Speaker 1: I guess, well, well, what's that mango. So did you
Speaker 1: know that Ben Franklin was this huge, huge fan of
Speaker 1: Genghis Khan. I did not. He actually had these books
Speaker 1: about Khan and they were popular during the day, and
Speaker 1: he'd circulated them across the colonies. So Ben Franklin was
Speaker 1: kind of Genghis Khan's book publicist. I guess, like, this
Speaker 1: seems like a pretty niche interest here if you if
Speaker 1: you asked me, yeah, I mean. The funny thing is,
Speaker 1: it wasn't just Franklin, like, it was a national obsession.
Speaker 1: So like Jefferson, he bought a ton of the copies
Speaker 1: of this book. He gave him to relatives and gifted
Speaker 1: him libraries. George and Martha Washington had the biography and
Speaker 1: Mount Vernon like for some reason that's never mentioned in
Speaker 1: Hamilton's think it is there were even like plays about
Speaker 1: con that were put on stage at the time. But
Speaker 1: this was a super peculiarly American obsession. And people in Europe,
Speaker 1: I mean, they had some interest in Genghis Khan, but
Speaker 1: I guess the reason it was so popular in the
Speaker 1: US was they were really looking for new non European
Speaker 1: heroes to look up to and also new models of government,
Speaker 1: and weirdly enough, Genghis Khan kind of fit into both
Speaker 1: those categories. But as we poke around his biography, we
Speaker 1: wanted to know how much of a hero was Genghis Khan,
Speaker 1: Like why was he so enamored with a meritocracy? And
Speaker 1: did he really invent the hamburger? So let's dive in
Speaker 1: pay their podcast listeners, Welcome to Part Time Genius. I'm
Speaker 1: Will Pearson and as always I'm joined by my good
Speaker 1: friend Mangesh Ticketer and sitting on the other side of
Speaker 1: the soundproof glass wearing yet another perfectly themed shirt. I mean,
Speaker 1: this guy nails it every time. That's our friends and
Speaker 1: producer Tristan McNeil. And actually I forget what it says exactly.
Speaker 1: Can you show us, Tristan, it says if Genghis Khan
Speaker 1: sokn you. I mean, you know, it's just spot on
Speaker 1: mango that is so terrible and it almost feels like
Speaker 1: a bad motivational poster. But I have a feeling that's
Speaker 1: not an original Genghis Khan quote. No, I don't. I
Speaker 1: don't think it is. It feels a little more Tristan,
Speaker 1: if you know what I mean? But what's clear from
Speaker 1: this week's reading is that Genghis Khan didn't need motivational
Speaker 1: phrases or a life coach to get things done. I mean,
Speaker 1: this was a born go getter. And in roughly two
Speaker 1: and a half decades, Genghis Khan and his army conquered
Speaker 1: more lands and people than the Romans did over a
Speaker 1: four hundred years span. I mean, that is just insane
Speaker 1: to me, like four hundred years of Roman rule and
Speaker 1: and like they didn't accomplish what Genghis Kan did in
Speaker 1: two and a half decades. But you know what's weird
Speaker 1: and Gabe told us to me is that Genghis Khan
Speaker 1: was apparently a really good boss, which is just such
Speaker 1: a funny idea to me, Like, I love the idea
Speaker 1: of Genghis just you know, sitting behind a desk pile
Speaker 1: of paperwork, like sipping from his world's best boss mug.
Speaker 1: But apparently this is true. He had all these progressive policies,
Speaker 1: like um, he granted universal religious freedom, he abolished torture.
Speaker 1: Uh in just about every country the Mongols took over,
Speaker 1: the quality of life actually improved for the citizens. I mean,
Speaker 1: as long as they pledged the loyalty to con things
Speaker 1: got better, and that's really what we wanted to get
Speaker 1: to the bottom of that today's show, like who was
Speaker 1: the real Genghis Khan? Was he a super innovative, ahead
Speaker 1: of his time mastermind or or was he just this
Speaker 1: blood thirst deep barbarian who kind of cleverly slaughtered his
Speaker 1: way to the top. Well, before we get into that debate,
Speaker 1: I feel like we should start with a little bit
Speaker 1: of a recap on how Genghis rose to power, and
Speaker 1: to do that, I feel like we really need to
Speaker 1: set the scene a little bit. So this may be
Speaker 1: a little bit weird, but Tristan, if you don't mind,
Speaker 1: I feel like we need a little bit of mood
Speaker 1: music here. So picture life for a twelfth century Mongol
Speaker 1: And at the time there were about a million nomadic
Speaker 1: people living on the Central Asian step and this is
Speaker 1: not too far from the border between modern Mongolia and Siberia.
Speaker 1: And as you might imagine, life was pretty brutal, to
Speaker 1: say the least, and you had dozens of different tribes
Speaker 1: living in the same general area, all vying for these
Speaker 1: same limited resources. That's funny because, like the way you
Speaker 1: described it started out so pastoral and romantic, and then
Speaker 1: it ended kind of like a really terrible game of Katan,
Speaker 1: or like game of Throne. That's exactly what it sounds like.
