1 00:00:01,440 --> 00:00:06,720 Speaker 1: Body Backs with Joseph's gotten More. One of the things 2 00:00:06,720 --> 00:00:15,920 Speaker 1: that I absolutely love about Body Backs is that we 3 00:00:16,000 --> 00:00:19,439 Speaker 1: are not a regional show. We do cases. Dave and 4 00:00:19,480 --> 00:00:23,160 Speaker 1: I do cases from not just across America we do 5 00:00:23,239 --> 00:00:26,479 Speaker 1: we cover cases from all over the world. Okay. And 6 00:00:26,560 --> 00:00:31,040 Speaker 1: the reason I love that is not necessarily because we're covering, 7 00:00:31,880 --> 00:00:37,040 Speaker 1: you know, horrible death. It's the idea that that part 8 00:00:37,080 --> 00:00:42,120 Speaker 1: of my brain gets stimulated because I learn about new places. 9 00:00:42,920 --> 00:00:47,720 Speaker 1: And you know, just like offices that work death cases, 10 00:00:48,360 --> 00:00:52,400 Speaker 1: they vary from region to region. Okay, And I don't know. 11 00:00:52,760 --> 00:00:55,880 Speaker 1: Dave and I have covered cases out of India, Ireland, 12 00:00:56,720 --> 00:00:59,840 Speaker 1: Great Britain, Australia. We've had a bunch of those. We've 13 00:01:00,080 --> 00:01:05,679 Speaker 1: on several out of various Southeastern Asian countries, South America, 14 00:01:06,280 --> 00:01:09,200 Speaker 1: and of course all over North America, including Canada and Mexico. 15 00:01:09,520 --> 00:01:13,200 Speaker 1: And but you know, you learn, you pick up a 16 00:01:13,240 --> 00:01:17,000 Speaker 1: little bit, you know, and it's almost like, what's the 17 00:01:17,040 --> 00:01:20,760 Speaker 1: word you live vicariously, I think to a certain degree 18 00:01:21,680 --> 00:01:24,080 Speaker 1: because I love to travel. I love to travel and 19 00:01:24,160 --> 00:01:27,280 Speaker 1: kind of learn new things. And some people say I 20 00:01:27,280 --> 00:01:28,840 Speaker 1: don't want to go to Europe, I don't want to 21 00:01:28,880 --> 00:01:31,800 Speaker 1: go anywhere else with the US, and look, I understand that. 22 00:01:31,959 --> 00:01:35,520 Speaker 1: And here's why there are so many places in America 23 00:01:36,000 --> 00:01:39,720 Speaker 1: that I have yet to go. Some places on my 24 00:01:39,800 --> 00:01:43,320 Speaker 1: bucket list, like anything north of Boston, I've never been there. 25 00:01:43,400 --> 00:01:45,160 Speaker 1: I can't wait till Keimmy and I get to go 26 00:01:45,280 --> 00:01:47,720 Speaker 1: up there. But I've been to California quite a bit, 27 00:01:49,760 --> 00:01:54,919 Speaker 1: primarily La a little bit San Francisco. But there's always 28 00:01:55,000 --> 00:01:58,520 Speaker 1: something else to find and explore. Today, we're going to 29 00:01:58,560 --> 00:02:02,360 Speaker 1: talk about a case in actually Los Angeles County, and 30 00:02:02,600 --> 00:02:06,920 Speaker 1: I've never visited this location. And when talking with brother 31 00:02:07,040 --> 00:02:12,560 Speaker 1: Dave before this taping started, I expressed to him that 32 00:02:13,720 --> 00:02:20,600 Speaker 1: I had never really placed this particular town on my radar, 33 00:02:21,480 --> 00:02:24,079 Speaker 1: but boy does it prominently play in the case we're 34 00:02:24,120 --> 00:02:32,720 Speaker 1: going to discuss today. The case is involving a mama, 35 00:02:32,840 --> 00:02:39,680 Speaker 1: a mama with three babies and a husband. She's dead 36 00:02:41,840 --> 00:02:48,119 Speaker 1: and they've all vanished into thin air. Coming to you 37 00:02:48,240 --> 00:02:52,600 Speaker 1: from the beautiful campus of Jacksonville State University. I'm Joseph 38 00:02:52,600 --> 00:02:59,240 Speaker 1: Scott Morgan and this is Bodybacks Dave. I was just 39 00:02:59,280 --> 00:03:03,840 Speaker 1: talking and I know I sound foolish, particularly coming from 40 00:03:03,880 --> 00:03:07,000 Speaker 1: someone that has spent a goodly portion of their life 41 00:03:07,040 --> 00:03:11,480 Speaker 1: in California. I never knew where Lancaster was. And even 42 00:03:11,520 --> 00:03:16,840 Speaker 1: beyond that, I always forget how big Los Angeles County 43 00:03:16,880 --> 00:03:21,960 Speaker 1: actually is. It's massive, I mean absolutely massive. It's got everything. 44 00:03:22,000 --> 00:03:24,280 Speaker 1: And people always say that, you know, you can you 45 00:03:24,320 --> 00:03:28,600 Speaker 1: can be skiing in the morning and surfing in the afternoon. 46 00:03:29,120 --> 00:03:31,000 Speaker 1: I don't buy that because I've been in the middle 47 00:03:31,000 --> 00:03:35,160 Speaker 1: of traffic in La so I don't Maybe, I don't know. 48 00:03:35,200 --> 00:03:37,720 Speaker 1: Maybe that was true in the early sixties. I don't know. 49 00:03:37,760 --> 00:03:41,280 Speaker 1: I don't think that that still applies. What say you, 50 00:03:41,320 --> 00:03:42,119 Speaker 1: my friend. 51 00:03:42,200 --> 00:03:46,280 Speaker 2: It does apply during holidays. During holidays, Yeah, and when 52 00:03:46,280 --> 00:03:50,240 Speaker 2: you're talking about Big Bear, which is really when people 53 00:03:50,280 --> 00:03:52,120 Speaker 2: talk about going you know, you can go to the 54 00:03:52,120 --> 00:03:54,840 Speaker 2: mountains in the beach on the same day. They're really 55 00:03:54,880 --> 00:03:58,160 Speaker 2: talking about getting up in the morning and driving up 56 00:03:58,200 --> 00:04:01,560 Speaker 2: to Big if you're in Los Angeles or Orange County. Okay, 57 00:04:01,760 --> 00:04:04,120 Speaker 2: those are the two areas. But you mentioned how big 58 00:04:04,240 --> 00:04:08,440 Speaker 2: Los Angeles County is. It incorporates the Angelus National Forest 59 00:04:08,480 --> 00:04:11,280 Speaker 2: for the most part, and it really does stretch out. 60 00:04:11,360 --> 00:04:14,600 Speaker 2: So you know what one of the most popular pop 61 00:04:14,640 --> 00:04:22,720 Speaker 2: culture celebrity websites is TMZ. Yeah, all right, TMZ actually 62 00:04:22,760 --> 00:04:27,760 Speaker 2: stands for something thirty mile zone. It's the thirty miles zone. 63 00:04:27,839 --> 00:04:29,520 Speaker 1: You do that, really? I do have that. 64 00:04:29,839 --> 00:04:32,720 Speaker 2: Yeah, they call that area the TMZ because that there's 65 00:04:32,760 --> 00:04:35,760 Speaker 2: a thirty mile zone where everything in Hollywood, in movies, 66 00:04:35,839 --> 00:04:39,680 Speaker 2: takes place, in TV. It's this area, and when you 67 00:04:39,720 --> 00:04:42,040 Speaker 2: think about it, you can you know, you've got this 68 00:04:42,160 --> 00:04:46,799 Speaker 2: thirty mile long and wide area that is Los Angeles 69 00:04:46,839 --> 00:04:49,880 Speaker 2: and Orange County mostly, and that's where all of your 70 00:04:49,920 --> 00:04:53,279 Speaker 2: stuff comes from that you watch on TV in theaters. 71 00:04:53,320 --> 00:04:56,320 Speaker 2: You know, that's where Germany anyway. But that's what TMZ 72 00:04:56,440 --> 00:04:58,599 Speaker 2: stands for in that So when we talk about this area, 73 00:04:58,640 --> 00:05:02,479 Speaker 2: you talk about Lancaster, it's just like any other place 74 00:05:02,520 --> 00:05:05,520 Speaker 2: you would talk about Pasadena, Pacuoeima, Ventura, you know, name 75 00:05:05,560 --> 00:05:09,120 Speaker 2: it at Placentia or York. Vilina in Orange County is 76 00:05:09,160 --> 00:05:12,920 Speaker 2: another city that melts into all the other cities unless 77 00:05:13,360 --> 00:05:16,200 Speaker 2: head out of town towards Big Bear. You know, you 78 00:05:16,240 --> 00:05:20,280 Speaker 2: can find comfort in knowing that there are places that 79 00:05:20,320 --> 00:05:23,640 Speaker 2: are not just cement and housing or buildings for business. 