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Speaker 1: Music saved me.

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Speaker 2: But telling that story through my music and watching you know,

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Speaker 2: the tens of thousands, one hundred thousands of people gravitate

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Speaker 2: towards that fine inspiration and hope in my music and

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Speaker 2: use my music to help them get through whatever they're

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Speaker 2: going through. And then they get to meet them at

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Speaker 2: meet and Greece at shows and hug their neck and

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Speaker 2: you know them crown our shoulder. And that's what's cant

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Speaker 2: me going, That's what's capt me straight.

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Speaker 1: I'm Lyn Hoffman, and welcome to the Music Saved Me Podcast,

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Speaker 1: the podcast where we get the incredible opportunity to chat

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Speaker 1: with musicians who share their stories about overcoming adversity or

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Speaker 1: what I like to call obstacles through the healing power

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Speaker 1: of music. If you enjoy our show, please share it

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Speaker 1: with your friends and check out our companion podcast with

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Speaker 1: a really cool guy that I think you're going to

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Speaker 1: like a lot. His name is Buzznight and he hosts

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Speaker 1: a really great podcast, also music related, called Taking a Walk,

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Speaker 1: and you can find that wherever you get your podcasts.

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Speaker 1: All right, today, we are really excited to welcome Struggle

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Speaker 1: Jennings as the grandson of Whylon Jennings and Jesse Coulter.

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Speaker 1: He hails from a legacy of outlaws and rock stars,

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Speaker 1: which I think should be the name of your next album.

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Speaker 1: Struggle has new music out called Live from Rikers Island,

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Speaker 1: and he's also had chart topping success with one of

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Speaker 1: our very first guests on the Music Save Me podcast,

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Speaker 1: Jelly Roll. Struggle is also the face of the Sound

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Speaker 1: Sobriety Rehab Clinics, which is a revolutionary music themed rehab

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Speaker 1: program that we'll also get to discuss. Welcome Struggle Jennings

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Speaker 1: to Music Save Me. It's so great to have you here, so.

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Speaker 3: Good to be here. I'm so grateful, Thank you for

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Speaker 3: having me.

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Speaker 1: I could have you talk to me forever. That voice

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Speaker 1: is just I'm sort of a voice geek, even just talking.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, to say thank you so much.

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Speaker 1: All right, let's start at the beginning, Struggle, can you

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Speaker 1: tell us a little bit about your musical upbringing and

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Speaker 1: some of your early influences when you were growing up

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Speaker 1: in Nashville.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so, I'm an eighties baby, and I grew up,

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Speaker 2: of course in a musical family. My mom had a

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Speaker 2: piano in the house, and my grandfather was whaling, and

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Speaker 2: grandmother Jesse and so the first ten years of my life,

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Speaker 2: or from the time I was four to six, my

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Speaker 2: mom was touring with Whalan as a backup singer, and

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Speaker 2: so summertimes stuff like that, I'd get to go out

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Speaker 2: on tour with them, and standing backstage and you know,

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Speaker 2: watching Whalan do his sing and watching my mom sing

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Speaker 2: and hearing the instruments. I was automatically just so drawing

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Speaker 2: to the emotion and music. And of course we'll get

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Speaker 2: into it a little bit later. But like my mother,

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Speaker 2: you know, she liked bad boys. She didn't want to

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Speaker 2: take handouts from Whalan. So we ended up living in

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Speaker 2: lower class areas throughout Nashville. And so as I was

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Speaker 2: growing hip hop, really as it was blowing up, it's

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Speaker 2: what I really latched onto, you know, the storytelling and

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Speaker 2: the stories of hard times and heartbreak and the same

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Speaker 2: as country. Just it was that generation, you know, and

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Speaker 2: that was the That's what spoke to me due to

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Speaker 2: my environment more than anything. So at a young age,

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Speaker 2: I started writing poetry and falling in love with music.

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Speaker 2: And you know, my mom would play the piano every

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Speaker 2: night when she'd get off work, or every morning when

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Speaker 2: she woke me up for school. She would start today

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Speaker 2: singing hymn notes and playing and you know, kind of

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Speaker 2: infuse that energetic, happy, blessed to be awake environment even

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Speaker 2: through our hardest times. She was sixteen when she had me,

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Speaker 2: so you know, we struggled a lot with her growing

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Speaker 2: up and us kind of raising each other.

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Speaker 3: But she always tried to.

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Speaker 2: Infuse music into the house household as uplifting and as

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Speaker 2: a way. So I latched onto that immediately, And a

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Speaker 2: lot of my influences, of course, was wailing musically. A

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Speaker 2: lot it came from my tupac, you know, with my

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Speaker 2: lyricism and telling my story in a way that others

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Speaker 2: could gravitate towards it. Right, Like always, even when I

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Speaker 2: was just doing poems when I was young, writing poems

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Speaker 2: in school, but it was always something maybe not that

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Speaker 2: I went through, but that I was watching somebody else

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Speaker 2: go through. And it's really heartfelt things.

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Speaker 1: Well, that's interesting, So even when you were young, you

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Speaker 1: observed things and were inspired to write about them poetically.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. One of the first poems that ever wrote was

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Speaker 2: about abortion, and of course I was like eleven years old,

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Speaker 2: so I didn't really even understand what that concept was.

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Speaker 2: But it was called nine Months and it was about

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Speaker 2: being in the womb and then but you know, then.

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Speaker 3: It was about abortion.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, I was always I've always been like the

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Speaker 2: person to like soak up everything around me, like we'll

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Speaker 2: get into it later. I did five years in prison,

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Speaker 2: and I didn't write a single song while I was

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Speaker 2: in there because I was like, I want to just

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Speaker 2: really take care of everything else I need to take

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Speaker 2: care of right now, observe, soak this up and then

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Speaker 2: I'll tell the story when I leave. And I've always

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Speaker 2: just been that kind of person, you know, like super pathic.

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Speaker 1: So well, do you do you remember? And pathic is

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Speaker 1: a phenomenal way to explain it. Do you remember the

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Speaker 1: first moment that music really deeply touched you?

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Speaker 3: I mean, it's I.

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Speaker 2: Don't I think it's been happening so long that I

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Speaker 2: probably don't remember the exact but I remember being in

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Speaker 2: kindergarten and liking a girl named Sarah in school, and

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Speaker 2: that song Sarah was like on the radio, and I

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Speaker 2: can remember just like being emotional on the way to

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Speaker 2: school thinking about this girl that is in I'm in

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Speaker 2: kindergarten that I have a crush on, you know, and

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Speaker 2: latching onto that song or you know, my Mom was

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Speaker 2: really musical since she was always listening to the radio,

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Speaker 2: Like music was constant when we were in the car

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Speaker 2: and the music was up all the way, And as

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Speaker 2: long as I can remember, I can remember the feeling

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Speaker 2: of the emotion from the songs, right, So, like I

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Speaker 2: can pinpoint a time of my life to a song.

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Speaker 2: A lot of times an emotion like when I was

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Speaker 2: going through a breakup, or when I was, you know,

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Speaker 2: going through a tough time in school, or you know,

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Speaker 2: when I lost my father ten I can kind of

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Speaker 2: pinpoint songs to that because I've latched on so heavy

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Speaker 2: my whole life to music and the emotion that came

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Speaker 2: from it, whether it's to soothe or to inspire or

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Speaker 2: to make me feel better about whatever the situation I'm

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Speaker 2: going through, or you know, like I've got all these

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Speaker 2: different playlists and the range of music is.

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Speaker 3: So wide, you know, depending on you know, if I'm

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Speaker 3: going to the.

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Speaker 2: Gym and I need like something that's going to get

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Speaker 2: me there, or if I'm sad or happier. You know,

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Speaker 2: music has such a power of being able to steer.

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Speaker 1: That for sure. And speaking of steering, you were once

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Speaker 1: hailed as one of Nashville's top rappers. And I'm curious,

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Speaker 1: despite your country music routs, what grew you to wrap

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Speaker 1: hip hop?

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Speaker 3: Well, it was just the environment. It was the era.

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Speaker 2: It was, you know, the eighties and on up in

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Speaker 2: the early nineties, becoming a teenager and you know, ninety three,

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Speaker 2: ninety four and Tupac and the long list of you know,

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Speaker 2: UGK and A Ball and MJG. That were like from

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Speaker 2: kind of close to where I'm from, and growing up,

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Speaker 2: that was what I gravitated towards, you know.

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Speaker 3: And by the time I was twelve, I was in

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Speaker 3: a gang.

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Speaker 2: My mom was working two jobs, and my dad was

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Speaker 2: murdered when I was ten, and so my wife had

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Speaker 2: kind of taken this huge shift to a different path,

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Speaker 2: you know.

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Speaker 3: And rap is just what I latched onto. It's what

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Speaker 3: spoke to me.

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Speaker 2: It's what made me feel okay, it's what made me

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Speaker 2: feel like I wasn't alone and what I was going

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Speaker 2: through how I felt then, I you know, I started

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Speaker 2: writing raps at twelve thirteen years old and decided that's

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Speaker 2: what I wanted to do, you know. And of course

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Speaker 2: life had its different obstacles and different you know, speed bumps,

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Speaker 2: But yeah, I think that's really where that came from.

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Speaker 3: But country music was still always a backdrop, you know.

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Speaker 2: It was always the soundtrack, you know, when I was

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Speaker 2: with my dad or when you know, after my dad

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Speaker 2: was gone and I was with my uncle's, country was

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Speaker 2: what everybody was listening to country or southern rock, and

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Speaker 2: so that was always ingrained in me, and I would

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Speaker 2: I found the same kind of comforting country a lot

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Speaker 2: of times just because of the storytelling.

