WEBVTT - TwoPercent_20260709_130_IHEART VERSION

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<v Speaker 1>Welcome to two percent. I'm your host, Michael Easter. Now,

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<v Speaker 1>most human beings will not climb Mount Everest. Most people

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<v Speaker 1>won't even think about attempting that. But our guest today

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<v Speaker 1>he has climb Mount Everest four different times. He also

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<v Speaker 1>managed to climb every single fourteen or in Colorado by

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<v Speaker 1>his eighteenth birthday. He also made a bold attempt at

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<v Speaker 1>K two, which is the most dangerous, risky mountain and

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<v Speaker 1>the hardest mountain on Earth. Our guest today is doctor

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<v Speaker 1>John Kadrowski. He was rolling through Las Vegas, so I

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<v Speaker 1>dragged him in the studio. I wanted to ask him

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<v Speaker 1>about what he's learned about life on these crazy climbs,

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<v Speaker 1>how you can train for the outdoors, and also how

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<v Speaker 1>he thinks about risk in everyday life and how sometimes

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<v Speaker 1>the most risky things we do are also the most rewarding.

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<v Speaker 1>So let's take a quick break and then we'll bring

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<v Speaker 1>in John. All Right, John, welcome to the show. How

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<v Speaker 1>you doing goo ahod man, It's good to have you here.

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<v Speaker 1>Thanks for yeah, thanks for the invite. Okay, here's where

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<v Speaker 1>I want to start. George Mallory temps Everest in nineteen twenties.

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<v Speaker 1>He gets asked why he wanted to climb Everest, and

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<v Speaker 1>he said, because it's there. Now, I think that's total bullshit.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm going to tell you why. I want to hear

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<v Speaker 1>your reaction to it.

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<v Speaker 2>In terms of it being total, total bullshit. Yeah, I mean,

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<v Speaker 2>I think he had a lot of other reasons, right,

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<v Speaker 2>he wanted to be the first. Yeah, I'd say that

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<v Speaker 2>was probably his main motivation. Well, you just at a

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<v Speaker 2>first ascent? Yeah, what is it about being the first?

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<v Speaker 2>It just it feels amazing, because, yeah, you're literally stepping

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<v Speaker 2>somewhere that nobody's ever gone. And for me, that climb

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<v Speaker 2>this past month was, honestly, it felt better than Everest.

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<v Speaker 2>And I've done Everest on seven expeditions over the years,

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<v Speaker 2>but it was just a different feel and also it

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<v Speaker 2>pushed me differently. What mountain was it? It was called

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<v Speaker 2>kick cap Ree two, So it was a mountain on

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<v Speaker 2>the bed Nepal border, about about one hundred and fifty

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<v Speaker 2>miles northwest of Katmandu and just in the middle of nowhere.

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<v Speaker 2>Very hard to get to go over a huge eighteen

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<v Speaker 2>thousand foot pass, hike up a valley where you're seeing

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<v Speaker 2>wild yaks, wild mustangs. There's snow upward tracks that kind

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<v Speaker 2>of thing, and to an area that was really hard

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<v Speaker 2>to get to and then you could see why. But

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<v Speaker 2>all the while was during the Mount Everest season over there,

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<v Speaker 2>and so I thought to myself, Man, this is pretty

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<v Speaker 2>cool because I'm not up, you know, getting stuck behind

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<v Speaker 2>people on a rope somewhere on a mountain where I've

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<v Speaker 2>already climbed it before. So I'd rather be somewhere new

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<v Speaker 2>and different. And I think that's what drives me in

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<v Speaker 2>life sometimes. Yeah, what did How did it hit different?

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<v Speaker 1>When you get up there and you're like, I'm the first,

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<v Speaker 1>I'm probably the first human who's ever met up here.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah? Uh well, first I was like going up and

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<v Speaker 2>I'm climbing up this ridge and I thought, well, shoot,

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<v Speaker 2>what if I get to the top and there's like

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<v Speaker 2>somebody's left something out there, and then I'm not the

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<v Speaker 2>first And I was like, ah, but still, like, we

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<v Speaker 2>haven't seen a person in over five days is to

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<v Speaker 2>even get to this mountain, so I'm pretty sure, Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>pretty sure, we're good. So yeah, it's just a whole different,

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<v Speaker 2>whole different feel, a whole different experience, And I think

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<v Speaker 2>in life that's what I thrive on is new and

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<v Speaker 2>different experiences all the time. It makes my brain work differently.

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<v Speaker 2>I think.

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<v Speaker 1>So my theory on that quote the reason that I

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<v Speaker 1>think it's bs. You probably just needed an answer for

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<v Speaker 1>the journalists who asks. I think people find something inherently

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<v Speaker 1>rewarding about taking on these big challenges. Right, It's not

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<v Speaker 1>just that it's there. There's a lot of things that

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<v Speaker 1>are just there that you could do, but the fact

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<v Speaker 1>that there's he would be the first. He knows it's

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<v Speaker 1>going to be extremely hard. He's going into the unknown

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<v Speaker 1>and he's got to figure it out, and that's going

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<v Speaker 1>to be tough. He knew that that was there was

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<v Speaker 1>something inherently special about that. Do you identify with that?

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<v Speaker 1>Climbing mountains?

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<v Speaker 2>I identify with it a ton for a few reasons. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>I think the biggest one is growth overall. I go

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<v Speaker 2>to these mountains now and some of them I get

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<v Speaker 2>to go to over and over again, and the growth comes.

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<v Speaker 2>And working with others to help them reach their goals.

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<v Speaker 2>But then what I started to take a part, especially

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<v Speaker 2>in the last two years now in my career because

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<v Speaker 2>since COVID so five or six years, I hadn't done

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<v Speaker 2>up until last fall. I hadn't done my own project

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<v Speaker 2>in like five or six years. I've read some books,

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<v Speaker 2>I've done some like ski projects over the years, some

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<v Speaker 2>you know, climbing, mountaineering and long distance type projects. But

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<v Speaker 2>for about five years after COVID, business for me got

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<v Speaker 2>so good that people were having me take them places.

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<v Speaker 2>And then I think a lot of us get like

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<v Speaker 2>this with our jobs, or our careers or our lives.

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<v Speaker 2>We let the busyness of life get in a way

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<v Speaker 2>and you put things off. And I was kind of

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<v Speaker 2>doing that, honestly. And then I got sort to a

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<v Speaker 2>point about a year and a half ago and I said,

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<v Speaker 2>wait a minute. I stopped myself and I was like, Okay,

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<v Speaker 2>there's this trail in the United States. It runs from

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<v Speaker 2>Canada to Mexico. It's called the Continental Divide Trail through

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<v Speaker 2>five states, Montana, I'd Oh, Wyoming, Colorado, and New Mexico.

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<v Speaker 2>I actually asked a friend of mine who I had

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<v Speaker 2>taken up Everest to go with me, and we went

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<v Speaker 2>and hiked the trail last fall for one hundred days.

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<v Speaker 2>That was my first project that I'd done for me

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<v Speaker 2>since COVID, and that felt good and it was a

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<v Speaker 2>reminder to continue to do things for me and so

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<v Speaker 2>then this year, the first ascent was the choice, and

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<v Speaker 2>then I've got some other things already on the radar

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<v Speaker 2>this year and in the next year. But it just

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<v Speaker 2>reminded me, and I think it's a good reminder for

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<v Speaker 2>people in general, like, stop what you're doing. Your life's

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<v Speaker 2>gonna still be there when you come back, So you

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<v Speaker 2>should pick something that's gonna change you. It's gonna help

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<v Speaker 2>you grow, it's gonna help it's gonna help push you,

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<v Speaker 2>and it might be hard and uncomfortable, but that's good.

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<v Speaker 2>And so I just took a lot from that experience

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<v Speaker 2>last year. It's springboarded me into this year and into

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<v Speaker 2>what I've got planned for the next three to five years.

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<v Speaker 1>Now, do you feel like that when you do the

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<v Speaker 1>thing for yourself that it then makes you better when

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<v Speaker 1>you go back into normal life, like with your work stuff.

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<v Speaker 2>Does it make that does it make you.

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<v Speaker 1>Perform better in that space, or does it make that

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<v Speaker 1>more rewarding or there's a question there.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Yeah, I think I think that that experience on

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<v Speaker 2>the CDT because like it was kind of awesome to like,

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<v Speaker 2>for three ish months. Yeah, I had a little bit

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<v Speaker 2>of internet off and on, but then sometimes there were

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<v Speaker 2>days where we're backpacking had nothing. Yeah, and so that's

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<v Speaker 2>a good unplug I also realized when I was out there,

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<v Speaker 2>I was like, yeah, it's okay, Like take this time

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<v Speaker 2>for yourself because you know what life is going to

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<v Speaker 2>be there when I get back, and so yeah, then

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<v Speaker 2>it makes you appreciate life more. And then when you

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<v Speaker 2>get back to it, yeah, I haven't felt burnt out

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<v Speaker 2>at all. In fact, I feel more energized, which sounds crazy,

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<v Speaker 2>and that's kind of in line with what I think

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<v Speaker 2>we'll probably delve into for me as my Everest Ready philosophy,

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<v Speaker 2>and that's you know, we'll talk more about what that entails.

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<v Speaker 2>But flipping the switch on the mindset is something that

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<v Speaker 2>these hard adventures do for me. So when I come back,

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<v Speaker 2>even this trip to A Paul, I was gone for

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<v Speaker 2>six weeks. I got home and last night my family's like,

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<v Speaker 2>are you tired, Like what's going on? And I'm like, actually, no,

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<v Speaker 2>I'm more energized. I'm more recharged. And people think I'm crazy,

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<v Speaker 2>but it's the truth. Yeah, that's awesome.

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<v Speaker 1>So before we get into the everest Ready mindset, I

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<v Speaker 1>think we needed two yet your experience on Everest. You've

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<v Speaker 1>climbed Everest how many times?

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<v Speaker 2>So? I've been on seven expeditions over the years, haven't

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<v Speaker 2>summitted on all of them because of various things that

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<v Speaker 2>have occurred right and challenges. But at least the three

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<v Speaker 2>clients that I've taken to the top twenty nineteen, twenty

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<v Speaker 2>twenty one, and twenty twenty four, I've all summitted, And

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<v Speaker 2>in my last summit was in twenty twenty four. So yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>And then there were some years in there where I

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<v Speaker 2>didn't summit because of an earthquake, one year you can't climb,

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<v Speaker 2>and then in two seasons. One of the seasons we

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<v Speaker 2>put some people up on a summit and I stayed

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<v Speaker 2>in Camp two on the radio. I didn't want to

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<v Speaker 2>compromise the fact that I had gotten like a chest

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<v Speaker 2>infection and stuff, and we had sure bus and team

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<v Speaker 2>members to help our clients, so I stayed in a

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<v Speaker 2>camp that I could be of assistance. And then I

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<v Speaker 2>tried one year without supplemental oxygen and turned around near

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<v Speaker 2>the summit, trying to sort of test myself but being conservative.

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<v Speaker 2>So sometimes I regret turning around, but at the same

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<v Speaker 2>time I knew it was in the moment, it was

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<v Speaker 2>the right choice. I was on the north side in

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<v Speaker 2>Tibet in twenty eighteen and was within an hour and

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<v Speaker 2>a half or two, but it was too early in

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<v Speaker 2>the morning and too windy, and there were a few

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<v Speaker 2>people on what's called the third step, and it was

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<v Speaker 2>just too cold and too windy in my opinion, and

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<v Speaker 2>I made the split second decisions to go down. And

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<v Speaker 2>I learned a lot from that experience. And I think

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<v Speaker 2>at some point, even though like the competitor and me,

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<v Speaker 2>will probably try to go back and finish the job,

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<v Speaker 2>so to speak. So we'll see. But yeah, Everest has

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<v Speaker 2>been has done a lot for me in seven expeditions

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<v Speaker 2>over the years. What Dunie to Evers in the first place.

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<v Speaker 2>I grew up in Vail, Colorado, So I as like

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<v Speaker 2>an eight year old kid. My parents took me up

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<v Speaker 2>mounted the Holy Cross, which is near Vale. And when

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<v Speaker 2>you're on top of that mountain and you learn in

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<v Speaker 2>elementary school with the highest mountain in the world, is

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<v Speaker 2>you kind of have something cangible? And so yeah, I

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<v Speaker 2>was like as an eight year old kid, I knew

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<v Speaker 2>I wanted to try to climb into the mountain and

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<v Speaker 2>learned as much as I could about it, and eventually

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<v Speaker 2>it led me there. Yeah, So ever's ready mindset? Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>tell us about that? Well, it's I think it goes

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<v Speaker 2>a few different directions, but it's mainly just taking at

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<v Speaker 2>a basic level. I could get off the couch, or

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<v Speaker 2>I could leave from this room and go climb Everest

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<v Speaker 2>on a whim, no problem, because I've created a lifestyle

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<v Speaker 2>that's lend itself to being ready at any given moment

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<v Speaker 2>for that sort of pursuit. Maybe you're constantly active, yeah, yeah, yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>and so but what also it means is it exemplifies

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<v Speaker 2>in life how, Yeah, there may be tough challenges that

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<v Speaker 2>we face, there may be tasks that we might not

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<v Speaker 2>necessarily want to do. For many people on this earth,

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<v Speaker 2>we're never at the end of our development as a person,

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<v Speaker 2>and at times there's going to be huge roadblocks, challenges,

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<v Speaker 2>things that we don't want to do that we have

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<v Speaker 2>to face them, And how is our attitude towards facing

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<v Speaker 2>them as well to get through those tough times.

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<v Speaker 1>So it's like, if your mind, if your body in

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<v Speaker 1>your mind, are ready for Everest actual Everest at any moment.

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<v Speaker 1>It's kind of like when the sort of bs of

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<v Speaker 1>life pops up, problems happened, You're like, well, I'm ready

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<v Speaker 1>for this. The literally the world's tallest mountain. I can

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<v Speaker 1>probably figure this out.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and don't sweat the small stuff, but like learn

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<v Speaker 2>how to flip the switch towards things that are really

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<v Speaker 2>really scary, hard, inconvenient, and if you seek god discomfort,

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<v Speaker 2>you're going to find that at the end of the day,

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<v Speaker 2>what's so bad about it? What's so hard about it?

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<v Speaker 2>So I kind of all those things are sort of

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<v Speaker 2>packaged into what this framework means to me, and what

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<v Speaker 2>I want to share with others is that they can

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<v Speaker 2>face their challenges head on if they have the right

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<v Speaker 2>attitude and perspective.

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<v Speaker 1>Is what is your climbing on ever taught you about

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<v Speaker 1>not sweating small stuff?

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<v Speaker 2>Mainly like you come home after being there sometimes and

0:11:17.679 --> 0:11:21.679
<v Speaker 2>it's yeah, it's cold, it's scary. There's like the crevasses

0:11:21.720 --> 0:11:24.400
<v Speaker 2>can be crazy going through these ladders. That's the biggest thing.

0:11:24.440 --> 0:11:29.439
<v Speaker 2>People see the crowds, which the media sensationalizes. The summits

0:11:29.440 --> 0:11:31.480
<v Speaker 2>I've had have actually been we wait and we go

0:11:31.559 --> 0:11:33.720
<v Speaker 2>later in the season when the weather is better and

0:11:34.280 --> 0:11:37.160
<v Speaker 2>less people, so we kind of avoid that as well.

0:11:38.200 --> 0:11:40.560
<v Speaker 2>But yeah, it's just taking taking on any sort of

0:11:41.040 --> 0:11:44.880
<v Speaker 2>challenge in life. And for me, like like even coming

0:11:44.920 --> 0:11:47.920
<v Speaker 2>home and driving driving over here today after flying to

0:11:48.000 --> 0:11:50.240
<v Speaker 2>Vegas and like someone cuts me off on the highway,

0:11:50.280 --> 0:11:52.960
<v Speaker 2>I'm like, well that's fine. Yeah, it doesn't bother me.

0:11:53.000 --> 0:11:56.599
<v Speaker 2>Actually a lot of things that should bother me don't anymore. Yeah,

0:11:56.679 --> 0:11:59.240
<v Speaker 2>through various experiences that I've had in the mountains that

0:11:59.280 --> 0:11:59.920
<v Speaker 2>have changed me.

0:12:00.200 --> 0:12:04.000
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it just puts it puts things in perspective more

0:12:04.120 --> 0:12:07.400
<v Speaker 1>or less. I've definitely experienced that with if I like

0:12:07.400 --> 0:12:09.000
<v Speaker 1>to say, like when I got back from the Arctic,

0:12:09.960 --> 0:12:13.200
<v Speaker 1>I was up there for like a month, and my

0:12:13.320 --> 0:12:16.520
<v Speaker 1>wife Leah said, like, nothing really stresses you out anymore.

0:12:17.559 --> 0:12:18.559
<v Speaker 2>I was like, yeah, that's.

0:12:18.400 --> 0:12:21.319
<v Speaker 1>Because up there, like there were actual problems of oh

0:12:21.360 --> 0:12:23.080
<v Speaker 1>we need water and we got a hike forever to

0:12:23.120 --> 0:12:26.240
<v Speaker 1>get it, or there's grizzly bears, or there's some crazy storm.

