1 00:00:10,680 --> 00:00:14,360 Speaker 1: Welcome to the Therapy for Black Girls Podcast, a weekly 2 00:00:14,400 --> 00:00:19,200 Speaker 1: conversation about mental health, personal development, and all the small 3 00:00:19,200 --> 00:00:22,360 Speaker 1: decisions we can make to become the best possible versions 4 00:00:22,400 --> 00:00:26,520 Speaker 1: of ourselves. I'm your host, Dr Joy Hard and Bradford, 5 00:00:26,840 --> 00:00:31,920 Speaker 1: a licensed psychologist in Atlanta, Georgia. For more information or 6 00:00:32,040 --> 00:00:35,440 Speaker 1: to find a therapist in your area, visit our website 7 00:00:35,560 --> 00:00:39,160 Speaker 1: at Therapy for Black Girls dot com. While I hope 8 00:00:39,200 --> 00:00:43,080 Speaker 1: you love listening to and learning from the podcast, it 9 00:00:43,200 --> 00:00:46,120 Speaker 1: is not meant to be a substitute for a relationship 10 00:00:46,200 --> 00:00:57,200 Speaker 1: with a licensed mental health professional. Hey, y'all, thanks so 11 00:00:57,280 --> 00:00:59,480 Speaker 1: much for joining me for session to sixty nine of 12 00:00:59,520 --> 00:01:02,600 Speaker 1: the Therapy for Black Girl's podcast. We'll get right into 13 00:01:02,680 --> 00:01:14,400 Speaker 1: the conversation after a word from our sponsors. It can 14 00:01:14,400 --> 00:01:16,440 Speaker 1: be hard to know where to start to get solid 15 00:01:16,480 --> 00:01:19,920 Speaker 1: information about food and nutrition, as so many sources share 16 00:01:19,959 --> 00:01:23,040 Speaker 1: information that is incorrect and can be damaging to both 17 00:01:23,080 --> 00:01:26,759 Speaker 1: our health and our relationships to food. Joining me today 18 00:01:26,800 --> 00:01:29,680 Speaker 1: to share their insights and expertise about all things food 19 00:01:29,680 --> 00:01:34,800 Speaker 1: and nutrition are registered dietitians and certified diabetes educators Wendy 20 00:01:34,840 --> 00:01:38,440 Speaker 1: Lopez and Jessica Jones. Wendy and Jessica are also the 21 00:01:38,480 --> 00:01:42,800 Speaker 1: host of the popular podcast Food Heaven. During our conversation, 22 00:01:43,080 --> 00:01:46,679 Speaker 1: they provided definitions to some important terms like intuitive eating 23 00:01:46,800 --> 00:01:50,800 Speaker 1: and diet culture. We discussed the cultural nuances that impact 24 00:01:50,840 --> 00:01:54,640 Speaker 1: our relationships to food, and we discussed how our relationship 25 00:01:54,680 --> 00:01:58,360 Speaker 1: to food impacts our mental health. If something resonates with 26 00:01:58,400 --> 00:02:01,360 Speaker 1: you while enjoying our conversation and please share with us 27 00:02:01,360 --> 00:02:05,520 Speaker 1: on social media using the hashtag TVG in session, or 28 00:02:06,040 --> 00:02:08,040 Speaker 1: join us over in the sister circle. To talk more 29 00:02:08,040 --> 00:02:10,680 Speaker 1: in depth about the episode, you can join us at 30 00:02:10,680 --> 00:02:14,960 Speaker 1: Community not Therapy for Black Girls dot com. Here's our conversation. 31 00:02:18,200 --> 00:02:20,600 Speaker 1: Thank you so much for joining us today. I'm so 32 00:02:20,639 --> 00:02:23,280 Speaker 1: excited to chat with both of you. Indian, just thank you. 33 00:02:23,360 --> 00:02:25,120 Speaker 1: I feel like this is a highlight of our career 34 00:02:25,480 --> 00:02:31,440 Speaker 1: being on this podcasting guise. I've been such a fan 35 00:02:31,520 --> 00:02:33,760 Speaker 1: of you all. You know, there were not very many 36 00:02:34,000 --> 00:02:36,440 Speaker 1: Black Girl podcast starting out, and I feel like y'all 37 00:02:36,520 --> 00:02:38,080 Speaker 1: have some real O g s in the game. So 38 00:02:38,080 --> 00:02:40,400 Speaker 1: it's an honor to chat with you all. Thank you 39 00:02:40,800 --> 00:02:43,720 Speaker 1: so excited. So tell me a little bit about what 40 00:02:43,840 --> 00:02:47,400 Speaker 1: inspired you both to go into nutrition science. Yeah, so 41 00:02:47,480 --> 00:02:50,239 Speaker 1: I can start with that. I was actually a journalist 42 00:02:50,440 --> 00:02:54,480 Speaker 1: before I was a dietitian. I still do love journalism 43 00:02:54,480 --> 00:02:57,280 Speaker 1: and I still write, but this was around the time, 44 00:02:58,120 --> 00:03:00,720 Speaker 1: let's see, like two thousand six, well, when I graduated 45 00:03:00,760 --> 00:03:04,480 Speaker 1: college and the blogs were just starting and the journalism 46 00:03:04,560 --> 00:03:07,880 Speaker 1: was really changing and becoming more unstable. And I also 47 00:03:07,919 --> 00:03:11,040 Speaker 1: made like literally no money, not that it's about money, 48 00:03:11,080 --> 00:03:12,560 Speaker 1: but I was like, I'm going to make a lot 49 00:03:12,560 --> 00:03:16,480 Speaker 1: of money nutrition, Just kidding. So I ended up wanting 50 00:03:16,520 --> 00:03:18,720 Speaker 1: to go back to school have a career where I 51 00:03:18,800 --> 00:03:21,799 Speaker 1: knew I could be more of an entrepreneur and also 52 00:03:21,960 --> 00:03:26,880 Speaker 1: feel like I could directly help people improve their health, 53 00:03:27,080 --> 00:03:30,600 Speaker 1: like with their nutrition their quality of life. And I 54 00:03:30,680 --> 00:03:35,400 Speaker 1: also discovered a real love and passion for science, like 55 00:03:35,480 --> 00:03:38,680 Speaker 1: nutrition science specifically that I didn't know that I had. 56 00:03:38,760 --> 00:03:42,000 Speaker 1: So yeah, I was kind of just started from looking 57 00:03:42,520 --> 00:03:46,960 Speaker 1: to do something different from journalism. It just involved and 58 00:03:47,000 --> 00:03:50,880 Speaker 1: what about you, Wendy. Yeah, so I didn't even know 59 00:03:51,120 --> 00:03:57,040 Speaker 1: that nutrition was a possibility professionally. So I met Jazz 60 00:03:57,080 --> 00:03:59,880 Speaker 1: and she was on her way to becoming a dietitian. Also, 61 00:04:00,080 --> 00:04:02,160 Speaker 1: oh wow, that's actually a career choice, and I was like, 62 00:04:02,200 --> 00:04:04,280 Speaker 1: I'm interested in that because I was struggling with some 63 00:04:04,360 --> 00:04:07,880 Speaker 1: health issues. Also the neighborhood that I grew up in 64 00:04:07,920 --> 00:04:10,360 Speaker 1: that I was living in, there wasn't really much access 65 00:04:10,800 --> 00:04:13,960 Speaker 1: to fresh food, and so I thought that it would 66 00:04:13,960 --> 00:04:17,440 Speaker 1: be really interesting to learn more about food justice and 67 00:04:17,560 --> 00:04:20,599 Speaker 1: nutrition science, and so Just and I started working together 68 00:04:20,720 --> 00:04:23,760 Speaker 1: at a farmer's market and the Bronx, and I was 69 00:04:23,839 --> 00:04:27,440 Speaker 1: just really inspired by the community that we were working with. 70 00:04:27,760 --> 00:04:30,480 Speaker 1: We would provide tools that were culturally relevant, and we 71 00:04:30,520 --> 00:04:34,440 Speaker 1: saw how impactful that was in them incorporating changes and 72 00:04:34,480 --> 00:04:36,960 Speaker 1: also just being receptive to the information that we were 73 00:04:36,960 --> 00:04:39,640 Speaker 1: giving them. From there, we were like, oh, maybe we 74 00:04:39,680 --> 00:04:42,320 Speaker 1: can do something with this, and that's when I decided 75 00:04:42,360 --> 00:04:46,960 Speaker 1: to pursue the career professionally, and Just and I started 76 00:04:47,000 --> 00:04:50,200 Speaker 1: our Passion project on the side. Nice So how did 77 00:04:50,200 --> 00:04:56,480 Speaker 1: you both meet? Through mutual friends and a black activist 78 00:04:57,240 --> 00:05:01,719 Speaker 1: meeting and you a part of next she and Wendy 79 00:05:01,839 --> 00:05:04,479 Speaker 1: or we're just there with Okay, So so you were 80 00:05:04,520 --> 00:05:06,120 Speaker 1: part of it, Our friends were part of it. They 81 00:05:06,160 --> 00:05:10,680 Speaker 1: brought me to It was really a Pott hangout, and yeah, 82 00:05:10,720 --> 00:05:12,960 Speaker 1: we didn't really talk much there, but then it was just, 83 00:05:13,120 --> 00:05:16,120 Speaker 1: you know, somewhere in Brooklyn. So I kept seeing her 84 00:05:16,120 --> 00:05:18,480 Speaker 1: over and over and then with the mutual friends. We 85 00:05:18,560 --> 00:05:21,039 Speaker 1: ended up like hitting it off nice. And so it 86 00:05:21,080 --> 00:05:23,160 Speaker 1: sounds like this kind of started by you all just 87 00:05:23,240 --> 00:05:25,599 Speaker 1: kind of having some shared interests. Just it sounds like 88 00:05:25,600 --> 00:05:28,160 Speaker 1: you were kind of starting your career. And so how 89 00:05:28,200 --> 00:05:30,919 Speaker 1: did all of that become then Food Heaven and the 90 00:05:30,920 --> 00:05:39,760 Speaker 1: Food Heaven podcast. Yeah, it's been a journey. So basically, we, 91 00:05:39,839 --> 00:05:43,239 Speaker 1: like Wendy said, we had been working together at farmers 92 00:05:43,320 --> 00:05:49,400 Speaker 1: markets doing nutrition education and underserved communities like Brooklyn, the Bronx, Harlem, 93 00:05:49,720 --> 00:05:53,839 Speaker 1: Washington Heights in New York City, and we were like, huh, 94 00:05:53,839 --> 00:05:55,880 Speaker 1: like we have really good chemistry, we really love what 95 00:05:55,920 --> 00:05:59,440 Speaker 1: we're doing. How can we try to reach more people 96 00:05:59,600 --> 00:06:03,360 Speaker 1: with this message? And so we ended up doing a 97 00:06:03,440 --> 00:06:06,960 Speaker 1: show actually on Brooklyn Public Access Television. I remember like 98 00:06:07,000 --> 00:06:11,039 Speaker 1: one summer you had to become a producer I think, 99 00:06:11,080 --> 00:06:13,680 Speaker 1: and do all these courses with it was called be 100 00:06:13,839 --> 00:06:17,240 Speaker 1: Cat and we did that and then we ended up 101 00:06:17,279 --> 00:06:20,279 Speaker 1: having a show, which I feel like it's still running 102 00:06:20,320 --> 00:06:22,479 Speaker 1: because they always are like your show has been renewed. 