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Speaker 1: Hey, Latino USA listener, here's a great show from our

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Speaker 1: archives from Fudro Media and PRX. It's Latino USA. I'm

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Speaker 1: Maria in no Hosa. Today Latino USA is exploring the

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Speaker 1: long standing and surprisingly political history between the Disney Company

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Speaker 1: and Latin America.

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Speaker 2: Maria, let me set a scene for.

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Speaker 1: You, Producer Antonia Serejidro.

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Speaker 2: It's a crisp October night. It's nineteen forty three. We're

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Speaker 2: in the Hollywood Bowl, which is this beautiful outdoor amphitheater,

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Speaker 2: and that night they're hosting a Latin American fiesta. And

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Speaker 2: so the performers on stage are playing rumbas and mambos.

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Speaker 2: So people are sitting under the stars, they're watching this concert.

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Speaker 2: Musicians like Desi Arnaz, who you know who that is?

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Speaker 1: Of course, Well, actually he was the most famous Latin

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Speaker 1: American actor, musicians, singer, and husband of Lucille Ball.

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Speaker 2: He was famous on I Love Lucy. And there was

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Speaker 2: Jaber Gugat right.

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Speaker 1: Right right, Javier Gougat. He was a band leader, of course.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, there was these big Latin jazz names on stage.

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Speaker 2: And then there was a guess that you might not.

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Speaker 1: Expect, Donald Duck. Yeah, or should I say it, Pat Donald.

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Speaker 2: Pat Donald was randomly one of the people at this

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Speaker 2: Latin Fiesta Night at the Hollywood Bowl. And it wasn't

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Speaker 2: actually Donald Duck but the man who voiced Donald Duck,

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Speaker 2: Clarence Nash. And so you might be like, why is

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Speaker 2: Donald Duck.

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Speaker 1: At the Hollywood Bowl when they're playing Latin music.

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Speaker 2: And it's because there was just a movie that was

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Speaker 2: put out called Salulos Amos. It was a Disney film

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Speaker 2: set in Latin America. And we're actually going to get

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Speaker 2: into the story behind the movie. But back to the

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Speaker 2: Latin American Fiesta Night at the Hollywood Bowl for a moment.

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Speaker 2: It was more than just a fun Latin night. It

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Speaker 2: was being held by the government, and not the US government,

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Speaker 2: but a collection of Latin American country's consulates in Los Angeles,

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Speaker 2: because this was wartime, and the aim of the concert

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Speaker 2: was to strengthen ties between the US and Latin America.

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Speaker 2: And as it turns out, Disney has played a surprisingly

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Speaker 2: involved role in not just the culture but the politics

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Speaker 2: of Latin America.

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Speaker 1: And so on today's show, we're going to explore this

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Speaker 1: relationship between Disney, both the man and the company and

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Speaker 1: Latin America. We're going to start with the story of

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Speaker 1: a trip that Walt Disney himself took to Latin America

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Speaker 1: during World War Two, where he was literally deployed as

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Speaker 1: a weapon against the Nazis. Then we're going to talk

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Speaker 1: about a book that was burned in Chile during the

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Speaker 1: nineteen seventies and the book is called how to Read

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Speaker 1: Donald Duck. And finally a look into Disney Pixar's film

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Speaker 1: Gocom which is set in Mexico about the Day of

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Speaker 1: the Dead. And we're going to ask the question, so,

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Speaker 1: just how much has Disney impacted Latin America.

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Speaker 2: To answer that question, we need to go back to

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Speaker 2: nineteen thirty three, the year Franklin D. Roosevelt became president.

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Speaker 3: I would dedicate this nation to the policy of the

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Speaker 3: Good Neighbor.

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Speaker 4: Right.

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Speaker 1: So this idea, this good Neighbor policy was really FDR's

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Speaker 1: attempt to actually build a close relationship between the United

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Speaker 1: States and Latin America.

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Speaker 2: And the good Neighbor policy had two goals, one which

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Speaker 2: was more immediate to stop the spread of fascism in

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Speaker 2: Latin America worth World War two looming, and the second

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Speaker 2: goal was to unite North and South America to make

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Speaker 2: the Western hemisphere its own power, especially its own power

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Speaker 2: that is separate from Europe.

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Speaker 3: We have been seeking to a firm of faith in

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Speaker 3: this Western world of ours.

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Speaker 2: One of the things that the US government did at

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Speaker 2: the time to remote the good Neighbor policy was to

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Speaker 2: create this special unit that was in charge of essentially

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Speaker 2: propaganda these movies that featured Latin America and were supposed

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Speaker 2: to make Latin Americans feel more appreciated and cared for

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Speaker 2: by Hollywood specifically, and their first attempts fell totally flat.

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Speaker 2: They were failing miserably.

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Speaker 1: Because they were like badly made propaganda.

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Speaker 2: They didn't get it. There was a movie called Argentine Knights,

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Speaker 2: which is actually the first movie that Andrew sisters were

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Speaker 2: ever in, and they were singing like Cuban style songs.

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Speaker 2: They had like fruits on their head, and it was

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Speaker 2: so bad Argentine people got so offended that there was

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Speaker 2: a riot. They had to bring serious They had to

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Speaker 2: bring riot police in to stop the pandemonium because people

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Speaker 2: were so upset with how they were being represented on screen.

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Speaker 2: And so at that point the US government officials who

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Speaker 2: were behind this propaganda were like, who can we turn

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Speaker 2: to who we know can reach out to people.

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Speaker 1: Who could it be I'm getting the picture here, So

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Speaker 1: it's Walt Disney obviously, So like they pick up the

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Speaker 1: phone and they call Walt totally.

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Speaker 2: This was the peak of Walt Disney's popularity. Guess what

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Speaker 2: movie like really launched.

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Speaker 1: Him into whytheusmell? Okay? Was it Donald Duck?

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Speaker 2: No?

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Speaker 1: Was it Fantasia?

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Speaker 2: No?

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Speaker 1: Was it Dumbo?

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Speaker 2: No?

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Speaker 1: It was snow White? Okay, all right?

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Speaker 2: So Snow White had like catapulted Disney to the next level,

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Speaker 2: and he had gone from being this guy who had

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Speaker 2: the small shop that was turning out to be really

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Speaker 2: popular to the owner of a major studio when he

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Speaker 2: had to hire thousands of employees all of a sudden,

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Speaker 2: his relationship to his animators changed dramatically. And so even

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Speaker 2: though Walt Disney became really popular, the animators at the

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Speaker 2: studio were being paid the same amount, and so they

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Speaker 2: decided to unionize, and when Walt Disney didn't react too

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Speaker 2: kindly to this, they went on strike. The banks weren't

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Speaker 2: as willing at this point in time to give him

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Speaker 2: loans to make his movies, and he had huge ambitions.

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Speaker 2: He wanted to make two feature films in one year,

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Speaker 2: which at that time was unheard of, not to mention

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Speaker 2: that the World War had closed off his access to

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Speaker 2: European markets. So the banks were like, Oh, we don't know,

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Speaker 2: we don't really want to pay for your stuff. But

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Speaker 2: do you know who did want to pay for Disney stuff?

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Speaker 1: I know it has something to do with Latin America. Oh,

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Speaker 1: it has to do with the government totally.

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Speaker 2: So they were like, hey, Disney, you're in a situation

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Speaker 2: right now, and we have these very specific political needs.

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Speaker 2: What if we offer to pay for your next couple

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Speaker 2: of movies, and we'll pay for you to go to

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Speaker 2: Latin America. They had asked him just to go like

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Speaker 2: shake hands and like talk to people, and he was like, no, no,

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Speaker 2: I'm going to make some movies out of this. I'm

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Speaker 2: gonna go get material and I'm going to make films

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Speaker 2: out of what I learned when I'm in Latin America.

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Speaker 2: And so then he, like Ocean's eleven style, collected this

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Speaker 2: group of storyboarders and animators and pr people that worked

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Speaker 2: at the Disney studios, and they went on a trip.

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Speaker 3: And I went down with a staff to see if

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Speaker 3: I couldn't make some films about the ABC countries down there.

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Speaker 3: You know, there's a Argentine, Brazil, and Chile.

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Speaker 2: So that's Disney himself. That audio is from a documentary

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Speaker 2: called South of the Border about Disney's trip to Latin America.

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Speaker 2: And so the first place they went to was Rio

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Speaker 2: de Janeedo in Brazil. At the time, Brazil was in

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Speaker 2: a place where they were really vacillating between the Allies

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Speaker 2: and the AXIS. On the one hand, Germany was their

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Speaker 2: largest market for cotton, but on the other hand, as

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Speaker 2: the war was starting, they were seeing that it was

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Speaker 2: probably more beneficial for them to trade more with the US. So, yeah,

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Speaker 2: the US was freaking out and that's part of why

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Speaker 2: Disney was sent there.

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Speaker 3: Judio we set up in Rio di Genio, Brazil, an

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Speaker 3: improvised studio in the hotel. It was a clearinghouse for

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Speaker 3: all our sketches, notes, and music, the record we were

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Speaker 3: keeping of our trip.

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Speaker 1: I kind of like love this image of like a

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Speaker 1: crew of white folks from Hollywood in Brazil and they're

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Speaker 1: all walking around with their little sketch books. Like what

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Speaker 1: are they sketching? You know, like ooo, color mangoes, wooh,

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Speaker 1: I don't know. It just seems really funny.

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Speaker 2: That's exactly what happened.

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Speaker 3: The artists spent hours in the botanical gardens and they

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Speaker 3: found an amazing variety of strange exotic plants orchids, for instance,

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Speaker 3: grow wild in Brazil's forests.

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Speaker 2: Also in Brazil's where they got their nickname the bell hop.

