1 00:00:03,200 --> 00:00:08,000 Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg Law with June Brusso from Bloomberg Radio. 2 00:00:10,200 --> 00:00:13,480 Speaker 2: The last time I appeared before Congress, I came to 3 00:00:13,600 --> 00:00:17,799 Speaker 2: protect mister Trump. Today I am here to tell the 4 00:00:17,880 --> 00:00:19,239 Speaker 2: truth about mister Trump. 5 00:00:19,560 --> 00:00:23,239 Speaker 1: Michael Cohene's testimony in the Trump hush money trial is 6 00:00:23,320 --> 00:00:27,600 Speaker 1: similar to his congressional testimony back in twenty nineteen, in 7 00:00:27,680 --> 00:00:30,880 Speaker 1: that he explained how he went from being Donald Trump's 8 00:00:31,000 --> 00:00:34,800 Speaker 1: lawyer and fixer to being the star witness against him. 9 00:00:35,159 --> 00:00:38,519 Speaker 1: Cohen is testified that the former president signed off on 10 00:00:38,600 --> 00:00:41,280 Speaker 1: a plan to cover up the one hundred thirty thousand 11 00:00:41,320 --> 00:00:45,480 Speaker 1: dollars hush money payment to adult film actress Stormy Daniels 12 00:00:45,800 --> 00:00:48,680 Speaker 1: to keep their alleged sexual encounter out of the news 13 00:00:48,720 --> 00:00:52,920 Speaker 1: ahead of the twenty sixteen election. The prosecution has basically 14 00:00:52,960 --> 00:00:56,240 Speaker 1: built its case around Cohen will be the final witness 15 00:00:56,320 --> 00:00:59,480 Speaker 1: for the Manhattan Da, joining me as Bloomberg Legal reporter 16 00:00:59,520 --> 00:01:02,200 Speaker 1: Patricia or Tada, who has been in the courtroom for 17 00:01:02,320 --> 00:01:05,920 Speaker 1: all the testimony. Before we go inside the courtroom, Pat, 18 00:01:06,560 --> 00:01:11,000 Speaker 1: let's talk about how Republicans, including the Speaker of the House, 19 00:01:11,160 --> 00:01:17,319 Speaker 1: Mike Johnson, Alabama Senator Tommy Tubberville, and other Republicans came 20 00:01:17,360 --> 00:01:21,240 Speaker 1: to support Trump on Tuesday and make statements on his 21 00:01:21,360 --> 00:01:23,160 Speaker 1: behalf outside the courthouse. 22 00:01:23,800 --> 00:01:27,440 Speaker 2: Mike Johnson showed up outside the courtroom but never went 23 00:01:27,520 --> 00:01:30,560 Speaker 2: inside the courtroom, so go figure that out. So he 24 00:01:30,640 --> 00:01:33,080 Speaker 2: was there to support Trump but didn't go into the courtroom. 25 00:01:33,200 --> 00:01:37,400 Speaker 2: So the Republican politicians showed up to show the support 26 00:01:37,480 --> 00:01:40,640 Speaker 2: for Trump, and then with the exception of Mike Johnson, 27 00:01:40,800 --> 00:01:44,520 Speaker 2: four of them went in to the courtroom and sat 28 00:01:44,560 --> 00:01:47,360 Speaker 2: in the front row, and then during a break they 29 00:01:47,480 --> 00:01:50,760 Speaker 2: left in the morning and came back late, and they 30 00:01:50,880 --> 00:01:54,920 Speaker 2: arrived just as Michael Cohen was describing to the jury 31 00:01:55,440 --> 00:02:00,200 Speaker 2: how he decided to seek guilty and start cooperating with 32 00:02:00,200 --> 00:02:02,600 Speaker 2: the government. And it was a very heartfelt moment where 33 00:02:02,640 --> 00:02:06,720 Speaker 2: he was describing how he basically had a reckoning with 34 00:02:06,880 --> 00:02:10,120 Speaker 2: his children, his eldest daughter, who was a freshman at 35 00:02:10,120 --> 00:02:14,200 Speaker 2: the University of Pennsylvania, and he said he was protecting 36 00:02:14,800 --> 00:02:17,519 Speaker 2: his family, and then his daughter told him that we're 37 00:02:17,600 --> 00:02:20,480 Speaker 2: your family, they're not your family, and you have to 38 00:02:20,520 --> 00:02:24,320 Speaker 2: think about us, and that's when he decided to be guilty. 39 00:02:24,480 --> 00:02:28,040 Speaker 2: And he's choking up with emotion, and then who comes 40 00:02:28,080 --> 00:02:32,400 Speaker 2: clattering down the center aisle of the courtroom, disrupting proceeding. 41 00:02:32,919 --> 00:02:35,079 Speaker 2: But the Republicans who came to show the support for 42 00:02:35,160 --> 00:02:38,280 Speaker 2: Donald Trump. It was a weird, disjointed moment. I don't 43 00:02:38,320 --> 00:02:40,520 Speaker 2: know if the jury was paying attention. It was kind 44 00:02:40,560 --> 00:02:42,840 Speaker 2: of to those of us, the reporters in the audience, 45 00:02:42,919 --> 00:02:45,560 Speaker 2: it was odd to see people being allowed to walk 46 00:02:45,600 --> 00:02:48,160 Speaker 2: into the courtroom in the middle of trial, in the 47 00:02:48,160 --> 00:02:50,799 Speaker 2: middle of testimony, and no one said a word to 48 00:02:50,880 --> 00:02:53,320 Speaker 2: them that would not be permitted from anyone else. But 49 00:02:53,480 --> 00:02:57,320 Speaker 2: this group and math arrived and clambered down the aisle, 50 00:02:57,560 --> 00:02:59,760 Speaker 2: clonking with their heels and sitting down. 51 00:03:00,560 --> 00:03:04,959 Speaker 1: Has the prosecution complained to the judge about the fact that, 52 00:03:05,560 --> 00:03:09,320 Speaker 1: for example, Mike Johnson in his statement, he's saying almost 53 00:03:09,480 --> 00:03:13,840 Speaker 1: word for word what Trump has said about the trial 54 00:03:14,040 --> 00:03:19,120 Speaker 1: about Michael Cohen. So Trump is using them to avoid 55 00:03:19,160 --> 00:03:20,520 Speaker 1: the gag order he's under. 56 00:03:21,240 --> 00:03:25,040 Speaker 2: Trump yesterday called them his surrogeis and it does appear 57 00:03:25,080 --> 00:03:27,720 Speaker 2: about he's using them as this mouse key surrogates to 58 00:03:27,880 --> 00:03:31,400 Speaker 2: speak and say the things he's not permitted now as 59 00:03:31,440 --> 00:03:35,080 Speaker 2: a descendant. Judge Mershawn, who's presiding over the case, has 60 00:03:35,120 --> 00:03:38,760 Speaker 2: some power and authority over Trump to say, behave and 61 00:03:38,800 --> 00:03:42,000 Speaker 2: don't make comments about the witnesses and the jury. I 62 00:03:42,040 --> 00:03:44,000 Speaker 2: guess this is their way of trying to do an 63 00:03:44,080 --> 00:03:46,760 Speaker 2: end run around the court rolls and around the judge's 64 00:03:46,800 --> 00:03:49,800 Speaker 2: dag order. No one has complained yet, and I don't 65 00:03:49,840 --> 00:03:53,200 Speaker 2: know if Murshawn has any authority to say anything to 66 00:03:53,360 --> 00:03:57,920 Speaker 2: direct members of Congress or former politicians like Visick Rowasani 67 00:03:58,000 --> 00:03:59,720 Speaker 2: to not say anything. 68 00:04:00,120 --> 00:04:03,040 Speaker 1: Like the judge has any control over what they say. 69 00:04:03,480 --> 00:04:06,920 Speaker 1: Let's turn out to Michael Cohen's testimony. Tell us about 70 00:04:06,920 --> 00:04:09,160 Speaker 1: his demeanor on direct examination. 