1 00:00:08,039 --> 00:00:12,760 Speaker 1: Welcome to Strictly Business, Variety's weekly podcast featuring conversations with 2 00:00:12,880 --> 00:00:17,040 Speaker 1: industry leaders about the business of media and entertainment. I'm 3 00:00:17,079 --> 00:00:20,959 Speaker 1: Cynthia Lyttleton, co editor in chief of Variety Today. My 4 00:00:21,040 --> 00:00:25,360 Speaker 1: guest is Justin Wilkes, President of Imagine Entertainment. About six 5 00:00:25,440 --> 00:00:28,159 Speaker 1: years ago, Imagine chose a good time to go on 6 00:00:28,200 --> 00:00:32,400 Speaker 1: a diversification push. The company, founded by Ron Howard and 7 00:00:32,479 --> 00:00:36,040 Speaker 1: Brian Grazer in the mid nineteen eighties, has expanded from 8 00:00:36,080 --> 00:00:40,160 Speaker 1: its stronghold of scripted feature films and TV shows into 9 00:00:40,240 --> 00:00:46,240 Speaker 1: documentaries and nonfiction content, kids and family shows, branded creative 10 00:00:46,360 --> 00:00:51,080 Speaker 1: advertising and marketing work, and more. Wilkes joined the company 11 00:00:51,159 --> 00:00:56,520 Speaker 1: from Radical Media in twenty eighteen to launch Imagine's documentary unit. 12 00:00:57,280 --> 00:01:01,160 Speaker 1: In twenty twenty two, he was promoted to Chief Strategy Officer, 13 00:01:01,560 --> 00:01:04,320 Speaker 1: and in January of this year he was named president 14 00:01:04,360 --> 00:01:08,480 Speaker 1: of the company. Imagine has explored sale options in the 15 00:01:08,520 --> 00:01:12,160 Speaker 1: recent past, and it brought on investors to help fund 16 00:01:12,200 --> 00:01:16,360 Speaker 1: its growth push. Amid all this, Imagine needed to bolster 17 00:01:16,480 --> 00:01:19,959 Speaker 1: its high level of executive management under Howard and Grazier, 18 00:01:20,800 --> 00:01:24,920 Speaker 1: two of Wilkes's predecessor executives had short tenures in the role, 19 00:01:25,520 --> 00:01:28,479 Speaker 1: Wilkes seems to be a better fit because he gradually 20 00:01:28,520 --> 00:01:32,440 Speaker 1: took on more responsibility after establishing himself as a leader 21 00:01:32,520 --> 00:01:37,479 Speaker 1: of an important new initiative. In our conversation, Wilkes details 22 00:01:37,600 --> 00:01:40,640 Speaker 1: imagines growth goals and how they fit in with the 23 00:01:40,680 --> 00:01:45,720 Speaker 1: company's ethos of telling aspirational stories that often revolve around 24 00:01:45,800 --> 00:01:49,800 Speaker 1: underdog characters. He also weighs in on how the deal 25 00:01:49,880 --> 00:01:53,400 Speaker 1: market for streaming content is slowly changing for the better. 26 00:01:54,320 --> 00:01:57,600 Speaker 1: We spoke at his Beverly Hills offices two days before 27 00:01:57,760 --> 00:02:00,920 Speaker 1: SAG after joining the Writer's Guild of an America in 28 00:02:01,000 --> 00:02:05,680 Speaker 1: calling a strike against Hollywood's largest employers. Sadly, we weren't 29 00:02:05,720 --> 00:02:08,920 Speaker 1: wrong in referring to the SAG after a work stoppage 30 00:02:09,200 --> 00:02:13,240 Speaker 1: as a FATA complete. In our conversation, in a tough 31 00:02:13,280 --> 00:02:17,520 Speaker 1: season of cost cutting and job slashing for Hollywood, Wilkes 32 00:02:17,560 --> 00:02:21,600 Speaker 1: explains why he believes that Imagine and other sizeable indies 33 00:02:21,840 --> 00:02:24,280 Speaker 1: will come out of this maelstrom in a better position 34 00:02:24,360 --> 00:02:30,120 Speaker 1: to succeed. As always, experience matters. He emphasizes all of 35 00:02:30,160 --> 00:02:33,920 Speaker 1: those insights and more from imaginees justin Wilkes are coming 36 00:02:34,000 --> 00:02:45,120 Speaker 1: at you after this break and we're back with more 37 00:02:45,400 --> 00:02:52,520 Speaker 1: from Imagine Entertainments. Justin Wilkes. Justin Wilkes, President of Imagin Entertainment, 38 00:02:52,560 --> 00:02:55,639 Speaker 1: thank you so much for having me in your beautiful 39 00:02:55,800 --> 00:02:57,080 Speaker 1: Beverly Hills offices. 40 00:02:57,200 --> 00:02:58,280 Speaker 2: Thanks for coming over. 41 00:02:58,280 --> 00:03:02,040 Speaker 1: A beautiful sunny day in which the entertainment industry is 42 00:03:02,040 --> 00:03:05,239 Speaker 1: on pins and needles because we are awaiting verdict on 43 00:03:05,480 --> 00:03:09,840 Speaker 1: a very intense and difficult labor negotiations. So appreciate you 44 00:03:09,919 --> 00:03:12,880 Speaker 1: making time for me at this time. Let's start by 45 00:03:12,880 --> 00:03:16,480 Speaker 1: what brought you to Imagine and what you saw as 46 00:03:16,520 --> 00:03:19,919 Speaker 1: the opportunity that you could pursue would imagine. 47 00:03:19,480 --> 00:03:24,760 Speaker 2: What has always made Imagine relevant in sort of contemporary 48 00:03:25,480 --> 00:03:27,320 Speaker 2: in pop culture, and even as we get into some 49 00:03:27,320 --> 00:03:30,359 Speaker 2: of the business conversation, because it's interesting to I always 50 00:03:30,360 --> 00:03:31,560 Speaker 2: like to go back in time to sort of look 51 00:03:31,560 --> 00:03:34,080 Speaker 2: at where the future is. This is a company that 52 00:03:34,160 --> 00:03:36,640 Speaker 2: every step of the way was ahead of the curve 53 00:03:37,240 --> 00:03:41,960 Speaker 2: of what the audience or the consumer was maybe looking 54 00:03:42,000 --> 00:03:43,920 Speaker 2: for or didn't even realize they were looking for. And 55 00:03:43,960 --> 00:03:47,760 Speaker 2: that starts with their comedies. They started producing comedies. Brian 56 00:03:47,800 --> 00:03:50,480 Speaker 2: and Ron started producing comedies in the mid to late 57 00:03:50,520 --> 00:03:53,480 Speaker 2: eighties at a time when like big comedies. Big Hollywood 58 00:03:53,480 --> 00:03:54,960 Speaker 2: comedies didn't quite exist yet. 59 00:03:55,400 --> 00:03:58,080 Speaker 1: Ron Howard came from the school of Danny Thomas and 60 00:03:58,160 --> 00:04:02,720 Speaker 1: Sheldon Leonard Is that is PhD in comedy before he 61 00:04:02,920 --> 00:04:03,760 Speaker 1: was what ten. 62 00:04:04,120 --> 00:04:06,560 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean literally literally grew up with that. And 63 00:04:06,600 --> 00:04:09,119 Speaker 2: you know, the first movie they produced together was Splash, 64 00:04:09,360 --> 00:04:11,600 