Speaker 1: This is the Patriots Catch twenty two podcasts with Evan
Speaker 1: Lazar and Alex Barth.
Speaker 2: And Lazar.
Speaker 1: Hello, everybody nailed it, Joined as always by our Bara.
Speaker 1: Here is Evan Lazar and Alex bar Okay, so let's
Speaker 1: do early day three and late day so you can
Speaker 1: get to that. Ted Johnson is I still believe. I
Speaker 1: will not quit Tesz Johnson. I will not quit.
Speaker 3: Right there, I will not quit.
Speaker 1: I won't quit test Johnson like I'm gonna's strategy. I'm
Speaker 1: gonna go down with the ship with Ted Johnson. I'm
Speaker 1: not wrong until I'm wrong, right. Isn't that one of
Speaker 1: your your shows like that, that's one of your your
Speaker 1: staples committed.
Speaker 3: That's big vulgar thing. R Waiver on Michael Pennox last
Speaker 3: year and read me the Riot Act.
Speaker 1: But until you're wrong, you're not wrong. That's a big take.
Speaker 1: I know Felger sometimes has, so I'm just saying I'm
Speaker 1: not wrong yet. On tedes Johnson, he could be really
Speaker 1: good in the NFL. We don't know yet. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: that's the case with all these guys, I suppose. But hello, everybody,
Speaker 1: welcome in Patriots Catch twenty two, eight days, eight days,
Speaker 1: ago till the NFL. Who's counting, Alex, I am counting
Speaker 1: at this point, Let's get there, let's get the picks made,
Speaker 1: and let's figure out who's going to be Patriots out
Speaker 1: of this class. But eight days to go to the draft.
Speaker 1: It's very exciting time with the draft. I feel like
Speaker 1: all the hay is almost there. We're almost in the
Speaker 1: barn at this point, I would say, and we get
Speaker 1: to the point now where we just are in the
Speaker 1: middle of reading body languages at press conferences and lying
Speaker 1: season and all that kind of stuff.
Speaker 3: So well, as Mike Rabel said yesterday, like he talked about,
Speaker 3: they're going through their running simulations to figure out what
Speaker 3: they're gonna do.
Speaker 1: They refuse to call them mock drafts, even though that's
Speaker 1: exactly what they are.
Speaker 3: Well, I think they're I think they're a little more involved.
Speaker 3: They're not they're not putting the PF. Maybe they are
Speaker 3: putting the PFL, but like you know, setting up certain trades.
Speaker 3: But I mean, we we used to on our old show,
Speaker 3: we used to do that exercise all the time, and
Speaker 3: please this is ridiculous. Yeah, well we're now we're not
Speaker 3: doing it to the same extent. They are, but it's
Speaker 3: a it's a good sparing.
Speaker 1: Ourselves to the actual in GMS. Okay, but I do
Speaker 1: love how every single GM gets up there and says, yeah,
Speaker 1: we're we're running simulations. And I was like, you can
Speaker 1: just say that you're doing mock drafts like that, that's
Speaker 1: what simulations, that's what.
Speaker 3: You're doing simulation. If they're not gonna call them mock drafts,
Speaker 3: maybe all start calling my mock draft simulation. Yes, paytris
Speaker 3: to the simulation three point Patriots draft simulation.
Speaker 1: There you go. Now we're now, we're in the business.
Speaker 1: We're in the know. Anyways, before we get rolling here,
Speaker 1: support the home team. Join New England's events staff here
Speaker 1: at Jilted Stadium. Seasonal positions available in food and beverage, parking, insecurity.
Speaker 1: Visit www dot thecraft group dot com, slash careers and
Speaker 1: apply today. Alex, you were a vendor at one point,
Speaker 1: weren't you.
Speaker 3: I was in high school as a hawker.
Speaker 1: You were a hawker here? That was my first explain
Speaker 1: what that means. I don't know the hawkers.
Speaker 3: Are you see him out there? The guys in yellow
Speaker 3: shirts that are so I didn't work in one of
Speaker 3: the concession stands. I would have the bag of pizza
Speaker 3: or water or whatever. I didn't sell beer. I wasn't
Speaker 3: old enough when I worked here to sell beer, but
Speaker 3: the bag of whatever over the shoulder. Get pizza here.
Speaker 3: It wants pizza. And it was games concerts. That was
Speaker 3: the first of three times I worked for.
Speaker 1: That's a that's incredible. That's a that's a great story,
Speaker 1: you know. That's that's right up there with mister Kraft
Speaker 1: being on the bleachers at the old Page Well, uh Sullivan,
Speaker 1: you know whatever? What was it called again, shaffer Staium?
Speaker 2: That was?
Speaker 3: That was my first Patriots game that I went to.
Speaker 3: I worked as a hawker. Was what season did they
Speaker 3: open it would have been I think it was twenty ten.
Speaker 3: Did they open against the Bengals? It was an opener
Speaker 3: against the Bengals. That was my first game and I
Speaker 3: was working.
Speaker 1: That's fascinating. Were you ever on the on the bleachers
Speaker 1: at the old Foxborough Stadium? Did you get to a
Speaker 1: game before they.
Speaker 3: Got for a Patriots game?
Speaker 1: Okay?
Speaker 3: I went for revs. Game and I think like maybe
Speaker 3: why I was younger, maybe one or two other events,
Speaker 3: but not a Patriots game.
Speaker 1: Okay, So I My very first game was at the
Speaker 1: old Foxborough Stadium. It was a night game. I can't
Speaker 1: tell you if it was Sunday or Monday night or whatever,
Speaker 1: but it's a night game in the pouring rain against
Speaker 1: I believe Aaron Brooks's New Orleans.
Speaker 3: There you go, that's a poll.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it was pouring and I remember, you know,
Speaker 1: I couldn't have been more excited. I didn't care at
Speaker 1: the time, but my parents were very worried about about
Speaker 1: the weather and about you know, me getting soaked at
Speaker 1: you know, at four or five years old. But it
Speaker 1: was a good time. Anyways, enough down memory lane, let's
Speaker 1: get in.
Speaker 3: Hang on. I found the game. It was against the Bengals.
Speaker 3: I was right, twenty ten against the Bengals. Patriots won
Speaker 3: thirty eight twenty four. I just want to see how
Speaker 3: Brady did. Brady was twenty five to thirty five, two
Speaker 3: fifty eight, three touchdowns, no picks. Ho hum, oh yeah, exactly.
Speaker 3: Home Wes Welker caught a couple of touchdowns. Good day.
Speaker 1: I know that there's there's some helmet news today that
Speaker 1: is I didn't even think we're gonna get in Tom
Speaker 1: Brady adjacent.
Speaker 3: Wait, hang on, Carson Palmer. That came thirty four of
Speaker 3: fifty three hundred and forty five yards.
Speaker 1: Two touchdowns, fifty attempts.
Speaker 3: It was a duel. There was some helmet news.
Speaker 1: There's some helmet news, but there Today is also the
Speaker 1: twenty fifth anniversary of the day the Patriots drafted Tom Brady.
Speaker 3: Thought there was yesterday.
Speaker 1: I think it's today in the in the sixth round.
Speaker 1: But regardless of it is today or yesterday, Oh.
Speaker 3: To day, because it's Belichick's birthday twenty.
Speaker 1: Five years ago.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so, and it's also Bill belichicks o old man.
Speaker 1: So happy birthday to the coach.
Speaker 3: Birthday to Bill.
Speaker 1: There all that and all the pleasantries are out of there.
Speaker 3: We we got a little installed generally.
Speaker 1: Let's get into the pre draft press conference yesterday. Both
Speaker 1: of us were there with Mike Rabel at the podium,
Speaker 1: and that was a pros pro press conference. He to me,
Speaker 1: I know that everybody wants to read into everything and
Speaker 1: read between the lines and look at body language. I
Speaker 1: know is his left tackle answer. There's a lot of
Speaker 1: body language doctors out there that are trying to decipher
Speaker 1: what exactly his mood was towards the tackles. The way
Speaker 1: I read it was that that was a pros pros
Speaker 1: press conference. He gave nothing away a lot of words.
Speaker 3: Well so nothing I would push back on. He gave
Speaker 3: nothing away, very little. I think we learned a lot
Speaker 3: about his big picture draft philosophy, and some of that
Speaker 3: might just be because it's the first year we're covering
Speaker 3: him doing a draft. And yeah, there wasn't much to
Speaker 3: learn about Bill's draft loos fy at the end because
Speaker 3: there was twenty years of data to go through, but
Speaker 3: we didn't really get anything about this draft. These press
Speaker 3: comms is the last few years, whether it was Elliot
Speaker 3: wolfor Matt grow I remember walking out last year. I
Speaker 3: think I said this to you when I wrote it
Speaker 3: at the Times, you can go and find it. I
Speaker 3: came out of that saying they're going quarterback, receiver, tackle,
Speaker 3: those are the whatever, whoever it is, that's the order.
Speaker 3: Because Wolf he talked about the depth of the tackle
Speaker 3: class and said they liked the group they had. He
Speaker 3: kind of hyped up their receivers and like I remember,
Speaker 3: he kind of laid it out the year before. They
Speaker 3: talked about more in so many words, reliance on the
Speaker 3: combine and what did we get we got a very
Speaker 3: combine based draft. Yeah, so the last two years. This
Speaker 3: press conference was very indicative, very telling. I felt like
Speaker 3: we got quite a few answers to the test coming
Speaker 3: away from that, I don't know that I again, I
Speaker 3: think I have a better understanding of the way Rabel
Speaker 3: viewsed roster building as a whole. But there's not much
Speaker 3: and some of it is the way this draft is structured.
Speaker 3: There's not much that applies to this specific draft. The
Speaker 3: only thing I think that does. I don't know if
Speaker 3: you want to start here or start somewhere else. I
Speaker 3: want to jump the gun. But was his answer about
Speaker 3: like taking a risk on a player who's maybe not
Speaker 3: a personality fit if the guy's talented.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that that is kind of where I did want
Speaker 1: to start, because I thought that was the most important
Speaker 1: answer to come out of the press conference yesterday, because
Speaker 1: you know, just coupling this with all the buzz about
Speaker 1: Jalen Walker lately as it pertains to the Patriots at
Speaker 1: four overall, and you know, Jalen Walker just being that
Speaker 1: type of guy. You know, I've compared him in the past,
Speaker 1: both playing style, perspective and leadership to Dante high Tower,
Speaker 1: just like one of those guys that is going to
Speaker 1: be a captain, is going to be a leader, is
Speaker 1: going to ooze football and tangibles and character in your
Speaker 1: locker room. And I look at Rabel's answer yesterday where
Speaker 1: it was Mikey already who asked the initial question about,
Speaker 1: you know, basically drafting good guys, you know, football high
Speaker 1: football character players, and he said he kind of stopped
Speaker 1: him and was like, well, talent comes first, right, like
Speaker 1: they gotta be good at football. And then he also added,
Speaker 1: you know, just to get the direct quote, so I
Speaker 1: can I can quote him directly. We can't can't do
Speaker 1: what we want to do with just a bunch of
Speaker 1: good dudes. That's not going to get it done. So essentially,
Speaker 1: you know, I read at as him saying it's not
Speaker 1: enough just to be a good guy. He also had
Speaker 1: to be a good football player.
Speaker 3: So I interpreted that a little differently. I took that
Speaker 3: more about Abdul Carter. And there's been that's obviously in
Speaker 3: the news too, with Shuder meeting with the Giants again
Speaker 3: and all of that, but that the Bob McGinn report
Speaker 3: that you know, not the guy's not the there's just
Speaker 3: some questions about his work ethic. Basically, not that he's
Speaker 3: the worst person in the world, there's some questions about
Speaker 3: his work ethic and is that the kind of guy
Speaker 3: Vrabel's gonna want to bring in? And we talked about
Speaker 3: I think we talked about this last week. I talked
Speaker 3: about with Felger last week about this is part of
Speaker 3: the reason why you build a strong culture, and that
Speaker 3: was part of that question that it was she already
Speaker 3: right specifically mentioned Morgan Moses and said when you have
Speaker 3: guys like Morgan Moses and other leaders, does it help you?
Speaker 3: You know? And builded this for years, builded this for years,
Speaker 3: I would say more successes than failures. It wasn't all successes,
Speaker 3: but the majority were successes. But it's a lot easier
Speaker 3: to do that ten years into building the culture than
Speaker 3: year one when you're trying to establish it. But what
Speaker 3: I kind of interpreted that as from Vrabel was basically,
Speaker 3: you know, if a guy's good enough, he's good enough,
Speaker 3: and we'll make it work. And you don't want he
Speaker 3: talked about you know you're gonna meet with him. You
Speaker 3: don't want a guy that you think is irredeemable. But
Speaker 3: all right, if a guy's not Matthew Slater, he's not
Speaker 3: Devin mccordy, but he's a really in terms of leadership.
Speaker 3: Obviously those guys are good football players, but if they're
Speaker 3: not those guys in terms of how they operate in
Speaker 3: the locker room, but he's a really good football player.
Speaker 3: Will you need good football players first, and then you
Speaker 3: bring them in and you work on it from there.
Speaker 3: So there had been some questions about would the Patriots
Speaker 3: rule out abdul Carter because of some of those mental
Speaker 3: red flags. One, I think those are a little overblown,
Speaker 3: but for what they are, and this team has put
Speaker 3: culture at a premium throughout the offseason. I kind of
Speaker 3: took that Vrabel answer to mean, as long as they
Speaker 3: think he's within a realistic realm, which the stuff that's
Speaker 3: been reported I don't think is anything egregious. Yeah, it's
Speaker 3: maybe not what they want, but it's not egregious. I
Speaker 3: kind of took that to mean, like Abdul Carter, that
Speaker 3: stuff's not going to be disqualifying for him getting drafted
Speaker 3: by the Patriots.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I think I think we're saying the same thing, just
Speaker 1: through two different players. And the reason why I brought
Speaker 1: up Jalen Walker was one because I don't feel like
Speaker 1: we've necessarily totally unpacked Jalen Walker on the show as
Speaker 1: a potential Patriot, because I haven't felt until recently that
Speaker 1: he was really in this conversation, you know, I have him.
Speaker 1: I'll look it up in a second to be exactly,
Speaker 1: but I have him like eight or ninth on the
Speaker 1: board right now, in the top ten. Certainly a top
Speaker 1: ten player in this draft, but I don't necessarily see
Speaker 1: him as a top five talent in a class like this,
Speaker 1: even in a class like this, I should say. But
Speaker 1: there's been a lot of scuttle but and this is
Speaker 1: you know, mostly coming from the media obviously, that Jalen
Speaker 1: Walker's character and his intangibles and his lead ship would
Speaker 1: maybe push the Patriots to draft somebody like him, maybe
Speaker 1: even over someone like Abdul Carter. And the way that
Speaker 1: I took Vrabel's answer, just taking it at face value,
Speaker 1: is I think the football player comes first, like who
Speaker 1: what they are on film, and the talent of the
Speaker 1: player has to come first. And I like Jalen Walker
Speaker 1: as a player. I like the complete package that he
Speaker 1: brings to the table, as we've been talking about. But
Speaker 1: I have some reservations about picking him that high as
Speaker 1: a tweeter, Like he's really not a guy that's going
Speaker 1: to have a full time position. He's gonna be somebody
Speaker 1: like High Tower that first and second down you're gonna
Speaker 1: play him off the ball. Third down and obvious pass situations,
Speaker 1: he's gonna be rushing the passer, probably off the edge.
Speaker 1: You're gonna have to move him around. He's gonna have
Speaker 1: to be a chess piece on the defensive side of
Speaker 1: the ball. I don't think he's a natural fit at
Speaker 1: either spot in terms of full time usage off ball
Speaker 1: linebacker or at edge. He's also six and forty pounds
Speaker 1: to lay the edge with that length and with that
Speaker 1: size at you know, a seventy percent clip is probably
Speaker 1: going to be unrealistic.
Speaker 3: No, he's gonna be a primary linebacker, like High Tire's
Speaker 3: gonna be a primary linebacker. Even Bentley kind of and
Speaker 3: Bentley's obviously bigger, but John Bentley kind of did that
Speaker 3: a little bit. Yeah, I think you talk about the
Speaker 3: talent coming first to me, it's more And Vrabel talked
Speaker 3: a little bit about this yesterday. Was it you asked
Speaker 3: this about like what's the tiebreaker if the players are
Speaker 3: greated similarly, which is a great question for this draft specifically.
Speaker 1: Try to get him. I think he knew what I
Speaker 1: was going He knew he were going.
Speaker 3: For Yeah, but no, but he said some of the
Speaker 3: things we've said, right, Yeah, position is a tiebreak. I
Speaker 3: think he said that, right, Samium utility and premium position
Speaker 3: is a tiebreaker. Combine testing, combine testing is I think
Speaker 3: he didn't say it, But if I were to project
Speaker 3: or just how I would approach it if I was
Speaker 3: in that spot, and what does that matter? I don't know.
Speaker 3: I'm not there. I would think though, like personality, leadership approach,
Speaker 3: mental approach, I would think that applies as a tiebreaker
Speaker 3: as well. So I don't know that it's you know,
Speaker 3: Carter and Walker being the same player, like if they're close,
Speaker 3: if they have Carter and I'm just pulling numbers out
Speaker 3: of my ass here, Yeah, they have Carter graded as
Speaker 3: an eight point five, they have Walker graded as an
Speaker 3: eight point three. Are those leadership and tangible things? And
Speaker 3: the questions about Carter's work ethic are those worth point
Speaker 3: two right or point three? Does that put car? I
Speaker 3: think that's more the conversation rather than like, well, they're
Speaker 3: graded the same in Walker as I think it's about
Speaker 3: does that how they view that couldn't be enough to
Speaker 3: close the gap between the two.
Speaker 1: Players, right, And just my opinion, like just going from
Speaker 1: predictive mode to just my take on the players. I
Speaker 1: don't think that those two players are particularly.
Speaker 3: I don't think they're that close either. But if they
Speaker 3: have them, are they close in the Patriot's eyes because
Speaker 3: the leadership makes them close or are they close on
Speaker 3: tape and then the leadership comes in and puts Walker
Speaker 3: over the top.
Speaker 1: Because I just feel like, and it's not I hate
Speaker 1: that if the draft discourse makes us do this, like
Speaker 1: it sounds like I'm dumping on Jalen Walker because I'm
Speaker 1: making an argument for Abdull Carter, But it's not the goal.