71 00:04:09,960 --> 00:04:12,720 Speaker 2: He mad quite a different presentation than he did when 72 00:04:12,760 --> 00:04:15,880 Speaker 2: he testified as the New York Attorney General civil fraud 73 00:04:15,920 --> 00:04:20,000 Speaker 2: case in October. There, he was harried, he filled out 74 00:04:20,040 --> 00:04:24,599 Speaker 2: his story, He was very anxious, nervous, and he went 75 00:04:24,720 --> 00:04:28,960 Speaker 2: on and gave very long answers that were very disjointed. 76 00:04:29,120 --> 00:04:32,280 Speaker 2: And then when cross examination came up with close examined 77 00:04:32,360 --> 00:04:36,480 Speaker 2: by Alena Haba, Trump's lawyer, she managed to immediately get 78 00:04:36,560 --> 00:04:41,120 Speaker 2: under his skin, ruffle him, unnerved him, and needle him, 79 00:04:41,760 --> 00:04:45,400 Speaker 2: and then he got very combative and defensive. This time, 80 00:04:45,560 --> 00:04:49,440 Speaker 2: he didn't do that his answers on direct examination by 81 00:04:49,560 --> 00:04:54,880 Speaker 2: prosecutor Susan Hoffinger was very methodical, quiet. He gave very 82 00:04:54,920 --> 00:04:59,359 Speaker 2: simple answers, no, ma'am, yes, ma'am. He didn't elaborate or 83 00:04:59,400 --> 00:05:02,960 Speaker 2: get broader any long involved anecdotes. I thought it was 84 00:05:03,080 --> 00:05:06,719 Speaker 2: very effective because basically he told a very simple story. 85 00:05:07,240 --> 00:05:08,880 Speaker 2: And this is a story he's been telling, as we 86 00:05:08,920 --> 00:05:11,919 Speaker 2: all remember, since he completed guilty in August twenty eighteen, 87 00:05:12,360 --> 00:05:15,600 Speaker 2: so for six years he's told this different story, and 88 00:05:15,640 --> 00:05:19,839 Speaker 2: now he got his chance to finally confront Trump. He 89 00:05:20,000 --> 00:05:22,600 Speaker 2: did a couple of times shoot a glance over at 90 00:05:22,640 --> 00:05:25,960 Speaker 2: the defense table, but I did notice whenever he got 91 00:05:26,040 --> 00:05:28,640 Speaker 2: up and to be moved and leave the courtroom, the 92 00:05:28,680 --> 00:05:32,279 Speaker 2: court officer sort of blocked him off from Trumps and 93 00:05:32,320 --> 00:05:35,800 Speaker 2: they basically stopped any confrontation. And that's kind of what 94 00:05:35,920 --> 00:05:40,760 Speaker 2: happened when Madeline Westerhouse testified, she seemed to go on 95 00:05:40,800 --> 00:05:43,520 Speaker 2: to go up to Trump, but the court officers prevented her, 96 00:05:43,680 --> 00:05:45,560 Speaker 2: and Trump seemed to try to go up to Hope 97 00:05:45,600 --> 00:05:48,279 Speaker 2: Hicks and greet her but was against blocked. None of 98 00:05:48,279 --> 00:05:50,200 Speaker 2: this was allowed to happen in front of the jury. 99 00:05:50,800 --> 00:05:55,919 Speaker 1: Explain how he explained the hush money payment to Stormy 100 00:05:56,000 --> 00:05:59,839 Speaker 1: Daniels Trump's connection to the hush money payment to Stormy Daniels. 101 00:06:00,080 --> 00:06:04,080 Speaker 2: A big, seventy thousand foot version is that macro view 102 00:06:04,200 --> 00:06:07,320 Speaker 2: is that they find out after the Acts of Hollywood 103 00:06:07,320 --> 00:06:10,640 Speaker 2: papers come out in October twenty sixteen, weeks before the election, 104 00:06:11,279 --> 00:06:14,400 Speaker 2: they find out that Stormy Daniels is shopping her story. 105 00:06:14,800 --> 00:06:16,720 Speaker 2: And the reason they find this out is because of 106 00:06:16,760 --> 00:06:20,320 Speaker 2: this agreement they have with David Pecker and the National Inquirer. 107 00:06:20,880 --> 00:06:24,760 Speaker 2: Cohen and Trump get alerted about the fallacious story that 108 00:06:24,839 --> 00:06:27,520 Speaker 2: Sterermy Daniels was trying to shop her story. Thorn Star 109 00:06:27,680 --> 00:06:30,039 Speaker 2: says she had sex response in two thousand and six 110 00:06:30,160 --> 00:06:32,839 Speaker 2: and had him and sexual encounter with him. As a 111 00:06:32,880 --> 00:06:37,160 Speaker 2: result of that, he alerts everybody and he starts freaking 112 00:06:37,240 --> 00:06:41,680 Speaker 2: out to Keith Edelman, who's Stormy lawyer, and they discussed 113 00:06:41,720 --> 00:06:44,200 Speaker 2: some kind of payment, and he's discussing this with David 114 00:06:44,200 --> 00:06:47,279 Speaker 2: Pecker as well, who had originally agreed to pay off 115 00:06:47,320 --> 00:06:50,599 Speaker 2: one hundred and fifty thousand dollars to Karen McDougal, the 116 00:06:50,640 --> 00:06:53,680 Speaker 2: Playboy model, to buy her silence for her story that 117 00:06:53,800 --> 00:06:56,360 Speaker 2: early age on this bump, and then the National Inquirer 118 00:06:56,480 --> 00:06:59,640 Speaker 2: paid fifty thousand dollars for a doorman, a Trump Tower 119 00:06:59,680 --> 00:07:02,839 Speaker 2: dorm man, who claimed that Trump had fathered an illegitimate 120 00:07:03,200 --> 00:07:06,880 Speaker 2: child with one of the female Latina employees. So Peckard 121 00:07:06,880 --> 00:07:10,320 Speaker 2: already worked over one hundred and eighty thousand dollars at 122 00:07:10,360 --> 00:07:14,280 Speaker 2: this point. So Pecker consulted with his lawyer and told 123 00:07:14,440 --> 00:07:17,960 Speaker 2: Cohen he wasn't going to pay anymore. And apparently Pecker 124 00:07:18,000 --> 00:07:21,800 Speaker 2: now became concerned that this could be a campaign finance violation, 125 00:07:22,000 --> 00:07:25,280 Speaker 2: so he didn't want to pay. So then Cohen says 126 00:07:25,320 --> 00:07:28,520 Speaker 2: he got very concerned about having to pay this off 127 00:07:28,600 --> 00:07:33,040 Speaker 2: quickly because the election was about will happen, and Trump 128 00:07:33,080 --> 00:07:36,640 Speaker 2: had told him this is terrible, this is quote a 129 00:07:36,800 --> 00:07:41,040 Speaker 2: disaster for the campaign. If I win, it won't matter, 130 00:07:41,480 --> 00:07:44,760 Speaker 2: and if I lose the presidency, I won't care. And 131 00:07:44,800 --> 00:07:49,640 Speaker 2: then Cohen says that Trump was pulling terribly with women, 132 00:07:50,040 --> 00:07:54,200 Speaker 2: so he was worried too. So then the decision comes 133 00:07:54,280 --> 00:07:58,600 Speaker 2: to he's going to pay Stormy off himself. So he 134 00:07:58,680 --> 00:08:02,680 Speaker 2: has this discussion won't pay, He decides to make the payment, 135 00:08:03,080 --> 00:08:06,000 Speaker 2: and he described in great detail a lot of the 136 00:08:06,040 --> 00:08:11,280 Speaker 2: things that jury's already seen. They've seen text between Stormy's 137 00:08:11,320 --> 00:08:15,600 Speaker 2: agent and for a lawyer discussing the payment. They've seen 138 00:08:15,880 --> 00:08:21,600 Speaker 2: emails between Cohen and Stormy's lawyers discussing the payment. They've 139 00:08:21,600 --> 00:08:25,480 Speaker 2: seen bank records where Cohen made the payment, and now 140 