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Speaker 1: Hey, guys, Ready or not, twenty twenty four is here,

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Speaker 1: and we here at Breaking Points, are already thinking of

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Speaker 1: ways we can up our game for this critical election.

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Speaker 1: coverage that is possible. If you like what we're all about,

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Speaker 1: it means the absolute world to have your support. What

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Speaker 1: are you waiting for? Become a premium subscriber today at

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Speaker 1: Breakingpoints dot com. So one thing I've been tracking very closely.

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Speaker 1: I actually did a monologue here before the release was

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Speaker 1: the government is mandated to release all of the records

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Speaker 1: related to JFK's assassination, and president after president has been

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Speaker 1: pushing off this deadline. Was once again that deadline was

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Speaker 1: upon Joe Biden and he did do a limited release

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Speaker 1: of documents. So very excited to be joined by an

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Speaker 1: expert journalist and researcher on exactly what is revealed by

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Speaker 1: these documents and also what is revealed by which documents

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Speaker 1: are continuing to be withheld. We're joined by Jefferson Warley.

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Speaker 1: He's a Washington journalist and author. He's co founder and

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Speaker 1: editor of the JFK Fax Substack, which I'm a subscriber

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Speaker 1: to and you should be as well. He's also vice

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Speaker 1: president of the Mary Farrell Foundation. Great to have you, welcome,

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Speaker 1: thanks for having me a lot to talk about. Yeah. Absolutely,

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Speaker 1: So for people who are uninitiated, can you just give

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Speaker 1: the backstory of where this release came from, what compelled

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Speaker 1: action in the first place. So, the assassination of President

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Speaker 1: Kennedy sixty years ago has long been controversial, and Congress

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Speaker 1: passed a law in nineteen ninety two in order to

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Speaker 1: quell speculation and keep people full informed that the government

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Speaker 1: had to release all of its records related to the

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Speaker 1: assassination and various investigations that were connected with it. In Congress,

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Speaker 1: a lot was done. It was a good law. A

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Speaker 1: lot of the material was released, but Congress had after

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Speaker 1: twenty five years everything has to be released except in

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Speaker 1: the rarest of cases. That was the law. There is

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Speaker 1: a law by the way, that passed Congress unanimous. So

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Speaker 1: the intent of Congress was very clear that after twenty

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Speaker 1: five years, and like you said, since then, since twenty seventeen,

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Speaker 1: first President Trump and then President Biden have delayed enforcing

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Speaker 1: the law to you know, to its full extent, and

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Speaker 1: they've been giving a pass to various federal agencies, primarily

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Speaker 1: the CIA, but also the FBI and other government agencies

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Speaker 1: which are still withholding portions of some files related to

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Speaker 1: the assassination of President Kennedy. So last month there was

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Speaker 1: this big balley who the Biden White House released a

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Speaker 1: memo and the CIA did a big press offensive and

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Speaker 1: tuned in their favorite reporters in Washington and they said, look,

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Speaker 1: we're you know, we're releasing all this stuff. There's really

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Speaker 1: nothing left here. It's very it's all cut and dried,

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Speaker 1: and we've complied with the law. And you know, when

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Speaker 1: we went in to look at that, we at the

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Speaker 1: Mary Farrell Foundation, which is JFK researchers, it was a

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Speaker 1: very partial release. It was there's still four thousand CIA

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Speaker 1: documents that contain reactions that are related to the assassination. So,

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Speaker 1: you know, it was kind of a shell game. And

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Speaker 1: so now we're trying to figure out what's going to

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Speaker 1: happen next. And what one striking thing that happened this

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Speaker 1: time around was the press coverage for once was very skeptical.

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Speaker 1: You know, I mean even mainstream media organizations are now

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Speaker 1: like wondering like the CIA must be hiding something if

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Speaker 1: they're hiding all this stuff, you know, and no, no, no,

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Speaker 1: the CIA comes along and briefs their favorite reporters on

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Speaker 1: background and says there's nothing to it. But you know,

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Speaker 1: that's not really very convincing anymore. So as we go

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Speaker 1: into twenty twenty three, as we head to the sixtieth

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Speaker 1: anniversary of the Kennedy assassination, the issue of, you know,

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Speaker 1: will the CIA fully disclosed is still a live one now.

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Speaker 1: They have till June thirtieth, so we'll see this spring

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Speaker 1: whether there are going to be any more forthcoming and

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Speaker 1: whether Biden can put his foot down and force them

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Speaker 1: to fully disclose. That hasn't happened yet. And you and

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Speaker 1: other researchers have identified certain documents that you're particularly interested

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Speaker 1: in which have not been released as of yet. What

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Speaker 1: are some of the pieces that, in your view, are

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Speaker 1: missing and could help fill in some of the import

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Speaker 1: blanks here. Well, there's sort of big picture things and

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Speaker 1: then there's very focused things. So let me start with

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Speaker 1: a big picture of one. One of the documents that

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Speaker 1: we wanted to see the most, I think was a

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Speaker 1: document that JFK's advisor Arthur Slessinger wrote to him in

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Speaker 1: June nineteen sixty one. This is two years before the assassination.

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Speaker 1: It was in the aftermath of the Bay of Pigs invasion,

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Speaker 1: which was a total failure. That was the CIA's plan

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Speaker 1: to overthrow Fidel Castro. It was very embarrassing to President

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Speaker 1: Kennedy that had failed within the first hundred days of

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Speaker 1: his presidency, and he was mighty pissed off at the

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Speaker 1: CIA at that point. And the feelings were mutual, you know,

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Speaker 1: the CIA didn't like Kennedy because he hadn't backed their

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Speaker 1: plan the way they thought he would. So in this

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Speaker 1: period of confrontation between the CIA and the White House,

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Speaker 1: Slessinger writes a memo to JFK about CIA reorganization, and

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Speaker 1: that's the title of the memo. And they're thinking about, well,

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Speaker 1: maybe we should reorganize the CIA. So a very interesting

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Speaker 1: memo of which about a page and a half are

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Speaker 1: still redacted by the CIA. And we were hoping that

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Speaker 1: this would be like we'd finally see what's under there.

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Speaker 1: And first of all, like there's no names of agents

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Speaker 1: in there. You know, this is two years before the assassination.

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Speaker 1: It doesn't have anything to do with the assassination directly,

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Speaker 1: So why not declassified? And you know what they did, Crystal,

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Speaker 1: They declassified one sentence out of the page and a

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Speaker 1: half and the rest of it remains blake. So what

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Speaker 1: do we draw from this? You know, the CIA doesn't

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Speaker 1: want to talk about their conflict with President Kennedy sixty

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Speaker 1: years ago, and somehow that's related to the assassination. That's

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Speaker 1: kind of a common sense conclusion that you would draw

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Speaker 1: from this, right and before you go into the micro piece,

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Speaker 1: just to draws out for people, you know, one of

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Speaker 1: the primary hypotheses here is that the CIA was somehow

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Speaker 1: implicated in the assassination of JFK. That's certainly something that

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Speaker 1: I think a lot of research and a lot of

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Speaker 1: the holes in the story points to. And what people

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Speaker 1: who say no, no, no, that's not the case, we'll

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Speaker 1: say is well, JFK did a lot of the things

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Speaker 1: that the CIA wanted him to do, so they really

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Speaker 1: weren't at odds. Ultimately, he had sort of gone all

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Speaker 1: on board with you know, the Red Scare and was

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Speaker 1: kept a lot of the CIA heads in charge. So

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Speaker 1: you know, that's not really plausible because they didn't really

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Speaker 1: have this conflict that other people see and so that's

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Speaker 1: why this memo is significant ultimately, right, Yeah, yeah, I mean,

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Speaker 1: because that's that's one view I would say. I've written

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Speaker 1: three books about the CIA in the nineteen sixties, and

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Speaker 1: particularly about three powerful men in the CIA. You know,

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Speaker 1: the CIA and the White House were very alienated in

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Speaker 1: nineteen sixty three. The CIA and the Joint Chiefs of

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Speaker 1: Staff were very alienated in nineteen sixty three. And that's

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Speaker 1: not Morley's conclusion. That's the conclusion of the official History

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Speaker 1: of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, and it's also seen

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Speaker 1: in dozens of books by CIA people. Kennedy's liberal policies,

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Speaker 1: especially on Cuba, were very disturbing to people in the CIA. Yes,

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Speaker 1: Kennedy went along with the CIA on other things, if

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Speaker 1: he went along in Vietnam. But you know, if you

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Speaker 1: know the story of the CIA and especially Cuba operations,

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Speaker 1: the sense of alienation after the Bay of Pigs was

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Speaker 1: very deep on both sides. So that continued through nineteen

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Speaker 1: sixty three. And it raises the question of if the

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Speaker 1: president was killed by his enemies, as a lot of

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Speaker 1: people think, you know, who would have the capacity to

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Speaker 1: make the crime look like something else, right, and it

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Speaker 1: would be people like the CIA. Now, I don't have

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Speaker 1: a CIA done it theory. I don't know who killed Kennedy.

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Speaker 1: That's what we're looking for. We're looking to try and

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Speaker 1: you know, resolve. And so one of the things that

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Speaker 1: we do as researchers is I look at three categories

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Speaker 1: of people if you're looking if you're talking about suspects

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Speaker 1: in the assassination, and that's people ciapeople who were involved

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Speaker 1: in assassination operations, other assassination operations CIA, people who implicated

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Speaker 1: themselves in the crime at one point or another, and

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Speaker 1: Howard Hunt and David Morales seemed to do that at

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Speaker 1: different times. And people who knew about the Harvey Oswald

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Speaker 1: before the assassination. Okay, and so if you look at

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Speaker 1: those people, and that's what that's where we're drilling down. Now.

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Speaker 1: You know, first of all, one thing that people should know,

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Speaker 1: and this is there's a lot of debates and disputes

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Speaker 1: about the assassination, but one thing I think everybody, all

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Speaker 1: researchers would agree is the CIA knew far far more

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Speaker 1: about Oswald than they ever told the Warren Commission or

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Speaker 1: they ever told the American people, and That's what we're

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Speaker 1: drilling down on now, is the CIA was very interested

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Speaker 1: in Oswald. Their denials notwithstanding, why were they interested in?

