1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:02,480 Speaker 1: Hi, this is new due to the virus. I'm recording 2 00:00:02,560 --> 00:00:05,960 Speaker 1: from home, so you may notice a difference in audio quality. 3 00:00:09,560 --> 00:00:13,440 Speaker 1: On this episode of News World, I'm continuing my fascinating 4 00:00:13,440 --> 00:00:18,040 Speaker 1: conversation with Lieutenant General Michael Flynn. In part one, we 5 00:00:18,160 --> 00:00:20,800 Speaker 1: talked about his thirty three years of service in the USR. 6 00:00:21,760 --> 00:00:25,680 Speaker 1: In this episode, his military career takes him to Washington, DC, 7 00:00:26,640 --> 00:00:29,600 Speaker 1: first to the Pentagon, then as the director of the 8 00:00:29,640 --> 00:00:34,000 Speaker 1: Tense Intelligence Agents. In twenty seventeen, he served as National 9 00:00:34,040 --> 00:00:37,640 Speaker 1: Security Adviser to President Donald Trump until he was embroiled 10 00:00:37,640 --> 00:00:41,280 Speaker 1: in Russia Gate. I'm pleased to welcome back my guest, 11 00:00:41,840 --> 00:00:56,520 Speaker 1: General Michael Flynn. This is part two of our interview. Mike, 12 00:00:56,560 --> 00:00:59,360 Speaker 1: You've had a long career in the professional military and 13 00:00:59,360 --> 00:01:01,360 Speaker 1: then you come to Worshington, DC to work at the 14 00:01:01,360 --> 00:01:05,640 Speaker 1: Pentagon under the Obama administration. Was that career change a 15 00:01:05,680 --> 00:01:09,600 Speaker 1: shock or a big difference to you? Yes, it was 16 00:01:09,640 --> 00:01:13,840 Speaker 1: a shock, and the differences were how the military was 17 00:01:14,800 --> 00:01:20,840 Speaker 1: treated from the perspective of understanding what the purpose of 18 00:01:20,840 --> 00:01:24,880 Speaker 1: our military actually is. And I always go back to 19 00:01:25,400 --> 00:01:28,800 Speaker 1: again what I learned from my father. He told me 20 00:01:28,880 --> 00:01:30,679 Speaker 1: one day when I was in the military, goes. You know, 21 00:01:30,720 --> 00:01:34,160 Speaker 1: the military is not a reflection of society anymore, and 22 00:01:34,319 --> 00:01:36,800 Speaker 1: whereas I think in World War Two, in his era, 23 00:01:37,319 --> 00:01:40,200 Speaker 1: it was a reflection of society. Society you really believed 24 00:01:40,560 --> 00:01:43,240 Speaker 1: in serving the military, and if the military went forward, 25 00:01:43,240 --> 00:01:45,800 Speaker 1: the nation went to war. And I just feel like 26 00:01:45,880 --> 00:01:48,680 Speaker 1: there was sort of a thing to experiment with. And 27 00:01:48,720 --> 00:01:51,920 Speaker 1: I think maybe unfair, but that's how I feel, and 28 00:01:51,960 --> 00:01:55,280 Speaker 1: I think I feel that way more so today. So 29 00:01:55,400 --> 00:01:59,520 Speaker 1: all that said, I ended up getting appointed by Barack 30 00:01:59,520 --> 00:02:04,120 Speaker 1: Obama twice and then confirmed by the United States Senate twice. 31 00:02:04,840 --> 00:02:08,760 Speaker 1: And I don't remember anybody saying, well, no, we don't 32 00:02:08,800 --> 00:02:12,359 Speaker 1: want him. I mean twice. So selected by the Department 33 00:02:12,360 --> 00:02:15,320 Speaker 1: of Defense, nominated by the President United States, would be 34 00:02:15,320 --> 00:02:18,360 Speaker 1: Assistant Director of National Intelligence for Partner Engagement, where I 35 00:02:18,400 --> 00:02:22,920 Speaker 1: was responsible really for outreach to the international community and 36 00:02:23,760 --> 00:02:27,760 Speaker 1: to the domestic community, state, local, and tribal. So I 37 00:02:27,800 --> 00:02:30,280 Speaker 1: had a real broad portfolio as the Assistant Director of 38 00:02:30,360 --> 00:02:33,160 Speaker 1: National Intelligence. In that role, that taught me a lot, 39 00:02:33,480 --> 00:02:36,400 Speaker 1: and I spent about the better part of ten to 40 00:02:36,440 --> 00:02:39,600 Speaker 1: twelve months there, and then I moved over to the 41 00:02:39,639 --> 00:02:44,280 Speaker 1: Defense Intelligence Agency, again appointed by Barack Obama. I'm one 42 00:02:44,280 --> 00:02:47,480 Speaker 1: of these guys when I see something that's not right. 43 00:02:47,560 --> 00:02:51,239 Speaker 1: I mean when we were arguing about national intelligence estimates, 44 00:02:51,360 --> 00:02:54,440 Speaker 1: for example, if we have a national intelligence estimate on 45 00:02:54,520 --> 00:02:57,880 Speaker 1: nuclear weapons, if we have a national intelligence estimate on 46 00:02:58,000 --> 00:03:01,240 Speaker 1: chemical biological weapons, or on a piece of geography, like 47 00:03:01,280 --> 00:03:05,240 Speaker 1: a national intelligence estimate on South Asia and India or 48 00:03:05,680 --> 00:03:09,160 Speaker 1: Sub Saharan Africa, where the intelligence community at the national 49 00:03:09,240 --> 00:03:14,080 Speaker 1: level does an estimate, and that estimate then drives policy. 50 00:03:14,600 --> 00:03:20,040 Speaker 1: It drives economic criteria and conditions, It drives military relationships, 51 00:03:20,040 --> 00:03:24,760 Speaker 1: it drives diplomatic relationships, it drives informational relationships. I had 52 00:03:24,800 --> 00:03:27,840 Speaker 1: been deployed in many, many of these places. I'm one 53 00:03:27,840 --> 00:03:31,120 Speaker 1: of these studies of cultures and studies of our threats 54 00:03:31,120 --> 00:03:34,240 Speaker 1: and adversaries, but also our competitors, because that would be 55 00:03:34,280 --> 00:03:36,040 Speaker 1: my job. If I was asked to go do something, 56 00:03:36,040 --> 00:03:38,240 Speaker 1: I would know where to get their information. So I 57 00:03:38,280 --> 00:03:41,960 Speaker 1: saw the Obama administration taking on things that I thought 58 00:03:42,400 --> 00:03:45,640 Speaker 1: were detrimental to our country. They actually I thought that 59 00:03:45,640 --> 00:03:47,680 Speaker 1: they were going to hurt our country. I don't think 60 00:03:47,720 --> 00:03:52,000 Speaker 1: we paid enough attention to the relationships that China, Russia, 61 00:03:52,280 --> 00:03:57,840 Speaker 1: Brazil and South Africa we're having in terms of geostrategic positioning, 62 00:03:57,880 --> 00:04:02,760 Speaker 1: for global finance, and also for geography, and geography matters. 