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Speaker 1: Hi, and welcome back to the Carol Markowitz Show on iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 1: There's this I don't know do we call it a meme.

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Speaker 1: My kids make fun of me when I call something

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Speaker 1: a meme when it's not. There's this thing going around

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Speaker 1: that Generation Z, that is the generation that is currently

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Speaker 1: in their early late teens to late twenties right now,

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Speaker 1: is quote aging like milk to translate for the olds

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Speaker 1: out there. That means they are looking older far faster

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Speaker 1: than previous generations had. And there have been some funny

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Speaker 1: answers as to why this is. Gen Z themselves say, oh,

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Speaker 1: it's because they are so much more stressed than any

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Speaker 1: other generations, to which I say, haha, stup it. Every

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Speaker 1: time these younger generations list everything they've been through, Like

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Speaker 1: when millennials are like, we live through nine to eleven

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Speaker 1: and wars and recession all of it, I'm like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: gen X was there too, except we didn't have the

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Speaker 1: Internet and all these things that you guys have to

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Speaker 1: make your lives easier. Millennials are having a good time

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Speaker 1: with this whole aging like milk thing, and they're saying

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Speaker 1: that they look better than Gen Z because they ate

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Speaker 1: a lot of preservatives and gen Z was raised on

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Speaker 1: all organic everything. I mean, maybe, you know, wouldn't hurt

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Speaker 1: gen Z to have a twinkie and see what happens.

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Speaker 1: At the same time that this whole conversation is happening online,

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Speaker 1: Kylie Jenner was photographed in Paris with, oh my god,

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Speaker 1: a shadow on her face, and then all of these

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Speaker 1: dermatologists online on Instagram and I assume on TikTok or whatever,

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Speaker 1: but you know, I'm too old for that app wade

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Speaker 1: in to say that it's possible that the shadow on

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Speaker 1: her face was caused by filler that she had had

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Speaker 1: that had migrated to different parts of her face. And look,

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Speaker 1: you know, maybe it is, maybe that's what it was,

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Speaker 1: or maybe she's and her face wasn't as flawless as usual.

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Speaker 2: Kylie actually showed.

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Speaker 1: Up at another event the next night looking perfect, and

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Speaker 1: none of the online you know, experts weighed back in

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Speaker 1: to say what happened to their speculations from the day before.

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Speaker 2: But my take overall here.

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Speaker 1: And why I mentioned Kylie, is that the reason gen

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Speaker 1: Z is aging like milk is because they have no

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Speaker 1: real perception of what reality is. Their entire existence has

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Speaker 1: been looking at very overfiltered photos, and they don't know

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Speaker 1: what aging actually looks like. They've seen everything through this

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Speaker 1: smooth view where you can edit out any wrinkle or blemish.

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Speaker 1: So Kylie was having, you know, a bad face day,

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Speaker 1: and the shock of seeing her face look even slightly

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Speaker 1: imperfect was a multi day news story. I mean, that's crazy.

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Speaker 1: You know. There are days I wake up and I

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Speaker 1: look significantly worse than I looked the day before, and

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Speaker 1: other days, you know, I look better. That's just how

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Speaker 1: life goes. But when you're in the public eye, you

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Speaker 1: have all these people commenting on the tiniest, tiniest little imperfection.

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Speaker 1: I think that's what these gen zers are doing wrong.

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Speaker 1: They think that their face is supposed to be completely

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Speaker 1: perfect at all times. I'm into pictures, you know, I've

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Speaker 1: talked about pictures on here before. I think taking natural

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Speaker 1: pictures is important. I think taking pictures in general is important.

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Speaker 1: I enjoy photography. I was always the person with a

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Speaker 1: camera in my bag in the days before cell phone cameras,

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Speaker 1: So I do spend a lot of time thinking about

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Speaker 1: the way we are portrayed in pictures, how we're perceived,

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Speaker 1: you know.

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Speaker 2: On what that says to young people.

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Speaker 1: I don't use filters at all ever, but I definitely

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Speaker 1: consider it on the days when I don't feel like

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Speaker 1: I'm looking my best and when I see everyone else

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Speaker 1: look so good on their social media, and I know

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Speaker 1: I can easily click something and fix any imperfection and

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Speaker 1: just look better. But I do think it messes up

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Speaker 1: our perception of ourselves and each other. To do that,

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Speaker 1: gen Z needs to have a few weeks of looking

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Speaker 1: at unfiltered photos from bygone eras like maybe the nineties

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Speaker 1: and the eighties to see that they're aging just fine.

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Speaker 1: It's their phones and these apps that are the problem,

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Speaker 1: and they're making them think that they're looking like old milk.

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Speaker 1: I'm still collecting stories for Thursday's episode on how single

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Speaker 1: people can meet someone. Give me your best piece of

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Speaker 1: advice for single people who want to meet someone to

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Speaker 1: date seriously and marry. Write to us at Carol Markowitz

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Speaker 1: Show at gmail dot com or tweet at me at

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Speaker 1: ka rol on x dot com. I'll read some of

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Speaker 1: the responses on the show. So tune in coming up

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Speaker 1: next and interview with John Carney.

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Speaker 2: Join us after the.

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Speaker 1: Break, Hey, and welcome back to The Carol Markowitz Show

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Speaker 1: on iHeartRadio. My guest today is John Carr, Finance and

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Speaker 1: economics editor at Breitbart News. He's the author of the

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Speaker 1: Breitbart Business Digest, the best daily guide on how national

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Speaker 1: and global economics affect you. Larry Kudlow of Fox Business

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Speaker 1: calls it a must read and says it now has

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Speaker 1: a cult following. You can sign up for it at

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Speaker 1: Breitbart dot com slash newsletters.

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Speaker 3: Hi John, Hi Carol, It's good to see you.

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Speaker 2: Really good to see you too. It's been a while.

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Speaker 3: It has been since you departed for the Southern Climbs.

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Speaker 3: It looks like it's done well for you though.

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Speaker 1: See. I feel like I knew you were going to

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Speaker 1: blame me, but actually you left first.