103 00:06:24,240 --> 00:06:26,560 Speaker 1: So and then we decided to put it on YouTube 104 00:06:27,000 --> 00:06:28,960 Speaker 1: because we're like, okay, like our friends and family who 105 00:06:29,000 --> 00:06:31,640 Speaker 1: aren't living in Brooklyn, we don't have TVs, they can't 106 00:06:31,640 --> 00:06:35,680 Speaker 1: see our show, so we started YouTube and then from 107 00:06:35,720 --> 00:06:40,200 Speaker 1: there it just evolved. Like I eventually moved back to California, 108 00:06:40,360 --> 00:06:42,880 Speaker 1: and that's when we decided, like, oh, how can we 109 00:06:42,920 --> 00:06:47,280 Speaker 1: continue this work in a way that is sustainable and 110 00:06:47,360 --> 00:06:49,520 Speaker 1: makes sense, And so that's when we kind of thought 111 00:06:49,560 --> 00:06:52,599 Speaker 1: about creating a podcast. Yeah, with the podcast, it's also 112 00:06:52,680 --> 00:06:56,160 Speaker 1: evolved a lot because initially we were focused more so 113 00:06:56,240 --> 00:06:59,800 Speaker 1: on topics related to like food, nutrition, the science of 114 00:06:59,839 --> 00:07:02,920 Speaker 1: the all. But then as our brand has evolved throughout 115 00:07:02,920 --> 00:07:04,560 Speaker 1: the years, because at this point, we've been doing this 116 00:07:04,640 --> 00:07:09,159 Speaker 1: for over eleven years, and so we started learning more 117 00:07:09,200 --> 00:07:13,640 Speaker 1: about how that every size, food, justice, intuitive eating, and 118 00:07:13,720 --> 00:07:17,600 Speaker 1: so our focus has also kind of pivoted throughout the years, 119 00:07:17,720 --> 00:07:21,960 Speaker 1: where now we talk about so many different topics, both 120 00:07:22,000 --> 00:07:24,119 Speaker 1: within like everything that I just spoke about, but also 121 00:07:24,200 --> 00:07:28,080 Speaker 1: like financial literacy, We speak about real estate, like all 122 00:07:28,200 --> 00:07:31,400 Speaker 1: things you might not think are like directly related to wellness, 123 00:07:31,440 --> 00:07:35,440 Speaker 1: but they are because they impact our quality of life 124 00:07:35,560 --> 00:07:38,240 Speaker 1: and our stress and our mental health. So we kind 125 00:07:38,240 --> 00:07:40,640 Speaker 1: of take on a more broad approach. And also with 126 00:07:40,680 --> 00:07:43,280 Speaker 1: the podcast, we just think about like what we want 127 00:07:43,320 --> 00:07:45,880 Speaker 1: to talk about, So we're like who do we want 128 00:07:45,880 --> 00:07:48,000 Speaker 1: to chat with and catch up with, and then we'll 129 00:07:48,040 --> 00:07:50,400 Speaker 1: kind of use that to guide the people that we 130 00:07:50,480 --> 00:07:54,240 Speaker 1: bring on m M. So I appreciate that you share 131 00:07:54,280 --> 00:07:57,400 Speaker 1: Wendy early around how you all started having some of 132 00:07:57,440 --> 00:08:00,559 Speaker 1: these conversations informers, more kids, and like, you know, living 133 00:08:00,600 --> 00:08:04,320 Speaker 1: in areas where like food wasn't really available or you know, 134 00:08:04,360 --> 00:08:07,760 Speaker 1: first producing those kinds of things. And I'm wondering, how 135 00:08:07,800 --> 00:08:11,720 Speaker 1: have you seen the community respond to some of these conversations. 136 00:08:11,720 --> 00:08:14,520 Speaker 1: So if I think about like my own growing up, 137 00:08:14,600 --> 00:08:17,000 Speaker 1: I feel like there was like health classes where I 138 00:08:17,040 --> 00:08:19,400 Speaker 1: think when I was younger, it was like the food pyramid, right, 139 00:08:19,440 --> 00:08:21,160 Speaker 1: like I think is now colors on a plate or 140 00:08:21,200 --> 00:08:24,360 Speaker 1: some some new terminology. But it feels like, you know, 141 00:08:24,440 --> 00:08:28,400 Speaker 1: conversations around food weren't really in the connection to health, 142 00:08:28,480 --> 00:08:31,040 Speaker 1: weren't really things that we were having. And so what 143 00:08:31,160 --> 00:08:34,559 Speaker 1: has been the community's response to these conversations. It's been 144 00:08:34,600 --> 00:08:38,640 Speaker 1: really positive. I mean, you know, I think initially there's 145 00:08:38,679 --> 00:08:41,400 Speaker 1: some resistance there because, like you said, with the history 146 00:08:41,400 --> 00:08:45,120 Speaker 1: of the food pyramid, and I think the conventional ways 147 00:08:45,160 --> 00:08:49,240 Speaker 1: of treating nutrition are very Eurocentric and so especially for 148 00:08:49,280 --> 00:08:52,120 Speaker 1: people of color, they're very closed off. I remember when 149 00:08:52,120 --> 00:08:54,320 Speaker 1: I was working in a clinic and I came in 150 00:08:54,440 --> 00:08:57,640 Speaker 1: as like the new dietitian. For months, patients would not 151 00:08:57,679 --> 00:09:00,120 Speaker 1: want to come to my office because they thought that 152 00:09:00,160 --> 00:09:02,719 Speaker 1: I was going to take on the same approach as 153 00:09:02,720 --> 00:09:05,439 Speaker 1: a dietician that was there before, where it's like, this 154 00:09:05,520 --> 00:09:08,040 Speaker 1: is what you need to eat. You gotta take out 155 00:09:08,080 --> 00:09:12,200 Speaker 1: all your cultural foods and essentially like making them feel 156 00:09:12,240 --> 00:09:15,320 Speaker 1: like they're a bad person for their food choices. Yeah, 157 00:09:15,400 --> 00:09:18,240 Speaker 1: just using like morale as a central thing, and people 158 00:09:18,520 --> 00:09:21,280 Speaker 1: would be very put off by it, and so it 159 00:09:21,360 --> 00:09:23,360 Speaker 1: took some time to kind of get them to warm 160 00:09:23,480 --> 00:09:26,680 Speaker 1: up to me. But then when you start talking to people, 161 00:09:26,960 --> 00:09:29,640 Speaker 1: you find out that it's not just food. There's like 162 00:09:29,760 --> 00:09:37,120 Speaker 1: just so many issues that are surrounding food, like family dynamics, trauma, immigration, 163 00:09:37,400 --> 00:09:40,000 Speaker 1: like just all of these things that once they start 164 00:09:40,120 --> 00:09:43,480 Speaker 1: trusting you, they start to unpack. So, you know, I've 165 00:09:43,520 --> 00:09:46,360 Speaker 1: learned as a provider that is really important to take 166 00:09:46,360 --> 00:09:50,240 Speaker 1: on that patient centered approach. It really just listen versus 167 00:09:50,480 --> 00:09:52,920 Speaker 1: doing the more old school approach, which is like you 168 00:09:52,960 --> 00:09:55,040 Speaker 1: just tell people what to do, you give them handouts, 169 00:09:55,040 --> 00:09:57,000 Speaker 1: and you're like, all right, this is what you need 170 00:09:57,040 --> 00:09:59,720 Speaker 1: to do to like get your blood sugars under control. 171 00:09:59,800 --> 00:10:04,120 Speaker 1: It's doesn't work, you know, m. So can you give 172 00:10:04,240 --> 00:10:06,760 Speaker 1: us like a one oh one version of like how 173 00:10:06,800 --> 00:10:10,040 Speaker 1: we can begin to start thinking more expensively around like 174 00:10:10,200 --> 00:10:12,440 Speaker 1: nutrition and how do we break some of those kind 175 00:10:12,480 --> 00:10:15,240 Speaker 1: of old cycles we may have fallen into. Yeah, I mean, 176 00:10:15,280 --> 00:10:20,520 Speaker 1: I think number one is just understanding that nutrition and 177 00:10:20,880 --> 00:10:23,480 Speaker 1: your relationship with nutrition and what works for you is 178 00:10:23,480 --> 00:10:26,439 Speaker 1: going to be different for everybody, because I think people 179 00:10:26,480 --> 00:10:28,920 Speaker 1: come to us expecting us to say, this is what 180 00:10:28,960 --> 00:10:31,640 Speaker 1: it means, and this is what you need to do, 181 00:10:31,760 --> 00:10:35,280 Speaker 1: and really it's very personal. So that's number one. Understanding that. 182 00:10:35,800 --> 00:10:39,559 Speaker 1: The second thing is understanding that nutrition is flexible. Right, 183 00:10:39,600 --> 00:10:42,560 Speaker 1: So a healthy diet is flexible. That's like one of 184 00:10:42,559 --> 00:10:45,600 Speaker 1: my favorite lines that I've heard another dietitian say, because 185 00:10:45,640 --> 00:10:48,920 Speaker 1: many people think that a healthy diet means like rigidity 186 00:10:48,920 --> 00:10:50,800 Speaker 1: and you eat certain foods some days in the week 187 00:10:50,840 --> 00:10:52,679 Speaker 1: and then on the weekends you have cheat days, and 188 00:10:52,720 --> 00:10:54,760 Speaker 1: like that would not be a definition of a healthy diet. 189 00:10:55,559 --> 00:10:59,439 Speaker 1: I also think it's important to before we even focus 190 00:10:59,480 --> 00:11:02,640 Speaker 1: on you know, what we call an intuitive eating gentle nutrition, 191 00:11:03,240 --> 00:11:07,839 Speaker 1: it's important to focus on your relationship with food, right, Like, 192 00:11:08,040 --> 00:11:12,320 Speaker 1: so if you're somebody who is noticing that you're restricting 193 00:11:12,400 --> 00:11:14,520 Speaker 1: during the week like I said, and binging on the weekends, 194 00:11:14,640 --> 00:11:16,800 Speaker 1: or you have a lot of foods that are off limits, 195 00:11:17,440 --> 00:11:20,360 Speaker 1: or I was watching a video the other day where 196 00:11:20,400 --> 00:11:22,600 Speaker 1: people were like quote eating healthy, and I was looking 197 00:11:22,600 --> 00:11:24,240 Speaker 1: at the meal that they're eating and I was like, wait, 198 00:11:24,240 --> 00:11:26,840 Speaker 1: they don't realize that like this would this would not 199 00:11:26,960 --> 00:11:29,440 Speaker 1: constitute as a full meal to me as a dietician 200 00:11:29,440 --> 00:11:33,440 Speaker 1: because like, essentially you're just sautaing vegetables, right, So just 201 00:11:34,000 --> 00:11:38,320 Speaker 1: understanding that we need variety flexibility is important and having 202 00:11:38,320 --> 00:11:41,280 Speaker 1: a healthy relationship. And then in terms of specifics, I 203 00:11:41,280 --> 00:11:44,800 Speaker 1: always like to encourage people to try to have at 204 00:11:44,840 --> 00:11:48,200 Speaker 1: least three food groups per meal, so aiming to have 205 00:11:48,559 --> 00:11:53,960 Speaker 1: a carbohydrate, which would be anything from tortillas to you 206 00:11:54,120 --> 00:11:58,839 Speaker 1: get to peace core rice. I also encourage people to 207 00:11:58,880 --> 00:12:02,480 Speaker 1: have protein, which most people are more familiar with proteins, 208 00:12:02,480 --> 00:12:07,800 Speaker 1: so that would be things like chicken, tofu, tempe, eggs, beans, 209 00:12:08,800 --> 00:12:14,679 Speaker 1: and then having a fat and or a fruit or vegetable, right, 210 00:12:14,720 --> 00:12:20,400 Speaker 1: So fats can be cheese, it can be avocado, olive oil, nuts, seeds, 211 00:12:20,480 --> 00:12:25,720 Speaker 1: And then fruits and vegetables, broccoli, cauliflower, carrots, and so 212 00:12:25,760 --> 00:12:27,440 Speaker 1: if we can have a balance of all of those 213 00:12:27,480 --> 00:12:30,360 Speaker 1: things on our plate, or at least three, I feel 214 00:12:30,360 --> 00:12:34,000 Speaker 1: like you're doing great. So you mentioned a couple of 215 00:12:34,120 --> 00:12:36,280 Speaker 1: terms that I've heard kind of in passing, and I'm 216 00:12:36,320 --> 00:12:38,400 Speaker 1: sure others have also, But I'd love for you to 217 00:12:38,520 --> 00:12:41,079 Speaker 1: dig a little deeper into So you mentioned this idea 218 00:12:41,120 --> 00:12:44,600 Speaker 1: of intuitive eating and genu nutrition, So can you go 219 00:12:44,760 --> 00:12:49,520 Speaker 1: more in depth about those absolutely so. Intuitive eating is 220 00:12:49,559 --> 00:12:54,199 Speaker 1: a concept that was popularized by two registered dietitians. I 221 00:12:54,240 --> 00:12:57,800 Speaker 1: think it Their book came out of like the first edition, 