1 00:00:00,280 --> 00:00:04,720 Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is 2 00:00:04,800 --> 00:00:09,119 Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or 3 00:00:09,240 --> 00:00:12,119 Speaker 1: learn the stuff they don't want you to know. A 4 00:00:12,240 --> 00:00:26,000 Speaker 1: production of I Heart Radio. Hello, welcome back to the show. 5 00:00:26,079 --> 00:00:28,520 Speaker 1: My name is Matt. Our colleague Nol is on a 6 00:00:28,600 --> 00:00:32,080 Speaker 1: real adventure, but we'll be returning very soon. They call 7 00:00:32,159 --> 00:00:35,240 Speaker 1: me Ben. We are joined as always with our super 8 00:00:35,320 --> 00:00:40,200 Speaker 1: producer Hall Mission controlled decade. Most importantly, you are you, 9 00:00:40,200 --> 00:00:43,480 Speaker 1: You are here and that makes this the stuff they 10 00:00:43,600 --> 00:00:49,240 Speaker 1: don't want you to know. This is uh special episode 11 00:00:49,280 --> 00:00:52,280 Speaker 1: for us. This is a two part episode, is the 12 00:00:52,320 --> 00:00:55,920 Speaker 1: whole week, so we do hope you like it. Uh. 13 00:00:56,320 --> 00:01:00,160 Speaker 1: We want to start out with some full disclosure and 14 00:01:00,240 --> 00:01:04,280 Speaker 1: transparency is very important here uh and stuff they want 15 00:01:04,280 --> 00:01:06,200 Speaker 1: want you to know. We would like to note that 16 00:01:06,280 --> 00:01:11,119 Speaker 1: our parent company are Corporate Overlord's I Heart Media, recently 17 00:01:11,160 --> 00:01:15,679 Speaker 1: recognize something called the I Heart Podcast Union. Now, Matt, 18 00:01:16,160 --> 00:01:20,720 Speaker 1: you and Nol and I are not involved with these negotiations, 19 00:01:21,200 --> 00:01:24,920 Speaker 1: but this did inspire us to take a closer look 20 00:01:24,959 --> 00:01:29,520 Speaker 1: at the concept as well as the conspiracies involved. Yes, 21 00:01:29,720 --> 00:01:32,800 Speaker 1: we've been watching the process happen right before our eyes. 22 00:01:33,360 --> 00:01:36,080 Speaker 1: We've been getting updates from our very own Paul mission 23 00:01:36,080 --> 00:01:39,520 Speaker 1: controled decade. Who I hope Paul, I hope you don't 24 00:01:39,520 --> 00:01:42,479 Speaker 1: mind us saying this, but you were involved and we 25 00:01:42,840 --> 00:01:45,399 Speaker 1: in a like in leading the charge and as you 26 00:01:45,480 --> 00:01:48,960 Speaker 1: listen to this series, if you have any questions, specifically 27 00:01:49,000 --> 00:01:51,960 Speaker 1: about the I Heeart Podcast Union, Paul has said he 28 00:01:52,160 --> 00:01:54,760 Speaker 1: is ready to hear those questions and will respond. You 29 00:01:54,800 --> 00:01:58,320 Speaker 1: can send those questions to us conspiracy at I heart 30 00:01:58,440 --> 00:02:02,200 Speaker 1: radio dot com. Here we go. If you live in 31 00:02:02,280 --> 00:02:06,000 Speaker 1: the United States, regardless of what sort of job or 32 00:02:06,200 --> 00:02:10,360 Speaker 1: career you have, you have probably heard of something called 33 00:02:10,480 --> 00:02:16,520 Speaker 1: unions labor unions specifically. In this two part episode, we're 34 00:02:16,560 --> 00:02:20,560 Speaker 1: exploring what a union is, where it comes from, and 35 00:02:20,600 --> 00:02:25,600 Speaker 1: why so many powerful people and institutions seem opposed to them. 36 00:02:26,080 --> 00:02:29,600 Speaker 1: Will also explore the controversies and corruption that have occurred 37 00:02:29,680 --> 00:02:36,680 Speaker 1: within unions themselves at times. In short, honestly, fellow conspiracy realist, 38 00:02:37,120 --> 00:02:39,920 Speaker 1: there's a lot of stuff they don't want you to 39 00:02:40,000 --> 00:02:43,679 Speaker 1: know here, So let's start at the beginning. Here are 40 00:02:43,720 --> 00:02:48,640 Speaker 1: the facts, Matt. What is a union? How did they begin? 41 00:02:48,919 --> 00:02:51,760 Speaker 1: Why is this a thing? Is this new? Is this old? 42 00:02:51,880 --> 00:02:55,639 Speaker 1: What's what's the school. Oh, this is quite old. Uh. 43 00:02:55,639 --> 00:02:58,280 Speaker 1: It's a common thing throughout history. When there are a 44 00:02:58,360 --> 00:03:02,600 Speaker 1: lot of individual a means, generally humans working together in 45 00:03:02,639 --> 00:03:06,760 Speaker 1: the same profession, they will often team up and say, hey, oh, 46 00:03:06,880 --> 00:03:08,840 Speaker 1: we're a lot like each other. We we have the 47 00:03:08,880 --> 00:03:11,079 Speaker 1: same needs and the same wants, and we do kind 48 00:03:11,080 --> 00:03:13,880 Speaker 1: of the same thing. How can we work together? If 49 00:03:13,919 --> 00:03:17,760 Speaker 1: you look to ancient Mesopotamia, there are laws there that 50 00:03:18,160 --> 00:03:22,600 Speaker 1: have really echoed from that time through until today. And 51 00:03:23,240 --> 00:03:28,639 Speaker 1: these things are like normalized wages, things that will moderately 52 00:03:29,040 --> 00:03:33,120 Speaker 1: protect workers. Let's say, moderately protect workers. That's the goal 53 00:03:33,600 --> 00:03:37,160 Speaker 1: at least from the workers perspective, not always from uh, 54 00:03:37,200 --> 00:03:40,560 Speaker 1: the employer's perspective of the people, you know, deciding what 55 00:03:40,600 --> 00:03:43,080 Speaker 1: those workers have to do. Um. And you can look 56 00:03:43,120 --> 00:03:47,760 Speaker 1: to also Egypt Rome. They're similar organizations that arise from 57 00:03:47,800 --> 00:03:51,760 Speaker 1: those civilizations. UM, similar kinds of rules as well. Yeah, 58 00:03:51,880 --> 00:03:54,800 Speaker 1: and then it's true. It's an ancient thing, and it 59 00:03:54,840 --> 00:03:58,800 Speaker 1: makes sense. Human beings are gregarious. They like to have 60 00:03:58,960 --> 00:04:04,200 Speaker 1: stuffing common, right, and most people like to think that 61 00:04:04,240 --> 00:04:07,320 Speaker 1: they're having an okay life. I don't think that's a 62 00:04:07,400 --> 00:04:11,120 Speaker 1: hot take. I mean, okay, so let's go right, the 63 00:04:11,120 --> 00:04:15,840 Speaker 1: The origins of these ideas are are quite ancient. Let's 64 00:04:15,880 --> 00:04:20,000 Speaker 1: go to Europe. It's uh, Matt, let's say it's like 65 00:04:20,080 --> 00:04:26,960 Speaker 1: the sixteenth or seventeenth century. At this point. Economies in 66 00:04:26,960 --> 00:04:30,000 Speaker 1: in that part of the world are largely run by 67 00:04:30,040 --> 00:04:34,880 Speaker 1: a series of things called guilds. Guilds are organizations of 68 00:04:35,040 --> 00:04:40,359 Speaker 1: merchants who all work in the same business. Now, yes, folks, 69 00:04:41,120 --> 00:04:45,000 Speaker 1: we'll do a City of London episode later. But the 70 00:04:46,600 --> 00:04:50,599 Speaker 1: City of London, that's in London, whatever, But it's a 71 00:04:50,600 --> 00:04:54,640 Speaker 1: whole thing. It's it's its own bag of badgers. Uh. 72 00:04:54,800 --> 00:05:02,200 Speaker 1: In theory, guilds were built with a good faith motivation. 73 00:05:02,279 --> 00:05:08,320 Speaker 1: They were protective outfits. Like if if Matt and Michigantrol 74 00:05:08,400 --> 00:05:14,120 Speaker 1: and I all sold wool, right, we're all somehow involved 75 00:05:14,120 --> 00:05:17,800 Speaker 1: in the wool game. We would join up with other 76 00:05:17,839 --> 00:05:21,320 Speaker 1: folks in that game, and then we would say, okay, look, 77 00:05:22,040 --> 00:05:27,120 Speaker 1: let's all sell stuff for roughly the same price, and 78 00:05:27,240 --> 00:05:33,880 Speaker 1: let's make sure that we can collectively not get screwed over. 79 00:05:34,200 --> 00:05:38,240 Speaker 1: And in these yeah, I mean, that's understandable. There's nothing 80 00:05:38,320 --> 00:05:43,760 Speaker 1: sinister about that. In these guilds, these workers would come 81 00:05:43,760 --> 00:05:49,680 Speaker 1: together again. Originally and then in theory to share expertise, 82 00:05:49,839 --> 00:05:53,720 Speaker 1: to support charities at times, like to take care of 83 00:05:54,040 --> 00:05:58,599 Speaker 1: you know, um, if if our fellow uh wool person 84 00:05:59,360 --> 00:06:02,640 Speaker 1: passed away, we would band together, we posse up, and 85 00:06:02,680 --> 00:06:06,200 Speaker 1: we take care of their family. Right. We will form 86 00:06:06,440 --> 00:06:10,440 Speaker 1: rules and policies for trade and commerce, and then we 87 00:06:10,480 --> 00:06:18,800 Speaker 1: would lobby whatever state or church or arbitrary monarchy was 88 00:06:19,040 --> 00:06:23,040 Speaker 1: in charge. We would lobby them to not scross over again. 