Speaker 1: M all right. Welcome to the State of the Lakers
Speaker 1: presented by DASH Radio. Thank you guys so much for
Speaker 1: coming to hang out on. This is gonna be a Thursday,
Speaker 1: Thursday evening. I guess. This is part two of our
Speaker 1: postgame show from Pacers Lakers, starting with rog and I
Speaker 1: breaking down some stuff with Russell Westbrook and then getting
Speaker 1: back into kind of like a eulogy for Frank, just remembering,
Speaker 1: you know, all the things that he did really well
Speaker 1: while he was here, which then turned ironic when we
Speaker 1: discovered live on the show that he was at least
Speaker 1: going to be staying with the team long enough to
Speaker 1: fly to Orlando. So that's all in this pot. As always,
Speaker 1: we appreciate you guys support, and we will see you
Speaker 1: for the postgame show on Friday night after the Magic Game.
Speaker 1: But I think this is a good transition to Russ because,
Speaker 1: you know, the one rotation decision he made tonight that
Speaker 1: I agree with was him pulling Russ. And this is
Speaker 1: something that we've talked about a lot on the show
Speaker 1: here in recent weeks, and it's a it's a basic concept.
Speaker 1: Like I shared out Russ's shot chart, the dude can't
Speaker 1: make anything around the basket. Okay, he's shooting. I think
Speaker 1: coming into tonight he was at like fifty percent within
Speaker 1: three ft of the rim. That's a horrible number, guys,
Speaker 1: that's not a good number. I know it sounds efficient
Speaker 1: in the grand scheme of things, but to literally miss
Speaker 1: almost half of the shots that you attempt at the
Speaker 1: rim is an atrocious number. And it vastly undercuts the
Speaker 1: positive impacts of his rim pressure. And like, what do
Speaker 1: I always say, guys, Like when you're when to be
Speaker 1: a positive perimeter basketball player, you have to be able
Speaker 1: to do You have to be a triple threat. You
Speaker 1: have to be able to shoot, you have to be
Speaker 1: able to drive, and you have to be able to
Speaker 1: make reads when teams send help your way. And the
Speaker 1: thing with Russ is he can't shoot. When he drives,
Speaker 1: he can't finish. And when it comes to making reads
Speaker 1: against bad teams, when he's passing to areas, he can
Speaker 1: have some success, but he really struggles making reads against
Speaker 1: good teams that take away what he's good at and
Speaker 1: take away his easy reads. That's why he has all
Speaker 1: these horrible turnover games. But again, this, this is what's
Speaker 1: so bad. Rogs one of my consistent themes has been like,
Speaker 1: you know, Russ sucks against good teams, Like Russ can't score,
Speaker 1: can't do anything to contribute against a good team. Well,
Speaker 1: he's starting to have these nights against bad teams too,
Speaker 1: and that's a really bad sign. This is the last
Speaker 1: thing I'll say, and I'll kick it over to you, Roger.
Speaker 1: There was there was a meme that became famous a
Speaker 1: couple of years ago. I think it was shortly after
Speaker 1: his time in Houston. Do you guys remember there was
Speaker 1: like a timeline, Okay, And in the timeline, it's like
Speaker 1: it's like a calendar timeline, and at the beginning, it's
Speaker 1: like it's Russell Westbrook and it's like at the beginning,
Speaker 1: it's like this is the worst basketball player of all time.
Speaker 1: And then in the middle there's a little stretch where
Speaker 1: it's like, oh, question mark. And then there's like another
Speaker 1: stretch where it's like this is the best basketball player
Speaker 1: of all time. And then there's the final and where
Speaker 1: it all becomes a b that that meme is now
Speaker 1: completely inaccurate because where's the stretch for he's the best
Speaker 1: basketball player of all time? Does that stretch exist? Because
Speaker 1: I see him getting worse and worse on a night
Speaker 1: to night basis, And it's just it's just the unfortunate
Speaker 1: reality of the predicament. Now I understand this is something
Speaker 1: that I've talked about a lot in recent weeks. It's
Speaker 1: going to be extremely difficult to trade Russ because nobody's
Speaker 1: gonna want him. It is going to take a great
Speaker 1: deal of circumstances falling in the Lakers lap to break
Speaker 1: their way in order for a team to be willing
Speaker 1: to take on Russ's salary and to send back filler.
Speaker 1: But there's a reason why, Frank ben Struss, there's a
Speaker 1: reason why in the Utah Jazz game we had our
Speaker 1: best moments without Russ. There's a reason why Dwight Howard
Speaker 1: and Russ on the floor don't work with the two
Speaker 1: of them together because that combined lack of shooting. And
Speaker 1: there's a reason why I've been pushing for this so far.
Speaker 1: It's because even if you got crap back for us,
Speaker 1: if it's crap, that can play a some kind of
Speaker 1: role on this team, not the Russ role, but rather
Speaker 1: similar role as to what Kuzma on KCP filled, Even
Speaker 1: if they do it at the rate that those guys,
Speaker 1: did this would be a better team. It's time to
Speaker 1: cut the losses. It's time to understand that this was
Speaker 1: a mistake and the team needs to move forward. Now.
Speaker 1: It's going to be difficult. It's very possible that this
Speaker 1: can't happen this deadline. What I'm advocating for is if
Speaker 1: it's possible, it needs to be done, because there's nothing
Speaker 1: to be gained by going down with the ship that
Speaker 1: that's just a matter of pride at that point, like
Speaker 1: that's just that's just cutting off your nose despite your face.
Speaker 1: It would make way more sense to just acknowledge the
Speaker 1: reality of the situation. Russ isn't a very good basketball
Speaker 1: player anymore. He's not going to raise your ceiling against
Speaker 1: good teams. Now, he's actively hurting you against bad teams.
Speaker 1: Just because he made a handful of threes. It's almost
Speaker 1: like the worst thing that can happen because he's gonna
Speaker 1: start shooting him even more. It's just it's it's been
Speaker 1: an absolute disaster on that front. And again, just like
Speaker 1: with Frank, it's not the only reason the Lakers are bad,
Speaker 1: but it's one of the reasons. And everything that went
Speaker 1: out in that trade is part of that reason as well.
Speaker 1: But that's just that's where I'm at with russ Man.
Speaker 1: This is just another another that shot chart is absurd.
Speaker 1: He can't put the ball in the basket. Rodge can
Speaker 1: do it anymore. It's interesting because I've been, you know,
Speaker 1: I've been kind of charting this and and looking at
Speaker 1: this rewatching the games and stuff. And this is the
Speaker 1: first time, obviously that Vogel has pulled Russ right, And
Speaker 1: I didn't think he would pull him in a game
Speaker 1: like I didn't even think it would happen halfway through
Speaker 1: the season. But it's been a progression of what I've
Speaker 1: been seeing. And we've been slowly and slowly we've been
Speaker 1: removing Russ from like what we do structurally right like
Speaker 1: in terms of what we run on offense. Go watch
Speaker 1: these games, and he has just parked on the week side,
Speaker 1: he is parked in the dunker spot off the ball.
Speaker 1: We're running off offense through th ht fully through Lebron
Speaker 1: as a screener or Lebron with the ball. Avery Bradley
Speaker 1: even runs actions like we have moved Russell Westwark so
Speaker 1: much off the ball, and I think that you're even
Speaker 1: seeing this in his stop shop selection as well. And
Speaker 1: again I think he had he had one turnover tonight,
Speaker 1: So we're getting the low turnover games, but we're sometimes
Speaker 1: we're getting even worse shots. You're seeing these one leg
Speaker 1: fadeaways because that's the only place that he's kind of
Speaker 1: a one legged fade away is the hardest basketball shot
Speaker 1: I've ever tried to learn. It is an impossible shot. Like,
Speaker 1: it's amazing that Kevin Durant is as good at it
Speaker 1: as he is. For Russ to be taking that as
Speaker 1: that bad of a jump shooter is literally the worst
Speaker 1: case of the worst lack of self awareness I've ever seen.
