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Speaker 1: Break on Dallas Cowboys dot Com with Ambar Garcia, Brian
Speaker 1: brought Us, Nick Harris, and Derek Eagleton.
Speaker 6: It is twos that July thirtieth, twenty twenty four, Season twenty,
Speaker 6: episode number eleven.
Speaker 5: Welcome to the latest.
Speaker 6: Edition of The Break, live from uh On, California. Yeah,
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Speaker 3: There you go today.
Speaker 6: Yeah, good to be back of you guys. It was
Speaker 6: an off day for the players on yesterday. Today they
Speaker 6: crank it up, and they really crank it up.
Speaker 5: Today.
Speaker 6: Pats come on for the first time, so it should
Speaker 6: be a lot of fun. A lot of things to
Speaker 6: look out for before we get into that though obviously
Speaker 6: the news that came from the weekend Sam Williams, mcl
Speaker 6: and ACL tear. What does this mean for Sam Williams
Speaker 6: Because this was a year where I feel like most observers,
Speaker 6: even those in the front office, looked at this as
Speaker 6: a year where I think they were expecting Sam to
Speaker 6: take that next step.
Speaker 5: What do you think is next for him?
Speaker 4: Yeah, this is tough for him. It was like you said,
Speaker 4: I think a lot of people were expecting him to
Speaker 4: take that next step because of the opportunity that was
Speaker 4: in front of him. You saw Dorn's Armstrong and Dante
Speaker 4: Fowler Junior leave over the offseason and go to Washington,
Speaker 4: and that just completely opened the floodgates for Sam Williams
Speaker 4: to be able to take on both of their snaps,
Speaker 4: both A Day productions. I mean, Dorren's Armstrong was a
Speaker 4: guy that was second in sacks only behind Micah Parsons
Speaker 4: on this team for the last two seasons, and the
Speaker 4: expectation was that Sam Williams could probably be Micah Parson's
Speaker 4: running mate as that athletic presence off the edge, whether
Speaker 4: he rotates in for Mico or they come off on
Speaker 4: both edges with each of those guys. I mean, that
Speaker 4: could have been a deadly little duo. But now he's
Speaker 4: gonna have to sit a whole season and that puts
Speaker 4: a lot of pressure here on this edge depth, which
Speaker 4: I'm sure we'll dive into as well. But for Sam Williams,
Speaker 4: it's super tough because he had the best opportunity of
Speaker 4: his career going into twenty twenty four, going into his
Speaker 4: third season, and now unfortunately he's gonna have to watch
Speaker 4: from the sidelines.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it really sucks.
Speaker 7: And I mean we did that campaign out show the
Speaker 7: night before, we talked quite a bit about him and
Speaker 7: what we were looking for this season. He was in
Speaker 7: such a great spirit, his energy. I mean, he's one
Speaker 7: of the best, and I get it. A lot of
Speaker 7: people criticize him, and obviously, yes, we see all the
Speaker 7: penalties he draws on the field. Sometimes he doesn't think
Speaker 7: ahead too well. But at the same time, he's a
Speaker 7: guy that has the drive and that has the competitive
Speaker 7: competitive ness to put in the work and I was very,
Speaker 7: very excited to look forward to see what he was
Speaker 7: gonna be able to do this training camp. Like you mentioned, Nick,
Speaker 7: the opportunities that he had in front of him and
Speaker 7: it's just it's devastating. He was in so much pain
Speaker 7: when he got injured. He laid on the ground for
Speaker 7: quite a few minutes there in pure pain. So it's
Speaker 7: just it's it sucks to see such a young guy
Speaker 7: at a key moment in his career get the year
Speaker 7: taken away. But now, I mean, we know next man
Speaker 7: up type of situation. Now it's the younger guys. Marshall Neelan,
Speaker 7: he's a guy that everyone's looking to next now that
Speaker 7: he got drafted, and that's a lot of pressure for
Speaker 7: for a rookie. But let's see what h and also
Speaker 7: what the Cowboys are gonna do if they're gonna end
Speaker 7: up signing some free agent guy.
Speaker 8: Yeah, there's it is a very difficult loss, but especially
Speaker 8: considering with armstrong fouther guys going out the door and
Speaker 8: you're losing some depth there. And then the thought was, okay,
Speaker 8: here's a guy that we really thought enough of. You
Speaker 8: know when you look at where he was selected, and
Speaker 8: you know, there's I'll challenge anybody to find plays where
Speaker 8: he plays a low number of plays but has productive snaps.
Speaker 8: Now he'll have some where he'll go low into a
Speaker 8: quarterback's knees or he'll hit hands to the face and
Speaker 8: you know, and you're trying to get off the field
Speaker 8: on third down, but he's also a guy that could
Speaker 8: get you off the field on third down. And visit
Speaker 8: with Mike Zimmer about that they had a plan for him,
Speaker 8: like seventy seventy five percent of the snaps, we're going
Speaker 8: to be some packages and things that they were going
Speaker 8: to do with him, And so this is a big loss,
Speaker 8: am Bar. You mentioned Marshawn Kneelan. He's shown up really
Speaker 8: well in the early part of the camp. We'll have
Speaker 8: pads out here today. I'm interested to see how that
Speaker 8: goes for him. But he's showing some quickness off the ball.
Speaker 8: I anticipate him getting a lot more work. He has
Speaker 8: been getting a lot work, but now it'll be even
Speaker 8: more prevalent.
Speaker 3: Out there, I think, with the opportunities that he'll get.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I think the interesting part about that is I
Speaker 6: think there are two things. One, I think it was
Speaker 6: interesting to me that he got hurt on a special
Speaker 6: teams type drill, which I've always wondered, like I'd much
Speaker 6: rather see him out there on defense and on special
Speaker 6: teams because special teams is where it seemed like there
Speaker 6: was some of those moments that would show up that
Speaker 6: were like what was that? You know, it's just but again,
Speaker 6: these are just you can't really predict them.
Speaker 5: These things happen. But even beyond that, I think.
