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Speaker 1: Ron and aian.

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Speaker 2: So you've got to be organized, and I guess that's

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Speaker 2: what I really like to be is But you organized

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Speaker 2: and functional in a shop the Car Doctor create another

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Speaker 2: fault code. Oh, I don't know. Unplug the throttle position sensor,

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Speaker 2: unplugged the cooling temp sensor? Does it set a fault

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Speaker 2: code for that? Is the computer able to be smart

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Speaker 2: enough to see a problem in another area.

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Speaker 3: Welcome to the radio home of ron Anian, the Car Doctor.

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Speaker 3: Since nineteen ninety one, this is where car owners the

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Speaker 3: world overturned to for their definitive opinion on automotive repair.

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Speaker 3: If your mechanics giving you a busy signal, pick up

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Speaker 3: the phone and call in the.

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Speaker 2: Garage doors are open, but I am here to take

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Speaker 2: your call at eight five five five six ninety nine.

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Speaker 1: Hundred and now.

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Speaker 2: Hey, Ronnie, Hey, welcome to the Car Doctor. Just another

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Speaker 2: week of oter repair. We're going to talk about here

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Speaker 2: this week, and thanks for joining us. Busy week in

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Speaker 2: the shop. We did our thing, we survived. I've been here,

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Speaker 2: we are on the weekend and we're talking to you

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Speaker 2: about order repair. That's what the Car Doctor does across

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Speaker 2: all of our affiliates and the podcasters out there and

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Speaker 2: everybody else did streams and the streaming machine is back up.

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Speaker 2: I should thank Tom for that. Tom did a great

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Speaker 2: job getting the streaming machine working. And the technology is

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Speaker 2: ever growing and ever challenging, and we were able to

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Speaker 2: get that fixed. So for those of you out on

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Speaker 2: the stream, we appreciate you being there as well. And

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Speaker 2: you know, welcome aboard. This is the car doctor. Uh yeah,

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Speaker 2: I wanted to start this hour as we're you know,

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Speaker 2: we're in the month of May now, or are we

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Speaker 2: in May? Yeah? This is May, and I want to

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Speaker 2: talk about air conditioning. It's that season, right, it's air

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Speaker 2: conditioning time. We're gonna you know, Memorial Day is a

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Speaker 2: month away or so, right, and we're going to be

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Speaker 2: using air conditioning. And where else would we go? But

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Speaker 2: there are resident in house experts, the folks over at MALA,

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Speaker 2: and we're gonna welcome here today. Isaac Nilsson. He's he's

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Speaker 2: a self professed engineer, he says, Ron, I've never done radio,

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Speaker 2: and I'm nervous as heck. And I already told him

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Speaker 2: he's got a good personality, even for an engineer. So

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Speaker 2: we like them already, and I know you guys will too. Isaac,

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Speaker 2: Welcome to the car Doctor. Happy to have you.

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Speaker 1: Oh thanks for having me.

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Speaker 2: You know, let's talk air conditioning. A little bit of history, right,

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Speaker 2: one thirty four refrigerant, the older refriger well actually R twelve,

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Speaker 2: but we don't need to talk about that. That's long gone.

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Speaker 2: That was phased out in ninety two to ninety three,

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Speaker 2: I think something like that. And you know that's where

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Speaker 2: one thirty four A came in and it's been around

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Speaker 2: oh thirty years or so, and then that went away,

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Speaker 2: and you know, it had its ups and downs. What

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Speaker 2: are your thoughts, you know, what made one thirty four

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Speaker 2: A refrigerant go away? What was the big problem with it?

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Speaker 1: Dno, Well it has much higher ozone depletion ratings than

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Speaker 1: the twelve thirty four YF that is now being used.

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Speaker 1: So that's actually what the EPA is currently evaluating on

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Speaker 1: whether they want to even continue to allow one thirty

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Speaker 1: four A to be used in heavy duty trucks and

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Speaker 1: or some pass cars that are still using that refrigerant.

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Speaker 1: So in you know, the very near future, I believe

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Speaker 1: in October of this year, they're going to make a

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Speaker 1: determination on whether they're going to allow one thirty four

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Speaker 1: A in these vehicles going forward, and it could come

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Speaker 1: as soon as twenty twenty five is when they could

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Speaker 1: outlaw the use on new vehicles. And in the meantime,

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Speaker 1: they're already starting to reduce the amount of one thirty

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Speaker 1: four A that can be produced, so that means prices

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Speaker 1: of one thirty four A are going to start to

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Speaker 1: go up as the supply is not going to be

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Speaker 1: able to meet the demand, and then blended refrigerants are

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Speaker 1: likely to start hitting the market to try to replace

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Speaker 1: the performance of a one thirty four A because obviously

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Speaker 1: you can't retrofit a one thirty four A system to

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Speaker 1: work directly with twelve thirty four YF because of the

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Speaker 1: reduced thermal capacity you know, heat performance of one thirty

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Speaker 1: one thirty four one two three four YF compared to

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Speaker 1: one thirty four A. So they'll be likely some sort

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Speaker 1: of blended gas that will be needed in these post

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty five era vehicles and maybe even retrofitted obviously

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Speaker 1: to the weather one thirty four A, as the one thirty

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Speaker 1: four A is going to be reduced in supply.

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Speaker 2: So what happens, you know, as as an equipment manufacturer,

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Speaker 2: you know how does model respond to that? Does it?

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Speaker 2: You guys still make a great one thirty four A machine?

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Speaker 2: We use it, we have, we have one, We use

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Speaker 2: it in the shop, you know, all the time. It's

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Speaker 2: a great machine. Does that mean that machine goes away

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Speaker 2: and it becomes something else? How does that affect that machine?

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Speaker 2: Can we use blended gas in a one thirty four

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Speaker 2: machine that wasn't designed for the guess? Or we don't

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Speaker 2: have that answer yet because we don't know what gas

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Speaker 2: is going to be used.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so we're currently evaluating that right now. We're working

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Speaker 1: with various chemical manufacturers on their potential replacement offering. And

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Speaker 1: what that would really mean is that we would probably

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Speaker 1: have to retrofit refrigerant identifiers into one thirty four A machines.

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Speaker 1: So there's some equipment out there that has refriger identifiers already.

