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Speaker 1: All great things were built by people no more capable

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Speaker 1: than your actively learning and pushing yourself every single day.

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Speaker 1: There is no problem. I don't think any human being

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Speaker 1: in the world can solve. Ken Tiyoshimira is a co

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Speaker 1: founder of Neuro.

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Speaker 2: A competitive Muay Thai fighter, ultra marathon runner, and mirroralist.

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Speaker 2: This episode is about how someone operates at a high

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Speaker 2: level across every domain and the system underneath all of it.

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Speaker 2: Suffering is not a reason to quit, it's a reason

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Speaker 2: to break through.

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Speaker 1: I think most people quit too early. Whatever you dive

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Speaker 1: into is almost a stress test system into what makes

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Speaker 1: you a comprehensive individual. All the different fields that I've

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Speaker 1: entered into and tried to be somewhat good at, they've

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Speaker 1: all built on each other to create me more comprehensively.

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Speaker 2: You said that fighting teaches you not just how to react,

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Speaker 2: but how to respond.

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Speaker 1: If you're reacting to everything in life, you're going to

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Speaker 1: be absolutely paralyzed. If you don't cheat on training, training

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Speaker 1: will never cheat on you. I think that idea of

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Speaker 1: creativity or artistic thinking, everyone has it. It's just how

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Speaker 1: is it built into the system. How do you apply

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Speaker 1: it to everything else that you do? In your life.

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Speaker 2: Hi guys, Kate here, thank you so much for tuning

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Speaker 2: into today's conversation. Please do us a favor and follow

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Speaker 2: the show wherever you're listening. It helps us continue bringing

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Speaker 2: you inspiring conversations. We'll be right back with our conversation

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Speaker 2: after this shortbreak, Kent. For our viewers listening today, what

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Speaker 2: is the reason you think it's important for them to

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Speaker 2: stay and what is it that you've spent your life

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Speaker 2: figuring out that actually matters to them.

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Speaker 1: I think humans are such complex creatures that we all

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Speaker 1: have the capability to do more than, you know, just

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Speaker 1: one thing. And for myself, I truly believe that in

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Speaker 1: all the different fields that I've entered into and you know,

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Speaker 1: tried to be somewhat good at, they've all built on

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Speaker 1: each other to create me more comprehensively, rather than what

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Speaker 1: some might say is a lack of focus.

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Speaker 2: And in twenty twenty four, Neuro your company was the

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Speaker 2: fastest growing brand on TikTok shop, But long before that

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Speaker 2: was a company. As you're saying, it seems like you

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Speaker 2: were building something else entirely, which is a system for

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Speaker 2: how to perform. So let's dive in. Tell us about

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Speaker 2: your journey and what led you to building neuro and

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Speaker 2: kind of all the things that you just mentioned.

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Speaker 1: Okay, I mean how far back should we go? Because

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Speaker 1: you know, even when I was young, my you know,

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Speaker 1: both my parents were working, so daycare for me was karate,

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Speaker 1: and martial arts became such a big part of my

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Speaker 1: life because and my identity frankly, because it was where

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Speaker 1: you know, I mean, I had a father figure, but

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Speaker 1: he wasn't really around because she was just so busy,

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Speaker 1: Like I never really knew my dad until I was thirteen,

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Speaker 1: So that martial arts environment became the place where I

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Speaker 1: was able to find I guess that like some sort

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Speaker 1: of masculinity that I could attach myself to. And in

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Speaker 1: that process, I think developing all the ideologies of martial

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Speaker 1: arts and embedding that into the way I prosed school,

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Speaker 1: the way I approached other sports that I did, the

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Speaker 1: way I continue to pursue it, and then eventually got

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Speaker 1: into neuroscience because I wanted to learn how cognitive performance

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Speaker 1: matches up with physical performance. It leaned the groundwork out

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Speaker 1: for ultimately where I am now, which is, you know,

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Speaker 1: a business owner that's constantly thinking about system building, constantly

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Speaker 1: thinking about processes, and you know, even prior to that

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Speaker 1: post college, post fighting career, because I didn't want to

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Speaker 1: get punched in the face anymore. I went into the

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Speaker 1: arts because it was something that I realized I could

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Speaker 1: push myself more further mentally and went to uSell a

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Speaker 1: film school, dropped out because I was shooting a documentary

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Speaker 1: with my friend Najib that didn't get produced and financed

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Speaker 1: because one of our executive producers passed away. It was

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Speaker 1: so Stephan Scarbeck was a producer for Amy Winehouse, and

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Speaker 1: there's a possibility that Amy Winehouse wasn't going to come

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Speaker 1: in and be an executive producer for a film, but

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Speaker 1: shinded up passing away that same year. So it kind

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Speaker 1: of took me down this entire different path of Okay,

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Speaker 1: what's something I can control, and that was art illustration.

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Speaker 2: Then eventually murals that's so interesting that you had both

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Speaker 2: the creative background and the athletic background, because you know,

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Speaker 2: it's kind of like what you said at the beginning

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Speaker 2: of the episode, where sometimes people feel like certain things

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Speaker 2: don't mix. But I love knowing that you had this

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Speaker 2: deep interest in athletics and that expressed itself through martial arts.

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Speaker 2: And you know, I know, you also run out your

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Speaker 2: marathons and you do a lot of other things athletically too,

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Speaker 2: But it started out with martial arts, and then post

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Speaker 2: college it translated creatively. Did you always know you were

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Speaker 2: a creative person?

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Speaker 1: I mean I told my mom. I was like, I'm

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Speaker 1: going to be an artist, mom, like when I was

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Speaker 1: five years old, and like any other Asian parents, she

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Speaker 1: was like, no, the hell you are not. You are

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Speaker 1: definitely not becoming an artist. But it's something that you know,

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Speaker 1: Even when I was a young age, I art wasn't

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Speaker 1: necessarily the end goal, Like the idea of like doing

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Speaker 1: art wasn't the end goal. It was really I saw

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Speaker 1: it as like the ultimate form of freedom, even as

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Speaker 1: a child, like when I was like drawing with crayons

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Speaker 1: or I was putting Collagius together. It was this idea

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Speaker 1: that I could create anything within the boundary, like within

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Speaker 1: my own physical boundaries, and to me that was really

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Speaker 1: interesting and eventually, you know, that let me down the

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Speaker 1: path of like, Okay, how do I apply this to

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Speaker 1: my martial arts, which obviously had the word art in it,

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Speaker 1: because there is physical creativity that you could do with it.

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Speaker 1: How do I apply this to my thought process with

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Speaker 1: how I even study, which is the reason I got

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Speaker 1: into neo trop pics during my own research, you know,

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Speaker 1: taking things like vasopressin so I could enhance my short

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Speaker 1: term memory before tests, so I can maximize my efficiency

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Speaker 1: to actually doing art in the former murals and painting

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Speaker 1: in big ways that you know, I could see a

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Speaker 1: vision and I had to actualize it in some way.

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Speaker 2: I grew up in a very athletic household where sports

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Speaker 2: were always the focus. But I relate to you in

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Speaker 2: a big way because I also had a big artistic

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Speaker 2: background and I loved taking art classes and that was

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Speaker 2: a side of me that I didn't tap into till

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Speaker 2: after college as well, because I kind of never knew

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Speaker 2: like where could this go? Yeah, So I like knowing

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Speaker 2: and hearing you say that art can be expressed in

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Speaker 2: so many different things, whether it be in studying neuroscience

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Speaker 2: and how you actually study, to how you perform athletically

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Speaker 2: in a martial arts practice. I mean, I was always

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Speaker 2: a big believer that having that kind of visual mindset

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Speaker 2: and that artistic background allowed me to like see a

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Speaker 2: field differently.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, do you think you're do you think of yourself

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Speaker 1: as like more of a like a visual learner. Definitely right,

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Speaker 1: And I think like that visual learning translates a lot

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Speaker 1: into even like with martial arts, you learn forms or

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Speaker 1: you learn certain moves. You could almost place yourself because

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Speaker 1: you're a visual learner into these situations, so you can

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Speaker 1: learn how to like more efficiently run because you could

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Speaker 1: to apply yourself to that. And I don't know, I

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Speaker 1: think that idea of like creativity or artistic thinking, everyone

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Speaker 1: has it, it's just how is it built into the system.

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Speaker 1: How do you apply it to everything else that you

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Speaker 1: do in your life?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and I often find that some of the most

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Speaker 2: successful founders are really creative and can tap into that

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Speaker 2: side of themselves. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I mean think about Steve Jobs, you know, one of

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Speaker 1: the most famous entrepreneurs ever to exist, and he's a

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Speaker 1: guy that dove deep into calligraphy, deep into design, and

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Speaker 1: that dictated how he changed the I mean, honestly he

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Speaker 1: changed like the idea of industrialization. How you take the

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Speaker 1: industrialization of computers and personalize it to people and now

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Speaker 1: we're on it for like five six hours a day.

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Speaker 1: These are things that we use on a daily basis

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Speaker 1: because we could almost like we feel comfortable using it

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Speaker 1: because of the design, because of the art components of it.

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Speaker 2: You have a pretty athletic family, right Your dear sister

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Speaker 2: was Olympic level weight trainer.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, she's yeah, Olympic little weightlifting, which was like a

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Speaker 1: national level. Right now, What was.

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Speaker 2: Going on in your household that like really pushed athletics.

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Speaker 2: Was this just something that you guys liked challenging yourself

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Speaker 2: to do.

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Speaker 1: It's so funny because like my sister and I were

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Speaker 1: watching old videos like a few months ago, and we're

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Speaker 1: just doing like summersaults and we're like jumping on the bed,

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Speaker 1: and I think, like my mom, because my dad was

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Speaker 1: always away for work, my mom couldn't handle two kids

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Speaker 1: like just running around. So she was like, you know what,

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Speaker 1: just do your thing. We're running around, you know, we're

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Speaker 1: like both of our daycares was something athletic, you know,

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Speaker 1: like whether it was swimming for my sister or martial

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Speaker 1: arts for me. And then eventually my sister got really

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Speaker 1: into equestrian, but like it was a very expensive sport,

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Speaker 1: so she had to get really good at it so

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Speaker 1: that she could ride other people's horses, so that she

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Speaker 1: could you know, like she could pay for her own training,

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Speaker 1: and then she got into CrossFit, which eventually led her

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Speaker 1: down this path of Olympic weightlifting. And yeah, it's like

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Speaker 1: my sister is like a freak athlete. It's unbelievable. And

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Speaker 1: then for me it was just always martial arts. I

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Speaker 1: was like living in the studio, in the dojo just

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Speaker 1: all the time, Like that was like my safe haven.

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Speaker 2: So when you went to see Si Diego, you were

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Speaker 2: balancing Moi Thai in Thailand. Yes, with a neuroscience degree. Yes,

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Speaker 2: and you Okay, so paint the picture for us what

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Speaker 2: did that actually look like in college? Like how were

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Speaker 2: you spending your time? Were you mainly in California or

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Speaker 2: were you doing online classes?

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Speaker 1: Yeah? So, I mean I hinted at this a little

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Speaker 1: bit with like the vasopresant thing, but there was a

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Speaker 1: point where I knew I had to maximize my study

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Speaker 1: time and my schooling. So that's really when I started

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Speaker 1: getting into neotropics and what supplements I could take to

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Speaker 1: enhance whether it's like short term memory or you know,

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Speaker 1: efficiency in taking quizzes, but and tests. But Moi Thai,

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Speaker 1: I would be fighting in I would be training like

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Speaker 1: about four to six hours every single day, I would

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Speaker 1: be training in Thailand. During the summers, we would go

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Speaker 1: out to set Yotong down in Pataya and train out there,

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Speaker 1: and we always have a fight for the King's Birthday,

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Speaker 1: which happens around August. And then I would go to

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Speaker 1: Japan and stay at the Kochikan, which is the number

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Speaker 1: one judo university in Japan, and train there, train with

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Speaker 1: Imperial Guards, or train with the Japanese Olympic judo team

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Speaker 1: at the Codocon. And so it was a lot of traveling.

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Speaker 1: But my like San Diego has an incredible judo team,

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Speaker 1: Like the Olympic judo coach justin Flores is actually down

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Speaker 1: there still, and so it was almost like this space

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Speaker 1: where I was and I wasn't even thinking about it

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Speaker 1: in high school.

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Speaker 2: You know.

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Speaker 1: It wasn't like I'm going to San Diego because the

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Speaker 1: judo is so good down there. It's like I was

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Speaker 1: very fortunate enough to find that opportunity that I could

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Speaker 1: discover a really good community of martial artists which allowed

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Speaker 1: me to excel even further.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and I can imagine that practicing those sports in

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Speaker 2: those places, especially my tie, I'm saying it wrong, tie, guys,

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Speaker 2: I can't talked about this. My tie is a drink

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Speaker 2: MOI sport. Hello, Okay, I could imagine that practicing Muay

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Speaker 2: Thai in Thailand is a very intense and unique experience, right, So, like,

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Speaker 2: what does the training look like on a day to

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Speaker 2: day I.

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Speaker 1: Mean, it's it's intense, but it's it's almost like a

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Speaker 1: reframing of how training is here. So the facilities definitely

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Speaker 1: aren't as nice. There's more archaic ways that you're doing things.

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Speaker 1: But it's you're doing roadwork in the morning. You wake up,

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Speaker 1: you do roadwork in the morning. You know you're what

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Speaker 1: is roadwork? Oh running, So you go run like a

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Speaker 1: five k or whatever in the morning, five five k

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Speaker 1: to like five miles whatever in the morning, and then

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Speaker 1: you spend basically like if you go to the gym's

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Speaker 1: it's so funny and I could probably pull up some

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Speaker 1: pictures later, but they just have these giant recycled tires

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Speaker 1: all over the gym and that's where you practice, like

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Speaker 1: you're jumping and like basically your like balance work, and

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Speaker 1: then you like spar you do pad work. Like the

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Speaker 1: mats you could tell are like incredibly gross, you know,

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Speaker 1: because there's no way of like really cleaning them, and

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Speaker 1: these are the places that produce champions. And all these

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Speaker 1: people that you know become champions are five year old

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Speaker 1: kids whose parents put them into more Tide because that

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Speaker 1: was their only way of making an income. And these

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Speaker 1: are the people that you're training against. So you could

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Speaker 1: imagine that the level of people that you know have

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Speaker 1: to fight for their life are the ones that are

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Speaker 1: also your training partners. And just the it's just like

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Speaker 1: one makes you have an appreciation for a life, but

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Speaker 1: allows you to push yourself further because it's like, how

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Speaker 1: many more resources do we have than all these people?

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Speaker 1: Like you have to get better if I'm hanging with them, Like.

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Speaker 2: What is it like showing up as an American university student? Right,

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Speaker 2: you know you're in the US. It's very different than

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Speaker 2: that type of environment that you're scriving, Like if that's

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Speaker 2: super gritty?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, well, and how do you compare? Thai

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Speaker 1: people are the nicest people in the world, and there's

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Speaker 1: no level of like I feel there's cynicism like embedded

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Speaker 1: in American culture unfortunately, But when you go to Thailand

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Speaker 1: and you're coming there as someone who's willing to experience

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Speaker 1: the culture and actually train alongside these people. They will

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Speaker 1: accept you with open arms as long as you can

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Speaker 1: hang out with them. And the way you can hang

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Speaker 1: with them is not giving up knowing that your place

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Speaker 1: is like to get better and having that same experience

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Speaker 1: that everyone else is experiencing. So if you're trying to

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Speaker 1: have a different experience than them, which is just like

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Speaker 1: natural in any environment they are, it's like with anything,

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Speaker 1: you know, like don't be an outlet, don't be acting

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Speaker 1: like the American tourist in their environment, like respect what

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Speaker 1: they're doing and go in and like learn as much

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Speaker 1: as possible, and then you take that and then you

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Speaker 1: take it back to the United States.

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Speaker 2: Did you have to learn the language while you were there?

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Speaker 1: No, I know, like three words?

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Speaker 2: What did you like? What would you say you learned

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Speaker 2: about yourself through being in that environment?

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Speaker 1: I mean beyond the fact that you know, I'm incredibly

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Speaker 1: grateful that I grew up in America, it's actually after

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Speaker 1: saying these how these people live and what they do

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Speaker 1: every single day, it's you know, there's like a a

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Speaker 1: level of humility that you have to approach anything with.

