1 00:00:01,400 --> 00:00:07,959 Speaker 1: Quody balance. But Joseph Scott more. 2 00:00:06,000 --> 00:00:12,000 Speaker 2: I, for one, like the idea of having what's called 3 00:00:12,119 --> 00:00:17,440 Speaker 2: a family plot. Family plot can either say that you're 4 00:00:18,680 --> 00:00:22,520 Speaker 2: maybe you have a space in a local municipal cemetery, 5 00:00:23,520 --> 00:00:30,000 Speaker 2: or maybe you have a place in your church's graveyard, 6 00:00:31,640 --> 00:00:37,680 Speaker 2: or it can mean that you actually have a plot 7 00:00:38,040 --> 00:00:41,480 Speaker 2: set aside for burial of your loved ones on property 8 00:00:41,800 --> 00:00:47,360 Speaker 2: that perhaps has been in your family for years and years. 9 00:00:49,040 --> 00:00:52,160 Speaker 2: I don't know if the word quaint quite applies here, 10 00:00:52,200 --> 00:00:55,840 Speaker 2: but there's something I think on one level that's kind 11 00:00:55,880 --> 00:01:01,360 Speaker 2: of comforting. That is, if you're buried on your family's property, 12 00:01:01,880 --> 00:01:07,680 Speaker 2: he'll be perpetually taken care of. Today, on Bodybacks, we're 13 00:01:07,680 --> 00:01:12,360 Speaker 2: going to talk about a fellow who literally decided to 14 00:01:13,080 --> 00:01:19,120 Speaker 2: bury his mom and dad on his own property in 15 00:01:19,160 --> 00:01:26,319 Speaker 2: the backyard eight years ago, after he, of course allegedly 16 00:01:27,360 --> 00:01:36,920 Speaker 2: murder I'm Joseph Scott Morgan and this is Bodybacks. There's 17 00:01:36,959 --> 00:01:41,600 Speaker 2: something comforting, Dave about I think on one level about 18 00:01:41,600 --> 00:01:45,280 Speaker 2: perpetual care. Maybe I think it's more of a comfort 19 00:01:45,319 --> 00:01:47,680 Speaker 2: to those that remain as opposed to those that are 20 00:01:47,720 --> 00:01:49,760 Speaker 2: passed on, because I don't think the ones that have 21 00:01:49,800 --> 00:01:52,680 Speaker 2: passed on truly have an awareness of this sort of thing. 22 00:01:55,160 --> 00:01:57,640 Speaker 2: Not going to address it spiritual, but I think scientifically, 23 00:01:57,680 --> 00:02:01,160 Speaker 2: you know, they don't have an awareness of it. But 24 00:02:01,920 --> 00:02:04,920 Speaker 2: it's kind of a maybe it's a quaint notion. Like 25 00:02:04,960 --> 00:02:09,280 Speaker 2: I said, you don't have these very often, and you 26 00:02:09,320 --> 00:02:13,280 Speaker 2: know you, I got to tell you a quick story. 27 00:02:13,520 --> 00:02:18,239 Speaker 2: There was a place in Atlanta, and you'll find this 28 00:02:18,400 --> 00:02:21,280 Speaker 2: kind of interesting. There was a place in Atlanta neighborhood 29 00:02:21,280 --> 00:02:24,880 Speaker 2: in Atlanta that's called actually called Cabbage Town. I don't 30 00:02:24,880 --> 00:02:27,799 Speaker 2: know if you've ever heard of cabbage Town, Dave, but. 31 00:02:28,080 --> 00:02:30,400 Speaker 1: It's I bet it's like socks. 32 00:02:31,520 --> 00:02:41,480 Speaker 2: Well. It's actually a place where where people from Appalachia 33 00:02:42,000 --> 00:02:47,320 Speaker 2: came to Atlanta to work in the mills, and they 34 00:02:47,360 --> 00:02:51,200 Speaker 2: came lockstock and barrel, and they still had relatives that 35 00:02:51,400 --> 00:02:55,200 Speaker 2: lived up in that mountainous region of North Georgia and 36 00:02:55,680 --> 00:02:58,880 Speaker 2: points beyond, because there's work in the big city, right 37 00:02:59,400 --> 00:03:03,799 Speaker 2: and the habited these you know, quickly built wooden structures 38 00:03:03,800 --> 00:03:06,239 Speaker 2: that in the South at least we call the mill villages. 39 00:03:06,520 --> 00:03:09,160 Speaker 2: They're adjacent to textile mills and that sort of thing. 40 00:03:09,960 --> 00:03:14,200 Speaker 2: But Cabbagetown in particular had these kind of interesting rolling 41 00:03:14,400 --> 00:03:16,639 Speaker 2: features to it. You know, the hills were I mean 42 00:03:16,639 --> 00:03:19,040 Speaker 2: the roads you know, kind of cut off in different directions, 43 00:03:19,040 --> 00:03:21,800 Speaker 2: and there were these these families that had dwelled these 44 00:03:21,840 --> 00:03:24,799 Speaker 2: houses for a couple of generations, but they would still 45 00:03:24,840 --> 00:03:28,000 Speaker 2: go back up home to see their kin folk. Well, 46 00:03:28,080 --> 00:03:34,200 Speaker 2: we had a fellow in Atlanta that had died, right, 47 00:03:34,639 --> 00:03:40,440 Speaker 2: and he had died violently in a car accident, and 48 00:03:40,480 --> 00:03:47,560 Speaker 2: he was domiciled in Cabbagetown. Well, his family wanted to 49 00:03:47,600 --> 00:03:51,520 Speaker 2: retrieve his remains. His family lived up in the North 50 00:03:51,520 --> 00:03:57,120 Speaker 2: Georgia Mountains. His family showed up with a flatbed truck 51 00:03:58,480 --> 00:04:02,560 Speaker 2: to pick up his remains, and they had signed all 52 00:04:02,600 --> 00:04:03,480 Speaker 2: the proper paperwork. 53 00:04:03,520 --> 00:04:05,160 Speaker 1: By the way, really. 54 00:04:05,000 --> 00:04:07,200 Speaker 2: They wanted to handle picking him up. They didn't want 55 00:04:07,240 --> 00:04:11,360 Speaker 2: a funeral home to do it. So we released the body. 56 00:04:11,800 --> 00:04:14,200 Speaker 2: We released the body to them, and he was left 57 00:04:14,200 --> 00:04:15,680 Speaker 2: in a body bag and he was strapped to the 58 00:04:15,720 --> 00:04:18,200 Speaker 2: back of a flatbed truck and off they went up 59 00:04:18,240 --> 00:04:21,200 Speaker 2: into the Blue Ridge Mountains where he would be buried 60 00:04:21,680 --> 00:04:25,960 Speaker 2: in the family plot. I was always fascinated by that. Yeah, 61 00:04:25,960 --> 00:04:28,359 Speaker 2: and it wasn't my case. It was one of my colleagues, 62 00:04:28,400 --> 00:04:31,440 Speaker 2: and it had the story was related to me. It 63 00:04:31,520 --> 00:04:34,600 Speaker 2: had happened late at night. You know, they show up, 64 00:04:34,640 --> 00:04:37,159 Speaker 2: which normally happens. You know, if you in a busy 65 00:04:37,200 --> 00:04:40,719 Speaker 2: medical examiner's office. Bodies are literally being picked up and 66 00:04:40,800 --> 00:04:44,440 Speaker 2: delivered all hours of day, day at night. You worked 67 00:04:44,440 --> 00:04:46,640 Speaker 2: in a funeral home for a while, I know, and this, 68 00:04:46,839 --> 00:04:49,880 Speaker 2: you know, is unpredictable. So you can have a funeral 69 00:04:49,880 --> 00:04:52,040 Speaker 2: home that'll come from out of town. They might hit 70 00:04:52,040 --> 00:04:54,760 Speaker 2: the city, you know, at midnight, one two in the morning. 71 00:04:54,800 --> 00:04:56,960 Speaker 2: They're there to pick up remains. They're going to put 72 00:04:57,000 --> 00:05:00,120 Speaker 2: the remains in their heart typically or their van and 73 00:05:00,120 --> 00:05:02,640 Speaker 2: haul them off. In this case, they were taking this 74 00:05:02,680 --> 00:05:04,359 Speaker 2: old boy back up to the mountains and they were 75 00:05:04,360 --> 00:05:05,760 Speaker 2: going to bury him the family flat. 76 00:05:06,680 --> 00:05:08,560 Speaker 3: I love the fact that you said they got the 77 00:05:08,600 --> 00:05:10,040 Speaker 3: right paperwork that. 78 00:05:10,160 --> 00:05:12,360 Speaker 2: Yes they did. They they had gone through and had 79 00:05:12,360 --> 00:05:15,760 Speaker 2: gotten I think it was a burial certificate, which also 80 00:05:16,200 --> 00:05:18,839 Speaker 2: they it was required for them to have a burial 81 00:05:18,880 --> 00:05:22,960 Speaker 2: certificate to bury his remains on the property, you know, 82 00:05:22,960 --> 00:05:25,039 Speaker 2: because there has to be an accounting for where the 83 00:05:25,080 --> 00:05:25,680 Speaker 2: body is. 84 00:05:26,680 --> 00:05:26,800 Speaker 3: Uh. 85 00:05:27,279 --> 00:05:30,520 Speaker 2: And you know, they had all these measures taken care 86 00:05:30,560 --> 00:05:33,760 Speaker 2: of and it was an accidental case. It was not 87 00:05:33,800 --> 00:05:35,920 Speaker 2: like it was an ongoing homicide. Investigation. 88 00:05:36,520 --> 00:05:40,080 Speaker 1: Well see, you see that sounds like a lot of love. 89 00:05:40,120 --> 00:05:42,920 Speaker 3: That's a family that has the family plot, and there's 90 00:05:42,960 --> 00:05:45,440 Speaker 3: no Alfred Hitchcock movie coming out about it. It's just 91 00:05:45,520 --> 00:05:47,239 Speaker 3: you know, they're going to take care of their loved one. 92 00:05:47,640 --> 00:05:54,240 Speaker 3: But what we're dealing what we're dealing with here as communicate, communicate. 93 00:05:54,279 --> 00:05:55,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, you're right. 