Speaker 1: And so, you know, and he's taking these because, like Jason,
Speaker 1: his only time that he's getting offensive possessions is in transition,
Speaker 1: you know, where he has a little bit of an
Speaker 1: advantage against a one on one against a player that
Speaker 1: you can physically over power. Or we're clearing aside for
Speaker 1: him to attack on right, so we're like, if he's
Speaker 1: gonna if he's on the left side, we throw everyone
Speaker 1: to the right side. It's a clear out where he
Speaker 1: can attack the rim or you know, shoot that little
Speaker 1: bank shot that that's pretty much it. We have gone
Speaker 1: away pretty much from russ screen role. He ran a
Speaker 1: field with Lebron tonight, a couple with dwife. Other than that,
Speaker 1: we've kind of gone away from Russ as the ball,
Speaker 1: how did he shoot? And he gets it and it's
Speaker 1: a it's rogue possessions, Jason, Like, okay, so someone has
Speaker 1: the ball, we run an action through the league Monk
Speaker 1: through Lebron. The ball swings because you know, Russ's guy
Speaker 1: plays off him because that's what everything's gonna do. So
Speaker 1: when we park us in the week side, where that's
Speaker 1: kind of the toughest place to kind of hell off, right,
Speaker 1: he's all the way in the week side. So even
Speaker 1: if you park his guy into the paint and still
Speaker 1: doesn't kind of impact the offensive action, but still so
Speaker 1: he gets the ball and then that's where he can
Speaker 1: kind of go rogue play in isolation play attack his
Speaker 1: match up there. But like he used to me, we're
Speaker 1: moving him more and more off the ball, and I
Speaker 1: think we're kind of seeing that as well. In the
Speaker 1: minutes he played twenty six minutes against Utah, twenty six
Speaker 1: minutes again tonight against uh I'm ready for God Tho.
Speaker 1: We played Indiana twenty six minutes again tonight gets Indiana
Speaker 1: like his minutes are going down, his possessions of the
Speaker 1: basketball are going down. And I've been a proponent of it.
Speaker 1: It's just wild to watch it in real time. And
Speaker 1: it's interesting. I think this is the way to best
Speaker 1: use you know, Russell westbrook skill set. Put him um
Speaker 1: where he's attacking and already compromised defense. And that's maybe
Speaker 1: better in theory than it is an actuality when you're
Speaker 1: watching the ball game. But it's interesting, man, we're watching
Speaker 1: this progression of how we're using Russell Westbrook, and when
Speaker 1: a d comes back, he'll be even more right subjected
Speaker 1: to uh less possessions, subjected to less offensive possessions that
Speaker 1: are surrounded by him. We're running. We've moved to non
Speaker 1: Braun and Russ liners. Remember in the off season, we're like, oh,
Speaker 1: we're gonna have one of Russ or Braun on the
Speaker 1: floor all the time. We have moved to line ups
Speaker 1: without both of them. We are getting we would wrap
Speaker 1: and again not this. I don't want this to be
Speaker 1: a full referendum on Russ because I don't think that's
Speaker 1: what it is. But you know, we're we would rather
Speaker 1: just have Malik Monk and Taylor, Horton, Tucker, get these possessions.
Speaker 1: Get these you know, ball screen possessions. Where the floor
Speaker 1: is open, where Stanley's at the five. Let those let
Speaker 1: them run accidents. They've been good, Jason. They have been
Speaker 1: caring us for for these last few games. So I
Speaker 1: think the Russ conundru musition interesting. But I'm still on
Speaker 1: the He's not going anywhere, you know, And I think
Speaker 1: there's ways to kind of, you know, put him still
Speaker 1: in better positions. And if I'm gonna put on the
Speaker 1: hold on, I'm gonna put you in this. Okay, Let's
Speaker 1: say Oklahoma City or some team not Oklahoma City. I
Speaker 1: don't think they have the salaries match. Let's say Orlando
Speaker 1: calls and they go, we want Russ, we want to
Speaker 1: sell tickets. We'll give you, you know, Terence Ross and
Speaker 1: you know, some combination of salaries, and but you're gonna
Speaker 1: have to give us a first round pick whatever. So
Speaker 1: let's say a Russ trade does materialize. Would you pull
Speaker 1: the trigger? Yes? Or no? Man? That that's so tough
Speaker 1: to decide, man, And maybe like maybe that's the course
Speaker 1: of action here. I would, you know, I think the
Speaker 1: team and who cares, you know what I think, like,
Speaker 1: I think the team would still like to see what
Speaker 1: Russ Ron and a d looked like as a collective.
Speaker 1: I also think it's just a bad look though, right
Speaker 1: You trade five players, four players, three of them super
Speaker 1: high rotation guys for Russell Westbrook over the summer, including
Speaker 1: a first round pick, and then you dump them to
Speaker 1: Orlando you know how many months later, four or five
Speaker 1: months later for whould you say, Terrence Ross? And well,
Speaker 1: I I put the trade together a while. There's a
Speaker 1: combination of salaries. I can't remember what it is. I
Speaker 1: just don't. I just like, okay, so in those okay,
Speaker 1: so is it not a bad I'd look also to
Speaker 1: go down with the ship, like dude, you know, Rose,
Speaker 1: He's gonna shoot this poorly in the paint in the playoffs,
Speaker 1: if not worse, when defenses are really dialed in and
Speaker 1: scheming to what he likes to do. This is going
Speaker 1: to get worse. There's not I just what have we
Speaker 1: seen this season that would lead you to believe that
Speaker 1: Russell Westbrook is going to be a successful and productive
Speaker 1: basketball player for US in a postseason series against a
Speaker 1: good basketball team. To give me one thing, is it Okay.
Speaker 1: I'll give you one thing. Playmaker. He's he's been a
Speaker 1: decent playmaker for us this season in our week schedule
Speaker 1: against mostly bad basketball teams, but in the games that
Speaker 1: we played against good basketball teams, that hasn't translated. So again,
Speaker 1: I like, literally today in the fourth quarter, there was
Speaker 1: a play where he worked into the lane break the
Speaker 1: jump shot, ran down the floor and got absolutely dusted
Speaker 1: by Harris Laverne on the perimeter for a lamp. It's
Speaker 1: like he is actively hurting us on both ends of
Speaker 1: the floor. Yeah, it's it's it is it is again,
Speaker 1: I get okay. Like I said, that's why I bring
Speaker 1: up the Pride thing. It will look bad to trade Russ.
Speaker 1: That will be the equivalent of Lebron and and and
Speaker 1: Rob Perlinko and Anthony Davis basically admitting, like we screwed up. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we screwed up bad. But my thing is, like, dude, like,
Speaker 1: I don't view that as a sign of weakness. I
Speaker 1: view that as a sign of strike when someone's willing
Speaker 1: to look in the mirror and be like, this didn't work.
Speaker 1: So this happened to a smaller extent, right, it wasn't
Speaker 1: to this level, but it was definitely like, oh this roster,
Speaker 1: we buill bring it. You know. It's funny. I'll think
Speaker 1: about that team they brought in Isaiah Thomas right that,
Speaker 1: And I thought, and you know, Isaiah Thomas was supposed
Speaker 1: to be like the inside Chanles, it wasn't healthy. So
Speaker 1: it's not the same apples apples, you know, comparison, but
Speaker 1: it's interesting kind of the similarities there right there. Isaiah
Speaker 1: Thomas lebron fit wasn't what they thought it would be,
Speaker 1: and they ship half that roster out, so that could happen.