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Speaker 1: And when you see that, there's a level of excellence

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Speaker 1: that these people push for every single day, knowing that

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Speaker 1: their life depends on it, and you're doing this almost

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Speaker 1: has a hobby relative to how they're experiencing muatai in

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Speaker 1: their own world. It's I mean, I'm so privileged, you know,

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Speaker 1: I'm so privileged to be able to even experience this

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Speaker 1: pay for like, you know, however much plane tickets were

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Speaker 1: to fly out there, stay out there for like two weeks,

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Speaker 1: three weeks at a time, and you know, be able

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Speaker 1: to go go back and sleep in a nice bed

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Speaker 1: once I'm back at home. It's like, it's incredible, And

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Speaker 1: so I don't know, you have to you have to

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Speaker 1: just like enjoy all these experiences and allow them to

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Speaker 1: just just take it and elevate who you are.

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Speaker 2: What was the goal for you with training there? Like

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Speaker 2: did you want to be a professional fighter?

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Speaker 1: I did? But you know, it's funny because I think

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Speaker 1: sometime in my junior year, I realized that me wanting

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Speaker 1: to be a professional fighter was me chasing my ego

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Speaker 1: more than anything. And fighting has always you know, my

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Speaker 1: original karate coach always taught me, if you don't cheat

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Speaker 1: on training, like training will never cheat on you. And

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Speaker 1: so I dove in headfirst and put myself into fighting,

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Speaker 1: like and it was always about like, how can I

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Speaker 1: make myself better? How can I make my It was

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Speaker 1: always about me within this environment, and I realized, especially

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Speaker 1: being in Thailand, it was so eye opening to for

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Speaker 1: It was interesting training with the professional team because you

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Speaker 1: start understanding what team is in a sport that's so individualistic,

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Speaker 1: and how important that is. And at some point something

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Speaker 1: clicked in my brain where I realized that that's not

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Speaker 1: really the path I wanted to go down, Like I

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Speaker 1: can push myself in a physical and mental way, but

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Speaker 1: how do I apply that to doing something bigger by

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Speaker 1: doing it with a greater group of people.

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Speaker 2: I really liked what you said to me yesterday on

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Speaker 2: the phone. You said that fighting teaches you not just

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Speaker 2: how to react, but how to respond. So I'm curious,

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Speaker 2: from a business perspective, how does that mentality help.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's I don't know. There's so many things that

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Speaker 1: fighting has tomming, and there's so many things that I

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Speaker 1: feel like fighting has been detrimental because it's hard to

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Speaker 1: break away from that yeah mindset right at the competitive mindset.

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Speaker 1: And I always think that athletes are some of the

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Speaker 1: best people to work with because they have that competitive

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Speaker 1: mindset as long as their ego doesn't get in the way.

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Speaker 1: And I had to break away from that ego. That

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Speaker 1: ego dissolution was one of the biggest things that I

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Speaker 1: think allowed me to elevate myself in art, allow me

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Speaker 1: to elevate myself in business and everything else I do

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Speaker 1: in my life. And when you are constantly in business,

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Speaker 1: especially when you're starting a new business, and you probably

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Speaker 1: know this even starting a podcast, you think everything is important,

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Speaker 1: like everything you know. You think every punch that's getting

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Speaker 1: thrown at you is something that you need to react towards.

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Speaker 1: And after a certain point, it's understanding what you need

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Speaker 1: to respond to to make the most impactful hit to

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Speaker 1: change the course of an entire match. And if martial

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Speaker 1: arts taught me anything it's being able to understand how

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Speaker 1: do you flow? How do you find these moments that

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Speaker 1: you could you're thoughtfully responding versus reacting to everything that's

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Speaker 1: coming at you. And that that applies to obviously everything

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Speaker 1: in life, right Like, if you're reacting to everything in life,

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Speaker 1: if you're going to be absolutely paralyzed.

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Speaker 2: When you're building a business, you really have to think

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Speaker 2: big picture because if you know you're somebody that's focused

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Speaker 2: on the font. You're never going to get through your

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Speaker 2: day by thinking about like what actually matters, you know, absolutely. Anyways,

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Speaker 2: he said it way more eloquently than me, but kind

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Speaker 2: of just maybe think of it exactly.

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Speaker 1: Then.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, when you say ego dissolution, can you break down

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Speaker 2: what that means for us?

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Speaker 1: Yes, I it's interesting because again, when I've thought about fighting,

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Speaker 1: or when I thought about art, or whenever, whenever I

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Speaker 1: think about business, like all these different things I dove into,

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Speaker 1: there was it's like this main character energy. You go

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Speaker 1: into the ring and believing that you are the main

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Speaker 1: character and you're always gonna win every single match because

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Speaker 1: that is what destiny set out for you to do.

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Speaker 1: Is a good ideology to have in many ways because

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Speaker 1: it builds your confidence. But that's not really the way

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Speaker 1: the world works. And to be able to navigate the

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Speaker 1: world almost as a passive observer sometimes allows you to

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Speaker 1: become a lot more thoughtful in the way you approach

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Speaker 1: everything and a lot more responsible in the way that

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Speaker 1: you can approach all the things that life throws at you.

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Speaker 1: And I've seen so many people, especially in the fighting world,

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Speaker 1: and you know, some of them are some of my

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Speaker 1: good friends. But you know, there's that saying of like

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Speaker 1: peaking in high school, right, It's almost like peaking in

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Speaker 1: high school is because that confidence and that ego was

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Speaker 1: elevated to such a degree. Elevate, I guess is like

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Speaker 1: the word of this podcast, Like that I keep saying it.

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Speaker 1: It's you've almost like made yourself so stuck in your

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Speaker 1: own ways that there there's like a difficulty in being

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Speaker 1: able to realize that the world is a lot bigger

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Speaker 1: than this like ecosystem that you've built for yourself. And

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Speaker 1: do know who Miyamoto Musashi is now. He wrote the

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Speaker 1: Book of Five Ranks. He's considered the greatest swordsman to

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Speaker 1: ever live in Japan, and he's a hero for a

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Speaker 1: lot of martial artists. But there was a point that

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Speaker 1: he realized, like the way of the Sword was all

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Speaker 1: about taking other people's lives, Like you can only become

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Speaker 1: the best you basically murder a bunch of people. And

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Speaker 1: when he reached a point where he was like, Wow,

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Speaker 1: I don't necessarily want to be the best swordsman in

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Speaker 1: the world. I want to be the best like human.

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Speaker 1: I want to be a more complete human being, he

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Speaker 1: basically quit everything that he did within the fighting world.

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Speaker 1: He did, quit everything he did in the swordsmanship all

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Speaker 1: he reached his best, He reached like the highest peak

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Speaker 1: and broke away to become a philosopher, and he locked

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Speaker 1: himself up in this cave and just ended up writing

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Speaker 1: how to live a better life for you and other people.

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Speaker 1: And I want to believe that almost every martial artist

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Speaker 1: you know, when they go through the trials and tribulations,

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Speaker 1: goes through that or not even martial artists. As a

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Speaker 1: human being, when you go through trials and tribulations and

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Speaker 1: you get humbled, you will ultimately end up on the

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Speaker 1: other side as a better human being.

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Speaker 2: And also like when you push yourself to those extremes.

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Speaker 2: You know, It's like martial arts are it's such an

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Speaker 2: interesting sport to train at, such an interesting range of

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Speaker 2: sports to train at, right, because there's different types of

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Speaker 2: we're learning all about this, guys, there's different types of

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Speaker 2: martial arts. There's more side, there's jiu jitsu, do jiu

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Speaker 2: jitsu count in Martin all right. But it is so

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Speaker 2: interesting because it is something that's been around for so long,

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Speaker 2: and it is so cool just hearing that that you know,

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Speaker 2: you can learn so much about just the principles of

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Speaker 2: life through practicing such an extreme sport.

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Speaker 1: But how are you pushing yourself constantly too? You know,

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Speaker 1: if you're getting comfortable because you became so good at

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Speaker 1: one martial arts or one skill, then like, where's the growth?

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Speaker 2: So okay, try time to try the next one exactly and.

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Speaker 1: How do you apply that the learnings from the previous

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Speaker 1: sport that you became so good at to the next thing.

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Speaker 2: I liked that you said that you like working with

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Speaker 2: other athletes and a question that I love asking people is, uh,

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Speaker 2: do you like hiring athletes and do you like hiring runners?

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Speaker 1: Yes? I mean I don't specifically go out for runners,

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Speaker 1: but I probably should, you know, especially like now that

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Speaker 1: I am a much more serious runner. The athlete mentality

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Speaker 1: to not give up, I think is one of the

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Speaker 1: most critical pieces in building any business, also approaching anything

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Speaker 1: in life. And when there is a challenge in front

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Speaker 1: of especially myself as an athlete, I am always looking

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Speaker 1: at that challenge and be like, oh, I could take

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Speaker 1: that on, And I'm sure you feel exactly the same way.

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Speaker 1: And it's like, you know, I was listening to your

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Speaker 1: husband Jeremy's Mom's podcast episode Shoutout.

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Speaker 2: Dana, Doctor Dana, and she deserves her own podcast.

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Speaker 1: She really does. Like she's incredible, Like I love that

435
00:22:56,960 --> 00:22:58,160
Speaker 1: episode that you did with her, but.

436
00:22:58,200 --> 00:22:59,800
Speaker 2: You could be the next Smele Robbins come on now.

437
00:23:00,080 --> 00:23:02,439
Speaker 1: There was something she said that really resonated with me.

438
00:23:02,600 --> 00:23:06,159
Speaker 1: Is like everyone eventually does hit a wall when you

439
00:23:06,200 --> 00:23:09,560
Speaker 1: are pushing yourself in a long run. But it's the

440
00:23:10,560 --> 00:23:13,520
Speaker 1: I think she used MVP as the acronym. You know

441
00:23:13,840 --> 00:23:17,159
Speaker 1: what is you know, mindfulness and then visualization, yeah, and

442
00:23:17,160 --> 00:23:20,879
Speaker 1: then people like performance or something like that, but mindfulness

443
00:23:21,200 --> 00:23:24,760
Speaker 1: being able to forget everything else, being able to forget

444
00:23:24,800 --> 00:23:29,320
Speaker 1: that you are competing, but it is just you in

445
00:23:29,320 --> 00:23:32,639
Speaker 1: this moment, having to just exist and find the rhythm

446
00:23:32,640 --> 00:23:36,240
Speaker 1: of the run. I think it was like so beautifully said,

447
00:23:36,760 --> 00:23:39,879
Speaker 1: and when you are challenged with things that you do

448
00:23:39,960 --> 00:23:43,080
Speaker 1: not know how to tackle because it's something new to you,

449
00:23:43,080 --> 00:23:45,120
Speaker 1: you just have to go back to your core who

450
00:23:45,160 --> 00:23:47,600
Speaker 1: you are and just challenge it head on and just

451
00:23:47,680 --> 00:23:50,040
Speaker 1: trust the rhythm of your feet to take you through it.

452
00:23:50,400 --> 00:23:53,840
Speaker 2: And I mean ultra runners like yourself and marathon runners.

453
00:23:53,880 --> 00:23:56,840
Speaker 2: It's like the art of the act of actually running

454
00:23:56,880 --> 00:23:59,720
Speaker 2: is one thing, but it really does teach you so

455
00:23:59,800 --> 00:24:03,000
Speaker 2: much about discipline and pushing yourself through something even when

456
00:24:03,000 --> 00:24:05,320
Speaker 2: it's hard, even when you feel like you have to stop,

457
00:24:06,960 --> 00:24:09,080
Speaker 2: and just the skills that you can learn through being

458
00:24:09,080 --> 00:24:11,920
Speaker 2: a long distance runner or being an ultra marathon or

459
00:24:11,960 --> 00:24:14,120
Speaker 2: being a martial artist, whatever sport it is that you're

460
00:24:14,119 --> 00:24:17,119
Speaker 2: taking to that next level, or just really doing setting

461
00:24:17,160 --> 00:24:19,359
Speaker 2: a goal for yourself and accomplishing it. It can be

462
00:24:19,359 --> 00:24:31,560
Speaker 2: applied in so many ways to your professional life. What

463
00:24:31,600 --> 00:24:35,480
Speaker 2: do you feel like running ultra, running marathons, running in general?

464
00:24:35,880 --> 00:24:38,199
Speaker 2: How do you feel like it's helped you in your

465
00:24:38,240 --> 00:24:39,119
Speaker 2: professional life?

466
00:24:39,720 --> 00:24:43,440
Speaker 1: Yeah? Man, I have so many answers because, like running,

467
00:24:43,440 --> 00:24:44,520
Speaker 1: it is such a big part of my life.

468
00:24:44,560 --> 00:24:47,200
Speaker 2: Now, how big? How much are you running?

469
00:24:47,359 --> 00:24:50,399
Speaker 1: I mean, so in peak training, I'm running usually ten

470
00:24:50,440 --> 00:24:52,800
Speaker 1: miles a day, and then when I was training for

471
00:24:52,840 --> 00:24:55,200
Speaker 1: my ultra, I was running like a marathon every weekend.

472
00:24:55,880 --> 00:25:01,280
Speaker 1: So but you know, it wasn't even like it's interesting

473
00:25:01,320 --> 00:25:04,560
Speaker 1: because when you get into a training mode for long

474
00:25:04,640 --> 00:25:07,439
Speaker 1: distance running, which eventually I want to do once I

475
00:25:07,560 --> 00:25:09,320
Speaker 1: have a little bit more time, just running takes up

476
00:25:09,359 --> 00:25:12,000
Speaker 1: so much time and my wife's pregnant so I can't

477
00:25:12,000 --> 00:25:14,199
Speaker 1: just be going for like four hours every weekend, but

478
00:25:17,000 --> 00:25:20,720
Speaker 1: I don't run with headphones on. It is my time

479
00:25:20,800 --> 00:25:23,480
Speaker 1: to be able to consolidate all my thoughts, which is

480
00:25:23,560 --> 00:25:26,480
Speaker 1: very important in a day and age where there's distractions

481
00:25:26,480 --> 00:25:32,000
Speaker 1: getting thrown at you from every single angle, and there

482
00:25:32,080 --> 00:25:39,359
Speaker 1: is a physical rhythm within the veil of pay. Like

483
00:25:39,520 --> 00:25:41,879
Speaker 1: you know, there's this veil of pain that obviously you

484
00:25:41,920 --> 00:25:45,200
Speaker 1: deal with when you're running long distances, but underneath it all,

485
00:25:45,640 --> 00:25:51,160
Speaker 1: there is this rhythm that you start discovering in how

486
00:25:51,200 --> 00:25:56,720
Speaker 1: you should process everything. And running has allowed me to

487
00:25:57,680 --> 00:26:03,760
Speaker 1: almost find that thought process and how I approach everything

488
00:26:03,760 --> 00:26:05,840
Speaker 1: else in my life. And it's funny because even with

489
00:26:05,920 --> 00:26:08,919
Speaker 1: my mural partners that I paint with, the guy ran

490
00:26:09,000 --> 00:26:12,080
Speaker 1: my Ultra marathon with is my mural painting partner that

491
00:26:12,080 --> 00:26:14,840
Speaker 1: I've been painting murals with for the last like twelve years,

492
00:26:15,440 --> 00:26:18,320
Speaker 1: and both of us have discovered that, and he's a

493
00:26:18,320 --> 00:26:24,159
Speaker 1: full time artist. Our best thoughts can only come in

494
00:26:24,200 --> 00:26:28,639
Speaker 1: these moments where you're by yourself and not just thinking.

495
00:26:28,680 --> 00:26:32,640
Speaker 1: It's it's it's just like active meditation, where you know

496
00:26:32,840 --> 00:26:36,920
Speaker 1: your body's moving, your mind is moving, and all those

497
00:26:36,920 --> 00:26:41,800
Speaker 1: things are getting pieced together, and all that exists is is.

498
00:26:41,760 --> 00:26:44,520
Speaker 2: You, what's the craziest idea you've come up with, well,

499
00:26:44,600 --> 00:26:47,480
Speaker 2: running that you guys have actually implemented for narrow.

500
00:26:48,040 --> 00:26:50,919
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, there's so many.

501
00:26:53,960 --> 00:26:56,720
Speaker 2: He's like tsing Ryan, like just give up with Ryan.