63 00:04:03,360 --> 00:04:05,440 Speaker 1: I think a lot of people don't know that China 64 00:04:05,520 --> 00:04:08,720 Speaker 1: really owns the Panama Canal. We built it, they own it. 65 00:04:08,960 --> 00:04:12,600 Speaker 1: And just one example of trade, if you have to 66 00:04:12,640 --> 00:04:15,320 Speaker 1: go from China to Europe and you have to cut 67 00:04:15,360 --> 00:04:19,600 Speaker 1: over the Arctic Circle, well that's about fifteen thousand kilometers right. Well, 68 00:04:19,600 --> 00:04:22,320 Speaker 1: if you can cut through the Panama Canal, that cuts 69 00:04:22,320 --> 00:04:25,760 Speaker 1: about seven thousand kilometers off of your trade route. That 70 00:04:25,800 --> 00:04:28,479 Speaker 1: matters a lot when you're talking about global trade and 71 00:04:28,600 --> 00:04:31,080 Speaker 1: being able to move goods and services across the globe 72 00:04:31,560 --> 00:04:34,440 Speaker 1: and you can do it faster, right. Trade is really 73 00:04:34,520 --> 00:04:38,919 Speaker 1: what is driving the world. Another area that really I 74 00:04:39,080 --> 00:04:41,200 Speaker 1: became very interested, and part of it was because of 75 00:04:41,240 --> 00:04:45,240 Speaker 1: my time in Afghanistan, was the global drug market and 76 00:04:45,360 --> 00:04:50,400 Speaker 1: the cartels that are wealthier than nation states and the 77 00:04:50,520 --> 00:04:54,440 Speaker 1: kinds of things that they were doing in South America, 78 00:04:54,520 --> 00:04:59,120 Speaker 1: in Afghanistan and Pakistan and the stands north of Afghanistan 79 00:04:59,120 --> 00:05:02,640 Speaker 1: and US Pakistan an example. So there's huge drug producing 80 00:05:02,720 --> 00:05:07,239 Speaker 1: countries and then you have Southeast Asia a drug producing region, 81 00:05:07,600 --> 00:05:10,680 Speaker 1: and you have obviously the Iron Triangle I call it 82 00:05:10,760 --> 00:05:14,160 Speaker 1: of South America, Columbia, Peru, Ecuador, and then you have 83 00:05:14,360 --> 00:05:17,760 Speaker 1: Mexico that's been involved in it for decades. But the 84 00:05:17,839 --> 00:05:21,360 Speaker 1: Mexicans figure they could grow China white heroine in Mexico. 85 00:05:21,839 --> 00:05:24,560 Speaker 1: Why the hell should we buy it from the Chinese. 86 00:05:25,000 --> 00:05:29,480 Speaker 1: There's a drug market that operates within the global trade 87 00:05:29,480 --> 00:05:32,680 Speaker 1: market and that is a massive, massive threat to our 88 00:05:32,720 --> 00:05:36,240 Speaker 1: country in ways that people don't understand. And I could 89 00:05:36,240 --> 00:05:38,800 Speaker 1: tie it to everything from our healthcare system to our 90 00:05:38,880 --> 00:05:41,599 Speaker 1: education system, so all the things that I'm talking about. 91 00:05:42,040 --> 00:05:44,320 Speaker 1: I began to really see that we were moving in 92 00:05:44,320 --> 00:05:48,440 Speaker 1: the wrong direction. And I stated that in different ways, 93 00:05:48,960 --> 00:05:52,400 Speaker 1: but professionally understanding my chain of command and leveraging my 94 00:05:52,480 --> 00:05:55,120 Speaker 1: chain of command and the whole deal with Iran was 95 00:05:55,160 --> 00:05:57,120 Speaker 1: a big deal. That was a huge mistake. I mean 96 00:05:57,839 --> 00:06:00,320 Speaker 1: huge mistake. And I think what Donald Trump has done 97 00:06:00,680 --> 00:06:04,640 Speaker 1: in the Middle East is extraordinary. In three years, He's 98 00:06:04,960 --> 00:06:08,160 Speaker 1: figured out how to solve a three or four decade problem, 99 00:06:08,200 --> 00:06:11,640 Speaker 1: probably longer than that. And Iran was an adversary and 100 00:06:11,680 --> 00:06:14,119 Speaker 1: they are still an adversary. And I really felt, wow, 101 00:06:14,200 --> 00:06:16,760 Speaker 1: this is really not a good thing, not a good step. 102 00:06:17,040 --> 00:06:19,240 Speaker 1: And so again in my military cap at the time, 103 00:06:19,240 --> 00:06:21,640 Speaker 1: I let that be known as well. So I really 104 00:06:21,640 --> 00:06:26,560 Speaker 1: saw trends that we were heading toward that. I'm not 105 00:06:26,560 --> 00:06:28,640 Speaker 1: going to sit in a room and not say something, Right, 106 00:06:28,720 --> 00:06:30,560 Speaker 1: the person that sits in the room who doesn't say anything, 107 00:06:30,839 --> 00:06:32,960 Speaker 1: you know why I invite him into the room. Did 108 00:06:32,960 --> 00:06:37,440 Speaker 1: you start to get real pushback from the Obama White House? Yeah, 109 00:06:37,839 --> 00:06:42,159 Speaker 1: it was really questioning, you know, why was I arguing 110 00:06:42,200 --> 00:06:45,000 Speaker 1: about some national intelligence estament to bring it back to 111 00:06:45,040 --> 00:06:48,760 Speaker 1: that part of the conversation, and also in a public 112 00:06:48,839 --> 00:06:52,640 Speaker 1: hearing the global threat briefing that Intel community gives, which 113 00:06:52,640 --> 00:06:56,320 Speaker 1: is a public threat briefing to the American public. Everybody 114 00:06:56,320 --> 00:06:58,440 Speaker 1: else at the table said al Kaite is on the run, 115 00:06:58,480 --> 00:06:59,760 Speaker 1: and I was like, wow, they're not really on the 116 00:06:59,880 --> 00:07:04,200 Speaker 1: r and they're still growing and they're growing exponentially. That 117 00:07:04,279 --> 00:07:08,159 Speaker 1: was sort of the straw I think where there was then, 118 00:07:08,360 --> 00:07:11,880 Speaker 1: I'm certain some backloom meeting and they said, this guy, 119 00:07:12,480 --> 00:07:15,120 Speaker 1: he's not one of our guys. And that's why I 120 00:07:15,200 --> 00:07:19,520 Speaker 1: was always because the guy you're talking to Newt hasn't 121 00:07:19,600 --> 00:07:22,240 Speaker 1: changed since I was a captain of my football team 122 00:07:22,240 --> 00:07:24,280 Speaker 1: in high school. I mean, I'm the same guy. I 123 00:07:24,360 --> 00:07:28,960 Speaker 1: always sort of talk straight and so how I got 124 00:07:29,000 --> 00:07:32,080 Speaker 1: to where I got twice by Barack Obama, I think 125 00:07:32,120 --> 00:07:34,360 Speaker 1: solely because I had done the things that I had 126 00:07:34,360 --> 00:07:38,440 Speaker 1: done and I really didn't know what was happening. I 127 00:07:38,480 --> 00:07:43,120 Speaker 1: had a great fingertip feel for operational environments and how 128 00:07:43,120 --> 00:07:46,280 Speaker 1: we could connect them to our strategic conditions that we 129 00:07:46,320 --> 00:07:48,960 Speaker 1: needed to set for our country, and I felt that way. 130 00:07:49,040 --> 00:07:52,120 Speaker 1: I had great relationships with senators and members of the 131 00:07:52,160 --> 00:07:54,840 Speaker 1: House at the time. It's really where I met people 132 00:07:54,880 --> 00:07:58,120 Speaker 1: like Devin Junius, who's been a real warrior for our country. 133 00:07:58,480 --> 00:08:00,720 Speaker 1: We established a great relationship and I still had that 134 00:08:00,760 --> 00:08:04,080 Speaker 1: relationship today. I actually had a great relationship with Senator McCain. 