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Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to Cool People, Did Cool Stuff or

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Speaker 1: c p W D C C AS by for short,

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Speaker 1: and by short I mean long because it takes at

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Speaker 1: least as long to say the acronym as does say

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Speaker 1: the title of the show. And one of my least

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Speaker 1: favorite things is people who try to correct me and

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Speaker 1: say that acronyms are only acronyms when they are pronounceable

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Speaker 1: as words. So I'm Mark kill j your host and

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Speaker 1: with me. Today is the one and only Andrew T.

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Speaker 1: Andrew Good just gave dog two kills. Yeah, everything's gone

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Speaker 1: great on this day. That is definitely a different day

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Speaker 1: from last time, because we definitely don't just record both

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Speaker 1: episodes back to back most of the time. We've also

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Speaker 1: got our producer, Sophie. How are you doing? Sophie? Still

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Speaker 1: doing well? Was doing well all those days ago when

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Speaker 1: we report recorded part one? Still well now? Yeah. The

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Speaker 1: days just fly by between recording part one important by bye,

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Speaker 1: they do. Sometimes it just feels like I get up

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Speaker 1: and get a glass of water, yeah, and then that's it.

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Speaker 1: We also have our editor Ian who's not on the calm,

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Speaker 1: but later we'll be listening to everything we say, just

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Speaker 1: to twist our words around and make it sound like

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Speaker 1: we said are saying things that we're not saying. Like

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Speaker 1: I actually got the acronym correct at the beginning of

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Speaker 1: this episode and then um Ian switched it around to

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Speaker 1: be wrong. And our theme music was written by a

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Speaker 1: woman and you can check out the rest of her

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Speaker 1: music if you would like. So today we're talking about

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Speaker 1: food up bombs, and we're talking abou mutual aid. And

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Speaker 1: if you didn't listen to the first half of this episode,

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Speaker 1: you are missing out on us pontificating about Catholic theology

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Speaker 1: for a moment, and also about why were or at

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Speaker 1: least why I'm not excited about people dressing up as

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Speaker 1: homeless people. Yeah, I mean, it's just so like a

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Speaker 1: classic of the genre. But yeah, you know, so the

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Speaker 1: street theater kind of always has that element to it,

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Speaker 1: I guess, just like, yeah, yeah, it's not a it's

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Speaker 1: not a high art form, and that is both its

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Speaker 1: advantage and disadvantage, both artistically and politically. Exactly. Yeah, So,

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Speaker 1: where we last left our heroes, they're feeding people every week.

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Speaker 1: They're collecting donations from all over the city and delivering

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Speaker 1: free groceries everywhere because they think that people might need

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Speaker 1: free groceries, and then they're taking what's left over and

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Speaker 1: making a ton of free food and feeding people in

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Speaker 1: the park. And this is just a a good thing

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Speaker 1: to do. No notes, the city is less convinced that

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Speaker 1: it's a good thing to do, or at least they

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Speaker 1: don't like the other stuff that these same activists are doing,

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Speaker 1: um like sticking their noses into every protest and action

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Speaker 1: that they possibly can, writing every good fight that they

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Speaker 1: come across. So so Keith mckenry, one of the founders

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Speaker 1: of food nut Bombs, the main person who's written all

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Speaker 1: this history. He who's actually really cool most of the time. Um,

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Speaker 1: he doesn't like that he's getting harassed by the city,

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Speaker 1: Like he's getting harassed a lot by the city. Apparently

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Speaker 1: is being kind of threatened by the city. Don't totally

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Speaker 1: know what that. I don't know exactly. So he fucks off.

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Speaker 1: He sucked off to San Francisco, and Food Up Bombs

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Speaker 1: Boston keeps going without him. In seven he starts Food

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Speaker 1: up Bombs San Francisco, and not long after, some people

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Speaker 1: in Long Beach, which I don't know if you all

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Speaker 1: knew this, but Long Beach is not actually the name

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Speaker 1: of a beach in l A. It turns out apparently

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Speaker 1: it's its own city. M yeah, yeah, Andrew, did you

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Speaker 1: know that Los Angeles resident? Uh? I think, I mean,

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Speaker 1: I assume it is also a beach though, right, I

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Speaker 1: don't know is Los Angeles an actual city or is

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Speaker 1: it just a Hollywood fabrication? So uh yeah, definitely both.

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Speaker 1: Is A is a ridiculous city as far as that goes? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: completely agree? Okay, just does cool Zone media have an

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Speaker 1: official stance on whether or not it's chill for me

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Speaker 1: to spread conspiracy theories like l A is a real

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Speaker 1: place and not just a Hollywood fabrication, because that's the

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Speaker 1: conspiracy for Los Angeles is a real place with stage

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Speaker 1: wink at the audience that they can't see if I'm

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Speaker 1: describing it, you can't see ship. Yeah all right. So

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Speaker 1: some people in Long Beach, legally distinct from Los Angeles

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Speaker 1: started food not bombs, and they were nervous about stealing

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Speaker 1: the name food nut bombs, so they started calling it

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Speaker 1: bread knot bombs. But then they got in touch with

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Speaker 1: food nat bombs and tun bombs, like, oh my god,

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Speaker 1: we don't care that rules used food not bombs. Um,

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Speaker 1: so they become Food Nut Bombs, and food Nut Bombs

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Speaker 1: writes up a little how to Get Started zine and

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Speaker 1: they start passing it around. There's thirty chapters. They had

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Speaker 1: a conference and decided on the three basic principles that

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Speaker 1: I mentioned at the beginning of Monday's episode, free veggy

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Speaker 1: based food, autonomous groups, non violence, and then they put

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Speaker 1: out the first edition of a book called food Nut

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Speaker 1: Bombs that explains the whole thing very direct titlers. I

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Speaker 1: appreciate a good direct title. So the group explodes in

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Speaker 1: popularity after this. Two years later, people attended international gathering

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Speaker 1: in San Francisco and the representing the US, Canada, Mexico,

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Speaker 1: and various countries in Europe. And okay, my my theory

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Speaker 1: is that the only downside of the popularity Food Not

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Speaker 1: Bombs is that we had to go through as activists

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Speaker 1: the whole generation of slogans with names that are like

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Speaker 1: bikes not bombs, home's not jails, food not lawn, solidarity

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Speaker 1: not charity, the something not something. I really appreciate that

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Speaker 1: y'alls is um something and something like. I feel like

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Speaker 1: that's a really positive development. Um Yeah, I wasn't around

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Speaker 1: for the genesis of it. I have no idea how

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Speaker 1: any of that care to be. But yeah, that is

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Speaker 1: actually a good point. Yeah, I we were we were

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Speaker 1: at a protest recently, and I because I hadn't been

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Speaker 1: involved in the early days of it when it was

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Speaker 1: mostly protest support. UM for Solidarity snacks mentioned last episode,

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Speaker 1: which people can financially support, Yes, we need or the

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Speaker 1: fund is getting we we only have a couple more

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Speaker 1: Saturdays left unless we get more funds, which hopefully will

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Speaker 1: come in. Um. But I didn't realize that the like

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Speaker 1: cart that my friend used initially to start the whole

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Speaker 1: thing is like it was like well known amongst people.

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Speaker 1: Really people were like, oh, it's the car, we know you.

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Speaker 1: It's the car. That's pretty amazing. Yeah. Um so yeah,

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Speaker 1: something and something that is my that is my endorsement society.

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Speaker 1: It's a new a new wrinkle on the on the format.

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Speaker 1: We've progressed past the need for things not the other

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Speaker 1: thing that said, all of those things that I named

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Speaker 1: like homes not jail's homes, that jail's rules, and I

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Speaker 1: actually almost did a whole thing about them, but I

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Speaker 1: ran out of time. They're like people who well they

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Speaker 1: do kind of what they say. They they open up squads.

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Speaker 1: The organizations are great, it's often just the like just

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Speaker 1: another pass at the copy usually yeah, yeah, totally, exactly. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's the main issue. And so that's why I would

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Speaker 1: like to propose a new something and something food and

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Speaker 1: bombs for people who want to kill the Tsar of Russia.

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Speaker 1: I mean, if you want to kill the Tsar of Russia,

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Speaker 1: it has been proven empirically through trial and air, a

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Speaker 1: lot of air, the most effective way to kill Tazar

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Speaker 1: of Russia is with bombs. So just saying putting that

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Speaker 1: out there, please don't actually do that and then say

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Speaker 1: that I had anything to do with it, Okay, shut yeah,

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Speaker 1: totally no fucking snitches and food and bombs, all right,

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Speaker 1: So food not bombs. It's getting super popular with people

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Speaker 1: who like to eat food. But there are people who

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Speaker 1: hate fun and freedom and people having nice things like

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Speaker 1: food who are waiting in the wings. And these people,

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Speaker 1: of course, best known as the government and the cops.

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Speaker 1: This conflict first arises in a serious way in in

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Speaker 1: San Francisco. You've got this mayor. He's super progressive. His

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Speaker 1: name's Art Agnos. He ran on how environmental and feminist

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Speaker 1: and pro union and ship he was, Ah spoiler. Okay,

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Speaker 1: So he comes in during an intense period of gentrification

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Speaker 1: of San Francisco and it's starting to change it into

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Speaker 1: the yuppie hell hole we all know and love today.

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Speaker 1: He wants to solve the homelessness crisis, and he starts

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Speaker 1: off with some decent ideas about how to solve the

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Speaker 1: homelessness crisis. M He wants to build low income housing,

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Speaker 1: which of course always gets complicated, but it's not inherently wrong. Um.

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Speaker 1: He also makes sleeping bands, and then he revives a

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Speaker 1: nineteenth century law against lying down in public place with

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Speaker 1: camping gear. Because you know that the government is doing

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Speaker 1: something good when they find a law that has not

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Speaker 1: been enforced in a hundred years. Yeah, so you should

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Speaker 1: look at the laws, the other laws from that year

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Speaker 1: and just see what else totally like, if this is

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Speaker 1: who you're in company with, yeah, it can't be. These

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Speaker 1: were not good legislators at the time. Yeah. Like, and

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Speaker 1: here's the law against the following racial oh wait yeah yeah,

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Speaker 1: oh yeah, but that's not for a couple of years. Yeah. No,

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Speaker 1: that's the sweet spot, that is the hey day of that. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I think San Francisco is like it started being all

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Speaker 1: the like, um, like, Chinese folks don't come here in

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Speaker 1: the late nineteenth century, I think, Yeah, and hooray America

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Speaker 1: has a really cool history. Yeah, and present that's wild

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Speaker 1: the other yeah go ahead, Oh no, they're just just

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Speaker 1: recapping for my brain, all right. Yeah. The laws back, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: the laws back, and he starts sending out cops to

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Speaker 1: sweep parks full of homeless folks. Fuck art Agnos. Uh,

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Speaker 1: he's not progressive, he claims it, and and everyone I

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Speaker 1: think starts seeing him as basically like, oh, he's the

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Speaker 1: classic democrat. He it's a bait and switch. He gets

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Speaker 1: elected by progressives because of the elector the people who

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Speaker 1: vote a manner progressives, and then he serves neoliberalism instead.

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Speaker 1: Um and fount Bombs shows up on the scene around

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Speaker 1: the time same time as art Agnos and food nut Bombs.

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Speaker 1: At the beginning, they weren't even trying to be controversial.

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Speaker 1: They actually applied for a permit and did all of

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Speaker 1: the paperwork and all that stuff. But the local business

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Speaker 1: owners were like, no, you can't have homeless people eating

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Speaker 1: food in public. Um as if there's some other place

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Speaker 1: for people who don't have houses to eat food uh,

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Speaker 1: so they pressure the city, the city denies the permit,

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Speaker 1: and food nut Bombs rolls over and accepts it and

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Speaker 1: ends as an organization. And wait, no, they say fuck it,

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Speaker 1: and they feed people food anyway, And they start to

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Speaker 1: get arrested for it, like a lot, Like in the

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Speaker 1: first few months, there's almost a hundred arrests. It becomes

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Speaker 1: an assembly line. Someone lines up to get a free meal.

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Speaker 1: Someone scoops food onto the plate of the person who's

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Speaker 1: there for a free meal, and the cops arrests the

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Speaker 1: person who serves the food. So the next server steps

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Speaker 1: up and feeds the next person in line and gets arrested.

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Speaker 1: And and they just do this right because they're not

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Speaker 1: afraid of civilis obedience. There. They do what's right, not

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Speaker 1: what's safe. You know. Yeah, it's also truly like you know, obviously,

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Speaker 1: if you're fucking cop, you are the worst human being.

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Speaker 1: But like it's hard to have it more like in

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Speaker 1: your face, what a fun discussing piece of ship you

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Speaker 1: are that day, I know. Yeah. And so the fight

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Speaker 1: is about food, I guess kind of, but not really.

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Speaker 1: It's it's about more than that. It's about who controls

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Speaker 1: public space. Are the parks controlled by the government or

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Speaker 1: are they controlled by the people who make use of

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Speaker 1: the park. And the government, of course, tends to believe

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Speaker 1: that they're the ones who get to control the park,

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Speaker 1: but I would argue, if you've ever been to a park,

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Speaker 1: you know that that's not the case. The politics of

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Speaker 1: a park are remapped daily by the people who are there.

