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Speaker 1: You're listening to the Sportsman's Nation podcast network, brought to

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Speaker 1: you by Interstate Batteries. Interstate Batteries has thousands upon thousands

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Speaker 1: is kind of a car nut, a truck nut, and

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Speaker 1: he told me that, I guess on the research that

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Speaker 1: know anything about it, It's just what my buddy told me.

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Speaker 1: So if you're looking for a new car or truck battery,

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Speaker 1: you need to go to your local retail Interstate Battery

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Speaker 1: retail shop and go pick one up, because I guess

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Speaker 1: they're badass. So I know I have one in my truck.

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Speaker 1: Other than that, if you won't have TV remote controls,

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Speaker 1: Interstate Batteries makes a battery for that. They make batteries

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Speaker 1: for your range finder, your trail cameras, and basically any

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Speaker 1: other electrical device for the most part that you use

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Speaker 1: while hunting or fishing or being outside. They also have

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Speaker 1: a whole bunch of other little knick knack products to

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Speaker 1: Like my buddy Dance Bano Uh. He is uh a

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Speaker 1: manager for his family's Interstate Battery retail location. He got

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Speaker 1: me some of these cool flashlights that have switches on them.

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Speaker 1: One of them looks like a lantern. So they have

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Speaker 1: a whole bunch of that stuff too. If you want

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Speaker 1: to find out more information about the kind of batteries

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Speaker 1: that Interstate Batteries makes, head on over to Interstate Batteries

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Speaker 1: dot com or visit your local retail store. I told

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Speaker 1: you I've been kind of the kind of a funny

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Speaker 1: place about hunting. You know, it's all kind of snowballed

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Speaker 1: on me the whole, you know, whether it be the

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Speaker 1: shaming for shooting smaller deer, whether it be how we've

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Speaker 1: changed hunting from the craft as Mike said earlier, to

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Speaker 1: more of a uh let's build a you know, an

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Speaker 1: ecosystem and back deer into a kind of thing. All

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Speaker 1: that's kind of just compounded on me here in the

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Speaker 1: last few years. And and you know, every year I

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Speaker 1: find myself struggling a little more to make sense of

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Speaker 1: all of it. And I just wondered if I was

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Speaker 1: by myself. Am I just out here on the island

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Speaker 1: by myself feeling this way or whatever? And so it's

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Speaker 1: just really unique that, uh he calls me today. We're

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Speaker 1: talking on the phone, he says, Man, he is on

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Speaker 1: I'm kind of a going through a midlife crisis on

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Speaker 1: this deer hunt. My name is Clay Nukeleman. I'm the

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Speaker 1: host of the Bear Honey magazine podcast. I'll also be

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Speaker 1: your host into the world of hunting the icon in

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Speaker 1: the North American wilderness. We'll talk about tactics, gear conservation.

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Speaker 1: We will also bring you into some of the wildest

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Speaker 1: country off the planet. Chasing bath. Yeah, I feel like

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Speaker 1: an astronaut. Where are we gonna take off? I feel

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Speaker 1: like a race car driver, Scott. I was just thinking about, Uh,

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Speaker 1: I remember, I remember when you remember in the Walmart

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Speaker 1: parking lot. This wouldn't have been it wouldn't have been

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Speaker 1: the first time I met you, but it would have

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Speaker 1: been the first memory I have a Walmart parking lot.

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Speaker 1: I was sixteen years old, Mena, Arkansas. Was just a

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Speaker 1: couple of years ago. Yeah, yeah, just a couple of

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Speaker 1: years ago, sixteen years old, because that's when I started

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Speaker 1: working at Walmart was sixteen, and I remember you were

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Speaker 1: probably you're a few years older than me. It when

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Speaker 1: I was sixteen, you were a lot older than me.

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Speaker 1: I mean, you were like just like a different league

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Speaker 1: of life. And I remember you and somebody, it may

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Speaker 1: have been one of the Clark brothers, came up into

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Speaker 1: the Walmart parking lot. I was pushing buggies working for Walmart,

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Speaker 1: and I knew you were a hunter, but we didn't

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Speaker 1: really know each other because you were Are you five

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Speaker 1: years older than me? Well, I'm forty two, so you're, well,

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Speaker 1: you're not that much older than me. I'm forty Okay,

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Speaker 1: we're just two years apart. Then, well, I think in

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Speaker 1: school you were at least three. There's probably three grades

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Speaker 1: ahead of it, so that yeah. Yeah, And so I

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Speaker 1: remember you. I started talking about hunting in the parking

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Speaker 1: lot and you said, man, I'm hunting the big deer.

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Speaker 1: And you said, if I kill this deer. I vividly

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Speaker 1: remember this. You you said, if I kill this deer,

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Speaker 1: everybody in this town is gonna know about it. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I distinctly remember that. And then you killed the deer

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Speaker 1: that everybody in the town knew about. Yeah, I would

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Speaker 1: have been nineteen, so that you would have been yeah,

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Speaker 1: you've been sixteen. I was nineteen when I killed that deer,

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Speaker 1: and uh yeah, you know, I've never seen that deer.

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Speaker 1: That was before game cameras and all that stuff. So

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Speaker 1: you're just going off of what, you know, the sign

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Speaker 1: that I was seeing. So, yeah, I found some sign.

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Speaker 1: I heard A had a little um inside information on

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Speaker 1: a guy who had seen some a bachelor group of

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Speaker 1: bucks an early season in this area. And it have

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Speaker 1: to be happened to be kind of in my backyard,

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Speaker 1: you know it was. I say that figuratively. You know,

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Speaker 1: I grew up, you know, my childhood. I grew up

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Speaker 1: at the foot of the Washtall Mountain Range, and literally

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Speaker 1: my back door butted up to you know, just acres

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Speaker 1: and acres and acres and National force Land, and uh,

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Speaker 1: where these deer were seen was just kind of in

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Speaker 1: some really familiar ground for me. So kind of perked

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Speaker 1: my interests and so went in there just on a whim,

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Speaker 1: trying to see if I could find any sign and

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Speaker 1: ended up finding, you know, some of the biggest bucks

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Speaker 1: and I've ever seen up until that point in my life.

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Speaker 1: And uh, you know, I think that's what hunting was

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Speaker 1: back then. You know, you what I found the first

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Speaker 1: day I went in there was was a rub. It

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Speaker 1: was you know, uh, it's probably a five or six

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Speaker 1: inches through hardwood. Yeah, you know, hardwood tree, all that.

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Speaker 1: And it was enough for me to hang a stand.

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Speaker 1: You know. It was just that's all I needed to

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Speaker 1: hang a stand. Back in those days. I didn't have

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Speaker 1: to have, you know, all the stuff you have to

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Speaker 1: have today to feel confident about hanging to stand. So,

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Speaker 1: you know, I just really went off of a went

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Speaker 1: off of a gut feeling that this was gonna be

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Speaker 1: the biggest deer, you know, that I'd ever seen, and

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Speaker 1: and sure enough it ended up being the biggest here

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Speaker 1: even to to this day, still the biggest dear of everything.

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Speaker 1: an old fashioned print magazine with all kinds of new stuff.

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Speaker 1: bear dash hunting dot com. That's bare hyphen Hunting dot com.

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Speaker 1: So we've got Mike, Mike Schultz, my uncle. He's sitting there. Mike,

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Speaker 1: let me tell you. When Scott killed that deer, the

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Speaker 1: deer end up scoring a hundred and fifty six inches

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Speaker 1: I remember vividly at the time. I mean, a hundred

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Speaker 1: and fifty six inch deer in the Washingtall Mountains was

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Speaker 1: pretty much unheard of. I mean, people killed deer that big,

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Speaker 1: but a good hunter would kill maybe one of those

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Speaker 1: in a lifetime. I mean, well that that's very true,

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Speaker 1: but not every good hunter would kill one of those

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Speaker 1: in a lifetime. Here. I mean it was a top

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Speaker 1: end deer and uh no, I just I vividly remember

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Speaker 1: that because you told you called it man, and you

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Speaker 1: know what that that story. So Scott ended up killing

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Speaker 1: that deer with his bow public land, and that my

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Speaker 1: entrance to friendship with you, I would say, has followed

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Speaker 1: that trajectory Scott of you saying things that happened and

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Speaker 1: we're true. I was telling Mike on the web U

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Speaker 1: here there, and I don't know if I've ever told

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Speaker 1: you this, but they're probably five people in my life

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Speaker 1: that have had significant influence on me and hunting, and

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Speaker 1: you're one of them. For real. Well, I've come to

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Speaker 1: the conclusion after listening to you. I had never thought

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Speaker 1: of it that I called my shot that day, But

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Speaker 1: maybe I need to do that more often. You need

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Speaker 1: to call it, because you know, I've been more confident

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Speaker 1: before and never come up with anything, you know, so

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Speaker 1: maybe I need to Maybe I need to call my

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Speaker 1: shot more often. You know. It's funny that you talk

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Speaker 1: about Walmart and how you you know, you you met

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Speaker 1: me through that day and that incident, you know, But

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Speaker 1: my first memories of you, I didn't even know you.

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Speaker 1: I knew who you were, I knew your dad, you know,

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Speaker 1: and your dad was kind of a pineer bow hunter

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Speaker 1: in our area when I when I took up bow hunting,

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Speaker 1: you know, there wasn't I mean, in all reality, I

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Speaker 1: don't know if there was a dozen bow hunters in

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Speaker 1: the town. You know that that there were some guys

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Speaker 1: that were into archery a little bit, but not a

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Speaker 1: whole lot of hunters. And uh, you know, and I

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Speaker 1: we had a if you remember there, we we had

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Speaker 1: a trophy board back in the sporting Goods area and

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Speaker 1: somebody that was basically the Facebook of nineteen Yeah. And

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Speaker 1: so if you go to Walmart to see the pictures

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Speaker 1: on the wall, yeah yeah, So you know, I can

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Speaker 1: remember going back there and this was you know, I

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Speaker 1: was only, man, I couldn't have been over fourteen, fifteen

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Speaker 1: years old when I first started seeing pictures of you

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Speaker 1: back there on that board with these bow kills, you know.

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Speaker 1: And and man, you said it a minute ago. Shooting

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Speaker 1: a deer back then with a bow, especially in in

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Speaker 1: the Washitas was a feat in itself into coming there

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Speaker 1: and see you on the board. And it wasn't this

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Speaker 1: big old, huge buck, you know, it'd just be a

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Speaker 1: might be a dough maybe a a three point or

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Speaker 1: whatever it was, you know, but it was just uncharted

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Speaker 1: territory for kids are to shoot a deer with a bow,

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Speaker 1: you know, And so I knew, I mean, I had

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Speaker 1: a lot of respect for you before ever even met you,

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Speaker 1: you know, because just seeing seeing somebody of my age

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Speaker 1: group shooting deer with a bow and that kind of thing,

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Speaker 1: and so I'm not gonna lie, it sparked sparked a

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Speaker 1: fire to me a little bit too. You were killing

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Speaker 1: deer before I was, though, but you were, you were

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Speaker 1: killing with a rifle. Like, yeah, yeah, I hunted years.

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Speaker 1: When I say years, you know, it seemed like half

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Speaker 1: a lifetime. Like you said, when you're sixteen, three years

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Speaker 1: is a long time. But uh, yeah, I think if

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Speaker 1: I remember right, I think I shot my first deer

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Speaker 1: when I was twelve years old. Um whe a rifle

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Speaker 1: and hunted a thousand hours to do that, you know,

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Speaker 1: Um just hunted and hunted and hunted for years and

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Speaker 1: never had an opportunity to even shoot a deer. And

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Speaker 1: shot my first deer when I was twelve with a rifle.

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Speaker 1: And then I got into bow hunting. I think I

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Speaker 1: was fourteen when I got my first bow, and I

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Speaker 1: could be a little off of that. I think I

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Speaker 1: was fourteen I got my first bow. I started bow hunting, um,

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Speaker 1: you know, in the wash Tols, And you know, I

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Speaker 1: never forget getting up the tree stand thinking, man, I've

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Speaker 1: hunted entire gun seasons and only seen two or three deer.

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Speaker 1: And here I'm sitting with this bow where I can

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Speaker 1: and back then, you know, a forty yard shot was

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Speaker 1: a mile back then, you know. And I'm sitting there

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Speaker 1: thinking real and really realistically, I've got a weapon here

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Speaker 1: that can shoot twenty five yards. You know what am

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Speaker 1: I doing? And you know it took a daunting yeah

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Speaker 1: it is. And I you know, I just remember the

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Speaker 1: first year I ever shot at, I shot at three

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Speaker 1: times and never touched it, you know, And so that

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Speaker 1: really started putting bow hunting in question, you know. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but uh hey, you know the first story that I

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Speaker 1: So we knew each other the same way our dads

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Speaker 1: knew each other, and you were a little bit older

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Speaker 1: than me, and our dad's didn't say hunt together anything.

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Speaker 1: They're just kind of in the community and knew, you know,

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Speaker 1: my dad knew your dad was a really good hunter.

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Speaker 1: Which Scott, Mike, I'm gonna introduce you better in a minute,

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Speaker 1: Mike Schultz, let me tell you something. Scott's Andy Brown.

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Speaker 1: Scott Brown and their group of hunters are as good

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Speaker 1: a regional hunters are as there are on the planet

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Speaker 1: in my opinion, I mean for real, like for like,

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Speaker 1: if you were in Colorado and there was a family

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Speaker 1: of hunters that didn't travel, they just knew how to

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Speaker 1: hunt Colorado, they aren't even better than Andy and Scott

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Speaker 1: Brown and these guys. And I mean that, and that's

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Speaker 1: that's something that my dad and I've said it so

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Speaker 1: many times on this podcast, taught me to respect. Was

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Speaker 1: people that knew how to get it done wherever God

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Speaker 1: put them, you know. I mean, because we we kind

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Speaker 1: of saw this influx in the nineties when when we

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Speaker 1: were growing up in the hunting of people that had

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Speaker 1: money or ability to go places kill these big deer.

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Speaker 1: It's kind of when people first started going to the

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Speaker 1: Midwest to kill big deer. And at the time, the

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Speaker 1: only people I could do that were people that had

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Speaker 1: money or had some had some path that we didn't have.

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Speaker 1: The guys that could kill big deer consistently, especially here

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Speaker 1: a man in the nineties here, the Washtalls were. It's

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Speaker 1: tough as anywhere on the planet kind of white tailed deer,

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Speaker 1: a mature white tail deer. It's gotten better. I think

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Speaker 1: now there's there's probably more dear than there's ever been.

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Speaker 1: But but anyway, well, okay, I was gonna tell the story.

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Speaker 1: So we knew each other. We knew each other. I

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Speaker 1: knew you just through stories. And so I am like,

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Speaker 1: probably like eight years old, and my dad said that.

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Speaker 1: My dad I vividly remember. I think I remember where

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Speaker 1: I was standing when he told me the story that

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Speaker 1: he said, hey, Clay, I heard a story. Uh. And

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Speaker 1: I think Steve Phillips told us to my dad, and

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Speaker 1: I'm sure it was. It was just as big as

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Speaker 1: it was. I love that guy. Yes, yeah, yeah, And

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Speaker 1: uh he said, uh he said Andy and Andy took

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Speaker 1: Scott turkey hunting other and you would have just been

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Speaker 1: a kid. I mean if I was eight, you would

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Speaker 1: have been eleven something like that. And uh he said, uh.

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Speaker 1: He said Andy took Scott out hunting the other day

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Speaker 1: and Andy told Scott to not shoot at a walk

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Speaker 1: in Turkey, and so Andy called up to Turkey and

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Speaker 1: it just walks right in and never stops, and Scott

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Speaker 1: never shoots it and it just comes right in. And

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Speaker 1: I mean it was just like, oh man, what a rookie.

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Speaker 1: I mean I remember just being like, that's Scott Brown.

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Speaker 1: He he what a rookie, and then Scott ends up being, uh,

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Speaker 1: probably the best turkey hunter that I know. So our

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Speaker 1: history was we both ended up moving to Faettaville to

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Speaker 1: go to college at the University of Arkansas. You were

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Speaker 1: like a senior junior when I would have got up there,

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Speaker 1: and that's when we really developed our friendship. So I

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Speaker 1: would have been, like, I think I was twenty one,

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Speaker 1: So it's kind of like we knew of each other,

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Speaker 1: had a little bit of experience. But Scott, you described

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Speaker 1: to me better than anybody how to hunt the mountains.

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Speaker 1: I vividly remember we we we hunted a wildlife management area,

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Speaker 1: and I don't have any problems saying the name of

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Speaker 1: it because we don't hut there anymore. Maddison County Wildlife

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Speaker 1: managin Area. It's not even called that anymore. But it

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Speaker 1: was the the the perfect Ozarkian habitat. I mean like

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Speaker 1: steep hollows, lots of bluffs. It was just like perfect, heavy,

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Speaker 1: heavily forested mountain hunting. And I remember you told me,

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Speaker 1: you said, you need to look for you need to

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Speaker 1: look for saddles, which are low spots on tops of ridges.

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Speaker 1: You need to look for trails at the heads of

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Speaker 1: hollows where fingers come together, and you just painted at

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Speaker 1: such a picture that I understood. I was like, oh, okay,

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Speaker 1: because even though I grew up down here in the mountains,

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Speaker 1: we actually hunted south of here, in a little bit

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Speaker 1: more of the flat lands, you know, And so you

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Speaker 1: you described really well for me. You just painted a

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Speaker 1: picture of nobody else head. No, it's number one. I

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Speaker 1: learned it so much during those years. I was like

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Speaker 1: a sponge talking to you. Number two. You taught me

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Speaker 1: how to tell a dear story. You really did, whether

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Speaker 1: you know it or not. And uh you, uh, you're

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Speaker 1: I said this before to somebody recently, is that I've noticed,

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Speaker 1: in being around a lot of different people from different

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Speaker 1: parts of the country inside of hunting, you and your

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Speaker 1: family and your people value a story about as much

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Speaker 1: as you value that the hunt. Yeah. Absolutely, I couldn't

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Speaker 1: agree with you anymore. I mean, and I'm gonna talk

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Speaker 1: for a minute here. I'm gonna eventually let you talk.

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Speaker 1: I remember one time I called it. It was back

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Speaker 1: before Facebook, and just like community, I mean, we communicate

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Speaker 1: quite a bit now, but there was a time when

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Speaker 1: we weren't. We didn't We probably talked on that when

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Speaker 1: we didn't live in the same town, and I'd call

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Speaker 1: you a couple of times a year and we'd have

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Speaker 1: a two hour talk on the phone. That's the way

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Speaker 1: communication was, do you know, do you remember what I'm

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Speaker 1: talking about. I mean that was before even cell phones.

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Speaker 1: You had to dial in on a hardline phone phone conversation, right.

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Speaker 1: I remember one time you, I said, how's your having been?

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Speaker 1: And you started telling me a story. And I was

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Speaker 1: absolutely riveted at this story. I mean it was just like,

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Speaker 1: I mean, you walked me through like the morning routine,

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Speaker 1: what it was like walking in the dark to the stand,

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Speaker 1: what it felt like when you got in the stand

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Speaker 1: as the wind went across your face, dotta dotta die.

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Speaker 1: And at the I mean at the end of the story,

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Speaker 1: I mean my eyes were just bug eyed, and I'm like,

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Speaker 1: he's gonna tell me he killed a hundred eating inch

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Speaker 1: buck on public land in Arkansas, And you were like,

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Speaker 1: doe deer walked up, and I mean I was just like, yes,

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Speaker 1: but the whole story was about a doe deer and

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Speaker 1: it was the best story I've ever heard. But and

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Speaker 1: not I can't do it as well as you can.

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Speaker 1: But you taught me how to tell a dear story.

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Speaker 1: And I've noticed your whole You're just a product of

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Speaker 1: your your dad and other guys that y'all hunt with.

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Speaker 1: I grew up, you know, with the luxury of having

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Speaker 1: a father that was a good hunter. I mean, you

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Speaker 1: know he had of course he had, he had a

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Speaker 1: family that taught him how to hunt. So and so

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Speaker 1: to say that, you know, I just was born some

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Speaker 1: great turkey hunter. I was, you know, some good deer

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Speaker 1: hunter or whatever. I owe all that to my dad.

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Speaker 1: You know, my dad, you know, he taught me how

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Speaker 1: to hunt these mountains around here in a time when

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Speaker 1: there was very few deer around here. And uh, you know,

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Speaker 1: I think about is a kid. My dad would load

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Speaker 1: me up in his truck and we go to my

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Speaker 1: great uncle's house, would be my dad's uncle. His name

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Speaker 1: was Irah Willis. You know, he grew up hunting, you know,

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Speaker 1: in the fifties and sixties and seventies, when dear populations

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Speaker 1: were even less, you know, And we go in there

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Speaker 1: and we'd sit down to his living room and he

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Speaker 1: was he had a he's a big old guy. He

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Speaker 1: just sit down over there in his big smith overalls,

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Speaker 1: and he'd start telling these stories and I'm telling you

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Speaker 1: you were right there sitting in the blind with him,

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Speaker 1: or you were you know. I mean he would just

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Speaker 1: tell the stories to the everlast detail, and I mean

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Speaker 1: you were there the whole time, you know, with them,

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Speaker 1: And and of course you're getting a history lesson to

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00:20:47,320 --> 00:20:49,960
Speaker 1: you know, he tells stories that were happened years ago.

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Speaker 1: I mean, just like, see the guy that just expected

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Speaker 1: you to know every saddle, every gap, every ridge in

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Speaker 1: this county. Yeah, you know, I'm I'm I was all

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Speaker 1: of you know, twelve years old or whatever, ten or

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Speaker 1: twelve years old. And he'd go tell these stories and

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Speaker 1: he'd say, well, you know, you know where that well

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Speaker 1: that big leg ties in over there, you know, when

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Speaker 1: you're trying to tell the story, trying to put me

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Speaker 1: there with him, you know, and finally you just have

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Speaker 1: to say yeah, yeah, yeah, you know. So he'd go on,

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Speaker 1: you know, and it was he'd stop and try to

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Speaker 1: tell you where it was at. Yeah, you'd just be like,

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Speaker 1: so finally you just nod, not your head, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I know where that's that. And then he keeps going,

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Speaker 1: you know, and he'd tell these great stories man, and

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Speaker 1: I mean so blessed to have spent just a few

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Speaker 1: years in my childhood with him. He passed away when

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Speaker 1: I was a teenager, so you know, I didn't get

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Speaker 1: to spend a whole lot of time with him, but

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Speaker 1: my dad would credit him. Uh, it's probably teaching him

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Speaker 1: more about hunting than any any other person in his life.