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Speaker 1: What were they doing with him? You know, what did

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Speaker 1: they want to do with him? And so what we

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Speaker 1: believe a lot of research is one very likely explanation

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Speaker 1: is somebody was running an operation using Oswald. Now, was

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Speaker 1: that an operation killed president? Don't know? Was it an

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Speaker 1: operation that underestimated the threat that Oswald posed to the president? Possibly,

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Speaker 1: we don't know, But that's where the story's going, the

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Speaker 1: CIA's interest in Oswald before the assassination. And so talk

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Speaker 1: to me then about the macro was the memo that

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Speaker 1: laid out a potential restructuring of the CIA plan? What

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Speaker 1: were the micro pieces that you were hoping would be

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Speaker 1: in this release and we're gone. So we're interested in

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Speaker 1: the CIA operations that touched on Oswald that somehow he

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Speaker 1: was involved with. And one of the most striking examples

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Speaker 1: of that happens three months before the assassination, where Oswald

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Speaker 1: has a series of encounters in New Orleans with a

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Speaker 1: group called the Cuban Student Director, which we now know

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Speaker 1: was funded by the CIA. The CIA didn't disclose it

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Speaker 1: to assassination investigators. And what this group did in that

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Speaker 1: was they publicized Oswald's procastro politics and they made a

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Speaker 1: big deal out of it. A totally obscure man. Nobody

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Speaker 1: had ever heard of the RB Oswald, but they were

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Speaker 1: paying close attention to him, and they were on the radio,

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Speaker 1: they were on TV, they were in the newspaper. Oswald

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Speaker 1: was a pro castro activist. Well, when Oswald was arrested,

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Speaker 1: that same group went to the press and said Kennedy

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Speaker 1: was killed by communists. And so the whole first day

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Speaker 1: coverage was very much shaped by the information from the

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Speaker 1: Cuban Student Directorate, these people who had had some contact

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Speaker 1: with Oswald, some fights over Cuban politics in New Orleans.

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Speaker 1: That's what we want to know about. And these records

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Speaker 1: are known to exist, they're known to concern CIA operations.

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Speaker 1: This isn't a phishing expedition. It's a very precise request,

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Speaker 1: you know, make these records public. And they didn't make

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Speaker 1: them public, and in fact, they seemed to deny that

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Speaker 1: these were even JFK record. So they're digging their feet

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Speaker 1: in because they really really don't want to talk about

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Speaker 1: this story. But it is starting to see the light

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Speaker 1: of day, your latest substack piece. Let's gohad and put

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Speaker 1: this up on the screen, guys. It says the CIA's

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Speaker 1: new spin on Lee Harvey Oswald. The official story of

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Speaker 1: the so called Loan Gunman recently changed. Why so their

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Speaker 1: original position that basically like, oh, we didn't know anything

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Speaker 1: about this dude, it just kind of came out of

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Speaker 1: nowhere has become increasingly untenable, and so they've had to

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Speaker 1: make some rhetorical shifts without really fully acknowledging the way

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Speaker 1: that they lied in the past. And you break some

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Speaker 1: of those down for us in the substack piece, just

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Speaker 1: lay it down for us. Yeah. So, I mean, look,

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Speaker 1: they don't call it the Central Intelligence Agency, but nothing.

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Speaker 1: These people are smart, okay, and they're defending their interests

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Speaker 1: in a smart way, you know. But their problem is

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Speaker 1: is they don't really have a ready cover story for

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Speaker 1: the records that were requesting, so they're trying to dodge

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Speaker 1: what's going on. So, like you said, it used to

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Speaker 1: be when the Warran Commission came out, the CIA said,

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Speaker 1: you know, we didn't know anything about this guy. I mean,

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Speaker 1: he came out of nowhere. We just we just didn't know,

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Speaker 1: you know, with revelations of congressional investigations in the nineteen

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Speaker 1: seventies and declassification which started in the nineteen nineties, we

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Speaker 1: finally saw that that just wasn't true at all. They

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Speaker 1: knew a lot about Oswald. They had opened a file

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Speaker 1: on him and monitored his movements constantly for four years.

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Speaker 1: And we're not talking about like some lowly clerk at

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Speaker 1: the CIA who's paying attention to you know, losers and

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Speaker 1: low nuts department. These were top people in the agency,

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Speaker 1: in the counterintelligence staff run by James Angleton and then

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Speaker 1: the Director of Operations run by Dick Helms. So these

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Speaker 1: were the people who had information about Oswald before the assassination.

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Speaker 1: So they never said that, and in the nineteen nineties

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Speaker 1: that became clear. And so now if they go to

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Speaker 1: talk to reporters, they can't say we didn't know anything

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Speaker 1: about this guy. So now they've backed up and now

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Speaker 1: they're just saying, we never engaged. So they're not denying

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Speaker 1: that they knew all about it, they're not denying that

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Speaker 1: they monitored it. They're just saying they never engaged. Well,

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Speaker 1: that's possible, so you know, let's check it. Let's see

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Speaker 1: the files and if there's nothing there. There's nothing there,

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Speaker 1: and they can explicate it, they can exonerate themselves. That

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Speaker 1: didn't happen either, So you know, on the face of

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Speaker 1: that seems suspicious maybe. I mean, you know, we didn't

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Speaker 1: get a very good explanation except for these talking points

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Speaker 1: that they distributed to their favorite reporters. And in there,

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Speaker 1: you know, they said that the records that were seeking

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Speaker 1: the file of George Joannides, they denied that they had

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Speaker 1: withheld that from investigators, and that's false. They did deny

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Speaker 1: it from investigators. And Judge Tomheim, the head of the

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Speaker 1: Assassination Records Review Board, said as much in a letter

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Speaker 1: to Biden last month. So you know, the judge put

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Speaker 1: it on the table. These are JFK records. CIA needs

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Speaker 1: to put them out, review them, and release them. And

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Speaker 1: they didn't do that. So very clear case. And we

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Speaker 1: now have another, you know, another deadline. Will they blow

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Speaker 1: it again? You know, after you blow the deadline four times,

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Speaker 1: you can probably count on blowing at five times. Right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: fair enough, Washington bureaucracy would would would would you know

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Speaker 1: conclude that? So that's where we're at right now. Well,

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Speaker 1: one thing that you do, as you pointed out have

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Speaker 1: on your side that you may not have had in

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Speaker 1: the past. Is a more skeptical media. And what do

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Speaker 1: you attribute that to. I mean, I think primarily that

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Speaker 1: that you know, the government story is not very credible.

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Speaker 1: I mean, you can't say we're not hiding anything, but

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Speaker 1: let us keep four thousand documents secret. Now, you know

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Speaker 1: the counter argument that they say and that they're you

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Speaker 1: know that their people in the in their public affairs

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Speaker 1: office say, is you know this, there's nothing related to

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Speaker 1: the assassination in these records. Okay, you know that's fine.

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Speaker 1: The law says you have to release them all. So

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Speaker 1: if you're right, release them. You know they're they're obstinates,

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Speaker 1: they're digging in tells you something, that's all you can say.

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Speaker 1: And we got to wait and see if we can,

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Speaker 1: if we can actually get the records. Yeah, you have

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Speaker 1: an agency that has a proven track record of lying,

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Speaker 1: insisting they never engaged with Lee Harvey Oswald, but the

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Speaker 1: very documents that could prove them correct, they for some reason,

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Speaker 1: for some reason, don't want to show the public. The

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Speaker 1: last thing that I want to get for you is

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Speaker 1: why should people still care about the story? Why should

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Speaker 1: people still be interested in this. Well, I think that

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Speaker 1: it showed I mean a couple of things. One, you know,

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Speaker 1: the notion that President Kennedy was killed by his enemies.

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Speaker 1: It's kind of common sensical and a lot of people

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Speaker 1: believed it. So it's not it's not crazy to think

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Speaker 1: that that's what happened. Jackie Kennedy thought that's what happened.

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Speaker 1: So you know, we need to understand our history and

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Speaker 1: what really happened, and you know, we need to hold

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Speaker 1: the government accountable. You know. And there's two ways to

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Speaker 1: look at the JFK story. One is, you know, let's

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Speaker 1: use that to tear down the government and you know,

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Speaker 1: and and and get rid of these people. But the

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Speaker 1: other way to look at it is, you know, let's

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Speaker 1: hold the government accountable and prove that the system can

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Speaker 1: work and that we can admit our bad mistakes. And

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Speaker 1: you know, if something untoward happened with President Kennedy. You know,

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Speaker 1: the American people are mature and we've seen a lot,

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Speaker 1: you know, we know that extra constitutional conspiracies are normal

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Speaker 1: in American history. From Watergate to January sixth, we see

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Speaker 1: extra constitutional conspiracies. If something like that happened in nineteen

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Speaker 1: sixty three, I think people will say, yeah, you know,

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Speaker 1: we need to know that. So that's where we're at.

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Speaker 1: That's why people should care about it today because it's

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Speaker 1: not just you know, it's not just a question of

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Speaker 1: something that happened long ago, but it's a test of

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Speaker 1: government of self government today. That's why it matters today.

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Speaker 1: I think. I think that's very well said. Tell people

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Speaker 1: where they can find you. And also, I know you

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Speaker 1: have a really exciting podcast coming out today, so let

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Speaker 1: people know about that as well. Yeah, so, if you're

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Speaker 1: interested in the JFK story, subscribe to Jfkfax jfkfax dot

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Speaker 1: substack dot com. You'll get a daily dose of JFK news.

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Speaker 1: You can sign up for free, or you can be

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Speaker 1: a premium subscriber for the modest cost of five dollars

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Speaker 1: a month. So and you will learn all about the

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Speaker 1: JFK story. And you know, frankly, we're ahead of the

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Speaker 1: media now where we have the credibility now and so

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Speaker 1: major news organizations are at least listening to our take

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Speaker 1: on what's going on. So if you want that news first,

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Speaker 1: go to jfkfacs dot substack dot com. You can get

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Speaker 1: in touch with me DM at Jefferson Morley on Twitter

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Speaker 1: and you can follow me there. I tweet about you

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Speaker 1: know what's in the JFK news, you know, on pretty

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Speaker 1: pretty regular basis. And one of the things that paying

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Speaker 1: subscribers get with JFK Fax is access to the weekly podcast.

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Speaker 1: And I have a terrific episode which is going on

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Speaker 1: tonight with a man named Ernst titibus And Ernst Tittibates

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Speaker 1: was a friend of Lee Harvey Oswald in Russia. He's

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Speaker 1: still alive. He's a biochemist. He was a twenty year

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Speaker 1: old medical student. Oswald was a twenty year old ex

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Speaker 1: marine and Titoviit spoke English and he got to know

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Speaker 1: the man who has been accused of killing President Kennedy.

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Speaker 1: And his view of the man of Oswald is quite

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Speaker 1: interesting and quite different than anything you've probably ever heard before,

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Speaker 1: certainly from mainstream news organizations. A very interesting man. So

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Speaker 1: if you want to hear that, tune in at eight

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Speaker 1: o'clock tonight jfkfax dot substack dot com, and I think

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Speaker 1: you will learn something. I thought I knew a lot

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Speaker 1: and I learned something fantastic. That is a great season.

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Speaker 1: I will definitely check it out. You guys all should

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Speaker 1: as well. Jefferson Morley over dafkfacts journalist, researcher and really

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Speaker 1: really grateful for your time today. Thank you so much, sir.