00:08:25,520 --> 00:08:27,800 Speaker 2: we hear it from his own words linking him up 141 00:08:27,840 --> 00:08:31,640 Speaker 2: to Trump. What he said, which was very interesting yesterday 142 00:08:31,960 --> 00:08:35,280 Speaker 2: the last day of direct was that he has a 143 00:08:35,320 --> 00:08:39,600 Speaker 2: discussion with Trump after the elections at the White House 144 00:08:40,120 --> 00:08:43,960 Speaker 2: in the Oval office, and Trump asked him, are you 145 00:08:44,080 --> 00:08:48,199 Speaker 2: doing okay? And he says, well, you know. He mentions 146 00:08:48,240 --> 00:08:51,360 Speaker 2: that he hasn't been paid for January and February, which 147 00:08:51,400 --> 00:08:54,000 Speaker 2: would be the start of the payments to the repayment 148 00:08:54,000 --> 00:08:56,480 Speaker 2: of one hundred and thirty thousand dollars that he was 149 00:08:56,520 --> 00:08:59,800 Speaker 2: supposed to get back from Trump. So Trump tells him, 150 00:09:00,200 --> 00:09:03,640 Speaker 2: see Alan Weifelberg and Alan Weifelberg, who was not allowed 151 00:09:03,679 --> 00:09:07,600 Speaker 2: to do anything financially without Trump's approval, and he was 152 00:09:07,640 --> 00:09:10,360 Speaker 2: not aligned to side any check for over a certain 153 00:09:10,400 --> 00:09:15,640 Speaker 2: amount of money without prior permission from Eric Trump, Don Junior, 154 00:09:15,760 --> 00:09:19,840 Speaker 2: or Donald Trump himself suddenly is sending texting it. So 155 00:09:20,000 --> 00:09:24,360 Speaker 2: Don Junior and Eric pay for a seventy thousand dollars installment, 156 00:09:24,520 --> 00:09:27,679 Speaker 2: which is two checks for January and February, and then 157 00:09:27,760 --> 00:09:31,360 Speaker 2: the jury saw another chess sign and then they saw 158 00:09:31,400 --> 00:09:35,840 Speaker 2: the eighth check that he said Donald Trump shigned from 159 00:09:35,840 --> 00:09:38,480 Speaker 2: the White House when Donald Trump was president already in 160 00:09:38,520 --> 00:09:42,600 Speaker 2: twenty seventeen. So every month onward h chess signed by 161 00:09:42,640 --> 00:09:46,720 Speaker 2: Donald Trump personally. And to his testimony that Donald Trump 162 00:09:46,760 --> 00:09:50,920 Speaker 2: has proclaimed in books and in interviews that he wouldn't 163 00:09:51,000 --> 00:09:53,720 Speaker 2: sign any check without knowing exactly what it was for. 164 00:09:55,000 --> 00:09:58,679 Speaker 1: So, Pat, what are the documents that are most supportive 165 00:09:59,360 --> 00:10:03,400 Speaker 1: of his test testimony that corroborate his claims that Trump 166 00:10:03,520 --> 00:10:05,920 Speaker 1: knew and approved the hush money payments. 167 00:10:06,920 --> 00:10:10,280 Speaker 2: The text, there's emails, there's tons of records, and there's 168 00:10:10,320 --> 00:10:13,480 Speaker 2: tons of text messages back and forth. There is a 169 00:10:13,600 --> 00:10:19,920 Speaker 2: handwritten document and it's basically Weifelberg scrapch notes calculating how 170 00:10:20,080 --> 00:10:23,960 Speaker 2: he'd repay coent. It got quote unquote grossed up and 171 00:10:24,840 --> 00:10:27,720 Speaker 2: multiplied up. It was one hundred and thirty thousand dollars. 172 00:10:28,040 --> 00:10:31,040 Speaker 2: Cohen said he was owed of fifty thousand dollars or 173 00:10:31,120 --> 00:10:33,360 Speaker 2: a job he'd done for Trump, and Trump had never 174 00:10:33,400 --> 00:10:36,520 Speaker 2: paid him back. He was expecting to get reimbursed for 175 00:10:36,640 --> 00:10:39,840 Speaker 2: his bonus for twenty seventeen. You know, the December check 176 00:10:39,880 --> 00:10:42,679 Speaker 2: that everybody loves to get for Christmas check is a bonus. 177 00:10:42,880 --> 00:10:45,720 Speaker 2: He didn't get anything like that from Trump. He was 178 00:10:45,800 --> 00:10:49,280 Speaker 2: expecting an additional amounts of money. So dry Solders basically 179 00:10:49,840 --> 00:10:53,959 Speaker 2: scrappad of all the calculations that added up to the 180 00:10:53,960 --> 00:10:57,480 Speaker 2: one hundred and thirty thousand plus fifty thousand, multiplied by 181 00:10:57,679 --> 00:11:01,880 Speaker 2: certain quantifiers. Because Cohen was in a certain tax bracket, 182 00:11:01,920 --> 00:11:05,800 Speaker 2: that ended up being one hundred and eighty thousand dollars payment, 183 00:11:06,040 --> 00:11:09,840 Speaker 2: but doubled because Cohen was in the fifty percent tax bracket, 184 00:11:10,440 --> 00:11:15,119 Speaker 2: that was a four hundred and twenty thousand dollars payment completely, 185 00:11:15,720 --> 00:11:19,160 Speaker 2: So then it said divided by twelve, which ended up 186 00:11:19,160 --> 00:11:23,080 Speaker 2: being thirty five thousands. But you hear the testimony from 187 00:11:23,280 --> 00:11:28,080 Speaker 2: la Cohen saying something like, but what about Melania? Won't 188 00:11:28,160 --> 00:11:30,679 Speaker 2: she be a shet when she finds out about Stormy? 189 00:11:31,400 --> 00:11:34,480 Speaker 2: And Trump said, are you kidding? You think I'm going 190 00:11:34,520 --> 00:11:38,199 Speaker 2: to be on the market long, no problem, not a chance. 191 00:11:38,760 --> 00:11:41,560 Speaker 2: Is that the comment that some man makes when he's 192 00:11:41,800 --> 00:11:45,200 Speaker 2: allegedly worried and concerned about his wife finding out about 193 00:11:45,200 --> 00:11:46,120 Speaker 2: his infidelity. 194 00:11:46,559 --> 00:11:49,840 Speaker 1: I think the prosecutor will probably be bringing that up 195 00:11:50,040 --> 00:11:53,520 Speaker 1: in closing arguments. Pat, stay with me. Coming up, we're 196 00:11:53,559 --> 00:11:57,880 Speaker 1: going to discuss Michael Cohen's cross examination. I'm June Grass. 197 00:11:57,920 --> 00:12:02,720 Speaker 1: When you're listening to Bloomberg. Donald Trump's fixer turned foe, 198 00:12:02,800 --> 00:12:06,199 Speaker 1: will return to the witness stand tomorrow and could face 199 00:12:06,280 --> 00:12:10,080 Speaker 1: a bruising round of questioning from the former president's lawyers. 200 00:12:10,600 --> 00:12:13,959 Speaker 1: Michael Cohen's testimony this week has linked Trump to all 201 00:12:14,000 --> 00:12:17,680 Speaker 1: aspects of a hush money scheme that prosecutors say was 202 00:12:17,760 --> 00:12:22,360 Speaker 1: aimed at stifling stories that threatened his twenty sixteen campaign. 203 00:12:22,960 --> 00:12:26,280 Speaker 1: Cohen is the prosecution's star witness, and they'll end their 204 00:12:26,320 --> 00:12:29,680 Speaker 1: case with him. Then we'll find out whether the defense 205 00:12:29,720 --> 00:12:32,280 Speaker 1: will be putting on a case and if Donald Trump 206 00:12:32,320 --> 00:12:35,040 Speaker 1: will testify in his own behalf. I've been talking to 207 00:12:35,040 --> 00:12:38,240 Speaker 1: Bloomberg legal reporter Patricia Hurtano, who's been in the courtroom 208 00:12:38,360 --> 00:12:39,520 Speaker 1: for all the testimony. 