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Speaker 1: You know, you want to avoid you know, contaminating that

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Speaker 1: your gas in that, you know, your tank. You don't

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Speaker 1: want to recover someone who might have put you know,

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Speaker 1: back in the day, putting pro paine or something else

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Speaker 1: like that as a replacement refrigerant. You don't want to

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Speaker 1: contaminate that. And so likely we will have to offer

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Speaker 1: retrofit kits to off. You have an identifier to identify

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Speaker 1: these blended gases from the one thirty four A, so

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Speaker 1: you know exactly what you're recovering and then what you're

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Speaker 1: going to be charging into the vehicle.

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Speaker 2: Obviously, what happens as long as you and you brought

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Speaker 2: it up. I don't know if you realize it, but

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Speaker 2: you know, you hook up your identifier and you find

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Speaker 2: I don't know, an illegal gas in the AC system.

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Speaker 2: Now you don't want to put that into the machine

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Speaker 2: because that contaminates it, right, that's what you're saying. So

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Speaker 2: what do you do with the gas? You don't want

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Speaker 2: to vent it to the atmosphere because that hurts the ozone.

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Speaker 2: Is there such a thing as a and I've heard

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Speaker 2: this from time to time. It's in the work somewhere

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Speaker 2: that a mobile recovery kit like a bag to put

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Speaker 2: on the trader and extract or you know, what do

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Speaker 2: you do? You just can't work on the car?

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Speaker 1: No, No, I mean every shop they should have a

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Speaker 1: recovery only unit of some sorts. So there's a lot

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Speaker 1: of different manufacturers, a lot of different options as far

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Speaker 1: as the recovery only unit. So this is an option

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Speaker 1: to basically just recover the gas to put in a

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Speaker 1: dedicated contaminated tank. And you know this is per the

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Speaker 1: MAX certification process that they you know, they tell you

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Speaker 1: that you need to be doing this, that you need

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Speaker 1: to recover this refrigerant. You know, it could always refuse work,

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Speaker 1: of course, but you know the best thing to do

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Speaker 1: to be able to help the customers remove that contaminated gas,

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Speaker 1: put it in a contaminated tank and then you know,

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Speaker 1: either drop it off or call your local you know,

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Speaker 1: chemical company to properly dispose of that contaminated refrigerant.

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Speaker 2: So so let me, let me, let me dive deeper

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Speaker 2: into this because this is something we've just uncovered here

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Speaker 2: on the Car Doctor. And if you're just tuning in,

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Speaker 2: I'm running any of the Car Doctor. We're talking to

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Speaker 2: Isaac Nielsen from Mala Aftermarket. You know, I've got a

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Speaker 2: Brand X I've got I've got a Mala machine and

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Speaker 2: I've got a Brand X right, I've got two one

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Speaker 2: thirty four machines in the shop. So obviously I would

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Speaker 2: make the older Brand X machine the one thirty four

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Speaker 2: recovery machine for contaminated unknown refrigerant that that doesn't give

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Speaker 2: me the ability to it's not a mobile tank. I

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Speaker 2: would have to get rid of the machine when it

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Speaker 2: gets filled up. So what do you.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so, I mean, if you if you want so,

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Speaker 1: if you wanted to use an older are Ur machine,

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Speaker 1: what you can do is have an external tank. You

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Speaker 1: can buy empty cylinders and then basically you treat that

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Speaker 1: cylinder as a car and then you try to charge

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Speaker 1: that full tank, you know, that external tank from the

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Speaker 1: internal tank, or you could potentially do a complete swap

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Speaker 1: off the tanks. That is also a possibility, But the

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Speaker 1: idea is that you really want to charge an external

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Speaker 1: one because if you try to swap out the tank,

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Speaker 1: there's always going to be a small portion of gas

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Speaker 1: that you're going to escape in the atmosphere, which is

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Speaker 1: definitely not something you want to do.

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Speaker 2: So, I mean, listen, realistic you know conversation. Does the

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Speaker 2: EPA really think and I'm trying to discredit this idea,

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Speaker 2: but do they really think they can regulate this where

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Speaker 2: repair shops or everywhere are going to be willing to

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Speaker 2: send off contaminated unknown refrigerant to a chemical company for recycling.

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Speaker 2: I mean, it can be done, but they've got to

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Speaker 2: be able to. You know, I hope they're looking at

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Speaker 2: this and saying, hey, we're going to make this easy

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Speaker 2: for you guys. You know, maybe it's an Amazon literally,

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Speaker 2: is it an Amazon return? Is it let's call Amazon, Hey,

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Speaker 2: we've got to pick up a refrigerant. Guess like they

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Speaker 2: take back HP takes back toner cartridges, you know, and

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Speaker 2: they pick it up because you know how many shops

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Speaker 2: are just going to put refrigerant out into the atmosphere

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Speaker 2: if they're that worried about it. You know, there's irresponsible

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Speaker 2: ter repair shops. Let's face it. Let's let's be honest,

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Speaker 2: like there's bad in every industry. Do they ever talk

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Speaker 2: about that the consequence or how they're going to organize

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Speaker 2: this or the conversation hasn't gotten that deep yet.

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Speaker 1: It was definitely was a question that was brought up

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Speaker 1: in the last MAX conference with the e p A,

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Speaker 1: and the e p A has acknowledged that, yes, there

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Speaker 1: is uh. The enforcement side of things has been you

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Speaker 1: know that they're limited, right, they're not unlimited funded in

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Speaker 1: what they can go after. You know, I'm that being said.

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Speaker 1: You know, they've had pretty strong handed actions against those

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Speaker 1: that were modifying diesel pickup trucks and skirting emissions. That way,

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Speaker 1: you know, they've pretty much cleaned house from a lot

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Speaker 1: of tuning companies who were skirting emissions. So I wouldn't

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Speaker 1: be surprised if, you know, once they've cracked down on

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Speaker 1: all these shops so that they could very well start

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Speaker 1: having fun to start going after these other shops that

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Speaker 1: didn't register their equipment and or don't have MAX certified

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Speaker 1: personnel and or are venting atmosphere they're not supposed to.

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Speaker 1: So I mean, you do that at your own risk.

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Speaker 4: You know.

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Speaker 1: The the actual finds, you know, can be quite extensive.

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Speaker 1: So that's you know, obviously that's on the shops, right.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Absolutely, Hey, let's let's pull over to take a pause. Isaac.

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Speaker 2: When we come back, I want to touch a little

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Speaker 2: bit about MAX licensing. You can shed some light on that.

