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Speaker 1: Hey, this is Andy and Samantha, and welcome to stuff

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Speaker 1: I've never told your prediction, I heard you.

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Speaker 2: And welcome to another Monday mini where I'm gonna start

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Speaker 2: with a content warning because I like to be sad anyway.

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Speaker 2: Content warning, we are talking about domestic of violence and

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Speaker 2: abuse and its patrol in media. We're also going to

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Speaker 2: talk about some celebrity beef. That's not content warning, but

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Speaker 2: just you know, to let you know because recently, the

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Speaker 2: movie adaptation of the book It Ends with Us has

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Speaker 2: been all over my social media pages, but not because

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Speaker 2: they're trying to advertise the movie to me or even

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Speaker 2: like give me a review of it, and I will

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Speaker 2: tell you I have never heard of this until now,

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Speaker 2: like I've not heard of the book. I have not

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Speaker 2: heard of any of this until recently. And it's mainly

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Speaker 2: because they have criticisms of the stars. So if you

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Speaker 2: don't know, Blake Lively and Justin Baldoni are the two

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Speaker 2: that are starring in this movie that I know the

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Speaker 2: most of. I know Jenny Slat is somewhere up in here.

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Speaker 2: I don't quite know who is what. Like I'm again,

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Speaker 2: so I'm gonna go ahead with this right here. I

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Speaker 2: know nothing about this book nor about this movie. I

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Speaker 2: know some of the context, and I know a lot

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Speaker 2: of the drama that's happening around movie. But with that,

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Speaker 2: it did bring out a topic that we're constantly talking about.

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Speaker 2: I feel like all the time we've talked about it

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Speaker 2: with Twilight, and we'll end up talking about it when

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Speaker 2: we finish up Twilight that we still love, but how

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Speaker 2: media often profits and portrays domestic violence and how it's romanticized.

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Speaker 2: So I think we also need to remember that they

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Speaker 2: oftentimes talk about these really serious subjects with that out

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Speaker 2: understanding or giving an understanding of the full context or

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Speaker 2: even the consequences of using the subject as a plot

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Speaker 2: device or a plot line. And I think that's something

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Speaker 2: that we want to talk about. Again, this is not

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Speaker 2: a specific criticism about the book or the movie. I

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Speaker 2: have yet to see it. I probably will never see it.

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Speaker 2: I'll just I'm sure i'll get clips here and there

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Speaker 2: from people whatever, whatnot. If you've read the book, let

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Speaker 2: me know there's a lot of controversy behind that. There's

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Speaker 2: a lot of controversy behind Colleen Hoover, the author of

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Speaker 2: the book, and just Ady just for the gossip bit,

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Speaker 2: I'll tell you you ready for it. So apparently Blake Lively,

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Speaker 2: who is the producer, and then Justin Baldoni is in

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Speaker 2: it as well. She's a producer and she's a star.

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Speaker 2: He's also a star in it, but I think he

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Speaker 2: directed the movie version. And something has happened where everybody's

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Speaker 2: gossiping that they're either team Blake Lively or team Justin Baldoni,

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Speaker 2: and they're saying that Justin Baldoni is looking at this

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Speaker 2: movie as a domestic violence subject rather, and he's taking

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Speaker 2: it very seriously and making sure the way he approaches

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Speaker 2: it versus Blake Lively, who's coming in and seeing this

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Speaker 2: as a ya romantic movie rom com, if you will,

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Speaker 2: and so approaching it very differently, even to the fact

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Speaker 2: that in one interview that has been circulating pretty loudly,

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Speaker 2: the dude who's interviewing her says something along the lines of,

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Speaker 2: you know, I'm sure you know that you're going to

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Speaker 2: get a lot of fans coming up to you after

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Speaker 2: this movie and asking you questions or advice. What would

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Speaker 2: you say to those who have been in similar DV situations?

