1 00:00:00,280 --> 00:00:04,680 Speaker 1: Now here's a highlight. From Coast to Coast AM on iHeartRadio. 2 00:00:05,080 --> 00:00:07,800 Speaker 2: We are back with George Swimmer, the author of Oswald 3 00:00:07,800 --> 00:00:10,800 Speaker 2: and Kennedy The Whole Story, and previous to that he 4 00:00:10,800 --> 00:00:14,360 Speaker 2: published Doppelganger, The Legend of Lee Harvey Oswald. So I 5 00:00:14,360 --> 00:00:17,520 Speaker 2: want to play a little I'll call it a little 6 00:00:17,560 --> 00:00:20,640 Speaker 2: game here. George called which Oswald is which? So I'm 7 00:00:20,680 --> 00:00:24,880 Speaker 2: just going to run by some sort of pivotal moments 8 00:00:24,920 --> 00:00:27,319 Speaker 2: in the Oswald timeline and you just we don't have 9 00:00:27,360 --> 00:00:29,000 Speaker 2: to get too deep into each one, but just tell 10 00:00:29,600 --> 00:00:32,440 Speaker 2: so we can track, you know, who's who here. You 11 00:00:32,479 --> 00:00:36,239 Speaker 2: mentioned this one already. We talked about Camp Pendleton in 12 00:00:36,479 --> 00:00:42,239 Speaker 2: San Diego. Which Oswald is training as a marine at 13 00:00:42,240 --> 00:00:45,000 Speaker 2: Camp Pendleton in San Diego in nineteen fifty seven? Is 14 00:00:45,040 --> 00:00:46,879 Speaker 2: it Lee or Harvey? 15 00:00:48,400 --> 00:00:55,080 Speaker 3: Harvey is the Marine Corps base. And based on some information, 16 00:00:55,440 --> 00:01:01,760 Speaker 3: I believe that Lee was at the language school. I 17 00:01:01,760 --> 00:01:04,640 Speaker 3: don't know which service runs at, but he was at 18 00:01:04,640 --> 00:01:08,920 Speaker 3: this language school in southern California and learning Spanish. And 19 00:01:08,920 --> 00:01:12,160 Speaker 3: the reason that I'm saying that is a deduction. But 20 00:01:12,959 --> 00:01:18,600 Speaker 3: later on I found information that he was in he 21 00:01:18,680 --> 00:01:22,840 Speaker 3: spoke fluent Spanish and so he didn't study Spanish in 22 00:01:22,959 --> 00:01:26,880 Speaker 3: high school and he had no background in Spanish. So 23 00:01:26,959 --> 00:01:30,280 Speaker 3: the only thing I can assume him is that he 24 00:01:30,360 --> 00:01:33,600 Speaker 3: spent the last year in the Marine Corps learning how 25 00:01:33,600 --> 00:01:36,800 Speaker 3: to speak Spanish because he was going to work with 26 00:01:36,880 --> 00:01:44,240 Speaker 3: the anti Castro exiles in Florida and in Louisiana. 27 00:01:45,760 --> 00:01:51,320 Speaker 2: So Harvey is at Camp Pendleton. Lee is at Langley, Okay? 28 00:01:51,480 --> 00:01:55,440 Speaker 2: So which Oswald arrives in Japan in September fifty seven 29 00:01:55,520 --> 00:02:04,200 Speaker 2: and stationed at Sugi Air Force Base Lee? That's Lee, Okay? Which? 