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Speaker 2: Maybe we've got a few shops out there that aren't

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Speaker 2: licensed that want to get there now because you can

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Speaker 2: see it's obvious it's it's going to be an absolute necessity.

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Speaker 2: And let's talk a little bit about twelve thirty four.

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Speaker 2: Y if if you have the time, Isac Nielsen Mala

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Speaker 2: after Market, you sit tight. I'm rounning any in the

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Speaker 2: Car Doctor. We'll both be back right after this. Don't

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Speaker 2: go away.

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Speaker 1: The little gto you read.

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Speaker 2: Need advice on how to maintain that classic gto. Ron

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Speaker 2: is the guy eight five five five six zero nine

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Speaker 2: nine zero zero. Here's Ron. Welcome back, listeners running any

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Speaker 2: in the Car Doctor here with Isaac Nielsen of Mala

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Speaker 2: after Market. We're chatting about air conditioning. It's that time

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Speaker 2: of year again, Isaac and we pulled away and took

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Speaker 2: the pause. You know that we were talking about well,

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Speaker 2: MAX Certification number one. Explain to the listeners and they've

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Speaker 2: heard this before, but repetition is always good. What is

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Speaker 2: MAX certification with regard to air conditioning?

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Speaker 1: So MAX certification is the mobile air climate certification process

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Speaker 1: that if you go to max Mobile air Climate dot org.

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Speaker 1: This is pretty much developed as a requirement from EPA

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Speaker 1: that not only does the one thirty four A or

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Speaker 1: twelve thirty four YF machine need to be certified, So

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Speaker 1: there's SAE standards for how these machines need to perform

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Speaker 1: as far as their accuracy and the amount of refrigermant

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Speaker 1: that it needs to contain. You know, it can only

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Speaker 1: can only invent a certain amount of refrigerant per service.

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Speaker 1: So not only is the machine need to be certified

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Speaker 1: per EPA, but also at least one technician at the

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Speaker 1: shop that is handling this equipment needs to be MAX certified.

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Speaker 1: So if anyone who's actually handling refrigerant or working with

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Speaker 1: these machines need to have this MAC certification. And not

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Speaker 1: only that, but the shop that buys this equipment needs

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Speaker 1: to register that equipment with their EPA, their local office

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Speaker 1: as well as which technician is MAC certified. So it

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Speaker 1: is fairly regulated on who should be handling refrigerant and

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Speaker 1: making sure that they are fully qualified to handle that

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Speaker 1: refrigerate in order to minimize the amount of gas that

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Speaker 1: might be vented in the air.

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Speaker 2: So that's now, Is that MAC certification apply to one

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Speaker 2: thirty four A only or is that with new twelve

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Speaker 2: thirty four YF also, Oh.

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Speaker 1: Definitely with twelve thirty four YF. So the twelve thirty

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Speaker 1: four yoff even has even even though it's less ozone

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Speaker 1: depleting than one thirty four A, it actually has more

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Speaker 1: stringent requirements on the accuracy and the amount of refrigerant

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Speaker 1: that it can vent into the atmosphere.

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Speaker 2: Because the typical for the for the book. The typical

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Speaker 2: one thirty four to twelve thirty four YF system, it's

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Speaker 2: you know, if if a one to thirty four vehicle

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Speaker 2: was two pounds, twelve thirty four YF is more efficient,

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Speaker 2: or they've done some things, it's one pounds, right, it's

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Speaker 2: it's it's way less refrigerant in the vehicle.

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Speaker 1: Now, uh, there's possible, but that's only through technology improvements

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Speaker 1: in the system. You know, twelve thirty four YF is

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Speaker 1: actually about twenty to thirty percent less thermally efficient on

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Speaker 1: on the heat transfer that it has. So it's really

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Speaker 1: just due to the compressor design and the HVAC designs

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Speaker 1: of the systems.

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Speaker 2: Is the training for a twelve thirty four YF system

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Speaker 2: that much different than one thirty four A? Still air

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Speaker 2: conditioning is air conditioning. The principles are still the same exactly.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, they're really there are very minimal differences, betwe

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Speaker 1: I mean, the process is nearly one hundred percent the same.

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Speaker 1: You know, the difference between a one thirty four A

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Speaker 1: to a twelve thirty four YF machine, for example, you

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Speaker 1: will see that there's like a fifteen percent pre charge

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Speaker 1: leak test that is performed on a twelve thirty four

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Speaker 1: YF machine that is not performed on a one thirty

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Speaker 1: four A machine by default.

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Speaker 2: Why is that?

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Speaker 1: Well, I mean, the initial spec for one thirty four

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Speaker 1: A machine was just to perform a leak test, and

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Speaker 1: that leak test was done under vacuum. But when the

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Speaker 1: twelve thirty four A twelve thirty four YF standards that

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Speaker 1: the SEE group developed also required to run tests under pressure,

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Speaker 1: which obviously sometimes when you run it under vacuum you

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Speaker 1: may not see a leak that as soon as you

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Speaker 1: apply a pressure, now that seal might expand you know that,

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Speaker 1: and cause a leak. So that's why the twelve thirty

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Speaker 1: four YF now requires you to also run a fifty

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Speaker 1: percent pre charge leak test before you can fully charge

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Speaker 1: the vehicle. So that's one thing.

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Speaker 3: I know.

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Speaker 1: That's a lot of complaints that people have and they've

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Speaker 1: been used to one thirty four A machines that they

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Speaker 1: run a twelve thirty four YF and like, oh, why

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Speaker 1: does this machine take so much longer? It's because it's

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Speaker 1: running a pressure check that the one thirty four eight

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Speaker 1: machines didn't run previously.

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Speaker 2: Well, and I've got to tell you in our closing

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Speaker 2: couple of minutes here Isaac, then they're not using a

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Speaker 2: Mala machine because I've also got a Mala twelve thirty

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Speaker 2: four YF machine. And I've got to tell you the

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Speaker 2: last software update was phenomenal. It's got a progress indicator bar.

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Speaker 2: It tells me exactly what's going on. Everything is clear cut.

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Speaker 2: It's it's you, guys, And I have to give credit here.