Speaker 1: I don't think you're wrong there. I just like, that's
Speaker 1: not like I don't see how Lindo doing that deal, right, Like,
Speaker 1: I don't see any team being like, Okay, well it's
Speaker 1: not likely, right, it's not likely. I'm just saying, like
Speaker 1: in the universe for that materialized, I am a firm
Speaker 1: believer that the Lakers would have to take that so
Speaker 1: that they would have to do and I think they
Speaker 1: have to do their due diligence to try, you know,
Speaker 1: and and and and and My thing is like like again,
Speaker 1: like I there was a point here that season about
Speaker 1: what games in We're like, you're looking at this and
Speaker 1: you're like, Russ has been okay. Yeah, you know, like
Speaker 1: he was really bad in that stretch to start the season,
Speaker 1: and like it was, it had some really rough moments
Speaker 1: like that, you know, the okay see losses for instance,
Speaker 1: you know, but like there was that little stretch there,
Speaker 1: like ten fifteen games. We're like like this, there's this
Speaker 1: is okay, like he's not bad. But the dirty little
Speaker 1: secret there is we were playing bad teams, Raj, we
Speaker 1: were we were we were playing bad teams. And he
Speaker 1: was also shooting abnormally well, he was shooting like thirty
Speaker 1: seven percent or something like that of wide open threes,
Speaker 1: which has since cratered until tonight at least. But like
Speaker 1: a get like like my thing, there is like outside
Speaker 1: of that little stretch where he was okay, not even
Speaker 1: really good, just like okay, like okay enough that you
Speaker 1: could look back and be like he's not the reason
Speaker 1: why they're struggling, you know. But outside of that stretch,
Speaker 1: it's been all bad. It's been all bad. Rage. Yeah, no,
Speaker 1: you're you're not wrong there. And I think you know
Speaker 1: he's facing his mortality. I keep saying that, and the
Speaker 1: adjustment really hasn't come we're trying to make him you
Speaker 1: know this, we're trying to make Russell Westbrook not Russell Westbrook, right,
Speaker 1: Like we're turning him into this low turnover you know guard.
Speaker 1: And when you do that, it's great, you get the
Speaker 1: no turnovers, but the domino effect is then created, right,
Speaker 1: you create this domin effect of like a guy who's
Speaker 1: you know, way more concerned about where his shot in
Speaker 1: past comes from then he's ever had to be. And no,
Speaker 1: so now you're getting these terrible shots again, these mid
Speaker 1: range pull ups. Those are the ones to me and
Speaker 1: you have to take out, like the misses at the
Speaker 1: rim what they are, if they're at the volume that
Speaker 1: they're at, I can live with. That issue is when
Speaker 1: you confound that when you compound that with the you know,
Speaker 1: in transition dribble, contested pull up jumper or you know
Speaker 1: he had that three pointer where he got the offensive
Speaker 1: foul on I believe where he liked. I think he
Speaker 1: hit Tory Craig in the face. Like, those are the
Speaker 1: shots that we can't have, Like when a defender flies
Speaker 1: under a screen, I honestly think, like you know, his
Speaker 1: forum is okay on those when he gets a little
Speaker 1: you know, jump stop pull up like that. That's probably
Speaker 1: where he's best. But then like the four for six
Speaker 1: from three is going to be a super anomally Obviously
Speaker 1: you're not gonna get that every night. But yeah, like
Speaker 1: it's been rough for sure. And I've always said, like
Speaker 1: this process that you want to build here and the
Speaker 1: contract is what it is. To me, I know you're
Speaker 1: ready to cut Bait and that might be and to me,
Speaker 1: I think that Bait is gonna be cut in the summer.
Speaker 1: Uh whatever happens here unless they win a title, but
Speaker 1: I think that Bait is gonna be cut. But like,
Speaker 1: there's places we have to fit them and we're doing
Speaker 1: that now, and it's gonna look ugly, and it's looked
Speaker 1: ugly for a lot of this season, but it's the
Speaker 1: best way to put it. And and you might be right,
Speaker 1: you know, you can trade Russ for some minimum guys.
Speaker 1: I just think that's that's such a tough decision for
Speaker 1: front obvious to make mid season because you're gonna obviously
Speaker 1: you're gonna you're gonna lose everything that you kind of did,
Speaker 1: and maybe that's the way you have to go, But man,
Speaker 1: I don't know the rest fit definitely has been ugly.
Speaker 1: I just I think when a D comes back, hopefully
Speaker 1: that kind of fits guys in the right place. But
Speaker 1: it hasn't been pretty man, and we're we're seeing the
Speaker 1: progression to moving rust more and more off ball, which
Speaker 1: is not what we thought over the summer. The whole
Speaker 1: point of bringing Russ in was to give Lebron the
Speaker 1: more off ball actions, which he's done, but it's been
Speaker 1: with like Leek Monk and to ht h D instead
Speaker 1: of you know, instead of with Russell Western. So it's
Speaker 1: such a such an interesting kind of situation we were
Speaker 1: in right now. Yeah, so I wanted to say one
Speaker 1: thing about Russ before we can move on, and maybe
Speaker 1: maybe you and I can try to find a shred
Speaker 1: of positivity in this somewhere. But you know, so, Pete
Speaker 1: from micro FILMERM had a really interesting uh A point
Speaker 1: that he made in the podcast today when he was
Speaker 1: referencing the predicament that Frank Vogel was put in this year,
Speaker 1: and his point was basically like, look at the first
Speaker 1: year Lebron came, it was like, let's get Paul George,
Speaker 1: and then when Paul George failed, it was like, let's
Speaker 1: bring in all these playmakers, you know, Land Stevenson and
Speaker 1: a Jean Rondo, so on and so forth. And then
Speaker 1: when that didn't work, the the you know, they traded
Speaker 1: everything for for Anthony Davis and then their an initial
Speaker 1: goal was to get Kawhi Leonard with that, you know,
Speaker 1: because because again like this is the dirty little secret
Speaker 1: about Lebron throughout his career. You know, there's some detractors
Speaker 1: of his that like to kind of paint him as
Speaker 1: a ballhog. But the dirty little secret about Lebron is
Speaker 1: he he wants to give the ball up, like he
Speaker 1: wants to have his you know, third slash half of
Speaker 1: the game that he's on the floor where he controls everything,
Speaker 1: but in the rest of that half, like he wants
Speaker 1: to have spot up possessions. He wants to have possessions
Speaker 1: where he can cut and do things like that. Why
Speaker 1: because that's been part of the tale of Lebron's creat
Speaker 1: He likes to rest while he's on the court. And
Speaker 1: the only way he can feel comfortable doing that is
Speaker 1: if you can give the ball to somebody else and
Speaker 1: have them make a play. And is extend that is
Speaker 1: extended year after year, because it happened even when they
Speaker 1: traded Danny Green for Dennis Schroeder and then finally culminating
Speaker 1: with the Russell Westbrook trade. The thing that I disagree
Speaker 1: about with that particularly is with this team construct without
Speaker 1: Russell Westbrook. Excuse me, Like, yeah, if you take Russell
Speaker 1: Westbrook out of the picture, like just for a second
Speaker 1: here as I try to paint this picture, this is
Speaker 1: not the same type of style offensively that Lebron is
Speaker 1: used to play. So traditionally, over the course of Lebron's career,
Speaker 1: guys who played off the ball were not you know,
Speaker 1: really they weren't guys who would make plays. You know.
Speaker 1: They were more like specialists, you know, and your your
Speaker 1: Kyle Korverer's or your Shane Battiers or you know, Mike Miller's,
Speaker 1: those those types of players, and not exactly so with
Speaker 1: those types of guys, you had to have playmaking guys
Speaker 1: that can generate high quality shots for those guys. But
Speaker 1: this is why in such a book, Big Believer in
Speaker 1: Modern Basketball. This is something that we talked about a
Speaker 1: ton after that Phoenix Sun series last year. This idea
Speaker 1: of high level clothes out attacking in a five out
Speaker 1: dribble drive and attack offense. It's kind of important for
Speaker 1: everybody to be able to do that kind of stuff, right,
Speaker 1: And so that the irony and all of this, as
Speaker 1: we saw in that Jazz game, is the Lakers actually
Speaker 1: have a lot of guys who can do that already.
Speaker 1: Like th HD can put the ball on the floor,
Speaker 1: make stuff happen. I thought he had one of his
Speaker 1: best games as a pro tonight, which there's just a
Speaker 1: line of guys. But anyway, the but Austin reeves like he's,
Speaker 1: you know, an extremely intelligent basketball player that can put
Speaker 1: the ball on the floor and make place for people.
