1 00:00:00,840 --> 00:00:03,200 Speaker 1: You're listening to the I Heart Radio and Coast to Coast, 2 00:00:03,240 --> 00:00:06,640 Speaker 1: a paranormal podcast network where we offer you podcasts of 3 00:00:06,720 --> 00:00:10,560 Speaker 1: the supernatural and the unexplained. Getting ready now for Shades 4 00:00:10,600 --> 00:00:19,200 Speaker 1: of the Afterlife with Sandra Champlain. The thoughts and opinions 5 00:00:19,280 --> 00:00:22,560 Speaker 1: expressed by the host our thoughts and opinions only, and 6 00:00:22,600 --> 00:00:25,759 Speaker 1: do not necessarily reflect those of I Heart Media, I 7 00:00:25,920 --> 00:00:29,360 Speaker 1: Heart Radio, Coast to Coast a out employees of premier 8 00:00:29,400 --> 00:00:33,519 Speaker 1: networks or their sponsors and associates. You are encouraged to 9 00:00:33,600 --> 00:00:36,600 Speaker 1: do the proper amount of research yourself, depending on the 10 00:00:36,640 --> 00:00:49,239 Speaker 1: subject matter and your needs. Hi. I'm Sandra Champlain. For 11 00:00:49,280 --> 00:00:52,519 Speaker 1: almost twenty five years, I've been on a journey to 12 00:00:52,680 --> 00:00:56,640 Speaker 1: prove the existence of life after death. On each episode 13 00:00:56,720 --> 00:00:59,840 Speaker 1: will discuss the reasons we now know that our loved 14 00:01:00,000 --> 00:01:05,200 Speaker 1: ones have survived physical death, and so will we Welcome 15 00:01:05,319 --> 00:01:08,480 Speaker 1: to Shades of the Afterlife. Well, Hello, I hope you're 16 00:01:08,520 --> 00:01:12,760 Speaker 1: having a wonderful day whatever you've been doing. Welcome, of 17 00:01:12,800 --> 00:01:17,039 Speaker 1: course to our show. Before we start, I just want 18 00:01:17,080 --> 00:01:19,840 Speaker 1: to give you some news because I feel like celebrating 19 00:01:20,440 --> 00:01:23,880 Speaker 1: the greatest is that our first feature film is really 20 00:01:24,319 --> 00:01:27,280 Speaker 1: making a big splash. I never thought I'd be the 21 00:01:27,319 --> 00:01:31,760 Speaker 1: producer of a film, but our friend and director Robert 22 00:01:31,800 --> 00:01:38,200 Speaker 1: Lyon has created a masterpiece called Rinaldi Instrumental trans Communication 23 00:01:38,440 --> 00:01:40,840 Speaker 1: with the Other Side. And I know you've heard me 24 00:01:40,880 --> 00:01:44,120 Speaker 1: talk about it before, but it's really great. We're getting 25 00:01:44,319 --> 00:01:48,120 Speaker 1: so many great comments about it. It's the story of 26 00:01:48,120 --> 00:01:51,639 Speaker 1: Sonya and Aldi and her work for over thirty years 27 00:01:52,160 --> 00:01:56,760 Speaker 1: capturing voices and now images of those in the afterlife 28 00:01:57,160 --> 00:02:01,680 Speaker 1: and of the people she works with, parents and the 29 00:02:01,840 --> 00:02:06,560 Speaker 1: stories of parents being reunited with their children through these 30 00:02:06,600 --> 00:02:11,639 Speaker 1: images and getting that knowing that their child has survived 31 00:02:12,240 --> 00:02:16,320 Speaker 1: is just amazing. So I'm so proud, and like I said, 32 00:02:16,360 --> 00:02:19,680 Speaker 1: getting so many great responses. So I think you should 33 00:02:19,720 --> 00:02:23,120 Speaker 1: see at bottom line. Everything is at our web page 34 00:02:23,280 --> 00:02:25,920 Speaker 1: we Don't Die dot com. You can click on the 35 00:02:25,960 --> 00:02:29,600 Speaker 1: store button. I think that's the easiest way to find it. Also, 36 00:02:29,760 --> 00:02:34,359 Speaker 1: this month makes two years of doing our free Sunday 37 00:02:34,520 --> 00:02:38,280 Speaker 1: gathering and it was our way of giving back back 38 00:02:38,320 --> 00:02:41,919 Speaker 1: when COVID first hit, when many of us lost our 39 00:02:42,040 --> 00:02:47,239 Speaker 1: jobs and were forced to recreate ourselves. And thankfully for me, 40 00:02:47,560 --> 00:02:52,120 Speaker 1: I've been interested in the afterlife and obviously being the 41 00:02:52,160 --> 00:02:56,040 Speaker 1: author of a book, this became. Instead of a part 42 00:02:56,080 --> 00:03:00,480 Speaker 1: time hobby, this became a full time passion and for me, 43 00:03:01,280 --> 00:03:05,560 Speaker 1: on our Sunday gatherings, we inspire you week after week 44 00:03:05,639 --> 00:03:09,639 Speaker 1: with a different topic, give you joy in your day, 45 00:03:09,800 --> 00:03:12,400 Speaker 1: things to look forward to in your week, and within 46 00:03:12,639 --> 00:03:16,680 Speaker 1: each and everyone there's a demonstration of mediumship. So we 47 00:03:16,720 --> 00:03:19,560 Speaker 1: hold them on zoom and no matter where you are 48 00:03:19,639 --> 00:03:22,160 Speaker 1: in the world, it's possible your loved one could come 49 00:03:22,200 --> 00:03:25,280 Speaker 1: through in the demonstration. We're so proud of it, and 50 00:03:25,320 --> 00:03:29,040 Speaker 1: it's a great reason to believe in the afterlife when 51 00:03:29,040 --> 00:03:33,359 Speaker 1: you see all these reconnections that happen and so much more. 52 00:03:34,440 --> 00:03:39,200 Speaker 1: Every month we hold weekly classes which are pretty cool. 53 00:03:39,520 --> 00:03:43,360 Speaker 1: I mean they're great. Actually, you've heard of trance mediumship 54 00:03:43,440 --> 00:03:47,440 Speaker 1: and physical mediumship. Well, we have the number one physical 55 00:03:47,520 --> 00:03:50,960 Speaker 1: medium in the world, Scott Milligan, doing a Monday course 56 00:03:51,000 --> 00:03:54,560 Speaker 1: with us called Trance and the Altered States. You know, 57 00:03:54,680 --> 00:03:57,720 Speaker 1: we talk about our loved ones being around us, and 58 00:03:57,800 --> 00:03:59,800 Speaker 1: of course they have jobs to do in the after 59 00:04:00,040 --> 00:04:02,640 Speaker 1: life and they're busy living their own lives, but they're 60 00:04:02,680 --> 00:04:06,440 Speaker 1: only a thought away from us. They really are there 61 00:04:06,480 --> 00:04:09,280 Speaker 1: around us, and you think of them and they can 62 00:04:09,280 --> 00:04:13,920 Speaker 1: be here. But also we have guides. We have beings 63 00:04:14,040 --> 00:04:17,599 Speaker 1: that love us, that have lived their life and they're 64 00:04:17,640 --> 00:04:21,240 Speaker 1: here to support us in ours. So I think depending 65 00:04:21,279 --> 00:04:24,159 Speaker 1: on what we're doing in life and what we need, 66 00:04:24,760 --> 00:04:27,760 Speaker 1: maybe our guides change a bit. I do think that 67 00:04:27,800 --> 00:04:30,280 Speaker 1: we have one or more that have been with us 68 00:04:30,279 --> 00:04:33,799 Speaker 1: since birth. But when we sit on Mondays, it's an 69 00:04:33,839 --> 00:04:39,719 Speaker 1: opportunity to quiet the mind and lower that veil between 70 00:04:39,760 --> 00:04:43,760 Speaker 1: the two worlds. So if we do have our guides 71 00:04:43,880 --> 00:04:48,080 Speaker 1: or inspirers that wish to communicate with us or communicate 72 00:04:48,240 --> 00:04:53,440 Speaker 1: through us through philosophy or inspiration, they can do that. 73 00:04:53,880 --> 00:04:57,640 Speaker 1: But it's also a good opportunity to reach out to 74 00:04:57,680 --> 00:05:00,400 Speaker 1: our loved ones and get to that space where the 75 00:05:00,440 --> 00:05:04,120 Speaker 1: mind is quiet, so the heart and soul can feel 76 00:05:04,240 --> 00:05:06,920 Speaker 1: the love from our loved one who has passed. We're 77 00:05:07,000 --> 00:05:11,440 Speaker 1: so proud of it. Every Tuesday we do a class 78 00:05:11,520 --> 00:05:14,120 Speaker 1: called The Way to Your Spirit, and it's just a 79 00:05:14,160 --> 00:05:18,240 Speaker 1: private journey for you really, so you get the most 80 00:05:18,640 --> 00:05:21,680 Speaker 1: bang for the buck, so to speak, on your adventure 81 00:05:21,800 --> 00:05:24,880 Speaker 1: of being human. It's done with Carrie and Phil who 82 00:05:24,920 --> 00:05:28,120 Speaker 1: are great mediums, and there's a lot of time sitting 83 00:05:28,160 --> 00:05:31,279 Speaker 1: within your own power and learning things that can really 84 00:05:31,320 --> 00:05:34,680 Speaker 1: give you that edge in life most enjoyable. And then 85 00:05:34,680 --> 00:05:38,279 Speaker 1: on Wednesdays we do a psychic development class and that's 86 00:05:38,320 --> 00:05:41,240 Speaker 1: pretty cool too, because you work with people in breakout 87 00:05:41,320 --> 00:05:44,760 Speaker 1: rooms and you realize you know things about another person 88 00:05:44,839 --> 00:05:48,839 Speaker 1: that you really shouldn't. How is that possible? Because we 89 00:05:48,960 --> 00:05:53,440 Speaker 1: are all divine souls and have a huge potential. I 90 00:05:53,480 --> 00:05:56,919 Speaker 1: was talking to my mom today about why is it 91 00:05:57,040 --> 00:06:00,600 Speaker 1: sometimes she and I think the exact same thing at 92 00:06:00,640 --> 00:06:03,919 Speaker 1: the exact same time, And we could be sitting together 93 00:06:04,360 --> 00:06:07,840 Speaker 1: doing our own work, being quiet for half hour or so, 94 00:06:08,279 --> 00:06:09,839 Speaker 1: and all of a sudden will come out with the 95 00:06:09,920 --> 00:06:13,960 Speaker 1: same thing at the same exact time. I call that 96 00:06:14,120 --> 00:06:17,600 Speaker 1: our psychic nature. And when you think about all the 97 00:06:17,640 --> 00:06:21,880 Speaker 1: satellites that are circling Earth right now, and they're all 98 00:06:21,920 --> 00:06:27,960 Speaker 1: sending this invisible signals and invisible information, first of all, 99 00:06:28,000 --> 00:06:31,720 Speaker 1: I think that's mind blowing. Second, if the satellites are 100 00:06:31,760 --> 00:06:35,479 Speaker 1: able to do it, why aren't we, Whether we're soul 101 00:06:35,560 --> 00:06:39,560 Speaker 1: to soul with another human being or soul to spirit 102 00:06:39,800 --> 00:06:43,880 Speaker 1: with someone who is deceased. We humans fall so much 103 00:06:44,080 --> 00:06:47,120 Speaker 1: into the illusion that we've got to see it to 104 00:06:47,200 --> 00:06:49,960 Speaker 1: believe it. But the truth is there's so much happening 105 00:06:50,360 --> 00:06:53,719 Speaker 1: in the invisible world, and I always ask you to 106 00:06:53,760 --> 00:06:58,320 Speaker 1: consider this ever expanding universe with billions and billions of 107 00:06:58,440 --> 00:07:03,680 Speaker 1: galaxies and ours and planets that we human beings may 108 00:07:03,720 --> 00:07:07,039 Speaker 1: not ever know in our lifetime. The answers to everything. 