222 00:12:58,480 --> 00:13:02,280 Speaker 1: and it's all about out getting back in touch with 223 00:13:02,400 --> 00:13:07,280 Speaker 1: like our bodies needs, ones and desires for food and 224 00:13:07,320 --> 00:13:11,920 Speaker 1: focusing more on internal cues what does your body feel 225 00:13:11,920 --> 00:13:16,319 Speaker 1: like eating? Many of us will naturally crave certain foods 226 00:13:16,440 --> 00:13:19,520 Speaker 1: right Like for example, for me, I know that when 227 00:13:19,600 --> 00:13:22,880 Speaker 1: I'm hot and maybe a little dehydrated, I crave fruit, 228 00:13:23,000 --> 00:13:25,679 Speaker 1: especially like during the summer, I'm always craving watermelon, and 229 00:13:25,720 --> 00:13:28,680 Speaker 1: that really hits the spot for me. So it's focusing 230 00:13:28,679 --> 00:13:31,840 Speaker 1: on those internal cues and weeding out the noise and 231 00:13:31,840 --> 00:13:37,040 Speaker 1: those external cues like calorie counting, or following whatever diet 232 00:13:37,080 --> 00:13:40,959 Speaker 1: on Instagram, because in the long run, that's not going 233 00:13:41,080 --> 00:13:44,520 Speaker 1: to help you have a healthy and positive relationship with 234 00:13:44,559 --> 00:13:47,760 Speaker 1: food and be able to trust yourself. Because intuitive eating 235 00:13:47,840 --> 00:13:52,160 Speaker 1: is also all about building trust with your body. Yeah, 236 00:13:52,160 --> 00:13:54,719 Speaker 1: we want to focus on what's going to help facilitate 237 00:13:55,160 --> 00:13:59,640 Speaker 1: that m m mmm. In this Gentle nutrition like an 238 00:13:59,640 --> 00:14:01,320 Speaker 1: ext and of that or is that kind of something 239 00:14:01,320 --> 00:14:04,920 Speaker 1: in a little different Yeah, gentle nutrition is absolutely an 240 00:14:04,920 --> 00:14:07,120 Speaker 1: extension of that. And again that's one of the ten 241 00:14:07,240 --> 00:14:11,160 Speaker 1: kind of principles of intuitive eating. But people often want 242 00:14:11,200 --> 00:14:14,800 Speaker 1: to start out with the nutrition because that's what we're 243 00:14:14,800 --> 00:14:18,000 Speaker 1: conditioned to think. It's all about, you know, doing this 244 00:14:18,200 --> 00:14:22,600 Speaker 1: huge overhaul and doing it overnight. But withinduity eating, we 245 00:14:22,640 --> 00:14:27,440 Speaker 1: focus on building that trust first, respecting our body, right, 246 00:14:27,520 --> 00:14:31,680 Speaker 1: respecting our bodies kind of like natural weight in shape 247 00:14:31,960 --> 00:14:34,720 Speaker 1: when we are listening to our hunger and fullness us. 248 00:14:35,280 --> 00:14:38,160 Speaker 1: And the gentle nutrition is leaning in on those things 249 00:14:38,160 --> 00:14:40,600 Speaker 1: that I mentioned, like trying to have a variety at 250 00:14:40,640 --> 00:14:44,040 Speaker 1: your plate. Obviously we all know like vegetables are healthy 251 00:14:44,160 --> 00:14:46,800 Speaker 1: in the context of a balanced meal, So just adding 252 00:14:46,800 --> 00:14:51,880 Speaker 1: that variety diversity, and yeah, doing that consistently. I appreciate 253 00:14:51,880 --> 00:14:54,320 Speaker 1: you saying that just like that, we typically want to 254 00:14:54,360 --> 00:14:56,240 Speaker 1: start with the nutrition because that's kind of what we've 255 00:14:56,280 --> 00:14:58,360 Speaker 1: been conditioned, like okay, like let me have one of 256 00:14:58,360 --> 00:15:00,080 Speaker 1: each of these food groups and you know, like that 257 00:15:00,200 --> 00:15:02,920 Speaker 1: kind of thing. But it sounds like foundationally, it really 258 00:15:03,000 --> 00:15:05,560 Speaker 1: is more important for us to start with developing or 259 00:15:05,640 --> 00:15:09,240 Speaker 1: really examining our relationship to food and trusting your body. 260 00:15:09,240 --> 00:15:11,800 Speaker 1: I really appreciate that language. Whendy, can you go a 261 00:15:11,880 --> 00:15:14,720 Speaker 1: little bit more in depth about how would we even 262 00:15:14,760 --> 00:15:18,080 Speaker 1: start to examine our relationship to food and what does 263 00:15:18,120 --> 00:15:20,800 Speaker 1: it look like for us to trust our body. Yeah, 264 00:15:21,120 --> 00:15:24,720 Speaker 1: it's important to have some level of self awareness when 265 00:15:24,760 --> 00:15:27,360 Speaker 1: you're eating because I think a lot of our decisions, 266 00:15:27,440 --> 00:15:29,800 Speaker 1: especially now with the internet, like there's just so much 267 00:15:29,840 --> 00:15:32,280 Speaker 1: information coming at us left and right about what we 268 00:15:32,280 --> 00:15:35,440 Speaker 1: should be eating, about what good nutrition looks like. And 269 00:15:35,600 --> 00:15:39,840 Speaker 1: I find it helpful to just pause and tune into 270 00:15:39,880 --> 00:15:43,920 Speaker 1: your body's needs like just said. And also, your body's 271 00:15:44,000 --> 00:15:47,080 Speaker 1: needs are changing literally every day, Like you know, if 272 00:15:47,120 --> 00:15:49,720 Speaker 1: you're menstruating, for example, your body's needs are going to 273 00:15:49,760 --> 00:15:53,640 Speaker 1: be very different from another time during the month, or 274 00:15:53,680 --> 00:15:55,840 Speaker 1: if you're pregnant for example, like there's just so many 275 00:15:55,840 --> 00:15:59,760 Speaker 1: different factors, and so I think it's important to check 276 00:15:59,800 --> 00:16:01,760 Speaker 1: in every day. And it doesn't have to be like 277 00:16:02,120 --> 00:16:05,280 Speaker 1: very time consuming or like energy draating. It's just like 278 00:16:05,360 --> 00:16:08,360 Speaker 1: being present when you're having your meal and asking yourself 279 00:16:08,440 --> 00:16:10,840 Speaker 1: questions like how do I feel when I'm eating this meal? 280 00:16:11,440 --> 00:16:13,560 Speaker 1: Why did I decide to eat this meal? Do I 281 00:16:13,560 --> 00:16:17,160 Speaker 1: even like sweet potatoes? Is chaos something that I actually enjoy? 282 00:16:17,320 --> 00:16:19,640 Speaker 1: Or am I eating it because I was told that 283 00:16:20,080 --> 00:16:22,680 Speaker 1: this is what I need to eat to be healthier? 284 00:16:22,720 --> 00:16:25,240 Speaker 1: Because like the reality is that there's just so many 285 00:16:25,360 --> 00:16:28,000 Speaker 1: different foods in the world, and there's so many different 286 00:16:28,000 --> 00:16:31,600 Speaker 1: ways to eat healthy regardless of what culture you're from. 287 00:16:31,760 --> 00:16:35,240 Speaker 1: And so that's where I think the flexibility is really important. 288 00:16:35,240 --> 00:16:38,200 Speaker 1: It doesn't just look like one thing. You can decide 289 00:16:38,240 --> 00:16:40,240 Speaker 1: what is going to look like for you based on 290 00:16:40,320 --> 00:16:43,840 Speaker 1: your preferences. If you like ice cream, then there is 291 00:16:43,880 --> 00:16:45,880 Speaker 1: a place for that. It doesn't have to be like 292 00:16:46,200 --> 00:16:50,840 Speaker 1: demonized or moralized as bad food. Yeah, and real well 293 00:16:50,840 --> 00:16:52,400 Speaker 1: I don't want to say like real, but for me, 294 00:16:52,560 --> 00:16:55,440 Speaker 1: real ice cream is like the fatty ice cream because 295 00:16:55,440 --> 00:16:58,360 Speaker 1: the other thing is like when we try to have 296 00:16:58,640 --> 00:17:02,720 Speaker 1: these diety foods that aren't the quote like real thing. 297 00:17:03,280 --> 00:17:05,639 Speaker 1: Sometimes that may work for you, and maybe you feel 298 00:17:05,640 --> 00:17:08,680 Speaker 1: better having those things, but oftentimes, at least for many 299 00:17:08,680 --> 00:17:11,320 Speaker 1: of my clients, they find that they're not actually satisfied 300 00:17:12,040 --> 00:17:15,880 Speaker 1: from having the sugar free whatever, or you know, there's 301 00:17:16,000 --> 00:17:17,919 Speaker 1: you know, certain brands of ice cream that barely have 302 00:17:17,960 --> 00:17:20,440 Speaker 1: any calories, and so you end up eating more of 303 00:17:20,480 --> 00:17:22,480 Speaker 1: that than if you were to just have had a 304 00:17:22,520 --> 00:17:26,919 Speaker 1: scoop of what you really wanted. M M. Yeah. You know, 305 00:17:27,000 --> 00:17:29,760 Speaker 1: just when you mentioned like, oh, the summertime, I find 306 00:17:29,840 --> 00:17:33,320 Speaker 1: myself like craving watermelon, I'm thinking like, oh, well, that's 307 00:17:33,320 --> 00:17:36,040 Speaker 1: not like an awful craving to him, right, like it's watermelon. 308 00:17:36,359 --> 00:17:38,479 Speaker 1: But I hear you saying like, even if you're craving 309 00:17:38,520 --> 00:17:40,960 Speaker 1: ice cream, like there is a way to have that 310 00:17:41,160 --> 00:17:43,199 Speaker 1: and still kind of look at the fullness of what 311 00:17:43,320 --> 00:17:46,080 Speaker 1: you're eating in your nutrition. Yeah, that's a great point, 312 00:17:46,080 --> 00:17:48,200 Speaker 1: because a lot of people be like, Wow, the watermelon 313 00:17:48,320 --> 00:17:51,800 Speaker 1: is like the healthier choice. You know, let me go 314 00:17:51,880 --> 00:17:54,200 Speaker 1: for a watermelon. But if your body is actually craving 315 00:17:54,240 --> 00:17:56,560 Speaker 1: ice cream, you can eat all the watermelon you want, 316 00:17:56,640 --> 00:17:58,320 Speaker 1: You're still gonna in the back of your how you're 317 00:17:58,320 --> 00:18:00,520 Speaker 1: gonna be like, damn, I want some ice cream. Yes, 318 00:18:01,359 --> 00:18:04,199 Speaker 1: maybe that wasn't the best example, because it's for me, 319 00:18:04,280 --> 00:18:05,960 Speaker 1: it's like, if I'm craving ice cream, I'm haven't like 320 00:18:06,000 --> 00:18:08,000 Speaker 1: I was with wedding this weekend and it's like we 321 00:18:08,240 --> 00:18:10,679 Speaker 1: I had ice cream. You know. The other thing I 322 00:18:10,680 --> 00:18:13,240 Speaker 1: want people to pay attention to is how do you feel? 323 00:18:13,440 --> 00:18:16,840 Speaker 1: Because I think people often with intuitive eating, they're like, oh, well, 324 00:18:16,880 --> 00:18:18,480 Speaker 1: you're just saying it's a free for all, like I'm 325 00:18:18,480 --> 00:18:22,000 Speaker 1: gonna be craving ice cream all day every day. In reality, 326 00:18:22,080 --> 00:18:26,040 Speaker 1: if you're really in tune with yourself and trusting yourself, 327 00:18:26,160 --> 00:18:28,760 Speaker 1: you're not gonna eventually like in the beginning, you probably 328 00:18:28,760 --> 00:18:30,439 Speaker 1: will crave ice cream all day every day if you're 329 00:18:30,480 --> 00:18:33,800 Speaker 1: used to restricting it. But with time, you'll be able 330 00:18:33,840 --> 00:18:37,320 Speaker 1: to check in like Wendy sang and say, how did 331 00:18:37,320 --> 00:18:40,359 Speaker 1: that feel having ice cream for lunch? Like I know 332 00:18:40,440 --> 00:18:41,840 Speaker 1: that There's been a lot