Speaker 1: Welcome to Good Game with Sarah Spain, where we're putting
Speaker 1: ourselves in time out for saying rugby player alone of
Speaker 1: Mar's name wrong this whole time. Who the hell is
Speaker 1: Alana Mayor? Come on, Spain, you're better than that, all right,
Speaker 1: I'm a head out.
Speaker 2: Uh, Sarah, you still kind of got to host the show?
Speaker 2: Oh shit, right? All right.
Speaker 1: On today's show, we're gonna chat with American runner Nikki
Speaker 1: Hilts about breaking the US Olympic Trials meet record in
Speaker 1: the fifteen hundred, qualifying for Paris and educating and inspiring
Speaker 1: fans along the way, plus more medals for Tmusa, we
Speaker 1: take a walk down memory Lane, and more. It's all
Speaker 1: coming up after the break. We're back, and here's what
Speaker 1: you need to know today. First things First, Alone o Mar,
Speaker 1: My apologies to our queen. It turns out I needed
Speaker 1: to stop obsessively watching her instagrams and start obsessively watching
Speaker 1: her games instead, you know, so i'd know how to
Speaker 1: say her damn name right, and also.
Speaker 2: So I could watch them win a bronze medal. That's right.
Speaker 1: Yesterday, Team USA rugby little slip up fell to New
Speaker 1: Zealand in their semi final matchup twenty four to twelve,
Speaker 1: but they bounced back in the bronze medal match later
Speaker 1: in the day and defeated Australia fourteen to twelve on
Speaker 1: a last second run by Alex Cedric with no time remaining.
Speaker 1: If you didn't see it, you have to look it up.
Speaker 1: That's the best finish and the first medal ever for
Speaker 1: USA and rugby.
Speaker 2: How about them Ruggers?
Speaker 1: And you know what, I saw someone say that the
Speaker 1: rugby women were having their ninety nine.
Speaker 2: Ers moment in these games.
Speaker 1: And I do think that a lot of kids are
Speaker 1: probably watching and searching how and where to play and
Speaker 1: kind of falling in love with rugby.
Speaker 2: So what a legacy way to go, ladies.
Speaker 1: And I think someone needs to book Alona on every
Speaker 1: late night show or just give her her own show.
Speaker 1: In gymnastics, Simone Biles and Team USA are golden again. Biles,
Speaker 1: Jordan Chiles, Sunny Lee, Jade Care and sixteen year old
Speaker 1: Hesley Rivera, who competed in qualifying but not in the final,
Speaker 1: finished with a total score of one hundred and seventy
Speaker 1: one point twenty nine to six. That's almost six points
Speaker 1: clear of second place Italy. Simone earns her eighth Olympic medal,
Speaker 1: passing Shannon Miller for the most all time by a
Speaker 1: US gymnast, and her fifth gold ties a US record
Speaker 1: set by Anton Hayda way back in nineteen oh four. Also,
Speaker 1: according to NBC Sports, Nick sa Cardi, Ali Raisman was
Speaker 1: the oldest US female gymnast to win Olympic gold at
Speaker 1: twenty two, but now Simone, Jade and Jordan all surpassed that.
Speaker 1: We love to see these ladies staying in the sport
Speaker 1: longer and definitely competing with more joy. There's been this
Speaker 1: real culture change in the sport in the last couple
Speaker 1: of years, and that's been just incredible to see. Brazil's
Speaker 1: Rebecca Andrages all around score was just zero point three
Speaker 1: sixty six behind Simone Biles on the night. Now, Biles
Speaker 1: didn't do her incredible Yurchenko double pike vault, that crazy
Speaker 1: vault we keep seeing in this team event, so she
Speaker 1: still got that trick up or sleeve heading into the
Speaker 1: individual all around. On Thursday, I mentioned Italy got silver.
Speaker 1: That's huge. They win an Olympic team medal for the
Speaker 1: first time in ninety six years, and with the bronze
Speaker 1: Brazil wins its first ever medal in the team event
Speaker 1: and finally shout out to Laurie Hernandez on the call.
Speaker 2: She's such a joy to listen to. She's so human too.
Speaker 1: We get the gasps and the giggles alongside all the insights.
Speaker 1: Just perfection And if you didn't know the story, she
Speaker 1: was a real gold medalist. She failed to make the
Speaker 1: Tokyo Olympic team, but went anyway as a commentator for NBC,
Speaker 1: making the best of a disappointing situation and jump starting
Speaker 1: her career as a broadcaster. And she's been great, so
Speaker 1: an impressive pivot, even for a world class gymnast. In swimming,
Speaker 1: the fifteen hundred meter freestyle final is today at three
Speaker 1: pm Eastern.
Speaker 2: A little context here.
Speaker 1: This is just the second Olympics that women have been
Speaker 1: allowed to swim the fifteen hundred meter. Until Tokyo, they
Speaker 1: were stuck at eight hundred meters even though the men
Speaker 1: have been swimming the fifteen hundred since nineteen oh eight.
Speaker 1: You heard that right, And this is good news for
Speaker 1: American Katie Ladeki because she's the favorite, and understandably so.
Speaker 1: She has not lost a race in this event in
Speaker 1: fourteen years and in the qualifier Ladeki beat the next
Speaker 1: closest swimmer by almost twenty whole seconds.
Speaker 2: That's some goat shit on the pitch.
