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Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grease Cole Mom Laurie Valo finally convicted,

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Speaker 1: but what about Chad Dabell. And now we learn that

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Speaker 1: coltman Laurie Valo, Hey, it ain't over yet. She's heading

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Speaker 1: to Arizona for yet another murdered case that in the

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Speaker 1: shooting death of her husband, Charles Valo. Now that would

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Speaker 1: be her fourth husband, Charles Value. The prophet Chad Dabell

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Speaker 1: was number five.

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Speaker 2: And I got.

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Speaker 1: A pretty sneaky suspicion that the prophet is going off script.

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Speaker 1: I do not believe that Unlike his wife, the Goddess

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Speaker 1: Laurie Valo, I don't think he's going to stand by

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Speaker 1: her at trial. I think he's going to sell her

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Speaker 1: straight down the river. Joining me right now is the

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Speaker 1: founder and director of the Cold Case Research Institute, forensic

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Speaker 1: expert in star of a hit podcast, Zone seven, Cheryl McCollum. So,

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Speaker 1: you know, after we learned that, it's kind of hard

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Speaker 1: for it to come out. After we learned that the

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Speaker 1: prophet Chad day Bell's penis was named the Storm. Yeah, okay,

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Speaker 1: that was like eating a dirt sandwich in court, which

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Speaker 1: I've had to do many many times. It looks like

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Speaker 1: the prophet Chad day Bill and the Storm are going

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Speaker 1: on trial for murder. Tell me your thoughts A on

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Speaker 1: the verdict regarding caled Mam Laurie Valo, and B what's

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Speaker 1: up for the Storm?

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Speaker 3: The verdict was absolutely just an accurate I think that

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Speaker 3: a lot of us are waiting and waiting to be

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Speaker 3: able to say convicted murderer, you know, Louis Valo, and

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Speaker 3: we can do that now, and I think Mother's Day

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Speaker 3: is an appropriate weekend to be able to do that.

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Speaker 3: Regarding the Storm, I think the Storm is going down.

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Speaker 1: I think that he yeah, you know what, I'm going

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Speaker 1: to try to ignore your phraseology, but go ahead.

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Speaker 2: I think putting the.

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Speaker 1: Storm and going down in one sentence is just too much,

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Speaker 1: but go ahead.

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Speaker 2: That's just you.

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Speaker 3: But she realizes absolutely what's coming for him. So he

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Speaker 3: knows one, you've got the murder charge, you know that

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Speaker 3: he's facing. But he knows he's probably more than likely

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Speaker 3: going to be somehow implicated in what happened to Charles

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Speaker 3: because you had a million dollars on the line here,

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Speaker 3: you had a crime scene that was staged, and his

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Speaker 3: name's going to be all over it. No question about it.

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Speaker 1: The extradition off Calmont Laurie Valo to Arizona is coming up.

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Speaker 1: It could be weeks, it could be months. We know

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Speaker 1: that it's going to be three months until she is sentenced. Interestingly,

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Speaker 1: the DPE death penalty off the table for Lori Valo,

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Speaker 1: but not so for Chad day Bell.

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Speaker 2: And this is what I think is the reasoning behind that.

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Speaker 1: As you know, Cheryl McCollum, they are very strict deadlines

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Speaker 1: that the state has to meet. I remember, I think

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Speaker 1: you may have been there. It's a big blur.

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Speaker 2: Now.

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Speaker 1: We have this giant, giant Xerox machine at the District

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Speaker 1: Attorney's office. It literally took up a room and there

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Speaker 1: was a strict deadline. If I wanted to start a

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Speaker 1: trial on let's just say Monday the tenth, very often

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Speaker 1: it would be the Friday night before, ten days before

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Speaker 1: I would have to be getting out discovery because it

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Speaker 1: had to be postmarked ten days.

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Speaker 2: Prior to trial.

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Speaker 1: Normally I'd hand it over much much longer before that,

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Speaker 1: but that is xerox machine would break down and I

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Speaker 1: would be in there throwing a fit all alone, to

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Speaker 1: be like ten o'clock at night, trying to xerox, the

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Speaker 1: defendant statements and the crime lab report and this, and yes,

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Speaker 1: I would have shared it with a defense like here,

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Speaker 1: you can look at the file, but you had to

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Speaker 1: actually give it to them. You couldn't just show it

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Speaker 1: to me. You had to give it to them before

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Speaker 1: a certain deadline or that evidence would not be allowed

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Speaker 1: at trial. You know, scientific reports like this is positive

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Speaker 1: for cocaine, and these are his fingerprints, and this says

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Speaker 1: the fiber from his.