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Speaker 2: Right when did you move?

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Speaker 3: I moved November twenty twenty, so.

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Speaker 1: Right, I mean you were out like a full two

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Speaker 1: years before me, And somehow it's my fall. We don't

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Speaker 1: hang out.

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Speaker 3: And I fled to New York City even before that

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Speaker 3: because they shut everything down. So why, you know, who

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Speaker 3: wants to live in a city where everything is shut down?

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Speaker 3: And my kids couldn't even go to school. So hey,

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Speaker 3: you know, we packed ourselves in a car and drove

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Speaker 3: across America.

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Speaker 1: We lived in this same neighborhood in Park Slope, and I,

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Speaker 1: you know, I always saw you as a very like.

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Speaker 2: Man about town. You are out a lot in New York.

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Speaker 2: You remember at four Square.

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Speaker 1: I was just telling my daughter about four Square for

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Speaker 1: the kids out there. It was an app where we

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Speaker 1: used to check in wherever we were and John Carney's

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Speaker 1: four Square was like just super active and all the time.

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Speaker 3: So about it was that it worked, you know, like

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Speaker 3: you could get in somewhere and friends would just show up,

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Speaker 3: and it was it was amazing for that.

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Speaker 1: Well, I have to say my husband, that was like

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Speaker 1: his just nightmare, the fact that like I would check

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Speaker 1: in somewhere and then somebody would stop in and he'd

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Speaker 1: be like, no, So I had to start checking in

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Speaker 1: like when we were leaving a place, because he didn't

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Speaker 1: like people dropping in.

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Speaker 3: At my wife's request, I made a similar concession in

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Speaker 3: that if we were you know, out just the two

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Speaker 3: of us together, I wouldn't check in because people would

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Speaker 3: just you know, drop by all the time. Right.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: She'd be like, I mean she personally would say things

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Speaker 3: like I can't believe this many people would ever want

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Speaker 3: to see you.

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Speaker 1: Well, I would say like you know the term like popular.

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Speaker 1: You know, it's usually reserved for school and like high

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Speaker 1: school or whatever. But John Carney was popular in New York.

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Speaker 1: And so you live in Connecticut. Now, are you still

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Speaker 1: cool or what's going on you?

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Speaker 3: Now? I'm starting to get some cool vibes up here.

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Speaker 3: People are starting to figure out it's you know, it's

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Speaker 3: different you You can't just check into your local place.

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Speaker 3: I mean one of the big differences is you have

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Speaker 3: to make and this is you know, won't be news

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Speaker 3: to women, but for men, having to make an appointment

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Speaker 3: to get a haircut isn't the deal. I used to

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Speaker 3: just walk down the street, go into the local Italian

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Speaker 3: barber shop with the you know, the spinning pole, and

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Speaker 3: you know, sit down, wait a couple of minutes, and

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Speaker 3: then they call you up and you get your haircut. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: you can't really walk into places out here in the country.

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Speaker 3: You have to call ahead, make sure you know, I

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Speaker 3: now have a barber guy. I used to just do

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Speaker 3: as like any of the rooms we were there, they

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Speaker 3: cut my hair. Now I have to be like, is

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Speaker 3: Kyle going to be there? Can I have an appointment?

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Speaker 1: Is that a sign of like getting older or is

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Speaker 1: that suburbs or is that you now need Kyle to

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Speaker 1: cut your hair like it's like it has to be Kyle.

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Speaker 3: Well, it's definitely a sign of of where I live.

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Speaker 3: I don't even live in the suburbs so much. I

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Speaker 3: live on two acres of land. It's more like my

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Speaker 3: neighbors have sheep. I live in the country. I live

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Speaker 3: in their farms around me. Uh, you know, I live

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Speaker 3: in a suburban house. I'm not a farmer. I had

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Speaker 3: some chickens. A fox got to them. I'm not you know,

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Speaker 3: I'm not try enough yet to keep your chickens alive

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Speaker 3: from the box.

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Speaker 2: Sorry chickens.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, my daughter had named them, so it was kind

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Speaker 3: of tragic when they when they got to although she

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Speaker 3: named her favorite one Nugget, which I thought was a

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Speaker 3: pretty dark name for chick You know that's what you're

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Speaker 3: going to become someday, I guess.

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Speaker 1: But still really actually, you know, sooner rather than later

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Speaker 1: the fox gets.

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Speaker 3: To you nuggets for the foxes exactly.

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Speaker 2: So have you enjoyed the move? Have you made friends?

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Speaker 3: I have one of the things, I had a lot

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Speaker 3: of grown up friends when I move out of the

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Speaker 3: city here. I've made a lot of friends through my

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Speaker 3: children and through my church like it's been, which is

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Speaker 3: also really through the kids. Like the people that my

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Speaker 3: kids know, I get to know their parents, and you know,

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Speaker 3: you sort of do this like pushing thing where if

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Speaker 3: you really like one group of you know, one set

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Speaker 3: of parents, you're like, hey, why don't you hang out

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Speaker 3: with her more?

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Speaker 2: And then it never works, right, It's.

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Speaker 3: Been okay, yeah, no, it's nice and there's a lot

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Speaker 3: of hiking around here, and I, you know, now like

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Speaker 3: to know a couple of the dads enough that I can,

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Speaker 3: you know, call up and be like, Hey, I'm going

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Speaker 3: out to Huntington State Park. You want to come with?

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Speaker 3: You come with me? And they do, and you know,

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Speaker 3: we take our dogs, we go on hikes and stuff.

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Speaker 3: So that's the next step. Right At first you need

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Speaker 3: the kids to be the excuse for what you're and

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Speaker 3: then you graduate to the like, no, it's okay, we

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Speaker 3: could you know, we could hang out, don't We don't

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Speaker 3: deep the kids, right, that's.

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Speaker 2: A big step, you know.

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Speaker 1: Making friends in adulthood is a topic we cover a

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Speaker 1: lot on the show because so many people have moved

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Speaker 1: in the last few.