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Speaker 1: Like there might not be a sign up that says

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Speaker 1: don't skateboard on the basketball court, but like the basketball

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Speaker 1: court most of the time is for basketball players and

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Speaker 1: who have their own structures about who decides which courts

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Speaker 1: are being used, and like, you know, it's it's I mean,

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Speaker 1: parts are are beautiful because they are these informal organizational

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Speaker 1: spots that happen daily all over the world. Um, I

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Speaker 1: don't know, it's like one thing I miss about living

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Speaker 1: in cities and yeah, or just like like the like

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Speaker 1: the yeah, the politics of any like public place are

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Speaker 1: like so interesting. Yeah, it's just like you can make

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Speaker 1: all the rules you want, but those aren't the rules,

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Speaker 1: yeah totally. And you know, and people who have no

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Speaker 1: private space to return to, they're going to use public space,

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Speaker 1: which makes sense, right, And I've never had to deal

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Speaker 1: with homelessness. I used to be a traveling activist, but

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Speaker 1: that was by by choice is very structurally different. But

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Speaker 1: I remember at this one time I was taking a

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Speaker 1: nap in a van and a parking lot and it

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Speaker 1: was really hot, so I opened the doors and and

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Speaker 1: I was just thinking about how like I could now

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Speaker 1: get in trouble. It would be perfectly legal for me

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Speaker 1: to park my van and get out of it and

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Speaker 1: leave my van in this public space, but now that

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Speaker 1: I'm sleeping in it, it's sketchy. But even more than that,

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Speaker 1: it seems so weird to me that if I didn't

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Speaker 1: have a car, I can't just set my stuff down

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Speaker 1: in this public space that is meant for holding stuff, right,

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Speaker 1: is a public spaceman for people to leave their car

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Speaker 1: and walk away. And it just sort of like hits

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Speaker 1: me the magic of a car used in a certain way. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: And then even if you have a car, if you

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Speaker 1: don't have a private space to then take it home

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Speaker 1: too later, you're not usually not allowed to park it anywhere. Um,

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Speaker 1: and it I don't know whatever. This isn't news to

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Speaker 1: anyone probably that there's a lot of laws against homelessness

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Speaker 1: that I wish I had the quote in front of me,

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Speaker 1: but I don't. There's that quote about the law and

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Speaker 1: it's it's it's awesome equality outlaws before and the rich

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Speaker 1: from like pissing, Yeah, um law the laws like perfectly fair,

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Speaker 1: like like no one is permitted to sleep under the

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Speaker 1: bridge or something, Yeah exactly. Um. And and l A specifically,

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Speaker 1: they've they've come out with all these like where they

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Speaker 1: pretend like it's not trying to do that type laws

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Speaker 1: where they're like like recently l A City council approved

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Speaker 1: an ordinance where it's like bike repair on the street

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Speaker 1: is now illegal, and and then they were like, well,

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Speaker 1: what do you mean this has not this has nothing

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Speaker 1: to do with you know, the un housed communities. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And and you know anybody with that that reads it

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Speaker 1: is like just be honest, Yeah, what are you? What

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Speaker 1: do you what do you mean? And uh, you know,

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Speaker 1: there's there's so many different things. It's like putting bolder

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Speaker 1: or is under freeway under passes and things like that.

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Speaker 1: They're like, oh no, it's to prevent and they make

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Speaker 1: up some lights like yeah, I saw a bat there

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Speaker 1: once and I don't want people to get rabies. So

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Speaker 1: that's why there's a Boulder. It's like, just treat people

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Speaker 1: with dignity, don't be so bastards. We'll just be gloves

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Speaker 1: off and be like we want our clean city. Actually,

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Speaker 1: don't do that either. Don't do That's always like like,

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Speaker 1: oh I I prefer the open fascists like like sort

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Speaker 1: of it's glib, but yeah, don't tempt them. Yeah, I know,

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Speaker 1: I'm not looking forward to that stage. It's like always

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Speaker 1: like like, oh, I just prefer what people are saying,

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Speaker 1: what they really believe. It's like I promise you don't

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Speaker 1: totally yeah, I know. I know. We were talking about

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Speaker 1: like democrats that run with these liberal policies and it's like, oh, no,

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Speaker 1: you're a Republican and like that sucks. But but having

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Speaker 1: like the actual fascists run on fat like yeah, it's

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Speaker 1: like like the like I prefer it at least I

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Speaker 1: know where I stand. It's like knowledge of where you

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Speaker 1: stand is like such a valueless thing. And also like right,

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Speaker 1: like when everyone had to be quiet about slightly more

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Speaker 1: quiet about the racism and ship, I think it made

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Speaker 1: fewer young racists because if you can't pass it on

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Speaker 1: is this continent, racism is a continuion. So like truly,

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Speaker 1: it is like like that that is like the thing

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Speaker 1: it's like for all like the you know, subconscious or

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Speaker 1: or like quiet racism, Like it truly is better. It

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Speaker 1: is just better better society where at least they have

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Speaker 1: to experience some sort of shame or second guessing themselves. Um,

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Speaker 1: I'm not saying it's good, but it's better than the alternative.

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Speaker 1: It's certainly use that totally Okay. So yeah, so all

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Speaker 1: these people are getting arrested because the city is real

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Speaker 1: clear how they want to control space. They're like, we

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Speaker 1: control the parks. There's actually all these quotes from different

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Speaker 1: city council people that are like or you know, from

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Speaker 1: the city government that's like and cops that are like,

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Speaker 1: we control these parks, not these homeless people in these

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Speaker 1: anarchists or like they're making a political statement. I mean

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Speaker 1: it's like, yeah, of course, feeding people in a society

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Speaker 1: where there's people going hungry and dying in the streets

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Speaker 1: as a political statement like this shouldn't be happening is

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Speaker 1: a political statement because the current political system isn't working. Um.

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Speaker 1: Also like pathetic that that is the like, yeah, you're

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Speaker 1: scared of political statements? Yeah, yeah, totally, So the civil

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Speaker 1: disobedience works, and after a few months, the city sits

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Speaker 1: down to negotiate with them and gives them a temporary permit.

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Speaker 1: They have to like move a couple blocks over to

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Speaker 1: like get out of Um I think they're in Golden

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Speaker 1: Gate Park at this point. They have to go a

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Speaker 1: few blocks away, so they're like less public eye. But

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Speaker 1: they drop all the charges against all the orestes and

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Speaker 1: and things are a little better. But these radical homeless people.

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Speaker 1: The next year they set up an encampment outside of

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Speaker 1: city Hall and they have the coolest slogan ever for

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Speaker 1: this exact thing, which is, we're tired, we're hungry, we

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Speaker 1: don't like the government. Um, just say what you fucking mean.

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Speaker 1: I want our side to say what they fucking mean.

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Speaker 1: You know, that's significantly better. Yeah, well, the problem is

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Speaker 1: most of our side quote unquote our side, uh doesn't

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Speaker 1: mean that. That's true. Yep, that's that's the dark side

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Speaker 1: of things. Uh. Well, fudnut Bombs decides to go support

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Speaker 1: that just to avoid lingering on that dark thought. Turn

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Speaker 1: up Bombs. They decided to go support this, this homeless

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Speaker 1: lead initiative. And I believe at this point a decent

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Speaker 1: nu chunk of the Food Up Bombs organizers are homeless

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Speaker 1: folks themselves. I'm not entirely certain about how all that works,

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Speaker 1: but it's yeah, more complicated than people might initially think. Um,

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Speaker 1: And they set up a twenty four hour super kitchen

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Speaker 1: to feed the protest camp. And this and the fact

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Speaker 1: that some of the organizers non violently occupy the mayor's office,

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Speaker 1: gets the whole encampment swept by the ostensibly progressive mayor

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Speaker 1: and Funup Bombs permit is revoked, and so Found up

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Speaker 1: Bombs is like, all right, fuck it, And they go

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Speaker 1: back to the park no longer a couple of blocks away,

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Speaker 1: and they just, um, they're not gonna be swept out

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Speaker 1: from public eye, and they're just gonna feed people. And

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Speaker 1: over the next seven years, this this fight goes on

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Speaker 1: for seven years, over two administrations. Over a thousand activists

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Speaker 1: get sighted and or arrested for feeding people in the park.

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Speaker 1: Nuns and priests joined them. At one point, my favorite

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Speaker 1: was that lawyers of the National Lawyers Guild showed up.

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Speaker 1: Shout out to the National Lawyers Guild, They're great. They

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Speaker 1: decided to serve food and get arrested. The cops are like,

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Speaker 1: now we're good. I just don't arrest the National Lawyers

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Speaker 1: Guild because that's who there sleep, right of. I mean

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Speaker 1: they used to be. I I was at the UM

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Speaker 1: just for a part of it. I wasn't able to

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Speaker 1: be around for like the most violent parts of the

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Speaker 1: uh disgusting hopefully soon to be gone. City Council member

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Speaker 1: Mitchell Ferrell ordered the LAPD to sweep Echo Park like

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Speaker 1: um here and truly, I mean it was one of

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Speaker 1: those like right like this this felt like a new thing.

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Speaker 1: I'm not super experienced with stuff, but like the l

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Speaker 1: A p D like first of all, like you know,

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Speaker 1: performing acts of violence now with like everything recorded, but

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Speaker 1: like actively going after journalists and the like the green

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Speaker 1: hat National folks, targeting them in some truly fascist ship

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Speaker 1: and then setting up a uh literal concentration camp at

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Speaker 1: Echo Park. They fence it off and you could not

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Speaker 1: You didn't. You weren't free to leave or enter. They're

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Speaker 1: just going to concentrate all the people into one place

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Speaker 1: so that they can be handled. It was concentration, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it was, it was. It was you know, it was

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Speaker 1: so fucking disgusting. Yeah, it's unforgettable. Major media wouldn't even

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Speaker 1: like really cover it because their cowards. But it's like

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Speaker 1: it was being live streamed on Twitter and you're seeing

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Speaker 1: it and you're like, yeah, this this is a concentration

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Speaker 1: camp in the middle of Los Angeles being run by

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Speaker 1: our by the l A p d by and by

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Speaker 1: actual fascist MITCHO Ferrell. Yeah, if you're listening to this

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Speaker 1: and you're an l A voter and there's or if

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Speaker 1: you're not, actually there's any way to to contribute to

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Speaker 1: the Ugo Soto Martinez campaign in any way to unsee

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Speaker 1: open fascist MITCHO Ferrell. Please do that please. One of

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Speaker 1: the things that I keep running when I was researching this.

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Speaker 1: At one point I got really frustrated about halfway through

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Speaker 1: writing all this, where I was like, it's also quaint.

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Speaker 1: I know that they were fighting for really hard things

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Speaker 1: and it was really hard, but I'm just like, oh

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Speaker 1: my god, Like, just even what you're saying about, you know,

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Speaker 1: the National Lawyers Guild actually gets arrested now right in

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Speaker 1: the exact same situation, and just like, yeah, I'm really

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Speaker 1: not trying to downplay the incredible amount of work that

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Speaker 1: Punat bombs well, that still does and does now in

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Speaker 1: this new context. So I'm really not trying to knock it, um,

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Speaker 1: but it is it's it's hard to see how far

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Speaker 1: we've not come in terms of the move towards it. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean I think it. It is also like like

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Speaker 1: probably the at least some version of this activism. The

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Speaker 1: stuff that I felt like I saw a lot in

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Speaker 1: the nineties was a lot of people insulated by their

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Speaker 1: whiteness from some of the worst things. And but that

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Speaker 1: is like part of you know, it goes both ways too,

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Speaker 1: because it is like of civil disobedience is like civil

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Speaker 1: disobedience only works if you're oppressors have any kind of conscience,

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Speaker 1: and like, yeah, it's just like cops have more of

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Speaker 1: a conscience for like white teens than you know, your

402
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Speaker 1: average on house person, your average black person, etcetera. Like

403
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Speaker 1: so there is some version of that, but then that

404
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Speaker 1: becomes like sort of this white savior re vibe that

405
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Speaker 1: can go the wrong way. It could turn into people

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Speaker 1: encouraging street theater where you dressed up like the homeless

407
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Speaker 1: because you don't think about what that means. Um, I

408
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Speaker 1: don't know, sorry, I'm just like on that little tangent.

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Speaker 1: It's like scary. Now think that's to me, Like like

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Speaker 1: during the George Floyd uprising, it was just like, oh,

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Speaker 1: the l a p D is like beating middle class

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Speaker 1: white women in broad daylight now, which feels like an escalation, Like,

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Speaker 1: you know, at least typically under they in the past,

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Speaker 1: it feels like they would at least wait till sun

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Speaker 1: down to do that. They were like actively kettling people

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Speaker 1: at like on on a on a Tuesday at like

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Speaker 1: one pm and then like and then like beating them

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Speaker 1: on camera. Yeah. It was like pretty remarkable, honestly. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: And you know what else is remarkable? Oh my god, Margaret,

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Speaker 1: I was like, are you going to do that? Because

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Speaker 1: it's that time. The concept of dogs dogs And oh,

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Speaker 1: we have a new advertiser that I'm very excited about

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Speaker 1: that we'll be running, and it would actually be the

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Speaker 1: first host voiced ad that we'll be running on this network.

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Speaker 1: And that is the concept of shut the funk up,

426
00:24:42,400 --> 00:24:45,720
Speaker 1: Shut the fuck up. Yeah, shut the funk up, don't

427
00:24:45,720 --> 00:24:50,400
Speaker 1: talk to cops. That is the concept. Oh smart, Yeah, No, sorry,

428
00:24:50,400 --> 00:24:51,840
Speaker 1: I wasn't on you all to shut the funk up

429
00:24:52,400 --> 00:24:54,360
Speaker 1: saying that when you get arrested, shut the funk up.

430
00:24:54,960 --> 00:24:57,800
Speaker 1: Oh there's that too, But some of y'all do need

431
00:24:57,800 --> 00:25:02,000
Speaker 1: to also shut the funk up. Here's some ads it Hi,

432
00:25:02,320 --> 00:25:05,440
Speaker 1: Margaret Killjoy here boy, the world sure is a mess

433
00:25:05,520 --> 00:25:07,920
Speaker 1: right now? Huh. Seems like every day there are more

434
00:25:07,920 --> 00:25:10,080
Speaker 1: and more reasons to get out into this recent protest.

435
00:25:10,680 --> 00:25:13,840
Speaker 1: That's why when I get arrested, there's only one strategy.

436
00:25:13,880 --> 00:25:17,399
Speaker 1: I trust, I shut the funk up. I say, I

437
00:25:17,400 --> 00:25:19,360
Speaker 1: would like to remain silent, I would like to talk

438
00:25:19,359 --> 00:25:21,480
Speaker 1: to my lawyer, and then I shut the funk up.

439
00:25:22,040 --> 00:25:25,199
Speaker 1: In the United States of America, it's constitutionally protected and

440
00:25:25,280 --> 00:25:28,760
Speaker 1: recommended by the National Lawyers Guild. That's s h U

441
00:25:28,840 --> 00:25:32,560
Speaker 1: t t h E f U c k u P.

