1 00:00:00,480 --> 00:00:05,120 Speaker 1: Okay, y'all, we're not trying to scare you. But someone 2 00:00:05,160 --> 00:00:08,360 Speaker 1: with the measles was on the DC Metro, the Amtrak 3 00:00:08,560 --> 00:00:13,760 Speaker 1: and at the airport planes trains and automobiles, and public 4 00:00:13,800 --> 00:00:16,360 Speaker 1: health officials were like, hey, heads up. 5 00:00:16,720 --> 00:00:18,799 Speaker 2: I know that kind of alert. Yeah, you don't get it. 6 00:00:18,680 --> 00:00:21,759 Speaker 1: For the flu, you don't get it for COVID anymore. 7 00:00:22,600 --> 00:00:25,239 Speaker 1: And yeah, so that made us really pay attention. 8 00:00:25,840 --> 00:00:29,240 Speaker 2: Yes, and we've talked about measles before, back in our 9 00:00:29,280 --> 00:00:31,960 Speaker 2: Protection Neck episode when there was a scare, but it 10 00:00:32,000 --> 00:00:35,360 Speaker 2: was mostly out West and now it seems like it's 11 00:00:35,400 --> 00:00:38,319 Speaker 2: here again. It's in West Texas, it's in hospitals, and 12 00:00:38,520 --> 00:00:40,519 Speaker 2: it's all up in my headlines that I'm reading on 13 00:00:40,560 --> 00:00:42,839 Speaker 2: the web. So the main thing I know is that 14 00:00:42,880 --> 00:00:44,400 Speaker 2: it's not just a rash. I heard. 15 00:00:44,400 --> 00:00:49,000 Speaker 1: It can be brain swelling and immune amnesia in kids 16 00:00:49,040 --> 00:00:51,720 Speaker 1: that are too young to get vaccinated. I didn't even 17 00:00:51,880 --> 00:00:55,560 Speaker 1: know that was a possibility before this lab. So if 18 00:00:55,640 --> 00:00:59,800 Speaker 1: you're like me, don't worry. We are your good science friends. 19 00:01:00,560 --> 00:01:07,000 Speaker 2: I'm TT and I'm Zachiah, and this is Dope Labs. 20 00:01:08,280 --> 00:01:11,480 Speaker 2: Welcome to Dope Labs, a weekly podcast that mixes hardcore 21 00:01:11,560 --> 00:01:14,520 Speaker 2: science with pop culture and a healthy dose of friendship. 22 00:01:19,319 --> 00:01:22,200 Speaker 2: Let's jump into the recitation. What do we know? 23 00:01:22,760 --> 00:01:25,880 Speaker 1: We talk a lot about viruses on the show, but 24 00:01:26,040 --> 00:01:30,080 Speaker 1: the measles feels like one that people put in the 25 00:01:30,200 --> 00:01:33,759 Speaker 1: old news category. But it's very much back, and we've 26 00:01:33,800 --> 00:01:35,760 Speaker 1: been seeing it all over the news. I lived just 27 00:01:35,800 --> 00:01:39,520 Speaker 1: outside of DC and they were saying somebody was on 28 00:01:39,560 --> 00:01:42,120 Speaker 1: the Metro and on the Amtrak and at the airport 29 00:01:42,200 --> 00:01:45,320 Speaker 1: and it's really stressing me out. And it's okay to 30 00:01:45,319 --> 00:01:48,360 Speaker 1: be stressed out because measles used to be the leading 31 00:01:48,400 --> 00:01:49,600 Speaker 1: cause of childhood death. 32 00:01:49,880 --> 00:01:53,440 Speaker 2: But oh how quickly we forget. You remember, like in 33 00:01:53,520 --> 00:01:55,800 Speaker 2: old movies they would have these huge families and they 34 00:01:55,800 --> 00:01:58,400 Speaker 2: will always be like such a such sibling died as 35 00:01:58,400 --> 00:02:01,880 Speaker 2: a baby or a toddler. It probably was the measles. 36 00:02:02,200 --> 00:02:05,960 Speaker 1: Cholera was not the only thing killing people in that 37 00:02:06,120 --> 00:02:07,440 Speaker 1: Oregon Trail game. 38 00:02:07,680 --> 00:02:11,160 Speaker 2: And in real life. Dude, I know I got my 39 00:02:11,560 --> 00:02:14,680 Speaker 2: MMR measles, mumps and rubella years ago. But I know 40 00:02:14,720 --> 00:02:17,760 Speaker 2: I got it because it was required for school, Okay, right, 41 00:02:17,840 --> 00:02:20,919 Speaker 2: an today that means most other people did too, right. 42 00:02:21,440 --> 00:02:22,720 Speaker 2: But here's what we want to know. 43 00:02:23,480 --> 00:02:28,320 Speaker 1: If the vaccines work, why is measles coming back? 44 00:02:28,880 --> 00:02:32,040 Speaker 2: Right? How did we get here again? And now that 45 00:02:32,080 --> 00:02:35,320 Speaker 2: we're here, how dangerous is it really? Like? How do 46 00:02:35,360 --> 00:02:37,720 Speaker 2: we cut through the noise and you know, people saying 47 00:02:37,800 --> 00:02:39,440 Speaker 2: this is what you should take, you should worry about 48 00:02:39,480 --> 00:02:41,440 Speaker 2: this or don't worry about it. How do we figure 49 00:02:41,480 --> 00:02:44,160 Speaker 2: out what we need to know to protect ourselves and 50 00:02:44,320 --> 00:02:45,839 Speaker 2: folks in our communities? Right? 51 00:02:46,200 --> 00:02:48,079 Speaker 1: So, to help us break it all down, we're talking 52 00:02:48,120 --> 00:02:52,280 Speaker 1: to doctor Caitlyn Jeddalina. All right, let's jump into the dissection. 53 00:02:53,320 --> 00:02:54,720 Speaker 3: My name is Caitlyn Jeddelina. 54 00:02:54,880 --> 00:02:58,680 Speaker 4: I'm an epidemiologist and founder and author of a public 55 00:02:58,680 --> 00:03:01,359 Speaker 4: health newsletter called Your Our Local Epidemiologist. 