Speaker 1: Of the Law and Order franchises, SVU is considered especially watchable.
Speaker 2: We are the amateur detectives who kind of investigate the
Speaker 2: vicious felonies.
Speaker 3: These episodes are based on. These are our stories, done done.
Speaker 2: Hello, Welcome to That's Messed Up an SVU podcast.
Speaker 3: This is my co host Kara Klank.
Speaker 1: And this is my co host Lisa Trigger. We're still
Speaker 1: doing this Freaky Friday intros.
Speaker 2: Yeah, one of my favorite movie tropes. In this podcast,
Speaker 2: we talk about an episode of Law and Order s
Speaker 2: view the True Crivates based on and then we have
Speaker 2: a special guest from the episode because we're cool and important.
Speaker 1: So that's that so cool and important that we are
Speaker 1: recording today from different hosts.
Speaker 3: Is in New York again a jet setter. I'm in
Speaker 3: New York.
Speaker 2: I'm in my friend's closet slash Peloton room, and there
Speaker 2: is a Route Paul ride and I will be riding
Speaker 2: this week.
Speaker 3: And I cannot wait.
Speaker 1: That guy Cody does it right, doesn't he love RuPaul?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 2: I just cannot wait to bounce around to Rutpaul songs.
Speaker 3: I actually can't wait.
Speaker 2: I don't know if I'm going to survive this New
Speaker 2: York trip. I've already just taken shots of something called
Speaker 2: rum fire, and on the bottle it says overproofed.
Speaker 3: So I don't know what that happens. I don't either,
Speaker 3: but it burned. She also sent me an email last night.
Speaker 1: You sent me an email last night, though it was
Speaker 1: like long, with all these notes, and then at the bottom
Speaker 1: it was like, I am realizing that I'm kind of
Speaker 1: drunk right now.
Speaker 2: So I forgot I sent that email till you just
Speaker 2: said it.
Speaker 3: I remember.
Speaker 2: No, I've been opening my phone and seeing photos. I mean,
Speaker 2: I feel like I'm in college again. Honestly, it's like
Speaker 2: I'm vaxed. I'm on the subway. I'm giving Yeah, I'm
Speaker 2: giving people.
Speaker 3: In the streets money. I don't care. No, it's exciting.
Speaker 3: I'm going in August and I can't wait to get
Speaker 3: back to New York. No, I want to move back.
Speaker 3: It's not good. You're just saving back, not right away,
Speaker 3: but just let's be rich. I know.
Speaker 1: It's just that's the thing with That's the thing though.
Speaker 1: You go back to New York and it's like Stockholm syndrome.
Speaker 1: You forget about all the bad stuff. You go back
Speaker 1: and you have these honeymoon periods where you're like, oh,
Speaker 1: especially right now it's like springtime in New York, like
Speaker 1: oh my god, it's magic, Like of course.
Speaker 3: You are magic, and I was here.
Speaker 2: I'd like to say, I'm filming my friend Sam Jay's new.
Speaker 3: HBO Max show. Oh yeah, that comes.
Speaker 2: That came out on the twenty first, so that was
Speaker 2: the premiere episode. I don't know what episode I'm in,
Speaker 2: but check it out because there I'm doing something perverted.
Speaker 2: So oh wow, stay tuned, so excited to watch it. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I'm doing some really wild things on this show, and
Speaker 2: I think it's going to be an amazing show.
Speaker 3: So check out Sam Jay.
Speaker 1: It's called pause with Sam Jay, right yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3: Pa usc not pause like pause up for No one
Speaker 3: thought pause for Lady Gaga. Nobody thought that.
Speaker 2: But she's amazing and it was an incredible set and
Speaker 2: I got.
Speaker 3: To see a lot of friends and it was nice
Speaker 3: to work again.
Speaker 2: You know, another show I want to mention I'm not
Speaker 2: in at all, but I think you guys might be interested.
Speaker 2: I watched all of Shrill, and the guy who plays
Speaker 2: ed Kemper and Mindhunter is like a love interest of
Speaker 2: eighty on Shrill, So that was like exciting and his
Speaker 2: voice is the same, and I'm like, wait, aren't you
Speaker 2: a murderer scared person?
Speaker 3: And he's like kind of nice guy, a good guy
Speaker 3: that lives in Portland. Yeah, that's fun. Oh yeah, I'm
Speaker 3: like dying. I gotta get to SHRILL.
Speaker 1: Well, once I start my nighttime routines with a new baby,
Speaker 1: I'll be watching SHRILL.
Speaker 3: Wait, I need to tell you about this.
Speaker 1: So I think you just heard about this, but we've
Speaker 1: been getting like a thousand DMS.
Speaker 3: Everyone is telling us.
Speaker 1: We tweeted this, of course, but everyone is talking about
Speaker 1: this little girl in Florida.
Speaker 3: Who defended her elf.
Speaker 1: She not only escaped to kidnapping attempt, but she was
Speaker 1: able to basically brand her attacker with blue slime so
Speaker 1: that when the police caught him, they I could positively
Speaker 1: identify that this was the guy who did it because
Speaker 1: she watches SVU. She's eleven years old and she's been
Speaker 1: watching SVU for a long time. So all you moms
Speaker 1: that follow us and her or daughters that follow us
Speaker 1: and have said I started watching SVU way too young.
Speaker 3: I don't think it was young enough.
Speaker 1: Like we are seeing SVU in these streets saving lives
Speaker 1: and I'm loving it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and Marishka, I guess reached out to her and
Speaker 2: she's going to get an SVU award because she did it.
Speaker 3: I mean, let her have a little walk on part.
Speaker 3: Let her find a body.
Speaker 2: Come on, where is the body? Also, you probably haven't
Speaker 2: seen this yet because you are a busy bee. But
Speaker 2: I was on Instagram, Sarah Jessica Parker did just post
Speaker 2: there is going to be a hocus Pocus too coming
Speaker 2: out twenty twenty two.
Speaker 3: Aready knew about that? You did?
Speaker 1: Yeah, but I wasn't allow to tell anyone because I
Speaker 1: know I my friend was approached to write it and didn't.
Speaker 3: But wow, you kept it a secret, you dumb it.
Speaker 3: I you know what you know?
Speaker 1: At least it wasn't even me keeping a secret. It's
Speaker 1: like I knew and I just forgot. I just forgot
Speaker 1: to tell you. I should have told you, and I
Speaker 1: just I filed it away because she was like, please
Speaker 1: don't say anything, and then I was like, oh, maybe
Speaker 1: it won't happen, you know, and then here we go,
Speaker 1: it's happening.
Speaker 3: Wow, all right?
Speaker 1: Well twenty twenty two, Oh my gosh, Liza, the countdown
Speaker 1: is on the countdown is on Baby.
Speaker 3: That's amazing. I'm glad they got all three of them
Speaker 3: back on board. It's like, what the Sex and the
Speaker 3: City reboot? You know my thoughts.
Speaker 1: I'm having a really hard time getting on board without Samantha.
Speaker 2: Oh but they just hired someone for a Sex and
Speaker 2: the City from Grey's Anatomy, Sarah Romirez or something like.
Speaker 3: That, Sara Ramirez.
Speaker 2: Yeah, she got care to be the Samantha. I don't
Speaker 2: know if she's the Samantha. She's probably going to be
Speaker 2: a gay character, but she will be a new friend.
Speaker 2: I don't think she's gonna put on a blonde wig
Speaker 2: and pretend she's also an svulum.
Speaker 3: Oh my god.
Speaker 1: Can you imagine if they just like cast someone as Samantha.
Speaker 1: I meant, like as the Samantha, as like the you know,
Speaker 1: more sexually free friend, not somebody going hi, it's me.
Speaker 2: Well. They also did a study and like Charlotte was
Speaker 2: the most prude, but she still fucked over seventy guys.
Speaker 3: On the run of that show. Are you serious?
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like they did the numbers like they're all sluts,
Speaker 2: you know what I mean?
Speaker 3: Like I have the merch that says, are we sluts?
Speaker 2: Oh? And we found out our Carly who are the
Speaker 2: did we already tell them this? I played tennis with
Speaker 2: Carly gen Andrews, who did our logo.
Speaker 3: We went on a friend date and I got to
Speaker 3: meet her in person. We didn't tell them this. I
Speaker 3: don't know. Maybe it's not interesting. I don't know. But
Speaker 3: we played tennis. What's happening?
Speaker 2: No, it is weird to socialize freshly with people, and like,
Speaker 2: I don't know, it is pretty wild to start over
Speaker 2: again and be in public and be at people houses
Speaker 2: and I could tell people are like, Okay, our hang.
Speaker 3: Is done, but I'm like I'm not leaving it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm not ready to stop talking, so I'm pouring
Speaker 2: another one.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's fun. I went to like an indoor dinner
Speaker 1: last night, me and my husband that there are another
Speaker 1: couple and then his parents who were in town and
Speaker 1: who liked to do it up when they come to town.
Speaker 1: We went to a really nice place and had like
Speaker 1: a really long dinner. Like I had to keep texting
Speaker 1: my babysitter being like just a little bit later, I
Speaker 1: didn't realize we were getting dessert and coffee.
Speaker 2: No, yeah, I heard that our friend's parents love a
Speaker 2: good time. Love a nice dinner, love a throwdown credit
Speaker 2: call like they like, yeah party, there are martini steaks. Yeah.
Speaker 1: And there were a lot of drinks, a lot of drinks,
Speaker 1: and you know what, I didn't appreciate. The somelier at
Speaker 1: the place who does the wine was like bringing out
Speaker 1: glasses and there were six of us and he brought
Speaker 1: out five glasses. And it's like, yes, I know, I
Speaker 1: am nine and a half months pregnant, but I will
Speaker 1: decide if I'm having a glass of.
Speaker 3: Wine or not.
Speaker 1: You do not need to only bring five classes. So
Speaker 1: I made him bring me a glass.
Speaker 3: Was he kissed or no? No, he was like oh
Speaker 3: oh so like yeah, he just like brought me one.
Speaker 2: This actually reminds me of something else, but that I
Speaker 2: would like to talk about the fucking horrific abortion bill
Speaker 2: that was just signed by the governor in Texas. And
Speaker 2: then my friend Julia, who is here, was tweeted like,
Speaker 2: I wonder if all these freedom fighting Austin centered comics
Speaker 2: we're all about freedoms and no laws and no censorship,
Speaker 2: are gonna say anything about this fucking abortion bill or
Speaker 2: do anything while they're in that state. Like all of
Speaker 2: them just wave up like keep going on and on
Speaker 2: about cancel culture, and then actual horrific laws that inhibit
Speaker 2: people's lives and safety are happening, and I don't think
Speaker 2: they're gonna say a fucking.
Speaker 1: Word, right, And to clarify, this is a law that
Speaker 1: makes it so that like you can't have you cannot
Speaker 1: have an abortion after six weeks I believe. Is that correct? Yes,
Speaker 1: And you can't even get in at a doctor until
Speaker 1: you're seven or eight.
Speaker 3: Weeks to confine.
Speaker 2: And anyone can sue you, like if someone like you can.
Speaker 2: You can sue the person who drives you to the clinic,
Speaker 2: you can sue the receptionist, like anyone can sue anybody
Speaker 2: if they find out you were at all a part
Speaker 2: of an abortion. Wow, it's like truly the most heinous act.
Speaker 2: And before the election of twenty sixteen, I remember a
Speaker 2: lot of me and my friends were like super concerned
Speaker 2: and scared about Roe v Way and all of this happening,
Speaker 2: and everyone was like, you're hysterical, shut up, relax, give
Speaker 2: them a shot, Like nothing will happen. You guys are
Speaker 2: going wild, And it's like, oh, look all of the
Speaker 2: things that we were scared of happening.
Speaker 3: Five six years ago are now could happen? Yeah, and
Speaker 3: Mississippi is the same. I mean, it's going to be states.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's just going to be people crossing state
Speaker 1: lines to try to get abortions.
Speaker 3: Now, it's fucking crazy.
Speaker 1: And what happened to all the anti mask people with
Speaker 1: my body my choice?
Speaker 3: How is that different?
Speaker 2: They're just all really big hypocrites and it's really upsetting
Speaker 2: and I'm just scared for everyone.
Speaker 3: And I don't even know do I hope for the best.
Speaker 2: It's like, we have all these justices and judges everywhere
Speaker 2: that are out of their fucking minds and people are
Speaker 2: gonna die from this in horrific ways.
Speaker 3: Yeah, no, it's it's fucking tragic.
Speaker 2: But you know, hopefully Joe Rogan won't get canceled like
Speaker 2: fucking it's so annoying.
Speaker 1: Yeah, hopefully white men will still be able to speak
Speaker 1: their truth.
Speaker 3: The balls of that man.
Speaker 2: You just made a hundred million dollars on your own
Speaker 2: show and you move to a place to not pay
Speaker 2: fucking taxes and then you're talking about like are they
Speaker 2: gonna come for me? It's like you get paid millions
Speaker 2: to talk. How are you so diluted? It is so frustrating.
Speaker 1: Well, he's speaking up for his brogans, right, He's speaking
Speaker 1: up for his followers.
Speaker 3: You know, man, they need their voices heard, Lisa.
Speaker 1: We need to hear their hot takes on fucking bitcoin
Speaker 1: and abortion.
Speaker 2: Oh you know what's terrible. I have a diamond tattoo
Speaker 2: and it has BTC. It's like an inside thing with
Speaker 2: my friend and I. People think it's a bitcoin tattoo.
Speaker 2: People have been coming up to me going bitcoin, and
Speaker 2: I'm like, what the fuck, And so I have to
Speaker 2: get it covered up.
Speaker 3: No you don't. Oh my god, people think I have
Speaker 3: a bitcoin tattoo.
Speaker 2: Kara.
Speaker 3: That's so fucking funny, Lisa.
Speaker 2: Also, we do have to mention that was a funny
Speaker 2: video you sent me of Rosie. You were trying to
Speaker 2: have Rosie bond with your future baby Yes' Instagram.
Speaker 1: I put it on our Instagram and I will save
Speaker 1: it in the mention it all highlight if people want
Speaker 1: to see it. But I was basically like pointing to
Speaker 1: my tummy and going like, hey, Rosie, who's coming next week?
Speaker 3: Who's coming next week?