89 00:06:23,120 --> 00:06:26,240 Speaker 1: It's a protective thing, right. Yeah, there's lots of working together, 90 00:06:26,360 --> 00:06:30,840 Speaker 1: and you you can kind of see some similarities here. 91 00:06:31,080 --> 00:06:36,960 Speaker 1: Maybe you're already hearing them between highly organized groups, especially 92 00:06:37,000 --> 00:06:40,560 Speaker 1: groups that exert some kind of power, right, and that's 93 00:06:40,560 --> 00:06:43,120 Speaker 1: not a bad thing. Like the point here is to 94 00:06:43,240 --> 00:06:47,520 Speaker 1: exert the the collective power of a group of people, right, 95 00:06:48,080 --> 00:06:50,320 Speaker 1: And you can it's just weird. Band I can already 96 00:06:50,320 --> 00:06:54,600 Speaker 1: see the threads of rumors and some of the older 97 00:06:54,640 --> 00:06:59,640 Speaker 1: issues with some unions where there's an organized uh not 98 00:06:59,640 --> 00:07:04,880 Speaker 1: necessarily criminal element, but an organized group maybe pulling strings 99 00:07:05,000 --> 00:07:09,320 Speaker 1: within the group. Oh yeah, yeah tail as old as time, Like, yes, 100 00:07:10,240 --> 00:07:16,200 Speaker 1: guilds decayed into corruption shoutout City of London. Uh, they 101 00:07:16,280 --> 00:07:23,800 Speaker 1: became increasingly unequal and oligarchical, and they repeated the same 102 00:07:24,000 --> 00:07:30,400 Speaker 1: problems of all monarchical systems, which is, ultimately they did 103 00:07:30,440 --> 00:07:37,800 Speaker 1: not manage to stay meritocracies, right. They ultimately began um 104 00:07:38,080 --> 00:07:43,440 Speaker 1: trying to become the governing structure that they originally opposed, 105 00:07:43,760 --> 00:07:48,160 Speaker 1: which happens with so many revolutions. It's just humans are 106 00:07:48,320 --> 00:07:52,080 Speaker 1: good at a lot of stuff. Group work is not one. Uh. 107 00:07:52,320 --> 00:07:56,800 Speaker 1: They like what one thing that really stands out is 108 00:07:57,080 --> 00:08:02,240 Speaker 1: if you look at the the old school Western European 109 00:08:02,440 --> 00:08:07,360 Speaker 1: or Central European guild system, you've got three stages. Right, 110 00:08:07,400 --> 00:08:12,880 Speaker 1: You've got the apprentice, You've got the journeyman, you've got 111 00:08:12,920 --> 00:08:26,360 Speaker 1: the master, the journeyman, and well it's also a different degree. Wow, alright, 112 00:08:26,400 --> 00:08:28,840 Speaker 1: we're right. And if you got that one. So the 113 00:08:30,000 --> 00:08:34,679 Speaker 1: journeyman were these folks who had moved up from their apprenticeship. 114 00:08:35,240 --> 00:08:38,160 Speaker 1: They had a little bit of agency in theory. They 115 00:08:38,200 --> 00:08:43,920 Speaker 1: could they could go learn from someone in another city, right, 116 00:08:44,320 --> 00:08:47,840 Speaker 1: And then ultimately the idea was for them to become 117 00:08:47,960 --> 00:08:52,840 Speaker 1: a master. They would create a masterpiece, that's where the 118 00:08:52,960 --> 00:08:57,360 Speaker 1: term masterpiece comes from. Uh. And this would elevate them 119 00:08:58,080 --> 00:09:02,760 Speaker 1: to a level such that they could also higher on apprentices, 120 00:09:03,080 --> 00:09:07,080 Speaker 1: grow them into journeymen, and then if they're you know, 121 00:09:07,440 --> 00:09:11,800 Speaker 1: not a terrible person, they would ultimately they would ultimately 122 00:09:11,840 --> 00:09:20,480 Speaker 1: facilitate those journeyman becoming masters. The thing is, these journeymen 123 00:09:20,640 --> 00:09:25,400 Speaker 1: were often getting getting the short end of the stick 124 00:09:25,520 --> 00:09:30,600 Speaker 1: or the fuzzy side of the lollipop. They were they 125 00:09:30,600 --> 00:09:36,199 Speaker 1: were getting underpaid, their work was uncredited, they were getting 126 00:09:36,200 --> 00:09:41,720 Speaker 1: a lot of restrictions, and so occasionally, sporadically they would 127 00:09:41,920 --> 00:09:46,200 Speaker 1: vultron up together and they would you know, it often 128 00:09:46,280 --> 00:09:51,160 Speaker 1: happened in capitals of this era, like because a lot 129 00:09:51,160 --> 00:09:55,880 Speaker 1: of people from rural environments would become journeyman, and then 130 00:09:55,920 --> 00:09:58,040 Speaker 1: they would go to the capital because that's where most 131 00:09:58,040 --> 00:10:02,880 Speaker 1: of the work was. And then they would say, okay, everybody, 132 00:10:02,920 --> 00:10:06,840 Speaker 1: and you know, Prague or whatever, uh, we all the 133 00:10:07,040 --> 00:10:11,720 Speaker 1: journeyman in charge of wool in Prague are gonna say 134 00:10:11,840 --> 00:10:14,720 Speaker 1: you have to you have to pay us, and you 135 00:10:14,760 --> 00:10:17,520 Speaker 1: have to pay us a standard wage, and we also 136 00:10:17,640 --> 00:10:20,960 Speaker 1: have to get like one day off one day. This 137 00:10:21,000 --> 00:10:24,720 Speaker 1: is before the concept of the weekend, by the way. Yes, yes, 138 00:10:25,080 --> 00:10:27,760 Speaker 1: well think think about this. Really, at the heart of it, 139 00:10:28,200 --> 00:10:31,280 Speaker 1: a a journeyman within that system, and you know, to 140 00:10:31,320 --> 00:10:33,640 Speaker 1: be described as a journeyman at that time. You have 141 00:10:33,840 --> 00:10:37,760 Speaker 1: all of the necessary skills of a master, of the 142 00:10:37,880 --> 00:10:40,320 Speaker 1: essential skills of a master, but you have none of 143 00:10:40,360 --> 00:10:44,760 Speaker 1: the power of a master. Right and two. And if 144 00:10:44,760 --> 00:10:48,360 Speaker 1: you get stuck in that spot where you cannot exert 145 00:10:48,400 --> 00:10:50,679 Speaker 1: a power, you cannot grow. You are just kind of 146 00:10:50,760 --> 00:10:53,679 Speaker 1: left there as a journeyman with the wages you have, 147 00:10:54,000 --> 00:10:57,760 Speaker 1: and everyone above you is satisfied with the work you're producing. 148 00:10:58,280 --> 00:11:02,040 Speaker 1: But there's no reason they don't benefit from elevating you 149 00:11:02,400 --> 00:11:06,840 Speaker 1: to master, at least not directly. Right. So keeping journeyman 150 00:11:06,880 --> 00:11:13,080 Speaker 1: at that level is beneficial for those above them, right. 151 00:11:13,559 --> 00:11:18,319 Speaker 1: And of course you can see the perspective of the masters, 152 00:11:18,520 --> 00:11:23,319 Speaker 1: you can see the perspective of the journeyman here. And 153 00:11:23,559 --> 00:11:28,160 Speaker 1: then banding together. That's kind of a forerunner of what 154 00:11:28,600 --> 00:11:32,120 Speaker 1: we would call unions in the West. That's not a 155 00:11:32,200 --> 00:11:36,080 Speaker 1: modern labor union because these were just a bunch of 156 00:11:36,080 --> 00:11:39,679 Speaker 1: people who basically got together and said, what's going on 157 00:11:40,840 --> 00:11:44,000 Speaker 1: here in Prague is malarkey, you know, or what's it 158 00:11:44,040 --> 00:11:46,640 Speaker 1: going out here in Paris is not working for us. 159 00:11:47,320 --> 00:11:51,000 Speaker 1: If you look at modern labor unions, you're really looking 160 00:11:51,040 --> 00:11:56,800 Speaker 1: at the industrial revolution in probably the late seventeen hundreds 161 00:11:56,920 --> 00:12:02,360 Speaker 1: in Europe. This was a huge social shift. Why is that? 162 00:12:02,400 --> 00:12:05,000 Speaker 1: Why does that sound like a tongue of This is 163 00:12:05,400 --> 00:12:10,040 Speaker 1: just a huge social shift anyway, not for nothing. Right 164 00:12:10,200 --> 00:12:12,920 Speaker 1: is it called a revolution? People don't think about that 165 00:12:13,000 --> 00:12:19,599 Speaker 1: as often as they should. Industrial revolution. It's like American revolution, 166 00:12:19,679 --> 00:12:22,920 Speaker 1: It's like French revolution. It is an upending of the 167 00:12:23,000 --> 00:12:26,720 Speaker 1: status quo. The here's what happened, and we don't have 168 00:12:26,840 --> 00:12:31,360 Speaker 1: to point to villains or heroes here. Uh, this is 169 00:12:31,600 --> 00:12:35,160 Speaker 1: something that happened to everybody, from the bottom of the 170 00:12:35,240 --> 00:12:41,280 Speaker 1: socioeconomic strata to the very top. A ton of people 171 00:12:42,720 --> 00:12:45,679 Speaker 1: used to work in agriculture or they worked in things 172 00:12:45,720 --> 00:12:49,480 Speaker 1: that were called cottage industries, and they found their jobs 173 00:12:49,600 --> 00:12:57,120 Speaker 1: disappearing because things were increasingly automated. Mechanization came in cottage industry. 174 00:12:57,240 --> 00:13:01,679 Speaker 1: Just to be clear for everyone. Uh, disc vibes kind 175 00:13:01,720 --> 00:13:09,120 Speaker 1: of like a system of subcontracting. So like you are tailor, right, 176 00:13:09,240 --> 00:13:14,560 Speaker 1: and you make um fancy I don't know whatever is 177 00:13:14,600 --> 00:13:18,240 Speaker 1: fancy at that time, Like dumb looking tunics that are 178 00:13:18,360 --> 00:13:22,840 Speaker 1: very ornate. You make those and as part of your 179 00:13:22,920 --> 00:13:25,800 Speaker 1: job as the tailor, you have a bunch of friends. 180 00:13:25,840 --> 00:13:27,600 Speaker 1: You get by with a little help from your friends. 181 00:13:27,679 --> 00:13:31,079 Speaker 1: You got somebody you know who lives at home. They 182 00:13:31,120 --> 00:13:36,160 Speaker 1: make lace. You've got someone you know who like is 183 00:13:36,200 --> 00:13:39,880 Speaker 1: in the wool game, and uh, and you sort of 184 00:13:40,160 --> 00:13:43,320 Speaker 1: get this all together, you agglomerate it, and then you know, 185 00:13:43,480 --> 00:13:48,480 Speaker 1: you end up with um extraordinarily fancy tunic. I don't 186 00:13:48,480 --> 00:13:51,280 Speaker 1: mean to call them silly, It's just not my thing anyway. 