Speaker 1: Welcome to the Truth with Li Sabooth, where we cut
Speaker 1: to the heart of the issues that matter to you today.
Speaker 1: We're joined by my friend, a Fox News contributor, a
Speaker 1: hero in my book, but everyone's book. He's a Purple
Speaker 1: Heart recipient, Marine Corps veteran and the author of a
Speaker 1: really powerful and important new book called Behind the Badge,
Speaker 1: Answering the Call to Serve on America's home front. His
Speaker 1: name is Joey Jones. You know him from Fox, you
Speaker 1: know him from everywhere. But he's a great friend of
Speaker 1: mine with an important message as well. So we're going
Speaker 1: to get into the historic United States strikes on Iran's
Speaker 1: nuclear facilities to this fragile cyasefire in the wake of
Speaker 1: the Iran Israel conflict or ongoing conflict as well. We'll
Speaker 1: talk to Joey using his combat experience, and he's also
Speaker 1: just a history buff. He's a history nerd. He loves history.
Speaker 1: So we'll dig into the conflict with him. Will just
Speaker 1: lead to World War three, as a lot of people
Speaker 1: are saying, a lot of naysayers were saying, we're these
Speaker 1: strikes necessary? Where is this all heading? And also why
Speaker 1: are some people on Capitol Hill? So cavalier about sending
Speaker 1: troops to war or potential boots on the ground. I'm
Speaker 1: looking at you, Senator Lindsey Graham. But most importantly, we're
Speaker 1: going to dive into his book exploring the sacrifices of
Speaker 1: first responders and their service, why they decided to serve,
Speaker 1: what's the common thread between these nine first responders that
Speaker 1: he interviewed and the stories that he tells in his book.
Speaker 1: So get ready for smart analysis and insightful conversation, and
Speaker 1: also an important conversation about the people who put on
Speaker 1: a badge or uniform to serve their communities and serve
Speaker 1: their country, who also risk their lives. Stay tuned for
Speaker 1: my friend and colleague, Joey Jones. Well, Joey Jones, it's
Speaker 1: great to have you on the show. I am in
Speaker 1: an office location in my building because there's fire alarm testing.
Speaker 1: So the joys of podcasting actually showering, and I heard
Speaker 1: a man's voice yesterday and it was the alarm. So
Speaker 1: scared at the crap out of me. So hopefully we're
Speaker 1: not interrupted.
Speaker 2: That is never sounds like something good. If you're showering
Speaker 2: and hear a man's voice, that sounds like a bad day, I.
Speaker 1: Thought I was going to get murdered. So but I'm
Speaker 1: here and thank God for that. Well, it's great to
Speaker 1: have on the show. You you're a friend, a colleague. Well,
Speaker 1: I think we're friends. I think you would. I think
Speaker 1: you would say that.
Speaker 2: But the amount that you let me pick on you,
Speaker 2: we better be friends otherwise I'm a real Ah It's.
Speaker 1: It's fun banter, is what I like to say. But
Speaker 1: I'm looking forward to digging into all this, obviously with
Speaker 1: everything that's happening in the Middle East, but also about
Speaker 1: your book. I think a lot of people don't know
Speaker 1: you're kind of a history nerd. Do you think that's
Speaker 1: a fair assessment to make.
Speaker 2: I think so. I mean I like to put things
Speaker 2: in context, and it's fun to go down rabbit holes.
Speaker 2: And also I'm a little studies major, so my entire
Speaker 2: collegic education was learning about the history of people. So yeah,
Speaker 2: I think you're right.
Speaker 1: Wait, I think there's a lot of rabbit holes to
Speaker 1: go down these days. So I wanted to get obviously,
Speaker 1: just more broadly, looking at President Trump's historic bombing of
Speaker 1: Iran's nuclear facilities. Did President Trump make the right call?
Speaker 1: And how do you assess the strategic impact of it.
Speaker 2: Well, I mean, we're right now on this teetering sea
Speaker 2: spire that could turn into peace or it could turn
Speaker 2: into war again. And so did he make the right call?
Speaker 2: I hate to be that guy, but like history will
Speaker 2: decide by the next few weeks will decide, the next
Speaker 2: few years will decide. I don't think you can sit
Speaker 2: here and say he made the wrong call. I don't
Speaker 2: see a bunch of net negatives from it. I think
Speaker 2: he did it because he felt like being decisive and
Speaker 2: hitting them in a way that they hadn't been hit
Speaker 2: before the other presidents had advanced around would show Iran
Speaker 2: and the rest of the world that he's not going
Speaker 2: to step away around this. And I think that in
Speaker 2: his mind, and I think probably in actuality, it sent
Speaker 2: a message to China and Russia and other places. I
Speaker 2: also think that his tour of the Middle East a
Speaker 2: few months ago was laying the groundwork for something like this.
Speaker 2: I think some of the other presidents before him would
Speaker 2: fear how this would affect the old markets out Saudi
Speaker 2: Arabia would respond, how some of the other Arab countries
Speaker 2: would respond. And I think President Trump has laid groundwork
Speaker 2: in those places that other presidents haven't. And not to
Speaker 2: say that Saudi Arabia is some friend, I mean, you know,
Speaker 2: or most of those countries. But a mutual working towards
Speaker 2: a mutual benefit can be all you need. And that's
Speaker 2: Trump's doctrine. I don't care if you're a bad guy
Speaker 2: or a dictator. It's not my job to figure out
Speaker 2: how your people are treated. That's their job. I need
Speaker 2: to know if you're going to stab us in the
Speaker 2: back or not, and how can I make sure you don't.