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Speaker 2: I got to take the moment and steal the stage

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Speaker 2: that you guys took what was a menial task or

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Speaker 2: a difficult task, and you made it so much easier

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Speaker 2: with the design of the machine. The machine works flawless,

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Speaker 2: and it does because everybody else's twelve thirty four IF

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Speaker 2: machine that I've seen is very it's complicated. You guys

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Speaker 2: made it simple, which is a good thing, it really is,

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Speaker 2: you know, so kudos you did a great job. You know,

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Speaker 2: with regard to that, is there going to be a

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Speaker 2: refrigerant identifier for twelve thirty four YF added to machines

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Speaker 2: by law? You think it'll just be as it sits now,

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Speaker 2: where it's a separate item.

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Speaker 1: No, well, so per ETA requirements that you know defines

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Speaker 1: the SAE spec that all twenty twelve thirty four WIF

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Speaker 1: machines have to follow. Refrigerant identification is a must, right,

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Speaker 1: so every twelve thirty four WIF machine should already have

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Speaker 1: a refriger identifier built in, which is one of the

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Speaker 1: main reasons why twelve thirty four WIF machines cost more

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Speaker 1: than one thirty four A machines, as well as taking

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Speaker 1: a bit longer because it can take a couple of

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Speaker 1: minutes to do a proper REDS.

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Speaker 2: That's part of that is that the clock's going to

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Speaker 2: grab us real quick, in ten seconds or less. We're

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Speaker 2: going the listeners will get more information.

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Speaker 1: They go to a website at pervent solution dot mala

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Speaker 1: mL dot com.

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Speaker 2: Perfectly, Isaac, would you pleasure serve we're going to be

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Speaker 2: back again. I want to talk about other fluid exchanges

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Speaker 2: and services until the next time. I'm mama naming the

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Speaker 2: car Doctor will get back right after this control and

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Speaker 2: we are back. Welcome back to listeners. RNN ending in

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Speaker 2: the car doctor our next caller. I don't know I've

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Speaker 2: answered this email. I tried to talk to him last

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Speaker 2: week on the phone. The technology gods have gotten in

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Speaker 2: the way, so we've made sure that we've got Gene

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Speaker 2: from Maine. I believe it is here on the show today.

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Speaker 2: We want to answer the question and talk to him

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Speaker 2: about his oath, Yukon and the dashboard warning lights Gene

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Speaker 2: or dashboard lights, Geane. Welcome to the car doctor, sir.

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Speaker 2: How can I help you?

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Speaker 4: Oh, thank you very much taking my call.

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Speaker 2: You're welcome. What's going on? What's going on with this truck?

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Speaker 4: Well, all of a sudden, I don't have any dashlights.

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Speaker 4: It happened once before, but they came back. Okay, that

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Speaker 4: was quite long ago. We don't use the Yukon very much.

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Speaker 4: And the battery you get going dead. So after all

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Speaker 4: I finally woke up and put a tender on it,

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Speaker 4: and now the battery doesn't go dead. Oh, we still

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Speaker 4: don't have any dashlights.

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Speaker 2: Okay. And when you say dashlights, just so that we

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Speaker 2: clarify this, this is the illumination. Right, you can't see

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Speaker 2: you if you turn your headlights on in the dark.

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Speaker 2: You're driving in the dark. You have no illumination of

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Speaker 2: the dashboard. You can't see you know, speed, uh, tachometer

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Speaker 2: and so on.

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Speaker 4: Right, that's correct. And it's also in the daytime too.

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Speaker 2: Okay, right, because it has auto headlights. If you have

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Speaker 2: you tried, just for giggles, if you take the headlight switch,

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Speaker 2: if you turned it down to the left right, because

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Speaker 2: it's said at auto right, it's in the auto position.

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Speaker 2: Usually is it that system?

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Speaker 4: This is kind of a unique question because I'm blind,

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Speaker 4: I don't drive, and my friend that drives the yukone

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Speaker 4: for me, it's not here.

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Speaker 2: Right now, okay, So usually that style switch was in

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Speaker 2: the auto position, and just ask him if he turns

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Speaker 2: it down once, usually a warning came up on the

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Speaker 2: dash auto lamps off, and then if he turned it

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Speaker 2: down again, it'll say auto lamps on. I'm just curious

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Speaker 2: does the headlight function work if it has that function?

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Speaker 1: You know.

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Speaker 2: The other question I would have is in the dashboard

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Speaker 2: in the top of the instrument panel to the about

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Speaker 2: from the middle over to the right, just to touch

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Speaker 2: there's a little black bubble which is the sun sensor,

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Speaker 2: the sunload sensor, and that will tell the body compute

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Speaker 2: or hey it's it's it's dark out. Turn on the

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Speaker 2: headlights automatically in auto lamp on position. So just just

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Speaker 2: a couple of questions that test functionality of the of

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Speaker 2: the system to see is it working all right? And

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Speaker 2: then go ahead. The headlights do come on, right, but

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Speaker 2: I just I just want to see do they come

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Speaker 2: on automatically? Just I'm just looking for something here. If

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Speaker 2: he has that answer, the other question I've got is

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Speaker 2: when when the headlights are on, you know, or when

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Speaker 2: we're looking for dashboard illumination, is it just the cluster

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Speaker 2: or is it does this have the steering wheel control buttons?

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Speaker 2: Do the the do the illumination LEDs and the steering

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Speaker 2: wheel controls light up? Do the do the controls or

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Speaker 2: the buttons for the radio and the heater control do

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Speaker 2: they light up? Or have you lost all of it? Okay,

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Speaker 2: all right, because that that tells us one thing or another.

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Speaker 2: If it's just the instrument cluster, but yet it has

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Speaker 2: controls for the radio, heater controls, and the buttons in

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Speaker 2: the steering wheel. If they are lit up they are

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Speaker 2: all on the same illumination fuse, then we know it's

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Speaker 2: not the fuse. That's why I asked that question. All right, Okay, yeah,

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Speaker 2: if they're well, if they're all out, okay, if all

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Speaker 2: the lights are out, all the illumination lights are out,

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Speaker 2: then we're gonna think fuse or power in through the circuit,

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Speaker 2: all right, I had.

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Speaker 4: The radio only has one channel, it doesn't have both channels.

