WEBVTT - I Don't Want to Become the Office Secretary 0:00:03.560 --> 0:00:05.800 My colleagues. We'll start commenting on everything. I get. My 0:00:05.880 --> 0:00:08.400 insist rolls, eyes at people and meeting Why does my 0:00:08.400 --> 0:00:10.879 coworker keep taking credit for all my ideas? Have any 0:00:10.880 --> 0:00:14.040 wisdom for me? Hi, I'm Alison Green. Welcome to the 0:00:14.040 --> 0:00:18.040 Aska Manager Podcast. Right answer questions from listeners about life 0:00:18.120 --> 0:00:20.840 at work. Everything from what to say if you're allergic 0:00:20.880 --> 0:00:23.119 to your coworkers perfume to what to do if you 0:00:23.200 --> 0:00:28.320 drink too much at the company party. Let's get started. Hi, 0:00:28.440 --> 0:00:31.400 and welcome to the show. Today. I have lots of 0:00:31.440 --> 0:00:35.160 interesting questions to answer. The first question today is from 0:00:35.200 --> 0:00:40.080 someone who's worried that she's inadvertently becoming the office secretary, 0:00:40.200 --> 0:00:44.680 even though that's not her job. Hello. I work at 0:00:44.680 --> 0:00:48.199 a larger educational institution and have a job that directly 0:00:48.240 --> 0:00:52.280 served and basis students. I love my job. When I started, 0:00:52.280 --> 0:00:55.240 we had a part time front office person who basically 0:00:55.240 --> 0:00:58.880 managed the office, ordered all the supplies, handled block in traffic, 0:00:58.880 --> 0:01:01.600 et cetera. We had an additional agreement with most of 0:01:01.600 --> 0:01:04.800 our office staff about to beating up the more menial 0:01:04.880 --> 0:01:08.000 task so that one person has never sattled with all 0:01:08.040 --> 0:01:12.000 the dishes cleaning the conference room vacuuming, etcetera. Our front 0:01:12.040 --> 0:01:14.880 office person left in early April of this year, so 0:01:14.880 --> 0:01:18.160 I've been covering this position for almost a year now. 0:01:18.520 --> 0:01:21.200 I normally wouldn't mind, but it's starting to if I 0:01:21.200 --> 0:01:24.000 try to see my job. I took this position thinking 0:01:24.000 --> 0:01:26.759 it was a step up with higher pay, more responsibility 0:01:26.880 --> 0:01:30.520 from a previous front office position I had, and specifically 0:01:30.520 --> 0:01:33.040 took it because I knew I wouldn't be the front 0:01:33.080 --> 0:01:38.520 office person a k secretary. However, the dynamics have changed 0:01:38.880 --> 0:01:41.920 in the absence of a front office person. Menial things 0:01:41.959 --> 0:01:43.920 are starting to take up my time. More and more. 0:01:44.240 --> 0:01:47.520 Coworkers may comments and requested me now that are much different. 0:01:48.240 --> 0:01:51.440 Um like asking me if I can fix the vacuum. 0:01:52.280 --> 0:01:54.120 You'd be so proud of me. I fixed a copy 0:01:54.240 --> 0:01:57.880 jam by myself. Our water tower seems gross. Can we 0:01:57.920 --> 0:02:00.600 get a new one? I wouldn't mind, but it's starting 0:02:00.640 --> 0:02:03.280 to affect my confidence at work. I'm all for helping 0:02:03.280 --> 0:02:05.400 out around the office, but I'm getting sort of bitter 0:02:05.520 --> 0:02:07.840 that I'm now to go to for me neo tasks 0:02:07.840 --> 0:02:11.000 and not to go to like before, for more technical tasks. 0:02:11.000 --> 0:02:14.760 Are questions instead of being asked to me coffee. Our 0:02:14.800 --> 0:02:17.280 main supervisor will now cry into his mug like a 0:02:17.280 --> 0:02:20.360 baby until I notice and ask if you'd like coffee? Folks, 0:02:20.400 --> 0:02:22.840 who I startuple motion for a pen instead of asking 0:02:22.880 --> 0:02:25.760 me for a pen? I know these things seem small, 0:02:25.800 --> 0:02:28.640 but it's starting to feel a little bit dehumanizing. And 0:02:28.680 --> 0:02:30.760 then I'm only there to be a secretary and not 0:02:30.919 --> 0:02:33.280 value for the more technical skills and background I was 0:02:33.360 --> 0:02:35.880 hired for. I've been trying to track it up as 0:02:35.919 --> 0:02:38.440 a temporary situation, but by boss needs to think we 0:02:38.480 --> 0:02:41.000 don't need to rehire that position because it's just an 0:02:41.040 --> 0:02:43.680 issue with office coverage, something I've tried to bring up 0:02:43.720 --> 0:02:47.440 multiple times again. I'm all over begining around the office. 