209 00:12:39,880 --> 00:12:40,120 Speaker 2: Pat. 210 00:12:40,160 --> 00:12:44,200 Speaker 1: Before the break, we were talking about the scribblings by 211 00:12:44,240 --> 00:12:48,960 Speaker 1: the former CFO of the Trump organization, Alan Weiselberg, detailing 212 00:12:48,960 --> 00:12:51,520 Speaker 1: how Michael Cohen was going to be paid back, a 213 00:12:51,640 --> 00:12:56,280 Speaker 1: very important document for the prosecution, and in most cases 214 00:12:56,920 --> 00:13:01,480 Speaker 1: the prosecutors would call Weiselberg to the state to testify 215 00:13:01,520 --> 00:13:05,720 Speaker 1: about those scribblings that he made. Alan Weisselberg is not 216 00:13:05,800 --> 00:13:08,840 Speaker 1: going to testify, is he? The jury's going to wonder. 217 00:13:08,880 --> 00:13:10,079 Speaker 1: I think where is he? 218 00:13:10,960 --> 00:13:15,600 Speaker 2: Well? Right now, the DA has no expectations or interest 219 00:13:15,679 --> 00:13:19,600 Speaker 2: in calling Wassilberg. After all, the man is a twice 220 00:13:19,760 --> 00:13:24,240 Speaker 2: convicted felon. He pleaded guilty to tax law charges on 221 00:13:24,280 --> 00:13:28,040 Speaker 2: behalf of the Trump organization, and he played guilty to perjury, 222 00:13:28,160 --> 00:13:32,199 Speaker 2: and he perjured himself when he testified in favor supporting 223 00:13:32,280 --> 00:13:35,240 Speaker 2: Donald Trump at the civil tax flawed case brought by 224 00:13:35,240 --> 00:13:38,920 Speaker 2: the New York State ag So why anybody would call 225 00:13:39,040 --> 00:13:41,920 Speaker 2: such a tainted witness, as anyone's yest, he would not 226 00:13:42,040 --> 00:13:44,920 Speaker 2: be a reliable witness, and he would be still protecting Trump. 227 00:13:45,240 --> 00:13:48,120 Speaker 2: I think the prosecution saying, why would you call somebody 228 00:13:48,200 --> 00:13:50,640 Speaker 2: that's possibly going to give reasonable doubt for a jury 229 00:13:50,640 --> 00:13:52,719 Speaker 2: when the documents speak for themselves and you don't have 230 00:13:52,760 --> 00:13:55,520 Speaker 2: to heed anybody going to translate because it's right there 231 00:13:55,520 --> 00:13:58,640 Speaker 2: in black and white. And they had other Trump witnesses, 232 00:13:58,880 --> 00:14:02,800 Speaker 2: Trump lords witnesses striving with the paperwork, said, so they 233 00:14:02,840 --> 00:14:05,640 Speaker 2: don't need it. The other thing that Cohen said yesterday 234 00:14:06,080 --> 00:14:09,559 Speaker 2: was he had to apologize to the mares and people 235 00:14:10,080 --> 00:14:13,560 Speaker 2: because he helped conceal the information they needed when they 236 00:14:13,600 --> 00:14:16,520 Speaker 2: were selecting a man who was running for the highest 237 00:14:16,559 --> 00:14:19,960 Speaker 2: office in the LAMB. So, I mean, when I heard that, 238 00:14:20,080 --> 00:14:23,280 Speaker 2: it was stunning to hear, because this really is central 239 00:14:23,360 --> 00:14:26,480 Speaker 2: to the DA claim that this is an effort to 240 00:14:26,640 --> 00:14:31,600 Speaker 2: undermine the elections. And Cohen said this would have helped 241 00:14:31,720 --> 00:14:35,360 Speaker 2: citizens understand if they had known the truth about Trump. 242 00:14:35,840 --> 00:14:39,040 Speaker 1: So one thing that I found really interesting was the 243 00:14:39,080 --> 00:14:43,200 Speaker 1: cover up of the cover up where Trump and others 244 00:14:43,240 --> 00:14:46,080 Speaker 1: tried to keep Michael Cohen in line. 245 00:14:47,160 --> 00:14:50,080 Speaker 2: Yeah, that was That's always been this argument that the 246 00:14:50,360 --> 00:14:54,560 Speaker 2: DA had file papers free trial saying there was something 247 00:14:54,640 --> 00:14:59,320 Speaker 2: called the quote unquote pressure campaign, and I assumed it 248 00:14:59,440 --> 00:15:03,040 Speaker 2: just meant be tweaked by Donald Trump. When Michael Cohen 249 00:15:03,320 --> 00:15:07,560 Speaker 2: gets his offices get raided, office and his apartment and 250 00:15:08,200 --> 00:15:11,280 Speaker 2: his hotel, he's extended in a hotel because his apartment 251 00:15:11,360 --> 00:15:13,960 Speaker 2: was being renovated, he says, So when he gets raided. 252 00:15:14,160 --> 00:15:18,480 Speaker 2: In April twenty eighteen, Trump is tweeting, Oh, he's my guy. 253 00:15:19,000 --> 00:15:21,920 Speaker 2: I'm supporting him. He's a good man, a great man, 254 00:15:22,000 --> 00:15:26,800 Speaker 2: a wonderful lawyer. But then the day after Michael Cohen 255 00:15:27,040 --> 00:15:30,960 Speaker 2: pleads guilty, and people may need to remember that the 256 00:15:31,080 --> 00:15:34,640 Speaker 2: day Michael Cohen played guilty in August twenty eighteen is 257 00:15:34,720 --> 00:15:38,280 Speaker 2: the same day that Paul Mannifort got convicted. It was 258 00:15:38,320 --> 00:15:43,320 Speaker 2: a new doubleheader that day, and the next day Donald 259 00:15:43,320 --> 00:15:47,400 Speaker 2: Trump is praising Paul Manifort for being a good American 260 00:15:47,960 --> 00:15:52,320 Speaker 2: but condemning and damning Michael Cohen as a sleave ball 261 00:15:52,520 --> 00:15:55,720 Speaker 2: and a terrible lawyer. And never hired this terrible man. 262 00:15:56,440 --> 00:15:58,800 Speaker 2: So I always thought that was the end of the 263 00:15:58,840 --> 00:16:02,760 Speaker 2: story of the of the pressure campaign. But then he 264 00:16:02,840 --> 00:16:07,080 Speaker 2: saw this other learn named Robert Costello, claimed that he 265 00:16:07,240 --> 00:16:14,000 Speaker 2: had represented Michael Cohen and was basically asserting that Cohen 266 00:16:14,080 --> 00:16:17,000 Speaker 2: had told him a completely different story and was a 267 00:16:17,040 --> 00:16:19,840 Speaker 2: liar and not to be believed. And this happens after 268 00:16:19,960 --> 00:16:24,000 Speaker 2: Michael Cohen plete guilty to federal charges, So it added 269 00:16:24,040 --> 00:16:28,200 Speaker 2: to the Murphy mess around Michael Cohen was he as 270 00:16:28,320 --> 00:16:32,600 Speaker 2: luosy as they claimed. We saw tons of emails yesterday 271 00:16:32,600 --> 00:16:36,240 Speaker 2: that were pretty stocking where Coleen gets introduced the Costello 272 00:16:36,600 --> 00:16:41,600 Speaker 2: and then Costello starts sending him these very kind of insinuating, 273 00:16:42,000 --> 00:16:46,400 Speaker 2: supplicating emails of like, hey, just remember I talked to 274 00:16:46,440 --> 00:16:50,080 Speaker 2: the big guy. He's in your on your side. I 275 00:16:50,200 --> 00:16:54,040 Speaker 2: spoke to our friend, a lawyer, meaning Juliani. So Costello 276 00:16:54,120 --> 00:16:59,080 Speaker 2: is apparently a Juliani ally. And Cohen said he was 277 00:16:59,120 --> 00:17:03,800 Speaker 2: afraid that Costello was just acting with Guliani to find 278 00:17:03,840 --> 00:17:07,160 Speaker 2: out exactly what Coen was going to do. Keep your 279 00:17:07,160 --> 00:17:10,560 Speaker 2: friends close for your enemy's closer kind of idea. And 280 00:17:10,720 --> 00:17:14,800 Speaker 2: you see these constant hollage of emails with Costello is 281 00:17:15,119 --> 00:17:18,239 Speaker 2: haranguing as the first he's supplicating and kissing up to him, 282 00:17:18,320 --> 00:17:21,040 Speaker 2: and then he starts haranguing. I'm like, you don't answer 283 00:17:21,080 --> 00:17:24,520 Speaker 2: my calls and you're not talking and we need to 284 00:17:24,520 --> 00:17:27,119 Speaker 2: discuss it, and why are you thinking of hiring another lawyer. 