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Speaker 3: So they kind of both coincided in my life.

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Speaker 2: To really pay that path to me being one of

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Speaker 2: the first artists to ever mix the two genres, you know,

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Speaker 2: and then now leaning into country and finding what my

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Speaker 2: voice is, what my world in country music is. And

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Speaker 2: a lot of these songs that I'm doing now are

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Speaker 2: coming out really old school, and you know, it's natural.

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Speaker 2: It's not like we're pushing to get a sound or

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Speaker 2: we're pushing it. We're just going in there and writing

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Speaker 2: about my life and.

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Speaker 3: Laying the instruments to it. And it's turning out.

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Speaker 2: I've got sixty five unreleased country songs right now.

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Speaker 3: Wow, coming up in the next year.

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Speaker 1: So congratulations.

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Speaker 2: You know, I took a break from touring last year

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Speaker 2: for just a few months.

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Speaker 3: For three months.

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Speaker 2: I still did over one hundred shows last year, but

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Speaker 2: for three months I took a break from touring and

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Speaker 2: wrote over one hundred songs in those three months.

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Speaker 1: It's been working. How did you having Whalen Jennings as

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Speaker 1: a grandfather impact your relationship with music?

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Speaker 2: Well, one, you know, growing up with him as my grandfather,

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Speaker 2: I didn't really you know, he's papa. So until I

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Speaker 2: got older, I didn't realize, like, oh man, my papa

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Speaker 2: is like the band. Like back then, he was just papa,

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Speaker 2: and I knew he was. I knew he was famous.

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Speaker 2: But also in school and stuff, kids would give me

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Speaker 2: stuff about it, like, you know, you know, my mom said,

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Speaker 2: your dad's your grandpa is not a country music star.

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Speaker 2: He's just a drug addict or you know, because he

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Speaker 2: had been going through legal cases with his drug abuse

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Speaker 2: and stuff. But I didn't know that side of him

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Speaker 2: because and I think it was an eighty five or

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Speaker 2: somewhere when I was like five or six, he had

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Speaker 2: that big heart attack and he quit doing everything. So

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Speaker 2: when I was just really young, he switched over to

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Speaker 2: a whole nother role as who he was, and I

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Speaker 2: got the best years of him. You know as a grandfather,

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Speaker 2: but musically it drew me, of course, closer to music.

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Speaker 2: Watching the guy that was like, you know everything my

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Speaker 2: dad wasn't around anymore, and wailing it stepped up to

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Speaker 2: the plate to really be like my father, and getting

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Speaker 2: to watch him walk out on those stages and the

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Speaker 2: people just go crazy, and him sing those songs, and

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Speaker 2: that of course solidified what I wanted to do as

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Speaker 2: a man. He taught me so much about family and

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Speaker 2: about integrity and about standing your ground and not selling

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Speaker 2: out or selling yourself short. Musically, he inspired me so

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Speaker 2: much to just tell your story and be truthful and

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Speaker 2: honest and just be you. Don't try to be like

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Speaker 2: somebody else, or you know, don't follow he used to say,

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Speaker 2: don't follow in my footsteps.

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Speaker 3: Find your own life, you know, stand in my shadow. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: There's so much that I gained from those years with

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Speaker 2: him being my grandfather. But when I was young, I

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Speaker 2: didn't you know, He's just like, yeah, whyn't Jens is

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Speaker 2: my grandfather And some people are like yeah, right, or

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Speaker 2: really or you know, And it got to a point

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Speaker 2: when I was older, I didn't tell anybody for a

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Speaker 2: few years. Yellow Wolf tells the story all the time

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Speaker 2: that he was you know me and they were best

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Speaker 2: friends for almost a year before I even brought it up.

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Speaker 4: Because yeah reaction, he was like what, yeah, right, you know,

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Speaker 4: but I didn't want to be judged that way musically

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Speaker 4: coming in, Like I didn't adopt the name Jennings until

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Speaker 4: probably twenty and twelve, twenty thirteen.

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Speaker 2: Like, I was just struggle. You know, there's a lot

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Speaker 2: that comes with that. You know, some people automatically assume, oh,

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Speaker 2: you've had it easier. You're riding your grandpa's coat tails.

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Speaker 2: You've had it easier because of who he is. It's like, man,

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Speaker 2: it makes it ten times harder. They expect you to

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Speaker 2: fill his shoes. They say, oh, you're not like your

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Speaker 2: grand wall.

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Speaker 3: Of course I'm not. I'm not him.

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Speaker 2: Myself, you know, I'm doing things my own way, and.

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Speaker 3: So there it actually makes it a lot harder.

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Speaker 2: Now, it makes for a good conversation piece, you know,

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Speaker 2: when you walk into a room of musicians or artists,

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Speaker 2: of course, but as far as in the industry or fans,

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Speaker 2: there was no head, you know, there was no like

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Speaker 2: I didn't get any free rise because of that.

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Speaker 3: If anything, it made it.

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Speaker 1: A lot harder I bet it was.

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Speaker 2: And the reason the reason I even adopted the name

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Speaker 2: is because that's what they started calling me. They started

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Speaker 2: calling me struggled Jennings when like everybody was talking about

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Speaker 2: me going to prison and like.

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Speaker 3: The news, you know.

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Speaker 2: And dear friend of mine who's been riding with me

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Speaker 2: the whole time and helped me build my brand, a

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Speaker 2: guy named Sebastians Marberry. He was like, man, if you

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Speaker 2: type in struggle on Google, you're never going to find you.

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Speaker 3: But you put in Jennings, you know it'll pop up.

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Speaker 2: And I talked to a Shooter about it, and Shooter

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Speaker 2: was like, man, please, that would be amazing, like pay

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Speaker 2: homage to them and use the name.

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Speaker 3: So I fought it for a while, but it just

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Speaker 3: kind of came part of the story. You know.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a great legacy. And I understand that because

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Speaker 1: I've talked to so many artists who have kids who

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Speaker 1: have said the words like I've ruined my kids. They

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Speaker 1: all think they're going to be just like me, and

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Speaker 1: it's you know, there you are with your grandfather, and

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Speaker 1: it's a tremendous burden to carry, especially if you're going

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Speaker 1: to go right into that same industry. Yeah, I totally know.

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Speaker 2: One of the things that I think one of the

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Speaker 2: things that helped the most about being his grandson and

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Speaker 2: having that relationship even in my darkest moments, even when

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Speaker 2: my music wasn't streaming, even when I had a fiction

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Speaker 2: notices on the door, even when you know, I was

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Speaker 2: getting into trouble and fighting court cases, and regardless all

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Speaker 2: the different phases of my life, I never gave up

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Speaker 2: because he was a clear example that I had from

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Speaker 2: as early as I can remember that he came from nothing,

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Speaker 2: dirt floors in Texas and to me seeing him that

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Speaker 2: his prime with you know, a nanny and maids and

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Speaker 2: Cadillacs and Mercedes and guards at the shack and you know,

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Speaker 2: like so I got to see what was possible. So

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Speaker 2: regardless of how bad things got, always had that glimmer

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Speaker 2: of faith and hope that it would it's possible. And

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Speaker 2: I think a lot of people from my neighborhood and

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Speaker 2: a lot of my old friends, they never had that,

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Speaker 2: And that was one of the defining things, you know,

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Speaker 2: And I'll try to instill that in my kids now

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Speaker 2: and in other people's kids. You know, I have friends

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Speaker 2: that are still struggling and you know, work, you know,

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Speaker 2: sixty hours a week to still barely getting by, and

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Speaker 2: they can't do as much for their kids as maybe

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Speaker 2: I can. But I try to pick up that slack

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Speaker 2: and take them on vacations and do things because I

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Speaker 2: want those kids to see that too. Like this is,

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Speaker 2: if you get a taste of that better life, sometimes

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Speaker 2: you'll you'll never settle for less. And I think that

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Speaker 2: what one of the differences was is I never settled

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Speaker 2: and I never gave up, regardless of what was handed

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Speaker 2: to me or what was in front of me.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and that's something that's definitely built in when you

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Speaker 1: know it naturally to not give up, and you know,

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Speaker 1: people leading ahead of you by example certainly put that

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Speaker 1: out there, but you have to be able to see

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Speaker 1: it and make that choice. And that's really hard, I

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Speaker 1: think for a lot of people to just choose to

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Speaker 1: not give up. Yeah, it sounds so simple, but it's

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Speaker 1: you know, like you said, it's a choice.

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Speaker 3: It's a choice. There was many times in my life

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Speaker 3: where I never thought the music would work.

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Speaker 2: Out, and you know, being Tony Montana wasn't working out.

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Speaker 1: And.

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Speaker 2: You know, all these different phases of my life and

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Speaker 2: the neighborhood that I come from West Nashville. It's called

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Speaker 2: the Nations. It's surrounded by prisons and factories. And you know,

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Speaker 2: in our neighborhood, you either worked at the factories or

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Speaker 2: you want to prison. You know.

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Speaker 3: It's kind of like those were the two, and so like.

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Speaker 2: To make it in that neighborhood is to get a

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Speaker 2: job with the city, you know.

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Speaker 3: Work your way up to twenty dollars an hour in

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Speaker 3: a retirement fund, you know.

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Speaker 2: And I just I always saw past that so far

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Speaker 2: that I never could settle into that comfort.

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Speaker 1: You know, you're a visionary. You know, you speak quite openly.

