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Speaker 1: So obvious. Even the Canadians figured it out. It's one

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Speaker 1: more thing.

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Speaker 2: One more thing.

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Speaker 3: Wow, way to sucker punch the Canadians, for some reason.

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Speaker 1: Actually have a couple of friends who are Canadians, and

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Speaker 1: they're absolutely delightful people.

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Speaker 2: Absolutely.

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Speaker 1: I love Canadians.

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Speaker 3: I love Canada. I was talking to my kids the

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Speaker 3: other day that we're gonna do that this summer. We've

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Speaker 3: been wanting to get him up there and we just

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Speaker 3: never get around to it. I love Vancouver Island and

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Speaker 3: then we'll take the ferry across and then drive the

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Speaker 3: part Canada. I'm always talking about stopping at the maple

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Speaker 3: syrup tastings.

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Speaker 1: Right.

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Speaker 4: You laughed, It's beautiful.

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Speaker 1: You laughed when I said I love Canadians. What's the

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Speaker 1: story banks bread taking? Yeah?

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Speaker 5: No, I just I I laughed because you you slammed

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Speaker 5: the Canadians and you're like, no, I got I got

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Speaker 5: friends that are Canadians.

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Speaker 2: You didn't do that.

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Speaker 4: It was like the token, like, oh, I've got black friends.

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Speaker 1: They're a little Canadians are a little slow, everybody, that's

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Speaker 1: what they're fine folks. Right.

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Speaker 3: A couple of texts before we get to Joe, Why

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Speaker 3: Joe hates Canadians.

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Speaker 1: I do not hate Canadians.

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Speaker 2: Thought, that's what you said.

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Speaker 3: No, I wasn't paying attention. I have to share this

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Speaker 3: as a text or I took my six year old

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Speaker 3: granddaughter to San Francisco. While we're walking to lunch, a

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Speaker 3: group of men rode by in their bikes, absolutely naked.

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Speaker 3: My granddaughter said, Nana, who is running this place out

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Speaker 3: of the mouths of babes?

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Speaker 2: Yep, no, wow.

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Speaker 3: Sort of thing you will see in San Francisco, completely

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Speaker 3: naked men on bicycles, And some people think that's wonderful

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Speaker 3: for some reason, that that's like progress for some reason.

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Speaker 2: I'll never understand it.

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Speaker 3: A bunch of Twistoids also mentioned at the end of

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Speaker 3: the radio show on the twenty first that it was

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Speaker 3: my birthday and for some reason, I've never cared less

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Speaker 3: about my birthday than now. And I'm not exactly sure

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Speaker 3: if it's wisdom and maturity or depression and I've lost

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Speaker 3: the ability to enjoy life. But we did get this text,

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Speaker 3: fuck your birthday. Everyone has when you're not special.

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Speaker 2: Geez, thank you for that.

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Speaker 1: All right, that's that's a person I really pity. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: imagine being that unhappy.

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Speaker 2: I just I don't even know. I don't even know.

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Speaker 3: When I see that sort of stuff on social media

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Speaker 3: and you see a lot, it's always like, wow.

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Speaker 4: First of all, Jack, happy birthday. Second of all, fuck

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Speaker 4: that person.

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Speaker 1: There you go, Yeah, that has nothing to do with you, obviously,

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Speaker 1: I know.

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Speaker 2: You know that Jack. No, no, no, no.

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Speaker 1: Boy, that's that's entirely about that person.

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Speaker 3: When I come across that stuff on social media. Really,

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Speaker 3: honest to God, the thing I think is I need

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Speaker 3: to make sure my kids don't end up like that,

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Speaker 3: to where they're so miserable at the with the lur

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Speaker 3: lives that they have to strike out at anything that

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Speaker 3: might be pleasant or happy for someone, Yeah, to get

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Speaker 3: through the day. I mean, Jesu, it's so awful.

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Speaker 5: Or someone that that maybe isn't so miserable that they

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Speaker 5: do that, but does it for joy?

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Speaker 1: You know?

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Speaker 5: There are those people that that, I mean, you see

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Speaker 5: them all over the internet that create these accounts just

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Speaker 5: to troll.

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Speaker 4: People because they enjoy it.