Speaker 6: One of the most interesting things for me about where
Speaker 6: they go from here is my expectation is they probably
Speaker 6: went into this camp thinking that Sam was definitely going
Speaker 6: to be a part of the rotation, and they were
Speaker 6: probably gonna get some from from Nyland as well hopefully, Yeah,
Speaker 6: and that was going to be there for man kind
Speaker 6: of in rotation. Now the question becomes it's not simple
Speaker 6: enough just to say well Neeland pushes up.
Speaker 5: The question becomes who's.
Speaker 6: That fourth guy, and you start throwing out names like
Speaker 6: tyrus Weet who popped up last year and kind of
Speaker 6: did some decent things at camp. You got Junior free Jolko, Like,
Speaker 6: who steps up to be that fourth guy?
Speaker 5: I think is the bigger question at this point.
Speaker 4: Yeah, you have Villiami Fojoco Junior, a fourth round pick
Speaker 4: from a year ago, and he didn't see the field
Speaker 4: at all last year, So I think there's an expectation
Speaker 4: that he has to be the guy to be able
Speaker 4: to step up and make an impact. But also, whenever
Speaker 4: dan Quinn was here, he was a guy that was
Speaker 4: maybe sliding in and playing in a little three tag
Speaker 4: and then pushing back out to five. So how does
Speaker 4: his versatility kind of play into that. He's definitely not
Speaker 4: a Sam Williams clone, if that's what you're looking for,
Speaker 4: But that Sam Williams clone is not on this roster. Right.
Speaker 4: You also have Durrell Johnson. He's a twenty twenty three
Speaker 4: undrafted free agent who was on the practice squad last
Speaker 4: year out of Liberty. He's a guy that Will McLay
Speaker 4: had mentioned almost immediately as somebody who would have at
Speaker 4: least an opportunity going into this week. And then you
Speaker 4: mentioned Tyrus Weed. He played a lot with the linebackers
Speaker 4: last year, and then whenever he found his active roster
Speaker 4: spot about halfway through the season, he was kind of
Speaker 4: rotating in with the edge group as well, but mainly
Speaker 4: just a special teams guy at the end of the day.
Speaker 4: But I think those three guys are going to have
Speaker 4: the first shot, and it's probably gonna be a shot
Speaker 4: that lasts, you know, however long into training camp, however,
Speaker 4: long into the preseason and then I think the Cowboys
Speaker 4: are going to have to make a decision probably going
Speaker 4: into that third preseason game or coming out of it saying, hey,
Speaker 4: how do we feel about this edge depth? Do we
Speaker 4: need to add a body here? I mean, there's still
Speaker 4: a couple of veterans out on the market right now.
Speaker 4: Cause I mentioned a couple of veterans out on the
Speaker 4: market as long as they're free agency, okay, Carl Carl
Speaker 4: Lawson and Yunique and Gacway. I mean those are two
Speaker 4: guys who have been super productive at different stops in
Speaker 4: their career. I mean, in Goakway he's been with six
Speaker 4: different teams in the last five years, which is kind
Speaker 4: of crazy. So you know, heyme come bring the journey along. Maybe.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 8: I feel like and you mentioned some really good names.
Speaker 8: Had a chance to look at four different guys free
Speaker 8: agency wise, and the guy I liked the best was
Speaker 8: Charles Harris, who was with the Detroit Lions. I felt like, though,
Speaker 8: I if I'm Will McLay or I'm in the pro
Speaker 8: department here with the Cowboys and I'm bringing names, I'm
Speaker 8: trying to find somebody that has similar traits to the
Speaker 8: guy lost. And I think that when you mentioned the
Speaker 8: Carl Lawson's and then Gackways and stuff like that, similar traits.
Speaker 8: But I think Charles Harris, when you watched him with
Speaker 8: the Lions, and even watching him play against the Cowboys
Speaker 8: last year, you could kind of pick up some stuff.
Speaker 8: The initial quickness off the ball, the explosiveness, the ability
Speaker 8: might play the run better than even what you had
Speaker 8: with Sam Williams. So you know, a guy that can
Speaker 8: hold the edge has some power but has some pass rushability.
Speaker 8: So if you're into that market, all these guys are
Speaker 8: kind of twenty nine years old, and can you say,
Speaker 8: all right, we can get them on a deal. Maybe
Speaker 8: they're looking for a little bit more money than probably
Speaker 8: you're willing to.
Speaker 3: Give. I looked at a Tyres Bowser this morning.
Speaker 8: He was a guy that had hurt his knee in
Speaker 8: twenty twenty three with the Ravens. Was more of a
Speaker 8: stand up three to four outside linebacker. See you didn't
Speaker 8: see him put his hand on the ground. But if
Speaker 8: you're looking for a position, it has some depth to it.
Speaker 8: As you look at your emergency board, the edges seem
Speaker 8: to have more quality. And so that's kind of where
Speaker 8: I think, like, you know, if you're going to have
Speaker 8: something happen. Maybe there's four or five guys there that
Speaker 8: you could take a peek at.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and I think there's probably a decision there from
Speaker 4: the personnel department as far as a type of edge
Speaker 4: that they could bring in. You mentioned probably wanting to
Speaker 4: bring in a guy that has similar traits to what
Speaker 4: Sam Williams now leaves in the void, right, But there
Speaker 4: also could be a decision there. You look at all
Speaker 4: the edges that are on the team right now. Obviously
Speaker 4: you have Micah Parsons, who is this a specimen. He's
Speaker 4: a special te that you could put anywhere on the
Speaker 4: line and kind of isolate him with an offensive lineman.
Speaker 4: But if you look at the rest of the group
Speaker 4: and it's power guys. It's Marcus Lawrence, it's it's Marshawn Kneeland.
Speaker 4: And even if you do look at that depth group
Speaker 4: of Illiami Fojoko Drel Johnson, Tyras Sweet, you have a
Speaker 4: lot of power guys. So hey, do you want to
Speaker 4: just push all your chips into the table and say, hey,
Speaker 4: let's bring in another power guy just so we can
Speaker 4: overwhelm the offensive tackles and wear him down by the
Speaker 4: end of the game, or do you want to give
Speaker 4: Michael Parsons a running mate similar to what Sam Williams
Speaker 4: could have been as an athletic presence off the edge.