285 00:17:27,200 --> 00:17:30,199 Speaker 2: I don't like this, and you know, basically accusing of 286 00:17:30,240 --> 00:17:33,560 Speaker 2: all kinds of nefarious substitutes. And Kellen is like, hey, 287 00:17:33,600 --> 00:17:35,760 Speaker 2: I didn't make a decision, you're not my lawyer, and 288 00:17:36,000 --> 00:17:39,119 Speaker 2: then he starts really almost assailing him, And that was 289 00:17:39,200 --> 00:17:42,320 Speaker 2: kind of shocking that Costello and we now know, and 290 00:17:42,600 --> 00:17:45,840 Speaker 2: Costello went on a campaign of his own integrating and 291 00:17:46,240 --> 00:17:49,320 Speaker 2: castigating Cohan. So it's kind of weird that you see 292 00:17:49,320 --> 00:17:52,040 Speaker 2: that that. Cohen said he felt that this was a 293 00:17:52,119 --> 00:17:57,760 Speaker 2: back channel way of Giuliani going between Trump and working 294 00:17:57,800 --> 00:18:01,280 Speaker 2: behind the scenes to keep him in line and keep 295 00:18:01,359 --> 00:18:04,879 Speaker 2: him from pleading guilty and trying to constantly take a 296 00:18:04,960 --> 00:18:07,840 Speaker 2: temperature and find out how close he was to cooperate. 297 00:18:08,880 --> 00:18:12,679 Speaker 1: Let's turn down to the cross examination. Blanche started the 298 00:18:12,800 --> 00:18:16,520 Speaker 1: cross trying to needle Cohen right started off. 299 00:18:17,000 --> 00:18:19,159 Speaker 2: And he said, didn't you call me, you know, a 300 00:18:19,280 --> 00:18:23,320 Speaker 2: stupid little expletive in a twite? And on social media? 301 00:18:23,440 --> 00:18:26,800 Speaker 2: Haven't you said these things? And what he was doing 302 00:18:27,040 --> 00:18:30,159 Speaker 2: was what the defense was complaining Cohen was doing. And 303 00:18:30,240 --> 00:18:35,200 Speaker 2: the defense had complained bitterly that Cohen was integrating and 304 00:18:35,359 --> 00:18:37,800 Speaker 2: saying mean things about Trump and he had to stop. 305 00:18:38,040 --> 00:18:41,520 Speaker 2: And then the judge told the DA, make him stop, 306 00:18:41,680 --> 00:18:44,160 Speaker 2: get them to knock it off. The judge told the DA, 307 00:18:44,800 --> 00:18:46,720 Speaker 2: and they said, as much as we can, We're going 308 00:18:46,800 --> 00:18:49,320 Speaker 2: to try. But controlling Michael Cohen is going to be 309 00:18:49,320 --> 00:18:53,479 Speaker 2: a different story. But then the defense Blanche gets up 310 00:18:53,480 --> 00:18:55,840 Speaker 2: there and it starts repeating the things he was complaining 311 00:18:55,840 --> 00:18:58,560 Speaker 2: Michael Cohen was saying. And then I think the judge 312 00:18:58,560 --> 00:19:01,920 Speaker 2: felt like, okay, to not make it personal between Todd 313 00:19:02,000 --> 00:19:06,200 Speaker 2: Blanche and Michael Cohen, let's talk about why we're here, 314 00:19:06,320 --> 00:19:08,840 Speaker 2: and I think the judge basically shut that down. And 315 00:19:08,880 --> 00:19:10,920 Speaker 2: then he started talking about all the new things he's 316 00:19:10,960 --> 00:19:14,640 Speaker 2: ever said about Trump, including the T shirt of Trumps 317 00:19:14,840 --> 00:19:18,520 Speaker 2: behind bars in an orange jump suit behind bars like 318 00:19:18,600 --> 00:19:22,440 Speaker 2: in the jail cell handcuffs and it says Trump twenty 319 00:19:22,480 --> 00:19:25,560 Speaker 2: twenty four and it's got a little logo on it. 320 00:19:25,960 --> 00:19:28,560 Speaker 2: And then they started quoting from all the things Michael 321 00:19:28,640 --> 00:19:31,280 Speaker 2: Cohen has ever said, and we know there are tons 322 00:19:31,280 --> 00:19:33,960 Speaker 2: of things Michael Cohen has said. We also learned that 323 00:19:34,000 --> 00:19:37,040 Speaker 2: Michael Cohen has made three point four million dollars. 324 00:19:37,359 --> 00:19:39,920 Speaker 1: That was really surprising. Explain how he made. 325 00:19:39,760 --> 00:19:44,439 Speaker 2: You know, well, in two books and podcasts merchandising, but 326 00:19:44,560 --> 00:19:50,080 Speaker 2: it's mainly the book and appearances and speakers speeds, so 327 00:19:50,200 --> 00:19:52,480 Speaker 2: I guess that makes sense. But I mean, if he's 328 00:19:52,560 --> 00:19:56,040 Speaker 2: charging thirty two dollars for a T shirt, Donald Trump 329 00:19:56,119 --> 00:19:58,200 Speaker 2: is charging how much money for a pair of gold 330 00:19:58,240 --> 00:20:01,879 Speaker 2: shoes and one hundred and forty nine dollars, so basically, 331 00:20:02,080 --> 00:20:05,680 Speaker 2: you know, and Stormy Dangels carn't eating, So I mean 332 00:20:05,840 --> 00:20:09,000 Speaker 2: it's kind of crazy. It is a crazy case. I 333 00:20:09,000 --> 00:20:14,159 Speaker 2: mean Todd Blanche accused Cohen of monetizing his hatred of Trump, 334 00:20:14,800 --> 00:20:16,879 Speaker 2: which you know the jury is going to have to 335 00:20:17,000 --> 00:20:20,240 Speaker 2: assess whether he's credible or not. I mean, helping their 336 00:20:20,440 --> 00:20:24,400 Speaker 2: and their decision. Is this wrap of documents that may 337 00:20:24,400 --> 00:20:26,679 Speaker 2: seem like just a bunch of boring pieces of paper, 338 00:20:26,840 --> 00:20:29,920 Speaker 2: but there is a paper trail that, if the jury 339 00:20:29,960 --> 00:20:32,439 Speaker 2: wants to look at it that way, could corroborate the 340 00:20:32,480 --> 00:20:34,240 Speaker 2: story that Michael Cohen says. 341 00:20:34,400 --> 00:20:37,080 Speaker 1: I mean, you said that Weiselberg would be a tough 342 00:20:37,400 --> 00:20:40,600 Speaker 1: witness and not believable. Michael Cohen has more baggage, it seems, 343 00:20:40,600 --> 00:20:41,440 Speaker 1: than Weiseelberg. 344 00:20:42,320 --> 00:20:45,000 Speaker 2: He does, but he does have an essential story to 345 00:20:45,040 --> 00:20:48,040 Speaker 2: tell that does have the ring of truth in white 346 00:20:48,160 --> 00:20:51,520 Speaker 2: of all these documents and in light of prior testimony, 347 00:20:51,560 --> 00:20:55,879 Speaker 2: I mean, historian Pecker's story are at hire seamlessly. The 348 00:20:56,080 --> 00:21:00,320 Speaker 2: only difference in their testimony is David Pecker he was 349 00:21:00,359 --> 00:21:03,080 Speaker 2: taking credits for Donald Trump getting the big idea of 350 00:21:03,160 --> 00:21:06,560 Speaker 2: running for president, that he had done this poll or 351 00:21:06,600 --> 00:21:08,639 Speaker 2: he had seen a poll, and he took us to Trump. 