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Speaker 3: I've only known I've only I've only personally known two trolls,

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Speaker 3: but they both had the same attitude. So I'm just

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Speaker 3: assuming that that's kind of common among.

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Speaker 2: The troll community.

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Speaker 3: They really get such enjoyment of there's somebody happy. I'm

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Speaker 3: gonna try to take some of that. And it's just

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Speaker 3: think it's so weird. I've never had that feeling. You know, somebody,

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Speaker 3: somebody's sickness, somebody got somebody got a new car, and

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Speaker 3: I say.

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Speaker 2: I heard they suck or just something like that. What

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Speaker 2: what is that like?

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Speaker 4: Why?

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Speaker 2: Why?

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Speaker 1: Well, as I've always said, people who are too dopey

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Speaker 1: or lazy to build things, the only satisfaction they get

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Speaker 1: is from breaking things. And again that's pathetic.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it's like the person who vandalizes the playground equipment.

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Speaker 3: I mean, it's the same sort of thing.

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Speaker 2: It's just awful.

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Speaker 1: The only effect they will ever have on the world

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Speaker 1: before they are dead is to break things and hurt people.

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Speaker 1: So that's what they do. And and again it's it's

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Speaker 1: just painfully pathetic.

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Speaker 2: What is a birthday dinner for you?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, well, I'm gonna go eat steak tonight and some

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Speaker 3: sort of ill advised dessert'd be my guess. It's more

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Speaker 3: for my kids than me. I don't know if I

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Speaker 3: would even leave the house tonight if.

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Speaker 4: It would kids birthday bang bang.

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Speaker 2: Oh boy, that sounds like a challenge.

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Speaker 4: Steak push ups. That's the that's the deal.

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Speaker 3: A bang bang is back to back meals of completely

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Speaker 3: different kinds. So what do I follow steak with pizza?

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Speaker 3: Stop and get a pizza?

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Speaker 1: Oh? Oh, steak is a dense, dense first blow.

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Speaker 2: It's gonna leave a mark. Yeah wow.

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Speaker 1: Following up steak something completely different, nice uh Ramen restaurant

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Speaker 1: or something that's a little hipster for you.

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Speaker 4: Maybe Italian though in the noodle the noodle realm.

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Speaker 1: Well right, let's go raman a. I like the spaghetti

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Speaker 1: and meatballs.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I did an accidental bang bang with my brother

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Speaker 3: when he was in town when I had cancer. We

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Speaker 3: ate a pizza not knowing my wife was making dinner,

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Speaker 3: and then we got home and she had made a

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Speaker 3: big dinner, like a big homemade dinner, because my brother

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Speaker 3: was in town, and so you can't you.

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Speaker 2: Know, So Mum's the word.

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Speaker 3: We had stuffed ourselves with pizza, but then brought it

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Speaker 3: hard for that homemade dinner.

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Speaker 2: Also, well, wait a man up.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I commend you for that.

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Speaker 2: It's just the polite thing to do. Mention this on

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Speaker 2: The Armstrong and Getty Show.

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Speaker 1: Wanted to flesh it out a little bit this big

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Speaker 1: Canadian study that came out from the Canadian Pediatric Society

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Speaker 1: strongly stating that the nanny state has gone too far.

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Speaker 1: The helicopter parent nation of veal calves spirit of the

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Speaker 1: modern world and that kids need more unstructured playtime. And

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Speaker 1: I love the way this is written. It's our friends

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Speaker 1: at Reason dot com. But kids need to climb trees,

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Speaker 1: jump off things, and ride their bikes, even at great speed,

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Speaker 1: according to the Canadian's Healthy Childhood Development through outdoor risky play.

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Speaker 1: Wait a minute, risky it's the sort of finding that's

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Speaker 1: almost considered radical these days. Uh they mentioned this developmental

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Speaker 1: psychologist the University of British Columbia has been championing risky

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Speaker 1: play for more than a decade.