Speaker 1: I'm not trying to dump on him. But I think
Speaker 1: there's little things that are getting overlooked when we say, oh,
Speaker 1: these guys are kind of just comparable players. Abdull Carter
Speaker 1: is two inches taller and ten pounds heavier than Jalen
Speaker 1: Walker is. I would also just say that he's a
Speaker 1: lot more explosive and a lot more dynamic off the
Speaker 1: ball than Jalen Walker is. As a pass rusher like
Speaker 1: Abdull Carter has all the tools to be like a
Speaker 1: Von Miller Micah Parsons level pass rusher. Jalen Walker is
Speaker 1: going to have that in his back pocket that he's
Speaker 1: a decent on the line edge rusher, but he's a
Speaker 1: linebacker like He's truly an off the ball linebacker in
Speaker 1: terms of the position, I think he's gonna lock the
Speaker 1: most snaps at I would say it's probably gonna be
Speaker 1: at the second level in the box. Now, unlike High Taler,
Speaker 1: like High Tower had the side in the power and
Speaker 1: and just the overwhelming, you know, sledgehammer of play straight
Speaker 1: that off ball linebacker Walker has closing speed like Walker
Speaker 1: is a very good open field bursty, closing speed type
Speaker 1: of player that he can chase down guys in the
Speaker 1: open field. I don't know if that was necessarily High
Speaker 1: Towers game, but when I watch you know, Walker playoff
Speaker 1: ball linebacker, I see a lot of the same, like
Speaker 1: compressing space, you know, plugging gaps, firing downhill at the
Speaker 1: line of scrimmage. You know, that's sort of his game,
Speaker 1: is just clogging the middle of the field. And then
Speaker 1: when you get into those pass rushing situations. You know,
Speaker 1: he can rush off the edge a little bit, he
Speaker 1: can rush over the guard or the center and use
Speaker 1: quickness on the inside. So similar type of players. But
Speaker 1: you know, Abdual Carter to me is in a different
Speaker 1: tier completely the Jalen Walker. So it would be disappointing
Speaker 1: to me a little bit if Jalen Walker was the
Speaker 1: pick at for I'm not saying it would be the
Speaker 1: worst pick in the world. We're not talking about, you know,
Speaker 1: a cold, strange level react from me here, but it
Speaker 1: would not be my pick like that would not be.
Speaker 3: Fav I've used this line a lot in the for
Speaker 3: this year's class, and I know it kind of sounds
Speaker 3: like a cop out, but I think it's fitting. It
Speaker 3: was my Mason Graham line for months. It still kind
Speaker 3: of is. Yeah, I think Carter would be I don't
Speaker 3: think Walker would be a bad pick. I don't think
Speaker 3: he's the best pick they could make. Yeah, he's not
Speaker 3: a bad pick. He's a good pick, but they would
Speaker 3: be leaving there there are better players of it. And
Speaker 3: some people may say, well, then that means he's a
Speaker 3: bad pick because they didn't make the best pick. I mean,
Speaker 3: there's what I mean by it is like there's ways
Speaker 3: you can justify it where there there is a path
Speaker 3: I think to Jalen Walker having a better career in
Speaker 3: New England than Abdull Carter would. There is a path
Speaker 3: to that. It's a much tougher path to get to, though,
Speaker 3: than the path to Carter's peak. It would path to
Speaker 3: Carter being better than want and it would have.
Speaker 1: To be like work ethic related, Like it would have
Speaker 1: to be work ethic football character related.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well that's why physical sales, that's why we're having
Speaker 1: the conversation.
Speaker 3: But like, yeah, that's so they can he can get there,
Speaker 3: they can the pick can be justified. Yeah, it's just
Speaker 3: going to be you need a lot to go right
Speaker 3: for that. Yeah. I mean you need a lot to
Speaker 3: go right for any draft pick to be to work out.
Speaker 3: It's not an easy process, but relatively speaking, there there's
Speaker 3: more projecting you're doing with Jalen Walker, and this would
Speaker 3: apply to other guys.
Speaker 1: Well. I wanted to kind of get to that because
Speaker 1: to me, I feel like this draft has turned into,
Speaker 1: you know a little bit Abdul Carter versus Jalen Walker,
Speaker 1: which again I don't think is particularly close, but that
Speaker 1: that's the conversations we're having.
Speaker 3: I think the real conversation to have is Carter and Walker.
Speaker 3: And what I mean by or sorry is is Campbell
Speaker 3: and Walker. Yeah, And what I mean by that is,
Speaker 3: I think if Carter's there, you take him. And I
Speaker 3: think if Carter's there, they will take them. So that's
Speaker 3: That's not a conversation in the sense that we can
Speaker 3: discuss the top three. But it's not we're not debating prospects.
Speaker 3: It's not a conversation relating to the PA. It's just
Speaker 3: wait and see if Carter's gone and Hunter's gone. Obviously
Speaker 3: putting that qualifier in there, I think Carter or Campbell
Speaker 3: and Walker is where you get. If I had a guess,
Speaker 3: it's just me guess. There's no inside information. If I
Speaker 3: had to guess, those are the top two players on
Speaker 3: their board, and I don't know which one would be
Speaker 3: one and two, but I would guess it's those two
Speaker 3: and then everybody else.
Speaker 1: So the other answers that he gave that people are
Speaker 1: dissecting a little bit here are are, obviously his response
Speaker 1: about left tackle and the fact that he sees starting
Speaker 1: caliber left tackle. Some people took that as him being
Speaker 1: a little bit lukewarm, you know, not coming out and
Speaker 1: saying this is the next Jonathan Ogden. I don't think
Speaker 1: he would say that even if there was another Jonathan
Speaker 1: Augda in this draft. But it did stand out to me.
Speaker 1: And this is something that I've tried to reiterate a
Speaker 1: little bit about this draft at tackle, because I think
Speaker 1: there's some concern that if they don't draft a tackle
Speaker 1: at four, then like last year, they're kind of gonna
Speaker 1: miss the boat on true star arding upside at left tackle.
Speaker 1: But he made it sound like he has a group
Speaker 1: that there's a group. Now it could be Campbell, Membu
Speaker 1: and maybe Calvin Banks end of group, right right. But
Speaker 1: I think we've talked a little bit about and I
Speaker 1: and I I see them as this, you know, the
Speaker 1: ariantisies U, the Josh Connerley's of the world. You know.
Speaker 1: I took that response and I don't want to do
Speaker 1: body language doctor, Like, if you think his body language
Speaker 1: was off on that answer and he's you know, out
Speaker 1: on the tackles, then that's your prerogative. I don't look
Speaker 1: that much into body language. I'm not a scientist in
Speaker 1: that respect.
Speaker 3: He kind of he just kind of is the same
Speaker 3: body language across question.
Speaker 1: Wouldn't look too much.
Speaker 3: Into that, just how he is when he's dealing with
Speaker 3: the media.
Speaker 1: But is there you know, I still think that it's
Speaker 1: very much in play that they draft who they feel
Speaker 1: is just the best player available at four, regardless of position,
Speaker 1: and come back up for a Josh Simmons and Arianisery
Speaker 1: and Josh Connery or maybe hope one of those guys
Speaker 1: foster them the thirty eight.
Speaker 3: Uh, I think that's possibility. Like to me, there's two
Speaker 3: ways to read that, and don't do you still transcript up?
Speaker 3: I can pull it up, but.
Speaker 1: No, but I can.
Speaker 3: I just I described that one the full answer. Look
Speaker 3: at two phones. Thles are over here, Okay, the full answer.
Speaker 3: He So he gets asked specifically, is there a tackle
Speaker 3: worth taking it for him?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 3: And he kind of rather than answering whether or not
Speaker 3: there's a tackle worth taking it for, he kind of
Speaker 3: gets into what he thinks a player worth the fourth
Speaker 3: overall pick is. Yeah, and he talks about a player
Speaker 3: in an impact position who can make an impact as
Speaker 3: a starter right away. And then he says, I think
Speaker 3: there are multiple starting tackles in the draft.
Speaker 1: All right, So I got it. So I think that
Speaker 1: that's really what you start to look for impact players
Speaker 1: when you start picking that high. What they're going to
Speaker 1: do for you, what's the impact, what's the position? You
Speaker 1: talk about premium positions. That's where you weigh saw the
Speaker 1: circumstances to be.
Speaker 3: He's not just talking the questions about tackles, but he's
Speaker 3: not just talking about tackles there. I think that's his
Speaker 3: philosophy for the fourth overall pick. And then he says,
Speaker 3: I think they're yes, I think they're starting tackles in
Speaker 3: this draft. Starting tackles in this draft doesn't mention four.
Speaker 3: So you can read that one of two ways. Is
Speaker 3: his qualifier for the fourth overall pick instant starter, in
Speaker 3: which case starting tackles in fourth overall pick tackles would
Speaker 3: mean the same thing. And we do know he talked
Speaker 3: highly about Campbell and armand Membu at the NFL Owners Meets.
Speaker 3: That's one way you can interpret it. The other way
Speaker 3: you can interpret it is we yeah, they're starting tackles
Speaker 3: in the draft. It doesn't just have to be at four,
Speaker 3: So you can go one way or the other. I
Speaker 3: kind of heard it as the former. Maybe that's me
Speaker 3: going in with some preset bias about what I want
Speaker 3: them to do. I'll admit that, but I'm with you
Speaker 3: if there are starting tackles past the fourth pick. There's
Speaker 3: not a lot We've talked about how fast this thing
Speaker 3: drops off after arianta Ursery. Does he get to thirty
Speaker 3: eight maybe, I really don't think Connorly's getting there now.
Speaker 3: If Simmons gets at thirty eight, it means his knee
Speaker 3: is bad, which I am. You guys know how I
Speaker 3: am on that. I'm very worried about that. I'm not
Speaker 3: against them not taking a tackle at four. They can't
Speaker 3: let it come to them though, like last year, because
Speaker 3: they will miss the run. I really think there's gonna
Speaker 3: be a run on tackles again this year. And I'll
Speaker 3: say I think there's gonna be a run on tackles
Speaker 3: next year. I think this is going to continue to
Speaker 3: happen until the tackle shortage is over, which is going
Speaker 3: to take a few years to get there. So I
Speaker 3: think they have to be ready to move up. They
Speaker 3: have the ammunition to do this, and on the tackles too.
Speaker 3: When we're talking about Simmons, it wasn't a tackle specific answer,
Speaker 3: but he was asked by Andrew Callahan what lessons he
Speaker 3: learned just from his top draft picks in Tennessee and
Speaker 3: wasn't asked about injuries, but he mentioned just kind of
Speaker 3: factoring in injuries when you look at a player, And
Speaker 3: so with Simmons, who has an injury that is tough
Speaker 3: to come back from, and there are long term not
Speaker 3: just short term implications. It's not just about when will
Speaker 3: he be healthy as a rookie, but will his knee
Speaker 3: hold up structurally in the long term or will it
Speaker 3: be long term to her ability issues because of this injury.
Speaker 3: That is something that they're going to consider. Caleb Fairly,
Speaker 3: I know, is the name that some people pointed to.
Speaker 1: There was also the Georgia tackle I'm blanking on right now,
Speaker 1: his name Wilson. I think Wilson.
Speaker 3: He was here for like a second so practice.
Speaker 1: He was a late later first round picked in Fairly,
Speaker 1: but they took a real chance on him both injury
Speaker 1: and football character, and that that goes down as not
Speaker 1: to pick on Vrabel, but that goes down as one
Speaker 1: of the worst first round picks of the last decade.
Speaker 3: Yeah he got there.
Speaker 1: Yeah, he didn't even really play for the Titans. So
Speaker 1: they took on some risk with those picks, and both
Speaker 1: of those guys had injury red flags, fairly had huge
Speaker 1: injury red flags. Was a top fifteen, top twelve talent
Speaker 1: in his draft just based off the film, but was
Speaker 1: significant injury red flags, and neither one of those players
Speaker 1: weren't out.
Speaker 3: So his was a back. Yeah, Failies was a back.
Speaker 3: Wilson's it was I think it was an ankle. I
Speaker 3: don't remember exactly what it was.
Speaker 1: There was also with and there were there were some football.
Speaker 3: Character issues, but part of it too was he had
Speaker 3: an injury that was was chronic, which means that it's
Speaker 3: not something that Seltzer's going through this right now with
Speaker 3: Jaalen Brown. It's not something that you heard it, it
Speaker 3: heals and you're done. It's not like a broken arm, right,
Speaker 3: It's something that is just going to kind of last
Speaker 3: and always be an issue. I'm not a doctor, but
Speaker 3: from what I've seen, like medical people say, this injury
Speaker 3: that Simmons has can have not guaranteed, can have some
Speaker 3: lasting impacts.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: So if that's the guy you're going to draft a
Speaker 3: left tackle, I've made the comp before Malcolm Mitchell. When
Speaker 3: Malcolm Mitchell was healthy, he was a good player, and
Speaker 3: I think when Josh Simmonson is healthy, he's a really
Speaker 3: good player. Is it gonna be healthy enough to justify
Speaker 3: a first round pick? That's what I worry about. I
Speaker 3: haven't seen the medicals. I wouldn't know what to make
Speaker 3: of them if I did, but you know, you gotta.
Speaker 3: I think he's one where I think sometimes teams really
Speaker 3: like a player and maybe the doctors tell him be careful,
Speaker 3: but you know, they see the tape and they sim
Speaker 3: as the player. I'd hope they listen to the doctors
Speaker 3: on And it sounds like Rabel from his experience in Tennessee,
Speaker 3: understands that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, especially early, I guess one thing to take an
Speaker 1: injury flyer on a guy later.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, no. And I mean this is coming from
Speaker 3: the same guy who has said, you know, I want
Speaker 3: them to take Seth McLaughlin. Yeah, who's torn achilles. That's
Speaker 3: no joke of an injury either. That's in the fifth round,
Speaker 3: have fun with it. In the top fifty. It's a
Speaker 3: very different conversation, all right.
Speaker 1: So the last thing that stood out to me from
Speaker 1: this press conference, and then I want to move on
Speaker 1: to my guys segment, on defense this week was obviously
Speaker 1: the very answer at the very very end about Joe
Speaker 1: Milton in the trade of Joe Milton, and I think
Speaker 1: the if you just take his answer at phase value,
Speaker 1: and look, he's not going to come out and say
Speaker 1: that Joe Milton is a bad locker room guy and
Speaker 1: it's not a good fit with Drake May. I don't
Speaker 1: think he would come out and say that publicly. But
Speaker 1: if we just take the answer at phase value about
Speaker 1: the reps, I kind of understand where he's coming from. That.
Speaker 1: When you go into a camp with an entrenched starting
Speaker 1: quarterback that is not in an open competition of any
Speaker 1: kind with anybody else, you go into that camp giving
Speaker 1: like ninety percent of the meaningful reps to that quarterback,
Speaker 1: especially when the quarterback is a second year guy, like
Speaker 1: especially when it's a young quarterback in the league like
Speaker 1: Drake May. So in order to continue to develop Joe Milton,
Speaker 1: you know, I think he was just saying that they're
Speaker 1: just outside of maybe preseason games where they you know,
Speaker 1: they wouldn't want to play Drake May. They wouldn't want
Speaker 1: to risk injury with Drake May. There wasn't a ton
Speaker 1: of reps to go around. If you just take that
Speaker 1: at face value. I think the only thing that I
Speaker 1: took away from that, because I've kind of closed the
Speaker 1: book on Joe Milton he's not here anymore, is that
Speaker 1: them drafting another quarterback at least in the top one
Speaker 1: point fifty that they might have some investment in and
Speaker 1: they might feel compelled to develop. It just doesn't seem
Speaker 1: realistic if they're going into this saying Drake May is
Speaker 1: going to get ninety percent, Josh Dobbs is our true backup.
Speaker 1: You know, he's our QB two as the veteran backup.
Speaker 1: This sounds to me more like, Okay, if there's a
Speaker 1: quarterback in the seventh round, they have two seventh round picks.
Speaker 1: If they really like a quarterback at the end of
Speaker 1: the draft and the seventh round, sure, you know, take
Speaker 1: a fly or whatever. But I think they're kind of
Speaker 1: looking more towards that like Camp arm territory of like,
Speaker 1: let's just get some a third quarterback in here for
Speaker 1: trading camp.
Speaker 3: They need, you need three quarterbacks operate, Yeah, you probably
Speaker 3: need four. Really ideal you force they're gonna add quarterbacks,
Speaker 3: but yeah, it's gonna be super late in the draft. Udfa.
Speaker 3: But it goes back to something I talked about after
Speaker 3: the trade, and I think kind of qualified it. I
Speaker 3: think a lot of people are looking at it as well,
Speaker 3: why would you trade your backup quarterback if Drake Mayge's hurt.
Speaker 3: They viewed him as the third string right, he was
Speaker 3: going to be the third string quarterback, emergency game day quarterback. Again,
Speaker 3: Dobbs was going to be the backup. And so because
Speaker 3: I think some people were confused, why would we request
Speaker 3: a trade if he wants a chance to compete and
Speaker 3: he goes to Dallas where Dak Prescott is ingrained as
Speaker 3: the starter, because he wants he just want a chance
Speaker 3: to compete for the backup job, which I don't think
Speaker 3: they were going to give him here. He should beat
Speaker 3: out Will Greer in Dallas and be there and Dak
Speaker 3: gets hurt, so like you know, who knows. But I
Speaker 3: don't think they viewed it as they were trading their
Speaker 3: backup quarterback. They were trading the third string guy. They
Speaker 3: were trading the emergency game day guy. Whether now, whether
Speaker 3: you think that's right or wrong, that's another story. I
Speaker 3: would have had him as the backup over Josh Dobbs.
Speaker 3: I think Josh Jobs there in a room, experienced guy
Speaker 3: like another coach. I would have had Milton as the backup,
Speaker 3: and you know, assuming he continued to progress and all
Speaker 3: that showed it on the field and kept up. But
Speaker 3: I think they viewed him as the third quarterback.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it just just looking you know how it pertains
Speaker 1: to the draft. I think there are just some mock
Speaker 1: drafts out there that I've seen with you know, a
Speaker 1: Riley Leonard for example, or you know, we did a
Speaker 1: mock draft yesterday before the Vaible Press or that I
Speaker 1: took Curtis Rourke in the seventh round, you know, just
Speaker 1: as a as a flyer. I think that's still on
Speaker 1: the on the table. Potentially Curtis Rourke makes a loss sense. Yeah,
Speaker 1: got a good two seventh round picks at the end.
Speaker 1: You're really just trying to get ahead of undrafted free
Speaker 1: agency at that point. Maybe they I'll do it at
Speaker 1: that point in the draft, But I just look at
Speaker 1: that quarterback spot as truly the third quarterback spot. Like
Speaker 1: you're saying, and I was taking a step further, it's
Speaker 1: basically just a camp arm as somebody that they can
Speaker 1: maybe stash on the practice squad all year. Long, so
Speaker 1: I wouldn't necessarily expect them to be making any more
Speaker 1: real investments at quarterback, you know, in terms of top
Speaker 1: one fifty picks at that position. So did you have
Speaker 1: any other big things that I missed? I mean those
Speaker 1: were kind of my.
Speaker 3: Pretty much again, like we didn't get as much out
Speaker 3: of that as we usually do it. And it's not
Speaker 3: me complaining. Yeah, right, Rabel has a different style.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we didn't.
Speaker 3: The running back thing was a little interesting. All had that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean he definitely left the door open there
Speaker 1: for gent, Like he didn't close it and say, no,
Speaker 1: you know, we're analytically driven, we don't, we don't care
Speaker 1: a running backs like you know, I would.
Speaker 3: Have said, well, well, he did give a whole answer
Speaker 3: on analytics. Yeah, yeah, which I know you love.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's good.
Speaker 3: But he did say you got to go back to
Speaker 3: the film. You got to confirm it all with the film.
Speaker 3: Which as long as you're doing that.
Speaker 1: I've always said, but that that the way that he
Speaker 1: talked about analytics is allway, is how the way that
Speaker 1: I think that you should apply your.
Speaker 3: Way vouch for that community. You have to vouch for
Speaker 3: the entire community.
Speaker 1: No, I don't yes, you do.
Speaker 3: It works.
Speaker 1: The analytics is a way in football. I'm not talking
Speaker 1: about other sports. I don't know enough about it.