109 00:07:07,480 --> 00:07:11,960 Speaker 1: So in that invisible space, yep, psychic communication, but also 110 00:07:12,040 --> 00:07:15,440 Speaker 1: our loved ones. And on Thursdays that's what we do. 111 00:07:15,800 --> 00:07:20,040 Speaker 1: We have Medium Development class. We never thought these classes 112 00:07:20,040 --> 00:07:24,400 Speaker 1: would be possible online in zoom rooms, but they are 113 00:07:24,880 --> 00:07:29,520 Speaker 1: because our souls are so powerful. Even though we might 114 00:07:29,560 --> 00:07:34,160 Speaker 1: be inhabiting a body, we can see and view and 115 00:07:34,280 --> 00:07:37,960 Speaker 1: feel someone who's on the other side of the world 116 00:07:38,160 --> 00:07:42,120 Speaker 1: or in the other world in the afterlife. So we're 117 00:07:42,160 --> 00:07:45,200 Speaker 1: so proud of the classes. And then on Fridays, our 118 00:07:45,240 --> 00:07:49,280 Speaker 1: friend Scott Milligan, who is a magnificent trance medium, brings 119 00:07:49,680 --> 00:07:54,880 Speaker 1: through information from his inspirers and we get to have 120 00:07:54,960 --> 00:08:00,200 Speaker 1: a conversation with someone in the afterlife. You can come 121 00:08:00,240 --> 00:08:03,640 Speaker 1: for free, you can leave a donation. We really want 122 00:08:03,720 --> 00:08:08,120 Speaker 1: to support all not just believing in the afterlife, but 123 00:08:08,280 --> 00:08:12,600 Speaker 1: how to live a good life while we're here. So again, 124 00:08:12,800 --> 00:08:16,440 Speaker 1: all that's on the website we Don't Die dot com. 125 00:08:16,480 --> 00:08:20,360 Speaker 1: And speaking of being in two places at once. There's 126 00:08:20,400 --> 00:08:25,120 Speaker 1: been some research done by several mediums who have at 127 00:08:25,160 --> 00:08:31,160 Speaker 1: the very same exact time worked with clients to bring 128 00:08:31,200 --> 00:08:35,680 Speaker 1: through the very same person. So in the United States 129 00:08:35,800 --> 00:08:40,280 Speaker 1: was one medium, in Australia was with another two sisters, 130 00:08:40,280 --> 00:08:43,760 Speaker 1: both with their same mother and the afterlife at the 131 00:08:43,880 --> 00:08:49,079 Speaker 1: very same time. Each medium was able to bring through 132 00:08:49,360 --> 00:08:55,160 Speaker 1: accurate information from the deceased mother. I find that extraordinary 133 00:08:55,240 --> 00:08:59,120 Speaker 1: because that tells me that we can I don't know 134 00:08:59,160 --> 00:09:02,160 Speaker 1: if by local kite is the correct word or not, 135 00:09:02,600 --> 00:09:05,640 Speaker 1: but we can be in two places at the very 136 00:09:06,000 --> 00:09:11,800 Speaker 1: same time after we expire from this world. So that 137 00:09:11,840 --> 00:09:16,920 Speaker 1: brings us into our conversation for today. Are we recycled? 138 00:09:17,160 --> 00:09:21,679 Speaker 1: And this is a conversation about reincarnation. And I know 139 00:09:21,760 --> 00:09:24,880 Speaker 1: we've spoken about this before, but I've got some neat 140 00:09:24,920 --> 00:09:27,040 Speaker 1: new stories for you, and I want to share some 141 00:09:27,080 --> 00:09:29,920 Speaker 1: words with Dr Jim Tucker, who has done a ton 142 00:09:30,000 --> 00:09:34,040 Speaker 1: of research into reincarnation. I want to be a hundred 143 00:09:34,080 --> 00:09:36,920 Speaker 1: percent upfront with you though on this. While it does 144 00:09:37,080 --> 00:09:40,680 Speaker 1: make sense that we recycle, and if Earth is so great, 145 00:09:40,840 --> 00:09:44,400 Speaker 1: why shouldn't we have a second chance? Right? Well, I 146 00:09:44,480 --> 00:09:49,800 Speaker 1: really believe what may happen goes so far beyond what 147 00:09:49,840 --> 00:09:53,160 Speaker 1: we can possibly imagine. And I don't talk about this 148 00:09:53,360 --> 00:09:57,640 Speaker 1: much because it's a very common concern from people who 149 00:09:57,640 --> 00:10:00,920 Speaker 1: have contacted me when their loved one has passed away. 150 00:10:00,960 --> 00:10:04,760 Speaker 1: They're afraid they've already reincarnated and they won't get to 151 00:10:04,800 --> 00:10:08,040 Speaker 1: see them in the afterlife. So this, my friends, is 152 00:10:08,080 --> 00:10:12,360 Speaker 1: certainly not true. There have been cases of those claiming 153 00:10:12,400 --> 00:10:17,079 Speaker 1: to be reincarnated, yet when a medium tries to contact 154 00:10:17,200 --> 00:10:21,679 Speaker 1: them or their spirit in the afterlife, they've been able 155 00:10:21,720 --> 00:10:25,520 Speaker 1: to come through and give messages for the loved one evidentially. 156 00:10:26,040 --> 00:10:31,920 Speaker 1: So it could mean that those who report having memories 157 00:10:31,960 --> 00:10:36,280 Speaker 1: of someone who have lived before are actually just highly mediumistic. 158 00:10:37,000 --> 00:10:40,320 Speaker 1: So it isn't their former life they're tapping into. They 159 00:10:40,360 --> 00:10:43,200 Speaker 1: are talking to a spirit person and not knowing it. 160 00:10:43,440 --> 00:10:47,959 Speaker 1: So there's a possibility. Many people believe we reincarnate in 161 00:10:48,040 --> 00:10:51,760 Speaker 1: soul groups, meaning that all the people in your life 162 00:10:51,920 --> 00:10:56,360 Speaker 1: will come back lifetime after lifetime, each playing different parts 163 00:10:56,400 --> 00:10:59,000 Speaker 1: in order for us to learn the most and we 164 00:10:59,080 --> 00:11:02,000 Speaker 1: get to have a well rounded soul, so to speak. 165 00:11:02,559 --> 00:11:05,120 Speaker 1: Then we wait up in the afterlife for everyone to 166 00:11:05,160 --> 00:11:08,240 Speaker 1: meet up together again, and we can choose whether we 167 00:11:08,320 --> 00:11:11,200 Speaker 1: want to go back or not. And if we don't 168 00:11:11,200 --> 00:11:13,319 Speaker 1: go back, there's plenty of work to be done on 169 00:11:13,360 --> 00:11:17,760 Speaker 1: the afterlife as guides or whatever other duties or interests 170 00:11:17,760 --> 00:11:20,800 Speaker 1: you might have. Why I tend to believe there's a 171 00:11:20,880 --> 00:11:24,559 Speaker 1: much bigger picture is when we look at the population 172 00:11:24,640 --> 00:11:28,600 Speaker 1: of the Earth. Fifty years ago, there were only four 173 00:11:28,640 --> 00:11:33,120 Speaker 1: billion people living on planet Earth. Now there are almost 174 00:11:33,240 --> 00:11:36,800 Speaker 1: eight billion. So if we just kept reincarnating over and 175 00:11:36,880 --> 00:11:40,679 Speaker 1: over and over again, there would still only be four 176 00:11:40,720 --> 00:11:45,160 Speaker 1: billion people on this Earth. But population has doubled. So 177 00:11:45,240 --> 00:11:49,080 Speaker 1: where did these extra souls come from? Or could parts 178 00:11:49,120 --> 00:11:52,480 Speaker 1: of us be in two or more places at once. 179 00:11:53,400 --> 00:11:55,600 Speaker 1: You know, maybe part of us is happy and living 180 00:11:55,600 --> 00:11:58,440 Speaker 1: the good life in the hereafter, and another part of 181 00:11:58,520 --> 00:12:01,320 Speaker 1: us has come back to Earth to piggyback on a 182 00:12:01,400 --> 00:12:06,480 Speaker 1: soul inhabiting life right now. You know, anything truly is possible. 183 00:12:07,000 --> 00:12:09,560 Speaker 1: But please don't be afraid that you won't be able 184 00:12:09,559 --> 00:12:12,320 Speaker 1: to see your loved ones again. I promise you they'll 185 00:12:12,320 --> 00:12:14,679 Speaker 1: be right there to meet you and greet you when 186 00:12:14,679 --> 00:12:19,000 Speaker 1: you pass into the next world. Also, the stories I'm 187 00:12:19,000 --> 00:12:23,280 Speaker 1: going to share with you today are definitely amazing and 188 00:12:23,320 --> 00:12:27,280 Speaker 1: they point to the reality of the afterlife. So of course, 189 00:12:27,880 --> 00:12:31,640 Speaker 1: that's why we're here. There's a funny cartoon that's got 190 00:12:31,640 --> 00:12:34,200 Speaker 1: a picture of an old man reading a newspaper and 191 00:12:34,280 --> 00:12:37,520 Speaker 1: on it says reincarnation and a little boy sitting next 192 00:12:37,520 --> 00:12:41,079 Speaker 1: to him, and a little boy says funny. I didn't 193 00:12:41,120 --> 00:12:44,760 Speaker 1: believe in reincarnation when I was your age either. Kind 194 00:12:44,760 --> 00:12:47,160 Speaker 1: of cute. When we come back from the break, we're 195 00:12:47,160 --> 00:12:52,240 Speaker 1: gonna hear some words from doctor Jim Tucker about reincarnation. 