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Speaker 2: At the hotel they were saying at every time you

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Speaker 2: had to order a taxi for them or something. Who

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Speaker 2: to go wal Disney El grupo, so they would in

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Speaker 2: Portuguese it actually would be o Grupo, but somehow in

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Speaker 2: Brazil they got El Grupo and it stuck. So the

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Speaker 2: first place that they were afraid was going to go

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Speaker 2: to the axis was Brazil, so they spent a lot

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Speaker 2: of time there, and then the next country that they

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Speaker 2: were sort of worried about was Argentina.

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Speaker 3: Buenos Aires is the third largest city in the Western Hemisphere,

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Speaker 3: a city of beauty and hospitality.

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Speaker 2: The reason why Argentina and Brazil were these two countries

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Speaker 2: that they were particularly worried about is because they were

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Speaker 2: sizeable groups of German immigrants in both countries. As fascism

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Speaker 2: spread in Germany, it also spread within those communities, and

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Speaker 2: so those were the two main targets of their trip.

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Speaker 2: The other thing that's of note is that they had

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Speaker 2: spent time in Winosyitis. But the thing that really kind

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Speaker 2: of captured their imagination wasn't the city. It was the

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Speaker 2: life of the gauchos.

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Speaker 3: And we learned a lot more about the Argentine from

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Speaker 3: segor f Molina Campos, famous artist and authority on the gaucho,

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Speaker 3: the Argentine cowboy.

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Speaker 2: How exotic, No, Maria, you have no idea. There are

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Speaker 2: pictures of Walt Disney dressed up as a gaucho, and

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Speaker 2: as you know, I'm Argentinian, I was freaking out. I

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Speaker 2: was like, what is this bizarre picture? So in that

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Speaker 2: picture Waltsneys drinking Mate, the popular Argentine tea, and he's

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Speaker 2: wearing this handkerchief around his neck, and he's wearing the

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Speaker 2: big one batchas the writing pants, and he has this

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Speaker 2: goofy smile and it's just totally surreal.

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Speaker 1: So he was not the ugly American that was coming

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Speaker 1: and saying, God, you guys are doing wearing red clothes,

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Speaker 1: eating strange fruits and doing strange dances. He was like, ooh,

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Speaker 1: this is really cool.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean that was the whole mode of the

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Speaker 2: trip was like them like being like, we want to

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Speaker 2: learn so much about you guys. We want to like

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Speaker 2: really find out about what you're all about. And yeah,

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Speaker 2: there's videos of him dancing folk dances, him singing along tunes,

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Speaker 2: like he really got involved. And so after these two countries,

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Speaker 2: the Lurupam split up and they covered a lot of grounds.

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Speaker 2: They visited a lot of different countries in Latin America.

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Speaker 3: Our collection, the picture ideas continued to grow as we

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Speaker 3: started homework Ecuador with this remarkable Calumbria, It's coffee and

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Speaker 3: banana plants, the city of Bogata, Venezuela, the birthplace of

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Speaker 3: Simon Bolivar, the Liberate. We found our visit much too

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Speaker 3: short to do full justice to all of these attractive places.

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Speaker 2: So the whole trip only lasted a couple months. It

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Speaker 2: wasn't that long, but they did a lot of research.

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Speaker 2: They covered a lot of ground, and when they all

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Speaker 2: got back to Burbank, back to the studio, they kind

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Speaker 2: of looked at all of their sketches and they were like,

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Speaker 2: what are we gonna do with all of it? This

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Speaker 2: is so much stuff, And what came out was this

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Speaker 2: movie Saalul Sannios.

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Speaker 5: So the opening credits are designed to put everybody in

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Speaker 5: a good mood. It's pure nineteen forties Hollywood bustling strings

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Speaker 5: and they're fortified by a trumpet motive and then these

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Speaker 5: descending scales in the brass.

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Speaker 2: This is Carol Hess. She's a professor of musicology at

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Speaker 2: UC Davis who has done extensive research on the film.

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Speaker 2: And then what they end up doing is they break

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Speaker 2: down the movie into four different segments, like they couldn't

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Speaker 2: decide on which character they wanted to do.

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Speaker 6: So they have.

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Speaker 2: Bolivian Lama, who's friends with Donald Duck in Lake Titicaga, seeing.

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Speaker 3: The land of the Incas through the eyes of a

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Speaker 3: celebrated North American tourist.

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Speaker 2: Then there's Gaucho Goofy, this colorful co.

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Speaker 3: Hand of the Great West as his part in the

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Speaker 3: South American Gacho.

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Speaker 2: There is Pto the plane, a baby airplane named Little

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Speaker 2: Pedro Wayne Poo. I swear to you, Petritil the plane

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Speaker 2: is because they only went to the airport and cheated,

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Speaker 2: Like I don't think they actually saw cheatingh Why would

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Speaker 2: they pick a plane that's so random? And the fourth

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Speaker 2: one that's definitely the most popular one was the section

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Speaker 2: in Brazil that has a talking parent named jose Ka Rioka.

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Speaker 2: Don't know.

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Speaker 1: I will show you the lend of this somba.

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Speaker 7: What this olba?

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Speaker 8: All right?

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Speaker 1: So what did people say when the film finally came out.

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Speaker 2: American critics actually loved it.

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Speaker 5: One critic wrote that quote, Disney has been careful that

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Speaker 5: in getting his laughs, the gags are not on our

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Speaker 5: good neighbors, but rather on the Yankees. Donald Duck and

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Speaker 5: Goofy are portrayed as the fall guy.

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Speaker 2: They actually were incredibly impressed by the amount of research

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Speaker 2: that went into the film and also how Donald Duck

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Speaker 2: is sort of like a bumbling American idiot. And there's

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Speaker 2: one scene in the film that comes to mind which

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Speaker 2: I was shocked by. Donald is like walking around like Titicaka,

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Speaker 2: like sort of like this tourist, and he snaps a

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Speaker 2: picture of like an Indian baby on his mom's back,

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Speaker 2: and immediately the kid takes out a camera and snaps

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Speaker 2: one back.

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Speaker 1: I thought you were going to say, immediately the kid

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Speaker 1: reached out and took the camera from him.

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Speaker 2: No, but it's almost even better because he's like cleverly

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Speaker 2: making fun of the Duck. And it was sort of

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Speaker 2: this like Oh, wow, the people. The joke is at

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Speaker 2: the expense of Donald Duck and not of the Andyan people,

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Speaker 2: which people were very surprised by.

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Speaker 1: What about the critics in Latin America?

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Speaker 5: So I took a look at the Latin American press myself,

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Speaker 5: and sure enough, it was pretty positive.

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Speaker 1: There's a love affair that's going on here. That's a

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Speaker 1: little to me unexpected.

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Speaker 2: I think it's very important to remember that this was wartime.

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Speaker 2: It was a time of unity because they were fighting

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Speaker 2: a common enemy. The other thing that is of note

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Speaker 2: about the film is that.

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Speaker 5: Salulos Amigos premiered not in Hollywood, but Salulas Amigos premiered

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Speaker 5: in Latin America. It was first shown in Rio de

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Speaker 5: Janeiro as Alo Amigos on the twenty third of August

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Speaker 5: nineteen forty two, and this was no ordinary night at

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Speaker 5: the movies. The previous day, after years of vacillating between

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Speaker 5: the Allies and the Axis, the Brazilian president, Dictator Dulio Varagas,

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Speaker 5: declared war on Italy and Germany.

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Speaker 1: So does that mean that in the end the trip worked?

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Speaker 1: It was successful?

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Speaker 2: So I asked Carol that question and she told me

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Speaker 2: about what this one critic of the time said.

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Speaker 5: And this critic called Donald Duck more effective than Joseph Gibbels,

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Speaker 5: who was Hitler's minister of propaganda.

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Speaker 2: And so in terms of a good will trip for

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Speaker 2: World War two, yeah, it worked. But did it work

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Speaker 2: in terms of helping Pan Americanism? Like, did this Disney

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Speaker 2: film all of a sudden change the relationship.

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Speaker 5: When the war ended? Good neighbor enthusiasms faded, the United

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Speaker 5: States was now a formidable superpower, and onto other things.

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Speaker 1: It wasn't really a love affair. It was political propaganda.

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Speaker 5: So within a few years it was as if Disney's

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Speaker 5: frolicsome cartoon characters and friendship cementing music had never graced

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Speaker 5: the screen.

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Speaker 1: Coming up on Leating New Usa, the unlikely story of

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Speaker 1: a Chilean man who put his life on the line

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Speaker 1: by criticizing Donald Duck.

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Speaker 6: And they stoned our house and began shouting, long Live

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Speaker 6: Donald Duck.

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Speaker 1: Stay with us, Hey, We're back. Before the break, we

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Speaker 1: were hearing about how Walt Disney and a team of

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Speaker 1: creatives took a trip down to Latin America basically to

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Speaker 1: help fight the spread of Nazism in the nineteen forties.

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Speaker 1: Now that trip was part of the Good Neighbor Policy,

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Speaker 1: which was President Roosevelt's plan to strengthen ties between North

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Speaker 1: and South America. Almost immediately after World War Two ended,

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Speaker 1: a new ideology was gaining global strength and quickly became

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Speaker 1: number one enemy to the United States.

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Speaker 6: Communism.

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Speaker 3: I believe at that time when mister Sorel was a

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Speaker 3: Communist because of all the things that I had heard,

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Speaker 3: and that was.

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Speaker 1: Walt Disney himself outing a Hollywood union leader as a

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Speaker 1: Communist in front of the House Committee on Un American Activities.

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Speaker 1: Many Hollywood actors, writers and directors were under fire during

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Speaker 1: that time when Senator Joseph McCarthy made it his personal

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Speaker 1: mission to get rid of all communists in the United States.

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Speaker 1: At the same time, communism was becoming more and more

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Speaker 1: popular in Latin America. Fiel Castro was in Cuba, Socialism

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Speaker 1: was gaining favor in Venezuela, and then in nineteen seventy

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Speaker 1: Chile elected its first socialist president. Da Sinde becomes the

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Speaker 1: first democratically elected Marxist. And here is when once again

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Speaker 1: this guy somehow gets involved in US and La American diplomacy.