0:02:47.480 --> 0:02:49.359 But what options do I have here to get back 0:02:49.360 --> 0:02:51.799 into loving my job? Should I stuck it up and 0:02:51.880 --> 0:02:56.000 grin and bear it? Thanks so much? Oh do not 0:02:56.120 --> 0:02:58.120 suck it up and grin and bear it, because if 0:02:58.160 --> 0:03:00.920 you do, it's very likely that the will become your 0:03:01.000 --> 0:03:03.640 job and it will get so ingrained that you won't 0:03:03.639 --> 0:03:06.400 be able to change it after a while. In fact, 0:03:06.480 --> 0:03:09.160 I am worried that that may have already started to 0:03:09.200 --> 0:03:12.000 happen because you have been a good sport about it. 0:03:12.040 --> 0:03:15.600 For so long. The fact that people are motioning to 0:03:15.639 --> 0:03:19.040 you to get them pens rather than getting their own pens, 0:03:19.120 --> 0:03:22.320 for example, worries me. It's a small thing, but you 0:03:22.320 --> 0:03:25.240 would never do that to appear who wasn't in charge 0:03:25.280 --> 0:03:27.919 of pens. They think you're in charge of pens now. 0:03:28.400 --> 0:03:31.280 So yeah, you've got a short circuit this and get 0:03:31.280 --> 0:03:34.640 it changed now. You said you've brought up with your 0:03:34.639 --> 0:03:37.600 boss multiple times that the front office needs more coverage, 0:03:37.680 --> 0:03:39.880 and he doesn't think he needs to rehire for it. 0:03:40.640 --> 0:03:43.760 I think instead, you should tackle it from a different angle. 0:03:43.800 --> 0:03:45.680 I mean, it's up to him if he rehires or not, 0:03:46.480 --> 0:03:48.400 but you want to step out of the role that 0:03:48.440 --> 0:03:51.880 you had stepped into temporarily to help out. I would 0:03:51.880 --> 0:03:54.200 sit down with him and say something like, I want 0:03:54.240 --> 0:03:56.000 to talk to you about my role here. I was 0:03:56.080 --> 0:03:58.800 happy to help out with front office coverage when Jane left, 0:03:58.960 --> 0:04:01.360 but I've been doing it or months now, and I'm 0:04:01.360 --> 0:04:04.360 concerned that doing it any longer will mean a permanent 0:04:04.400 --> 0:04:07.360 shift in my role. I actually took this job in 0:04:07.480 --> 0:04:10.120 part because it wasn't the front office person, and it's 0:04:10.120 --> 0:04:11.760 important to me to be able to focus on the 0:04:11.760 --> 0:04:14.440 technical skills that I was hired to use, and which 0:04:14.440 --> 0:04:17.080 are the reason that I took the job. Make sure 0:04:17.120 --> 0:04:19.800 that you use that language that stuff about the reason 0:04:19.880 --> 0:04:22.320 that I took this job, because that is emphasizing that 0:04:22.400 --> 0:04:25.280 the job is evolving into something that you didn't and 0:04:25.400 --> 0:04:29.120 wouldn't have signed on for. And then say, you know, 0:04:29.160 --> 0:04:31.240 I stepped up to help cover that work because I 0:04:31.279 --> 0:04:34.040 wanted to be helpful and I figured it would be temporary. 0:04:34.320 --> 0:04:36.240 But admin work is starting to take up more and 0:04:36.279 --> 0:04:38.480 more of my time, and I'm seeing people just assume 0:04:38.520 --> 0:04:41.000 that it's my job, doing things like asking me to 0:04:41.040 --> 0:04:44.120 fix the vacuum or handle the water tower or bring 0:04:44.160 --> 0:04:47.320 them pens or coffee. And again, I was willing to 0:04:47.360 --> 0:04:49.600 help out in a pinch, but at this point, I'm 0:04:49.640 --> 0:04:51.920 concerned that it's really overshadowing the work that I came 0:04:51.960 --> 0:04:54.040 on board to do, and I want to return to 0:04:54.120 --> 0:04:57.479 focusing on that. If you don't plan to rehire for 0:04:57.520 --> 0:04:59.960 