1 00:00:00,840 --> 00:00:04,080 Speaker 1: Hey, everybody, it's Josh, and Chuck is here in spirit too, 2 00:00:04,360 --> 00:00:07,360 Speaker 1: and we just wanted to drop a casual reminder that 3 00:00:07,400 --> 00:00:11,680 Speaker 1: we are going to have a swinging Pacific Northwest Swing 4 00:00:11,880 --> 00:00:15,400 Speaker 1: this coming February, and tickets are now on sale. February 5 00:00:15,440 --> 00:00:18,520 Speaker 1: one will be at the More Theater in Seattle, February 6 00:00:18,600 --> 00:00:22,440 Speaker 1: two will be at Revolution Hall in Portland, and on 7 00:00:22,520 --> 00:00:25,600 Speaker 1: February three, for s F Sketch Fest, will be at 8 00:00:25,640 --> 00:00:28,600 Speaker 1: the Sydney Goldstein Theater. Go check out all of our 9 00:00:28,640 --> 00:00:32,479 Speaker 1: social media's for more information and links to tickets, and 10 00:00:32,520 --> 00:00:36,920 Speaker 1: we'll see you in February. Welcome to Stuff You Should Know, 11 00:00:37,280 --> 00:00:45,920 Speaker 1: a production of I Heart Radio. Hey, and welcome to 12 00:00:45,960 --> 00:00:48,720 Speaker 1: the podcast. I'm Josh and there's Chuck and Jerry's hanging 13 00:00:48,720 --> 00:00:50,919 Speaker 1: out too, so that makes us a good old fashioned 14 00:00:50,920 --> 00:00:56,680 Speaker 1: Stuff you Should Know, Episode Old School Top ten of Dish. Yeah. 15 00:00:56,680 --> 00:00:58,520 Speaker 1: Do you think we'll actually make it through ten of these? 16 00:00:59,680 --> 00:01:03,320 Speaker 1: I'm not. Maybe you'll you'll do all tend keep going 17 00:01:03,680 --> 00:01:06,800 Speaker 1: after you log off, how about that? Yeah, we could 18 00:01:06,800 --> 00:01:10,800 Speaker 1: probably get through all ten. And these they're they're pretty uh, 19 00:01:09,840 --> 00:01:13,360 Speaker 1: it's we'll see. Let's just start at the beginning. I 20 00:01:13,440 --> 00:01:15,680 Speaker 1: just want to make sure that we hit the last one, 21 00:01:16,000 --> 00:01:20,080 Speaker 1: number one for sure. Okay, let's do it. Then, all right, 22 00:01:20,280 --> 00:01:22,920 Speaker 1: what are we talking about? Even well, we're talking today 23 00:01:22,920 --> 00:01:25,679 Speaker 1: about cases of mistaken identity, as anyone who read the 24 00:01:25,680 --> 00:01:28,399 Speaker 1: title of this episode or maybe even the synopsis could 25 00:01:28,480 --> 00:01:31,600 Speaker 1: tell you. And we talked a lot Chuck in our 26 00:01:31,880 --> 00:01:35,560 Speaker 1: Doppelganger episode, which hopefully came out before this episode or 27 00:01:35,560 --> 00:01:38,000 Speaker 1: else people won't know what we're talking about. We talked 28 00:01:38,080 --> 00:01:40,039 Speaker 1: a lot about some of this stuff, which is like, 29 00:01:40,200 --> 00:01:43,319 Speaker 1: you know, terrible things can happen if somebody mistakes you 30 00:01:43,400 --> 00:01:46,400 Speaker 1: for somebody else. Um. And that even in in the 31 00:01:46,440 --> 00:01:51,640 Speaker 1: age of facial recognition technology and genetic testing, UM, that 32 00:01:51,640 --> 00:01:54,760 Speaker 1: stuff can still happen. And because of our faith and 33 00:01:54,840 --> 00:01:59,680 Speaker 1: things like facial recognition programs and DNA testing, if if 34 00:01:59,720 --> 00:02:03,200 Speaker 1: you you come up with a mistaken identity case, it 35 00:02:03,240 --> 00:02:05,760 Speaker 1: makes it much harder to be believed when you're like, 36 00:02:05,840 --> 00:02:08,359 Speaker 1: I swear to God, it wasn't me, because people say 37 00:02:08,800 --> 00:02:10,639 Speaker 1: we've got your d N a man, and it's a match. 38 00:02:10,960 --> 00:02:14,639 Speaker 1: It was you. You're just fibbing, yeah, And I think 39 00:02:14,680 --> 00:02:17,440 Speaker 1: it gets a lot more interesting when you're talking about 40 00:02:18,560 --> 00:02:22,480 Speaker 1: mistaken identity for a crime that has been committed. Yeah, totally, 41 00:02:22,639 --> 00:02:24,320 Speaker 1: So I already want to skip this first one, can 42 00:02:24,400 --> 00:02:27,840 Speaker 1: we sure, let's do it and we'll go instead to 43 00:02:28,240 --> 00:02:32,880 Speaker 1: uh grand Old Israel, where there was a an Australian 44 00:02:32,919 --> 00:02:35,720 Speaker 1: ex pat named Nicole McCabe who'd been living there for years, 45 00:02:35,800 --> 00:02:38,119 Speaker 1: was married. She was six months pregnant at the time. 46 00:02:38,120 --> 00:02:42,480 Speaker 1: That has happened in two thousand and yes, and apparently 47 00:02:42,639 --> 00:02:45,720 Speaker 1: she um was watching the news, the local news in Israel, 48 00:02:45,840 --> 00:02:50,639 Speaker 1: and Um I saw that there was an assassination of 49 00:02:50,680 --> 00:02:54,679 Speaker 1: one of the Hamas chiefs, Mahmoud. I'll mab Mabou, That's 50 00:02:54,680 --> 00:02:59,400 Speaker 1: what I'm going with. Mabu, Yeah, Mabu m ab h 51 00:02:59,440 --> 00:03:02,040 Speaker 1: o u A how else you going to say that? 52 00:03:02,040 --> 00:03:04,760 Speaker 1: That's how I would say it. So Um he was 53 00:03:04,800 --> 00:03:08,200 Speaker 1: assassinated in Dubai and the Dubai authorities were looking for 54 00:03:08,360 --> 00:03:11,960 Speaker 1: twenty six people, and one of them was Nicole McCabe 55 00:03:12,120 --> 00:03:14,160 Speaker 1: and she knew they were looking for because they showed 56 00:03:14,160 --> 00:03:18,760 Speaker 1: her passport on television. That's right, So she was like, 57 00:03:18,800 --> 00:03:22,280 Speaker 1: what is going on? W t F. So it turns 58 00:03:22,320 --> 00:03:30,080 Speaker 1: out that if you are in Israeli intelligence agency and 59 00:03:30,360 --> 00:03:33,640 Speaker 1: it's called Massad, you can say, hey, I want to 60 00:03:33,720 --> 00:03:37,000 Speaker 1: use real identities as a cover. So instead of like 61 00:03:37,600 --> 00:03:40,360 Speaker 1: making up a false identity as a cover for their agents, 62 00:03:40,640 --> 00:03:44,840 Speaker 1: they use real identities and they basically use the identities 63 00:03:45,440 --> 00:03:49,760 Speaker 1: of of foreigners living in Israel, and all twenty six 64 00:03:49,760 --> 00:03:53,400 Speaker 1: of these Westerners evidently, and this is why they were suspected, 65 00:03:53,880 --> 00:03:57,440 Speaker 1: is because they were real identities used by Massad as 66 00:03:57,520 --> 00:04:01,560 Speaker 1: cover that we're real people, and they just basically lifted 67 00:04:01,560 --> 00:04:04,920 Speaker 1: their information from government databases. It's not like she lost 68 00:04:04,920 --> 00:04:08,640 Speaker 1: her her license in her passport and stuff like that. 69 00:04:08,680 --> 00:04:12,360 Speaker 1: They just took it basically sorry, except they didn't say sorry. 70 00:04:12,400 --> 00:04:14,600 Speaker 1: I didn't even say sorry. They just did it. And 71 00:04:14,720 --> 00:04:18,960 Speaker 1: that's so like insidious that apparently the one some of 72 00:04:19,000 --> 00:04:23,120 Speaker 1: the ex pats living in Israel were Brits, and the 73 00:04:23,240 --> 00:04:27,040 Speaker 1: UK expelled the highest ranking MASSAD agent from the Israeli 74 00:04:27,120 --> 00:04:29,719 Speaker 1: embassy as a result of this. It's just like you 75 00:04:29,720 --> 00:04:32,279 Speaker 1: don't do that. And apparently that was like standard procedure 76 00:04:32,320 --> 00:04:35,760 Speaker 1: for the MASSAD. So Nicole McKay, being an Australian, was 77 00:04:36,240 --> 00:04:38,560 Speaker 1: expecting that Australia would help her out of like this 78 00:04:38,640 --> 00:04:41,520 Speaker 1: legal jam that she had been gotten into, and they 79 00:04:41,520 --> 00:04:44,000 Speaker 1: were like, how about we just give you another passport, 80 00:04:44,800 --> 00:04:46,320 Speaker 1: and she said, is that in And they said, yeah, 81 00:04:46,360 --> 00:04:48,440 Speaker 1: that's it, but you should probably take it because you're 82 00:04:48,440 --> 00:04:50,640 Speaker 1: going to be on every single watch list in the 83 00:04:50,680 --> 00:04:53,960 Speaker 1: world now using your old passport. Just go with a 84 00:04:54,000 --> 00:04:56,919 Speaker 1: new one. Do the smart thing, McCabe and she said, 85 00:04:57,080 --> 00:05:00,200 Speaker 1: cry key, let's go Now, this isn't twenty in. I 86 00:05:00,200 --> 00:05:02,680 Speaker 1: wonder if they've stopped using real identities because that just 87 00:05:02,720 --> 00:05:06,000 Speaker 1: seems like a recipe for trouble. It definitely does. It's 88 00:05:06,000 --> 00:05:07,919 Speaker 1: one of those things that was like super reported on, 89 00:05:08,040 --> 00:05:10,440 Speaker 1: and they never reported on the rain so I didn't 90 00:05:10,440 --> 00:05:12,640 Speaker 1: see any follow up stuff, but it was widely reported 91 00:05:12,640 --> 00:05:15,240 Speaker 1: on in different outlets about it, and it wasn't just 92 00:05:15,279 --> 00:05:17,520 Speaker 1: the same story over and over again. It was. It 93 00:05:17,560 --> 00:05:22,560 Speaker 1: was investigated, but there wasn't a lot of follow up. Yeah, alright, 94 00:05:22,560 --> 00:05:24,760 Speaker 1: moving on to the next one. Number eight or number two, 95 00:05:24,880 --> 00:05:27,719 Speaker 1: depending on how you want to number these. This was 96 00:05:27,800 --> 00:05:33,320 Speaker 1: a case of a mistaken identity. That also was the 97 00:05:33,360 --> 00:05:35,880 Speaker 1: case of someone else having that same name as well, 98 00:05:36,600 --> 00:05:39,919 Speaker 1: which is we talked a little bit about this someone 99 00:05:39,960 --> 00:05:41,800 Speaker 1: else I think in the Oh no, I don't think 100 00:05:41,800 --> 00:05:44,560 Speaker 1: that anyone had the same name in the Doppelganger episode. 