WEBVTT - Leslie Odom Jr. of Hamilton 0:00:02.000 --> 0:00:06.080 With lockdowns in tense elections and seemingly bad news everywhere, 0:00:06.559 --> 0:00:08.480 we thought we'd lighten things up over here in the 0:00:08.520 --> 0:00:12.559 Broken Record universe and brings some Christmas cheer early with 0:00:12.680 --> 0:00:16.239 none other than Leslie Odom Junior, whose new release is 0:00:16.560 --> 0:00:21.320 the Christmas Album. This is actually Leslie's second Christmas album, 0:00:21.520 --> 0:00:24.319 plus He's released several vocal jazz albums over the last 0:00:24.320 --> 0:00:27.080 few years, but he's best known for his Grammy and 0:00:27.160 --> 0:00:32.280 Tony Award winning performance as Aaron Burr in Hamilton. Leslie 0:00:32.320 --> 0:00:35.199 spoke to Bruce Headlum about his career on stage and 0:00:35.400 --> 0:00:38.880 in music, about his all time favorite Christmas album, which 0:00:39.000 --> 0:00:42.000 is a touchstone of nineties R and B. He also 0:00:42.040 --> 0:00:44.800 talks about how playing a founding and father as a 0:00:44.880 --> 0:00:49.320 black man was an exercise in empathy, and he shares 0:00:49.360 --> 0:00:52.519 a lesson he learned thanks to the incomparable talents of 0:00:52.680 --> 0:01:00.000 Natkin Coole and Sammy Davis Jr. This is Broken Record 0:01:00.480 --> 0:01:04.400 liner notes for the digital age. I'm justin Mischian. Here's 0:01:04.440 --> 0:01:08.679 Bruce Dlam with Leslie Odom Junior. So you're in a 0:01:08.760 --> 0:01:12.759 strange point in your career because you've had a long career. 0:01:13.080 --> 0:01:15.200 People might know you from Rent. People might know you 0:01:15.319 --> 0:01:18.600 from television, but people really got to know you as 0:01:18.640 --> 0:01:21.640 Aaron Burr in Hamilton. Yeah, but now you have this 0:01:21.800 --> 0:01:25.679 music career. And I've had this twice recently where people said, 0:01:25.680 --> 0:01:28.440 oh my god, I'm listening to this guy, Leslie Odom Junior, 0:01:28.920 --> 0:01:31.640 and did you know he was also in Hamilton. Yeah, 0:01:31.680 --> 0:01:33.640 you're like you know when people used to say, you know, 0:01:33.680 --> 0:01:36.160 Paul McCartney was in a band before Wings, you know 0:01:36.200 --> 0:01:41.600 that's you now? Oh man, Thank goodness, no complaints. Because 0:01:41.640 --> 0:01:45.440 I came out to Los Angeles almost twenty years ago 0:01:46.120 --> 0:01:50.000 after graduating from college, and I was doing television and 0:01:50.840 --> 0:01:52.840 my goal really was simple. I I was trying to 0:01:52.880 --> 0:01:56.400 make a living as an artist, and that meant taking 0:01:56.440 --> 0:01:59.360 almost any job on television that people would offer me, 0:01:59.440 --> 0:02:01.760 which I was auditioning for lots and lots of very 0:02:01.800 --> 0:02:09.640 silly sitcoms, very you know, dubious dramas, and I could 0:02:09.639 --> 0:02:11.760 have gotten one of those. I didn't. I didn't get 0:02:11.800 --> 0:02:13.919 any of the one that I really really wanted. But 0:02:13.960 --> 0:02:15.360 I could have gotten one of those, and I could 0:02:15.360 --> 0:02:18.920 have been known for some ridiculous catchphrase or for you know, 0:02:19.360 --> 0:02:24.760 pulling some stupid face to make people laugh. But the 0:02:24.800 --> 0:02:27.400 worst of what I get having been a part of 0:02:27.440 --> 0:02:30.360 the original company of Hamilton is like people saying, pardon me, 0:02:30.400 --> 0:02:33.480 are you Aaron Burrser? You know so I'll take that, 0:02:33.760 --> 0:02:37.280 and I'll also yes, it is. It is my job, 0:02:37.320 --> 0:02:40.639 it is my mission now to continue to make sure 0:02:40.680 --> 0:02:44.080 that that is not the peak, that it's a peak 0:02:44.480 --> 0:02:47.239 in my career. But that but that, Yeah, we continue 0:02:47.280 --> 0:02:50.680 to I continue to push myself and surprise people, surprise 0:02:50.840 --> 0:02:55.519 myself and just keep digging. Will you actually turned down 0:02:55.520 --> 0:02:59.280 a TV show for Hamilton? I did. In fact, I 0:02:59.320 --> 0:03:01.120 think you'd signed the contract and you would