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Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to Save for Protection of I Heart Radio.

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Speaker 1: I'm Anny Reese and I'm Lauren Vogelbaum, and today we

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Speaker 1: have an episode for you about frog legs. Yeah. This

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Speaker 1: one goes places just like frogs do. Oh yeah, hey

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Speaker 1: yeah absolutely it does. Oh I let frogs are so

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Speaker 1: cute like that was That was the most upsetting wonderful

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Speaker 1: part about this research is I was like, every time

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Speaker 1: I opened a page there was a picture of a frog,

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Speaker 1: and I was like, look about adorable frog. It's gonna

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Speaker 1: be tasty. Mm hmm. It's a strange place to be.

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Speaker 1: It's a mixed bag of emotions, for sure. For sure,

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Speaker 1: I do have a lot of The more I thought

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Speaker 1: about it, the more I'm like, I've had a lot

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Speaker 1: of frog memories throughout my life. Not necessary frog legs, um,

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Speaker 1: but I grew up near a pond and I would

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Speaker 1: just remember catching tadpoles when I was a kid nothing

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Speaker 1: and I love doing that. I played a lot of

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Speaker 1: leap frog as a kid. And then recently I was

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Speaker 1: fortunate enough to get to go to a beach house

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Speaker 1: with some friends of mine and when we were coming back,

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Speaker 1: we were almost back to Atlanta, and this little frog

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Speaker 1: just jumps onto the windshield out of nowhere inside the car.

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Speaker 1: Oh and I've never seen like such quick panic that

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Speaker 1: is also quickly contained because we're gonna move in vehicle.

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Speaker 1: But it was a tiny, that little sweet frog. Um.

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Speaker 1: But we all panicked and then we're like, stay calm,

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Speaker 1: stay calm, and the frog just kept bouncing and trying

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Speaker 1: to get out of the windshield and bounce to one

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Speaker 1: end and to the other end, to the one end.

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Speaker 1: And then we got back to Atlanta. I let the

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Speaker 1: frog out. I put some water on it and then

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Speaker 1: let it go. And I hope if you're out there

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Speaker 1: frog and you're listening to podcast, won't congrats, because this

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Speaker 1: is probably not your episode. You should be listening to

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Speaker 1: you now. Yeah, no, no no, no, no no, turn this one off, buddy.

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Speaker 1: Yeah you heard the story, and now that's the end.

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Speaker 1: But then I recently got to go back. Another frog

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Speaker 1: got in the car, and I was like trying to

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Speaker 1: get back to see his buddy make it back. Unfortunately,

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Speaker 1: Oh I'm sorry. Well the sun oh yeah, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I know it can be very warm, very too warm

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Speaker 1: for frogs in cars. Yeah, it was. It was um.

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Speaker 1: And then you know, just because I have to throw

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Speaker 1: a Star Wars difference and every time I came. They're

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Speaker 1: very popular and fan fiction right now because of the

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Speaker 1: whole group. Yeah, but all that aside. I've had frog

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Speaker 1: legs once, ostensibly a food show. Ye. How what was

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Speaker 1: your frog leg eating experience? Like? I liked them, um,

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Speaker 1: And that's honestly, I probably didn't get the best frog legs.

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Speaker 1: I remember liking them and thinking they tasted like chicken,

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Speaker 1: But it wasn't a super memorable experience for me when

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Speaker 1: when I got them. I thought it would be because

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Speaker 1: frog legs was a new thing to me, is it.

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Speaker 1: I was pretty young when this happened. Um, But yeah,

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Speaker 1: I just basically remember m taste good. Yeah. Yeah, I

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Speaker 1: think I possibly had them as a kid at some point,

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Speaker 1: but for sure I ate them. A few years ago

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Speaker 1: here in Atlanta, there's a like Vietnamese slash Southern restaurant

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Speaker 1: called Poor Calvin's Um kind of downtown and it's great um.

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Speaker 1: And yeah, they had a they had a really good

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Speaker 1: like like fried frog legs, like deep fried frog legs

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Speaker 1: appetizer and they were lovely. I was like, well, this

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Speaker 1: is delicious and I'm into it. That sounds so good. Yeah, um. Uh,

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Speaker 1: I have seen them on menus around town. Other than that, though,

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Speaker 1: I think um jen Chans and abbage Town had like

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Speaker 1: a lemon pepper wet frog legs situation recently. I'm like,

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Speaker 1: that's so good. Um there there is a national frog

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Speaker 1: leg holiday here in the United States. It's February. Let

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Speaker 1: that sink in a sec. It only happens on leap here. Uh.

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Speaker 1: I was like, are they just? Is that some weird

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Speaker 1: like she that frog legs only get one every four years? Okay,

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Speaker 1: all right. I will also say another lovely thing in

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Speaker 1: doing this reading was that that there are so many puns,

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Speaker 1: just so many. Oh yes, so many reporters enjoying so

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Speaker 1: many puns. It's a beautiful thing to see. It is

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Speaker 1: just like frogs and then we eat them. So I

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Speaker 1: guess this brings us to question, sure, sure, frog legs,

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Speaker 1: what are they? Well, frog legs are the hind legs

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Speaker 1: of certain species of frogs, harvested and skinned and bony

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Speaker 1: feet removed, then cooked up however you like, often on

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Speaker 1: the bone in stews or sauteed or grilled or breaded

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Speaker 1: and deep fried. The texture and taste is basically like

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Speaker 1: chicken wing flats. Yeah, um like tender and moist with

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Speaker 1: a little bit of chew um and a flavor like

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Speaker 1: a like a chicken slash mild seafood crossover. Yeah. They

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Speaker 1: look like like just really cute little ba donks. Every

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Speaker 1: time I see them, I'm just like, am I going

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Speaker 1: to eat that cute little bit donk? And then I'm like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I am, Yeah, that's that's what's about to happen. Um.