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Speaker 1: Ira Willis Well, he he was a true He was

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Speaker 1: just a true outdoorsman. I mean he was He came

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Speaker 1: up in a time where you hunted out of necessity.

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Speaker 1: You know, it's a totally different thing than what we

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Speaker 1: experienced today. But he come up at the time when

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Speaker 1: you hunt it out of necessity. I mean you you

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Speaker 1: hunted for food to help sustain you. I mean you know, uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, you come up through the you know, the

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Speaker 1: latter years of the depression and those types of things

395
00:22:07,720 --> 00:22:11,480
Speaker 1: where work was hard find and and it was important

396
00:22:11,560 --> 00:22:13,800
Speaker 1: that you hunted and and did those types of things.

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Speaker 1: And so he mastered his craft. And so to sit

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Speaker 1: there and listen to him talk, you know, we didn't remember.

399
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Speaker 1: Do you remember how he told stories? I mean, did

400
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Speaker 1: he did? He? Uh? I don't know, what what was it?

401
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Speaker 1: Do you think your dad learned how to tell a

402
00:22:28,760 --> 00:22:31,040
Speaker 1: story from him. I think so because when you when

403
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Speaker 1: you hear my dad tell a story, now it's very

404
00:22:32,920 --> 00:22:35,800
Speaker 1: similar to him. You know. Um, you know, when you're

405
00:22:35,840 --> 00:22:38,680
Speaker 1: not around me, I tell stories like you do. Well

406
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Speaker 1: when I do when I talk to you. I realized

407
00:22:41,520 --> 00:22:43,480
Speaker 1: this the other day. A lot of times when you, uh,

408
00:22:43,640 --> 00:22:46,160
Speaker 1: you're like, well, tell me the story. I when you're

409
00:22:46,160 --> 00:22:49,080
Speaker 1: around somebody that you perceive as a better storyteller than you,

410
00:22:49,080 --> 00:22:53,880
Speaker 1: you always kind of just cut it short and well. Yeah,

411
00:22:53,920 --> 00:22:57,320
Speaker 1: I think you know my dad he tells stories a

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Speaker 1: lot like my great uncle. I mean, people say that

413
00:23:01,040 --> 00:23:02,800
Speaker 1: about mealtime we will your dad can tell the best

414
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Speaker 1: dear stories. You are the best hunting stories or fishing

415
00:23:05,040 --> 00:23:07,960
Speaker 1: stories or whatever it is. But yeah, I think my

416
00:23:08,000 --> 00:23:10,080
Speaker 1: dad would give him all the credit for being able

417
00:23:10,119 --> 00:23:14,040
Speaker 1: to tell a good dear story. Yeah. But hey, we've

418
00:23:14,080 --> 00:23:18,280
Speaker 1: were like twenty minutes in Mike Schultz. I got introduced

419
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Speaker 1: by Mike is my is my I call him my uncle.

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00:23:23,200 --> 00:23:27,440
Speaker 1: It's my actually my wife's uncle. But uh, Mike is uh,

421
00:23:27,720 --> 00:23:31,080
Speaker 1: Mike's my traveling buddy today. You rode down here with me.

422
00:23:31,200 --> 00:23:34,520
Speaker 1: But Mike is a quite a bit of experience hunting,

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Speaker 1: even different parts of the world, hunting a little bit,

424
00:23:38,400 --> 00:23:40,080
Speaker 1: a little bit here and there. Head and you're Mike, Yeah,

425
00:23:40,119 --> 00:23:44,359
Speaker 1: a little bit in Africa and Zimbabwe, and you know, yeah,

426
00:23:44,640 --> 00:23:49,320
Speaker 1: Texas and now you live in Arkansas, Mike Schultz, both

427
00:23:49,320 --> 00:23:52,639
Speaker 1: of you guys are massively influenced, influential in my life.

428
00:23:52,720 --> 00:23:55,439
Speaker 1: For real. I'm not just saying that Mike is a

429
00:23:56,560 --> 00:23:59,880
Speaker 1: Mike is not just a professional photographer. He is a

430
00:24:00,440 --> 00:24:05,480
Speaker 1: photographer's photographer. He really is. And he Uh, Mike's published

431
00:24:05,560 --> 00:24:10,840
Speaker 1: numerous books. Uh, Mike's a published author. But uh, but

432
00:24:11,080 --> 00:24:14,560
Speaker 1: Mike taught me years ago. I mean a lot of

433
00:24:14,680 --> 00:24:17,080
Speaker 1: my my career right now, I attribute a lot to

434
00:24:17,160 --> 00:24:19,120
Speaker 1: Mike because a lot of what I do right now

435
00:24:19,240 --> 00:24:25,080
Speaker 1: is visual, visual stuff with photography and video and uh.

436
00:24:25,160 --> 00:24:28,960
Speaker 1: And Mike taught me how to how to view light.

437
00:24:29,280 --> 00:24:31,560
Speaker 1: He taught me how to use a camera. He taught

438
00:24:31,600 --> 00:24:35,399
Speaker 1: me what was beautiful and what wasn't. For real, Like,

439
00:24:35,480 --> 00:24:38,400
Speaker 1: I remember, Mike, one time, We're riding down the road,

440
00:24:39,040 --> 00:24:42,879
Speaker 1: and I'm seeing similarities in some ways in my relationship

441
00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:46,240
Speaker 1: with both of you, and I'll explain. I remember one time, uh,

442
00:24:46,240 --> 00:24:49,800
Speaker 1: probably two thousand five, fifteen years ago, riding down the road,

443
00:24:50,600 --> 00:24:52,600
Speaker 1: and it was getting late in the evening and the

444
00:24:52,680 --> 00:24:58,080
Speaker 1: sun hit this mountain over in the Ozarks, and Mike said,

445
00:24:58,080 --> 00:24:59,920
Speaker 1: look at the way the lights hitting that little set

446
00:25:00,280 --> 00:25:03,360
Speaker 1: right there. And it was the first time I ever

447
00:25:03,400 --> 00:25:06,800
Speaker 1: thought about light. And if you're a photographer or in

448
00:25:06,840 --> 00:25:13,280
Speaker 1: any kind of visual videography, light is everything, everything and

449
00:25:13,280 --> 00:25:16,240
Speaker 1: it and and we started talking about light. Anyway, it

450
00:25:16,240 --> 00:25:18,960
Speaker 1: opened my I mean, it opened my eyes. It gave

451
00:25:19,000 --> 00:25:22,959
Speaker 1: me some sights. So anyway, Clay was a quick study,

452
00:25:24,520 --> 00:25:27,040
Speaker 1: just a few words, and you grasp it and took

453
00:25:27,040 --> 00:25:30,800
Speaker 1: off and I watched this photography just explode, I mean,

454
00:25:31,680 --> 00:25:36,720
Speaker 1: very very definite eye did He has ability to capture,

455
00:25:37,040 --> 00:25:42,920
Speaker 1: especially capture people and environments around people. So yeah, and Scott,

456
00:25:43,040 --> 00:25:47,320
Speaker 1: I'm kind of I'm kind of jumbled here, but Scott,

457
00:25:47,480 --> 00:25:52,359
Speaker 1: you also the third thing that you taught me was

458
00:25:52,440 --> 00:25:56,960
Speaker 1: an appreciated appreciation for the washing Tols. You really did.

459
00:25:57,280 --> 00:25:59,560
Speaker 1: I mean, I grew up here, so I did have

460
00:25:59,800 --> 00:26:02,440
Speaker 1: a apreciation for them on my own. But when we

461
00:26:02,520 --> 00:26:06,919
Speaker 1: moved to Faida, you said, if when I close my

462
00:26:06,960 --> 00:26:10,040
Speaker 1: eyes and think about where I want to sit to

463
00:26:10,160 --> 00:26:12,960
Speaker 1: deer hunt, and you name the place that both of

464
00:26:13,040 --> 00:26:17,200
Speaker 1: us know, you you you kind of painted this picture

465
00:26:17,280 --> 00:26:22,760
Speaker 1: of this just like larger than life thing, and it's

466
00:26:22,800 --> 00:26:25,800
Speaker 1: just it's just a place that was just hard to

467
00:26:25,800 --> 00:26:29,640
Speaker 1: get to and beautiful and kind of mysterious, and that

468
00:26:30,520 --> 00:26:32,919
Speaker 1: you know, nobody's running game cameras back in there to

469
00:26:33,000 --> 00:26:35,760
Speaker 1: see if there's a big deer back there, but you

470
00:26:35,760 --> 00:26:40,400
Speaker 1: you know that there is and uh, and that that

471
00:26:40,920 --> 00:26:44,840
Speaker 1: influenced the way that I viewed these mountains big time.

472
00:26:45,200 --> 00:26:47,639
Speaker 1: You know that that place that you're talking about today,

473
00:26:47,720 --> 00:26:49,359
Speaker 1: I would tell you that today the same as I

474
00:26:49,440 --> 00:26:51,800
Speaker 1: told you that I know you would fifteen years ago.

475
00:26:51,880 --> 00:26:53,560
Speaker 1: When I sit and think of a place I'd like

476
00:26:53,600 --> 00:26:58,560
Speaker 1: to spend a day sitting in a tree, just sitting there,

477
00:26:59,800 --> 00:27:02,240
Speaker 1: I still named that place. And there's there's a far

478
00:27:02,600 --> 00:27:05,280
Speaker 1: likely chance, that far more likely chance I would not

479
00:27:05,320 --> 00:27:08,800
Speaker 1: see a deer sitting there, But I would sit there

480
00:27:08,840 --> 00:27:11,320
Speaker 1: the entire time thinking that any minute it was gonna happen,

481
00:27:11,440 --> 00:27:13,520
Speaker 1: you know, and and be happy about it. You know,

482
00:27:14,320 --> 00:27:19,000
Speaker 1: um beautiful place. There's something about the Washta though. You

483
00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:21,680
Speaker 1: know we moved. When we moved to northwest Arkansas and

484
00:27:21,720 --> 00:27:24,080
Speaker 1: started hunting the Ozarks, it was it's a big change,

485
00:27:24,080 --> 00:27:27,879
Speaker 1: you know. It was just it was, But why I

486
00:27:27,880 --> 00:27:29,720
Speaker 1: thought about you think about though the hunt was so

487
00:27:29,760 --> 00:27:31,760
Speaker 1: good up there, but every chance I could, I came

488
00:27:31,800 --> 00:27:35,560
Speaker 1: home to come hunting. You know, Um, so makes sense

489
00:27:35,560 --> 00:27:38,200
Speaker 1: of that, you know, it's just you had a lot

490
00:27:38,240 --> 00:27:41,200
Speaker 1: better chance of shooting something. Part of and even you're

491
00:27:41,240 --> 00:27:46,000
Speaker 1: talking about it's a specific place that you love so

492
00:27:46,080 --> 00:27:48,399
Speaker 1: much of our hunting the value that comes from it

493
00:27:48,480 --> 00:27:51,679
Speaker 1: comes from and Johnny Carroll saying, my buddy said this

494
00:27:51,800 --> 00:27:55,840
Speaker 1: two podcasts ago. It comes from our connection to place

495
00:27:56,280 --> 00:28:00,199
Speaker 1: quote unquote, our connection to place. What what is our

496
00:28:00,440 --> 00:28:03,840
Speaker 1: place in that environment? Like and I talked about how

497
00:28:03,960 --> 00:28:06,560
Speaker 1: when I go to Canada and kill a big buck

498
00:28:06,640 --> 00:28:09,240
Speaker 1: up there, man, I love it, and I'm gonna keep

499
00:28:09,280 --> 00:28:14,000
Speaker 1: doing that. I enjoy that, but it means it doesn't

500
00:28:14,000 --> 00:28:17,240
Speaker 1: mean to me what it would mean here to kill

501
00:28:17,359 --> 00:28:21,200
Speaker 1: just a good buck. It does, it doesn't. It does

502
00:28:21,280 --> 00:28:24,920
Speaker 1: not because I don't have a connection to place up there.

503
00:28:25,760 --> 00:28:28,760
Speaker 1: I don't fit really up there just just because of

504
00:28:28,880 --> 00:28:32,920
Speaker 1: natural I didn't grow up there. There's value, there's value

505
00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:36,240
Speaker 1: in roots, it really is, man, and and some people

506
00:28:36,280 --> 00:28:40,120
Speaker 1: don't have real strong hunting roots or whatever. And that's

507
00:28:40,160 --> 00:28:44,160
Speaker 1: that's you know, Yeah, I was thinking, but Scott, just

508
00:28:44,280 --> 00:28:49,080
Speaker 1: the lineage of your family here because I think probably

509
00:28:49,120 --> 00:28:52,040
Speaker 1: produced that sense of place inside of you. Those stories

510
00:28:52,080 --> 00:28:55,880
Speaker 1: that your grandfather told and your dad would tell produces

511
00:28:55,960 --> 00:29:00,000
Speaker 1: something here that goes beyond the game itself, goes even

512
00:29:00,120 --> 00:29:03,440
Speaker 1: beyond hunting. It goes beyond it's a love of the

513
00:29:03,480 --> 00:29:08,680
Speaker 1: place that that Yeah, if it was so good there,

514
00:29:08,720 --> 00:29:11,000
Speaker 1: most most guys would have gone up there and stayed

515
00:29:11,040 --> 00:29:13,000
Speaker 1: up there. All the hunting is phenomenal, I'm gonna go

516
00:29:13,080 --> 00:29:17,520
Speaker 1: hunt and and they would have moved there. Uh And

517
00:29:17,520 --> 00:29:20,360
Speaker 1: and you didn't. You came back here. Well, like me

518
00:29:20,560 --> 00:29:24,040
Speaker 1: in northwest Arkansas, Scott. I think I told you this before,

519
00:29:24,080 --> 00:29:28,560
Speaker 1: but I had this epiphany, Like last year, I could

520
00:29:28,640 --> 00:29:33,640
Speaker 1: drive the same distance northwest and be in southeast Kansas

521
00:29:34,560 --> 00:29:37,600
Speaker 1: and some of the best hunting in the country for deer.

522
00:29:38,120 --> 00:29:41,760
Speaker 1: But you know how much I drive due south and

523
00:29:41,880 --> 00:29:48,720
Speaker 1: come into this rough country to hunt. Yeah, after something different.

524
00:29:48,840 --> 00:29:50,880
Speaker 1: I mean if I was just if I was just

525
00:29:50,920 --> 00:29:54,040
Speaker 1: trying to kill big deer, I would forget this place.

526
00:29:55,240 --> 00:30:00,120
Speaker 1: And there's value. There's added value to anything the that

527
00:30:00,520 --> 00:30:04,920
Speaker 1: is perceived as valuable by the people that you value.

528
00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:08,240
Speaker 1: Should you follow me, your dad and your great uncle

529
00:30:09,000 --> 00:30:11,720
Speaker 1: I mean, not that hunting is about pleasing someone else,

530
00:30:11,800 --> 00:30:15,360
Speaker 1: but hunting does gain a lot of value from our

531
00:30:15,400 --> 00:30:19,760
Speaker 1: social connections massively. I thought before, like wood Clay newcom

532
00:30:19,880 --> 00:30:23,160
Speaker 1: hunt if I couldn't tell anyone or there was no

533
00:30:23,200 --> 00:30:26,560
Speaker 1: one connected to it that valued it as well. That's

534
00:30:26,560 --> 00:30:28,280
Speaker 1: a fine line to walk, though, because if you go

535
00:30:28,360 --> 00:30:30,680
Speaker 1: too far down that and then you say, well, are

536
00:30:30,720 --> 00:30:34,400
Speaker 1: you hunting just impress people? And the answer to that

537
00:30:34,520 --> 00:30:38,560
Speaker 1: is no. But when I kill a deer in these

538
00:30:38,600 --> 00:30:42,200
Speaker 1: mountains or bear, you're one of the first people I call,

539
00:30:42,560 --> 00:30:45,120
Speaker 1: are you not? And do you know why I call

540
00:30:45,200 --> 00:30:47,960
Speaker 1: you and not you know, my other buddy that I

541
00:30:48,040 --> 00:30:51,440
Speaker 1: hunt Canada with. I call you because you value this

542
00:30:51,520 --> 00:30:56,040
Speaker 1: place and and you know what I've just done, and

543
00:30:56,080 --> 00:30:59,000
Speaker 1: so you know, I reach out to the person that's

544
00:30:59,000 --> 00:31:03,520
Speaker 1: gonna probably validate that, you know what I mean. And

545
00:31:03,760 --> 00:31:05,760
Speaker 1: that's a that's a fine line to walk because you

546
00:31:05,800 --> 00:31:09,560
Speaker 1: know the trend of the age, especially with Instagram and

547
00:31:09,680 --> 00:31:14,440
Speaker 1: Scott's not on social media. Um, he's he's disconnected, which

548
00:31:14,480 --> 00:31:18,120
Speaker 1: is he's he's like a primitive man. Uh, we're getting

549
00:31:18,120 --> 00:31:21,760
Speaker 1: a high file. Both these guys aren't on social media.

550
00:31:22,120 --> 00:31:25,680
Speaker 1: You know, the trend of the ages that people are building,

551
00:31:25,720 --> 00:31:30,240
Speaker 1: these Instagram profiles and identity, they're just false. It's just

552
00:31:30,320 --> 00:31:33,560
Speaker 1: not who they are. They're they're doing things that they

553
00:31:33,560 --> 00:31:37,480
Speaker 1: wouldn't do except for that they're gonna they know they're

554
00:31:37,480 --> 00:31:39,720
Speaker 1: gonna get a good photo, put it on Instagram, get

555
00:31:39,720 --> 00:31:44,720
Speaker 1: immediate likes, they get a release of satisfaction inside of

556
00:31:44,960 --> 00:31:48,720
Speaker 1: feeling like they're something. So again, the pendulum is that.

557
00:31:49,240 --> 00:31:53,160
Speaker 1: But the core of something that I think is is

558
00:31:53,200 --> 00:31:57,320
Speaker 1: healthy is to have true relationships with people that they

559
00:31:57,320 --> 00:32:01,000
Speaker 1: can value and celebrate. You know, they can celebrate what

560
00:32:01,680 --> 00:32:05,520
Speaker 1: you've done, and I celebrate what you. I mean, you

561
00:32:05,600 --> 00:32:08,400
Speaker 1: text me pictures, called me when you kill something here too. Well,

562
00:32:08,440 --> 00:32:09,960
Speaker 1: it's funny you bring it up because when when you

563
00:32:10,000 --> 00:32:12,440
Speaker 1: came in, were and of course on the podcast you

564
00:32:12,480 --> 00:32:14,680
Speaker 1: can't tell where we're at, but we're in a room

565
00:32:14,720 --> 00:32:16,560
Speaker 1: here where we've got deer heads hanging on the wall

566
00:32:16,600 --> 00:32:18,720
Speaker 1: and different things, and we pointed out a deer that

567
00:32:18,760 --> 00:32:22,880
Speaker 1: I shot several years back with my bow. I shot

568
00:32:22,920 --> 00:32:27,600
Speaker 1: that deer, watched him just run out of sight, picked

569
00:32:27,680 --> 00:32:34,640
Speaker 1: up my phone and within five minutes I was texting you, man,

570
00:32:34,720 --> 00:32:37,480
Speaker 1: I've just shot a big deer. You know, I actually

571
00:32:37,520 --> 00:32:40,760
Speaker 1: had service there where I shot that deer. And you know,

572
00:32:40,800 --> 00:32:43,400
Speaker 1: that's what I couldn't wait to tell you because where

573
00:32:43,400 --> 00:32:45,760
Speaker 1: I was hunting was kind of in your neck of

574
00:32:45,760 --> 00:32:47,800
Speaker 1: the woods, like where you were you like to hunt,

575
00:32:47,920 --> 00:32:50,840
Speaker 1: and uh, I thought, Man, if anybody's gonna appreciate this clay,

576
00:32:50,840 --> 00:32:53,200
Speaker 1: he's gonna appreciate this. So, man, I I couldn't wait

577
00:32:53,240 --> 00:32:55,360
Speaker 1: to text you and tell you that I just shot

578
00:32:55,400 --> 00:32:57,000
Speaker 1: a big deer and I hadn't even trailed the deer

579
00:32:57,040 --> 00:32:59,040
Speaker 1: up yet or anything, but I knew, you know, the

580
00:32:59,120 --> 00:33:00,760
Speaker 1: arrow was good. I knew it was gonna be you know,

581
00:33:00,840 --> 00:33:03,120
Speaker 1: I knew it was gonna be a done deal, and

582
00:33:03,240 --> 00:33:06,240
Speaker 1: I just couldn't wait to tell you the story. But yeah,

583
00:33:05,600 --> 00:33:08,160
Speaker 1: I think there is a lot to what you just said.

584
00:33:10,200 --> 00:33:14,320
Speaker 1: If we didn't appreciate it together as a group, you know,

585
00:33:14,360 --> 00:33:16,400
Speaker 1: how interested would you be in honey? I don't know.

586
00:33:16,440 --> 00:33:18,040
Speaker 1: I don't do it to brag about it, but I

587
00:33:18,080 --> 00:33:21,160
Speaker 1: do it to share experiences with my closest friends and

588
00:33:21,600 --> 00:33:24,240
Speaker 1: people who appreciate what I appreciate and that type of thing,

589
00:33:24,400 --> 00:33:27,400
Speaker 1: you know. So, and just like you said earlier, you're

590
00:33:27,400 --> 00:33:30,160
Speaker 1: mentioned that this a big, long story. I drug out

591
00:33:30,160 --> 00:33:31,880
Speaker 1: and drug out, drug out, just to tell you I

592
00:33:31,880 --> 00:33:34,440
Speaker 1: shot a dough. Well Man, that was a big deal

593
00:33:34,480 --> 00:33:37,560
Speaker 1: to me, and it still is today. I'd still lead

594
00:33:37,600 --> 00:33:39,280
Speaker 1: you down a long story to tell you about a

595
00:33:39,320 --> 00:33:42,360
Speaker 1: dough I shot today. I still get appreciation for that,

596
00:33:42,440 --> 00:33:45,120
Speaker 1: Like I did you know twenty years ago whatever it was,

597
00:33:45,200 --> 00:33:48,000
Speaker 1: And I know you do too, and so that's why

598
00:33:48,040 --> 00:33:50,320
Speaker 1: I tell you the full story. I was thinking, Uh,

599
00:33:51,840 --> 00:33:55,680
Speaker 1: do you remember that dough in the snow in Madison County?