94 00:05:55,279 --> 00:06:00,440 Speaker 3: You know Joe, this loving son who when we look 95 00:06:00,440 --> 00:06:06,239 Speaker 3: at his parents' ages, they were ninety two. Yeah, Franz 96 00:06:06,279 --> 00:06:09,440 Speaker 3: Krause was ninety two and Teresa krousse eighty three. Okay, 97 00:06:09,720 --> 00:06:12,960 Speaker 3: that's today, that's how old they would be today. But 98 00:06:13,320 --> 00:06:15,680 Speaker 3: they were killed eight years ago. They haven't been seen 99 00:06:15,720 --> 00:06:19,279 Speaker 3: since August of twenty seventeen. So take away eight years 100 00:06:19,320 --> 00:06:23,520 Speaker 3: and you're talking about Franz Crouse was eighty four and 101 00:06:23,800 --> 00:06:32,200 Speaker 3: Teresa Krause seventy five, seventy five. That's that's not crawling 102 00:06:32,279 --> 00:06:37,039 Speaker 3: in the basket, you know. Anyway, we'll talk more about 103 00:06:37,360 --> 00:06:39,600 Speaker 3: their physical condition in a few minutes, but I just 104 00:06:39,640 --> 00:06:41,800 Speaker 3: wanted to get this off my chest because you need 105 00:06:41,839 --> 00:06:47,039 Speaker 3: to know that Lawrence Kraus wrote up this two page manifesto, 106 00:06:47,120 --> 00:06:48,920 Speaker 3: so to speak. You sent to every media outlet in 107 00:06:49,000 --> 00:06:52,880 Speaker 3: town and there was an investigation happening at the house. 108 00:06:53,120 --> 00:06:55,440 Speaker 3: The self security administration in the bank and a few 109 00:06:55,440 --> 00:06:58,840 Speaker 3: other financial institutions were concerned that they hadn't seen mister 110 00:06:58,880 --> 00:07:01,479 Speaker 3: and miss Krause for eight years, and they tried to 111 00:07:01,520 --> 00:07:02,120 Speaker 3: reach out to him. 112 00:07:02,160 --> 00:07:03,760 Speaker 1: They tried to contact him over the years. 113 00:07:03,760 --> 00:07:05,960 Speaker 3: It wasn't like it just started one day last week, 114 00:07:06,080 --> 00:07:09,160 Speaker 3: you know, over the years, they had made several attempts 115 00:07:09,200 --> 00:07:12,280 Speaker 3: to make contact with the crowd with mister missus Crosson. 116 00:07:12,320 --> 00:07:16,600 Speaker 3: Couldn't couldn't do it. And that's when finally Social Security 117 00:07:16,640 --> 00:07:21,680 Speaker 3: asked the police to go do a welfare check, and 118 00:07:22,600 --> 00:07:27,320 Speaker 3: that's when they started realizing we got a bigger problem here. 119 00:07:27,840 --> 00:07:29,720 Speaker 3: So I just want to be clear on this because 120 00:07:31,320 --> 00:07:34,760 Speaker 3: their son, their loving son, sends out this two page 121 00:07:35,120 --> 00:07:41,560 Speaker 3: manifesto and he gets a callback from a news anchor 122 00:07:43,200 --> 00:07:46,640 Speaker 3: at the local CBS affiliate in town. This news anchor 123 00:07:46,640 --> 00:07:49,320 Speaker 3: has been in the business of broadcasting news for forty 124 00:07:49,360 --> 00:07:50,040 Speaker 3: five years. 125 00:07:50,560 --> 00:07:54,320 Speaker 1: This ain't his first rodeo. I will tell you that. 126 00:07:55,720 --> 00:07:59,240 Speaker 3: If you sit down with Greg Floyd, a forty five 127 00:07:59,360 --> 00:08:03,560 Speaker 3: year veteran newsman, He's going to get out of you 128 00:08:03,640 --> 00:08:04,520 Speaker 3: what he wants. 129 00:08:04,760 --> 00:08:07,360 Speaker 1: He's going to figure you out. That's what he does. 130 00:08:08,080 --> 00:08:09,600 Speaker 1: He knows how to tell his story. 131 00:08:09,640 --> 00:08:12,080 Speaker 3: And what you do in this case is you find 132 00:08:12,240 --> 00:08:14,960 Speaker 3: what that person really wants to tell and you create 133 00:08:15,000 --> 00:08:17,720 Speaker 3: opportunities for them to tell it. He knew that he 134 00:08:17,840 --> 00:08:20,200 Speaker 3: that Cross really wanted to confess, and he was using 135 00:08:20,240 --> 00:08:23,800 Speaker 3: this two page manifesto of his belief system as the bait. 136 00:08:24,080 --> 00:08:25,960 Speaker 3: But he didn't want to confess. He didn't want to see. 137 00:08:25,960 --> 00:08:27,600 Speaker 3: He didn't want to admit it. He knows the jag 138 00:08:27,720 --> 00:08:32,880 Speaker 3: is up once I do this. But mister Floyd would 139 00:08:32,880 --> 00:08:35,680 Speaker 3: not give in. He would not He allowed him to 140 00:08:35,800 --> 00:08:40,079 Speaker 3: dig a hole, but he kept handing him the shovel. 141 00:08:40,280 --> 00:08:43,160 Speaker 3: You know, it's a brilliant piece of work. I hope 142 00:08:43,200 --> 00:08:47,000 Speaker 3: you get a chance to watch the video. Like I said, 143 00:08:47,000 --> 00:08:49,320 Speaker 3: the news anchor's name is Greg Floyd. He works for 144 00:08:49,360 --> 00:08:53,520 Speaker 3: the local CBS affiliate in Albany, New York, w RGB, 145 00:08:53,800 --> 00:08:57,760 Speaker 3: Channel six. It is it is something I should be 146 00:08:57,840 --> 00:09:02,280 Speaker 3: studied by, should be studied by everybody in broadcasting. This 147 00:09:02,320 --> 00:09:04,440 Speaker 3: is how you do an interview when you have no 148 00:09:04,520 --> 00:09:07,720 Speaker 3: time to prepare. He had ten minutes to prepare for 149 00:09:07,760 --> 00:09:10,559 Speaker 3: the interview of his life, and he's able to get 150 00:09:11,040 --> 00:09:16,960 Speaker 3: a very intelligent guy to confess to the murder of 151 00:09:17,000 --> 00:09:21,199 Speaker 3: his parents, and it's a confession on tape that will 152 00:09:21,200 --> 00:09:22,439 Speaker 3: hold up in court. 153 00:09:22,840 --> 00:09:26,000 Speaker 2: I think that it probably will because it wasn't elicited 154 00:09:27,240 --> 00:09:31,160 Speaker 2: by the police. This is a civilian doing this, and 155 00:09:31,200 --> 00:09:34,560 Speaker 2: can they use that, Yeah, I think they will. They're 156 00:09:34,559 --> 00:09:37,720 Speaker 2: certainly going to push forward with a trial in this 157 00:09:37,800 --> 00:09:40,520 Speaker 2: case because this individual has in fact been charged. But 158 00:09:41,280 --> 00:09:44,800 Speaker 2: it just goes to show you you never know who's 159 00:09:44,840 --> 00:09:47,880 Speaker 2: going to walk into a studio, and more than that, 160 00:09:48,280 --> 00:10:06,800 Speaker 2: you never know what they might say. Deranged, which is 161 00:10:07,440 --> 00:10:11,440 Speaker 2: an adjective. It's a descriptor, right, is a word that 162 00:10:11,559 --> 00:10:15,440 Speaker 2: is used to describe someone. And here's a definition. I 163 00:10:15,480 --> 00:10:23,800 Speaker 2: think this is actually Webster's definition of a person wildly 164 00:10:24,000 --> 00:10:30,000 Speaker 2: irrational or uncontrolled, such as in a deranged gunman. You know, 165 00:10:30,040 --> 00:10:33,080 Speaker 2: we hear that term frequently in the media. I was 166 00:10:33,120 --> 00:10:36,640 Speaker 2: reading an article, Dave in a New York Post, and 167 00:10:36,800 --> 00:10:44,520 Speaker 2: they used the term deranged to describe this son who 168 00:10:44,559 --> 00:10:51,000 Speaker 2: went into the studio relative to you know, what what 169 00:10:51,200 --> 00:10:56,560 Speaker 2: he had done. You know, And this is after the fact, Dave, 170 00:10:56,960 --> 00:11:03,760 Speaker 2: we're eight years down range from the disappearance of his parents. 171 00:11:04,160 --> 00:11:10,000 Speaker 2: I don't I think someone at the editorial. The editorial 172 00:11:10,040 --> 00:11:12,720 Speaker 2: people with New York posts need to sit down with 173 00:11:12,760 --> 00:11:14,920 Speaker 2: some of their reporters and have a discussion about the 174 00:11:14,960 --> 00:11:19,480 Speaker 2: word deranged, because this doesn't seem like somebody that is 175 00:11:19,520 --> 00:11:24,080 Speaker 2: in fact deranged if they're acting in an irrational manner. 176 00:11:26,040 --> 00:11:28,040 Speaker 2: I wonder if he was deranged when he was cashing 177 00:11:28,080 --> 00:11:29,320 Speaker 2: the checks. What say you? 178 00:11:32,200 --> 00:11:32,839 Speaker 1: I think that. 179 00:11:33,800 --> 00:11:37,400 Speaker 3: You know, a lot of words are misapplied, they're misused. 180 00:11:37,880 --> 00:11:41,200 Speaker 3: I hate the term superstar. I hate the term bravery 181 00:11:41,440 --> 00:11:44,480 Speaker 3: being used for people that are not brave. They're just 182 00:11:46,120 --> 00:11:50,720 Speaker 3: usually full of bs. You know, we reward people for 183 00:11:50,960 --> 00:11:53,400 Speaker 3: crazy things these days, and this guy's not deranged, right 184 00:11:53,679 --> 00:11:58,280 Speaker 3: he Actually it's interesting because this is I wanted the 185 00:11:58,280 --> 00:12:01,880 Speaker 3: opening paragraph. And by the way, it was the CBS 186 00:12:01,920 --> 00:12:09,600 Speaker 3: affiliate that actually got this news thing is WRGBTV. And 187 00:12:10,760 --> 00:12:14,840 Speaker 3: it's not that RGBTV was the target for this guy. 188 00:12:15,840 --> 00:12:19,120 Speaker 3: Lawrence Krause sent that email out to everybody in the community, 189 00:12:19,160 --> 00:12:24,880 Speaker 3: and this is the one that responded, and this is 190 00:12:24,920 --> 00:12:27,800 Speaker 3: what it says in the opening paragraph. A man admitted 191 00:12:27,880 --> 00:12:30,560 Speaker 3: during a television interview last week to killing his parents 192 00:12:30,559 --> 00:12:32,640 Speaker 3: and burying them in the backyard of their Upstate New 193 00:12:32,720 --> 00:12:34,000 Speaker 3: York home eight years ago. 194 00:12:34,920 --> 00:12:35,360 Speaker 1: Then he was. 195 00:12:35,360 --> 00:12:40,240 Speaker 3: Arrested as he left the studio. The stunning on camera 196 00:12:40,320 --> 00:12:44,319 Speaker 3: confession from Laurence Kraus fifty three came a day after 197 00:12:44,400 --> 00:12:46,880 Speaker 3: police say they recovered two bodies from the home in 198 00:12:46,920 --> 00:12:50,280 Speaker 3: Albany as part of an investigation that found Krau's parents, 199 00:12:50,320 --> 00:12:54,239 Speaker 3: Bronz and Teresa, were still receiving Social Security payments despite 200 00:12:54,559 --> 00:12:57,160 Speaker 3: not having been seen or heard from in years. 