442
00:25:33,280 --> 00:25:37,480
Speaker 1: Once again, that's s h U T th h E

443
00:25:37,560 --> 00:25:40,640
Speaker 1: f U c k u P. Because you can't talk

444
00:25:40,680 --> 00:25:43,680
Speaker 1: yourself out of custody, but you can talk yourself into

445
00:25:43,680 --> 00:25:47,080
Speaker 1: a conviction. Providing identification to law enforcement required in some

446
00:25:47,119 --> 00:25:50,400
Speaker 1: states and situations, giving name an addressed expedient. In most circumstances,

447
00:25:50,600 --> 00:25:52,560
Speaker 1: never discuss the events leading to arrest with anyone except

448
00:25:52,560 --> 00:25:55,280
Speaker 1: your lawyer, doctor, or therapist. Posting pictures of protests and

449
00:25:55,320 --> 00:25:57,879
Speaker 1: actions on social media may lead to complications if you

450
00:25:57,920 --> 00:26:00,280
Speaker 1: have already talked to cops or experienced confuse and about

451
00:26:00,280 --> 00:26:02,920
Speaker 1: talking to cops, call your attorney immediately, as these maybe

452
00:26:02,920 --> 00:26:05,480
Speaker 1: signs of more serious legal problems. The concept of not

453
00:26:05,480 --> 00:26:06,960
Speaker 1: talking to cops does not provide legal advice, and the

454
00:26:06,960 --> 00:26:09,199
Speaker 1: foregoing statements are for informational purposes only if you have

455
00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:17,760
Speaker 1: specific legal questions. Consultant attorney and we are back, um,

456
00:26:17,800 --> 00:26:21,400
Speaker 1: and we are thinking about the escalation. And also yeah,

457
00:26:21,480 --> 00:26:25,000
Speaker 1: how like people who actually are are more heavily marginalized

458
00:26:25,000 --> 00:26:26,719
Speaker 1: by society have been dealing with this ship and it

459
00:26:26,760 --> 00:26:30,399
Speaker 1: wasn't as like quaint even back you know. So that

460
00:26:30,520 --> 00:26:34,240
Speaker 1: is a really good point. I mean it's it's tough. Yeah,

461
00:26:34,440 --> 00:26:39,360
Speaker 1: it just goes always like it's like, yes, they're absolutely

462
00:26:39,400 --> 00:26:42,520
Speaker 1: doing you know, a good thing on the balance, and

463
00:26:42,600 --> 00:26:46,960
Speaker 1: like certainly there are the allies, but yeah, it's just

464
00:26:47,119 --> 00:26:50,560
Speaker 1: it is weird, like the the using essentially you're on

465
00:26:50,680 --> 00:26:55,800
Speaker 1: privilege to advance goals, but sort of still you have

466
00:26:55,880 --> 00:26:59,520
Speaker 1: that privilege and you can not extend that privilege, which

467
00:26:59,560 --> 00:27:03,919
Speaker 1: is always the precarious thing too. Yeah, and I mean

468
00:27:03,920 --> 00:27:05,080
Speaker 1: I think that that has a lot to do with

469
00:27:05,080 --> 00:27:08,560
Speaker 1: like where you're taking direction from right, Like, um, you know,

470
00:27:08,920 --> 00:27:11,159
Speaker 1: if I'm going to be protesting in a context in

471
00:27:11,200 --> 00:27:14,240
Speaker 1: which I'm attempting to use my white privilege, uh, it

472
00:27:14,480 --> 00:27:17,920
Speaker 1: usually ideally would be in the context of like listening

473
00:27:17,960 --> 00:27:22,159
Speaker 1: to um, you know, the direction and the overall strategy

474
00:27:22,240 --> 00:27:26,480
Speaker 1: that is being proposed by the the group that I'm

475
00:27:26,520 --> 00:27:29,840
Speaker 1: attempting to be in solidary with, you know, UM, and

476
00:27:30,200 --> 00:27:32,719
Speaker 1: which is of course also really complicated because people are,

477
00:27:32,920 --> 00:27:35,280
Speaker 1: like people of color or not, the monoliths even among

478
00:27:35,359 --> 00:27:39,240
Speaker 1: individual you know, like identities, and so you know, you

479
00:27:40,000 --> 00:27:43,000
Speaker 1: people choosing who they listen to. It. Well, this is

480
00:27:43,000 --> 00:27:46,200
Speaker 1: why I don't run a politics podcasts. This ship gets messy.

481
00:27:46,280 --> 00:27:49,119
Speaker 1: I just talk about history. No exactly. I mean I

482
00:27:49,200 --> 00:27:53,400
Speaker 1: think that's like it's both messy and like ugly and

483
00:27:53,400 --> 00:27:58,960
Speaker 1: and you know, the reality is there is no like right, Yeah,

484
00:27:59,040 --> 00:28:00,960
Speaker 1: I think that that. And that's one of the things

485
00:28:00,960 --> 00:28:04,520
Speaker 1: I love about movements that are so um like like

486
00:28:04,880 --> 00:28:07,879
Speaker 1: diverse in terms of ideologies, in terms of ideas, in

487
00:28:07,960 --> 00:28:10,720
Speaker 1: terms of strategies tactics, Like when we can work to

488
00:28:10,800 --> 00:28:14,240
Speaker 1: coordinate different strategies and tactics together and different people coming

489
00:28:14,280 --> 00:28:17,280
Speaker 1: from different positions, I feel like that's where we are

490
00:28:17,280 --> 00:28:22,960
Speaker 1: our strongest personally. UM, so the next mayor San Francisco,

491
00:28:23,040 --> 00:28:25,879
Speaker 1: speaking of people getting a little more um glove off.

492
00:28:26,560 --> 00:28:29,280
Speaker 1: The next pair of San Francisco was the chief of

493
00:28:29,280 --> 00:28:33,320
Speaker 1: police who orchestrated the crackdown on fodnut pomps. All right,

494
00:28:34,119 --> 00:28:37,720
Speaker 1: and a runs an anti homeless camp on he runs

495
00:28:37,720 --> 00:28:40,360
Speaker 1: onto anti homeless platform and things just heat up for

496
00:28:40,360 --> 00:28:42,240
Speaker 1: food nut bombs. But of course also everywhere in the

497
00:28:42,280 --> 00:28:44,680
Speaker 1: city with this guy. And over the course of the fight,

498
00:28:45,160 --> 00:28:47,200
Speaker 1: the city removes all the benches from the park, so

499
00:28:47,240 --> 00:28:49,720
Speaker 1: the folks have to eat sitting on the ground, which

500
00:28:49,760 --> 00:28:52,520
Speaker 1: didn't stop anyone from eating food. You'll be shocked to know.

501
00:28:53,320 --> 00:28:55,920
Speaker 1: Then they put up signs everywhere that said serving food

502
00:28:55,960 --> 00:28:58,600
Speaker 1: without a permit is a crime. Um, these were probably

503
00:28:58,760 --> 00:29:02,120
Speaker 1: roughly as effective escape warding is a crime science. Yeah,

504
00:29:02,640 --> 00:29:06,360
Speaker 1: And and it's like it really is like, what, like

505
00:29:07,040 --> 00:29:11,360
Speaker 1: what society are you in? You know that that that

506
00:29:11,600 --> 00:29:15,280
Speaker 1: is your like priority. Let's say that means taxpayers spend

507
00:29:15,320 --> 00:29:17,960
Speaker 1: money on this. It's like, is this really who you

508
00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:24,239
Speaker 1: fucking are? It? Like it's gross to think about, like

509
00:29:24,400 --> 00:29:27,000
Speaker 1: or to be that person. And the other thing they

510
00:29:27,040 --> 00:29:29,800
Speaker 1: spent taxpayer money on was to remove the fountain from

511
00:29:29,840 --> 00:29:34,640
Speaker 1: the park. Because I guess that would you know, all right,

512
00:29:34,680 --> 00:29:36,520
Speaker 1: well they're gonna eat, they better not be somewhere with

513
00:29:36,560 --> 00:29:39,120
Speaker 1: like pretty things. They better not enjoy it, you know,

514
00:29:39,120 --> 00:29:43,560
Speaker 1: have access to a water feature anyway. Um, So food

515
00:29:43,560 --> 00:29:46,160
Speaker 1: not Bomb starts getting it comes up with different tactics

516
00:29:46,160 --> 00:29:48,520
Speaker 1: to deal with all this harassment. Right, people get sick

517
00:29:48,520 --> 00:29:50,959
Speaker 1: of people of the cops stealing their food, so they

518
00:29:50,960 --> 00:29:53,160
Speaker 1: start having decoy food buckets where they put a third

519
00:29:53,200 --> 00:29:55,080
Speaker 1: of the food in the bucket and they go up

520
00:29:55,120 --> 00:29:57,760
Speaker 1: and they set up, and the cops steal the bucket

521
00:29:58,240 --> 00:30:00,880
Speaker 1: and then they're like, oh, shut you stole our food,

522
00:30:00,920 --> 00:30:02,400
Speaker 1: and the cops leaves. So then they bring out the

523
00:30:02,400 --> 00:30:05,240
Speaker 1: next third of a bucket and they serve some people,

524
00:30:05,280 --> 00:30:07,280
Speaker 1: and then the cops steal the food, and then they

525
00:30:07,320 --> 00:30:10,000
Speaker 1: bring out a final third in a third bucket, and

526
00:30:10,040 --> 00:30:12,880
Speaker 1: the flyer that they distribute all over the world being

527
00:30:12,880 --> 00:30:14,200
Speaker 1: like here's how to deal with it if the cops

528
00:30:14,200 --> 00:30:17,520
Speaker 1: are stealing your food is like cops are too embarrassed

529
00:30:17,520 --> 00:30:19,800
Speaker 1: to come back the third time to steal the food.

530
00:30:22,080 --> 00:30:23,880
Speaker 1: And I don't know whether it's they're too embarrassed that

531
00:30:23,920 --> 00:30:27,320
Speaker 1: they got like looney Tunes tricked, or if they're just

532
00:30:27,400 --> 00:30:30,640
Speaker 1: embarrassed about the fact that it really hits home about

533
00:30:30,640 --> 00:30:34,280
Speaker 1: the fact that they are like just stealing food. That's

534
00:30:34,360 --> 00:30:37,480
Speaker 1: what their job is, is steal food from the mouths

535
00:30:37,480 --> 00:30:41,480
Speaker 1: of hungry people. And Keith mckennry, the founder guy that

536
00:30:41,720 --> 00:30:43,400
Speaker 1: you know I have the most information about, he was

537
00:30:43,520 --> 00:30:48,360
Speaker 1: arrested ninety four times between which is more than once

538
00:30:48,400 --> 00:30:50,959
Speaker 1: a month for seven years straight. As he puts it,

539
00:30:51,000 --> 00:30:53,760
Speaker 1: he was framed up on three other felonies during that time.

540
00:30:53,800 --> 00:30:56,600
Speaker 1: It was facing twenty five years in prison. UM. I

541
00:30:56,640 --> 00:30:59,720
Speaker 1: have no counter argument to this. And during that same

542
00:30:59,760 --> 00:31:02,480
Speaker 1: time period, for example, the FBI had just covered up

543
00:31:02,520 --> 00:31:06,360
Speaker 1: the car bombing of two environmentalists, Judy Barry and Darryl Churney,

544
00:31:06,600 --> 00:31:08,959
Speaker 1: and they the FEDS might have even done the car bombing,

545
00:31:09,000 --> 00:31:11,800
Speaker 1: but the thing that's been proven in court is that

546
00:31:11,840 --> 00:31:14,200
Speaker 1: they at least covered it up, right. So this is

547
00:31:14,240 --> 00:31:16,680
Speaker 1: the so here I am being like ha ha at

548
00:31:16,680 --> 00:31:18,840
Speaker 1: different times, like, actually, no people are getting car bombed

549
00:31:18,880 --> 00:31:23,960
Speaker 1: by the FEDS. Um. Probably, but yeah, yeah, I mean

550
00:31:24,040 --> 00:31:27,520
Speaker 1: it's it's just like it probably is. I mean they

551
00:31:27,560 --> 00:31:30,280
Speaker 1: are the same people. They're worse than they have the

552
00:31:30,320 --> 00:31:34,600
Speaker 1: internet now, but like they're the same people that have

553
00:31:34,680 --> 00:31:38,960
Speaker 1: always been doing this ship. So yeah, it is different.

554
00:31:38,960 --> 00:31:43,000
Speaker 1: There was more innocent and less innocent. Yeah, you know,

555
00:31:43,120 --> 00:31:45,640
Speaker 1: in different ways different yea, yeah, yeah, it's just different,

556
00:31:45,760 --> 00:31:50,480
Speaker 1: is honestly the Yeah. Yeah, they're not any less murderous

557
00:31:50,480 --> 00:31:56,280
Speaker 1: in service of right, you know, of their their little society. Yeah,

558
00:31:56,480 --> 00:32:00,440
Speaker 1: just their tactics changed in different situations. Yeah. He spends

559
00:32:00,680 --> 00:32:02,760
Speaker 1: a total of Keith mckennry spends a total of five

560
00:32:02,840 --> 00:32:05,560
Speaker 1: hundred days in jail during this seven year time just

561
00:32:05,600 --> 00:32:09,280
Speaker 1: with all of these minor arrests for serving food. Um,

562
00:32:09,320 --> 00:32:12,560
Speaker 1: and the harassment started gaining so bad that Amnesty International

563
00:32:13,040 --> 00:32:15,320
Speaker 1: was wrote a letter to San Francisco saying that they

564
00:32:15,360 --> 00:32:19,440
Speaker 1: were considering designating food up bombs activists as prisoners of conscience,

565
00:32:19,640 --> 00:32:22,480
Speaker 1: basically saying like, if you, if you don't start harassing

566
00:32:22,480 --> 00:32:27,080
Speaker 1: people based on their political beliefs, that we're going to

567
00:32:27,120 --> 00:32:29,240
Speaker 1: adopt them as prisoners of conscious, you will be breaking

568
00:32:29,280 --> 00:32:31,640
Speaker 1: international law and we will fight for their unconditional release.