600
00:33:55,880 --> 00:33:58,480
Speaker 1: I do absolutely? Do you remember be chasing that fully

601
00:33:58,520 --> 00:34:02,440
Speaker 1: live dear? Yeah, dude, that was the greatest. I tell

602
00:34:02,480 --> 00:34:05,640
Speaker 1: that story about two or three times a year to yeah, yeah,

603
00:34:05,680 --> 00:34:07,720
Speaker 1: I tell you. I see, it's been so I bet

604
00:34:07,760 --> 00:34:10,279
Speaker 1: it's been fifteen years since I heard you tell that.

605
00:34:10,520 --> 00:34:12,719
Speaker 1: But I knew that you told that making fun of me.

606
00:34:13,320 --> 00:34:16,919
Speaker 1: Oh my goodness. So, yeah, we're in Madison County. Uh

607
00:34:17,200 --> 00:34:19,360
Speaker 1: up there, hunting in a in a management area. It

608
00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:23,120
Speaker 1: is snowed, which is pretty rare for a northwest Arkansas

609
00:34:23,920 --> 00:34:25,799
Speaker 1: and it was a pretty good snow like that, four

610
00:34:25,840 --> 00:34:27,200
Speaker 1: or five inches of snow on the ground, and we

611
00:34:27,280 --> 00:34:29,080
Speaker 1: just could not wait. It was still it was late

612
00:34:29,200 --> 00:34:31,640
Speaker 1: archery season week. When do you think it was January.

613
00:34:31,680 --> 00:34:34,920
Speaker 1: I'd say it was in January. Uh, probably in January.

614
00:34:35,000 --> 00:34:37,680
Speaker 1: So and it was cold, real cold. So anyway, we

615
00:34:37,719 --> 00:34:40,880
Speaker 1: go up there and spread out on you know that

616
00:34:40,960 --> 00:34:42,759
Speaker 1: this management has these food plots and I think you

617
00:34:42,800 --> 00:34:44,560
Speaker 1: and Josh said on some food plots for the evening,

618
00:34:44,600 --> 00:34:47,160
Speaker 1: and saw just a pile of deer that even if

619
00:34:47,160 --> 00:34:49,319
Speaker 1: I remember right, that was the day that I saw

620
00:34:49,560 --> 00:34:53,319
Speaker 1: like thirty three deer. Yeah. So and I go hunt

621
00:34:53,360 --> 00:34:56,560
Speaker 1: this whole trusty spot that I've hunted, you know, ten

622
00:34:56,640 --> 00:34:59,960
Speaker 1: times or more and on a just a game trap

623
00:35:00,520 --> 00:35:03,920
Speaker 1: and just kind of hoping for the best. And I

624
00:35:04,000 --> 00:35:07,200
Speaker 1: only saw five deer all evening like where you guys saw.

625
00:35:07,520 --> 00:35:09,839
Speaker 1: I think you and him together saw nearly fifty deer

626
00:35:09,880 --> 00:35:12,080
Speaker 1: or something. It was some crazy number. And so anyway,

627
00:35:12,160 --> 00:35:15,280
Speaker 1: I I see five deer, but I have this deer

628
00:35:15,320 --> 00:35:19,480
Speaker 1: come in and uh anyway, long story short, I get

629
00:35:19,480 --> 00:35:21,520
Speaker 1: a shot at this deer and it is not great,

630
00:35:21,960 --> 00:35:25,560
Speaker 1: Like I know, the arrow is a little back, it's

631
00:35:25,600 --> 00:35:29,040
Speaker 1: not great. Deer runs off. Anyway, I give it time,

632
00:35:29,040 --> 00:35:31,560
Speaker 1: I get down. I walk out there and you know,

633
00:35:31,600 --> 00:35:34,239
Speaker 1: the arrow looks pretty good and the blood looks pretty good.

634
00:35:34,239 --> 00:35:36,880
Speaker 1: Of course, in that snow, it just yeah, it just

635
00:35:36,960 --> 00:35:39,880
Speaker 1: jumps out. So, you know, I remember walking out and

636
00:35:39,920 --> 00:35:41,840
Speaker 1: waiting on you guys to come out. It was well

637
00:35:41,880 --> 00:35:44,000
Speaker 1: after dark by the time you guys made it out

638
00:35:44,040 --> 00:35:46,399
Speaker 1: to me. And anyway, um, I don't remember how much

639
00:35:46,400 --> 00:35:48,120
Speaker 1: time had passed, but quite a bit of time had passed.

640
00:35:48,120 --> 00:35:49,840
Speaker 1: And I said, you know, the blood looks good, the

641
00:35:49,920 --> 00:35:53,400
Speaker 1: arrow looks good. It may be better than what I

642
00:35:53,600 --> 00:35:55,799
Speaker 1: what I'm thinking. And so we decided we go down

643
00:35:55,800 --> 00:35:57,600
Speaker 1: and look at it, and sure enough, they're all look

644
00:35:57,680 --> 00:36:01,440
Speaker 1: pretty good. And and I think all kind of decided, hey,

645
00:36:01,480 --> 00:36:03,040
Speaker 1: I think this deer is dead, you know. So we

646
00:36:03,080 --> 00:36:05,880
Speaker 1: start trailing this deer and it's it's really easy to trail.

647
00:36:05,960 --> 00:36:08,600
Speaker 1: And somebody I don't remember who is me, you're Josh,

648
00:36:08,640 --> 00:36:11,000
Speaker 1: somebody shines up there and there is a deer standing

649
00:36:11,040 --> 00:36:15,280
Speaker 1: down there looking at us, right down the blood trail,

650
00:36:15,680 --> 00:36:19,880
Speaker 1: and we all just immediately thought, there's the deer. You know,

651
00:36:20,280 --> 00:36:23,040
Speaker 1: he's alive. Oh man, we're still alive. You know. We're

652
00:36:23,040 --> 00:36:26,600
Speaker 1: all just standing there trying to trying to decide how

653
00:36:26,640 --> 00:36:28,960
Speaker 1: we want to go about this. Do we just back out?

654
00:36:29,120 --> 00:36:30,920
Speaker 1: I mean, what is the deer like? As he betted?

655
00:36:30,920 --> 00:36:34,120
Speaker 1: We couldn't tell you know, it's dark. Clay's like, man,

656
00:36:34,160 --> 00:36:36,399
Speaker 1: I think that dear is betted, you know. And and

657
00:36:36,680 --> 00:36:38,120
Speaker 1: it was kind of down a ridge so and I

658
00:36:38,160 --> 00:36:40,600
Speaker 1: think it was I think it was laying down. It

659
00:36:40,640 --> 00:36:43,040
Speaker 1: may have been laying down. So we decided to deer,

660
00:36:43,320 --> 00:36:44,920
Speaker 1: give me that at least. Okay, I'll give you then.

661
00:36:45,040 --> 00:36:48,920
Speaker 1: So Clay just goes, you know what we need to do,

662
00:36:49,080 --> 00:36:51,239
Speaker 1: and I said, what's that. He goes, we just need

663
00:36:51,280 --> 00:36:56,640
Speaker 1: a bull rush that thing or jump on it. I'm like, okay,

664
00:36:56,680 --> 00:36:59,560
Speaker 1: you know that's something new, you know, give it a shot.

665
00:37:00,520 --> 00:37:04,040
Speaker 1: So anyway, Clay just says, let's go. I mean, he

666
00:37:04,080 --> 00:37:06,360
Speaker 1: takes off and Josh is right behind him, and I

667
00:37:06,360 --> 00:37:09,680
Speaker 1: mean it's just flashlight lights bouncing in the night down

668
00:37:09,719 --> 00:37:12,239
Speaker 1: the ridge and they run all the way off the

669
00:37:12,280 --> 00:37:16,839
Speaker 1: end of this ridge and I'm like, what is going on?

670
00:37:16,920 --> 00:37:19,319
Speaker 1: And I just kind of walked up there to a

671
00:37:19,360 --> 00:37:23,280
Speaker 1: deer dad laying on the ground. And they're still chasing

672
00:37:23,320 --> 00:37:27,120
Speaker 1: this deer off down the ridge. And finally they get

673
00:37:27,120 --> 00:37:29,560
Speaker 1: down at the bottom of the ridge and I'm like, hey, guys,

674
00:37:30,320 --> 00:37:34,360
Speaker 1: deer's right here. And they literally just ran right by it.

675
00:37:34,719 --> 00:37:37,480
Speaker 1: You'll read, right by the deer you know, you're in

676
00:37:37,520 --> 00:37:39,320
Speaker 1: such a such a rush to get off the ennery.

677
00:37:39,360 --> 00:37:41,000
Speaker 1: So that's a great story. I tell that a couple

678
00:37:41,040 --> 00:37:43,960
Speaker 1: three times. You're chasing the fully live deer. Yeah, I see.

679
00:37:44,080 --> 00:37:47,040
Speaker 1: Here's the way I remember it. I remember seeing the

680
00:37:47,080 --> 00:37:50,040
Speaker 1: deer and thinking it was bettered and just saying like,

681
00:37:50,120 --> 00:37:54,400
Speaker 1: there's a deer right there, and then it got up. Okay.

682
00:37:54,760 --> 00:37:57,879
Speaker 1: I feel like that's when I said let's go, let's go,

683
00:37:58,880 --> 00:38:02,960
Speaker 1: suckers getting away, and and so we just took on,

684
00:38:03,280 --> 00:38:07,279
Speaker 1: and I see what what you wouldn't know, or you

685
00:38:07,360 --> 00:38:10,319
Speaker 1: may have known. I got a pretty good history of

686
00:38:10,440 --> 00:38:15,080
Speaker 1: running stuff down. I got a pretty good history of

687
00:38:15,160 --> 00:38:19,600
Speaker 1: running stuff down. So you know that was that was

688
00:38:19,640 --> 00:38:22,640
Speaker 1: probably a couple of years after Well, I don't know

689
00:38:22,640 --> 00:38:25,120
Speaker 1: if I can tell that story on a podcast. M

690
00:38:25,360 --> 00:38:27,399
Speaker 1: that's a tough one. I had to wrestle a deer

691
00:38:27,440 --> 00:38:28,960
Speaker 1: down the middle of the road after I hit it

692
00:38:28,960 --> 00:38:31,319
Speaker 1: with my four wheeler one time. Do you remember that.

693
00:38:31,360 --> 00:38:34,799
Speaker 1: It's a wonder it didn't hurt you man on the

694
00:38:34,840 --> 00:38:38,400
Speaker 1: four wheeler park Oh it nearly. Yeah. I was running

695
00:38:38,440 --> 00:38:41,160
Speaker 1: about fifty five miles. I mean I was running full

696
00:38:41,239 --> 00:38:44,640
Speaker 1: tilt on a on a Yamaha three fifty twin Banshee

697
00:38:45,640 --> 00:38:49,760
Speaker 1: on out at uh Well out in the Washington National Forest.

698
00:38:50,800 --> 00:38:53,600
Speaker 1: I never saw the deer, and it just I just

699
00:38:53,719 --> 00:38:59,919
Speaker 1: felt something just smack me, just bam smack, and uh.

700
00:39:00,280 --> 00:39:03,759
Speaker 1: The four wheeler, it felt like, just moved sideways two

701
00:39:03,800 --> 00:39:06,479
Speaker 1: ft but didn't didn't get caught in the wheels, didn't

702
00:39:06,520 --> 00:39:09,680
Speaker 1: flip me, didn't erect me. Just slammed on the brakes

703
00:39:10,080 --> 00:39:14,000
Speaker 1: and turned around. And there was a deer flopping around,

704
00:39:14,040 --> 00:39:17,880
Speaker 1: like going off in the ditch. And so my dad

705
00:39:17,960 --> 00:39:20,080
Speaker 1: and a bunch of people were way behind us riding

706
00:39:20,160 --> 00:39:23,160
Speaker 1: slower four wheelers. I was riding the fast one, leading

707
00:39:23,160 --> 00:39:27,200
Speaker 1: out front. You know, in in this steer, it's clearly

708
00:39:28,040 --> 00:39:31,839
Speaker 1: I'm gonna die, but it's like running off and so man,

709
00:39:31,880 --> 00:39:35,120
Speaker 1: I just take after it and just just tackle the

710
00:39:35,200 --> 00:39:40,799
Speaker 1: steer and uh. And you can't hardly break a deer's neck.

711
00:39:41,200 --> 00:39:43,160
Speaker 1: Let me just tell you that when by twisting its

712
00:39:43,200 --> 00:39:47,000
Speaker 1: neck and anyway, my dad comes around the and and

713
00:39:47,120 --> 00:39:50,239
Speaker 1: my whole family comes around the corner and I'm laying

714
00:39:50,280 --> 00:39:52,240
Speaker 1: in the middle of the road with his flopping deer.

715
00:39:53,160 --> 00:39:54,759
Speaker 1: We got it. We we took it. We took him

716
00:39:54,760 --> 00:39:58,120
Speaker 1: out quickly, though, But you can. You can chase one

717
00:39:58,160 --> 00:40:00,919
Speaker 1: down if you have to. Part of what we wanted

718
00:40:00,960 --> 00:40:07,640
Speaker 1: to talk about was what you term the other day,

719
00:40:07,680 --> 00:40:10,879
Speaker 1: scot the death of the death of the sportsman. When

720
00:40:10,880 --> 00:40:13,840
Speaker 1: we were talking the other day, expounded on that to

721
00:40:13,920 --> 00:40:18,040
Speaker 1: me a little bit. Well, it's you know it, there's

722
00:40:18,040 --> 00:40:19,799
Speaker 1: a ton of rabbit trails you can go down while

723
00:40:19,840 --> 00:40:23,680
Speaker 1: talking about it. But you know, I think about how

724
00:40:23,719 --> 00:40:27,880
Speaker 1: I grew up hunting versus how my kids are hunting today,

725
00:40:28,120 --> 00:40:32,759
Speaker 1: and the how much difference there is between that, and

726
00:40:32,760 --> 00:40:35,200
Speaker 1: and then compound that to how my dad hunted when

727
00:40:35,239 --> 00:40:37,640
Speaker 1: he was a kid, and and so forth, and where

728
00:40:37,719 --> 00:40:43,200
Speaker 1: hunting is going. I guess I should say, and you

729
00:40:43,200 --> 00:40:45,880
Speaker 1: know when I when I was and I'm not an

730
00:40:45,880 --> 00:40:50,200
Speaker 1: old guy, but here here in the um washitals, even

731
00:40:50,200 --> 00:40:55,160
Speaker 1: in the eighties early nineties, deer were scarce, and um

732
00:40:55,200 --> 00:40:59,160
Speaker 1: it was you know, a feat to shoot a deer

733
00:40:59,280 --> 00:41:04,000
Speaker 1: of any kind, to like the smallest buck in the woods.

734
00:41:04,800 --> 00:41:07,600
Speaker 1: You know, it was a big deal. Uh, And it

735
00:41:07,640 --> 00:41:10,640
Speaker 1: was looked at as an accomplishment to shoot any kind

736
00:41:10,640 --> 00:41:14,920
Speaker 1: of a deer. And you know, hunting was done so

737
00:41:15,000 --> 00:41:18,560
Speaker 1: much differently then. You know, you you you went out

738
00:41:18,560 --> 00:41:22,400
Speaker 1: here on public land and you walked and walked and walked,

739
00:41:22,480 --> 00:41:25,280
Speaker 1: and you studied the land, and you studied the mass,

740
00:41:25,560 --> 00:41:29,680
Speaker 1: and you studied deer movement and dear sign and you

741
00:41:29,719 --> 00:41:33,400
Speaker 1: did all these things and tried to find the perfect

742
00:41:33,520 --> 00:41:36,680
Speaker 1: thing to to to set up on and to hunt,

743
00:41:37,000 --> 00:41:39,520
Speaker 1: and in most cases never saw a thing, you know.

744
00:41:40,160 --> 00:41:41,760
Speaker 1: And it wasn't that there wasn't deer in the area.

745
00:41:41,800 --> 00:41:43,680
Speaker 1: There just wasn't very many deer in the area. And

746
00:41:43,719 --> 00:41:47,520
Speaker 1: dear just for spread out so much wider than I

747
00:41:47,760 --> 00:41:50,520
Speaker 1: than I feel they are today. And so what it did,

748
00:41:50,680 --> 00:41:55,360
Speaker 1: is it it really it really caused you to study

749
00:41:55,400 --> 00:41:59,680
Speaker 1: the study harder and put in harder work on studying

750
00:42:00,000 --> 00:42:03,840
Speaker 1: actual dear habitat in their own environment and so on.

751
00:42:03,960 --> 00:42:06,200
Speaker 1: And so when and I think, where does that come from? Well,

752
00:42:06,520 --> 00:42:08,479
Speaker 1: you know, we talked about my great uncle and even

753
00:42:08,520 --> 00:42:10,960
Speaker 1: my grandfather and my dad. You know, they come up

754
00:42:11,000 --> 00:42:16,280
Speaker 1: when dear numbers in Arkansas were just you know, horrible,

755
00:42:16,719 --> 00:42:20,600
Speaker 1: and you know where you know, the total dear harvest

756
00:42:20,640 --> 00:42:23,480
Speaker 1: in the state in a year, especially when my great

757
00:42:23,520 --> 00:42:25,200
Speaker 1: uncle was hunting, you know, there wouldn't even be a

758
00:42:25,239 --> 00:42:28,960
Speaker 1: thousand deer checked and checked in is is killed in

759
00:42:28,960 --> 00:42:31,359
Speaker 1: the state of Arkansas in the entire year. But yet

760
00:42:31,400 --> 00:42:34,720
Speaker 1: they were killing deer back then, and you know those guys,

761
00:42:36,320 --> 00:42:39,880
Speaker 1: you know, we're hunting was different for them. We hunt.

762
00:42:40,120 --> 00:42:42,319
Speaker 1: What would you say, why would you say you hunt?

763
00:42:42,360 --> 00:42:47,160
Speaker 1: You hunt for what? That's a loaded question I do.

764
00:42:47,840 --> 00:42:52,040
Speaker 1: I mean, I hunt for I hunt for me, I

765
00:42:52,160 --> 00:42:55,440
Speaker 1: hunt for challenge, I hunt for adventure. I hunt immersed

766
00:42:55,480 --> 00:42:59,319
Speaker 1: into wild places. And that's why me and you get

767
00:42:59,360 --> 00:43:01,520
Speaker 1: along soil. It is because we hunt for other reasons.

768
00:43:01,600 --> 00:43:02,839
Speaker 1: You know. I think a lot of people right now

769
00:43:02,880 --> 00:43:06,080
Speaker 1: think about hunting as a sport. You know, it's a sport,

770
00:43:06,160 --> 00:43:10,120
Speaker 1: and every sport you ever play there you're trying to

771
00:43:10,160 --> 00:43:12,680
Speaker 1: win something, right, you're trying to be a winner or whatever.

772
00:43:13,160 --> 00:43:17,200
Speaker 1: You know, people in the fifties, go back as far

773
00:43:17,239 --> 00:43:19,480
Speaker 1: as you want, thirties, forties, fifties, sixties, whatever you want,

774
00:43:19,600 --> 00:43:22,040
Speaker 1: hunted more out of necessity than they did for sport.

775
00:43:22,120 --> 00:43:24,000
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't think if you asked somebody in

776
00:43:24,040 --> 00:43:27,399
Speaker 1: that team fifty five, you hunt for sport, and they,

777
00:43:27,719 --> 00:43:30,160
Speaker 1: you know, they say, no, I hunt to feed my

778
00:43:30,200 --> 00:43:33,680
Speaker 1: family or a hunt to you know, provide for somebody.

779
00:43:34,719 --> 00:43:37,759
Speaker 1: And so I think I said it earlier, but that

780
00:43:37,880 --> 00:43:42,239
Speaker 1: caused people if you knew what you harvested or what

781
00:43:42,320 --> 00:43:45,799
Speaker 1: you killed, or what you trapped or what you know,

782
00:43:46,000 --> 00:43:49,760
Speaker 1: caught uh fishing or whatever was going to feed your family,

783
00:43:50,440 --> 00:43:52,920
Speaker 1: you'd learn how to do it pretty well. You know,

784
00:43:52,960 --> 00:43:57,080
Speaker 1: if if it was something to sustain you to some degree,

785
00:43:57,120 --> 00:43:59,319
Speaker 1: maybe not a d percent, but just to say, maybe

786
00:43:59,360 --> 00:44:02,640
Speaker 1: it was thirty send of your food, maybe it's you'd

787
00:44:02,719 --> 00:44:05,440
Speaker 1: learn how to be very good at it, very quickly,

788
00:44:05,600 --> 00:44:08,440
Speaker 1: because your families can, especially if it was scarce. Yeah,

789
00:44:08,560 --> 00:44:10,520
Speaker 1: like it like it would have been back down. It's

790
00:44:10,640 --> 00:44:13,440
Speaker 1: hard to kill a deer. Correct. And so you know,

791
00:44:14,800 --> 00:44:19,400
Speaker 1: when I think about folks of that time period, let's say, fifties, sixties,

792
00:44:19,440 --> 00:44:24,400
Speaker 1: maybe even to the seventies, a lot of people trapped.