Speaker 2: That's his policy and he does a pretty good job
Speaker 2: at it well.
Speaker 1: And I think that's what makes President Trump so interesting,
Speaker 1: is you know, to your point, like a Saudi Arabia friend,
Speaker 1: like I don't know, but can we work together?
Speaker 2: Right? Like?
Speaker 1: President Trump sees the world very clear eye it. I mean,
Speaker 1: he's not trying to sort of impose or ideals in
Speaker 1: other nations. He's not trying to turn the Middle East
Speaker 1: into a democracy. He even set in a speech to
Speaker 1: Saudi Arabia like you guys, do you you know, like
Speaker 1: I'm here for business, I'm here for strategic partnerships kind
Speaker 1: of how do you look at that particularly, you know,
Speaker 1: compared to someone like you know, former President George W.
Speaker 2: Bush. Well, I think George W. Bush his dark presidency
Speaker 2: was derailed as far as these polsage into by nine
Speaker 2: to eleven. And we can talk about why that happened.
Speaker 2: I think that you know, I really love you bringing
Speaker 2: up that time, although it's not a question, you ask
Speaker 2: and let me explain why people are worried that President
Speaker 2: Trump's actions are going to cause a greater war. I think,
Speaker 2: you know, or at least up until yesterday when the
Speaker 2: ceasefire was announced. But here's the deal. Had Bill Clinton
Speaker 2: gone after Osamom bin Laden, not eleven, might not have happened.
Speaker 2: And so it might be a little bit more complicated
Speaker 2: than that. But we know for a fact there were
Speaker 2: opportunities to take Osama bin Laden and al Qaeda out
Speaker 2: in the nineties Darren, Bill Clinton's tenure that we either
Speaker 2: missed or there was one famous case where a leak
Speaker 2: told them we were about to hit him because there
Speaker 2: were some princes there with him they didn't want to kill.
Speaker 2: And I think President Trump is trying to show the
Speaker 2: world that's not me. I'm not going to make those mistakes.
Speaker 2: I'm not going to let you know something that might
Speaker 2: be a negative stop me from doing something that can
Speaker 2: be a positive for our country and for our national security.
Speaker 2: And I think the other presidents have tried to make
Speaker 2: everybody happy, and I think you can't make everybody happy.
Speaker 2: I think you're actually better off if you just piss
Speaker 2: everybody off, but you're consistent. And I think that's what
Speaker 2: President Trump is looking for. He's looking to show the
Speaker 2: world that he is consistent. If this, then that that's
Speaker 2: his foreign policy. If you do this, we will bring
Speaker 2: down that hammer. And I think that's, you know, Operation
Speaker 2: Midnight Hammer. He has to. He has no choice but
Speaker 2: the back that rhetoric up. And that's what he did.
Speaker 2: But is that just leadership, I would hope. So I've
Speaker 2: told people for a long time. I've spent the time
Speaker 2: I did in the Marine Corps. Your worst leaders are
Speaker 2: the ones that want to make everybody happy, and because
Speaker 2: of that, go back on their own policies and decisions
Speaker 2: all the time because they think that it's going to
Speaker 2: hurt somebody that they didn't mean to hurt, or or
Speaker 2: hurt somebody's feelings. And at the end of the day,
Speaker 2: when you make a policy decision, if you know what
Speaker 2: you're doing, is for the betterment of the team, and
Speaker 2: not everything just for the betterment of the team, is
Speaker 2: for the betterment of every individual. And part of being
Speaker 2: a team is knowing you have to make sacrifices along
Speaker 2: the way. So a good leader is one it's consistent
Speaker 2: that you know, when they say this is what we're
Speaker 2: going to do, we're going to do it until it
Speaker 2: either fails or succeeds. And that's President Trump.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I mean you told her on you have
Speaker 1: sixty days. You know, they didn't negotiate, and so boom,
Speaker 1: you know, there goes the dynamite.
Speaker 2: Literally there it goes auly. And when I say that's
Speaker 2: President Trump, that's President Trump. In defense and foremn policy.
Speaker 2: He handles things like the economy much differently. He handles
Speaker 2: things like legislation much differently. More of a populace comes
Speaker 2: out in those cases, and he uses a lot of
Speaker 2: hyperbole in his rhetoric. We're gonna, you know, we're going
Speaker 2: to pass this big, beautiful bill exactly how it is,
Speaker 2: and it may get changed, but the point is, don't
Speaker 2: think we're not passing this bill. And so he has
Speaker 2: a style of leadership that translates in so many places
Speaker 2: but doesn't translate in DC, because in DC they're used
Speaker 2: to speaking out both sides of their mouth all the
Speaker 2: time and having a different truth even behind closed doors.
Speaker 2: And as we saw this morning, a President Trump losing
Speaker 2: his cool and you know, dropping an F bomb. He
Speaker 2: doesn't mask a lot. We know where he is with
Speaker 2: things pretty much every time the microphone is in front
Speaker 2: of him, and I think that alone throws people off
Speaker 2: in DC.