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Speaker 1: I've seen on TikTok and a couple of other places

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Speaker 1: about a very pivotal moment in your life. Although you

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Speaker 1: saw the potential in the future, you still ended up

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Speaker 1: going through quite a bit of strife to get where

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Speaker 1: you are now. And when you were in prison, you

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Speaker 1: decided to turn your life around. That was the moment,

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Speaker 1: at least, that's what I can recall from what you

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Speaker 1: would had said. Yeah, can can you describe that moment?

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Speaker 1: That that moment for the listeners right now? Because I

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Speaker 1: feel like, you know, you're such an amazing example of

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Speaker 1: someone who has like everybody thinks, you had it all

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Speaker 1: and you had all the best influences from the top down,

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Speaker 1: and you saw the good, you saw the bad, but

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Speaker 1: you still ended up where you ended up. How did

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Speaker 1: you What was that moment like for you? And can

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Speaker 1: you tell us?

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Speaker 3: Yeah?

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Speaker 2: Well, you know, there was a lot of in and

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Speaker 2: outs as far as jail, and you know, I tempted

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Speaker 2: to change my life a few times and been successful

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Speaker 2: and then failed, and you know, took steps forward and

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Speaker 2: fell steps back. And at one point I did fifteen

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Speaker 2: months in jail for a marijuana case and got out

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Speaker 2: and my kids were scattered. The mother of my kids

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Speaker 2: was fighting a fed case, and so I went and

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Speaker 2: got my kids and I was a single dad with

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Speaker 2: two kids. And I did good for like five six years,

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Speaker 2: stayed straight, working you know, two jobs if I had to,

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Speaker 2: and started having more kids with the mother of my

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Speaker 2: three youngest.

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Speaker 3: And fell back in.

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Speaker 2: You know, it was like one too too many or

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Speaker 2: too too many viction notices and you know, jobs not

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Speaker 2: panning out, and you know, I just I kept I

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Speaker 2: kept working hard, and that I you know, get knocked

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Speaker 2: down and or allowed myself to fall. I hate to

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Speaker 2: use the get knocked down, because we have this choice

364
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Speaker 2: as well, right to get back up. And I fell

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Speaker 2: short numerous times in and out of jail, and I

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Speaker 2: you know, did good for years and then I fall

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Speaker 2: back off. And then this last time when I went

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Speaker 2: to prison. At that point, I had five kids, and

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Speaker 2: I was watching the ones that I thought for so

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Speaker 2: long I was doing right by you know, where I

371
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Speaker 2: was instilled with a lot of irrational beliefs at a

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Speaker 2: young age.

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Speaker 3: You know, you feature.

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Speaker 2: Family by any means necessary. It's okay to do wrong

375
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Speaker 2: if you're doing it for the right reasons. You know,

376
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Speaker 2: I live by that. I justify everything by like, I'm

377
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Speaker 2: just doing this for my kids. I'm just doing this

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Speaker 2: for my family, to take care of my kids.

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Speaker 3: You know. Then when those gate shut, my kids became

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Speaker 3: the biggest victim.

381
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Speaker 2: They were left without a father, without someone to protect them,

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Speaker 2: provide for them. You know, my wife at the time

383
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Speaker 2: was left without a partner, without the man that was

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Speaker 2: paying the bills and taking care of her. So I

385
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Speaker 2: got slapped with that reality real fast that hey, I'm

386
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Speaker 2: not the man I thought I was, and I'm not

387
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Speaker 2: being a good father, I'm not being a good husband.

388
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Speaker 2: I'm not being a good son, I'm not being a

389
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Speaker 2: good friend by continuing to put my family through this.

390
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Speaker 2: That's a hard pill to swallow, you know, when you

391
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Speaker 2: really have to look at things and take accountability and say,

392
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Speaker 2: everything that is happening to me and everything that is

393
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Speaker 2: happening to the people that I love, is a direct

394
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Speaker 2: result of a decision that I made.

395
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Speaker 3: You know, you can't really hide anymore. You can't hide behind,

396
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Speaker 3: you can't justify.

397
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Speaker 2: You know, you can't be mad at the guy that

398
00:21:04,480 --> 00:21:06,639
Speaker 2: told on you because I shouldn't have been doing what

399
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Speaker 2: I was doing. And then the top that I'm watching

400
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Speaker 2: what's happening the mother of my kids hooking up with

401
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Speaker 2: another guy getting addicted to drugs again, and when I worked.

402
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Speaker 3: Hard to get her off of them.

403
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Speaker 2: My children being drug through the mud and in the

404
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Speaker 2: bad situations, you know, having to make those phone calls

405
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Speaker 2: home and my five year old daughter at the time

406
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Speaker 2: is crying, saying, Daddy, we have an eight and I'm

407
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Speaker 2: having a teacher from a jail phone how to make

408
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Speaker 2: macaroni and cheese so she can feed her two siblings

409
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Speaker 2: because her mom's passed out on drugs. And realizing that

410
00:21:44,720 --> 00:21:49,239
Speaker 2: I'm not there. I can't protect them, you know. And

411
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Speaker 2: then my daughter got molested in a drug house, you know.

412
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Speaker 2: And I'm finding all this out while sitting behind concrete

413
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Speaker 2: and still with no one to blame but myself. You

414
00:22:03,560 --> 00:22:06,720
Speaker 2: come to a point where you're like, hey, the same

415
00:22:06,760 --> 00:22:09,800
Speaker 2: way I messed all this up, I'm the only one

416
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Speaker 2: that can fix it. So I decided to just really

417
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Speaker 2: buckle down and work to become the best man that

418
00:22:16,520 --> 00:22:18,399
Speaker 2: I could make sure that my kids never had to

419
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Speaker 2: go through that again. There were a lot of moments

420
00:22:21,160 --> 00:22:23,760
Speaker 2: in there where I'm looking around the room and I'm

421
00:22:23,760 --> 00:22:27,600
Speaker 2: seeing the guys that are gambling and smoking cigarettes, eating

422
00:22:27,640 --> 00:22:30,119
Speaker 2: honey buns and you know, and then I'm seeing the

423
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Speaker 2: guys that are reading books, going to every program, working out.

424
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Speaker 3: I said, that's what I want to do.

425
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Speaker 2: So I spent every day of my five years training mind, body, soul, spirit,

426
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Speaker 2: finding out, stripping down all those layers and finding out

427
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Speaker 2: why do I keep coming back? Why do I keep

428
00:22:47,880 --> 00:22:51,000
Speaker 2: coming here? How can I stop this fish a cycle?

429
00:22:51,000 --> 00:22:54,040
Speaker 2: Because my uncle said it. My dad was killed when

430
00:22:54,080 --> 00:22:57,200
Speaker 2: I was ten, and you know, he was a great man,

431
00:22:57,280 --> 00:23:00,240
Speaker 2: but you know, he sold drugs and worked all and

432
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Speaker 2: just a good old boy.

433
00:23:01,119 --> 00:23:03,320
Speaker 3: But it's a vicious cycle. You know.

434
00:23:03,840 --> 00:23:07,040
Speaker 2: Wailing passed from drug induced diabetes, you know, from years

435
00:23:07,080 --> 00:23:12,359
Speaker 2: of addiction. I don't want my kids to have to

436
00:23:12,359 --> 00:23:15,199
Speaker 2: go through what I went through. I want them to

437
00:23:15,200 --> 00:23:17,400
Speaker 2: have a father, I want them to have a role model.

438
00:23:17,440 --> 00:23:19,960
Speaker 2: I want them to have somebody that can look up to,

439
00:23:20,000 --> 00:23:23,720
Speaker 2: look to count on. I started stripping all those layers

440
00:23:23,760 --> 00:23:28,280
Speaker 2: away and really digging and so searching and finding myself,

441
00:23:28,560 --> 00:23:30,840
Speaker 2: finding who I wanted to.

442
00:23:30,840 --> 00:23:32,679
Speaker 3: Be, Like who am I really? You know.

443
00:23:32,680 --> 00:23:36,240
Speaker 2: That's why I wear all the turquoise because for so long,

444
00:23:36,440 --> 00:23:37,480
Speaker 2: since I was a kid.

445
00:23:37,320 --> 00:23:38,840
Speaker 3: Turquoise was my favorite stone.

446
00:23:38,880 --> 00:23:41,520
Speaker 2: But I was so caught up in what was cool

447
00:23:42,040 --> 00:23:44,720
Speaker 2: and what I thought I was supposed to be that

448
00:23:44,760 --> 00:23:46,880
Speaker 2: I would never wear it. I had all these diamond

449
00:23:47,040 --> 00:23:50,800
Speaker 2: chains and gold and you know, and so when I

450
00:23:50,840 --> 00:23:54,000
Speaker 2: came home, I was like, turquoise wasn't cool at that time,

451
00:23:54,200 --> 00:23:55,800
Speaker 2: you know, And I was like, but it was to me.

452
00:23:56,480 --> 00:23:59,960
Speaker 3: So I started rocking the turquoise. Now it's trendy, but you.

453
00:23:59,880 --> 00:24:01,720
Speaker 1: Know, back then, my first time.

454
00:24:01,960 --> 00:24:06,679
Speaker 2: Yeah, but yeah, So it was like watching all this happen,

455
00:24:08,000 --> 00:24:11,119
Speaker 2: you know, even leading up to the death of the

456
00:24:11,119 --> 00:24:13,400
Speaker 2: mother of my kids who died from a drug overdose

457
00:24:13,400 --> 00:24:16,640
Speaker 2: a few years ago, watching what my children were going

458
00:24:16,680 --> 00:24:19,960
Speaker 2: through and having to honestly look at that and go.

459
00:24:21,280 --> 00:24:24,000
Speaker 3: Just because of me, This is because of.