56 00:03:02,040 --> 00:03:04,240 Speaker 2: Thank you for joining us. We are so excited to 57 00:03:04,240 --> 00:03:04,800 Speaker 2: hear from you. 58 00:03:05,120 --> 00:03:08,840 Speaker 1: Let's start with the basics. What exactly is the measles 59 00:03:08,880 --> 00:03:11,480 Speaker 1: and how does it spread? And can we compare it 60 00:03:11,520 --> 00:03:14,880 Speaker 1: to other contagious diseases so that people can get like 61 00:03:15,160 --> 00:03:17,359 Speaker 1: an understanding of how contagious it is. 62 00:03:18,360 --> 00:03:22,240 Speaker 4: Yeah, So, measles is a virus and it has been 63 00:03:22,280 --> 00:03:27,280 Speaker 4: around forever and it used to cause about five hundred 64 00:03:27,320 --> 00:03:31,760 Speaker 4: to one thousand deaths per year before a vaccine, many 65 00:03:31,840 --> 00:03:34,600 Speaker 4: many many infections, I mean some years we're up to 66 00:03:34,760 --> 00:03:41,440 Speaker 4: six hundred thousand infections. And then with the introduction of 67 00:03:41,480 --> 00:03:45,800 Speaker 4: sanitation as well as a medicine as well as an 68 00:03:45,960 --> 00:03:52,280 Speaker 4: MMR vaccine, we really saw almost the disappearance of measles 69 00:03:52,320 --> 00:03:55,720 Speaker 4: within the United States. In two thousand, it was eliminated. 70 00:03:55,920 --> 00:04:00,600 Speaker 4: We got an elimination status, meaning it wasn't spreading. 71 00:04:00,120 --> 00:04:02,280 Speaker 3: Everywhere like fluid does or covid does. 72 00:04:02,360 --> 00:04:06,200 Speaker 4: Now. In fact, we would just get sporadic cases. And 73 00:04:06,800 --> 00:04:11,680 Speaker 4: you're right, I mean this year it is coming in hot. 74 00:04:11,920 --> 00:04:14,640 Speaker 4: Backing up on the measles. You know, measles is spread 75 00:04:14,640 --> 00:04:18,240 Speaker 4: through the air. It is the most contagious virus there 76 00:04:18,320 --> 00:04:22,719 Speaker 4: is on earth. So for one infected person, they can 77 00:04:22,760 --> 00:04:27,599 Speaker 4: infect about eighteen other unvaccinated people. It can live in 78 00:04:27,680 --> 00:04:30,400 Speaker 4: the air for hours, and so that's why people at 79 00:04:30,400 --> 00:04:36,000 Speaker 4: the Metro or Amtrak were worried. Rightfully so, because measles 80 00:04:36,040 --> 00:04:38,839 Speaker 4: can stay up in the air for about two to 81 00:04:38,920 --> 00:04:44,000 Speaker 4: three hours after the person has left, and so really 82 00:04:44,200 --> 00:04:47,840 Speaker 4: a virus we don't want to play around, I will say, 83 00:04:47,920 --> 00:04:51,840 Speaker 4: you know, the vast majority of people do just okay. 84 00:04:51,920 --> 00:04:55,080 Speaker 4: It is just quote unquote a rash to them. The 85 00:04:55,160 --> 00:04:59,000 Speaker 4: problem is it's like playing Russian roulette or if you're not vaccinated, 86 00:04:59,120 --> 00:05:04,080 Speaker 4: because it's also it can be a nasty virus. We're 87 00:05:04,120 --> 00:05:08,520 Speaker 4: talking about brain swelling, we're talking about hearing loss. There's 88 00:05:08,560 --> 00:05:12,159 Speaker 4: this thing called immune amnesia with measles, which means that 89 00:05:12,279 --> 00:05:15,200 Speaker 4: even if you survive a measles infection, it wipes your 90 00:05:15,200 --> 00:05:18,440 Speaker 4: immune memory from other viruses. So what we see is 91 00:05:19,040 --> 00:05:22,240 Speaker 4: that after a measles infection, you can die five ten 92 00:05:22,320 --> 00:05:25,680 Speaker 4: years later from flu because it wiped your memory of 93 00:05:25,720 --> 00:05:26,280 Speaker 4: flu out. 94 00:05:27,080 --> 00:05:28,400 Speaker 3: And then of course there's death. 95 00:05:28,440 --> 00:05:30,320 Speaker 4: And we've already seen two dusts this year in the 96 00:05:30,440 --> 00:05:33,760 Speaker 4: United States. So yeah, not something I want to mess 97 00:05:33,800 --> 00:05:34,159 Speaker 4: around with. 98 00:05:34,480 --> 00:05:37,320 Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, you said that most people fear. 99 00:05:37,440 --> 00:05:41,839 Speaker 2: Okay, when you say people, are you talking kids included? 100 00:05:42,240 --> 00:05:46,160 Speaker 2: We're seeing outbreaks with children, particularly in West Texas and 101 00:05:46,320 --> 00:05:48,960 Speaker 2: places where we see people are not vaccinated. When you 102 00:05:49,000 --> 00:05:52,080 Speaker 2: say people, do you mean everybody? 103 00:05:52,200 --> 00:05:54,920 Speaker 4: So like we learned during COVID, and I love this 104 00:05:55,040 --> 00:05:58,159 Speaker 4: question because it makes my public health heart happy, is 105 00:05:58,160 --> 00:06:01,920 Speaker 4: that risk is not uniform. So the people that are 106 00:06:02,000 --> 00:06:05,120 Speaker 4: hit the hardest by measles if they have no protection, 107 00:06:05,400 --> 00:06:09,120 Speaker 4: are the youngest. So right now, in this massive measles 108 00:06:09,160 --> 00:06:12,040 Speaker 4: outbreak in West Texas. The vast majority of cases are 109 00:06:12,080 --> 00:06:16,280 Speaker 4: school age children. Their little immune systems just can't handle 110 00:06:16,880 --> 00:06:20,880 Speaker 4: this nasty virus replicating within their system very well, as 111 00:06:20,920 --> 00:06:25,080 Speaker 4: well as older people are compromised, so kind of both 112 00:06:25,120 --> 00:06:27,680 Speaker 4: of the spectrums of the age. 113 00:06:28,000 --> 00:06:29,080 Speaker 3: And so that's what we've seen. 114 00:06:29,120 --> 00:06:31,000 Speaker 4: We've seen one death and a six year old, and 115 00:06:31,040 --> 00:06:34,320 Speaker 4: one death and an older unvaccinated adult, and so that's 116 00:06:34,360 --> 00:06:35,920 Speaker 4: not too surprising, Okay. 117 00:06:36,120 --> 00:06:38,880 Speaker 1: Zakia's background is in genetics and genomics, so she knows 118 00:06:38,960 --> 00:06:41,880 Speaker 1: a lot about this stuff. My background is an engineering. 