WEBVTT - Jo Piazza 0:00:00.200 --> 0:00:16.800 Hi, everybody, Welcome back. It's season three of Access podcast, 0:00:16.920 --> 0:00:20.840 the podcast about podcast. If you're a brand new listener 0:00:21.040 --> 0:00:23.560 and this is your first time, we'll welcome. I'm Maddie Stout. 0:00:23.960 --> 0:00:26.320 Eleven years ago, I left the number one morning show 0:00:26.320 --> 0:00:29.400 in San Francisco to jump into podcasting and join the 0:00:29.440 --> 0:00:32.680 startup team at Stitcher. Currently, I work as vice president 0:00:32.720 --> 0:00:35.760 of Podcast Programming fried Heart Radio. But here's the thing. 0:00:36.040 --> 0:00:38.479 I just love podcasts. I love listening to podcast, I 0:00:38.479 --> 0:00:42.040 love talking about podcast, podcast, podcast, podcast. I've had a 0:00:42.080 --> 0:00:44.280 dollar for every time I said podcast during the day, 0:00:44.400 --> 0:00:46.720 I would be so f and rich. You have no idea, 0:00:47.240 --> 0:00:49.440 but anyway, my job is to help you find new 0:00:49.520 --> 0:00:51.840 shows and also get to know some of the hosts 0:00:51.840 --> 0:00:55.480 that you already love, including this week's host who I'm 0:00:55.480 --> 0:00:59.520 really excited about. She's the author of seven critically acclaimed 0:00:59.520 --> 0:01:03.040 books and a former editor and columnist with Yahoo, Current 0:01:03.120 --> 0:01:06.200 TV and The New York Daily News. Her work has 0:01:06.200 --> 0:01:08.240 also appeared in The Wall Street Journal, New York Times, 0:01:08.280 --> 0:01:11.680 New York Magazine, Glamour, l Time, re Claire, The Daily Beast. 0:01:12.000 --> 0:01:15.480 If it's a good obligation, Joe Piazza has been in it, 0:01:15.800 --> 0:01:18.600 and I highly recommend you read anything that she's written. 0:01:18.600 --> 0:01:21.880 She's such a good writer. She's also a great podcaster. 0:01:22.319 --> 0:01:25.000 Her show is called Committed. Let's check out a clip 0:01:25.160 --> 0:01:27.560 and then let's talk to Joe. A few things bring 0:01:27.600 --> 0:01:30.360 a couple closer than fighting off a starving grizzly bear. 0:01:32.720 --> 0:01:35.240 But by the time the bear came along, Patent Caroline 0:01:35.280 --> 0:01:39.840 were used to confronting danger and discomfort together. They love 0:01:39.959 --> 0:01:43.200 the outdoors and for adventure has shaped their entire relationship. 0:01:43.480 --> 0:01:46.240 It's to find them. They've checked thousands of miles over 0:01:46.280 --> 0:01:50.320 the most rugged terrain on Earth, testing their bodies, their minds, 0:01:51.160 --> 0:01:56.840 and each other. Joe Piazza, thanks for coming on Access podcast. 0:01:57.160 --> 0:02:01.240 I think you are in Philadelphia right now. I am. Indeed, 0:02:01.280 --> 0:02:03.840 we just moved here. I've just fled the Bay Area 0:02:04.040 --> 0:02:08.200 as well. I moved to l A. Congratulations. I don't 0:02:08.200 --> 0:02:11.720 want to slag on it, but I'm every time I 0:02:11.720 --> 0:02:14.400 go back, I'm grateful that I'm not living there anymore. 0:02:14.480 --> 0:02:17.160 It really has changed a lot from the fifteen years 0:02:17.160 --> 0:02:19.480 when I moved there. My husband moved there twenty years ago, 0:02:19.520 --> 0:02:22.040 when it's a completely different city. It really is. Somebody 0:02:22.040 --> 0:02:24.480 tweeted you and made a comment that it was like 0:02:24.480 --> 0:02:27.880 a downgrade to move to Philadelphia, and your comment back was, yeah, no, 0:02:28.120 --> 0:02:31.560 not stepping over needles and poop anymore, yep, yep exactly. 