of times where I've had 333 00:18:41,880 --> 00:18:44,080 Speaker 1: ice cream for lunch and I'm like, well, I kind 334 00:18:44,080 --> 00:18:46,560 Speaker 1: of like didn't feel the best like after I know 335 00:18:46,640 --> 00:18:48,159 Speaker 1: for me, I tend to do better if I have 336 00:18:48,240 --> 00:18:50,639 Speaker 1: it after a meal because my blood sugar levels are 337 00:18:50,640 --> 00:18:52,800 Speaker 1: a little more stable, so I'm not going to have 338 00:18:52,840 --> 00:18:55,000 Speaker 1: as much of a crash. So I think it's kind 339 00:18:55,040 --> 00:18:58,720 Speaker 1: of just really paying attention. Just to go back to 340 00:18:58,760 --> 00:19:02,280 Speaker 1: that YouTube videos watching where the person was trying to 341 00:19:02,320 --> 00:19:05,240 Speaker 1: eat healthy and they were having just like stir fry 342 00:19:05,280 --> 00:19:08,560 Speaker 1: but with like cauliflower rice, and then the surfry was 343 00:19:08,640 --> 00:19:11,159 Speaker 1: like just vegetables, kind of no protein, no nothing, And 344 00:19:11,160 --> 00:19:13,600 Speaker 1: I was just thinking, like, I bet they're gonna say, 345 00:19:13,600 --> 00:19:15,560 Speaker 1: like in the next like five minutes. They were really 346 00:19:15,680 --> 00:19:18,280 Speaker 1: hungry after that, and sure enough she's like, Okay, it's 347 00:19:18,280 --> 00:19:21,199 Speaker 1: been an hour and like I'm already starving. And I mean, 348 00:19:21,240 --> 00:19:23,960 Speaker 1: there's nothing wrong with that, per se, but that's another 349 00:19:24,000 --> 00:19:26,879 Speaker 1: part of a tuity beating. Like what would it feel 350 00:19:26,920 --> 00:19:29,000 Speaker 1: like if I were to have had that surfry but 351 00:19:29,080 --> 00:19:32,840 Speaker 1: added some protein, added, you know, some more flavor of 352 00:19:32,920 --> 00:19:36,720 Speaker 1: factor of foods, had actual rice added olive oil, Like 353 00:19:37,040 --> 00:19:39,760 Speaker 1: how would that change your sotiety in your fullness? How 354 00:19:39,760 --> 00:19:42,359 Speaker 1: long would it last then? And it wouldn't make you 355 00:19:42,400 --> 00:19:44,480 Speaker 1: feel like healthy eating means you're just going to be 356 00:19:44,560 --> 00:19:46,560 Speaker 1: hungry all the time, because that's not the case when 357 00:19:46,600 --> 00:19:51,400 Speaker 1: you're eating enough. Mm hmmmmmm. So something that you mentioned earlier, 358 00:19:51,440 --> 00:19:55,040 Speaker 1: Wendy was health at Every Size is. I'm sure a 359 00:19:55,040 --> 00:19:57,680 Speaker 1: lot of people have seen that abbreviation. Can you tell 360 00:19:57,760 --> 00:20:01,440 Speaker 1: us a little bit more about wood Health at every Yes. 361 00:20:01,720 --> 00:20:04,280 Speaker 1: So it is a movement that was started by health 362 00:20:04,320 --> 00:20:11,080 Speaker 1: professionals and it addresses weight stigma and also health behaviors 363 00:20:11,119 --> 00:20:13,439 Speaker 1: that promote our well being that have nothing to do 364 00:20:13,520 --> 00:20:17,240 Speaker 1: with weight, because in the conventional medical and nutrition approach, 365 00:20:17,880 --> 00:20:20,480 Speaker 1: weight is at the forefront. It's always be and my 366 00:20:20,960 --> 00:20:24,080 Speaker 1: it's always hop on the scale, let's see what your 367 00:20:24,119 --> 00:20:27,679 Speaker 1: weight is. And so it takes on, I think a 368 00:20:27,800 --> 00:20:31,399 Speaker 1: more holistic approach to health where we look at things 369 00:20:31,440 --> 00:20:35,200 Speaker 1: like culture, like gender, like social status, like all of 370 00:20:35,240 --> 00:20:39,040 Speaker 1: these things that might be impacting your food choices, of 371 00:20:39,160 --> 00:20:42,280 Speaker 1: food access, all these different things instead of just being like, oh, well, 372 00:20:42,280 --> 00:20:44,840 Speaker 1: how much do you weigh and these are the recommendations 373 00:20:44,880 --> 00:20:46,760 Speaker 1: that we're going to give you based on that. More 374 00:20:46,800 --> 00:20:51,480 Speaker 1: from my conversation with Wendy and Jessica after the break 375 00:21:02,280 --> 00:21:04,320 Speaker 1: and so, what would you say to critics, because I 376 00:21:04,359 --> 00:21:06,440 Speaker 1: have seen a lot of people criticize It's like, oh, 377 00:21:06,520 --> 00:21:08,919 Speaker 1: are you just buying into these ideas that you know 378 00:21:09,160 --> 00:21:13,320 Speaker 1: everything goes and feeding into this unhealthy behavior, so to speak, 379 00:21:13,320 --> 00:21:15,720 Speaker 1: what would you say to like critics of it? Yes, 380 00:21:15,920 --> 00:21:18,280 Speaker 1: and I would say actually, in the black community, there's 381 00:21:18,320 --> 00:21:21,439 Speaker 1: a lot of critics because there's also this issue with 382 00:21:21,480 --> 00:21:25,679 Speaker 1: food access, which is a very delicate conversation. You know, 383 00:21:25,760 --> 00:21:27,919 Speaker 1: there's not a lot of access to fresh fruits and 384 00:21:28,000 --> 00:21:33,000 Speaker 1: vegetables and the hood. So it becomes really tricky because 385 00:21:33,040 --> 00:21:34,840 Speaker 1: then it's like, oh, well, what are you saying, like 386 00:21:34,880 --> 00:21:38,440 Speaker 1: people should be eating McDonald's, Like that's what the systems 387 00:21:38,480 --> 00:21:41,240 Speaker 1: that are in place want us to do. And it's like, well, 388 00:21:41,280 --> 00:21:44,359 Speaker 1: we can talk about both things simultaneously, Like we of 389 00:21:44,400 --> 00:21:48,200 Speaker 1: course want to increase access to fresh food in low 390 00:21:48,240 --> 00:21:52,160 Speaker 1: income communities, but also as dietitians, we don't want people 391 00:21:52,160 --> 00:21:55,399 Speaker 1: to be consumed by their food choices because really, I mean, 392 00:21:55,400 --> 00:21:57,800 Speaker 1: food should be an enjoyable experience. There shouldn't be something 393 00:21:57,840 --> 00:22:00,760 Speaker 1: that's taking up so much energy and your brain, and 394 00:22:00,880 --> 00:22:02,840 Speaker 1: especially as a black person, we have so many other 395 00:22:02,880 --> 00:22:05,359 Speaker 1: things that we have to think about in this world 396 00:22:05,440 --> 00:22:08,160 Speaker 1: that like you stressing out about you know, a size 397 00:22:08,200 --> 00:22:10,240 Speaker 1: of pizza that you ate is like, you know, do 398 00:22:10,280 --> 00:22:12,720 Speaker 1: you really want to put that much energy into that? 399 00:22:12,800 --> 00:22:16,439 Speaker 1: And also is it really having as much impact on 400 00:22:16,480 --> 00:22:19,200 Speaker 1: your health as you think it is, because really, like 401 00:22:19,680 --> 00:22:25,600 Speaker 1: I think issues like food, access, access to healthcare, mental health, 402 00:22:26,440 --> 00:22:30,080 Speaker 1: all these things are much more important I think than 403 00:22:30,200 --> 00:22:33,240 Speaker 1: like you having a size of pizza or whatever. You know. 404 00:22:33,320 --> 00:22:35,840 Speaker 1: I think people kind of like zoom in and they 405 00:22:36,040 --> 00:22:38,400 Speaker 1: really just focus and put so much energy into those 406 00:22:38,440 --> 00:22:41,239 Speaker 1: things where really there's like so many bigger systems in 407 00:22:41,320 --> 00:22:46,680 Speaker 1: place that impact our health and our well being. Yeah, 408 00:22:46,760 --> 00:22:49,440 Speaker 1: And just to follow up with that, health that every 409 00:22:49,480 --> 00:22:53,960 Speaker 1: size or Haze isn't saying that everybody should just engage 410 00:22:54,000 --> 00:22:58,280 Speaker 1: in quote unhealthy behaviors, like it's literally the pursuit of health. 411 00:22:58,520 --> 00:23:01,840 Speaker 1: But like when he said, with this social justice lends, 412 00:23:01,840 --> 00:23:06,520 Speaker 1: So the HAT principles promote health equality, support ending weight discrimination, 413 00:23:06,600 --> 00:23:09,560 Speaker 1: and improve access to quality health care regardless of size. 414 00:23:09,840 --> 00:23:12,240 Speaker 1: So the principles are just saying, like, we don't want 415 00:23:12,240 --> 00:23:16,200 Speaker 1: to discriminate against people in larger bodies and they deserve 416 00:23:16,359 --> 00:23:18,640 Speaker 1: access to health as well. I don't know how anybody 417 00:23:18,680 --> 00:23:22,600 Speaker 1: could argue with that. And Hayes is also saying kind 418 00:23:22,600 --> 00:23:25,600 Speaker 1: of what Wendy's saying, Like health isn't our nutrition obviously 419 00:23:25,680 --> 00:23:30,359 Speaker 1: isn't everything. We can't control everything about our health and 420 00:23:30,440 --> 00:23:33,600 Speaker 1: let's focus on for many of us what we can 421 00:23:33,640 --> 00:23:37,480 Speaker 1: try to control, which is behaviors. So behaviors are like 422 00:23:37,600 --> 00:23:41,439 Speaker 1: moving every day. Behaviors are like we mentioned, including gentle 423 00:23:41,520 --> 00:23:46,280 Speaker 1: nutrition if you have access to that. Behaviors aren't weight loss, 424 00:23:46,320 --> 00:23:50,480 Speaker 1: and studies show that if we lean in on these 425 00:23:50,520 --> 00:23:55,320 Speaker 1: healthy behaviors that we can mitigate some of the risk 426 00:23:55,640 --> 00:23:59,840 Speaker 1: that might come from being in a larger body. And 427 00:24:00,080 --> 00:24:04,159 Speaker 1: especially like people who are on both ends of the 428 00:24:04,160 --> 00:24:07,800 Speaker 1: b M I, so like those both pose some health risk, 429 00:24:07,880 --> 00:24:11,120 Speaker 1: but with HAZE, we can try to mitigate that by 430 00:24:11,119 --> 00:24:15,520 Speaker 1: focusing on behaviors. And also I just wanted to say 431 00:24:15,520 --> 00:24:18,439 Speaker 1: that if someone decides that they don't want to engage 432 00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:21,800 Speaker 1: in any health promotive behaviors, then we also want to 433 00:24:21,840 --> 00:24:25,360 Speaker 1: make sure to take on a compassionate approach, because everyone 434 00:24:25,840 --> 00:24:28,840 Speaker 1: is entitled to move in this world the way that 435 00:24:29,080 --> 00:24:31,080 Speaker 1: they want. When it comes to their health, it's their body. 436 00:24:31,119 --> 00:24:33,560 Speaker 1: And I think that especially in the health space, there's 437 00:24:33,560 --> 00:24:35,960 Speaker 1: a lot of shaming and a lot of assumptions, especially 438 00:24:36,040 --> 00:24:38,440 Speaker 1: for people who are at a higher weight, like oh, well, 439 00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:41,960 Speaker 1: if you did this, then you wouldn't have diabetes, for example, 440 00:24:42,040 --> 00:24:45,080 Speaker 1: or like whatever, and that is just not in my 441 00:24:45,160 --> 00:24:49,000 Speaker 1: experience as a health professional, it's not effective, it doesn't 442 00:24:49,040 --> 00:24:53,159 Speaker 1: do anything, it doesn't motivate people. And if someone is 443 00:24:53,160 --> 00:24:57,120 Speaker 1: not trying to eat more vegetables and that is their choice, 444 00:24:57,280 --> 00:24:59,360 Speaker 1: you know, like they're not a bad person for doing 445 00:24:59,400 --> 00:25:01,440 Speaker 1: that because they probably have a lot of other things 446 00:25:01,480 --> 00:25:05,480 Speaker 1: going on in their life that are top of priority. 