the front office work for a while, can someone else 0:05:00.200 --> 0:05:02.920 take over most of this coverage so that I can 0:05:02.960 --> 0:05:04.520 get back to the work that I came on to do. 0:05:05.920 --> 0:05:09.240 So something like that. So the thing that you're pushing 0:05:09.279 --> 0:05:11.240 is not you need to hire to fill that role. 0:05:11.400 --> 0:05:13.719 It's that you're going to step back from doing so 0:05:13.839 --> 0:05:19.160 much of it. Again, you volunteered, so just d volunteer yourself, 0:05:19.279 --> 0:05:23.080 un volunteered, whatever the word might be. Also, if there 0:05:23.160 --> 0:05:25.600 is a mix of genders in your office, if there 0:05:25.600 --> 0:05:28.599 are some guys in there too, I would also say, 0:05:29.600 --> 0:05:31.680 I don't want to fall into a trap where people 0:05:31.680 --> 0:05:33.400 are turning to me to do this work because I'm 0:05:33.440 --> 0:05:35.560 a woman. It's really important to me to have your 0:05:35.600 --> 0:05:39.320 support in making sure that that doesn't happen, because that 0:05:39.480 --> 0:05:42.440 is very much a thing that does happen. Women step 0:05:42.480 --> 0:05:44.919 in to fill this kind of vacuum far more often 0:05:44.960 --> 0:05:46.840 than men do, and you don't want to get pulled 0:05:46.880 --> 0:05:49.640 into that. And sometimes when you're talking to your boss, 0:05:49.680 --> 0:05:54.040 that can help to make that very explicit. Especially well, 0:05:54.440 --> 0:05:56.159 I was gonna say especially as a man, but but 0:05:56.200 --> 0:05:57.960 actually it's helpful to point it out to women too. 0:05:58.080 --> 0:06:01.760 Sometimes people just don't realize that that gender dynamic is 0:06:01.760 --> 0:06:05.719 playing out, and when you name it, they realize, oh okay, 0:06:06.000 --> 0:06:09.480 and they're more willing to help you out with that. Also, 0:06:09.640 --> 0:06:11.960 to some extent, it sounds like you may be sort 0:06:11.960 --> 0:06:16.120 of enabling your coworkers dependence on you for the admin work. 0:06:16.160 --> 0:06:19.640 You know, if someone is whining about not having coffee, 0:06:19.680 --> 0:06:23.960 even if it's your boss, you absolutely do not need 0:06:24.000 --> 0:06:26.919 to volunteer to solve that. It's not your job, and 0:06:26.960 --> 0:06:29.159 there is a danger that people will start thinking that 0:06:29.200 --> 0:06:31.719 it's your job if you keep doing it. So don't 0:06:31.760 --> 0:06:34.240 do it, not at all, not even one more time. 0:06:34.320 --> 0:06:36.719 He can get his own coffee, or if he doesn't 0:06:36.760 --> 0:06:39.200 want to, he can hire someone who has that in 0:06:39.240 --> 0:06:43.320 their job description. But it's not your responsibility. Stop volunteering 0:06:43.320 --> 0:06:46.360 to get him coffee. The same thing with the pens 0:06:46.480 --> 0:06:49.360 and the vacuum and so forth. If someone motions to 0:06:49.400 --> 0:06:52.200 you to get them a pen from now on you 0:06:52.240 --> 0:06:54.479 have no idea what they're gesturing for, give them a 0:06:54.480 --> 0:06:57.640 weird look, and if necessary, you can say the pencer 0:06:57.680 --> 0:07:00.760 in the supply closet or or wherever they are, or 0:07:00.839 --> 0:07:02.800 give them the same response that they would get if 0:07:02.839 --> 0:07:04.680 they did that to the dude in your office who 0:07:04.680 --> 0:07:07.520 has no idea where the pens are. Along the same lines, 0:07:07.560 --> 0:07:10.040 if someone asks you to like fix the vacuum, your 0:07:10.080 --> 0:07:12.160 answer can just be huh, I don't know how to 0:07:12.200 --> 0:07:14.000 do that anymore than you do, and I'm right in 0:07:14.040 --> 0:07:16.679 the middle of something. Sorry, I can't help if someone 0:07:16.720 --> 0:07:18.920 asks you to do other things that aren't your job, 0:07:19.200 --> 0:07:21.200 same thing, you know, Sorry, I just don't have time 0:07:21.240 --> 0:07:23.800 to do that right now. I know that you want 0:07:23.800 --> 0:07:26.160 