569
00:32:32,360 --> 00:32:36,040
Speaker 1: And eventually, two mayors later, food nut bombs just kind

570
00:32:36,080 --> 00:32:39,000
Speaker 1: of wins by default because the city stops at war

571
00:32:39,040 --> 00:32:42,160
Speaker 1: against them and they keep serving food. And thirty years

572
00:32:42,200 --> 00:32:46,400
Speaker 1: after all this stuff they're still serving food, and they

573
00:32:46,440 --> 00:32:48,400
Speaker 1: still serve food all over the world. The current best

574
00:32:48,440 --> 00:32:52,320
Speaker 1: guests there's no official registry of food up bombs. The

575
00:32:52,360 --> 00:32:54,240
Speaker 1: best guess is that there's around five hundred cities in

576
00:32:54,240 --> 00:32:56,880
Speaker 1: the US with chapters and about five more cities around

577
00:32:56,880 --> 00:33:00,440
Speaker 1: the world, and fun bombs of active US have been

578
00:33:00,480 --> 00:33:02,600
Speaker 1: spied on by the FEDS and arrested by cops time

579
00:33:02,600 --> 00:33:06,320
Speaker 1: and time again. Literally, while I was researching this, I

580
00:33:06,360 --> 00:33:09,479
Speaker 1: messaged Sophia since I figured this out. I ran across

581
00:33:09,480 --> 00:33:11,960
Speaker 1: a memo from the FBI about how they were spying

582
00:33:11,960 --> 00:33:14,440
Speaker 1: on Denver Food Not Bombs in two thousand four, which

583
00:33:14,520 --> 00:33:19,080
Speaker 1: is um when I was in Denver coun bombs, and

584
00:33:19,120 --> 00:33:22,479
Speaker 1: it stuck out to me because they're describing how they

585
00:33:22,520 --> 00:33:25,080
Speaker 1: were trying to get information out of my neighbors, like

586
00:33:25,120 --> 00:33:27,760
Speaker 1: our house ran one day of cooking, and different houses

587
00:33:27,760 --> 00:33:30,520
Speaker 1: across the city ran different days of it, and some

588
00:33:30,600 --> 00:33:33,640
Speaker 1: punks like some it's like punks did it some days,

589
00:33:33,680 --> 00:33:38,400
Speaker 1: students did it other days, whatever, and and so. The

590
00:33:38,400 --> 00:33:41,920
Speaker 1: the document points out that while they arrested eight activists

591
00:33:41,920 --> 00:33:44,120
Speaker 1: at the Food Not Bombs house, none of them nor

592
00:33:44,200 --> 00:33:45,880
Speaker 1: any of the other people at the residents that the

593
00:33:45,920 --> 00:33:49,440
Speaker 1: FBI was trying to question gave any information to the investigation,

594
00:33:49,920 --> 00:33:52,920
Speaker 1: which rules and is what how you all should handle

595
00:33:53,920 --> 00:33:56,560
Speaker 1: interactions with the federal police. You tell them that you

596
00:33:56,680 --> 00:33:59,840
Speaker 1: have representation and that UM ask for their card and

597
00:34:00,080 --> 00:34:01,840
Speaker 1: does the only information you give them. You don't lie

598
00:34:01,840 --> 00:34:06,040
Speaker 1: to them and you don't tell them anything anyway. So

599
00:34:07,560 --> 00:34:10,040
Speaker 1: after the fall of the Soviet Union, let's just jump

600
00:34:10,040 --> 00:34:14,000
Speaker 1: gears really quick, run up. Bombs springs up all over

601
00:34:14,080 --> 00:34:18,719
Speaker 1: Russia and the former Communist block Poland, Ukraine, Serbia, Croatia, Hungary, Romania, Bulgaria,

602
00:34:18,760 --> 00:34:22,440
Speaker 1: and Russia all have or had chapters, and the stakes

603
00:34:22,480 --> 00:34:25,880
Speaker 1: there are a bit higher than they've been for a

604
00:34:25,920 --> 00:34:29,520
Speaker 1: lot of the U S chapters. In November two thousand five,

605
00:34:30,200 --> 00:34:33,919
Speaker 1: a food nut bombser in St. Petersburg Team or cache Vera,

606
00:34:34,520 --> 00:34:36,680
Speaker 1: was hanging out at a cafe a few hours after

607
00:34:36,719 --> 00:34:39,319
Speaker 1: serving food in the park. A crew of bone heads,

608
00:34:39,320 --> 00:34:42,239
Speaker 1: which are Nazi skinheads, swarmed him, chanting and this will

609
00:34:42,239 --> 00:34:44,720
Speaker 1: be a familiar chance to Americans that they were chanting

610
00:34:44,760 --> 00:34:51,600
Speaker 1: anti Antifa Nazis restrained teamer while another another Nazi who

611
00:34:51,680 --> 00:34:55,279
Speaker 1: was only fourteen years old, stabbed him to death five

612
00:34:55,280 --> 00:34:57,960
Speaker 1: times in the neck and teamer was it was an

613
00:34:57,960 --> 00:35:00,359
Speaker 1: anarchist and a philosophy student. He was twenty is old

614
00:35:00,400 --> 00:35:03,759
Speaker 1: and he played in a punk band called Sandinista. Two

615
00:35:03,800 --> 00:35:06,399
Speaker 1: years later, Bone had swarmed food not bombs in St.

616
00:35:06,440 --> 00:35:09,920
Speaker 1: Petersburg again, and if I'm reading the various articles correctly,

617
00:35:09,920 --> 00:35:13,560
Speaker 1: they swarmed the actual feeding itself. This time they attacked

618
00:35:13,640 --> 00:35:16,880
Speaker 1: and another food nut bombs are Ivan yelling. He survives,

619
00:35:17,239 --> 00:35:20,239
Speaker 1: but he got stabbed twenty times for serving food in

620
00:35:20,280 --> 00:35:22,880
Speaker 1: the park. And while he was recovering in the hospital,

621
00:35:23,040 --> 00:35:25,000
Speaker 1: dozens of his friends showed up to donate blood at

622
00:35:25,000 --> 00:35:27,120
Speaker 1: the hospital. Some came from as far away as Moscow,

623
00:35:27,160 --> 00:35:29,720
Speaker 1: which is like an eight hour train ride. Basically people

624
00:35:29,960 --> 00:35:33,319
Speaker 1: coming in solidarity too to offer their blood. I'm sure

625
00:35:33,320 --> 00:35:34,879
Speaker 1: they had plenty of blood. I hope that people showed

626
00:35:34,920 --> 00:35:36,640
Speaker 1: up then gave blood to other people in the hospital,

627
00:35:38,080 --> 00:35:42,399
Speaker 1: which is an interesting escalation of mutual aid. And then

628
00:35:42,440 --> 00:35:45,239
Speaker 1: on the flourth of February two thousand seven, Nazis went

629
00:35:45,280 --> 00:35:48,320
Speaker 1: for the ultimate irony and they bombed the food nut bombs.

630
00:35:48,960 --> 00:35:51,719
Speaker 1: No one gets killed, Uh, they just want to like

631
00:35:51,800 --> 00:35:53,879
Speaker 1: say that up front so there's less tension around that

632
00:35:54,320 --> 00:35:57,040
Speaker 1: they hid a bomb in the flower stall, and it's

633
00:35:58,320 --> 00:36:00,600
Speaker 1: I hate to laugh at this. It's to go off

634
00:36:00,600 --> 00:36:03,279
Speaker 1: at the time of the feeding, but the jokes on

635
00:36:03,320 --> 00:36:08,120
Speaker 1: the Nazis because feeding was run by punks and so

636
00:36:08,160 --> 00:36:12,600
Speaker 1: they were late. So the bomb goes off before anyone arrives,

637
00:36:12,800 --> 00:36:15,080
Speaker 1: and no one was hurt. And they've had people as

638
00:36:15,160 --> 00:36:18,080
Speaker 1: usual on the day that Nazis tried to bomb them.

639
00:36:18,120 --> 00:36:19,799
Speaker 1: I said at the very beginning where I was like,

640
00:36:19,800 --> 00:36:21,600
Speaker 1: in this time, no one gets killed by Nazis, and

641
00:36:21,640 --> 00:36:25,759
Speaker 1: actually one person gets killed by And I didn't. I didn't.

642
00:36:25,800 --> 00:36:27,880
Speaker 1: I should have probably known where I was going. I was.

643
00:36:28,239 --> 00:36:31,800
Speaker 1: I was more chuckling at the you know, we're anti

644
00:36:31,880 --> 00:36:35,399
Speaker 1: anti five Yeah, yeah, you're just fascist. It's fine, yeah,

645
00:36:35,440 --> 00:36:42,240
Speaker 1: your regulars Yeah yeah, no, I no, totally. Um yeah.

646
00:36:42,520 --> 00:36:44,520
Speaker 1: And I remember when this happened. It hit us all

647
00:36:44,600 --> 00:36:47,719
Speaker 1: kind of hard, and it was like kind of sobering, right, um,

648
00:36:47,760 --> 00:36:50,520
Speaker 1: because we would get harassed for serving food nut bombs

649
00:36:50,560 --> 00:36:52,360
Speaker 1: and like a couple of times I've served food, not bombs,

650
00:36:52,360 --> 00:36:54,080
Speaker 1: are eating it with like riot police all around and

651
00:36:54,120 --> 00:36:57,879
Speaker 1: helicopters overhead and all that ship. But fucking Russia, they're

652
00:36:57,880 --> 00:37:02,400
Speaker 1: getting bombed for it. And and the attacks were focused.

653
00:37:02,960 --> 00:37:04,960
Speaker 1: It's the same focus in the U. S. It's it's

654
00:37:04,960 --> 00:37:07,480
Speaker 1: about who controls spaces. Right in the US, it is

655
00:37:07,520 --> 00:37:09,239
Speaker 1: the government is like, we control the parks. And in

656
00:37:09,280 --> 00:37:10,920
Speaker 1: Russia at the time, the Nazis were like, no, we

657
00:37:11,000 --> 00:37:14,880
Speaker 1: control the parks, and so it was they were attacking

658
00:37:15,680 --> 00:37:19,160
Speaker 1: the the St. Petersburg d i y leftist n anarchist

659
00:37:19,200 --> 00:37:22,880
Speaker 1: punk scene which organized against the fascists under the name Antifa,

660
00:37:23,440 --> 00:37:26,440
Speaker 1: and so the regular are not fans of Antifa, and

661
00:37:26,520 --> 00:37:31,719
Speaker 1: so you know, no, it's but it's just like it's

662
00:37:31,760 --> 00:37:40,360
Speaker 1: like again, if you're murdering people for like handing out food,

663
00:37:40,880 --> 00:37:43,239
Speaker 1: it's it's I mean, but that's like such a like

664
00:37:43,760 --> 00:37:47,759
Speaker 1: fascist through line, and it's just like and that is

665
00:37:47,760 --> 00:37:49,400
Speaker 1: a little you know, we talked, I talked about it.

666
00:37:49,400 --> 00:37:52,040
Speaker 1: It's like me not understanding, you know. I was sort

667
00:37:52,080 --> 00:37:55,880
Speaker 1: of like, I guess I was still also just like

668
00:37:55,960 --> 00:37:59,399
Speaker 1: not not not clear, but like when I was talking

669
00:37:59,400 --> 00:38:02,080
Speaker 1: about just the small amount of mutual aid stuff I've

670
00:38:02,120 --> 00:38:04,399
Speaker 1: been doing over the last couple of years, and like

671
00:38:04,520 --> 00:38:08,560
Speaker 1: the like relative paranoia I feel that you know, these

672
00:38:08,760 --> 00:38:13,520
Speaker 1: these you know of patriots like have and I think

673
00:38:13,560 --> 00:38:16,080
Speaker 1: that the thing that is it's like because in my

674
00:38:16,200 --> 00:38:17,680
Speaker 1: in my mind, it's like, what are they gonna do

675
00:38:17,760 --> 00:38:20,520
Speaker 1: kill us for handing out you know, granola bars? And

676
00:38:20,560 --> 00:38:25,000
Speaker 1: the answer is yes, depends on how far things but yeah, yeah,

677
00:38:25,040 --> 00:38:29,480
Speaker 1: but the answer is yes. Like so so that's like

678
00:38:29,640 --> 00:38:32,040
Speaker 1: hard to internalize. And I think that is. It's like

679
00:38:32,239 --> 00:38:34,960
Speaker 1: because often you like come to this sort of thing

680
00:38:35,000 --> 00:38:41,040
Speaker 1: with like the energy of this is like a social thing,

681
00:38:41,960 --> 00:38:43,719
Speaker 1: or at least it's part of it, and it's like

682
00:38:44,440 --> 00:38:48,719
Speaker 1: very hard to not you know, to realize that like yes,

683
00:38:49,239 --> 00:38:52,680
Speaker 1: like we are like doing something, but it's like we're

684
00:38:52,680 --> 00:38:56,480
Speaker 1: actually there is an element of parel to this that

685
00:38:56,640 --> 00:39:00,279
Speaker 1: is hard to like kind of like really realized sometimes. Right,

686
00:39:00,320 --> 00:39:03,279
Speaker 1: the ship is like real and like even though it

687
00:39:03,320 --> 00:39:07,880
Speaker 1: shouldn't be. It's literally just handing out fucking snacks and

688
00:39:07,960 --> 00:39:12,360
Speaker 1: like hand sanity and almost every single food not bombs

689
00:39:12,400 --> 00:39:19,400
Speaker 1: feeding that happens worldwide is pleasant with good mediocre to

690
00:39:19,480 --> 00:39:23,239
Speaker 1: good food depending on the cooks, and a good environment

691
00:39:23,280 --> 00:39:27,160
Speaker 1: and safe, you know and like and I definitely wouldn't

692
00:39:27,280 --> 00:39:31,400
Speaker 1: discourage people. You know, um, if you're in Moscow right now,

693
00:39:31,400 --> 00:39:35,279
Speaker 1: it's a lot more complicated, right um, but you know,

694
00:39:35,360 --> 00:39:38,720
Speaker 1: and and things will get more complicated here as things happen.