Speaker 1: Like and like making her look at the baby, and
Speaker 1: she just like looks me in the eyes and like
Speaker 1: grins and goes Lisa like.
Speaker 3: She's got you on the mind all the time. I
Speaker 3: liked when you went, oh my god.
Speaker 1: All right, well, speaking of babies, this is a sort
Speaker 1: of kid centric episode of SBU. Let's get right into
Speaker 1: it and get going for today. All right, let's get
Speaker 1: going into the woods, guys. Today we're doing Glasgow Man's Wrath,
Speaker 1: which is season sixteen, episode six. So we open up
Speaker 1: on like home video footage of a little girl sleeping
Speaker 1: and then like her mattress gets tipped up, she falls
Speaker 1: out of bed. It's like her older sister Mia and
Speaker 1: her friend that are kind of like pranking her, and
Speaker 1: then MIA's friend Perry is videotaping them.
Speaker 3: The older girls seem like.
Speaker 1: They're around twelve and the younger girl is maybe nine
Speaker 1: or ten. The whole movie then kind of switches to
Speaker 1: them like being witchy, right, like you're having some kind
Speaker 1: of like witchy time, and they're like it's November first,
Speaker 1: the day after Halloween, and they're about to do a ceremony.
Speaker 1: Now they're outside on the street like with their little backpacks.
Speaker 1: They're at the entrance of inwood Hill Park inwood If
Speaker 1: you're wondering, is the neighborhood at the very tippy top
Speaker 1: of Manhattan, like right before you cross over into the Bronx,
Speaker 1: and I've actually been there.
Speaker 3: It's super super cute.
Speaker 1: They film a lot of stuff up there to try
Speaker 1: to make it look like suburbs, because like it's very
Speaker 1: there's very cute little streets with houses and stuff. Like
Speaker 1: I went to a shoot once there that was on
Speaker 1: this like adorable little street where all the houses look
Speaker 1: the same. So anyway, they're making their spooky vlog and
Speaker 1: about how they're talking about how they're going to go
Speaker 1: into the park to find Glasgow Man and by dawn
Speaker 1: and their.
Speaker 3: Journey will begin.
Speaker 1: The girl videotaping Perry is trying to like freak out
Speaker 1: the little one whose name is Zoe, and he's like, oh,
Speaker 1: he likes the little ones about Glasgow Man. And then
Speaker 1: they like hear a sound, they start running, and we're
Speaker 1: just it's just very blair witchy found footage, like we're
Speaker 1: just seeing them kind of run and it's like it
Speaker 1: is pretty creepy. And then suddenly like you see Zoey
Speaker 1: go down and it's like he's got Zoe and the
Speaker 1: camera's on the ground like just obstructed by leaves.
Speaker 2: I'm like, does did Found Footage exist before Blair Witch?
Speaker 3: Like blair Witch is Found Footage?
Speaker 1: Yeah, I know, and then and then paranormal like all
Speaker 1: the paranormal activities.
Speaker 3: But that's post.
Speaker 2: I feel like Blair Yeah changed the game for cheap filmmaking.
Speaker 3: So true. And that came out in ninety nine, right.
Speaker 3: I remember me and my brother in law went to
Speaker 3: go see it.
Speaker 1: I went to go see it Lisa. I was working
Speaker 1: at summer camp. I knew so no TV, I've got
Speaker 1: no Internet, I've got nothing. And my brother had told
Speaker 1: me about the movie before I went to camp and
Speaker 1: was like, yeah, it's real, like they found this footage
Speaker 1: of these kids like that that were never found again.
Speaker 1: And so when I went to go see it, I
Speaker 1: like fully thought it was real, Like it was the
Speaker 1: most terrifying movie going experience of my life.
Speaker 3: So I remember not being scared enough to be honest.
Speaker 1: Wait, but you're younger than me. I was like nineteen
Speaker 1: when I saw that. Weren't you like twelve? You weren't
Speaker 1: scared at all?
Speaker 2: No, because I was ready to be so scared, and
Speaker 2: I was kind of disappointed.
Speaker 3: I remember being like my brother in law was so scared.
Speaker 3: I remember my.
Speaker 2: Brother in law and I went to go see the
Speaker 2: Hillary Swank movie about like the plagues, like the Egyptian
Speaker 2: you know what I mean, Like like there was focus
Speaker 2: and stuff, and I remember him jumping and going insane,
Speaker 2: and I'm like, this is humiliating for you.
Speaker 3: Bro.
Speaker 1: I have been known to scream like a cartoon character
Speaker 1: in horror movies in the theater, but that one, I've
Speaker 1: just scared the shit me because I thought it was real.
Speaker 2: No, for sure, I've screamed at lesser things. I'm not
Speaker 2: a tough guy. Like I screamed at the Gift on
Speaker 2: a plane. Oh, my Gift is freaky. I remember screaming
Speaker 2: at the ring we saw us together.
Speaker 1: I screamed, yes, you were a bundle of nerves during US.
Speaker 3: I feel like I was scared.
Speaker 2: I screamed during Yeah, I will scream, but maybe I
Speaker 2: didn't scream as much as a youth.
Speaker 3: I don't know.
Speaker 2: Blair Witch was a disappointment, but I'm impressed with their
Speaker 2: I don't know, like ingenuity.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yes, like they were on the frontier of the
Speaker 1: found footage stuff. So now at the top of act one,
Speaker 1: it's regular TV again. We're not looking at the footage anymore.
Speaker 3: It's sunrise. Rollin's and Crisey are on the scene.
Speaker 1: A birdwatcher has found Zoe who's being loaded into an
Speaker 1: ambulance and she's been stabbed a bunch of times.
Speaker 3: Koresy is going to talk to the.
Speaker 1: Bird watcher, but first he's like any homeless around here,
Speaker 1: and the uniform police officers like what do you think?
Speaker 1: And he's like, go round them up, and I'm kind
Speaker 1: of like, not a great look that you like immediately
Speaker 1: are like it's the unhoused, you know, like give it
Speaker 1: a second, Like I don't necessarily think unhoused people are
Speaker 1: just wandering the parks to stab children. So now they're
Speaker 1: talking to the bird lady again. More birds on SVU.
Speaker 1: We will get to the bottom of this, like I
Speaker 1: will ask Neil Bhart or somebody, like what is always
Speaker 1: going on? There's bird watchers, bird owners, just a lot
Speaker 1: of bird stuff happening on the show all the time.
Speaker 2: Maybe because they're just always out and about looking paying attention.
Speaker 1: Those are the people that like have a camera, I guess.
Speaker 1: So we're talking to the bird lady and she said
Speaker 1: she saw a guy.
Speaker 3: Come out of the woods.
Speaker 1: He was huge and hulking and standing over the girl's body.
Speaker 1: She said she shoot him off, but she also took
Speaker 1: photos and she's like they're digital, very cute. So now
Speaker 1: we're at the hospital and they're looking at the pictures
Speaker 1: on the phone that are like kind of blurry, and
Speaker 1: Rollin's we get a little we get a little glimpse
Speaker 1: into the personal lives where Rollin's asks tomorrow, like, how
Speaker 1: is California because at this point we know that his
Speaker 1: wife Maria and his daughter Zara have moved to California,
Speaker 1: and he's like it was confusing. Zara's thriving, but like
Speaker 1: blah blah blah. I'm like, yeah, California's great. You know,
Speaker 1: of course she's thriving. She loves the sunshine. She probably
Speaker 1: loves it here. I'm sure she's into green juice now.
Speaker 1: So then the doctor comes out, the one who's been
Speaker 1: examining Zoe, and that is doctor Darby Wilder, played by.
Speaker 3: The most beautiful woman in the world. Yeah, she's so beautiful.
Speaker 1: We've talked about her before, but her real name is
Speaker 1: Evanna Copat right. I'm probably saying her name wrong. I apologize.
Speaker 1: She's been in ten episodes of Best View but this
Speaker 1: is her first one. So she first appeared in season sixteen,
Speaker 1: and I believe has been in season sixteen through twenty one,
Speaker 1: so we'll see if she pops up this season. In
Speaker 1: twenty two, she says, Zoe's lucky.
Speaker 3: To be alive.
Speaker 1: She had all this head trauma, plus one of her
Speaker 1: stab wounds was millimeters from her friend Artery, and she
Speaker 1: is out of surgery, but she lost a lot of blood.
Speaker 3: So now these two women rush up to Rollins and Tomorrow.
Speaker 1: These are Zoe's mothers, and they want to know if
Speaker 1: Mia is there too, because they to their mind, Mia
Speaker 1: and Zoe both went to a sleepover at Perry's house,
Speaker 1: and Perry is a single mom who is not answering
Speaker 1: any calls or texts, but there the mom's tracker app
Speaker 1: says that the girl's phones are inside Perry's house. So
Speaker 1: Rollin's and Tomorrow had previously been debating whether to call
Speaker 1: Olivia because she's home on like her one day off
Speaker 1: with Noah, and they decide ultimately they have to call
Speaker 1: her because now two young girls are missing. Now we
Speaker 1: go to Livia's apartment and we see that this is
Speaker 1: like her day with Noah. This is the baby Noah
Speaker 1: that I stand. Okay, I love this cute, little chubby
Speaker 1: toddler Noah. He's just a little puff ball with a
Speaker 1: lot of hair.
Speaker 3: I love him. I wish they could have just like
Speaker 3: kept rotating babies.
Speaker 1: And she had like a Benjamin button like Noah that
Speaker 1: never grows up, because you will know how I feel
Speaker 1: about older Noah. So then she while she's playing with Noah,
Speaker 1: she gets the call from Rollin's and Tomorrow and she's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: let me just call my sitter.
Speaker 3: I don't really.
Speaker 1: Understand why they have to bother her, like it doesn't
Speaker 1: really seem like.
Speaker 2: Well, it's an active chase. There's two missing girls. They
Speaker 2: need to find out the kid.
Speaker 3: True, I guess. I just it's a big deal.
Speaker 4: I know.
Speaker 3: I'm just like, you guys know how to handle this.
Speaker 3: How long have you guys been on the squad? Gotta
Speaker 3: tell your lieutenant. I do get a live in nan.
Speaker 3: I don't understand this nanny that's just going to show
Speaker 3: up on Sunday in the middle of.
Speaker 1: It day has a super nanny this because like later
Speaker 1: I think the nanny's name.
Speaker 3: Is Lucy, and she's just like it's four am.
Speaker 1: Lucy can you pop over like we've got a VIC Like,
Speaker 1: it's crazy how flexible Lucy is.
Speaker 3: I hope she's getting the coin.
Speaker 1: So when they get to Perry's apartment, Rollins and Tomorrow
Speaker 1: are coming up the stairs. They come upon Perry's mom, Barbara,
Speaker 1: who is seemingly being attacked right outside her apartment door.
Speaker 1: They pull weapons the guys like I'm on the job
Speaker 1: State police, and they were just doing like a sexy
Speaker 1: rape role play. I guess, I don't know. It was
Speaker 1: like very weird to me that that's like the moment
Speaker 1: that the cops get there is when they're just like
Speaker 1: playing break in.
Speaker 3: It seemed weird.
Speaker 1: So she doesn't really understand why the cops are looking
Speaker 1: for her kid, and it's like, have you not checked
Speaker 1: your phone in twenty four hours?
Speaker 3: Like they said, They've been texting her and she's not answering.
Speaker 1: So it's like you're on just like a date with
Speaker 1: your guy, overnight date, just not checking your phone even
Speaker 1: though you have a teenage kid. Sorry I'm being a
Speaker 1: judging mom right now, but that just seems weird. I'm
Speaker 1: looking at my phone constantly.
Speaker 2: Yeah, care, but it's not always for parenting that you're
Speaker 2: staring at your phone.
Speaker 3: No, but when I'm away from Rosie, I literally am.
Speaker 1: Like looking at my phone just because I know my
Speaker 1: husband's gonna text me going she's having a meltdown, like
Speaker 1: and I'm gonna have to like do some kind of
Speaker 1: triage over FaceTime. But I'm just saying, like, it is
Speaker 1: kind of weird to have like a thirteen year old
Speaker 1: daughter who's home with a sitter and you just haven't
Speaker 1: looked at your phone in twelve hours, because like these
Speaker 1: kids have been gone all night.
Speaker 3: I just wanted to call you out and your phone prads.
Speaker 3: You think I look at my phone too much? You
Speaker 3: look at it a lot? Yeah, I mean I look
Speaker 3: at it a lot.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we're all looking at it a lot.
Speaker 3: She Okay.
Speaker 1: So they get into the apartment, they don't see the girls,
Speaker 1: there's no sign of struggle.
Speaker 3: They call Perry's cell phone.
Speaker 1: It starts ringing from inside the hamster cage, and that's
Speaker 1: where all three of the phones are. And here's where
Speaker 1: we find out that Perry just turned thirteen. Mia is twelve.
Speaker 1: So they're just like these are just little, I mean,
Speaker 1: like barely teens. So Olivia is now at the precinct,
Speaker 1: She's pissed they didn't call her. She's like, we got
Speaker 1: one girl stab, two missing, and they really don't have
Speaker 1: that much to go on, just some blurry photos of
Speaker 1: you know, this man.
Speaker 3: That the birdwatcher took.
Speaker 1: And then on top of that, every cop in the
Speaker 1: city is working the New York City Marathon because it's
Speaker 1: marathon Sunday. And then Zoe is awake, so we go
Speaker 1: over into Zoe's exam room so she can explain what's
Speaker 1: going on. She gives us the whole sleepover scam. It's
Speaker 1: the classic, I mean, it's basically what we saw in
Speaker 1: Mean Too right, Like I mean mean they changed the
Speaker 1: answering machine, but this one was just like I texted
Speaker 1: pretending to be the one mom, and then they texted
Speaker 1: pretending to be another mom, basically saying that they were
Speaker 1: sleeping at Perry's house while Perry's mom was out. But
Speaker 1: Perry told her mom that she was sleeping at those girls' house.
Speaker 1: So blonde mom is getting there's a blonde mom and
Speaker 1: a brunette mom, and the blonde mom's getting really worked up,
Speaker 1: so they got to like take her out of there.
Speaker 1: So they basically asked Zoe, like what happened, and she's like, well,
Speaker 1: Perry and Mia wanted to go into the park at
Speaker 1: night the day after Halloween, like they thought the spirits
Speaker 1: would be out, zombies, et cetera. They left at midnight.
