WEBVTT - Transforming the Factory Floor with AI, New Approach to Curing ALS 0:00:02.920 --> 0:00:11.760 Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio news. This is Bloomberg BusinessWeek Inside, 0:00:11.840 --> 0:00:14.760 from the reporters and editors who bring you America's most 0:00:14.800 --> 0:00:19.200 trusted business magazine, plus global business, finance and tech news. 0:00:19.360 --> 0:00:23.479 The Bloomberg Business Week Podcast with Carol Messer and Tim 0:00:23.520 --> 0:00:25.800 Stenebek from Bloomberg Radio. 0:00:27.760 --> 0:00:28.560 This is not my world. 0:00:28.640 --> 0:00:30.760 But bear with me for a second here. Okay, Let's 0:00:30.760 --> 0:00:34.159 say you're a manufacturer. You've designed a specialized widget, but 0:00:34.200 --> 0:00:36.280 you need a machine to make said widget. 0:00:36.360 --> 0:00:37.440 Okay, are you with me? Yep? 0:00:37.479 --> 0:00:40.120 Okay, you need special machine designing that machine. It's not 0:00:40.120 --> 0:00:42.640 in your wheelhouse because you're a widget designer, not a 0:00:42.680 --> 0:00:46.960 widget machine designer. That's where ventionin comes in. It's a 0:00:46.960 --> 0:00:49.640 cloud robotics platform that allows people of all stripes to 0:00:49.640 --> 0:00:54.000 build their own custom industrial machines. It's got some big backers, 0:00:54.000 --> 0:00:57.880 Ban Capital Ventures, Georgian Fidelity Investment, Canada, Bolt Ventures, among others. 0:00:58.120 --> 0:01:01.360 It counts Amazon, Bowing, Blue Origin, and Striker among its clients. 0:01:01.360 --> 0:01:03.680 That's according to its website. We've got with us the 0:01:03.680 --> 0:01:06.839 founder and CEO of at Bention, Atien Lacroix. He joins 0:01:06.880 --> 0:01:09.679 us here in the Bloomberg Interactive Broker's studio. 0:01:09.959 --> 0:01:11.959 How did I do? Did I describe? You say? 0:01:12.080 --> 0:01:12.200 Right? 0:01:12.280 --> 0:01:13.320 Well, thanks for having met him. 0:01:13.319 --> 0:01:15.160 Thanks. You create the machines that create the widgets. 0:01:15.200 --> 0:01:18.680 We create the machine that create the machine. Correct, And 0:01:18.720 --> 0:01:22.440 we help small meats in business mostly get starting where 0:01:22.440 --> 0:01:24.039 they're in dashall automation journey. 0:01:24.520 --> 0:01:27.319 So you said small and medium businesses, but some of 0:01:27.360 --> 0:01:30.840 your clients are huge, I mean Boeing, Blue Origin Striker, 0:01:30.840 --> 0:01:33.360 those are Amazon. Amazon is not a smaller medium size. 0:01:33.120 --> 0:01:34.640 Correct, we serve both. 0:01:34.680 --> 0:01:37.720 But let me speak about small meats and business first, right, 0:01:37.840 --> 0:01:40.600 those are ninety percent of the business manufacturing business in 0:01:40.640 --> 0:01:44.319 North America, and they face the same labor shortages and 0:01:44.400 --> 0:01:48.240 cash pleasure as those bigger client Yet it's really really 0:01:48.320 --> 0:01:52.400 hard for them to automate profitably today with indush all 0:01:52.440 --> 0:01:56.160 automation technology. If we want to solve to some extent 0:01:56.280 --> 0:02:00.600 the manufacturing renaissance, this is the problem to solve small 0:02:00.640 --> 0:02:03.080 meats and businesses. And that's what we're trying to do here, Adventure. 0:02:03.160 --> 0:02:05.080 Well, it's the bulk of the backbone, Like we talk about, right, 0:02:05.120 --> 0:02:07.520 what is really the backbone of our economy? And there's 0:02:07.520 --> 0:02:10.120 so much you know, obviously small businesses, but in the 0:02:10.120 --> 0:02:12.800 MidCap space, there's so much that goes on. We don't 0:02:12.840 --> 0:02:14.600 necessarily spend as much time as we do to the 0:02:14.919 --> 0:02:17.280 big cap names, but so much is going on there. 0:02:18.000 --> 0:02:22.040 What would surprise someone who was listening about your business? 