196 00:12:52,760 --> 00:12:56,600 Speaker 1: An amazing story. You're listening to Shades of the Afterlife 197 00:12:56,600 --> 00:12:59,040 Speaker 1: on the I Heart Radio and Coast to Coast, a 198 00:12:59,200 --> 00:13:19,960 Speaker 1: m parent normal podcast network. Welcome back to Shades of 199 00:13:20,000 --> 00:13:24,800 Speaker 1: the Afterlife. I'm Sander Champlain and we're talking reincarnation. Are 200 00:13:25,040 --> 00:13:29,480 Speaker 1: we recycled? Someone who has done a ton of work 201 00:13:29,600 --> 00:13:34,160 Speaker 1: in the field of reincarnation is Dr Ian Stevenson, who 202 00:13:34,240 --> 00:13:37,520 Speaker 1: has passed away, Yes he has, but while he was 203 00:13:37,559 --> 00:13:42,600 Speaker 1: alive he conducted more than case studies over a period 204 00:13:42,679 --> 00:13:47,760 Speaker 1: of forty years with children who supposedly remembered past lives. 205 00:13:48,679 --> 00:13:54,800 Speaker 1: Carrying on that work is Dr Jim B. Tucker. He 206 00:13:55,160 --> 00:14:00,560 Speaker 1: is a professor of psychiatry and neurobehavioral studies at the 207 00:14:00,679 --> 00:14:04,200 Speaker 1: University of Virginia, and I want to play for you 208 00:14:04,400 --> 00:14:09,280 Speaker 1: now a presentation he had made, and he gives a 209 00:14:09,520 --> 00:14:13,600 Speaker 1: very compelling story that you might have heard about in 210 00:14:13,640 --> 00:14:18,760 Speaker 1: the News of a Boy and Reincarnation. The story begins 211 00:14:18,760 --> 00:14:22,720 Speaker 1: with Ian Stevenson and he came here to be the 212 00:14:22,800 --> 00:14:27,040 Speaker 1: chairman of the Topartament Psychiatry in nineteen fifty seven. At 213 00:14:27,040 --> 00:14:28,880 Speaker 1: that point he was in the middle of quite a 214 00:14:28,920 --> 00:14:33,720 Speaker 1: successful mainstream career. He had nearly seventy publications to his 215 00:14:33,800 --> 00:14:36,600 Speaker 1: credit at that point, but he also had an interest 216 00:14:36,640 --> 00:14:40,120 Speaker 1: in parapsychology, and after he had been here a while, 217 00:14:40,800 --> 00:14:45,040 Speaker 1: UH he heard about these cases of children from various 218 00:14:45,120 --> 00:14:49,000 Speaker 1: parts of the world who described memories of a past life, 219 00:14:49,520 --> 00:14:53,520 Speaker 1: and he decided to go investigate those cases. UM. He 220 00:14:53,600 --> 00:14:57,560 Speaker 1: was able to fund that travel with the help of 221 00:14:57,680 --> 00:15:03,080 Speaker 1: Chester Carlson. Chester Carlson invented the xerox machine, so he 222 00:15:03,160 --> 00:15:06,120 Speaker 1: was quite wealthy and he became a big supporter of 223 00:15:06,200 --> 00:15:11,960 Speaker 1: Egan's UM. So in nineteen sixty seven, with Carlson's help, 224 00:15:12,440 --> 00:15:14,960 Speaker 1: Ian was able to step down as chairman of the 225 00:15:15,000 --> 00:15:19,160 Speaker 1: department and established the what we now call the Division 226 00:15:19,160 --> 00:15:23,480 Speaker 1: of Perceptual Studies. So that this year marks our fiftieth 227 00:15:23,520 --> 00:15:28,480 Speaker 1: year anniversary. Uh, and we've been going strong ever since then. 228 00:15:29,160 --> 00:15:32,680 Speaker 1: As for Ian, once he established the division in in 229 00:15:32,800 --> 00:15:35,680 Speaker 1: nineteen sixty seven, he spent the bulk of the next 230 00:15:35,760 --> 00:15:40,320 Speaker 1: forty years focused on these cases of children reporting past 231 00:15:40,400 --> 00:15:45,120 Speaker 1: life memories. He published numerous books and papers about them. 232 00:15:46,120 --> 00:15:50,040 Speaker 1: One of his books was reviewed in Jamma, and it 233 00:15:50,120 --> 00:15:53,960 Speaker 1: was actually reviewed by the book review editor who wrote 234 00:15:54,520 --> 00:16:00,120 Speaker 1: in regard to reincarnation, his painstakingly and unemotionally collected the 235 00:16:00,200 --> 00:16:03,840 Speaker 1: detailed series of cases from India, cases in which the 236 00:16:03,920 --> 00:16:08,600 Speaker 1: evidence is difficult to explain on any other grounds. He's 237 00:16:08,640 --> 00:16:11,680 Speaker 1: placed on record a large amount of data that cannot 238 00:16:11,720 --> 00:16:15,160 Speaker 1: be ignored. So to tell you a little bit about 239 00:16:15,200 --> 00:16:21,480 Speaker 1: this phenomenon, we have now studied overes from around the world. 240 00:16:22,320 --> 00:16:25,480 Speaker 1: They are easiest to find in cultures with the belief 241 00:16:25,520 --> 00:16:29,000 Speaker 1: in reincarnation, but they have been found wherever anyone has 242 00:16:29,000 --> 00:16:31,840 Speaker 1: looked for them. Uh. They have been found on all 243 00:16:31,920 --> 00:16:38,320 Speaker 1: the continents except Antarctica. And they typically involve very young 244 00:16:38,440 --> 00:16:43,120 Speaker 1: children who spontaneously start talking about a past life and 245 00:16:43,200 --> 00:16:46,920 Speaker 1: the recent ordinary past life. These kids are not claiming 246 00:16:46,920 --> 00:16:50,680 Speaker 1: to be Cleopatra or Joyous Caesar or anything like that. 247 00:16:51,560 --> 00:16:55,560 Speaker 1: Just describing somebody who lived and died. The one part 248 00:16:55,560 --> 00:16:58,040 Speaker 1: of the life that's often out of the ordinary is 249 00:16:58,080 --> 00:17:02,720 Speaker 1: how the previous person died. In over seventy of the cases, 250 00:17:03,480 --> 00:17:10,480 Speaker 1: the previous person died by unnatural means, meaning murder, suicide, accident, combat, 251 00:17:10,560 --> 00:17:14,440 Speaker 1: that sort of thing, and often the kids. In fact, 252 00:17:14,440 --> 00:17:17,680 Speaker 1: in most of the cases that we've investigated, the kids 253 00:17:17,720 --> 00:17:20,960 Speaker 1: give enough details so that people have been able to 254 00:17:21,000 --> 00:17:25,200 Speaker 1: confirm that somebody did actually live and die whose life 255 00:17:25,280 --> 00:17:28,919 Speaker 1: matches the details of the child gave. Now, along with 256 00:17:28,960 --> 00:17:34,560 Speaker 1: the statements, the children often show emotional or behavioral features 257 00:17:34,600 --> 00:17:38,320 Speaker 1: that seemed connected to the material they're describing, and I'll 258 00:17:38,320 --> 00:17:41,080 Speaker 1: give you an example of that in a minute. In addition, 259 00:17:41,160 --> 00:17:47,080 Speaker 1: some children even have birthmarks or birth defects that match wounds, 260 00:17:47,200 --> 00:17:50,480 Speaker 1: usually the fatal wounds on the body of the previous person. 261 00:17:51,520 --> 00:17:54,800 Speaker 1: And Ian studied a lot of these cases. One was 262 00:17:54,800 --> 00:17:56,920 Speaker 1: a little girl who remembered the life of a man 263 00:17:57,000 --> 00:18:00,160 Speaker 1: who got his fingers choked off as he was being murdered, 264 00:18:00,600 --> 00:18:03,280 Speaker 1: and the little girl was born with her hands looking 265 00:18:03,359 --> 00:18:06,840 Speaker 1: like that. Uh. There was a boy who remembered the 266 00:18:06,840 --> 00:18:09,879 Speaker 1: life of a boy in another village who had lost 267 00:18:09,920 --> 00:18:13,760 Speaker 1: the fingers of his right hand and a fodder chopping machine. 268 00:18:14,600 --> 00:18:18,040 Speaker 1: And the second little boy was born with his hands 269 00:18:18,080 --> 00:18:21,560 Speaker 1: looking like that, which is quite an unusual defect. Uh. 270 00:18:21,600 --> 00:18:23,760 Speaker 1: And then there was a boy who remembered the life 271 00:18:23,760 --> 00:18:26,320 Speaker 1: of a man who had been killed by a shotgun 272 00:18:26,400 --> 00:18:29,840 Speaker 1: blast at the side of his head, and the little 273 00:18:29,840 --> 00:18:31,920 Speaker 1: boy was born with just a stump for an ear 274 00:18:32,440 --> 00:18:35,680 Speaker 1: and an underdeveloped right side of his space. Ian also 275 00:18:35,760 --> 00:18:39,800 Speaker 1: listed eighteen cases in which children were born to two birthmarks, 276 00:18:40,200 --> 00:18:43,439 Speaker 1: ones that matched both the entrance wound and the exit 277 00:18:43,520 --> 00:18:48,280 Speaker 1: wound on the body of a gunshot victim. Now, in 278 00:18:48,359 --> 00:18:52,720 Speaker 1: recent years we hit focused more on American cases, and 279 00:18:52,800 --> 00:18:56,160 Speaker 1: we can now stay with certainty that this is not 280 00:18:56,280 --> 00:19:00,040 Speaker 1: purely a cultural phenomenon that takes place in areas with 281 00:19:00,119 --> 00:19:04,200 Speaker 1: the belief in reincarnation, because we have lots of American cases, 282 00:19:04,920 --> 00:19:08,640 Speaker 1: and most of them take place in families who had 283 00:19:08,680 --> 00:19:12,159 Speaker 1: never believed in reincarnation before the children started talking about 284 00:19:12,160 --> 00:19:14,680 Speaker 1: a past live. I wanted to give you an example 285 00:19:14,720 --> 00:19:17,440 Speaker 1: of a case. UH. This is a case that got 286 00:19:17,440 --> 00:19:20,480 Speaker 1: some publicity