30 00:02:04,600 --> 00:02:07,720 Speaker 2: And do we know in September fifty seven? Where is 31 00:02:07,760 --> 00:02:08,280 Speaker 2: Harvey at? 32 00:02:08,320 --> 00:02:15,400 Speaker 3: Do we know? I'm not actually sure because there was 33 00:02:15,960 --> 00:02:19,600 Speaker 3: a lot of material. Anybody who's interested in that, they 34 00:02:19,600 --> 00:02:28,400 Speaker 3: can read John Armstone's Armstrong's book Harvey and Lee. What 35 00:02:28,880 --> 00:02:34,320 Speaker 3: happened was Harvey joined the Marines the same time that 36 00:02:34,440 --> 00:02:37,960 Speaker 3: Lee did, even though Harvey was a year younger. You 37 00:02:38,000 --> 00:02:40,280 Speaker 3: look at his photograph and he looks like a little kid. 38 00:02:41,160 --> 00:02:46,800 Speaker 3: But anyway, both she and Lee were trained in radar, 39 00:02:48,080 --> 00:02:53,000 Speaker 3: and apparently basic training and training and radar triok about 40 00:02:53,000 --> 00:02:58,680 Speaker 3: a year and then for some reason I can't figure 41 00:02:58,680 --> 00:03:01,840 Speaker 3: out what they pulled them out of the Marines, and 42 00:03:02,160 --> 00:03:06,480 Speaker 3: Harvey went back to New Orleans and he was working 43 00:03:06,560 --> 00:03:10,720 Speaker 3: there for I don't know, eight or ten months, just 44 00:03:10,760 --> 00:03:14,360 Speaker 3: an ordinary job. And then he came back into the 45 00:03:14,400 --> 00:03:20,440 Speaker 3: Marines and he showed up around October of that year, 46 00:03:21,680 --> 00:03:26,960 Speaker 3: and that's when he switched identities with lee Is after 47 00:03:27,440 --> 00:03:30,919 Speaker 3: he finished a job in New Orleans and went back 48 00:03:30,919 --> 00:03:36,680 Speaker 3: into the Marines. And that was in the fall of nineteen. 49 00:03:36,920 --> 00:03:38,280 Speaker 3: I guess it was fifty eight. 50 00:03:39,000 --> 00:03:43,480 Speaker 2: Okay, which Oswald departs the United States in nineteen fifty 51 00:03:43,560 --> 00:03:45,760 Speaker 2: nine by way of I think he went from England 52 00:03:45,760 --> 00:03:49,560 Speaker 2: to Helsinki to his final destination in the Soviet Union 53 00:03:49,760 --> 00:03:50,400 Speaker 2: in fifty nine. 54 00:03:50,440 --> 00:03:54,200 Speaker 3: I was, yeah, well that was Harvey and he was 55 00:03:54,240 --> 00:03:57,120 Speaker 3: doing what he was told, which is being a so 56 00:03:57,320 --> 00:04:00,640 Speaker 3: called defector and then positively double ash. 57 00:04:02,240 --> 00:04:05,800 Speaker 2: And so Harvey marries Marina Oswald and Moscow in April 58 00:04:05,880 --> 00:04:06,560 Speaker 2: of sixty one. 59 00:04:07,920 --> 00:04:11,360 Speaker 3: Right, I don't think you've met her in Moscow. I 60 00:04:11,360 --> 00:04:13,840 Speaker 3: think he married her in Minsk. 61 00:04:14,640 --> 00:04:18,800 Speaker 2: Okay, right, right, you're right, Minsk. Sorry, So, and that. 62 00:04:22,360 --> 00:04:22,520 Speaker 1: Is it? 63 00:04:22,680 --> 00:04:26,440 Speaker 2: Is there any point? I mean, obviously you found instances 64 00:04:26,520 --> 00:04:30,760 Speaker 2: where there was a Harvey is one in one location 65 00:04:30,880 --> 00:04:33,480 Speaker 2: and Lee's in another. I mean, you can't have too. 66 00:04:33,560 --> 00:04:37,239 Speaker 2: Lee Harvey Oswald's in two different locations at the same time. 67 00:04:37,920 --> 00:04:40,719 Speaker 2: Aren't they starting to I mean, aren't they risking tripping 68 00:04:40,760 --> 00:04:43,919 Speaker 2: themselves up? Isn't someone gonna say, wait a minute, you 69 00:04:44,040 --> 00:04:47,560 Speaker 2: said that Lee Harvey Oswald was or Harvey was in Minsk, 70 00:04:47,600 --> 00:04:50,240 Speaker 2: and but he was over here, you know, in Fort 71 00:04:50,240 --> 00:04:53,080 Speaker 2: Worth or New Orleans or wherever. Aren't they gonna aren't 72 00:04:53,080 --> 00:04:57,200 Speaker 2: they risking tripping themselves up or exposing this operation? 