Speaker 1: Welcome back to another episode of Big Money Energy, where
Speaker 1: we talked to super successful and self made people to
Speaker 1: find out exactly how they did it, how they went
Speaker 1: from nothing to something. I'm Ryan, Sirhant, and today I'm
Speaker 1: talking to a pioneer in the world of banking, Marianne Lake.
Speaker 1: She's the Chief Executive Officer of Consumer Lending at JP
Speaker 1: Morgan Chase and knows everything there is to know about money.
Speaker 1: We discuss advice for people looking to pay down debt,
Speaker 1: the biggest mistakes people make with their money, what Americans
Speaker 1: take for granted in the banking system, and whether or
Speaker 1: not it's smart to invest in cryptocurrency. So let's get
Speaker 1: into it. Welcome to another episode. Today is a very
Speaker 1: very special day because I finally got the guests who's
Speaker 1: in front of me to agree to sit down with me.
Speaker 1: Her schedule is insane for a lot of different reasons. One,
Speaker 1: she's an absolute icon. She is a mega businesswoman. She's
Speaker 1: the former CFO of JP Morgan and now the CEO
Speaker 1: of Consumer Lending at JP Morgan Chase. Mary Anne Lake.
Speaker 1: She's been with JP Morgan for twenty years, working as
Speaker 1: a senior financial officer in London. Office and managing the
Speaker 1: global financial infrastructure and control programs as a part of
Speaker 1: the Corporate Finance Group. Not to mention she's a champion
Speaker 1: of empowering women in finance. She is the co founder
Speaker 1: of the Women on the Move Initiative, the largest employee
Speaker 1: business resource group at the company. And as if that
Speaker 1: wasn't enough, she also sits on the board of directors
Speaker 1: of the New York City Ballet. She is easily one
Speaker 1: of the smartest and most influential people in the world. Um,
Speaker 1: and that is a statement. I'm gonna leave that there,
Speaker 1: and has had such a dynamic career. Chase Cards Services
Speaker 1: alone is the number one credit card issuer in the nation.
Speaker 1: So I am super excited to be sitting down with
Speaker 1: her today. Out further ado, Hi, Marianne, thanks for doing this.
Speaker 1: My absolute pleasure to do it, and I'm thrilled to
Speaker 1: be here. And that was a big intro, so we'll
Speaker 1: hope to live up to it a bit. Well, there's more.
Speaker 1: You know, when I wrote the intro, it was like
Speaker 1: a full page. You know, it's tough because you do
Speaker 1: so many things and you've had such a really it's
Speaker 1: such an important and impressive career so then I'm like
Speaker 1: trying to figure out with the team, like, Okay, we
Speaker 1: won't go through all this stuff and I just I'll
Speaker 1: just talk to her. How is it being back in
Speaker 1: the city today. It's good. I like you to be here.
Speaker 1: I miss it, if I'm honest with you, you know,
Speaker 1: I think we've become incredibly capable virtually, and there are
Speaker 1: some really big benefits to it, and some of those
Speaker 1: are family related and some of them are, you know, professionally,
Speaker 1: But I miss it. I missed the combustion, the collaboration,
Speaker 1: that kind of bumping into people in the corridor. So
Speaker 1: it's fun to be back for me. You know, back
Speaker 1: then it was, you know, it was very new, scary.
Speaker 1: Nobody knew what they were doing. New York was the
Speaker 1: epicenter of this whole thing. And even though you know,
Speaker 1: nationally it's still um, the pandemic is still an issue.
Speaker 1: I feel like we kind of have a little bit
Speaker 1: of an understanding about how to cope with it here.
Speaker 1: So yeah, it's kind of like anything, right, Like you
Speaker 1: you kind of figure out what your flaws are personally,
Speaker 1: and then you just learn how to amplify your better traits.
Speaker 1: It's like we've all kind of figured out, all right,
Speaker 1: this virus is a flaw. We want to amplify our
Speaker 1: better traits, coping mechanisms, all that. Can you talk to
Speaker 1: me for just for a split second about you know,
Speaker 1: you see all the time hospitals and you know, let's
Speaker 1: say the police force fire department, they run drills all
Speaker 1: the time for you know, terrorist attacks, for anything, anything, anything.
Speaker 1: You are a very very large part of the biggest
Speaker 1: bank in the world. Are there drills for if everyone
Speaker 1: needs to stay home for seven months? What do you do?
Speaker 1: How you operate? Yeah? So, I mean look, business resiliency
Speaker 1: and kind of operational resildiency is a you know, pretty
Speaker 1: critical part of what we do, and we're systemically important
Speaker 1: all around the world to you know, the financial infrastructure
Speaker 1: and all of our clients, and so we do drill
Speaker 1: all of the time in every possible way. To be
Speaker 1: completely candid, you know, many of the resiliency plans that
Speaker 1: companies had in all genres of industry involved failing over
Speaker 1: from one location to another and level loading around the world.