Speaker 1: You know, Stanley Johnston, we talked about a lot in
Speaker 1: the last pot about his basketball background and how that
Speaker 1: bred his ability to make things happen with the ball
Speaker 1: in his hands with a live dribble. And then obviously
Speaker 1: Molique Monk is is like literally like the modern generations Microwent,
Speaker 1: you know, so like we have guys that can do that.
Speaker 1: So in this in this scheme, now with our personnel
Speaker 1: running in modern five out attack, guess what, Lebron, you
Speaker 1: don't have to have somebody at the top of the
Speaker 1: key running high pick and roll twenty five times in
Speaker 1: a row to generate quality shots for stains bill shooters.
Speaker 1: That's not the need anymore. So I understand that coming
Speaker 1: in here in two thousand eighteen you felt the need
Speaker 1: for playmaking. I understand that. But with the direction the
Speaker 1: game is going, and with the types of players you
Speaker 1: already have on this team, with that youthful lineup that
Speaker 1: I just talked about, you don't need that anymore. And
Speaker 1: Anon and Anthony Davis is coming back, and chances are
Speaker 1: you're gonna end up upgrading th HD to somebody who's
Speaker 1: even a little bit more polished in in mature, you know. So,
Speaker 1: Like my thing is, like the Lakers don't need Russ anymore.
Speaker 1: Why because they don't need to throw the ball to
Speaker 1: one guy in every non Lebron possession and have him
Speaker 1: create everything. What they actually need is, hey, Lebron, like
Speaker 1: on the possessions, you want to s on the floor
Speaker 1: just starting the corner and you know, have Moleague or
Speaker 1: t HD be the guy who initially breaks down the
Speaker 1: defense and then you, yeah, you might have to do
Speaker 1: a little bit more about to do some clothes out attacking,
Speaker 1: but that's easier on your legs than doing what you
Speaker 1: have to do. And you yourself, Lebron, you don't have
Speaker 1: to do that anymore, have to be it's wide open
Speaker 1: shots for your for your teammates anymore. You can literally
Speaker 1: do what you did against You talk set ball screens
Speaker 1: and roll to the basket while somebody else goes to
Speaker 1: work because of the anatomy of the way modern basketball
Speaker 1: has played. So that's kind of like the philosophy that
Speaker 1: I think that the Lakers need to come to terms
Speaker 1: with here, Like Russ would have made more sense if
Speaker 1: you had really traditional three and D specialists parked in
Speaker 1: the corner that did all the dirty work and just
Speaker 1: sat there and shot threes all day long. That would
Speaker 1: have made more sense. But that's just not the construct
Speaker 1: of this team. And in theory, like man, Russ would
Speaker 1: have been a devastating five out player back in two
Speaker 1: thousand seventeen, but he's just not that guy anymore. Back
Speaker 1: in two thousand seventeen, Russ would have been an amazing
Speaker 1: fit with this team, but those days are gone and
Speaker 1: now it's a bad fit. And so that's why I'm saying, like, like, understand,
Speaker 1: when we talk about the good team that lies here,
Speaker 1: it's a good team that is beneath the surface that
Speaker 1: doesn't really have anything to do with Russ and and
Speaker 1: that's why he needs to be viewed as, you know,
Speaker 1: somebody that needs to be gotten rid of for lack
Speaker 1: of a better term. Yeah, and you know, the interesting
Speaker 1: part of that is, like we've the you know, Lebron
Speaker 1: a D with three and D players or even D
Speaker 1: and three players, Like that's a that's a proven formula, right,
Speaker 1: Like that's something that we've seen work already once, um
Speaker 1: even last year a little bit. Dennis Shooter is a
Speaker 1: little bit differently, but he's still you know, a defensive
Speaker 1: tycle player who doesn't command the amount of uses obviously
Speaker 1: that Russ would usually command. That's a you know, that's
Speaker 1: a formula that's worked and has been proven. And this
Speaker 1: is the whole new experiment. And how much of this
Speaker 1: was you know, Lebron pushing for this, how much of
Speaker 1: it was you know, the front office something you know,
Speaker 1: we'll never know. But again, like I say, like maybe
Speaker 1: if you can cut Bay with Russ, I understand it.
Speaker 1: I just I don't see it happening, you know, during
Speaker 1: the season, which so I'm just trying to find ways,
Speaker 1: I guess, to work around it. And we've we've started
Speaker 1: to do that already at a pace that I just
Speaker 1: did not expect. But Jason, we're halfway through the season
Speaker 1: and we've already, you know, cut Russ out of most
Speaker 1: of our offensive actions like that, Like that's pretty much
Speaker 1: what's happened. And I think, you know, Frank Vogel's kind
Speaker 1: of understood where he needs to put like how we
Speaker 1: need to kind of work offensively with Russ. But I
Speaker 1: don't know it's gonna be it. It's gonna be a
Speaker 1: kind of uphill climb here. Hopefully when a D comes
Speaker 1: back we can kind of build some kind of rhythm
Speaker 1: with it, because I just don't think he's going anywhere.
Speaker 1: I don't see a trade happening. You might be right,
Speaker 1: like maybe you know, if Russ isn't playing, we could
Speaker 1: just play full three and D. But that's a lot
Speaker 1: on you know, Lebron's play, even with the other ball
Speaker 1: handlers we have, So it's a it's a tough kind
Speaker 1: of thing to jug with here. I don't I don't
Speaker 1: know where we go though, Like this is I feel
Speaker 1: like our coach is gonna be gone tomorrow and we're
Speaker 1: gonna start brand new, Like like we're gonna start brand new.
Speaker 1: We'll see if they if they hire in house and
Speaker 1: stuff like that. But the rust stuff is tough. Man,
Speaker 1: I understand where you're at. Here, you're at the let's
Speaker 1: just jump off the ship. Um. I just think, like,
Speaker 1: this is not a ship. This is like a bed
Speaker 1: that's like clung to the floor until you know, six
Speaker 1: until six or seven months. Like that's how like I
Speaker 1: just that's how I see it. This is a bed
Speaker 1: that's you know, changed to the ground, and we're gonna
Speaker 1: lay in this. Like I said before that you know
Speaker 1: that that's saying you made your bed, you laying it.
Speaker 1: We're gonna lay in this until you know, after the
Speaker 1: playoffs to me, and that's kind of when you can
Speaker 1: kind of make decisions on the roster. This roster has
Speaker 1: flipped three times. I would bet on it flipping again.
Speaker 1: Uh you know, maybe this deadline as well, if we
Speaker 1: can kind of manufacture anything there. I just think Russ
Speaker 1: is going to be on the team. The focal quotes
Speaker 1: are super interesting though. Man, that's a guy who's super
Speaker 1: diplomatic went and said, uh, you know, I why do
Speaker 1: I bench for us? Because I wanted to win? That
Speaker 1: is a that's a that's a crazy quote, crazy quote
Speaker 1: from from your head coach. But I don't know. I
Speaker 1: don't have any answers there, and you might be right
Speaker 1: that movie it's time to move on. I just don't
Speaker 1: think that time is going to be this deadline. Did
Speaker 1: you have anything else on your list you wanted to
Speaker 1: hit before we called it tonight? Man? You know, my
Speaker 1: first half notes were a lot of like, oh man, we're,
Speaker 1: you know, going small, We're starting to switch more than's.
Speaker 1: You know, there's some positive stuff we're seeing. Burn it off,
Speaker 1: burn it off, there's nothing you gotta start all over from.
Speaker 1: I guess I think we play in Orlando. Ironically, you
Speaker 1: brought up to Orlando trade. We play Orlando next, and
Speaker 1: we'll see if we can kind of get that win.
Speaker 1: We'll see if Frank Vogel's the coach still during that time.
Speaker 1: What a chaotic What a chaotic season? Man? Oh man,
Speaker 1: it's absolutely outrageous. I am looking really quick because I
Speaker 1: wanted to double check the to see if that Stanley Johnson,
Speaker 1: th HT, Reeves, Monk and Lebron line up played any
Speaker 1: minutes tonight. So I'm checking really quick, like I think,
Speaker 1: I think th HT deserves a shout out. Like I
Speaker 1: mentioned on Twitter, in his last six games, thirteen points
Speaker 1: on six percent for shooting. He's owing lots of defensive flashes.