695
00:39:38,840 --> 00:39:45,040
Speaker 1: But but that's going to be true. It's yeah, but

696
00:39:45,160 --> 00:39:50,560
Speaker 1: it is also like yeah, like elements of like there's

697
00:39:50,600 --> 00:39:55,239
Speaker 1: always something you can do. M So it's like, you know,

698
00:39:55,400 --> 00:39:59,040
Speaker 1: if you get to the point where it feels perilous

699
00:39:59,080 --> 00:40:01,480
Speaker 1: to be there and person, there's things you can do,

700
00:40:01,640 --> 00:40:04,360
Speaker 1: and it feels perilous to like be with a collective

701
00:40:04,400 --> 00:40:08,000
Speaker 1: group of people cooking or organizing or whatever, there's things

702
00:40:08,040 --> 00:40:13,239
Speaker 1: you can do. Yeah, something, there's always more. You can

703
00:40:13,280 --> 00:40:15,520
Speaker 1: always be doing more than you've been doing, and like,

704
00:40:16,320 --> 00:40:18,800
Speaker 1: and it can always be something that plays to your strength,

705
00:40:18,960 --> 00:40:20,719
Speaker 1: and it doesn't have to be something that is like

706
00:40:21,040 --> 00:40:23,040
Speaker 1: you can think about what you are willing to risk

707
00:40:23,520 --> 00:40:26,560
Speaker 1: and then think about how you can go about meeting

708
00:40:26,560 --> 00:40:28,879
Speaker 1: your own needs and still engage, you know, and like

709
00:40:29,560 --> 00:40:32,880
Speaker 1: just being the person to call like food co ops

710
00:40:32,960 --> 00:40:37,280
Speaker 1: or big chain organic stores or regular stores and be like, hey,

711
00:40:37,360 --> 00:40:40,160
Speaker 1: I'm working with you know food nut bombs or if

712
00:40:40,400 --> 00:40:43,600
Speaker 1: if they're burned on that make up some other I

713
00:40:43,640 --> 00:40:46,440
Speaker 1: don't know legality what I'm saying, um, find ways to

714
00:40:46,480 --> 00:40:49,239
Speaker 1: get donations of food and like I think, I think, yeah,

715
00:40:49,280 --> 00:40:52,280
Speaker 1: you probably can just not name the yeah, yeah, place,

716
00:40:52,840 --> 00:40:56,120
Speaker 1: I suppose but yeah, yeah, yeah, there's always something. I

717
00:40:56,120 --> 00:40:58,680
Speaker 1: mean I think that I was doing UM. Also during

718
00:40:58,719 --> 00:41:00,879
Speaker 1: the George Floyd uprising, was like trying to help out

719
00:41:00,920 --> 00:41:06,239
Speaker 1: with UM just listening to the police scanner, which was

720
00:41:06,280 --> 00:41:09,240
Speaker 1: also illuminating in that I was like, oh, these people

721
00:41:09,239 --> 00:41:12,920
Speaker 1: are both like it was whild listening to cops be

722
00:41:13,239 --> 00:41:17,840
Speaker 1: legitimately sound afraid. I mean, they're fucking you know, fascist cowards,

723
00:41:18,239 --> 00:41:20,560
Speaker 1: but it really was. I was like, Oh, you're scared

724
00:41:20,600 --> 00:41:24,399
Speaker 1: of like I know who's in that crowd, Like you're

725
00:41:24,440 --> 00:41:28,960
Speaker 1: looking scared of them. You feel towards like you have guns,

726
00:41:29,040 --> 00:41:32,640
Speaker 1: you're the violent one. And that's I mean because fascism

727
00:41:32,680 --> 00:41:35,480
Speaker 1: is the cowards ideology, Like it's that's why they only

728
00:41:35,480 --> 00:41:38,400
Speaker 1: attack when they're in big groups. That's why, you know,

729
00:41:38,520 --> 00:41:42,359
Speaker 1: like yeah, um, and when there's a fair fight, they

730
00:41:42,400 --> 00:41:46,440
Speaker 1: backed down. It seems like not universally, but it um

731
00:41:47,000 --> 00:41:48,560
Speaker 1: and a lot of what I mean not even not

732
00:41:48,640 --> 00:41:50,520
Speaker 1: even a fair fight. Yeah, but I mean you see

733
00:41:50,560 --> 00:41:53,440
Speaker 1: it like in Portland and like all like if you

734
00:41:53,560 --> 00:41:57,320
Speaker 1: just like can stand up and be organized, the fucking

735
00:41:57,400 --> 00:42:00,920
Speaker 1: proud boy type folks just like they're too stupid and

736
00:42:01,080 --> 00:42:05,120
Speaker 1: weak and scared, and I mean it is the difference

737
00:42:05,160 --> 00:42:07,920
Speaker 1: in the ideologies. It's like they don't have each other's backs.

738
00:42:09,360 --> 00:42:11,920
Speaker 1: So so the reason they need like the swarm is

739
00:42:11,920 --> 00:42:17,520
Speaker 1: because it's they're they're so brittle, because they are so cowardly. Yeah, yeah,

740
00:42:17,680 --> 00:42:20,359
Speaker 1: I mean it's it's literally just I'm afraid of the other.

741
00:42:20,520 --> 00:42:22,759
Speaker 1: That is the it seems to me, is the core

742
00:42:22,840 --> 00:42:27,399
Speaker 1: of fascism, you know. And yeah, so speaking of people

743
00:42:27,440 --> 00:42:29,839
Speaker 1: standing up to fascism, this isn't an ad break. This

744
00:42:29,920 --> 00:42:33,400
Speaker 1: is just mere talking more about some of these Russian

745
00:42:33,400 --> 00:42:37,080
Speaker 1: food numbers. But it could be dogs stand up the fascists.

746
00:42:38,239 --> 00:42:40,640
Speaker 1: Some of them, some of them, I don't know. Okay,

747
00:42:41,000 --> 00:42:43,960
Speaker 1: that's a hard one. Favorite famously a bunch of them

748
00:42:44,000 --> 00:42:48,040
Speaker 1: love fascists. Yeah, okay, um, well probably a lot of

749
00:42:48,200 --> 00:42:51,080
Speaker 1: a lot of our most famous dogs are pro fascism,

750
00:42:51,800 --> 00:42:57,760
Speaker 1: you know. Alright, alright, fine, regrettably, I'm just saying, yeah, no,

751
00:42:57,760 --> 00:43:03,120
Speaker 1: no more dogs. More dogs are cops and are not coughs.

752
00:43:03,840 --> 00:43:07,439
Speaker 1: More dogs are not cops, but more famous dogs are cops. Yeah,

753
00:43:07,440 --> 00:43:11,040
Speaker 1: but there's riot dogs all over Greece and various countries

754
00:43:11,040 --> 00:43:15,200
Speaker 1: in South America and Central America. Who who hate cops?

755
00:43:15,520 --> 00:43:18,279
Speaker 1: All right? Well then here's some unrelated advertisements. Because we

756
00:43:18,320 --> 00:43:26,839
Speaker 1: live in a capitalistic hell world. Yes, and we are

757
00:43:26,920 --> 00:43:30,880
Speaker 1: back and we are talking about unat bombs in Russia

758
00:43:31,320 --> 00:43:35,799
Speaker 1: and Fudna bombs continues in Russia, I believe to this day.

759
00:43:36,320 --> 00:43:40,240
Speaker 1: During the invasion, well at the beginning of the current

760
00:43:40,320 --> 00:43:44,360
Speaker 1: invasion of the Russian invasion of Ukraine Moscow, Funat Bombs

761
00:43:44,360 --> 00:43:48,200
Speaker 1: put out a hasty translation of a statement which is

762
00:43:49,239 --> 00:43:51,399
Speaker 1: in order to keep an increase the benefits in their hands.

763
00:43:51,480 --> 00:43:54,279
Speaker 1: The government declares wars who will collect their intestines with

764
00:43:54,320 --> 00:43:56,200
Speaker 1: their hands, who will have their arms and legs torn

765
00:43:56,200 --> 00:43:59,200
Speaker 1: off by explosions, whose families will bury their children. Of course,

766
00:43:59,239 --> 00:44:01,440
Speaker 1: all of this does not apply to the ruling minority.

767
00:44:01,719 --> 00:44:04,279
Speaker 1: We must resist the militaristic regime and the war it

768
00:44:04,360 --> 00:44:07,040
Speaker 1: is waging with all of our might. Spread information among

769
00:44:07,040 --> 00:44:10,759
Speaker 1: your comrades, fight as best you can and uh. And

770
00:44:10,760 --> 00:44:13,319
Speaker 1: then they've been doing that. The A bunch of food

771
00:44:13,360 --> 00:44:16,759
Speaker 1: nut bombs activists were arrested in February and anti war demonstration.

772
00:44:17,080 --> 00:44:18,919
Speaker 1: You can see the video. It's literally just some people

773
00:44:18,920 --> 00:44:22,200
Speaker 1: walking down the street with a banner and cops grabbing

774
00:44:22,239 --> 00:44:25,440
Speaker 1: them off the street and arresting them. And then in

775
00:44:25,520 --> 00:44:29,759
Speaker 1: March at a Food Not Bombs feeding unknown assailants. They

776
00:44:29,880 --> 00:44:31,479
Speaker 1: might have been cops, they might have been just piece

777
00:44:31,480 --> 00:44:34,600
Speaker 1: of ship. Warmongers, kidnapped four people out of Food nat Bombs,

778
00:44:34,640 --> 00:44:36,520
Speaker 1: threw them into a car, drove them out in the forest,

779
00:44:36,560 --> 00:44:38,360
Speaker 1: said they were going to make them dig their own graves,

780
00:44:38,840 --> 00:44:40,359
Speaker 1: dropped them off one by one and beat the ship

781
00:44:40,440 --> 00:44:43,320
Speaker 1: out of them with police batons and seriously wounded several

782
00:44:43,320 --> 00:44:46,520
Speaker 1: of them. I believe all of them, but I'm not sure. Um.

783
00:44:46,600 --> 00:44:50,120
Speaker 1: Belarus Food Not Bombs has been going since two thousands six,

784
00:44:50,120 --> 00:44:54,160
Speaker 1: but they had to suspend operations in January two because

785
00:44:54,160 --> 00:44:57,920
Speaker 1: of the repression there of the anarchist movement because Belarus

786
00:44:58,000 --> 00:45:01,360
Speaker 1: is boot looking for Putin and end that things have

787
00:45:01,360 --> 00:45:05,080
Speaker 1: been going real hard for them there. Um, But that

788
00:45:05,200 --> 00:45:07,560
Speaker 1: was a terrible bummer note for me to end this

789
00:45:07,600 --> 00:45:09,600
Speaker 1: part about Food nat Bombs on There's actually one more

790
00:45:09,680 --> 00:45:12,440
Speaker 1: story that's related to mutual Aid than I want to say.

791
00:45:12,520 --> 00:45:14,000
Speaker 1: But if you have a way to quickly turn this

792
00:45:14,040 --> 00:45:16,160
Speaker 1: around on a positive note about Food not Bombs, I'm

793
00:45:16,520 --> 00:45:18,200
Speaker 1: I'm looking at how I wrote the script and I'm

794
00:45:18,239 --> 00:45:21,040
Speaker 1: not proud. Well, I mean, I think the thing that

795
00:45:21,400 --> 00:45:24,920
Speaker 1: is like it's the scary part, but it is the

796
00:45:25,239 --> 00:45:29,560
Speaker 1: like real part, which is like again, I came to

797
00:45:29,719 --> 00:45:33,600
Speaker 1: mutual aid mainly because you know, the world, but also

798
00:45:33,840 --> 00:45:37,719
Speaker 1: like it was like honestly just for my own mental health,

799
00:45:37,880 --> 00:45:41,160
Speaker 1: like such a like important thing. It wind up being

800
00:45:41,320 --> 00:45:43,960
Speaker 1: to like do something and it's like there's a social

801
00:45:44,000 --> 00:45:48,239
Speaker 1: element to it, but like not that it's good that

802
00:45:49,480 --> 00:45:52,000
Speaker 1: this is this is a political action that is like

803
00:45:53,200 --> 00:45:58,279
Speaker 1: violently repressed by literal fascists. But I think it's the

804
00:45:58,320 --> 00:46:00,760
Speaker 1: extent that there's a silver lining for like an American

805
00:46:00,840 --> 00:46:04,400
Speaker 1: audience is like this is like you are part of

806
00:46:04,520 --> 00:46:07,960
Speaker 1: something actually powerful when you do things like this. Um

807
00:46:08,200 --> 00:46:12,080
Speaker 1: that Again, it's it's that like you know, you look

808
00:46:12,120 --> 00:46:15,000
Speaker 1: around and like for me, I'm like, god, everyone see

809
00:46:15,080 --> 00:46:17,719
Speaker 1: here seems really fucking paranoid, and it's like they're not,

810
00:46:18,200 --> 00:46:21,520
Speaker 1: but they're not bad. You know. It's still like like

811
00:46:22,920 --> 00:46:26,200
Speaker 1: at least there's that power there of realizing that you

812
00:46:26,280 --> 00:46:32,640
Speaker 1: are like really doing something. Um can be helpful, but yeah,

813
00:46:32,719 --> 00:46:35,239
Speaker 1: it's sucking hard obviously, Now that makes sense. I mean,

814
00:46:35,320 --> 00:46:37,359
Speaker 1: like we live in a society that tries to deny

815
00:46:37,440 --> 00:46:40,640
Speaker 1: us agency, right, that's like one of its main structural

816
00:46:40,800 --> 00:46:46,520
Speaker 1: ideas um and and here's just a a really good,

817
00:46:46,960 --> 00:46:53,319
Speaker 1: almost always very safe way to claim agency. And also this, uh,

818
00:46:54,320 --> 00:46:56,279
Speaker 1: the society we're living in right now is trying to

819
00:46:56,719 --> 00:46:58,600
Speaker 1: live in the society at large, but trunks of it

820
00:46:58,960 --> 00:47:01,279
Speaker 1: are trying to disappear people and more and more people

821
00:47:01,320 --> 00:47:03,800
Speaker 1: are trying are starting to fall through the cracks. And

822
00:47:03,920 --> 00:47:06,200
Speaker 1: it's not a coincidence from my point of view that

823
00:47:06,200 --> 00:47:08,719
Speaker 1: this is happening as other things in the world are

824
00:47:08,719 --> 00:47:12,040
Speaker 1: getting worse. And and here's a way that you can

825
00:47:12,320 --> 00:47:15,160
Speaker 1: help stop that. You know that there's that there's that

826
00:47:15,239 --> 00:47:17,600
Speaker 1: fucking poem about the you know, first they came for

827
00:47:17,760 --> 00:47:21,520
Speaker 1: and then they came for and like great, like give

828
00:47:21,600 --> 00:47:26,000
Speaker 1: people give stuff to people who are homeless, Like that's good.