0:02:32.080 --> 0:02:35.440 And I found I found affordable, wonderful childcare in like 0:02:35.520 --> 0:02:40.640 an hour. Podcasting is definitely a world that a lot 0:02:40.720 --> 0:02:43.440 of journalists are thriving in. And you coming from print 0:02:43.520 --> 0:02:46.959 journalism into podcasting, what was the first thing that made 0:02:47.000 --> 0:02:48.720 you go, you know, I want to get into this 0:02:48.760 --> 0:02:51.480 and do this. One is that I think the Internet 0:02:51.480 --> 0:02:54.760 has ruined good journalism in a lot of ways. We 0:02:54.880 --> 0:02:57.080 are living We're living in an age where some of 0:02:57.080 --> 0:03:00.560 the best journalism ever is happening, but we're also living 0:03:00.560 --> 0:03:05.639 in an age of content spam, bullshit, um, where it's 0:03:05.800 --> 0:03:10.600 harder and harder to discover real and authentic and great storytelling. Uh. 0:03:10.600 --> 0:03:12.920 And I was having a really hard time with a 0:03:12.919 --> 0:03:15.760 lot of the crap that was just being produced by 0:03:15.800 --> 0:03:20.600 every single even even legitimate news websites in the world, 0:03:20.760 --> 0:03:24.760 and podcasting felt like a real opportunity to do good 0:03:24.880 --> 0:03:27.920 storytelling again. And I tell people this all the time 0:03:28.040 --> 0:03:30.760 when I'm interviewing people or what I'm trying to convince 0:03:30.800 --> 0:03:33.359 other journalists to do podcasts. This is the most fun 0:03:33.400 --> 0:03:35.920 I've had in journalism in ten years. I mean really 0:03:36.040 --> 0:03:39.720 since social media took hold and ruined good journalism. So 0:03:39.880 --> 0:03:42.640 I think podcasting is absolutely the best medium to be 0:03:42.720 --> 0:03:45.920 telling great stories right now. You know, kind of a 0:03:45.960 --> 0:03:48.640 recurring theme when I talked to guests is that I'm 0:03:48.680 --> 0:03:52.240 a personal believer that podcasting is part of a movement 0:03:52.400 --> 0:03:55.360 to make people smarter. And also, you know, we look 0:03:55.400 --> 0:03:59.040 at stats at like people twelve to listen to podcast 0:03:59.360 --> 0:04:02.320 That kind lets me think, well, maybe we aren't raising 0:04:02.440 --> 0:04:06.640 a group of illiterate, Instagram hungry kids that they're actually 0:04:06.720 --> 0:04:08.960 caring about stories and they want to hear good storytelling. 0:04:09.320 --> 0:04:11.120 I think we are. I really think we are. It's 0:04:11.160 --> 0:04:13.440 that's actually interesting that you say that, because we were 0:04:13.480 --> 0:04:15.920 just living in Tahoe for six months, in between San 0:04:15.960 --> 0:04:19.000 Francisco and Philadelphia. We had this like Tahoe breather, and 0:04:19.040 --> 0:04:22.560 we had this wonderful babysitter who was nineteen, and she 0:04:22.640 --> 0:04:25.080 doesn't do social media, and none of her friends do 0:04:25.200 --> 0:04:27.760 social media. They're not on Instagram, they're not on Facebook. 0:04:27.880 --> 0:04:31.039 They even refused to Venmo because there's a social component 0:04:31.120 --> 0:04:33.839 to it. But there, I know, And which means they're 0:04:33.839 --> 0:04:41.000 all awesome and yes, they're also avid podcast listeners. So 0:04:41.240 --> 0:04:43.600 that and I had these long conversations with her about this, 0:04:43.640 --> 0:04:47.400 and it gave me so much hope for the next 0:04:47.520 --> 0:04:51.680 generation that I think that they're genuinely hungry for real 0:04:51.720 --> 0:04:55.679 and authentic connection and good storytelling. And I think another 0:04:55.720 --> 0:04:58.080 part of that is also when you look at the 0:04:58.120 --> 0:05:01.839 hosts of podcast, they look different than the host of 0:05:01.880 --> 0:05:04.719 traditional media. We see a lot more women, we see 0:05:04.720 --> 0:05:07.400 a lot more people of color. That's another thing. I 0:05:07.440 --> 0:05:10.400 work at a university. I teach, and I also train 0:05:10.480 --> 0:05:13.600 a lot of young radio talent, and I like cringes 0:05:13.600 --> 0:05:16.320 when I talked to someone who's a young lady in 0:05:16.480 --> 0:05:17.880 radio and ask them what they want to do and 0:05:17.960 --> 0:05:19.400 they tell me they want to be a co host, 0:05:19.640 --> 0:05:23.240 And I immediately like, no, you don't, you want to 0:05:23.279 --> 0:05:26.560 be a host. But in that world, that's kind of 0:05:26.600 --> 0:05:29.000 what the career path has always been. We're in podcasting. 