0:12:26.800 --> 0:12:29.720
<v Speaker 1>And so then when I come home and you know,

0:12:29.760 --> 0:12:32.720
<v Speaker 1>the HOA has dinged me with a violation for not

0:12:32.800 --> 0:12:35.880
<v Speaker 1>pulling a weed, I'm just like, whatever I might have

0:12:35.920 --> 0:12:38.240
<v Speaker 1>been those sons of bitches, I'm going to show the

0:12:38.520 --> 0:12:40.600
<v Speaker 1>ho way and start a revolution.

0:12:41.120 --> 0:12:41.360
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

0:12:42.320 --> 0:12:44.560
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I definitely hear you on that. So when you

0:12:44.640 --> 0:12:46.760
<v Speaker 1>talk to people, because you talk to a lot of

0:12:46.760 --> 0:12:50.240
<v Speaker 1>groups about this, how do you find people are applying

0:12:50.880 --> 0:12:53.400
<v Speaker 1>evers mindset and using it being evers ready.

0:12:53.679 --> 0:12:56.359
<v Speaker 2>I think a lot of it comes with the challenges

0:12:56.440 --> 0:13:00.800
<v Speaker 2>within the corporate structure sometimes, you know, and even like, uh,

0:13:01.240 --> 0:13:03.640
<v Speaker 2>if I do a keynote speech. Sometimes at events we

0:13:03.760 --> 0:13:07.360
<v Speaker 2>do connection walks and hikes so people can actually actively

0:13:07.400 --> 0:13:11.040
<v Speaker 2>get out and hike and walk together and discuss in

0:13:11.120 --> 0:13:13.840
<v Speaker 2>a group. And we find that by getting people outdoors

0:13:14.400 --> 0:13:18.040
<v Speaker 2>they're willing to open up more just a basic sense,

0:13:19.280 --> 0:13:23.440
<v Speaker 2>but yeah, applying some of the frameworks there of being

0:13:23.480 --> 0:13:29.000
<v Speaker 2>ever ready allows people to be more vulnerable even sometimes

0:13:29.679 --> 0:13:32.199
<v Speaker 2>and uh and and open up on the basic level.

0:13:32.480 --> 0:13:37.040
<v Speaker 1>I do feel like that the walking outside together is

0:13:37.160 --> 0:13:40.360
<v Speaker 1>powerful and there is research that shows when people are

0:13:40.400 --> 0:13:44.000
<v Speaker 1>walking side by side outdoors, they tend to have conversations

0:13:44.040 --> 0:13:48.720
<v Speaker 1>where they definitely connect deeper. And especially in a corporate structure,

0:13:49.320 --> 0:13:51.240
<v Speaker 1>everyone's kind of on guard. You don't want to say

0:13:51.280 --> 0:13:53.480
<v Speaker 1>the wrong thing, like what am I doing the.

0:13:53.520 --> 0:13:56.319
<v Speaker 2>Right to get rid of surface level stuff? Yeah, you realize, hey,

0:13:56.640 --> 0:13:59.040
<v Speaker 2>it's it's it's okay, and hey, we're out here too

0:13:59.160 --> 0:14:01.360
<v Speaker 2>and know, and then one of the events they did

0:14:01.360 --> 0:14:04.679
<v Speaker 2>in Arizona in April, saw this huge snake and then

0:14:04.800 --> 0:14:07.120
<v Speaker 2>like after that, it's like all of a sudden, the

0:14:07.160 --> 0:14:10.560
<v Speaker 2>conversations people start opening up, even after just seeing that,

0:14:10.880 --> 0:14:13.440
<v Speaker 2>like the snake go across the trail and you know,

0:14:13.559 --> 0:14:15.520
<v Speaker 2>so like got people it's just kind of going.

0:14:15.800 --> 0:14:19.560
<v Speaker 1>Adding some element of risk almost makes people bond more. Yeah,

0:14:19.680 --> 0:14:21.240
<v Speaker 1>have you found out what the people you climb with?

0:14:21.760 --> 0:14:27.440
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, for sure, and trusting the process and then yeah,

0:14:27.680 --> 0:14:30.520
<v Speaker 2>on some of these trips, you know, especially like on

0:14:30.560 --> 0:14:33.720
<v Speaker 2>the seven Summits. For me, I've had so many summits

0:14:33.760 --> 0:14:36.520
<v Speaker 2>over the years and success, so when I'm there, people

0:14:36.560 --> 0:14:39.840
<v Speaker 2>trust me. But sometimes in the early going of a trip,

0:14:39.880 --> 0:14:42.720
<v Speaker 2>if something goes wrong, or if it's too windy or

0:14:42.720 --> 0:14:46.080
<v Speaker 2>the weather's too bad and people have doubts, then it's

0:14:46.120 --> 0:14:50.120
<v Speaker 2>really interesting to see people's character too. Yeah, And I

0:14:50.200 --> 0:14:54.480
<v Speaker 2>love what expeditions do to people with patients, right, because

0:14:55.040 --> 0:14:59.080
<v Speaker 2>we're so insta gratification now society, whether it's like phone

0:14:59.120 --> 0:15:02.440
<v Speaker 2>in our hand, something needs to load immediately, and when

0:15:02.480 --> 0:15:05.080
<v Speaker 2>you're out on an expedition, and first of all, just

0:15:05.120 --> 0:15:07.880
<v Speaker 2>put your devices away, but second of all, Okay, this

0:15:08.000 --> 0:15:11.160
<v Speaker 2>summit might not be a week away, two weeks away,

0:15:11.240 --> 0:15:14.120
<v Speaker 2>a month away, And how do people handle that and

0:15:14.480 --> 0:15:16.800
<v Speaker 2>bring card games out of bring like you know, all

0:15:16.880 --> 0:15:18.960
<v Speaker 2>kinds of stuff. We're playing Jenga in the dining tent,

0:15:19.080 --> 0:15:22.320
<v Speaker 2>like we just do different things and then also get

0:15:22.320 --> 0:15:25.520
<v Speaker 2>people just to have some patience. And it's amazing, like

0:15:25.880 --> 0:15:28.240
<v Speaker 2>how some people don't deal with that very well and

0:15:28.320 --> 0:15:30.720
<v Speaker 2>some people do. Do they get better over time or

0:15:30.760 --> 0:15:33.400
<v Speaker 2>does it just get worse? It just really just depends

0:15:33.440 --> 0:15:34.000
<v Speaker 2>on the person.

0:15:34.400 --> 0:15:36.960
<v Speaker 1>What do you think separates the people who understand, Okay,

0:15:37.000 --> 0:15:38.880
<v Speaker 1>this is a month away, this is what I've bought into,

0:15:38.920 --> 0:15:39.880
<v Speaker 1>this is what it's going to take.

0:15:39.960 --> 0:15:42.000
<v Speaker 2>We can't rush this because if we try and rush it,

0:15:42.000 --> 0:15:44.400
<v Speaker 2>we're going to die. Yeah, we're blasted or we're not

0:15:44.440 --> 0:15:47.400
<v Speaker 2>acclimatized yet, right. There so many little things that can

0:15:47.440 --> 0:15:50.160
<v Speaker 2>go into it. Yeah, I think it depends on the person.

0:15:50.240 --> 0:15:53.360
<v Speaker 2>The people that have maybe had to persevere something as

0:15:53.440 --> 0:15:55.880
<v Speaker 2>as simple as something in their career or sports related

0:15:56.480 --> 0:15:59.840
<v Speaker 2>are often do the best. And the people that need

0:15:59.880 --> 0:16:02.000
<v Speaker 2>to be too wired or have to have Wi Fi

0:16:02.160 --> 0:16:05.560
<v Speaker 2>like that could be a problem. Sometimes it's pretty pretty crazy.

0:16:05.600 --> 0:16:07.680
<v Speaker 1>What conversations do you have with them? Is that you

0:16:07.800 --> 0:16:08.960
<v Speaker 1>being like you need to chill out?

0:16:09.080 --> 0:16:12.120
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, try to, Yeah, but it's try to interact to

0:16:12.200 --> 0:16:14.280
<v Speaker 2>try to get them to do something else or like

0:16:14.360 --> 0:16:16.080
<v Speaker 2>even if it's like hey, let's go out of the

0:16:16.200 --> 0:16:18.760
<v Speaker 2>base camp and go for a side hike or you know,

0:16:19.000 --> 0:16:22.800
<v Speaker 2>try to occupy them. Yeah, I've become a professional time waster,

0:16:23.600 --> 0:16:25.120
<v Speaker 2>so to speak. Awesome.

0:16:26.600 --> 0:16:29.320
<v Speaker 1>You're like, you're kind of like a scout camp leader. Yeah,

0:16:29.480 --> 0:16:31.760
<v Speaker 1>kids are getting restless. You're like, hey, guys, let's go

0:16:31.760 --> 0:16:34.480
<v Speaker 1>out and look for error ads. Yeah, we're going to

0:16:34.560 --> 0:16:34.920
<v Speaker 1>find some.

0:16:35.720 --> 0:16:38.040
<v Speaker 2>But the good things that we've added over the years

0:16:38.080 --> 0:16:40.560
<v Speaker 2>to a lot of these trips are like yeah, just

0:16:40.600 --> 0:16:43.480
<v Speaker 2>trying to trying to make them even try to bring

0:16:43.480 --> 0:16:46.840
<v Speaker 2>the comfort out there. So you know, a chef in

0:16:46.880 --> 0:16:50.200
<v Speaker 2>the base camp cooking good meals, a massage therapist, a

0:16:50.280 --> 0:16:54.120
<v Speaker 2>yoga instructor, like things that you know some people might

0:16:54.160 --> 0:16:56.800
<v Speaker 2>have at home, bring you got to bring it out there,

0:16:56.920 --> 0:17:00.240
<v Speaker 2>and then it's and then it makes the experience it's

0:17:00.280 --> 0:17:01.480
<v Speaker 2>not quite as bad.

0:17:01.720 --> 0:17:06.400
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, totally. And I think there's a people can kind

0:17:06.400 --> 0:17:09.000
<v Speaker 1>of have this thing like, oh, you had you had

0:17:09.000 --> 0:17:10.919
<v Speaker 1>all these comforts out there, what do you do that

0:17:11.080 --> 0:17:15.720
<v Speaker 1>like nullifies it. Right when I did the Haydu Trail

0:17:15.840 --> 0:17:19.119
<v Speaker 1>last year, our thinking was, this thing is already so

0:17:19.320 --> 0:17:22.200
<v Speaker 1>damn hard. Why are we not going to take advantage

0:17:22.359 --> 0:17:26.000
<v Speaker 1>of things like the softer mattress and carry that. Why

0:17:26.000 --> 0:17:28.440
<v Speaker 1>are we going to just like try to make this

0:17:28.600 --> 0:17:30.520
<v Speaker 1>any harder than it already is. Like, that's just going

0:17:30.560 --> 0:17:32.119
<v Speaker 1>to lead us to fail. It's like, what can we

0:17:32.160 --> 0:17:35.320
<v Speaker 1>do that'll improve our odds of making it? And whether

0:17:35.359 --> 0:17:38.440
<v Speaker 1>that's a chef, whether that's you know, in our case,

0:17:38.520 --> 0:17:41.480
<v Speaker 1>like we're going to carry the slightly heavier mattress, We're

0:17:41.520 --> 0:17:43.560
<v Speaker 1>going to make sure we do a down day every

0:17:43.600 --> 0:17:44.639
<v Speaker 1>seven days or whatever.

0:17:44.680 --> 0:17:46.800
<v Speaker 2>It is, like that allows.

0:17:46.480 --> 0:17:48.000
<v Speaker 1>You to complete the whole thing, because the whole thing

0:17:48.040 --> 0:17:50.080
<v Speaker 1>is going to be hard as hell, and if you're

0:17:50.119 --> 0:17:53.040
<v Speaker 1>trying to just go too far and make it almost

0:17:53.040 --> 0:17:57.240
<v Speaker 1>austere for the sake of that, that can just totally backfire.

0:17:57.440 --> 0:17:59.199
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, And like that's what Mike and I do on

0:17:59.200 --> 0:18:01.760
<v Speaker 2>the continent of the Vibe Trail last summer too. You know,

0:18:02.640 --> 0:18:05.199
<v Speaker 2>going into it, it was like, hey, okay, there are

0:18:05.240 --> 0:18:10.439
<v Speaker 2>people that come out and start in June or you know,

0:18:10.440 --> 0:18:12.679
<v Speaker 2>if they're going north. We went north to south or

0:18:12.680 --> 0:18:14.479
<v Speaker 2>people go south to north on the trail and they

0:18:14.480 --> 0:18:16.560
<v Speaker 2>start in April or May and they're out there for

0:18:16.600 --> 0:18:19.240
<v Speaker 2>one hundred and fifty days, which is like five months.

0:18:19.680 --> 0:18:21.520
<v Speaker 2>And when we were looking at that, we both kind

0:18:21.520 --> 0:18:24.560
<v Speaker 2>of liked said, well, Okay, I'm busy leading expeditions and

0:18:24.640 --> 0:18:28.760
<v Speaker 2>trips and living my life. You're busy with your concerts

0:18:28.800 --> 0:18:32.520
<v Speaker 2>and playing music and pursuing that. Do we both really

0:18:32.520 --> 0:18:36.080
<v Speaker 2>want to be away for five months? And the answer

0:18:36.119 --> 0:18:37.680
<v Speaker 2>that was no. And it was like, well, okay, is

0:18:37.720 --> 0:18:39.280
<v Speaker 2>there way to shorten that? Yes, you have to do

0:18:39.320 --> 0:18:41.760
<v Speaker 2>more miles. Okay, is there a way to surround some

0:18:41.800 --> 0:18:45.440
<v Speaker 2>of our favorite friends and family with that experience? Yeah, okay,

0:18:45.520 --> 0:18:48.280
<v Speaker 2>let's get it. Let's get it sponsored. Let's get an RV,

0:18:49.080 --> 0:18:50.720
<v Speaker 2>and then we're going to have we're going to slot

0:18:50.760 --> 0:18:54.679
<v Speaker 2>in people our best friends and family as crew at

0:18:54.720 --> 0:18:57.639
<v Speaker 2>two or three people at a time, for cooking meals,

0:18:57.640 --> 0:19:00.280
<v Speaker 2>picking us up from trail heads, dropping us off this

0:19:00.359 --> 0:19:02.560
<v Speaker 2>massive spreadsheet, which was a lot of work, but once

0:19:02.600 --> 0:19:05.639
<v Speaker 2>we had it rolling, it shortened the trip by two months,

0:19:06.160 --> 0:19:08.159
<v Speaker 2>and then we still we enjoyed the heck out of

0:19:08.200 --> 0:19:10.480
<v Speaker 2>it because we had airstream sponsor us and we had

0:19:10.480 --> 0:19:12.960
<v Speaker 2>some other companies pitch in, and then we were able

0:19:12.960 --> 0:19:15.439
<v Speaker 2>to kind of do it glamping style, and then we

0:19:15.480 --> 0:19:17.440
<v Speaker 2>started to learn as we did research of the trail,

0:19:17.480 --> 0:19:20.439
<v Speaker 2>I was like, well, I'd say maybe twenty to thirty

0:19:20.440 --> 0:19:22.760
<v Speaker 2>of the days we still had to backpack, but the

0:19:22.800 --> 0:19:26.760
<v Speaker 2>other sixty to seventy days, it was Okay, here's a

0:19:26.920 --> 0:19:30.160
<v Speaker 2>highway forty and here's highway thirty, and we have a

0:19:30.200 --> 0:19:32.200
<v Speaker 2>twenty eight mile a day from road to road. Okay,

0:19:32.200 --> 0:19:34.119
<v Speaker 2>can we do that with a running best? Sure? And

0:19:34.160 --> 0:19:37.320
<v Speaker 2>we did some big days and it was inspiring and motivating,

0:19:37.320 --> 0:19:39.240
<v Speaker 2>and some people with other friends would come and hike

0:19:39.320 --> 0:19:41.720
<v Speaker 2>with us, and so we were able to create sort

0:19:41.760 --> 0:19:43.680
<v Speaker 2>of more of a community feel with it with our

0:19:43.800 --> 0:19:47.120
<v Speaker 2>closest friends and family, as opposed to what we also

0:19:47.200 --> 0:19:49.480
<v Speaker 2>found out there. We met some great people on the trail,

0:19:49.520 --> 0:19:52.320
<v Speaker 2>but they did it the hard way, admittedly, where they

0:19:52.359 --> 0:19:55.159
<v Speaker 2>just took their backpacks, carried all their food and supplies

0:19:55.320 --> 0:19:57.600
<v Speaker 2>solid the whole trip. They would have to hitchhike into

0:19:57.640 --> 0:20:01.640
<v Speaker 2>towns and resupply and that just took them a long time.

