Speaker 1: My name is Jeffrey Z Carrian and you're listening to
Speaker 1: Four Courses with Jeffrey Zcarrian from my Heart Radio. Today,
Speaker 1: we're turning the table, so to speak. This three part
Speaker 1: series will be a little different than what you've come
Speaker 1: to expect from us. Today, I'm handing over the host
Speaker 1: duties to our executive producer, Christopher Hessiotis, who's going to
Speaker 1: be putting me in the hot seat and asking me
Speaker 1: all the tough questions that we usually reserve for our
Speaker 1: wonderful guests. During this first episode, Christopher and I dig
Speaker 1: into some of my early influences, from studying economics and
Speaker 1: urban planning in college to eating my way across France
Speaker 1: as a young adult. It's been a lot of fun
Speaker 1: for me to sit down with Christopher and reflect on
Speaker 1: all the things that shape me into who I am.
Speaker 1: And I hope you all have as much fun as
Speaker 1: I did. And with that, i'd like to introduce you
Speaker 1: to Christopher. Chris take it away. Thanks for having me,
Speaker 1: and listeners, thanks for putting up with me chatting here
Speaker 1: with Jeffrey. Mine is not a voice that you may
Speaker 1: have heard before, but we're going to keep the focus
Speaker 1: on jef free because we hear it. I aren't thought
Speaker 1: he's done a really terrific job of digging into the
Speaker 1: backgrounds and the lives of his guests on this podcast.
Speaker 1: But as Jeffrey said, we're turning the tables, and we
Speaker 1: know it's such a treat to get to know Jeffrey
Speaker 1: as a personality, as a chef, as a family man,
Speaker 1: as a businessman. There's a lot to dig into. So
Speaker 1: I hope you learned something new about Jeffrey z Carrian
Speaker 1: on four Courses. You really like to dig into the
Speaker 1: early days of people's lives, the formative moments that brought
Speaker 1: them the success that they now enjoy. I wanted to
Speaker 1: talk to you about some of your studies at Worcester
Speaker 1: State College. You know, economics was a big focus for you.
Speaker 1: I would like to know why the interest in economics,
Speaker 1: Why that was what you chose to put your energy
Speaker 1: and attention into in those early days before you became
Speaker 1: who you are now. That's a great question, and you know,
Speaker 1: I I tell people on first past it was always
Speaker 1: fascinated by the stock market, and my brother was an
Speaker 1: investment banker or investor, and so as a kid growing up,
Speaker 1: I sort of came away with a lot of like paper.
Speaker 1: Back then it was everything was on paper, so we'd
Speaker 1: leave stuff around. I read it, and then I had
Speaker 1: my own charts, and I grabbed the stock Market. I
Speaker 1: read that back of that page that no one reads,
Speaker 1: with all the little fine printed. It's still if you
Speaker 1: read any newspaper, they still have it printed. And in
Speaker 1: there that the last two or three pages of the
Speaker 1: Wall Street Journal, whereas I mean, it's like three thousand
Speaker 1: companies listed. Every day they're up there down there, and
Speaker 1: their pe ratio there there changed their year to day earnings.
Speaker 1: So I used to read that stuff. I don't know why.
Speaker 1: I just think that for some reason, I found it
Speaker 1: fascinating that someone would track this, and um, I grabbed
Speaker 1: onto that uh probably with one hand, nut both hands.
Speaker 1: I grabbed onto that pony and I wrote it a bit.