Speaker 1: Well, I also think it's good to you know, obviously
Speaker 1: red lines didn't mean much under Obama and under Biden,
Speaker 1: and obviously they do under Trump. And so I think
Speaker 1: that's a good message for our enemies and our friends.
Speaker 1: You know that he means what he says, and he
Speaker 1: says what he means. Sent I want to ask you
Speaker 1: about this ceasefire, because he did lose his cool and
Speaker 1: he said that they don't know what the f they're
Speaker 1: doing talking about Iran and Israel. Do they know what
Speaker 1: that f they're doing?
Speaker 2: I don't know. I think that are israel vision that
Speaker 2: Yalus said it best, really right before we dropped the bonds.
Speaker 2: He said, Israel's going to do what's best for Israel,
Speaker 2: and President Trump is going to do what's best for
Speaker 2: the United States, and in saying that, he's admitting that
Speaker 2: that they may have different goals. They may support one
Speaker 2: another's goals, but they may have different goals. I have
Speaker 2: no problem with Israel having the goal of regime change
Speaker 2: or at least regime crippling. I believe that Israel is
Speaker 2: well within the right over the last four or five
Speaker 2: decades to have that goal or to work towards it
Speaker 2: now that Iran has baited them into war. And I
Speaker 2: think that's what's happened from October seventh, four to Iran's
Speaker 2: done twenty enough for Israel to justify a preemptive attack.
Speaker 2: I don't think that's worth disputing at this point. But
Speaker 2: President Trump has to have a worldview that encompasses the
Speaker 2: rest of the Arab nations, Europe and what he's trying
Speaker 2: to accomplish for our country. And for President Trump's perspective,
Speaker 2: although he may be totally for the idea of Iran
Speaker 2: having different leaders, he may not need that happening right
Speaker 2: now for him to accomplish the things he's trying to
Speaker 2: accomplish for our country. I mean, you know, that's that's
Speaker 2: perfectly reasonable, and so I don't think that I don't
Speaker 2: think that Israel doesn't know what they're doing. I think
Speaker 2: that they are. They're very smart, and they are very tactical,
Speaker 2: and they have their set of goals. What they don't
Speaker 2: know is how much of that Trump's going to support
Speaker 2: based on what Trump is also trying to get done.
Speaker 2: And as Trump talks to these Arab countries in Europe,
Speaker 2: that may change what he's willing to support and what
Speaker 2: he isn't and Israel has to decide if they're willing
Speaker 2: to follow that or lead in their own direction. I
Speaker 2: don't think they're going to hurt our partnership, but you
Speaker 2: know you're going to have moments like we had today
Speaker 2: where President Trump, just out of frustration says, what in
Speaker 2: the hell are you doing? I just broke it a
Speaker 2: peace deal and it's so fragile. Why would you? Why
Speaker 2: would you risk it? And Israel's going to say, if
Speaker 2: we don't send a message in these six hours you
Speaker 2: gave us to send as many bombs as we can,
Speaker 2: they're going to turn. They're going to think they got
Speaker 2: one over on us all over again and keep building
Speaker 2: their bombs. And so I don't think either one of
Speaker 2: them are wrong. They just start heading in the same
Speaker 2: direction on two different paths.
Speaker 1: We've got more with Joey. But first, Israel is at
Speaker 1: war with Iran, a nation that is vowed to wipe
Speaker 1: Israel and even the United States off the map, and
Speaker 1: a necessary act of self defense, Israel struck Iranian nuclear facilities,
Speaker 1: military targets, and top leadership. Right now, the International Fellowship
Speaker 1: of Christians and Jews is on the ground preparing large
Speaker 1: scale distributions of life saving food, first aid and emergency kits,
Speaker 1: especially to Israel's most vulnerable people, the sick, the elderly, children,
Speaker 1: and families in need. The Fellowship is also making sure
Speaker 1: that hospitals, emergency rooms, and shelters are fully stocked with
Speaker 1: critical and life saving medical supplies. But the Fellowship needs
Speaker 1: your most generous gift today to make this work possible.
Speaker 1: Now is your time to stand with Israel as most vulnerable.
Speaker 1: To rush your gift eight eight eight for a eight
Speaker 1: I FJ. That's eight eight eight for a eight IFCJ,
Speaker 1: or you can go online at IFCJ dot org IFCJ
Speaker 1: dot org. You'd mentioned previously that Israel is within its
Speaker 1: right to strike at Oran after October seventh, and you know,
Speaker 1: obviously Iran was behind that financially with via Hamasa proxy.
Speaker 1: And I've been asking this like on TV as well,
Speaker 1: of like what is the appropriate response to a nine
Speaker 1: to eleven type terror attack? Right, because Israel obviously has
Speaker 1: a much smaller population than we have in the United States.
Speaker 1: So if that's where the attack happened, here we're talking
Speaker 1: about tens of thousands of people that would have been
Speaker 1: murdered comparatively speaking from a population perspective, and we went
Speaker 1: to war for like twenty years after nine to eleven.
Speaker 1: Not saying that was the right call, you know, but
Speaker 1: I'm saying, like, what is the appropriate response, Like doesn't
Speaker 1: Israel have every right to, you know, want to annihilate
Speaker 1: Iran if they're a terror attack like that?
Speaker 2: Absolutely they do. And anyone that disputes that is biased
Speaker 2: in a way that I don't understand. Israel beliefs Iran
Speaker 2: was behind that. We have circumstantial evidence to prove it.
