Speaker 1: Also media.
Speaker 2: Forty years ago, the old gods decided to create a podcast.
Speaker 2: Are capable of withstanding twenty hours of podcasting in the
Speaker 2: space of five days. I am at Zeitron and this
Speaker 2: is better offline CS coverage. We are large and in
Speaker 2: charge in the Palazzo Hotel in Las Vegas, beautiful Las Vegas, Nevada,
Speaker 2: with an open bar, Tacos and the strongest bench of
Speaker 2: tech commentator talent in the known universe. As every We're
Speaker 2: bringing you coverage of the world's biggest tech conference. It's
Speaker 2: day two, Episode two, and our first contestants have just arrived.
Speaker 2: Joining me for the first block is the amazing, victorious
Speaker 2: song of the Verge. Hello, And we've got the wonderful
Speaker 2: stand up comedian host of the Factually podcast, Adam Connover.
Speaker 3: Hello, and of course.
Speaker 2: The legendary broadcast of My Dad's Gonna be So Happy.
Speaker 2: Rory Kecklin Jones, who writes the Always On newsletter and
Speaker 2: the mo is on the Movers and Shakers podcast.
Speaker 4: Thank you for your sorry, Hello, so pleased to please
Speaker 4: your dad.
Speaker 2: Oh, He's gonna He's gonna be elated, So Victoria. You
Speaker 2: describe your beat as the Curse Technology Beat and I
Speaker 2: think this is a great place to begin.
Speaker 5: Not for my mental health, but sure.
Speaker 2: Yes, but for the full of yucks. Perhaps what have
Speaker 2: you seen? Just just start anywhere?
Speaker 5: Okay, So with my editors, you know, we're talking trend
Speaker 5: pieces right now, and they're like, what's your what's your
Speaker 5: trend this year? And I was like, bodily fluids. We
Speaker 5: are talking piss semen, uh, blood urine, bodily fluids, because
Speaker 5: you know, my actual beat is wearable in health technology, right,
Speaker 5: so you know, I'm you know, I'm surprisingly light under
Speaker 5: unwearable today.
Speaker 2: How many people got today?
Speaker 5: I only got two? The other day I was racking.
Speaker 2: Four like a parallax style things.
Speaker 5: Yeah, actually, actually no, I have AI You you sent
Speaker 5: me these?
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, don't name them insuls.
Speaker 5: The AI generated insuls. My feet seas still hurt, So
Speaker 5: there we go. H But yeah, so you know, longevity
Speaker 5: quote unquote longevity tech is in right now. Wellness is bullshit,
Speaker 5: as we know, but a lot of my beat deals
Speaker 5: with wellness, and therefore the snake oil perpetuated by wellness
Speaker 5: influencers in the world, and I get to have the
Speaker 5: lovely job of going, what bullshit are they going to
Speaker 5: make me? Wear this year. So I've worn uh, I've
Speaker 5: worn in led face mask that makes Jason Vorhees look funny. Okay,
Speaker 5: but you know it's not the Jason Warheas type led mask.
Speaker 5: It's you'll see it tomorrow on Leverage Dot. There's that
Speaker 5: I closed the loop on the taint zapper and you know.
Speaker 2: I'm gonna stop you then, Okay, what is that?
Speaker 1: Okay?
Speaker 5: So we have to go back six years because this
Speaker 5: is a year. This is a story that is six
Speaker 5: years in the reporting and the making. So CES twenty twenty,
Speaker 5: right before the world closes down because of COVID. I'm
Speaker 5: at Cees suffering, I have a cold or whatever. I'm
Speaker 5: at CS Unveiled, which is the inaugural Nights showcase of
Speaker 5: vendors and whatnot. I'm walking along a long what am
Speaker 5: I going to cover? What am I going to cover?
Speaker 5: And I see a table. It's one of those booths
Speaker 5: that's very empty and sad, right, and on the table
Speaker 5: there is a mannequin and it's just this mid torso
Speaker 5: section of a male mannequin with Kendall smooth giblets, and
Speaker 5: it's on its back so its tant is exposed to
Speaker 5: a roving crowd of tech journalists and on on the
Speaker 5: goos of this, of this, a mannequin is a band aid, right,
Speaker 5: And on this sparse table, I really have to paint
Speaker 5: the picture. Here there's a laptop, and on the laptop
Speaker 5: there is a slideshow presentation. And I want you to
Speaker 5: think of a black and white picture of a couple
Speaker 5: in bed and they're disgruntled. The woman is on the
Speaker 5: bed and she's sitting here with her arms folded and
Speaker 5: just like a look of disgust on our face. And
Speaker 5: the man is at the edge of the bed with
Speaker 5: his head and his hands and he's so sad. And
Speaker 5: the text on this slide show is premature ejaculation is
Speaker 5: the number one male dysfunction. So I take a picture.
Speaker 5: I was like his moto at the time. So I
Speaker 5: take a picture of this and I send it to
Speaker 5: our slack channel, and my editor goes, bitch, you must
Speaker 5: write this, and I go, okay, so I'll just describe it.
Speaker 5: I wrote it. A week later, the CEO Lovely Man, Jeff.
Speaker 5: He reaches out to me and he goes, I because
Speaker 5: I had some burning questions about this taint banding. I
Speaker 5: was like, is it gonna rip off the hair off
Speaker 5: these men's gooches, Like, is what are we doing here?
Speaker 5: And it's like the proposed it was a concept wearable.
Speaker 5: So the proposal was that to help men with premature ejaculation,
Speaker 5: it was gonna zop you, okay, to you know, delay orgism.
Speaker 5: And so I was like, I have so many questions.
Speaker 5: I asked many penis half others that I knew. I
Speaker 5: was like, would you would you try this? Would you do?
Speaker 5: And they're all like, bitch no, And so you know,
Speaker 5: a week later he reaches out to me. I was like,
Speaker 5: I want to answer some of your questions. No, it's
Speaker 5: not going to rip the hair off. We've done a
Speaker 5: lot of research into the type of adhesive views. And
Speaker 5: I was like, okay, I'll write that follow up. The
Speaker 5: next year, I see them again and they have the
Speaker 5: most They have this gift that shows how it works
Speaker 5: and it's like a if you were on the floor
Speaker 5: and you were panning up, it's like the view of
Speaker 5: the gooch and just it's the most cursed gift I've
Speaker 5: ever seen in my life. Right, it's in our social
Speaker 5: video if you want to see it. But yeah, so
Speaker 5: that was there and we were talking and he's like,
Speaker 5: we've discovered something mysterious in our testing. And I was like, oh, okay, cool,
Speaker 5: what sure? So I met up with this guy this
Speaker 5: year and it's now a product. They are FDA cleared.
Speaker 5: Nice And the mysterious discovery that they discovered was that
Speaker 5: not only can it help men with premature ejaculation delay
Speaker 5: orgasm mm hmmm, the electrical signal contracts the prostate and
Speaker 5: makes ejaculation more forceful.
Speaker 2: So how did they measure.
Speaker 5: That it was discovered? It was discovered in test.
Speaker 3: You can tell when you do it how forceful it is.
Speaker 2: Well, I've never had sex, so yeah. No.
Speaker 6: Sometimes sometimes you're in a good mood and you hit
Speaker 6: the wall and and people it must have experienced this.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I actually you know that year after, when I
Speaker 5: was doing the follow up, I talked to a user
Speaker 5: who had used it. You wanted to be anonymous, and
Speaker 5: he was like, it's saving my marriage. It's great, it
Speaker 5: doesn't hurt, it feels great.
Speaker 2: I'm being kind of cynical, but it seems like it's
Speaker 2: actually possibly use.
Speaker 5: But you know, there's there's like a lot of meaning
Speaker 5: between FDA proved, FDA clear isn't listed, it has to
Speaker 5: do with the type of medical class device it is
Speaker 5: and whatnot. But but, but but I did get to
Speaker 5: try it myself on my forearm, as I do not
Speaker 5: possess the actual body part necessary for real life testing,
Speaker 5: so I put it on my forearm. I got to
Speaker 5: try it out. It costs three hundred dollars for the
Speaker 5: starter kit it has.
Speaker 2: Does it require a subscription?
Speaker 5: No, And there's no AI involved, so you know, but
Speaker 5: you know you can. You can customize the zapp pattern,
Speaker 5: so you can you can. There's a strength level of
Speaker 5: one to one hundred. I could feel the strength at one,
Speaker 5: which I was yeah, on my arm, tained which I
Speaker 5: was told that makes me a unicorn because most people
Speaker 5: can't actually feel it at one. Like he was saying
Speaker 5: that depending on your body, uh, how hairy you are,
Speaker 5: how much body fat you have, you might need to
Speaker 5: like go up to twenty five to feel something nice.
Speaker 2: That's that's yeah, that's good. I'm trying, like I'm trying
Speaker 2: not to like just laugh at the idea of bums
Speaker 2: just like just like wooo bum poo, but like it
Speaker 2: seems like an actual, like weirdly useful thing, like well, you.
Speaker 5: Know, a lot of men don't want to talk about
Speaker 5: premature ejaculates.
Speaker 2: I don't want to talk about sex at all. Like
Speaker 2: that's like that's a universal thing with the Fellas, Like
Speaker 2: this came up last year with Shad and like men
Speaker 2: just like you start talking about sex and like no,
Speaker 2: I couldn't possibly.
Speaker 5: Yeah yeah, And you know, the their founder is a
Speaker 5: really good sport because Jimmy Kimmel did roast him on
Speaker 5: a monologue in twenty twenty two about it, and he's like,
Speaker 5: that's fine. I just want people talking about it, and
Speaker 5: I want men who suffer from this to actually do
Speaker 5: something for you. Jeff, Yeah, Jeff is like he's.
Speaker 6: A cool d And the FDA clearance would mean this
Speaker 6: it works, like they've tested it or is it just
Speaker 6: not going to kill you?
Speaker 5: It means that it's safe basically. So they did have
Speaker 5: to test it on rabbits, So.
Speaker 4: You mean they didn't have a double blind placebo control trial.
Speaker 2: I love the one that doesn't.
Speaker 6: Think you think you've been shocked, but if you have
Speaker 6: an actually been so just it just naturally hot.
Speaker 5: It feels more like a vibration, to be quite honest,
Speaker 5: It's not like a type of feeling. But what FDA
Speaker 5: clearance means is like there's different types of medical devices.
Speaker 5: There's Class one, which is like a tongue depressor, it's
Speaker 5: not really doing anything. Class two is like moderate risk.
Speaker 5: And I believe this would probably be in class two
Speaker 5: because they require five ten clearance and basically they have
Speaker 5: to go through testing for safety, efficacy, privacy.
Speaker 2: And this one. This is all of it. It's past them.
Speaker 5: Yes, it passed that. It took a long time because
Speaker 5: this is a six year period. I want to say,
Speaker 5: like they had to go through two rounds of funding,
Speaker 5: like FDA clearance, millions of dollars, millions of dollars.
Speaker 2: Right now, the Titan Zeppr is the most functional product
Speaker 2: we've discussed on the show. Like I'm deadly serious, Like
Speaker 2: we spent the last two outs spend like, yeah, this
Speaker 2: doesn't work. This doesn't because it's not. The Titan Zuppr
Speaker 2: is real and it's real.
Speaker 5: And you know, so part of the thing was is
Speaker 5: that you know, they had done their initial round of
Speaker 5: gathering data, which took them a year and a half
Speaker 5: to gather all all this data, and then the FDA
Speaker 5: was like, yeah, but we're gonna need you to do
Speaker 5: animal testing so you're gonna have to put this taint
Speaker 5: zapperro ond bunnies.
Speaker 2: And just to be clear, that's not the tits.
Speaker 5: No, it's not the bunny taints. They're putting it on
Speaker 5: the bunnies because bunnies are furry and some taints are furrery.
Speaker 5: So you need to make sure that when you put
Speaker 5: this adhesive on on on skin that when you take
Speaker 5: it off, you're not causing rashes, irritation, ripping things out.
Speaker 5: So you know, they he told me that, you know,
Speaker 5: they'd have to put the patch on the bunny every
Speaker 5: single day and monitor it for a few hours and
Speaker 5: you know, and yeah.
Speaker 2: So Rory, moving on, moving on from the tank for now,
Speaker 2: I'm just a dog.
Speaker 4: I've wandered off the streets and it's an old BBC man.
Speaker 5: Oh, it's actually not called a taint zapper. That's just
Speaker 5: what I've called it, called more m O R.
Speaker 2: That's a horrible That is one of the worst names
Speaker 2: they could have come up with.
Speaker 6: It's called more but it sounds like one thing you
Speaker 6: don't get is more. You don't like there.
Speaker 3: You don't get more more velocity.
Speaker 5: More, more velocity, more lasting power. The company behind it
Speaker 5: is called marai inc and maori and Latin means delay,
Speaker 5: so shocking.
Speaker 7: Call it longer longer long yeah, with no e Yeah.
Speaker 6: Because then it's like you're going longer and your dick
Speaker 6: is longer. Yeah, men like longer.
Speaker 2: That's and that's the that's men like longer. But Rory,
Speaker 2: what have you seen at the show? Anything unrelated to bums?
Speaker 4: I'm just that I've not got any human detritus to
Speaker 4: bring before you. I mean, I've seen something incredibly wholesome.
Speaker 2: Please please tell me.
Speaker 4: I went to the Lego press conference. I used to
Speaker 4: come here a year after year for the BBC and
Speaker 4: it was a nightmare because of the time difference, and
Speaker 4: we had to make a store on a Sunday and
Speaker 4: a Monday to go out on the Tuesday eight hours
Speaker 4: behind and be desperate. And I learned a good lesson there,
Speaker 4: which is never go to a CS press conference because
Speaker 4: they're terrible. Because every single press conference features a CEO
Speaker 4: who thinks he's Steve Jobs unveiling the iPhone and he's
Speaker 4: not Steve Jobs and he hasn't got an iPhone. And
Speaker 4: I know this because my very first CES was my
Speaker 4: best ever because it had a historic event in which
Speaker 4: in the BBC, having paid an awful lot for a
Speaker 4: lot of us to come over, led by me, I
Speaker 4: said to them, listen, We're going to take a day
Speaker 4: out and leave Ces and go to think called Matt World,
Speaker 4: because there's a room if something BIG's going to happen.
Speaker 4: And so I was there when Steve Jobs did unveil
Speaker 4: the iPhone, which was better than any event that I've
Speaker 4: ever seen it fifteen.
Speaker 6: When he goes, when he goes, are you getting it?
Speaker 6: That's my favorite part.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you get it?
Speaker 6: Were you getting it in that moment? Were you like, wait,
Speaker 6: it's one device?
Speaker 2: Well.
Speaker 4: I was kind of shocked in a kind of very
Speaker 4: British way by the fact that there were people standing
Speaker 4: up and cheering. Were journalists we don't cheer for. There
Speaker 4: was not the requisite level of cynical old hackery, but
Speaker 4: even I got carried away. I knew something was big
Speaker 4: when my desk in London rang people who were not
Speaker 4: remotely interested in technology and said, you've got to get
Speaker 4: your hands on that phone, and I said, you are deluded.
Speaker 4: Apple is like North Korea, but less less open. They
Speaker 4: will never let me near a phone that's not coming
Speaker 4: out for six months. Are you dreaming? And then I
Speaker 4: remembered that we've been promised an interview with Phil Schiller,
Speaker 4: a tubby little marketing guy who did not quite have
Speaker 4: Steve Job's charisma.
Speaker 2: And I had said, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4: Yeah, we'll do that, thinking no, we won't, and I
Speaker 4: changed my mind and we headed back to the Moscowe centerency.
Speaker 4: We would like that interview with mister mister Schiller. After all,
Speaker 4: he appears, I see you don't happen to have the phone,
Speaker 4: and he said, oh yeah, handed it to me. I
Speaker 4: did my piece to camera and did an interview with
Speaker 4: Phil Schiller, which we didn't use, and I had my
Speaker 4: shot on the on the main news and the following weekend,
Speaker 4: a tech columnist in The Venerable Observant newspaper described me
Speaker 4: as looking like a French medieval peasant holding a piece
Speaker 4: of the one true cross us, which was because God
Speaker 4: damn Christ, I had actually got the whole of the
Speaker 4: damn thing. So, which is a long way around saying
Speaker 4: CS has been sort of twenty years of disappointment for me, mainly,
Speaker 4: but this year I decided, against my better insects, I
Speaker 4: would go to one press conference. Yeah, and that was
Speaker 4: the Lego one, right, and the contrast between that experience
Speaker 4: and sitting through I didn't bother to go, but watch
Speaker 4: the live stream of the Nvidia press conference was quite instructive.
Speaker 2: We hurst ourselves with that on the first day. It
Speaker 2: was truly truly boring.
Speaker 4: Yeah, but where is the great thing about the Lego
Speaker 4: one was we got a little freebie, a little package
Speaker 4: of bricks on every seat. It was short, it was
Speaker 4: forty five minutes. It was the toy industry and the
Speaker 4: media industry because Disney and lucasfilms were there and Star
Speaker 4: Wars characters telling the industry. Actually we know a bit
Speaker 4: about storytelling, and which I'm afraid dear mister Jensen Wining
Speaker 4: he obviously did not.
Speaker 2: He doesn't and it's weird. Other than these shiny jackets,
Speaker 2: he doesn't really have much going on. And mostly I
Speaker 2: was already the listeners already heard me say this, but
Speaker 2: it's like it was mostly him just repeating stuff from
Speaker 2: three to six months ago. It felt kind of washed,
Speaker 2: and I mean it was quite enjoyable.
Speaker 4: When the tech when he's describing the most advanced, exciting
Speaker 4: technology in the world and his PowerPoint failed.
Speaker 2: Someone's getting shot.
Speaker 4: Well, somebody, a whole team is going to be replaced
Speaker 4: by AI within seconds.
Speaker 5: I do respect when it's a live text presentation now though,
Speaker 5: because you know now they just flies to the Steve
Speaker 5: Jobs Theater for ALP. Watch a filmed presentation in a theater, like.
Speaker 4: No sense of peril.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's you know what in video could use a
Speaker 2: little peril in that. There should have been some trap
Speaker 2: doors or something. It was. It was very bizarre. It
Speaker 2: was like two hours of a man clearly trying to
Speaker 2: feign excitement and he's just like, yeah, Blackwell might come
Speaker 2: out at some point. Yeah, it's in full full manufacturer,
Speaker 2: and just the audience going yeah. The reaction was really sad.
Speaker 2: It was it was, it was. It was.
Speaker 4: It was like a you know, a failing politician at
Speaker 4: party conference setting up the que lines. Applaud, applaud and yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah it's thank god. Okay, it's good to good
Speaker 2: to know other people heard that. But let's let's change,
Speaker 2: because Adam, what have you seen? You've just got here,
Speaker 2: So what wonders if you bold?
Speaker 6: You know, I'm sort of drawn to everything that's not
Speaker 6: AI related.
Speaker 3: First of all, I was.