502
00:26:57,160 --> 00:26:58,080
Speaker 2: You're running right now?

503
00:26:58,400 --> 00:27:00,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, all right, I mean there's definite. Those moments

504
00:27:00,600 --> 00:27:02,320
Speaker 1: are like I would come back on like a Monday

505
00:27:02,560 --> 00:27:04,120
Speaker 1: and like be talking to the team about all these

506
00:27:04,119 --> 00:27:06,320
Speaker 1: like random things, and they'd be like, Okay, like maybe

507
00:27:06,359 --> 00:27:09,760
Speaker 1: I should have consolidated my thoughts a little more so

508
00:27:09,880 --> 00:27:12,920
Speaker 1: this isn't business. But there was like a period when

509
00:27:13,920 --> 00:27:19,040
Speaker 1: you know, I I was debating, this is gonna get personal,

510
00:27:19,560 --> 00:27:22,400
Speaker 1: but it's like I don't know if I ever really

511
00:27:22,400 --> 00:27:24,639
Speaker 1: want to get married, like especially like early on in

512
00:27:24,680 --> 00:27:26,320
Speaker 1: my life. But there was a moment when I was

513
00:27:26,400 --> 00:27:29,600
Speaker 1: running my year seventy Ultra Marathon, which was like seventy

514
00:27:29,640 --> 00:27:33,959
Speaker 1: two hundred feet elevation gain thirty eight miles, and around

515
00:27:34,000 --> 00:27:37,080
Speaker 1: like mile thirty two, like near the end of my run,

516
00:27:37,520 --> 00:27:41,640
Speaker 1: I hit this crazy runners high that where I actually

517
00:27:41,680 --> 00:27:44,280
Speaker 1: like couldn't stop crying. I was like running up this

518
00:27:44,359 --> 00:27:50,240
Speaker 1: hill and I couldn't stop crying, and it was. There

519
00:27:50,280 --> 00:27:54,280
Speaker 1: was never a moment where my mind was so clear

520
00:27:54,760 --> 00:27:58,320
Speaker 1: that I wanted to marry my wife, and a few

521
00:27:58,359 --> 00:28:01,439
Speaker 1: months later I proposed to her, and I feel like

522
00:28:02,080 --> 00:28:05,399
Speaker 1: that was one of the most important moments of my life.

523
00:28:06,520 --> 00:28:09,679
Speaker 1: So during that run was the moment that I was

524
00:28:09,680 --> 00:28:11,960
Speaker 1: able to consolidate all my feelings and thoughts and be

525
00:28:12,000 --> 00:28:15,040
Speaker 1: able to put aside this again idea of ego on

526
00:28:15,160 --> 00:28:17,160
Speaker 1: having to work through the business and having to work

527
00:28:17,240 --> 00:28:20,439
Speaker 1: so hard and think back to what was truly important

528
00:28:20,440 --> 00:28:22,840
Speaker 1: in my life, which was, you know, having a person

529
00:28:22,920 --> 00:28:26,239
Speaker 1: by my side that challenges me every single day but

530
00:28:26,760 --> 00:28:29,120
Speaker 1: is also also my rock.

531
00:28:29,720 --> 00:28:32,760
Speaker 2: She's like, keep running, babe, this is greatly exactly.

532
00:28:33,040 --> 00:28:37,000
Speaker 1: I'm going to clip that. Yeah, I always have that, Michelle.

533
00:28:37,119 --> 00:28:39,880
Speaker 2: Michelle shout out, Michelle, that's so funny.

534
00:28:39,920 --> 00:28:41,560
Speaker 1: I'm going to have that just in case we get

535
00:28:41,560 --> 00:28:43,520
Speaker 1: into a fight, and so I can always pull it up,

536
00:28:44,480 --> 00:28:45,120
Speaker 1: just in case.

537
00:28:44,960 --> 00:28:47,040
Speaker 2: You're ever mad at me for running long distance. Just no,

538
00:28:47,160 --> 00:28:50,400
Speaker 2: it's great for our relationship. Yesterday, when we were talking

539
00:28:50,400 --> 00:28:53,400
Speaker 2: on the phone briefing for this podcast, you said, suffering

540
00:28:53,560 --> 00:28:56,080
Speaker 2: is not a reason to quit, it's a reason to

541
00:28:56,120 --> 00:28:59,200
Speaker 2: break through. Can you explain that to us, and was

542
00:28:59,200 --> 00:29:02,000
Speaker 2: there a specific moment in your life that taught you that.

543
00:29:03,600 --> 00:29:05,760
Speaker 1: I want to say, there are so many moments, you know,

544
00:29:05,920 --> 00:29:08,640
Speaker 1: like what is life? I don't mean this in a

545
00:29:08,680 --> 00:29:11,480
Speaker 1: negative way, like what is life without suffering? Though, like

546
00:29:12,120 --> 00:29:14,800
Speaker 1: it is, that's the competitor in you, it is. And

547
00:29:14,840 --> 00:29:17,560
Speaker 1: it's like there's again going back to the physical and

548
00:29:17,600 --> 00:29:20,440
Speaker 1: mental there's like the physical suffering and definitely the mental suffering.

549
00:29:20,480 --> 00:29:24,400
Speaker 1: I mean, I've I'll talk about my co founder later

550
00:29:24,440 --> 00:29:26,640
Speaker 1: on in this podcast, because he's definitely gone through both

551
00:29:26,640 --> 00:29:29,080
Speaker 1: the physical and mental suffering, and you know, he inspires

552
00:29:29,120 --> 00:29:31,600
Speaker 1: me every single day with how resilient he is. But

553
00:29:32,600 --> 00:29:36,320
Speaker 1: when we were, you know, after college, when I was

554
00:29:36,320 --> 00:29:39,680
Speaker 1: trying to find my identity after fighting, I went to

555
00:29:39,720 --> 00:29:42,400
Speaker 1: film and then I thought I found my identity there

556
00:29:42,560 --> 00:29:46,080
Speaker 1: until my film project completely fell through. And when I

557
00:29:46,120 --> 00:29:48,160
Speaker 1: started getting into something that I could do a lot

558
00:29:48,160 --> 00:29:51,400
Speaker 1: more independently, which was my own art career. The way

559
00:29:51,440 --> 00:29:55,640
Speaker 1: I was able to support myself was doing hospital stays

560
00:29:55,640 --> 00:29:58,600
Speaker 1: and doing clinical trials, so I would make money staying

561
00:29:59,440 --> 00:30:02,800
Speaker 1: at a hospital in Anaheim, doing Anaheim clinical trials and

562
00:30:02,880 --> 00:30:05,080
Speaker 1: making money that way, so I didn't have to pay

563
00:30:05,120 --> 00:30:07,280
Speaker 1: for rent, I could take these experiential drugs and then

564
00:30:07,320 --> 00:30:10,080
Speaker 1: I could work on my own business. And I remember

565
00:30:10,160 --> 00:30:14,520
Speaker 1: at that point, especially graduating from you know, I would say,

566
00:30:14,560 --> 00:30:17,520
Speaker 1: like a decent college. All my friends were working in tech,

567
00:30:17,680 --> 00:30:19,880
Speaker 1: they were enjoying their life, they were making money, and

568
00:30:20,000 --> 00:30:23,960
Speaker 1: I felt like I was just living this incredibly scrappy life,

569
00:30:24,000 --> 00:30:26,840
Speaker 1: trying to live a life I wanted to live. And

570
00:30:28,600 --> 00:30:33,080
Speaker 1: when I compare myself, it's interesting because it was at

571
00:30:33,080 --> 00:30:35,720
Speaker 1: that moment I was comparing myself to others and where

572
00:30:35,880 --> 00:30:39,440
Speaker 1: that competitive nature of an athlete was more detrimental to

573
00:30:39,520 --> 00:30:43,440
Speaker 1: myself versus being able to focus on the bigger picture.

574
00:30:44,160 --> 00:30:48,120
Speaker 1: Why am I going through these processes to achieve something

575
00:30:48,680 --> 00:30:50,680
Speaker 1: that I know will pay off? Which is the same

576
00:30:50,680 --> 00:30:52,880
Speaker 1: with training, Like why are you training and suffering in

577
00:30:52,920 --> 00:30:56,440
Speaker 1: that moment? And it is because you know there's going

578
00:30:56,480 --> 00:30:58,800
Speaker 1: to be a payoff at the end, and you know

579
00:30:58,920 --> 00:31:02,320
Speaker 1: very fortunately say you know, like Neurogum is a ten

580
00:31:02,600 --> 00:31:07,280
Speaker 1: ten year overnight success in many ways, but that suffering

581
00:31:07,320 --> 00:31:09,840
Speaker 1: and believing in the process, believing in the team, believing

582
00:31:09,880 --> 00:31:13,920
Speaker 1: in in the people that are supporting you in building

583
00:31:14,560 --> 00:31:19,240
Speaker 1: what you believe is making sense and bringing a contribution

584
00:31:19,360 --> 00:31:23,320
Speaker 1: in some way to the world allowed me to keep

585
00:31:23,360 --> 00:31:26,280
Speaker 1: going and eventually break through and you know, get to

586
00:31:26,320 --> 00:31:28,320
Speaker 1: a point where we do have a certain level of

587
00:31:28,320 --> 00:31:31,800
Speaker 1: accolades and a revenue number that's I guess pretty decent.

588
00:31:31,880 --> 00:31:34,640
Speaker 1: But you know, the journey's not over. Like the suffering,

589
00:31:35,920 --> 00:31:38,400
Speaker 1: it's less suffering now, but I think there's so much

590
00:31:38,440 --> 00:31:40,880
Speaker 1: more to go, and maybe that's you know, maybe we're

591
00:31:40,880 --> 00:31:42,920
Speaker 1: in the ultra marathon phase of the business.

592
00:31:42,960 --> 00:31:44,720
Speaker 2: Now. Do you think some people quit too early?

593
00:31:45,120 --> 00:31:51,120
Speaker 1: Absolutely? I think most people quit too early if there's

594
00:31:51,160 --> 00:31:55,760
Speaker 1: so much If you are actively learning and pushing yourself

595
00:31:55,840 --> 00:31:58,760
Speaker 1: every single day, there is no problem. I don't think

596
00:31:58,800 --> 00:32:03,000
Speaker 1: any human being in the world world can't solve. There's

597
00:32:03,080 --> 00:32:06,360
Speaker 1: a we were talking about Steve Jobs earlier. There's a

598
00:32:06,360 --> 00:32:09,479
Speaker 1: great book in my own Words by Steve Jobs, and

599
00:32:09,520 --> 00:32:13,560
Speaker 1: in the four that's written by his wife, there's a

600
00:32:13,600 --> 00:32:18,160
Speaker 1: section that says, you have to believe all great I'm

601
00:32:18,160 --> 00:32:22,840
Speaker 1: misquoting it so but the trucks of it is all

602
00:32:22,880 --> 00:32:27,280
Speaker 1: great things were built by people no more capable than

603
00:32:27,320 --> 00:32:30,840
Speaker 1: you or I, And she's referring to obviously Steve Jobs,

604
00:32:30,840 --> 00:32:36,320
Speaker 1: who invented the entire personal computer world. Personalized computer computer world.

605
00:32:36,400 --> 00:32:41,480
Speaker 1: But all of us are capable of doing anything. It's

606
00:32:41,560 --> 00:32:43,959
Speaker 1: just how far we want to push ourselves and how

607
00:32:44,040 --> 00:32:45,680
Speaker 1: much we believe ourselves be able to do it.

608
00:32:45,840 --> 00:32:47,360
Speaker 2: And I feel like you have to learn how to

609
00:32:47,400 --> 00:32:52,280
Speaker 2: differentiate between pain that grows you versus breaks you.

610
00:32:52,680 --> 00:32:56,160
Speaker 1: Yes, I love that. Yeah.

611
00:32:56,200 --> 00:32:57,600
Speaker 2: Did you ever have pain that felt like it was

612
00:32:57,600 --> 00:32:59,600
Speaker 2: going to break you when you're doing your hospital stays?

613
00:33:00,080 --> 00:33:02,440
Speaker 2: Did you have any like crazy reactions to anything?

614
00:33:03,120 --> 00:33:06,520
Speaker 1: No, not in a physical way, but I will say

615
00:33:06,560 --> 00:33:11,160
Speaker 1: in a mental way. You know, even art is not

616
00:33:11,200 --> 00:33:19,960
Speaker 1: a very lucrative career, and you know, like I love

617
00:33:20,000 --> 00:33:21,960
Speaker 1: my parents, but there was like a certain level of

618
00:33:22,000 --> 00:33:23,960
Speaker 1: pressure that they were definitely putting on me to go

619
00:33:24,040 --> 00:33:27,440
Speaker 1: find a real job to a certain degree, you know,

620
00:33:27,560 --> 00:33:31,240
Speaker 1: like my parents believe that if I kept pushing myself

621
00:33:31,680 --> 00:33:38,160
Speaker 1: like I would achieve something. But I think it was again,

622
00:33:38,280 --> 00:33:42,120
Speaker 1: it was more about me. And I think this is

623
00:33:42,240 --> 00:33:44,239
Speaker 1: a fault that humans just have in general, Like how

624
00:33:44,240 --> 00:33:48,160
Speaker 1: do you how do you feel when you compare yourself

625
00:33:48,200 --> 00:33:50,720
Speaker 1: to other people versus how do you feel when you

626
00:33:50,760 --> 00:33:54,960
Speaker 1: compare yourself against yourself and what you feel like you

627
00:33:55,000 --> 00:33:59,000
Speaker 1: could achieve? And when I was finally able to break

628
00:33:59,040 --> 00:34:03,560
Speaker 1: away from okay, you know, going out and everyone's ordering

629
00:34:03,560 --> 00:34:06,200
Speaker 1: cocktails and having a great time, and they're going on

630
00:34:06,240 --> 00:34:08,319
Speaker 1: these trips because they all have great tech jobs, and

631
00:34:08,840 --> 00:34:11,479
Speaker 1: you know, I'm here, Like usually I would just drink

632
00:34:11,520 --> 00:34:14,600
Speaker 1: water because I won't be able to afford a drink like.

633
00:34:17,200 --> 00:34:17,319
Speaker 2: One.

634
00:34:17,400 --> 00:34:20,920
Speaker 1: I appreciate my friends for, you know, like understanding my

635
00:34:20,960 --> 00:34:23,439
Speaker 1: situation and like I wouldn't make it like a big

636
00:34:23,440 --> 00:34:26,920
Speaker 1: deal by any means in that moment, but one understanding

637
00:34:26,920 --> 00:34:32,680
Speaker 1: my situation, understanding that you know, this push that I

638
00:34:32,719 --> 00:34:36,279
Speaker 1: was doing was for something that I truly believed in.

639
00:34:36,840 --> 00:34:40,520
Speaker 1: And it's really funny because like when you are truly

640
00:34:40,560 --> 00:34:43,080
Speaker 1: passionate about something and you are truly trying to push

641
00:34:43,120 --> 00:34:45,799
Speaker 1: through and this is this goes for anyone. People will

642
00:34:45,880 --> 00:34:49,640
Speaker 1: rally behind you if you have a belief in something,

643
00:34:50,080 --> 00:34:54,640
Speaker 1: no matter what that belief if you if you have

644
00:34:54,640 --> 00:34:58,360
Speaker 1: a belief in something, no matter what situation or what

645
00:34:58,480 --> 00:35:02,680
Speaker 1: position you may be in, people will stand behind you

646
00:35:02,840 --> 00:35:07,279
Speaker 1: and push you and push for that belief. And that

647
00:35:07,320 --> 00:35:09,600
Speaker 1: was probably one of the most valuable things that I've

648
00:35:09,680 --> 00:35:13,839
Speaker 1: learned in setting a vision, being able to push the team,

649
00:35:13,880 --> 00:35:16,480
Speaker 1: making decisions and striving for something.

650
00:35:16,200 --> 00:35:19,719
Speaker 2: And at that time, had you started the idea for

651
00:35:19,800 --> 00:35:22,000
Speaker 2: neuro or was your belief at the time like I'm

652
00:35:22,000 --> 00:35:23,120
Speaker 2: going to make it as an artist.

653
00:35:23,480 --> 00:35:27,040
Speaker 1: It was both, so, you know, just a backtrack on

654
00:35:27,080 --> 00:35:30,319
Speaker 1: my career. There was my early art days and then

655
00:35:30,360 --> 00:35:34,240
Speaker 1: neuro started actually like right when I started painting murals,

656
00:35:34,239 --> 00:35:36,000
Speaker 1: so I was probably painting murals for about a year.