793
00:44:25,040 --> 00:44:27,360
Speaker 1: Trapping was a big deal, you know, and trapping is

794
00:44:27,400 --> 00:44:31,520
Speaker 1: becoming less and less popular every year that goes back. Then, First,

795
00:44:31,560 --> 00:44:35,000
Speaker 1: we're worth a whole lot of money, correct, Those hides

796
00:44:35,040 --> 00:44:39,120
Speaker 1: could be traded for cash, money that paid for stuff. Yeah,

797
00:44:39,200 --> 00:44:43,239
Speaker 1: and you know, you sit there and think nineteen even

798
00:44:43,239 --> 00:44:48,080
Speaker 1: in the nineteen seventies, you know, a raccoon hide was

799
00:44:48,120 --> 00:44:50,880
Speaker 1: bringing twenty dollars and you think, well, man, that's not

800
00:44:50,920 --> 00:44:53,279
Speaker 1: a whole lot of money. Minimum wage was a dollar

801
00:44:53,320 --> 00:44:59,040
Speaker 1: twenty five, So you could make and one night coon

802
00:44:59,160 --> 00:45:02,000
Speaker 1: hunting or coon trapping or whatever you however you wanted

803
00:45:02,040 --> 00:45:04,200
Speaker 1: to do it, you can make in one night what

804
00:45:04,360 --> 00:45:07,680
Speaker 1: people would work over a week. It was, and that

805
00:45:07,719 --> 00:45:09,959
Speaker 1: was a huge deal. And so you know, not only

806
00:45:10,040 --> 00:45:13,640
Speaker 1: was it sustainability for food and what you put on

807
00:45:13,680 --> 00:45:15,680
Speaker 1: your table, but it was it was income, you know.

808
00:45:15,760 --> 00:45:18,719
Speaker 1: And those guys trapped and when if you want to

809
00:45:18,840 --> 00:45:20,480
Speaker 1: I've always said this, but if you want to find

810
00:45:20,560 --> 00:45:25,479
Speaker 1: a really good hunter, find an overland trapper, and they'll

811
00:45:25,520 --> 00:45:27,520
Speaker 1: be one of the finest hunters you will ever be around,

812
00:45:27,719 --> 00:45:31,440
Speaker 1: because they have a they have an understanding of animal

813
00:45:31,520 --> 00:45:36,080
Speaker 1: behavior and movement unlike anybody else in the woods. And

814
00:45:36,120 --> 00:45:41,200
Speaker 1: those guys they didn't just trap. While they were trapping,

815
00:45:41,280 --> 00:45:44,480
Speaker 1: they were paying attention to everything around them. Deer tracks,

816
00:45:44,560 --> 00:45:47,840
Speaker 1: deer trails, you know, dear sign all those things, and

817
00:45:47,880 --> 00:45:51,719
Speaker 1: they and they studied deer at a level that we

818
00:45:51,840 --> 00:45:55,759
Speaker 1: don't today. Um, and I'll go a little further into

819
00:45:55,800 --> 00:46:00,239
Speaker 1: it later on, but those guys, I think you and

820
00:46:00,280 --> 00:46:02,000
Speaker 1: I were talking here while back, and I said, you know,

821
00:46:02,080 --> 00:46:05,920
Speaker 1: back back in those days, you inserted yourself into a

822
00:46:06,080 --> 00:46:12,360
Speaker 1: deer's home in his ecosystem, if you will, and tried

823
00:46:12,400 --> 00:46:17,400
Speaker 1: to put yourself in a place within his own domain

824
00:46:18,239 --> 00:46:20,279
Speaker 1: and tried to harvest that deer. And it was very

825
00:46:20,280 --> 00:46:22,320
Speaker 1: difficult to do because there wasn't a lot of deer,

826
00:46:22,400 --> 00:46:25,920
Speaker 1: and so you searched hie and low for a buck

827
00:46:26,600 --> 00:46:30,680
Speaker 1: to hunt back in those days. And then um put

828
00:46:30,680 --> 00:46:35,480
Speaker 1: all the pieces together. You know, those guys understood travel

829
00:46:35,640 --> 00:46:40,880
Speaker 1: paths and travel routes, and they understood you know, scrapes

830
00:46:40,920 --> 00:46:43,759
Speaker 1: and rubs and stuff that you know, you saw. We've

831
00:46:43,760 --> 00:46:46,719
Speaker 1: seen a million articles written over the years on how

832
00:46:46,760 --> 00:46:49,640
Speaker 1: to read deer scrapes and rubs and all that type stuff.

833
00:46:49,840 --> 00:46:53,160
Speaker 1: Those guys understood that stuff in the fifties, in the sixties,

834
00:46:53,280 --> 00:46:56,160
Speaker 1: you know, how to kill deer off of it. Anyway,

835
00:46:56,280 --> 00:46:59,640
Speaker 1: I'd understood the science behind it, but they understood what

836
00:46:59,800 --> 00:47:02,520
Speaker 1: it meant for deer movement and how to yeah, how

837
00:47:02,520 --> 00:47:04,919
Speaker 1: to find them. Yeah, without the you know, without all

838
00:47:04,920 --> 00:47:08,200
Speaker 1: the articles to read and and all the free information,

839
00:47:08,280 --> 00:47:10,680
Speaker 1: we get to get us ahead of the game, you know.

840
00:47:11,080 --> 00:47:15,640
Speaker 1: And so anyway is is times went along, Deer hunting

841
00:47:15,640 --> 00:47:19,719
Speaker 1: has changed a lot, and you know, and before I

842
00:47:19,760 --> 00:47:22,279
Speaker 1: speak anything, I want everybody to understand what I'm about

843
00:47:22,320 --> 00:47:24,800
Speaker 1: to say. I'm not trying to offend anybody, because here's

844
00:47:24,800 --> 00:47:27,680
Speaker 1: the here's the thing. I don't care how you like hunting.

845
00:47:28,200 --> 00:47:30,640
Speaker 1: I don't care if you if you hunt over bait,

846
00:47:30,719 --> 00:47:34,560
Speaker 1: if your dog hunt, if you do deer drives, if you,

847
00:47:34,680 --> 00:47:36,879
Speaker 1: I don't care how you like to hunt. Whatever suits

848
00:47:36,920 --> 00:47:39,279
Speaker 1: you is fine with me. So what I'm about to

849
00:47:39,280 --> 00:47:41,640
Speaker 1: say is gonna sound like I don't appreciate the way

850
00:47:41,640 --> 00:47:44,759
Speaker 1: people hunt today. I absolutely do. In fact, I participate

851
00:47:44,840 --> 00:47:47,320
Speaker 1: in in the very thing I'm about to talk about. Okay,

852
00:47:47,880 --> 00:47:51,839
Speaker 1: So I hope we offend everybody listening. So I think

853
00:47:51,880 --> 00:47:54,400
Speaker 1: some I think sometimes people take it as if I

854
00:47:54,440 --> 00:47:57,799
Speaker 1: don't agree with certain ways of hunting, that wrong. I

855
00:47:57,840 --> 00:48:01,439
Speaker 1: don't care. That's teach of their own. If you want

856
00:48:01,440 --> 00:48:03,920
Speaker 1: to un overbaate, un overbaate, man, I think it's great.

857
00:48:05,040 --> 00:48:08,719
Speaker 1: But you know, coming back to that, I think, um,

858
00:48:08,760 --> 00:48:12,759
Speaker 1: you know, today with game management, and I want to

859
00:48:12,760 --> 00:48:15,080
Speaker 1: I want to say that in quotations right game management,

860
00:48:15,080 --> 00:48:18,600
Speaker 1: we want to we're wanting to manage or the deer

861
00:48:18,640 --> 00:48:22,560
Speaker 1: that we that we're hunting now, or maybe it's bears

862
00:48:22,560 --> 00:48:25,400
Speaker 1: we're talking about. Maybe it's deer, maybe it's turkeys, whatever.

863
00:48:25,440 --> 00:48:28,560
Speaker 1: But we're in a game management mode these days, and

864
00:48:28,600 --> 00:48:34,200
Speaker 1: so now it's about let me create the ecosystem and

865
00:48:34,280 --> 00:48:37,760
Speaker 1: invite the deer into it, to the ecosystem that I've created,

866
00:48:37,840 --> 00:48:40,440
Speaker 1: and which is totally different. So if you take a

867
00:48:40,440 --> 00:48:42,760
Speaker 1: piece of property, whether you you're on a deer hunting

868
00:48:42,800 --> 00:48:44,840
Speaker 1: lease or maybe you're on a piece of private lands,

869
00:48:45,000 --> 00:48:47,960
Speaker 1: you have access to and and maybe you you plant

870
00:48:47,960 --> 00:48:51,640
Speaker 1: food plots, maybe you put in ponds for water sources,

871
00:48:51,680 --> 00:48:54,680
Speaker 1: maybe you put out corn feeders and run them year round,

872
00:48:54,800 --> 00:48:58,279
Speaker 1: or whatever it is to to create an ecosystem that

873
00:48:58,440 --> 00:49:02,800
Speaker 1: is very friendly to dear And so you nowadays, rather

874
00:49:02,880 --> 00:49:08,240
Speaker 1: than going into you know, a deer's you know home,

875
00:49:08,360 --> 00:49:11,480
Speaker 1: if you will, and try to hunt a deer from that,

876
00:49:12,000 --> 00:49:16,719
Speaker 1: we're creating an ecosystem that we know everything about. We

877
00:49:16,800 --> 00:49:20,840
Speaker 1: know every single square acre of it, where every pinch

878
00:49:20,880 --> 00:49:23,680
Speaker 1: point is, you know, we we we create it and

879
00:49:23,719 --> 00:49:27,160
Speaker 1: then we draw them in. And and that's not a again,

880
00:49:27,200 --> 00:49:29,520
Speaker 1: it's not a bad thing. It's just different. It's different.

881
00:49:29,520 --> 00:49:32,359
Speaker 1: It's a different there's reasons for that. There's a couple

882
00:49:32,360 --> 00:49:35,759
Speaker 1: of reasons. And and I think about where we're going

883
00:49:35,840 --> 00:49:38,200
Speaker 1: to from hunting, like there's in a lot of cases

884
00:49:38,239 --> 00:49:41,279
Speaker 1: you have to hunt that way. Let's say let's say

885
00:49:41,360 --> 00:49:45,200
Speaker 1: you you're on a hunting lease and with that hunting membership,

886
00:49:45,280 --> 00:49:48,319
Speaker 1: you get three stand locations and that's it. So you're

887
00:49:48,360 --> 00:49:51,200
Speaker 1: gonna do everything you can to attract dear to that place. Correct.

888
00:49:51,320 --> 00:49:53,319
Speaker 1: So you know you're gonna you're gonna put your stand

889
00:49:53,400 --> 00:49:55,640
Speaker 1: up and you gotta do whatever you can do to

890
00:49:55,719 --> 00:49:57,960
Speaker 1: get that dear to come in front of that stand.

891
00:49:58,719 --> 00:50:01,759
Speaker 1: And which is much different than having you know, a

892
00:50:01,880 --> 00:50:05,759
Speaker 1: million acres of national forest and trying to you know,

893
00:50:06,000 --> 00:50:09,600
Speaker 1: pinpointed ear down. And yeah, so it again, it's not

894
00:50:09,680 --> 00:50:12,839
Speaker 1: a negative thing. Well it could be, though, Scott. And

895
00:50:12,880 --> 00:50:15,960
Speaker 1: that's I think that's where we're going and and we've

896
00:50:16,000 --> 00:50:18,400
Speaker 1: talked about it on a couple of these recent podcasts.

897
00:50:18,560 --> 00:50:21,520
Speaker 1: Is that what's the end goal of this? Like where

898
00:50:21,520 --> 00:50:25,600
Speaker 1: does it? Where does it end up? Correct? Because me

899
00:50:25,680 --> 00:50:28,840
Speaker 1: and you we you know, I've killed deer overbait, my

900
00:50:28,960 --> 00:50:30,839
Speaker 1: kids have killed ever we can hunt. We can hunt

901
00:50:30,840 --> 00:50:33,000
Speaker 1: over bait in Arkansas, but I think we can and

902
00:50:33,200 --> 00:50:35,280
Speaker 1: there's a lot of places where you can't hunt deer overbait.

903
00:50:35,640 --> 00:50:38,160
Speaker 1: But I think we could say that even just building

904
00:50:38,239 --> 00:50:43,040
Speaker 1: food plots and manipulating habitat, Like maybe maybe that's the

905
00:50:43,080 --> 00:50:47,279
Speaker 1: phrase that we could use. Um. And there's so many

906
00:50:47,320 --> 00:50:51,640
Speaker 1: different levels that people get involved in this and and

907
00:50:51,640 --> 00:50:54,200
Speaker 1: and there's a lot of nuance inside of it, you know,

908
00:50:54,360 --> 00:50:57,560
Speaker 1: Like if you've only got thirty acres to hunt in

909
00:50:57,680 --> 00:51:01,120
Speaker 1: Arkansas and it's totally legal to put out bait, sure,

910
00:51:01,239 --> 00:51:03,080
Speaker 1: and you want to kill deer, and you want your

911
00:51:03,120 --> 00:51:06,359
Speaker 1: kids to kill deer, And boy, I can tell you

912
00:51:06,400 --> 00:51:09,000
Speaker 1: I know exactly how that works because you can sit

913
00:51:09,040 --> 00:51:13,919
Speaker 1: there all season and see just a handful of deer

914
00:51:13,960 --> 00:51:17,719
Speaker 1: on that thirty acres and have you know, struggle to

915
00:51:17,800 --> 00:51:20,200
Speaker 1: kill a deer. But do you put out some corn?

916
00:51:20,520 --> 00:51:24,439
Speaker 1: You're gonna kill some deer. Yeah, And it's it's hard

917
00:51:24,480 --> 00:51:26,840
Speaker 1: to fault the guy for that. No, you can't fault

918
00:51:26,840 --> 00:51:29,719
Speaker 1: the guy for that. But where does it lead though? Yeah?

919
00:51:29,760 --> 00:51:32,399
Speaker 1: And that's because what we're talking about here, it's it's

920
00:51:32,440 --> 00:51:35,680
Speaker 1: not it's not we're you know, we're both agreeing here.

921
00:51:35,719 --> 00:51:38,360
Speaker 1: That's it's not a bad way to to to shoot

922
00:51:38,360 --> 00:51:42,160
Speaker 1: a dear. I mean, that's perfectly acceptable. Might like you said,

923
00:51:42,200 --> 00:51:45,000
Speaker 1: my kids have killed deer over corn. I have no

924
00:51:45,080 --> 00:51:48,960
Speaker 1: problem with that. Um. What I see happening though, is

925
00:51:49,360 --> 00:51:53,280
Speaker 1: even in my own kids, and it's it's my fault

926
00:51:53,800 --> 00:51:56,239
Speaker 1: as a parent up in this point. Now. My kids

927
00:51:56,239 --> 00:52:02,200
Speaker 1: are still pretty young, but they don't understand what bucks on,

928
00:52:02,239 --> 00:52:05,400
Speaker 1: how to hunt bucks on. They don't understand how to hunt.

929
00:52:06,120 --> 00:52:09,600
Speaker 1: You know, I could drop my kids off in the

930
00:52:09,680 --> 00:52:12,160
Speaker 1: National Force and say go find the best place you

931
00:52:12,200 --> 00:52:13,920
Speaker 1: feel like to hunt a deer and they, you know,

932
00:52:14,840 --> 00:52:17,000
Speaker 1: they wouldn't know where to get. It'd be overwhelming to

933
00:52:17,080 --> 00:52:19,160
Speaker 1: them and they wouldn't understand, you know, to find the

934
00:52:19,200 --> 00:52:22,480
Speaker 1: pinch points, the finals, the places, the saddles and all

935
00:52:22,480 --> 00:52:26,400
Speaker 1: those things. And if they did, they'd sit there about

936
00:52:26,480 --> 00:52:28,719
Speaker 1: two days and not see anything and be like, let's

937
00:52:28,719 --> 00:52:31,439
Speaker 1: go back and hunt cornpie, you know, I mean, because

938
00:52:31,440 --> 00:52:35,160
Speaker 1: it's yeah, because it's so much easier. It's easier, and

939
00:52:35,160 --> 00:52:37,359
Speaker 1: it's far more. You're gonna see a lot more, dear,

940
00:52:37,400 --> 00:52:40,319
Speaker 1: if you do it that way. And you know, that's

941
00:52:40,360 --> 00:52:42,200
Speaker 1: kind of where we are kids, you know, I said,

942
00:52:42,280 --> 00:52:44,879
Speaker 1: say kids, adults were in a fast food society. Now

943
00:52:44,880 --> 00:52:46,920
Speaker 1: everybody wants something, they want it right now, you know,

944
00:52:47,000 --> 00:52:51,200
Speaker 1: and you know, so as a society, we're impatient. We're

945
00:52:51,280 --> 00:52:53,640
Speaker 1: very impatient, and so whatever we can do to to

946
00:52:53,760 --> 00:52:56,520
Speaker 1: speed it along. And the other thing is is, man,

947
00:52:56,560 --> 00:53:02,000
Speaker 1: we're busy. You knows about that last just last week,

948
00:53:02,040 --> 00:53:04,960
Speaker 1: about how time is a major limiting factor. It is.

949
00:53:05,600 --> 00:53:09,480
Speaker 1: So you know, our our grandfather's, our dad's, I mean

950
00:53:09,680 --> 00:53:14,040
Speaker 1: us twenty years ago, we just weren't as busy. We

951
00:53:14,080 --> 00:53:17,200
Speaker 1: may have worked as much, but there was less there

952
00:53:17,280 --> 00:53:22,160
Speaker 1: was there was there was more recreational time for the

953
00:53:22,160 --> 00:53:25,040
Speaker 1: most part. Yeah, And in in that recreational time, you

954
00:53:25,080 --> 00:53:30,040
Speaker 1: were outside. You know, my my parents grew up without television,

955
00:53:30,080 --> 00:53:31,799
Speaker 1: they grew you know what I mean. I mean what

956
00:53:31,840 --> 00:53:34,160
Speaker 1: you what time recreational time you had, you did it

957
00:53:34,200 --> 00:53:37,360
Speaker 1: outside doing something. And so you found yourself in the

958
00:53:37,400 --> 00:53:40,279
Speaker 1: woods more. And like I said before, you take my

959
00:53:40,360 --> 00:53:42,560
Speaker 1: grandfather and write great uncle and some of those guys,

960
00:53:42,600 --> 00:53:46,239
Speaker 1: I mean, their job was in the woods in a

961
00:53:46,320 --> 00:53:48,279
Speaker 1: lot of cases. And so man, they had all the

962
00:53:48,320 --> 00:53:50,400
Speaker 1: time in the world to study, dear and all that stuff.

963
00:53:50,560 --> 00:53:53,040
Speaker 1: As fast as we move in today's society, I mean,

964
00:53:53,040 --> 00:53:55,640
Speaker 1: there's just never any downtime, it feels like. And so

965
00:53:56,120 --> 00:54:01,360
Speaker 1: whatever you can do to better your chance for the

966
00:54:01,400 --> 00:54:03,920
Speaker 1: four days you get to hunt during season, you know,

967
00:54:03,960 --> 00:54:05,880
Speaker 1: And that's the other thing you have to consider. You know,

968
00:54:05,920 --> 00:54:07,520
Speaker 1: a lot of guys only get to hunt maybe three

969
00:54:07,600 --> 00:54:10,200
Speaker 1: or four days of the entire season. Maybe maybe they

970
00:54:10,239 --> 00:54:12,320
Speaker 1: take a week off, one week out of the entire

971
00:54:12,360 --> 00:54:15,520
Speaker 1: hunting season, and they put all their eggs into that basket.

972
00:54:15,800 --> 00:54:18,799
Speaker 1: They're gonna do whatever they can do to increase the

973
00:54:19,200 --> 00:54:24,120
Speaker 1: whatever they're gonna They're gonna so socially and functionally be

974
00:54:24,239 --> 00:54:29,200
Speaker 1: pressured to do whatever the regional norm is. I mean, like,

975
00:54:29,200 --> 00:54:32,160
Speaker 1: if you're hunting on a deer lease that's acres and

976
00:54:32,200 --> 00:54:34,879
Speaker 1: there's twenty five guys on that dear lease, and all

977
00:54:34,920 --> 00:54:37,080
Speaker 1: those twenty five guys are putting out corn in front

978
00:54:37,080 --> 00:54:41,000
Speaker 1: of their deerstand, then if you're gonna be successful on

979
00:54:41,040 --> 00:54:42,920
Speaker 1: that lease, you're gonna have to put out corn from

980
00:54:42,960 --> 00:54:45,319
Speaker 1: your deer stand, correct. I mean, you know that there's

981
00:54:45,320 --> 00:54:48,440
Speaker 1: probably a deeper way of thinking about it that might

982
00:54:48,520 --> 00:54:52,239
Speaker 1: be successful. But you know that's the idea, And so

983
00:54:52,320 --> 00:54:57,240
Speaker 1: the MICUs you have something. As we're discussing this, The

984
00:54:57,280 --> 00:55:01,160
Speaker 1: thing that I'm thinking about is Scott, is how much

985
00:55:01,239 --> 00:55:05,200
Speaker 1: does this change the value of hunting? You know what

986
00:55:05,320 --> 00:55:09,880
Speaker 1: I'm you value it more because you worked and it

987
00:55:10,000 --> 00:55:11,960
Speaker 1: was part of your it was well, even for your

988
00:55:12,000 --> 00:55:14,879
Speaker 1: grandfather and your father, it was part of a lifestyle.

989
00:55:15,520 --> 00:55:18,200
Speaker 1: It was the way they lived. It wasn't just something

990
00:55:18,239 --> 00:55:21,000
Speaker 1: that did did for recreation, it was it was part

991
00:55:21,040 --> 00:55:24,920
Speaker 1: of their life and something that was it was a necessity.