0:05:29.000 --> 0:05:30.880 You've got a lot of really strong women who were 0:05:30.960 --> 0:05:34.560 doing amazing podcast and being uh celebrated for them, No 0:05:34.720 --> 0:05:37.240 exactly exactly. I mean, I feel like women in podcasting 0:05:37.240 --> 0:05:40.800 are really are being celebrated for having strong voices and 0:05:40.920 --> 0:05:44.040 strong opinions in a way that I think just wasn't 0:05:44.080 --> 0:05:48.000 always possible in traditional radio before. I just listened to 0:05:48.040 --> 0:05:51.560 this episode of Longest Shortest Time where they interviewed Terry 0:05:51.600 --> 0:05:54.960 Gross of Fresh Air about her decision not to have kids, 0:05:55.320 --> 0:05:57.960 and she had a lot of reasons for it, but 0:05:58.120 --> 0:06:01.560 one was that she did not see women hosting their 0:06:01.600 --> 0:06:06.960 own shows in radio who could juggle a family and 0:06:07.000 --> 0:06:09.440 the amount of work it took not just to create 0:06:09.440 --> 0:06:11.880 a great radio show, but to be a woman creating 0:06:11.920 --> 0:06:14.920 a great radio show. And I think that that's changing 0:06:15.080 --> 0:06:17.720 a lot. I mean, I have I'm working on two 0:06:17.760 --> 0:06:20.560 podcasts right now. I've got a toddler and another one 0:06:20.560 --> 0:06:23.479 on the way, and thinking about developing a third one. 0:06:23.600 --> 0:06:27.640 And I think that podcasting is welcoming all genders, it's 0:06:27.640 --> 0:06:31.520 welcoming all colors, and it's welcoming people who may be 0:06:31.600 --> 0:06:34.520 in a different part of their career but still want 0:06:34.560 --> 0:06:36.960 to create great content. I've got to find that and 0:06:37.000 --> 0:06:39.240 read that as someone who doesn't have children but has 0:06:39.240 --> 0:06:41.960 been happily married for thirteen years. And you know, met 0:06:42.000 --> 0:06:43.880 my wife. She was a fan of my radio show 0:06:43.880 --> 0:06:45.359 and sent me an email, and you know, we're just 0:06:45.440 --> 0:06:48.080 best friends, very much in love. The one thing that 0:06:48.200 --> 0:06:50.840 I find is that people have no problem asking me 0:06:50.880 --> 0:06:52.440 why we don't have children, and they do it all 0:06:52.440 --> 0:06:55.279 the time, but it's she doesn't get that question as much. 0:06:55.440 --> 0:06:57.280 It can be a kind of a taboo thing for 0:06:57.279 --> 0:06:58.840 for some people and for other beliy have no problem 0:06:58.839 --> 0:07:00.480 at all saying, Hey, what have who have kids? You 0:07:00.520 --> 0:07:03.320 should have kids? That's that's It's really funny that you 0:07:03.360 --> 0:07:05.960 bring that up, because ever since I got married, I've 0:07:05.960 --> 0:07:08.280 been asked when are you having kids? And then when 0:07:08.320 --> 0:07:10.600 I had one, all I got asked was when are 0:07:10.640 --> 0:07:15.200 you having another one? Wow, get on it. Well you're 0:07:15.240 --> 0:07:17.360 doing it, so maybe they'll quit asking or do you 0:07:17.400 --> 0:07:19.480 think that they're totally gonna ask me if I'm having 0:07:19.520 --> 0:07:22.239 a third I'm gonna be like, no, my husband's getting snapped. 0:07:24.880 --> 0:07:26.720 You know. I think it's it's changed a lot. Just 0:07:26.760 --> 0:07:28.600 made a decision not to have children. You know. I 0:07:28.600 --> 0:07:30.560 find it more when I talked to like my neighbors 0:07:30.560 --> 0:07:33.120 who are not from the United States, they tend to 0:07:33.160 --> 0:07:35.880 ask us a lot. They have no problems like almost 0:07:35.880 --> 0:07:38.679 like wagging their finger at my wife for not having children. 0:07:38.680 --> 0:07:41.440 And you know, but it's definitely a life choice is 0:07:41.480 --> 0:07:44.160 becoming more accepted, at least I think it is. But also, 0:07:44.240 --> 0:07:47.200 people who aren't from the United States have no problem 0:07:47.280 --> 0:07:50.240 saying anything to you, Like my my friends who aren't 0:07:50.240 --> 0:07:52.560 from the United States have no problem saying, why did 0:07:52.600 --> 0:07:57.320 you get so fat? Oh my gosh, that's not nice. 0:07:57.840 --> 0:07:59.800 It's not nice, and it's it's The answer is because 0:07:59.800 --> 0:08:03.440 I eat a lot of cheese. Yeah, I like cheese too. Hey, Keto, 0:08:03.640 --> 0:08:05.640 I'm on that you can do the cheese. It's great. 