Speaker 1: And I went to school, and you know, when they
Speaker 1: say what's your major, I I picked economics because obviously
Speaker 1: my all those papers lyning around. I did that. But
Speaker 1: I actually went to what's just State College, But in
Speaker 1: between I changed over to University of Massachusetts. So I
Speaker 1: actually bounced back and forth between Worcester State, which I
Speaker 1: spent a year at and I left and went to
Speaker 1: U Mass. I spent a year U Mass. I didn't
Speaker 1: like it, and I came back to Worcester State and
Speaker 1: I graduated. So I had a double major I had
Speaker 1: at Worcester State. I major urban studies, which is the
Speaker 1: study of how cities form and how they come about,
Speaker 1: what do they create, and how that relates to say
Speaker 1: people and how people move and how people react to
Speaker 1: cities and density and what that does to the psyche
Speaker 1: is a fascinating sort of thing to study. And so
Speaker 1: I had two majors. So the economics was just something
Speaker 1: I held onto and I guess I carried it over
Speaker 1: to the restaurant industry, because you know, you cannot own
Speaker 1: or operate a restaurant unless you know that it's all
Speaker 1: about making money at the end of the day. How
Speaker 1: how shallow that sounds, but it really is because you
Speaker 1: cannot support two or three people in their families that
Speaker 1: they come with it. You can't feed them or give
Speaker 1: them a paycheck unless you have a break even or
Speaker 1: you make money. So I know that answer the deacon
Speaker 1: I was question, but it is in my blood and
Speaker 1: it's probably going to stay in my blood. I really
Speaker 1: I really enjoy the way that things break down to basically,
Speaker 1: at the end of the day, there's an economic reality
Speaker 1: that every single situation that we choose for ourselves. I think, Jeffrey,
Speaker 1: having gotten to know you over the past couple of
Speaker 1: years and working on this show and having been to
Speaker 1: some of your restaurants, that makes a lot of sense
Speaker 1: to me. You know, economics is the study of how
Speaker 1: we value things and the systems that are put in
Speaker 1: place to grow what's valued. And urban planning, like you said,
Speaker 1: is really about how people use space, how spaces are
Speaker 1: built for people by people, and how those can kind
Speaker 1: of get in the way of people sometimes. And that
Speaker 1: it really makes me think about you know, those first
Speaker 1: two or three months when you open a restaurant. You
Speaker 1: design a space the way you think people are going
Speaker 1: to use it, and then all of a sudden you realize,
Speaker 1: wait a minute, all of our servers are congregating over
Speaker 1: in this corner. Every time a guest walks, and we
Speaker 1: thought they would walk past this mural, but eight percent
Speaker 1: of people end up walking past these tables. We've got
Speaker 1: to change the layout of the restaurants. We've got to
Speaker 1: make a human space so so to me. This makes
Speaker 1: almost as much sense as someone who says I went
Speaker 1: to culinary school, I staged, I cooked and that's all
Speaker 1: I know. Yeah, and I did that and you did
Speaker 1: that too, so I did so. I mean, it's great
Speaker 1: that you just mentioned something that is so spot on, Chris,
Speaker 1: and I want to talk about that for people who
Speaker 1: are interested. You know, when we open a restaurant, you
Speaker 1: absolutely hit on the head by saying like, okay, this
Speaker 1: is you know, the seven menu items at twelve, appetize
Speaker 1: that this is gonna be the home run. This These
Speaker 1: fried Arti chokes are unbelievable. People that killing you order
Speaker 1: all these fried Arti chokes, and then you look at
Speaker 1: the menu before you open you like, you know what,
Speaker 1: I think we need an option for like someone who
Speaker 1: watches a simple green vegetable and it's not enough there,
Speaker 1: there's too much fried stuff. When you know, you you
Speaker 1: work through that, you know, and it's totally guess. It's
Speaker 1: a complete and utter guest. There's absolutely zero science to it.
Speaker 1: The science starts after the restaurant opens. Then you start
Speaker 1: collecting data, but before it opens, you have zero data.
Speaker 1: You have what you've done in the past, so you
Speaker 1: have the abundance of data from other operations, and that
Speaker 1: data is only worth so much unless you're going to
Speaker 1: open the exact same restaurant, and still that data is
Speaker 1: still worthless. But when you look at this restaurant, say yes,
Speaker 1: you know we have some we need something green, and
Speaker 1: one of your cooks will say, hey, chef, you know
Speaker 1: we're doing this dish with asparagus rarioli and we have
Speaker 1: a lot of asparagus tips left over. Let's make like
Speaker 1: a soup. And I'm like, great. We come up with
Speaker 1: a soup and they taste it, and you know, we
Speaker 1: do a chill soup. It's basically like a throwaway to
Speaker 1: get rid of something that you have to use. And
Speaker 1: guess what happens That asparagus soup that you give zero
Speaker 1: thought to is the best seller. And that's that's what
Speaker 1: happens on the formative side with the culinary of it.
Speaker 1: So you're all the effort and tasting you put into
Speaker 1: those artichokes turn up to be the least selling artichokes.
Speaker 1: So you put all this work and guess what you do?
Speaker 1: You take it off the menu because not selling, So
Speaker 1: you can't buy artichokes, have them ready to go and
Speaker 1: they're expensive and just not sell it's not worth it.
Speaker 1: So there's an economic value of that food, you know.