135 00:08:04,680 --> 00:08:07,360 Speaker 1: I'm probably one of the only general officers that called 136 00:08:07,400 --> 00:08:09,280 Speaker 1: him grumpy one day because he was grumpy when I 137 00:08:09,320 --> 00:08:11,480 Speaker 1: was invited over to his office to talk to him. 138 00:08:11,520 --> 00:08:13,560 Speaker 1: And he had a great advisor that worked with him, 139 00:08:13,600 --> 00:08:16,040 Speaker 1: who was a former military guy who I knew, and 140 00:08:16,080 --> 00:08:19,000 Speaker 1: we had a great conversation with Senator McCain. May you 141 00:08:19,080 --> 00:08:21,920 Speaker 1: rest in peace and people can see what they say, 142 00:08:22,160 --> 00:08:24,520 Speaker 1: but I think he was a person who served this 143 00:08:24,560 --> 00:08:26,720 Speaker 1: country in an extraordinary way. But I had a good 144 00:08:26,760 --> 00:08:29,000 Speaker 1: relationship with him, and I could talk to him straight, 145 00:08:29,040 --> 00:08:30,520 Speaker 1: and I felt like he would talk to me straight, 146 00:08:30,960 --> 00:08:34,400 Speaker 1: and so those relationships mattered to me. They knew that 147 00:08:34,440 --> 00:08:36,960 Speaker 1: there was tension, not for me, but there was tension 148 00:08:37,000 --> 00:08:40,440 Speaker 1: between what we felt we needed to do to move 149 00:08:40,720 --> 00:08:44,640 Speaker 1: are America first, sort of priorities and I'll use that 150 00:08:44,679 --> 00:08:48,640 Speaker 1: phrase versus where the direction that the Obama administration was 151 00:08:48,679 --> 00:08:52,480 Speaker 1: taking us. I think that led me to where, frankly, 152 00:08:52,480 --> 00:09:10,439 Speaker 1: where I'm at today. Talk to me about sort of 153 00:09:10,440 --> 00:09:14,680 Speaker 1: the direct path between crossing them in the sense that 154 00:09:15,120 --> 00:09:18,400 Speaker 1: I think they expected everybody to be obedient and do 155 00:09:18,480 --> 00:09:22,679 Speaker 1: what they're told, and when you end up then being 156 00:09:22,679 --> 00:09:27,000 Speaker 1: for Trump, they become stunningly vindictive. And it's amazing to me, 157 00:09:27,440 --> 00:09:31,480 Speaker 1: given your background, how they could have targeted you. I mean, 158 00:09:31,480 --> 00:09:33,040 Speaker 1: to what extent do you think that was just, in 159 00:09:33,160 --> 00:09:36,120 Speaker 1: part just a grudge fight from the Paris I don't 160 00:09:36,120 --> 00:09:40,160 Speaker 1: know if you remember a phone call we had, probably 161 00:09:40,200 --> 00:09:44,080 Speaker 1: in twenty sixteen time frame. Early we were connected on 162 00:09:44,120 --> 00:09:46,120 Speaker 1: a phone call, and I think that this is important 163 00:09:46,160 --> 00:09:49,560 Speaker 1: because at the time I just knew what I felt 164 00:09:49,559 --> 00:09:51,439 Speaker 1: about Donald Trump. He's the guy that I met in 165 00:09:51,480 --> 00:09:54,440 Speaker 1: the summer of twenty fifteen and then really got to 166 00:09:54,440 --> 00:09:57,760 Speaker 1: know him. At the time, I was out campaigning for 167 00:09:57,840 --> 00:10:00,839 Speaker 1: Donald Trump, and I used to introduce Donald Trump to 168 00:10:01,000 --> 00:10:04,120 Speaker 1: thousands and thousands of people as the most imperfect guy 169 00:10:04,200 --> 00:10:06,400 Speaker 1: who's going to be the next president of the United States, 170 00:10:07,160 --> 00:10:09,280 Speaker 1: you know, and people would go nuts. They would cheer 171 00:10:09,480 --> 00:10:14,120 Speaker 1: that because the American public, they don't want perfection, they 172 00:10:14,120 --> 00:10:17,560 Speaker 1: want leadership, and they know that leaders are imperfect. And 173 00:10:17,600 --> 00:10:20,600 Speaker 1: that's what I saw it in Donald Trump. And because 174 00:10:20,640 --> 00:10:25,400 Speaker 1: he and I connected and rode on the campaign battlefield together, 175 00:10:26,080 --> 00:10:28,160 Speaker 1: I knew a lot about what was happening. And I 176 00:10:28,240 --> 00:10:31,079 Speaker 1: was witnessing a change in the direction of our country. 177 00:10:31,240 --> 00:10:34,480 Speaker 1: That's where I was coming from. Not that Barack Obama bad, 178 00:10:34,640 --> 00:10:38,360 Speaker 1: you know, Hillary Clinton bad, these irreevil people. I witnessed 179 00:10:38,360 --> 00:10:39,600 Speaker 1: a change in our country. And I had a lot 180 00:10:39,600 --> 00:10:43,240 Speaker 1: of conversations with Donald Trump about that. I was champion 181 00:10:43,800 --> 00:10:47,560 Speaker 1: for him, and I think because when they began to 182 00:10:47,600 --> 00:10:52,160 Speaker 1: realize that my role may have been helping him, and 183 00:10:52,200 --> 00:10:55,960 Speaker 1: I believe it did in that twenty sixteen campaign. When 184 00:10:56,000 --> 00:10:59,680 Speaker 1: they saw that, that's when they said, we cannot allow 185 00:10:59,720 --> 00:11:02,719 Speaker 1: this guy who thinks he's all that do this. I mean, 186 00:11:02,760 --> 00:11:07,760 Speaker 1: they inserted a spy into their early days of the 187 00:11:07,840 --> 00:11:11,439 Speaker 1: post convention, but a spy to spy on me and him, 188 00:11:12,559 --> 00:11:15,360 Speaker 1: and that's all public now. So I think that I 189 00:11:15,480 --> 00:11:18,200 Speaker 1: became a threat. I became a threat because of a 190 00:11:18,280 --> 00:11:21,560 Speaker 1: variety of reasons. One was because Donald Trump. And if 191 00:11:21,559 --> 00:11:23,959 Speaker 1: you looked at the numbers, the numbers that people were 192 00:11:23,960 --> 00:11:26,480 Speaker 1: looking at, they probably were seeing, Jesus guy, Donald Trump 193 00:11:26,640 --> 00:11:29,960 Speaker 1: has a shot, even though the media and Democrats would say, now, 194 00:11:29,960 --> 00:11:32,480 Speaker 1: he didn't have a shot of polls or this. Actually 195 00:11:32,880 --> 00:11:34,920 Speaker 1: we were seeing that Donald Trump had a shot for 196 00:11:34,960 --> 00:11:37,200 Speaker 1: a long time, a real shot, as long as he 197 00:11:37,960 --> 00:11:39,920 Speaker 1: left it all on the field and showed the American 198 00:11:40,040 --> 00:11:42,520 Speaker 1: people that he was for them. I presented a threat 199 00:11:42,640 --> 00:11:44,440 Speaker 1: in that regard. I think the other threat that I 200 00:11:44,480 --> 00:11:47,600 Speaker 1: presented was I knew a lot about some of the 201 00:11:47,720 --> 00:11:51,600 Speaker 1: policy direction and certainly the intelligence community and certainly the 202 00:11:51,640 --> 00:11:55,040 Speaker 1: Department of Defense that I could advise the president on. 203 00:11:55,679 --> 00:11:59,560 Speaker 1: So all of a sudden Trump wins after he appointed 204 00:11:59,559 --> 00:12:02,120 Speaker 1: his chief staff. I'm one of the first two people 205 00:12:02,120 --> 00:12:04,600 Speaker 1: that he appoints on to his new team. In a 206 00:12:04,679 --> 00:12:09,160 Speaker 1: formal way, I'm now the National Security Advisor. When that happened, 207 00:12:09,400 --> 00:12:12,440 Speaker 1: I guarantee that in some back room in Washington, DC, 208 00:12:13,200 --> 00:12:16,240 Speaker 1: a group of people said, there's no way in the 209 00:12:16,280 --> 00:12:17,840 Speaker 1: world that we're going to allow this guy to have 210 00:12:17,920 --> 