0:08:16.640 --> 0:08:18.800 So what are your favorite stories to tell? Because you know, 0:08:18.880 --> 0:08:21.960 reading your articles, you've told a lot of different stories, 0:08:22.160 --> 0:08:24.920 everything from the bro culture of Silicon Valley too. By 0:08:24.960 --> 0:08:27.440 the way, if I had daughters, I would be like, 0:08:27.560 --> 0:08:30.720 you're reading all of Joe's Ship right now because you 0:08:30.800 --> 0:08:33.080 just have a lot of uplifting and things that I think, 0:08:33.160 --> 0:08:35.040 you know, women, especially young women, should read. But what 0:08:35.080 --> 0:08:37.760 are the stories that you like telling? Thank you, um, 0:08:37.760 --> 0:08:39.760 And we're actually we're having a daughter, So that makes 0:08:39.800 --> 0:08:41.839 me feel really good that you said that, because now 0:08:42.160 --> 0:08:45.199 I'm excited for her to read it. On Good Morning America, 0:08:45.240 --> 0:08:47.680 they were introducing one of my books, Miss Junkie Wants, 0:08:47.720 --> 0:08:52.200 and they called me a feminist adjacent writer. Uh, and 0:08:52.280 --> 0:08:53.920 I kind of liked that. I mean, I've thought of 0:08:53.960 --> 0:08:55.840 a lot of the things that I write as feminist 0:08:55.880 --> 0:08:59.680 but kind of feminism in like a hide feminism, feminism 0:08:59.679 --> 0:09:03.079 and act and so writing about how being a woman 0:09:03.200 --> 0:09:09.000 affects me and affects other women, but through real, everyday circumstances. 0:09:09.120 --> 0:09:11.760 And I like to tell the stories that aren't being 0:09:11.800 --> 0:09:13.960 told in the stories that are a little difficult to tell, 0:09:14.160 --> 0:09:17.559 but through the lens of a human experience. So how 0:09:17.559 --> 0:09:20.480 how is an actual person experiencing this as opposed to 0:09:21.000 --> 0:09:23.560 just a great snappy headline. And that goes back to 0:09:23.600 --> 0:09:25.160 what I was saying before about how I think the 0:09:25.160 --> 0:09:28.120 Internet has ruined a lot of journalism because the Internet 0:09:28.200 --> 0:09:32.960 really only cares about great snappy headlines and click baity tweets. Yeah, 0:09:33.080 --> 0:09:36.440 and I think to kind of morph into your podcast Committed, 0:09:36.480 --> 0:09:38.760 where do you find them good stories that people need 0:09:38.800 --> 0:09:41.120 to hear, but definitely not going to see a quick 0:09:41.120 --> 0:09:44.160 clickbait headline on you know, a Republican marrying a Democrat 0:09:44.240 --> 0:09:47.920 unless it's some horrible, you know version of that, right 0:09:48.000 --> 0:09:49.680 of course, of course, I mean, unless like one of 0:09:49.720 --> 0:09:54.000 them beheads the other one. Uh. Well, so with committed. 0:09:54.480 --> 0:09:56.839 It came out of when I got married. I got 0:09:56.840 --> 0:10:01.120 engaged at thirty four, which isn't geriatric. That's not young either, 0:10:01.679 --> 0:10:04.120 And both my husband and I had lived a life 0:10:04.240 --> 0:10:06.640 before we got married, and we had no idea how 0:10:06.640 --> 0:10:09.680 to be married or join our lives together. And people 0:10:09.760 --> 0:10:11.640 tell you that marriage is hard, but they don't tell 0:10:11.679 --> 0:10:15.920 you why exactly. And I'd also been a celebrity journalist 0:10:16.040 --> 0:10:17.840 for a little while, which is both the best and 0:10:17.920 --> 0:10:20.559 worst job in the entire world. And when you're a 0:10:20.600 --> 0:10:24.960 celebrity journalist, you cover weddings and you covered divorces, but 0:10:25.040 --> 0:10:28.240 you never cover the in between. You never cover the 0:10:28.600 --> 0:10:31.679 mundaneity ees or the messy parts of an actual day 0:10:31.679 --> 0:10:34.920 to day marriage. So we traveled around the world because 0:10:34.960 --> 0:10:38.000 I was a travel journalist for Yahoo when we got married. 