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Speaker 2: Carpet blah blah blah.

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Speaker 1: Anyway, then I would have to drive it to the

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Speaker 1: Atlanta airport because they had the very last I guess

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Speaker 1: FedEx or mailing that would go out at midnight and

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Speaker 1: it had to be postmarked that day or it wouldn't

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Speaker 1: come in.

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Speaker 2: I'm leading up to something. Just go with me on this.

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Speaker 1: As the investigation was, you know, rapidly accelerating leading up

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Speaker 1: to trial, the state found evidence like that long blonde

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Speaker 1: hair that absolutely DNA proved was Lori Valo's on the

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Speaker 1: tape wrapped around seven year old JJ. That happened within

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Speaker 1: the discovery period. And I think that a lot, well

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Speaker 1: not a lot, some very vital evidence was discovered during

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Speaker 1: that period. And it was too late to hand it.

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Speaker 1: It was handed over, but it didn't meet the deadlines.

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Speaker 2: Now why is that important?

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Speaker 1: Because Lori Valo called mal Lauri Valo had filed a

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Speaker 1: demand for speedy trial, so the trial couldn't be further no,

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Speaker 1: oister continued a month later. It had to be done

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Speaker 1: then or else should be acquitted under the law. And

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Speaker 1: I think that's why they took the DP off the table,

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Speaker 1: because the state could not not that they were doing

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Speaker 1: anything sneaky or nefarious. They could not meet that that deadline.

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Speaker 1: And I believe that's why the DP was taken off

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Speaker 1: the table.

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Speaker 2: That's just me.

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Speaker 3: That's a solid reason. But let's talk about the reality.

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Speaker 3: If you have the deathiny.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, all the discovery deadlines, they're not real. Is

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Speaker 1: that what you're saying?

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Speaker 3: No, no, no, I'm saying something regarding the destinity in prison.

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Speaker 3: If you get the destinery, you get a single cell

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Speaker 3: by yourself, you get total privacy. I would like to

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Speaker 3: see her in general population. I would like for her

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Speaker 3: to see the full effect of being in prison the

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Speaker 3: rest of her days. That's just me.

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Speaker 1: Okay, So that was okay, that was an okay observation.

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Speaker 2: But who wouldn't.

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Speaker 1: Can we talk about the strongest evidence at the trial.

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Speaker 1: And I believe that hair that I was just describing

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Speaker 1: was incredibly, incredibly strong.

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Speaker 3: That's true.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah. Another thing, the sexting. While the bodies are

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Speaker 1: buried in his pet cemetery, he the prophet and she

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Speaker 1: the goddess are exchanging sex messages over and over and

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Speaker 1: over as they plot to kill Tammy Dave Bell.

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Speaker 2: I mean, it removes every.

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Speaker 1: Shred of a facade of a motherly concern for these children.

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Speaker 2: Everything.

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Speaker 1: All she is concerned about is hopping in the sick

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Speaker 1: at some hotel with Chad Dave Bell, who is complete idiot.

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Speaker 2: I mean, have you read any of his prophecies?

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Speaker 3: I have not, but I want to go back.

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Speaker 2: Oh hold on, I think I'm going to gag right now.

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Speaker 2: Listen to this.

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Speaker 1: James their pseudonym for each other, James and Olena. James

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Speaker 1: took her in his arms and they smiled at each other.

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Speaker 1: The vibration in the room was intense. Their hearts reached out.

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Speaker 2: To each other in glorious reunion.

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Speaker 1: James gently touched the side of Elena's breast and he

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Speaker 1: was in ecstasy. You know, there's so much more I mean,

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Speaker 1: I don't know how the jerry kept their lunched down

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Speaker 1: looking at these two in court.

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Speaker 3: Oh Nancy, well James and Elena. Again, they're going to prison,

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Speaker 3: so he's gonna have plenty of time to write these

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Speaker 3: lovely things to her. But let's go back seriously, because

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Speaker 3: when the DNA came back matching Lori Valow to the

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Speaker 3: hair that was found on the duct tave yep Aj,

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Speaker 3: I thought of you immediately, because you remember with Kasey Anthony.