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Speaker 1: Our producer Antonia Silhido brings us a story about Chile,

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Speaker 1: book burning and El Pato Ronald.

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Speaker 2: When Adeird Dorfmann was in his twenties, he was an

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Speaker 2: idealistic writer who loved Marx.

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Speaker 6: There was a sense of achilaration as I cannot describe.

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Speaker 2: As a dreamer and thinker ad Chile as a nation

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Speaker 2: of endless possibilities.

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Speaker 6: There's the idea that you can change everything, that the

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Speaker 6: world that is being, that has been narrated for you

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Speaker 6: and by others about you, is no longer valid, that

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Speaker 6: you can tell your own story. And I can remember

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Speaker 6: being in the midst of enormous crowds that were marching

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Speaker 6: the night again they won the election.

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Speaker 2: Really soon after the election, major changes were already underway.

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Speaker 2: The national government was going to take back Chilia's natural

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Speaker 2: resources from big corporations. The land that peasants had previously

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Speaker 2: worked on was now going to belong to them.

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Speaker 6: A real liberation of our country.

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Speaker 2: And Adie saw that a political and economic revolution was

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Speaker 2: happening in Chile. But as a writer, he thought the

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Speaker 2: revolution needed to go one step further.

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Speaker 6: Revolution in the culture itself. Because most of the cultural

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Speaker 6: products of Chile were all imported from abroad.

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Speaker 2: It was time for Cheetah to create its own cultural

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Speaker 2: products and for Chilean artists to take their own work seriously.

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Speaker 2: And it was Walad Yet was thinking about how to

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Speaker 2: do this that he met Armann Mattelert, another young rabble

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Speaker 2: rousing writer. They met at a cocktail party, and immediately

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Speaker 2: they hit it off and bonded over what all adult

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Speaker 2: men bond over at cocktail parties.

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Speaker 6: Walt Disney. We're interested in Walt Disney.

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Speaker 2: They were particularly into Disney comic books.

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Speaker 6: Millions and millions of comic books in particular were being

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Speaker 6: imported from outside Chile, and we thought, well, let's target

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Speaker 6: Walt Disney and particularly Donald Duck, this very popular character,

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Speaker 6: and let's read him. Let's show what are the hidden

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Speaker 6: values and systems behind this.

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Speaker 2: For the next ten days, Adriel Rmand devoured Donald Duck

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Speaker 2: comic books and they started to write about what they noticed.

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Speaker 2: They identified what they saw as problematic characters, like this

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Speaker 2: one Vietnamese rat.

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Speaker 6: Jan Bigrat, who happened to be a Vietnamese revolutionary who

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Speaker 6: was throwing bombs at the Ducks.

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Speaker 2: Right, so this Vietnamese rat is threatening the ducks Donald

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Speaker 2: Donald's family. He has nephews named Huey, Dewey and Louis

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Speaker 2: for the Disney philisteins out there. But Adil doesn't think

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Speaker 2: the Ducks are upstanding citizens either.

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Speaker 6: Huey, Dewey and Louis saying, well, boys, when you grow up,

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Speaker 6: what are you going to be. I'm going to make

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Speaker 6: a lot of money. I'm going to be a capitalist.

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Speaker 6: I'm going to exploit people in general.

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Speaker 2: He was dismayed by the values the comics promoted, let's say.

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Speaker 6: Greed versus solidarity, or competition versus the idea of self reliance.

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Speaker 2: So Adilanmann compiled all of these thoughts about the Disney

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Speaker 2: animal heroes, and the final product was this one hundred

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Speaker 2: and twenty page book slash essay called how to Read

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Speaker 2: Donald Duck or par.

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Speaker 6: And the book became a runaway best seller in Chile.

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Speaker 2: Chilean's were hungry for a book that had the irreverent

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Speaker 2: tone of the revolution itself, and Nadiel was already a

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Speaker 2: pretty established writer. He even worked as a cultural advisor

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Speaker 2: to sal in this administration, and so he had a

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Speaker 2: perspective that people were immediately drawn to. The book was

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Speaker 2: really sarcastic. One passage titled instructions on how to expel

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Speaker 2: someone from the Disneyland Club started with the line the

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Speaker 2: authors of this book are to be defined as follows

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Speaker 2: indecent and immoral. Yet not everyone in Juliet found the

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Speaker 2: book insightful or funny.

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Speaker 6: There was a situation where I was crossing the street

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Speaker 6: and somebody tried to run me over in his car,

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Speaker 6: shouting Vivan Patland, which is really crazy. I mean, it

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Speaker 6: sounds funny, but it's it's it's not funny if they

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Speaker 6: try to run you over. We lived in a semi

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Speaker 6: bourgeois neighborhood and they stoned our house and began shouting

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Speaker 6: long lived Donald Duck.

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Speaker 2: Outside of Adia's world, there was a growing tension in Chile.

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Speaker 2: The economy started to decline, and officials, including Supreme Court judges,

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Speaker 2: began to complain that the government was ineffective at enforcing

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Speaker 2: the law. I In this popularity nationally still managed to

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Speaker 2: stay relatively high, but many right wingers, particularly military personnel,

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Speaker 2: were losing patients and so. On September eleventh, nineteen seventy three,

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Speaker 2: Chile's military armed forces storms Lamonida. La Moneda is basically

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Speaker 2: the Chilean White House, and they demanded that President Ayin

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Speaker 2: they surrender. The country ended up dying in Lamonida and

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Speaker 2: military leader Agusta Pinocchet took over.

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Speaker 6: I wasn't there at the palace when Allende died, and

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Speaker 6: when so many of my other friends either died or

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Speaker 6: or disappeared, and so I went on the run. I

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Speaker 6: was told that I should go clandestine, and I was

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Speaker 6: at a friend's house when she put on the television set,

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Speaker 6: and live on television, there were a series of soldiers

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Speaker 6: who were burning books. I mean, I thought this was

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Speaker 6: impossible that you could burn books after the Nazis had

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Speaker 6: done something similar so many years before, you know. And

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Speaker 6: then the camera goes forward a little bit and it

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Speaker 6: shows my own book being burnt. So I found this

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Speaker 6: very strange situation in which I was witnessing my own

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Speaker 6: book being burnt on television live. I think probably I

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Speaker 6: may have been the first person to watch his own

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Speaker 6: book being burnt live. Of course, this was a coup

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Speaker 6: which was fomented and helped by the United States, the

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Speaker 6: Land of Disney.

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Speaker 2: The Nixon administration was vehemently opposed to in this term,

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Speaker 2: and the CIA had actually been working for three years

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Speaker 2: to help organize the coup. The dream of a socialist Chile,

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Speaker 2: one that wasn't in us by superpower like the United States,

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Speaker 2: died overnight.

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Speaker 6: So we thought that we were roasting Donald Duck, and

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Speaker 6: Donald Duck was roasting us all the time. It would

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Speaker 6: much stronger than we thought he would be.

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Speaker 1: And part of what.

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Speaker 2: Died was a whole edition of How to Read Donald Duck.

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Speaker 2: It was thrown into the ocean, five thousand copies, completely

439
00:24:18,520 --> 00:24:26,560
Speaker 2: destroyed by the Chilean military government. So after this Adid

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Speaker 2: had to go into exile and somewhat ironically ended up

441
00:24:29,640 --> 00:24:32,440
Speaker 2: in the US and in this new land. He wanted

442
00:24:32,480 --> 00:24:33,760
Speaker 2: his manifesto to survive.

443
00:24:33,920 --> 00:24:35,119
Speaker 6: One of the things that I wanted to do as

444
00:24:35,160 --> 00:24:37,040
Speaker 6: soon as I went into exile was I want this

445
00:24:37,240 --> 00:24:39,119
Speaker 6: book to be published in the land of Disney.

446
00:24:39,280 --> 00:24:42,400
Speaker 2: I did felt that Disney wasn't just exporting oppressive values

447
00:24:42,440 --> 00:24:45,159
Speaker 2: to the world, but it was oppressing its own people

448
00:24:45,320 --> 00:24:49,360
Speaker 2: by instilling those values within the United States. Because, according

449
00:24:49,359 --> 00:24:51,879
Speaker 2: to Idia, the whole notion of Donald Duck, it.

450
00:24:51,960 --> 00:24:55,320
Speaker 6: Had come out of the special idea of American innocence,

451
00:24:55,720 --> 00:24:59,120
Speaker 6: on American goodness and American fund Disney.

452
00:24:58,920 --> 00:25:01,520
Speaker 2: Was presenting an income fleet and sanitized version of the

453
00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:02,879
Speaker 2: US to itself.

454
00:25:03,280 --> 00:25:07,080
Speaker 6: There was no racism, for instance, in Disney's comics. That

455
00:25:07,160 --> 00:25:11,200
Speaker 6: didn't exist. Hiroshima didn't exist in Disney's comics, et cetera.

456
00:25:11,240 --> 00:25:11,960
Speaker 6: I could go on or not.

457
00:25:12,280 --> 00:25:14,920
Speaker 2: And this is the big thing Ididn wanted to expose.

458
00:25:15,320 --> 00:25:18,240
Speaker 2: The biggest issue he took with Disney's animations is that

459
00:25:18,359 --> 00:25:23,320
Speaker 2: they spread a false narrative of American innocence. US publishers, however,

460
00:25:23,520 --> 00:25:25,720
Speaker 2: did not want to help him spread that message, but

461
00:25:25,920 --> 00:25:28,560
Speaker 2: not because of the book's politics, but rather good old

462
00:25:28,640 --> 00:25:30,200
Speaker 2: fashioned copyright infringement.