Speaker 1: And clearly I would be misleading you to suggest that
Speaker 1: we had the you know, one year long global pandemic
Speaker 1: work from home drill. So you know, there was a
Speaker 1: lot of lessons to be learned. And you know, my
Speaker 1: hat is off to all the tech and infrastructure folks here,
Speaker 1: you know, at our company, but quite frankly, you know
Speaker 1: everywhere that managed to pull off getting you know, for
Speaker 1: us two d fifty thousand close to two hundred and
Speaker 1: fifty thousand people working from home in weeks and we've
Speaker 1: just gotten better and better and better. And so you know,
Speaker 1: when we look forward now to whatever that looks like,
Speaker 1: resiliency planning for the future, you know, one of the
Speaker 1: things that will be you know, conscious of is you know,
Speaker 1: this whole dynamic of virtual working, working from home, and
Speaker 1: you know, we should never lose this capability now, right,
Speaker 1: One of the things that we're focus on and everybody
Speaker 1: will be focused on, is what does the you know,
Speaker 1: workpace solution look like in the future ways of working?
Speaker 1: You know, will people be physical virtual hybrid? You know,
Speaker 1: what will that look like? And so you know we're
Speaker 1: working on it too, and it will be different. I'm
Speaker 1: pretty sure would have been the benefits of virtual work
Speaker 1: in a bank is productivity? Still there is the intellectual
Speaker 1: conversation what's tougher like? What do you think that what
Speaker 1: do you think is going to come out of this
Speaker 1: Other than just that you can save on office space,
Speaker 1: which everyone talks about. We're more worried about the things
Speaker 1: that you might lose than necessarily focusing on the benefits.
Speaker 1: But there are some I would say, you know, first
Speaker 1: of all, this has been a deeply human crisis, and
Speaker 1: so you know, we are first and foremost we employ um,
Speaker 1: you know, two human beings who have families that they
Speaker 1: care about, and many of many people have experienced sickness
Speaker 1: and grief. And so the ability to continue to employ
Speaker 1: those people and allow them to have, you know, a
Speaker 1: more flexible working dynamic when they're kind of personal and
Speaker 1: professional life is collided in this un like precedented, completely
Speaker 1: unimaginable way, you know, has been a benefit, of course,
Speaker 1: because you know, otherwise more people would have had to
Speaker 1: put their hand up and say, I'm tapping out. I
Speaker 1: need to go deal with you know, my kids, my family,
Speaker 1: my circumstances, and you know, I think this virtual world
Speaker 1: has allowed a degree of flexibility that we see when
Speaker 1: we measure the statistics. We see some people are working
Speaker 1: later at night and having to take some time off
Speaker 1: during the day to get stuff done. Other people are
Speaker 1: coming in because we need them to. Branches need to
Speaker 1: be staffed to help our customers. The traders are in,
Speaker 1: you know, and other people are working you know, an
Speaker 1: extra hour a day that they're not commuting. So we're
Speaker 1: paranoid about losing productivity. We measure everything we can measure,
Speaker 1: which is not everything. I think that you know, our
Speaker 1: employees have met us more than halfway and are like
Speaker 1: putting in the extra time when they can, and so
Speaker 1: we're just you know, sort of keeping the face. Now.
Speaker 1: What we're worried about, other than just activity, is the
Speaker 1: cultural draw down because you know, you build You're a
Speaker 1: relationship guy, right, You build relationships because you have the
Speaker 1: human interaction and the human factor and you get the
Speaker 1: organic opportunities to sort of understand people and what makes
Speaker 1: them tick. And you know that's hard. So figuring out
Speaker 1: how you can mentor people virtually making the time to
Speaker 1: like hire, how you hire people, how you train them,
Speaker 1: how you mentor them, how you teach them the culture,
Speaker 1: and then how you maintain the culture. That's you know,
Speaker 1: what we're focused on. And you know, so far, so good, honestly,
Speaker 1: like pleasantly surprised, but you know, it's the watch item,
Speaker 1: and we're paranoid about that, so we're focused on over
Speaker 1: compensating for it. We've started to have what we're calling
Speaker 1: like zoom amnesia, because if the place doesn't change, the
Speaker 1: screen doesn't change, and all that's changing, or the little
Speaker 1: squares and faces. You know, I will always remember this meeting,
Speaker 1: sitting down with you. I always remember, you know, good
Speaker 1: times I've had with other people physically, because I haven't
Speaker 1: going to remember these ceilings. You know that whatever the
Speaker 1: zoom always looks the same, and so you know it's like, oh,
Speaker 1: remember that conversation we had, and like I honestly vaguely,
Speaker 1: I mean I remember, I remember the sound, remember exactly
Speaker 1: that specific zoom meeting. Which is which is I think
Speaker 1: tough for tough for growth? Right, Like it's everyone's going
Speaker 1: to become either these these task tickers and doers. Everyone's
Speaker 1: gonna have their little memo pads because they're not going
Speaker 1: to be able to remember specific situations because they will
Speaker 1: have no planting in place. Right, there's no hook. Everything
Speaker 1: is like monochrome. But you know, look, I will say
Speaker 1: one other benefit for me, and you know, I'm like
Speaker 1: thrilled about this is if if you call me on
Speaker 1: the phone these days, like you know, CELLU learned no video,
Speaker 1: I'm like, what are you doing? Why? Why would you
Speaker 1: do that? Why are we not looking at each other?