Speaker 3: This is like you pinning uh Dan Campbell on me
Speaker 3: for being like a football guy.
Speaker 1: Analytics are are a way to provide context to what
Speaker 1: you're seeing on tape. So you watch the film, just
Speaker 1: like Rabel said, you watch the film and you say,
Speaker 1: this guy seems to be really good after the catch, right,
Speaker 1: like that that's the strength of his game. Well you
Speaker 1: might say that, and then you might look at the
Speaker 1: analytics and he's you know, twenty fifth out of twenty
Speaker 1: six qualified receivers in the draft and yards after the
Speaker 1: catch per reception, and so then you just have to
Speaker 1: go back to the tape and say, well, where's the
Speaker 1: disconnect here? Was it the routes he was being asked
Speaker 1: to run? Is it the scheme? Is it you know
Speaker 1: where he's playing on the field? Like, why is the
Speaker 1: juice that I see after the catch not translating to
Speaker 1: the numbers? Whereas sometimes you might say this guy's really
Speaker 1: good after the catch, and then the numbers say he's
Speaker 1: really good after the catch, And now we have a
Speaker 1: guy that we can say is a lead after the catch.
Speaker 1: You know Luther Burden, Sure, Kyle Williams, you know someone
Speaker 1: like that. Great that that's all it's all about. Uh
Speaker 1: I did. I thought his answer about you know, the
Speaker 1: injury prediction was really interesting. Yeah, I don't know as
Speaker 1: much about that stuff as I do about like the
Speaker 1: nerd math.
Speaker 3: But like you're talking about the one about Tennessee.
Speaker 1: Uh, well he's he mentioned that they they have ways
Speaker 1: predictive models about a durability and how and if guys
Speaker 1: have prior injury in college, Like are those injuries you know,
Speaker 1: to your point about you know Simmons's knee, like, are
Speaker 1: those injuries going to linger into the pros? Do that?
Speaker 1: Does that set up potentially injuries down the road? That
Speaker 1: stuff is newer, I would say, in terms of the
Speaker 1: sports science. But it's cool, like it's it's uh, it's
Speaker 1: some innovative tech that's actually working in medicine.
Speaker 3: You want to use all the math you want the medicine.
Speaker 3: I have no problem with that. Yeah, that fine, go
Speaker 3: for that. But they're back to the running back thing.
Speaker 3: I thought it was interesting because the question was like,
Speaker 3: do you have a philosophy on like running backs in
Speaker 3: the top ten? They basically said, no, I don't, but
Speaker 3: they have to be able to do all these things,
Speaker 3: and he basically just described Ashton Genty.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: But then the last thing he said was and what
Speaker 3: the team's prior convictions are. So he basically said. The
Speaker 3: question was do you believe a running back should go
Speaker 3: in the top ten? And he basically said, if a
Speaker 3: running back is really good, if a team is comfortable
Speaker 3: taking them in the top ten, they should so yeah,
Speaker 3: Like he kind of the answer for me was, well,
Speaker 3: if they're like, if they're he was like ash And
Speaker 3: the answer is basically, if a running back was going
Speaker 3: to go in the top ten, ash and Genty is
Speaker 3: that kind of guy. Yeah, I don't think they'll do it,
Speaker 3: but it's something to remember if like Genty becomes a
Speaker 3: free agent in a few years or request a trade
Speaker 3: or whatever.
Speaker 1: The interesting thing to me about his answer was that
Speaker 1: he mentioned a receiving upside and like pass catching. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and not that he's a zero as a pass catcher,
Speaker 1: but like Derrick Henry is not necessarily James.
Speaker 3: He didn't take Derek Henry in the first round. Yeah,
Speaker 3: And they remember, they repeatedly when Henry was there, brought
Speaker 3: in smaller backs to catch the football. Deon Lewis there.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well that's sort of My point is, like, so
Speaker 1: Derrick Henry, and I know it wasn't a first round pick,
Speaker 1: but Derrick Henry was their offense in Tennessee rightfully, so
Speaker 1: they built the entire thing around him. Now, the one
Speaker 1: thing that Derrick Henry I I think separates him from
Speaker 1: other running backs that we've seen is there's a clear
Speaker 1: correlation between play action success and Derrick Henry being on
Speaker 1: the field. Like the Titans numbers with Derrick Henry in
Speaker 1: the backfield on play action were just insane for like
Speaker 1: a three or four year period because you know, obviously
Speaker 1: defenses are stacked.
Speaker 3: Running sets up the past.
Speaker 1: What a concept when you have Derrick Henry, sure, and
Speaker 1: you have you know, just you know, Joe Schmoe running
Speaker 1: back behind the quarterback, it's not.
Speaker 3: Just say so, it's it's worth investing in a good
Speaker 3: running back, I.
Speaker 1: Would say Derrick Henry. My point was that Derrick Henry
Speaker 1: is kind of his own thing in that.
Speaker 3: Regard or the Eagles. What were the Eagles play action
Speaker 3: numbers this year? I actually don't know.
Speaker 1: If thought my head, well, the guns here, it's different,
Speaker 1: that's true, but yeah, they sure fine. But I thought
Speaker 1: that was interesting that he included pass catching. I did
Speaker 1: go back, you know, semi recently and watched you know,
Speaker 1: some agent's twenty twenty three tape to get the pass
Speaker 1: catching feel for him a little bit at a lot
Speaker 1: more in twenty three. I still think that he's more
Speaker 1: of like an underneath uh, you know, sneak out into
Speaker 1: the flat, you know, check down over the middle type
Speaker 1: of pass catcher. I don't know if he's a dynamic receiver,
Speaker 1: like I don't know if you're gonna be mismatch aligning
Speaker 1: him in the slot or out wide or having him
Speaker 1: run all these vertical routes from the back, you know,
Speaker 1: wheels fitting into the scene, things like that. Like, I
Speaker 1: don't know if that's necessarily his game, but he certainly
Speaker 1: is a a an adequate receiver.
Speaker 3: I would say, you know, for the basic wide receiver,
Speaker 3: for the basic running back pass catching skills you're looking for,
Speaker 3: he's go, yeah, like he's really good at that stuff.
Speaker 3: But he's not a guy like I wouldn't put in
Speaker 3: the same categori as a guy like Burshard Smith or
Speaker 3: the Quinn Allen or Woody marks where you're gonna kind
Speaker 3: of use him as a hybrid wide receiver like that
Speaker 3: James White stuff. But for the the base stuff, you're
Speaker 3: gonna ask a running back to doing the passing game
Speaker 3: both as a receiver and as a blocker. I would
Speaker 3: say he's not just baseline. He's better in those areas.
Speaker 1: All right, let's transition into my guys here and then
Speaker 1: those second hour of the show will open up the
Speaker 1: calls in the email, So just bear with us here
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Speaker 1: All right, let's get into my guys on defense. We
Speaker 1: changed it a little bit up this week to get
Speaker 1: a little bit faster through these guys. We spent a
Speaker 1: lot of time on this last week. Well, this is
Speaker 1: like the draft previous, I know, but I'm trying to
Speaker 1: move it along a little bit quicker. So we do
Speaker 1: have the five positions here, you know, interior, defensive line,
Speaker 1: edge linebackers, cornerback, and safety. No we don't, Yes, yes
Speaker 1: we do.
Speaker 3: They're going to take a kickers, So let's hold us
Speaker 3: last week. Let's start week.
Speaker 1: Let's start with the defensive line. Uh my, my first
Speaker 1: guy on this list. I tried to do early late
Speaker 1: I kind of cheated in. I tried to do that
Speaker 1: as well.
Speaker 3: We don't know who the first round guys are on defense.
Speaker 3: It's Carter and it's.
Speaker 1: And yeah, so my my defensive lineman on Day two,
Speaker 1: Alfred Collins from Texas. I feel like, is your kind
Speaker 1: of guy.
Speaker 3: He is? He was that was gonna be mild. I
Speaker 3: had a couple, but he was going to be my pick.
Speaker 1: So six six yeah, three thirty yeah, thirty six inch
Speaker 1: arms like this is just an absolute monster, monster of
Speaker 1: a man. Now, if the Patriots were in a traditional
Speaker 1: Belichick two gaping defense, like Alfred Collins is a two
Speaker 1: gapping three four end is like exactly what he fits.
Speaker 1: So I'm not sure it's an exact system fit for
Speaker 1: what the Patriots are going to do now, but I
Speaker 1: still look at him in the patriots a current defense
Speaker 1: with Vrabel and there's in their new system like can
Speaker 1: you play nose tackle?
Speaker 3: At that time they played that Jeffrey Simmons.
Speaker 1: Role is a three technique. I mean, like maybe, but
Speaker 1: I think that Milton Williams is going to play that role.
Speaker 1: But like what I look at with Alfred Collins is
Speaker 1: put him, you know, in the shade, in the A
Speaker 1: gap and just let him hold the A gap for you,
Speaker 1: like he's not going to be moved. I mean, that
Speaker 1: guy's an app mammoth. Like he's huge, he's got great length,
Speaker 1: he knows how to use it. I think the one
Speaker 1: thing that really stood out to me though watching his
Speaker 1: film that it was exciting that got me really excited
Speaker 1: about the player. His motor like he's he's.
Speaker 3: A loves his calary.
Speaker 1: He runs hot and and to be that big and
Speaker 1: play that hard for that many snaps in a game
Speaker 1: is sometimes a question mark. And he is just a
Speaker 1: mean dude.
Speaker 3: So obviously not it's not Rabel. Like oddly we've made
Speaker 3: all these Tennessee comps with Rabel. I'm gonna this might
Speaker 3: be a first for this offseason. I'm gonna make a
Speaker 3: Tennessee comp that doesn't involve like Rabel. Okay, Simmons next
Speaker 3: to Devandre Sweat because he's got some Toandre Sweat in
Speaker 3: his game. He's playing that role in that Texas defense, right,
Speaker 3: he's the next guy up?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 3: Like is that Milton Williams and Alfred Collins.
Speaker 1: I really like Alfred Collins a lot I do. I
Speaker 1: just thought that he can't teach size, he can't teach power,
Speaker 1: and you can't teach effort and he checks all three
Speaker 1: of those boxes.
Speaker 3: So since you went to him, yeah, I should go
Speaker 3: Dion Walker. He's really falling now. That one sucks. I
Speaker 3: was so ready to be he plays standing up at
Speaker 3: three hundred and forty pounds like.
Speaker 1: That one but that's the problem is he like literally
Speaker 1: and figuratively, he plays standing up his pad level.
Speaker 3: He plays like a player sign like fifty pounds smaller
Speaker 3: than he is, and that is that is both a
Speaker 3: good thing and a bad thing.
Speaker 1: He's got to get his pass down.
Speaker 3: You know. Sometimes there's like those cats that grow up
Speaker 3: in a house with all dogs and the cat or
Speaker 3: the doges the house all cats, and the dog just
Speaker 3: like thinks it's a cat. Yeah, that's kind of like
Speaker 3: like he he plays like a two hundred and eighty
Speaker 3: pounds speed rusher. Yeah, but he's three hundred and forty pounds.
Speaker 3: It's anyway. So instead of that, I'll go similar guy,
Speaker 3: Jamark Caldwell. Yeah, similar, Probably gonna go a little bit
Speaker 3: later Ben Collins. But same thing. One of these hyper
Speaker 3: athletic uh three. I think he I don't think he's
Speaker 3: three thirty. I think he's in the three twenties. Yeah,
Speaker 3: but a guy that can kind of do some similar things.
Speaker 1: Wide body just just a big butt.
Speaker 3: Well you know that Bill Belichick Kirby Smart story about
Speaker 3: the forty right, No, oh, have you not heard that?
Speaker 3: Might have so, Kirby Smart told us at a coaching
Speaker 3: clinic This was a few years ago, but it's on
Speaker 3: Twitter if you want to go find it. And I
Speaker 3: don't remember.
Speaker 1: If Kirby was with Bill the big butt.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Bill wanted to stand. This is a Bill starting
Speaker 3: line at the forties.
Speaker 1: This is a Bill Parcells thing.
Speaker 3: Oh is it to see which lineman of the biggest
Speaker 3: ass when they get down in the in the stands?
Speaker 1: Yeah? No, that this is that started with Parcels. Who
Speaker 1: by the way, Parcels. I mean, people know this, but
Speaker 1: I'm not breaking any news. Parcells is an amazing talent evaluator,
Speaker 1: like one of the best talent evaluators.
Speaker 3: Pretty good for the grocery.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's out there. I mean, obviously he's going into
Speaker 1: the Patriots Hall of Fame and uh and a big
Speaker 1: reason why is because he drafted a lot of the
Speaker 1: first pillars of Dynasty one point zero. You know, he
Speaker 1: drafted most of those guys. He was he was the
Speaker 1: first guy to talk about the behinds and making sure
Speaker 1: that those linemen have having a big, big butts and
Speaker 1: they cannot lie. All right, My next guy here, Day three,
Speaker 1: interior defensive lineman Tim Smith. Tim Smith from Alabama. I
Speaker 1: really thought he stood out at the Senior Bowl, downed
Speaker 1: Mobile back in January. He's been on my list ever
Speaker 1: since then. Heavy handed, aggressive, up the field, interior rusher.
Speaker 1: I can stop, to run, can shoot gaps, can beat
Speaker 1: guys latterly to the to the spot, really good upper
Speaker 1: body strength. I feel like he's another one of these dudes,
Speaker 1: like Alfred Collins is kind of like the second round version.
Speaker 1: Tim Smith is to me the Day three version if
Speaker 1: the Patriots are looking for that true interior run stuffer
Speaker 1: and a pair next to Milton Williams and Barmore and
Speaker 1: Keon White and just add to the rotation Tim Smith.
Speaker 1: I've been trying all draft season mock draft big board
Speaker 1: to find a place to write and talk about it.
Speaker 3: Always one guy that like I want to get into
Speaker 3: mock drafts and I don't.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it just hasn't worked out. But I think that
Speaker 1: Tim Smith is a Patriot type player for sure.
Speaker 3: So my Day three Alfred Collins guy. Day one's Kenneth Grant,
Speaker 3: Day two's Alfred Collins. Smart Caldwell is Cam Jackson from Florida. Yeah,
Speaker 3: another guy Senior Bowl. But I'm gonna go with J. J.
Speaker 3: Pageese Pilgrim Mats big Board pick he's a project player.
Speaker 3: He's a project player. He's not a guy that might
Speaker 3: make an impact right away. He's supposed to go on
Speaker 3: Day three, so that's okay. But really really good athlete
Speaker 3: for his size, So I was trying to look. He
Speaker 3: measured in at three twenty at the Senior Bowl, but
Speaker 3: then was three zho nine at the Combine. So I
Speaker 3: don't know where he's gonna play in the NFL. I
Speaker 3: would like him to play around three fifteen three twenty,
Speaker 3: but I think part of the reason he took some
Speaker 3: of that size off is in addition to playing on
Speaker 3: the defensive line, and he can play multiple positions.
Speaker 1: That's probably his best trade.
Speaker 3: Well or is it the fact that they would you
Speaker 3: and you think, all right, So I'm gonna say they
Speaker 3: played him on offense. You're thinking three hundred and twenty
Speaker 3: pound guy on offense, lead fall back like the Patriots
Speaker 3: used to use Richard Seymour. No, they use him as
Speaker 3: a running back. They use him as a short yarded
Speaker 3: running back. He had twenty one carries last year. Eighteen
Speaker 3: of them went for first downs, including seven touchdowns. He
Speaker 3: can carry the football. He ran some routes at the
Speaker 3: Combine in he didn't look out of place. So if
Speaker 3: you put some weight back on, who knows where that's at.
Speaker 3: But can he give you like a Patrick Ricard kind
Speaker 3: of thing. And I know I've compared Robber Huts to
Speaker 3: Patrick McCard, but this is much more similar with the
Speaker 3: body type. And I think he has the potential to
Speaker 3: be a multi positional, three down rotational player on defense.
Speaker 3: He's got a ways to go to get there. Like
Speaker 3: he's winning on pure athleticism right now. The technical part
Speaker 3: of his game needs to be refined certainly, but this
Speaker 3: coaching staff is good with that. And if you give
Speaker 3: him a year or two, I think he can be
Speaker 3: a really, really fun piece. I think he can be
Speaker 3: a guy you can get really creative with and can
Speaker 3: make an impact on both sides of the ball.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I like it. His versatility was the number one
Speaker 1: thing I wrote down, yeah, just in my notes about him.
Speaker 1: I really felt like his speed to power was kind
Speaker 1: of a foundational move for him. Though. You know, he's
Speaker 1: got that ability to really roll his hips and convert
Speaker 1: speed to power in the pass rush, and that's going
Speaker 1: to give him a nice foundation. Maybe you add like
Speaker 1: an armover or swim or something. Like that to just
Speaker 1: compliment that I liked his tape a lot too, as
Speaker 1: you know, an early day three, mid day three kind
Speaker 1: of guy, impressive player in terms of the movement skills.
Speaker 1: All right, let's go to the edge. I kind of cheated.
Speaker 1: I put two day two edge guys. Gotta like them
Speaker 1: bowl so much I couldn't decide. So my first one
Speaker 1: is Femiola Daejo from UCLA. I just feel like he's
Speaker 1: a Rabel type of player. Explosiveness, play, strength, effort, finish, versatility,
Speaker 1: played off the ball early on in his career at UCLA,
Speaker 1: then moved to the edge this past season, a great
Speaker 1: Senior Bowl week. That's another one of those guys that
Speaker 1: got on my radar down in Mobile. But what I
Speaker 1: really liked about him effort, finish, explosiveness off the ball,
Speaker 1: And I just am clamoring for the Patriots to give
Speaker 1: Torell Williams and Mike Rabel one of these balls of
Speaker 1: clay on the edge, Like I don't necessarily need their
Speaker 1: edge pick to be an early, you know, top fifty
Speaker 1: selection on a guy that's an already finished product, like
Speaker 1: I'm okay with taking on some development upside there at
Speaker 1: that position. I think Oldeho, the guy I compared him
Speaker 1: to his boy Mafi out in Seattle, like you give
Speaker 1: him a year or two to develop underneath Rabel and
Speaker 1: Terrell Williams and Harold Landry and Chase On and Anthony
Speaker 1: Jennings and Keon White are going to be playing a
Speaker 1: lot of the snaps there in twenty twenty five, by
Speaker 1: twenty twenty six, twenty twenty seven, Like ol Day, who
Speaker 1: might be one of the better Day two edge rushers
Speaker 1: out of this class. He's got a ton of tools.
Speaker 3: I'll go to the opposite for Day two. I'll go
Speaker 3: with the guy that's ready, Jack Sawyer.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I've been on this since the beginning. They're kind of
Speaker 3: guy culture, tone setter, physical. What's the word they've used
Speaker 3: to describe their defense so many times? Violence? Yeah, right,
Speaker 3: plays with violence.
Speaker 1: Both these guys playing violence. You know.
Speaker 3: Yeah, He's a guy you can put opposite calevon Chase
Speaker 3: on your speed rusher. He's power on the other side,
Speaker 3: the Ohio State thing, all of it. He just he's
Speaker 3: he's such a fit. He is everything that this offseason
Speaker 3: has kind of been pointed towards.
Speaker 1: Absolutely the last one I had here and I can't.