201 00:12:58,080 --> 00:12:58,560 Speaker 1: Eight years. 202 00:12:58,640 --> 00:13:03,040 Speaker 3: Joe, I think about that. Where were you eight years ago? 203 00:13:03,120 --> 00:13:04,000 Speaker 3: And what were you doing? 204 00:13:04,679 --> 00:13:08,080 Speaker 2: Oh lord, let's see where was I I had. I 205 00:13:08,160 --> 00:13:11,480 Speaker 2: was into my second or third year here at jack State, 206 00:13:13,640 --> 00:13:18,319 Speaker 2: you know, working as a professor, appearing on air, doing 207 00:13:18,559 --> 00:13:20,400 Speaker 2: a lot of the stuff I'm doing right now. But 208 00:13:20,600 --> 00:13:23,400 Speaker 2: it wasn't quite at this tempo that I work at now. 209 00:13:23,840 --> 00:13:27,000 Speaker 2: Wasn't doing a podcast eight years ago. But yeah, yeah, 210 00:13:27,200 --> 00:13:30,240 Speaker 2: I mean that's where I was. Here's the chilling thing 211 00:13:30,280 --> 00:13:33,400 Speaker 2: about that. I love the fact that you referenced time here, 212 00:13:33,600 --> 00:13:37,640 Speaker 2: because people, I think that people think these things happen 213 00:13:37,720 --> 00:13:40,800 Speaker 2: in a vacuum. Many times, there are cases like this. 214 00:13:40,960 --> 00:13:42,880 Speaker 2: There are currently cases out there right now that we're 215 00:13:42,920 --> 00:13:46,880 Speaker 2: not even aware of. Where you have a child, perhaps 216 00:13:47,000 --> 00:13:49,760 Speaker 2: that has killed their parents. Parents are missing, have been 217 00:13:49,800 --> 00:13:54,439 Speaker 2: missing for a while, and the child has has gotten 218 00:13:54,480 --> 00:13:56,960 Speaker 2: rid of remains one way or another. You know, you 219 00:13:57,000 --> 00:14:00,040 Speaker 2: and I, you know, always harp on dismemberment. But you know, 220 00:14:00,120 --> 00:14:04,160 Speaker 2: we've covered those cases. We've covered burning, reducing the body 221 00:14:04,760 --> 00:14:12,040 Speaker 2: through cremation, and in some cases like this burial. I 222 00:14:12,840 --> 00:14:15,080 Speaker 2: you know, it harkened back. I think I've mentioned this 223 00:14:15,120 --> 00:14:18,439 Speaker 2: case before to a case that we consulted on many 224 00:14:18,559 --> 00:14:21,240 Speaker 2: years ago. When I was with a corner in New Orleans. 225 00:14:22,000 --> 00:14:25,720 Speaker 2: There was an adjacent city where a guy had been 226 00:14:25,760 --> 00:14:29,040 Speaker 2: living in the house. His wife had none missing his wife. 227 00:14:29,200 --> 00:14:31,040 Speaker 2: And this is right out by the way. This is 228 00:14:31,120 --> 00:14:36,560 Speaker 2: right after luminol stepped onto the stage as an instrument, 229 00:14:37,040 --> 00:14:39,680 Speaker 2: and a friend of mine, one of my colleagues, was 230 00:14:39,720 --> 00:14:43,080 Speaker 2: one of the first people in Louisiana to be trained 231 00:14:43,160 --> 00:14:46,840 Speaker 2: up utilizing luminol. He was a forensic scientist and he 232 00:14:47,560 --> 00:14:50,120 Speaker 2: agreed to go to this jurisdiction and apply it in 233 00:14:50,160 --> 00:14:53,160 Speaker 2: the basement of the house. What happened is the guy 234 00:14:53,160 --> 00:14:56,320 Speaker 2: that lived in the house sold the house, and the 235 00:14:56,360 --> 00:14:58,800 Speaker 2: cops had been watching the house for a protracted period 236 00:14:58,840 --> 00:15:02,000 Speaker 2: of time. They knew they thought that the wife had 237 00:15:02,000 --> 00:15:05,400 Speaker 2: been killed in the house. And my friend shows up, 238 00:15:05,600 --> 00:15:09,160 Speaker 2: and you know, he's having to explain, you know, how 239 00:15:09,160 --> 00:15:10,960 Speaker 2: to use luminol and all that sort of thing. And 240 00:15:11,000 --> 00:15:12,960 Speaker 2: I want you to know, they peel the carpet back 241 00:15:13,040 --> 00:15:16,920 Speaker 2: in the basement of this home and sprayed it. And 242 00:15:16,960 --> 00:15:20,120 Speaker 2: this is many years later, and it just began to luminess. 243 00:15:20,800 --> 00:15:22,760 Speaker 2: And you have to do this in the dark, you know, 244 00:15:22,800 --> 00:15:25,080 Speaker 2: and you have to be keen. And this is back 245 00:15:25,120 --> 00:15:28,200 Speaker 2: when we were using thirty five millimeters photography, and you 246 00:15:28,280 --> 00:15:31,640 Speaker 2: have to be very very sensitive to the settings on 247 00:15:32,160 --> 00:15:34,520 Speaker 2: your film and these sorts of things on your camera. 248 00:15:34,600 --> 00:15:38,960 Speaker 2: Rather and as it turns out, the new couple, the 249 00:15:39,040 --> 00:15:41,440 Speaker 2: couple that had bought the house hadn't moved in yet, Dave, 250 00:15:41,440 --> 00:15:44,200 Speaker 2: can you imagine having a cop show up and they said, hey, 251 00:15:45,320 --> 00:15:48,640 Speaker 2: we think this guy may have killed his wife in 252 00:15:48,680 --> 00:15:52,400 Speaker 2: the house you just fought. And they had a statement 253 00:15:52,680 --> 00:15:58,280 Speaker 2: from the next door neighbor that from years earlier that 254 00:15:58,320 --> 00:16:02,000 Speaker 2: the neighbors had said he had they used to didn't 255 00:16:02,040 --> 00:16:03,760 Speaker 2: have a rose garden, now to have a rose guard. 256 00:16:03,800 --> 00:16:05,360 Speaker 2: And I want you to know, they dug up the 257 00:16:05,400 --> 00:16:09,960 Speaker 2: rose guard and the wife was buried there. Your pardon yeah, yeah, 258 00:16:10,000 --> 00:16:12,080 Speaker 2: I never promise you. I said what you did, They're 259 00:16:12,280 --> 00:16:15,760 Speaker 2: very well done. Yeah, and so yeah, and so this 260 00:16:15,760 --> 00:16:19,720 Speaker 2: this does happen. You know, these ideas of concealment, and 261 00:16:19,960 --> 00:16:24,560 Speaker 2: from a forensics perspective, here's here's kind of what you're 262 00:16:24,600 --> 00:16:28,480 Speaker 2: faced with, because this is what is referred to as 263 00:16:28,480 --> 00:16:34,520 Speaker 2: a clandestine grave or some people say clandestine grave, where 264 00:16:34,960 --> 00:16:43,320 Speaker 2: you're you're attempting to conceal a body. Now, you can't 265 00:16:43,400 --> 00:16:48,480 Speaker 2: say necessarily that that you have a homicide on your hands, 266 00:16:48,480 --> 00:16:51,320 Speaker 2: but you do know you do have somebody that is 267 00:16:51,400 --> 00:16:54,120 Speaker 2: making an attempt to keep the body out of view 268 00:16:54,200 --> 00:16:57,200 Speaker 2: so that no one else will find it. I guess 269 00:16:57,240 --> 00:17:01,200 Speaker 2: in principle, maybe from a practice standpoint point, it might 270 00:17:01,280 --> 00:17:03,360 Speaker 2: be a good idea, you know, to try to do it, 271 00:17:03,400 --> 00:17:06,119 Speaker 2: to try to render it down. But if you can't 272 00:17:06,119 --> 00:17:08,840 Speaker 2: put distance between yourself and the body and you're still 273 00:17:08,880 --> 00:17:13,160 Speaker 2: domiciled at that location, they show up and they disinter 274 00:17:13,359 --> 00:17:16,119 Speaker 2: the bodies, dig up the backyard, which you would have 275 00:17:16,160 --> 00:17:18,040 Speaker 2: had to have done. They would have called in a 276 00:17:18,040 --> 00:17:24,760 Speaker 2: forensic anthropologist. You know, you're they're going to be looking 277 00:17:24,800 --> 00:17:27,480 Speaker 2: at you really hard at this point because you have 278 00:17:27,560 --> 00:17:30,480 Speaker 2: to ask who has access to the backyard. Who would 279 00:17:30,480 --> 00:17:33,440 Speaker 2: have time in order to do this, and who would 280 00:17:33,480 --> 00:17:36,080 Speaker 2: who would kill two elderly people like this? 281 00:17:36,240 --> 00:17:39,719 Speaker 3: Okay, And when we get into this, I'm curious because 282 00:17:41,800 --> 00:17:43,480 Speaker 3: going to the end of the story, first, I would 283 00:17:43,560 --> 00:17:49,520 Speaker 3: have thought that the smell of decomposition would have been prevalent, 284 00:17:49,560 --> 00:17:51,439 Speaker 3: that neighbors would have smelled, even if you bury them 285 00:17:51,480 --> 00:17:54,520 Speaker 3: a few feet deep. I would have thought that that 286 00:17:54,560 --> 00:17:55,680 Speaker 3: people would smell it. 287 00:17:56,840 --> 00:18:02,880 Speaker 2: No, uh no, what I think probably it's masked greatly. 288 00:18:03,080 --> 00:18:06,359 Speaker 2: And of course this is and it's kind of common sense. 