447 00:25:05,840 --> 00:25:08,080 Speaker 1: You know. Yeah, you know. That's one of the things 448 00:25:08,160 --> 00:25:10,720 Speaker 1: I have appreciated most about your platform is that it 449 00:25:10,760 --> 00:25:12,960 Speaker 1: feels like you are able to have these very difficult 450 00:25:13,000 --> 00:25:16,440 Speaker 1: conversations in a way that is very compassionate and sensitive, 451 00:25:16,560 --> 00:25:19,240 Speaker 1: especially to the communities that you're working with. Can you 452 00:25:19,320 --> 00:25:23,000 Speaker 1: talk a little bit about how we can discuss healthy 453 00:25:23,080 --> 00:25:28,760 Speaker 1: eating without contributing to diet culture. First, it's important to 454 00:25:28,880 --> 00:25:31,639 Speaker 1: learn all the different ways that diet culture shows up 455 00:25:31,680 --> 00:25:34,040 Speaker 1: because it could be very like just in your face, 456 00:25:34,040 --> 00:25:35,840 Speaker 1: and it could also be very subtle. And so as 457 00:25:35,880 --> 00:25:38,280 Speaker 1: a provider, I try to practice a lot of self 458 00:25:38,280 --> 00:25:42,199 Speaker 1: awareness because sometimes I'm projecting my own stuff too onto, 459 00:25:42,280 --> 00:25:45,760 Speaker 1: like you know, the conversations that I'm having, or like 460 00:25:45,840 --> 00:25:47,760 Speaker 1: the stuff that I'm putting out. So it's nice having 461 00:25:47,840 --> 00:25:50,840 Speaker 1: just as a business partner, because we're able to bounce 462 00:25:50,880 --> 00:25:52,760 Speaker 1: ideas off of each other and be like, wait a minute, 463 00:25:53,640 --> 00:25:56,560 Speaker 1: that my come off the wrong way, or that is 464 00:25:56,600 --> 00:26:00,440 Speaker 1: coming from a place of diet culture. So it's really important, 465 00:26:00,520 --> 00:26:02,320 Speaker 1: I think, to ask yourself like, Okay, well, what does 466 00:26:02,359 --> 00:26:05,200 Speaker 1: health look like for me? What are all the signs 467 00:26:05,240 --> 00:26:09,200 Speaker 1: and signals that I've gotten from society that has informed 468 00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:11,919 Speaker 1: my belief about health and well being about what I 469 00:26:11,920 --> 00:26:14,760 Speaker 1: should look like? Where does that come from? Because there's 470 00:26:14,800 --> 00:26:18,119 Speaker 1: a lot of problematic history there too, especially as it 471 00:26:18,160 --> 00:26:20,119 Speaker 1: relates to black people, and so I think once you 472 00:26:20,160 --> 00:26:23,800 Speaker 1: start learning about those things, yeah, you just become more aware. 473 00:26:24,080 --> 00:26:27,040 Speaker 1: And there's a lot of great books out there for 474 00:26:27,119 --> 00:26:29,399 Speaker 1: people that want to learn more. On our website, we 475 00:26:29,440 --> 00:26:32,320 Speaker 1: actually have a whole resource list of books that you 476 00:26:32,359 --> 00:26:35,040 Speaker 1: can read up on. But intuitive eating is a great 477 00:26:35,160 --> 00:26:41,479 Speaker 1: place to start. There's also anti diet body kindness, unapologetic eating, 478 00:26:41,720 --> 00:26:44,399 Speaker 1: Fearing the Black Body. I love because it goes into 479 00:26:44,480 --> 00:26:46,639 Speaker 1: like the history of you know, the b and my 480 00:26:47,160 --> 00:26:50,480 Speaker 1: and you know the racism behind it. Also, Yeah, I 481 00:26:50,480 --> 00:26:53,719 Speaker 1: think that those are really great resources too. So you know, 482 00:26:53,800 --> 00:26:55,800 Speaker 1: you both have already kind of alluded to some of this, 483 00:26:55,840 --> 00:26:58,360 Speaker 1: and I feel like this is probably a whole separate episode, 484 00:26:58,359 --> 00:26:59,879 Speaker 1: but I do want to get into some of it. 485 00:27:00,200 --> 00:27:03,240 Speaker 1: So you mentioned just that you like saw a video recently, 486 00:27:03,760 --> 00:27:05,879 Speaker 1: and I know you know y'all are both you know, 487 00:27:06,000 --> 00:27:09,199 Speaker 1: on Instagram and like paying attention to like what is 488 00:27:09,240 --> 00:27:13,480 Speaker 1: happening on places like Instagram, TikTok YouTube, and I can 489 00:27:13,520 --> 00:27:15,680 Speaker 1: imagine some of it makes you want to scratch your 490 00:27:15,680 --> 00:27:18,280 Speaker 1: head because it's just a lot, right, And so I'm 491 00:27:18,280 --> 00:27:21,439 Speaker 1: curious to know, like what you have been observing. It 492 00:27:21,480 --> 00:27:24,200 Speaker 1: definitely feels like a lot of like diet fans are 493 00:27:24,359 --> 00:27:28,600 Speaker 1: repackaged in some ways in places like Instagram and TikTok. 494 00:27:28,680 --> 00:27:31,320 Speaker 1: So what have you been observing and tell me how 495 00:27:31,359 --> 00:27:34,240 Speaker 1: your job has been impacted, because you all have been 496 00:27:34,280 --> 00:27:36,480 Speaker 1: doing this long enough to kind of know a little 497 00:27:36,520 --> 00:27:38,439 Speaker 1: bit about like what it was like to practice as 498 00:27:38,440 --> 00:27:41,680 Speaker 1: a dietician before social media became such a big thing 499 00:27:41,760 --> 00:27:44,479 Speaker 1: and now. So I'd love to hear your reflections on 500 00:27:44,520 --> 00:27:51,879 Speaker 1: those things. I feel like social media is so candy 501 00:27:52,440 --> 00:27:55,520 Speaker 1: depends on how you curate it, it can be very toxic, 502 00:27:56,000 --> 00:27:58,760 Speaker 1: and especially I feel like even a couple of years ago, 503 00:27:59,359 --> 00:28:01,560 Speaker 1: you followed in, you followed, and that's the content that 504 00:28:01,600 --> 00:28:05,200 Speaker 1: you've got. But now I'm just like getting all these 505 00:28:05,240 --> 00:28:09,040 Speaker 1: other suggestions, and sometimes the way that they integrate it, 506 00:28:09,080 --> 00:28:11,159 Speaker 1: you don't know that it's a suggestion, and you just 507 00:28:11,200 --> 00:28:13,520 Speaker 1: think you're scrolling your feet and you're like, wait a minute, 508 00:28:13,640 --> 00:28:15,560 Speaker 1: like what do you mean you only eat one meal 509 00:28:15,560 --> 00:28:18,080 Speaker 1: a day and you're talking about like the Ovat diet, 510 00:28:18,280 --> 00:28:23,560 Speaker 1: or I'm seeing people like fasting for like long periods 511 00:28:23,560 --> 00:28:27,600 Speaker 1: of time, and it all to me just feels very toxic, 512 00:28:27,720 --> 00:28:30,920 Speaker 1: and it's unfortunate that now with social media, like this 513 00:28:31,000 --> 00:28:33,040 Speaker 1: message is kind of getting out to more people, and 514 00:28:33,080 --> 00:28:35,960 Speaker 1: people are forming communities around what I would consider eating 515 00:28:35,960 --> 00:28:40,560 Speaker 1: disorders or at the very least disordered eating. So for 516 00:28:40,600 --> 00:28:44,640 Speaker 1: that reason, I'm not on TikTok. I honestly don't. I 517 00:28:44,680 --> 00:28:46,400 Speaker 1: just see the stuff that's like on TikTok that they 518 00:28:46,440 --> 00:28:49,560 Speaker 1: then post on Instagram. Another part of it, too is 519 00:28:50,640 --> 00:28:53,680 Speaker 1: I think a lot of creators are trying to beat 520 00:28:53,720 --> 00:28:56,280 Speaker 1: the algorithm or figure out the algorithms, So it's almost 521 00:28:56,280 --> 00:28:58,680 Speaker 1: like you have to be more extreme with your content 522 00:28:58,720 --> 00:29:02,080 Speaker 1: and what you're doing, and were extreme like with the 523 00:29:02,160 --> 00:29:05,440 Speaker 1: diets and and the before and after pictures and the 524 00:29:05,760 --> 00:29:09,200 Speaker 1: you know, really quick like weight loss. So I think 525 00:29:09,520 --> 00:29:13,280 Speaker 1: you know, it's just figuring out how can you create 526 00:29:13,760 --> 00:29:18,200 Speaker 1: a safe space for yourself and maybe that means logging 527 00:29:18,240 --> 00:29:20,640 Speaker 1: off live because it can be really bad. Are you 528 00:29:20,640 --> 00:29:23,920 Speaker 1: on TikTok? Dr Joy? I'm on there to watch like 529 00:29:24,240 --> 00:29:27,840 Speaker 1: kids videos and like food, you know, quick desserts and stuff. 530 00:29:27,880 --> 00:29:30,040 Speaker 1: But I'm not really on there. I have a couple 531 00:29:30,080 --> 00:29:33,520 Speaker 1: of videos, but not a whole bunch. Okay. Yeah. I 532 00:29:34,000 --> 00:29:37,200 Speaker 1: talking to people that have been around for a little 533 00:29:37,200 --> 00:29:39,600 Speaker 1: bit longer and social media and it just kind of 534 00:29:39,880 --> 00:29:42,760 Speaker 1: get their perspective on things because it's changed so much. 535 00:29:43,200 --> 00:29:46,760 Speaker 1: And like with TikTok, like the content is just so 536 00:29:46,880 --> 00:29:49,840 Speaker 1: quick and so catchy, and I'm just like, oh my god, 537 00:29:49,880 --> 00:29:51,640 Speaker 1: Like my brain is like I feel like I'm on 538 00:29:51,720 --> 00:29:54,000 Speaker 1: some kind of drug or something like watching all these 539 00:29:54,080 --> 00:29:57,960 Speaker 1: videos and this constant like in flocks, and personally, I'm 540 00:29:58,000 --> 00:30:00,880 Speaker 1: just like I can't keep up. I don't. I feel 541 00:30:00,920 --> 00:30:04,320 Speaker 1: like my head is just like spinning with especially with TikTok. 