Speaker 1: He was amazing against Donovan Mitchell against the Jazz. He
Speaker 1: had a lot of big defensive place tonight. He's playing
Speaker 1: himself into being a legitimate um trade asset. I still
Speaker 1: think we're at the point where, even though he's playing better,
Speaker 1: I think the Lakers are so desperate for talent that
Speaker 1: they have to consider um, you know, using him. But
Speaker 1: it's definitely something to keep in mind. It feels like
Speaker 1: we have two separate teams, right we have this like
Speaker 1: older group and then we have this young group that
Speaker 1: comes in and plays hard, and Lebron kind of plays
Speaker 1: on both teams, which is which is really interesting. But
Speaker 1: that's what it feels like. She was awesome. Though. It
Speaker 1: looks like he's getting his field back. You know, his
Speaker 1: drives are under a under more control. He had that
Speaker 1: drive today where he lobbed it to the League Monk.
Speaker 1: Just a lot more in control with his dribble and
Speaker 1: his actions. And uh, he's definitely you know, moving forward,
Speaker 1: moving up, maybe the you know COVID stuff, and I
Speaker 1: think he had the hand injury as well, was kind
Speaker 1: of holding him down. But his jumpers starting to be
Speaker 1: there too. I think he had two three tonight. It
Speaker 1: was awesome. It just you know, it sucks to that
Speaker 1: he's starting to build while the team is kind of
Speaker 1: crashing down again. But you know, shout out to t
Speaker 1: H had another good night for him. All Right, guys,
Speaker 1: before we get out of here, I got I got
Speaker 1: the numbers for you. So that let me guess up.
Speaker 1: So the line that we're talking about is Reeves, Reeves, Reeves,
Speaker 1: th HD, Monk, Johnson, Lebron. Okay, I'm gonna guess. They
Speaker 1: played five minutes tonight, Bagel rog they played zero minutes.
Speaker 1: They played zero minutes tonight. The lineup that beat the
Speaker 1: Utah Jazz and on Monday played zero minutes. Frank Vogel
Speaker 1: dug his own grave. Man, I don't know what else
Speaker 1: to tell you. That's absolutely outrageous. That is completely inexcusable.
Speaker 1: That is that is a fireable offense. I'm with you,
Speaker 1: and and then you you you know, you split that up.
Speaker 1: Carmelo Anthony thirty minutes, Avery Bradley five minutes. Just that's
Speaker 1: that's not a winning formula. Especially when you need to
Speaker 1: switch everything kind of goes against We dove into this already,
Speaker 1: dude time, where is this all right? Guys? Well, we're uh,
Speaker 1: we probably should sleep on this. I think this entire
Speaker 1: podcast was was mostly yelling. So like I feel like
Speaker 1: I feel like Richard Sherman after knocking away the thing
Speaker 1: from Michael Crabtree. I've just way too emotional to be
Speaker 1: doing any sort of public speaking at this point. But anyway, guys,
Speaker 1: this is gonna air on Dash Radio tomorrow morning at
Speaker 1: seven and Pacific Standard time. It will I will also
Speaker 1: piece together the Crash to Spaces and this one and
Speaker 1: put them on our podcast feed that should be live
Speaker 1: in about an hour or so. But we're blown away
Speaker 1: by the support as always. I know this is crazy
Speaker 1: and super discouraging, but there is a good team in
Speaker 1: here somewhere. They just have to actually play the players
Speaker 1: that are good. I don't know. My guess is by
Speaker 1: the time we're talking on Friday Rise, we're gonna have
Speaker 1: Vogel out of the picture, and we're gonna be talking
Speaker 1: about We're gonna be talking about Fizzdale, and we're gonna
Speaker 1: be talking it could like and who knows, maybe Fizdale
Speaker 1: will come back on Friday and start playing DeAndre Jordan
Speaker 1: again and all just be like like literally ready to
Speaker 1: just quit um. But you know, it's it's been a
Speaker 1: rough go. But I do, I do have a feeling
Speaker 1: that there is some sort of run in this team.
Speaker 1: It's just gonna be a matter of whether or not
Speaker 1: they ever tap into that really really quick before we
Speaker 1: before we close, and you know, if this is the
Speaker 1: I don't know if this is the elog Frank Vogo
Speaker 1: as a coach, But he's not a bad coach, right,
Speaker 1: Like he might just not be the fit for this team.
Speaker 1: But it's a great point. That doesn't mean Frank Boto
Speaker 1: is a bad coach. It doesn't mean his philosophies are correct,
Speaker 1: doesn't mean his defensive philosophies don't have, you know, an
Speaker 1: imprint on the game with the correct lineups and stuff.
Speaker 1: But this might just not be this This just might
Speaker 1: not be the team for him. There's just a disconnect
Speaker 1: maybe between him the front office superstar whatever, between their
Speaker 1: value systems, and maybe that's just what it is. But
Speaker 1: Frank Vogo is a good coach and he's gonna, you know,
Speaker 1: be in the NBA for a very long time, even
Speaker 1: if it's not here. So I just wanted to give
Speaker 1: that shout out. His adjustments in the playoffs I thought
Speaker 1: were excellent defensively, so so I give him a shout out.
Speaker 1: And because it was a lot of negativity towards him
Speaker 1: today and I know, I think he's a good coach
Speaker 1: that maybe just doesn't fit this team. I'm gonna save
Speaker 1: my eulogy for Friday because I don't know if I
Speaker 1: can muster up the proper list of works. I mean,
Speaker 1: you said at yourself, man like he he because of
Speaker 1: his rigid approach. He's he's best with the team that
Speaker 1: has a talent set that fits his scheme. He was
Speaker 1: too stubborn the whole time, and he never leave like
Speaker 1: even when he wanted to lean into the approach that
Speaker 1: we were talking about. He even talked about in the
Speaker 1: pressers about how he was fighting the urge to go back.
Speaker 1: Remember that after that, I can't remember was at the
Speaker 1: Minnesota game like that that That's been the story of
Speaker 1: Frank's time here. He's been stubborn and slow to make
Speaker 1: changes and and I think it cost him his job.
Speaker 1: And it's the unfortunate circumstance He's not the only thing
Speaker 1: to blame. There's so much more to blame, you know.
Speaker 1: But I'll say I'll say one last thing about this,
Speaker 1: and this is a This is something that my friend,
Speaker 1: our friend ven A pointed out to me in a
Speaker 1: conversation earlier today. Effort has been one of the biggest
Speaker 1: problem them was for the Lakers this year. That goes
Speaker 1: without saying, but effort is almost always directly tied to
Speaker 1: you know, kind of like an exchange, right, Like you're
Speaker 1: exchanging work for results, Like if I'm gonna do a
Speaker 1: thing that's hard, hard to do, then I expect results
Speaker 1: to follow. And so one of the biggest things that
Speaker 1: I think one of the things that I that I
Speaker 1: think bit of Frank Vogel in the ask this year
Speaker 1: is you know, it was hard for him to get
Speaker 1: the guys to play hard because of the fact that
Speaker 1: his schemes never really made sense with the personnel that
Speaker 1: he was playing and the personnel was failing. And I
Speaker 1: think that those things are directly tied to each other,
Speaker 1: like it's I don't think that's a coincidence. I don't
Speaker 1: think it's a coincidence that the switchy big wing lineups
Speaker 1: that played five out basketball, played harder than the traditional
Speaker 1: drop covers lineups that were ill suited for the scheme
Speaker 1: they were running. And those lineups always seemed to be lethargic,
Speaker 1: and those lineups always seemed to underperformed to the alleged
Speaker 1: talent that they have on the floor. Those things are connected.
