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Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind from how Stuff

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Speaker 1: Works dot com. Hey you welcome to Stuff to Blow

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Speaker 1: your Mind. My name is Robert Lamb and I'm Joe McCormick.

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Speaker 1: And of course, since it's October, we're still in our

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Speaker 1: month long celebration of monster science, horror science, spooky science

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Speaker 1: all month long, and today we're bringing you another entry.

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Speaker 1: This time we're gonna be taking a visit to the

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Speaker 1: vampire clinic. That's right. We have all of these various

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Speaker 1: vampire patients coming in, uh, family members bringing them in

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Speaker 1: and uh, you know, straight jackets, caskets, what have you,

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Speaker 1: all of them with a seemingly insatiable appetite for blood.

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Speaker 1: But how how are the doctors here supposed to treat

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Speaker 1: these various vampires because there's not simply one vampire, right,

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Speaker 1: I mean, all we have to do is look around

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Speaker 1: at the at the wealth of of of global folklore

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Speaker 1: and legend to see that there are multiple varieties of

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Speaker 1: vampire out there. How are we to figure out exactly

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Speaker 1: what ailment might be causing any given one of them? Right?

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Speaker 1: You know? I I think despite the fact that sometimes

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Speaker 1: when you hear people complain about the vampire movies of today.

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Speaker 1: They will specifically complain about the lack of consistency and

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Speaker 1: the rules that the vampire must adhere to in order

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Speaker 1: to survive or be defeated or whatever, you know what

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Speaker 1: I'm talking about. Like they're saying there needs to be

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Speaker 1: more consistency, Like people complain like what this movie had

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Speaker 1: a vampire that like, yeah, what this vampire didn't respond

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Speaker 1: to across or oh what you know what I mean?

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Speaker 1: But I feel exactly the opposite. I I do not

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Speaker 1: think there should be more consistency in what supernatural rules

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Speaker 1: apply to vampires in the movies. I think there should

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Speaker 1: be less consistency and more variety to reflect the fact

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Speaker 1: that the vampire, long before it emerged as a sort

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Speaker 1: of twentieth century movie monster with with well established tropes

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Speaker 1: and cliches that you can repeat in every single monster

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Speaker 1: movie down the road, it was, it was a folk

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Speaker 1: almost at folk hero, certainly not a fulk hero of

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Speaker 1: folk monster, a monster of the people of the folk

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Speaker 1: lore you know, spread from house to house, from town

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Speaker 1: to town, beliefs about the dead coming back to life,

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Speaker 1: beliefs about how they drain the vitality of the living.

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Speaker 1: There are a few things that are consistent, but other

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Speaker 1: than that, there's a lot of variety. And I think

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Speaker 1: one of the reasons we see a lot of variety

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Speaker 1: in vampire folklore is the close association with vampires and

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Speaker 1: real historical biological diseases, which of course there is plenty

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Speaker 1: of variety in as well. Yeah, I mean globally you

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Speaker 1: look at them and they range from spectral forces to

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Speaker 1: physical blood drinkers, from humanoid monsters to things best described

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Speaker 1: as great flesh bags or or chimerical hybrids that have

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Speaker 1: you know, involved beast parts. Right. Uh, And you know,

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Speaker 1: we obviously love vampires on the show We're very We're

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Speaker 1: a pro vampire podcast. I think we're we're recovering to

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Speaker 1: the vampire position, right. Vampires got a little stale for

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Speaker 1: a while there in the movies. Well, I think the

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Speaker 1: things that get stale are first of all, a tendency

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Speaker 1: to only adhere to very certain aspects of the vampire

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Speaker 1: trope and not and this, and not realizing they have

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Speaker 1: this rich heritage that you need to you you could

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Speaker 1: be drawing from, Like how many vampire movies utilize their

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Speaker 1: fascination with with knots and uh and and chords. You

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Speaker 1: know where they have some sort of intricate pattern that

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Speaker 1: keeps them occupied until the sun comes up. How many?

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Speaker 1: How many use the throw rice on the ground or

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Speaker 1: seeds on the ground so they have to stop and

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Speaker 1: count them. Yeah, that sort of thing. Um or or

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Speaker 1: the idea which we will touch on later, the the

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Speaker 1: idea that you could become a vampire simply by being

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Speaker 1: a magnificent lover. That's almost never explored as a vampire origin.

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Speaker 1: I don't think I know that one. Yeah, like that,

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Speaker 1: that's one that's sited in one of the papers we

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Speaker 1: look at. If you're just a fabulous lover, you might

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Speaker 1: turn into a vampire. I want to see that in

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Speaker 1: the film. Yeah, it should, well, I mean it should

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Speaker 1: show up because there should be more variety, like I'm saying,

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Speaker 1: in the vampire movies. I think we're on the same

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Speaker 1: page about this. And then the other thing too is

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Speaker 1: we can't always blame it on the vampire. Sometimes it's

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Speaker 1: just a poor movie or poor script or performance. Is

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Speaker 1: there any other man? The many factors that can hurt

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Speaker 1: a vampire film. But no matter what, the baseline principle

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Speaker 1: behind the vampire continues to resonate that you have this

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Speaker 1: sort of human but ultimately an human thing that wants

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Speaker 1: to drain our life force. And there are any number

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Speaker 1: of cultural and psychological angles to take on all of this, right,

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Speaker 1: I mean, the racial treatment of the vampire legend, the

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Speaker 1: the emotional aspects of vampireism. Sexual issues with vamporism are

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Speaker 1: long for immortality, but there's almost always this this element

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Speaker 1: of contagion, right, some physical change uh, in physiological other

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Speaker 1: news that can be acquired, and that's what we're going

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Speaker 1: to be focusing on today, the element of contagion, of disease,

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Speaker 1: of physiological change. We want to explore the medical side

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Speaker 1: of the vampire legend, uh, and this is a territory

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Speaker 1: that's extremely rich. So there's no way we're gonna have

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Speaker 1: time today to explore all of the fascinating ways that

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Speaker 1: you can look at vampire legends from from a medical standpoint,

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Speaker 1: where we're going to explore some of the most interesting

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Speaker 1: ones right now, there's a lot of fascinating ground to

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Speaker 1: cover on the subject in the link between uh, medical

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Speaker 1: conditions and diseases and the vampire lore. So this is

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Speaker 1: going to be part one of a two part episode.

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Speaker 1: We hope you'll stick around for both of them. And

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Speaker 1: if some of you out there are are listening to

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Speaker 1: this and you're saying, well, Robert and Joe, I'm not

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Speaker 1: really a vampire fan. I'm more of a werewolf fan. Well,

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Speaker 1: the good news is that there's a little bit of

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Speaker 1: werewolf in here too. A lot of the things that

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Speaker 1: we're discussing here you could potentially apply to myths of werewolf,

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Speaker 1: any kind of myth where people are taking on some

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Speaker 1: sort of you know, physiological otherness. Yes. And another thing

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Speaker 1: I would say is that the vampire lore and the

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Speaker 1: werewolf lore are not quite so distinct in their origins

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Speaker 1: as they have become in the movies of today. Uh So,

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Speaker 1: obviously we're not going to be assuming today that vampires

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Speaker 1: are real, but we can ask what goes to explain

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Speaker 1: the origins of vampire folklore. And of course, as always, Robert,

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Speaker 1: you and I are fond of emphasizing that sometimes in

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Speaker 1: seeking the inspiration behind mythical beasts and monsters and that

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Speaker 1: kind of thing, we sometimes underplay the potential role of

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Speaker 1: creative imagination. Right, Sometimes writers and storytellers just use their

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Speaker 1: imagination and make things up, And sometimes these made up

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Speaker 1: stories become very popular and spread far and wide, but

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Speaker 1: also sometimes mythical beasts and stories are indeed inspired by

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Speaker 1: aspects of reality, of nature, of human history being misinterpreted

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Speaker 1: as supernatural. And so we're gonna look at how that

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Speaker 1: last part applies to the idea of vampires. Could vampires

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Speaker 1: be an example of something in nature being misinterpreted, not

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Speaker 1: simply a product of creative imagination, but based in a

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Speaker 1: misunderstanding of real biology and nature at work, interpreted through

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Speaker 1: the superstitious lenses of human culture. And of course, as

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Speaker 1: we we've we've hinted at an obvious place to look

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Speaker 1: for this kind of inspiration for vampire lore would be

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Speaker 1: in human diseases. It turns out lots of human diseases

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Speaker 1: over the years have been linked to vampireism, so many

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Speaker 1: that we can't talk about all of them. But today

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Speaker 1: we we we want to take a quick tour through

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Speaker 1: the medical view of vampireism. So let's settle into the

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Speaker 1: vampire clinic. Robert, you started to paint a picture of

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Speaker 1: this earlier. Yeah, we imagine we're in a wing of

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Speaker 1: Dark Place Hospital and uh, and Dr Lucian Sanchez is

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Speaker 1: waiting to see the next patient who comes in at

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Speaker 1: the vampire clinic. So we got a waiting room full

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Speaker 1: of people who have brought their loved ones suspecting they

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Speaker 1: may be vampires, they may be becoming vampires, they may

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Speaker 1: be at risk of becoming vampires. And they've all got

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Speaker 1: to see Dr Sanchez and say, tell me what's going on? Doc?

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Speaker 1: Can you help my vampire uncle? Yeah? And the confusing

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Speaker 1: thing is that these different vampire patients, they do have

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Speaker 1: at times drastically different characteristics. Some are are pale and

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Speaker 1: frothing blood uh summer uh summer, or violent. Some are

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Speaker 1: more carnal in their their desires, you know. Some are

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Speaker 1: creeping along like like Count Orlock from nos Ferato. Others

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Speaker 1: are are just waltzing in, glittering like the vampires from Twilight.

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Speaker 1: Surely these are all different ailments. They most surely are. Now.

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Speaker 1: I think one patient that we can get out of

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Speaker 1: the way fairly quickly, not because it's not interesting, but

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Speaker 1: because it's kind of a different direction than we want

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Speaker 1: to go in today is the patient who presents to

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Speaker 1: Dr Lucien Sanchez with clinical vamporism. This would be a

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Speaker 1: term that is not so much a disease of the body,

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Speaker 1: but this would be a mental disorder that tends to

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Speaker 1: entail aspects of necrophilia, of cannibalism, of sadism, of necrophagia,

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Speaker 1: and fascination with blood. This is when you get, for example,

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Speaker 1: people who are actually drinking blood, not because they are

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Speaker 1: supernatural vampires, but because they have an unfortunate mental disorder

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Speaker 1: right that may or may not be um influenced by

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Speaker 1: existing vampire fiction, kind of giving them something to feed

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Speaker 1: on with their delusions. Now, putting that aside, the first

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Speaker 1: patient that I think we should see in the clinic

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Speaker 1: today is one that you've visited before on this podcast, Robert,

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Speaker 1: which is the vampire who in fact is experiencing an

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Speaker 1: infection of syphilis. Yes, and indeed, Julie Douglas and I

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Speaker 1: discussed this at length in two episodes that we did

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Speaker 1: on syphilis, and we recently relaunched these episodes as a

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Speaker 1: single vault episode of stuff to blow your mind. So

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Speaker 1: if you want the full deep dive on that, you

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Speaker 1: should probably go back to the syphilis episodes, right, But

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Speaker 1: but I'm gonna I'm gonna try and condense it here

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Speaker 1: and give you, like just the the vampire syphilis cell

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Speaker 1: on the whole thing. So First of all, I just

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Speaker 1: need to run through what is syphilis. Many of you

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Speaker 1: may not know, uh, you should know because it is.

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Speaker 1: It is still around and it has been a highly

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Speaker 1: influential um uh disease on human history. Yeah, you might

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Speaker 1: say it is a major player in the cast of biohistory. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: definitely so. Syphilis is a chronic, sexually transmitted disease caused

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Speaker 1: by the spiral keep bacterium Treponema palladum palatum or T. Palatum.

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Speaker 1: The illness spread through Europe from the mid fifteenth century onward,

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Speaker 1: and despite the twentieth century advancement of antibiotics, which is

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Speaker 1: really the you know, the silver bullet that that that

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Speaker 1: took out a lot of the threat posed by syphilis. Regardless,

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Speaker 1: syphilis remains a global health concern, especially when you when

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Speaker 1: you consider that more than a million pregnant women pass

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Speaker 1: syphilis onto unborn children each year. According to the World

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Speaker 1: Health Organization, this forum, known as congenital syphilis, causes severe,

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Speaker 1: disabling and lethal health complications for the developing fetus. Now,

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Speaker 1: in non congenital cases, the primary infection of syphilis occurs

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Speaker 1: when T. Palatum enters the body, leaving a sore or

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Speaker 1: sores at the side of transmission for three to six weeks.

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Speaker 1: Then a secondary infection pops up in the weeks following

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Speaker 1: the primary infection. At this point, the initial te paatum

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Speaker 1: invasion is over, and now the enemy moves through the host.

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Speaker 1: A rash spreads across the entire body, accompanying accompanied by

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Speaker 1: various symptoms such as fever, lethargy, headaches, aches, and hair loss.

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Speaker 1: At this point, the host will enter a latent or

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Speaker 1: or hidden stage of the disease, and the T. Palatum

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Speaker 1: invasion is still present the body, but it's just no

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Speaker 1: longer contagious. You can think how that kind of hidden section,

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Speaker 1: or any any disease that has a latency period like that,

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Speaker 1: that makes it harder to discern exactly where the symptoms

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Speaker 1: you're experiencing are coming from or what caused them. Those

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Speaker 1: can help contribute to supernatural interpretations exactly. And it also

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Speaker 1: makes it all the more dangerous, right because you you

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Speaker 1: you get sick and then it seems like you get better,

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Speaker 1: but it's not the case. You still are carrying um

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Speaker 1: uh T palatum inside your body. Uh. And also I

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Speaker 1: should point out as far as symptoms go, syphialus was

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Speaker 1: often referred to as the Great Imitator because it would

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Speaker 1: it would the symptoms were not necessarily just you know ABC. Uh.