00:12:22,240 Speaker 1: that role because he could understand what's happening. And so 211 00:12:22,640 --> 00:12:25,160 Speaker 1: I won't get into the details of that new because 212 00:12:25,600 --> 00:12:28,280 Speaker 1: there's more to come on that. I remember seeing you 213 00:12:28,400 --> 00:12:32,280 Speaker 1: during the transition up the Trump Tower, and well, you 214 00:12:32,320 --> 00:12:35,720 Speaker 1: were putting another looking at the whole national security system 215 00:12:35,760 --> 00:12:39,160 Speaker 1: of the country. And I think at the time, I mean, 216 00:12:39,240 --> 00:12:42,480 Speaker 1: I couldn't imagine how much pain you would go through 217 00:12:43,040 --> 00:12:48,880 Speaker 1: and how vicious the attack of you was really almost unimaginable. Yeah, 218 00:12:49,000 --> 00:12:54,079 Speaker 1: the environment was hostile. It was not collegial for transition 219 00:12:54,120 --> 00:12:56,840 Speaker 1: for the United States of America. And I studied our 220 00:12:56,920 --> 00:12:59,520 Speaker 1: National Security Council all the way back to Nation Security 221 00:12:59,559 --> 00:13:05,079 Speaker 1: Act nine. So I studied the different presidencies and the 222 00:13:05,200 --> 00:13:08,880 Speaker 1: national security system or structure that they had around them. 223 00:13:09,160 --> 00:13:11,800 Speaker 1: And of course you have cabinet secretaries and other key 224 00:13:11,840 --> 00:13:14,880 Speaker 1: departments and stuff like that, but the immediate team of 225 00:13:14,920 --> 00:13:18,160 Speaker 1: people that you have to answer a problem. And I 226 00:13:18,200 --> 00:13:22,199 Speaker 1: look at our National Security Council at that time and 227 00:13:22,240 --> 00:13:24,800 Speaker 1: it was like four hundred people. Essentially, it was a 228 00:13:24,880 --> 00:13:27,920 Speaker 1: government within a government. Very dangerous for the United States 229 00:13:27,960 --> 00:13:32,680 Speaker 1: of America in my judgment, and my ultimate goal in 230 00:13:32,760 --> 00:13:36,200 Speaker 1: about six months would be to neck that down to 231 00:13:36,360 --> 00:13:41,359 Speaker 1: probably around seventy five, maybe down as low as fifty. 232 00:13:41,400 --> 00:13:44,240 Speaker 1: At the height of the Soviet Union under Ronald Reagan, 233 00:13:44,679 --> 00:13:47,240 Speaker 1: the Nation Security Council that existed around him, it was 234 00:13:47,280 --> 00:13:50,120 Speaker 1: like forty five people, maybe fifty people that lived and 235 00:13:50,160 --> 00:13:54,079 Speaker 1: breathed on a daily basis. That was restructuring. That must happen. 236 00:13:54,080 --> 00:13:56,960 Speaker 1: It still needs to happen, because what you then have 237 00:13:57,080 --> 00:13:59,080 Speaker 1: is you bring in the best talent that the country 238 00:13:59,160 --> 00:14:02,920 Speaker 1: can have. You surround them in a small team way, trusted, loyal, 239 00:14:03,320 --> 00:14:06,040 Speaker 1: and understand the direction that the President United States is 240 00:14:06,080 --> 00:14:08,239 Speaker 1: going to go. And then when you need an expertise, 241 00:14:08,480 --> 00:14:11,320 Speaker 1: form a team of experts, solve this problem, come back 242 00:14:11,320 --> 00:14:13,679 Speaker 1: to us in thirty days and give us what you 243 00:14:13,720 --> 00:14:18,120 Speaker 1: recommend as a policy action. Literally, the first National Security 244 00:14:18,559 --> 00:14:20,760 Speaker 1: Council meeting that I went into it, I look around 245 00:14:20,760 --> 00:14:22,760 Speaker 1: the room and there was like thirty forty people in 246 00:14:22,800 --> 00:14:24,760 Speaker 1: the room. I walked into the room just to say 247 00:14:25,040 --> 00:14:28,040 Speaker 1: make some opening remarks, where's the Department of Defense? And 248 00:14:28,080 --> 00:14:30,240 Speaker 1: there was somebody that was there from the Department of Defense. 249 00:14:30,280 --> 00:14:32,120 Speaker 1: There was somebody there from the Department of State, but 250 00:14:32,240 --> 00:14:34,120 Speaker 1: most of the people worked to the Nation Security Council. 251 00:14:34,600 --> 00:14:36,600 Speaker 1: Why do we have all these people over here. You 252 00:14:36,680 --> 00:14:39,000 Speaker 1: need to be where you can be most effective, and 253 00:14:39,120 --> 00:14:41,560 Speaker 1: when we need you, we will bring you in. I 254 00:14:41,640 --> 00:14:44,520 Speaker 1: want the best that the country can provide for the 255 00:14:44,560 --> 00:14:46,920 Speaker 1: President of United States in a small shot group of 256 00:14:46,960 --> 00:14:49,840 Speaker 1: a team forty five to fifty people. I mean remember 257 00:14:49,840 --> 00:14:51,800 Speaker 1: at the height of the Cold War, that was about 258 00:14:51,800 --> 00:14:54,400 Speaker 1: the size of the National Security Council. We had five 259 00:14:54,560 --> 00:14:57,800 Speaker 1: hundred thousand troops at that time in Europe alone. Why 260 00:14:57,840 --> 00:14:59,720 Speaker 1: were we able to do that and achieve what we 261 00:14:59,760 --> 00:15:03,200 Speaker 1: could achieve for a president like Ronald Reagan? But I'm 262 00:15:03,240 --> 00:15:06,920 Speaker 1: stepping into admired swamp of four hundred people, and I'm 263 00:15:06,920 --> 00:15:09,560 Speaker 1: wondering where are their loyalties? Who do they actually work for? 264 00:15:09,840 --> 00:15:12,400 Speaker 1: Why are you assigned here? And I didn't want to 265 00:15:12,440 --> 00:15:15,040 Speaker 1: ask those questions. I just wanted to say thank you 266 00:15:15,080 --> 00:15:18,280 Speaker 1: for your service. You are a detail ee from CIA 267 00:15:18,440 --> 00:15:21,440 Speaker 1: or a detail ee from State Department. You can return 268 00:15:21,520 --> 00:15:25,080 Speaker 1: to your home agency and thank you. If their shape 269 00:15:25,120 --> 00:15:29,240 Speaker 1: our nasal security Appress. That was job number one. Because 270 00:15:29,280 --> 00:15:32,080 Speaker 1: the rest of it, then is the reform in terms 271 00:15:32,080 --> 00:15:35,880 Speaker 1: of organizationally and financially and the budgets if you will 272 00:15:36,320 --> 00:15:41,280 Speaker 1: have to be examined, Well, you just described is typical. 273 00:15:41,440 --> 00:15:44,840 Speaker 1: I think of why the reaction to both you and 274 00:15:44,880 --> 00:15:48,640 Speaker 1: Trump was so extraordinary. I mean, you're taking an institution. 275 00:15:49,760 --> 00:15:51,920 Speaker 1: Three hundred and fifty people he would get rid of 276 00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:54,720 Speaker 1: poll see that as a center of their career, a 277 00:15:54,720 --> 00:15:58,520 Speaker 1: center of their power, and you're now immortal threat to them. 278 00:15:58,840 --> 00:16:00,760 Speaker 1: I'm one of these type of people that thinks out loud, 279 00:16:00,760 --> 00:16:02,800 Speaker 1: like I'm doing right now. So I think out loud 280 00:16:02,880 --> 00:16:05,640 Speaker 1: because why, I don't want to waste people's time. I 281 00:16:05,640 --> 00:16:08,480 Speaker 1: don't want to make people wonder what am I thinking? 