460
00:24:24,080 --> 00:24:26,720
Speaker 2: That guy I was trying to be and I justified

461
00:24:26,760 --> 00:24:33,639
Speaker 2: it for so long, you know, and now trying to

462
00:24:33,680 --> 00:24:38,160
Speaker 2: make sure that I can keep those same irrational beliefs

463
00:24:38,240 --> 00:24:43,040
Speaker 2: out of my children's mind. So, you know, those moments

464
00:24:43,640 --> 00:24:47,920
Speaker 2: and those phone calls calling home. I remember as soon

465
00:24:47,920 --> 00:24:49,560
Speaker 2: as I got into County Jail, one of the first

466
00:24:49,600 --> 00:24:52,960
Speaker 2: things that my five year old daughter, Innocence, who just

467
00:24:53,119 --> 00:24:57,320
Speaker 2: went through so much, finding out that her mom had

468
00:24:57,359 --> 00:25:01,160
Speaker 2: passed out and she was at a bus stop crying,

469
00:25:02,400 --> 00:25:04,520
Speaker 2: couldn't you know, one there to pick her up for

470
00:25:04,560 --> 00:25:08,360
Speaker 2: four hours, you know, and thinking about what a six

471
00:25:08,440 --> 00:25:11,400
Speaker 2: year old is going through in their mind when she's

472
00:25:11,720 --> 00:25:14,000
Speaker 2: used to Daddy pulling up and being there, and now

473
00:25:14,040 --> 00:25:16,280
Speaker 2: Daddy's not here, and now nobody's there to pick her up.

474
00:25:16,359 --> 00:25:22,679
Speaker 2: Like those moments were the just the ones that is,

475
00:25:22,800 --> 00:25:24,640
Speaker 2: even though as tragic as they are, and I tell

476
00:25:24,680 --> 00:25:28,080
Speaker 2: my family all the time, it's like, that's why I'm

477
00:25:28,119 --> 00:25:30,080
Speaker 2: not going to give up. That's why I didn't give up.

478
00:25:30,480 --> 00:25:32,480
Speaker 2: Something great has to come from this, or it was

479
00:25:32,520 --> 00:25:35,160
Speaker 2: all in vain. If we can take all the pain

480
00:25:35,440 --> 00:25:39,280
Speaker 2: and all the tragedy and all the bad mistakes and

481
00:25:39,440 --> 00:25:41,639
Speaker 2: do something great with that, learn.

482
00:25:41,440 --> 00:25:42,119
Speaker 3: From it and.

483
00:25:43,760 --> 00:25:49,080
Speaker 2: Inspire others and live a purpose driven life in gratitude,

484
00:25:49,720 --> 00:25:51,560
Speaker 2: and we can do something great with all of this,

485
00:25:52,440 --> 00:25:53,200
Speaker 2: it wasn't in vain.

486
00:25:53,840 --> 00:25:56,359
Speaker 1: We'll be right back with more of the Music Saved

487
00:25:56,440 --> 00:25:59,520
Speaker 1: Me podcast. And by the way, if you like this podcast,

488
00:25:59,560 --> 00:26:02,600
Speaker 1: you were going to love our companion podcast called Taking

489
00:26:02,680 --> 00:26:05,600
Speaker 1: a Walk. It's hosted by my dear friend Buzz Night

490
00:26:05,640 --> 00:26:08,200
Speaker 1: and you can find it wherever you get your podcasts.

491
00:26:12,359 --> 00:26:15,800
Speaker 1: Welcome back to the Music Saved Me Podcast, the podcast

492
00:26:15,800 --> 00:26:18,719
Speaker 1: where we discussed the healing powers of music with some

493
00:26:18,760 --> 00:26:21,600
Speaker 1: of the biggest names in music as well as up

494
00:26:21,600 --> 00:26:26,280
Speaker 1: and comers, and looking inward, the fact that you had

495
00:26:26,280 --> 00:26:29,880
Speaker 1: the wherewithal to look inward. I'm curious, did writing and

496
00:26:29,920 --> 00:26:33,520
Speaker 1: creating music play any type of role in your personal

497
00:26:33,560 --> 00:26:37,160
Speaker 1: transformation on top of all of discovery.

498
00:26:37,240 --> 00:26:39,359
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, every bit of it. You know.

499
00:26:41,160 --> 00:26:45,200
Speaker 2: I journaled the whole time I was there. I wrote letters,

500
00:26:46,080 --> 00:26:48,760
Speaker 2: I would write while I was in there. I didn't

501
00:26:48,840 --> 00:26:51,840
Speaker 2: actually form songs because I was like I'm just going

502
00:26:51,920 --> 00:26:55,200
Speaker 2: to write my you know, write about things. And it's

503
00:26:55,240 --> 00:26:58,359
Speaker 2: always been my go to A's always where my therapy was.

504
00:26:59,160 --> 00:27:04,480
Speaker 2: And then getting out from prison and telling that story,

505
00:27:04,520 --> 00:27:07,320
Speaker 2: showing that transformation of course and my actions and who

506
00:27:07,320 --> 00:27:11,560
Speaker 2: I am, but telling that story through my music and

507
00:27:11,600 --> 00:27:15,560
Speaker 2: watching you know, the tens of thousands, one hundred thousands

508
00:27:15,600 --> 00:27:20,600
Speaker 2: of people gravitate towards that find inspiration and hope in

509
00:27:20,720 --> 00:27:23,440
Speaker 2: my music and use my music to help them get

510
00:27:23,480 --> 00:27:26,080
Speaker 2: through whatever they're going through. And then to get to

511
00:27:26,080 --> 00:27:28,120
Speaker 2: meet them at meet and greets at shows and hug

512
00:27:28,160 --> 00:27:30,520
Speaker 2: their neck and you know them cry on our shoulder.

513
00:27:30,560 --> 00:27:34,040
Speaker 2: And that's what's kept me going. That's what's kept me straight,

514
00:27:34,040 --> 00:27:37,320
Speaker 2: that's what keeps me focused, That's what keeps me from

515
00:27:37,480 --> 00:27:39,040
Speaker 2: you know, losing it.

516
00:27:39,240 --> 00:27:41,080
Speaker 3: God allowed me to be strong enough to make it

517
00:27:41,119 --> 00:27:41,399
Speaker 3: through this.

518
00:27:42,280 --> 00:27:44,600
Speaker 2: And now I have a testimony to give and I

519
00:27:44,600 --> 00:27:49,600
Speaker 2: have an opportunity to give that back. And you know,

520
00:27:50,040 --> 00:27:53,199
Speaker 2: when you have that, when you have a purpose, when

521
00:27:53,280 --> 00:27:55,960
Speaker 2: you feel like there's purpose in what you do, right,

522
00:27:57,359 --> 00:27:58,760
Speaker 2: all the other things that come.

523
00:27:59,520 --> 00:28:01,360
Speaker 3: Now. I tell people all the time, I don't look

524
00:28:01,400 --> 00:28:04,680
Speaker 3: at ops. I look at obstacles as opportunities.

525
00:28:05,680 --> 00:28:09,000
Speaker 2: Another notch under my belt story to tell to show

526
00:28:09,080 --> 00:28:11,199
Speaker 2: somebody else that they can get through this too, you know,

527
00:28:11,320 --> 00:28:13,879
Speaker 2: like when I found out that I found out recently

528
00:28:13,960 --> 00:28:16,840
Speaker 2: that how my father had got killed, you know, and

529
00:28:16,880 --> 00:28:19,639
Speaker 2: it had been by a family member, And when I

530
00:28:19,720 --> 00:28:23,479
Speaker 2: was young. He died when I was ten and I

531
00:28:23,560 --> 00:28:27,199
Speaker 2: was outside playing football and my mom comes out there

532
00:28:27,200 --> 00:28:29,000
Speaker 2: and she's like, hey, your dad's on the phone, and

533
00:28:29,040 --> 00:28:30,600
Speaker 2: I was like, tell him, I'll call him back later.

534
00:28:31,440 --> 00:28:33,560
Speaker 3: Well, when I came in that night, she was crying.

535
00:28:33,920 --> 00:28:36,160
Speaker 2: All my family pulled up, told me that my dad

536
00:28:36,240 --> 00:28:40,200
Speaker 2: was no longer with us. I was ten, and they

537
00:28:40,200 --> 00:28:44,840
Speaker 2: told me it was suicide. So where they thought they

538
00:28:44,880 --> 00:28:47,640
Speaker 2: were protecting me by telling me it was suicide, I

539
00:28:47,680 --> 00:28:50,760
Speaker 2: was the last person he called and I didn't take

540
00:28:50,800 --> 00:28:54,680
Speaker 2: the phone call. So I lived with that all through

541
00:28:54,720 --> 00:28:58,440
Speaker 2: my teenage years, feeling that regret of what if I

542
00:28:58,480 --> 00:29:02,320
Speaker 2: would answer the phone, which of course led me to

543
00:29:02,360 --> 00:29:05,440
Speaker 2: be suicidal because then I was like, you know, last

544
00:29:05,440 --> 00:29:06,360
Speaker 2: time my dad died.

545
00:29:07,960 --> 00:29:08,960
Speaker 3: And it wasn't until I was.

546
00:29:08,920 --> 00:29:12,560
Speaker 2: Eighteen and my uncle told me, boy, your dad didn't

547
00:29:12,600 --> 00:29:16,440
Speaker 2: kill himself. He was killed, but I never got a

548
00:29:16,480 --> 00:29:18,920
Speaker 2: clear answer who it was. And then one of my

549
00:29:18,960 --> 00:29:22,800
Speaker 2: family members of my favorite aunts. She was on her

550
00:29:23,080 --> 00:29:25,560
Speaker 2: deathbed and I went to visit her, and one of

551
00:29:25,560 --> 00:29:27,360
Speaker 2: my other uncles let it out the bag that she

552
00:29:27,480 --> 00:29:28,080
Speaker 2: was the one that.