Speaker 1: USA Soccer already punched his ticket to the knockout stage,
Speaker 1: but they close out group play today against Australia at
Speaker 1: one pm Eastern Tierna Davidson will miss this game. She
Speaker 1: suffered a knee contusion against Germany forward Jaden Shaw, who
Speaker 1: missed the first two games due to a lingering lower
Speaker 1: leg injury, will not be available either. In tennis, Coco
Speaker 1: Goff suffered a surprising loss to Donna Vekich of Croatia
Speaker 1: yesterday and it was deja.
Speaker 2: Vu in a bad way.
Speaker 1: Goff found herself fighting a similar call to the one
Speaker 1: made by an official in the French Open in June,
Speaker 1: and on the same court. Even so, there was a
Speaker 1: return volli from Bekich hit near the baseline and a
Speaker 1: line judge called it out. Because of the call, GoF
Speaker 1: didn't keep the ball in play, but then the chair
Speaker 1: umpire decided that Beckicch's shot did lit and in bounds
Speaker 1: and gave her the point. Goff pleaded her case, saying
Speaker 1: that the ball was called out before she hit it
Speaker 1: and that she had a right to finish or swing
Speaker 1: without being impeded by the call. But with no video
Speaker 1: review available, the ump stood firm and Veckich was given
Speaker 1: the point. For what it's worth, the call happened after
Speaker 1: Gough was already behind, but it's still hard to measure
Speaker 1: how a moment like that can affect a competitor's mindset.
Speaker 1: So no singles medal for Coco, but she still got
Speaker 1: a shot at medaling in women's doubles and mixed doubles.
Speaker 1: The BMX Freestyle finals are today. Americans Hannah Roberts and
Speaker 1: Paris Benegas will take to the course at seven ten
Speaker 1: am Eastern on USA Network.
Speaker 2: Roberts is a five time.
Speaker 1: World champion and will look to improve on the silver
Speaker 1: medal she earned in the Olympic debut of BMX freestyle
Speaker 1: three years ago. Plus there's plenty more to follow on
Speaker 1: today's Olympic slate. Team USA Field Hockey taken on Australia
Speaker 1: today at seven to fifteen am Eastern, looking for their
Speaker 1: first win after opening with a loss to Argentina and
Speaker 1: a drug against Spain.
Speaker 2: Now, if you haven't seen.
Speaker 1: It, go watch this incredible play from that tie with Spain.
Speaker 1: We're even going to link to it in our show notes.
Speaker 1: Just a minute into the game, one of Spain's players
Speaker 1: took a point blank shot on goal and it slipped
Speaker 1: past the US keeper Kelsey Bing, but unclum and certified
Speaker 1: badass Ashley Hoffman saved the day with a clutch defensive
Speaker 1: save and it ended up leading to an incredible transition play.
Speaker 1: Ten seconds later, Penn State's Fia Gladio found the back
Speaker 1: of the net. Such a cool play. Even if you
Speaker 1: don't understand bioldagi, even if you're still figuring out the rules,
Speaker 1: go watch that and get hyped for USA Australia. Today
Speaker 1: in indoor volleyball, USA plays Serbia and Pool A play
Speaker 1: at eleven am Eastern. In beach volleyball, reigning world champs
Speaker 1: Sarah Hughes and Kelly Chang of the US faced host
Speaker 1: country France at nine am Eastern. That's streaming on Peacock.
Speaker 1: They opened their Olympics with a two to zero win
Speaker 1: over Checchia, and they can confirm a spot in the
Speaker 1: round of sixteen with another pool see win today in
Speaker 1: three x three basketball. After opening their Olympic campaign, With
Speaker 1: the loss to Germany, the US team looked to rebound
Speaker 1: against Azerbaijan at three point thirty pm. Easterns have never
Speaker 1: played each other at a World Championships or an Olympic Games,
Speaker 1: and Azerbaijan's roster sports a name familiar to many WNBA fans.
Speaker 1: Las Vegas Aces guard Tiffany Hayes. Hayes became a naturalized
Speaker 1: Azerbaijani citizen in twenty fifteen and will make her Olympic debut.
Speaker 1: This is also Azerbaijan's first three x three appearance at
Speaker 1: the Olympics. In honor of today's guest, the amazing Nicky Hilt,
Speaker 1: who is a proud representative for the LGBTQIA plus community,
Speaker 1: I want to shout out a great statistic from this
Speaker 1: year's Olympic Games. Yep, that means it's time for good game,
Speaker 1: good game, fact you. According to outsports dot Com, the
Speaker 1: Paris Olympics have an all time record of one hundred
Speaker 1: and ninety three openly lgbtqia plus athletes competing gay perie. Indeed,
Speaker 1: also I want to shout out the Pride House, which
Speaker 1: debuted at the twenty ten Olympics and this year is
Speaker 1: located on a boat.
Speaker 2: Floating down the Senne River.
Speaker 1: The Pride House acts as a hub for the queer
Speaker 1: community during the competition, and this year there's even a
Speaker 1: pop up Pride House where teams of volunteers will visit
Speaker 1: various venues, meet with the public, and raise awareness of
Speaker 1: the LGBTQIA plus issues in sport.
Speaker 2: We love it.
Speaker 1: Okay, we got to take a quick break, but when
Speaker 1: we come back, we'll hear from Nicky Hilts.
Speaker 2: Joining us today.