289 00:18:06,600 --> 00:18:10,640 Speaker 2: I think. First off, have you wrapped the body? Did 290 00:18:10,680 --> 00:18:13,120 Speaker 2: he wrap the body in anything? Is there any remnant? 291 00:18:13,600 --> 00:18:15,240 Speaker 2: You know, we just did the case about the woman 292 00:18:15,280 --> 00:18:18,040 Speaker 2: in the well and they found the burlap sack one 293 00:18:18,119 --> 00:18:20,080 Speaker 2: hundred years ago that she had been wrapped in and 294 00:18:20,160 --> 00:18:23,479 Speaker 2: dumped down the well. Great story. I've thought about that 295 00:18:23,520 --> 00:18:28,240 Speaker 2: several times since we laid that one down. And if 296 00:18:28,240 --> 00:18:31,640 Speaker 2: he concealed their bodies or cocoon the bodies and then 297 00:18:31,720 --> 00:18:33,399 Speaker 2: bury them. But a lot of this is going to 298 00:18:33,440 --> 00:18:36,679 Speaker 2: be depth related. And what did he do with the soil? 299 00:18:37,040 --> 00:18:38,879 Speaker 2: You know, how did he did he do anything to 300 00:18:39,920 --> 00:18:43,360 Speaker 2: did he add soil to it? Did he go out 301 00:18:43,359 --> 00:18:45,880 Speaker 2: and augment because you know, you can dig a hole. 302 00:18:45,920 --> 00:18:49,040 Speaker 2: Here's one of the problems with clandestine graves and truth, 303 00:18:49,160 --> 00:18:55,359 Speaker 2: I mean clandestine burials. Let me just say that, because again, 304 00:18:55,560 --> 00:18:59,520 Speaker 2: you can in a clandestine manner, you can get rid 305 00:18:59,560 --> 00:19:03,920 Speaker 2: of a body. But when you have a clandestine burial, 306 00:19:05,760 --> 00:19:07,879 Speaker 2: you're not going to have a vault to put a 307 00:19:07,960 --> 00:19:10,280 Speaker 2: body in. So what does that mean. Well, if you 308 00:19:10,400 --> 00:19:13,479 Speaker 2: dig a hole and it's just a hole in the earth, 309 00:19:13,520 --> 00:19:17,240 Speaker 2: and let's say you decide to go down six feet, okay, Well, 310 00:19:18,200 --> 00:19:22,000 Speaker 2: once you put that body at the bottom of that hole. 311 00:19:22,960 --> 00:19:25,639 Speaker 2: You know you talked about the smell of decomposition. You 312 00:19:25,720 --> 00:19:28,240 Speaker 2: might not spell the decomposition. But one of the things 313 00:19:28,240 --> 00:19:31,240 Speaker 2: that's going to be evidenced, and this is kind of cool, 314 00:19:31,600 --> 00:19:36,199 Speaker 2: is that if you look at a traditional image of 315 00:19:36,240 --> 00:19:39,800 Speaker 2: a burial where you got earth that's mounded up. You know, 316 00:19:39,840 --> 00:19:42,680 Speaker 2: and I know we've all seen this, and you know 317 00:19:42,720 --> 00:19:44,960 Speaker 2: in literature and movies and that sort of thing, where 318 00:19:44,960 --> 00:19:46,960 Speaker 2: you've got a mound of earth where a body has 319 00:19:46,960 --> 00:19:51,600 Speaker 2: been buried beneath the ground. Guess what happens, Well, the 320 00:19:51,640 --> 00:19:58,560 Speaker 2: soil begins to sink and as the body decomposes, at 321 00:19:58,600 --> 00:20:04,840 Speaker 2: the bottom. Okay, all that tissue begins to disappear, the 322 00:20:04,920 --> 00:20:07,800 Speaker 2: thing is going to sink even more. So you don't 323 00:20:07,840 --> 00:20:10,480 Speaker 2: have the framework of like a concrete vault that's stuck 324 00:20:10,480 --> 00:20:13,520 Speaker 2: in the ground, like when you put into a regular 325 00:20:13,840 --> 00:20:17,440 Speaker 2: you know, city cemetery, where you drop this concrete vault 326 00:20:17,440 --> 00:20:19,320 Speaker 2: in there and you put a lid over it and 327 00:20:19,359 --> 00:20:21,520 Speaker 2: you pack down. You know, they got the machinery they 328 00:20:21,560 --> 00:20:23,800 Speaker 2: pack it down and all that. You don't have access 329 00:20:23,840 --> 00:20:26,639 Speaker 2: to that unless he's got you know, he's got like 330 00:20:26,680 --> 00:20:28,840 Speaker 2: a little skid steer or something like that that he 331 00:20:28,880 --> 00:20:31,160 Speaker 2: can go out there. If you're digging these holes by hand. 332 00:20:31,600 --> 00:20:34,720 Speaker 2: Also you can go back behind it and you can 333 00:20:34,760 --> 00:20:38,359 Speaker 2: stack gravel perhaps or rock and then bury that on 334 00:20:38,440 --> 00:20:42,160 Speaker 2: top of the bodies as well. But still you're going 335 00:20:42,320 --> 00:20:46,720 Speaker 2: there's there's nothing like nature to pack soil. If you 336 00:20:46,800 --> 00:20:51,840 Speaker 2: have virgin, untouched soil, maybe the soil has literally never 337 00:20:51,880 --> 00:20:54,280 Speaker 2: been turned in this area. Now I doubt it, because 338 00:20:54,359 --> 00:20:58,880 Speaker 2: this is a plot where a home was built at 339 00:20:58,920 --> 00:21:02,119 Speaker 2: some point time, So you have to imagine that some uh, 340 00:21:02,720 --> 00:21:04,800 Speaker 2: some earth had been moved at some point in time 341 00:21:04,880 --> 00:21:08,480 Speaker 2: in the distant past. It's going to change the configuration 342 00:21:09,320 --> 00:21:11,840 Speaker 2: of the mound there that you have where you have 343 00:21:11,920 --> 00:21:13,800 Speaker 2: it kind of in dwelling, it's going to begin to 344 00:21:13,840 --> 00:21:15,040 Speaker 2: collapse in on itself. 345 00:21:16,160 --> 00:21:16,480 Speaker 1: Wow. 346 00:21:18,359 --> 00:21:23,280 Speaker 3: I'm amazed at the things I don't think about sometimes 347 00:21:23,320 --> 00:21:25,520 Speaker 3: when we get ready to do a story. You know, 348 00:21:26,480 --> 00:21:28,560 Speaker 3: it didn't occur to me, So I don't. 349 00:21:28,359 --> 00:21:30,840 Speaker 2: Think about them many times until I go back to 350 00:21:30,880 --> 00:21:34,720 Speaker 2: a case. Nowadays, I don't think about it and I'm like, oh, okay, 351 00:21:34,760 --> 00:21:37,919 Speaker 2: this is something that I once knew and that and 352 00:21:37,960 --> 00:21:41,679 Speaker 2: that you know, I was practiced at. You know, you know, 353 00:21:41,760 --> 00:21:43,960 Speaker 2: you rekindle these things in your brain, you begin to 354 00:21:43,960 --> 00:21:44,720 Speaker 2: think about. 355 00:21:44,480 --> 00:21:45,320 Speaker 1: Them, all right. 356 00:21:45,359 --> 00:21:48,440 Speaker 3: Well, in this particular case, I have to wonder Joe 357 00:21:49,200 --> 00:21:52,920 Speaker 3: as Laurence Kraus, Uh, like I said, they figured this out. 358 00:21:52,920 --> 00:21:57,560 Speaker 3: They say they being pretty much probably accountant because nobody 359 00:21:57,640 --> 00:21:58,040 Speaker 3: had seen. 360 00:21:58,040 --> 00:22:00,480 Speaker 1: It's just you know, Alvan, he's not a big place. 361 00:22:00,880 --> 00:22:04,280 Speaker 2: It's uh see the government for the New York Yeah. 362 00:22:04,560 --> 00:22:08,720 Speaker 3: But from a neighborhood standpoint, you know, just like your neighborhood. 363 00:22:08,800 --> 00:22:13,760 Speaker 3: My neighborhood, people asked questions and you know, somebody's looking 364 00:22:13,800 --> 00:22:16,600 Speaker 3: at this guy, going, I haven't seen his parents. You're 365 00:22:16,640 --> 00:22:20,720 Speaker 3: down at the bank, you're dealing with somebody's gonna talk. Okay, 366 00:22:21,000 --> 00:22:23,000 Speaker 3: when they don't see mom and dad in here and 367 00:22:23,000 --> 00:22:25,080 Speaker 3: they see you living off their money, somebody's they're going 368 00:22:25,160 --> 00:22:26,960 Speaker 3: to be jealous and be they're going to want to 369 00:22:27,000 --> 00:22:27,800 Speaker 3: know what happened. 370 00:22:28,200 --> 00:22:32,119 Speaker 2: And so yeah, and you know, it begs a question, 371 00:22:32,240 --> 00:22:34,560 Speaker 2: you know, when you're an investigator and you're you're working 372 00:22:34,600 --> 00:22:37,640 Speaker 2: on cases like this, who else knew the crosses? 373 00:22:38,040 --> 00:22:38,240 Speaker 1: You know? 374 00:22:38,280 --> 00:22:42,159 Speaker 2: Who like were there? Did they have any living siblings? 375 00:22:42,160 --> 00:22:45,480 Speaker 2: Were there any cousins that were still love They're elderly, 376 00:22:45,600 --> 00:22:48,280 Speaker 2: so you have to assume that their parents had passed on. 377 00:22:49,560 --> 00:22:53,200 Speaker 2: But did they have laurens? They were siblings, have any kids? 378 00:22:54,840 --> 00:22:58,080 Speaker 3: According to him, they were World War two Nazi survivors, 379 00:22:58,119 --> 00:23:01,439 Speaker 3: survivors of Nazi Germany, you know, and which does kind 380 00:23:01,480 --> 00:23:03,280 Speaker 3: of lead you. I'm glad you pointed that out about 381 00:23:03,320 --> 00:23:06,240 Speaker 3: the did they have any other relatives because if they did, 382 00:23:07,000 --> 00:23:08,040 Speaker 3: shame on them. 383 00:23:08,560 --> 00:23:08,760 Speaker 2: Yeah? 384 00:23:08,800 --> 00:23:12,000 Speaker 1: Eight years, come on, eight years. Yeah, but elderly people. 