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Speaker 1: They're like, um, they're like the chicken of the pond.

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Speaker 1: Oh if no one's taking that, Lauren, that's pretty good,

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Speaker 1: thank you. Yeah, yeah, that's definitely a frog leg producers

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Speaker 1: get in touch um uh. Frogs um broadly are amphibians

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Speaker 1: that live in and around bodies of usually fresh water. UM.

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Speaker 1: They have a permeable skin that water and oxygen can

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Speaker 1: pass through, so yeah, they have to have a lot

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Speaker 1: of water in their environments. UM frogs are specialized to

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Speaker 1: be powerful jumpers thanks to their beef behind legs, which

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Speaker 1: helps them move quickly when catching prey and or avoiding

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Speaker 1: being caught. Um. The muscles in their hind legs are

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Speaker 1: really the only like meaty part of a frog and

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Speaker 1: can account for like of a frog's mass. Whoa yeah, yeah. Um.

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Speaker 1: But even accounting for that, like of frogs are really small. Um. Oh,

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Speaker 1: you just got so excited. I I agree. I like

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Speaker 1: have you seen the video of the little frogs that

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Speaker 1: are too little to jump good? Like they're so tiny

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Speaker 1: that they don't have a good like sense of balance

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Speaker 1: developed in their inner frog ear or however that works,

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Speaker 1: and they just they just never land right because they're

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Speaker 1: too small. Yeah, it's o um Okay, back to ostensibly

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Speaker 1: a food show here we go. Um. Yes, of the

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Speaker 1: over seven thousand species of frogs around the world, only

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Speaker 1: a few grow large enough to be considered like worth

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Speaker 1: catching and eating. Um. Also, like, lots of them secrete

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Speaker 1: toxins from their skin to discourage predators that happened to

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Speaker 1: get ahold of them despite their power legs. Um, and

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Speaker 1: you generally don't want to mess with that. Also. Also,

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Speaker 1: although frogs can be farmed kind of um, not profitably, uh,

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Speaker 1: they're they're often wild caught and over how ting has

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Speaker 1: seriously endangered the populations of a few species that have

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Speaker 1: been like traditionally used for food. So a handful of

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Speaker 1: species are eaten around the world, maybe like fifteen to

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Speaker 1: twenty um. But ideally as a consumer in like the

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Speaker 1: United States or Europe especially UM you're looking at either

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Speaker 1: the American bullfrog or UM the European common frog also

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Speaker 1: called UM the European edible frog. UM. Bullfrogs are like

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Speaker 1: a little bit bigger, like three to six inches that's

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Speaker 1: like eight to fifteen centimeters from snout to vent um

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Speaker 1: no no nose to but yeah, versus like two to

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Speaker 1: five inches or five to eleven centimeters for the common frog. UM.

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Speaker 1: Either way, their their legs outstretched will be about that long.

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Speaker 1: Frog is a pretty like neutrally flavored meat, so it's

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Speaker 1: a great base for strong flavors UM heavy spices like garlic,

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Speaker 1: butter um. If you are into eating things off the

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Speaker 1: bone own um, there really is a certain satisfaction to it. Yes, agreed,

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Speaker 1: local harvest of frogs tends to be fairly regulated UM.

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Speaker 1: In the United States, for example, like most of the

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Speaker 1: fifty states do have specific catch limits that are like

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Speaker 1: a dozen or so per person per day at most

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Speaker 1: during particular seasons. UM. And partially because of this and

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Speaker 1: a bunch of other issues we're going to talk about

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Speaker 1: at length, UM, as a consumer, it can be difficult

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Speaker 1: to make educated choices when you're sourcing frog legs because

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Speaker 1: exported products are often just the skinned, frozen legs, which

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Speaker 1: is good for preventing the spread of microbes that can

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Speaker 1: cause infection of local animals if they get into local waterways,

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Speaker 1: but also means that you can't visually identify the species

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Speaker 1: that you're buying. Um. And like with many other like

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Speaker 1: seafood related products, there's a lot of miss un you're

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Speaker 1: standing to deliberate dishonesty in labeling. Um. It does not

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Speaker 1: help that one of the species that's doing okay is

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Speaker 1: literally called the edible frog. So you know, someone's like, oh,

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Speaker 1: what kind of frog is this? Oh, it's an edible frog. Uh.

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Speaker 1: It's really up to local governments to regulate and codify

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Speaker 1: harvesting and sales practices, and many of them have done that. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but there is still work to be done. Yes, yes, yes, yes. Um.

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Speaker 1: Well what about the nutrition? Uh well, it perhaps obviously

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Speaker 1: depends on exactly how much garlic butter Uh you're using here? Um,

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Speaker 1: but but frog meat is uh, you know, chocolate protein,

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Speaker 1: fairly lean, got a decent spread of micronutrients. Um. Uh,

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Speaker 1: eat a vegetable that isn't garlic butter. If you insist, Lauren.

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Speaker 1: If you insist, well, car like butter, is its own

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Speaker 1: food group, I say, but it is all right. Well

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Speaker 1: what we do I've got I'm messing up, I'm messing

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Speaker 1: up my questions, Lauren. We do have some numbers for you.

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Speaker 1: We do. UM. As of an estimated hundred million to

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Speaker 1: four hundred million frogs were exported as food every year

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Speaker 1: around the world. UM. But it is hard to track

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Speaker 1: outside of imports and exports and like legal farms. UM.