a few years ago. It's a little boy 287 00:19:20,640 --> 00:19:24,639 Speaker 1: named James Lineger always not so little anymore, but h 288 00:19:25,080 --> 00:19:29,640 Speaker 1: James was the son of a Christian couple in Louisiana, 289 00:19:30,080 --> 00:19:33,080 Speaker 1: and his dad in particular, was quite opposed to the 290 00:19:33,160 --> 00:19:37,600 Speaker 1: idea of reincarnation before all this started, but around the 291 00:19:37,600 --> 00:19:42,200 Speaker 1: time of his second birthday, James started having horrible nightmares 292 00:19:42,320 --> 00:19:45,359 Speaker 1: multiple times a week in which he would be kicking 293 00:19:45,359 --> 00:19:48,720 Speaker 1: his legs up in the air and screaming, airplane crash 294 00:19:48,760 --> 00:19:52,280 Speaker 1: on fire. Little man can't get out. And during the 295 00:19:52,400 --> 00:19:55,240 Speaker 1: day he would take his little tory airplanes and he 296 00:19:55,280 --> 00:19:58,440 Speaker 1: would say airplane crash on fire and bam. He would 297 00:19:58,480 --> 00:20:01,520 Speaker 1: slam them into the families call he take. He did 298 00:20:01,560 --> 00:20:05,320 Speaker 1: this over and over again, and his parents are apparently 299 00:20:05,359 --> 00:20:11,679 Speaker 1: tolerant people because uh their coffee table at dozens of 300 00:20:11,760 --> 00:20:16,119 Speaker 1: scratches and dens from airplane crash on fire. Bam. So 301 00:20:16,200 --> 00:20:19,520 Speaker 1: when you add that play to the nightmares that he 302 00:20:19,600 --> 00:20:24,040 Speaker 1: was having, he really looked like a traumatized child. But 303 00:20:24,160 --> 00:20:27,399 Speaker 1: he had not experienced any trauma at least in this life. 304 00:20:27,880 --> 00:20:31,840 Speaker 1: And then a little while after his second birthday, his 305 00:20:31,920 --> 00:20:35,320 Speaker 1: parents were able to have several conversations with him during 306 00:20:35,359 --> 00:20:37,440 Speaker 1: the day in which he could talk about these things. 307 00:20:38,080 --> 00:20:41,680 Speaker 1: He said, how his plane had crashed on fire, how 308 00:20:42,040 --> 00:20:45,280 Speaker 1: he had been shot down by the Japanese and he 309 00:20:45,320 --> 00:20:48,400 Speaker 1: said that he flew a Corsair. Now, I've never heard 310 00:20:48,440 --> 00:20:51,040 Speaker 1: of a Corsair, but there was a special plane that 311 00:20:51,119 --> 00:20:53,919 Speaker 1: was developed during World War Two. Then, when he was 312 00:20:53,920 --> 00:20:56,639 Speaker 1: twenty eight months old, he said one day that his 313 00:20:57,240 --> 00:21:00,440 Speaker 1: plane had flown off of a boat, and his parents 314 00:21:00,560 --> 00:21:03,200 Speaker 1: asked him the name of the boat, and he said 315 00:21:03,760 --> 00:21:07,000 Speaker 1: Natoma And it turns out that there was a us S. 316 00:21:07,119 --> 00:21:10,680 Speaker 1: Natoma Bay that was stationed in the Pacific during World 317 00:21:10,680 --> 00:21:13,399 Speaker 1: War Two. Then when he was two and a half, 318 00:21:13,840 --> 00:21:16,480 Speaker 1: his father bought this book on Iwajima to give to 319 00:21:16,560 --> 00:21:21,440 Speaker 1: his own father, James grandfather for Christmas, and he was 320 00:21:21,480 --> 00:21:23,520 Speaker 1: looking through it one day when James came and got 321 00:21:23,520 --> 00:21:27,119 Speaker 1: in his lap and they were thumbing through it and 322 00:21:27,200 --> 00:21:29,879 Speaker 1: they got to this page and James pointed out the 323 00:21:29,920 --> 00:21:33,639 Speaker 1: picture and said that's where my plane was shut down. 324 00:21:34,640 --> 00:21:37,320 Speaker 1: And his dad said what, And he said, my airplane 325 00:21:37,359 --> 00:21:40,359 Speaker 1: got shot down there, daddy, And that just floored his 326 00:21:40,520 --> 00:21:42,560 Speaker 1: dad that his two and a half year old was 327 00:21:42,640 --> 00:21:45,840 Speaker 1: talking like that. And then he learned in the fact 328 00:21:45,880 --> 00:21:48,800 Speaker 1: that Natoma Bay did take part in the Iwa g 329 00:21:48,800 --> 00:21:52,119 Speaker 1: Email operation. Then, when James got old enough to draw, 330 00:21:52,720 --> 00:21:56,439 Speaker 1: he drew dozens and dozens of pictures of planes and 331 00:21:56,520 --> 00:22:00,639 Speaker 1: battle scenes, and he always signed in James three and 332 00:22:00,720 --> 00:22:04,520 Speaker 1: said that he was the third James. Well, eventually, with 333 00:22:04,560 --> 00:22:06,840 Speaker 1: all this going on, his dad did begin to wonder 334 00:22:06,880 --> 00:22:09,840 Speaker 1: if he was remembering the past life. So when James 335 00:22:09,920 --> 00:22:12,960 Speaker 1: is four and a half, he went to a Nautoma 336 00:22:13,040 --> 00:22:16,720 Speaker 1: Bay reunion and he learned that one and only one 337 00:22:17,119 --> 00:22:20,280 Speaker 1: pilot from the ship had been killed during the EWA 338 00:22:20,359 --> 00:22:24,720 Speaker 1: GMAIL operation. This was a young man from Pennsylvania named 339 00:22:24,800 --> 00:22:28,920 Speaker 1: James Houston. So what we can do is compare what 340 00:22:29,040 --> 00:22:32,320 Speaker 1: James Lineger said to James Houston's life to see how 341 00:22:32,359 --> 00:22:36,320 Speaker 1: well they match. Now, James's parents said that he also 342 00:22:36,400 --> 00:22:40,400 Speaker 1: talked about family life before the war, but we don't 343 00:22:40,400 --> 00:22:43,760 Speaker 1: have documentation of those statements that was made before Houston 344 00:22:43,880 --> 00:22:46,879 Speaker 1: was identified. But what we do have here this is 345 00:22:46,920 --> 00:22:51,000 Speaker 1: a list of items where we do have definite documentation 346 00:22:51,440 --> 00:22:56,560 Speaker 1: made before anyone knew anything about James Houston. So James 347 00:22:56,600 --> 00:23:01,800 Speaker 1: signed his drows James three. Hughes was James Jr. Which 348 00:23:01,800 --> 00:23:05,480 Speaker 1: would make James Linerger the third James. James said he 349 00:23:05,560 --> 00:23:09,199 Speaker 1: flew off in the Toma. Houston was a pilot on 350 00:23:09,440 --> 00:23:12,880 Speaker 1: the uss Ne Tomb of Bay. James said he flew 351 00:23:12,880 --> 00:23:16,200 Speaker 1: a Corsair Houston had flown. Of course, there was actually 352 00:23:16,200 --> 00:23:18,479 Speaker 1: playing a different plane when he was killed, but he 353 00:23:18,520 --> 00:23:21,359 Speaker 1: was part of the squadron that tested the Corsair for 354 00:23:21,400 --> 00:23:24,520 Speaker 1: the Navy. James said he was shot down by the 355 00:23:24,600 --> 00:23:29,160 Speaker 1: Japanese and Houston was shot down by the Japanese. James 356 00:23:29,200 --> 00:23:32,720 Speaker 1: said he died at Iwajima. Houston was the one and 357 00:23:32,840 --> 00:23:35,240 Speaker 1: only in the Tone of Bay pilot killed during the 358 00:23:35,240 --> 00:23:40,360 Speaker 1: Iwajima operation. James said, one day, quote my airplane got 359 00:23:40,359 --> 00:23:42,919 Speaker 1: shot in the engine and crashed in the water, and 360 00:23:43,040 --> 00:23:47,520 Speaker 1: that's how I died. I witnesses reported that Houston's plane 361 00:23:47,560 --> 00:23:49,879 Speaker 1: was quote hit head on right on the middle of 362 00:23:49,920 --> 00:23:53,400 Speaker 1: the engine. James had nightmares of his plane crashing and 363 00:23:53,440 --> 00:23:57,000 Speaker 1: sinking in the water, and Houston's plane crashed in the 364 00:23:57,040 --> 00:24:00,639 Speaker 1: water and quickly sank, and James it one day that 365 00:24:00,800 --> 00:24:04,359 Speaker 1: his friend Jack Larson was there and Jack Larson was 366 00:24:04,400 --> 00:24:06,960 Speaker 1: a parliament of the plane next to Houston's on the 367 00:24:07,040 --> 00:24:11,760 Speaker 1: day that he was killed. James is now eighteen years old. 368 00:24:12,280 --> 00:24:15,600 Speaker 1: He graduated from high school last spreeing, and he has 369 00:24:15,640 --> 00:24:18,880 Speaker 1: now joined the Navy. I hope you enjoyed listening to that. 370 00:24:19,359 --> 00:24:22,520 Speaker 1: Every time I do, I get filled with goose bumps, 371 00:24:23,080 --> 00:24:26,880 Speaker 1: and especially when the young boy was saying, I flew 372 00:24:26,920 --> 00:24:31,439 Speaker 1: the course air my plane got hit. He's experiencing it 373 00:24:31,840 --> 00:24:37,240 Speaker 1: first person and he's just little, so that points to reincarnation. 374 00:24:37,760 --> 00:24:43,120 Speaker 1: I also know from my own experience doing mediumship and 375 00:24:43,560 --> 00:24:48,960 Speaker 1: experiencing what it's like for a discarnate person to work 376 00:24:49,080 --> 00:24:53,600 Speaker 1: through me, I actually feel like I am that person. 377 00:24:54,320 --> 00:24:57,760 Speaker 1: I feel the emotion, I feel the love for the recipient. 