Speaker 2: Just walking your goal the section.
Speaker 6: Well, what I found was h Strangely, I saw like
Speaker 6: five or six products related to teeth.
Speaker 3: Have you guys noticed a teeth trend? The teeth Every
Speaker 3: everywhere I'm looking.
Speaker 4: There's usually it's an AI toothbrush.
Speaker 6: The first thing I saw was I was all the
Speaker 6: AI you know, blurred out, and I just my vision
Speaker 6: honed in on something called the y brush. Yeah, it's
Speaker 6: a toothbrush, but what if the end of the toothbrush
Speaker 6: was the same shape as all of your teeth, So
Speaker 6: you just put it over all of your teeth at once,
Speaker 6: and it brushes all your teeth simultaneously, And you know
Speaker 6: what as the owner of an electric toothbrush, and it
Speaker 6: has a timer and I'd do it for two minutes
Speaker 6: and it's like thirty seconds per quadrant and it's so
Speaker 6: boring and I have to listen to it to like
Speaker 6: two minutes of a podcast. I was like, you know what,
Speaker 6: ten seconds to brush all my teeth? Yes, someone buy
Speaker 6: me this shit at Brookstone for Christmas.
Speaker 3: Thank you. This is what cees is for. This is
Speaker 3: what it's supposed to be. Is dumb garbage that says
Speaker 3: is going to save you a minute and a half. Right,
Speaker 3: that's nice.
Speaker 2: I like that, did you see anything that was useless?
Speaker 2: I was just describe the rest of the cees. I
Speaker 2: guess do what else did you do? You see more
Speaker 2: teeth related things?
Speaker 3: Yeah, look, I even got a teeth I got. I
Speaker 3: got a free night guard. So I.
Speaker 6: Have a loose plastic bags and beautiful I've taken out
Speaker 6: of my hoodie pocket.
Speaker 3: I've produced it.
Speaker 6: Yeah, so there was a smart night guard that I wear,
Speaker 6: a nightguard for tooth grinding. And it's a night guard
Speaker 6: that will much like the taint zapper when you grind
Speaker 6: your teeth, it'll buzz in the middle of the night
Speaker 6: to stop you from grinding your teeth. Which reminds me
Speaker 6: of when I was a kid and I used to
Speaker 6: wet the bed and my parents would put the pistol
Speaker 6: arm did it? And you know the pistol arm. No,
Speaker 6: this is from the early nineties. This has been very
Speaker 6: high tech. It's a little so you know, if you
Speaker 6: used to wet the bed, it was just common. You know,
Speaker 6: it happens to a lot of people. Ed like, you know,
Speaker 6: I'm like older than you.
Speaker 3: Should be on wedding the bed and and so.
Speaker 4: Once again, when you get to a age, well you
Speaker 4: would be interested in this product.
Speaker 6: It's it's a pad like with election roads out that
Speaker 6: you put into your underpants and then when it to
Speaker 6: text moisture, it's connected to a little speaker that is
Speaker 6: like attached to your shirt.
Speaker 2: And so this is a so this is sorry, I'm lost,
Speaker 2: it's the piste along.
Speaker 6: Now I'm describing something that was inflicted on me as
Speaker 6: a child that frankly, was almost like a form of
Speaker 6: abuse to stop me from doing something that just.
Speaker 2: Naturally stops, like something that kids do accidentally.
Speaker 3: Yeah, like a very common thing. But it's a shame
Speaker 3: alarm right now, like.
Speaker 4: A short color for dogs, is that right?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 6: Yeah, this is the same thing for grinding your teeth.
Speaker 6: And actually it's not a bad idea because I do
Speaker 6: I can't.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I can actually see the use of that because
Speaker 2: I grind my teeth sometimes as well, and I'm I
Speaker 2: find myself accidentally doing it.
Speaker 6: Yeah, and I wear a night guard, and you know,
Speaker 6: sometimes I'm like, am I grinding my teeth? Do I
Speaker 6: need to keep wearing the night guard? Or I switched
Speaker 6: to sleeping on my side? Is it still happening?
Speaker 3: You know that? I was like, all right, that's kind
Speaker 3: of nice.
Speaker 6: And then they they gave me a they molded a
Speaker 6: nightguard to my teeth, and they gave me a free nightguard.
Speaker 6: And this sort of like loose bag. You might use
Speaker 6: the bag produce at the supermarket.
Speaker 2: This looks like what a criminal would hand drugs to someone.
Speaker 2: And it's just.
Speaker 5: Like going to central seat over my teeth.
Speaker 2: On your headline, I sober, it says Steph Cory finally
Speaker 2: finishes eating mouth God. But for the three basketball listeners, no,
Speaker 2: that's that's good.
Speaker 6: There's a jerkoff machine. You saill a jerk off machine
Speaker 6: right in the Eureka.
Speaker 3: It's called the Handy.
Speaker 5: Yeah, that's good, and.
Speaker 6: The handy too. They've got both of them in the
Speaker 6: same what's the sequel? Like, it looked like that's basically
Speaker 6: the same thing.
Speaker 5: Just shakes heart.
Speaker 8: Yeah.
Speaker 5: I saw that thing two years ago and I was like, okay, cool,
Speaker 5: that was that's funny looking. And then it's back here
Speaker 5: again and I'm like, bill more the same.
Speaker 6: It's it's like, got all this copy where it's like,
Speaker 6: don't worry everybody looks twice like, yep, it really is.
Speaker 3: It's really hamming it up, you know, the only.
Speaker 2: Way to do that is be super serious about yeah,
Speaker 2: just like you're like, excuse me, said something funny about this.
Speaker 3: Yeah, see that would be better.
Speaker 2: That would be so much more interesting. It's like a
Speaker 2: huh yeah, we went there.
Speaker 6: Yeah, it's very much the Cards against Humanity. They're like
Speaker 6: just for nerds.
Speaker 3: To be able to I recognize this as comedy.
Speaker 5: You know, and be able to let I mean CS
Speaker 5: as a show is extremely prudish and does not fuck
Speaker 5: like the Rue.
Speaker 3: Yeah, well, the jerk Off Machine is not a fucking machine.
Speaker 3: I'll tell you that.
Speaker 5: There was a time where there was like a like
Speaker 5: back in twenty nineteen, twenty twenty, there was like a
Speaker 5: controversy because they had given a vibrator, uh vibrator. It
Speaker 5: was like a micro robotic kind of lingus dildo type
Speaker 5: device and it was the Laura de Carlo and they
Speaker 5: had given them a innovation award and they're like no, no, no, no,
Speaker 5: we're gonna take the innovation award away. And then everyone's like.
Speaker 2: Why did they take it away? Because it was imbrober
Speaker 2: uh so they could give it to just something that didn't.
Speaker 5: Exist, Like yeah, they were just like this is not
Speaker 5: this is not robotics. And everyone was like yeah, it's robotically.
Speaker 6: Like they gave it and people complained and then they
Speaker 6: took it away again.
Speaker 2: That's so that the most cowardly fuckless ship I've heard
Speaker 2: in my.
Speaker 5: Then the next year, the next year, they're like, no,
Speaker 5: we falk get all the sex tech companies to come
Speaker 5: back and we'll have a sex tech pavilion. And they
Speaker 5: had a whole camper. They had like a build your
Speaker 5: own dildo experience, which I did and you know I
Speaker 5: was reporting on it. And now it's just like, where's
Speaker 5: the sex tech companies. It's one hand job device thing,
Speaker 5: and it's like, okay, I would.
Speaker 3: Have expected build adild to be a big hit.
Speaker 6: You know, it was that year they could, you know,
Speaker 6: have have it be a kiosk in the mall. You
Speaker 6: know you go with your for your friend's birthday.
Speaker 2: Not smaller, smaller, smaller, you got any Yeah, we got
Speaker 2: a special one out back right, not small than that. No.
Speaker 2: I like this though, because David Roth sadly was only
Speaker 2: here yesterday because the sex conversation we had towards the
Speaker 2: end of Lost the Yes, just watching him like, no,
Speaker 2: he's a lovely guy. I'm sure he's had sex. I'm
Speaker 2: not going to comment further on that before I can
Speaker 2: get comment from him, which would be really funny to
Speaker 2: text him. Actually lost the Yes, I got in trouble
Speaker 2: for texting my family group chat what my dad's horny
Speaker 2: level was. Sorry, dad, you can now hear this anyway?
Speaker 2: Your son's doing you proud? Yeah, it's it's it's actually
Speaker 2: kind of nice to hear this useful stuff.
Speaker 1: But I guess it usually is.
Speaker 5: It's just takes six years of you know, development.
Speaker 2: Of bum buch.
Speaker 5: Of taint research is just.
Speaker 3: Like coming back here again and again.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 5: Yeah, And it takes a long time to get some
Speaker 5: of the stuff actually made. It's it's not like a
Speaker 5: you know, a lot of the I say, a lot
Speaker 5: of the tech I see here on my Beata's vaporware,
Speaker 5: because it's just like where where is it?
Speaker 1: Where is it?
Speaker 5: Sometimes it takes six years to get approval, you know,
Speaker 5: and bunny testing to make sure it's safe enough for
Speaker 5: human use and that there's a scientific reason why you
Speaker 5: might want to actually use this shit.
Speaker 2: Yeah. So yeah, it's funny like the non AI stuff
Speaker 2: is like for real people doing things like fucking.
Speaker 5: Well, you know, they are looking into AI for the
Speaker 5: tant Zappera as well.
Speaker 2: So I just I if you can as a listener,
Speaker 2: if you're hearing this and you see something at CS
Speaker 2: with AI and it works, please let me know because
Speaker 2: so far, I'm oh, four hundred I think it is.
Speaker 6: I had a really interesting conversation with a woman and
Speaker 6: it was like the sort of conversation where I was like,
Speaker 6: I wish I had had a camera I was recording
Speaker 6: it or something, because it was one of the first
Speaker 6: boots I went up to and I'm like, I flew
Speaker 6: here today.
Speaker 3: I didn't get enough sleep.
Speaker 6: I'm like kind of zonked out, so I just walk
Speaker 6: up to this thing and it's like AI fast food
Speaker 6: ordering thing. Yeah, well the most obvious possible thing. But
Speaker 6: the guy demonstrates it and he's like, I have a
Speaker 6: coffee please, do you want to make it a calm?
Speaker 3: Yes, I want to make it a combo? Could I
Speaker 3: have a croissant?
Speaker 6: And it goes five croissants and then do you want
Speaker 6: to make it a combo? He says yes, and then
Speaker 6: it makes one of the croissants a combo, and he
Speaker 6: says could I remove the other four croissants and it
Speaker 6: goes yes. See it can remove stuff you know, and
Speaker 6: they're like, what do you think? And I was like,
Speaker 6: I mean, it seems worse than ordering. If I were
Speaker 6: to confront this rather than a person like I wouldn't
Speaker 6: like it.
Speaker 2: I'd be actively annoyed.
Speaker 3: Yeah. And you know they're like, well, you know, sounds bad.
Speaker 2: I'm like, yeah, yeah, but it sounds bad, but also
Speaker 2: it is.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it needs a bit of wo But what I
Speaker 3: asked the woman was, I was like, she was very
Speaker 3: nice to engage in this conversation.
Speaker 6: I was like, because she was saying, you know this,
Speaker 6: people want a good customer experience, and a person doesn't
Speaker 6: always give you a good customer experience.
Speaker 5: For some robot doesn't, so.
Speaker 2: I give you a bad one every time.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 6: She was like, I checked it at the hotel today
Speaker 6: and the guy was rude and and you know, the
Speaker 6: AI can never be rude. It'll always be in a
Speaker 6: good mood. And I said, Okay, even if that's true,
Speaker 6: if you you know, did the travel I did here today, right,
Speaker 6: You got in a way mow. Then you get to
Speaker 6: the airport, there's no person to check in. It's just
Speaker 6: a kiosk. There's no TSA agent, there's no person to
Speaker 6: talk to you in security. When you go get your coffee,
Speaker 6: it's just a you know, a thing you talk to
Speaker 6: and then it dispenses it. On the plane there's no
Speaker 6: one to talk to. You get to the hotel, there's
Speaker 6: no person there, right, and it just gives you a key.
Speaker 6: Is that a world that you would like to live in?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 5: Japan they do that in Japan.
Speaker 3: Okay, we do that there.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but it's cool there.
Speaker 4: I don't know. Yeah, as a as a UK citizen
Speaker 4: coming through the American border, I'd quite like to you know,
Speaker 4: global entry is have a rope book.
Speaker 6: There's certainly some things, but like she goes, she goes. Well,
Speaker 6: you know, I like talking to people, but most people don't.
Speaker 6: I like it, So, you know, I would maybe prefer
Speaker 6: to have a person. I'm like, I think most people
Speaker 6: do like other people.
Speaker 5: To your point, I was at pepcom last night and
Speaker 5: we saw this thing called ag.
Speaker 2: I bought and I've heard about that.
Speaker 5: So this this this giant bot and then there's like
Speaker 5: a smaller version next to it. So just imagine this
Speaker 5: that the smaller version is like doing taichi and break
Speaker 5: dancing like a psycho bot. It's like quite smoothly too,
Speaker 5: very disconcerting. And the big bot is supposed to be
Speaker 5: shaking tech reporters hands because the purpose of this bot
Speaker 5: is to greet people at museums and that stuff. And
Speaker 5: it's like it's supposed you're supposed to walk up to
Speaker 5: it and it has like a doesn't have a face,
Speaker 5: it just has a screen and it's like, my name
Speaker 5: is Luca, say hi to me or whatever, and you're
Speaker 5: supposed to say Hi, Luca, and it's supposed to put
Speaker 5: out its hand, and you're supposed to put your hand
Speaker 5: out and shake the robot's hand. And so my colleague
Speaker 5: Jen Twey, she's our smart home reviewer, and she's like
Speaker 5: on a robot mission this particular cees. She puts out
Speaker 5: her I'm like, Jen, you know you're doing the robots.
Speaker 5: Let me get a video of you shaking this robot's hands.
Speaker 5: This robot was like incapable of shaking her hands, and
Speaker 5: the one time it does, it pulls her hand down
Speaker 5: and she's like Jesus Christ, and then it just starts
Speaker 5: flirting with her and.
Speaker 2: We're like, oh, have you heard about the more?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 5: But like the funniest thing about this show is that
Speaker 5: this is the largest tech show in the in the US,
Speaker 5: it's the big thing of the year. No one can
Speaker 5: get fucking Bluetooth or Wi Fi correct at this show,
Speaker 5: and so all the demos fucking fail all the time.
Speaker 2: I just don't want to touch any more. I don't
Speaker 2: want want to go places. I don't want to talk.
Speaker 2: I like seeing people.
Speaker 4: You don't want to touch your robots.
Speaker 2: I don't want to touch anyone. I don't want to
Speaker 2: shake hands with someone. I want to go to the museum.
Speaker 5: Just the robots.
Speaker 6: But to the point that I was asking the presenter
Speaker 6: I was talking to like you you.
Speaker 2: I'm finally talking to me, I quite like And I
Speaker 2: think if I just walk through a series of machines,
Speaker 2: that was like when I went to Korea, there was
Speaker 2: a lot of machines, but like still the occasional person.
Speaker 2: If it was just to your description, Adam, just a
Speaker 2: series of screens that I interacted, but that would fucking suck.
Speaker 2: I'd feel a loan in a way that I quite
Speaker 2: like being solitary, But that would just be like I
Speaker 2: feel like I'm going through tubes.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 6: I think what it's gonna be the future that they're
Speaker 6: gonna have I describe, you know, when I go to
Speaker 6: the Alaska terminal at Lax, they've specifically done this where
Speaker 6: like there's no check in counter, it's mostly kiosks and
Speaker 6: there's like two people roaming around. So it's the self
Speaker 6: checkout of airlines. And whenever I fly Alaska, there's always
Speaker 6: some fucking problem with my ticket. I don't know what
Speaker 6: it is with their system, and so every time I'm like,
Speaker 6: where's the person? And that's what it's gonna be everywhere
Speaker 6: And this as I'm talking to this woman, she goes, well,
Speaker 6: I want people to have the choice. Maybe they want
Speaker 6: to use the automated system. I'm like, I don't think
Speaker 6: we'll have a choice, and she goes, yeah, we won't
Speaker 6: have a choice because it's gonna be so much cheaper
Speaker 6: to automate everything they're gonna do, like.
Speaker 5: The robo things. You call your bank and you just
Speaker 5: want to talk to someone, they're like, press one for
Speaker 5: the thing that you don't need to do. I am
Speaker 5: press see for the second thing you don't need to do,
Speaker 5: and you're just on the phone. You're pressing zero.
Speaker 2: Give me I would take that, and we're going to
Speaker 2: rotate to the next thirteen second. But I just want
Speaker 2: to say as a British person, every fucking single American
Speaker 2: voice activated thing sucks for me. It's just like, okay,
Speaker 2: give me a reminder for seven pm calling your mother, calling,
Speaker 2: calling mum, sending her your last link, which was the
Speaker 2: teen sapper. All right, we're gonna rotate through the next ad.
Speaker 2: I fully endorse and if you don't like it, email
Speaker 2: me at god at gov dot biz. Welcome Berg, Welcome Berg,
Speaker 2: Welcome Berg, Zitron, We're back. It's the Consumer Electronics Show,
Speaker 2: better offline and joining me in the room is the
Speaker 2: victorious song of the Verge, Robert Evans of Behind the Bastards.
Speaker 9: Yeah, I gotta do this real quick. Sorry, Yeah, I
Speaker 9: just like on air was the best way.
Speaker 2: I've decided not to do that because I've drunk so
Speaker 2: many diet cokes already and I'm I've got like three
Speaker 2: more in me. And of course Adam kind of a
Speaker 2: wonderful stand up on the host of the Factory podcast.
Speaker 6: You know, I stayed at your apartment once and I
Speaker 6: was frankly concerned at how much diet coke was in
Speaker 6: that apartment and no coffee maker. You're one of those
Speaker 6: no are you die coke? In the morning, pervert.
Speaker 2: I'm a diet coke whenever. Perfect. Oh man, it was
Speaker 2: ten thirty pm and I went to bed half an
Speaker 2: hour later and I drank one of those motherfuckers with
Speaker 2: my sleeping meds. Yeah, I'm a they're gonna.
Speaker 5: Say, so, caffeine doesn't affect you.
Speaker 2: It just it's fine. Yeah, Like I have like ADHD,
Speaker 2: and I take medicae.
Speaker 9: Off prescription at all, but I.
Speaker 2: Also have concerto. Like they give me that, but the
Speaker 2: doctor gives me that because I actually unsupposingly have ADHD.
Speaker 2: You haven't worked that out from the tens of thousands words.
Speaker 2: So Robert, you got the sea of intuit to say something.
Speaker 9: The CMO into it. Yeah, So I started my day.
Speaker 9: All I did really today was panels. I was in
Speaker 9: like six different fucking panels, and the first one was
Speaker 9: about uh one, I should probably have had this.