187 00:13:51,400 --> 00:13:57,160 Speaker 1: So some tunics are dope, Okay, yes, hashtag not all tunics, 188 00:13:57,160 --> 00:14:00,360 Speaker 1: I got you, man. So the uh, The the is 189 00:14:00,440 --> 00:14:06,400 Speaker 1: that when the industrial Revolution occurred in Europe for the 190 00:14:06,440 --> 00:14:12,040 Speaker 1: first time in known history, all of that stuff that 191 00:14:12,160 --> 00:14:15,280 Speaker 1: people used to do on their own and then send 192 00:14:15,360 --> 00:14:19,960 Speaker 1: to some sort of overseer, it all could happen in 193 00:14:20,000 --> 00:14:24,760 Speaker 1: the same place. This is the emergence of the factory 194 00:14:24,920 --> 00:14:27,880 Speaker 1: and thus the emergence of the factory town. So people 195 00:14:28,240 --> 00:14:32,560 Speaker 1: poured into industrial areas. There were a flood of what 196 00:14:32,600 --> 00:14:35,720 Speaker 1: you would call like low skilled workers, and they had 197 00:14:35,760 --> 00:14:41,320 Speaker 1: absolutely no rights. They were ground to the bones. They died, 198 00:14:42,320 --> 00:14:46,800 Speaker 1: They died making those stupid tunics, and their standard of 199 00:14:46,880 --> 00:14:50,880 Speaker 1: living plummeted. I just want to point this out. They 200 00:14:50,920 --> 00:14:54,560 Speaker 1: probably would have been better on the farm, even as 201 00:14:54,680 --> 00:14:58,320 Speaker 1: it's messed up. Well, yeah, because now the master work 202 00:14:58,640 --> 00:15:03,040 Speaker 1: is being done by machines, and so now you literally 203 00:15:03,120 --> 00:15:07,040 Speaker 1: need hands to move things along that production line. And 204 00:15:07,080 --> 00:15:11,120 Speaker 1: that's why, that's why the skill, the skill level requirement 205 00:15:11,200 --> 00:15:14,360 Speaker 1: to actually function and create the you know, the same 206 00:15:14,400 --> 00:15:18,240 Speaker 1: tunic or you know who whatever it is, is lowered 207 00:15:18,520 --> 00:15:21,640 Speaker 1: so much because you're not actually making the tunic. Now 208 00:15:21,840 --> 00:15:24,480 Speaker 1: you're perhaps making a part of the tunic with the 209 00:15:24,560 --> 00:15:28,120 Speaker 1: help of machines, and then that the tunic itself is 210 00:15:28,160 --> 00:15:32,120 Speaker 1: being put together through the machines. And you can just 211 00:15:32,160 --> 00:15:35,200 Speaker 1: see how again, like I'm trying to show the perspective 212 00:15:35,200 --> 00:15:37,720 Speaker 1: on both sides here. From the perspective of the worker 213 00:15:38,880 --> 00:15:41,440 Speaker 1: you are, you don't need to know as much to 214 00:15:42,000 --> 00:15:44,920 Speaker 1: create a thing or to be functional in your position, 215 00:15:45,320 --> 00:15:48,440 Speaker 1: and from the people who are running the factory, those 216 00:15:48,480 --> 00:15:51,680 Speaker 1: people who are now the actual humans who are creating 217 00:15:51,800 --> 00:15:56,440 Speaker 1: your goods are just pieces in this machine that are 218 00:15:56,480 --> 00:16:00,400 Speaker 1: manufacturing your goods. It is not you know, several prized 219 00:16:00,480 --> 00:16:03,000 Speaker 1: individuals who have the skills required to make the thing. 220 00:16:03,320 --> 00:16:07,000 Speaker 1: It's people who move the thing along well, put yeah, 221 00:16:07,360 --> 00:16:13,760 Speaker 1: cogs right, moving parts and and that's you know, uh, folks, 222 00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:17,280 Speaker 1: long time listeners, you know that Matt, and I take 223 00:16:17,640 --> 00:16:26,760 Speaker 1: great offense to the idea or the term low skill worker. Agreed, agreed, Yeah, 224 00:16:26,840 --> 00:16:29,520 Speaker 1: I'm sorry, and I don't. I only use that even 225 00:16:29,600 --> 00:16:33,280 Speaker 1: framing of it as in the way that workers began 226 00:16:33,320 --> 00:16:37,720 Speaker 1: to be viewed from that perspective. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah yeah, 227 00:16:38,000 --> 00:16:43,480 Speaker 1: Like we obviously know and hopefully everybody knows that there's 228 00:16:43,640 --> 00:16:47,560 Speaker 1: not really such a thing as a low skilled worker. 229 00:16:48,000 --> 00:16:51,720 Speaker 1: Maybe some executives there there are may be some executives 230 00:16:51,760 --> 00:17:02,360 Speaker 1: like skating by on nepotism, you know what I mean? Fine, Uh, no, 231 00:17:02,680 --> 00:17:05,560 Speaker 1: I disagree with you, Matt. Matt, you are quite talented 232 00:17:05,960 --> 00:17:09,600 Speaker 1: as a very fact. The the the only thing, the 233 00:17:09,640 --> 00:17:13,440 Speaker 1: only thing that I think, uh that I think you're 234 00:17:13,440 --> 00:17:16,880 Speaker 1: not good at is having high standards and friends. So 235 00:17:17,040 --> 00:17:22,120 Speaker 1: thank you for hanging out with me. Sure, so alright, 236 00:17:22,119 --> 00:17:25,040 Speaker 1: trade unions is the real thing. So the the what 237 00:17:25,119 --> 00:17:29,240 Speaker 1: you need to know is that in the United Kingdoms specifically, 238 00:17:30,200 --> 00:17:33,520 Speaker 1: you see the first arrival of modern trade unions, and 239 00:17:33,560 --> 00:17:38,320 Speaker 1: they're usually going to be sporadic. Uh, they're restricted to 240 00:17:38,400 --> 00:17:44,320 Speaker 1: certain regions or professions. But the governing powers were aware 241 00:17:44,320 --> 00:17:48,560 Speaker 1: of this, right because this is a lower class speaking 242 00:17:48,680 --> 00:17:53,720 Speaker 1: truth to the people. In power. So it should not 243 00:17:53,800 --> 00:17:58,119 Speaker 1: surprise anyone that at various times throughout history, especially in 244 00:17:58,160 --> 00:18:04,840 Speaker 1: Western Europe, these things were explicitly outlawed. The concept itself 245 00:18:04,880 --> 00:18:07,399 Speaker 1: had not reached a tipping point. If you want to 246 00:18:07,520 --> 00:18:12,360 Speaker 1: look at the tipping point, the emergence of the concept 247 00:18:13,160 --> 00:18:16,359 Speaker 1: of workers representing themselves, you have to look to the 248 00:18:16,480 --> 00:18:19,679 Speaker 1: United States now. Yes, of course, if you listen to 249 00:18:19,680 --> 00:18:23,639 Speaker 1: this show, uh, you know that the US gets a 250 00:18:23,640 --> 00:18:28,000 Speaker 1: lot of things wrong. And edit me here, Paul, we 251 00:18:28,200 --> 00:18:31,480 Speaker 1: rightly on Uncle Sam at times, uh, and I think 252 00:18:31,480 --> 00:18:33,760 Speaker 1: we do it in a very fair way. But it 253 00:18:33,840 --> 00:18:38,080 Speaker 1: may surprise, it may surprise many of us to know 254 00:18:38,720 --> 00:18:41,399 Speaker 1: that the the US now is known as a pretty 255 00:18:41,480 --> 00:18:45,840 Speaker 1: anti labor union country, but in many ways it was 256 00:18:45,960 --> 00:18:50,600 Speaker 1: home to the modern labor movement. It was. I just 257 00:18:50,640 --> 00:18:52,760 Speaker 1: love the concept that every once in a while we 258 00:18:52,760 --> 00:19:00,760 Speaker 1: give Uncle Sam a right fair, very British of us. Yes, Ben, 259 00:19:00,840 --> 00:19:02,399 Speaker 1: why don't we Why don't we hear a word from 260 00:19:02,440 --> 00:19:05,679 Speaker 1: our sponsor and then come right back and learn a 261 00:19:05,680 --> 00:19:16,440 Speaker 1: little bit about the history of unions within the United States. Ah, 262 00:19:16,440 --> 00:19:19,720 Speaker 1: we have returned, and we are headed to the United States, 263 00:19:19,760 --> 00:19:23,520 Speaker 1: the good old US of a. Yes, So the interesting 264 00:19:23,560 --> 00:19:29,160 Speaker 1: thing here is that the history of labor disputes the 265 00:19:29,240 --> 00:19:36,479 Speaker 1: working class versus the ownership class, the employees versus the employers. 266 00:19:37,280 --> 00:19:42,000 Speaker 1: It's older than the American Revolution. If you look back 267 00:19:42,040 --> 00:19:46,119 Speaker 1: in sixteen thirty six, you'll see that a bunch of 268 00:19:46,119 --> 00:19:49,880 Speaker 1: people working in the fishing industry on this one island 269 00:19:50,040 --> 00:19:55,320 Speaker 1: off the coast of Maine went on strike. In sixteen 270 00:19:55,760 --> 00:20:01,320 Speaker 1: seventies seven, people working in the transportation industry went on 271 00:20:01,359 --> 00:20:05,080 Speaker 1: strike in New York City. And most of those incidents 272 00:20:06,080 --> 00:20:12,399 Speaker 1: are temporary and they're isolated, and it was very rare 273 00:20:12,640 --> 00:20:18,360 Speaker 1: for these incidents to result in a formation of a 274 00:20:18,480 --> 00:20:22,560 Speaker 1: permanent group that would try to bargain with the powers 275 00:20:22,600 --> 00:20:29,320 Speaker 1: that be. Uh, mainly because they had very little legal ability, 276 00:20:29,440 --> 00:20:33,760 Speaker 1: they have very little agency. UH. If if they were 277 00:20:33,800 --> 00:20:38,680 Speaker 1: injured in the result of a strike or something, then 278 00:20:40,160 --> 00:20:45,880 Speaker 1: the going consensus was, it's on you, it's your bad. Uh. 279 00:20:45,920 --> 00:20:53,280 Speaker 1: There was one criminal prosecution in the colonial era in Savannah, 280 00:20:53,280 --> 00:20:57,479 Speaker 1: Georgia in seventy six a bunch of carpenters went on 281 00:20:57,560 --> 00:21:02,280 Speaker 1: strike and and the law officially got on them. Now, 282 00:21:02,800 --> 00:21:06,640 Speaker 1: don't get us wrong, folks, these people were getting their 283 00:21:06,640 --> 00:21:13,200 Speaker 1: heads bashed left and right, and that is typically well. Often, 284 00:21:13,520 --> 00:21:15,840 Speaker 1: as you'll see him part two of this week's episode. 