Speaker 1: They said Perry had a camera and then Zoe says
Speaker 1: he caught me knocked me down, and they're like.
Speaker 3: Who are talking about. She's like, it was the Glasgow man.
Speaker 1: So that is this figure who they were trying to meet,
Speaker 1: but then who.
Speaker 3: Also attacked Zoe.
Speaker 1: So the cops are all gathered about two search they're
Speaker 1: looking for a big guy, possibly with a scar on
Speaker 1: his face and an eyepatch. You can tell immediately because
Speaker 1: they're all wearing sailor hats that these are cadets in
Speaker 1: the police academy. They had to call him the Juniane
Speaker 1: Uivarsity because all the other cops were working at the marathon.
Speaker 3: And I din't catch that. That's funny. Yeah.
Speaker 1: They find kind of like a circle of sticks, very
Speaker 1: Blair witchy, and then that right near there they find
Speaker 1: Zoe's backpack, and then they find this sort of little
Speaker 1: cave and one of the cadets just saw a guy
Speaker 1: run in there, so he comes out eventually growling like
Speaker 1: holding a stick, like saying of like just like you know,
Speaker 1: and they tase him, and Rollin's increase here being like
Speaker 1: extra nice to this guy. They're just like stop tasing him,
Speaker 1: like leave him alone, And it's like, Okay, this is
Speaker 1: not realistically how the cops would ever treat an on
Speaker 1: house person or a person dealing with with mental illness
Speaker 1: who was having a confrontation with the cops.
Speaker 2: But it's still selfish because they need him to find
Speaker 2: the girls. Sure, so they can't they they can't taste
Speaker 2: the shit out of him because they need him.
Speaker 1: To chat, right, true, but they are also SVU yes,
Speaker 1: and they're very patient and kind with him kind of
Speaker 1: the entire time, which I just like feels very sv
Speaker 1: the show to me and not necessarily real life. But
Speaker 1: they've got this guy down, handcuffed. They're going to bring
Speaker 1: him in. So they bring Perry's mom and her horny
Speaker 1: boyfriend into the precinct. They show her the suspect. She's
Speaker 1: never seen him before, so she starts crying, being like
Speaker 1: we lost to them, they're dead, Like she's freaking out.
Speaker 1: We get the rundown on who this guy is. His
Speaker 1: name is Charlie Dorsey. He's thirty six. He has been
Speaker 1: spotted around the neighborhood collecting cans. He was a frequent
Speaker 1: flyer at the State Asylum, according to Tomorrow, but they
Speaker 1: turned him loose when they got shut down. Then he
Speaker 1: stopped taking his meds. Then he stabbed a guy and
Speaker 1: the kidney in a shelter and then got three years
Speaker 1: in Attica, was released two years ago, met with his
Speaker 1: parole officer one time, and has been off the grid
Speaker 1: ever since. So you know, this is like just a
Speaker 1: person who is living on the streets without any kind
Speaker 1: of medical supervision.
Speaker 3: And probably needs a little bit of help.
Speaker 1: Okay, they're talking about this guy being let out of
Speaker 1: the State asylum, and of course he went on to
Speaker 1: like reoffend and Cariese's like, I mean, you can't be
Speaker 1: surprised when you unscrew the lid of assault shaker and
Speaker 1: the next surprise when it spills all over the table,
Speaker 1: And I'm like, can I get a job? This is
Speaker 1: not a good metaphor. It's not funny, and it's just
Speaker 1: like who's unscrewing assault shaker and leaving it on the table.
Speaker 3: It's like, what are you pranksters? Pranksters.
Speaker 1: That's what they let him out of his They let
Speaker 1: him out of the state asylum as a prank and
Speaker 1: he stabbed a guy in a kidney.
Speaker 3: So I think the prankster won.
Speaker 1: So yeah, I just I was like, there's a better
Speaker 1: room for a better metaphor here, So no weapon on him.
Speaker 1: They're testing his clothes. The cave is pretty tidy. Of course,
Speaker 1: you noticed how tidy the cave was.
Speaker 3: No, that's what they said. I was impressed when I
Speaker 3: saw it later.
Speaker 1: When I saw it later, I was like, oh my god,
Speaker 1: he keeps it so clean. So they're talking about searching
Speaker 1: for these girls in the woods, but Tomorrow's like, the
Speaker 1: woods are really dense.
Speaker 3: It's the last primeval forest in the area. And this
Speaker 3: is true. I looked it up.
Speaker 1: So this is Inwoodhill Park, which is part of one
Speaker 1: of which is Manhattan's only primeval forest, and a primeval
Speaker 1: forest is basically just a forest that's been mainly untouched.
Speaker 1: So there's like a weird moment where Caresy and Tomorrow
Speaker 1: or like butting heads. Did you notice this?
Speaker 2: We're like, oh, I noticed it, and I was like, wow,
Speaker 2: we don't really get them that much together, right, Like yeah,
Speaker 2: it's kind of a rare tree.
Speaker 1: There is this like weird moment where Careese and Tomorrow
Speaker 1: are kind of having like a little bit of like
Speaker 1: a dick measuring contests of like, let me take it
Speaker 1: a run at this guy.
Speaker 3: I actually have a pretty good relationship with him.
Speaker 1: And then it's like Amanda and then Olivia is like, Amanda,
Speaker 1: pick with one of your boyfriends you.
Speaker 3: Think is better? That was shady. Yeah, Olivia knows how
Speaker 3: to drum up some drama.
Speaker 1: So Charlie is definitely kind of having like a paranoid
Speaker 1: mental health event when they go in to speak with him,
Speaker 1: like he's sort of going from howling like a dog
Speaker 1: to telling them he knows he's on their watch list.
Speaker 1: He said he saw a missile shoot down the plane
Speaker 1: that presumably Sully Selenberg landed, and that like they know
Speaker 1: that he knows the truth about Sully's flight and that's
Speaker 1: why he's on this watch list. So Olivia promises her
Speaker 1: phone doesn't have lasers in it and then shows him
Speaker 1: a picture of the girls and he says he's never
Speaker 1: seen any of these girls before, But then they show
Speaker 1: him a picture of him picking Zoe up because there's
Speaker 1: a picture of him holding Zoe, and he says he
Speaker 1: does remember her, that she smelled like strawberries, and that
Speaker 1: he found her so he could kind of move her
Speaker 1: away from his area because he knew he would be
Speaker 1: accused of stabbing her and he was trying to be
Speaker 1: the last good samaritan in this dying society. And they're like, well,
Speaker 1: you know, you did save her in a way, but
Speaker 1: he says he doesn't know about the other girls, but
Speaker 1: you guys should know everything because you're filming me. He
Speaker 1: basically says he has found this device in his dwelling,
Speaker 1: that is that the cops planted on him, and that
Speaker 1: that is what they're using to surveil him.
Speaker 3: A real Munch vibe. Yes, it's a very much vibe.
Speaker 3: Munch is like I've heard of weirder things.
Speaker 1: So they're gonna go check out the device and he's like,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna need my eye patch back for that, and
Speaker 1: he's like, don't and he says he has like a
Speaker 1: really touching and he's like, don't threaten me with medication.
Speaker 3: Just treat me like a man.
Speaker 2: So it's like kind of a when I had pink
Speaker 2: Ey but still wanted a party in my early twenties.
Speaker 3: I did go out with an eye patch with pink eye.
Speaker 2: Yeah, my friend Chox, he bought me a pink eye
Speaker 2: patch with a butterfly on it.
Speaker 1: Lisa, I appreciate the fashion moment, but I think you're
Speaker 1: supposed to let pink eye like breathe.
Speaker 2: I know, but I used to get it all the
Speaker 2: time for some reason, and so I just needed.
Speaker 3: To go out.
Speaker 1: You know what, if we keep this in the podcast,
Speaker 1: people are gonna say, the reason you get pink eye
Speaker 1: all the time is because you're not washing your.
Speaker 3: Hands after you go.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Are you sure you want that input, Liza.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I haven't had pink eye like over in like
Speaker 2: a decade. Yeah yeah, but I had outdoors. I had
Speaker 2: shows last night, and I did go. I mean it's over, guys, right,
Speaker 2: Like I stopped washing my hands and I got laughs
Speaker 2: both times. So I think I think everyone's not washing
Speaker 2: their hands now. I think everyone's well noting happy birthday anymore.
Speaker 3: Not to yes, and not to the degree that we were.
Speaker 1: Like the minute we walked in the door, like before
Speaker 1: I even touched Rosie, I was like washing my hands.
Speaker 1: I'm definitely I've definitely lost that discipline.
Speaker 2: My favorite is like when we all couldn't get wipes,
Speaker 2: and then I found, like through a friend that we
Speaker 2: can get wipes from U Salon websites like to clean
Speaker 2: tanning beds and hair studios, and so all of us
Speaker 2: bought jugs of these wipes.
Speaker 1: I have had two massive ones that like one of
Speaker 1: them is unopened. One of them has like maybe ten
Speaker 1: wipes removed from it.
Speaker 2: Like it was like over, like we got them too
Speaker 2: late in the pandemic process, and we all just have
Speaker 2: these Salon wipes time, like our eye tend group.
Speaker 1: I literally this past weekend, I've had them on the
Speaker 1: counter like ready to sanitize, and I'm like, I think
Speaker 1: it's time.
Speaker 3: To put these away. I just put them into a
Speaker 3: cabinet like goodbye, goodbye, sweet but.
Speaker 2: That jug in suitcases like every time I've gone home
Speaker 2: to Skokie and back to LA I'm like, I gotta
Speaker 2: get my salon wipes, and then they're never used.
Speaker 1: It's so big, I can't believe you traveled with it anyway.
Speaker 1: So now we're back at Charlie's cave with Charlie's help,
Speaker 1: and he tells them where to find quote unquote this device,
Speaker 1: and like he keeps asking Careesi to like switch his
Speaker 1: eye patch so that like people like can't see him
Speaker 1: or like he can't get hurt. It's sort of like
Speaker 1: a endearing little thing about Charlie. And then he's like, Okay,
Speaker 1: thank you, we found the device. Let me take you
Speaker 1: back in. Rollins is like, I'll stay here and guard
Speaker 1: your cave. I mean she's bluffing. Obviously, she's going to
Speaker 1: search through all the stuff. She finds a bunch of
Speaker 1: bloody knives. So back at the precinct, we find out
Speaker 1: that there's still no trace of the two girls and
Speaker 1: that Charlie has told them that the knives are for
Speaker 1: hunting and fishing, and he claims that the blood on
Speaker 1: them is from bluefish. Now terru Has is moving quickly.
Speaker 1: They have the device and it's the video camera from
Speaker 1: the girls.
Speaker 3: So I don't know.
Speaker 1: I got the impression that Charlie had thought that that
Speaker 1: device had been planted in his cave like a long
Speaker 1: time ago, but I guess it was just the night before,
Speaker 1: like when these girls went missing.
Speaker 3: I really don't know get the timeline sometimes with.
Speaker 1: These things, So they are able to take off video
Speaker 1: off this like sort of smashed up camera there's video
Speaker 1: of the girls talking about how tonight glasgow Man's going
Speaker 1: to meet them and take them to his mansion and
Speaker 1: all this stuff, and they're like, Zoe didn't tell us
Speaker 1: any of this. So at the hospital, Zoe's claiming up.
Speaker 1: She's like, I can't tell you. I already broke the pact.
Speaker 1: It's like, your sister is missing. You do you've missed?
Speaker 1: Your sister is missing. Your moms are going nuts. The
Speaker 1: mom's like, drop cut the shit, honey, tell everything. So
Speaker 1: Zoe thinks glasgow Man will kill Perry and Mia if
Speaker 1: he finds out that grown ups know about this, so
Speaker 1: immediately like that's a red flag with any like little
Speaker 1: creepy meme thing that kids are into. It's like, oh,
Speaker 1: only kids can know about it. That's not gonna be
Speaker 1: that's not gonna work out well. She explains that if
Speaker 1: glasgow Man likes you, you get to live in his mansion,
Speaker 1: no rules, no school means sounds pretty cool, Lisa.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you're down. I'm down with a mansion with no rules.
Speaker 1: A mansion, no rules, no school, I'm in, and that
Speaker 1: there are portals to other realms inside the mansion. And
Speaker 1: in the video they'd been talking about a map, and
Speaker 1: so they're like, well, where did the map come from?
Speaker 1: And Zoe's like, oh, from Leslie. Perry's babysitter plot twist.
Speaker 1: Leslie is a boy, So they go to Leslie's apartment.
Speaker 1: He is kind of just like this nerdy dude and
Speaker 1: he's got all these drawings up on his wall and
Speaker 1: he's wearing a Glasgow Man sweat, which.
Speaker 3: I kind of like, yeah, I want glasgow Man. I
Speaker 3: was like, I.
Speaker 1: Would totally get a glasgow mansbun shirt. So they're like,
Speaker 1: tell us about glasgow Man and he's like, glasgow Man
Speaker 1: isn't real.
Speaker 3: So they show him a picture of Charlie. He says, oh, yeah,
Speaker 3: I know him.
Speaker 1: I bring him food and he tells me crazy stories
Speaker 1: and the kids call him glasgow Man. I just took
Speaker 1: it and ran with it and like amped the story
Speaker 1: up for entertainment.
Speaker 2: They treat him like a full on deviant criminal, and
Speaker 2: I'm like, he's clearly like a sweet nerd. I don't
Speaker 2: get their aggression towards him, Like I was thinking the
Speaker 2: same thing. I was like, you all guys need to
Speaker 2: calm down. They start ripping his shit apart, and it's
Speaker 2: like he's he's a good I don't know. It confused me,
Speaker 2: and I know they have to rush because they want
Speaker 2: to find these girls, but I was not into how
Speaker 2: mean they were to him.
Speaker 3: He clearly is a chill dude.
Speaker 1: And he has like a It's like, I think even
Speaker 1: since twenty fourteen, that kind of stuff has been more mainstream,
Speaker 1: just like graphic novels and you know, spooky mem type
Speaker 1: of stuff where it's like that doesn't necessarily mean you're
Speaker 1: like a deviant who kidnapped two kids, Like you just
Speaker 1: are into My husband's into that stuff.
Speaker 2: He's not kidnapping anyone as far as I know. You know,
Speaker 2: he would not be able to be kidnapping.