Speaker 1: But so it was really a terrible time, and because
Speaker 1: of that scarcity, everyone was always drinking and fighting and
Speaker 1: stealing from each other. People were afraid to go out
Speaker 1: after dark, and it was really just a chaotic way
Speaker 1: of life by most accounts, at least, like I read
Speaker 1: that most people slept on top of their weapons just
Speaker 1: in case anyone tried something during the night. And this
Speaker 1: is the world Genghis Khan was born into in the
Speaker 1: early eleven sixties. So according to the myths, he came
Speaker 1: out of his mother clutching a blood clot and his fist,
Speaker 1: which is an odd detail and I don't really know
Speaker 1: exactly what that means, but I guess it was supposed
Speaker 1: to be a sign that he was destined to be
Speaker 1: a great leader. I love that that's the re sure,
Speaker 1: which is a nice story. But you know, even without
Speaker 1: that blood clot, the boy would have been in line
Speaker 1: for a pretty kush leadership role. So he was the
Speaker 1: son of a Mongol chieftain. He was the head of
Speaker 1: the Borgigan clan, and this was composed of around families,
Speaker 1: and because Asia's feudal system was what it was, it
Speaker 1: favored class and ancestry, and that kind of set Genghis
Speaker 1: up nicely well. And besides, his name was Genghis Khan,
Speaker 1: which literally translated means universal ruler. I mean, I think
Speaker 1: if you have a kid with a name like that,
Speaker 1: it's pretty clear what the plan is. Yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: you're right, that's what the name means. But the boy
Speaker 1: who would be Khan actually didn't go by that name
Speaker 1: until he was already in his forties. Before that, he
Speaker 1: was actually called Timidgen, which was the Mongol word for blacksmith,
Speaker 1: and his dad actually took that name from an enemy
Speaker 1: chief that he'd recently captured, so he was named for
Speaker 1: an enemy. Apparently it was this common practice in Mongol
Speaker 1: culture to name a newborn after some kind of important event,
Speaker 1: like something good that happened recently. So I guess you
Speaker 1: could say that like Timidgen wasn't so much named after
Speaker 1: the father's enemy, but I guess the capture of that enemy,
Speaker 1: and I guess that makes a little more sense. It's
Speaker 1: still a little but so if Timidgen's dad was this
Speaker 1: hot shot clan leader and the soldier. Does that mean
Speaker 1: Genghis Khan was basically born into success and just kind
Speaker 1: of expanded the empire because I don't know, I always
Speaker 1: had this thought of him as as being more of
Speaker 1: a self made man. Yeah, me too. But you know,
Speaker 1: for the most part, Mongol leaders went through the same
Speaker 1: hardships as their people, So it's not like his family
Speaker 1: status really put him on easy street or anything. But
Speaker 1: Genghis's story actually takes a turn for the worst before
Speaker 1: things start to go really well for him. So, when
Speaker 1: Timidgin was just nine years old, his father was poisoned
Speaker 1: to death by assassins from Arrival Klan, and since he
Speaker 1: was so young, Timiden wasn't given the chance to take
Speaker 1: over for his father obviously, you know, like a nine
Speaker 1: year old is not going to lead however many people.
Speaker 1: But you know, instead of being able to live among
Speaker 1: the tribe, the clan kind of saw his family as
Speaker 1: a burden now and that they'd have to be responsible
Speaker 1: for feeding and housing. So instead Timagen, along with his
Speaker 1: mother and their six siblings were banished from their own clan. Wow,
Speaker 1: I mean this is honestly, it feels like the start
Speaker 1: of I don't know, like a good superhero origin story.
Speaker 1: Maybe it's because I saw the recent Spider Man movie,
Speaker 1: but that just just feels that's coming, yeah, into the
Speaker 1: Genghas verse. But you know, things don't get easier for
Speaker 1: Genghas here. Like during his teenage years, they're spent mostly
Speaker 1: hunting and foraging with his family. There's this really low
Speaker 1: point in their situation where Timidgen actually murders his older
Speaker 1: half brother because his brother isn't sharing the limited food
Speaker 1: they have. I mean, that's how bleak things get. And
Speaker 1: then after facing his mother and grappling with what he'd done, somehow,
Speaker 1: things even get worse for Timidgen. So while foraging for food,
Speaker 1: he gets captured and enslaved by the same clan that
Speaker 1: had banished him a few years earlier. Oh my gosh.
Speaker 1: You know, you think about abandoning his family being bad enough,
Speaker 1: But but what happened though? He must have escaped at
Speaker 1: some point, yeah, I mean pretty soon after his capture
Speaker 1: he got away, and it was kind of this morale boost,
Speaker 1: strangely for him, because after that he decided he was
Speaker 1: strong enough to return to society, and now he had
Speaker 1: kind of a chip on his shoulder, so he decided
Speaker 1: to go in and asked to marry the woman that
Speaker 1: had been betrothed to them just before his father's death.