80 00:05:24,240 --> 00:05:28,600 Speaker 2: Lancaster is on that it's to the west, north and west, 81 00:05:29,200 --> 00:05:32,560 Speaker 2: I mean north and east rather of Los Angeles, so 82 00:05:33,279 --> 00:05:36,360 Speaker 2: that gives you an idea of what we're talking about. 83 00:05:36,720 --> 00:05:41,240 Speaker 2: But this is a case of it's domestic violence, Joe 84 00:05:41,560 --> 00:05:46,239 Speaker 2: and the reason it exploded onto the national spotlight. Sheila 85 00:05:46,400 --> 00:05:52,640 Speaker 2: Cabrera was reported missing and her They took the report 86 00:05:52,760 --> 00:05:59,000 Speaker 2: on August the twelfth. August thirteenth, the very next day, 87 00:05:59,800 --> 00:06:05,600 Speaker 2: investigators are able to locate a digital well today, we 88 00:06:06,000 --> 00:06:08,680 Speaker 2: know that everything is on camera. They actually found digital 89 00:06:08,720 --> 00:06:12,880 Speaker 2: footage surveillance of the apartment complex where Sheila Cabrera lived 90 00:06:12,880 --> 00:06:17,440 Speaker 2: with her husband and their three children. And on this 91 00:06:18,000 --> 00:06:26,800 Speaker 2: surveillance video they see her husband, Hoosamar Cabrera, dragging a 92 00:06:26,920 --> 00:06:32,200 Speaker 2: large job day, a large object that is wrapped in material. Okay, now, 93 00:06:32,240 --> 00:06:34,760 Speaker 2: if your wife is if you've reported your wife missing 94 00:06:35,680 --> 00:06:41,520 Speaker 2: and detectives see you on security footage dragging something in 95 00:06:41,560 --> 00:06:44,080 Speaker 2: the shape of a body wrapped in something else as 96 00:06:44,080 --> 00:06:47,160 Speaker 2: a disguise, yeah, they're going to put the highlight beams 97 00:06:47,200 --> 00:06:53,960 Speaker 2: on you. And they, being detectives, were able to take 98 00:06:54,000 --> 00:06:57,320 Speaker 2: it to the next level and that's where this whole 99 00:06:57,360 --> 00:06:59,279 Speaker 2: case exploded. You know, you and I have talked about 100 00:06:59,360 --> 00:07:03,000 Speaker 2: having b row footage for different cases like John Bana Ramsey. 101 00:07:03,040 --> 00:07:05,000 Speaker 2: When you've got video, you can run in the background 102 00:07:05,040 --> 00:07:06,600 Speaker 2: of a news report, it gains a lot more of 103 00:07:06,640 --> 00:07:10,280 Speaker 2: attention of the public. Brother, And that's what happens here. 104 00:07:10,840 --> 00:07:15,880 Speaker 2: As soon as that goes public. Joe, a guy dragging 105 00:07:15,960 --> 00:07:19,000 Speaker 2: something that looks like his missing wife's body out of 106 00:07:19,040 --> 00:07:22,840 Speaker 2: their apartment complex. Yeah, that's going to get your news coverage. 107 00:07:22,960 --> 00:07:24,600 Speaker 2: And that's why it exploded the way it did. 108 00:07:25,600 --> 00:07:29,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's it's quite amazing. I got to tell you, 109 00:07:29,560 --> 00:07:34,920 Speaker 1: it's one. It's one of the more disturbing video images 110 00:07:34,960 --> 00:07:39,160 Speaker 1: that I've seen. And it's not necessarily for the faint 111 00:07:39,160 --> 00:07:42,880 Speaker 1: of heart, all right, but it's out there. Everyone can 112 00:07:42,960 --> 00:07:45,840 Speaker 1: see it, and I urge you just to kind of 113 00:07:47,480 --> 00:07:50,360 Speaker 1: understand put this in context if you have not been 114 00:07:50,400 --> 00:07:58,080 Speaker 1: following following this case. Look at the struggle that this 115 00:07:58,320 --> 00:08:03,160 Speaker 1: grown man is having, and you can't look at that 116 00:08:03,600 --> 00:08:08,840 Speaker 1: and not at least at least think there might be 117 00:08:08,920 --> 00:08:14,119 Speaker 1: human remains in Some people have called it a sheet, 118 00:08:14,240 --> 00:08:16,120 Speaker 1: some people have called it a back. It looks like 119 00:08:16,160 --> 00:08:18,760 Speaker 1: a sheet. To me, it almost looks like a fitted sheet. 120 00:08:19,560 --> 00:08:25,160 Speaker 1: And yeah, and look, you know, because the elasticity in 121 00:08:25,200 --> 00:08:28,160 Speaker 1: there along the edges, it'll kind of pop together anyway. 122 00:08:30,120 --> 00:08:32,800 Speaker 1: The one thing about it though, that I didn't. Granted, 123 00:08:33,120 --> 00:08:35,320 Speaker 1: we only have this in profile, and it's there for 124 00:08:35,400 --> 00:08:38,600 Speaker 1: a few seconds and he I hate to say this, man, 125 00:08:38,679 --> 00:08:45,560 Speaker 1: it's so disrespectful. He's literally dragging this object across a 126 00:08:45,640 --> 00:08:49,880 Speaker 1: concrete surface, all right. You can tell that it's poured concrete. 127 00:08:50,600 --> 00:08:53,600 Speaker 1: And if this is in fact the remains of his 128 00:08:53,760 --> 00:09:00,280 Speaker 1: wife that are being drug how incredibly disrespectful. You know, 129 00:09:00,360 --> 00:09:02,320 Speaker 1: you and I we spend a lot of time, and 130 00:09:02,360 --> 00:09:05,920 Speaker 1: I know because I know your heart and you know mine. 131 00:09:07,160 --> 00:09:11,560 Speaker 1: We're advocates for the dead, all right, because nobody else 132 00:09:11,600 --> 00:09:13,640 Speaker 1: really talks up for them, you know. I mean, I've 133 00:09:13,640 --> 00:09:16,960 Speaker 1: always viewed myself that way, and I think some of 134 00:09:17,000 --> 00:09:20,480 Speaker 1: that's translated to you, because you know, you have this 135 00:09:20,559 --> 00:09:25,360 Speaker 1: awareness that people will do any and everything to dead. 136 00:09:25,520 --> 00:09:27,760 Speaker 1: You and I have proven that over and we've got 137 00:09:27,800 --> 00:09:30,679 Speaker 1: an entire catalog now of over four hundred episodes and 138 00:09:30,720 --> 00:09:34,400 Speaker 1: body Bags. How many of those episodes would you say 139 00:09:35,400 --> 00:09:38,480 Speaker 1: the dead are horribly disrespected? And I'm not just talking 140 00:09:38,480 --> 00:09:41,040 Speaker 1: about the homicides that we've covered. I'm talking about the 141 00:09:41,080 --> 00:09:44,640 Speaker 1: treatment of remains afterwards. And this is a glaring example. 142 00:09:45,080 --> 00:09:50,199 Speaker 1: This almost looks like this almost looks like a guy 143 00:09:51,000 --> 00:09:56,640 Speaker 1: that is that stands stands the potential being evicted out 144 00:09:56,640 --> 00:09:58,960 Speaker 1: of his apartment. He's trying to load everything up in 145 00:09:59,000 --> 00:10:01,480 Speaker 1: there and drag it out, putting this truck so that 146 00:10:01,520 --> 00:10:02,840 Speaker 1: he can save and it's not going to be put 147 00:10:02,880 --> 00:10:06,800 Speaker 1: out by the curb or he's hauling tobree out again. 148 00:10:07,480 --> 00:10:11,000 Speaker 1: You measure that against against the idea that this is 149 00:10:11,400 --> 00:10:14,800 Speaker 1: the mama of his children, yep, you know, And that's 150 00:10:15,000 --> 00:10:18,640 Speaker 1: that's you know, the police have not definitely said that. 151 00:10:18,840 --> 00:10:23,680 Speaker 1: They've not said because they can't necessarily, but just just 152 00:10:23,760 --> 00:10:26,440 Speaker 1: that premise, you know, thinking about that, that this is 153 00:10:26,480 --> 00:10:31,920 Speaker 1: the way he's treating these remains, I think that it goes. 154 00:10:32,480 --> 00:10:34,920 Speaker 1: It factors in quite a bit to if you're doing 155 00:10:34,920 --> 00:10:39,440 Speaker 1: the calculus on maybe how he viewed viewed her in 156 00:10:39,600 --> 00:10:44,199 Speaker 1: life and how he viewed himself perhaps if he if 157 00:10:44,240 --> 00:10:46,280 Speaker 1: he did harm to her, and if he's treating her 158 00:10:46,320 --> 00:10:50,920 Speaker 1: remains like this, My Lord Dave, what was life like 159 00:10:50,960 --> 00:10:54,040 Speaker 1: inside that apartment, buddy? It must have been. And you've 160 00:10:54,040 --> 00:10:55,559 Speaker 1: got three babies in there with him too. 161 00:10:56,200 --> 00:11:00,600 Speaker 2: And this one really hit me square in the eyes 162 00:11:00,640 --> 00:11:02,160 Speaker 2: when I saw it, Joe, And let me tell you why. 163 00:11:02,880 --> 00:11:06,000 Speaker 2: In twenty twelve, I started a movie called River of Life. 164 00:11:06,120 --> 00:11:09,480 Speaker 2: That's the other part of the Dave macworld is acting. 