Speaker 2: which you know, it's it's still one of the greatest 65 00:04:11,720 --> 00:04:13,200 Speaker 2: comedies all of all time. 66 00:04:14,240 --> 00:04:16,880 Speaker 1: It's so indicative of its era too, so. 67 00:04:16,920 --> 00:04:18,960 Speaker 2: Much so, but it completely holds up. I just watched 68 00:04:18,960 --> 00:04:20,159 Speaker 2: it long ago. 69 00:04:20,240 --> 00:04:21,960 Speaker 1: It really does like a great comedy, like. 70 00:04:21,880 --> 00:04:24,159 Speaker 2: A great comedy. And then they really were able to 71 00:04:24,160 --> 00:04:27,720 Speaker 2: pivot that into big budget Hollywood dramas at a time 72 00:04:27,760 --> 00:04:30,120 Speaker 2: when you know, being a movie star and literally helping 73 00:04:30,160 --> 00:04:32,720 Speaker 2: him give birth to someone like a Tom Hanks or 74 00:04:32,760 --> 00:04:34,919 Speaker 2: a Denzel Washington or even an Eddie Murphy on the 75 00:04:34,920 --> 00:04:39,440 Speaker 2: comedy side. And then even one step further when really 76 00:04:39,520 --> 00:04:43,039 Speaker 2: before Hollywood producers in the sort of traditional film sense 77 00:04:43,120 --> 00:04:46,760 Speaker 2: even thought of television as a medium. They were one 78 00:04:46,760 --> 00:04:49,600 Speaker 2: of the first transitions over with From Earth to Moon, 79 00:04:49,680 --> 00:04:51,200 Speaker 2: which was sort of in a way a follow up 80 00:04:51,240 --> 00:04:54,120 Speaker 2: to Apollo thirteen as a mini series that they produced 81 00:04:54,120 --> 00:04:56,120 Speaker 2: for HBO. It was a first HBO mini series. It 82 00:04:56,200 --> 00:04:59,960 Speaker 2: won an Emmy that year, and so they've always kind 83 00:04:59,960 --> 00:05:01,480 Speaker 2: of I have been one step ahead of it, and 84 00:05:01,520 --> 00:05:04,600 Speaker 2: I think off of that then getting into television with 85 00:05:04,720 --> 00:05:06,760 Speaker 2: Friday Night Lights, which then led to twenty four, and 86 00:05:06,800 --> 00:05:09,600 Speaker 2: of course the rested Development and more recently Empire. There's 87 00:05:09,640 --> 00:05:11,640 Speaker 2: just been this history where they've always kind of thought 88 00:05:12,200 --> 00:05:14,840 Speaker 2: a little bit of one step ahead. And I think, 89 00:05:15,160 --> 00:05:16,880 Speaker 2: knowing the two guys now a little bit the way 90 00:05:16,880 --> 00:05:19,440 Speaker 2: that I do, They're not sitting in a room scheming 91 00:05:19,520 --> 00:05:21,880 Speaker 2: up what's the next thing that everyone's going to want 92 00:05:21,880 --> 00:05:24,280 Speaker 2: to buy. It's just it's almost innate because there are 93 00:05:24,279 --> 00:05:27,480 Speaker 2: also consumers of content, and I can speak for myself 94 00:05:27,480 --> 00:05:29,880 Speaker 2: and everybody here at this company, we also just love 95 00:05:29,960 --> 00:05:33,520 Speaker 2: watching movies and television, so that sort of feeds this ecosystem. 96 00:05:33,880 --> 00:05:35,960 Speaker 2: So going back to your question about six years ago, 97 00:05:36,040 --> 00:05:39,960 Speaker 2: seven years ago now, as a film company and as 98 00:05:40,000 --> 00:05:43,120 Speaker 2: a television company, they both saw that there was going 99 00:05:43,200 --> 00:05:47,440 Speaker 2: to be another seismic change in the media landscape. And 100 00:05:47,480 --> 00:05:50,360 Speaker 2: remember streaming had just started to really become a thing 101 00:05:50,560 --> 00:05:53,400 Speaker 2: back then, and at the time they were also tethered 102 00:05:53,400 --> 00:05:55,680 Speaker 2: to these long standing deals that they had both at 103 00:05:55,760 --> 00:05:59,560 Speaker 2: Universal for film and twentieth for television, and they made 104 00:05:59,560 --> 00:06:03,039 Speaker 2: a very decision to essentially walk away from both of 105 00:06:03,080 --> 00:06:07,440 Speaker 2: those overhead deals, bring in some investment capital, and start 106 00:06:07,480 --> 00:06:10,120 Speaker 2: to really think about what Imagine two point zero might 107 00:06:10,160 --> 00:06:12,400 Speaker 2: look like. How do we really take this brand into 108 00:06:12,440 --> 00:06:15,520 Speaker 2: the future. How do we create an environment that had 109 00:06:15,560 --> 00:06:17,560 Speaker 2: always sort of been there in a smaller way, but 110 00:06:17,960 --> 00:06:21,920 Speaker 2: supersize it where a list talent, whether it's writing talent, 111 00:06:22,000 --> 00:06:25,520 Speaker 2: acting talent, executive talent, can come in and really be 112 00:06:25,520 --> 00:06:28,960 Speaker 2: able to create and incubate as an independent company. And 113 00:06:28,960 --> 00:06:32,880 Speaker 2: that independence, as you pointed out, really and especially now 114 00:06:32,920 --> 00:06:36,440 Speaker 2: even more so, continues to be our strategic advantage because 115 00:06:36,440 --> 00:06:39,520 Speaker 2: it enables us to be as nimble as possible in 116 00:06:39,560 --> 00:06:43,520 Speaker 2: the marketplace as we're creating it, as we're developing these ideas. 117 00:06:44,240 --> 00:06:46,240 Speaker 2: So when I made the decision to come over, I 118 00:06:46,240 --> 00:06:48,560 Speaker 2: had been at Radical Media for a really long time, 119 00:06:48,560 --> 00:06:53,800 Speaker 2: almost eighteen years. Literally, that was sort of my undergrad education, 120 00:06:53,880 --> 00:06:56,719 Speaker 2: as I like to think about it. Left as the 121 00:06:56,760 --> 00:06:59,880 Speaker 2: president of the entertainment division there as well as a partner. 122 00:07:00,720 --> 00:07:04,839 Speaker 2: Imagine was really the only company that I entertained. I 123 00:07:04,920 --> 00:07:07,839 Speaker 2: wasn't even thinking of leaving Radical at the time. But 124 00:07:07,880 --> 00:07:09,800 Speaker 2: when this opportunity presented itself. 125 00:07:09,560 --> 00:07:11,280 Speaker 1: To come in and you got an incoming call. 126 00:07:11,600 --> 00:07:16,080 Speaker 2: Incoming call, we had been we had been collaborating on 127 00:07:16,120 --> 00:07:17,280 Speaker 2: a project called Mars. 128 00:07:17,360 --> 00:07:19,880 Speaker 1: Oh right, right, I remember even talking to you at 129 00:07:19,960 --> 00:07:22,200 Speaker 1: Radical during that time. That's right. And the truth is 130 00:07:22,240 --> 00:07:24,680 Speaker 1: the two companies do have a lot of similarities. I mean, 131 00:07:24,720 --> 00:07:28,040 Speaker 1: Imagine as an obviously larger profile in Hollywood, but but 132 00:07:28,160 --> 00:07:30,440 Speaker 1: my sense of getting to know the Radical folks was 133 00:07:30,480 --> 00:07:33,520 Speaker 1: a very similar ethough, so people that like to make things. 