Speaker 1: It's kind of a confusing image though, like so he
Speaker 1: just storms back into the village and makes these demands
Speaker 1: and does that work or what? Yeah, So this is
Speaker 1: actually where things start to turn around for Timigen. So
Speaker 1: he convinces the tribe leader to honor this old agreement
Speaker 1: with his father, and Timidgen's allowed to marry the chief's
Speaker 1: daughter named Borte, And now Timidgen's honor is more or
Speaker 1: less restored. He kind of has a place in society again.
Speaker 1: And uh, you know, this is ancient Mongolia we're talking about,
Speaker 1: so so things don't stay that peaceful for long. Pretty
Speaker 1: soon after the wedding, this rival tribe goes on a
Speaker 1: raid and during the scuffle, Timidgen's bride is kidnapped and
Speaker 1: carried away on horseback. But it's like they can't get
Speaker 1: a break, like nothing is easy in this cult where
Speaker 1: it seems like I know, and and he's he's kind
Speaker 1: of like the ziggy of Mongols like that thinks keep
Speaker 1: happening to him. But this ends up being like the
Speaker 1: last straw for Timogen. So right then, like backing down,
Speaker 1: he rallies some friends and he rides out and he
Speaker 1: rescues Borte, and he kind of realized he's good at this.
Speaker 1: And and with those connections established and he's got this win,
Speaker 1: he starts to form alliances and then he attracts more followers,
Speaker 1: and over the course of the next few years, this
Speaker 1: just keeps growing and growing, and he gradually consolidates all
Speaker 1: the various nomadic tribes one by one, until in twelve
Speaker 1: o five when Timodgen best the very last of his rivals,
Speaker 1: Like he's now looking for more things to do, and
Speaker 1: and at this point, like the Mongols really have established
Speaker 1: their leadership, Like he's toppled the entire structure that I've
Speaker 1: been there before. The step tribes are all united for
Speaker 1: the first time in history, and honestly, everything is about
Speaker 1: to change. And the following year, Timogen calls together representatives
Speaker 1: from every part of the region, and once they're gathered,
Speaker 1: he informs them there now all part of this brand
Speaker 1: new nation. It's going to be organized by these universal laws.
Speaker 1: It's going to be overseen by a universal ruler him
Speaker 1: And at the end of the meeting, Timagen has proclaimed
Speaker 1: Chengis Khan, or the universal Ruler, and uh, you know,
Speaker 1: in the West this gets translated as Genghis Khan. Al Right,
Speaker 1: So just to kind of wrap my head around this
Speaker 1: whole thing, I mentioned that we're about a million people
Speaker 1: living on the step when Khan came to power. So
Speaker 1: all of a sudden, the prince, turned outcast, turned slave
Speaker 1: is now in charge of a million people. Is this right? Yeah?
Speaker 1: It is this miraculous return to grace. And and you
Speaker 1: know he really meant it when he came out of
Speaker 1: the womb clutching that blood clout, I guess, because that
Speaker 1: was just the start of it. But uh, you know,
Speaker 1: with the tribe United, con spent the next two decades
Speaker 1: just growing and growing this empire. And at the peak
Speaker 1: of his power, the Mongol leader controlled roughly twelve million
Speaker 1: contiguous square miles, which was more than twice as much
Speaker 1: land as any other person before or since. And at
Speaker 1: the heart of that conquest was this ferocious but highly
Speaker 1: disciplined Mongol army composed of just a hundred thousand men.
Speaker 1: I'm curious to like, how could such a small army
Speaker 1: conquered that much territory? Like, I know it happened, but
Speaker 1: it really feels impossible. Yeah, and I think it wouldn't
Speaker 1: have been possible for most countries. But that's really where
Speaker 1: Genghis Khan's genius comes in. Like the innovations he brought
Speaker 1: to society and warfare really made it possible for his
Speaker 1: people not only to conquer an empire, but to run
Speaker 1: it effectively once the fighting was done. And so what
Speaker 1: kind of innovations are we talking about? Like, what what
Speaker 1: did Genghas do differently that made his reign so successful?
Speaker 1: I mean all kinds of things, but I'd say one
Speaker 1: of the most important was the way he dealt with
Speaker 1: the people in the places he conquered. Like his whole
Speaker 1: focus was expansion. He wanted to extend his empire and
Speaker 1: grow his hoard, and that meant that wholesale slaughter was
Speaker 1: really out of the question. And that doesn't mean he
Speaker 1: didn't kill people. He killed plenty of people. It's just
Speaker 1: that his army always needed new recruits, and any nation
Speaker 1: that was conquered had plenty of them waiting in the way.
Speaker 1: The only catch was that these people would have to
Speaker 1: be treated well enough that they wouldn't mind joining forces
Speaker 1: with him and also bending the need in So how
Speaker 1: did he make these people convert? Well, once he conquered
Speaker 1: a nation, he killed the leaders on the spot, but
Speaker 1: he had kind of like a weird justification for that,
Speaker 1: like he thought those kings and royals or chieftains like
Speaker 1: they all deserved it for leading their people into a
Speaker 1: war they couldn't win. And then he also killed off
Speaker 1: the wealthy ruling class because on one hand he considered
Speaker 1: them soft, but he also figured he could never really
Speaker 1: win their loyalty anyway. But everyone else, if they surrendered,
Speaker 1: they were spared, and anyone with useful skills was allowed
Speaker 1: to stay and essentially carry on with their lives pretty
Speaker 1: much as usual, though now with sort of greater security.