0:02:22.200 --> 0:02:24.800 Right? I think what's changing in the world of industrial 0:02:24.800 --> 0:02:29.320 automation is what I call software platforming and hardware productization. 0:02:29.680 --> 0:02:33.600 Software platforming basically is the ability for somebody who designed 0:02:33.600 --> 0:02:37.200 machine to do all the act of design, programming, deployment 0:02:37.480 --> 0:02:41.280 in a single platform versus six to ten different points 0:02:41.360 --> 0:02:45.200 solution today. And hardware productization is having kind of lego 0:02:45.280 --> 0:02:48.440 kits industrial lego kits where all the components are de 0:02:48.560 --> 0:02:52.560 facto compatible with one another. When you bring those two 0:02:52.600 --> 0:02:56.280 things in the same platform, magic happen and you can 0:02:56.320 --> 0:02:59.160 make the act of designing those machines that make the 0:02:59.240 --> 0:03:03.679 machine significantly faster and accessible to small measum manufacturers. 0:03:03.720 --> 0:03:05.799 Give us an example, like I think, if somebody's listening, 0:03:05.800 --> 0:03:08.320 and like I get when you're kind of talking like 0:03:08.360 --> 0:03:10.280 big picture and stuff, But give us an example of 0:03:10.360 --> 0:03:13.160 something that you've done without maybe giving away too much 0:03:13.160 --> 0:03:13.680 of what you. 0:03:13.639 --> 0:03:16.160 Have done for a customer. Let's see, you're a small 0:03:17.160 --> 0:03:20.720 om decore manufacturer. You're manufacturing good frame for Walmart, and 0:03:20.760 --> 0:03:23.000 you need to apply glue. There's a machine that needs 0:03:23.040 --> 0:03:26.880 for that. In fact, on manufacturing floor, most manufacturing assets 0:03:26.880 --> 0:03:29.720 are custom made. They're unique, they're unique to the finish 0:03:29.760 --> 0:03:33.720 good being manufacturer. And as a result, those unique finish 0:03:33.760 --> 0:03:37.320 good manufacturing asset needs to be designed and program So 0:03:37.440 --> 0:03:40.520 you're the small medium frame manufacturers. With frame manufacturers, you 0:03:40.560 --> 0:03:42.640 need to figure out how to staple that frame, how 0:03:42.680 --> 0:03:45.640 to apply glue, how to apply to back cover. Today 0:03:45.680 --> 0:03:48.440 those things are made with custom machine that are designed 0:03:48.480 --> 0:03:49.720 with traditional technique. 0:03:50.200 --> 0:03:53.640 So how much time and money does your technique say 0:03:53.760 --> 0:03:55.800 versus a traditional technique. 0:03:55.480 --> 0:03:59.160 When you start to platform and productize, what we see 0:03:59.160 --> 0:04:03.119 our users save is around forty percent and go three 0:04:03.160 --> 0:04:08.320 to five time faster than more traditional industrial automation technology. 0:04:08.400 --> 0:04:10.560 This is a game changer for the industry. 0:04:10.640 --> 0:04:12.800 So you're actually creating the equipment. I bring this right 0:04:13.160 --> 0:04:15.200 because I'm bringing this up like early on as a 0:04:15.200 --> 0:04:17.520 college kid, and my mom worked for a company and 0:04:17.600 --> 0:04:20.120 I would spend some time in summers and my time 0:04:20.200 --> 0:04:21.040 off working for them. 0:04:21.080 --> 0:04:23.560 And they were a. 0:04:23.480 --> 0:04:26.520 Plastic company and they made things like sprockets and gears, 0:04:26.640 --> 0:04:29.200 and they would have molding, and they would have all 0:04:29.240 --> 0:04:34.159 these corporate customers, and they would custom design the molds, 0:04:34.240 --> 0:04:38.000 if you will, to make whatever designs they needed. So 0:04:38.040 --> 0:04:40.400 you guys are actually doing if I was kind of 0:04:40.400 --> 0:04:43.359 doing apples to apples, the molds or the devices and 0:04:43.440 --> 0:04:45.720 designs to make whatever that they have. 0:04:45.880 --> 0:04:47.800 All that gear that is an initial mold that needs 0:04:47.800 --> 0:04:49.560 to be put in and out of a machine. At 0:04:49.680 --> 0:04:51.360 least a human doing that today, but it could be 0:04:51.400 --> 0:04:53.760 a robot and that robot needs to figure out how 0:04:53.800 --> 0:04:55.400 to take the part out of the machine, how to 0:04:55.400 --> 0:04:56.839 put it in the trade when you go to the 0:04:56.880 --> 0:05:01.000 next operation. That machine that replaced a human is unique, 0:05:01.040 --> 0:05:04.400 and those machines are really really hard to design today, right, 0:05:04.520 --> 0:05:05.520 That's what we're solving. 