Speaker 1: Nicki Hilts, the American record holder in the mile, the
Speaker 1: two time reigning US outdoor fifteen hundred meter champion. At
Speaker 1: the US Olympic Track Trials last month, Hilt's clock the
Speaker 1: second fastest time ever recorded by an American in the
Speaker 1: women's fifteen hundred meter race. Their time of three minutes
Speaker 1: and fifty five point thirty three seconds was a personal
Speaker 1: best and a meet record. They competed collegiately for Oregon
Speaker 1: in Arkansas. They just might have more sunglasses than shoes
Speaker 1: and fun fact, Hilts is a professional runner and they
Speaker 1: can't even beat their own girlfriend in the steeplechase.
Speaker 2: Welcome Nicki Hilts.
Speaker 3: Very amazing intro. Thank you so much, I'm so excited
Speaker 3: to be here.
Speaker 2: Shout out to your girlfriend. I'm McGee.
Speaker 1: She's a steeplechaser. Hence the dig at you. I won't
Speaker 1: even ask you if you think you could. You could
Speaker 1: beat her if you trained hard enough, because I'm not
Speaker 1: starting any beef. I'm not starting any beef in the household.
Speaker 1: First of all, congrats on the Olympic berth. That's so
Speaker 1: exciting and what an incredible time at the trials. You're
Speaker 1: now the second fastest American in the fifteen hundred. The
Speaker 1: top eight finishers in that trials race all set personal best.
Speaker 1: That is a fast, fast race. The Olympics are such
Speaker 1: a lifelong dream for so many athletes. I'm wondering how
Speaker 1: that moment of crossing the finish line and knowing that
Speaker 1: you're headed to the Games, how did that compare to
Speaker 1: your expectations or maybe lifelong dreams about it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it was definitely just an amazing moment. I think
Speaker 3: just a lot of emotions at once. I think one
Speaker 3: was definitely joy, another was like relief because there's just
Speaker 3: so much pressure on the trials, and then the third,
Speaker 3: I would say, would be like shock, Like I knew
Speaker 3: going into that race. You know, top three get an
Speaker 3: Olympic berth and I knew I could be third, Like
Speaker 3: that was something I was very confident in. But I'm
Speaker 3: a competitor and I wanted to win, and like I
Speaker 3: thought that I could, but obviously there was some doubt too,
Speaker 3: because you know, Ellie Saint Pierre had had a PR
Speaker 3: at the time that was four seconds better than mine.
Speaker 3: So yeah, I mean I did believe deep down, but
Speaker 3: like actually when it was happening and breaking the tape,
Speaker 3: I was like, I can't believe I'm winning this right now,
Speaker 3: Like what's going on? So yeah, just a lot of emotions.
Speaker 3: And then you add on the fact that yet like, yes,
Speaker 3: this race means a lot in that now I can
Speaker 3: finally call myself an Olympian, And yeah, I think it's
Speaker 3: just surreal because it's a goal I've had, I don't know,
Speaker 3: probably ever since like two thousand and four, two thousand
Speaker 3: and eight, just tuning into those Olympics as a kid. Uh.
Speaker 3: I think I just was watching it and I was like,
Speaker 3: I want to be there someday, and so it's just
Speaker 3: crazy to, yeah, have a childhood dream just come true
Speaker 3: like that.
Speaker 1: After you qualified for the Olympics. You said this race
Speaker 1: is bigger than just me. Can you explain what you meant?
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, I feel like the past few years,
Speaker 3: you know, I've been very vocal and out about my
Speaker 3: gender identity and sexuality, and so yeah, I wanted to
Speaker 3: run this race for my community, and I just feel
Speaker 3: when I stand on the start line, I just feel
Speaker 3: so overwhelmed with love and support, and I think it
Speaker 3: allows me to run really free because I know, no
Speaker 3: matter what the result, or whether I'm first or last
Speaker 3: in this race, I'm going to be loved and supported.
Speaker 3: And so that is just such a gift that I
Speaker 3: feel like I've gotten from the queer community, and so
Speaker 3: I yeah, I wanted to give it back and just
Speaker 3: think them in any way I could, And so yeah,
Speaker 3: I feel like dedicating that race to them was like
Speaker 3: my wife's just saying thank you for allowing me to
Speaker 3: run so free.
Speaker 2: So cool.
Speaker 1: I want to give our listeners the correct context and
Speaker 1: information for your gender identity and your sexuality. You're getting
Speaker 1: a lot of incredible coverage about it, but a lot
Speaker 1: of people still sort of misunderstand this or just don't
Speaker 1: have the knowledge, haven't really talked about or read enough
Speaker 1: about the differences between sex and gender and gender identity,
Speaker 1: and especially in the sports world, that's so binary.
Speaker 2: So let's sort of level set.
Speaker 1: On the International Transgender Day of Visibility of twenty twenty one,
Speaker 1: you announce on Instagram that you're transgender and non binary.
Speaker 1: So can you tell us what transgender and non binary
Speaker 1: mean to you?
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's a great question. I think people get confused. Yeah,
Speaker 3: I'm non binary, but I use the term trans non
Speaker 3: binary because I believe that being non binary is underneath
Speaker 3: the trans umbrella. But I think people see the word
Speaker 3: trans and automatically think, like, Okay, were you assigned female
Speaker 3: at birth? And are you now you know, a transman
Speaker 3: or vice versa, where you assigned male at birth and
Speaker 3: you already trans woman? Like I think people are still
Speaker 3: in that very binary headspace. And so yeah, to me,
Speaker 3: like non binary means like just gender fluid and like
Speaker 3: my my gender is it's a spectrum, like I've never
Speaker 3: really identified fully with like girl and then vice versa,
Speaker 3: never fully with boy either, and it's just somewhere in between.