73 00:04:58,040 --> 00:04:58,120 Speaker 1: No? 74 00:04:59,240 --> 00:05:01,800 Speaker 3: See, one on one. One of the characteristics of any 75 00:05:01,839 --> 00:05:07,080 Speaker 3: intelligence service is to create confusion, and so they're perfectly 76 00:05:07,120 --> 00:05:12,279 Speaker 3: happy to confuse people. And so a lot of times 77 00:05:12,279 --> 00:05:17,560 Speaker 3: when the Warrant Commission would get contradictory facts, they'd say, oh, well, 78 00:05:17,640 --> 00:05:21,480 Speaker 3: you know, that's just a witness who is a misidentifying 79 00:05:21,520 --> 00:05:24,320 Speaker 3: this latter or other thing. I'll let me mention one 80 00:05:24,320 --> 00:05:29,600 Speaker 3: thing to you that shows you what goes on Harvey 81 00:05:32,480 --> 00:05:35,000 Speaker 3: with the New Orleans and one of the things he 82 00:05:35,240 --> 00:05:41,560 Speaker 3: was tasked to do by the CIA, he was helping 83 00:05:41,600 --> 00:05:46,800 Speaker 3: to develop a cancer. This is crazy, but the CIA 84 00:05:46,960 --> 00:05:51,120 Speaker 3: wanted to create a cancer, fast acting cancer and use 85 00:05:51,160 --> 00:05:53,640 Speaker 3: it to kill Castro. Now, this is one of those 86 00:05:54,000 --> 00:05:59,200 Speaker 3: any ideas that the CIA had during the fifties and sixties. Anyway, 87 00:05:59,279 --> 00:06:04,080 Speaker 3: he was a doctor called doctor Mary Sherman, and she 88 00:06:04,240 --> 00:06:08,640 Speaker 3: was a very well known physician and she was in 89 00:06:08,760 --> 00:06:13,240 Speaker 3: charge of doing this. So Harvey's a job wasn't very much, 90 00:06:13,400 --> 00:06:16,320 Speaker 3: you know, we just he killed some mice to get 91 00:06:16,400 --> 00:06:20,159 Speaker 3: the cancer cells and so on. Anyway, they did find 92 00:06:20,200 --> 00:06:23,800 Speaker 3: out they did find a quick killing cancer, and so 93 00:06:23,839 --> 00:06:29,919 Speaker 3: that Harvey supposedly he was tasked with taking these cancer 94 00:06:30,000 --> 00:06:35,160 Speaker 3: cells and a special container to Mexico City. And now 95 00:06:35,320 --> 00:06:39,000 Speaker 3: these cells are very delicate, and so he couldn't get 96 00:06:39,040 --> 00:06:42,280 Speaker 3: on a bus and go to Mexico City. So I 97 00:06:42,320 --> 00:06:46,400 Speaker 3: am assuming that he was flown there, and I'm making 98 00:06:46,400 --> 00:06:49,279 Speaker 3: a guess he was flown there in some planes that 99 00:06:49,320 --> 00:06:54,160 Speaker 3: were all owned by oil companies, because there's very clearly 100 00:06:54,240 --> 00:06:58,080 Speaker 3: some millionaire oil and were involved one way or another 101 00:06:58,400 --> 00:07:01,320 Speaker 3: with this thing. So Harvey he went to Mexico City 102 00:07:01,400 --> 00:07:06,880 Speaker 3: supposedly to go and hand off these cancer cells to 103 00:07:07,160 --> 00:07:10,680 Speaker 3: somebody who would take it to Cuba and then somehow 104 00:07:10,720 --> 00:07:15,160 Speaker 3: they would inject it in Castro and he died of 105 00:07:15,200 --> 00:07:17,240 Speaker 3: this cancer. I mean, it's a looney thing, but they 106 00:07:17,280 --> 00:07:21,480 Speaker 3: were serious about it. Okay, Nobody knows about that except 107 00:07:22,760 --> 00:07:25,520 Speaker 3: his lover. He had a lover in the New Orleans 108 00:07:26,160 --> 00:07:30,880 Speaker 3: Judith Barry Baker. Yes, and she's the one who wrote 109 00:07:30,920 --> 00:07:35,440 Speaker 3: in her book that he went to Mexico City by plane. Apparently. 