to be helpful, but you are going to train people 0:07:26.160 --> 0:07:28.520 to think that you are the admin and you're not. 0:07:29.400 --> 0:07:31.000 If you want to do the job you're hired to do, 0:07:31.040 --> 0:07:33.360 you're going to have to put up boundaries and focus 0:07:33.400 --> 0:07:36.400 on doing that. Don't worry about fixing a problem that 0:07:36.600 --> 0:07:39.640 is not yours to fix. It's your boss's problem to fix, 0:07:39.680 --> 0:07:42.080 and if he wants to fix it, he will look 0:07:42.080 --> 0:07:44.480 around at all of your coworkers who have decided it's 0:07:44.520 --> 0:07:47.840 not their problem and take your cues from them. I 0:07:47.880 --> 0:07:49.560 know that you want to be helpful, and that's a 0:07:49.640 --> 0:07:52.559 lovely trait, but by making it your problem to solve, 0:07:52.600 --> 0:07:55.600 you're making it really easy for your boss to avoid 0:07:55.640 --> 0:07:59.160 doing anything else about it. So from here on forward, 0:07:59.600 --> 0:08:03.240 you are not the front office coverage anymore. We're gonna 0:08:03.240 --> 0:08:04.880 take a short break here and then come back with 0:08:04.920 --> 0:08:07.200 a question from someone who was getting ready to make 0:08:07.200 --> 0:08:19.760 a job offer and then found the candidates Instagram. Hi Allison, 0:08:20.240 --> 0:08:24.840 I work for a very conservative nonprofit organization and we 0:08:24.880 --> 0:08:28.360 are currently hiring for a high level position. We have 0:08:28.520 --> 0:08:31.840 narrowed it down to two candidates, and there was one 0:08:31.920 --> 0:08:35.960 candidate who um clearly was more qualified and ready for 0:08:36.040 --> 0:08:39.040 the job. So UM we were about to make an 0:08:39.040 --> 0:08:43.280 offer and I did some Internet flu thing and noticed 0:08:43.440 --> 0:08:49.000 that on his Instagram page he is following some very 0:08:49.160 --> 0:08:54.160 inappropriate accounts. So not to get too detailed here, but 0:08:54.440 --> 0:08:57.400 the accounts are I guess what you would call Instagram models, 0:08:57.480 --> 0:09:03.120 but um barely closed and in latex type clothing, often 0:09:03.120 --> 0:09:08.320 showing um much skin. And he follows about you know, 0:09:09.040 --> 0:09:13.160 these um different accounts. So I don't know if that 0:09:13.280 --> 0:09:17.600 is a reason that we would not hire him based 0:09:17.640 --> 0:09:21.000 on that one piece of information alone. So would love 0:09:21.080 --> 0:09:25.000 to hear any advice you have. Thank you. You know, 0:09:25.080 --> 0:09:28.120 this is tricky in general. I am a big believer 0:09:28.200 --> 0:09:30.040 that people get to have a private life and it 0:09:30.040 --> 0:09:32.760 shouldn't really have any bearing and whether you hire them. 0:09:33.200 --> 0:09:37.160 But Instagram isn't exactly a private life. It's public enough 0:09:37.200 --> 0:09:40.120 that you can see what he's doing there, and he's 0:09:40.240 --> 0:09:43.560 knowingly putting out a certain image, or if not knowingly, 0:09:43.679 --> 0:09:46.800 then he's certainly not maybe displaying the type of savvy 0:09:46.840 --> 0:09:48.760 that you would want for someone that you're hiring for 0:09:48.880 --> 0:09:53.000 a high level position at a conservative organization. Now, if 0:09:53.000 --> 0:09:56.480 this were a lower level position, I'd be more inclined 0:09:56.520 --> 0:09:59.559 to say not really your business. But you said the 0:09:59.640 --> 0:10:02.280 jobs high level job, and he said the organization is 0:10:02.320 --> 0:10:05.640 a very conservative one. So I don't think it's entirely 0:10:05.640 --> 0:10:09.400 off base to think about this. At least, it's hard 0:10:09.440 --> 0:10:12.600 to say exactly how you should navigate it without more 0:10:12.679 --> 0:10:16.600 information about the job that you're considering him for. There 0:10:16.600 --> 0:10:18.920 are some jobs where it really shouldn't matter, and there 0:10:18.960 --> 0:10:22.000 are other jobs where it would, especially if it's high profile. 