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Speaker 1: In the early two thousands, the United Nations estimated that

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Speaker 1: as many as a billion wild frogs were being caught

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Speaker 1: for food every year. Wow. Yeah wow um. According to

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Speaker 1: one source I found, the French consumer estimated one hundred

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Speaker 1: and sixty million frog legs annually, and Indonesia makes up

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Speaker 1: eight of the European import market. The US is the

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Speaker 1: second largest importer, with around two thousand, two hundred and

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Speaker 1: eighty tons of legs per year. We can see about

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Speaker 1: the supply a year. But according to some things I

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Speaker 1: read again, we are set to surpass France and Belgium

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Speaker 1: to become the largest consumers of frog lugs. Oh wow uh.

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Speaker 1: Those numbers have to have been from before Indonesia. UM

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Speaker 1: band from before, which is when Indonesia put kind of

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Speaker 1: a crackdown on exports. UM. But hoofta, yeah, I think

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Speaker 1: that the numbers of importation are still about the same

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Speaker 1: from wherever they're coming from. Yes, by the end of

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Speaker 1: the tents, the frog meat market was worth about forty

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Speaker 1: million dollars around the world. And just to give you

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Speaker 1: an idea of like a like an example of some

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Speaker 1: of these wild harvesting operations UM in Turkey, um in

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Speaker 1: in commercial wild harvesting operations UM as of harvesters sometimes

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Speaker 1: collected as many as three thousand frogs in a single night,

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Speaker 1: like per person UM. That's about hundred and thirty pounds

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Speaker 1: or sixty kilo's worth of frogs worth up to five

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Speaker 1: dollars and fifty cents a pound. Wow. Um, it's a

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Speaker 1: big industry. UM speaking of, there are frog leg festivals UM.

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Speaker 1: One of them is in the US in Fellsmere, Florida.

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Speaker 1: Every January that's about an hour outside of Orlando. Three

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Speaker 1: will be its thirty second year. UM. They offer deep

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Speaker 1: fried frog legs and gatortail bites, and you can add

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Speaker 1: grits and cole slaw and hush puppies to make it

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Speaker 1: a dinner. During the pandemic, they've offered a drive through

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Speaker 1: pickup option. UM. It's recorded some eighty thousand attendees in

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Speaker 1: a single year, serving some seven thousand pounds of frog legs. WHOA,

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Speaker 1: yeah yeah. There's also one every July in France outside

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Speaker 1: of um Anger, which serves up some eighty thousand frogs

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Speaker 1: every year to some ten thousand attendees. UM as they

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Speaker 1: were still mostly imparted from Indonesia, and interestingly, for for

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Speaker 1: both of these festivals, they didn't begin because frog legs

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Speaker 1: are like some incredibly common dish in the region, but

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Speaker 1: rather because sometime during the nineteen nineties the organizers thought

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Speaker 1: it would be like an unusual tourist attraction, and it

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Speaker 1: has turned out to be so. UM Another in France,

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Speaker 1: um in battel Um does come out of a local

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Speaker 1: tradition of frog farming UM, having been founded by a

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Speaker 1: local restaurantur and farmer. The festival is run by the

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Speaker 1: town's brotherhood of frog thigh Tasters. WHOA, WHOA, what sounds serious.

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Speaker 1: I love the seriousness that that sounds like. Um yes uh.

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Speaker 1: As of two thousand nine, the festival was hosting some

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Speaker 1: twenty thousand attendees serving up to seven metric tons of

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Speaker 1: frog legs. Um saute aid with all manner of French

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Speaker 1: sauces or in kiche, in torts, in omelets, in castlets,

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Speaker 1: in soufle, in grotin, and in pizza. I love that

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Speaker 1: the frogs also are imported. Um. Yeah, also chocolate frogs

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Speaker 1: always always um. Up to one third of the amphibian

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Speaker 1: population are on the verge of extinction yep uh. And

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Speaker 1: this isn't entirely due to the overharvesting of frogs, but

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Speaker 1: frogs in general are a sort of like litmus species,

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Speaker 1: as sort of canary in a coal mine for environmental

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Speaker 1: changes in our fresh water ways. Um. You know, frogs

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Speaker 1: are are delicate creatures and they have that tadpole stage

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Speaker 1: that um that is entirely water dependent, right um. And

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Speaker 1: so when pollution or climate change or insect die offs

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Speaker 1: or agricultural land changes or whatever begins affecting an area's ecosystem,

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Speaker 1: frog populations are some of the first and most visibly affected. Yes. Um.

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Speaker 1: And kind of a funny slash sad cultural note in here. Um.

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Speaker 1: In the Muppet Movie, after being asked to be the

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Speaker 1: spokesperson for a fast food restaurant that specializes in frog legs,

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Speaker 1: Kermit the Frog says, all I can see are millions

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Speaker 1: of frogs with tiny crutches. Also, I do not have

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Speaker 1: a Kermit the Frog impression, so I did not try it.

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Speaker 1: But you can do the work in your head. You

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Speaker 1: got it. And speaking of doing the work, we have

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Speaker 1: a long history to get through with this one. Oh

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Speaker 1: we do, and we are going to get into that

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Speaker 1: as soon as we get back from a quick break

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Speaker 1: for a word from our sponsors, and we're back. Thank you, sponsor, Yes,

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Speaker 1: thank you. So frogs are quite old, quite um. Some

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Speaker 1: evidence indicates they've been around for at least two hundred

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Speaker 1: million years, and that's dinosaur territory, so that's yeah old

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Speaker 1: evolutionarily speaking, they've been what they are for quite a

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Speaker 1: long time. But when it comes to the eating of frogs,

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Speaker 1: and specifically frog legs, recent uncovered evidence suggests that the

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Speaker 1: British were eating frog legs over ten thousand years ago

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Speaker 1: in an area close to Stonehenge, and in the way

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Speaker 1: that the media likes to do there like the British

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Speaker 1: got there first stop the French, yes um, eating frogs

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Speaker 1: probably was a convenient option for our hunter gatherer ancestors.