Speaker 1: Like we can't necessarily be in the same room And
Speaker 1: that's like a given. But now everything I do is
Speaker 1: face to face. And so I'm weaning myself off email,
Speaker 1: not completely, but as much as I can. And that's
Speaker 1: a benefit, so you know, and I'm able to zoom
Speaker 1: you at nine o'clock at night and it doesn't like
Speaker 1: ruined my day. So there are some good stuff and
Speaker 1: dinner with my kids, yes, family time. How stressful was
Speaker 1: March twenty twenty. I think that this company and like
Speaker 1: for me, you know, we rise to a good crisis.
Speaker 1: If I'm honest with you, and you know, I think
Speaker 1: that you feel the stress of it kind of a
Speaker 1: little bit more when you're past the peak, So you know,
Speaker 1: I would say, kind of June maybe felt to me
Speaker 1: like my gosh, this is like, you know, still going
Speaker 1: and here we are now in January. I think in
Speaker 1: March for me it was it was all about our customers.
Speaker 1: You know, we had millions of customers that needed our help.
Speaker 1: In a variety of different capacities and they needed it quickly.
Speaker 1: And when we were all sitting there in March, I
Speaker 1: don't know about you, but you know, we didn't know
Speaker 1: where it was going to end. And you know, we
Speaker 1: were talking about unemployment in the you know above t
Speaker 1: and you know, so if you think about the business
Speaker 1: that we're in in terms of helping people, you know,
Speaker 1: both with their financial lives in terms of their banking investments,
Speaker 1: but also you know, with their lending um you know,
Speaker 1: being able to provide them with quick solutions and you know,
Speaker 1: engage with them digitally. That's the other thing. We're a
Speaker 1: world where you know, our default is, you know, pick
Speaker 1: up the phone and call the call center or go
Speaker 1: into the branch and ask for help. And so we
Speaker 1: rapidly had to turn around and say no, no no, no,
Speaker 1: like we've we've got you covered digitally, and like reabituating
Speaker 1: or obituating people to do things a little differently. So
Speaker 1: I would say March and April it was like you know, execution, execution, execution,
Speaker 1: you know, meeting every day, like solving problems, like figuring
Speaker 1: out the plan, like getting after it, like singularly focused
Speaker 1: on helping customers, and June was more than kind of
Speaker 1: and then you know, you're re up what were some
Speaker 1: of the tough decisions that you all had to make. Honestly,
Speaker 1: if you come at something from a customer lends, decisions
Speaker 1: to kind of become a little easier. But for us
Speaker 1: it was you know that the government obviously has done
Speaker 1: a huge amount to help all Americans at least to
Speaker 1: try to, and you know we wanted to, you know,
Speaker 1: step up and do our part. And so clearly as
Speaker 1: you know, the cares that provided you know, certain protections
Speaker 1: and payment relief for only parts of the mortgage industry.