0:10:38.160 --> 0:10:42.040 Um so God bless them and their deep pockets, uh, 0:10:42.040 --> 0:10:45.480 and interviewed people about what it means to be married 0:10:45.880 --> 0:10:48.400 and the stories turned into a book called How to 0:10:48.440 --> 0:10:51.560 Be Married, And that book then got optioned as a 0:10:51.559 --> 0:10:56.400 podcast where we explore different couples stories of how do 0:10:56.480 --> 0:10:59.040 you do this? What are the messy parts of your 0:10:59.040 --> 0:11:03.880 marriage that you don't instagram but you don't hashtag, hashtag 0:11:03.960 --> 0:11:07.360 date night uh. And I know that I slag off 0:11:07.400 --> 0:11:09.720 on social media a lot. I slag off on social 0:11:09.720 --> 0:11:11.880 media almost as much as I slag off on San Francisco. 0:11:12.360 --> 0:11:14.400 But I do it because I think it is a 0:11:14.440 --> 0:11:18.200 problem on social media. Everyone's relationship looks perfect and we're 0:11:18.200 --> 0:11:21.160 held we're held to a standard that's not true or 0:11:21.280 --> 0:11:24.679 real and uncommitted. We want to talk about what real 0:11:24.760 --> 0:11:28.079 commitment looks like. So in the beginning, we were we 0:11:28.080 --> 0:11:30.920 were tracking down couples. I would hear stories, I would 0:11:30.920 --> 0:11:34.520 ask people for interesting stories. And now we had twenty 0:11:34.600 --> 0:11:38.079 nine episodes for season one, and you know, a couple 0:11:38.080 --> 0:11:41.320 of million downloads, I think, and now people are coming 0:11:41.320 --> 0:11:44.880 to us. We we get dozens of emails a day 0:11:44.960 --> 0:11:47.800 with people saying, listen to my story. And those are 0:11:47.840 --> 0:11:51.079 actually better than the ones that have been written about 0:11:51.360 --> 0:11:54.440 in the press before, because they're real people. They're real 0:11:54.480 --> 0:11:59.240 people who aren't media trained, who are really open and honest, 0:11:59.400 --> 0:12:01.600 and the has have been some of my favorite episodes. 0:12:02.080 --> 0:12:04.360 It's one of the things I teach my students is 0:12:04.400 --> 0:12:06.120 that one of their assignments is they have to go 0:12:06.160 --> 0:12:08.560 find somebody they interact with in their daily life. But 0:12:08.600 --> 0:12:10.880 don't know very well and wouldn't think have a good 0:12:10.880 --> 0:12:12.640 story and to get a good story out of them, 0:12:12.679 --> 0:12:15.080 because everybody's got great stories. And I think that's one 0:12:15.080 --> 0:12:17.400 of the things that's great about podcasting. And when I 0:12:17.440 --> 0:12:19.920 talk to people, you know, people listen to podcasts, they 0:12:19.920 --> 0:12:23.080 don't really want to hear a celebrity tell the same 0:12:23.120 --> 0:12:25.560 story that they've told on entertainments and I fifty times 0:12:25.600 --> 0:12:29.160 they'd much rather hear, uh, somebody real that they've never 0:12:29.200 --> 0:12:32.640 met who's got a really cool, interesting story that is 0:12:32.760 --> 0:12:36.280 educational and entertaining. I mean, that's the first thing that 0:12:36.360 --> 0:12:39.240 I tell younger people who want to be journalists too. 0:12:39.320 --> 0:12:41.920 I'm like, everyone has a story, and everyone wants to 0:12:41.920 --> 0:12:44.000 tell that story. It's just figuring out what it is. 0:12:44.400 --> 0:12:47.040 One of the best packages that the Wall Street Journal 0:12:47.080 --> 0:12:50.080 ever let me do was on the people behind fashion 0:12:50.120 --> 0:12:53.280 Week because I've covered the glitzy, fancy part of fashion 0:12:53.280 --> 0:12:55.720 week for years um and then I was like, I 0:12:55.800 --> 0:12:57.880 want to do a story on the guys who roll 0:12:58.000 --> 0:13:01.080 out the carpet that the models walked out, or the 0:13:01.120 --> 0:13:04.440 guys who have to spray Tanna model's body before they 0:13:04.440 --> 0:13:07.160 can walk down the runway, and the or the guys 0:13:07.200 --> 0:13:09.199 putting up the tents that that year there