Speaker 1: And this was for really any type of skills, so
Speaker 1: like basket weavers and and those with ability to write
Speaker 1: were essentially as valued as those who farmed or forged weapons.
Speaker 1: All right, So what about the conquered citizens who didn't
Speaker 1: have certain skills, Like, what would happen to these people? Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean they were spared as well. They were typically
Speaker 1: forced into labor or or sometimes used as human chields
Speaker 1: in the army's next battle, which was I'm sure, a
Speaker 1: little less appealing for them. It's kind of a kind
Speaker 1: of a mixed bag for these people. Yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: you might have been progressive, but he was still, you know,
Speaker 1: a con but uh um, you know, Genghis was still
Speaker 1: this incredibly harsh and violent guy when he had to be.
Speaker 1: But before we get into the mass murder and the
Speaker 1: city burning, I do want to spend a little more
Speaker 1: time building the case for Khan as a great progressive. Well.
Speaker 1: I can't wait to see what you come up with,
Speaker 1: but first, let's take a quick break. You're listening to
Speaker 1: Part Time Genius and we're talking about the softer side
Speaker 1: of Genghis Khan. At least I think that's what we're
Speaker 1: about to talk about. Yeah, it almost feels like a
Speaker 1: Hallmark movie, right, it should be all right? Well, migo,
Speaker 1: before the break, you were playing devil's advocate for Khan
Speaker 1: and laying out some of the surprisingly tolerant views he
Speaker 1: had held. But do you do you want to give
Speaker 1: us a few more examples of him. Yeah, definitely, so again,
Speaker 1: so much of what he did differently came down to
Speaker 1: how he treated his subjects, and those were really not
Speaker 1: just his own people, but the people from the conquered territories. Basically,
Speaker 1: he knew that if he kept people happy, they'd be
Speaker 1: less likely to rebel, and his empire would continue to
Speaker 1: grow as a result. So with that in mind, Khan
Speaker 1: created universal laws aimed at keeping the peace and preventing
Speaker 1: the infighting that had previously plagued his tribe. So first
Speaker 1: and foremost, he granted religious freedom to everyone under his rule.
Speaker 1: This was super crucial because so many of his followers
Speaker 1: practice completely different religions. So within his ranks you'd find Jews, Christians, Muslims, Buddhist, Taoists,
Speaker 1: and and even people who followed animistic traditions like the
Speaker 1: shamanism Genghis Khan himself practiced. And then his new regions
Speaker 1: fell to the Mongol invaders, religious representation within a hoard
Speaker 1: became more and more diverse. But you know, con didn't
Speaker 1: stopped just that tolerance. He he also rewarded piety by
Speaker 1: exempting religious personnel and places of worship from paying taxes,
Speaker 1: which is kind of a huge boon. And he also
Speaker 1: exempted any person whose profession contributed to the common goods.
Speaker 1: So if you think about it, like these are people
Speaker 1: like teachers, doctors, undertakers, all of them were exempt as well.
Speaker 1: And uh, you know, as we mentioned earlier, Genghis also
Speaker 1: outlawed other traditional practices at the time, like torturing prisoners, uh,
Speaker 1: kidnapping women, and taking other Mongols as servants or slaves.
Speaker 1: And as you might have noticed, that some of those
Speaker 1: decisions drew directly from his own life experiences. So his
Speaker 1: wife had been kidnapped, he himself had been slaved as
Speaker 1: a teenager, and all this taught him firsthand that you
Speaker 1: can't really build a healthy community or economy when fellow
Speaker 1: citizens are living in bondage. Wow. I mean, those are
Speaker 1: great examples, and I feel like you make a compelling
Speaker 1: point here. But there was one example that I thought
Speaker 1: you would include here, one of really I think his
Speaker 1: biggest achievements, and that is, of course, that he devised
Speaker 1: one of the first international postal systems in the world.
Speaker 1: Like it was basically an early version of the Pony Express.
Speaker 1: That's right. So here's a breakdown that actually saw on
Speaker 1: history dot com. I thought it would just read it directly,
Speaker 1: so it says one of his earliest decrees as con
Speaker 1: involved the formation of a mounted courier service known as
Speaker 1: the Yam. This medieval express consisted of a well organized
Speaker 1: series of post houses and way stations strung across the
Speaker 1: whole empire. By stopping to rest or take on a
Speaker 1: fresh mount every few miles, official writers could often travel
Speaker 1: as far as two hundred miles a day. The system
Speaker 1: allowed goods and information to travel with unprecedented speed, but
Speaker 1: also acted as the eyes and ears of the con
Speaker 1: Thanks to the Am, Genghis could easily keep abreast of
Speaker 1: military and political developments and maintain contact with his extensive
Speaker 1: network of spies and scouts. I love that it's called
Speaker 1: Yam first off, that feels like such a weird, fun branding,
Speaker 1: But I I think you're right that is way too
Speaker 1: cool to leave out, especially since it's such a great
Speaker 1: example of like advantages that Khan's army had over other people.