Speaker 1: It's like you've gotta move versus the sales. So there's artistry, yes,
Speaker 1: but if it's not selling, you've got to change the
Speaker 1: artistry because otherwise you're gonna be locked in this. You're
Speaker 1: gonna be swallowed up by the black hole of debt
Speaker 1: and you can't pay your bills, you can't pay your
Speaker 1: sales tax, and you get into the spiral. And that's
Speaker 1: because you're like, no, it's perfect, I love it. It's
Speaker 1: my favorite. It's a signature dish. The signature dishes are
Speaker 1: made by what the customer orders, end of story, and
Speaker 1: you have to really grapple with that. So that's what
Speaker 1: you're talking about. Spatially. I think it happens in a
Speaker 1: restaurant spatially and also formatively with the food. And I
Speaker 1: am a real crazy person. Anyone who knows me. When
Speaker 1: I walk into a restaurant, we rehearsed this before we
Speaker 1: start building. I'm like, Okay, I'm walking in spatially, and
Speaker 1: where's the bar. It's gonna be on the right, it's
Speaker 1: gonna be right over there. Why on the right, because
Speaker 1: no one goes left to a bar. It's just whatever
Speaker 1: are gene for walking into restaurants is the bars right
Speaker 1: there on the right. And the best way to walk
Speaker 1: in is to walk in through a revolving door because
Speaker 1: you get glimpses of something, you get excited, then you're
Speaker 1: forced to not look again and you can't wait to
Speaker 1: see it again, and then you come in, So it's
Speaker 1: a double excitement. That's why I love revolving doors. It's
Speaker 1: like a peak. It's like a you know, someone lifting
Speaker 1: their shirt up at at a marti gras, You're like,
Speaker 1: oh my god, let me go see that again. So
Speaker 1: that's kind of like a rather rough representation of what
Speaker 1: it means. But when the bar is on the right,
Speaker 1: it's just think the sensibility is to go right there.
Speaker 1: Your brain wants it over there. And so we actually
Speaker 1: practice walking in with the architects and we spray paint
Speaker 1: where the bar has to start with spray paint. Okay,
Speaker 1: that's close enough, started here, and then we start putting
Speaker 1: up like fake walls, like where's the bank at going
Speaker 1: to start? Where's the line of sight? All that before
Speaker 1: anyone draws one thing, because if we don't get that right.
Speaker 1: It's really critical. You can't undo it. I mean, it's
Speaker 1: we can. You can shut the restaurant down and undo it,
Speaker 1: and it's not a good thing. Keith McNally opens Bauth
Speaker 1: his arm pests. I mean, he's great at this. He
Speaker 1: actually builds i think one scale models of the restaurant.
Speaker 1: Well they're very expensive, but he builds them and he says, well,
Speaker 1: that's not right, that's too close. So he knows what
Speaker 1: the restaurants gonna feel like before he spends three million
Speaker 1: dollars opening a restaurant. He might spend a few extra dollars,
Speaker 1: but it's really important so that that spatial element combined
Speaker 1: with the element of surprise that the customer decides And yeah,
Speaker 1: they do decide whether they like the restaurant or not,
Speaker 1: but you've got to convince them when they walk in
Speaker 1: that it's human. It's wow. Everything has put at the
Speaker 1: right place. The tables are the right height, the chair heights.
Speaker 1: Are fanatic about chair heights. Probably the worst thing ever
Speaker 1: is when you have a chair that's too low. You'll
Speaker 1: never go back to that restaurant eating like appear like
Speaker 1: a baby, like you feel like a kid. The table
Speaker 1: has a little lower than your elbow, so it's almost
Speaker 1: lower than normal, and that feels right. So you can
Speaker 1: sit like this and talk. Even if you're six too,
Speaker 1: it doesn't matter because we all sit the same. If
Speaker 1: it's too low, it's uncomfortable and you won't go. So
Speaker 1: that's a good tip for folks at home. Right if
Speaker 1: you're having people over, don't all sit down on the couch.
Speaker 1: If you want to have a nice conversation, gather around
Speaker 1: the table, get cozy. Gotta choose, and you gotta choose
Speaker 1: chairs a little shorter, probably sixteen to seventeen chairs off
Speaker 1: the ground, with shorter legs. All these little things are
Speaker 1: so human they have nothing to do. Notice we haven't
Speaker 1: mentioned money. We haven't mentioned the quality of the food.
Speaker 1: We haven't mentioned the silf. We haven't mentioned his artistry,
Speaker 1: his viewpoint, his what he's wearing, where he gets his
Speaker 1: lettuce from. None of that really is Germane until all
Speaker 1: of these other things are put that person at ease.