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Speaker 1: We're excited to be back now with none other than

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Speaker 1: Matt Tayibe. You should check out tayibet dot com, TK

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Speaker 1: news over there. Matt, welcome back to Counterpoints. Thanks for

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Speaker 1: having me on. Of course, we're really excited. We talked

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Speaker 1: earlier in the show about so the first jump of

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Speaker 1: the two part jump yesterday, there was so much information.

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Speaker 1: We want to talk to you about the belly button

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Speaker 1: and maybe we have a picture of the lovely illustration

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Speaker 1: of the Twitter and the FBI belly button. Now, Matt,

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Speaker 1: you had a thread on this on Twitter, you had

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Speaker 1: a post on it up on TK which was excellent.

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Speaker 1: Can you start just by telling us some while people

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Speaker 1: are looking at the lovely graphic, what the hell the

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Speaker 1: FBI belly button is? It's actually really interesting. I know

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Speaker 1: that picture is gross and kind of off putting, but

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Speaker 1: in a way it kind of should be. Because one

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Speaker 1: of the things that we were focused on with these

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Speaker 1: documents is trying to figure out the architecture of how

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Speaker 1: information flowed to and from the government with Twitter, And

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Speaker 1: what this thread is really about is how Twitter didn't

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Speaker 1: really want to work with certain agencies for a variety

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Speaker 1: of reasons. They had political disagreements. They thought the State Department,

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Speaker 1: for instance, was too trumpy, and so they were putting

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Speaker 1: up a front about how many different agencies they wanted

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Speaker 1: to give away their chief moderator's phone number two, and

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Speaker 1: ultimately they settled on a system where everything went through

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Speaker 1: the DHS and the FBI. And there's a passage where

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Speaker 1: the FBI agent says, think of us as the belly

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Speaker 1: button for the USG so information essentially, and there's another

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Speaker 1: passage where the agent says, the FBI will take care,

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Speaker 1: you know, will handle the federal and the USI C

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Speaker 1: and DHS will know what's going on in all the states.

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Speaker 1: So that's how they did did up the information. The

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Speaker 1: moderation request came in on the federal and international side

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Speaker 1: through FBI and domestically through the Homeland Security. And you

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Speaker 1: also talked about this one back and forth around people

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Speaker 1: who were retweeting or zero head or zero hedge articles

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Speaker 1: or on zero hedge had been banned, but then people

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Speaker 1: are still sharing some of the information and they said

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Speaker 1: it led to quote another flurry of disinformation narratives Around

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Speaker 1: the time, Zero hedge had been speculating on the origins

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Speaker 1: of COVID, whether whether or not it was a lab

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Speaker 1: leak or natural origin. So what what's going on with

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Speaker 1: Like are they are they zeroing in on zero hedge

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Speaker 1: at this point and then trying to make sure that

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Speaker 1: there's nothing emanating remotely from them? And what what else

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Speaker 1: did you find around this area? So I think this

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Speaker 1: came from a report by the Global Engagement Center, which

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Speaker 1: is like the fledgling intel arm of the State Department

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Speaker 1: that nobody's ever heard of. It was founded in the

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Speaker 1: Obama years under Hillary Clinton. I think they want to

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Speaker 1: make basically like the State Department version of the NSA.

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Speaker 1: And so it's kind of the weak sister of the

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Speaker 1: intelligence community. And they issued a report in February of

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty that basically identified a whole bunch of actors

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Speaker 1: as potential cyber threats, and one of their criteria was

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Speaker 1: sort of arguing that COVID might have come from a

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Speaker 1: lab or retweeting news about zero hedge being banned from Twitter.

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Speaker 1: And what this really offers you a window into is

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Speaker 1: how government agencies decide that this or that account is suspicious,

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Speaker 1: Like they have all these crazy criteria. Everybody thinks it's

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Speaker 1: super sophisticated. It's not. It's really stupid. Like in another

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Speaker 1: area of these reports, they're talking about anybody who retweets

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Speaker 1: two or more Chinese diplomats is now suspect for being

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Speaker 1: for spreading Chinese disinformation, and that included like the Canadian military,

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Speaker 1: like a CNN account. So this just gives you a

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Speaker 1: window into how they're how they're making those decisions. I

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Speaker 1: think it also gives us a window into how And

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Speaker 1: this was another thing. Your earlier thread yesterday reported on

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Speaker 1: how reporters promulgate and fuel so much of this cycle.

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Speaker 1: Your earlier threads something like reporters now know this model works.

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Speaker 1: That was an email from a Twitter reporter or a

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Speaker 1: Twitter staffer. What did you find as it relates to

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Speaker 1: this question in terms of reporters fueling and working with

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Speaker 1: the government agencies basically in service of censorship. Yeah, so

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Speaker 1: I find this part fascinating. Maybe only other reporters find

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Speaker 1: it interesting, But you know, you might remember back in

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Speaker 1: the WMD episode, there was this famous thing involving Dick

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Speaker 1: Cheney and this thing called stovepiping, where Chaney would reach

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Speaker 1: into one of the intelligence agencies and grab raw intel

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Speaker 1: that hadn't been vetted, would feed it to a news

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Speaker 1: agency or a newspaper like the New York Times, and

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Speaker 1: then would go on a show like Meet the Press

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Speaker 1: and say, hey, did you hear about that New York

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Speaker 1: Times article? And exactly the same process goes on here. Basically,

428
00:24:22,480 --> 00:24:26,480
Speaker 1: you have you know, either a government government department like

429
00:24:26,480 --> 00:24:30,920
Speaker 1: the Senate Intel Committee, or some private researcher that's connected

430
00:24:30,960 --> 00:24:34,560
Speaker 1: to the government that goes through a reporter and says,

431
00:24:34,720 --> 00:24:36,919
Speaker 1: here are a bunch of suspect accounts we think are

432
00:24:36,960 --> 00:24:41,360
Speaker 1: Russia linked. And then they will go to Twitter and

433
00:24:41,400 --> 00:24:43,680
Speaker 1: say we think these are Russia linked. Will you take

434
00:24:43,720 --> 00:24:47,840
Speaker 1: action on them? Do you have any comment? And Facebook,

435
00:24:47,920 --> 00:24:51,520
Speaker 1: not wanting to take the political hit, might suspend a

436
00:24:51,520 --> 00:24:54,399
Speaker 1: few accounts, and then instantly they have a headline like,

437
00:24:54,440 --> 00:24:59,560
Speaker 1: you know, Facebook uncovers with our help, you know, Russian influence.

438
00:25:00,200 --> 00:25:02,800
Speaker 1: And that's what the Twitter stuffer was talking about, that

439
00:25:02,880 --> 00:25:04,520
Speaker 1: this is a model that works as soon as you

440
00:25:04,560 --> 00:25:07,840
Speaker 1: get somebody to sign off on the idea that this

441
00:25:07,960 --> 00:25:11,600
Speaker 1: or that account is Russia linked. You already give an

442
00:25:11,600 --> 00:25:14,640
Speaker 1: automatic news story, and they did that over and over again.

443
00:25:14,680 --> 00:25:17,119
Speaker 1: And what's really interesting, I thought in these documents is

444
00:25:17,119 --> 00:25:19,320
Speaker 1: you see the Twitter staffer saying this is going to

445
00:25:19,359 --> 00:25:22,320
Speaker 1: happen to us over and over again, and it did.

446
00:25:23,400 --> 00:25:25,640
Speaker 1: I also want to ask you about this your Roth

447
00:25:25,640 --> 00:25:28,320
Speaker 1: email that's number seventeen in your thread, which I think

448
00:25:28,359 --> 00:25:32,240
Speaker 1: actually kind of exposes the divide in such a profound way.

449
00:25:32,680 --> 00:25:37,520
Speaker 1: And it's Rath referring to the DHS and FBI as

450
00:25:37,640 --> 00:25:40,600
Speaker 1: a political and he puts generally, He puts generally in

451
00:25:40,640 --> 00:25:44,320
Speaker 1: parentheses to acknowledge that, Okay, maybe there's a tiny bit

452
00:25:44,359 --> 00:25:46,840
Speaker 1: of politics going on with DHS and FI, but it's

453
00:25:46,880 --> 00:25:48,960
Speaker 1: an internal email. I feel like when he's writing this,

454
00:25:49,040 --> 00:25:53,119
Speaker 1: I think he means it. And the problem with this

455
00:25:53,200 --> 00:25:55,119
Speaker 1: GEC and you can talk a little about with GC,

456
00:25:55,320 --> 00:25:58,920
Speaker 1: is to them that was political. So what do you

457
00:25:59,000 --> 00:26:01,000
Speaker 1: draw from the fact that and let's assume that he

458
00:26:01,080 --> 00:26:03,920
Speaker 1: means it that when he thinks of the FBI and DHS,

459
00:26:03,920 --> 00:26:06,239
Speaker 1: that he sees them as a political What does that

460
00:26:06,280 --> 00:26:11,560
Speaker 1: tell you about how Twitter was relating to those organizations,

461
00:26:11,560 --> 00:26:17,200
Speaker 1: those government agencies. Well, clearly I think they moved, they

462
00:26:17,240 --> 00:26:21,199
Speaker 1: brought themselves into a place psychologically where they were able

463
00:26:21,280 --> 00:26:27,480
Speaker 1: to comply with really this unbelievably incessant stream of demands

464
00:26:27,520 --> 00:26:32,280
Speaker 1: from agencies like the FBI and the DHS to eliminate

465
00:26:32,320 --> 00:26:35,720
Speaker 1: certain accounts. They justified that in the grounds that all

466
00:26:35,840 --> 00:26:39,920
Speaker 1: these things were legitimate threats, they were legitimately dangerous. We

467
00:26:40,119 --> 00:26:44,320
Speaker 1: legitimately had to worry about what he called major risks,

468
00:26:44,359 --> 00:26:47,919
Speaker 1: which included, I guess Donald Trump getting re elected. So

469
00:26:48,760 --> 00:26:52,320
Speaker 1: when they were presented with an agency that was politically

470
00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:54,919
Speaker 1: not in the same place as they were, and it

471
00:26:55,000 --> 00:26:57,399
Speaker 1: happened twice that year. Actually I didn't mention this, but

472
00:26:58,080 --> 00:27:03,479
Speaker 1: also that summer they refused to go along with a

473
00:27:03,680 --> 00:27:09,879
Speaker 1: Pentagon program that involved the army making fake accounts to

474
00:27:09,920 --> 00:27:15,520
Speaker 1: cover up for drone attacks. They basically they decided that,

475
00:27:16,760 --> 00:27:21,480
Speaker 1: you know, a more Trump leaning government agency was quote political,

476
00:27:22,080 --> 00:27:25,920
Speaker 1: and the FBI, DHS, N S, A, c, I, A,

477
00:27:25,920 --> 00:27:29,959
Speaker 1: all those other agencies were not political. So that's how

478
00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:34,080
Speaker 1: they justified dealing with all those those moderation requests. But

479
00:27:34,600 --> 00:27:38,320
Speaker 1: I think it's pretty transparent what they were doing, and

480
00:27:38,400 --> 00:27:41,520
Speaker 1: I think people will see it that way too. Follow

481
00:27:41,600 --> 00:27:43,560
Speaker 1: up on that real quick, How does that relate to

482
00:27:43,720 --> 00:27:46,240
Speaker 1: what you found, how does that relate to Lefong's story?