101 00:05:44,560 --> 00:05:49,880 Speaker 1: Did they No, No, I don't think so. But that 102 00:05:49,960 --> 00:05:54,200 Speaker 1: was the case with Will West in New York about 103 00:05:54,240 --> 00:05:57,680 Speaker 1: the turn of the twentieth century. Yeah, he was brought 104 00:05:57,760 --> 00:06:00,040 Speaker 1: up on charges of manslaughter and taken to Level and 105 00:06:00,080 --> 00:06:04,360 Speaker 1: Worth prison. Um to be um, what's it called when 106 00:06:04,400 --> 00:06:09,479 Speaker 1: they induct you. It's not inducted? UM identify you? I 107 00:06:09,480 --> 00:06:14,040 Speaker 1: guess when they book you. Yes, you procedurally check you in. Sure, 108 00:06:14,200 --> 00:06:16,080 Speaker 1: that's what we'll go with as better than induction. I'll 109 00:06:16,080 --> 00:06:18,839 Speaker 1: tell you that, UM. And he said, I've never been 110 00:06:18,839 --> 00:06:21,000 Speaker 1: here before. I've never been in trouble with the law before. 111 00:06:21,600 --> 00:06:24,679 Speaker 1: H And as part of standard procedure, they followed the 112 00:06:24,800 --> 00:06:31,159 Speaker 1: um uh bertillion um process of measuring your head, your face, 113 00:06:31,480 --> 00:06:34,000 Speaker 1: the distance between your eyes, the length of your nose, 114 00:06:34,320 --> 00:06:37,120 Speaker 1: the width from ear to ear, all this different stuff. 115 00:06:37,440 --> 00:06:42,839 Speaker 1: It's a form of what's called anthropometry and throw and throw. No, 116 00:06:42,960 --> 00:06:45,880 Speaker 1: I'm going with anthropometry. And we've talked about before, I 117 00:06:45,880 --> 00:06:49,479 Speaker 1: think in the forensics episode, probably the fingerprinting episode. It 118 00:06:49,520 --> 00:06:52,320 Speaker 1: was the way that you distinguished one person from another, 119 00:06:52,440 --> 00:06:56,400 Speaker 1: usually criminals. Before we relied on fingerprints, and apparently it 120 00:06:56,440 --> 00:06:58,880 Speaker 1: worked really well because it was so granular and so 121 00:06:59,040 --> 00:07:02,599 Speaker 1: detailed and so they took will West's measurements and they said, 122 00:07:02,880 --> 00:07:05,279 Speaker 1: you know what, we found somebody with the exact same 123 00:07:05,279 --> 00:07:09,600 Speaker 1: measurements as you. Right, so you have the same name, 124 00:07:10,280 --> 00:07:14,640 Speaker 1: you have nearly identical measurements. According to this French uh 125 00:07:14,800 --> 00:07:19,280 Speaker 1: police procedure of of identifying people. Um, you look like 126 00:07:19,360 --> 00:07:21,520 Speaker 1: him in the photograph. It's not just that your head 127 00:07:21,560 --> 00:07:24,679 Speaker 1: measures out the same. And so we think we've got you, buddy, 128 00:07:24,720 --> 00:07:28,000 Speaker 1: and he's like, it's not me, I promise you. And 129 00:07:28,120 --> 00:07:31,920 Speaker 1: as it turns out, the real William West was already 130 00:07:31,920 --> 00:07:36,160 Speaker 1: in Leavenworth, already serving a life sentence for murder. And 131 00:07:36,240 --> 00:07:40,440 Speaker 1: even though fingerprinting wasn't widespread, they were able to use 132 00:07:40,560 --> 00:07:44,600 Speaker 1: in the early days of fingerprinting, um, their fingerprints to 133 00:07:44,600 --> 00:07:48,160 Speaker 1: to right this wrong. Yeah. Um. And some people have 134 00:07:48,200 --> 00:07:51,920 Speaker 1: speculated that these guys were actually like related somehow, maybe 135 00:07:51,920 --> 00:07:55,080 Speaker 1: even twins that were pulling a scam um. But as 136 00:07:55,120 --> 00:07:59,760 Speaker 1: far as anyone officially knows, they were essentially doppelgangers. That 137 00:07:59,800 --> 00:08:02,520 Speaker 1: how upen to have the same name, and they looked 138 00:08:02,560 --> 00:08:05,320 Speaker 1: so much alike if you look at pictures of them, like, 139 00:08:05,360 --> 00:08:09,960 Speaker 1: they were clearly doppelgangers. Um that will will West when 140 00:08:09,960 --> 00:08:12,440 Speaker 1: he was being booked. They showed him the pictures from 141 00:08:12,480 --> 00:08:15,960 Speaker 1: the past booking and he said, yeah, that's me, but 142 00:08:16,040 --> 00:08:17,920 Speaker 1: I don't know where you got that photo. Like that's 143 00:08:17,920 --> 00:08:19,600 Speaker 1: how much it looked like him. He thought it was 144 00:08:19,640 --> 00:08:23,600 Speaker 1: a photo of himself. So they ended up um moving 145 00:08:23,640 --> 00:08:27,320 Speaker 1: to fingerprints. I think the Warden of Leavenworth stopped using 146 00:08:27,360 --> 00:08:31,520 Speaker 1: the barche ln Um process like the next day, essentially 147 00:08:32,240 --> 00:08:35,000 Speaker 1: the fingerprints instead, because yeah, because everyone thought the bear 148 00:08:35,080 --> 00:08:38,959 Speaker 1: chelon Um process was like unassailable, and then it showed no, 149 00:08:39,120 --> 00:08:42,000 Speaker 1: there's a problem, and fingerprints got got us out of 150 00:08:42,040 --> 00:08:44,439 Speaker 1: this jam. So let's just all move to fingerprints. From 151 00:08:44,480 --> 00:08:47,720 Speaker 1: that point one, the headtime headline the next day said 152 00:08:48,160 --> 00:08:54,400 Speaker 1: bird alone process assailable. Exclamation point. Clark says fingerprints rule. 153 00:08:56,200 --> 00:08:58,719 Speaker 1: Uh oh, yeah, you're Clark. I got that. Now it 154 00:09:00,080 --> 00:09:03,960 Speaker 1: sounds like he was Clark, all right, And now we 155 00:09:03,960 --> 00:09:09,160 Speaker 1: can move on to the case of uh, well, three gentlemen. 156 00:09:09,640 --> 00:09:12,800 Speaker 1: Uh there was a bad guy who committed crimes under 157 00:09:12,840 --> 00:09:16,760 Speaker 1: the names John Smith and a much more fancy pants 158 00:09:16,800 --> 00:09:20,439 Speaker 1: and name Lord Wilton to Willoughby. Uh And it seemed 159 00:09:20,480 --> 00:09:24,240 Speaker 1: like this guy and for about uh geez, for almost 160 00:09:24,280 --> 00:09:29,160 Speaker 1: twenty years, was bilking women out of their jewelry by uh, 161 00:09:29,360 --> 00:09:32,320 Speaker 1: I guess writing bad checks. He was a con man 162 00:09:32,320 --> 00:09:35,319 Speaker 1: and a thief, and I made a man named Adolph 163 00:09:35,400 --> 00:09:39,960 Speaker 1: Beck was mistaken for this man. And it wasn't just 164 00:09:40,000 --> 00:09:42,200 Speaker 1: the case of oh you look like him, we booked you, 165 00:09:42,240 --> 00:09:45,199 Speaker 1: but hey, we cleared it up. This guy did hard time, 166 00:09:45,400 --> 00:09:50,240 Speaker 1: seven years in prison. Yeah. So um. Apparently Lord Wilton 167 00:09:50,280 --> 00:09:54,080 Speaker 1: to Willoughby's scam was he would find a woman say 168 00:09:54,120 --> 00:09:56,880 Speaker 1: that he was looking for a mistress, and I think 169 00:09:56,880 --> 00:10:00,000 Speaker 1: he'll do you just find you like me? I like you, um, 170 00:10:00,160 --> 00:10:02,439 Speaker 1: And hey, that jewelry you're wearing is kind of shabby. 171 00:10:02,440 --> 00:10:04,360 Speaker 1: Why don't you give it to me? And I will 172 00:10:04,400 --> 00:10:06,480 Speaker 1: take it and use it for size to get some 173 00:10:06,600 --> 00:10:09,520 Speaker 1: very nice jewelry. Um. And then he just wouldn't return 174 00:10:09,559 --> 00:10:11,560 Speaker 1: the jewelry. And it was such a petty crime. This 175 00:10:11,679 --> 00:10:14,920 Speaker 1: wasn't nice jewelry. Like he must have taken tens of 176 00:10:14,960 --> 00:10:18,000 Speaker 1: dollars worth of jewelry, but he did it very frequently. 177 00:10:18,600 --> 00:10:22,760 Speaker 1: He was convicted and put in prison in eighteen seventy seven. 