Speaker 1: Without you know it, without me knowing. He can barely
Speaker 1: eat at Arby's without me knowing. Okay, so Perry, he
Speaker 1: basically explains, he's like, Perry likes scary stories. I started
Speaker 1: telling them these stories. I'm trying to turn it into
Speaker 1: a graphic novel. Because then they find this picture of
Speaker 1: like basically the three girls and they're like have blood
Speaker 1: on them and they look spooky, and it's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: because he turned the little story he told them into artwork.
Speaker 3: It's not that's not a crime. So they're like, where's
Speaker 3: the map.
Speaker 1: Olivia starts like ripping things off the wall, and he
Speaker 1: caves because he doesn't want them to like destroy all
Speaker 1: his work. I don't know why he wouldn't just say
Speaker 1: before where he thought the entrance might be, but he
Speaker 1: basically says it's like an entrance that he created in
Speaker 1: his mind that would be upriver somewhere. And they talk
Speaker 1: about Spitan Devil Park, which I hope I'm saying the
Speaker 1: right way. It's in the Bronx. It's right when you
Speaker 1: cross over from Manhattan into the Bronx, and so that's
Speaker 1: where they head. They head to this park and they're
Speaker 1: searching for the girls.
Speaker 3: They enter an abandoned building.
Speaker 1: First they see a knife on the ground, then they
Speaker 1: see a dead cat, and then Amaro finds this like
Speaker 1: abandoned room that has like you know, vinds all over
Speaker 1: it and breaks down the door and finds the girls
Speaker 1: lying on the ground bleeding, barely conscious. I mean they're talking,
Speaker 1: they're like help us, but they're they're not fully conscious,
Speaker 1: and they say, who did this to you? And Perry
Speaker 1: goes Glasgow man he said he was coming back to
Speaker 1: bleed the devil out of us, but he never did scary.
Speaker 3: Okay.
Speaker 1: So now we're in the hospital. Mia is giving her account.
Speaker 1: She seems fine. She's not even like in a hospital bed.
Speaker 1: She's like sitting on a hospital bed fully clothed. So
Speaker 1: I don't know if MIA's stab wounds were just kind
Speaker 1: of like shallow, like she's not even in a hospital gown.
Speaker 1: She said they were in the woods. Glasgow man saw
Speaker 1: them and started chasing them. She said she went back
Speaker 1: and saw him standing over Zoe's body, just stabbing and
Speaker 1: stabbing her, and then he went after her and Perry
Speaker 1: and said if they didn't go with him, he'd bleed
Speaker 1: them out right there.
Speaker 3: So he covered Zoe with.
Speaker 1: Leaves and left her there. And now they're talking to
Speaker 1: Perry getting her story. And you can tell Olivia kind
Speaker 1: of clocks that they're using some of the same language,
Speaker 1: so like they like almost like they rehearsed their stories
Speaker 1: or were relished in some way ballistic.
Speaker 3: That's kind of what stopped her.
Speaker 2: Also, I do need to add, like while they're talking
Speaker 2: to Perry in the hospital, there is a the mom's
Speaker 2: hand with like red long nails as on her shoulder,
Speaker 2: and it is the most aggressive hand acting I've ever
Speaker 2: seen in my life. Like, I couldn't stop looking at
Speaker 2: this hand. It's giant, and the nails are so acrylic,
Speaker 2: and she's like petting her unwrinkling the show like it's
Speaker 2: just like a full with the Adams family hand.
Speaker 3: Yes, it's so much and you don't and you only see.
Speaker 2: The back of her head in her hand for like
Speaker 2: ten minutes, and I'm just like it was distracting for me.
Speaker 3: Wait, I'm also humiliated. It's not cousin it. It's thing.
Speaker 1: Oh, I can't believe I said cousin it. Cousin it
Speaker 1: means that way worth it.
Speaker 3: I don't care.
Speaker 1: Cousin it is the hair. I've just love the Adam's
Speaker 1: family and I don't want to embarrass myself. Well, when
Speaker 1: you just said cousin it, I went, oh, yeah, the
Speaker 1: bald one.
Speaker 3: Like that's vester. Thing is the hand. Okay.
Speaker 1: So Perry says that Glasgow man tied me up and
Speaker 1: they're like, but he didn't tie you.
Speaker 3: Up, and she's like I was fighting him off.
Speaker 1: It's like, okay, so you're you're stronger, what you're like
Speaker 1: smaller than me? This is none of this is starting
Speaker 1: to make sense and They're like, oh, yeah, Glasgow man
Speaker 1: hurt helicopters and got spooked and so he stabbed Perry,
Speaker 1: killed the cat and took off and she heard him
Speaker 1: kill the cat.
Speaker 3: She didn't see it.
Speaker 1: And she says this all happened last night, Sunday, and
Speaker 1: then she identifies Charlie from a lineup on the phone
Speaker 1: and says, oh my god, how did you get this
Speaker 1: close to him?
Speaker 3: So at the hospital.
Speaker 1: Now outside of this room, beautiful doctor is back and
Speaker 1: she tells Rollins that they have dehydration and exposure. They
Speaker 1: had food in their backpacks, mostly candy, which I love
Speaker 1: because I feel like I planned to run away like
Speaker 1: two or three times, made it to the top of
Speaker 1: my driveway and then was like, it's too windy.
Speaker 3: I should try another day.
Speaker 1: And I feel like all I ever had was like
Speaker 1: a package of dunk a Ruse and some fruit snacks,
Speaker 1: and I was like, this will last me.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I love. One of my favorite things is kids with
Speaker 2: little suitcases with their own bags and it's like, what.
Speaker 3: Have you gotten there? I want to know, would you pack?
Speaker 3: It's cute. Yeah, So she explains that the stab wounds on.
Speaker 1: Perry were all on the left side mostly arms, no organs,
Speaker 1: and they're not as deep as Zoey's.
Speaker 3: She also says that these.
Speaker 1: Wounds are fresh, like only an hour or two old,
Speaker 1: and that she had no defensive wounds. So Rollins, you know,
Speaker 1: meets up in the hallway with Live and Tomorrow and
Speaker 1: they're basically like the timeline on this is way off.
Speaker 1: They've had Charlie and custody since Sunday afternoon, So there's
Speaker 1: no way that these that he could have done at
Speaker 1: this because these wounds are fresh.
Speaker 2: I love the confidence of children thinking they can mastermind
Speaker 2: a whole thing, I know, against a New York City
Speaker 2: police I know.
Speaker 1: So Rollins has checked their social checked their texts, and
Speaker 1: she's like, they don't really have that much up there.
Speaker 1: They don't have that many other friends, and it's just
Speaker 1: like a ton of texts back and forth between me
Speaker 1: and Perry about probably about Glasgow man, and they're like
Speaker 1: in their own world, she says. So they talked to
Speaker 1: Zoe and they're like, any reason why Perry or Mia
Speaker 1: would want to hurt you, And she's like, well, maybe Perry,
Speaker 1: she pushed me down one time, but Mia would never
Speaker 1: hurt me on purpose.
Speaker 3: We're sisters. We love each other. It's like, really cute.
Speaker 3: She's in a couple other movies this, she's very sweet.
Speaker 1: The knife in that they found in the gatehouse where
Speaker 1: they found the two girls only has Perry's prints on it,
Speaker 1: so now they basically have confirmed she stabbed herself. The
Speaker 1: knife that stabbed Zoe has DNA from Charlie, Perry, and Mia.
Speaker 1: So Charlie was telling the truth like he didn't do this,
Speaker 1: I think, because I don't know why. That leads them
Speaker 1: to believe that he's definitely telling the truth since his
Speaker 1: DNA is on the knife, but also the girls is
Speaker 1: on the knife, so.
Speaker 3: They're like, should we call Barbara.
Speaker 1: This is a bit of a blue balling for the
Speaker 1: Barbara Brigade because they go, should we call Barbara, and
Speaker 1: then they're like no, and they don't call Barbara, and
Speaker 1: he never shows up in this episode, so I could
Speaker 1: see how some of you would be upset. But Olivia
Speaker 1: explains both the girls are under fourteen. Zoe lived, I'll
Speaker 1: call corporation Council, which I looked that up, and the
Speaker 1: Corporation Council is the chief legal officer who handles civil
Speaker 1: claims against the city, So I guess they end up
Speaker 1: calling in eighty a p. Cox, who must be the
Speaker 1: Corporation Council, to ask her like, what's the best course
Speaker 1: of action here, because this is almost like an adult
Speaker 1: crime where you could charge one of them as an adult,
Speaker 1: but the it's a living victim.
Speaker 3: The girls are under fourteen. I don't know what the
Speaker 3: rules are.
Speaker 1: So Crasy goes to Charlie and he goes, you know,
Speaker 1: I know you're crazy, but you're not paranoid, and he
Speaker 1: wants to get him into a program, onto some meds.
Speaker 1: He's like, we can't just like let you back out
Speaker 1: into the woods, and Charlie's like agrees.
Speaker 3: He's like, I can do that for a little while.
Speaker 1: So hopefully, you know, some piece is going to come
Speaker 1: to Charlie because ultimately he was a good guy who
Speaker 1: was just helping a little girl. Okay, So now we're
Speaker 1: in an interrogation room with Mia, and this is my
Speaker 1: favorite kind of interrogation on SVU. When it's like raining
Speaker 1: outside and dark and there's lightning, like I just think
Speaker 1: it's like like, I don't know, I love the feeling
Speaker 1: of it, so it's like spooky and fun. And I
Speaker 1: also like when it's pouring rain, but you're dry inside.
Speaker 3: I think Rosie's rubbed off on you. Oh, because she
Speaker 3: likes sayings spooky.
Speaker 1: Now, oh yeah, you can't stop. Well, this episode did
Speaker 1: come out around Halloween. It's supposed to be a Halloween episode,
Speaker 1: and you know Halloween is for spooky times. Yes, but
Speaker 1: my kid is all the time saying is that spooky
Speaker 1: to me? So she's trying to figure out the definition
Speaker 1: of spook. Okay, so they're interrogating Mia. She's like, I
Speaker 1: just thought we were gonna leave Zoe in the woods
Speaker 1: and scare her. And I'm like, that's also terrifying, like
Speaker 1: to do that to your little sister, like when you
Speaker 1: live in New York City, to bring your kid or
Speaker 1: even if you have any word, we're just gonna bring
Speaker 1: my sister into the woods and leave her there.
Speaker 3: I can see that so scary. You could see that happening. Yeah,
Speaker 3: you don't have a little sister. I wouldn't have done
Speaker 3: that to my little sister. No. I don't think my
Speaker 3: sister would have done it to me either.
Speaker 2: But I don't think it's like that crazy to be like,
Speaker 2: oh yeah, let's just because I remember we did have
Speaker 2: a friend who was scared of the cemetery, and we
Speaker 2: tried to plan like a way to drop her in
Speaker 2: there at night or something, but we couldn't. Like we didn't,
Speaker 2: but I could. I just don't think it's that crazy.
Speaker 1: I think bringing them in there and kind of like
Speaker 1: hiding from them is one thing, but like to leave
Speaker 1: them there, that seems like, I don't know, that seems
Speaker 1: really harsh.
Speaker 3: I'm not advocating for it, I am Jaz.
Speaker 1: It really sounds like you're telling people to leave children
Speaker 1: in the woods. That's kind of what I'm getting from
Speaker 1: you right now.
Speaker 3: That's the vibe. So, And like the woods in New York,
Speaker 3: how big are they?
Speaker 1: They're pretty big. This is a prime evil forest. Doesn't
Speaker 1: that scare you? Just the idea of a prime evil
Speaker 1: forest leaving a nine year old, I don't know. I
Speaker 1: don't know what prime evil means. I told you a
Speaker 1: primeval forest just means it's like an untouched forest. It
Speaker 1: hasn't been like manicured. It's not like Central Park with
Speaker 1: like a you know a lot of boat houses and
Speaker 1: cute little freakin rot like ice skating rinks.
Speaker 3: Well, I would never say Central Park is a forest.
Speaker 1: Okay, where do we go from here. I'm just telling
Speaker 1: you I don't think leaving a nine year old in
Speaker 1: a primeval forest, which seems like a very dense forest.
Speaker 2: Is a good idea. I don't think it's a good idea.
Speaker 2: But I do understand that kid prank. You know, I
Speaker 2: could see it happening without it being like, these bitches
Speaker 2: need to go to jail, you know.
Speaker 3: Okay, the snabbing is what takes me over the end.
Speaker 1: The shabbing, Yeah, I would say the stabbing is a heightening,
Speaker 1: to put it in improv terms. So they're like, well,
Speaker 1: why did you bring a knife, And MIA's like, I
Speaker 1: didn't bring a knife. Perry brought a knife. She brought
Speaker 1: one for her and one for me, and it was
Speaker 1: for protection. And then basically the lawyers are like they
Speaker 1: need to know whose idea this was, and Mia completely flips.
Speaker 1: She's like, it was all Perry's idea. She hit Zoe
Speaker 1: on the head with a rock. She told me to
Speaker 1: stab Zoe, but I wouldn't do it. She went crazy
Speaker 1: and just started stabbing Zoe and there was so much blood.
Speaker 1: Mia says. Perry says she would kill me if I
Speaker 1: didn't do what she said. Blonde Mom is like something's
Speaker 1: always been off about that girl. And I'm like, and
Speaker 1: you're just mentioning that. Now Perry takes the knife and
Speaker 1: the camera threw them away, made me cover her sister
Speaker 1: with the leaves, and then held a knife to her throat,
Speaker 1: and she's like, forget about Zoe. We're going to glasgow
Speaker 1: Man's mansion. And she said her eyes were bugging out
Speaker 1: and she looked like a maniac. So now we're talking
Speaker 1: to Perry and she's like, it wasn't my idea. I
Speaker 1: was simply following orders, glasgow Man's orders, like she says,
Speaker 1: he comes to me at night, we communicate. He stared
Speaker 1: into my eyes and told me my mission. If I failed,
Speaker 1: he was going to take my breath away at midnight,
Speaker 1: and I had to prove my loyalty. This is all
Speaker 1: very like ya novel type stuff. And she basically said
Speaker 1: her instructions were to take innocent blood, which is Zoe,
Speaker 1: and that's how you get to be a proxy.
Speaker 3: I guess that just means one of glasgow Man's people.