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Speaker 1: They were like a small, quickly cooked snack field protein

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Speaker 1: snack like protein snack filled snack leg either way, you

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Speaker 1: know what I mean? Yeah, yes, thank you, Lauren Umar.

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Speaker 1: According to the historical record, frog legs were being eaten

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Speaker 1: on a regular basis in southern China as early as

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Speaker 1: the first century CE. The Aztecs ate them too. However,

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Speaker 1: despite current popular understanding, mentions of frog legs eating frog

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Speaker 1: legs didn't pop up in Europe until the twelfth century

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Speaker 1: ce UM when they were first mentioned in relation to

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Speaker 1: the Catholic Church in France. And I don't know how

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Speaker 1: much I believe this, but apparently the church authorities were

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Speaker 1: wary of their monks gaining too much weight, so they

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Speaker 1: decreed that they can consume meat a certain number of

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Speaker 1: days a year, and to get around this, the monks

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Speaker 1: determined that frogs counted as fish, so they could eat

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Speaker 1: frog legs. Whenever. I thought it was gonna be another

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Speaker 1: lent thing, um, but sure, right either way, whatever it is, Um.

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Speaker 1: Improverished French folks followed the lead of the church and

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Speaker 1: people in the Church, and soon frog legs gained an

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Speaker 1: association with France and French cuisine. In the grand Dictionneio

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Speaker 1: di Cuisine, written by Alexandre Dumas in the sixteen hundreds

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Speaker 1: and published later in the eighteen hundreds, someone in South

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Speaker 1: France was making quote a most considerable fortune with frogs

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Speaker 1: sent to him from his region, which he fattened and

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Speaker 1: then sold to the very finest restaurants in Paris, where

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Speaker 1: this food stuff was very much in fashion. So in

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Speaker 1: this book from the sixteen hundreds, um with the rise

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Speaker 1: of hult cuisine in the eighteen hundreds, the use of

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Speaker 1: frog legs only rose in France, as did they perceived frenchness. Um.

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Speaker 1: When the French set up colonies in areas like New Orleans,

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Speaker 1: they brought their taste for frog legs with them, which

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Speaker 1: helps solidify that perception around the world of France and

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Speaker 1: frog legs. Frog Legs did grow in popularity in Britain

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Speaker 1: in the late eighteen hundreds early nineteen hundreds, and it

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Speaker 1: was considered a delicacy there at the time. In eight

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Speaker 1: august Escoffier put together a dish that translated was called

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Speaker 1: flies of the Dawn nymphs for a big party for

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Speaker 1: the Prince of Wales in London. That's also pretty solid. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: the dawn and nymphs, nymphs, that's pretty good. Um. The

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Speaker 1: addition involved imported bullfrogs and they were seasoned with paprika

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Speaker 1: or paprika herbs, bullion and covered with tarragon and chicken chilly.

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Speaker 1: It's pretty good. Yeah. According to the Oxford Companion of Food,

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Speaker 1: Alan Davidson wrote about the more modern disdain the British

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Speaker 1: have had. I think it's changed, but have had towards

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Speaker 1: eating frog legs. Quote. Why the idea of eating frog

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Speaker 1: legs should be repellent to the English in particular is

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Speaker 1: mildly puzzling. May have something to do with the ugly

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Speaker 1: to human beings, appearance of the creatures, or the thought

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Speaker 1: that they emerge all slimy from evil smelling bonds. Okay, ugly, hey, hey,

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Speaker 1: pardon those things are heck and adorable. I agree, check

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Speaker 1: yourself right anyway, emerge slimy from evil smelling bonds. I

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Speaker 1: love this idea that we're like still stung up on

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Speaker 1: fairy tales you read as children like. Uh well. However,

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Speaker 1: century British cookbook by Robert May had a recipe for

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Speaker 1: a pie made with live frogs that would quote cause

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Speaker 1: much delight and would make women quote skip and shriek.

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Speaker 1: So I'm sure this is one of those things where like, oh, surprised,

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Speaker 1: Like it's just a pie crest filled with live animals.

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Speaker 1: Isn't this fun at a dinner table? Isn't this fun

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Speaker 1: at a hoot? And everyone runs away screaming fogs everywhere.

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Speaker 1: In nineteen twelve, tons of frog legs were produced, consumed,

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Speaker 1: and shipped out of Detroit. Um. Yes, are all together. Obviously,

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Speaker 1: you can't both consume and ship out. That's not what

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Speaker 1: we're talking about here, right, Okay, good, good clarity point,

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Speaker 1: Thank you Annie, thank you. Um. And this was largely

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Speaker 1: due to the French Canadian population in Detroit or in

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Speaker 1: that area too. UM. At the time, frog legs were

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Speaker 1: pretty popular in America. President Cover Cleveland named them his

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Speaker 1: favorite meal, and by the nineteen forties, or at least

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Speaker 1: by the nineteen forties, they were a popular appetizer in California. UM,

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Speaker 1: and I would imagine in several other places. Okay, yep.