Speaker 1: And I think, like again, that doesn't mean Frank step
Speaker 1: to blame for everything, but I do think that his
Speaker 1: fingers are in this pie quite a bit, and I
Speaker 1: think that I don't think that he's blameless. And I
Speaker 1: think that, you know, I think that we rudge. We
Speaker 1: we've done our part. Man like we gave we talked,
Speaker 1: We gave him so much slack. We talked so much
Speaker 1: about the good things that he brings to the table.
Speaker 1: We tried really hard to stay positive, and it just
Speaker 1: it wasn't. It got to the point where's too much. Well,
Speaker 1: here's he's my last question for you, and we can
Speaker 1: close out on this kind. We're going a little longer.
Speaker 1: We're both guys, you know, we try to rewatch these games.
Speaker 1: And you know, Phil Frank Boggle is not a guy
Speaker 1: who came up because he had family in the NBA.
Speaker 1: He's not a guy who played in the NBA at all, right,
Speaker 1: so he has come up, was all through the film
Speaker 1: and not saying like guys like that come up. It's
Speaker 1: just like Frank vogel story right as a guy who
Speaker 1: worked in the film room, started as a video editor,
Speaker 1: and the guy who started in the video room film
Speaker 1: and worked his way up each and every spot to
Speaker 1: become the head coach everything he got. So my question
Speaker 1: to you is like, this is the part that I
Speaker 1: struggled with, Like you watch DeAndre Jordan, you know, do
Speaker 1: the same thing through thirty million times, not give every defensively,
Speaker 1: and yet he continued to start him. So that's like
Speaker 1: my disconnect here, like where we all watch the same tape,
Speaker 1: we all watch the same film. Where is that disconnect
Speaker 1: coming from? Because there's no way in hell to me,
Speaker 1: I don't care what you think about Frank Vogel, there's
Speaker 1: no way he's not seeing DeAndre Jordan. You know, take
Speaker 1: as I say, take the path at least resistance on
Speaker 1: every play, right, So any time that and and Frank
Speaker 1: bo was a guy his big ist supposed to be
Speaker 1: active and in activity and all that. So that's like
Speaker 1: that's my last question to you, Like Where is that disconnect?
Speaker 1: I guess because that's where I'm like, that has been
Speaker 1: that has been my biggest like where I give Frank
Speaker 1: Vogel credit now tonight, David Bradley stuff, you know, the
Speaker 1: Carmelo Anthony stuff is just unforgivable not playing the small ball,
Speaker 1: But the DeAndre Jordan has been like was the first
Speaker 1: kind of stone to be thrown, right, the first kind
Speaker 1: of like, hey, what the hell are you doing? Why
Speaker 1: is DeAndre Jordan's starting twenty three games? Like we've had
Speaker 1: enough data to see that this just doesn't make any sense.
Speaker 1: And now DeAndre Jordan is, you know, on the bench,
Speaker 1: riding the bench alot with camp bays Moore. But that's where,
Speaker 1: like I'm wondering that because as a film that Frank
Speaker 1: Vogel Lizzy obviously is a guy who you know, lives
Speaker 1: in the film room. What is that disconnected where like, Okay,
Speaker 1: he's seeing this yet still you know, being stubborn to
Speaker 1: go into the same things. That's my last I guess
Speaker 1: question you there. Well, I my suspicion would be that
Speaker 1: it's primarily tied to his philosophies mixed with the fact
Speaker 1: that the Lakers have consistently wanted to keep Dwight Howard
Speaker 1: off the bench. That's been a theme ever since he
Speaker 1: signed that non guaranteed deal two years ago, just because
Speaker 1: of his attitude issues. They were under the impression that
Speaker 1: if they kept him coming off the bench, they could
Speaker 1: kind of keep him focused on his dirty work responsibilities. Rather,
Speaker 1: if you start him, it could feed his ego and
Speaker 1: convince him that he's more important than he actually isn't
Speaker 1: get him outside of his role, you know, kind of
Speaker 1: like the guy who took that random pull up three
Speaker 1: against Denver at the start of the second half. Like,
Speaker 1: those are the kinds of things that I think wanted
Speaker 1: the Lakers, or led the Lakers to want to have
Speaker 1: Dwight come off the bench, which inherently forces you to
Speaker 1: start DeAndre Jordan. I think it's primarily philosophy, but conspiracy theory.
Speaker 1: You know, it's possible that he's under a great deal
Speaker 1: of pressure with these decisions. Like I mean, I like
Speaker 1: it's got it. It's a little bit of like of
Speaker 1: like a you know, a double take situation for him
Speaker 1: to bench r Us in his last game, as the
Speaker 1: Lakers said coach, like probably probably last game, I should
Speaker 1: say the that very well could be an example of
Speaker 1: of Vogel just kind of demonstrating to us that if
Speaker 1: he had it his way, he might have done things differently,
Speaker 1: but he might have been under some internal pressure. I'm
Speaker 1: not sure. I don't think that's the case. I'm just
Speaker 1: generally as a human being, I'm not much of a
Speaker 1: conspiracy theorist. But but like that, that's certainly something that
Speaker 1: is like worth entertaining. But my guess is it's primarily
Speaker 1: tied to his philosophy. And you know, that's the thing,
Speaker 1: like like Frank's you know, Frank was a damn good coach.
Speaker 1: This is something you and I talked a lot about
Speaker 1: over the course of the last three years. There was
Speaker 1: the famous story that I say a point out is
Speaker 1: allegedly at one point Lebron and some other Lakers actually
Speaker 1: got up and gave him a round of applause after
Speaker 1: a defensive scouting session a film session where they were
Speaker 1: going over like their defensive game plan for an opponent,
Speaker 1: like he is one of the best defensive game planners
Speaker 1: in the league. His adjustment of putting Anthony Davis on
Speaker 1: Russell Westbrook in the Houston series completely swung that series
Speaker 1: because Russ was having some success attacking mismatches against the
Speaker 1: Laker guards in that in that Denver series, the way
Speaker 1: he was using Dwight Howard on uh on Nicola Yokich
Speaker 1: was very successful. And then guys like like Frank Vogel's
Speaker 1: drop coverage scheam literally absolutely obliterated the Miami Heat in
Speaker 1: the NBA Finals when they actually did what he asked
Speaker 1: in Game one, in Game six, the two games that
Speaker 1: they ran it most proficiently, like, they literally absolutely demolished
Speaker 1: to the Miami Heat. So there's a reason why Frank
Speaker 1: believes in his schemes. There's a reason why he has
Speaker 1: faith there. And here's the thing, Like, if I was
Speaker 1: a Philly fan and for whatever reason, Doc Rivers was
Speaker 1: out of the picture, I'd be sitting there like man
Speaker 1: like he'd be perfect for us. There are teams around
Speaker 1: the league where Frank's scheming fits perfect. This just isn't
Speaker 1: one of them. This needs to be this, this would
Speaker 1: have been. This is where the Tyler thing gets kind
Speaker 1: of like iron because Tyler might not have been the
Speaker 1: right coach for the Lakers, but he damn sure is
Speaker 1: the right coach for this team with him, with with
Speaker 1: what he's done with the Clippers. With his defensive scheming
Speaker 1: and his offensive approach, he'd be perfect there. So Frank's
Speaker 1: gonna land on his feet. He's gonna get another job elsewhere.
Speaker 1: I will always be a fan of Frank and what
Speaker 1: he brings to the table. He just he was stubborn.
Speaker 1: He was so stubborn that he dug his own grave
Speaker 1: on on this Laker team. And you know, I I've
Speaker 1: kind of oscillated back and forth in this a few times.