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Speaker 2: And her response was very odd and went to, like, oh,

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Speaker 2: you mean, like give him my address, given my phone number,

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Speaker 2: given my direct contact. Like she was really on the

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Speaker 2: defensive to the point that everybody was uncomfortable except for

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Speaker 2: her because they were like, ha, no, that was that

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Speaker 2: was a real question, what is happening. So there's been

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Speaker 2: so many criticisms to her, specifically saying you were not

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Speaker 2: handling this well. We know that you're not the arbiter

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Speaker 2: of the answers for domestic violence victims, but you know,

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Speaker 2: it's reasonable to believe that people are going to see

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Speaker 2: you and think that you are trying to portray something

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Speaker 2: that they may have gone through similar things that they've

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Speaker 2: gone through, or are going to ask you advice and

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Speaker 2: or you know, questions about this. And she followed up

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Speaker 2: afterwards with Instagram stories saying, you know, we want to

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Speaker 2: dedicate this to all the victims and whatever whatnot, and

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Speaker 2: they are so strong and we know that they are

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Speaker 2: and if you are a victim of domestic violence, called

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Speaker 2: this link whatever whatnot as where Justin Baldoni immediately has

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Speaker 2: been on the We want to make sure we portray

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Speaker 2: this correctly. Again, I might be on just one side

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Speaker 2: of TikTok, but this is what I've gathered. We want

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Speaker 2: you know that the women they know that who have

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Speaker 2: gone through this know that we were with them and

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Speaker 2: we want to stand for them. And all these things,

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Speaker 2: and like has had a link to who likes resources

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Speaker 2: for domestic violence victims and survivors. So all these things,

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Speaker 2: so all these drama, drama, drama, drama, which made me

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Speaker 2: wonder about this situation. And when the book initially published

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Speaker 2: there were back and forth. There was a skating review

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Speaker 2: for the book as well, and here is one from

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Speaker 2: Cosmo or Cosmopolitan. It says, hoovery and plot typically kicks

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Speaker 2: off with a relationship problem that drives the protagonist away

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Speaker 2: like an ugly love, and these are all books that

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Speaker 2: she's written. I believe. The boyfriend character then uses physical

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Speaker 2: abuse and manipulation to get his partner to stay see

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Speaker 2: November ninth the book. The main character very easily forgives

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Speaker 2: her partner for his dangerous transgressions without merit. The book

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Speaker 2: is just one example, and the boyfriend rarely, if ever

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Speaker 2: apologizes for his harm, like in It Ends with Us. Now.

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Speaker 2: You could easily argue that these books are fiction and

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Speaker 2: should be treated as such, but Colleen Hoover's books are

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Speaker 2: extremely popular and an impression on young women, Whover's primary

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Speaker 2: audience by casually portraying abuse as quote just how a

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Speaker 2: relationship is supposed to look. This is the main reason

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Speaker 2: it's worrying that It Ends with Us is getting a

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Speaker 2: film adaptation. Given this book's popularity, it doesn't come as

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Speaker 2: much of a surprise that Justin Baldoni he apparently was

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Speaker 2: the director of Five Feet Apart, and Blake Lively happily

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Speaker 2: joined the project. It Ends with Us follows the story

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Speaker 2: of Lily Bloom and her doomed relationship with Ryle Kincaid.

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Speaker 2: It traces a Lily's life from her childhood in an

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Speaker 2: abusive home, to adulthood in an abusive relationship, and her

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Speaker 2: eventual escape from this tragic cycle, with Blake being the

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Speaker 2: epitome of an it girl. You know the theaters will

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Speaker 2: be filled with teens. So this was before it was

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Speaker 2: actually filmed. In these comments, these new comments have kind

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Speaker 2: of done exactly what this article was afraid of. That

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Speaker 2: this is emphasized in a way. Now I will say

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Speaker 2: there were women who watched this movie and said, I

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Speaker 2: relate to this, this is my story and was very

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Speaker 2: very excited to see it, or I'm not excited but hopeful.

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Speaker 2: I guess that the message was being spread. But their

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Speaker 2: response was that Colleen Hoover and Blake Lively's response were

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Speaker 2: not good and did not give the seriousness that it

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Speaker 2: should have been attributed to. They really felt like they

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Speaker 2: dropped the ball in with how this could have been handled. Again,

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Speaker 2: that one interview that I watched with Blake Lively was

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Speaker 2: really odd that she got on the defensive instead of

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Speaker 2: talking about, well, these are you know, these are amazing women.