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Speaker 3: Yes, you remember my story of some of my sons

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Speaker 3: are super super into skateboarding and we took a trip

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Speaker 3: to Los Angeles where skateboarding was kind of born. You know,

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Speaker 3: they're in Venice Beach and the dog Park or whatever

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Speaker 3: that's called the dog Pound. But we went around all

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Speaker 3: these skateboard parks. I'd Google Google them and I'd go

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Speaker 3: to them, and everyone but one had all these rules

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Speaker 3: about you had to have a helmet, and knee pads

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Speaker 3: and elbow pads, or you weren't allowed to skateboard there

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Speaker 3: in the city where skateboarding was invented by like, you know,

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Speaker 3: cool kids just being dangerous and wild, and we didn't

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Speaker 3: get to skateboard because we didn't bring all those pads

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Speaker 3: and everything like that. He doesn't use knee pads and

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Speaker 3: opal bads. But how nuts is that?

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Speaker 1: So? The Kinnucker Pediatric Society wasn't ready to endorse this

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Speaker 1: doctor's call for action. It was only when faced with

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Speaker 1: soaring rates of childhood anxiety, depression, obesity, and even myopia shortsightedness,

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Speaker 1: that Canadian health officials realized that quote letting kids go

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Speaker 1: out and play could be a real way to deal

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Speaker 1: with a lot of these challenging issues. That's because the

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Speaker 1: doctors came to recognize two truths. Number One, children are

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Speaker 1: hardwired to play because it aids their development. It teaches

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Speaker 1: them how to take action, get along and solve problems.

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Speaker 1: And Second, replacing rollicking kid led play with structured adult

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Speaker 1: led play was a mistake. It deprived children of a

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Speaker 1: million opportunities to exercise their autonomy. It also increased the

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Speaker 1: risk of physical danger. Oddly, enough and you get me

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Speaker 1: started on this, I will go all day about You

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Speaker 1: learn volumes. When you invent a game, you invent the rules,

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Speaker 1: you enforce the rules. You have disagreements about the rules,

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Speaker 1: You have the interplay between human beings negotiating the outcome

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Speaker 1: to that. You see who goes along with it who doesn't.

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Speaker 1: You see people who behave with dignity, You see people

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Speaker 1: who behave in a petulant manner. You learn stacks and

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Speaker 1: stacks and stacks of things about human beings by doing

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Speaker 1: that that a kid could never learn in a book

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Speaker 1: and never learn from adult led play. Actually I'm a

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Speaker 1: militant on this topic.

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Speaker 3: They actually outlawed that at the grade school near me.

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Speaker 3: I know because there's a game that the kids all

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Speaker 3: play that they made up on the court there on

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Speaker 3: the asphalt, where they bounce a ball around and you

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Speaker 3: hit it with your hands and keep scoring.

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Speaker 2: Stuff like that.

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Speaker 3: But anyway, they came up with official school rules that

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Speaker 3: everybody has to follow and nobody's able to deviate from.

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Speaker 1: I despise that thinking.

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Speaker 2: I despise those people. Well.

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Speaker 3: Their reasoning, though wrong, was it would cause less content

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Speaker 3: than less arguing. And although your point is.

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Speaker 2: Oh, good. It's the content prime of the kids.

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Speaker 1: The chance right, yeah, yeah yeah. Listen to another Brick

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Speaker 1: in the Wall part two. If you get a chance later.

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Speaker 1: That's a big floyd an old band.

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Speaker 2: Anyway.

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Speaker 1: So play does those things that Oh I'm sorry, I

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Speaker 1: skipped ahead. When kids play without adult supervision, they hone

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Speaker 1: their social and emotional coping skills. What's more, free play

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Speaker 1: can quote significantly reduce children's risk for elevated anxiety, and

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Speaker 1: play does that in a rather obvious way, says Peter Grave,

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Speaker 1: professor of psychology and neuroscience at Boston College and co

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Speaker 1: founder of with actually the author of this article, with

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Speaker 1: an organization called let Grow. He says, quote from an

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Speaker 1: evolutionary standpoint, why do children want to play in a

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Speaker 1: risky way? Because this is how they develop a little courage.

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Speaker 1: They deliberately put themselves into situations where they're feeling fear

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Speaker 1: so that unconsciously they can have a sense of control

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Speaker 1: over it. Quote I can feel this fear and survive it.

