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Speaker 3: Hey Daniel, do you ever wish you'd studied a more

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Speaker 3: practical science?

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Speaker 1: What do you mean?

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Speaker 3: I think you know what I mean?

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Speaker 1: If you study, you mean, should I have studied something

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Speaker 1: that has actual practical applications that could help people in

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Speaker 1: their everyday lives?

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Speaker 3: Yeah? You know something that saves people's lives for example,

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Speaker 3: or you know, or turned lead into gold.

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Speaker 1: Well, those are great examples because those are the two

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Speaker 1: things that particle physics actually does do.

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Speaker 3: I thought turning lead into gold was alchemy. You know,

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Speaker 3: is pseudoscience from hundreds of years ago.

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Speaker 1: It used to be pseudoscience, but now we have made

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Speaker 1: it real science. Particle physics can actually do this, But

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Speaker 1: as always there's a catch.

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Speaker 3: Welcome to our podcast. This is Annul and Jorge Explain

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Speaker 3: the Universe, a production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 1: In which we look all around the universe and try

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Speaker 1: to find fascinating little nuggets of intellectual gold, or turn

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Speaker 1: mysterious nuggets of intellectual lead into nuggets of understandable intellectual gold.

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Speaker 3: That's right. We are podcasts alchemists turning bad jokes into

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Speaker 3: comedy gold.

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Speaker 1: That's right. We turn the mysterious into the understandable.

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Speaker 3: Physics can do anything.

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Speaker 1: We still haven't figured out teleportation or anti gravity or

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Speaker 1: warp drives or you know, how to make my internet

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Speaker 1: actually go quickly?

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Speaker 3: Still a mystery for me for sure. Here at my house.

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Speaker 1: We'll probably figure out teleportation before we figure out fast

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Speaker 1: internet at home.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, which one's more impossible. I don't know.

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Speaker 1: If I could just teleport the data from Netflix to

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Speaker 1: my TV, I wouldn't need the Internet.

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Speaker 3: Maybe that is how they do it.

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Speaker 1: That's how they should do it. At least somebody over

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Speaker 1: at Netflix is pouring a billion dollars into their teleportation

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Speaker 1: department right now.

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Speaker 3: So to be on a podcast, we are tackling a

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Speaker 3: topic that used to be considered a magic hundreds of

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Speaker 3: years ago. Right, alchemy, this idea that you can transmute

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Speaker 3: or transform one element into a totally different element.

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Speaker 1: That's right. And that was back in the day when

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Speaker 1: they thought that what we consider the elements were the

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Speaker 1: fundamental building blocks of the universe. You know, they were like,

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Speaker 1: here we found these things that make up everything, and

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Speaker 1: you combine them in different ways to make cool stuff.

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Speaker 1: But they seemed to be sort of the basic building blocks.

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Speaker 1: They hadn't yet broken them up and found the smaller bits,

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Speaker 1: and so it made sense that people were like, well,

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Speaker 1: is it possible to change one kind of thing into

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Speaker 1: another kind of thing? Because you know, one kind of thing,

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Speaker 1: like lead, you can find it not too without much difficulty,

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Speaker 1: and it's not that valuable, while other kinds of things

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Speaker 1: like tremendously valuable, So it seemed appealing not just from

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Speaker 1: the economic point of view, but from the sort of

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Speaker 1: deep understanding point of view, like can we turn one

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Speaker 1: thing into another kind of thing?

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Speaker 3: To they on the program, we'll be talking about how

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Speaker 3: do you make gold? How do you make the shiny

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Speaker 3: golden stuff that everybody, every human seems to want for

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Speaker 3: some weird and almost arbitrary reason.

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Speaker 1: That's right, well, that's economics, right, It's all arbitrary, And

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Speaker 1: it's not just about how do we make gold or

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Speaker 1: how could you make gold? Or could you fabricate gold

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Speaker 1: in your garage? But it's like how does the universe

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Speaker 1: make gold? Like where does gold come from? Right? Was

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Speaker 1: it created during the Big Bang? Is it made in

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Speaker 1: the core of the Earth. Is it all made in

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Speaker 1: the lab of somebody somewhere in Europe, you know, underground somewhere,

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Speaker 1: or is there some other mysterious process? How is gold made?

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Speaker 3: Are we going to be selling gold making kits at

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Speaker 3: the end of this podcast, Daniel could probably make a

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Speaker 3: lot of money just be a box of lead with

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Speaker 3: some instructions that say step one, raise a quadrillion dollars,

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Speaker 3: Step two, build a particle, collider.

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Speaker 1: Done, we have a particle collider. You just need to

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Speaker 1: apply for time at the Large Hadron Collider. So yeah,

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Speaker 1: we'll send you a lump of gold and instructions for

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Speaker 1: how to get discern.

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Speaker 3: Step one, apply apply, fill out this application.

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Speaker 1: Sure, yeah, first send us forty nine ninety nine and

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Speaker 1: you'll get these incredible items.

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Speaker 3: Technically, it would be a real thing like it is

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Speaker 3: actually the steps of how to make gold.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you really can. I think it's sort of cool

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Speaker 1: that we have understood the way the universe works, this

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Speaker 1: sort of elemental understanding, to a point where we do

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Speaker 1: see how these things are put together. We can understand

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Speaker 1: them from the ground up. You know, how to assemble

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Speaker 1: protons and neutrons and what makes something gold and something else.

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Speaker 1: Led to the point where we can actually change them

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Speaker 1: from one to the other. I mean it's not economically feasible,

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Speaker 1: but we do have the power. We have conquered this

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Speaker 1: barrier of the elements.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Well, why do you think humans are so fascinated

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Speaker 3: with gold? Like, out of all the elements? Why why

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Speaker 3: is gold so special in human culture?

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Speaker 1: I think I have to refer to a comic made

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Speaker 1: by my good friend, and whyse comic who said humans

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Speaker 1: like sparkly things.

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Speaker 3: That's something my grandma always used to say.

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Speaker 1: Why is it every time you say something sort of wise,

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Speaker 1: you just attributed to your grandma.

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Speaker 3: She was a wise woman.

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Speaker 1: I think it's just your humility. You don't want to

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Speaker 1: come off sounding like you think your intelligence. You attribute

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Speaker 1: this to this fictional grandma.

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Speaker 3: I think I just don't want to reveal that I

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Speaker 3: have no idea where I got that quote.

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Speaker 1: So anonymous becomes Jorge's grandma.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, so people like shiny, sparkly things. And that's what

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Speaker 3: gold is, right. It doesn't stain right, it doesn't rust

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Speaker 3: when you make something out of gold. It just always

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Speaker 3: stays shiny, right, that's what's special about it.

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Speaker 1: Well, yeah, of course, and the other special thing is

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Speaker 1: that it's rare. Right. You don't find a lump of

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Speaker 1: gold under every rock. It's not in lots of places,

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Speaker 1: and so because it's hard to get, that makes it valuable. Right.

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Speaker 1: But it's sort of this weird thing. I mean, my

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Speaker 1: kids asked me this question, like why does gold cost

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Speaker 1: so much? And it really is just, you know, something

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Speaker 1: we've all decided on. You know, it's this weird thing.

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Speaker 1: I never really understood about economics is that the value

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Speaker 1: of something is really just what people are willing to

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Speaker 1: pay for it. So we all decided that, you know,

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Speaker 1: something else was better than gold, and we were willing

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Speaker 1: to pay for it, then we would just read it

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Speaker 1: this enormous wealth, right.

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Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, Welcome to the new podcast Daniel and Jorge

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Speaker 3: explain economics.

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Speaker 1: Daniel and jorgey are clueless a bout economics and pontificate ignorantly.

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Speaker 3: Now, But there is something special about gold itself as

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Speaker 3: a metal, right, It is shinier than most other elements, right,

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Speaker 3: and it doesn't rust, and it's it's easy to make smooth. Right,

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Speaker 3: It's something there's something special about it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's malleable in this cool way, you know, but

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Speaker 1: it's it is still arbitrary. It's you know, it's like beauty, right,

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Speaker 1: it's just what we decide. We think it's cool, we

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Speaker 1: think it's interesting. We think it looks good on jewelry

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Speaker 1: and stuff. You know, why is gold so much more

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Speaker 1: valuable than silver? You know, it is more rare and

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Speaker 1: people do like it more, But it helds a special place,

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Speaker 1: you know.

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Speaker 3: Do you think it's somehow related to our evolution to

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Speaker 3: sort of like sunlight and you know, shiny light and

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Speaker 3: gold that particularly gold color.

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Speaker 1: Oh man, I think that whole field of science is maloney.

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Speaker 1: Is like attempt to evolutionary psychology, like this attempt to

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Speaker 1: say like maybe we'd act this way because it could

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Speaker 1: have been preferable medal and the savannah or something like

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Speaker 1: uh huh, I think that you can make You can

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Speaker 1: explain almost anything using that kind of logic.