Speaker 4: I think that's probably some of the questions that they're
Speaker 4: asking themselves right now, and that they will.
Speaker 2: Be asking a case, well, what would you guys rather have?
Speaker 3: I you know, I'm trying to get.
Speaker 8: I think I'm going to get more of a guy
Speaker 8: that can can rush than the power. And I say
Speaker 8: this because Nick, when we watched kneel and play at
Speaker 8: Western Michigan for the Draft show and stuff like that,
Speaker 8: I think he's showing that he has more quickness and
Speaker 8: pass rush ability then maybe he even showed it at
Speaker 8: Western Michigan. I you know, we were talking to Will
Speaker 8: McClay on one O five three the Fan yesterday and
Speaker 8: I was asking Will about that I didn't think he
Speaker 8: was a particularly explosive or bendy kind of guy, and
Speaker 8: He's like, no, he's really not the bendy. But the
Speaker 8: quickness is better than they even thought, you know, as
Speaker 8: they were looking at at him and they're like, there's
Speaker 8: some things about him, so there might be some pass
Speaker 8: rush quickness, but along with that power that that that
Speaker 8: we were talking about with him. So that's something. But
Speaker 8: if I was to answer your question, Ambar, I would
Speaker 8: try and get a guy that's got some upfield and
Speaker 8: grab that shoulder and get around and like I say,
Speaker 8: Charles Harris would be that guy for me. As I
Speaker 8: look at as I look at these veteran.
Speaker 4: Guys, Yeah, I think there's a couple of guys that
Speaker 4: maybe have a combination of the two as well. But yeah,
Speaker 4: I'm probably with you, Brian. I'd want to find that
Speaker 4: athletic guy who can get up field and kind of
Speaker 4: attack the attack the backfield in a different way than
Speaker 4: maybe what's on the roster are.
Speaker 3: Yeah, this you know, this is it's a it's a
Speaker 3: position that's always you know, you're always kind of struggling
Speaker 3: to find. You know.
Speaker 8: Do you have those tweener guys you know, and and
Speaker 8: and you know some good players for them went on.
Speaker 8: They you know, Armstrong and Fowler, those guys were legitimate
Speaker 8: pass rush type of guys.
Speaker 3: But you know, maybe with Neil and they've.
Speaker 8: Got a guy that does have the combination that they're
Speaker 8: that they're looking for. I'll tell you what I think
Speaker 8: they're trying to make sure they protect themselves at three technique,
Speaker 8: And so you talk about would you move Golston, you know,
Speaker 8: would you move And I'm like, I don't know if
Speaker 8: Hooko has been playing more tackle than he has been
Speaker 8: playing edge, so it might be one of those situations
Speaker 8: where they're forced to put him on the outside as well.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I wonder how much this this injury And it's
Speaker 6: weird to say when you're talking about a guy that
Speaker 6: was not going to be necessarily a starter, but how
Speaker 6: much this injury really impacts them because of what they
Speaker 6: lost in the offseason? Do they have enough of as
Speaker 6: Jerry calls him, the war Daddy's the guys that really
Speaker 6: can go get after the quarterback after losing Armstrong and Fowler,
Speaker 6: who are two guys that could come in in.
Speaker 5: Rotation and get after the quarterback? And even have enough
Speaker 5: those guys.
Speaker 7: Left even then they were still struggling a little bit
Speaker 7: last year, you know, getting to the quarterback towards the
Speaker 7: second half of the season.
Speaker 2: So it's a it's a big yeah.
Speaker 6: And one thing I do like about it is Zimmer
Speaker 6: is a coordinator that tends to use his linebackers in
Speaker 6: the in the in the rush game and so there'll
Speaker 6: be some of that as well that I think could
Speaker 6: be helpful.
Speaker 5: But this is gonna be a challenge for them.
Speaker 6: I think this is a probably one of the one
Speaker 6: of the players that they probably would have said, we
Speaker 6: don't want to if we had to choose what players
Speaker 6: we lose, we wouldn't want to lose a player at
Speaker 6: this position. I think that's a that's a big one
Speaker 6: for him.
Speaker 4: That's an interesting point because as somebody asked me on
Speaker 4: Twitter I think it was last night, Hey can Demarvey
Speaker 4: and over show them be a guy that they isolate
Speaker 4: off the edge at times? That's an opportunity that I mean,
Speaker 4: that's an option that that could possibly work.
Speaker 5: He did it at Texas.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And you also have Maris Lui Foul
Speaker 4: who was kind of a third down specialty pass rusher
Speaker 4: at times last year for Notre Dame. He's a guy
Speaker 4: who would show pre snap like, hey he's going to
Speaker 4: cover the middle of the field and he just b
Speaker 4: lines for the quarterback as soon as the ball was
Speaker 4: snapped and he was able to get there and hurry.
Speaker 4: So yes, that that position group I think could kind
Speaker 4: of help this this depth problem out. But at the
Speaker 4: end of the day. You lost three bodies now this offseason,
Speaker 4: and you only added one. So there's gonna have to
Speaker 4: be some sort of coming together as far as the
Speaker 4: talent that's already on this roster adding another piece from outside.
Speaker 5: All right, personal guy, get to work.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's the thing about.
Speaker 8: You know, the thing you come to camp with is
Speaker 8: a list of like I say, an emergency board, you know,
Speaker 8: in there in the personnel trailer.
Speaker 3: The names are up all on the wall.
Speaker 8: And then you know, Will and the staff probably sat
Speaker 8: down and looked at that, you know, looked at that
Speaker 8: list and said, okay, if we had to, And then
Speaker 8: then it turns into next thing. You know, you ask
Speaker 8: God in pacifica, then okay, Adam, go sign the guy.
Speaker 8: So once you determine who that guy is, then you
Speaker 8: got to go make sure you sign that guy. You know,
Speaker 8: maybe bring him in, work him out here, you know,
Speaker 8: between practices and kind of find out really what kind
Speaker 8: of shape they're in as well.