Speaker 2: I can tell you when I was in Iraq, I
Speaker 2: found Iranian made ordinance, or at least we did. I
Speaker 2: won't say me personally, but we found Iranian made ordinance,
Speaker 2: and I read reports on the Moni Iranian made ordinance
Speaker 2: all the time is just working as security for a
Speaker 2: D before I became an EOD technician, and so the
Speaker 2: fact that Iran has supported the GHD, the Global GHOD
Speaker 2: is pretty obvious. Now. On the nuclear weapons thing, I
Speaker 2: think the nuclear weapons is the easiest way to justify
Speaker 2: large scale action, and I think that in a little
Speaker 2: bit of a way, both the United States and Israel
Speaker 2: is using that really as a cover for all the
Speaker 2: reasons that Iran needs to be at least weakened. I
Speaker 2: don't know on was trying to actively build a bomb
Speaker 2: or if being in the eleventh hour of building a
Speaker 2: bomb might have been more leverage, because I mean, once
Speaker 2: you have the bomb, now you're an actual threat, and
Speaker 2: I don't know that you get the same type of
Speaker 2: appeasement you're you know, it's kind of like catching a
Speaker 2: tiger by the tail. You know, once you catch it,
Speaker 2: now you've got a tiger on the other end. And
Speaker 2: I think, you know, the responsibility of owning nuclear weapons
Speaker 2: is a big one, and I think that as long
Speaker 2: as they were capable of and presumably heading towards building
Speaker 2: a nuclear weapon, there were a lot of things that
Speaker 2: the international community was willing to do to kind of
Speaker 2: coltew to them and ask them not to and maybe
Speaker 2: those things kind of go away if they get too
Speaker 2: far down the road. Maybe they were holding themselves back
Speaker 2: in that way because it made such a great point
Speaker 2: of leverage. I'm not sure that's totally theoretical, but so
Speaker 2: I don't know. There are some intelligence supports that they
Speaker 2: weren't advancing in building a nuclear weapon, and Israel says
Speaker 2: they were days away, And you know, it's hard because
Speaker 2: from my perspective, I heard my entire adult life they
Speaker 2: were weeks away, and it's like, how can you be
Speaker 2: weeks away for twenty years? Like there is some healthy
Speaker 2: skethicism there that I think is appropriate, But at the
Speaker 2: end of the day, you take all the nuclear weapons
Speaker 2: stuff out of it. Iran has done nothing but try
Speaker 2: to undermine and kill the United States and Israel for
Speaker 2: at least thirty years. I mean, in nineteen eighty eight
Speaker 2: we took out a portion of their navy because they
Speaker 2: suckle or they had tried to sink one of our
Speaker 2: ships with a mind closing the straight to remove so
Speaker 2: you know, go all the way back to Iran country
Speaker 2: even before that, and then the hostages in seventy nine,
Speaker 2: so it's this idea that Iran has turned the tide,
Speaker 2: or hasn't been a bad actor, or hasn't been actively
Speaker 2: against us in Israel, that ship is sailed. And so
Speaker 2: I think Israel's fully justified in their war against Iran,
Speaker 2: whether or without a nuclear weapon, because Iran has tried
Speaker 2: to mobilize guerrilla units, militaries and terrorists against Israel actively
Speaker 2: and in doing so, against US for a really long time.
Speaker 1: Will this lead to World War three?
Speaker 2: No, anything can lead to World War three. I mean, hell,
Speaker 2: you know, Franz Berdinand. I mean, anything can lead to
Speaker 2: World War three. That's a part of existing in a
Speaker 2: world of nations and armies. But I don't see the
Speaker 2: cards on the table for many places to want to
Speaker 2: get involved in this. I think that Russia sits it
Speaker 2: out because President Trump quite frankly tells Vladimir Putin, if
Speaker 2: you are Iran, I'll make sure the Ukrainian War lasts
Speaker 2: for the next twenty years. I mean, that's exactly what
Speaker 2: that phone call looks like. And Vladimir Putin doesn't want that,
Speaker 2: or at least I wouldn't think you would. For China,
Speaker 2: it's much more of the economic drivers, and I don't
Speaker 2: think it helps them in any way economically to have
Speaker 2: a larger scale war. Now China's status quo is to
Speaker 2: fight us through proxies. I mean, look at all the
Speaker 2: Southeast Asian conflicts, but I just don't see that being
Speaker 2: their goal right now. And the Arab nations have all
Speaker 2: but said they're sitting it out. So what world powers
Speaker 2: go to war against the Allies in this case? I
Speaker 2: don't there.
Speaker 1: What are your thoughts in the whole debate about President
Speaker 1: Trump's decision to strike or wrong without congressional approval, he.
Speaker 2: Took immediate military action to end a conflict we would
Speaker 2: surely be engulfed in. I mean, you can have the
Speaker 2: constitutional debate from here to tim Book two. Our constitution
Speaker 2: is incredibly important. There are powers in the Constitution given
Speaker 2: to the president for such a case. And if you
Speaker 2: want to take him the court over it, take him
Speaker 2: the court over. The fact is B two bombers flu
Speaker 2: bombs dropped and the war is at a ceasefire. So
Speaker 2: you know, if you want to pitch a fit about it,
Speaker 2: pitch a fit about it, and pass the legislation that
Speaker 2: changes it.
