.760 --> 1:03:34.760 Tom Stoppard's son is also in it, and he plays 1:03:35.960 --> 1:03:38.880 the I'm forgetting his name, just the the guy in charge, 1:03:39.400 --> 1:03:43.720 Bernard's boss who shows up something to say to lecture 1:03:43.800 --> 1:03:48.720 him worked, the white guy, the one who gets pushed 1:03:48.760 --> 1:04:01.959 over the cliff. No, I didn't, I didn't finish this fathers. Yeah, sorry, 1:04:02.000 --> 1:04:04.440 I kind of do. Sometimes have white guy face blindness 1:04:04.480 --> 1:04:09.360 with really generic looking handsome guys. Were handsome in there 1:04:09.440 --> 1:04:12.520 to make it okay, but like if someone is like 1:04:12.560 --> 1:04:15.400 a certain level of handsome, they just all look the 1:04:15.480 --> 1:04:19.960 same to me, like every every like bachelor guy, every 1:04:20.000 --> 1:04:21.720 guy who's ever been on the badelor I can never 1:04:21.920 --> 1:04:23.360 I can't tell a part. I mean, I think that's 1:04:23.400 --> 1:04:27.680 done on purpose. They all, yeah, they're all casting cast 1:04:27.760 --> 1:04:32.560 to look the same the same there twice And I 1:04:32.800 --> 1:04:34.520 found it out recently and I was like, really, I 1:04:34.640 --> 1:04:38.440 would have never known if you lined them up. They 1:04:38.480 --> 1:04:41.120 should just be renaming the same guys every season with 1:04:41.200 --> 1:04:46.400 a different name and a different occupation. Like, wow, Matthi 1:04:46.560 --> 1:04:50.200 architect really looks a lot like Mark the Pilot. I 1:04:50.320 --> 1:04:53.120 just take it over it. They make them like change 1:04:53.160 --> 1:04:59.440 their whole identity every time social Security number. Also, I 1:04:59.520 --> 1:05:01.600 think for if we were to write this, I would 1:05:01.640 --> 1:05:05.000 love to see just like capitalism even grosser than what's 1:05:05.040 --> 1:05:09.960 being shown, just like they don't really gross capitalists. No 1:05:10.120 --> 1:05:12.680 person buy a thing. Do they have money? Like it 1:05:12.760 --> 1:05:16.479 doesn't it's not clear. It's certainly clear in the book 1:05:16.520 --> 1:05:19.480 that they have to keep consuming that someone guys because 1:05:19.600 --> 1:05:22.600 Lenina talks about that someone bought her like a darling 1:05:22.720 --> 1:05:25.920 Mouth Lucian belt. Yeah, and that was a gift. And 1:05:26.040 --> 1:05:29.720 the show, do they have money, It's very unclear. It's 1:05:29.800 --> 1:05:32.880 unclear they don't. It's unclear how they like have their 1:05:33.600 --> 1:05:38.160 their apartments and like how they get and their damas, 1:05:38.760 --> 1:05:42.000 just as signed the game just like you have a 1:05:42.120 --> 1:05:45.920 person that's your person, Yeah, my person, and they just 1:05:46.160 --> 1:05:51.040 love you. Yeah. I there was something that was really 1:05:51.120 --> 1:05:55.280 intriguing that I don't remember at least being explored in 1:05:55.320 --> 1:05:57.280 the book. I've blocked out the majority of the book 1:05:57.360 --> 1:05:59.720 because I was like, I don't care for this. This 1:05:59.840 --> 1:06:03.920 is racist, racist in a lot of ways. Um, but 1:06:04.520 --> 1:06:09.560 they get There's a part where Lenina and Bernard do dating, 1:06:09.840 --> 1:06:13.400 as they call it. Um. They try out doing a 1:06:13.520 --> 1:06:18.160 date like a monogamous, savage person would do, and Bernard 1:06:18.280 --> 1:06:22.000 is basically like trying to see if Lenina like likes him, 1:06:22.160 --> 1:06:25.240 which is sweet in a way, but then he gets 1:06:25.280 --> 1:06:29.400 really frustrated when she clearly is like I want to go. 1:06:30.280 --> 1:06:32.400 But then he like plays chicken with her in a 1:06:32.480 --> 1:06:35.440 way where he's like, okay, so now we fuck, and 1:06:35.560 --> 1:06:39.080 then she's like clearly not interested in it, but starts 1:06:39.120 --> 1:06:41.480 taking her clothes off because it's what she's supposed to 1:06:41.520 --> 1:06:45.400 do because she's a beta, and he does stop her, 1:06:45.480 --> 1:06:48.480 he doesn't assault her, but like the fact that he's 1:06:48.520 --> 1:06:53.120 willing to humiliate her in that way was very weird, 1:06:53.560 --> 1:06:56.920 and I don't know it sort of got into this 1:06:57.120 --> 1:06:59.640 idea like the betas are supposed to be good time 1:06:59.720 --> 1:07:03.919 girl all the time, and I are all the fascinating. 