0:10:22.920 --> 0:10:25.800 I think what I would ask is, if your staff 0:10:25.920 --> 0:10:29.520 or your donor saw what you saw, would that cause issues? Like, 0:10:29.559 --> 0:10:31.760 for example, if he would be in a position where 0:10:31.760 --> 0:10:36.040 he's going to be managing women or evaluating women, is 0:10:36.080 --> 0:10:38.840 that going to give those women some pause about how 0:10:38.880 --> 0:10:41.480 he will treat them and if he is fair and 0:10:41.520 --> 0:10:44.480 if he's someone they feel comfortable with. If, for example, 0:10:44.559 --> 0:10:47.000 he would be working in HR and he would be 0:10:47.040 --> 0:10:50.600 handling sexual harassment complaints, are women going to feel comfortable 0:10:50.640 --> 0:10:53.840 bringing harassment complaints to him? And I don't know, um 0:10:53.840 --> 0:10:55.480 I mean that that sounds I feel like that sounds 0:10:55.480 --> 0:10:57.720 like I'm sort of pre judging the answer, But I 0:10:57.760 --> 0:11:00.640 don't know. I think it really depends on your context 0:11:00.679 --> 0:11:03.280 and the job you're hiring him for. And also if 0:11:03.360 --> 0:11:06.280 you are working for like a gender equality group or 0:11:06.360 --> 0:11:10.080 an anti porn group and he'd be a spokesperson, is 0:11:10.120 --> 0:11:12.559 that going to look off? So I think you've got 0:11:12.559 --> 0:11:14.760 to think about the specific job that he'll be doing 0:11:14.920 --> 0:11:16.960 and how he'll be interacting with people on your staff, 0:11:17.000 --> 0:11:20.040 and decide from there if it would affect his ability 0:11:20.080 --> 0:11:22.360 to do the job with credibility. And again, I'm not 0:11:22.400 --> 0:11:24.559 pre judging it. I feel like I'm sort of leading 0:11:24.600 --> 0:11:26.800 you to the answer of yes, it would be a problem, 0:11:26.840 --> 0:11:29.440 but I genuinely don't know. It really does depend on 0:11:29.520 --> 0:11:34.040 those details. One other possibility is if you do decide 0:11:34.040 --> 0:11:37.040 that it's something you're concerned about, you could try raising 0:11:37.080 --> 0:11:39.920 it with him directly. You could say something like, we 0:11:40.000 --> 0:11:42.640 think you're a strong candidate, but I've got to be honest, 0:11:42.640 --> 0:11:45.640 we're a conservative organization and this is a high level position, 0:11:46.080 --> 0:11:48.080 and this is a thing we noticed, and we're wondering 0:11:48.120 --> 0:11:50.360 how it would play with our staff and with our donors. 0:11:51.120 --> 0:11:53.120 And then see what he says. Who knows, I mean, 0:11:53.120 --> 0:11:55.360 maybe you'll hear it's an abandoned account and it's been 0:11:55.400 --> 0:11:57.880 taken over by spammers, which is a thing that can happen. 0:11:58.720 --> 0:12:00.679 Maybe you'll get some other real sin that will make 0:12:00.679 --> 0:12:02.240 you think, oh, okay, this is not going to be 0:12:02.240 --> 0:12:05.360 an issue. And there is certainly a school of thought 0:12:05.400 --> 0:12:07.640 that if you are going to rule someone out because 0:12:07.679 --> 0:12:09.719 of something like this, it's better to give them the 0:12:09.800 --> 0:12:12.840 chance to respond to it. You don't have to, but 0:12:12.920 --> 0:12:16.080 if he's an otherwise great candidate who you are excited about, 0:12:16.480 --> 0:12:21.319 it could be worth doing. Okay, here is our next letter. 0:12:23.120 --> 0:12:25.680 H I've been working for a small nonprofit for a 0:12:25.679 --> 0:12:29.520 few years. I've recently been given a new position. It's 0:12:29.520 --> 0:12:33.000 a sideways move rather than a promotion, but involves managing 0:12:33.000 --> 0:12:36.880 a small team, whereas before I didn't have direct reports. 