Speaker 1: And you know, I run not just a government lending business,
Speaker 1: but also proprietary business and also a credit card business
Speaker 1: and auto and auto lending business, and we have you know,
Speaker 1: lending to small businesses, and so you know, we made
Speaker 1: the decision that we were going to provide you know,
Speaker 1: consistent relief across all asset classes from Marche. We had
Speaker 1: it all built up and running digitally for everyone and
Speaker 1: not sort of be led necessarily by just what's required,
Speaker 1: but just you know, full stop, everybody who needs help
Speaker 1: can get ninety days of relief, no questions asked, across
Speaker 1: all asset classes to buy time, you know, for everybody
Speaker 1: to figure out where this was going. And I wouldn't
Speaker 1: say it was hard decision, but it was important to
Speaker 1: make the decision and just do it. Yeah, I will say,
Speaker 1: you know, in the converse stations that I have with salespeople,
Speaker 1: buyer sellers around the country, in Chase was one of
Speaker 1: those companies where everyone felt safe. Like that feeling. Actually,
Speaker 1: I think in hindsight, you guys will see this in
Speaker 1: consumer growth. Probably people always go to what they think
Speaker 1: is safe because you know, they hear it through rumor
Speaker 1: or they got them through that pandemic. I know, with
Speaker 1: kind of the you know, the paycheck protection program, Chase
Speaker 1: was right on top of it and was answering emails
Speaker 1: everything quickly, whereas other banks were having a really really
Speaker 1: hard time either technically or logistically playing catch up. But
Speaker 1: that program ran through. You know, it didn't, but you
Speaker 1: know part of the team that did it. And I
Speaker 1: have a colleague of mine who's like an extraordinary partner
Speaker 1: who spent large portions of her twenty year figuring out
Speaker 1: the p p P program and is now you know,
Speaker 1: doing again round two. And there will be you know,
Speaker 1: around three and listen, we moments of truth are important
Speaker 1: that you know, there are like customer experience is important
Speaker 1: all the time, but it's never more important than when
Speaker 1: there's a moment of truth for someone regardless of what
Speaker 1: that is. That's what people remember. You know, you had
Speaker 1: my back when I needed your help. And you know,
Speaker 1: did we do everything right? You know? No? And did
Speaker 1: you know will every customer be you know, we'll be
Speaker 1: equally happy. I'm sure not, but we like definitely tried
Speaker 1: and it is you know, our intention to like meet
Speaker 1: our customers in those moments of truth. So PPP was
Speaker 1: you know a really important program? Wasn't straightforward? It still isn't,
Speaker 1: but you know we did our best. Are you you know,
Speaker 1: motivated because there are so many people looking for home
Speaker 1: loans right now and buying cars and spending money? Or
Speaker 1: is there a worry in the back of your mind
Speaker 1: as someone who runs the entire lending business, that these
Speaker 1: interest rates are just too low? Where does inflation go?
Speaker 1: What are the next couple of years going to look like?
Speaker 1: These valuations, forget New York City, valuations on real estate
Speaker 1: around the country are not making a whole lot of sense.
Speaker 1: Like where we go from here, Disco. Do you think
Speaker 1: it's a kind of roaring twenties into another crisis or
Speaker 1: do you think we are set up as much smarter
Speaker 1: and more capable. And so I think for me, I
Speaker 1: think this is a very different situation than the great
Speaker 1: you know, the recession that we had in the last
Speaker 1: ten years. And I can speak for us, but I
Speaker 1: think it's true, you know, quite broadly that like our
Speaker 1: business is very different today than it was before, and
Speaker 1: you know, we de risked and so and and this
Speaker 1: isn't a consumer lead crisis either, So consumer balance sheets
Speaker 1: are stronger. I mean that's not to say obviously that
Speaker 1: at the margin there are not you know a lot
Speaker 1: of people who are and will struggle and we should
Speaker 1: have like significant empathy and might be there to help folks.
Speaker 1: But you know, it is the case that you know,
Speaker 1: in that kind of ability and willingness to pay spectrum,
Speaker 1: you know, I think that the consumer just generally is
Speaker 1: in a decent spot. And so with interest rates where
Speaker 1: they are, and you know, and the appetite as you
Speaker 1: talked about for home purchases in record purchase volumes in
Speaker 1: this region, we've doubled our mortgage origination year. Every year.
Speaker 1: I do think the next year or two has a
Speaker 1: long way to run. And you know, we pulled back
Speaker 1: a little bit on risk of course, you know, so
Speaker 1: we we are always going to make sure that when
Speaker 1: we do loans, we expect our customers be able to
Speaker 1: unwilling to pay them. Um. So I don't actually see
Speaker 1: that this is going to be something where we're going
Speaker 1: to get through the next couple of years and then
Speaker 1: see a significant consumer stress. But you know, we prepare
Speaker 1: for the worst always. What advice do you give to
Speaker 1: anyone who's listening who might have you know, let's say,
Speaker 1: either lower credit or they've got a student loan that
Speaker 1: they need to pay down. So it makes things hard
Speaker 1: in this idea of the American dream of home ownership
Speaker 1: just seems like it's getting further and further and further
Speaker 1: away from their grasp. Is it? Just listen, go through
Speaker 1: the motions. You gotta make money, they got to be
Speaker 1: able to build up. These are the protocols. You know,
Speaker 1: big banks need to calculate risk because there we we
Speaker 1: deal with a lot of people as well. Um, you know,
Speaker 1: first time homebuyers who have said to us, well listen, right,
Speaker 1: I can't even I have some money, but I've got
Speaker 1: this loan to pay down, I got this to handle,
Speaker 1: I got this. I don't think I'll ever be able
Speaker 1: to buy a home or afford it. Yeah, I mean, look,
Speaker 1: at the end of the day, there are some things
Speaker 1: you can control, and then there are obviously things that
Speaker 1: you can't. And so you know, as an individual, you
Speaker 1: can control like your credit, education, your financial health, doing
Speaker 1: what you can do to make sure that you're positioning
Speaker 1: yourself the best way you can for someone who's gonna,
Speaker 1: you know, potentially assess you, you know for you know,
Speaker 1: credit worthiness in the future. And so you know, everywhere
Speaker 1: that you look, you can find your credit score, you
Speaker 1: can find tips on how to improve it, um and
Speaker 1: just maintain good financial discipline and health in what you do.