Speaker 1: So when Zoe was lying there bleeding, Perry says, I
Speaker 1: didn't feel glasgow Man's presence. I started to doubt myself
Speaker 1: and that must be why he switched up the plan.
Speaker 1: He led us to this gatehouse in the form of
Speaker 1: a cat. I knew it was him.
Speaker 3: He had Glasgow Man's eyes, and he told her to
Speaker 3: murder mea she.
Speaker 1: Goes, the cat was glad at me so powerfully trying
Speaker 1: to make this hypnotic connection. I couldn't take it, Like,
Speaker 1: I just think the way she's talking as a thirteen
Speaker 1: year old is kind of funny. And then she stabbed
Speaker 1: the cat through the heart because she didn't want to
Speaker 1: kill her friend. The mom is like freaking out. This
Speaker 1: is horny mom. She's like freaking out. I've never heard
Speaker 1: her talk like this before, Like, this isn't my daughter.
Speaker 1: Now we meet Ada Peppa Cox. She says, this girl's
Speaker 1: clearly not competent to stand trial. And then I think,
Speaker 1: what's the key is what Olivia says, which is there
Speaker 1: was no sign of this behavior until she knew we
Speaker 1: were on to her, So like she knows right and
Speaker 1: wrong well enough to have a cover story for this
Speaker 1: Glasgow Man shit, you know. And they're like, well, is
Speaker 1: there any proof of conspiracy emails, texts, like premeditated planning
Speaker 1: of this crime? And they say no, And then They're like,
Speaker 1: we'll order a psychic aal and take it from there.
Speaker 1: And so now we're at family court. H Perry is testifying,
Speaker 1: saying that glasgow Man promised they would in his mansion
Speaker 1: and have a true life, and she said that she
Speaker 1: wouldn't stab her friend, and that her body got hot
Speaker 1: and she could feel her blood swirling inside of her,
Speaker 1: and so she stabbed herself to let the blood cool off,
Speaker 1: which I do think sounds like remember we talked about
Speaker 1: like how that that other crime that kid like stuck
Speaker 1: us stick up the kid's butt to try to like
Speaker 1: get his heart to stop or to start working again.
Speaker 3: Like kids just have crazy ideas.
Speaker 1: Of how the body works, Like I feel hot, I
Speaker 1: should cool off my blood by stabbing myself.
Speaker 3: You know what I mean.
Speaker 1: It's like weird kid, Yeah, kid anatomy. Okay, maybe you'd
Speaker 1: have a comment, but.
Speaker 3: No, I'm on board with everything you're saying.
Speaker 1: So she says, do you know, did you know stabbing
Speaker 1: Zoe was wrong? And she said no, the police were wrong.
Speaker 1: Them entering glasgow Man's realm made the world an unbalanced place,
Speaker 1: and glasgow Man's partners from the other realms are going
Speaker 1: to come back seeking vengeance.
Speaker 3: We're all going to die. I mean, she sounds very
Speaker 3: cute and on to be honest with.
Speaker 1: You, like she's really like, she's really like, you need
Speaker 1: to open your eyes and see what the truth is.
Speaker 3: So the judge has.
Speaker 1: Basically heard enough. She says family court is meant to
Speaker 1: be therapeutic, not punitive. Wouldn't it be cool if that
Speaker 1: was true of all court to be therapeutic or not punitive.
Speaker 1: She rules that Mia was also a victim and declares
Speaker 1: her not responsible, and she recommends, you know, weakly, psychiatric
Speaker 1: care for Mia and Zoe. And then she says, Perry,
Speaker 1: based on your testimony, I'm remanding you to a psychiatric
Speaker 1: facility to remain until you're no longer deemed a threat
Speaker 1: to yourself for others. Rollin's and caries You're headed to
Speaker 1: the elevator after the trial, and they're kind of just
Speaker 1: like arguing over whether justice was served, and Cariese's kind
Speaker 1: of like, I mean, this is good, this is how
Speaker 1: it should have worked.
Speaker 3: Out, you know.
Speaker 1: And then when they get in the elevator, Mia and
Speaker 1: Perry also get in probably not realistic. They get in
Speaker 1: with their parents and like the cop that has Perry
Speaker 1: arrested and everything, and then Chraesy looks down and sees
Speaker 1: these two girls, me and Perry link their little pinky
Speaker 1: fingers together for a couple seconds, and then he's like
Speaker 1: making an incredulous face and he sees that Rollins doesn't
Speaker 1: see it, and he's like, wait a second, and then
Speaker 1: we fade to Dick Wolf.
Speaker 3: So they did trick everyone.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, in my opinion, like this was this
Speaker 1: seemed like a yeah, a story that they set up.
Speaker 3: They nailed it. Yeah, as Nicole Byer says.
Speaker 1: Famously, but let's take a quick break. And then Lee's like,
Speaker 1: can't wait for you to tell me about the real crime.
Speaker 3: Okay, so this real crime.
Speaker 2: What's wild is so much in the episode is exactly
Speaker 2: the crime.
Speaker 3: Like the words ballistic are you used? In this case?
Speaker 2: The stab wound missed the victim's artery by the thickness
Speaker 2: of a hair like half a millimeter, and so that's connected.
Speaker 3: Just there's just a lot of.
Speaker 2: Connections between the case and it happened within the same year,
Speaker 2: and it's like.
Speaker 3: Pretty fucking wild. I love when it gets really close.
Speaker 2: And I will just say, you know, also, like the show,
Speaker 2: the girl does not die, which is amazing, and I
Speaker 2: like that. Now, sorry if you were if you liked
Speaker 2: the suspense if this kid is dead.
Speaker 3: Or not, sorry if you were hanging on waiting for
Speaker 3: a child death.
Speaker 2: But she is alive, which is really happy, which is
Speaker 2: that's not proper, but it's a good thing. So there
Speaker 2: is a slender Man documentary HBO put out in twenty seventeen.
Speaker 2: This case happened in twenty fourteen, and then obviously, so
Speaker 2: the documentary ends before sentencing and all of that stuff,
Speaker 2: and so obviously I have more information. The documentary was awesome,
Speaker 2: and it was actually really really scary, and I would
Speaker 2: watch it at night, and two nights in a row
Speaker 2: I had to plause it and stop and watch The
Speaker 2: Simpsons because Slenderman is fucking scary, Like he is creepy looking.
Speaker 3: I was getting.
Speaker 2: Nervous during my research and this documentary, like I'm gonna
Speaker 2: kind of follow their pattern and the way it was
Speaker 2: basically like current time mixed with the past, so it
Speaker 2: was like you would see them in interrogation, and then
Speaker 2: you would see them in core, and then you would
Speaker 2: see the parents dealing with it as it's happening. So
Speaker 2: like the documentaries, mixed together with their interrogation the day
Speaker 2: it happened, like immediately, and then it cuts to like
Speaker 2: the parents talking about it while their kids are incarcerated,
Speaker 2: and it goes back and forth, and it's it's done
Speaker 2: very well. So I might be going from like six
Speaker 2: months post arrest to exactly what's happening in interrogation, because
Speaker 2: that's just what's up. So if you're confused, that's what's happening.
Speaker 2: So this happened May thirty first, twenty fourteen. This is
Speaker 2: in Waukeshaw, Wisconsin, a suburb of Milwaukee. A twelve year
Speaker 2: old female is stabbed and at nine point fifty in
Speaker 2: the morning, a concerned citizen called the police. Now I
Speaker 2: saw an interview with this concerned citizen on twenty twenty
Speaker 2: and he was bicycling on a roped off course, so
Speaker 2: like he wasn't even supposed to be on this path.
Speaker 2: There was a rope that said do not enter, and
Speaker 2: he was like fuck it and went bicycling, so like
Speaker 2: it's by chance, universal like what the fuck that she
Speaker 2: was even found because he shouldn't have been there, and
Speaker 2: he called the police, and you can even tell the
Speaker 2: dispatcher was like horrified because the guy was like a
Speaker 2: twelve She looks she's twelve and she's been stabbed and
Speaker 2: the operator is like stabbed sat like they like, she can't.
Speaker 3: Even believe it either, So it was wild.
Speaker 2: So then the search begins for the other two girls,
Speaker 2: Anissa where she's a brunette and Morgan geyser blonde. I
Speaker 2: might be calling him brunette and blonde throughout, but it's
Speaker 2: Anissa brunette.
Speaker 3: Morgan blonde.
Speaker 2: And so they're looking for these girls, you know, sky
Speaker 2: and cars, and so the logline of what happened is
Speaker 2: they lured her into the woods and left her for dead.
Speaker 2: They used a five inch blade and stabbed her nineteen times.
Speaker 2: Like fact that Peyton survived is insane. And Peyton is
Speaker 2: also called Bella, so her name is Peyton, but she
Speaker 2: had a nickname and they called her Bella a lot,
Speaker 2: so it's interchangeable.
Speaker 3: That's like what she went by with her friend group.
Speaker 2: And when they asked, who did this to you, she said,
Speaker 2: my best friend. So this isn't a stranger and these
Speaker 2: girls have been best friends for years. And then so
Speaker 2: Morgan and Peyton best friends for years. And then Anissa
Speaker 2: is like Peyton didn't really know her, but Morgan and
Speaker 2: her were very very close, and Anissa had no friends
Speaker 2: at all. She was a dork and Morgan befriended her
Speaker 2: and they became friends, and Anissa was just so happy
Speaker 2: to have a friend. She really didn't get along with
Speaker 2: many people and was a loner and was really desperate
Speaker 2: for friends. And because she didn't have any friends, that's
Speaker 2: why she was so into the Internet and fantasy worlds
Speaker 2: and like the Internet was her friend. And so there's
Speaker 2: a website called Creepy Pasta Wiki, and I guess it
Speaker 2: was really cool. It is just like wild thinking about
Speaker 2: something as silly as creepy Pasta led to a full
Speaker 2: on stabbing, yes, but it is true. And creepy Pasta
Speaker 2: is like scary stories, so people just put really scary
Speaker 2: stories on. And a scary story that became popular is
Speaker 2: called slender Man.
Speaker 3: And he's like a tall, thin man.
Speaker 2: He's a faceless ghoul and basically he's like it's kind
Speaker 2: of like it follows where once he gets you, you
Speaker 2: will never escape him. He will always follow you for
Speaker 2: the rest of your life. You can't summon him. He
Speaker 2: just arrives and then you can't get rid of him,
Speaker 2: and he has tentacles that come out from his back
Speaker 2: and can choke you.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I remember when this case came out, like I specifically
Speaker 1: was very interested in it and also when it actually happened. Also,
Speaker 1: my sister's nickname is Creepy, so we were very into.
Speaker 1: We were very into talking about Creepy Pasta and calling
Speaker 1: her Creepy Pasta. But I remember thinking that the images
Speaker 1: were really really freaky, Like when they were posting just
Speaker 1: slender Man stuff on blogs and stuff.
Speaker 2: I was like, like, I just know he is creepy,
Speaker 2: and then it's kind of like in Glasgow Man, where
Speaker 2: he's like bad, but also he is an escape. So
Speaker 2: if you're a kid who hates your life and thinks
Speaker 2: school sucks and you have no friends, you kind of
Speaker 2: want to go with slender Man and escape this sad
Speaker 2: reality I have. So to some they wanted to be
Speaker 2: with slender Man, and then to most I think they
Speaker 2: were scared of him.
Speaker 3: And there's a lot of.
Speaker 2: Like photoshop photos that I can understand why a child
Speaker 2: would be tricked of, like black and white photos with
Speaker 2: slender Man behind a tree in the distance or like away.
Speaker 2: And then people made videos there's tons of videos on
Speaker 2: the site of like kids running with found footage and
Speaker 2: seeing slender Man. So I can imagine someone being like
Speaker 2: I've seen the photos. You know, I don't think it's
Speaker 2: that shocking to for a kid to believe something like this.
Speaker 2: I thought hocus Pocus witches were gonna fly out of
Speaker 2: my toilet every time I flushed it, you know, like
Speaker 2: kids are wild.
Speaker 3: I thought Bob from Twin Peaks lived in my basement.
Speaker 2: So yeah, yeah, for a while, I was scared of
Speaker 2: Batman and I was too scared to go to the
Speaker 2: bathroom and I would pee behind my family.
Speaker 3: Couch and I got in trouble.
Speaker 2: What Yeah, because I was home alone a lot and
Speaker 2: I was just like terrified to go to the bathroom,
Speaker 2: so I would squat behind the couch and pee. I
Speaker 2: mean I was caught, but I would imagine, Yeah, it
Speaker 2: just I was scared of going.
Speaker 3: I was scared.
Speaker 2: Now, so that's like the background. Now our back to reality.
Speaker 2: So we have patents at the hospital and they're looking
Speaker 2: for these girls. And the girls were found walking near
Speaker 2: the interstate and they were on their way to slender
Speaker 2: Man's mansion and like their goal of walking, like I
Speaker 2: don't think they understood distances, and that's what brings them
Speaker 2: back to child because like they committed very heinous crimes
Speaker 2: that were premeditated and very planned out, but they also
Speaker 2: don't understand that the forest they were going they were
Speaker 2: trying to go to is a four to five hour drive.
Speaker 3: Oh my god, they would have been start her.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so like they left her and then started this
Speaker 2: walk that would have taken days. I would say, I mean,
Speaker 2: I don't know about You can do the math problem
Speaker 2: if you really want.
Speaker 3: I don't. I'm not going to do it.
Speaker 2: There's like tons of interrogation videos, and as an SVU watcher,
Speaker 2: I'm just like.
Speaker 3: Shut your mouth, get a lawyer, don't tell them anything.
Speaker 3: They're not on your side.
Speaker 2: But fun fact, in Wisconsin you do not need an
Speaker 2: adult present to interrogate a child.
Speaker 1: Which is crazy because that's part of making a murderer.
Speaker 1: When they when they were interviewing his nephew, who had
Speaker 1: like a very low IQ and probably should definitely have
Speaker 1: had a parent with him, he confessed to all this
Speaker 1: stuff that he's like, that's actually just stuff I.
Speaker 2: Read in the book Kiss the Girls. I read that book. Yeah,
Speaker 2: And so I was a big James Patterson girl. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and so they didn't wait for any parents. They did
Speaker 2: get their miranda rights written to them. But yeah, the
Speaker 2: girls just like confessed everything. They were in separate rooms, obviously.