happened to 0:13:09.200 --> 0:13:11.120 be a ton of snow during New York Fashion Week, 0:13:11.280 --> 0:13:13.200 and so they had to call in all of these 0:13:13.320 --> 0:13:16.600 unionized construction workers to get the snow off the tents 0:13:16.679 --> 0:13:18.240 to get them up. And I did a story about 0:13:18.240 --> 0:13:21.760 those guys, and those were the best Fashion Week stories 0:13:22.040 --> 0:13:24.720 I've ever done. And I've interviewed every cool designer in 0:13:24.720 --> 0:13:27.360 New York City and they weren't nearly as good as 0:13:27.400 --> 0:13:30.160 those people. Absolutely, you kind of inspired me. I was 0:13:30.200 --> 0:13:32.000 just thinking thinking back to something you said a little 0:13:32.000 --> 0:13:34.080 bit earlier about you know, how people live the Facebook 0:13:34.120 --> 0:13:37.120 them and nobody lives the Facebook life or the Instagram life. 0:13:37.120 --> 0:13:39.560 That's that's the best version that they can come up with. 0:13:39.880 --> 0:13:42.760 I'm recovered, and I do speeches for groups once in 0:13:42.760 --> 0:13:44.000 a while, and one of the things I tell people 0:13:44.080 --> 0:13:46.040 is that you have to understand that everybody has got 0:13:46.080 --> 0:13:48.360 a lot of issues and it's okay to admit them 0:13:48.400 --> 0:13:50.760 because you're not seeing any of that because you're only 0:13:50.760 --> 0:13:54.040 seeing the Instagram in the Facebook. You But how interesting 0:13:54.080 --> 0:13:56.160 is it to think about maybe a social media or 0:13:56.160 --> 0:13:58.679 even maybe it is just through podcasting of having people 0:13:58.720 --> 0:14:01.160 be the real them somewhere, because they're just not. We're 0:14:01.160 --> 0:14:03.640 just kind of raising a whole society right now. That is, 0:14:03.760 --> 0:14:05.760 you know, the whole thing is based on look, how 0:14:05.800 --> 0:14:07.920 good I look and how good I'm doing instead of 0:14:08.000 --> 0:14:09.360 you know, I'm had a bad day. I don't look 0:14:09.360 --> 0:14:11.880 good today. Yeah, exactly exactly. And that's what scares me 0:14:11.920 --> 0:14:15.240 about it because life isn't perfect, life isn't messy, and 0:14:15.280 --> 0:14:17.720 I think the unhappiest people are probably the people that 0:14:17.760 --> 0:14:20.360 are posting the most on social media and that are 0:14:20.600 --> 0:14:23.160 that are looking the most at social media. And I've 0:14:23.200 --> 0:14:26.880 really tempered my social media use. I'm completely off Facebook. Um. 0:14:26.920 --> 0:14:29.600 Except for the occasional odd work post. Most of my 0:14:29.680 --> 0:14:32.960 Instagram is either baby stuff because it's easier than texting 0:14:32.960 --> 0:14:36.200 my mother fifty pictures a day or um. I mean, 0:14:36.240 --> 0:14:37.880 and she really likes it too, like she really just 0:14:37.920 --> 0:14:39.680 gets a kick out of like in those pictures on 0:14:39.760 --> 0:14:42.680 my toddler, or there are things for work. It's my book, 0:14:42.760 --> 0:14:44.440 so this is my podcast, this is what I'm doing, 0:14:44.760 --> 0:14:46.520 and I also do try to be honest and like 0:14:46.560 --> 0:14:48.200 I had a bad day. The baby woke up at 0:14:48.240 --> 0:14:49.920 four thirty m puked and I kind of don't like 0:14:50.000 --> 0:14:51.840 my husband very much today, and I like him again 0:14:51.920 --> 0:14:54.680 this afternoon, but for right now, I kind of want 0:14:54.720 --> 0:14:57.760 to punch him in the face. And I just I 0:14:57.800 --> 0:15:00.320 think we do need to be more authentic and honest, 0:15:00.320 --> 0:15:02.520 because if we're not, what kind of little people are 0:15:02.520 --> 0:15:04.520 we raising? You know, not to just speak to a 0:15:04.560 --> 0:15:07.160 bigger social ill, but one of the number one reasons 0:15:07.160 --> 0:15:10.480 people don't get help when they're depressed, where they have addiction, 0:15:10.800 --> 0:15:12.960 you know, have other things that if they just reached 0:15:12.960 --> 0:15:14.680 out for help, they could, you know, get it. They 0:15:14.720 --> 0:15:17.520 don't because of that because they feel like, well, everybody 0:15:17.520 --> 0:15:20.160 else has got their ship together. It's just something I'm broken. 