Speaker 1: Do pay your bills on time, and don't overreach and
Speaker 1: and and so for me, if you kind of take
Speaker 1: those disciplines um, you know, into account and then I
Speaker 1: would also say for us, we we also build relationships.
Speaker 1: So it's not to say that we don't want to
Speaker 1: make money on a transaction. But for me, if you're
Speaker 1: a customer of Chase, you have had your financial situation
Speaker 1: with us, we know your inflows, we know your outflows,
Speaker 1: we know what you have. We're more inclined to be
Speaker 1: able to lend you because we see risk separation. We
Speaker 1: see that the performance of our own customers is better.
Speaker 1: So I would say, you know, consolidate your financial situation
Speaker 1: with a partner you trust, pay attention to your financial
Speaker 1: discipline and your own financial health, do what you can
Speaker 1: to improve your situation. And then there's an element of
Speaker 1: things you can't control, so you know, patients is also
Speaker 1: a virtue. And then if you can't you know, reach
Speaker 1: the goals of being able to own a home, then
Speaker 1: maybe there's other ways you can invest and continue to
Speaker 1: grow your wealth. I mean, obviously the American dream is
Speaker 1: that you have you know, home ownership and that it's
Speaker 1: able to sort of create generational wealth for you and
Speaker 1: and that's something for everyone should aspire to you, but
Speaker 1: any wealth creation would be helpful. What was your connection
Speaker 1: to money growing up? And as a kid, do you
Speaker 1: remember so my dad he was an electronic engineer, so
Speaker 1: he wasn't like this super ambitious guy, incredibly smart, um,
Speaker 1: you know, had a good job. We were sort of
Speaker 1: very happy and you know, financially healthy, but we didn't.
Speaker 1: We weren't like wealthy by the stretch of imagination. I
Speaker 1: do have a recollection and it's like not particularly clear,
Speaker 1: but I do have a recollection of when I was
Speaker 1: you know, old enough to know and young enough not
Speaker 1: to be worried about it. Of interest rates in the
Speaker 1: UK like hitting double digits and they're being you know,
Speaker 1: a big negative equity wave and it being an actual
Speaker 1: thing that was you know, worrying for my family. So
Speaker 1: I have that recollection. And but other than that, you know,
Speaker 1: it wasn't really something that I paid huge amounts of
Speaker 1: attention to. We didn't have any real challenges, We didn't
Speaker 1: have you know, significant excess either. And I would say
Speaker 1: one sort of formative financial thing for me was when
Speaker 1: I was at college and you know, I worked a
Speaker 1: job as well as being at college and you know,
Speaker 1: has a barmaid pulled pines, um, so yeah, it's fun,
Speaker 1: it's social. Why not. But I did that as well
Speaker 1: as like being at college, and I don't even really
Speaker 1: know or have a clear appreciation of how I did it.
Speaker 1: But I ran up some that's not like huge, but
Speaker 1: like enough that I couldn't you get out on credit
Speaker 1: cards and stuff not on credit cards, but like you know,
Speaker 1: just not not so significant that it would be a thing.
Speaker 1: But I remember being like really embarrassed and just like
Speaker 1: making myself the promise that that's not happening again. And so,
Speaker 1: you know, planning is a big part of what I do.
Speaker 1: It's someone who's advised and is consulted, and it is
Speaker 1: now a part of a very very large bank. What
Speaker 1: what's the biggest money advice that you've either given or
Speaker 1: someone's given to you that that you think everyone who's
Speaker 1: listening could take away from. So I think two things.
Speaker 1: One is like, you know, a little bit more super tactical,
Speaker 1: but I think probably the most important thing. And then
Speaker 1: one may be a bit more strategic. You need to
Speaker 1: have some liquidity. You know, stuff happens and you can't
Speaker 1: control everything clearly, right And you know we have in
Speaker 1: this company, we have the JP Morgan Chase Institute that
Speaker 1: does a lot of kind of research and did some
Speaker 1: research on you know, um savings, and you know what
Speaker 1: you need to be able to weather you know, a
Speaker 1: contemporaneous or a simultaneous you know, decrease in income with
Speaker 1: the spike and expenses. I think you lose your job
Speaker 1: or your hours are curtailed, and you have a medical expense,
Speaker 1: and you know, mostly you know, the rule of thumb
Speaker 1: is six weeks of like you know, take home pay
Speaker 1: would be a good liquidity buffer to try and help
Speaker 1: make you resilient through those kinds of normal income volatility stresses.