1:07:04.360 --> 1:07:06.280 Not all of the women are betas. I think in 1:07:06.360 --> 1:07:10.080 this they do have alpha's that are women. I'm pretty sure. 1:07:11.080 --> 1:07:13.080 I'm pretty sure all the women are betas because he 1:07:13.120 --> 1:07:16.840 wrote it in and women didn't develop full brains until 1:07:18.560 --> 1:07:21.240 women didn't get the right to vote in Switzerland until 1:07:21.280 --> 1:07:25.360 the nineteen seventies. Did you know that? But I found 1:07:25.400 --> 1:07:29.280 it out today. It is curious though maybe I mean, again, 1:07:29.360 --> 1:07:31.560 only watch two episodes, but in the second episode on 1:07:31.600 --> 1:07:35.400 the bus that like, there's like a shitty kid who's like, yeah, 1:07:35.520 --> 1:07:39.120 you're a beta, like and why would he say that 1:07:39.240 --> 1:07:42.080 if like every woman was a beta like that, you're 1:07:42.160 --> 1:07:46.720 a lady Helm is a I'm pretty sure. I felt 1:07:46.720 --> 1:07:49.919 the tender swopping on that was fun, was very good. 1:07:50.760 --> 1:07:53.760 She was too artistic for a dystopia. She was too cool. 1:07:56.480 --> 1:07:58.280 That ended up being her problem. And she became so 1:07:58.440 --> 1:08:02.040 fascinated by the idea of John's feelings and how she 1:08:02.160 --> 1:08:05.160 got to explore his feelings, like she downloaded his feelings 1:08:05.200 --> 1:08:07.520 and she was like, I've never seen anything like that before. 1:08:07.840 --> 1:08:10.720 And then she like takes off her wig and he's 1:08:10.760 --> 1:08:17.280 a new person, Like again giving these people full history books, 1:08:17.520 --> 1:08:21.439 why wouldn't you just do like a bunch of historical promise. Um, 1:08:22.160 --> 1:08:25.519 the the amount of information they have given them is 1:08:25.600 --> 1:08:28.200 not compatible with the art that this world is turning out. 1:08:28.880 --> 1:08:31.040 Part of a part of a dystopia is you have 1:08:31.240 --> 1:08:34.439 to restrict information, like the difference with this and they 1:08:34.520 --> 1:08:37.240 haven't at all. There's that famous essay of like the 1:08:37.320 --> 1:08:41.120 difference between comparing Brave New World with n and it's like, yeah, 1:08:41.160 --> 1:08:43.920 the dystopia in nineteen eight four is they destroy all 1:08:44.000 --> 1:08:46.760 the books and restrict it and center it. And the 1:08:46.880 --> 1:08:49.720 difference in Brave New World is they give you so 1:08:49.920 --> 1:08:52.519 much that you don't even care to read the history books. 1:08:52.800 --> 1:08:55.439 So it's like they're not doing either of those things. 1:08:55.520 --> 1:08:59.920 So why is the system working in a bit of 1:09:00.080 --> 1:09:03.320 the matrix? Because that's the at the end of the series, 1:09:03.360 --> 1:09:05.559 and it's like a test. It's like to see if 1:09:05.680 --> 1:09:08.880 Indra can withstand the Savage coming in and he's like 1:09:08.960 --> 1:09:12.879 a virus. Like it's so weird. It's such a bizarre 1:09:13.320 --> 1:09:18.040 ending that came from nothing. In the book Full Scale Revolt, 1:09:18.200 --> 1:09:23.120 I forgot that part. They murder people, they murder people. 