119 00:06:41,920 --> 00:06:44,600 Speaker 1: I don't know anything about this. And so when I 120 00:06:44,640 --> 00:06:47,560 Speaker 1: hear you say it was eliminated in a two thousand, 121 00:06:47,640 --> 00:06:50,640 Speaker 1: I'm like, right, twenty five years ago. 122 00:06:51,560 --> 00:06:52,440 Speaker 3: Why is it back? 123 00:06:52,600 --> 00:06:56,520 Speaker 1: Anything that has been eliminated for me is no longer returning. 124 00:06:56,800 --> 00:07:00,760 Speaker 1: Lots of ex boyfriends and things like that. What is 125 00:07:00,960 --> 00:07:04,360 Speaker 1: happening with measles? Why is it beck like the bad 126 00:07:04,400 --> 00:07:05,960 Speaker 1: ex that just keeps texting you. 127 00:07:07,880 --> 00:07:10,680 Speaker 4: There's a multitude of reasons, but I think the biggest 128 00:07:10,680 --> 00:07:13,280 Speaker 4: one is that vaccines are a victim of their success. 129 00:07:13,760 --> 00:07:13,920 Speaker 2: Right. 130 00:07:14,040 --> 00:07:17,200 Speaker 4: We just have general amnesia right now. A lot of 131 00:07:17,280 --> 00:07:21,840 Speaker 4: us have never seen measles. Physicians have never treated measles before, right, 132 00:07:22,000 --> 00:07:25,320 Speaker 4: and so a lot of parents don't know why this 133 00:07:25,480 --> 00:07:29,400 Speaker 4: virus is bad. May think it's just like a rash, 134 00:07:29,480 --> 00:07:32,280 Speaker 4: like maybe chicken pox or something, and it's really something 135 00:07:32,320 --> 00:07:36,320 Speaker 4: a whole lot more dangerous, and so there's that amnesia. 136 00:07:36,360 --> 00:07:41,520 Speaker 4: There's this rise of individualism, particularly we're seeing the decline 137 00:07:41,720 --> 00:07:46,800 Speaker 4: in vaccine exemptions and a lot of states because of 138 00:07:46,840 --> 00:07:51,880 Speaker 4: this individual choice freedom for sort of movement. There's this 139 00:07:52,000 --> 00:07:56,880 Speaker 4: new information ecosystem which is called social media, and it 140 00:07:56,960 --> 00:08:01,760 Speaker 4: is chaos there. There's so many hot takes and bad 141 00:08:01,840 --> 00:08:05,160 Speaker 4: takes as well as just lots of trust and institutions 142 00:08:05,200 --> 00:08:09,040 Speaker 4: right now as well, and so as creating this perfect storm. 143 00:08:09,400 --> 00:08:11,840 Speaker 4: The reason we're seeing it with measles instead of like 144 00:08:11,960 --> 00:08:15,800 Speaker 4: polio coming back or you know, others, is because it's 145 00:08:15,880 --> 00:08:20,600 Speaker 4: so contagious, like it's usually the first building block we lose. 146 00:08:21,200 --> 00:08:25,760 Speaker 4: Because of its contagiousness, we need a really high heard 147 00:08:25,800 --> 00:08:29,480 Speaker 4: immunity level, which is about ninety five percent to stop it, 148 00:08:29,560 --> 00:08:32,400 Speaker 4: and right now we're about ninety two percent on a 149 00:08:32,520 --> 00:08:35,000 Speaker 4: national level, and that's why we're seeing it now. 150 00:08:35,080 --> 00:08:37,440 Speaker 2: That's a really good point, caitln You're saying, we go 151 00:08:37,520 --> 00:08:39,920 Speaker 2: from ninety five percent to ninety two percent, And I 152 00:08:39,960 --> 00:08:43,280 Speaker 2: know to most people listening, they're like, that's still an. 153 00:08:43,120 --> 00:08:44,280 Speaker 3: A It is. 154 00:08:44,320 --> 00:08:46,680 Speaker 2: But I think in the same way that you said, 155 00:08:46,920 --> 00:08:52,800 Speaker 2: risk is not the same across categories for people, vaccination 156 00:08:52,920 --> 00:08:55,760 Speaker 2: uptake is not the same. It's not evinly distributed across 157 00:08:55,800 --> 00:08:58,199 Speaker 2: the country. And so I'd love for you to tell 158 00:08:58,280 --> 00:09:01,520 Speaker 2: us a little bit more about how that unequal distribution 159 00:09:02,679 --> 00:09:04,920 Speaker 2: puts herd immunity at risk for people. 160 00:09:05,960 --> 00:09:08,760 Speaker 4: Oh my god, I love your guys as questions. You're right, 161 00:09:08,920 --> 00:09:12,840 Speaker 4: that is absolutely right. So ninety two percent seems very high. 162 00:09:12,880 --> 00:09:16,040 Speaker 4: It is very high, right, it's a great number, But 163 00:09:16,600 --> 00:09:21,760 Speaker 4: there's vast variability at a hyper local level, which means 164 00:09:21,760 --> 00:09:26,520 Speaker 4: that there are just really there's pockets in counties and 165 00:09:26,640 --> 00:09:30,600 Speaker 4: states across the United States that have really low vaccination rates. 166 00:09:30,679 --> 00:09:33,280 Speaker 4: So the average is ninety two percent, but there's a 167 00:09:33,360 --> 00:09:38,360 Speaker 4: lot far under. The least vaccinated state is Idaho seventy 168 00:09:38,480 --> 00:09:43,120 Speaker 4: nine percent MMR vaccination rate. And even if we keep 169 00:09:43,160 --> 00:09:47,560 Speaker 4: going hyper local into some counties like Gaines County where 170 00:09:47,600 --> 00:09:51,360 Speaker 4: this outbreak happened, like in certain counties in New York, 171 00:09:51,520 --> 00:09:53,840 Speaker 4: I mean certain counties in California where I am I 172 00:09:53,840 --> 00:09:57,560 Speaker 4: mean vaccination rates get down to like fourteen twenty percent, 173 00:09:58,120 --> 00:10:00,520 Speaker 4: and remember we need a ninety five percent level. And 174 00:10:00,600 --> 00:10:05,280 Speaker 4: so these pockets measles just runs like wildfire when they 175 00:10:05,320 --> 00:10:07,720 Speaker 4: find it. And that's what we're seeing in East Texas 176 00:10:07,760 --> 00:10:09,160 Speaker 4: right now. It's what we saw in New York in 177 00:10:09,200 --> 00:10:11,680 Speaker 4: twenty nineteen, and it's what we saw at Disneyland in 178 00:10:11,679 --> 00:10:12,800 Speaker 4: twenty sixteen, and so. 179 00:10:12,800 --> 00:10:15,480 Speaker 3: It's just that's what's happening. 