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Speaker 2: Well, okay, yeah, separate issue. That's just that's that's that's

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Speaker 2: likely internal in the radio, you know. But but but

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Speaker 2: ask him to you know, when he when he turns

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Speaker 2: on the headlights, you know, is just is it just

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Speaker 2: we'll call it instrument cluster illumination, so spinnometer, tachometer gages

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Speaker 2: or is it all of the illumination he has no,

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Speaker 2: he has no lighting for heater control, radio dashboard, and

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Speaker 2: the steering wheel buttons. All right, if it's if it's

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Speaker 2: if it's just the instrument cluster that's out. Just the

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Speaker 2: instrument cluster, all right, But everything else functions. He can

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Speaker 2: turn the dimmer switch of the headlight and the other

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Speaker 2: lights and buttons, you know, or the other lights for

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Speaker 2: the buttons, you know, brightens and dims. Then we know

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Speaker 2: the headlight switches functioning. We know we have power, We

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Speaker 2: have a good fuse. Then I'm gonna say we've got

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Speaker 2: a problem with the instrument cluster itself. All right. How

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Speaker 2: they how they how they control voltage to that and

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Speaker 2: that could be at the back circuit board. You know,

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Speaker 2: this could this could be a bad connection at the

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Speaker 2: back of the instrument cluster itself. The fact that it

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Speaker 2: happened once before tells me it's a repetitive problem. Maybe

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Speaker 2: something's corroded and you know, one good bump down the

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Speaker 2: road and all of a sudden it starts working again.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, right, you know those are the those are

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Speaker 2: the things you got to stop and consider. But I

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Speaker 2: need you get me an answer to that question. Is

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Speaker 2: it all of the illumit all the illuminated lights, or

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Speaker 2: just the instrument cluster and defining that, we're going to say,

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Speaker 2: for the sake of our conversation, that spinometer, tachometer gauges,

433
00:24:22,240 --> 00:24:24,720
Speaker 2: that center cluster right in front of you. Is it

434
00:24:24,880 --> 00:24:27,040
Speaker 2: just that that's out. If it's just that that's out

435
00:24:27,400 --> 00:24:31,159
Speaker 2: and everything else functions, then I'm going to say that,

436
00:24:31,960 --> 00:24:35,080
Speaker 2: you know, we've got a good headlights switch, good fuse,

437
00:24:35,920 --> 00:24:38,919
Speaker 2: and they're good, but the problem is in the spinometer

438
00:24:39,280 --> 00:24:44,640
Speaker 2: cluster itself. Makes sense, Yeah, okay.

439
00:24:46,400 --> 00:24:53,680
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'll let you recorded this, so yeah,

440
00:24:53,800 --> 00:24:54,480
Speaker 4: by and.

441
00:24:54,400 --> 00:24:57,240
Speaker 2: By all means, if if he has any questions and

442
00:24:57,280 --> 00:24:58,840
Speaker 2: he wants to give us a call back, you know,

443
00:24:58,880 --> 00:25:01,440
Speaker 2: the number eight five y five five six zero nine

444
00:25:01,520 --> 00:25:03,240
Speaker 2: nine zero zero by all means have him give us

445
00:25:03,240 --> 00:25:04,800
Speaker 2: a call back. We've let to talk to him on air.

446
00:25:04,960 --> 00:25:06,560
Speaker 2: Might take two or three tries to get it out

447
00:25:06,600 --> 00:25:09,639
Speaker 2: of the technology to Maine these days. Maybe it doesn't.

448
00:25:09,720 --> 00:25:12,520
Speaker 2: Maybe it doesn't like you know, technology doesn't like going north.

449
00:25:12,560 --> 00:25:14,560
Speaker 2: I'm not sure what it is. But you know, we're

450
00:25:14,600 --> 00:25:18,760
Speaker 2: we're persistent. We're persistent, persistent if nothing else, you know, Jeane,

451
00:25:18,800 --> 00:25:20,440
Speaker 2: we we want to take care of all of you guys.

452
00:25:20,880 --> 00:25:24,199
Speaker 2: So you know, we're happy to have you here.

453
00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:26,480
Speaker 4: Thank you, Thank you very much.

454
00:25:26,560 --> 00:25:29,080
Speaker 2: You're very welcome. You're very welcome. Sir, you'd be well,

455
00:25:29,080 --> 00:25:31,399
Speaker 2: you have a great rest of the day and we'll

456
00:25:31,480 --> 00:25:34,120
Speaker 2: kind of we'll talk to you again, Yes, sir, you too.

457
00:25:34,680 --> 00:25:38,159
Speaker 2: You know that's what it is, listeners, it's it's it's

458
00:25:38,400 --> 00:25:41,119
Speaker 2: how can you break the technology down? How can you

459
00:25:41,920 --> 00:25:46,439
Speaker 2: recreate that in its shape or form, and you know,

460
00:25:46,560 --> 00:25:49,520
Speaker 2: diagnose it all right. What I'm trying to do with

461
00:25:49,640 --> 00:25:51,960
Speaker 2: Jeans truck is I'm trying to split the system. I'm

462
00:25:51,960 --> 00:25:55,160
Speaker 2: trying to break it up. You know, where's the problem

463
00:25:55,240 --> 00:25:58,080
Speaker 2: most likely to occur, And that's that's how you diagnose something.

464
00:25:58,119 --> 00:26:02,040
Speaker 2: You know, part of a job, part of the job

465
00:26:02,200 --> 00:26:05,560
Speaker 2: of any good mechanic is to get to the middle

466
00:26:05,640 --> 00:26:08,840
Speaker 2: as fast as he can. You know, if there's forty

467
00:26:08,880 --> 00:26:12,160
Speaker 2: diagnostic steps, I don't want to do all forty, All right,

468
00:26:12,440 --> 00:26:14,639
Speaker 2: I can. I just don't want to. There's no need.

469
00:26:15,040 --> 00:26:16,920
Speaker 2: It takes time and it costs money. I want to

470
00:26:16,960 --> 00:26:20,439
Speaker 2: get to twenty as fast as I can. And knowing

471
00:26:20,480 --> 00:26:25,000
Speaker 2: whether or not Genes instrument cluster lights up by itself

472
00:26:25,400 --> 00:26:29,000
Speaker 2: or all of the dashboard area, the instrument cluster, the

473
00:26:29,040 --> 00:26:32,040
Speaker 2: heater control, the radio, the steering wheel, and anything else

474
00:26:32,040 --> 00:26:35,360
Speaker 2: that might normally light up, knowing whether or not they

475
00:26:35,400 --> 00:26:39,000
Speaker 2: work in unison or separately, that will tell us where

476
00:26:39,040 --> 00:26:41,840
Speaker 2: are we already at step two or step twenty or

477
00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:44,960
Speaker 2: step thirty and whatever the diagnostic tree is that we're

478
00:26:44,960 --> 00:26:48,680
Speaker 2: trying to approach. So, you know, just good stuff. And

479
00:26:48,760 --> 00:26:51,200
Speaker 2: you know, again, Gene, I apologize. I can't believe that

480
00:26:51,240 --> 00:26:54,399
Speaker 2: took three calls to you know, but that's what happens. Listen.