Speaker 1: So I want to segue to your book Behind the
Speaker 1: badge andswering the call to serve on America's home front,
Speaker 1: because when we talk about even this broader conversation about
Speaker 1: what's happening in the Middle East and the possibility that
Speaker 1: a lot of these conflicts could potentially lead to broader wars,
Speaker 1: could potentially lead to boots on the ground, whether it's
Speaker 1: in Europe with Russia and Ukraine or with Iran and Israel.
Speaker 1: How frustrating is it for you, as someone who has
Speaker 1: served and who has also suffered injury as a result
Speaker 1: of that surface to sort of have this like cavalier
Speaker 1: attitude very often on Capitol Hill about like sending, you know,
Speaker 1: boots on the ground, or let's go to war or
Speaker 1: you know.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean you're essentially you're invoking the ghost of
Speaker 2: Lindsay Graham. And I get it. Basically.
Speaker 1: I was kind of poo a step by you're picking
Speaker 1: up when I putted out, yeah, you know.
Speaker 2: The one thing I will say about Lindsay Graham is
Speaker 2: God bless him. He's consistent. He doesn't backtrack on it,
Speaker 2: and that at least means something on Capitol heel and
Speaker 2: I think he believes, he believes the policy he advocates
Speaker 2: for I don't think he's cavalier about lives being lost.
Speaker 2: I think in his heart of hearts, he believes that
Speaker 2: strong military action is almost always the answer, and sometimes
Speaker 2: it is the answer. But when you have a twenty
Speaker 2: year war that consists of really two your wars, where
Speaker 2: we decide if we're going to continue it every mid
Speaker 2: term and presidential election, that's that's really devastating to your
Speaker 2: country's faith in the government and its ability to protect
Speaker 2: us by going to war when they need to. So
Speaker 2: it's you know, it's kind of like the Boy that
Speaker 2: Cried Wolf. We fought this twenty year war against these
Speaker 2: ghosts called al Qaeda and the Taliban and in the
Speaker 2: countries of Iraq and Afghanistan. And now if there is
Speaker 2: a legitimate Middle Eastern threat, who's going to believe it
Speaker 2: because we experienced that twenty year war. And that's kind
Speaker 2: of the conundrum that President Truck finds himself in because
Speaker 2: there are plenty of people on the right and the
Speaker 2: left criticizing him for taking action because that's all they
Speaker 2: can see. I think it's much different. Number One, Israel
Speaker 2: is a completely different factor. I mean, having you know,
Speaker 2: we had NATO forces in Afghanistan, but we led the
Speaker 2: way we had. They attacked us. We were the ones
Speaker 2: that had the gripe. We we responded and retaliated, and
Speaker 2: they came in and helped this. Having this what's going
Speaker 2: on with Israel and Iran, US helping Israel or US
Speaker 2: taking decisive action to ensure it doesn't spread beyond in
Speaker 2: my opinion, Iran in Israel. I mean, let's go back
Speaker 2: to you know, if Bill Clinton would have taken out
Speaker 2: Osama bin Laden, there might not have ever been a
Speaker 2: war in Afghanistan. So sometimes the sisive military action is
Speaker 2: exactly what prevents war. The difference between the twenty year
Speaker 2: war in Iraq and Afghanistan and what's happening with Iran
Speaker 2: is one. I don't think the world, especially the Arab world,
Speaker 2: has the appetite to feed this radical Islamic terror that's
Speaker 2: really spread like wildfire in the nineties and then into
Speaker 2: the two thousands. I just don't think the world has
Speaker 2: a tolerance for it that it had twenty thirty years ago,
Speaker 2: or at least the blind eye to it. I think
Speaker 2: the Saudis were behind some of it. I don't think
Speaker 2: they have an appetite for it today. Money talks and
Speaker 2: bull crap walks, you know, And so I just don't
Speaker 2: think that that type of enemy is going to is
Speaker 2: going to be what we're fighting. And then conventional warfare.
Speaker 2: We are the superpower in the world when it comes
Speaker 2: to conventional warfare. So this idea that it would take
Speaker 2: twenty years doesn't make sense. I mean, desert storm, in
Speaker 2: my opinion, is as much of an analogy to where
Speaker 2: we are today, or more so than the wars in
Speaker 2: Iraq in Afghanistan.
Speaker 1: Yeah, what all about President Trump? And he did this
Speaker 1: recently with the Joint addressed to Congress. He's so good
Speaker 1: at sending a message and telling stories through people and
Speaker 1: using individuals as an example to tell those stories. And
Speaker 1: you did that in your book Behind the Badge. You
Speaker 1: tell the stories of nine first responders. Why did you
Speaker 1: pick these nine people? And what stories and what were
Speaker 1: you hoping to convey with those nine people?