Speaker 1: And you know, two thirds of people in this company
Speaker 1: don't have that, and you know, so that's one of
Speaker 1: the reasons why national savings is such a priority. And
Speaker 1: I do the same thing. I mean, it looks different
Speaker 1: for me maybe, but you know, I, you know, take
Speaker 1: a look at what I have that I need to
Speaker 1: you know, lay out in terms of operating expense for
Speaker 1: my life and my family, and I make sure that
Speaker 1: that is at least for some period of time it's
Speaker 1: liquid and that I have access to it um And
Speaker 1: I just think that discipline, and it's not always possible,
Speaker 1: and everybody's situation is different, but I think that like
Speaker 1: having that when you can it is super important. And
Speaker 1: you know, any kind of goals based savings, any kind
Speaker 1: of ability to try and lean into that I think
Speaker 1: would be you know, great advice and has been for me.
Speaker 1: The other thing is, I think long term about your
Speaker 1: financial situation, if you can, like if you can get
Speaker 1: invested again, whether it's in investments, whether it's in you know,
Speaker 1: your first home. However that is, even if it's in
Speaker 1: a small amount, and stay invested through cycles and not
Speaker 1: get sort of over excited with you know, the day
Speaker 1: to day markets, stay invested, have a long term view.
Speaker 1: Generally speaking for me, that's you know, that's my philosophy.
Speaker 1: What's the biggest mistake though, that you think people make
Speaker 1: with money? You know, from your position where you sit,
Speaker 1: which you're the one, is there is there something you
Speaker 1: know where a one third of Americans I wish I
Speaker 1: wish people could just learn to stop doing that thing
Speaker 1: and they'd be so much better off as it just savings. Probably.
Speaker 1: I don't spend much time judging other people because you know,
Speaker 1: I think everything is relative to your situation. So you know,
Speaker 1: sometimes what looks like a mistake is by necessity. I
Speaker 1: do think it is literally at its core, just like
Speaker 1: financial discipline, so you know, don't overreach and pay your
Speaker 1: bills on time you know you can control. I mean
Speaker 1: not everybody can control all of the time. And if
Speaker 1: you lose your job and you haven't got the funds
Speaker 1: that you know, you know, circumstances can you know, can
Speaker 1: conspire against you, of course, but if you have the capacity,
Speaker 1: don't be sloppy. Um and you know, and then yes, savings.
Speaker 1: So to me, it would be if you have the capacity,
Speaker 1: if you're not in a difficult situation, don't be lacks,
Speaker 1: don't be sloppy, don't use track of things, be on
Speaker 1: top of it, like maintain the discipline that you would
Speaker 1: over your health or whatever else. It is. What do
Speaker 1: you think Americans take for granted with our banking system?
Speaker 1: You see Venezuela for example, or other countries, and you know,
Speaker 1: Americans like to complain a lot, right, not things that
Speaker 1: are good enough. You know, you know the Cares Act.
Speaker 1: It's only I can't remember what was it, trillions of dollars,
Speaker 1: but it was only trillions. How come you can't do this?
Speaker 1: How can we can't do that? And I feel like
Speaker 1: if people just understood what it was like in other
Speaker 1: parts of the world, it really come to appreciate a
Speaker 1: lot in the United States, but specifically the US banking system. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean, I look, I don't think that you know,
Speaker 1: our customers take a lot for granted. I think they
Speaker 1: have high expectations, and I think they should. They have
Speaker 1: the right to have high expectations of the US banking system.
Speaker 1: But I suppose of course that you know, we have
Speaker 1: the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau, we have a lot of
Speaker 1: other you know, regulatory standards, and you know, the fd
Speaker 1: I C insurance. So I think there's a lot of protections,
Speaker 1: you know, for for US consumers in terms of the
Speaker 1: you know, where they put their money in, the banking
Speaker 1: relationships and how you know, regulated banks should be UM,
Speaker 1: and the standards we should be held to when we're
Speaker 1: dealing with other people's money and livelihoods and things like that, UM.
Speaker 1: And so I think that there are high expectations and
Speaker 1: that's like as it should be, honestly, and we have
Speaker 1: to earn the right to continue to deserve that every day,
Speaker 1: and that's that's healthy. So I don't know if it's unrealistic,
Speaker 1: but I do think we are blessed over here. Of course,
Speaker 1: we have you know, and you know, Jamie always says
Speaker 1: it the deepest, most liquid financial markets in the world,
Speaker 1: and you know, our Americans have access to you know,
Speaker 1: I think differently situated you know, protections. What's a misconception
Speaker 1: that people have of your job. Well, I don't know
Speaker 1: if it's a misconception. I mean, I read a lot
Speaker 1: of customer complaints. I think it's incredibly important to do it. Really, Yes,
Speaker 1: listen to a lot of phone calls customer really all
Speaker 1: those recorded calls, every time they see this call is
Speaker 1: being recorded for yes, really, we're not all of them.