Speaker 5: All right, we're gonna take our first break, we'll come back.
Speaker 6: We'll get some observations from the last couple of practices,
Speaker 6: and I want to hear from you guys as we're
Speaker 6: getting ready for this next practice. Who are the guys
Speaker 6: that you are particularly wanting to see when the pats
Speaker 6: come on to see if they can maybe continue what
Speaker 6: they've sell shown them so far in some of those
Speaker 6: first practices.
Speaker 5: We'll do that when we come back down. Cowboys dot
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Speaker 5: Welcome back.
Speaker 6: We were in the second segment live from ox Nod, California.
Speaker 6: Today is the most exciting day of training camp in
Speaker 6: my opinion, the day the pads come on for the
Speaker 6: first time. So there's gonna be some popping out here.
Speaker 6: So finally looking forward to that.
Speaker 3: It's also terrifying all the same.
Speaker 6: Yeah, exactly right, exactly. But before we as we get
Speaker 6: into that, let's start first. I want you guys to
Speaker 6: take me back to the previous two practices. Give me
Speaker 6: an observation, just one observation of a player or a
Speaker 6: group of players that really stood out to you one
Speaker 6: way or the other.
Speaker 5: Uh, in these last couple practices.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I'll start Tyron Billy Johnson. How about that. It
Speaker 4: feels like there's a different receiver every year out here
Speaker 4: that kind of catches our eye as far as a
Speaker 4: name that not necessarily that we didn't know or a
Speaker 4: it's just a name that kind of popped up from
Speaker 4: under the radar to being a guy who's you know,
Speaker 4: starting to threaten for a spot now saying that there's
Speaker 4: gonna be a pretty tough competition to get that final
Speaker 4: ross your spot at the receiver position. And you also
Speaker 4: have a draft pick that's factored into that equation too,
Speaker 4: that we haven't even had an opportunity to really see
Speaker 4: on the field as a result of injury. But if
Speaker 4: you had to ask me who has been the most
Speaker 4: consistent receiver here every single day, you take the names
Speaker 4: off their jerseys and just tell me which one. It's
Speaker 4: number thirteen tying Billy Johnson. I mean, he's a guy
Speaker 4: who's been super impactful in the short, intermediate, and long range.
Speaker 4: He's had the deep balls from Cooper Rush that he
Speaker 4: hauled in for a touchdown in the final practice on Sunday.
Speaker 4: He's had this short and intermediate stuff with Trey Lance
Speaker 4: and Dak Prescott. He's looked awesome. I mean, he was
Speaker 4: a speed guy coming out of Oklahoma State and he's
Speaker 4: kind of developed as this possession guys his career has
Speaker 4: gone on, and hey man, he's a guy that's just
Speaker 4: kind of hung around on practice squads for the last
Speaker 4: four or five seasons. He's starting to build some experience
Speaker 4: and we see that experience paying.
Speaker 7: Off a guy that I would say, and this is
Speaker 7: more an observation as far as like just the dynamics
Speaker 7: of it rather than plays that I've seen. But Ezekiel
Speaker 7: Elliott and his his comeback and what that group looks like.
Speaker 7: You know, it's very different than the time that he
Speaker 7: was here. During the time that he was here, you know,
Speaker 7: we always would see the dynamic between him and Dak
Speaker 7: and very close and he's a very happy and active guy.
Speaker 7: Right now it's completely different, Like if you didn't tell
Speaker 7: me that was Zeke, I wouldn't know that that was
Speaker 7: him because of the way he's carrying himself. He's like
Speaker 7: and not that he was ever obnoxious at all. It's
Speaker 7: more he's low key at the moment. He's focused, focused
Speaker 7: on what he needs to do. He's doing his work
Speaker 7: with the running back group. He's not like taking over completely.
Speaker 14: He he.
Speaker 7: I'm trying to perfectly describe it as like, you know,
Speaker 7: it's Zeke when he was here, that's the main guy,
Speaker 7: and he's the leader of the crowd. Now he's just
Speaker 7: part of the group and just doing like working his
Speaker 7: way back up. I should say, so, I thought that
Speaker 7: was very interesting and completely different than what I've been
Speaker 7: used to seeing when he was here prior. But I'm
Speaker 7: curious to see just how the running back group develops.
Speaker 7: Right now, there's nobody that really is taking over. Everyone's
Speaker 7: doing kind of the same type of work and the
Speaker 7: same type of the same amount of work.
Speaker 2: And I'm still.
Speaker 7: Wanting to see what the keeping my eye on that
Speaker 7: running back group and see if anyone actually takes the leader.
Speaker 3: Eric Kendricks is as good as advertised. Yeah, and you
Speaker 3: watch him play.
Speaker 8: His ability to be at the right place at the
Speaker 8: right time. He baited Dak into an interception the other
Speaker 8: day in practice where we haven't seen a linebacker I
Speaker 8: believe since Sean Lee. When you start to talk about
Speaker 8: playing past defense, getting in throwing lanes, getting interceptions, knocking
Speaker 8: balls down, you know we're going to see what the
Speaker 8: pads come on. You'll see that part where these linebackers
Speaker 8: step up, they thump. They don't bring the running backs
Speaker 8: or ball carriers to the ground. But you'll see number
Speaker 8: fifty a lot probably in your clips. Probably Nick Harris
Speaker 8: will have a bunch of clips where you'll see number fifty.
Speaker 8: He's at the ball he's at the ball. He's at
Speaker 8: the ball the way he's knocking the ball down. So
Speaker 8: he's just been as good as advertised when you look
Speaker 8: at his the veteran presence he has and his ability
Speaker 8: to be at the right place at the right time
Speaker 8: when the defense is called for.
Speaker 6: So, as you guys are looking at those guys you've
Speaker 6: watched through these first three practices as they get ready
Speaker 6: to put on the paths today, what guys are you
Speaker 6: going to be looking particularly for, because now with the
Speaker 6: pads on, you can get a better evaluation on them.