0:05:05.800 --> 0:05:07.919 So like you do have some big customers though you 0:05:07.920 --> 0:05:10.479 have Tesla, you have Facebook, you have Apple, can you 0:05:11.400 --> 0:05:12.320 can you share what you. 0:05:12.279 --> 0:05:16.160 Do for them? So even in those large troueput manufacturers, 0:05:16.279 --> 0:05:19.440 you always found what I call secondary in tertiary process. 0:05:19.560 --> 0:05:22.280 It's not the finel assembly line, it's perhaps the metrology 0:05:22.320 --> 0:05:24.680 lab or perhaps the R and D lab, and those 0:05:24.760 --> 0:05:28.000 lower troteput processes also need to be automated, and it's 0:05:28.080 --> 0:05:31.200 really really hard to automate with today's technology because the 0:05:31.320 --> 0:05:34.200 cost is simply not compatible with the payback. That's what 0:05:34.200 --> 0:05:36.200 we're going to do with those Tesla and Apple of 0:05:36.200 --> 0:05:36.559 the world. 0:05:37.000 --> 0:05:39.440 So if somebody were to use the product, or when 0:05:39.480 --> 0:05:42.400 somebody does use the product, they design it using their 0:05:42.400 --> 0:05:46.960 web browser correct sort of like a version of CAD 0:05:47.120 --> 0:05:47.839 on the web browser. 0:05:47.960 --> 0:05:50.920 You designed with Industrial Lego. You go online, you will 0:05:50.960 --> 0:05:54.479 design with a library of Industrial Lego parts, robot conveyor, 0:05:54.600 --> 0:05:58.000 sensor motors. You will see price in real time, assembly time, 0:05:58.040 --> 0:06:01.000 in real time automatic Billo material. When you're done, you 0:06:01.120 --> 0:06:03.360 program in a code for your environment, so we keep 0:06:03.400 --> 0:06:06.080 the experience simple, and you order and you get your 0:06:06.240 --> 0:06:08.080 IKEA box equivalent the next day. 0:06:08.120 --> 0:06:10.320 That's what I was gonnample. That's how much time does 0:06:10.400 --> 0:06:10.680 it take. 0:06:11.240 --> 0:06:14.320 So from an ideation of a machine to the delivered machine, 0:06:14.360 --> 0:06:16.720 we have client to go as fast as three days, 0:06:16.960 --> 0:06:19.920 and that contrasts with the traditional world of automation where 0:06:20.200 --> 0:06:22.400 those project takes three eight to nine months. 0:06:22.480 --> 0:06:24.280 You know, when you're setting up something for my ki 0:06:24.360 --> 0:06:26.440 ed has the picture of like the two people standing 0:06:26.480 --> 0:06:29.159 there scratching their heads. Yeah, and they're like the question 0:06:29.240 --> 0:06:30.040 mark is over their. 0:06:29.960 --> 0:06:31.320 Head that you stare at me. 0:06:32.360 --> 0:06:33.480 We make it easier than I keep. 0:06:33.839 --> 0:06:36.200 We actually laser engrave departm nuber on the parts, you 0:06:36.240 --> 0:06:36.920 know what goes where? 0:06:36.960 --> 0:06:38.839 Okay, That's what I was going to check. How easasy 0:06:38.880 --> 0:06:39.080 to do? 0:06:39.160 --> 0:06:41.359 Like how much customization do you have to ultimately do? 0:06:41.440 --> 0:06:43.839 Because it sounds like you guys have things that people 0:06:43.880 --> 0:06:45.800 can kind of take off the shelf, right, but how 0:06:45.880 --> 0:06:47.440 much customization goes into this process? 0:06:47.480 --> 0:06:50.200 There's around twenty ten plates available online for people to 0:06:50.279 --> 0:06:52.520 jump start in their journey, but most people design again 0:06:52.600 --> 0:06:54.480 machine that are unique to them. 0:06:54.640 --> 0:06:54.800 Right. 