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Speaker 1: So when they face a real emergency, they're slightly less

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Speaker 1: likely to panic. They're also less fearful because they know

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Speaker 1: quote something can happen and I can manage it. The

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Speaker 1: Canadian report recommends pediatricians promote risky plays preventive medicine for

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Speaker 1: mental health. But what about the physical danger that risky

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Speaker 1: play sometimes involves? How can doctors and parents in schools

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Speaker 1: ignore that? By looking at the statistics, says the first

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Speaker 1: psychologist lady, from twenty oh seven to twenty twenty two,

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Speaker 1: there are two deaths from falls on the playground and

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Speaker 1: four hundred and eighty from motor vehicle crashes. This is

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Speaker 1: in Canada two to four hundred and eighty. So if

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Speaker 1: you don't let your kid engage in risky play, you

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Speaker 1: need to be two hundred and forty times more adamant

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Speaker 1: that they're never in a motor vehicle. As the Pediatrics

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Speaker 1: paper notes, quote, the research is established that children are

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Speaker 1: less likely to be injured while engaging in unstructured activities

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Speaker 1: than when playing an organized sport.

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Speaker 2: Sports are mortane.

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Speaker 1: Interest in goof around play starting to sound like the

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Speaker 1: real risk and risky plays that our culture is busy

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Speaker 1: outlawing it. Think it signs like the one in suburban Washington,

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Speaker 1: d C. Playground like you were talking about. Check that

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Speaker 1: warns would be fun, havers, adult supervision required.

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Speaker 2: Would be fun. Havers.

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Speaker 1: So how do we normalize free play again? The one

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Speaker 1: doctor tells parents start with an underwhelming experiment. Let them

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Speaker 1: out in the backyard while you're watching for a few minutes.

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Speaker 1: The next day, sit in the kitchen and don't watch.

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Speaker 1: You and your kids will get used to the time apart.

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Speaker 1: Another way is to ask your kids school to start

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Speaker 1: a let grow play club. That's when the school stays

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Speaker 1: open for mixed age free play. An adult is there,

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Speaker 1: but like a lifeguard, they don't organize the games or

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Speaker 1: solve the spats.

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Speaker 2: Oh lifeguard.

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Speaker 3: Then you had to bring up the community pool, which

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Speaker 3: is you know, doesn't allow cannon balls, or a local pool.

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Speaker 4: They took the diving board out of ours, yeah.

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Speaker 2: Place twenty years ago.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, treading water.

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Speaker 3: Treading water. You can jump feet first into the water,

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Speaker 3: but you can't turn in the air. You have to

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Speaker 3: be facing the same directions when your feet left the cement.

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Speaker 3: Or they will whistle you and come over with the

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Speaker 3: clipboard and fill out some forms.

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Speaker 4: And no diving or you're getting benched.

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Speaker 2: Oh diving, what are you? Insane? Shit?

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Speaker 1: They jail you for that. It's as if we are

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Speaker 1: deliberately trying to give kids anxiety and lack of confidence.

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Speaker 1: If I were to design a program to accomplish that,

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Speaker 1: it would look a lot like the modern world. And

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Speaker 1: I'm reminded, and I wish I'd thought of this in

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Speaker 1: advance to grab this. We talked about this. I think

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Speaker 1: it feels like it was last year. I'm getting old.

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Speaker 1: It was probably fifteen years ago. In Germany, the big

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Speaker 1: association of German insurance companies came out and issued a

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Speaker 1: statement in favor of letting kids play free and take

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Speaker 1: on risk because they did studies and they make their

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Speaker 1: living this way, so they're serious about it. They did

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Speaker 1: studies showing that kids don't grow up with an ability

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Speaker 1: to assess risk. They don't know if they can do

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Speaker 1: this or handle that, or endure that or whatever, because

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Speaker 1: they've never been given the chance to try. So they're

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Speaker 1: much more prone to serious accidents and injury.

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Speaker 3: So the only way out of this is if the

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Speaker 3: insurance companies decide it's actually cheaper to let kids play

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Speaker 3: and have a few bumps and bruises, then we pay

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Speaker 3: for their anxiety medicine, or they get into worse accidents

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Speaker 3: when they're older.

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Speaker 2: That's just fantastic.

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Speaker 1: Wow, Yeah, you're right, what a conundrum. So yeah, the

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Speaker 1: insurance companies have to all get together and say, hey, look,

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Speaker 1: some kids playing ball at another kid's house. Don't sue

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Speaker 1: the parents for the cost of the broken arm.