Speaker 4: I don't want to see anybody's answer. I don't want
Speaker 4: to keep going first, Go ahead, Okay, I'm looking at
Speaker 4: the trenches. You know, this is a group that I
Speaker 4: think has got a big spotlight on them going into
Speaker 4: Give me a guy one name Tyler guy easily looking
Speaker 4: at him at left tackle. I mean, he was able
Speaker 4: to do some things last week lining up against Michael
Speaker 4: Parsons where he was able to account for whatever Michael
Speaker 4: Parsons was throwing at him as far as what he
Speaker 4: has on his path rush toolbag. But but the pads
Speaker 4: aren't on. That's always the caveat see now the pads
Speaker 4: are on. So he's gonna have to be able to
Speaker 4: account for the full force that is Michael Parsons, the
Speaker 4: full force that is the Marcus Lawrence and Marshawn neland
Speaker 4: so how can he account for that? Whenever the Pads
Speaker 4: come on today, Man, that's gonna be what I'm looking for.
Speaker 4: I think it's gonna be a fascinating journey that Tyler
Speaker 4: Guidon will have out here in Oxnard and in the preseason.
Speaker 4: It's gonna be really big for him.
Speaker 7: Well, my favorite period that I'm so excited to see today,
Speaker 7: well it's when the O lineman go against the defensive
Speaker 7: line and yes, the one on ones and one of
Speaker 7: the main guys, i mean, Mazzie Smith. Huge, huge year
Speaker 7: for him before the Pads coming on and all that
Speaker 7: we saw or did we talk about it when he
Speaker 7: had his little argument or five.
Speaker 6: Talked about We talked about it on the on the
Speaker 6: show the other night in.
Speaker 7: Between the other truble, Well, he had some beef with somebody.
Speaker 7: I'm still trying to figure out who the person was.
Speaker 7: Apparently nobody saw it, but again, if the fire was
Speaker 7: there during early that earlier on in practice, I'm waiting
Speaker 7: to see.
Speaker 2: I'm excited to see how he looks, how quick he looks.
Speaker 7: We talked about how his body has started to change
Speaker 7: a little bit, so I'm curious just to see how
Speaker 7: he actually looks in action.
Speaker 8: Can I say overshown, Yes, just because I feel like
Speaker 8: though that he The last memory I had at him
Speaker 8: was in a preseason game and I think he had
Speaker 8: six plays and three tackles. And I'm interested to see
Speaker 8: how now with the pads on the movement looks good.
Speaker 8: He looks confident out there playing. I guarantee he's going
Speaker 8: to get to every single ball today. He's that type
Speaker 8: of player. And talking to Mike Zimmer, I'll give you
Speaker 8: another guy real quick too, is Damone Clark.
Speaker 3: Mike really likes Damon Clark.
Speaker 8: And if you when you dig into with Damon Clark,
Speaker 8: the physical ability is there, the athletic of ability is there.
Speaker 3: Mike has got to work with him though on that
Speaker 3: awareness and then also his.
Speaker 8: Ability to read and to react, because once he's able
Speaker 8: to do that, he can make plays. This lineback and
Speaker 8: crew is so much better than where they were last
Speaker 8: year at this time, and so as a whole, if
Speaker 8: you want to watch a position today, and I mentioned Kendricks.
Speaker 8: Watch this linebacker crew today, and like Damber's talking about,
Speaker 8: there's probably gonna be some one on one stuff, you know,
Speaker 8: with maybe we'll see the linebackers working against running backs
Speaker 8: and tight ends throwing the football.
Speaker 3: Maybe you'll see a little bit of that. You'll see some.
Speaker 8: Nine on seven where there's a run period. You know,
Speaker 8: you'll see them fit in the runs and how they go,
Speaker 8: and then you'll see some team period as well. But
Speaker 8: I have a feeling at the end of the day,
Speaker 8: to quote Stephen Jones, how he says that in the
Speaker 8: end of the day, uh, the you're gonna look at
Speaker 8: this lineback and crew and say, as a whole, they
Speaker 8: probably had a pretty damn good day.
Speaker 4: Monk Clark is a fascinating if I could, Mike, it's
Speaker 4: a fascinating thing. Really. You look at what he was
Speaker 4: asked to do last year. He was asked to do
Speaker 4: everything in the middle of that defense. And I think
Speaker 4: it might be unfair for some to say that, you know,
Speaker 4: DeMont Clark probably won't be what everyone expected. But I
Speaker 4: think you kind of have to throw twenty twenty three
Speaker 4: out of the out of the picture because I understand
Speaker 4: games like Buffalo where he was just in the wrong
Speaker 4: place at the wrong time at all times, but exactly
Speaker 4: he was asked to do so much last year whenever
Speaker 4: late Vandresh went down. But now that those responsibilities are
Speaker 4: kind of being taken off his plate, he has a
Speaker 4: veteran in the room and Eric Kendricks. He has a
Speaker 4: guy that can rush the pass or step back into
Speaker 4: coverage next to him into Marven and Overshonamris, a little
Speaker 4: foul demon. Clark is going to be able to be
Speaker 4: DeMont Clark this year, and I'm very excited to see
Speaker 4: what that looks like.
Speaker 6: I'll throw out another position group that I'm really excited
Speaker 6: to see. I've in some of the conversations I've had
Speaker 6: with folks around here, I think there is a real
Speaker 6: belief that they have something special in the tight end room.
Speaker 6: And so one of the things I want to see
Speaker 6: once the pacts come on is who starts to separate
Speaker 6: themselves when you start blocking. Yeah, can school Maker take
Speaker 6: that step? Because that's what we saw from him in
Speaker 6: college at Michigan. We thought that's the part he would
Speaker 6: be able to come in and immediately be able to
Speaker 6: be an upgrade there.
Speaker 5: But I don't know if they got that out of
Speaker 5: him last year.
Speaker 3: They sure.
Speaker 6: The question is now is he ready to take that step?