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Speaker 1: Stepping back to the nineteen thirties, the American Frog Canning

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Speaker 1: Company released a flyer promising some good money for folks

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Speaker 1: willing to breed giant rocks. The desire for frog meat

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Speaker 1: outstripped the supply, so this seemed like a pretty solid

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Speaker 1: business opportunity to a lot of people. That company's founder,

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Speaker 1: Albert Broll, was determined to develop the frog like industry

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Speaker 1: here in America. In one portrait in front of their

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Speaker 1: headquarters in New Orleans, he and his wife are pictured

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Speaker 1: by a statue statues of frogs whose light of eyes

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Speaker 1: allegedly glowed red in the night. Wow. Okay, that's that

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Speaker 1: sounds that sounds like a like a horror it does, Okay,

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Speaker 1: but I'm excited about it. Good, that's great, Thank you U.

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Speaker 1: Role promised that for those breeders who entered the frog

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Speaker 1: like market, the frog breeding market, they would make quite

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Speaker 1: a profit. And Roll claimed through various stories that his

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Speaker 1: mother was his inspiration for entering the frog business, so

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Speaker 1: he had like the story he would tell to try

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Speaker 1: to get people to join him. He was a top

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Speaker 1: name in the American frog industry and came up with

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Speaker 1: products like giant frog gumbo frog a La King barbecue,

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Speaker 1: Giant bullfrog sandwich is, American Giant bullfog pie, Giant bullfrog oumelets,

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Speaker 1: and giant bullfrog pineapple salad. Yes, of course, yeah, why not?

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Speaker 1: Why not? At one point, Broll claimed that someone could

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Speaker 1: make three hundred sixty billion dollars growing frogs. Yes, okay, yes,

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Speaker 1: he himself later wrote to an Ohio newspaper it was

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Speaker 1: quote simply published as I published all other things of

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Speaker 1: interest to people engaged in the frog business. I think

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Speaker 1: you will agree with me that such a statement is

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Speaker 1: so ridiculous upon its face that it could not seriously

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Speaker 1: influence the judgment of anyone deliberating as to whether or

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Speaker 1: not he should engage in frog racing. That is quite

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Speaker 1: the statement. Oh my goodness, that's what a guy. Slippery

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Speaker 1: like a frog. And and yes, some folks were suspicious

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Speaker 1: of this claim and of the frog business at large

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Speaker 1: in the US, calling it a get rich quick scheme.

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Speaker 1: In fact, in nineteen thirty three, the U. S d

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Speaker 1: A released this statement. Within the past fifteen years, the

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Speaker 1: Bureau has received thousands of inquiries concerning frog raising, but

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Speaker 1: to the present time it has heard of only about

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Speaker 1: three persons or institutions claiming any degree of success, and

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Speaker 1: people who got into the field because of things they'd

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Speaker 1: heard about getting rich sued Southern Industries, which was another

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Speaker 1: big player in the frog growing industry. After UM, they

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Speaker 1: still hadn't received money a year in to the frog business. UM.

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Speaker 1: On top of this, because so many people got in

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Speaker 1: on it, states like Louisiana put a limit on frog

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Speaker 1: hunting in the high season of April and May. UM

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Speaker 1: in the nineteen thirties. Yeah. Um. Commercial farming just isn't

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Speaker 1: profitable in many areas because of the of the sheer

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Speaker 1: biological demands of frogs. UM. I found a page from

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Speaker 1: the Missouri Department of Conservation that was estimating that it

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Speaker 1: takes like a little over a pound of food to

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Speaker 1: raise a single less than half a pound bullfrog. Um.

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Speaker 1: And they note that production costs for frog legs can

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Speaker 1: be around like twelve dollars and seventy cents a pound

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Speaker 1: in the US South, whereas imported frog legs are selling

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Speaker 1: for just three dollars a pound. So that math does

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Speaker 1: not math. No, does not math at all. No. Um.

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Speaker 1: There was a huge jump in European demand for frog

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Speaker 1: legs post World War Two, so much so that Romania's

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00:26:44,760 --> 00:26:51,080
Speaker 1: local frog population went extinct. UM. Yeah, yeah. Frog hunting

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Speaker 1: saw a resurgence in the US in the nineteen seventies

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Speaker 1: and eighties, and during the eighties, frog farming was on

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Speaker 1: the rise in Asia, Europe and Brazil. UH. This coincided

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Speaker 1: with in the United States and drop in attempts at

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Speaker 1: farming UM and a rise in imported frogs UM and

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Speaker 1: also arise in food born illnesses from imported frogs. Supposedly,

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Speaker 1: Nixon served frog legs at his second inaugural dinner in

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Speaker 1: nineteen seventy three and Congressman got salmonella poisoning. Oh yeah,

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Speaker 1: frog legs, Okay yeah. After a significant drop in the

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Speaker 1: frog population in the nineteen eighties, France band commercial frog

400
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Speaker 1: hunting and farming, and yes in similar rules were put

401
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Speaker 1: in place around the frog population in Indonesia at the time.

402
00:27:39,320 --> 00:27:43,199
Speaker 1: Although Indonesia was the largest exporter in the world of

403
00:27:43,320 --> 00:27:47,679
Speaker 1: over five thousand metric tons per year UM, it was

404
00:27:47,840 --> 00:27:51,560
Speaker 1: estimated that locals were eating two to seven times as

405
00:27:51,600 --> 00:27:55,600
Speaker 1: many as we're being exported UM. It was just wildly

406
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Speaker 1: unsustainable UM and something similar happened in India. They were

407
00:28:00,000 --> 00:28:02,480
Speaker 1: a big importer of frogs in the nineteen fifties, but

408
00:28:02,520 --> 00:28:06,480
Speaker 1: it was hugely detrimental to the local environment and agriculture.