0:20:01.680 --> 0:20:03.479
<v Speaker 2>And a lot of these people were pretty frail at

0:20:03.520 --> 0:20:05.679
<v Speaker 2>the end, and we were being well fed, you know,

0:20:05.760 --> 0:20:07.359
<v Speaker 2>and I was. I'm not going to apologize for that

0:20:07.400 --> 0:20:09.280
<v Speaker 2>because we dialed it up that way, but that was

0:20:09.280 --> 0:20:10.840
<v Speaker 2>sort of the purpose of it. And then we ended

0:20:10.880 --> 0:20:12.800
<v Speaker 2>up finding out we had so much fun doing it

0:20:12.920 --> 0:20:16.360
<v Speaker 2>versus suffering, and so we turned the challenge of yeah

0:20:16.359 --> 0:20:18.800
<v Speaker 2>it was hard to into more like fun too.

0:20:19.080 --> 0:20:21.119
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I'm sure there are there were hard times, but

0:20:21.160 --> 0:20:23.360
<v Speaker 1>you're also able to pull this other level of like.

0:20:24.280 --> 0:20:26.280
<v Speaker 2>I think there was a lot less type three fun.

0:20:26.359 --> 0:20:28.480
<v Speaker 2>There was more Type one and type two fun in there.

0:20:28.640 --> 0:20:31.200
<v Speaker 2>You know, let's go, it's good, got it. Life is

0:20:31.240 --> 0:20:33.000
<v Speaker 2>all about balance, Yeah, exactly.

0:20:34.080 --> 0:20:37.080
<v Speaker 1>So you is it right that you climbed every fourteen

0:20:37.160 --> 0:20:38.800
<v Speaker 1>or in Colorado before you were eighteen?

0:20:39.119 --> 0:20:42.440
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so I grew up doing all the mountains because

0:20:42.480 --> 0:20:43.960
<v Speaker 2>I'm out of my back door. When I got my

0:20:44.040 --> 0:20:46.080
<v Speaker 2>learner's permit as a fifteen year old kid, I would

0:20:46.160 --> 0:20:49.800
<v Speaker 2>drive to trailheads, and back then there were only some

0:20:50.000 --> 0:20:52.800
<v Speaker 2>trails on these fourteen ers, and you get above tree line.

0:20:52.840 --> 0:20:54.720
<v Speaker 2>On most of them, there was no trail. So that

0:20:55.000 --> 0:20:57.560
<v Speaker 2>goes back to like this essence of expiration. You's got

0:20:57.600 --> 0:20:59.640
<v Speaker 2>to figure it out. I loved, Yeah, figure it out.

0:20:59.760 --> 0:21:02.200
<v Speaker 2>And yeah, and then as a skier, I always wanted

0:21:02.200 --> 0:21:04.159
<v Speaker 2>to ski them. So I also went back and skied

0:21:04.200 --> 0:21:07.200
<v Speaker 2>down all their coloraud of fourteen ers, and then obviously

0:21:07.200 --> 0:21:09.560
<v Speaker 2>did that other project called Sleeping on the Summits, which

0:21:09.600 --> 0:21:12.119
<v Speaker 2>was one of my books, which was camping up on

0:21:12.160 --> 0:21:15.520
<v Speaker 2>the tops of all these mountains to enjoy the view,

0:21:15.560 --> 0:21:19.040
<v Speaker 2>the sunset, sunrise photos and then acclimate my body for

0:21:19.119 --> 0:21:23.760
<v Speaker 2>bigger challenges. And yeah, all this fourteener stuff just led

0:21:23.800 --> 0:21:26.200
<v Speaker 2>me into wanting to do the mountains all over the world.

0:21:26.480 --> 0:21:31.960
<v Speaker 2>What was the most dangerous one to ski for fourteen ers? Yeah,

0:21:32.280 --> 0:21:35.800
<v Speaker 2>Capital is pretty difficult, Pyramids pretty difficult. They're both in

0:21:35.800 --> 0:21:39.960
<v Speaker 2>their aspen steep. They're just really steep. They have no

0:21:40.040 --> 0:21:44.040
<v Speaker 2>fall zones on them, and like a good thing that

0:21:44.160 --> 0:21:46.760
<v Speaker 2>Like when I did that project, I had skied most

0:21:46.800 --> 0:21:48.640
<v Speaker 2>of the fourteen ers over the years, and I went

0:21:48.680 --> 0:21:50.920
<v Speaker 2>back and tried to attempt them all in the same

0:21:51.000 --> 0:21:54.040
<v Speaker 2>year in twenty sixteen, which is now ten years ago.

0:21:54.119 --> 0:21:58.040
<v Speaker 2>But when I compare that winter to what we just

0:21:58.119 --> 0:22:00.480
<v Speaker 2>had for a winter this winter, would have not been

0:22:00.520 --> 0:22:03.040
<v Speaker 2>possible really to ski most of them because too much

0:22:03.200 --> 0:22:07.040
<v Speaker 2>ice to to lack of snow. Yeah, I mean, just

0:22:07.080 --> 0:22:10.280
<v Speaker 2>not enough coverage not enough. The winter was so poor

0:22:10.600 --> 0:22:13.720
<v Speaker 2>in Colorado, so pretty lucky that that year was a

0:22:13.760 --> 0:22:17.720
<v Speaker 2>really big winter snow wise to be able to ski

0:22:17.800 --> 0:22:19.439
<v Speaker 2>down all the peaks.

0:22:19.560 --> 0:22:21.160
<v Speaker 1>We're going to take a quick break and then John

0:22:21.240 --> 0:22:23.320
<v Speaker 1>is going to tell us what he learned sleeping at

0:22:23.320 --> 0:22:25.560
<v Speaker 1>the peak of every single fourteen or in Colorado.

0:22:32.840 --> 0:22:36.080
<v Speaker 2>What'd you learn from sleeping on the peaks? What I

0:22:36.160 --> 0:22:38.600
<v Speaker 2>learned from sleeping on the peaks was I did the

0:22:38.640 --> 0:22:41.680
<v Speaker 2>sleeping on the summits before the full ski project, even

0:22:41.720 --> 0:22:43.600
<v Speaker 2>though I had skied a lot of the fourteen ers

0:22:43.600 --> 0:22:46.200
<v Speaker 2>when I was younger, because that was one thing that

0:22:46.320 --> 0:22:49.159
<v Speaker 2>was lost in the translation of the twenty sixteen. I

0:22:49.200 --> 0:22:51.800
<v Speaker 2>went and attempted all of them and was able to

0:22:51.800 --> 0:22:54.400
<v Speaker 2>summit all of them. And then there was controversy whether

0:22:54.440 --> 0:22:56.840
<v Speaker 2>it's not I skied down certain ones, and I was like,

0:22:56.880 --> 0:23:00.199
<v Speaker 2>well no, because it was too rocky. Still, I had

0:23:00.240 --> 0:23:02.479
<v Speaker 2>to repel something, and it was, you know, not complete

0:23:02.560 --> 0:23:04.919
<v Speaker 2>ski descents on a couple of them, but almost all

0:23:04.920 --> 0:23:07.000
<v Speaker 2>of them. Is still skied down, all of them. But

0:23:07.280 --> 0:23:09.040
<v Speaker 2>I guess what I'm saying about that project was a

0:23:09.080 --> 0:23:11.400
<v Speaker 2>lot of people are like, oh, well, how's he doing

0:23:11.400 --> 0:23:13.879
<v Speaker 2>this so fast? Like this guy's never skied all these

0:23:13.920 --> 0:23:16.040
<v Speaker 2>mountains before. I was like, well, actually, I'd already skied

0:23:16.080 --> 0:23:19.160
<v Speaker 2>most of them prior to that, and that was because,

0:23:19.560 --> 0:23:22.720
<v Speaker 2>you know, I was grew up a skier. But then

0:23:22.760 --> 0:23:26.199
<v Speaker 2>the fourteen Ers Sleeping project was four years before that,

0:23:27.000 --> 0:23:30.800
<v Speaker 2>and so I had taken all this data right from Okay, well,

0:23:30.840 --> 0:23:33.080
<v Speaker 2>people ask me questions about like when I spent the

0:23:33.160 --> 0:23:35.639
<v Speaker 2>night on all the fourteen Ers, Well, what did you

0:23:35.680 --> 0:23:37.639
<v Speaker 2>do when you're up there? Well, as a skier, I

0:23:37.680 --> 0:23:39.840
<v Speaker 2>actually dialed in like if I were to come back

0:23:39.840 --> 0:23:41.760
<v Speaker 2>and ski all these how would I ski them? And

0:23:42.240 --> 0:23:44.640
<v Speaker 2>you studied you know, you're sitting up there for hours, right,

0:23:44.760 --> 0:23:47.200
<v Speaker 2>So yeah, I was shooting photos, but you can only

0:23:47.200 --> 0:23:49.639
<v Speaker 2>shoot so many pictures at sunrise and sunset if you're

0:23:49.720 --> 0:23:52.600
<v Speaker 2>up there for two or three hours. Besides, you know,

0:23:53.680 --> 0:23:57.199
<v Speaker 2>drinking water and nutrition sitting around You're like, okay, well

0:23:57.240 --> 0:23:59.240
<v Speaker 2>it'd be really cool to go off this face, Right'd

0:23:59.280 --> 0:24:01.560
<v Speaker 2>be really cool to go that face. So studying the

0:24:01.600 --> 0:24:04.520
<v Speaker 2>geography of the peaks too, and that aided me four

0:24:04.600 --> 0:24:07.080
<v Speaker 2>years later and to be able to put together a

0:24:07.080 --> 0:24:10.000
<v Speaker 2>project that was about four or five months in the

0:24:10.000 --> 0:24:12.840
<v Speaker 2>making of skiing all the fourteen ers in one season.

0:24:13.359 --> 0:24:14.280
<v Speaker 2>This is kind of pivoting.

0:24:14.800 --> 0:24:19.359
<v Speaker 1>Why do you think the outdoor world there's so much like,

0:24:20.480 --> 0:24:23.359
<v Speaker 1>for lack of a better term, like a pissing contest.

0:24:23.160 --> 0:24:27.159
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, like competitiveness, chess put I feel like it's unique.

0:24:27.880 --> 0:24:31.800
<v Speaker 2>There's unlike, it's unlike anything I've ever seen to my attention,

0:24:32.000 --> 0:24:34.240
<v Speaker 2>more in the last like ten years, especially with more

0:24:34.280 --> 0:24:38.080
<v Speaker 2>social media, because my projects were built on this sort

0:24:38.080 --> 0:24:41.600
<v Speaker 2>of go out test myself progression. And I've always thought

0:24:41.640 --> 0:24:45.320
<v Speaker 2>the outdoors were for you to create your own project, right,

0:24:45.920 --> 0:24:49.960
<v Speaker 2>And the reason for me doing these things is that like, yeah,

0:24:49.960 --> 0:24:52.840
<v Speaker 2>I mean, I just love being out there and it's like, well,

0:24:53.080 --> 0:24:55.359
<v Speaker 2>is this possible? Is this possible? It's just like a

0:24:55.400 --> 0:24:59.639
<v Speaker 2>cur genuine curiosity for the outdoors, not a measuring stick.

0:25:00.320 --> 0:25:02.840
<v Speaker 2>And the thing with the outdoors is the conditions changed

0:25:02.840 --> 0:25:05.920
<v Speaker 2>so much too so when people try to let's say

0:25:05.960 --> 0:25:10.160
<v Speaker 2>the guys that do FKTs fastest known times. A good

0:25:10.160 --> 0:25:13.160
<v Speaker 2>example is even this year on Everest, Tyler Andrews did

0:25:13.200 --> 0:25:16.720
<v Speaker 2>his fastest known time up the mountain with oxygen and

0:25:16.840 --> 0:25:21.600
<v Speaker 2>he bested a Sherpa from ten or fifteen years prior

0:25:22.160 --> 0:25:25.000
<v Speaker 2>by about an hour. But my argument even with that,

0:25:25.240 --> 0:25:28.239
<v Speaker 2>is that for both of those guys, because I've been

0:25:28.240 --> 0:25:30.120
<v Speaker 2>in the Ice Fall so many times, well, what if

0:25:30.320 --> 0:25:31.920
<v Speaker 2>the year that the other guy did at the ice

0:25:31.960 --> 0:25:34.080
<v Speaker 2>Fall had more turns in it because of the way

0:25:34.160 --> 0:25:37.080
<v Speaker 2>that the trail gets created. So for that kind of record,

0:25:37.080 --> 0:25:40.120
<v Speaker 2>I don't really see the point. I mean, yeah, you're

0:25:40.160 --> 0:25:43.159
<v Speaker 2>fast going up at great But like, and as similar

0:25:43.160 --> 0:25:46.080
<v Speaker 2>to some of the projects I've done over the years,

0:25:46.160 --> 0:25:48.280
<v Speaker 2>at times, if it's come out in the community that

0:25:48.320 --> 0:25:51.160
<v Speaker 2>I've done something, there's always haters, right, There's always somebody

0:25:51.160 --> 0:25:52.879
<v Speaker 2>that comes down and like, oh, well he didn't do

0:25:52.920 --> 0:25:54.320
<v Speaker 2>this one or he didn't see that peak, And I

0:25:54.400 --> 0:25:56.320
<v Speaker 2>was like, yeah, but I wasn't trying to compare myself

0:25:56.359 --> 0:25:58.720
<v Speaker 2>to others. I was just trying to test myself and

0:25:58.760 --> 0:26:01.080
<v Speaker 2>to see what is possible in that season and to

0:26:01.119 --> 0:26:03.000
<v Speaker 2>have fun. And I'm like, I think you guys are

0:26:03.000 --> 0:26:05.840
<v Speaker 2>all getting lost and like the fact that I'm just

0:26:05.840 --> 0:26:08.199
<v Speaker 2>out having fun and I want to encourage other people

0:26:08.280 --> 0:26:10.960
<v Speaker 2>to go out and do their own adventures so that

0:26:11.080 --> 0:26:15.400
<v Speaker 2>it goes back to this idea of like growth and

0:26:15.520 --> 0:26:18.480
<v Speaker 2>enjoyment and fulfillment and things that we all should seek.

0:26:18.640 --> 0:26:21.440
<v Speaker 2>So yeah, so that's kind of been my purpose in

0:26:21.480 --> 0:26:25.120
<v Speaker 2>the outdoors, and that's changed with my why now too. Right,

0:26:25.240 --> 0:26:27.920
<v Speaker 2>So over the years I would do my own projects.

0:26:28.160 --> 0:26:30.560
<v Speaker 2>I kind of got away from that because my why

0:26:30.720 --> 0:26:34.879
<v Speaker 2>also shifted for Mount Everaricet or for the Seventh Summits.

0:26:35.080 --> 0:26:36.960
<v Speaker 2>I don't really go back to the Seven Summits on

0:26:36.960 --> 0:26:41.160
<v Speaker 2>my own anymore. It's okay, what client has the same

0:26:41.240 --> 0:26:44.440
<v Speaker 2>values as me? Are they seeking out to potentially change

0:26:44.440 --> 0:26:47.800
<v Speaker 2>their life or to work towards something? And those are

0:26:47.880 --> 0:26:49.920
<v Speaker 2>usually the people that I gravitate towards.

0:26:50.200 --> 0:26:53.240
<v Speaker 1>What qualities do you think people who make it to

0:26:53.280 --> 0:26:55.760
<v Speaker 1>the top half you mentioned patients? Is there other things

0:26:55.760 --> 0:26:57.600
<v Speaker 1>that you see pop up like these are the sort

0:26:57.640 --> 0:26:59.800
<v Speaker 1>of skill set you need beyond just you need being shared?

0:27:00.480 --> 0:27:05.440
<v Speaker 2>But yeah, it's the It's the patience mainly obviously perseverance

0:27:05.520 --> 0:27:11.560
<v Speaker 2>and the willing to kind of up their level of

0:27:12.320 --> 0:27:17.280
<v Speaker 2>whatever it is, attention, endurance, facing their fears. Mike Posner

0:27:17.280 --> 0:27:19.520
<v Speaker 2>and Devin Levec in particular in twenty twenty one and

0:27:19.560 --> 0:27:23.960
<v Speaker 2>twenty twenty four, both great guys, both distinctly different in

0:27:24.000 --> 0:27:28.000
<v Speaker 2>the mount on the mountain with their approach both authentic

0:27:28.080 --> 0:27:30.600
<v Speaker 2>though and great people to work with, but you know,

0:27:31.080 --> 0:27:34.720
<v Speaker 2>they both had sort of their own whys, and they

0:27:34.720 --> 0:27:38.720
<v Speaker 2>both were successful because they both were willing to put

0:27:38.760 --> 0:27:39.960
<v Speaker 2>in the extra effort too.

0:27:40.480 --> 0:27:43.240
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, you know, I mean putting the extra effort on

0:27:43.240 --> 0:27:45.000
<v Speaker 1>the mountain or in preparation or all.