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Speaker 3: Well, anyway, so it's rare on Earth, and that's an

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Speaker 3: interesting question. Why is it rare? And how do how

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Speaker 3: is it made? And could we make it here in

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Speaker 3: a lab for example?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. And you know, if you start thinking about

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Speaker 1: like where this stuff comes from, you might wonder like

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Speaker 1: how does this stuff all get made? You know, how

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Speaker 1: did things begin? You know, did was all the stuff

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Speaker 1: in the universe made in the first bill a second

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Speaker 1: you know, made during the Big Bang? Or would the

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Speaker 1: big bang just make hydrogen and everything else get assembled later?

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Speaker 1: These are really fascinating questions, and it's the kind of

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Speaker 1: thing that really it's sort of the kind of puzzle

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Speaker 1: that scientists can use to understand the mechanisms of the universe,

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Speaker 1: like what's going on in the universe. Can we explain

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Speaker 1: how much hydrogen there is, and how much iron there is,

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Speaker 1: and how much of this there is. It's a huge

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Speaker 1: amount of really specific data that helps us understand what's

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Speaker 1: going on in the universe. We let's us build models

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Speaker 1: to try to explain what we've seen. And because the

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Speaker 1: data is so specific, there's so many different elements and

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Speaker 1: we can measure their abundance. It gives us a lot

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Speaker 1: of handles for understanding like what's going on inside stars

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Speaker 1: and inside other astrophysical objects.

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Speaker 3: Oh, I see. It's kind of a question of did

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Speaker 3: all the ingredients for the universe that we see around

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Speaker 3: us right now, was that all there from the beginning

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Speaker 3: at the Big bang? You know, that everything that we

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Speaker 3: need to make the universe as it is now get

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Speaker 3: created in those first few moments, or did the universe

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Speaker 3: get created one way and then the ingredients of it

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Speaker 3: change over time exactly?

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Speaker 1: And it's just part of this larger question of do

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Speaker 1: we understand what's around us? You know, we look around

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Speaker 1: us and we see, okay, we've seen this stuff. Do

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Speaker 1: we understand how it got there? So we try to

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Speaker 1: tell a story, you know, and we want to make

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Speaker 1: sure that the story makes sense? Do we know how

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Speaker 1: the story began? Do we understand why went this way

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Speaker 1: and not the other way? And so, as a part,

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Speaker 1: it's been like one hundred years we've been trying to

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Speaker 1: piece this story together to explain why we see what

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Speaker 1: you know, the stuff we see in the universe, and

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Speaker 1: where it is. Can we understand it? So it's a

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Speaker 1: pretty big question.

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Speaker 3: And so today on the podcast, we're talking about one

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Speaker 3: specific thing, which is gold, and so we were wondering

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Speaker 3: how many people out there know where gold is made

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Speaker 3: or how it's made.

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Speaker 1: I walked around the campus you see, Irvine, and I

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Speaker 1: popped this question to a bunch of unsuspecting students or

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Speaker 1: whoever else would happen to be around campus that day,

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Speaker 1: and I asked them where do you think gold is made?

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Speaker 1: So before you listen to these answers, think for yourself

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Speaker 1: for a moment. Do you know where gold is made?

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Speaker 3: And if you get the right answer right, you get

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Speaker 3: a gold star, right, you know?

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Speaker 1: Or a lead star or a lead star and an

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Speaker 1: application form.

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Speaker 3: Well, here's what people had to say.

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Speaker 1: Maybe in the sun or in another planet, I'm not sure,

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Speaker 1: being like fusions in like the center of stars.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm not sure I would say big bang, like

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Speaker 3: in the Earth's cruss through collision, please uh.

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Speaker 4: I have no idea chemically or physically like whatever happens

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Speaker 4: within core, like gold.

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Speaker 3: Funds, aliens, like thous species.

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Speaker 4: After many or so later, it's just naturally rotted and

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Speaker 4: it becomes cold.

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Speaker 3: All right, A lot of interesting answers, and honestly, they

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Speaker 3: all seem kind of plausible to me. You know, some

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Speaker 3: people said that gold is made inside of the Earth,

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Speaker 3: at the core, the core of the Earth, or inside

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Speaker 3: the stars, or.

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Speaker 1: The first ones you mentioned. The ones people said maybe

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Speaker 1: it was made inside the earth. That puzzled me for

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Speaker 1: a bit until somebody said, you know, kind of like diamonds.

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Speaker 1: Then I realized, yeah, that's true. Diamonds really are made

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Speaker 1: inside the earth. It's the pressure of the Earth on

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Speaker 1: carbon that creates these incredible crystals. And so it is

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Speaker 1: plausible to think, like you know, jewels and gold, maybe

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Speaker 1: they're just made in high temperature reactions inside the Earth.

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Speaker 1: So I understood the line of thinking after a bit.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, because it's it's also kind of a rare and

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Speaker 3: valuable thing, and maybe people associate rare and valuable with

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Speaker 3: the things taking a long time to make and extreme conditions.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and like many plausible ideas, it's totally wrong.

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Speaker 3: No gold start for you, exactly exactly. Well, let's get

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Speaker 3: into this idea of gold. What do we know about gold?

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Speaker 1: Well, it's shiny and it looks good on your finger.

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Speaker 1: But the think the thing to understand is that gold

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Speaker 1: is one of the elements, right, and the identity of

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Speaker 1: these elements is determined by how many protons there are

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Speaker 1: in the nucleus. So remember every everything that's elemental is

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Speaker 1: just an atom, right, It's not a mixture of different elements.

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Speaker 1: It's just an atom. And the atom has a nucleus

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Speaker 1: inside it, and the nucleus has protons and neutrons. And

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Speaker 1: the thing that determines the identity which element you are?

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Speaker 1: Are you hydrogen, are you helium? Are you nickel? Are

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Speaker 1: you uranium? Is the number of protons in the nucleus.

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Speaker 3: Right, Because all these elements, they're not They're all just

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Speaker 3: variations of the same thing, right, like different combinations of

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Speaker 3: the same thing. Righted to that, we used to think

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Speaker 3: that carbon and oxygen or like its own thing in

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Speaker 3: the universe, but actually turned out that they're just the

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Speaker 3: same thing, just rearranged differently.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and it's more about the numbers. Like you take

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Speaker 1: one proton and one electron, you get hydrogen, right, you

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Speaker 1: add another proton and another electron to balance it out electrically,

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Speaker 1: and you get helium. And so it's just the number

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Speaker 1: of servings you get, right, that determines which element you are.

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Speaker 1: And you're right. It's fascinating that these things aren't fundamental,

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Speaker 1: but they are just made at the same things, but

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Speaker 1: they're so vastly different. Right. Iron is totally different from helium.

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Speaker 1: It's totally different from silicon, from carbon, from oxygen, but

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Speaker 1: all these things are made up of the same stuff.

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Speaker 1: This is the kind of thing I blows my mind

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Speaker 1: every time I think about it, that the critical identity

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Speaker 1: of these things comes not from what they're made out of,

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Speaker 1: but just from the arrangements of the particles inside them.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. It's kind of like if you think about like

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Speaker 3: your favorite recipe of your favorite kind of food, right,

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Speaker 3: Like it's you add a lot of ingredients into it. Really,

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Speaker 3: at the end, all of those ingredients are probably just

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Speaker 3: carbon and hydrogen, right.

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Speaker 1: That's true. I don't know. I would say the critical

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Speaker 1: issue for baking is whether or not includes chocolate. It

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Speaker 1: includes chocolate. It's going to be tasty. Otherwise it's a

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Speaker 1: question mark. I don't know.

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Speaker 3: It has chocolate. It's golden wins the gold star.

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Speaker 1: That's right. And so the thing about gold is that

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Speaker 1: it's pretty heavy, right. It has a lot of protons

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Speaker 1: in the nucleus. Right, So as you add a proton

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Speaker 1: to a nucleus, it gets heavier and heavier, and you

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Speaker 1: walk your way up the periodic table, and as an assize,

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Speaker 1: you know, as.

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Speaker 3: You start with hydrogen, right, you start hydrogen is like

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Speaker 3: the simplest atom is just one proton and one electron.

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Speaker 1: That's right. That's the first thing you would make. And

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Speaker 1: that's the first thing that the universe did make, in fact,

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Speaker 1: and still it's what most of the universe is. Most

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Speaker 1: of the universe, like seventy four percent of the universe

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Speaker 1: is hydrogen. And the reason is that it's the simplest thing. Right.

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Speaker 1: But as you walk your way up the periodic table,

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Speaker 1: you add a proton, you get more more complex stuff.

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Speaker 1: And this is how we knew that there were gaps

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Speaker 1: in the periodic table. Right, we said, okay, we see

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Speaker 1: this element, we see that element, we see the other element.

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Speaker 1: We can measure how many protons there are in the

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Speaker 1: nucleus of an element, and then we put them in place,

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Speaker 1: and then we could tell oh, look there's nothing with

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Speaker 1: you know, this number of protons. How come we haven't

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Speaker 1: found anything with that number of protons, so we go

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Speaker 1: look for it and we try to make it or

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Speaker 1: this kind of stuff. It's it's cool that the identity

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Speaker 1: of the element is determined just by the number of protons.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and so you start with hydrogen, and then you

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Speaker 3: add a proton and you get helium, and then you

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Speaker 3: add another proton, and it just you go up the

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Speaker 3: list of elements and at some point you get to gold.