Speaker 2: It's okay, intuit intu. It's wonderful as well because they
Speaker 2: have this new chat GPT integration. They've got it.
Speaker 9: That's exactly what I was talking about. So I was
Speaker 9: in this uh this panel, which is like a leadership
Speaker 9: roundtable sorry on like technology and advertising. Although the actual
Speaker 9: panel did not seem to have much to do with that,
Speaker 9: and the CMO of Intuit was there and talked about
Speaker 9: the integration that they've been doing with chat GPT and
Speaker 9: talked about how like they're partnering with open ai so
Speaker 9: that you have when you're doing your taxes, you have
Speaker 9: access to like a chat bot basically to help do
Speaker 9: and you can have an agent. The idea is an
Speaker 9: agent will at some point be able to handle most
Speaker 9: of this task. But yeah, well that's kind of the problem,
Speaker 9: and like so there's there's a couple of issues with this.
Speaker 9: When I first started, like, I had been reading about
Speaker 9: the into it integration because they're putting like one hundred
Speaker 9: million dollars into open ai million, not bl the trip.
Speaker 9: I said that clearly. And when that first happened, I
Speaker 9: read an article by a security researcher who was pointing
Speaker 9: out that they are giving into it is giving read
Speaker 9: and write access to an LLM jesus of your tax data,
Speaker 9: of any of the tax data that's integrated into that,
Speaker 9: which is a problem from a security point of view.
Speaker 9: One of the things this guy points out is that
Speaker 9: there's a kind of attack that you can execute against
Speaker 9: AI models that is there's a kind of attack that
Speaker 9: you can execute against AI. Yeah, yeah, prompt injection.
Speaker 2: And that's when you do you go to a website
Speaker 2: which tells the LM to do something.
Speaker 9: Right, a website or one of the things that this
Speaker 9: guy proposes. If you want to put in a fraudulent invoice,
Speaker 9: you could have an invoice that has that's not like
Speaker 9: visible to the naked eye, but that the LLLM would
Speaker 9: read and that text basically executes an exploit. And there's
Speaker 9: not a like you can't defend against these really like
Speaker 9: there's not a functional way to stop this. The point
Speaker 9: he was making is that it's not a question of
Speaker 9: whether or not there will be a data breach of
Speaker 9: people's tax data because they're integrating it with this chatbot.
Speaker 9: But when And the question that this researcher had that
Speaker 9: I thought was a really good question was who is
Speaker 9: then responsible? This is Chris Black published this in a
Speaker 9: website called a raptus, But who is responsible if your
Speaker 9: data all gets leaked because of this integration? Is into
Speaker 9: It responsible? Is open AI responsible? Is whatever third party
Speaker 9: you're using that uses into it software responsible? So I
Speaker 9: asked the Thomas renize, who's the CMO of into it
Speaker 9: that right when they had time for questions, and I said,
Speaker 9: I basically brought up what's in this article? I said,
Speaker 9: given the fact that this is in an ability that
Speaker 9: attacks like this will be carried out and data will
Speaker 9: be leaked, who do you like who is responsible? Like
Speaker 9: who should take legal responsibility in that instance? And like
Speaker 9: what safeguards are you building to try and deal with
Speaker 9: the fact that this is going to happen. And the
Speaker 9: first answer he gave is that we're talking about it
Speaker 9: with open AI, which which I viewed as a non answer.
Speaker 9: So I came up to him after the panel and
Speaker 9: kind of corning up a little bit and asked, like,
Speaker 9: you have to have more You're the CMO. Yeah right,
Speaker 9: you're like the chief marketing officer of this entire company.
Speaker 9: Security is a pretty big marketing huge standpoint, right, Like
Speaker 9: I would think you would know something about this, And
Speaker 9: he eventually got angry at me and said, like, I
Speaker 9: don't have any of that information. That's not my job
Speaker 9: basically to care about this sort of thing. I've got
Speaker 9: a recording of it we'll play at some point, but
Speaker 9: that that's literally all that I got from him, was like,
Speaker 9: we're talking about it with open AI, And I don't
Speaker 9: really know A.
Speaker 5: Browsers right, because yeah, hair browsers doing the same thing.
Speaker 5: They're so so, so so vulnerable to the prompt jack.
Speaker 2: I really like that. Also, they trying to pretend A
Speaker 2: eyebrowsers are useful. They're not.
Speaker 5: I tested five of them. Me, I had to test
Speaker 5: five fucking AI browsers. All I wanted was the pair
Speaker 5: of fucking new balances, and it couldn't get me. I
Speaker 5: had to get my mother in law to get me
Speaker 5: the new balances, Like what are you doing?
Speaker 3: So what are you doing on the AI browser? Try
Speaker 3: to get the new.
Speaker 5: So you know, they're like gent like AI. You can
Speaker 5: ask it to find you the fucking new balances or whatnot,
Speaker 5: and it's supposed to help you research this stuff. And
Speaker 5: all these tech CEOs are like, well, the future of
Speaker 5: computing is that you will not do anything on the computer.
Speaker 5: You'll talk to It's kind of like Her, the movie Her,
Speaker 5: where you just talk to the computer and it goes
Speaker 5: here you go. So all I wanted was a pair
Speaker 5: of fucking new balances. But I take my shoes very seriously, right,
Speaker 5: and I'm like, Okay, I want a pair of new balances?
Speaker 5: What these are the prep like the parameters that I want?
Speaker 5: How am I going to get them? And my query
Speaker 5: kept getting longer and longer and longer and longer and
Speaker 5: longer because they can't into it things. So I was like,
Speaker 5: my foot size is this, This is the stuff that
Speaker 5: I have to deal with. This is the color I want,
Speaker 5: this is the style that I want. These are the
Speaker 5: scenarios that I want to wear them, and these are
Speaker 5: the prices that I want to have. So it's like
Speaker 5: a fucking three paragraph prompt that I have to give,
Speaker 5: and I'm asking all five of these different stupid AI
Speaker 5: browsers to just get me a pair of goddamn new balances,
Speaker 5: and it's just like that, I can't do it.
Speaker 2: Oh So I like browsing the Internet, not as much
Speaker 2: as I used to due to all the obstacles, but
Speaker 2: looking for a pair of shoes, looking for something in
Speaker 2: a store, that's kind of you know, you fuck around,
Speaker 2: you learn some stuff. It's kind of fun.
Speaker 5: Like, yeah, no, I did ruin once again, cursed tech beat.
Speaker 5: I did ruin my mental health just trying to bigger.
Speaker 2: Pair by three hundred word essay.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean the part of The enjoyment of purchasing
Speaker 6: something is to know that you got the thing that
Speaker 6: you want. You put the work in, you found the
Speaker 6: like I'm trying to I've been trying to buy the
Speaker 6: perfect set of towels for a little while and I'm
Speaker 6: and I was like, I was like, no, I don't
Speaker 6: want to get the Onsen towels that like the fake
Speaker 6: Japanese towels. I want to find some real Japanese towel.
Speaker 6: And so I found out about like a variety of
Speaker 6: towel that's like only made in one town in Japan,
Speaker 6: trying to find the right vendor. And I know when
Speaker 6: I get the towels, I'm going to be like these,
Speaker 6: I went through something to get these right. And that's
Speaker 6: how people you want to feel about your new balances.
Speaker 3: These are so good.
Speaker 6: You want to I got the ones I put a
Speaker 6: little bit of sweat equity in. You want to be
Speaker 6: like I got some shoes. The computer bought me some shoes.
Speaker 5: Also, the computer doesn't listen. I said, I already have
Speaker 5: the perfect running shoe, right, I thought I found that
Speaker 5: I was stylistic. I want walking shoes. And what did
Speaker 5: it do? It gave me the fucking running shoes over
Speaker 5: and over and over again. I said I didn't want
Speaker 5: the running shoes. I wanted the walking shoes.
Speaker 3: Right.
Speaker 2: This is kind of like every one of these AI
Speaker 2: browsers I've read about. It's kind of the same things.
Speaker 2: Like imagine, if you will, you're seeing that you want
Speaker 2: to buy something, and there's just no way to do that.
Speaker 2: It's just like an alien, an alien that's never used anything. Yeah,
Speaker 2: how do we do anything? Oh, I'll type in and
Speaker 2: it's like, yeah, off the three minutes, it might do something. Right. Yeah,
Speaker 2: It's like fucking yeah.
Speaker 9: That's the that's the frust That's the frustrating thing about
Speaker 9: sitting in all of these panels in particular, is that
Speaker 9: it's like entering this alternate world where all of the
Speaker 9: technology works much better than it does, and people talk
Speaker 9: about it as if like, yeah, we deployed fifteen hundred agents,
Speaker 9: right that are you know, they're doing great work, And
Speaker 9: it's like, okay, but I'm looking at, for example, the
Speaker 9: statistics that Copilot released last year that about so or
Speaker 9: that were released about Copile last year that about seventy
Speaker 9: percent of work tasks that it's tasked with, it fails
Speaker 9: at y right, because the agents are not functional yet.
Speaker 5: So I you know, I'm trying to tell Atlas chatgbt's
Speaker 5: thing to buy me these fucking new balances, and it's
Speaker 5: just like, oh, crap, there's a pop up. Let me
Speaker 5: try and close this pop up. Oh that didn't close
Speaker 5: the pop up. Let me click more precisely at the
Speaker 5: coordinates and it's listing the coordinates on the site. Let
Speaker 5: me try and close the pop It took.
Speaker 2: Just gas fumes.
Speaker 5: It took five I'm watching it. It took five attempts
Speaker 5: for the AI to close the pop up a minute
Speaker 5: and thirty seconds. I'm just watching it, and I'm just like,
Speaker 5: Jesus fucking crazy.
Speaker 2: Close.
Speaker 3: It's narrating as it's doing.
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, yeah, it narrates. It goes just like, let
Speaker 5: me think about the best way that I can close
Speaker 5: this pop up. It didn't seem like I clicked hard enough.
Speaker 5: Let me look at the coordinates and click more precisely. Well,
Speaker 5: that didn't order.
Speaker 7: I know.
Speaker 2: The compute on that is also bonkers.
Speaker 5: You know that they boiled oceans to watch and AI
Speaker 5: struggle to close pop ups minute and.
Speaker 2: Seconds giraffes from the back of a truck into a
Speaker 2: furnace to make this like a guest turbine in a
Speaker 2: poor community in Texas. Yeah, many people got cancer and
Speaker 2: you didn't get the shoes you wanted.
Speaker 9: Yeah, And it's in between panels. A friend of mine
Speaker 9: back and Iportant sent me a video that's some guy
Speaker 9: I think in Tennessee recorded of like the sound of
Speaker 9: the data center that went up near its house. That's
Speaker 9: like this, I mean for months has just been this
Speaker 9: like constant like droning beep noise thing, like like it
Speaker 9: just sounds awful. And so I'm I'm going in between
Speaker 9: these people talking about like you know and really focusing
Speaker 9: on how like AI's going to augment human capability and
Speaker 9: you know, these agents are are only getting more capable,
Speaker 9: and like we're going to be using this to like
Speaker 9: really set human creativity on fire. And then I'm like
Speaker 9: watching a video where a guy's like, yeah, now it
Speaker 9: screams every day, the internet screams every day outside my house. Yeah,
Speaker 9: And I'm looking at the statistics that show that like
Speaker 9: none of this stuff works as well as these people
Speaker 9: are are saying it does, right, like not to the
Speaker 9: extent that like I would want it doing a job
Speaker 9: that really matters, and I'm just so like in between that.
Speaker 9: The other thing that I read while I was going
Speaker 9: in between sessions was an article that came out today
Speaker 9: about a patent Sony filed last year to basically create
Speaker 9: use an AI agent to play video games for you
Speaker 9: when you're trying to do something hard if you can't
Speaker 9: beat a boss.
Speaker 5: Did you see Razor stuff?
Speaker 9: Yeah, well, and that's the other crazy I haven't seen
Speaker 9: the booth yet though, but you want to talk about that.
Speaker 1: I saw that.
Speaker 5: I was in that really sweaty Venetian suite where they
Speaker 5: were giving the preview of the role a.
Speaker 2: You know, it's so crazy.
Speaker 9: Oh my god.
Speaker 5: So they had two crazy AI concepts. First, this Project EVA,
Speaker 5: and the only way you can describe it is a
Speaker 5: little anime wife, the wife Tube. It's the wife Tube.
Speaker 5: It's a little desktop wife tube where the holographic anime
Speaker 5: wife who named Kia, and like there's a camera in
Speaker 5: the thing and so she's watching it and she's gone,
Speaker 5: like and it's based on grox Annie if you oh god, yeah,
Speaker 5: they did tell they did tell us like specifically that
Speaker 5: it was based on And I'm.
Speaker 2: Like, oh, did you ask if it was based on
Speaker 2: an adult.
Speaker 9: Well, I'll tell you what it's based on. Visually, if
Speaker 9: you ever watched the show Archer, there's like, yeah, creepy
Speaker 9: Sid has the Waifu hologround looks identical smaller.
Speaker 5: I was there with my colleague Antonio, who Tania, Oh god,
Speaker 5: sorry Antonio, because he does listen to your podcast, Antonio
Speaker 5: di Benedetto and he's our laptop reviewer. And so they're like,
Speaker 5: you know, Kira can help you when you're playing your game,
Speaker 5: and so he's playing like this a first person shooter
Speaker 5: but it's just like a it's like not an actual level,
Speaker 5: so you can't die in this section. And she's like, oh,
Speaker 5: this is the gun you're holding is not the correct gun,
Speaker 5: and it's like, oh, you died and he didn't die.
Speaker 5: And then they like programmed, they programmed like, oh, so
Speaker 5: did you see anything really cool at cees and like
Speaker 5: this is how she talks because it's based on and
Speaker 5: he's like no, and she's like, oh that's cool. And
Speaker 5: but so you can have different like avatars doesn't have
Speaker 5: to be an AI wife who you can also have
Speaker 5: Zane the AI husbando and he has like nake tattoos
Speaker 5: on there and it goes like, hang.
Speaker 2: On, I'm stuck. I need to ask the wife tube again.
Speaker 5: But like that's the whole point of games is that
Speaker 5: you're strugged, is that you're playing, that you're using the
Speaker 5: problem solving and all that, and it's just like, no,
Speaker 5: tell me how to beat this level. And all the
Speaker 5: time I talk to these companies and they're like, yeah.
Speaker 10: You're going to be able to yeah, because they're training
Speaker 10: it off of like YouTube videos of people playing the
Speaker 10: game too, which I also I just don't know if
Speaker 10: I believe it's going to work well.
Speaker 9: It is a pattern, so maybe Sony doesn't either, Like they.
Speaker 6: Are they showing the AI just like the video frames,
Speaker 6: like the literal.
Speaker 9: The YouTube video from the patent from what I haven't
Speaker 9: read the patent. I read an article about the patent application.
Speaker 9: That's what it sounds like.
Speaker 6: You could you could program an old fashioned AI, what
Speaker 6: we used to call AI in video games, just like
Speaker 6: you know and n PC.
Speaker 3: You could just when you're making a video game, you
Speaker 3: have the world state, you know, how the game works.
Speaker 6: You could just like have something in the game. I think, yeah, exactly,
Speaker 6: that like is part of the game. It's an artificial world.
Speaker 3: Why do you need to insult a game?
Speaker 9: I think this is like Aana.
Speaker 5: It didn't ask if we should actually fucking make Krtana.
Speaker 5: Losers just played Halo way too when they were in
Speaker 5: their formative years.
Speaker 6: Yes, I think a big mistake that they're making, or
Speaker 6: just which one. Well, look, there's such a big difference
Speaker 6: between a tool that extends or enhances human capability makes
Speaker 6: you more powerful, and you not doing it yourself and
Speaker 6: having someone else do it for you. I literally, just
Speaker 6: for the first time, hired an assistant because I the
Speaker 6: perfect person who I knew would do is such a
Speaker 6: great job for me, is available for a couple of months.
Speaker 6: So it's great you correspond with she's amazing, right, But
Speaker 6: like it's because I have worked with her before in
Speaker 6: a different capacity. I know she's amazing. I like trust
Speaker 6: her to do all these various things that I don't
Speaker 6: have to do myself anymore. But the moment that, like
Speaker 6: I work with someone who fucks something up, I'm like, well,
Speaker 6: I can never work with the contract. I'm not going
Speaker 6: to assign things to them. And like versus, when I
Speaker 6: fuck something up with a tool that I'm using myself,
Speaker 6: I'm like, Okay, I need to do a little bit
Speaker 6: better or whatever. Like the experience of those things is
Speaker 6: so fundamentally different. The use cases for them is different,
Speaker 6: the sort of person who wants to do them is different.
Speaker 6: And so like, I don't know, like for into it
Speaker 6: to be a company that goes from you know, here's
Speaker 6: tax software that helps you do your own taxes if
Speaker 6: you would really like to do that, and yes, but
Speaker 6: like to go from that to now we will automatic
Speaker 6: will be an automatic accountant. Is like they don't understand
Speaker 6: the gulf that they're trying to jump.
Speaker 2: Now, well, it's because they misunderstand. It's kind of the
Speaker 2: ongoing thing of See, it's like people that don't experience
Speaker 2: the problems they're trying to fix. Because the best assistant,
Speaker 2: to your point is someone that you kind of hand
Speaker 2: stuff up, like my written edits to Matt Hughes. The
Speaker 2: whole reason Matt works well with me is he can anticipate,
Speaker 2: like he kind of gets my thing and he knows yeah,
Speaker 2: and I can trust him to get it without me
Speaker 2: having to I don't know, give a three hundred word
Speaker 2: prompt to explain every nuance because so much.
Speaker 5: Handholding and I don't want to hand hold an assistant.
Speaker 5: That's the whole fucking the whole point.
Speaker 9: Yeah, it's handholding. And it's also like picking having an
Speaker 9: assistant to do the things you wouldn't have an assistant do,
Speaker 9: like I don't play a video game for you. Yeah,
Speaker 9: but there's so much of it is focused on, like
Speaker 9: the the tasks that are deeply human. Like whenever I
Speaker 9: hear like this AI can help you brainstorm, it's like, well, no,
Speaker 9: it can't. That's not how brainstorming works. Someone else can't
Speaker 9: brainstorm for you.
Speaker 1: That's not You're.
Speaker 5: Just talking to yourself in the mirror. But the mirror
Speaker 5: is a chapla.
Speaker 9: Yeah, and you were hoping to plagiarize a good idea
Speaker 9: from the chatbot that itself is built from plagiarism, which
Speaker 9: I also feel like is a mistake.
Speaker 2: But regurgitating thought into your own brain and the hopes
Speaker 2: and new idea comes out.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean, like I've talked about this before, my
Speaker 6: most positive experience with chat GPT was I was trying
Speaker 6: to decide whether to get myself a little apartment in
Speaker 6: New York and I'll talk to you about this, yeah, right,
Speaker 6: whether it's a good financial decision, and I plug into
Speaker 6: chat GPT. Hey, here's all the numbers, and like, is
Speaker 6: this a good thing?