0:06:54.839 --> 0:06:57.120 The goal is not to serve here a control expert 0:06:57.200 --> 0:07:00.960 to a roboticists. The goal is to serve an average 0:07:01.000 --> 0:07:04.480 manufacturing professional who knows this shop well but couldn't do 0:07:04.560 --> 0:07:05.920 it if the tool is too complex. 0:07:06.520 --> 0:07:11.240 How often does that average manufacturer need to pay you money? 0:07:11.440 --> 0:07:15.280 Because I'm thinking here, is there an opportunity for recurring revenue? 0:07:15.400 --> 0:07:15.640 Yeah? 0:07:16.480 --> 0:07:18.160 Or is this like you know, you fill your shop 0:07:18.200 --> 0:07:19.960 with the parts you need and then you don't need 0:07:20.000 --> 0:07:20.760 to go back to them. 0:07:20.880 --> 0:07:24.320 Actually, most of our business is actually reoccurring. This sort 0:07:24.360 --> 0:07:28.200 of thing recurring, and those manufacturers when they learn the 0:07:28.280 --> 0:07:31.960 tool that are freely available online, stick to it because 0:07:32.000 --> 0:07:35.400 it's so easier and more convenient and more traditional approach. 0:07:35.840 --> 0:07:37.960 So for their next machines, and we go for. 0:07:37.920 --> 0:07:40.640 The next machine, and the next machine and the next machine. 0:07:40.800 --> 0:07:43.160 So the business that you are seeing did you play 0:07:43.200 --> 0:07:45.200 in like the small and mid cap space, although you 0:07:45.240 --> 0:07:48.880 do have some really well known companies as well. What 0:07:48.920 --> 0:07:50.600 you are seeing, what does it tell you about the 0:07:50.680 --> 0:07:53.160 level of business activity that's happening right now, and what 0:07:53.200 --> 0:07:54.680 does it tell you about the business and comments. 0:07:54.680 --> 0:07:56.800 So we're definitely operating at a lower level than what 0:07:56.880 --> 0:07:59.120 we've seen in twenty twenty, twenty twenty one and mid 0:07:59.240 --> 0:08:00.200 twenty twenty two. 0:08:00.400 --> 0:08:01.720 Right that said, the. 0:08:01.680 --> 0:08:04.720 Cash pressure and the labor shortage are just as intense 0:08:04.920 --> 0:08:06.080 as they were back then. 0:08:06.240 --> 0:08:08.320 So the pressure, the need to automate. 0:08:08.000 --> 0:08:12.320 The long tail positive, the long tail win is there 0:08:12.360 --> 0:08:15.000 until twenty thirty because the labor shortage in the United 0:08:15.000 --> 0:08:17.120 States is structural until that time. 0:08:17.760 --> 0:08:19.400 So what does that mean for your business in terms 0:08:19.480 --> 0:08:22.640 of what kind of growth you into quite twenty thirty, 0:08:22.680 --> 0:08:26.680 you're seeing that's a pretty long runway. You're saying six 0:08:26.880 --> 0:08:30.280 years out that you say the labor market there's going 0:08:30.320 --> 0:08:32.079 to be shortages, correct. 0:08:31.920 --> 0:08:36.120 Right, So we're very well positioned to leverage those tails 0:08:36.120 --> 0:08:41.400 win and help those small businesses automated by themselves profitable. Now, yeah, 0:08:41.440 --> 0:08:43.720 there's a lot to build to build the next industrial 0:08:43.760 --> 0:08:46.520 automation giant. So we deliberately invest quite a bit in 0:08:46.640 --> 0:08:50.360 R and d IPO on the horizon because mention Is 0:08:50.360 --> 0:08:53.240 is a platform business and there's so many revenue stream 0:08:53.280 --> 0:08:57.120 monetization potential. Yes, Mention as the characteristic to be an 0:08:57.120 --> 0:08:58.160 apeable business. 0:08:58.520 --> 0:08:58.960 Very cool. 0:08:59.000 --> 0:09:04.040 Staff. Yeah, when you know, we'll see what the future 0:09:04.080 --> 0:09:05.800 brings to us. But that at ridden we grow, we 0:09:05.840 --> 0:09:08.079 believe is going to be possible behind the before the 0:09:08.160 --> 0:09:08.720 end of the decay. 0:09:09.400 --> 0:09:12.480 Thanks all right, at On Laqua, thank you so much, 0:09:12.520 --> 0:09:14.480 Founder and CEO of Bention. Joining us here in our 0:09:14.480 --> 0:09:18.000 Bloomberg Interactive Broker studio, Carol Master, Jim Stanevik. This is 0:09:18.000 --> 0:09:19.040 Bloomberg BusinessWeek. 