165 00:11:10,600 --> 00:11:13,760 Speaker 2: I've done a number of films and TV shows, and 166 00:11:14,679 --> 00:11:17,559 Speaker 2: I was starring in this independent film called River of Life, 167 00:11:17,600 --> 00:11:21,520 Speaker 2: and in it, I actually killed my wife and I 168 00:11:21,760 --> 00:11:25,400 Speaker 2: drag her body wrapped in a blanket, out in the 169 00:11:25,440 --> 00:11:28,520 Speaker 2: back and I'm caught on security film doing this in 170 00:11:28,559 --> 00:11:33,680 Speaker 2: the movie. And when we were shooting that scene, it 171 00:11:33,760 --> 00:11:36,320 Speaker 2: was very difficult for you know, we didn't want to 172 00:11:36,320 --> 00:11:37,959 Speaker 2: have me dragging a body. We wanted to have me 173 00:11:38,040 --> 00:11:40,120 Speaker 2: dragging something else. You know, you don't want to drag 174 00:11:40,160 --> 00:11:43,360 Speaker 2: a human being out like that. I mean, especially on 175 00:11:43,400 --> 00:11:47,719 Speaker 2: a low budget independent film, you know. And so we 176 00:11:47,760 --> 00:11:50,120 Speaker 2: actually went through this process of trying to find the 177 00:11:50,200 --> 00:11:53,640 Speaker 2: right amount of weight to use, and it ended up 178 00:11:53,640 --> 00:11:56,000 Speaker 2: being Okay, you're going to have to lay down here 179 00:11:56,040 --> 00:11:57,640 Speaker 2: for a minute and let me see what it's like 180 00:11:57,679 --> 00:11:59,920 Speaker 2: to pull you so that I can act this out properly. 181 00:12:00,360 --> 00:12:03,720 Speaker 2: It ain't easy, MANA. 182 00:12:04,280 --> 00:12:07,080 Speaker 1: Thank you for saying that term, because I don't think 183 00:12:07,080 --> 00:12:11,360 Speaker 1: that most people understand when they hear the term dead weight. 184 00:12:11,760 --> 00:12:16,200 Speaker 1: They do not fully appreciate that what's being inferred there. 185 00:12:16,520 --> 00:12:20,720 Speaker 1: And if I can just briefly explain that when well, 186 00:12:20,800 --> 00:12:23,880 Speaker 1: when in life, and just think about it. If you've 187 00:12:23,880 --> 00:12:26,760 Speaker 1: got kids, grandkids, I don't know, maybe your spouse. I 188 00:12:26,760 --> 00:12:31,880 Speaker 1: still my back won't allow me to, you know, lift 189 00:12:31,880 --> 00:12:33,800 Speaker 1: my wife up and twirl around the house like I 190 00:12:33,880 --> 00:12:36,480 Speaker 1: used to maybe a decade ago. But I try, I 191 00:12:36,640 --> 00:12:38,800 Speaker 1: really do. We'll go walzing around every now and then 192 00:12:38,880 --> 00:12:42,640 Speaker 1: in the living room. But you know, there's there's a 193 00:12:42,720 --> 00:12:48,319 Speaker 1: thing when someone is alive, Okay, someone is alive, people 194 00:12:48,320 --> 00:12:53,360 Speaker 1: don't realize that the living person is helping you. They 195 00:12:53,360 --> 00:12:57,320 Speaker 1: don't realize that because you know, your body goes tense, 196 00:12:58,280 --> 00:13:00,280 Speaker 1: and believe it or not, it's almost like you've got 197 00:13:00,320 --> 00:13:02,760 Speaker 1: a built in gyroscope in your brain and it kind 198 00:13:02,800 --> 00:13:06,400 Speaker 1: of adjust It adjusts your center of balance so that 199 00:13:06,440 --> 00:13:09,360 Speaker 1: if one person is swaying one way, you can counterbalance it. 200 00:13:09,440 --> 00:13:12,320 Speaker 1: And it's something with the equilibrium that happens in your brain. Dude, 201 00:13:13,520 --> 00:13:16,800 Speaker 1: when you have a dead body and you're trying to 202 00:13:17,720 --> 00:13:21,320 Speaker 1: do this, they're not going to cooperate. And it's not 203 00:13:21,360 --> 00:13:24,160 Speaker 1: even like it's it's not let's say you've got one 204 00:13:24,240 --> 00:13:32,199 Speaker 1: hundred pound person, okay, one hundred pound person that's deceased. 205 00:13:32,280 --> 00:13:36,800 Speaker 1: It's not like picking up one hundred pound log. The 206 00:13:36,880 --> 00:13:40,080 Speaker 1: log is static. Okay, now it's going to be heavy obviously, 207 00:13:40,240 --> 00:13:42,840 Speaker 1: given that if you're capable of lifting one hundred pounds, 208 00:13:42,840 --> 00:13:44,880 Speaker 1: which I don't know if I am anymore, I might 209 00:13:44,920 --> 00:13:46,320 Speaker 1: be maybe I've got to go put that to the 210 00:13:46,360 --> 00:13:49,320 Speaker 1: desk this afternoon. But when you pick up a log 211 00:13:49,520 --> 00:13:54,000 Speaker 1: that's static and you tote it, put it in terms 212 00:13:54,040 --> 00:13:58,760 Speaker 1: of the south we're toting it somewhere. It's a big difference. 213 00:13:58,800 --> 00:14:03,160 Speaker 1: Then if you've got a body where the weight of 214 00:14:03,200 --> 00:14:07,960 Speaker 1: the head is distributed in one area and you've got 215 00:14:07,960 --> 00:14:10,040 Speaker 1: the feet down at the other area, and then you've 216 00:14:10,040 --> 00:14:14,440 Speaker 1: got the mid torso and it's always shifting, you know, bodies. 217 00:14:15,880 --> 00:14:20,320 Speaker 1: Bodies are even if they're stiff relative to you know, 218 00:14:20,400 --> 00:14:23,600 Speaker 1: like riger that sort of thing, they're not going to 219 00:14:23,680 --> 00:14:25,840 Speaker 1: help you at all, and it makes it very difficult. 220 00:14:25,920 --> 00:14:28,880 Speaker 1: And so the default position, I think, with somebody that's 221 00:14:28,920 --> 00:14:31,440 Speaker 1: trying to move a body and try to get it 222 00:14:31,480 --> 00:14:34,560 Speaker 1: to a conveyance where they can take it out where 223 00:14:34,560 --> 00:14:37,080 Speaker 1: they think that no one is going to find it, 224 00:14:37,720 --> 00:14:41,520 Speaker 1: the default is maybe to throw it in the most 225 00:14:41,560 --> 00:14:46,440 Speaker 1: convenient thing like a sheet, and drag it to they 226 00:14:46,560 --> 00:15:03,040 Speaker 1: get it to the vehicle. Dave, let me throw a 227 00:15:03,080 --> 00:15:08,880 Speaker 1: name out to you and automatically, I think you're going 228 00:15:08,960 --> 00:15:12,920 Speaker 1: to recognize it. Okay, you're in van der Schlut. Who 229 00:15:12,960 --> 00:15:14,560 Speaker 1: is that? Hate that guy? 230 00:15:15,000 --> 00:15:17,080 Speaker 2: You know, I don't hate many, but he's right up 231 00:15:17,080 --> 00:15:19,800 Speaker 2: there at the top of the most scummy, horrible evil 232 00:15:19,840 --> 00:15:22,520 Speaker 2: people on the planet of the year. You know, Natalie 233 00:15:22,560 --> 00:15:27,720 Speaker 2: Holloway was not his only murder victim. He actually might 234 00:15:27,720 --> 00:15:29,560 Speaker 2: not have been his first, but first one that he 235 00:15:29,600 --> 00:15:33,640 Speaker 2: got caught. But it was the second one, almost on 236 00:15:33,720 --> 00:15:39,840 Speaker 2: the anniversary of Natalie's death, that he killed after she 237 00:15:40,040 --> 00:15:42,680 Speaker 2: realized who he was. And he killed her in such 238 00:15:42,720 --> 00:15:45,560 Speaker 2: a way in a hotel room that it goes beyond 239 00:15:45,960 --> 00:15:50,360 Speaker 2: what human being can do in terms of violence. It 240 00:15:50,440 --> 00:15:53,120 