Speaker 1: But like when the news comes down tomorrow from Warsnowski
Speaker 1: or from whoever the hell it comes from, that Frank
Speaker 1: is fired, I'm not gonna feel sympathy for him. Because
Speaker 1: when you play fifteen minutes again into Utah Jazz with
Speaker 1: that lineup, go plus eighteen and literally win the game,
Speaker 1: and then not even attempts to use that lineup again tonight,
Speaker 1: that is that is coaching, now practice. And at that point,
Speaker 1: you are showing me that you are too, that you're
Speaker 1: so damn stubborn that you actually look at that game
Speaker 1: and you think the winning stretch was a fluke and
Speaker 1: the losing stretch wasn't. So you default back to those
Speaker 1: things and hope for a different outcome. It's like it's
Speaker 1: like with all those advanced metrics with Avery Bradley earlier
Speaker 1: in the year, when he was like, oh, I'm aware
Speaker 1: of the advanced metrics. I'm just I believe that they'll
Speaker 1: turn around. It's like that's his that's his philosophy. He
Speaker 1: doesn't actually care what happens on the scoreboard. He's he's
Speaker 1: more concerned with like what he thinks should happen on
Speaker 1: the scoreboard with an alleged group of players. And so
Speaker 1: he's he's so fixed on that concept that he will
Speaker 1: literally stare data in the face. He will stare a
Speaker 1: scoreboard in the face and ignore the outcome because it
Speaker 1: doesn't match with what his personal philosophies are. And I'm
Speaker 1: it's like that that that to me is that to
Speaker 1: me is the final mail in the coffin. And it's unfortunate. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but like you know, to be just to be fair
Speaker 1: to like, his philosophy paid off, like it was rewarded.
Speaker 1: It was the right players, you know what I mean,
Speaker 1: Like it was routed with you know, just like just
Speaker 1: put like your shoe like on frame votus play right.
Speaker 1: Like his philosophy paid off into a championship team and
Speaker 1: the front office decided to flip the rust right like
Speaker 1: like just from him, and he's like, I'm gonna change
Speaker 1: no, no no, no, Liek monk, You're going to chase over
Speaker 1: the ball streams like you know what I mean. Like
Speaker 1: that's and it's probably not the correct move, it's just
Speaker 1: what happened. And you know that's where like my sympathy
Speaker 1: comes in with this. And again he doesn't have anthy
Speaker 1: Davis for a lot of this year, and you know,
Speaker 1: you can we've gone back and forth in terms of
Speaker 1: like the pauses and eggs and all that, but that's
Speaker 1: like where I kind of go back and forth as well,
Speaker 1: because this is the guy who's philosophy is paid off.
Speaker 1: It's not like, you know, you know, people are talking
Speaker 1: about Canada Mike D'Antoni offense win, right, you know what
Speaker 1: I mean, And Mike D'Antoni everywhere he went, he took
Speaker 1: his offense with him. You know, James Harden turned into
Speaker 1: See Nash, turned into James Harden and turned into whoever
Speaker 1: it was in New York. Like it's just that kind
Speaker 1: of you know, was passed around because that's what you know,
Speaker 1: coaches do. They believe in what they believe in. You
Speaker 1: go twenty thirty years with the philosophy, you're going to
Speaker 1: stick with that. And Frank Vogel was, you know, rewarded
Speaker 1: with it, and then uh, the team kind of flipped
Speaker 1: around him and he had to kind of adjust to that.
Speaker 1: And I'm not saying it's his fault. I would love
Speaker 1: to know, like, did Frank Vogel want to start Andre
Speaker 1: Dromaneszo as we did? I don't know. I don't have
Speaker 1: answers to those questions. Does he want to start DeAndre
Speaker 1: Doordan as much as we did? I don't know. Don't
Speaker 1: have to answer those questions, you know what I mean?
Speaker 1: Was he for you know, letting Crusoe walk for for
Speaker 1: what we did? Like that stuff? Like like I don't know,
Speaker 1: I don't have answers to. All I know is I
Speaker 1: know what Frank Vogel likes to do. I know what
Speaker 1: kind of stuff he likes to run, and it doesn't
Speaker 1: fit for this team. And that's just where we are
Speaker 1: in the crossroads. But that's where my kind of sympothy
Speaker 1: comes in from, is that, like he's a guy whose
Speaker 1: philosophy is paid off and then we just stripped all
Speaker 1: of it and said start over, you know, and that
Speaker 1: that's tough. And even though it hasn't worked out and
Speaker 1: I've been annoyed at the Lions and stuff, I just
Speaker 1: want to keep that context here because I think it's important, Um,
Speaker 1: even whoever we go forward with, Like, I think that
Speaker 1: context is import in terms of coach, star in front
Speaker 1: office and walking in unison and and that's kind of
Speaker 1: and I don't see that's what's happening right now. Well,
Speaker 1: it's it's the perfect example, Roger. Like, it's if I
Speaker 1: picked two incredibly intelligent people just at random, there's a
Speaker 1: good chance that one of them would align more with
Speaker 1: Republican political ideals and one would aligned with democratic political
Speaker 1: I put that into that I was gonna I was
Speaker 1: gonna go that route in a second. But but my
Speaker 1: point is is, like it's possible for someone to be
Speaker 1: extremely intelligent and to be on the wrong side of
Speaker 1: something or on a different side of something someone else.
Speaker 1: And so that's the thing with Frank. Like Frank this
Speaker 1: tonight is not an example of Frank being dumb. It's
Speaker 1: just an example of you know, I could even argue
Speaker 1: it's just him being too smart for his own good.
Speaker 1: And overthinking his own philosophies. But I was getting ready
Speaker 1: to go to bed. It is it is after midnight
Speaker 1: here in Tucson, Arizona. But we have to keep going
Speaker 1: for a few more minutes because of this news that
Speaker 1: Franks can wait till tomorrow morning. And Chris Haynes had
Speaker 1: to put this out, you know, before they hop on
Speaker 1: the flight to Orlando. Have they even left you know
Speaker 1: whatever arena? Actually they were home tonight. What am I
Speaker 1: talking about? They were at Crypto Arena, so I don't know.
Speaker 1: They're probably hopping on a flight though, I mean either
Speaker 1: probably tomorrow morning. But it's like, you know, the thing is,
Speaker 1: this is my initial takeaway when I saw that this
Speaker 1: is a problem with hatching your ship out in the press,
Speaker 1: which is which is one of my biggest tet peeves
Speaker 1: in general in sports when you see reported excuse me,
Speaker 1: one reporting one way or another and guys constantly trying
Speaker 1: to control the narrative one way or the other, because
Speaker 1: you know, Frank probably leaked all that stuff out with
Speaker 1: the intention of controlling the narrative on his end, Like, hey, guys,
Speaker 1: I'm trying to coach the team and I've got this
Speaker 1: random mass failed coach, sitting on sitting into my coaches meetings,
Speaker 1: trying to tell me what to do, telling me that
Speaker 1: DeAndre George and should play more, and he's sharing that
Speaker 1: information to try to share his end of the perspective. Meanwhile,
Speaker 1: you also have probably you probably have Rob Polinka linking
Speaker 1: leaking stuff about how Lebron was advocating for the Russell
Speaker 1: Westbrook trade. And then like there's this the immediate leak
Speaker 1: the next day from the from the Rambis and and
Speaker 1: Bus camp about how there's no plans to to to
Speaker 1: get rid of of Frank Vogel at the moment, and
Speaker 1: so so like all of this dirty laundry is getting
Speaker 1: aired out in public because of this total ship show
Speaker 1: of a season. And this is where we land now
Speaker 1: because now Frank does something, has a night and the
Speaker 1: team has a night where it's like, oh, like we
Speaker 1: actually have to make a coaching change. But now Rambis
Speaker 1: and Bus are caught with their pants down because they
Speaker 1: just came out with the report the other day saying
Speaker 1: they're not going to do it. So it's like, like, Roger,
Speaker 1: what is the point of putting of putting Frank Vogel
Speaker 1: on that airplane tomorrow. What is the point of having
Speaker 1: him sits six rows away from Russell Westbrook after he
Speaker 1: just told the press that he didn't think he was
Speaker 1: capable of winning a game against the Indiana Pacers. Like,
Speaker 1: what's the point of all of that? Now? Now we're
Speaker 1: entering into teenager drama here, Like this is like like like,
Speaker 1: well this is it's l a, You're going to get drama.