178 00:10:23,600 --> 00:10:26,280 Speaker 1: The exact same crime was carried out in eighteen nine 179 00:10:26,760 --> 00:10:30,240 Speaker 1: by him. But it just so happened that Adolph Beck 180 00:10:30,640 --> 00:10:33,080 Speaker 1: was fingered for that crime, and they were like you 181 00:10:33,200 --> 00:10:35,720 Speaker 1: and you were the same man who was convicted in 182 00:10:35,800 --> 00:10:37,880 Speaker 1: eighteen seventy seven, and we know it. And he said, no, 183 00:10:38,000 --> 00:10:39,800 Speaker 1: it wasn't me. It wasn't me, and they didn't listen 184 00:10:39,840 --> 00:10:42,200 Speaker 1: to him like you said. He did hard time, like 185 00:10:42,480 --> 00:10:47,200 Speaker 1: for years, yeah, for seven years, and he had a 186 00:10:47,240 --> 00:10:49,320 Speaker 1: lot of evidence to prove that it wasn't him. He 187 00:10:49,360 --> 00:10:52,600 Speaker 1: was like, hey, I was in Peru during this initial crime, 188 00:10:52,600 --> 00:10:56,600 Speaker 1: and I can prove that. And he said, also, I'm 189 00:10:56,640 --> 00:11:02,800 Speaker 1: not circumcised. Take a look at this, and everyone went hey, no, no, no, 190 00:11:02,800 --> 00:11:06,280 Speaker 1: no no. He said this is important to stop being childish. Well, 191 00:11:06,320 --> 00:11:10,199 Speaker 1: but that's true. He was not circumcised apparently. I mean, 192 00:11:10,200 --> 00:11:12,439 Speaker 1: who was the real name. I think maybe Frederick Meyer. 193 00:11:12,800 --> 00:11:15,760 Speaker 1: I saw that, I saw William Thomas, William Wyatt. I'm 194 00:11:15,800 --> 00:11:18,600 Speaker 1: not sure. Most people just referred to him as John Smith, 195 00:11:20,320 --> 00:11:26,880 Speaker 1: John old circumcised Smith. So, uh, fifteen convictions, seven years 196 00:11:26,880 --> 00:11:29,640 Speaker 1: in prison, and it gets worse. He finally gets out 197 00:11:29,679 --> 00:11:31,880 Speaker 1: of prison for a crime he didn't commit. He's in 198 00:11:31,960 --> 00:11:35,200 Speaker 1: his I think he's sixty at this point, and old 199 00:11:35,200 --> 00:11:37,280 Speaker 1: Lord Willoughby was still going to work and this guy 200 00:11:37,320 --> 00:11:42,400 Speaker 1: got convicted again for the same guy's crime. Yeah. So somebody, 201 00:11:42,480 --> 00:11:45,040 Speaker 1: luckily and journalists that the Daily Mail had taken an 202 00:11:45,040 --> 00:11:47,439 Speaker 1: interest in this, was like, this is a gross miscarriage 203 00:11:47,440 --> 00:11:50,440 Speaker 1: of justice, Like it's been documented, this is not the 204 00:11:50,480 --> 00:11:53,600 Speaker 1: same guy for years, and they're going after him again. 205 00:11:53,720 --> 00:11:57,280 Speaker 1: So he turned public um opinion against the Crown and 206 00:11:57,520 --> 00:12:00,120 Speaker 1: basically pointed to the to the prosecutor and said this 207 00:12:00,120 --> 00:12:04,040 Speaker 1: point his penis right. He said, this man is not 208 00:12:04,040 --> 00:12:07,680 Speaker 1: not not only incompetent, he's almost a fraud. He's such 209 00:12:07,720 --> 00:12:10,880 Speaker 1: a bad lawyer, um, and we should release this guy. 210 00:12:10,920 --> 00:12:13,439 Speaker 1: So not only did they release him, the Crown gave 211 00:12:13,520 --> 00:12:17,240 Speaker 1: him a five thousand dollar compensation I'm sorry, five thousand 212 00:12:17,240 --> 00:12:20,760 Speaker 1: pound compensation, I chuck. Not only did I do the 213 00:12:21,720 --> 00:12:25,560 Speaker 1: inflation calculator for pounds, I converted it to dollars. All right, 214 00:12:25,640 --> 00:12:28,360 Speaker 1: let's hear it. So in nine, five thousand pounds was 215 00:12:28,400 --> 00:12:32,160 Speaker 1: worth about six hundred and eighty three thousand pounds today, 216 00:12:32,240 --> 00:12:34,440 Speaker 1: And if you convert that to dollars today, he got 217 00:12:34,520 --> 00:12:39,720 Speaker 1: seven hundred and eighty seven thousand dollars. That's about a 218 00:12:39,760 --> 00:12:43,280 Speaker 1: hundred grand a year in prison. I get the impression 219 00:12:43,320 --> 00:12:45,120 Speaker 1: he wasn't a bad guy from what I saw, but 220 00:12:45,280 --> 00:12:48,640 Speaker 1: he Um was not a magnet for money. Apparently he 221 00:12:48,960 --> 00:12:52,320 Speaker 1: did not die Um with any money. I'm gonna just 222 00:12:52,360 --> 00:12:53,680 Speaker 1: say it. I know how much you hate it. He 223 00:12:53,720 --> 00:12:58,360 Speaker 1: died penniless. But one of the upshots of this is 224 00:12:58,480 --> 00:13:02,240 Speaker 1: a direct result of the miscarriage of justice from just 225 00:13:02,400 --> 00:13:06,480 Speaker 1: mistaken identity Um. The British Court of Appeals was established 226 00:13:06,640 --> 00:13:10,560 Speaker 1: like three years after he was convicted the last time. Well, 227 00:13:10,600 --> 00:13:13,240 Speaker 1: and it became sort of a hey, eyewitness because I 228 00:13:13,240 --> 00:13:16,720 Speaker 1: think sixteen people identified him, and it sort of became 229 00:13:16,760 --> 00:13:20,240 Speaker 1: a hey, this reliability of eyewitnesses is not something we 230 00:13:20,280 --> 00:13:23,240 Speaker 1: could really lean into all the time. Sixteen people, he 231 00:13:23,280 --> 00:13:25,120 Speaker 1: really did look a lot like him. But I mean, 232 00:13:25,320 --> 00:13:27,720 Speaker 1: come on, there's got to be something like, like, you 233 00:13:27,800 --> 00:13:32,120 Speaker 1: can't read a genuine protestation from an innocent person. Let's 234 00:13:32,200 --> 00:13:34,880 Speaker 1: let's open our eyes a little bit here, people, Okay, yeah, 235 00:13:34,960 --> 00:13:36,720 Speaker 1: and open your pants and just check out the penis. 236 00:13:36,760 --> 00:13:38,679 Speaker 1: That would have solved that once and for all right. 237 00:13:39,440 --> 00:13:42,280 Speaker 1: They were just so prude. I guess they wouldn't even 238 00:13:42,320 --> 00:13:44,840 Speaker 1: look at that very clear evidence. I mean they were 239 00:13:44,960 --> 00:13:48,280 Speaker 1: Victorian Chuck, all right, Should we take a break. Yeah, 240 00:13:48,400 --> 00:13:50,199 Speaker 1: I gotta say I'm having a lot of fun here, 241 00:13:50,240 --> 00:13:51,760 Speaker 1: but I do think we should take a break at 242 00:13:51,800 --> 00:14:18,400 Speaker 1: this point. Okay, let's do it all right. Uh this 243 00:14:18,440 --> 00:14:23,600 Speaker 1: one is a little uh sad on a lot of levels. Um. 244 00:14:23,600 --> 00:14:26,320 Speaker 1: This was a medical identity theft. And by the way, 245 00:14:26,360 --> 00:14:28,680 Speaker 1: this we want to thank our old If we're doing 246 00:14:28,720 --> 00:14:31,240 Speaker 1: a top ten, chances are it's from our old friends 247 00:14:31,240 --> 00:14:33,720 Speaker 1: at house stuffworks dot com because to write a lot 248 00:14:33,760 --> 00:14:37,800 Speaker 1: of those. This one specifically is by Nicholas Jervis or 249 00:14:37,840 --> 00:14:39,600 Speaker 1: gerbas So. I don't know how you pronounce the thing, 250 00:14:39,640 --> 00:14:41,080 Speaker 1: but I think he did a bang up job on 251 00:14:41,120 --> 00:14:43,520 Speaker 1: this one. Bang up job. Uh. So. This is a 252 00:14:43,520 --> 00:14:48,240 Speaker 1: case of Anne Dorree Sacks, who lived in Salt Lake City, Utah, 253 00:14:48,440 --> 00:14:52,400 Speaker 1: was a mom at four kids, and um, all of 254 00:14:52,440 --> 00:14:58,440 Speaker 1: a sudden was reported that her newborn child under her 255 00:14:58,560 --> 00:15:02,000 Speaker 1: name tested positive for legal drugs, which is a problem 256 00:15:02,040 --> 00:15:06,200 Speaker 1: for that mom. She's like, hey, listen, I got four kids, 257 00:15:06,280 --> 00:15:08,680 Speaker 1: but I don't have a newborn and I certainly don't 258 00:15:08,680 --> 00:15:11,840 Speaker 1: have a newborn that tested positive for drugs. Myth no 259 00:15:12,040 --> 00:15:16,600 Speaker 1: less um. So, not only was the newborn tested positive 260 00:15:16,680 --> 00:15:19,960 Speaker 1: for meth, the newborn had been abandoned by the mother, 261 00:15:20,080 --> 00:15:23,080 Speaker 1: who had also split with a ten thousand dollar medical bill, 262 00:15:24,480 --> 00:15:28,120 Speaker 1: Dick's her baby to meth abandons. The baby doesn't pay 263 00:15:28,160 --> 00:15:31,480 Speaker 1: a ten bill, So of course the hospitals like, you're 264 00:15:31,520 --> 00:15:33,400 Speaker 1: a crook and we're not gonna listen anything you said. 265 00:15:33,880 --> 00:15:36,440 Speaker 1: The woman's like, no, I swear to God it was 266 00:15:36,520 --> 00:15:40,520 Speaker 1: not me. And finally turned out that drug addicted um 267 00:15:40,960 --> 00:15:45,400 Speaker 1: uh woman had broken into and Dory Sacks's car, got 268 00:15:45,400 --> 00:15:47,680 Speaker 1: her I D which is a lesson, never leave your 269 00:15:47,720 --> 00:15:50,160 Speaker 1: life your license in your car. That's just a bad 270 00:15:50,200 --> 00:15:54,080 Speaker 1: idea all around, got her medical records and then went 271 00:15:54,160 --> 00:15:58,920 Speaker 1: and gave birth as and Dorry Sacks and ultimately apparently 272 00:15:59,000 --> 00:16:04,520 Speaker 1: amended and Dorr Sachs medical