134 00:07:33,680 --> 00:07:36,400 Speaker 2: People like to make things in this incredible creative ecosystem. 135 00:07:36,520 --> 00:07:38,280 Speaker 2: It was around that time that, like I said, Ron 136 00:07:38,320 --> 00:07:40,840 Speaker 2: and Brian had taken on this investment capital, We're looking 137 00:07:40,840 --> 00:07:42,960 Speaker 2: to expand in one of the areas they had a 138 00:07:43,000 --> 00:07:46,240 Speaker 2: lot of interest in was in fact, documentaries, and they 139 00:07:46,440 --> 00:07:51,160 Speaker 2: started to see clearly that docs were becoming a more 140 00:07:51,320 --> 00:07:53,360 Speaker 2: more of a commodity in the marketplace. But even more 141 00:07:53,360 --> 00:07:56,920 Speaker 2: so than that, Imagine has always, for the most part, 142 00:07:57,360 --> 00:08:00,680 Speaker 2: on the scripted side, produced real stories about real true 143 00:08:00,680 --> 00:08:01,640 Speaker 2: stories about real people. 144 00:08:01,680 --> 00:08:03,400 Speaker 1: That's true when you think about their big at their 145 00:08:03,440 --> 00:08:08,960 Speaker 1: big ip even Friday and at lights is beautiful, religion 146 00:08:09,080 --> 00:08:09,680 Speaker 1: and football. 147 00:08:09,880 --> 00:08:12,800 Speaker 2: More recently, you know thirteen lives. So there's this history 148 00:08:12,840 --> 00:08:15,600 Speaker 2: of just true stories. It's kind of always permeated the 149 00:08:15,680 --> 00:08:18,559 Speaker 2: creative ecosystem here. So to get into documentaries never felt 150 00:08:18,560 --> 00:08:20,200 Speaker 2: like a stretch, and it almost felt like, well, of 151 00:08:20,240 --> 00:08:22,400 Speaker 2: course they should be. And at that point Ron had 152 00:08:22,440 --> 00:08:25,640 Speaker 2: obviously done this Jay Z documentary, he directed a great 153 00:08:25,640 --> 00:08:28,640 Speaker 2: film about the Beatles, Yes, and it just Pavarati was 154 00:08:28,760 --> 00:08:31,760 Speaker 2: just coming out at the time, and so so I 155 00:08:31,880 --> 00:08:35,920 Speaker 2: joined to launch that division. I brought my partner Sarah Bernstein, 156 00:08:35,920 --> 00:08:38,000 Speaker 2: who had been at HBO for almost as long as 157 00:08:38,040 --> 00:08:39,920 Speaker 2: I had been at Radical, maybe even a little bit longer, 158 00:08:40,960 --> 00:08:44,480 Speaker 2: to join as well. And we really just I think 159 00:08:45,160 --> 00:08:49,120 Speaker 2: came in at this perfect storm of a moment when 160 00:08:49,400 --> 00:08:52,920 Speaker 2: the premium non fiction business was going gangbuster or about 161 00:08:52,920 --> 00:08:54,320 Speaker 2: to go gangbuster. 162 00:08:54,000 --> 00:08:57,080 Speaker 1: A few billion dollars injected by some of our favorite streamers, 163 00:08:57,240 --> 00:08:58,520 Speaker 1: our favorite streamers Netflix. 164 00:08:58,520 --> 00:09:00,600 Speaker 2: You know. I'd give a lot of it to Lisa 165 00:09:00,679 --> 00:09:03,560 Speaker 2: Nischemura and Adam Delde over there for really jump starting it. 166 00:09:04,280 --> 00:09:07,520 Speaker 2: And then obviously others followed, and we really were able 167 00:09:07,600 --> 00:09:09,480 Speaker 2: to I want to say ride the wave, but I'd 168 00:09:09,520 --> 00:09:12,520 Speaker 2: say help help push the wave and generate the wave, 169 00:09:13,080 --> 00:09:15,079 Speaker 2: because we were able to turn to all of our 170 00:09:15,200 --> 00:09:19,160 Speaker 2: favorite doc filmmakers, people that I had long standing relationships 171 00:09:19,160 --> 00:09:22,840 Speaker 2: with Sarah as well, and say, come over to Imagine. 172 00:09:22,960 --> 00:09:25,839 Speaker 2: Even if you have your own company, come over to Imagine. 173 00:09:25,880 --> 00:09:28,120 Speaker 2: We can co produce. We can bring you in. We 174 00:09:28,160 --> 00:09:30,600 Speaker 2: can physically produce if we need to. We can support you. 175 00:09:30,640 --> 00:09:33,600 Speaker 2: We have money that we can invest in development, we. 176 00:09:33,559 --> 00:09:35,280 Speaker 1: Can mention, we have money, we can. 177 00:09:35,120 --> 00:09:38,160 Speaker 2: Go after rights, and together we can really package up 178 00:09:38,160 --> 00:09:41,199 Speaker 2: and sell and produce these great stories. And I think 179 00:09:41,240 --> 00:09:43,240 Speaker 2: for Sarah and I and for Ron and Brian, it 180 00:09:43,280 --> 00:09:46,800 Speaker 2: was important that we kept all of our films, all 181 00:09:46,800 --> 00:09:50,880 Speaker 2: of our doc film projects, within the same DNA as 182 00:09:51,040 --> 00:09:53,560 Speaker 2: what you'd expect in other aspects of the Imagine brand, 183 00:09:53,920 --> 00:09:58,199 Speaker 2: And those attributes are it's aspirational, it's uplifting. It usually 184 00:09:58,240 --> 00:10:00,000 Speaker 2: is an underdog story. Even if we're going to do 185 00:10:00,080 --> 00:10:04,200 Speaker 2: a true crime project, where's the humanity in that? Let's 186 00:10:04,240 --> 00:10:07,280 Speaker 2: really in this most cases tell the story of the victims, 187 00:10:07,280 --> 00:10:10,600 Speaker 2: not just the crime itself, you know. And and when 188 00:10:10,640 --> 00:10:12,360 Speaker 2: along the way we've we've just had a lot of 189 00:10:12,400 --> 00:10:15,720 Speaker 2: fun and a lot of success. And then just going 190 00:10:15,760 --> 00:10:18,720 Speaker 2: back toward the end of last year, the guys asked 191 00:10:18,720 --> 00:10:20,280 Speaker 2: me if I'd be interested in taking on a bit 192 00:10:20,320 --> 00:10:24,320 Speaker 2: more responsibility in the company. They had never really had 193 00:10:25,000 --> 00:10:29,600 Speaker 2: a leader under them who had who had come up 194 00:10:29,640 --> 00:10:32,400 Speaker 2: through the company. There had been some individuals who had 195 00:10:32,440 --> 00:10:36,120 Speaker 2: come in with more of a either a banking background 196 00:10:36,360 --> 00:10:38,760 Speaker 2: or or more of even like an m and a background, 197 00:10:39,640 --> 00:10:44,280 Speaker 2: and for one reason or