463
00:25:30,400 --> 00:25:34,880
Speaker 6: An army of lawyers was going to contest our copyright

464
00:25:34,960 --> 00:25:36,320
Speaker 6: because one of the things we had done in the

465
00:25:36,359 --> 00:25:40,200
Speaker 6: book was we had filled it with Disney cartoons without

466
00:25:40,280 --> 00:25:43,240
Speaker 6: asking permission. So we published it in London and we

467
00:25:43,400 --> 00:25:46,760
Speaker 6: imported four thousand copies to the United States, which were

468
00:25:46,760 --> 00:25:49,000
Speaker 6: immediately impounded by the US Treasury Department.

469
00:25:49,200 --> 00:25:51,480
Speaker 2: The case was taken to court. The argument was that

470
00:25:51,640 --> 00:25:54,159
Speaker 2: because how to Read Donald Duck was a critique, the

471
00:25:54,280 --> 00:25:56,600
Speaker 2: inclusion of the comics in the book was fair use,

472
00:25:57,119 --> 00:25:59,080
Speaker 2: and IDI had actually won, but.

473
00:25:59,720 --> 00:26:02,160
Speaker 6: The Treasury Department only allowed us to import one thousand,

474
00:26:02,200 --> 00:26:05,760
Speaker 6: five hundred copies of those books because of an arcane

475
00:26:05,840 --> 00:26:09,840
Speaker 6: law from the eighteen nineties or something like that with copyright.

476
00:26:10,119 --> 00:26:12,080
Speaker 2: The few copies that did make it into the US

477
00:26:12,200 --> 00:26:15,320
Speaker 2: have since become collector's items, going for hundreds of dollars.

478
00:26:16,119 --> 00:26:18,760
Speaker 2: But How to Read Donald Duck was not widely circulated,

479
00:26:18,880 --> 00:26:21,080
Speaker 2: and it wasn't the household name that I had hoped

480
00:26:21,119 --> 00:26:29,639
Speaker 2: it would be in the States. Regardless, Idiot has had

481
00:26:29,680 --> 00:26:32,000
Speaker 2: a long career here in the US. He became a

482
00:26:32,080 --> 00:26:35,200
Speaker 2: professor at Dartmouth and is now retired, but in Latin

483
00:26:35,240 --> 00:26:38,000
Speaker 2: America he's still mostly known for his thoughts on the Duck.

484
00:26:38,240 --> 00:26:40,800
Speaker 6: Now in Latin America, this book became a classic, and

485
00:26:40,920 --> 00:26:43,119
Speaker 6: we sold a million copies, and it was published I

486
00:26:43,119 --> 00:26:46,720
Speaker 6: don't know, like twenty thirty languages around the world. So

487
00:26:47,240 --> 00:26:50,240
Speaker 6: our Duck has grown, But I must say that Disney's

488
00:26:50,280 --> 00:26:52,200
Speaker 6: Duck has grown even more than ours has.

489
00:26:53,880 --> 00:26:57,800
Speaker 2: After four decades, Idia has finally found a publisher in

490
00:26:57,920 --> 00:27:01,119
Speaker 2: the US who is willing to publish How to Read Donald.

491
00:27:00,920 --> 00:27:12,760
Speaker 1: Dutt producer Antonia Sarehido. So at this point we've heard

492
00:27:12,800 --> 00:27:16,480
Speaker 1: about Latin America's relationship to Disney from the nineteen forties

493
00:27:16,600 --> 00:27:20,399
Speaker 1: up to the nineteen seventies. But a lot has happened

494
00:27:20,440 --> 00:27:23,800
Speaker 1: within the Disney Company since the nineteen seventies. In fact,

495
00:27:23,840 --> 00:27:27,880
Speaker 1: the studio helm by Walt Disney himself is a very

496
00:27:28,080 --> 00:27:31,560
Speaker 1: different place than the Disney of today that's releasing the

497
00:27:31,600 --> 00:27:36,080
Speaker 1: film Goco, and so in order to understand how Disney

498
00:27:36,200 --> 00:27:40,560
Speaker 1: has evolved and shifted, I spoke to Aisha Harris. Aisha

499
00:27:40,640 --> 00:27:43,720
Speaker 1: is a writer and she hosts the podcast represent for

500
00:27:43,960 --> 00:27:48,000
Speaker 1: Slate dot com. She also wrote the article Moana makes

501
00:27:48,040 --> 00:27:52,960
Speaker 1: it official Disney has entered a progressive, inclusive third Golden Age.

502
00:27:53,359 --> 00:27:55,719
Speaker 1: Aisha Harris, Welcome to Lettino USA.

503
00:27:56,200 --> 00:27:57,040
Speaker 4: Thank you for having me.

504
00:27:57,080 --> 00:28:00,639
Speaker 1: I'm excited. So, Aisha, you are an expert on diversity

505
00:28:00,720 --> 00:28:04,680
Speaker 1: in Disney, this kind of very specific thing. Yes, and

506
00:28:04,800 --> 00:28:07,960
Speaker 1: you've actually you've broken it down to begin with these

507
00:28:08,119 --> 00:28:11,920
Speaker 1: kind of three different golden ages of Disney. So break

508
00:28:12,000 --> 00:28:14,720
Speaker 1: down these three golden ages.

509
00:28:15,119 --> 00:28:15,840
Speaker 6: Well, you have the.

510
00:28:15,880 --> 00:28:19,400
Speaker 4: First Golden Age, which is the beginning of Disney, really

511
00:28:19,480 --> 00:28:21,520
Speaker 4: the beginning of the Disney brand as we know it today.

512
00:28:21,600 --> 00:28:25,560
Speaker 4: You have Walt Disney creating these stories based off of

513
00:28:26,000 --> 00:28:28,800
Speaker 4: fairy tales. And you have snow White, which is the

514
00:28:28,920 --> 00:28:32,040
Speaker 4: very first feature length animated film to be released, and

515
00:28:32,200 --> 00:28:34,120
Speaker 4: that period continued for a little while for a few

516
00:28:34,200 --> 00:28:36,560
Speaker 4: years after that, but there's sort of a break once

517
00:28:36,760 --> 00:28:39,480
Speaker 4: World War Two hit. It was a period that was

518
00:28:39,720 --> 00:28:44,720
Speaker 4: very white. Okay, So we had a second period, which

519
00:28:44,920 --> 00:28:48,520
Speaker 4: was the sort of renaissance period. That renaissance started right

520
00:28:48,600 --> 00:28:53,000
Speaker 4: around Little Mermaid in nineteen eighty nine and went into

521
00:28:53,240 --> 00:28:55,760
Speaker 4: the mid nineties. You have a Little Mermaid, Aladdin beating

522
00:28:55,880 --> 00:28:59,280
Speaker 4: the Beast Lion King. And one of the things that

523
00:28:59,440 --> 00:29:01,400
Speaker 4: is the marker of that period is that you see

524
00:29:02,120 --> 00:29:06,720
Speaker 4: the Disney brand sort of pivoting into bigger music holes

525
00:29:07,240 --> 00:29:10,600
Speaker 4: and taking cues from Broadway. And in this third period

526
00:29:10,680 --> 00:29:13,520
Speaker 4: they're innovating in other ways, and those ways are mainly

527
00:29:13,960 --> 00:29:17,600
Speaker 4: i think in terms of its progressive politics. It starts

528
00:29:17,760 --> 00:29:20,440
Speaker 4: around the time of The Princess and the Frog, in

529
00:29:20,520 --> 00:29:24,880
Speaker 4: which we have the very first black Disney princess, and

530
00:29:25,480 --> 00:29:28,320
Speaker 4: more recently they're digging even harder into it. You have

531
00:29:28,760 --> 00:29:32,880
Speaker 4: frozen these two princesses and their relationship being not about

532
00:29:33,120 --> 00:29:36,520
Speaker 4: men but building this sisterly bond, and that sisterly bond

533
00:29:36,680 --> 00:29:39,160
Speaker 4: is not something you really ever saw in Disney movies,

534
00:29:39,200 --> 00:29:40,760
Speaker 4: and that was its own progression.

535
00:29:41,040 --> 00:29:44,240
Speaker 1: Give us kind of like the process where Disney says,

536
00:29:44,640 --> 00:29:47,160
Speaker 1: you know what, we understand now that it's not about

537
00:29:48,200 --> 00:29:51,480
Speaker 1: white princesses with blonde hair being saved by the man.

538
00:29:52,120 --> 00:29:53,080
Speaker 1: So how did they get there?

539
00:29:53,200 --> 00:29:56,440
Speaker 4: I think that they were realizing that people were looking

540
00:29:56,520 --> 00:30:00,400
Speaker 4: for something new. I don't want to discount the Obama effect.

541
00:30:00,440 --> 00:30:03,080
Speaker 4: I think to some extent that had a huge impact

542
00:30:03,280 --> 00:30:08,240
Speaker 4: on the way America saw itself and the desire to

543
00:30:09,240 --> 00:30:12,320
Speaker 4: see more diversity. You have all these people who are

544
00:30:12,320 --> 00:30:15,640
Speaker 4: start for representation and they finally get some that is

545
00:30:16,280 --> 00:30:20,760
Speaker 4: actually not terrible. Then you see your box office, you

546
00:30:20,760 --> 00:30:23,840
Speaker 4: see your returns do really well, and then from there,

547
00:30:24,200 --> 00:30:26,960
Speaker 4: like Hollywood is in Disney, they're naturally they want to

548
00:30:27,000 --> 00:30:30,800
Speaker 4: repeat themselves, and so they're trying to I think the

549
00:30:30,880 --> 00:30:32,400
Speaker 4: cynical way to look at it as they're ticking off

550
00:30:32,400 --> 00:30:35,240
Speaker 4: all their boxes one by one with each new film.

551
00:30:35,480 --> 00:30:39,160
Speaker 1: So you're talking about the content that Disney is putting out,

552
00:30:39,320 --> 00:30:42,200
Speaker 1: but what about the history of who's actually making that content.