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Speaker 2: Years and it's tough.

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Speaker 1: But I would say, out of all of my guests,

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Speaker 1: you might be doing the best job, because a lot

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Speaker 1: of the answers I get to that question are still like, well,

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Speaker 1: I knew people already from Twitter, and they happen to

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Speaker 1: live near me, so it's going fine.

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Speaker 2: You know, it's not like yours.

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Speaker 1: Seems to be more organic, and even for me, we

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Speaker 1: haven't met that many. We haven't made that many friends

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Speaker 1: like the organic, you know, situational way. A few, we

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Speaker 1: definitely have a few. We have a couple we go

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Speaker 1: out with sometimes, but the majority of our friends are

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Speaker 1: either like from the Internet that I knew before, or

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Speaker 1: like friends of ours from New York who also I mean,

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Speaker 1: obviously Florida was a has been a popular choice in

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Speaker 1: the last few years, so like friends who move down

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Speaker 1: to it.

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Speaker 3: Because I moved to a place where I didn't know

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Speaker 3: anybody right there was you know, there was nobody here.

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Speaker 3: There was a you know, one or two people who

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Speaker 3: I'm friends with on Twitter who live up here, but

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Speaker 3: I don't want to out them, so like, you know,

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Speaker 3: I won't give away where they live, but very few.

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Speaker 3: So in a sense, like out of as you said,

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Speaker 3: I'm a pretty social person and so out of necessity,

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Speaker 3: I've had to you know, be outgoing. But but it

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Speaker 3: is a little bit you said, like high school, it

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Speaker 3: does feel a little bit like you're starting over again.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, completely starting over.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, people make friends with them, and especially I think

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Speaker 3: those of us who have kind of isolating jobs. So

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Speaker 3: a lot of times when people move to new places,

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Speaker 3: you know, they have a new work you know, new workplace,

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Speaker 3: and they go out with their coworkers. I work from

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Speaker 3: home and so exactly don't have that natural group of

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Speaker 3: like coworkers to like invite out. You have to be

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Speaker 3: very intentional if you're going to meet people in social life.

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Speaker 1: And it's also tough, I think, you know, like me,

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Speaker 1: you grew up in New York and right, and I

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Speaker 1: grew up in Manhattan. Yeah, so I grew up in Brooklyn.

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Speaker 1: We you know, have a similar trajectory. And you know,

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Speaker 1: I used to run into people all the time in

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Speaker 1: New York, even though it's this giant city. It was

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Speaker 1: just like because you're from there, you're constantly running into

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Speaker 1: people like on the subway or on the street or

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Speaker 1: at a restaurant or whatever. And so I've been in

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Speaker 1: Florida two years and it only recently have I started

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Speaker 1: running into people and I you know, and both of

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Speaker 1: them were like not super close to my house.

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Speaker 2: It was like, oh, I'm in Florida.

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Speaker 1: And I ran into, you know, a friend of mine

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Speaker 1: on the right line, and then I ran into another

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Speaker 1: friend of mine at a restaurant like forty minutes from

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Speaker 1: my house.

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Speaker 2: So it's been that those are like really cool moments

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Speaker 2: for me.

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Speaker 1: Those were like, oh, yes, this is like I'm starting

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Speaker 1: to like live there.

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Speaker 2: It's like starting to real.

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Speaker 3: My wife makes fun of me because we'll go into

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Speaker 3: like a crowded shopping mall or something and I'll start

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Speaker 3: to look around. I was like, all these people, there

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Speaker 3: must be somebody I know, and she's like, there's no

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Speaker 3: one you know here. But you know, you do get

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Speaker 3: used to that in New York City, as you said,

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Speaker 3: it's a city of eight million people, but you still

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Speaker 3: run into front time, right time, and that because once

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Speaker 3: you move out. I think that's a very New York thing.

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Speaker 3: I think most other places and even other big cities,

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Speaker 3: it's very rare that you have that kind of uh

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Speaker 3: you know, just you know, very common but random uh

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Speaker 3: encounters with people all the time.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, probably because in other places you drive more, whereas

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Speaker 1: in New York you're walking around or you're on the subway,

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Speaker 1: and which is just.

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Speaker 3: More you're interacting with more people all over the time.

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Speaker 3: You're not interested car you know, you don't people. You know,

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Speaker 3: when you're driving around, people you know could drive past

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Speaker 3: you and you wouldn't necessarily even know it's them.

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Speaker 2: Yes, right.

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Speaker 1: I would also say, like near me in South Florida,

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Speaker 1: like I go to the same restaurants that like the.

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Speaker 2: Tourists go to.

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Speaker 3: Where it's in New York.

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Speaker 1: That line is really stark, like you do not go

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Speaker 1: to the same restaurants so the tourists go to, like

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Speaker 1: the tourists go somewhere else entirely.

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Speaker 3: In fact, we stop going to places once once other

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Speaker 3: people start throwing up. We're like, oh yeah, we can't

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Speaker 3: go there. It's too popular now.

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Speaker 1: Right.

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Speaker 2: So do you have a bar, because you had a

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Speaker 2: bar in New York City.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it was Tom and Jerry's, right, it's the bar,

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Speaker 1: and so you don't have that not yet.

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Speaker 3: You know, it's sort of under development. It took a

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Speaker 3: while to find, you know. Tom and Jerry's was like

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Speaker 3: my third bar, you know, because they close. You know,

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Speaker 3: New York City, you know, you have to get used

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Speaker 3: to constant change. They open and close, so I'm still

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Speaker 3: you know, looking around find myavorite places. One thing is, uh,

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Speaker 3: I do do a lot of sort of backyard socializing,

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Speaker 3: which is not something you can do in New York City.

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Speaker 3: You know, I can invite people over to my house.

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Speaker 3: They don't even have to come into my house necessarily,

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Speaker 3: you know. They like during the you know, summertime, it's

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Speaker 3: just you know, we can all hang out. I can

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Speaker 3: cook food, have a I have a one of those

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Speaker 3: like fire pits. I can fire you know. So there

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Speaker 3: there's a lot more of that. One of the reasons

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Speaker 3: in New York City people are in restaurants and bars.