Speaker 2: was animalistic, Yeah, it really was. 241 00:15:53,160 --> 00:15:57,160 Speaker 1: And plus plus you know, I'll try to stay off 242 00:15:57,200 --> 00:16:00,160 Speaker 1: my moral high horse here, but it's really hard hard. 243 00:16:01,120 --> 00:16:03,440 Speaker 1: Children turn out many ways the way they're raised. Right, 244 00:16:04,080 --> 00:16:06,360 Speaker 1: it's you know, when you give them a lot of 245 00:16:06,400 --> 00:16:09,000 Speaker 1: latitude and yeah, honey, just go do whatever you want 246 00:16:09,040 --> 00:16:12,600 Speaker 1: to do. And that's what happened. Well, guess where he's 247 00:16:12,640 --> 00:16:18,400 Speaker 1: cooling his heels now, he's done Peru and it's a 248 00:16:19,040 --> 00:16:22,200 Speaker 1: god awful situation to be in, because if you think 249 00:16:22,240 --> 00:16:25,560 Speaker 1: American jails are bad, American prisons are bad. I don't 250 00:16:25,600 --> 00:16:28,360 Speaker 1: think that people can even begin to fathom what Peru 251 00:16:28,440 --> 00:16:35,040 Speaker 1: would be like. All right, there's tough and then there's 252 00:16:35,080 --> 00:16:39,120 Speaker 1: Peru tough. All right, ain't the same thing. It's horrible 253 00:16:39,640 --> 00:16:43,560 Speaker 1: and he's in that world. But interestingly enough, I think 254 00:16:43,600 --> 00:16:45,960 Speaker 1: that vander Salute, if he had it to do over again, 255 00:16:46,040 --> 00:16:50,800 Speaker 1: he would you know. Nancy, Me, Nancy and Mac were 256 00:16:50,840 --> 00:16:55,080 Speaker 1: actually at the Federal courthouse in Birmingham when he was 257 00:16:55,120 --> 00:16:58,360 Speaker 1: in rained that day and then they flew him, you know, 258 00:16:58,400 --> 00:17:00,760 Speaker 1: flew him out. That was part of the agreement. Flew 259 00:17:00,800 --> 00:17:04,760 Speaker 1: him out and he went back to Peru. The case 260 00:17:04,840 --> 00:17:12,240 Speaker 1: that we're talking about today out of California, this individual 261 00:17:12,359 --> 00:17:18,480 Speaker 1: apparently that perpetrated this crime has decided that it would 262 00:17:18,520 --> 00:17:23,439 Speaker 1: be better in Peru than to be here in the US, 263 00:17:23,680 --> 00:17:27,360 Speaker 1: and not only better for him, but better for his kids. 264 00:17:28,359 --> 00:17:33,159 Speaker 1: So after we've got this view and all points, bulletins 265 00:17:33,240 --> 00:17:36,360 Speaker 1: sent out for this missing mother, they recover a ren 266 00:17:36,440 --> 00:17:44,439 Speaker 1: cam video. Suddenly they're looking for mom and dad and 267 00:17:44,560 --> 00:17:47,280 Speaker 1: kids are nowhere to be found. Next thing they know, 268 00:17:48,760 --> 00:17:53,560 Speaker 1: Peru pops up Peru pops up and they've located these 269 00:17:53,600 --> 00:17:58,640 Speaker 1: three kids. He's still he's still out and about, maybe 270 00:17:58,640 --> 00:18:01,040 Speaker 1: in Peru, wandering about who. Who knows. I don't know 271 00:18:01,040 --> 00:18:03,160 Speaker 1: how hard disks cross borders and that sort of thing 272 00:18:03,200 --> 00:18:05,840 Speaker 1: down there. But as he just vanished into the wind, 273 00:18:05,880 --> 00:18:08,520 Speaker 1: I don't know, but I know that the US government's 274 00:18:08,640 --> 00:18:11,199 Speaker 1: actively looking to have him extra dieted if they get 275 00:18:11,240 --> 00:18:12,159 Speaker 1: their hands on him. 276 00:18:12,359 --> 00:18:17,680 Speaker 2: You know, it was interesting that we mentioned how investigators 277 00:18:17,920 --> 00:18:22,040 Speaker 2: found the video surveillance video showing hosts of market. By 278 00:18:22,080 --> 00:18:23,800 Speaker 2: the way, he has been charged with murder, so we 279 00:18:23,840 --> 00:18:27,320 Speaker 2: can say murder suspect Hosmar Cabrera was seen on this 280 00:18:27,440 --> 00:18:32,440 Speaker 2: video dragging the what is assumed to be his wife 281 00:18:33,040 --> 00:18:37,479 Speaker 2: and when the investigators were searching. Now, in this day 282 00:18:37,520 --> 00:18:39,640 Speaker 2: and age, Joe, we have seen a number of cases 283 00:18:39,720 --> 00:18:43,439 Speaker 2: where investigators were able to use surveillance video to track 284 00:18:43,520 --> 00:18:47,600 Speaker 2: a person as they went about their crime. They use 285 00:18:47,680 --> 00:18:50,479 Speaker 2: cell phone data, they use security film, and when they 286 00:18:50,520 --> 00:18:52,480 Speaker 2: know a direction a car is headed and think where 287 00:18:52,480 --> 00:18:55,320 Speaker 2: they might be going, they're able to anticipate and find 288 00:18:56,359 --> 00:18:59,359 Speaker 2: digital evidence of their trip and they can almost map 289 00:18:59,400 --> 00:19:02,479 Speaker 2: it out digitally, which is what led them into the 290 00:19:02,520 --> 00:19:06,320 Speaker 2: Los Angeles National Forest and our Angelus National Forest. I 291 00:19:06,320 --> 00:19:09,920 Speaker 2: always say that wrong. Just FYI, No, it is the 292 00:19:10,040 --> 00:19:13,680 Speaker 2: Angelus National Forest, not lost. But anyway, that's where The 293 00:19:13,800 --> 00:19:16,240 Speaker 2: very next day after she's reported missing, they're able to 294 00:19:16,560 --> 00:19:20,200 Speaker 2: find her. The Montrose Mountain Search and Rescue Team discover 295 00:19:20,520 --> 00:19:24,560 Speaker 2: this object similar to the one Cabrera was seen dragging, 296 00:19:25,160 --> 00:19:27,919 Speaker 2: and it's down the side of an embankment. You mentioned 297 00:19:27,960 --> 00:19:32,240 Speaker 2: the disrespect he showed, and it's like he drug it 298 00:19:32,400 --> 00:19:36,200 Speaker 2: and just he treated it worse than you could treat 299 00:19:36,359 --> 00:19:39,080 Speaker 2: a piece of furniture. Joe, just throwing it down an 300 00:19:39,080 --> 00:19:41,560 Speaker 2: embankment and then loads up the kids, takes them to Peru, 301 00:19:41,680 --> 00:19:43,800 Speaker 2: getting them out of this country as quick as he could. 302 00:19:44,359 --> 00:19:46,320 Speaker 2: They were able to locate the children, and the children 303 00:19:46,600 --> 00:19:48,320 Speaker 2: there are three of them. They are safe. They were 304 00:19:48,359 --> 00:19:52,359 Speaker 2: removed from that custody. They're now being taken care of 305 00:19:52,440 --> 00:19:56,920 Speaker 2: by somebody who has the total responsibility of not harming them. 306 00:19:57,400 --> 00:20:00,479 Speaker 2: But still looking for Cabrera at this point, Joe, But 307 00:20:00,520 --> 00:20:03,520 Speaker 2: what do we know about what kind of life they 308 00:20:03,520 --> 00:20:06,640 Speaker 2: were living? Do we know? Was their abuse in this family? 309 00:20:06,840 --> 00:20:09,520 Speaker 2: Was she the victim of domestic violence? 