history. Um with with this 273 00:16:04,520 --> 00:16:08,560 Speaker 1: this information that may or may not have been purged. Yeah, 274 00:16:08,640 --> 00:16:12,760 Speaker 1: so you know, who knows what uh this impostor reported 275 00:16:12,760 --> 00:16:16,040 Speaker 1: about their medical history? But Sacks can't find out because 276 00:16:16,080 --> 00:16:20,680 Speaker 1: there are laws, privacy laws that prevent the records from 277 00:16:20,720 --> 00:16:25,640 Speaker 1: being shown even to her. So basically she has uh 278 00:16:25,800 --> 00:16:27,400 Speaker 1: she has to always sort of be on the lookout 279 00:16:27,520 --> 00:16:30,200 Speaker 1: for this. She has in real life a clotting disorder 280 00:16:30,920 --> 00:16:32,920 Speaker 1: in her blood and if she's given the wrong blood 281 00:16:32,920 --> 00:16:36,000 Speaker 1: type she could die. So she doesn't really even know 282 00:16:36,080 --> 00:16:38,600 Speaker 1: what's in there for what kind of blood type she 283 00:16:38,640 --> 00:16:42,200 Speaker 1: has on her medical records. So now Andrey Sachs has 284 00:16:42,240 --> 00:16:46,120 Speaker 1: to be just really careful and I guess proactive anytime 285 00:16:46,160 --> 00:16:49,200 Speaker 1: she goes to the hospital or doctor. Yeah, the whole 286 00:16:49,200 --> 00:16:52,200 Speaker 1: thing is called medical identity theft. This happened and I 287 00:16:52,240 --> 00:16:55,360 Speaker 1: think two thousand tennis and it was like a super 288 00:16:55,400 --> 00:16:58,800 Speaker 1: scary two thousand ten things to happen, But apparently it 289 00:16:58,880 --> 00:17:02,280 Speaker 1: was happening at the time early frequently enough that they 290 00:17:02,320 --> 00:17:04,440 Speaker 1: interviewed a couple other people and they were like, man, 291 00:17:04,760 --> 00:17:07,520 Speaker 1: if this happens to you, you are on your own, 292 00:17:08,000 --> 00:17:10,280 Speaker 1: because not only is the hospital not helping you, they 293 00:17:10,280 --> 00:17:14,840 Speaker 1: sick um basically billing investigators to find out what's going on. 294 00:17:15,400 --> 00:17:19,080 Speaker 1: And they interviewed and Dory Sex's like children to find 295 00:17:19,080 --> 00:17:22,560 Speaker 1: out had mommy been pregnant recently. Um. They would not 296 00:17:22,680 --> 00:17:25,040 Speaker 1: believe her. They just they did not take her word 297 00:17:25,040 --> 00:17:27,200 Speaker 1: for it. And it wasn't until she um took a 298 00:17:27,320 --> 00:17:30,359 Speaker 1: DNA test to prove like, this is not my child 299 00:17:30,640 --> 00:17:34,440 Speaker 1: they finally off. I wonder if you could like demand 300 00:17:34,480 --> 00:17:37,280 Speaker 1: that first rather than putting your family through all that, 301 00:17:37,359 --> 00:17:39,520 Speaker 1: you know, I think, so you just show up with 302 00:17:39,560 --> 00:17:42,240 Speaker 1: a zip block bag of blood at the investigator's office 303 00:17:42,240 --> 00:17:44,160 Speaker 1: and be like test this. You just plunk it down 304 00:17:44,200 --> 00:17:45,960 Speaker 1: on the desk in front of them, or just spit 305 00:17:46,000 --> 00:17:50,960 Speaker 1: at them and say collect this. Oh boy, check. That 306 00:17:51,040 --> 00:17:53,800 Speaker 1: turned dark pretty fast. But I liked it. Well, that 307 00:17:53,840 --> 00:17:57,400 Speaker 1: whole story was dark. It's very just a heartbreaking situation 308 00:17:57,400 --> 00:17:59,960 Speaker 1: all the way around. I've got a little positive spin 309 00:18:00,080 --> 00:18:04,080 Speaker 1: for you. Then at the end of the article I read, 310 00:18:04,800 --> 00:18:07,440 Speaker 1: you know, this is a different article. Apparently the mother um, 311 00:18:07,480 --> 00:18:10,760 Speaker 1: the actual like biological mom who had abandon her kid, 312 00:18:10,880 --> 00:18:12,960 Speaker 1: got let out of jail because she played guilty to 313 00:18:13,040 --> 00:18:15,280 Speaker 1: some other stuff and did some time, and like did 314 00:18:15,280 --> 00:18:19,040 Speaker 1: her time. But and Dory Sachs was interviewed and when 315 00:18:19,080 --> 00:18:21,360 Speaker 1: asked how she felt about it, and she said, if 316 00:18:21,400 --> 00:18:23,720 Speaker 1: the use of my ideas would allowed that baby a 317 00:18:23,800 --> 00:18:26,760 Speaker 1: chance to survive, then it's worth it to me. Wow, 318 00:18:28,119 --> 00:18:30,040 Speaker 1: I thought you were gonna say that, you know, the 319 00:18:30,359 --> 00:18:33,040 Speaker 1: biological momb turned her life around and reclaimed the baby. 320 00:18:33,119 --> 00:18:39,879 Speaker 1: And don't be naives. Oh that's a good one. How 321 00:18:39,920 --> 00:18:47,560 Speaker 1: about this number five? Or we skipped one, so number four, six, six? 322 00:18:48,840 --> 00:18:51,320 Speaker 1: How can we be that's this bad? At this? I 323 00:18:51,359 --> 00:18:56,040 Speaker 1: don't know math, Uh in two thousand three, the cops 324 00:18:56,600 --> 00:18:59,200 Speaker 1: in Britain said, we would very much like to arrestue 325 00:18:59,480 --> 00:19:01,640 Speaker 1: Peter hamm Can and that's how we do things over 326 00:19:01,720 --> 00:19:04,399 Speaker 1: here for cops. Because we think you've murdered someone. We're 327 00:19:04,440 --> 00:19:06,159 Speaker 1: not gonna pull a gun on you, or we're just 328 00:19:06,160 --> 00:19:09,199 Speaker 1: gonna ask you very kindly to come with us. We 329 00:19:09,240 --> 00:19:12,160 Speaker 1: think you murdered murdered a woman in Italy last year 330 00:19:12,320 --> 00:19:15,520 Speaker 1: in two thousand two. You match the description of the person, 331 00:19:16,040 --> 00:19:18,520 Speaker 1: and you're coming with me. But this bartender was like, 332 00:19:19,040 --> 00:19:23,040 Speaker 1: I've never been to Italy and they're like, you sound 333 00:19:23,080 --> 00:19:24,760 Speaker 1: like you have it. As a matter of fact, you 334 00:19:24,800 --> 00:19:27,400 Speaker 1: sound like you're from Italy, friend, he said, but it's 335 00:19:27,520 --> 00:19:31,040 Speaker 1: not a true. So this bartender, what was his name, 336 00:19:32,320 --> 00:19:35,960 Speaker 1: Peter Hampkin, I believe he was like, what do you 337 00:19:35,960 --> 00:19:38,760 Speaker 1: guys have never been to Italy. I certainly wasn't there 338 00:19:38,760 --> 00:19:42,040 Speaker 1: when this this murder happened. They said, okay, not only 339 00:19:42,080 --> 00:19:44,480 Speaker 1: do you look just like the description of the guy 340 00:19:44,520 --> 00:19:47,280 Speaker 1: that we're looking for, we're gonna take your blood and 341 00:19:47,520 --> 00:19:50,840 Speaker 1: oh yeah, you're a match, my friend, you're a match 342 00:19:50,960 --> 00:19:53,120 Speaker 1: to this. Uh. I guess the evidence that had been 343 00:19:53,119 --> 00:19:56,760 Speaker 1: found on the scene and um, Peter Hampkin was suddenly 344 00:19:56,760 --> 00:19:59,040 Speaker 1: in a lot of trouble despite the fact that it 345 00:19:59,119 --> 00:20:00,960 Speaker 1: was not himp And this is where we were just 346 00:20:01,040 --> 00:20:04,359 Speaker 1: kind of like the beginnings of the true dystopian um 347 00:20:04,600 --> 00:20:08,440 Speaker 1: mistaken identity stuff. Yeah, this one I don't. I mean, 348 00:20:08,440 --> 00:20:12,800 Speaker 1: I understand it in a way. But here's how it works. 349 00:20:12,920 --> 00:20:17,320 Speaker 1: If you are using DNA databases to match someone, it 350 00:20:17,440 --> 00:20:21,600 Speaker 1: is going to compare um subsites on the strand that 351 00:20:21,640 --> 00:20:25,080 Speaker 1: are called locusts or together they're called loki. And that's 352 00:20:25,119 --> 00:20:27,560 Speaker 1: just like I've seen it described as showing like the 353 00:20:27,640 --> 00:20:31,760 Speaker 1: genes neighborhood is the physical location of the geneo a chromosome, 354 00:20:32,560 --> 00:20:34,600 Speaker 1: And depending on where you are and what lab you 355 00:20:34,680 --> 00:20:37,280 Speaker 1: are and where you are in the world, you might 356 00:20:37,400 --> 00:20:39,640 Speaker 1: use a different a certain amount of these low key 357 00:20:40,280 --> 00:20:44,000 Speaker 1: as identifiers. In the States, I think the FBI uses thirteen. 358 00:20:44,920 --> 00:20:51,480 Speaker 1: In the UK it is ten. And apparently that you 359 00:20:51,520 --> 00:20:54,480 Speaker 1: can like make mistakes, like I thought DNA was the 360 00:20:54,480 --> 00:20:58,240 Speaker 1: gold standard, and reading this, it seems like if you're 361 00:20:58,280 --> 00:21:00,960 Speaker 1: just looking at as low as six low ki for 362 00:21:01,040 --> 00:21:04,560 Speaker 1: a match, then that's can be a real problem. It 363 00:21:04,640 --> 00:21:07,840 Speaker 1: certainly can. I think they thought before that nine gave 364 00:21:07,880 --> 00:21:11,000 Speaker 1: you a one and a hundred and thirteen billion chance 365 00:21:11,119 --> 00:21:14,760 Speaker 1: of a false positive. But apparently people looked into and 366 00:21:14,760 --> 00:21:17,040 Speaker 1: they're like, where did you get that evidence? FBI, and 367 00:21:17,080 --> 00:21:19,400 Speaker 1: they're like, we don't have to tell you'd be quiet. Um, 368 00:21:19,440 --> 00:21:23,680 Speaker 1: So no one's entirely certain what m the actual chances. 