1:09:24.120 --> 1:09:29.160 The exons just completely revolt and c Jack sixty is 1:09:29.400 --> 1:09:32.840 the leader of the revolt, and then when he sees 1:09:32.960 --> 1:09:35.760 how it actually ends up happening because it's done with 1:09:35.840 --> 1:09:38.559 the use of Indra, because you can't tell anybody apart 1:09:38.680 --> 1:09:41.000 other than with Indra because they don't have their color 1:09:41.080 --> 1:09:44.200 coordinated outfits like they did in the book. So, um, 1:09:44.360 --> 1:09:45.960 if there were a couple of people who like took 1:09:46.040 --> 1:09:48.920 Indra out and he was like, oh god, this is 1:09:49.280 --> 1:09:52.360 this is not good, what's happening, and those people get 1:09:52.439 --> 1:09:55.479 to live and they're like, it's it's really interesting to 1:09:55.560 --> 1:09:57.960 see how Indra is the only way that they can 1:09:58.040 --> 1:10:01.680 tell what class anybody is. So once you take that out, 1:10:01.760 --> 1:10:05.160 everybody's the same. Maybe that maybe that is what the 1:10:05.360 --> 1:10:08.240 remake should have been, is just follow ce Jack see 1:10:08.320 --> 1:10:12.719 Jack sixty. Yeah, and not following alpha and not follow 1:10:12.760 --> 1:10:15.240 a beta, not follow someone who's like up in that society, 1:10:15.240 --> 1:10:17.479 because they start doing it a little bit where they're 1:10:18.080 --> 1:10:20.400 where he like touches the person that jumped up like 1:10:20.560 --> 1:10:24.679 touches his clone, and he has a feeling that was bizarre. 1:10:25.920 --> 1:10:27.800 But if that's what you wanted, if that is something 1:10:27.880 --> 1:10:30.920 that you wanted to explore, that like people are starting 1:10:31.000 --> 1:10:35.360 to like play with emotion and feeling. I would buy that. 1:10:35.880 --> 1:10:39.200 It's very the giver that it's like, oh, people, people 1:10:39.240 --> 1:10:42.479 are starting to have emotions. What's happening. One of the 1:10:42.560 --> 1:10:44.439 best scenes in the book, though, is the scene that 1:10:44.479 --> 1:10:48.280 makes it so clear that revolt it's impossible that John 1:10:48.400 --> 1:10:51.439 in the book tries to start a revolt, and the 1:10:51.640 --> 1:10:54.599 first of all, everybody's just really annoyed that he's growing 1:10:54.640 --> 1:10:57.639 out their soma. And then once it got so annoyed 1:10:57.680 --> 1:11:00.120 that they're willing to attack him, they just really a 1:11:00.200 --> 1:11:02.719 cloud of so mane to the air and they play 1:11:03.080 --> 1:11:06.519 a little recording saying like, why are you doing this? 1:11:06.920 --> 1:11:09.320 Please be good, just be nice to each other. Okay, 1:11:11.960 --> 1:11:13.800 all right, right right right right right right right right 1:11:13.960 --> 1:11:17.880 right right yeah, nice, right right nice? Yeah, what we 1:11:18.000 --> 1:11:24.760 do here again? I would be into that too. Yeah, absolutely, yeah. 1:11:24.920 --> 1:11:28.360 I think one of the most interesting parts of their culture, 1:11:28.400 --> 1:11:30.400 and the reason I think their culture keeps working is 1:11:30.439 --> 1:11:33.320 because you just do that every time there's an attempt 1:11:33.320 --> 1:11:36.720 at uprising. Yeah, it's a successful it's a successful dystopia. 1:11:36.800 --> 1:11:39.800 And also if someone is too smart for it, they 1:11:39.880 --> 1:11:42.200 send you to a nice island where it seems fine, 1:11:42.400 --> 1:11:44.759 where then you don't. It's not like they're murdering people 1:11:44.800 --> 1:11:46.720 and they're guillotining people and they're like, oh we have 1:11:46.880 --> 1:11:49.479 to Okay, this system is not working. This is violent. 1:11:49.560 --> 1:11:51.559 It's like, all right, if you don't work for the system, 1:11:51.880 --> 1:11:58.120 go live in like the Falkland Islands with fun. Okay, 1:11:58.240 --> 1:12:01.320 that sounds nice. I'll do that what we're saying about 1:12:01.560 --> 1:12:05.560 that though, And I wonder do they do that with 1:12:06.280 --> 1:12:09.120 gammas and absalon's or do they just do it with 1:12:09.240 --> 1:12:11.439 like alpha's and baby But I think the prob the 1:12:11.560 --> 1:12:13.960 thing in the book is it assumes that gammas and 1:12:14.040 --> 1:12:18.400 epsilons are so programmed that they would