285 00:21:16,400 --> 00:21:21,479 Speaker 1: Often that remains the case in some way. So the 286 00:21:21,600 --> 00:21:27,360 Speaker 1: US gets this tradition of unions or something like unions 287 00:21:27,480 --> 00:21:33,200 Speaker 1: and European guilds from their friends across the pond. And 288 00:21:33,280 --> 00:21:35,480 Speaker 1: this is where we want to introduce this guy named 289 00:21:35,520 --> 00:21:39,600 Speaker 1: Samuel Gompers. I'm sorry to say his name like that. 290 00:21:39,720 --> 00:21:43,080 Speaker 1: I think it's a great name anyway, Samuel Gompers. Uh, 291 00:21:43,840 --> 00:21:47,399 Speaker 1: don't don't let don't let that delightful name fool you. 292 00:21:47,480 --> 00:21:52,560 Speaker 1: He's a big deal. In six he brought together a 293 00:21:52,800 --> 00:21:59,159 Speaker 1: couple of craft unions and specifically cigar makers, and he 294 00:21:59,280 --> 00:22:03,600 Speaker 1: forms something called the American Federation of Labor the a 295 00:22:03,840 --> 00:22:07,399 Speaker 1: f L. That was one of the first big, big 296 00:22:07,520 --> 00:22:12,240 Speaker 1: unions in the US. And then fast forward seventy years, 297 00:22:12,920 --> 00:22:16,720 Speaker 1: the a f L merges with something called the Congress 298 00:22:16,840 --> 00:22:23,199 Speaker 1: of Industrial Organizations. This creates the a f L dash 299 00:22:23,440 --> 00:22:27,040 Speaker 1: c i O, and this is one of the largest 300 00:22:27,680 --> 00:22:31,840 Speaker 1: labor organizations around. Look, there's a ton of history when 301 00:22:31,880 --> 00:22:35,920 Speaker 1: it comes to unions. We're just giving you the highlights 302 00:22:36,600 --> 00:22:40,520 Speaker 1: from a very Western perspective. There there is also a 303 00:22:40,640 --> 00:22:45,480 Speaker 1: dark side to this history because it turns out pretty 304 00:22:45,560 --> 00:22:51,040 Speaker 1: much from the beginning of the concept of unions centuries 305 00:22:51,040 --> 00:22:54,919 Speaker 1: and centuries ago, people in power have been trying to 306 00:22:55,119 --> 00:23:01,720 Speaker 1: abolish them. Why here's where it gets well, because if 307 00:23:01,760 --> 00:23:05,200 Speaker 1: there's a union, then I have to provide my cogs 308 00:23:05,320 --> 00:23:09,320 Speaker 1: with things that they want, like wages that are fit 309 00:23:09,720 --> 00:23:13,920 Speaker 1: to live within society as well, you know, as well 310 00:23:13,960 --> 00:23:16,960 Speaker 1: as healthcare perhaps benefits if you're in the United States 311 00:23:17,000 --> 00:23:20,720 Speaker 1: because you have to provide healthcare through a private insurance company, uh, 312 00:23:21,359 --> 00:23:25,880 Speaker 1: you know, or things like time off on a regular basis, 313 00:23:27,200 --> 00:23:31,040 Speaker 1: not working their hands with their bone. Um, it's it's unions. 314 00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:34,040 Speaker 1: I'm been opposed because it does kind of put a 315 00:23:34,119 --> 00:23:39,199 Speaker 1: hamper on theoretically your ability to make goods in a 316 00:23:39,280 --> 00:23:43,280 Speaker 1: profit at a pace that perhaps you would wish as 317 00:23:43,320 --> 00:23:49,879 Speaker 1: an employer, which is well, I mean that you can 318 00:23:49,920 --> 00:23:55,280 Speaker 1: at least see that viewpoint right as from historically and 319 00:23:55,320 --> 00:23:59,160 Speaker 1: there that that is a feeling I think a thread 320 00:23:59,320 --> 00:24:03,240 Speaker 1: that that goes all throughout history and that continues on 321 00:24:03,280 --> 00:24:07,639 Speaker 1: today and and there is a deep desire I would say, 322 00:24:07,720 --> 00:24:12,879 Speaker 1: on behalf of a large organization's large corporations too, to 323 00:24:13,240 --> 00:24:17,920 Speaker 1: stop unionization from happening. Because of the fears of what 324 00:24:18,119 --> 00:24:21,320 Speaker 1: may happen to your company, to your profitability, to what 325 00:24:21,400 --> 00:24:23,840 Speaker 1: your shareholders will think about your company. If there is 326 00:24:23,880 --> 00:24:28,959 Speaker 1: a union within your organization, and it's it's really interesting 327 00:24:29,040 --> 00:24:32,560 Speaker 1: something that we found out. Uh. I mean, I would 328 00:24:32,560 --> 00:24:38,280 Speaker 1: say a bit firsthand recently, forming a union from within 329 00:24:38,359 --> 00:24:44,360 Speaker 1: a company is in itself, necessarily I think, a bit 330 00:24:44,400 --> 00:24:49,560 Speaker 1: of a conspiracy. Yeah, yeah, you're agree. You can say 331 00:24:49,600 --> 00:24:54,920 Speaker 1: that unions function in their nascent days as a conspiracy 332 00:24:54,920 --> 00:24:59,439 Speaker 1: of sorts, and it's it's a conspiracy by necessity at times, 333 00:25:00,160 --> 00:25:03,800 Speaker 1: you know, if there are well, talk in a second 334 00:25:03,840 --> 00:25:08,679 Speaker 1: about how bad to get, but it's not people necessarily 335 00:25:08,760 --> 00:25:12,840 Speaker 1: being extra. It's not people who just have a love 336 00:25:12,920 --> 00:25:16,600 Speaker 1: of subterfuge or something like that. They are trying to 337 00:25:17,720 --> 00:25:23,760 Speaker 1: avoid retaliation at times, retaliation that includes murder. This is 338 00:25:23,800 --> 00:25:28,040 Speaker 1: a real thing that happened. Uh. The on the other 339 00:25:28,080 --> 00:25:30,720 Speaker 1: side of this, I like that we're looking at at 340 00:25:30,840 --> 00:25:34,080 Speaker 1: multiple angles here. On the other side of this, you 341 00:25:34,119 --> 00:25:39,480 Speaker 1: can also absolutely say that anti union activities union busting 342 00:25:40,080 --> 00:25:44,400 Speaker 1: falls into the realm of conspiracy. Like union union busting. 343 00:25:44,480 --> 00:25:48,840 Speaker 1: All right, there's a ton of consulting agencies who don't 344 00:25:48,960 --> 00:25:52,480 Speaker 1: like when we use that phrase. Just like, there's a 345 00:25:52,520 --> 00:25:56,360 Speaker 1: ton of crooked, crooked people out there who don't like 346 00:25:57,160 --> 00:26:01,520 Speaker 1: being called body brokers. There are companies that exist entire 347 00:26:01,640 --> 00:26:07,280 Speaker 1: now they call themselves like employee relationship consultancies or whatever. 348 00:26:07,680 --> 00:26:10,679 Speaker 1: If you're seeing this on YouTube, I'm doing a very 349 00:26:10,720 --> 00:26:14,840 Speaker 1: disrespectful kind of dance because I don't respect it what 350 00:26:14,920 --> 00:26:18,320 Speaker 1: they're doing. They don't like the term union busting, but 351 00:26:18,400 --> 00:26:23,240 Speaker 1: you'll hear that term a lot, and union busting collectively 352 00:26:23,480 --> 00:26:28,960 Speaker 1: describes a bunch of activities that are meant to either 353 00:26:29,960 --> 00:26:34,320 Speaker 1: um at the very least, disrupt an existing trade union 354 00:26:34,440 --> 00:26:39,560 Speaker 1: or labor union, or most often nowadays, to prevent them 355 00:26:39,680 --> 00:26:43,119 Speaker 1: from forming in the first place. And you have to 356 00:26:43,160 --> 00:26:47,040 Speaker 1: ask yourself, regardless of how you feel about a union 357 00:26:47,240 --> 00:26:52,600 Speaker 1: or the concept of it, why would these powerful entities 358 00:26:53,040 --> 00:26:56,439 Speaker 1: care so much? You know, where's the beef? Well, like 359 00:26:56,560 --> 00:26:59,800 Speaker 1: you said, Matt, it would increase cost for a company, 360 00:27:00,080 --> 00:27:03,880 Speaker 1: very likely, And it would increase the cost not just 361 00:27:04,359 --> 00:27:10,240 Speaker 1: by standardizing a wage or something, but by also guaranteeing 362 00:27:10,320 --> 00:27:15,679 Speaker 1: things like healthcare, vacation time, a weekend, which used to 363 00:27:15,680 --> 00:27:18,560 Speaker 1: be a hot take for any for anybody who's very 364 00:27:18,640 --> 00:27:23,640 Speaker 1: against the idea of unions, like I don't know what 365 00:27:23,800 --> 00:27:27,119 Speaker 1: propaganda side you fall on, if it's pro union or 366 00:27:27,160 --> 00:27:31,560 Speaker 1: anti union, if you're reading it on a Saturday or 367 00:27:31,640 --> 00:27:37,800 Speaker 1: a Sunday, you're reading it because the union stuff will 368 00:27:37,960 --> 00:27:42,720 Speaker 1: worked for a second. Uh, Like remember back when, back 369 00:27:42,760 --> 00:27:45,720 Speaker 1: when those British people we mentioned earlier, before the break, 370 00:27:45,960 --> 00:27:49,439 Speaker 1: when they came to those factory towns, they had zero rights, 371 00:27:49,760 --> 00:27:56,000 Speaker 1: no vacation or guarantee of wages. Obviously people were paid 372 00:27:56,040 --> 00:28:00,840 Speaker 1: according to their demographic rather than they're a bill city. Uh. 373 00:28:01,200 --> 00:28:03,399 Speaker 1: And they had no like guarantee that they would have 374 00:28:03,440 --> 00:28:07,400 Speaker 1: a job tomorrow. Is zip zilch, not a you get 375 00:28:07,480 --> 00:28:13,359 Speaker 1: nothing Lebowski. And there's there's this thing called the Combination laws, 376 00:28:14,480 --> 00:28:20,880 Speaker 1: And in eighteen twenty four Britain repealed those laws. This 377 00:28:21,000 --> 00:28:25,600 Speaker 1: meant that it was no longer illegal to have a 378 00:28:25,720 --> 00:28:29,920 Speaker 1: labor organization. Unions used to be such a big deal 379 00:28:30,240 --> 00:28:34,800 Speaker 1: that state powers banned them. It was it was like 380 00:28:35,720 --> 00:28:39,239 Speaker 1: selling meth or something. You know, it was treated with 381 00:28:39,360 --> 00:28:46,480 Speaker 1: that level of um tyranny. So once it's no longer illegal, 382 00:28:47,760 --> 00:28:51,160 Speaker 1: these groups of employees they posse up, they vultron up, 383 00:28:51,480 --> 00:28:55,080 Speaker 1: and they start things like the Friendly Society of Agricultural 384 00:28:55,320 --> 00:28:59,920 Speaker 1: Laborers spelled with a you in there right because it's 385 00:29:00,080 --> 00:29:05,720 Speaker 1: it's British. Uh. They this was two and these folks 386 00:29:05,840 --> 00:29:12,000 Speaker 1: mainly wanted to make sure that their wages stopped going down. 387 00:29:12,600 --> 00:29:15,560 Speaker 1: They weren't trying to make a bunch of money. They 388 00:29:15,560 --> 00:29:19,600 Speaker 1: were trying to make sure that they made something close 389 00:29:19,680 --> 00:29:24,040 Speaker 1: to the same amount of money each year. And any 390 00:29:24,120 --> 00:29:29,160 Speaker 1: employer they agreed this is price fixing. Basically, they agreed 391 00:29:29,200 --> 00:29:33,360 Speaker 1: that anybody who was going to hire a member of 392 00:29:33,400 --> 00:29:38,440 Speaker 1: the agriculture the Friendly Society of Agricultural Laborers, would need 393 00:29:38,520 --> 00:29:42,280 Speaker 1: to pay them a minimum wage. Now that is not 394 00:29:42,360 --> 00:29:47,040 Speaker 1: a hot take, but just two years after that, the 395 00:29:48,080 --> 00:29:52,440 Speaker 1: members of the landowning class complained, and they complained to 396 00:29:52,480 --> 00:29:56,240 Speaker 1: their friends who are in power, and the leaders of 397 00:29:56,280 --> 00:30:01,080 Speaker 1: that movement, leaders of that organization were arrested, they were charged, 398 00:30:01,480 --> 00:30:06,080 Speaker 1: and they were convicted. I'm laughing because this is a 399 00:30:06,160 --> 00:30:11,320 Speaker 1: silly law. They were convicted not of organizing labor. They 400 00:30:11,320 --> 00:30:16,920 Speaker 1: were convicted of Get this match the swearing of secret oaths. 