553
00:29:28,880 --> 00:29:29,520
Speaker 3: Had killed him.

554
00:29:31,240 --> 00:29:34,280
Speaker 2: And I had my arm around her when it was

555
00:29:34,320 --> 00:29:37,280
Speaker 2: told to me, and it was one of those moments

556
00:29:37,280 --> 00:29:40,600
Speaker 2: where like, you know, I kind of blanked out, you know,

557
00:29:40,760 --> 00:29:42,800
Speaker 2: and I just kind of looked around, and I looked

558
00:29:42,800 --> 00:29:47,440
Speaker 2: at her, and she didn't budge, you know, she took

559
00:29:47,480 --> 00:29:50,680
Speaker 2: it all the way to the grave with it. But

560
00:29:50,760 --> 00:29:54,040
Speaker 2: she had been such a light in my life, and

561
00:29:54,080 --> 00:29:55,840
Speaker 2: she had took care of me so many times when

562
00:29:55,840 --> 00:29:58,560
Speaker 2: I was in my darkest moment, and I wasn't even

563
00:29:58,600 --> 00:29:59,000
Speaker 2: mad at her.

564
00:29:59,080 --> 00:30:01,040
Speaker 3: It was another level of closure.

565
00:30:02,160 --> 00:30:05,160
Speaker 2: I would have liked to been able to talk to

566
00:30:05,160 --> 00:30:07,760
Speaker 2: her and find out like what happened, you know, like

567
00:30:08,040 --> 00:30:11,160
Speaker 2: if they got an argument or what the reason was.

568
00:30:12,240 --> 00:30:14,600
Speaker 3: But she passed that night and I didn't. I never

569
00:30:14,640 --> 00:30:17,440
Speaker 3: got that. But but even then it was one of

570
00:30:17,520 --> 00:30:17,960
Speaker 3: those things.

571
00:30:17,960 --> 00:30:20,840
Speaker 2: It was like I had to go through that to

572
00:30:20,920 --> 00:30:23,040
Speaker 2: become who I am today and to be able to

573
00:30:23,040 --> 00:30:25,920
Speaker 2: talk to other people that are going through the same

574
00:30:26,000 --> 00:30:29,320
Speaker 2: things or that have been through or been through you know,

575
00:30:29,400 --> 00:30:31,760
Speaker 2: things like that to let them know that they're not

576
00:30:31,840 --> 00:30:34,440
Speaker 2: alone and that they can find strength, and the fact

577
00:30:34,440 --> 00:30:41,160
Speaker 2: that I'm still here and I'm doing good. You know,

578
00:30:41,200 --> 00:30:44,160
Speaker 2: I'm working to do great, but I'm doing good. You know,

579
00:30:44,440 --> 00:30:48,160
Speaker 2: I've got all seven kids in the house, you know,

580
00:30:48,320 --> 00:30:53,000
Speaker 2: my daughter who was molested and you know, cooking macaroni

581
00:30:53,040 --> 00:30:56,000
Speaker 2: and cheese in that apartment, talking to her dad on

582
00:30:56,040 --> 00:30:58,200
Speaker 2: the phone, trying to feed her siblings, and watching her

583
00:30:58,240 --> 00:31:02,120
Speaker 2: mom overdose and pass out, and then eventually losing her

584
00:31:02,160 --> 00:31:03,440
Speaker 2: mother to a drug overdose.

585
00:31:04,200 --> 00:31:06,440
Speaker 3: She just called me this morning because she couldn't. She

586
00:31:06,480 --> 00:31:08,200
Speaker 3: was trying to figure out where to get her parking past.

587
00:31:08,240 --> 00:31:13,000
Speaker 2: At college, she graduated with three point nine SHEPA honors.

588
00:31:13,480 --> 00:31:15,200
Speaker 1: You know, that's such amassing.

589
00:31:15,600 --> 00:31:19,520
Speaker 2: Western She's in Western Kentucky now, you know, for going

590
00:31:19,520 --> 00:31:24,200
Speaker 2: to college, you know, and is doing incredible. My daughter,

591
00:31:24,280 --> 00:31:27,640
Speaker 2: Curtis that who's sixteen, she's you know, she was right there.

592
00:31:27,720 --> 00:31:30,360
Speaker 2: She was the younger sister, and she went through all

593
00:31:30,400 --> 00:31:33,480
Speaker 2: of that just as much, you know, and having to

594
00:31:33,560 --> 00:31:36,280
Speaker 2: be stripped from not only their father leaving, but then

595
00:31:36,320 --> 00:31:39,959
Speaker 2: their mother crashing when he left, and then you know,

596
00:31:40,040 --> 00:31:43,880
Speaker 2: going from a life where I was providing to the

597
00:31:44,040 --> 00:31:47,400
Speaker 2: depths of poverty until they ended up in foster care.

598
00:31:47,680 --> 00:31:50,760
Speaker 2: And then you know, I came home and fought for

599
00:31:50,800 --> 00:31:53,200
Speaker 2: a year to get them out of foster care and

600
00:31:53,280 --> 00:31:55,640
Speaker 2: to get custody of them again, and then you know,

601
00:31:55,760 --> 00:31:59,920
Speaker 2: rebuilding those relationships and those that trust and stability.

602
00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:04,000
Speaker 3: And you know, now she's.

603
00:32:02,720 --> 00:32:06,480
Speaker 2: Sixteen and drives some brand new Lexus at V and

604
00:32:07,720 --> 00:32:13,800
Speaker 2: the homecoming queen straight a student like not even ninety eight,

605
00:32:14,000 --> 00:32:16,960
Speaker 2: like one hundreds and hundred and two s like, you know,

606
00:32:17,960 --> 00:32:20,360
Speaker 2: in an incredible relationship with a great guy who was

607
00:32:20,400 --> 00:32:24,440
Speaker 2: a huge soccer star. I mean, it's just you know, there,

608
00:32:24,680 --> 00:32:27,120
Speaker 2: it is possible to turn it all around. You just

609
00:32:27,280 --> 00:32:29,840
Speaker 2: have to believe. You have to believe in yourself. You

610
00:32:29,880 --> 00:32:32,040
Speaker 2: have to put the work in, and you have to

611
00:32:32,760 --> 00:32:34,960
Speaker 2: find those things. Like for me, music was one of

612
00:32:35,000 --> 00:32:38,880
Speaker 2: the biggest things that I could latch onto and when

613
00:32:38,920 --> 00:32:42,160
Speaker 2: I needed you know, of course I have prayer and

614
00:32:42,200 --> 00:32:45,479
Speaker 2: other things, but when I need to just recenter, I

615
00:32:45,520 --> 00:32:50,080
Speaker 2: can find that song, you know, and strike that emotion.

616
00:32:50,240 --> 00:32:53,320
Speaker 2: And whether it's me driving around you know with it

617
00:32:53,360 --> 00:32:56,880
Speaker 2: on ten, crying my eyes out, or you know, getting

618
00:32:56,920 --> 00:32:59,080
Speaker 2: amped up, or just a happy singing at the top

619
00:32:59,120 --> 00:33:01,959
Speaker 2: of my lungs, whatever or that is, whatever that emotion

620
00:33:02,080 --> 00:33:03,960
Speaker 2: I need or that strength that I need being able to.

621
00:33:03,880 --> 00:33:04,760
Speaker 3: Pull it for music.

622
00:33:06,200 --> 00:33:10,480
Speaker 2: You know, That's why we came out with Sound Sobriety

623
00:33:10,520 --> 00:33:13,560
Speaker 2: and the concept to Sound Sobriety, which is the rehabs

624
00:33:13,600 --> 00:33:14,240
Speaker 2: that were opening.

625
00:33:14,760 --> 00:33:16,560
Speaker 3: I'm supposed to be cutting the ribbon on the first

626
00:33:16,560 --> 00:33:17,120
Speaker 3: one soon.

627
00:33:17,200 --> 00:33:20,440
Speaker 2: We had a few hiccups in it, but we're lined

628
00:33:20,520 --> 00:33:23,280
Speaker 2: up to do about twenty of them as soon as

629
00:33:23,280 --> 00:33:25,960
Speaker 2: we get the first model completely locked in and done.

630
00:33:26,240 --> 00:33:28,880
Speaker 2: But I'm also working. We're still working, even though we

631
00:33:28,920 --> 00:33:31,440
Speaker 2: don't have our facility open yet. We're still doing things.

632
00:33:31,480 --> 00:33:34,960
Speaker 2: But the concept behind it was, you know, for me,

633
00:33:35,160 --> 00:33:39,840
Speaker 2: writing was one of my biggest avenues of release and therapy.

634
00:33:39,960 --> 00:33:41,160
Speaker 3: And you know, so.

635
00:33:42,840 --> 00:33:45,800
Speaker 2: I'll be having big songwriters and big artists come in

636
00:33:45,840 --> 00:33:49,920
Speaker 2: to the rehabs and Pete doing the songwriting class where

637
00:33:49,920 --> 00:33:55,840
Speaker 2: we teach each participant that comes through how to put

638
00:33:55,880 --> 00:33:59,040
Speaker 2: their life and their emotions and their feelings into song form.