Speaker 3: But they both said, basically, slender Man made us do this. Well,
Speaker 3: they said a lot of stuff.
Speaker 2: We'll get into everything, but they were very honest and
Speaker 2: it was slender Man, and it seems like they truly
Speaker 2: believe slender Man. So it's like they had to do
Speaker 2: this or slender Man was going to kill them in
Speaker 2: their families and they had to do it for slender Man.
Speaker 2: And then like Morgan said, I didn't want to do this,
Speaker 2: but she was scared what would happen if she didn't.
Speaker 2: That's what they kept saying, so like they had to
Speaker 2: do this to keep their families safe.
Speaker 3: And they asked the.
Speaker 2: Cop like, did you believe the girls when they said
Speaker 2: that the believed in slender Man, And the officers did
Speaker 2: say yes, like these girls fucking believed it. It wasn't
Speaker 2: a cover story or anything like that, like they believed it.
Speaker 1: And yeah, yeah, it's a little bit different in the
Speaker 1: episode because you don't get the feeling that Mia is
Speaker 1: fully on board with the slender man shit at all
Speaker 1: or the Glasgow Man stuff like.
Speaker 2: No into it enough to leave her sister stabbed in
Speaker 2: the woods, but yes, yes for her friend's attention. And
Speaker 2: then in the courtroom in the future, the cop, one
Speaker 2: of the cops that was interrogating, asked if Morgan was remorseful,
Speaker 2: and he says no, like she had no remorse or
Speaker 2: no emotions right all reading that, and then what's like
Speaker 2: hard about this documentary is you see them as young children. Yeah,
Speaker 2: it's just like sad to see a little kid playing
Speaker 2: a colorful xylophone and being a baby with her parents,
Speaker 2: and then all of a sudden you just know that
Speaker 2: she's like stabbing people and it's really hard, and it's
Speaker 2: really hard to watch the parents talk. And so Morgan's
Speaker 2: mom did say that Morgan didn't seem upset when Bambie's
Speaker 2: mom was killed and she knew something was up, so
Speaker 2: like her daughter just didn't react to things like a
Speaker 2: normal child would and it wasn't sad for things and
Speaker 2: didn't really have empathy for like if they were watching
Speaker 2: something and something bad happen to the main character, she
Speaker 2: had no empathy for them. And the mom also said
Speaker 2: she knew that Morgan was into Slenderman, but didn't think
Speaker 2: anything of it, like kids like scary stories, who cares
Speaker 2: like she never imagined her child thought that it was real.
Speaker 2: She just was like, Okay, I was into horror stuff.
Speaker 2: I like to read it when I was a kid,
Speaker 2: So why would I be nervous about this? And then
Speaker 2: Anissa was in the choir. She had a cat pink
Speaker 2: bedroom like all stuh. So, Morgan and sa are both
Speaker 2: charged with attempted first degree murder, and Wisconsin law says
Speaker 2: they must be tried as adults and they face up
Speaker 2: to sixty five years, which is so scary. So their
Speaker 2: lawyers obviously are arguing that they should be tried as children.
Speaker 2: What I wonder, what makes it that they have to
Speaker 2: be charged as adults?
Speaker 3: The nature of the crime.
Speaker 2: I guess I think so because I'll be honest, like
Speaker 2: throughout this whole thing, I know what happens to them.
Speaker 2: And we talked about it and it was very much like,
Speaker 2: this is bullshit. This is bullshit, Like they should not
Speaker 2: have to sit in jail for decades and decades for
Speaker 2: something they did at twelve. But later and I'll go
Speaker 2: into it when the judge is explaining why. I understand
Speaker 2: where he's coming from. I still feel sad for everyone involved.
Speaker 2: But I also watched interviews with like with Peyton, and
Speaker 2: it scarred her for life emotionally, mentally, and physically.
Speaker 3: Like there's just a lot.
Speaker 2: But the judge basically was saying, like it's it was premeditated,
Speaker 2: this was thought out, and we.
Speaker 3: Have to think of the safety of people.
Speaker 2: We can't guarantee the safety of others with these people
Speaker 2: out in the world. And can I just ask one
Speaker 2: quick question, Yeah, did they did they take turn stabbing
Speaker 2: or did one person do the stabbing? No, one person
Speaker 2: did so Anisa was like the ringleader in a way,
Speaker 2: but made Morgan do the stabbing. Oh, like she said
Speaker 2: the word and went now and then Morgan legit whispered
Speaker 2: into Peyton's ear, I'm so sorry, like she didn't want
Speaker 2: to do this and then just started stabbing her. I
Speaker 2: guess I don't know why. I'm like, there are I
Speaker 2: don't know why. I'm like keeping tidbits. We find out
Speaker 2: Morgan does suffer from schizophrenia, and so does her father. Yeah,
Speaker 2: so to her too, obviously the schizophrenia to why she
Speaker 2: believed this so intensely, and the father was like crying,
Speaker 2: he's so sad. And basically they were going to talk
Speaker 2: to Morgan eventually about schizophrenia, and like there was a risk,
Speaker 2: and the mom talks about it. Of course there was
Speaker 2: a risk because it is genetically passed down. But the father, hand,
Speaker 2: I don't know if has a handle on it, you
Speaker 2: know what I mean.
Speaker 3: Like he he was crying talking about it.
Speaker 2: It's hard for him, but he was a functioning member
Speaker 2: of society and he was able. He goes, it's really
Speaker 2: hard because you know it's not real. You know, the
Speaker 2: devil is not in the backseat of your car, but
Speaker 2: it is real and you sense him and you feel
Speaker 2: him and you're scared. He goes, it's scary, and so
Speaker 2: you know it's not real, but you can't help but
Speaker 2: feel the fear and the real life reactions to it.
Speaker 3: And the father is just crying a lot.
Speaker 2: And unfortunately Morgan never talked about it, so they didn't
Speaker 2: even know she was suffering for it from it, and
Speaker 2: so it is really sad. And she talks about how
Speaker 2: she's had visions since she was three years old and
Speaker 2: she didn't talk about it with anybody, so like and
Speaker 2: now when she's incarcerated, the parents can't really discuss it
Speaker 2: with her either, and so they're really sad about it.
Speaker 2: But yeah, the schizophrenia definitely added to the believability. So
Speaker 2: they stabbed her a bunch, and then Peyton got up
Speaker 2: and was trying to walk to the main road and
Speaker 2: they said, no, laid down, it'll slow down the release
Speaker 2: of blood and will go get help. But they had
Speaker 2: no intention of getting help. So their intention was.
Speaker 3: To leave her dead in the woods, yea.
Speaker 2: And that that's intent and lying and manipulative, and they
Speaker 2: were going to leave her and not help her. And
Speaker 2: so it's like even after the fact, they weren't going
Speaker 2: to help her, and.
Speaker 3: So I understand why the judge is like, nah.
Speaker 2: Sorry, yeah, you know that makes sense. Yeah, you don't
Speaker 2: get to be released. But I obviously understand why the
Speaker 2: defense attorneys were gunning for that.
Speaker 3: And that was like a year.
Speaker 2: So the case to just like appeal if they're charged
Speaker 2: as adults or not was a whole year, and then
Speaker 2: they were going to be tried at all. And this
Speaker 2: is kind of, you know, a coincidence, because I'm a
Speaker 2: step getter. But Anissa ask the cops if they know
Speaker 2: how far she walked because she's usually not an athletic,
Speaker 2: but wants to know her step count. So that was
Speaker 2: like a little moment of funny in this horrific sadness.
Speaker 3: But I liked that she wanted to count her steps.
Speaker 2: So outside of adult or child, the next issue in
Speaker 2: court is competency and we see that in the episode
Speaker 2: with Pippa Cocks, like can these kids even are they
Speaker 2: sane enough to stand trial? So going a little bit backwards,
Speaker 2: like I said, you know, I'm going to go back
Speaker 2: and forth through things, is like how the doc went,
Speaker 2: and then I have other resources I'm putting in here,
Speaker 2: but I'm just going in the order. And so basically
Speaker 2: how they all hung out, as a niece's parents say,
Speaker 2: there was like a sleepover from Morgan's twelfth birthday. They
Speaker 2: had an amazing sleepover. They had a fun breakfast altogether,
Speaker 2: and then the girls asked to go to the park.
Speaker 2: Nothing is strange here, you know, it's everything is up
Speaker 2: to code. They are best friends. They're going to the park,
Speaker 2: and then they were going to do it. They go
Speaker 2: to the bathroom and the plan was to do it
Speaker 2: in the bathroom first and have the blood drain into
Speaker 2: the sink, like that's the that's why the judge was like,
Speaker 2: you're this is you thought out Like they had all
Speaker 2: they had so many plans of like how to leave
Speaker 2: the body, how not to get caught, like all this stuff,
Speaker 2: and then it didn't work out in the bathroom and
Speaker 2: then they're like, let's go to the woods, and then
Speaker 2: that's like when it happened. But they like in the
Speaker 2: interview with Peyton, she's like, yeah, we went to the
Speaker 2: park like whatever, you know.
Speaker 3: Like nothing was, no red flags, no red flags.
Speaker 2: And Morgan was saying that a Nissa said we had
Speaker 2: to do this or he would our slender Man would
Speaker 2: kill our families, and like she didn't know that much
Speaker 2: about Slenderman, but Anissa did. And so when you add
Speaker 2: Anissa's fascination with slender Man with Morgan's schizophrenia, that's a
Speaker 2: recipe for disaster.
Speaker 3: Yeah, because it sounds like neither of them.
Speaker 1: It sounds like they were both in a way a
Speaker 1: little bit out of touch with reality in terms of
Speaker 1: what a death actually means, like or like taking someone's life.
Speaker 2: Morgan's mom was saying how Morgan like believed in Santa
Speaker 2: till she was eleven and like the Easter Bonnie and
Speaker 2: all of that.
Speaker 1: That's what I'm saying, Like I don't think that there's
Speaker 1: necessarily like normal like not normal, but I don't think
Speaker 1: there's like typical development going on with ideas and concepts
Speaker 1: with these girls or at least or maybe at least
Speaker 1: with Morgan, like where ye like to stay sorry to
Speaker 1: someone and then stab them. It's like implies that you
Speaker 1: don't really understand how your how your actions are creator
Speaker 1: having an effect on someone.
Speaker 2: So Richard Fuckins was explaining how, like what's the benefit
Speaker 2: of being a believer, And it's like it's the feeling
Speaker 2: that you're special and you're a part of something just
Speaker 2: by believing it, Like you don't even have to put
Speaker 2: in that much effort, Like suddenly you're in this group
Speaker 2: of people just because you believe.
Speaker 1: In slender Man, right, and for people who have not
Speaker 1: found their people or not found that in their life,
Speaker 1: that's huge.
Speaker 4: You know.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And the whole thing he was explaining it's behind
Speaker 2: folk belief is you can't prove without a shadow of
Speaker 2: a doubt that slender Man isn't real, So like you
Speaker 2: can't and that's like with God, like you can't prove
Speaker 2: he's not real, so then that proves that he is
Speaker 2: or whatever, like if you know, without a shadow of
Speaker 2: a doubt. So that's how like folk beliefs grow, Like
Speaker 2: we can't judge these girls when people go to church
Speaker 2: every Sunday. Like, sorry, there were crusades, there were burnt witches,
Speaker 2: like it happens all the time.
Speaker 3: Okay, so we'll get into the details.
Speaker 2: So on the stand during the trial was Michael, doctor
Speaker 2: Michael Calwell, a psychologist, and he gave them also he
Speaker 2: said that the girls they had schizo toopy. It took
Speaker 2: me a lot of pausing and Google it and like even.
Speaker 3: Google was like, we don't know what you're trying to say.
Speaker 3: We cannot help you. So what is schizot to be?
Speaker 2: It is the diminished capacity to know the difference between
Speaker 2: what is real and not real. Yeah, it's a personality
Speaker 2: disorder characterized by thought disorder, paranoia, and a form of
Speaker 2: social anxiety derealization. Yeah, psychosis, and uh, that's what it is.
Speaker 2: And people with this feel pronounced discomfort when forming and
Speaker 2: maintaining social connections with other people. And it's very common
Speaker 2: for these types of people to be into the paranormal
Speaker 2: and like have a lot of superstitious beliefs, and adults
Speaker 2: can have spiritual like I mentioned, like you can have
Speaker 2: you can be spiritual or believe in all these conspiracy
Speaker 2: theories and live.
Speaker 3: Out your lives with no problems.
Speaker 2: So he doesn't think Anissa is a psychopath or sociopath
Speaker 2: at all and has no signs of it. So we
Speaker 2: get to Morgan diagnoses and doctor Kenneth Kasimir is giving
Speaker 2: it up and it's schizophrenia and oppositional defiant disorder and
Speaker 2: she had asthma, which I don't know why they needed
Speaker 2: to add that on the stand, but cool. Also during
Speaker 2: the trial, Morgan still seemed really scared of slender Man,
Speaker 2: Like she was scared that something she would say would
Speaker 2: make him angry and he would kill her and her family.
Speaker 2: So like even in court, she was terrified of this guy.
Speaker 1: So like nothing that anybody is saying to her is
Speaker 1: getting through to her that this is not real.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's the thing where I think the mom
Speaker 2: was explaining she does think Morgan understands no one else
Speaker 2: sees what she sees, like her visions, but they are
Speaker 2: real to her, but she is aware enough to know
Speaker 2: it other people aren't seeing it, So I don't know
Speaker 2: if that's good or bad, but it is what it is.
Speaker 2: And then we uh in the doc get to talk
Speaker 2: to David Janish and he's a private investigator and he
Speaker 2: searched her room and in the bedroom he found journals
Speaker 2: and pieces of papers with drawings and writing all pertaining
Speaker 2: to slender Man, like drawings that said he will find you,
Speaker 2: colored pencils that like it's just said no, no, no, no, no,
Speaker 2: over and over again with drawings of slender Man. She
Speaker 2: had things that said the pain is inside, I want
Speaker 2: to die, Help me escape my mind. She had like
Speaker 2: satanic barbies with pentagrams on it and like would cut
Speaker 2: off its limbs, so like hands and feet were cut off.
Speaker 3: And that was all found in her bedroom.
Speaker 2: Okay, And if you ask Morgan, like what if slender
Speaker 2: Man doesn't exist, she does not tell that kind of discussion.