Speaker 1: And I guess that urban landscape spatial planning is something
Speaker 1: that I'm very very aware of. So you gotta get
Speaker 1: in that restaurant, feel good about where the door is,
Speaker 1: feel good about the bar, feel good about the table height,
Speaker 1: feel good about the person is where he's directing you.
Speaker 1: And then when you get in and the lighting is loveliness,
Speaker 1: warm and there's enough of it and it's uplit, you're
Speaker 1: halfway there and you haven't even looked at the menu yet.
Speaker 1: So it really is about taking care to make sure
Speaker 1: everything is done correctly, and then people will naturally come
Speaker 1: back again. I think that people like an environment almost
Speaker 1: more than the food. Not to derail talk from your
Speaker 1: your restaurant exploits, but you know, it's clear that you
Speaker 1: have to be a planner to succeed as you have,
Speaker 1: but you also have to be flexible to succeed as
Speaker 1: you have. So I want to go back to some
Speaker 1: of your earlier days too and and ask you. After college,
Speaker 1: you traveled around France for a year, and that's something
Speaker 1: that a lot of people do, and it's something a
Speaker 1: lot of people dream about doing. I want to know
Speaker 1: what kind of traveler you are when you did that.
Speaker 1: Did you plan it all out? Did you have your
Speaker 1: list of things you wanted to do or were you adaptive?
Speaker 1: Did you kind of take things as they come on
Speaker 1: this journey abroad and diving into the culinary world of France. Well,
Speaker 1: here is what I planned. I planned economically doesn't have
Speaker 1: any money, so I think it was I had twenty
Speaker 1: five or thirty dollars a day and I don't remember
Speaker 1: exactly how much, but it was not a lot. So
Speaker 1: I had to really, you know, take it as I go,
Speaker 1: and it was. It was terrific. So I was there sightseeing,
Speaker 1: you know. I end up in the Italian Riviera in Monton,
Speaker 1: which is sort of like the Boca Grand of France.
Speaker 1: It's very elderly population and so do where they go
Speaker 1: to sort of retire and enjoy the their golden years. Uh.
Speaker 1: And I didn't know that, but it had really inexpensive
Speaker 1: hotel rooms and it was really sort of beautiful. And
Speaker 1: I could go hop on the train and go to
Speaker 1: Ventimiglia or the Italian Riviera and one day and come
Speaker 1: back and I could just do that, so like, let's
Speaker 1: go to all these places. I used to hear about
Speaker 1: watching a lot of James Bond movies, so I had
Speaker 1: a little bit of a crazy James Bond thing going
Speaker 1: on in my head. I'm sure a lot of people
Speaker 1: in my age did. And the culture is everything really
Speaker 1: the culture is what I had really was drawn towards. Yeah,
Speaker 1: the food and all that it was. It was breathtaking
Speaker 1: because they've been doing it for four thousand years. You know,
Speaker 1: we've been doing it for three hundred years, so you
Speaker 1: can't compare. And people say, well, it's so much better
Speaker 1: over there, Like, it's not better, it's different. It's it's
Speaker 1: different because they have passed down traditions for three or
Speaker 1: four thousand years that we are only beginning to understand
Speaker 1: and we can copy. But that's why everything feels different
Speaker 1: in Europe. So I I had a blast, you know,
Speaker 1: and it was very scary. I didn't speak French, but
Speaker 1: I quickly learned how to make my way around. A
Speaker 1: lot of people spoke English to me, and you know,
Speaker 1: a smile goes a long way, you know. They really
Speaker 1: loved a lot of people say I don't like Americans.
Speaker 1: I didn't find that at all. Maybe it was just
Speaker 1: an age thing that I sort of had, you know,
Speaker 1: my different colored lenses on back then. But it was
Speaker 1: a delightful experience something I'll never forget. What it brought
Speaker 1: me and the views I have now are very much
Speaker 1: borrowed from that time abroad. One of the things that
Speaker 1: I've really enjoyed on the podcast that you do when
Speaker 1: you talk to your guests as you you ask them
Speaker 1: to share some of those formative smells and tastes and
Speaker 1: memories of those sense memories, um and I think that's
Speaker 1: always been really evocative. That's a great part of your
Speaker 1: show and it's also a great thing to do when
Speaker 1: you're sitting around a table with a bunch of people.