483
00:27:46,880 --> 00:27:51,520
Speaker 1: But once Trump was in or like, yeah, can you

484
00:27:51,600 --> 00:27:54,320
Speaker 1: like what's the connection between Leifong was on our show

485
00:27:54,920 --> 00:27:57,280
Speaker 1: a couple of weeks ago talking about what he had found,

486
00:27:58,920 --> 00:28:02,280
Speaker 1: in which Twitter was kind of whitelisting a bunch of

487
00:28:02,320 --> 00:28:05,920
Speaker 1: Pentagon bots and Pentagon accounts that were that were doing

488
00:28:07,480 --> 00:28:11,239
Speaker 1: propaganda around the globe and around around drone strikes. They did.

489
00:28:11,240 --> 00:28:15,080
Speaker 1: They at some point then you found pushback against some

490
00:28:15,320 --> 00:28:18,440
Speaker 1: hit They going too far? Yeah, and Lee even wrote

491
00:28:18,440 --> 00:28:22,440
Speaker 1: about that. The pushback came in June of twenty twenty.

492
00:28:23,359 --> 00:28:28,080
Speaker 1: It started with Facebook. Actually Facebook was the first company

493
00:28:28,119 --> 00:28:31,200
Speaker 1: to say no, and then Twitter kind of followed their lead.

494
00:28:31,840 --> 00:28:38,080
Speaker 1: But essentially the Pentagon and we can put Pentagon in

495
00:28:38,120 --> 00:28:41,400
Speaker 1: parentheses because this really we're talking about the MSA. In

496
00:28:41,440 --> 00:28:49,320
Speaker 1: some cases, they they had been creating local foreign language accounts,

497
00:28:49,920 --> 00:28:52,360
Speaker 1: so that if, for instance, you did a drone strike

498
00:28:52,920 --> 00:28:55,960
Speaker 1: in a foreign country where they speak Arabic and there

499
00:28:55,960 --> 00:28:58,160
Speaker 1: were lots of local news reports saying, oh, they blew

500
00:28:58,240 --> 00:29:01,080
Speaker 1: up a hospital, all these kids died, suddenly you would

501
00:29:01,080 --> 00:29:04,160
Speaker 1: see a flurry of fake accounts that would say, oh no,

502
00:29:04,240 --> 00:29:07,840
Speaker 1: actually it wasn't that bad. There were no serious casualties.

503
00:29:08,000 --> 00:29:10,480
Speaker 1: And guess who that was? That was us doing that? Right,

504
00:29:10,520 --> 00:29:14,240
Speaker 1: So those were what we call influence information operations, and

505
00:29:14,600 --> 00:29:16,400
Speaker 1: they had been doing They've been going along with that

506
00:29:16,560 --> 00:29:20,080
Speaker 1: for years. But the Pentagon had not had a good

507
00:29:20,120 --> 00:29:23,920
Speaker 1: relationship with Twitter dating back to twenty seventeen. I was

508
00:29:23,960 --> 00:29:29,120
Speaker 1: told this explicitly by somebody in the defense community that

509
00:29:29,760 --> 00:29:33,360
Speaker 1: they had been basically ghosted by a Twitter dating back

510
00:29:33,400 --> 00:29:37,920
Speaker 1: to the middle of twenty seventeen. Finally, in twenty twenty,

511
00:29:38,360 --> 00:29:42,040
Speaker 1: the companies banded together and decided not to do this anymore.

512
00:29:42,080 --> 00:29:44,600
Speaker 1: And that story didn't come out until twenty twenty two.

513
00:29:44,640 --> 00:29:48,760
Speaker 1: You might remember it from earlier last fall when it

514
00:29:48,800 --> 00:29:51,680
Speaker 1: came out in the Washington Post that they had uncovered

515
00:29:51,720 --> 00:29:55,560
Speaker 1: a US information operation. It was actually a Pentagon operation.

516
00:29:56,080 --> 00:29:59,520
Speaker 1: It's really interesting. One thing from all of these, all

517
00:29:59,520 --> 00:30:01,440
Speaker 1: of the report that's happened during the Twitter files to

518
00:30:01,480 --> 00:30:05,080
Speaker 1: see how much business is conducted over email and slack.

519
00:30:05,160 --> 00:30:08,240
Speaker 1: I mean, one thing that's always plagged journalists like to time,

520
00:30:08,680 --> 00:30:12,160
Speaker 1: like forever basically is that nobody puts things in writing.

521
00:30:12,200 --> 00:30:14,400
Speaker 1: You know, this is all phone calls or in writing.

522
00:30:14,440 --> 00:30:16,440
Speaker 1: They say, we need to move this to a phone call.

523
00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:19,600
Speaker 1: But so much of this was happening in writing and

524
00:30:19,760 --> 00:30:23,400
Speaker 1: was etched and so called like digital stone. Maybe, but Matt,

525
00:30:23,720 --> 00:30:25,920
Speaker 1: is that have you seen any effort. I'm sure there

526
00:30:25,920 --> 00:30:27,720
Speaker 1: are a couple of emails where it's like, let's chat

527
00:30:27,800 --> 00:30:29,360
Speaker 1: over the phone, or I think I've actually even seen

528
00:30:29,360 --> 00:30:32,000
Speaker 1: any of that. But have you seen any effort as

529
00:30:32,000 --> 00:30:35,920
Speaker 1: you're going through these thousands, tens of thousands of emails

530
00:30:36,440 --> 00:30:39,600
Speaker 1: to move conversations to phone Not that I'm in favor

531
00:30:39,760 --> 00:30:43,400
Speaker 1: of less transparency, but did they really just think that

532
00:30:43,480 --> 00:30:45,680
Speaker 1: this was kind of in a vault and was not

533
00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:49,840
Speaker 1: a liability for them to be talking like this. They

534
00:30:50,200 --> 00:30:55,000
Speaker 1: clearly thought that they were extremely cavalier in what they

535
00:30:55,000 --> 00:30:58,200
Speaker 1: were doing. There are moments where they say, maybe this

536
00:30:58,280 --> 00:31:01,640
Speaker 1: is more of a phone conversation. They also, and this

537
00:31:01,760 --> 00:31:03,200
Speaker 1: is one of the things that came out in the

538
00:31:03,200 --> 00:31:07,280
Speaker 1: second thread yesterday, the quote unquote industry call, which is

539
00:31:08,200 --> 00:31:11,280
Speaker 1: involved Twitter, Facebook, some other company and a whole bunch

540
00:31:11,280 --> 00:31:16,440
Speaker 1: of other companies, and then the DHS, FBI, Director of

541
00:31:16,520 --> 00:31:19,200
Speaker 1: National Intelligence, and then there were a bunch of other

542
00:31:19,520 --> 00:31:22,160
Speaker 1: agencies that were sort of auditing. They were in listen

543
00:31:22,240 --> 00:31:27,080
Speaker 1: mode only all that was going on in signal, which

544
00:31:28,560 --> 00:31:30,880
Speaker 1: is an interesting question because some lawyers have raised to

545
00:31:30,920 --> 00:31:34,840
Speaker 1: me the issue of, you know, can you really send

546
00:31:34,880 --> 00:31:39,880
Speaker 1: things an encrypted fashion or can you send documents that

547
00:31:39,920 --> 00:31:42,400
Speaker 1: are time to disappear, which is what happens through the

548
00:31:42,480 --> 00:31:47,479
Speaker 1: FBI's teleporter program. If you're a government agency, you're supposed

549
00:31:47,480 --> 00:31:52,920
Speaker 1: to be recording everything, right, So that's interesting, Like they had,

550
00:31:53,520 --> 00:31:56,960
Speaker 1: I would say, on the whole, really terrible opseec on

551
00:31:57,040 --> 00:32:01,520
Speaker 1: all this stuff. But in some cases, you know, they're

552
00:32:01,600 --> 00:32:05,280
Speaker 1: using methods that I'm not sure were legal if their

553
00:32:05,600 --> 00:32:10,960
Speaker 1: government agency endeavors. So that it's both it's interesting on

554
00:32:11,040 --> 00:32:14,080
Speaker 1: both fronts. Yeah, that happened here in DC. Government officials

555
00:32:14,080 --> 00:32:16,560
Speaker 1: were communicating over signal and they had to stop that

556
00:32:16,760 --> 00:32:20,320
Speaker 1: because it's not appropriate. Right, Well, that raises a lot

557
00:32:20,320 --> 00:32:24,720
Speaker 1: of questions. I'm sorry to interrupt, but you had thousands

558
00:32:24,760 --> 00:32:29,520
Speaker 1: and thousands of moderation requests coming in via signal and teleporter,

559
00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:32,240
Speaker 1: and you know, I'm not sure how much of that

560
00:32:32,400 --> 00:32:36,520
Speaker 1: is ever going to be retrieved, and you know, is

561
00:32:36,560 --> 00:32:39,600
Speaker 1: that okay, I'm not sure, you know. Yeah, And so

562
00:32:40,280 --> 00:32:42,920
Speaker 1: you and the other other reporters working on the Twitter

563
00:32:42,920 --> 00:32:46,160
Speaker 1: files have been accused of quote unquote cherry picking, and

564
00:32:46,520 --> 00:32:48,920
Speaker 1: I saw you responded to that in one of your

565
00:32:48,960 --> 00:32:52,360
Speaker 1: recent recent newsletters. Can you can you elaborate on on

566
00:32:52,360 --> 00:32:56,560
Speaker 1: on your kind of response to that particular line of attack.

567
00:32:57,560 --> 00:32:59,160
Speaker 1: First of all, I don't even know what that means,

568
00:32:59,280 --> 00:33:02,920
Speaker 1: like as opposed to what you know, the the the

569
00:33:03,680 --> 00:33:08,320
Speaker 1: absolutely perfect even representative sample of humanity that you see

570
00:33:08,320 --> 00:33:13,080
Speaker 1: on other news channels, Like what are they talking about? Uh?