639
00:34:00,000 --> 00:34:03,120
Speaker 2: And then when they graduate the program, they'll get a

640
00:34:03,720 --> 00:34:06,840
Speaker 2: be my number and be a registered songwriter, and so

641
00:34:06,880 --> 00:34:08,839
Speaker 2: they'll have somebody that they can pitch it. We'll pitch

642
00:34:08,920 --> 00:34:10,640
Speaker 2: songs for them, you know, they'll have somebody that they

643
00:34:10,680 --> 00:34:13,120
Speaker 2: can turn their songs into and pitch them for other

644
00:34:13,239 --> 00:34:16,640
Speaker 2: artists and hopefully give them, you know, hope and of

645
00:34:16,680 --> 00:34:20,160
Speaker 2: a career in that as well, because.

646
00:34:19,840 --> 00:34:20,799
Speaker 3: That's what it's been for me.

647
00:34:20,960 --> 00:34:25,840
Speaker 2: You know, if I didn't have divine connection with music

648
00:34:25,920 --> 00:34:30,720
Speaker 2: or that deep passion to create, and you know, who

649
00:34:30,760 --> 00:34:32,480
Speaker 2: knows if I would have made it through all this stuff.

650
00:34:33,680 --> 00:34:36,680
Speaker 1: I didn't even want to stop this momentum because you're

651
00:34:36,800 --> 00:34:40,160
Speaker 1: just your story is just so incredible. And then every

652
00:34:40,200 --> 00:34:42,680
Speaker 1: time I think I've heard it all, it's just another

653
00:34:42,760 --> 00:34:46,319
Speaker 1: height that you've reached after reaching the lowest lows. It's

654
00:34:46,360 --> 00:34:49,719
Speaker 1: pretty incredible, and it's amazing how much music has been

655
00:34:49,760 --> 00:34:52,360
Speaker 1: a part of it. And obviously this question I'm going

656
00:34:52,400 --> 00:34:53,759
Speaker 1: to ask you, I'm going to guess I know the

657
00:34:53,800 --> 00:34:57,040
Speaker 1: answer to Do you believe that music has healing powers?

658
00:34:57,800 --> 00:35:00,000
Speaker 3: I think it's one of the strongest.

659
00:35:00,120 --> 00:35:03,279
Speaker 2: I mean, we know it scientifically right through, like you know,

660
00:35:03,360 --> 00:35:06,440
Speaker 2: different frequencies and stuff you know that are able to

661
00:35:06,480 --> 00:35:10,680
Speaker 2: heal soundbats, and you know, there's so much scientific research,

662
00:35:10,760 --> 00:35:13,920
Speaker 2: but just as far as the personal, yes, I think

663
00:35:13,920 --> 00:35:17,160
Speaker 2: it's one of the most healing things ever. You know,

664
00:35:17,480 --> 00:35:20,480
Speaker 2: I've had songs that I needed to write, like when

665
00:35:20,480 --> 00:35:24,040
Speaker 2: the mother and my children passed, or when I was

666
00:35:24,040 --> 00:35:27,240
Speaker 2: first coming home and I didn't really have that relationship

667
00:35:27,280 --> 00:35:30,600
Speaker 2: back with my daughters yet that I'd have these songs.

668
00:35:31,560 --> 00:35:33,640
Speaker 2: They take me months to write because every time I'd

669
00:35:33,640 --> 00:35:36,520
Speaker 2: get emotional when I try to write it. But once

670
00:35:36,600 --> 00:35:38,239
Speaker 2: I got that out on the paper and once I

671
00:35:38,360 --> 00:35:42,960
Speaker 2: sang it through that microphone, not only did I get

672
00:35:43,000 --> 00:35:45,000
Speaker 2: a level of healing, but then being able to play

673
00:35:45,000 --> 00:35:49,000
Speaker 2: it for them and then understand and have that to

674
00:35:49,000 --> 00:35:50,000
Speaker 2: hold on to as well.

675
00:35:50,040 --> 00:35:52,359
Speaker 3: It's just a whole nother you know.

676
00:35:52,680 --> 00:35:56,279
Speaker 2: I think music has definitely been what's healed me more

677
00:35:56,320 --> 00:35:57,360
Speaker 2: than anything else.

678
00:35:58,200 --> 00:36:00,799
Speaker 1: Who are so much artists that you listen into when

679
00:36:00,840 --> 00:36:04,080
Speaker 1: you're having sort of a difficult time or maybe that

680
00:36:04,160 --> 00:36:07,560
Speaker 1: you can recall you listen to in times of darkness.

681
00:36:08,200 --> 00:36:12,160
Speaker 2: I mean there's so many, you know, and different levels

682
00:36:12,200 --> 00:36:16,560
Speaker 2: of different years and who was everything from you know

683
00:36:17,719 --> 00:36:22,759
Speaker 2: old country, nineties country, George Street and George John like

684
00:36:22,840 --> 00:36:27,080
Speaker 2: heartbreak songs, or you know Ed Sheeran has had there's

685
00:36:27,120 --> 00:36:29,799
Speaker 2: He's had a couple of songs. There's an artist named

686
00:36:29,880 --> 00:36:33,200
Speaker 2: Ron Pope who he had some songs that got me

687
00:36:33,239 --> 00:36:37,799
Speaker 2: through some really really dark times. Let's go Chris Stapleton,

688
00:36:38,239 --> 00:36:41,440
Speaker 2: you know, I mean there's just so many, you know,

689
00:36:41,480 --> 00:36:43,839
Speaker 2: you can go back to, you know, Whaland songs and

690
00:36:44,480 --> 00:36:47,480
Speaker 2: Tupac songs. You know old rat that was just telling

691
00:36:47,520 --> 00:36:51,600
Speaker 2: those stories. There's there's so many, you know. I couldn't

692
00:36:51,600 --> 00:36:52,720
Speaker 2: pinpoint one artist.

693
00:36:53,040 --> 00:36:56,759
Speaker 1: That would be a whole other show, isn't it. Well,

694
00:36:56,840 --> 00:37:00,480
Speaker 1: you know, speaking of artists, one of your bestie? Can

695
00:37:00,520 --> 00:37:03,120
Speaker 1: I say that about guys best?

696
00:37:03,560 --> 00:37:03,960
Speaker 3: Actually?

697
00:37:04,120 --> 00:37:07,040
Speaker 2: When I just when I just went to the ad MS,

698
00:37:07,560 --> 00:37:11,880
Speaker 2: the ATHM Awards last year and in Texas, uh, you know,

699
00:37:11,920 --> 00:37:14,840
Speaker 2: you get your credentials, and Jelly was up for a

700
00:37:14,840 --> 00:37:15,680
Speaker 2: bunch of awards.

701
00:37:15,680 --> 00:37:17,600
Speaker 3: I wasn't out for any awards or anything, but I.

702
00:37:17,600 --> 00:37:21,800
Speaker 2: Was there as his guest and my credential, said Struggle

703
00:37:21,920 --> 00:37:24,480
Speaker 2: Jennings artist Jelly Rolls bestie.

704
00:37:24,760 --> 00:37:27,799
Speaker 1: Oh good, So I'm not the only one that called

705
00:37:27,840 --> 00:37:32,200
Speaker 1: me that. I love that so much? Can you tell

706
00:37:32,200 --> 00:37:36,520
Speaker 1: me I love him too? How important is that brotherhood

707
00:37:36,680 --> 00:37:39,760
Speaker 1: with someone like Jelly Roll on your on your journey?

708
00:37:40,520 --> 00:37:42,439
Speaker 2: Well, it's been everything, you know, I mean, it's been

709
00:37:42,520 --> 00:37:47,400
Speaker 2: it's been such a major role. He we met I

710
00:37:47,480 --> 00:37:51,000
Speaker 2: was fresh out of a jail sentence, raising two kids

711
00:37:51,000 --> 00:37:51,719
Speaker 2: by myself.

712
00:37:52,200 --> 00:37:52,680
Speaker 3: I think I.

713
00:37:54,480 --> 00:37:57,359
Speaker 2: Hadn't even had my third child yet when I when

714
00:37:57,520 --> 00:38:01,200
Speaker 2: we met and he just got out of jail or

715
00:38:01,320 --> 00:38:05,439
Speaker 2: juvenile because he was still young and he was out

716
00:38:05,520 --> 00:38:08,600
Speaker 2: selling CDs and doing rap battles and I was promoting

717
00:38:08,600 --> 00:38:10,799
Speaker 2: the show and selling my CD and we met and

718
00:38:10,920 --> 00:38:12,600
Speaker 2: just automatically clicked.

719
00:38:13,560 --> 00:38:17,200
Speaker 3: And going on twenty three years of a friendship.

720
00:38:17,239 --> 00:38:20,719
Speaker 2: You know, he slept on my couch and I've watched him,

721
00:38:21,239 --> 00:38:25,640
Speaker 2: you know, grow and become who he's becoming. Not only

722
00:38:25,640 --> 00:38:28,600
Speaker 2: did our friendship because we were in the streets together.

723
00:38:28,719 --> 00:38:30,480
Speaker 2: You know, we we did a lot of things. We

724
00:38:30,520 --> 00:38:32,560
Speaker 2: carried a lot of caskets together, We lost a lot

725
00:38:32,560 --> 00:38:38,800
Speaker 2: of friends. We both did time, you know, during our friendship.

726
00:38:38,840 --> 00:38:47,279
Speaker 2: And having somebody that you just always know is there

727
00:38:47,320 --> 00:38:52,200
Speaker 2: for you, you know, has been such a major part

728
00:38:52,200 --> 00:38:56,160
Speaker 2: of it because there's you know, I think a lot

729
00:38:56,160 --> 00:38:59,520
Speaker 2: of people make a lot more That's why I believe

730
00:38:59,560 --> 00:39:00,799
Speaker 2: in support system so much.