Speaker 1: And speaking of advantage is one of my favorite things
Speaker 1: about Genghis Kan's leadership style is the way he used
Speaker 1: his army's diversity as a strength. Like if you remember
Speaker 1: all those skilled workers they accumulated from fallen cities, you
Speaker 1: know he had brought in these engineers, craftsmen, experts on
Speaker 1: everything from like Chinese metallurgy to um to Arabian mathematicians.
Speaker 1: And because Khan put all religions and cultures on the
Speaker 1: same equal footing, he was able to wield this big
Speaker 1: melting pot of international expertise however he wanted, which is amazing.
Speaker 1: But what did he do with this? Exactly? Like, I
Speaker 1: feel like the Mongols mostly fought on horseback with bow
Speaker 1: and arrows, So how do you improve on that? Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean that archer approach worked really well early, and
Speaker 1: so when enemy is retreated behind city walls, Mongols could
Speaker 1: just aim higher and pepper them with arrows until they surrendered.
Speaker 1: But it got harder and harder as word got out,
Speaker 1: so you know, the nations started building up their defenses,
Speaker 1: walls got taller and stronger. It became clear that Mongols
Speaker 1: would have to like change their tactics, and that's where
Speaker 1: the fleet of engineers and craftsmen really come in. So
Speaker 1: pretty soon the Mongols were catapulting these iron balls filled
Speaker 1: with gunpowder over the walls or just straight up tearing
Speaker 1: down the walls with grappling hooks, and on at least
Speaker 1: one occasion, the army diverted the flow of an entire
Speaker 1: river as a way to flood a walled city and
Speaker 1: force the people out. Isn't the insane It really is.
Speaker 1: I mean, you look back at this and you think,
Speaker 1: not only is he building this huge and sweeping empire,
Speaker 1: but he's also changing the face of warfare. In the
Speaker 1: process of all of this exactly. But beyond all these tactics,
Speaker 1: Con also changed the way armies were structured and ranked.
Speaker 1: So in the past, Mongol armies had been organized according
Speaker 1: to the same feudal system that governed society as a whole.
Speaker 1: Officers were appointed and promoted based on which class they
Speaker 1: belonged to or who they were related to. But again,
Speaker 1: Genghis Khan was having none of this right, he had
Speaker 1: this traumatic childhood experience, so that really showed him the
Speaker 1: flaws of the system. So, rather than perpetuating something he
Speaker 1: saw and had experienced as broken, Con decided to up
Speaker 1: end that too, and he started promoting his officers based
Speaker 1: on individual merit and skill. And this setup, which feels
Speaker 1: kind of obvious and almost American, you can see why
Speaker 1: all those founding fathers liked him. It really made his
Speaker 1: soldiers work harder to distinguish themselves, since all of a
Speaker 1: sudden they felt like they had this chance to improve
Speaker 1: their standing and it was on them to do it. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I was actually reading this week about how Khan was
Speaker 1: a big fan of meritocracy, which we kind of alluded
Speaker 1: to earlier. But you know, it makes sense when you
Speaker 1: look back at how he had to prove himself to
Speaker 1: his fellow tribe members. But I feel like the clearest
Speaker 1: example of his philosophy is from this early encounter his
Speaker 1: army had with a rival tribe. So this enemy archer
Speaker 1: managed to shoot down Genghis Khan's horse in the heat
Speaker 1: of battle, and when the horse fell, it nearly killed
Speaker 1: Khan on its way down. And in the end, the
Speaker 1: Mongols were victorious and the opposing soldiers were all taken prisoner.
Speaker 1: And so at this point Genghis demands to know who
Speaker 1: the archer was that had shot his horse. I mean,
Speaker 1: who knows if he actually expected anybody to raise their
Speaker 1: hand and kind of cop to it. But he might
Speaker 1: have just been looking for an excuse to punish all
Speaker 1: of them. I guess, at least that's what I would
Speaker 1: have thought if I were in that position. And this
Speaker 1: is Genghis Khan we're talking about. But anyway, at any rate,
Speaker 1: after a pause, one soldier steps forward and admits to
Speaker 1: having shot the arrow. And this kind of bravery actually
Speaker 1: catches Genghis off guard, so rather than having the man
Speaker 1: killed where he stood, Genghis immediately pardons him and makes
Speaker 1: him a ranking officer in his army. In fact, contakes
Speaker 1: to the guy so well that he even gives him
Speaker 1: one of those callback nicknames like he had when he
Speaker 1: was a kid. So what do you mean, like he
Speaker 1: he gets a name like almost shot me or something.
Speaker 1: It's really not far from that. kN actually started calling
Speaker 1: him jeb A, which means arrow. And yeah, you might
Speaker 1: assume that being renamed by a conquering warlord would rub
Speaker 1: this guy the wrong way, but Jeb didn't mind one bit.