110 00:07:35,960 --> 00:07:38,679 Speaker 2: Yeah, I think this is also covered in Sorry, George, 111 00:07:38,680 --> 00:07:40,680 Speaker 2: I think it's also covered in Doctor Mary's Monkey by 112 00:07:40,760 --> 00:07:41,480 Speaker 2: Edward Haslam. 113 00:07:42,800 --> 00:07:49,360 Speaker 3: Okay, so, but on the record quote Lee, Harvey Oswald, 114 00:07:49,480 --> 00:07:55,960 Speaker 3: which actually had to be Lee, went from I'm not 115 00:07:56,000 --> 00:07:58,200 Speaker 3: sure if he started from Dallas, but anyway he went. 116 00:07:58,280 --> 00:08:01,160 Speaker 3: He went to He went to mexic Pro City on 117 00:08:01,240 --> 00:08:06,080 Speaker 3: two different buses. And while he was on that bus, 118 00:08:06,640 --> 00:08:10,560 Speaker 3: the second bus, he started talking to a couple of 119 00:08:10,800 --> 00:08:15,600 Speaker 3: young women and he told them he'd been in Russia, 120 00:08:16,560 --> 00:08:21,360 Speaker 3: and then he pulled out a past passport with Russian 121 00:08:21,440 --> 00:08:24,520 Speaker 3: stamps on it. Now, the only problem with that is 122 00:08:24,560 --> 00:08:28,040 Speaker 3: that Harvey Oswald had gotten a new passport in New 123 00:08:28,120 --> 00:08:32,200 Speaker 3: Orleans about a month before, so Hardy must have turned 124 00:08:32,240 --> 00:08:37,720 Speaker 3: in his old passport and the CIA gave it to Lee. Now, 125 00:08:37,760 --> 00:08:39,920 Speaker 3: if you go, if you look in my book, and 126 00:08:39,960 --> 00:08:43,000 Speaker 3: then you can look online, there's a lot of other pictures. 127 00:08:43,240 --> 00:08:47,960 Speaker 3: There are many pictures, including the IDs, A couple of 128 00:08:48,000 --> 00:08:52,120 Speaker 3: IDs and so on that people claim was Lee Harvey Oswald. 129 00:08:52,760 --> 00:08:56,000 Speaker 3: But people who have done a photo analysis say that 130 00:08:56,480 --> 00:09:00,640 Speaker 3: the right side of the pictures is the right side 131 00:09:00,640 --> 00:09:03,840 Speaker 3: of Lee's face and the left side of the picture 132 00:09:04,679 --> 00:09:07,320 Speaker 3: is the left side of Harvey's face. And I have 133 00:09:07,400 --> 00:09:10,640 Speaker 3: some of those photographs in my book. So anyway, Lee 134 00:09:10,800 --> 00:09:14,280 Speaker 3: was on this bus and he had this Russian passport, 135 00:09:14,360 --> 00:09:16,760 Speaker 3: so we know there are two different people, ones on 136 00:09:16,800 --> 00:09:18,920 Speaker 3: a bus and oness on a plane. 137 00:09:20,080 --> 00:09:25,360 Speaker 2: Fascinating back to which Oswald is which which Oswald is 138 00:09:25,440 --> 00:09:30,080 Speaker 2: distributing Fair Play for Cuba pamphlets in New Orleans in 139 00:09:30,160 --> 00:09:32,160 Speaker 2: sixty early sixty three. 