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Speaker 3: And this is something like I discovered that people from

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Speaker 3: around the country don't know. But those bars and restaurants

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Speaker 3: are our living rooms.

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Speaker 2: We have nowhere else to be, don't We.

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Speaker 3: Can't meet up with you know, ten of our friends

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Speaker 3: in our house. We don't have a backyard.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so we've hung out on your stoop in Park Slope.

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Speaker 2: I brought my kids over to your kids on the.

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Speaker 3: Store, you know, which somebody had a roof. We could

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Speaker 3: go up there sometimes, but very but you know, it's

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Speaker 3: usually when you hang out with people, it's going to

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Speaker 3: be in a you know, in an establishment rather than

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Speaker 3: somebody's house in New York City. And so that's been

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Speaker 3: like an adjustment, you know, to realize, like, oh, if

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Speaker 3: I want to hang out with people, I should invite

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Speaker 3: them over. Yeah, she's like not a New York thing

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Speaker 3: to do, right.

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Speaker 1: That is definitely a giant adjustment. So you're a writer,

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Speaker 1: but you're also you're you were a lawyer and you

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Speaker 1: were working I believe one of the top firms in

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Speaker 1: true right am I Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, So but you left it all to go be

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Speaker 2: in media. Why would you do that?

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Speaker 3: Good question? It was more fun. I mean, you know,

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Speaker 3: I thought I would go back to being a lawyer.

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Speaker 3: I left being a lawyer almost twenty years ago, so

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Speaker 3: I'm not going back, I guess. But I did think

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Speaker 3: at the time. I was feeling a little burnt out.

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Speaker 3: It's a lot of work. I was a corporate lawyer

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Speaker 3: doing leverage finance transactions and it and I needed a break.

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Speaker 3: And I it was two thousand and six. There was

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Speaker 3: a lot of ridiculous going in this going on on

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Speaker 3: Wall Street. My clients were kind of ridiculous. I thought

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Speaker 3: it would be really fun to write, and I got

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Speaker 3: to help start a website called deal Breaker. I then

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Speaker 3: got to do Business Insider, I got to do CNBC

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Speaker 3: and then Wall Street Journal, so like things just kept

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Speaker 3: working out. So I never, you know, like the finance.

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Speaker 3: First of all, the financial crisis happened, right, So yeah,

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Speaker 3: if I were thought like, oh, I'll do you know,

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Speaker 3: I'll write for a little while and then I'll go

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Speaker 3: back to work, I ended up writing, like starting to

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Speaker 3: like by making fun of Wall Street. And my basic

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Speaker 3: thesis was like, these people on these idiots on Wall

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Speaker 3: Street don't know what they're doing. Ha ha. And then

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Speaker 3: it like became totally obvious that I was right about that.

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Speaker 3: It wasn't that funny. It was going to destroy the economy.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, it's really your fault to the Yes, well.

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Speaker 3: I do say that it's sort of dark. But I

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Speaker 3: was one of the you know, biggest bet you know,

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Speaker 3: other than the guys who made billions of dollars. I

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Speaker 3: was one of the biggest beneficiaries of the financial crisis

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Speaker 3: because it turned me into one of more serious journalists,

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Speaker 3: but to a lot more people started paying attention to

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Speaker 3: what I was doing, and that worked out.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's you know, that's a good, good ending.

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Speaker 1: And I mean things turned around, you know, economy. Of course,

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Speaker 1: what's your prediction? Now where are we heading?

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Speaker 3: So I think people are going to be surprised that

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Speaker 3: inflation doesn't go away as fast as a lot of

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Speaker 3: the official predictions are. I said last year that inflation

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Speaker 3: was going to last a lot longer than people thought,

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Speaker 3: and it did. I said, we weren't going to have

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Speaker 3: a recession because the economy seemed to be doing like

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Speaker 3: people were shopping a lot. Yeah, well that's happening still today.

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Speaker 3: There's a you know, retail sales come out and you

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Speaker 3: see that they blow out all expectations. I think people

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Speaker 3: are going to be surprised that inflation. We're not going

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Speaker 3: to go up to nine percent inflation like we had

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Speaker 3: two years ago, but we're not going to come down

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Speaker 3: to two percent. We're going to be stuck somewhere in

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Speaker 3: the three to four percent range, which will feel like

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Speaker 3: a lot of inflation because inflation is like interest in

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Speaker 3: your bank account. It compounds, right, you get nine percent

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Speaker 3: one year and three percent the other things didn't get cheaper.

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Speaker 3: They kept going up, just at a slower rate, and

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Speaker 3: that will feel very bad for a lot of people.

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Speaker 1: We're going to take a quick break and be right

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Speaker 1: back on the Carol Markowitch Show. So for those of

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Speaker 1: us who don't know a lot about the financial system,

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Speaker 1: how is it possible that inflation is so high but

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Speaker 1: people keep shopping? Like, where does this money come from?

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Speaker 3: Right? Well, good, good question, So I help you know. Yeah, Well,

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Speaker 3: a big source of idea is government spending. So the

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Speaker 3: initial inflation happened because we had, on the one side,

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Speaker 3: supply constraints and two all of this stimulus money that

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Speaker 3: came from putting in people got checks, but it was

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Speaker 3: beyond just the checks. People also got uh the basically

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Speaker 3: rent a bate abatements because you couldn't get foreclosing upon you.

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Speaker 3: People didn't have to pay off their student loans. So

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Speaker 3: there's a lot more money that people could spend into

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Speaker 3: the economy. And if you look at the size of

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Speaker 3: the government deficit today, a lot of the formal stimulus

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Speaker 3: that's gone away, but the deficit is still really high

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Speaker 3: compared to GDP on a historical basis. And so what

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Speaker 3: that means is that there's still a lot of government

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Speaker 3: pumping of the economy going on and that's where the

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Speaker 3: money comes from. It's you know, sure you might not

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Speaker 3: get a check directly from the government, but government workers

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Speaker 3: are spending money into the economy. Every time government government

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Speaker 3: employee gets a job, they get a paycheck. Every Time

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Speaker 3: the government needs to build a road, it hire you know,

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Speaker 3: it hires a private contractor so there's a lot of

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Speaker 3: spending going on through the government that's helping prop up

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Speaker 3: the economy even though we've had such bad inflation.