0:27:45.560 --> 0:27:47.919
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, preparation. And then you could see for both of

0:27:47.920 --> 0:27:51.240
<v Speaker 2>them why their lives are so successful off the mountain,

0:27:52.000 --> 0:27:56.000
<v Speaker 2>you know. And and I just love working with people

0:27:56.040 --> 0:27:58.960
<v Speaker 2>like that. That drives me for sure. Yeah, you know,

0:28:00.280 --> 0:28:03.160
<v Speaker 2>it's a lot of fun. Yeah, We're going to take

0:28:03.160 --> 0:28:03.680
<v Speaker 2>a quick.

0:28:03.480 --> 0:28:04.960
<v Speaker 1>Break, and then John is going to tell us more

0:28:05.000 --> 0:28:07.840
<v Speaker 1>about the Everest Ready mindset and how you can find it.

0:28:15.160 --> 0:28:18.560
<v Speaker 1>What are some of the more harrowing experiences you've had

0:28:18.600 --> 0:28:19.120
<v Speaker 1>on Everest.

0:28:20.000 --> 0:28:24.120
<v Speaker 2>I'd say there's been two or three moments where well,

0:28:24.160 --> 0:28:26.720
<v Speaker 2>the earthquake was probably the biggest one that changed my life.

0:28:26.880 --> 0:28:29.560
<v Speaker 2>What was that like? So in twenty fifteen, I went

0:28:29.640 --> 0:28:35.480
<v Speaker 2>there on my own actually to climb and ski Everston

0:28:35.560 --> 0:28:39.840
<v Speaker 2>Lotzi at the time. And when I went there, I

0:28:40.240 --> 0:28:42.880
<v Speaker 2>barely got to the mountain and this giant seven point

0:28:42.920 --> 0:28:46.720
<v Speaker 2>nine magnitude earthquake happens. We're in base camp. A big

0:28:46.840 --> 0:28:49.240
<v Speaker 2>sonic wave of ice and snow come down from a

0:28:49.320 --> 0:28:52.120
<v Speaker 2>side mountain across from Everest and wipes out the base

0:28:52.160 --> 0:28:54.160
<v Speaker 2>camp and kills twenty people right in front of me.

0:28:54.560 --> 0:28:57.840
<v Speaker 2>Holy crap. And I was above the base camp, like

0:28:58.480 --> 0:29:01.280
<v Speaker 2>my camp was luckily higher up than the main part

0:29:01.320 --> 0:29:03.640
<v Speaker 2>of base camp, so we didn't get hit by the

0:29:03.720 --> 0:29:07.240
<v Speaker 2>last of ice and snow and wind. And when we

0:29:07.320 --> 0:29:10.120
<v Speaker 2>went down into the disaster zone, there was twenty people

0:29:10.160 --> 0:29:15.400
<v Speaker 2>dead and many people injured, and you know, we're helping

0:29:15.440 --> 0:29:18.920
<v Speaker 2>carry injured to helipads. Obviously people were dead and you're

0:29:18.960 --> 0:29:21.320
<v Speaker 2>just like, wow, I could have been me. And that

0:29:21.400 --> 0:29:25.200
<v Speaker 2>experience really changed my life because except for the COVID year,

0:29:25.320 --> 0:29:27.840
<v Speaker 2>since twenty fifteen, I go back every year two or

0:29:27.880 --> 0:29:32.800
<v Speaker 2>three times to Nepal, taking various groups to their climb mountains,

0:29:33.040 --> 0:29:35.720
<v Speaker 2>track hike. We run a study abroad program now with

0:29:35.960 --> 0:29:39.760
<v Speaker 2>one of the colleges. So I just my calling is

0:29:39.800 --> 0:29:41.800
<v Speaker 2>like I got home from that experience and my parents

0:29:41.880 --> 0:29:44.640
<v Speaker 2>hugged me, and my mom and dad said to me, well,

0:29:44.760 --> 0:29:45.920
<v Speaker 2>what are you going to do with this now? And

0:29:45.960 --> 0:29:47.400
<v Speaker 2>I'm like, what do you mean? And my Dad's like, well,

0:29:47.440 --> 0:29:48.840
<v Speaker 2>you got to live, Like what are you going to

0:29:48.920 --> 0:29:53.080
<v Speaker 2>do now? And I just because of that, I have

0:29:53.240 --> 0:29:55.800
<v Speaker 2>very few bad days now, I've I've never tired. I'm

0:29:55.840 --> 0:29:58.320
<v Speaker 2>always excited to get up and go again and live

0:29:58.480 --> 0:30:02.040
<v Speaker 2>because I feel like I could have just been wiped out. Yeah,

0:30:02.080 --> 0:30:05.840
<v Speaker 2>and that's experience really just profoundly changed how I mean.

0:30:05.880 --> 0:30:08.000
<v Speaker 2>It's not like I had a bad too before that,

0:30:08.320 --> 0:30:11.200
<v Speaker 2>but I just think it it really pushed my level

0:30:11.240 --> 0:30:14.719
<v Speaker 2>even higher. Put in Christmas and it just yeah, and

0:30:14.760 --> 0:30:17.920
<v Speaker 2>it just allows me to live more fulfilling and more

0:30:17.960 --> 0:30:21.560
<v Speaker 2>excited life about anything that I'm doing. Yeah, regardless.

0:30:21.600 --> 0:30:23.760
<v Speaker 1>And you've had people on the mountain that have been

0:30:23.800 --> 0:30:27.480
<v Speaker 1>in a sort of bad shape that you've helped, right, Yeah.

0:30:27.520 --> 0:30:30.640
<v Speaker 2>So in twenty twelve, on my first climb, you know,

0:30:30.680 --> 0:30:33.520
<v Speaker 2>there was sort of like this incident that happened similar

0:30:33.560 --> 0:30:36.320
<v Speaker 2>to what happened on Into Thinner, like John krack Hour's

0:30:36.320 --> 0:30:39.960
<v Speaker 2>book where I in twenty twelve, that was my first

0:30:40.040 --> 0:30:43.360
<v Speaker 2>climb I've ever. So I couldn't really afford to go

0:30:43.440 --> 0:30:44.920
<v Speaker 2>with like a big company, so I went with a

0:30:44.920 --> 0:30:47.600
<v Speaker 2>smaller company. I paid like twenty nine grand for my

0:30:47.640 --> 0:30:51.360
<v Speaker 2>first ever expedition. The trip included some like help with

0:30:51.400 --> 0:30:53.600
<v Speaker 2>some of the camps, but like buy and large, I

0:30:53.640 --> 0:30:55.640
<v Speaker 2>was on my own on the mountain. Yeah, most trips

0:30:55.640 --> 0:30:57.800
<v Speaker 2>are how much are most trips like now seven sixty

0:30:57.840 --> 0:31:00.760
<v Speaker 2>to one hundred grand with a lot of shirp support

0:31:00.800 --> 0:31:03.800
<v Speaker 2>and open things. But anyway, I was on a summit push.

0:31:03.880 --> 0:31:06.480
<v Speaker 2>We decided that sort of the team, there were several

0:31:06.560 --> 0:31:08.880
<v Speaker 2>other people on the team I was on that all

0:31:08.960 --> 0:31:10.960
<v Speaker 2>sort of had paid different amounts of money to be

0:31:11.000 --> 0:31:14.160
<v Speaker 2>there with either a shirt bo or have oxygen available,

0:31:14.200 --> 0:31:17.080
<v Speaker 2>and to avoid crowds on the mountain, we waited an

0:31:17.120 --> 0:31:19.239
<v Speaker 2>extra day. But by waiting an extra day, we were

0:31:19.280 --> 0:31:22.600
<v Speaker 2>risking higher winds. But that meant I'd rather hike in

0:31:22.600 --> 0:31:25.840
<v Speaker 2>a non traffic jam. But there was so many people

0:31:25.840 --> 0:31:28.720
<v Speaker 2>that were up on the mountain as this windstorm came

0:31:28.760 --> 0:31:30.960
<v Speaker 2>in when we were going for the summit, that people

0:31:31.240 --> 0:31:34.240
<v Speaker 2>seven people died that night. Wow. And there were people

0:31:34.240 --> 0:31:36.240
<v Speaker 2>that you couldn't help, and then there were people on

0:31:36.280 --> 0:31:38.520
<v Speaker 2>our team that needed help. And basically I ended up

0:31:38.560 --> 0:31:42.479
<v Speaker 2>aboarding a summit push, going back to base camp, and

0:31:42.520 --> 0:31:45.000
<v Speaker 2>then three or four days later having to skip camps

0:31:45.040 --> 0:31:47.400
<v Speaker 2>to actually reach the summit. And that was the topic

0:31:47.440 --> 0:31:50.760
<v Speaker 2>of a Dayline NBC documentary called Into the Death Zone,

0:31:51.600 --> 0:31:53.800
<v Speaker 2>and that sort of because I was my first climb

0:31:53.840 --> 0:31:56.040
<v Speaker 2>of Everest, and that with the timing of my books,

0:31:56.120 --> 0:31:58.040
<v Speaker 2>gave me at the time kind of a platform to

0:31:58.080 --> 0:32:02.920
<v Speaker 2>create this career in the outdoors. Yeah, and so Everest

0:32:03.000 --> 0:32:08.280
<v Speaker 2>for me was this story of overcoming all odds. Like

0:32:08.360 --> 0:32:10.680
<v Speaker 2>there were so many people that quit after that summit push,

0:32:10.760 --> 0:32:13.480
<v Speaker 2>because usually when you get within five hundred feet of

0:32:13.520 --> 0:32:16.080
<v Speaker 2>the summit, you only get one shot. You go back

0:32:16.080 --> 0:32:18.680
<v Speaker 2>to base camp, you're exhausted. But at the time, I

0:32:18.800 --> 0:32:21.000
<v Speaker 2>was in my early thirties and I was a beast,

0:32:21.320 --> 0:32:24.120
<v Speaker 2>which I pried upon, like always growing up in the

0:32:24.160 --> 0:32:26.280
<v Speaker 2>mounds and just pushing myself. And I knew that I

0:32:27.040 --> 0:32:29.560
<v Speaker 2>also I knew that if I gave up on that investment,

0:32:29.720 --> 0:32:31.840
<v Speaker 2>like what was going to happen to my life? I

0:32:31.840 --> 0:32:33.640
<v Speaker 2>didn't know. I was like I got to go back up,

0:32:34.240 --> 0:32:37.000
<v Speaker 2>and my friends and family supported me, and I went

0:32:37.040 --> 0:32:39.479
<v Speaker 2>back up and made it to the top of the world.

0:32:40.040 --> 0:32:44.480
<v Speaker 2>And ever since that day, Yeah, my career just took

0:32:44.520 --> 0:32:47.120
<v Speaker 2>off in terms of I think that gave me the

0:32:47.120 --> 0:32:50.120
<v Speaker 2>momentum that I wanted to be able to do other

0:32:50.240 --> 0:32:54.320
<v Speaker 2>things and just enjoy not having failed on Everest hanging

0:32:54.320 --> 0:32:54.920
<v Speaker 2>over my head.

0:32:55.800 --> 0:32:57.720
<v Speaker 1>What do you think was the switch that flipped that

0:32:57.920 --> 0:32:59.680
<v Speaker 1>where most people are going, I'm not doing this.

0:33:01.080 --> 0:33:05.880
<v Speaker 2>I think fear of death or exhaustion, or genuinely strength.

0:33:05.920 --> 0:33:07.920
<v Speaker 2>I mean, we were in one hundred mile prior winds

0:33:07.920 --> 0:33:11.560
<v Speaker 2>getting blasted one night and I covered up and came

0:33:11.640 --> 0:33:15.880
<v Speaker 2>down and myself and a few sherpas were helping others

0:33:15.920 --> 0:33:18.760
<v Speaker 2>to get back to tents and give them oxygen. And

0:33:18.840 --> 0:33:21.080
<v Speaker 2>for some reason, why was an ie suffering? It was

0:33:21.160 --> 0:33:22.880
<v Speaker 2>sort of odd. It was like, well, I think it's

0:33:22.880 --> 0:33:24.880
<v Speaker 2>because I grew up in the mountains and I've been climbing,

0:33:24.880 --> 0:33:28.719
<v Speaker 2>and I have a natural affinity for altitude. And I'm okay,

0:33:29.040 --> 0:33:33.040
<v Speaker 2>you know, just by fortune, I guess, but maybe not

0:33:33.080 --> 0:33:36.320
<v Speaker 2>an accident, but yeah, so yeah. So then when I

0:33:36.360 --> 0:33:38.080
<v Speaker 2>got down from that, it actually gave me a lot

0:33:38.080 --> 0:33:39.960
<v Speaker 2>of confidence. I was like, wait, if I can do that,

0:33:40.120 --> 0:33:44.000
<v Speaker 2>I think I could do anything. Yeah. And then I

0:33:44.040 --> 0:33:46.920
<v Speaker 2>wanted to do some other expeditions and get some of

0:33:46.960 --> 0:33:49.640
<v Speaker 2>my guide certifications and become a ski guy and a

0:33:49.680 --> 0:33:51.920
<v Speaker 2>mountain guide and all that kind of stuff too. And

0:33:51.960 --> 0:33:55.360
<v Speaker 2>that's how the right after that, in twenty fourteen, I

0:33:55.520 --> 0:33:59.440
<v Speaker 2>led some trips to kill Them and Jarro and Atcancagua

0:33:59.480 --> 0:34:01.520
<v Speaker 2>and that gave me some confidence that maybe I can

0:34:01.560 --> 0:34:02.800
<v Speaker 2>create a career out of this thing.

0:34:03.600 --> 0:34:05.040
<v Speaker 1>We're going to take a break and then John is

0:34:05.040 --> 0:34:07.840
<v Speaker 1>going to tell us about how he balances risk on

0:34:07.880 --> 0:34:09.680
<v Speaker 1>these really dangerous climbs.

0:34:16.920 --> 0:34:19.759
<v Speaker 2>How do you balance risk? What do you think about it?

0:34:19.760 --> 0:34:21.640
<v Speaker 1>I feel like most people if they're up there and now, yeah,

0:34:21.719 --> 0:34:24.600
<v Speaker 1>as I go, okay, maybe mountaineering is not for me.

0:34:24.960 --> 0:34:28.920
<v Speaker 2>When I'm guiding, it's more conservative approach. Though when I'm

0:34:29.000 --> 0:34:31.560
<v Speaker 2>not guiding, I can push it a little more and

0:34:31.640 --> 0:34:35.799
<v Speaker 2>be more aggressive. But even even on trips where like

0:34:35.840 --> 0:34:38.200
<v Speaker 2>in twenty twenty one, a dear friend of mine, Colin

0:34:38.239 --> 0:34:40.959
<v Speaker 2>ol Brady, he invited me on the K two Winter

0:34:41.120 --> 0:34:44.880
<v Speaker 2>Expedition where there was several climbers attempting to become the

0:34:44.920 --> 0:34:48.640
<v Speaker 2>first people in the winter to summit K two. And

0:34:48.880 --> 0:34:51.000
<v Speaker 2>when I went on that trip with him, I had

0:34:51.120 --> 0:34:54.840
<v Speaker 2>different acceptable levels of risk than he did. Yours are higher,

0:34:55.960 --> 0:35:01.840
<v Speaker 2>oh much lower, except well a higher meaning like a

0:35:01.960 --> 0:35:05.479
<v Speaker 2>I don't accept if it's too cold or too windy. Yeah, yeah,

0:35:05.560 --> 0:35:09.080
<v Speaker 2>So I guess my level of risks tolerance is probably

0:35:09.440 --> 0:35:13.319
<v Speaker 2>a little bit lower than his. But we had because

0:35:13.320 --> 0:35:15.640
<v Speaker 2>they're such good friends, We've done other projects together. We

0:35:16.320 --> 0:35:18.239
<v Speaker 2>sort of had an agreement like on the trip is

0:35:18.280 --> 0:35:20.040
<v Speaker 2>like at any time, if either one of us wanted

0:35:20.080 --> 0:35:22.719
<v Speaker 2>to pull the plug, that's okay, because we had also

0:35:22.800 --> 0:35:27.240
<v Speaker 2>hired shrip Was to climb with and in that particular instance,

0:35:27.760 --> 0:35:30.000
<v Speaker 2>and they'll be a There's a documentary coming out this

0:35:30.000 --> 0:35:35.080
<v Speaker 2>summer on Apple TV called The Last First about K two,

0:35:35.160 --> 0:35:39.080
<v Speaker 2>and it's about that trip and what happened because five

0:35:39.200 --> 0:35:42.439
<v Speaker 2>people have lost their lives, and three of them lost

0:35:42.480 --> 0:35:45.560
<v Speaker 2>their lives on the summit push where Colin and I

0:35:45.600 --> 0:35:47.839
<v Speaker 2>walked out of base camp, we went up towards Camp one,

0:35:48.360 --> 0:35:50.880
<v Speaker 2>started going up to some of the ropes after we

0:35:50.880 --> 0:35:53.640
<v Speaker 2>had already climatized up to Camp two on the mountain,

0:35:53.760 --> 0:35:56.560
<v Speaker 2>and I just melt a rat and a lot of

0:35:56.560 --> 0:35:59.279
<v Speaker 2>different ways. One was that because of my background on

0:35:59.320 --> 0:36:03.640
<v Speaker 2>neurology having access to good weather forecasts, I just knew

0:36:03.640 --> 0:36:06.160
<v Speaker 2>the weather wasn't going to be acceptable. It's going to

0:36:06.160 --> 0:36:08.440
<v Speaker 2>be too cold and too windy. And then I also

0:36:08.520 --> 0:36:11.440
<v Speaker 2>knew that there was a bunch of other somewhat amateur

0:36:11.520 --> 0:36:13.840
<v Speaker 2>climbers going on this summit push, and I felt like

0:36:13.880 --> 0:36:15.680
<v Speaker 2>that wasn't a safe thing to be up there when

0:36:15.680 --> 0:36:18.600
<v Speaker 2>they were, and those two things for me just were

0:36:18.680 --> 0:36:21.839
<v Speaker 2>enough evidence to say, look, calm, it's okay. You can

0:36:21.840 --> 0:36:23.960
<v Speaker 2>take the shirp as we have and go for an attempt.