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Speaker 1: In a way, it kind of ties in nicely with

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Speaker 1: what we're discussing, uh in regards to the vampire myth.

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Speaker 1: So it became difficult to to diagnose at times. I mean,

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Speaker 1: how many diseases have flu like symptoms exactly, these diseases

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Speaker 1: that are easy to mistake for each other. Now there's

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Speaker 1: another step to all of this that goes into decidedly

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Speaker 1: more monstrous territory. Finally, and roughly fifteen to thirty of

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Speaker 1: those infected, the syphilis enters its late stage, also known

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Speaker 1: as the tertiary stay age, and it occurs ten to

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Speaker 1: twenty years after the initial infection, and the cavalcade of

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Speaker 1: symptoms include tissue damage, muscle damage, oregon damage, coordination problems, paralysis, numbness,

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Speaker 1: gradual blindness, dementia, and death. Um. This is where you

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Speaker 1: really get into the period where syphilis, um, you know,

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Speaker 1: has just this disastrous debilitating effects on say, facial features.

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Speaker 1: I've often mentioned on the show before. If anyone wants

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Speaker 1: to just a fabulous bit of medical history UH television,

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Speaker 1: they should watch The Nick, which was the Soderberg television series,

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Speaker 1: went to two seasons. Clive Owens, Yeah, Clive Owens plays

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Speaker 1: Dr Thackeray, Uh, you know, cutting edge of physician of

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Speaker 1: the of the time. But this is and and there's

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Speaker 1: a whole plot line in it where he's treating um

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Speaker 1: an individual with syphilis, and this is uh, this is

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Speaker 1: pre antibiotics. So there's only so much you can do.

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Speaker 1: But it's a very well done examination of syphilis in

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Speaker 1: that show. So, according to Slavic and comparative literature professor

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Speaker 1: Thomas Longanovic, commentators have often drawn a line of comparison

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Speaker 1: between the vampire uh and hereditary syphilis, especially hereditary again

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Speaker 1: being that that has passed from a mother to a child.

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Speaker 1: Because this it twists and decimates the features uh it uh,

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Speaker 1: and it can result in sharp, pointy teeth also known

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Speaker 1: as Hutchinson's teeth, long nails, and elongated skulls and so superficially,

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Speaker 1: it's easy to look at extreme cases of late syphilis

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Speaker 1: and compare them to something like count like Count Orlock

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Speaker 1: from the film Nosferato. Oh yeah, now the nose Ferrato

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Speaker 1: tradition especially this comes through in in later versions of

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Speaker 1: the Lord. It might not be there quite so much

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Speaker 1: in earlier versions, but like in Werner Hertzog's adaptation of No.

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Speaker 1: S Farrato, there's a clear link between the vampire and disease.

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Speaker 1: Maybe not so much explicitly syphilis, but like in in

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Speaker 1: Hertzog's Nos f a To, the vampire brings plague rats

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Speaker 1: with him where he goes. Yeah, he arrives on a

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Speaker 1: ship too. I mean the way a number of contagions

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Speaker 1: suddenly spread their way through an ever widening world. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And it's also been pointed out that while we uh

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Speaker 1: we we don't know the exact cause of brom Stoker's

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Speaker 1: death in nine uh, some biographers do attribute his death

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Speaker 1: to possibly being tertiary syphilis. So there is this idea

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Speaker 1: that perhaps, um, perhaps this is a this is a

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Speaker 1: big elf here, the vampire story that is presented in

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Speaker 1: popularized through Dracula has a direct link to the experience

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Speaker 1: of syphilis. Oh. You can almost imagine a kind of

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Speaker 1: cronenbergie in take on that on the composition of the

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Speaker 1: story with that in mind. Now, if I were to

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Speaker 1: present though a clear case, I mean, there are a

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Speaker 1: number of cases I think of of cinematic vampires and

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Speaker 1: TV vampires that match up with this. So we've already

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Speaker 1: mentioned or Lock. I think you could also throw in

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Speaker 1: any version of a vampire where at first they're beautiful

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Speaker 1: and then like a hideous nature's revealed. I'm thinking of

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Speaker 1: Samahiak and from Dusk Till Dawn. But the best example

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Speaker 1: it's clearly Count spiral Keet himself, which was from a

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Speaker 1: a U. S. Military um educational animated film about the

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Speaker 1: dangers of syphilis. What I didn't know about this? Oh yeah,

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Speaker 1: I recommend everyone check it out. If you just go

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Speaker 1: to YouTube and you do a search for Count spiral

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Speaker 1: Keet or just Count Syphilis, I guess it'll probably come

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Speaker 1: up for that as well. It's just this, uh, this wonderful,

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Speaker 1: weird educational film about the dangers of syphilis. Oh. I

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Speaker 1: just looked it up. I'm seeing okay. It's got a

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Speaker 1: kind of like pink panther kind of animation style. Also

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Speaker 1: looks like it might have some uh some somewhat sexist imagery,

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Speaker 1: like casting the female form as like a like a

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Speaker 1: target of disease delivery. Yeah, you see this a lot.

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Speaker 1: I mean I don't want to go down the syphilis

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Speaker 1: wormhole too much here, but um, you see that a

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Speaker 1: lot too, and messaging of the of of the the

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Speaker 1: early twentieth century, especially where they're they're warning men about

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Speaker 1: the dangers of syphilis and in doing so, they're warning

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Speaker 1: them about the dangers of females and they're portraying females.

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Speaker 1: Is this kind of monstrous creature ultimately like a hidden

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Speaker 1: monstrous nature. Now, of course, one has to take into

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Speaker 1: account of the primary target of these messages. We're you know,

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Speaker 1: we're talking about men that are in the military at

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Speaker 1: the listed men, listed men. But uh, but at the

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Speaker 1: same time, it is kind of creepy and and clearly

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Speaker 1: there's this strain of misogyny to the messages. It's almost

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Speaker 1: the same way that you couldn't just warn children about

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Speaker 1: the dangers of drowning in the pool and the old

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Speaker 1: moral pit. You had to make up a monster that

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Speaker 1: lived there and would pull them in. Yeah, it's like

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Speaker 1: you can't just warn people about the dangers of unprotected

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Speaker 1: sexual intercourse. You have to like sort of make the

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Speaker 1: person that they might be having X with into a

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Speaker 1: monster of some kind. Yeah. Indeed, though thought at the

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Speaker 1: heart that we we do have to drive home. So syphilis, yes, uh,

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Speaker 1: contagious and can do very debilitating things to your body

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Speaker 1: and also your mind. But for the most part that look,

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Speaker 1: there's not this link of of syphilis making anybody want

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Speaker 1: to drink blood or anything like that. No, no, no, no,

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Speaker 1: So it's I think it's a it's a there's a

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Speaker 1: it lines up in interesting ways with the vampire myth.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, I don't. I'm certainly not one to say, oh, vampires,

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Speaker 1: that's syphilis. Okay, So a mixed bag on this one.

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Speaker 1: A few a few things that say this could have

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Speaker 1: inspired some vampire lore, possibly especially maybe in the modern age,

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Speaker 1: but it's not a super strong link. Still, those vampires

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Speaker 1: that have come to the clinic that that that look

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Speaker 1: a little or locking in. We'll just give him some

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Speaker 1: antibiotics and yes, and see if we can't sort that out.

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Speaker 1: All right, Well, we need to take a quick ad

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Speaker 1: break and then we will be right back. Alright, we're back. Okay.

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Speaker 1: Are you ready to look at the next patient at

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Speaker 1: the Dark Place Vampire clinic. Let's do it. Okay, So

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Speaker 1: this next one, I think is going to be and

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Speaker 1: it's going to be kind of a false trail, but

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Speaker 1: an interesting one raising some good questions about science, communication,

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Speaker 1: and the media. So I want to start this next

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Speaker 1: one by looking at a New York Times article from

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Speaker 1: nineteen five by Philip M. Boffi called rare disease proposed

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Speaker 1: as cause for vampires. I like how it they used

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Speaker 1: the word cause. It's not like inspiration, but like cause,

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Speaker 1: like it made vampires. And I think they're that that

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Speaker 1: might show up again in some other media that we

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Speaker 1: should be wary of. So this article is presenting ideas

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Speaker 1: by someone named Dr David H. Dolphin, who is a

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Speaker 1: Canadian biochemist at the University of British Columbia, and Dr

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Speaker 1: Dolphin apparently suggested in a talk at the American Association

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Speaker 1: of the Advancement of Science or AS that va Empire

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Speaker 1: and werewolf legends might be rooted in the effects of

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Speaker 1: porphyria diseases. Now, porphyria diseases, I'll go into more detail

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Speaker 1: about them in a bit, but they're essentially a malfunction

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Speaker 1: of the body's ability to manufacture important compounds in the blood.

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Speaker 1: And this malfunction of the manufacturing of these compounds leads

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Speaker 1: to a build up of byproducts in the body that

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Speaker 1: can be harmful about. The article says about one out

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Speaker 1: of every two hundred thousand people are affected, and Dr

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Speaker 1: Dolphin gives some reasons. He thinks that porphyria diseases may

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Speaker 1: have inspired the vampire legends. So, first of all, vampires

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Speaker 1: obviously hate the sun. Aversion to sunlight, right, Indeed, that's

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Speaker 1: one of the rules of emperiism that is there is

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Speaker 1: most commonly portrayed, I would say, especially in the modern age.

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Speaker 1: Actually maybe less universal in the older folk beliefs. But

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Speaker 1: he says that porphyria diseases can leave the skin extremely

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Speaker 1: sensitive to sunlight, to the extent that even mild exposure

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Speaker 1: to sunlight could cause disfiguring in jury to the skin

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Speaker 1: and quote caused the nose and fingers to fall off

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Speaker 1: and make the lips and gums so taught that the teeth,

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Speaker 1: although no larger than ordinary, look like they are jutting

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Speaker 1: out in a menacing animal like manner. And at a

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Speaker 1: time before modern medicine or modern medical understanding, this could

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Speaker 1: lead someone suffering from porphyria to only leave the house

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Speaker 1: at night because of the dangers of the sunlight. Quote.

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Speaker 1: Some victims of the disease also become very hairy, he said,

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Speaker 1: conceivably one of nature's efforts to protect the skin from

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Speaker 1: the sun. Uh. And so this makes a link to

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Speaker 1: the werewolf legend also, of course, but apparently Dr Dolphin

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Speaker 1: was not the first to suggest porphyria could have contributed

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Speaker 1: to werewolf legend. He might have been the first to

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Speaker 1: make the link to vampires. You know, this is also

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Speaker 1: interesting to think about in terms of sunglasses, which which

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Speaker 1: you and I have research for an upcoming side project.

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Speaker 1: I guess you'd say, but without access to modern sunglasses,

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Speaker 1: what could you do if you had a severe reaction

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Speaker 1: to sunlight? I mean, you could wear hats and hoods certainly,

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Speaker 1: but you wouldn't be able to just throw on a

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Speaker 1: pair of all encompassing um spectacles that will shield your

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Speaker 1: eyes from the fearsome light of day. Yeah, I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I wonder if what the sensitivity to light is in

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Speaker 1: an ocular sense. It's definitely there in the skin, um,

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Speaker 1: but it could affect the eyes as well. I don't know. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean you could cover yourself up with just make

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Speaker 1: sure you're you're fully covered. I mean, you know this

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Speaker 1: one there there is there that might be regarded as

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Speaker 1: suspicious as well. As villagers as well. There's because there's

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Speaker 1: some vampire film that I saw a part of on

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Speaker 1: TV ages ago. Maybe listeners can chime in if if

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Speaker 1: you don't know the name of this film. But the

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Speaker 1: vampires are seeing like walking around in the daylight in

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Speaker 1: I think Texas somewhere, and they're covering themselves with like

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Speaker 1: super thick sunblock, like just basically and like like pasty

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Speaker 1: white face with big sunglasses on. Uh. And it and

400
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Speaker 1: it's the near dark. I don't think it's No, it's not.

401
00:23:04,400 --> 00:23:06,639
Speaker 1: It's not near dark. They do a little bit of

402
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Speaker 1: walking around in the daylight like super bundled up. And

403
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Speaker 1: I love near dark to know it. But but this

404
00:23:13,000 --> 00:23:16,240
Speaker 1: is something else and I'm suddenly remembering it for the

405
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Speaker 1: first time in a while. No, I don't know what

406
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Speaker 1: it is right in let us know, Okay. So the

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Speaker 1: next thing Dr Dolphin says is I think where his theory.

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Speaker 1: We can explain this more later, but this is where

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Speaker 1: I think he starts really going off the rails. So

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Speaker 1: he says a major treatment at the time in porphyria

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Speaker 1: conditions was the injection of a compound called hem him

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Speaker 1: is an iron containing compounds, so it's got iron in it.