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Speaker 1: I'm just gonna have to think that through, but I'll

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Speaker 1: save that for another day. When you find out about

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Speaker 1: the defendant's hair wrapped in that.

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Speaker 2: Duct tape, you thought of me. Thank you. I think

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Speaker 2: this first thing I should say, but go ahead.

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Speaker 3: The reason is because you said something so passionately one

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Speaker 3: day and it was so dead accurate. You were like,

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Speaker 3: there's no way you're ever gonna find duct tape on

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Speaker 3: somebody's face and it not the murder.

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Speaker 1: Well, yeah, I was talking about the fact that the

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Speaker 1: duct tape facilitated the death. It may not have been

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Speaker 1: the intentional mode of death, but when you wrap duct

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Speaker 1: tape around let's just say, Kaylee Anthony's face around her mouth,

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Speaker 1: and knows she's going to die, just like JJ. Of

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Speaker 1: course I think he was already dead. But doing that

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Speaker 1: to the child, to JJ and her hair being in it,

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Speaker 1: not just on his pajamas or his socks or his person,

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Speaker 1: which could have come from a hug, but on the

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Speaker 1: tape that facilitated his death.

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Speaker 3: Right, you no longer have an accident, You no longer

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Speaker 3: have something that she's going to be able to explain,

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Speaker 3: just like with Casey Anthony, there's no way to explain

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Speaker 3: why that action was taken. And when you look at JJ,

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Speaker 3: him having the scratches on his throat, that to me

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Speaker 3: was when the devil walked in that room, because that

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Speaker 3: baby tried to save himself. And cook.

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Speaker 2: Time stories with Nancy Grace.

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Speaker 1: Another thing that came out in trial, which we really

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Speaker 1: didn't talk about that much, these damning text messages about

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Speaker 1: plotting to cause the children pain JJ and Tony. I'm

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Speaker 1: wanting to hear this. Dave Bell asks Valo if she

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Speaker 1: wants him to quote cause pain to children, and he

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Speaker 1: says that they were dark people. Dave Bell, Valo told

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Speaker 1: him to hold off, but if they these children they

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Speaker 1: were with acted up again, quote, we can zap them. Also,

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Speaker 1: she says that day well, Dave Bell responded, if they're

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Speaker 1: going to act up, we'll at least give them a

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Speaker 1: reason to scream. He also states that he had quote

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Speaker 1: turned up the pain on her daughter.

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Speaker 2: It just.

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Speaker 1: I don't I don't understand anyone's thinking when they talk

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Speaker 1: about children in this manner. But I also think that

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Speaker 1: her demeanor in court really hurt her. Cheryl McCollum, what

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Speaker 1: do you think.

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Speaker 3: The jury sat and watched her every day have no

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Speaker 3: emotion with stoic To me, it sometimes even smugs. That

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Speaker 3: absolutely affected the way that they saw her, the way

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Speaker 3: they understood this crime. Again, when you have a mama

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Speaker 3: that is going to allow any man to harm their

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Speaker 3: children to the point they're going to scream, she knows

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Speaker 3: it's going to happen, so it's premeditated and she sits

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Speaker 3: by and allows it.

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Speaker 1: Let me ask you what you think, what you predict

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Speaker 1: in the prophet Chad da Bell's upcoming trial. I mean,

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Speaker 1: she would not take this dance. She would not sell

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Speaker 1: him or her brother Alex Cox down the river. I

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Speaker 1: don't think that's going to work for him, And I'm

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Speaker 1: basing that on the way he has behaved in court.

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Speaker 1: The few times they've been in there together before their

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Speaker 1: cases were severed, she would smile and be flirtatious toward him,

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Speaker 1: chin a mouth of words at Himp, just go and.

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Speaker 2: Look away from her.

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Speaker 1: I know that's just body language, but I think he's

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Speaker 1: going to try to blame everything on her.

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Speaker 3: I think body language is important because a lot of

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Speaker 3: times that's something you don't even realize you're given away.

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Speaker 3: Just like Ballow after the guilty verdict, she crossed her

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Speaker 3: arms while the jury was leaving. She was disgusted, she

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Speaker 3: was over that. So I think what you're observing with

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Speaker 3: you know, Dave Bell, is important because here's the thing.