never even have 1:12:18.840 --> 1:12:22.040 the ability to see outside the box they love, that's true. 1:12:22.080 --> 1:12:24.599 And they also all have like fetal alcohol syndrome. Yeah, 1:12:24.960 --> 1:12:30.240 they're like they're like actually brain damage like on purpose, yeah, 1:12:31.200 --> 1:12:38.679 developmentally like actively stunted. Yeah, I mean bad. But aspect 1:12:38.760 --> 1:12:42.280 of it was missing from the show. Yes, yeah, the 1:12:42.360 --> 1:12:46.200 AICs was gone. Yes, said they really they flattened it out, 1:12:46.360 --> 1:12:49.480 They made it much more. They made the like questions 1:12:49.600 --> 1:12:55.960 of morality and society just like way less pressing. I mean, 1:12:56.040 --> 1:12:58.519 you could you could push all of those things to 1:12:58.640 --> 1:13:01.519 make it more relevant for to and they just flattened 1:13:01.560 --> 1:13:05.400 it out. Yeah, doing like a very eugenics heavy, um 1:13:06.439 --> 1:13:11.720 dystopian show. That would have been interesting, scary look a 1:13:12.040 --> 1:13:16.639 dystopian world about like the distraction of consumerism and social 1:13:16.720 --> 1:13:21.160 media and also eugenics and also apathy that people just 1:13:21.520 --> 1:13:24.720 don't care is very scary and I would want to 1:13:24.760 --> 1:13:26.960 see that. And I was just like disappointed that we 1:13:27.040 --> 1:13:30.519 didn't get that. And that's why I think so not 1:13:30.640 --> 1:13:33.040 to harp on the nine episodes, but I feel like 1:13:33.120 --> 1:13:36.559 if they had had episodes, if they had kind of episodes, 1:13:36.600 --> 1:13:38.719 I feel like they might have been able to figure 1:13:38.720 --> 1:13:40.960 out a way to stretch and explore all of those things. 1:13:41.360 --> 1:13:44.800 But like they went for nine, not even eight, So 1:13:44.920 --> 1:13:46.640 it doesn't feel like they were told, you only have 1:13:46.720 --> 1:13:49.400 eight episodes. I don't I don't know what happened there. 1:13:49.439 --> 1:13:51.160 I think that they like came up with the thing 1:13:51.200 --> 1:13:52.760 and they were like, Okay, we said all the things 1:13:52.880 --> 1:13:55.120 we want to say. I say all the things that 1:13:55.160 --> 1:13:57.679 the book wanted to say. I feel like the nine 1:13:57.840 --> 1:14:00.840 meant that they that the I was like, how many 1:14:00.920 --> 1:14:03.120 do you need to tell the story you want to tell? 1:14:03.200 --> 1:14:07.240 And he's like mm hmm nine, So they got exactly 1:14:07.320 --> 1:14:11.120 what they wanted. You know, it wouldn't work if John 1:14:11.200 --> 1:14:13.960 got completely absorbed into that society. Would that be a 1:14:14.080 --> 1:14:17.640 kind of tragedy if he went there and just by that, 1:14:17.920 --> 1:14:20.200 like he ended up realizing that he didn't want to 1:14:20.240 --> 1:14:23.439 towel himself off ever again, then he wanted Gary to 1:14:23.560 --> 1:14:25.760 gently towel off his wet body every time he came 1:14:25.800 --> 1:14:27.439 out of the shower for the rest of his life. 1:14:28.160 --> 1:14:32.920 I think he would have been happier. I mean maybe, Yeah, 1:14:33.160 --> 1:14:35.360 I don't know down into the show, so I don't 1:14:35.360 --> 1:14:37.599 know how good this toweling off is. So I can't 1:14:37.640 --> 1:14:41.200 make it. I can't make a good judgment. Very gentle 1:14:41.320 --> 1:14:44.439 Garry is very lovely him, and we're talking like what 1:14:44.640 --> 1:14:51.479 kind of what kind of really fluffy? Okay, yeah, just 1:14:51.720 --> 1:14:56.280 Gary warms it up a little bit beforehand, Pyle, Okay, well, 1:14:56.320 --> 1:14:59.160 then that would have been tragic. I would have liked 1:14:59.200 --> 1:15:04.320 to see. Yeah, they didn't include any of the good stuff. 