0:09:20.320 --> 0:09:23.840 You're listening to the Bloomberg Business Week podcast. Catch us 0:09:23.880 --> 0:09:27.080 live weekday afternoons from two to five pm. Easter Listen 0:09:27.160 --> 0:09:29.319 on Apple, card Play and and brout Auto with a 0:09:29.360 --> 0:09:32.400 Bloomberg Business app, or want us live on YouTube. 0:09:34.160 --> 0:09:37.600 Well chairs of the microcap publicly traded biotech Koya Therapeutic, 0:09:37.679 --> 0:09:40.320 surging earlier today up as much as eleven percent, on 0:09:40.400 --> 0:09:43.319 news that the Alzheimer's Drug Discovery Foundation has purchased more 0:09:43.320 --> 0:09:46.319 than six hundred and three thousand company shares for total 0:09:46.400 --> 0:09:49.319 investment about five million dollars. Here to talk about the 0:09:49.360 --> 0:09:52.079 investment and on the work they are doing around als 0:09:52.120 --> 0:09:55.800 treatments as well as Alzheimer's is Howard Berman, chairman and 0:09:55.840 --> 0:09:58.840 CEO of Koya Therapeutic, joining us from Boston. That's stock, 0:09:58.920 --> 0:10:02.280 by the way, up close twenty percent so far this year. 0:10:02.280 --> 0:10:04.640 Howard, nice to have you with us. 0:10:04.880 --> 0:10:06.760 Tell us a little bit about your company, because you're 0:10:06.760 --> 0:10:10.000 working on some really serious stuff that impacts the brain 0:10:10.120 --> 0:10:13.439 that I think, unfortunately pretty much everyone who's listening or 0:10:13.480 --> 0:10:16.000 watching right now has dealt with in terms of their 0:10:16.000 --> 0:10:17.840 family or somebody close to them. 0:10:18.280 --> 0:10:19.480 Lay it all out for us, if. 0:10:19.400 --> 0:10:21.160 You could, what you're working on and how you think 0:10:21.160 --> 0:10:22.360 you're able to pull it off. 0:10:23.280 --> 0:10:25.520 Right, well, thank you. It's a pleasure to be here today, 0:10:25.920 --> 0:10:28.120 and just to say that I am one of those 0:10:28.160 --> 0:10:32.240 people who it's affected directly. My own father, unfortunately, a 0:10:32.280 --> 0:10:37.640 brilliant clinician, he himself had dementia and unfortunately passed away. 0:10:37.720 --> 0:10:40.840 So this is very personal to me that we're developing 0:10:40.840 --> 0:10:47.160 therapeutics for neurodegenerative diseases, including dementias as well as Lukeerrig's disease, 0:10:47.400 --> 0:10:51.839 which is as people know, amyotrophic lateral sclerosis. And what 0:10:51.840 --> 0:10:57.760 we're doing is we have therapeutics that target multiple pathways 0:10:57.760 --> 0:11:02.080 that are involved in inflammation inflammatory pathways. The goal here 0:11:02.160 --> 0:11:05.840 is to dampen the inflammation, which we've discovered plays a 0:11:05.920 --> 0:11:08.839 central role in the path of physiology of these diseases. 0:11:08.960 --> 0:11:11.360 I think it's interesting that and Howard, great to have 0:11:11.440 --> 0:11:12.880 you here with us. I do feel like we are 0:11:12.960 --> 0:11:15.680 learning more and more about the body overall and the 0:11:15.720 --> 0:11:19.160 importance of inflammation right and how do we either prevent 0:11:19.200 --> 0:11:22.080 that to begin with, but that it is often the 0:11:22.120 --> 0:11:26.000 cause of so many things that ail us. When it 0:11:26.040 --> 0:11:30.920 comes to ALS specifically, it is ALS Awareness Month, also 0:11:30.960 --> 0:11:34.720 known as lou Gerrigg's disease, the famous New York Yankees 0:11:34.760 --> 0:11:38.360 baseball player who had to retire because he was diagnosed 0:11:38.360 --> 0:11:41.439 with it and had come down with that. It is 0:11:41.640 --> 0:11:44.480 at this point, if you get that diagnosis, the outlook 0:11:44.520 --> 0:11:45.040 is not good. 0:11:47.520 --> 0:11:50.920 The outlook is terrible. Patients typically die within two to 0:11:51.000 --> 0:11:56.800 three years on average, so the disease is incessant. The 0:11:56.840 --> 0:12:00.280 patients decline month upon month, and the problem has been 0:12:00.920 --> 0:12:03.240 is that the drugs that have been used so far 0:12:03.320 --> 0:12:06.559 the mechanism have not been well defined and not well understood. 