369 00:21:24,200 --> 00:21:28,280 Speaker 1: But the basis you said d NA was the gold standard, 370 00:21:28,400 --> 00:21:31,280 Speaker 1: it totally is for forensics, and the chances are really 371 00:21:31,320 --> 00:21:34,679 Speaker 1: really small that there would be a false match using 372 00:21:34,800 --> 00:21:38,800 Speaker 1: standard search procedures. Because they're looking at I think you 373 00:21:38,840 --> 00:21:42,560 Speaker 1: said thirteen. I believe they've up to ten. Yeah, they've 374 00:21:42,600 --> 00:21:44,919 Speaker 1: uped it to twenty. There's twenty sites that they say 375 00:21:45,080 --> 00:21:47,560 Speaker 1: these loki. These loki are going to be the ones 376 00:21:47,600 --> 00:21:50,800 Speaker 1: that we check. And you can have a minimum when 377 00:21:50,840 --> 00:21:54,439 Speaker 1: you like, if you arrest somebody and you take their blood, 378 00:21:54,600 --> 00:21:57,119 Speaker 1: you work up a DNA profile of that person, you 379 00:21:57,200 --> 00:21:59,520 Speaker 1: have to have at least a minimum of those twenty 380 00:21:59,640 --> 00:22:03,040 Speaker 1: cover preferably up to twenty for your for your profile. 381 00:22:03,320 --> 00:22:04,919 Speaker 1: And then the more you have and the more you 382 00:22:04,960 --> 00:22:08,399 Speaker 1: match the twenty loca, the less of a chance you 383 00:22:08,480 --> 00:22:12,960 Speaker 1: have of a false positive. But it can happen. And 384 00:22:13,000 --> 00:22:16,800 Speaker 1: I think the point of the people who are saying like, um, 385 00:22:16,960 --> 00:22:18,760 Speaker 1: we need to talk about this. That there can be 386 00:22:18,840 --> 00:22:21,639 Speaker 1: false positive is because if you are on a jury, 387 00:22:21,760 --> 00:22:23,280 Speaker 1: especially if you watch a lot of C s I 388 00:22:23,359 --> 00:22:25,480 Speaker 1: or Law and Order, you're like, you got DNA evidence, 389 00:22:25,560 --> 00:22:28,000 Speaker 1: it's over for you. Pal The idea that it could 390 00:22:28,040 --> 00:22:30,520 Speaker 1: be wrong is just out the window. And they're like, 391 00:22:30,560 --> 00:22:33,639 Speaker 1: we need to train the public injuries better than this 392 00:22:33,760 --> 00:22:37,439 Speaker 1: because they think it's it's again unassailable, right, But the 393 00:22:37,480 --> 00:22:43,000 Speaker 1: idea is you can always get way more granular with 394 00:22:43,080 --> 00:22:49,080 Speaker 1: your DNA uh peek alou and and and really find 395 00:22:49,080 --> 00:22:51,680 Speaker 1: out the truth though, right, Well, that's how Peter Hampkin 396 00:22:51,800 --> 00:22:54,280 Speaker 1: finally got off that bartender that kicked this whole thing off. 397 00:22:54,359 --> 00:22:57,639 Speaker 1: He they did a further DNA profile of them, and 398 00:22:57,680 --> 00:23:00,480 Speaker 1: they're like, Okay, it's not you. Because the chances of 399 00:23:00,560 --> 00:23:04,600 Speaker 1: somebody having those same mutations. They look at short tandem 400 00:23:04,640 --> 00:23:08,960 Speaker 1: repeating um snippets, which are non protein coding sequences, which 401 00:23:09,000 --> 00:23:12,320 Speaker 1: means like, it doesn't matter if they mutate a lot, 402 00:23:12,359 --> 00:23:14,119 Speaker 1: So they mutate a lot. So the chances of you 403 00:23:14,200 --> 00:23:17,399 Speaker 1: having the same mutation in all twenty of those is 404 00:23:17,680 --> 00:23:20,600 Speaker 1: vanishing lee small, and even in all eight of them 405 00:23:20,720 --> 00:23:24,000 Speaker 1: is pretty small enough. That it is still the gold standard. 406 00:23:24,280 --> 00:23:26,400 Speaker 1: It's just if you get caught and you have money 407 00:23:26,440 --> 00:23:27,920 Speaker 1: for a good lawyer, you can be like, you need 408 00:23:28,000 --> 00:23:30,480 Speaker 1: to do a better profile, and then they'll find that 409 00:23:30,520 --> 00:23:34,200 Speaker 1: it's not actually you. And of course I use peak alou, 410 00:23:34,280 --> 00:23:38,119 Speaker 1: that's not the official language they use for looking at DNA. 411 00:23:38,200 --> 00:23:44,920 Speaker 1: That's peekaboo. I used the slang. Okay, all right, I 412 00:23:44,960 --> 00:23:46,760 Speaker 1: think we do one more then we take our other break. 413 00:23:46,760 --> 00:23:49,480 Speaker 1: How about that? Okay, I'm still having a lot of 414 00:23:49,480 --> 00:23:55,080 Speaker 1: fun here, chuck um. Alright, so I guess we're on 415 00:23:55,320 --> 00:23:58,399 Speaker 1: either number four or number three and number five or 416 00:23:58,480 --> 00:24:04,639 Speaker 1: number uh. There was a interesting case of mistaken identity 417 00:24:04,880 --> 00:24:08,840 Speaker 1: in UM which turned out to be a sibling. In Alaska, 418 00:24:08,920 --> 00:24:13,919 Speaker 1: police had a sexual assault case and it was they 419 00:24:13,920 --> 00:24:17,000 Speaker 1: had a semen sample, they had usable DNA, they had 420 00:24:17,040 --> 00:24:20,640 Speaker 1: a DNA match. This guy was already in the system, 421 00:24:20,680 --> 00:24:22,600 Speaker 1: so they thought like, all right, this is an open 422 00:24:22,600 --> 00:24:27,239 Speaker 1: and shut case. Except one problem. This guy is was 423 00:24:27,280 --> 00:24:30,879 Speaker 1: in jail already when the crime was committed, So what 424 00:24:30,920 --> 00:24:35,280 Speaker 1: are we gonna do? Yeah, this one was incredibly fascinating. 425 00:24:35,280 --> 00:24:40,000 Speaker 1: I think this Alaskan um UH. DNA analysts or forensic 426 00:24:40,000 --> 00:24:43,600 Speaker 1: analysts like like went around the country giving talks on 427 00:24:43,600 --> 00:24:46,680 Speaker 1: this case and really opened people's eyes because it turned 428 00:24:46,720 --> 00:24:50,560 Speaker 1: out that the guy who was in prison whose DNA 429 00:24:50,680 --> 00:24:53,960 Speaker 1: matched the semen on the crime scene. I guess um 430 00:24:54,280 --> 00:24:58,640 Speaker 1: had gotten a bone marrow transplant from his brother, and 431 00:24:58,720 --> 00:25:02,479 Speaker 1: because of that, he was carrying around his brother's DNA 432 00:25:02,720 --> 00:25:05,440 Speaker 1: in his blood. Because when you get a bow marrow transplant, 433 00:25:05,480 --> 00:25:09,119 Speaker 1: you're getting uh like a red blood cell um stem 434 00:25:09,160 --> 00:25:12,200 Speaker 1: cell transplant, and those things turned into red blood cells 435 00:25:12,200 --> 00:25:14,919 Speaker 1: and they test your blood, So whatever DNA your blood 436 00:25:14,920 --> 00:25:17,280 Speaker 1: has is what they come back with on the DNA profile. 437 00:25:17,880 --> 00:25:22,240 Speaker 1: I wonder if the other brother immediately was like, you're 438 00:25:22,280 --> 00:25:25,800 Speaker 1: looking for my brother, because like maybe it sounds like 439 00:25:25,960 --> 00:25:27,840 Speaker 1: the brother. You know, the other brother was not a 440 00:25:27,840 --> 00:25:31,920 Speaker 1: good guy obviously, I mean, clearly if he committed sexual assault, 441 00:25:31,960 --> 00:25:34,439 Speaker 1: but if he was already in jail for something else, 442 00:25:34,960 --> 00:25:38,639 Speaker 1: then it sounds like good good brother, bad brother. They 443 00:25:38,640 --> 00:25:42,920 Speaker 1: were both sexual assaulters. The one was already in jail 444 00:25:42,960 --> 00:25:44,840 Speaker 1: for it. The one who actually did it had not 445 00:25:44,960 --> 00:25:47,000 Speaker 1: been caught yet. They thought that the guy who was 446 00:25:47,240 --> 00:25:50,560 Speaker 1: in jail already was the purp for the outside one, 447 00:25:51,000 --> 00:25:54,120 Speaker 1: and it turned out knows the whole family of sexual 448 00:25:54,200 --> 00:25:58,440 Speaker 1: assaulters makes a lot more sense now, Yeah, I get it, Okay, 449 00:25:58,480 --> 00:26:01,120 Speaker 1: all right, I mean it made sense before, but this, 450 00:26:01,119 --> 00:26:05,440 Speaker 1: this makes such glorious sense. The like the blinders are off, 451 00:26:05,800 --> 00:26:08,760 Speaker 1: so um, this really is like enough of a thing 452 00:26:08,840 --> 00:26:12,200 Speaker 1: that that forensic analysts from Alaska who discovered this, because 453 00:26:12,200 --> 00:26:14,160 Speaker 1: at first they were like, well the lab obviously made 454 00:26:14,200 --> 00:26:16,240 Speaker 1: as up and they looked in there like what is 455 00:26:16,280 --> 00:26:19,439 Speaker 1: going on here? They started looking into it more and 456 00:26:19,440 --> 00:26:21,600 Speaker 1: they're like, this could be a thing. Actually we need 457 00:26:21,640 --> 00:26:25,640 Speaker 1: to let the law enforcement know, Like there's a thing 458 00:26:25,720 --> 00:26:29,160 Speaker 1: that happens when you get a bowemarrow transplant. Your DNA changes. 