378 00:24:58,359 --> 00:25:02,280 Speaker 1: I feel memories as if or my own. So again, 379 00:25:02,600 --> 00:25:07,000 Speaker 1: this could point to this young boy being highly mediumistic 380 00:25:07,480 --> 00:25:11,600 Speaker 1: and feeling those feelings. Doesn't really matter though, does it, 381 00:25:12,160 --> 00:25:15,679 Speaker 1: because it points to life after death. So we'll be 382 00:25:15,680 --> 00:25:18,200 Speaker 1: back with more stories in just a minute. If you're 383 00:25:18,240 --> 00:25:21,200 Speaker 1: listening to Shades of the Afterlife on the I Heart 384 00:25:21,320 --> 00:25:44,080 Speaker 1: Radio and Coast to Coast AM Paranormal Podcast Network, welcome 385 00:25:44,080 --> 00:25:47,440 Speaker 1: back to Shades of the Afterlife. I'm Sandra Champlain. Now 386 00:25:47,480 --> 00:25:50,120 Speaker 1: I encourage you to go check out the books by 387 00:25:50,240 --> 00:25:54,040 Speaker 1: Jim B. Tucker, m D. He's the fellow you heard 388 00:25:54,080 --> 00:25:57,439 Speaker 1: from just before the Break who is pioneering this field 389 00:25:57,600 --> 00:26:01,520 Speaker 1: of children's memories. His lay this book is called Before 390 00:26:02,160 --> 00:26:06,040 Speaker 1: Children's Memories of Previous Lives, and it's actually a two 391 00:26:06,080 --> 00:26:09,520 Speaker 1: in one book because he's combined his two books, life 392 00:26:09,560 --> 00:26:13,920 Speaker 1: before Life and returned to Life in one book. So 393 00:26:14,240 --> 00:26:18,560 Speaker 1: I'm reading the book and there's some extraordinary stories, but 394 00:26:18,680 --> 00:26:21,520 Speaker 1: one that's really caught my eye is about a five 395 00:26:21,600 --> 00:26:25,719 Speaker 1: year old boy named Ryan. Ryan's father is a policeman 396 00:26:26,119 --> 00:26:29,800 Speaker 1: and his mother works for the County Clerk's office, and 397 00:26:29,840 --> 00:26:33,280 Speaker 1: little Ryan kept telling these stories as if he was 398 00:26:33,400 --> 00:26:38,800 Speaker 1: someone else. The wife was exploring reincarnation. The parents ended 399 00:26:38,880 --> 00:26:41,639 Speaker 1: up getting into a big fight about it, because you 400 00:26:41,680 --> 00:26:45,560 Speaker 1: know who believes in reincarnation, and the little boy overheard 401 00:26:45,560 --> 00:26:49,040 Speaker 1: the fight, and so the father ended up comforting his 402 00:26:49,200 --> 00:26:52,440 Speaker 1: son and said, you can tell me anything. And so 403 00:26:52,840 --> 00:26:55,840 Speaker 1: these are in the words of the wife, and her 404 00:26:55,920 --> 00:26:59,640 Speaker 1: name is Cindy. Ryan left for a moment after our 405 00:26:59,680 --> 00:27:03,440 Speaker 1: fight and came back carrying a big book about Hollywood. 406 00:27:04,119 --> 00:27:07,720 Speaker 1: He crawled up beside my husband Kevin, and thumbed through 407 00:27:07,760 --> 00:27:11,320 Speaker 1: the thick pages until he found a picture that he 408 00:27:11,400 --> 00:27:15,560 Speaker 1: was so excited to show his daddy. See, daddy, Mommy 409 00:27:15,640 --> 00:27:19,920 Speaker 1: got this book. She found me that's me and that's George. 410 00:27:20,119 --> 00:27:23,320 Speaker 1: And we did a picture together, he said, pointing at 411 00:27:23,359 --> 00:27:27,159 Speaker 1: two men in a photo of six. The me was 412 00:27:27,200 --> 00:27:30,639 Speaker 1: on the far right in a bowler hat, and George 413 00:27:30,680 --> 00:27:34,359 Speaker 1: was second from the left. The photo caption was on 414 00:27:34,400 --> 00:27:37,760 Speaker 1: the far edge of the opposite page, saying the still 415 00:27:37,960 --> 00:27:42,120 Speaker 1: was from a nineteen thirty two movie called Night after Night, 416 00:27:42,640 --> 00:27:46,760 Speaker 1: starring George Raft, who Marian had pointed to. It was 417 00:27:46,840 --> 00:27:51,640 Speaker 1: May West's first film. Kevin was speechless, his face full 418 00:27:51,680 --> 00:27:55,200 Speaker 1: of questions. Ryan talked for a few minutes and said 419 00:27:55,240 --> 00:27:57,800 Speaker 1: that he loved both of us and he was glad 420 00:27:57,840 --> 00:28:00,960 Speaker 1: he could finally tell us both about the old me. 421 00:28:01,640 --> 00:28:03,560 Speaker 1: Then he asked if he could go into the living 422 00:28:03,640 --> 00:28:07,480 Speaker 1: room and watch cartoons. I had explained to my husband 423 00:28:07,720 --> 00:28:11,440 Speaker 1: everything I had been holding back for months. Ryan had 424 00:28:11,480 --> 00:28:13,840 Speaker 1: told me one night that he had a secret, and 425 00:28:13,880 --> 00:28:16,320 Speaker 1: he was pretty sure that it was a secret he 426 00:28:16,400 --> 00:28:19,919 Speaker 1: wasn't supposed to tell. He knew that he used to 427 00:28:19,960 --> 00:28:23,199 Speaker 1: be somebody else. He was another person who was a 428 00:28:23,280 --> 00:28:26,840 Speaker 1: movie star and lived in Hollywood. He was rich, and 429 00:28:26,880 --> 00:28:29,560 Speaker 1: he lived in a big house with a large swimming 430 00:28:29,600 --> 00:28:33,080 Speaker 1: pool in the yard. The house had been full of children. 431 00:28:33,640 --> 00:28:37,080 Speaker 1: In fact, he had had three boys. He didn't think 432 00:28:37,080 --> 00:28:40,160 Speaker 1: that the boys were his but gave them his name 433 00:28:40,600 --> 00:28:44,080 Speaker 1: because no one else could. He had been in movies 434 00:28:44,160 --> 00:28:47,360 Speaker 1: and had driven a green car. He went to fancy 435 00:28:47,400 --> 00:28:50,840 Speaker 1: parties with the Cowboy man, the guy who had the 436 00:28:50,880 --> 00:28:54,560 Speaker 1: horse that did tricks. This man was his buddy and 437 00:28:54,640 --> 00:28:58,240 Speaker 1: was also in the movie. The Cowboy had also done 438 00:28:58,280 --> 00:29:02,120 Speaker 1: all of those cigarette commercials. So Cindy the wife ended 439 00:29:02,200 --> 00:29:05,120 Speaker 1: up buying a bunch of Hollywood books and bringing them home. 440 00:29:05,920 --> 00:29:09,040 Speaker 1: I never imagined finding a picture of a man that 441 00:29:09,280 --> 00:29:13,080 Speaker 1: Ryan would say was him. That never even occurred to me, 442 00:29:13,360 --> 00:29:16,560 Speaker 1: but it happened, just as he had shown Kevin that night. 443 00:29:17,480 --> 00:29:20,200 Speaker 1: Ryan had pointed to the same photo a few weeks ago, 444 00:29:20,640 --> 00:29:24,360 Speaker 1: saying the same thing. You found me, Mama, You found me. 445 00:29:24,680 --> 00:29:27,640 Speaker 1: That's me, and that's George, and we did a picture together. 446 00:29:28,240 --> 00:29:30,840 Speaker 1: With the passing weeks. He knew small things and he 447 00:29:30,920 --> 00:29:34,440 Speaker 1: knew big things, things like I hated cats, or I 448 00:29:34,560 --> 00:29:37,520 Speaker 1: used to travel on big boats because that's how you 449 00:29:37,600 --> 00:29:40,880 Speaker 1: got to see the world on a big boat. Most nights, 450 00:29:40,960 --> 00:29:44,240 Speaker 1: his concern seemed to be what happened to the children, 451 00:29:44,560 --> 00:29:47,840 Speaker 1: and what was his mother's name. He just couldn't remember. 452 00:29:48,160 --> 00:29:52,400 Speaker 1: He knew she had short, dark, curly hair, Kevin suggested 453 00:29:52,440 --> 00:29:55,560 Speaker 1: we looked for clips of Night after Night on YouTube. 454 00:29:56,120 --> 00:29:58,400 Speaker 1: Even though it was such an old movie, he was 455 00:29:58,440 --> 00:30:01,440 Speaker 1: able to find the whole thing. We went into the 456 00:30:01,520 --> 00:30:03,800 Speaker 1: kitchen and pulled up two chairs in front of the 457 00:30:03,840 --> 00:30:07,040 Speaker 1: computer and began to watch. When it came to the 458 00:30:07,160 --> 00:30:11,320 Speaker 1: brief portion with the man from Ryan's photo, we stared 459 00:30:11,360 --> 00:30:15,360 Speaker 1: at it in silence. The actor in question never spoke 460 00:30:15,400 --> 00:30:19,240 Speaker 1: a word. Kevin then called Ryan into the kitchen and 461 00:30:19,360 --> 00:30:22,280 Speaker 1: had him watch some of the film for the first time. 462 00:30:22,880 --> 00:30:25,400 Speaker 1: We came to the part that showed the men opening 463 00:30:25,480 --> 00:30:30,480 Speaker 1: up a closet stocked with guns. Ryan had remembered this earlier. 464 00:30:31,040 --> 00:30:33,600 Speaker 1: He had already told me that while making the movie, 465 00:30:34,040 --> 00:30:37,040 Speaker 1: they had all helped to carry the guns and load 466 00:30:37,120 --> 00:30:40,920 Speaker 1: them into the closet. Ryan went on then to tell 467 00:30:41,040 --> 00:30:45,760 Speaker 1: Kevin excitedly about the closet being full from top to bottom. 468 00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:49,320 Speaker 1: His little face was completely animated because now he knew 469 00:30:49,440 --> 00:30:52,160 Speaker 1: that I was okay to tell Daddy and I everything. 470 00:30:52,840 --> 00:30:55,760 Speaker 1: Kevin and I watched the rest, and the actor whom 471 00:30:55,880 --> 00:31:00,719 Speaker 1: Ryan pointed was only in one other short scene, also 472 00:31:00,760 --> 00:31:05,040 Speaker 1: without lines. This meant he was an extra, meaning that 473 00:31:05,120 --> 00:31:09,080 Speaker 1: none of the names mentioned in the credits belonged to him, 474 00:31:09,120 --> 00:31:12,600 Speaker 1: so we had no idea who he was. Often it 475 00:31:12,680 --> 00:31:16,040 Speaker 1: was like working a jigsaw puzzle. Sometimes there would be 476 00:31:16,240 --> 00:31:19,880 Speaker 1: full of stories about dances on the stages of New 477 00:31:19,960 --> 00:31:23,360 Speaker 1: York with his buddies, how the little man who ran 478 00:31:23,440 --> 00:31:26,560 Speaker 1: the Chinese restaurant had become his friend and taught him 479 00:31:26,560 --> 00:31:29,200 Speaker 1: how to meditate, what it was like to have an 480 00:31:29,280 --> 00:31:31,880 Speaker 1: endless supply of money and to be able to travel 481 00:31:31,920 --> 00:31:35,280 Speaker 1: the world. He said he knew Rita Hayworth, whom he 482 00:31:35,320 --> 00:31:38,320 Speaker 1: saw in a photo, and that she made ice drinks. 