282 00:16:08,880 --> 00:16:11,960 Speaker 1: In terms of the kinds of things and reforms and 283 00:16:12,400 --> 00:16:15,360 Speaker 1: ways that we must move. We must do this. We 284 00:16:15,480 --> 00:16:19,160 Speaker 1: have to move our country in a direction that it's 285 00:16:19,200 --> 00:16:22,400 Speaker 1: not necessarily going to solve the problem, but it's going 286 00:16:22,440 --> 00:16:25,040 Speaker 1: to manage the problem in a much better way for 287 00:16:25,080 --> 00:16:27,640 Speaker 1: an individual who's the President of the United States, who 288 00:16:27,640 --> 00:16:32,360 Speaker 1: has extraordinary decisions to make on a daily basis. And 289 00:16:32,480 --> 00:16:34,680 Speaker 1: what you need is you need to have a level 290 00:16:34,720 --> 00:16:36,920 Speaker 1: of trust, you need to have a level of expertise, 291 00:16:37,320 --> 00:16:40,400 Speaker 1: and you need to have them available. Now. I learned 292 00:16:40,400 --> 00:16:44,200 Speaker 1: when I went to Washington, DC, versus being in the military. Right, 293 00:16:44,480 --> 00:16:46,720 Speaker 1: when you're in the military organization, you tell the ship 294 00:16:46,800 --> 00:16:49,240 Speaker 1: to turn right, or you tell the army formation to 295 00:16:49,320 --> 00:16:52,760 Speaker 1: move left, they do it. They move and they don't 296 00:16:52,840 --> 00:16:55,800 Speaker 1: question it because they know the planning process that went 297 00:16:55,880 --> 00:17:00,480 Speaker 1: behind that. When you start to deal with the bureaucracy question, 298 00:17:00,720 --> 00:17:02,720 Speaker 1: and instead of moving in the direction that you want 299 00:17:02,760 --> 00:17:05,840 Speaker 1: them to move, like a presidential policy or a presidential director, 300 00:17:06,160 --> 00:17:09,719 Speaker 1: they come back to you with white papers and studies 301 00:17:10,119 --> 00:17:13,440 Speaker 1: from think tanks to tell you why you shouldn't do it. 302 00:17:13,840 --> 00:17:15,720 Speaker 1: And all of a sudden you wake up and as 303 00:17:15,760 --> 00:17:18,920 Speaker 1: the president or the National Security Advisor, and you go, jeez, 304 00:17:18,920 --> 00:17:20,879 Speaker 1: I thought we were already doing that. The President signed 305 00:17:20,880 --> 00:17:24,160 Speaker 1: that order six months ago, and you find no, they're 306 00:17:24,160 --> 00:17:26,680 Speaker 1: still thinking about doing it. They're actually still thinking about 307 00:17:26,680 --> 00:17:29,200 Speaker 1: whether or not they're going to support it. We can't 308 00:17:29,240 --> 00:17:32,320 Speaker 1: function like that. So where it has to start, though, 309 00:17:32,359 --> 00:17:35,520 Speaker 1: I think, is there has to be an example of 310 00:17:35,560 --> 00:17:38,840 Speaker 1: that type of reform at the White House level and 311 00:17:38,920 --> 00:17:42,480 Speaker 1: in the National Security Council. I actually think that President 312 00:17:42,520 --> 00:17:46,200 Speaker 1: Trump what he did with the National Economic Council, which 313 00:17:46,240 --> 00:17:49,160 Speaker 1: is akin to the National Security Council in the White 314 00:17:49,200 --> 00:17:54,040 Speaker 1: House how he formed that himself is why he's achieved 315 00:17:54,359 --> 00:17:59,000 Speaker 1: incredible successes that he achieved for our economy. I wish 316 00:17:59,040 --> 00:18:02,200 Speaker 1: to God that had said after he won, Okay, let's 317 00:18:02,200 --> 00:18:04,199 Speaker 1: give him a shot, see what he can do, and 318 00:18:04,280 --> 00:18:06,040 Speaker 1: allow him to do it, because I actually think that 319 00:18:06,080 --> 00:18:08,159 Speaker 1: our economy would be double where it is today, and 320 00:18:08,200 --> 00:18:11,760 Speaker 1: maybe even more. He's that much of a master. That's 321 00:18:11,760 --> 00:18:14,359 Speaker 1: what he did. He took the National Economic Council in 322 00:18:14,440 --> 00:18:17,480 Speaker 1: his own hands and he drove it personally. He got 323 00:18:17,480 --> 00:18:20,399 Speaker 1: different advisors, and they're good, sharp advisors over time that 324 00:18:20,440 --> 00:18:23,520 Speaker 1: he's had versus the other side the aisle, which is 325 00:18:23,520 --> 00:18:26,680 Speaker 1: sort of the US foreign policy stuff that the National 326 00:18:26,960 --> 00:18:31,440 Speaker 1: Security Council allows itself to sort of look at and examine. 327 00:18:32,080 --> 00:18:34,280 Speaker 1: The reform has got to start at the top. That 328 00:18:34,440 --> 00:18:36,639 Speaker 1: sets the stage, and it gives an example for the 329 00:18:36,760 --> 00:18:40,800 Speaker 1: rest of the government. I will tell the Department of 330 00:18:40,840 --> 00:18:44,920 Speaker 1: the Treasury and Department of Commerce. Trump has leveraged those 331 00:18:45,000 --> 00:18:50,080 Speaker 1: two finer than any other president that I've studied, and 332 00:18:50,119 --> 00:18:53,120 Speaker 1: I've studied I think all of our presidents dating back 333 00:18:53,119 --> 00:18:56,080 Speaker 1: to George Washington, He's been a master at it. I 334 00:18:56,119 --> 00:18:59,560 Speaker 1: think he struggled in the state and the Defensive Department, 335 00:18:59,560 --> 00:19:02,480 Speaker 1: although with Pompey over there, I think that's been a 336 00:19:02,520 --> 00:19:05,680 Speaker 1: good positive leader over there to kind of shape it 337 00:19:05,720 --> 00:19:08,440 Speaker 1: a bit. But the State Department, in the Defense Department, 338 00:19:08,480 --> 00:19:12,600 Speaker 1: they absolutely need to be reformed in ways that make 339 00:19:12,640 --> 00:19:18,200 Speaker 1: them more focused on what their true responsibility is. Former 340 00:19:18,240 --> 00:19:21,240 Speaker 1: Secretary of Defense Bob Gates one said that the Pentagon 341 00:19:21,760 --> 00:19:24,000 Speaker 1: plans for wars, they don't fight wars, and he says, 342 00:19:24,040 --> 00:19:41,919 Speaker 1: and they don't plan wars very well. Given how bold 343 00:19:42,000 --> 00:19:45,600 Speaker 1: you were and how bold Trump was, the skill to 344 00:19:45,640 --> 00:19:48,440 Speaker 1: which I think people were on the left and in 345 00:19:48,520 --> 00:19:52,879 Speaker 1: the professional bureaucracy on a state of struck, to what 346 00:19:53,040 --> 00:19:58,480 Speaker 1: extent do you think they went after you personally because 347 00:19:58,560 --> 00:20:01,080 Speaker 1: you were a direct threat, And to what extent do 348 00:20:01,080 --> 00:20:03,800 Speaker 1: you think they were going after you as a way 349 00:20:03,840 --> 00:20:08,240 Speaker 1: of getting a Trump. Well, we know now from