Speaker 1: I listen. Yeah, we are. So I get complaints directly
Speaker 1: to me. We you know, we also go through them often,
Speaker 1: listen to the cause. I think it's not a misconception
Speaker 1: of my job. Obviously, we're we're very large financial tution,
Speaker 1: lots of lots of transactions, um, and you know that
Speaker 1: that I'm sort of personally involved in deciding each and
Speaker 1: every one of those is obviously not realistic. But I
Speaker 1: do try to listen to the cause the complaints and
Speaker 1: like really dig into what we could do differently. So
Speaker 1: I don't know if it's a misconception, but we do
Speaker 1: spend as much time and I do spend, you know,
Speaker 1: a decent amount of time like really getting into the
Speaker 1: nitty gritty of the experience, because you know, it's not
Speaker 1: always where it should be and we need to do better.
Speaker 1: Do you remember when you bought your first time. I
Speaker 1: definitely remember when I bought my first time. I'm a
Speaker 1: real estate geek. You know that, right, yes, yes, yes?
Speaker 1: Where was it? It was in Wimbledon in London in
Speaker 1: a mansion block, so like purpose built mansioned flats, hundred
Speaker 1: years old, two and a half bedrooms. Yeah, it was
Speaker 1: when I bought it. The real estate market in the
Speaker 1: UK was like fully booming, so like quite literally between
Speaker 1: starting to look for a place and like being able
Speaker 1: to buy a place, I went from being able to
Speaker 1: afford a small terraced house to a partment hundred percent
Speaker 1: loan to value io when in the days when that
Speaker 1: was a thing, really that was your loan. Super brave.
Speaker 1: That's the bravest I've been. But then I like tightened
Speaker 1: my belt. I didn't go out. I painted everything would
Speaker 1: be your absolute nightmare. I painted every single room a
Speaker 1: different color. Thanks swear to God. How long did I
Speaker 1: have it? I had that from so I had that
Speaker 1: for maybe two two and a half years, and I
Speaker 1: was fortunate that in that two and a half years
Speaker 1: the UK real estate market we're still doing quite well.
Speaker 1: So Liquidated brought up not a hundred percent loan to
Speaker 1: value you'd be delighted to know. Um, and I still
Speaker 1: have that house, by the way, That is the house
Speaker 1: I bought. Yeah, I still have that one. You keep
Speaker 1: it rented or family lives there? My family? Yeah, okay, Yeah,
Speaker 1: why do you think you like real estate so much?
Speaker 1: I'm not great at investing in real estate, just so
Speaker 1: they were clear, because I'm emotional about it, and I
Speaker 1: think that's like not a really particularly um you know,
Speaker 1: good trade. I actually I appreciate that. I guess I
Speaker 1: just enjoy the process as my wich as I enjoy
Speaker 1: the outcome of it. So you know, for me, I
Speaker 1: spend a lot of time like getting to know the
Speaker 1: neighborhoods I'm in so right now, you know, I'm not
Speaker 1: in the city at the moment, and I spend a
Speaker 1: lot of time just looking at everything that's for sale
Speaker 1: around the area, so I know the markets. Yeah, it's
Speaker 1: not necessarily about the deal. It's more about the like
Speaker 1: awareness and having the context and the insights and being
Speaker 1: a amateur of what you are, a deep deep amateur.
Speaker 1: What would you say to women entering the workplace now?
Speaker 1: And can you tell me a little bit about what
Speaker 1: you do for women on the move and what that
Speaker 1: initiative is all about. So Women on the Move started
Speaker 1: being quite internally focused and started off working like a
Speaker 1: Draper Morgan Chase, where a few of us in you know,
Speaker 1: some senior positions in the company kind of said, well,
Speaker 1: we should get together and listen to what the experience
Speaker 1: is like if you are a woman working in this
Speaker 1: company but maybe you're not at the level we're at,
Speaker 1: or in the business in or even in New York,
Speaker 1: and just really understand, you know, what the experiences like
Speaker 1: and understand at a really practical level, whether we as
Speaker 1: leaders could actually you know, champion some change and make
Speaker 1: this a great place to work. We did that for
Speaker 1: you know, a couple or three years, and then decided
Speaker 1: that actually, you know, we ought to turn not just
Speaker 1: to be internally but externally focused and look at you know,
Speaker 1: women in corporate America, but also our clients and you know,
Speaker 1: small business women, entrepreneurs and other parts of our client base,
Speaker 1: and you know, try and see whether through our actual
Speaker 1: businesses we could um, you know, promote more women run businesses.