Speaker 2: She knows it is true. It can't be proven untrue,
Speaker 2: go fuck yourself, So she is not willing to discuss
Speaker 2: like maybe if slender Man is not real. And then
Speaker 2: a corrections officer actually testifies during this as well, and
Speaker 2: she said that Morgan, while incarcerated and juvenile detention, said
Speaker 2: it had to be done. The man ordered it, She said.
Speaker 2: The man started to visit her when she was three
Speaker 2: years old. She believed she communicated with him telepathically and
Speaker 2: she had to do what he demanded to her or
Speaker 2: her family wouldn't be safe.
Speaker 3: Now, this is Morgan, But I thought that Anissa was
Speaker 3: more into slender Man. That's what was said towards the beginning.
Speaker 2: I mean, that's kind of the thing where they were
Speaker 2: both pretty honest during the interrogations, but then there.
Speaker 3: Were these moments of like she wanted it more, no,
Speaker 3: she told me what to do that.
Speaker 1: So, yeah, and it sounds like Morgan may have just
Speaker 1: been having visual hallucinations like her whole life, like from
Speaker 1: the age of three, and then like when you heard
Speaker 1: about Slenderman.
Speaker 3: She's like, oh, that's who this is.
Speaker 1: Like that, you know, just seeing some kind of figure
Speaker 1: your whole life and then kind of just melding it
Speaker 1: together with this new thing you're learning about.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it definitely took over her life. And then there again.
Speaker 2: This is like I get like how the two girls
Speaker 2: stories differ a little. Anissa said that after they did
Speaker 2: it that she cried and said, I want to go home.
Speaker 2: And then Morgan said you can't tell anyone because you'll
Speaker 2: spend your life in prison or get executed, and then
Speaker 2: blamed Morgan for everything and said you will. You stabbed her,
Speaker 2: you wanted this, And Morgan's aware of what's happening, like
Speaker 2: in interrogation she does ask the officer are you going
Speaker 2: to put me in prison?
Speaker 3: And am I going to rot and die?
Speaker 2: And then on Anissa's phone there was a goodbye letter
Speaker 2: like please don't remember me for this and like just
Speaker 2: kind of suicide style letter. But I don't know if
Speaker 2: it's because she knew she was going to go to
Speaker 2: jail and it was like please forgive me by peace out,
Speaker 2: I'm going to jail or suicide.
Speaker 3: It does sort of sound like they didn't want to.
Speaker 1: It's like they had to, like or you know, they
Speaker 1: were scared of what this man was going to do.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you're right, I don't Yeah, they didn't have bloodlust,
Speaker 2: like I don't think they but but they are dangerous,
Speaker 2: Like I wouldn't want to live in the neighborhood with
Speaker 2: these girls for sure.
Speaker 1: But it's just it's interesting that they're not just like, yeah,
Speaker 1: what would it be like to kill someone?
Speaker 3: They're just like, well, this is the.
Speaker 1: Order we were given from our Supreme Master, and we
Speaker 1: have to do it or he'll kill our whole family,
Speaker 1: you know.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: And so it took a like I said, it took
Speaker 2: a year to decide if they were going to be
Speaker 2: tried as adults and children, and we touched on this already.
Speaker 2: But the judge in the court basically finds that it
Speaker 2: was violent, premeditated personal offense and a decision made to
Speaker 2: let the victim die. It was an effort to kill someone,
Speaker 2: not attempted like a mistake. This wasn't Oh I pushed
Speaker 2: them and they fell down the stairs. They made an
Speaker 2: effort to someone And he said, I know they're young,
Speaker 2: but they will get older every year. And what do
Speaker 2: you do when they're eighteen to keep the public safe?
Speaker 2: And that was the critical factor in the judge. The
Speaker 2: offense was so vicious and there needs to be assurance
Speaker 2: it won't happen again, and it is a serious offense
Speaker 2: that is needs to be dealt with on a serious
Speaker 2: basis for protections for all. But I don't like that
Speaker 2: they're charged as adults. It's really hard, Like I don't
Speaker 2: I see it, I feel it.
Speaker 3: I'm like fuck yeah, Judge, And then I'm like damn,
Speaker 3: I don't know.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because when we were talking about it, before all
Speaker 2: the research and all of this, we did talk like.
Speaker 3: Come on, why so long the girl lived? Who cares?
Speaker 1: You know, Like no, yeah, I mean not necessarily now,
Speaker 1: but like you know, the girl did live, and they
Speaker 1: were so young. I mean, like to me, it's like
Speaker 1: there's a big difference between like twelve and like sixteen
Speaker 1: or seventeen, Like that's still under eighteen, but you're like more.
Speaker 3: Mature, and like, I don't know, twelve is like still
Speaker 3: so just a kid to me.
Speaker 2: Yeah, like what if like they might have not even
Speaker 2: had their periods?
Speaker 3: Like yai right, but that guy.
Speaker 2: The case with the episode of With Conscience, he got
Speaker 2: life right, Yeah, he keeps getting paroled, but he keeps
Speaker 2: getting parole opportunities but didn't being denied.
Speaker 3: And he was young.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he was really young. And he's forty in his
Speaker 2: forties now and still in prison.
Speaker 1: What chucking to me is that the person has like
Speaker 1: a mental health diagnosis and is still being sort of
Speaker 1: kept for so long like that it's like she wasn't
Speaker 1: being treated at the time.
Speaker 3: So it's like now that she could be treated. That's
Speaker 3: a really good point.
Speaker 2: And they, like Morgan pleaded guilty and then the court
Speaker 2: found her not guilty because of reason of mental disease
Speaker 2: or defect, and she is put in a mental institution
Speaker 2: for forty years. So in terms of getting care, it's
Speaker 2: not a prison, Like, she's getting care, but it doesn't
Speaker 2: change anything.
Speaker 1: I was also reading that she was the youngest person
Speaker 1: in her facility, and I can't imagine that that's like
Speaker 1: an easy road.
Speaker 2: No. Well, now I'm just thinking about it in terms
Speaker 2: of Orange as the New Black, and like, I hope
Speaker 2: the women.
Speaker 3: Are taking care of her, or is it? But they're
Speaker 3: in June until eighteen? Oh was that how it was?
Speaker 1: They were in juvenile detention until eighteen and then they
Speaker 1: were moved to mental facility.
Speaker 2: No, no, like Morgan was being held at a state
Speaker 2: hospital and Anissa remained in custody at the County Jail
Speaker 2: for juveniles.
Speaker 3: Oh, like, they're not just putting a.
Speaker 2: Twelve year old in with like hardened right like fift
Speaker 2: twenty five year olds. But and then Anissa got twenty
Speaker 2: five years and eligible for release in twenty twenty. She
Speaker 2: was denied, but she can appeal again in June, and
Speaker 2: Anissa was charged as an adult with an attempted first
Speaker 2: degree intentional homicide in June twenty fourteen, but as part
Speaker 2: of her plea, the court lowered the charge to attempted
Speaker 2: second degree intentional homicide and took her insanity defense to
Speaker 2: the jury. And she's been in the Winnebago Mental Health
Speaker 2: Institute since she was sentenced in December twenty seventeen. Bella
Speaker 2: on twenty twenty said she's not scared of their eventual release,
Speaker 2: but she does sleep with a pair of broken scissors
Speaker 2: under her pillow just in case.
Speaker 3: I'm just happy Peyton is alive and doing okay.
Speaker 2: Yes, Bella, truly a miracle that she is alive.
Speaker 1: Yeah, thank god for that off road bicyclist. Like the
Speaker 1: knife cut the tissue of her heart but not the artery.
Speaker 3: Wow.
Speaker 1: All right, well, let's let that sink in and take
Speaker 1: a little break and we'll be back with our guests. Okay,
Speaker 1: now it is time to talk to our very special guests.
Speaker 1: We were so happy to talk to this actor. You
Speaker 1: guys have seen her on tons of shows, Criminal Minds, Parenthood,
Speaker 1: Chicago med. She also has played the role of Katie
Speaker 1: in three of the paranormal Activity movies Spooky and she
Speaker 1: played the creepy Glasgow man devote Herself Perry Gilbert. Please
Speaker 1: check out our chat with Chloe Changrey.
Speaker 3: So wait, so where are you are you?
Speaker 5: I'm actually in California, so I'm originally from Houston, but
Speaker 5: I go to college out here.
Speaker 3: So I'm in my.
Speaker 4: Little apartment in north Ridge, California.
Speaker 2: Were you living in Houston and then sending tapes or
Speaker 2: were you moving around sending audition Like how did your
Speaker 2: early career work?
Speaker 5: So I started traveling to LA when I was around
Speaker 5: nine years old with my mom, but most of the
Speaker 5: time we would just come to LA for three months
Speaker 5: at a time and then go back to Texas. So
Speaker 5: when I auditioned for Law and Order, I was in
Speaker 5: Houston and I sent in a self tape for it.
Speaker 2: Wow, you were young, so I'm assuming you never watched it.
Speaker 5: I was when I auditioned for that. I was a
Speaker 5: freshman in high school, so I was fourteen years old.
Speaker 1: So yeah, Like we get some listeners that are like,
Speaker 1: I've been watching the show since I was ten, but
Speaker 1: it was a little young.
Speaker 3: Like did you ever watch the show before you?
Speaker 2: Uh?
Speaker 3: Were on it.
Speaker 5: I had not, But my dad is the biggest st
Speaker 5: fan in the whole entire life.
Speaker 3: Love it's your dad.
Speaker 4: He's a little he's a dentist in my small town.
Speaker 5: So when I booked the role, my mom usually goes
Speaker 5: with me on step but my dad was like, I
Speaker 5: am taking two weeks off work.
Speaker 4: I am going to New York. I am going with
Speaker 4: Chloe for this one.
Speaker 3: Oh my god, I love it. He's like, let him
Speaker 3: get cavities. I'm going to meet him exactly. I love it.
Speaker 3: That's so funny. So was he geeking out on set?
Speaker 3: What was his experience?
Speaker 4: Like, Oh my god, he was fan going so hard.
Speaker 5: He was absolutely in love with the whole experience, trying
Speaker 5: to talk to every single person.
Speaker 4: I'm like, Dad, I'm on set.
Speaker 3: Like You're like, Dad, leave ice tea alone.
Speaker 4: Yeah, he was like, can I have a photo? Oh
Speaker 4: my god, can I have a photo? My dad?
Speaker 3: Please go? That is so funny. I love that. So
Speaker 3: tell like what was the general vibe on set?
Speaker 1: Like you were so young, like, and we were talking
Speaker 1: about how normally when a guest star comes on, they're
Speaker 1: usually like alone or maybe there's another guest star, but
Speaker 1: like you were on with like these two other girls
Speaker 1: that were like your age.
Speaker 3: Did you guys all get along? Did you do you
Speaker 3: keep in touch?
Speaker 4: Oh?
Speaker 2: We do?
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 5: I actually still met Mina and Una still follow each
Speaker 5: other on Instagram, but we all became super close doing filming.
Speaker 5: And I had never been to New York. It was
Speaker 5: my first time there, and Mina and Una are both
Speaker 5: from New York. So on I think our second day
Speaker 5: of filming, Mina was supposed to go to a Broadway
Speaker 5: show with her parents, and she was like, how about
Speaker 5: you come with me? So she let me come to
Speaker 5: the Broadway show with her just so we could, like Vaughan,
Speaker 5: get to know each other.
Speaker 4: And it was amazing.
Speaker 5: We saw aDNA Menzel, which was incredible.
Speaker 4: But yeah, the girls on set were amazing.
Speaker 5: We definitely all got along really well, which I think
Speaker 5: made it a lot easier to all so young, So
Speaker 5: it made it easier when we were on set because
Speaker 5: we're all friends.
Speaker 3: That's so great.
Speaker 2: Well, this is jumping ahead, but you know, what is
Speaker 2: your theory? Who was in charge?
Speaker 3: They saw the pink? What was the plan?
Speaker 5: I go back and forth on this, but I genuinely
Speaker 5: think that they believed in Glasgow man that Perry and
Speaker 5: Mia believed in it, but once they realized that they
Speaker 5: were getting caught, I think they devised a plan. Okay,
Speaker 5: Perry's going to act like I'm crazy. I'm gonna act
Speaker 5: like I'm crazy, and you pretend like I made you
Speaker 5: do everything so.
Speaker 4: Then I can get off.
Speaker 5: Go to a mental institution, and you just get to
Speaker 5: go off and be with your family.
Speaker 1: So you were only like fourteen when you shot this.
Speaker 1: Did you care about, like any of the other cast
Speaker 1: members that you saw? Were you like excited to see
Speaker 1: any of them? Or were you just like, who are
Speaker 1: all these old people?
Speaker 4: I honestly had not watched the show show. I didn't
Speaker 4: know who they were.
Speaker 5: But then it was so bad because after I was
Speaker 5: on the show, I started watching it and then I
Speaker 5: became the biggest SBU fan.
Speaker 4: I've seen every single episode, and I.
Speaker 5: Was like, God, why did I not like fully taking
Speaker 5: that experience when I was there?
Speaker 4: Like, now I'm obsessed with all of these people.
Speaker 3: That's amazing. Do you find Carees attractive?
Speaker 4: Yes?
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, come.
Speaker 4: On, he's so cute, character's so sweet. How can you
Speaker 4: not like him?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 2: Well, I'm like, I think he's very hot and Karen's
Speaker 2: I'm like, he's okay, whatever.
Speaker 1: He's not man candy for you. Yeah, I'm more into
Speaker 1: some of the other guys on the show. But uh,
Speaker 1: I you know, I get the careasy thing for people,
Speaker 1: I really do. I just think his accent is a
Speaker 1: little bit dorky for me.
Speaker 4: Yeah, his auction's a little much, but it's part of
Speaker 4: the charm.
Speaker 3: I think.
Speaker 1: Let's talk about when you're on the stand and you
Speaker 1: get those tears flowing.
Speaker 3: How did that work? How did you?
Speaker 1: I mean, I guess you'd been acting since you were
Speaker 1: like seven or eight or something, but that still seems
Speaker 1: like you were. That was multiple tiers you were pushing
Speaker 1: out without getting hysterical.
Speaker 4: I was actually, I'm kind of funny story abou this.
Speaker 5: So when we were doing that scene, I was very
Speaker 5: nervous and I can cry on cue.