Speaker 1: It's a great conversation starter. And you, Jeffrey is a
Speaker 1: professional conversationalist. You already know that, but you know as
Speaker 1: you as you think back to this time jetting around,
Speaker 1: whether you're hanging out with with the French and Italian
Speaker 1: retirees or pretending to be James Bond, what are the smells,
Speaker 1: What are the sounds, What are the what are the
Speaker 1: tastes that that really bring you back? What is that
Speaker 1: trip and that time in your life? Taste? Like, So,
Speaker 1: when I asked people what was this smell? The smell
Speaker 1: is the first thing. The taste is the second thing.
Speaker 1: The memory comes right out. It's like they can spit
Speaker 1: out where they are, what room they're in, what floor
Speaker 1: they're on, and if you can describe where you were
Speaker 1: you can bring up some emotions. Everything is a memory,
Speaker 1: and all tastes relate to memories, and those are the
Speaker 1: most vivid memories you have. I believe, at least I have.
Speaker 1: And I think that as long as I've known, I've
Speaker 1: been cooking for memory, and I've been cooking for the
Speaker 1: memory of my aunt and my mom's food that they
Speaker 1: used to cook me all the time, because I grew
Speaker 1: up in a family that just we you know, we
Speaker 1: cooked everything and it was great. We didn't go out
Speaker 1: to dinner a lot. We didn't have the finances to
Speaker 1: do that. But between my my mother, who was a
Speaker 1: terrific Polish Russian cooking, my aunt's four of them who
Speaker 1: had amazing cooking skills, are all Armenian, and they made
Speaker 1: every single thing from pickling. They grew the cucumbers, they
Speaker 1: pickled the peppers, they jarred everything. It was just it
Speaker 1: was a remarkable thing. I had no idea, you know,
Speaker 1: I didn't know us is what it tastes like, This
Speaker 1: is what a pepper tastes like, jarred and perfect, And
Speaker 1: I couldn't believe when I tasted the lesser equivalent, like wow,
Speaker 1: that's just awful. So you grow up like that by
Speaker 1: four or five years old, you're very much spoiled, and
Speaker 1: I think in a good way, very much like probably
Speaker 1: my children are today. But those memories, they don't linger
Speaker 1: and then go away, like clothes or homes or moving
Speaker 1: or friends that you don't get in touch with. They
Speaker 1: stay with you forever. I'm still looking for that bite
Speaker 1: of lentils that I my grandmother made with fried onions.
Speaker 1: I'm still looking for that sweetness of the blueberry pie
Speaker 1: that my mom did, like there was so luscious. I
Speaker 1: still look for these things, and I collectively have thousands
Speaker 1: of these memories because I was surrounded by all these
Speaker 1: memory builders. I imagine having that. So I carry these
Speaker 1: tastes and memories with me to this day. And I
Speaker 1: when I went to Europe and I tasted some things,
Speaker 1: there were so many tastes in Europe that made me
Speaker 1: think of my my mother and my aunts. It was
Speaker 1: so specifically, almost remarkably similar. It was the way they
Speaker 1: treated the ingredients. So there's this old world, real fresh
Speaker 1: done from scratch, not imperfect, but so valued and so
Speaker 1: warm and yummy. And wow, you know, I was a
Speaker 1: good God. Then I turned the trip into after a
Speaker 1: few months into an eating trip, and I found the
Speaker 1: Michelin Guide, and I started going around trying to like,
Speaker 1: where am I gonna go? Am I gonna go? Am
Speaker 1: I gonna go? And this was all on my head.
Speaker 1: So that very moment where I saw this happening and
Speaker 1: I was eating this food and feeling this was why
Speaker 1: I came back and decided to go to Colony school.
Speaker 1: So it wasn't that I was planning on being a chef,
Speaker 1: it's the chef part of it sort of found me.
Speaker 1: It found me, so that ancestral memory that I had
Speaker 1: sort of out of complete coincidence, just discovered by by eating.
Speaker 1: And then luck came my way. I went to a
Speaker 1: casino and gambled, having never been to one, living out
Speaker 1: a fantasy and Monte Carlo Casino, Um, I want a
Speaker 1: lot of money for a twenty year old, and um
Speaker 1: I decided to sort of spend all of it on food,
Speaker 1: and I did, and I got my Michelin Guide, and
Speaker 1: I learned what a Michelin star wars, what a toko was,
Speaker 1: what a cross hatch on forks were, and I learned
Speaker 1: about the Michelin Guide because it really wove its way
Speaker 1: through all of Continental Europe, and I ended up spending
Speaker 1: every week that one of one at least one three
Speaker 1: star restaurant. I needed lunch because it was the cheapest.
Speaker 1: It was a prefixed menu, and I had one suit
Speaker 1: and I would wear to lunch. I would order the prefix,
Speaker 1: I would have some wine, I would own a more stuff.