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Speaker 3: He is now on an island alone. He doesn't have

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Speaker 3: the benefit of her you know, whatever you want to

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Speaker 3: call it sexual. I don't know Nancy. Whatever she's doing

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Speaker 3: for him, she can't do anymore. So he doesn't have that.

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Speaker 3: He's alone the majority of the time, with his own thoughts,

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Speaker 3: his own fears, his own feelings. If the right person

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Speaker 3: can get to him, whether it's a family member or

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Speaker 3: an attorney, I think there's a great possibility that he's

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Speaker 3: going to flip.

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Speaker 2: Well, here's another thing that we haven't talked about.

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Speaker 1: Yet while they took the DPE death penalty off the

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Speaker 1: table for caltmom Laurie Valo in this trial, Arizona has

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Speaker 1: the death penalty. That's where she's going in for the

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Speaker 1: trial of her fourth husband, Charles Valot. And there, as

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Speaker 1: you know, the death penalty was put on a moratorium

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Speaker 1: after a botched execution of Joseph Wood back in twenty fourteen,

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Speaker 1: and since that time they have changed their cocktail for

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Speaker 1: the DP, the needle lethal injection to one simple ingredient,

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Speaker 1: penta barbitol. She can look at the death penalty in Arizona,

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Speaker 1: and when you've got now.

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Speaker 2: Three dead bodies that have legally been chalked up.

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Speaker 1: To you, I think there's a very good chance she

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Speaker 1: could get the death penalty in az.

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Speaker 3: If you're ever going to use the death penity, it's

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Speaker 3: in a case like this. If we're ever going to

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Speaker 3: say that a person deserves to be put to death

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Speaker 3: by the state, it is here. It's when somebody has

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Speaker 3: this just trail of death behind them only for their

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Speaker 3: own advancement. I'm not somebody that's spleetly bought in that

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Speaker 3: they thought this was the end of time. This has

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Speaker 3: a very evil thread of money all throughout it. Well,

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Speaker 3: she started reading these books by Chad. She's thinking he's

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Speaker 3: got money, he's some big time you know author. She

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Speaker 3: wanted the million dollar insurance from Charles. She wanted to

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Speaker 3: again gain financially from these people. There's no question about it.

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Speaker 3: To get rid of your children again, there's money because

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Speaker 3: she goes and she gets their social security. I mean,

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Speaker 3: there's a there's a thread here. You can't ignore that

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Speaker 3: she is doing. She wanted that money, she wanted.

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Speaker 1: The un You're right, and I just jumped to the

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Speaker 1: next step, the next concludion, the logical conclusion for you're saying,

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Speaker 1: I really believe that she should be prosecuted in Arizona

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Speaker 1: for the murder of Charles Valle, her fourth husband, for

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Speaker 1: pecuniary or money gain. I really do, because when you

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Speaker 1: add that that is an aggravating circumstance for which you

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Speaker 1: can get the death penalty. And listen, dp's up to

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Speaker 1: the jury. It's the state's duty to advance it, and

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Speaker 1: it's the jury's decision. But if the state wants to

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Speaker 1: seek the death penalty on her, which they did here

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Speaker 1: in Idaho, but they got up against that timeline and

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Speaker 1: had to withdraw it. Not so in Arizona. Pecuniary gain

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Speaker 1: is one of the most successful child strategies to get

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Speaker 1: a DP because it displays Cheryl such a cold heart

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Speaker 1: and Charles value murder was.

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Speaker 2: Just the beginning.

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Speaker 1: After that came Tylely and and JJ his son, then

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Speaker 1: came Timmy J. Bell, and then came Alex Cox, and

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Speaker 1: there's always Joseph Ryan.

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Speaker 2: I guess that would have been her third husband, right,

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah.

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Speaker 1: And I find it really hard to believe with all

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Speaker 1: these dead bodies that he died of natural causes. And

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Speaker 1: I got another problem with Alex cox cod cause of

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Speaker 1: death because according to official documents, there have been two

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Speaker 1: different CODs for one person.

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Speaker 3: Ok.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that stinks to high Heaven. So something's way wrong

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Speaker 1: with that. So in my mind his death is suspicious

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Speaker 1: as well. And wouldn't you just know it, the trigger

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Speaker 1: man dies of natural causes.

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Speaker 2: I'm not buying that at all.