Speaker 2: You know. I like to say I didn't pick these
Speaker 2: nine people, these non people picked me, And that was
Speaker 2: almost a Peter Popper pick thing there. But yeah, they
Speaker 2: picked me. I mean they came into my life, they
Speaker 2: are in my life. The first two chats are a
Speaker 2: guy that I've known since I was three years old,
Speaker 2: and my brother in law that I've known for more
Speaker 2: than twenty years. And these are first responders of all
Speaker 2: walks of life. Justin Heflin in there is a guy
Speaker 2: that I replaced in Afghanistan. He was a radio detech
Speaker 2: and became an Indiana State trooper. Caitlin Kotfella is in there,
Speaker 2: and she's a police officer down in Tampa. She was
Speaker 2: assigned to be my security a few years ago at
Speaker 2: an event. It wasn't really an event I needed security yet,
Speaker 2: so she invited her to sit down next to me
Speaker 2: and have dinner with the table and I got to
Speaker 2: hear her story and it just really my jolly at
Speaker 2: the floor, Like she's just so inspiring, and so when
Speaker 2: I decided to write this book, she was and easy fit.
Speaker 2: Sheriff Mark Lamb is on there. I've interviewed him many
Speaker 2: times on Fox. He's done a fantastic job showing the
Speaker 2: country what a proactive, media friendly sheriff, what a big
Speaker 2: impact someone like that can have. And then when you
Speaker 2: learn his backstory of how he got there, it's truly inspiring.
Speaker 2: It's very American. E Vince Vargas is in there. He's
Speaker 2: a Border Patrol search and rescue guy. Before that, he
Speaker 2: was an army ranger, and or after both of those things,
Speaker 2: he was involved with the guys that created Black Riffle
Speaker 2: coffee companies. So he's been a close friend of mine
Speaker 2: for a long time. And to learn that this Mexican
Speaker 2: American from La became a Border of Patrol search and
Speaker 2: rescue guy and saw both sides of that issue and
Speaker 2: was so patriotic and wanted to defend his country, but
Speaker 2: also was empathetic towards the people he was interdicting and
Speaker 2: has so much to say about it that after finding
Speaker 2: fame and being on the TV show The Miyans, he
Speaker 2: went back to be a journalist for the Border Patrol
Speaker 2: to help tell those stories in a time when people
Speaker 2: are trying to demonize Border Patrol. I mean, these are
Speaker 2: amazing stories that really I would love to tell you
Speaker 2: are so unique that they were the best nine in
Speaker 2: the world. But the point of the book is that
Speaker 2: it could be any nine that wear a badge and
Speaker 2: keep us safe every day. Keith Densey and Clay Hendrick
Speaker 2: the first two chapters in the book. They're firemen at
Speaker 2: Dalton Fire Department, Dalton, Georgia and Northeast and Northwest Georgia's
Speaker 2: it's not a super small city, but it's not a
Speaker 2: city you know of any It's not a big city.
Speaker 2: And their stories are remarkable, the tragedy they've experienced, the
Speaker 2: growth that they've had, the triumphs they've experienced, saving people,
Speaker 2: saving buildings, helping other people get through their post traumatic
Speaker 2: stress of being on a job like that. I mean
Speaker 2: Clai Hedrick at one time was working on a fire
Speaker 2: truck as a fireman one out of every three days,
Speaker 2: riding the ambulance as an EMT one out of every
Speaker 2: three days, and working at the non to one one
Speaker 2: call center one out of every three days. And to
Speaker 2: think that there are people out there that are so
Speaker 2: dedicated to saving lives and keeping us safe that they
Speaker 2: really they give up their own peace of mind so
Speaker 2: we can live in peace.
Speaker 1: We've got more of Joey. If you liked the podcast,
Speaker 1: please share on social media or send to your friends.
Speaker 1: What is the common thread when interviewing all these people, obviously,
Speaker 1: as you just mentioned, people that you know personally as well,
Speaker 1: and you deciding to serve as well, what is the
Speaker 1: common thread and all these people deciding to put on
Speaker 1: a badge or deciding to put on a uniform and
Speaker 1: go serve their community or the country.
Speaker 2: It's really quite simple, and it took me a while
Speaker 2: to figure this out. Every single one of them, early
Speaker 2: on in their career, add something happen in front of
Speaker 2: them on the job that really reset their entire perspective.
Speaker 2: I mean, you know, you go to police academy or
Speaker 2: fire academy, and it's all about tactics and procedures and
Speaker 2: what to do and how to do it and how
Speaker 2: to be successful. It's rarely showing you the face and
Speaker 2: name of a five year old little girl that dies
Speaker 2: in a fire or dies in a car wreck that
Speaker 2: you're going to have to respond to. And every single
Speaker 2: one of them, early on in their career, like for Clay,
Speaker 2: it was just about the very first shift. That's what
Speaker 2: happens is now you meet the faces and the tragedy
Speaker 2: of this job. And every single one of them experienced
Speaker 2: that early on and realized and made the decision, as
Speaker 2: difficult as that was. And I don't believe after writing
Speaker 2: this book to anybody is quite simply born to do it.
Speaker 2: I think that they experienced the sadness and the trauma,
Speaker 2: just like any of us would have. But every single
Speaker 2: one of them decided that it was worth it that
Speaker 2: sacrificing their own peace so that we could live in peace.
Speaker 2: And when I say live in peace, I mean that
Speaker 2: we believe when we walk out the door that if
Speaker 2: our house catches on fire, somebody will come put it out.
Speaker 2: If we get in a carreg somebody will respond. If
Speaker 2: we have a medical emergency, somebody will be there to
Speaker 2: help us. Like that's the peace that we live in
Speaker 2: in this country. And they decided, each and ever one
Speaker 2: of them early in their career it was worth sacrificing
Speaker 2: that to keep their community safe. And now they've done
Speaker 2: it for ten twenty thirty years.