481
00:26:54,480 --> 00:26:58,320
Speaker 2: That's technology, right, that's the way it works. Sometimes, you know,

482
00:26:58,359 --> 00:27:00,439
Speaker 2: we just we just can't get through every buddy. And

483
00:27:01,480 --> 00:27:04,399
Speaker 2: you know, we were if nothing else were persistent and

484
00:27:04,440 --> 00:27:06,080
Speaker 2: I give a lot of that credit to Tom. Tom

485
00:27:06,119 --> 00:27:08,719
Speaker 2: does a great job. He had a tough time with that.

486
00:27:08,760 --> 00:27:11,440
Speaker 2: Maybe the electrons didn't want to go north. Did you

487
00:27:11,480 --> 00:27:14,639
Speaker 2: see the article came out recently about the electric truck

488
00:27:15,359 --> 00:27:19,560
Speaker 2: that wanted to go from California to Rock Springs in

489
00:27:19,600 --> 00:27:21,840
Speaker 2: a rivian It was a rivian and the driver an

490
00:27:21,880 --> 00:27:24,680
Speaker 2: electric truck from California went in the hard way. Recently

491
00:27:24,720 --> 00:27:28,240
Speaker 2: that Wyoming's difficult terrain creates challenges to driving electric vehicle there,

492
00:27:28,240 --> 00:27:30,720
Speaker 2: and what works in California doesn't always go as smoothly

493
00:27:31,320 --> 00:27:34,199
Speaker 2: crossing over. It's not just the distance between charging stations.

494
00:27:34,240 --> 00:27:37,159
Speaker 2: There are other factors to consider. And they talk about

495
00:27:37,160 --> 00:27:41,160
Speaker 2: how this vehicle died somewhere in the course of its journey,

496
00:27:41,840 --> 00:27:44,440
Speaker 2: ran out of electricity and they weren't able to find

497
00:27:44,480 --> 00:27:47,600
Speaker 2: charging stations. And you know, make sure you know. I

498
00:27:47,680 --> 00:27:50,320
Speaker 2: read these stories about the evs and the problems people

499
00:27:50,359 --> 00:27:53,520
Speaker 2: are having, and they're all saying the same thing. It's

500
00:27:53,520 --> 00:27:55,280
Speaker 2: funny everybody says the same thing. You know, we've got

501
00:27:55,320 --> 00:27:57,359
Speaker 2: to get more of an infrastructure, we've got to create

502
00:27:57,800 --> 00:28:02,160
Speaker 2: more charging stations, but yet it's just not happening fast enough,

503
00:28:02,160 --> 00:28:04,200
Speaker 2: which it will. I get it. It will, but it's

504
00:28:04,240 --> 00:28:07,879
Speaker 2: not happening yet. And inasmuch that's the problem that we

505
00:28:07,960 --> 00:28:10,399
Speaker 2: need to we need to address if we're going to

506
00:28:10,480 --> 00:28:12,119
Speaker 2: do this, we need to do this one hundred percent.

507
00:28:12,200 --> 00:28:14,960
Speaker 2: You know, it's all or nothing when it comes to

508
00:28:15,040 --> 00:28:17,720
Speaker 2: the electric vehicle future. And right now we're sort of

509
00:28:17,760 --> 00:28:20,240
Speaker 2: stuck somewhere in the middle and we need to do more.

510
00:28:20,320 --> 00:28:23,320
Speaker 2: So just my thoughts, and was an interesting article to read.

511
00:28:23,359 --> 00:28:26,400
Speaker 2: If you google search Rivian Stuck Colorado, I think you'll

512
00:28:26,400 --> 00:28:28,000
Speaker 2: find that if you want to read it yourself. I'm

513
00:28:28,040 --> 00:28:29,800
Speaker 2: Ronning Ady in the car Doctor. Don't go away. I'm

514
00:28:29,840 --> 00:28:42,640
Speaker 2: back right after this. Thanks, Welcome back to listeners. Let

515
00:28:42,640 --> 00:28:45,560
Speaker 2: me respond, Remember last week's show? Was it last week's show?

516
00:28:45,600 --> 00:28:49,320
Speaker 2: The week before? Ken from Vermont, I believe it was

517
00:28:49,400 --> 00:28:51,800
Speaker 2: called and he had a twenty three Ford Maverick, just

518
00:28:51,840 --> 00:28:54,840
Speaker 2: gotten the vehicle brand new, and he was concerned about

519
00:28:54,920 --> 00:28:58,600
Speaker 2: battery maintenance and maintaining the battery. And I misunderstood him. Originally,

520
00:28:58,600 --> 00:29:00,880
Speaker 2: I thought he was speaking about the twelve volt battery

521
00:29:00,960 --> 00:29:04,680
Speaker 2: that powers the computer, which then powers the starter, et cetera.

522
00:29:04,760 --> 00:29:06,880
Speaker 2: But no, he was speaking about the lithium ion battery.

523
00:29:06,880 --> 00:29:07,760
Speaker 2: And I said, you know what, let me do a

524
00:29:07,760 --> 00:29:09,680
Speaker 2: little maintenance, because it was a question I had not

525
00:29:10,040 --> 00:29:12,440
Speaker 2: come across of late, and I hadn't come across the situation.

526
00:29:13,440 --> 00:29:16,480
Speaker 2: So on a hybrid vehicle, on this on the majority

527
00:29:16,480 --> 00:29:20,680
Speaker 2: of hybrid vehicles, research pointed out that first of all,

528
00:29:21,240 --> 00:29:24,480
Speaker 2: there are no real documented cases of a lithium battery.