310 00:20:10,480 --> 00:20:13,479 Speaker 1: It's it's they haven't had a big reveal at this 311 00:20:13,520 --> 00:20:17,000 Speaker 1: point in time, and we were kind of thin on 312 00:20:17,119 --> 00:20:21,320 Speaker 1: facts at this moment in time. But something, something apparently 313 00:20:21,440 --> 00:20:26,560 Speaker 1: triggered this behavior to the point and again you refer 314 00:20:26,640 --> 00:20:29,200 Speaker 1: to him, Dave as a murder suspect at this point 315 00:20:29,200 --> 00:20:32,000 Speaker 1: in time, he's no longer, you know, just a person 316 00:20:32,040 --> 00:20:34,960 Speaker 1: of interest, all right, because they've hung charges on him. 317 00:20:35,560 --> 00:20:39,440 Speaker 1: Ellie County District Attorney has, and so they have some 318 00:20:39,520 --> 00:20:43,399 Speaker 1: kind of information. And I would imagine that one of 319 00:20:43,400 --> 00:20:46,399 Speaker 1: the things that would happen because their apartment was actually 320 00:20:46,480 --> 00:20:52,600 Speaker 1: located in Lancaster, which just so folks understand Lancaster. They're 321 00:20:52,640 --> 00:20:57,399 Speaker 1: saying that the Angelo's National Forest and it's kind of 322 00:20:57,600 --> 00:21:00,800 Speaker 1: co mingled with some other federal prop in there. And 323 00:21:00,840 --> 00:21:04,760 Speaker 1: I found it kind of interesting geographically, how would you 324 00:21:04,800 --> 00:21:10,560 Speaker 1: get from Lancaster to I think it's Arcadia, which is 325 00:21:10,800 --> 00:21:13,679 Speaker 1: the address that the National Forest actually carries. And of 326 00:21:13,680 --> 00:21:15,959 Speaker 1: course it can carry an address, it doesn't necessarily mean 327 00:21:16,000 --> 00:21:18,480 Speaker 1: she was found in that little town, but that's the 328 00:21:18,560 --> 00:21:24,679 Speaker 1: address of the Angelus National Forest right there. So you 329 00:21:24,840 --> 00:21:31,480 Speaker 1: have to really do some serious skill driving to get 330 00:21:31,480 --> 00:21:35,400 Speaker 1: from Lancaster over to that point. If it's on the 331 00:21:35,720 --> 00:21:39,720 Speaker 1: further southern location adjacent to this little town, which I 332 00:21:39,760 --> 00:21:41,880 Speaker 1: would assume is where the main gate is to get 333 00:21:41,920 --> 00:21:46,679 Speaker 1: in to the National Forest, or approximating that area. And 334 00:21:46,720 --> 00:21:50,199 Speaker 1: it's about an hour and fifteen minute drive from Lancaster. 335 00:21:51,400 --> 00:21:57,560 Speaker 1: So I'm envisioning my mind. If he has a conveyance 336 00:21:57,640 --> 00:22:00,000 Speaker 1: that he places her body in, does he go out 337 00:22:00,200 --> 00:22:04,399 Speaker 1: gather the children and their belongings and just follow me 338 00:22:04,480 --> 00:22:12,240 Speaker 1: here and he throws belongings like luggage. You know, everybody 339 00:22:12,240 --> 00:22:14,000 Speaker 1: pack a bag or I'm gonna pack a bag for you. 340 00:22:14,960 --> 00:22:19,080 Speaker 1: Throw that in there into the conveyance and they hop 341 00:22:19,119 --> 00:22:22,600 Speaker 1: in the car and you know, daddy, where are we going? 342 00:22:22,720 --> 00:22:26,080 Speaker 1: We got to make one stop. Well, the one stop 343 00:22:26,560 --> 00:22:32,280 Speaker 1: is along this isolated area because man, you talk about wilderness, 344 00:22:32,359 --> 00:22:37,199 Speaker 1: I mean it is. It's impressive. It's because it's so vast, 345 00:22:37,560 --> 00:22:42,679 Speaker 1: incredibly vast. So do you have your kids in the 346 00:22:42,760 --> 00:22:46,560 Speaker 1: car with you when you're doing this? Because the next 347 00:22:46,600 --> 00:22:49,120 Speaker 1: stop is going to be the airport. Now I don't 348 00:22:49,119 --> 00:22:50,760 Speaker 1: know where he at this point time. I don't know 349 00:22:50,800 --> 00:22:53,080 Speaker 1: where he bounced out of. At this point in time, 350 00:22:54,000 --> 00:22:57,600 Speaker 1: the obvious obvious would be, you know, I would think lax, 351 00:22:58,359 --> 00:23:01,000 Speaker 1: But there are other airports around them. You know, did 352 00:23:01,000 --> 00:23:02,879 Speaker 1: he head down to Orange County and that John Wayne 353 00:23:02,880 --> 00:23:04,840 Speaker 1: Airport down there. I don't know if they have the 354 00:23:04,920 --> 00:23:08,320 Speaker 1: ability to get you to Peru. You might have multiple 355 00:23:08,960 --> 00:23:12,399 Speaker 1: stopovers in various locations. I guess there are direct flights 356 00:23:12,400 --> 00:23:16,040 Speaker 1: out of Los Angeles to Peru. I'm assuming that there 357 00:23:16,040 --> 00:23:20,959 Speaker 1: probably are. But logistically this is an absolute nightmare in 358 00:23:21,080 --> 00:23:23,400 Speaker 1: order to facilitate, or you could look at it from 359 00:23:23,400 --> 00:23:26,120 Speaker 1: the perspective that it's kind of simple for him. Yeah, 360 00:23:26,160 --> 00:23:28,760 Speaker 1: kind of simple because I'm gonna just take her dumper, 361 00:23:28,880 --> 00:23:30,200 Speaker 1: take the kids, and we're heading out. 362 00:23:30,440 --> 00:23:35,240 Speaker 2: Well, you know, Okay reported missing on the twelfth, Joe. Yeah, 363 00:23:35,440 --> 00:23:37,480 Speaker 2: when they go looking for him, you know, they find 364 00:23:37,480 --> 00:23:41,600 Speaker 2: the digital video of him dragging what they believe is 365 00:23:41,640 --> 00:23:45,160 Speaker 2: her body. Well, when they go back to talk to him, 366 00:23:45,160 --> 00:23:45,679 Speaker 2: he's gone. 367 00:23:46,720 --> 00:23:47,320 Speaker 1: He bolted. 368 00:23:47,680 --> 00:23:50,119 Speaker 2: You know, the missing person thing is filed before they 369 00:23:50,119 --> 00:23:52,360 Speaker 2: find the body, he's already gone. So yeah, I mean, 370 00:23:52,400 --> 00:23:54,720 Speaker 2: going from Lancaster to lax and getting out of town, 371 00:23:54,800 --> 00:23:56,040 Speaker 2: that's not that big of a deal. 372 00:23:56,560 --> 00:24:01,480 Speaker 1: I wouldn't Yeah, I wouldn't think so. And you know, 373 00:24:01,760 --> 00:24:07,639 Speaker 1: his vehicle too. I think my thought is that once 374 00:24:08,080 --> 00:24:10,720 Speaker 1: the vehicle's got to be somewhere adjacent to that. For 375 00:24:10,760 --> 00:24:15,840 Speaker 1: those of you that have never been to Lax, it's 376 00:24:15,960 --> 00:24:20,640 Speaker 1: kind of a nightmare. Of course, I measure everything by Atlanta, 377 00:24:20,720 --> 00:24:23,960 Speaker 1: which is a perpetual nightmare that I fly out of. 378 00:24:24,560 --> 00:24:28,479 Speaker 1: But Lax is in and of itself, you know, a 379 00:24:28,520 --> 00:24:30,679 Speaker 1: horror show most of the time. But you have to 380 00:24:30,760 --> 00:24:33,440 Speaker 1: have that vehicle somewhere unless you dump it somewhere else 381 00:24:33,960 --> 00:24:36,479 Speaker 1: catch an uber. But again, that's going to put you 382 00:24:36,560 --> 00:24:39,240 Speaker 1: on on the radar, you know, because now you've got 383 00:24:39,440 --> 00:24:43,760 Speaker 1: an uber driver that sees you with three kids and 384 00:24:43,800 --> 00:24:46,679 Speaker 1: he drops you off at a specific criminal at Lax. 385 00:24:47,560 --> 00:24:49,760 Speaker 1: But I don't know how much this got cared because 386 00:24:49,800 --> 00:24:51,720 Speaker 1: you know, I was thinking about what you said just 387 00:24:51,720 --> 00:24:54,520 Speaker 1: a second ago about you know, the movie that you 388 00:24:54,640 --> 00:24:57,359 Speaker 1: were shooting, and that was all the way back in 389 00:24:57,720 --> 00:25:01,960 Speaker 1: twenty twelve. Day. Yeah, think about the world how much 390 00:25:01,960 --> 00:25:06,720 Speaker 1: it's changed since twelve that we're in now where there 391 00:25:06,840 --> 00:25:09,760 Speaker 1: is videography everywhere you go. I mean, you know, ring 392 00:25:09,880 --> 00:25:14,400 Speaker 1: cams are on everything. Do you remember when the coburger 393 00:25:14,440 --> 00:25:18,480 Speaker 1: thing dropped, they were looking for camera footage. And this 394 00:25:18,600 --> 00:25:21,240 Speaker 1: is something I was not aware of because I'm not 395 00:25:21,440 --> 00:25:24,720 Speaker 1: in that atmosphere to have a tesla, But I didn't 396 00:25:24,760 --> 00:25:27,960 Speaker 1: realize that tesla's have. You know, they have the ability 397 00:25:28,040 --> 00:25:30,200 Speaker 1: to like catch images and that sort of thing the 398 00:25:30,280 --> 00:25:32,959 Speaker 1: people that are passing by. I guess it initiates somehow. 