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Speaker 1: Right, that's right. And you know, there's one hundred and

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Speaker 1: some elements that we've discovered or created by now, and

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Speaker 1: each one is so different, and their properties are determined

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Speaker 1: really just by how many protons, which determines how many

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Speaker 1: electrons you need to balance it, and then how those

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Speaker 1: atoms interact, so like, why are some of them metallic

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Speaker 1: and some of them are conductors, and some of them

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Speaker 1: are really active and some are inactive. All all that

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Speaker 1: is determined just by how the electrons fill out their orbitals. Right,

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Speaker 1: Whether they like to interact with other atoms or not,

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Speaker 1: and that in turn is determined by how many protons

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Speaker 1: are in the nucleus. So it's really just proton counting.

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Speaker 3: So you're saying gold is really just like a fat hydrogen.

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Speaker 1: It's like a crowd of hydrogen.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it's just a cluster of a hydrogen and the

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Speaker 3: kind of right. But then then that really changes its behaviors.

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Speaker 1: It totally changes its behavior. And it's the other thing

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Speaker 1: I understand is that it's not easy to do, right.

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Speaker 1: It's not that you can just very easily take two

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Speaker 1: hydrogen atoms and make helium out of them. And the

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Speaker 1: reason is that the nuclei don't like to hang out together.

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Speaker 1: The nuclei nucleus of hydrogen atom is a proton which

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Speaker 1: is positively charged. So they're going to repel each other.

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Speaker 1: And we had a whole podcast episode about this recently.

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Speaker 1: How does this happen? And you know, they will repel

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Speaker 1: each other unless you force them together. You get them

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Speaker 1: close enough together, the strong nuclear force takes over and

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Speaker 1: then it attracts the quarks inside. Those protons attract each

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Speaker 1: other and they overcome that called that the Coulomb barrier.

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Speaker 1: Because Kulam is the guy who first thought about electromagnetic

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Speaker 1: force electrostatic forces that repel each other.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I hear. He was a cool guy.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, but there were some barriers to getting to know him.

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Speaker 3: But it's like they snap together, right, Like they repel

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Speaker 3: each other, but at some point they get so close

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Speaker 3: that they snap together and they become a different element.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. You can think of its sort of like hiking

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Speaker 1: into a volcano. Right, You're walking up the hill and

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Speaker 1: it's getting harder and harder and harder. Right, it's steeper,

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Speaker 1: The sides are getting steeper and steeper and steeper. It's

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Speaker 1: easier to roll down away from the center of the volcano.

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Speaker 1: But once you get to the top, right, it's very

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Speaker 1: easy to just like fall into the center. And so

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Speaker 1: it's sort of that way.

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Speaker 3: And then you die a horrible death, right, or.

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Speaker 1: You fuse beautifully into something new. Right, you rise out

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Speaker 1: of the ashes like a phoenix, something else and beautiful. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So you push them together hard enough, and that's what

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Speaker 1: we call fusion. You get the strong nuclear force to

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Speaker 1: take over and it makes a new nucleus, right, and

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Speaker 1: it becomes something totally different. So this is alchemy, right,

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Speaker 1: changing one element into another. That you just got to

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Speaker 1: push hard enough, you know, or take protons out, and

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Speaker 1: you can change what something is.

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Speaker 3: Okay, So that's how you make gold. You take hydrogen

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Speaker 3: and you just keep building it up and at some

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Speaker 3: point you go through all the elements and you get

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Speaker 3: to the shiny stuff.

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Speaker 1: Right, that's right. But that's not easy to do, right,

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Speaker 1: It's really hard to squeeze these things together. They don't

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Speaker 1: like to be together, right, It's not the configuration they like.

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Speaker 1: So the question really is not how do you make gold,

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Speaker 1: but like, where in the universe does this happen? How

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Speaker 1: is it even possible?

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Speaker 3: All right, let's get into that, and let's start with

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Speaker 3: a big bang. But first let's take a quick break.

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465
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Speaker 3: All right, we're talking about how to make gold, and

466
00:22:16,600 --> 00:22:18,560
Speaker 3: so we know how to make it, which is you

467
00:22:19,000 --> 00:22:22,560
Speaker 3: build up a hydrogen atom up until you get into

468
00:22:23,080 --> 00:22:25,240
Speaker 3: the different elements and eventually you get to gold. But

469
00:22:25,280 --> 00:22:28,280
Speaker 3: it's a pretty extreme process, like you need a lot

470
00:22:28,280 --> 00:22:29,200
Speaker 3: of energy.

471
00:22:29,280 --> 00:22:31,080
Speaker 1: That's right, You really do need a lot of energy.

472
00:22:31,560 --> 00:22:34,760
Speaker 1: It's not something that's easy to do. And as usual

473
00:22:35,200 --> 00:22:38,040
Speaker 1: with a hard physics question, let's start with the Big Bang, right,

474
00:22:38,080 --> 00:22:41,800
Speaker 1: because the creator of all things. Right, And you might think, well,

475
00:22:41,840 --> 00:22:43,879
Speaker 1: the Big Bang, that was pretty hot and dense, and

476
00:22:43,960 --> 00:22:45,720
Speaker 1: so maybe all that stuff was just made in the

477
00:22:45,800 --> 00:22:46,760
Speaker 1: very beginning.

478
00:22:46,520 --> 00:22:50,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, because everything was compressed, and so I would think

479
00:22:50,040 --> 00:22:52,120
Speaker 3: maybe a lot of gold was made in the Big Bang.

480
00:22:52,200 --> 00:22:54,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, but it takes a while to get to gold, right,

481
00:22:54,440 --> 00:22:57,000
Speaker 1: And so, and the Big Bang turns out was pretty short.

482
00:22:57,320 --> 00:22:59,320
Speaker 1: You know, there was a whole lot of time there

483
00:22:59,359 --> 00:23:02,480
Speaker 1: to make stuff. When the Big Bang started, it was

484
00:23:02,480 --> 00:23:04,240
Speaker 1: really hot and dense. But I also remember it was

485
00:23:04,280 --> 00:23:07,119
Speaker 1: expanding really fast, right, that's the bang part of it.

486
00:23:07,240 --> 00:23:09,600
Speaker 1: And so the universe started out really hot and dense,

487
00:23:09,640 --> 00:23:12,960
Speaker 1: but it cooled off pretty quickly. The temperature dropped very rapidly,

488
00:23:13,320 --> 00:23:15,520
Speaker 1: so there was actually only about twenty minutes. I mean,

489
00:23:15,560 --> 00:23:17,680
Speaker 1: I think it's kind of hilarious to talk about early

490
00:23:17,800 --> 00:23:20,439
Speaker 1: universe in terms of like minutes, you know, in days

491
00:23:20,440 --> 00:23:21,760
Speaker 1: and stuff like that. It's not like there was an

492
00:23:21,800 --> 00:23:24,640
Speaker 1: Earth and the Sun back then to even create these

493
00:23:24,720 --> 00:23:27,680
Speaker 1: the meanings of these time units. But after about twenty

494
00:23:27,720 --> 00:23:30,600
Speaker 1: minutes after the Big Bang on somebody's watch, the universe

495
00:23:30,640 --> 00:23:33,320
Speaker 1: cooled down so that this kind of fusion wasn't possible anymore.

496
00:23:33,760 --> 00:23:33,879
Speaker 4: So.

497
00:23:33,920 --> 00:23:36,040
Speaker 1: The things that were made in the Big Bang, of course,

498
00:23:36,080 --> 00:23:39,600
Speaker 1: were fundamental particles, you know, quarks and electrons and stuff

499
00:23:39,600 --> 00:23:42,160
Speaker 1: like this, and the quarks came together to make protons,

500
00:23:42,200 --> 00:23:44,919
Speaker 1: and the protons and electrons found each other to make hydrogen,

501
00:23:45,160 --> 00:23:46,840
Speaker 1: and there was a little bit of time left and

502
00:23:46,840 --> 00:23:49,280
Speaker 1: they could make some helium and a few bits of

503
00:23:49,320 --> 00:23:52,480
Speaker 1: trace elements higher up to like beryllium or maybe boron

504
00:23:52,520 --> 00:23:54,840
Speaker 1: and stuff. But really the Big Bang was all about

505
00:23:54,840 --> 00:23:56,440
Speaker 1: making hydrogen and helium.

506
00:23:56,480 --> 00:23:58,879
Speaker 3: You're saying, kind of like the party was over before

507
00:23:59,119 --> 00:23:59,960
Speaker 3: they could make gold.

508
00:24:01,040 --> 00:24:03,439
Speaker 1: They wasted a lot of time dancing, and then they

509
00:24:03,480 --> 00:24:04,920
Speaker 1: ran out of time at the end, and they hadn't

510
00:24:04,920 --> 00:24:05,920
Speaker 1: really finished their homework.

511
00:24:06,040 --> 00:24:08,440
Speaker 3: Yeah, kind of right. That's what you're saying is that

512
00:24:08,480 --> 00:24:10,640
Speaker 3: it was intense in the Big Bang, but then by

513
00:24:10,680 --> 00:24:13,879
Speaker 3: the time that you would get to making gold, everything

514
00:24:13,960 --> 00:24:15,800
Speaker 3: was already spread out and cooled off.