459 00:26:29,920 --> 00:26:32,040 Speaker 1: And they there was a guy named Chris Long on 460 00:26:32,160 --> 00:26:34,440 Speaker 1: a um I read about an I f L Science 461 00:26:34,600 --> 00:26:38,400 Speaker 1: article UM and they tested him four years after he'd 462 00:26:38,440 --> 00:26:42,320 Speaker 1: gotten a um A transplant from a donor in Germany 463 00:26:42,400 --> 00:26:45,720 Speaker 1: who we never met, I don't believe, and his DNA 464 00:26:46,080 --> 00:26:49,480 Speaker 1: in different parts of his body were entirely the donors. 465 00:26:49,720 --> 00:26:54,680 Speaker 1: Including get this, chuck, his semen had had nothing but 466 00:26:55,119 --> 00:26:58,960 Speaker 1: his donor's DNA. So if he fathered a child, whose 467 00:26:59,040 --> 00:27:01,040 Speaker 1: kid would that be? Because the kid would have the 468 00:27:01,040 --> 00:27:05,400 Speaker 1: same DNA as the donor, not him. His dad, Um, well, 469 00:27:05,400 --> 00:27:08,080 Speaker 1: it would be his kids. Still, legally it would be 470 00:27:08,160 --> 00:27:12,359 Speaker 1: his kid, but biologically wouldn't it be the German Donors child. 471 00:27:14,080 --> 00:27:16,399 Speaker 1: I don't know. I think there's an old saying about that, 472 00:27:16,440 --> 00:27:19,680 Speaker 1: like whoever smelt it delta? But I can't quite work 473 00:27:19,720 --> 00:27:23,399 Speaker 1: it out. Uh, there's a couple of rhymes. I'm trying 474 00:27:23,480 --> 00:27:27,919 Speaker 1: not right now. Two bad brothers, man. I just that 475 00:27:28,000 --> 00:27:30,240 Speaker 1: was sitting there right in front of my face. Yeah, 476 00:27:30,320 --> 00:27:32,840 Speaker 1: well so they both went to jail, right, Yeah, I 477 00:27:32,920 --> 00:27:38,880 Speaker 1: believe the Alaska forensic analysts got them, nabbed their person. Sweet, 478 00:27:39,680 --> 00:27:42,240 Speaker 1: is it time for that break now? You promised? Yeah, 479 00:27:42,240 --> 00:27:44,960 Speaker 1: I'm gonna go ruminate on that justice served and we'll 480 00:27:44,960 --> 00:28:10,000 Speaker 1: be right back and things. So I guess we should say, chuck, 481 00:28:10,040 --> 00:28:12,480 Speaker 1: if you're out there in podcast land listening to us 482 00:28:12,960 --> 00:28:15,240 Speaker 1: and you didn't actually have to hear an ad, give 483 00:28:15,280 --> 00:28:18,760 Speaker 1: us a double twot. Dude, dude. You know there was 484 00:28:18,840 --> 00:28:23,800 Speaker 1: an email er I think he bothered me several times 485 00:28:23,840 --> 00:28:27,040 Speaker 1: with Emil that trying to convince us that we were 486 00:28:27,080 --> 00:28:29,240 Speaker 1: in podcast land. Because we used to say that out 487 00:28:29,240 --> 00:28:31,800 Speaker 1: there in podcast land and this guy ruined it. We 488 00:28:31,840 --> 00:28:33,880 Speaker 1: just quit saying it because he was like you in 489 00:28:33,960 --> 00:28:36,920 Speaker 1: fact or in podcast land. I kind of get where 490 00:28:37,000 --> 00:28:43,320 Speaker 1: that guy's coming from. Was that you nabe? That's weird? 491 00:28:43,480 --> 00:28:49,320 Speaker 1: He signed your name is Jehan Jehan Paul Dusseldorf three 492 00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:54,720 Speaker 1: seven at hotmail. What I don't get that one? That 493 00:28:54,880 --> 00:28:58,120 Speaker 1: was who who sent it in? John John Paul seven 494 00:28:58,160 --> 00:29:02,080 Speaker 1: at hotmail dot com. I gotta check that was their email. 495 00:29:02,880 --> 00:29:06,920 Speaker 1: Can we talk about these twins? Sure? Um, because apparently 496 00:29:07,000 --> 00:29:11,800 Speaker 1: in real life, Chuck twins actually get out of criminal 497 00:29:11,880 --> 00:29:14,880 Speaker 1: prosecution because they say, no, it wasn't me, it was 498 00:29:14,960 --> 00:29:17,680 Speaker 1: my identical twins. Yeah. I don't see how this is. 499 00:29:18,440 --> 00:29:20,680 Speaker 1: I mean, can't they do more work to arrest somebody 500 00:29:20,760 --> 00:29:22,440 Speaker 1: for a crime when they know it's one of the two. 501 00:29:24,160 --> 00:29:29,080 Speaker 1: All right, Well this happened in Germany. A big department 502 00:29:29,120 --> 00:29:33,200 Speaker 1: store in UH in Europe is the calf House uh 503 00:29:33,600 --> 00:29:38,280 Speaker 1: dis Weston's. And in January two thousand nine, Um, there 504 00:29:38,320 --> 00:29:41,640 Speaker 1: were three people who broke into one of these department stores. 505 00:29:42,160 --> 00:29:44,920 Speaker 1: They were smart, they were masks, they were Latex gloves. 506 00:29:45,360 --> 00:29:48,880 Speaker 1: They sold close to seven million dollars in jewelry. But 507 00:29:49,000 --> 00:29:51,120 Speaker 1: one of them left one of their gloves behind and 508 00:29:51,160 --> 00:29:54,240 Speaker 1: they did a DNA test on the sweat inside the 509 00:29:54,280 --> 00:29:58,000 Speaker 1: glove gross. And they had two matches of these two 510 00:29:58,160 --> 00:30:02,920 Speaker 1: identical twins uh psalm and a boss uh. And Germany 511 00:30:02,960 --> 00:30:07,040 Speaker 1: doesn't give last name, so the last initials oh and 512 00:30:07,280 --> 00:30:11,960 Speaker 1: yeah a Samo Riley And they basically did what you said. 513 00:30:12,240 --> 00:30:16,200 Speaker 1: These twenty seven year old twins were like, um, whatn't me? 514 00:30:16,480 --> 00:30:18,680 Speaker 1: And the other one said what didn't me? And they 515 00:30:18,800 --> 00:30:20,920 Speaker 1: let them go. They did. And I just wanted to 516 00:30:20,960 --> 00:30:24,360 Speaker 1: give a shout out to this group whom I'm not 517 00:30:24,520 --> 00:30:29,080 Speaker 1: like a um an admirer of criminals or anything like that, 518 00:30:29,600 --> 00:30:32,040 Speaker 1: but I read Chuck. They did like real great Muppet 519 00:30:32,120 --> 00:30:35,160 Speaker 1: caper stuff and like slid down ropes coming from the 520 00:30:35,200 --> 00:30:37,920 Speaker 1: skylights to do this robbery. It wasn't like a smash 521 00:30:38,000 --> 00:30:42,640 Speaker 1: and grab. They had finace at least, okay movie style 522 00:30:42,720 --> 00:30:46,600 Speaker 1: robber robbery. So so yeah, exactly so in Germany, UM, 523 00:30:47,120 --> 00:30:50,360 Speaker 1: they like, you can't just lock up both people because 524 00:30:50,440 --> 00:30:52,160 Speaker 1: one of them might be innocent. And if you have 525 00:30:52,280 --> 00:30:54,240 Speaker 1: to make that decision under German law, and the same 526 00:30:54,320 --> 00:30:58,640 Speaker 1: thing in America, UM, you can't lock up innocent people. 527 00:30:58,720 --> 00:31:02,640 Speaker 1: It's better to let criminal go free until lock up 528 00:31:02,680 --> 00:31:04,880 Speaker 1: an innocent person. That's the trade off. That we have. 529 00:31:05,080 --> 00:31:09,880 Speaker 1: And it's not just happened in Germany with the O'Reilly brothers. Um, 530 00:31:10,040 --> 00:31:14,200 Speaker 1: It's happened around the world in other places too. Yeah. 531 00:31:14,960 --> 00:31:17,680 Speaker 1: I think in Malaysia in two thousand nine there were 532 00:31:17,760 --> 00:31:22,280 Speaker 1: identical twins who, um, we're narcotics traffickers, and they had 533 00:31:22,320 --> 00:31:26,440 Speaker 1: a death sentence, but they couldn't prove who was who. Um. 534 00:31:26,760 --> 00:31:30,600 Speaker 1: Here's my thing, and I agree with due process, but 535 00:31:30,680 --> 00:31:35,800 Speaker 1: I think if you strong arm them a little bit, no, 536 00:31:36,080 --> 00:31:40,080 Speaker 1: nothing like that, but like, hey, one of you is 537 00:31:40,080 --> 00:31:42,640 Speaker 1: going to go to prison, and we'll flip a coin, 538 00:31:42,720 --> 00:31:45,080 Speaker 1: We'll flip a Deutsche Mark. I still got one in 539 00:31:45,160 --> 00:31:48,080 Speaker 1: my pocket from the old days. Uh, and and one 540 00:31:48,120 --> 00:31:49,520 Speaker 1: of you is going to go to jail. I think 541 00:31:49,840 --> 00:31:53,040 Speaker 1: they could pressure them into one of them, like they 542 00:31:53,120 --> 00:31:55,960 Speaker 1: got to really be in unison, you know, one of 543 00:31:55,960 --> 00:31:57,920 Speaker 1: them would eventually crack the person who didn't do it 544 00:31:58,840 --> 00:32:00,800 Speaker 1: or did do it. So the thing is is, I 545 00:32:00,840 --> 00:32:03,120 Speaker 1: mean we're talking about twin siblings here. I mean if 546 00:32:03,120 --> 00:32:05,360 Speaker 1: they've got resolved and not rap the other one out, 547 00:32:07,080 --> 00:32:09,440 Speaker 1: they've got it. Yeah, exactly. So I'm sure if both 548 00:32:09,520 --> 00:32:12,160 Speaker 1: of them know hack, both of them might have been there. 