140 00:09:33,400 --> 00:09:36,880 Speaker 3: That was Harvey. And I once ran across a vague 141 00:09:36,960 --> 00:09:42,720 Speaker 3: mention that Harvey had actually given out these pamphlets in 142 00:09:42,840 --> 00:09:46,480 Speaker 3: Dallas for I don't know, it was just a very 143 00:09:46,720 --> 00:09:49,920 Speaker 3: brief period, but I couldn't find anything more on that. 144 00:09:50,000 --> 00:09:53,079 Speaker 3: It was just a mention somewhere by someone. But anyway, 145 00:09:53,120 --> 00:09:56,080 Speaker 3: he did it in New Orleans. Now, this is where 146 00:09:56,600 --> 00:10:00,840 Speaker 3: the thing gets very confusing but very interesting. When Harvey 147 00:10:00,920 --> 00:10:05,360 Speaker 3: came back from Russia, he didn't do anything. He got 148 00:10:05,360 --> 00:10:08,600 Speaker 3: a job paying a dollar twenty five cents an hour 149 00:10:09,360 --> 00:10:15,840 Speaker 3: U and that was a very very medial job. Well, 150 00:10:16,000 --> 00:10:20,080 Speaker 3: then then he was asked to come to Dallas by 151 00:10:20,520 --> 00:10:23,199 Speaker 3: a Russian named George lawn Shilder. I don't want to 152 00:10:23,240 --> 00:10:28,280 Speaker 3: get that about launch story. And then after he got 153 00:10:28,320 --> 00:10:32,000 Speaker 3: to Dallas, eventually he was sent to New Orleans. As 154 00:10:32,080 --> 00:10:34,600 Speaker 3: you mentioned. Now the thing about New Orleans is aren't 155 00:10:34,640 --> 00:10:39,560 Speaker 3: interesting because he was doing a couple of legitimate intelligence 156 00:10:39,840 --> 00:10:43,559 Speaker 3: intelligence work down in New Orleans and at the same 157 00:10:43,600 --> 00:10:47,320 Speaker 3: time he was being set up by the conspirators to 158 00:10:47,360 --> 00:10:51,760 Speaker 3: be a pants a patsy. Now the handing out the 159 00:10:51,800 --> 00:10:55,600 Speaker 3: pamphlets want to set him up as a castro loving patsy. 160 00:10:56,440 --> 00:10:59,360 Speaker 3: He handed out the leaflets, he got on radio, he 161 00:10:59,400 --> 00:11:04,800 Speaker 3: got on television, he got arrested, and so he was. 162 00:11:04,840 --> 00:11:09,720 Speaker 3: He was known in New Orleans as a quote castro unquote. 163 00:11:09,880 --> 00:11:14,480 Speaker 3: That was his second personality. And the guy, the guy 164 00:11:14,520 --> 00:11:17,679 Speaker 3: that was in charge Balls, his name was David Philip. 165 00:11:19,000 --> 00:11:21,439 Speaker 3: David Philip I can't think it was last night for 166 00:11:22,000 --> 00:11:28,400 Speaker 3: right now, but anyway, he was in charge of Harvey. 167 00:11:28,960 --> 00:11:33,960 Speaker 3: And so what the original persona was a Russian Russian 168 00:11:34,000 --> 00:11:37,960 Speaker 3: loving defector, and then he goes to New York and 169 00:11:38,000 --> 00:11:43,960 Speaker 3: he adds to it a castro loving person. And actually 170 00:11:44,040 --> 00:11:45,599 Speaker 3: when he was in the last year he was in 171 00:11:45,640 --> 00:11:48,560 Speaker 3: the Marines, he told people that he was planning to 172 00:11:48,559 --> 00:11:52,880 Speaker 3: go and join Castro's army. So anyway, those are the 173 00:11:53,240 --> 00:11:55,400 Speaker 3: those are the things that he was being set up with. 174 00:11:56,040 --> 00:11:58,760 Speaker 3: The legitimate things he was doing was he was doing 175 00:11:58,840 --> 00:12:03,080 Speaker 3: this cancer helping with the cancer research. Then he was 176 00:12:03,559 --> 00:12:08,120 Speaker 3: he was involved in some way or another with training 177 00:12:11,120 --> 00:12:15,600 Speaker 3: the Cuban exiles. And I spoke back to the question you 178 00:12:15,600 --> 00:12:17,000 Speaker 3: had of it is one day I met each other. 