657
00:35:36,080 --> 00:35:38,279
Speaker 1: And then we launched a neurogum because I realized that

658
00:35:38,680 --> 00:35:40,839
Speaker 1: I wanted to start a business that would actually be

659
00:35:41,360 --> 00:35:44,240
Speaker 1: producing capital in some way or something that was actually

660
00:35:44,719 --> 00:35:49,640
Speaker 1: backed monetarily. And then I started another company called Okidoki,

661
00:35:49,680 --> 00:35:52,120
Speaker 1: which is an experiential design agency, where we started building

662
00:35:52,120 --> 00:35:55,680
Speaker 1: toy stores in New York. So I shifted away from

663
00:35:55,840 --> 00:35:59,200
Speaker 1: my personal art stuff into large scale projects, whether it

664
00:35:59,200 --> 00:36:02,800
Speaker 1: was public art piece is with my murals, or building

665
00:36:02,880 --> 00:36:06,080
Speaker 1: toy stores, like there's a toy store called camp so

666
00:36:06,160 --> 00:36:08,560
Speaker 1: we built in New York. And then The Wonder we

667
00:36:08,640 --> 00:36:11,880
Speaker 1: built the very first iteration of that. We built a

668
00:36:11,920 --> 00:36:18,279
Speaker 1: Britney Spears experiential project, like like her experiential museum. We

669
00:36:18,320 --> 00:36:22,040
Speaker 1: did the design, the entire experiential design for the Fear

670
00:36:22,040 --> 00:36:25,960
Speaker 1: of God six six collection were so cool. Yeah, we

671
00:36:26,000 --> 00:36:27,640
Speaker 1: actually ended up doing like a lot of projects, but

672
00:36:27,640 --> 00:36:30,160
Speaker 1: then COVID completely chilled bad business.

673
00:36:30,600 --> 00:36:34,880
Speaker 2: But and you were doing hospital stays all while during

674
00:36:34,880 --> 00:36:36,719
Speaker 2: this or did you start making money from these?

675
00:36:36,880 --> 00:36:39,440
Speaker 1: So thankfully I started making money from both because I

676
00:36:39,440 --> 00:36:39,960
Speaker 1: was gonna.

677
00:36:39,719 --> 00:36:42,080
Speaker 2: Say, experiential marketing. I feel like there's even more money

678
00:36:42,080 --> 00:36:42,480
Speaker 2: in it now.

679
00:36:42,960 --> 00:36:47,080
Speaker 1: Yeah. Absolutely, But like it was, you know, those days

680
00:36:47,120 --> 00:36:50,560
Speaker 1: when I was staying in the hospital and doing making

681
00:36:50,920 --> 00:36:55,760
Speaker 1: money that way, was able to build a foundation to

682
00:36:55,760 --> 00:36:56,799
Speaker 1: do all these other things.

683
00:36:56,840 --> 00:36:58,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, you gotta get scrappy.

684
00:36:58,600 --> 00:37:00,759
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I mean I told I've never had

685
00:37:00,760 --> 00:37:03,319
Speaker 1: a W two until neurogum.

686
00:37:03,440 --> 00:37:03,920
Speaker 2: Oh wow.

687
00:37:04,120 --> 00:37:07,640
Speaker 1: Yeah. I have always just pushed myself to like and again,

688
00:37:08,320 --> 00:37:10,440
Speaker 1: it was not that I couldn't get a job, you

689
00:37:10,440 --> 00:37:13,880
Speaker 1: know with the hospital stays. It was that allowed me

690
00:37:13,920 --> 00:37:15,839
Speaker 1: to have the freedom to be able to pursue all

691
00:37:15,840 --> 00:37:17,520
Speaker 1: the things that I wanted to pursue, and I was

692
00:37:17,520 --> 00:37:19,840
Speaker 1: willing to take that, I guess like moment of suffering

693
00:37:20,000 --> 00:37:20,920
Speaker 1: to be able to do that.

694
00:37:30,520 --> 00:37:33,960
Speaker 2: Let's talk about neurogum. What products were you trying out

695
00:37:34,000 --> 00:37:36,799
Speaker 2: at the time that led you, guys into developing the

696
00:37:36,800 --> 00:37:39,319
Speaker 2: first iteration of what neuro and neurogum was.

697
00:37:39,719 --> 00:37:43,000
Speaker 1: Yeah. So in college while I was fighting, the only

698
00:37:43,040 --> 00:37:46,400
Speaker 1: things that existed were energy drinks or you know, very

699
00:37:47,000 --> 00:37:52,880
Speaker 1: very badly substantiated supplements, especially during that era, and I

700
00:37:52,880 --> 00:37:55,960
Speaker 1: got really deep into nootropics because I was reading Tim

701
00:37:55,960 --> 00:37:58,960
Speaker 1: Ferriss's Five Hour work Week book, which is very popular

702
00:37:59,000 --> 00:38:01,759
Speaker 1: at that time, and he was talking about taking me

703
00:38:01,800 --> 00:38:04,480
Speaker 1: dafinil and it's like, oh, human beings don't need to sleep.

704
00:38:04,920 --> 00:38:07,560
Speaker 1: You could do like the Superman cycle or the Ubermint cycle.

705
00:38:07,719 --> 00:38:09,759
Speaker 2: And truly the wild West of something.

706
00:38:09,840 --> 00:38:11,279
Speaker 1: It was, Oh my god, it was crazy. And I

707
00:38:11,320 --> 00:38:12,680
Speaker 1: was doing that for a while. Like I was doing

708
00:38:12,719 --> 00:38:15,319
Speaker 1: the twenty minute naps throughout the day, so I was

709
00:38:15,320 --> 00:38:18,359
Speaker 1: doing twenty minutes every four hours, and then I would

710
00:38:18,360 --> 00:38:20,520
Speaker 1: do like a two like a big two hour sleep session,

711
00:38:20,680 --> 00:38:23,080
Speaker 1: so I would only be sleeping about like four hours

712
00:38:23,120 --> 00:38:25,480
Speaker 1: a day, like throughout the day. So I did that

713
00:38:25,520 --> 00:38:27,520
Speaker 1: for like eight I want to say, like eight months

714
00:38:27,640 --> 00:38:29,439
Speaker 1: or eight eight or nine months, like not a full year,

715
00:38:29,440 --> 00:38:31,000
Speaker 1: but I did for like a majority of a year.

716
00:38:31,520 --> 00:38:34,960
Speaker 1: And obviously don't do that. I am like so against

717
00:38:35,080 --> 00:38:38,560
Speaker 1: not getting good sleep now. But during that time, I

718
00:38:38,640 --> 00:38:42,520
Speaker 1: was constantly thinking about how do I maximize every single

719
00:38:42,560 --> 00:38:45,560
Speaker 1: waking hour in my life. And the things I began

720
00:38:45,640 --> 00:38:49,399
Speaker 1: mixing was the rasatam so parrasstam oxy rastam and rast

721
00:38:49,440 --> 00:38:52,520
Speaker 1: tam that I would buy from Russian websites using bitcoin.

722
00:38:52,680 --> 00:38:55,320
Speaker 1: Like this is like I wish I just kept that bitcoin,

723
00:38:55,560 --> 00:38:58,200
Speaker 1: but you know, yeah, spending a bigcoin. This is about

724
00:38:58,239 --> 00:39:03,680
Speaker 1: fifteen years ago. Caffeine helthyenian, which eventually ended up becoming

725
00:39:03,719 --> 00:39:06,840
Speaker 1: V zero of our product, Medafinil. I'll be taking medafinil

726
00:39:06,840 --> 00:39:08,640
Speaker 1: all the time, which is the anti narcolepsy drug. So

727
00:39:08,640 --> 00:39:10,640
Speaker 1: it allowed you to stay away can be more productive.

728
00:39:11,880 --> 00:39:15,520
Speaker 1: I was playing with different dosages of caffeine, playing with

729
00:39:15,560 --> 00:39:18,920
Speaker 1: different dosages of even like I didn't ge't too crazy

730
00:39:18,960 --> 00:39:22,200
Speaker 1: into like the adderall dosaging, but there was definitely a

731
00:39:22,239 --> 00:39:27,480
Speaker 1: little bit of playing with that. And eventually, just when

732
00:39:27,480 --> 00:39:30,200
Speaker 1: it came down to it, I realized the tried and

733
00:39:30,200 --> 00:39:35,520
Speaker 1: true methods of having good sleep, getting a getting a

734
00:39:35,520 --> 00:39:40,880
Speaker 1: good dose caffeine healthy was the most effective way of

735
00:39:41,239 --> 00:39:47,680
Speaker 1: maintaining a very healthy but sustainable work ethic. And when

736
00:39:47,680 --> 00:39:49,680
Speaker 1: I met my co founder Ryan in college, he was

737
00:39:49,760 --> 00:39:51,120
Speaker 1: he was actually a runner, so he was caffin in

738
00:39:51,200 --> 00:39:53,920
Speaker 1: his cross country and tracting the show. Yeah, we got

739
00:39:54,000 --> 00:39:54,960
Speaker 1: to get yan on the show. He was one of

740
00:39:54,960 --> 00:39:56,600
Speaker 1: the fastest kids in California. Like he was he was

741
00:39:56,640 --> 00:39:59,400
Speaker 1: running like a four to twenty mile or something like,

742
00:39:59,480 --> 00:40:02,319
Speaker 1: absolutely insane. But then his sophomore year, he got in

743
00:40:02,320 --> 00:40:04,879
Speaker 1: a snowboarding accident that left him paralyzed from the waist down.

744
00:40:05,480 --> 00:40:08,279
Speaker 1: And these seltments that I was taking were the ones

745
00:40:08,320 --> 00:40:09,879
Speaker 1: I was giving him so that he could get back

746
00:40:09,880 --> 00:40:12,600
Speaker 1: into school and finish on time, which is absolutely crazy

747
00:40:12,640 --> 00:40:15,480
Speaker 1: to do after being an a grievous injury like being

748
00:40:15,520 --> 00:40:20,440
Speaker 1: paralyzed from the waist down, and then after college on

749
00:40:20,480 --> 00:40:22,480
Speaker 1: a scuba diving trip, which is one of the most

750
00:40:22,560 --> 00:40:28,400
Speaker 1: accessible things that you could do, we were exhausted and

751
00:40:29,080 --> 00:40:31,840
Speaker 1: realizing that one, you know, neither of us want to

752
00:40:31,920 --> 00:40:34,759
Speaker 1: drink coffee, like for him, drinking coffee is a little

753
00:40:34,760 --> 00:40:37,200
Speaker 1: bit difficult because of you know, his injury and like

754
00:40:37,239 --> 00:40:42,520
Speaker 1: his stomach, and realizing there has to be a more efficient, approachable,

755
00:40:42,640 --> 00:40:47,839
Speaker 1: accessible way of taking things, and that was gumn Mints

756
00:40:48,120 --> 00:40:50,160
Speaker 1: putting something that we could share with each other, putting

757
00:40:50,160 --> 00:40:52,200
Speaker 1: something that we could share on these like adventures that

758
00:40:52,200 --> 00:40:57,160
Speaker 1: we were taking, and that led us into starting Neurogum I.

759
00:40:57,160 --> 00:40:59,600
Speaker 2: Think what's so cool too is and I said this

760
00:40:59,600 --> 00:41:01,840
Speaker 2: to you on the run, but it's two completely different

761
00:41:01,880 --> 00:41:04,920
Speaker 2: lived experiences, right, obviously two friends coming together with this

762
00:41:04,960 --> 00:41:09,680
Speaker 2: aligned mission. But his you know, need for the product

763
00:41:09,840 --> 00:41:12,640
Speaker 2: is different than what yours was, but similar at the

764
00:41:12,680 --> 00:41:17,399
Speaker 2: same time. So I'm curious, like, what did Ryan's experience

765
00:41:17,640 --> 00:41:19,600
Speaker 2: with the products and kind of what they were being

766
00:41:19,680 --> 00:41:22,480
Speaker 2: used for from his perspective? How did that kind of

767
00:41:22,520 --> 00:41:25,319
Speaker 2: teach you? I guess I'm not really phrasing that right,

768
00:41:25,320 --> 00:41:27,000
Speaker 2: but like, what did that teach you about? You? Guys

769
00:41:27,040 --> 00:41:27,680
Speaker 2: were starting to owner.

770
00:41:27,680 --> 00:41:30,520
Speaker 1: I think for Ryan, who was to live? You know,

771
00:41:30,640 --> 00:41:32,839
Speaker 1: for me it was to optimize. For ryano was to live,

772
00:41:33,000 --> 00:41:36,440
Speaker 1: which is a totally different approach and how you have

773
00:41:36,560 --> 00:41:43,879
Speaker 1: to I mean look at life, like if neurogum, neuromins,

774
00:41:43,960 --> 00:41:46,400
Speaker 1: all the supplements I was mixing and taking was to

775
00:41:47,000 --> 00:41:50,120
Speaker 1: better my own life. Ryan took it in a way,

776
00:41:50,480 --> 00:41:53,759
Speaker 1: was I have this injury, How am I going to

777
00:41:53,840 --> 00:41:57,479
Speaker 1: get back to at least equilibrium to live my life again?

778
00:41:58,480 --> 00:42:02,239
Speaker 1: And that's exactly what he does now, you know, And

779
00:42:03,160 --> 00:42:06,960
Speaker 1: the fact that and when you meet Ryan, it's amazing

780
00:42:07,160 --> 00:42:10,239
Speaker 1: because like you've met Ryan before, like you do not

781
00:42:10,440 --> 00:42:14,719
Speaker 1: need to stop him like physically, like nothing stops him.

782
00:42:14,840 --> 00:42:16,960
Speaker 1: Like he will go down an escalator, he will, you know,

783
00:42:17,160 --> 00:42:19,680
Speaker 1: we lead down like a set of stairs. If he

784
00:42:19,680 --> 00:42:21,200
Speaker 1: needs to go up a set of stairs, like I'll

785
00:42:21,239 --> 00:42:22,759
Speaker 1: just piggyback ride him and then we'll just take the

786
00:42:22,760 --> 00:42:27,200
Speaker 1: wheelchair up like it there is in all the places

787
00:42:27,200 --> 00:42:32,239
Speaker 1: I've traveled with him, he is more mobile than any

788
00:42:32,280 --> 00:42:35,480
Speaker 1: other human being with the use of two legs. And

789
00:42:37,400 --> 00:42:43,520
Speaker 1: the the experimentation with neurogum, the fact that we started

790
00:42:43,520 --> 00:42:46,040
Speaker 1: a business together, the fact that I feel like, for

791
00:42:46,160 --> 00:42:49,640
Speaker 1: both of us, you know, believing in something created more

792
00:42:49,719 --> 00:42:52,240
Speaker 1: meaning in our lives than anything, like more than anything,

793
00:42:52,280 --> 00:42:56,040
Speaker 1: like I feel like business and uh neurogum has created

794
00:42:57,080 --> 00:43:00,879
Speaker 1: meaning in both of our lives that has allowed us

795
00:43:00,920 --> 00:43:05,879
Speaker 1: to really for me, you know, optimize my life. But

796
00:43:05,960 --> 00:43:11,719
Speaker 1: for Ryan keep pushing himself in ways that I don't

797
00:43:11,719 --> 00:43:15,480
Speaker 1: think he would have been he would have found a

798
00:43:15,480 --> 00:43:18,879
Speaker 1: way like knowing Ryan, but I think it's definitely helped

799
00:43:18,960 --> 00:43:23,400
Speaker 1: him find like a reason to be more be beyond

800
00:43:23,400 --> 00:43:23,920
Speaker 1: his injury.

801
00:43:24,320 --> 00:43:28,360
Speaker 2: Absolutely, It's like everybody needs purpose, and especially when you're

802
00:43:28,400 --> 00:43:31,759
Speaker 2: going through such a traumatic life event that requires you

803
00:43:31,840 --> 00:43:33,800
Speaker 2: to be resilient in a way you never thought you could.