Speaker 1: He remained loyal to Khan throughout his life and eventually
Speaker 1: became one of his most successful and respected field commanders.
Speaker 1: And in this entire vast army, Oh Jeffy, and I'm
Speaker 1: surprised we don't hear that name more often. Well, don't
Speaker 1: sing his praises too much. Remember, being an effective general
Speaker 1: really just means he was super good at killing people,
Speaker 1: like a lot of people. Sure, So, now that we've
Speaker 1: covered what a tolerant, unifying statesman genghas Khan was we
Speaker 1: should probably address the pile of dead elephants in the
Speaker 1: room and talk about just how bloody his rise to
Speaker 1: power really was. Yeah, I mean, the progressive policies were
Speaker 1: great and all, but it's hard to get around the
Speaker 1: fact that Genghis Khan was also responsible for the deaths
Speaker 1: of as many as forty million people. So I I
Speaker 1: didn't realize the head count was actually that high. The
Speaker 1: official number is forty million people. I mean, there's no
Speaker 1: official numbers, not like anybody was keeping track out on
Speaker 1: the battlefield or anything like that. But the best guess
Speaker 1: according to historians is that somewhere around forty million people
Speaker 1: were killed during Genghis Khan's conquest of Asia and of
Speaker 1: course Europe. I mean that is staggering. So how are
Speaker 1: they getting that sort of number if there's no written record. Well,
Speaker 1: there's no written record from the battles, but that doesn't
Speaker 1: mean there are no records at all. I mean, we
Speaker 1: actually have details sensus reports from the Middle Ages, and
Speaker 1: those show that the population of China dropped by tens
Speaker 1: of millions during Khan's lifetime. So when you add up
Speaker 1: all the circumstantial evidence, it's likely that the Mongols rampage
Speaker 1: reduced as much as eleven percent of the entire world population.
Speaker 1: That is horrific. I feel like I can't even wrap
Speaker 1: my head around that amount of carnage. Yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: it's definitely a lot to process. But on the bright side, though,
Speaker 1: there are these studies that show that something like point
Speaker 1: five percent of the global population is descended from Genghis Khan.
Speaker 1: So I guess you could make the case that he
Speaker 1: indirectly replaced all these lives that he took. But I
Speaker 1: don't think you could really say that makes up for
Speaker 1: too much. What a hot take to make that case.
Speaker 1: But uh, you know, instead, let's take another quick break
Speaker 1: and then when we come back, let's talk about how
Speaker 1: Genghis Khan might have affected climate change. Okay, well, so
Speaker 1: was Genghis Khan a blood thirsty tyrant or was he
Speaker 1: a progressive champion of the people? We need your take. Well,
Speaker 1: you know, at the end of the day, and I've
Speaker 1: been thinking about this, I'd have to say my answer
Speaker 1: is a resounding yes. Sure, So yes to both. I'm
Speaker 1: guessing yes to both. I mean, I don't know what
Speaker 1: the other conclusion you could draw, really, I mean, on
Speaker 1: the one hand, he was tolerant of other religions, other cultures,
Speaker 1: relatively kind to women and prisoners, a staunch defender of
Speaker 1: the rule of law. I mean, his life as the
Speaker 1: underdog story for the ages. And it just so happens
Speaker 1: that this really innovative and inspirational figure was also a
Speaker 1: mass murderer, like the likes of which the world had
Speaker 1: never seen before and honestly hopefully we'll never see again. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he's definitely a difficult figure to pin down, but you know,
Speaker 1: in my mind, there are some things that do come
Speaker 1: across as kind of tough but fair. Like his laws
Speaker 1: are incredibly harsh, but he does seem to like abide
Speaker 1: by them and enforce them in equal measure, which, if
Speaker 1: you look at like Europe and other places, his peers
Speaker 1: aren't doing this, Like they play fast and loose with
Speaker 1: laws and they rarely hold themselves or their friends accountable. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's a good point. I mean. Another thing is that
Speaker 1: from everything I've read, Khan also seemed to be unfailingly loyal.