401 00:30:19,760 --> 00:30:25,960 Speaker 1: That sounds a lot like the anti Freemason movement that came. 402 00:30:26,560 --> 00:30:29,440 Speaker 1: I want to say after maybe that's around the same 403 00:30:29,440 --> 00:30:34,400 Speaker 1: time the anti Mason movement. You can't that's that's a 404 00:30:36,080 --> 00:30:39,760 Speaker 1: multiple nations in Europe had that idea, like one cannot 405 00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:43,680 Speaker 1: be a member of a secret society, but the swearing 406 00:30:43,760 --> 00:30:50,160 Speaker 1: of secret oaths. I get where they're going, but they're 407 00:30:50,200 --> 00:30:52,960 Speaker 1: better ways to write that, I think. So anyway, these 408 00:30:52,960 --> 00:30:55,680 Speaker 1: guys they don't get killed. They're sentenced to a very 409 00:30:55,720 --> 00:31:01,000 Speaker 1: specific kind of punishment at that time, transportation, which meant 410 00:31:01,080 --> 00:31:04,560 Speaker 1: they were sent to the continent of Australia and they 411 00:31:04,560 --> 00:31:07,000 Speaker 1: were going to be sent there for seven years. But 412 00:31:07,120 --> 00:31:12,360 Speaker 1: there's this huge grassroots public backlash and they eventually are released. 413 00:31:12,920 --> 00:31:15,800 Speaker 1: But we say all this, yeah, we see all this 414 00:31:15,880 --> 00:31:21,640 Speaker 1: to point out the odds were originally retty stacked against 415 00:31:21,640 --> 00:31:25,680 Speaker 1: the concept of unions because again, as as you said, 416 00:31:26,040 --> 00:31:30,760 Speaker 1: it doesn't make sense from the perspective of the people 417 00:31:30,800 --> 00:31:33,600 Speaker 1: at the top. Absolutely, I know it's just an a 418 00:31:33,680 --> 00:31:36,080 Speaker 1: side guys, But just to throw it in, we're talking 419 00:31:36,120 --> 00:31:40,000 Speaker 1: about eighteen thirty four when the Friendly Society of Agricultural 420 00:31:40,080 --> 00:31:44,800 Speaker 1: Laborers got shipped off to Australia. The Anti Masonic Party 421 00:31:44,840 --> 00:31:48,880 Speaker 1: within the United States formed in eighteen eight so just 422 00:31:49,000 --> 00:31:53,000 Speaker 1: a little bit before that, and um just for that 423 00:31:53,120 --> 00:31:56,440 Speaker 1: history and only functioned until eighteen forty and then it 424 00:31:56,640 --> 00:31:59,040 Speaker 1: came back and had like a second run. But just 425 00:31:59,200 --> 00:32:03,080 Speaker 1: it's interesting that there was an anti secret oaths trend 426 00:32:03,080 --> 00:32:08,080 Speaker 1: going on. So let's talk about let's talk about some 427 00:32:08,120 --> 00:32:12,320 Speaker 1: of this stuff. Uh, let's talk about strikes. So a strike, 428 00:32:12,480 --> 00:32:15,400 Speaker 1: you've heard of this. A strike is when a group 429 00:32:15,480 --> 00:32:21,840 Speaker 1: of workers stops working and they're protesting maybe unsafe working 430 00:32:21,920 --> 00:32:28,640 Speaker 1: conditions or they're using it as of flex during negotiations 431 00:32:28,680 --> 00:32:36,320 Speaker 1: between a union and management. Today, strikes are largely, at 432 00:32:36,360 --> 00:32:40,560 Speaker 1: least in the US, they're largely peaceful events. This was 433 00:32:40,840 --> 00:32:43,840 Speaker 1: very much not the case back in the day. If 434 00:32:43,920 --> 00:32:47,560 Speaker 1: you look back through let's say the eighteen hundreds, you 435 00:32:47,600 --> 00:32:56,320 Speaker 1: will see that numerous strikes were put down hard hired militia, police, 436 00:32:57,160 --> 00:33:05,160 Speaker 1: actual US government troops reigned fire on on people who 437 00:33:05,200 --> 00:33:08,200 Speaker 1: were just like, again, these are not you know, these 438 00:33:08,240 --> 00:33:11,240 Speaker 1: are not bad faith actors. These are people who are 439 00:33:11,320 --> 00:33:15,040 Speaker 1: saying stuff like, hey, please spend a couple of bucks 440 00:33:15,080 --> 00:33:18,720 Speaker 1: to make the uh, the lumber mill less dangerous. I 441 00:33:18,720 --> 00:33:21,000 Speaker 1: would like to have both of my hands at the 442 00:33:21,120 --> 00:33:24,480 Speaker 1: end of the day. And then multiple forces were like, no, 443 00:33:24,680 --> 00:33:28,960 Speaker 1: we're gonna shoot you. That's what happened. And I would 444 00:33:29,000 --> 00:33:32,240 Speaker 1: say the one of The major thrust of this episode 445 00:33:32,280 --> 00:33:36,600 Speaker 1: is to talk about this and the groups that physically 446 00:33:36,720 --> 00:33:40,960 Speaker 1: pushed back and fought human beings that were attempting to 447 00:33:41,080 --> 00:33:45,960 Speaker 1: strike for all the things we've mentioned, better wages and everything. Um, 448 00:33:46,000 --> 00:33:50,600 Speaker 1: there's a group ben I believe they're called the Pinkerton's 449 00:33:50,880 --> 00:34:00,640 Speaker 1: or is it the Pinkerton Detective Detective Agency was? Yeah, ah, 450 00:34:00,680 --> 00:34:08,720 Speaker 1: these guys ak Matt Frederick's favorites. Yeah, as I stayed 451 00:34:08,719 --> 00:34:13,760 Speaker 1: in clearly previously in the episode. You now they're they're 452 00:34:13,800 --> 00:34:18,000 Speaker 1: they're they're pretty horrified. These the Pinkerton Detective Agency is. 453 00:34:18,040 --> 00:34:21,440 Speaker 1: They're the guys who would go in and intimidate striking workers, 454 00:34:21,840 --> 00:34:26,800 Speaker 1: would uh escort people who were not striking but needed 455 00:34:26,840 --> 00:34:32,120 Speaker 1: to like move through a big crowd of strikers, especially scabs, right, 456 00:34:32,200 --> 00:34:34,799 Speaker 1: or the idea of other workers who were hired to 457 00:34:34,880 --> 00:34:40,640 Speaker 1: replace striking workers at least temporarily, all kinds of stuff. Yeah, yeah, 458 00:34:40,719 --> 00:34:45,640 Speaker 1: the Pinkerton's story is worthy of its own episode. It 459 00:34:45,960 --> 00:34:51,080 Speaker 1: is at its origin, it's um kind of an American 460 00:34:51,239 --> 00:34:55,160 Speaker 1: success story because we're talking the guy who started at 461 00:34:55,200 --> 00:35:00,759 Speaker 1: Pinkerton himself Scottish immigrant, very good at detective work. And 462 00:35:00,800 --> 00:35:04,319 Speaker 1: then it just sort of went off the rails. We'll 463 00:35:04,320 --> 00:35:07,960 Speaker 1: talk more about Pinkerton's in the second part of this 464 00:35:08,000 --> 00:35:11,880 Speaker 1: week's episode, but for now, we want to give you 465 00:35:11,920 --> 00:35:16,399 Speaker 1: a sense of how how strikes worked um and and 466 00:35:16,480 --> 00:35:20,240 Speaker 1: what happens when they go wrong. So on May one, 467 00:35:21,680 --> 00:35:27,400 Speaker 1: there was a nationwide strike leading to something called the 468 00:35:27,520 --> 00:35:32,680 Speaker 1: Haymarket Riot. This remains one of the most infamous and 469 00:35:33,040 --> 00:35:37,799 Speaker 1: tragic events of this story. Here's what they were striking for, 470 00:35:38,000 --> 00:35:41,680 Speaker 1: by the way, an eight hour work day. That's it. 471 00:35:42,200 --> 00:35:45,440 Speaker 1: They wanted at nine to five. That's all they wanted, 472 00:35:46,080 --> 00:35:53,399 Speaker 1: and something many of us love, slash, enjoy, slash, get 473 00:35:53,480 --> 00:35:58,399 Speaker 1: to have right right, Yes, I like the slashes there. 474 00:35:58,880 --> 00:36:04,200 Speaker 1: Uh so there was is after this strike. So three 475 00:36:04,480 --> 00:36:07,360 Speaker 1: we said May first, So three days later there's a 476 00:36:07,480 --> 00:36:13,279 Speaker 1: rally in a place in Chicago, Haymarket, and this rally 477 00:36:13,320 --> 00:36:20,920 Speaker 1: is protesting the laws, crackdown, violent crackdown to a strike 478 00:36:21,239 --> 00:36:26,239 Speaker 1: by employees at a place called McCormick Reaper Works, not 479 00:36:26,400 --> 00:36:30,400 Speaker 1: related to our good friend Joe McCormick of stuff to 480 00:36:30,400 --> 00:36:36,160 Speaker 1: play your mind or death themselves as in the Reapers. 481 00:36:37,520 --> 00:36:41,479 Speaker 1: It's a hay Market, guys. Yeah. And the thing about 482 00:36:41,520 --> 00:36:45,600 Speaker 1: this rally is the weather sucked that day, So there 483 00:36:45,640 --> 00:36:48,040 Speaker 1: weren't a ton of people. There weren't as many people 484 00:36:48,080 --> 00:36:51,520 Speaker 1: as they were hoping, right or the rallies organizers. There 485 00:36:51,520 --> 00:36:54,600 Speaker 1: were a few hundred police move in, they want to 486 00:36:54,600 --> 00:37:01,719 Speaker 1: disperse the crowd and someone, this person has lost to history. 487 00:37:01,960 --> 00:37:04,440 Speaker 1: We don't know whether it was a protester or an 488 00:37:04,440 --> 00:37:09,360 Speaker 1: agent provocateur, or whether this is a bill of goods 489 00:37:09,400 --> 00:37:14,200 Speaker 1: that you're sold in textbooks. Somebody threw a bomb and 490 00:37:14,280 --> 00:37:18,800 Speaker 1: it blew up in the mob, and then pandemonium strikes. 