483 00:31:39,000 --> 00:31:43,440 Speaker 1: Other times they were just fragmented statements. Although he often 484 00:31:43,480 --> 00:31:46,760 Speaker 1: talked like a grown up, we must remember that Ryan 485 00:31:47,000 --> 00:31:51,080 Speaker 1: was only five years old. One day he began doing 486 00:31:51,120 --> 00:31:53,760 Speaker 1: a tap dance routine in the middle of the floor, 487 00:31:54,000 --> 00:31:57,360 Speaker 1: saying tip tap, tip tap, as if he was keeping 488 00:31:57,360 --> 00:32:00,320 Speaker 1: a beat for himself. He said he remembered how to 489 00:32:00,400 --> 00:32:02,320 Speaker 1: do it and asked if I would get him some 490 00:32:02,400 --> 00:32:05,920 Speaker 1: tap shoes. I heard some music today on a cartoon 491 00:32:06,040 --> 00:32:08,880 Speaker 1: and it made me remember how to dance because it 492 00:32:08,960 --> 00:32:11,920 Speaker 1: reminded me of one of the songs we used to use, 493 00:32:12,000 --> 00:32:15,560 Speaker 1: He explained. He would also cry for me to buy 494 00:32:15,680 --> 00:32:20,000 Speaker 1: agent clothes, ties, suits, dress, shirts and clothes that were 495 00:32:20,040 --> 00:32:24,280 Speaker 1: not appropriate for everyday dress for little boys. He wanted 496 00:32:24,320 --> 00:32:28,040 Speaker 1: black rimmed agent glasses. He took a pair of kids 497 00:32:28,160 --> 00:32:31,480 Speaker 1: three D movie glasses and popped the lenses out and 498 00:32:31,560 --> 00:32:35,080 Speaker 1: wore them everywhere. One day, he was talking to me 499 00:32:35,120 --> 00:32:38,680 Speaker 1: again about Hollywood, Mommy, I don't want to be an actor, 500 00:32:39,120 --> 00:32:42,080 Speaker 1: and I don't want to go back there. Hollywood is 501 00:32:42,120 --> 00:32:45,560 Speaker 1: scary and I just want to be Ryan. But then 502 00:32:45,760 --> 00:32:49,000 Speaker 1: later that night he cried for about thirty minutes before 503 00:32:49,040 --> 00:32:51,960 Speaker 1: going to sleep, telling me over and over that he 504 00:32:52,080 --> 00:32:55,800 Speaker 1: was homesick. A few weeks later, I had one of 505 00:32:55,840 --> 00:32:59,280 Speaker 1: the more important conversations with Ryan when we went to 506 00:32:59,400 --> 00:33:03,160 Speaker 1: visit my brother's grave at the local cemetery. Ryan told 507 00:33:03,200 --> 00:33:06,480 Speaker 1: me that he had been in a graveyard before because 508 00:33:06,520 --> 00:33:09,480 Speaker 1: his buddy had to go to the graveyard to see 509 00:33:09,840 --> 00:33:15,760 Speaker 1: Senator five. I asked, Ryan, who is Senator five? He 510 00:33:15,880 --> 00:33:18,200 Speaker 1: was the meanest villain that you would ever want to 511 00:33:18,240 --> 00:33:22,000 Speaker 1: meet when me and my buddy worked for the agency 512 00:33:22,040 --> 00:33:27,080 Speaker 1: they were investigating him. He was one dirty, mean guy. Ryan, 513 00:33:27,360 --> 00:33:30,400 Speaker 1: was this while you were in Hollywood? Mom? I don't 514 00:33:30,480 --> 00:33:33,480 Speaker 1: think you really want to hear about Senator five. I'm 515 00:33:33,560 --> 00:33:37,040 Speaker 1: not talking about one of my films. This happened, but 516 00:33:37,160 --> 00:33:41,640 Speaker 1: the graveyard wasn't in Hollywood. It was somewhere else. We 517 00:33:41,680 --> 00:33:44,959 Speaker 1: had been home about two hours when Ryan asked to 518 00:33:45,000 --> 00:33:48,360 Speaker 1: see a map of the United States. Then he pointed 519 00:33:48,400 --> 00:33:51,560 Speaker 1: to New York. Mom, that's where we went to meet 520 00:33:51,760 --> 00:33:55,400 Speaker 1: Senator five. I wonder if they ever got him. We 521 00:33:55,560 --> 00:33:59,520 Speaker 1: never did. The agency wanted him, the police wanted him, 522 00:33:59,760 --> 00:34:03,320 Speaker 1: but we never got him. Ryan said he saw Senator 523 00:34:03,440 --> 00:34:06,480 Speaker 1: Five's face at night when he was asleep, and at 524 00:34:06,520 --> 00:34:09,520 Speaker 1: that moment I knew exactly that was what was haunting 525 00:34:09,560 --> 00:34:14,320 Speaker 1: my child's dreams. Ryan always seemed to be looking over 526 00:34:14,360 --> 00:34:18,680 Speaker 1: his shoulder somehow, being frightened a Senator five, whether he 527 00:34:18,719 --> 00:34:22,440 Speaker 1: was real or fantasy. On April seventeenth, we had our 528 00:34:22,480 --> 00:34:25,640 Speaker 1: meeting with doctor Jim Tucker, who was just as pleasant 529 00:34:25,640 --> 00:34:28,600 Speaker 1: as I had imagined he would be. During the interview, 530 00:34:28,640 --> 00:34:31,759 Speaker 1: he asked me if I believed that the agency could 531 00:34:31,840 --> 00:34:35,840 Speaker 1: all be make believe. I told him that the agency 532 00:34:36,040 --> 00:34:39,200 Speaker 1: was the one thing Ryan was certain of. He had 533 00:34:39,280 --> 00:34:42,880 Speaker 1: been an agent with an agency that had been involved 534 00:34:42,920 --> 00:34:47,960 Speaker 1: in changing people's names. A television show called The Unexplained, 535 00:34:48,320 --> 00:34:52,680 Speaker 1: which was covering Dr Tucker's work was interested in Ryan's case. 536 00:34:53,320 --> 00:34:55,720 Speaker 1: They thought they knew who the man in the bowler 537 00:34:55,760 --> 00:34:59,239 Speaker 1: hat was, but when they showed us a picture of him, 538 00:34:59,440 --> 00:35:02,919 Speaker 1: Ryan thought it was the wrong man. Dr Tucker wasn't 539 00:35:02,920 --> 00:35:06,440 Speaker 1: convinced either, But when they offered to take Ryan to Hollywood, 540 00:35:06,880 --> 00:35:10,600 Speaker 1: Ryan was intensely excited, so we decided to go. But 541 00:35:10,680 --> 00:35:14,120 Speaker 1: it was a disaster because Ryan didn't react to any 542 00:35:14,160 --> 00:35:17,120 Speaker 1: of the locations they took him to, except for that 543 00:35:17,280 --> 00:35:21,279 Speaker 1: of his cowboyfriend from the movie, whom we identified as 544 00:35:21,360 --> 00:35:24,680 Speaker 1: wild Bill Elliott. They did not treat us well and 545 00:35:24,719 --> 00:35:28,800 Speaker 1: we returned emotionally drained, feeling we had wasted our time. 546 00:35:29,440 --> 00:35:32,360 Speaker 1: A few months later, I received a call from Russ Stratton, 547 00:35:32,719 --> 00:35:37,480 Speaker 1: a very excited executive producer for The Unexplained, who said 548 00:35:37,560 --> 00:35:40,680 Speaker 1: they had had a breakthrough on Ryan's case. He had 549 00:35:40,760 --> 00:35:44,520 Speaker 1: hired a Hollywood historian to go through the archives at 550 00:35:44,560 --> 00:35:49,080 Speaker 1: the Academy Emotion, Picture, Arts and Science Library in order 551 00:35:49,120 --> 00:35:52,440 Speaker 1: to identify the man in the picture. He had already 552 00:35:52,440 --> 00:35:55,960 Speaker 1: contacted Dr Tucker and they were interested in visiting with 553 00:35:56,120 --> 00:36:00,239 Speaker 1: us with a different camera crew. He couldn't disclose much 554 00:36:00,280 --> 00:36:04,520 Speaker 1: information because he didn't want to taint the investigation. Process. 555 00:36:04,719 --> 00:36:08,840 Speaker 1: Neither did Dr Tucker. Cindy. I have been producing television 556 00:36:08,880 --> 00:36:12,280 Speaker 1: shows for ten years, and this is the most extraordinary 557 00:36:12,320 --> 00:36:15,759 Speaker 1: thing that I have ever seen, he told me. When 558 00:36:15,760 --> 00:36:19,000 Speaker 1: the team arrived the following week, Ryan warmed up to 559 00:36:19,120 --> 00:36:22,800 Speaker 1: Russ and instantly liked him. As part of the process, 560 00:36:22,800 --> 00:36:26,480 Speaker 1: with the cameras rolling, Dr Tucker laid out four black 561 00:36:26,480 --> 00:36:30,040 Speaker 1: and white pictures on our table. All of them were 562 00:36:30,080 --> 00:36:33,600 Speaker 1: pretty women, and the pictures look similar to one another. 