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Speaker 1: It's it's part of a class of compounds known as

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Speaker 1: the porphyrion class, and it's this it makes part of

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Speaker 1: hemoglobin in the blood and some other important molecules in

416
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Speaker 1: the body, but essentially it's important for transporting oxygen to

417
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Speaker 1: the body's tissues through the blood. Of course, him is

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Speaker 1: a constituent of blood found in human blood, so Dolphin says,

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Speaker 1: pre modern victims of porphyria could conceivably have treated their

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Speaker 1: own condition by drinking large quantities of the blood of

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Speaker 1: others which contained the heam they needed. Now, in a

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Speaker 1: quote given elsewhere and reported by the Associated Press, Dolphins said, quote,

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Speaker 1: My theory is that in the Middle Ages, if you

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Speaker 1: couldn't get an injection of heam, which you clearly couldn't,

425
00:24:23,520 --> 00:24:25,320
Speaker 1: the next best thing would be to drink a lot

426
00:24:25,359 --> 00:24:28,720
Speaker 1: of blood. Now we'll get more into this in a minute,

427
00:24:28,720 --> 00:24:31,840
Speaker 1: but immediately when reading that, I had some thoughts. I

428
00:24:31,880 --> 00:24:34,840
Speaker 1: was like, wait a second, Now, that would require the

429
00:24:34,880 --> 00:24:38,640
Speaker 1: person with the porphyria condition to either have some kind

430
00:24:38,640 --> 00:24:42,840
Speaker 1: of instinct or you know, so instinctual knowledge of that

431
00:24:42,880 --> 00:24:45,720
Speaker 1: they should drink blood. That seems unlikely, or they would

432
00:24:45,720 --> 00:24:49,080
Speaker 1: have to somehow acquire the knowledge that blood drinking could

433
00:24:49,119 --> 00:24:52,200
Speaker 1: relieve their symptoms, and how would they learn this? Now,

434
00:24:52,320 --> 00:24:55,040
Speaker 1: certainly there's there's something to be said about the about

435
00:24:55,040 --> 00:24:58,960
Speaker 1: our appetite and uh, and how we all will find

436
00:24:58,960 --> 00:25:02,000
Speaker 1: ourselves sometimes crave the thing that our body needs. Right,

437
00:25:02,040 --> 00:25:05,520
Speaker 1: But that's not that would be based on normal evolved

438
00:25:06,000 --> 00:25:09,919
Speaker 1: cravings that are that are common to people. Right. Evolution

439
00:25:09,960 --> 00:25:12,359
Speaker 1: doesn't select for cravings that are only going to occur

440
00:25:12,440 --> 00:25:16,280
Speaker 1: in one out of every two hundred thousand people or something. Right. Yeah,

441
00:25:16,800 --> 00:25:18,760
Speaker 1: I'm sure it's making a number of people think of

442
00:25:18,800 --> 00:25:22,000
Speaker 1: those scenes in various vampire films where like the hunger

443
00:25:22,040 --> 00:25:23,879
Speaker 1: begins to creep in and they don't know what it is,

444
00:25:23,960 --> 00:25:25,879
Speaker 1: and so that that the first thing they do is

445
00:25:25,880 --> 00:25:29,520
Speaker 1: they start like I'm thinking of Chronos for example, Yeah,

446
00:25:29,720 --> 00:25:33,439
Speaker 1: Del Toro Vampire's great one where he sees like somebody's

447
00:25:33,440 --> 00:25:35,960
Speaker 1: had a nosebleed on the floor of a bathroom and

448
00:25:36,320 --> 00:25:38,919
Speaker 1: he's compelled to lick it off the floor. Well, I

449
00:25:38,920 --> 00:25:41,840
Speaker 1: mean that that's great in supernatural vampire movies. I don't

450
00:25:41,840 --> 00:25:45,040
Speaker 1: think that makes sense biologically, but we'll we'll come back

451
00:25:45,040 --> 00:25:47,560
Speaker 1: to this. Another caveat here, of course, is that Dolphin

452
00:25:48,200 --> 00:25:50,840
Speaker 1: did not have direct evidence that the body could acquire

453
00:25:50,920 --> 00:25:54,080
Speaker 1: him in the needed way by ingesting it orally. Another

454
00:25:54,160 --> 00:25:56,800
Speaker 1: question I'd have is, okay, even if you accept this,

455
00:25:57,000 --> 00:26:01,000
Speaker 1: that that they would get him from blood drinking blood,

456
00:26:02,040 --> 00:26:04,760
Speaker 1: why the blood of humans and not animals. Yeah, it's

457
00:26:04,760 --> 00:26:08,000
Speaker 1: so much easier to acquire uh and just go to

458
00:26:08,000 --> 00:26:10,040
Speaker 1: the butcher shopping. It's some animal, Beloyeah, you don't have

459
00:26:10,080 --> 00:26:13,080
Speaker 1: to worry about being, you know, anybody dragging you through

460
00:26:13,080 --> 00:26:17,520
Speaker 1: the streets and executecuting you in the town square. I mean,

461
00:26:17,600 --> 00:26:20,560
Speaker 1: unless it's a really beloved animal. Obviously. Another part of

462
00:26:20,600 --> 00:26:25,040
Speaker 1: dolphins hypothesis is okay, so, how did the bite of

463
00:26:25,119 --> 00:26:29,959
Speaker 1: a porphyria vampire turn somebody else into a vampire? Well,

464
00:26:30,040 --> 00:26:33,439
Speaker 1: it didn't, but it might have seemed to. Dolphin quote

465
00:26:33,480 --> 00:26:36,800
Speaker 1: suggested that brothers and sisters could have shared the defective

466
00:26:36,840 --> 00:26:40,800
Speaker 1: gene that causes the diseases the porphyria diseases, but that

467
00:26:40,960 --> 00:26:44,000
Speaker 1: only one of them might have experienced symptoms of the disease.

468
00:26:44,280 --> 00:26:47,280
Speaker 1: If that victim then bit a sibling to get blood,

469
00:26:47,600 --> 00:26:50,200
Speaker 1: the shock of the experience might have triggered an attack

470
00:26:50,240 --> 00:26:54,840
Speaker 1: of the disease in the bitten sibling. Thus producing another vampire.

471
00:26:55,000 --> 00:26:57,120
Speaker 1: But this was the Middle Ages, so you would imagine

472
00:26:57,160 --> 00:26:59,400
Speaker 1: that like just every day would be kind of shocking,

473
00:27:00,240 --> 00:27:02,520
Speaker 1: or nothing would be shocking because he was so numb

474
00:27:02,600 --> 00:27:07,320
Speaker 1: to it. Now, I don't I'm gonna present several reasons

475
00:27:07,320 --> 00:27:10,240
Speaker 1: for not agreeing with this hypothesis, but I will say

476
00:27:10,280 --> 00:27:13,119
Speaker 1: at least in favor of that when vampiresm does seem

477
00:27:13,160 --> 00:27:15,679
Speaker 1: to be a thing that in the folklore is very

478
00:27:15,760 --> 00:27:19,440
Speaker 1: often passed from one family member to another. Right, It's

479
00:27:19,520 --> 00:27:22,320
Speaker 1: not so much like you know, the vampire goes out

480
00:27:22,400 --> 00:27:24,760
Speaker 1: to the stuff you see in the movies today where

481
00:27:24,760 --> 00:27:27,040
Speaker 1: they go out to the nightclub or something and they

482
00:27:27,440 --> 00:27:30,680
Speaker 1: bite a victim. Vamporism in the folks since very often

483
00:27:30,760 --> 00:27:33,880
Speaker 1: was like you had one sibling in the family die

484
00:27:34,040 --> 00:27:37,200
Speaker 1: and then it was assumed that that sibling would come

485
00:27:37,240 --> 00:27:39,560
Speaker 1: back from the dead as a vampire to get other

486
00:27:39,600 --> 00:27:43,240
Speaker 1: members of the family or other members from the community. Finally,

487
00:27:43,359 --> 00:27:46,480
Speaker 1: aversion to garlic. Dolphins says why the fear of garlic, Well,

488
00:27:46,560 --> 00:27:49,800
Speaker 1: he claims garlic contains a chemical that makes symptoms of

489
00:27:49,840 --> 00:27:54,520
Speaker 1: porphyria diseases worse than He doesn't say what that chemical is. Then,

490
00:27:54,600 --> 00:27:56,639
Speaker 1: the mere fact that he's bringing in the garlic and

491
00:27:56,760 --> 00:27:58,679
Speaker 1: does make it sound like he's really going for an

492
00:27:58,720 --> 00:28:04,160
Speaker 1: all inclusive um model for vampireism here, which which I

493
00:28:04,160 --> 00:28:06,000
Speaker 1: I love that kind of thing. Like certainly I can

494
00:28:06,000 --> 00:28:10,120
Speaker 1: think to a number of vampire movies or books where

495
00:28:10,119 --> 00:28:14,280
Speaker 1: they really try and roll out a nice science explanation

496
00:28:14,359 --> 00:28:18,560
Speaker 1: for what's happening. Um, I think of Peter Watts. Peter Watts, Yeah,

497
00:28:18,600 --> 00:28:22,040
Speaker 1: and when it rolls out his space vampire in that

498
00:28:22,280 --> 00:28:25,920
Speaker 1: or I'm also thinking of I am legend. He always

499
00:28:25,920 --> 00:28:28,720
Speaker 1: had a pretty robust kind of science the explanation for

500
00:28:28,760 --> 00:28:30,640
Speaker 1: what's going on. Yeah, that can be a lot of fun.

501
00:28:30,800 --> 00:28:34,280
Speaker 1: I think Peter Watts is my favorite, uh sci fi

502
00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:38,000
Speaker 1: ing of a supernatural legend I've ever encountered. Like the

503
00:28:38,040 --> 00:28:41,400
Speaker 1: way he turns vampires into a biological creature is super

504
00:28:41,440 --> 00:28:44,640
Speaker 1: interesting and the book there is blind site if anyone

505
00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:47,719
Speaker 1: wants to check that out in greater detail. But this

506
00:28:47,800 --> 00:28:51,640
Speaker 1: is not a sci fi novel, no. Uh So after

507
00:28:51,680 --> 00:28:54,160
Speaker 1: this for a while, this seemed to really catch on

508
00:28:54,240 --> 00:28:57,600
Speaker 1: in the media, this idea that porphyria diseases could be

509
00:28:57,600 --> 00:29:02,040
Speaker 1: the cause of vampire legends, or as some headlines would say,

510
00:29:02,400 --> 00:29:07,880
Speaker 1: created vampires like porphyria made people into vampires, and a

511
00:29:07,920 --> 00:29:11,840
Speaker 1: lot of experts hit back really hard against this hypothesis

512
00:29:11,880 --> 00:29:15,600
Speaker 1: and against the association characterizing the whole porphyria vampire thing

513
00:29:15,960 --> 00:29:21,640
Speaker 1: has stupid, evidentially unjustified, and even harmful to people with porphyria. Um.

514
00:29:22,040 --> 00:29:24,880
Speaker 1: So just a little bit more on porphyria diseases in general.

515
00:29:24,960 --> 00:29:27,320
Speaker 1: First of all, there is more than one kind of

516
00:29:27,360 --> 00:29:31,640
Speaker 1: porphyria condition. Porphyria's can be inherited or acquired, but most

517
00:29:31,640 --> 00:29:34,840
Speaker 1: are inherited and they're classed in different categories according to

518
00:29:34,880 --> 00:29:38,760
Speaker 1: their symptoms. So there are acute or neurological porphyrias which

519
00:29:38,760 --> 00:29:42,040
Speaker 1: attack the nervous system, and then there are cutaneous or

520
00:29:42,080 --> 00:29:46,960
Speaker 1: dermatological porphyrias which attack primarily the skin. And in general,

521
00:29:47,000 --> 00:29:52,200
Speaker 1: porphyria diseases constitute a malfunction of the process creating hemoglobin,

522
00:29:52,320 --> 00:29:55,440
Speaker 1: which is this protein in red blood cells that carries

523
00:29:55,480 --> 00:29:59,320
Speaker 1: and delivers oxygen to tissues within the body. An important

524
00:29:59,360 --> 00:30:01,720
Speaker 1: part of hemo globin is, as I mentioned earlier, the

525
00:30:01,760 --> 00:30:06,400
Speaker 1: iron containing compound heam, and now the human body manufactures

526
00:30:06,400 --> 00:30:09,720
Speaker 1: the heam it needs in bone, marrow and in the

527
00:30:09,800 --> 00:30:14,479
Speaker 1: liver through this complex multi step process. Involving eight different

528
00:30:14,560 --> 00:30:18,720
Speaker 1: key enzymes, and as this process moves along the body,

529
00:30:18,760 --> 00:30:23,880
Speaker 1: the body creates these intermediate compounds known as HEM precursors,

530
00:30:24,200 --> 00:30:27,120
Speaker 1: which eventually, in the end of the process become heame.

531
00:30:27,760 --> 00:30:30,280
Speaker 1: But if there is a problem with the production process,

532
00:30:30,320 --> 00:30:33,880
Speaker 1: something gets jammed up along the chemical assembly line. There say,

533
00:30:33,880 --> 00:30:36,680
Speaker 1: if one of the eight key enzymes is deficient, you

534
00:30:36,720 --> 00:30:38,720
Speaker 1: don't have enough of it to make the heam you need.