Speaker 1: I can't get this guy out of my head, even
Speaker 1: though I don't think he's necessarily a great system fit anymore.
Speaker 1: But Josiah Stewart from Michigan just twitched up rusher, really
Speaker 1: undersized for the position, probably pigeonholed into like a three
Speaker 1: four outside linebacker situational pass rusher type of role, which
Speaker 1: is why maybe he doesn't make as much sense anymore
Speaker 1: for the Patriots. But I just loved watching Josiah Stewart
Speaker 1: at the Senior Bowl against USC last year, just absolutely
Speaker 1: eight up the USC tackles, a great first step, exposed
Speaker 1: in this great bend. Just an absolute twitched up mover.
Speaker 1: I think he's gonna be a good proble. I think
Speaker 1: he's gonna outplay his size, Like you know, Marcus Jones,
Speaker 1: we had him in here on Patriots Unfiltered yesterday, Like
Speaker 1: he's like the defensive back version of this. Josiah Stewart's
Speaker 1: gonna be like the edge rusher version of a guy
Speaker 1: who's undersized. So he'll probably go in like the third
Speaker 1: or fourth round because of that. But it's gonna just
Speaker 1: be a really good football player regardless of the size.
Speaker 3: All Right, you want the Day three version of that guy,
Speaker 3: then sure. Colin Oliver Oklahoma State. Yeah, really productive for
Speaker 3: the Cowboys for three years, miss most of last year.
Speaker 3: I think it was a foot injury, right, yeah, foot injury.
Speaker 3: So he's another one. There's an odd number of players
Speaker 3: in this draft, like more than usual that missed significant
Speaker 3: time last season, like in the season leading up to
Speaker 3: the draft. So there's value there, right, and he's gonna
Speaker 3: have to come back. He's another He's undersized. I have
Speaker 3: it here. He is six two forty with thirty inch arms,
Speaker 3: but he flies off the edge, great speed, good bend,
Speaker 3: and he's had the production, so like he's kind of
Speaker 3: proven it. He's probably never gonna be more than just
Speaker 3: a third down rusher. But if you want a guy
Speaker 3: develop in that package, he's gonna go later because it's
Speaker 3: a deep class and he was hurt. And by the way,
Speaker 3: there's spoiler alert, he's not the only Oklahoma State player
Speaker 3: that fits this description. There could be some value there
Speaker 3: and he could be an interesting find for them.
Speaker 1: I think I know where you're going. It might be
Speaker 1: at the next position.
Speaker 3: It is at the next but the other guy, I'd
Speaker 3: give you two How much have you done on Kaimon Rucker.
Speaker 1: He's on my list. I have like a couple of
Speaker 1: more guys to go.
Speaker 3: I'm not sure what to make of him. I really
Speaker 3: liked him in college, but it's tough for projecting him.
Speaker 3: I thought i'd like it, like because when I watch
Speaker 3: him in the fall and watch him as a college player,
Speaker 3: mostly like I'm mentally filing it away. But like it's
Speaker 3: tougher to project him to the NFL than I thought
Speaker 3: it would be.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I have like five or six more edge guys
Speaker 1: I want to get to before the draft.
Speaker 3: Maybe we'll cover that next.
Speaker 1: Baron Sorel from Texas, Savion Jones from melosu Kay Robinson
Speaker 1: from Alabama, who's getting some love now, you know as
Speaker 1: a just an edge rusher, you know, pure speed edge rusher. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so there's a couple more of those guys. All right,
Speaker 1: let's move over to linebacker. My day two linebacker Demetrius
Speaker 1: Knight from South Carolina. Yeah, shot out of the cannon,
Speaker 1: just an explosive downhill trigger his game, his game against Alabama,
Speaker 1: like had it all like just chasing down Jalen Milroe,
Speaker 1: you know, and uh and closing from from depth on
Speaker 1: Jalen Milroe and just tackling him in space, Like there's
Speaker 1: not a whole lot of guys that can get Jalen
Speaker 1: Milroe on the ground, like you watch Jalen Miller as
Speaker 1: a runner is a leade elite, and Demetrius Knight's able
Speaker 1: to do that. Like I said, physical downhill striker, take
Speaker 1: online lineman at the point of attack. I run guys
Speaker 1: down in the flats. You know, when he's moving downhill,
Speaker 1: he's moving at a great speed, And I just love
Speaker 1: his aggressiveness, his attack mindset. I think he's gonna fait
Speaker 1: right in in the NFL.
Speaker 3: So I feel like I've talked about a lot of
Speaker 3: these guys. You guys know, I like Knight, I like
Speaker 3: Chris Paul, I like Danny Stutsman, I like Beart Carter
Speaker 3: Vrabel's gonna love Stutsman. Yeah, like Sutsman could be Patriot.
Speaker 3: But yeah, I'll go I'm gonna give you two day
Speaker 3: three guys. So one, this is what I was in
Speaker 3: at Nick martin Oklahoma State. So it's a little different.
Speaker 1: They had him in here for thirty they did.
Speaker 3: It's a little different than Oliver because Oliver had played
Speaker 3: he was a three year starter. He played a lot
Speaker 3: for three years. I don't know he was a starter,
Speaker 3: but like he had a regular role. Martin really didn't
Speaker 3: play like at all until twenty twenty three. He was
Speaker 3: freaking unbelievable one hundred and forty tackles all over the field,
Speaker 3: looked like one of the best athletes on the field,
Speaker 3: whoever the opponent was. I mean, he was flying around regularly,
Speaker 3: get into the football, making plays on the ball, three
Speaker 3: down player, all of that, and then two games into
Speaker 3: the season last year he gets hurt and he was
Speaker 3: the rest of the season. I don't know if you
Speaker 3: have his injury ev and I don't have it pulled up,
Speaker 3: but Mick Martins, yeah, so yeah, you talk about a
Speaker 3: ball of play, Rightney, Okay, So, like I, I the
Speaker 3: guys that just have one year of experience, whether it
Speaker 3: be injury related or something else, it always worries me because,
Speaker 3: as we've seen in the past, you can have one
Speaker 3: really good year in college football the piece hasn't come together,
Speaker 3: and that can just be kind of it. So, like I, I,
Speaker 3: this isn't me telling you he's gonna be a great player.
Speaker 3: This is me telling you there's a lot there that
Speaker 3: I like that I'd like to see them work with
Speaker 3: and the fact that he's a projected like fifth sixth
Speaker 3: round pick, that's where you should be taking a guy
Speaker 3: like yeah. So people are gonna hear this and say
Speaker 3: Cameron mcgron and roll their Yeah. He is kind of
Speaker 3: similar to Cameron mcgroun, if anything, is litt less experienced
Speaker 3: than Cameron mcgron was.
Speaker 1: I got a lot of heat for liking Cameron mcgron.
Speaker 3: I'll take that flyer every time. If you take that
Speaker 3: flyer four times the pick or five times, you get
Speaker 3: one stud player out of it. And I'm talking about
Speaker 3: in the fifth, sixth, seventh round.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm fine.
Speaker 3: You want to take one flyer like that a year,
Speaker 3: especially if you have like day of what eight picks, yep,
Speaker 3: nine picks, go for it. So Nick Martin is a
Speaker 3: guy put on that list, especially because the fit. I
Speaker 3: think they're in a position where for And that was
Speaker 3: the weird thing about mcgroen. He wasn't their kind of linebacker.
Speaker 3: He didn't fit into their defense. I think Nick Martin
Speaker 3: fits really well given the linebacker editions they've made, Like
Speaker 3: he plays the position the way they want it played.
Speaker 3: There's gonna be less of a growing curve for him.
Speaker 1: He was my fifty first guy on my Big Boy. Really,
Speaker 1: I wanted to get him on there because I tried
Speaker 1: to get everybody that they had in for a thirty visit.
Speaker 1: Reportedly had in here a thirty visit. He's one of them.
Speaker 1: And to your point, the way that they the body
Speaker 1: type that they've looked for at line, it's nick more the.
Speaker 3: Body and the athleticis. Yeah, he's a really good appen Yeah.
Speaker 1: He checks all the boxes for them.
Speaker 3: Uh.
Speaker 1: The guy that I had on day three was Jack
Speaker 1: Kaiser from Notre Dame because I just think he's like
Speaker 1: a throwback linebacker. Yeah, you know, he's just one of
Speaker 1: those guys that's gonna, you know, move lad early, follow
Speaker 1: the ball, good instincts, gonna be around the football a
Speaker 1: lot as a tackler, going to clean up in the
Speaker 1: run game. I believe that Jack Kaiser is gonna be
Speaker 1: a tackling machine at the next level. He might not
Speaker 1: be the most impactful linebacker, Like he's not gonna be
Speaker 1: someone that's gonna make splash plays all over the field
Speaker 1: like a Demetrius Night might. But Jack Kaiser, I think,
Speaker 1: is gonna be a guy that's gonna rack up tackles
Speaker 1: just being in the action.
Speaker 3: Also team captain, and I think any any line as
Speaker 3: we go, edge rusher's, linebackers, corner safeties, like yeah, when
Speaker 3: you're getting a Day three that special teams experience is important.
Speaker 3: He has a ton of special teams experience. Ye King's guy,
Speaker 3: My Day three linebacker Sean Dolak from Buffalo. I don't
Speaker 3: know how much you know about Sean Dorry. I don't
Speaker 3: because that is the kind of guy that would be
Speaker 3: a little off your board here. So Sean Dolak tell
Speaker 3: me this sounds like a Mike Vrabel player. Sean Dolac
Speaker 3: began his career at Buffalo as a walk on. Now
Speaker 3: five years later he is a consensus All American. The
Speaker 3: production is absolutely insane. I think he had one hundred
Speaker 3: and sixty tackles last year, had one hundred and sixty
Speaker 3: tackles two years before that. He was heard in between.
Speaker 3: He's kind of undersize six five. You know, he's not
Speaker 3: necessarily as big and as strong as some of these
Speaker 3: guys are, but plays with great instincts, plays with a
Speaker 3: great motor. Again, captain walk on to All American. That
Speaker 3: whole thing he might not get drafted. He might be
Speaker 3: u DFA. You talk about a guy that can come
Speaker 3: in and be a core special teamer for years, certainly
Speaker 3: has that projection, and then maybe he fills in a
Speaker 3: little bit of linebacker as well. When we talk about
Speaker 3: a Vrabel guy, like I kind of said before, Jack
Speaker 3: Sawyer is everything that the sauces has been pointing towards
Speaker 3: Sean Dolac. The tiebreaker there might just be Ohio State
Speaker 3: because Sean Dolak has that as well. Isn't necessarily gonna
Speaker 3: be like a big defensive weapon, but he seems like
Speaker 3: the kind of guy they're gonna wan on the football team.
Speaker 1: All right, Corners, I'm sticking with the Notre Dame theme here.
Speaker 1: I mean going with Ben Morrison from Notre Dame as
Speaker 1: my I did too.
Speaker 3: He's there's great value there.
Speaker 1: He's injury, which I think is is a little bit
Speaker 1: why he's not getting as much buzz as some of
Speaker 1: these other guys at the cornerback position. But his man
Speaker 1: coverage tape, like his ability to stick to receivers in
Speaker 1: man coverage. I'll take that against pretty much any non
Speaker 1: Travis Hunter corner in this class. Like I thought his
Speaker 1: game against Stanford in particular. Was it was great. I
Speaker 1: mean he was just in everybody's hip pocket for four
Speaker 1: straight quarters. Feisty man coverage corner, extremely sticky and glued
Speaker 1: to the route break at all times. He is a
Speaker 1: pattern matching machine. Like, he's not someone that's gonna necessarily
Speaker 1: make a ton of plays on the ball. He's just
Speaker 1: gonna take this guy out of the game and you're
Speaker 1: not gonna be able to throw him the football. I
Speaker 1: am surprised, and maybe it's just a type thing. I
Speaker 1: also think it's you know, a flavor thing. And I
Speaker 1: think it's also you know, this time of year, a
Speaker 1: lot of people tend to gravitate towards guys that have
Speaker 1: big interception numbers or pick sixes or whatever the case
Speaker 1: may be. You know, I'm a man coverage guy. It's
Speaker 1: probably just from being a you know, a Patriots person.
Speaker 1: But I look at Ben Morrison as as one of
Speaker 1: the top top man coverage corners in this crowd.
Speaker 3: Well he was. He was a first round pick until
Speaker 3: the hip injury. Yeah, so he's another guy. It's another
Speaker 3: guy where like the medicals are gonna be a part
Speaker 3: of the evaluation. Yep, I should probably go Darien Porter
Speaker 3: or Chevon Revel, Like that's so my kind of corner. Yeah,
Speaker 3: I think I saw Revel komped to h Tarik Wolan.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was a little disappointed with Revel a tad.
Speaker 3: How there's nothing to see. He's played like fourteen games,
Speaker 3: I know, but I you got to watch something and
Speaker 3: he's a pure projection.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Uh, he's a little stiff, like he's he's a
Speaker 1: big stiff dude, but he's a literally explosive guy. Like
Speaker 1: I could see it.
Speaker 3: In like the right matchups. Right, he's his own corner,
Speaker 3: which is tough.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I just didn't necessarily love the transitions, Like I
Speaker 1: thought he was a little stiff in the hips, but I.
Speaker 3: Think that's something you learn as you play. And he
Speaker 3: just hasn't played a lot of football. Yeah that's possible,
Speaker 3: like the injury this year killed him. So those are
Speaker 3: those of the guys I'd usually go towards Sevon Revel,
Speaker 3: Darian Port, I means six three two a what random
Speaker 3: four to three, he's just like ninety years old. And
Speaker 3: another guy that's his own corner, yeah, Jacob Parrish, Yeah,
Speaker 3: Jacob Parrish. There's a lot of John Jones there. Yeah,
Speaker 3: there's a lot of John Jones can play the slot
Speaker 3: like he'll be primarily slot corner. The NFL can play
Speaker 3: the boundary, can play safety, plays bigger than a size, physical,
Speaker 3: really smart football player. That's just kind of guy you
Speaker 3: want your secondary. I think versatility all right, versutill He's
Speaker 3: probably more important on the offensive line than anywhere else.
Speaker 3: After that, I think versatility in the secondary is more important.
Speaker 3: The more you can do in the secondary, not only
Speaker 3: does it help you keep depth, it helps you just
Speaker 3: guy's coverage it right, because if a guy can line
Speaker 3: up anywhere and realistically play any of those spots, the
Speaker 3: defense doesn't know what to expect or the offense doesn't
Speaker 3: know what to expect. So I think Parish can come
Speaker 3: in here give them depth in the slot. Could potentially
Speaker 3: start if Marcus Jones leaves. He's in a contract here.
Speaker 3: I'd like them to keep Marcus Jones, but you know
Speaker 3: he gets hurt a lot too, write that sort of thing,
Speaker 3: and I just think he can be useful player for them.
Speaker 1: I had one corner on my big board. Yeah it
Speaker 1: was Jacob Parish. Like I feel like Jacob Parrish to
Speaker 1: play this.
Speaker 3: I had one corner on but he said to the
Speaker 3: visits they met with Blalcomb and it.
Speaker 1: Was Jacob Parish who also they reportedly had a visit,
Speaker 1: and I just you explained it. He's Jonathan Jones to
Speaker 1: point out to me and to play the slot. Carlon
Speaker 1: Davis and Christian Gonzales on the outside, Jacob Parrish in
Speaker 1: the slot makes a whole lot of sense. I think,
Speaker 1: you know, Jonathan Jones is probably the right colm. There's
Speaker 1: a little bit of Trent McDuffie in there if you
Speaker 1: want to go ceiling, like if you want to be
Speaker 1: a hot really on the player. But that's the archetype, right,
Speaker 1: a guy that's probably at his best, you know, playing
Speaker 1: inside or moving around the formation with like a a
Speaker 1: Z receiver, you know, the pure route runner of the
Speaker 1: of the group, and then you know, occasionally play on
Speaker 1: the outside. But I love Jacob Parrish's film. He also
Speaker 1: puts his nose in there in the run game at
Speaker 1: his size pretty well and scrappy guy too, So I
Speaker 1: was really high on him too. U Day day three
Speaker 1: cornerback Mac McWilliams, Yes, UCF had.
Speaker 3: That's kind of Day three. I was literally about to
Speaker 3: say the other John Jones comp John Jones.
Speaker 1: I kind of see a little Jack Jones in him too.
Speaker 3: Like I said, there was somebody I think was Kobe Bryant,
Speaker 3: I saw like Jones.
Speaker 1: Yeah. So Mac McWilliams is again, a slot corner, probably
Speaker 1: a nickel at the NFL level, maybe a safety, even
Speaker 1: nickels safety if you want to call it that.
Speaker 3: He played a little deep safety at Yeah, he.
Speaker 1: Can play man to man in the slot though. I
Speaker 1: had a really good Senior Bowl week. Was really feisty,
Speaker 1: really sticky and coverage, play man to man, you know,
Speaker 1: run around with slot corner slot receivers. I should say
Speaker 1: all day long. I really liked mc McWilliams and mobile.
Speaker 1: I thought he came in with an edge. I thought
Speaker 1: he came in with some fires and competitives, that alpha
Speaker 1: corner mentality, like he'd break up a pass and you
Speaker 1: let him hear about it. I like those types of guys.
Speaker 1: It doesn't hurt to have those types of guys. Ever,
Speaker 1: So if you know Jacob Parrish is kind of the
Speaker 1: day too version of this, I would say Mac McWilliams
Speaker 1: is the day three So.
Speaker 3: I and you covered it all there, and I love
Speaker 3: his ability to play safety too. Yeah, I am curious
Speaker 3: what you thought. We talked a little about a bit
Speaker 3: about him last week of Denzel Burke.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so Denzel Burke to me was I had some
Speaker 1: questions about his top end speed, his long speed to
Speaker 1: carry verticals on the outside a lot. It kind of
Speaker 1: reminds me a lot of Sean Waite like in terms
Speaker 1: of his career path. And maybe it's just the ohigest
Speaker 1: very similar.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 1: It was a really high projected player early on in
Speaker 1: his career, had an injury, had some issues.
Speaker 3: Well not just projected. He was a freshman All American.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so he was.
Speaker 3: He was the first true freshman to start again to
Speaker 3: start the season open for Ohio State since former Patriot
Speaker 3: Andy Katzimware.
Speaker 1: Oh that's an interesting stat.
Speaker 3: I just want to get Andy Katzman. Yeah, I know
Speaker 3: there and the show of like three years you've never gasl.
Speaker 1: Burke is one of those guys that's gonna play in
Speaker 1: the league for a while. But he might not ever
Speaker 1: be like a standout player, but he's going to be
Speaker 1: able to play a lot of snaps. A comp that
Speaker 1: I came up with with him was kind of like
Speaker 1: a Jalen Mills type, right, Like he's just that sort
Speaker 1: of player, like not necessarily exactly the style of play,
Speaker 1: but just like the usage of like, Okay, this is
Speaker 1: gonna be an NFL defensive back for a while, But
Speaker 1: is he ever going to be like a number one corner.
Speaker 1: Probably not, but he's he's going to belong on an NFL. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that those are your corners.
Speaker 3: I mean, if I had to give another one, it
Speaker 3: I like blal Cone. I don't know how much sense
Speaker 3: he makes for them at this point. They need slot guys.
Speaker 3: They're actually pretty good on size. But who's the I'm
Speaker 3: laying you on the name now there is another slot guy.