0:36:24.040 --> 0:36:27.440
<v Speaker 2>You'll be safe with them, relatively safe with them. But

0:36:27.640 --> 0:36:29.160
<v Speaker 2>I'm out. I'm going to go down to base camp.

0:36:29.200 --> 0:36:31.479
<v Speaker 2>I'll be on the radio. I still support you going

0:36:31.520 --> 0:36:34.719
<v Speaker 2>to the top. And then in the days after that,

0:36:34.800 --> 0:36:39.719
<v Speaker 2>which this documentary will really cover, is three people lost

0:36:39.760 --> 0:36:41.840
<v Speaker 2>their lives and then two more on the course of

0:36:41.840 --> 0:36:45.359
<v Speaker 2>that trip died, so five guys never came home. And

0:36:45.440 --> 0:36:50.319
<v Speaker 2>that experience too changed my risk tolerance a lot of

0:36:50.360 --> 0:36:53.960
<v Speaker 2>times with what I'm doing in my own career. Even Yeah,

0:36:54.000 --> 0:36:55.960
<v Speaker 2>it's kind of an interesting thing. Even lately I've been

0:36:58.280 --> 0:37:01.360
<v Speaker 2>talking with other climbers and my I sort of feel

0:37:01.440 --> 0:37:07.360
<v Speaker 2>the profession reading some things even just like learning, talking

0:37:07.760 --> 0:37:09.960
<v Speaker 2>like my parents and people that are older, and I

0:37:09.960 --> 0:37:13.040
<v Speaker 2>feel like as we all get older, like for me,

0:37:13.160 --> 0:37:16.080
<v Speaker 2>I'm in my forties, but like, there's things I won't

0:37:16.120 --> 0:37:17.800
<v Speaker 2>do now that I would have done in my twenties

0:37:17.840 --> 0:37:21.279
<v Speaker 2>and thirties. And it's not even about me saying I'm

0:37:21.320 --> 0:37:24.040
<v Speaker 2>too old to do it, because I don't have that attitude. Still,

0:37:24.080 --> 0:37:26.960
<v Speaker 2>I still do a lot of climbing and trips, and

0:37:27.000 --> 0:37:32.440
<v Speaker 2>I'm out there living, but it's more about learning about

0:37:32.480 --> 0:37:36.239
<v Speaker 2>what those consequences are and knowing that I want to

0:37:36.280 --> 0:37:38.800
<v Speaker 2>just live longer and not deal with that risk anymore,

0:37:38.960 --> 0:37:41.880
<v Speaker 2>that I say no. And an example that is like,

0:37:41.960 --> 0:37:44.040
<v Speaker 2>at one time I thought I'd want to climb the

0:37:44.080 --> 0:37:47.720
<v Speaker 2>fourteen highest mountains in the world, the eight thousand meter peaks.

0:37:48.360 --> 0:37:51.440
<v Speaker 2>Through my twenties and thirties, I pursued several expeditions on

0:37:51.600 --> 0:37:54.560
<v Speaker 2>mountains like Manisley that I summoned it without oxygen or

0:37:54.640 --> 0:37:58.480
<v Speaker 2>gasherbrum two, and then I went to K two. But

0:37:58.640 --> 0:38:00.719
<v Speaker 2>then I thought, okay, cool. At some point I might

0:38:00.800 --> 0:38:03.279
<v Speaker 2>end up on Annapurna or canchin Junger or some of

0:38:03.280 --> 0:38:05.920
<v Speaker 2>these hard or more dangerous eight thousand ers, And at

0:38:05.960 --> 0:38:08.080
<v Speaker 2>this time I look at them and I'd rather go

0:38:08.960 --> 0:38:11.520
<v Speaker 2>climb my first ascent on a mountain that's not as dangerous,

0:38:11.640 --> 0:38:13.719
<v Speaker 2>or go do an old I run ultras, run one

0:38:13.760 --> 0:38:16.160
<v Speaker 2>hundred k like I'm going to do this summer and

0:38:16.680 --> 0:38:19.640
<v Speaker 2>go explore new countries and do things that aren't as

0:38:19.960 --> 0:38:23.160
<v Speaker 2>dangerous anymore. And I'm okay with it. And I used

0:38:23.160 --> 0:38:24.920
<v Speaker 2>to say, oh, I definitely want to do that. I

0:38:24.960 --> 0:38:26.520
<v Speaker 2>definitely want to do that. I want to put myself

0:38:26.520 --> 0:38:29.920
<v Speaker 2>in that area. And I now I'm kind of that

0:38:30.600 --> 0:38:31.960
<v Speaker 2>perception for me is changing.

0:38:32.280 --> 0:38:35.800
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, a lot of those are notable simply because they're risky.

0:38:36.320 --> 0:38:39.400
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, they're really big and dangerous mountains. Yeah, you know.

0:38:39.800 --> 0:38:41.360
<v Speaker 1>And so it kind of it almost goes back to

0:38:41.400 --> 0:38:44.080
<v Speaker 1>that like measuring stick like you were talking about. Yeah,

0:38:44.160 --> 0:38:45.759
<v Speaker 1>it's like, why do we want to do this, well

0:38:45.800 --> 0:38:47.680
<v Speaker 1>because people think it's awesome. What do they think it's

0:38:47.719 --> 0:38:49.600
<v Speaker 1>awesome because it's risky And you go, oh wait, but

0:38:49.640 --> 0:38:51.719
<v Speaker 1>I'm the one who's going to actually be putting my

0:38:51.760 --> 0:38:53.440
<v Speaker 1>life on the line for a couple of pots on

0:38:53.480 --> 0:38:54.399
<v Speaker 1>the back from my head.

0:38:54.480 --> 0:38:56.560
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and and and at the end of the day,

0:38:56.719 --> 0:38:59.440
<v Speaker 2>nobody really cares except myself or my family or my

0:38:59.480 --> 0:39:01.399
<v Speaker 2>close friends. Are my loved ones, Like I could care

0:39:01.480 --> 0:39:04.759
<v Speaker 2>less about what a photo does on social media. And

0:39:04.840 --> 0:39:08.760
<v Speaker 2>I think that's the most important takeaway for me living

0:39:08.840 --> 0:39:11.279
<v Speaker 2>now that I think a lot of people should start

0:39:11.280 --> 0:39:15.279
<v Speaker 2>paying attention due because yeah, there are all these like

0:39:15.320 --> 0:39:17.600
<v Speaker 2>record seekers and people that are going out and doing

0:39:17.640 --> 0:39:19.680
<v Speaker 2>mountains just to say the look at me, look at me,

0:39:19.760 --> 0:39:22.560
<v Speaker 2>and that sort of loses its value. I think it

0:39:22.600 --> 0:39:25.320
<v Speaker 2>loses its value a lot because the reason becomes outward

0:39:25.400 --> 0:39:29.239
<v Speaker 2>not inward. Yeah. Yeah, and you see that unfortunately the

0:39:29.280 --> 0:39:32.239
<v Speaker 2>most on Mount Everest. Yeah, you know, this season it

0:39:32.320 --> 0:39:36.640
<v Speaker 2>was the worst it's ever been. Well, we had the

0:39:36.640 --> 0:39:40.319
<v Speaker 2>most summits in the history of the mountain. And if

0:39:40.400 --> 0:39:42.719
<v Speaker 2>you go do a search on social the amount of

0:39:42.719 --> 0:39:44.719
<v Speaker 2>people just doing the look at me, look at me

0:39:44.920 --> 0:39:48.279
<v Speaker 2>is really the present and then there's not a ton

0:39:48.320 --> 0:39:51.720
<v Speaker 2>of Well the media highlights certain things or certain people

0:39:51.760 --> 0:39:54.160
<v Speaker 2>sometimes and you're sort of like, well, that's not really unique,

0:39:54.200 --> 0:39:56.840
<v Speaker 2>Like this person is climbing it. Well seven thousand, eight

0:39:56.880 --> 0:39:59.440
<v Speaker 2>thousand people, Now I've done that mountain. So yeah, it's

0:39:59.440 --> 0:40:01.399
<v Speaker 2>still a challenge. It's still highest moount in the world.

0:40:01.440 --> 0:40:03.600
<v Speaker 2>I do see why people are drawing to it, and

0:40:03.640 --> 0:40:06.359
<v Speaker 2>that's okay, but I think people need to dial back

0:40:06.400 --> 0:40:10.279
<v Speaker 2>their bravado, I think, and really take a hard look

0:40:10.320 --> 0:40:14.200
<v Speaker 2>at their Why why is K two so hard? Isn't

0:40:14.200 --> 0:40:18.040
<v Speaker 2>it considered the hardest? Yeah, it's so steep. It's only

0:40:18.080 --> 0:40:21.680
<v Speaker 2>seven hundred and fifty feet lower than Everest. Yeah, so

0:40:21.800 --> 0:40:25.040
<v Speaker 2>because that's still really high. Yeah, and so what it

0:40:25.080 --> 0:40:26.960
<v Speaker 2>can do to the body is really really tough and

0:40:27.080 --> 0:40:30.839
<v Speaker 2>damaging and scary. And yeah, and now I look at

0:40:30.880 --> 0:40:35.280
<v Speaker 2>that mountain after experiencing it in the winter, and another

0:40:35.360 --> 0:40:37.640
<v Speaker 2>thing that kind of turns me off now is for

0:40:37.719 --> 0:40:40.319
<v Speaker 2>better or for worse, the commercialization of our mountains. And

0:40:40.320 --> 0:40:42.640
<v Speaker 2>that's why I have to sort of take this with

0:40:42.680 --> 0:40:45.120
<v Speaker 2>a little bit of a cautious approach, right, because I'm

0:40:45.160 --> 0:40:47.680
<v Speaker 2>part of that commercialization like it or not. I've brought

0:40:47.719 --> 0:40:51.040
<v Speaker 2>people to Everest, I bring people to mountains, but how

0:40:51.080 --> 0:40:54.399
<v Speaker 2>are we protecting these places? How are we managing them?

0:40:54.400 --> 0:40:57.480
<v Speaker 2>And how are we you know, when they can commercialize,

0:40:57.480 --> 0:41:04.000
<v Speaker 2>how is that impacting people's experiences and the safety when

0:41:04.000 --> 0:41:07.120
<v Speaker 2>they're there. And so for me, that's the epitome of

0:41:07.160 --> 0:41:10.360
<v Speaker 2>why I did choose a first ascent this season in

0:41:10.400 --> 0:41:14.560
<v Speaker 2>Nepaul over a commercialized mountain, because for me, some commercialized

0:41:14.560 --> 0:41:17.640
<v Speaker 2>mountains aren't growth anymore unless I can go to the

0:41:17.680 --> 0:41:20.480
<v Speaker 2>mountain with let's say, a small team myself and we

0:41:20.600 --> 0:41:23.799
<v Speaker 2>do all the work ourselves and we climb ourselves. One

0:41:23.840 --> 0:41:26.520
<v Speaker 2>of my heroes in the mountaineering space of eight thousand

0:41:26.520 --> 0:41:29.520
<v Speaker 2>meter peaks was Ed Viisters, the first to climb the

0:41:29.680 --> 0:41:32.960
<v Speaker 2>fourteen and he did it without supplemental oxygen, and he

0:41:33.040 --> 0:41:36.920
<v Speaker 2>did it in an era before buying large commercialization on mountains.

0:41:37.719 --> 0:41:40.680
<v Speaker 2>Somebody like that is just I admire because of what

0:41:40.719 --> 0:41:43.680
<v Speaker 2>they went through to accomplish that feat. And now when

0:41:43.680 --> 0:41:47.120
<v Speaker 2>you go the mountains are so commercialized, there's ropes everywhere,

0:41:47.200 --> 0:41:50.360
<v Speaker 2>there's people on them. It's easier like it or not,

0:41:50.480 --> 0:41:52.440
<v Speaker 2>for better or for worse. And it's okay if people

0:41:52.480 --> 0:41:55.280
<v Speaker 2>want that experience, I think people should go to the mountains.

0:41:55.320 --> 0:41:57.760
<v Speaker 2>But for me now it's I think it's more about

0:41:57.760 --> 0:42:02.839
<v Speaker 2>seeking these experiences that uh more will allow me to

0:42:02.880 --> 0:42:06.920
<v Speaker 2>grow more. Yeah, And so the combination of picking like

0:42:06.960 --> 0:42:09.640
<v Speaker 2>a first ascent or going to places I haven't gone before.

0:42:10.360 --> 0:42:14.239
<v Speaker 2>And if I'm guiding, I'm guiding somebody that that is

0:42:14.360 --> 0:42:16.879
<v Speaker 2>really for me. That's the project, is working with them

0:42:16.920 --> 0:42:19.520
<v Speaker 2>getting them to their summit. And those are the things

0:42:19.520 --> 0:42:22.960
<v Speaker 2>that allow me to grow now versus some experiences that

0:42:23.000 --> 0:42:25.520
<v Speaker 2>are different that I don't feel like challenge me as much.

0:42:26.040 --> 0:42:27.879
<v Speaker 1>It's almost like you've had to put put in more

0:42:27.960 --> 0:42:32.439
<v Speaker 1>work and there's more questions about the things that you're

0:42:32.440 --> 0:42:35.439
<v Speaker 1>doing now. So the first ascent you just did, no one,

0:42:35.560 --> 0:42:36.880
<v Speaker 1>no one had ever been there, it's not like you

0:42:36.920 --> 0:42:39.120
<v Speaker 1>could download yeah, try.

0:42:39.040 --> 0:42:41.239
<v Speaker 2>To look on Google Earth and we're like it's over here,

0:42:41.280 --> 0:42:43.440
<v Speaker 2>somewhere in this valley and kind of look there. But

0:42:43.520 --> 0:42:46.399
<v Speaker 2>it was okay, the only one and that was the thing,

0:42:46.520 --> 0:42:49.239
<v Speaker 2>like and and some of the people helped me out

0:42:49.320 --> 0:42:51.239
<v Speaker 2>that too, or people ask me questions about like, oh,

0:42:51.360 --> 0:42:53.239
<v Speaker 2>you could just google it and figure that out. I'm like, actually, no,

0:42:53.239 --> 0:42:54.799
<v Speaker 2>it doesn't work that way. You have a full lot

0:42:54.800 --> 0:42:56.719
<v Speaker 2>of map and then you have to go in the

0:42:56.800 --> 0:42:59.240
<v Speaker 2>valley and just go explore it. And that was fun

0:42:59.440 --> 0:43:01.520
<v Speaker 2>and figure out how you up, what route are you

0:43:01.560 --> 0:43:01.920
<v Speaker 2>going to take?

0:43:01.920 --> 0:43:04.640
<v Speaker 1>There's all these questions as whereas with the other thing,

0:43:04.680 --> 0:43:06.480
<v Speaker 1>if there's already all the ropes ready.

0:43:06.239 --> 0:43:08.040
<v Speaker 2>For yeah, they just kind of like rope in and

0:43:08.080 --> 0:43:09.920
<v Speaker 2>climbers show up and they just have to jug up

0:43:09.920 --> 0:43:11.520
<v Speaker 2>the rope and you're like, well, there's not growth in

0:43:11.560 --> 0:43:12.320
<v Speaker 2>that for me anymore.

0:43:12.640 --> 0:43:16.720
<v Speaker 1>There's more a mental component, yeah, to having to figure

0:43:16.719 --> 0:43:19.319
<v Speaker 1>out more things by yourself. If everything is sort of

0:43:19.360 --> 0:43:21.480
<v Speaker 1>fixed and pre planned, you just got to like do

0:43:21.600 --> 0:43:24.440
<v Speaker 1>exactly as you're told and then just push.

0:43:24.480 --> 0:43:26.920
<v Speaker 2>Yeah yeah and then and so that's kind of like

0:43:27.120 --> 0:43:28.600
<v Speaker 2>now and I still get made fun of all the

0:43:28.640 --> 0:43:30.560
<v Speaker 2>time because I'm more like my dad with this, but

0:43:30.680 --> 0:43:33.359
<v Speaker 2>like he pulls out the old road outis still hey,

0:43:33.360 --> 0:43:36.440
<v Speaker 2>where are we going? HOI? He crewed Mike and I

0:43:36.600 --> 0:43:40.480
<v Speaker 2>for about forty to fifty percent of that Continental Divide trail.