563 00:36:34,320 --> 00:36:37,040 Speaker 1: He then asked Ryan if any of them looked familiar 564 00:36:37,080 --> 00:36:40,880 Speaker 1: to him. Ryan instantly pointed to one of the unmarked 565 00:36:40,880 --> 00:36:45,359 Speaker 1: photos and stated that one she looks familiar. I saw 566 00:36:45,480 --> 00:36:49,200 Speaker 1: Dr Tucker smile widen, and I asked nervously who is she. 567 00:36:50,239 --> 00:36:55,239 Speaker 1: Dr Tucker replied she was his wife. Ryan grinned and 568 00:36:55,280 --> 00:36:58,840 Speaker 1: shook his head with gratification. Ryan then picked out a 569 00:36:58,880 --> 00:37:02,719 Speaker 1: picture of his previous his family. He the man in 570 00:37:02,719 --> 00:37:05,480 Speaker 1: the bowler hat was not in the photo, but it 571 00:37:05,560 --> 00:37:10,280 Speaker 1: showed his wife, two step daughters, the three adopted sons, 572 00:37:10,760 --> 00:37:15,400 Speaker 1: and insert of the biological daughter. But the most shocking 573 00:37:15,880 --> 00:37:19,360 Speaker 1: was when Dr Tucker laid out another group of pictures, 574 00:37:19,800 --> 00:37:23,920 Speaker 1: all of older men in suits. Ryan didn't need any 575 00:37:23,960 --> 00:37:28,000 Speaker 1: time with these. Despite Dr Tucker's instructions to take his 576 00:37:28,080 --> 00:37:31,359 Speaker 1: time and think about them, he quickly pointed to one 577 00:37:31,400 --> 00:37:36,359 Speaker 1: and said, that's Senator five. Dr Tucker then told us 578 00:37:36,800 --> 00:37:40,640 Speaker 1: the man in the photo was New York Senator i'ves 579 00:37:41,880 --> 00:37:44,080 Speaker 1: we'll be back in just a minute. You're listening to 580 00:37:44,400 --> 00:37:47,400 Speaker 1: Shades of the Afterlife on the I Heart Radio and 581 00:37:47,520 --> 00:38:09,600 Speaker 1: Coast to Coast, a m paranormal podcast network. Welcome back 582 00:38:09,640 --> 00:38:13,120 Speaker 1: to Shades of the Afterlife. I'm Sandra Champlain and we're 583 00:38:13,160 --> 00:38:19,040 Speaker 1: talking about reincarnation and a really fantastic story of five 584 00:38:19,160 --> 00:38:24,160 Speaker 1: year old Ryan who had a ton of memories of 585 00:38:24,200 --> 00:38:27,200 Speaker 1: a past life of someone else. And so where we 586 00:38:27,320 --> 00:38:31,840 Speaker 1: left off was Ryan was convinced of a bad man 587 00:38:32,320 --> 00:38:36,840 Speaker 1: and he called him Senator five. And Dr Jim Tucker 588 00:38:37,000 --> 00:38:40,160 Speaker 1: was actually able to prove that there was a New 589 00:38:40,239 --> 00:38:45,120 Speaker 1: York Senator named Ives I V. E. S. And when 590 00:38:45,120 --> 00:38:49,040 Speaker 1: he told Ryan about it, Ryan actually got upset and 591 00:38:49,080 --> 00:38:52,479 Speaker 1: he said, I missed his name by one stupid letter. 592 00:38:53,400 --> 00:38:56,239 Speaker 1: So the next thing that happened was Bryan was presented 593 00:38:56,640 --> 00:39:00,600 Speaker 1: four photos of a young man in tennis clothes, three 594 00:39:00,640 --> 00:39:04,000 Speaker 1: of them holding a racket. He pointed to one and 595 00:39:04,160 --> 00:39:07,279 Speaker 1: said it was familiar. It was the man in the 596 00:39:07,320 --> 00:39:11,840 Speaker 1: bowler hat at a young age. Then finally, Dr Tucker 597 00:39:11,960 --> 00:39:15,959 Speaker 1: asked Kevin the father, to read the four names out 598 00:39:16,000 --> 00:39:21,160 Speaker 1: loud and asked Ryan to choose one. He read them 599 00:39:21,280 --> 00:39:31,400 Speaker 1: very slowly, John Johnson, Willie Wilson, Marty Martin, Robert Robertson. 600 00:39:32,680 --> 00:39:35,920 Speaker 1: Ryan shook his head no for the first two and 601 00:39:36,040 --> 00:39:41,080 Speaker 1: the fourth, but did not respond at all to Marty Martin. 602 00:39:42,280 --> 00:39:46,959 Speaker 1: At the end, he said, this name was the one. 603 00:39:48,320 --> 00:39:51,600 Speaker 1: Doctor Tucker told us he was right, This was the 604 00:39:51,719 --> 00:39:55,319 Speaker 1: name of the man in the photo. He proceeded to 605 00:39:55,360 --> 00:39:58,640 Speaker 1: go over many of the memories Ryan had, which had 606 00:39:58,680 --> 00:40:01,480 Speaker 1: been written down and had been in front of him, 607 00:40:01,560 --> 00:40:04,680 Speaker 1: and told us they were correct. For the life of 608 00:40:04,719 --> 00:40:09,600 Speaker 1: this man, Marty had indeed been an agent. He ran 609 00:40:10,080 --> 00:40:16,160 Speaker 1: Marty Martin Talent Agency, representing some of Hollywood's leading stars, 610 00:40:16,880 --> 00:40:21,080 Speaker 1: most of whom had changed their names. Marty died on 611 00:40:21,200 --> 00:40:25,399 Speaker 1: Christmas Day in nineteen sixty four, when he was sixty one. 612 00:40:25,520 --> 00:40:29,720 Speaker 1: In the hospital. I was stunned. I remembered that Ryan 613 00:40:29,840 --> 00:40:32,760 Speaker 1: had said one day that he didn't know why God 614 00:40:33,080 --> 00:40:35,799 Speaker 1: would let you get to sixty one and then make 615 00:40:35,840 --> 00:40:39,440 Speaker 1: you come back again as a baby. This was written 616 00:40:39,640 --> 00:40:43,600 Speaker 1: on April two in my journal. A few days before, 617 00:40:43,880 --> 00:40:46,120 Speaker 1: when we were in the hospital when I had some 618 00:40:46,160 --> 00:40:48,799 Speaker 1: tests done, he had said that you have to go 619 00:40:48,880 --> 00:40:51,839 Speaker 1: to a room with numbers on the door before you die. 620 00:40:52,520 --> 00:40:54,840 Speaker 1: At that time I had no idea what that meant, 621 00:40:55,400 --> 00:40:58,680 Speaker 1: but now it was clear that Marty's hospital door would 622 00:40:58,680 --> 00:41:02,120 Speaker 1: have had a number on it. When the film crew left, 623 00:41:02,400 --> 00:41:05,480 Speaker 1: Ryan and I sat alone in what became a very 624 00:41:05,600 --> 00:41:09,480 Speaker 1: private time for both of us. They had left pictures 625 00:41:09,520 --> 00:41:12,959 Speaker 1: for him to keep. In fact, Russ had made Ryan 626 00:41:13,080 --> 00:41:17,000 Speaker 1: a complete book filled with photos and even an old 627 00:41:17,080 --> 00:41:22,120 Speaker 1: sheet that contained vital statistic records that verified that he 628 00:41:22,239 --> 00:41:25,800 Speaker 1: had indeed changed his name just as he had said, 629 00:41:26,360 --> 00:41:30,080 Speaker 1: and that there had been two sisters. Their ages were 630 00:41:30,160 --> 00:41:34,200 Speaker 1: scrawled out along with their names in an early handwritten 631 00:41:34,640 --> 00:41:39,200 Speaker 1: nine hundred census form. The sister he had loved so 632 00:41:39,280 --> 00:41:42,520 Speaker 1: much was in some of the photos with him dancing 633 00:41:42,560 --> 00:41:46,160 Speaker 1: on the stages of New York. In fact, she had 634 00:41:46,239 --> 00:41:49,840 Speaker 1: lived in Paris, dancing there at a young age, and 635 00:41:49,880 --> 00:41:52,360 Speaker 1: there were photos of Marty in front of the Paris 636 00:41:52,480 --> 00:41:55,960 Speaker 1: landmarks like the Eiffel Tower when he had visited her. 637 00:41:56,840 --> 00:41:59,480 Speaker 1: There were even some photos of the big fancy boats 638 00:41:59,560 --> 00:42:03,040 Speaker 1: that he used to get there. Seeing the photo of 639 00:42:03,080 --> 00:42:08,000 Speaker 1: the oldest stepdaughter gave Ran a headache. He became furious 640 00:42:08,040 --> 00:42:12,719 Speaker 1: as he said she had no respect, no respect. He 641 00:42:12,800 --> 00:42:14,719 Speaker 1: was quick to let me know that he had no 642 00:42:14,840 --> 00:42:19,640 Speaker 1: desire to see her again ever at all. The photos 643 00:42:19,640 --> 00:42:23,000 Speaker 1: were powerful for Ryan. He loved the ones that showed 644 00:42:23,040 --> 00:42:26,920 Speaker 1: Marty as young and handsome. He wasn't pleased at all 645 00:42:26,960 --> 00:42:29,440 Speaker 1: to see the ones that showed him older and bald. 646 00:42:30,280 --> 00:42:34,040 Speaker 1: He would say, let's go back to those ones. Before then, 647 00:42:34,080 --> 00:42:36,879 Speaker 1: he told me that he hoped that he didn't lose 648 00:42:36,960 --> 00:42:40,080 Speaker 1: his hair this time around like he had last time. 649 00:42:41,040 --> 00:42:45,120 Speaker 1: The producer told us that they had contacted Marty Martin's 650 00:42:45,320 --> 00:42:49,279 Speaker 1: one biological child and she had agreed to meet with 651 00:42:49,400 --> 00:42:52,560 Speaker 1: us at a neutral spot. She was only eight years 652 00:42:52,600 --> 00:42:55,279 Speaker 1: old when her father died, so we really were not 653 00:42:55,440 --> 00:42:58,200 Speaker 1: sure just how much she would be able to tell us, 654 00:42:58,920 --> 00:43:02,160 Speaker 1: but we all felt it would be worthwhile, even though 655 00:43:02,160 --> 00:43:05,360 Speaker 1: I suspected it would be hard for Ryan to see 656 00:43:05,400 --> 00:43:09,480 Speaker 1: his previous young daughter now old enough to be his grandmother. 657 00:43:10,640 --> 00:43:14,280 Speaker 1: The trip was planned for August, a month pasted Ryan's 658 00:43:14,320 --> 00:43:18,680 Speaker 1: sixth birthday. Ryan was very shy when we were with Marty, 659 00:43:18,760 --> 00:43:22,120 Speaker 1: Martin's daughter. He didn't want to talk much to her 660 00:43:22,400 --> 00:43:24,520 Speaker 1: and stayed out of the room most of the time. 661 00:43:25,360 --> 00:43:28,319 Speaker 1: Now in her fifties, she was agreeable and tried to 662 00:43:28,320 --> 00:43:31,880 Speaker 1: be helpful. She was able to confirm many of the 663 00:43:31,920 --> 00:43:35,320 Speaker 1: details that Ryan had provided and that I had written 664 00:43:35,360 --> 00:43:39,319 Speaker 1: down in my journal for Dr Tucker's files. They were 665 00:43:39,360 --> 00:43:42,600 Speaker 1: the small personal things, like he did drive a green 666 00:43:42,680 --> 00:43:46,879 Speaker 1: car and nobody else was allowed to drive it but him. 667 00:43:47,000 --> 00:43:50,520 Speaker 1: Ryan had claimed that his address had the word rock 668 00:43:50,960 --> 00:43:55,799 Speaker 1: or mountain it and they lived on Roxbury Drive. Her 669 00:43:55,840 --> 00:43:59,319 Speaker 1: father hated cats and never allowed her to have one 670 00:43:59,360 --> 00:44:02,680 Speaker 1: as a child, but instead he had bought her a dog, 671 00:44:03,080 --> 00:44:06,520 Speaker 1: and she admitted that she hated the dog, just as 672 00:44:06,600 --> 00:44:10,960 Speaker 1: Ryan had told me previously. Marty had had an extensive 673 00:44:11,040 --> 00:44:15,879 Speaker 1: collection of sunglasses, and there was more. She answered all 674 00:44:15,920 --> 