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Speaker 3: Not only does he die of natural causes, he's with

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Speaker 3: a wife he's been married to for what two weeks

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Speaker 3: that Chad puts him up with as a thank you

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Speaker 3: for being so supportive of his sister.

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Speaker 1: I only hope Cheryl McCollum that the prophet Chad da

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Speaker 1: Bell's pickup line can come into court, that pickup line

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Speaker 1: being Hey, we were married in a previous life.

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Speaker 2: We've already had sex, so what's the problem.

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Speaker 3: Well, when you self steal yourself to somebody, you know,

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Speaker 3: I guess it's pretty easy to convince that same person

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Speaker 3: you were married in a previous life. Hey, I wonder

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Speaker 3: if we can get a wedding shower the legs we

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Speaker 3: had before the.

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Speaker 2: Listen.

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Speaker 1: I don't need any more pots and pans or irons,

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Speaker 1: which I'm not going to use anyway. But you know,

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Speaker 1: I'm just thinking this through because you know, Cheryl, you

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Speaker 1: and I have been through a lot of cases together,

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Speaker 1: not just covering them, but trying them, investigating them.

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Speaker 2: And we are.

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Speaker 1: Actually laughing at some of the things that cult man,

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Speaker 1: Laury Valo and Chad Dave Bell have done. And I

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Speaker 1: think that's kind of a would you say when a

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Speaker 1: case is so upsetting, like what was done to JJ

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Speaker 1: and Tyley. It is overwhelming, it's dark and upsetting, and

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Speaker 1: if you don't watch out, it will grab you by

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Speaker 1: the toe and drag you under aim you will never

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Speaker 1: see the light of day again. And I guess laughing

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Speaker 1: at some of the like the storm, the name for

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Speaker 1: his penis. I've got a lot of other names for

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Speaker 1: his penis, but that ain't one of them. And thinking

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Speaker 1: about how stupid they were going on Amazon and buying

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Speaker 1: your quote beach b each wedding dress to marry the

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Speaker 1: prophet Da Bell before his wife died, and then woe

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Speaker 1: she dies and you have a wedding on the beach

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Speaker 1: like a couple of weeks later.

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Speaker 3: It's just crazy, it is, It is crazy. Lori Vallow's

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Speaker 3: sister said it best you were dancing on the beach

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Speaker 3: while your children were buried in the ground. There's no

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Speaker 3: way any mama can make sense of that in her head,

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Speaker 3: it's not going to happen. So again, yes, when you

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Speaker 3: think of Hollie being burned and they can't even tell

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Speaker 3: you how she died, don't have a call to death

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Speaker 3: for her. That's how pitiful that baby was treated. And

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Speaker 3: just jump thrown on top of her. And then you've

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Speaker 3: got jj that you know at one point was alive

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Speaker 3: when he was being suffocated because he's trying to save itself.

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Speaker 1: Covered in bruises, trying to breathe through that plastic bag

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Speaker 1: that they had over his head.

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Speaker 3: But of course we have to talk about the storm.

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Speaker 3: We have to balance that. So yeah, we're gonna make

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Speaker 3: fun and we're gonna laugh, because there has to be that,

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Speaker 3: you know, balance that we could just self protect ourselves.

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Speaker 1: You know, I know it's hard to understand, but thinking

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Speaker 1: about I mean really thinking about it has to make

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Speaker 1: juries do this, and I'd be so upset. I couldn't

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Speaker 1: sleep at night, literally could not sleep at night to

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Speaker 1: make a jury confront the evidence because it's so upsetting

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Speaker 1: and so settling, unsettling to think about what was done

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Speaker 1: to these two children.

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Speaker 2: It's just so hard to think about.

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Speaker 1: And if you notice you said about how JJ fought

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Speaker 1: for his life, he was asphyxiated with a plastic bag.

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Speaker 2: That's how he died.

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Speaker 1: And there are bruise marks on his body where he

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Speaker 1: tried to fight to get that bag off of his

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Speaker 1: face and his head.

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Speaker 2: Same thing with Tammy Dabell.

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Speaker 1: She was asphyxiated and she had bruising on her body

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Speaker 1: where she tried to live. And by God, they're gonna

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Speaker 1: answer up for this, true, of course, as they had

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Speaker 1: to hell, but in a court of law, So help

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Speaker 1: me God, Thank you, Cheryl McCombe.

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Speaker 2: Goodbye for