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Speaker 1: Welcome to the Bloomberg Law Podcast. I'm June Grosso. Every

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Speaker 1: day we bring you insight an analysis into the most

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Speaker 1: important legal news of the day. You can find more

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Speaker 1: episodes at the Bloomberg Law Podcast, on Apple podcast, SoundCloud,

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Speaker 1: and on Bloomberg dot com slash podcasts. Chief Justice John

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Speaker 1: Roberts famously compared justices to umpires at his confirmation hearing.

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Speaker 1: Judges and justices are servants of the law, not the

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Speaker 1: other way around. Judges are like umpires. Umpires don't make

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Speaker 1: the rules, they apply them. The role of an umpire

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Speaker 1: and a judge is critical. They make sure everybody plays

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Speaker 1: by the rules, but it is a limited role. Now

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Speaker 1: Roberts finds himself in the position of making sure that

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Speaker 1: everyone plays by the rules at the impeachment trial of

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Speaker 1: President Donald Trump, which he'll preside over, pulling the Chief

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Speaker 1: into the same role that the late Chief Justice William

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Speaker 1: Rehnquist played at the ile of President Bill Clinton, but

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Speaker 1: at a far more partisan time in our history. Joining

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Speaker 1: me is Bloomberg New Supreme Court reporter Greg Store. You

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Speaker 1: spoke to Chief Justice Roberts when he was a mere

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Speaker 1: lawyer before ran Quist oversaw the impeachment of President Clinton. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that was back when I got to call him John.

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Speaker 1: He was a very successful private lawyer, and I just

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Speaker 1: asked him because he's a former law clerk to William Rehnquist,

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Speaker 1: and we hadn't had an impeachment so long, so I

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Speaker 1: asked him, how do you think that Chief Justice Renklist

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Speaker 1: is going to be able to handle things? And he

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Speaker 1: basically said, if anybody can do what, he can do it.

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Speaker 1: Chief Justice Rehnquist had written a book on impeachment, so

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Speaker 1: he knew as much about the process as anybody else,

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Speaker 1: and he managed to juggle his dual duties. He was

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Speaker 1: at the Supreme Court in the morning handling arguments and

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Speaker 1: in the Senate in the afternoon dealing with the impeachment trout.

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Speaker 1: And that's probably what John Roberts will have to do

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Speaker 1: as well. As we've discussed many times, John Roberts repeatedly

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Speaker 1: when he's at lecture or Q and as talks about

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Speaker 1: how the judiciary is above partisan politics, and now he's

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Speaker 1: going to be thrust in the center of the most

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Speaker 1: partisan trial of our time. Perhaps how will he manage that?

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Speaker 1: It's certainly something he has prided himself on, both himself

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Speaker 1: and the Supreme Court not being, as he said, part

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Speaker 1: of politics. It could be a challenge for him. It

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Speaker 1: really depends a lot on how much he's asked to do.

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Speaker 1: Back in the Clinton impeachment trial, the two sides agreed

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Speaker 1: on the basic ground rules, and what they didn't agree

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Speaker 1: on going in, they agreed to as they went along,

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Speaker 1: and that meant that William Rinqust really didn't have to

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Speaker 1: decide all that much. That could end up being the

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Speaker 1: same thing with John Roberts. But it could also be

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Speaker 1: the case that he's being asked to deal with a

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Speaker 1: lot of questions. And while it's always the case that

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Speaker 1: the Senate can override anything he decides, he's not the

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Speaker 1: final word. Um, it may be that he feels a

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Speaker 1: need to make a show of being even handed and

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Speaker 1: making sure there's a certain amount of fairness to the proceeding.

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Speaker 1: I just wonder about his image. As you mentioned in

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Speaker 1: your story, this is the first time that most people

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Speaker 1: will have heard the Chief Justice since his confirmation hearings,

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Speaker 1: and they're going to see him in this very political environment,

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Speaker 1: and I just wonder what that does to his image. Well,

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Speaker 1: it could go either way. It could drag him down

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Speaker 1: into it or it could be in the moment where

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Speaker 1: he rises above it. You know, undoubtedly all the members

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Speaker 1: of Congress who are going to be before him are

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Speaker 1: going to be acting in a very political manner. He

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Speaker 1: may appear to be the one person in the room

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Speaker 1: who's not thinking about politics. In that sense, one could

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Speaker 1: imagine it could enhance his image. On the other hand,

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Speaker 1: if he gets forced into making decisions, if he makes

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Speaker 1: controversial decisions, there is some danger that he will be

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Speaker 1: seen as taking sides. Chief Justice Rehnquist had a relatively

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Speaker 1: light docket when he presided over the Clinton impeachment trial.