515
00:24:15,920 --> 00:24:17,560
Speaker 1: Yeah. And the thing that blows my mind the most

516
00:24:17,640 --> 00:24:21,480
Speaker 1: is that the story hasn't really changed after twenty minutes.

517
00:24:21,600 --> 00:24:24,960
Speaker 1: Twenty minutes into the universe, the universe was seventy five

518
00:24:25,080 --> 00:24:29,800
Speaker 1: ish percent hydrogen and twenty five ish percent helium, and

519
00:24:29,960 --> 00:24:32,320
Speaker 1: that's basically the story now. I mean, there's like one

520
00:24:32,359 --> 00:24:35,359
Speaker 1: percent left over that's like other heavier stuff and that,

521
00:24:35,400 --> 00:24:37,240
Speaker 1: you know, that's the bit we're talking about. That's the

522
00:24:37,280 --> 00:24:39,239
Speaker 1: bits to make up me and you and all the

523
00:24:39,280 --> 00:24:41,960
Speaker 1: interesting stuff in the universe that's not hydrogen and helium.

524
00:24:42,160 --> 00:24:45,120
Speaker 1: But we're really just playing with the one percent. Most

525
00:24:45,119 --> 00:24:47,360
Speaker 1: of the stuff in the universe is still the baryonic

526
00:24:47,440 --> 00:24:48,960
Speaker 1: matter at least, I mean, we're not even talking about

527
00:24:49,040 --> 00:24:51,120
Speaker 1: dark matter and dark energy. We're talking about atomic matter.

528
00:24:51,320 --> 00:24:52,920
Speaker 1: It's still hydrogen and helium.

529
00:24:52,960 --> 00:24:55,280
Speaker 3: And so all the changes, all the kind of visible

530
00:24:55,320 --> 00:24:58,159
Speaker 3: changes in the universe from you know, a crazy cloud

531
00:24:58,160 --> 00:25:02,000
Speaker 3: of nothing of chaos and stars and planets and galaxies

532
00:25:02,080 --> 00:25:05,280
Speaker 3: that that's you're saying, that's only really the one percent.

533
00:25:05,400 --> 00:25:07,119
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly, we are the one percent.

534
00:25:07,359 --> 00:25:12,159
Speaker 3: Yeah. Well, I don't know how much. You know how

535
00:25:12,240 --> 00:25:14,720
Speaker 3: much cartoons get paid, but you know, I'm more in

536
00:25:14,720 --> 00:25:20,520
Speaker 3: the five to five to two pers Okay, so in

537
00:25:20,560 --> 00:25:22,640
Speaker 3: the Big Bang, not a lot of gold was made.

538
00:25:22,680 --> 00:25:25,879
Speaker 1: You're saying, that's right. Basically, you get hydrogen helium and

539
00:25:25,920 --> 00:25:28,720
Speaker 1: then gravity takes over. Right, You have these huge clouds

540
00:25:28,760 --> 00:25:32,560
Speaker 1: of hydrogen and they're cool and they're neutral, right, so

541
00:25:32,600 --> 00:25:35,920
Speaker 1: electromagnetism is not really doing much anymore. And then gravity

542
00:25:35,960 --> 00:25:38,000
Speaker 1: takes over and it starts to pull this stuff together.

543
00:25:38,280 --> 00:25:40,680
Speaker 1: You get these big nebula and these gas clouds get

544
00:25:40,720 --> 00:25:44,320
Speaker 1: clumped together by gravity until things get dense enough that

545
00:25:44,359 --> 00:25:47,520
Speaker 1: they start to heat up. Right, gravitational pressure pushes on them,

546
00:25:47,760 --> 00:25:48,800
Speaker 1: and you get stars.

547
00:25:48,920 --> 00:25:50,960
Speaker 3: And so that's what a lot of people said. They

548
00:25:51,000 --> 00:25:55,280
Speaker 3: said that maybe gold is made inside of stars because

549
00:25:55,320 --> 00:26:00,600
Speaker 3: stars are pretty hot and there's a lot of pressure

550
00:26:00,680 --> 00:26:03,240
Speaker 3: and there's a lot of explosives going on inside. So

551
00:26:04,040 --> 00:26:05,600
Speaker 3: is gold made inside of stars?

552
00:26:05,840 --> 00:26:08,639
Speaker 1: The answer is no, Actually, stars are not capable of

553
00:26:08,680 --> 00:26:11,320
Speaker 1: making gold. And I understand why a lot of people

554
00:26:11,359 --> 00:26:13,400
Speaker 1: thought of that, because I think it's pretty commonly known

555
00:26:13,480 --> 00:26:15,920
Speaker 1: these days that you know, we are all all star dust,

556
00:26:16,000 --> 00:26:17,919
Speaker 1: and that's a really cool concept. You know that the

557
00:26:17,960 --> 00:26:20,560
Speaker 1: stuff that makes us up is not made here or

558
00:26:20,600 --> 00:26:22,600
Speaker 1: not made on Earth, or you know that it was

559
00:26:22,600 --> 00:26:25,280
Speaker 1: made inside of stars somewhere else a long time ago,

560
00:26:25,520 --> 00:26:27,760
Speaker 1: which then blew up. And that part is true, that

561
00:26:28,040 --> 00:26:29,720
Speaker 1: a lot of the elements that make us up, the

562
00:26:29,720 --> 00:26:32,439
Speaker 1: heavier elements, are made inside of stars. And we'll go

563
00:26:32,480 --> 00:26:34,200
Speaker 1: through it in a little bit of detail, but it

564
00:26:34,240 --> 00:26:37,320
Speaker 1: turns out stars are not capable of making things heavier

565
00:26:37,359 --> 00:26:38,560
Speaker 1: than like nickel or iron.

566
00:26:38,600 --> 00:26:41,320
Speaker 3: Wait, you were saying Carl Sagan lied to us. Is

567
00:26:41,359 --> 00:26:43,680
Speaker 3: that what you're saying here officially on the podcast.

568
00:26:43,800 --> 00:26:46,879
Speaker 1: Well, no, no, If you're not made of gold, then

569
00:26:46,920 --> 00:26:49,280
Speaker 1: Carl Sagan was correct. If you are made of gold,

570
00:26:49,600 --> 00:26:55,000
Speaker 1: then yeah, Carl Sagan was wrong. So our animatronic gold

571
00:26:55,040 --> 00:26:58,800
Speaker 1: plated AI listeners you are exempt from Carl Sagan's wisdom.

572
00:26:58,960 --> 00:27:01,280
Speaker 3: Okay, got it it. It's good to know, you know,

573
00:27:01,760 --> 00:27:03,200
Speaker 3: just in case I was made out a goal.

574
00:27:03,720 --> 00:27:05,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, you know, I haven't seen you in a

575
00:27:05,359 --> 00:27:07,200
Speaker 1: few days, so maybe you did get replaced by a

576
00:27:07,720 --> 00:27:09,200
Speaker 1: gold plated robot who.

577
00:27:09,040 --> 00:27:14,040
Speaker 3: Knows Okay, so you're saying a star by itself chugging

578
00:27:14,080 --> 00:27:15,440
Speaker 3: along doesn't make goal.

579
00:27:15,760 --> 00:27:19,200
Speaker 1: No, And what's happening inside a star is that it's fusing, right.

580
00:27:19,240 --> 00:27:21,639
Speaker 1: It's doing that thing we talked about earlier with pushing

581
00:27:21,960 --> 00:27:25,400
Speaker 1: the hydrogen nuclei together close enough that the strong force

582
00:27:25,440 --> 00:27:28,520
Speaker 1: takes over and it makes helium nucleus. Right, And the

583
00:27:28,600 --> 00:27:31,240
Speaker 1: key thing to understand is that that's not an energy

584
00:27:31,400 --> 00:27:34,639
Speaker 1: neutral event. What happens when you do that is you

585
00:27:34,680 --> 00:27:38,560
Speaker 1: release energy. There's less energy in a helium nucleus than

586
00:27:38,560 --> 00:27:42,040
Speaker 1: there is in two hydrogen nuclei, So when you form

587
00:27:42,080 --> 00:27:45,160
Speaker 1: the helium nucleus, this energy left over, it releases energy.

588
00:27:45,200 --> 00:27:47,840
Speaker 1: It's like burning, right, That's what burning is. There's less

589
00:27:47,920 --> 00:27:50,720
Speaker 1: energy stored in wood ash than there is in wood,

590
00:27:50,760 --> 00:27:53,400
Speaker 1: which is why when you burn it, energy is released

591
00:27:53,400 --> 00:27:53,919
Speaker 1: as fire.

592
00:27:53,960 --> 00:27:56,439
Speaker 3: It's kind of like when you take two three year

593
00:27:56,480 --> 00:27:57,800
Speaker 3: olds who are hyperactive and.

594
00:27:57,760 --> 00:27:59,320
Speaker 1: Then mash them together.

595
00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:05,120
Speaker 3: iPad, so only there's a lot of leftover energy. That's right.