exculpatory 350 00:20:08,320 --> 00:20:10,439 Speaker 1: evidence that it was an effort to get Flynn to 351 00:20:10,440 --> 00:20:15,080 Speaker 1: get Trump. That's a public filing in my case that 352 00:20:15,119 --> 00:20:18,480 Speaker 1: we fought tooth and nail for fighting my own government 353 00:20:18,800 --> 00:20:21,480 Speaker 1: to prove that I got the raw end of the 354 00:20:21,520 --> 00:20:24,800 Speaker 1: stick here. If I was to say something about our 355 00:20:24,880 --> 00:20:29,440 Speaker 1: president that I think is different, I actually think that 356 00:20:30,000 --> 00:20:35,120 Speaker 1: once the election was over in twenty sixteen. I actually 357 00:20:35,160 --> 00:20:38,800 Speaker 1: think that the president felt like, hey, I won, This 358 00:20:38,920 --> 00:20:42,480 Speaker 1: is great, and that's the political process. There was great 359 00:20:42,520 --> 00:20:46,480 Speaker 1: turnout for President Trump. The country came to his aid 360 00:20:46,640 --> 00:20:49,280 Speaker 1: and said, we want something different. We're tired of the 361 00:20:49,280 --> 00:20:52,840 Speaker 1: political class. But it was a war, as you know. 362 00:20:53,560 --> 00:20:56,040 Speaker 1: So he gets elected, he's the winner. He's now starting 363 00:20:56,080 --> 00:20:58,359 Speaker 1: to get all the phone calls from around the world, 364 00:20:58,359 --> 00:21:01,080 Speaker 1: and he's starting to think about, Okay, wow, I wanted 365 00:21:01,160 --> 00:21:04,800 Speaker 1: sinking in. I do think that there was probably a 366 00:21:04,920 --> 00:21:08,159 Speaker 1: moment where he felt like, now that he's won, you know, 367 00:21:08,160 --> 00:21:11,080 Speaker 1: everybody's going to say, great job, Donald, We're gonna be 368 00:21:11,160 --> 00:21:13,320 Speaker 1: right there with you. There's gonna be tension between the 369 00:21:13,320 --> 00:21:16,800 Speaker 1: Democrats and the Republicans like there always has been. But 370 00:21:16,880 --> 00:21:18,920 Speaker 1: we are in a different era new we are moving 371 00:21:18,960 --> 00:21:23,600 Speaker 1: towards something, as Barack Obama said, something fundamentally different. And 372 00:21:23,680 --> 00:21:27,040 Speaker 1: so when he won, there wasn't a decision to say 373 00:21:27,359 --> 00:21:29,479 Speaker 1: we're gonna give you a shot, right, We're gonna give 374 00:21:29,480 --> 00:21:32,959 Speaker 1: you a shot at being president. That lasted about five minutes, 375 00:21:33,480 --> 00:21:35,359 Speaker 1: but I think for a period of time, I believe 376 00:21:35,359 --> 00:21:37,679 Speaker 1: he felt that it was you four for him. I 377 00:21:37,800 --> 00:21:40,719 Speaker 1: know how I felt so, and his family was right 378 00:21:40,760 --> 00:21:45,119 Speaker 1: there with him too, And then the machine started, and 379 00:21:45,200 --> 00:21:48,800 Speaker 1: the machine kicked into high gear. And you know, everybody 380 00:21:48,840 --> 00:21:51,080 Speaker 1: knows the kinds of things that happened right after the election, 381 00:21:51,359 --> 00:21:54,600 Speaker 1: where there was press conferences and statements from the other 382 00:21:54,680 --> 00:21:59,000 Speaker 1: camp that said we're going to resist, and it probably 383 00:21:59,040 --> 00:22:02,480 Speaker 1: started then, But for you personally, know you're in the 384 00:22:02,520 --> 00:22:05,480 Speaker 1: White House, you are the national scruitive measure. When did 385 00:22:05,560 --> 00:22:08,800 Speaker 1: you begin to realize that this was really serious and 386 00:22:08,960 --> 00:22:12,920 Speaker 1: not just something you could shrug off. I realized that prior. 387 00:22:13,000 --> 00:22:17,280 Speaker 1: I realized it really in a deep way during the transition, 388 00:22:19,080 --> 00:22:23,440 Speaker 1: because there's sort of a hostile environment. Who wasn't a 389 00:22:23,440 --> 00:22:26,440 Speaker 1: great job. We want to make sure we turn over 390 00:22:26,560 --> 00:22:30,240 Speaker 1: things to you so the country is able to continue 391 00:22:30,240 --> 00:22:35,040 Speaker 1: to function and operate in an environment globally where there 392 00:22:35,080 --> 00:22:37,600 Speaker 1: are threats, as you know, and I knew it. I 393 00:22:37,600 --> 00:22:39,439 Speaker 1: mean I knew some of these people, knew most of 394 00:22:39,440 --> 00:22:42,920 Speaker 1: them the types of people that they were. But anyway, 395 00:22:43,119 --> 00:22:45,680 Speaker 1: I felt that then, and then of course, going into 396 00:22:45,720 --> 00:22:48,560 Speaker 1: the White House, you want to believe what's best in people, 397 00:22:49,080 --> 00:22:51,960 Speaker 1: and you're working with different organizations, agencies, which I hadn't 398 00:22:52,000 --> 00:22:54,479 Speaker 1: been doing for the second half of my career. And 399 00:22:54,600 --> 00:22:58,120 Speaker 1: you want to trust the senior officials in our government. 400 00:22:58,440 --> 00:23:01,520 Speaker 1: You want to trust them that they're not out to 401 00:23:01,640 --> 00:23:05,200 Speaker 1: ruin the country. As I look back and try to 402 00:23:05,240 --> 00:23:08,360 Speaker 1: answer your question in a sort of a roundabout way, 403 00:23:08,359 --> 00:23:11,359 Speaker 1: because I'm not a vindicted person, I always say new 404 00:23:11,440 --> 00:23:14,240 Speaker 1: that there's anything I'll do, I'll live all the bastards. 405 00:23:14,280 --> 00:23:18,720 Speaker 1: But when senior government officials in our government you serve 406 00:23:19,400 --> 00:23:22,600 Speaker 1: not only an individual, particularly an individual like me and 407 00:23:22,680 --> 00:23:27,560 Speaker 1: a really really important job, but you serve the presidency 408 00:23:27,680 --> 00:23:32,119 Speaker 1: and the country, our constitution. That's very, very dangerous, and 409 00:23:32,160 --> 00:23:36,040 Speaker 1: that's what happened. It was a means to an end, 410 00:23:36,760 --> 00:23:39,639 Speaker 1: and that means to an end we are still living 411 00:23:39,680 --> 00:23:43,800 Speaker 1: today in this disastrous election that we are going through. 