Speaker 3: Oh Jabar Muhammad. Yeah, Morgan played on the boundary exclusively,
Speaker 3: almost exclusively in college. Was part of both the Washington
Speaker 3: Or and Oregon teams that went to the playoff. He's
Speaker 3: gonna move in the inside of the next level really good.
Speaker 3: When the ball's in the air, he you know, he's
Speaker 3: not the stickiest cover corner, but he's fine. But he
Speaker 3: does a good job of recovering. And then when the
Speaker 3: ball's in the air and at the catch point, especially
Speaker 3: for guys' size, is very very competitive. So I think
Speaker 3: there's some real UNTAP patent if you can improve his
Speaker 3: cover skills and kind of get him, you know, in
Speaker 3: the film room and recognizing patterns and things like that,
Speaker 3: and just maybe work on his footwork. I don't know
Speaker 3: exactly what it is that his cover skills aren't there.
Speaker 3: Those are just a couple of things that can you
Speaker 3: can do to improve it. Like I think there's some
Speaker 3: real untap potential. But he is small. He's gonna have
Speaker 3: to play in the slot.
Speaker 1: Okay, safety, See this is a good pace, all right.
Speaker 1: He didn't take an hour and a half to get
Speaker 1: through all the different positions. Is nice already. Kickers.
Speaker 3: I don't care if say we're doing kickers.
Speaker 1: My day two safety might be the same as yours.
Speaker 1: But I just love this player so much I had
Speaker 1: to give him the hype. Andrew from Texas is just
Speaker 1: the absolute dog.
Speaker 3: That's the That's the guy I've been screaming about them
Speaker 3: getting for two years now retired. Is that not the
Speaker 3: exact guy? He so?
Speaker 1: For whatever reason, like I feel like I'm much higher
Speaker 1: on him than a lot of other people.
Speaker 3: Are, Like every week, what are you people looking at?
Speaker 1: I think it's because of the size, Like I would think,
Speaker 1: like he's not the biggest guy.
Speaker 3: I'm not super word. How big was devinc Cordy? I'm
Speaker 3: not super fine. Can you cover ground? That's all I
Speaker 3: care about all but like.
Speaker 1: Just absolute uh shot out of a cannon trigger to
Speaker 1: the football, whether it's ranging over the top, you know,
Speaker 1: fill in the alley in the run game, screen game,
Speaker 1: whatever the case may be. That interception that he made
Speaker 1: against Georgia was just ridiculous, uh, insane ball skills, Like
Speaker 1: has that ability to rotate, you know, down into the
Speaker 1: robber role or play the deep part of the field,
Speaker 1: or play split safety. I just think that he's gonna
Speaker 1: be a hell of a football player. That another one
Speaker 1: of those guys that might not have like the size,
Speaker 1: speed measureables that everybody you know goes ooh and ah over,
Speaker 1: but it's gonna vastly outplay the physical tools that that
Speaker 1: are at his disposal, with instincts and just you know,
Speaker 1: feel for the game and and uh and just talent,
Speaker 1: you know, in terms of football talent. So I can't
Speaker 1: say enough good things about Andrew mccooba. I think he's
Speaker 1: a heck of a safety. And I put Billy Bowman
Speaker 1: like kind of in the same sort of bucket. Guy
Speaker 1: with those two guys. I thought both those guys were
Speaker 1: awesome watches.
Speaker 3: Yeah, mccoob was one of my favorite players in this draft, like,
Speaker 3: not like one of the best, but I think he's
Speaker 3: really good at what he does. And the fact he's
Speaker 3: getting slept on since you took him for Day two.
Speaker 3: I'll just throw Xavier Watson there another guy that I
Speaker 3: think could play the back end for them. Yeah, but
Speaker 3: I I like mccoomba and Bowman. I Bowman now is
Speaker 3: getting Day two looks. Apparently. I thought he was like
Speaker 3: one oh six great, but now I guess some people
Speaker 3: think he could go on day two. I think Bowman
Speaker 3: is a little different Bowman played. He's he's shorter, but
Speaker 3: he's like he's got more muscle on him, a little
Speaker 3: bit more. I think he plays the game more physically,
Speaker 3: more with an edge. He's more to me that hybrid.
Speaker 3: He's kind of similar to Mac McWilliams, where I think
Speaker 3: they're both hybrid slot corner deep safeties. But I think
Speaker 3: McWilliams is more primarily a corner. I think Bowman is
Speaker 3: more primarily a safety like Andrew mccoob. But we've talked
Speaker 3: about this.
Speaker 1: Put mccooba as a playmaker that is gonna be around.
Speaker 3: So, like, we've talked about this deep safety role for
Speaker 3: a few years now, and we talk about it every time.
Speaker 3: We talk about it in two ways, Devin mccorty and
Speaker 3: Deron Harmon. And there's the guy that's gonna be out
Speaker 3: there and you're gonna play single high a lot because
Speaker 3: this guy's on the field seventy eighty ninety percent of
Speaker 3: the time Devin mccorty was leading the Patriots and snaps
Speaker 3: every year. And then there's also, all right, if you
Speaker 3: don't get that guy, can you get a guy like
Speaker 3: Drawn Harmon who can come on the field and just
Speaker 3: play it situationally when you're in clear passing situations, two
Speaker 3: minute trail, third and long things like that. So, to me,
Speaker 3: like Billy Bowman is a situational deep safety. Billy Bowman
Speaker 3: is not gonna be a guy who's gonna play ninety
Speaker 3: percent of your defensive snaps. It's gonna be out there
Speaker 3: fifty to sixty percent of the time. He's gonna play
Speaker 3: the role really well, but you're not gonna want to
Speaker 3: overdo it. Andrew mccooba, I'm fine if Andrew mccoop maybe
Speaker 3: not as a rookie, but like Andrew mccooba, to me
Speaker 3: is a guy that can full time play the Devin
Speaker 3: mccordy role and be on and not come off the field.
Speaker 3: Bowman to me is more situational. So the guy that
Speaker 3: I looked at and I say rotational in that situation.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I have been pumping this guy's tires as sort
Speaker 1: of the Deron Harmon Day three pick is Malchai Moore
Speaker 1: from Alabama. Yeah, who has similar you know, range and
Speaker 1: instincts and ball howking ability in the deep part of
Speaker 1: the field. I think he's one of those guys that
Speaker 1: is exactly the Deron Harmon role, like third down in
Speaker 1: eight and you gotta have it, like you just put
Speaker 1: him in the deep middle. He's going to cover the post,
Speaker 1: He's going to cover over the top. He's gonna, you know,
Speaker 1: take advantage of those arm punts that every once in
Speaker 1: a while Dron Harmon would take advantage of the closer
Speaker 1: right and go and make those types of plays. Is
Speaker 1: he Ed Reid in the middle of the field. No,
Speaker 1: like's not. He's not that kind of impact player, but
Speaker 1: he's a guy that can come in and play that
Speaker 1: role and allow Kyle Dugger and Jabriel Peppers to do
Speaker 1: their thing closer to the line of scrimmage. And we've
Speaker 1: been talking about this a lot, and I feel like,
Speaker 1: you know, every single year, and some people push back
Speaker 1: on it, but I really feel strongly that they got
Speaker 1: to get those guys Dugger and Peppers back into their
Speaker 1: natural spots, especially yes when the game is on the
Speaker 1: line and when they're really in those money situations. Get
Speaker 1: Kyle Dugger out of the middle of the field, get
Speaker 1: him closer to the box, get him moving forward again,
Speaker 1: get him blitzing, get him covering tight ends, you know,
Speaker 1: like that sort of thing. I think there's so they're
Speaker 1: much better players when Dugger and Peppers are doing those
Speaker 1: types of things versus asking them to play free safety.
Speaker 1: So even if it's a guy that comes in that's
Speaker 1: only going to play thirty five forty percent of the
Speaker 1: snaps fifty percent of the snaps, but it's allowing those
Speaker 1: guys to play where they should be playing. I think
Speaker 1: that would really complete this secondary like puzzle completely to get.
Speaker 3: We're back to the Javon Holland talk based all right,
Speaker 3: do you have any more safety Day three? Deep Safety Uh,
Speaker 3: Dante Trader from Maryland.
Speaker 1: I loved him at the Senior Bowl. I thought he
Speaker 1: was a really good player.
Speaker 3: This is Bill's guy. You know, he was a top
Speaker 3: ten lacrosse recruit coming out of high school.
Speaker 1: Yeah, he was. He he moved up the board a
Speaker 1: little bit. I think maybe the Senior Bowl helped him.
Speaker 1: He had a good week down.
Speaker 3: Big Tom lacrosse player and football player.
Speaker 2: Uh.
Speaker 3: And you know, I was just going to get to
Speaker 3: focus on football. Rob like again too, sport athletes like.
Speaker 3: He's athletic as hell. He's one of the most truly
Speaker 3: athletic players in this draft to me, hyper athletic safety.
Speaker 3: At the very worst, you're getting a plus special teams player.
Speaker 3: And for a guy that's projected to go I mean,
Speaker 3: I think could probably get him one seventy one would
Speaker 3: be the earliest I think you need to take him.
Speaker 3: You might be able to get him with those two
Speaker 3: hundred picks. A guy like that to make good, that'd
Speaker 3: be good solid pick.
Speaker 1: Yeah, he's kind of a hybrid safety to me, just
Speaker 1: at least the way I used him at the scene.
Speaker 1: But I think he's he can play a little bit
Speaker 1: in the box and cover tight ends and also played.
Speaker 3: He's still so raw. I like him as a coverage player.
Speaker 3: He's still so raw. You've got to turn him into
Speaker 3: whatever you want him to be. I don't know that
Speaker 3: he has a skill set at this point that it's
Speaker 3: like he needs to play here, he needs to play there.
Speaker 3: He's just an athlete. Stick him somewhere and let him
Speaker 3: learn the position.
Speaker 1: In mobile he played, they had him doing one on
Speaker 1: ones against tight ends for a lot of the week
Speaker 1: and he did a really good job. Like I think
Speaker 1: he was one of the better safeties in respects of,
Speaker 1: you know, covering some of those tight ends down there
Speaker 1: at the Senior Bowl. So definitely a guy on my
Speaker 1: list as well. All Right, we're going to get into
Speaker 1: all your lovely calls and emails here. We've got tons
Speaker 1: of emails rolling in alex So as you can expect,
Speaker 1: you know, eight days before the draft. You know the
Speaker 1: people you want to be heard from. But before we do, wait,
Speaker 1: we we more position.
Speaker 3: You almost stuck down by me. Yes, give me one kicker.
Speaker 3: Give name a kicker in the draft.
Speaker 1: Ryan Fitzgerald.
Speaker 3: All right, why Ryan Fitzgerald flories state why big Leg Okay.
Speaker 1: Can hit from fifty plus? Made a fifty nine yarder
Speaker 1: against Georgia Tech.
Speaker 3: I heard.
Speaker 1: I read that on NFL dot Com.
Speaker 3: Yeah I did. I think that was an islands.
Speaker 1: Yeah, big leg cut it through the Foxborough winters, got
Speaker 1: good ballflight, you know, the ballflies high, which is what
Speaker 1: Jeremy Springer was talking about. I got to cut it
Speaker 1: through the wind in the air here in Foxborough. Ryan Fitzgerald,
Speaker 1: I still like Sauls. I think they're gonna take Borgallis is.
Speaker 1: The other thing Springer talked about a.
Speaker 3: Lot was consistency. So Sauls had a really good twenty
Speaker 3: twenty two. He had an excellent twenty twenty four. He
Speaker 3: kind of slipped in twenty twenty three. He took a
Speaker 3: step back. He didn't have a good year. Borgallis has
Speaker 3: been steady all four years, has been a starter at Miami.
Speaker 3: I think that's what they're gonna value more than the
Speaker 3: bad weather.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Fitzgerald, at least from what I read, again, did
Speaker 1: not do any homework on the Kickers, besides reading NFL
Speaker 1: dot COM's scotting report. Yeah, like forty to forty nine
Speaker 1: range is a little iffy for him, but he's like
Speaker 1: money from inside forty and then he's got the big
Speaker 1: leg to kick fifty plus, but those like intermediate kicks
Speaker 1: were a little bit of a up and down roller
Speaker 1: coaster for him, And I feel like that might take
Speaker 1: them off the board, you know, that might put them
Speaker 1: in a different category.
Speaker 3: So then the guy you're probably looking at, if you
Speaker 3: value that, is Tyler Loop from Arizona. Loop seven of
Speaker 3: eight from forty to forty nine last year, but also
Speaker 3: was six of nine from fifty plus, including Evan a
Speaker 3: sixty two yard sixty two.
Speaker 1: Get the all right, you good? Now at your.
Speaker 3: Kickers, there's like just numbers wise forget talent. There's not
Speaker 3: a lot of kickers in this draft.
Speaker 1: No, no, but it's but there's in like there's some
Speaker 1: draftable kickers. Yeah, I just named the couple.
Speaker 3: Pork also get drafted. I think fitzals and Fitzgerald might
Speaker 3: be Yeah, Loop, we'll see.
Speaker 1: Patriots Catch twenty two is sponsored by Massachusetts two fifty campaign,
Speaker 1: commemorating a history of possibility, Plan your revolutionary weekend at
Speaker 1: Massachusetts two fifty dot org and easy to drink, easy
Speaker 1: to enjoy. But like the official beer sponsor of the
Speaker 1: New England Patriots. All right, let's get to your phones.
Speaker 1: Into your emails. Thank you so much for waiting on
Speaker 1: the line. I know you guys have been waiting for
Speaker 1: a while. Patty is an aguam. What's up, Patty?
Speaker 5: What is going on?
Speaker 3: Jon?
Speaker 6: How we doing doing great today?
Speaker 2: Man?
Speaker 6: Eight days to the draft. I just wanted to express
Speaker 6: one of the things that's been Somebody brought this up
Speaker 6: and I can't remember who brought it up, but like
Speaker 6: the facts are not the fact, but like the hypothetical,
Speaker 6: if we were to pick genty at number four, what
Speaker 6: are the odds that, like he signs a second contract?
Speaker 6: And just let me rank here for a minute. Alex,
Speaker 6: I'm in agreement with you because I think you were
Speaker 6: one of the first two people to bring up I mean,
Speaker 6: our first three round guys. You know, they they have
Speaker 6: to contribute, they have to play, they have to contribute,
Speaker 6: maybe not even start. But to me, the bigger picture
Speaker 6: thing with this draft, because it doesn't look like it's
Speaker 6: gonna happen with what's the last year's draft, is I
Speaker 6: want all three of those picks, all four of those picks,
Speaker 6: I'm sorry, in the first three rounds to be able.
Speaker 6: I want guys that are going to sign second contracts
Speaker 6: because how long did we go without signing a first
Speaker 6: or second round guy over the last ten years? I
Speaker 6: think Duggar was like the last one last year, right,
Speaker 6: And I don't even know the answer to the question.
Speaker 3: I remember looking it up.
Speaker 2: It it was.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it'd been like five or six years.
Speaker 6: And I think, I mean, anyway, not only do they
Speaker 6: need to hit, they need they need guys that they're
Speaker 6: going to sign second contracts and be part of this
Speaker 6: nucleus in this in this rable era. That's all I got,
Speaker 6: That's all I had to get off my JAD. But
Speaker 6: I'll tell you guys next week next week with my
Speaker 6: predictive picks.
Speaker 1: Awesome, love it, Pattie, Thanks for the call. It was
Speaker 1: a while that in between guys. It was like Dante
Speaker 1: high Tower was like the last one for like a
Speaker 1: really long time in between guys that they drafted in
Speaker 1: the first round and signed the second contracts. I think
Speaker 1: Juwan Bentley might have ended the run technically for overall
Speaker 1: draft picks yeah, which.
Speaker 3: Is uh, yeah, I've never and Jennings knows and Jennings
Speaker 3: for top one hundred picks before them, it was if
Speaker 3: you don't count, if you don't count, Joe Toney's franchise
Speaker 3: tag it was Oh, that's right, it was Logan Ryan
Speaker 3: and Deron Harmon. Yeah, so they had a get there.
Speaker 3: As for Genty in a second contract, I mean it's
Speaker 3: a fair question. It's obviously a position where durability is
Speaker 3: more more of a question than usual gent you're not
Speaker 3: drafting gent d. I don't want to say you're not
Speaker 3: drafting Genty with a long term outlook. I don't want
Speaker 3: to say this, like I think one of the big
Speaker 3: boosts for drafting Genty if you're drafted, the part of
Speaker 3: the conviction for drafting him. He's an immediate chart shot
Speaker 3: in the arm of the offense. This is not a
Speaker 3: guy that needs to develop. This is not a guy
Speaker 3: that needs to grow. He's going to step on the field.
Speaker 3: Does he have just all things, even Evan, Yeah, he has.
Speaker 3: He has a quicker path to make an impact. He's
Speaker 3: a better chance to make a massive impact more than
Speaker 3: any other player they'd take it for.
Speaker 1: Yeah, if you know, Travis Hunter and Abdol Carter aren't there.
Speaker 1: I think that what you're trying to say with Gendi
Speaker 1: to me at least, is like you just inherently expect
Speaker 1: running back to have a little bit of a shorter
Speaker 1: shelf life. Yeah, and I think his career, I've said
Speaker 1: this in the past, I think would probably mirror something
Speaker 1: like Zeke Elliott's career, where the rookie contract is phenomenal,
Speaker 1: Like he's like an All Pro player every single year
Speaker 1: of his rookie contract, but then once you get into
Speaker 1: the second contract, you're five year six, year seven, you
Speaker 1: just see a precipitous drop off like you did with Zeke.
Speaker 1: I think it's similar because Zeke also carried the ball
Speaker 1: out at Ohio State and was like a featured back
Speaker 1: at Ohio State, and then he came into the NFL
Speaker 1: and was the best player from his rookie class. Is
Speaker 1: his rookie year, I would say, and was awesome for Dallas,
Speaker 1: Like Dallas was a wagon that year and had him
Speaker 1: in the playoffs.
Speaker 3: I just think if you're drafting genty, part of the
Speaker 3: reason you're drafting him is to get the offense going
Speaker 3: as quick as possible.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's probably so you think the Dallas was probably
Speaker 1: you know, they didn't know that Dak was going to hit,
Speaker 1: but they had a similar kind of plan for sure
Speaker 1: with the Cowboys. All Right, Todd is in North Carolina.
Speaker 1: What's up, Todd, Todday, Todd?
Speaker 3: What you got.
Speaker 1: Three?
Speaker 3: Two one?
Speaker 1: All right, Todd? We had you on hold for a while.
Speaker 1: Give us a call back if you want. Randy's in Providence.
Speaker 1: What's up, Randy?
Speaker 5: Hey, how's it going? Guys? I had a quick draft
Speaker 5: question for you and a couple of names I wanted
Speaker 5: to throw at you, but I first Alex had been
Speaker 5: talking about working at the stadium to open the program,
Speaker 5: and I wanted to share a quick story, if you
Speaker 5: don't mind, when I worked there in the warehouse in
Speaker 5: like two thousand and five and two thousand and six,
Speaker 5: that was the year Teddy Brushy was coming back. And
Speaker 5: the warehouse they like stock up concession stands and food
Speaker 5: locations and stuff. And back then, the security CSC guys
Speaker 5: had like a food rum right by the mouth of
Speaker 5: the tunnel, and I was stalking that up when Teddy
Speaker 5: Brushy came out onto the field. And I mean he
Speaker 5: was at the podium all the time. He tea him
Speaker 5: on TV, and he looked like a totally regular dude.