491 00:37:19,400 --> 00:37:24,080 Speaker 1: The police are firing guns. Um, it's likely that some 492 00:37:24,200 --> 00:37:29,280 Speaker 1: of the protesting workers at firearms. There's no official tally 493 00:37:29,760 --> 00:37:33,520 Speaker 1: even now in there's no official tally of how many 494 00:37:34,000 --> 00:37:39,200 Speaker 1: civilians died, but we know seven h seven police died 495 00:37:39,600 --> 00:37:43,640 Speaker 1: and sixty more were injured, and a lot of those 496 00:37:43,680 --> 00:37:48,239 Speaker 1: injuries for that sixty officers came from their fellow officers 497 00:37:48,440 --> 00:37:53,600 Speaker 1: friendly fire, you would call it. So anyway this happens, 498 00:37:53,880 --> 00:37:57,359 Speaker 1: it's crazy. You know, Chicago is super corrupt at this 499 00:37:57,440 --> 00:38:01,719 Speaker 1: time and maybe today, but even more corrupt back then. 500 00:38:02,080 --> 00:38:05,280 Speaker 1: And someone's like her rub for up for um, something 501 00:38:05,360 --> 00:38:10,400 Speaker 1: must be done, so they arrest a lot of protesters. 502 00:38:11,160 --> 00:38:15,520 Speaker 1: This is before cops were really arrested for doing crime. Uh. 503 00:38:15,920 --> 00:38:21,719 Speaker 1: They arrest folks who have ideologies like socialism or anarchists. Right. 504 00:38:22,360 --> 00:38:26,960 Speaker 1: Eight of them are charged and convicted for not swearing 505 00:38:27,040 --> 00:38:31,680 Speaker 1: secret oaths this time, but inflammatory speeches and publications that 506 00:38:32,080 --> 00:38:36,880 Speaker 1: allegedly caused the violence. This is a kangaroo court. There's 507 00:38:37,000 --> 00:38:40,320 Speaker 1: no there's no way to escape it. It's a kangaroo court. 508 00:38:40,840 --> 00:38:45,680 Speaker 1: And everybody who is outside of this, everybody who is 509 00:38:45,800 --> 00:38:50,960 Speaker 1: essentially not controlled by the people in power, are like, 510 00:38:51,080 --> 00:38:56,040 Speaker 1: they're saying, what gives. Four of those who are convicted 511 00:38:56,120 --> 00:39:04,520 Speaker 1: are hanged in One guy doesn't get hanged because he 512 00:39:04,680 --> 00:39:09,279 Speaker 1: kills himself by putting a stick of dynamite in his 513 00:39:09,480 --> 00:39:13,920 Speaker 1: own mouth while he's in prison, which makes you wonder, 514 00:39:14,320 --> 00:39:22,480 Speaker 1: you know, shades of Epstein. But on June there's this 515 00:39:22,520 --> 00:39:26,040 Speaker 1: guy's a new governor of Illinois. His name is John 516 00:39:26,160 --> 00:39:30,080 Speaker 1: p Altgeld, and he says, hey, the three of you 517 00:39:30,120 --> 00:39:33,520 Speaker 1: who are still alive, I'll give you a full pardon. 518 00:39:34,920 --> 00:39:42,360 Speaker 1: And this is the reason that may first became the 519 00:39:43,000 --> 00:39:50,000 Speaker 1: like international Celebration of Workers, because other labor leaders saw 520 00:39:50,080 --> 00:39:53,000 Speaker 1: this and they thought there was some light at the 521 00:39:53,120 --> 00:39:57,560 Speaker 1: end of the tunnel. Uh, but you you may be 522 00:39:57,680 --> 00:40:01,279 Speaker 1: asking yourself, what about Labor Day? Is this where Matt 523 00:40:01,320 --> 00:40:03,719 Speaker 1: and Ben talked about Labor Day, Well, it's called May 524 00:40:03,800 --> 00:40:06,920 Speaker 1: Day in some countries and throughout a lot of the world, 525 00:40:06,920 --> 00:40:10,759 Speaker 1: it's celebrated on May one. Here in the US, it 526 00:40:11,080 --> 00:40:16,759 Speaker 1: is I think it's the first Monday in September. And 527 00:40:17,000 --> 00:40:19,319 Speaker 1: uh that is like some stuff they don't want you 528 00:40:19,320 --> 00:40:22,319 Speaker 1: to know history about it. I don't know about you, 529 00:40:22,440 --> 00:40:25,880 Speaker 1: but growing up, whenever I heard Labor Day, I always 530 00:40:25,920 --> 00:40:29,239 Speaker 1: thought it was kind of paradoxical. You know, it's a 531 00:40:29,400 --> 00:40:34,759 Speaker 1: day off, but it's called Labor Day. A kid, you, Matt, 532 00:40:34,880 --> 00:40:37,200 Speaker 1: I used to think. I used to think it was 533 00:40:37,239 --> 00:40:40,719 Speaker 1: like a commemoration of what women have to go through 534 00:40:40,800 --> 00:40:45,359 Speaker 1: giving birth. Oh, like a target that you could aim for, like, oh, 535 00:40:45,400 --> 00:40:50,880 Speaker 1: we gotta hit Labor Day this year. Uh so let's 536 00:40:50,920 --> 00:41:02,160 Speaker 1: get started. It's you know, it's late December, early January. No, alright, So, um, yeah, 537 00:41:02,239 --> 00:41:04,359 Speaker 1: I don't know. I didn't know much about Labor Day 538 00:41:04,440 --> 00:41:07,000 Speaker 1: until I got to college, and so I wonder how 539 00:41:07,040 --> 00:41:10,399 Speaker 1: many people out there listening even knew that, um that 540 00:41:10,560 --> 00:41:13,440 Speaker 1: May Day exists. And then also, you know, Labor Day 541 00:41:13,520 --> 00:41:17,000 Speaker 1: within the United States and as it's celebrated in September. Ben, 542 00:41:17,040 --> 00:41:19,120 Speaker 1: I really want to look. I said it was one 543 00:41:19,120 --> 00:41:20,960 Speaker 1: of the most import parts of this episode. I may 544 00:41:21,000 --> 00:41:23,319 Speaker 1: have been a little wrong there, but I really want 545 00:41:23,360 --> 00:41:27,160 Speaker 1: to get back into the Pinkerton's. We do that. Yeah, 546 00:41:27,360 --> 00:41:30,000 Speaker 1: let's you know what, let's pause for a word from 547 00:41:30,040 --> 00:41:39,680 Speaker 1: our sponsors, and let's get back to some villains. And 548 00:41:39,760 --> 00:41:44,640 Speaker 1: we've returned. It is pretty obvious that union slash anti 549 00:41:44,840 --> 00:41:50,080 Speaker 1: union conflicts were way more blatantly violent back in the day. 550 00:41:50,600 --> 00:41:54,480 Speaker 1: We're talking about Robert Barrens. You know, we're talking about 551 00:41:54,520 --> 00:42:02,240 Speaker 1: decade aristocrats, uh nepotistic ne'er do wells, murderous bosses, crooked cops, 552 00:42:02,360 --> 00:42:05,120 Speaker 1: you name it. They're all there, all the hits, all 553 00:42:05,160 --> 00:42:10,440 Speaker 1: the good ones. And out of all of these rapscallions, 554 00:42:11,040 --> 00:42:16,320 Speaker 1: the most fascinating are probably the Pinkerton's, the Peakerton National 555 00:42:16,400 --> 00:42:19,439 Speaker 1: Detective Agency. Let's talk a little bit more about that. 556 00:42:20,320 --> 00:42:25,600 Speaker 1: So the Pinkerton's, they were founded as a private police 557 00:42:25,640 --> 00:42:29,320 Speaker 1: force in Chicago in eighteen fifty by a Scottish immigrant. 558 00:42:29,680 --> 00:42:33,600 Speaker 1: And this guy's story is is pretty interesting. The founder 559 00:42:35,000 --> 00:42:38,960 Speaker 1: was actually a Scottish immigrant who started off as a 560 00:42:39,000 --> 00:42:44,200 Speaker 1: barrel maker, but he was so good at catching local 561 00:42:44,360 --> 00:42:48,080 Speaker 1: ne'er do wells that eventually he stopped making and repairing 562 00:42:48,120 --> 00:42:53,359 Speaker 1: barrels and started, uh started making a difference in Chicago's 563 00:42:53,440 --> 00:42:59,520 Speaker 1: crime scene. Yeah, barrels can wait, we got crooks to catch. 564 00:43:00,560 --> 00:43:02,799 Speaker 1: That's kind of cool to kind of respect to that, 565 00:43:02,920 --> 00:43:06,880 Speaker 1: Like I feel like that's cool. It's just it's it 566 00:43:07,000 --> 00:43:10,160 Speaker 1: becomes a weapon, right, Any any police force, any law 567 00:43:10,239 --> 00:43:14,680 Speaker 1: enforcement agency, is a weapon against the whatever the thing 568 00:43:14,880 --> 00:43:18,440 Speaker 1: is that it's aimed at. And in this case, the Pinkerton's, 569 00:43:18,480 --> 00:43:21,880 Speaker 1: in my opinion, got aimed at the wrong thing. Agreed me, 570 00:43:22,080 --> 00:43:26,839 Speaker 1: Because there's one thing that you don't often here described 571 00:43:26,960 --> 00:43:30,400 Speaker 1: in a lot of media, but it's true. One of 572 00:43:30,440 --> 00:43:34,120 Speaker 1: the powers of the state really is just the monopoly 573 00:43:34,160 --> 00:43:39,000 Speaker 1: on violence, the monopoly on legal violence. And the Pinkerton's 574 00:43:39,360 --> 00:43:44,440 Speaker 1: were became something that blurred that line between private militia 575 00:43:44,480 --> 00:43:49,200 Speaker 1: and state power when they became the Pinkerton National Detective Agency. 