0:12:06.720 --> 0:12:12.520 But again, inflammation is the central component in ALS, but 0:12:12.559 --> 0:12:16.280 the problem was as you cannot target one pathway, one 0:12:16.280 --> 0:12:20.600 has to target multiple inflammatory pathways. Which is why I 0:12:20.679 --> 0:12:23.920 believe that the Olzheimer Drug Discovery Foundation, who we just 0:12:24.000 --> 0:12:27.360 received this investment, liked what we were doing because they 0:12:27.400 --> 0:12:32.240 too believe that targeting multiple cascades and pathways are the 0:12:32.240 --> 0:12:33.240 future of treatment. 0:12:33.440 --> 0:12:35.719 So what does this investment do for you? And you're right, 0:12:35.760 --> 0:12:38.600 your stock really popped initially on the news, up as 0:12:38.640 --> 0:12:40.760 much as eleven percent, as Tip mentioned earlier. I think 0:12:40.760 --> 0:12:43.319 it's a little changed on the day as we speak, 0:12:43.360 --> 0:12:47.080 but we're talking about about a five million dollar investment. 0:12:47.120 --> 0:12:50.040 What does this do for you, guys, specifically in your work. 0:12:50.920 --> 0:12:55.320 While we are focused entirely, at least initially on ALS, 0:12:55.840 --> 0:12:59.040 we have expanded our pipeline. We're now moving into fronto 0:12:59.120 --> 0:13:03.040 temporal dementia, which is the second most common type of 0:13:03.080 --> 0:13:07.079 dementia after Alzheimer's disease, And so this money allows us 0:13:07.080 --> 0:13:10.640 to pursue a trial, a phase two trial to be 0:13:10.720 --> 0:13:12.960 filed this year and I in D filed this year 0:13:13.440 --> 0:13:17.520 and unfortunately an FTD fronder temporal dementia. There are no 0:13:17.960 --> 0:13:22.439 approved treatments for that condition. So we will work alongside 0:13:22.520 --> 0:13:26.160 the ADDF to pursue this indication and we're going to 0:13:26.200 --> 0:13:29.480 run a rigorous trial that answers a number of questions 0:13:29.880 --> 0:13:32.840 and we hope that this therapy may make a meaningful 0:13:32.880 --> 0:13:33.880 difference in patients. 0:13:34.040 --> 0:13:38.480 Hey, Howard, how does your approach here differ from the 0:13:38.520 --> 0:13:40.360 approach of other companies that are working on. 0:13:40.280 --> 0:13:44.960 This So, as I mentioned, inflammation is a central pathway 0:13:45.000 --> 0:13:48.680 and mechanism in these diseases. Many other companies target one 0:13:48.800 --> 0:13:53.200 pathway where they target a cytokind, but that we believe 0:13:53.240 --> 0:13:56.760 is not sufficient. So what we do is we enhance 0:13:56.880 --> 0:13:59.840 the regulatory t cells the t rex we call them, 0:14:00.040 --> 0:14:04.200 which are anti inflammatory cells. But that is not all 0:14:04.240 --> 0:14:07.640 that we do. We also block other pro inflammatory pathways 0:14:07.840 --> 0:14:12.800 with another drug called CTLA four, and that reduces or 0:14:12.840 --> 0:14:17.440 inhibits the other cascades that are responsible for the disease 0:14:17.480 --> 0:14:21.480 path of physiology. So by doing both the upregating the 0:14:21.560 --> 0:14:26.600 regulatory T cells down regulating the pro inflammatory cascades, you're 0:14:26.640 --> 0:14:31.320 able to slow the inflammation or block the inflammatory process 0:14:31.920 --> 0:14:36.400 and an ameliorate or relieve these the disease conditions and 0:14:36.840 --> 0:14:40.840 part of the pathways that are responsible for a progression. 