Speaker 5: You know, he looked like someone's dad. He's very conservative,
Speaker 5: mild mannered, et cetera. But I remember watching him run
Speaker 5: past me, and he just looked like a madman. His
Speaker 5: eyes were so intense it was it blew my mind
Speaker 5: that it was the same guy that I had seen
Speaker 5: on TV. So I don't know, I thought it was
Speaker 5: a fun story to share with you. But the Travis Hunter,
Speaker 5: he came out with the CBS basically saying like I think,
Speaker 5: directly saying, if he wasn't allowed to play full time
Speaker 5: both sides of the ball, he would essentially retire. And
Speaker 5: I wonder how you guys think that's going to affect
Speaker 5: his stock, not just with us, but just like with
Speaker 5: the rest of the league, and not even just in
Speaker 5: that he wants to play both sides of the ball
Speaker 5: full time, but the idea that he can come in
Speaker 5: making such a demand might offset some coaches or ruffle
Speaker 5: some feathers and so puts. And then the couple names
Speaker 5: that after he guys is uh, I don't think I
Speaker 5: heard you mentioned either Omar Norman Law or J. J.
Speaker 5: Pagays good penetrating tackles. And then one guy on offense.
Speaker 5: Have you guys seen any lamb laris and tape? The
Speaker 5: guy is it's it's wild stuff. I mean, one hand
Speaker 5: to catch it as well. He's breaking tackles, hurtling players
Speaker 5: left and right. It's really entertaining, highlight, real stuff to watch.
Speaker 1: So thanks, thanks for the caller. Any good call to
Speaker 1: the first point? Uh what was the first place? Travis
Speaker 1: Hunter saying Travis Hunter, Yeah, that's what I want. Yeah.
Speaker 3: So for he didn't say he'd retire if he couldn't
Speaker 3: play both ways full time. The full time was not
Speaker 3: a part of that.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Also, go ahead, dude, like, don't play football. I I
Speaker 3: don't think it's gonna impact it that much.
Speaker 1: I don't think it impacts it at all.
Speaker 3: No, he he wasn't talking about playing full time. And
Speaker 3: I do think he'll play whatever, and he's gonna play
Speaker 3: wide receiver primarily. I think wherever he ends up, I
Speaker 3: do think he'll still mix in a little bit on defense.
Speaker 3: And I again i'd call his block right, say you know,
Speaker 3: all right, finding go cover kicks. You want to be
Speaker 3: on the football field, so bad, go cover kicks.
Speaker 1: I don't think it's gonna matter one. No, I think
Speaker 1: that this kind of stuff never really truly matters to
Speaker 1: prospects status. I mean, he's obviously extremely unique in terms
Speaker 1: of what he can do, but I think he's going
Speaker 1: to be a Cleveland Brown, And I don't think there's
Speaker 1: really much that he could say outside of like pulling
Speaker 1: like an Eli Manning and saying I refuse to play
Speaker 1: for the Cleveland Browns. Right, that would stop him from
Speaker 1: being a Cleveland Brown. So I don't necessarily look too
Speaker 1: much into any of that kind of stuff. And I
Speaker 1: am with you, it's not necessarily that he's saying that
Speaker 1: he has to play one hundred percent of the snaps
Speaker 1: on both sides of the football. He just wants the
Speaker 1: opportunity to potentially play both sides. And I keep mentioning
Speaker 1: it because he was with us yesterday. But you know,
Speaker 1: Marcus Jones has played both sides of the ball. Obviously
Speaker 1: not at a high clip on offense, but he technically
Speaker 1: has played both sides of the ball. So I don't
Speaker 1: think it's going to be too hard for a team
Speaker 1: to pease Travis hunt Her in that respect. You'll get
Speaker 1: them snaps on both sides of the football eventually. All
Speaker 1: right here he is Eldred's in North Carolina. What's up? Eldred?
Speaker 2: There we go, Hey, fellas, how y'all doing good? I
Speaker 2: got a question, really too okay, uh, every mock draft
Speaker 2: and then some of the chat sports or NFL Rush
Speaker 2: Patriots or whatever you know podcast be listening to why
Speaker 2: everybody want to keep getting splot receivers when all that
Speaker 2: we got is a bunch of slot receivers, not an X,
Speaker 2: not a true EG. And the stuccest question is what
Speaker 2: round do because I can't finding on PFF. Do they
Speaker 2: got Jordan uh selected to go in and Jalen Smith
Speaker 2: and John Giles if they're coming back or they just
Speaker 2: camp body and I.
Speaker 1: Take it off their Thanks fellas, Thanks Eldrid. I think
Speaker 1: those last two guys that you mentioned they were on
Speaker 1: the Patriots roster are our practice squad, you know, camp
Speaker 1: tryout types. Dante Thornton I think is probably gonna be
Speaker 1: mid day three, you know, fifth or sixth round up there.
Speaker 1: He is a complete project, Like he doesn't have very
Speaker 1: many branches to his roundtree. He's got you know, catch
Speaker 1: point issues that he's going to have to work out.
Speaker 1: He is a size speed project. And you know, if
Speaker 1: he goes to a team that knows how to develop receivers,
Speaker 1: like if he goes to Pittsburgh for example, and trades
Speaker 1: a trains underneath dk Metcalf, who is like probably the
Speaker 1: apex of his archetype. Then maybe Dante Thornton can turn
Speaker 1: into something.
Speaker 2: Uh.
Speaker 1: The reason it's a good question about you know, there's
Speaker 1: a lot of conversations about Jalen Knowle or Kyle Williams
Speaker 1: or Luther Burden, you guys that play in the slot
Speaker 1: versus outside. And I would just say, there's not a
Speaker 1: ton of pure x receivers in this draft at the
Speaker 1: top of the draft. But outside of Ted and Jenden Higgins,
Speaker 1: if it's not one of those two guys, maybe Trey Harris,
Speaker 1: you know, would probably be like first, second, third round.
Speaker 3: Uh.
Speaker 1: And so those are the three guys that really that
Speaker 1: I can think of unless you're an a man or
Speaker 1: guy who can play a little bit on the outside
Speaker 1: maybe full time and you know, obviously like Day three guys.
Speaker 1: But that's what I think. The enticing guys is the
Speaker 1: point I'm trying to make. You know, Noel Williams, Burden,
Speaker 1: like Buka, Matthew Golden, even like those guys are more
Speaker 1: move you know, Z flanker type of receivers uh than
Speaker 1: the pure x guys. And that's just the type of people,
Speaker 1: you know, the type of receiver that people are looking for.
Speaker 3: Well, I would also push back on the idea that
Speaker 3: all the Patriots have are slot guys. I don't think
Speaker 3: that's at least not proven. Uh, you know I, Pop
Speaker 3: Douglas is not. You gotta we gotta go back to
Speaker 3: that McDaniels offense. That's the other reason we're talking so
Speaker 3: much about the slot. This is not an offensive passing
Speaker 3: game that runs through the X receiver. It's an offense
Speaker 3: that runs through the slot receiver in the tight end.
Speaker 3: So Pop Douglas is a good player. Like I have
Speaker 3: nothing against Pop Douglas. He's not a Josh McDaniel slot player.
Speaker 3: He's gonna be more in that Chris Hogan role. He's
Speaker 3: gonna line up in the slot, but he's gonna go
Speaker 3: more vertical. He's not a chain mover. He's not a
Speaker 3: guy you can throw the ball two one hundred twenty
Speaker 3: times a season. He's just not built for that. Jalen
Speaker 3: Polk is more that prototype. But is he a guy
Speaker 3: that you're comfortable putting into that spot without any real
Speaker 3: competition this year? After that, Baker's gonna play primarily on
Speaker 3: the outside. Booty is a z outside guy. I think
Speaker 3: Bourne is a true Z. Maybe you're gonna play Steph
Speaker 3: Diggs in the slot, but I guess I should have
Speaker 3: included him in there. If they're comfortable with Diggs is
Speaker 3: that guy. I don't know that that's the best uses
Speaker 3: of him, though I want him as the Z. To me,
Speaker 3: ideally it's Diggs. Digs is the full time Z. Pop
Speaker 3: Douglas is kind of your fourth receiver, your big play.
Speaker 3: You know he's not gonna play a lot. When he's
Speaker 3: on the field, he makes an impact. He's Dan Avindla, right,
Speaker 3: And then you gotta get at an X in a slot.
Speaker 3: And I don't even know that they need. Like, if
Speaker 3: they want to throw Booty out there at the X, fine,
Speaker 3: if they get a really good slot receiver, I think
Speaker 3: that would work. Or you have Booty and Born and
Speaker 3: Baker all compete, what have you? Like, I do think
Speaker 3: slot's a need because this is a slot heavy offense.
Speaker 3: They don't have anybody proven there. Pop Douglas to me
Speaker 3: is a proven player, but he's not a guy you
Speaker 3: can put in that role in this offense for what
Speaker 3: that players asked to do well.
Speaker 1: So the question is really and coming off the injury
Speaker 1: is with Diggs, it's his dig's going to be able
Speaker 1: to be a high volume receiver next year. Because if
Speaker 1: he's a high volume receiver next year, then he is
Speaker 1: the Z receiver in this offense that gets fed to targets.
Speaker 1: That's the Edelman Welker, you know, Dion Branch, Troy Brown
Speaker 1: type of receiver in this offense. Like he's the chain mover,
Speaker 1: he's the engine of the offense. My big question with
Speaker 1: McDaniels just in general, you know, and we get to
Speaker 1: talk to him a little bit more like his offense
Speaker 1: is historically now not so much the Raiders because they
Speaker 1: ended up getting DeVante Adams and they kind of pivoted
Speaker 1: away from this, But historically speaking in New England, they've
Speaker 1: had a sacrificial X receiver whose job is literally just
Speaker 1: to draw coverage away from where they're actually trying to
Speaker 1: throw the football. So is he always going to have
Speaker 1: an X receiver that's just doing wind sprints on the
Speaker 1: outside and occasionally if he gets behind the defense he'll
Speaker 1: see targets. Or are they going to try to revamp
Speaker 1: the offense around a X receiver that is the high
Speaker 1: volume guy in the offense. You know, they did it
Speaker 1: in Vegas, DeVante Adams. They obviously did it here with
Speaker 1: Randy Moss, but that's DeVante Adams and Randy.
Speaker 3: Moss and even those two guys. Even those two guys,
Speaker 3: Moss was here with Welker. Yeah, Moss wasn't catching a
Speaker 3: hundred passes, right, Welker was to a lesser extent in Vegas.
Speaker 3: Kobe Myers, yeah, was in that role. So you need
Speaker 3: a guy in the slot that you're comfortable targeting one
Speaker 3: hundred to one hundred and twenty times in the season.
Speaker 3: It's that guy on this roster right now. I don't
Speaker 3: think so.
Speaker 1: So you don't think it's Steph Diggs because I think
Speaker 1: it might be.
Speaker 3: He probably is the best shot. Yeah, I wonder with
Speaker 3: the injury, if that's how they want to use him.
Speaker 3: You also don't have him at the beginning of the year,
Speaker 3: like you don't know where he's at. Fair Enough, he
Speaker 3: is the best shot, But I don't feel great about
Speaker 3: Pulp being that guy. I like again, I like Pop
Speaker 3: as a player. That's not his role, that's not where
Speaker 3: he's going to be at his best. Maybe who else
Speaker 3: is even really in contention, like has the skill set
Speaker 3: for that?
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's their vision for Diggs, assuming that
Speaker 1: he's healthy, is to really be the chain mover and
Speaker 1: be the engine of the offense.
Speaker 3: And I want to see him in was in in
Speaker 3: twenty one before he got sick, like Peek Bourne in
Speaker 3: twenty one.
Speaker 1: That's a I mean it's adjacent like where.
Speaker 3: It's adjacent, but he was he was playing off of myrons.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but Bourne was like in a catch and run role,
Speaker 1: you know, like I think Diggs is a true like
Speaker 1: it's thirty eight, I'm gonna get you nine ten eleves.
Speaker 3: Yeah, but I don't have a problem with that being
Speaker 3: part of diggs role. I want to see him at
Speaker 3: all three levels. I think he can still make plays
Speaker 3: at all three levels. So I'm talking about the guy
Speaker 3: that you're gonna have go, you know, run return route
Speaker 3: at the sticks. Yeah, and that's what he's doing. He's
Speaker 3: gonna do really well and he's gonna pick up yards
Speaker 3: after the catch. But that's like his assignment. I want
Speaker 3: that can be part of what Diggs does, and he
Speaker 3: can function in this role at times, but I want
Speaker 3: him doing more than that.
Speaker 1: So I agree, I could see that. I think that
Speaker 1: the role you know that you're probably talking about they're
Speaker 1: probably envisioning for pop Like I think Douglas is going
Speaker 1: to be, you know, to peer like number three inside
Speaker 1: of Haas that's running the juke series and things like that.
Speaker 1: You know, Diggs is probably gonna be running the seams
Speaker 1: or whatever. You know, I I could see that. I
Speaker 1: think that, you know, when you look at the McDaniels
Speaker 1: offense and the receivers that typically you know, have played
Speaker 1: the X in his offense, Like I think Trey Harris
Speaker 1: from Ole Miss is exactly the type of X receiver
Speaker 1: that they would target. That is a that he is
Speaker 1: a sacrificial act?
Speaker 3: Was he the one you compared to Lafel? Yeah, well
Speaker 3: you can do a little more than that, like sacrificial
Speaker 3: get no offense because you know, I like this players
Speaker 3: jimir Berg or.
Speaker 1: De mere Bird and Nelson or like extreme examples of
Speaker 1: what I'm talking about. But yeah, like that's the role.
Speaker 1: But that made some plays though, Yeah, and I think
Speaker 1: Trey Harris would make some play, you know, like I
Speaker 1: I think.
Speaker 3: That that's but you need to take that guy in
Speaker 3: the second round.
Speaker 1: No, I think that that's probably someone you take it
Speaker 1: the third round or maybe.
Speaker 3: At one O Sick can Dante Thorton do that.
Speaker 1: Maybe in a couple of years that if he develops.
Speaker 1: You know, Dante Thornton is a is a one trick
Speaker 1: pony without very many other tricks.
Speaker 3: When you say sacrificial, I'm thinking just windsprints.
Speaker 1: I think when I say sacrificial, I mean like a
Speaker 1: guy on the outside that again is not Randy Moss,
Speaker 1: Like he's not really dictating coverage plan, but you have
Speaker 1: to at least respect the fact that he's on the field, right,
Speaker 1: Like we're not talking about a complete We're just not
Speaker 1: even gonna worry about this guy being out there. But
Speaker 1: it's not a high volume role, and it's a role
Speaker 1: that is a lot of clear outs, you know, taking
Speaker 1: coverage out of the way, occupying the post safety in
Speaker 1: the middle of the field, like that sort of stuff,
Speaker 1: Like because they're trying to hit you know, different areas,
Speaker 1: you know, between the numbers at the first and second level,
Speaker 1: you know, with tight ends, slot receivers, running backs out
Speaker 1: of the backfield. Uh so you have to have somebody
Speaker 1: that is there to take the top off. But that's
Speaker 1: not necessarily a guy that's gonna see a whole lot
Speaker 1: of targets. I think Trey Harris is probably the best
Speaker 1: in this draft, and you know, the third round range
Speaker 1: as somebody that could purely do that. Now if it
Speaker 1: was me to your point, a little bit like Jalen
Speaker 1: Nole can come in and be like the true slot
Speaker 1: right in this off Yeah, Kyle Williams might be able
Speaker 1: to do that too and play a little bit more
Speaker 1: on the outside and kind of play almost like digs
Speaker 1: where he has like a little bit of inside outside versatility.
Speaker 1: So I just think those guys offer a little bit
Speaker 1: more whereas if you're taking Trey Harris or if you're
Speaker 1: taking a o manor if you're taking even Dante Thornton later,
Speaker 1: like you're taking them to play that role for the
Speaker 1: rest of their career, right like that that's what they're
Speaker 1: gonna I'm going to do.
Speaker 3: Is one most point. At what point you look at
Speaker 3: it and just say that's mac Collins and they don't
Speaker 3: take an X.
Speaker 1: That's kind of where I'm at right Like, it's like,
Speaker 1: would you would you do that when you could have
Speaker 1: Kaishan Boody do that, or you could have MATC Collins
Speaker 1: do that? Like would you really waste a top one
Speaker 1: hundred draft pick on something that Kaishan Boody is is
Speaker 1: capable of doing. You know, every once in a while,
Speaker 1: when Kaishan Boody gets a match up and he has
Speaker 1: a good release, he's going to get a go ball.
Speaker 1: I mean it's like football ash yeah, right, like you
Speaker 1: know that, do you have to use another top one
Speaker 1: hundred pick on a guy that can just is just
Speaker 1: gonna do that?
Speaker 3: I I want them to prioritize the slot. That's what
Speaker 3: I I you need that guy that can and and
Speaker 3: you're right, it's tigging. I I er, it's it's it's nol.
Speaker 3: I even wonder about Kyle Williams in that role a
Speaker 3: little bit, just because like he's not a big guy either.
Speaker 3: He strikes me as more of a ze than like
Speaker 3: a McDaniel's slot. Yeah, yeah, he's just a great are you?
Speaker 3: Are you done with Restreppa?
Speaker 1: Pretty much like if I'm drafting Rostreppa, though I'm drafting
Speaker 1: him like to push or replace Pop Douglas, Like he's
Speaker 1: like the fourth guy in this mix.
Speaker 3: To me, I do very different things yet not really though,
Speaker 3: Like I.
Speaker 1: Think that if you fast right, but they're both in
Speaker 1: my mind guys that they're gonna have running quick hitters,
Speaker 1: like you're gonna have Ristreppa running the juke route. You're
Speaker 1: gonna have Rastrepo, you know, finding soft spots over the
Speaker 1: middle of the field and zone like that would be
Speaker 1: the one thing that I would say he probably is
Speaker 1: better at than Pop, Like Pop doesn't have a great
Speaker 1: feel for zone right now yet, and like kind of
Speaker 1: finding those pockets and making himself available and things like
Speaker 1: that and settling and all that good stuff, Like Rastreppo
Speaker 1: could probably do that a little bit better already. But
Speaker 1: Pop is obviously way more dynamic, you know, as a mover,
Speaker 1: you know, Rostrepo. To me, I still think is is
Speaker 1: a Danny Amandola type, Like I still think that that's
Speaker 1: a decent time.
Speaker 3: I don't think he is the burst for that.
Speaker 1: But I you're saying, yeah, all right, let's get to
Speaker 1: some of these emails. We have a lot of a
Speaker 1: lot of emails rolling in. So, uh, this is an
Speaker 1: interesting question, and I think it's something that we've talked
Speaker 1: about a little bit. But this is Steven from Crown
Speaker 1: Point and he did a lot of homework. I don't know,
Speaker 1: we can't really translate this to Radio Steven, So I apologize,
Speaker 1: but basically his his argument is, you know, Will Campbell
Speaker 1: obviously has a lot of talk about his arm lane
Speaker 1: thirty two and five minutes thirty combine thirty three at
Speaker 1: his pro day, and he mentioned all of the he
Speaker 1: did the homework of all the pass rushers that Will
Speaker 1: Campbell faced and our top one hundred guys that he
Speaker 1: faced in twenty twenty five and wrote down all of
Speaker 1: their their arm lights and basically made the point that
Speaker 1: he's been winning against guys with longer arms than him
Speaker 1: for yeah, three years in the SEC.