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Speaker 1: What kind of docket is if Justice Robert's facing, It's

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Speaker 1: relatively light in January when the trial is probably going

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Speaker 1: to take place. So, for example, on the on the

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Speaker 1: Wednesdays when the Court is hearing argument that week, it's

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Speaker 1: only hearing one each day, So it would be easy

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Speaker 1: enough for him to hear arguments in that case in

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Speaker 1: the morning and go over to the Senate in the afternoon.

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Speaker 1: The term as a whole, of course, is a lot

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Speaker 1: bigger than that, and we've discussed some of those big cases.

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Speaker 1: A gun case, they've got an abortion case, they've got

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Speaker 1: sectional orientation, and transgender job discrimination. And now they have

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Speaker 1: the Trump subpoena cases where members of Congress and the

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Speaker 1: New York Grand Jury are trying to get Donald Trump's

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Speaker 1: financial documents. So the big picture is that John Roberts

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Speaker 1: has an awful lot of big stuff to deal with,

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Speaker 1: But it may not be the case in January that

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Speaker 1: he's got that much on his plate. So we know

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Speaker 1: one thing for sure, and that is that he will

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Speaker 1: not be wearing the robes that Chief Justice Rehnquist war,

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Speaker 1: which had gold braiding on them like Gilbert and Sullivan,

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Speaker 1: but Chief Justice in quists other than that took sort

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Speaker 1: of a backseat role as a presiding judge is chief

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Speaker 1: just as Roberts likely do the same. Well. Yeah, so

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Speaker 1: the one thing everybody remembers from the Clinton and Peachman

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Speaker 1: trial about William Renklist is that he had the four

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Speaker 1: gold stripes on his sleeves. Those were inspired by the

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Speaker 1: Gilbert and Sullivan operetta Iolanthey. After that trial, Renclist used

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Speaker 1: a quote from that operetta to describe what he did.

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Speaker 1: He said, I did nothing in particular, and I did

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Speaker 1: it very well. I'm sure John Roberts would love for

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Speaker 1: that to be the case for him now, he is

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Speaker 1: probably not looking forward to this. It puts him out

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Speaker 1: of his element. He's going to have to be dealing

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Speaker 1: with stuff that he's not at all accustomed dealing with

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Speaker 1: Senate rules, having to make decisions on the spot. It

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Speaker 1: may be that, especially if the Senators end up with

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Speaker 1: a bare bones kind of trial, or he doesn't have

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Speaker 1: to do a whole lot, he can come out much

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Speaker 1: like William Renklist didn't say he didn't have to do

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Speaker 1: a whole lot, but we'll just have to see. And

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Speaker 1: he has presided over a so called hot bench at

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Speaker 1: the Supreme Court, but he's never presided over a trial.

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Speaker 1: He has not. You're right on you, so to my

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Speaker 1: yours is the only one of the nine Supreme Court

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Speaker 1: justices who's been a trial judge. So yeah, you know,

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Speaker 1: trial judges, unlike Capella judges, do make decisions on the spot.

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Speaker 1: They don't get to go back and sit in their

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Speaker 1: conference room and discuss with their colleagues how they're going

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Speaker 1: to come out and then rule several months later. It'll

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Speaker 1: be a new experience for John Roberts. Absolutely, he will

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Speaker 1: have the ability to consult with the Senate Parliamentarian that

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Speaker 1: and doubtedly will be an important source of support for him.

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Speaker 1: He'll have at least one aid from the Supreme Court,

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Speaker 1: the man named Jeff mcneir, who will be coming over

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Speaker 1: there with him. He can us his law clarks if

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Speaker 1: he wants to, so he will have some assistance, but

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Speaker 1: it will be a very new experience for him. Thanks Greg.

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Speaker 1: That's Greg Store, Bloomberg new Supreme Court reporter. Thanks for

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Speaker 1: listening to the Bloomberg Law Podcast. You can subscribe and

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Speaker 1: listen to the show on Apple podcast, SoundCloud and on

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg dot com slash podcast. I'm June Brasso. This is

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg contained bed the dependent du contation