535
00:30:39,040 --> 00:30:41,840
Speaker 1: The body can end up failing to make HEM, and

536
00:30:41,920 --> 00:30:47,000
Speaker 1: instead it will be stuck with excess unfinished precursors, sort

537
00:30:47,000 --> 00:30:50,240
Speaker 1: of useless porphyrions that can be harmful in excess in

538
00:30:50,280 --> 00:30:52,680
Speaker 1: the body. Imagine a you know, there's a there's a

539
00:30:52,720 --> 00:30:57,000
Speaker 1: car assembly line, and it can't make the car every time. Instead,

540
00:30:57,040 --> 00:31:00,200
Speaker 1: you end up with these half assembled cars, cramming up

541
00:31:00,200 --> 00:31:02,920
Speaker 1: the warehouse and getting in the way. I will say,

542
00:31:02,960 --> 00:31:05,680
Speaker 1: no matter what, UM, I just want to I want

543
00:31:05,680 --> 00:31:09,600
Speaker 1: to hear vampire dialogue talking about HEM. I want to

544
00:31:09,640 --> 00:31:11,600
Speaker 1: hear it as the sling for blood, where they're talking

545
00:31:11,600 --> 00:31:13,720
Speaker 1: about gotta get that heme, need to give me some

546
00:31:13,800 --> 00:31:16,120
Speaker 1: of that heme, where's the hem at? I bet somebody

547
00:31:16,160 --> 00:31:18,560
Speaker 1: has done that. I hope so. But anyway, So what

548
00:31:18,640 --> 00:31:21,440
Speaker 1: happens in in the porphyria conditions is that there's a

549
00:31:21,480 --> 00:31:24,160
Speaker 1: build up of these porphyrions in the blood, the liver,

550
00:31:24,360 --> 00:31:28,880
Speaker 1: other tissues, and this can result in the symptoms of porphyrias.

551
00:31:28,880 --> 00:31:32,000
Speaker 1: Now there, as I mentioned, there was some serious expert

552
00:31:32,040 --> 00:31:37,120
Speaker 1: pushback against the dolphin hypothesis. One very succinct, good, short

553
00:31:37,120 --> 00:31:40,040
Speaker 1: little paper I wanted to quote on this um is

554
00:31:40,080 --> 00:31:43,640
Speaker 1: called Porphyria and vampiresm Another myth in the making by

555
00:31:43,800 --> 00:31:48,920
Speaker 1: An M. Cox from the Postgraduate Medical Journal uh and

556
00:31:49,000 --> 00:31:52,560
Speaker 1: so Cox talks about how in the eighteenth century in

557
00:31:52,680 --> 00:31:54,520
Speaker 1: Eastern Europe and a lot of a lot of the

558
00:31:54,600 --> 00:31:57,600
Speaker 1: vampire legend, we talk about the folkloric vampire stuff, a

559
00:31:57,640 --> 00:32:01,600
Speaker 1: lot of it is like eighteenth nineteen century Eastern Europe,

560
00:32:01,760 --> 00:32:05,080
Speaker 1: that that is like ground zero for vampire belief right.

561
00:32:05,120 --> 00:32:08,080
Speaker 1: And and it's definitely this is the time period in

562
00:32:08,120 --> 00:32:10,920
Speaker 1: the particular strains of the folklore that have had the

563
00:32:11,000 --> 00:32:17,080
Speaker 1: greatest influence on Western and ultimately global ideas of the vampire.

564
00:32:17,720 --> 00:32:20,280
Speaker 1: Not to discount some of the the excellent strains of

565
00:32:20,320 --> 00:32:23,960
Speaker 1: the Eastern vampire that have made their way into say

566
00:32:23,960 --> 00:32:26,440
Speaker 1: Hong Kong cinema and the Japanese cinema. Yeah, like the

567
00:32:26,800 --> 00:32:29,560
Speaker 1: hopping vampires of China and stuff. Sadly, I don't think

568
00:32:29,560 --> 00:32:32,719
Speaker 1: any of our discussions today look for like hopping as

569
00:32:32,760 --> 00:32:35,000
Speaker 1: a symptom that we're gonna have to We're gonna have

570
00:32:35,040 --> 00:32:38,800
Speaker 1: to come back to that future installment of Vampire Clinic. Well,

571
00:32:38,800 --> 00:32:41,400
Speaker 1: those are great vampires, but yeah, so I think we're

572
00:32:41,440 --> 00:32:43,600
Speaker 1: talking more about the versions that are inspired by these

573
00:32:43,600 --> 00:32:48,360
Speaker 1: sort of diseased Eastern European vampires. Where As she says,

574
00:32:48,520 --> 00:32:52,040
Speaker 1: the belief in vampires was absolutely rampant. She says, quote

575
00:32:52,360 --> 00:32:54,640
Speaker 1: so prevalent was the belief in the existence of a

576
00:32:54,680 --> 00:32:58,600
Speaker 1: literal vampire. That the Austrians are occupying Serbia in the

577
00:32:58,640 --> 00:33:02,360
Speaker 1: seventeen thirties dispatched a team of medical officers to a

578
00:33:02,400 --> 00:33:07,040
Speaker 1: Serbian town to investigate the weekly exhumations and killing of

579
00:33:07,080 --> 00:33:11,480
Speaker 1: the dead weekly. So basically just bands of just obsessed

580
00:33:12,080 --> 00:33:16,040
Speaker 1: um Europeans going around just digging up the graves, searching

581
00:33:16,080 --> 00:33:19,880
Speaker 1: for evidence of that vampire and then pulverizing the corps

582
00:33:20,000 --> 00:33:24,600
Speaker 1: as necessary. I remember there being one account, um, and

583
00:33:24,640 --> 00:33:27,720
Speaker 1: I'm sorry I don't have citation for this, uh, but

584
00:33:27,800 --> 00:33:31,200
Speaker 1: I remember reading this one alleged treatment of the vampire

585
00:33:31,240 --> 00:33:33,720
Speaker 1: case where they dug up the grave of a of

586
00:33:33,760 --> 00:33:36,360
Speaker 1: a body of a suspected vampire and they made the

587
00:33:36,400 --> 00:33:41,040
Speaker 1: body into paste, which everyone then ate on crackers. Wow,

588
00:33:41,080 --> 00:33:42,840
Speaker 1: I've never heard that one. Yeah, I have to look

589
00:33:42,840 --> 00:33:44,480
Speaker 1: that one up again and see if there's a to

590
00:33:44,520 --> 00:33:46,600
Speaker 1: what degree there's any validity to that. You know. That's

591
00:33:46,600 --> 00:33:48,680
Speaker 1: the thing about so many of these these folk tales

592
00:33:48,720 --> 00:33:53,920
Speaker 1: and uh and uh alleged vampire traditions. Well, I think

593
00:33:53,960 --> 00:33:58,040
Speaker 1: about a very common thing is of course decapitating the corps,

594
00:33:58,120 --> 00:34:01,280
Speaker 1: separating the head from the body. There's earning involved, burning

595
00:34:01,320 --> 00:34:04,280
Speaker 1: parts of the body, burning the whole body. Uh, there's

596
00:34:05,000 --> 00:34:08,160
Speaker 1: things you can do to the bones. There's a running

597
00:34:08,160 --> 00:34:10,600
Speaker 1: an iron rod through it, there's putting a steak in it.

598
00:34:10,840 --> 00:34:13,320
Speaker 1: That one of the ones I really think of the

599
00:34:13,480 --> 00:34:16,600
Speaker 1: just sticks in my mind is I believe it's I'm

600
00:34:16,640 --> 00:34:18,400
Speaker 1: sorry if I'm wrong about this. I believe it was

601
00:34:18,480 --> 00:34:21,560
Speaker 1: from Venice where they found a body with a brick

602
00:34:21,600 --> 00:34:25,080
Speaker 1: shoved and it's that one. But anyway back to this paper,

603
00:34:25,120 --> 00:34:27,360
Speaker 1: so so Cox says, at the time of her writing,

604
00:34:27,360 --> 00:34:30,840
Speaker 1: the idea of vamporism being inspired by Porphyria, had become

605
00:34:30,960 --> 00:34:35,080
Speaker 1: deeply embedded in popular consciousness, like this idea had really

606
00:34:35,080 --> 00:34:37,680
Speaker 1: caught on. And she traces this idea back to this

607
00:34:37,840 --> 00:34:42,040
Speaker 1: nineteen New York Times article and Dr Dolphin, Uh with

608
00:34:42,120 --> 00:34:44,200
Speaker 1: the one that I was just talking about. And so

609
00:34:44,280 --> 00:34:48,960
Speaker 1: Cox examines the idea what what if porphyria did inspire vamporism?

610
00:34:49,080 --> 00:34:51,760
Speaker 1: She says, the main type of porphyria disease that could

611
00:34:51,760 --> 00:34:56,640
Speaker 1: be applied to the situation is congenital erythropoietic porphyria, and

612
00:34:56,719 --> 00:34:59,319
Speaker 1: she lists some facts about this type of porphyria. One

613
00:34:59,360 --> 00:35:00,960
Speaker 1: is that at the time time of this publication, it

614
00:35:01,040 --> 00:35:04,080
Speaker 1: was so rare that only about two hundred cases had

615
00:35:04,160 --> 00:35:09,560
Speaker 1: ever been diagnosed. It's inherited, It first manifests in early childhood,

616
00:35:09,840 --> 00:35:13,120
Speaker 1: and it leaves carriers with extreme sensitivity to the sun,

617
00:35:13,280 --> 00:35:16,200
Speaker 1: so much that the skin can blister on exposure to

618
00:35:16,280 --> 00:35:19,640
Speaker 1: sunlight and uh. And so this is the part where

619
00:35:19,640 --> 00:35:22,799
Speaker 1: where dolphins hypothesis had some validity to it. There's the

620
00:35:22,840 --> 00:35:25,800
Speaker 1: idea that that exposure to the sun could be extremely

621
00:35:25,800 --> 00:35:29,360
Speaker 1: injurious and uh. And also people suffering from this disease

622
00:35:29,440 --> 00:35:34,320
Speaker 1: can benefit from blood transfusions. UH. So here was dolphins

623
00:35:34,320 --> 00:35:37,359
Speaker 1: points sensitive to sunlight and they need blood. But then

624
00:35:37,400 --> 00:35:40,440
Speaker 1: there are some major problems with this picture of the

625
00:35:40,480 --> 00:35:44,600
Speaker 1: porphyry of vampire number one. Cox actually says sensitivity to

626
00:35:44,719 --> 00:35:48,880
Speaker 1: sunlight is not a universal part of traditional folk vampire beliefs.

627
00:35:48,920 --> 00:35:51,960
Speaker 1: It shows up sometimes, but she cites how in nineteenth

628
00:35:52,000 --> 00:35:55,319
Speaker 1: century Europe there are all these reported sightings of vampires

629
00:35:55,360 --> 00:35:58,040
Speaker 1: in the daytime. Furthermore, and this is maybe the most

630
00:35:58,080 --> 00:36:02,000
Speaker 1: important part, people with the throw poetic porphyria do not

631
00:36:02,280 --> 00:36:07,160
Speaker 1: cray of blood and cannot benefit from drinking it, uh coxwrites,

632
00:36:07,239 --> 00:36:11,680
Speaker 1: quote the enzyme hamatan necessary to alleviate the symptoms is

633
00:36:11,800 --> 00:36:16,399
Speaker 1: not absorbed intact on oral ingestion, and drinking blood would

634
00:36:16,400 --> 00:36:20,080
Speaker 1: have no beneficial effect for the sufferer. So, like other

635
00:36:20,120 --> 00:36:23,320
Speaker 1: than sensitivity to to sunlight, the biggest part of dolphins

636
00:36:23,600 --> 00:36:26,839
Speaker 1: hypothesis is that what they would maybe need to drink

637
00:36:26,880 --> 00:36:30,080
Speaker 1: blood in order to treat their symptoms, but that wouldn't work. Now,

638
00:36:30,120 --> 00:36:33,720
Speaker 1: it sounds like they would need to inject the blood,

639
00:36:33,880 --> 00:36:36,960
Speaker 1: which a they probably they almost certainly did not have

640
00:36:37,040 --> 00:36:39,759
Speaker 1: the equipment to do, and it wouldn't know to do,

641
00:36:39,880 --> 00:36:41,720
Speaker 1: and they wouldn't know to do, and but then also

642
00:36:41,880 --> 00:36:46,320
Speaker 1: would be extremely disastrous to even attempt without knowledge of

643
00:36:46,320 --> 00:36:50,120
Speaker 1: of blood types. Yeah, and and sterilization. So yeah, I

644
00:36:50,120 --> 00:36:53,759
Speaker 1: mean it's crazy. Uh. But also, she says, the fact

645
00:36:53,760 --> 00:36:57,720
Speaker 1: that vampire reports and beliefs were absolutely rampant in say,

646
00:36:57,800 --> 00:37:00,880
Speaker 1: eighteenth century Eastern Europe. She can is that example, you know,

647
00:37:00,920 --> 00:37:04,960
Speaker 1: they're all over the place. It's inconsistent with how erythropoietic

648
00:37:05,040 --> 00:37:09,120
Speaker 1: porphyria is an extremely rare version of an already rare

649
00:37:09,239 --> 00:37:12,759
Speaker 1: congenital disease. Right, and it certainly this is a case

650
00:37:12,800 --> 00:37:16,200
Speaker 1: where you're you're inclined to say it looked dolphin, pull

651
00:37:16,280 --> 00:37:18,719
Speaker 1: back a little on it. And and because I could

652
00:37:18,800 --> 00:37:21,960
Speaker 1: conceivably see, you know, it's like, okay, it's super rare.