529
00:29:24,480 --> 00:29:28,040
Speaker 2: They're the battery, the hybrid battery, the hybrid drive battery

530
00:29:29,320 --> 00:29:32,760
Speaker 2: going down. Falling down below limits. It would take, by

531
00:29:32,800 --> 00:29:35,560
Speaker 2: some estimates, anywhere from six to eight months of sitting idle,

532
00:29:35,640 --> 00:29:39,000
Speaker 2: and in some cases some manufacturers set a year. So

533
00:29:39,680 --> 00:29:42,920
Speaker 2: that's not the issue. If it did or if it

534
00:29:42,960 --> 00:29:45,800
Speaker 2: did fall to a minimum, the concern is it can't

535
00:29:45,840 --> 00:29:48,880
Speaker 2: fall below twenty percent, And for it to fall below

536
00:29:48,920 --> 00:29:52,840
Speaker 2: twenty percent, there's likely a major malfunction somewhere in the

537
00:29:52,880 --> 00:29:55,680
Speaker 2: system and it has lit up the dashboard and you know,

538
00:29:55,720 --> 00:29:57,800
Speaker 2: sent a few trouble codes and turned on warning lights

539
00:29:57,800 --> 00:30:02,040
Speaker 2: and so on. So let's let's go to that. So

540
00:30:02,280 --> 00:30:05,600
Speaker 2: you know, if you're out there listening, can you know

541
00:30:05,800 --> 00:30:10,200
Speaker 2: understand that, Yeah, your concerns are, well, they're old school.

542
00:30:10,240 --> 00:30:13,200
Speaker 2: We don't have to think like that, you know, as

543
00:30:13,280 --> 00:30:15,960
Speaker 2: long as it doesn't fall below twenty percent the twelve

544
00:30:16,040 --> 00:30:18,800
Speaker 2: volt battery which is the start battery, but not for

545
00:30:18,880 --> 00:30:21,959
Speaker 2: a starter, because how does a hybrid start. A hybrid

546
00:30:21,960 --> 00:30:24,560
Speaker 2: does not have a starter. A hybrid has a motor

547
00:30:24,600 --> 00:30:26,760
Speaker 2: attached to the backup. There's actually two motors attached to

548
00:30:26,800 --> 00:30:29,440
Speaker 2: the back of it, and at different times one's one's

549
00:30:29,440 --> 00:30:32,360
Speaker 2: a generator, one's a starter, one's putting power into the battery,

550
00:30:32,400 --> 00:30:35,200
Speaker 2: one's driving the wheels, and you know, so on. So

551
00:30:35,360 --> 00:30:38,640
Speaker 2: that twelve vault battery that we would tend to think

552
00:30:38,680 --> 00:30:41,360
Speaker 2: of as a start battery for the starter that it

553
00:30:41,400 --> 00:30:44,400
Speaker 2: doesn't have like a gas engine, like an internal combustion

554
00:30:44,440 --> 00:30:47,320
Speaker 2: engine vehicle, that twelve vault battery, what does it do?

555
00:30:47,520 --> 00:30:50,640
Speaker 2: It powers up the computer, which turns on all the

556
00:30:50,680 --> 00:30:55,120
Speaker 2: actuators and relays and then sends the signal for the

557
00:30:55,320 --> 00:30:58,680
Speaker 2: hybrid drive motor to become a starter to crank the

558
00:30:58,720 --> 00:31:01,840
Speaker 2: internal combustion engine. You want to put a trickle charge

559
00:31:01,880 --> 00:31:04,560
Speaker 2: on that? Sure, you know, I don't know that you

560
00:31:04,600 --> 00:31:08,080
Speaker 2: need to on something so new, you know, I don't

561
00:31:08,120 --> 00:31:09,880
Speaker 2: know that it's gonna matter. Again, it depends on how

562
00:31:09,960 --> 00:31:12,080
Speaker 2: much this vehicle sits. But you could come out with

563
00:31:12,160 --> 00:31:15,120
Speaker 2: you're not going to hurt anything to do that OBD

564
00:31:15,240 --> 00:31:17,280
Speaker 2: two charge port. Remember I said you can plug the

565
00:31:17,280 --> 00:31:22,000
Speaker 2: OBD two dongle using a solar charger. We talked about

566
00:31:22,000 --> 00:31:24,720
Speaker 2: a tablet size solar charger that you could plug into

567
00:31:24,760 --> 00:31:29,400
Speaker 2: the OBED two port and allow that to trickle charge

568
00:31:29,480 --> 00:31:33,400
Speaker 2: or slow charge. The twelve old battery, the traditional what

569
00:31:33,440 --> 00:31:36,280
Speaker 2: we'll call start battery, which is actually that's the wake

570
00:31:36,360 --> 00:31:38,120
Speaker 2: up battery. I like to think of it on a hybrid,

571
00:31:38,760 --> 00:31:40,200
Speaker 2: you know, I would rather say it that way, that

572
00:31:40,280 --> 00:31:43,360
Speaker 2: it is going to wake up all the computers and

573
00:31:43,360 --> 00:31:45,480
Speaker 2: bring everything to life and bring everything online. You want

574
00:31:45,480 --> 00:31:47,120
Speaker 2: to take care of that twelve old battery. Sure, do

575
00:31:47,200 --> 00:31:49,400
Speaker 2: you need to on a twenty three Maverick. I don't

576
00:31:49,440 --> 00:31:52,560
Speaker 2: think so. I don't think it's necessary. But as far

577
00:31:52,760 --> 00:31:56,479
Speaker 2: as the lithium battery and even the nickel metal hydride

578
00:31:56,480 --> 00:31:59,200
Speaker 2: batteries in the hybrids, they don't have that problem. They

579
00:31:59,360 --> 00:32:02,840
Speaker 2: just because you've got to realize in a hybrid, all

580
00:32:02,880 --> 00:32:08,680
Speaker 2: that battery does is drive the vehicle when it is operating.

581
00:32:08,720 --> 00:32:12,160
Speaker 2: There's no computers attached to that, or there's no electrical

582
00:32:12,200 --> 00:32:14,800
Speaker 2: devices attached to that. That's going to drain it down.