412 00:23:44,760 --> 00:23:51,359 Speaker 1: There's this whole new strategy of criminalizing behavior and not 413 00:23:51,480 --> 00:23:55,119 Speaker 1: trying to defeat people, but trying to destroy them. It 414 00:23:55,119 --> 00:23:58,960 Speaker 1: seems that you got caught up the transition moment where 415 00:23:59,440 --> 00:24:02,760 Speaker 1: there weren't rules except to get you. And in fact, 416 00:24:02,760 --> 00:24:06,280 Speaker 1: we now know, because of your courage in refusing to 417 00:24:06,320 --> 00:24:11,040 Speaker 1: give in and your willingness to keep fighting, that people 418 00:24:11,080 --> 00:24:14,480 Speaker 1: were literally explicitly breaking the law to try to go 419 00:24:14,560 --> 00:24:17,640 Speaker 1: after you. And to try to free you. Right, wouldn't 420 00:24:17,640 --> 00:24:22,480 Speaker 1: that have struck you? Was inconceivable back when you in uniform. Absolutely, 421 00:24:22,560 --> 00:24:27,400 Speaker 1: I mean on ten percent. And that's what happened. Through 422 00:24:27,480 --> 00:24:32,720 Speaker 1: my fight. What we were able to expose is really 423 00:24:32,800 --> 00:24:37,760 Speaker 1: the nonsense of the entire Muller investigation. One specific example 424 00:24:38,440 --> 00:24:42,840 Speaker 1: is the interview of one of the senior FBI agents 425 00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:45,359 Speaker 1: who was a very season guy. He was in the 426 00:24:45,400 --> 00:24:47,639 Speaker 1: midst of it during twenty sixteen. He was in the 427 00:24:47,640 --> 00:24:50,800 Speaker 1: middle of it in early in the transition. He was 428 00:24:50,880 --> 00:24:54,720 Speaker 1: part of the Muller team. And he came forward his statement, 429 00:24:54,960 --> 00:24:58,520 Speaker 1: his five or six page statement, which is an extraordinary 430 00:24:58,600 --> 00:25:01,879 Speaker 1: It essentially said, in a very specific way what you 431 00:25:02,040 --> 00:25:07,840 Speaker 1: just described, to criminally go after opponents in politics and 432 00:25:07,960 --> 00:25:12,640 Speaker 1: criminalize anything you can do and destroy them instead of 433 00:25:12,800 --> 00:25:16,760 Speaker 1: fighting them in an American political way. And that's what 434 00:25:16,800 --> 00:25:19,679 Speaker 1: the left does. New that's what the left does. I 435 00:25:19,720 --> 00:25:22,200 Speaker 1: will tell you this because over the last four years 436 00:25:22,200 --> 00:25:24,199 Speaker 1: that I've been dealing with this, people would come to 437 00:25:24,200 --> 00:25:26,240 Speaker 1: me and they would say, hey, Mike Jeeves, were so 438 00:25:26,280 --> 00:25:28,959 Speaker 1: sorry what happened to you? And I look at him 439 00:25:28,960 --> 00:25:30,600 Speaker 1: and I say, don't feel sorry for me, because I 440 00:25:30,600 --> 00:25:33,040 Speaker 1: don't feel sorry for myself. I feel sorry for the 441 00:25:33,080 --> 00:25:37,520 Speaker 1: country because the country was disadvantaged by not having me 442 00:25:37,600 --> 00:25:41,360 Speaker 1: allowed to be President Donald J. Trump's National security advisor. 443 00:25:41,600 --> 00:25:43,919 Speaker 1: But I was not allowed to do that. And what 444 00:25:44,119 --> 00:25:49,840 Speaker 1: happened was the previous administration did something so devious to 445 00:25:49,960 --> 00:25:53,800 Speaker 1: the incoming administration, and we have witnessed it in spades, 446 00:25:54,240 --> 00:25:56,280 Speaker 1: and they're not hiding it anymore. They don't hide it. 447 00:25:56,720 --> 00:26:00,480 Speaker 1: On the battlefield, I would always say to our teams, 448 00:26:01,080 --> 00:26:03,960 Speaker 1: we would get intelligence where the enemy was telling you things. 449 00:26:03,960 --> 00:26:05,919 Speaker 1: They were saying how they were going to operate, or 450 00:26:06,200 --> 00:26:09,639 Speaker 1: they would publish things in the military doctrine. Read the 451 00:26:09,720 --> 00:26:12,359 Speaker 1: damn stuff. Read what they're telling us they are going 452 00:26:12,440 --> 00:26:15,159 Speaker 1: to do, how they are going to operate, and watch 453 00:26:15,240 --> 00:26:18,480 Speaker 1: their behavior, because if they tell you they're going to 454 00:26:18,560 --> 00:26:21,560 Speaker 1: do something, you definitely got to be prepared and planned 455 00:26:21,600 --> 00:26:24,600 Speaker 1: for it. Well, the Left is now in our country. 456 00:26:24,960 --> 00:26:27,480 Speaker 1: They're telling us what they're going to do to the country, 457 00:26:27,800 --> 00:26:29,600 Speaker 1: and so I think that that's something that we just 458 00:26:29,680 --> 00:26:33,399 Speaker 1: all have to be aware of. That to me is 459 00:26:33,600 --> 00:26:36,760 Speaker 1: unimaginable in our country that they would have targeted me 460 00:26:37,160 --> 00:26:41,119 Speaker 1: to destroy me. The attacks that I and my family 461 00:26:41,200 --> 00:26:44,000 Speaker 1: experienced from the media you know, I'm like my mother 462 00:26:44,119 --> 00:26:46,399 Speaker 1: used to say when we would come home from a 463 00:26:46,480 --> 00:26:49,439 Speaker 1: fist fighter or something at school. She would say, sticks 464 00:26:49,440 --> 00:26:51,440 Speaker 1: and stones will break your bones, but names will never 465 00:26:51,520 --> 00:26:54,640 Speaker 1: hurt you, So, you know, go back outside. That's sort 466 00:26:54,640 --> 00:26:57,760 Speaker 1: of my mentality in a funny way. I don't worry 467 00:26:57,800 --> 00:27:00,280 Speaker 1: about what the haters do, because haters hate. And I 468 00:27:00,400 --> 00:27:03,520 Speaker 1: know who I am. I have my faith, I have 469 00:27:03,600 --> 00:27:08,000 Speaker 1: an incredible family and an extended family and a large 470 00:27:08,040 --> 00:27:10,679 Speaker 1: Irish family. And my wife is Portuguese. My wife and 471 00:27:10,720 --> 00:27:14,400 Speaker 1: I we've been together since we were thirteen, so thank 472 00:27:14,440 --> 00:27:17,840 Speaker 1: God because she's been just a rock with me through 473 00:27:17,880 --> 00:27:20,919 Speaker 1: this and through my career too, and we have just 474 00:27:20,960 --> 00:27:24,840 Speaker 1: an extraordinary family. And then I have what I call 475 00:27:24,960 --> 00:27:28,840 Speaker 1: true friends, new true friends, many have been with me 476 00:27:28,880 --> 00:27:31,320 Speaker 1: from the beginning as a child, who I've still stay 477 00:27:31,320 --> 00:27:33,600 Speaker 1: in touch with. And I mentioned early on in the 478 00:27:33,680 --> 00:27:37,840 Speaker 1: conversation about our non commissioned officers the number of sergeants, Majors, 479 00:27:37,840 --> 00:27:42,159 Speaker 1: first sergeants, old two sergeants who know me personally and 480 00:27:42,359 --> 00:27:45,440 Speaker 1: live with me, breathe with me, fought with me. They 481 00:27:45,480 --> 00:27:48,720 Speaker 1: know that's not that's what's being described, so they'd say, hey, Flynn, 482 00:27:48,760 --> 00:27:50,119 Speaker 1: let me know what you want me to do, you know, 483 00:27:50,160 --> 00:27:52,520 Speaker 1: I mean we're here with you. I mean even to 484 00:27:52,600 --> 00:27:54,800 Speaker 1: the point of someone reaching out to me this morning 485 00:27:54,880 --> 00:27:57,040 Speaker 1: just to ask how I'm doing. An old Sartin major 486 00:27:57,080 --> 00:27:59,720 Speaker 1: friend of mine who lives down in Fort Benning, Georgia. 