Speaker 1: Like as you were saying before, he was of course
Speaker 1: loyal to the law itself, but he was also loyal
Speaker 1: to soldiers and to the people who followed him. So,
Speaker 1: for example, Ginghis Khan is often thought to be one
Speaker 1: of the richest people in history, if not the richest,
Speaker 1: and that's mostly because of the sheer quantity of land
Speaker 1: that he possessed, I mean, those twelve million or so
Speaker 1: acres that we were talking about before. But the thing is,
Speaker 1: Kant never kept all the money and riches that he
Speaker 1: won through the conquest for himself. Instead, he redistributed all
Speaker 1: that wealth to his people, thereby ensuring that it would
Speaker 1: go right back into growing the nation's economy. And he
Speaker 1: didn't just do that for the soldiers and craftsmen either,
Speaker 1: like even widows and orphans were given a share of
Speaker 1: the spoils. So in the end, here was a ruler
Speaker 1: who never built himself a palace, never ordered a monument
Speaker 1: to be built in his honor, and instead he made
Speaker 1: sure that the weakest and most vulnerable members of the
Speaker 1: community were all provided for. And yet for all that good,
Speaker 1: there was still a lot of blood and death. I mean,
Speaker 1: he's definitely president of contradictions. I mean, you know what's
Speaker 1: funny is that you hear about Genghis Khan and even
Speaker 1: though I knew how wide his empire was, I rarely
Speaker 1: compared it to Julius Caesar and Alexander the Great. I mean,
Speaker 1: both of these guys. He really puts the shame, to
Speaker 1: be honest. Yeah, you know, one thing I hadn't realized
Speaker 1: was that there was this concerned effort from the Soviets
Speaker 1: to stamp out the memory of Genghis Khan. And it
Speaker 1: kind of sounds weird now because modern day Mongolia is
Speaker 1: right next door to Russia, but you know, Mongolians revere
Speaker 1: Khan as kind of a national hero and founding father
Speaker 1: all sort of rolled into one. But in the early
Speaker 1: twentieth century, when the region was still under Soviet rule,
Speaker 1: it was illegal to even mention the name Genghis Khan.
Speaker 1: And it wasn't just his name that was taboo either,
Speaker 1: Like the Soviets also removed con story from their textbooks,
Speaker 1: their history books. They it made it a crime to
Speaker 1: visit his birthplace. It was insane. Wow. So the Mongols
Speaker 1: really did a number on Russia. I mean, if you
Speaker 1: think about all of those centuries later, they were still
Speaker 1: insecure about this defeat. Yeah, I mean, the crackdown was
Speaker 1: definitely fueled apart by hard feelings, but the bigger concern
Speaker 1: was that the memories of Khan's conquest would ignite a
Speaker 1: sense of nationalism in the Mongolians, and the Soviets really
Speaker 1: wanted to like keep their thumb on the population, so
Speaker 1: it was kind of in their best interest to race
Speaker 1: any connection to a hero or a figure who might
Speaker 1: be inspirational to the Mongolians and give them any ideas
Speaker 1: of independence. Yeah. But once the Cold War ended and
Speaker 1: the Soviet Union fell in the early nineties, Mongolia did,
Speaker 1: of course become a sovereign nation again, that's right. And
Speaker 1: when it did, the history of Genghis Khan was restored.
Speaker 1: And of course he's been a huge part of the
Speaker 1: art and culture in Mongolia ever since. In fact, CON's
Speaker 1: faces even featured on Mongolian currency. All right, So what
Speaker 1: about outside of Asia? Like, why do so many people
Speaker 1: in Europe and the States have such a limited view
Speaker 1: of Khan's accomplishments. I mean, I think a lot of
Speaker 1: it comes down to this idea that Mongols were really
Speaker 1: barbaric and savage. But there are a lot of historians
Speaker 1: out there who have made it their mission to set
Speaker 1: the record straight on Genghis Khan, and and chief among
Speaker 1: them is is this anthropology professor and this author named
Speaker 1: Jack Weatherford. He's written multiple books on the life and
Speaker 1: exploits of Genghis Khan, and much of his work focuses
Speaker 1: on the duality we've been talking about today. But you know,
Speaker 1: thanks to his efforts, a lot of people have this
Speaker 1: much fuller picture of who Genghas Khan was. And as
Speaker 1: a nice bonus, books have actually helped Mongolia's economy. Apparently
Speaker 1: tourism there has more than tripled in the decades since
Speaker 1: his first book on Genghis was published. Wow, and does
Speaker 1: he have a theory for wa Genghis isn't more celebrated. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he does. I Actually, I've got a quote right here,
Speaker 1: and this is from an interview he did two years
Speaker 1: ago with the History News Network. So in it he says, quote,
Speaker 1: contrary to common myth and cliche, history is written not
Speaker 1: necessarily by the victors, but by those who hold the
Speaker 1: deepest grudges. The so called civilized world, Europe, the Middle East,
Speaker 1: in China was not only defeated by, but humiliated by
Speaker 1: its conquest by people whom they considered inferior barbarians. For
Speaker 1: a long time, we have been unable to accept that
Speaker 1: an Asian conqueror might have something to teach us. Still today,
Speaker 1: it is time to reconsider that legacy of Genghis Khan.
Speaker 1: To label him an environmentalist, feminist, liberal, or democrat would
Speaker 1: be silly and anachronistic. He was a conqueror, but he
Speaker 1: was also more a man of the future than the past,
Speaker 1: because we still not have been able to fulfill his
Speaker 1: vision of a just world. I mean, it's it's weird.