553
00:30:42,600 --> 00:30:44,480
Speaker 1: I mean, we know that there was a black animator

554
00:30:44,640 --> 00:30:47,800
Speaker 1: Disney his name is Floyd Norman in the nineteen fifties,

555
00:30:48,240 --> 00:30:50,840
Speaker 1: but have there been other poc animators.

556
00:30:50,440 --> 00:30:53,040
Speaker 4: Floyd Norman I actually interviewed on my podcast because a

557
00:30:53,240 --> 00:30:57,520
Speaker 4: very interesting documentary was made about his life, and before

558
00:30:57,600 --> 00:30:59,840
Speaker 4: that documentary, I had not even known he was there,

559
00:31:00,360 --> 00:31:01,920
Speaker 4: who he was. I didn't know that there was a

560
00:31:01,960 --> 00:31:04,760
Speaker 4: black animator as far back as when Sleeping Beauty was

561
00:31:04,800 --> 00:31:07,520
Speaker 4: being made. That was very surprised, I think dizzy. Now

562
00:31:07,640 --> 00:31:12,240
Speaker 4: they are very much being open for their benefit. They're

563
00:31:12,400 --> 00:31:16,480
Speaker 4: having more inclusivity on the consulting side and telling these stories.

564
00:31:16,600 --> 00:31:19,240
Speaker 4: But the fact that he was there, and I think

565
00:31:19,280 --> 00:31:21,280
Speaker 4: most people didn't know that there was a black animator

566
00:31:21,360 --> 00:31:25,800
Speaker 4: there as far back as the fifties is kind of ridiculous.

567
00:31:26,440 --> 00:31:28,480
Speaker 4: And then there was also a Tyro song. He actually

568
00:31:28,520 --> 00:31:30,800
Speaker 4: passed away at the age of I think one hundred

569
00:31:30,880 --> 00:31:33,800
Speaker 4: and one, one hundred and two last year. He was

570
00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:37,040
Speaker 4: a animator on Bambi and is largely credited as being

571
00:31:37,200 --> 00:31:39,520
Speaker 4: like the voice behind Bambi. He is the one who

572
00:31:39,720 --> 00:31:43,640
Speaker 4: created the animation style that they use, and that style

573
00:31:43,680 --> 00:31:46,480
Speaker 4: has been praised for ever since it came out. It's

574
00:31:46,520 --> 00:31:49,720
Speaker 4: considered like a classic animation style. But he didn't really

575
00:31:49,760 --> 00:31:51,920
Speaker 4: get the property credit for that movie.

576
00:31:51,720 --> 00:31:55,080
Speaker 1: At the time. Aisha Harris, thank you so much for

577
00:31:55,200 --> 00:31:56,440
Speaker 1: joining us. I'm lating the USA.

578
00:31:56,800 --> 00:31:57,120
Speaker 4: Thank you.

579
00:32:01,400 --> 00:32:04,520
Speaker 1: Coming up on Latino Usay we hear from the filmmakers

580
00:32:04,560 --> 00:32:48,400
Speaker 1: behind Goco. Stay with us notes. Hey, here's the rest

581
00:32:48,560 --> 00:32:51,880
Speaker 1: of our podcast. The film Goco is about a boy

582
00:32:52,000 --> 00:32:55,360
Speaker 1: named Miguel who wants to be a musician, but his

583
00:32:55,600 --> 00:32:59,880
Speaker 1: family disapproves. I know, I'm not supposed to love music,

584
00:33:00,120 --> 00:33:03,640
Speaker 1: long nize. So Miguel runs away from his family and

585
00:33:03,800 --> 00:33:07,560
Speaker 1: he finds himself in the Land of the Day. Welcome

586
00:33:07,680 --> 00:33:10,400
Speaker 1: to the Land of the Day Now. Goco has a

587
00:33:10,480 --> 00:33:12,880
Speaker 1: lot of the themes and trappings that are pretty commonly

588
00:33:12,960 --> 00:33:16,400
Speaker 1: found in Disney films, But Goco's different in that, since

589
00:33:16,480 --> 00:33:19,200
Speaker 1: it's set in Mexico, it's filled with a lot of

590
00:33:19,400 --> 00:33:24,760
Speaker 1: Mexican art and very specific Mexican references. There are flying,

591
00:33:25,120 --> 00:33:30,240
Speaker 1: colorful ale briques everywhere. The characters insert Spanish expressions like

592
00:33:30,640 --> 00:33:34,960
Speaker 1: no matchus, and they're voiced by beloved Mexican actors like

593
00:33:35,080 --> 00:33:39,480
Speaker 1: Gayel Garcia Bernal. So how exactly did Pixar no to

594
00:33:39,640 --> 00:33:44,040
Speaker 1: include all of these very minute details. Well, the answer

595
00:33:44,160 --> 00:33:47,120
Speaker 1: is they didn't know, so they hired consultants to make

596
00:33:47,200 --> 00:33:49,760
Speaker 1: sure that they would get it right. And one of

597
00:33:49,800 --> 00:33:53,760
Speaker 1: these Consultants is cartoonist la loore Garas. Now Lalo is

598
00:33:53,760 --> 00:33:57,240
Speaker 1: a friend of Latino USA, and Lalo is also someone

599
00:33:57,280 --> 00:34:00,959
Speaker 1: who has come after Disney several times with his cartoons

600
00:34:01,120 --> 00:34:05,240
Speaker 1: and also on Twitter. So how exactly did Lalo Algarez

601
00:34:05,320 --> 00:34:09,080
Speaker 1: go from being a very big Disney critic to now

602
00:34:09,200 --> 00:34:12,680
Speaker 1: being a Disney insider. Well, it all started back in

603
00:34:12,880 --> 00:34:17,399
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety four when the majority of California voted yes

604
00:34:17,680 --> 00:34:21,480
Speaker 1: on something known as Proposition one eighty seven, which denied

605
00:34:21,600 --> 00:34:26,480
Speaker 1: basic public benefits to undocumented immigrants. Now, the Republican governor

606
00:34:26,520 --> 00:34:29,280
Speaker 1: at the time who was running for reelection, Pete Wilson,

607
00:34:29,760 --> 00:34:33,080
Speaker 1: was an avid supporter of prop one eighty seven. So

608
00:34:33,520 --> 00:34:36,840
Speaker 1: Lallo decided to make a statement of his own directed

609
00:34:36,880 --> 00:34:40,120
Speaker 1: at one very particular and formidable foe.

610
00:34:41,760 --> 00:34:45,279
Speaker 7: The Disney Company had donated money to Pete Wilson, who

611
00:34:45,360 --> 00:34:48,840
Speaker 7: was anti Mexican immigrant, when at the time Disney was

612
00:34:49,280 --> 00:34:52,959
Speaker 7: dubbing their movies into Spanish and really promoting them into

613
00:34:53,120 --> 00:34:56,360
Speaker 7: the Latino community. So I just thought that that was

614
00:34:56,440 --> 00:34:59,920
Speaker 7: a little uh ironic and funny, and I spoofed it.

615
00:35:01,239 --> 00:35:05,400
Speaker 7: I drew Mickey Mouse in a Border patrolman uniform in

616
00:35:05,440 --> 00:35:08,960
Speaker 7: front of a wall. He's happily pointing you back across

617
00:35:09,040 --> 00:35:12,200
Speaker 7: the border. And that cartoon went viral before there was

618
00:35:12,239 --> 00:35:19,239
Speaker 7: the internet, you know, it just went everywhere and it

619
00:35:19,320 --> 00:35:21,680
Speaker 7: was used in marches and people would redraw it and

620
00:35:22,239 --> 00:35:32,720
Speaker 7: build paper mache masks of it. And then in twenty thirteen,

621
00:35:33,600 --> 00:35:36,759
Speaker 7: the Disney Company tried to trademark the term the Other

622
00:35:36,840 --> 00:35:40,120
Speaker 7: Those Mortos or Day of the Dead because they're working

623
00:35:40,440 --> 00:35:42,960
Speaker 7: on a movie which I didn't know was a Pixar

624
00:35:43,080 --> 00:35:45,399
Speaker 7: movie with the theme being the Day of the Dead

625
00:35:45,440 --> 00:35:48,920
Speaker 7: or the Other Those Mortos. But when the Chicano community

626
00:35:49,000 --> 00:35:54,040
Speaker 7: found out, all their collective heads exploded, including mine. Some

627
00:35:54,320 --> 00:35:58,440
Speaker 7: startup petition against the move, and I drew a cartoon.

628
00:35:59,080 --> 00:36:02,840
Speaker 7: My cartoon, Mortal Mouse is a giant galla vera monster

629
00:36:03,000 --> 00:36:07,000
Speaker 7: sized mouse rampaging through the streets, coming to trademark Yorkupura

630
00:36:07,360 --> 00:36:10,520
Speaker 7: is the catchwort. So by the third day, Disney had

631
00:36:10,600 --> 00:36:14,719
Speaker 7: withdrawn the trademark because of all the bad press, and

632
00:36:15,040 --> 00:36:18,920
Speaker 7: they recently acknowledged that it was a mistake and kind

633
00:36:18,960 --> 00:36:24,640
Speaker 7: of apologize for it. So migram Mouse, Mortal Mouse. I'm

634
00:36:24,640 --> 00:36:27,080
Speaker 7: pretty much done with the mouse. I think I've milked

635
00:36:27,120 --> 00:36:34,040
Speaker 7: that mouse. People at Disney would have copies of my

636
00:36:34,280 --> 00:36:37,440
Speaker 7: Migram mouse in their offices because everybody loves to tweak

637
00:36:37,680 --> 00:36:42,000
Speaker 7: the big mouse, you know. So what happened was my

638
00:36:42,120 --> 00:36:45,920
Speaker 7: now colleague contacted me and asked if I would want

639
00:36:45,960 --> 00:36:49,360
Speaker 7: to meet with the producer of the film Coco to

640
00:36:49,480 --> 00:36:53,040
Speaker 7: talk about possibly working with them on the film. And

641
00:36:53,200 --> 00:36:56,160
Speaker 7: I said, yes, of course. In Hollywood, I mean, my

642
00:36:56,560 --> 00:37:01,160
Speaker 7: philosophy is take every meeting because you never know, they

643
00:37:01,200 --> 00:37:05,200
Speaker 7: seem to be very you know, ready to listen to

644
00:37:05,680 --> 00:37:09,600
Speaker 7: people from the community and get feedback, including the hiring

645
00:37:09,719 --> 00:37:14,200
Speaker 7: of consultants to make sure that they do the movie right.