992
00:55:25,120 --> 00:55:29,480
Speaker 1: But you know, as it becomes easier and the pressure

993
00:55:30,160 --> 00:55:36,880
Speaker 1: to to um well is the habitat has changes, and

994
00:55:36,920 --> 00:55:39,920
Speaker 1: as people have less time and you know, food plots

995
00:55:39,920 --> 00:55:42,440
Speaker 1: and all this. I just think about what happens to

996
00:55:42,480 --> 00:55:45,560
Speaker 1: the value of hunting. You know, how how does a

997
00:55:45,680 --> 00:55:51,479
Speaker 1: hunter value hunting? And that's ultimately what we're what we're

998
00:55:51,520 --> 00:55:55,200
Speaker 1: sniffing out is like, wait a minute, does this have

999
00:55:55,360 --> 00:55:58,120
Speaker 1: the value that used to? But it's a slippery slope

1000
00:55:58,880 --> 00:56:04,239
Speaker 1: because they're not everybody And this is this is where

1001
00:56:04,239 --> 00:56:06,640
Speaker 1: I've come to, and I don't know the answer is

1002
00:56:06,680 --> 00:56:10,400
Speaker 1: that not everybody has to value hunting like you and

1003
00:56:10,440 --> 00:56:14,279
Speaker 1: I do, Scott, Mike doesn't. I mean really, Mike isn't

1004
00:56:14,360 --> 00:56:18,000
Speaker 1: that serious of a hunter, Like he's not trying to be.

1005
00:56:18,880 --> 00:56:21,440
Speaker 1: It's just a small part of his life, pretty small

1006
00:56:23,640 --> 00:56:25,960
Speaker 1: me and you. It's a big part of our life.

1007
00:56:26,320 --> 00:56:30,439
Speaker 1: It's a big part of our culture, our history, it's

1008
00:56:31,000 --> 00:56:36,000
Speaker 1: and so not everybody has to be like me and you.

1009
00:56:36,880 --> 00:56:40,680
Speaker 1: And that's the hard part because if we if we

1010
00:56:40,840 --> 00:56:43,480
Speaker 1: if we cheapen it, and I mean, I'm a massive

1011
00:56:43,520 --> 00:56:46,880
Speaker 1: proponent for baiting bears, and so I mean like I'm

1012
00:56:46,920 --> 00:56:49,520
Speaker 1: there's all kinds of nuance and all kind of different stories.

1013
00:56:51,320 --> 00:56:55,080
Speaker 1: But the problem is is that if we, if we

1014
00:56:55,160 --> 00:56:59,160
Speaker 1: make it so easy, well, there come a day when

1015
00:56:59,200 --> 00:57:02,279
Speaker 1: our kids because have not really earned it, when they

1016
00:57:02,280 --> 00:57:04,919
Speaker 1: don't really value it, and they quit fighting for it.

1017
00:57:05,719 --> 00:57:08,000
Speaker 1: In fifty years from now, when you and I are

1018
00:57:09,320 --> 00:57:13,600
Speaker 1: dang near hundred Scott, our kids will be like a

1019
00:57:13,840 --> 00:57:16,440
Speaker 1: hunt is not that important to me, and and it

1020
00:57:16,640 --> 00:57:20,240
Speaker 1: and so there in lies the thing Johnny Carroll saying

1021
00:57:20,240 --> 00:57:24,720
Speaker 1: the other day told me he quoted another author that said,

1022
00:57:26,480 --> 00:57:29,439
Speaker 1: we don't need more hunters, we need maybe we need

1023
00:57:29,560 --> 00:57:34,160
Speaker 1: better hunters, because we talked about needing more hunters like

1024
00:57:34,280 --> 00:57:38,720
Speaker 1: to for this thing to persist, and ultimately by liberalizing

1025
00:57:38,760 --> 00:57:44,160
Speaker 1: game laws, by making things easier, like we're making it

1026
00:57:44,280 --> 00:57:48,520
Speaker 1: easier for people to become hunters. And so the conversation

1027
00:57:48,560 --> 00:57:51,520
Speaker 1: we had was like, what if we took away everything

1028
00:57:51,600 --> 00:57:55,040
Speaker 1: that made it easy and just made it hard. And

1029
00:57:55,160 --> 00:57:58,000
Speaker 1: my point was, well, we'd lose everybody, we'd snuff it out,

1030
00:57:58,080 --> 00:58:02,400
Speaker 1: we'd snuff it out. But his point was maybe we wouldn't.

1031
00:58:02,720 --> 00:58:06,600
Speaker 1: Maybe we don't need more hunters, maybe we need better

1032
00:58:06,880 --> 00:58:08,880
Speaker 1: And by better hunters, it doesn't mean guys that are

1033
00:58:08,920 --> 00:58:13,200
Speaker 1: successful killing bigger bucks. By better hunters meaning people that

1034
00:58:14,840 --> 00:58:17,440
Speaker 1: really have a rich, deep experience insteade of hunting that's

1035
00:58:17,520 --> 00:58:20,439
Speaker 1: valuable for their life that they want to bring forward

1036
00:58:20,480 --> 00:58:25,200
Speaker 1: into future generations, you know. And but at the same

1037
00:58:25,240 --> 00:58:27,880
Speaker 1: time last podcast, I had a new hunter on a

1038
00:58:27,960 --> 00:58:31,040
Speaker 1: good friend of mine, and I encouraged to him. I said, man,

1039
00:58:31,200 --> 00:58:34,080
Speaker 1: you don't have to be a serious hunter. You could.

1040
00:58:34,120 --> 00:58:38,400
Speaker 1: You can hunt two days a year and that just

1041
00:58:38,480 --> 00:58:41,600
Speaker 1: be all the hunting you do. And you have as

1042
00:58:41,680 --> 00:58:46,760
Speaker 1: much input into conservation in some ways as I do,

1043
00:58:47,280 --> 00:58:49,600
Speaker 1: because a lot of what we talked about now is

1044
00:58:49,640 --> 00:58:54,800
Speaker 1: conservation dollars, Like what money does hunting produce that is

1045
00:58:54,880 --> 00:58:58,360
Speaker 1: going to save habitat that's going to and it's it's

1046
00:58:58,400 --> 00:59:01,280
Speaker 1: that is more crucial in different parts the country than

1047
00:59:01,440 --> 00:59:04,920
Speaker 1: maybe even here. But like you know, if there's no hunters,

1048
00:59:05,040 --> 00:59:07,960
Speaker 1: Arkansas Gaming Fish Commission isn't funded. Probably about half of

1049
00:59:08,000 --> 00:59:10,160
Speaker 1: their funding comes from I don't know if that's the

1050
00:59:10,200 --> 00:59:13,800
Speaker 1: exact data, But a lot of their funding comes from

1051
00:59:14,120 --> 00:59:18,080
Speaker 1: the sale of of hunting licenses. Well, Jonathan Webster hunts

1052
00:59:18,080 --> 00:59:19,840
Speaker 1: two days a year and buys a twenty five dollar

1053
00:59:19,920 --> 00:59:23,400
Speaker 1: sportsman's license. Clay Newcom hunts x number of days a

1054
00:59:23,480 --> 00:59:28,200
Speaker 1: year by hunting license just the same, So he's valuable.

1055
00:59:29,160 --> 00:59:32,560
Speaker 1: But if he's hunting two days a year in Arkansas,

1056
00:59:33,240 --> 00:59:37,520
Speaker 1: he's probably gonna be sitting over some corn. He's bad

1057
00:59:37,600 --> 00:59:39,800
Speaker 1: for that. Well, it's only two days he's guns, so yes,

1058
00:59:40,000 --> 00:59:44,000
Speaker 1: I mean, but are his kids gonna value hunting the

1059
00:59:44,000 --> 00:59:48,840
Speaker 1: way that our kids hopefully do? Yeah, that makes me worry.

1060
00:59:48,920 --> 00:59:52,360
Speaker 1: You know, I thought about something today sitting there thinking.

1061
00:59:52,400 --> 00:59:55,600
Speaker 1: You know, you said, if we if we water if

1062
00:59:55,600 --> 00:59:57,480
Speaker 1: we're cheapen it, or if we water it down, or

1063
00:59:57,520 --> 01:00:00,240
Speaker 1: if we make it too easier we you know, ki kids,

1064
01:00:01,040 --> 01:00:04,000
Speaker 1: what kids have a deep appreciation for hunting like you

1065
01:00:04,040 --> 01:00:06,040
Speaker 1: and I do? And you said, well, you know, you

1066
01:00:06,080 --> 01:00:08,440
Speaker 1: don't have to have a deep appreciation. I get that,

1067
01:00:10,000 --> 01:00:12,440
Speaker 1: but somebody does in the future. You know, That's what

1068
01:00:12,640 --> 01:00:16,760
Speaker 1: that's my problem is is in you know, the future's

1069
01:00:17,080 --> 01:00:20,040
Speaker 1: infinity or whatever. But you know, you've got ten years

1070
01:00:20,080 --> 01:00:22,080
Speaker 1: from now, or let's say when me and you were

1071
01:00:22,120 --> 01:00:26,440
Speaker 1: gone and our kids are grown men with their own families, Well,

1072
01:00:26,480 --> 01:00:28,640
Speaker 1: they have an appreciation for hunting that me and you did.

1073
01:00:28,800 --> 01:00:31,400
Speaker 1: And what what I worry about is if they don't,

1074
01:00:33,080 --> 01:00:35,640
Speaker 1: are they going to fight for it as hard as

1075
01:00:36,000 --> 01:00:37,920
Speaker 1: me and you would fight for our ability to hunt

1076
01:00:37,960 --> 01:00:41,480
Speaker 1: every day? And so that worries me in the future.

1077
01:00:41,960 --> 01:00:43,840
Speaker 1: And I think the answer to that is, no, they wouldn't.

1078
01:00:44,280 --> 01:00:49,360
Speaker 1: And I mean, life is full of fights, and if

1079
01:00:49,400 --> 01:00:52,600
Speaker 1: you don't really believe in something, you're not going to

1080
01:00:52,680 --> 01:00:54,960
Speaker 1: I mean, life is full of fights in terms of

1081
01:00:55,960 --> 01:00:59,000
Speaker 1: a metaphorical fight of just time. I mean, like it's

1082
01:00:59,040 --> 01:01:02,240
Speaker 1: really easy to not for the kids of even hunters

1083
01:01:02,240 --> 01:01:04,720
Speaker 1: to not really latch onto it because of the pool

1084
01:01:05,200 --> 01:01:08,880
Speaker 1: of society. It's so strong right now on our kids.

1085
01:01:09,480 --> 01:01:12,480
Speaker 1: And it's not necessarily bad, but you know what I mean,

1086
01:01:12,480 --> 01:01:16,439
Speaker 1: it's like there's so much a kid could be raised

1087
01:01:16,480 --> 01:01:18,080
Speaker 1: up by a guy like mirror you and not even

1088
01:01:18,120 --> 01:01:22,960
Speaker 1: be a hunter, which is just bizarre. I mean, because

1089
01:01:23,000 --> 01:01:25,600
Speaker 1: there's so much pulling on them. So I mean, the

1090
01:01:27,160 --> 01:01:30,240
Speaker 1: will they value hunting enough to even teach their kids,

1091
01:01:30,680 --> 01:01:33,760
Speaker 1: that's the question. And and you know, and then there

1092
01:01:33,800 --> 01:01:35,920
Speaker 1: it lies another question, why do we care of hunting?

1093
01:01:36,000 --> 01:01:40,200
Speaker 1: Last beyond us? Why do we care? Why do you care?

1094
01:01:40,640 --> 01:01:42,960
Speaker 1: And And that's where you where, that's where you arrive

1095
01:01:43,080 --> 01:01:46,120
Speaker 1: when you when you start thinking about that, you think, well,

1096
01:01:46,240 --> 01:01:48,200
Speaker 1: if it doesn't matter to our kids, what does it

1097
01:01:48,240 --> 01:01:50,360
Speaker 1: matter to us when we're gone? You know, I mean,

1098
01:01:50,440 --> 01:01:53,360
Speaker 1: what does Yeah? I get what exactly what? You have

1099
01:01:53,440 --> 01:01:56,120
Speaker 1: an answer? I don't. I mean I feel like, do

1100
01:01:56,160 --> 01:02:01,520
Speaker 1: you have an answer? Mike? Uh? I'm interrupted both of you.

1101
01:02:01,800 --> 01:02:05,280
Speaker 1: I think I think that And I said this before, Uh,

1102
01:02:05,320 --> 01:02:07,320
Speaker 1: I said on the last podcast. I'll say it again.

1103
01:02:07,800 --> 01:02:11,960
Speaker 1: But if my son's couldn't go up on this mountain

1104
01:02:12,000 --> 01:02:16,240
Speaker 1: over here and hunt a bear thirty years from now,

1105
01:02:16,360 --> 01:02:20,040
Speaker 1: forty years from now, if my son bart Newcomb couldn't

1106
01:02:20,080 --> 01:02:22,600
Speaker 1: drive up their Parker's truck, walk up there and kill

1107
01:02:22,640 --> 01:02:27,880
Speaker 1: a bear, I fear that he would be something different

1108
01:02:28,480 --> 01:02:32,080
Speaker 1: than me. Yeah. That may not be in and of

1109
01:02:32,160 --> 01:02:36,640
Speaker 1: itself wrong, but the but but we have survived as

1110
01:02:36,680 --> 01:02:39,760
Speaker 1: a people. I mean, the whole idea of parenthood is

1111
01:02:39,800 --> 01:02:43,520
Speaker 1: that you're passing values into your kids. You're passing values

1112
01:02:43,640 --> 01:02:47,760
Speaker 1: because whatever we did worked for us. I mean, do

1113
01:02:47,800 --> 01:02:50,280
Speaker 1: you see the logic I mean, like, as a parent,

1114
01:02:50,360 --> 01:02:54,400
Speaker 1: you want your kid essentially to be kind of like

1115
01:02:54,520 --> 01:02:56,280
Speaker 1: you. You You don't. You don't raise up a kid just

1116
01:02:56,360 --> 01:03:00,960
Speaker 1: hoping they're gonna go do something radic clearly different than you.

1117
01:03:01,000 --> 01:03:03,000
Speaker 1: And I'm not saying that's necessarily right or wrong, but

1118
01:03:03,080 --> 01:03:07,560
Speaker 1: just that's the nature of parenthood. Deep down inside, I

1119
01:03:07,640 --> 01:03:11,120
Speaker 1: want my sons to kind of be like me. And

1120
01:03:11,160 --> 01:03:13,120
Speaker 1: now they may not be big hunters, and I've told

1121
01:03:13,160 --> 01:03:17,160
Speaker 1: them deliberately many times, you don't have to take hunting

1122
01:03:17,200 --> 01:03:19,280
Speaker 1: as serious as I have, you know, kind of de

1123
01:03:19,480 --> 01:03:21,800
Speaker 1: escalating the pressure because I take it serio. It's my job.

1124
01:03:21,840 --> 01:03:24,000
Speaker 1: I mean, it's like we talked about, it is a

1125
01:03:24,040 --> 01:03:27,080
Speaker 1: big part of our life. And I've intentionally de escalated

1126
01:03:27,160 --> 01:03:30,960
Speaker 1: that inside my family, kind of let them approach hunting

1127
01:03:31,000 --> 01:03:35,160
Speaker 1: at their own pace, you know. But deep down, I

1128
01:03:35,200 --> 01:03:39,440
Speaker 1: hope that they value it. And I hope that, you know,

1129
01:03:39,600 --> 01:03:42,720
Speaker 1: should time persist and I grow to be an old

1130
01:03:42,760 --> 01:03:45,200
Speaker 1: man and can't go up on that mountain, that they

1131
01:03:45,240 --> 01:03:47,280
Speaker 1: come and tell me stories of them and their sons

1132
01:03:47,320 --> 01:03:50,280
Speaker 1: going up on that mountain, and that would be valuable

1133
01:03:51,000 --> 01:03:55,960
Speaker 1: to me. I think that's true of every every generation.

1134
01:03:56,040 --> 01:04:00,840
Speaker 1: Like you said, I think Stonemason's building Gothic person cathedrals,

1135
01:04:00,840 --> 01:04:06,840
Speaker 1: and twelve fifty wanted their children to be Stonemasons. And

1136
01:04:06,840 --> 01:04:12,440
Speaker 1: then there came a day where technology moved, priorities moved.

1137
01:04:13,760 --> 01:04:18,040
Speaker 1: You know, life goes on and it's it's continually changes,

1138
01:04:18,400 --> 01:04:20,920
Speaker 1: and there came a day where they didn't need the

1139
01:04:20,920 --> 01:04:25,560
Speaker 1: Stonemasons anymore. And there was there was a generation that said, well,

1140
01:04:25,600 --> 01:04:28,600
Speaker 1: I guess my my kids aren't gonna be Stonemasons because

1141
01:04:28,920 --> 01:04:34,240
Speaker 1: we don't build cathedrals anymore. And that's true of you

1142
01:04:34,280 --> 01:04:38,040
Speaker 1: can look at that in many, many areas of life

1143
01:04:38,200 --> 01:04:41,800
Speaker 1: where our parents hope their children have this experience or

1144
01:04:41,960 --> 01:04:45,040
Speaker 1: value this because it's so important to the parent. But

1145
01:04:45,520 --> 01:04:50,680
Speaker 1: things move on and those those opportunities have changed, the

1146
01:04:50,760 --> 01:04:54,040
Speaker 1: circumstances have changed. So does that mean I mean some

1147
01:04:54,080 --> 01:04:56,760
Speaker 1: people would predict that modern hunting that we know in

1148
01:04:56,800 --> 01:05:00,360
Speaker 1: North America will not exist as it is in next

1149
01:05:00,960 --> 01:05:04,440
Speaker 1: fifty six years. That's a bizarre and scary thought to me.

1150
01:05:05,640 --> 01:05:08,760
Speaker 1: I mean, and it's truth. We are sheltered Scott living

1151
01:05:08,800 --> 01:05:12,120
Speaker 1: here in Arkansas, but in and you've heard me talk

1152
01:05:12,200 --> 01:05:15,560
Speaker 1: about being on the National Bear scene. Of all scenes,

1153
01:05:16,480 --> 01:05:24,520
Speaker 1: I see firsthand the you know, what's happening nationally? Um

1154
01:05:24,560 --> 01:05:27,080
Speaker 1: and and there there is some good news inside of

1155
01:05:27,560 --> 01:05:31,200
Speaker 1: inside of hunter recruitment and inside of public perception of hunting.

1156
01:05:31,840 --> 01:05:34,120
Speaker 1: But but with what we're talking about is even a

1157
01:05:34,200 --> 01:05:38,840
Speaker 1: layer deeper than that. We're talking about not what other

1158
01:05:38,840 --> 01:05:41,560
Speaker 1: people think of us. Are not a democratic process that's

1159
01:05:41,560 --> 01:05:46,200
Speaker 1: gonna influence our lives. We're talking about the very fabric

1160
01:05:46,240 --> 01:05:51,480
Speaker 1: of hunting changing, you know, and uh and in and

1161
01:05:51,600 --> 01:05:55,160
Speaker 1: ultimately in forty fifty years will the hunters be the same.

1162
01:05:55,360 --> 01:06:00,160
Speaker 1: But could they have said the same thing, um in

1163
01:06:01,800 --> 01:06:06,080
Speaker 1: when ger Stoker was pounding around out in these mountains

1164
01:06:06,120 --> 01:06:10,720
Speaker 1: and buckskin that he made shooting deer with you know,

1165
01:06:10,840 --> 01:06:15,000
Speaker 1: single shot round bullet muzzloaders. I mean, like, would he

1166
01:06:15,040 --> 01:06:18,160
Speaker 1: have said, Man, these guys coming up aren't gonna know

1167
01:06:18,240 --> 01:06:21,880
Speaker 1: about this. It's gonna run hunting. I don't know, he

1168
01:06:21,960 --> 01:06:26,680
Speaker 1: probably he probably did. Mike briefly talked about photography. You

1169
01:06:26,720 --> 01:06:31,320
Speaker 1: said something earlier about how Mike drew the same parallel

1170
01:06:31,520 --> 01:06:36,040
Speaker 1: to what we're saying about photography. Uh, about how the

1171
01:06:36,080 --> 01:06:39,080
Speaker 1: guys used to haul in, Like photography used to be

1172
01:06:39,120 --> 01:06:42,240
Speaker 1: so hard and now it's so easy. And in some

1173
01:06:42,280 --> 01:06:46,360
Speaker 1: ways it has cheapened this thing so very much, very much.

1174
01:06:46,400 --> 01:06:51,240
Speaker 1: So I was telling Clay about UM photographers that were

1175
01:06:51,560 --> 01:06:54,080
Speaker 1: especially out of West guy by the name of Edward

1176
01:06:54,120 --> 01:07:01,480
Speaker 1: my Bridge, William, Henry Jackson, Um, Edward Curtis, their number

1177
01:07:01,520 --> 01:07:04,640
Speaker 1: of them, that especially the guys who were first guys

1178
01:07:04,640 --> 01:07:08,920
Speaker 1: who went into Yosemite Valley. They would have to backpack

1179
01:07:09,000 --> 01:07:13,520
Speaker 1: in about a ton of equipment with probably six seven

1180
01:07:13,600 --> 01:07:17,040
Speaker 1: eight mules. There were no roads, and it would take,

1181
01:07:17,080 --> 01:07:22,080
Speaker 1: you know, entire summer. And they had big glass plate negatives,

1182
01:07:22,200 --> 01:07:25,000
Speaker 1: and it was when you set up for a scene,

1183
01:07:25,040 --> 01:07:27,280
Speaker 1: you better make sure it's what you want and you

1184
01:07:27,400 --> 01:07:29,960
Speaker 1: better get it right because you only had so many

1185
01:07:30,000 --> 01:07:32,760
Speaker 1: negatives you could carry with you, and so it was

1186
01:07:32,800 --> 01:07:34,840
Speaker 1: a lot of hard work. You had to know the light,

1187
01:07:35,000 --> 01:07:37,680
Speaker 1: the conditions. They would scout for days to find the

1188
01:07:37,720 --> 01:07:40,880
Speaker 1: best advantage point. And so when they came back with

1189
01:07:40,920 --> 01:07:42,920
Speaker 1: a negative and then made a print out of it,

1190
01:07:42,960 --> 01:07:45,280
Speaker 1: I mean, it was something kind of like coming home

1191
01:07:45,280 --> 01:07:48,160
Speaker 1: with that one dough out of the washing toss. I am,

1192
01:07:48,200 --> 01:07:51,680
Speaker 1: you know, this is special to me. Um. And then

1193
01:07:51,680 --> 01:07:55,680
Speaker 1: you advanced forward and the film films got different, you know,

1194
01:07:55,800 --> 01:07:58,600
Speaker 1: film film came out and cameras got different. They got

1195
01:07:58,720 --> 01:08:02,960
Speaker 1: much much much smaller, and the sense of craft, and

1196
01:08:02,960 --> 01:08:05,560
Speaker 1: I think that's what I feel in your family is

1197
01:08:05,600 --> 01:08:08,200
Speaker 1: just a sense of craft of hunting, and that sense

1198
01:08:08,240 --> 01:08:12,760
Speaker 1: of craft began to be lost. Inside of photography. You

1199
01:08:12,800 --> 01:08:15,360
Speaker 1: would spend hours in a dark room and trying to

1200
01:08:15,360 --> 01:08:18,680
Speaker 1: get a perfect print and making sure you understood how

1201
01:08:18,680 --> 01:08:22,240
Speaker 1: to develop the negative, and and very sense of learning

1202
01:08:22,280 --> 01:08:24,639
Speaker 1: how to be very sensitive to the light. Because of that,

1203
01:08:25,240 --> 01:08:27,720
Speaker 1: and then digital, the digital came age, and this is

1204
01:08:27,760 --> 01:08:31,080
Speaker 1: something you know that's in definitely in our lifetime. I

1205
01:08:31,080 --> 01:08:37,719
Speaker 1: can almost tell you the year a massive shift took

1206
01:08:37,720 --> 01:08:41,880
Speaker 1: place inside of photography, and by two thousand six photographers

1207
01:08:41,880 --> 01:08:45,280
Speaker 1: were throwing away dark room equipment and selling every film

1208
01:08:45,320 --> 01:08:49,000
Speaker 1: camera they had, and digital digital age was absolutely here.