653
00:37:22,239 --> 00:37:26,120
Speaker 1: One person had it once, and then it was popularized

654
00:37:26,120 --> 00:37:30,279
Speaker 1: and it became part of a general moral panic. Why,

655
00:37:30,400 --> 00:37:33,640
Speaker 1: you know, a widespread panic regarding the possibility of vampiresm

656
00:37:33,880 --> 00:37:37,760
Speaker 1: But yeah, when you start really digging in your heels

657
00:37:37,800 --> 00:37:41,000
Speaker 1: and saying this is the model, this is the explanation,

658
00:37:41,000 --> 00:37:44,799
Speaker 1: this is patient zero for vampireism. Uh, then you start

659
00:37:44,840 --> 00:37:48,880
Speaker 1: getting into trouble. I think, Yeah, I agree. She mentions how,

660
00:37:48,920 --> 00:37:51,239
Speaker 1: despite all of this stuff that she's just explained, the

661
00:37:51,320 --> 00:37:55,120
Speaker 1: Learning Channel recently ran a program on vampires featuring Dr

662
00:37:55,160 --> 00:37:58,120
Speaker 1: Dolphin and pumping the porphyria hypothesis. Wait, wait, what's the

663
00:37:58,200 --> 00:38:01,759
Speaker 1: learning channel? The learning channel? It's channel on TV. Oh yeah, no, no,

664
00:38:01,800 --> 00:38:04,360
Speaker 1: but I think some of our listeners might not be

665
00:38:04,400 --> 00:38:07,120
Speaker 1: aware that this is what TLC used to be, the

666
00:38:07,200 --> 00:38:10,760
Speaker 1: Learning Channel. There was a time when TLC stood for something,

667
00:38:10,800 --> 00:38:12,600
Speaker 1: and it was the Learning Channel. What does it stand

668
00:38:12,640 --> 00:38:17,759
Speaker 1: for now? Nothing? It's just letters. It's like KFC. I no, no,

669
00:38:17,880 --> 00:38:20,000
Speaker 1: that does not have anything to do with the state

670
00:38:20,440 --> 00:38:23,000
Speaker 1: or with a bird with a cooking method. Is just

671
00:38:23,080 --> 00:38:25,840
Speaker 1: some letters, you know. I like some letters better than others.

672
00:38:26,120 --> 00:38:28,480
Speaker 1: KFC are good ones. One more thing I do want

673
00:38:28,480 --> 00:38:30,440
Speaker 1: to mention here, and I think we should also just

674
00:38:30,640 --> 00:38:34,320
Speaker 1: mention this is a a general note about our episode.

675
00:38:34,400 --> 00:38:37,680
Speaker 1: I read another paper from Nine Perspectives in Biology and

676
00:38:37,719 --> 00:38:41,400
Speaker 1: Medicine by Mary Winkler and Carl Anderson called Vampires, Porphyria

677
00:38:41,400 --> 00:38:45,080
Speaker 1: and the media Medicalization of a myth, And essentially the

678
00:38:45,120 --> 00:38:47,840
Speaker 1: authors here take strong exception to the linking of the

679
00:38:47,920 --> 00:38:52,360
Speaker 1: vampire legend with porphyria diseases. Uh and they said this

680
00:38:52,360 --> 00:38:56,439
Speaker 1: this link resembled rumormongering more than science. It had never

681
00:38:56,480 --> 00:38:59,560
Speaker 1: even been formally presented in a scientific journal. It was

682
00:38:59,640 --> 00:39:02,320
Speaker 1: just sort of like some scientist with a funny idea

683
00:39:02,440 --> 00:39:05,239
Speaker 1: talking to the media and then the media running with

684
00:39:05,280 --> 00:39:09,480
Speaker 1: it in an irresponsible way. But they mentioned, you know this,

685
00:39:09,480 --> 00:39:12,279
Speaker 1: this kind of thing could also be damaging to the

686
00:39:12,320 --> 00:39:15,400
Speaker 1: actual image of these diseases, and two people who hold

687
00:39:15,480 --> 00:39:18,600
Speaker 1: them like they quote a guy who had read who

688
00:39:18,640 --> 00:39:22,359
Speaker 1: had a porphyria condition, who had read stuff like this

689
00:39:23,000 --> 00:39:25,280
Speaker 1: and had said, like, wait, does this mean I'm descended

690
00:39:25,280 --> 00:39:28,799
Speaker 1: from vampires? Now? And I think that's that should just

691
00:39:28,880 --> 00:39:31,440
Speaker 1: remind us, like, well, this is a super interesting question

692
00:39:31,480 --> 00:39:35,040
Speaker 1: to try to say, like, is this vampire legend rooted

693
00:39:35,160 --> 00:39:38,640
Speaker 1: in actual medical conditions? We should remember not to be

694
00:39:38,680 --> 00:39:42,000
Speaker 1: insensitive about the medical conditions real people have these, and

695
00:39:42,080 --> 00:39:46,560
Speaker 1: you know, it's good not to characterize these people as vampires,

696
00:39:46,600 --> 00:39:50,720
Speaker 1: recognize them as people with medical conditions. Now that being said,

697
00:39:51,040 --> 00:39:55,640
Speaker 1: if you were to pinpoint any cinematic vampires, TV vampires,

698
00:39:55,680 --> 00:39:59,960
Speaker 1: etcetera that the kind of line up with this disease,

699
00:40:00,160 --> 00:40:01,920
Speaker 1: which ones would you pick? I guess I'll have to

700
00:40:01,960 --> 00:40:03,920
Speaker 1: come back to that. I don't know which one this

701
00:40:03,960 --> 00:40:07,320
Speaker 1: would line up with, but I will say, in general,

702
00:40:07,600 --> 00:40:12,040
Speaker 1: my verdict on Porphyria as the the explanation for the

703
00:40:12,120 --> 00:40:15,360
Speaker 1: vampire lore. Thumbs down. I don't think this one carries

704
00:40:15,440 --> 00:40:19,520
Speaker 1: much weight at all conditions. Rare would not actually result

705
00:40:19,560 --> 00:40:22,719
Speaker 1: in drinking blood. About the only thing it has going

706
00:40:22,760 --> 00:40:25,520
Speaker 1: for it is the association with sensitivity to sunlight, which

707
00:40:25,560 --> 00:40:28,319
Speaker 1: is not even a universal part of the myth. Al Right, well,

708
00:40:28,320 --> 00:40:29,680
Speaker 1: on that note, we're going to take a quick break,

709
00:40:29,719 --> 00:40:32,040
Speaker 1: and when we come back, we will continue to diagnose

710
00:40:32,160 --> 00:40:38,000
Speaker 1: our vampires. Than all right, we're back, so, Robert. One

711
00:40:38,040 --> 00:40:42,279
Speaker 1: thing that I often think about with the vampire lore

712
00:40:42,640 --> 00:40:47,719
Speaker 1: is the vampires traditional association with the children of the night,

713
00:40:48,360 --> 00:40:51,080
Speaker 1: that the creatures of the forest, with wild beasts like

714
00:40:51,160 --> 00:40:55,560
Speaker 1: wolves and bats. Yeah, and just the overall ba steal

715
00:40:55,680 --> 00:40:59,839
Speaker 1: nature of the vampire. Um. This, this film has its

716
00:41:00,000 --> 00:41:03,879
Speaker 1: problems for sure. But brom Stoker's Dracula, which is really

717
00:41:04,160 --> 00:41:08,040
Speaker 1: Francis Ford Copula's Dracula, What problems are you talking about?

718
00:41:08,200 --> 00:41:11,200
Speaker 1: Because I can't think of any Oh, I guess I. I

719
00:41:11,040 --> 00:41:13,680
Speaker 1: I still hold a grudge against it based on kind

720
00:41:13,680 --> 00:41:17,120
Speaker 1: of a nitpicking, uh fact, and that is that when

721
00:41:18,080 --> 00:41:22,520
Speaker 1: quote unquote brom Stoker's Dracula came out, there was a

722
00:41:22,600 --> 00:41:26,759
Speaker 1: cool movie branded copy of brom Stoker's Dracula you could

723
00:41:26,760 --> 00:41:29,920
Speaker 1: buy at the bookstore. But then also there was a

724
00:41:30,000 --> 00:41:34,560
Speaker 1: novelization of the film, No, Yes, No, which was I get.

725
00:41:34,600 --> 00:41:36,040
Speaker 1: I can't remember what they called it. I guess it

726
00:41:36,080 --> 00:41:38,960
Speaker 1: was like Francis Ford Coppola's bron Stoker's Dracula. Did the

727
00:41:39,120 --> 00:41:42,400
Speaker 1: did the author of this novelization slip and stop calling

728
00:41:42,480 --> 00:41:45,000
Speaker 1: him Count Dracula and just start calling him Gary Oldman?

729
00:41:45,280 --> 00:41:47,840
Speaker 1: I never read it, but I remember seeing it on

730
00:41:47,880 --> 00:41:51,120
Speaker 1: the bookshelves when that film came out, and it made

731
00:41:51,120 --> 00:41:53,799
Speaker 1: me mad. I was like, no, if, if, if you

732
00:41:53,880 --> 00:41:57,480
Speaker 1: have to do a novelization of this film, then it

733
00:41:57,600 --> 00:42:00,200
Speaker 1: is not bron Stoker's Dracula, Because if it were rom

734
00:42:00,200 --> 00:42:03,680
Speaker 1: Stoker's Dracula, then the original book is the novelization of

735
00:42:03,719 --> 00:42:08,480
Speaker 1: the film. What's going on? That is a perversion of

736
00:42:08,480 --> 00:42:11,840
Speaker 1: our modern times? Because because brom Stoker's Dracula, it's a

737
00:42:11,840 --> 00:42:15,040
Speaker 1: great book. It's a very readable book, food for modern audiences.

738
00:42:15,320 --> 00:42:17,840
Speaker 1: You know. I wouldn't put it on the same level

739
00:42:17,920 --> 00:42:21,680
Speaker 1: as Mary Shelley's Frankenstein, but it is. It's a great book,

740
00:42:21,880 --> 00:42:25,080
Speaker 1: very readable. There was there was no need. I mean,

741
00:42:25,120 --> 00:42:27,920
Speaker 1: I'm glad that that somebody got a novelization job out

742
00:42:27,960 --> 00:42:31,040
Speaker 1: of it, but uh, it just seemed kind of plumosus

743
00:42:31,120 --> 00:42:35,360
Speaker 1: that being said, a fabulously fun film. That's that shows

744
00:42:35,440 --> 00:42:38,200
Speaker 1: us a number of different ideas of what the vampire

745
00:42:38,280 --> 00:42:40,479
Speaker 1: could be. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean that movie

746
00:42:40,640 --> 00:42:43,640
Speaker 1: is great because it it just embraces the fact that

747
00:42:43,719 --> 00:42:47,400
Speaker 1: the story is bonkers and it asks us essentially to

748
00:42:47,560 --> 00:42:50,200
Speaker 1: side with the Count and not with the human heroes

749
00:42:50,239 --> 00:42:53,279
Speaker 1: who are fighting him. I love how Anthony Hopkins says

750
00:42:53,360 --> 00:42:56,200
Speaker 1: Van Helsing is just out of his mind and running

751
00:42:56,239 --> 00:43:00,600
Speaker 1: around like beheading she vampires left and right. Yeah, there's

752
00:43:00,600 --> 00:43:02,680
Speaker 1: a great line. One of my favorite parts of it

753
00:43:02,760 --> 00:43:07,840
Speaker 1: is they they're talking about after he beheads Lucy Western,

754
00:43:08,000 --> 00:43:10,640
Speaker 1: who you know, has turned into a vampire queen who

755
00:43:10,680 --> 00:43:13,440
Speaker 1: has turned into a vampire bride. You know he Uh,

756
00:43:13,480 --> 00:43:17,480
Speaker 1: They're like, was she in pain? And he says something like, yes,

757
00:43:17,600 --> 00:43:19,080
Speaker 1: she was in great pain, but then I cut off

758
00:43:19,080 --> 00:43:20,719
Speaker 1: our head and drove a stake through hard and burned

759
00:43:20,760 --> 00:43:23,680
Speaker 1: it and then she found peace. Well, when Anthony Hopkins

760
00:43:23,760 --> 00:43:26,839
Speaker 1: that lives the line, you know you're more invested. But

761
00:43:27,080 --> 00:43:30,120
Speaker 1: roll through real quick. The various versions of the vampire

762
00:43:30,239 --> 00:43:33,680
Speaker 1: the Gary Oldman takes in this film. Oh, let's see. Well,

763
00:43:33,719 --> 00:43:36,239
Speaker 1: he's definitely at some point I think a bat and

764
00:43:36,280 --> 00:43:38,719
Speaker 1: then like a big bat creature. It's almost like a

765
00:43:38,800 --> 00:43:42,080
Speaker 1: dog bat hybrid. At some point he's some kind of

766
00:43:42,280 --> 00:43:47,040
Speaker 1: bipedal wolf thing like werewolf. Yetie kind of creature. Uh,

767
00:43:47,280 --> 00:43:49,799
Speaker 1: it's at another point he's just it seems just like

768
00:43:49,800 --> 00:43:55,080
Speaker 1: a straightforward wolf for fox or something quadrupedal canid. Are

769
00:43:55,080 --> 00:43:57,440
Speaker 1: there other ones? Well, you could certainly those are the

770
00:43:57,440 --> 00:43:59,359
Speaker 1: more be steal forms. And then of course he also

771
00:43:59,400 --> 00:44:03,120
Speaker 1: takes the form of a extremely creepy old man with

772
00:44:03,480 --> 00:44:07,399
Speaker 1: with fabulous hair and gray hair. That hair, that's that's

773
00:44:07,440 --> 00:44:10,200
Speaker 1: what the movie is all about, is the Gary Oldman bun. Yes,

774
00:44:10,560 --> 00:44:12,640
Speaker 1: And then of course there's the young Gary Oldman, the

775
00:44:13,040 --> 00:44:16,840
Speaker 1: sexy vampire. So so it's it's it's interesting that it

776
00:44:17,200 --> 00:44:20,080
Speaker 1: manages to encompass all of these different versions of what

777
00:44:20,080 --> 00:44:23,320
Speaker 1: a vampire could be, but it certainly hits that animal.