646
00:37:14,880 --> 00:37:17,320
Speaker 7: So I talked to them, and I asked them a

647
00:37:17,360 --> 00:37:21,120
Speaker 7: bunch of questions. I interviewed them, and they reassured me

648
00:37:21,600 --> 00:37:26,520
Speaker 7: with their answers, and so they offered me a consulting gig.

649
00:37:34,200 --> 00:37:38,440
Speaker 7: So then when people found out, the response was overwhelmingly

650
00:37:38,760 --> 00:37:42,560
Speaker 7: positive from the community, and it was almost the biggest

651
00:37:42,600 --> 00:37:45,239
Speaker 7: thing that I had ever announced. I mean, just so

652
00:37:45,360 --> 00:37:48,840
Speaker 7: many people shared it and congratulated me. But there was

653
00:37:48,920 --> 00:37:52,160
Speaker 7: a group of people that chided me and called me

654
00:37:52,280 --> 00:37:55,880
Speaker 7: names for daring to work with the mouse, you know.

655
00:37:56,080 --> 00:37:59,160
Speaker 7: But my philosophy is, you know, they're going to make

656
00:37:59,200 --> 00:38:03,480
Speaker 7: the movie anyway, So if they're offering to get my input,

657
00:38:03,760 --> 00:38:06,719
Speaker 7: you know, one of the biggest critics of Disney, I'm

658
00:38:06,800 --> 00:38:11,799
Speaker 7: happy to help. They are a giant corporation that takes

659
00:38:11,880 --> 00:38:14,040
Speaker 7: up a lot of oxygen. So I mean, there's always

660
00:38:14,120 --> 00:38:17,880
Speaker 7: going to be problems with any big cultural force like that.

661
00:38:19,160 --> 00:38:29,520
Speaker 1: Laalol Caraz cartoonist and a consultant Encore. Just like the

662
00:38:29,640 --> 00:38:33,080
Speaker 1: movie Saludos Amigos, which we talked about earlier in the show.

663
00:38:33,560 --> 00:38:37,040
Speaker 1: Goco first premiered in Latin America, and this is something

664
00:38:37,120 --> 00:38:41,080
Speaker 1: I asked co director of the Coco film, Adrian Molina,

665
00:38:41,239 --> 00:38:41,680
Speaker 1: all about.

666
00:38:42,440 --> 00:38:45,759
Speaker 9: It's kind of a strange experiment. We wanted to have

667
00:38:45,920 --> 00:38:48,880
Speaker 9: this policy of, you know, think of Mexico first. We

668
00:38:49,000 --> 00:38:52,239
Speaker 9: really wanted in Mexico to have it release, you know,

669
00:38:52,400 --> 00:38:55,320
Speaker 9: in time for the celebration in Mexico, because the people

670
00:38:55,600 --> 00:38:58,200
Speaker 9: know the traditions and they'll be with their families and

671
00:38:58,360 --> 00:39:00,760
Speaker 9: for them to be able to experience them in conjunction

672
00:39:00,960 --> 00:39:04,800
Speaker 9: with the actual celebration felt like it was culturally appropriate

673
00:39:04,880 --> 00:39:07,360
Speaker 9: and it was a thank you for all of the

674
00:39:07,800 --> 00:39:11,000
Speaker 9: warm and the opening of the doors that we experienced

675
00:39:11,040 --> 00:39:12,279
Speaker 9: as we were creating this film.

676
00:39:12,360 --> 00:39:15,120
Speaker 8: I had many many people coming up to me, and

677
00:39:15,320 --> 00:39:18,120
Speaker 8: Adrian had people coming up to him wanting to hug

678
00:39:18,200 --> 00:39:21,719
Speaker 8: us after the screenings, genuinely appreciative of what we had done.

679
00:39:22,000 --> 00:39:24,400
Speaker 1: Lee Unkrich, the director of the film, who's known for

680
00:39:24,560 --> 00:39:28,520
Speaker 1: other popular Pixar movies like Toy Story three and Finding Dory,

681
00:39:29,280 --> 00:39:31,240
Speaker 1: was also at the premiere.

682
00:39:31,120 --> 00:39:35,760
Speaker 8: And they were really happy that a company like Pixar

683
00:39:35,800 --> 00:39:38,239
Speaker 8: would tell a story like that. I get emotional just

684
00:39:39,000 --> 00:39:41,319
Speaker 8: thinking about that, because I spent a lot of time

685
00:39:41,400 --> 00:39:45,440
Speaker 8: making the film worried that the Latino community and that

686
00:39:46,280 --> 00:39:50,279
Speaker 8: people of Mexico would not accept this film and would

687
00:39:50,280 --> 00:39:52,319
Speaker 8: see it as something made by outsiders.

688
00:39:52,680 --> 00:39:56,279
Speaker 1: Lee is not Mexican and he's not Latino, but he

689
00:39:56,400 --> 00:40:00,120
Speaker 1: wanted to make this movie as authentic as possible. Oh,

690
00:40:00,920 --> 00:40:04,560
Speaker 1: just like Walt Disney did decades ago. Lee gathered up

691
00:40:04,600 --> 00:40:06,280
Speaker 1: his crew and went to Mexico.

692
00:40:10,080 --> 00:40:14,560
Speaker 8: I really wanted to embed ourselves, me and my crew

693
00:40:14,600 --> 00:40:17,960
Speaker 8: who was traveling with me, with families in Mexico. So

694
00:40:18,120 --> 00:40:21,600
Speaker 8: we went to sometimes some very rural areas out outside

695
00:40:21,640 --> 00:40:24,520
Speaker 8: Wahaka and other parts of the country, and we would

696
00:40:24,560 --> 00:40:28,160
Speaker 8: just spend entire days living with families, having them feed us,

697
00:40:28,880 --> 00:40:32,040
Speaker 8: having them share their traditions of Dia ede muertos, and

698
00:40:32,440 --> 00:40:35,680
Speaker 8: in some cases we visited families that had livelihoods that

699
00:40:35,719 --> 00:40:37,279
Speaker 8: were similar to what we were trying to do in

700
00:40:37,360 --> 00:40:39,360
Speaker 8: the movie. You know, we have a family in the movie.

701
00:40:39,719 --> 00:40:42,440
Speaker 8: Our main character, Miguel, is a twelve year old boy

702
00:40:42,560 --> 00:40:45,560
Speaker 8: leaving in a family of shoemakers. So we did visit

703
00:40:45,600 --> 00:40:48,840
Speaker 8: some shoemakers, and we visited families that had many other trades,

704
00:40:48,880 --> 00:40:53,600
Speaker 8: making ala rejes, making mescal, making papelle picado mole and

705
00:40:53,640 --> 00:40:55,560
Speaker 8: we would just spend time with them. And as we

706
00:40:55,640 --> 00:40:57,719
Speaker 8: spend time with them, I tried to really watch the

707
00:40:57,840 --> 00:40:59,640
Speaker 8: dynamics going on within the families.

708
00:41:00,040 --> 00:41:02,759
Speaker 1: So you started thinking about this six years ago, how

709
00:41:02,800 --> 00:41:05,120
Speaker 1: did that happen? Where you were like, I want to

710
00:41:05,200 --> 00:41:06,719
Speaker 1: do a story about the day of the dad.

711
00:41:07,400 --> 00:41:11,359
Speaker 8: Basically, yes, I had long been interested in Dia damuertos

712
00:41:11,400 --> 00:41:14,000
Speaker 8: as an outsider, and I was introduced to it the

713
00:41:14,080 --> 00:41:17,960
Speaker 8: way many non Latinos are through the through the artwork,

714
00:41:18,360 --> 00:41:22,400
Speaker 8: and I wanted to learn more. So I started to

715
00:41:23,200 --> 00:41:26,160
Speaker 8: research and do a lot of investigation. We started to

716
00:41:26,200 --> 00:41:30,840
Speaker 8: bring in some different cultural experts on the celebration. You know,

717
00:41:30,960 --> 00:41:33,000
Speaker 8: I was always conscious from the very beginning of this

718
00:41:33,080 --> 00:41:36,879
Speaker 8: project that, you know, I'm not Latino myself. I knew

719
00:41:36,960 --> 00:41:39,719
Speaker 8: that this was going to be a huge responsibility on

720
00:41:39,800 --> 00:41:45,400
Speaker 8: my shoulders to tell this story authentically and respectfully. I mean,

721
00:41:45,480 --> 00:41:48,719
Speaker 8: I just from the very beginning that was paramount. We

722
00:41:48,840 --> 00:41:52,080
Speaker 8: had a lot of Mexicans and Mexican Americans on our crew.

723
00:41:52,680 --> 00:41:54,960
Speaker 8: We also have many other Latino people within the company

724
00:41:55,000 --> 00:41:58,040
Speaker 8: who we regularly brought in to kind of look at

725
00:41:58,080 --> 00:42:00,200
Speaker 8: what we were up to with our storytelling. And there

726
00:42:00,320 --> 00:42:02,279
Speaker 8: was a lot of adjustment along the way as people

727
00:42:02,360 --> 00:42:04,880
Speaker 8: told their own personal stories about their own abuelas and

728
00:42:06,239 --> 00:42:09,320
Speaker 8: people within their family, and that slowly shaped the story

729
00:42:09,520 --> 00:42:12,120
Speaker 8: and slowly brought it to this more truthful place.