352 00:21:08,840 --> 00:21:12,040 Speaker 2: And then Cohen said in his testimony, which was a 353 00:21:12,040 --> 00:21:15,800 Speaker 2: little tet dish controvitory, that he had seen the poll 354 00:21:16,040 --> 00:21:18,080 Speaker 2: and he took it to Donald Trump, and that he 355 00:21:18,240 --> 00:21:20,800 Speaker 2: convinced Donald Trump to run for president. So both of 356 00:21:20,800 --> 00:21:23,680 Speaker 2: them were trying to claim the big chance. The only 357 00:21:23,720 --> 00:21:27,800 Speaker 2: difference is that David Pecker never severed his relationship with 358 00:21:28,160 --> 00:21:33,520 Speaker 2: Trump and so supirely of him. Meanwhile, Michael Cohen, he 359 00:21:33,640 --> 00:21:37,200 Speaker 2: went to prison for him. So that's where the ill 360 00:21:37,240 --> 00:21:38,200 Speaker 2: wills comes from. 361 00:21:38,520 --> 00:21:42,199 Speaker 1: You can tell a lot on cross if the witness's 362 00:21:42,200 --> 00:21:43,760 Speaker 1: demeanor changes. 363 00:21:43,760 --> 00:21:47,760 Speaker 2: And it did not. He stayed very calm. The questions 364 00:21:47,960 --> 00:21:52,919 Speaker 2: were not as needling as Olena habs. I mean, he 365 00:21:52,960 --> 00:21:56,000 Speaker 2: may come back with more firepower on Thursdays. 366 00:21:55,720 --> 00:21:59,040 Speaker 1: Because I noticed that, for example, the question of whether 367 00:21:59,119 --> 00:22:01,600 Speaker 1: or not he wanted to Trump convicted, the answer is 368 00:22:01,640 --> 00:22:04,240 Speaker 1: pretty obvious. He's the star witness against him, but it 369 00:22:04,320 --> 00:22:08,560 Speaker 1: took Blanche question after question after question after question for 370 00:22:08,640 --> 00:22:09,639 Speaker 1: Cohen to admit it. 371 00:22:09,880 --> 00:22:14,960 Speaker 2: Look, I've covered tons of trials, tons of criminal trial, murder, racketeering, 372 00:22:15,520 --> 00:22:20,920 Speaker 2: financial flaught, you name it, and I've seen plenty across examination. 373 00:22:21,760 --> 00:22:25,080 Speaker 2: It was fine, it was working like and co Winner 374 00:22:25,160 --> 00:22:30,240 Speaker 2: is a lawyer, and I think that the fundamental part 375 00:22:30,240 --> 00:22:33,119 Speaker 2: of his story you should say, there's animus and I 376 00:22:33,119 --> 00:22:35,399 Speaker 2: guess that's what Blanche was trying to depict him as 377 00:22:35,400 --> 00:22:39,760 Speaker 2: being like a tody who was constantly insinuating himself to 378 00:22:39,840 --> 00:22:42,560 Speaker 2: Donald Trump and a loyal acolyte, and then he became 379 00:22:43,040 --> 00:22:47,560 Speaker 2: a vicious trumpeting guy who basically was bent on revenge 380 00:22:47,600 --> 00:22:49,200 Speaker 2: and then on making money off Trump. 381 00:22:49,760 --> 00:22:53,399 Speaker 1: So this is the last prosecution witness. What has the 382 00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:56,280 Speaker 1: defense said about a defense? Will they put on a defense? 383 00:22:56,760 --> 00:23:00,080 Speaker 2: They have not said. They had answered the possibility of 384 00:23:00,200 --> 00:23:05,000 Speaker 2: being allowed to call a witness about elections finance, election fraud, 385 00:23:05,680 --> 00:23:10,240 Speaker 2: and I believe originally that Mershawan is strictly limited what 386 00:23:10,320 --> 00:23:13,560 Speaker 2: that person could stay or bring basically as an expert witness. 387 00:23:13,840 --> 00:23:17,720 Speaker 2: And they also told Mershawn yesterday they haven't decided what 388 00:23:17,760 --> 00:23:20,359 Speaker 2: they're going to do, including whether or not they're going 389 00:23:20,400 --> 00:23:23,520 Speaker 2: to call Trump as a witness, and we're going to 390 00:23:23,560 --> 00:23:26,800 Speaker 2: have to wait and see. I don't think cross will 391 00:23:26,920 --> 00:23:31,080 Speaker 2: end tomorrow because we're ending early at three for the weekend, 392 00:23:31,119 --> 00:23:34,480 Speaker 2: and we're not going to have trial on Friday because 393 00:23:34,520 --> 00:23:38,879 Speaker 2: Trump wants a campaign and attend Bearn Trump's high school graduations. 394 00:23:39,440 --> 00:23:44,000 Speaker 2: So I expect that the redirect will continue into Monday. 395 00:23:44,040 --> 00:23:47,280 Speaker 2: Of Cohen and then I guess we'll see what's going 396 00:23:47,320 --> 00:23:49,000 Speaker 2: to happen with the rest of the week. But the 397 00:23:49,000 --> 00:23:52,080 Speaker 2: defense said they're going to review what the judges previously ruled. 398 00:23:52,200 --> 00:23:55,760 Speaker 1: So the trial is winding down, but there still could 399 00:23:55,800 --> 00:23:58,199 Speaker 1: be a lot happening in the next week, depending on 400 00:23:58,240 --> 00:24:03,120 Speaker 1: the defense. Thanks so much. That's Patricia Hertado, Bloomberg Legal reporter. 401 00:24:03,680 --> 00:24:07,280 Speaker 1: Coming up next on the Bloomberg Law Show. Opening statements 402 00:24:07,280 --> 00:24:11,040 Speaker 1: in the trial of Senator Robert Menendez on bribery charges. 403 00:24:11,560 --> 00:24:13,800 Speaker 1: We'll talk to a reporter who is in the courtroom. 404 00:24:14,240 --> 00:24:19,320 Speaker 1: I'm June Grosso and you're listening to Bloomberg. It's the 405 00:24:19,320 --> 00:24:22,399 Speaker 1: first time in history that a senator has been indicted 406 00:24:22,440 --> 00:24:26,600 Speaker 1: twice in separate bribery cases. It's also the first time 407 00:24:26,640 --> 00:24:30,160 Speaker 1: a senator has been indicted under the foreign agent statute. 408 00:24:30,520 --> 00:24:34,480 Speaker 1: Quite a come down for New Jersey's Democratic Senator Robert Menendez. 409 00:24:34,720 --> 00:24:37,879 Speaker 1: Once a powerful senator and chair of the Senate's Foreign 410 00:24:37,920 --> 00:24:41,919 Speaker 1: Relations Committee. Now he's on trial accused of taking cash, 411 00:24:42,119 --> 00:24:45,639 Speaker 1: gold bars in a luxury car from two businessmen to 412 00:24:45,720 --> 00:24:49,520 Speaker 1: perform favors for them and corruptly help the Egyptian government. 413 00:24:49,960 --> 00:24:53,399 Speaker 1: The trial is taking place in Federal Court in Lower Manhattan, 414 00:24:53,800 --> 00:24:57,040 Speaker 1: not far from the hush money trial of former President 415 00:24:57,080 --> 00:25:01,000 Speaker 1: Donald Trump. Bloomberg Legal reporter David Rikis was in the 416 00:25:01,040 --> 00:25:04,600 Speaker 1: courtroom for the opening statements today, so David. In her 417 00:25:04,640 --> 00:25:08,480 Speaker 1: opening statements, the prosecutor said that this was not politics 418 00:25:08,520 --> 00:25:11,160 Speaker 1: as usual, but politics for profit. 