Speaker 6: Are some of those other guys who are really looking
Speaker 6: good when they're running, you know, in shorts and and
Speaker 6: and and and shells, but when you put on the pads,
Speaker 6: how do they look when they're having to block some
Speaker 6: of those defensive ends, some of those linebackers. I think
Speaker 6: that's going to be the tele tape for the tight ends.
Speaker 3: There's a lot of us.
Speaker 8: Here that have thrown dirt on on hindershot, you know,
Speaker 8: and all of a sudden, you know he's made a
Speaker 8: couple of plays in camp, and you know they they
Speaker 8: run the way they get the tight ends. It seems
Speaker 8: the ball it's either the seam for the waggles where
Speaker 8: they move. They send the defense one way and come
Speaker 8: back the other with the tight end. So I'm looking forward.
Speaker 8: I'm with you on this. Can you know, can you
Speaker 8: see Luke scoon Maker and others?
Speaker 1: Uh?
Speaker 3: Span forward?
Speaker 8: These guys they're supposed to be blockers, big blocking guys,
Speaker 8: and if you and they're going to run the football,
Speaker 8: they've got to be better as point of attack blockers
Speaker 8: at tight end.
Speaker 4: Quick question I would have for you guys, as far
Speaker 4: as the tight end position goes is you have Schoonmaker.
Speaker 4: Obviously it was this blocking guy you bring in, Brevin
Speaker 4: span Ford, who his specialty coming out of the Big
Speaker 4: Ten as well was the blocking aspect of things. The
Speaker 4: schoonmaker's roster spot is safe. So that's not what I'm
Speaker 4: asking here. But do you think there's a little bit
Speaker 4: more pressure on Schoonmaker, Yes, to be able to produce
Speaker 4: knowing that you have another Big Ten guys span Ford
Speaker 4: who's ready to do the same thing.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you got to figure out too.
Speaker 8: And like with John Stevens, I mean, are they if
Speaker 8: they go long at a position When we break camp
Speaker 8: and we're all packing this thing up and we're starting
Speaker 8: to think about what positions, how's this fifty three man
Speaker 8: roster gonna look? These tight ends can make you feel
Speaker 8: about going long, and I mean going long like carrying
Speaker 8: an extra guy, you know, And so that's that's you know,
Speaker 8: these training camp practice to you'll cut yourself. If you
Speaker 8: don't perform, you will cut yourself. And eight everyone's like, oh,
Speaker 8: well that the coach has got no you cut yourself
Speaker 8: because you didn't do I think there's a lot of
Speaker 8: pressure on Luke's schoonmaker. And I know he's a second
Speaker 8: round and all that, but there are some guys on
Speaker 8: this roster right now that if they show better and
Speaker 8: they you know, Luke Schoomaker, I'm not gonna say safe.
Speaker 8: I'm gonna say consideration if he doesn't perform well enough.
Speaker 8: And they've got three other guys and plus what they got.
Speaker 8: You know, Will McClay was talking to us about Hunter Lipkey,
Speaker 8: you know, and there's another guy that Okay, you're gonna
Speaker 8: keep a full back, that's gonna keep what's gonna happen
Speaker 8: at running back?
Speaker 4: Now?
Speaker 3: WHOA Does that affect the tight ends? Does that affect
Speaker 3: the offensive line?
Speaker 4: They did line up Loopkey on some Titans.
Speaker 3: Yes, exactly exactly.
Speaker 2: So you saw Hendershan. He needs to This is a.
Speaker 4: Step it off.
Speaker 2: I have to step it up because last year was
Speaker 2: not good. And we'll see.
Speaker 7: So far, I haven't seen him do a whole lot
Speaker 7: yet in this I don't know if you guys have
Speaker 7: noticed anything from him.
Speaker 8: Caught a couple of passes and stuff like that on
Speaker 8: those boots and waggles things like that, but that's kind
Speaker 8: of where.
Speaker 3: You've seen the group. You've seen Hi.
Speaker 8: You've seen him catch passes and that Scoonmakers even caught passes.
Speaker 8: But to Derek's point, this group, if they are going
Speaker 8: to run the football better, they have got to be
Speaker 8: better as point of attack blockers.
Speaker 3: And it starts out here today.
Speaker 6: And to that point, there were two names. I've been
Speaker 6: having some conversation with different people around here. They are
Speaker 6: two names that keep coming up, Hunter lip Key and
Speaker 6: John Stevens. Those two names keep coming up, and everybody
Speaker 6: keep saying, man, these guys are and.
Speaker 5: They but they have but they have. The people I've
Speaker 5: talked to just they have a it seems like they
Speaker 5: have a mental plan.
Speaker 6: You always talk about this, Brian, you have a vision
Speaker 6: for the player, and it seems like everybody that I've
Speaker 6: talked to has like they see the vision for these
Speaker 6: two players and they're excited about what they can be
Speaker 6: in this offense.
Speaker 8: Everybody wants Kyle Huescheck from the forty nine ers. See
Speaker 8: if you've ever seen Kyle Hughescheck play. He's one of
Speaker 8: the reasons why all of a sudden, Christian McCaffrey has
Speaker 8: space because they got wide receivers that block, they got
Speaker 8: a tight end at blocks and then they got a
Speaker 8: full back that they bring in motion that sets us
Speaker 8: the edge and then just hammers people to get the
Speaker 8: so if they You know Hunter Lipkey last year, but
Speaker 8: during the season he was what I call a half
Speaker 8: man blocker.
Speaker 3: He was only hitting half the defender and the defender
Speaker 3: was getting off.
Speaker 8: Towards the end of the year, he was hitting more
Speaker 8: square and he was staying with guys and he was
Speaker 8: kind of figuring out how to dig guys out of
Speaker 8: a hole, which is a skill that's a hard still
Speaker 8: to do something. I mean, Darryl Johnston was a master
Speaker 8: at it in the nineties for the Super Bowl teams
Speaker 8: here of going in there and digging guys. As a
Speaker 8: full back, you can't be indecisive. You can't go in
Speaker 8: there like and just kind of stop and shut her
Speaker 8: around in there, because that makes the backstop. And what
Speaker 8: happens when the backstops all of a sudden, everybody's getting there.