778
00:44:23,360 --> 00:44:28,000
Speaker 1: Note that idea of the vampire is this bloodthirsty beast. Yeah,

779
00:44:28,040 --> 00:44:30,520
Speaker 1: and I like that it actually does include that, and

780
00:44:30,640 --> 00:44:35,640
Speaker 1: it puts it alongside him being a smooth, suave sunglasses

781
00:44:35,719 --> 00:44:38,560
Speaker 1: top hat wearing dandy about town in London. I also

782
00:44:38,600 --> 00:44:40,799
Speaker 1: love his armor in that film. I'm I'm forgetting the

783
00:44:40,840 --> 00:44:44,600
Speaker 1: historical lad vampire that we get the muscles. There's it's

784
00:44:44,600 --> 00:44:46,640
Speaker 1: so rich, there's so much good stuff. But you're right, yeah,

785
00:44:46,640 --> 00:44:49,720
Speaker 1: it does emphasize the be steel aspects. He turns into

786
00:44:49,760 --> 00:44:52,359
Speaker 1: animals in the movie. And this leads us to our

787
00:44:52,360 --> 00:44:55,600
Speaker 1: next disease. In our discussion here, as we inevitably try

788
00:44:55,680 --> 00:44:59,759
Speaker 1: to diagnose the vampire that's brought into our clinic, that

789
00:44:59,840 --> 00:45:03,600
Speaker 1: it snarling and biting and lunging at all of our

790
00:45:04,040 --> 00:45:07,680
Speaker 1: the other patients and doctors. Uh, this brings us to

791
00:45:07,800 --> 00:45:11,880
Speaker 1: rabies right now. It's it's easy to discount the horror

792
00:45:11,880 --> 00:45:15,560
Speaker 1: of rabies, especially you know in our modern world. Uh

793
00:45:15,680 --> 00:45:20,520
Speaker 1: Luis Pasteur devised preventative vaccine back in five and if

794
00:45:20,520 --> 00:45:26,360
Speaker 1: treated early, the disease is one pcent treatable. But rabies

795
00:45:26,440 --> 00:45:29,200
Speaker 1: is an old enemy. References to the disease date back

796
00:45:29,280 --> 00:45:34,000
Speaker 1: more than four thousand years to the ancient Mesopotamians. They're

797
00:45:34,040 --> 00:45:36,759
Speaker 1: very dawn of recorded history. So it's it's been with

798
00:45:36,840 --> 00:45:41,200
Speaker 1: us a while. Supplet's break down what it does. Rabies

799
00:45:41,280 --> 00:45:44,120
Speaker 1: is a viral disease that attack the central nervous system.

800
00:45:44,320 --> 00:45:47,319
Speaker 1: The virus centers the body, has the spinal column, and

801
00:45:47,840 --> 00:45:51,799
Speaker 1: heads straight to the brain for replication and destruction. And

802
00:45:51,840 --> 00:45:54,600
Speaker 1: it's just distressing enough to see the ravages of rabies

803
00:45:54,640 --> 00:45:58,319
Speaker 1: in an animal, but in humans it's it's it's even

804
00:45:58,400 --> 00:46:02,920
Speaker 1: more horrific. Uh. There are several different strains of rabies,

805
00:46:02,960 --> 00:46:05,560
Speaker 1: but we can break the virus down into two main types.

806
00:46:06,320 --> 00:46:10,120
Speaker 1: On one hand, there's a paralytic rabies and this is

807
00:46:10,120 --> 00:46:14,440
Speaker 1: typified by a weariness and a lethargy. But then encephalytic

808
00:46:14,600 --> 00:46:17,760
Speaker 1: rabies is more common, and this is where we see

809
00:46:17,800 --> 00:46:24,719
Speaker 1: foaming at the mouth. Uh, we see increased agitation, aggression, disorientation, hallucinations,

810
00:46:25,640 --> 00:46:29,600
Speaker 1: whatever the strain, though, it all culminates in paralysis and death.

811
00:46:29,800 --> 00:46:31,640
Speaker 1: So I mean I could basically stop there, and I

812
00:46:31,680 --> 00:46:34,160
Speaker 1: think everyone would see how this lines up with various

813
00:46:34,520 --> 00:46:39,080
Speaker 1: interpretations of the vampire, right you. I mean, you're talking

814
00:46:39,080 --> 00:46:42,280
Speaker 1: about a virus that attacks the nervous system and causes

815
00:46:42,400 --> 00:46:46,279
Speaker 1: erratic behavior. And whenever we think of erratic behavior, we think, okay, well,

816
00:46:46,280 --> 00:46:48,759
Speaker 1: maybe that could cause people who didn't understand what was

817
00:46:48,800 --> 00:46:51,680
Speaker 1: going on to think this person is turning into a monster, right,

818
00:46:51,719 --> 00:46:55,000
Speaker 1: and then towards the end they're incapacitated and kind of

819
00:46:55,000 --> 00:46:59,239
Speaker 1: in the state of of of of of living death. Right. Yeah,

820
00:46:59,320 --> 00:47:02,080
Speaker 1: But then again, you about how every virus. You know,

821
00:47:02,160 --> 00:47:06,000
Speaker 1: diseases need a route of transmission, and very often diseases

822
00:47:06,040 --> 00:47:11,879
Speaker 1: are evolutionarily smart. Like a disease that is spread by

823
00:47:11,920 --> 00:47:15,760
Speaker 1: aerosolized droplets in the air tends to make people cough

824
00:47:15,880 --> 00:47:18,800
Speaker 1: and sneeze, you know, the disease makes you coughin sneeze

825
00:47:18,840 --> 00:47:22,360
Speaker 1: so it can get to other carriers. And the rabies

826
00:47:22,440 --> 00:47:25,799
Speaker 1: virus is an ingenious hijacker in this regard because once

827
00:47:25,840 --> 00:47:28,759
Speaker 1: it takes over a host, it needs to spread. That's

828
00:47:28,800 --> 00:47:31,360
Speaker 1: a that's a genetic mission, and in order to fulfill

829
00:47:31,440 --> 00:47:35,400
Speaker 1: this mission, it generates the symptoms of that that mad

830
00:47:35,400 --> 00:47:38,920
Speaker 1: dog rage and the foaming mouth because guess what's in

831
00:47:38,920 --> 00:47:42,080
Speaker 1: that saliva. Guess what's in that foam. That's where the

832
00:47:42,120 --> 00:47:44,480
Speaker 1: rabies is ready to spread to the next animal or

833
00:47:44,560 --> 00:47:48,520
Speaker 1: human via a b steal bite. And what's more, the

834
00:47:48,600 --> 00:47:51,560
Speaker 1: virus instills a strong aversion to water in its victim

835
00:47:51,800 --> 00:47:55,440
Speaker 1: animal or human to ensure this frothy mouthful of doom

836
00:47:55,719 --> 00:47:59,080
Speaker 1: doesn't get washed away. Oh yeah, this is where the hydrophobia.

837
00:47:59,160 --> 00:48:01,319
Speaker 1: Like if you ever read is an old yeller where

838
00:48:01,360 --> 00:48:04,200
Speaker 1: they talk about rabies and they call it hydrophobia. I

839
00:48:04,239 --> 00:48:07,200
Speaker 1: only remember one moment and all the other and uh,

840
00:48:07,200 --> 00:48:09,800
Speaker 1: and I think everyone knows which moment that is. Well,

841
00:48:09,840 --> 00:48:11,680
Speaker 1: I think you know you read the older sources and

842
00:48:11,719 --> 00:48:14,440
Speaker 1: they call rabies hydrophobia. And I think this is because it, uh,

843
00:48:14,760 --> 00:48:17,760
Speaker 1: it tends to cause like difficulty swallowing that makes people

844
00:48:17,800 --> 00:48:21,200
Speaker 1: not able or want to drink water. Uh. Interestingly enough,

845
00:48:21,239 --> 00:48:24,040
Speaker 1: this came up in a Basilisk episode as well. So

846
00:48:24,160 --> 00:48:26,239
Speaker 1: just a health note if if you're ever bitten by

847
00:48:26,280 --> 00:48:29,600
Speaker 1: a wild animal, especially a bat, uh, seek medical attention

848
00:48:29,600 --> 00:48:33,360
Speaker 1: as soon as possible, because while again it is treatable

849
00:48:33,360 --> 00:48:37,719
Speaker 1: in its early stages, rabies is almost completely fatal in

850
00:48:37,760 --> 00:48:41,480
Speaker 1: the long term. Um, so you have left untreated, it

851
00:48:41,560 --> 00:48:46,360
Speaker 1: is almost certainly a death sentence. So seek care early. Yes,

852
00:48:46,640 --> 00:48:49,399
Speaker 1: so it makes sense that we might create monsters out

853
00:48:49,400 --> 00:48:52,840
Speaker 1: of rabies, out of observing cases of rabies, right, and

854
00:48:52,880 --> 00:48:55,640
Speaker 1: the idea that there might be a vampire connection. Uh,

855
00:48:55,680 --> 00:48:58,280
Speaker 1: this has been explored in the literature as well. Uh.

856
00:48:58,360 --> 00:49:01,200
Speaker 1: The hypothesis goes back. I would say, at least as

857
00:49:01,200 --> 00:49:05,800
Speaker 1: far as two the work of Gomez Alonso and J. Robbia.

858
00:49:06,480 --> 00:49:10,600
Speaker 1: Um and I'll get to one of Gomez Alonso's papers

859
00:49:10,680 --> 00:49:13,040
Speaker 1: in a bed here. But yeah, a lot of people

860
00:49:13,120 --> 00:49:15,720
Speaker 1: have chimed in on this, so like the rabies vampire

861
00:49:15,760 --> 00:49:19,840
Speaker 1: connection is seemingly pretty strong. Yeah, I read it mentioned

862
00:49:20,280 --> 00:49:23,640
Speaker 1: back in uh just a letter from nineteen ninety two

863
00:49:23,640 --> 00:49:26,640
Speaker 1: and the Animals of Internal Medicine by a I believe

864
00:49:26,640 --> 00:49:30,640
Speaker 1: a Dutch doctor named Alex Hike who wrote a letter

865
00:49:30,680 --> 00:49:34,399
Speaker 1: just about the ties between the possible ties between vampires

866
00:49:34,400 --> 00:49:36,960
Speaker 1: and rabies. And he writes, quote, although we may still

867
00:49:37,040 --> 00:49:39,799
Speaker 1: be fascinated by the vampire legend, we all now know

868
00:49:39,840 --> 00:49:42,640
Speaker 1: that the human vampire never really existed or did he

869
00:49:42,920 --> 00:49:47,120
Speaker 1: bump bump. A bite from an irrationally aggressive animal leads

870
00:49:47,120 --> 00:49:50,799
Speaker 1: to aggressively psychotic behavior in the human victim. Doesn't it

871
00:49:50,880 --> 00:49:54,120
Speaker 1: sound like rabies? In the agony of rabies, all affected

872
00:49:54,160 --> 00:49:58,040
Speaker 1: mammals may display such a hyper excitable phase. Even otherwise

873
00:49:58,040 --> 00:50:02,040
Speaker 1: placid insectivorous bats have been reported to attack humans and

874
00:50:02,080 --> 00:50:06,200
Speaker 1: other mammals. Human rabies, a hyper excitable psychotic phase is

875
00:50:06,239 --> 00:50:10,919
Speaker 1: also seen, although genuine biting behavior has rarely been reported. Uh,

876
00:50:11,000 --> 00:50:14,720
Speaker 1: and he mentions a paper by a doctor named lint Yourn,

877
00:50:15,040 --> 00:50:18,319
Speaker 1: which is case Studies of Rabies. That quote mentions a

878
00:50:18,360 --> 00:50:21,120
Speaker 1: fifteen year old rabid boy who bit off one of

879
00:50:21,160 --> 00:50:25,960
Speaker 1: his mother's fingertips. So it sounds like in human rabies infections,

880
00:50:26,040 --> 00:50:29,480
Speaker 1: biting is not a universal characteristic, but it can happen.