409
00:28:06,960 --> 00:28:10,560
Speaker 1: Trade of frogs was banned in that country in nineteen seven, UH,

410
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Speaker 1: and the frog population has since recovered. UH. These pushes

411
00:28:15,560 --> 00:28:19,080
Speaker 1: have not ended the demand for frog legs though, and

412
00:28:19,520 --> 00:28:24,000
Speaker 1: the industry has moved several times in response In response

413
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Speaker 1: to to these legal pressures. UM. After Romania and France,

414
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Speaker 1: it was India in Bangladesh, and then after that, Yeah,

415
00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:35,200
Speaker 1: it was Indonesia. Now I think the industry has mostly

416
00:28:35,200 --> 00:28:40,200
Speaker 1: moved to China and Turkey. The globalization of this trade

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00:28:40,520 --> 00:28:43,760
Speaker 1: UM has also, as I talked about a little bit earlier,

418
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Speaker 1: introduced wide labeling problems. A study out of France in

419
00:28:50,440 --> 00:28:53,640
Speaker 1: tested the DNA of two hundred nine frog leg samples

420
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Speaker 1: from supermarkets and found that two hundred and six of

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00:28:56,480 --> 00:29:02,520
Speaker 1: them were mislabeled. Wow. Yeah, m yep UM. And of course,

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Speaker 1: deep fines haven't always stopped poachers. In two thousand seven,

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Speaker 1: frog leg ring in France got broken up. UM. The

424
00:29:11,360 --> 00:29:19,440
Speaker 1: main dude involved admitted to harvesting over ten thou frogs personally. Yeah.

425
00:29:19,760 --> 00:29:22,600
Speaker 1: And right now, there's a little bit of talk about

426
00:29:22,800 --> 00:29:28,720
Speaker 1: UM improving UH purposeful farm growing UM. There's talk about

427
00:29:28,760 --> 00:29:33,920
Speaker 1: about some advancements in UM science and technology making it

428
00:29:33,960 --> 00:29:39,160
Speaker 1: easier to farm frogs um but and in terms of wildcatch,

429
00:29:39,720 --> 00:29:45,080
Speaker 1: experts really recommend placing limits on harvesting too, only five

430
00:29:45,120 --> 00:29:48,880
Speaker 1: to ten tops of a local population per year and

431
00:29:48,960 --> 00:29:55,640
Speaker 1: like only larger adult frogs after mating season. So yep, yep,

432
00:29:55,720 --> 00:29:58,600
Speaker 1: which sounds like it would be really tricky to enforce.

433
00:29:59,080 --> 00:30:04,920
Speaker 1: U yep. So a lot of ongoing conversations around that,

434
00:30:05,320 --> 00:30:08,640
Speaker 1: and I'm sure we'll be hearing more about it. We'll

435
00:30:08,680 --> 00:30:13,200
Speaker 1: probably revisit this topic at a later date. But yeah,

436
00:30:13,280 --> 00:30:15,200
Speaker 1: I think that's what we have to say about frog

437
00:30:15,280 --> 00:30:19,320
Speaker 1: legs for now. It is. We do have some listener

438
00:30:19,400 --> 00:30:20,960
Speaker 1: mail for you, though, and we will get into that

439
00:30:21,000 --> 00:30:22,600
Speaker 1: as soon as we get back from one more quick

440
00:30:22,600 --> 00:30:33,520
Speaker 1: break for a word from our sponsors. And we're back.

441
00:30:33,560 --> 00:30:43,760
Speaker 1: Thank you sponsor, Yes, thank you, we're back with I

442
00:30:43,800 --> 00:30:50,360
Speaker 1: knew that one was gonna be tricky. Oh that was wonderful.

443
00:30:51,800 --> 00:30:56,640
Speaker 1: You're welcome. It was magnificent. Listeners, you missed my facial expression,

444
00:30:56,720 --> 00:31:00,800
Speaker 1: I did, but it was good. Yeah, there was. There

445
00:31:00,880 --> 00:31:03,320
Speaker 1: was like a like a bellowing of the cheeks that

446
00:31:03,440 --> 00:31:07,640
Speaker 1: was going on. Um, it was really it was high quality.

447
00:31:07,680 --> 00:31:12,200
Speaker 1: Thank you for recognizing my brilliance, Lord anytime. Thank you.

448
00:31:15,800 --> 00:31:18,960
Speaker 1: M Chad wrote, I haven't written in a minute, but

449
00:31:19,000 --> 00:31:21,360
Speaker 1: after listening to the Jello episode this morning, I knew

450
00:31:21,400 --> 00:31:23,680
Speaker 1: I had to write in again. I grew up in

451
00:31:23,760 --> 00:31:26,080
Speaker 1: Utah as a Mormon for over thirty years, and jello

452
00:31:26,240 --> 00:31:29,840
Speaker 1: was definitely part of our culture. I distinctly remember going

453
00:31:29,880 --> 00:31:32,600
Speaker 1: to church functions and seeing copious amounts of jello dishes

454
00:31:32,720 --> 00:31:35,880
Speaker 1: with varying fruits, nuts, creams, et cetera within or top

455
00:31:35,960 --> 00:31:40,160
Speaker 1: of them. Growing up, my mother and grandmother's would always

456
00:31:40,200 --> 00:31:42,640
Speaker 1: have some sort of a jellow dish at the dinner table.

457
00:31:42,880 --> 00:31:46,040
Speaker 1: The gotoos around my house were lime jello with bottled pears,

458
00:31:46,040 --> 00:31:50,080
Speaker 1: the best cherry jello with canned fruit cocktail unless there

459
00:31:50,120 --> 00:31:53,800
Speaker 1: was whipped cream on top, and orange jello with shaved

460
00:31:53,880 --> 00:31:59,920
Speaker 1: carrots and raisons. Absolutely disgusting. Jello is definitely a ut

461
00:32:00,000 --> 00:32:02,400
Speaker 1: Off thing, and although I left Utah and Mormonism several

462
00:32:02,480 --> 00:32:05,000
Speaker 1: years ago, my first conditioned thought when invited to get

463
00:32:05,000 --> 00:32:10,080
Speaker 1: together is what kind of jellow dish should I bring? Well?