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Speaker 1: So are you feeling optimistic on America's near future or pessimistic?

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Speaker 3: Optimistic on growth? Okay, I don't think that growth is

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Speaker 3: going to crater, which puts me at odds with a

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Speaker 3: lot of conservatives. For three years now, conservatives have been saying, oh,

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Speaker 3: you know, we're in a recession already or we're heading

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Speaker 3: into one. I don't think we are. But I'm pessimistic

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Speaker 3: on inflation. I think inflation is going to be more

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Speaker 3: stubborn than people think, and I think eventually that means

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Speaker 3: that the Fed won't cut interest rates as much as

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Speaker 3: people think, and they may even have to start raising

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Speaker 3: rates again, which is basically on nobody's RDAR screen, and

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Speaker 3: that could be pretty damaging to the economy when it happens.

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Speaker 1: What about culturally, what do you think is our largest

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Speaker 1: cultural scietal problem and is it solvable?

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Speaker 3: Well, So, I do think that we are in a

437
00:21:53,720 --> 00:21:57,040
Speaker 3: culture that is increasingly divided. I mean, that's almost a

438
00:21:57,080 --> 00:22:00,400
Speaker 3: cliche now. People are at each other's throat, it's all

439
00:22:00,400 --> 00:22:03,960
Speaker 3: the time. I think that gets worse before it gets better.

440
00:22:04,040 --> 00:22:06,960
Speaker 3: I think that we still have a few years. Like

441
00:22:07,040 --> 00:22:11,120
Speaker 3: right now, people are I can't believe how vicious things are.

442
00:22:12,000 --> 00:22:13,600
Speaker 3: I think that's going to get worse. I don't think

443
00:22:13,640 --> 00:22:16,920
Speaker 3: it gets better. I think people will continue to divide

444
00:22:17,320 --> 00:22:23,320
Speaker 3: until we come to until either we face a horrific

445
00:22:23,760 --> 00:22:27,840
Speaker 3: economic or foreign policy disaster where there's a war, or

446
00:22:27,880 --> 00:22:30,680
Speaker 3: we come to something very close to a civil war frankly,

447
00:22:32,160 --> 00:22:36,640
Speaker 3: and then we will be able to come together again.

448
00:22:36,760 --> 00:22:39,520
Speaker 3: I don't think we are permanently divided, but I do

449
00:22:39,600 --> 00:22:42,919
Speaker 3: think we're going to keep edging towards a crisis for

450
00:22:43,000 --> 00:22:43,399
Speaker 3: a while.

451
00:22:44,200 --> 00:22:46,720
Speaker 1: So I think of all of my guests who I've

452
00:22:46,800 --> 00:22:50,000
Speaker 1: interviewed who have made the move to another state, I

453
00:22:50,000 --> 00:22:52,600
Speaker 1: think you might be the only one who went to

454
00:22:52,640 --> 00:22:53,280
Speaker 1: a blue state.

455
00:22:53,640 --> 00:22:55,720
Speaker 2: And so it's funny, you.

456
00:22:55,680 --> 00:23:01,120
Speaker 1: Know, yeah, right right, weird, But how has that been?

457
00:23:01,240 --> 00:23:02,640
Speaker 1: Like the fact, you know, you say.

458
00:23:02,480 --> 00:23:04,840
Speaker 2: We're very divided and we're at each other's throat.

459
00:23:04,840 --> 00:23:07,880
Speaker 1: It's like I see that much less now in Florida

460
00:23:08,040 --> 00:23:11,280
Speaker 1: because you know, it's a majority red state. But also

461
00:23:11,359 --> 00:23:14,399
Speaker 1: I just think, I guess people are just more normal

462
00:23:14,440 --> 00:23:16,520
Speaker 1: here than in New York. Like I think I see

463
00:23:16,520 --> 00:23:20,199
Speaker 1: a normalcy that I really appreciate. But you move to

464
00:23:20,240 --> 00:23:22,200
Speaker 1: a blue state, Like, what has that been.

465
00:23:22,080 --> 00:23:24,200
Speaker 2: Like for you? You know, politically speaking?

466
00:23:24,400 --> 00:23:28,359
Speaker 3: It's actually really kind of fun because like I'll drive

467
00:23:28,440 --> 00:23:30,240
Speaker 3: down the road and there'll be somebody with like a

468
00:23:30,320 --> 00:23:32,520
Speaker 3: Trump flag outside of their house.

469
00:23:33,160 --> 00:23:35,960
Speaker 2: Yep, Okay, that's.

470
00:23:37,880 --> 00:23:42,320
Speaker 3: Like I end up. It becomes division actually becomes something

471
00:23:42,320 --> 00:23:43,399
Speaker 3: that unites people.

472
00:23:43,760 --> 00:23:45,800
Speaker 1: But that's like what it was like in New York too, right,

473
00:23:45,960 --> 00:23:50,400
Speaker 1: I mean, you know we had like our servers, right, So.

474
00:23:50,400 --> 00:23:52,920
Speaker 3: There's definitely still some of that where you run, you

475
00:23:52,960 --> 00:23:57,080
Speaker 3: meet somebody and you can you know, it begins just

476
00:23:57,119 --> 00:23:59,879
Speaker 3: like in New York right quietly, where somebody will be

477
00:23:59,880 --> 00:24:03,520
Speaker 3: like you know, somebody will say something about the schools,

478
00:24:03,520 --> 00:24:05,720
Speaker 3: and like you'll see somebody rolled around.