385 00:23:12,440 --> 00:23:14,520 Speaker 3: I hope I make it to ninety and you don't 386 00:23:14,520 --> 00:23:16,320 Speaker 3: hear from me from that, You don't show up and 387 00:23:16,320 --> 00:23:18,680 Speaker 3: find me in my recliner, you know, skeletoniz. 388 00:23:19,480 --> 00:23:24,520 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, and you have to because It's one thing. Okay, 389 00:23:24,520 --> 00:23:27,800 Speaker 2: it's one thing if you're taking care of elderly parents, 390 00:23:27,800 --> 00:23:32,520 Speaker 2: all right, and you have dad that passes away, and 391 00:23:32,560 --> 00:23:35,280 Speaker 2: there's all those you know, kind of and I don't 392 00:23:35,320 --> 00:23:39,200 Speaker 2: necessarily think they're anecdotal stories, Dave. As a matter of fact, 393 00:23:39,200 --> 00:23:42,000 Speaker 2: I recall having worked one similar to it. You know 394 00:23:42,040 --> 00:23:43,639 Speaker 2: these stories that pop up in the news, I know 395 00:23:43,680 --> 00:23:46,040 Speaker 2: you're aware of them, where you'll have an elderly couple 396 00:23:46,080 --> 00:23:48,080 Speaker 2: have been together for years and years and the wife 397 00:23:48,080 --> 00:23:50,719 Speaker 2: will died and then the husband will diestly, yeah, shortly 398 00:23:50,760 --> 00:23:53,840 Speaker 2: after or or conversely. You know it can happen like that. 399 00:23:54,400 --> 00:24:00,200 Speaker 2: But what are the odds that both parents would essentially 400 00:24:00,520 --> 00:24:04,600 Speaker 2: slip off the mortal coil, if you will, into the 401 00:24:04,600 --> 00:24:25,640 Speaker 2: great beyond without even leaving a trace, Dave. A real 402 00:24:26,400 --> 00:24:29,280 Speaker 2: tip of the cap here too. And I love the 403 00:24:29,320 --> 00:24:36,000 Speaker 2: fact that you used the term newsman. You don't hear 404 00:24:36,040 --> 00:24:42,959 Speaker 2: that term used much anymore. This this guy, he's actually 405 00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:48,000 Speaker 2: an anchor. His name's Greg Floyd. I really if I 406 00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:49,760 Speaker 2: could sit down have a cup of coffee with him, 407 00:24:49,800 --> 00:24:52,639 Speaker 2: I would love just to sit there, ask him maybe 408 00:24:52,680 --> 00:24:55,879 Speaker 2: two questions and just let him talk. I'd love to 409 00:24:55,920 --> 00:24:59,040 Speaker 2: hear what his gut reaction was to all this and 410 00:24:59,320 --> 00:25:02,600 Speaker 2: being perfec professional in media. I'm sure that you know 411 00:25:02,720 --> 00:25:04,960 Speaker 2: he would try to keep it right down the line, 412 00:25:05,000 --> 00:25:07,840 Speaker 2: but you know, at a human level, he's sitting across 413 00:25:08,160 --> 00:25:11,720 Speaker 2: He's sitting across from this guy saying this is the 414 00:25:11,800 --> 00:25:13,960 Speaker 2: last thing I expected when I woke up this morning. 415 00:25:14,280 --> 00:25:17,040 Speaker 2: You know, I can I can only imagine the tale. 416 00:25:17,280 --> 00:25:20,359 Speaker 2: And what's really fascinating about this, Dave, is that this case, 417 00:25:20,520 --> 00:25:24,000 Speaker 2: these cases are going to go to trial. He's going 418 00:25:24,040 --> 00:25:27,480 Speaker 2: to be compelled to testify and he'll be up on 419 00:25:27,520 --> 00:25:29,439 Speaker 2: the stand, and it's it's a rare thing when you 420 00:25:29,480 --> 00:25:32,240 Speaker 2: hear reporters testify, you know, so in this case, you 421 00:25:32,320 --> 00:25:34,720 Speaker 2: will you probably because you know he's the one that 422 00:25:34,800 --> 00:25:36,520 Speaker 2: kind of glinks because they're going to want him to 423 00:25:36,560 --> 00:25:38,840 Speaker 2: break down. How did this work? What was your motivation 424 00:25:39,000 --> 00:25:42,840 Speaker 2: for you know, offering this this guy, uh, you know, 425 00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:46,920 Speaker 2: access to you and to you know, to your your 426 00:25:47,119 --> 00:25:50,719 Speaker 2: your megaphone that you have with the media, and uh, 427 00:25:51,280 --> 00:25:53,080 Speaker 2: you know. And the thing about it is, it's all 428 00:25:53,119 --> 00:25:56,800 Speaker 2: on tape, brother, every bit is on tape. With with 429 00:25:56,880 --> 00:25:57,399 Speaker 2: this case. 430 00:25:57,640 --> 00:26:01,240 Speaker 3: It makes you when you look at the history of 431 00:26:01,280 --> 00:26:03,919 Speaker 3: the guy of Floyd. Mister Floyd had been in the 432 00:26:03,920 --> 00:26:06,520 Speaker 3: business for forty five years. Okay, he's not a rookie. 433 00:26:07,160 --> 00:26:11,640 Speaker 3: And when this two page email comes in from somebody 434 00:26:11,680 --> 00:26:14,840 Speaker 3: that they just found two bodies in the backyard, and he, 435 00:26:15,119 --> 00:26:17,840 Speaker 3: you know, he wants he wants his statement post. 436 00:26:17,920 --> 00:26:19,600 Speaker 1: That's where this whole thing started with. 437 00:26:21,119 --> 00:26:26,080 Speaker 3: The son, the the killer, the son or the alleged killer, 438 00:26:26,480 --> 00:26:29,440 Speaker 3: the admitted killer. I don't know the right word, but anyway, 439 00:26:29,960 --> 00:26:34,200 Speaker 3: Lawrence Krause sends an email to all the media, newspaper, radio, TV, 440 00:26:34,320 --> 00:26:37,640 Speaker 3: sends it out to everybody, and he's saying, I want 441 00:26:37,680 --> 00:26:40,760 Speaker 3: this posted. You know, I'm on your website. It's my 442 00:26:40,840 --> 00:26:44,640 Speaker 3: two page explanation of why they're in the backyard. And 443 00:26:45,840 --> 00:26:48,960 Speaker 3: nobody responded. And it's probably because there was probably nobody 444 00:26:49,000 --> 00:26:52,280 Speaker 3: at the radio stations there, you know, because they're all 445 00:26:52,320 --> 00:26:55,359 Speaker 3: brought in from outside nobody, you know, local radio and 446 00:26:55,359 --> 00:27:01,160 Speaker 3: TV are not really local anymore. And so this one newsplace, 447 00:27:01,680 --> 00:27:03,919 Speaker 3: they are a man, and they did have a professional 448 00:27:03,920 --> 00:27:05,880 Speaker 3: in there. And so he reaches out and says heay, 449 00:27:05,920 --> 00:27:10,399 Speaker 3: what buddy, we'll post this on our website if you 450 00:27:10,440 --> 00:27:11,360 Speaker 3: come in for an interview. 451 00:27:12,480 --> 00:27:13,800 Speaker 1: So it's a little trade off here. 452 00:27:13,840 --> 00:27:16,240 Speaker 3: You know, you don't know if this guy is going 453 00:27:16,320 --> 00:27:19,600 Speaker 3: to go, you know, David Koresh, you know, wanting to 454 00:27:19,600 --> 00:27:21,879 Speaker 3: open up the Seven Seals before he gives you the truth. 455 00:27:22,280 --> 00:27:25,480 Speaker 3: But this guy said, Okay, let's do it. And so 456 00:27:25,600 --> 00:27:28,879 Speaker 3: Floyd has like ten minutes to prepare ten minutes. So 457 00:27:28,920 --> 00:27:30,679 Speaker 3: in that ten minutes, he knows the bodies are in 458 00:27:30,680 --> 00:27:33,520 Speaker 3: the backyard, and he knows they're elderly, so he's probably 459 00:27:33,520 --> 00:27:35,760 Speaker 3: gonna assume they were getting some kind of payment here, 460 00:27:35,800 --> 00:27:37,639 Speaker 3: money's coming in. There's going to have to he's going 461 00:27:37,720 --> 00:27:41,840 Speaker 3: to justify something. And so once he gets him in there, 462 00:27:44,520 --> 00:27:46,200 Speaker 3: the son is trying to make it seem like he 463 00:27:46,240 --> 00:27:50,880 Speaker 3: was doing a suddenly duty, a child's way of taking 464 00:27:50,880 --> 00:27:53,879 Speaker 3: care of mom and dad. Well, just because somebody's old 465 00:27:53,960 --> 00:27:57,040 Speaker 3: doesn't mean they're headed for the dirt. You know, there 466 00:27:57,040 --> 00:27:58,879 Speaker 3: are a lot of people that are very old that 467 00:27:58,960 --> 00:28:02,359 Speaker 3: are living vibrant lives. You know, Clint Eastwood is still 468 00:28:02,359 --> 00:28:04,680 Speaker 3: directing movies and he's one hundred and fifty seven. 469 00:28:04,960 --> 00:28:08,840 Speaker 2: You know, yeah, yeah, you're you're right. And you know, 470 00:28:08,880 --> 00:28:11,000 Speaker 2: one of the one of the things that he had 471 00:28:12,200 --> 00:28:15,400 Speaker 2: he had he had stated as his rationale. I think 472 00:28:15,600 --> 00:28:18,920 Speaker 2: he's he's regarding this as a mercy killing. Essentially, that 473 00:28:19,000 --> 00:28:21,359 Speaker 2: is what it comes down to. And one of the 474 00:28:21,400 --> 00:28:26,240 Speaker 2: things that he had stated his rationale is his parents 475 00:28:26,640 --> 00:28:31,200 Speaker 2: were and again I'm kind of using my own words here, 476 00:28:32,640 --> 00:28:36,879 Speaker 2: that his parents were declining in health. And one of 477 00:28:37,680 --> 00:28:41,960 Speaker 2: one of the one of the reasons cited is that 478 00:28:42,160 --> 00:28:45,680 Speaker 2: his parents had had uh the dad had been hit 479 00:28:46,200 --> 00:28:50,040 Speaker 2: at some point in time as a pedestrian and had, 480 00:28:50,240 --> 00:28:56,040 Speaker 2: you know, could not ambulate real well. Mom had had 481 00:28:56,200 --> 00:29:00,120 Speaker 2: cataract surgery. Now I got I got to tell you, 482 00:29:00,240 --> 00:29:04,600 Speaker 2: I didn't know cataract surgery was a qualification for you know, 483 00:29:04,680 --> 00:29:10,120 Speaker 2: for murder. But you know, if everybody in America that 484 00:29:10,200 --> 00:29:13,080 Speaker 2: had had cataract surgery, if that condemns you to death, 485 00:29:13,160 --> 00:29:15,760 Speaker 2: oh my lord, we'd lose at the population. That's a 486 00:29:16,560 --> 00:29:18,640 Speaker 2: that's the perspective he's coming from. Day. 487 00:29:19,280 --> 00:29:21,800 Speaker 3: I'm taking them out of their misery. Joe, my dad 488 00:29:22,000 --> 00:29:23,880 Speaker 3: not getting around like he used to him. Mom just 489 00:29:23,960 --> 00:29:27,120 Speaker 3: had cataract surgery. They're both they're old, and they're falling apart. 