another, it didn't it didn't 198 00:10:44,320 --> 00:10:46,760 Speaker 2: fit the culture of the place. But I think what 199 00:10:46,960 --> 00:10:49,160 Speaker 2: made me unique potentially was the fact that I'd kind 200 00:10:49,200 --> 00:10:52,760 Speaker 2: of grown up here over the last five years. And 201 00:10:52,840 --> 00:10:54,760 Speaker 2: I'm a producer, you know, which is something that I 202 00:10:54,800 --> 00:10:56,520 Speaker 2: think when you look at Ron and you look at Brian, 203 00:10:56,920 --> 00:10:59,760 Speaker 2: their producers, their filmmakers. Every one of our division heads 204 00:10:59,800 --> 00:11:02,400 Speaker 2: is as a producer. Actually, we don't really have execs here. 205 00:11:02,440 --> 00:11:04,720 Speaker 2: We have people who make stuff. To have a company 206 00:11:04,720 --> 00:11:07,000 Speaker 2: where we don't just put our name on stuff. We're 207 00:11:07,040 --> 00:11:09,040 Speaker 2: not just packaging things up. We're not a studio, we're 208 00:11:09,040 --> 00:11:10,760 Speaker 2: not distributing. We actually have to make it. 209 00:11:10,800 --> 00:11:13,280 Speaker 1: Send me the check, give me my vanity slate, and 210 00:11:13,320 --> 00:11:13,800 Speaker 1: we'll move on. 211 00:11:13,800 --> 00:11:17,079 Speaker 2: In those projects don't make themselves right, and there's a 212 00:11:17,120 --> 00:11:22,320 Speaker 2: lot of you know, sweat and energy that goes into that, 213 00:11:22,400 --> 00:11:24,640 Speaker 2: and then there's also a lot of a lot of 214 00:11:24,679 --> 00:11:27,400 Speaker 2: reward that comes from the feeling of seeing something on 215 00:11:27,440 --> 00:11:29,840 Speaker 2: a screen, regardless of the size of the screen, and 216 00:11:29,880 --> 00:11:32,760 Speaker 2: feeling like, oh, I had a hand in that coming 217 00:11:32,760 --> 00:11:34,880 Speaker 2: to market or you know, being able to create that. 218 00:11:34,880 --> 00:11:39,480 Speaker 1: That level of consistency has got to be enormous, especially 219 00:11:39,520 --> 00:11:40,079 Speaker 1: at this time. 220 00:11:40,240 --> 00:11:41,880 Speaker 2: I think it really is, and we're seeing it not 221 00:11:41,920 --> 00:11:44,040 Speaker 2: just on the talent side, but even more so on 222 00:11:44,080 --> 00:11:46,599 Speaker 2: the buyer's side now. I think with so much confusion 223 00:11:47,280 --> 00:11:51,240 Speaker 2: in the marketplace, buyers are scared, you know, Executives are scared. 224 00:11:51,280 --> 00:11:53,520 Speaker 2: Friends of mine who are at platforms right now are 225 00:11:53,559 --> 00:11:56,120 Speaker 2: scared to make decisions that would have been easy decisions 226 00:11:56,160 --> 00:11:59,920 Speaker 2: to make six months ago. Everybody is on pins and needles, 227 00:12:00,120 --> 00:12:04,640 Speaker 2: you know, when you've gone through so many layoffs. There's 228 00:12:04,720 --> 00:12:10,000 Speaker 2: this sort of culture of concern and in action that 229 00:12:10,040 --> 00:12:12,319 Speaker 2: comes from that, and of course you add the strike 230 00:12:12,360 --> 00:12:15,840 Speaker 2: to that, and you add budgets being frozen. The one 231 00:12:15,920 --> 00:12:18,720 Speaker 2: thing that I think everybody is looking for particularly now 232 00:12:19,240 --> 00:12:22,800 Speaker 2: is leadership, and is creative leadership. So if there's a 233 00:12:22,800 --> 00:12:24,959 Speaker 2: project that we're going to bring to market, or even 234 00:12:25,000 --> 00:12:27,200 Speaker 2: if we're talking to a buyer that's brought maybe an 235 00:12:27,200 --> 00:12:29,880 Speaker 2: opportunity to us. They're talking to us because they know 236 00:12:29,920 --> 00:12:31,800 Speaker 2: that we're going to deliver, and they know that we're 237 00:12:31,800 --> 00:12:33,200 Speaker 2: going to make them look good, and they're going to 238 00:12:33,200 --> 00:12:34,480 Speaker 2: look good, and their boss is going to look good, 239 00:12:34,480 --> 00:12:35,719 Speaker 2: and their boss's boss is going to look good, and 240 00:12:35,720 --> 00:12:37,960 Speaker 2: there's not going to be a concern as to is 241 00:12:38,000 --> 00:12:39,800 Speaker 2: this thing going to get produced the right way, is 242 00:12:39,840 --> 00:12:41,920 Speaker 2: it going to get produced on budget? And are they 243 00:12:41,960 --> 00:12:44,200 Speaker 2: going to deliver? And I think that if you can 244 00:12:44,200 --> 00:12:46,880 Speaker 2: think of that as a commodity or call that commodity 245 00:12:47,000 --> 00:12:50,320 Speaker 2: calling card, whatever, that is going to be of paramount 246 00:12:50,679 --> 00:12:53,559 Speaker 2: importance I think going forward, because there's going to be 247 00:12:53,640 --> 00:12:56,559 Speaker 2: less stuff made, at least in the short term. Budgets 248 00:12:56,600 --> 00:13:00,120 Speaker 2: are going to be a real concern going forward, and 249 00:13:00,160 --> 00:13:03,480 Speaker 2: that kind of creative consistency and that creative dependence is 250 00:13:03,559 --> 00:13:05,679 Speaker 2: going to be the thing that I think everybody is 251 00:13:05,720 --> 00:13:08,040 Speaker 2: going to be looking out for. And on the talent side, 252 00:13:08,520 --> 00:13:11,960 Speaker 2: especially talent that maybe not even you know, not that 253 00:13:12,040 --> 00:13:14,240 Speaker 2: long ago, had been in overall deals was sort of 254 00:13:14,520 --> 00:13:19,640 Speaker 2: you know, surfing the success of the premium to buyouts. 255 00:13:20,240 --> 00:13:21,439 Speaker 2: All of a sudden, the. 256 00:13:21,440 --> 00:13:24,040 Speaker 1: Money gusher was never going to end. Until it did. 257 00:13:24,120 --> 00:13:26,480 Speaker 2: It kind of ends, and then talent still wants to 258 00:13:26,480 --> 00:13:29,199 Speaker 2: make stuff because as a creative individual, you want to 259 00:13:29,240 --> 00:13:31,439 Speaker 2: keep creating and you want to plug into and identify 260 00:13:31,480 --> 00:13:35,720 Speaker 2: with a company that has that ability to facilitate that. 261 00:13:36,600 --> 00:13:38,920 Speaker 2: So I think the reputation is important, but I think 262 00:13:38,960 --> 00:13:42,360 Speaker 2: even more so right now, what we're currently doing and 263 00:13:42,360 --> 00:13:44,240 Speaker 2: how we're able to sort of project that out to 264 00:13:44,280 --> 00:13:46,040 Speaker 2: the marketplace I think is equally important. 