0:43:41.120 --> 0:43:43.040
<v Speaker 2>We had to teach him how to use some of

0:43:43.080 --> 0:43:46.400
<v Speaker 2>the maps and Google maps to assist him because he

0:43:46.560 --> 0:43:48.640
<v Speaker 2>was pulling out road houses and he'd be like, well

0:43:48.719 --> 0:43:50.359
<v Speaker 2>is the road to get in there? And we're like, Dad,

0:43:50.360 --> 0:43:55.680
<v Speaker 2>it's on there, like yeah, you know, crazy and interesting

0:43:55.760 --> 0:43:58.680
<v Speaker 2>to see that too. But I do defend him on

0:43:58.719 --> 0:44:01.399
<v Speaker 2>some of that because a good example is even navigating here.

0:44:01.440 --> 0:44:03.480
<v Speaker 2>Instead of having Siri tell me where, I like to

0:44:03.480 --> 0:44:05.680
<v Speaker 2>pull up the whole map, see where it is, see

0:44:05.680 --> 0:44:09.440
<v Speaker 2>where I am, and then follow the map as is,

0:44:09.480 --> 0:44:12.319
<v Speaker 2>as opposed to have Siri tell me on it. And

0:44:12.400 --> 0:44:15.040
<v Speaker 2>I've still worked that way because I'm a geographer and

0:44:15.200 --> 0:44:17.640
<v Speaker 2>most people think I'm crazy. But I don't like to

0:44:17.680 --> 0:44:20.239
<v Speaker 2>shut my mind off and just have something tell me.

0:44:20.320 --> 0:44:23.360
<v Speaker 2>I like to learn as I go and worry it myself.

0:44:23.560 --> 0:44:26.040
<v Speaker 1>I think I've mentioned this study on the podcast before,

0:44:26.080 --> 0:44:29.040
<v Speaker 1>but there's this These researchers looked at four hundred different

0:44:29.040 --> 0:44:32.680
<v Speaker 1>careers and they wanted to know what careers tend to

0:44:32.680 --> 0:44:36.759
<v Speaker 1>get Alzheimer's and other degenerate brain diseases the most in

0:44:36.840 --> 0:44:40.920
<v Speaker 1>the least, and they found that the two jobs that

0:44:41.000 --> 0:44:45.120
<v Speaker 1>had the least amount of Alzheimer's were ambulance drivers and

0:44:45.200 --> 0:44:49.160
<v Speaker 1>taxi drivers. And the big reason, they thought, is because

0:44:49.200 --> 0:44:52.120
<v Speaker 1>they're having to pay attention to their environment and navigate

0:44:52.160 --> 0:44:54.319
<v Speaker 1>their environment all the time. And that seems to do

0:44:54.800 --> 0:44:57.279
<v Speaker 1>so if you think about an evolutionary context, people had

0:44:57.280 --> 0:44:59.600
<v Speaker 1>to figure out where they were in space, where they

0:44:59.600 --> 0:45:02.640
<v Speaker 1>were going all the time, and they had to do

0:45:02.680 --> 0:45:04.880
<v Speaker 1>it on the move, And there's something that's good for

0:45:04.960 --> 0:45:06.880
<v Speaker 1>our brain behind that. And then but today we can

0:45:06.920 --> 0:45:09.120
<v Speaker 1>obviously offload so much of that to just you.

0:45:09.239 --> 0:45:10.680
<v Speaker 2>Just follow the blue dog fall.

0:45:10.880 --> 0:45:13.759
<v Speaker 1>So if you can figure out ways to do more

0:45:13.800 --> 0:45:15.920
<v Speaker 1>of your figuring it out how to get from point

0:45:15.960 --> 0:45:18.440
<v Speaker 1>A to point B, that seems to be good for people.

0:45:19.200 --> 0:45:21.440
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. And I think

0:45:21.840 --> 0:45:25.359
<v Speaker 2>with all this technology and AI, that's the other part.

0:45:25.400 --> 0:45:27.120
<v Speaker 2>It's like, oh my gosh, I want to actually want

0:45:27.120 --> 0:45:29.520
<v Speaker 2>to write this email, like I actually want to think

0:45:29.560 --> 0:45:32.840
<v Speaker 2>on my own. And I think some people, especially the

0:45:32.840 --> 0:45:35.919
<v Speaker 2>younger generation, and get lost in this, in that and

0:45:35.960 --> 0:45:38.440
<v Speaker 2>not thinking on their own. That's kind of scary. Actually,

0:45:39.040 --> 0:45:42.200
<v Speaker 2>you know, technology is great, good for better or worse.

0:45:42.239 --> 0:45:44.440
<v Speaker 2>But yeah, and I hope people don't get lost and

0:45:44.520 --> 0:45:46.760
<v Speaker 2>not being able to think on their own. What happened

0:45:46.760 --> 0:45:50.520
<v Speaker 2>when you got struck by lightning or you're tempted? Man,

0:45:50.600 --> 0:45:55.799
<v Speaker 2>that experience was crazy. Yeah. Basically, there was like a

0:45:55.920 --> 0:45:58.960
<v Speaker 2>rogue storm sort of coming over. It was in the fall,

0:45:59.160 --> 0:46:01.919
<v Speaker 2>so you get these sort of like cold fronts that

0:46:02.000 --> 0:46:05.200
<v Speaker 2>move over the mountains in Colorado where kind of hails

0:46:05.239 --> 0:46:09.319
<v Speaker 2>and snows and yeah, and I was sitting in a tent.

0:46:09.560 --> 0:46:12.200
<v Speaker 2>I was actually I called my mom real quick to

0:46:12.480 --> 0:46:14.680
<v Speaker 2>check in. I had sell service and say, well, hey,

0:46:14.719 --> 0:46:16.640
<v Speaker 2>I only have like four peaks left in this project

0:46:16.680 --> 0:46:18.600
<v Speaker 2>and I can't wait to get done. And then and

0:46:18.640 --> 0:46:20.480
<v Speaker 2>then all of a sudden, there's like a flash boom

0:46:20.480 --> 0:46:22.719
<v Speaker 2>outside of my tent. I'm like, what the heck is this?

0:46:23.480 --> 0:46:26.680
<v Speaker 2>And uh, and then the tent poles were kind of

0:46:26.719 --> 0:46:30.920
<v Speaker 2>like buzzing and every yeah, and so I opened up

0:46:30.960 --> 0:46:34.440
<v Speaker 2>the zipper and look out and it was literally the

0:46:34.520 --> 0:46:38.319
<v Speaker 2>storm moving right over me. And then when you see, yeah,

0:46:38.360 --> 0:46:40.520
<v Speaker 2>like sort of lights flashing on the rocks and that's

0:46:40.560 --> 0:46:43.480
<v Speaker 2>it's called Sante Almo's fire happening. You know, lightning's going

0:46:43.560 --> 0:46:45.279
<v Speaker 2>to strike their pretty quick. And this was on a

0:46:45.280 --> 0:46:49.319
<v Speaker 2>mountain called Harvard. So as soon as I saw that,

0:46:49.360 --> 0:46:51.879
<v Speaker 2>I slipped my shoes on, jumped out of the tent

0:46:51.960 --> 0:46:54.120
<v Speaker 2>and jumped sort of off the summit block to get

0:46:54.120 --> 0:46:57.520
<v Speaker 2>down to the trail. Lightning struck the tent and knocked

0:46:57.520 --> 0:47:00.719
<v Speaker 2>me off my feet into the ground that I got up,

0:47:00.760 --> 0:47:02.560
<v Speaker 2>and I was like, just in fear for my life.

0:47:02.560 --> 0:47:05.600
<v Speaker 2>So I ran down the trail and it was kind

0:47:05.600 --> 0:47:08.520
<v Speaker 2>of in haste and it was dark, and next thing,

0:47:08.560 --> 0:47:10.680
<v Speaker 2>I know, maybe a thousand feet down from the summit,

0:47:10.719 --> 0:47:12.839
<v Speaker 2>and as storms moved through, car out of they moved

0:47:12.840 --> 0:47:15.320
<v Speaker 2>through quick usually, and so just it was over, stars

0:47:15.360 --> 0:47:17.800
<v Speaker 2>came out and I was like what And then I realized,

0:47:17.840 --> 0:47:20.040
<v Speaker 2>wait a minute, all my stuff's up there. It's the

0:47:20.040 --> 0:47:22.040
<v Speaker 2>middle of the night. Now it's like ten pm. I

0:47:22.040 --> 0:47:25.440
<v Speaker 2>can't go down. So I went back up to the

0:47:25.480 --> 0:47:28.160
<v Speaker 2>tent and just kind of looked and I'm like what

0:47:28.200 --> 0:47:30.440
<v Speaker 2>the heck, And like the charred remains in my headlamp

0:47:30.440 --> 0:47:34.080
<v Speaker 2>were sitting on my sleeping bag and then I and

0:47:34.120 --> 0:47:37.480
<v Speaker 2>then I kind of smelt burnt, like burned, and so

0:47:37.520 --> 0:47:38.920
<v Speaker 2>then I was well, I'm like, well, I have no

0:47:39.000 --> 0:47:40.400
<v Speaker 2>choice here. I just got go to bed. So I

0:47:40.400 --> 0:47:43.640
<v Speaker 2>got back and sleeping bag and fell asleep the morning

0:47:43.719 --> 0:47:46.080
<v Speaker 2>to light. Yeah, the storm was gone. It was beautiful morning.

0:47:46.120 --> 0:47:48.520
<v Speaker 2>I took a video of that, which is in the book.

0:47:49.239 --> 0:47:52.240
<v Speaker 2>The video. There's QR codes in the book show everything.

0:47:52.440 --> 0:47:55.080
<v Speaker 2>Yeah and yeah. And then and then I go to

0:47:55.120 --> 0:47:57.400
<v Speaker 2>take the tent down. The poles were melted together and

0:47:57.440 --> 0:47:59.399
<v Speaker 2>there were holes in the tent and it was like, yeah,

0:47:59.440 --> 0:48:04.400
<v Speaker 2>this got cooked pretty good, you know, but I escaped. Yeah, yeah,

0:48:04.520 --> 0:48:05.760
<v Speaker 2>it was. It was gnarly.

0:48:06.760 --> 0:48:10.319
<v Speaker 1>So you have a PhD. And tell us what an

0:48:10.480 --> 0:48:11.640
<v Speaker 1>environmental geography was.

0:48:11.719 --> 0:48:14.600
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, emphasis is on weather and climate. So I

0:48:14.640 --> 0:48:20.239
<v Speaker 2>took climatology, meteorology, all those courses, glaciology and so yeah,

0:48:20.280 --> 0:48:23.880
<v Speaker 2>I'm essentially a meteorologist with my training and stuff. How

0:48:23.920 --> 0:48:27.480
<v Speaker 2>has that helped you in the mountains tremendously? Yeah, I

0:48:27.520 --> 0:48:31.240
<v Speaker 2>mean sleeping on the summits was a partnership my great

0:48:31.280 --> 0:48:34.759
<v Speaker 2>friend Chris Tomer, who's a he does mount weather for expeditions. Now,

0:48:35.440 --> 0:48:38.280
<v Speaker 2>that was sort of the infancy of his career because

0:48:38.320 --> 0:48:40.879
<v Speaker 2>after that, I sent him a lot of referrals after

0:48:40.920 --> 0:48:42.560
<v Speaker 2>that book came out and people would call him, and

0:48:42.600 --> 0:48:45.480
<v Speaker 2>now he does mountain weather for expeditions all over the world.

0:48:45.520 --> 0:48:48.319
<v Speaker 2>He had several clients on Everest this year. When I'm

0:48:48.360 --> 0:48:51.560
<v Speaker 2>on trips, he sends me forecasts. But anyway, at the time,

0:48:52.120 --> 0:48:55.040
<v Speaker 2>you know, this was twenty twelve, so you know, we

0:48:55.080 --> 0:48:58.719
<v Speaker 2>didn't really have those fancy weather apps where you can

0:48:58.719 --> 0:49:00.560
<v Speaker 2>just pull it up and look at the radar. But

0:49:00.640 --> 0:49:03.960
<v Speaker 2>I'd be up on a mountain, and after having climbed

0:49:03.960 --> 0:49:07.319
<v Speaker 2>those peaks through my childhood, I could be like, hey, okay,

0:49:07.360 --> 0:49:09.560
<v Speaker 2>we're on this. You know Mount Harvard, got stand by

0:49:09.560 --> 0:49:12.600
<v Speaker 2>that rock over there, and you have cell coverage and

0:49:13.360 --> 0:49:15.279
<v Speaker 2>and so then it would pop in and send me

0:49:15.280 --> 0:49:18.000
<v Speaker 2>messages about the current conditions and be like, hey, there's

0:49:18.040 --> 0:49:20.000
<v Speaker 2>a storm over. You know, being a vista, it looks

0:49:20.000 --> 0:49:22.680
<v Speaker 2>like it's moving away. Here, there's a storm over. Assmen,

0:49:22.680 --> 0:49:24.799
<v Speaker 2>it's coming towards you. You might want to get out

0:49:24.840 --> 0:49:26.799
<v Speaker 2>of the way, that kind of stuff. But it would

0:49:26.840 --> 0:49:29.320
<v Speaker 2>allow me to watch the storms go by at eye level,

0:49:29.960 --> 0:49:33.440
<v Speaker 2>and that would it was really fantastic because you know,

0:49:34.080 --> 0:49:35.640
<v Speaker 2>I could stay up there or I'd have to make

0:49:35.680 --> 0:49:38.640
<v Speaker 2>the call and get off, and you know it contributed

0:49:38.719 --> 0:49:42.120
<v Speaker 2>success for sure, and trusting his judgment of what he

0:49:42.239 --> 0:49:45.000
<v Speaker 2>was seeing on his radar and working as a metrologists.

0:49:45.000 --> 0:49:50.160
<v Speaker 2>But then also I having studied weather and climate up

0:49:50.160 --> 0:49:51.520
<v Speaker 2>being up there, I could be like, oh, yeah, that

0:49:51.520 --> 0:49:53.440
<v Speaker 2>storm is definitely going to fade out of for sunset,

0:49:53.640 --> 0:49:55.400
<v Speaker 2>or you know, I know they're prevailing winds today, I

0:49:55.440 --> 0:49:57.279
<v Speaker 2>know that's going to go away, or hey, you know

0:49:57.360 --> 0:49:59.640
<v Speaker 2>these cumulus clouds are going to develop even higher should

0:49:59.640 --> 0:50:00.000
<v Speaker 2>probably be.

0:50:00.920 --> 0:50:05.920
<v Speaker 1>So I feel like people overestimate, or rather they fear

0:50:06.040 --> 0:50:07.840
<v Speaker 1>things like bears and snakes.

0:50:08.120 --> 0:50:11.799
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, but it's the weather that kills you. Yeah, yeah, Yeah,

0:50:11.840 --> 0:50:13.239
<v Speaker 2>I mean I had to run in with the bear

0:50:13.280 --> 0:50:16.879
<v Speaker 2>in one particular occasion on Little Bear. Have you done

0:50:16.920 --> 0:50:19.040
<v Speaker 2>any fourteen ers over the years. I haven't. I haven't

0:50:19.040 --> 0:50:21.919
<v Speaker 2>spent much time in Colorado now. I'm I'm from Utah,

0:50:22.040 --> 0:50:24.200
<v Speaker 2>so we're like kind of Colorado. You shune your family

0:50:24.239 --> 0:50:27.000
<v Speaker 2>out for a hike? Yeah, something we'll have to yeah. Yeah.

0:50:27.280 --> 0:50:32.000
<v Speaker 1>Regarding weather, do you feel like Everest is getting safer

0:50:32.120 --> 0:50:33.560
<v Speaker 1>or more dangerous?

0:50:34.080 --> 0:50:36.560
<v Speaker 2>So I've heard two really hard Yeah, that's a hard

0:50:36.640 --> 0:50:39.280
<v Speaker 2>question because I feel like we do have good data,

0:50:39.400 --> 0:50:43.440
<v Speaker 2>and we have good weather forecasting with basic trends and generally,

0:50:43.480 --> 0:50:46.440
<v Speaker 2>but you know, I was in contact with Crys a

0:50:46.440 --> 0:50:49.600
<v Speaker 2>lot this year. He had six different people on the mountain.

0:50:50.280 --> 0:50:53.799
<v Speaker 2>And even though in general from a general meteorology trend,

0:50:53.840 --> 0:50:56.080
<v Speaker 2>every year from about the fifteenth to the twenty fifth

0:50:56.160 --> 0:50:58.080
<v Speaker 2>is kind of the sweet spot on Everest. And what

0:50:58.160 --> 0:51:01.879
<v Speaker 2>I've found personally is it's twofold. If we do wait

0:51:01.960 --> 0:51:04.120
<v Speaker 2>and let all the people that think the summit window

0:51:04.200 --> 0:51:06.240
<v Speaker 2>opens and they go for it, and there's a bajillion

0:51:06.280 --> 0:51:08.360
<v Speaker 2>people going up like this year there was two hundred

0:51:08.360 --> 0:51:10.600
<v Speaker 2>and seventy eight people on the same day. It was

0:51:10.640 --> 0:51:14.040
<v Speaker 2>a new record. When I gather info in base camp

0:51:14.080 --> 0:51:15.960
<v Speaker 2>and see that many people going on a day, I

0:51:16.000 --> 0:51:18.000
<v Speaker 2>don't go. I'm like, I'll wait, I'll wait a week.