731
00:39:00,920 --> 00:39:03,280
Speaker 3: I believe that a lot of people make a lot worse.

732
00:39:03,400 --> 00:39:06,239
Speaker 2: Decisions when they feel like they're all alone and they

733
00:39:06,239 --> 00:39:11,000
Speaker 2: have nobody, you know, the level of desperation or the

734
00:39:11,120 --> 00:39:12,279
Speaker 2: level of loneliness and.

735
00:39:13,560 --> 00:39:15,000
Speaker 3: Feeling like you have nothing to lose.

736
00:39:15,000 --> 00:39:17,880
Speaker 2: And there's something Jelly's always given me is feeling like

737
00:39:17,920 --> 00:39:21,120
Speaker 2: I had something to lose. You know, when I was

738
00:39:21,120 --> 00:39:27,960
Speaker 2: in prison, he you know, calling him from that jail phone.

739
00:39:28,040 --> 00:39:30,839
Speaker 3: And him being like, oh man, I'm in Missouri. I'm

740
00:39:30,880 --> 00:39:31,680
Speaker 3: in Mississippi.

741
00:39:31,680 --> 00:39:33,920
Speaker 2: You know, he was out doing shows and he was

742
00:39:33,920 --> 00:39:37,960
Speaker 2: sleeping in a van, and you know, he started telling

743
00:39:38,040 --> 00:39:40,320
Speaker 2: me as I was getting close to getting out.

744
00:39:40,239 --> 00:39:42,879
Speaker 3: Like sure, I'm telling you, this is possible. Man.

745
00:39:43,280 --> 00:39:45,680
Speaker 2: You guys made a thousand bucks last night at the show,

746
00:39:46,120 --> 00:39:47,200
Speaker 2: you know, Like why you mean a.

747
00:39:47,200 --> 00:39:49,719
Speaker 3: Thousand dollars in one night without set of drugs, like,

748
00:39:50,239 --> 00:39:50,440
Speaker 3: you know.

749
00:39:51,840 --> 00:39:55,759
Speaker 2: So there was so much inspiration and hope. And when

750
00:39:55,760 --> 00:39:58,040
Speaker 2: I came home, you know, he still didn't having figured out.

751
00:39:58,080 --> 00:40:04,000
Speaker 2: It was still you know, doing shows and sleeping in

752
00:40:04,000 --> 00:40:08,160
Speaker 2: a van still sometimes and you know he wasn't but

753
00:40:08,200 --> 00:40:11,319
Speaker 2: then he just never gave up. He kept plugging away

754
00:40:11,360 --> 00:40:15,000
Speaker 2: and uh, and it definitely was a big inspiration for

755
00:40:15,040 --> 00:40:19,480
Speaker 2: me to not give up, you know. And then we

756
00:40:19,560 --> 00:40:22,719
Speaker 2: started doing the Weaving and Willie albums together and they

757
00:40:22,800 --> 00:40:26,080
Speaker 2: just took off, and then he signed with Strange Music.

758
00:40:26,160 --> 00:40:28,239
Speaker 2: And then had the song save Me, and.

759
00:40:28,200 --> 00:40:33,320
Speaker 3: It was just like yep, now.

760
00:40:32,400 --> 00:40:34,880
Speaker 2: He's the household name, and I couldn't be more proud

761
00:40:34,920 --> 00:40:38,200
Speaker 2: of him. I love it, and he's he's still this

762
00:40:38,320 --> 00:40:41,200
Speaker 2: day my best friend. You know, we we can sometimes

763
00:40:41,280 --> 00:40:44,680
Speaker 2: talk five times a week, or sometimes we might not

764
00:40:44,760 --> 00:40:47,000
Speaker 2: talk for three or four weeks because of his schedule.

765
00:40:47,360 --> 00:40:48,719
Speaker 1: He's picked left off.

766
00:40:49,760 --> 00:40:53,160
Speaker 2: Well anytime we cost two three hour phone call. You know,

767
00:40:54,320 --> 00:40:56,840
Speaker 2: I can be that sounding board for him and he

768
00:40:56,920 --> 00:41:00,440
Speaker 2: can decompress and know that anything he says that phone

769
00:41:00,480 --> 00:41:04,040
Speaker 2: with me is a thousand percent safe and things that

770
00:41:04,360 --> 00:41:06,879
Speaker 2: you know, a lot of times, men we don't have

771
00:41:07,080 --> 00:41:12,040
Speaker 2: too many people that we can really just vent and

772
00:41:12,160 --> 00:41:15,279
Speaker 2: lay it all on, you know, like our wives, or

773
00:41:15,280 --> 00:41:18,880
Speaker 2: our children, or our mothers or everybody kind of looks

774
00:41:18,960 --> 00:41:21,239
Speaker 2: to us to be that strength in that backbone.

775
00:41:21,280 --> 00:41:24,560
Speaker 3: So in our moments of weakness sometimes it's hard. You know,

776
00:41:24,600 --> 00:41:25,240
Speaker 3: we try.

777
00:41:25,040 --> 00:41:30,360
Speaker 2: To hold that into shield others from feeling you know,

778
00:41:30,719 --> 00:41:33,239
Speaker 2: getting nervous or ANTSI you know, we got to act

779
00:41:33,280 --> 00:41:34,360
Speaker 2: like we've got it all together.

780
00:41:38,000 --> 00:41:41,520
Speaker 3: So me and him have that in each other.

781
00:41:41,560 --> 00:41:45,560
Speaker 2: And you know, I don't call him because I respect

782
00:41:45,600 --> 00:41:47,959
Speaker 2: his time and I know how busy he is, all right.

783
00:41:48,280 --> 00:41:49,120
Speaker 3: I mean, if I had.

784
00:41:48,960 --> 00:41:52,040
Speaker 2: Something, you know, that I really needed to talk to

785
00:41:52,120 --> 00:41:54,560
Speaker 2: him about, it was like an important or something, I

786
00:41:54,560 --> 00:41:57,319
Speaker 2: would call him. I'm not saying I don't ever call him,

787
00:41:57,320 --> 00:42:00,080
Speaker 2: but I just I kind of try to be that

788
00:42:00,239 --> 00:42:02,600
Speaker 2: friend that is just like he knows he can call

789
00:42:02,640 --> 00:42:05,040
Speaker 2: me at any time, and I'm going to shut the

790
00:42:05,080 --> 00:42:07,000
Speaker 2: world down and give him those two or three hours

791
00:42:07,000 --> 00:42:10,799
Speaker 2: that he needs because he's he's really busy right now.

792
00:42:10,840 --> 00:42:14,080
Speaker 2: He's going through a lot a lot of changes, you know,

793
00:42:14,200 --> 00:42:17,560
Speaker 2: from coming from where we came from and going through

794
00:42:17,560 --> 00:42:20,439
Speaker 2: what he's went through to now being the biggest star

795
00:42:20,520 --> 00:42:21,560
Speaker 2: on the face of the planet.

796
00:42:21,600 --> 00:42:23,120
Speaker 3: You know, there's a lot of pressure in that. There's

797
00:42:23,120 --> 00:42:25,680
Speaker 3: a lot of you know, I know he's so busy.

798
00:42:25,719 --> 00:42:28,839
Speaker 2: He's got people pulling them a hundred different ways, right

799
00:42:30,000 --> 00:42:31,840
Speaker 2: So being able to be that support for him and

800
00:42:31,920 --> 00:42:32,799
Speaker 2: just be that guy for.

801
00:42:32,800 --> 00:42:35,480
Speaker 3: Him that's always there for him means the world to me.

802
00:42:35,840 --> 00:42:39,880
Speaker 1: You know, two things, keeping each other grounded and also

803
00:42:40,200 --> 00:42:43,080
Speaker 1: knowing that as much as it's great to ride to

804
00:42:43,200 --> 00:42:46,279
Speaker 1: the success levels, there's also pitfalls that come with it,

805
00:42:46,400 --> 00:42:50,080
Speaker 1: and I'm sure he needs the safety of your friendship

806
00:42:50,920 --> 00:42:51,880
Speaker 1: even though he's.

807
00:42:51,960 --> 00:42:55,040
Speaker 3: Always have it and always have it.

808
00:42:55,040 --> 00:42:57,839
Speaker 2: It really is holding each other accountable to you know,

809
00:42:58,000 --> 00:43:02,520
Speaker 2: like he calls me all my sh it. You know,

810
00:43:02,640 --> 00:43:06,520
Speaker 2: he's like struggle or you're not being accountable or not

811
00:43:06,560 --> 00:43:08,040
Speaker 2: holding yourself accountable right now?

812
00:43:08,760 --> 00:43:09,640
Speaker 3: Why did that happen?

813
00:43:09,800 --> 00:43:11,560
Speaker 1: You know, that's a nice way of putting it.

814
00:43:12,120 --> 00:43:14,800
Speaker 3: Yeah. Well, he likes to give me my own medicine.

815
00:43:14,400 --> 00:43:16,680
Speaker 2: You know, Yes, you know, I got to hear my

816
00:43:16,760 --> 00:43:19,840
Speaker 2: own sermons sometimes from somebody else.

817
00:43:20,320 --> 00:43:23,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, like what would you say to yourself? What would

818
00:43:23,200 --> 00:43:25,960
Speaker 1: you tell me? Tell yourself that same thing kind of

819
00:43:26,480 --> 00:43:28,160
Speaker 1: advice it Jelly does that.

820
00:43:28,239 --> 00:43:34,120
Speaker 2: He uses uh, he uses my own sayings against me,

821
00:43:34,400 --> 00:43:34,960
Speaker 2: not against me.