1209
01:08:49,160 --> 01:08:54,679
Speaker 1: And now everybody is a photographer. Everybody can produce thirty

1210
01:08:54,720 --> 01:08:58,160
Speaker 1: by forty gigantic prints in their house with their own printer,

1211
01:08:58,479 --> 01:09:02,559
Speaker 1: and and what that done. As someone who's I mean,

1212
01:09:02,680 --> 01:09:04,840
Speaker 1: is it? Is it good or is it bad? Can

1213
01:09:04,920 --> 01:09:06,840
Speaker 1: you answer it? I can. I've never been able to

1214
01:09:06,920 --> 01:09:08,720
Speaker 1: say whether it's good or bad. I can only say

1215
01:09:08,720 --> 01:09:12,960
Speaker 1: that it is. It just is what it is. And

1216
01:09:13,560 --> 01:09:16,759
Speaker 1: there's part of me that misses the craft and misses

1217
01:09:16,800 --> 01:09:19,879
Speaker 1: that sense of craft craft because the life was invested

1218
01:09:19,920 --> 01:09:22,320
Speaker 1: inside of it and a love was developed inside of it.

1219
01:09:22,920 --> 01:09:27,040
Speaker 1: Now it's just something that feels it's easy, it's quickly,

1220
01:09:27,640 --> 01:09:29,560
Speaker 1: it's quick, and it's a quick return and there's a

1221
01:09:29,640 --> 01:09:31,920
Speaker 1: quick reward and then you're off to the next thing.

1222
01:09:32,439 --> 01:09:34,800
Speaker 1: I like. I like that you brought that word in.

1223
01:09:35,520 --> 01:09:38,479
Speaker 1: It was craft. It was it was a craft, like

1224
01:09:38,520 --> 01:09:42,320
Speaker 1: the craft of hunting, because I think that's what essentially,

1225
01:09:42,560 --> 01:09:46,040
Speaker 1: that's what a lot of these modern things that we're

1226
01:09:46,040 --> 01:09:49,280
Speaker 1: doing takes away, takes away the craft of it, and

1227
01:09:49,320 --> 01:09:53,679
Speaker 1: that's what someone that's what we value inside of hunting.

1228
01:09:55,720 --> 01:09:58,799
Speaker 1: But at the same time, the only reason Clay newcomes

1229
01:09:58,840 --> 01:10:04,519
Speaker 1: a photographers because it digital digital cameras. Mike Schultz, there

1230
01:10:04,560 --> 01:10:08,479
Speaker 1: you go in in. The only reason some of these

1231
01:10:08,479 --> 01:10:12,240
Speaker 1: guys are are hunting is because it's easier than it

1232
01:10:12,320 --> 01:10:17,040
Speaker 1: used to be. Yeah, you know, every every ounce of society.

1233
01:10:17,080 --> 01:10:21,320
Speaker 1: What we're experiencing is just a societal shift in every way.

1234
01:10:21,360 --> 01:10:24,120
Speaker 1: I mean, I think about coon hunting, I probably wouldn't

1235
01:10:24,160 --> 01:10:25,680
Speaker 1: be a coon hunter to day if it wasn't for

1236
01:10:25,840 --> 01:10:28,839
Speaker 1: GPS technology. When I was a kid in these mountains,

1237
01:10:28,880 --> 01:10:31,040
Speaker 1: turn a loose dogs that just had a leather collar on.

1238
01:10:32,800 --> 01:10:35,519
Speaker 1: I mean, like for real, I mean dogs go out

1239
01:10:35,520 --> 01:10:36,800
Speaker 1: of here and you don't know where they're at, you

1240
01:10:36,800 --> 01:10:39,720
Speaker 1: stay out all night. Geez. I don't know if I

1241
01:10:39,720 --> 01:10:41,919
Speaker 1: would be a coon hunter if I didn't have GPS,

1242
01:10:41,960 --> 01:10:44,679
Speaker 1: because GPS you know exactly where they're at. If they're

1243
01:10:44,720 --> 01:10:47,840
Speaker 1: not barking, then there half mile away. You drive over

1244
01:10:47,880 --> 01:10:50,800
Speaker 1: there and catch them and go home. And uh, you

1245
01:10:50,800 --> 01:10:53,840
Speaker 1: know they're going towards a road and they're gonna drive

1246
01:10:54,080 --> 01:10:56,320
Speaker 1: get out on the highway and get hit. You tone

1247
01:10:56,360 --> 01:10:59,400
Speaker 1: them and they turn around and come back like you

1248
01:10:59,439 --> 01:11:02,720
Speaker 1: would never on. So my point is somebody could an

1249
01:11:02,720 --> 01:11:05,360
Speaker 1: old coon hunter could be sitting here going Clay, you

1250
01:11:05,400 --> 01:11:08,360
Speaker 1: don't even know what coon hunt is. Coon hunting is

1251
01:11:08,400 --> 01:11:11,280
Speaker 1: when you turn a dog loose and you're committed, you're

1252
01:11:11,280 --> 01:11:13,840
Speaker 1: committed to listen to his bark, You're committed to know

1253
01:11:14,320 --> 01:11:17,880
Speaker 1: where he's probably gonna run. You're committed to know you know,

1254
01:11:17,960 --> 01:11:21,000
Speaker 1: you're you're you know the craft of coon. You know

1255
01:11:21,040 --> 01:11:22,639
Speaker 1: that you turn him loose here, that dog is probably

1256
01:11:22,640 --> 01:11:25,679
Speaker 1: gonna end up on the backside of that ridge, way

1257
01:11:25,760 --> 01:11:28,920
Speaker 1: up in that holiday treat. You know, Clay Nuclem doesn't

1258
01:11:28,960 --> 01:11:31,640
Speaker 1: know that because Clay has a GPS and it's just

1259
01:11:31,680 --> 01:11:35,200
Speaker 1: like you know, so, I think what we're experiencing is

1260
01:11:35,840 --> 01:11:39,160
Speaker 1: is happening all through society. But our problem is is

1261
01:11:39,160 --> 01:11:43,760
Speaker 1: that the consequences of of what we're talking about is significant.

1262
01:11:44,280 --> 01:11:47,160
Speaker 1: You know, nobody's gonna quit. Photography isn't gonna cease to

1263
01:11:47,200 --> 01:11:52,599
Speaker 1: exist because people it makes it easier. It's actually probably

1264
01:11:52,640 --> 01:11:58,439
Speaker 1: going to grow absolutely. But maybe that's what is happening

1265
01:11:58,439 --> 01:12:01,400
Speaker 1: with hunting. I mean, if we and that's the question

1266
01:12:01,760 --> 01:12:04,559
Speaker 1: is if we make it easier, are more people gonna

1267
01:12:04,560 --> 01:12:08,080
Speaker 1: do it and it's gonna become, you know, something better

1268
01:12:08,120 --> 01:12:11,479
Speaker 1: than it was. Do you see what I'm saying? Yeah,

1269
01:12:11,479 --> 01:12:15,080
Speaker 1: oh yeah, I see you can arrive with that. Or

1270
01:12:15,160 --> 01:12:18,080
Speaker 1: is it gonna cheapen it so much that when it

1271
01:12:18,080 --> 01:12:21,000
Speaker 1: could when it really gets down to brass tacks, that

1272
01:12:21,080 --> 01:12:23,320
Speaker 1: they're gonna go, ah, it's not that valuable. I don't know.

1273
01:12:23,520 --> 01:12:26,920
Speaker 1: I don't know either. It's interesting. I had you on

1274
01:12:27,080 --> 01:12:29,360
Speaker 1: here so you could tell us the answers. Yeah, well,

1275
01:12:31,080 --> 01:12:32,320
Speaker 1: I don't know if I have an answer for that.

1276
01:12:32,400 --> 01:12:35,280
Speaker 1: But you you know, technology is driving everything. I mean,

1277
01:12:35,680 --> 01:12:39,040
Speaker 1: you just think about how one device I think the

1278
01:12:39,120 --> 01:12:43,080
Speaker 1: single biggest device that has changed hunting over the past

1279
01:12:44,360 --> 01:12:46,800
Speaker 1: let's just say twenty years, and probably you could probably

1280
01:12:46,880 --> 01:12:48,640
Speaker 1: narrow it down more than that, and it has to

1281
01:12:48,680 --> 01:12:54,639
Speaker 1: do with photography cameras, camera photos. Nothing has changed hunting

1282
01:12:54,960 --> 01:12:57,519
Speaker 1: more in my opinion, trail camera than the trail camera.

1283
01:12:58,280 --> 01:13:03,479
Speaker 1: Camera is forever changed hunting. And I think about, man,

1284
01:13:03,680 --> 01:13:06,519
Speaker 1: if I'd had some trail cameras when I was growing

1285
01:13:06,600 --> 01:13:09,040
Speaker 1: up out here in the Washing Alls and you go,

1286
01:13:09,439 --> 01:13:13,280
Speaker 1: you know, all year without seeing a deer. Sometimes, what

1287
01:13:13,400 --> 01:13:16,680
Speaker 1: would I have given to put a trail camera on

1288
01:13:16,840 --> 01:13:19,120
Speaker 1: that scrape that I found, you know, so I could

1289
01:13:19,680 --> 01:13:22,000
Speaker 1: just get a glimpse of the deer, you know what,

1290
01:13:22,280 --> 01:13:25,400
Speaker 1: what is that? You know? But then I think about it,

1291
01:13:25,400 --> 01:13:31,720
Speaker 1: and I think what made it so fun was the

1292
01:13:31,920 --> 01:13:36,040
Speaker 1: unknown of what that deer was. You know, you laid

1293
01:13:36,120 --> 01:13:40,160
Speaker 1: in bed at night day, you know, drifting off in

1294
01:13:40,200 --> 01:13:43,120
Speaker 1: a sleep thinking about how big that deer was, or

1295
01:13:43,160 --> 01:13:45,560
Speaker 1: how big he could be or whatever. And it was

1296
01:13:45,640 --> 01:13:49,840
Speaker 1: that unknown to me that made it fun. I just

1297
01:13:50,680 --> 01:13:56,400
Speaker 1: I absolutely loved it, you know, not knowing um back then.

1298
01:13:56,720 --> 01:14:00,280
Speaker 1: Nowadays it's like, you know, we got names all of

1299
01:14:00,320 --> 01:14:04,880
Speaker 1: our dear and you know, that's so split. You gave

1300
01:14:04,920 --> 01:14:09,120
Speaker 1: a good example earlier to me. You said that somebody

1301
01:14:09,120 --> 01:14:10,960
Speaker 1: will text you a picture of a of a deer

1302
01:14:11,840 --> 01:14:14,240
Speaker 1: and they'll say how old you think that dear is?

1303
01:14:15,400 --> 01:14:17,240
Speaker 1: And you'll say it's probably a two or three year

1304
01:14:17,240 --> 01:14:21,320
Speaker 1: old deer, and they'll go, we'll shoot I don't shoot

1305
01:14:21,360 --> 01:14:23,439
Speaker 1: two or three two or three year old deer. I

1306
01:14:23,479 --> 01:14:26,479
Speaker 1: mean it as a condensed version, and and and Scott's

1307
01:14:26,520 --> 01:14:30,560
Speaker 1: point was that they would if they actually saw that

1308
01:14:30,640 --> 01:14:32,719
Speaker 1: deer in the woods and didn't have it on camera,

1309
01:14:32,840 --> 01:14:35,960
Speaker 1: they'd shoot it in a heartbeat, absolutely and be probably

1310
01:14:36,040 --> 01:14:39,320
Speaker 1: thrilled with it. But because we have this new tool

1311
01:14:39,439 --> 01:14:44,720
Speaker 1: for analysis, and and and and that's social to tell

1312
01:14:44,760 --> 01:14:47,519
Speaker 1: about the story about your your boys, dear, if you're

1313
01:14:47,560 --> 01:14:52,200
Speaker 1: comfortable telling them. So anyway, I've got a lot of

1314
01:14:52,280 --> 01:14:54,640
Speaker 1: pros and cons cameras. I just want to tell you that.

1315
01:14:54,800 --> 01:14:58,479
Speaker 1: But anyhow, my my son last year killed a really

1316
01:14:58,600 --> 01:15:00,800
Speaker 1: nice dear. I mean it, the deer wasn't a day

1317
01:15:00,840 --> 01:15:02,280
Speaker 1: over two and a half years old. It was an

1318
01:15:02,320 --> 01:15:05,360
Speaker 1: eight point biggest deer he's ever killed. So it was

1319
01:15:05,400 --> 01:15:07,920
Speaker 1: his personal best if you will, you know, and uh,

1320
01:15:09,439 --> 01:15:11,840
Speaker 1: the only person prouder than him for killing that deer

1321
01:15:11,960 --> 01:15:15,200
Speaker 1: was me. I just thought it was you know, he'd

1322
01:15:15,280 --> 01:15:18,240
Speaker 1: hit over the moon, you know, he killed this deer,

1323
01:15:18,320 --> 01:15:20,280
Speaker 1: and of course we took pictures of it on his

1324
01:15:20,479 --> 01:15:22,240
Speaker 1: phone and this, that another, and he took it to

1325
01:15:22,320 --> 01:15:24,600
Speaker 1: school the next day. Couldn't wait to show you know,

1326
01:15:24,880 --> 01:15:26,519
Speaker 1: just like me and you can't wait to show each

1327
01:15:26,520 --> 01:15:29,360
Speaker 1: other what we killed. Yeah, So he went to school

1328
01:15:29,360 --> 01:15:31,360
Speaker 1: and he showed it to you know, a couple of

1329
01:15:31,439 --> 01:15:36,799
Speaker 1: his buddies, and you know, he come home from school

1330
01:15:36,880 --> 01:15:39,040
Speaker 1: and I said, well, what's your what's your buddies think

1331
01:15:39,080 --> 01:15:40,760
Speaker 1: about the deer he killed? And he's like, oh, he's

1332
01:15:40,760 --> 01:15:44,439
Speaker 1: told me I should have waited. And I said what

1333
01:15:45,160 --> 01:15:48,800
Speaker 1: And I said yeah. You know, the first first friend

1334
01:15:48,840 --> 01:15:50,519
Speaker 1: I asked, Sid, why why did you shoot that deer?

1335
01:15:51,040 --> 01:15:53,200
Speaker 1: You should let him grow another year or two, you know,

1336
01:15:53,479 --> 01:15:55,720
Speaker 1: And another kid was like, why did you shoot that dere?

1337
01:15:55,760 --> 01:15:58,840
Speaker 1: You know, every every kid was just almost critical of

1338
01:15:58,960 --> 01:16:02,400
Speaker 1: him shooting this deer. And it was obviously a young deer,

1339
01:16:03,200 --> 01:16:05,519
Speaker 1: but it was the best dear he had ever killed

1340
01:16:05,560 --> 01:16:09,639
Speaker 1: in his life, and probably the best dear those kids

1341
01:16:09,680 --> 01:16:13,800
Speaker 1: that ever I've ever killed. It. Yeah, so it's it's

1342
01:16:14,000 --> 01:16:18,439
Speaker 1: it came down to you know, we've almost created a

1343
01:16:18,600 --> 01:16:22,559
Speaker 1: sense of and and here's the thing I believe in, dear, management,

1344
01:16:22,640 --> 01:16:24,439
Speaker 1: If you want to grow big deer and you want

1345
01:16:24,479 --> 01:16:26,280
Speaker 1: to do all that stuff and you've got the time

1346
01:16:26,320 --> 01:16:28,840
Speaker 1: to do it, hey, more power to you. I'm all

1347
01:16:28,880 --> 01:16:32,400
Speaker 1: about it. But when you got guys at text message

1348
01:16:32,439 --> 01:16:35,559
Speaker 1: and say, hey, uh, you think I ought to let

1349
01:16:35,600 --> 01:16:38,320
Speaker 1: this deer grow up? And my response to that person is,

1350
01:16:39,439 --> 01:16:42,599
Speaker 1: I don't know. Would would you be happy with that? Dear?

1351
01:16:42,840 --> 01:16:45,400
Speaker 1: I mean, if you would be if you would be

1352
01:16:45,479 --> 01:16:48,880
Speaker 1: happy with that deer, then shoot the deer, you know,

1353
01:16:49,040 --> 01:16:52,680
Speaker 1: I mean, what quit worrying about whether or not it's

1354
01:16:52,800 --> 01:16:56,200
Speaker 1: five or it's four, or it's a one five or

1355
01:16:56,240 --> 01:16:58,920
Speaker 1: a one forty year, what it may or may not

1356
01:16:59,080 --> 01:17:02,559
Speaker 1: ever be or whatever. If you think if you look

1357
01:17:02,600 --> 01:17:05,479
Speaker 1: at that deer in in your heart you want to

1358
01:17:05,600 --> 01:17:08,439
Speaker 1: kill that, dear, I didn't kill that deer. That's my

1359
01:17:08,520 --> 01:17:11,360
Speaker 1: whole thing is we get so caught up in and

1360
01:17:11,439 --> 01:17:16,360
Speaker 1: I believe that comes from a lot of social absolutely pressure. Um.

1361
01:17:16,640 --> 01:17:19,400
Speaker 1: Just like my son, he he he was so proud

1362
01:17:19,520 --> 01:17:22,479
Speaker 1: but was almost shamed. Yeah, he was shamed for shooting this.

1363
01:17:23,600 --> 01:17:25,680
Speaker 1: You pulled out a text mess, a picture on your

1364
01:17:25,680 --> 01:17:29,679
Speaker 1: phone earlier, Mike Scott will show it to you. Maybe

1365
01:17:30,200 --> 01:17:33,400
Speaker 1: me and Scott back in two thousand one, I think

1366
01:17:33,439 --> 01:17:36,599
Speaker 1: it was or two, and Scott had killed a six

1367
01:17:36,720 --> 01:17:40,880
Speaker 1: point buck that probably had a total of twenty inches

1368
01:17:40,920 --> 01:17:45,400
Speaker 1: on his head maybe maybe, Yeah, And he'd killed a

1369
01:17:45,520 --> 01:17:48,160
Speaker 1: doe and a buck that day on public land, and

1370
01:17:48,240 --> 01:17:49,880
Speaker 1: there was a bunch of us that were hunting together.

1371
01:17:50,240 --> 01:17:52,439
Speaker 1: And I mean we thought enough of those, dear too,

1372
01:17:52,520 --> 01:17:55,280
Speaker 1: Like we got a group pictures, a group picture and

1373
01:17:55,479 --> 01:17:58,960
Speaker 1: that I remember just thinking that was like the coolest

1374
01:17:59,040 --> 01:18:03,200
Speaker 1: day ever and and just a little bit six point buck.

1375
01:18:03,240 --> 01:18:04,920
Speaker 1: And Scott said, man, I wish we could go back

1376
01:18:04,960 --> 01:18:06,560
Speaker 1: to that, and I thought that. I mean, when I

1377
01:18:06,600 --> 01:18:09,240
Speaker 1: look at that picture, I just like, dyang, that was fun. Yeah.

1378
01:18:09,360 --> 01:18:11,360
Speaker 1: You know, this picture to me strikes me. It's a

1379
01:18:11,360 --> 01:18:16,400
Speaker 1: great photograph, all these men standing around supporting him, and

1380
01:18:16,560 --> 01:18:20,519
Speaker 1: yet it's almost counterculture today. You know. You you would

1381
01:18:20,560 --> 01:18:23,320
Speaker 1: think there would be it would be a one sixty

1382
01:18:23,360 --> 01:18:27,280
Speaker 1: class buck on the ground or something. You have that photograph. Yeah, yeah,

1383
01:18:27,320 --> 01:18:29,800
Speaker 1: we we went way out of our way to do that. Yeah.

1384
01:18:29,840 --> 01:18:31,960
Speaker 1: I just think about that, dear today, and we've arrived

1385
01:18:31,960 --> 01:18:34,559
Speaker 1: at the place now that you know, if you shot

1386
01:18:34,640 --> 01:18:37,679
Speaker 1: that little six point you'd be ashamed to tell anybody

1387
01:18:37,680 --> 01:18:40,639
Speaker 1: about where your son's deer was bigger than now, oh yeah,

1388
01:18:41,439 --> 01:18:44,800
Speaker 1: it was much larger than this deer and picture. But

1389
01:18:46,120 --> 01:18:48,880
Speaker 1: I don't know, I worry about stuff like that. You know.