0:15:20.240 --> 0:15:22.160 It's my fault, you know, and everybody's going to think 0:15:22.200 --> 0:15:24.600 less of me if they find out totally. And it's amazing. 0:15:24.840 --> 0:15:27.440 When I was pregnant last time, I had really bad 0:15:27.480 --> 0:15:31.160 depression and anxiety while I was pregnant, so it wasn't 0:15:31.160 --> 0:15:33.560 even postpartum. It was just like part of depression and 0:15:33.640 --> 0:15:36.280 feeling like ship all the time. Uh. And I wrote 0:15:36.280 --> 0:15:39.280 an essay about it, and then I wrote another essay 0:15:39.280 --> 0:15:42.200 about feeling the same way after I finished breastfeeding, and 0:15:42.560 --> 0:15:45.560 I've written you know, got thousands of articles in my 0:15:45.640 --> 0:15:49.640 life right for for everywhere, for giving outlets from the 0:15:49.640 --> 0:15:53.680 Wall Street Journal to Marie Claire to Glamour everything, And 0:15:54.120 --> 0:15:56.560 those articles are the ones I get emails about on 0:15:57.200 --> 0:15:59.480 on a weekly basis. A woman who's going through that, 0:15:59.520 --> 0:16:02.240 who says, you know, I just look at these images 0:16:02.240 --> 0:16:05.440 of perfect, happy, pregnant women and mothers all the time, 0:16:05.760 --> 0:16:08.600 and thank you for sharing the fact that you felt 0:16:08.600 --> 0:16:11.120 like crap. And so I think that that that's really important, 0:16:11.160 --> 0:16:14.560 and that's part of what Committed does. Every episode of Committed, 0:16:14.600 --> 0:16:16.920 I feel like it does bring you some hope, but 0:16:17.360 --> 0:16:19.920 people also get honest and they get real about the 0:16:20.160 --> 0:16:22.840 times that were hard and the things that hurt them, 0:16:22.880 --> 0:16:25.400 and the times where they wanted to walk away from 0:16:25.440 --> 0:16:27.880 their marriage and they didn't, and the reasons that they stayed. 0:16:28.200 --> 0:16:29.880 And we just need more of that in the world. 0:16:30.200 --> 0:16:33.360 You're right. Martha Quinn, who is one of our radio 0:16:33.360 --> 0:16:35.560 talent and somebody I'm friends with, and and she had 0:16:35.600 --> 0:16:38.520 did a podcast one day and she talked about postpartum 0:16:38.560 --> 0:16:41.280 depression and she made a statement of it was that 0:16:41.400 --> 0:16:43.520 I didn't want to kill myself, but I just some 0:16:43.600 --> 0:16:45.880 days I just didn't want to live and as somebody 0:16:45.880 --> 0:16:48.840 who had suffered and gone through, you know, years of depression. 0:16:49.120 --> 0:16:52.360 It was the first time that I understood what postpartum 0:16:52.400 --> 0:16:54.760 depression was because I was like, yes, I know that 0:16:54.800 --> 0:16:57.160 feeling exactly. I used to have that feeling all the 0:16:57.240 --> 0:16:59.960 time back when I was really suffering. Really made me 0:17:00.080 --> 0:17:03.360 feel closer to her and also just closer to women 0:17:03.400 --> 0:17:06.120 when I read about postpartum depression. Now I'm like, oh, 0:17:06.280 --> 0:17:08.600 we're kind of we're in the same family. I understand 0:17:08.640 --> 0:17:12.560 what it is. Yeah. I interviewed Um Maddie Corman, the actress, 0:17:12.640 --> 0:17:15.880 yesterday for an upcoming episode of Committed, and she's doing 0:17:15.920 --> 0:17:20.000 a one woman show called Accidentally Brave that's absolutely incredible 0:17:20.000 --> 0:17:21.720 in New York right now. I really can't say enough 0:17:21.760 --> 0:17:24.440 about it. And it's a what women show about her 0:17:24.520 --> 0:17:30.879 husband being busted by the FBI with child porn. Um, 0:17:30.960 --> 0:17:33.160 I mean that, and that tends to be the reaction 0:17:33.680 --> 0:17:37.280 to find out, Um, what that shows about. And it's 0:17:37.280 --> 0:17:40.960 a show about how that all went down and how 0:17:41.040 --> 0:17:46.120 she survived it and