596
00:28:05,760 --> 00:28:07,840
Speaker 1: I've never noticed them heating up, but I'm sure. But

597
00:28:07,880 --> 00:28:11,160
Speaker 1: because of conservation of energy that that energy does go somewhere.

598
00:28:12,040 --> 00:28:14,400
Speaker 3: The energy just goes to the parents who are like.

599
00:28:14,920 --> 00:28:18,320
Speaker 1: Finally, Except then how come parents are always napping when

600
00:28:18,359 --> 00:28:19,960
Speaker 1: their kids are on the iPad? I'm not sure how

601
00:28:20,040 --> 00:28:21,879
Speaker 1: the how the energy flow works.

602
00:28:21,960 --> 00:28:24,679
Speaker 3: So there's a limit to what you can make inside

603
00:28:24,680 --> 00:28:25,080
Speaker 3: of a star.

604
00:28:25,280 --> 00:28:26,919
Speaker 1: Yeah, and so that's the burning of a star, right,

605
00:28:26,960 --> 00:28:29,320
Speaker 1: That's what makes the star hot, is it does this process.

606
00:28:29,320 --> 00:28:31,880
Speaker 1: It releases energy and that allows it to do more. Right,

607
00:28:32,240 --> 00:28:34,119
Speaker 1: And you can do more. You can take the helium nuclei,

608
00:28:34,280 --> 00:28:36,720
Speaker 1: you can fuse them together, and the same thing is

609
00:28:36,760 --> 00:28:39,320
Speaker 1: true that you use two helium nuclei to get something

610
00:28:39,320 --> 00:28:42,280
Speaker 1: heavier and energy is released, and you can keep doing

611
00:28:42,280 --> 00:28:43,800
Speaker 1: that and keep doing that, and keep doing that, and

612
00:28:43,960 --> 00:28:46,360
Speaker 1: energy keeps being released, and you get heavier and heavier

613
00:28:46,400 --> 00:28:48,680
Speaker 1: stuff up to like nickel or up to iron.

614
00:28:48,800 --> 00:28:52,640
Speaker 3: Right, But then at iron something special happens, right because

615
00:28:52,680 --> 00:28:56,440
Speaker 3: iron is kind of a special Is that a special

616
00:28:56,480 --> 00:28:57,720
Speaker 3: place in the periodic table?

617
00:28:57,880 --> 00:29:00,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, this is really interesting fact about how you put

618
00:29:00,240 --> 00:29:02,840
Speaker 1: nuclei together. And remember the thing that holds the nucleus

619
00:29:02,840 --> 00:29:05,000
Speaker 1: together is the strong force. Right, There's a bunch of

620
00:29:05,000 --> 00:29:08,000
Speaker 1: protons and the strong forces holding them together by linking

621
00:29:08,040 --> 00:29:11,560
Speaker 1: the quarks inside the protons. But once you get to iron,

622
00:29:11,760 --> 00:29:14,840
Speaker 1: there's more energy stored in the heavier combinations. So if

623
00:29:14,840 --> 00:29:17,320
Speaker 1: you want to take two iron nuclei and fuse them

624
00:29:17,320 --> 00:29:20,400
Speaker 1: together to make whatever too iron nuclei make, then you

625
00:29:20,440 --> 00:29:23,160
Speaker 1: need to add energy, right, You need to pour energy

626
00:29:23,200 --> 00:29:25,560
Speaker 1: into that to make the heavier thing. So the result

627
00:29:25,720 --> 00:29:28,920
Speaker 1: is that you're cooling the star instead of burning.

628
00:29:28,680 --> 00:29:32,320
Speaker 3: Right, But it doesn't actually cool it does It does

629
00:29:32,360 --> 00:29:34,280
Speaker 3: absorb some of the energy from the star.

630
00:29:34,520 --> 00:29:37,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, if that happened, and it happened a lot, then

631
00:29:37,040 --> 00:29:38,640
Speaker 1: it would cool the star. And so the thing you

632
00:29:38,680 --> 00:29:41,440
Speaker 1: have to understand is that stars are like they're like

633
00:29:41,640 --> 00:29:44,640
Speaker 1: a balance, right. They're fusing all the time. They're making

634
00:29:44,680 --> 00:29:47,600
Speaker 1: this heavier stuff, and that's releasing energy. But then that

635
00:29:47,640 --> 00:29:50,240
Speaker 1: stuff is also getting blown apart because it's an incredible

636
00:29:50,240 --> 00:29:52,760
Speaker 1: place in there. There's all these photons. You have photodisintegration,

637
00:29:53,200 --> 00:29:55,200
Speaker 1: So you're like make something heavy and then you blow

638
00:29:55,200 --> 00:29:57,120
Speaker 1: it up because of heavy photons or hitting it. Then

639
00:29:57,120 --> 00:29:58,800
Speaker 1: you make something heavy and you blow it up, and

640
00:29:58,840 --> 00:30:02,440
Speaker 1: it's sort of gradually humulating heavier and heavier stuff. Right,

641
00:30:02,600 --> 00:30:04,400
Speaker 1: But you also got to keep the star burning. If

642
00:30:04,400 --> 00:30:07,240
Speaker 1: the star doesn't stay hot enough, then it collapses, right,

643
00:30:07,280 --> 00:30:10,600
Speaker 1: Then it can no longer support itself from gravity winds.

644
00:30:11,000 --> 00:30:13,520
Speaker 1: So if you start getting too much heavy stuff like

645
00:30:13,560 --> 00:30:16,360
Speaker 1: the iron and the nickel and the stuff that if

646
00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:19,120
Speaker 1: you do fuse it, it costs you energy. That's the

647
00:30:19,120 --> 00:30:21,120
Speaker 1: death knell of a star. That's when a star starts

648
00:30:21,120 --> 00:30:22,200
Speaker 1: to die. Yeah.

649
00:30:22,360 --> 00:30:24,800
Speaker 3: So it's like it burns all its fuel, it turns

650
00:30:24,800 --> 00:30:27,040
Speaker 3: it into iron, and then it can't do anything with

651
00:30:27,080 --> 00:30:27,960
Speaker 3: the iron anymore.

652
00:30:28,080 --> 00:30:31,240
Speaker 1: Exactly, to do something with the iron takes somebody adding energy.

653
00:30:31,280 --> 00:30:33,200
Speaker 1: And so that's when the star starts to go out. Right,

654
00:30:33,240 --> 00:30:35,840
Speaker 1: when its fuel is no longer fuel, it's something that

655
00:30:35,920 --> 00:30:38,080
Speaker 1: requires work instead of releasing energy.

656
00:30:38,160 --> 00:30:41,160
Speaker 3: It's kind of like when you burn a fire, right,

657
00:30:41,200 --> 00:30:43,360
Speaker 3: would you throw the logs in and it eventually the

658
00:30:43,400 --> 00:30:46,840
Speaker 3: logs turn into ash and you can't do anything with that, right,

659
00:30:46,880 --> 00:30:48,360
Speaker 3: You can't burn it anymore.

660
00:30:48,080 --> 00:30:49,720
Speaker 1: That's right. Yeah, you could do something with the ash,

661
00:30:49,760 --> 00:30:51,960
Speaker 1: but it might require energy to do it, right, So

662
00:30:52,040 --> 00:30:54,320
Speaker 1: you don't have that. It's not a self sustaining thing anymore.

663
00:30:54,400 --> 00:30:56,160
Speaker 1: It's a self extinguishing thing.

664
00:30:56,360 --> 00:30:57,760
Speaker 3: Yeah, So your fire goes out.

665
00:30:57,880 --> 00:30:59,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, and so your fire goes out, and that's what happens. Right,

666
00:31:00,240 --> 00:31:03,560
Speaker 1: stars burn, they make heavier stuff that they can't burn anymore,

667
00:31:03,600 --> 00:31:05,440
Speaker 1: so they've used up their fuel and then they go

668
00:31:05,520 --> 00:31:08,160
Speaker 1: out and you know, they spread that stuff back out

669
00:31:08,200 --> 00:31:11,320
Speaker 1: into the universe. There's the solar wind, right, They're spewing

670
00:31:11,360 --> 00:31:13,640
Speaker 1: particles out from the Sun from the star all the time.

671
00:31:13,680 --> 00:31:17,480
Speaker 1: That spreads them out. Or they go supernova and you know,

672
00:31:17,520 --> 00:31:20,280
Speaker 1: they collapse and then explode and they spew all their

673
00:31:20,320 --> 00:31:23,560
Speaker 1: stuff out to the universe. And one really cool thing

674
00:31:23,960 --> 00:31:26,560
Speaker 1: is that then that stuff gets gathered back together to

675
00:31:26,680 --> 00:31:29,200
Speaker 1: make a new star. And so we've had these cycles

676
00:31:29,240 --> 00:31:32,560
Speaker 1: of stars. We had original first stars that just burned

677
00:31:32,600 --> 00:31:36,280
Speaker 1: hydrogen and turned it into helium, and then those blew up,

678
00:31:36,400 --> 00:31:38,440
Speaker 1: you know, and we had different kinds of stars that

679
00:31:38,520 --> 00:31:41,840
Speaker 1: primarily burn helium and heavier stuff, and those blew up,

680
00:31:42,040 --> 00:31:43,680
Speaker 1: and then we had different kind of stars. And so

681
00:31:43,720 --> 00:31:45,960
Speaker 1: it takes a few cycles of stars to even get

682
00:31:46,040 --> 00:31:49,360
Speaker 1: up to stars capable of making things like iron and nickel.