265 00:13:46,480 --> 00:13:49,760 Speaker 1: How important is the build out of nonfiction content and 266 00:13:49,840 --> 00:13:53,240 Speaker 1: documentary content been to imagine as a business as a 267 00:13:53,280 --> 00:13:57,480 Speaker 1: diversification of the of the of the business. And I 268 00:13:57,480 --> 00:14:00,240 Speaker 1: know also you've done You've also gone into kids and fams, family, 269 00:14:00,280 --> 00:14:02,160 Speaker 1: You've gone into some interesting new areas. 270 00:14:02,400 --> 00:14:06,240 Speaker 2: The diversification, honestly speaking, has been the key to our 271 00:14:06,440 --> 00:14:09,280 Speaker 2: financial success, especially over the last i'd say three or 272 00:14:09,320 --> 00:14:15,360 Speaker 2: four years between COVID time to diversified. Yeah, between COVID 273 00:14:15,520 --> 00:14:21,320 Speaker 2: and certainly the consolidation and downward forces market forces on 274 00:14:21,320 --> 00:14:26,160 Speaker 2: on the business. And then compound that with strikes, multiple strikes. 275 00:14:26,760 --> 00:14:26,880 Speaker 1: Uh. 276 00:14:27,040 --> 00:14:30,280 Speaker 2: It really is that perfect storm. Our nonfiction business this 277 00:14:30,400 --> 00:14:35,680 Speaker 2: year will have record profits, which is which is both 278 00:14:36,040 --> 00:14:38,360 Speaker 2: a testament I think to what we were able to 279 00:14:38,360 --> 00:14:42,320 Speaker 2: build over the last five years, but also just demonstrative 280 00:14:42,360 --> 00:14:46,400 Speaker 2: of the fact that the other divisions on the scripted 281 00:14:46,480 --> 00:14:50,320 Speaker 2: side are clearly suffering because of because of the you know, 282 00:14:50,320 --> 00:14:51,240 Speaker 2: the market conditions. 283 00:14:51,320 --> 00:14:53,560 Speaker 1: I mean hurry up and weight. Even hurry up and 284 00:14:53,560 --> 00:14:56,200 Speaker 1: weight has costs to it. I saw a little grin 285 00:14:56,240 --> 00:14:58,760 Speaker 1: when you said record profits for the non fiction division, 286 00:14:58,800 --> 00:15:02,840 Speaker 1: which you know understandable in this market. But also, like 287 00:15:02,880 --> 00:15:06,720 Speaker 1: you said, you know, forward thinking of leadership to to 288 00:15:06,880 --> 00:15:08,200 Speaker 1: see what this brand could be. 289 00:15:08,800 --> 00:15:11,800 Speaker 2: Yeah, but you know, on a positive note, we're also 290 00:15:11,880 --> 00:15:14,160 Speaker 2: seeing and this is through a new relationship with Amazon 291 00:15:14,400 --> 00:15:16,920 Speaker 2: on the on the feature film side, and we have 292 00:15:16,920 --> 00:15:19,040 Speaker 2: a first look with Amazon as well for docs, but 293 00:15:19,080 --> 00:15:23,320 Speaker 2: specifically on features. They're one of the few studios right now, 294 00:15:24,120 --> 00:15:26,680 Speaker 2: despite some of what we're hearing in terms of their own, 295 00:15:26,800 --> 00:15:30,240 Speaker 2: you know, budgetary restraints, they're in the movie business. I mean, 296 00:15:30,320 --> 00:15:32,680 Speaker 2: talking to Courtney Valenti here was here not you know, 297 00:15:32,720 --> 00:15:35,560 Speaker 2: a couple of weeks ago. They're going to make you know, 298 00:15:36,160 --> 00:15:38,160 Speaker 2: X number of movies a year, and they're going to 299 00:15:38,160 --> 00:15:40,320 Speaker 2: really get behind them, and they're looking for movies that 300 00:15:40,360 --> 00:15:42,200 Speaker 2: have movie stars in them, and they're looking for movies 301 00:15:42,200 --> 00:15:44,920 Speaker 2: that are very similar to honestly, what Imagine has always 302 00:15:45,000 --> 00:15:49,200 Speaker 2: kind of made so while the strike has certainly temporarily 303 00:15:49,200 --> 00:15:51,800 Speaker 2: slowed things down, you know, we see a real growth 304 00:15:51,840 --> 00:15:54,560 Speaker 2: opportunity for our for our future business. And then on 305 00:15:54,600 --> 00:15:57,040 Speaker 2: the television side, you know, prior to the strike, we 306 00:15:57,120 --> 00:15:59,560 Speaker 2: actually with Kristen Zoelner joining us, she could been at 307 00:16:00,040 --> 00:16:04,040 Speaker 2: Looks prior, we have you know, an incredible slate of 308 00:16:04,240 --> 00:16:05,960 Speaker 2: shows that are set up that are just you know, 309 00:16:06,040 --> 00:16:08,520 Speaker 2: rear and a go at this point. So I think 310 00:16:08,640 --> 00:16:11,480 Speaker 2: next year is going to be an exciting year for 311 00:16:11,600 --> 00:16:12,560 Speaker 2: us in terms of growth. 312 00:16:15,800 --> 00:16:18,120 Speaker 1: Hang tight, folks, We'll take a short break here and 313 00:16:18,200 --> 00:16:21,840 Speaker 1: be back with more from Imagine Entertainment President Justin Wilkes, 314 00:16:29,760 --> 00:16:35,440 Speaker 1: And we're back with more from Imagine Entertainments Justin Wilkes. 315 00:16:35,440 --> 00:16:37,320 Speaker 1: Being that you're Imagine and you bring so much to 316 00:16:37,360 --> 00:16:40,960 Speaker 1: the table, are you seeing any improvement in the economics 317 00:16:41,000 --> 00:16:44,280 Speaker 1: of streaming for scripted shows? Are you finding people a 318 00:16:44,360 --> 00:16:48,120 Speaker 1: little more willing to deal and maybe you know, work 319 00:16:48,160 --> 00:16:50,840 Speaker 1: with you on areas that are important, you know, areas 320 00:16:50,880 --> 00:16:54,000 Speaker 1: of rights or retention or licensed terms that are important 321 00:16:54,000 --> 00:16:55,400 Speaker 1: to Imagine. 322 00:16:55,280 --> 00:17:00,000 Speaker 2: If you look historically at the film and television business, 323 00:17:00,880 --> 00:17:03,840 Speaker 2: and even as we were discussing prior to this, to 324 00:17:03,920 --> 00:17:09,359 Speaker 2: this recording, there was a very clear understanding of where 325 00:17:09,440 --> 00:17:14,440 Speaker 2: revenue came from, where costs lie, and where profit was derived. 326 00:17:15,040 --> 00:17:16,040 Speaker 2: It's either in box. 327 00:17:15,840 --> 00:17:18,479 Speaker 1: Office, magic of syndication and international license. 