00:44:18,880 Speaker 1: of the questions as best she could, at least the 675 00:44:18,920 --> 00:44:22,600 Speaker 1: ones that she could remember. When we went to Marty's home, 676 00:44:23,000 --> 00:44:25,840 Speaker 1: it had been partially torn down and was in the 677 00:44:25,880 --> 00:44:30,040 Speaker 1: process of renovation, but the swimming pool was still there, 678 00:44:30,560 --> 00:44:35,040 Speaker 1: and Ryan smiled during the whole trip. He seemed so 679 00:44:35,120 --> 00:44:38,880 Speaker 1: relieved that he finally had proof that he hadn't just 680 00:44:39,000 --> 00:44:42,439 Speaker 1: made it all up. The most amazing part was when 681 00:44:42,480 --> 00:44:45,800 Speaker 1: we got back to the building where Marty Martin Talent 682 00:44:45,840 --> 00:44:49,480 Speaker 1: Agency had been. It was a beautiful old building and 683 00:44:49,560 --> 00:44:54,680 Speaker 1: downtown Beverly Hills, with a chandelier in the entryway. The 684 00:44:54,800 --> 00:44:57,759 Speaker 1: offices were locked, but we were still able to walk 685 00:44:57,800 --> 00:45:01,880 Speaker 1: around inside this ceilings were some of the most beautiful 686 00:45:01,960 --> 00:45:05,440 Speaker 1: that I had ever seen. Ryan ran up the stairs 687 00:45:05,480 --> 00:45:07,959 Speaker 1: so he could show his dad how you could sit 688 00:45:08,040 --> 00:45:12,120 Speaker 1: out on the roof and smoke. At one point he 689 00:45:12,200 --> 00:45:15,279 Speaker 1: sat on the window sill and just smiled, taking it 690 00:45:15,360 --> 00:45:18,600 Speaker 1: all in. He would have just sat there all day 691 00:45:18,719 --> 00:45:21,759 Speaker 1: if we had let him. He didn't say much, but 692 00:45:21,920 --> 00:45:27,600 Speaker 1: his face said everything. We returned home with a different outlook. 693 00:45:28,160 --> 00:45:32,120 Speaker 1: Marty's daughter sent us many photos which we had seen 694 00:45:32,520 --> 00:45:36,360 Speaker 1: when we were there, of her father, mother, herself, and 695 00:45:36,400 --> 00:45:40,480 Speaker 1: their home. Some showed Marty at the beach or in Paris, 696 00:45:41,040 --> 00:45:43,880 Speaker 1: or holding his daughter when she was about two years old. 697 00:45:44,760 --> 00:45:47,600 Speaker 1: We also had pictures of the Rolls Royce which his 698 00:45:47,680 --> 00:45:51,600 Speaker 1: wife drove, the piano in the house, and her with 699 00:45:51,680 --> 00:45:56,240 Speaker 1: the dog Marty gave her since he hated cats. Ryan 700 00:45:56,360 --> 00:45:59,799 Speaker 1: was relieved of a lot of uncertainty and seemed better 701 00:45:59,840 --> 00:46:03,399 Speaker 1: able to live in the present as Ryan. He had 702 00:46:03,400 --> 00:46:06,279 Speaker 1: been able to prove that he was right and that 703 00:46:06,400 --> 00:46:10,040 Speaker 1: there really had been an old me who matched his stories. 704 00:46:10,920 --> 00:46:13,680 Speaker 1: For the most part, he was content to believe that 705 00:46:13,760 --> 00:46:17,560 Speaker 1: now he could leave the past behind and enjoy his 706 00:46:17,640 --> 00:46:22,120 Speaker 1: new life. He seemed more peaceful. He still talked about 707 00:46:22,160 --> 00:46:26,960 Speaker 1: memories somewhat, but less and less over time. I felt 708 00:46:27,160 --> 00:46:30,320 Speaker 1: as if we had finished now, we had an ending. 709 00:46:31,160 --> 00:46:34,080 Speaker 1: The day I walked through the agency building with Ryan 710 00:46:34,440 --> 00:46:37,920 Speaker 1: forever changed my life. I saw a small boy act 711 00:46:38,080 --> 00:46:42,160 Speaker 1: as if he were truly returning home after a long journey. 712 00:46:42,360 --> 00:46:45,480 Speaker 1: The sadness was gone, and his whole face was lit 713 00:46:45,560 --> 00:46:48,279 Speaker 1: up with joy. I didn't know what to make of it, 714 00:46:48,360 --> 00:46:51,600 Speaker 1: but it made me feel as if anything was possible. 715 00:46:52,680 --> 00:46:55,239 Speaker 1: And just a little side note, when this was all 716 00:46:55,320 --> 00:46:59,839 Speaker 1: said and done with, fifty five memories were actually VERI 717 00:47:00,040 --> 00:47:04,840 Speaker 1: fied about the life of Marty Martin. Here's just a few. 718 00:47:05,280 --> 00:47:08,680 Speaker 1: He lived in Hollywood. He was rich, His house was big. 719 00:47:09,280 --> 00:47:12,600 Speaker 1: There were three boys. He didn't think the boys were his, 720 00:47:12,719 --> 00:47:15,400 Speaker 1: but he gave them his name. He had a daughter, 721 00:47:15,880 --> 00:47:18,600 Speaker 1: He had a very large swimming pool. His mother had 722 00:47:18,640 --> 00:47:22,560 Speaker 1: curly brown hair. He had a younger sister. He bought 723 00:47:22,680 --> 00:47:25,719 Speaker 1: his daughter a dog when she was about six. She 724 00:47:25,800 --> 00:47:31,120 Speaker 1: didn't like the dog. He hated cats. He new senator ives, 725 00:47:31,800 --> 00:47:35,960 Speaker 1: which he called five. He had a green car. He 726 00:47:36,160 --> 00:47:40,719 Speaker 1: changed people's names through his agency. He tap danced on 727 00:47:40,760 --> 00:47:44,040 Speaker 1: the stage. He went to Paris, saw the Eiffel Tower. 728 00:47:44,840 --> 00:47:48,120 Speaker 1: He did no Rita Hayworth, the woman who made ice drinks. 729 00:47:49,239 --> 00:47:53,279 Speaker 1: He was a smoker, He had a sunglass collection, and 730 00:47:54,200 --> 00:47:59,520 Speaker 1: so much more. That is an amazing story, isn't it? 731 00:48:00,000 --> 00:48:03,000 Speaker 1: Of me? Goose bumps so many times reading it to you. 732 00:48:03,600 --> 00:48:06,160 Speaker 1: I just recently did a little research about how we 733 00:48:06,239 --> 00:48:09,879 Speaker 1: live life based on what we believe, and people who 734 00:48:09,880 --> 00:48:13,520 Speaker 1: believe in reincarnation are being really good stewards of the 735 00:48:13,520 --> 00:48:16,200 Speaker 1: earth because they want a good place to come back 736 00:48:16,280 --> 00:48:22,400 Speaker 1: to again. Those who believe are recycling, keeping the environment clean, volunteering, 737 00:48:22,560 --> 00:48:26,879 Speaker 1: keeping their electric bills low, reduced waste, and so many 738 00:48:26,920 --> 00:48:31,319 Speaker 1: other things. While people that are of a belief that 739 00:48:31,400 --> 00:48:35,400 Speaker 1: they have some kind of judgment in the afterlife, the Christians, 740 00:48:35,440 --> 00:48:40,640 Speaker 1: the Muslims, the Jews, seem to concentrate more on personal 741 00:48:40,680 --> 00:48:46,040 Speaker 1: success financial independence, believing the more they achieve in this 742 00:48:46,239 --> 00:48:49,120 Speaker 1: life and the more they accomplish will be rewarded in 743 00:48:49,160 --> 00:48:52,560 Speaker 1: the next one. Here's a couple of quotes on reincarnation. 744 00:48:53,040 --> 00:48:56,480 Speaker 1: This one by J. D. Salinger. It's so silly. All 745 00:48:56,520 --> 00:48:58,320 Speaker 1: you do is get the heck out of your body 746 00:48:58,360 --> 00:49:02,080 Speaker 1: when you die. My gosh, everyone's done it a thousand times. 747 00:49:02,520 --> 00:49:05,160 Speaker 1: Just because they don't remember it doesn't mean they haven't 748 00:49:05,160 --> 00:49:08,920 Speaker 1: done it. And this one by Henry Ford. I adopted 749 00:49:08,960 --> 00:49:14,080 Speaker 1: the theory of reincarnation when I was Genius is experience. 750 00:49:14,600 --> 00:49:16,759 Speaker 1: Some seem to think that it is a gift or 751 00:49:16,760 --> 00:49:20,480 Speaker 1: a talent, but it is the fruit of long experience 752 00:49:20,640 --> 00:49:24,720 Speaker 1: in many lives. So I'm closing out this show today. 753 00:49:24,760 --> 00:49:27,440 Speaker 1: I hope you've enjoyed it. I'm not telling you what 754 00:49:27,520 --> 00:49:30,480 Speaker 1: to believe in, or really what I believe in, because 755 00:49:30,760 --> 00:49:34,279 Speaker 1: it's so much a mystery. But the bottom line is 756 00:49:34,760 --> 00:49:40,480 Speaker 1: this proves that we go on after physical death. I 757 00:49:40,560 --> 00:49:44,600 Speaker 1: encourage you to check out the books by Jim B. Tucker, 758 00:49:45,040 --> 00:49:48,840 Speaker 1: m D. And you can easily find his website Jim B. 759 00:49:49,120 --> 00:49:53,280 Speaker 1: Tucker dot com. And remember to come visit your friends 760 00:49:53,320 --> 00:49:56,800 Speaker 1: that We Don't Die dot com for our Sunday gathering 761 00:49:56,920 --> 00:50:00,360 Speaker 1: for one of our classes, for one of our demonstrate Shans, 762 00:50:01,200 --> 00:50:03,879 Speaker 1: I tell you, my friend, there's more to life than 763 00:50:04,000 --> 00:50:07,279 Speaker 1: meets the eye, and there's certainly more to you than 764 00:50:07,360 --> 00:50:11,400 Speaker 1: you know. I'm Sandra Champlain and thank you for listening 765 00:50:11,440 --> 00:50:14,960 Speaker 1: to Shades of the Afterlife on the I Heart Radio 766 00:50:15,160 --> 00:50:27,600 Speaker 1: and Coast to Coast a m paranormal podcast Network. Thanks 767 00:50:27,600 --> 00:50:29,600 Speaker 1: for listening to the I Heart Radio and Coast to 768 00:50:29,640 --> 00:50:32,600 Speaker 1: Coast Day and Paranormal Podcast Network. Make sure and check 769 00:50:32,640 --> 00:50:35,359 Speaker 1: out all our shows on the I Heart Radio app 770 00:50:35,680 --> 00:50:42,720 Speaker 1: or by going to I heart radio dot com.