Speaker 1: It's just man, I feel like we've moved in so
Speaker 1: far away from the basketball and we're we've gone into
Speaker 1: like all the stuff off of it. But it's interesting
Speaker 1: that I don't know, I don't like to me, like
Speaker 1: the report came out that uh and you know, you
Speaker 1: don't know who leaked it whatever, but that you know,
Speaker 1: they're a battle evaluating Frank on a day to day basis,
Speaker 1: that's a thurd if that's true, right, and for for
Speaker 1: for a coach, like a day to day basis for
Speaker 1: a coach, it just makes no sense to me, Like,
Speaker 1: you know, just with the variation as basketball games going again,
Speaker 1: you can decide, you know, lineup rotations and those things
Speaker 1: and kind of uh stumble over, But I don't know
Speaker 1: like that that's those are the time kind of reports
Speaker 1: that come out when you're organizations going through some turmoil. Obviously,
Speaker 1: whenever Lebrons on the team, there's going to be an
Speaker 1: actual layer of drama and stuff. But did you see
Speaker 1: the Lebron quote tonight? Know what was it? Oh, we
Speaker 1: don't one about how the coaching staff. Yeah, Lebron's not
Speaker 1: Lebron's not allowed. Lebron is not he are But this
Speaker 1: is the funniest thing with the Lebron stuff. He somehow
Speaker 1: has a reputation of getting coaches fired. But when you
Speaker 1: look back, it's like Paul Silists, which was so early
Speaker 1: in his career, Lebron didn't have the power to get
Speaker 1: coaches fired. And then you know David Blatt and then
Speaker 1: Luke Walton, who objectively was terrible and may or may
Speaker 1: not have been a rapist. So it's like like they're like, really,
Speaker 1: the Lebron coach fire thing doesn't actually line up with reality.
Speaker 1: And so what's funny is like I could see Lebron
Speaker 1: just being like, I want to get as far away
Speaker 1: from this as possible, Like if they get rid of him,
Speaker 1: it wasn't my decision because I'm not allowed. I'm not
Speaker 1: about to let that get on my resume. Yeah, so
Speaker 1: I don't know, man, I don't know where they go.
Speaker 1: And you know, whatever coach comes comes in, whatever coach
Speaker 1: comes in here, obviously they can fix they can play
Speaker 1: better line up. So there's a lot of stuff this
Speaker 1: team also has to figure out internally as well. The
Speaker 1: rust fit isn't, like I said, going anywhere. I don't
Speaker 1: care who you bring in. I don't care if you're
Speaker 1: bringing Jeremy Grant in the team, you know, over the deadline,
Speaker 1: like the rest of it has to get figured out.
Speaker 1: A d coming back has to be reintrogated, like maybe
Speaker 1: they see it how I see it, you know, Jason,
Speaker 1: that like firing Frank doesn't do much if you don't
Speaker 1: have a replacement ready, right, Like maybe they do have
Speaker 1: a replacement, right, I don't know. I just you know,
Speaker 1: people are brought up Fisdale. Tusdale is just the easy decision, right.
Speaker 1: You know, Phil Handy is another guy zero coaching experience.
Speaker 1: I love Phil Handy, but you know, zero coaching. His
Speaker 1: brands jumping into this. So it's just fascinating. I don't know,
Speaker 1: and do you trust I don't see the Lakers going
Speaker 1: off go out and going off on some extensive coaching
Speaker 1: search either, especially in the middle of the season, it's
Speaker 1: really tough. So the perfect guy for their five attack
Speaker 1: would be Mike D'Antoni. I'm just not sure you can
Speaker 1: bring in a coach from outside the system in the
Speaker 1: middle of the season to try to make that work.
Speaker 1: But he would be the perfect guy to optimize this
Speaker 1: roster offensively, and he would absolutely lean one thousand percent
Speaker 1: into switching everything. Maybe, but you know, Mike Cantoni's the
Speaker 1: demens of principles have been attacked. His origidness as well
Speaker 1: has been a right. Is ability to adjust in the
Speaker 1: playoffs also an issue. My point only with that is
Speaker 1: there's no perfect option out there, right, absolutely not. There's
Speaker 1: no perfect answer. So it looks like Frank Vogel is
Speaker 1: going to survive another you know, another game at least,
Speaker 1: um they lose to Orlando, we'll be back here, I
Speaker 1: guess too. To relitigate all of it, of what we
Speaker 1: just said, I guess. But yeah, it looks like Frank
Speaker 1: Vogel's point to survive another day. I can't. I can't
Speaker 1: believe it, man, I can't believe it. After all those
Speaker 1: quotes like like if I'm Frank, like if Frank's probably
Speaker 1: like like just pulling into his driveway at home and
Speaker 1: like getting the alert on the Chris Haine Sweet and like,
Speaker 1: oh my god, I have to go to work tomorrow.
Speaker 1: Yeah man, yeah, what can How are they? How are
Speaker 1: they keeping me out? It's like that episode of Signed
Speaker 1: Feld where George Costanzas trying to get fired by the
Speaker 1: New York Yankees, like driving around the parking lot with
Speaker 1: the World Series trophy, just dragging around, just breaking it.
Speaker 1: That's literally what Frank did. And he's coming back just
Speaker 1: doesn't make any sense. But I, you know, I I
Speaker 1: for his sake. I hope he's gone for his sake,
Speaker 1: because like he doesn't seem happy, he doesn't seem happy
Speaker 1: with the players trying to implement his scheme and obviously
Speaker 1: it's just not a good fit anymore. And and that's
Speaker 1: just that's just kind of where we're at. But did
Speaker 1: you have anything else you wanted to hit, buddy before
Speaker 1: we call it night? I think that's pretty much it.
Speaker 1: And you know, I just I'm not saying I disagree
Speaker 1: with that. I just I think, you know, if Frank
Speaker 1: can stay, and he does stay, and it looks like
Speaker 1: he will, I think there's a justments that you can make.
Speaker 1: You know, tomorrow or even the next day, we'll see
Speaker 1: if they happen. But I think it's just tough man.
Speaker 1: Moving on. I've always said, you know, organizations that go
Speaker 1: through coaches on just like a regular basis, those are ones.
Speaker 1: Those are bad organizations. You know, you'll see like I
Speaker 1: don't like the Kings or something. They'll have like six
Speaker 1: coaches in the last eight years or something like. You know,
Speaker 1: those are the kind of stuff you see from bad
Speaker 1: organ zation. So there's like a you know, there's a
Speaker 1: gray area here. But maybe it's his time. I'm not sure.
Speaker 1: I just it's tough for me to kind of just
Speaker 1: get fully on that board yet. So well, but the Lakers,
Speaker 1: like the Lakers not there either, So we're gonna go.
Speaker 1: We're gonna play this out for another game. What a
Speaker 1: soap opera? Man? Al Right, everybody, So I think this
Speaker 1: went on long enough, then I'm probably just gonna split
Speaker 1: it into two parts, uh, since we got a couple
Speaker 1: of days to kill here, but I'll put part one
Speaker 1: before Twitter spaces crashed on us. I'll put that on
Speaker 1: our our podcast feed for two for immediately, So give
Speaker 1: it about a half hour and then I'll put the
Speaker 1: second part for Thursday was that Friday morning. But as always, guys,
Speaker 1: we appreciate your support. If you haven't subscribed yet to
Speaker 1: the State of the Lakers podcast, you can find the
Speaker 1: link on my Twitter page. I'm pretty sure Rog has
Speaker 1: it on his Twitter page as well. But we take
Speaker 1: the recordings from every one of these spaces and we
Speaker 1: put them on there. So if you missed any part
Speaker 1: of it, obviously we got uh pretty deep into the
Speaker 1: frank stuff at the beginning. Um, But like I said,
Speaker 1: we appreciate you guys to support. We will be back
Speaker 1: right after the final buzzer early game on Friday. I
Speaker 1: think it starts at like three o'clock your time, Roads
Speaker 1: just so a really a really early game, but we
Speaker 1: will be there. Are you heading out of town for
Speaker 1: that one? Are you gonna be here for that one? No?
Speaker 1: So I leave Saturday morning? Okay? Cool? Friday, all right,
Speaker 1: So we will see you guys after the Orlando game
Speaker 1: on Friday. Thanks, everyone, appreciate it.