419 00:25:11,640 --> 00:25:16,160 Speaker 3: The prosecutor laid out a very damning portrait of Bob 420 00:25:16,240 --> 00:25:21,239 Speaker 3: Menendez's actions over five years, saying that he sold his 421 00:25:21,400 --> 00:25:27,639 Speaker 3: office to two New Jersey businessmen in exchange for hundreds 422 00:25:27,640 --> 00:25:31,479 Speaker 3: of thousands of dollars of cash and gold bars, and 423 00:25:31,520 --> 00:25:35,520 Speaker 3: that he also used his office to corruptly help the 424 00:25:35,560 --> 00:25:40,200 Speaker 3: Egyptian government and to help out a businessman seeking money 425 00:25:40,400 --> 00:25:46,879 Speaker 3: from Qatar. It was a picture that was not pretty, 426 00:25:47,160 --> 00:25:53,919 Speaker 3: and essentially said that Menendez and his wife worked together 427 00:25:54,280 --> 00:25:59,720 Speaker 3: to receive these bribe payments, and that his wife introduced 428 00:26:00,600 --> 00:26:06,600 Speaker 3: him to Egyptian officials, who then exploited the opportunity to 429 00:26:07,080 --> 00:26:14,399 Speaker 3: benefit from their relationship with Menendez. In response, the senators 430 00:26:14,520 --> 00:26:19,719 Speaker 3: lawyer said that he never took any corrupt actions and 431 00:26:19,760 --> 00:26:23,440 Speaker 3: that there are innocent explanations for the cash and the gold. 432 00:26:24,000 --> 00:26:28,000 Speaker 3: The gold, who said had been in his wife, Nadine's 433 00:26:28,040 --> 00:26:33,320 Speaker 3: family for many years, and he acknowledged that she received 434 00:26:33,400 --> 00:26:38,080 Speaker 3: gold from one of the businessmen who's on trial, Fred Davies, 435 00:26:38,440 --> 00:26:43,400 Speaker 3: but he said that the Senator had no knowledge of 436 00:26:43,440 --> 00:26:47,160 Speaker 3: her receiving this gold until after he moved in with her. 437 00:26:47,280 --> 00:26:50,199 Speaker 3: This was a second merriage to both of them. He 438 00:26:50,280 --> 00:26:54,359 Speaker 3: also said that Menendez had been in the habit for 439 00:26:54,520 --> 00:26:57,840 Speaker 3: thirty years of taking cash out of the bank and 440 00:26:58,000 --> 00:27:00,800 Speaker 3: keeping it in his house, and that he would take 441 00:27:00,840 --> 00:27:03,280 Speaker 3: it out in amounts of four hundred to five hundred 442 00:27:03,359 --> 00:27:08,520 Speaker 3: dollars several times a month. And that's the explanation for 443 00:27:08,920 --> 00:27:12,679 Speaker 3: more than four thousand dollars seized by a sci agent 444 00:27:13,160 --> 00:27:16,879 Speaker 3: in his house in twenty twenty two, for in the 445 00:27:16,920 --> 00:27:19,879 Speaker 3: house that he shared with his wife, Nadine, and that 446 00:27:19,960 --> 00:27:23,480 Speaker 3: there was no corrupt intent and that he did not 447 00:27:23,640 --> 00:27:25,960 Speaker 3: receive any bribes at all of cash or gold. 448 00:27:26,680 --> 00:27:29,800 Speaker 1: I think we all remember the pictures after the raid 449 00:27:29,960 --> 00:27:33,880 Speaker 1: of the cash stuffed into a jacket and the gold bars. 450 00:27:34,240 --> 00:27:35,879 Speaker 1: Did the jury see that today? 451 00:27:36,320 --> 00:27:40,119 Speaker 3: They did not see those pictures. No, But you know, 452 00:27:40,359 --> 00:27:45,399 Speaker 3: good defense lawyer Alve Weisman for Bob Menendez spent a 453 00:27:45,440 --> 00:27:48,119 Speaker 3: good deal of time trying to explain that because he 454 00:27:48,240 --> 00:27:52,120 Speaker 3: understands how explosive that evidence is and he knows that 455 00:27:52,160 --> 00:27:55,240 Speaker 3: he needs to deal with it head on. It looks 456 00:27:55,400 --> 00:27:58,000 Speaker 3: very bad for us senator to have so much cash 457 00:27:58,040 --> 00:28:01,840 Speaker 3: in house for anyone. Well, he came up with the 458 00:28:01,880 --> 00:28:05,919 Speaker 3: explanation that this is a long standing habit for the 459 00:28:05,960 --> 00:28:09,200 Speaker 3: senator to collect cash, and he says that he has 460 00:28:09,280 --> 00:28:12,320 Speaker 3: bank records to prove it, going back thirty years. 461 00:28:12,840 --> 00:28:16,280 Speaker 1: He tried to get his wife's trial severed and it 462 00:28:16,359 --> 00:28:19,360 Speaker 1: was rejected, but now she's going to be tried later, 463 00:28:19,440 --> 00:28:20,480 Speaker 1: explain what happened. 464 00:28:20,880 --> 00:28:25,520 Speaker 3: Nadine Menendez developed an illness that has not been disclosed 465 00:28:25,680 --> 00:28:31,920 Speaker 3: that requires surgery, and so after rejecting earlier requests to 466 00:28:32,080 --> 00:28:36,760 Speaker 3: sever her from the trial, that judge agreed a couple 467 00:28:36,800 --> 00:28:40,360 Speaker 3: of months ago to give her her own trial because 468 00:28:40,400 --> 00:28:43,520 Speaker 3: of this illness and the time she will need to 469 00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:45,080 Speaker 3: recover from her surgery. 470 00:28:45,760 --> 00:28:49,120 Speaker 1: Is Menandez going to blame his wife for this? 471 00:28:49,960 --> 00:28:54,200 Speaker 3: He blamed his wife. His lawyer blamed his wife in 472 00:28:54,240 --> 00:28:58,120 Speaker 3: the opening statement in several different ways, saying that the 473 00:28:58,160 --> 00:29:03,640 Speaker 3: two co descendants were longtime friends of maybe Menendez who 474 00:29:04,280 --> 00:29:08,760 Speaker 3: entered into transactions with her that he didn't know about, 475 00:29:09,360 --> 00:29:12,720 Speaker 3: that they gave her gifts that he didn't know about, 476 00:29:13,080 --> 00:29:16,560 Speaker 3: and that she was in financial distress in a way 477 00:29:16,600 --> 00:29:19,520 Speaker 3: that he didn't fully appreciate, and that they were trying 478 00:29:19,560 --> 00:29:22,560 Speaker 3: to help her out, not bribe him. 479 00:29:23,240 --> 00:29:24,240 Speaker 1: Are they still together. 480 00:29:25,040 --> 00:29:29,280 Speaker 3: They are still together, although his lawyer said that when 481 00:29:29,320 --> 00:29:32,440 Speaker 3: he was in Washington he was essentially reading a separate 482 00:29:32,560 --> 00:29:33,280 Speaker 3: life from her. 483 00:29:34,360 --> 00:29:36,560 Speaker 1: It's never a good look to blame your wife, but 484 00:29:36,720 --> 00:29:39,680 Speaker 1: it's certainly better if your wife is not being tried 485 00:29:39,760 --> 00:29:43,360 Speaker 1: with you. So he's lucky in that respect that her 486 00:29:43,400 --> 00:29:44,600 Speaker 1: trial was severed from his. 487 00:29:45,400 --> 00:29:48,400 Speaker 3: Is One of the reasons that he wanted a separate 488 00:29:48,520 --> 00:29:53,400 Speaker 3: trial initially was because of the spousal privilege. He wanted 489 00:29:53,440 --> 00:29:58,040 Speaker 3: to be able to make excliminating statements about her if 490 00:29:58,080 --> 00:30:02,960 Speaker 3: he testified, and now it appears clearly that he's prepared 491 00:30:03,000 --> 00:30:03,440 Speaker 3: to do that. 492 00:30:03,920 --> 00:30:06,160 Speaker 1: Did he testified his last trial. 