328 00:17:18,560 --> 00:17:23,080 Speaker 2: That's right. There's box office, there's international distribution, there's upfront 329 00:17:23,119 --> 00:17:27,880 Speaker 2: license fees, and there's syndication and distribution on the television side. 330 00:17:28,119 --> 00:17:31,760 Speaker 2: And for a really long time that worked pretty well. 331 00:17:33,359 --> 00:17:35,359 Speaker 2: You know, maybe there were times when the writers should 332 00:17:35,359 --> 00:17:36,720 Speaker 2: have been paid a little bit more, Maybe there's time 333 00:17:36,720 --> 00:17:38,040 Speaker 2: when the actors should been paid a little bit more, 334 00:17:38,040 --> 00:17:39,600 Speaker 2: Maybe there's times where the producer should have be paid 335 00:17:39,600 --> 00:17:41,080 Speaker 2: a little bit more. But for the most part, it 336 00:17:41,119 --> 00:17:45,520 Speaker 2: was pretty pretty well, uh, you know, defined in terms 337 00:17:45,520 --> 00:17:48,119 Speaker 2: of how you'd make money in this business, and not 338 00:17:48,160 --> 00:17:51,159 Speaker 2: even more often than not, but across the board, in 339 00:17:51,240 --> 00:17:55,040 Speaker 2: success you would make more than you would if it 340 00:17:55,080 --> 00:17:57,640 Speaker 2: wasn't successful, which seems like a pretty good trade. 341 00:17:57,480 --> 00:17:58,720 Speaker 1: Off aligning incentives. 342 00:18:00,920 --> 00:18:03,399 Speaker 2: If you were just pretty good but you never had 343 00:18:03,440 --> 00:18:05,760 Speaker 2: a breakout hit, you can make a decent living. You 344 00:18:05,760 --> 00:18:09,280 Speaker 2: could kind of churn and I think Imagine has had an, 345 00:18:10,119 --> 00:18:13,320 Speaker 2: you know, a track record that's almost unparalleled in the 346 00:18:13,359 --> 00:18:15,760 Speaker 2: successes and we've also made a lot of great base 347 00:18:15,840 --> 00:18:18,320 Speaker 2: hits and they kind of balance each other out, and 348 00:18:18,359 --> 00:18:19,600 Speaker 2: that's been a good business for a long time. 349 00:18:19,640 --> 00:18:22,240 Speaker 1: Most pictures do throw more balls than strikes, of. 350 00:18:22,240 --> 00:18:24,760 Speaker 2: Course, of course, and you know, we've just had the 351 00:18:24,760 --> 00:18:27,080 Speaker 2: benefit of doing it maybe long, you know, longer than 352 00:18:27,119 --> 00:18:30,119 Speaker 2: most people. So then, of course, without getting to a 353 00:18:30,119 --> 00:18:32,640 Speaker 2: whole history of the streaming industry, we all know how 354 00:18:32,880 --> 00:18:35,320 Speaker 2: streaming kind of disrupted that model, and we know how 355 00:18:35,320 --> 00:18:38,200 Speaker 2: Wall Street embraced streaming and that sort of disrupted this model. 356 00:18:38,200 --> 00:18:41,480 Speaker 2: And now there really is this moment of reckoning, which unfortunately, 357 00:18:41,520 --> 00:18:43,960 Speaker 2: this strike is not going to solve because it's a 358 00:18:44,040 --> 00:18:47,639 Speaker 2: much larger issue than what's being discussed really in terms 359 00:18:47,640 --> 00:18:50,720 Speaker 2: of the deal points of the strike. It's it's a 360 00:18:50,840 --> 00:18:53,720 Speaker 2: moment of reconciliation that all of these media companies are 361 00:18:53,720 --> 00:18:57,960 Speaker 2: going to have to ultimately contend with, which is, how 362 00:18:58,000 --> 00:19:02,520 Speaker 2: do we accurately report the success of something or the 363 00:19:02,960 --> 00:19:07,080 Speaker 2: not the failure of something, and how do we come 364 00:19:07,160 --> 00:19:09,840 Speaker 2: up with a way of incentivizing people to be able 365 00:19:09,880 --> 00:19:12,439 Speaker 2: to create for us and not have to overpay for 366 00:19:12,520 --> 00:19:16,639 Speaker 2: it upfront. And until that real moment happens, it is 367 00:19:16,680 --> 00:19:18,440 Speaker 2: a little bit of the wild West. So long wave 368 00:19:18,480 --> 00:19:21,560 Speaker 2: answering your question, there is actually a moment that I 369 00:19:21,560 --> 00:19:24,040 Speaker 2: think is now coming upon us where we're starting to 370 00:19:24,040 --> 00:19:27,920 Speaker 2: see some cracks in what was impenetrable armor at places 371 00:19:28,040 --> 00:19:31,120 Speaker 2: like Netflix, at places like Disney, at places like Amazon, 372 00:19:31,160 --> 00:19:34,040 Speaker 2: at places like HBO. Even that announcement just a week 373 00:19:34,040 --> 00:19:37,560 Speaker 2: ago of HBO, you know, acknowledging that they're going to 374 00:19:37,600 --> 00:19:40,680 Speaker 2: license content to Netflix, Well, that makes a lot of sense. 375 00:19:41,040 --> 00:19:43,000 Speaker 1: We need to cash some checks, people, We need to 376 00:19:43,000 --> 00:19:43,640 Speaker 1: cash some checks. 377 00:19:43,640 --> 00:19:48,080 Speaker 2: We's again going back to how the business was always run, syndication, 378 00:19:48,400 --> 00:19:51,560 Speaker 2: second windows, third windows, like that's how this whole business worked. 379 00:19:52,200 --> 00:19:54,520 Speaker 2: Imagine has a great library of content that we still 380 00:19:54,560 --> 00:19:57,680 Speaker 2: benefit from because of these these past deals where they're 381 00:19:57,680 --> 00:19:59,920 Speaker 2: you know, they're profit sharing deals and shows that's still 382 00:20:00,080 --> 00:20:02,720 Speaker 2: get bought by platforms around the world or films that 383 00:20:02,720 --> 00:20:06,119 Speaker 2: get distributed around the world. So we're starting to see 384 00:20:06,160 --> 00:20:09,600 Speaker 2: that as an independent company, as an independent company that 385 00:20:09,640 --> 00:20:13,359 Speaker 2: has a facility to deficit finance if we believe it 386 00:20:13,400 --> 00:20:17,120 Speaker 2: makes sense co finance less on the feature film side, 387 00:20:17,119 --> 00:20:19,080 Speaker 2: but on the dock side and as well as on 388 00:20:19,080 --> 00:20:21,600 Speaker 2: the television side, where we can start to be a 389 00:20:21,640 --> 00:20:24,920 Speaker 2: little bit more aggressive in the dealmaking. I think it's 390 00:20:24,960 --> 00:20:29,399 Speaker 2: going to require a few more of those coming to 391 00:20:29,440 --> 00:20:31,879 Speaker 2: the table to really start to see if that's a 392 00:20:31,920 --> 00:20:36,000 Speaker 2: trend we can count on. But us, like everybody else 393 00:20:36,040 --> 00:20:38,600 Speaker 2: on the producing side, is certainly looking for opportunities to 394 00:20:38,640 --> 00:20:41,399 Speaker 2: either be able to retain rights, to be able to 395 00:20:42,320 --> 00:20:48,000 Speaker 2: have some participation meaningful participation in upside in future revenue streams. 