180 00:10:15,760 --> 00:10:17,920 Speaker 4: The other thing that's happening right now is not just 181 00:10:18,040 --> 00:10:22,560 Speaker 4: measles finding those unvaccinated pockets, but a lot of sparks 182 00:10:22,640 --> 00:10:25,800 Speaker 4: going off across the United States, and these are called 183 00:10:25,840 --> 00:10:30,640 Speaker 4: sporadic cases from international travel. And the problem with a 184 00:10:30,640 --> 00:10:33,240 Speaker 4: lot more sparks is that the more probability of them 185 00:10:33,280 --> 00:10:35,680 Speaker 4: finding an unvaccinated pocket. And so we kind of see 186 00:10:35,720 --> 00:10:37,360 Speaker 4: the two happening at the same time. 187 00:10:52,640 --> 00:10:56,880 Speaker 1: So the MMR vaccine measles, mumps and rubella vaccine has 188 00:10:56,920 --> 00:10:59,880 Speaker 1: been around for a long time since like the sixties, 189 00:11:00,520 --> 00:11:06,280 Speaker 1: and what I felt like was that it offers lifelong protection. 190 00:11:07,440 --> 00:11:11,319 Speaker 1: But there's also a lot of confusion about like boosters. 191 00:11:11,400 --> 00:11:14,800 Speaker 1: If you're over sixty something, then maybe you'll need to 192 00:11:14,800 --> 00:11:18,600 Speaker 1: get another one. How strong is the defense when you 193 00:11:18,640 --> 00:11:22,280 Speaker 1: have the vaccine. And two, what should people be considering 194 00:11:22,400 --> 00:11:27,440 Speaker 1: now that measles is starting to reseurge and their vaccine status. 195 00:11:28,520 --> 00:11:33,120 Speaker 4: Yeah, so the MMR vaccine is incredibly durable, and you're right, 196 00:11:33,200 --> 00:11:36,240 Speaker 4: we kind of make the assumption that it is lifetime protection. 197 00:11:37,640 --> 00:11:40,360 Speaker 4: This is very different than like flu right where we 198 00:11:40,400 --> 00:11:42,880 Speaker 4: need a vaccine every year or covid or a vaccine 199 00:11:42,920 --> 00:11:45,200 Speaker 4: every year. And the reason for that is this is 200 00:11:45,240 --> 00:11:47,840 Speaker 4: just a very different virus. It hasn't really changed since 201 00:11:47,840 --> 00:11:50,840 Speaker 4: the nineteen sixties, and so we can just use the 202 00:11:50,920 --> 00:11:55,440 Speaker 4: two dose there is and so people are very well 203 00:11:55,480 --> 00:11:57,960 Speaker 4: protected if you're up to date on vaccines ninety seven 204 00:11:58,000 --> 00:12:02,240 Speaker 4: percent effectiveness. There's a group before nineteen fifty seven that 205 00:12:02,360 --> 00:12:06,600 Speaker 4: didn't get measles vaccines because measles was widespread then, and 206 00:12:06,679 --> 00:12:09,800 Speaker 4: so it's assumed that everyone born before nineteen fifty seven 207 00:12:09,920 --> 00:12:14,120 Speaker 4: were naturally exposed and have immunity, and I think that's 208 00:12:14,160 --> 00:12:17,719 Speaker 4: a good assumption. There's one exception of a group that 209 00:12:17,920 --> 00:12:21,280 Speaker 4: needs a booster right now, and those are born between 210 00:12:21,400 --> 00:12:25,760 Speaker 4: nineteen sixty three and nineteen sixty seven, And the reason 211 00:12:25,840 --> 00:12:29,880 Speaker 4: for that is during those short three years, Uh, most 212 00:12:29,920 --> 00:12:36,840 Speaker 4: people received a dead virus vaccine, let's just say, and 213 00:12:37,240 --> 00:12:39,960 Speaker 4: it's not as effective as what we have today, and 214 00:12:40,000 --> 00:12:41,280 Speaker 4: so they may need a booster. 215 00:12:42,320 --> 00:12:42,520 Speaker 2: You know. 216 00:12:43,080 --> 00:12:45,680 Speaker 1: I was just talking as a key about this because 217 00:12:45,800 --> 00:12:47,760 Speaker 1: I go to pilates and I go early in the morning. 218 00:12:47,800 --> 00:12:50,679 Speaker 1: So it's a lot of older women there. Shout out 219 00:12:50,720 --> 00:12:55,400 Speaker 1: to them though, and one woman said, if you're between 220 00:12:55,520 --> 00:12:58,160 Speaker 1: ages of sixty three and sixty eight, you have to 221 00:12:58,160 --> 00:13:00,839 Speaker 1: go get a booster. But that's not what it is. 222 00:13:01,040 --> 00:13:05,000 Speaker 1: If you were born between nineteen sixty three and nineteen 223 00:13:05,080 --> 00:13:09,319 Speaker 1: sixty seven, then you really need to be thinking about it. 224 00:13:10,120 --> 00:13:10,520 Speaker 3: Correct. 225 00:13:10,800 --> 00:13:13,440 Speaker 1: That's wow. You see how this misinformation travels. 226 00:13:13,679 --> 00:13:17,760 Speaker 4: Ugh confusing too, and then you're like why those years, 227 00:13:17,920 --> 00:13:20,600 Speaker 4: Like why what happens if I don't have a record 228 00:13:20,640 --> 00:13:24,040 Speaker 4: of measles or vaccination? And that's why it's really just 229 00:13:24,120 --> 00:13:28,040 Speaker 4: best for people to talk to their physician, because even 230 00:13:28,120 --> 00:13:31,280 Speaker 4: if they don't have a record of it, there's very 231 00:13:31,280 --> 00:13:33,040 Speaker 4: little harm in getting these vaccines. 232 00:13:33,080 --> 00:13:35,800 Speaker 3: It may just make sense to get a booster. Nonetheless, 233 00:13:35,840 --> 00:13:36,640 Speaker 3: if you don't. 234 00:13:36,360 --> 00:13:38,800 Speaker 1: Know, I looked at the vaccine schedule, and I know 235 00:13:38,840 --> 00:13:41,600 Speaker 1: the first dose is at one year or a year 236 00:13:41,600 --> 00:13:44,040 Speaker 1: and a half, and the second dose is when you're 237 00:13:44,080 --> 00:13:47,800 Speaker 1: between four and six. What about the kids that are 238 00:13:47,920 --> 00:13:49,960 Speaker 1: in between that. So, let's say you have a child 239 00:13:50,000 --> 00:13:52,800 Speaker 1: that's three years old and they've only received one dose. 240 00:13:53,200 --> 00:13:56,760 Speaker 1: Should parents be concerned or is the one dose good enough? 