0:51:18.040 --> 0:51:22.920
<v Speaker 2>It's fine. But also we know meteorologically statistically the weather

0:51:23.040 --> 0:51:25.279
<v Speaker 2>does get warmer from about the twenty first to the

0:51:25.280 --> 0:51:28.279
<v Speaker 2>twenty eighth. On Everest every year it's warmer than in

0:51:28.400 --> 0:51:31.399
<v Speaker 2>the teens, And so it's better just to wait. You're

0:51:31.400 --> 0:51:33.160
<v Speaker 2>gonna be up there, it's going to be safer for

0:51:33.200 --> 0:51:37.560
<v Speaker 2>you frostbite wise. There's gonna usually be less wind. This year,

0:51:37.680 --> 0:51:41.000
<v Speaker 2>the people were summoning from about the when they got

0:51:41.040 --> 0:51:43.000
<v Speaker 2>the ropes, and I think on like the fourteenth, all

0:51:43.040 --> 0:51:46.439
<v Speaker 2>the way through the twenty ninth, for a two week

0:51:46.520 --> 0:51:49.680
<v Speaker 2>period there wasn't summits every day. But then this year

0:51:49.680 --> 0:51:52.520
<v Speaker 2>it was odd because the jet stream lingers, and this

0:51:52.600 --> 0:51:56.960
<v Speaker 2>can happen every year. Sometimes after the twentieth it's actually

0:51:57.000 --> 0:51:59.160
<v Speaker 2>really really nice, and this year there was some days

0:51:59.200 --> 0:52:02.560
<v Speaker 2>where it was souper windy and then people didn't sum it,

0:52:02.719 --> 0:52:04.680
<v Speaker 2>or like even on the last some of the last

0:52:04.719 --> 0:52:07.359
<v Speaker 2>summit pushes, my friend Garrett Madison was up there with

0:52:07.400 --> 0:52:09.960
<v Speaker 2>his team and they waited in Camp four for an

0:52:10.000 --> 0:52:12.680
<v Speaker 2>extra day because it got so windy and nobody summitted

0:52:12.719 --> 0:52:15.719
<v Speaker 2>on like the twenty sixth or something like that, and

0:52:15.760 --> 0:52:19.400
<v Speaker 2>then the next day people summitted. Interesting, and so it

0:52:19.520 --> 0:52:22.360
<v Speaker 2>even though we have good tools to forecast the weather,

0:52:22.880 --> 0:52:26.239
<v Speaker 2>that jet stream is unpredictable. It's unpredictable. Yeah, there's some

0:52:26.360 --> 0:52:28.960
<v Speaker 2>days where even Chris was like, yeah, looks like it's

0:52:28.960 --> 0:52:31.399
<v Speaker 2>gonna be maybe twenty mile prior wins and it's like, oh,

0:52:32.200 --> 0:52:34.480
<v Speaker 2>it's terrible. And then and then there were days where

0:52:34.480 --> 0:52:37.399
<v Speaker 2>it was forecasted maybe twenty and it was dead calm,

0:52:38.080 --> 0:52:40.879
<v Speaker 2>and yeah, Unfortunately the four summits I've done have been

0:52:41.000 --> 0:52:45.080
<v Speaker 2>twenty first, twenty third, twenty sixth, and June first, so

0:52:45.280 --> 0:52:49.040
<v Speaker 2>later in the period, and always they've been good. Fortunately,

0:52:49.120 --> 0:52:49.959
<v Speaker 2>they've been really good.

0:52:50.040 --> 0:52:54.920
<v Speaker 1>It's this push and poll of we have better weather technology, imperfect,

0:52:55.000 --> 0:52:57.680
<v Speaker 1>but better. Yeah, but then also the rising popularity of

0:52:57.719 --> 0:53:00.560
<v Speaker 1>the mountain where so yeah, tell people about like the

0:53:00.600 --> 0:53:02.640
<v Speaker 1>Hillary step and how people have to wait and what's

0:53:02.640 --> 0:53:03.400
<v Speaker 1>the danger in that?

0:53:03.640 --> 0:53:06.399
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean the dangers higher up is that, yeah,

0:53:06.440 --> 0:53:09.400
<v Speaker 2>it's cold, but and you got to keep moving. But

0:53:10.200 --> 0:53:13.000
<v Speaker 2>you know most climbers don't evers climb with oxygen, so

0:53:13.520 --> 0:53:16.239
<v Speaker 2>and when a guide to guide on it. So when

0:53:16.280 --> 0:53:20.120
<v Speaker 2>you're up that high, if oxygen runs out, you're cooked,

0:53:20.760 --> 0:53:24.640
<v Speaker 2>like it's like a drug. And so you could be

0:53:24.680 --> 0:53:26.680
<v Speaker 2>going up and if you're taking too long on that

0:53:26.760 --> 0:53:29.040
<v Speaker 2>Hillary step, and it's just why the trails as wide

0:53:29.040 --> 0:53:31.520
<v Speaker 2>as this table. Okay, And so you couple you can

0:53:31.520 --> 0:53:33.480
<v Speaker 2>see how you can't really get by. You can try

0:53:33.520 --> 0:53:35.640
<v Speaker 2>you kind of wrap around. It's easier to get around

0:53:35.640 --> 0:53:38.600
<v Speaker 2>people on the way down. And one of my summits

0:53:38.600 --> 0:53:42.279
<v Speaker 2>in twenty twenty four with Devin was actually a crowded day.

0:53:42.920 --> 0:53:45.280
<v Speaker 2>The way we avoided that was we started really early

0:53:45.320 --> 0:53:48.000
<v Speaker 2>and we're on the summit at like five am and

0:53:48.040 --> 0:53:50.719
<v Speaker 2>got off the summit before six am, and on the

0:53:50.760 --> 0:53:53.440
<v Speaker 2>way down, tons of people were coming up and we

0:53:53.560 --> 0:53:55.560
<v Speaker 2>just reached around and reached around them. And then once

0:53:55.600 --> 0:53:58.399
<v Speaker 2>you got to the South Summit, which is maybe an

0:53:58.400 --> 0:54:00.839
<v Speaker 2>hour down, you could get down real quick and out

0:54:00.840 --> 0:54:02.640
<v Speaker 2>of there and it's you can get by people then.

0:54:03.160 --> 0:54:05.640
<v Speaker 2>So so yeah, we were able to manage it accordingly.

0:54:05.719 --> 0:54:07.239
<v Speaker 2>But that day there were a lot of people up

0:54:07.280 --> 0:54:10.920
<v Speaker 2>there getting stuck. People can wait for hours, yeah, two hours,

0:54:11.120 --> 0:54:14.680
<v Speaker 2>because then the other thing that happens in people's minds. Yeah,

0:54:14.680 --> 0:54:17.520
<v Speaker 2>I mean gratefully, I've found that I've pretty clear head

0:54:17.680 --> 0:54:20.440
<v Speaker 2>up on those heights. Even you know, they say, oh,

0:54:20.680 --> 0:54:23.000
<v Speaker 2>people are focusing, they don't pay attention. I'm like, I'm

0:54:23.040 --> 0:54:26.560
<v Speaker 2>pretty aware of everything that's going on. But I'll stand

0:54:26.560 --> 0:54:28.319
<v Speaker 2>there and it's amazing how you try to talk to

0:54:28.400 --> 0:54:31.320
<v Speaker 2>somebody and they're so locked in. And that's what happens

0:54:31.360 --> 0:54:33.000
<v Speaker 2>on that step is you can be the line of

0:54:33.000 --> 0:54:35.760
<v Speaker 2>climbers and they're coming up and no one will stop,

0:54:35.800 --> 0:54:37.879
<v Speaker 2>and you know, rest for a second. Let you kind

0:54:37.880 --> 0:54:39.719
<v Speaker 2>of come down and go by and you can end

0:54:39.800 --> 0:54:42.360
<v Speaker 2>up standing there for like two hours. And if people

0:54:42.440 --> 0:54:44.520
<v Speaker 2>if you run out of bucy, then that's when people's

0:54:45.400 --> 0:54:50.040
<v Speaker 2>cognitive functions and people's decision making and people's stamina just

0:54:50.080 --> 0:54:53.680
<v Speaker 2>goes down the tubes. And that's the biggest problem is

0:54:53.719 --> 0:54:56.960
<v Speaker 2>with the lines. Yeah, we were reading about even this season,

0:54:57.080 --> 0:55:00.880
<v Speaker 2>some people having a twenty four hour can't for to camp.

0:55:01.320 --> 0:55:03.239
<v Speaker 2>If Camp ford a summit and back to Camp four

0:55:03.360 --> 0:55:06.200
<v Speaker 2>for twenty four hours, how long does it usually take.

0:55:06.320 --> 0:55:08.759
<v Speaker 2>It's way too long. Usually you should be going up

0:55:09.040 --> 0:55:12.920
<v Speaker 2>from Camp four three thousand vertical to the summit in

0:55:13.040 --> 0:55:16.480
<v Speaker 2>about six to ten hours. If you take longer than

0:55:16.520 --> 0:55:20.759
<v Speaker 2>ten hours, something's wrong. And so when you do that,

0:55:21.360 --> 0:55:23.680
<v Speaker 2>and then if you're a fastestcender, you can come down

0:55:23.680 --> 0:55:26.279
<v Speaker 2>in two to four hours back to the camp, so

0:55:26.360 --> 0:55:28.040
<v Speaker 2>you can do it in a twelve hour round trip.

0:55:28.040 --> 0:55:31.600
<v Speaker 2>That's an acceptable time. Strong climbers will be a little faster.

0:55:32.160 --> 0:55:34.080
<v Speaker 2>If someone's a little bit beat up, maybe they take

0:55:34.120 --> 0:55:37.160
<v Speaker 2>fourteen hours. That's okay, we get pass about fourteen hours.

0:55:37.200 --> 0:55:40.160
<v Speaker 2>You're in the death zone. Then bad things can happen,

0:55:40.520 --> 0:55:42.839
<v Speaker 2>whether it's running out of oxygen or just being really

0:55:42.880 --> 0:55:45.759
<v Speaker 2>exerted and not being able to move very well. And

0:55:46.600 --> 0:55:48.960
<v Speaker 2>that's the one thing I'll pride myself upon with Everest

0:55:49.000 --> 0:55:52.560
<v Speaker 2>is and I feel like it's very ethical. Is that. Yeah,

0:55:52.600 --> 0:55:54.719
<v Speaker 2>we make sure we get our people up there for sunrise,

0:55:54.760 --> 0:55:56.840
<v Speaker 2>we get them back down to Camp four about like

0:55:56.960 --> 0:55:59.520
<v Speaker 2>nine or ten am, and then we don't let them

0:55:59.719 --> 0:56:02.520
<v Speaker 2>stay there. They stay for maybe an hour quick just

0:56:02.560 --> 0:56:04.959
<v Speaker 2>to eat and drink. We'll have another shrip of making

0:56:05.080 --> 0:56:06.799
<v Speaker 2>water and they can eat and drink, eat and drink,

0:56:07.200 --> 0:56:08.919
<v Speaker 2>We pack them, we get them out of there. Because

0:56:08.960 --> 0:56:11.000
<v Speaker 2>the lower you can get on Everest down to Camp

0:56:11.040 --> 0:56:14.320
<v Speaker 2>three in Camp two by like lunchtime is the best way,

0:56:14.440 --> 0:56:18.040
<v Speaker 2>risk management wise to do the mountain. And we've been

0:56:18.080 --> 0:56:21.319
<v Speaker 2>watching these teams and these groups that just don't get it,

0:56:21.360 --> 0:56:25.800
<v Speaker 2>and they're going up for too long. Twelve fourteen, eighteen

0:56:25.840 --> 0:56:28.640
<v Speaker 2>hours are going up and then another six to ten

0:56:28.680 --> 0:56:31.719
<v Speaker 2>hours down. It's too long. And that those kinds of

0:56:31.760 --> 0:56:34.839
<v Speaker 2>ethics is what myself and many other guides are trying

0:56:34.880 --> 0:56:37.719
<v Speaker 2>to coach these other groups and teams to say that

0:56:37.719 --> 0:56:40.520
<v Speaker 2>that's not acceptable. Yeah, like that's how you get killed.

0:56:40.640 --> 0:56:44.319
<v Speaker 2>Super risky. Yeah, So you know, and over time, the

0:56:44.400 --> 0:56:47.000
<v Speaker 2>teams that are doing it the right way, in my opinion,

0:56:47.040 --> 0:56:49.359
<v Speaker 2>are the ones that are successful, safe and not having

0:56:49.400 --> 0:56:52.160
<v Speaker 2>any problems. But once you get past that, those times

0:56:52.160 --> 0:56:55.400
<v Speaker 2>it's just bad things have been happening. And most of

0:56:55.400 --> 0:56:57.600
<v Speaker 2>the deaths that have occurred on Everest it's been because

0:56:57.600 --> 0:56:58.759
<v Speaker 2>people don't abide by that.

0:56:59.440 --> 0:57:01.480
<v Speaker 1>How do you how do you have people train for

0:57:01.560 --> 0:57:03.200
<v Speaker 1>Everest like physical training?

0:57:04.320 --> 0:57:07.480
<v Speaker 2>Well, it's one of my favorite favorite sayings is trained

0:57:07.480 --> 0:57:11.399
<v Speaker 2>mounains of mountains, because what else is better than doing

0:57:11.440 --> 0:57:14.440
<v Speaker 2>the real thing? And on top of that, it's creating

0:57:14.440 --> 0:57:19.440
<v Speaker 2>those simulations. And so you know, someone like Mike who

0:57:19.480 --> 0:57:21.920
<v Speaker 2>trained with me for two years, he moved to Colorado.

0:57:21.960 --> 0:57:23.720
<v Speaker 2>We trained on mountains there, but then we went to

0:57:23.800 --> 0:57:26.160
<v Speaker 2>like four or five different countries and did some bigger

0:57:26.200 --> 0:57:28.960
<v Speaker 2>mountains with some sort of simulations of Everest where it's

0:57:29.560 --> 0:57:30.920
<v Speaker 2>you know, on the summ at night, we leave at

0:57:30.920 --> 0:57:32.920
<v Speaker 2>eight or nine pm and you climb through the night,

0:57:32.960 --> 0:57:34.760
<v Speaker 2>so you can sum it at four or five am

0:57:34.840 --> 0:57:37.920
<v Speaker 2>and the sunrise and then you're back down. And so

0:57:38.040 --> 0:57:42.520
<v Speaker 2>I would create a lot of Everest simulations where even

0:57:42.560 --> 0:57:45.000
<v Speaker 2>if it was a smaller mountain like Mount Rainier. Hey, Mike,

0:57:45.040 --> 0:57:47.640
<v Speaker 2>we're going to start at ten pm on Vernier and

0:57:47.680 --> 0:57:49.760
<v Speaker 2>climb through the night from the parking lot and do

0:57:49.800 --> 0:57:52.440
<v Speaker 2>a big day so we can sum it at sunrise

0:57:52.480 --> 0:57:54.280
<v Speaker 2>and come back down and so you can feel how

0:57:54.320 --> 0:57:57.960
<v Speaker 2>hard that is. And I think those simulations are the

0:57:58.000 --> 0:57:59.840
<v Speaker 2>best for anybody trying to do. Ever.

0:58:00.360 --> 0:58:03.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, probably his fitness is not improving all that much

0:58:04.000 --> 0:58:07.280
<v Speaker 1>that day, but what is happening is that his mind

0:58:07.360 --> 0:58:09.040
<v Speaker 1>is going, Okay, this is what it's going to be.

0:58:09.160 --> 0:58:12.200
<v Speaker 2>Like I've been here before, cold and dark, I'm fumbling

0:58:12.240 --> 0:58:14.360
<v Speaker 2>with my mittens. I've got to figure out where my

0:58:14.400 --> 0:58:16.040
<v Speaker 2>snacks are. I got to figure out how to make

0:58:16.040 --> 0:58:18.320
<v Speaker 2>sure my light doesn't go out. So it's all the

0:58:18.360 --> 0:58:21.480
<v Speaker 2>real world things. I mean, even tomorrow going to Mount

0:58:21.480 --> 0:58:24.480
<v Speaker 2>Whitney with some people that want to get ready Foreverest

0:58:24.520 --> 0:58:27.280
<v Speaker 2>at some point. Yeah, we're going to start at ten

0:58:27.360 --> 0:58:29.960
<v Speaker 2>pm and go through the night and see how they

0:58:30.120 --> 0:58:32.479
<v Speaker 2>see how tough they are, and that's a good way

0:58:32.800 --> 0:58:34.320
<v Speaker 2>to be Ever's ready.