Speaker 3: You know?
Speaker 6: Would this be a big mistake? And it sort of goes, no,
Speaker 6: it wouldn't be a big mistake. You could do that.
Speaker 6: If you want it, you can do it. And then
Speaker 6: I'm like, okay, but what about the fact that I
Speaker 6: can't sublet it? Oh, that means it's bad.
Speaker 3: Now you shouldn't do it.
Speaker 9: Now you're fine.
Speaker 6: Oh, but what about the fact that it's kind of
Speaker 6: important to me. Well, if it's really important to you,
Speaker 6: you should do it. And I did actually find that clarifying,
Speaker 6: like it did help me think through it all.
Speaker 2: But just agreed with your lost statement.
Speaker 3: I was talking to myself in the mirror.
Speaker 5: The only that's the most useful it is it's like
Speaker 5: you need to talk out loud to yourself, to myself,
Speaker 5: you can, But sometimes I can do that to you people.
Speaker 6: If you answer all my texts for some reason, because
Speaker 6: my friend.
Speaker 2: And I love you, like that's why I do it,
Speaker 2: because I care about you and want you to be happy.
Speaker 2: And the chat ball.
Speaker 5: Doesn't can't, No, the chatbot doesn't care.
Speaker 2: I actually wonder if my latent like actual autism is
Speaker 2: mounting myself on the show. Like, that's why it doesn't work,
Speaker 2: because when every time I've tried anything like this and
Speaker 2: just like just talk it to my fucking self, Why
Speaker 2: are you agreeing with me on everything?
Speaker 5: But I mean like that's because that's you, like to
Speaker 5: be real, that's I know. I'm talking to myself on
Speaker 5: that too. It's just like it just doesn't work.
Speaker 2: Like I literally have tried to do the things. I'm
Speaker 2: just like, no, just like there's a blog. I'm just
Speaker 2: like it's just repeating more just faking said.
Speaker 5: Yeah. No, you're like you have to know the artifice
Speaker 5: in order to get to a point where you're like,
Speaker 5: if you understand that you're talking to yourself, you're just
Speaker 5: thinking aloud in a different format, it can be helpful
Speaker 5: if you understand that that's what you're doing. People don't
Speaker 5: understand that's what they're doing. That's why they're getting the
Speaker 5: AI psychosis. Yeah, they're mistaking this for a friend. It's
Speaker 5: not a friend, it's literally a person.
Speaker 9: Yeah. I will say one thing that was interesting to me.
Speaker 9: I did a panel that was Intelligence through Motion AI
Speaker 9: takes physical form, and it was about like robots, robots
Speaker 9: with AI in them. It was actually the better one
Speaker 9: of the day. There was not much that was silly,
Speaker 9: and it was I think it was a really good
Speaker 9: example of like how you ought to be responsibly talking
Speaker 9: about and thinking about products like this. So one of
Speaker 9: the people who was there was Andrea Thomas, who's the
Speaker 9: co founder and CEO of Diligent Robotics, and they've built
Speaker 9: a robot that is basically an assistant for doctors and
Speaker 9: nurses at the hospital, not doing medical stuff. But like,
Speaker 9: the thing that she pointed out is when we because
Speaker 9: we started and this was the first thing they liked.
Speaker 9: We started not with a product idea, but by talking
Speaker 9: to a bunch of doctors and nurses and figuring out, like,
Speaker 9: what are the different jobs you have. And one of
Speaker 9: the things they figured out is that nurses in particular,
Speaker 9: spend a shitload of time every day running stuff back
Speaker 9: and forth through the hospital, and so like, well, if
Speaker 9: we have a robot that can move things and can
Speaker 9: potentially move refrigerated things or move things that you have
Speaker 9: to be very careful when carrying, then a skilled, trained
Speaker 9: human being isn't doing that bullshit work and they can
Speaker 9: do more medical work. And there's not enough medical profession
Speaker 9: that's effectively a convey about right right, which that's more
Speaker 9: maneuverable than a conveyor because it can go.
Speaker 2: But the point is like it's useful because it's moving
Speaker 2: stuff between places, right right.
Speaker 9: And I believe there was some talk about other like
Speaker 9: they're looking at adding other capabilities, but the way that
Speaker 9: they were thinking about it were, well, first, we're going
Speaker 9: to talk to the people who we want to we
Speaker 9: want to be making products that will be used in hospitals.
Speaker 9: Let's talk to people who work in hospitals to see
Speaker 9: where it's useful. And then the other thing that they
Speaker 9: said during that this was something a couple other people
Speaker 9: pointed out, is that you have to when you're talking
Speaker 9: about building products that human beings will be working alongside
Speaker 9: in an industrial capacity, you have to assume that there
Speaker 9: will be failures and build that in because otherwise you're
Speaker 9: taking risks with people's lives. Right, So you have to
Speaker 9: be figuring out, we want this thing to fail when
Speaker 9: it does, because it will in a way that doesn't
Speaker 9: endanger human beings. How do we build that in from
Speaker 9: the ground up. This is like a fundamental assumption it
Speaker 9: will fail. We need to make sure it fails in
Speaker 9: a way that does not lead to it crushing or
Speaker 9: killing people because it's going to be around them, And
Speaker 9: so I really appreciate it. And it was such a
Speaker 9: that was such a gap to me from how everyone else.
Speaker 9: I'm used to other people talking about this a lot more.
Speaker 5: In the health techomy, right, yeah, because the stakes are
Speaker 5: so high. Yeah, you know, like all the tech people
Speaker 5: are like break shit, disrupt, but like medicine is like, no, no,
Speaker 5: don't break the people.
Speaker 9: Something's already broken.
Speaker 5: They're broken already.
Speaker 9: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think one of the barriers to that though,
Speaker 2: And this is not even me being cynical. It is
Speaker 2: just you ask people what the problems are and then
Speaker 2: you go, oh, you're an LM. Can't do that sorry.
Speaker 2: Like the answer is the problems that you have are
Speaker 2: not fixable with the technology we have NAT like housing
Speaker 2: and health like health stuff. It's like there are very
Speaker 2: big limitations because of medical device clearance. But also just well.
Speaker 5: Technology is streamlining, right, like if you think about the
Speaker 5: like I just remember this from a macro acinemic class
Speaker 5: in college. But like all technology does is it moves
Speaker 5: the curve up. It doesn't. It doesn't like change the
Speaker 5: angle of the curve or whatnot. It just you know,
Speaker 5: allows you to do more. So it's about streamlining things.
Speaker 5: It's not about fixing problems. It's about finding things that
Speaker 5: you could do more efficiently. Being more efficient doesn't fix
Speaker 5: the problem, right, different, it's two different streams that you're approaching,
Speaker 5: but they're conflating it by being like, if you're efficient,
Speaker 5: you fix the problems. Like, no, the problem isn't always efficiency.
Speaker 6: Yeah, and you know, I mean the thing I think
Speaker 6: about a lot is what I'm in any city, but
Speaker 6: especially New York or LA where I spend a lot
Speaker 6: of time. It's like the physical infrastructure is so bad.
Speaker 6: But everybody has cell phones right, right, Like no one's
Speaker 6: even like oh, homeless people have We know, everybody has
Speaker 6: cell phones, like because the price of them is so
Speaker 6: cheap and and you can do a lot with them.
Speaker 6: But like there's potholes, the trains don't run right, and
Speaker 6: like those are the problems in society, and the fact
Speaker 6: that we have you know, high technology in these particular
Speaker 6: areas but not in like the rest of our society
Speaker 6: is like a weird distortion. We all know this. We
Speaker 6: don't think about it often enough. But like what you're
Speaker 6: talking about is is this AI will like push that
Speaker 6: distortion even further. Yeah, in the best case scenario and
Speaker 6: people like you know, Simon Wilson or whatever will have
Speaker 6: like some crazy agentic shit happening. You know, like they'll
Speaker 6: they'll be you know, in some fucking matrix and everybody
Speaker 6: else will be like, how do I buy food?
Speaker 2: Someone Willisson be trying to draw a Pelican on a bicycle.
Speaker 2: I think that's the one thing that's literally the test
Speaker 2: thrones on every LM. But yeah, Willison is kind of
Speaker 2: realistic about and yeah, yeah, to your point, Robert, with
Speaker 2: that panel, it's like, yeah, we're talking about this fantasy land.
Speaker 2: But even when we so during the Nvidia conference, it
Speaker 2: was talking about yeah, and now agents are getting even
Speaker 2: more powerful in doing this.
Speaker 3: They're not well yeah, no they're not.
Speaker 2: But also gun to your head, explain what that means, like,
Speaker 2: because I regularly am arguing with people about this online
Speaker 2: perpetual that.
Speaker 5: Was they're talking about the agents and the consumerism and
Speaker 5: the commerce aspect of agents just because that's the only
Speaker 5: way they have a chance of making them.
Speaker 9: Such a lack of specificity, like that is the thing
Speaker 9: that is most like in like the first three panels
Speaker 9: I did, all of which were one way or the
Speaker 9: other talking about like agents and their ability to like
Speaker 9: improve productivity and creativity. There was an exam exactly one
Speaker 9: specific example of a thing that people used AI, like
Speaker 9: that a marketing or company used AI to do for marketing, right,
Speaker 9: because these were all fairly marketing focused, and it was
Speaker 9: specifically it was the company that makes Allegra had like
Speaker 9: a new non drowsy formula, and they engaged in what
Speaker 9: the the I think it was a deloittte I forget,
Speaker 9: I forget who who said this, it's in my notes,
Speaker 9: but what the person who was talking about it described
Speaker 9: as model hacking to basically put out a bunch of
Speaker 9: content so that chetch ept would repeatedly scrape articles or
Speaker 9: whatnot that talked about how Allegra was non drowsy, so
Speaker 9: that if people asked questions about it, the LLLM would
Speaker 9: return both always would say l Allegra is non drowsy,
Speaker 9: would like put that before the word Allegra, and would
Speaker 9: like subtly talk about other allergy medicines causing drowsiness. And
Speaker 9: they were talking about like and that's like a really
Speaker 9: great example like the this is like a strategy developed
Speaker 9: using AI that like, uh is not what we couldn't
Speaker 9: have done marketing like this before. It couldn't possibly have
Speaker 9: come up with a way to reverse. Yeah, first off,
Speaker 9: like you're you're the most specific example of the use
Speaker 9: of this technology in advertising is disinformation. Yeah right, basically
Speaker 9: you know, or at least that yeah, on that spectrum.
Speaker 4: And that probably costs thousands of dogs, Like probably so
Speaker 4: thousands of articles or whatever just fed into the training
Speaker 4: Jesus fucking Christ.
Speaker 9: Well, and at the same time, they're talking about how
Speaker 9: important trust is and that like you have to be
Speaker 9: you have to keep and there's yeah as they lie
Speaker 9: and they're like, well, you know, people only trust you,
Speaker 9: will only trust your AI as much as they trust
Speaker 9: your company, So it's really about like having a good
Speaker 9: bread so the other way round.
Speaker 2: Well, that's what kind.
Speaker 9: Of what I took it as them saying is that like, look,
Speaker 9: people don't trust AI, but they still have some trust
Speaker 9: for specific brands. So if you really want to, like
Speaker 9: there's a limited period of time for.
Speaker 1: For that trust to stay alive.
Speaker 2: It feels like blow it up.
Speaker 5: Yeah, that's honest to god, makes the show more boring.
Speaker 9: Yeah, it really, it's all fucking AI ship.
Speaker 8: Yeah.
Speaker 6: Like the stuff I was popping for was there was
Speaker 6: a robot lawnmower that could go up a hill.
Speaker 2: Yeah, see that.
Speaker 5: All the robots are getting GEN again. Look like Gen's coverage.
Speaker 5: It's just about how last year the robots had arms,
Speaker 5: This year the robots have legs.
Speaker 2: Next year, big old Willie.
Speaker 3: There was also a.
Speaker 6: There was we were I was talking about the jerk
Speaker 6: off robot last time. But first I saw there was
Speaker 6: a robot called beat Bot, and it said.
Speaker 9: That was like a masturbation.
Speaker 6: That wasn't It was that nothing beats beat bot, and
Speaker 6: I was like, this is a masturbation.
Speaker 3: Great.
Speaker 6: It turns out it's a little robot that swims in
Speaker 6: your pool and cleans your pool. And I think maybe
Speaker 6: it's also the Bluetooth speaker, and I was like, it's
Speaker 6: like a pool room.
Speaker 9: But also you didn't if you were going to if
Speaker 9: there's any good call for a hybridized robot, a combination
Speaker 9: pool robot or gas and robot, like make the sexy
Speaker 9: pool boy a robot.
Speaker 2: And it's just doing that weird song from you remember
Speaker 2: that one. Yeah, there was the offbeat song the guy
Speaker 2: was claiming he would only have sex to No. No
Speaker 2: one remembers that. No, just oh god.
Speaker 9: Yeah, you can market it to Richmond with like wives
Speaker 9: in their tow twenties where you're like, look, your wife
Speaker 9: is going to cheat on you with the cabana boy.
Speaker 9: Just make sure it's a robot cabana book.
Speaker 1: What you look depressed?
Speaker 9: Honey? Do you need some time with the cabana bot?
Speaker 2: On new music?
Speaker 6: Genuinely the best, one of the best use cases for
Speaker 6: generative AI has sex stuff like it.
Speaker 9: It's certainly one of the most.
Speaker 5: Use Sorry, as someone who was subjected to testing Annie
Speaker 5: the Grock sexpot, Jesus that was damaging, you might have.
Speaker 9: A workman's comp Yeah.
Speaker 5: Listen, I keep asking for hazard pay at the Verge
Speaker 5: dot com and for my title to change to Senior
Speaker 5: Curse tech Reviewer. It's not happened yet. It's not happened yet.
Speaker 5: But I did have to test Annie, and boy did she.
Speaker 6: Yeah noticed, Like the only people who are really making
Speaker 6: good use of like Sora style videos are niche fetish
Speaker 6: communities on the Internet who have been able to move
Speaker 6: from writing fan fiction for each other because that's a
Speaker 6: cheap thing where they can, you know, have make media
Speaker 6: for each other. Now they can make little videos they're
Speaker 6: making and they're so happy there.
Speaker 5: Okay, but AI doesn't know how to animate tongues. And
Speaker 5: I know this because again my job is cursed, and
Speaker 5: I had to I had to test these AI video
Speaker 5: generating more men kissing, making the AI kiss each other. No,
Speaker 5: they don't, they don't. They don't understand how tongues work.
Speaker 2: It's just a little Jensen Wong said that the new
Speaker 2: generation Vera Ruben is four times more powerful for training.
Speaker 2: So maybe that's the Jensen Huang's bring the tongues in.
Speaker 2: But sadly we are go, we're gonna have to end
Speaker 2: this thirty second. The next thing coming up is an
Speaker 2: ad for a tongue training models. And if you hear
Speaker 2: something else that's an error. Whatever it is, just ignore
Speaker 2: it because we're meant to. It's the tongue training app.
Speaker 2: But before we get to the tongue training app, Robert
Speaker 2: has a very important man.
Speaker 9: So I came across the booth during the brief time
Speaker 9: I spent on the floor today of a robotics company
Speaker 9: called Zeroith, which I think is a reference to the
Speaker 9: laws of robotics, and you know, you had the normal
Speaker 9: laws and there was the zero with law, YadA, YadA, YadA. Anyway,
Speaker 9: we don't need to get into Asimov right now, but
Speaker 9: it's they had a whole booklet. I actually thought these
Speaker 9: were like notebooks at first, but every page of this
Speaker 9: is printed, explaining the vision for their company and the
Speaker 9: robots they make. The origin story. I'm just going to
Speaker 9: read a little bit from here, Okay. The prevailing narrative
Speaker 9: in robotics has long been one of replacement and utility,
Speaker 9: Robots as instruments of precision, built for efficiency and stripped
Speaker 9: of warmth. Yet from across the long memory of civilization,
Speaker 9: the impulse to create was never merely mechanical. From yan
Speaker 9: Shies graceful wooden automaton and ancient China to Tallos, the
Speaker 9: bronze guardian of crete, our earliest machines were not tools.
Speaker 9: There were mirrors, reflections of an ancient longing too, with
Speaker 9: the reflections of an ancient longing to understand ourselves. Zero
Speaker 9: withth emerges from that unbroken thread of imagination and hearing that,
Speaker 9: and there's so much more flowery pros. I need you
Speaker 9: all to see. The robot that they wrote that.
Speaker 2: Okay, let's let's take it.
Speaker 6: Why is he wearing a little Zo Polo shirt?
Speaker 1: I love that that's your first question.
Speaker 9: So listeners at home, what they've got is a robot
Speaker 9: that looks kind of like a cross between Elon Musk's
Speaker 9: shitty robot and a guy in a fencing helmet. It
Speaker 9: can't stand on its own power. They have like a
Speaker 9: sex harness built that's like standing it up. That's like
Speaker 9: so it doesn't fall on its ass, and they put
Speaker 9: an awkward T shirt on it, I think, to hide
Speaker 9: the straps.
Speaker 1: From the thing that keeps it standing.
Speaker 2: Jesus fucking this is the consumer electronic show everyone. This
Speaker 2: is yeah, they did. They are lying to you. Any
Speaker 2: motherfucker that tells you that robotics ry is coming, they're
Speaker 2: fucking lying anyway. If this is an AI add off
Speaker 2: to this, that's the fucking problem. Diane. I'm once again
Speaker 2: in scenic Las Vegas, and the locals are staring at
Speaker 2: me with daggers in their eyes as I insist on
Speaker 2: podcasting further. After rotating cubes in my head all day,
Speaker 2: I'm now rotating. My guests joining me once again is
Speaker 2: victorious song of the Vergine, not remotely. You're wonderful and
Speaker 2: your very popular listeners love you as well. It's important
Speaker 2: for you to hear this.
Speaker 5: Not from my ego.
Speaker 2: You need the ego. Ed On Guaiso, Junior of the
Speaker 2: Tech Bubble newsletter and the incredible, wonderful stand up comedian.
Speaker 2: The start of the movie is this thing on. Chloe
Speaker 2: Radcliffe is joining us?
Speaker 1: Yeah, what is hell?
Speaker 2: Your first ces?
Speaker 4: Yeah?
Speaker 2: What do you think?
Speaker 8: I'm a cees virgin? Wow, there's so many boys.
Speaker 5: It's crazy boy.
Speaker 8: No, no, no, no, there's so many hairlines. Is I
Speaker 8: should stay a lot of balls? Yeah, a lot of combs, Yeah,
Speaker 8: a lot of a lot of comb comb over ponytails.
Speaker 2: Offer any hair stuff?
Speaker 1: Yes they do.
Speaker 5: Did you go to go to Eureka Park? There's always
Speaker 5: someone who has like some led hair bands situation and
Speaker 5: it's yeah that's good.