Speaker 8: You've got to get that thing going downhill. And Hunter
Speaker 8: Lipkey got better at that last year.
Speaker 4: You could kind of see the McCarthy wants to have
Speaker 4: another John Coon in his offense. As you can you
Speaker 4: can see.
Speaker 6: That we're going to take our final break, we will
Speaker 6: come back. We'll continue our conversation on camp storyline. Let's
Speaker 6: talk a little bit about the running back position. I
Speaker 6: think there's so much intrigue in this position. We teed
Speaker 6: it up there with a little talk on lipkey, but
Speaker 6: there's some other guys we should mention as well that
Speaker 6: when we come back.
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Speaker 5: It is the final segment of the mortgage. We're not
Speaker 5: fly from this WBC mortgage California.
Speaker 6: I'm gonna do that all the way through camp until
Speaker 6: we get back to That's how it always goes This
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Speaker 6: mister producer, Man Chris beIN. All right, so let's let's
Speaker 6: talk a little bit about storylines. Not the storylines, but storylines,
Speaker 6: some storylines from camp.
Speaker 5: I want to talk about the running back stop member.
Speaker 6: I want to talk about the running back position, and
Speaker 6: I want to talk about it from the standpoint of
Speaker 6: I'm gonna throw out some different uh, some different options,
Speaker 6: and I'm gonna ask you, guys, which of these options
Speaker 6: is most concerning to you?
Speaker 5: Most concerning to.
Speaker 6: You Zeke's ability to be a lead back, Rico Dowdle's
Speaker 6: ability to stay healthy, Induce Vaughan Size, or Hunter Lipkey's
Speaker 6: real true position?
Speaker 5: Is he a running back or fullback? What's more concerning?
Speaker 4: Hm hmm. I would have to go with Zeke's ability
Speaker 4: to be a lead back, just because those other three,
Speaker 4: those are other three areas. If they don't pan out,
Speaker 4: I think there's a somewhere else where you could kind
Speaker 4: of fill in and make something happen with it. Uh,
Speaker 4: run me back. It was Rico's where if that were
Speaker 4: to falter, you still have other bodies in that room.
Speaker 4: Deuce Van Size. Yes, it's a concern, but I don't
Speaker 4: think he's going to be asked what everybody else in
Speaker 4: that running back room is going to be asked to do.
Speaker 4: And then Hunter Lipke's positional you know, where does he go?
Speaker 4: I think that's more speaks to his versatility. Yes, I
Speaker 4: factor him into that running back room, but I also
Speaker 4: kind of see him as a guy off on an
Speaker 4: island a little bit. But Zeke's ability to be a
Speaker 4: lead back. If he can't be a lead back, I
Speaker 4: don't know who can in that room. So I would
Speaker 4: have to go with that option.
Speaker 2: But what are you calling a lead back?
Speaker 6: A guy that if you get into a game and
Speaker 6: you need to run him twenty times in that game,
Speaker 6: he can do it.
Speaker 5: And the question is is that Zeke at this point
Speaker 5: his career.
Speaker 6: I do think in the second half of the season
Speaker 6: last year he had some games where you're like, Okay,
Speaker 6: that's that's vintage Zeke.
Speaker 8: Yeah, I think you can run him twenty times, but
Speaker 8: it might be for sixty one yards. Yeah, That's that's
Speaker 8: kind of where you're.
Speaker 3: At right now.
Speaker 8: I mean it's the tough yards and stuff like that.
Speaker 8: I think every point that you just went through is
Speaker 8: an absolute concern, And I mean the Hunter Lipkey one.
Speaker 8: I think Hunter Lipkey, we've kind of got him figured
Speaker 8: out as being is the full back, the h the
Speaker 8: tight end, maybe a short yardage back if he doesn't
Speaker 8: fumble against the Dolphins. I think everybody's super happy about
Speaker 8: Hunter Lipkey and what he's done. And you know, but
Speaker 8: to me, this is where if I'm Will McClay, I'm
Speaker 8: telling my pro department, my guys, I'm like, listen, let's
Speaker 8: keep an eye on all these teams that have surplus
Speaker 8: at running back. I don't know, I'm not gonna let
Speaker 8: this scene get into the season like they did the
Speaker 8: one year with the wide receivers. Remember when we're out
Speaker 8: here and they went wide receiver by committee, then all
Speaker 8: of a sudden it said we need Amari Cooper. You know,
Speaker 8: I don't think it's gonna be week five, week six.
Speaker 8: I think if they get through a couple of weeks
Speaker 8: of practice here, maybe a preseason game, and it doesn't
Speaker 8: look like it's like listen, our line is blocking, but
Speaker 8: we're not getting anywhere, then I could very well see
Speaker 8: them taking any surplus that they do have at a
Speaker 8: position and maybe making a swap or taking a compensatory
Speaker 8: pick and sending it to somebody, because there's teams that
Speaker 8: do have starting callible running backs that aren't going to
Speaker 8: be starters for that team, and maybe you can determine
Speaker 8: that you can get that guy and it can help
Speaker 8: you get to where you need to be.
Speaker 2: See to me, I think.
Speaker 7: I think Zeke with that role of having just a
Speaker 7: split work between Rico, I think that could still be successful.
Speaker 7: Then they could be better off playing that way. And
Speaker 7: in certain tough scenarios like closer to the end zone,
Speaker 7: you can now lean more towards a guy like Leapke,
Speaker 7: like we've seen him do some of that. I mean,
Speaker 7: he had that one mistake in that game where he
Speaker 7: dolphins chair drop the ball or something, but I think
Speaker 7: he can be that weapon that you bring in at
Speaker 7: certain times at unique times. But the combination of Rico
Speaker 7: and Zeke, I think I have my hopes and hopefully,
Speaker 7: I mean we haven't seen it just yet, but I
Speaker 7: think that could work. So to me, I would say
Speaker 7: just having Rico's health more important. And I'll give you
Speaker 7: just a funny observation that you know the little thing
Speaker 7: the machine where you put the ball and he goes
Speaker 7: and he goes.