399 00:25:33,119 --> 00:25:35,960 Speaker 1: I'm not really sure how that works. They're everywhere day, 400 00:25:36,119 --> 00:25:38,840 Speaker 1: I mean, just everywhere you can be snapped doing anything, 401 00:25:39,320 --> 00:25:44,280 Speaker 1: and in this particular instance, we've got a pretty substantial 402 00:25:44,920 --> 00:25:49,879 Speaker 1: bit of video evidence of him moving moving this item 403 00:25:50,480 --> 00:25:55,440 Speaker 1: across the ground and where she is deposited out here 404 00:25:55,480 --> 00:26:02,440 Speaker 1: in this location. I'm wondering what state her remains were in. 405 00:26:02,560 --> 00:26:08,560 Speaker 1: I'm wondering about accessibility because when I hear that a 406 00:26:08,600 --> 00:26:11,560 Speaker 1: body has been found in an isolated location like this, 407 00:26:11,720 --> 00:26:15,160 Speaker 1: and it has been how'd you frame it to kind 408 00:26:15,160 --> 00:26:18,360 Speaker 1: of dump down the side of the hill? Yes, down 409 00:26:18,320 --> 00:26:23,119 Speaker 1: in an embankment. This is not showing due care to 410 00:26:23,200 --> 00:26:28,240 Speaker 1: human remains. This is speed. This is speed. This is 411 00:26:28,320 --> 00:26:31,600 Speaker 1: like you're just kind of rolling the body off. One 412 00:26:31,600 --> 00:26:34,760 Speaker 1: thing that came into play here, though. One thing that 413 00:26:34,800 --> 00:26:37,760 Speaker 1: came in to play here is the fact that the 414 00:26:37,800 --> 00:26:45,120 Speaker 1: police did in fact mention that item that maybe cocooned 415 00:26:45,160 --> 00:26:51,840 Speaker 1: her body. It appears to be perhaps a green colored 416 00:26:51,880 --> 00:27:09,840 Speaker 1: cheek from their home, Dave, I wanted to return back 417 00:27:10,080 --> 00:27:16,199 Speaker 1: to a theme that kind of inhabits a lot of 418 00:27:16,200 --> 00:27:23,520 Speaker 1: our discussions on body backs. And you know, I've always 419 00:27:23,520 --> 00:27:27,120 Speaker 1: held that, you know, I think that the most, probably 420 00:27:27,160 --> 00:27:31,879 Speaker 1: the vast majority of homicides that are committed in our 421 00:27:31,920 --> 00:27:35,720 Speaker 1: country are as a result of some kind of domestic violence. 422 00:27:36,160 --> 00:27:39,280 Speaker 1: You know, because contrary to what people think, it's not 423 00:27:39,359 --> 00:27:42,040 Speaker 1: the stranger in the dark alley. It's just not. I mean, 424 00:27:42,080 --> 00:27:45,879 Speaker 1: it does happen. Obviously, it happens. Okay, nobody you know, 425 00:27:46,280 --> 00:27:50,719 Speaker 1: lose your mind. It does happen. But you're generally going 426 00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:52,800 Speaker 1: to get into a beef with somebody you're inhabiting the 427 00:27:52,800 --> 00:27:55,600 Speaker 1: same space with, all right, and it turns very violent. 428 00:27:55,640 --> 00:27:59,920 Speaker 1: We talked about the degree of violence here with domestic violence. 429 00:28:01,960 --> 00:28:04,560 Speaker 1: You had mentioned history of domestic violence. 430 00:28:04,560 --> 00:28:10,160 Speaker 2: What have you got his mother, her mother, Sheila's mom 431 00:28:10,800 --> 00:28:14,080 Speaker 2: said that her daughter, you know, they lived in Peru 432 00:28:14,480 --> 00:28:20,040 Speaker 2: before coming to Southern California, and while in Peru, according 433 00:28:20,040 --> 00:28:27,359 Speaker 2: to Sheila's mother, she had reported him for domestic violence 434 00:28:27,600 --> 00:28:32,560 Speaker 2: in Peru and the last time that they spoke. You know, 435 00:28:33,400 --> 00:28:35,679 Speaker 2: you got that whole control thing, right. A lot of 436 00:28:35,800 --> 00:28:38,800 Speaker 2: men who abuse their spouse controlled them, and one of 437 00:28:38,800 --> 00:28:43,920 Speaker 2: the control mechanisms is to a remove all their support. 438 00:28:45,080 --> 00:28:47,440 Speaker 2: And what did he do? She reports him for domestic 439 00:28:47,560 --> 00:28:49,720 Speaker 2: violence in Peru. He loads up the family and moves 440 00:28:49,720 --> 00:28:52,920 Speaker 2: to La where she knows nobody. And that came out 441 00:28:52,960 --> 00:28:57,160 Speaker 2: at the vigil. Friends and neighbors, coworkers, they actually got 442 00:28:57,160 --> 00:29:00,719 Speaker 2: together and did a vigil for Shela. You know, remember 443 00:29:00,760 --> 00:29:03,720 Speaker 2: the murder victim, not another one. That kind of domestic 444 00:29:03,840 --> 00:29:07,560 Speaker 2: violence rallied to a degree, and one of them was 445 00:29:07,600 --> 00:29:12,280 Speaker 2: talking about how that she didn't have any family in 446 00:29:12,320 --> 00:29:15,560 Speaker 2: the United States, and this friend said, we have to 447 00:29:15,600 --> 00:29:18,840 Speaker 2: be her voice. She has no he she had been 448 00:29:18,880 --> 00:29:22,160 Speaker 2: totally separated from any kind of a support. So she 449 00:29:22,240 --> 00:29:24,640 Speaker 2: reports him for abuse in Peru. He loads up her 450 00:29:24,680 --> 00:29:27,360 Speaker 2: and his kids and brings them here. So and then 451 00:29:27,600 --> 00:29:29,720 Speaker 2: you know, obviously, well, no, he has been charged with 452 00:29:29,760 --> 00:29:33,040 Speaker 2: her murder. He hasn't been convicted. He is charged with murder. 453 00:29:33,360 --> 00:29:36,120 Speaker 2: And then the first thing he does reports are missing 454 00:29:37,120 --> 00:29:40,800 Speaker 2: heads to Peru with the kids. The children are being 455 00:29:40,800 --> 00:29:41,760 Speaker 2: taken care of it by her mother. 456 00:29:41,840 --> 00:29:47,360 Speaker 1: By the way, well, I know that I can almost 457 00:29:48,040 --> 00:29:51,640 Speaker 1: bet that at this point in time, they've already looked 458 00:29:51,680 --> 00:29:55,200 Speaker 1: into how many calls were made at their residence, uh, 459 00:29:55,360 --> 00:29:57,479 Speaker 1: both with you know, and they would they would look 460 00:29:57,520 --> 00:30:00,680 Speaker 1: at it from the perspective of Lancaster PD that would 461 00:30:00,720 --> 00:30:04,240 Speaker 1: work that area. And also Los Angeles can't share his office. 462 00:30:04,280 --> 00:30:06,680 Speaker 1: If anything else that happened, you know, that might you know, 463 00:30:06,720 --> 00:30:09,640 Speaker 1: maybe they got into a fight in a store, or 464 00:30:09,840 --> 00:30:13,000 Speaker 1: he was seen hurting her or abusing her in any 465 00:30:13,080 --> 00:30:13,880 Speaker 1: number of ways. 466 00:30:14,200 --> 00:30:16,840 Speaker 2: And John, I got a question for you about the body. 467 00:30:16,920 --> 00:30:19,400 Speaker 2: And okay, we saw him dragging what we believed to 468 00:30:19,440 --> 00:30:23,320 Speaker 2: be her body. And okay, if he reports you're missing 469 00:30:23,320 --> 00:30:25,280 Speaker 2: on the twelfth, so let's we're going to have to 470 00:30:25,400 --> 00:30:29,760 Speaker 2: assume that was the a day after or the day 471 00:30:30,000 --> 00:30:34,160 Speaker 2: that she died. Yeah, and so they find her body 472 00:30:34,200 --> 00:30:38,640 Speaker 2: the next day, wrapped in this blanket or sheet. What 473 00:30:38,760 --> 00:30:42,800 Speaker 2: kind of information? What kind of forensic evidence are we 474 00:30:42,840 --> 00:30:45,880 Speaker 2: going to find wrapped in this sheet? Is it going 475 00:30:45,960 --> 00:30:47,400 Speaker 2: to be a good thing for him or a bad 476 00:30:47,440 --> 00:30:47,920 Speaker 2: thing for him? 477 00:30:48,000 --> 00:30:49,640 Speaker 1: That it's going to be a bad thing, because if 478 00:30:49,680 --> 00:30:51,760 Speaker 1: you married that up, what did I tell you? What 479 00:30:51,800 --> 00:30:53,320 Speaker 1: did I say just a second ago? What kind of 480 00:30:53,320 --> 00:30:57,000 Speaker 1: surface were they on? They weren't a concrete surface. And 481 00:30:57,000 --> 00:31:00,960 Speaker 1: that's all we can see, all right, So anybody that 482 00:31:01,080 --> 00:31:03,520 Speaker 1: is hearing my voice right now, the next time you 483 00:31:03,560 --> 00:31:05,760 Speaker 1: go outside, if you've got a sidewalk, if you've got 484 00:31:05,760 --> 00:31:08,520 Speaker 1: a sidewalk outside of your house, or maybe a walkway 485 00:31:08,560 --> 00:31:11,440 Speaker 1: that leads to you know, your garage or whatever it is, 486 00:31:12,000 --> 00:31:14,800 Speaker 1: look down just for a second, take your hand and 487 00:31:14,880 --> 00:31:17,719 Speaker 1: place it on that surface. Okay, place it on the surface, 488 00:31:17,760 --> 00:31:20,840 Speaker 1: and just gently rub your hand across the top of it. 489 00:31:20,840 --> 00:31:23,760 Speaker 1: It's any irregular surface, all right. And even if you've 490 00:31:23,800 --> 00:31:30,080 Speaker 1: got like newly poured concrete, it's still it is very abrasive. 