464
00:32:10,160 --> 00:32:12,959
Speaker 1: I gotta follow up, what kind of jello dish do

465
00:32:13,040 --> 00:32:18,560
Speaker 1: you bring? And yeah, do you bring jellow dishes? Oh?

466
00:32:18,640 --> 00:32:22,240
Speaker 1: Heck um, those those three are all ones that I

467
00:32:22,240 --> 00:32:25,760
Speaker 1: am personally familiar with UM from my own family experiences,

468
00:32:25,800 --> 00:32:31,120
Speaker 1: although we were not Mormon UM. But yeah, yeah, I

469
00:32:31,160 --> 00:32:33,719
Speaker 1: forgot about the raisins. I think. Do you agree with

470
00:32:33,720 --> 00:32:39,719
Speaker 1: the rankings or the the best the worst? I don't know.

471
00:32:39,960 --> 00:32:43,080
Speaker 1: I I like cann Like as a child, I loved

472
00:32:43,120 --> 00:32:47,320
Speaker 1: canned fruit cocktails so much that anything with it I

473
00:32:47,360 --> 00:32:54,400
Speaker 1: was really into UM. I think more often. Yeah, definitely

474
00:32:54,400 --> 00:32:57,560
Speaker 1: the orange jello was shaved carrots and raisins. I wouldn't

475
00:32:57,560 --> 00:33:00,880
Speaker 1: say it's I personally don't find it out solutely disgusting,

476
00:33:01,040 --> 00:33:03,440
Speaker 1: but it's on the lower end of the ranking. I

477
00:33:03,480 --> 00:33:06,320
Speaker 1: would love to see a Jella ranking from you, Lauren,

478
00:33:06,560 --> 00:33:12,920
Speaker 1: just scale. Yes, I am really bad at ranking. I

479
00:33:12,800 --> 00:33:15,880
Speaker 1: know that you have like top whatever lists of everything

480
00:33:15,920 --> 00:33:17,880
Speaker 1: all the time, and they're very intricate and really well

481
00:33:17,880 --> 00:33:20,280
Speaker 1: thought out. Like I my brain like doesn't really work

482
00:33:20,320 --> 00:33:22,880
Speaker 1: in sets like that. Like it's kind of like it's

483
00:33:22,920 --> 00:33:25,680
Speaker 1: all good everything, it's great. I don't know what. Why

484
00:33:25,680 --> 00:33:30,240
Speaker 1: are you asking me? That's a good way to be. Yeah,

485
00:33:30,360 --> 00:33:32,200
Speaker 1: I don't know, but it's nice to have. Again, I

486
00:33:32,280 --> 00:33:36,960
Speaker 1: love a specific opinion absolutely. Now I just want more

487
00:33:37,040 --> 00:33:40,960
Speaker 1: Jella molds. Okay, alright, uh Red wrote I just wanted

488
00:33:40,960 --> 00:33:43,360
Speaker 1: to send a quick letter about your recent lemonade episode.

489
00:33:43,440 --> 00:33:46,080
Speaker 1: It was great and made me really want a glass

490
00:33:46,080 --> 00:33:49,600
Speaker 1: of lemonade. You are totally right that in America, lemonade

491
00:33:49,640 --> 00:33:51,360
Speaker 1: is a much bigger deal in the South than in

492
00:33:51,400 --> 00:33:54,280
Speaker 1: the North. I've lived in many different parts of the North,

493
00:33:54,360 --> 00:33:57,640
Speaker 1: but I have never heard anyone up here describe lemonade

494
00:33:57,680 --> 00:34:01,080
Speaker 1: with such excitement and endearing love. It's not that lemonade

495
00:34:01,080 --> 00:34:03,440
Speaker 1: doesn't exist in the North, but it's just sort of there.

496
00:34:04,000 --> 00:34:06,880
Speaker 1: I can't imagine anyone telling me their opinions about where

497
00:34:06,920 --> 00:34:09,000
Speaker 1: to go to get the best lemonade in town, like

498
00:34:09,040 --> 00:34:12,600
Speaker 1: you were talking about. It definitely made me wonder, well, heck,

499
00:34:13,000 --> 00:34:15,800
Speaker 1: what is lemonade like in Georgia? Have I been missing

500
00:34:15,800 --> 00:34:18,919
Speaker 1: out on a delicious version of this unremarkable picnic punch

501
00:34:19,000 --> 00:34:22,400
Speaker 1: my whole life? I need to get to Atlanta. Also,

502
00:34:22,760 --> 00:34:25,120
Speaker 1: it really made me laugh to hear the origin story

503
00:34:25,320 --> 00:34:28,120
Speaker 1: of pink lemonade. I didn't know it was associated with

504
00:34:28,120 --> 00:34:31,160
Speaker 1: the circus, as it happens. I have recently learned to juggle,

505
00:34:31,280 --> 00:34:33,360
Speaker 1: and your podcast is my favorite thing to listen to

506
00:34:33,480 --> 00:34:36,160
Speaker 1: when I go practice in the park. So I got

507
00:34:36,160 --> 00:34:38,319
Speaker 1: a big kick out of tossing my juggling clubs in

508
00:34:38,320 --> 00:34:41,560
Speaker 1: the air while hearing about those wacky circus folks passing

509
00:34:41,560 --> 00:34:45,879
Speaker 1: off laundry as lemonade. Side note, if your laundry water