0:58:34.480 --> 0:58:39.760
<v Speaker 1>What's the ideal build for mountaineers, Skinny.

0:58:39.720 --> 0:58:42.240
<v Speaker 2>I think, well, yeah, I mean a good example is me.

0:58:42.440 --> 0:58:45.560
<v Speaker 2>Like when I was in college, I played basketball at

0:58:45.600 --> 0:58:48.120
<v Speaker 2>Velpros University. I played for Scott Drew. Now who was

0:58:48.160 --> 0:58:50.640
<v Speaker 2>the coach of Baylor. We still stay in touch. And

0:58:51.840 --> 0:58:54.800
<v Speaker 2>I was about, well, I'm about six two sixty three.

0:58:54.800 --> 0:58:57.200
<v Speaker 2>I'm about the same height as Steph Curry actually, but

0:58:57.320 --> 0:59:00.560
<v Speaker 2>I weighed like two twenty five two thirty and college

0:59:01.080 --> 0:59:04.560
<v Speaker 2>just pushing more heavier weight, and I still had the

0:59:04.600 --> 0:59:07.520
<v Speaker 2>cardio to play basketball, but you just have to be bigger,

0:59:07.560 --> 0:59:09.840
<v Speaker 2>a little bit bigger and stronger. Now way about one

0:59:09.960 --> 0:59:12.880
<v Speaker 2>eighty and I found that not having that extra forty

0:59:12.920 --> 0:59:16.640
<v Speaker 2>to forty five pounds on my frame really benefits me

0:59:16.760 --> 0:59:19.880
<v Speaker 2>on the mountains. I can move much more efficiently. Cardio

0:59:20.120 --> 0:59:24.000
<v Speaker 2>strength and just endurance is there. So so yeah, a

0:59:24.040 --> 0:59:27.360
<v Speaker 2>prototypic person, they don't need to be so skinny and frail.

0:59:27.440 --> 0:59:30.240
<v Speaker 2>But if you don't have the extra, you know, sometimes

0:59:30.240 --> 0:59:32.120
<v Speaker 2>you get these guys that are like kind of jacked

0:59:32.120 --> 0:59:35.280
<v Speaker 2>and they kill Theminjarro and they get beach body and

0:59:35.320 --> 0:59:37.520
<v Speaker 2>they get pretty worked. Yeah, you know, and they look

0:59:37.560 --> 0:59:38.920
<v Speaker 2>at me and they're like, what the heck. You know,

0:59:38.960 --> 0:59:40.920
<v Speaker 2>I've had some guys on kill manjar the last few

0:59:40.960 --> 0:59:44.280
<v Speaker 2>years that they all summitted, but they were like, you know,

0:59:44.360 --> 0:59:48.000
<v Speaker 2>in their twenties and early thirties and young, and what's

0:59:48.040 --> 0:59:50.080
<v Speaker 2>going on why is doctor John so strong. I'm the

0:59:50.080 --> 0:59:52.160
<v Speaker 2>one that's like at the gym body and I'm tough,

0:59:52.240 --> 0:59:54.520
<v Speaker 2>you know. But but yeah, I found you can't have

0:59:54.600 --> 0:59:56.680
<v Speaker 2>that to have good amountain cardios.

0:59:56.960 --> 0:59:59.240
<v Speaker 1>Even if it's muscle, you're still having to carry it. Yeah,

0:59:59.240 --> 1:00:01.320
<v Speaker 1>you just need it enough to make it up. And

1:00:01.360 --> 1:00:03.600
<v Speaker 1>that's not going to be as much as people might think.

1:00:03.800 --> 1:00:06.120
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, So we still do is a lot of functional training,

1:00:06.160 --> 1:00:08.080
<v Speaker 2>and I have a couple of coaches that do work

1:00:08.080 --> 1:00:11.200
<v Speaker 2>with like clients of mine that want to train remotely

1:00:11.280 --> 1:00:13.960
<v Speaker 2>and based on where they live for example. But we

1:00:14.000 --> 1:00:16.720
<v Speaker 2>do try to up the cardio and the mountain experiences

1:00:17.040 --> 1:00:20.120
<v Speaker 2>because I think that's probably weighted, in my opinion, ninety

1:00:20.160 --> 1:00:23.480
<v Speaker 2>percent of the importance versus the gym. I do a

1:00:23.560 --> 1:00:26.520
<v Speaker 2>lot more yoga than actual weightlifting. Oh really, Yeah, to

1:00:26.560 --> 1:00:29.880
<v Speaker 2>stay stretched and stay strong with some of the poses.

1:00:29.960 --> 1:00:33.120
<v Speaker 2>And I'll do some functional training in the gym, but

1:00:33.800 --> 1:00:35.760
<v Speaker 2>sometimes the gym is few and far between because the

1:00:35.800 --> 1:00:38.040
<v Speaker 2>outdoors is my gym. You know. There you go.

1:00:38.200 --> 1:00:42.160
<v Speaker 1>So how do you approach eating on these big expeditions.

1:00:43.000 --> 1:00:46.120
<v Speaker 2>I do a lot of packing my own snacks. If

1:00:46.120 --> 1:00:48.960
<v Speaker 2>I want certain snacks that you can't get what's your

1:00:48.960 --> 1:00:54.960
<v Speaker 2>go to? Well, it depends, Like Paul, we eat a

1:00:54.960 --> 1:00:57.960
<v Speaker 2>lot of snickers, but awesome, But I mean I like

1:00:58.000 --> 1:01:01.000
<v Speaker 2>to try to eat eat healthy so or even just

1:01:01.040 --> 1:01:03.280
<v Speaker 2>like snacks that have a lot of good vitamins, minerals,

1:01:03.280 --> 1:01:07.600
<v Speaker 2>certain ingredients, superfoods, things like that, like pro bars I love.

1:01:07.760 --> 1:01:11.360
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, you eat the green one, the super food Yeah,

1:01:11.360 --> 1:01:12.800
<v Speaker 1>the superfood one is tasty.

1:01:13.000 --> 1:01:17.560
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that one's pretty nice. I learned a lot about

1:01:17.800 --> 1:01:21.560
<v Speaker 2>other sort of alternative type snacks and foods from Mike

1:01:21.720 --> 1:01:25.480
<v Speaker 2>actually because he was trying to, you know, eliminate sugar,

1:01:26.280 --> 1:01:28.920
<v Speaker 2>and sugar can be a problem, right, because some of

1:01:28.960 --> 1:01:31.520
<v Speaker 2>these these snacks are so sugar and it's like, well, yeah,

1:01:31.640 --> 1:01:33.120
<v Speaker 2>just a certain degree when you're out there, it's okay

1:01:33.120 --> 1:01:36.080
<v Speaker 2>because you're burning it all, but it also can make

1:01:36.120 --> 1:01:39.520
<v Speaker 2>your heart rate skyrocket. And also just like you know,

1:01:40.200 --> 1:01:43.000
<v Speaker 2>you got to get good protein as well. So he

1:01:43.120 --> 1:01:45.480
<v Speaker 2>was ordering a lot of different kind of organic type

1:01:46.160 --> 1:01:49.760
<v Speaker 2>bars or raw bars, like these brownie bars are good.

1:01:49.800 --> 1:01:52.520
<v Speaker 2>The brand name was. And then we had these mirror

1:01:52.600 --> 1:01:57.400
<v Speaker 2>energies they were called yeah, yeah, Mirror Energy, which were

1:01:57.440 --> 1:02:00.000
<v Speaker 2>like less sugar in them, it's like all natural ingredients.

1:02:01.520 --> 1:02:04.200
<v Speaker 2>But then actually The other one that I really gravitate towards,

1:02:04.360 --> 1:02:10.120
<v Speaker 2>especially on US trips, is just real fruits and vegetables,

1:02:10.120 --> 1:02:14.720
<v Speaker 2>so like cuties and apples and bananas. I mean, that's

1:02:14.720 --> 1:02:17.160
<v Speaker 2>what I grabbed the store that I'm gonna take tomorrow

1:02:17.200 --> 1:02:19.560
<v Speaker 2>because I just want to eat real food. My trail

1:02:19.640 --> 1:02:23.800
<v Speaker 2>name was Avocado, so I would carry alvocados and just

1:02:23.840 --> 1:02:26.040
<v Speaker 2>cut them up and eat them straight on the trail,

1:02:26.600 --> 1:02:28.800
<v Speaker 2>you know, two or three a day. Sometimes good oil

1:02:28.840 --> 1:02:30.320
<v Speaker 2>is good fats, that kind of thing.

1:02:30.720 --> 1:02:34.160
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so we're going to take a break and then

1:02:34.200 --> 1:02:36.240
<v Speaker 1>John is going to tell us about the best hikes

1:02:36.240 --> 1:02:46.240
<v Speaker 1>and climbs that anyone can do. Peaks in Colorado, the

1:02:46.320 --> 1:02:50.520
<v Speaker 1>average person could climb that. You like, what do you recommend?

1:02:50.760 --> 1:02:53.160
<v Speaker 2>I like going down to like Buna Vista and the

1:02:53.600 --> 1:02:56.200
<v Speaker 2>Cleegiate Peaks are there, and you've got hot springs and

1:02:56.240 --> 1:02:59.360
<v Speaker 2>the trails are easy to access, and then they're asspen

1:02:59.440 --> 1:03:02.400
<v Speaker 2>I mean, I obviously the peaks and Asthma are more

1:03:02.440 --> 1:03:04.480
<v Speaker 2>rugged like the Maroon Bells and Capital, but I end

1:03:04.560 --> 1:03:07.520
<v Speaker 2>up on the Maroon Bells and Capital and Castle Peak.

1:03:07.560 --> 1:03:10.040
<v Speaker 2>Every year I generally lead a hut trip over by

1:03:10.040 --> 1:03:12.600
<v Speaker 2>Castle Peak every winter because we love to ski down.

1:03:12.680 --> 1:03:15.520
<v Speaker 2>We actually ski down it this year, So yeah, I

1:03:15.560 --> 1:03:17.520
<v Speaker 2>just love the They're so beautiful. And then for me,

1:03:17.600 --> 1:03:19.360
<v Speaker 2>out of my backyard of vale As, you have the

1:03:19.440 --> 1:03:22.280
<v Speaker 2>Gore Mountains and Gore Range and they're all thirteen ers.

1:03:22.760 --> 1:03:26.200
<v Speaker 2>So because they're so they're not fourteen ers at all,

1:03:26.240 --> 1:03:29.360
<v Speaker 2>they're more rugged. You don't see people. You know, you

1:03:29.360 --> 1:03:30.880
<v Speaker 2>can go to a trail head on a Saturday and

1:03:30.880 --> 1:03:33.920
<v Speaker 2>it's empty, and so I like to get out on

1:03:34.040 --> 1:03:37.280
<v Speaker 2>places that you won't see anybody. It makes it more fun.

1:03:37.320 --> 1:03:39.720
<v Speaker 2>Even I like that. What's your go to pieces of

1:03:39.760 --> 1:03:43.480
<v Speaker 2>gear from a trail runner perspective? I like things that

1:03:43.520 --> 1:03:46.200
<v Speaker 2>are fast and light, So I mean I have a

1:03:46.240 --> 1:03:49.960
<v Speaker 2>few different sort of runners type hoodies that are like

1:03:50.040 --> 1:03:54.120
<v Speaker 2>more lightweight windbreaker type things. And then I'm on the

1:03:54.200 --> 1:03:56.440
<v Speaker 2>Hmalai Athlete team now, so like I love the sun

1:03:56.440 --> 1:04:02.120
<v Speaker 2>hoodies and they're accelerator jackets are great. We give those

1:04:02.160 --> 1:04:04.720
<v Speaker 2>to all of our clients and trips. Yeah, so we

1:04:05.360 --> 1:04:07.760
<v Speaker 2>hook people up with some of the gear. I'm not

1:04:07.800 --> 1:04:09.840
<v Speaker 2>a huge gearhead though, Like I'll have like shirts that

1:04:09.880 --> 1:04:11.760
<v Speaker 2>I've had forever and I'll wear them still that kind

1:04:11.800 --> 1:04:13.280
<v Speaker 2>of thing. People are like, do you have a hole

1:04:13.280 --> 1:04:14.880
<v Speaker 2>in that, like get a new shirt, and I'm like, well,

1:04:14.920 --> 1:04:15.600
<v Speaker 2>I like it, you know.

1:04:15.640 --> 1:04:20.280
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so it's good to not get too Yeah. Yeah,

1:04:20.400 --> 1:04:23.720
<v Speaker 1>I have friends that I think they enjoy the process

1:04:23.720 --> 1:04:25.920
<v Speaker 1>of looking for and buying gear more than they do

1:04:26.080 --> 1:04:27.000
<v Speaker 1>actually going out.

1:04:26.920 --> 1:04:29.600
<v Speaker 2>In the wilderness. Yeah. Yeah, I always chuckle at that

1:04:30.440 --> 1:04:34.560
<v Speaker 2>going back functional for sure, over like looks. Sometimes my

1:04:34.600 --> 1:04:37.600
<v Speaker 2>color schemes aren't great, but although with Hamali my gear

1:04:37.840 --> 1:04:40.120
<v Speaker 2>gets better, for sure. Yeah, I like it.

1:04:40.800 --> 1:04:45.160
<v Speaker 1>With sort of everything you've learned from the mountains, what's

1:04:45.200 --> 1:04:47.200
<v Speaker 1>the takeaway for the average person, Like, how do they

1:04:47.280 --> 1:04:48.120
<v Speaker 1>use this in their own life?

1:04:48.120 --> 1:04:48.640
<v Speaker 2>If they're like.

1:04:48.600 --> 1:04:51.040
<v Speaker 1>I'm never going to climb a mountain, dude, Yeah, what

1:04:51.040 --> 1:04:52.400
<v Speaker 1>can I do? And what can I learn from it?

1:04:52.880 --> 1:04:54.920
<v Speaker 2>I mean, I think you have to accept an embrace

1:04:55.000 --> 1:04:58.680
<v Speaker 2>being uncomfortable on some level in order to grow. I

1:04:58.720 --> 1:05:02.400
<v Speaker 2>can stamp that seal of approval. Yeah, And I mean

1:05:02.400 --> 1:05:04.919
<v Speaker 2>that's that's how I've lived my life now and it's

1:05:05.000 --> 1:05:08.880
<v Speaker 2>changed my life for the better no matter what. And

1:05:09.040 --> 1:05:13.120
<v Speaker 2>then when it comes to doing projects in the outdoors

1:05:13.640 --> 1:05:16.280
<v Speaker 2>or signing up for a trip or going out with

1:05:16.320 --> 1:05:18.960
<v Speaker 2>your friends, is like you should just say yes, Like

1:05:19.000 --> 1:05:22.760
<v Speaker 2>if if someone asks you to do something crazy and audacious,

1:05:23.040 --> 1:05:26.240
<v Speaker 2>you should always say yes, and if you do, like

1:05:26.560 --> 1:05:32.040
<v Speaker 2>what possibly could go wrong? Something will happen. Yeah. Yeah.

1:05:32.120 --> 1:05:34.400
<v Speaker 1>The guy I did the Heyduke with he would always

1:05:34.480 --> 1:05:35.800
<v Speaker 1>just say something will happen.

1:05:36.400 --> 1:05:37.440
<v Speaker 2>Like that.

1:05:37.640 --> 1:05:40.080
<v Speaker 1>That's the most accurate sentence I've ever heard of my life.

1:05:40.080 --> 1:05:43.760
<v Speaker 1>Something will happen, Matt. Well, John, it is awesome to

1:05:43.800 --> 1:05:48.280
<v Speaker 1>have you. Yeah, I appreciate having here. Thanks, thanks for

1:05:48.360 --> 1:05:50.600
<v Speaker 1>checking out the show, and thanks to John for coming

1:05:50.600 --> 1:05:52.840
<v Speaker 1>into the studio on his way to climb another mountain.

1:05:53.320 --> 1:05:55.560
<v Speaker 1>As a reminder, we are in your feed twice a week,

1:05:55.600 --> 1:05:57.680
<v Speaker 1>so please keep an eye out for more. Don't forget

1:05:57.720 --> 1:06:00.000
<v Speaker 1>to hit subscribe so you can get those updates when

1:06:00.120 --> 1:06:02.400
<v Speaker 1>new episodes come out, and if you want to watch

1:06:02.440 --> 1:06:05.320
<v Speaker 1>it on the new and free iHeart video app, you

1:06:05.320 --> 1:06:08.280
<v Speaker 1>should definitely do that. We're always open to questions, so

1:06:08.360 --> 1:06:11.320
<v Speaker 1>please send them to media at twopct dot com or

1:06:11.400 --> 1:06:13.000
<v Speaker 1>drop them in the comments and we will be sure

1:06:13.040 --> 1:06:15.520
<v Speaker 1>to answer as many of your questions as we can.

1:06:16.160 --> 1:06:20.240
<v Speaker 1>As always, have fun, don't die, and find your next mountain.