479
00:24:06,720 --> 00:24:13,040
Speaker 4: All right, right, right, So it hasn't been an issue

480
00:24:13,040 --> 00:24:16,720
Speaker 4: and you don't feel like you're outcast, and actually, I

481
00:24:16,720 --> 00:24:18,159
Speaker 4: mean not any more than usual.

482
00:24:19,119 --> 00:24:23,480
Speaker 3: I would take much less. So that the the sort

483
00:24:23,520 --> 00:24:29,440
Speaker 3: of hot house of Brooklyn was so politically extreme, yeah,

484
00:24:29,520 --> 00:24:31,760
Speaker 3: that it was, especially park Slope, Yeah, I mean it

485
00:24:31,880 --> 00:24:34,200
Speaker 3: was scary. I had a friend who was a US

486
00:24:34,200 --> 00:24:36,320
Speaker 3: marshal who I used to have drinks with around park

487
00:24:36,400 --> 00:24:39,359
Speaker 3: Slope and we would talk about politics and he was like,

488
00:24:40,119 --> 00:24:42,080
Speaker 3: you know, this guy carried a gun around and he

489
00:24:42,200 --> 00:24:42,760
Speaker 3: was worried.

490
00:24:43,000 --> 00:24:45,440
Speaker 2: He's like, yeah, oh, yeah, for sure.

491
00:24:46,920 --> 00:24:47,120
Speaker 3: Yeah.

492
00:24:47,760 --> 00:24:50,240
Speaker 1: I have a funny park Slope story from when my

493
00:24:50,320 --> 00:24:54,639
Speaker 1: daughter was young and my middle son was young. You know,

494
00:24:54,680 --> 00:24:57,080
Speaker 1: they were like, I don't know, three and six or something,

495
00:24:57,240 --> 00:25:02,879
Speaker 1: and the he said something like, you know, what can't

496
00:25:02,920 --> 00:25:06,480
Speaker 1: girls be and she said a father And I was like,

497
00:25:07,359 --> 00:25:09,880
Speaker 1: you know, you can't say that here.

498
00:25:14,040 --> 00:25:16,720
Speaker 3: I mean, there was definitely that feeling where you'd walk

499
00:25:16,920 --> 00:25:21,480
Speaker 3: into Ah, you know, there'd be signs that say like

500
00:25:21,960 --> 00:25:24,840
Speaker 3: hate has no home here in a store window and

501
00:25:24,880 --> 00:25:28,760
Speaker 3: you think, okay, that is literally like a no conservative

502
00:25:28,800 --> 00:25:32,680
Speaker 3: trespassing sign, right, and it means the opposite. They mean

503
00:25:32,880 --> 00:25:35,560
Speaker 3: they hate me, yeah, right, Like like they mean this

504
00:25:35,640 --> 00:25:37,600
Speaker 3: is a home for hate of the right. That is

505
00:25:37,640 --> 00:25:40,040
Speaker 3: what that sign means it doesn't actually mean to hate

506
00:25:40,280 --> 00:25:42,159
Speaker 3: as a home here. And I used to joke we

507
00:25:42,200 --> 00:25:44,720
Speaker 3: actually we were driving around and we passed one of

508
00:25:44,760 --> 00:25:49,800
Speaker 3: those signs out here, and my my daughter joked, she

509
00:25:49,920 --> 00:25:52,960
Speaker 3: was like, Dad, do they think that there are like,

510
00:25:53,480 --> 00:25:57,360
Speaker 3: you know, refugees driving around, being like, oh good, finally

511
00:25:57,400 --> 00:26:02,000
Speaker 3: a house that doesn't do those not Yeah.

512
00:26:02,119 --> 00:26:02,320
Speaker 2: Yeah.

513
00:26:02,320 --> 00:26:04,200
Speaker 1: A mutual friend of ours is not going to name her,

514
00:26:04,280 --> 00:26:06,679
Speaker 1: but in Park Slope said that, you know, when she

515
00:26:06,840 --> 00:26:09,359
Speaker 1: when the hate has no home here, signs went up

516
00:26:09,400 --> 00:26:12,359
Speaker 1: on the various schools, she felt like, you know, writing

517
00:26:12,440 --> 00:26:17,480
Speaker 1: underneath like except Trump, because that's like what you know, what.

518
00:26:16,480 --> 00:26:18,480
Speaker 2: What it really what it really meant?

519
00:26:18,560 --> 00:26:23,000
Speaker 1: You know? Right, So you're a lawyer turned writer. You

520
00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:26,760
Speaker 1: made some very good predictions in your life. You moved

521
00:26:26,800 --> 00:26:29,399
Speaker 1: to Connecticut, you have a great family. Do you feel

522
00:26:29,400 --> 00:26:30,320
Speaker 1: like you've made it?

523
00:26:31,560 --> 00:26:31,800
Speaker 2: Yes?

524
00:26:32,240 --> 00:26:35,800
Speaker 3: So I always wanted I want to write more. So

525
00:26:35,840 --> 00:26:38,119
Speaker 3: I know I write every day. I'd like to write books.

526
00:26:38,240 --> 00:26:40,600
Speaker 3: You know, my my brother Tim's on his fourth book.

527
00:26:40,640 --> 00:26:42,160
Speaker 3: I think it's coming out this March.

528
00:26:42,320 --> 00:26:44,520
Speaker 2: We're going to have him on Friendly.

529
00:26:44,560 --> 00:26:47,639
Speaker 3: Everybody should go pre order it now. But you know,

530
00:26:47,760 --> 00:26:50,639
Speaker 3: my brother Brian's written a couple of books. I'd like that.

531
00:26:50,800 --> 00:26:52,600
Speaker 2: What's taking you so long? What's up with that?

532
00:26:52,960 --> 00:26:53,159
Speaker 1: You know?

533
00:26:53,200 --> 00:26:56,600
Speaker 3: It's hard when I write every single day about you know,

534
00:26:56,680 --> 00:26:59,200
Speaker 3: the economy. I write put out bright Oart Business Digest

535
00:26:59,280 --> 00:27:03,480
Speaker 3: every day. It's free, everybody subscribe, and then and then

536
00:27:03,520 --> 00:27:06,480
Speaker 3: I'm writing for the website as well. It's hard to

537
00:27:06,560 --> 00:27:10,240
Speaker 3: like have extra energy to write a lot of times. Okay,

538
00:27:10,359 --> 00:27:12,280
Speaker 3: I did it all already. I'm not sure I have.