683
00:31:49,480 --> 00:31:54,440
Speaker 1: Oh I say, and those first stars are no longer

684
00:31:54,440 --> 00:31:57,560
Speaker 1: even existing, Like, we haven't seen any of those first stars.

685
00:31:57,520 --> 00:31:59,960
Speaker 3: They're the ones that are pure hydrogen.

686
00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:02,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, the first cycle of stars, the original stars, the

687
00:32:02,400 --> 00:32:06,480
Speaker 1: og stars. Right, We recently thought we might have seen

688
00:32:06,480 --> 00:32:09,000
Speaker 1: a hint of evidence of them, but nobody's ever actually

689
00:32:09,000 --> 00:32:12,000
Speaker 1: seen them directly. They're so old, they happened so long ago,

690
00:32:12,360 --> 00:32:14,880
Speaker 1: they're very difficult to see. That's a whole other interesting

691
00:32:14,920 --> 00:32:16,440
Speaker 1: podcast about the history of stars.

692
00:32:16,560 --> 00:32:18,680
Speaker 3: Yeah, that we know of, nobody has seen.

693
00:32:19,040 --> 00:32:22,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's right. And the other fascinating fact there's so

694
00:32:22,120 --> 00:32:24,320
Speaker 1: many interesting things about this is that most of the

695
00:32:24,320 --> 00:32:26,760
Speaker 1: really heavy stuff, like the iron and the nickel, is

696
00:32:26,800 --> 00:32:29,520
Speaker 1: made in the last few moments of a star's life. Like,

697
00:32:29,560 --> 00:32:31,880
Speaker 1: those things are hard to make. Even though you know

698
00:32:31,880 --> 00:32:34,960
Speaker 1: it is energetically favorable to produce iron, it's a really

699
00:32:35,120 --> 00:32:36,840
Speaker 1: small effect, and so you don't make a lot of

700
00:32:36,840 --> 00:32:39,200
Speaker 1: it until the last few moments. Most of that stuff

701
00:32:39,240 --> 00:32:42,880
Speaker 1: happens just before the supernova as like the outer bits

702
00:32:42,880 --> 00:32:45,600
Speaker 1: of the star collapsing. Those are the perfect times to

703
00:32:45,640 --> 00:32:48,200
Speaker 1: make iron and nickel. So like most of the iron

704
00:32:48,240 --> 00:32:50,000
Speaker 1: and the nickel in the universe was made in the

705
00:32:50,080 --> 00:32:52,520
Speaker 1: last few moments just before a star went supernova.

706
00:32:52,840 --> 00:32:55,520
Speaker 3: Yeah, but that's kind of the limit, right.

707
00:32:55,560 --> 00:32:58,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. These stars can't make things that are heavier.

708
00:32:58,760 --> 00:33:01,240
Speaker 1: So for a long time people it's like, well, we

709
00:33:01,320 --> 00:33:03,600
Speaker 1: have this great model of stars. We can explain how

710
00:33:03,640 --> 00:33:05,840
Speaker 1: they made iron, how they made nickel, all this stuff.

711
00:33:05,920 --> 00:33:08,280
Speaker 1: But what about this other stuff we see because there

712
00:33:08,360 --> 00:33:12,040
Speaker 1: is stuff in the universe, it's heavier uranium, plutonium, gold,

713
00:33:12,400 --> 00:33:14,080
Speaker 1: all this stuff. Where does that come from?

714
00:33:14,200 --> 00:33:17,160
Speaker 3: Well, let's get into that. Let's get into whether supernova

715
00:33:17,360 --> 00:33:19,760
Speaker 3: are able to make these things and whether they can

716
00:33:19,800 --> 00:33:23,320
Speaker 3: make gold. But first, let's take a quick break.

717
00:33:27,640 --> 00:33:29,440
Speaker 1: When you pop a piece of cheese into your mouth,

718
00:33:29,560 --> 00:33:32,680
Speaker 1: or enjoy a rich spoonful of Greek yogurt, you're probably

719
00:33:32,720 --> 00:33:36,760
Speaker 1: not thinking about the environmental impact of each and every bite.

720
00:33:36,800 --> 00:33:39,440
Speaker 1: But the people in the dairy industry are. US Dairy

721
00:33:39,480 --> 00:33:43,760
Speaker 1: has set themselves some ambitious sustainability goals, including being greenhouse

722
00:33:43,800 --> 00:33:46,360
Speaker 1: gas neutral by twenty to fifty. That's why they're working

723
00:33:46,400 --> 00:33:48,720
Speaker 1: hard every day to find new ways to reduce waste,

724
00:33:48,800 --> 00:33:53,040
Speaker 1: conserve natural resources, and drive down greenhouse gas emissions. Take water,

725
00:33:53,080 --> 00:33:56,640
Speaker 1: for example, most dairy farms reuse water up to four times.

726
00:33:56,720 --> 00:33:59,720
Speaker 1: The same water cools the milk, cleans equipment, washes the

727
00:33:59,760 --> 00:34:02,920
Speaker 1: bar and irrigates the crops. How is US dairy tackling

728
00:34:02,960 --> 00:34:06,400
Speaker 1: greenhouse gases? Many farms use anaerobic digestors that turn the

729
00:34:06,440 --> 00:34:10,240
Speaker 1: methane from maneuver into renewable energy that can power farms, towns,

730
00:34:10,280 --> 00:34:12,360
Speaker 1: and electric cars. So the next time you grab a

731
00:34:12,360 --> 00:34:14,400
Speaker 1: slice of pizza or lick an ice cream cone, know

732
00:34:14,480 --> 00:34:17,160
Speaker 1: that dairy farmers and processors around the country are using

733
00:34:17,200 --> 00:34:20,680
Speaker 1: the latest practices and innovations to provide the nutrient dense

734
00:34:20,800 --> 00:34:23,520
Speaker 1: dairy products we love with less of an impact. Visit

735
00:34:23,640 --> 00:34:26,399
Speaker 1: usdairy dot com slash sustainability to learn more.

736
00:34:26,600 --> 00:34:30,240
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737
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738
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739
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740
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741
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742
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743
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749
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750
00:35:10,840 --> 00:35:13,759
Speaker 6: California has millions of homes that could be damaged in

751
00:35:13,800 --> 00:35:17,880
Speaker 6: a strong earthquake. Older homes are especially vulnerable to quake damage,

752
00:35:17,920 --> 00:35:20,480
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753
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754
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755
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756
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757
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759
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Speaker 3: All right, so start checking it along. Can't make gold.

760
00:35:52,320 --> 00:35:54,040
Speaker 3: I can only sort of go up to iron. And

761
00:35:54,080 --> 00:35:56,799
Speaker 3: that's even only when it blows up, right, Yeah, that's

762
00:35:56,840 --> 00:36:00,000
Speaker 3: right after a few cycles and during the blow up.

763
00:36:01,080 --> 00:36:04,439
Speaker 3: So then how does gold get made? It's not in supernovas.

764
00:36:04,480 --> 00:36:07,600
Speaker 1: It's not in supernovas. Supernovas are responsible for like the

765
00:36:07,880 --> 00:36:10,319
Speaker 1: heaviest stuff the stars can make, right, And people have

766
00:36:10,400 --> 00:36:12,520
Speaker 1: done a lot of extensive work on this and modeling

767
00:36:12,520 --> 00:36:15,680
Speaker 1: and try to understand are there weird kinds of supernovas?

768
00:36:15,719 --> 00:36:22,080
Speaker 1: Are there special circumstances under which meganova's there actually are

769
00:36:22,080 --> 00:36:26,640
Speaker 1: things called killanovas? And the hyper novas and stuff like that.

770
00:36:27,560 --> 00:36:29,400
Speaker 3: That sounds like a hell of a Helenova.

771
00:36:29,520 --> 00:36:33,879
Speaker 1: Hell that's the California version, Yeah, Helenova or telenovela. It's

772
00:36:33,880 --> 00:36:36,080
Speaker 1: one of the most dramatic events in the universe that's

773
00:36:36,160 --> 00:36:39,800
Speaker 1: responsible for making gold and platinum and all that heavy stuff.