179 00:12:17,040 --> 00:12:22,320 Speaker 3: There's a photograph. It's only something that somebody told about. 180 00:12:22,679 --> 00:12:24,920 Speaker 3: I couldn't find that. Nobody, nobody knows what it is. 181 00:12:25,200 --> 00:12:29,120 Speaker 3: But anyway, this photograph, which the government probably has, showed 182 00:12:29,760 --> 00:12:36,840 Speaker 3: Harvey and Olshold and David Attlee Phillips. 183 00:12:36,600 --> 00:12:37,959 Speaker 2: And the yeah that was the handler. 184 00:12:38,040 --> 00:12:41,480 Speaker 3: Yeah, that time that both both Oswald's were at that 185 00:12:41,559 --> 00:12:46,400 Speaker 3: particular camp helping him train. So by that time both 186 00:12:46,400 --> 00:12:47,280 Speaker 3: of them knew each other. 187 00:12:47,960 --> 00:12:50,320 Speaker 2: Oh wait a second, you're saying that somewhere there is 188 00:12:50,600 --> 00:12:55,040 Speaker 2: in existence a photograph showing Harvey and Lee Oswald, the 189 00:12:55,040 --> 00:12:58,200 Speaker 2: two doppel gangers in the same photograph. 190 00:12:58,360 --> 00:13:01,280 Speaker 3: That's what That's what I read. You know, I haven't 191 00:13:01,280 --> 00:13:05,120 Speaker 3: seen it. I can only tell you that somebody claimed 192 00:13:05,120 --> 00:13:10,360 Speaker 3: that there was a photograph and the government has it. 193 00:13:10,840 --> 00:13:15,040 Speaker 2: So let's talk about the Texas Book Depository building. Harvey 194 00:13:15,160 --> 00:13:17,160 Speaker 2: is hired to work there. 195 00:13:17,600 --> 00:13:22,600 Speaker 3: Or is it Lee Harvey is? And actually, you know 196 00:13:23,400 --> 00:13:28,280 Speaker 3: he's hired in name only because Harvey had three jobs 197 00:13:28,840 --> 00:13:31,480 Speaker 3: when he came back from Russia. Had the first job 198 00:13:31,559 --> 00:13:36,479 Speaker 3: I mentioned earlier. Then he had a job in New Orleans, 199 00:13:37,000 --> 00:13:39,760 Speaker 3: and then he had this job in Dallas, and all 200 00:13:39,800 --> 00:13:43,800 Speaker 3: three jobs were arranged for him by the CIA, So 201 00:13:44,080 --> 00:13:46,880 Speaker 3: you know, it was a normal hire, and that shout 202 00:13:46,840 --> 00:13:51,280 Speaker 3: was very Baker said that Harvey told her that the 203 00:13:53,720 --> 00:13:58,720 Speaker 3: so called superintendent of the Texas School but repository knew 204 00:13:58,760 --> 00:14:03,520 Speaker 3: that Harvey was an informer for the FBI. So you know, 205 00:14:03,520 --> 00:14:04,960 Speaker 3: if you want to get into that, there's a lot 206 00:14:05,000 --> 00:14:09,319 Speaker 3: of funny stuff going on with the Texas School Books topauditory. 