1390
01:18:49,120 --> 01:18:53,479
Speaker 1: I feel like, you know, we I shot that deer

1391
01:18:53,600 --> 01:18:58,200
Speaker 1: because it meant something to me, you know, I mean,

1392
01:18:58,840 --> 01:19:01,240
Speaker 1: oh my gosh, it was public land. Like you said,

1393
01:19:01,640 --> 01:19:03,720
Speaker 1: we hunted hard all week, if you'll remember, and this

1394
01:19:03,920 --> 01:19:06,680
Speaker 1: really hadn't had any luck at all. And when we

1395
01:19:06,800 --> 01:19:09,519
Speaker 1: killed that deer, it was kind of like finally, you know,

1396
01:19:09,800 --> 01:19:13,680
Speaker 1: we we've we've put all the pieces together and we

1397
01:19:13,880 --> 01:19:16,280
Speaker 1: finally produce something, you know, and we were so proud

1398
01:19:16,320 --> 01:19:20,240
Speaker 1: of that deer. And today, man, I don't know, I

1399
01:19:20,320 --> 01:19:24,160
Speaker 1: feel like we've gotten a place where um and I

1400
01:19:24,280 --> 01:19:26,920
Speaker 1: think if you search the hearts of men, if you

1401
01:19:27,000 --> 01:19:31,120
Speaker 1: will women whatever hunters and said, if you took the

1402
01:19:31,439 --> 01:19:34,519
Speaker 1: social pressure out of it, they'd shoot those deer all

1403
01:19:34,600 --> 01:19:37,280
Speaker 1: day long, you know what I mean. They would be happy.

1404
01:19:37,960 --> 01:19:40,840
Speaker 1: But because of the social pressure that they feel from

1405
01:19:41,160 --> 01:19:45,320
Speaker 1: you know, outside sources whatever, they don't shoot. You know,

1406
01:19:45,680 --> 01:19:47,439
Speaker 1: they question whether or not they want to shoot their

1407
01:19:47,479 --> 01:19:51,200
Speaker 1: tear well, it's the honey world is just it's never

1408
01:19:51,400 --> 01:19:55,240
Speaker 1: apples to apples like we've been. The culture has been

1409
01:19:55,400 --> 01:20:01,639
Speaker 1: highly pressured by Midwestern whitetail television the nineties, even when

1410
01:20:01,720 --> 01:20:05,640
Speaker 1: guys were in the Midwest killing big deer, and all

1411
01:20:05,680 --> 01:20:08,519
Speaker 1: of a sudden that became the standard. And those deer

1412
01:20:08,560 --> 01:20:12,799
Speaker 1: weren't everywhere, those opportunities weren't everywhere. They still aren't everywhere,

1413
01:20:14,000 --> 01:20:17,800
Speaker 1: And so you can't take the standards of the Midwest

1414
01:20:17,960 --> 01:20:21,120
Speaker 1: Kansas and southern Iowa and put them in the Washingtab

1415
01:20:21,160 --> 01:20:25,639
Speaker 1: Mountains of Arkansas. You'll tear yourself apart. But our world

1416
01:20:25,760 --> 01:20:29,120
Speaker 1: is so connected now that it's hard not to And

1417
01:20:29,240 --> 01:20:32,400
Speaker 1: that's what those boys, those boys that were given given

1418
01:20:32,439 --> 01:20:34,800
Speaker 1: to your boy a hard time. I mean, they've been

1419
01:20:34,840 --> 01:20:38,160
Speaker 1: watching Outdoor Channel and it's and boy, it's it's just

1420
01:20:38,280 --> 01:20:40,479
Speaker 1: a can of worms. But I think the answer is

1421
01:20:40,880 --> 01:20:45,759
Speaker 1: is that every every family has the right to build

1422
01:20:46,080 --> 01:20:49,000
Speaker 1: their own hunting culture and values. And that's what I'm

1423
01:20:49,200 --> 01:20:51,439
Speaker 1: working hard to do inside of my family. And I've

1424
01:20:51,479 --> 01:20:55,200
Speaker 1: seen holes in my in in my parenting that I

1425
01:20:55,280 --> 01:20:59,840
Speaker 1: have noticed of late, I really have, and and you

1426
01:21:00,000 --> 01:21:05,519
Speaker 1: know we've I'm I'm making very intentional decisions to uh

1427
01:21:06,160 --> 01:21:08,680
Speaker 1: to change some of the things that I'm doing. But

1428
01:21:08,960 --> 01:21:13,200
Speaker 1: my kids do know that we value. They understand value

1429
01:21:13,240 --> 01:21:17,519
Speaker 1: inside of a hunt. They understand that a deer taken

1430
01:21:17,600 --> 01:21:22,760
Speaker 1: this way, it might step on somebody's toes, but is

1431
01:21:22,920 --> 01:21:26,880
Speaker 1: less valuable. Now from a meat perspective, from a functional perspective,

1432
01:21:27,280 --> 01:21:31,639
Speaker 1: from a rational you know, it's it's not we're getting meat.

1433
01:21:31,920 --> 01:21:35,320
Speaker 1: But humans are complex animals. We're we're not animals. We're

1434
01:21:35,400 --> 01:21:38,839
Speaker 1: complex beings that you know. I am able to assign

1435
01:21:39,000 --> 01:21:43,040
Speaker 1: value here and assigned value here, and there are certain

1436
01:21:43,120 --> 01:21:45,280
Speaker 1: things that have a higher value to me than other things,

1437
01:21:45,360 --> 01:21:48,040
Speaker 1: even though from a you know, we get the same meat,

1438
01:21:48,120 --> 01:21:51,400
Speaker 1: which is equal value. If we're just talking about gathering meat,

1439
01:21:51,479 --> 01:21:54,080
Speaker 1: none of this matters, None of it matters a bit.

1440
01:21:54,600 --> 01:21:57,320
Speaker 1: But the truth is we're not just talking about gathering meat.

1441
01:21:57,400 --> 01:22:00,599
Speaker 1: We're complex. This is a complex thing. So we're talking

1442
01:22:00,640 --> 01:22:03,800
Speaker 1: about what it. You know, we're talking about a whole

1443
01:22:03,960 --> 01:22:09,400
Speaker 1: bunch of different stuff. But mm hmm, yeah, you know,

1444
01:22:09,680 --> 01:22:12,000
Speaker 1: it's funny. We I think we talked on the phone

1445
01:22:12,040 --> 01:22:13,760
Speaker 1: here while back. I got a really good friend lives

1446
01:22:13,800 --> 01:22:16,920
Speaker 1: Northwest arks On. Fact, he showed me the way to Madison,

1447
01:22:16,960 --> 01:22:19,040
Speaker 1: County Wildlife Management Area back in the day, and you

1448
01:22:19,160 --> 01:22:22,679
Speaker 1: know him really well, and uh, you know, I credit

1449
01:22:22,800 --> 01:22:26,800
Speaker 1: him to allowing me into his kind of honey hole,

1450
01:22:26,880 --> 01:22:31,519
Speaker 1: if you will, and northwest Arkansas and uh anyway, we

1451
01:22:31,800 --> 01:22:35,840
Speaker 1: uh hunted a lot together back then. And you know

1452
01:22:37,040 --> 01:22:39,320
Speaker 1: he wasn't in that photograph we're talking about earlier, but

1453
01:22:39,600 --> 01:22:41,519
Speaker 1: you know he was in on a lot of hunts

1454
01:22:41,560 --> 01:22:43,759
Speaker 1: with me up there, and you know, we were tickled

1455
01:22:43,760 --> 01:22:46,960
Speaker 1: to death to shoot a two year old basket rack

1456
01:22:47,040 --> 01:22:49,040
Speaker 1: eight point buck with our bow. I mean, it was

1457
01:22:50,040 --> 01:22:52,200
Speaker 1: it meant more to me than some of the biggest

1458
01:22:52,240 --> 01:22:55,040
Speaker 1: bucks I've killed in my lifetime, those hunts that that

1459
01:22:55,120 --> 01:22:58,560
Speaker 1: I went on up there. And you know, making I

1460
01:22:58,680 --> 01:23:00,720
Speaker 1: told you I've been kind of the kind of a

1461
01:23:00,800 --> 01:23:03,040
Speaker 1: funny place about hunting. You know, it's all kind of

1462
01:23:03,240 --> 01:23:06,000
Speaker 1: snowballed on me the whole, you know, whether it be

1463
01:23:06,160 --> 01:23:11,439
Speaker 1: the shaming for shooting smaller deer, whether it be how

1464
01:23:11,560 --> 01:23:15,400
Speaker 1: we've changed hunting from the craft as Mike said earlier,

1465
01:23:15,560 --> 01:23:19,360
Speaker 1: to more of a uh let us build a you know,

1466
01:23:19,400 --> 01:23:21,519
Speaker 1: an ecosystem and back deer into a kind of thing.

1467
01:23:21,960 --> 01:23:23,760
Speaker 1: All that's kind of just compounded on me here in

1468
01:23:23,800 --> 01:23:26,200
Speaker 1: the last few years, and and you know, every year

1469
01:23:26,240 --> 01:23:30,280
Speaker 1: I find myself struggling a little more too makes sense

1470
01:23:30,320 --> 01:23:33,479
Speaker 1: of all of it. And I just wondered if I

1471
01:23:33,560 --> 01:23:35,200
Speaker 1: was by myself, you know, I can't think, am I

1472
01:23:35,240 --> 01:23:36,880
Speaker 1: just out here on the island by myself feeling this

1473
01:23:36,960 --> 01:23:40,600
Speaker 1: way or whatever? And so it's just really unique that

1474
01:23:40,960 --> 01:23:44,280
Speaker 1: uh uh. He calls me the tother day. We're talking

1475
01:23:44,320 --> 01:23:47,599
Speaker 1: on the phone, he says, and he goes, Oh, I'm

1476
01:23:47,680 --> 01:23:50,200
Speaker 1: kind of in a I'm going through a midlife crisis

1477
01:23:50,280 --> 01:23:53,360
Speaker 1: on this deer hunt. And that's the way you put it. Yeah,

1478
01:23:54,000 --> 01:23:56,280
Speaker 1: And I kind of thought, you know, I've never I've

1479
01:23:56,320 --> 01:23:58,240
Speaker 1: never thought about it like that. And I said, yeah,

1480
01:23:58,280 --> 01:24:00,640
Speaker 1: I carry on, you know, I'm listening, you know, And

1481
01:24:00,680 --> 01:24:02,400
Speaker 1: he's like, man, I just don't know what to do,

1482
01:24:02,600 --> 01:24:05,599
Speaker 1: he said. I I've you know, I've got game cameras

1483
01:24:05,680 --> 01:24:07,880
Speaker 1: up all over the place. I got these big deer

1484
01:24:08,040 --> 01:24:10,639
Speaker 1: on camera. You know, I've spent it all my time

1485
01:24:10,760 --> 01:24:14,360
Speaker 1: hunting one or two deer. And you know, I'm realizing

1486
01:24:14,439 --> 01:24:17,639
Speaker 1: that the joy that I used to experience with Honey

1487
01:24:17,960 --> 01:24:21,759
Speaker 1: when we used to go shoot does and just whatever,

1488
01:24:22,000 --> 01:24:24,160
Speaker 1: you know, whatever we could get within bow range back

1489
01:24:24,520 --> 01:24:27,160
Speaker 1: years ago, you know the joy I experience, and that

1490
01:24:27,960 --> 01:24:31,240
Speaker 1: is gone. You know, he's it's me and this deer.

1491
01:24:32,280 --> 01:24:34,080
Speaker 1: I don't have a group with me. I don't have

1492
01:24:34,160 --> 01:24:36,840
Speaker 1: a bunch of guys to hunt with because it's me

1493
01:24:36,960 --> 01:24:39,280
Speaker 1: and this deer that I've got on camera. And he

1494
01:24:39,400 --> 01:24:41,920
Speaker 1: can't invite you to go on that. Yeah, he said,

1495
01:24:41,960 --> 01:24:45,880
Speaker 1: I'm just I've realized, you know, he goes, I want

1496
01:24:45,920 --> 01:24:47,840
Speaker 1: to shoot these big deer. I feel like i'm prep

1497
01:24:48,240 --> 01:24:51,160
Speaker 1: there's pressure on me to shoot these big deer. And

1498
01:24:51,400 --> 01:24:54,680
Speaker 1: he said that. And and he's killed a lot of

1499
01:24:54,720 --> 01:24:56,960
Speaker 1: big deer. I told the other day I think I

1500
01:24:57,040 --> 01:24:59,759
Speaker 1: think he you know, he's killed more deer than more poping,

1501
01:24:59,800 --> 01:25:02,160
Speaker 1: young class deer than anybody I know in the past

1502
01:25:02,200 --> 01:25:05,920
Speaker 1: twenty years probably. And he said, man, I just don't

1503
01:25:07,400 --> 01:25:11,000
Speaker 1: I'm almost expected now to only shoot these big deer.

1504
01:25:11,240 --> 01:25:13,599
Speaker 1: It's become the expectation for me to shoot big deer

1505
01:25:13,640 --> 01:25:16,880
Speaker 1: and not you know, young deer or whatever. He said.

1506
01:25:16,920 --> 01:25:20,519
Speaker 1: So I'm questioning how much I really enjoy this, he said,

1507
01:25:20,600 --> 01:25:26,600
Speaker 1: I'm it's almost unenjoyable. And so anyway, you know, we

1508
01:25:26,680 --> 01:25:29,320
Speaker 1: talked about that, and the whole time I'm talking to him,

1509
01:25:29,400 --> 01:25:34,040
Speaker 1: I'm thinking man, have you been reading my mind? I mean,

1510
01:25:34,120 --> 01:25:36,800
Speaker 1: that's exactly the way I feel. I feel the same

1511
01:25:36,840 --> 01:25:39,600
Speaker 1: way you feel about this. There's almost a you know,

1512
01:25:39,680 --> 01:25:43,400
Speaker 1: an expectation now that you deliver some big deer every year,

1513
01:25:43,520 --> 01:25:49,920
Speaker 1: every other year or whatever, and you know, the minute

1514
01:25:49,960 --> 01:25:52,280
Speaker 1: you stop enjoying it, you need to slow down and

1515
01:25:52,360 --> 01:25:57,800
Speaker 1: just think about it and reevaluate. I've done my best,

1516
01:25:57,880 --> 01:26:00,200
Speaker 1: and my the thing that's helped me over the past

1517
01:26:00,240 --> 01:26:03,400
Speaker 1: couple of years is I have basically just started hunting

1518
01:26:03,439 --> 01:26:05,559
Speaker 1: public land again, just you know, there for a while,

1519
01:26:05,600 --> 01:26:08,400
Speaker 1: I got on some leases and I did some of

1520
01:26:08,479 --> 01:26:10,519
Speaker 1: that for a while, and like you said, you're in

1521
01:26:10,680 --> 01:26:12,760
Speaker 1: competition with everybody else on the lease, and so you

1522
01:26:12,840 --> 01:26:15,160
Speaker 1: find yourself hunting in a way that you don't really

1523
01:26:15,280 --> 01:26:17,400
Speaker 1: like to hunt, but you have to hunt in order

1524
01:26:17,439 --> 01:26:20,200
Speaker 1: to compete with the people in the least. And you know,

1525
01:26:20,320 --> 01:26:25,439
Speaker 1: I just I thought, man, I'm I'm shooting deer, but

1526
01:26:25,600 --> 01:26:27,840
Speaker 1: I'm if I'm honest with myself, I'm not just having

1527
01:26:27,920 --> 01:26:31,880
Speaker 1: the greatest time. But going back to hunting public land,

1528
01:26:31,920 --> 01:26:33,960
Speaker 1: there's a management area here that means you both have

1529
01:26:34,080 --> 01:26:36,920
Speaker 1: hunted in our life, in our lifetimes that I value

1530
01:26:36,960 --> 01:26:39,160
Speaker 1: a lot and I have hunted a lot on hunting

1531
01:26:39,160 --> 01:26:44,639
Speaker 1: the Washingtab mountains up here, I know that my chances

1532
01:26:44,680 --> 01:26:47,800
Speaker 1: of shooting a deer are far less even seeing a

1533
01:26:47,880 --> 01:26:52,559
Speaker 1: deer are far less. Um But and here's the other thing.

1534
01:26:52,960 --> 01:26:56,800
Speaker 1: I haven't put a game camera on a tree in

1535
01:26:56,880 --> 01:27:00,640
Speaker 1: four or five years. I've just quit it. And I

1536
01:27:00,760 --> 01:27:04,599
Speaker 1: find myself at the end of the day really enjoying

1537
01:27:04,680 --> 01:27:06,760
Speaker 1: hunting a little bit more. Let me tell you something else.

1538
01:27:07,439 --> 01:27:09,880
Speaker 1: You kill big deer too. Yeah, and there's a big

1539
01:27:10,880 --> 01:27:12,960
Speaker 1: It sounds like Scott's building up to say that he's

1540
01:27:13,000 --> 01:27:15,679
Speaker 1: not been a very successful hunter in recent years. We're

1541
01:27:15,720 --> 01:27:18,560
Speaker 1: looking at a deer right there that he killed a

1542
01:27:18,680 --> 01:27:23,240
Speaker 1: month ago. That is a monster public land Arkansas buck.

1543
01:27:23,800 --> 01:27:26,280
Speaker 1: You know what, the greatest thing, but the great appreciation

1544
01:27:26,400 --> 01:27:28,479
Speaker 1: for that dear is for me. I know what you're

1545
01:27:28,479 --> 01:27:31,640
Speaker 1: gonna say, I've never seen that deer. I knew you're

1546
01:27:31,640 --> 01:27:34,080
Speaker 1: gonna say that. I'd never laid eyes on that deer.

1547
01:27:34,160 --> 01:27:37,720
Speaker 1: But you knew you you play. Even if you never do,

1548
01:27:37,880 --> 01:27:42,040
Speaker 1: that deer was there. You absolutely did your homework. I

1549
01:27:42,080 --> 01:27:44,519
Speaker 1: mean I know you you knew exactly what you were

1550
01:27:44,520 --> 01:27:46,120
Speaker 1: doing when you killed that deer, even though you never

1551
01:27:46,160 --> 01:27:48,760
Speaker 1: had a trail camera. Well it was old school. It

1552
01:27:48,880 --> 01:27:51,960
Speaker 1: was actually almost cheating what you did, Scott. You knew

1553
01:27:52,040 --> 01:27:54,519
Speaker 1: that you knew that ground so well, and those deer

1554
01:27:54,600 --> 01:27:57,519
Speaker 1: movements so well, you know, it was it was old

1555
01:27:57,560 --> 01:28:01,320
Speaker 1: schoolost as if it was craft. It was it was craft.

1556
01:28:01,360 --> 01:28:03,760
Speaker 1: It really was that one. But that's exactly what that

1557
01:28:03,840 --> 01:28:06,160
Speaker 1: deer was, you know. I found the sign, I went

1558
01:28:06,240 --> 01:28:09,519
Speaker 1: in there and just on you know, just faith. It

1559
01:28:09,680 --> 01:28:11,160
Speaker 1: was just I just had that, Well, you got away

1560
01:28:11,200 --> 01:28:14,479
Speaker 1: from people to you did some stuff that, yeah, helped

1561
01:28:14,520 --> 01:28:17,200
Speaker 1: you get way away from people on public land without

1562
01:28:18,680 --> 01:28:22,400
Speaker 1: you know, yeah, you didn't use a mule, no, but

1563
01:28:22,560 --> 01:28:25,000
Speaker 1: you got away from people, right, And it's you know,

1564
01:28:25,120 --> 01:28:27,320
Speaker 1: it's one of those deals where I was acceptant of

1565
01:28:27,439 --> 01:28:29,599
Speaker 1: the fact that when I see the deer that's made

1566
01:28:29,680 --> 01:28:31,639
Speaker 1: the sign, it may not be a very big deer,

1567
01:28:32,920 --> 01:28:35,040
Speaker 1: but it didn't matter to me. I was gonna shoot

1568
01:28:35,360 --> 01:28:37,760
Speaker 1: whatever deer was making that sign in there. I made

1569
01:28:37,880 --> 01:28:39,800
Speaker 1: my mind up. I didn't have to know that it

1570
01:28:39,920 --> 01:28:42,320
Speaker 1: was a hundred and forty five or fifty ends deer

1571
01:28:42,400 --> 01:28:44,000
Speaker 1: or whatever. I didn't have to know any of that.

1572
01:28:44,640 --> 01:28:46,640
Speaker 1: I knew that if I could put the pieces of

1573
01:28:46,680 --> 01:28:49,840
Speaker 1: the puzzle together, and kill and and and get a

1574
01:28:50,400 --> 01:28:53,519
Speaker 1: in range of that deer. I was gonna shoot that deer.

1575
01:28:54,160 --> 01:28:56,599
Speaker 1: And of course there was probably more than one buck

1576
01:28:56,640 --> 01:28:58,600
Speaker 1: in there. Who knows. Maybe I didn't even shoot the

1577
01:28:58,600 --> 01:29:00,559
Speaker 1: biggest one in there. I don't know, but I don't care.

1578
01:29:01,720 --> 01:29:04,400
Speaker 1: The deer I shot plenty good enough for me, you know,

1579
01:29:04,560 --> 01:29:06,080
Speaker 1: And maybe there was a bigger one in there. And

1580
01:29:06,160 --> 01:29:08,160
Speaker 1: that's the deal it had. I had a game camera

1581
01:29:08,240 --> 01:29:10,000
Speaker 1: in there, and there was one twice that big in there.

1582
01:29:10,080 --> 01:29:12,640
Speaker 1: What I shot that, dear, would I have? I don't know.

1583
01:29:13,520 --> 01:29:15,280
Speaker 1: You know what would have been torn if you did?