Speaker 2: To whatever it's called, what is it called machine.
Speaker 7: After practice, you know how they do that with some
Speaker 7: of the players and they getting some extra work just
Speaker 7: catching the ball right there. Well, they had a few
Speaker 7: of the running backs and you know, everyone's waiting their turn,
Speaker 7: and Lipky he's doing his thing, and then Zeke is
Speaker 7: waiting off to the side and he's just waiting. Okay,
Speaker 7: Well it looked like was done with the work, and
Speaker 7: then Zeke started going in and then he's like, oh no, no, no,
Speaker 7: hold on, I'm still not done, and like just get
Speaker 7: in the stiff arm. And then Zeke is like, it's
Speaker 7: all good man, he took your find. But then Zike
Speaker 7: just walked off and took his helmet off and it's like,
Speaker 7: all right, I'm done. It wasn't It wasn't anything like
Speaker 7: I'm not causing drama or anything.
Speaker 2: It wasn't anything.
Speaker 7: But it was just like something surprising that you see
Speaker 7: that you don't tend to see younger players kind of
Speaker 7: be like that with a veteran guy. So with all
Speaker 7: that being said, I'm just saying Leaky is a guy
Speaker 7: to look for, and I think he has the the personality,
Speaker 7: the drive, and we've seen it last year on the field,
Speaker 7: how he was playing, and I think he will be very,
Speaker 7: very effective this year.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I agree with you.
Speaker 2: Yeah you know, Oh yeah, I have a picture of
Speaker 2: the guy on your desk.
Speaker 8: I'll say this though, this is a really important position
Speaker 8: for this team because and this is nothing against.
Speaker 3: Dak Prescott, but I don't think I want Dak Prescott.
Speaker 8: Throwing the ball forty five times a game if they
Speaker 8: have no running game, you know, all of a sudden,
Speaker 8: and you know, interceptions happen. It's not all Dak's fault
Speaker 8: on interceptions, but the more you throw, the more the
Speaker 8: possibility of a ball clanging off somebody or somebody not
Speaker 8: running the right route or somebody you know, and then
Speaker 8: all of a sudden, it turns into turnovers.
Speaker 3: They have got to have They don't have to be
Speaker 3: the San Francisco.
Speaker 8: Forty nine ers running the football. They don't have to
Speaker 8: be the Baltimore Ravens running the football. But they don't
Speaker 8: need to be the thirty second ranked team running the football.
Speaker 8: And I think that that puts so much pressure on
Speaker 8: Dak and these receivers and tight ends if in fact
Speaker 8: they don't have a running game, and it might even
Speaker 8: put more pressure on their offensive line too to have
Speaker 8: to protect so and if, especially if you're dealing with
Speaker 8: a rookie left tackle, you know, how much do you
Speaker 8: really want to put him in harm's way early? So
Speaker 8: figuring out this running back room quickly before it, you know,
Speaker 8: goes into the point where, hell, the only way they
Speaker 8: can move the ball is throwing it. And that's not
Speaker 8: a problem. Sometimes with Dak, it's not a problem. Dak
Speaker 8: can throw the football and be just fine. We saw
Speaker 8: him finish second as the MVP. But throwing the football
Speaker 8: could also lead to more turnovers.
Speaker 4: That's a really good point. That's a really good point.
Speaker 4: You look at early in the season at Cleveland week
Speaker 4: one home and gets Baltimore week three, Homan gets Detroit
Speaker 4: week six at San Francisco. You need to win the
Speaker 4: time of possession battle on those games. And it's it's
Speaker 4: probably not a situation like the Amari Cooper situation was
Speaker 4: where maybe you can get five six weeks into the
Speaker 4: season and maybe address it. You gotta address that thing
Speaker 4: on the right of it, right, So that's gonna be
Speaker 4: an interesting factor in this whole whole equation.
Speaker 3: Final cutdowns will be big for them.
Speaker 8: Because maybe somebody will put a running back out there
Speaker 8: that they said, Okay, this guy is better than or
Speaker 8: maybe they just don't want to they don't want to
Speaker 8: chance it. And they could they could flip a pick
Speaker 8: and go get a guy and then say okay, let's
Speaker 8: plug him in and go.
Speaker 4: One of you got that. I would be interested to
Speaker 4: start talking to some folks about his molikue. I mean,
Speaker 4: if you're looking for a guy who could maybe bring
Speaker 4: some athletic presence to to marry with zek style. I mean,
Speaker 4: Malin Davis was a guy I think we were coming
Speaker 4: into camp last year as a guy like, hey, he
Speaker 4: could compete for an RB two type of role, and
Speaker 4: he ended up staying on the practice squad and just
Speaker 4: kind of fell off. And we haven't seen a whole
Speaker 4: lot of him out here yet, but I would like
Speaker 4: to see what he can bring from an athletic standpoint
Speaker 4: every season.
Speaker 3: Yeah, if you remember the playoff game against San Francisco
Speaker 3: when Pollard got hurt.
Speaker 5: Yeah he was.
Speaker 8: They didn't put him in, they went they went totally
Speaker 8: different direction there, So you wonder, but that was a
Speaker 8: previous regime in some in some ways with the running
Speaker 8: back coach and things like that, So you know, maybe
Speaker 8: it was a doghouse situation and now he's trying to
Speaker 8: kind of find his way out of that dog.
Speaker 6: It certainly felt like he fell out of favor with
Speaker 6: someone at some point, because there was a point where
Speaker 6: you thought he was kind of working himself into the mix,
Speaker 6: and then all of a sudden, it just seemed like
Speaker 6: he wasn't a part of the plans. All right, we
Speaker 6: appreciate you guys. John's will be back on Thursday and
Speaker 6: we'll get more and too. We'll go to tell you
Speaker 6: guys what's going on out here with these pads that'll
Speaker 6: be coming up today, So make sure you check out
Speaker 6: all the coverage on Dallas Cowboys dot Com till the
Speaker 6: End for Brian brought us Amber Garcia, Dick Harris.
Speaker 5: I'm Derek Eagleton. This has been the Break live on
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