396 00:20:48,480 --> 00:20:50,320 Speaker 2: And I think on the streamer side, what we're seeing 397 00:20:50,359 --> 00:20:52,520 Speaker 2: is maybe we don't have to pay as much money 398 00:20:52,560 --> 00:20:55,719 Speaker 2: upfront for this thing, and maybe as a result of that, 399 00:20:55,760 --> 00:20:57,280 Speaker 2: we don't need it for as long as we thought. 400 00:20:57,560 --> 00:20:59,880 Speaker 2: Because there's real data out there that shows people tend 401 00:20:59,880 --> 00:21:01,639 Speaker 2: to watch things when it first comes out, and then 402 00:21:01,640 --> 00:21:04,000 Speaker 2: they kind of don't watch it after that unless it 403 00:21:04,000 --> 00:21:06,840 Speaker 2: maybe appears somewhere else at another time, and then they'll 404 00:21:06,920 --> 00:21:07,920 Speaker 2: watch it in reruns. 405 00:21:08,119 --> 00:21:10,560 Speaker 1: You've got to surface it to the whole new audience. 406 00:21:10,640 --> 00:21:13,360 Speaker 1: I mean, that was the whole windowing strategy exactly. 407 00:21:13,520 --> 00:21:16,520 Speaker 2: So when you see a company like I mean Disney 408 00:21:16,520 --> 00:21:18,480 Speaker 2: just did this HBO two where they were max where 409 00:21:18,520 --> 00:21:20,879 Speaker 2: you know, where they dump a bunch of the content 410 00:21:20,920 --> 00:21:24,360 Speaker 2: that's on the platform. Because there's a tax implication for it, well, 411 00:21:24,400 --> 00:21:26,400 Speaker 2: wouldn't it make sense for that content to probably live 412 00:21:26,440 --> 00:21:28,680 Speaker 2: somewhere else? And we know this even from take a 413 00:21:28,720 --> 00:21:31,840 Speaker 2: show like Arrested Development, which is now living on Netflix right, 414 00:21:31,880 --> 00:21:34,360 Speaker 2: people still like watching that show. How many years since 415 00:21:34,400 --> 00:21:38,359 Speaker 2: it's done it was on the air and Fox. So again, 416 00:21:39,200 --> 00:21:41,359 Speaker 2: there's no reason to sort of reinvent how the business 417 00:21:41,400 --> 00:21:44,760 Speaker 2: has always worked. But I think our advantage because of 418 00:21:44,760 --> 00:21:47,440 Speaker 2: our name brand, because of the new content that we 419 00:21:47,520 --> 00:21:50,280 Speaker 2: are taking to market, and because of our ability to 420 00:21:50,800 --> 00:21:54,840 Speaker 2: offer up at least financing, will lead to some more 421 00:21:54,840 --> 00:21:59,680 Speaker 2: interesting deals. Interestingly, on the dock side, we've seen more 422 00:21:59,680 --> 00:22:02,800 Speaker 2: of that at recently where we've actually been able to 423 00:22:03,040 --> 00:22:05,920 Speaker 2: license content for a shorter period of time. 424 00:22:06,200 --> 00:22:08,840 Speaker 1: I've been hearing them yeah. 425 00:22:08,119 --> 00:22:09,840 Speaker 2: For the very same reason, because if a platform can 426 00:22:09,880 --> 00:22:11,240 Speaker 2: pay a little less for it but still get the 427 00:22:11,240 --> 00:22:14,400 Speaker 2: benefit of some form of exclusivity, it's a win win 428 00:22:14,440 --> 00:22:15,040 Speaker 2: for everybody. 429 00:22:15,200 --> 00:22:16,520 Speaker 1: Let me ask you to drill down a little bit 430 00:22:16,520 --> 00:22:18,639 Speaker 1: because I'm kind of fascinated by the kids and family 431 00:22:18,680 --> 00:22:20,800 Speaker 1: business and where that's going, because we all know that 432 00:22:20,960 --> 00:22:24,800 Speaker 1: kids are the leading lights of going into a world 433 00:22:24,880 --> 00:22:27,760 Speaker 1: where they look at television as a box that has 434 00:22:27,800 --> 00:22:30,280 Speaker 1: a dial on it. You know, what is this device? 435 00:22:31,080 --> 00:22:33,000 Speaker 1: Curious where you're finding opportunity there? 436 00:22:33,480 --> 00:22:37,560 Speaker 2: Sure, when you think of the Imagined brand again, what 437 00:22:37,600 --> 00:22:39,760 Speaker 2: I've always loved about it is it really can play 438 00:22:39,760 --> 00:22:42,000 Speaker 2: in so many different spaces. Also, if you look at 439 00:22:42,000 --> 00:22:44,399 Speaker 2: the Imagine brand over the years, kids and family is 440 00:22:44,400 --> 00:22:47,199 Speaker 2: a category that we've always played in. I mean, The 441 00:22:47,240 --> 00:22:50,359 Speaker 2: Grinch to this day still is in the top ten 442 00:22:51,080 --> 00:22:55,000 Speaker 2: on global streaming platforms around the holiday season. 443 00:22:54,800 --> 00:22:56,040 Speaker 1: About six months out of the year. 444 00:22:56,080 --> 00:22:59,640 Speaker 2: Every yeah, well there's something great about that. We've produced 445 00:23:00,160 --> 00:23:02,960 Speaker 2: Fraught with season right now, but the Curious George animated 446 00:23:03,000 --> 00:23:05,119 Speaker 2: series on a was on PBS in the United States, 447 00:23:05,119 --> 00:23:07,199 Speaker 2: but then it runs, you know, around the world. And 448 00:23:07,240 --> 00:23:09,840 Speaker 2: we've done some children's programming on the dock side with 449 00:23:10,160 --> 00:23:13,240 Speaker 2: the Peanuts characters in the Charles Sheltz State, which is fun. 450 00:23:13,640 --> 00:23:15,359 Speaker 2: So we've always kind of played in that space, and 451 00:23:15,480 --> 00:23:17,800 Speaker 2: so it made a lot of sense to really lean 452 00:23:17,840 --> 00:23:20,760 Speaker 2: into that and start to develop. And the approach originally was, 453 00:23:21,359 --> 00:23:24,600 Speaker 2: let's look at it from the underlying ip side of things, 454 00:23:24,640 --> 00:23:28,040 Speaker 2: because fees in the kids and family business tend to 455 00:23:28,119 --> 00:23:31,320 Speaker 2: not be nearly as significant as they are on the 456 00:23:31,359 --> 00:23:32,199 Speaker 2: other side of things, and. 457 00:23:32,280 --> 00:23:34,000 Speaker 1: It's harder if you don't have a t if you're 458 00:23:34,000 --> 00:23:37,680 Speaker 1: not Disney and endowed with a ton of great IP. 459 00:23:38,000 --> 00:23:40,359 Speaker 2: Right, So for us, it was actually investing in that IP, 460 00:23:40,600 --> 00:23:44,160 Speaker 2: trying to spot the IP from the ground up. And 461 00:23:44,640 --> 00:23:46,399 Speaker 2: while we have a whole slate, the two projects in 462 00:23:46,440 --> 