Speaker 2: Yeah. So Chloe, you'll first ces. Have you seen anything
Speaker 2: that's stuck in your brain?
Speaker 8: My biggest take has so far from being on the
Speaker 8: floor for a pretty limited amount of time, is that
Speaker 8: the theme is numbers that you don't need.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 8: I stopped at a booth that had a smart dog cage.
Speaker 5: Oh, the smart pet crate.
Speaker 8: Yeah, yeah, smart pet crate and it tells you your
Speaker 8: dog's It tells you your dog's heart rate and breathing rate,
Speaker 8: and then it also tells you the distance between the
Speaker 8: top of the cage and the dog.
Speaker 5: Welcome to my useless numbers.
Speaker 8: Uselessnessnumbers, And I said to the guy I was, I like,
Speaker 8: stopped and was Lena, And I was like, well, why
Speaker 8: do you need the distance from the top of the
Speaker 8: cage to the top of the dog? And he goes, well,
Speaker 8: that's how you know whether the dog is moving or not.
Speaker 8: And I was like, yeah, but you just look and
Speaker 8: he goes, well, but you're like looking at your app
Speaker 8: and so you want to know maybe if the number,
Speaker 8: if the number has stayed static for a little while,
Speaker 8: maybe the dog has died. I said yeah, but wouldn't
Speaker 8: you know that from the other numbers like heart right.
Speaker 1: To take your dog dead.
Speaker 5: They're gonna ramp up to four hundred biometrics. That's something.
Speaker 2: Your dog is Lena Dunham Inde. I love that well
Speaker 2: because it's like, if the dog's moving, couldn't emotion sense,
Speaker 2: I mean, there's so.
Speaker 8: Many things, couldn't We already have pet camps whoever has
Speaker 8: whoever is.
Speaker 1: Buying a smart pet crate also.
Speaker 8: Already has a video camera trained on that dark's crane.
Speaker 8: That person is not doing smart crate over pet camp and.
Speaker 11: They're like, hey, can you look at this graft?
Speaker 5: Do you think I've got I've got two cats and
Speaker 5: a lot of cat tech. I don't need a crate. No,
Speaker 5: Like I got auto feeder. It has a little camera.
Speaker 5: And we did that because when we went to Italy,
Speaker 5: I was just like, I got to make sure these
Speaker 5: dumb cats are eating in between pet sitter visits. And
Speaker 5: literally day one I'm in Italy, I watched my cat
Speaker 5: look at me through the camera. It's pissed, knock cat rage, and.
Speaker 8: I do need to ask if the cats were not
Speaker 8: eating between feed feeders, between pet sitters.
Speaker 1: Yeah, what were you gonna do for me?
Speaker 5: Nothing?
Speaker 1: Nothing.
Speaker 5: I was gonna call the pet sitter and be crazy
Speaker 5: lady and be like, my extremely ro ton nineteen point
Speaker 5: five pound cat is not eating.
Speaker 8: It's now living off its own body fat and it
Speaker 8: will be fun. Yeah, and it has enough calories to
Speaker 8: support it enough. But yeah, So I mean that's the thing.
Speaker 8: I think that like all of these numbers that my
Speaker 8: theme of numbers that you don't need. What they wind
Speaker 8: up filtering into is anxiety. Oh yeah, it's like too
Speaker 8: much information leads to anxiety.
Speaker 5: Senior cursed tech reviewer. Because I I'd test wearable. I
Speaker 5: have useless numbers for humans, yes all the time. Yeah,
Speaker 5: and just I'm completely overwhelmed and over inundated, and yeah,
Speaker 5: it's very accurate.
Speaker 8: It would drive me insane all of the sleep tech
Speaker 8: I'm The thing is that I'm like sort of the
Speaker 8: wrong person to be here because I'm like, stay away
Speaker 8: from me with your with your numbers and your vibrations.
Speaker 2: Having you here is good. We need that kind of
Speaker 2: energy because there's too many perverts here. Like, actually, we
Speaker 2: need enough number so we know how the space between
Speaker 2: your dog and the seeing the crate, but what if
Speaker 2: about what about the sides?
Speaker 1: Yeah, how are they going to get that?
Speaker 2: And also just I love the idea of getting a
Speaker 2: notification about what does notification say your dog is this tall?
Speaker 2: We've measured your dog.
Speaker 5: Like the smart little robots they're now having like cameras
Speaker 5: so you can watch your cat go into the little
Speaker 5: robot to piss.
Speaker 8: Wow, they already, they say, already weigh the cats as well,
Speaker 8: so you can see how much my like I can.
Speaker 5: I can literally look into an app and go like,
Speaker 5: oh you lost zero point five pounds on that douchie,
Speaker 5: good for you.
Speaker 1: What do you mean eating?
Speaker 6: Brother?
Speaker 1: Brother?
Speaker 2: The only exception is is if I have a cat
Speaker 2: with a urinary thing, how my beautiful, big, beautiful and annoying,
Speaker 2: just like daddy. But he is this beautiful cat who
Speaker 2: he occasionally has pe problems. But you can mostly just
Speaker 2: get that by looking at your cat like you're just
Speaker 2: checking occasionally be like, oh, okay, he hasn't paid in
Speaker 2: a while. I don't need a four hundred and fifty
Speaker 2: dollars WiFi connected thing to be like, are you sure?
Speaker 2: I think that's how much they know?
Speaker 5: They're like eight hundred dollars.
Speaker 8: Fuck off, Sorry not to you, but the cat thing, Yeah,
Speaker 8: how much do you love your cat?
Speaker 2: I love my cat so much. But a beautiful ARMANI suit.
Speaker 2: I assume god he'd look fetching. He's a big, big,
Speaker 2: white and ginger cat. Oh my god. No, I did
Speaker 2: get him a bow tie at one point.
Speaker 11: Off, Oh I hear it. Yeah, I used to get
Speaker 11: my cats.
Speaker 12: I had the both ties with bells so I could
Speaker 12: hear them because they would disappear into yeah, I didn't
Speaker 12: know where in the house, and they always would rip
Speaker 12: them off and leave them yeah outside.
Speaker 2: Like a real fuck you, like just like that's where
Speaker 2: that ship goes, right, don't don't put bells on me. Yeah.
Speaker 2: I put a little cats on, a little tie on
Speaker 2: him as well. Once. There's so many good things you
Speaker 2: can do with the cat, none of which involve an
Speaker 2: eight hundred and fifty dollars piss measurer.
Speaker 1: One time I tied a balloon around a tortoise. Didn't
Speaker 1: why because we kept losing it.
Speaker 8: I lived and it kept getting stuck under the radiator,
Speaker 8: but then we wouldn't find it for a couple of days.
Speaker 1: She was fine, but kept was just smoking around the
Speaker 1: apoblem with the ball.
Speaker 2: Told version of up.
Speaker 1: Yeah, she was trying to get taken away.
Speaker 5: That should be at the but at the consumer electronic
Speaker 5: show would probably be like a wearable tortoise tracker with.
Speaker 8: No no, you can steal a balloon, you can ruin
Speaker 8: a kid's day to get your tortoise found.
Speaker 5: They would have like an optical tracker to read the
Speaker 5: tortoises temperature and it's art right, so you go to
Speaker 5: her app and be like, is my reptile alive?
Speaker 2: Is what happened to you? It's just a tool slowly
Speaker 2: walking ye seven hundred dollars.
Speaker 12: There's this video from an account I followed because of
Speaker 12: this video where they have a tortoise and they have
Speaker 12: a cat and the tortoise has a skateboard to follow
Speaker 12: the cat around all day and harassium, that's the tech
Speaker 12: I would get.
Speaker 11: That's, you know, a little skateboard for my little guys.
Speaker 1: You know, someday we're all gonna go.
Speaker 2: Back, so is cats and skateboards. That's the real technology.
Speaker 2: Did you get any other numbers that didn't that don't
Speaker 2: match or make you upset?
Speaker 1: There was a there was a sleep bot.
Speaker 2: Nice.
Speaker 1: I think I'm calling it the right thing.
Speaker 8: It's a it's a smart pillow, okay, and uh it
Speaker 8: seems like the actually useful thing is that it's filled
Speaker 8: with these little like pneumatic air sacks that inflate or
Speaker 8: deflate based on your snoring to stop you from and.
Speaker 5: That that beds. Yeah, okay, that seems.
Speaker 1: Right, like I can buy that.
Speaker 8: It's like that that that passes the sniff test. But
Speaker 8: this pillow also when you're When it senses your head
Speaker 8: is on the pillow, it turns off your lights, It
Speaker 8: turns off your uh speaker if you have a speaker plane,
Speaker 8: it closes your curtains for you automatically, and then it
Speaker 8: this is not a lie, texts your family that you
Speaker 8: are asleep.
Speaker 1: And I took pictures.
Speaker 2: Of pillow for a prison you know, I'm.
Speaker 1: Going to close. I'm reading.
Speaker 8: I'm reading the example text that it has sending a
Speaker 8: message to the family. Cassie Oscar has been detected lying down. Wow,
Speaker 8: Jimmy Oscar has been detected, lying down.
Speaker 1: I am I am not making this up.
Speaker 8: Doctor Larry Calibracy, Oscar has been detected lying down.
Speaker 2: Text he has this is this is a prison pillow.
Speaker 1: Yeah, this is just for what you do.
Speaker 11: If you got that text, I.
Speaker 2: Would be horrified. So funny, I mean everyone, and of
Speaker 2: course everyone who comes to see yes with me has
Speaker 2: to use I love the odor as well. That you're
Speaker 2: just going to bed, your your blind's rope and all
Speaker 2: of the lights are on you just blaring core when
Speaker 2: I assume and I have no way of doing any
Speaker 2: of this myself, So just my pillow will psychopath I know.
Speaker 5: Sleep tech is all about like optimization. That's why my
Speaker 5: newsletters called like an optomizer. This whole beat of health
Speaker 5: tech and all that is just about having the most
Speaker 5: optimal something right. So they're like, oh, science shows that
Speaker 5: if you sleep in like X, y Z conditions, you'll
Speaker 5: sleep so good, So have a pillow, close all of
Speaker 5: these things so you're in the most optimal sleep environment whatever,
Speaker 5: and like, yeah, it is good to have an optimal
Speaker 5: sleep environment. It is good for you to do all
Speaker 5: that stuff. But you don't need to fucking text your
Speaker 5: doctor calib races about your sleeping.
Speaker 2: That would be such a strange text to receive, like
Speaker 2: he is, and especially with the way it was written,
Speaker 2: like Galactus.
Speaker 1: Hated.
Speaker 8: Also, the smart pillow doesn't like smooth out your bed
Speaker 8: sheets for you, you know, like all of this stuff
Speaker 8: that actually make it everything that actually makes sleeping good,
Speaker 8: which is like wear the right clothes for you to
Speaker 8: sleep in and.
Speaker 1: Have the right bed you know.
Speaker 5: It's like, I've done the digital sh I've done so
Speaker 5: much sleep tech testing, and the only thing that's really
Speaker 5: worked for me and my spouse is unfortunately, a five
Speaker 5: thousand dollars smart mattress cover, which.
Speaker 2: Is yeah, I burn. I pay for one as well,
Speaker 2: and like people made fun of it because of the
Speaker 2: a WS thing when it went down, your bed wouldn't work. Yeah,
Speaker 2: that happens to me.
Speaker 5: I think it happened. It definitely happened.
Speaker 2: Like I need to sleep in an ice coffin, like
Speaker 2: I just my poor girlfriend, just like even for her,
Speaker 2: I'm just like, yeah, this is I sleep at fifty
Speaker 2: degrees like Dracula.
Speaker 5: It saves marriages and relationships because you could sleep at
Speaker 5: different temperatures. I need to be a cozy little a
Speaker 5: cozy little gal normal.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I need to be a little book bug in
Speaker 1: a rug.
Speaker 5: I need to be like toasty. And my spouse also
Speaker 5: needs to be a corpse so we can set different temperatures.
Speaker 2: I need to set to Dracula.
Speaker 5: Yeah. And you know, they snore, and it used to
Speaker 5: be a thing where every every like day, I would
Speaker 5: hear them storing and I'd be like, what fuck up?
Speaker 5: So I can sleep? But now the bed actually just
Speaker 5: lifts when it detects and snoring on his side, no
Speaker 5: on our side. So sometimes I go like, oh it's moving,
Speaker 5: and I will fall right back asleep. But you know,
Speaker 5: ever since that happened, he doesn't wake me up snoring anymore.
Speaker 5: That's good, Like it's saved our marriage.
Speaker 1: Wow, this is unfortunately you're selling me on this discover But.
Speaker 5: Unfortunately it also comes with useless numbers, Like how can.
Speaker 2: I useless number? Here's my psychopath thing? Though I have
Speaker 2: my numbers for my eight sleep and I have my
Speaker 2: numbers for my aura ring and they disagree all the time.
Speaker 2: I love it.
Speaker 5: Yeah, same is like long term tusting that.
Speaker 2: My favorite thing was I posted because I also use
Speaker 2: so many which is the thing that electrocutes for Actually
Speaker 2: what I love it. It's this thing that electrocute you head.
Speaker 2: It sounds insane. Just best not to think too hard.
Speaker 2: But like I posted my numbers on Blue Sky once,
Speaker 2: which was a mistake, and so it was immediate like
Speaker 2: you're not getting enough deep sleep, you should be really concerned.
Speaker 2: I'm like, I really had to stop myself being like
Speaker 2: kill you.
Speaker 5: To be clear, the or ring is like they do
Speaker 5: a lot of science, they do a lot of research.
Speaker 5: They're only about like I want to say, seventy nine
Speaker 5: percent correlation between the gold standard of polysomnography. That's what
Speaker 5: are you guys dreaming a lot? No, I do have medications.
Speaker 1: Dream that'll do.
Speaker 5: My new medications are giving me night terrors really bad.
Speaker 2: I heard them going.
Speaker 12: I was like, you gott he's listening to no, no,
Speaker 12: he was listening to this stuff.
Speaker 2: But he lied down on this pillow. You know he
Speaker 2: has night terrors. Yeah. He strikes me to kind of
Speaker 2: just wake up, like, yeah, I used.
Speaker 12: To think when he went to sleep he would just
Speaker 12: be in his memory palace.
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly, like regarding it. Yeah, that's the thing that's well,
Speaker 2: it's like the basic things for sleep, like is it
Speaker 2: light in there or dark in there? Are you the
Speaker 2: right temperature? Are you comfortable? And it's like, yeah, but
Speaker 2: what if the pillow did all this ship you already?
Speaker 1: I asked. I asked the people at the booth.
Speaker 8: I was like, but what if I want to lay
Speaker 8: in bed and not have the lights out?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 1: And he goes, well, you'd have to put another pillow
Speaker 1: on top.
Speaker 2: What's great? What's so good about that? It is likely
Speaker 2: no one has asked them that. You're the first person
Speaker 2: to be like, what if I am in bed but
Speaker 2: not sleeping yet? He's like, fuck, how much was this?
Speaker 2: Did he give you a price?
Speaker 1: I didn't even ask I should have asked.
Speaker 2: It's probably, like.
Speaker 5: It's probably my estimate is six hundred yeah, five dollars.
Speaker 5: It's always stupid.
Speaker 2: N you could go on like eBay and get some
Speaker 2: like really nice sheets that will like some like Crisp Bokale.
Speaker 5: Perhaps I've tested smart pillows in the past, but like
Speaker 5: it was a very different smart pillow was testing like
Speaker 5: my breathing rate?
Speaker 11: Why not?
Speaker 5: But it was also like it had a speaker in
Speaker 5: there so you could listen to your podcast to fall
Speaker 5: asleep in your smart pillow. And I was like, this
Speaker 5: is dumb. It's so dumb.
Speaker 12: I'm someone who you know, I'm not trying to optimize sleep,
Speaker 12: but I do value the dream pertion of it. So
Speaker 12: is there really is for someone like me who's just
Speaker 12: like I, you know, I'm interested in deeper sleep. Does
Speaker 12: it make sense to go on the journey of trying
Speaker 12: out the smart attach it or should I just invest in.
Speaker 3: I can't.
Speaker 11: I don't dream on melatonin?
Speaker 2: What about trust?
Speaker 5: Usually melatonin will make your dream super intense?
Speaker 2: I wake up?
Speaker 1: What about magnesium, the one that doesn't make you poop?
Speaker 2: I haven't done what is it?
Speaker 3: I know?
Speaker 11: I haven't I haven't tried a.
Speaker 8: Magnesium I think it's magnesium glyconate makes you sleep, and
Speaker 8: magnesium sit trate makes you.
Speaker 5: Ship relaxes you. Magnesium healthy aine. And then there's also
Speaker 5: you could try a GLP because one of the side
Speaker 5: effects of that is intensely vivid dream.
Speaker 12: Oh yeah, I mean you know, I like I lucid
Speaker 12: dream regularly, which is why I'm like, okay, I'll do
Speaker 12: anything as accept whatever goes and fringes on that. But
Speaker 12: I've never thought too much about doing the tech beyond,
Speaker 12: like I'll just invest in really nice sheet, you know,
Speaker 12: and just to get myself really comfort.
Speaker 2: The sleep measurement stuff sucks, but I really love the keat.
Speaker 2: I love the cold. I love the fact control over
Speaker 2: the end. I burn half I sleep and I look
Speaker 2: and I have like a full scale like blackout eye mask.
Speaker 2: I have a giant sheet. I like curl myself up
Speaker 2: in a ball. It's probably not great, Like it's probably
Speaker 2: not a great sign. And I'm just like cold and
Speaker 2: like wrapped in this thing like I've just blacked at,
Speaker 2: like and I wake up when my alarm goes off
Speaker 2: and not a moment earlier. It's fucking great. I mean,
Speaker 2: I write constantly I think like, this is the only
Speaker 2: reason I can just like endless sleep. But it's again,
Speaker 2: the numbers do fucking nothing for me. I wake up
Speaker 2: feeling like shit, It's like you didn't sleep enough. Thank you?
Speaker 8: Yeah. For me, the numbers make it so much worse
Speaker 8: because mostly if I'm having trouble sleeping, then a huge
Speaker 8: proportion of my brain is fixated on I am not
Speaker 8: sleeping and that is bad. And so then to have
Speaker 8: when they're like, this is going to help you sleep better,
Speaker 8: I'm like, no, no, no, it's gonna remind me how badly
Speaker 8: I'm sleeping, and that's going to make me sleep so
Speaker 8: much worse because every night when I lay down, it's
Speaker 8: gonna be like, well, tonight has to be the night
Speaker 8: that it is good now.
Speaker 2: And get you loved ones get a text saying she's
Speaker 2: not sleeping.
Speaker 8: Chloe has been detected lying down, but has not been
Speaker 8: detected unconscious yet.
Speaker 2: Chloe has violated the rules of the Billows Sleep bought that.
Speaker 5: That matric is called sleep latency. It sucks.
Speaker 2: Yeah, what's the what how long it takes you to.