0:14:41.080 --> 0:14:43.120 All Right, it sounds logical. I'm not going to say 0:14:43.120 --> 0:14:46.160 it sounds simplistic because it doesn't. But I'm listening to 0:14:46.240 --> 0:14:48.200 your train of thought, and I'm like, I kind of 0:14:48.240 --> 0:14:50.920 get this, But I'm assuming none of this is ever 0:14:51.080 --> 0:14:53.880 ever easy. What's the most complicated part of this? And 0:14:54.240 --> 0:14:57.360 is this only for patients and at a certain stage 0:14:57.840 --> 0:14:59.840 of the disease, is there a point where the inflammation 0:15:00.200 --> 0:15:05.000 or the ailment is so severe that it's just it's 0:15:05.040 --> 0:15:05.720 not going to work. 0:15:07.160 --> 0:15:10.520 We don't have an answer to that, but we've tested 0:15:10.560 --> 0:15:14.680 this combination already in Olzheimer's disease, and we were very 0:15:14.720 --> 0:15:18.280 surprised in the early studies in mild to moderate patients, 0:15:18.280 --> 0:15:22.520 which are more advanced patients, those patients actually responded. Those 0:15:22.560 --> 0:15:26.920 patients their cognition was enhanced, and in als, in patients 0:15:26.960 --> 0:15:30.560 who weren't doing very well, the ALS progression was stopped, 0:15:31.320 --> 0:15:34.680 so we believe that you can that this therapy or 0:15:34.680 --> 0:15:39.480 this regimen may have an impact in more advanced stages. However, 0:15:39.840 --> 0:15:43.920 we do want to start testing this initially in patients 0:15:43.960 --> 0:15:47.440 who are less progressed, to give the therapy the best 0:15:47.520 --> 0:15:49.600 chance of success, at least initially. 0:15:50.520 --> 0:15:53.120 I'm curious about competitors out there. There's an FDA advisory 0:15:53.120 --> 0:15:56.360 committee meeting on the ELI Lilly Alzheimer's drug coming up 0:15:56.520 --> 0:16:01.840 in early June, though has been delayed amid concerns about 0:16:01.840 --> 0:16:04.880 its unusual trial design. I'm wondering how important you think 0:16:05.520 --> 0:16:07.560 this advisory committee is going to be. 0:16:08.920 --> 0:16:14.760 Yeah, well, advisory committees are important because they involve thought 0:16:14.800 --> 0:16:18.560 leaders and experts in certainly, the FDA uses them to 0:16:18.760 --> 0:16:21.880 help guide their decisions. Let me tell you about the 0:16:21.920 --> 0:16:25.800 approach that's typically taken at this point in Olzheimer's disease. 0:16:25.920 --> 0:16:29.920 They the targeting of beta amyloid, which is this protein, 0:16:30.120 --> 0:16:33.920 this misfolded protein, the sticky protein, if you will, that's 0:16:34.000 --> 0:16:38.600 responsible or partly responsible for Alzheimer's disease. It's a complex 0:16:38.880 --> 0:16:43.479 story and while the existing therapistes have shown slowing of progression, 0:16:43.640 --> 0:16:46.960 there are lots of side effects and there is toxicities 0:16:46.960 --> 0:16:49.880 associated with it, and it's only a mild slowing of 0:16:49.880 --> 0:16:53.600 progression over a period of time. The advisory committee will 0:16:53.600 --> 0:16:56.040 do their best. They know that there is a huge 0:16:56.080 --> 0:16:58.400 unmet need and patients are in desperate need and their 0:16:58.400 --> 0:17:01.240 families are in desperate need. So they're doing the right thing, 0:17:01.320 --> 0:17:04.600 and the FDA advisory committees are also doing the right thing. 0:17:04.800 --> 0:17:08.199 Everyone is trying to come together to protect patients, but 0:17:08.440 --> 0:17:10.840 also to make sure that the treatments that they do 0:17:10.920 --> 0:17:13.800 approve and that they keep on the market are safe 0:17:13.880 --> 0:17:15.240 and efficacious as well. 0:17:15.600 --> 0:17:17.320 Hey, I do wonder, and I'm sure you've seen it 0:17:17.400 --> 0:17:22.800 sixty minutes doctor oli Razai and basically using ultrasound to 0:17:22.840 --> 0:17:27.600 help in the penetration of drugs for whether it's Alzheimer's 0:17:27.640 --> 0:17:31.240 also addiction, and I do wonder whether that is something 0:17:31.280 --> 0:17:33.679 that might need to be paired with what you are doing. 