207 00:14:09,880 --> 00:14:12,600 Speaker 2: Yeah, before that, I got one more, Which Oswald is which, 208 00:14:13,400 --> 00:14:17,640 Speaker 2: and that has to do with that famous photograph in 209 00:14:17,679 --> 00:14:22,040 Speaker 2: the backyard of well whichever. Oswald was living at two 210 00:14:22,080 --> 00:14:24,400 Speaker 2: hundred and fourteen West Neely Street in Dallas, where he's 211 00:14:24,440 --> 00:14:29,360 Speaker 2: holding the Manlika the Menlca carcano rifle in one hand 212 00:14:29,400 --> 00:14:32,200 Speaker 2: and he's got the two communist or socialist newspapers in 213 00:14:32,240 --> 00:14:36,560 Speaker 2: the other. Is that Harvey or is that Lee? It's 214 00:14:36,600 --> 00:14:43,280 Speaker 2: an either one oh of the plot sickens. 215 00:14:43,040 --> 00:14:51,400 Speaker 3: It's a phony picture. They superimposed the face of Harvey 216 00:14:52,160 --> 00:14:58,440 Speaker 3: from the lifts up onto another figure, and the people 217 00:14:58,440 --> 00:15:03,240 Speaker 3: who've analyze the photograph, I believe the figure is a 218 00:15:03,240 --> 00:15:09,240 Speaker 3: police photographer, and you can tell there's something wrong with it. 219 00:15:09,400 --> 00:15:11,360 Speaker 3: I don't want to get too all the technicogy details, 220 00:15:11,400 --> 00:15:15,840 Speaker 3: but the shadows are all wrong. And what is the 221 00:15:15,840 --> 00:15:21,320 Speaker 3: most obvious thing is when you enlarge the photographs, which 222 00:15:21,400 --> 00:15:24,920 Speaker 3: I was able to do on my computer, I could 223 00:15:24,920 --> 00:15:28,840 Speaker 3: see with the naked eye. You don't need to analyze anything. 224 00:15:28,880 --> 00:15:33,840 Speaker 3: You can see that in Harvey's booking photo in Dallas, 225 00:15:34,200 --> 00:15:40,800 Speaker 3: his chin is almost to a point, very narrow, narrow chin, 226 00:15:40,920 --> 00:15:43,720 Speaker 3: and there's very little at the very bottom of the shin. 227 00:15:44,040 --> 00:15:46,840 Speaker 3: And you look at the picture on the so called 228 00:15:47,400 --> 00:15:51,560 Speaker 3: backyard photo and the chin is square and it's quite wide, 229 00:15:52,440 --> 00:15:55,960 Speaker 3: so you can tell immediately that it's not the same chin. 230 00:15:56,360 --> 00:15:58,360 Speaker 3: And there's lots of other things I didn't want to 231 00:15:58,360 --> 00:16:01,320 Speaker 3: get into, but there are people of written articles and 232 00:16:01,360 --> 00:16:04,280 Speaker 3: books about all the things that are wrong with a photograph, 233 00:16:04,360 --> 00:16:08,720 Speaker 3: and I think every researcher agrees at this point that 234 00:16:08,760 --> 00:16:14,960 Speaker 3: this is a pony photograph. I also theorized that this 235 00:16:15,120 --> 00:16:21,120 Speaker 3: building where the photograph was taken was a CIA safehouse 236 00:16:22,120 --> 00:16:24,880 Speaker 3: and it was used because they had a backyard which 237 00:16:24,960 --> 00:16:29,080 Speaker 3: was protected and they could go and use the backyard 238 00:16:29,120 --> 00:16:29,920 Speaker 3: to make the picture. 239 00:16:30,440 --> 00:16:33,720 Speaker 1: Listen to more Coast to Coast AM every weeknight at 240 00:16:33,760 --> 00:16:37,000 Speaker 1: one am Eastern and go to Coast to coastam dot 241 00:16:37,040 --> 00:16:37,840 Speaker 1: com for more