Speaker 3: Those guys are going to the league.
Speaker 1: Yeah. So the one guy that I looked at when
Speaker 1: I wrote my film review of Will Campbell, which published
Speaker 1: today on Patriots dot Com, was a Shamar Stewart who
Speaker 1: has over thirty four inch arms.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: And now I'm not the biggest Shamar Stewart fan, so
Speaker 1: maybe it's a little bit. You know, I already kind
Speaker 1: of have some concerns about Stuart as a player, and
Speaker 1: I kind of pumped up Campbell using Stewart as an example.
Speaker 1: But Stewart is a has thirty four inch arms and
Speaker 1: is a bull rusher, Like that's a power, linear, down
Speaker 1: the hill bull rusher with great arm light and great
Speaker 1: raw measurables, and Will Campbell had no problem whatsoever anchoring
Speaker 1: against Jamar Stewart in that game. So I use that
Speaker 1: as an example. You know, it's a great point. It's
Speaker 1: a great point about Will Campbell's arm length and something
Speaker 1: that I feel like we've touched on a little bit.
Speaker 1: This is another question about tackles from Larry, and he
Speaker 1: just wanted us to give like the best case and
Speaker 1: worst case scenario for Will Campbell and armand Membo. Now
Speaker 1: I always put this caveat in there. The worst case
Speaker 1: for any draft prospect is that they stink in their
Speaker 1: out of the league, right, That's the worst case. But
Speaker 1: let's let's talk about, you know, realistic worst cases. And
Speaker 1: I think you know the answer for Will Campbell's obvious
Speaker 1: he's either a best case, great franchise left tackle or
Speaker 1: worst case he's a left guard, starting left guard in
Speaker 1: the NFL. With Membo, I think it's either a franchise
Speaker 1: left tackle or right tackle.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 1: I think that's the one case for the pro Membu
Speaker 1: people that I don't hear enough of pro Membu people make,
Speaker 1: is that worst case scenario. If we're gonna give Will
Speaker 1: Campbell that he's gonna be a good guard no matter what.
Speaker 1: Then why would we not give Membu that he's gonna
Speaker 1: be a good right tackle no matter what?
Speaker 4: Right?
Speaker 1: Like that just stands to reason.
Speaker 3: Because the Patriots don't need a right tackle, and there
Speaker 3: is an argument not to need a left guard immediately.
Speaker 3: But I would I would structure that differently, like who
Speaker 3: has the quicker path to the worst case And I
Speaker 3: think it's Membo. Yeah, that move is so tough, and Campbell, Yeah,
Speaker 3: he doesn't have the longest arms, but they've they're not
Speaker 3: uncharacteristically short, despite what some people think. He's at thirty
Speaker 3: three inches, the same as Rashawan Slater. And mostly he
Speaker 3: doesn't have to learn anything new. He gets to play
Speaker 3: the same position he's played a entire life armand Membu
Speaker 3: is to come in and play a position he's never
Speaker 3: played in his life. Like that's a major variable that
Speaker 3: doesn't get talked about, Like people talk about, oh, well,
Speaker 3: you know it's arm length versus position switch, and they
Speaker 3: just go to arm length because it's physical. But it's like, okay,
Speaker 3: but one guy has gotten here despite that shortcoming the
Speaker 3: other guy, we have no clue what it's going to
Speaker 3: look like yeah, and so there's much more unknown there.
Speaker 1: So the question is is that, yeah, I guess the
Speaker 1: pro membuah thing is okay, Morgan Moses is thirty four
Speaker 1: years old, right, So if we try him at left
Speaker 1: tackle as a rookie and worst case scenario he fails
Speaker 1: at left tackle as a rookie, how long are we
Speaker 1: really expecting Morgan Moses to keep playing? So is there
Speaker 1: a chance that in twenty six armand Membu is just
Speaker 1: our starting right tackle. Now you're back to the driving
Speaker 1: board at left tackle and you have to do that
Speaker 1: whole thing all over again. But you would be in
Speaker 1: the same spot at right tackle too. If Morgan Moses
Speaker 1: this decides, I'm retiring at thirty five years old, like
Speaker 1: you also are going to need a right tackle. So
Speaker 1: in some ways, like again, like we talk about backstops
Speaker 1: with the Campbell being left guard, I don't know our
Speaker 1: guard in general. I don't understand why nobody just says
Speaker 1: the backstop for Membu is right tackle, right.
Speaker 3: It's just it's fair. But again, then the question I
Speaker 3: ask is who is who is more likely to get
Speaker 3: to the worst case, who has a tougher path to
Speaker 3: avoid that worst case.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I would probably say, you know, Membo is is
Speaker 1: probably more likely to play right tackle long term than
Speaker 1: left tackle, just based off of what I see him
Speaker 1: on tape. You know, his body type and his obviously
Speaker 1: his experience on that side.
Speaker 3: So instead of assuming the worst case scenario, yeah, let's
Speaker 3: actually look at which player is a better chance of
Speaker 3: avoiding the worst case scenario. And I think that's Campbell.
Speaker 1: That's a fair point. I just think it's funny how
Speaker 1: like everybody's like asked that question about Membo. It's like,
Speaker 1: it's it's right. The answer is right there. It's just
Speaker 1: a natural position, which is right tackle. All right.
Speaker 3: You could argue his natural positions guards soon he's recruited
Speaker 3: as coming out of high school, he's built more like
Speaker 3: one physically.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but he's so athletic and he's got the lank tackle.
Speaker 1: I don't know why you would move him.
Speaker 3: Inside, because every tackle should always be moved inside to guard.
Speaker 3: We should have no tackles because nobody's good enough at it.
Speaker 1: So two questions from fill in North Carolina that are
Speaker 1: good ones. One shout out to you. I'll get to
Speaker 1: that in a second. But this first question is along
Speaker 1: the same lines of what we're just talking about. We
Speaker 1: brought this up a couple of shows ago about J. C.
Speaker 1: Latham and him trying left tackle as a rookie and
Speaker 1: now they get him back to right tackle, and he
Speaker 1: just asked, you know, what's the difference between Membo and
Speaker 1: J C. Latham. I think there are different types of players.
Speaker 1: Latham's a pham booth player. Latham's a power player. He's
Speaker 1: someone that has got incredible power at the point of
Speaker 1: attack and people moving skill. Membu is a much better
Speaker 1: athlete than JC Latham is, and that gives you a
Speaker 1: little bit more hope about him switching to the left side.
Speaker 1: So that's a short answer there.
Speaker 3: Uh.
Speaker 1: The other question that Phil had or just a guy
Speaker 1: that he is gravitating towards as a sleeper is Isaac Tesla,
Speaker 1: who we got up a couple of shows ago as well.
Speaker 3: There's a slot for you and I.
Speaker 1: I had just watched Tesla semi recently to is it Tesla?
Speaker 1: Tesla like Thatla.
Speaker 3: That's how they was saying that at the combine, you
Speaker 3: don't have to be that ridiculous with.
Speaker 1: Isaac Teslaw sounds funny. It sounds think of like.
Speaker 3: Think like it's like t apostrophe s instead of the
Speaker 3: imagine feels like that.
Speaker 1: What I was impressed by him, uh well, first of all,
Speaker 1: the the athletics, athleticism. His relative athletics score as RAS
Speaker 1: was off the charts, Like really good athlete. Another one
Speaker 1: of these like Day three developmental guys that's got a
Speaker 1: ton of physical talent. But what I was really impressed
Speaker 1: with with him was was how good he is after
Speaker 1: the catch, like on screens and stuff like that, Like
Speaker 1: he's a true catch and run threat. Not in necessarly elusive,
Speaker 1: but he's one of those guys that just h is
Speaker 1: you know, got great contact balance.
Speaker 3: Six four twelve, he gets moving bounce off of Yeah,
Speaker 3: I like his billy tracked the ball to downfield like
Speaker 3: he does a good job with that.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I kind of put him in a similar bucket
Speaker 1: as Thornton Dante Thorton just because they're both like a
Speaker 1: little raw but have great great uh size, speed, weight measurables.
Speaker 3: So I hadn't really thought of this. With the slot.
Speaker 3: We talked about all these guys to play on the
Speaker 3: boundary in college and move inside just slaw heavy heavy,
Speaker 3: heavy slot receiver. Is he a guy that can move
Speaker 3: outside at the NFL.
Speaker 1: Could he be the X potentially, But I like, I
Speaker 1: feel like with him, you know, he's such a ball
Speaker 1: of clay in terms of his technique, like his releases,
Speaker 1: and especially if you're going to play the X and
Speaker 1: play a lot of like backside coverage, you're gonna see
Speaker 1: a lot of press man, so you have to be
Speaker 1: able to release at the line of scrimmage. Like that's
Speaker 1: the number one thing. I know. There's not a lot
Speaker 1: of evidence. It's not that I don't think he could
Speaker 1: do it, more of a projection. Yeah, there's just not
Speaker 1: a lot of it on tape. Yeah, what's a lot
Speaker 1: of what's him of him on tape is screens, seam routes,
Speaker 1: you know, underneath crossers, you know, shallows where he's just
Speaker 1: catching run with the football. But I thought some of
Speaker 1: the screen stuff that he was doing was really impressive.
Speaker 1: Like he's going to be a true gadget player right
Speaker 1: out of the gate. I have a great comp for him,
Speaker 1: But I just feel like that that was interesting. I
Speaker 1: wasn't expecting that. I was expecting a little more craft
Speaker 1: nonetheless explosiveness. He's actually the opposite. He's a rock.
Speaker 3: He's a. He's a boomer He's a boomer bus player.
Speaker 3: He's gonna catch that really short stuff and then the
Speaker 3: go ball.
Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, Curtis in Saint Louis.
Speaker 3: Wait, was there's something else in that email that was it?
Speaker 3: It was?
Speaker 1: Yeah, he's said, because you brought up Tesla. Yeah. Uh,
Speaker 1: Curtison Saint Louis has two questions, uh that are both
Speaker 1: good ones. First one, is there a pick the Patriots
Speaker 1: can make it for that would make you pull your
Speaker 1: hair out or left feeling underwhelmed? He has his, but
Speaker 1: I I'll reveal it after reveal ours.
Speaker 3: Sure, Okay, come on, I know it's it's a weird draft.
Speaker 3: There's a lot of play. Again, there's a lot of
Speaker 3: players that like are fine picks. I can see the path.
Speaker 3: I definitely have my preferences at four. I mean, if
Speaker 3: we want to go nuts, like if they take like
Speaker 3: the second best player to a position, right, So if
Speaker 3: they took like if they took like Kelvin Banks right
Speaker 3: with Will Campbell and in Membo still on the board,
Speaker 3: if they took it's tough to even say a receiver
Speaker 3: because I Matthew Golden, like I wouldn't necessarily be super
Speaker 3: upset if they took him over Ted. I don't know
Speaker 3: I'd love either guy at four, but that would make
Speaker 3: sense if they took like Walter Nolan over over Mason Graham,
Speaker 3: right like, I think it would probably have to be
Speaker 3: something like that. There aren't that many players in this
Speaker 3: draft that is outright hate for them. They're really aren't,
Speaker 3: at least at the top.
Speaker 1: So I feel like I am contractually obligated to say
Speaker 1: Ashton Dante, but I don't think I would be like
Speaker 1: that pulling my hair out. I probably would be underwhelmed
Speaker 1: by them taking Gent because I'd have all the reservations
Speaker 1: about taking a running back that high, but he's so
Speaker 1: talented that I wouldn't be like, what a horrible pick,
Speaker 1: Like it's that that would not make sense, Like that's
Speaker 1: not what you know I know.
Speaker 3: Who would be and no offense to the player is
Speaker 3: more about them. Will Johnson, Yeah, I just don't He's
Speaker 3: a fine player. There's better players on the board, and
Speaker 3: taking a boundary corner that high for the setup they have,
Speaker 3: that would make no sense that I couldn't even think
Speaker 3: of one because he's not even on my radar. For
Speaker 3: the fourth overall pick, Will Johnson would make no sense
Speaker 3: to me.
Speaker 1: So the pick that I would probably uh be pulling
Speaker 1: my I don't think i'd pull my hair out for anybody.
Speaker 1: But the pick that I'd probably feel the most underwhelmed
Speaker 1: by would be Jalen Walker.
Speaker 3: Honestly, like I just I think I'd be more underwhelmed
Speaker 3: by like Mason Graham.
Speaker 1: So his was Mason Graham, Colonel said Mason Graham.
Speaker 4: Uh.
Speaker 1: Maybe it's just the way that I have the like
Speaker 1: the my top ten is set up like I have
Speaker 1: Mason Graham with the higher grade. Like I just think
Speaker 1: Mason Graham is a better player. I don't know. I
Speaker 1: just I don't love the idea of Jalen Walker at four.
Speaker 1: I don't love the idea of Mason Graham at for either,
Speaker 1: And I don't love the idea of gent Like. Those
Speaker 1: are the three guys that if they took it for
Speaker 1: I would be underwhelmed. Would I be cold? Strange? Like
Speaker 1: to bring back what I said earlier, I don't think
Speaker 1: I would have a meltdown on the air about them
Speaker 1: taking any under those players, But I would be.
Speaker 3: Underwhelming, you know what? You know what would it would
Speaker 3: really be for me? It's not even a player. If
Speaker 3: they're so determined to trade down that they trade the
Speaker 3: pick for less than what it's worth just so they
Speaker 3: can trade down, that that would bother me. Be it
Speaker 3: for a couple of reason One, get what it's worth
Speaker 3: to new Ish front office, like don't set the don't
Speaker 3: set the standard that you can be had in the
Speaker 3: trade just to move like, don't don't be that team.
Speaker 3: And that tells me they don't like anybody on the board.
Speaker 3: And whoever they take it nine, they probably don't like
Speaker 3: that much. So it's not me saying don't trade down.
Speaker 3: Let me be clear, if they get like real value,
Speaker 3: do it trade down if you get what the pick's worth.
Speaker 3: If they trade down for if they go from like
Speaker 3: four to nine, four to ten, four to twelve for
Speaker 3: like a third round pick, I'd be pretty disappointed.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a fair point. And I feel like there
Speaker 1: is a lot of people out there that are just
Speaker 1: trade down at all costs, Like even if it's for
Speaker 1: pennies on the dollar. No, just trade down and set
Speaker 1: that precedent. And I'm with you, it's the president's bad.
Speaker 3: And I also get the better player, agreed.
Speaker 1: I don't think that it's that leveled off of a
Speaker 1: top ten. Yeah, that we're really saying that they're all
Speaker 1: the same player. I just think that that's oversimplifying it.
Speaker 1: I do think there's a difference between these players.
Speaker 3: And I think when you look at it for them specifically,
Speaker 3: right Campbell, Membu, Jalen Walker, like how far back are you?
Speaker 2: Like?
Speaker 3: Yeah, all right, Ted McMillan, Mason Graham, Tyler Warren, it
Speaker 3: could work. I think those three it's not a full tier,
Speaker 3: it's like a half tier. So Hunter and Carter or
Speaker 3: tier one. I would say, Walker, Campbell, and Membu are
Speaker 3: Tier two A, and then the rest of those guys
Speaker 3: are to B. So like I if you don't have like, yeah,
Speaker 3: I could be convinced to go to to B, but
Speaker 3: you got to convince me to do it. I don't.
Speaker 3: I'm not just gonna do it to do it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, No, I'm with you. And it's funny because I
Speaker 1: feel like we said that thing about nine and forty yeah,
Speaker 1: and then like everybody ragged on us and said, oh,
Speaker 1: like you wouldn't do that, You're crazy, And then it
Speaker 1: like resurfaced when the Saints with the Derek Carr news
Speaker 1: and how everybody wants this King's ransom and I was like,
Speaker 1: what happened? I thought that nine for forty was that
Speaker 1: was part that was.
Speaker 3: Part of that take was like, if the team's moving
Speaker 3: up to get a quarterback, make them pay the quarterback tax.
Speaker 1: Yeah, one hundred percent. All right, a couple more emails.
Speaker 3: Here, we'll get back on my future pick.
Speaker 1: We get back to the phone calls. I gotta you
Speaker 1: gotta be a little bit greedy. Like I'm not saying
Speaker 1: that you want to be like crazy where you get
Speaker 1: you know, a bunch of hang ups, you know on
Speaker 1: the old phone when you're trying to make the trades.
Speaker 1: But yeah, it's gonna be a little bit greedy with
Speaker 1: some of these, you know, along those same lines. You know,
Speaker 1: just uh, Tom from Jersey was asking if you would
Speaker 1: roll the dice on Will Campbell you know, do you
Speaker 1: because by trading down uh and uh and seeing if
Speaker 1: he makes it to you? And he said, you know
Speaker 1: he's not a guy that he's like running the card
Speaker 1: up for kind of guy, and Uh, I think where
Speaker 1: I've come to, you know, in conclusions, still another show
Speaker 1: this week, And I wrote this on in my thing
Speaker 1: on Patriots dot Com, is do I think that He's
Speaker 1: a perennial future Hall of Fame all pro you know,
Speaker 1: Jonathan Ogden, Orlando Pace, Joe Thomas like level prospect. Uh No,
Speaker 1: But when I look at him, you know, I see
Speaker 1: a lot of Jake Matthews. I've made that comp before.
Speaker 1: I know other people have made the Bernard Raymond comp
Speaker 1: with the Colts and Bernard Raymond the last couple of
Speaker 1: years has been like a top Tennish tackle, a left
Speaker 1: tackle in the NFL. I think, you know, as much
Speaker 1: as uh, you're gonna say, wow, you're saying this as
Speaker 1: corny and cliche as some of that stuff is, Like,
Speaker 1: there's something about Will Campbell that just like his intangibles
Speaker 1: and his character and his demeanor and just his attitude
Speaker 1: and what he's about dog that just kind of tells
Speaker 1: me that, like he's going to break through a ceiling potentially. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And I'm I'm for trading down for at the right price,
Speaker 1: like we were just talking about in a draft like this,
Speaker 1: But I'm not like so gung ho about it that
Speaker 1: I'm willing to lose out on Will Campbell for pennies
Speaker 1: on the dollar. It'd have to be a trade where
Speaker 1: we all see the return and we're like, yeah, like
Speaker 1: they had.
Speaker 3: Again, I go to first round pick, second round pick,
Speaker 3: and then depending how far down you're moving like a
Speaker 3: future top fifty pick, Yeah, somewhere in there. That that's
Speaker 3: where I'm That's where I'm settling. Like I'd obviously start higher,
Speaker 3: but that's that's ultimately I think what would get it done.
Speaker 3: I lets you moving way down like the twenties, but
Speaker 3: how far down can you move? For Campbell, it's tough.
Speaker 3: The thing that would make me nervous is Miami lurking
Speaker 3: at thirteen. I don't think you're necessarily if you're moving
Speaker 3: back beyond thirteen, you're not gonna get them. But I
Speaker 3: also and the Bears at tend to like those are
Speaker 3: teams that it makes a lot of sense for him
Speaker 3: to go to that have ammunition to move up. So
Speaker 3: you may look at it and say, we can go
Speaker 3: back to call it eight with Carolina, right, or I'll
Speaker 3: just do nine because that's what we're doing this week.