829
00:47:26,280 --> 00:47:29,600
Speaker 1: That is part of that. That is part of stopping

830
00:47:29,680 --> 00:47:31,680
Speaker 1: that chain of events that does lead to you and

831
00:47:31,800 --> 00:47:36,719
Speaker 1: I you know, like, um, you know the other like

832
00:47:36,960 --> 00:47:39,279
Speaker 1: purely selfish way, if if you want to look at

833
00:47:39,280 --> 00:47:42,279
Speaker 1: it this way, it's like like we're talking about like

834
00:47:42,360 --> 00:47:47,560
Speaker 1: sort of like in vaguely like militaristic terms. But the

835
00:47:47,680 --> 00:47:51,759
Speaker 1: thing is it's like again, I am passed probably my

836
00:47:51,920 --> 00:47:55,960
Speaker 1: brick throwing days, but like why do you keep winking

837
00:47:56,040 --> 00:48:02,200
Speaker 1: when you say that though, Oh sorry anyway, Uh no,

838
00:48:02,320 --> 00:48:09,640
Speaker 1: I really am even even even like very funny though

839
00:48:10,120 --> 00:48:13,399
Speaker 1: carrying carrying a folding table. The other day, I was like, god, damn,

840
00:48:16,080 --> 00:48:19,759
Speaker 1: I'm like I just can't yeah like you. Here's why

841
00:48:20,239 --> 00:48:22,480
Speaker 1: not because I'm like, it's it's I'm just like you.

842
00:48:22,880 --> 00:48:26,120
Speaker 1: You don't want me. I'm not. I'm not best used

843
00:48:26,360 --> 00:48:29,480
Speaker 1: on brick throwing duty on either side of things. It's

844
00:48:29,520 --> 00:48:33,840
Speaker 1: just like not, it's not good for anyone. However, it

845
00:48:34,040 --> 00:48:35,520
Speaker 1: was a thing where I was like during like some

846
00:48:35,640 --> 00:48:40,320
Speaker 1: of the darkest and the like perpetual upcoming darkest moments,

847
00:48:40,400 --> 00:48:43,640
Speaker 1: like the darkest moments that come is that like these

848
00:48:43,719 --> 00:48:47,320
Speaker 1: motherfucker's who are like the paranoid people who are just

849
00:48:47,480 --> 00:48:49,880
Speaker 1: like you know, in my eyes, paranoid people who are

850
00:48:50,280 --> 00:48:55,360
Speaker 1: like handing out cranola bars, etcetera. Like when if and

851
00:48:55,480 --> 00:48:59,840
Speaker 1: when like shit really goes bad, like this is the network,

852
00:49:00,000 --> 00:49:03,360
Speaker 1: this is the thing that becomes a resistance or whatever

853
00:49:03,640 --> 00:49:05,719
Speaker 1: or like if not these people, then something like it

854
00:49:05,920 --> 00:49:09,239
Speaker 1: or something adjacent to it or like and you know

855
00:49:09,480 --> 00:49:13,120
Speaker 1: it's real because these people have been out on the

856
00:49:13,280 --> 00:49:17,359
Speaker 1: street doing ship spending their own like energy and money

857
00:49:17,520 --> 00:49:22,719
Speaker 1: and like time, Like if they were knarcs, it would

858
00:49:22,760 --> 00:49:24,640
Speaker 1: be you know, they deserve it because I think they

859
00:49:24,760 --> 00:49:31,560
Speaker 1: put in years this ship. So it's like, yeah, fine,

860
00:49:32,080 --> 00:49:35,120
Speaker 1: send me to jail. It's great. Yeah, there's this old

861
00:49:35,160 --> 00:49:37,680
Speaker 1: earth first thing where Earth firsts would be like, Okay,

862
00:49:37,719 --> 00:49:39,480
Speaker 1: once you figure out who the cop is in the group,

863
00:49:39,560 --> 00:49:42,640
Speaker 1: you don't you don't kick them out. You just have

864
00:49:42,760 --> 00:49:46,640
Speaker 1: them take all the notes. You just like make sure

865
00:49:46,680 --> 00:49:50,160
Speaker 1: that they pay for everything. I am not recommending this

866
00:49:50,280 --> 00:49:52,799
Speaker 1: as a strategy. I am not trying to opine about

867
00:49:52,840 --> 00:49:56,000
Speaker 1: how groups should deal with infiltration. I am merely relaying

868
00:49:56,080 --> 00:50:00,920
Speaker 1: a thing that has happened in the past. U No, truly,

869
00:50:00,920 --> 00:50:04,600
Speaker 1: because well but yeah, but it's it's like just the

870
00:50:04,719 --> 00:50:08,920
Speaker 1: element of like, you know, yeah, just again on a

871
00:50:09,120 --> 00:50:12,520
Speaker 1: purely selfish level, it was like, these are the folks

872
00:50:12,680 --> 00:50:16,239
Speaker 1: that I having demonstrated having their back, they're going to

873
00:50:16,320 --> 00:50:19,759
Speaker 1: have my back. Um, and and the people you meet,

874
00:50:19,840 --> 00:50:23,000
Speaker 1: I don't know. It's like, I mean, you know, if

875
00:50:23,120 --> 00:50:25,279
Speaker 1: that's another way to look at it, it's like you're

876
00:50:25,360 --> 00:50:28,640
Speaker 1: just building the structures that hopefully we will never need

877
00:50:28,719 --> 00:50:31,279
Speaker 1: in a real way, but what we already use them

878
00:50:31,320 --> 00:50:34,719
Speaker 1: in a real way. And I've always been about you know,

879
00:50:34,920 --> 00:50:38,160
Speaker 1: I think that this dichotomy between the self interest in

880
00:50:38,200 --> 00:50:42,319
Speaker 1: the community interest is a false dichotomy because being part

881
00:50:42,400 --> 00:50:44,960
Speaker 1: of a healthy community that takes care of people rules

882
00:50:45,080 --> 00:50:48,160
Speaker 1: for me as an individual, Like I love food not

883
00:50:48,280 --> 00:50:50,480
Speaker 1: bombs because I ate it us so much, and it

884
00:50:50,640 --> 00:50:52,399
Speaker 1: let me not have a job and just run around

885
00:50:52,400 --> 00:50:54,600
Speaker 1: and hop freight trains badly and mostly failed at that

886
00:50:54,680 --> 00:50:57,799
Speaker 1: and hitchhike around and like live the life I wanted

887
00:50:57,840 --> 00:51:01,680
Speaker 1: to lead in my twenties, right, and and also, yeah,

888
00:51:01,800 --> 00:51:04,279
Speaker 1: building these networks is like one of the only ways

889
00:51:04,320 --> 00:51:05,640
Speaker 1: that I can, like, I mean, I'm not doing the

890
00:51:05,680 --> 00:51:07,239
Speaker 1: work of building these networks now. I just run a

891
00:51:07,280 --> 00:51:10,800
Speaker 1: podcast and read history books also rules, but I don't know,

892
00:51:10,800 --> 00:51:13,680
Speaker 1: I mean part knowing these networks exist is part of

893
00:51:13,800 --> 00:51:16,480
Speaker 1: literally how I sleep as well as I do as

894
00:51:16,480 --> 00:51:20,919
Speaker 1: a trans woman in the current environment, you know. So yeah,

895
00:51:21,080 --> 00:51:23,520
Speaker 1: it's like it's like at least you kind of have

896
00:51:23,640 --> 00:51:28,120
Speaker 1: a sense that, look, you you have a chance, and

897
00:51:28,280 --> 00:51:33,800
Speaker 1: you have people who are like organized and doing something,

898
00:51:33,880 --> 00:51:37,440
Speaker 1: and look, yeah, not not everything thing is going to succeed.

899
00:51:37,800 --> 00:51:44,399
Speaker 1: Mostly it doesn't success, but yeah, you know it's something. Yeah, yeah,

900
00:51:44,840 --> 00:51:47,880
Speaker 1: well that does not actually naturally lead to. But I

901
00:51:47,920 --> 00:51:50,600
Speaker 1: want to pivot to talk about the final final part

902
00:51:50,680 --> 00:51:53,320
Speaker 1: of this whole thing, which is I bet you're wondering.

903
00:51:53,719 --> 00:51:55,160
Speaker 1: I know a lot of people at home are wondering,

904
00:51:55,680 --> 00:51:59,560
Speaker 1: what do gay birds have to do with mutual aid?

905
00:52:01,560 --> 00:52:04,560
Speaker 1: And and I am an answer for you, because this

906
00:52:04,719 --> 00:52:07,120
Speaker 1: is going to be a story that talks about the

907
00:52:07,200 --> 00:52:09,840
Speaker 1: origins of mutual aid as a as a term at least,

908
00:52:10,400 --> 00:52:13,160
Speaker 1: and it brings us back to Russia, where the land

909
00:52:13,239 --> 00:52:15,279
Speaker 1: where the government says there are no gay people. Um,

910
00:52:15,400 --> 00:52:16,920
Speaker 1: I don't know whether they say or not there's any

911
00:52:16,960 --> 00:52:23,600
Speaker 1: gay birds. But so I can't remember the name of

912
00:52:23,640 --> 00:52:25,560
Speaker 1: the magazine, and I'm so annoyed. I spent so long

913
00:52:25,640 --> 00:52:27,640
Speaker 1: trying to find this magazine. But I read this magazine

914
00:52:27,640 --> 00:52:30,040
Speaker 1: in two thousand four. It was about gay birds and

915
00:52:30,160 --> 00:52:34,320
Speaker 1: mutual aid. And I wish I had a time machine

916
00:52:34,360 --> 00:52:35,960
Speaker 1: so I'd go back and tell younger me that, like

917
00:52:36,200 --> 00:52:38,400
Speaker 1: one day, all of these things that I read that

918
00:52:38,480 --> 00:52:40,400
Speaker 1: give me my ideas, I'll actually have to decite them

919
00:52:40,440 --> 00:52:44,480
Speaker 1: and source them. I would not have believed you. And

920
00:52:45,040 --> 00:52:47,799
Speaker 1: I find this magazine in a trash can, and it's

921
00:52:47,800 --> 00:52:50,600
Speaker 1: about science. It's a science magazine I don't remember the

922
00:52:50,680 --> 00:52:53,719
Speaker 1: name of it, and as an article, and it's talking

923
00:52:53,800 --> 00:52:57,280
Speaker 1: about scientists are finally starting to talk about gay animals

924
00:52:57,320 --> 00:53:00,560
Speaker 1: in the early the turn of the millennia, the early

925
00:53:00,640 --> 00:53:03,640
Speaker 1: auts and um, and they're trying to figure out what

926
00:53:03,680 --> 00:53:08,520
Speaker 1: the funk it means for evolutionary science. So so this

927
00:53:08,680 --> 00:53:11,120
Speaker 1: brings us to Darwin, and I promise we'll come back

928
00:53:11,120 --> 00:53:13,160
Speaker 1: to the birds. You might have heard of this guy,

929
00:53:13,680 --> 00:53:17,800
Speaker 1: this guy named Charles Darwin. H soph he's nodding, so

930
00:53:17,840 --> 00:53:23,279
Speaker 1: if he's heard of this guy and um, he's this

931
00:53:23,440 --> 00:53:26,280
Speaker 1: rich white British science dude who was like, whoa evolution?

932
00:53:26,760 --> 00:53:28,720
Speaker 1: And then more than that, he was like, whoa natural

933
00:53:28,760 --> 00:53:31,520
Speaker 1: selection is? What drives evolution? And he wrote a book

934
00:53:31,520 --> 00:53:34,640
Speaker 1: about it. And the book is called whoa Natural Selection?

935
00:53:34,680 --> 00:53:37,000
Speaker 1: The Origin of the Species or something like that, and

936
00:53:37,080 --> 00:53:43,080
Speaker 1: he wrote a direct quotes, Yeah, damn darge. And he

937
00:53:43,239 --> 00:53:45,480
Speaker 1: was actually way cooler than most of the people who

938
00:53:45,520 --> 00:53:48,200
Speaker 1: came after him, who invoke his name, and way cooler

939
00:53:48,280 --> 00:53:50,480
Speaker 1: than I expected him to be when I started researching

940
00:53:50,520 --> 00:53:53,320
Speaker 1: this part of the story. Among other things that have

941
00:53:53,400 --> 00:53:55,399
Speaker 1: nothing to do with today's story, he he and other

942
00:53:55,440 --> 00:53:59,240
Speaker 1: scientists helped intervene on behalf of a French geographer, Ali Raclu,

943
00:53:59,480 --> 00:54:01,440
Speaker 1: who fought the Paris Commune and was like going to

944
00:54:01,520 --> 00:54:05,160
Speaker 1: be executed for trying to overthrow France basically, and all

945
00:54:05,160 --> 00:54:07,040
Speaker 1: these scientists were like, no, you can't execute him. He's

946
00:54:07,040 --> 00:54:10,759
Speaker 1: our guy, he's like a scientist. Darwin was also an abolitionist. Um.

947
00:54:11,040 --> 00:54:13,960
Speaker 1: He pushed back against race science that invoked his name,

948
00:54:14,680 --> 00:54:18,600
Speaker 1: and he argued against any kind of like social planning

949
00:54:18,719 --> 00:54:22,000
Speaker 1: that led to eugenics um and he believed that people

950
00:54:22,040 --> 00:54:23,920
Speaker 1: needed to be free to reproduce as they wanted, which

951
00:54:24,000 --> 00:54:26,200
Speaker 1: is again since most eugenics is sort of based in

952
00:54:26,320 --> 00:54:28,359
Speaker 1: calling itself darwinistic. I feel like it's a big deal,

953
00:54:28,719 --> 00:54:31,279
Speaker 1: and specifically it's kind of interesting to me because he

954
00:54:31,360 --> 00:54:33,800
Speaker 1: didn't deny this like concept of like, I guess you

955
00:54:33,840 --> 00:54:37,960
Speaker 1: could change how humans work by selective breeding. But what

956
00:54:38,080 --> 00:54:41,840
Speaker 1: he says is, and this is a paraphrase, not a quote, Okay,

957
00:54:42,000 --> 00:54:45,040
Speaker 1: some traits are genetic, but if you control who reproduces,

958
00:54:45,080 --> 00:54:47,200
Speaker 1: you will get rid of the single best trait in humanity,

959
00:54:47,239 --> 00:54:50,239
Speaker 1: which is our capacity for empathy. And so he's just like, no,

960
00:54:50,320 --> 00:54:51,759
Speaker 1: I would never work. And I kind of like that.