490 00:29:27,240 --> 00:29:29,360 Speaker 3: I'm just going to help them so they can die 491 00:29:29,640 --> 00:29:33,520 Speaker 3: in peace and at their own home. And again, this 492 00:29:33,560 --> 00:29:38,720 Speaker 3: guy's level of he needs to be a salesman, but 493 00:29:38,880 --> 00:29:41,120 Speaker 3: he's not. He's going to be selling in prison now. 494 00:29:41,240 --> 00:29:44,400 Speaker 2: So yeah, yeah, I don't understand it. 495 00:29:44,480 --> 00:29:47,480 Speaker 3: Now I know what he did. How did he accomplish 496 00:29:47,640 --> 00:29:48,760 Speaker 3: killing his mom and his dad? 497 00:29:48,880 --> 00:29:53,000 Speaker 2: Joe, listen, This is according to the interview, and it's 498 00:29:53,400 --> 00:29:55,600 Speaker 2: it is one of the more chilling things I've heard 499 00:29:55,720 --> 00:29:57,600 Speaker 2: in some time. And I've already shared this with you, 500 00:29:57,640 --> 00:29:59,600 Speaker 2: but I think our friends need to know. And this 501 00:29:59,720 --> 00:30:06,120 Speaker 2: is you know, actually from uh from the local the 502 00:30:06,160 --> 00:30:13,560 Speaker 2: local news outlet up there. He actually confesses and when 503 00:30:13,600 --> 00:30:21,200 Speaker 2: he confesses, he tells them in this taping that he 504 00:30:21,440 --> 00:30:30,120 Speaker 2: had in fact suffocated his father. Now, when you say suffocate, 505 00:30:30,360 --> 00:30:37,640 Speaker 2: that's very specific because it's suffocation, just like other ways 506 00:30:37,680 --> 00:30:41,320 Speaker 2: to compromise the airway are considered to be as phixial deaths, 507 00:30:41,400 --> 00:30:46,479 Speaker 2: which is phixial means that you're depriving someone of oxygen. Okay, 508 00:30:46,640 --> 00:30:51,840 Speaker 2: so how would you go about suffocating somebody? Well, there 509 00:30:51,840 --> 00:30:55,960 Speaker 2: are any number of ways, uh, suffocation, smothering. You know, you 510 00:30:56,040 --> 00:31:00,600 Speaker 2: begin to think about using a pillow, place a plastic 511 00:31:00,680 --> 00:31:07,720 Speaker 2: bag over somebody's head or even even the hand, uh, 512 00:31:07,760 --> 00:31:11,160 Speaker 2: if they're in a debilitated state, which you know, he 513 00:31:11,160 --> 00:31:15,080 Speaker 2: he's making the argument that they're physically compromised at this 514 00:31:15,120 --> 00:31:19,560 Speaker 2: point in time in their lives. Would you would you 515 00:31:19,560 --> 00:31:22,680 Speaker 2: hold your hand pinch your dad's nose and hold holds 516 00:31:22,720 --> 00:31:26,160 Speaker 2: your hand over his mouth? What what kind of person 517 00:31:26,640 --> 00:31:29,920 Speaker 2: would do this to their father? And then he makes 518 00:31:30,080 --> 00:31:32,720 Speaker 2: this is the real chilling party kills his dad at 519 00:31:32,720 --> 00:31:37,479 Speaker 2: this point in tom Then he says, and get this, David, 520 00:31:38,000 --> 00:31:45,600 Speaker 2: that his mother laid her head on the chest of 521 00:31:45,640 --> 00:31:52,760 Speaker 2: her now deceased husband, and the son stated allegedly that 522 00:31:53,040 --> 00:31:57,160 Speaker 2: he allowed her to be with the man for a 523 00:31:57,200 --> 00:32:02,720 Speaker 2: couple of hours. And then he pooks the exclamation point 524 00:32:03,000 --> 00:32:06,880 Speaker 2: by saying, I put her out of her misery by 525 00:32:06,960 --> 00:32:13,480 Speaker 2: using a rope. So now he's suffocated his dad allegedly 526 00:32:14,160 --> 00:32:17,600 Speaker 2: and has taken a rope wrapped around his mama's throat 527 00:32:19,280 --> 00:32:22,120 Speaker 2: and choked the life out of her with it. Now 528 00:32:22,160 --> 00:32:25,040 Speaker 2: that's a ligature strangulation. Again, it falls under the broad 529 00:32:25,080 --> 00:32:29,760 Speaker 2: category of his sphyxial death. And he sees this apparently 530 00:32:29,880 --> 00:32:33,000 Speaker 2: as a mercy killing, that this was merciful. But then 531 00:32:33,040 --> 00:32:38,000 Speaker 2: you have to decide at this point in time, what's 532 00:32:38,040 --> 00:32:40,640 Speaker 2: going to do with mom and dad? And apparently he 533 00:32:40,760 --> 00:32:43,600 Speaker 2: lingered for some time thinking about this, maybe a couple 534 00:32:43,640 --> 00:32:45,840 Speaker 2: of days, thinking about, you know, how do I dispose 535 00:32:45,920 --> 00:32:49,760 Speaker 2: the remains? One of the most fascinating aspects to people 536 00:32:49,840 --> 00:32:53,360 Speaker 2: that kill individuals to me, and they do it in 537 00:32:53,400 --> 00:32:56,040 Speaker 2: a manner where it's unseen. This isn't some kind of 538 00:32:56,040 --> 00:32:59,160 Speaker 2: public attack or something like that, and they're trying to 539 00:32:59,200 --> 00:33:02,080 Speaker 2: cover it up. Always amazed by the psychology of these people. 540 00:33:02,200 --> 00:33:06,480 Speaker 2: Dave this idea that they kill someone, but yet they 541 00:33:06,560 --> 00:33:09,800 Speaker 2: want to keep the body near them. 542 00:33:09,880 --> 00:33:10,040 Speaker 1: You know. 543 00:33:10,040 --> 00:33:13,760 Speaker 2: It's almost like they're they're controlling the remains years after, 544 00:33:13,840 --> 00:33:17,320 Speaker 2: they can keep tabs on who's coming and going, who's 545 00:33:17,360 --> 00:33:21,000 Speaker 2: around the area, you know, things like that, you know, 546 00:33:21,120 --> 00:33:26,080 Speaker 2: and I've often wondered what the psychology behind that is, 547 00:33:26,160 --> 00:33:30,880 Speaker 2: you know, thinking about can you imagine, you know, making 548 00:33:30,920 --> 00:33:34,840 Speaker 2: you a cup of coffee, You're sitting at the breakfast nook, 549 00:33:35,760 --> 00:33:40,520 Speaker 2: You're looking out the window, and there the grassy plane 550 00:33:40,640 --> 00:33:44,640 Speaker 2: behind the house. I wonder, I wonder how Mom and 551 00:33:44,720 --> 00:33:48,000 Speaker 2: Dad are doing, you know, in their subterranean dwelling that 552 00:33:48,080 --> 00:33:51,960 Speaker 2: I created for them eight years earlier. It just it 553 00:33:52,120 --> 00:33:56,400 Speaker 2: absolutely baffles me. And then to couple that with with 554 00:33:56,520 --> 00:33:59,600 Speaker 2: what with the fact that this guy goes on on 555 00:33:59,640 --> 00:34:02,720 Speaker 2: a in a broadcast and actually it missed to this day. 556 00:34:03,280 --> 00:34:07,560 Speaker 3: You know, I have to wonder Joe breaking down how 557 00:34:07,560 --> 00:34:10,840 Speaker 3: he admitted he killed them to put them out of 558 00:34:10,880 --> 00:34:13,719 Speaker 3: their misery, sent them home. However, he wanted to look 559 00:34:13,760 --> 00:34:20,200 Speaker 3: at it based on the Social Security Administration beginning the investigation, 560 00:34:20,320 --> 00:34:21,880 Speaker 3: and I believe they were the ones that I actually 561 00:34:21,920 --> 00:34:25,080 Speaker 3: asked for a welfare check because there were some question marks, 562 00:34:25,080 --> 00:34:27,399 Speaker 3: and the neighbors thought that the Crosses hadn't moved back 563 00:34:27,400 --> 00:34:27,960 Speaker 3: to Germany. 564 00:34:28,480 --> 00:34:29,439 Speaker 1: That's what neighbors said. 565 00:34:29,480 --> 00:34:31,360 Speaker 3: They thought because they hadn't seen him around, thought they 566 00:34:31,400 --> 00:34:35,440 Speaker 3: went back to Germany. So I have to wonder Social 567 00:34:35,440 --> 00:34:39,920 Speaker 3: Security administration, they're looking into financial crimes, all targeted at 568 00:34:39,920 --> 00:34:42,399 Speaker 3: the son who's living in the home. Can't find mom 569 00:34:42,440 --> 00:34:44,200 Speaker 3: and dad. They didn't go back to Germany, Well where 570 00:34:44,239 --> 00:34:47,880 Speaker 3: are they? And that's when all of this kind of 571 00:34:48,239 --> 00:34:53,640 Speaker 3: came to the forefront. But I have to ask you, 572 00:34:53,719 --> 00:34:57,680 Speaker 3: when you kill somebody like that, not you, but generally speaking, 573 00:34:57,719 --> 00:35:02,640 Speaker 3: people die at your hand. Now he decides to bury 574 00:35:02,680 --> 00:35:06,000 Speaker 3: them in the backyard, how long are we talking about 575 00:35:06,200 --> 00:35:11,960 Speaker 3: from the time they die till the time you decompositions 576 00:35:11,960 --> 00:35:16,520 Speaker 3: that's in. You've gone over rigamortis, ragamortis, Oh yeah, and 577 00:35:16,640 --> 00:35:19,600 Speaker 3: all of that, because they still have to be buried. 