491 00:31:30,320 --> 00:31:33,080 Speaker 1: So that sheet, to me, which I think it's a 492 00:31:33,120 --> 00:31:37,040 Speaker 1: sheet Dave, is not going to provide very much protection. 493 00:31:38,360 --> 00:31:40,560 Speaker 1: When we were little boys and mom had us dressed 494 00:31:40,560 --> 00:31:43,960 Speaker 1: in our tough skin jeans, you know, even if you 495 00:31:44,080 --> 00:31:46,480 Speaker 1: fell in your tough skin jeans, you know which would 496 00:31:46,520 --> 00:31:49,160 Speaker 1: stand up by themselves. Look those up. If you're not 497 00:31:49,200 --> 00:31:52,640 Speaker 1: familiar with what Dave and I are referring to. Even 498 00:31:52,680 --> 00:31:56,280 Speaker 1: if you're wearing tough skin jeans and you pound it 499 00:31:56,320 --> 00:31:58,200 Speaker 1: on your knees when you hit the ground, you're still 500 00:31:58,200 --> 00:32:01,640 Speaker 1: gonna have abrasions on there. Well. The dead can actually 501 00:32:01,680 --> 00:32:05,760 Speaker 1: have pattern abrasions as well. Now they're they're not really 502 00:32:06,000 --> 00:32:08,960 Speaker 1: abrasions in the sense that we think about in dwelling hemorrhage, 503 00:32:08,960 --> 00:32:12,479 Speaker 1: because the dead don't hemorrhage. But what you can see 504 00:32:12,920 --> 00:32:16,440 Speaker 1: there are you think about drag marks in the dirt day, Well, 505 00:32:16,480 --> 00:32:19,440 Speaker 1: you can have these impressions on the body as it's 506 00:32:19,440 --> 00:32:22,600 Speaker 1: being drug there. Most of the time, they're going to 507 00:32:22,680 --> 00:32:26,600 Speaker 1: have kind of a linear appearance, and they'll be clustered 508 00:32:26,640 --> 00:32:29,600 Speaker 1: almost like concurrently with a surface that you're dragging them 509 00:32:29,600 --> 00:32:35,240 Speaker 1: over the top of, and it will the abrasiveness is 510 00:32:35,280 --> 00:32:38,920 Speaker 1: so substantial that it will penetrate through that sheet. It's 511 00:32:38,960 --> 00:32:43,080 Speaker 1: a very tiny membrane. It's not like you have them. 512 00:32:43,640 --> 00:32:45,760 Speaker 1: I don't know, it's not like you you you have 513 00:32:45,880 --> 00:32:51,720 Speaker 1: them in a multi multi layered uh. You know, even 514 00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:55,080 Speaker 1: a body bag. A body bag is not going you 515 00:32:55,160 --> 00:32:57,640 Speaker 1: won't see those kind of a braided areas on their 516 00:32:57,760 --> 00:33:01,760 Speaker 1: post mortal abrasions. If you will, so there'll be evidence. 517 00:33:01,760 --> 00:33:04,640 Speaker 1: And look, man, if you take that, if you take 518 00:33:04,680 --> 00:33:10,280 Speaker 1: that video and you analyze it compared to the way 519 00:33:10,360 --> 00:33:13,120 Speaker 1: you think, and they can do this with computer analyzation 520 00:33:13,240 --> 00:33:18,240 Speaker 1: day where they can they can actually get an idea 521 00:33:18,360 --> 00:33:21,440 Speaker 1: the position of her body. I'm thinking she's laying like 522 00:33:21,520 --> 00:33:24,720 Speaker 1: in what we would call a right recumbent position, where's 523 00:33:25,280 --> 00:33:30,200 Speaker 1: her right side is making contact with the ground, her 524 00:33:30,280 --> 00:33:32,920 Speaker 1: left side is up and she's almost in a fetal 525 00:33:32,960 --> 00:33:35,360 Speaker 1: position or the body is and it's being drug So 526 00:33:35,480 --> 00:33:38,000 Speaker 1: I would look on like the right contacting side of 527 00:33:38,040 --> 00:33:41,840 Speaker 1: the body, maybe points of the shoulder, the hips, that 528 00:33:41,960 --> 00:33:45,200 Speaker 1: sort of thing, and you can actually see those kind 529 00:33:45,200 --> 00:33:49,520 Speaker 1: of striations that would appear on the body. That's a 530 00:33:49,560 --> 00:33:51,960 Speaker 1: big piece of evidence, man, I mean a huge piece 531 00:33:51,960 --> 00:33:54,720 Speaker 1: of evidence. And then if you find those fibers, which 532 00:33:54,760 --> 00:33:58,360 Speaker 1: I think you probably could embedded, and those insults all 533 00:33:58,400 --> 00:34:01,680 Speaker 1: along there, that's going to be a telltale thing too. 534 00:34:02,040 --> 00:34:05,960 Speaker 1: Here's another piece of evidence. You know. I don't know 535 00:34:06,640 --> 00:34:09,200 Speaker 1: where you get your sheets from, but most of the time, 536 00:34:09,680 --> 00:34:12,080 Speaker 1: if you buy a package of sheets, all right, you're 537 00:34:12,080 --> 00:34:15,239 Speaker 1: gonna get a fitted sheet. You can get a standard sheet, 538 00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:19,480 Speaker 1: you know, and you get pillow cases. Right Well, are 539 00:34:19,480 --> 00:34:23,400 Speaker 1: there other sheets and pillowcases that match that lot that 540 00:34:24,080 --> 00:34:28,000 Speaker 1: this covering came from, all right, still remaining in the house, 541 00:34:28,719 --> 00:34:31,760 Speaker 1: And that again is another point where you can marry 542 00:34:31,840 --> 00:34:34,440 Speaker 1: up evidence. You know, we've got something that originated from 543 00:34:34,480 --> 00:34:37,799 Speaker 1: the same original pack. Here Okay, so you've got that. 544 00:34:38,880 --> 00:34:43,839 Speaker 1: I'm very curious because I didn't. And again we're kind 545 00:34:43,840 --> 00:34:47,200 Speaker 1: of at a disadvantage of looking at the CCTV. But 546 00:34:48,520 --> 00:34:51,840 Speaker 1: I didn't see any kind of like big stains on 547 00:34:51,880 --> 00:34:54,160 Speaker 1: the outside of the sheet that would indicate that sheets 548 00:34:54,160 --> 00:34:57,839 Speaker 1: profusely or the body is profusely bled. Sometimes you'll see 549 00:34:57,840 --> 00:35:01,360 Speaker 1: those kind of super saturated areas. I'm not seeing that here. 550 00:35:01,680 --> 00:35:04,680 Speaker 1: That doesn't mean that she's not bleeding. But what I'm 551 00:35:04,680 --> 00:35:07,920 Speaker 1: interested in is going back into the house and searching 552 00:35:07,960 --> 00:35:11,719 Speaker 1: the bedroom. You know, mom and dad want to have 553 00:35:11,719 --> 00:35:13,799 Speaker 1: a discussion. They go in the bedroom, shut the door 554 00:35:13,800 --> 00:35:16,680 Speaker 1: to the kids, or somewhere else. I guess he could 555 00:35:16,719 --> 00:35:19,040 Speaker 1: have chased her through the house, you know, whatever may 556 00:35:19,080 --> 00:35:21,200 Speaker 1: have happened. But I'm going to go through that house 557 00:35:21,640 --> 00:35:23,759 Speaker 1: room by room, inch by inch, and I'm going to 558 00:35:23,800 --> 00:35:26,640 Speaker 1: look for any kind of bloody deposition and there anything 559 00:35:26,800 --> 00:35:30,319 Speaker 1: whatsoever that types out to her. You know, you can 560 00:35:30,360 --> 00:35:35,440 Speaker 1: say it's amazing. It's one thing to say, well, we 561 00:35:35,520 --> 00:35:38,200 Speaker 1: found her DNA at a scene, all right, because the 562 00:35:38,239 --> 00:35:41,440 Speaker 1: standard line now it's almost wrote everybody knows that, well, 563 00:35:41,480 --> 00:35:43,920 Speaker 1: you expect to find her DNA there because she lives there. 