571
00:33:13,200 --> 00:33:15,880
Speaker 1: And if you see an email in a seat of

572
00:33:15,920 --> 00:33:21,440
Speaker 1: emails where it says, hey, we're the FBI all the

573
00:33:21,600 --> 00:33:25,960
Speaker 1: reports that come in from the US intelligence community, uh,

574
00:33:26,000 --> 00:33:30,760
Speaker 1: and from US we'll go through our channels and the

575
00:33:30,800 --> 00:33:34,240
Speaker 1: Homeland Security is going to handle all the states. You're

576
00:33:34,280 --> 00:33:36,600
Speaker 1: not going to pick that cherry like you know. As

577
00:33:36,640 --> 00:33:38,800
Speaker 1: a reporter, I don't. I don't really understand what they're

578
00:33:38,880 --> 00:33:42,840
Speaker 1: arguing here. Yes, of course we're taking the interesting, interesting stuff.

579
00:33:44,120 --> 00:33:45,920
Speaker 1: But if you're if you want to argue that there's

580
00:33:45,960 --> 00:33:49,840
Speaker 1: some other emails somewhere that says, oh, we're not doing this,

581
00:33:51,640 --> 00:33:54,080
Speaker 1: I would feel ethically obligated to put that in there.

582
00:33:54,240 --> 00:33:58,120
Speaker 1: I haven't seen that, so uh. That's why I'm feeling

583
00:33:58,120 --> 00:34:01,040
Speaker 1: confident in publishing this stuff. But they're there isn't really

584
00:34:01,080 --> 00:34:04,760
Speaker 1: like a contra argument that is not appearing in these emails.

585
00:34:04,920 --> 00:34:08,560
Speaker 1: One thing that people have said, because I reported this initially,

586
00:34:08,960 --> 00:34:13,160
Speaker 1: there were requests that came from the Trump administration and

587
00:34:13,280 --> 00:34:17,080
Speaker 1: we're honored. I was told that pretty solidly by former

588
00:34:17,160 --> 00:34:20,359
Speaker 1: executives and I felt obligated to report it. But I

589
00:34:20,400 --> 00:34:24,319
Speaker 1: haven't seen it in the email record, so that's why

590
00:34:24,360 --> 00:34:26,440
Speaker 1: people aren't seeing it. It's just that I don't have

591
00:34:26,480 --> 00:34:29,480
Speaker 1: it in writing. That is really interesting, and I really

592
00:34:29,520 --> 00:34:32,279
Speaker 1: recommend folks follow your subseac to TK news because it's

593
00:34:32,320 --> 00:34:36,200
Speaker 1: been helpful sort of flushing this out even more. Just

594
00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:38,239
Speaker 1: great reads over there, and I hope you're able to

595
00:34:38,280 --> 00:34:44,680
Speaker 1: get some sleep. Map. I thank you both. So we

596
00:34:44,760 --> 00:34:48,479
Speaker 1: have some very interesting and new information. I've always thought

597
00:34:48,520 --> 00:34:51,400
Speaker 1: that the Virgin Islands could have been one of the

598
00:34:51,480 --> 00:34:55,560
Speaker 1: areas where they're prosecutors and their team very much wanted

599
00:34:55,560 --> 00:34:57,480
Speaker 1: to try and get to the bottom of this. And

600
00:34:57,520 --> 00:35:01,720
Speaker 1: a new filing in the US Attorney's Office is devastating

601
00:35:01,760 --> 00:35:04,400
Speaker 1: for one of the major financial institutions in the country.

602
00:35:04,600 --> 00:35:07,479
Speaker 1: Let's put this up there on the screen. Epstein's sex

603
00:35:07,520 --> 00:35:11,160
Speaker 1: trafficking was aided by JP Morgan. This is according to

604
00:35:11,200 --> 00:35:15,840
Speaker 1: a new lawsuit from the US Virgin Island's Attorney General's

605
00:35:15,920 --> 00:35:18,600
Speaker 1: Office that was filed in the Southern District of Manhattan

606
00:35:18,920 --> 00:35:22,000
Speaker 1: on Tuesday. Essentially, what they are alleging is that JP

607
00:35:22,120 --> 00:35:26,640
Speaker 1: Morgan failed to report Epstein's suspicious activities and actually provided

608
00:35:26,680 --> 00:35:31,200
Speaker 1: the financier with services reserved for high wealth clients, even

609
00:35:31,320 --> 00:35:34,480
Speaker 1: after a two thousand and eight conviction for soliciting a

610
00:35:34,520 --> 00:35:38,880
Speaker 1: minor for prostitution in Palm Beach, Florida. They specifically say

611
00:35:39,120 --> 00:35:43,239
Speaker 1: that they have information which has revealed that JP Morgan knowingly,

612
00:35:43,480 --> 00:35:47,640
Speaker 1: negligently and unlawfully provided and pulled the levers through which

613
00:35:47,880 --> 00:35:52,239
Speaker 1: recruiters and victims were paid, and was indispensable to the

614
00:35:52,280 --> 00:35:57,360
Speaker 1: operation and concealment of the Epstein trafficking enterprise. So why

615
00:35:57,400 --> 00:35:59,640
Speaker 1: does all of this matter? We should go back and

616
00:35:59,680 --> 00:36:03,440
Speaker 1: remember member a New York Financial Services Department find of

617
00:36:03,600 --> 00:36:07,480
Speaker 1: JP Morgan, of Deutsche Bank and of other financial institutions

618
00:36:07,680 --> 00:36:11,279
Speaker 1: which showed specifically that the banks were involved in a

619
00:36:11,320 --> 00:36:16,240
Speaker 1: collusion process to go after Epstein's business and specifically facilitated

620
00:36:16,239 --> 00:36:19,560
Speaker 1: his own transactions from the United States to Eastern Europe,

621
00:36:19,680 --> 00:36:23,040
Speaker 1: presumably and in many cases towards women who are using

622
00:36:23,120 --> 00:36:26,440
Speaker 1: used for sex trafficking purposes. Why does that matter? Because

623
00:36:26,440 --> 00:36:30,680
Speaker 1: Epstein himself and his network and organization were pulling all

624
00:36:30,760 --> 00:36:33,439
Speaker 1: sorts of financial chicanery that if you or I tried

625
00:36:33,440 --> 00:36:35,799
Speaker 1: to pull a crystal, we would be automatically reported to

626
00:36:36,160 --> 00:36:38,800
Speaker 1: the FBI. And in fact, one of those, my personal

627
00:36:38,800 --> 00:36:42,279
Speaker 1: favorite example from the Financial Services Department complaint was when

628
00:36:42,280 --> 00:36:45,200
Speaker 1: they would say how much cash can we withdraw without

629
00:36:45,200 --> 00:36:49,080
Speaker 1: triggering the Feds? By the way, just asking that question,

630
00:36:49,320 --> 00:36:52,440
Speaker 1: you're supposed to call the FEDS, and they engage in

631
00:36:52,480 --> 00:36:55,520
Speaker 1: regular behavior where they would try and withdraw as much

632
00:36:55,560 --> 00:37:00,120
Speaker 1: cash as possible without triggering an automatic regulatory informing to

633
00:37:00,440 --> 00:37:03,360
Speaker 1: federal authorities. This is just the tip of the iceberg.

634
00:37:03,600 --> 00:37:06,840
Speaker 1: What the US Virgin Islands is doing here is revealing

635
00:37:06,840 --> 00:37:11,240
Speaker 1: it at the major meta financial institutional level, of which remember,

636
00:37:11,600 --> 00:37:15,760
Speaker 1: we have no transparency outside of that financial services fine

637
00:37:16,040 --> 00:37:18,520
Speaker 1: that happened for Deutsche Bank, and I think it was

638
00:37:18,560 --> 00:37:22,080
Speaker 1: in twenty twenty one. We have no more clarity because

639
00:37:22,160 --> 00:37:24,799
Speaker 1: the glaidne Maxwell trial focused on crimes and I'm not

640
00:37:24,800 --> 00:37:27,400
Speaker 1: saying these weren't valid, but on things that happened in

641
00:37:27,520 --> 00:37:30,319
Speaker 1: so far limited in scope and so long time ago.

642
00:37:30,680 --> 00:37:34,600
Speaker 1: The actual architect of all of the power networks, the

643
00:37:34,640 --> 00:37:37,520
Speaker 1: people like Leon Black, the billionaires, the Wall Street, the

644
00:37:37,600 --> 00:37:42,120
Speaker 1: financial institutions, all of it remains outside of public records.

645
00:37:42,120 --> 00:37:45,160
Speaker 1: So this is a very important case that's happening here. Yeah,

646
00:37:45,200 --> 00:37:47,720
Speaker 1: I mean, the glaidne Maxwell trial. I think it's pretty

647
00:37:47,719 --> 00:37:52,560
Speaker 1: clear was engineered to protect as many powerful people as

648
00:37:52,600 --> 00:37:56,440
Speaker 1: possible while still putting her in prison because the public

649
00:37:56,520 --> 00:37:59,080
Speaker 1: was just not going to accept her ultimately going through

650
00:37:59,480 --> 00:38:03,799
Speaker 1: going free. So when you look at this pattern with

651
00:38:03,880 --> 00:38:08,879
Speaker 1: these financial institutions, keep in mind like maybe before he

652
00:38:09,040 --> 00:38:12,359
Speaker 1: was a convicted sex offender, maybe you could sort of

653
00:38:12,400 --> 00:38:15,360
Speaker 1: turn a blind eye and make up some innocent reason

654
00:38:15,560 --> 00:38:19,600
Speaker 1: for these strange transactions. But they continue to do business

655
00:38:19,640 --> 00:38:22,640
Speaker 1: with him and seek out business with him after he's

656
00:38:22,680 --> 00:38:27,359
Speaker 1: a convicted sex offender. And these are sophisticated institutions, You

657
00:38:27,400 --> 00:38:31,680
Speaker 1: don't think that they don't know what suspicious financial transactions

658
00:38:31,840 --> 00:38:36,040
Speaker 1: look like, what they are supposed to report under the

659
00:38:36,160 --> 00:38:41,319
Speaker 1: law in terms of suspicial suspicious financial transactions. So it

660
00:38:41,400 --> 00:38:44,480
Speaker 1: really is, you know, disgusting. All they cared about ultimately

661
00:38:44,880 --> 00:38:48,040
Speaker 1: was the money. And then the next twist in this

662
00:38:48,160 --> 00:38:51,600
Speaker 1: story is this Attorney General for the Virgin Islands who's

663
00:38:51,640 --> 00:38:54,880
Speaker 1: been seems to be pretty dogged in her pursuit of

664
00:38:55,080 --> 00:39:00,879
Speaker 1: accountability and exposing the enablers of the Jeffrey Epstein sex

665
00:39:00,960 --> 00:39:05,880
Speaker 1: crimes ring. She was fired from her job for filing

666
00:39:05,920 --> 00:39:09,040
Speaker 1: this lawsuit against JP Morgan Chase. Go and put this

667
00:39:09,120 --> 00:39:14,279
Speaker 1: piece up on the screen here. She was fired days

668
00:39:14,520 --> 00:39:19,680
Speaker 1: after suing JP Morgan Chase over the Jeffrey Epstein ties.