576 00:43:49,239 --> 00:43:52,720 Speaker 1: When they went official, they first were focused on catching 577 00:43:53,040 --> 00:43:58,319 Speaker 1: street level crime, you know, thieves, burglars, but they got 578 00:43:58,360 --> 00:44:02,560 Speaker 1: a reputation for results, and powerful people started paying attention, 579 00:44:02,920 --> 00:44:07,319 Speaker 1: and so the Pinkerton's branched out. They diversified and they 580 00:44:07,360 --> 00:44:13,440 Speaker 1: became the bane of the labor movement. They were enthusiastic, ruthless, 581 00:44:13,920 --> 00:44:18,520 Speaker 1: vicious strike breakers, and they could break the law because 582 00:44:18,560 --> 00:44:22,600 Speaker 1: the people who made the laws were hiring them. It 583 00:44:22,680 --> 00:44:25,799 Speaker 1: feels like we experienced some of the same things, at 584 00:44:25,880 --> 00:44:29,680 Speaker 1: least in our lifetime. I think, Ben, it's it's really frustrating, 585 00:44:29,680 --> 00:44:33,239 Speaker 1: and you know, there's um it's depicted in fiction a 586 00:44:33,280 --> 00:44:37,520 Speaker 1: lot the Pinkerton's or or Pinkertons like organizations companies that 587 00:44:37,920 --> 00:44:42,120 Speaker 1: do this, the police force that's hired specifically to break strikes, 588 00:44:42,200 --> 00:44:44,480 Speaker 1: and the severity that you're I just don't want it 589 00:44:44,520 --> 00:44:47,680 Speaker 1: to be lost on people, the severity of the beatings 590 00:44:47,920 --> 00:44:51,880 Speaker 1: and the violence that was enacted by these guys. Yeah, 591 00:44:52,040 --> 00:44:55,840 Speaker 1: it bears further scrutiny because the story is often swept 592 00:44:55,920 --> 00:44:59,040 Speaker 1: under the rug, as is a lot of the story 593 00:44:59,239 --> 00:45:02,920 Speaker 1: of the La Aber movement in the United States. Whether 594 00:45:03,000 --> 00:45:06,279 Speaker 1: you love it or hate it, whatever your personal ideology is, 595 00:45:06,880 --> 00:45:10,000 Speaker 1: knowledge is power, and so we should all be very 596 00:45:10,040 --> 00:45:15,000 Speaker 1: aware of the moments when someone doesn't want you to 597 00:45:15,080 --> 00:45:17,839 Speaker 1: know about a thing. I mean, I I just accidentally 598 00:45:17,880 --> 00:45:21,080 Speaker 1: talked about the point of our show anyway. Yeah, how 599 00:45:21,160 --> 00:45:25,840 Speaker 1: ruthless are the Pinkerton's. Uh you could classify their actions 600 00:45:25,960 --> 00:45:30,399 Speaker 1: against strikers or the working class under something like by 601 00:45:30,480 --> 00:45:35,080 Speaker 1: any means necessary. Remember those anarchists we mentioned earlier in 602 00:45:35,080 --> 00:45:37,880 Speaker 1: the show, the ones who were arrested after the Haymarket 603 00:45:37,960 --> 00:45:40,719 Speaker 1: riot with zero proof. By the way, it was a 604 00:45:40,840 --> 00:45:44,799 Speaker 1: kangaroo court. The Pinkerton's sent those folks down the river, 605 00:45:45,040 --> 00:45:49,640 Speaker 1: and they even had a Pinkerton's operative perjur themselves go 606 00:45:49,760 --> 00:45:53,120 Speaker 1: to the sham trial and just make stuff up to 607 00:45:53,320 --> 00:45:57,040 Speaker 1: send these folks to their deaths to the gallows. And 608 00:45:57,120 --> 00:46:00,319 Speaker 1: that's only one example. There are multiple examples, so more 609 00:46:00,400 --> 00:46:04,480 Speaker 1: recent than you might think. Another example of Pinkerton's approach 610 00:46:04,560 --> 00:46:07,759 Speaker 1: to unions can be found in something called the eighteen 611 00:46:08,760 --> 00:46:14,680 Speaker 1: two Homestead Strike. It features our old pal Andrew Carnegie, 612 00:46:15,120 --> 00:46:18,640 Speaker 1: steel tycoon, but a person like anybody else. He has 613 00:46:18,680 --> 00:46:21,960 Speaker 1: good days, he has bad days. When this story takes place, 614 00:46:22,640 --> 00:46:25,759 Speaker 1: Andy is having just a bad week. It's having a 615 00:46:25,800 --> 00:46:30,000 Speaker 1: bad week, Matt. You know, he's worried about rich guy 616 00:46:30,160 --> 00:46:34,719 Speaker 1: problems because the employees at his steel mill over in Homestead, 617 00:46:34,760 --> 00:46:37,879 Speaker 1: Pennsylvania are also having a bad week. They've been having 618 00:46:37,880 --> 00:46:41,040 Speaker 1: a series of bad years they're fed up. You know, 619 00:46:41,080 --> 00:46:44,640 Speaker 1: there were labor discussions occurring at his steel mill between 620 00:46:44,680 --> 00:46:48,279 Speaker 1: I guess Carnegie and his representatives and the workers, and 621 00:46:50,080 --> 00:46:53,760 Speaker 1: he drapped it up a new contract that actually lowered 622 00:46:54,040 --> 00:46:58,480 Speaker 1: the workers wages UM and that didn't go well. Uh, 623 00:46:58,800 --> 00:47:04,160 Speaker 1: probably not a great idea. But again, as we've been 624 00:47:04,200 --> 00:47:08,200 Speaker 1: talking throughout these episodes, I don't know the real pressures 625 00:47:08,200 --> 00:47:10,839 Speaker 1: that Carnegie was under, or of that the steel mill 626 00:47:10,960 --> 00:47:15,600 Speaker 1: itself was under, or whatever. Those pressures were economic pressures 627 00:47:15,640 --> 00:47:18,920 Speaker 1: that made him believe the right move was to lower 628 00:47:18,960 --> 00:47:23,080 Speaker 1: wages to lower the production costs UM. But those are 629 00:47:23,160 --> 00:47:26,839 Speaker 1: human beings with families, and it was probably just not 630 00:47:26,920 --> 00:47:29,120 Speaker 1: the smartest move, but somebody had to test it out 631 00:47:29,160 --> 00:47:33,399 Speaker 1: throughout history. What if we lower the employees wages. Let's 632 00:47:33,440 --> 00:47:35,560 Speaker 1: just give it a go, you know what I mean, 633 00:47:35,800 --> 00:47:38,759 Speaker 1: Like like those people who are pick up artists and 634 00:47:38,800 --> 00:47:41,440 Speaker 1: just say the same terrible line to a hundred folks, 635 00:47:41,800 --> 00:47:44,960 Speaker 1: thinking it's not thee that are too smart to fall 636 00:47:45,080 --> 00:47:47,880 Speaker 1: for this, it's the one that this will work on. 637 00:47:48,520 --> 00:47:53,759 Speaker 1: So yes, Carnegie, Carnegie said, just shoots his shot, as 638 00:47:53,760 --> 00:47:57,160 Speaker 1: you would say in the parlance of our day, and surprise, surprise, 639 00:47:57,600 --> 00:48:00,680 Speaker 1: the employees refused to sign it because it is in 640 00:48:00,760 --> 00:48:03,719 Speaker 1: fact a much worse steal than what they had in 641 00:48:03,760 --> 00:48:06,600 Speaker 1: the beginning. You could almost say, and I'm sure many 642 00:48:06,680 --> 00:48:10,120 Speaker 1: members of the union thought this. Uh, you could almost 643 00:48:10,160 --> 00:48:15,080 Speaker 1: say that it was an offer made in retaliation for 644 00:48:15,280 --> 00:48:20,799 Speaker 1: the inconvenience of of asking for some basic considerations. So 645 00:48:20,880 --> 00:48:25,480 Speaker 1: Carnegie gets his boy, Henry Frick to come in come 646 00:48:25,480 --> 00:48:29,759 Speaker 1: into play. Henry Frick is the technical term here, a 647 00:48:29,920 --> 00:48:36,240 Speaker 1: real pill. He is a piece of work as a person, 648 00:48:36,760 --> 00:48:40,719 Speaker 1: and given his personality and his bedside manner, Uh, he 649 00:48:40,880 --> 00:48:44,440 Speaker 1: is what hr would call an area of opportunity, and 650 00:48:44,520 --> 00:48:48,200 Speaker 1: not as a compliment, but because in general is an 651 00:48:48,200 --> 00:48:51,320 Speaker 1: area of an opera of opportunity. As as a person, 652 00:48:51,800 --> 00:48:55,480 Speaker 1: he has the opportunity to be better. Uh. Here's how 653 00:48:55,520 --> 00:48:58,520 Speaker 1: he responds. He looks at the employees of this steel 654 00:48:58,600 --> 00:49:03,200 Speaker 1: mill and they're about three thousand, eight hundred of them, 655 00:49:03,239 --> 00:49:07,719 Speaker 1: and he says, okay, you're all fired. All of you 656 00:49:07,719 --> 00:49:12,400 Speaker 1: were fired. And furthermore, I'm bringing in the Pinkerton's. So 657 00:49:12,440 --> 00:49:15,040 Speaker 1: he gets the Pinkerton Agency, He gets three hundred of 658 00:49:15,080 --> 00:49:18,960 Speaker 1: their operatives who are armed by the way to occupy 659 00:49:19,200 --> 00:49:23,720 Speaker 1: the property. The former employees don't like this. Tensions are high. 660 00:49:24,040 --> 00:49:27,839 Speaker 1: This leads to a twelve hour gun battle. You thought 661 00:49:27,840 --> 00:49:33,200 Speaker 1: the Amazon stuff was acrimonious, folks, No, these people are 662 00:49:33,320 --> 00:49:36,440 Speaker 1: bringing heat and they're not doing it a posture. They 663 00:49:36,440 --> 00:49:41,560 Speaker 1: are firing live rounds at each other. Eventually, three Pinkerton's 664 00:49:41,600 --> 00:49:47,200 Speaker 1: go down. At least seven employees are murdered. The Pinkerton's 665 00:49:47,320 --> 00:49:51,399 Speaker 1: get the word to stand down, but the damage is done. 666 00:49:52,080 --> 00:49:57,400 Speaker 1: The strike ends up collapsing. And this guy, by by 667 00:49:57,440 --> 00:50:00,840 Speaker 1: the way, also Frick was taken at home. Dude. He 668 00:50:00,840 --> 00:50:05,719 Speaker 1: he was threatening to evict workers from their houses, not 669 00:50:05,880 --> 00:50:09,239 Speaker 1: just fire them. Yeah, think about what it would take 670 00:50:09,600 --> 00:50:12,800 Speaker 1: for you to show up to your job site wherever 671 00:50:12,800 --> 00:50:16,359 Speaker 1: it is that you work with, maybe with a gun, 672 00:50:16,400 --> 00:50:19,640 Speaker 1: maybe with a pipe, maybe with just yourself, but with 673 00:50:19,800 --> 00:50:23,320 Speaker 1: a willingness to go to battle to keep your job. 674 00:50:24,280 --> 00:50:26,279 Speaker 1: What would it take. Not only is that a lot 675 00:50:26,280 --> 00:50:29,280 Speaker 1: of fortitude, that's you can you can tell that people 676 00:50:29,360 --> 00:50:32,759 Speaker 1: needed that job. The individual of the three thousand, eight 677 00:50:32,840 --> 00:50:38,160 Speaker 1: hundred employees needed that job. And uh wow, I can't 678 00:50:38,160 --> 00:50:41,080 Speaker 1: believe it was a gun battle at their job site 679 00:50:41,120 --> 00:50:44,520 Speaker 1: to keep their job. That's just that blows my mind. Yeah, 680 00:50:44,600 --> 00:50:48,480 Speaker 1: and now we have to well, you know, I want 681 00:50:48,520 --> 00:50:53,920 Speaker 1: to say, in this case, it's clear that the Pinkerton's 682 00:50:54,000 --> 00:50:58,600 Speaker 1: and Carnegie and Frick, they were doing evil things right 683 00:50:58,640 --> 00:51:02,120 Speaker 1: there is all. You know, the old adage is true 684 00:51:02,600 --> 00:51:06,799 Speaker 1: when you talk about conflict, if you are in conflict 685 00:51:06,840 --> 00:51:10,760 Speaker 1: and active conflict, then you have already messed up because 686 00:51:11,320 --> 00:51:15,320 Speaker 1: you should be able to In most conflicts you should 687 00:51:15,320 --> 00:51:18,560 Speaker 1: be able to de escalate into some sort of negotiation. 