542 00:30:04,920 --> 00:30:07,160 Speaker 1: So I'm curious to see like how social media is 543 00:30:07,160 --> 00:30:09,120 Speaker 1: going to change in the next few years and what 544 00:30:09,160 --> 00:30:11,640 Speaker 1: direction attended, because because I'm like I could barely keep 545 00:30:11,720 --> 00:30:15,480 Speaker 1: up with what's happening now, I can't imagine in five years. Yeah, 546 00:30:15,680 --> 00:30:18,360 Speaker 1: I agree, and I think that's interesting language that you use, Wendy, 547 00:30:18,400 --> 00:30:20,240 Speaker 1: like that you feel like it's on a drug because 548 00:30:20,280 --> 00:30:22,160 Speaker 1: you know, there's all this research that talks about like 549 00:30:22,200 --> 00:30:25,840 Speaker 1: dopamine being activated, like when we are on these platforms, 550 00:30:25,840 --> 00:30:27,840 Speaker 1: and so some of that is built into it, right 551 00:30:27,880 --> 00:30:30,560 Speaker 1: to keep us there. But I definitely think as a 552 00:30:30,560 --> 00:30:33,840 Speaker 1: mental health professional, they are definitely some concerning things that 553 00:30:34,040 --> 00:30:35,760 Speaker 1: I see, and I think you're right just that it 554 00:30:35,840 --> 00:30:38,480 Speaker 1: feels like people are being encouraged to be more extreme 555 00:30:38,560 --> 00:30:42,200 Speaker 1: in their viewpoints because that is what gets the likes 556 00:30:42,240 --> 00:30:45,120 Speaker 1: and the engagement. So I would imagine, as you know, 557 00:30:45,200 --> 00:30:48,400 Speaker 1: dietitian and health professionals in your lane, that some of 558 00:30:48,400 --> 00:30:52,480 Speaker 1: this stuff that you see is concerning in that same way. Totally. Yeah. 559 00:30:52,520 --> 00:30:55,560 Speaker 1: The food is like just the recipes along You're like what, 560 00:30:55,920 --> 00:30:58,160 Speaker 1: I would never eat that, But it's like what is 561 00:30:58,200 --> 00:31:01,440 Speaker 1: gonna get the most attention. It's like the most extreme 562 00:31:01,520 --> 00:31:04,719 Speaker 1: what you know, like let's do a Snickers sandwich or 563 00:31:04,800 --> 00:31:08,600 Speaker 1: something And I'm like what, this doesn't make any sense, 564 00:31:08,800 --> 00:31:11,360 Speaker 1: but you know it's like it's all for the Yeah, 565 00:31:11,400 --> 00:31:15,560 Speaker 1: it's all for the like of the engagement. Shares in 566 00:31:15,600 --> 00:31:21,520 Speaker 1: the saves, Right, So you mentioned this fasting thing, and 567 00:31:21,560 --> 00:31:24,840 Speaker 1: I definitely have seen that come up several times too. 568 00:31:24,960 --> 00:31:26,880 Speaker 1: It definitely seems like at certain points of the year 569 00:31:26,960 --> 00:31:29,920 Speaker 1: people do maybe more fasting. Okay, you talk a little 570 00:31:29,920 --> 00:31:32,480 Speaker 1: bit about what fasting is and why it might be 571 00:31:32,520 --> 00:31:35,680 Speaker 1: a concern. Yeah, So fasting it is just when you 572 00:31:36,200 --> 00:31:38,720 Speaker 1: don't eat for a certain period of time. And I 573 00:31:38,840 --> 00:31:43,880 Speaker 1: know that there are levels to it. So there's some 574 00:31:43,960 --> 00:31:48,360 Speaker 1: people who may fast for like twelve hours, and then 575 00:31:48,360 --> 00:31:52,520 Speaker 1: there's other people who fast for days. I even saw 576 00:31:52,680 --> 00:31:56,239 Speaker 1: a speaking of YouTube, a YouTuber who his video was 577 00:31:56,360 --> 00:31:59,280 Speaker 1: I didn't eat for thirty days, and I'm just like, 578 00:31:59,800 --> 00:32:03,560 Speaker 1: are you kidding me? Like for why for legs for 579 00:32:03,560 --> 00:32:05,840 Speaker 1: for views like I don't get it. And so there's 580 00:32:05,880 --> 00:32:09,680 Speaker 1: that extreme as well. But for me, it is someone 581 00:32:09,720 --> 00:32:12,680 Speaker 1: who is a big advocate of intuitive eating and listening 582 00:32:12,680 --> 00:32:17,840 Speaker 1: to your body. Like fasting by nature of fasting is 583 00:32:17,880 --> 00:32:20,320 Speaker 1: all about like not listening to your body, right, because 584 00:32:20,360 --> 00:32:24,920 Speaker 1: you are essentially like ignoring your hunger cues, and with 585 00:32:25,000 --> 00:32:27,760 Speaker 1: time and with you know, just ignoring them consistently, they're 586 00:32:27,760 --> 00:32:30,000 Speaker 1: going to For many people, they end up like kind 587 00:32:30,000 --> 00:32:31,760 Speaker 1: of turning off for not being as loud, and then 588 00:32:32,240 --> 00:32:35,920 Speaker 1: when they stop fasting, it becomes confusing. So I just 589 00:32:35,960 --> 00:32:39,880 Speaker 1: don't understand why somebody would want to go against like 590 00:32:39,920 --> 00:32:43,600 Speaker 1: what their body is asking force, you know, like again, 591 00:32:43,720 --> 00:32:46,320 Speaker 1: hunger is like your body asking for food. I'm not 592 00:32:46,600 --> 00:32:49,000 Speaker 1: a fasting expert per se, and I know that like 593 00:32:49,080 --> 00:32:51,840 Speaker 1: that's out there too where people like big advocates because 594 00:32:51,880 --> 00:32:54,240 Speaker 1: of X, Y, and Z. But from the research that 595 00:32:54,320 --> 00:32:57,920 Speaker 1: we have done, it is very important to eat consistently, 596 00:32:58,360 --> 00:33:02,160 Speaker 1: have at least it least two, but ideally three meals 597 00:33:02,200 --> 00:33:05,600 Speaker 1: per day with those food groups because also when you're 598 00:33:05,600 --> 00:33:09,160 Speaker 1: fasting for that long, you're not meeting your nutrition needs 599 00:33:09,360 --> 00:33:12,720 Speaker 1: right because you don't have as many opportunities to get 600 00:33:12,760 --> 00:33:17,320 Speaker 1: in your vitamins, your minerals, those micronutrients. And so I 601 00:33:17,400 --> 00:33:20,480 Speaker 1: just it's not something that I personally recommend. And I 602 00:33:20,480 --> 00:33:23,720 Speaker 1: have many clients, you know, we're formally doing these fasts 603 00:33:23,720 --> 00:33:28,040 Speaker 1: that they've seen on the internet and stopped doing them 604 00:33:28,080 --> 00:33:30,920 Speaker 1: and then feel like they're completely disconnected with their bodies 605 00:33:30,920 --> 00:33:34,800 Speaker 1: and don't even know where to start. So we talked 606 00:33:34,840 --> 00:33:36,680 Speaker 1: about diet culture a little earlier, and I want to 607 00:33:36,720 --> 00:33:39,920 Speaker 1: go back to that conversation, um to hear. Do you 608 00:33:39,960 --> 00:33:43,240 Speaker 1: think that there's something different about the way diet culture 609 00:33:43,280 --> 00:33:46,920 Speaker 1: maybe shows up in the Black community versus other communities, 610 00:33:46,960 --> 00:33:48,600 Speaker 1: Like what does it look like? Maybe is there a 611 00:33:48,640 --> 00:33:52,280 Speaker 1: particular spin on it in our community. Yeah, we had 612 00:33:52,280 --> 00:33:56,320 Speaker 1: a whole podcast episode about this with another dietitian and 613 00:33:56,360 --> 00:33:59,920 Speaker 1: just talked about how in the Black community it's definitely different. 614 00:34:00,120 --> 00:34:05,160 Speaker 1: Like our beauty standard may not be Gwyneth Paltrow um, 615 00:34:05,200 --> 00:34:07,600 Speaker 1: but for many of us it's kind of like that 616 00:34:07,680 --> 00:34:10,320 Speaker 1: fashion nova look right, Like I'm thinking of Cardi b 617 00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:13,960 Speaker 1: where it's like the snatch waste, the big booty, the 618 00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:18,840 Speaker 1: perky breast, and also kind of that pressure to have 619 00:34:18,960 --> 00:34:23,359 Speaker 1: a baby and then snap back immediately. The interesting thing 620 00:34:23,560 --> 00:34:26,399 Speaker 1: is a lot of that for so many people, Like 621 00:34:26,560 --> 00:34:31,120 Speaker 1: it's not even natural and it's achieved biplastic surgery. I'm 622 00:34:31,160 --> 00:34:33,800 Speaker 1: just learning about like the whole like kind of black 623 00:34:33,840 --> 00:34:38,239 Speaker 1: market plastic surgery culture on Instagram and on TikTok, where 624 00:34:38,280 --> 00:34:42,160 Speaker 1: a lot of young women are created upon and these 625 00:34:42,239 --> 00:34:45,400 Speaker 1: plastic surgeons are like reaching out maybe from different countries 626 00:34:45,480 --> 00:34:48,759 Speaker 1: and encouraging them to get like the Brazilian butt lift, Like, oh, 627 00:34:48,800 --> 00:34:50,719 Speaker 1: it's gonna help you with your platform it's gonna help 628 00:34:50,760 --> 00:34:53,279 Speaker 1: you get more followers. And living in l A, I'm 629 00:34:53,320 --> 00:34:57,160 Speaker 1: just seeing the beauty standard and how it's so different 630 00:34:57,200 --> 00:35:01,000 Speaker 1: for black people also, just like the waste trainers and 631 00:35:01,239 --> 00:35:05,640 Speaker 1: the flat tummy t s, the extreme restriction and thinking 632 00:35:05,680 --> 00:35:08,920 Speaker 1: that healthy eating means that I need to cut out 633 00:35:08,960 --> 00:35:11,840 Speaker 1: all these food groups and just eat vegetables and salmon 634 00:35:11,960 --> 00:35:14,640 Speaker 1: or something like that. So it's definitely in the black community, 635 00:35:14,680 --> 00:35:17,040 Speaker 1: but I think the beauty standards are just a little 636 00:35:17,080 --> 00:35:21,080 Speaker 1: bit different. M h. Yeah, and they're still rooted in 637 00:35:21,200 --> 00:35:24,800 Speaker 1: whiteness because it's like you want to control certain parts 638 00:35:24,920 --> 00:35:28,360 Speaker 1: of your body to look more thin than others. And 639 00:35:28,400 --> 00:35:32,600 Speaker 1: I think it goes back to bigger conversation about how 640 00:35:32,640 --> 00:35:35,040 Speaker 1: we see black beauty, like that could go for skin tone, 641 00:35:35,040 --> 00:35:37,200 Speaker 1: and that could go for hair texture, and it's very 642 00:35:37,280 --> 00:35:40,720 Speaker 1: similar with body shape. It's like, well, we don't accept 643 00:35:40,719 --> 00:35:43,640 Speaker 1: all black bodies. They have to look this kind of way, 644 00:35:43,880 --> 00:35:47,080 Speaker 1: and it's like it's impossible, Like you know, most black 645 00:35:47,120 --> 00:35:49,960 Speaker 1: people just aren't gonna look that way unless they're getting 646 00:35:49,960 --> 00:35:53,280 Speaker 1: work done. And our bodies are constantly changing throughout life, 647 00:35:53,360 --> 00:35:56,920 Speaker 1: so it's like you're gonna put so much effort into 648 00:35:56,960 --> 00:36:00,640 Speaker 1: trying to achieve this body, and you're pretty much going 649 00:36:00,640 --> 00:36:02,560 Speaker 1: against your own bodies to try to achieve this like 650 00:36:02,600 --> 00:36:07,680 Speaker 1: beauty ideal. More from my conversation with Wendy and Jessica 651 00:36:08,080 --> 00:36:19,920 Speaker 1: after the break. I'm glad you shared that just I 652 00:36:19,960 --> 00:36:22,640 Speaker 1: did not know that young women were being targeted by 653 00:36:22,680 --> 00:36:28,200 Speaker 1: like plastics. So you guys have to read this book. 654 00:36:28,320 --> 00:36:31,319 Speaker 1: It's called Get Richer Lie Trying Why Depend Me On? 655 00:36:31,520 --> 00:36:35,040 Speaker 1: And it's about like deceit and like scamming in the 656 00:36:35,080 --> 00:36:39,040 Speaker 1: influencer economy. And it's by a black journalist based in 657 00:36:39,080 --> 00:36:42,920 Speaker 1: the UK, and he just talks about all these stories 658 00:36:42,960 --> 00:36:45,160 Speaker 1: and all these interviews he's done with people and how 659 00:36:45,680 --> 00:36:49,720 Speaker 1: deceptive it is because these surgeons will prey on people, 660 00:36:49,960 --> 00:36:52,760 Speaker 1: and they'll have like somebody who they may offer surgery 661 00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:55,880 Speaker 1: to at a discount or for free or for free 662 00:36:55,920 --> 00:36:58,960 Speaker 1: and say like, oh, like tell people to work with me, 663 00:36:59,480 --> 00:37:02,000 Speaker 1: but not disclosing that they had the surgery for free, 664 00:37:02,080 --> 00:37:05,520 Speaker 1: or that most of them had like negative health outcomes 665 00:37:05,560 --> 00:37:07,879 Speaker 1: because of it, or they didn't heal well. So I'm 666 00:37:07,920 --> 00:37:09,840 Speaker 1: just like, oh my god, this is just so toxic 667 00:37:09,880 --> 00:37:11,560 Speaker 1: and this is why I need to just get offline. 