0:12:37.640 --> 0:12:40.120 The person who used to head up this team just 0:12:40.320 --> 0:12:45.000 left and management decided to restructure rather than recruit directly 0:12:45.040 --> 0:12:49.000 to replace them. However, I've heard from others that the 0:12:49.000 --> 0:12:51.199 person who was second in command and the old team 0:12:51.480 --> 0:12:54.320 was very disappointed on hearing this news, as I think 0:12:54.360 --> 0:12:57.400 he expected for his boss's position to be open and 0:12:57.400 --> 0:12:59.360 that he could throw his hat in the ring for 0:12:59.480 --> 0:13:03.280 what it's worth. He is great at his job, but 0:13:03.400 --> 0:13:06.719 younger and a little less experience than me. Again, on 0:13:06.840 --> 0:13:08.839 well with him, and I think he likes and respects me. 0:13:09.440 --> 0:13:13.440 But we've not worked closely together before, and he will 0:13:13.440 --> 0:13:16.200 now be my direct report. Any advice on how to 0:13:16.240 --> 0:13:18.480 deal with this? Should I acknowledge the elephant in the 0:13:18.559 --> 0:13:21.080 room and get that out of the way, or just 0:13:21.120 --> 0:13:25.079 skip over it? Thanks, I would definitely talk with him. 0:13:25.080 --> 0:13:27.720 I probably wouldn't start out with a really blunt hey, 0:13:27.840 --> 0:13:30.200 I realized that you may have wanted the opportunity to 0:13:30.240 --> 0:13:33.120 apply for this job. I think I would ease more 0:13:33.160 --> 0:13:35.520 into talking about his work and how you think he's 0:13:35.520 --> 0:13:37.400 great at his job, and kind of see how that 0:13:37.440 --> 0:13:40.800 conversation goes. Tell him you're impressed by his work, you're 0:13:40.800 --> 0:13:44.040 excited to work with him, and then, depending on how 0:13:44.080 --> 0:13:47.400 that's going, you could say something like I know you 0:13:47.440 --> 0:13:49.840 were second in command on the old team and might 0:13:49.880 --> 0:13:51.760 have been interested in this job, so I want to 0:13:51.800 --> 0:13:53.920 tell you that I'm really committed to working with you 0:13:53.960 --> 0:13:56.520 to give you more responsibility if you want it, and 0:13:56.600 --> 0:13:59.880 development opportunities and helping you get really well positioned for 0:14:00.000 --> 0:14:03.120 that kind of promotion if it's something you're interested in 0:14:03.120 --> 0:14:06.680 in the future. So it's not hey, you must be 0:14:06.720 --> 0:14:09.520 feeling weird, because that's pretty likely to make him feel 0:14:09.520 --> 0:14:12.960 weird if he's not already. It's more, I recognize that 0:14:13.000 --> 0:14:14.800 you're great at what you do and that you might 0:14:14.840 --> 0:14:17.839 have ambitions to move up, and I'm all about helping 0:14:17.840 --> 0:14:20.640 you do that if you want me to. The thing 0:14:20.720 --> 0:14:23.440 is in his position, he might be worried about what 0:14:23.520 --> 0:14:26.480 this restructure means for him and whether it will be 0:14:26.560 --> 0:14:29.280 in some ways a demotion for him, especially if he 0:14:29.360 --> 0:14:32.640 was second command in the old structure but isn't now, 0:14:33.280 --> 0:14:36.520 and he might be wondering, do you recognize what he 0:14:36.560 --> 0:14:38.280 brings to the table or is he going to be 0:14:38.320 --> 0:14:41.680 sort of unrecognized and unappreciated. So one of the best 0:14:41.680 --> 0:14:43.760 things that you can do early on is to make 0:14:43.760 --> 0:14:46.440 it clear that you do recognize what he brings and 0:14:46.440 --> 0:14:49.560 that you value and appreciate him, and that's likely to 0:14:49.640 --> 0:14:54.000 help the situation. Now, there are sometimes situations where the 0:14:54.000 --> 0:14:57.360 person who has passed over is resentful and handles it badly, 0:14:57.400 --> 0:14:59.480 but it doesn't sound like you're seeing signs of that 0:14:59.600 --> 0:15:02.480 in this case. So far. If that happens, of course 0:15:02.520 --> 0:15:04.040 you would have to deal with that head on. But 0:15:04.360 --> 0:15:06.640 you know, if he's just a bit disappointed, that's okay. 0:15:06.680 --> 0:15:08.280 I mean, it makes sense that he might be, and 0:15:08.360 --> 0:15:11.760 we can understand that as long as you're really underscoring 0:15:11.840 --> 0:15:14.320 to him that you appreciate the value that he brings 0:15:14.440 --> 0:15:18.280 and that you're not overlooking that, it's pretty likely that 0:15:18.280 --> 0:15:20.560 that will give you a good foundation to start building 0:15:20.560 --> 0:15:25.080 a working relationship with him. Okay. The next question we 0:15:25.120 --> 0:15:27.840 have is from someone whose boss sort of traps her 0:15:27.880 --> 0:15:31.520 in her office and rambles at her and she can't escape. 