493 00:30:06,320 --> 00:30:08,840 Speaker 3: He did not. That was the one in twenty seventeen 494 00:30:09,000 --> 00:30:12,360 Speaker 3: where he was accused in a separate corruption case in 495 00:30:12,400 --> 00:30:17,600 Speaker 3: New Jersey and the jury did not be to unanimous verdict. 496 00:30:17,720 --> 00:30:20,360 Speaker 3: There was a hung jury and a mistriald declared, and 497 00:30:20,480 --> 00:30:23,160 Speaker 3: the Justice Department then dropped that case. 498 00:30:23,800 --> 00:30:26,640 Speaker 1: What the defense is going to try to do is 499 00:30:26,720 --> 00:30:29,320 Speaker 1: show that he did not have corrupt intent. 500 00:30:29,440 --> 00:30:32,680 Speaker 3: Is that it correct right and that these were all 501 00:30:33,480 --> 00:30:36,160 Speaker 3: legal actions that he took. He didn't take any corrupt 502 00:30:36,200 --> 00:30:38,720 Speaker 3: official acts in exchange for bribes. 503 00:30:39,360 --> 00:30:43,640 Speaker 1: Now, a fifth defendant has already pleaded guilty. Tell us 504 00:30:43,680 --> 00:30:44,960 Speaker 1: about that guilty plea. 505 00:30:45,360 --> 00:30:50,720 Speaker 3: Jose Euribe was an insurance broker and he owned a 506 00:30:50,800 --> 00:30:55,680 Speaker 3: trucking business in New Jersey. He pleaded guilty and admitted 507 00:30:55,760 --> 00:31:01,440 Speaker 3: that he bribed Senator Menendez and his wife with a 508 00:31:01,680 --> 00:31:07,600 Speaker 3: Mercedes Benz after she needed one, and in exchange for that, 509 00:31:08,440 --> 00:31:14,400 Speaker 3: he said that the Senator interceded on his behalf to 510 00:31:14,560 --> 00:31:20,520 Speaker 3: try to get two criminal investigations in New Jersey that 511 00:31:20,600 --> 00:31:24,680 Speaker 3: were handled by the state Attorney General resolved in a 512 00:31:24,720 --> 00:31:30,440 Speaker 3: favorable manner. One involved defendant who was already under indictment 513 00:31:30,560 --> 00:31:34,600 Speaker 3: who have been pleted guilty, and another was a close 514 00:31:34,720 --> 00:31:39,080 Speaker 3: friend of Uribe who was under criminal investigation who ultimately 515 00:31:39,160 --> 00:31:43,680 Speaker 3: was never criminally charged. Is he GiB cleted guilty and 516 00:31:43,960 --> 00:31:48,400 Speaker 3: will be testifying at trial against the Menendez according to 517 00:31:48,440 --> 00:31:49,200 Speaker 3: the prosecutor. 518 00:31:49,520 --> 00:31:53,000 Speaker 1: Prosecutors have said that they expect to call dozens of witnesses, 519 00:31:53,760 --> 00:31:58,360 Speaker 1: likely some of the law enforcement officials who Menendez allegedly 520 00:31:58,560 --> 00:32:02,120 Speaker 1: pressured to drop in investigations, So that would include the 521 00:32:02,120 --> 00:32:05,880 Speaker 1: top federal prosecutor in New Jersey, the US attorney. 522 00:32:06,080 --> 00:32:09,960 Speaker 3: Yes, that's correct. That still Selander is the US attorney, 523 00:32:10,200 --> 00:32:14,880 Speaker 3: and Gerbier gray Wall, who's the former US attorney in 524 00:32:15,000 --> 00:32:18,520 Speaker 3: New Jersey and is now the enforcement chief at the 525 00:32:18,560 --> 00:32:22,760 Speaker 3: Security is In Exchange Commission. They're expected to testify at 526 00:32:22,760 --> 00:32:23,240 Speaker 3: the trial. 527 00:32:23,680 --> 00:32:28,680 Speaker 1: The judge issued a ruling yesterday that will prevent Menandez 528 00:32:28,680 --> 00:32:33,880 Speaker 1: from presenting testimony from a psychiatrist who evaluated him right. 529 00:32:34,680 --> 00:32:39,640 Speaker 3: Menendez wanted to present a psychiatrist who would say that 530 00:32:40,120 --> 00:32:47,040 Speaker 3: Menendez had lasting psychological trauma caused by his parents fleeing 531 00:32:47,200 --> 00:32:52,520 Speaker 3: Cuba sixty years ago and having their cash confiscated, so 532 00:32:52,640 --> 00:32:58,320 Speaker 3: that's the reason why he essentially hoarded cash. And the 533 00:32:58,440 --> 00:33:01,680 Speaker 3: judge did not allow that because he didn't think that 534 00:33:01,760 --> 00:33:07,280 Speaker 3: he was properly introducing this psychiatrist as an expert. And 535 00:33:08,480 --> 00:33:16,440 Speaker 3: there was also the argument that Menendez's father committed suicide, 536 00:33:17,080 --> 00:33:23,400 Speaker 3: that he had been a compulsive gambler, and he when 537 00:33:23,720 --> 00:33:28,320 Speaker 3: Menendez was a young man, he discontinued paying off his 538 00:33:28,520 --> 00:33:31,840 Speaker 3: father's gambling debts, and that that was such a trauma 539 00:33:31,960 --> 00:33:37,320 Speaker 3: to him that serves as an explanation for why Menendez 540 00:33:37,480 --> 00:33:38,479 Speaker 3: was parting cash. 541 00:33:38,920 --> 00:33:41,200 Speaker 1: It doesn't sound like a complicated case, but it is 542 00:33:41,240 --> 00:33:43,160 Speaker 1: a complicated case for the jury. 543 00:33:42,920 --> 00:33:46,360 Speaker 3: Rights well, the trials expected the last almost two months. 544 00:33:46,560 --> 00:33:51,880 Speaker 3: There's another different official acts that will be considered spans 545 00:33:52,040 --> 00:33:55,920 Speaker 3: five years of time. There's a lot of cash and 546 00:33:56,120 --> 00:34:03,680 Speaker 3: gold bars to explain, and there's essentially three different bribe 547 00:34:03,680 --> 00:34:08,279 Speaker 3: schemes that are interwoven that the government needs to prove 548 00:34:08,360 --> 00:34:11,760 Speaker 3: to make their case. In some ways, it's a simple case. 549 00:34:11,920 --> 00:34:14,760 Speaker 3: The government says he's a corrupt senator who took bride, 550 00:34:15,520 --> 00:34:18,160 Speaker 3: but the details of proving that are going to take 551 00:34:18,200 --> 00:34:19,240 Speaker 3: a lot of time and effort. 552 00:34:19,920 --> 00:34:21,799 Speaker 1: Thanks so much, David. We'll talk with you as the 553 00:34:21,840 --> 00:34:26,439 Speaker 1: trial proceeds. That's David Voriakuz, Bloomberg Legal Reporter. And that's 554 00:34:26,440 --> 00:34:29,440 Speaker 1: it for this edition of the Bloomberg Law Podcast. Remember 555 00:34:29,440 --> 00:34:32,160 Speaker 1: you can always get the latest legal news by subscribing 556 00:34:32,200 --> 00:34:35,680 Speaker 1: and listening to the show on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and 557 00:34:35,760 --> 00:34:39,719 Speaker 1: at Bloomberg dot com, Slash podcast, Slash Law. I'm June 558 00:34:39,760 --> 00:34:41,920 Speaker 1: Grosso and this is Bloomberg