774
00:36:40,360 --> 00:36:43,120
Speaker 1: And we've only recently figured out what this is. And

775
00:36:43,200 --> 00:36:45,600
Speaker 1: what happens is not the collapse of a single star

776
00:36:45,680 --> 00:36:48,480
Speaker 1: into like a neutron star or something really heavy. It's

777
00:36:48,520 --> 00:36:52,239
Speaker 1: when two stars collide. So sometimes you'll have like two

778
00:36:52,360 --> 00:36:55,040
Speaker 1: neutron stars that are near each other. And you remember

779
00:36:55,080 --> 00:36:57,359
Speaker 1: neutron stars with this really really dense stuff. We had

780
00:36:57,360 --> 00:37:00,560
Speaker 1: an episode recently about density and you know, like eastpoon

781
00:37:00,600 --> 00:37:03,320
Speaker 1: of neutron star weighs as much as like a million

782
00:37:03,400 --> 00:37:06,759
Speaker 1: Eiffel towers. Right, it's ridiculous. So already you have this

783
00:37:07,040 --> 00:37:11,080
Speaker 1: crazy intense environment. Now imagine two of those things and

784
00:37:11,120 --> 00:37:13,640
Speaker 1: they're near each other, and they're orbiting each other, and

785
00:37:13,640 --> 00:37:17,200
Speaker 1: they're pulling each other together, and eventually, boom, they collide.

786
00:37:17,239 --> 00:37:18,880
Speaker 1: They collapse into one object.

787
00:37:19,080 --> 00:37:21,359
Speaker 3: That's how gold is made. That's the only way we know.

788
00:37:21,719 --> 00:37:24,600
Speaker 1: That's the only way we know. Yeah, gold and all

789
00:37:24,640 --> 00:37:28,160
Speaker 1: the other stuff heavier than iron is primarily made in

790
00:37:28,239 --> 00:37:32,319
Speaker 1: the collapses of neutron stars, and like, it's a crazy idea, right,

791
00:37:32,600 --> 00:37:35,719
Speaker 1: And for a long time people thought, but neutron star collapses, like,

792
00:37:35,760 --> 00:37:38,040
Speaker 1: how often can that happen? Can there really be enough

793
00:37:38,080 --> 00:37:39,840
Speaker 1: of that to make all the gold?

794
00:37:39,880 --> 00:37:42,840
Speaker 3: Wait, they collapse and then they explode out into the universe.

795
00:37:42,880 --> 00:37:46,160
Speaker 3: Because if it collapses, doesn't it keep all the gold

796
00:37:46,160 --> 00:37:46,640
Speaker 3: inside of it?

797
00:37:46,760 --> 00:37:49,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, they collide, they make gold, and then a lot

798
00:37:49,120 --> 00:37:52,560
Speaker 1: of his is ejected. Yeah, so they explode. And we

799
00:37:52,680 --> 00:37:57,200
Speaker 1: discover this recently because we saw gravitational waves. These things

800
00:37:57,200 --> 00:38:01,040
Speaker 1: are heavy enough, they're big enough, and they're moving fast enough,

801
00:38:01,040 --> 00:38:05,680
Speaker 1: they're accelerating enough they actually cause gravitational waves, these ripples

802
00:38:05,680 --> 00:38:08,560
Speaker 1: in space and time itself. We had a whole podcast

803
00:38:08,560 --> 00:38:11,200
Speaker 1: episode about that about how we saw like black holes

804
00:38:11,280 --> 00:38:15,040
Speaker 1: merging and neutron star collisions, and we see this because

805
00:38:15,080 --> 00:38:17,960
Speaker 1: they're so heavy that they make these ripples in space. Remember,

806
00:38:18,440 --> 00:38:22,120
Speaker 1: really massive stuff bend space. That's what gravity is. And

807
00:38:22,160 --> 00:38:24,839
Speaker 1: so if you have something like that moving really quickly accelerating,

808
00:38:25,200 --> 00:38:27,960
Speaker 1: then its gravitational field is wiggling, and it's wiggling in

809
00:38:27,960 --> 00:38:30,560
Speaker 1: a way to send waves through space that we can

810
00:38:30,640 --> 00:38:31,719
Speaker 1: actually detect.

811
00:38:31,920 --> 00:38:34,800
Speaker 3: Yeah, so that's why goal is so rare. It's that

812
00:38:35,160 --> 00:38:39,480
Speaker 3: it can only be made in these super rare events,

813
00:38:39,640 --> 00:38:42,799
Speaker 3: which is two neutron stars which just happened to be

814
00:38:42,800 --> 00:38:44,480
Speaker 3: close enough to each other to merge.

815
00:38:44,560 --> 00:38:46,640
Speaker 1: That's right. The thing that's interesting is that it's not

816
00:38:46,719 --> 00:38:49,880
Speaker 1: as rare as we thought before we turned on Lego,

817
00:38:49,960 --> 00:38:53,560
Speaker 1: this gravitational wave detector. They turns it on, they knew

818
00:38:53,560 --> 00:38:55,440
Speaker 1: what it could see, but what they didn't know is

819
00:38:55,560 --> 00:38:58,400
Speaker 1: how often is there stuff to see? Like you build

820
00:38:58,400 --> 00:39:02,160
Speaker 1: this amazing telescope, this gravitational wave detector, you're looking out

821
00:39:02,200 --> 00:39:03,920
Speaker 1: into the universe with sort of a new set of

822
00:39:03,960 --> 00:39:06,600
Speaker 1: eyes for the first time. You don't know if it's

823
00:39:06,640 --> 00:39:09,040
Speaker 1: going to be like a big party or total darkness.

824
00:39:09,080 --> 00:39:11,560
Speaker 1: We just really had no idea. And the cool thing

825
00:39:11,640 --> 00:39:14,200
Speaker 1: is that just after they turned it on, boom they

826
00:39:14,200 --> 00:39:16,480
Speaker 1: saw gravitational wave, and then like next week, boom they

827
00:39:16,480 --> 00:39:18,720
Speaker 1: saw another one. So it turns out this stuff happens

828
00:39:18,760 --> 00:39:22,359
Speaker 1: a little bit more often than people were thinking. So

829
00:39:22,400 --> 00:39:25,320
Speaker 1: it's not that unlikely to see neutron stars, which is

830
00:39:25,360 --> 00:39:28,239
Speaker 1: why gold is rare, but not like impossible to.

831
00:39:28,200 --> 00:39:31,360
Speaker 3: Find or anything heavier than gold, right, because anything heavier

832
00:39:31,400 --> 00:39:33,400
Speaker 3: than gold you also need these rare events.

833
00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:36,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. All the plutonium, all the uranium, all that

834
00:39:36,239 --> 00:39:38,719
Speaker 1: kind of stuff that's made that's heavier than gold was

835
00:39:38,800 --> 00:39:43,120
Speaker 1: created in these incredible cosmic collisions of neutron stars. And

836
00:39:43,520 --> 00:39:45,480
Speaker 1: we know that because we saw one recently. So we

837
00:39:45,520 --> 00:39:48,160
Speaker 1: saw it with the gravitational wave detector. We also saw

838
00:39:48,200 --> 00:39:51,480
Speaker 1: the collision using other telescopes. So this is called multi

839
00:39:51,520 --> 00:39:54,080
Speaker 1: messenger because you see the same event with light and

840
00:39:54,120 --> 00:39:56,960
Speaker 1: with gravitational waves. And then we could look at what

841
00:39:57,120 --> 00:40:00,840
Speaker 1: happened and look at the emissions of the stuff nearby,

842
00:40:00,960 --> 00:40:03,719
Speaker 1: and we could see that there was gold just afterwards

843
00:40:03,719 --> 00:40:05,040
Speaker 1: where there wasn't gold before.

844
00:40:05,320 --> 00:40:09,120
Speaker 3: Oh no kidding. It got shiny like it twinkled a

845
00:40:09,120 --> 00:40:09,720
Speaker 3: little extra.

846
00:40:09,880 --> 00:40:12,240
Speaker 1: All these bracelets were made and all these nice rings,

847
00:40:12,320 --> 00:40:15,239
Speaker 1: you know, stuff I think would be really wonderful. Now

848
00:40:15,320 --> 00:40:17,279
Speaker 1: you could see because of the way it absorbs light

849
00:40:17,320 --> 00:40:20,760
Speaker 1: from behind it and amidst light, gold has a characteristic signature,

850
00:40:21,080 --> 00:40:23,759
Speaker 1: so we could see gold having been made pretty.

851
00:40:23,480 --> 00:40:25,360
Speaker 3: Awesome, kind of like if you close your eyes and

852
00:40:25,360 --> 00:40:27,840
Speaker 3: you listen out into the universe, you will hear gold

853
00:40:27,920 --> 00:40:30,480
Speaker 3: being made kind of right, like pop pop pop pop.

854
00:40:32,840 --> 00:40:34,680
Speaker 1: If you close your eyes and listen to the universe,

855
00:40:35,080 --> 00:40:39,040
Speaker 1: I don't know what you're gonna hear, but yeah, there is. Yeah,

856
00:40:39,040 --> 00:40:41,359
Speaker 1: if you listen to the gravitational waves, you hear these

857
00:40:41,480 --> 00:40:46,000
Speaker 1: crazy events. That is where gold and heavy stuff is made.

858
00:40:46,040 --> 00:40:48,160
Speaker 1: So it's not made in the Earth's crust, it's not

859
00:40:48,280 --> 00:40:51,120
Speaker 1: made in the normal burning of stars. It's only made

860
00:40:51,160 --> 00:40:54,480
Speaker 1: in these special crazy collisions of two dead stars.