539
00:27:12,840 --> 00:27:15,040
Speaker 3: So I do think if I write, I might have

540
00:27:15,119 --> 00:27:18,679
Speaker 3: to be fiction. Actually, I would really like to write,

541
00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:22,200
Speaker 3: you know, fiction now. So many of my New York

542
00:27:22,280 --> 00:27:26,480
Speaker 3: experiences I feel like would make really cool stories to

543
00:27:26,560 --> 00:27:29,040
Speaker 3: tell you see that, you know, you know, through the

544
00:27:29,080 --> 00:27:32,120
Speaker 3: medium of fiction. So that might be how I get

545
00:27:32,160 --> 00:27:34,280
Speaker 3: around to it. But you know, have I made it? Sure?

546
00:27:34,320 --> 00:27:36,639
Speaker 3: I have, you know, a beautiful family. I've gotten to

547
00:27:36,680 --> 00:27:43,479
Speaker 3: do an amazing job now for fifteen years, which you know,

548
00:27:43,640 --> 00:27:46,000
Speaker 3: I mean, if you think about it, did you ever

549
00:27:46,119 --> 00:27:48,800
Speaker 3: think that we could like make a living doing what

550
00:27:48,920 --> 00:27:51,760
Speaker 3: we do? I mean back in the day, it's.

551
00:27:51,600 --> 00:27:54,800
Speaker 2: Crazy not I hadn't really thought that far ahead.

552
00:27:55,560 --> 00:27:58,320
Speaker 3: I mean, I always thought it would be amazing to

553
00:27:58,359 --> 00:28:00,320
Speaker 3: be able to write the kind of things I did,

554
00:28:00,359 --> 00:28:03,359
Speaker 3: but I didn't think, you know it, didn't you know

555
00:28:03,400 --> 00:28:05,359
Speaker 3: I was. I was a blogger. I wrote, you know,

556
00:28:05,600 --> 00:28:08,680
Speaker 3: I wrote for free on the internet. I didn't think

557
00:28:08,760 --> 00:28:11,679
Speaker 3: that this was like a career. I was a lawyer.

558
00:28:12,560 --> 00:28:15,679
Speaker 3: So it's been terrific to be able to you know,

559
00:28:15,920 --> 00:28:18,960
Speaker 3: make a living, feed my family, save up some money

560
00:28:19,440 --> 00:28:20,880
Speaker 3: doing this thing that I love.

561
00:28:21,720 --> 00:28:24,240
Speaker 2: So John and I both started out as bloggers.

562
00:28:24,480 --> 00:28:28,680
Speaker 1: And I remember when my blog picked up some ads

563
00:28:28,760 --> 00:28:31,840
Speaker 1: and I think I was making like maybe six hundred.

564
00:28:31,600 --> 00:28:34,880
Speaker 2: Dollars a month. I was like, whoa, you know, this

565
00:28:34,960 --> 00:28:35,719
Speaker 2: is amazing.

566
00:28:37,680 --> 00:28:40,640
Speaker 1: And it's also funny because like what was like large

567
00:28:40,720 --> 00:28:45,200
Speaker 1: traffic numbers back then is nothing now. I just remember

568
00:28:45,480 --> 00:28:47,920
Speaker 1: like when my blog hit like two thousand readers a day,

569
00:28:47,960 --> 00:28:51,160
Speaker 1: and that was like, whoa, you know, I mean it

570
00:28:51,240 --> 00:28:55,200
Speaker 1: was great, right, it's.

571
00:28:55,040 --> 00:28:58,640
Speaker 3: Really nice to I mean when I look back on

572
00:28:58,800 --> 00:29:01,040
Speaker 3: like the guys who I came up with through the

573
00:29:01,080 --> 00:29:04,680
Speaker 3: early days of Business Insider, for instance, people have done

574
00:29:04,760 --> 00:29:08,880
Speaker 3: really well. You have your Joe Wisenhall's at Bloomberg. Jay

575
00:29:08,960 --> 00:29:12,160
Speaker 3: Yarrow now runs c MBC's website that you dan from.

576
00:29:12,360 --> 00:29:16,680
Speaker 3: There's people are everywhere. They've done really well. And uh

577
00:29:16,800 --> 00:29:18,800
Speaker 3: and a lot of the people who I knew from

578
00:29:18,840 --> 00:29:22,520
Speaker 3: those years ended up doing so well that I think

579
00:29:22,560 --> 00:29:25,280
Speaker 3: there was almost something magical happening in New York at

580
00:29:25,280 --> 00:29:28,680
Speaker 3: the time. Yeah, one was an openness that doesn't exist

581
00:29:28,760 --> 00:29:31,760
Speaker 3: right now. You know, we you and I were. We

582
00:29:31,760 --> 00:29:34,720
Speaker 3: were able to be friends with people who we differed

583
00:29:34,840 --> 00:29:35,920
Speaker 3: with on politics.

584
00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:40,920
Speaker 1: Right, That's crazy. Yeah, it's much harder to do today.

585
00:29:41,160 --> 00:29:44,920
Speaker 1: I think about that whole blogger era actually, Like so

586
00:29:45,000 --> 00:29:48,160
Speaker 1: before Joe Wisenthal was at Business Insider, he had a

587
00:29:48,200 --> 00:29:50,960
Speaker 1: blog that I used to follow, and I just think

588
00:29:51,320 --> 00:29:55,160
Speaker 1: all of the best bloggers from that time got picked

589
00:29:55,240 --> 00:29:57,800
Speaker 1: up by you know, we were such rebels, we were

590
00:29:57,800 --> 00:30:01,360
Speaker 1: going to like, you know, change the way journalism happened.