Speaker 5: Sleep, how long until you try to go to sleep,
Speaker 5: and how when you actually fall asleep it's called sleep
Speaker 5: latencyy and you can kind of measure certain things by that.
Speaker 5: It's it's bullshit occasionally bullshit, but it's bullshit.
Speaker 2: I occasionally really like I'll get like a two minute
Speaker 2: one of the fuck.
Speaker 5: Yeah, well, like all it does. All it does is
Speaker 5: if you have a sleep and see under fifteen minutes,
Speaker 5: it just means you're really fucking tired.
Speaker 1: And that's bad. Interesting. Yeah, wait, you mean like healthy
Speaker 1: people have.
Speaker 5: About fifteen minutes to fall asleep.
Speaker 1: Interesting, that's like a normal Take that boyfriend.
Speaker 5: Yeah, like you're falling.
Speaker 1: He falls asleep in forty five seconds. It's like if
Speaker 1: and then highlight there he helps angry.
Speaker 8: Listening to him, get this peaceful rest that I should
Speaker 8: be enjoying.
Speaker 5: I'm like, you fall asleep too quickly.
Speaker 2: It could be one hour yesterday, Jesus Christ. Yeah, okay,
Speaker 2: seventeen six minutes, two days ago, thirteen sixteen and seven,
Speaker 2: seven sixteen, twenty eight, eight thirty three, one fucking fucking
Speaker 2: lost Friday, one minute, just fucking I think I was
Speaker 2: like in a moment with my girlfriend, I'm very happy.
Speaker 2: So that's lovely. Under that layer, all you.
Speaker 5: Need is like a baseline and like the only point
Speaker 5: of these numbers is to build a long term base,
Speaker 5: and when you're off the baseline, you go like, oh, okay,
Speaker 5: maybe happened to me.
Speaker 8: It's yet again to go back to sort of the
Speaker 8: theme of earlier, don't you know when you're off the
Speaker 8: baseline by I'm having trouble sleeping lately?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm having trouble to sleep. Like.
Speaker 5: The whole point of this is that they're trying to
Speaker 5: do something like illness prediction, and there is science that
Speaker 5: they can do that. Like during COVID they.
Speaker 2: Were yeah, or is not great of that?
Speaker 5: It actually is.
Speaker 2: It hasn't been great for me.
Speaker 5: I've gotten it where like the symptom radar is just
Speaker 5: like you're getting sick and then I would get sick,
Speaker 5: so like, but you know, it's not that helpful because
Speaker 5: it's like a forty eight hour button.
Speaker 8: Though again I know I'm like, I know my throat
Speaker 8: has a tiny tickle, I'm about to get sick.
Speaker 5: Like all of this stuff came from like when they
Speaker 5: were doing COVID research because it's asymptomatics. Okay, get like
Speaker 5: that sort of like, but.
Speaker 2: This is the thing with all this wellness shit. It's
Speaker 2: like well, you can't be mad at us that it
Speaker 2: isn't really useful, because once it.
Speaker 5: Was snake oil. That's my beat, snake.
Speaker 2: Oil, snake oil cussed feet.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I just I just sit here and go like, no,
Speaker 5: that's not true, No that's not true. Here's the nuance.
Speaker 5: And everyone yells at me and they're like you're a
Speaker 5: big farmer shell and I'm like, no, I'm not.
Speaker 2: What the fuck does that? I mean, what do you
Speaker 2: mean a big farma shoe?
Speaker 5: Oh. I wrote a story recently about the wellness wild West.
Speaker 5: It's kind of like a storyline that I read about
Speaker 5: a lot, and I was talking about how people shouldn't
Speaker 5: be injecting unapproved drugs. Ideally, even if it.
Speaker 2: Peptides, yes, Chinese peptide.
Speaker 5: Don't don't do that. Don't take GOLP three. It's not
Speaker 5: actually a GOLP three because the only people with access
Speaker 5: to the proprietary components to that is Eli Lilly. So
Speaker 5: whatever you're getting from China is almost one not a
Speaker 5: gil and.
Speaker 2: You're not seeing GOP three is a problem. Just getting
Speaker 2: it from an unlicensed getting it from.
Speaker 5: An unlicensed Chinese pharmacist is not a great idea. Bub
Speaker 5: reconstituting it yourself. You are not a pharmacist. I don't
Speaker 5: see any of you on TikTok using fucking sterile ingredients
Speaker 5: or sterile instruments or whatnot. Like I said that and
Speaker 5: they were like, fucking big sh pharma's shill. I can't
Speaker 5: believe me saying don't use unapproved drugs. Is me being
Speaker 5: a big farmer.
Speaker 2: Show I'm this week, I'm using the new viral GLP.
Speaker 5: From REDDA and Rada tu weey because there, you know
Speaker 5: the the videos. It was like, oh my god, here's
Speaker 5: week one on read. I'm like, first of all, you're
Speaker 5: not on REDDA, You're on some other fucking co The
Speaker 5: The thing that they're calling GLP three, which is also
Speaker 5: like not the correct way to call it, is redd
Speaker 5: a true tide.
Speaker 2: I feel like if you describe this like a hunt,
Speaker 2: like I went to a mysterious man who handed me
Speaker 2: some pills, you'd be like, yeah, that sounds bad, you
Speaker 2: should go to the doctor. But this is like, well,
Speaker 2: not because I got it from the internet.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I just was reading an article about peptides. Because
Speaker 1: not because I was like would those make my life better?
Speaker 8: Not certainly, not that Not because I was thinking about
Speaker 8: trying them, and I read an article and there was
Speaker 8: somebody was quoted. Somebody was just saying, like, they're all
Speaker 8: over Silicon Valley and uh, like this crew, you know,
Speaker 8: Crypto loves them, AI loves them whatever whatever else, this
Speaker 8: other thing loves them. And whoever was quoted said, the
Speaker 8: only group that's a little more skeptical is uh. Anybody
Speaker 8: who works in biotech is a little bit more skeptical.
Speaker 8: But they're just so in the pocket of the FDA,
Speaker 8: or they're so they're so uh they like bow down
Speaker 8: to the FDA. And I was like, well, the other
Speaker 8: interpretation is they this is the world that they work in,
Speaker 8: and they're steeped in way, way, way more information than
Speaker 8: somebody who works in crypto is about peptides specifically, So
Speaker 8: maybe their skepticism is like healthy and ractional.
Speaker 5: It's partly like little like the FDA doesn't want you
Speaker 5: to have that. And I get where that's coming from,
Speaker 5: because you know, healthcare sucks in our country, it's expensive.
Speaker 5: These things could be helpful, but you're getting blocked from it.
Speaker 5: They are trying to, you know, make sure that they're
Speaker 5: making the most amount of money of it. Those are
Speaker 5: all true things, But the FDA exists. We have these
Speaker 5: regulations because people fucking died. People died before, Like this
Speaker 5: is how people die or get really adverse effects because
Speaker 5: I don't know, but doctor matt On TikTok, who is
Speaker 5: most certainly not an actual doctor, telling you how to
Speaker 5: dose gray market Chinese peptides from like things you bought
Speaker 5: from Amazon. I'm sorry when you're in the comments and
Speaker 5: you're like, oh, yeah, I was vomiting uncontrollably.
Speaker 1: Oh I wonder why.
Speaker 2: I'm just doing weight loss math math.
Speaker 12: I had such a distant sense of the GLP once
Speaker 12: because I've been learning about them from the way in
Speaker 12: which they're displacing insulin production in a lot of places,
Speaker 12: and I hadn't had a good sense of the extent
Speaker 12: to which I was like, oh, why are they calling
Speaker 12: them Chinese peptides so incessantly? And that piece was interesting,
Speaker 12: and that time piece was interested in laying out one
Speaker 12: Silicon Valley's obsession with them and also making click into
Speaker 12: sense that I feel like we're seeing others subcultures be like,
Speaker 12: well like, yeah, of course you got to do it yourself.
Speaker 12: Of course you got a looks Max. Of course you
Speaker 12: gotta yeah, you know, like uh optimization.
Speaker 11: Yes exactly.
Speaker 2: I just want to be abundantly clear about something. By
Speaker 2: the way, we're not saying g o P one is
Speaker 2: a bad thing, like it's totally fine. I just want
Speaker 2: to be really abundantly to developed. I mean.
Speaker 12: And one of the use cases is for like, you know,
Speaker 12: if you have, for example, diabetes. You know that, you
Speaker 12: know that's that's one of the uh the proven use cases.
Speaker 12: And yeah, gives it to you.
Speaker 11: Yeah, as long as as you're not doing it in
Speaker 11: your bathtub.
Speaker 2: PhD in philosophy teaching you that.
Speaker 12: It's been so fascinating to see the extent to which
Speaker 12: people are like throwing a lot of uh reason out
Speaker 12: of the door just to be like, no, this is fine,
Speaker 12: this is okay. Actually, and you are a big Pharmachelle,
Speaker 12: if you are, you.
Speaker 5: Know, maybe maybe you know body builders who already are
Speaker 5: a very lean taking GOLP so called GOLP three. Maybe
Speaker 5: that's not a great idea because they've actually never studied
Speaker 5: what this medication does in people with low body fact.
Speaker 5: You don't know what.
Speaker 11: If you're going to do this, how many times are
Speaker 11: we going to do a wave.
Speaker 12: Of a drug that does seem to have a really
Speaker 12: miraculous impact on people. And then you know the crusading
Speaker 12: group of power users maybe you know who are like, hey,
Speaker 12: you know, well, if you're not supporting everyone using it
Speaker 12: as widely as possible, then you're.
Speaker 1: In the pocket of the I mean, side effects are
Speaker 1: a lot more. Yes, effects are real.
Speaker 5: We may not actually want to have those side effects.
Speaker 5: And like, these drugs are so new, we don't know
Speaker 5: what the long term effect is. And it's not bad
Speaker 5: to say, like, you know, you're you're always doing a
Speaker 5: weigh a pro and con like I'm willing to do
Speaker 5: the side effect because the alternative is worse, and like,
Speaker 5: those are conversations you need to have with a real
Speaker 5: fucking doctor. Oh, not a comment section, not some billy
Speaker 5: bob doctor boo on TikTok. It seems it's.
Speaker 1: Times.
Speaker 8: The word A thought that I was having on the
Speaker 8: plane here is it feels like society as a whole,
Speaker 8: and particularly like the this this sections of society that
Speaker 8: are more online, that are more techified, that are more
Speaker 8: you know whatever for sort of forward in that kind
Speaker 8: of progression.
Speaker 1: Uh have plenty of room for.
Speaker 8: Skepticism when it comes to systems of like social support,
Speaker 8: but do not have room for skepticism about tech or so.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, just.
Speaker 5: Like medicine, Like, oh, medicine, vaccines, why would we do
Speaker 5: that despite hundreds of years of evidence, Like they can't
Speaker 5: possibly be right because coach Matt told me on TikTok
Speaker 5: and it seems right.
Speaker 2: And I mean I say this from a perspective of
Speaker 2: I've been very overweight in my life, like I used
Speaker 2: to be like three hundred and fifty pounds a while back,
Speaker 2: and it's like I get the desperation. Yeah, I get desperation,
Speaker 2: especially when it's like GLP one is like very GP three.
Speaker 2: I'm sorry, but it's like very expensive. You have to
Speaker 2: go to a doctor and all that, and just being
Speaker 2: like maybe I could do this cheaper, maybe my doctor
Speaker 2: won't give it to me, maybe whatever, And I get
Speaker 2: that fucking desperation. You'll try it, Like when I've had
Speaker 2: weight problems, you're fucking scratching at the walls, trying to
Speaker 2: find some cheat code around the actual hard thing of
Speaker 2: changing lifestyle, which I should be clear, it's very fucking difficult.
Speaker 2: I have sympathy with everyone. I've been through it multiple
Speaker 2: cycles in my life I get it, but it's like
Speaker 2: to your point, Victoria, it's like, yeah, you're gonna get
Speaker 2: side effects. I'd rather roll the dice on the doctor
Speaker 2: who's using the thing that they know the side effects,
Speaker 2: they've done trials and such, versus the doctor.
Speaker 5: It's hard because you go to doctors and doctors don't
Speaker 5: listen to you. I have bekase, I have metabolic conditions.
Speaker 5: I'm on a GLP actually for it for like peacos
Speaker 5: and fatty liver, And getting to that point was over
Speaker 5: a ten year long journey.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but these.
Speaker 5: Are conversations I was having and I had to fire
Speaker 5: like five doctors because one was like listen to the
Speaker 5: Huberman lab no, or like maybe you should be maybe
Speaker 5: you should be a vegan. Fuck off. Not not to
Speaker 5: like say anything with vegans, but like that's not the
Speaker 5: solution I was looking for, or just being like, well,
Speaker 5: you know picos causes weight gain. Also the solution is
Speaker 5: weight loss, but also your body will not let you
Speaker 5: lose the weight, so just lose some weight. And like
Speaker 5: I understand that desperation, like from a very personal level,
Speaker 5: but at the same time, you have to believe in science.
Speaker 5: You have to believe in like the process exists because
Speaker 5: people have died because side effects are also debilitating to
Speaker 5: quality of life. The worst part about being on a
Speaker 5: GLP for me is that I like food. I don't
Speaker 5: have a lot of food noise. I actually genuinely don't
Speaker 5: have food noise. My liver just wants to fuck me over,
Speaker 5: and so like I can't eat. It's so it takes
Speaker 5: the joy out of eating for me. I don't enjoy
Speaker 5: it at all. I'm sorry, yeah no, And like I'm tired.
Speaker 5: I get fucking clown nightmares. I literally had a nightmare
Speaker 5: that my spouse's X came running after me and I
Speaker 5: was like, oh, this ho and then she turned into
Speaker 5: Penny Wise, the fucking clown, the Bill Scar's Guard version.
Speaker 5: I woke up screaming like.
Speaker 2: This is the side effect I have, clown.
Speaker 5: Yeah, no, that's a side effect I have. This is
Speaker 5: a thing, you know, and you have to wait those
Speaker 5: pros and cons for health. But you know, in the
Speaker 5: pursuit of optimization, and that's rampant here at CEES, people
Speaker 5: are like, yeah, numbers that don't matter, do this, do that,
Speaker 5: and it's like, this is why I have mental health
Speaker 5: problems doing my job.
Speaker 2: But now you have numbers to help.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, now you have so many numbers.
Speaker 8: I want to I mean, I want to go back
Speaker 8: to one thing that you said, which is you said
Speaker 8: you have to believe in science.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because people have died, we've done this whatever.
Speaker 8: I think that there's just a huge swath of the population,
Speaker 8: which is heavily represented here, of people who would just say, no,
Speaker 8: you don't have to believe in science.
Speaker 2: It is lies.
Speaker 1: It is you know, it is bunk, it is biased,
Speaker 1: it is whatever.
Speaker 8: And that fracture is where I'm like, oh no, we've
Speaker 8: not just about science particularly, but sort of like the
Speaker 8: like communal agreement on some like really foundational social pillars.
Speaker 2: Consensus reality.
Speaker 8: Yeah, consensus reality is is like seems to be crumbling.
Speaker 2: And it doesn't help that the leader of the FDA
Speaker 2: sounds like a fucking cyberman. Oh you know yet. Yeah, Now,
Speaker 2: we can't make fun of him. It's a physical condition.
Speaker 2: We can't make fun of him for that. We can
Speaker 2: make fun of that, for the fucking worm in his.
Speaker 5: Brain, the warm in his brain, and the.
Speaker 2: Whale corpse and the bare corpse.
Speaker 5: I he keeps me up at night because in June
Speaker 5: he was like in four years. I want every American
Speaker 5: wearing a wearable and as we quantified people on the
Speaker 5: earth wearing three to four wearables continuously twenty four seven,
Speaker 5: three sixty five.
Speaker 2: No, don't do that, so at that point we can rotate.
Speaker 2: Oh guess one last time, Thank you so much for listening.
Speaker 2: The upcoming AD I assume is not for weight loss drugs.
Speaker 2: If it is, well, I guess.
Speaker 7: You know how we feel about that now, but that's
Speaker 7: not really my goddamn problem.
Speaker 2: Welcome back to the better off line CS experience. We're
Speaker 2: just talking about wanking. I guess.
Speaker 1: I was more specific.
Speaker 3: I was saying, the flashlights are They're just okay, and so.
Speaker 1: Why would be interesting take yes, oh.
Speaker 6: What because you're oh, because I admit to using a sexat.
Speaker 3: A man who.
Speaker 6: Uses a sex toy. Women are vibrator vibrator vibr because men.
Speaker 8: Are inadequate, because men, and if you say that women
Speaker 8: are inadequate, I will take deeper.
Speaker 11: The next generation of sex toy.
Speaker 2: Welcome. Welcome to a offline. You complained last year we
Speaker 2: didn't have enough woman, which was true. Now we've got
Speaker 2: one that's just immediately created. The fracture got you for
Speaker 2: two more days. As well as gonna be great hair
Speaker 2: now this chaos and truthfully having like amazing teams the
Speaker 2: core better offline team for the show as well. And
Speaker 2: I'm actually like both you and Adam Chloe, you both
Speaker 2: kind of were like it's like like Adam, you've done
Speaker 2: a bit of tech cloth you've not done really and
Speaker 2: you're like, oh is this Am I going to be
Speaker 2: a right to do this? Because like I haven't done it.
Speaker 2: This is the perfect view because I think the really
Speaker 2: tech poisoned people are incapable of just being like that
Speaker 2: sounds fucking useless. That sounds dumb as ship even the
Speaker 2: jack off machine. It's like, you're going to attach this
Speaker 2: heavy looking looks pretty heavy.
Speaker 3: It didn't. It didn't look useful or necessary.
Speaker 6: It's a we've already we've already talked about.
Speaker 8: It doesn't look useful or necessary.
Speaker 3: To describe.
Speaker 6: Because we talked about the handy and Handy too in
Speaker 6: the previous segment, we didn't describe what it is. It's
Speaker 6: basically the it's called the it's it's a joke product.
Speaker 3: People laugh.
Speaker 6: It's like the inner core of the flesh light, which
Speaker 6: is like, okay, a flesh light if you're not familiar.
Speaker 6: You know, the sticky hand from the vending machine of
Speaker 6: the supermarkets.
Speaker 3: Trust that is that material.
Speaker 6: That's the material you put lubin in and it's squishy, okay,
Speaker 6: and and again just okay. As an experience had I
Speaker 6: got it's been in a drawer for years, right and
Speaker 6: I got it, uh for free, by the way, because
Speaker 6: I used to do a comedy show in a sex
Speaker 6: shop in Los Angeles.
Speaker 3: Wonderful show at the pleasure chests. But uh, I didn't
Speaker 3: pay for it, but so.
Speaker 1: Imagine I would have. It was on my list.
Speaker 11: I support the industry genuinely, sup.
Speaker 6: It's just it's a squishy core of a flesh light
Speaker 6: and then it's attached to a velcrow harness which is
Speaker 6: attached to like a big piece of metal machinery that
Speaker 6: that moves it up and down.