804
00:43:34,000 --> 00:43:37,359
Speaker 1: Yeah. Absolutely, And resiliency is the name of the game

805
00:43:37,400 --> 00:43:39,720
Speaker 1: when it comes to anything in life, you know, especially

806
00:43:39,760 --> 00:43:42,160
Speaker 1: for him getting past his injury, especially in business. This

807
00:43:42,200 --> 00:43:45,359
Speaker 1: idea of the react versus respond Like, sometimes you do

808
00:43:45,440 --> 00:43:47,600
Speaker 1: have to react because things are getting thrown at you

809
00:43:47,920 --> 00:43:50,440
Speaker 1: from a million different directions, but you keep going, you

810
00:43:50,440 --> 00:43:51,160
Speaker 1: stay resilient.

811
00:43:52,400 --> 00:43:57,319
Speaker 2: What do you feel like his experience taught you?

812
00:43:57,320 --> 00:44:03,759
Speaker 1: You know, I was saying that nothing stops Ryan. And

813
00:44:04,160 --> 00:44:08,279
Speaker 1: when you think about cognitive performance, which is exactly the

814
00:44:08,320 --> 00:44:11,840
Speaker 1: reason I got into neuroscience in the first place. Physical performance,

815
00:44:11,920 --> 00:44:15,560
Speaker 1: especially when you're young and you're in your youth, you

816
00:44:15,560 --> 00:44:17,400
Speaker 1: don't even think about the brain. You just kind of

817
00:44:17,400 --> 00:44:19,480
Speaker 1: go because your body could keep up with everything that

818
00:44:19,600 --> 00:44:25,440
Speaker 1: you're thinking about. When I saw Ryan and saw him

819
00:44:25,480 --> 00:44:28,839
Speaker 1: go through his injury, it was the definition of what

820
00:44:28,920 --> 00:44:32,640
Speaker 1: I was and it was the archetype of what I

821
00:44:32,760 --> 00:44:37,120
Speaker 1: was chasing, which was cognitive performance at its best. When

822
00:44:37,360 --> 00:44:39,960
Speaker 1: you put your mind to something and when you realize

823
00:44:40,000 --> 00:44:44,480
Speaker 1: that your physical capabilities are stunted, then anything is possible.

824
00:44:45,239 --> 00:44:51,440
Speaker 1: And that's in many ways with neurogum or business or

825
00:44:51,520 --> 00:44:55,960
Speaker 1: anything I do. It's subconsciously been built in the back

826
00:44:56,000 --> 00:44:56,759
Speaker 1: of my mind.

827
00:44:56,760 --> 00:44:59,560
Speaker 2: Right, And so I know that we talked about the

828
00:45:00,000 --> 00:45:01,719
Speaker 2: scessibility with gum, right you can kind of I saw

829
00:45:01,719 --> 00:45:03,360
Speaker 2: you guys on Shark Tank talking about it, like you

830
00:45:03,400 --> 00:45:05,400
Speaker 2: can put a pack of gum in your pocket, mince.

831
00:45:05,480 --> 00:45:09,960
Speaker 2: It's very accessible, it's shareable, it's social. But I'm curious,

832
00:45:10,440 --> 00:45:14,400
Speaker 2: is there like a scientific even backing to like it

833
00:45:14,480 --> 00:45:17,120
Speaker 2: does just chewing gum or having a mentioned in your mouth,

834
00:45:17,120 --> 00:45:18,200
Speaker 2: does it absorbed quicker?

835
00:45:18,440 --> 00:45:21,080
Speaker 1: Oh? Yeah, okay, yeah, yeah absolutely, And like that's one

836
00:45:21,120 --> 00:45:23,120
Speaker 1: of those things that we found out later, but I

837
00:45:23,120 --> 00:45:25,680
Speaker 1: guess I shouldn't known, like when we were starting off,

838
00:45:25,680 --> 00:45:26,840
Speaker 1: but we weren't even thinking about it.

839
00:45:26,920 --> 00:45:30,279
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's happy. That's like a lucky surprise exactly, Like.

840
00:45:30,239 --> 00:45:33,479
Speaker 1: Oh that's nice. Like we're better than even drinking energy

841
00:45:33,520 --> 00:45:36,360
Speaker 1: drinking like coffee and all these things. Yeah, the buckle

842
00:45:36,400 --> 00:45:40,240
Speaker 1: and sublingual absorption component of it, like knowing from basically

843
00:45:40,520 --> 00:45:44,640
Speaker 1: just in menstruation methods in general, from a clinical you know,

844
00:45:44,680 --> 00:45:48,440
Speaker 1: a clinical studies perspective, absorbs a lot faster, like you

845
00:45:48,480 --> 00:45:52,920
Speaker 1: absorb things faster through the glands and the glands in

846
00:45:52,960 --> 00:45:55,600
Speaker 1: your mouth or the glands in your tongue versus having

847
00:45:55,600 --> 00:45:58,000
Speaker 1: to digest it like you process it in your stomach.

848
00:45:58,080 --> 00:46:03,040
Speaker 1: Then you're the bile has to break it down. And yeah,

849
00:46:03,120 --> 00:46:05,399
Speaker 1: that was just like a great surprise. And also there's

850
00:46:05,520 --> 00:46:07,799
Speaker 1: all these studies that talk about just the act of

851
00:46:08,040 --> 00:46:12,360
Speaker 1: chewing gum activates your brain because of that motion. So

852
00:46:12,400 --> 00:46:15,440
Speaker 1: when you combine all those things together, the effective ingredients,

853
00:46:15,719 --> 00:46:18,239
Speaker 1: the act of chewing activating your brain, and then the

854
00:46:18,239 --> 00:46:22,000
Speaker 1: bukele and sublinguable George component, I honestly, it's like a

855
00:46:22,040 --> 00:46:26,959
Speaker 1: trifecta of creating a product that is efficiently working more

856
00:46:27,000 --> 00:46:30,000
Speaker 1: so than traditional traditional formats.

857
00:46:30,080 --> 00:46:31,759
Speaker 2: Okay, let's pull up the product because we have it

858
00:46:31,840 --> 00:46:34,799
Speaker 2: on the side here, So show us this product. What

859
00:46:34,920 --> 00:46:36,279
Speaker 2: is this one that we just had?

860
00:46:36,520 --> 00:46:40,080
Speaker 1: So this is the neuro Mints. It is a natural

861
00:46:40,080 --> 00:46:43,800
Speaker 1: caffeine forty milligrams and natural caffeine, altenene and B vitamins

862
00:46:44,080 --> 00:46:46,640
Speaker 1: in a mint format that do want?

863
00:46:46,880 --> 00:46:50,479
Speaker 2: I do want another one? Like I'm The thing about

864
00:46:50,480 --> 00:46:51,960
Speaker 2: me is when I have a pack of ments, I e. All,

865
00:46:52,239 --> 00:46:53,680
Speaker 2: how many of these can you have a day?

866
00:46:53,800 --> 00:46:56,320
Speaker 1: So the great thing about this is one piece is

867
00:46:56,400 --> 00:46:59,480
Speaker 1: half a cup of coffee, And there's no reason that

868
00:46:59,840 --> 00:47:05,000
Speaker 1: you know your adenasy receptors, like you're when you're taking

869
00:47:05,200 --> 00:47:08,400
Speaker 1: something like a Celsius that has three hundred milligrams of caffeine,

870
00:47:08,480 --> 00:47:11,160
Speaker 1: or even like Eventu, I think the largest right at

871
00:47:11,200 --> 00:47:14,360
Speaker 1: Starbucks that's like three hundred and sixty milligrams of caffeine.

872
00:47:14,360 --> 00:47:17,840
Speaker 1: And every single year Starbucks has increased the amount of

873
00:47:17,880 --> 00:47:19,960
Speaker 1: caffeine in their products because they know there is the

874
00:47:20,000 --> 00:47:25,200
Speaker 1: dopaminergic reaction to how people want more energy and more caffeine.

875
00:47:25,640 --> 00:47:28,160
Speaker 1: That is not how the human body should be operating.

876
00:47:28,560 --> 00:47:32,440
Speaker 1: You can microdose effectively, and you can control the dosage

877
00:47:32,480 --> 00:47:35,919
Speaker 1: of the caffeine that you take so that you could

878
00:47:35,920 --> 00:47:39,200
Speaker 1: efficiently not have the crash and keep going with your life,

879
00:47:39,360 --> 00:47:41,400
Speaker 1: like you do not need to burn yourself out, And

880
00:47:41,680 --> 00:47:43,440
Speaker 1: that is the philosophy that we live by. That is

881
00:47:43,440 --> 00:47:45,800
Speaker 1: the philosophy. Like you as a runner, also with the

882
00:47:45,880 --> 00:47:48,600
Speaker 1: running marathons, you're not supposed to burn yourself out and

883
00:47:48,680 --> 00:47:51,279
Speaker 1: like start sprinting at the starting line. You're supposed to

884
00:47:51,280 --> 00:47:55,480
Speaker 1: consistently be going through life, you know, and thoughtfully going

885
00:47:55,520 --> 00:47:59,320
Speaker 1: through life. And that's that's the reason we put in

886
00:47:59,400 --> 00:48:01,279
Speaker 1: as much as we did. And there's so many other

887
00:48:01,280 --> 00:48:04,320
Speaker 1: companies that you know that have tried to do something

888
00:48:04,320 --> 00:48:06,719
Speaker 1: similar to what we've done, but they always approach in

889
00:48:06,760 --> 00:48:13,000
Speaker 1: the sense of an energy drinks. It's like trying to

890
00:48:13,080 --> 00:48:17,839
Speaker 1: overload people, so they get an instant hit instead of Hey,

891
00:48:18,200 --> 00:48:22,719
Speaker 1: if we are supposed to thoughtfully live our lives and

892
00:48:22,840 --> 00:48:25,440
Speaker 1: be resilient and all these things we're talking about, like

893
00:48:25,520 --> 00:48:29,080
Speaker 1: to be able to continue in a sustainable way because

894
00:48:29,120 --> 00:48:32,359
Speaker 1: life is a marathon, then how can you be more

895
00:48:32,400 --> 00:48:35,000
Speaker 1: thoughtful with your dosing and be more thoughtful with the

896
00:48:35,000 --> 00:48:37,279
Speaker 1: things you put into your body? And so that was

897
00:48:37,320 --> 00:48:39,719
Speaker 1: a long way of saying, yes, you could take a

898
00:48:39,760 --> 00:48:42,040
Speaker 1: whole ten of this and it's still less caffeine then, but.

899
00:48:42,000 --> 00:48:44,880
Speaker 2: They're awesome and they taste so good, and they are

900
00:48:45,000 --> 00:48:46,600
Speaker 2: now going to become a part of my every day

901
00:48:46,680 --> 00:48:48,640
Speaker 2: ritual and they have become a part of so many

902
00:48:48,680 --> 00:48:51,680
Speaker 2: people's everyday rituals. I saw this stat that one in

903
00:48:51,760 --> 00:48:53,920
Speaker 2: seven people knows about.

904
00:48:53,719 --> 00:48:56,839
Speaker 1: Neuro Yeah, probably more like one in six now, but.

905
00:48:57,000 --> 00:48:59,440
Speaker 2: It's one in six people. I mean that is wild.

906
00:49:00,080 --> 00:49:02,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's pretty crazy. I mean we sell more than

907
00:49:02,080 --> 00:49:06,560
Speaker 1: five hour energy in revenue and velocity at CVS now,

908
00:49:06,840 --> 00:49:11,120
Speaker 1: so we are taking over what I think people are

909
00:49:11,200 --> 00:49:15,719
Speaker 1: more conscious of these of what they're taking now, you know,

910
00:49:15,719 --> 00:49:18,680
Speaker 1: with these energy drinks and like, gone are the days

911
00:49:18,719 --> 00:49:22,279
Speaker 1: where I mean thankfully gone are the days where you're

912
00:49:22,360 --> 00:49:25,320
Speaker 1: just like they used to release energy drink called cocaine

913
00:49:25,480 --> 00:49:28,239
Speaker 1: energy drink. You know that's crazy, It's like crazy.

914
00:49:27,880 --> 00:49:29,919
Speaker 2: But I do it five hour energy or I remember every

915
00:49:29,920 --> 00:49:31,600
Speaker 2: CVS you would go into it would be like whatever

916
00:49:31,600 --> 00:49:33,120
Speaker 2: they called the little gret Like when you're kind of

917
00:49:33,160 --> 00:49:34,960
Speaker 2: checking out, it's right there, oh yeah.

918
00:49:35,080 --> 00:49:37,200
Speaker 1: At the cash register at the gene lane. Yeah.

919
00:49:37,239 --> 00:49:39,280
Speaker 2: What I think, too is so cool is I feel

920
00:49:39,320 --> 00:49:42,839
Speaker 2: like we're almost living in this efficiency world now, where

921
00:49:42,960 --> 00:49:45,680
Speaker 2: whatever it is, people just want the most efficient like option.

922
00:49:45,760 --> 00:49:48,720
Speaker 2: It's like, we want effishient options for our groceries delivered

923
00:49:48,760 --> 00:49:51,120
Speaker 2: right to our door. We want an efficient workout class

924
00:49:51,160 --> 00:49:53,040
Speaker 2: if it's twenty five minutes, ten minutes, whatever we have

925
00:49:53,120 --> 00:49:54,480
Speaker 2: time for. We want to make sure we're getting a

926
00:49:54,520 --> 00:49:56,560
Speaker 2: great sweat in. I also feel like when it comes

927
00:49:56,560 --> 00:49:58,560
Speaker 2: to the products that we're using, like we want them

928
00:49:58,560 --> 00:50:01,279
Speaker 2: to be efficient and gum pre has done literally nothing

929
00:50:01,320 --> 00:50:04,480
Speaker 2: for us other than like hurting our teeth. Yeah, so

930
00:50:04,640 --> 00:50:07,160
Speaker 2: I feel like, what's cool about this product? Is you

931
00:50:07,280 --> 00:50:09,680
Speaker 2: at least are getting benefits out of it? Oh?

932
00:50:09,719 --> 00:50:13,479
Speaker 1: Absolutely, yeah, And like why would you even chew regular

933
00:50:13,520 --> 00:50:14,160
Speaker 1: gum at this point?

934
00:50:14,200 --> 00:50:14,960
Speaker 2: That's what I'm saying.

935
00:50:15,520 --> 00:50:17,839
Speaker 1: We're looking at consumption data from our retailers, and what's

936
00:50:17,840 --> 00:50:22,120
Speaker 1: funny is people are thinking. It's great that people are

937
00:50:22,120 --> 00:50:25,680
Speaker 1: thinking that way, where there's definitely an overlap between people

938
00:50:25,680 --> 00:50:27,839
Speaker 1: that are drinking coffee or energy drinks and then also

939
00:50:27,960 --> 00:50:32,480
Speaker 1: chewing gum, you know, And we are now I think

940
00:50:32,520 --> 00:50:36,480
Speaker 1: within the top ten of even traditional gumments in general,

941
00:50:36,520 --> 00:50:40,320
Speaker 1: like the extra the orbits, the altoids. We are selling

942
00:50:40,320 --> 00:50:44,960
Speaker 1: more in terms of dollars per distribution point and velocity

943
00:50:45,400 --> 00:50:49,719
Speaker 1: than like the bottom six of that top ten. So

944
00:50:51,239 --> 00:50:52,000
Speaker 1: we're onto something.

945
00:50:52,320 --> 00:50:57,640
Speaker 2: You're taking over multiple industries. It's so impressive. I liked

946
00:50:57,640 --> 00:51:00,239
Speaker 2: that you said it was a ten year business that

947
00:51:00,280 --> 00:51:03,640
Speaker 2: has become an overnight success. What in the past ten

948
00:51:03,719 --> 00:51:06,160
Speaker 2: years was the biggest turning point for you guys?

949
00:51:07,400 --> 00:51:09,680
Speaker 1: You know, in twenty twenty we went on Shark Tank

950
00:51:10,080 --> 00:51:14,319
Speaker 1: and so that was, well, let's go back because ten

951
00:51:14,360 --> 00:51:16,120
Speaker 1: years ago when we first launched, we were in our

952
00:51:16,160 --> 00:51:19,799
Speaker 1: neotropics and we're targeting a very small group of consumers

953
00:51:20,040 --> 00:51:23,399
Speaker 1: that were into this thing called nootropis, which I bet

954
00:51:23,400 --> 00:51:25,799
Speaker 1: it's less than one in seven people in America that

955
00:51:25,840 --> 00:51:28,040
Speaker 1: I even know what that term is. What is that

956
00:51:28,120 --> 00:51:30,680
Speaker 1: it is basically substances that allowed you to have cognitive

957
00:51:30,719 --> 00:51:34,399
Speaker 1: benefits with minimal or no side effects. So this idea

958
00:51:34,440 --> 00:51:38,239
Speaker 1: of like adderall is not necessarily a nootropic because it

959
00:51:38,280 --> 00:51:41,200
Speaker 1: is basically math. There's a lot of side effects to it.