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Speaker 2: I don't know. I couldn't even be in their shoes honestly,

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Speaker 2: and I know it's a big honor that I can

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Speaker 2: portray this for them point blankly, even if you have

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Speaker 2: no experience whatsoever, and that that's all you really needed

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Speaker 2: to say, or even if you have, like you know,

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Speaker 2: soch a complicated subject. Playing this role was difficult, but

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Speaker 2: I hope I honored them that could be just like

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Speaker 2: they didn't even you know, she didn't even need to

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Speaker 2: give resourcesm or stuff, because let's be honest, actors are actors.

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Speaker 2: They're not necessarily someone who know exactly what's happening. They

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Speaker 2: don't understand the depth of their role. It's a job

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Speaker 2: get I get that but she's also an executive producer,

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Speaker 2: so it kind of is to like, you know, you

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Speaker 2: took on a big charge. This is your movie. You

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Speaker 2: need to understand. Just beyond that, it was successful. And

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Speaker 2: another part of the backlash to this was apparently Colleen

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Speaker 2: Hoover was going to do a coloring book based on

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Speaker 2: the story. And here's a quote from SLAT about that.

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Speaker 2: It says the negative response was swift and overwhelming for

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Speaker 2: obvious reasons. It ends with us is a book about

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Speaker 2: domestic violence. Hoover detractors who say she romanticizes abusers how

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Speaker 2: do a new weapon in their arsenal? How can Hoover

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Speaker 2: pretend she takes the subject matter seriously while creating QC

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Speaker 2: juvenile merchandise. Only twenty four hours after the coloring book's

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Speaker 2: publication was announced, it was canceled do to pushbacks from

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Speaker 2: both fans and critics. So here's another part to this.

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Speaker 2: Colleen Hoover does have experience with her mother being in

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Speaker 2: an abuse victim her father. I guess her father was

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Speaker 2: the abuser. Here's a little from her campus dot com.

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Speaker 2: The afterward of Hoover's book is also very important. Colleen

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Speaker 2: discloses in her afterward that she herself is a child

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Speaker 2: of an abusive relationship. The author's own personal story as

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Speaker 2: an extra layer and personal struggle to Ryle and Lily's story.

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Speaker 2: Hoover thinks and applauds her mom for leaving her dad

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Speaker 2: to ensure she grew up in a healthy, safe, non

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Speaker 2: abusive household. Hoover's mom ended her cycle of abuse to

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Speaker 2: ensure it didn't carry through into her daughter's life. This

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Speaker 2: is mirrored in Lily's story, and Colleen reminds us once

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Speaker 2: again of the complexities of domestic abuse. While Colleen Hoover's

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Speaker 2: own mother and her character Lily eventually do leave their abusers,

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Speaker 2: a lot of women do not. Many remain with their

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Speaker 2: abusers because they're not just abusers. They are their husband's

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Speaker 2: boyfriend's fathers. They are someone they love and who they

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Speaker 2: believe loves them. It is far more complicated than just leaving,

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Speaker 2: and to pretend otherwise is disingenuous. So I feel like

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Speaker 2: that article was specific to saying that this is this

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Speaker 2: is a question like is this book an actual romanticization

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Speaker 2: of abuse? So the way that the story, if I

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Speaker 2: had not known anything about the drama, the celebrity drama

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Speaker 2: if you will, to the point that like Baldoni has

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Speaker 2: hired a crisis pr crew apparently, Like I don't know,

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Speaker 2: these could be just rumors. I'm just really caught up

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Speaker 2: in celebrity gossip. I don't know why. But had I

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Speaker 2: not known that the advertisements that, because there are a

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Speaker 2: few that I have seen, would make me think this

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Speaker 2: is a funny, romantic comedy with maybe a splice of drama,

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Speaker 2: and you know, like not knowing what that drama is,

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Speaker 2: I will say I think like Ryan Reynolds, her husband

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Speaker 2: has come on to rewrite scenes, and the way they

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Speaker 2: come together to again ties the movie does make it

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Speaker 2: seem very lighthearted. At one point, there's another male actor

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Speaker 2: who gets along really well with Blake Lively and have