510
00:34:45,960 --> 00:34:55,759
Speaker 1: tastes that good, I have many other questions. Yes, I

511
00:34:55,840 --> 00:35:00,759
Speaker 1: think that's a fair question. Oh yeah, if no one

512
00:35:00,880 --> 00:35:03,239
Speaker 1: noticed and they were all like this daste great mm

513
00:35:03,360 --> 00:35:12,120
Speaker 1: hmmm yeah yeah. Yeah. Also, I do love your description

514
00:35:12,160 --> 00:35:15,040
Speaker 1: of lemonade in the north because that is quite different

515
00:35:15,080 --> 00:35:18,879
Speaker 1: from my experience in the South. Yeah, and it makes

516
00:35:19,040 --> 00:35:22,279
Speaker 1: it also makes me curious about lemonade in the North.

517
00:35:22,360 --> 00:35:24,359
Speaker 1: Is it just that we like it here because we're

518
00:35:24,360 --> 00:35:26,799
Speaker 1: conditioned to like it here more or is it one

519
00:35:26,960 --> 00:35:29,240
Speaker 1: like truly? I think maybe we just have more options.

520
00:35:29,400 --> 00:35:34,839
Speaker 1: It sounds like um here in the South. Yeah, it's

521
00:35:34,840 --> 00:35:38,879
Speaker 1: hard to I mean, more research is necessary mm hm yes,

522
00:35:39,160 --> 00:35:42,600
Speaker 1: lemonade research. And you know, we'll just have to go

523
00:35:42,840 --> 00:35:45,160
Speaker 1: visit you. You've come visit us, and we compare lemonade

524
00:35:45,200 --> 00:35:50,160
Speaker 1: and that's it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Also for learning to juggle, um,

525
00:35:50,239 --> 00:35:53,520
Speaker 1: I I can juggle balls, but not pens. I mostly

526
00:35:53,560 --> 00:35:55,880
Speaker 1: just hit myself in the face with pins. Uh, So

527
00:35:55,960 --> 00:36:02,200
Speaker 1: I haven't gotten very far with that. But um, yes, dangerous, yes, dangerous. Um,

528
00:36:02,200 --> 00:36:06,880
Speaker 1: but I do know if you excellent jugglers around Atlanta.

529
00:36:07,239 --> 00:36:10,439
Speaker 1: I Annie, I like hate saying this out loud because

530
00:36:10,480 --> 00:36:12,080
Speaker 1: I know where your brain is about to go. But

531
00:36:12,120 --> 00:36:21,920
Speaker 1: like I kind of hang out with a lot of clowns. Yep,

532
00:36:22,360 --> 00:36:26,240
Speaker 1: clowns aren't scary. Clowns are not scary. Clowns can Clowns

533
00:36:26,280 --> 00:36:29,880
Speaker 1: can be scary. The scary clown is an excellent horror trope.

534
00:36:29,960 --> 00:36:34,080
Speaker 1: But um, but no, no, um, the circus community around

535
00:36:34,080 --> 00:36:38,000
Speaker 1: here is really great. Um Uh. There's a segment of

536
00:36:38,080 --> 00:36:42,040
Speaker 1: humans who go into into hospitals and um, retirement homes

537
00:36:42,080 --> 00:36:46,360
Speaker 1: and do work. They're through clowning and it's really beautiful. Um.

538
00:36:46,920 --> 00:36:51,120
Speaker 1: So so yeah, come come everyone, come to Atlanta, try

539
00:36:51,160 --> 00:36:57,200
Speaker 1: the lemonade, watch watch some circus acts. I totally agree,

540
00:36:57,200 --> 00:36:59,399
Speaker 1: and I love that, But that is quite a specific,

541
00:37:00,560 --> 00:37:04,440
Speaker 1: like say, come to Atlanta, try and eliminate and watch

542
00:37:04,480 --> 00:37:12,160
Speaker 1: the circus. Yeah, they're not hiring me for the tourism

543
00:37:12,160 --> 00:37:15,600
Speaker 1: board anytime soon, are they. Well that's that's their loss.

544
00:37:15,600 --> 00:37:18,840
Speaker 1: That is their loss, because I think there's people that

545
00:37:18,880 --> 00:37:25,440
Speaker 1: would love that. I agree, yes, thank you, I agree, Well,

546
00:37:26,080 --> 00:37:28,719
Speaker 1: thanks to both of those listeners for writing in. If

547
00:37:28,719 --> 00:37:30,239
Speaker 1: you would like to write us that you can our

548
00:37:30,280 --> 00:37:32,920
Speaker 1: email us hello at saber pod dot com. We are

549
00:37:32,960 --> 00:37:35,719
Speaker 1: also on social media. You can find us on Twitter, Facebook,

550
00:37:35,760 --> 00:37:38,200
Speaker 1: and Instagram at saver pod and we do hope to

551
00:37:38,239 --> 00:37:40,720
Speaker 1: hear from you. Saber is production of I Heart Radio.

552
00:37:40,840 --> 00:37:43,000
Speaker 1: For more podcasts from my Heart Radio, you can visit

553
00:37:43,040 --> 00:37:45,759
Speaker 1: the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you

554
00:37:45,840 --> 00:37:48,400
Speaker 1: listen to your favorite shows. Thanks as always to our

555
00:37:48,400 --> 00:37:51,960
Speaker 1: superproducers Dylan Fagin and Andrew Howard. Thanks to you for listening,

556
00:37:52,000 --> 00:37:53,719
Speaker 1: and we hope that lots more good things are coming

557
00:37:53,760 --> 00:38:00,160
Speaker 1: your wayw