688 00:51:19,160 --> 00:51:22,319 Speaker 1: But this, yeah, this is just again a couple of 689 00:51:22,360 --> 00:51:30,000 Speaker 1: cases of Pinkerton's doing some very villainous things. You can, however, 690 00:51:30,920 --> 00:51:34,799 Speaker 1: learn more about Pinkerton's. We're We're excited. I think they're 691 00:51:34,840 --> 00:51:38,160 Speaker 1: an episode all their own, if you you can go. 692 00:51:38,320 --> 00:51:42,160 Speaker 1: They're still around obviously, I think we established this before. 693 00:51:42,680 --> 00:51:48,759 Speaker 1: They're going by Pinkerton Comprehensive Risk Management. Uh. You can 694 00:51:48,920 --> 00:51:52,319 Speaker 1: hop on their website pinkerton dot com right now and 695 00:51:52,520 --> 00:51:58,080 Speaker 1: you'll see some very interesting things about the Pinkerton's stuff 696 00:51:58,080 --> 00:52:00,239 Speaker 1: that we may not get to in part two of 697 00:52:00,280 --> 00:52:02,880 Speaker 1: this episode, but we will definitely get to in a 698 00:52:02,960 --> 00:52:06,760 Speaker 1: third episode. Um, we're going to be examining the current 699 00:52:06,800 --> 00:52:10,400 Speaker 1: state of unions or collective bargaining as well as the 700 00:52:10,440 --> 00:52:14,719 Speaker 1: future of union busting. Conspiracies. Oh my gosh. I don't 701 00:52:14,719 --> 00:52:17,760 Speaker 1: want to spoil it, Matt, but it's it's really tough. 702 00:52:17,800 --> 00:52:20,440 Speaker 1: We're We're also going to, by the way, talk a 703 00:52:20,480 --> 00:52:26,080 Speaker 1: little bit about the imperfections of unions, because unions, being 704 00:52:26,320 --> 00:52:30,200 Speaker 1: organizations created by humans, have all the foibles of any 705 00:52:30,239 --> 00:52:36,600 Speaker 1: other human created organization, you know, like unions did work 706 00:52:36,680 --> 00:52:40,920 Speaker 1: actively to suppress some demographics in the past, you know, 707 00:52:41,000 --> 00:52:46,440 Speaker 1: and they have been um leveraged by organized crime, etcetera, etcetera. 708 00:52:46,520 --> 00:52:51,240 Speaker 1: But it goes so much deeper than the conspiracies of history. 709 00:52:51,640 --> 00:52:55,239 Speaker 1: There are active anti union conspiracies today. That's what I 710 00:52:55,239 --> 00:52:57,759 Speaker 1: would say. What do you think, Yeah, I mean, for sure, 711 00:52:58,280 --> 00:53:02,279 Speaker 1: there are active conspiracies against those who want to organize, uh, 712 00:53:03,000 --> 00:53:08,080 Speaker 1: for the purposes of more fair labor practices and you know, 713 00:53:08,320 --> 00:53:11,400 Speaker 1: payment and everything. Um. Sorry, Ben, I got stuck on 714 00:53:11,400 --> 00:53:15,560 Speaker 1: the Pinkerton website. Here I went on, I went under 715 00:53:16,480 --> 00:53:20,200 Speaker 1: our approach and then checked out our story and under 716 00:53:20,400 --> 00:53:24,799 Speaker 1: our under our story, Ben, the last thing it says 717 00:53:24,840 --> 00:53:29,600 Speaker 1: in that section is being a Pinkerton agent means we 718 00:53:29,719 --> 00:53:35,480 Speaker 1: are your trusted partner, because at Pinkerton we never sleep. 719 00:53:36,640 --> 00:53:40,759 Speaker 1: I know. I love it. Uh, It's it's true. It is. 720 00:53:40,880 --> 00:53:43,480 Speaker 1: It is true. I wouldn't say it's strong, brave, tender, 721 00:53:43,560 --> 00:53:45,960 Speaker 1: and true, but it is true that they don't sleep. 722 00:53:46,239 --> 00:53:48,400 Speaker 1: If you want to understand that reference, check out the 723 00:53:48,440 --> 00:53:50,640 Speaker 1: part of the website Matt's talking about. There's a neat 724 00:53:50,680 --> 00:53:54,800 Speaker 1: little video that is kind of propaganda that's fun to watch. 725 00:53:55,360 --> 00:53:58,520 Speaker 1: And and this is just a quick disclaimer here. We 726 00:53:58,600 --> 00:54:01,520 Speaker 1: have no idea what the Pinkerton Agency is actually like 727 00:54:01,719 --> 00:54:04,400 Speaker 1: right now to work there or to be whatever it 728 00:54:04,480 --> 00:54:08,160 Speaker 1: is that an agent is now. Uh, we're describing the 729 00:54:08,200 --> 00:54:12,359 Speaker 1: Pinkerton's back in the day in this episode. Yes, yes, 730 00:54:12,760 --> 00:54:15,760 Speaker 1: we're describing them back in the day. But we will 731 00:54:15,760 --> 00:54:19,359 Speaker 1: talk a little bit more about the modern day in 732 00:54:19,400 --> 00:54:23,520 Speaker 1: the future. In the meantime, we can't wait to hear 733 00:54:23,600 --> 00:54:27,359 Speaker 1: your opinions, fellow conspiracy realists, because you know, Matt and 734 00:54:27,480 --> 00:54:31,400 Speaker 1: Mission Control and I are well aware that unions have 735 00:54:31,640 --> 00:54:36,840 Speaker 1: become a highly divisive, highly politicized concept here in the US. 736 00:54:37,640 --> 00:54:42,120 Speaker 1: We are pretty sure that we know the reasons why, 737 00:54:42,560 --> 00:54:46,680 Speaker 1: some of which verge into the realm of propaganda conspiracy. 738 00:54:46,719 --> 00:54:52,160 Speaker 1: But but again, we want to provide a balanced look 739 00:54:52,200 --> 00:54:53,960 Speaker 1: at this. So now you know a little bit of 740 00:54:54,000 --> 00:54:58,560 Speaker 1: the history of labor movements from their roots in Europe 741 00:54:58,640 --> 00:55:02,120 Speaker 1: all the way up and now. And you know some 742 00:55:02,200 --> 00:55:06,560 Speaker 1: of the problems. But what about the future. That's the 743 00:55:06,640 --> 00:55:09,480 Speaker 1: question we're going to ask, So stay tuned and in 744 00:55:09,520 --> 00:55:12,400 Speaker 1: the meantime, we can't wait to hear from you. What 745 00:55:12,480 --> 00:55:15,400 Speaker 1: do you think? Do you think unions are divisive? Do 746 00:55:15,480 --> 00:55:19,560 Speaker 1: you have your own personal war stories or anecdotes or 747 00:55:19,600 --> 00:55:26,040 Speaker 1: experiences with labor organizations? And if so, uh, what do 748 00:55:26,120 --> 00:55:30,360 Speaker 1: you wish your fellow conspiracy realists knew about them? For 749 00:55:30,480 --> 00:55:33,480 Speaker 1: the good or for the ill? Uh? We can't wait 750 00:55:33,520 --> 00:55:36,440 Speaker 1: to share those stories. We try to be easy to 751 00:55:36,560 --> 00:55:41,040 Speaker 1: find online. Yes, just search for conspiracy Stuff or Conspiracy 752 00:55:41,040 --> 00:55:44,640 Speaker 1: Stuff Show and whichever app you use on Twitter, Facebook, 753 00:55:44,640 --> 00:55:48,439 Speaker 1: and YouTube. We are conspiracy Stuff on Instagram Conspiracy Stuff Show. 754 00:55:49,120 --> 00:55:50,799 Speaker 1: We would love to hear from you, so please reach 755 00:55:50,800 --> 00:55:53,640 Speaker 1: out in those ways if you'd like. If not, you 756 00:55:53,680 --> 00:55:56,560 Speaker 1: can use your mouth and your phone to give us 757 00:55:56,560 --> 00:56:01,200 Speaker 1: a call and leave a voicemail. That's correct one Pinkerton 758 00:56:01,360 --> 00:56:04,520 Speaker 1: No I'm kidding. It is a free number to call. 759 00:56:04,640 --> 00:56:08,080 Speaker 1: That is one eight three three st d w y 760 00:56:08,200 --> 00:56:11,640 Speaker 1: t K. You will hear a familiar voice letting you 761 00:56:11,680 --> 00:56:14,280 Speaker 1: know you're in the right place you left three minutes. 762 00:56:14,440 --> 00:56:18,560 Speaker 1: Those three minutes are yours. Go nuts, go ham on it, 763 00:56:18,560 --> 00:56:23,239 Speaker 1: get weird, give yourself a cool nickname or moniker. Let 764 00:56:23,320 --> 00:56:26,239 Speaker 1: us know whether we can use your name and or 765 00:56:26,400 --> 00:56:28,520 Speaker 1: voice on the air. Tell us what's on your mind. 766 00:56:28,600 --> 00:56:32,759 Speaker 1: Tell your fellow listens what's on your mind. And most importantly, 767 00:56:33,800 --> 00:56:37,399 Speaker 1: don't feel like you have to edit yourself. That goes 768 00:56:37,440 --> 00:56:40,200 Speaker 1: against the mission of this show. It's antithetical to us. 769 00:56:40,800 --> 00:56:44,000 Speaker 1: It's anathema and just taking out the A words here 770 00:56:44,040 --> 00:56:47,600 Speaker 1: matt uh. Instead, if you have some links you want 771 00:56:47,640 --> 00:56:51,040 Speaker 1: to provide, if you have some photographs you want to send, 772 00:56:52,680 --> 00:56:55,560 Speaker 1: if you want to usher us further into the rabbit hole, 773 00:56:55,840 --> 00:56:58,680 Speaker 1: let's keep the thunder here. If if it's if you 774 00:56:58,719 --> 00:57:01,879 Speaker 1: can hear it, it is becoming a dark, stormy night 775 00:57:02,040 --> 00:57:05,279 Speaker 1: here in our fair metropolis of Atlanta, Georgia, which means 776 00:57:05,360 --> 00:57:07,839 Speaker 1: it's time for us to sign off. It's time for 777 00:57:07,880 --> 00:57:10,520 Speaker 1: you to sign on. Do check out our book coming 778 00:57:10,520 --> 00:57:13,560 Speaker 1: out in October. And if you want to help us 779 00:57:14,160 --> 00:57:18,360 Speaker 1: find the new rabbit holes and to help us figure 780 00:57:18,400 --> 00:57:21,960 Speaker 1: out more stuff they don't want you to know, then 781 00:57:22,000 --> 00:57:23,720 Speaker 1: all you have to do is shoot us a good 782 00:57:23,720 --> 00:57:26,480 Speaker 1: old fashioned email. We'd love to hear from you. We 783 00:57:26,560 --> 00:57:49,160 Speaker 1: are conspiracy at i heeart radio dot com. Stuff they 784 00:57:49,200 --> 00:57:51,080 Speaker 1: Don't want you to know is a production of I 785 00:57:51,240 --> 00:57:54,320 Speaker 1: heart Radio. For more podcasts from my heart Radio, visit 786 00:57:54,360 --> 00:57:57,120 Speaker 1: the i heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you 787 00:57:57,160 --> 00:57:58,320 Speaker 1: listen to your favorite shows.