730
00:42:17,480 --> 00:42:21,120
Speaker 1: And another major step in making this film credible was

731
00:42:21,200 --> 00:42:24,680
Speaker 1: bringing on Adrian Molina as his co director of the film.

732
00:42:25,000 --> 00:42:27,759
Speaker 8: When I started working on Coco, Adrian really wanted to

733
00:42:27,800 --> 00:42:30,920
Speaker 8: be a part of it, and he came on very early.

734
00:42:31,200 --> 00:42:33,720
Speaker 8: And about midway through the process of making the film,

735
00:42:34,520 --> 00:42:37,960
Speaker 8: we hit some story roadblocks, and one day Adrian came

736
00:42:38,000 --> 00:42:40,560
Speaker 8: to me and he handed me script pages that he

737
00:42:40,600 --> 00:42:42,480
Speaker 8: had written. He had just taken it upon himself to

738
00:42:42,800 --> 00:42:44,160
Speaker 8: work on the screenplay.

739
00:42:43,880 --> 00:42:46,080
Speaker 9: And a lot of that was motivated by the fact

740
00:42:46,120 --> 00:42:49,560
Speaker 9: that I couldn't go home at night and let this

741
00:42:49,760 --> 00:42:54,480
Speaker 9: film not exist. You know, sometimes movies get really far

742
00:42:54,680 --> 00:42:57,440
Speaker 9: and then they don't happen, and on this film, I

743
00:42:57,640 --> 00:43:00,200
Speaker 9: wanted so badly for it to happen, and.

744
00:43:00,320 --> 00:43:04,080
Speaker 8: So I read his pages and they were incredible. I mean,

745
00:43:04,120 --> 00:43:06,759
Speaker 8: there were as good as any professional screenwriter that I

746
00:43:06,920 --> 00:43:09,560
Speaker 8: had worked with in the past, and so we gave

747
00:43:09,640 --> 00:43:12,840
Speaker 8: him the role of screenwriter. He took over screenwriting and

748
00:43:13,440 --> 00:43:15,600
Speaker 8: held that position all the way till we finished the film.

749
00:43:16,040 --> 00:43:18,279
Speaker 8: It had become so invaluable to me that I asked

750
00:43:18,360 --> 00:43:21,160
Speaker 8: him to be my co director on the film. The

751
00:43:21,239 --> 00:43:25,320
Speaker 8: fact that he is Latino didn't enter into the decision.

752
00:43:25,480 --> 00:43:28,480
Speaker 8: It was because he's an incredibly talented guy with a

753
00:43:28,520 --> 00:43:30,239
Speaker 8: bright future, and I really wanted him to be a

754
00:43:30,280 --> 00:43:33,040
Speaker 8: part of this film. But the fact that he is

755
00:43:33,200 --> 00:43:38,800
Speaker 8: Mexican American brought an incredible richness to the storytelling, and

756
00:43:39,200 --> 00:43:41,360
Speaker 8: he was able to tap into his own family history

757
00:43:41,520 --> 00:43:44,960
Speaker 8: and in a way that I don't think the film

758
00:43:45,040 --> 00:43:47,400
Speaker 8: never would have gotten to the same place had I

759
00:43:47,520 --> 00:43:49,759
Speaker 8: not been working with a Latino screenwriter.

760
00:43:50,400 --> 00:43:53,880
Speaker 9: So much of the deep core of this family story

761
00:43:54,280 --> 00:43:57,840
Speaker 9: was informed by my own experience, and if there was

762
00:43:57,920 --> 00:44:00,959
Speaker 9: ever a film that played in my strengths, this would

763
00:44:00,960 --> 00:44:01,160
Speaker 9: be it.

764
00:44:01,440 --> 00:44:05,279
Speaker 1: So what's your relationship to indell Doos Mortos. Did you

765
00:44:05,400 --> 00:44:07,880
Speaker 1: grow up kind of celebrating it or knowing about it

766
00:44:08,080 --> 00:44:09,759
Speaker 1: or talking about it or was it something that you

767
00:44:09,880 --> 00:44:12,320
Speaker 1: came to as an older Latino?

768
00:44:13,239 --> 00:44:17,080
Speaker 9: Yeah, it was something that I learned about in high school.

769
00:44:17,360 --> 00:44:20,359
Speaker 9: So my mother is from Hallisco, but it was when

770
00:44:20,360 --> 00:44:22,799
Speaker 9: I was taking Spanish classes because I didn't grow up

771
00:44:22,840 --> 00:44:26,719
Speaker 9: speaking Spanish. I took classes in high school that we

772
00:44:26,760 --> 00:44:30,320
Speaker 9: would get the lessons on different, you know, cultural events.

773
00:44:31,040 --> 00:44:35,920
Speaker 9: But the things that I recognized about the culture surrounding

774
00:44:37,120 --> 00:44:41,440
Speaker 9: death and what your relationship to it is was very

775
00:44:41,520 --> 00:44:44,120
Speaker 9: similar to what I saw Every time when I was

776
00:44:44,160 --> 00:44:47,880
Speaker 9: growing up that someone close to us passed away. We

777
00:44:48,040 --> 00:44:52,360
Speaker 9: would do the funeral, but then it just became laughter

778
00:44:52,680 --> 00:44:57,800
Speaker 9: and stories. Everyone recounted the funny times and the crazy

779
00:44:57,880 --> 00:45:01,440
Speaker 9: things and the quirky things, and and that relationship to

780
00:45:02,520 --> 00:45:06,400
Speaker 9: the idea of someone passing but not passing them surviving

781
00:45:06,600 --> 00:45:09,600
Speaker 9: by the memories we keep of them was something that

782
00:45:09,760 --> 00:45:10,880
Speaker 9: was very intuitive to me.

783
00:45:14,440 --> 00:45:18,000
Speaker 1: In fact, much of that authenticity in this film comes

784
00:45:18,040 --> 00:45:19,960
Speaker 1: from Adrian's personal experiences.

785
00:45:20,280 --> 00:45:25,040
Speaker 9: There's two spots that I know came from my own experiences.

786
00:45:25,760 --> 00:45:30,000
Speaker 9: One of them is this idea of Miguel's blessing and

787
00:45:30,560 --> 00:45:33,600
Speaker 9: that he needs his family's blessing in order to return home.

788
00:45:34,320 --> 00:45:36,719
Speaker 9: But the moment was inspired when I was heading off

789
00:45:36,760 --> 00:45:39,800
Speaker 9: to college to art school, and my parents, after we hugged,

790
00:45:39,880 --> 00:45:43,120
Speaker 9: they said, we want to give you our blessing before

791
00:45:43,160 --> 00:45:46,160
Speaker 9: you head off, And you know, they just said, we

792
00:45:46,719 --> 00:45:49,320
Speaker 9: pray that you know that we love you and that

793
00:45:49,400 --> 00:45:52,360
Speaker 9: we support you, and all the good things that we

794
00:45:52,440 --> 00:45:54,480
Speaker 9: could wish for you come your way. I didn't know

795
00:45:55,080 --> 00:45:57,040
Speaker 9: that that was a feeling that could mean so much

796
00:45:57,120 --> 00:46:00,680
Speaker 9: until it happened to hear your parents say we love

797
00:46:00,760 --> 00:46:04,200
Speaker 9: you and we support you, and whatever you do in

798
00:46:04,320 --> 00:46:07,279
Speaker 9: this life, you go with our blessing. The other one

799
00:46:07,640 --> 00:46:11,280
Speaker 9: is this idea of the final death. You die three deaths.

800
00:46:11,480 --> 00:46:15,000
Speaker 9: One is when your heart stops beating, one is when

801
00:46:15,120 --> 00:46:19,160
Speaker 9: you're interred into the ground, and the last and final

802
00:46:19,239 --> 00:46:21,800
Speaker 9: death is when no one in the living world remembers you.

803
00:46:22,640 --> 00:46:25,360
Speaker 9: And that's perhaps the most sad and you know, ultimate

804
00:46:25,520 --> 00:46:26,040
Speaker 9: of them all.

805
00:46:29,920 --> 00:46:33,640
Speaker 1: So let's talk about the music, because obviously music is

806
00:46:33,760 --> 00:46:37,360
Speaker 1: central to the story of this movie, and was that

807
00:46:37,520 --> 00:46:41,000
Speaker 1: kind of from the beginning. Was that decided very early on?

808
00:46:41,320 --> 00:46:43,719
Speaker 9: You know, Miguel wanted to be a musician and his

809
00:46:43,840 --> 00:46:47,520
Speaker 9: family disapproved. So we knew that earlier than any other

810
00:46:47,640 --> 00:46:49,560
Speaker 9: Pixar film we'd ever made it we would need to

811
00:46:49,600 --> 00:46:50,920
Speaker 9: think of the music.

812
00:46:51,440 --> 00:46:51,560
Speaker 2: You know.

813
00:46:51,640 --> 00:46:55,279
Speaker 9: When I started writing, we had one song that we

814
00:46:55,440 --> 00:46:59,680
Speaker 9: knew was kind of emblematic of so many things in

815
00:46:59,680 --> 00:47:04,800
Speaker 9: the film, and that was remember Me, Remember that had stuck.

816
00:47:04,920 --> 00:47:08,080
Speaker 9: That was something that really was in line with the

817
00:47:08,160 --> 00:47:11,480
Speaker 9: traditions of the celebration and also with the themes of

818
00:47:11,520 --> 00:47:14,279
Speaker 9: our storytelling. And I really wanted to as much as

819
00:47:14,320 --> 00:47:17,280
Speaker 9: we could lean on Mexican musical style.

820
00:47:17,800 --> 00:47:22,239
Speaker 7: Remember no, I have to travel far, remember me.

821
00:47:23,200 --> 00:47:25,000
Speaker 5: Each time you here guitar.