668 00:37:14,680 --> 00:37:17,239 Speaker 1: It's absolutely crazy. I was just sharing with just the 669 00:37:17,239 --> 00:37:19,279 Speaker 1: other day that I was on Instagram and it was 670 00:37:19,400 --> 00:37:22,280 Speaker 1: like one of those ads and it was for dimple surgery, 671 00:37:22,400 --> 00:37:24,480 Speaker 1: and I was like, what is the world coming to? 672 00:37:24,600 --> 00:37:27,600 Speaker 1: And apparently that's like a big thing now where you 673 00:37:27,719 --> 00:37:31,920 Speaker 1: have women who are getting like dimples made on their 674 00:37:32,000 --> 00:37:35,799 Speaker 1: faith and it's like a cosmetic surgery and it's put 675 00:37:35,800 --> 00:37:38,560 Speaker 1: out as a sponsored post so that you can, you know, 676 00:37:38,640 --> 00:37:40,759 Speaker 1: see it and engage with it, and there's a lot 677 00:37:40,800 --> 00:37:43,200 Speaker 1: of people engaging with this content. It was like shocking 678 00:37:43,280 --> 00:37:47,319 Speaker 1: to me. Yeah, oh my god. And it's just like 679 00:37:47,560 --> 00:37:51,080 Speaker 1: these young faces, Like what is this going to look 680 00:37:51,160 --> 00:37:54,719 Speaker 1: like in twenty thirty years? And like when I'm looking 681 00:37:54,719 --> 00:37:57,160 Speaker 1: at these pictures of people with the dimple surgery, it's 682 00:37:57,200 --> 00:37:59,840 Speaker 1: just like these permanent, like indentations on their face. And 683 00:37:59,840 --> 00:38:02,480 Speaker 1: I just like the beauty standards, I just can't. I 684 00:38:03,040 --> 00:38:05,160 Speaker 1: can't get with it. Yeah, and it feels like they 685 00:38:05,239 --> 00:38:08,680 Speaker 1: rapidly change, right, you know, Yeah, some new thing that 686 00:38:08,719 --> 00:38:12,799 Speaker 1: we should be wanting on our bodies, right, because when 687 00:38:12,800 --> 00:38:17,960 Speaker 1: dimples are oh honey, you're stuck with those dimples. Okay, 688 00:38:18,880 --> 00:38:23,240 Speaker 1: it's a mask, it really is. So we've talked about 689 00:38:23,280 --> 00:38:25,000 Speaker 1: this a little bit, but I would love to hear 690 00:38:25,080 --> 00:38:28,280 Speaker 1: more from you about like how our relationship to food 691 00:38:28,360 --> 00:38:32,160 Speaker 1: does impact our mental health. So I know that as dietitians, 692 00:38:32,200 --> 00:38:34,560 Speaker 1: both of you probably have also worked with therapists as 693 00:38:34,560 --> 00:38:36,960 Speaker 1: a part of like a treatment team for people who 694 00:38:37,000 --> 00:38:39,919 Speaker 1: do have disordered eating concerns, and so can you talk 695 00:38:39,920 --> 00:38:42,640 Speaker 1: a little bit about the mental health connection. Yeah, it 696 00:38:42,719 --> 00:38:45,759 Speaker 1: goes back to what I was talking about, just like 697 00:38:45,880 --> 00:38:49,239 Speaker 1: thinking about how much space food and nutrition occupies in 698 00:38:49,280 --> 00:38:53,560 Speaker 1: your mind, and it can very easily turn into like 699 00:38:53,600 --> 00:38:57,719 Speaker 1: an obsession with healthy eating, especially with kind of the 700 00:38:57,760 --> 00:38:59,880 Speaker 1: side culture that we're living in now and with so 701 00:39:00,000 --> 00:39:02,680 Speaker 1: social media the way that it is, and so that 702 00:39:02,719 --> 00:39:06,279 Speaker 1: could go left. When you start obsessing over food, it 703 00:39:06,360 --> 00:39:09,680 Speaker 1: could end about your body, especially, it could impact so 704 00:39:09,719 --> 00:39:14,920 Speaker 1: many things, your relationships with loved ones, your self esteem, 705 00:39:15,000 --> 00:39:18,920 Speaker 1: how you feel physically, and also the things that you're 706 00:39:18,960 --> 00:39:20,719 Speaker 1: able to do in the world, because I mean for 707 00:39:20,800 --> 00:39:22,680 Speaker 1: some people as to the point where they can't even 708 00:39:22,719 --> 00:39:24,640 Speaker 1: go out to eat with their friends because they're so 709 00:39:24,840 --> 00:39:27,000 Speaker 1: concerned about, you know, what's going to be ordered at 710 00:39:27,040 --> 00:39:29,600 Speaker 1: the table, They're going to have all the skill afterwards, 711 00:39:30,040 --> 00:39:34,640 Speaker 1: and so it impacts all aspects of someone's life. That's 712 00:39:34,680 --> 00:39:37,439 Speaker 1: why I think it's really important to to take on 713 00:39:37,560 --> 00:39:41,360 Speaker 1: like a complex approach when talking about food and really 714 00:39:41,400 --> 00:39:44,400 Speaker 1: get to the root of what's going on, because it's 715 00:39:44,440 --> 00:39:48,520 Speaker 1: just so much happening at the same time, and everyone's 716 00:39:48,560 --> 00:39:50,919 Speaker 1: situation is different, so we have to like just take 717 00:39:50,960 --> 00:39:56,040 Speaker 1: all those things into account. How might somebody know if 718 00:39:56,080 --> 00:39:58,280 Speaker 1: there are some concerns where they may need to talk 719 00:39:58,320 --> 00:40:02,000 Speaker 1: with a dietitian or a rapist about their relationship with food, 720 00:40:02,040 --> 00:40:04,279 Speaker 1: Like what kinds of things should they be on the 721 00:40:04,280 --> 00:40:07,880 Speaker 1: lookout for thinking about food all the time? That's the 722 00:40:07,920 --> 00:40:10,680 Speaker 1: first one I have, like a whole assessment where it's 723 00:40:10,719 --> 00:40:13,600 Speaker 1: like you eat one meal and immediately you're thinking about 724 00:40:13,600 --> 00:40:16,480 Speaker 1: the next meal. Do you feel like you have a 725 00:40:16,480 --> 00:40:19,719 Speaker 1: lot of rules around food? I mentioned you know some 726 00:40:19,800 --> 00:40:22,080 Speaker 1: of them, like you don't eat more than this amount 727 00:40:22,080 --> 00:40:24,560 Speaker 1: of calories, or you don't eat past seven pm? What 728 00:40:24,680 --> 00:40:27,040 Speaker 1: happens when you're hungry after seven pm? Like does that 729 00:40:27,040 --> 00:40:31,360 Speaker 1: cause stress for you? Do you feel like you're obsessing 730 00:40:31,400 --> 00:40:35,439 Speaker 1: about your your body or your weight and like that's 731 00:40:35,520 --> 00:40:38,200 Speaker 1: kind of getting in the way of your quality of life? 732 00:40:38,280 --> 00:40:41,200 Speaker 1: Or even for many of my clients of people in general, 733 00:40:41,320 --> 00:40:45,480 Speaker 1: like not wanting to see people or see friends, or oh, 734 00:40:45,520 --> 00:40:47,600 Speaker 1: I'm actually not going to be in your wedding because 735 00:40:47,600 --> 00:40:49,560 Speaker 1: I don't really like how I'm going to look in 736 00:40:49,600 --> 00:40:52,160 Speaker 1: the dress. And so yeah, those are just a couple 737 00:40:52,200 --> 00:40:57,160 Speaker 1: of things to to start with asking yourself. But I 738 00:40:57,160 --> 00:41:01,319 Speaker 1: always recommend people do a consult like with a dietitian 739 00:41:01,640 --> 00:41:05,600 Speaker 1: or even with a therapist, just to kind of explore 740 00:41:05,840 --> 00:41:09,799 Speaker 1: that relationship further, because I know dietitians, especially with like 741 00:41:09,840 --> 00:41:12,560 Speaker 1: relationship with food, Like if you're having a dietician who 742 00:41:12,880 --> 00:41:14,960 Speaker 1: specializes in this, like they're going to be able to 743 00:41:15,040 --> 00:41:19,360 Speaker 1: kind of quickly point out behaviors that may indicate that 744 00:41:19,440 --> 00:41:23,799 Speaker 1: there is some kind of disconnect there. M And is 745 00:41:23,840 --> 00:41:26,560 Speaker 1: there a haze like directory, because I think you know 746 00:41:27,040 --> 00:41:29,560 Speaker 1: to your point earlier, Wendy, you know, we want to 747 00:41:29,600 --> 00:41:32,440 Speaker 1: avoid working with dietitians who are going to shame you 748 00:41:32,920 --> 00:41:35,040 Speaker 1: or make you feel bad about it or not like 749 00:41:35,120 --> 00:41:38,680 Speaker 1: taking the totality of your experience. So can we look 750 00:41:38,680 --> 00:41:41,239 Speaker 1: for like people who have like a Hay certification, Like 751 00:41:41,280 --> 00:41:43,960 Speaker 1: how would we be able to find a dietitian that will, 752 00:41:44,080 --> 00:41:46,160 Speaker 1: you know, approach things in the way that will be 753 00:41:46,640 --> 00:41:52,000 Speaker 1: most helpful. Yes, So there is HAZE resource where you 754 00:41:52,000 --> 00:41:56,279 Speaker 1: can find providers not just dieticians, but even physicians and 755 00:41:56,320 --> 00:42:00,160 Speaker 1: other healthcare providers. So the website is a s d 756 00:42:00,440 --> 00:42:02,880 Speaker 1: A h dot org and I can share that with you. 757 00:42:02,960 --> 00:42:07,200 Speaker 1: But the Association for Size Diversity and Health and for 758 00:42:07,280 --> 00:42:09,759 Speaker 1: dietitians generally, I mean, if you just google, you know 759 00:42:09,880 --> 00:42:13,239 Speaker 1: health that every sized dietician and someone who's local to you, 760 00:42:13,320 --> 00:42:16,759 Speaker 1: I'm sure that there will be options that will come up. 761 00:42:17,080 --> 00:42:20,080 Speaker 1: But intuitive eating dieticians health OU every size dieticians are 762 00:42:20,160 --> 00:42:24,400 Speaker 1: usually very outspoken about their approach and so there's no questioning, 763 00:42:24,440 --> 00:42:26,200 Speaker 1: like usually they're kind of front and center there like 764 00:42:26,239 --> 00:42:28,799 Speaker 1: this is my approach. I would recommend if you're looking 765 00:42:28,840 --> 00:42:31,480 Speaker 1: for a dietitian to go on there about page and 766 00:42:31,600 --> 00:42:34,040 Speaker 1: usually there they'll talk about what their approach is, like 767 00:42:34,080 --> 00:42:37,239 Speaker 1: if their focus is more like digestive health, so they 768 00:42:37,360 --> 00:42:40,799 Speaker 1: take on health that every size approach with digestive health, 769 00:42:40,840 --> 00:42:43,319 Speaker 1: they're usually very specific with kind of like what they 770 00:42:43,400 --> 00:42:46,120 Speaker 1: do and so just kind of go on there about 771 00:42:46,120 --> 00:42:49,080 Speaker 1: page UM and I have a really great resource that 772 00:42:49,160 --> 00:42:53,560 Speaker 1: even goes beyond that for black and brown people. Whitney Trotter, 773 00:42:53,800 --> 00:42:57,840 Speaker 1: who's a dietitian. Her handles at Whitney Trotter dot r 774 00:42:57,960 --> 00:43:02,480 Speaker 1: D on Instagram. She can how a bipoc eating disorder 775 00:43:03,040 --> 00:43:06,960 Speaker 1: provider lists and it's a Google spreadsheet of dietitians on 776 00:43:06,960 --> 00:43:10,040 Speaker 1: one page, therapist on the other. And you can look 777 00:43:10,080 --> 00:43:13,000 Speaker 1: and see what their race, ethnicity is, other identities, like 778 00:43:13,040 --> 00:43:16,400 Speaker 1: if someone identifies as queer or fat or whatever, and 779 00:43:16,440 --> 00:43:19,000 Speaker 1: you would feel more comfortable working with that person. And 780 00:43:19,000 --> 00:43:21,040 Speaker 1: then you could see like what do they focus on? 781 00:43:21,080 --> 00:43:23,240 Speaker 1: So it's like, is it eating disorder, is it disordered eating? 