Speaker 1: I never would have guessed that Genghis Khan's vision was
Speaker 1: something to aspire to, but here we are. I mean,
Speaker 1: I guess in the end, it all goes back to
Speaker 1: Tristan's T shirt. Like, if the world is heading in
Speaker 1: the wrong direction and you don't feel like finding any
Speaker 1: longer to try and make it right, just remember if
Speaker 1: Genghis Khan so kanu thanks Tristan. Yeah, truly words to
Speaker 1: live by. But before any of you go out and
Speaker 1: change the world, we still got a few great facts
Speaker 1: to cover, so let's do this fact. One of the
Speaker 1: weird things about Genghis Khan is that no one knows
Speaker 1: where he was buried. He he wanted to be placed
Speaker 1: in an unmarked grave. And there are all these theories
Speaker 1: of the people who buried him being killed so that
Speaker 1: the secret died with them. There's another story that his
Speaker 1: engineers diverted a river over his grave to cover it up.
Speaker 1: But whatever they did, it worked because even now this
Speaker 1: many centuries later, we still don't know where his body
Speaker 1: is actually. Speaking of devoting rivers, apparently it was a
Speaker 1: favorite trick of Genghis. After vanquishing one enemy, he diverted
Speaker 1: a river through the enemy's birthplace so that it would
Speaker 1: be totally erased from the maps. So here's a fun one.
Speaker 1: Do you know that one of the world's hardest horse
Speaker 1: races is directly inspired by Genghis Khan. Apparently as part
Speaker 1: of the Mongol derby, writers try to stay on these
Speaker 1: half wild Mongols horses as they raced along Genghis's old
Speaker 1: postal route, which was over six miles long. That's pretty cool.
Speaker 1: One of the things we really didn't touch. I mean,
Speaker 1: we mentioned that forty million number, but we really didn't
Speaker 1: touch on how brutal Khan could be. So after defeating
Speaker 1: a Russian army, he and the Mongols forced the Russian
Speaker 1: army to lie on the ground and they basically threw
Speaker 1: a party on top of them, like they put this
Speaker 1: giant wooden gate, then chairs and tables, then feasted and
Speaker 1: danced on their enemies, cru shing them beneath. I know
Speaker 1: we usually like to keep it kind of light and
Speaker 1: the fact off, but I felt like I had to
Speaker 1: mention this one. But how horrible is that? That is horrific?
Speaker 1: You know. I feel like it's almost like when my
Speaker 1: mom used to kill an ant in the kitchen and
Speaker 1: then leave it there as a warning to all the
Speaker 1: other ants to see you. Both my mom and Genghis
Speaker 1: Khan like to send a message. You know. Here's one
Speaker 1: of the weirder theories I read about this week. The
Speaker 1: Guardian had the story that because Khan killed so many
Speaker 1: millions of people, he was actually an unintentional eco warrior.
Speaker 1: Raid supposedly resulted in man made climate change cooling the
Speaker 1: planet and possibly scrubbing seven metric tons of C O
Speaker 1: two from the atmosphere. Yeah, I'm not sure I can
Speaker 1: get behind that argument. But that's that's pretty well well,
Speaker 1: I will say. I know we've shared some pretty terrible
Speaker 1: things about Genghis Khan, but one thing that does really
Speaker 1: kind of redeem him, to be honest, is the spread
Speaker 1: of the Hamburger. So nat g O and first we
Speaker 1: Fees both trace the big mac back to Khan and
Speaker 1: his squad. And that's because Mongolians would carry meat under
Speaker 1: their saddles to transport on the go, and this would
Speaker 1: tend arise the food. And they brought this technique to
Speaker 1: Russia they started eating steak tartar and from there it
Speaker 1: past to Germany where people started making these hamburg steaks,
Speaker 1: and of course you fast forward from there and it
Speaker 1: was finally slapped on buns and ordered animal style at
Speaker 1: in and outs. I really hope someone comes up with
Speaker 1: like a new fast food chain called Genghis Is for
Speaker 1: you wait like three yards from the restaurant and they
Speaker 1: just pony expressed that's a good thing. So good. But uh,
Speaker 1: I do think you take the prize today. But you know,
Speaker 1: before we go, I I did want to give a
Speaker 1: special shout out to my wonderful sister in law. Even
Speaker 1: though I've got this terrible voice, it's it's sincere Laura Cravis.
Speaker 1: She's one of the world's best teachers. And if your
Speaker 1: kid is lucky enough to have her, your kids are
Speaker 1: gonna fall in love with history and reading and learned
Speaker 1: so much but you know, not only has she been
Speaker 1: a big champion for mental floss over the years, but
Speaker 1: essentially since the first time I've met her, she's been
Speaker 1: telling me how we should do an article on Gangs Khan,
Speaker 1: or an issue one Genghis Khan, or make Genghis Khan
Speaker 1: t shirts or poster her. She's been such a supporter
Speaker 1: and I never did any of it, so all this
Speaker 1: years later, this episode for her. Oh, we're a little
Speaker 1: late on the execution here, I think that thank you
Speaker 1: for listening to our little show. If you have thoughts
Speaker 1: or comments, hit us up at part time genius at
Speaker 1: how stuff works, and if you really want to make
Speaker 1: our year, give us a nice rating on the ratings thingies,
Speaker 1: you know, and tell your friends about the show. But
Speaker 1: from Gabe, Tristan, Mango, and me, thanks so much for listening.