822
00:47:26,160 --> 00:47:28,879
Speaker 1: Now, if after listening to all of this, you're saying

823
00:47:28,960 --> 00:47:32,200
Speaker 1: to yourself, hold on, I think I've seen a movie

824
00:47:32,440 --> 00:47:36,080
Speaker 1: just like this before, well you're not wrong. In fact,

825
00:47:36,280 --> 00:47:40,920
Speaker 1: there was another animated film specifically about Ilia dels Mortos,

826
00:47:41,440 --> 00:47:44,279
Speaker 1: and we asked about that. So a couple of years

827
00:47:44,280 --> 00:47:47,120
Speaker 1: ago we interviewed the directors of the film Book of Life,

828
00:47:47,200 --> 00:47:51,359
Speaker 1: which was the first movie that dealt with the Day

829
00:47:51,400 --> 00:47:54,680
Speaker 1: of the Dead. So were you at all inspired by

830
00:47:54,760 --> 00:47:59,359
Speaker 1: Book of Life? I mean, there are some similarities, there are,

831
00:47:59,480 --> 00:47:59,840
Speaker 1: I'll tell you.

832
00:48:00,160 --> 00:48:03,360
Speaker 8: I'm actually friends now with Jorge Gutierrez, who directed a

833
00:48:03,560 --> 00:48:06,840
Speaker 8: Book of Life, and he's been a huge supporter of

834
00:48:06,960 --> 00:48:07,640
Speaker 8: what we're doing.

835
00:48:09,840 --> 00:48:14,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, so there's no fighting going on, no heart and zero.

836
00:48:14,800 --> 00:48:17,239
Speaker 8: We get along very very well, and we were both

837
00:48:17,280 --> 00:48:18,760
Speaker 8: supportive of each other's projects.

838
00:48:20,239 --> 00:48:20,400
Speaker 6: You know.

839
00:48:20,719 --> 00:48:23,200
Speaker 8: Sometimes there's just something in the water, I guess, and

840
00:48:23,719 --> 00:48:26,200
Speaker 8: two ideas kind of come out in near proximity. I

841
00:48:26,239 --> 00:48:29,759
Speaker 8: think it happened with asteroid movies a few years back.

842
00:48:30,760 --> 00:48:32,600
Speaker 8: At the time that I thought to do this film,

843
00:48:32,760 --> 00:48:35,440
Speaker 8: one of the things that attracted me was that in

844
00:48:35,520 --> 00:48:38,640
Speaker 8: the entire history of cinema, I couldn't think of a

845
00:48:38,760 --> 00:48:42,560
Speaker 8: single film other than an unfinished film by Sergei Eisenstein,

846
00:48:42,719 --> 00:48:46,600
Speaker 8: that had anything to do with Diademertos. So I was

847
00:48:46,719 --> 00:48:49,000
Speaker 8: very excited that I felt we were doing something unique.

848
00:48:49,280 --> 00:48:52,640
Speaker 8: So when I found out that Jorge was making his film,

849
00:48:53,280 --> 00:48:57,640
Speaker 8: my initial thought was one of dismay, I'll admit, because

850
00:48:58,560 --> 00:49:01,600
Speaker 8: I knew that his film coming out before us would

851
00:49:01,600 --> 00:49:06,239
Speaker 8: automatically render us render Coco less original but once I

852
00:49:06,280 --> 00:49:09,759
Speaker 8: got past that, I felt that we were telling a

853
00:49:09,840 --> 00:49:12,520
Speaker 8: good story that was worthy of being in the world,

854
00:49:13,320 --> 00:49:16,560
Speaker 8: and by and large, we were telling two very very

855
00:49:16,600 --> 00:49:20,080
Speaker 8: different stories that happened to both be set against diadem wertos.

856
00:49:25,200 --> 00:49:28,440
Speaker 1: I mean for this film, was it for you, Adrian?

857
00:49:28,600 --> 00:49:31,280
Speaker 1: Was it just about a great story and great visuals?

858
00:49:32,560 --> 00:49:35,520
Speaker 1: Was there something else that you wanted to make happen

859
00:49:35,840 --> 00:49:37,160
Speaker 1: with this particular film.

860
00:49:37,680 --> 00:49:39,840
Speaker 9: I think it's important. I think it's important beyond this

861
00:49:39,920 --> 00:49:42,640
Speaker 9: story that's being told. I think it's important for the

862
00:49:42,800 --> 00:49:47,880
Speaker 9: way in which it represents a culture that is beautiful

863
00:49:47,960 --> 00:49:52,560
Speaker 9: but maybe doesn't always get recognized as such. I think

864
00:49:52,640 --> 00:49:56,840
Speaker 9: it's important because it is a character in Miguel and

865
00:49:56,920 --> 00:50:00,719
Speaker 9: a family in the Riveras that I think have a

866
00:50:00,800 --> 00:50:04,919
Speaker 9: lot to show the world, have a lot to teach

867
00:50:05,040 --> 00:50:08,600
Speaker 9: the world through their experience, and I wanted the world

868
00:50:08,719 --> 00:50:10,440
Speaker 9: to give them a chance. I wanted them to have

869
00:50:10,520 --> 00:50:14,319
Speaker 9: the opportunity to do that. So, yeah, it's your heart

870
00:50:14,360 --> 00:50:15,359
Speaker 9: gets wrapped up in all.

871
00:50:15,320 --> 00:50:21,399
Speaker 1: These things, Adrian Lee. Congratulations on your film and thanks

872
00:50:21,400 --> 00:50:22,400
Speaker 1: so much for speaking with me.

873
00:50:22,760 --> 00:50:24,759
Speaker 8: Well, thank you. I'm so happy that you enjoyed it.

874
00:50:25,120 --> 00:50:26,480
Speaker 9: It's been a pleasure. Thank you. So much.

875
00:50:33,239 --> 00:50:36,440
Speaker 1: Well, to wrap up our entire show about Disney, I've

876
00:50:36,480 --> 00:50:39,080
Speaker 1: got Antonia s Dhiel back in this studio. So, okay,

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Speaker 1: what's the big takeaway?

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Speaker 2: Two things have really stuck out to me now that

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00:50:43,040 --> 00:50:46,320
Speaker 2: the reporting is done. The first is that I was

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00:50:46,360 --> 00:50:49,279
Speaker 2: sort of surprised to realize that Disney used to work

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00:50:49,360 --> 00:50:53,520
Speaker 2: with and even for the US government for decades, and

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00:50:53,880 --> 00:50:56,040
Speaker 2: the Disney Company has very little to do with US

883
00:50:56,239 --> 00:50:58,840
Speaker 2: government institutions today. In fact, it has nothing to do

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00:50:58,920 --> 00:51:02,719
Speaker 2: with US institutions today. And now that there's this sort

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00:51:02,719 --> 00:51:06,640
Speaker 2: of separation, I'm curious whether we could still consider Disney

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00:51:06,800 --> 00:51:09,120
Speaker 2: an American company or whether it should be thought of

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00:51:09,200 --> 00:51:11,359
Speaker 2: as a global company, and what does that mean?

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00:51:11,520 --> 00:51:14,520
Speaker 1: And there's another point, right, And the other thing is.

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00:51:14,600 --> 00:51:18,440
Speaker 2: That Disney, for many kids is the first time they

890
00:51:18,640 --> 00:51:22,600
Speaker 2: encounter any kind of story or narrative, and stories and

891
00:51:22,680 --> 00:51:26,480
Speaker 2: narratives they instill values and morals, and so these films

892
00:51:26,560 --> 00:51:30,120
Speaker 2: are literally shaping people's perspectives. And that's why it's really

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00:51:30,160 --> 00:51:32,600
Speaker 2: important to understand the context and the history of a

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00:51:32,680 --> 00:51:35,520
Speaker 2: company like Disney that's shaping people's lives.

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Speaker 1: Great reporting, Thank you, Antonia, Thank you madam. This episode

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00:51:52,760 --> 00:51:56,120
Speaker 1: was produced by Antonia Sirihido and edited by Marlon Bishop.

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00:51:56,520 --> 00:52:00,880
Speaker 1: The Latino USA team includes Andreal Lopes Crusado, Arta Martinez,

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00:52:01,280 --> 00:52:06,719
Speaker 1: Daisy Contreras, Mike Sargent, Julia Ta Martinelli, Victoria Estrada, Rinaldo, Leanos,

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00:52:06,800 --> 00:52:10,920
Speaker 1: Junior Alejandra Salassar, Patricia Sulbaran and Julia Rocha, with help

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00:52:10,920 --> 00:52:14,600
Speaker 1: from ra Upes. Our editorial director is Julio Ricardo Varela.

901
00:52:14,960 --> 00:52:18,400
Speaker 1: Our director of engineering is Stephanie Lebau. Our senior engineer

902
00:52:18,560 --> 00:52:22,239
Speaker 1: is Julia Caruso. Our associate engineers are Gabriel Abayez and

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00:52:22,320 --> 00:52:25,960
Speaker 1: jj Carubin. Our marketing manager is Luis Luna. Our theme

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00:52:26,040 --> 00:52:29,000
Speaker 1: music was composed by Sanger Robinos. I'm your host and

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00:52:29,080 --> 00:52:32,759
Speaker 1: executive producer Marieo Jsac Guerdayas, and we'll see you on

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00:52:32,840 --> 00:52:34,399
Speaker 1: our next episode. Ciao.

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00:52:37,760 --> 00:52:42,000
Speaker 4: Latino USA is made possible in part by the Ford Foundation,

908
00:52:42,640 --> 00:52:46,600
Speaker 4: working with visionaries on the front lines of social change worldwide,

909
00:52:47,120 --> 00:52:51,120
Speaker 4: the John Dee and Catherine T. MacArthur Foundation, and the

910
00:52:51,239 --> 00:52:56,240
Speaker 4: Heising Simons Foundation unlocking knowledge, opportunity and possibilities.

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Speaker 2: More at hsfoundation dot org.