669
00:39:20,160 --> 00:39:22,680
Speaker 1: And it says in the article, I mean they out

670
00:39:22,760 --> 00:39:26,360
Speaker 1: and out acknowledged that this was the reason for her dismissal.

671
00:39:26,400 --> 00:39:27,960
Speaker 1: They didn't even try to make up like, oh, no,

672
00:39:28,040 --> 00:39:30,200
Speaker 1: it had something to do with her other conduct and

673
00:39:30,200 --> 00:39:31,759
Speaker 1: it really had nothing to do with Epstein. No, they

674
00:39:31,800 --> 00:39:33,799
Speaker 1: were like, no, this caught us off guard, and so

675
00:39:33,920 --> 00:39:38,320
Speaker 1: we relieved her of her duties. So even from the grave,

676
00:39:39,040 --> 00:39:43,280
Speaker 1: this man is still being protected. But more to the point,

677
00:39:43,480 --> 00:39:47,040
Speaker 1: all of the powerful people who were caught up in this,

678
00:39:47,200 --> 00:39:50,120
Speaker 1: or who enabled this and chose to look the other way,

679
00:39:50,400 --> 00:39:54,560
Speaker 1: or were active participants, they continued to be protected at

680
00:39:54,600 --> 00:39:57,680
Speaker 1: the highest levels. Yes, I want to underscore again that

681
00:39:57,760 --> 00:40:01,040
Speaker 1: Denise George, the Attorney General here, who was has been

682
00:40:01,280 --> 00:40:05,000
Speaker 1: really courageous on this investigation for years. Now, let's gohead

683
00:40:04,960 --> 00:40:07,040
Speaker 1: and put this up there on the screen. It's a

684
00:40:07,080 --> 00:40:09,440
Speaker 1: news item from a couple of years ago, but it

685
00:40:09,480 --> 00:40:12,920
Speaker 1: shows you that in an initial lawsuit that she actually filed,

686
00:40:13,239 --> 00:40:16,000
Speaker 1: they alleged that to Epstein was trafficking girls as young

687
00:40:16,040 --> 00:40:18,719
Speaker 1: as twelve years old to the US Vision Islands on

688
00:40:18,760 --> 00:40:22,600
Speaker 1: the property and the island that he privately owned. This

689
00:40:22,760 --> 00:40:26,480
Speaker 1: was part of a hundred million dollars settlement with the

690
00:40:26,480 --> 00:40:29,239
Speaker 1: Epstein estate that the Virgin Islands actually just came to

691
00:40:29,600 --> 00:40:32,719
Speaker 1: with the Epstein estate to claw back quote more than

692
00:40:32,760 --> 00:40:36,560
Speaker 1: eighty million dollars in economic development tax benefits that Epstein

693
00:40:36,640 --> 00:40:40,960
Speaker 1: and co defendants had fraudulently obtained from US Virgin Islands

694
00:40:41,000 --> 00:40:44,120
Speaker 1: and other authorities to actually use to then fund his

695
00:40:44,160 --> 00:40:48,040
Speaker 1: sex trafficking enterprise. I also want to read a quote

696
00:40:48,120 --> 00:40:50,960
Speaker 1: from the lawsuit that she filed before she was fired.

697
00:40:51,239 --> 00:40:55,600
Speaker 1: These decisions were advocated and approved at the senior levels

698
00:40:55,680 --> 00:41:00,120
Speaker 1: of JP Morgan, who facilitated and concealed wire and as

699
00:41:00,239 --> 00:41:04,040
Speaker 1: transactions that raised suspicious of and were impact part of

700
00:41:04,320 --> 00:41:08,080
Speaker 1: a criminal enterprise whose currency was a sexual servitude of

701
00:41:08,200 --> 00:41:11,640
Speaker 1: dozens of women and girls in and beyond the US

702
00:41:11,880 --> 00:41:17,040
Speaker 1: Virgin Islands. This lawsuit is again the tip of the iceberg,

703
00:41:17,520 --> 00:41:20,600
Speaker 1: and if it actually was allowed to proceed, we would

704
00:41:20,640 --> 00:41:25,440
Speaker 1: have gotten financial statements, subpoenas, possibly as senior JP Morgan, executives,

705
00:41:25,680 --> 00:41:29,880
Speaker 1: account managers, some of the other sophisticated financial chicanery that

706
00:41:29,960 --> 00:41:33,239
Speaker 1: Epstein and all of his coacharie were involved in. I mean,

707
00:41:33,560 --> 00:41:35,880
Speaker 1: I still have so many questions. If we'll all remember

708
00:41:36,000 --> 00:41:38,319
Speaker 1: Leon Black, who was the head of the Apollo Group,

709
00:41:38,360 --> 00:41:41,520
Speaker 1: he was one of the richest men in the United States,

710
00:41:42,360 --> 00:41:44,680
Speaker 1: one of the most powerful people on Wall Street, and

711
00:41:44,719 --> 00:41:47,920
Speaker 1: he paid him some hundred million dollars for quote tax advice.

712
00:41:48,280 --> 00:41:50,480
Speaker 1: And the way that he paid him that one hundred

713
00:41:50,480 --> 00:41:53,320
Speaker 1: million was through the shell corporation that owned his private

714
00:41:53,400 --> 00:41:56,400
Speaker 1: jet to jeffreyet I mean, and then Bill Gates, I

715
00:41:56,440 --> 00:41:59,600
Speaker 1: mean Bill Gates's own divorce, as Melinda Gates has now

716
00:41:59,640 --> 00:42:03,120
Speaker 1: come out and said, was because she was understanding the

717
00:42:03,239 --> 00:42:06,440
Speaker 1: level of his involvement with Jeffrey Epstein, not just some

718
00:42:06,560 --> 00:42:10,319
Speaker 1: one chance meeting. We're talking about behind closed doors, even

719
00:42:10,520 --> 00:42:14,279
Speaker 1: allegedly in some cases complaining about his marriage. And you know,

720
00:42:14,320 --> 00:42:16,760
Speaker 1: he's known to have been involved in affairs also while

721
00:42:17,000 --> 00:42:19,080
Speaker 1: he was married, So some of the world's richest and

722
00:42:19,200 --> 00:42:22,640
Speaker 1: most powerful men aren't snared in this, and none of

723
00:42:22,680 --> 00:42:25,319
Speaker 1: it yet has come to light. And he's been dead.

724
00:42:25,400 --> 00:42:28,279
Speaker 1: I'll just say dead. We'll say for the circumstances for

725
00:42:28,360 --> 00:42:32,440
Speaker 1: later for several years now. I mean, it's just completely crazy.

726
00:42:32,480 --> 00:42:34,799
Speaker 1: This was one of the only chances that we really had.

727
00:42:34,800 --> 00:42:37,839
Speaker 1: And now she's been fired, and you know, I'll let

728
00:42:37,880 --> 00:42:40,360
Speaker 1: you surmise about why exactly that would happen. But in

729
00:42:40,400 --> 00:42:43,839
Speaker 1: twenty twenty two we covered how inflation caused a lot

730
00:42:43,880 --> 00:42:46,759
Speaker 1: of pain for a lot of people, but there was

731
00:42:46,880 --> 00:42:49,279
Speaker 1: one group of people who not too sad about the

732
00:42:49,280 --> 00:42:52,520
Speaker 1: fact that they also had a lot of financial pain.

733
00:42:52,600 --> 00:42:54,960
Speaker 1: Let's go and put that up on the screen. The

734
00:42:54,960 --> 00:43:00,960
Speaker 1: world's billionaires lost one point for trillion dollars in twenty

735
00:43:01,040 --> 00:43:02,640
Speaker 1: twenty two. Leave this up on the screen. Let me

736
00:43:02,680 --> 00:43:06,440
Speaker 1: read few of the details here. The headline from Bloomberg

737
00:43:06,520 --> 00:43:09,359
Speaker 1: says how Elon Musk, Mark Zuckerberg, and the world's five

738
00:43:09,440 --> 00:43:12,120
Speaker 1: hundred richest billionaires lost one point four trillion dollars in

739
00:43:12,160 --> 00:43:15,719
Speaker 1: a year. Ultra wealthy tech founders led a wipeout in

740
00:43:15,800 --> 00:43:18,880
Speaker 1: fortunes span the globe. Those secretive families and pro sports

741
00:43:18,920 --> 00:43:24,160
Speaker 1: owners emerged relatively unscathed. I want to read just a

742
00:43:24,200 --> 00:43:27,520
Speaker 1: little bit of this article here, he says. They say

743
00:43:27,560 --> 00:43:29,800
Speaker 1: in Bloomberg it's not just the money that was lost,

744
00:43:29,800 --> 00:43:31,960
Speaker 1: that it was staggering almost one point four trillion wipe

745
00:43:31,960 --> 00:43:34,399
Speaker 1: from those fortunes. Plenty of the pain, it turns out,

746
00:43:34,520 --> 00:43:37,360
Speaker 1: was self inflicted. The alleged fraud by one time crypto

747
00:43:37,400 --> 00:43:40,400
Speaker 1: Wonderkin Sam bankman Free, the devastating war wage by Rushaw

748
00:43:40,400 --> 00:43:42,880
Speaker 1: and Ukraine that spurred crippling sanctions on its business Titans,

749
00:43:43,040 --> 00:43:45,439
Speaker 1: and of course the antis elon Musk, the new owner

750
00:43:45,440 --> 00:43:49,440
Speaker 1: of Twitter, who's worth one hundred and thirty eight billion

751
00:43:49,520 --> 00:43:54,000
Speaker 1: dollars less than he was just a year ago. Combined

752
00:43:54,000 --> 00:43:57,480
Speaker 1: with the backdrop of widespread inflation and aggressive central bank tightening,

753
00:43:57,760 --> 00:44:00,239
Speaker 1: the year was a dramatic come down for a group

754
00:44:00,280 --> 00:44:03,200
Speaker 1: of billionaires whose fortunes fall to unfathomable heights in the

755
00:44:03,200 --> 00:44:06,800
Speaker 1: COVID era of easy money. In most cases, the bigger

756
00:44:06,840 --> 00:44:11,600
Speaker 1: the rise, the more dramatic the fall. Musk, bezos cz

757
00:44:11,880 --> 00:44:15,160
Speaker 1: and Mark Zuckerberg alone saw some three hundred and ninety

758
00:44:15,200 --> 00:44:19,600
Speaker 1: two billion erase from their cumulative net worth, and soccer

759
00:44:19,719 --> 00:44:22,800
Speaker 1: This is kind of the flip side of the FED

760
00:44:23,320 --> 00:44:28,200
Speaker 1: tightening and hiking interest rates dynamic, because it is true

761
00:44:28,680 --> 00:44:32,160
Speaker 1: that in the era of zero interest rates, you've had

762
00:44:32,320 --> 00:44:37,759
Speaker 1: this tremendous financialization of the economy. You've had money so

763
00:44:38,200 --> 00:44:41,280
Speaker 1: cheap and easy that you had a lot of dramatic

764
00:44:41,360 --> 00:44:46,920
Speaker 1: fortunes wildly inflated, and so that part it's not bad

765
00:44:47,160 --> 00:44:49,960
Speaker 1: that you have a coming down to earth of parts

766
00:44:50,040 --> 00:44:53,480
Speaker 1: of the economy. It's just the pain of working class

767
00:44:53,480 --> 00:44:55,279
Speaker 1: people and the fact that this has been sort of

768
00:44:55,320 --> 00:45:00,200
Speaker 1: explicitly engineered to crush wages and spike unemployment. That's the

769
00:45:00,200 --> 00:45:03,400
Speaker 1: part of the FED policy that has been very objectionable.