Speaker 1: I would just eat everything. And I really really saw
Speaker 1: now that construct of cultural element of food, how they
Speaker 1: treat food, the restaurant business, the front of the house,
Speaker 1: at the back of the house, the dignity of the chef,
Speaker 1: the toke, the white, the owner, the in a play
Speaker 1: with the staff, that formality, all that, that dance, that
Speaker 1: bell at and you know, I was like, oh my god,
Speaker 1: this is what I want to do. I fell in
Speaker 1: love with the theater. I must admit. The food brought
Speaker 1: me back, right, It brought me back to memories of
Speaker 1: that taste and where it was, and I was like,
Speaker 1: this is incredible. This is like my mom and my
Speaker 1: cousins and my aunt's cooking. So that was okay. It
Speaker 1: didn't really dawn on me that this is something I
Speaker 1: could do for a living. What really really excited me
Speaker 1: was the theater, and I started to understand the cadence
Speaker 1: of it. You know, usually it was the the husband
Speaker 1: was a chef and the wife was in front. You
Speaker 1: get ready, your prep, you have a family meal, you
Speaker 1: sit together, you meet, and then you open the doors
Speaker 1: and it's like a curtain going up. And I saw that.
Speaker 1: I saw the curtain before I saw the act. I
Speaker 1: loved it. I loved everything about it. I loved the
Speaker 1: napkin up seat pulling, the naming, how do you see people?
Speaker 1: Where do you see the stations? It was like a
Speaker 1: Broadway show and it was absolutely the most intoxicating part
Speaker 1: of the business. So there I was at the end
Speaker 1: of that trip having all these I think I ate
Speaker 1: an eighteen three star restaurants and that was and UM.
Speaker 1: I came home and I told my parents I don't
Speaker 1: want to go to get a degree at the graduate
Speaker 1: degree in economics. I want to be a chef. And
Speaker 1: I really was not happy about that. But I went
Speaker 1: to see i A in Hyde Park and I announced
Speaker 1: myself pretty boldly and they said, UM, something to effect
Speaker 1: that will we can put you on a list. We
Speaker 1: have a two year waiting list something like that. I said,
Speaker 1: I, I I, that's too long. I was taking to the
Speaker 1: director of admission. But I had a journal of what
Speaker 1: I was doing and where I went and what I ate,
Speaker 1: And I'm like, I have this journal. I've been doing
Speaker 1: this for a year now, and I don't think anybody
Speaker 1: on your staff or any of the teachers here of
Speaker 1: eating in any of these places, let alone collectively. So
Speaker 1: I was very i would say, forward and obnoxious. They said,
Speaker 1: I'm so sorry. You know, well, we'll call you if
Speaker 1: something opens. I think it was a month, not even
Speaker 1: a month. I got a call and they said, we
Speaker 1: have something open. Can you be here in two weeks.
Speaker 1: That it Jeffrey. I loved it. As a twenty year
Speaker 1: old who comes across a windfall of cash through gambling,
Speaker 1: your immediate reaction to that was, now I'm going to
Speaker 1: eat really well, I think that's that's that's really indicative.
Speaker 1: It's it's great, and I hope I never thought of that.
Speaker 1: I never thought of that. Especially, you know, you studied economics.
Speaker 1: You were the kid reading the boring back pages of
Speaker 1: the newspaper. You could have taken that money, come home
Speaker 1: and joined the bank. But the food is what trew
Speaker 1: you in. You know. I should have, actually, Chris, because
Speaker 1: compounded compounded, you know we're probably sitting on my jet
Speaker 1: having a cocktail. Thanks very much for listening to Four
Speaker 1: Courses with Jeffrey Z Carrian, a production of I Heart
Speaker 1: Radio and Corner Table Entertainment. Four Courses is created by
Speaker 1: Jeffrey Z. Carrion, Margaret Scarrion, Jared Keller, and Tara Helper.
Speaker 1: Our executive producer is Christopher Hesiotis. Four Courses is produced
Speaker 1: by Jonathan Haws Dressler. Our research is conducted by Jescelyn Shields.
Speaker 1: Our talent booking is by Pamela Bauer at Dogtown Talent.
Speaker 1: This episode was edited and written by Priya Mahadevan. Special
Speaker 1: thanks to Katie Fellman for help as recording engineer. For
Speaker 1: more podcasts from my Heart Radio, visit the I Heart
Speaker 1: Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your
Speaker 1: favorite shows.