how her marriage survived it. And 0:17:46.160 --> 0:17:48.199 so that's what this episode of Committed is about. And 0:17:48.240 --> 0:17:50.560 it was such it was it was a beautiful interview 0:17:51.000 --> 0:17:53.240 because it was messy and it was the really it 0:17:53.320 --> 0:17:55.360 was the messiest parts of the marriage that you could 0:17:55.520 --> 0:17:59.399 possibly ever imagine, but then also the strongest parts of 0:17:59.400 --> 0:18:02.480 a marriage. And every everyone's crying at the end of 0:18:02.480 --> 0:18:06.520 the interview. I'm crying, our producer Ramsey's crying, and Mattie 0:18:06.560 --> 0:18:07.800 was telling me, She's like, you know, at the end 0:18:07.840 --> 0:18:10.479 of every single show that I do, people come up 0:18:10.520 --> 0:18:14.000 to me and say thank you because they have Everyone 0:18:14.040 --> 0:18:16.400 has a story. Everyone has something. It may not be 0:18:16.680 --> 0:18:19.159 as extreme as her story, but everyone's got something that 0:18:19.200 --> 0:18:20.560 they need to get off their chest, and they just 0:18:20.600 --> 0:18:23.639 want to hear other people talk about their own ship. Yeah. 0:18:23.680 --> 0:18:25.760 I'm a heart on the sleeve kind of person. And 0:18:26.000 --> 0:18:28.359 I had something happened last week that was I just 0:18:28.720 --> 0:18:30.200 made a faux pau. I said something that was I 0:18:30.200 --> 0:18:32.480 shouldn't have said to somebody, and I was nervous to 0:18:32.480 --> 0:18:34.600 talk to other people about it. But when I did, 0:18:34.920 --> 0:18:37.240 everybody was like, come on, guy, give yourself a break. 0:18:37.840 --> 0:18:40.680 Everybody does this, and then they wanted to unload their 0:18:40.800 --> 0:18:43.760 story of what they had done, which you know, made 0:18:43.800 --> 0:18:45.440 me feel better because I was like, damn, you really 0:18:45.440 --> 0:18:47.959 did say something stupid. But I do feel like that 0:18:48.119 --> 0:18:50.320 is a good kind of give back kind of thing. 0:18:50.359 --> 0:18:52.719 When you give out, people want to give back. It is. 0:18:52.800 --> 0:18:55.240 It is, And I think just people telling their own 0:18:55.280 --> 0:18:58.359 stories and being honest and being open, it's really the 0:18:58.400 --> 0:19:00.560 only way that we're going to connect as humans when 0:19:00.600 --> 0:19:04.040 we're all staring at screens all day long. Who are 0:19:04.080 --> 0:19:07.000 your favorite storytellers? Oh my gosh, does everyone just say 0:19:07.000 --> 0:19:10.320 Ira Glass? I imagine everyone says Ira Glass. I don't 0:19:10.359 --> 0:19:12.000 ask everybody that. Can I sell you a quick Ira 0:19:12.080 --> 0:19:14.280 Glass story? I think yes, and and then I have 0:19:14.280 --> 0:19:17.440 a quick eye re Glass, and let me hear yours first. Mine. 0:19:17.560 --> 0:19:20.520 Mine's not that exciting. It's exciting to me. Though. I 0:19:20.560 --> 0:19:24.240 was in Denver for a religion newswriter's conference. I actually 0:19:24.400 --> 0:19:27.560 weirdly have this masters in religious studies and wrote a 0:19:27.560 --> 0:19:30.919 book about ten badass feminist nuns. It was like this 0:19:31.000 --> 0:19:33.920 alter ego I was living while I was a celebrity journalist. 0:19:33.920 --> 0:19:35.840 I would be like chasing Britney Spears while she hid 0:19:35.840 --> 0:19:37.960 in a closet and shaved her head, and then interviewing 0:19:38.040 --> 0:19:40.679 nuns on the side. It's my dirty little secret. But 0:19:41.440 --> 0:19:43.640 so I was at this religion conference and I guess 0:19:43.680 --> 0:19:45.679 there was a public Variety of conference in town at 0:19:45.680 --> 0:19:48.400 the same time, and both conferences were at a baseball game, 0:19:48.760 --> 0:19:51.000 and I just heard this guy at the concession stand 0:19:51.040 --> 0:19:54.320 in front of me ordering French fries, and I knew 0:19:54.359 --> 0:19:55.880 that it was Ira Glass, and I don't think I 0:19:55.880 --> 0:19:57.840 hadn't I'd never watched the TV show, so I wouldn't 0:19:57.840 --> 0:19:59.840