1584
01:29:15,360 --> 01:29:18,160
Speaker 1: I guarantee you that. And so the way it is now,

1585
01:29:18,280 --> 01:29:20,800
Speaker 1: I don't know that. So that deer right over there

1586
01:29:22,200 --> 01:29:23,600
Speaker 1: makes me as happy as I could be about it,

1587
01:29:23,760 --> 01:29:30,599
Speaker 1: you know. And so it's funny too. I was telling

1588
01:29:30,600 --> 01:29:32,120
Speaker 1: you about that my friend up north of Sorry, So

1589
01:29:32,200 --> 01:29:33,479
Speaker 1: I don't know if I should mention his name or

1590
01:29:33,520 --> 01:29:35,040
Speaker 1: because I don't know if he want me to, but

1591
01:29:35,920 --> 01:29:37,600
Speaker 1: I figured he wouldn't care, but I don't know. I

1592
01:29:37,640 --> 01:29:42,360
Speaker 1: don't want to anyway. He's uh he text me I

1593
01:29:42,400 --> 01:29:44,599
Speaker 1: think it was last week or week before, and he said, man,

1594
01:29:44,680 --> 01:29:48,000
Speaker 1: you inspired me on the telephone the other day and

1595
01:29:48,120 --> 01:29:51,880
Speaker 1: I said, I said, for what he goes man? He said,

1596
01:29:51,920 --> 01:29:55,719
Speaker 1: I went to Missouri, place I've never been before, found

1597
01:29:55,840 --> 01:29:59,120
Speaker 1: some sign, got in the tree where I felt I

1598
01:29:59,160 --> 01:30:01,120
Speaker 1: needed to be, and shot this buck. And he has

1599
01:30:01,160 --> 01:30:05,160
Speaker 1: a picture of this really nice buck. Yeah, and I

1600
01:30:05,400 --> 01:30:07,960
Speaker 1: didn't never, never had seen it before, didn't have you know,

1601
01:30:08,040 --> 01:30:10,320
Speaker 1: didn't have game cameras on the tree. Just went up there,

1602
01:30:10,360 --> 01:30:14,800
Speaker 1: old school and and hunted some sign and in in

1603
01:30:15,200 --> 01:30:17,240
Speaker 1: some faith and got up on a tree and killed

1604
01:30:17,320 --> 01:30:20,080
Speaker 1: this deer. And he's so proud of it. And you know,

1605
01:30:20,200 --> 01:30:21,880
Speaker 1: not as big as the ones he had on camera

1606
01:30:22,000 --> 01:30:25,600
Speaker 1: back in Arkansas or any of that stuff, but just

1607
01:30:25,840 --> 01:30:27,920
Speaker 1: thrilled to death about that deer that he killed. And

1608
01:30:28,040 --> 01:30:30,639
Speaker 1: so you know that, I think you gotta get back

1609
01:30:30,720 --> 01:30:34,479
Speaker 1: to that sometimes, you know, I think about you. You know,

1610
01:30:34,520 --> 01:30:36,920
Speaker 1: I've been struggling the last few years as an archery hunter.

1611
01:30:37,040 --> 01:30:40,760
Speaker 1: I loved archery hunt, absolutely love it, um, But if

1612
01:30:40,800 --> 01:30:43,519
Speaker 1: I'm honest with myself, I don't get quite what I

1613
01:30:43,600 --> 01:30:47,320
Speaker 1: got out of it twenty years ago. But you going

1614
01:30:47,400 --> 01:30:51,679
Speaker 1: back to traditional having the best archery equipment money can buy,

1615
01:30:52,400 --> 01:30:56,000
Speaker 1: and now you're shooting a stick with a string on

1616
01:30:56,120 --> 01:30:59,400
Speaker 1: it and killing animals with it. And there's something very

1617
01:30:59,560 --> 01:31:03,240
Speaker 1: organ about that that. I mean, I just love it.

1618
01:31:03,439 --> 01:31:06,080
Speaker 1: I love and I think that's where but it brought

1619
01:31:06,160 --> 01:31:09,280
Speaker 1: it brought back. It brought back something that I felt

1620
01:31:09,320 --> 01:31:11,320
Speaker 1: like I had lost. Yeah, there you go. And I

1621
01:31:11,400 --> 01:31:13,559
Speaker 1: think that's what you're in search of the whole time,

1622
01:31:13,920 --> 01:31:17,320
Speaker 1: whether it's me going back and hunting public land and

1623
01:31:17,400 --> 01:31:20,080
Speaker 1: committing to that and just getting back into that and

1624
01:31:20,600 --> 01:31:23,519
Speaker 1: and doing away with the game cameras and making it,

1625
01:31:25,360 --> 01:31:27,519
Speaker 1: you know, getting back to the roots of it, I guess,

1626
01:31:28,240 --> 01:31:32,320
Speaker 1: or like you like in your case, you know, switching

1627
01:31:32,400 --> 01:31:35,400
Speaker 1: back or going to no, switching back to it. You

1628
01:31:35,479 --> 01:31:38,840
Speaker 1: started out with compounds and all that, but but going

1629
01:31:38,960 --> 01:31:43,439
Speaker 1: to traditional archery equipment and and you know, giving yourself

1630
01:31:43,520 --> 01:31:49,479
Speaker 1: a you know, a new challenge. It brought back something

1631
01:31:49,600 --> 01:31:52,120
Speaker 1: that I had used to have with a compound bow. Yeah,

1632
01:31:52,240 --> 01:31:54,680
Speaker 1: that I lost with a compound bow. But I get

1633
01:31:54,720 --> 01:31:56,639
Speaker 1: it back when I have that tread bow in hand.

1634
01:31:56,720 --> 01:31:59,600
Speaker 1: That's right, It's true. Yeah, And I'm mire you for that.

1635
01:31:59,800 --> 01:32:02,000
Speaker 1: And I've got as a friend here in town, you do,

1636
01:32:02,080 --> 01:32:04,960
Speaker 1: you know as well who's done the same thing. You know.

1637
01:32:05,040 --> 01:32:06,640
Speaker 1: He told me a few years ago, he said, Man,

1638
01:32:06,680 --> 01:32:09,160
Speaker 1: I'm just just kind of losing interest and just that

1639
01:32:09,280 --> 01:32:11,599
Speaker 1: another and he went and got him a trad bow

1640
01:32:11,920 --> 01:32:15,000
Speaker 1: and that's all he talks about. Now. He's just back

1641
01:32:15,040 --> 01:32:20,080
Speaker 1: into it. So I think, what, you know, I identify

1642
01:32:20,280 --> 01:32:23,639
Speaker 1: with what you're saying about the hunting midlife crisis. Yeah,

1643
01:32:23,720 --> 01:32:27,840
Speaker 1: when it comes to white tails and locally, you know,

1644
01:32:27,960 --> 01:32:31,920
Speaker 1: the massively, I really do. I mean, I don't mean

1645
01:32:32,120 --> 01:32:33,960
Speaker 1: we're too deep in this for me to get into it,

1646
01:32:34,040 --> 01:32:37,479
Speaker 1: but I just want to say, identify. And I think

1647
01:32:37,479 --> 01:32:42,240
Speaker 1: a lot of people will identify with that hunting midlife crisis,

1648
01:32:42,880 --> 01:32:45,200
Speaker 1: especially guys that have hunted their whole life. Yeah, you know,

1649
01:32:45,280 --> 01:32:47,080
Speaker 1: guys that are just getting into it. It's it may

1650
01:32:47,120 --> 01:32:49,559
Speaker 1: be a little different, and that's good. But it's funny

1651
01:32:49,600 --> 01:32:52,120
Speaker 1: you say that. I think some of the funniest hunting

1652
01:32:52,200 --> 01:32:53,840
Speaker 1: I do. Now, we had a friend this year. We

1653
01:32:54,320 --> 01:32:56,679
Speaker 1: we'll take a year or here, we'll take a week

1654
01:32:56,760 --> 01:32:59,920
Speaker 1: off every year here in Halloween, and it's an archery hunt.

1655
01:33:00,320 --> 01:33:05,160
Speaker 1: And it's normally it's really that it's from the front

1656
01:33:05,280 --> 01:33:07,960
Speaker 1: door of the rut. It's really a good time to

1657
01:33:08,000 --> 01:33:09,960
Speaker 1: be in the woods. This year, it wasn't as good.

1658
01:33:10,479 --> 01:33:12,960
Speaker 1: Rutt fell a little later this year is a little different.

1659
01:33:13,720 --> 01:33:15,519
Speaker 1: But we had a guy in camp who had never

1660
01:33:15,840 --> 01:33:19,560
Speaker 1: killed a deer with a boat, and I'm telling you,

1661
01:33:20,080 --> 01:33:22,679
Speaker 1: me and and my friend Tim, it was in camp

1662
01:33:22,800 --> 01:33:26,040
Speaker 1: with us, that's all we wanted to accomplish that week.

1663
01:33:26,200 --> 01:33:29,760
Speaker 1: And that was just as fun. And we put him

1664
01:33:29,840 --> 01:33:34,800
Speaker 1: in absolutely the best place that you could possibly find

1665
01:33:34,960 --> 01:33:37,800
Speaker 1: in his public land. And we've done all the scout

1666
01:33:37,840 --> 01:33:40,240
Speaker 1: and we did the homework for for the guy. It

1667
01:33:40,360 --> 01:33:43,160
Speaker 1: was basically a guided hunt, you know. We did all

1668
01:33:43,240 --> 01:33:45,280
Speaker 1: the homework, we told him which treat to get in,

1669
01:33:45,439 --> 01:33:47,360
Speaker 1: We we did all the work for him. But we

1670
01:33:47,520 --> 01:33:50,000
Speaker 1: wanted so bad for him to kill a deer that

1671
01:33:50,080 --> 01:33:52,800
Speaker 1: it didn't matter what we did, you know. And uh,

1672
01:33:52,880 --> 01:33:54,479
Speaker 1: of course we got and we got that done and

1673
01:33:54,560 --> 01:33:57,880
Speaker 1: that was the greatest. Yeah, he killed a really nice

1674
01:33:57,960 --> 01:34:01,880
Speaker 1: eight point Yeah he did, uh, biggest buck of the

1675
01:34:01,920 --> 01:34:04,280
Speaker 1: week for sure. I mean, just a really nice dear,

1676
01:34:05,120 --> 01:34:08,160
Speaker 1: um And he was just tickled to death. And I

1677
01:34:08,479 --> 01:34:11,160
Speaker 1: don't know, I really believe it. Tim and I were

1678
01:34:11,240 --> 01:34:14,000
Speaker 1: probably more proud of that dear than he was. I

1679
01:34:14,200 --> 01:34:16,280
Speaker 1: only feel that way. Yeah, I mean he was, he

1680
01:34:16,360 --> 01:34:19,880
Speaker 1: was excited, don't get me wrong, But to me, getting

1681
01:34:19,960 --> 01:34:25,000
Speaker 1: somebody seeing that excitement and a new hunter puts a

1682
01:34:25,040 --> 01:34:26,720
Speaker 1: little bit in me too, you know, because you get

1683
01:34:26,760 --> 01:34:29,120
Speaker 1: to see them go through it and get excited and

1684
01:34:30,240 --> 01:34:32,679
Speaker 1: oh man, that's what it's all about. And I miss

1685
01:34:32,720 --> 01:34:34,240
Speaker 1: a little bit of that and to see. And that's

1686
01:34:34,240 --> 01:34:36,080
Speaker 1: why I hunt so much with my kids now. When

1687
01:34:36,120 --> 01:34:40,560
Speaker 1: I have free time to hunt, now you know of

1688
01:34:40,640 --> 01:34:42,559
Speaker 1: that I'm taking one of my boys or we're doing

1689
01:34:42,640 --> 01:34:45,680
Speaker 1: something hunting together, because they get excited, you know, they

1690
01:34:45,760 --> 01:34:51,160
Speaker 1: still have that fire to that. You know, they get nervous,

1691
01:34:51,320 --> 01:34:53,360
Speaker 1: they get all those things, you know, and that's what

1692
01:34:53,479 --> 01:34:56,479
Speaker 1: it's all about, it really is. So I take a

1693
01:34:56,560 --> 01:34:58,880
Speaker 1: lot of turkey hunters it's on their first hunt, you know,

1694
01:34:59,080 --> 01:35:02,280
Speaker 1: And that's a something I really like to do. Um.

1695
01:35:02,800 --> 01:35:05,360
Speaker 1: I've killed a lot of turkeys in my life, and

1696
01:35:05,439 --> 01:35:08,160
Speaker 1: if I don't kill another one, that's okay. But man,

1697
01:35:08,200 --> 01:35:10,679
Speaker 1: when I take somebody and set them down in front

1698
01:35:10,720 --> 01:35:12,960
Speaker 1: of me and call up a turkey and get to

1699
01:35:13,000 --> 01:35:15,040
Speaker 1: sit there and get a front row seat to somebody,

1700
01:35:15,960 --> 01:35:19,639
Speaker 1: you know, going through that stress of trying to stay

1701
01:35:19,720 --> 01:35:21,880
Speaker 1: still and doing all that and they're shaking and they're

1702
01:35:21,880 --> 01:35:24,080
Speaker 1: all the man, it just don't get any better than that.

1703
01:35:24,600 --> 01:35:27,479
Speaker 1: It just doesn't get me better. Does that take you back?

1704
01:35:27,880 --> 01:35:29,880
Speaker 1: It does in a way you're kind of you're kind

1705
01:35:29,920 --> 01:35:32,719
Speaker 1: of seeing it through their eyes. I am, that's exactly

1706
01:35:32,760 --> 01:35:35,479
Speaker 1: what it is. I think. I think it it brings

1707
01:35:35,640 --> 01:35:37,599
Speaker 1: back those old feelings that when you used to get

1708
01:35:37,680 --> 01:35:42,080
Speaker 1: that way and and and all that, and man, I

1709
01:35:42,120 --> 01:35:46,240
Speaker 1: don't know. I well, I think we're just all searching

1710
01:35:46,320 --> 01:35:49,640
Speaker 1: for the we want so bad for our kids that

1711
01:35:49,720 --> 01:35:51,439
Speaker 1: you said it earlier. We want so bad for our

1712
01:35:51,520 --> 01:35:53,639
Speaker 1: kids to be as excited about it as we are,

1713
01:35:53,760 --> 01:35:56,120
Speaker 1: and and and the person who you take hunting, you

1714
01:35:56,160 --> 01:35:58,519
Speaker 1: want him to be just as excited as you are were,

1715
01:35:58,840 --> 01:36:03,360
Speaker 1: and you want all the things. And I was thinking

1716
01:36:03,439 --> 01:36:06,920
Speaker 1: though that even if they don't follow in your footsteps

1717
01:36:07,040 --> 01:36:11,960
Speaker 1: the values that you impart inside of your pursuit, and

1718
01:36:12,080 --> 01:36:17,599
Speaker 1: they're seeing you and your craft, it does implant something

1719
01:36:17,720 --> 01:36:20,120
Speaker 1: in them that they will use inside of their life.

1720
01:36:20,160 --> 01:36:22,040
Speaker 1: It will be probably a part of who they are

1721
01:36:22,520 --> 01:36:25,000
Speaker 1: and what they do. It may not look the same,

1722
01:36:25,080 --> 01:36:27,600
Speaker 1: it may not be in the same area of expertise

1723
01:36:27,800 --> 01:36:31,599
Speaker 1: or that type of thing, but it does. It doesn't

1724
01:36:31,640 --> 01:36:34,760
Speaker 1: plant something in the in them. Your excitement about it,

1725
01:36:35,760 --> 01:36:40,320
Speaker 1: um and you're in the death of the good because

1726
01:36:40,560 --> 01:36:44,880
Speaker 1: you know, anything that we do. I mean, really I

1727
01:36:45,360 --> 01:36:48,880
Speaker 1: hope that my son's ultimately what I want my kids

1728
01:36:49,000 --> 01:36:54,960
Speaker 1: to become is is really probably people that are capable

1729
01:36:55,600 --> 01:36:59,920
Speaker 1: of excellence and craft inside of something. And I've chow

1730
01:37:00,040 --> 01:37:04,240
Speaker 1: wasn't hunting to dedicate myself to, you know, but because

1731
01:37:04,280 --> 01:37:06,720
Speaker 1: it's like what I want my son to just grow

1732
01:37:06,800 --> 01:37:09,640
Speaker 1: up and be a big buck killer, but be a

1733
01:37:09,800 --> 01:37:16,080
Speaker 1: terrible employee and father and nor what I want him

1734
01:37:16,080 --> 01:37:21,400
Speaker 1: to be is like a whole human that But but

1735
01:37:21,680 --> 01:37:26,960
Speaker 1: I see his connection to wild places and wildlife and

1736
01:37:27,040 --> 01:37:29,600
Speaker 1: hunting as as as being a part of that, you know,

1737
01:37:30,280 --> 01:37:31,920
Speaker 1: I mean, I hope that it would be. I see

1738
01:37:31,960 --> 01:37:33,680
Speaker 1: what you're saying. I didn't say it the right way there, Mike,

1739
01:37:33,760 --> 01:37:36,280
Speaker 1: But what you're saying is that if your dad wasn't

1740
01:37:36,479 --> 01:37:38,479
Speaker 1: it was a was a woodcraft you know, it was

1741
01:37:38,560 --> 01:37:43,160
Speaker 1: a it was a great you know, woodworker. You may

1742
01:37:43,200 --> 01:37:46,320
Speaker 1: not be a woodworker, but you're gonna take that excellence

1743
01:37:46,640 --> 01:37:50,519
Speaker 1: that he had inside of that and applied in something

1744
01:37:50,600 --> 01:37:54,559
Speaker 1: else maybe, yeah, and learning how to manage that also,

1745
01:37:54,760 --> 01:37:57,400
Speaker 1: like you know Scott's talking about, you know this kind

1746
01:37:57,439 --> 01:38:01,439
Speaker 1: of almost like rebirth. That's important because you're going back

1747
01:38:01,520 --> 01:38:05,960
Speaker 1: to to really the important thing. Why do I do this?

1748
01:38:07,040 --> 01:38:09,800
Speaker 1: You know, why is it important to me? And that's

1749
01:38:09,880 --> 01:38:12,800
Speaker 1: the thing to share with your your I think with

1750
01:38:13,160 --> 01:38:17,040
Speaker 1: the next generation, why do we do this? Why is

1751
01:38:17,080 --> 01:38:21,040
Speaker 1: it important? And uh and then again they can apply

1752
01:38:21,200 --> 01:38:27,920
Speaker 1: that into their their life. Well, guys. Closing thoughts, Scott

1753
01:38:28,200 --> 01:38:31,920
Speaker 1: closing thought. We we didn't talk about probably everything we

1754
01:38:32,040 --> 01:38:34,400
Speaker 1: talked about, but we'll we'll do another one one of

1755
01:38:34,439 --> 01:38:39,880
Speaker 1: these days. Now. I really enjoyed it. You know, I've

1756
01:38:39,920 --> 01:38:43,200
Speaker 1: always admired uh uklay and and because I think we

1757
01:38:43,320 --> 01:38:45,960
Speaker 1: think a lot of like, um, you know, the thing,

1758
01:38:46,080 --> 01:38:49,960
Speaker 1: the value and hunting, passing on the tradition, the heritage

1759
01:38:50,000 --> 01:38:53,120
Speaker 1: and all those things. You know. I love what you

1760
01:38:53,200 --> 01:38:56,120
Speaker 1: do with your videography and you're breaking your kids into

1761
01:38:56,240 --> 01:38:58,560
Speaker 1: it and all that time stuff. And I think my

1762
01:38:58,680 --> 01:39:00,840
Speaker 1: favorite videos or when you got one of your kids

1763
01:39:00,920 --> 01:39:03,800
Speaker 1: with you and maybe maybe you're not even successful that

1764
01:39:03,960 --> 01:39:05,880
Speaker 1: hunt or whatever. I know, River had a couple of

1765
01:39:07,000 --> 01:39:09,760
Speaker 1: rough deals, but you know, that's hunting, and that's that's

1766
01:39:09,800 --> 01:39:11,720
Speaker 1: all part of the process, you know, And I think

1767
01:39:11,760 --> 01:39:16,320
Speaker 1: it's great and I appreciate that you you know, allow

1768
01:39:16,520 --> 01:39:19,080
Speaker 1: us into your I get to see how you manage

1769
01:39:19,080 --> 01:39:22,680
Speaker 1: your kids and and through the hunting landscape and all that,

1770
01:39:22,880 --> 01:39:27,120
Speaker 1: and I think it's great. And uh, you know, I

1771
01:39:27,200 --> 01:39:32,040
Speaker 1: hope hunting tradition and my family goes on generation after generation.

1772
01:39:32,120 --> 01:39:35,320
Speaker 1: But um, you know, all we can do is manage,

1773
01:39:35,800 --> 01:39:39,600
Speaker 1: manage today and and do what we can to. Like

1774
01:39:40,000 --> 01:39:43,040
Speaker 1: Mike said, maybe maybe they don't take an appreciation for it,

1775
01:39:43,160 --> 01:39:46,479
Speaker 1: but we instill something in them through that process that

1776
01:39:46,800 --> 01:39:50,400
Speaker 1: carries on for generations. It comes. Man, I appreciate you

1777
01:39:50,479 --> 01:39:54,519
Speaker 1: bringing me on love just having conversations. This is like

1778
01:39:54,600 --> 01:39:56,400
Speaker 1: a conversation. Mean you have on the phone a lot

1779
01:39:56,479 --> 01:39:58,800
Speaker 1: of times driving down a rup, you know. So we

1780
01:39:58,880 --> 01:40:01,439
Speaker 1: make a podcast that's really what we're trying to replicate here.

1781
01:40:01,439 --> 01:40:04,439
Speaker 1: I wish we could. Yeah, yeah, sometimes you wish you

1782
01:40:04,680 --> 01:40:12,880
Speaker 1: had stuff recorded sometimes. Yeah, but it's been fun. Closing thoughts, Uh,

1783
01:40:13,360 --> 01:40:14,519
Speaker 1: what do you what do you think about what we

1784
01:40:14,600 --> 01:40:16,439
Speaker 1: just talked about. I thought it was really rich and

1785
01:40:16,520 --> 01:40:20,200
Speaker 1: deep and uh, I appreciate you inviting me in on

1786
01:40:20,360 --> 01:40:23,320
Speaker 1: this clay to sit here and listen and to meet Scott,

1787
01:40:23,479 --> 01:40:26,800
Speaker 1: get to know him better and uh really see his

1788
01:40:26,960 --> 01:40:31,719
Speaker 1: heart for for the for hunting and for his family. Yeah.

1789
01:40:32,520 --> 01:40:35,280
Speaker 1: Great time for me tonight, really enjoyed it. Yeah, it's

1790
01:40:35,320 --> 01:40:39,320
Speaker 1: been fun. Well, gentlemen, keep the wild places wild because

1791
01:40:39,360 --> 01:40:40,320
Speaker 1: that's where the bears live.