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Speaker 2: Just just let it go.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, that's likely, Joe, You're right, that was from last year.

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Speaker 5: And they wanted the children to develop risk competence.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, risk playgrounds.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, so nuts, so nuts, And it's so tragic. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: how did we get so the kids didn't do this

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Speaker 3: to themselves? All the parents are doing it. So how

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Speaker 3: did How did generations that grew up running around having

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Speaker 3: a good time and it's not like you know, I

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Speaker 3: know a half a dozen people that lost an eye

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Speaker 3: or an arm or died. How did we then decide

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Speaker 3: that we were going to raise our kids differently?

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Speaker 2: How did that happen?

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Speaker 4: Maybe the Internet?

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Speaker 2: Maybe the Internet? Yeah.

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Speaker 1: The theories that I've found most compelling is a the growth

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Speaker 1: of coast to coast media, so that if something horrific

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Speaker 1: happens to a child in Florida, you hear about it

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Speaker 1: in Seattle in a way that never used to be

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Speaker 1: the case. Secondly, and I'm intrigued by this theory. I

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Speaker 1: haven't really dug into it as people who become less

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Speaker 1: and less religious and less and less believers in another life.

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Speaker 1: That makes the only life you'll ever have worthy of

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Speaker 1: obsessive protection. You've got to stay safe and alive as

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Speaker 1: even to a red level of caution.

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Speaker 2: That's intriguing.

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Speaker 1: It's kind of a big, big question. Then you got liability, right,

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Speaker 1: And third, safety ism, which is a product of all

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Speaker 1: those things I mentioned in a couple other factors where

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Speaker 1: people adopted safety first, is like an unquestionable maxim for

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Speaker 1: living life. As I've said many times through the years,

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Speaker 1: how about safety? Third, fun British third, and I'm not

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Speaker 1: talking about your operating an e fing wood chipper.

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Speaker 2: Okay, Fun first, let's have fun with the wood chipper.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and then maybe innovation second, adventure second, safety, third.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, the combination of not wanting kids to get hurt,

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Speaker 3: which is a decent impulse. I don't want a kid

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Speaker 3: to get hurt either. I'm thinking about this person I

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Speaker 3: know who when the skateboard park oput up in town.

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Speaker 3: They told me that they volunteered with some other mothers

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Speaker 3: to go there on Saturday mornings with clipboards and check

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Speaker 3: kids in and make sure they were all wearing their helmets,

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Speaker 3: and I thought, wow, that's what you did with your

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Speaker 3: Saturday to the skateboard park and be the skateboard Nazis.

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Speaker 3: But I know this person. They're super nice. They were

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Speaker 3: just thought something dangerous came to town and we're gonna

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Speaker 3: try to help keep kids safe. They were wrong. But

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Speaker 3: then you got the other part of it, the liability

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Speaker 3: where your insurance carrier just says, hey, if you let

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Speaker 3: kids run on the grass and somebody gets slips and falls,

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Speaker 3: we're gonna get sued. So you better not let kids

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Speaker 3: run on the grass if it rained the day before,

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Speaker 3: or we'll drop your We'll drop your insurance, and then

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Speaker 3: you have no choice.

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Speaker 1: We clearly need to establish the conservative States of America

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Speaker 1: or that crap is not allowed. It's in the few

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Speaker 1: regulations we have, and we run an experiment with all

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Speaker 1: the things you're talking about. Kids are allowed to play

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Speaker 1: in risky ways. Your kid breaks your arm, their arm,

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Speaker 1: you pay for it. And just the experiment on the

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Speaker 1: other side has been a miserable, effing failure.

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Speaker 2: Miserable and it's getting worse.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, well, in some places it is worse than others.

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Speaker 4: Jack's birthday dinner here we go, steak spaghetti mcflury.

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Speaker 3: Ah flurry, that might be the dessert on the way

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Speaker 3: home to mcflury, I love that dessert.

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Speaker 1: Well, happy eights birthday because you're speaking like a child.

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Speaker 4: Yes, happy birthday.

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Speaker 2: Happy birthday. Well, I guess that's it. Spaghetti to mcfory.