881
00:50:30,120 --> 00:50:32,800
Speaker 1: And again, it would only really have to happen once

882
00:50:33,920 --> 00:50:37,640
Speaker 1: for the story to really begin to generate. Right. So

883
00:50:37,680 --> 00:50:39,440
Speaker 1: I was looking at one of these papers by a

884
00:50:39,600 --> 00:50:44,000
Speaker 1: Juan Gomez Alonzo, MD, who wrote about it in Rabies

885
00:50:44,000 --> 00:50:46,640
Speaker 1: A Possible Explanation for the Vampire legend published in the

886
00:50:46,680 --> 00:50:51,640
Speaker 1: journal Historical Neurology from in which the author looks at

887
00:50:51,640 --> 00:50:54,719
Speaker 1: the hypothesis. So he starts off in this paper by

888
00:50:54,719 --> 00:50:57,840
Speaker 1: pointing out that, yes, in vampire legends of European folklore,

889
00:50:58,239 --> 00:51:01,320
Speaker 1: you often see dogs and other easts wrapped up in

890
00:51:01,360 --> 00:51:04,319
Speaker 1: the whole scenario. The vampire could take the form of

891
00:51:04,320 --> 00:51:06,400
Speaker 1: a beast, and in the form of a dog, it

892
00:51:06,440 --> 00:51:08,520
Speaker 1: could kill all the dogs of a village. And it's

893
00:51:08,560 --> 00:51:12,920
Speaker 1: also also maybe associated with wolves or cats, etcetera. I

894
00:51:12,960 --> 00:51:14,840
Speaker 1: don't know if there's any real connection here, but I

895
00:51:14,840 --> 00:51:17,560
Speaker 1: mean It makes me think about the way that animals

896
00:51:17,600 --> 00:51:21,799
Speaker 1: like cats especially are also associated with witchcraft. If you're

897
00:51:21,800 --> 00:51:26,320
Speaker 1: giving a kind of Christian demonology take on the vampire legend,

898
00:51:26,480 --> 00:51:28,759
Speaker 1: like you know which cats were often thought to be

899
00:51:28,800 --> 00:51:31,600
Speaker 1: the familiars of witches. Now in this paper, he he

900
00:51:31,640 --> 00:51:36,560
Speaker 1: also prizes a nice, uh overall sided look at some

901
00:51:36,640 --> 00:51:39,120
Speaker 1: of the frequent attributes of vamps. Some of these we've

902
00:51:39,120 --> 00:51:42,640
Speaker 1: already discussed, like the idea that they're mostly nocturnal. I

903
00:51:42,719 --> 00:51:44,960
Speaker 1: love this, uh that you could become a vampire by

904
00:51:45,000 --> 00:51:47,880
Speaker 1: being attacked by a vamp, eating the flesh of animals

905
00:51:47,960 --> 00:51:52,120
Speaker 1: killed by vamps quote, having been a great lover unquote,

906
00:51:52,719 --> 00:51:56,760
Speaker 1: or having died of plague, rabies, or other illnesses. Also,

907
00:51:57,080 --> 00:51:59,480
Speaker 1: if a corpse saw its own reflection in a mirror,

908
00:51:59,560 --> 00:52:02,319
Speaker 1: it could go a vamp. Uh what Yeah, how would

909
00:52:02,320 --> 00:52:04,920
Speaker 1: the corpse see the reflection? Just don't hold any mirrors

910
00:52:04,960 --> 00:52:07,080
Speaker 1: up to corpses, then you don't risk it at all.

911
00:52:07,239 --> 00:52:11,560
Speaker 1: Yeah uh yeah. This course ties into the whole supernatural

912
00:52:11,600 --> 00:52:14,120
Speaker 1: aspect of mirrors and the fact that most people really

913
00:52:14,120 --> 00:52:18,160
Speaker 1: don't understand how mirrors work. But but that's another another

914
00:52:18,160 --> 00:52:21,960
Speaker 1: topic for another episode. Um. Also, animals walking over a

915
00:52:22,000 --> 00:52:25,840
Speaker 1: grave could also do the trick. Yeah, he writes. Quote.

916
00:52:25,960 --> 00:52:30,080
Speaker 1: Signs that made a cadaver suspicious included good external appearance,

917
00:52:30,520 --> 00:52:33,080
Speaker 1: a swollen body full of liquid blood that flowed out

918
00:52:33,080 --> 00:52:36,680
Speaker 1: of the mouth, prominent genitalia, and the emission of a

919
00:52:36,760 --> 00:52:39,319
Speaker 1: cry when a steak was driven into it. Well, I'm

920
00:52:39,320 --> 00:52:42,200
Speaker 1: a little confused by that last one. The emission of

921
00:52:42,200 --> 00:52:46,200
Speaker 1: the cry. Well, there are this one's easily explained though.

922
00:52:46,239 --> 00:52:49,600
Speaker 1: I mean the idea, if you're you're exhuming a body, uh,

923
00:52:49,640 --> 00:52:53,520
Speaker 1: and it is say, bloated with various gases due to decomposition,

924
00:52:54,160 --> 00:52:57,319
Speaker 1: if you press on it or certainly drive a steak

925
00:52:57,360 --> 00:53:00,680
Speaker 1: into its heart, uh, some sort of sound might emerge.

926
00:53:00,840 --> 00:53:04,440
Speaker 1: It's kind of sound like a sigh potentially, or like

927
00:53:04,480 --> 00:53:08,520
Speaker 1: a sort of a grotesque um like necro mouth fart

928
00:53:08,600 --> 00:53:11,480
Speaker 1: kind of a situation. I don't know. Um. Well, I

929
00:53:11,480 --> 00:53:14,480
Speaker 1: mean this is another thing that has been considered a

930
00:53:14,640 --> 00:53:17,399
Speaker 1: very important part of the formation of vampire legends, which

931
00:53:17,440 --> 00:53:22,200
Speaker 1: is the counterintuitive appearance of exhumed corpses. That sometimes you

932
00:53:22,200 --> 00:53:24,560
Speaker 1: would dig up a body and people would look at

933
00:53:24,600 --> 00:53:27,760
Speaker 1: it and think, that doesn't look like I would expect

934
00:53:27,800 --> 00:53:31,120
Speaker 1: a decomposing body to look instead something about it looks

935
00:53:31,160 --> 00:53:33,920
Speaker 1: like it's you know, recently been alive or doing stuff

936
00:53:33,960 --> 00:53:36,480
Speaker 1: like it might have blood running from the mouth, or

937
00:53:36,520 --> 00:53:39,320
Speaker 1: it might somehow look healthy and bloated in the face,

938
00:53:39,400 --> 00:53:43,279
Speaker 1: like it's been gorging. Yeah, I mean the bloating of

939
00:53:43,320 --> 00:53:45,880
Speaker 1: corpses alone, you think of that. And I did not

940
00:53:45,960 --> 00:53:48,960
Speaker 1: encourage anyone to look up images of bloated corpses. But

941
00:53:49,040 --> 00:53:52,319
Speaker 1: if you do, uh, you will be astounded at how

942
00:53:52,360 --> 00:53:55,239
Speaker 1: bloated things can get. And I could see where one

943
00:53:55,320 --> 00:53:58,640
Speaker 1: might think, oh, well, this is this is an absurdly

944
00:53:58,680 --> 00:54:01,920
Speaker 1: bloated version of this individual we used to see around town.

945
00:54:02,400 --> 00:54:05,000
Speaker 1: How do they get so bloated? Perhaps they have been

946
00:54:05,040 --> 00:54:07,839
Speaker 1: eating something, perhaps they have been drinking something. Yeah, that's

947
00:54:07,840 --> 00:54:10,239
Speaker 1: sort of the full logic you would apply to seeing

948
00:54:10,280 --> 00:54:12,360
Speaker 1: a corpse look like this. Another thing about the corpses

949
00:54:12,440 --> 00:54:16,800
Speaker 1: that's been observed is the idea that um during postmortem decomposition,

950
00:54:16,880 --> 00:54:21,680
Speaker 1: sometimes skin will pull back away from things like fingernails

951
00:54:21,680 --> 00:54:24,160
Speaker 1: and teeth, you know, the surrounding tissue will draw back,

952
00:54:24,320 --> 00:54:27,560
Speaker 1: giving the appearance that things like fingernails and teeth have

953
00:54:27,760 --> 00:54:31,000
Speaker 1: grown longer in the grave. And so a lot of

954
00:54:31,040 --> 00:54:34,200
Speaker 1: stuff like this just ways that a corpse doesn't look

955
00:54:34,239 --> 00:54:37,680
Speaker 1: like a person would naively assume it should look after

956
00:54:37,760 --> 00:54:41,360
Speaker 1: it's been exhumed. That probably played a large role in

957
00:54:41,400 --> 00:54:44,160
Speaker 1: contributing to the vampire legend. And and then if you

958
00:54:44,160 --> 00:54:47,200
Speaker 1: get to the point where you're you're exhuming corpses to

959
00:54:47,440 --> 00:54:51,440
Speaker 1: look for signs of supernatural on life, I mean, you're

960
00:54:51,480 --> 00:54:55,120
Speaker 1: probably gonna find it. There's a sunk cost and digging

961
00:54:55,200 --> 00:54:57,480
Speaker 1: up that grave. Some of the papers we've been reading

962
00:54:57,480 --> 00:54:59,120
Speaker 1: for this episode point out, you know, one of the

963
00:54:59,160 --> 00:55:04,360
Speaker 1: things about the vampire records of vampire control activities is

964
00:55:04,400 --> 00:55:07,040
Speaker 1: that pretty much anytime people dug up a corpse to

965
00:55:07,040 --> 00:55:11,200
Speaker 1: find a vampire, it turns out, yep, it was a vampire. Yeah.

966
00:55:11,239 --> 00:55:13,560
Speaker 1: I mean maybe the stories of oh it's a negative,

967
00:55:13,600 --> 00:55:16,200
Speaker 1: sorry everybody, we can just go home, let's bury this

968
00:55:16,239 --> 00:55:19,480
Speaker 1: thing again, those don't make it into the newspaper now.

969
00:55:19,480 --> 00:55:23,120
Speaker 1: In this paper, Gomez Alonso also discusses the seeming link

970
00:55:23,200 --> 00:55:27,200
Speaker 1: between vampire behavior and limbic system disorders. He says, quote,

971
00:55:27,480 --> 00:55:30,080
Speaker 1: this brutish part of the brain plays the central role

972
00:55:30,120 --> 00:55:33,200
Speaker 1: in the regulation of emotion and behavior in patients with

973
00:55:33,239 --> 00:55:36,440
Speaker 1: diseases such as rabies and epilepsy. A clear link has

974
00:55:36,440 --> 00:55:39,400
Speaker 1: been found between aggressiveness and the dysfunction of some limbic

975
00:55:39,520 --> 00:55:46,920
Speaker 1: system regions, i e. The hypothalamus, the amygdaloid complex, the heppocampus. Likewise,

976
00:55:47,400 --> 00:55:51,520
Speaker 1: relation between has been shown in humans between altered sexual

977
00:55:51,560 --> 00:55:55,320
Speaker 1: behavior and some olymbic system structures such as the septal area.

978
00:55:55,600 --> 00:55:59,160
Speaker 1: Nocturnal activity may be present in patients with insomnia or

979
00:55:59,200 --> 00:56:02,719
Speaker 1: disruption of the sleep wake cycle. Both have been reported

980
00:56:02,760 --> 00:56:06,560
Speaker 1: in disorders of the anterior hypothalamus. So he is showing

981
00:56:06,680 --> 00:56:10,960
Speaker 1: that there could be some clear behavioral links between things

982
00:56:11,040 --> 00:56:13,640
Speaker 1: you might expect to see in a person who's suffering

983
00:56:13,680 --> 00:56:18,480
Speaker 1: the neurodegenerative effects of rabies and things that appear in

984
00:56:18,520 --> 00:56:21,880
Speaker 1: the vampire lore exactly. And of course, obviously we have

985
00:56:22,000 --> 00:56:26,400
Speaker 1: this animal interaction situation in vamp Empire, some vampire legends,

986
00:56:26,400 --> 00:56:30,480
Speaker 1: which gives us a link to zoonosis and and rabies

987
00:56:30,560 --> 00:56:33,480
Speaker 1: is a disease that best fits so symptoms that it

988
00:56:33,560 --> 00:56:37,920
Speaker 1: is transferred by animals and then can be transferred from

989
00:56:38,239 --> 00:56:42,720
Speaker 1: human to human via kind of animalistic attacks in some cases.

990
00:56:43,719 --> 00:56:45,919
Speaker 1: So yeah, the rabid human may froth of the mouth,

991
00:56:45,960 --> 00:56:49,919
Speaker 1: their facial muscles may twitch and reveal their teeth. And

992
00:56:50,200 --> 00:56:52,880
Speaker 1: these episodes may be triggered, he says, by changes in

993
00:56:53,280 --> 00:56:56,919
Speaker 1: the air uh, in the in water, or in even light,

994
00:56:57,120 --> 00:57:01,200
Speaker 1: like walking out into say bright sunlight. And then they

995
00:57:01,200 --> 00:57:04,120
Speaker 1: may act that the individual with rabies may act with

996
00:57:04,200 --> 00:57:08,799
Speaker 1: furious aggression towards other humans. Meanwhile, during quiet intervals, they

997
00:57:08,800 --> 00:57:12,080
Speaker 1: may lie in bed mentally alert, but with the work

998
00:57:12,120 --> 00:57:15,920
Speaker 1: of a look of like frozen horror, perhaps drooling bloody

999
00:57:15,920 --> 00:57:20,360
Speaker 1: saliva from their mouths. Uh. Nightmares and hallucinations may emerge

1000
00:57:20,440 --> 00:57:23,040
Speaker 1: during this phase as well, which certainly can add to

1001
00:57:23,120 --> 00:57:26,360
Speaker 1: this sense of horror. Uh. And again, this is a

1002
00:57:26,400 --> 00:57:29,360
Speaker 1: phase that we thankfully see very little of in this

1003
00:57:29,440 --> 00:57:33,320
Speaker 1: day and age, due to early rabies intervention in human patients.

1004
00:57:33,880 --> 00:57:36,560
Speaker 1: I mean, generally speaking, I think we've gotten to the

1005
00:57:36,560 --> 00:57:39,000
Speaker 1: point in most places where if someone has been bitten

1006
00:57:39,040 --> 00:57:42,400
Speaker 1: by a wild animal, or even if you've been bitten

1007
00:57:42,400 --> 00:57:45,240
Speaker 1: by a pet like a child as bit by a

1008
00:57:45,240 --> 00:57:50,360
Speaker 1: pet dog. I belong to enough neighborhood groups on Facebook

1009
00:57:50,640 --> 00:57:53,520
Speaker 1: that you see that that is is instantly a panic moment.