Speaker 3: And I didn't have context for what that meant until
Speaker 3: I was a little bit older, you know. I think
Speaker 3: it was the pandemic. Honestly, in twenty twenty, when you
Speaker 3: know I got TikTok and my for you page, knew
Speaker 3: I was trans before I did. It was it was
Speaker 3: just that I saw them. The algorithms are too good,
Speaker 3: and so I started seeing all this non binary representation
Speaker 3: literally on my for you page and I was like,
Speaker 3: oh my god, this is me. This is what I've
Speaker 3: felt my entire life. And so yeah, and then a
Speaker 3: year later, you know, on trans Day Visibility, I told
Speaker 3: the you know, important people in my life and people,
Speaker 3: you know, my partner and training partner and coach at
Speaker 3: the time had started using d them pronouns for me.
Speaker 3: But I was like, I think it's time to tell
Speaker 3: the world. And this is something I kind of had
Speaker 3: to come out about, because if you want people to
Speaker 3: affirm you and your gender, you have to let them
Speaker 3: know that you use the them pronounce you know. So
Speaker 3: it was kind of, yeah, that was my journey, But
Speaker 3: what was the question defined? But not okay?
Speaker 2: I think, you.
Speaker 1: Know, as a straight SIS woman who actually covers a
Speaker 1: lot of women's sports and actually gets into a lot
Speaker 1: of issues around gender identity and sexuality. The result of
Speaker 1: covering a lot of women's sports where the isms are
Speaker 1: always at play. I just find so many people haven't
Speaker 1: ever read or thought about it, so for them, they
Speaker 1: don't understand well enough to get what you just articulated,
Speaker 1: which is this idea of like, yes, sometimes I wake
Speaker 1: up and I'm a dude's dude and sometimes I wake
Speaker 1: up and I'm a.
Speaker 2: Girl's girl, and it can be both.
Speaker 1: And now we see so many more representations of that,
Speaker 1: and we have the language for it, and that's allowing
Speaker 1: so many people to understand the experiences of others.
Speaker 2: And I think it's sport.
Speaker 1: It's particularly useful because unfortunately we do have these incredibly
Speaker 1: gender binary sets that we are having to fit people into,
Speaker 1: even if they don't feel like they fit in. And
Speaker 1: I think some people are misunderstanding because they don't know enough,
Speaker 1: and some people are being intentionally obtuse or even cruel.
Speaker 1: You got a social media comment after winning at the trials.
Speaker 1: Someone accused you of being quote a mediocre man stealing
Speaker 1: a woman's place on the Olympic team. Your response and
Speaker 1: correction were both perfect and hilarious. But how do you
Speaker 1: explain to folks who don't understand what it means to
Speaker 1: be non binary trans and competing in women's events.
Speaker 3: I mean, I'm thinking back to the just the mediocre
Speaker 3: man thing, and I actually wish I would have said
Speaker 3: something like I feel like a mediocre man couldn't even
Speaker 3: run three fifty five. But I'm not giving like a
Speaker 3: lot of credit, like for men are.
Speaker 2: Not winning the Olympic trials.
Speaker 3: Come on, Yeah, exactly, but no, it's it's exactly like
Speaker 3: you said, like some people are being ignorant on purpose,
Speaker 3: and some people genuinely just have never heard what, don't
Speaker 3: know what non binary means or and so yeah, I
Speaker 3: do feel like I want to take my platform like
Speaker 3: at times to educate. And I feel like the really
Speaker 3: beautiful thing that's happened within the past three years is
Speaker 3: that people have started to do it for me, like
Speaker 3: you know, on my Instagram or whatever, Like someone will
Speaker 3: be a comment like that's a dude or whatever it is,
Speaker 3: and then you'll see at least five responses just from
Speaker 3: my following or you know people who who yeah, like
Speaker 3: are like, get out of here. You don't even know
Speaker 3: what you're talking about, like he was a signed female birth.
Speaker 3: Like people do it for me now, which I think
Speaker 3: is really beautiful. And but yeah, no, they're always I
Speaker 3: think there's always opportunities to like educate, and like obviously
Speaker 3: there's people who are just like assholes and ignorant and
Speaker 3: like I'm maybe never gonna change their hearts and minds,
Speaker 3: but like the people that I don't know. I got
Speaker 3: a really beautiful message the other day from someone who
Speaker 3: was like, you know, my liberal grandpa was watching the
Speaker 3: trials and I was like cheering for you and using
Speaker 3: day them pronouns, and he was like like, why are
Speaker 3: you using that? Like what do you mean they like
Speaker 3: there's only one person, And she was like it was
Speaker 3: a really beautiful moment where I got to like educate
Speaker 3: him and he was like, oh, that's really cool, Like
Speaker 3: I didn't know that, and like so just things like that,
Speaker 3: I just really like fill my heart and like it's
Speaker 3: not just this one. Like if you don't get it,
Speaker 3: get out. I don't want to ever create that space.
Speaker 3: I think in order to create change, you kind of
Speaker 3: have to find those people in the middle and and
Speaker 3: do your best to educate, and then if they don't
Speaker 3: want to know, it's like okay, well then I don't care.
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, I did my best. I tried. Yeah,
Speaker 2: my friend.