0:17:35.440 --> 0:17:38.800 Sure, so, people in the past have looked at the 0:17:38.880 --> 0:17:42.960 mechanisms of trying to enhance the penetration of drugs into 0:17:43.000 --> 0:17:46.560 the brain. What you typically find in Alzheimer's disease is 0:17:46.600 --> 0:17:50.119 that the blood brain barrier is somewhat leaky, which means 0:17:50.160 --> 0:17:55.119 that drugs that normally would not have crossed or in 0:17:55.200 --> 0:18:00.879 a normal healthy individual, make cross in patients with Allzheimer's disease. 0:18:01.200 --> 0:18:03.919 But I think the most central thing to understand is 0:18:04.119 --> 0:18:08.000 we target inflammation, and if you can modify inflammation in 0:18:08.040 --> 0:18:13.359 the periphery in your blood, that actively involves manipulating the 0:18:13.440 --> 0:18:15.960 cells in the central nervous system in the brain, because 0:18:16.080 --> 0:18:18.560 the immune cells can move back and forth from the 0:18:18.640 --> 0:18:21.480 periphery to the brain. So in our case we don't 0:18:21.480 --> 0:18:24.240 need to manipulate the blood brain barrier, but there are 0:18:24.359 --> 0:18:29.240 also issues or possible toxic effects by trying to make 0:18:29.240 --> 0:18:33.640 the blood brain barrier more penetrant for drugs in the periphery. 0:18:33.800 --> 0:18:35.280 Well, I just you know, was something the top of 0:18:35.280 --> 0:18:37.800 mind from me. I spent some time talking to doctor 0:18:37.840 --> 0:18:40.280 Rozzia at Milkin and one of the speakers. 0:18:40.320 --> 0:18:41.400 So I hope you. 0:18:41.359 --> 0:18:44.359 Will come back, I know, phase two trials once you 0:18:44.400 --> 0:18:46.680 guys know a little bit more. I hope you will 0:18:46.680 --> 0:18:49.520 touch base again because this is obviously something on the 0:18:49.520 --> 0:18:51.200 mind of a lot of us, and as you said, 0:18:51.240 --> 0:18:55.359 you've had personal experience, and we certainly all have personal 0:18:55.400 --> 0:18:57.520 experience with that as well, So I hope you will 0:18:57.520 --> 0:19:02.040 come again. Howard Berman chairman Cefkoya Therapeutic joining us right there, 0:19:03.760 --> 0:19:05.760 I'm brother Mack. 0:19:07.640 --> 0:19:08.120 Journal. 0:19:09.160 --> 0:19:10.120 How about you let me drive? 0:19:10.400 --> 0:19:15.840 Oh no, no, no, no, alright please, I'll do the riding gravels. 0:19:16.040 --> 0:19:17.640 Elease, mate, I want to drive. 0:19:19.920 --> 0:19:21.800 It's a good question time. 0:19:24.600 --> 0:19:27.560 This is the drive to the Globe dot com for me. 0:19:27.720 --> 0:19:29.240 Think well, brun Young. 0:19:29.200 --> 0:19:31.040 Don on Bloomberg Radio. 0:19:31.240 --> 0:19:33.560 All right, everybody, just about eighteen minutes left in today's 0:19:33.640 --> 0:19:37.440 trading session, getting ready to wrap up this Monday trade. 0:19:37.480 --> 0:19:39.160 And as you said to him, anything in the green 0:19:39.200 --> 0:19:41.200 on the S and P five hundred would be another record. 0:19:41.200 --> 0:19:43.480 It would be the twenty fourth record on the S 0:19:43.520 --> 0:19:44.760 and P five hundred this year. 0:19:44.960 --> 0:19:46.760 The S and B five hundred up one tenth of 0:19:46.760 --> 0:19:49.160 one percent right now, the NASDAK up seven tenths of one. 0:19:49.200 --> 0:19:52.760 But that's the numbers enough so far this year, Carol, Yeah, 0:19:52.840 --> 0:19:55.880 twelve percent up on the Nasdaq. Can posit eleven point 0:19:55.960 --> 0:19:57.080 three percent. 0:19:57.040 --> 0:19:58.800 On the S and P five hundred. Yeah, I'm looking 0:19:58.800 --> 0:19:59.280 at the SMA. 0:19:59.480 --> 0:20:02.440 It's not about sell and may go away. Oh wait 0:20:02.480 --> 0:20:03.159 does that happen? 0:20:03.720 --> 0:20:04.440 Could it? 0:20:04.440 --> 0:20:05.320 It depends on the year. 0:20:05.800 --> 0:20:07.920 All right, let's get to at our clothes, our drive 0:20:08.000 --> 0:20:08.400 to the close. 0:20:08.440 --> 0:20:09.919 Guest is with us. Back with us. 0:20:10.080 --> 0:20:13.440 Lamar Villary, portfolio manager at Villary and Company. They have 0:20:13.520 --> 0:20:16.480 about one point six billion in assets under management. He 0:20:16.640 --> 0:20:18.680