Speaker 3: You may look at it and say, okay, there's no
Speaker 3: tackle teams between four and nine. We can move back
Speaker 3: and get them, and now, uh oh, here come the
Speaker 3: Bears up to seven, Here come the Dolphins up to
Speaker 3: eight and now you got jumped. That's what you gotta
Speaker 3: be worried about. When they did the move back for
Speaker 3: Gonzales in twenty three. The thing that they had that
Speaker 3: we didn't know at the time that it's reported, they
Speaker 3: knew two of those teams weren't going to take a corner,
Speaker 3: and they knew Washington really liked Emmanuel Forbes for whatever reason.
Speaker 3: So they they had it. But there was still the
Speaker 3: risk that somebody was gonna move up. Like there's always
Speaker 3: that risk. So that's what I worry about with Campbell.
Speaker 3: I don't think realistically, were you moving down. There's a
Speaker 3: ton of tackle teams there, the Bears and Dolphins, and
Speaker 3: maybe there's some others too that I'm missing, but like,
Speaker 3: there are teams lurking that can move up and jump
Speaker 3: you to take the tackle. That would be the bigger
Speaker 3: concern for me.
Speaker 1: Yeah, So Andrew and DC writes in about Will Campbell too,
Speaker 1: and he just he said that he wasn't impressed with
Speaker 1: him early on in the process. But me, Evan, you know,
Speaker 1: gloating about Will Campbell or whatever I think he said, moting,
Speaker 1: I don't know moning anyways about Will Campbell. He watched
Speaker 1: the tape again and he said that he sees it
Speaker 1: more of a technician now and you know, his pass blocking.
Speaker 1: But the one thing he points out about Campbell that
Speaker 1: he doesn't see is great finishing or raw power to
Speaker 1: his game, and said that he thinks that Membo and
Speaker 1: Banks have that more regularly. And I actually would agree
Speaker 1: with that, Like, I don't think Will Campbell is a
Speaker 1: true stack the pancakes kind of guy. He's more of
Speaker 1: a technician. He's more of a positional run blocker athlete,
Speaker 1: you know, and protection. I would just say that, you know,
Speaker 1: he he just plays a different style than those two guys.
Speaker 1: Those two guys are more you know, road graders. They
Speaker 1: got a bigger size and weight to them as well.
Speaker 1: They're more blocky, you know, wide bodied type of players
Speaker 1: than Will Campbell is. But to me, you know, it's
Speaker 1: pass blocking is the most important thing. Yeah, Like I
Speaker 1: would put pass blocking in as the number one thing
Speaker 1: for my you know, if I'm building a team, my
Speaker 1: left tackle would it would be a very high level
Speaker 1: pass blocker first and foremost. I think protecting the quarterback
Speaker 1: and keeping the integrity of the pocket is the most
Speaker 1: important thing that tackles do at the NFL level. So
Speaker 1: I think he's the best pass protector out of the group,
Speaker 1: and I think he has plenty of like snarl and.
Speaker 3: Toughness to and I was gonna say, let's see what
Speaker 3: he looks like when he comes in after having to
Speaker 3: hear about his freaking arms from form that, yeah, some
Speaker 3: kind of edge he's playing with.
Speaker 1: Don I hear what he's saying. Though, In general, when
Speaker 1: you watch the tape, amongst these three guys, I would
Speaker 1: say Campbell is probably the least in terms, you know,
Speaker 1: in terms of raw power, He's probably third on the list,
Speaker 1: but it's just a difference of what you know you
Speaker 1: want in the player. And again he asks like who
Speaker 1: plays like that at the end of the level. And
Speaker 1: this is this reason is why I keep going back
Speaker 1: to the Jake Matthews comp because I don't think Jake
Speaker 1: Matthews has ever been known for being like a true
Speaker 1: road grader or a true people mover in the run game.
Speaker 1: But he's just a very technically sound, very polished left
Speaker 1: tackle that that doesn't get beat too often. And I
Speaker 1: think that's what Campbell's gonna be. So Andrew, your your
Speaker 1: eye is not totally off. I just I don't know
Speaker 1: if I would prioritize, you know, he says his subject
Speaker 1: line is Campbell isn't violent, you know, And I understand
Speaker 1: that that's that's fun, right, and you can see that
Speaker 1: that's tangible when you watch tape of offensive Linemanaer. Guys,
Speaker 1: that finishes is fun to watch, But I don't know
Speaker 1: if that's necessarily the most important thing when it's all
Speaker 1: said and done. All right, let's get back to the
Speaker 1: phones and I will wrap up the show here. Sean
Speaker 1: is in Vancouver. What's up Sean?
Speaker 7: After pass over?
Speaker 1: Alex and Evan hopefully, thank you sir, you too.
Speaker 4: I have two things.
Speaker 7: One question I have is about a wide receiver who
Speaker 7: was injured, but I've heard that he's good to go
Speaker 7: now as Tory Horton. My concern though, is is this
Speaker 7: frame too small? And then the other question I have
Speaker 7: is is a hypothetical and what you guys would do yourself,
Speaker 7: but what you think the Patriots would do if New
Speaker 7: Orleans decides to make a trade and offer their second
Speaker 7: round pick with the Patriots stay and just turn it
Speaker 7: down and draft well Campbell, like assuming.
Speaker 3: That Carter and.
Speaker 7: Hunter and Hunter are gone, or would they make the
Speaker 7: trade and they you know, and after that, would they
Speaker 7: just keep picked at nine to thirty eight and forty
Speaker 7: stay there or where they move around?
Speaker 5: Right?
Speaker 6: That's it.
Speaker 3: I'll take it off there, thanks j Yeah, I hope
Speaker 3: they'd ask for more in that trade. I think if
Speaker 3: you end up with thirty eight and forty, especially after
Speaker 3: moving back, you're definitely moving up. Should be What's the
Speaker 3: first question? Is Tory Horton's brain too small? Frame frame?
Speaker 1: I heard brain at first too, but I was like,
Speaker 1: he wouldn't say that. I heard that.
Speaker 3: Well, that was like did he did he say spring
Speaker 3: because he had a sprain ankle. You can have a
Speaker 3: size sprain. He plays, he plays bigger than he is,
Speaker 3: and he's got some room to put muscle on. I
Speaker 3: don't think he can play. I'd have him put muscle on.
Speaker 3: I don't think his current frame is where you want
Speaker 3: him to play, but I think his frame you can
Speaker 3: you can change that and get him to where you
Speaker 3: need him to be.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm not totally out on Tory Horren. I don't
Speaker 1: hate him as as somebody that they can pick him
Speaker 1: the fourth or fifth.
Speaker 3: Round on a little bit. There's an AX for you.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't know, I didn't like necessarily, I wasn't
Speaker 1: wowed by I actually watched him against Travis Hunter. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and like most of his yards in that game where
Speaker 1: like shallow crossers. Like so he's another on how much
Speaker 1: twenty three did you? I think this was in twenty
Speaker 1: three fins Travis Hunter. But look at a perfectly capable
Speaker 1: flyer and then like to your point, is a guy
Speaker 1: that was higher on the board, significantly higher or projected
Speaker 1: to be higher and then got injured and and you know,
Speaker 1: if you're looking to try to to try to do
Speaker 1: that thing, you know where you you kind of buy
Speaker 1: low on a player in the draft, and Tory Horton
Speaker 1: is probably that at wide receiver, Like I think he's
Speaker 1: probably the guy to be doing that at wide receiver.
Speaker 1: And the other thing is quickly about the Saints. Nick
Speaker 1: Underhill does a great job covering the Saints. I think
Speaker 1: it's NOLA dot Football is his site, and he does
Speaker 1: a fantastic job. One of the most plugged in guys
Speaker 1: on the Saints. And he's been reporting pretty consistently that
Speaker 1: he doesn't see the Saints drafting Shadoor Sanders, like that
Speaker 1: they're not that's not They're they're not a Shadoor team.
Speaker 3: Well, maybe they want to trade up for Mason Graham.
Speaker 1: Evan I I just would pump the brakes because I
Speaker 1: trust Nick and I trust is reporting with it. I
Speaker 1: would pump the brakes a little bit on the nine
Speaker 1: to four jump for Schador.
Speaker 3: Maybe they want Mason Grimm. I've been saying, I've been
Speaker 3: putting in my mock drafts the Saints taking Mason Graham
Speaker 3: because it's Kellen Moore trying to recreate Jalen Carter and
Speaker 3: Milton Williams with Tyler Bursey and Mason Grim.
Speaker 1: A very very worst version of Milton Williams and trying.
Speaker 3: Trying.
Speaker 1: I think the one thing too, about the quarterback thing.
Speaker 1: Just quickly, all these teams, the Browns, the Giants, maybe Vegas,
Speaker 1: maybe the Jets, maybe the Saints, maybe the Steelers. It's
Speaker 1: like six teams. All of those teams are saying, we'll
Speaker 1: just get the quarterback in the second round. Yeah, not
Speaker 1: all of them can get the quarterback in the second round, right,
Speaker 1: Like someone's gonna have like gonna be lose out on
Speaker 1: the musical chairs if every single team is targeting Jackson
Speaker 1: Dart and Jalen Milroe, and there's five teams that are
Speaker 1: going after two players and three teams are gonna be
Speaker 1: left without it.
Speaker 3: Well, the Raiders will get will happen. So what could
Speaker 3: end up happening is we could see a run on
Speaker 3: quarterbacks late in the first round. Where do you get
Speaker 3: the Browns and these teams trying to trade up from
Speaker 3: the early thirties, and that would impact the Patriots. The
Speaker 3: question is in what way? On one hand, might make
Speaker 3: it more expensive to trade up, because if you're trying
Speaker 3: to move up to get a tackle and these teams
Speaker 3: are trying to move up to get a quarterback, they're
Speaker 3: gonna offer more. And if there's a team in their
Speaker 3: dead set on taking a tackle and you can't jump them,
Speaker 3: that makes it tough. Now, the flip side is if
Speaker 3: maybe those teams aren't set, that's gonna push a tackle
Speaker 3: or a receiver down to thirty eight. So maybe so
Speaker 3: it'll be interesting. But if you need a tackle, you
Speaker 3: need to tackle, it'll be interesting to see how that
Speaker 3: plays out. I think we're gonna see a lot of
Speaker 3: trades in the back half of this first round. I
Speaker 3: don't think you're gonna see a ton at the top
Speaker 3: once we get into the twenties, especially like if the
Speaker 3: Steelers twenty one, right, so if the Steelers take a quarterback, yeah,
Speaker 3: and the Browns and Giants don't, right, well, now here
Speaker 3: cut the Browns and Giants start trying to move up,
Speaker 3: and that's the range you're talking about the Patriots trying
Speaker 3: to trade into for Josh Connerley and maybe Arianta or Yeah.
Speaker 1: It's a great point because I there's a lot of
Speaker 1: reporting out there about this Shador visit to the Giants,
Speaker 1: and there's another thing I want to get to in
Speaker 1: terms of news, but one second on this just there's
Speaker 1: a lot of reporting out there and now it's kind
Speaker 1: of getting walked back about this Chador one last private workout.
Speaker 1: I guess they have a one last private workout with
Speaker 1: the entire top of the quarterback class, like the Giants
Speaker 1: I'm talking about. So they're going to Chadoor today, They're
Speaker 1: going to Jaln Milroe on Friday or maybe it's Thursday, Friday, Saturday,
Speaker 1: and they're going to Tyler Schuck at some point.
Speaker 3: You see that combine throw that went out there from.
Speaker 1: So they're they're doing they were planning on doing this
Speaker 1: with all the quarterbacks. So this is not a unique
Speaker 1: to Chador thing. But some of the reporting out of
Speaker 1: the Shador stuff is that they might actually be looking
Speaker 1: at Shador at the top of the second round, not
Speaker 1: at the top of the first round. So all these teams,
Speaker 1: the Browns, the Giants, uh, those teams that are have
Speaker 1: been whispered to be connected to Shador Sanders might be
Speaker 1: looking at Shador standers at the top of the second round.
Speaker 1: But the problem with that is, I don't think Shador
Speaker 1: Sanders is getting past the Steelers at twenty one. So
Speaker 1: if you don't somehow jump Pittsburgh at twenty one, if
Speaker 1: you're the Browns, are you're the Giants, you're not getting
Speaker 1: Shador in my opinion. So it's just a weird thing.
Speaker 1: Like it's a I don't really like Chador is gonna
Speaker 1: go higher than thirty three or thirty four. I think
Speaker 1: he's not gonna say a round, right, So like at
Speaker 1: some point, you know, the slide's gonna stop, right, And
Speaker 1: I feel like twenty one with Pittsburgh's to stop. So
Speaker 1: that leaves them with you know, Milroe Dart Howard.
Speaker 3: You know that Pittsburgh gets nervous and tries to move
Speaker 3: up in the middle of the first.
Speaker 1: Okay, really quickly. Then we'll take this last call and
Speaker 1: we'll we'll end it. This is a question from Matt
Speaker 1: in the OC on tja Oh. I guess is in
Speaker 1: a contract dispute. I don't guess. You know, this is
Speaker 1: what we're here in reports of this. TJ. Watt is
Speaker 1: in a contract dispute with Pittsburgh. It seems like maybe
Speaker 1: a trade would be in order. Are you in or
Speaker 1: out on TJ Watt?
Speaker 3: I mean, what am I trading? I take the player's
Speaker 3: a hell of a player. Yeah, I don't think he's
Speaker 3: getting moved, but great player.
Speaker 1: Yes, in Yeah, I'd definitely be in. But he's he's
Speaker 1: thirty thirty one years old. Like, I'm not trading in
Speaker 1: the farm for TJ.
Speaker 3: Wait. I guess uh is Palazola right from Pim Pazzolo,
Speaker 3: Steve Palasola round pick set a third round pick?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 3: What could be more poetic than trading the Matthew Judon pick. Now,
Speaker 3: they probably asked for sixty nine and I'd give it
Speaker 3: to them. Yeah, but if you can get a third
Speaker 3: round pick, I might even do like second third pick swap.
Speaker 3: I don't know what their third round pick is in Pittsburgh,
Speaker 3: but thirty eight for what and whatever their third is?
Speaker 1: Can I just why do we have to make it
Speaker 1: so complicated like we do all these trades now where
Speaker 1: it's like every time we talk about trades, and I'm
Speaker 1: not just picking on you, I'm picking on everybody. Every
Speaker 1: time we do these trades. It's gotta be like, well,
Speaker 1: the Ariots get their second round pick, their fifth round pick,
Speaker 1: their seventh round pick twenty twenty nine, and then this
Speaker 1: team gets this pick, and.
Speaker 3: Because that's how these trades happen.
Speaker 1: Like what we just say, like the value is like
Speaker 1: a third round pick, that's it. Can we can we
Speaker 1: just not get all complicated about it?
Speaker 3: Sorry?
Speaker 1: Okay, thank you? Uh what I would probably trade a
Speaker 1: third round pick for TJ. Watt, Yes, but I wouldn't
Speaker 1: give up much more. And I know that sounds crazy,
Speaker 1: but like just the value of the player, the age
Speaker 1: of the contract, like that's the world now.
Speaker 3: So this is so and then this is where that
Speaker 3: kind of well, let's make it complicated comes from. If
Speaker 3: the Steelers are making that trade, they're trying to get
Speaker 3: tools to make sure they can move up if they
Speaker 3: need to. And get your door. Yeah, quarterback, right, thirty
Speaker 3: eight helps them significantly more than sixty nine does. So
Speaker 3: that's where Okay, they're gonna want thirty eight, but you
Speaker 3: don't want to give up that much. Okay, fun, you
Speaker 3: give up thirty eight, but you get that third back.
Speaker 3: Now you pair two of those thirds and move back
Speaker 3: up in the second. You're back where you need to be. Well,
Speaker 3: why wouldn't Pittsburgh just make the trade themselves? Because you're
Speaker 3: helping them out and that's part of the deal. You're
Speaker 3: making it easier for them.
Speaker 1: All right, John is in the high on the highway,
Speaker 1: and so cow John, are you on the ten?
Speaker 6: Like?
Speaker 1: Which highway are we talking about?
Speaker 3: With the LA stuff? Give it a break.
Speaker 7: I'm on the five on.
Speaker 1: The five, Yeah, I was close.
Speaker 8: Hey, what's going on, guys?
Speaker 2: Uh?
Speaker 8: I just got a quick comment about Will Campbell.
Speaker 3: Uh.
Speaker 8: I think that we very well have won a couple
Speaker 8: more games this year, like that Colts game and Miami
Speaker 8: without two, we could have easily been picking seven, eight,
Speaker 8: nine in this draft, and I think we'd be splamming
Speaker 8: our fits against the table hoping Will Campbell fell to
Speaker 8: us there. Yes, So I think that I think that
Speaker 8: now that we're picking four. All these Pats fans are
Speaker 8: turned off by Will Campbell. But you know, I think
Speaker 8: it's gonna be our first pick anyway, with around the
Speaker 8: same talent pool you'd get at seven, eight nine, So
Speaker 8: I think, uh yeah, I thought, yeah.
Speaker 1: John, great call, great way.
Speaker 3: It seems too easy, It seems too good to be true.
Speaker 1: Is that part of the hate for Will Campbell? It's
Speaker 1: just too obvious I've made, I've made. I've said this
Speaker 1: take a million times. I'll say it one more time
Speaker 1: before the end of the draft, and I'm sure at
Speaker 1: least once. But this is one of those drafts where
Speaker 1: there's not a big talent gap. Once you get past
Speaker 1: Travis Hunter and Abdul Carter. There's a little bit of
Speaker 1: a drop off there in town and it kind of
Speaker 1: levels off at the end of the day where the
Speaker 1: player plays left tackle versus running back, versus tight end.
Speaker 1: When you have Hunter Henry on the roster, you are
Speaker 1: going to probably see a lot of teams that try
Speaker 1: to marry up need with best player available, right, They're
Speaker 1: gonna say these guys are our best players available. They're
Speaker 1: all kind of similarly graded. Where are holes and the
Speaker 1: Patriots have a giant void of left tackle. Will Campbell's
Speaker 1: the best left tackle on the board. And that's why
Speaker 1: at this point, I feel like everybody, whether they are
Speaker 1: like us that have been on board pretty much the
Speaker 1: whole time on Will Campbell, or they're now coping and
Speaker 1: just saying it's gonna be Will Campbell. So let's just
Speaker 1: all accept the fact that it's going to be Will Campbell.
Speaker 1: We're all there. We're all there now because every mock
Speaker 1: draft I read now is the Patriots taking Will Campbell.
Speaker 1: We have reached the acceptance stage.
Speaker 3: Finally, of the week the draft used to be two
Speaker 3: weeks earlier. They should like a whole week in here.
Speaker 1: We don't need I have an LA related take, but
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Speaker 1: All right, we'll be back next week next Wednesday for
Speaker 1: our official official Draft preview show because we haven't been
Speaker 1: pre viewing the draft for the last six months, so
Speaker 1: we have to have another show and call it the
Speaker 1: Draft Preview Show. But we'll see you guys next week.
Speaker 3: Hey, this is Fred. Thanks for tuning into the show.
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