861
00:40:54,640 --> 00:40:56,880
Speaker 3: So I feel like that makes it even more special

862
00:40:56,960 --> 00:41:00,479
Speaker 3: than diamonds. You know, like diamonds just made or on Earth.

863
00:41:00,560 --> 00:41:07,040
Speaker 3: But gold, that's that's only made in the marriage of

864
00:41:07,120 --> 00:41:09,120
Speaker 3: two giant neutron stars.

865
00:41:09,160 --> 00:41:11,040
Speaker 1: No, I think you're right, and I think you know

866
00:41:11,080 --> 00:41:13,200
Speaker 1: the de Beers Corporation will not be very interested in

867
00:41:13,280 --> 00:41:16,520
Speaker 1: sponsoring this podcast. But diamonds, you're right, they're not that special.

868
00:41:16,600 --> 00:41:18,600
Speaker 1: You know, they're just created by a lot of pressure

869
00:41:18,920 --> 00:41:20,440
Speaker 1: here in the center of the Earth. But we are

870
00:41:20,480 --> 00:41:22,759
Speaker 1: not capable of making gold on Earth. There's certainly not

871
00:41:23,520 --> 00:41:26,200
Speaker 1: nowhere in our solar system are there the conditions to

872
00:41:26,280 --> 00:41:28,760
Speaker 1: make gold, and so it is pretty unusual.

873
00:41:28,840 --> 00:41:30,400
Speaker 3: But you know, but you said you can make it

874
00:41:30,440 --> 00:41:32,400
Speaker 3: at the large hadron collide.

875
00:41:32,840 --> 00:41:34,719
Speaker 1: No, you're right, you're right, we can make it at

876
00:41:34,760 --> 00:41:37,400
Speaker 1: a large hadron collider sort of naturally produced gold, you know,

877
00:41:37,640 --> 00:41:39,480
Speaker 1: fusing of lighter stuff. What we do with at a

878
00:41:39,520 --> 00:41:41,880
Speaker 1: large hadron collider actually is we can take gold. We

879
00:41:41,880 --> 00:41:43,960
Speaker 1: can take lead, which is heavier than gold, and we

880
00:41:44,000 --> 00:41:46,040
Speaker 1: can strip off some of the protons. Right, you can

881
00:41:46,080 --> 00:41:48,840
Speaker 1: shoot like neutrons and stuff at it to sort of

882
00:41:48,840 --> 00:41:51,200
Speaker 1: break it apart and take off some of the protons

883
00:41:51,239 --> 00:41:54,080
Speaker 1: to turn some lead into some gold. But we can

884
00:41:54,120 --> 00:41:56,400
Speaker 1: only do it at really really low levels. Like you

885
00:41:56,440 --> 00:41:58,800
Speaker 1: can't take a block of lead, and you need to

886
00:41:58,840 --> 00:42:01,239
Speaker 1: turn each atom one or time into gold, which is

887
00:42:01,280 --> 00:42:03,000
Speaker 1: why it would cost a quadrillion dollars.

888
00:42:04,680 --> 00:42:06,680
Speaker 3: I see, you make it the other way. You don't

889
00:42:06,680 --> 00:42:09,480
Speaker 3: fuse it together, you strip down lead to make gold.

890
00:42:09,560 --> 00:42:11,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, so it's pretty much cheating because the lead also

891
00:42:11,719 --> 00:42:13,799
Speaker 1: was made in the collision of neutron stars, right, so

892
00:42:13,800 --> 00:42:16,360
Speaker 1: we're taking that we're just like turning it into gold.

893
00:42:16,480 --> 00:42:19,040
Speaker 1: So it's like it's a very unsatisfying sort of monkey

894
00:42:19,040 --> 00:42:21,600
Speaker 1: paw answer, right, like, can you make lead into gold? Yes?

895
00:42:21,760 --> 00:42:24,000
Speaker 3: So Carl Sagan didn't lie to us. You did.

896
00:42:24,560 --> 00:42:29,759
Speaker 1: That's a fairly safe assumption in general. But I don't

897
00:42:29,760 --> 00:42:32,520
Speaker 1: think I said anything incorrect. We can turn lead into gold,

898
00:42:32,520 --> 00:42:34,680
Speaker 1: it's just not the most of the gold that you

899
00:42:34,760 --> 00:42:37,120
Speaker 1: find is not made in the Large Hadron Collider.

900
00:42:36,760 --> 00:42:38,880
Speaker 3: All right, So that's pretty pretty cool to know. So

901
00:42:38,920 --> 00:42:42,239
Speaker 3: the next time you see your wedding ring maybe, or

902
00:42:42,280 --> 00:42:44,560
Speaker 3: your pendant or something made out of gold out there,

903
00:42:44,800 --> 00:42:48,120
Speaker 3: you should think about that it wasn't made here in Earth.

904
00:42:48,800 --> 00:42:51,640
Speaker 3: It wasn't made inside of a star. It was made

905
00:42:51,800 --> 00:42:57,040
Speaker 3: in a giant, really cataclysmic, crazy explosion of two giant

906
00:42:57,520 --> 00:42:58,320
Speaker 3: neutron stars.

907
00:42:58,440 --> 00:43:02,080
Speaker 1: That's right. Two neutron stars gave their lives so that

908
00:43:02,160 --> 00:43:04,719
Speaker 1: you could have that ring with that bracelet and give

909
00:43:04,760 --> 00:43:07,319
Speaker 1: it to your special person. So you know, think for

910
00:43:07,360 --> 00:43:09,279
Speaker 1: a moment about what they sacrificed and.

911
00:43:09,200 --> 00:43:12,640
Speaker 3: Then exploded out into space and somehow, some way it

912
00:43:12,760 --> 00:43:16,560
Speaker 3: made it into here and into the Earth and into

913
00:43:16,600 --> 00:43:17,040
Speaker 3: your finger.

914
00:43:17,280 --> 00:43:20,640
Speaker 1: Yeah. So every atom of gold has a really interesting

915
00:43:20,680 --> 00:43:24,040
Speaker 1: life story, much more interesting than you. Right, has existed

916
00:43:24,080 --> 00:43:24,960
Speaker 1: for a long time.

917
00:43:25,960 --> 00:43:30,360
Speaker 3: Well, I was made in the Large Hadron Collider, you know.

918
00:43:30,840 --> 00:43:33,760
Speaker 1: That's why you're so shiny and brilliant. No, every element

919
00:43:34,040 --> 00:43:36,920
Speaker 1: you know that that you're made out of is pretty stable.

920
00:43:37,000 --> 00:43:38,920
Speaker 1: They were not made on Earth. They were not rearranged

921
00:43:38,920 --> 00:43:41,560
Speaker 1: on Earth. They've been that element for billions of years.

922
00:43:41,800 --> 00:43:44,520
Speaker 1: They've survived being created inside a star or inside the

923
00:43:44,520 --> 00:43:47,759
Speaker 1: collisions of neutron stars, and they've had their personality for

924
00:43:47,840 --> 00:43:50,480
Speaker 1: billions of years, and they're just temporarily for this brief

925
00:43:50,760 --> 00:43:52,080
Speaker 1: moment part of you.

926
00:43:52,520 --> 00:43:55,200
Speaker 3: All right, Well, we hope you enjoyed that discussion and

927
00:43:55,640 --> 00:43:58,520
Speaker 3: learn a little bit about where are the heavy elements

928
00:43:58,600 --> 00:43:59,080
Speaker 3: come from?

929
00:43:59,200 --> 00:44:01,160
Speaker 1: And I hope you and with that golden nugget of

930
00:44:01,560 --> 00:44:02,439
Speaker 1: intellectual thought.

931
00:44:02,560 --> 00:44:04,319
Speaker 3: And if you want to eject some gold and send

932
00:44:04,360 --> 00:44:06,760
Speaker 3: it to us, send it to me my address.

933
00:44:06,960 --> 00:44:08,960
Speaker 1: That's right. Thanks for tuning in. And if you have

934
00:44:09,000 --> 00:44:12,840
Speaker 1: a question about our crazy, golden, beautiful, nasty, weird universe,

935
00:44:13,120 --> 00:44:16,440
Speaker 1: send it to us. I have questions at Danielanjorge dot com.

936
00:44:16,480 --> 00:44:17,720
Speaker 1: We love your emails.

937
00:44:17,760 --> 00:44:18,520
Speaker 3: See you next time.

938
00:44:18,680 --> 00:44:28,440
Speaker 1: All right, thanks for listening. If you still have a

939
00:44:28,480 --> 00:44:31,920
Speaker 1: question after listening to all these explanations, please drop us

940
00:44:31,960 --> 00:44:34,040
Speaker 1: a line. We'd love to hear from you. You can

941
00:44:34,080 --> 00:44:37,480
Speaker 1: find us at Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram at Daniel and

942
00:44:37,600 --> 00:44:41,120
Speaker 1: Jorge that's one word, or email us at Feedback at

943
00:44:41,200 --> 00:44:45,240
Speaker 1: Danielandhorge dot com. Thanks for listening and remember that. Daniel

944
00:44:45,280 --> 00:44:48,720
Speaker 1: and Jorge Explain the Universe is a production of iHeartRadio.

945
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Speaker 1: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

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