241 00:13:57,679 --> 00:13:58,360 Speaker 3: Good question? 242 00:13:58,679 --> 00:14:01,200 Speaker 4: So, and I want to out highly what you're saying too, 243 00:14:01,320 --> 00:14:03,840 Speaker 4: is that you're right. Kids can only get their first 244 00:14:03,880 --> 00:14:08,040 Speaker 4: dose at twelve months old. That's the purpose of herd immunity, right, 245 00:14:08,160 --> 00:14:11,199 Speaker 4: is we protect people that can't get protected, and that 246 00:14:11,240 --> 00:14:15,240 Speaker 4: includes infants under twelve months, it includes immune compromise, et cetera. 247 00:14:15,640 --> 00:14:17,800 Speaker 4: But you're right, they get their first dose at twelve 248 00:14:17,800 --> 00:14:21,040 Speaker 4: months and then that just that first dose is ninety 249 00:14:21,080 --> 00:14:25,359 Speaker 4: three percent effective, So like you're pretty darn well effective. 250 00:14:25,800 --> 00:14:32,560 Speaker 4: The second dose is really for those entering kindergarten, for example, 251 00:14:32,640 --> 00:14:36,280 Speaker 4: where measle spreads easily. It's not technically a booster, but 252 00:14:36,360 --> 00:14:39,000 Speaker 4: it does help cover the seven percent of people that 253 00:14:39,040 --> 00:14:42,560 Speaker 4: didn't respond to that first dose. And so without that 254 00:14:42,640 --> 00:14:46,720 Speaker 4: second dose there's gaps and immunity that can feel outbreaks. Now, 255 00:14:46,880 --> 00:14:50,720 Speaker 4: I will say, if you have a three year old 256 00:14:50,800 --> 00:14:52,840 Speaker 4: and you're in West Texas in the middle of this 257 00:14:52,920 --> 00:14:56,840 Speaker 4: hot zone, they can get the second MMR vaccine. Actually 258 00:14:56,880 --> 00:15:01,080 Speaker 4: you only need twenty eight days between both do and 259 00:15:01,160 --> 00:15:05,320 Speaker 4: this flexibility is actually very useful in outbreak areas where 260 00:15:05,440 --> 00:15:09,080 Speaker 4: kids could get a second dose. I will say, though, 261 00:15:09,120 --> 00:15:14,160 Speaker 4: the longer the interval generally strengthens the immunity, and so 262 00:15:14,280 --> 00:15:17,320 Speaker 4: that's why we wait a couple more years. But really 263 00:15:17,320 --> 00:15:20,000 Speaker 4: it's not a detrimental thing to get it earlier. 264 00:15:20,280 --> 00:15:24,600 Speaker 1: There's a lot of misinformation, not just on social media, 265 00:15:24,640 --> 00:15:29,680 Speaker 1: but even from government officials like RFK Junior, who is 266 00:15:29,800 --> 00:15:33,560 Speaker 1: now the new head of Health and Human Services or AHHS. 267 00:15:34,280 --> 00:15:37,720 Speaker 1: He said that measles can best be treated with vitamin 268 00:15:37,800 --> 00:15:41,120 Speaker 1: A and cod liver oil. Which do they sell cod 269 00:15:41,200 --> 00:15:42,040 Speaker 1: liver oil still? 270 00:15:42,080 --> 00:15:42,520 Speaker 3: I don't know. 271 00:15:44,120 --> 00:15:49,520 Speaker 1: And he's emphasizing that getting vaccinated should be just a 272 00:15:49,520 --> 00:15:54,080 Speaker 1: personal decision, even during an outbreak, and that kind of 273 00:15:54,120 --> 00:15:56,040 Speaker 1: framing can really confuse people. 274 00:15:56,160 --> 00:15:57,160 Speaker 2: Can you talk. 275 00:15:57,480 --> 00:16:01,600 Speaker 1: About how these kinds of messages under public health and 276 00:16:01,680 --> 00:16:03,560 Speaker 1: what the science actually says. 277 00:16:04,640 --> 00:16:08,680 Speaker 4: You're right, I mean, it's incredibly dangerous. New York Times 278 00:16:08,800 --> 00:16:12,320 Speaker 4: reported about all of these overdoses on vitamin A that 279 00:16:12,440 --> 00:16:15,760 Speaker 4: kids are showing up at hospitals and because they're liver functions, 280 00:16:16,080 --> 00:16:18,120 Speaker 4: they have liver failure now because they just got too 281 00:16:18,200 --> 00:16:22,360 Speaker 4: much vitamin A because their poor parents are terrified, and 282 00:16:22,440 --> 00:16:26,119 Speaker 4: so you know, I actually I don't necessarily blame parents 283 00:16:26,200 --> 00:16:30,160 Speaker 4: for any of this. It's an incredibly confusing landscape. This 284 00:16:30,320 --> 00:16:38,359 Speaker 4: is coming from the highest office in government, spouting really conflicting, 285 00:16:38,520 --> 00:16:42,040 Speaker 4: confusing messages for people to try to understand. 286 00:16:42,760 --> 00:16:43,200 Speaker 3: You're right. 287 00:16:43,280 --> 00:16:47,160 Speaker 4: One of his messages was that everyone just needs vitamin 288 00:16:47,200 --> 00:16:50,400 Speaker 4: A and they will do just fine. And you know, 289 00:16:50,440 --> 00:16:53,320 Speaker 4: there is a kernel of truth there. The who does 290 00:16:53,360 --> 00:16:56,360 Speaker 4: say we need to treat measles infections with vitamin A, 291 00:16:57,240 --> 00:17:02,800 Speaker 4: but in vitamin deficient countries. Only zero point three percent 292 00:17:02,840 --> 00:17:08,760 Speaker 4: of Americans are vitamin A deficient, and so vitamin A supplementation, 293 00:17:09,320 --> 00:17:15,359 Speaker 4: especially not under physicians supervision, can be incredibly dangerous. And 294 00:17:15,400 --> 00:17:20,560 Speaker 4: the reason for that is because vitamin A is a 295 00:17:21,160 --> 00:17:25,320 Speaker 4: fat soluble vitamin, which means if you consume too much 296 00:17:25,480 --> 00:17:29,360 Speaker 4: like supplements, especially for kids, you can't excrete it out 297 00:17:29,400 --> 00:17:32,840 Speaker 4: of your stool or your p so it builds up 298 00:17:32,880 --> 00:17:36,040 Speaker 4: to toxic levels and leads to to liver damage and 299 00:17:36,080 --> 00:17:37,480 Speaker 4: other serious health issues. 