578 00:35:19,600 --> 00:35:21,919 Speaker 3: They don't have to be put somewhere and they're going 579 00:35:21,960 --> 00:35:25,480 Speaker 3: to be decomposing. So what are we talking about from 580 00:35:25,520 --> 00:35:28,239 Speaker 3: the time they die inside the house and the time 581 00:35:28,239 --> 00:35:30,200 Speaker 3: he can get them in the backyard, you know, in 582 00:35:30,239 --> 00:35:33,680 Speaker 3: the flower bed, what are we talking about in terms of. 583 00:35:33,640 --> 00:35:37,040 Speaker 2: Well, here's an interesting thing. I think we may have 584 00:35:37,120 --> 00:35:41,160 Speaker 2: mentioned this before, but if if they were let's say 585 00:35:41,200 --> 00:35:45,960 Speaker 2: that they had died. Uh, I hate to box myself 586 00:35:46,000 --> 00:35:48,920 Speaker 2: in with specific time, but let's just say that they 587 00:35:48,960 --> 00:35:51,279 Speaker 2: had died. Just for grins and giggles, will say that 588 00:35:51,680 --> 00:35:53,440 Speaker 2: they had died and they had been in the ground 589 00:35:53,440 --> 00:35:55,640 Speaker 2: for one year, and you had an indication as an 590 00:35:55,680 --> 00:36:00,680 Speaker 2: investigator that they were buried back there. But you nowhere 591 00:36:01,000 --> 00:36:03,480 Speaker 2: you could go in with like a methane probe, you 592 00:36:03,480 --> 00:36:06,320 Speaker 2: know where you're taking taking this and you're taking samples 593 00:36:06,360 --> 00:36:08,799 Speaker 2: where you're sticking the probe into the ground. And one 594 00:36:08,800 --> 00:36:11,719 Speaker 2: of the things with organic material, when it decomposes, it 595 00:36:11,760 --> 00:36:15,480 Speaker 2: gives off methane gas, and so you're looking for like 596 00:36:15,560 --> 00:36:19,120 Speaker 2: a spike in the methane something that like if you 597 00:36:19,120 --> 00:36:22,719 Speaker 2: have normal organic material safe you had a composting bin, 598 00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:25,480 Speaker 2: for instance, in your backyard where people will put coffee 599 00:36:25,480 --> 00:36:29,000 Speaker 2: grounds and dog poop and leaves and all that, and 600 00:36:29,000 --> 00:36:32,360 Speaker 2: they'll turn it periodically. You know, you would have you 601 00:36:32,400 --> 00:36:39,680 Speaker 2: would have it would produce methane. Okay, a good example 602 00:36:39,680 --> 00:36:41,840 Speaker 2: of that. I'll give you a great example of that. 603 00:36:41,880 --> 00:36:44,240 Speaker 2: One of the things that happens down in the swamps 604 00:36:44,280 --> 00:36:47,800 Speaker 2: in New Orleans we have and I think this happens 605 00:36:47,840 --> 00:36:55,080 Speaker 2: in Florida too, you have swamp fires. And one of 606 00:36:55,120 --> 00:36:58,160 Speaker 2: the things that happens with swamp fires, our highways would 607 00:36:58,200 --> 00:37:03,560 Speaker 2: get covered with smoke. Have these little methane methane fires 608 00:37:03,560 --> 00:37:05,279 Speaker 2: that will break out in the swamp because of the 609 00:37:05,320 --> 00:37:09,120 Speaker 2: decomposing organic matter, and they might be in multiple places 610 00:37:10,000 --> 00:37:14,160 Speaker 2: and it'll catch a blaze, sometimes just spontaneously. So that's 611 00:37:14,200 --> 00:37:17,799 Speaker 2: the power of something decomposing. There's always decomposition going on 612 00:37:18,080 --> 00:37:22,440 Speaker 2: in swampy areas. So if you introduce a body into 613 00:37:22,840 --> 00:37:27,920 Speaker 2: you know, this non sealed situation, like a cascaded body, 614 00:37:27,960 --> 00:37:31,440 Speaker 2: you're not going to find methane production there. But if 615 00:37:31,480 --> 00:37:33,520 Speaker 2: you've buried a body like that, one of the ways 616 00:37:33,520 --> 00:37:37,120 Speaker 2: that they do it. You would, You could stick a 617 00:37:37,160 --> 00:37:39,680 Speaker 2: probe into the ground. But these people are not fresh 618 00:37:39,719 --> 00:37:42,400 Speaker 2: dead day. We're talking eight years down the road. 619 00:37:42,800 --> 00:37:43,440 Speaker 1: I would. 620 00:37:45,640 --> 00:37:52,160 Speaker 2: Okay, you're going to have you're going to have bone 621 00:37:52,520 --> 00:37:54,480 Speaker 2: that is left behind. I don't know what state the 622 00:37:54,480 --> 00:37:56,839 Speaker 2: bone would necessarily be in a lot of it's going 623 00:37:56,920 --> 00:37:59,640 Speaker 2: to be dependent upon the pH of the soil, you know, 624 00:37:59,719 --> 00:38:03,839 Speaker 2: is it more acid or is it more base. You're 625 00:38:03,880 --> 00:38:09,640 Speaker 2: going to have to take into consideration water flow through 626 00:38:09,680 --> 00:38:15,000 Speaker 2: the area because oh yeah, because it will rise and fall. 627 00:38:15,040 --> 00:38:17,160 Speaker 2: We talked about this with a well lady. But you 628 00:38:17,280 --> 00:38:21,840 Speaker 2: also have this even in ground burials like this. The 629 00:38:21,920 --> 00:38:26,000 Speaker 2: other thing that people that people don't think about. You 630 00:38:26,040 --> 00:38:28,359 Speaker 2: know how we always talk about the earth just keeps 631 00:38:28,360 --> 00:38:31,000 Speaker 2: on spinning and it keeps on moving. Well, the earth 632 00:38:31,080 --> 00:38:35,880 Speaker 2: is actually earth. The substrata is actually moving as well. 633 00:38:36,080 --> 00:38:39,560 Speaker 2: People don't realize this. It's a process called turbation. And 634 00:38:39,640 --> 00:38:42,080 Speaker 2: so the soil actually kind of if you will, think 635 00:38:42,120 --> 00:38:47,960 Speaker 2: about the slowest turning tumble dryer you've ever seen. All right, 636 00:38:48,160 --> 00:38:53,280 Speaker 2: maybe just time of bits, all right, the earth actually 637 00:38:53,320 --> 00:38:59,000 Speaker 2: does the sub subterranean the strata actually does turn like this, 638 00:38:59,160 --> 00:39:04,200 Speaker 2: and so you'll have changes in skeletal remains where it 639 00:39:04,360 --> 00:39:07,200 Speaker 2: let's just say that both mom and Dad are buried 640 00:39:07,239 --> 00:39:10,799 Speaker 2: in the same grave. You've got them laid out in there, 641 00:39:11,640 --> 00:39:16,879 Speaker 2: and now they're reduced to skeletal remains. You can have 642 00:39:17,920 --> 00:39:21,200 Speaker 2: these commingled remains, which is kind of a headache for 643 00:39:21,760 --> 00:39:24,440 Speaker 2: those that are doing the recovery. Now it's great, I 644 00:39:24,480 --> 00:39:28,160 Speaker 2: think investigatively that you'll have it all concentrated there, perhaps 645 00:39:28,600 --> 00:39:32,120 Speaker 2: unless you've had some kind of subterranean burrowing animal that 646 00:39:32,160 --> 00:39:35,120 Speaker 2: would get down there and you know, extricate some bit 647 00:39:35,200 --> 00:39:40,240 Speaker 2: of that that's that's left behind. But they should still 648 00:39:40,640 --> 00:39:43,759 Speaker 2: be there. Now there's things that are going on with 649 00:39:43,880 --> 00:39:46,440 Speaker 2: the skeletal remains that can cause them to begin to 650 00:39:46,480 --> 00:39:48,319 Speaker 2: break down more so, and a lot of that goes 651 00:39:48,360 --> 00:39:51,640 Speaker 2: with the environment that they're buried in. The chemicals, you know, 652 00:39:51,760 --> 00:39:54,240 Speaker 2: the chemical status of the soil. You know, I'd mentioned, 653 00:39:54,320 --> 00:39:56,600 Speaker 2: you know what the pH level was, those sorts of things. 654 00:39:57,080 --> 00:40:00,440 Speaker 2: And the other thing is do they have any external 655 00:40:01,800 --> 00:40:05,319 Speaker 2: covering like where the cocoon and also are their clothing. Now, 656 00:40:05,320 --> 00:40:09,239 Speaker 2: if you've got let's say that you have synthetics, synthetic 657 00:40:09,400 --> 00:40:13,120 Speaker 2: you know, ray on, uh, your polyesters, those sorts of 658 00:40:13,120 --> 00:40:16,960 Speaker 2: things if the clothing is still that clothing is very resilient. 659 00:40:17,160 --> 00:40:20,000 Speaker 2: But if you have natural fibers, you know, things like cotton, 660 00:40:20,200 --> 00:40:24,959 Speaker 2: for instance, or wool, it might tend to break down 661 00:40:25,160 --> 00:40:27,640 Speaker 2: a little bit more. You might not have as much remnant, 662 00:40:27,719 --> 00:40:33,479 Speaker 2: but things like zippers, buttons, medical devices. Let's you say 663 00:40:33,520 --> 00:40:37,400 Speaker 2: that they they had had surgery. Maybe you have a 664 00:40:37,400 --> 00:40:40,760 Speaker 2: subject that has had a screw put into a bone. 665 00:40:41,360 --> 00:40:44,280 Speaker 2: Do that surgical still is still going to be their brother, 666 00:40:44,920 --> 00:40:46,560 Speaker 2: so you'll be able to see it. 667 00:40:46,640 --> 00:40:49,200 Speaker 3: That's you have to drink testing in the cave at 668 00:40:49,200 --> 00:40:50,520 Speaker 3: the beach and Planet of the Apes. 669 00:40:52,160 --> 00:40:56,040 Speaker 2: Yeah, I know you're gonna, Yeah, you're gonna find all 670 00:40:56,040 --> 00:40:56,359 Speaker 2: that there. 