487 00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:03,720 Speaker 1: Those types of people stuck with me, and I cherish 488 00:28:04,000 --> 00:28:07,200 Speaker 1: those true friendships and these tough moments in life where 489 00:28:07,600 --> 00:28:10,320 Speaker 1: E're up against the wall. Like the Afghans I described 490 00:28:10,359 --> 00:28:17,520 Speaker 1: as resilient. I have a resilient fiber in my body mentally, physically, emotionally, 491 00:28:17,600 --> 00:28:21,639 Speaker 1: and spiritually that has allowed me to withstand these body 492 00:28:22,119 --> 00:28:25,520 Speaker 1: blows that I have taken and put me where I'm 493 00:28:25,560 --> 00:28:29,480 Speaker 1: at right now talking to you and feeling like I've 494 00:28:29,520 --> 00:28:34,679 Speaker 1: survived something that no Americans should ever ever have to 495 00:28:34,720 --> 00:28:37,600 Speaker 1: go through again, as long as we can keep the 496 00:28:37,720 --> 00:28:42,120 Speaker 1: constitutional republic that we have. How the American people helped you, Well, 497 00:28:42,160 --> 00:28:45,240 Speaker 1: you had to deal with all the legal battles during 498 00:28:45,240 --> 00:28:48,840 Speaker 1: this entire period new You know, we were struggling financially. 499 00:28:48,880 --> 00:28:50,880 Speaker 1: It's one of the reasons I probably got caught up 500 00:28:50,920 --> 00:28:52,920 Speaker 1: in having to make the decisions I've made. You know, 501 00:28:52,920 --> 00:28:55,440 Speaker 1: I'm a soldier and I come from a lower middle 502 00:28:55,440 --> 00:28:58,480 Speaker 1: class family not looking for people to feel sorry for me. 503 00:28:58,880 --> 00:29:03,880 Speaker 1: So my family and we started to reach out to America, 504 00:29:03,920 --> 00:29:07,680 Speaker 1: and we did it through radio to say, hey, my 505 00:29:07,720 --> 00:29:10,760 Speaker 1: brother needs some help, and we asked America to help me, 506 00:29:11,440 --> 00:29:15,840 Speaker 1: and America came true in spades for me. I never 507 00:29:15,920 --> 00:29:18,720 Speaker 1: had to put a tin cup out, and that speaks 508 00:29:18,920 --> 00:29:24,640 Speaker 1: volumes for the American people's instincts about what is right 509 00:29:24,680 --> 00:29:27,640 Speaker 1: and what is wrong. Tell me about the letters you 510 00:29:27,680 --> 00:29:31,280 Speaker 1: have received from people writing to you to your legal 511 00:29:31,280 --> 00:29:35,560 Speaker 1: defense fund. So what happened was my sister Barbara, we 512 00:29:35,600 --> 00:29:39,160 Speaker 1: created a legal defense fund, and through that legal defense fund, 513 00:29:40,120 --> 00:29:43,480 Speaker 1: I mean thousands and thousands of letters came in to me, 514 00:29:44,240 --> 00:29:48,920 Speaker 1: and so I sat and wrote letters back to all 515 00:29:48,960 --> 00:29:52,640 Speaker 1: those people, every one of them. The letters that I 516 00:29:52,720 --> 00:29:56,000 Speaker 1: get that I have received from the American people is 517 00:29:56,040 --> 00:29:59,560 Speaker 1: a book in itself, because the letters will bring a 518 00:29:59,680 --> 00:30:04,920 Speaker 1: reader two tiers. I have envelopes with sticky notes, five 519 00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:07,400 Speaker 1: or six sticky notes stuck together that they wanted to 520 00:30:07,480 --> 00:30:09,320 Speaker 1: write me a letter, and I guess that's all they had. 521 00:30:09,440 --> 00:30:14,000 Speaker 1: I have beautifully typed written letters of pouring their emotions 522 00:30:14,040 --> 00:30:16,800 Speaker 1: out about what they feel about the country. When I 523 00:30:16,800 --> 00:30:20,000 Speaker 1: first got the first set of letters I was reading 524 00:30:20,080 --> 00:30:21,760 Speaker 1: and I said, oh God, I can't just put these 525 00:30:21,760 --> 00:30:23,760 Speaker 1: in a box. I gotta do something with them. So 526 00:30:23,800 --> 00:30:26,560 Speaker 1: I started writing letters back and I've been doing that 527 00:30:26,640 --> 00:30:31,360 Speaker 1: for four years. Those letters, they represent people from every 528 00:30:31,360 --> 00:30:35,800 Speaker 1: single state. It's extraordinary. It is one of the major 529 00:30:35,880 --> 00:30:40,400 Speaker 1: reasons why I was able to get through this, because 530 00:30:40,480 --> 00:30:43,320 Speaker 1: people around the country reached out to me and said, 531 00:30:44,200 --> 00:30:47,920 Speaker 1: we believe in you. Thank you for serving the country 532 00:30:48,320 --> 00:30:51,400 Speaker 1: both on the military battlefield and in the bureacutic and 533 00:30:51,400 --> 00:30:57,000 Speaker 1: political battlefields. You have shown enormous courage and persistence. I 534 00:30:57,040 --> 00:31:01,360 Speaker 1: appreciate that, Nude I've always believed that you see right 535 00:31:01,520 --> 00:31:04,360 Speaker 1: from wrong, and that for allowing me adopting to tell 536 00:31:04,440 --> 00:31:09,040 Speaker 1: part of the story even while we were developing these interviews. 537 00:31:09,760 --> 00:31:14,560 Speaker 1: Judge Sullivan finally, after all this time, released General Flynn 538 00:31:14,640 --> 00:31:17,840 Speaker 1: from the case, which I believe should never have been brought. 539 00:31:18,640 --> 00:31:21,960 Speaker 1: And I think it's sad that Judge Sullivan could have 540 00:31:21,960 --> 00:31:25,960 Speaker 1: done this at any point, but deliberately waited until after 541 00:31:26,000 --> 00:31:30,280 Speaker 1: the President's partner. In either case. We now know that 542 00:31:30,400 --> 00:31:33,080 Speaker 1: General Flynn should never have been charged, that the case 543 00:31:33,120 --> 00:31:36,440 Speaker 1: had no merit, and that General Flynt can go back 544 00:31:36,760 --> 00:31:42,800 Speaker 1: to serving the American people. Thank you to my guests, 545 00:31:43,040 --> 00:31:46,560 Speaker 1: Lieutenant General Michael Flynn. You can read more about his 546 00:31:46,640 --> 00:31:50,640 Speaker 1: life on our show page at newtsworld dot com. Newts 547 00:31:50,640 --> 00:31:54,760 Speaker 1: World is produced by Gingwish, Sweet sixty and iHeartMedia. Our 548 00:31:54,800 --> 00:31:58,479 Speaker 1: executive producer is Debbie Myers, our producer is Garnsey Slump, 549 00:31:58,960 --> 00:32:02,320 Speaker 1: and our researcher is Rachel Peterson. Your work for the 550 00:32:02,320 --> 00:32:06,120 Speaker 1: show was created by Steve Penley. Special thanks to the 551 00:32:06,160 --> 00:32:09,600 Speaker 1: team at Gingrich three sixty. Please email me with your 552 00:32:09,680 --> 00:32:14,080 Speaker 1: questions at Gingrich three sixty dot com slash questions. I'll 553 00:32:14,120 --> 00:32:18,080 Speaker 1: answer a selection of questions in future episodes. If you've 554 00:32:18,120 --> 00:32:19,880 Speaker 1: been enjoying news World, I hope you will go to 555 00:32:19,960 --> 00:32:23,520 Speaker 1: Apple podcast and both rate us with five starts and 556 00:32:23,640 --> 00:32:26,400 Speaker 1: give us a review so others can learn what it's 557 00:32:26,400 --> 00:32:30,120 Speaker 1: all about. I'm new Gingrich. This is news World.