Speaker 1: Well, you know, because there is a price. Ray, I mean,
Speaker 1: you lost your alert, your legs as a marine, you
Speaker 1: are a Purple Heart recipient serving as an explosive ordinance
Speaker 1: disposal technician in Afghanistan. You look at nine to eleven.
Speaker 1: We lost hundreds of first responders during nine to eleven
Speaker 1: who ran towards the buildings, who ran towards the attack
Speaker 1: to to save them Americans, to save their fellow Americans.
Speaker 1: I mean, the price is the price worth it? Is
Speaker 1: it price worth the sacrifice?
Speaker 2: One hundred percent of it is. I can speak that
Speaker 2: for myself like I would give my legs to keep
Speaker 2: this country safe over and over again like Groundhog's Day,
Speaker 2: and I just I know I would. After interviewing these
Speaker 2: nine first responders, knowing the dozens more that are in
Speaker 2: my life, they make that decision every time they go
Speaker 2: out there. Let me tell you a quick story if
Speaker 2: I can so. Keith Dimpsry, my brother in law, was
Speaker 2: his first jobs at Marietta, which touches Atlantis, so it
Speaker 2: has a lot of the same types of calls as
Speaker 2: a big city. It is part basically of the Atlanta footprint.
Speaker 2: And for about a month they ran calls every shift
Speaker 2: that were just insane, you know, john buildings catching on fire,
Speaker 2: homes catching on fire, big bag car wrecks, huge medical
Speaker 2: overdose emergencies where you know they go in and it's
Speaker 2: it's a home with domestic violence and all kinds of
Speaker 2: stuff that they have to clean up to save his life.
Speaker 2: And there was just one call after another and on
Speaker 2: that shift for a lot of young firemen. So at
Speaker 2: the end of that month, the city saw it fit
Speaker 2: to give them an award. So they gave them an
Speaker 2: award for going through and doing all of that in
Speaker 2: such a short period of time. In the middle of
Speaker 2: all that, Keith and another young fireman responded to a
Speaker 2: house fire. The family somehow got out, but there were
Speaker 2: two little girls that didn't, and they went in to
Speaker 2: get them and they went into the bedroom. They searched
Speaker 2: all over the bedroom. What they found out was there
Speaker 2: was a pile of stuffed animals, and the little girls
Speaker 2: crawled under those stuffed animals. They going to keep them safe,
Speaker 2: and of course it did the opposite, and they perished.
Speaker 2: And so when Keith got that award, it broke his
Speaker 2: heart and he's never worn the award. It's one of
Speaker 2: the most traumatic things that he's ever gone through. And
Speaker 2: eventually I had to point out to Keith, hey, brother,
Speaker 2: you need to understand you didn't get that award because
Speaker 2: of what happened that night. You got that award because
Speaker 2: you put your gear on the next day and went
Speaker 2: back to work after what happened that night. You didn't
Speaker 2: give up, you didn't quit continue to be that guy
Speaker 2: and you continue to save people. You know. I wish
Speaker 2: that every first responder could always say they batted a thousand,
Speaker 2: but that just simply isn't the case. And so that's
Speaker 2: that's the type of sacrifice that we see when you
Speaker 2: can experience something like that and still go put your
Speaker 2: gear on the next day and go into a burning
Speaker 2: building and have those memories, those those haunting memories, and
Speaker 2: today though you save somebody. I mean, that's who we
Speaker 2: have out there, and that's who we live beside, that's
Speaker 2: who we go to church with, that's who's in the
Speaker 2: pickup line when we pick our kids up from school,
Speaker 2: or those kind of people, and we're just so lucky
Speaker 2: in this country to have them.
Speaker 1: What's so interesting is, you know, I've interviewed a lot
Speaker 1: of people for the podcast. Obviously we engage with a
Speaker 1: lot of people with their jobs at Fox, and you
Speaker 1: look at a lot of professions, there can be a
Speaker 1: lot of arrogance, particularly looking at Congress and some of
Speaker 1: these other places. And I will say that of all
Speaker 1: the first responders I've interviewed, particularly or military veterans, there's
Speaker 1: such a humility that comes with it, and like a
Speaker 1: really like if you're like, oh, you're a hero, they're like, no,
Speaker 1: don't say that. What do you think is behind that?
Speaker 2: I think it's it's cultural. You be in EOD tech.
Speaker 2: I understand it a little bit because in EOD, especially
Speaker 2: Marine Corpo D, we weed out the guys that are
Speaker 2: all about themselves because eventually they'll do something dangerous so
Speaker 2: other people are impressed. But in doing that dangerous thing,
Speaker 2: there is their lives and other people's lives. So you
Speaker 2: can't have heroes in heroic jobs. You can't have people
Speaker 2: looking for the pats on the back and the ground
Speaker 2: and the adulation in jobs that they are so dangerous
Speaker 2: and self sacrificing that they may one day rate it
Speaker 2: when people say he won the Purple Heart or he
Speaker 2: won the Medal of Honor, that's that's really horrible. You
Speaker 2: earn those things, but you don't win them. They're not
Speaker 2: a prize you're out looking for. And so it's the
Speaker 2: same thing for these individuals, like they understand that, especially
Speaker 2: police officers, they can't go out looking to be a
Speaker 2: hero because then they'll make a bad decision. And so
Speaker 2: it's a cultural thing bred in them from day one
Speaker 2: in good departments and on good forces. And that's most
Speaker 2: of them.