Speaker 1: Chris moser Is is a transman in men's events and
Speaker 1: talks a lot about how he almost has the privilege
Speaker 1: of people not caring because they don't think that athletes
Speaker 1: like him exist, and they also somehow think, well, he's
Speaker 1: at a disadvantage being you know, assigned female at birth
Speaker 1: and competing in the men's events. You also get some
Speaker 1: accusations of abusing some sort of privilege of identifying as
Speaker 1: trans and non binary but competing against women.
Speaker 2: How do you respond to that?
Speaker 1: It's usually not being said in good faith or curiosity,
Speaker 1: but more so in a way to sort of continue
Speaker 1: to demonize trans athletes.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't know. I mean, I just I know
Speaker 3: my truth and like that's enough for me. Sometimes, Like
Speaker 3: I know that i'm you know, I'm not taking any HRT,
Speaker 3: Like I'm not on hormone replacement therapy, Like I'm not
Speaker 3: on testosterone. Like I know that I'm doing it fair
Speaker 3: and I'm or whatever, I'm following the rules, like whatever
Speaker 3: you want to call it. And I I don't know,
Speaker 3: I think that's enough for me. It's like, and also
Speaker 3: I've nothing that anyone can say is anything that is
Speaker 3: nothing's new. I've heard it all. I've seen it all.
Speaker 3: Nothing's gonna catch me by surprise anymore. And like, yeah,
Speaker 3: I also just think that I'm like I just have
Speaker 3: a really good sports system around me, like my partner,
Speaker 3: my coaches, my training partners, like my therapists, like my family,
Speaker 3: Like I just have such a like it's a pretty
Speaker 3: small team, but it's like my people, and like I
Speaker 3: know that, Like nothing's going to penetrate that.
Speaker 2: And I don't know.
Speaker 3: Yeah, does I answer your question?
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, honestly, you're damned if you do, damned
Speaker 1: if you don't. So, like, if you're trying to please
Speaker 1: everybody or fix the opinions of people that you don't
Speaker 1: even know that aren't saying them with you know, good intent,
Speaker 1: you'll spend a lot of time, you know, trying to
Speaker 1: talk to people that don't deserve any energy your time.
Speaker 1: I want to talk personal best because the Olympic Trials
Speaker 1: is a really good time to have one, and you
Speaker 1: have had many of them of late. In fact, if
Speaker 1: you go back to twenty twenty one, you finished last
Speaker 1: in the fifteen hundred meters at the US Olympic Trials,
Speaker 1: and since then you've won two indoor and two outdoor
Speaker 1: US National Championships in the fifteen hundred meter in silver
Speaker 1: at Indoor Worlds to what do you attribute that kind
Speaker 1: of progress?
Speaker 3: Oh, Man, I mean, I think I changed a lot.
Speaker 3: After the last trials, I kind of looked at my
Speaker 3: life and my situation. I was like, I think it's
Speaker 3: time to make change, you know, and so I moved.
Speaker 3: I was living in San Diego and now I live
Speaker 3: in flag Cut, Arizona, which is up at seven thousand
Speaker 3: feet of elevation, and you know, I got a new
Speaker 3: coach and he's he's amazing. And then I also changed sponsors,
Speaker 3: like I was with Adidas and now I'm with lou Lemon.
Speaker 3: Like I just changed so much in my life, and
Speaker 3: so it's kind of hard to like pinpoint exactly what
Speaker 3: it was that, you know, helped this success. But I
Speaker 3: think kind of just what we were talking about, I'm
Speaker 3: really really confident in who I am because I came
Speaker 3: out and because you know, at the start, it was
Speaker 3: really rocky, and you know that whole twenty twenty one
Speaker 3: season I was I don't think I was used to
Speaker 3: getting that much backlash and it did definitely affect me
Speaker 3: on the track. But now, like I've done a lot
Speaker 3: of personal growth, and not just that, I think the
Speaker 3: whole track community as a whole has done incredible growth.
Speaker 3: Like Carri Goucher, you know, an NBC broadcaster, has done
Speaker 3: a phenomenal job of just keep getting better at like
Speaker 3: like sometimes she messed up in the beginning, and but
Speaker 3: she just like kept trying and like kept getting it right,
Speaker 3: and now she's flawless. And that's kind of the new
Speaker 3: standard now that all the other broadcasters are trying to
Speaker 3: rise to. And then it's you know, it's media outlets
Speaker 3: like city Smag is a big you know, media space
Speaker 3: in the track and field world. And those guys are
Speaker 3: my friends, and you know, they always get my pronouns right.
Speaker 3: And whenever there's comments or people like you know, being
Speaker 3: ignorant and stupid, they you know, start a conversation with them.
Speaker 3: They're like, no, we're gonna get Nicky's pronouns right. And
Speaker 3: Nicky's not binary and that's okay and it's not weird.
Speaker 3: And it's it's like people I think constantly are trying
Speaker 3: to other trans people. But I I've and because of
Speaker 3: the people around me, like I'm kind of impossible to
Speaker 3: be othered like I'm here and people get my pronouns right,
Speaker 3: it's not weird, and you're actually weird if you get
Speaker 3: it wrong.
Speaker 2: You know, oh kind of right.
Speaker 1: And there's such a freedom then of running as your
Speaker 1: true self. And it's amazing how much limiting what people
Speaker 1: can see of us, or not being authentic to ourselves
Speaker 1: can affect even you know, the physical and the racing.
Speaker 1: The fifteen I was a heptathlete.