300 00:17:37,880 --> 00:17:41,639 Speaker 3: And so I mean, yeah, I guess I can't. 301 00:17:42,040 --> 00:17:45,359 Speaker 4: I don't know what the words are for how crazy 302 00:17:45,400 --> 00:17:49,240 Speaker 4: we are in this moment to be hearing this information 303 00:17:49,680 --> 00:17:54,280 Speaker 4: from a Health and Human Service secretary is it's beyond me. 304 00:17:55,640 --> 00:17:59,200 Speaker 2: Something you've mentioned is how important it is to talk 305 00:17:59,240 --> 00:18:04,320 Speaker 2: to your doctor, you know. But when I listen to reports, 306 00:18:04,359 --> 00:18:06,239 Speaker 2: I know this is not the case everywhere. But I 307 00:18:06,280 --> 00:18:09,880 Speaker 2: think The Daily just did a story where they were 308 00:18:09,880 --> 00:18:13,000 Speaker 2: in West Texas and they were talking about the outbreak 309 00:18:13,040 --> 00:18:15,879 Speaker 2: and how it was straining the public health system, particularly 310 00:18:15,920 --> 00:18:18,600 Speaker 2: physicians there. We combined that with something we like to 311 00:18:18,640 --> 00:18:21,760 Speaker 2: do at Dope Labs is to consider that science and 312 00:18:21,840 --> 00:18:24,600 Speaker 2: medicine don't happen in a vacuum, and all the other 313 00:18:25,200 --> 00:18:28,040 Speaker 2: inequities of the world show up in these places too, 314 00:18:28,440 --> 00:18:32,800 Speaker 2: And so I'm curious about how outbreaks like this strain 315 00:18:32,880 --> 00:18:36,960 Speaker 2: our public health systems and impact communities from your perspective, 316 00:18:37,040 --> 00:18:38,600 Speaker 2: especially marginalized ones. 317 00:18:39,800 --> 00:18:43,320 Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, first off, it takes an incredible amount 318 00:18:43,400 --> 00:18:46,800 Speaker 4: of resources. I mean, we're talking dollar signs right now 319 00:18:46,880 --> 00:18:51,280 Speaker 4: right about responding to these outbreaks, and that's because it's 320 00:18:51,359 --> 00:18:55,119 Speaker 4: so contagious and right now, a lot of challenge is 321 00:18:55,160 --> 00:18:59,639 Speaker 4: around the mistrust of public health, particularly with for example, 322 00:18:59,680 --> 00:19:04,240 Speaker 4: these communities like the Mennonite such as don't trust institutions. 323 00:19:04,520 --> 00:19:08,640 Speaker 4: They're not coming forward, they're not quarantining, they're not reporting cases, 324 00:19:09,200 --> 00:19:12,560 Speaker 4: and so we're seeing this outbreak grow and grow and grow, 325 00:19:12,760 --> 00:19:16,640 Speaker 4: which costs resources, that cost time, but also is costing 326 00:19:17,240 --> 00:19:20,760 Speaker 4: the health of kids as well. You know, I mentioned 327 00:19:20,840 --> 00:19:24,160 Speaker 4: talk to your physician. We often forget that one third 328 00:19:24,200 --> 00:19:27,879 Speaker 4: of Americans don't have a primary care physician, right, and 329 00:19:27,960 --> 00:19:30,760 Speaker 4: they can't just go talk to a physician. They go 330 00:19:30,800 --> 00:19:34,120 Speaker 4: to the emergency department, they look on social media, they 331 00:19:34,119 --> 00:19:38,040 Speaker 4: maybe go to their pharmacy, they talk to their pastors. 332 00:19:38,160 --> 00:19:40,480 Speaker 4: I mean, there's a lot of different trust and messengers 333 00:19:40,520 --> 00:19:43,919 Speaker 4: out there, and so what I've been calling for lately 334 00:19:44,240 --> 00:19:48,159 Speaker 4: is that instead of talking from the Ivory Tower and 335 00:19:48,200 --> 00:19:51,120 Speaker 4: hoping it trickles down to each household, we really need 336 00:19:51,119 --> 00:19:55,200 Speaker 4: to equip trust and messengers. And I'm really happy with 337 00:19:55,760 --> 00:20:00,320 Speaker 4: those physicians coming forward and speaking the Mennonite community trust us. 338 00:20:00,440 --> 00:20:03,400 Speaker 4: They're faith based leaders a ton. I wish they would 339 00:20:03,440 --> 00:20:06,040 Speaker 4: be coming out more. Maybe they are not. During COVID 340 00:20:06,080 --> 00:20:10,320 Speaker 4: we saw like barbershop owners taking ownership of COVID vaccines, right, 341 00:20:10,400 --> 00:20:13,240 Speaker 4: And so I think this moment isn't necessarily that more 342 00:20:13,280 --> 00:20:17,560 Speaker 4: clipboards have to descend and as parachutes. But like, we 343 00:20:17,640 --> 00:20:20,399 Speaker 4: need to figure out how to partner and equip trust 344 00:20:20,400 --> 00:20:24,800 Speaker 4: in messengers in a timely, understandable, and actionable manner so 345 00:20:25,600 --> 00:20:31,120 Speaker 4: we can effectively respond to these outbreaks. And I'm honestly 346 00:20:31,119 --> 00:20:32,960 Speaker 4: I'm not sure how much that is happening. 347 00:20:33,000 --> 00:20:33,720 Speaker 3: It's kind of a. 348 00:20:33,640 --> 00:20:36,720 Speaker 4: New way to think about it, but that would help 349 00:20:36,760 --> 00:20:37,800 Speaker 4: meet this moment right. 350 00:20:37,680 --> 00:20:56,439 Speaker 1: Now, We're just coming out of COVID. Everybody's tired, nobody 351 00:20:56,480 --> 00:21:00,040 Speaker 1: wants to wear a mask anymore, like fatigued with the 352 00:20:59,840 --> 00:21:05,520 Speaker 1: whole pandemic thing. What can we do to stop the spread? 