Speaker 1: Why did you decide to serve? Why did you decide
Speaker 1: to become a marine.
Speaker 2: I'm happy to tell you, and it's not, you know,
Speaker 2: like it's not the selfless thing that I admire in
Speaker 2: other people. I chose to be a marine because I
Speaker 2: come from a poor city and at the time a
Speaker 2: poor family, and my parents worked really hard to give
Speaker 2: me opportunities that I kind of squandered by being enamored with,
Speaker 2: you know, playing football and chasing girls. So when I
Speaker 2: graduated high school, I didn't have scholarships to college. And
Speaker 2: to their credit, you know, to be fair, my parents
Speaker 2: didn't expect college because it was never expected of them.
Speaker 2: They were a poor class of people and college wasn't
Speaker 2: really on the table, so they just wanted me to
Speaker 2: graduate high school. And so a year after graduating high school,
Speaker 2: I was I was seventeen when I graduated. So at eighteen,
Speaker 2: in my eighteenth year, I realized that I owed it
Speaker 2: to my parents to take the opportunities that life had
Speaker 2: given me and they had worked for, and go make
Speaker 2: something of it. College had passed me by, so the
Speaker 2: next available opportunity was the military. So that was the
Speaker 2: origin of joining the Marine Corps. Joined the Marine Corps
Speaker 2: because when I went to the Navy, they told me
Speaker 2: that i'd have health care for the rest of my life.
Speaker 2: When I went to the Air Force, they told me
Speaker 2: to teach me a job that I could use when
Speaker 2: I got out of the Air Force. When I went
Speaker 2: to the Army, they told me that I would have
Speaker 2: the GI bill to go to college after the Army.
Speaker 2: None of them told me how great being in those
Speaker 2: three services would be like my time actually in them.
Speaker 2: When I went to the Marine Corps, they said being
Speaker 2: a Marine is a privilege and you may have what
Speaker 2: it takes to earn it, and that just that was it.
Speaker 2: That's what I was looking for, that type of challenge.
Speaker 2: I was earning a title, and it resonated with me.
Speaker 2: But both of those reasons are kind of selfish. They
Speaker 2: were about me. It wasn't until I went to boot
Speaker 2: camp and had Joe instructors that had just come back
Speaker 2: from a rock that the selfless and sacrifice part of
Speaker 2: it really resonated with me.
Speaker 1: Hey, July, before we go, what do you hope people
Speaker 1: take away from this book?
Speaker 2: I hope people read this book and do two things.
Speaker 2: One understand much better what people go through to keep
Speaker 2: them safe. That way they is they interact with them,
Speaker 2: because nobody's happy when they get pulled over first speeding ticket.
Speaker 2: But if you read this book and you can kind
Speaker 2: of see behind the eyes of that person on the
Speaker 2: other side of your window when you're getting that speeding ticket,
Speaker 2: then you just think for a second about all that
Speaker 2: guy or gal has been through in the last week,
Speaker 2: and that they're not pulling you over because they hate you.
Speaker 2: They're pulling you over because they had to respond to
Speaker 2: a card just like yours. It was plastered all over
Speaker 2: the road last week. You'll have a better understanding of
Speaker 2: what they go through and maybe try to live more responsibly.
Speaker 2: And then on the other side of it, what I
Speaker 2: really hope happens is that first responder families read it
Speaker 2: and understand their hero better, because I don't think most
Speaker 2: first responders are exceptionally vulnerable with their families and they
Speaker 2: think they're protecting them, but a lot of times they
Speaker 2: just leave them in the dark so much that they
Speaker 2: don't know what's going on behind their eyes. And I
Speaker 2: think it'll do both of those things.
Speaker 1: Joey, can I tell you something? To be honest, When
Speaker 1: I first met you, I didn't know if I should
Speaker 1: call you Joey Jones or Johnny Jones.
Speaker 2: It's a debate that still resonates every day. But most
Speaker 2: of my friends that Jane would call me.
Speaker 1: Joey, Well, you are my friend and hero in my eyes,
Speaker 1: and you're just a really smart guy, and I always
Speaker 1: love being on with you. You always just make really smart,
Speaker 1: intelligent points, also filled with a lot of common sons,
Speaker 1: which isn't so common these days.
Speaker 2: So those are those are gracious words, and I appreciate
Speaker 2: it because certainly you're smart and fun to work with.
Speaker 2: And that's what's great about this business, especially being on
Speaker 2: the right side of it, is that you're aul such
Speaker 2: good people.
Speaker 1: And even though you make fun of me sometimes, we're
Speaker 1: so Thanks for making the time. I know this book's
Speaker 1: going to be huge success. I'm so happy for you,
Speaker 1: and I hope that we are filling in together soon.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm sure I'll see you soon.
Speaker 1: That was my friend and colleague from Fox News, Joey
Speaker 1: joe Zones. Appreciate him for making the time to come
Speaker 1: on the show. Appreciate his service. I mean, the guy
Speaker 1: is a freaking hero. Appreciate you guys at home for
Speaker 1: listening every Tuesday and Thursday, but you can listen throughout
Speaker 1: the week until next time