782 00:43:23,280 --> 00:43:25,799 Speaker 1: Is it intuitive eating? Many of them focus on all 783 00:43:25,840 --> 00:43:28,440 Speaker 1: three of those things. So yeah, this is an amazing 784 00:43:28,480 --> 00:43:31,200 Speaker 1: resource and so happy that she put this together. Thank 785 00:43:31,200 --> 00:43:33,040 Speaker 1: you for that. We will definitely include that in the 786 00:43:33,040 --> 00:43:35,799 Speaker 1: show notes. So just another question for you. So we've 787 00:43:35,840 --> 00:43:39,279 Speaker 1: definitely seen an increase in black vegans, right, So people 788 00:43:39,320 --> 00:43:42,040 Speaker 1: who are wanting to, you know, live and appreciate a 789 00:43:42,080 --> 00:43:46,279 Speaker 1: more plant based lifestyle. Where does someone get started if 790 00:43:46,320 --> 00:43:48,000 Speaker 1: they are thinking that they want to have a more 791 00:43:48,080 --> 00:43:50,800 Speaker 1: plant based lifestyle. So the first thing that they should 792 00:43:50,840 --> 00:43:56,120 Speaker 1: do is some reflection and ask yourself, why why do 793 00:43:56,200 --> 00:43:58,200 Speaker 1: I want to have a more plant based lifestyle or 794 00:43:58,280 --> 00:44:01,200 Speaker 1: vegan in particular, is it because I feel like I 795 00:44:01,360 --> 00:44:04,879 Speaker 1: need to to be healthy. Well, we know that that's 796 00:44:04,880 --> 00:44:07,160 Speaker 1: not the case, right, Like we can still get some 797 00:44:07,200 --> 00:44:11,080 Speaker 1: of those health benefits by incorporating more plant based foods, 798 00:44:11,080 --> 00:44:12,520 Speaker 1: but we don't have to go all the way is 799 00:44:12,560 --> 00:44:15,160 Speaker 1: to say that we're being vegan. So I think just 800 00:44:15,239 --> 00:44:18,239 Speaker 1: asking what is the motive for many people? And I 801 00:44:18,680 --> 00:44:21,879 Speaker 1: d percent respect this, and I feel conflicted myself with 802 00:44:22,080 --> 00:44:25,320 Speaker 1: animal rights and animal cruelty. I think that that's a 803 00:44:25,440 --> 00:44:29,560 Speaker 1: motivation that's like very valid when it comes to going vegan. 804 00:44:30,080 --> 00:44:32,120 Speaker 1: There might be some people who may just feel better, 805 00:44:32,360 --> 00:44:35,799 Speaker 1: like if they're really listening to their body and they're 806 00:44:35,800 --> 00:44:38,560 Speaker 1: being honest, like maybe they feel better eating vegan. There's 807 00:44:38,560 --> 00:44:40,120 Speaker 1: a lot of people who don't, though, where it's like 808 00:44:40,120 --> 00:44:42,879 Speaker 1: they feel worse and they're like I need a meat 809 00:44:42,960 --> 00:44:44,799 Speaker 1: and I feel better when I have meat. So I 810 00:44:44,800 --> 00:44:47,000 Speaker 1: think really kind of exploring, and I have a lot 811 00:44:47,080 --> 00:44:48,920 Speaker 1: of clients who come thinking I'm gonna be like, oh, 812 00:44:48,960 --> 00:44:51,120 Speaker 1: you should eat vegan, Like let's talk about that, and 813 00:44:51,200 --> 00:44:54,080 Speaker 1: really I kind of challenge any assumptions that they might 814 00:44:54,120 --> 00:44:58,319 Speaker 1: have about veganism. But if you look into it and 815 00:44:58,360 --> 00:45:01,080 Speaker 1: you really do sort of reflection and you decide like, oh, 816 00:45:01,120 --> 00:45:04,759 Speaker 1: this is something that's for me for whatever reason. I 817 00:45:04,800 --> 00:45:09,240 Speaker 1: think the number one place to start is Vegetary Nutrition Resource. 818 00:45:09,600 --> 00:45:11,360 Speaker 1: I can send the link for you guys for the 819 00:45:11,360 --> 00:45:14,160 Speaker 1: show notes, but they have some really good just like 820 00:45:14,239 --> 00:45:18,160 Speaker 1: hand doubts and studies and MythBusters that I think is 821 00:45:18,400 --> 00:45:21,719 Speaker 1: very helpful for people. And I think most importantly, we 822 00:45:21,719 --> 00:45:24,360 Speaker 1: want to make sure we're eating enough with a vegan 823 00:45:24,400 --> 00:45:28,359 Speaker 1: diet because there's so much fiber. Because there often tends 824 00:45:28,400 --> 00:45:31,480 Speaker 1: to be more vegetables, you can be hungrier, and so 825 00:45:31,560 --> 00:45:34,520 Speaker 1: you might have to actually eat five meals a day, 826 00:45:34,600 --> 00:45:36,840 Speaker 1: six meals a day so that you're able to get 827 00:45:36,880 --> 00:45:41,080 Speaker 1: like enough calories and enough energy, enough nutrition, enough protein, 828 00:45:41,680 --> 00:45:44,080 Speaker 1: Whereas if you're eating a diet that includes meat, it 829 00:45:44,120 --> 00:45:45,719 Speaker 1: might be a little bit easier to do that with 830 00:45:45,760 --> 00:45:48,440 Speaker 1: like less volume, because I know that sometimes it's a 831 00:45:48,440 --> 00:45:50,640 Speaker 1: complaint for people following up you can diet where it's 832 00:45:50,680 --> 00:45:53,000 Speaker 1: like oh my god, like it's a lot of volume, 833 00:45:53,080 --> 00:45:56,960 Speaker 1: it's a lot of chewing, So yeah, making sure eating enough. 834 00:45:57,000 --> 00:45:59,279 Speaker 1: And then I think the same thing applies with the 835 00:45:59,320 --> 00:46:02,480 Speaker 1: gentle nutrient scian trying to get in a variety of 836 00:46:02,719 --> 00:46:06,040 Speaker 1: food groups because I know many people they just focus 837 00:46:06,120 --> 00:46:09,200 Speaker 1: on the vegetables and like rice or whatever carb and 838 00:46:09,280 --> 00:46:11,880 Speaker 1: yet they're not thinking about protein, they're not thinking about fat. 839 00:46:11,960 --> 00:46:14,160 Speaker 1: And we really in order to get all those, like 840 00:46:14,200 --> 00:46:17,560 Speaker 1: I said, vitamins, minerals, macronutrients, we have to have a 841 00:46:17,640 --> 00:46:20,600 Speaker 1: variety at most meals. Well, you'll have shared such a 842 00:46:20,640 --> 00:46:24,040 Speaker 1: wealth of information. I'm so appreciative for you. Both. Tell 843 00:46:24,120 --> 00:46:26,719 Speaker 1: us where we can stay connected with you. What is 844 00:46:26,760 --> 00:46:29,080 Speaker 1: your website as well as any social media handles that 845 00:46:29,120 --> 00:46:32,319 Speaker 1: you want to share. Our website is food Heaven Made 846 00:46:32,320 --> 00:46:35,600 Speaker 1: Easy dot com. And we also have a podcast it's 847 00:46:35,600 --> 00:46:37,560 Speaker 1: called The Food have a podcast, so you can find 848 00:46:37,600 --> 00:46:40,680 Speaker 1: that on iTunes and Spotify and all the things. And 849 00:46:40,719 --> 00:46:44,720 Speaker 1: then on Instagram where food Happen. That's when we're most active. Yes, 850 00:46:44,840 --> 00:46:48,879 Speaker 1: and then if people are looking for more specifically like 851 00:46:49,120 --> 00:46:53,040 Speaker 1: for intuitive eating within the bipod community, I do have 852 00:46:53,080 --> 00:46:56,920 Speaker 1: a course. It's Jessica Jones Nutrition dot com. You can 853 00:46:56,960 --> 00:46:59,799 Speaker 1: find it on there and it's called food Positive. And 854 00:47:00,000 --> 00:47:03,920 Speaker 1: and for anybody who is listening who wants to join 855 00:47:04,040 --> 00:47:08,680 Speaker 1: the course, I am offering fifty off. So the keupon 856 00:47:08,880 --> 00:47:12,520 Speaker 1: code is therapy, so you guys can do that and 857 00:47:12,520 --> 00:47:14,759 Speaker 1: that's pretty much like all the work that I do 858 00:47:14,840 --> 00:47:18,760 Speaker 1: one on one with clients, and unfortunately I'm not accepting 859 00:47:18,800 --> 00:47:22,840 Speaker 1: any clients anymore. But yeah, that's another resource for folks. 860 00:47:23,440 --> 00:47:25,520 Speaker 1: We love it. We love a good discount code, so 861 00:47:25,560 --> 00:47:28,160 Speaker 1: we appreciate you sharing it. And it sounds like y'all 862 00:47:28,160 --> 00:47:30,920 Speaker 1: have also developed a very thorough resource list on your 863 00:47:30,920 --> 00:47:35,640 Speaker 1: website exactly there also yeah, every books, every like. Yeah. 864 00:47:35,719 --> 00:47:38,200 Speaker 1: The podcast is such a wealth of information too, because 865 00:47:38,200 --> 00:47:40,399 Speaker 1: we've been doing it for so long and there's every 866 00:47:40,400 --> 00:47:44,640 Speaker 1: conversations on there very pect Well, thank you so much 867 00:47:44,680 --> 00:47:47,480 Speaker 1: for joining me today. I really appreciate it. Thank you. 868 00:47:51,719 --> 00:47:53,839 Speaker 1: I'm so glad Wendy and Jessica were able to share 869 00:47:53,880 --> 00:47:56,879 Speaker 1: their expertise with us today. To learn more about them 870 00:47:56,920 --> 00:47:59,200 Speaker 1: and their work, be sure to visit the show notes 871 00:47:59,239 --> 00:48:01,680 Speaker 1: at Therapy for at Girls dot com slash session to 872 00:48:01,880 --> 00:48:04,960 Speaker 1: ste and don't forget to text two of your girls 873 00:48:05,000 --> 00:48:07,359 Speaker 1: and tell them to check out the episode right now. 874 00:48:08,480 --> 00:48:10,919 Speaker 1: If you're looking for a therapist in your area, check 875 00:48:10,920 --> 00:48:13,680 Speaker 1: out our therapist directory at Therapy for Black Girls dot 876 00:48:13,680 --> 00:48:16,960 Speaker 1: com slash directory. And if you want to continue digging 877 00:48:17,000 --> 00:48:20,000 Speaker 1: into this topic or just be in community with other sisters. 878 00:48:20,360 --> 00:48:22,400 Speaker 1: Come on over and join us in the Sister Circle. 879 00:48:22,840 --> 00:48:25,319 Speaker 1: It's our cozy corner of the Internet designed just for 880 00:48:25,400 --> 00:48:28,560 Speaker 1: black women. You can join us at Community Not Therapy 881 00:48:28,600 --> 00:48:32,480 Speaker 1: for Black Girls dot com. This episode was produced by 882 00:48:32,480 --> 00:48:36,480 Speaker 1: Freda Lucas, Alice Ellis, and Gabby Gladney, and editing was 883 00:48:36,560 --> 00:48:39,480 Speaker 1: done by Dennis and Bradford. Thank you all so much 884 00:48:39,560 --> 00:48:42,000 Speaker 1: for joining me again this week. I look forward to 885 00:48:42,040 --> 00:48:45,600 Speaker 1: continue in this conversation with you all real soon. Take 886 00:48:45,640 --> 00:48:46,080 Speaker 1: good care,