Speaker 2: The eight hundred was already way.
Speaker 1: Too far for me to run, and I can't even
Speaker 1: imagine races like the fifteen hundred where you actually have
Speaker 1: time to really think and strategize. So I'm wondering down
Speaker 1: the stretch, what is your brain doing? Like at the
Speaker 1: end of the eight hundred, I was just like, don't die,
Speaker 1: don't die, don't die.
Speaker 2: Everything hurts, this sucks.
Speaker 1: What are you doing to summon up the last bit
Speaker 1: of strength and energy and speed that you have down
Speaker 1: the stretch?
Speaker 3: Oh? Man? Well, running can be a very emotional sport,
Speaker 3: as you know, and so I actually think the emotion
Speaker 3: can sometimes it can help you just as much as
Speaker 3: it can hurt you. So I try to really just
Speaker 3: focus and be in the moment and not let myself
Speaker 3: think about like, oh my god, this straights determines if
Speaker 3: you're an Olympian or not. Like that's just too.
Speaker 2: Strong, so I can't even come there.
Speaker 3: And one of the last things my coach or what
Speaker 3: we were kind of talking about leading into the trials
Speaker 3: was like, don't try to make an Olympic team, try
Speaker 3: to win a race. And that was like my goal
Speaker 3: going in and so because I think it really helped
Speaker 3: me kind of approach it as like this literally is
Speaker 3: just another race. And but with that being said, I
Speaker 3: do have a really strong finishing kick, and so a
Speaker 3: lot of the time something I do is I find
Speaker 3: something really emotional to think about, and I tell myself, like,
Speaker 3: you're not allowed to think about that until one hundred
Speaker 3: meters to go, and as soon as one hundred years
Speaker 3: ago you can think about that. So I told myself
Speaker 3: in this race it was like, think of all the
Speaker 3: love and support and representation of your community, think about
Speaker 3: like your childhood dream of being an Olympian, and like,
Speaker 3: as soon as you hit one hundred to go, you
Speaker 3: can like let that fill you and bring you home.
Speaker 3: And like, it's just crazy because I've never had that
Speaker 3: explosive of a kick off of that fast of a pace,
Speaker 3: and I really think it was some like cosmic energy
Speaker 3: or force of like love and support from around the world,
Speaker 3: like pushing me home, and it was I mean everyone
Speaker 3: I've talked to that watched that is like I literally
Speaker 3: cried when you took like like it was an emotional experience,
Speaker 3: and I think we all kind of felt it, including me,
Speaker 3: And so yeah, I think that's that's kind of how
Speaker 3: I kind of bottle up the emotions until I like
Speaker 3: really need them.
Speaker 2: That's really awesome.
Speaker 1: I also believe a lot in like neuroplasticity and training
Speaker 1: your brain using repetition to be in the position that
Speaker 1: you were at the end and.
Speaker 2: Be able to like know you can do it.
Speaker 1: And I know you've posted on social media some of
Speaker 1: the mental work that you've done, like notes you've written
Speaker 1: to yourself. I feel like people really underestimate how much
Speaker 1: we're training ourselves in advance of a situation to be
Speaker 1: ready for it and take advantage. How did you develop
Speaker 1: that sort of skill set and figure out that those
Speaker 1: kind of mental notes were useful for you?
Speaker 3: Yeah, I really this year was the main goal of
Speaker 3: mine to prioritize my mental health and you know, I've
Speaker 3: just I've watched the Olympics my whole life, and you talk,
Speaker 3: I feel like within more recently, like the past few Olympics,
Speaker 3: you just see a ton of athletes like Simone Biles
Speaker 3: or Michael Phelps, Like like I came home from the
Speaker 3: Olympics and I was like the way to the world
Speaker 3: and it was like I was not okay, And I
Speaker 3: was like, Okay, well, I know this is a big year.
Speaker 3: I know I'm capable of doing this, Like I just
Speaker 3: it's not going to hurt me to like prioritize this
Speaker 3: part of my life. And so yeah, I started going
Speaker 3: to seeing a sports psych weekly and that I started
Speaker 3: that in December, so it's only been about seven months.
Speaker 3: But that's super helpful to just once a week talk
Speaker 3: to someone about my fears and and you know, things
Speaker 3: I want to work on. And then yeah, I think
Speaker 3: I journal a ton and meditate. I think it was
Speaker 3: just I know that this event and this sport, and
Speaker 3: honestly any sport at the Olympic level, that when I'm
Speaker 3: standing on the start line, like the eleven other people
Speaker 3: I'm racing, we're all very fit. Like we can all
Speaker 3: run sub four, we can all, and so what's going
Speaker 3: to set us apart or in like the race is
Speaker 3: like who who can believe in themselves more? Who can
Speaker 3: like mentally be calm and like you know, not get
Speaker 3: in their own way? And so I just really wanted
Speaker 3: to prioritize that, and so it's it's been a really
Speaker 3: fun journey of seeing what I can unlock just by
Speaker 3: like doing the little things every single day.
Speaker 2: Gosh.
Speaker 1: I love the spokespeople for mental health going into this Olympics,
Speaker 1: like you and Simone talking about it the way you
Speaker 1: are is just it's going to help a lot of people,
Speaker 1: I think, and that continuing to break down that stigma
Speaker 1: of addressing those things and how meaningful and important it
Speaker 1: can be.
Speaker 2: What are you most excited about about Paris?
Speaker 3: Oh man, I'm I'm just excited to take it all in.