1:15:05.040 --> 1:15:08.439 I think that they did a disservice to themselves by 1:15:08.520 --> 1:15:13.040 making the first two episodes medium good and then like 1:15:13.640 --> 1:15:17.080 making those the three episodes because we're I not watching it. 1:15:17.200 --> 1:15:20.360 I always will watch anything for three to five episodes 1:15:20.520 --> 1:15:25.720 just to test it out. I'll watch truly pretty much anything. Um. 1:15:26.240 --> 1:15:30.280 But if it weren't something that we were talking about 1:15:30.360 --> 1:15:32.840 for this show, with the first two episodes being free, 1:15:32.880 --> 1:15:35.840 I don't think I would have pushed to go further. Like, 1:15:35.920 --> 1:15:37.920 I don't think I would have signed up to get 1:15:38.080 --> 1:15:41.240 more episodes. Yeah, we had watched this for this and 1:15:41.400 --> 1:15:45.400 we only watched two and three. Yeah, it's about relationships, right. 1:15:45.479 --> 1:15:48.720 I feel like I could see a version where you 1:15:48.840 --> 1:15:52.400 just really slow it all down and like really drill 1:15:52.520 --> 1:15:55.040 into Bernard and Lenina in the first episode and like 1:15:55.080 --> 1:15:58.519 why we care about them, and then you just an 1:15:58.600 --> 1:16:01.240 episode three, you're with John and you don't know who 1:16:01.320 --> 1:16:06.439 he is, you don't know like what world the whole episode. Yeah, 1:16:06.640 --> 1:16:12.600 it's very like yeah exactly, uh, and it feels like 1:16:13.360 --> 1:16:15.960 then you're just with him and then you you understand 1:16:16.000 --> 1:16:18.960 how the world's intersect. Like I'd be all in. Yeah, 1:16:19.960 --> 1:16:22.080 that sounds I want to watch that. I want to 1:16:22.120 --> 1:16:25.400 watch that show too. Yeah, Peacock, what do you think 1:16:25.400 --> 1:16:29.720 a reboot of Brave New World? At least? No, I 1:16:29.840 --> 1:16:32.960 think that we've we've done enough braving of this New 1:16:33.040 --> 1:16:36.760 World we can stick with old worlds and other new 1:16:36.840 --> 1:16:40.800 worlds that have other adjectives, so like maybe like a 1:16:40.880 --> 1:16:46.439 funky new world. I don't know. I would love a 1:16:46.520 --> 1:16:49.160 world that's just about like funk music, just like funk 1:16:49.280 --> 1:16:53.519 music and soma just like people having a good time. 1:16:53.640 --> 1:16:57.960 People would love that. I know exactly what people would 1:16:57.960 --> 1:17:03.120 love that. And they're on Somac show. I think that's 1:17:03.160 --> 1:17:09.080 just like a live concert fish. It's a fish concert, 1:17:13.840 --> 1:17:19.720 some funny music, people on drugs. Fun. Thank you so 1:17:19.840 --> 1:17:23.040 much for listening. Next week is Rebecca, So get reading 1:17:23.080 --> 1:17:24.960 if you want to read along or just watch the movie. 1:17:25.080 --> 1:17:27.240 We're doing both of them. There's one coming to Netflix 1:17:27.760 --> 1:17:31.360 with Army Hammer and Lily James. So thanks for listening. 1:17:31.520 --> 1:17:40.040 Bye bye bye. That's our show for the week. Thank 1:17:40.080 --> 1:17:42.560 you so much for listening. I'm Danish Schwartz and you 1:17:42.600 --> 1:17:45.040 can find me on Twitter at Danis Schwartz with three 1:17:45.120 --> 1:17:49.400 z s. You can follow Jennifer Wright at Jen Ashley Right, Karama, 1:17:49.439 --> 1:17:53.200 Donqua is at Karama Drama, Melissa Hunter is at Melissa 1:17:53.720 --> 1:17:56.439 f t W and Tan Tran is smart enough to 1:17:56.479 --> 1:17:58.920 have gotten off Twitter, but she is on Insta at 1:17:59.040 --> 1:18:02.599 Hank Tina Our Executive producer is Christopher Hessiotes and were 1:18:02.640 --> 1:18:06.400 produced and edited by Mike John's Special thanks to David Wasserman. 1:18:06.720 --> 1:18:09.400 Next week, we are going goth in time for Halloween. 1:18:09.800 --> 1:18:12.960 Not like dressing in black listening to the care goth Unfortunately, 1:18:13.600 --> 1:18:18.040 we're discussing the gothic novel Rebecca by Daphne Dumourier, soon 1:18:18.120 --> 1:18:20.840 to be a film on Netflix. Popcorn book Club is 1:18:20.840 --> 1:18:22.320 a production of I Heart Radio