671 00:40:56,440 --> 00:40:58,680 Speaker 3: Let me ask you about this because one of the 672 00:40:58,760 --> 00:41:01,800 Speaker 3: tips that they had, okay, it started as a financial crime, 673 00:41:01,800 --> 00:41:05,880 Speaker 3: with solid security and all that, they brought cadaver dogs 674 00:41:06,200 --> 00:41:10,000 Speaker 3: out to the property, and the cadaver dogs hit John. 675 00:41:10,040 --> 00:41:12,799 Speaker 3: They hadn't been seen in eight years. They're buried in 676 00:41:12,840 --> 00:41:16,800 Speaker 3: the background, but cadaver dogs could still get ith. 677 00:41:17,440 --> 00:41:20,920 Speaker 2: Yeah. Their spectrum is quite amazing, you know what, And 678 00:41:21,320 --> 00:41:23,919 Speaker 2: it might be something that you and I obviously would 679 00:41:23,920 --> 00:41:27,680 Speaker 2: because we've had a very limited all factory spectrum. You know, 680 00:41:27,760 --> 00:41:31,719 Speaker 2: compared to compared to canines. Canines are amazing. You and 681 00:41:31,800 --> 00:41:35,520 Speaker 2: I are both you know, huge dog lovers anyway, Yeah, 682 00:41:35,880 --> 00:41:39,120 Speaker 2: and so it's amazing what dogs are capable of, these 683 00:41:39,160 --> 00:41:42,000 Speaker 2: working dogs. So yet, now, I don't put a lot 684 00:41:42,040 --> 00:41:45,400 Speaker 2: of stock in dogs that you take out the lakes, 685 00:41:46,120 --> 00:41:47,680 Speaker 2: you know, and put them on the bow of a boat, 686 00:41:47,840 --> 00:41:50,640 Speaker 2: and they allegedly can smell things. I think that's kind 687 00:41:50,640 --> 00:41:52,440 Speaker 2: of a hit or miss proposition. But you give me 688 00:41:52,480 --> 00:41:55,080 Speaker 2: a cadaver dog any day and run them out in 689 00:41:55,080 --> 00:41:59,160 Speaker 2: the woods. Now, there have been cases where they have failed. 690 00:41:59,160 --> 00:42:02,319 Speaker 2: They've walked right over bodies. I think my question would be, 691 00:42:02,360 --> 00:42:05,080 Speaker 2: with those dogs that fail to smell things, how well 692 00:42:05,120 --> 00:42:08,399 Speaker 2: were they trained to begin with? You know, I think 693 00:42:08,440 --> 00:42:10,200 Speaker 2: a lot of that goes to the handler and also 694 00:42:10,320 --> 00:42:13,120 Speaker 2: the evaluation of the of the animal. You know, are 695 00:42:13,120 --> 00:42:16,960 Speaker 2: they are they ticking all the boxes relative. 696 00:42:16,480 --> 00:42:19,279 Speaker 3: To this, I saw eight years the last time these 697 00:42:19,320 --> 00:42:21,720 Speaker 3: people are seeing, we know they're gone and these. 698 00:42:22,080 --> 00:42:24,959 Speaker 2: That's something yeah that they But you know, here here's 699 00:42:24,960 --> 00:42:28,040 Speaker 2: the real problem. Even though he's saying that he did this, 700 00:42:28,920 --> 00:42:36,080 Speaker 2: and I'm assuming that the corner slash medical examiner is 701 00:42:36,120 --> 00:42:39,920 Speaker 2: going to rule their deaths at some point tom as 702 00:42:40,040 --> 00:42:43,680 Speaker 2: a homicide if they haven't already at this point. Here's 703 00:42:45,320 --> 00:42:50,600 Speaker 2: here's the thing. You're not going to have any tissue 704 00:42:50,680 --> 00:42:54,759 Speaker 2: left behind to be able to make a diagnosis of 705 00:42:54,920 --> 00:42:59,440 Speaker 2: Like you know, like he talked about having used a 706 00:42:59,520 --> 00:43:03,719 Speaker 2: rope to quote unquote doing air quotes right here to 707 00:43:03,800 --> 00:43:08,200 Speaker 2: quote unquote put his mama out of her misery. Well, 708 00:43:08,520 --> 00:43:13,799 Speaker 2: we would be looking for furrows in the neck. I 709 00:43:13,840 --> 00:43:17,000 Speaker 2: don't know, like certain people I won't mention their name, 710 00:43:17,080 --> 00:43:20,040 Speaker 2: but their initials are Epstein, you know, where you're looking 711 00:43:20,040 --> 00:43:24,080 Speaker 2: for a furrow on the surface of the neck. That's 712 00:43:24,280 --> 00:43:27,520 Speaker 2: not going to be evidenced with her because that's that 713 00:43:27,640 --> 00:43:31,360 Speaker 2: tissues no longer going to exist at this point. The 714 00:43:31,400 --> 00:43:33,960 Speaker 2: only thing you could possibly hope for is if some 715 00:43:34,080 --> 00:43:38,440 Speaker 2: of the structures of the neck may have been fractured, 716 00:43:38,560 --> 00:43:41,399 Speaker 2: the skeletal structures, and if there's any evidence of that. 717 00:43:42,200 --> 00:43:47,640 Speaker 2: If you're suffocating, somebody's suffocation is not this It's not 718 00:43:47,760 --> 00:43:51,400 Speaker 2: quite as violent as you know, taking a rope, you know, 719 00:43:51,440 --> 00:43:54,959 Speaker 2: and like senching it up on an elderly woman's neck 720 00:43:55,000 --> 00:43:57,719 Speaker 2: and doing that sort of thing. If you're putting a 721 00:43:58,080 --> 00:44:01,720 Speaker 2: pillow over someone's face to stuff them or a hand 722 00:44:01,920 --> 00:44:04,600 Speaker 2: or a bag or whatever it is. It's not going 723 00:44:04,640 --> 00:44:07,640 Speaker 2: to leave a tremendous amount of trauma, certainly, no trauma 724 00:44:07,680 --> 00:44:09,680 Speaker 2: that I think, and I might be proven wrong. I've 725 00:44:09,680 --> 00:44:12,680 Speaker 2: been wrong before that you know that you're not going 726 00:44:12,719 --> 00:44:15,200 Speaker 2: to you know that you're going to be able to appreciate. 727 00:44:15,280 --> 00:44:18,520 Speaker 2: So I don't know, we'll we'll keep our eye on it, 728 00:44:18,600 --> 00:44:21,880 Speaker 2: and you know, kind of see what happens in this case. 729 00:44:22,080 --> 00:44:24,879 Speaker 2: I know that you know. I don't want to put 730 00:44:24,880 --> 00:44:28,040 Speaker 2: words in your mouth, but one of the reasons you 731 00:44:28,080 --> 00:44:30,560 Speaker 2: know I pitched this this case to you is it's 732 00:44:30,680 --> 00:44:33,279 Speaker 2: one of the more bizarre things that we've actually had 733 00:44:33,400 --> 00:44:36,000 Speaker 2: happen in recent memory. I don't know if you concur. 734 00:44:35,800 --> 00:44:40,799 Speaker 3: With before you think this is a slam dunk. Let 735 00:44:40,840 --> 00:44:43,439 Speaker 3: me share one quick side note. All right, please, let's 736 00:44:43,480 --> 00:44:46,239 Speaker 3: just say, for the sake of argument, that this guy 737 00:44:46,239 --> 00:44:49,239 Speaker 3: who goes on TV and confesses that they found the 738 00:44:49,680 --> 00:44:54,200 Speaker 3: financial crimes and all that, but what if, what if 739 00:44:54,239 --> 00:44:57,360 Speaker 3: after everything's said and done, Joe, they find out this 740 00:44:57,400 --> 00:44:59,040 Speaker 3: guy is a true crime fan who wanted to start 741 00:44:59,040 --> 00:45:01,279 Speaker 3: his own podcast and this was the best way for 742 00:45:01,360 --> 00:45:03,279 Speaker 3: him to launch it. But really what happened it was 743 00:45:03,320 --> 00:45:06,680 Speaker 3: a murder suicide. His dad killed her, his mom, and 744 00:45:06,719 --> 00:45:12,279 Speaker 3: then he suffocated himself. And the son was so humiliated 745 00:45:12,280 --> 00:45:15,000 Speaker 3: by what had happened to his heroic parents that he 746 00:45:15,280 --> 00:45:17,239 Speaker 3: took care of their bodies. He did his you know, 747 00:45:17,520 --> 00:45:20,640 Speaker 3: and he used this as the stepping stone to launch 748 00:45:20,680 --> 00:45:21,759 Speaker 3: his own career in true crime. 749 00:45:21,760 --> 00:45:23,200 Speaker 1: But he didn't actually kill his parents. 750 00:45:23,520 --> 00:45:25,840 Speaker 3: He did put their bodies in the backyard, but he 751 00:45:25,920 --> 00:45:28,319 Speaker 3: did that out of love and devotion. He did not 752 00:45:28,440 --> 00:45:31,080 Speaker 3: want the memory of his father to you know what 753 00:45:31,200 --> 00:45:33,600 Speaker 3: about something like that coming down the pike. I'm telling you, friends, 754 00:45:34,120 --> 00:45:38,000 Speaker 3: if oj Simpson can walk out of court a free man, 755 00:45:38,760 --> 00:45:40,280 Speaker 3: their stories can work as well. 756 00:45:40,400 --> 00:45:41,399 Speaker 1: It ain't a slam dunk. 757 00:45:42,040 --> 00:45:44,400 Speaker 2: I got to take something, brother Dave. In the world 758 00:45:44,440 --> 00:45:50,000 Speaker 2: that we live in now, confessions on television, burials in 759 00:45:50,040 --> 00:45:57,840 Speaker 2: the backyard, sons that disregard the lives of their loving 760 00:45:57,960 --> 00:46:05,440 Speaker 2: parents that survived Nazi Germany, nothing nowadays surprises me. Everything 761 00:46:06,080 --> 00:46:11,560 Speaker 2: is on the table. I'm Joseph Scott Morgan and this 762 00:46:12,600 --> 00:46:13,560 Speaker 2: is bodybags