549 00:32:12,280 --> 00:32:14,720 Speaker 1: It was three three robbers, so two of them might 550 00:32:14,760 --> 00:32:17,480 Speaker 1: have been the twins. They just could not say which 551 00:32:17,640 --> 00:32:21,040 Speaker 1: one they that was definitely there, so they said no. 552 00:32:21,560 --> 00:32:23,760 Speaker 1: And yeah, I mean, if you have no other evidence, 553 00:32:23,840 --> 00:32:26,200 Speaker 1: what can you do? What can you do hot shot? 554 00:32:26,480 --> 00:32:30,120 Speaker 1: Smack them around with I guess so you'd be like 555 00:32:30,240 --> 00:32:36,160 Speaker 1: by Dousldorf, you will crack all right. So I think 556 00:32:36,200 --> 00:32:38,280 Speaker 1: we got a couple of more. We just had a 557 00:32:38,320 --> 00:32:41,000 Speaker 1: brief This is how the sausage is made, a brief 558 00:32:41,120 --> 00:32:46,000 Speaker 1: off Mike convo. We're going to circle back to the 559 00:32:46,040 --> 00:32:48,080 Speaker 1: original one that I wanted to skip at the end 560 00:32:48,840 --> 00:32:50,880 Speaker 1: because Josh is in love with it. I love it, 561 00:32:51,240 --> 00:32:54,520 Speaker 1: he wants to marry it. He's in love. I'm already married. 562 00:32:55,080 --> 00:32:57,560 Speaker 1: We're skipping. Uh. I wonder if anyone ever goes to 563 00:32:57,600 --> 00:33:01,760 Speaker 1: see what we skipped. I don't care. But there's some 564 00:33:01,920 --> 00:33:05,200 Speaker 1: army members they're like, uh, listen up, everybody all time. 565 00:33:05,280 --> 00:33:08,360 Speaker 1: I got the dirt on the one, all right, So 566 00:33:08,440 --> 00:33:11,120 Speaker 1: we're gonna finish or do you want to finish with 567 00:33:11,360 --> 00:33:13,920 Speaker 1: the one I didn't like? And then because you really 568 00:33:13,960 --> 00:33:17,000 Speaker 1: wanted to do number one? Yeah, we have to. Man, 569 00:33:17,080 --> 00:33:21,720 Speaker 1: it's the most astounding case of mistaken identity. And recent memory. 570 00:33:21,800 --> 00:33:23,840 Speaker 1: All right, so let's do it right the second Okay, 571 00:33:23,960 --> 00:33:29,000 Speaker 1: go now, So this was a case uh jeez, it's 572 00:33:29,160 --> 00:33:33,200 Speaker 1: both sad and uplifting, kind of depending on whose family 573 00:33:33,240 --> 00:33:36,280 Speaker 1: you're in. But it was a very tragic day in 574 00:33:36,400 --> 00:33:40,000 Speaker 1: two thousand six. I kind of remember this happening. Um. 575 00:33:40,480 --> 00:33:44,400 Speaker 1: There was a semi truck driver who in April of 576 00:33:44,480 --> 00:33:46,280 Speaker 1: that year, like I said, fell asleep at the wheel, 577 00:33:46,840 --> 00:33:50,680 Speaker 1: crossed the median and crashed into a university van from 578 00:33:50,720 --> 00:33:54,520 Speaker 1: Taylor University that had nine people uh in the in 579 00:33:54,600 --> 00:33:57,000 Speaker 1: the van. And it was a very bad crash. It 580 00:33:57,080 --> 00:34:00,800 Speaker 1: killed five uh I think all students, but five people. 581 00:34:01,840 --> 00:34:04,120 Speaker 1: And it was just you know, people were flung all 582 00:34:04,160 --> 00:34:08,239 Speaker 1: over the place there. Stuff was flung all over the place. Uh. 583 00:34:08,320 --> 00:34:10,960 Speaker 1: And it was obviously a mess of a scene of 584 00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:15,360 Speaker 1: an accident scene and two young women got mistaken for 585 00:34:15,440 --> 00:34:19,360 Speaker 1: one another in a very tragic way. Yeah. So I 586 00:34:19,440 --> 00:34:24,040 Speaker 1: guess um uh Whitney saranac Um had her. She was 587 00:34:24,160 --> 00:34:28,040 Speaker 1: basically bundled up onto a stretcher and um met of 588 00:34:28,120 --> 00:34:31,719 Speaker 1: act out by helicopter. But the first responder who put 589 00:34:31,760 --> 00:34:35,239 Speaker 1: her on the stretcher had grabbed an I d of 590 00:34:35,360 --> 00:34:37,680 Speaker 1: another girl who was in the van that looked a 591 00:34:37,800 --> 00:34:40,560 Speaker 1: lot like her, especially I'm sure at night under a 592 00:34:40,640 --> 00:34:43,680 Speaker 1: crazy circumstances like that, And the I D went to 593 00:34:43,840 --> 00:34:47,719 Speaker 1: Laura van Wrinn and while Whitney Sarak was alive, Laura 594 00:34:47,800 --> 00:34:51,080 Speaker 1: van Wren was dead. But people now thought that this 595 00:34:51,280 --> 00:34:54,759 Speaker 1: person who was bloodied, beat up um, whose face was 596 00:34:54,840 --> 00:34:58,200 Speaker 1: swollen and would suit be bandaged for weeks was Laura 597 00:34:58,320 --> 00:35:02,319 Speaker 1: van Wrin, when in fact it was Whitney's Iraq. Yeah. 598 00:35:02,560 --> 00:35:07,200 Speaker 1: So boy, this one is um. Like I said, very 599 00:35:07,360 --> 00:35:10,040 Speaker 1: very bad news for one family and very good news 600 00:35:10,120 --> 00:35:12,840 Speaker 1: for another. And that one family thought their daughter was 601 00:35:12,880 --> 00:35:17,080 Speaker 1: alive and she had passed and the other way around. So, uh, 602 00:35:17,520 --> 00:35:19,640 Speaker 1: it's just this, this one's a tough one to even 603 00:35:19,680 --> 00:35:23,320 Speaker 1: think about how someone gets through something like this in 604 00:35:23,400 --> 00:35:28,200 Speaker 1: true movie fashion, Um and inconsistencies sorted to kind of 605 00:35:28,320 --> 00:35:32,440 Speaker 1: pile up as she recovered, and people were sort of 606 00:35:32,480 --> 00:35:36,200 Speaker 1: suspicious of what was going on, and finally someone asked 607 00:35:36,200 --> 00:35:40,200 Speaker 1: her to write her name, and she wrote down Whitney. Uh, 608 00:35:40,719 --> 00:35:42,520 Speaker 1: it's just it's a moment, like you know, it's a 609 00:35:42,560 --> 00:35:45,640 Speaker 1: pretty chilling moment. It's a movie moment for goodness, sick. 610 00:35:47,040 --> 00:35:51,440 Speaker 1: It's crazy because I mean in the meantime, like Laura's 611 00:35:51,800 --> 00:35:54,560 Speaker 1: family were the ones who were at Whitney's bedside as 612 00:35:54,600 --> 00:35:59,600 Speaker 1: she recovered for weeks in the hospital. Um and like 613 00:36:00,080 --> 00:36:03,160 Speaker 1: they had had a funeral service for Whitney. So her 614 00:36:03,239 --> 00:36:06,080 Speaker 1: family was just now coming to terms with her with 615 00:36:06,200 --> 00:36:09,080 Speaker 1: the fact that she was dead when they found out that, no, 616 00:36:09,520 --> 00:36:12,200 Speaker 1: she's alive. And Laura's family, who had been like hoping 617 00:36:12,239 --> 00:36:15,040 Speaker 1: that their child was recovering, now found out that their 618 00:36:15,120 --> 00:36:19,080 Speaker 1: child was dead. Like it's just mind boggling that this 619 00:36:19,320 --> 00:36:24,000 Speaker 1: actually happened somewhere in Michigan. No less. Yeah, very very 620 00:36:24,040 --> 00:36:26,600 Speaker 1: sad case. But we don't want to leave you with 621 00:36:26,640 --> 00:36:29,480 Speaker 1: the said case, right, No, that's why we're going looping 622 00:36:29,560 --> 00:36:32,480 Speaker 1: back to do number one, which is actually number nine, 623 00:36:32,880 --> 00:36:37,879 Speaker 1: number sin which is number nine. Boy. This is about 624 00:36:37,920 --> 00:36:44,840 Speaker 1: Peter Sellers, who uh somehow was mistaken for Woody Allen 625 00:36:44,920 --> 00:36:47,680 Speaker 1: early in his career. A couple of key times. They're 626 00:36:47,719 --> 00:36:52,040 Speaker 1: famously doppel gangers. I know, they don't look much alike. 627 00:36:52,719 --> 00:36:54,520 Speaker 1: A couple of things I'll attribute it to is Woody 628 00:36:54,560 --> 00:36:57,480 Speaker 1: Allen looked um when he was younger. He you know, 629 00:36:57,600 --> 00:37:00,239 Speaker 1: he looked different than you might think of him now. First, Hall. 630 00:37:00,880 --> 00:37:04,200 Speaker 1: Uh And Peter Sellers was was a sort of man 631 00:37:04,280 --> 00:37:06,359 Speaker 1: of a thousand faces. As an actor, he was well 632 00:37:06,440 --> 00:37:10,879 Speaker 1: known for doing disguises, doing accents. No one ever knew 633 00:37:10,880 --> 00:37:16,720 Speaker 1: who the real Peter Sellers was. Um. Fascinating dude, very troubled, 634 00:37:16,960 --> 00:37:19,920 Speaker 1: not too great guy in real life. But I'm a 635 00:37:20,040 --> 00:37:22,719 Speaker 1: huge Peter Sellers fan and like read biographies on him. 636 00:37:23,680 --> 00:37:25,480 Speaker 1: Uh And, but that's what he was known for, is 637 00:37:26,000 --> 00:37:28,200 Speaker 1: is looking like other people. So it's no surprise that 638 00:37:28,320 --> 00:37:31,120 Speaker 1: maybe he would get confused with someone else. I'm a 639 00:37:31,239 --> 00:37:33,920 Speaker 1: David Niven guy, by the way, I love David Niven. 