Speaker 3: And I'm like, I have hands, Yeah, I just And.
Speaker 1: Here's my pitch.
Speaker 8: Here's my pitch for an analog version of that is
Speaker 8: take one of the actual sticky hands that you actually
Speaker 8: stick on the window, and put some lube on that
Speaker 8: and put.
Speaker 1: Just hold that on the problem of your hand.
Speaker 8: And check that out that it's gonna feel like it's
Speaker 8: somebody else's hands.
Speaker 3: Here's here's what I would like.
Speaker 6: I would like a woman to stand across the room.
Speaker 2: I must I must also be clear, by the ways.
Speaker 2: So I looked up the handy too, and I just
Speaker 2: want to be clear. There are two SKUs. And there
Speaker 2: is the standard, which is one hour of battery life
Speaker 2: save sixty dollars launch price, and it's regularly two hundred
Speaker 2: and niney nine dollars. And then there's the five hours
Speaker 2: of battery.
Speaker 11: Oh, the cooner package.
Speaker 2: Yeah, three hundred and seventy nine dollars down four hundred
Speaker 2: and ninety nine. And you scroll out and it's like,
Speaker 2: we recommend the FoST charger handy, And I just got
Speaker 2: to ask how much you? How much you doing that? Yeah? Well,
Speaker 2: he purchased the award winning VR compatible Automatic stroker. Think,
Speaker 2: but isn't the isn't.
Speaker 3: The point of it V? It's VR.
Speaker 2: Come on, I mean, you're watching the poeos and all that,
Speaker 2: But but isn't the.
Speaker 6: Point of the device that it's supposed to be very fast,
Speaker 6: supposed to make you come fast?
Speaker 2: Really?
Speaker 3: I would think so.
Speaker 1: They should put it three four hours of battery life.
Speaker 12: Yeah, I know, I just they should use like most
Speaker 12: of that battery life for a little screen where you
Speaker 12: can watch some porn on it while you're gone.
Speaker 2: It's just really like people that don't have sex or
Speaker 2: jack off. It sounds like it's just like the least
Speaker 2: sexless people.
Speaker 8: I would love to know that the man who is
Speaker 8: horny enough to want to use the jack off machine,
Speaker 8: but so dedicated to tech that when he goes to
Speaker 8: pick up his jack off machine and the battery is dead,
Speaker 8: he goes, I have to put it on my fast
Speaker 8: charger now and wait for seven minutes for to give
Speaker 8: up battery life to make.
Speaker 2: Me come to thing his fo like sonic a hedgehog
Speaker 2: sitting on.
Speaker 1: His hands, being like, there's no other way to do this?
Speaker 2: Does this ever happened to you? It's just I must
Speaker 2: be This is a sex positive podcast. It's great, sex wonderful.
Speaker 2: It's a great thing between consenting adults and wife fu tubes,
Speaker 2: I guess. And it's just very strange to look at
Speaker 2: another product on the show is just like an alien
Speaker 2: made this, Like what what do you need? You can't
Speaker 2: jack off? I guess, or you really want to. And
Speaker 2: also I just feel like just there's a masturbata that's
Speaker 2: a great thing to say. I just feel like picking
Speaker 2: this thing up, I would just be consumed with shame immediately.
Speaker 2: The only thing would make me more ashamed would be
Speaker 2: if it was out of battery. Mm hmm, you're like, fuck,
Speaker 2: I've used it. Yeah, just like I'm too into this.
Speaker 6: See now, this this is my pet peeve because I
Speaker 6: think when you see be consumed with the shame, you're
Speaker 6: ashamed of your own sexuality. Yet that's what's happening, is
Speaker 6: you as you are a shamed the idea of masturbating
Speaker 6: with a device.
Speaker 2: Why why Because my hands can do it perfectly fine,
Speaker 2: that's I can have.
Speaker 3: Why shame?
Speaker 2: Why?
Speaker 1: Why shame?
Speaker 8: Why not?
Speaker 1: Why not amusement? If your hands can do it perfectly fine,
Speaker 1: Like I just.
Speaker 2: Well already we're in this weird world where I wouldn't
Speaker 2: buy it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Like so it's just would you feel a shamed
Speaker 1: not not a shame?
Speaker 8: Would you feel shame if you picked up a flash
Speaker 8: light if you were going to use a flash light?
Speaker 1: Or is the machine worse? No, I just feel the
Speaker 1: machine laughing at you.
Speaker 11: I just have never seen this.
Speaker 2: We're now going on the show, or just that one's like,
Speaker 2: how does that jack off? It's just like the idea
Speaker 2: of the unnecessary. To me, I don't like something else.
Speaker 6: That's because maybe the male sex toy is not a
Speaker 6: jerk off device, because we can do that perfect. The
Speaker 6: real male sex toy is a butt plug, and men
Speaker 6: won't buy them. That's it's prostate stimulation.
Speaker 11: Yeah, that is you know if you like that, that's
Speaker 11: fucking cool.
Speaker 2: I like, my problem isn't And you know what, maybe
Speaker 2: as a guy who just like he's like a sex
Speaker 2: guy and he likes all the different kinds, Fine, that
Speaker 2: sounds fine. I just think like if I got a
Speaker 2: machine that was out of batteries for jacket off and
Speaker 2: it was unpowdered, be like, I've been doing this a lot,
Speaker 2: haven't I do?
Speaker 12: The do the sex toys have big useless numbers too?
Speaker 12: Oh god, I wonder if you haven't been coming lately.
Speaker 3: You haven't you come?
Speaker 1: Wait and see.
Speaker 8: The distance of time between when you begin to jack off.
Speaker 2: It's like a little prompter you okay, you haven't.
Speaker 1: And when you are off the baseline that.
Speaker 2: Is when you I'm actually looking out to see if
Speaker 2: there's any metrics that come discrete delivery, I.
Speaker 11: Mean discreet delivery.
Speaker 10: One nice.
Speaker 6: What if what if withings made a sex toy and
Speaker 6: then it tracked your you know what I mean, it
Speaker 6: gave you some stats.
Speaker 3: The gooners might like that some jerk off so.
Speaker 2: What yeah, like, oh, how about like a special watch for.
Speaker 3: Jerking on off that like Matt, you know, they have
Speaker 3: like a stat line. It lets you know how efficient
Speaker 3: you're being and.
Speaker 1: How much time you spend, like you know, how on treadmills.
Speaker 8: You can follow the little workouts where it like shows
Speaker 8: it it's like it's gonna get faster now, and then
Speaker 8: the treadmill goes faster, you have to run faster, and
Speaker 8: then it's like now it's slower. If you're if you
Speaker 8: had a little like if you had a little gooning
Speaker 8: workout line where it could be like go faster now,
Speaker 8: and then it's like slow down, so down, sow down,
Speaker 8: sow down, and you like follow your little workouts.
Speaker 4: I mean.
Speaker 3: You're describing joy videos.
Speaker 2: I just want to read something.
Speaker 3: It's a really good form of video porn.
Speaker 6: I think those are like it's very kind of wholesome
Speaker 6: because it's sort of like I want someone.
Speaker 11: To instruct there's a relations there's.
Speaker 3: A relationship about the jerking off.
Speaker 2: I just want to be clear. There is a button
Speaker 2: on this website to lead you to various videos. It
Speaker 2: says explore the handy verse and handy verse. I don't
Speaker 2: feel great having read that.
Speaker 8: The greatest sin that Mark Zuckerberg has committed on the
Speaker 8: phase of this planet.
Speaker 1: He's giving us blank verse. We got that done. I'm close.
Speaker 11: We got the handy verse with sixty nine.
Speaker 2: What actually, oddly, like, what is handy feeling? There's like
Speaker 2: a whole thing and I'm like coming around to this,
Speaker 2: like this isn't for me, but I'm like, okay, if
Speaker 2: someone's a real beat offerer, like this is quite nice.
Speaker 3: I don't know.
Speaker 6: The reason I feel shame is because I feel like
Speaker 6: we're falling for it because this is a gag product.
Speaker 3: We're talking about it.
Speaker 2: No, this is real. This is just like a real
Speaker 2: thing that charge in frint.
Speaker 3: It exists, but I don't think it serves it's to
Speaker 3: laugh at it. Cees and devices know if I agree.
Speaker 2: Like, here's the thing. Woman sex toys very well documented
Speaker 2: and used and talked about quite.
Speaker 1: You've seen pictures of them, yeah, very.
Speaker 2: Also like women discussed them. I feel like, Adam, You're
Speaker 2: like one of the only men I've talked to about
Speaker 2: sex who's just not immediately Yeah, I've had it like
Speaker 2: one million times, but I can't discuss it at all. Yeah,
Speaker 2: but it's like I believe that, like, there are men
Speaker 2: who jack off in this man, I'm good on them
Speaker 2: as long as it's like normal and consensual, and like.
Speaker 3: I could be wrong. I just don't believe in this product.
Speaker 3: I believe in sex toys for men.
Speaker 6: I believe they're underrepresented a category, but I believe where
Speaker 6: this product is situated in the hall and the way
Speaker 6: that they have designed it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yes, Okay.
Speaker 11: The only one I saw was the love Sense one,
Speaker 11: which was the vibrators. I was like, okay, I saw
Speaker 11: that last year also, so I was like, okay, that's
Speaker 11: the one I know.
Speaker 6: It's in the Eureka Hall and it's sort of position
Speaker 6: it's like meant to make you laugh. And I think
Speaker 6: it's a five hundred dollars back big.
Speaker 2: But was it a big it was it a big booth?
Speaker 3: They had a big booth, then that's a real company.
Speaker 1: Because well, look, men called it big, women call it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's just a regular size nice. Yeah, but that's
Speaker 2: the thing. If they have a regular sized booth.
Speaker 1: It's a perfectly normal sized booth.
Speaker 2: It's a good get biga during the show, if like
Speaker 2: that's a real company, because otherwise it's just like, yeah,
Speaker 2: we've one hundred thousand dollars in the jack Off booth.
Speaker 2: I do, I do? Let the idea has spoken of,
Speaker 2: I can have a goat.
Speaker 1: Hey, come on over to the jack Off booth.
Speaker 11: Come in, Uh, everyway, both anyway in the booth for you.
Speaker 2: We're going to segue away from this, right.
Speaker 8: Here's a question that is sort of off of this theme.
Speaker 8: As a Cees virgin.
Speaker 1: Right not to really lean into this kind of language.
Speaker 8: Uh, how many of these products, Like, there are a
Speaker 8: lot of products that seemed absolutely fucking useless. Yes, And
Speaker 8: what I don't know is how many of the people
Speaker 8: who are here earnestly believe that what they are hawking
Speaker 8: is going to make the world better in some way,
Speaker 8: and how many people like what what is the percentage
Speaker 8: split between earnest believers?
Speaker 1: Uh, people who are here for.
Speaker 8: A paycheck because they need a job and this happens
Speaker 8: to be the job they're doing, and people who are
Speaker 8: totally disillusioned but are still doing it for the paycheck,
Speaker 8: but like, are are totally jaded?
Speaker 1: I would be curious.
Speaker 2: I think what it is is like you get a job.
Speaker 2: It's hard getting a job, and you get the product,
Speaker 2: and it's like, well, I gotta fucking believe in something.
Speaker 2: So you learn the talking points and you're like the
Speaker 2: pillow thing you were talking about last piece, It's like
Speaker 2: that person clearly had never had a conversation with someone
Speaker 2: who's like, yeah, but what if I want to lie
Speaker 2: in bed without falling asleep? Because they've memorize the talking
Speaker 2: points and they've internalize them. I'm sure that there are
Speaker 2: a percentage of cynical people, but I think a lot
Speaker 2: of these people have just like not thought about it
Speaker 2: too much. They're like, yeah, the air purifier with the
Speaker 2: spike on it, the dog scratches itself on. That makes
Speaker 2: perfect sense because I've been forced to believe it because
Speaker 2: this is how I make money. And I think that
Speaker 2: there's something kind of sad about it because you have
Speaker 2: to believe. I mean like there's a certain degree at
Speaker 2: times when you get a product. I don't do consumer electronics,
Speaker 2: but like in the past where I've had to be
Speaker 2: like yay, even go, it's like it's gonna pay mortgage. Like,
Speaker 2: I think that that's a degree of that. And I
Speaker 2: think some people just fucking stupid. I think some people
Speaker 2: are just like, yeah, they said they isn't it cool
Speaker 2: it can do this? And they focus on how cool
Speaker 2: it is. And then when they think two sex and
Speaker 2: they go, oh, fuck, this is one alien would use.
Speaker 2: This is like it's just like stall Trek accept nothing
Speaker 2: like it.
Speaker 3: I think.
Speaker 8: So.
Speaker 3: I also think a lot of them are just happy
Speaker 3: to like do the job.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 6: You know, like when I went to the ORB thing,
Speaker 6: my ORB debacle, all the people I told, well, whatever,
Speaker 6: people know about it or they don't. But when I
Speaker 6: talk to people who work for this horrible product, like
Speaker 6: some of them seemed kind of enthusiastics. Some of them
Speaker 6: sort of had thousand yard stairs yeah, where where I
Speaker 6: was talking and going like, ah, they're making like three
Speaker 6: hundred grand a year probably yeah, working for like a
Speaker 6: sam Altman company doing interesting work. Like they're like they
Speaker 6: wanted to be an engineer. They're a software engineer. They're
Speaker 6: working on something that's tech technically interesting. They would like
Speaker 6: for it to work. They sort of have to drink
Speaker 6: the kool at exactly in the same way that someone
Speaker 6: who's like working on a shitty movie.
Speaker 3: Is like I'm living the drink. All the movie kind
Speaker 3: of sucks, but I'm living the dream.
Speaker 2: But you're gonna be good.
Speaker 3: It's gonna be good. I'm making movies like it's this. Yeah,
Speaker 3: that makes suspension of disbelief.
Speaker 2: But I respect people of movies way more. Like, just
Speaker 2: do want to be clear, Like learning about how movies
Speaker 2: are made. Recently, it's insane a single movie has ever
Speaker 2: been made. Yeah, I do not understand how any movie
Speaker 2: is made.
Speaker 3: Well they're not made anymore.
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, that's that's also the other thing. No, they're
Speaker 2: either one hundred million dollars or one million dollars.
Speaker 6: The movies when you watch movies now, like I you know,
Speaker 6: I was watching like Rob Ryner movies because he passed away,
Speaker 6: of course, and watched like Harry Met Salary another movie
Speaker 6: like that. It's like walking through like the ruins of
Speaker 6: like a Roman Colisseum in the Dark Age is like
Speaker 6: look at what humans.
Speaker 2: Used to be able to do, Like it's and then
Speaker 2: you watch Stranger Things and there's a big crab and
Speaker 2: win on a Ryder punches it to death. You just
Speaker 2: I don't watch that show strange enough already and it's
Speaker 2: just sad. But I think I think movies are gonna be. Okay,
Speaker 2: I'm choosing to be optimistic for no reason.
Speaker 8: Yeah, yeah, I mean that's a sort of a whole
Speaker 8: separate yet whole other conversation. But I do think that
Speaker 8: there's a lot of people who would say, like the
Speaker 8: same people who are who are who.
Speaker 1: See movies as sort of the dinosaurs, the things of
Speaker 1: the past.
Speaker 8: Are the people who see a lot of shit at CST,
Speaker 8: who sort of willingly drink the kool aid of a
Speaker 8: lot of the shit at CEES and are like, this
Speaker 8: is the stuff of the future without actually even being
Speaker 8: paid three hundred.
Speaker 2: Thousand dollars by the company because they want to be first.
Speaker 8: They want to, but they sort of have gotten on
Speaker 8: the roller coaster of they're addicted to the high of
Speaker 8: u the possibility of success, the newness.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 6: I mean, I remember when it was over ten years
Speaker 6: ago now, but I was working at College Humor and
Speaker 6: stuff like Google Glass would come out and.
Speaker 3: My coworkers would be like, it's it's gonna be.
Speaker 6: The future and just based on the premise alone, and
Speaker 6: I have to be like I don't think so, yeah's right,
Speaker 6: same thing happened with the VR.
Speaker 8: You know you wait, Adam, Google Glass is coming, ray
Speaker 8: Ban Meta glasses.
Speaker 6: People were so they had the script in them for
Speaker 6: I think, you know, and they want it to be true.
Speaker 6: They just want something new that's gonna be fun.
Speaker 12: I also, I'd be curious what you think, because you
Speaker 12: know you've been coming to see us for a while.
Speaker 12: How much of it is Also people at a firm
Speaker 12: that tried to sell something to another business and it failed,
Speaker 12: and now they're doing consumer because I feel like I
Speaker 12: would talk to some people, especially in Eureka Park, and
Speaker 12: they wouldn't say it, but you could hear in the
Speaker 12: conversation that there was a much more ambitious plan and
Speaker 12: that fell through, and now they're winning to something else
Speaker 12: that a consumer might be able to use.
Speaker 2: It's the raw economy, baby, It's growth of all costs.
Speaker 2: Because if you solve a small, boring problem for a
Speaker 2: million people, that fucking rocks, is that gonna be worth
Speaker 2: ten billion dollars new you're gonna be able to take
Speaker 2: that public? No, you can sell it to enough company. No,
Speaker 2: But if you say I'm gonna solve fucking everything, forever
Speaker 2: you get hundreds of millions of dollars because you've just
Speaker 2: over promised and being part of this newness futuristic thing
Speaker 2: and vaguely attaching yourself to it. If you're wrong, you
Speaker 2: can say, oh, it is experimental. If you're right, you
Speaker 2: can say I was fissed.
Speaker 8: Yeah. But and that's sort of to what Adam was
Speaker 8: saying about, you know, wanting it's my language now, like
Speaker 8: wanting the possibility of success addicted to the high of
Speaker 8: that possibility. But everyone you were saying, I think you're
Speaker 8: saying like the U when you're saying that they had
Speaker 8: a more ambitious plan. Do you mean they had a
Speaker 8: more ambitious plan for what the tech itself could be
Speaker 8: capable of or do you mean like they've had They've
Speaker 8: figured out a tech that is capable of whatever it is,
Speaker 8: and the ambitious plan was to use it in a
Speaker 8: much broader use case or a much higher scale use case.
Speaker 8: And now they've sort of been like shunted down to
Speaker 8: a bof a ces where they're trying to make somebody
Speaker 8: pay six hundred dollars.
Speaker 12: It feels like they thought the idea was worth ten
Speaker 12: x what it actually is. An example, I mean, I
Speaker 12: saw it a lot more last year where it would
Speaker 12: be people talking about tech that would be that's helpful
Speaker 12: assistive tech, but their initial formulation of it seemed to
Speaker 12: be we are going to apply this at scale and
Speaker 12: workplaces to augment your.
Speaker 2: Productive for like standing up the thing for opening the
Speaker 2: cash rep.