583
00:32:14,880 --> 00:32:17,480
Speaker 2: So I just wanted to clarify that for you. You know,

584
00:32:17,480 --> 00:32:19,160
Speaker 2: I said I would do some research and come back

585
00:32:19,160 --> 00:32:21,720
Speaker 2: with an explanation, and that's it. So no need to

586
00:32:21,760 --> 00:32:24,760
Speaker 2: worry about the lithium or the hybrid drive battery on

587
00:32:24,920 --> 00:32:26,960
Speaker 2: a hybrid vehicle. No need to worry about it on

588
00:32:27,040 --> 00:32:29,360
Speaker 2: that twenty three Maverick for sure, anything else that's out

589
00:32:29,400 --> 00:32:32,040
Speaker 2: there really, And you know, again, in my research, it

590
00:32:32,080 --> 00:32:34,600
Speaker 2: did remind me that, you know, a lot of these

591
00:32:34,680 --> 00:32:38,600
Speaker 2: hybrids are overbuilt. I mean, they work really well, you know,

592
00:32:38,720 --> 00:32:40,600
Speaker 2: some of them. Some of the toyotas tend to go

593
00:32:40,680 --> 00:32:43,160
Speaker 2: through the electric water pump or the electric cooling pump

594
00:32:43,680 --> 00:32:46,080
Speaker 2: on a regular basis. But that's okay, that's you know,

595
00:32:46,120 --> 00:32:49,479
Speaker 2: that's like normal maintenance kind of stuff. But you know,

596
00:32:49,520 --> 00:32:51,960
Speaker 2: as a rule, pretty solid vehicles. And I kind of

597
00:32:52,000 --> 00:32:54,800
Speaker 2: think they're the future, really, but you know, what do

598
00:32:54,840 --> 00:32:56,560
Speaker 2: I know? Anyway, Let's see what I know, because I'll

599
00:32:56,560 --> 00:32:58,040
Speaker 2: come back after this and i'll talk to you about

600
00:32:58,040 --> 00:32:59,400
Speaker 2: it a little bit more. I'm running aiding in the

601
00:32:59,400 --> 00:33:14,760
Speaker 2: car doctor. Don't go anyway, I'll be right back. Welcome back, listeners,

602
00:33:14,840 --> 00:33:17,760
Speaker 2: Running in in the car doctor. You know, I want

603
00:33:17,760 --> 00:33:20,680
Speaker 2: to thank Isaac Nielsen from Mala at the beginning of

604
00:33:20,680 --> 00:33:23,240
Speaker 2: today's hour to talk to us about air conditioning. A

605
00:33:23,280 --> 00:33:25,160
Speaker 2: lot of changes going on right, A lot of changes

606
00:33:25,160 --> 00:33:28,160
Speaker 2: in air conditioning. Like everything else in automotive, the technology

607
00:33:28,200 --> 00:33:30,920
Speaker 2: marches forward. I'm concerned about the one thirty four a

608
00:33:31,000 --> 00:33:33,120
Speaker 2: refrigerant situation. We'll have to keep an eye on that

609
00:33:33,560 --> 00:33:36,000
Speaker 2: and report it here as it evolves. I already see

610
00:33:36,080 --> 00:33:39,200
Speaker 2: rumblings the last week or the week before the EPA

611
00:33:39,360 --> 00:33:43,560
Speaker 2: is making some changes to certain AC regulations. So we're

612
00:33:43,560 --> 00:33:46,040
Speaker 2: gonna have to watch that more carefully and see what

613
00:33:46,080 --> 00:33:48,400
Speaker 2: that evolves into. But bottom line, if you've got an

614
00:33:48,400 --> 00:33:50,920
Speaker 2: air conditioning system, make sure it's into working order and

615
00:33:50,960 --> 00:33:52,880
Speaker 2: that it's not leaking, because it's only going to cost

616
00:33:52,960 --> 00:33:56,120
Speaker 2: you money and cost us environmentally in the future. Hey,

617
00:33:56,160 --> 00:33:59,200
Speaker 2: if you're you know, into NASCAR, great book Nascar is

618
00:33:59,240 --> 00:34:02,280
Speaker 2: seventy five years by Al Pierce is out now. It

619
00:34:02,360 --> 00:34:05,280
Speaker 2: came out in April of twenty three of this year,

620
00:34:05,680 --> 00:34:08,680
Speaker 2: and it talks about NASCAR's growth from a small, little

621
00:34:08,719 --> 00:34:12,440
Speaker 2: family business. I can't imagine NASCAR being a small family

622
00:34:12,480 --> 00:34:15,239
Speaker 2: business to become the leader in sports entertainment that it

623
00:34:15,320 --> 00:34:17,920
Speaker 2: is currently. You know, every week, millions of people on

624
00:34:18,080 --> 00:34:21,279
Speaker 2: National TV watch it in person, and it shows the

625
00:34:21,280 --> 00:34:24,279
Speaker 2: evolution of vehicles, which is kind of neat, you know

626
00:34:24,280 --> 00:34:26,480
Speaker 2: if you watch NASCAR long term. But the book goes

627
00:34:26,480 --> 00:34:28,640
Speaker 2: a long way to showing the evolution of the automobile

628
00:34:29,000 --> 00:34:31,440
Speaker 2: to when it was you know, I remember NASCAR was

629
00:34:31,440 --> 00:34:33,759
Speaker 2: you know, family cars, right, it was mom and Dad's car.

630
00:34:34,040 --> 00:34:37,080
Speaker 2: Now there's seven hundred horsepower, as the book points out,

631
00:34:37,560 --> 00:34:41,280
Speaker 2: race built behemoths. I've looked through the book, great color pictures, excellent,

632
00:34:41,480 --> 00:34:43,680
Speaker 2: you know forward, you know, just something if you're a

633
00:34:43,760 --> 00:34:46,799
Speaker 2: NASCAR fan, if Mom or Dad, right, Mother's Day's coming up,

634
00:34:46,840 --> 00:34:50,200
Speaker 2: Father's Day's coming up, somebody's into NASCAR and nascar seventy

635
00:34:50,200 --> 00:34:53,560
Speaker 2: five years Al Pierce just a great, great book. It's

636
00:34:53,600 --> 00:34:55,560
Speaker 2: something you want to pick up and you know, pick

637
00:34:55,560 --> 00:34:56,799
Speaker 2: a copy at it, you won't be able to put

638
00:34:56,800 --> 00:34:59,320
Speaker 2: it down. It's a wonderful book. Well, that about wraps

639
00:34:59,360 --> 00:35:00,600
Speaker 2: it up for this week. I want to thank all

640
00:35:00,640 --> 00:35:02,400
Speaker 2: of our guests and all the conversations we had, and

641
00:35:02,440 --> 00:35:04,400
Speaker 2: I'm ronnin Andy and the Car Doctor and I appreciate

642
00:35:04,400 --> 00:35:06,880
Speaker 2: you guys being here. And as always, I'm reminding you

643
00:35:06,960 --> 00:35:10,320
Speaker 2: this time till next time. Every time good mechanics aren't expensive,

644
00:35:10,400 --> 00:35:20,240
Speaker 2: they're priceless. See you