Speaker 3: Like I opening ceremonies is really exciting to me. I
Speaker 3: think I want to be like a spectator, Like I'd
Speaker 3: love to go to I don't know, a soccer game
Speaker 3: or the gymnastics or swimming. Yeah, I think just being
Speaker 3: in the athlete village is awesome. I'm excited for all
Speaker 3: of it.
Speaker 1: I got to catch that beach volleyball right under the
Speaker 1: Eiffel Tower. That looks like that set up that's absolutely insane.
Speaker 1: You did an interview with Runners World last year and
Speaker 1: actually talked about the idea of going to the Olympics,
Speaker 1: and you said, quote, going to the Olympics is such
Speaker 1: a dream of mine, But it's all also such a
Speaker 1: dream of mine to take testosterone, or grow facial hair
Speaker 1: or have top surgery. And so I think sometimes I
Speaker 1: can really resent this sport. How are you reconciling those
Speaker 1: feelings with the dream that you're now getting to achieve
Speaker 1: by going to Paris.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think I think it's just like a great
Speaker 3: example of like both things can exist at once. You
Speaker 3: can be really happy and really sad.
Speaker 2: And I don't know.
Speaker 3: One of my favorite movies ever is Inside Out, and
Speaker 3: it's just like kind of that message throughout it. And
Speaker 3: I think kind of how I've reframed it or thought
Speaker 3: about in my mind is I'm chasing one goal right now,
Speaker 3: and that's to be the best athlete I can be
Speaker 3: and represent my country and my community the best I
Speaker 3: possibly can, and you know, set American records and win
Speaker 3: some medals, like all goals that I have. But I
Speaker 3: also have this really beautiful thing that I'm looking forward to,
Speaker 3: like after my career is over, and I'm I think
Speaker 3: a lot of times athletes you ask them, what, yeah,
Speaker 3: what are you going to be when you retire? Like
Speaker 3: what's the next chapter look like? And I have no
Speaker 3: idea career wise what I want to do, you know,
Speaker 3: like who knows? But I do know who I am
Speaker 3: and I do know the gender affirming steps I want
Speaker 3: to take, and that's that's really exciting for me to
Speaker 3: know that, like, yeah, I can have both goals, just
Speaker 3: maybe not at the same time.
Speaker 1: That's fascinating because we do. We talk to athletes so
Speaker 1: much about the loss of identity that they feel when
Speaker 1: their athletic career ends, and in some ways you're gonna
Speaker 1: be gaining one.
Speaker 2: That's really totally wow. Yeah, an awesome thing to look
Speaker 2: forward to.
Speaker 1: You were on a panel at our espnW summit last
Speaker 1: fall that was probably my favorite of the summit with
Speaker 1: er fight Master and Leisia Clarendon, both of whom I'm
Speaker 1: obsessed with, and I just love the entire conversation you had.
Speaker 1: People can find it online on YouTube on ESPN if
Speaker 1: they search for the summit in your name.
Speaker 2: But I was really moved by this quote that you paraphrased.
Speaker 1: If you're born into a world in which you don't fit,
Speaker 1: that means you were made to build a new one.
Speaker 1: And I'm wondering how the building is going.
Speaker 2: Oh, great question.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's a journey, like it's it's hard, it's it's
Speaker 3: I think there is like an asterisk to all that.
Speaker 3: It's like, you know, I crossed the finish line, and
Speaker 3: I'm so excited in that moment, is like one of
Speaker 3: the happiest I've ever been. And then there's this like
Speaker 3: I go on social media and there's just like, of
Speaker 3: course there's outpourting of love and support, but there's also like,
Speaker 3: I don't know, this like cloud of like you're a man,
Speaker 3: or you like you're a cheat or whatever it is
Speaker 3: that it's just like, ugh, I hate that, Like, you know,
Speaker 3: there's just like this, there is difficult parts in moments,
Speaker 3: but I don't know. I was just at the s
Speaker 3: p's and I don Staley gave an incredible speech and
Speaker 3: she was basically talking about how in order to be
Speaker 3: an incredible athlete, so much of your life you had
Speaker 3: to go right. You know, you had to have good coaches.
Speaker 3: You had to never fail a class or have a
Speaker 3: career ending injury, right, Like, all the stars essentially had
Speaker 3: to align for you to be sitting in this room.
Speaker 3: I just like I literally felt she was like talking.
Speaker 2: Directly to me.
Speaker 3: I was like like nodding my head, you know. And
Speaker 3: then she's like and because of that, like this you
Speaker 3: live in a extraordinary life, and like with that comes
Speaker 3: an extraordinary responsibility. And it's it's just something like my
Speaker 3: mom has said, my whole life is like with great
Speaker 3: power comes great responsibility. And like, so how you all
Speaker 3: these stars have aligned, You've arrived, How are you now
Speaker 3: going to use it? Like you are so privileged? Like,
Speaker 3: how are you now going to like use it to
Speaker 3: stand up for what's right to make the world better?
Speaker 3: And that was just kind of all the motivation I
Speaker 3: needed to hear, like right before heading to Paris, is
Speaker 3: like I am so lucky and privileged, and I'm like,
Speaker 3: I'm trans and I'm in this community, but I'm like
Speaker 3: one of the most digestible forms of a transperson, right,
Speaker 3: Like I'm white, I'm non binary. Like I don't know,
Speaker 3: I think there's just this I do. I feel like
Speaker 3: I have this opportunity and responsibility to continue to like
Speaker 3: be seen like why would I not? How could I?