960
00:51:41,560 --> 00:51:44,759
Speaker 1: But the combination of natural caffeine and elthanine is considered

961
00:51:44,920 --> 00:51:50,399
Speaker 1: a base nootropic stack because the eldanine curbs a lot

962
00:51:50,400 --> 00:51:53,360
Speaker 1: of the side effects of caffeine, so instead of for

963
00:51:53,400 --> 00:51:55,920
Speaker 1: getting like that high peak, you know, it promotes more

964
00:51:55,920 --> 00:51:59,440
Speaker 1: of the relaxation the alpha waves to be able to

965
00:51:59,600 --> 00:52:08,799
Speaker 1: equal equalize the side effects of caffeine. So that was

966
00:52:09,000 --> 00:52:10,480
Speaker 1: the initial group of people that we were able to

967
00:52:10,480 --> 00:52:14,440
Speaker 1: tap into. And right when we launched, Doctor Oz and

968
00:52:14,480 --> 00:52:16,239
Speaker 1: his team actually called us, so we went on like

969
00:52:16,280 --> 00:52:18,440
Speaker 1: Doctor Oz's show, whatever you think about him as a

970
00:52:18,440 --> 00:52:20,600
Speaker 1: actual doctor or not. That put us on the national

971
00:52:20,640 --> 00:52:24,640
Speaker 1: stage in front of a specific consumer group. But it

972
00:52:24,719 --> 00:52:28,839
Speaker 1: wasn't until Shark Tank that in twenty twenty that we

973
00:52:28,840 --> 00:52:31,319
Speaker 1: were able to hit a much larger audience. And then

974
00:52:31,400 --> 00:52:34,560
Speaker 1: Joe Rogan talked about us almost at that exact same time,

975
00:52:35,160 --> 00:52:36,759
Speaker 1: and now all of a sudden, there was like this

976
00:52:36,920 --> 00:52:40,400
Speaker 1: national exposure happening with this product where we were creating

977
00:52:40,400 --> 00:52:44,919
Speaker 1: a new category. So to be able to tell people like, oh,

978
00:52:45,040 --> 00:52:48,080
Speaker 1: we're a gum, but we're also a supplement you know

979
00:52:48,120 --> 00:52:50,799
Speaker 1: we have We're like an energy product, but we're also

980
00:52:50,840 --> 00:52:56,720
Speaker 1: a gum. Categorically, to be to have to educate people

981
00:52:56,800 --> 00:52:59,240
Speaker 1: was one of our hardest things, and those big PR bombs,

982
00:52:59,239 --> 00:53:01,839
Speaker 1: whether it's with Joe Rogan or whether it's with Shark Tank,

983
00:53:02,280 --> 00:53:05,359
Speaker 1: allowed us to what they say, cross the chasm into

984
00:53:05,400 --> 00:53:10,359
Speaker 1: a larger national audience. And then in twenty twenty three,

985
00:53:10,440 --> 00:53:14,680
Speaker 1: we started experimenting with TikTok where Jonathan ha, our VP

986
00:53:14,800 --> 00:53:18,680
Speaker 1: of Growth, and I were committed to posting something every

987
00:53:18,760 --> 00:53:22,080
Speaker 1: single day to figure out what virality is on TikTok

988
00:53:22,120 --> 00:53:25,759
Speaker 1: and what causes virality on TikTok, And when we've got

989
00:53:25,920 --> 00:53:28,280
Speaker 1: our first video, which was a video of me reacting

990
00:53:28,320 --> 00:53:32,319
Speaker 1: to Joe Rogan talking about our product go viral, we

991
00:53:32,400 --> 00:53:37,000
Speaker 1: set in motion this like hook to conversion process that

992
00:53:37,160 --> 00:53:39,640
Speaker 1: we continue to replicate and then continue to turn into

993
00:53:39,719 --> 00:53:44,480
Speaker 1: an entire creator community slash Ecosystem, which is now twenty

994
00:53:44,480 --> 00:53:50,720
Speaker 1: five thousand people after three years, to really continue elevating

995
00:53:50,719 --> 00:53:55,040
Speaker 1: our business and creating almost like an impressions vehicle, Like

996
00:53:55,120 --> 00:53:59,440
Speaker 1: how do you continue to You know, if people you

997
00:53:59,480 --> 00:54:03,120
Speaker 1: could have, you could be doing the most extraordinary thing.

998
00:54:03,400 --> 00:54:05,439
Speaker 1: But if people don't know about it, then what's the point?

999
00:54:05,600 --> 00:54:05,759
Speaker 2: Right?

1000
00:54:06,120 --> 00:54:14,120
Speaker 1: So how do you create that engine?

1001
00:54:17,400 --> 00:54:20,200
Speaker 2: How did Joe Rogan talking about your product compared to

1002
00:54:20,200 --> 00:54:21,359
Speaker 2: you guys being on Shark Tank.

1003
00:54:21,800 --> 00:54:24,960
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, Joe Rogan is basically male oprah. So

1004
00:54:25,440 --> 00:54:28,759
Speaker 1: it was like Shark Tank was one level, but Joe

1005
00:54:28,840 --> 00:54:33,800
Speaker 1: Rogan just it was a level of credibility that elevated

1006
00:54:33,920 --> 00:54:36,680
Speaker 1: us to a whole another level. Yeah, and then we

1007
00:54:36,680 --> 00:54:38,640
Speaker 1: went back on Shark Tank two weeks ago. You know,

1008
00:54:38,880 --> 00:54:41,120
Speaker 1: so we're the first company in Shark Tank history that

1009
00:54:41,120 --> 00:54:42,879
Speaker 1: didn't get a deal the first time that went back

1010
00:54:42,920 --> 00:54:44,560
Speaker 1: on Shark Tank and got a deal the second time.

1011
00:54:45,040 --> 00:54:46,960
Speaker 2: Well, you said you went back two weeks ago, did

1012
00:54:47,040 --> 00:54:47,319
Speaker 2: it air?

1013
00:54:47,800 --> 00:54:49,880
Speaker 1: It's just air two weeks I was from like, we

1014
00:54:50,040 --> 00:54:51,120
Speaker 1: yes last.

1015
00:54:51,040 --> 00:54:52,920
Speaker 2: Year, but right, okay, got it because I saw your

1016
00:54:53,000 --> 00:54:55,840
Speaker 2: Actually we might have damoned on tomorrow for the for

1017
00:54:55,880 --> 00:54:56,799
Speaker 2: the walking portion of the show.

1018
00:54:56,880 --> 00:54:58,359
Speaker 1: Yes, that's great, but.

1019
00:55:00,120 --> 00:55:03,000
Speaker 2: That's it. So we had Jamie simonov On, who's the

1020
00:55:03,040 --> 00:55:05,879
Speaker 2: founder of Ring oh Okay. He also went on Shark

1021
00:55:05,920 --> 00:55:07,719
Speaker 2: Tank and came out the first time with no deal,

1022
00:55:07,719 --> 00:55:10,399
Speaker 2: and then he eventually went back on and was a shark.

1023
00:55:10,960 --> 00:55:13,840
Speaker 2: And it was fun talking to him about his experience

1024
00:55:13,880 --> 00:55:16,840
Speaker 2: on the show because while he walked away without a deal,

1025
00:55:17,280 --> 00:55:20,200
Speaker 2: he still got so much national recognition and then saw

1026
00:55:20,239 --> 00:55:22,279
Speaker 2: such like a spike in sales. So it was great

1027
00:55:22,280 --> 00:55:27,840
Speaker 2: exposure for the brand. But it was interesting because both

1028
00:55:27,920 --> 00:55:31,719
Speaker 2: him and you were kind of and at both Ring

1029
00:55:32,080 --> 00:55:35,120
Speaker 2: and Neuro were kind of misses in the world of

1030
00:55:35,120 --> 00:55:37,719
Speaker 2: the Sharks, like they should have taken the deal.

1031
00:55:38,360 --> 00:55:40,840
Speaker 1: But like, how does that feel. I mean, it feels

1032
00:55:40,880 --> 00:55:43,480
Speaker 1: great for me, but you.

1033
00:55:43,440 --> 00:55:45,239
Speaker 2: Guys looked a good impression, like they liked you on

1034
00:55:45,280 --> 00:55:45,520
Speaker 2: the show.

1035
00:55:45,600 --> 00:55:48,520
Speaker 1: Well, they liked us exactly, and like you know, at

1036
00:55:48,560 --> 00:55:52,160
Speaker 1: the end of the day, it was when we think

1037
00:55:52,200 --> 00:55:54,480
Speaker 1: about why we didn't get a deal or take any

1038
00:55:54,520 --> 00:55:57,560
Speaker 1: of those deals. One Kevin O'Leary's deal was absolutely garbage,

1039
00:55:58,320 --> 00:56:02,040
Speaker 1: and Robert Herzevic was de valuing our business and for

1040
00:56:02,200 --> 00:56:05,120
Speaker 1: Ryan and I it was always going into the show,

1041
00:56:05,160 --> 00:56:06,640
Speaker 1: we are going to stand our ground. We are going

1042
00:56:06,680 --> 00:56:10,920
Speaker 1: to truly believe what we feel is our valuation. And

1043
00:56:11,080 --> 00:56:14,840
Speaker 1: we either get that or were we're not going to

1044
00:56:14,880 --> 00:56:18,280
Speaker 1: take a deal, and so we approach it with honesty

1045
00:56:18,480 --> 00:56:19,800
Speaker 1: at the end of the day, you know, and we

1046
00:56:19,840 --> 00:56:23,920
Speaker 1: approach it with like a sense of with no dis

1047
00:56:24,480 --> 00:56:27,120
Speaker 1: like we were not disingenuous by any means, and I

1048
00:56:27,160 --> 00:56:32,359
Speaker 1: think the sharks like that. And then eventually, through a

1049
00:56:32,400 --> 00:56:34,440
Speaker 1: process of a lawsuit and reaching back out to daniel

1050
00:56:34,480 --> 00:56:37,400
Speaker 1: Lebtski in this whole situation, we became incredibly close with

1051
00:56:37,480 --> 00:56:41,320
Speaker 1: him and we were able to secure a deal with

1052
00:56:41,320 --> 00:56:43,120
Speaker 1: with daniel Lebtski, who's the comounder of a kind bar,

1053
00:56:43,200 --> 00:56:45,319
Speaker 1: who's the best shark, we could have gone all right.

1054
00:56:45,440 --> 00:56:47,640
Speaker 2: So six years later, you guys go back on the

1055
00:56:47,640 --> 00:56:50,239
Speaker 2: show twenty twenty to twenty twenty six. How did the

1056
00:56:50,239 --> 00:56:51,320
Speaker 2: deal terms change?

1057
00:56:51,600 --> 00:56:55,080
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh. So I think when we went in,

1058
00:56:55,440 --> 00:56:58,879
Speaker 1: our valuation was around something like ten to fifteen million,

1059
00:56:58,960 --> 00:57:00,799
Speaker 1: Like Robert Herdevick was trying to work is Town till

1060
00:57:00,800 --> 00:57:03,120
Speaker 1: like seven point five. We wanted to meet at ten,

1061
00:57:03,200 --> 00:57:05,480
Speaker 1: but we went in at a fifteen million dollar valuation.

1062
00:57:08,320 --> 00:57:12,240
Speaker 1: Multiply that by over ten x the second time around,

1063
00:57:13,080 --> 00:57:15,040
Speaker 1: like way more than ten x. Whatever the math is.

1064
00:57:16,320 --> 00:57:17,800
Speaker 1: So yeah, we got a good deal.

1065
00:57:17,840 --> 00:57:19,240
Speaker 2: Were they excited to see you back?

1066
00:57:19,480 --> 00:57:21,240
Speaker 1: Oh my god, they were so excited, and it was

1067
00:57:21,280 --> 00:57:24,120
Speaker 1: like it was one of those things where it was

1068
00:57:24,120 --> 00:57:25,840
Speaker 1: cool because we got to bring in our partners too.

1069
00:57:26,000 --> 00:57:29,600
Speaker 1: So Daniel Beski met us at a paddle club in

1070
00:57:29,720 --> 00:57:33,360
Speaker 1: Austin because Andrew Schultz we just signed is a huge

1071
00:57:33,480 --> 00:57:34,120
Speaker 1: paddle player.

1072
00:57:34,160 --> 00:57:37,840
Speaker 2: I love Andrew on the show. He's a paddle and

1073
00:57:37,920 --> 00:57:41,080
Speaker 2: paddel whatever you call it. I used to see him

1074
00:57:41,080 --> 00:57:43,280
Speaker 2: at the Dumbo Padel the Padel and Dumbo.

1075
00:57:43,240 --> 00:57:46,080
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, he's an investor in that one. Oh he is.

1076
00:57:46,200 --> 00:57:46,960
Speaker 1: I didn't even know that.

1077
00:57:47,240 --> 00:57:48,800
Speaker 2: I saw him in there once and I had to

1078
00:57:48,840 --> 00:57:50,360
Speaker 2: go up and say hi. I was like, I love you.

1079
00:57:50,440 --> 00:57:51,919
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, you just have him on the show.

1080
00:57:52,040 --> 00:57:54,400
Speaker 1: He's awesome. So it was him and Mitchell Hooper, who's

1081
00:57:54,400 --> 00:57:55,160
Speaker 1: the World's strongest man.

1082
00:57:55,200 --> 00:57:58,160
Speaker 2: He's one of the Andrew Schultz on this show. And

1083
00:57:58,200 --> 00:58:01,160
Speaker 2: we will pop an every five minutes.

1084
00:58:01,280 --> 00:58:06,440
Speaker 1: Yes, let's go, let's see him. Yeah, I'll ping him afterwards.

1085
00:58:06,520 --> 00:58:07,800
Speaker 1: And then we had you key to know to f

1086
00:58:07,840 --> 00:58:09,560
Speaker 1: one race car driver, and then Daniel came in to

1087
00:58:09,640 --> 00:58:11,600
Speaker 1: just play like padel paddle with us.

1088
00:58:12,520 --> 00:58:15,240
Speaker 2: And that's when I'm closed better at who's better at

1089
00:58:15,280 --> 00:58:16,320
Speaker 2: padel Andrew? Are you?

1090
00:58:17,240 --> 00:58:21,040
Speaker 1: Oh? Well, Andrew's a professional padel player according to him,

1091
00:58:21,240 --> 00:58:23,120
Speaker 1: so I guess I have to give him the benefit

1092
00:58:23,120 --> 00:58:24,400
Speaker 1: of the doubt and better.

1093
00:58:25,480 --> 00:58:28,240
Speaker 2: Okay, you referenced this before, but in twenty twenty four,

1094
00:58:28,440 --> 00:58:31,400
Speaker 2: Nero became one of the fastest growing brands on TikTok shop.

1095
00:58:32,080 --> 00:58:34,920
Speaker 2: What do you think, you guys, as a company recognized

1096
00:58:35,160 --> 00:58:37,640
Speaker 2: worked on TikTok that maybe other brands.