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Speaker 2: been a part of all of her publicity. Junk Is

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Speaker 2: like he's been a part of it. Like there was

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Speaker 2: a little quit where Ryan Reynolds gets to like interview

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Speaker 2: him and being like, oh, I see you're my wife's

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Speaker 2: love interests. But I also have you know, like being

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Speaker 2: quirky and silly and like almost like a crossover for

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Speaker 2: Wolverine Dead, pulling Wolverine with that movie. Like I've seen

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Speaker 2: a lot of that, but it turns out the stories

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Speaker 2: about fleeing domestic violence and I'm like, wow, I would

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Speaker 2: have never I would have never known what that was.

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Speaker 2: And that's really complicated because how triggering could that be

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Speaker 2: for so many who do not know anything about this? Again,

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Speaker 2: like I said, I'm one of the few that it not.

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Speaker 2: And then that complicated question, that conversation that we continue

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Speaker 2: to have about why it's okay to profit off of

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Speaker 2: these traumatic experience is without taking any responsibility in what

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Speaker 2: they produce. Again, like I am all about get your money,

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Speaker 2: take your story, do what you need to is for

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Speaker 2: you. You know you have that right. So I have no

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Speaker 2: problem with Colleen Hoover doing what she needs to do

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Speaker 2: through her own trauma. But you also need to be

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Speaker 2: aware when you make it big and you sell it

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Speaker 2: to audiences and ask audiences to accept this and fans

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Speaker 2: to accept this and to love this and take this

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Speaker 2: as something as a part of their heart, you know

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Speaker 2: what I mean, like to love it as much as

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Speaker 2: they do. You have to actually be responsible and helping

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Speaker 2: to create a safe space for those people. And that

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Speaker 2: goes with like executive producers who decided like, oh, I'm

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Speaker 2: gonna make a lot of money off this movie. Let's

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Speaker 2: do it this way, and you know, like as well

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Speaker 2: as the writers in this. Now again, I'm not saying

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Speaker 2: actors who have a job go in are necessarily responsible

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Speaker 2: for other people's trauma. That's not what I'm saying at all,

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Speaker 2: But I think there is that level of understanding that

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Speaker 2: if you're willing to take a personal story like this

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Speaker 2: that many that you think many will relate to, you

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Speaker 2: also have to be willing to see where that level

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Speaker 2: of trauma can take a person like this has nothing

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Speaker 2: to do with what people choosing to go see a movie.

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Speaker 2: That's their choice and just as much as their is

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Speaker 2: their choice to leave. Absolutely, but you can't be afraid

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Speaker 2: to be like, yeah, this may be taken out of context,

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Speaker 2: or this is a flourishment of what I saw, and

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Speaker 2: I don't agree that this is healthy necessarily blah blah

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Speaker 2: blahlah blah blah. As we've talked about with like Twilight again,

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Speaker 2: I come back to that because we're like, that is

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Speaker 2: a stalker, that dude. Like if we were comparing Twilight

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Speaker 2: to and I was actually to Cult Girls, which we

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Speaker 2: just read, it's similar the whole Like, oh, I know

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Speaker 2: you're just out of college, out of high school, but

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Speaker 2: I want to have you want to have sex with me?

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Speaker 2: We got to get married now. Like that that kind

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Speaker 2: of context is like it's not as romantic as you

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Speaker 2: think that is. Yeah, But again with all of that,

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Speaker 2: I feel like we have a responsibility to a certain

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Speaker 2: degree of at least having the conversation behind it, Like

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Speaker 2: you need to be able to have that conversation with

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Speaker 2: it in order to dispel the romanticism that is often

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Speaker 2: misleading to younger people.