640 00:37:34,600 --> 00:37:39,400 Speaker 1: So apparently on the set of Casino Royal, um Leo Jaffee, 641 00:37:39,480 --> 00:37:42,120 Speaker 1: who's the head of Columbia Pictures, the studio making the 642 00:37:42,200 --> 00:37:44,760 Speaker 1: movie at the time, which is I think nineteen sixty 643 00:37:44,800 --> 00:37:48,000 Speaker 1: seven is when that movie was made. Yeah, it sounds right, 644 00:37:48,360 --> 00:37:52,080 Speaker 1: And it was based on the Ian Fleming novel Casino Royal. 645 00:37:52,200 --> 00:37:54,239 Speaker 1: It was a James Bond movie, but it was a 646 00:37:55,719 --> 00:38:01,040 Speaker 1: horror show. It was so poorly conceived and made that 647 00:38:01,160 --> 00:38:05,400 Speaker 1: they had five directors um each shooting different parts of 648 00:38:05,480 --> 00:38:09,920 Speaker 1: the movie, each working with different James Bonds, David Niven, 649 00:38:09,960 --> 00:38:13,120 Speaker 1: Peter Sellers, Woody Allen, I don't know who else was there. Um, 650 00:38:13,239 --> 00:38:14,920 Speaker 1: and then each of the directors didn't know what the 651 00:38:14,960 --> 00:38:16,720 Speaker 1: other one was doing. And then they put it together 652 00:38:16,840 --> 00:38:18,520 Speaker 1: and thought it was going to be a good idea. 653 00:38:18,920 --> 00:38:21,840 Speaker 1: But even before then, um, they had bigger problems on 654 00:38:21,920 --> 00:38:24,160 Speaker 1: their hands because Leo Jaffey was talking to who he 655 00:38:24,239 --> 00:38:26,600 Speaker 1: thought was Woody Allen, when in turn it was actually 656 00:38:26,680 --> 00:38:31,040 Speaker 1: Peter Sellers, and um, he started complaining about Peter Sellers 657 00:38:31,120 --> 00:38:34,200 Speaker 1: to Woody Allen, who was in fact actually Peter Sellers. 658 00:38:34,760 --> 00:38:38,000 Speaker 1: That's right. And I'm just now looking at a picture 659 00:38:38,000 --> 00:38:41,160 Speaker 1: of Peter Sellers from the late sixties and with the 660 00:38:41,200 --> 00:38:43,160 Speaker 1: horn room glasses he and Woody Allen, I can see 661 00:38:43,160 --> 00:38:45,279 Speaker 1: it a little bit, I guess, especially if you're a 662 00:38:45,400 --> 00:38:48,640 Speaker 1: studio exactly, who couldn't like all the actors are just 663 00:38:48,719 --> 00:38:51,640 Speaker 1: like cattle to you with or cash registers as well. 664 00:38:51,760 --> 00:38:54,080 Speaker 1: You know. Uh. This happened again on the set of 665 00:38:54,120 --> 00:38:57,480 Speaker 1: What's New Pussycat? Uh, And at this point Sellers was 666 00:38:57,520 --> 00:39:01,160 Speaker 1: pretty annoyed that this kept happening and that he was, 667 00:39:01,600 --> 00:39:03,080 Speaker 1: you know, he was a big star at that time, 668 00:39:03,120 --> 00:39:04,920 Speaker 1: and what Allen was kind of just getting started, so 669 00:39:05,600 --> 00:39:07,399 Speaker 1: uh and he had quite an ego, so he wasn't 670 00:39:07,440 --> 00:39:11,280 Speaker 1: none too pleased. Yeah, so, if you read um write 671 00:39:11,320 --> 00:39:14,960 Speaker 1: ups on UM Casino Royal the nineteen sixty seven version, 672 00:39:15,080 --> 00:39:18,120 Speaker 1: people are just like this was a legendary catastrophe, which 673 00:39:18,160 --> 00:39:20,040 Speaker 1: are some of the most fun movies to read about. 674 00:39:20,320 --> 00:39:23,680 Speaker 1: Those in Stanley Kubrick films are in large. Von Tarier 675 00:39:23,760 --> 00:39:27,040 Speaker 1: films are the most enjoyable to read about because people 676 00:39:27,080 --> 00:39:30,480 Speaker 1: are just agog for one reason or another, about what 677 00:39:30,600 --> 00:39:37,040 Speaker 1: their their subject is. Mm hmm, great word. I think 678 00:39:37,080 --> 00:39:40,600 Speaker 1: so too, man, I've been peppering really great words throughout 679 00:39:40,640 --> 00:39:44,600 Speaker 1: this episode. If you ask me, I've noticed you got 680 00:39:44,600 --> 00:39:46,680 Speaker 1: anything else? You want to talk about some more stolen 681 00:39:46,760 --> 00:39:51,799 Speaker 1: identity or mistaken identity stuff? Nah? All right, let's not then. Um. 682 00:39:52,120 --> 00:39:55,000 Speaker 1: If you want to know more about mistaken identities, you 683 00:39:55,000 --> 00:39:56,880 Speaker 1: can check out this article on how stuff works. And 684 00:39:56,960 --> 00:40:03,200 Speaker 1: since Chuck said nah, it's time for listener mail, I'm 685 00:40:03,239 --> 00:40:04,680 Speaker 1: just gonna read the first thing I saw because it 686 00:40:04,719 --> 00:40:08,680 Speaker 1: didn't have one prepared, and this is called Chuck's rope Trauma. 687 00:40:09,320 --> 00:40:12,040 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, hey, guys, I'm imagining we're gonna play this 688 00:40:12,120 --> 00:40:14,759 Speaker 1: out for years. Hey guys, I'm imagining Chuck at a 689 00:40:14,840 --> 00:40:19,960 Speaker 1: rough go at practicing shabari on himself. I'm sure hoping 690 00:40:20,040 --> 00:40:21,680 Speaker 1: this is true so we can get a future topic 691 00:40:22,200 --> 00:40:28,160 Speaker 1: on the art of shabarim thing. I don't know here 692 00:40:28,200 --> 00:40:30,560 Speaker 1: it is. Yeah, I think it's rope binding for sexual 693 00:40:30,680 --> 00:40:36,600 Speaker 1: pleasure Japanese bondage. You well, I just I just know that, 694 00:40:36,760 --> 00:40:40,240 Speaker 1: like in the back of my head. Apparently those pictures 695 00:40:40,320 --> 00:40:43,959 Speaker 1: are Yeah, these pictures are interesting. So Chuck answer the question, 696 00:40:44,080 --> 00:40:46,560 Speaker 1: is that where you got your rope trauma? No, it 697 00:40:46,640 --> 00:40:48,960 Speaker 1: wasn't shabari. Unfortunately, that seems like a lot more fun 698 00:40:49,040 --> 00:40:51,719 Speaker 1: than what happened to me. Um. But this is from 699 00:40:51,840 --> 00:40:54,799 Speaker 1: Ryan Loves the Show. Listen to every episode and Ryan 700 00:40:54,880 --> 00:40:58,799 Speaker 1: works in a diesel shop. Diesel like the clothing wine 701 00:40:59,400 --> 00:41:03,120 Speaker 1: No for over the road trucks, which I don't even 702 00:41:03,160 --> 00:41:04,880 Speaker 1: know what that means. Is that like a long haul trucker? 703 00:41:04,920 --> 00:41:09,880 Speaker 1: Probably over No, I think it's like a flying truck. Okay, right, 704 00:41:12,520 --> 00:41:14,800 Speaker 1: you should leave that in there. A momo. Yeah, I 705 00:41:15,040 --> 00:41:17,799 Speaker 1: just parked, everybody. Uh, it's nice to keep my mind 706 00:41:17,840 --> 00:41:19,880 Speaker 1: active while I'm mindlessly wrenching on bolts all day. And 707 00:41:19,920 --> 00:41:24,560 Speaker 1: that is from Ryan Schmidt and Waterloo. I A uh, 708 00:41:25,000 --> 00:41:29,759 Speaker 1: Waterloo Idaho. I A, where is that? That's Iowa? Yeah, 709 00:41:29,840 --> 00:41:33,440 Speaker 1: I just wanted to rip the Iowans and the idaho WANs. Uh. 710 00:41:33,520 --> 00:41:36,879 Speaker 1: And that was Ryan. That's Ryan. Thanks a lot, Ryan. 711 00:41:36,960 --> 00:41:39,319 Speaker 1: That was a good question. So, Chuck, do you want 712 00:41:39,320 --> 00:41:41,800 Speaker 1: to share now what the rope trauma was? No? I 713 00:41:41,840 --> 00:41:43,919 Speaker 1: think I literally think we should play this up for years. 714 00:41:44,120 --> 00:41:45,759 Speaker 1: And so I was talking to one of my one 715 00:41:45,800 --> 00:41:49,000 Speaker 1: of my friends and neighbors, Wesley, and he had just 716 00:41:49,200 --> 00:41:52,520 Speaker 1: heard the episode about Mallory today and was like, so, so, 717 00:41:52,680 --> 00:41:54,080 Speaker 1: what was it what happened to Chuck? I was like, 718 00:41:54,360 --> 00:41:57,160 Speaker 1: he won't tell me. He could not believe that you 719 00:41:57,280 --> 00:41:59,160 Speaker 1: didn't actually tell me. I was like, I don't know 720 00:41:59,239 --> 00:42:01,279 Speaker 1: any more than any one else. So, oh, we've got 721 00:42:01,320 --> 00:42:03,680 Speaker 1: a genuine internet mystery. Then I love it. It's a 722 00:42:03,760 --> 00:42:06,480 Speaker 1: genuine one. If you want to send us a guess 723 00:42:06,520 --> 00:42:08,400 Speaker 1: at what happened to Chuck with the rope, you can 724 00:42:08,400 --> 00:42:11,480 Speaker 1: already cross Shabari off of the list. You can send 725 00:42:11,520 --> 00:42:14,480 Speaker 1: it in an email to stuff podcast at iHeart radio 726 00:42:14,840 --> 00:42:20,080 Speaker 1: dot com. Stuff you Should Know is a production of 727 00:42:20,120 --> 00:42:23,399 Speaker 1: I Heart Radio. For more podcasts my heart Radio, visit 728 00:42:23,480 --> 00:42:26,560 Speaker 1: the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen 729 00:42:26,640 --> 00:42:27,600 Speaker 1: to your favorite shows