1097
00:58:37,280 --> 00:58:43,040
Speaker 1: Didn't incentivizing creators effectively. And it's funny because I see

1098
00:58:43,160 --> 00:58:44,960
Speaker 1: all these other companies trying to reach out to creators

1099
00:58:44,960 --> 00:58:46,400
Speaker 1: and be like, hey, I'll give you free product if

1100
00:58:46,400 --> 00:58:49,520
Speaker 1: you talk about it. What is the incentive there for

1101
00:58:49,720 --> 00:58:52,480
Speaker 1: like any person to talk about anything? You know, what

1102
00:58:52,560 --> 00:58:54,720
Speaker 1: is an incentive for any person to work towards anything

1103
00:58:55,040 --> 00:58:58,080
Speaker 1: and being able to take is probably comes from the

1104
00:58:58,120 --> 00:59:02,320
Speaker 1: athlete mentality, you know, like how do you push yourself

1105
00:59:02,360 --> 00:59:06,200
Speaker 1: and how do you encourage others to push themselves. We

1106
00:59:06,280 --> 00:59:10,560
Speaker 1: built that in to the way we interacted with our creators,

1107
00:59:10,680 --> 00:59:13,200
Speaker 1: whether it was through monetary value, whether it was through

1108
00:59:14,440 --> 00:59:16,600
Speaker 1: the community that we were building amongst creators. We have

1109
00:59:16,680 --> 00:59:19,160
Speaker 1: like creator houses where our creators get together and they

1110
00:59:19,200 --> 00:59:21,680
Speaker 1: could talk, whether it's the discord channel that we built

1111
00:59:21,760 --> 00:59:24,360
Speaker 1: where everyone could share their thoughts and ideas, and like

1112
00:59:24,680 --> 00:59:27,720
Speaker 1: we pop in and we provide them with content. All

1113
00:59:27,760 --> 00:59:32,600
Speaker 1: these different incentivization structures kept the creators excited and kept

1114
00:59:32,600 --> 00:59:37,080
Speaker 1: them pushing themselves to be creating new content every single day.

1115
00:59:37,200 --> 00:59:38,640
Speaker 1: And the fact that they would talk to each other

1116
00:59:38,680 --> 00:59:41,000
Speaker 1: on what works and what doesn't also allowed them to

1117
00:59:41,040 --> 00:59:47,320
Speaker 1: have this almost like efficient community, self contained, efficient community

1118
00:59:47,360 --> 00:59:53,919
Speaker 1: within themselves to be able to develop what ideas work

1119
00:59:53,960 --> 00:59:54,720
Speaker 1: and what didn't.

1120
00:59:54,920 --> 00:59:57,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, like literally what hooks work? Right? Yeah, it's so

1121
00:59:57,280 --> 01:00:00,200
Speaker 2: funny because TikTok Shop, I feel like, I mean, I'm it,

1122
01:00:00,240 --> 01:00:01,880
Speaker 2: I'm on a different side of TikTok because it's like

1123
01:00:01,920 --> 01:00:04,200
Speaker 2: I'm just creating content, putting out there and hoping that

1124
01:00:04,200 --> 01:00:06,080
Speaker 2: the videos do well. Obviously, we have a format that

1125
01:00:06,080 --> 01:00:09,160
Speaker 2: we follow, but everybody knows that they scroll on their

1126
01:00:09,200 --> 01:00:10,920
Speaker 2: for you page and every other video is like a

1127
01:00:11,440 --> 01:00:14,280
Speaker 2: TikTok shop video. So I feel like people are fascinated

1128
01:00:14,320 --> 01:00:17,640
Speaker 2: by it. How much can an affiliate make if they

1129
01:00:17,680 --> 01:00:18,600
Speaker 2: have a video go off.

1130
01:00:18,840 --> 01:00:21,080
Speaker 1: I mean, we've paid out over two hundred and fifty

1131
01:00:21,080 --> 01:00:24,200
Speaker 1: thousand dollars a month to one of our top affiliates,

1132
01:00:24,240 --> 01:00:26,240
Speaker 1: just one person, this one person, but he also made

1133
01:00:26,320 --> 01:00:28,200
Speaker 1: us like millions of dollars, you know, in that month.

1134
01:00:28,360 --> 01:00:32,280
Speaker 1: So the it was like a payout for that that video.

1135
01:00:32,800 --> 01:00:34,480
Speaker 2: And then I liked that you used this as an

1136
01:00:34,520 --> 01:00:37,160
Speaker 2: example before. But once Joe Rogan talked about the product,

1137
01:00:37,160 --> 01:00:39,960
Speaker 2: then you guys were almost stitching what he said and

1138
01:00:40,000 --> 01:00:42,640
Speaker 2: creating content around it. So is that kind of a

1139
01:00:42,680 --> 01:00:45,520
Speaker 2: hook that did well? And then maybe other creators now

1140
01:00:45,640 --> 01:00:46,439
Speaker 2: use that hook too.

1141
01:00:46,720 --> 01:00:52,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean yes, that was definitely worked. But at

1142
01:00:52,320 --> 01:00:54,880
Speaker 1: the core of it, it was what is the credibility

1143
01:00:54,960 --> 01:00:57,920
Speaker 1: that you could build in a product that has is

1144
01:00:57,960 --> 01:01:00,240
Speaker 1: a category builder? You know, like no one knows is

1145
01:01:00,240 --> 01:01:06,760
Speaker 1: about again, like what gum with supplementation is. So how

1146
01:01:06,760 --> 01:01:09,560
Speaker 1: do you build credibility, whether it's through a celebrity like

1147
01:01:09,600 --> 01:01:14,439
Speaker 1: a Joe Rogan, whether it's through research papers, whether it's

1148
01:01:14,480 --> 01:01:17,040
Speaker 1: through like a doctor talking about it, and how do

1149
01:01:17,080 --> 01:01:19,720
Speaker 1: you layer that into all the attributes of the product

1150
01:01:20,000 --> 01:01:21,960
Speaker 1: that eventually lead to a conversion.

1151
01:01:22,840 --> 01:01:24,439
Speaker 2: Yeah, I feel like there's just so much that goes

1152
01:01:24,480 --> 01:01:27,960
Speaker 2: into the it goes into distribution and marketing on these platforms.

1153
01:01:27,960 --> 01:01:29,480
Speaker 2: It's so cool, and it's just so cool knowing that

1154
01:01:29,480 --> 01:01:31,520
Speaker 2: you guys leaned into TikTok Shop, because I feel like

1155
01:01:31,920 --> 01:01:34,640
Speaker 2: sometimes brands are slow to jump on the new things

1156
01:01:34,640 --> 01:01:36,720
Speaker 2: that you hear about trending, but you guys jumped on

1157
01:01:36,800 --> 01:01:37,480
Speaker 2: it pretty quickly.

1158
01:01:37,520 --> 01:01:39,040
Speaker 1: I mean, I think one of the things that would

1159
01:01:39,120 --> 01:01:41,400
Speaker 1: be great for you guys is doing lives. So you

1160
01:01:41,680 --> 01:01:44,680
Speaker 1: like recording these podcasts, but doing it in a live format.

1161
01:01:44,720 --> 01:01:49,560
Speaker 1: People hop in and if people even tap into your live,

1162
01:01:50,480 --> 01:01:54,680
Speaker 1: you are going to be refeeding them your like basically

1163
01:01:54,720 --> 01:01:57,680
Speaker 1: your page on their for you page, and it continues

1164
01:01:57,720 --> 01:01:59,520
Speaker 1: to build on itself and a lot of people. When

1165
01:01:59,720 --> 01:02:03,520
Speaker 1: live became very uh not profitable, there was like a

1166
01:02:03,560 --> 01:02:05,640
Speaker 1: period of like six months where it wasn't very profitable.

1167
01:02:05,640 --> 01:02:07,920
Speaker 1: We kept doing them because we knew that there was

1168
01:02:07,920 --> 01:02:10,840
Speaker 1: like a retargeting targeting funnel.

1169
01:02:11,800 --> 01:02:13,360
Speaker 2: I saw you guys were live last night when I

1170
01:02:13,400 --> 01:02:14,000
Speaker 2: went to your two too.

1171
01:02:14,120 --> 01:02:15,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, we're live all the time.

1172
01:02:15,160 --> 01:02:18,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, No, it makes so much sense. So I'm curious.

1173
01:02:18,080 --> 01:02:20,480
Speaker 2: You know, I back in the day, I've lived many

1174
01:02:20,520 --> 01:02:22,000
Speaker 2: lives I feel like on social media. But I had

1175
01:02:22,000 --> 01:02:25,520
Speaker 2: tried to start a brand, an active wear brand, and

1176
01:02:25,520 --> 01:02:27,000
Speaker 2: then I started the Runing Interview Show, and I just

1177
01:02:27,080 --> 01:02:28,560
Speaker 2: kind of had to weigh the pros and cons and

1178
01:02:28,600 --> 01:02:30,400
Speaker 2: I realized that the Running Interview Show was going to

1179
01:02:30,400 --> 01:02:33,480
Speaker 2: be more profitable through just working with brands. But I'm

1180
01:02:33,520 --> 01:02:36,640
Speaker 2: curious for people that want to start a brand, what

1181
01:02:36,680 --> 01:02:39,160
Speaker 2: would be your biggest distribution tip, Like, how do they

1182
01:02:39,160 --> 01:02:41,640
Speaker 2: get their brand out there? What's the what do you

1183
01:02:41,680 --> 01:02:43,240
Speaker 2: think are the keys to success that they have to

1184
01:02:43,240 --> 01:02:43,880
Speaker 2: be thinking about?

1185
01:02:44,480 --> 01:02:48,120
Speaker 1: So I think with I think personal brand it's very

1186
01:02:48,280 --> 01:02:52,240
Speaker 1: very powerful nowadays because so many people are disillusioned by

1187
01:02:52,240 --> 01:02:55,600
Speaker 1: these big companies that are trying to feed them something.

1188
01:02:55,640 --> 01:02:57,800
Speaker 1: You know, that are trying to follow the trends, but

1189
01:02:58,840 --> 01:03:04,360
Speaker 1: the slow, almost boring things like building your brand, building

1190
01:03:04,400 --> 01:03:07,680
Speaker 1: the process, having people learn who you are and going

1191
01:03:07,680 --> 01:03:13,120
Speaker 1: through that almost like interview process with your consumer allows

1192
01:03:13,160 --> 01:03:18,680
Speaker 1: you to have an identity that differentiates yourself from anything else.

1193
01:03:19,200 --> 01:03:22,440
Speaker 1: So are you developing yourself personally and how are you

1194
01:03:22,560 --> 01:03:25,360
Speaker 1: applying it to a brand that talks to a consumer

1195
01:03:25,400 --> 01:03:28,000
Speaker 1: that is just like you and a lot of people

1196
01:03:28,040 --> 01:03:32,080
Speaker 1: like comfort clothes. I think they're called on TikTok. They're

1197
01:03:32,440 --> 01:03:34,640
Speaker 1: Duren like ten million dollars a month or something, right,

1198
01:03:34,880 --> 01:03:38,480
Speaker 1: and that started because people were able to associate themselves

1199
01:03:38,560 --> 01:03:42,680
Speaker 1: effectively with the founders. There's Jim Shark is like another

1200
01:03:42,720 --> 01:03:46,160
Speaker 1: example where like he tapped into this very specific type

1201
01:03:46,160 --> 01:03:50,480
Speaker 1: of gim creator ecosystem and was able to create an

1202
01:03:50,480 --> 01:03:55,480
Speaker 1: identity that was really built from who he was as

1203
01:03:55,520 --> 01:04:00,720
Speaker 1: an individual. So in short, it's to say, how are

1204
01:04:00,720 --> 01:04:04,720
Speaker 1: you creating an identity that fits into an ecosystem that

1205
01:04:04,760 --> 01:04:07,560
Speaker 1: you could play into and then continue re iterating it

1206
01:04:07,600 --> 01:04:10,680
Speaker 1: against the flywheel that you do create, so that exposure

1207
01:04:10,680 --> 01:04:14,720
Speaker 1: against the specific audience compounds on itself. And that's how

1208
01:04:14,760 --> 01:04:15,600
Speaker 1: I would create a brand.

1209
01:04:15,800 --> 01:04:18,480
Speaker 2: Right. It's like, don't try to be so many things.

1210
01:04:18,560 --> 01:04:20,720
Speaker 2: Try to be something to a specific group of people

1211
01:04:20,720 --> 01:04:21,520
Speaker 2: and expand from there.

1212
01:04:21,840 --> 01:04:23,919
Speaker 1: Yeah, and then once you master that, you could become

1213
01:04:23,920 --> 01:04:26,560
Speaker 1: the multi hyphen it, right, you could start developing yourself

1214
01:04:26,560 --> 01:04:27,640
Speaker 1: into different fields.

1215
01:04:28,240 --> 01:04:30,160
Speaker 2: I feel like, we got to get your mural art

1216
01:04:30,240 --> 01:04:32,120
Speaker 2: somehow into the branding for a nerve.

1217
01:04:32,400 --> 01:04:35,040
Speaker 1: I got, well, we do, so we have these like

1218
01:04:35,080 --> 01:04:37,320
Speaker 1: custom edition tins and so last year we were the

1219
01:04:37,600 --> 01:04:40,200
Speaker 1: largest donor to Patty aware at the Ocean Conservation Group

1220
01:04:40,280 --> 01:04:44,360
Speaker 1: for the scuba diving organization Patty, and we painted like

1221
01:04:44,360 --> 01:04:46,840
Speaker 1: a twenty two hundred square foot wall in San Diego.

1222
01:04:47,240 --> 01:04:50,000
Speaker 1: So that design ended up going on one of our

1223
01:04:50,040 --> 01:04:52,400
Speaker 1: tins that ended up raising money, and you know, we

1224
01:04:52,480 --> 01:04:54,800
Speaker 1: end up raising like high six figures or something. Okay,

1225
01:04:55,120 --> 01:04:57,880
Speaker 1: So there's some interplay there. Yeah.

1226
01:04:58,680 --> 01:04:59,920
Speaker 2: I like that. I feel like you gotta leave it

1227
01:04:59,920 --> 01:05:02,400
Speaker 2: a a little bit because your mural art, like it's incredible, guys,

1228
01:05:02,520 --> 01:05:04,640
Speaker 2: oh thank you. He'll go to his Instagram and it's

1229
01:05:04,760 --> 01:05:07,800
Speaker 2: just it's so impressive, right, I mean it's seriously so,

1230
01:05:07,800 --> 01:05:09,520
Speaker 2: so how like how do you balance it? Do you

1231
01:05:09,560 --> 01:05:11,680
Speaker 2: do you get gigs still for mural art or do

1232
01:05:11,720 --> 01:05:12,880
Speaker 2: you kind of do them for fun? Now?

1233
01:05:13,600 --> 01:05:16,280
Speaker 1: So I mean I have to, like I work with

1234
01:05:16,280 --> 01:05:19,040
Speaker 1: like these two managers that typically tend to get me gigs,

1235
01:05:19,080 --> 01:05:22,600
Speaker 1: and I would only do them if it really makes sense.

1236
01:05:22,880 --> 01:05:24,320
Speaker 1: Like murals take so much out of me.

1237
01:05:24,680 --> 01:05:25,640
Speaker 2: They take so much time.

1238
01:05:25,800 --> 01:05:27,560
Speaker 1: They take so much time, Like it's hard for me,

1239
01:05:27,800 --> 01:05:29,640
Speaker 1: you know, like usually I'm on the wall, like taking

1240
01:05:29,680 --> 01:05:32,959
Speaker 1: phone calls and talking to the dem And as Neurro grows,

1241
01:05:33,000 --> 01:05:35,000
Speaker 1: it just becomes more and more difficult, but you know,

1242
01:05:35,040 --> 01:05:37,640
Speaker 1: I'm going out to Gone in like a few months

1243
01:05:37,680 --> 01:05:41,560
Speaker 1: again to paint a mural out in one of the

1244
01:05:41,600 --> 01:05:45,320
Speaker 1: villages that we're building with mister Beast. So you know,

1245
01:05:45,920 --> 01:05:50,200
Speaker 1: if it applies to something that I feel passionate about,

1246
01:05:50,360 --> 01:05:53,480
Speaker 1: or if it applies to something that's about giving back,

1247
01:05:53,920 --> 01:05:57,800
Speaker 1: then that's probably where I'm going to start exploring doing

1248
01:05:57,800 --> 01:06:01,520
Speaker 1: more and more murals again. But right now, it's, uh,

1249
01:06:01,760 --> 01:06:04,320
Speaker 1: I would only pay murals if one if it's in

1250
01:06:04,360 --> 01:06:08,560
Speaker 1: a public space that I would love to activate, or

1251
01:06:08,840 --> 01:06:11,240
Speaker 1: too if it's you know, monetarily it makes sense.

1252
01:06:11,320 --> 01:06:12,840
Speaker 2: Okay. I love knowing that you guys are doing stuff

1253
01:06:12,840 --> 01:06:15,200
Speaker 2: with mister Beast. Is mister Beast an investor in euro.