770
00:45:03,800 --> 00:45:06,000
Speaker 1: That's the hard part, right, which is that there really

771
00:45:06,040 --> 00:45:08,280
Speaker 1: is no way to do both when you're only using

772
00:45:08,320 --> 00:45:10,440
Speaker 1: the federal reserve. I also do want to underscore I

773
00:45:10,480 --> 00:45:13,480
Speaker 1: think it is interesting that China also was a huge

774
00:45:13,520 --> 00:45:17,520
Speaker 1: part of this story. The Chinese economic lockdowns that happened

775
00:45:17,560 --> 00:45:20,880
Speaker 1: have been devastating for the Chinese billionaire class. So this

776
00:45:20,920 --> 00:45:23,880
Speaker 1: isn't just America, this is worldwide. The Russian oligarchs, of

777
00:45:23,920 --> 00:45:27,520
Speaker 1: course got nuked by US and Western sanctions, but the

778
00:45:27,640 --> 00:45:31,000
Speaker 1: Chinese had a self inflicted financial bomb that they set

779
00:45:31,000 --> 00:45:34,240
Speaker 1: off on their economy with the COVID zero. On top

780
00:45:34,280 --> 00:45:37,480
Speaker 1: of you have the central bank tightening, So it's global.

781
00:45:37,560 --> 00:45:41,520
Speaker 1: This is a complete global meltdown really of what's happening.

782
00:45:41,600 --> 00:45:43,760
Speaker 1: And look, I mean, all of these people will sleep

783
00:45:43,800 --> 00:45:45,680
Speaker 1: just fine at night at a certain point, you know,

784
00:45:45,760 --> 00:45:48,000
Speaker 1: is there any real difference in lifestyle between three hundred

785
00:45:48,000 --> 00:45:49,799
Speaker 1: and fifty billion and one hundred billion. So I'm not

786
00:45:49,840 --> 00:45:53,120
Speaker 1: going to get too upset for Jeff Bezos, for Elon Musk.

787
00:45:53,360 --> 00:45:55,799
Speaker 1: I do think it more represents though, that there are

788
00:45:55,840 --> 00:45:59,239
Speaker 1: millions of people who work for these individuals who are

789
00:45:59,239 --> 00:46:02,920
Speaker 1: now suffering as a result, and it is more of

790
00:46:02,960 --> 00:46:06,040
Speaker 1: a reflection on the aggregate of the pain that so

791
00:46:06,120 --> 00:46:09,600
Speaker 1: many people have suffered. And you know, look, I can't

792
00:46:09,600 --> 00:46:11,600
Speaker 1: be the only one two years later where you know,

793
00:46:11,600 --> 00:46:13,799
Speaker 1: inflation may not be in the headlines anymore, but it's

794
00:46:13,840 --> 00:46:17,000
Speaker 1: not like grocery prices have fallen. They basically just stayed

795
00:46:17,000 --> 00:46:19,760
Speaker 1: the same. You actually hear where I am in Mexico.

796
00:46:20,040 --> 00:46:22,680
Speaker 1: I was looking at gas price here. It's like a

797
00:46:22,760 --> 00:46:25,560
Speaker 1: buck forty a leader. I mean, that's a lot of money.

798
00:46:26,160 --> 00:46:28,680
Speaker 1: And when you consider what GDP per capita is, I'm

799
00:46:28,680 --> 00:46:31,000
Speaker 1: like Wow, you know people. I guess they call it petrol,

800
00:46:31,080 --> 00:46:35,160
Speaker 1: but petrol is really gouging you know, working people worldwide.

801
00:46:35,440 --> 00:46:38,760
Speaker 1: So we should consider just how much of the pain

802
00:46:39,239 --> 00:46:41,200
Speaker 1: which is reflected in the top line figure of their

803
00:46:41,239 --> 00:46:44,560
Speaker 1: net worth is also dispersed on everybody else. So it's

804
00:46:44,560 --> 00:46:47,600
Speaker 1: a tough one. It's one of those where given at

805
00:46:47,760 --> 00:46:51,800
Speaker 1: the playbook that central policymakers use at the banking level,

806
00:46:52,120 --> 00:46:54,759
Speaker 1: this is really the only way to try and engineer it,

807
00:46:54,800 --> 00:46:56,560
Speaker 1: when really there should be a way to make sure

808
00:46:56,600 --> 00:46:59,240
Speaker 1: that they don't do as well and then others actually

809
00:46:59,239 --> 00:47:02,000
Speaker 1: get to do even better. Yeah. Well, it's just like

810
00:47:02,040 --> 00:47:04,239
Speaker 1: we've been saying for quite a while. I mean, the

811
00:47:04,280 --> 00:47:08,800
Speaker 1: FED policy of zero interest rates or effectively negative interest

812
00:47:08,880 --> 00:47:12,839
Speaker 1: rates for years and years, that created a lot of

813
00:47:13,160 --> 00:47:21,120
Speaker 1: tremendous and basically fake wealth for the very very tippy top. Meanwhile,

814
00:47:21,400 --> 00:47:24,600
Speaker 1: it's not like working class people benefited from that era.

815
00:47:24,920 --> 00:47:28,200
Speaker 1: But when you pop the balloon and you send the

816
00:47:28,239 --> 00:47:31,719
Speaker 1: thing crashing back down, yeah, you're going to claw back

817
00:47:31,960 --> 00:47:35,879
Speaker 1: some of those insane fortunes that were claimed by that

818
00:47:36,120 --> 00:47:39,560
Speaker 1: fake easy money. But you're also going to hurt on

819
00:47:39,600 --> 00:47:42,799
Speaker 1: the way down a lot of working class people and

820
00:47:42,840 --> 00:47:45,440
Speaker 1: that's you know, that's exactly the story that we see

821
00:47:45,480 --> 00:47:49,120
Speaker 1: playing out right now. So you have the accumulation of

822
00:47:49,480 --> 00:47:53,319
Speaker 1: FED sins over a number of years, which basically, you know,

823
00:47:53,480 --> 00:47:57,480
Speaker 1: backstop the fortunes of the richest among us, and then

824
00:47:57,520 --> 00:48:01,200
Speaker 1: you also have a total government failure to be able

825
00:48:01,239 --> 00:48:04,920
Speaker 1: to pass economic policy independent of the FED and use

826
00:48:04,960 --> 00:48:08,040
Speaker 1: a toolkit that would be better tailored and more suitable

827
00:48:08,239 --> 00:48:12,000
Speaker 1: for these strange economic circumstances that we ultimately find us in.

828
00:48:12,160 --> 00:48:15,480
Speaker 1: And that's sort of the story of the economy right now.

829
00:48:15,520 --> 00:48:18,400
Speaker 1: But listen, I think it is in and of itself

830
00:48:18,600 --> 00:48:22,680
Speaker 1: a fundamental good for the economy to have that some

831
00:48:22,800 --> 00:48:26,320
Speaker 1: of that easy money that was floating zombie companies and

832
00:48:26,400 --> 00:48:29,000
Speaker 1: creating fake fortunes and all of this stuff. I think

833
00:48:29,000 --> 00:48:33,440
Speaker 1: it's good to have that bubble ultimately pierced. It just

834
00:48:33,880 --> 00:48:37,880
Speaker 1: is incredibly painful that, you know, the policy that's been

835
00:48:37,920 --> 00:48:39,800
Speaker 1: pursued as one that is going to hurt working class

836
00:48:39,800 --> 00:48:43,000
Speaker 1: people so much more that you know, Elon Musk is

837
00:48:43,000 --> 00:48:45,680
Speaker 1: not going to hurt because he lost two hundred billion dollars.

838
00:48:45,680 --> 00:48:48,080
Speaker 1: For whatever he ultimately lost, He's going to be just fine.

839
00:48:48,520 --> 00:48:51,840
Speaker 1: Even so, so it's a it's a complicated landscape. I

840
00:48:51,880 --> 00:48:58,399
Speaker 1: guess that's what I'll say. Some really interesting data put

841
00:48:58,440 --> 00:49:03,680
Speaker 1: out by the Financial Time about the political ideology of millennials.

842
00:49:03,760 --> 00:49:06,040
Speaker 1: Let's go and put this up on the screen. So

843
00:49:06,520 --> 00:49:11,520
Speaker 1: historically demographic groups have gotten more conservative as they have aged.

844
00:49:11,560 --> 00:49:16,160
Speaker 1: But millennials are they say, shattering that oldest rule in politics.

845
00:49:16,440 --> 00:49:19,080
Speaker 1: And you can see on the right side of the

846
00:49:19,200 --> 00:49:23,600
Speaker 1: screen these charts that track the political ideology of boomers,

847
00:49:23,640 --> 00:49:27,040
Speaker 1: Silent Generation, and Gen X. They all follow that traditional

848
00:49:27,040 --> 00:49:31,640
Speaker 1: pattern of becoming more conservative as they get older. Millennials, though,

849
00:49:31,760 --> 00:49:35,400
Speaker 1: are not only are they not following that pattern, they

850
00:49:35,400 --> 00:49:38,400
Speaker 1: seem to be going in the opposite direction. This is

851
00:49:38,480 --> 00:49:42,719
Speaker 1: data from both the US and the UK, so it's

852
00:49:42,760 --> 00:49:46,439
Speaker 1: pretty fascinating. Obviously, we'll have huge implications for politics as

853
00:49:47,160 --> 00:49:50,080
Speaker 1: Silent Generation passes on, as boomers continue to age and

854
00:49:50,080 --> 00:49:53,239
Speaker 1: millennials continue to come into power. There's some indications Gen

855
00:49:53,320 --> 00:49:56,759
Speaker 1: Z may follow in millennials footsteps with their political ideology

856
00:49:56,800 --> 00:50:01,560
Speaker 1: as well, So huge ramifications in terms of political realignments

857
00:50:01,560 --> 00:50:04,880
Speaker 1: and political power and sagart. You know, this is just

858
00:50:05,000 --> 00:50:07,279
Speaker 1: sort of spitballing, but I have to think coming of

859
00:50:07,320 --> 00:50:11,680
Speaker 1: age at a time of global financial total collapse where

860
00:50:11,719 --> 00:50:15,480
Speaker 1: you have, you know, clear mouthfeasance on the top of

861
00:50:15,560 --> 00:50:18,480
Speaker 1: top financial institutions, you have no one going to jail

862
00:50:18,520 --> 00:50:21,520
Speaker 1: for it. You have you know, your entire career prospects impacted,

863
00:50:21,600 --> 00:50:25,759
Speaker 1: your whole life trajectory impacted by this series of events.