961
00:54:51,840 --> 00:54:54,040
Speaker 1: That's like a science approach to being like you can't

962
00:54:54,040 --> 00:54:56,480
Speaker 1: do this racist thing because of this like science, you

963
00:54:56,560 --> 00:55:01,319
Speaker 1: know well, but also too, it's like because that isn't

964
00:55:01,360 --> 00:55:04,520
Speaker 1: how it works. It's like you need variance and randomness

965
00:55:04,640 --> 00:55:09,600
Speaker 1: and like trying to direct it is not going to work. Yeah,

966
00:55:09,640 --> 00:55:13,160
Speaker 1: it's just wrong on some fucking levels. Uh, what wasn't wrong?

967
00:55:13,880 --> 00:55:17,399
Speaker 1: Where his iconic mutton shops, which later became an epic

968
00:55:17,480 --> 00:55:20,000
Speaker 1: wizard beard. That almost makes me sad. I got laser

969
00:55:20,040 --> 00:55:22,400
Speaker 1: hair removal. It's such a good bed. I don't know why.

970
00:55:22,480 --> 00:55:24,480
Speaker 1: It's everyone has wizard beards back in the day, but

971
00:55:24,560 --> 00:55:26,560
Speaker 1: Darwin is particularly good. Now that I don't hate him,

972
00:55:26,560 --> 00:55:30,440
Speaker 1: I kind of always assumed he was. I don't know.

973
00:55:31,160 --> 00:55:34,440
Speaker 1: I mean I think, like all learned people of the time,

974
00:55:35,000 --> 00:55:38,399
Speaker 1: you're still grating on a curve. It's true. He um, yeah,

975
00:55:38,400 --> 00:55:44,200
Speaker 1: I'm gonna get to some of that. Um sorry, no, no, okay.

976
00:55:44,239 --> 00:55:47,400
Speaker 1: So he was like, whoa, look how species differentiate, and

977
00:55:47,480 --> 00:55:50,120
Speaker 1: other people were like, yes, this justifies imperialism and the

978
00:55:50,160 --> 00:55:52,640
Speaker 1: abuse of the poor. The strong survived the meek parish

979
00:55:53,280 --> 00:55:55,360
Speaker 1: and he had to like waste his time being like,

980
00:55:55,840 --> 00:55:58,400
Speaker 1: maybe you shouldn't base policy on what made one animal

981
00:55:58,480 --> 00:56:02,799
Speaker 1: into another animal. Yeah, And he does spend a while

982
00:56:02,880 --> 00:56:06,480
Speaker 1: trying to figure out colonialism is comparable to evolutionary natural selection.

983
00:56:06,960 --> 00:56:10,040
Speaker 1: And he also believes that men naturally dominate over women

984
00:56:10,160 --> 00:56:14,120
Speaker 1: because of genetics or whatever. Um yeah, well, I mean

985
00:56:14,239 --> 00:56:18,200
Speaker 1: I think it's like just so hard to like any scientists.

986
00:56:18,239 --> 00:56:22,040
Speaker 1: It's like I think as humans clearly were like wired

987
00:56:22,080 --> 00:56:28,360
Speaker 1: to believe like it's if it happens, yeah, it's good. Yeah, totally.

988
00:56:28,400 --> 00:56:32,840
Speaker 1: It's like, yeah, it definitely happens. But like one of

989
00:56:32,920 --> 00:56:35,719
Speaker 1: the trademarks of being human is realizing that things that

990
00:56:35,880 --> 00:56:39,759
Speaker 1: happen aren't good just because they happen totally. Yeah, it's

991
00:56:39,840 --> 00:56:44,680
Speaker 1: like wild, like yes, yes, absolutely, you know, survival of

992
00:56:44,760 --> 00:56:50,440
Speaker 1: the fittest occurs, but is it good? Yeah, and there

993
00:56:50,480 --> 00:56:54,160
Speaker 1: are other options and that's what other scientists. But first

994
00:56:54,200 --> 00:56:56,080
Speaker 1: I'm to talk about scientists who took it the wrong way.

995
00:56:57,080 --> 00:56:59,800
Speaker 1: So oh, and that's the final note about Darwin total

996
00:57:00,000 --> 00:57:02,640
Speaker 1: aience nerd uh. The year before he dies, he's like

997
00:57:02,719 --> 00:57:05,560
Speaker 1: seventy something and which in the nineteenth century means you're

998
00:57:05,600 --> 00:57:08,239
Speaker 1: kicking as because the life expectancy is forty for men

999
00:57:08,520 --> 00:57:11,520
Speaker 1: in England at the time that he's alive. Um, there's

1000
00:57:11,520 --> 00:57:14,360
Speaker 1: almost doubled that. And the year before he dies he

1001
00:57:14,400 --> 00:57:16,720
Speaker 1: publishes his last work. And his last work is called

1002
00:57:16,720 --> 00:57:19,000
Speaker 1: The Formation of Vegetable Mole through the Action of Worms,

1003
00:57:19,960 --> 00:57:22,960
Speaker 1: and I just, yeah, I love it. He's a science guy.

1004
00:57:23,680 --> 00:57:26,680
Speaker 1: He never stopped. Um. And so there's two ways you

1005
00:57:26,720 --> 00:57:29,080
Speaker 1: can take all of the stuff he says. And there's

1006
00:57:29,120 --> 00:57:31,840
Speaker 1: the reasonable way and the way that doesn't make any

1007
00:57:31,880 --> 00:57:34,720
Speaker 1: fucking sense. And the guy who took it the most

1008
00:57:34,840 --> 00:57:36,800
Speaker 1: the way it doesn't make any fucking sense, is best

1009
00:57:36,840 --> 00:57:39,560
Speaker 1: exemplified at least by this guy named Herbert Spencer. There's

1010
00:57:39,600 --> 00:57:42,920
Speaker 1: another white British dude. He also has iconic mutton shops.

1011
00:57:43,360 --> 00:57:47,360
Speaker 1: Herbert Spencer should have been cool. His parents were Quakers,

1012
00:57:47,880 --> 00:57:50,960
Speaker 1: he grew up anti authoritarian and socialist and militantly feminist.

1013
00:57:51,480 --> 00:57:53,960
Speaker 1: As someone who is all of those things, I like that. Um.

1014
00:57:54,840 --> 00:57:57,720
Speaker 1: Then he took a turn to the hard right libertarian thing,

1015
00:57:58,240 --> 00:58:01,240
Speaker 1: and he started opposing women's suffering and saying that all

1016
00:58:01,320 --> 00:58:03,840
Speaker 1: socialism is slavery and that at sure is good that

1017
00:58:03,960 --> 00:58:06,080
Speaker 1: all the inferior races are being wiped off the face

1018
00:58:06,120 --> 00:58:08,400
Speaker 1: of the earth. And he spent time complaining about race

1019
00:58:08,480 --> 00:58:11,200
Speaker 1: mixing deluding the white race. He doesn't sound anything like

1020
00:58:11,280 --> 00:58:14,200
Speaker 1: people who are around today. He's the one who coined

1021
00:58:14,240 --> 00:58:18,560
Speaker 1: the term survival of the fittest, and he laid the

1022
00:58:18,800 --> 00:58:22,320
Speaker 1: philosophical groundwork for what later became right wing libertarianism and

1023
00:58:22,440 --> 00:58:26,040
Speaker 1: the economics of I've got Mine, Fuck you. Um, survival

1024
00:58:26,240 --> 00:58:30,280
Speaker 1: fit is truly is yeah, like just a tiny sliver

1025
00:58:30,560 --> 00:58:36,240
Speaker 1: of the theory is like yeah, no exactly. And for

1026
00:58:36,360 --> 00:58:40,040
Speaker 1: some odd reason, this guy died alone and lonely. I'm

1027
00:58:40,080 --> 00:58:44,280
Speaker 1: not it's hard to imagine why. Um. He also might

1028
00:58:44,320 --> 00:58:47,080
Speaker 1: have invented the paper clip. There's a lot of people

1029
00:58:47,120 --> 00:58:49,560
Speaker 1: who claim to have invented the paper clip. He is

1030
00:58:49,600 --> 00:58:55,240
Speaker 1: a month. So that's like the social Darwinism side, all

1031
00:58:55,280 --> 00:58:58,040
Speaker 1: about competition. The thing is, although that Darwin didn't only

1032
00:58:58,080 --> 00:59:01,400
Speaker 1: write about competition. He also wrote about co operation. And

1033
00:59:01,520 --> 00:59:04,160
Speaker 1: this brings me back to the gay animals, because all

1034
00:59:04,200 --> 00:59:07,280
Speaker 1: these Darwinists, they're not the social Darmans particularly a problem.

1035
00:59:07,480 --> 00:59:09,360
Speaker 1: If every animal is just trying to fucking pass on

1036
00:59:09,400 --> 00:59:11,120
Speaker 1: their genes as widely as possible, then why are some

1037
00:59:11,200 --> 00:59:13,560
Speaker 1: of them gay? Which for a long time people just

1038
00:59:13,680 --> 00:59:15,640
Speaker 1: ignored the fact that dogs are animals were gay. But

1039
00:59:15,680 --> 00:59:19,080
Speaker 1: have you met a dog like, I don't know. I

1040
00:59:19,200 --> 00:59:21,479
Speaker 1: only have one dog, and my dog is gay as fuck.

1041
00:59:22,400 --> 00:59:26,040
Speaker 1: My dog gay as fuck. Yeah, I'm pretty sure my

1042
00:59:26,120 --> 00:59:28,800
Speaker 1: dog's pan, but I haven't like proven this, partly because

1043
00:59:28,840 --> 00:59:37,400
Speaker 1: I am removed his capacity to yeah. Yeah. But so

1044
00:59:37,720 --> 00:59:40,120
Speaker 1: some animals are gay. Uh. For a while in the

1045
00:59:40,200 --> 00:59:43,760
Speaker 1: twentie century, reactionaries used to be like, gayness isn't natural.

1046
00:59:44,120 --> 00:59:46,160
Speaker 1: If it was natural, then animals would be gay, and

1047
00:59:46,200 --> 00:59:49,280
Speaker 1: there's no gay animals. And then finally someone was like, yeah,

1048
00:59:49,280 --> 00:59:51,920
Speaker 1: there's so many gay animals, and so now reactionaries instead

1049
00:59:51,960 --> 00:59:54,720
Speaker 1: have to be like, we are better than those gay animals.

1050
00:59:54,800 --> 00:59:59,280
Speaker 1: That's what makes us human, you know. Um. And but

1051
00:59:59,400 --> 01:00:01,919
Speaker 1: then around the beginning century, basically people were like, okay,

1052
01:00:01,920 --> 01:00:03,840
Speaker 1: we have to address the fact that animals are gay.

1053
01:00:04,720 --> 01:00:09,040
Speaker 1: And people were like, but why how does this work

1054
01:00:09,120 --> 01:00:11,560
Speaker 1: with if all we believe is survival of the fittest?

1055
01:00:12,360 --> 01:00:14,520
Speaker 1: And the answer is something that evolutionary biologs just have

1056
01:00:14,520 --> 01:00:16,760
Speaker 1: been talking about for a hundred god damn fucking years,

1057
01:00:17,360 --> 01:00:22,040
Speaker 1: And basically they realized a couple of things hundred goddamn

1058
01:00:22,160 --> 01:00:24,520
Speaker 1: years ago. One, sometimes animals do things just because things

1059
01:00:24,560 --> 01:00:28,040
Speaker 1: are fun. Um, we're not actually robots, Animals try to

1060
01:00:28,320 --> 01:00:31,000
Speaker 1: aren't just trying to maximize the reproduction or whatever. Birds

1061
01:00:31,040 --> 01:00:33,120
Speaker 1: fly around and flocks because like, holy sh it, we

1062
01:00:33,160 --> 01:00:37,240
Speaker 1: can fucking fly the rules, you know, and fucking is

1063
01:00:37,320 --> 01:00:40,520
Speaker 1: also fun unless you're unlucky enough to be like sucking

1064
01:00:40,560 --> 01:00:42,920
Speaker 1: a right wing dude who buys into the Ben Shapiro thing,

1065
01:00:43,160 --> 01:00:47,400
Speaker 1: which case you're not necessarily having a good time all

1066
01:00:47,480 --> 01:00:50,720
Speaker 1: of them, or you know, have other drama that whatever. Anyway, anyway,

1067
01:00:53,760 --> 01:00:55,960
Speaker 1: but also, gay animals are good for community, and this

1068
01:00:56,160 --> 01:00:57,560
Speaker 1: is the main thing that was in this article that

1069
01:00:57,600 --> 01:00:59,680
Speaker 1: I read that like have I had my mind explode

1070
01:00:59,720 --> 01:01:03,760
Speaker 1: moment or whatever about this um. Gay animals foster kids,

1071
01:01:04,120 --> 01:01:08,040
Speaker 1: and they also allow for relationships like within the animal

1072
01:01:08,080 --> 01:01:11,800
Speaker 1: communities that aren't just like one boy ostrich one and

1073
01:01:11,920 --> 01:01:14,800
Speaker 1: making this animal up for an example, and one girl

1074
01:01:14,880 --> 01:01:17,760
Speaker 1: ostrich or whatever. As you have a greater capacity for

1075
01:01:17,880 --> 01:01:20,600
Speaker 1: love within the community, and it turns out that that

1076
01:01:20,760 --> 01:01:24,920
Speaker 1: makes everyone happier, live longer, and everything is good. So

1077
01:01:25,680 --> 01:01:27,960
Speaker 1: this is a confirmation of this fight that had been

1078
01:01:28,040 --> 01:01:31,439
Speaker 1: going on a hundred years ago competition versus cooperation, which

1079
01:01:31,560 --> 01:01:35,040
Speaker 1: wasn't actually competition versus cooperation. It was one side saying

1080
01:01:35,120 --> 01:01:37,680
Speaker 1: competition is the only thing that happens, and the other

1081
01:01:37,760 --> 01:01:40,920
Speaker 1: side saying it's both. It's always been both, it will

1082
01:01:40,960 --> 01:01:46,320
Speaker 1: always be both. Yeah. Well, that's also like cooperation is.