Speaker 12: Right, you know, something like that, where it's like not
Speaker 12: even really clear that would be adopted at an individual scale.
Speaker 2: Well, so that one really pissed me off because it's like,
Speaker 2: you don't give a fuck about anyone, you don't love
Speaker 2: them in the eye, No, you were excited about touching
Speaker 2: a screen towards it treats you little.
Speaker 5: You know.
Speaker 12: It feels like it's like we wanted to sell this
Speaker 12: ad scale to like McDonald's at a bunch of other
Speaker 12: fast food restaurants, and that didn't work. So now we
Speaker 12: are cobbling together some of the IP to figure out
Speaker 12: another approach that might be usable in smaller UH settings.
Speaker 12: And I feel like, you know, when I talk with people,
Speaker 12: especially in some of the assistive tech, you know, where
Speaker 12: they're not really talking about it in the way of
Speaker 12: we're helping people who are disabled or helping people who
Speaker 12: need mobility it's it's it's it's almost adjacent to or
Speaker 12: sounding just like how we talk about convenience.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, did you see anything today that was
Speaker 2: of note?
Speaker 12: Like I mean, most of the stuff that I saw
Speaker 12: today in Eureka Park wash more misuse of agentic language
Speaker 12: and saying oh no, let's you know what if you
Speaker 12: had a chat bought that you know, managed your home
Speaker 12: Google calendar and told you when to pick up your
Speaker 12: kids because you forgot, or you know, when we got
Speaker 12: because you don't give us ship. You know what, if
Speaker 12: you have something, I would look at your ship and
Speaker 12: tell you when you're sick or not sick.
Speaker 1: You mean literally your poop?
Speaker 11: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah no literally, yeah, you poop.
Speaker 2: That was one thing that Victoria. We didn't get to
Speaker 2: the piss poop. We go to the com sadly, but
Speaker 2: it was like there's a many different toilet measures. Now.
Speaker 3: Yeah, oh I saw a good product, yes, and I
Speaker 3: would describe it. I walked I saw this product, I
Speaker 3: looked at I immediately recognized what it was. I walked
Speaker 3: up to them.
Speaker 6: I said, fit Bit for your cat, and they said,
Speaker 6: that's what you know, fit Bit for your cat. You're
Speaker 6: going to sell that, and it's like a little food dish,
Speaker 6: food dish and a bubbler for your and then it like,
Speaker 6: I don't know, has some stats about your cat, and
Speaker 6: it said like here's how much food is left, here's
Speaker 6: the temperature of your cat, and then it just said healthy.
Speaker 3: Yes, and that's it's like, really, all the cat owners what.
Speaker 6: It's like, Well, could it could the box say my
Speaker 6: cat's healthy and it'll relieve my anxiety and.
Speaker 2: Your cat owner, yes, I have, I don't know, like
Speaker 2: and it's the only measurement is like how beautiful they
Speaker 2: are like that, which I remind them of constantly. I
Speaker 2: just how holt my cat is is very funny.
Speaker 11: Yeah, I got two cats.
Speaker 12: And it's like when I learned I got a I
Speaker 12: got one of the letter boxes, those automatic ones. When
Speaker 12: I learned there was an app, I asked them, can
Speaker 12: I do.
Speaker 9: I need app? Can I delete that?
Speaker 11: They're like yes, And I was like, okay, I will
Speaker 11: never look at this ship again. Yeah, And it works out.
Speaker 12: You know that anything that even wears other or has
Speaker 12: a little motor other than.
Speaker 9: The litter box, they destroy. They swat it, they throw.
Speaker 12: It down the stairs, they push it, they literally catch it.
Speaker 12: To the stairs and throw it down, so I can't
Speaker 12: get anything smart for them.
Speaker 2: I get a fit bit for a dog, though, because
Speaker 2: you like woke them. I would love to, actually, just
Speaker 2: for my sick pleasure, know how fast Barbo runs because
Speaker 2: him and his sister Pokey too bad. But no, they
Speaker 2: just they will be sleeping all day and then just
Speaker 2: run into bam, just fucking like across the entire house,
Speaker 2: gone back.
Speaker 1: They're trying to get their steps in exactly like just.
Speaker 2: Cats like don't experience the same things that human being, Like,
Speaker 2: they're not seeing that being, Like do I run around
Speaker 2: a lot? They get the instinct like I need to
Speaker 2: fucking run so fast in a straight line, fast than
Speaker 2: I've ever But it's not because they're like I need
Speaker 2: to be healthy. They just fucking cat Stop trying to
Speaker 2: optimize my cat. Bro, My cats. Cats are not optimal
Speaker 2: other than how beautiful and fancy they are and how
Speaker 2: beautiful I miss them, anything else, like it's just this.
Speaker 2: You're gonna be here for another two days. You're gonna
Speaker 2: see more stuff like this.
Speaker 12: But I'm general I saw something we all need and
Speaker 12: present ads inside of AI. How to put ads inside
Speaker 12: of chatbots, how to put ads inside of any sort
Speaker 12: of interface or product I might use the genitor of AI.
Speaker 2: It's so cool they haven't worked that out, I know.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: That's also like the most obvious thing that they need
Speaker 2: it the way that they would monetize this fucking thing. Yeah,
Speaker 2: the one way to make the one way that every
Speaker 2: per I get three emails a week from someone being like,
Speaker 2: have you thought that they could put ads in chat jept? Yes, motherfucker,
Speaker 2: I've fucking thought. Every single time you've emailed me about this.
Speaker 2: I've thought about it.
Speaker 1: Do we know why they haven't yet?
Speaker 2: Because it's very hard to guarantee. The whole thing with
Speaker 2: ads is you need to have applicability and reliability and accountability.
Speaker 2: You cannot have your you can't have like an ad
Speaker 2: for a children's thing by someone looking up sex and
Speaker 2: vice versa. And the best example we have that this
Speaker 2: doesn't really work is Perplexity. Their ads chief left a
Speaker 2: few months ago and they made twenty thousand dollars selling
Speaker 2: ads in twenty twenty four.
Speaker 6: Plex They Yeah, I mean the needs of advertisers like
Speaker 6: determine everything.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Like you know, why does YouTube wor the way
Speaker 3: it work? Ninety percent of.
Speaker 6: YouTube is to please advertisers, so to make sure that
Speaker 6: you know, age verification, like content warnings, like all of
Speaker 6: it is just for them and like they'll sort of
Speaker 6: run the show. But also isn't part of the problem
Speaker 6: that like advertising is not enough money for you know,
Speaker 6: the massive amount of investments these companies are taking on, like.
Speaker 3: You put ads and chatgy, but you're saying enough, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 3: it won't sustain trillions.
Speaker 2: Well, the other problem they have is the information and
Speaker 2: a good story about this where it's like nine hundred
Speaker 2: million weekly active US is ish even though Opening Eye
Speaker 2: double counts people all the time. They admit this and
Speaker 2: they're on academic papers, but nevertheless only one hundred million
Speaker 2: if those are in America, which is a large number
Speaker 2: whatever whatever, But that means like they're mostly overseas who
Speaker 2: are lower value advertising plans, because there's a very big
Speaker 2: difference between to advertising someone in America versus in India
Speaker 2: or Indonesia where they release chat gpt go, which is
Speaker 2: the cheaper one, which will inevitably be advertising support it.
Speaker 2: And it's just like I do love that there are
Speaker 2: like different boots of people being like what if we
Speaker 2: could solve the problem the open Ai, Google, Perplexity, and
Speaker 2: multiple other companies just haven't been able to touch. It
Speaker 2: feels like watching the end of the world in a
Speaker 2: very boring way at times.
Speaker 8: Well, so that's what brings me back to my that
Speaker 8: brings me back to my question about how earnestly do
Speaker 8: these people believe in what they're pushing. Like are there
Speaker 8: people who are like, yeah, yeah, yeah, we are the
Speaker 8: we have the secret key, we are the geniuses. And
Speaker 8: sure would I be hired at Google if I was
Speaker 8: really a genius. Maybe, But that's not what we're talking about, right.
Speaker 6: I think that they at the very least considered themselves
Speaker 6: to have be the holder of a lottery ticket. Yeah,
Speaker 6: maybe it'll work. And if it works, I'm a billionaire.
Speaker 6: And if I can convince someone it kind of works,
Speaker 6: maybe I get Aqua hired by Google, and then I
Speaker 6: make half a million dollars yeah, you know, and like,
Speaker 6: and I only have to get to like, you know,
Speaker 6: next month to make that happen.
Speaker 3: I just got to convince some dopeoo's here right now.
Speaker 2: I believe all the TV people believe it fully, and
Speaker 2: I get it. And I'm a big dumb ape. I
Speaker 2: see a giant scream like.
Speaker 6: Yeah, baby, oh yeah, I want to see the TVs
Speaker 6: at this so goo and I got mad because I
Speaker 6: saw I think I was looking at the Vergis coverage
Speaker 6: or something, and there's a new TV technology that's better
Speaker 6: than I MINI bought the best. I bought the I
Speaker 6: bought the you know the one, the one really good
Speaker 6: Sony one. I got the really good Sony. I'm like,
Speaker 6: I don't want a fucking better TV. This is as
Speaker 6: good as TV's need to be. Seventy seven inches, it's
Speaker 6: true black.
Speaker 2: Stop.
Speaker 1: I don't know.
Speaker 2: Just to be clear, you'll you'll find they haven't really
Speaker 2: made better than that.
Speaker 3: Like I know it'll be in ten years. I'm still
Speaker 3: just like, stop it.
Speaker 1: I don't know if you're gonna have kids.
Speaker 8: But I've heard a couple of dad sentences, both in
Speaker 8: this TV discussion and earlier when you were like, now
Speaker 8: I saw a good product.
Speaker 6: I'm oh yeah, but I was able to buy this
Speaker 6: TV because I'm not as price sensitive as a real dad,
Speaker 6: because I don't have the kids.
Speaker 3: That's why I got to get the get the get
Speaker 3: the good one.
Speaker 2: And it's like, as a child have a that's the
Speaker 2: normal way to say it, Like big screen, big Screen's fine.
Speaker 2: It's like, you got a big screen, that's the coolest
Speaker 2: thing to shoot, big screen, giant screen, to play Minecraft
Speaker 2: on your fucking best father in the world.
Speaker 12: Two so you can both play it in separate rooms,
Speaker 12: so you don't have to talk to me exactly what
Speaker 12: they want.
Speaker 2: One of the most cherish things is watching my son
Speaker 2: play Minecraft explaining shiit to me. But we're not talking
Speaker 2: about a normal thing. We're talking about what the consumer
Speaker 2: wants separate themselves.
Speaker 8: We're talking about what that guy who did the tweet
Speaker 8: about how he gets boiling mad if he spends more
Speaker 8: than ten minutes with children.
Speaker 1: Did you see this?
Speaker 8: There's some dad was like, am I normal? If I
Speaker 8: spend more than ten minutes? Was it day with my children?
Speaker 2: Day?
Speaker 1: My blood boils? That's normal?
Speaker 2: Right?
Speaker 8: But everybody was like, hey, buddy, that's not totally normal.
Speaker 8: But like, we totally get it. Being a dad is hard.
Speaker 2: You're a balance, you know, for that is, but not
Speaker 2: like ten minutes should not because you can you have
Speaker 2: a lot more of those in the day with the
Speaker 2: child than that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, it seems like this guy doesn't have to.
Speaker 6: But it reminds me of when when you know, the
Speaker 6: COVID lockdown first happened, and all the parents and the
Speaker 6: ones on the internet were suddenly like.
Speaker 3: Someone needs to help me from being around my kid.
Speaker 3: I thought you liked having the kids.
Speaker 6: Now you're mad that you got to be around the kids.
Speaker 6: Why do you Why do you have the kid if
Speaker 6: you don't want to be around them. And it also
Speaker 6: makes you realize that like, oh yeah, the main purpose
Speaker 6: of school was not education. It was just childcare so
Speaker 6: people could go to work. That's why they're complaining. They're like,
Speaker 6: I need to go to work.
Speaker 3: Well, that's You've just revealed a fucked up thing about
Speaker 3: school and parenting all at once. I actually think that's
Speaker 3: the lens. I'm going to go through everything tomorrow.
Speaker 2: I'm just going to look around the exposent to being like, okay,
Speaker 2: what's the shoot where it's just people like I need
Speaker 2: to get away from my obligations, like I made these
Speaker 2: fucking decisions throughout my life. I got a fucking fast,
Speaker 2: unhealthy bitch of a cat I got.
Speaker 1: We were all waiting on what that last word was
Speaker 1: gonna be.
Speaker 3: There some options.
Speaker 1: It's like cat okay. He's saying cat okay.
Speaker 2: So I wasn't referring to any of my perfect fucking angels,
Speaker 2: but it's like these people were just like, Okay, I
Speaker 2: need to find it if my cat's healthy, because I
Speaker 2: don't want to look at it or use it. Can
Speaker 2: I keep my child in the separate room? Can I
Speaker 2: give it an action figure that can go a.
Speaker 11: Robot and an action figure that will talk to each other.
Speaker 2: And and also if you want any of these things,
Speaker 2: don't worry. They don't fucking work. They don't even do
Speaker 2: the thing that we're promising you. But it's funny. Just
Speaker 2: imagine this guy is walking and being like, please get
Speaker 2: me away from all this. Can this is the robot
Speaker 2: gonna be Oh, the robot's gonna fall over. It's falling over.
Speaker 2: It's gonna kick me in the nuts. Do you see
Speaker 2: that video the guy just getting fucking hoofed in the
Speaker 2: nuts by That was great. If you've got a bootho
Speaker 2: guy's being kicked in the balls, I don't care what
Speaker 2: you're selling me, fucking Lockheed mouth.
Speaker 6: I mean, so that made me kind of sad. Like
Speaker 6: there was one that was I don't want to say
Speaker 6: the name of it because it did make me sad,
Speaker 6: but it was a little It was like a little toy,
Speaker 6: like a little Hello Kitty type toy, and.
Speaker 3: It was, you know, you could talk to it.
Speaker 1: Was it the one that was like the future of
Speaker 1: robot Friend.
Speaker 3: Something like that. It was a funny.
Speaker 6: It was also like it'll watch everything that you do
Speaker 6: and remember it. And I was like all right, and
Speaker 6: I and I walked up and I was like, oh right,
Speaker 6: what was it doing here?
Speaker 2: It is?
Speaker 3: I was like, oh, can I talk to it? And
Speaker 3: she was like no, you know, the Wi Fi is
Speaker 3: in here.
Speaker 6: In here is bad and it uses chat GPT, so
Speaker 6: it can't connect to chat GPT right now. And I'm like,
Speaker 6: this is just some somebody put like a couple hundred
Speaker 6: grand of their own money into like a little doll
Speaker 6: that connects to the Chat GPT API and is here
Speaker 6: thinking that's anything, like like, why would we want such
Speaker 6: a thing? Why would anybody here be excited by just
Speaker 6: a front end to chat GPT a product that already exists.
Speaker 2: But that's the thing I think. I feel like, as
Speaker 2: we're rapids a good way to put it. It's like
Speaker 2: there are two there are two real cons with AI.
Speaker 2: There's the con of the consumer being told it will
Speaker 2: do this for you, that for you'll be a personal assistant.
Speaker 2: And then there's for companies that are like, yeah, if
Speaker 2: we put chat GPT in this, it'll be smart. No, motherfucker,
Speaker 2: he's not gonna do that at all. And it's like
Speaker 2: it's you don't want to name the company, which is fine,
Speaker 2: but it's like there are so many that were there
Speaker 2: last year as well. It's like, oh, it's an agent.
Speaker 2: It's like it's just a fucking chat bot and you've
Speaker 2: poorly trained it and it's like gonna tell you that
Speaker 2: Taiwan is part of China or like BDSM shit like,
Speaker 2: and it's just quite sad. It's like everyone is being
Speaker 2: conned by these companies. Yeah, both the consumer and the
Speaker 2: companies themselves. I can't wait to catalog them. I'm looking
Speaker 2: forward to watching the sadness. But it's just it's it
Speaker 2: is quite sad. I'm so glad I'm here a week.
Speaker 2: This is great, my dark my joker, Like it's a shrug.
Speaker 3: It's a shrug economy. Like everyone just sort of hoping.
Speaker 6: Like I was talking to people about the Disney open
Speaker 6: a ideal because that's like a bunch of people in Hollywood. Yeah,
Speaker 6: like freaked out about it, especially writers who are worried
Speaker 6: about IP and stuff like that.
Speaker 3: But like my take on if you look at the
Speaker 3: deal is nobody even knows why they're doing it.
Speaker 6: Yeah, Like open Ai has the idea that, like, we
Speaker 6: need licensed characters for Sora, and Disney just doesn't want
Speaker 6: to be left out. Yeah, but like they think, they
Speaker 6: appear to think maybe it's marketing for Disney. Plus open
Speaker 6: Ai has some idea maybe people will want to create
Speaker 6: scenes of Deadpool hanging out with Elsa or whatever.
Speaker 3: How does that result in money? Question mark? Nobody knows.
Speaker 6: Yeah, it loses money, But like Disney is just like
Speaker 6: not getting left out of a thing. That's maybe the future.
Speaker 6: Open Ai is making a deal that makes their business
Speaker 6: look better to whoever the fuck is gonna give them
Speaker 6: money next, and they didn't even pay Disney for it.
Speaker 2: Like they're doing a licensing deal where they pay Disney
Speaker 2: in open Ai stock, which Disney already bought more of,
Speaker 2: and in fact, Disney has the option to buy more stock.
Speaker 2: It's just you gotta wonder what happens when open Ai collapses,
Speaker 2: because he's gonna fucking help. And it's just like these
Speaker 2: companies will change to the Chinese models, I guess, or
Speaker 2: what remains of anthwer It's.
Speaker 11: Just everyone can use quin.
Speaker 2: Yeah, the quick Kimmy took too deep sea.
Speaker 3: Gotta be fine.
Speaker 2: Well, all right, I'm gonna wrap it there so I
Speaker 2: don't just launch into a rant about AI as per
Speaker 2: fucking usual. Thank you so much. We've got the core
Speaker 2: three here. It's gonna be joining us the next day
Speaker 2: or two. It's gonna be wonderful. Thank you so much
Speaker 2: for traveling in with us. We're gonna end the episode
Speaker 2: as we have, dedicated to Sean Paul. He's a wonderful fella.
Speaker 2: Came in twenty twenty. Donate to the Pediatric Epilepsy Research Consortium.
Speaker 2: Link will be in there, dedicated to his son. Thank
Speaker 2: you so much everyone for listening. We'll be back tomorrow.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much. Thank you for listening to Better Offline.
Speaker 2: The editor and composer of the Better Offline theme song
Speaker 2: is Matasowski. You can check out more of his music
Speaker 2: and audio projects and MATTASAUSK M A T T O
Speaker 2: S O W s KI dot com. You can email
Speaker 2: me at easy at better offline dot com or visit
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Speaker 5: Better Offline is a production of cool Zone Media.
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