0:15:32.840 --> 0:15:36.320 I work overnights, and by the time I come in, 0:15:36.640 --> 0:15:39.400 my boss's schedules to just finish up his daily tasks 0:15:39.400 --> 0:15:42.480 and head out. Sometimes this takes a while, but he 0:15:42.560 --> 0:15:45.040 tends to make it even longer, like coming into our 0:15:45.160 --> 0:15:49.160 room it's connected to his office, and he'll ramble on 0:15:49.240 --> 0:15:52.920 and on about something, usually political, of which I have 0:15:52.960 --> 0:15:56.560 a strong opposing view. I can't argue too much because 0:15:56.600 --> 0:15:59.680 he determines whether or not I have the job, and 0:16:00.000 --> 0:16:02.760 because that will only extend his day in the office. 0:16:02.840 --> 0:16:05.640 Since he's a very my way of the highway type, 0:16:05.760 --> 0:16:08.520 and that makes him have to take more time to 0:16:08.560 --> 0:16:11.160 finish his daily work. I've tried turning my back to 0:16:11.320 --> 0:16:14.520 him while still giving like little uh huh and other 0:16:14.600 --> 0:16:18.080 minor engagements to show I'm not being rude and ignoring him. 0:16:18.120 --> 0:16:21.160 But what can I do about my rambling, ranting boss? 0:16:23.000 --> 0:16:25.440 That is annoying because you are sort of his captive 0:16:25.480 --> 0:16:28.560 audience because of the power dynamics, and he's using you 0:16:28.600 --> 0:16:31.680 as kind of a captive outlet for his ranting. A 0:16:31.720 --> 0:16:33.680 long time ago, I worked with someone who would always 0:16:33.720 --> 0:16:35.200 do this at the end of the day too, and 0:16:35.280 --> 0:16:38.240 it was not fun. Often with this kind of thing, 0:16:38.280 --> 0:16:40.920 where you don't feel like you can just directly say, hey, 0:16:40.920 --> 0:16:43.440 stop talking to me, the best thing to do is 0:16:43.480 --> 0:16:46.920 to have almost physical barriers to the person doing it 0:16:46.960 --> 0:16:49.080 to you. So, for example, if you have to make 0:16:49.080 --> 0:16:51.240 phone calls for your job, I wonder if you could 0:16:51.240 --> 0:16:53.760 save some of them for the time of day when 0:16:53.800 --> 0:16:56.520 he tends to come by on his way out. If 0:16:56.560 --> 0:16:58.400 you're on the phone when he comes by, it's going 0:16:58.440 --> 0:17:01.840 to head off him rambling it you. You could also 0:17:01.960 --> 0:17:03.840 just be about to get up and leave your desk 0:17:03.960 --> 0:17:07.040 to get coffee or to go to the bathroom. Obviously, 0:17:07.080 --> 0:17:09.040 you don't want to stand up and leave every time 0:17:09.080 --> 0:17:11.320 your boss enters your office, but you can do it 0:17:11.400 --> 0:17:13.479 some of the time. And you can also do it 0:17:13.600 --> 0:17:15.600 after he has rambled for five minutes, so you can 0:17:15.600 --> 0:17:17.880 say I'm dying of thirst, I'll be right back, and 0:17:18.040 --> 0:17:20.399 sometimes that's going to be enough to break up whatever 0:17:20.480 --> 0:17:24.160 monologue he's delivering. You can also just say sorry, I've 0:17:24.160 --> 0:17:26.000 got to get this report done, so I better not 0:17:26.000 --> 0:17:29.280 get too involved in this conversation. What I would do 0:17:29.359 --> 0:17:31.879 is a mix of these different ones on different days, 0:17:32.200 --> 0:17:34.760 and also except that sometimes you'll have to just let 0:17:34.800 --> 0:17:37.680 him ramble too, but you can probably get it down 0:17:37.720 --> 0:17:40.160 to just being stuck listening to the rambling maybe once 0:17:40.280 --> 0:17:43.280 or twice a week rather than every day. Now, if 0:17:43.359 --> 0:17:46.240 you had a different type of boss, in that case, 0:17:46.280 --> 0:17:49.240 I might say no, just be direct about it, because 0:17:49.240 --> 0:17:52.280 with some types of bosses you could say, hey, I've 0:17:52.280 --> 0:17:54.240 noticed I get pulled into chatting with you when you're 0:17:54.280 --> 0:17:56.719 leaving every day, and I love talking to you, but 0:17:57.000 --> 0:17:59.160 I'm realizing it's making me get behind on my work 0:17:59.160 --> 0:18:00.600 on those days and then I have to rush to 0:18:00.640 --> 0:18:02.800 catch up. So I'm going to try to pull back 0:18:02.840 --> 0:18:06.240 on our five PM chats. But you said this guy 0:18:06.359 --> 0:18:09.080 is very my way or the highway, So with him, 0:18:09.119 --> 0:18:12.080 I'm guessing that maybe more subtle methods of avoidance might 0:18:12.119 --> 0:18:15.080 work better, or at least they might feel more comfortable 0:18:15.320 --> 0:18:18.840 to you to use them. Let's take a break here, 0:18:18.880 --> 0:18:21.120 and when we come back, we have a question from 0:18:21.119 --> 0:18:32.439 someone who can't seem to get hired. I'm recent college 0:18:32.480 --> 0:18:35.240 grad well, if you can count two years out of 0:18:35.280 --> 0:18:37.920 school recent, and I can't seem to land a full 0:18:37.960 --> 0:18:41.560 time job to remedy my situation. While I'm working two 0:18:41.600 --> 0:18:45.560 part time jobs. I've sent in applications probably over a 0:18:45.680 --> 0:18:48.400 hundred and fifty to full time jobs across the country 0:18:48.440 --> 0:18:52.080 for the last two years. I consistently get good feedback 0:18:52.119 --> 0:18:55.600 on my performance at work and on my application materials. 0:18:56.000 --> 0:18:59.000 But I'm really worried I'm doing something wrong navigating the 0:18:59.000 --> 0:19:01.879 work world, and one is telling me what can I 0:19:01.880 --> 0:19:06.400 do differently to land a full time job. So it's 0:19:06.480 --> 0:19:10.160 really hard to say with confidence what isn't working without 0:19:10.200 --> 0:19:13.320 seeing your resume and your cover letter and seeing you interview. 0:19:13.560 --> 0:19:16.560 But what I can tell you is that the vast, 0:19:16.680 --> 0:19:19.240 vast majority of resumes and cover letters that I see 0:19:19.800 --> 0:19:23.640 are not good So the first thing that I always 0:19:23.680 --> 0:19:27.080 suspect when I hear someone saying something like this is 0:19:27.119 --> 0:19:29.640 that your resume and cover letter aren't as strong as 0:19:29.640 --> 0:19:32.439 they could be and are holding you back, because just 0:19:32.440 --> 0:19:36.320 statistically speaking, that's the case like n percent at the time. 0:19:37.160 --> 0:19:39.440 And what is interesting is that I will often hear 0:19:39.480 --> 0:19:41.840 from people who tell me, oh, I know that my 0:19:41.920 --> 0:19:44.800 resume and cover letter are fine. They're definitely not the problem. 0:19:44.840 --> 0:19:47.439 I've gotten feedback on them from people I followed all 0:19:47.440 --> 0:19:51.359 of your advice and writing them. And then sometimes I say, well, 0:19:51.400 --> 0:19:54.000 just to make sure, can I take a look at them, 0:19:54.040 --> 0:19:57.720 and they send them over, and much of the time, 0:19:57.960 --> 0:20:00.240 even though they were very sure that their material els 0:20:00.240 --> 0:20:03.960 were good, they're not that good. Even when people tell 0:20:03.960 --> 0:20:06.240 me that they have followed my advice and writing them, 0:20:06.320 --> 0:20:08.919 when I actually take a look at them, they haven't 0:20:08.920 --> 0:20:11.680 really followed that advice. So the first thing I would 0:20:11.720 --> 0:20:14.480 look at is that if you go to my website 0:20:14.560 --> 0:20:17.440 ask a manager dot org, there's a lot of totally 0:20:17.480 --> 0:20:19.920 free information on how to write a good cover letter 0:20:20.000 --> 0:20:22.120