1010
00:57:53,560 --> 00:57:56,760
Speaker 1: Because we have been we've kind of rehearsed this, you know, like,

1011
00:57:56,840 --> 00:57:59,440
Speaker 1: what if there's there is a what if the animal

1012
00:57:59,480 --> 00:58:01,800
Speaker 1: is at all rabbid like this has to be taken

1013
00:58:01,840 --> 00:58:03,920
Speaker 1: care of in advance. Yeah, and I know. I mean,

1014
00:58:03,960 --> 00:58:05,920
Speaker 1: one thing I've read about is that there definitely is

1015
00:58:06,080 --> 00:58:09,680
Speaker 1: more of a rabies threat in say, more developing parts

1016
00:58:09,680 --> 00:58:11,480
Speaker 1: of the world, where a lot of times it doesn't

1017
00:58:11,520 --> 00:58:14,400
Speaker 1: necessarily come from like you know, the wild wolf for

1018
00:58:14,520 --> 00:58:17,960
Speaker 1: something that comes from animals like straight dogs. In addition

1019
00:58:18,000 --> 00:58:20,960
Speaker 1: to to this behavior though it's also a hyper sexual

1020
00:58:21,040 --> 00:58:26,439
Speaker 1: activity has been observed prolonged directions. Um, the author says,

1021
00:58:26,520 --> 00:58:29,720
Speaker 1: quote the literature reports cases of rabid patients who practiced

1022
00:58:29,720 --> 00:58:32,600
Speaker 1: intercourse up to twenty times a day and who made

1023
00:58:32,680 --> 00:58:36,720
Speaker 1: violent rape attempts. So the connection between animals is clear here.

1024
00:58:36,760 --> 00:58:40,600
Speaker 1: And and the connection between not only human and animal behavior,

1025
00:58:40,640 --> 00:58:45,080
Speaker 1: but but between like normal human behavior and like animalistic

1026
00:58:45,200 --> 00:58:48,800
Speaker 1: savage models of how humans could behave And he says

1027
00:58:48,920 --> 00:58:51,040
Speaker 1: it's also worth noting that while the bide is the

1028
00:58:51,080 --> 00:58:54,000
Speaker 1: main way rabies is transmitted, he says, there are accounts

1029
00:58:54,000 --> 00:58:58,400
Speaker 1: in the literature of sexual transmission as well. Um, and

1030
00:58:58,400 --> 00:59:00,760
Speaker 1: this with time that you mentioned earlier idea that some

1031
00:59:00,920 --> 00:59:05,280
Speaker 1: of the vampire folklore has uh highlights I don't know,

1032
00:59:05,400 --> 00:59:08,720
Speaker 1: questionable sexual activity or what they would have considered questionable

1033
00:59:08,760 --> 00:59:11,680
Speaker 1: sexual activity. Yeah. Yeah, And then he also mentions that,

1034
00:59:11,760 --> 00:59:15,200
Speaker 1: you know, biting is not necessarily I mean, biden could

1035
00:59:15,200 --> 00:59:17,440
Speaker 1: be part of sexual activity as well. I mean there

1036
00:59:17,440 --> 00:59:20,320
Speaker 1: are Sexual activity is kind of a big tent that

1037
00:59:20,360 --> 00:59:22,920
Speaker 1: contains a lot of different things and contain and can

1038
00:59:22,960 --> 00:59:26,920
Speaker 1: also encompass a number of different bodily fluids, which could

1039
00:59:27,520 --> 00:59:32,520
Speaker 1: contain the rabies, sort of a carnival of disease vectors. Yes, now,

1040
00:59:32,840 --> 00:59:36,520
Speaker 1: rabies is also this is interesting, seven times more likely

1041
00:59:36,520 --> 00:59:39,440
Speaker 1: in males than in females, he tells us, thus lining

1042
00:59:39,520 --> 00:59:43,800
Speaker 1: up with the frequent masculine vampire trope. Especially that was

1043
00:59:44,080 --> 00:59:47,920
Speaker 1: he says, was president during that time. Also worth noting,

1044
00:59:47,960 --> 00:59:50,920
Speaker 1: he says that in the eighteen hundreds, UH there were

1045
00:59:50,960 --> 00:59:54,320
Speaker 1: there was a fairly large rabies epidemic among animals in

1046
00:59:54,360 --> 00:59:59,440
Speaker 1: places like Hungary. Rabid animals typically die within two weeks

1047
00:59:59,440 --> 01:00:03,360
Speaker 1: by his fit sea or cardio respiratory arrest, and modes

1048
01:00:03,360 --> 01:00:06,919
Speaker 1: of death UH in this case may produce a persistence

1049
01:00:06,960 --> 01:00:12,040
Speaker 1: of liquid blood, turgent genitalia, and the emission of sperm. UH.

1050
01:00:12,040 --> 01:00:16,040
Speaker 1: Though he also notes though that when wild animals UH

1051
01:00:16,200 --> 01:00:20,400
Speaker 1: presented these symptoms or certainly of the human exhibited these

1052
01:00:20,520 --> 01:00:23,080
Speaker 1: these symptoms, it was probably more likely that they would

1053
01:00:23,080 --> 01:00:27,680
Speaker 1: be killed before they reached this point, especially if there's

1054
01:00:27,680 --> 01:00:30,360
Speaker 1: a pervasive vampire myth in in the area. One can

1055
01:00:30,480 --> 01:00:33,960
Speaker 1: only imagine uh. And he also argues that you know

1056
01:00:34,000 --> 01:00:36,840
Speaker 1: this is likely. There's likely a connection between rabies and

1057
01:00:36,880 --> 01:00:40,240
Speaker 1: many Greek myths uh and the werewolf legend as well.

1058
01:00:40,320 --> 01:00:43,520
Speaker 1: All right, so, Robert, do you have a verdict on

1059
01:00:43,560 --> 01:00:47,360
Speaker 1: the validity of this and explaining the inspiration of vampire lore.

1060
01:00:47,400 --> 01:00:49,600
Speaker 1: I think we've said so far that syphilis might be

1061
01:00:49,680 --> 01:00:52,760
Speaker 1: a good candidate for explaining some cases, especially maybe some

1062
01:00:52,800 --> 01:00:56,080
Speaker 1: more modern cases. We think that porphyria is not a

1063
01:00:56,120 --> 01:00:59,760
Speaker 1: good explanation of vampire of the origin of vampire lore.

1064
01:00:59,800 --> 01:01:01,800
Speaker 1: What do think about rabies? Well, I think that this

1065
01:01:01,960 --> 01:01:05,080
Speaker 1: the overall fear that I mean, the fear of our

1066
01:01:05,160 --> 01:01:08,960
Speaker 1: b steal nature, the fear of behaving like an animal,

1067
01:01:09,000 --> 01:01:13,280
Speaker 1: of giving ourselves over entirely to violent or carnal impulses.

1068
01:01:13,880 --> 01:01:16,360
Speaker 1: That that is a that's a fear that will never

1069
01:01:16,360 --> 01:01:18,560
Speaker 1: go away, and it's just part of our human nature.

1070
01:01:18,960 --> 01:01:21,560
Speaker 1: And in this case, we do have a medical condition

1071
01:01:22,400 --> 01:01:27,320
Speaker 1: that that lines up with that fear. So well, uh So, Yeah,

1072
01:01:27,320 --> 01:01:30,840
Speaker 1: I'm pretty sold on the idea that if they were

1073
01:01:31,560 --> 01:01:35,840
Speaker 1: just even notable cases of human rabies, much less an epidemic,

1074
01:01:36,120 --> 01:01:39,840
Speaker 1: it could definitely have uh it could send shock waves

1075
01:01:39,880 --> 01:01:44,360
Speaker 1: through the folklore traditions of a given region. But then again,

1076
01:01:45,240 --> 01:01:48,440
Speaker 1: I'm I'm hesitant to I'm not only hesitant, I mean

1077
01:01:48,640 --> 01:01:52,840
Speaker 1: I'm opposed to saying vampire vampire is m equals rabies.

1078
01:01:53,400 --> 01:01:55,560
Speaker 1: I think that that would be going a little too far.

1079
01:01:55,600 --> 01:01:57,880
Speaker 1: But they do line up in interesting ways. We've tried

1080
01:01:57,920 --> 01:02:00,400
Speaker 1: to emphasize several times. I think that we're not going

1081
01:02:00,440 --> 01:02:05,520
Speaker 1: to push a vamporism equals some disease or some condition. Here.

1082
01:02:05,560 --> 01:02:09,400
Speaker 1: We we know that the inspiration behind folklore and and

1083
01:02:09,520 --> 01:02:12,000
Speaker 1: belief in mythical beasts and stuff is number one, more

1084
01:02:12,040 --> 01:02:15,520
Speaker 1: complex than that. Number two, it's influenced by pure creative imagination.

1085
01:02:15,960 --> 01:02:18,840
Speaker 1: Number three, The connections we make with known medical diseases

1086
01:02:18,880 --> 01:02:21,280
Speaker 1: today are all it's all just inferences. You know, we

1087
01:02:21,280 --> 01:02:23,480
Speaker 1: we don't know for sure what was going on then,

1088
01:02:23,600 --> 01:02:25,920
Speaker 1: what caused it? Yeah, I will say if you if

1089
01:02:25,960 --> 01:02:29,360
Speaker 1: you want to learn more about rabies, you should check

1090
01:02:29,360 --> 01:02:32,640
Speaker 1: out I honestly can't remember remember it was a radio

1091
01:02:32,680 --> 01:02:35,320
Speaker 1: Lab or This American Life. I think it was Radio Lab.

1092
01:02:35,600 --> 01:02:39,160
Speaker 1: They did an episode on rabies and it includes audio

1093
01:02:39,240 --> 01:02:42,160
Speaker 1: recordings or a snippet of an audio recording of a

1094
01:02:42,280 --> 01:02:45,320
Speaker 1: human rabies case. And you hear this, this like the

1095
01:02:45,360 --> 01:02:49,680
Speaker 1: guttural howling of the individual. Uh so listen to that.

1096
01:02:49,720 --> 01:02:52,680
Speaker 1: It'll it'll haunt you for the rest of your life.

1097
01:02:52,840 --> 01:02:55,240
Speaker 1: And if you think you have rabies exposure, by all means,

1098
01:02:55,240 --> 01:02:58,440
Speaker 1: get to a hospital immediately. Absolutely. All right, Well, I

1099
01:02:58,480 --> 01:03:00,240
Speaker 1: think we have to call it there for today, but

1100
01:03:00,400 --> 01:03:03,360
Speaker 1: join us again next time for part two of our

1101
01:03:03,400 --> 01:03:07,880
Speaker 1: two part exploration of the link between medical conditions and

1102
01:03:08,000 --> 01:03:11,160
Speaker 1: the origins of the vampire legend. That's right, the clinic

1103
01:03:11,240 --> 01:03:12,919
Speaker 1: is gonna close for a day, but then it's gonna

1104
01:03:12,960 --> 01:03:15,720
Speaker 1: reopen on Thursday and we will will explore even more

1105
01:03:15,760 --> 01:03:18,400
Speaker 1: on this topic. We we figured this one would be

1106
01:03:18,760 --> 01:03:21,800
Speaker 1: a natural episode displute into because I think everybody's down

1107
01:03:21,840 --> 01:03:24,960
Speaker 1: for vampires during the month of October, and there's just

1108
01:03:25,000 --> 01:03:27,200
Speaker 1: a lot to talk about here. In the meantime, if

1109
01:03:27,240 --> 01:03:29,040
Speaker 1: you want to check out more episodes of stuff to

1110
01:03:29,040 --> 01:03:33,280
Speaker 1: blow your mind, especially are our seasonal offerings that occur

1111
01:03:33,400 --> 01:03:36,200
Speaker 1: every October, head on over to stuff to Blow your

1112
01:03:36,200 --> 01:03:38,240
Speaker 1: Mind dot com. That's the mothership. That's where you'll find

1113
01:03:38,280 --> 01:03:40,880
Speaker 1: all the episodes of the show. You'll find links out

1114
01:03:40,920 --> 01:03:43,720
Speaker 1: to our various social media accounts. You'll find a tab

1115
01:03:43,760 --> 01:03:46,320
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1116
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Speaker 1: our store and you can pick up some cool swags,

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1118
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1119
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Speaker 1: way to support the show. And if you want to

1120
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Speaker 1: support us in a way that doesn't cost you any

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01:03:59,120 --> 01:04:02,600
Speaker 1: money at all, why I simply go and rate and

1122
01:04:02,680 --> 01:04:04,840
Speaker 1: review us wherever you have the power to do so.

1123
01:04:05,320 --> 01:04:08,920
Speaker 1: Huge thanks as always to our excellent audio producers Alex

1124
01:04:08,960 --> 01:04:11,400
Speaker 1: Williams and Tarry Harrison. If you would like to get

1125
01:04:11,440 --> 01:04:14,120
Speaker 1: in touch with us directly to let us know feedback

1126
01:04:14,120 --> 01:04:17,240
Speaker 1: about this episode or any other, to suggest a topic

1127
01:04:17,320 --> 01:04:19,440
Speaker 1: for the future, just to say hi, let us know

1128
01:04:19,640 --> 01:04:21,840
Speaker 1: how you found out about the show, where you listen from,

1129
01:04:21,880 --> 01:04:23,920
Speaker 1: how long you've been listening all that fun stuff. You

1130
01:04:23,920 --> 01:04:26,400
Speaker 1: can email us at blow the Mind at how stuff

1131
01:04:26,400 --> 01:04:37,880
Speaker 1: works dot com for more on this and thousands of

1132
01:04:37,920 --> 01:04:48,320
Speaker 1: other topics. Is it how stuff works dot com. B

1133
01:05:00,000 --> 01:05:00,160
Speaker 1: one