822
00:43:35,000 --> 00:43:35,880
Speaker 3: It's for me, you know.

823
00:43:36,680 --> 00:43:39,279
Speaker 2: Yeah, but you need that, you need you know, if

824
00:43:39,320 --> 00:43:42,439
Speaker 2: you're surrounded by yes men or people that just tell

825
00:43:42,480 --> 00:43:46,680
Speaker 2: you what you want to hear, or you know, condone

826
00:43:47,520 --> 00:43:49,479
Speaker 2: your bad behavior rights, We're all going to slip.

827
00:43:49,480 --> 00:43:52,399
Speaker 3: We're all going to make mistakes. That never stops, right.

828
00:43:52,480 --> 00:43:57,680
Speaker 2: It's really just realizing when you make those, taking accountability

829
00:43:57,800 --> 00:44:02,040
Speaker 2: for him and then it because it's really not about

830
00:44:02,040 --> 00:44:03,880
Speaker 2: how many times you falls, about how many times you

831
00:44:03,920 --> 00:44:04,520
Speaker 2: get back up.

832
00:44:05,360 --> 00:44:08,040
Speaker 3: You know, we all have were riddled with human nature.

833
00:44:08,480 --> 00:44:12,600
Speaker 1: Mistakes. I like to say mistakes are tuition, you know,

834
00:44:12,719 --> 00:44:16,359
Speaker 1: if you use them correctly, then they're not mistakes. Yeah,

835
00:44:16,680 --> 00:44:19,200
Speaker 1: and sometimes you have to have a piano. A friend

836
00:44:19,200 --> 00:44:22,080
Speaker 1: of mine said this once. It was so sometimes you

837
00:44:22,120 --> 00:44:24,280
Speaker 1: know when like a piano just falls on your head,

838
00:44:24,719 --> 00:44:26,839
Speaker 1: like those are those moments that you need to wake up,

839
00:44:27,040 --> 00:44:31,960
Speaker 1: you know whatever that you know incredibly. I saw a

840
00:44:32,080 --> 00:44:34,680
Speaker 1: video and I believe it just happened this past year,

841
00:44:34,680 --> 00:44:36,960
Speaker 1: and I just want to congratulate you when you were

842
00:44:37,000 --> 00:44:40,719
Speaker 1: invited to the grandel Opry. I'm falling watching the video

843
00:44:40,800 --> 00:44:42,640
Speaker 1: over asking you, well.

844
00:44:43,719 --> 00:44:44,800
Speaker 3: I didn't know what's going to happen.

845
00:44:44,880 --> 00:44:46,560
Speaker 2: He told me I needed to come down there today

846
00:44:46,680 --> 00:44:50,280
Speaker 2: CMS and there was like a little grandell'd opery event

847
00:44:50,320 --> 00:44:52,719
Speaker 2: that he wanted me to come to. And when did

848
00:44:52,760 --> 00:44:55,640
Speaker 2: Billy Bob's with them the night before? And so I'm

849
00:44:55,640 --> 00:44:59,080
Speaker 2: in there and the vent's cool or whatever, but I

850
00:44:59,120 --> 00:45:01,720
Speaker 2: was like, eh, I'm I might have a drink or something,

851
00:45:01,960 --> 00:45:03,839
Speaker 2: you know. So I mows you over to the bar

852
00:45:03,960 --> 00:45:06,719
Speaker 2: and I'm talking to other artists and hanging out, and

853
00:45:06,880 --> 00:45:10,319
Speaker 2: I see him coming across the room and I can

854
00:45:10,360 --> 00:45:11,280
Speaker 2: tell that he's upset.

855
00:45:12,040 --> 00:45:14,279
Speaker 3: But he's like teary ad and he gets up on

856
00:45:14,440 --> 00:45:16,960
Speaker 3: me and I'm paying attention to him.

857
00:45:16,960 --> 00:45:19,399
Speaker 2: So I didn't even realize there was cameras around us, right,

858
00:45:19,440 --> 00:45:22,359
Speaker 2: but they were like camera crew's following him. But I'm

859
00:45:22,400 --> 00:45:25,200
Speaker 2: locked into his eyes because I can see he's like

860
00:45:25,600 --> 00:45:28,520
Speaker 2: choked up. He's like, man, I got to tell you something.

861
00:45:29,480 --> 00:45:32,960
Speaker 2: And my first thing because of our history, and you know,

862
00:45:32,960 --> 00:45:35,560
Speaker 2: I thought somebody had died, you know, like we lost

863
00:45:35,560 --> 00:45:39,080
Speaker 2: one of our best friends, like our little nephew a

864
00:45:39,160 --> 00:45:42,560
Speaker 2: year two years before that, the day me and him

865
00:45:42,560 --> 00:45:44,960
Speaker 2: were doing Red Rocks together, we got the call that

866
00:45:45,000 --> 00:45:47,799
Speaker 2: he had got killed outside of a club in Nashville,

867
00:45:48,719 --> 00:45:49,560
Speaker 2: our nephew, Nate.

868
00:45:49,719 --> 00:45:52,600
Speaker 3: And so it's like we've had so many of those

869
00:45:52,680 --> 00:45:54,480
Speaker 3: kind of moments.

870
00:45:54,040 --> 00:45:57,160
Speaker 2: That I just automatically went into like what's wrong, what's wrong,

871
00:45:57,200 --> 00:46:00,759
Speaker 2: what's wrong? And then he's like they've invited you to

872
00:46:00,760 --> 00:46:01,960
Speaker 2: play the grand old Opery.

873
00:46:03,719 --> 00:46:05,919
Speaker 1: He couldn't even get the words out, he couldn't even

874
00:46:05,960 --> 00:46:06,359
Speaker 1: say it.

875
00:46:06,880 --> 00:46:08,879
Speaker 3: I'd betther look on my face of the video.

876
00:46:08,960 --> 00:46:10,600
Speaker 2: I laugh at it all the time because it was

877
00:46:10,719 --> 00:46:15,799
Speaker 2: like a whirlwind of emotions going from thinking somebody's died

878
00:46:15,960 --> 00:46:18,680
Speaker 2: or something's really wrong to Oh my God, this is

879
00:46:18,719 --> 00:46:21,320
Speaker 2: one of the greatest honors I could ever get, and

880
00:46:21,360 --> 00:46:24,399
Speaker 2: I don't take something else. How God likes to give

881
00:46:24,440 --> 00:46:26,080
Speaker 2: little winks every once in a while and let you

882
00:46:26,160 --> 00:46:26,960
Speaker 2: know you're doing right.

883
00:46:27,800 --> 00:46:30,759
Speaker 3: My Grand Old Opry debut, I didn't get to pick

884
00:46:30,800 --> 00:46:31,719
Speaker 3: the date, you know.

885
00:46:31,760 --> 00:46:34,240
Speaker 2: They said, well, this is the day that you're gonna

886
00:46:34,880 --> 00:46:36,440
Speaker 2: that we want you to come do.

887
00:46:36,520 --> 00:46:39,680
Speaker 3: The Grand Old Opry fell on the same day is

888
00:46:39,760 --> 00:46:40,840
Speaker 3: my last day of parole.

889
00:46:42,719 --> 00:46:44,960
Speaker 2: So I walked out on the stage at the Grand

890
00:46:44,960 --> 00:46:48,839
Speaker 2: Old Opry a free man, and it was like one

891
00:46:48,840 --> 00:46:51,440
Speaker 2: of those wings from God saying this is the end

892
00:46:51,480 --> 00:46:52,239
Speaker 2: of one chapter in.

893
00:46:52,280 --> 00:46:53,200
Speaker 3: The beginning of another.

894
00:46:54,239 --> 00:46:55,960
Speaker 1: You know it sure was.

895
00:46:56,280 --> 00:46:59,800
Speaker 3: You can't make it up, man, can't make it up.

896
00:46:59,080 --> 00:47:02,839
Speaker 3: It's just so beautiful. How if you just stay in

897
00:47:02,840 --> 00:47:04,560
Speaker 3: tune and you stay in line.

898
00:47:04,239 --> 00:47:08,160
Speaker 2: And you listen and you pay attention, do your best

899
00:47:08,200 --> 00:47:13,160
Speaker 2: to be your best and be humble and grateful, so

900
00:47:13,360 --> 00:47:17,719
Speaker 2: much amazing things fall into place, things we could never

901
00:47:17,760 --> 00:47:18,480
Speaker 2: even design.

902
00:47:18,880 --> 00:47:22,880
Speaker 1: You know, Struggle Jennings, thank you so much for coming

903
00:47:22,960 --> 00:47:26,040
Speaker 1: on Music Save Me and sharing your story with us. Well,

904
00:47:26,200 --> 00:47:28,839
Speaker 1: thank you, really, I mean, just wonderful, wonderful stuff that

905
00:47:28,880 --> 00:47:31,040
Speaker 1: you're doing, and keep doing what you're doing, and that's

906
00:47:31,040 --> 00:47:34,759
Speaker 1: what we're doing here and highlighting stories like you love

907
00:47:34,800 --> 00:47:37,200
Speaker 1: It are just some of the most amazing things that

908
00:47:37,400 --> 00:47:39,520
Speaker 1: I feel like I've ever been a part of. So

909
00:47:39,600 --> 00:47:42,520
Speaker 1: thanks for coming on to share it and for the liteners.

910
00:47:43,040 --> 00:47:45,840
Speaker 3: Thank you doing what you're doing. Thanks keep touching lives.

911
00:47:46,080 --> 00:47:46,880
Speaker 3: People need to hear it.