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Speaker 1: Yes, absolutely, it kind of It reminds me of our

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Speaker 1: when we talked about rape revenge movies and how important

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Speaker 1: it is if you're who's involved in filming that, who's

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Speaker 1: behind the camera, who's writing it, and even if you

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Speaker 1: know it's just having some person on set who's very

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Speaker 1: cognizant of you know, we need to be aware of

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Speaker 1: these things like that is really important because something like

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Speaker 1: that it can be incredibly devastating or triggering to someone

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Speaker 1: who's been through something like that. And I also think

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Speaker 1: it's just better it generally feels it's more like, Okay,

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Speaker 1: this is coming from a place of at least somebody knows,

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Speaker 1: somebody did some research or somebody is aware of the

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Speaker 1: impacts of this. It's one of the things I dislike

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Speaker 1: the most in media is when things are romanticized that

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Speaker 1: I'm like, this is actually we really really shouldn't be

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Speaker 1: romanticizing this. And I'll say, of course, I got to

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Speaker 1: bring it up from my fan fiction perspective. It used

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Speaker 1: to be a lot like that, and that still exists,

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Speaker 1: don't get me wrong, but it has shifted much more

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Speaker 1: where maybe that exists, but that guy is now the

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Speaker 1: bad guy instead of the like, oh, he's just troubled.

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Speaker 1: Now it's like he is bad. And I'm personally very

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Speaker 1: glad for this because it has always posed me like

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Speaker 1: why are we attracted to this?

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Speaker 2: He's the worst?

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Speaker 1: But it's not even like why are you attracted to this?

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Speaker 1: It's like why are we writing it? Like it is

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Speaker 1: right attractive?

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Speaker 2: Right? Yeah, it's been around. I was thinking my so

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Speaker 2: called live Jordan Katalano was the worst dude in the world,

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Speaker 2: and yet we all wanted him, and then he grew

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Speaker 2: up and we all grew up.

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Speaker 1: I was like, oh, never mind, that's the thing. But

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Speaker 1: that is the thing. When it's like a young adult, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's really tricky. You have to keep in mind.

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Speaker 2: Right and again, for those who loved this book or

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Speaker 2: are excited about this movie, I apologize. I get I

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Speaker 2: know nothing specifically about this book. I'm just going from

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Speaker 2: what I'm reading and from the drama that has encouraged

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Speaker 2: from this because apparently Justin Baldoni, people are like loving

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Speaker 2: him the fact that he has emphasized the importance of

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Speaker 2: intimacy coordinators, like he apparently brought up that up as

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Speaker 2: a part of the way they filmed it, and he

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Speaker 2: wanted people to know that, like as well as like

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Speaker 2: talking about and I'm not putting him in pencil. I

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Speaker 2: know nothing about Lively, y'all. Apparently all this stuff has

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Speaker 2: come out. I don't even know if I've ever seen

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Speaker 2: her in a movie, now that I think about it,

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Speaker 2: I don't think I've watched her in anything. I don't

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Speaker 2: think I've ever seen her in anything. That's how little

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Speaker 2: I know of her. I know she's apparently a great

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Speaker 2: mother and a wife and great friends with Taylor Swift.

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Speaker 2: So there you go. So no hate to that. I'm

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Speaker 2: just saying, like these articles and just in these subjects alone,

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Speaker 2: and this just happened to be the hot topic of today.

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Speaker 2: August fifteenth, twenty twenty four, which could change. But like,

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Speaker 2: it is interesting when we have these conversations about who

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Speaker 2: is the it couple and why, and then who were

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Speaker 2: celebrating who we're not, and then how it's being handled

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Speaker 2: after it's brought into public.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, there's definitely a lot to think about an

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Speaker 1: unpack with this. You know, I've got a lot of

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Speaker 1: thoughts about this. Well, listeners, if you have any thoughts

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Speaker 1: about this, if you have thoughts about the book or

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Speaker 1: the movie or both, please let us know. You can

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Speaker 1: email us as Stuff Media mom Stuff at iHeartMedia dot com.

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Speaker 1: You can find us on Twitter at mom Stuff Podcast,

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Speaker 1: or on Instagram and TikTok at Stuff I've Never Told You.

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Speaker 1: We're also on YouTube. We have a tea public store,

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Speaker 1: and we have a book you can get wherever you

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Speaker 1: get your books. Thanks as always to our super produced

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Speaker 1: Christina or executive dus to Maya and our contributor Joey.

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Speaker 1: Thank you and thanks to you for listening Stuff Never

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Speaker 1: Told You the protection of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from

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Speaker 1: my heart Radio, you can check out the iHeart Radio app,

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Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shifts