353 00:21:05,560 --> 00:21:08,520 Speaker 1: Is it going to be similar to our action with COVID? 354 00:21:09,240 --> 00:21:12,240 Speaker 1: This is way more contagious. Is there extra precautions we 355 00:21:12,280 --> 00:21:15,280 Speaker 1: need to be taking. What do we do to not 356 00:21:15,720 --> 00:21:17,240 Speaker 1: let this get any worse? 357 00:21:19,200 --> 00:21:22,239 Speaker 4: That's like a billion dollar question right right, But I 358 00:21:22,280 --> 00:21:26,160 Speaker 4: think you know the bottom line is if you have 359 00:21:26,240 --> 00:21:29,760 Speaker 4: your MMR vaccine, you are very well protected. And this 360 00:21:29,840 --> 00:21:33,560 Speaker 4: should not be in your top ten stressors of the day. 361 00:21:33,640 --> 00:21:36,919 Speaker 4: There's plenty of other stressors out there. This is not 362 00:21:37,080 --> 00:21:39,399 Speaker 4: because you are protected from their vaccine. 363 00:21:39,480 --> 00:21:41,240 Speaker 3: I think I. 364 00:21:41,320 --> 00:21:46,520 Speaker 4: Worry about parents with those with you know, infants. I 365 00:21:46,560 --> 00:21:49,840 Speaker 4: am very worried about them, especially if they're in hot zones, 366 00:21:50,320 --> 00:21:52,960 Speaker 4: and my advice to them is to pay attention to 367 00:21:53,040 --> 00:21:57,000 Speaker 4: the Public Health Department websites about where these outbreaks are happening, 368 00:21:58,040 --> 00:21:59,360 Speaker 4: where exposures are. 369 00:22:00,280 --> 00:22:01,400 Speaker 3: Maybe even if you're in. 370 00:22:01,320 --> 00:22:04,639 Speaker 4: West Texas with a five month old, try not to 371 00:22:04,720 --> 00:22:06,360 Speaker 4: go to public spaces right now. 372 00:22:06,400 --> 00:22:06,880 Speaker 1: I know that. 373 00:22:07,080 --> 00:22:10,320 Speaker 4: Sucks, but like these little kids have very little protection 374 00:22:10,440 --> 00:22:13,679 Speaker 4: starting out about six months because antibody's wane from the 375 00:22:13,720 --> 00:22:18,800 Speaker 4: placenta exposure. Now, as far as the broader, bigger question 376 00:22:18,880 --> 00:22:24,360 Speaker 4: around vaccine hesitancy and these bigger questions, I think that one, 377 00:22:24,400 --> 00:22:26,880 Speaker 4: it's equipping trust to messengers. Who are those in your 378 00:22:26,880 --> 00:22:31,560 Speaker 4: community that need information and people look to for health information? 379 00:22:32,320 --> 00:22:33,959 Speaker 3: Do they have the right sources? 380 00:22:34,440 --> 00:22:39,080 Speaker 4: Two is responding to these events and these moments in 381 00:22:39,119 --> 00:22:43,280 Speaker 4: a place of empathy and really trying to understand why 382 00:22:43,320 --> 00:22:46,320 Speaker 4: these parents are so scared to get an MMR vaccine, 383 00:22:46,359 --> 00:22:50,560 Speaker 4: why it is so much more an appetite to have 384 00:22:50,560 --> 00:22:54,119 Speaker 4: a vitamin A supplement versus a vaccine, and really try 385 00:22:54,160 --> 00:22:58,960 Speaker 4: to answer their questions and be responsive to their needs 386 00:22:59,200 --> 00:23:02,560 Speaker 4: because they are seeing this firestorm. And I also think 387 00:23:02,600 --> 00:23:05,520 Speaker 4: like there just needs to be systematic changes as well, 388 00:23:05,920 --> 00:23:08,760 Speaker 4: maybe like not how AJHSS. 389 00:23:08,200 --> 00:23:09,440 Speaker 3: Secretary warrior is. 390 00:23:09,560 --> 00:23:12,080 Speaker 4: But I mean there's many different levels to this, and 391 00:23:12,119 --> 00:23:15,280 Speaker 4: I think we all play a role once we are 392 00:23:15,359 --> 00:23:17,919 Speaker 4: in the comfort of knowing we have the immunity to 393 00:23:17,960 --> 00:23:19,080 Speaker 4: protect ourselves. 394 00:23:20,840 --> 00:23:25,280 Speaker 2: Earlier, you mentioned like this shifting attitude across the nation 395 00:23:25,560 --> 00:23:28,760 Speaker 2: and maybe across the globe that is very individual. First, 396 00:23:29,359 --> 00:23:33,000 Speaker 2: we're talking about hotspots like West Texas, but even back 397 00:23:33,040 --> 00:23:35,879 Speaker 2: in twenty nineteen, we saw outbreaks in California and New 398 00:23:36,000 --> 00:23:40,280 Speaker 2: York and Washington, and I'm curious, are you concerned about 399 00:23:40,320 --> 00:23:43,720 Speaker 2: outbreaks in those kind of places again? And then I 400 00:23:43,720 --> 00:23:47,080 Speaker 2: think the second question is is measles the big bad 401 00:23:47,119 --> 00:23:49,680 Speaker 2: wolf or is measles just the prelude as we think 402 00:23:49,720 --> 00:23:53,080 Speaker 2: about this individual first approach to public health. 