Speaker 1: Try and you provide capital or you know, get access
Speaker 1: to capital for you know, female entrepreneurs and things that
Speaker 1: are just a little bit harder. We have now internally
Speaker 1: focused a lot of events that we do where we
Speaker 1: do go out and go on the road and listen
Speaker 1: to our employees and here like what's working and what's
Speaker 1: not working and how we could change things. And as
Speaker 1: I think you said at the beginning, the sort of
Speaker 1: women's group in the company is the biggest resource group
Speaker 1: we have. And there's tens of thousands of women and men,
Speaker 1: by the way, who participate in that. UM. Many of
Speaker 1: our women are mentored by great men who have you know,
Speaker 1: wives and daughters and want women to be successful. UM.
Speaker 1: And then obviously we're you know, structuring our businesses to
Speaker 1: also make sure that we're promoting success for minority and
Speaker 1: women owned businesses and communities. What do you think about
Speaker 1: when people say you're a trailblazer in the industry? Do
Speaker 1: you agree with them? Do you feel like that's a
Speaker 1: lot of weight on your shoulders and you kind of
Speaker 1: have to agree. I don't really think about it so
Speaker 1: very much, except for I will tell you that when
Speaker 1: I became the CFO of the company, and you know,
Speaker 1: people would start asking me, you know, my thinking, my
Speaker 1: thoughts about you know, women in the workforce and women
Speaker 1: in corporate America, and I realized that you had a
Speaker 1: responsibility to actually have a point of view and to
Speaker 1: lean in and really you know, take some responsibility for
Speaker 1: you know, helping others. But I don't, you know, think
Speaker 1: so very much about myself. And you know, I do
Speaker 1: this job because I love it in this company because
Speaker 1: I love it, um you know, with a team that
Speaker 1: I think is extraordinary, and nothing that any of us
Speaker 1: do is like just us. The best leaders are people
Speaker 1: who have you know, teams of people working for them
Speaker 1: that are more talented than they are, and you know,
Speaker 1: bring talent and culture along. And so I really think
Speaker 1: it's got precious little to do with me, but I'm
Speaker 1: happy to be a part of it. What would you
Speaker 1: say is, I don't know what to say. Number one,
Speaker 1: But why do you think you've been successful other than
Speaker 1: just work really hard and you're smart and like math,
Speaker 1: you know, there's there's got to be more to it
Speaker 1: than that. You know, you are resilient, right persistent. I
Speaker 1: will say that there are two things that that about
Speaker 1: me that I think are the most true of anything.
Speaker 1: And uh, and again I don't know that I'm the
Speaker 1: only person that's ever said this, but it is definitely
Speaker 1: true of me. And there is no one that will
Speaker 1: be more prepared to me, and there will there is
Speaker 1: no one that will ever our work me and you know,
Speaker 1: so I think those are like reasonably um sort of
Speaker 1: good core competencies is to like work hard, be prepared
Speaker 1: um and you know, know your stuff and get stuff done. Um.
Speaker 1: I think that you know, people become people have trust
Speaker 1: and confidence in people who know what they're doing and
Speaker 1: get stuff done, who actually have a clear appreciation of
Speaker 1: what they don't know, know when to ask for help.
Speaker 1: They don't consider that there are boundaries to their jobs,
Speaker 1: that are willing to like put their hand up and
Speaker 1: lean into things that haven't you know, got very much
Speaker 1: to do with them. So who are great partners. And
Speaker 1: then I wouldn't underestimate the importance of being nice to
Speaker 1: be around, you know, I will. I know it's you
Speaker 1: should never overuse it. But the number of times that
Speaker 1: I've said to people like it is a genuine pleasure
Speaker 1: to have you on the team. And that's not nothing right,
Speaker 1: that is like pretty significant. People like to be with
Speaker 1: people where they have trust and confidence in them because
Speaker 1: they know that if they need help, gonna ask for it. Um.
Speaker 1: If they can't do what you want them to do,
Speaker 1: they're gonna like tell you that they are going to
Speaker 1: work really hard and that they're going to do it
Speaker 1: with a smile on their face and a good attitude
Speaker 1: and be a great partner. Thank you so much for
Speaker 1: doing this and going into the city amongst the craziness
Speaker 1: I do come in. It's not just for you, but
Speaker 1: I'm going to say it's just for me because that
Speaker 1: makes me feel today. It was you. Yeah, good, great um,
Speaker 1: and you're the best. Thank you so much and we'll talk.
Speaker 1: Thank you if you're ready to take action today. Based
Speaker 1: on Mary Anne Lake's entire blueprint for how she got
Speaker 1: to where she is, go to Big Money Energy dot
Speaker 1: com slash podcast to download an action plan and I
Speaker 1: put together for you as well as the show notes.
Speaker 1: That's Big Money Energy dot com slash podcast. Find more
Speaker 1: podcasts like Big Money Energy on the I Heart Radio
Speaker 1: app or wherever you get your podcasts. Big Money Energy
Speaker 1: is hosted by me Ryan Sirhant. It's produced by Mike
Speaker 1: Coscarelli and Joe Loreesca, an executive produced by Lindsay Hoffman.