Speaker 2: Now? You know? Yeah?
Speaker 3: Sure, Sometimes there's it's hard and it's exhausting, and it's like, oh,
Speaker 3: why can't I just be a runner?
Speaker 2: Like why do I?
Speaker 3: But like, I think it's worth it because in the end,
Speaker 3: I know that I'm making space. For sure, I'm the first,
Speaker 3: but I'm not the last, Like there's there's gonna be
Speaker 3: tons of people that come after me.
Speaker 1: I think it's not just the power of your accomplishments,
Speaker 1: but the power of who you are, and you seem
Speaker 1: like someone built for it. And those who can take
Speaker 1: on that extraordinary burden of being a first or of
Speaker 1: helping lead others into their truth like the that's that's
Speaker 1: a power that almost can't be denied or turned away from.
Speaker 1: It feels like it's it's almost necessary to use it.
Speaker 1: And you are, which is fricking awesome. We're so excited
Speaker 1: to watch you race. We're gonna be incredibly nervous, but
Speaker 1: we're going to power through all of us. All the
Speaker 1: good game listeners are going to be giving you all
Speaker 1: that energy you talked about, just like throwing it across
Speaker 1: the pond towards France and all the best luck to you.
Speaker 3: I'm gonna need it.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much to Nikki for joining us.
Speaker 1: We got to take another break, but when we come back,
Speaker 1: we turn this thing into a family affair. Keep it
Speaker 1: locked right here. You're back, Oh my god, so are
Speaker 1: we fun? Don't forget that. We'd love to hear from you.
Speaker 1: Guest suggestions, thoughts about the show, really, whatever's.
Speaker 2: On your mind.
Speaker 1: Shoot us an email good game at wondermedianetwork dot com,
Speaker 1: or leave us a voicemail at eight seven two two
Speaker 1: oh four fifty seventy like this guy did.
Speaker 3: Hey, this is Wit.
Speaker 1: I'm calling from Indianapolis and yeah, I was fishing.
Speaker 3: For a podcast last night, and props to your marketing department,
Speaker 3: I stumbled across this one.
Speaker 2: Love you, Sarah, have a great day and have a
Speaker 2: great show.
Speaker 1: So I'm scrolling through your voicemails and listening to all
Speaker 1: your lovely voices.
Speaker 2: And bam, that was my cousin, Wit. What a nice surprise.
Speaker 2: Thanks for the love, cuz.
Speaker 1: And actually that brings us to our good game play
Speaker 1: of the day, because we love that you're listening, but
Speaker 1: we want you to get in the game every day too,
Speaker 1: so your mission, should you choose to accept it, leave
Speaker 1: us a voicemail sharing one of your favorite memories of
Speaker 1: watching the Olympics as a kid. Could be watching with family,
Speaker 1: could be a memorable moment like Brian Boytano versus Brian Orser,
Speaker 1: Carrie Strug's memorable vault, maybe Alison Felix dominating the track.
Speaker 1: Or it could be getting inspired to play a sport
Speaker 1: of your own after watching someone in the games. Whatever
Speaker 1: it is, give us a call eight seven two two
Speaker 1: o four fifty seventy. Keep it quick, maybe we'll play
Speaker 1: it on the show. Don't forget to subscribe, Rate and review.
Speaker 1: It's easy watch those robots and muscle people graphics in
Speaker 1: the swimming events at the Olympics.
Speaker 2: Rating three out of five stars. Review.
Speaker 1: It can be useful to see what the swimmers' bodies
Speaker 1: should look like when they're entering the pool or during
Speaker 1: a relay, but it's also very unsettling, especially the fact
Speaker 1: that they're wearing swim caps and goggles over their non
Speaker 1: hair of their non eyeballs, not to mention the potential
Speaker 1: for a dystopian, not so far off future where a
Speaker 1: robot overloord are winning all the medals. Okay, now it's
Speaker 1: your turn to rate and review. And while you're in
Speaker 1: there scrolling down to find those stars and review, click
Speaker 1: and take a look under each Good Game episode. My
Speaker 1: amazing producers put all sorts of info in the episode notes,
Speaker 1: useful links, and info galore for you down there. Thanks
Speaker 1: for listening, and make sure you come back tomorrow for
Speaker 1: another sure to be fun edition of group Chat. We're
Speaker 1: gonna find out what happens when an ultra marathoner and
Speaker 1: a TV producer who used to be married but aren't
Speaker 1: anymore and still talk sports together share the mic. Good Game, Nikki,
Speaker 1: Good Game, Lori Hernandez hw anyone who ever doubted Simone
Speaker 1: Biles go go Goat, Goat, Goat?
Speaker 2: What is your g name?
Speaker 1: Around? And Good Game with Sarah Spain is an iHeart
Speaker 1: women's sports production in partnership with Deep Blue Sports and Entertainment.
Speaker 2: You can find us on.
Speaker 1: The iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Speaker 1: Production by Wonder Media Network, our producers are Alex Azzi
Speaker 1: and Misha Jones. Our executive producers are Christina Everett, Jesse Katz,
Speaker 1: Jenny Kaplan.
Speaker 2: And Emily Rudder.
Speaker 1: Our editors are Jenny Kaplan, Emily Rudder, Brittany Martinez, and
Speaker 1: Grace Lynch. Production assistants from Lucy Jones and I'm Your
Speaker 1: Host Sarah Spain