1254
01:06:16,600 --> 01:06:21,600
Speaker 1: He's not an investor, but Beast philanthropy is like going

1255
01:06:21,640 --> 01:06:25,040
Speaker 1: to be a shareholder. So we are. You know, we

1256
01:06:25,080 --> 01:06:27,800
Speaker 1: look at philanthropy as a big part of our business.

1257
01:06:27,880 --> 01:06:30,000
Speaker 1: So whether it's giving back to again Patty Aware being

1258
01:06:30,000 --> 01:06:33,080
Speaker 1: the biggest uh, you know donor for ocean conservation through

1259
01:06:33,080 --> 01:06:37,880
Speaker 1: that timar WB, which is the largest mental the mental

1260
01:06:37,920 --> 01:06:42,000
Speaker 1: health charity for veterans in the United States. It's when

1261
01:06:42,000 --> 01:06:43,840
Speaker 1: we were out in Ghana and we saw what beast

1262
01:06:43,840 --> 01:06:48,120
Speaker 1: philanthropy does. Like, because I was, you know, thinking of

1263
01:06:48,360 --> 01:06:51,560
Speaker 1: Jimmy what like how he presents himself on YouTube. I

1264
01:06:51,640 --> 01:06:57,640
Speaker 1: didn't truly believe that he was approaching charity in as

1265
01:06:57,680 --> 01:07:00,920
Speaker 1: comprehensive of a way as we we're expecting it to be.

1266
01:07:01,760 --> 01:07:06,920
Speaker 1: But like his mission with feastables to and like child

1267
01:07:07,000 --> 01:07:11,040
Speaker 1: labor out there, and like the cocoa farms, him building

1268
01:07:11,040 --> 01:07:14,160
Speaker 1: these educational centers and villages out in Ghana so that

1269
01:07:14,200 --> 01:07:18,880
Speaker 1: people like actually create a system to get out of poverty,

1270
01:07:18,920 --> 01:07:22,440
Speaker 1: to get out of this child labor loop that's happening.

1271
01:07:23,360 --> 01:07:26,040
Speaker 1: And then Craig Kielberger, who he works with, who's the

1272
01:07:26,080 --> 01:07:29,760
Speaker 1: CEO of his Psilanthry group, and what he's able to do,

1273
01:07:30,560 --> 01:07:34,320
Speaker 1: Like his background really made us believe in the mission

1274
01:07:34,520 --> 01:07:37,680
Speaker 1: and whatever it is that we could contribute back to

1275
01:07:39,800 --> 01:07:42,880
Speaker 1: what they're doing and what we truly believe in. It

1276
01:07:42,960 --> 01:07:43,600
Speaker 1: just made sense.

1277
01:07:43,760 --> 01:07:46,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, not a bad person to get involved with. Yeah,

1278
01:07:46,520 --> 01:07:49,320
Speaker 2: cool stuff, Like I mean, it's a cool guy, Yeah,

1279
01:07:49,440 --> 01:07:52,080
Speaker 2: really cool guy. We love our North Carolina people come

1280
01:07:52,120 --> 01:07:55,960
Speaker 2: on that exactly. Obviously, Jeremy loves the North Carolina creators. Yeah,

1281
01:07:56,000 --> 01:07:58,680
Speaker 2: they're great. Also, it's been one of our goals since

1282
01:07:58,680 --> 01:08:00,560
Speaker 2: we started the show, but just to get to Greenville

1283
01:08:00,600 --> 01:08:02,440
Speaker 2: and see the crazy production that they Oh my god.

1284
01:08:02,320 --> 01:08:03,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, you guy should come out, like I think I'm

1285
01:08:03,840 --> 01:08:05,280
Speaker 1: gonna go out in a few months. I'll let you

1286
01:08:05,280 --> 01:08:06,120
Speaker 1: guys know, Hey, let us know.

1287
01:08:06,160 --> 01:08:10,400
Speaker 2: Maybe we'll bring our baby. That's right, more baby, No,

1288
01:08:10,440 --> 01:08:14,360
Speaker 2: that'd be funny. But Greenville's a crazy place because Jeremy

1289
01:08:14,360 --> 01:08:16,240
Speaker 2: always describes it as like what the hell is going

1290
01:08:16,280 --> 01:08:18,599
Speaker 2: on in Greenville? It's like basically now like Jimmy's world

1291
01:08:18,760 --> 01:08:21,240
Speaker 2: because it's like the middle of nowhere in North Carolina, right,

1292
01:08:21,320 --> 01:08:24,120
Speaker 2: yare of nowhere? Kind of That's what he would describe

1293
01:08:24,160 --> 01:08:27,640
Speaker 2: it as. What have you learned from working with somebody

1294
01:08:27,720 --> 01:08:31,040
Speaker 2: like mister beast Jimmy? What have you learned about business?

1295
01:08:31,080 --> 01:08:34,439
Speaker 1: I mean, it's that man does not stop. But he

1296
01:08:34,479 --> 01:08:38,240
Speaker 1: also surrounds some self with people that work at the

1297
01:08:38,280 --> 01:08:41,080
Speaker 1: same speed that he does. And obviously, you know, like

1298
01:08:41,280 --> 01:08:45,920
Speaker 1: at least to like toxic workplace allegations. But I think

1299
01:08:47,400 --> 01:08:49,320
Speaker 1: I don't know if this is an HR friendly answer,

1300
01:08:49,400 --> 01:08:52,800
Speaker 1: but when you are operating at that high level and

1301
01:08:52,840 --> 01:08:57,759
Speaker 1: that highest speed, you can't keep up like that culture

1302
01:08:57,840 --> 01:08:59,360
Speaker 1: is not for you. And I think It's more that

1303
01:08:59,400 --> 01:09:02,519
Speaker 1: than anything else, because every single person there, we were

1304
01:09:02,560 --> 01:09:05,200
Speaker 1: waking up at five thirty am, and the film crew

1305
01:09:05,240 --> 01:09:07,280
Speaker 1: was already up for like two hours at that point

1306
01:09:07,320 --> 01:09:09,800
Speaker 1: to go three hours into this village film all day.

1307
01:09:09,840 --> 01:09:11,559
Speaker 1: They get back at like nine pm, and then they

1308
01:09:11,560 --> 01:09:14,040
Speaker 1: start their day all over again. And Jimmy would be

1309
01:09:14,200 --> 01:09:17,640
Speaker 1: so like Jimmy would be the person driving that he

1310
01:09:17,680 --> 01:09:21,679
Speaker 1: would stay out there in an excavator and sleep overnight

1311
01:09:21,760 --> 01:09:23,000
Speaker 1: so that he could wake up first thing in the

1312
01:09:23,000 --> 01:09:26,040
Speaker 1: morning and start filming. Like that is how devoted he is.

1313
01:09:26,080 --> 01:09:27,880
Speaker 1: And he does that three hundred and sixty five days

1314
01:09:27,880 --> 01:09:28,360
Speaker 1: out of the year.

1315
01:09:28,479 --> 01:09:30,200
Speaker 2: It's such a good example for your team.

1316
01:09:30,320 --> 01:09:32,080
Speaker 1: It's such a good example. And if you work at

1317
01:09:32,080 --> 01:09:34,160
Speaker 1: that speed, people are going to work at that speed.

1318
01:09:34,400 --> 01:09:36,240
Speaker 1: And same with neuro Like for Ryan and I, you know,

1319
01:09:36,280 --> 01:09:38,559
Speaker 1: we talked about like the mental resilience and everything, like

1320
01:09:38,560 --> 01:09:43,599
Speaker 1: how much you're pushing yourself. You can obviously set an

1321
01:09:43,600 --> 01:09:46,400
Speaker 1: example that translates to everyone else and the way they

1322
01:09:46,400 --> 01:09:49,160
Speaker 1: should operate in the team. But with that, you need

1323
01:09:49,200 --> 01:09:52,120
Speaker 1: to be as decisive like Jimmy is very decisive and

1324
01:09:52,160 --> 01:09:55,160
Speaker 1: everything he does. And that's probably one thing I learned

1325
01:09:55,200 --> 01:09:57,599
Speaker 1: where we were talking on the run. It's like, when

1326
01:09:57,640 --> 01:10:00,800
Speaker 1: you make a decision, the universe can spire to make

1327
01:10:00,840 --> 01:10:04,639
Speaker 1: that decision come true. And as a leader, I think

1328
01:10:04,680 --> 01:10:06,760
Speaker 1: that's the most important attribute that you have to have,

1329
01:10:06,880 --> 01:10:09,920
Speaker 1: that is servedness making a decision, but gathering the right

1330
01:10:09,960 --> 01:10:11,840
Speaker 1: evidence to make a decision that makes sense so that

1331
01:10:11,920 --> 01:10:13,760
Speaker 1: everyone could could back you in that.

1332
01:10:14,040 --> 01:10:17,280
Speaker 2: What's an example that you witnessed in Ghana of Jimmy

1333
01:10:17,320 --> 01:10:18,280
Speaker 2: making a quick decision.

1334
01:10:18,680 --> 01:10:20,720
Speaker 1: I mean, so one of the days, so Ghana has

1335
01:10:20,760 --> 01:10:27,440
Speaker 1: these crazy rainstorms out of nowhere, and even the situation

1336
01:10:27,640 --> 01:10:30,320
Speaker 1: of Jimmy sleeping in the excavator is one of those

1337
01:10:30,320 --> 01:10:34,120
Speaker 1: moments where he's like, we're all staying out here tonight

1338
01:10:34,160 --> 01:10:36,679
Speaker 1: because it rained and we lost three hours of filming.

1339
01:10:37,200 --> 01:10:40,200
Speaker 1: How are we going to start filming early tomorrow? You know,

1340
01:10:40,240 --> 01:10:43,240
Speaker 1: his entire team's like all right, Like fine, we're staying

1341
01:10:43,240 --> 01:10:44,400
Speaker 1: out here so we don't have to drive back to

1342
01:10:44,439 --> 01:10:45,800
Speaker 1: the hotel and back. None of us are going to

1343
01:10:45,840 --> 01:10:47,920
Speaker 1: shower and we're gonna get straight straight back into it.

1344
01:10:48,360 --> 01:10:51,040
Speaker 1: And mind you, not showering in Ghana when it is

1345
01:10:51,200 --> 01:10:54,960
Speaker 1: like seventy percent humidity and ninety degrees every single day

1346
01:10:55,040 --> 01:10:57,920
Speaker 1: is absolutely nuts. But his entire team backs him in

1347
01:10:57,920 --> 01:11:01,240
Speaker 1: that decision. And when were I went back to the hotel,

1348
01:11:01,400 --> 01:11:04,559
Speaker 1: you know, but when we came back the next day,

1349
01:11:04,720 --> 01:11:07,600
Speaker 1: like they were all back at it, and like you know,

1350
01:11:07,680 --> 01:11:09,639
Speaker 1: ten year old comes in and everyone's like chewing urogum

1351
01:11:09,680 --> 01:11:11,519
Speaker 1: out there, But like they were all back at it

1352
01:11:11,960 --> 01:11:14,479
Speaker 1: filming because they knew that they have a short time

1353
01:11:14,720 --> 01:11:18,280
Speaker 1: span to be able to do anything until they had

1354
01:11:18,280 --> 01:11:21,960
Speaker 1: to jump onto their next project. And it's like, I

1355
01:11:22,000 --> 01:11:23,759
Speaker 1: don't know, like I used to work at that speed

1356
01:11:23,800 --> 01:11:25,960
Speaker 1: when we were working in like the Exponential Marketing Agency,

1357
01:11:26,000 --> 01:11:27,920
Speaker 1: and like we were building that and building toy stores

1358
01:11:27,960 --> 01:11:29,679
Speaker 1: and like you had to move at a certain pace

1359
01:11:29,800 --> 01:11:33,240
Speaker 1: to the deadlines. But the fact that he's doing that

1360
01:11:34,000 --> 01:11:37,080
Speaker 1: and everything, you know, I would say the only con

1361
01:11:37,280 --> 01:11:41,160
Speaker 1: of working in that way is everything bottlenecks into Jimmy,

1362
01:11:41,240 --> 01:11:45,920
Speaker 1: because if Jimmy slows down, the entire team slows down.

1363
01:11:45,960 --> 01:11:48,120
Speaker 1: Or if Jimmy can't work one day because he's sick

1364
01:11:48,200 --> 01:11:50,800
Speaker 1: or something, the entire team has that day off also.

1365
01:11:51,479 --> 01:11:55,360
Speaker 1: And so with Jeff, their new CEO, I think a

1366
01:11:55,360 --> 01:11:57,040
Speaker 1: lot of what they're doing and it's a big lesson

1367
01:11:57,040 --> 01:11:59,880
Speaker 1: for myself as well. How do you build the systems

1368
01:12:00,120 --> 01:12:03,599
Speaker 1: to build the processes so things can keep running beyond

1369
01:12:03,640 --> 01:12:06,840
Speaker 1: who you are, beyond the individual. And you know, going

1370
01:12:06,880 --> 01:12:10,360
Speaker 1: back to this idea of like ego dissolution, like how

1371
01:12:10,400 --> 01:12:13,320
Speaker 1: do you expand? The only way that you could create

1372
01:12:13,360 --> 01:12:17,320
Speaker 1: something bigger is if it extends beyond the individual, beyond

1373
01:12:17,400 --> 01:12:18,759
Speaker 1: who you are as yourself.

1374
01:12:18,880 --> 01:12:21,880
Speaker 2: Well, Kent, we covered so much today. As we wrap up,

1375
01:12:22,280 --> 01:12:24,320
Speaker 2: I want you to give us one final piece of advice,

1376
01:12:24,479 --> 01:12:26,280
Speaker 2: a piece of advice that you would give to your

1377
01:12:26,280 --> 01:12:26,920
Speaker 2: younger self.

1378
01:12:28,280 --> 01:12:32,040
Speaker 1: So I always say that pressure makes diamonds. And when

1379
01:12:32,080 --> 01:12:35,240
Speaker 1: you are creating this operating system called the human being

1380
01:12:35,640 --> 01:12:38,519
Speaker 1: and you're exploring all these different things in life, I

1381
01:12:38,520 --> 01:12:42,280
Speaker 1: truly believe that whatever you dive into is almost a

1382
01:12:42,320 --> 01:12:46,720
Speaker 1: stress test system into what makes you a comprehensive individual.

1383
01:12:47,120 --> 01:12:49,840
Speaker 1: So when I dive into murals and having you think

1384
01:12:49,840 --> 01:12:52,320
Speaker 1: big picture, you know, and trusting the process there, or

1385
01:12:52,439 --> 01:12:54,360
Speaker 1: when I think about martial arts and running and my

1386
01:12:54,439 --> 01:12:58,320
Speaker 1: fitness side, and this idea of uh, we talked about pain.

1387
01:12:58,560 --> 01:13:02,840
Speaker 1: You know, pain is really like thinking through final output,

1388
01:13:03,320 --> 01:13:08,080
Speaker 1: like what the ultimate outcome would be. All those things

1389
01:13:08,600 --> 01:13:13,120
Speaker 1: and obviously business with systems and system building all those

1390
01:13:13,160 --> 01:13:20,960
Speaker 1: things are again stress testing what you are capable of

1391
01:13:21,640 --> 01:13:25,519
Speaker 1: to become not just an individual on a single track path,

1392
01:13:26,160 --> 01:13:31,880
Speaker 1: but someone that can look at the world comprehensively and

1393
01:13:32,640 --> 01:13:34,799
Speaker 1: explore it in all this beautiful ways.

1394
01:13:34,960 --> 01:13:36,679
Speaker 2: Well, thank you so much for being here with me today.

1395
01:13:36,760 --> 01:13:37,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, I thank you.

1396
01:13:41,439 --> 01:13:43,479
Speaker 2: Thank you guys so much for making it this far

1397
01:13:43,640 --> 01:13:46,679
Speaker 2: into our conversation. I hope you guys got as much

1398
01:13:46,720 --> 01:13:49,000
Speaker 2: out of it as I know our team did. If

1399
01:13:49,000 --> 01:13:51,519
Speaker 2: you found this episode helpful, please make sure if you

1400
01:13:51,600 --> 01:13:54,280
Speaker 2: haven't already, to follow the show, share it with a friend,

1401
01:13:54,680 --> 01:13:57,640
Speaker 2: and stay tuned for our weekly uploads. I'll see you

1402
01:13:57,640 --> 01:13:59,400
Speaker 2: guys next week.