1083
01:01:47,880 --> 01:01:52,360
Speaker 1: Typically it's cooperation within a sphere that helps a larger

1084
01:01:52,400 --> 01:01:57,080
Speaker 1: group possibly compete with you know, different groups or societies

1085
01:01:57,200 --> 01:02:02,800
Speaker 1: or whatever. Yeah. The champion of this other school of

1086
01:02:02,920 --> 01:02:05,520
Speaker 1: evolutionary biology was not other than a friend of the podcast,

1087
01:02:05,560 --> 01:02:09,200
Speaker 1: Peter Kropotkin, who was this Russian prince. He's another rich

1088
01:02:09,240 --> 01:02:12,040
Speaker 1: white guy, let's be honest, and he renounces his royalty

1089
01:02:12,160 --> 01:02:15,560
Speaker 1: to declare war on Czarist Russia and all states. Uh.

1090
01:02:15,840 --> 01:02:17,840
Speaker 1: He dedicates his life to the twin goals of science

1091
01:02:17,840 --> 01:02:20,080
Speaker 1: and anarchism. He breaks out of the most impossible to

1092
01:02:20,160 --> 01:02:22,400
Speaker 1: break out of prison in Russia in the nineteenth century

1093
01:02:22,760 --> 01:02:25,720
Speaker 1: to circumnavigate the world to foster revolution of let's take

1094
01:02:25,720 --> 01:02:27,480
Speaker 1: care of each other like I watched some animals do

1095
01:02:27,600 --> 01:02:31,000
Speaker 1: while I was a biologist. And so he's the anti Spencer,

1096
01:02:31,160 --> 01:02:33,560
Speaker 1: the survival of the fittest guy, and he writes a

1097
01:02:33,600 --> 01:02:35,400
Speaker 1: book about it, and his book about it is called

1098
01:02:35,680 --> 01:02:38,160
Speaker 1: mutual Aid, A Factor and Revolution. Because he's also a

1099
01:02:38,280 --> 01:02:43,120
Speaker 1: very literal title guy and this is where the phrase

1100
01:02:43,280 --> 01:02:46,480
Speaker 1: mutual aid in the modern context comes from. Is this

1101
01:02:46,600 --> 01:02:48,840
Speaker 1: book mutual aid? As far as I can tell, Um,

1102
01:02:48,880 --> 01:02:51,200
Speaker 1: I don't believe this is this is absolutely not the

1103
01:02:51,280 --> 01:02:53,800
Speaker 1: origin of the idea of mutual aid. In fact, since

1104
01:02:53,920 --> 01:02:55,920
Speaker 1: Kropotkin is a scientist, it's like he's like, no, I've

1105
01:02:55,960 --> 01:03:02,800
Speaker 1: observed this, this exists, um, but I don't know. And

1106
01:03:02,840 --> 01:03:04,600
Speaker 1: then he got into all these like arguments about it

1107
01:03:04,600 --> 01:03:06,440
Speaker 1: at the time. But basically people like sort of forgot

1108
01:03:06,480 --> 01:03:08,600
Speaker 1: about all of these arguments, and it was all of

1109
01:03:08,640 --> 01:03:11,680
Speaker 1: the Russian scientists all not just the leftists, were like no, no, no,

1110
01:03:11,800 --> 01:03:15,440
Speaker 1: it's cooperation, it's both you know. Um, but the sort

1111
01:03:15,480 --> 01:03:18,440
Speaker 1: of further West idea kind of one over for a

1112
01:03:18,480 --> 01:03:21,600
Speaker 1: long time. Yeah, it's so yeah, so id I mean,

1113
01:03:21,720 --> 01:03:24,560
Speaker 1: I I learned most of the bog biological side of

1114
01:03:24,640 --> 01:03:30,040
Speaker 1: this from now right wing lunatic Richard Dawkins's books. Um,

1115
01:03:30,360 --> 01:03:36,680
Speaker 1: but his like books on you know, on genetics, correct, Okay,

1116
01:03:37,200 --> 01:03:39,800
Speaker 1: it's his ideas of how to apply them to women

1117
01:03:40,280 --> 01:03:45,080
Speaker 1: Muslims that, yeah, which Darwin would have had a fucking

1118
01:03:45,240 --> 01:03:49,600
Speaker 1: fist fight with him over. Yeah. Well, I think I mean, look,

1119
01:03:49,680 --> 01:03:53,960
Speaker 1: this might be just me liking an older thing. But

1120
01:03:54,120 --> 01:03:57,240
Speaker 1: I would have thought that the older version of Richard

1121
01:03:57,560 --> 01:04:00,360
Speaker 1: or the younger version of Richard Dawkins would also feel

1122
01:04:00,440 --> 01:04:03,040
Speaker 1: the same way. But truly, what do I know? Yeah,

1123
01:04:03,400 --> 01:04:06,720
Speaker 1: we we can reckon it either way and just declare

1124
01:04:06,960 --> 01:04:10,000
Speaker 1: that young Richard Dawkins would absolutely fistfight, would be the

1125
01:04:10,160 --> 01:04:14,760
Speaker 1: champion four Darwin in the fight to death. Maybe even

1126
01:04:14,800 --> 01:04:17,680
Speaker 1: as you say it out loud, that sounds crazy, all right.

1127
01:04:18,520 --> 01:04:24,160
Speaker 1: My idea about the younger Richard Duckin sounds you know,

1128
01:04:24,400 --> 01:04:30,360
Speaker 1: just not the fighting part, the being a good person part. Yeah, yeah, okay,

1129
01:04:30,480 --> 01:04:34,480
Speaker 1: who knows, Well, that's that's kind of So that's like

1130
01:04:34,560 --> 01:04:37,440
Speaker 1: the phenomenon, right, they went observed this phenomenon, and it's

1131
01:04:37,440 --> 01:04:40,000
Speaker 1: a phenomenon that food not bombs, and literally countless other

1132
01:04:40,040 --> 01:04:44,680
Speaker 1: individuals and organizations such as Solidarity and Snacks not Solidarity

1133
01:04:44,720 --> 01:04:50,880
Speaker 1: not Snacks, which was the precursor or popular Um, has

1134
01:04:50,960 --> 01:04:53,000
Speaker 1: been using this phenomenon all over the world and it

1135
01:04:53,080 --> 01:04:55,600
Speaker 1: is a phenomenon that rules. And that is my my

1136
01:04:55,760 --> 01:04:59,160
Speaker 1: story of food not bombs and mutual aid. That's oh

1137
01:04:59,240 --> 01:05:01,320
Speaker 1: my god, thank you for having it for this has

1138
01:05:01,360 --> 01:05:04,480
Speaker 1: been like lovely and educational, but also I think like

1139
01:05:05,080 --> 01:05:07,000
Speaker 1: it is. It is this like double edge thing of

1140
01:05:07,160 --> 01:05:09,800
Speaker 1: like the history is interesting, but one of the important

1141
01:05:09,840 --> 01:05:13,680
Speaker 1: parts of the I think the rules you talked about

1142
01:05:13,760 --> 01:05:17,040
Speaker 1: last week is like the most important part is like

1143
01:05:17,800 --> 01:05:21,760
Speaker 1: you know, yeah, but also these these people weren't gods

1144
01:05:21,840 --> 01:05:27,200
Speaker 1: that founded this thing. You know, It's like they made mistakes. Um,

1145
01:05:27,400 --> 01:05:31,840
Speaker 1: and it's fine, but the basic bedrock is fine and

1146
01:05:32,000 --> 01:05:36,920
Speaker 1: usable and adjustable. Yeah, totally. Yeah, but again, careful when

1147
01:05:36,920 --> 01:05:38,520
Speaker 1: you're serving that meat because it's a real pain in

1148
01:05:38,560 --> 01:05:42,600
Speaker 1: the g s on the streets. Totally. Andrew, do you

1149
01:05:42,680 --> 01:05:44,440
Speaker 1: have any thing you'd like to plug at the end

1150
01:05:44,480 --> 01:05:47,800
Speaker 1: here for us? Oh? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, well yeah,

1151
01:05:47,840 --> 01:05:51,400
Speaker 1: if you've enjoyed listening to me talk, Um, I'm going

1152
01:05:51,440 --> 01:05:54,760
Speaker 1: to be on tour with a couple more dates, not

1153
01:05:54,880 --> 01:05:58,160
Speaker 1: really tours or a mini tour with my podcasts This

1154
01:05:58,280 --> 01:06:00,640
Speaker 1: Racist I co hosted with Tony News So um, we're

1155
01:06:00,640 --> 01:06:04,120
Speaker 1: going to be in Austin on August and Brooklyn on

1156
01:06:04,600 --> 01:06:10,200
Speaker 1: September time. So possibly the single least profitable way to

1157
01:06:10,240 --> 01:06:16,320
Speaker 1: put together a tour humanly possible, but it's fun and

1158
01:06:16,480 --> 01:06:19,800
Speaker 1: it's you know, just a nice chance to see everyone. Awesome,

1159
01:06:20,120 --> 01:06:22,760
Speaker 1: And Margaret, you have a book coming out, correct I do.

1160
01:06:23,040 --> 01:06:25,439
Speaker 1: It's called we Won't Be Here Tomorrow, and I didn't

1161
01:06:25,480 --> 01:06:27,520
Speaker 1: have a pun prepared about the fact that the title

1162
01:06:27,600 --> 01:06:29,720
Speaker 1: reference okay anyway, And you can get it from a

1163
01:06:29,840 --> 01:06:32,080
Speaker 1: k Press or you can get it from different independent

1164
01:06:32,120 --> 01:06:33,960
Speaker 1: bookstores and if you preorder it, you get an art

1165
01:06:34,000 --> 01:06:36,600
Speaker 1: print and it comes out September twenty and it's full

1166
01:06:36,680 --> 01:06:40,200
Speaker 1: of all of my short stories about uh, I don't know.

1167
01:06:40,240 --> 01:06:44,760
Speaker 1: There's like a trans woman who feeds men too. She

1168
01:06:44,920 --> 01:06:46,960
Speaker 1: robs men and then feeds them to her mermaid lover

1169
01:06:47,320 --> 01:06:49,280
Speaker 1: and then it's like, you know, a whole parable imagine that.

1170
01:06:49,920 --> 01:06:54,040
Speaker 1: And there's another one about someone who uses drones to

1171
01:06:54,240 --> 01:06:58,400
Speaker 1: troll CEOs into quitting. And there's another one about the

1172
01:06:58,560 --> 01:07:01,600
Speaker 1: dead from Valhalla back and fight in the civil war

1173
01:07:01,680 --> 01:07:06,120
Speaker 1: against Nazis because there's no Nazis in Valhalla. Um, if

1174
01:07:06,120 --> 01:07:08,480
Speaker 1: you like that kind of thing, yeah, I know, it's

1175
01:07:08,520 --> 01:07:13,280
Speaker 1: kind of a it's a little bit of Apama, you know.

1176
01:07:14,560 --> 01:07:17,080
Speaker 1: Uh So you can you can buy that and also

1177
01:07:17,280 --> 01:07:19,560
Speaker 1: you can, um listen to my podcasts. I have a

1178
01:07:19,560 --> 01:07:21,600
Speaker 1: podcast called Cool People Who Did Cool Stuff, which is

1179
01:07:21,680 --> 01:07:24,120
Speaker 1: on cool Zone Media and you can't do it every

1180
01:07:24,160 --> 01:07:26,720
Speaker 1: Monday and Wednesday, I have another podcast called Lived Like

1181
01:07:26,760 --> 01:07:29,480
Speaker 1: the World is Dying and it is about individual and

1182
01:07:29,520 --> 01:07:32,800
Speaker 1: community preparedness and you can listen to it also on

1183
01:07:32,840 --> 01:07:35,840
Speaker 1: wherever you find podcasts. Um, but Sophie's not on it,

1184
01:07:36,640 --> 01:07:40,000
Speaker 1: so it's not and we all be sad about that

1185
01:07:40,080 --> 01:07:44,000
Speaker 1: for a moment, a moment of silence. Where can people

1186
01:07:44,080 --> 01:07:47,360
Speaker 1: find you on the Internet? Uh? You can? You can?

1187
01:07:47,440 --> 01:07:50,200
Speaker 1: You can. You can find me on Twitter and Instagram.

1188
01:07:50,960 --> 01:07:53,400
Speaker 1: You can just search my name, I pop up, uh,

1189
01:07:53,880 --> 01:07:56,040
Speaker 1: and then you can follow out cool Zone Media also

1190
01:07:56,240 --> 01:07:59,160
Speaker 1: on Twitter and Instagram. And if you look on the

1191
01:07:59,200 --> 01:08:02,400
Speaker 1: Internet archive, you can find Sophie Lichtman's my Space page.

1192
01:08:02,400 --> 01:08:07,120
Speaker 1: Please don't put, please put, please don't, please don't. It's

1193
01:08:07,200 --> 01:08:11,000
Speaker 1: really it's really not not it baby. If you can

1194
01:08:11,040 --> 01:08:16,040
Speaker 1: find my profile, find my space, don't find mine. I'm

1195
01:08:16,320 --> 01:08:17,720
Speaker 1: gonna tell you the name of the band I was

1196
01:08:17,800 --> 01:08:20,479
Speaker 1: in in two thousand five as on my Space. It's terrible.

1197
01:08:21,160 --> 01:08:25,120
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh. Yeah, So everyone get researching you have

1198
01:08:25,439 --> 01:08:29,920
Speaker 1: a vague sense of your assignment. Yeah yeah, And we'll

1199
01:08:29,920 --> 01:08:33,160
Speaker 1: be back on Monday with another story of cool people

1200
01:08:33,160 --> 01:08:39,840
Speaker 1: who did Cool Stuff. Yeah. By Cool People who Did

1201
01:08:39,920 --> 01:08:42,720
Speaker 1: Cool Stuff is a production of cool zone Media or

1202
01:08:42,760 --> 01:08:45,800
Speaker 1: more podcasts on cool zone Media, Visit our website cool

1203
01:08:45,840 --> 01:08:48,200
Speaker 1: zone media dot com, or check us out on the

1204
01:08:48,360 --> 01:08:51,280
Speaker 1: I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get

1205
01:08:51,360 --> 01:08:52,080
Speaker 1: your podcasts.