403 00:23:53,880 --> 00:23:54,840 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean the. 404 00:23:54,880 --> 00:23:59,720 Speaker 4: Challenge with individualism, especially with infectious diseases, is that infectious 405 00:23:59,720 --> 00:24:03,480 Speaker 4: disease is violate the assumption of independence, right Like what 406 00:24:03,640 --> 00:24:07,920 Speaker 4: TT does at the grocery store directly impacts me. I 407 00:24:07,960 --> 00:24:11,719 Speaker 4: think we all got that lesson during COVID and this 408 00:24:11,880 --> 00:24:15,640 Speaker 4: is what's gonna happen with measles. It will happen with polio, 409 00:24:16,119 --> 00:24:18,880 Speaker 4: whooping cough, we're seeing right now as well. I mean, 410 00:24:18,920 --> 00:24:25,280 Speaker 4: it's gonna come back, because the general assumption behind public health, 411 00:24:25,320 --> 00:24:28,800 Speaker 4: behind our community is that we care about our neighbors 412 00:24:28,800 --> 00:24:33,280 Speaker 4: and our communities and as well as ourselves. And the 413 00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:36,720 Speaker 4: ultimate question is what happens when you stop caring about 414 00:24:36,720 --> 00:24:40,879 Speaker 4: our communities and our neighbors. Is not a pretty scene 415 00:24:41,240 --> 00:24:45,600 Speaker 4: I want to explore. And so right now, in this moment, 416 00:24:45,880 --> 00:24:52,080 Speaker 4: it's about educating. I think it's also about reframing how 417 00:24:52,119 --> 00:24:56,200 Speaker 4: we talk about it, right, that a measles vaccine does 418 00:24:56,359 --> 00:25:00,280 Speaker 4: protect you and your immediate family as well well as 419 00:25:00,359 --> 00:25:04,160 Speaker 4: the community, right and really try to measles vaccines. Here's 420 00:25:04,200 --> 00:25:07,800 Speaker 4: another one allows you to have more freedom. You can 421 00:25:07,840 --> 00:25:11,160 Speaker 4: go not get sick, you don't have to be hospitalized, 422 00:25:11,359 --> 00:25:14,359 Speaker 4: you can go to school. Schools won't be shut down 423 00:25:14,400 --> 00:25:18,200 Speaker 4: from a measles outbreak. I mean, we can use these frameworks. 424 00:25:18,320 --> 00:25:20,480 Speaker 4: We just have to be a whole lot smarter in 425 00:25:20,640 --> 00:25:24,400 Speaker 4: the delivery and the framing of it. But I do 426 00:25:24,440 --> 00:25:26,960 Speaker 4: think it is needed in this moment more now than ever. 427 00:25:28,000 --> 00:25:29,399 Speaker 2: That was great. That's it for me. 428 00:25:29,480 --> 00:25:30,359 Speaker 3: It was amazing. 429 00:25:30,480 --> 00:25:32,160 Speaker 2: Is there anything that we didn't ask that you think 430 00:25:32,240 --> 00:25:35,480 Speaker 2: is like, hey, you need to know this. 431 00:25:35,720 --> 00:25:38,960 Speaker 4: One interesting thing that is a lot of nuance. But 432 00:25:39,000 --> 00:25:43,000 Speaker 4: it seems like you guys like nuance is every five 433 00:25:43,080 --> 00:25:45,760 Speaker 4: years measles flares up. 434 00:25:46,560 --> 00:25:50,960 Speaker 3: That was before the vaccine too, And guess. 435 00:25:50,720 --> 00:25:52,719 Speaker 4: What, it's been about five to six years since our 436 00:25:52,800 --> 00:25:56,360 Speaker 4: last big flare up. And so I think that not 437 00:25:56,440 --> 00:26:03,880 Speaker 4: only is driven by individualism amnesia, but it's also just 438 00:26:04,040 --> 00:26:08,800 Speaker 4: driven by the virus itself. And we'll see if this 439 00:26:08,960 --> 00:26:12,080 Speaker 4: isn't just a general increase in measles overall, or it's 440 00:26:12,240 --> 00:26:15,760 Speaker 4: just a bad year because measles acts weirdly every five years. 441 00:26:16,040 --> 00:26:18,760 Speaker 4: That's gonna take time to know or understand. 442 00:26:23,400 --> 00:26:26,560 Speaker 1: Okay, So for me, the key takeaways where the measles 443 00:26:26,560 --> 00:26:29,239 Speaker 1: are back, and it's not just a rash. It's one 444 00:26:29,280 --> 00:26:33,280 Speaker 1: of the most contagious viruses on earth. It can wipe 445 00:26:33,320 --> 00:26:38,880 Speaker 1: out your immune memory. And the vaccine still the best 446 00:26:38,960 --> 00:26:42,680 Speaker 1: tool we have in our toolbox. Yes, not only is 447 00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:46,160 Speaker 1: the best tool, it actually works. So if you're vaccinated, 448 00:26:46,160 --> 00:26:48,960 Speaker 1: you're ninety seven percent protected, and that means you're not 449 00:26:49,040 --> 00:26:52,280 Speaker 1: just keeping yourself safe, you're keeping you know, babies that 450 00:26:52,320 --> 00:26:54,760 Speaker 1: are under one that can't be vaccinated safe. Older folks 451 00:26:54,800 --> 00:26:56,560 Speaker 1: who naturally have Wanning immune systems. 452 00:26:56,560 --> 00:26:59,399 Speaker 2: You're keeping them safe. And people who just can't get 453 00:26:59,480 --> 00:27:01,480 Speaker 2: vaccinated for other reasons, you're keeping them safe too. 454 00:27:01,720 --> 00:27:04,280 Speaker 1: And if you're not sure about your vaccine status, ask 455 00:27:04,320 --> 00:27:06,880 Speaker 1: your doctor. If you were born between nineteen sixty three 456 00:27:07,040 --> 00:27:10,400 Speaker 1: and sixty seven, especially, that's a group that might need 457 00:27:10,440 --> 00:27:13,639 Speaker 1: a booster. And this is really a moment for us 458 00:27:13,680 --> 00:27:16,280 Speaker 1: to just think about public health and not thinking about 459 00:27:16,280 --> 00:27:18,800 Speaker 1: it just as like this protective thing, but as this 460 00:27:18,920 --> 00:27:19,560 Speaker 1: powerful thing. 461 00:27:19,600 --> 00:27:21,520 Speaker 2: Think of it as a power up. It gives you 462 00:27:21,560 --> 00:27:24,119 Speaker 2: the freedom to move about the country and outside of 463 00:27:24,119 --> 00:27:26,800 Speaker 2: it because measles is global. So if you're vaccinated, don't 464 00:27:26,800 --> 00:27:28,280 Speaker 2: have to worry about any of this. If you're on 465 00:27:28,400 --> 00:27:31,480 Speaker 2: vacation or I guess working, whatever you're doing, you don't 466 00:27:31,480 --> 00:27:32,320 Speaker 2: have to worry about it. 467 00:27:32,520 --> 00:27:35,840 Speaker 1: Yeah, And if you found this episode helpful, send it 468 00:27:35,880 --> 00:27:47,159 Speaker 1: to your friend or your pilates group. 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