864
00:50:26,200 --> 00:50:28,480
Speaker 1: It seems to me like that might shape your worldview

865
00:50:28,480 --> 00:50:31,640
Speaker 1: for life. Oh, I think it's actually easy. It just

866
00:50:31,719 --> 00:50:33,960
Speaker 1: tracks with wealth. Why do you think boomers became more

867
00:50:34,000 --> 00:50:36,960
Speaker 1: conservative as they got older because they had more money.

868
00:50:36,960 --> 00:50:41,640
Speaker 1: They got more money. Yeah, they're like, oh, actually I

869
00:50:41,680 --> 00:50:44,920
Speaker 1: want to pay less taxes. Yeah, mortgage interest deductions and

870
00:50:44,960 --> 00:50:47,279
Speaker 1: all of that sounds good. Why do you care about

871
00:50:47,280 --> 00:50:48,960
Speaker 1: that if you don't have any of it? Actually, what

872
00:50:49,040 --> 00:50:50,960
Speaker 1: you want is really what your parents had. So I

873
00:50:51,000 --> 00:50:53,640
Speaker 1: don't think it's all that complicated, And in fact, I mean,

874
00:50:53,680 --> 00:50:56,480
Speaker 1: it just shows me that the definitions of conservative, liberal

875
00:50:56,480 --> 00:50:59,080
Speaker 1: and all that these things don't even really mean anything.

876
00:50:59,120 --> 00:51:01,440
Speaker 1: What we're going to see is a great reordering in

877
00:51:01,480 --> 00:51:04,520
Speaker 1: our lifetime. What the Republican Party looks like in twenty

878
00:51:04,520 --> 00:51:06,680
Speaker 1: five thirty years. I think it's just going to have

879
00:51:06,760 --> 00:51:09,680
Speaker 1: to be completely different if it's going to survive. Very

880
00:51:09,719 --> 00:51:12,920
Speaker 1: akin to what happened in the nineteen forties or in

881
00:51:12,920 --> 00:51:16,200
Speaker 1: the nineteen thirties and forties under Franklin D. Roosevelt, when

882
00:51:16,320 --> 00:51:19,920
Speaker 1: basically they had to abandon so much of what they

883
00:51:20,040 --> 00:51:23,759
Speaker 1: stood for during the pretty great Depression era and you

884
00:51:23,800 --> 00:51:26,279
Speaker 1: had Eisenhower come in and basically declare peace on the

885
00:51:26,280 --> 00:51:29,320
Speaker 1: New Deal and usher in a completely new party. I

886
00:51:29,360 --> 00:51:31,400
Speaker 1: think that's very likely to happen. I think on the

887
00:51:31,400 --> 00:51:35,239
Speaker 1: Democratic side, much of the corporate kind of alliance and

888
00:51:35,280 --> 00:51:38,000
Speaker 1: all that that stood for under the Bill Clinton era

889
00:51:38,160 --> 00:51:40,600
Speaker 1: has really been thrown out, especially in the UK where

890
00:51:40,600 --> 00:51:44,320
Speaker 1: they've basically thrown that out almost completely with the Liberals,

891
00:51:44,360 --> 00:51:47,399
Speaker 1: and in the Democratic Party. For the US, it's still

892
00:51:47,400 --> 00:51:49,799
Speaker 1: going to take some time. One of the things that

893
00:51:49,880 --> 00:51:53,040
Speaker 1: I am taking some heart in with this Kevin McCarthy

894
00:51:53,080 --> 00:51:56,319
Speaker 1: saga is that the parties are weaker now, and that's

895
00:51:56,360 --> 00:51:59,640
Speaker 1: a really good thing. It's over the last one hundred

896
00:51:59,719 --> 00:52:03,640
Speaker 1: years there has been no ability to cause chaos and

897
00:52:03,760 --> 00:52:07,520
Speaker 1: revolt to try and take off the tops of these parties.

898
00:52:07,600 --> 00:52:09,680
Speaker 1: And something I've come around to is that no matter

899
00:52:09,719 --> 00:52:12,960
Speaker 1: who gets this speakership, if Kevin McCarthy doesn't get it,

900
00:52:13,120 --> 00:52:17,000
Speaker 1: that's actually good for American democracy, because they should not

901
00:52:17,280 --> 00:52:20,960
Speaker 1: have locks on the speakership boats. They should not have

902
00:52:21,040 --> 00:52:23,840
Speaker 1: locks to be able to have top down controls. This

903
00:52:23,960 --> 00:52:27,000
Speaker 1: is something that really evolved more in the Gilded Age

904
00:52:27,280 --> 00:52:30,000
Speaker 1: and onward, and instead we need to see a return

905
00:52:30,080 --> 00:52:33,480
Speaker 1: to some like raucous chaos and the ability to inject

906
00:52:33,600 --> 00:52:36,120
Speaker 1: some new blood into the system. I think that's actually

907
00:52:36,120 --> 00:52:38,319
Speaker 1: when it's working at its best, as opposed to the

908
00:52:38,320 --> 00:52:40,320
Speaker 1: way it has been now for the last like forty

909
00:52:40,400 --> 00:52:42,320
Speaker 1: or fifty years and especially laste hundred years at the

910
00:52:42,320 --> 00:52:45,040
Speaker 1: house level. Yeah, I agree with you. I mean, when

911
00:52:45,080 --> 00:52:49,080
Speaker 1: things are stayed and ossified and controlled top down, it

912
00:52:49,160 --> 00:52:52,040
Speaker 1: becomes very limited because when it's top down control, you

913
00:52:52,120 --> 00:52:55,520
Speaker 1: know exactly ultimately who they are going to serve. But yeah,

914
00:52:55,520 --> 00:52:57,640
Speaker 1: it is fascinating me. I think you're right on the money. Like,

915
00:52:57,760 --> 00:53:01,320
Speaker 1: if you want young people to have more conservative politics,

916
00:53:01,360 --> 00:53:03,560
Speaker 1: maybe cut him in on the deal, cut him in,

917
00:53:04,560 --> 00:53:06,680
Speaker 1: create some wealth, and then maybe they'll, you know, a

918
00:53:06,800 --> 00:53:08,440
Speaker 1: stake in the status quo. Right now, they have no

919
00:53:08,480 --> 00:53:10,560
Speaker 1: stake in the status quo. They're like, buck the status quo.

920
00:53:10,640 --> 00:53:13,800
Speaker 1: This is not working for me whatsoever. And that's reflected

921
00:53:13,880 --> 00:53:17,239
Speaker 1: ultimately in the data. So you see You know, we

922
00:53:17,360 --> 00:53:20,960
Speaker 1: covered the Charlie Munger and Bernie Marcus and whatever, all

923
00:53:20,960 --> 00:53:23,640
Speaker 1: these old guys like lamenting these young people not being

924
00:53:23,680 --> 00:53:26,239
Speaker 1: grateful for what they have, et cetera. But when you

925
00:53:26,280 --> 00:53:29,920
Speaker 1: look at the numbers millennials and gen z U following

926
00:53:29,960 --> 00:53:34,840
Speaker 1: in their footsteps, they're achieving every major life milestone later

927
00:53:35,080 --> 00:53:38,319
Speaker 1: than previous generations. And so yeah, of course that's going

928
00:53:38,400 --> 00:53:40,600
Speaker 1: to impact your politics. Of course, that's going to impact

929
00:53:40,640 --> 00:53:43,840
Speaker 1: your sense of justice of how the society should ultimately

930
00:53:44,200 --> 00:53:46,759
Speaker 1: be ordered. And so no one should be surprised to

931
00:53:46,800 --> 00:53:48,880
Speaker 1: see that it is in fact having that impact on

932
00:53:48,920 --> 00:53:51,720
Speaker 1: the political ideology. Yeah. I mean, Charlie Munger really should

933
00:53:51,760 --> 00:53:53,480
Speaker 1: know better. You know, I think I was telling you.

934
00:53:53,520 --> 00:53:56,839
Speaker 1: I read that biography of Warren Buffett called Snowball. Yeah,

935
00:53:56,840 --> 00:53:59,880
Speaker 1: I read that central character. Well, what's the lesson with

936
00:54:00,080 --> 00:54:03,960
Speaker 1: Charlie Munger? Him and Warren Buffett got extraordinarily. I'm not

937
00:54:03,960 --> 00:54:06,040
Speaker 1: saying they didn't work hard, but they also happened to

938
00:54:06,080 --> 00:54:08,840
Speaker 1: invest during one of the greatest booms in modern American

939
00:54:08,880 --> 00:54:12,400
Speaker 1: history during the nineteen sixties. Were they responsible for that

940
00:54:12,800 --> 00:54:17,560
Speaker 1: or was broad around macro conditions the world's superpower Cold War?

941
00:54:17,680 --> 00:54:20,720
Speaker 1: All of that see. It just shows you that major

942
00:54:21,040 --> 00:54:25,800
Speaker 1: economic conditions shape the options that are even available to people.

943
00:54:25,840 --> 00:54:28,239
Speaker 1: So if you came, you know, came of age in

944
00:54:28,280 --> 00:54:31,000
Speaker 1: the seventies as opposed to the sixties, it's a totally

945
00:54:31,000 --> 00:54:34,880
Speaker 1: different world. And with millennials, we basically had the seventies,

946
00:54:35,160 --> 00:54:40,080
Speaker 1: except they just never ended. There's no eighties that have

947
00:54:40,200 --> 00:54:42,800
Speaker 1: come to save us. And so it's not a surprise

948
00:54:42,840 --> 00:54:46,040
Speaker 1: when you have malaise and you know, really just really

949
00:54:46,239 --> 00:54:49,400
Speaker 1: a lack of questioning and faith in institutions, which you know,

950
00:54:49,440 --> 00:54:50,920
Speaker 1: a person, I don't think you should have faith in

951
00:54:50,960 --> 00:54:53,440
Speaker 1: those institutions. So I think it's a good thing that

952
00:54:53,520 --> 00:54:57,759
Speaker 1: people are rejecting the status quo. It creates possibility. What

953
00:54:57,920 --> 00:55:02,040
Speaker 1: happens with that possibility totally uncertain, could be better, could

954
00:55:02,080 --> 00:55:04,759
Speaker 1: be worse, who knows, but it at least creates possibility.