591
00:30:01,360 --> 00:30:03,720
Speaker 1: But really what happened is all of the like big

592
00:30:03,760 --> 00:30:07,560
Speaker 1: outlets either hired the bloggers or bought the blog and

593
00:30:07,920 --> 00:30:12,040
Speaker 1: adapted it to their site, and they really ended up

594
00:30:12,160 --> 00:30:16,280
Speaker 1: killing our own thing. Like independent blocks was largely murdered

595
00:30:16,360 --> 00:30:19,640
Speaker 1: by independent bloggers who were hired to do you know,

596
00:30:20,000 --> 00:30:22,360
Speaker 1: back to regular journalism.

597
00:30:22,080 --> 00:30:25,440
Speaker 3: Right, which which which was smart? I mean, you know, yeah,

598
00:30:25,920 --> 00:30:29,480
Speaker 3: everybody won. It was just why these or you know,

599
00:30:29,480 --> 00:30:31,160
Speaker 3: the Wall Street Journal or the New York Times have

600
00:30:31,240 --> 00:30:34,080
Speaker 3: existed for hundreds of years, because yeah, they're pretty smart

601
00:30:34,120 --> 00:30:36,320
Speaker 3: about how to survive. And I think what they saw was,

602
00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:39,200
Speaker 3: you know, hey, here are a bunch of writers who

603
00:30:39,200 --> 00:30:42,320
Speaker 3: are able to attract an audience without any of the

604
00:30:42,360 --> 00:30:45,480
Speaker 3: institutional support. Imagine what will happen if we give them

605
00:30:45,520 --> 00:30:47,960
Speaker 3: the institutional support and it worked.

606
00:30:48,400 --> 00:30:50,800
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, that's a really interesting point.

607
00:30:50,840 --> 00:30:53,200
Speaker 1: That's exactly it. They you know, they're like, oh, these

608
00:30:53,200 --> 00:30:55,920
Speaker 1: people are already doing it, Like we can hire them

609
00:30:55,960 --> 00:30:59,520
Speaker 1: and get all their viewers and other readers and that

610
00:30:59,560 --> 00:31:03,040
Speaker 1: could be you know, yeah, it's excellent, excellent point about

611
00:31:03,080 --> 00:31:04,760
Speaker 1: the whole They've been doing it for a while and

612
00:31:04,800 --> 00:31:05,800
Speaker 1: they know what's going on.

613
00:31:06,360 --> 00:31:10,320
Speaker 3: They know what. You know, longevity at least suggests a

614
00:31:10,360 --> 00:31:11,760
Speaker 3: good instinct for survival.

615
00:31:12,240 --> 00:31:17,480
Speaker 1: Sure right, definitely, So end here with your best tip

616
00:31:17,560 --> 00:31:20,600
Speaker 1: for my listeners on how they can improve their lives.

617
00:31:22,160 --> 00:31:25,800
Speaker 3: So I'll give you three. How's that all right? Let's

618
00:31:25,840 --> 00:31:29,960
Speaker 3: go three exercise every day, get to sleep, and wear

619
00:31:29,960 --> 00:31:30,880
Speaker 3: comfortable shoes.

620
00:31:31,080 --> 00:31:35,400
Speaker 2: That's it, John, You sound like an old man. Where

621
00:31:35,480 --> 00:31:37,000
Speaker 2: is that crazy revel guy?

622
00:31:37,640 --> 00:31:44,320
Speaker 3: Okay, here's a more controversial one. When don't be afraid

623
00:31:44,440 --> 00:31:48,120
Speaker 3: to just be a little bit more socially aggressive. We

624
00:31:48,160 --> 00:31:50,520
Speaker 3: live in an age that almost seems to punish people,

625
00:31:50,960 --> 00:31:52,920
Speaker 3: whether it's you're a young man or a young woman

626
00:31:52,960 --> 00:31:55,320
Speaker 3: and you're you're worried, like can I talk to somebody

627
00:31:55,360 --> 00:31:58,200
Speaker 3: of the opposite sexes? Or you're older and you just

628
00:31:58,240 --> 00:32:01,000
Speaker 3: want to be friends with people. One of the things

629
00:32:01,120 --> 00:32:02,840
Speaker 3: I had to get over in life, but it's been

630
00:32:02,880 --> 00:32:06,200
Speaker 3: one of the biggest improvements has been the willingness to

631
00:32:06,280 --> 00:32:10,800
Speaker 3: like reach out to people in person or online. I

632
00:32:11,080 --> 00:32:12,960
Speaker 3: write to writers who I like. If I read so

633
00:32:13,000 --> 00:32:16,480
Speaker 3: many stuff, I very often reach out to them and say, like, hey,

634
00:32:16,600 --> 00:32:19,360
Speaker 3: let's hang out or at least let's talk, like let

635
00:32:19,360 --> 00:32:22,000
Speaker 3: me and I think that's a good idea. And I

636
00:32:22,040 --> 00:32:25,120
Speaker 3: think people are the people have always been shy, that's

637
00:32:25,200 --> 00:32:28,040
Speaker 3: that new. But I think we've actually made social life

638
00:32:28,160 --> 00:32:32,400
Speaker 3: so dangerous that people need to, you know, be a

639
00:32:32,440 --> 00:32:34,800
Speaker 3: little bit more courageous in their social lives.

640
00:32:35,280 --> 00:32:35,800
Speaker 1: I like that.

641
00:32:35,960 --> 00:32:36,960
Speaker 2: Thank you so much for that.

642
00:32:37,640 --> 00:32:40,200
Speaker 1: Hughes John Carney. Find him on brave bart dot com.

643
00:32:40,240 --> 00:32:43,120
Speaker 1: He's fantastic, love talking to you. Thanks for coming on,

644
00:32:43,520 --> 00:32:46,400
Speaker 1: Thanks Carol, Thanks so much for joining us on the

645
00:32:46,440 --> 00:32:47,400
Speaker 1: Carol Marcowitz Show.

646
00:32:47,440 --> 00:32:49,480
Speaker 2: Subscribe wherever you get your podcasts,