564 00:35:44,680 --> 00:35:48,600 Speaker 1: You don't expect to find copious amounts of blood that 565 00:35:48,719 --> 00:35:51,960 Speaker 1: married back to her. Okay, that cannot as easily be 566 00:35:52,000 --> 00:35:56,359 Speaker 1: explained away because blood always denotes injury. So if I've 567 00:35:56,400 --> 00:35:59,799 Speaker 1: got blood deposition a scene, I'm thinking, okay, somebody was in, 568 00:36:00,680 --> 00:36:03,120 Speaker 1: you know, prior to this. This isn't just like passively 569 00:36:03,160 --> 00:36:06,600 Speaker 1: touching a surface and you're leaving you know, dead skin 570 00:36:06,680 --> 00:36:09,640 Speaker 1: cells behind, but touch DnaA as something completely different. I 571 00:36:09,680 --> 00:36:13,240 Speaker 1: want to look there. I want to know about the car. 572 00:36:13,560 --> 00:36:17,080 Speaker 1: The car is huge here, because if the car is 573 00:36:17,120 --> 00:36:20,960 Speaker 1: being used to transport her body, I can tell you 574 00:36:20,960 --> 00:36:23,120 Speaker 1: they didn't put the body into the back of an 575 00:36:23,239 --> 00:36:26,440 Speaker 1: uber and drive through the Angelus National Forest and say, hey, driver, 576 00:36:26,520 --> 00:36:27,960 Speaker 1: can you stop here and let me take care of 577 00:36:28,000 --> 00:36:29,640 Speaker 1: this that I have in the back of your car. 578 00:36:29,680 --> 00:36:33,319 Speaker 1: Here it's his vehicle or vehicle he has access to. 579 00:36:34,120 --> 00:36:37,600 Speaker 1: So what was going on inside of that vehicle was 580 00:36:38,760 --> 00:36:41,160 Speaker 1: and my god, this is terrifying to think about. I 581 00:36:41,200 --> 00:36:45,120 Speaker 1: can't help myself though. I got to say this. Chris Watts, Yep, 582 00:36:46,200 --> 00:36:48,240 Speaker 1: she was in that back seat, she was in the floorboard, 583 00:36:48,239 --> 00:36:49,759 Speaker 1: and those babies were in the back seat with her. 584 00:36:49,960 --> 00:36:54,000 Speaker 1: You remember that, ye, And he was transporting, transporting them 585 00:36:54,040 --> 00:36:57,880 Speaker 1: out there with those babies in there with their mama, 586 00:36:58,320 --> 00:37:01,560 Speaker 1: you know, like in the cab of the vehicle. I 587 00:37:01,600 --> 00:37:03,960 Speaker 1: don't know. I mean, that's that's one of the things, 588 00:37:04,120 --> 00:37:07,400 Speaker 1: you know, that comes to mind for me. What what 589 00:37:07,840 --> 00:37:12,680 Speaker 1: can these children communicate about that fateful moment, you know, 590 00:37:12,880 --> 00:37:15,440 Speaker 1: when they're being driven around and the next thing you know, 591 00:37:15,600 --> 00:37:18,520 Speaker 1: they're sitting. They're sitting in a terminal in lax and 592 00:37:18,560 --> 00:37:23,399 Speaker 1: it's wheels up, baby, They're heading south. And then I think, 593 00:37:23,640 --> 00:37:28,560 Speaker 1: finally I'm going to be really interested in the scene 594 00:37:28,560 --> 00:37:33,280 Speaker 1: itself because we believe if we think that her body 595 00:37:33,320 --> 00:37:36,839 Speaker 1: is cocooned in this material and kind of pressed down 596 00:37:36,880 --> 00:37:40,520 Speaker 1: slope or pushed down slope, is there anything else that 597 00:37:40,560 --> 00:37:43,600 Speaker 1: he took and kind of tossed out, you know, that 598 00:37:43,680 --> 00:37:48,080 Speaker 1: approximates the body, or was there anything else in that cocooning, 599 00:37:48,280 --> 00:37:51,879 Speaker 1: like you know, because I've had cases where I had 600 00:37:51,880 --> 00:37:56,360 Speaker 1: one case I remember specifically where shower curtain was involved 601 00:37:56,719 --> 00:37:58,920 Speaker 1: to transport the body in the person who been stabbed, 602 00:37:58,960 --> 00:38:01,120 Speaker 1: and they took the knife they'd used and wrapped it 603 00:38:01,200 --> 00:38:03,759 Speaker 1: up in the shower curtain too. Thank you very much. 604 00:38:03,920 --> 00:38:08,080 Speaker 1: We really appreciate your efforts here because that helped us, 605 00:38:08,239 --> 00:38:10,879 Speaker 1: you know, because you've got literally the murder weapon there 606 00:38:10,920 --> 00:38:14,160 Speaker 1: that's been gifted to you by the perpetrator. So you 607 00:38:14,239 --> 00:38:17,759 Speaker 1: have those three points contact here where you're wondering what 608 00:38:17,960 --> 00:38:20,520 Speaker 1: else is there that's going to tell this poor woman's 609 00:38:20,600 --> 00:38:25,040 Speaker 1: story because she can't I mean, her light's been snuffed 610 00:38:25,080 --> 00:38:28,240 Speaker 1: out now and she can't convey to us the horror 611 00:38:28,320 --> 00:38:31,440 Speaker 1: that she probably endured, and not just in the moment 612 00:38:31,480 --> 00:38:34,359 Speaker 1: of her death, but Lord only knows months leading up 613 00:38:34,400 --> 00:38:36,799 Speaker 1: to it. You know, he's going to drag her away 614 00:38:36,800 --> 00:38:41,120 Speaker 1: from her family in Peru because he's been reported for 615 00:38:41,280 --> 00:38:43,640 Speaker 1: DV and he's going to land in Los Angeles, where 616 00:38:43,680 --> 00:38:47,840 Speaker 1: she's isolated, doesn't know anybody. I wonder how much access 617 00:38:47,840 --> 00:38:50,480 Speaker 1: he gave her to a phone, you know, how much 618 00:38:50,600 --> 00:38:53,480 Speaker 1: was she allowed to work outside the home? Was she 619 00:38:53,520 --> 00:38:55,960 Speaker 1: allowed to even answer a phone? Did he have her 620 00:38:56,000 --> 00:39:00,760 Speaker 1: trapped in the house? I don't know. It's certainly horrible. 621 00:39:00,840 --> 00:39:03,319 Speaker 1: And of course these kids are Dave, They're just they're 622 00:39:03,400 --> 00:39:05,880 Speaker 1: left and the way can you, okay, can you imagine 623 00:39:05,880 --> 00:39:10,839 Speaker 1: this can't find your daddy? Your mom is dead and 624 00:39:10,920 --> 00:39:14,480 Speaker 1: now and granted you said that they're with her Grandma, 625 00:39:14,640 --> 00:39:17,719 Speaker 1: which is great Grandma's are the best creatures God ever 626 00:39:17,719 --> 00:39:19,040 Speaker 1: put on the face of the planet as far as 627 00:39:19,080 --> 00:39:23,239 Speaker 1: I'm concerned. They're with her, but there's only so much 628 00:39:23,280 --> 00:39:26,160 Speaker 1: solace you can take in that in this old world, Dave, 629 00:39:26,640 --> 00:39:29,200 Speaker 1: and that's where these three kids are right now. They're 630 00:39:29,239 --> 00:39:31,920 Speaker 1: down there and their mom and dad are completely gone. Man. 631 00:39:33,280 --> 00:39:36,040 Speaker 1: We're going to keep our eye on this case because 632 00:39:36,080 --> 00:39:38,399 Speaker 1: I can tell you there is going to be much 633 00:39:38,520 --> 00:39:42,400 Speaker 1: much more to be revealed about this, particularly from an 634 00:39:42,400 --> 00:39:48,400 Speaker 1: evidentiary standpoint. We still have yet to answer what method 635 00:39:48,520 --> 00:39:53,960 Speaker 1: was employed to take this poor mother's life. We're going 636 00:39:54,000 --> 00:39:57,400 Speaker 1: to keep our eye on it for you. I'm Joseph 637 00:39:57,400 --> 00:40:06,480 Speaker 1: Scott Morgan and this his bodybags