00:23:49,280 Speaker 2: particular that are that are out right now Tiny Chef, 463 00:23:49,440 --> 00:23:52,600 Speaker 2: which is a really fun property. It's a stop motion 464 00:23:52,680 --> 00:23:56,800 Speaker 2: animation of a little chef who became an Instagram sensation 465 00:23:57,040 --> 00:24:00,359 Speaker 2: and then now has a series on Nickelodeon in addition 466 00:24:00,400 --> 00:24:02,240 Speaker 2: to a whole product line which is kind of fun. 467 00:24:02,359 --> 00:24:04,879 Speaker 2: It's like an overachiever, very much an overteev And then 468 00:24:05,160 --> 00:24:09,760 Speaker 2: Bossy Bear, which which also underlying IP that we've invested in, 469 00:24:09,880 --> 00:24:13,440 Speaker 2: also a series that's currently on nick which we're expanding upon, 470 00:24:14,560 --> 00:24:17,240 Speaker 2: you know. And then on the feature film side, we've 471 00:24:17,359 --> 00:24:20,600 Speaker 2: been putting the pieces together for a new Curious George 472 00:24:21,000 --> 00:24:23,840 Speaker 2: live action movie The Band in the Yellow Hat, which 473 00:24:23,880 --> 00:24:27,440 Speaker 2: is kind of exciting. And same thing on the television side. 474 00:24:27,480 --> 00:24:29,199 Speaker 2: So so Kids and Family is always going to be 475 00:24:29,200 --> 00:24:31,600 Speaker 2: a part of the Imagined brand in one way, shape 476 00:24:31,640 --> 00:24:33,680 Speaker 2: or form. We also have just a plug while we're 477 00:24:33,680 --> 00:24:38,000 Speaker 2: talking about it, a great film coming out called Slumber Party, 478 00:24:38,240 --> 00:24:41,080 Speaker 2: which is coming out on Disney, and the log line is, 479 00:24:41,119 --> 00:24:44,080 Speaker 2: so if you took the hangover but applied it to 480 00:24:44,280 --> 00:24:48,040 Speaker 2: like a twelve year old girl's sleepover and sort of 481 00:24:48,080 --> 00:24:49,679 Speaker 2: like what happens when they all wake up and they 482 00:24:49,720 --> 00:24:53,040 Speaker 2: find got makeup on and someone's missing an eyebrow, and like, 483 00:24:53,080 --> 00:24:56,120 Speaker 2: what's going on here? It's a really fun movie that's 484 00:24:56,160 --> 00:24:57,840 Speaker 2: going to be premiering on Disney later this month. 485 00:24:58,560 --> 00:25:02,840 Speaker 1: Having attended sleepovers and having chaperone kids sleepovers, there's great 486 00:25:02,920 --> 00:25:05,760 Speaker 1: potential there. It's actually the minute you said, it's like, 487 00:25:05,800 --> 00:25:07,720 Speaker 1: I can't believe it hasn't been done because there's great 488 00:25:08,200 --> 00:25:11,040 Speaker 1: there's great potentially. My daughter's turning twelve, major drama, and 489 00:25:11,560 --> 00:25:13,119 Speaker 1: sometimes in these things. 490 00:25:12,880 --> 00:25:15,240 Speaker 2: My daughter's turning twelve next week. She's having a sleepover. 491 00:25:15,359 --> 00:25:17,560 Speaker 2: So I was like, Okay, we're actually gonna watch this movie. 492 00:25:17,600 --> 00:25:18,439 Speaker 2: Don't get any ideas. 493 00:25:20,160 --> 00:25:22,160 Speaker 1: That's awesome. That's also got to be, you know, kind 494 00:25:22,160 --> 00:25:25,960 Speaker 1: of an exciting area to just explore what what is potential? 495 00:25:26,000 --> 00:25:29,160 Speaker 1: And of course, I mean, are you I'm sure you're 496 00:25:29,160 --> 00:25:31,280 Speaker 1: thinking down the road. If you do get you know, 497 00:25:31,359 --> 00:25:34,240 Speaker 1: something really takes off. There's lunch boxes. 498 00:25:33,920 --> 00:25:37,200 Speaker 2: Of course, sir well, and that's why strategically going after 499 00:25:37,240 --> 00:25:41,200 Speaker 2: the underlying IP was important for us versus just developing 500 00:25:41,200 --> 00:25:43,720 Speaker 2: a TV show and selling it, because that is where 501 00:25:43,720 --> 00:25:45,800 Speaker 2: the upside is in the in the merchant and the 502 00:25:45,800 --> 00:25:46,760 Speaker 2: consumer products. 503 00:25:47,080 --> 00:25:49,479 Speaker 1: Hollywood is in a is in a really tough season 504 00:25:49,520 --> 00:25:53,720 Speaker 1: of difficult labor discussions. How does a company like Imagine 505 00:25:53,800 --> 00:25:57,280 Speaker 1: Entertainment hold on through that? But you've just explained how 506 00:25:57,359 --> 00:26:00,600 Speaker 1: you do like the diversification push, and I it's such 507 00:26:00,680 --> 00:26:05,280 Speaker 1: credit to the forward thinking leadership of the company that 508 00:26:05,440 --> 00:26:06,960 Speaker 1: you would be in this position. 509 00:26:07,320 --> 00:26:10,879 Speaker 2: There's certainly a feeling amongst friends and you know, other 510 00:26:10,960 --> 00:26:13,840 Speaker 2: colleagues that I have in the industry of just that 511 00:26:14,000 --> 00:26:16,879 Speaker 2: sense of fear and what's going to happen next? This 512 00:26:17,000 --> 00:26:20,000 Speaker 2: two shell pass might be weeks, it might be months, 513 00:26:20,520 --> 00:26:22,800 Speaker 2: but it's more productive to think about what's it going 514 00:26:22,840 --> 00:26:24,560 Speaker 2: to look like on the other side of it, and 515 00:26:24,600 --> 00:26:27,240 Speaker 2: how do we best position ourselves for it and how 516 00:26:27,280 --> 00:26:30,480 Speaker 2: can we be a leader within it, which is what 517 00:26:30,520 --> 00:26:33,959 Speaker 2: we were talking about before. And it's a combination of 518 00:26:34,200 --> 00:26:38,679 Speaker 2: the diversification, it's a combination of having the financial resources 519 00:26:38,960 --> 00:26:42,080 Speaker 2: to be able to invest in IP, invest in talent 520 00:26:42,320 --> 00:26:45,240 Speaker 2: package projects up and be able to bring those to 521 00:26:45,320 --> 00:26:48,520 Speaker 2: market and try to cut new kinds of new kinds 522 00:26:48,520 --> 00:26:51,680 Speaker 2: of old deals where we're able to get the benefit 523 00:26:51,960 --> 00:26:57,040 Speaker 2: of success. And that's I'm pretty sure if I had 524 00:26:57,080 --> 00:26:59,080 Speaker 2: to bet where the business is going to be heading, 525 00:26:59,119 --> 00:27:01,639 Speaker 2: it's actually going to be back to a little bit 526 00:27:01,640 --> 00:27:05,080 Speaker 2: of what it might have been before. 527 00:27:09,080 --> 00:27:11,960 Speaker 1: Thanks for listening. 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