Speaker 4: But it's like it's a little hard for me to
Speaker 4: get there. And I was on set and I was
Speaker 4: really nervous.
Speaker 5: I was shaking a little, and we had done a
Speaker 5: few takes and I was just having kind of a
Speaker 5: hard time getting there and Marshka came up to me,
Speaker 5: looked at me in the eyes, and she goes, you're
Speaker 5: gonna cry on this take.
Speaker 4: I believe in you. And I was like, okay, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 4: we do the next take.
Speaker 5: I start crying, and after we like cut the scene,
Speaker 5: she is running around the sound and saying, yes.
Speaker 4: Oh my god, my girl. That was incredible.
Speaker 1: Ah.
Speaker 4: I reaked out. I was like in my head like,
Speaker 4: oh my god. Like she just looked at me in
Speaker 4: the eyes and started talking to me.
Speaker 3: Wow, what a woman.
Speaker 4: All right, she's incredible.
Speaker 1: Tell us about the paranormal Activity movies because that's like
Speaker 1: a big thing for you, right, and like I can
Speaker 1: barely watch a horror movie now and I'm a full
Speaker 1: blown woman, and like you're eleven years old in these
Speaker 1: horror movies.
Speaker 3: Well, so we watched the trailer.
Speaker 1: Well I was watching the trailer, Oh my god, and
Speaker 1: I was like, what are you watching.
Speaker 2: I was scared of Activity three, and I was like,
Speaker 2: she's the main person. You're the main Like, I mean
Speaker 2: it looks so I jumped like four times just in
Speaker 2: the trailery.
Speaker 5: Yeah, it was definitely on set. It was not scary
Speaker 5: at all. And I think now I'm so susceptible to
Speaker 5: not being scared watching horror films because I was on
Speaker 5: that set and I did.
Speaker 4: Three of those movies, so they just make it such.
Speaker 5: A fun environment on set and everything's like in special
Speaker 5: effects afterwards, when you're on there, it's just completely normal.
Speaker 5: I remember in the Bloody Mary scene where the ghost
Speaker 5: is supposed to be banging on the door, it was
Speaker 5: just one of the ads and he was just banging
Speaker 5: on the door, so it's not scary at.
Speaker 4: All, which is the scariest scene in the film.
Speaker 5: But for me, I'm like, Oh, it's this big guy
Speaker 5: just banging against the door.
Speaker 4: It's not terrifying. Wow.
Speaker 2: What scared me was like some they poured of water
Speaker 2: and the ghost was there.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, like when they do paint or whatever. Yeah.
Speaker 1: We obviously were stalking you a little bit on your
Speaker 1: Wikipedia and everything, and we notice that your twenty first birthdays.
Speaker 3: Coming up in a few months. You're the youngest person
Speaker 3: we've spoken to on our podcast.
Speaker 4: And really, yes, still honored.
Speaker 1: But you don't feel like we're talking to don't You
Speaker 1: don't feel like we're talking to somebody who's super young.
Speaker 3: You feel like an old soul.
Speaker 1: Oh thank you, But we want to know what your
Speaker 1: twenty first birthday plans are.
Speaker 5: Okay, I think I'm actually going to be back in
Speaker 5: Texas because I go home for the summer. So I'm
Speaker 5: hoping that my parents said that they're maybe going to
Speaker 5: fly on some of my best friends from LA to
Speaker 5: come down to Texas. So hopefully we'll go to a
Speaker 5: few bars in downtown Houston, maybe a few clubs down there, right,
Speaker 5: because I mean, Texas is completely open now, which is
Speaker 5: very weird.
Speaker 4: But.
Speaker 5: I got my exactly. I'll be fully vaccinated by then.
Speaker 2: I love how close you are with your parents. I
Speaker 2: would never celebrate my twenty first birthday with my parents.
Speaker 2: Actually I did, never mind, I did, I did, I did,
Speaker 2: I did, I forgot, But they are your close with them.
Speaker 5: Extremely close. Like my mom is my best friend. She
Speaker 5: had done acting with me since I was nine years old.
Speaker 5: I owe everything to my parents.
Speaker 1: I've worked with a lot of girls who were like
Speaker 1: Disney girls when they were younger and stuff, and they
Speaker 1: would come to LA with their moms and they're so
Speaker 1: close with their mom. I think when you like come
Speaker 1: to LA to like you guys live in like those
Speaker 1: furnished apartments in Burbank that everybody lives in. Oh yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: like you know, like I feel like you're just there
Speaker 1: with your mom and you're like, hope I get this audition.
Speaker 3: You're running lines with your mom, like you better be
Speaker 3: friends with your mom or song d you heard about
Speaker 3: those apartments?
Speaker 1: I just said my from my Disney folks.
Speaker 4: Where every child actor had lived.
Speaker 3: It's like a classic place.
Speaker 5: We lived in this really tiny apartment one time, and
Speaker 5: it was one room with it was a studio, and
Speaker 5: I had a little bed right by the bathroom, so
Speaker 5: every time my mom would get up to go to
Speaker 5: the bathroom in the middle of the night would wake
Speaker 5: me up because my head is literally right where the
Speaker 5: toilet is.
Speaker 4: So that was probably one of the worst apartments we've
Speaker 4: stayed on.
Speaker 1: But sacrifices for the art. I guess right, you gotta
Speaker 1: do it, Okay.
Speaker 3: Wow.
Speaker 1: I love talking to her. It's so nice to talk
Speaker 1: to a young, a young soul. She's so young, not
Speaker 1: even twenty one yet.
Speaker 3: Now it makes me feel all confident in her future.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Same.
Speaker 1: I love talking to like a young twenty nineteen year
Speaker 1: old person or whatever who just has like a great
Speaker 1: head on their shoulders and is not like all.
Speaker 3: About fucking TikTok. And I want to meet her dad. Yeah,
Speaker 3: and her dad, huge, huge fan. I want to meet
Speaker 3: her dad. Mister Chendry, What up? Listen? What did we learn?
Speaker 3: The Internet's evil.
Speaker 1: Creepy Pasta is not for me? I learned that, but
Speaker 1: I learned that a long time ago. I actually did
Speaker 1: go on Creepy Pasta. I don't know why I mentioned that,
Speaker 1: like when it when this case first happened, my sister
Speaker 1: and I went and checked it out.
Speaker 3: We were like, this is too much. But yeah, I
Speaker 3: guess it's just like, keep an.
Speaker 1: Eye on what your kids are watching and make sure
Speaker 1: they have a healthy sense of reality versus make believe
Speaker 1: or imagination.
Speaker 3: And don't stab your friends. Yeah, don't stab your friends,
Speaker 3: you guys.
Speaker 1: And also yeah, like, if you're thirteen, like the chances
Speaker 1: of you outwitting the cops are super super slim.
Speaker 3: So I just wouldn't take the bat.
Speaker 1: I don't know if you're thirteen and listening to this
Speaker 1: podcast and considering committing a heinous crime, but I would just,
Speaker 1: I mean, watch a few more seasons of.
Speaker 2: Its view and for your some shit out. Oh, I
Speaker 2: learned what what is it? An unkept forest is prime
Speaker 2: evil forest. I learned about that. That's exciting.
Speaker 3: Unkept forest.
Speaker 2: I learned about Primevil and it sounds like something different.
Speaker 2: It sounds like a haunted forest, but it just means
Speaker 2: not chopped up. Yeah, not used for paper. Yeah, they
Speaker 2: haven't put a boat house with a Sauvignon blanc in
Speaker 2: it yet. Oh, we learned that Olivia Benson has one
Speaker 2: of the best babysitters with the most flexible schedule in
Speaker 2: the life of her own.
Speaker 1: Like, honestly, yeah, drop take where you're using care dot
Speaker 1: com sitter city.
Speaker 3: What are we talking about here? I need to know.
Speaker 1: I need to get a babysitter that I can literally
Speaker 1: call at three am and say get over here.
Speaker 2: Like she needs to have a plan, B babysitter. I
Speaker 2: can't always be lucy, Like that's my issue. There just
Speaker 2: needs to be another, right, It's just not realistic.
Speaker 3: I have ten babysitters.
Speaker 1: Names in my phone and I have one kid, and
Speaker 1: I've been mostly in a pandemic.
Speaker 3: My whole life is a mom so, like, you definitely
Speaker 3: have to have a plan B babysit.
Speaker 2: Are you sad when you have to call number eight
Speaker 2: or do you still trust them?
Speaker 1: I actually haven't had to mostly my top two or
Speaker 1: three are available.
Speaker 3: Yeah, babysitting so wild. Also like, don't leave your sister behind.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, don't leave your sister in the woods
Speaker 1: at night in New York City. That's just not I
Speaker 1: don't think that that's that's not a cute prank.
Speaker 2: No. And then also when your other sisters are missing,
Speaker 2: stop keeping secrets. Spill the beans. Spill the bean, like
Speaker 2: what is going on? Also, keep your cell phone close by,
Speaker 2: have an Apple Watch, you know, like, I know you
Speaker 2: want to play sex games with your boyfriend, but just
Speaker 2: keep an eye out on your kid.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I think we can all take a lesson
Speaker 1: from Careesy about treating the unhoused like people.
Speaker 3: And manipulating them to get them to do what you want.
Speaker 1: Well, he just said, treat me like a man, And
Speaker 1: I feel like that's what Creese tried to do. You know,
Speaker 1: he didn't treat him like he was like, they did
Speaker 1: lie to him a little bit.
Speaker 3: You're right.
Speaker 2: Someone online was like, I'm a Stabler fan, but I
Speaker 2: would want my sister to date Careesi, And I thought
Speaker 2: that was a nice way of putting it.
Speaker 3: This was a great episode. It was what Zeo was
Speaker 3: a departure.
Speaker 2: You know, we always say in SVU there aren't no
Speaker 2: comparisons of crimes.
Speaker 3: But you know, this is a chill one. The crimes
Speaker 3: weren't so heinous. Yeah, well nobody did die, but you know,
Speaker 3: and d it was just girls stabbing each other lightly.
Speaker 1: It was kind of you know some Yeah, in real life,
Speaker 1: if it was bad, it was Wait and actually somebody
Speaker 1: did write us and told us that they had like
Speaker 1: a friend who was like tangentially involved in the case
Speaker 1: and like wasn't allowed to obviously tell her anything, but
Speaker 1: said that it like the real life case like gave
Speaker 1: her nightmares because it was one of the there's stuff
Speaker 1: that's not been released about it. She said that is
Speaker 1: like horrific and like like you just would keep you
Speaker 1: up at night.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I always mean the SVU episode was like obviously sure,
Speaker 2: of course what happened in Wisconsin is not chill. I'm
Speaker 2: not advocating for any of that.
Speaker 3: Just no chill.
Speaker 2: Yeah, as far as crimes go. But and you know, killers,
Speaker 2: they're just like us. They're trying to get their steps into.
Speaker 1: We're all working over Yeah, when those girls thought they
Speaker 1: could walk like ten miles to the park, well, you
Speaker 1: know I think that we did. We did speak about
Speaker 1: the real life girls involved in this case and how
Speaker 1: one of them was a person suffering from skits sophrennia.
Speaker 1: And so for this week's what would Sister Peg Do,
Speaker 1: which is when we direct you towards resources or articles
Speaker 1: or books or something to help you get more information
Speaker 1: about the.
Speaker 3: Topics we broached.
Speaker 1: In today's episode, we thought we would focus on NAMMY,
Speaker 1: which is the National Alliance on Mental Illness. It's NAMI
Speaker 1: dot org and it is the nation's largest grassroots mental
Speaker 1: health organization dedicated to, you know, building better lives for
Speaker 1: millions of Americans affected by mental illness.
Speaker 3: So go check out their page.
Speaker 1: There's a ton of resources on their website and you
Speaker 1: can get more information and things there.
Speaker 2: Thank you, Karra, You're welcome. That was really good information.
Speaker 2: Well let me take that in thanks Kara. That was okay,
Speaker 2: back to you, Lisa, Kara, that was really informative. Boom
Speaker 2: goes the Dynamite. If you get that joke, you might
Speaker 2: be old. Okay, did you get it, Kara? No, you
Speaker 2: don't know Boom goes the Dynamite?
Speaker 3: What is it?
Speaker 2: It was like a really really famous YouTube clip and
Speaker 2: it was like a newscaster who is young?
Speaker 3: I don't know if it was like.
Speaker 2: School news, like a university or like local news.
Speaker 3: But he just had a.
Speaker 2: Brain fart and couldn't get anything out and he was like, oh,
Speaker 2: like started stuttering and saying words it didn't make sense,
Speaker 2: and just like truly lost it on air and at
Speaker 2: the end goes boom, goes the dynamite And those are
Speaker 2: the only words he.
Speaker 3: Was able to cut get out of his like stuttering.
Speaker 3: I never say that, but I shall be looking it up.
Speaker 2: It was awesome, So we'll post that because it is
Speaker 2: one of the greatest YouTube videos.
Speaker 3: And next week we're taking it back. Baby.
Speaker 2: We're gonna do Execution, season three, episode fifteen, So please
Speaker 2: do your homework with your cute pets and good snacks.
Speaker 2: You can watch all the episodes on Hulu and peacock
Speaker 2: and we'll see you soon.
Speaker 3: Bye bye.
Speaker 2: That's Messed Up as an exactly right production.
Speaker 1: If you have compliments you'd like to give us or
Speaker 1: episodes you'd like us to cover, shoot us an email
Speaker 1: at That's Messed Up Pod at gmail dot com.
Speaker 2: Follow the podcast on Instagram at That's Messed Up Pod
Speaker 2: and on Twitter at messed Up Pod, and follow us
Speaker 2: personally at Karaklank and at Glittercheese.
Speaker 1: As always, please see our show notes for sources and
Speaker 1: more information.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much to SBU superfan and our incredible producer, Hannah.
Speaker 1: Kyle Kragon, and to our sound engineer and personal hero
Speaker 1: Anali Snilson, and to Henry Koperski for our theme song,
Speaker 1: to Carly Jean Andrews for our artwork. Thanks to our
Speaker 1: executive producers Georgia Hardstar, Karen Kilgarriff, Daniel Kramer, and everybody
Speaker 1: at exactly Right Media.
Speaker 2: Listen, subscribe, leave us a review on Apple Podcasts, Stitcher,
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Speaker 3: Done. Done