right to 0:03:01.120 --> 0:03:03.160 the head of the network and say, please, please, I 0:03:04.120 --> 0:03:06.760 have to do this other thing. Yeah. And they were 0:03:06.760 --> 0:03:09.040 really nice about it. They were his name was his 0:03:09.160 --> 0:03:11.160 name out, I'll give him credit forever. His name is 0:03:11.160 --> 0:03:14.560 Bob Greenblatt. He runs HBO. Now, But I did. I 0:03:14.600 --> 0:03:18.080 went to Bob and I said, I know, thank you 0:03:18.160 --> 0:03:20.680 very much. You guys have given me a contract for 0:03:20.760 --> 0:03:24.760 guaranteed half a million dollars, and man, that's nice, but 0:03:25.280 --> 0:03:28.040 I really want to do this off Broadway show, this 0:03:28.200 --> 0:03:31.200 hip hop musical about the founding fathers. Will you let 0:03:31.200 --> 0:03:35.040 me out of this contract, and he looked at me 0:03:35.120 --> 0:03:38.280 like I was out of my mind, and he said, sure, 0:03:38.640 --> 0:03:41.160 I'll let you out of Are you that's what you 0:03:41.200 --> 0:03:44.160 want to do? Really? And I said yes, and he 0:03:44.320 --> 0:03:46.600 let me out. But it wasn't a point that you 0:03:46.640 --> 0:03:50.600 were feeling a little too comfortable doing TV. You felt 0:03:50.600 --> 0:03:52.800 it was it was safe and you wanted you wanted 0:03:52.800 --> 0:03:56.000 to take a risk. I did. While I didn't know 0:03:56.200 --> 0:03:59.040 what America would feel. I didn't know if the show 0:03:59.080 --> 0:04:02.560 would find an audio, but I knew what I felt 0:04:02.600 --> 0:04:06.640 about Hamilton. You know, it was it was undeniable to 0:04:06.680 --> 0:04:11.440 me how it was changing me from the inside because 0:04:11.520 --> 0:04:13.880 at that point I had been involved in development for 0:04:13.920 --> 0:04:18.200 a few years and this, this little show was not 0:04:18.240 --> 0:04:21.160 only making me a better actor and a better performer, 0:04:21.560 --> 0:04:23.120 you know, it was making me a better husband. It 0:04:23.200 --> 0:04:25.960 was making me a better friend. It was making me 0:04:26.000 --> 0:04:28.159 a better citizen, like you know, it was making me 0:04:28.200 --> 0:04:31.480 a better human being. And listen, the TV show was nice, 0:04:31.520 --> 0:04:34.040 but it wasn't doing that. You know, when I'm talking 0:04:34.040 --> 0:04:37.000 to young people, I say this, it's really important that 0:04:37.080 --> 0:04:41.080 you know what you're in it for. You really have 0:04:41.160 --> 0:04:43.960 to know what you're in it for. Whatever, whatever game 0:04:43.960 --> 0:04:48.000 you're playing, whether it's finance, so whether it's medicine or 0:04:48.640 --> 0:04:51.080 your nurse, whatever, whatever, you know, what are you in 0:04:51.160 --> 0:04:54.960 it for? Because when the thing shows up, you want 0:04:55.000 --> 0:04:57.719 to recognize it. Don't miss it when it comes, you know. 0:04:57.720 --> 0:05:00.120 And so if you're in it for the dough, if 0:05:00.160 --> 0:05:03.920 you're in it for the promotion, if you're in it 0:05:04.360 --> 0:05:09.640 for validation or chicks or a great car, whatever it 0:05:09.800 --> 0:05:11.520 is that you at the end of the day, like 0:05:11.600 --> 0:05:14.680 I got in it for this reason, know it so 0:05:14.760 --> 0:05:19.040 that you don't miss it when it comes. And Hamilton, 0:05:19.279 --> 0:05:23.560 you know, a piece of art like that, That is 0:05:23.600 --> 0:05:27.080 why I got in it. Rent was the show that 0:05:27.160 --> 0:05:30.960 brought me to the theater. And you know, my favorite 0:05:31.000 --> 0:05:34.000 quote about art and artists is that an artist spends 0:05:34.040 --> 0:05:36.160 their entire life trying to get back to the place 0:05:36.160 --> 0:05:38.560 where their heart was first opened up. And that's what 0:05:38.600 --> 0:05:40.320 Hamilton did for me. It made me feel like that 0:05:40.400 --> 0:05:42.520 thirteen year old kid again. That's what I was in 0:05:42.560 --> 0:05:44.159 it for. So it didn't matter if it was half 0:05:44.160 --> 0:05:47.640 a million dollars or a million dollars or eight million dollars. 0:05:47.800 --> 0:05:51.000 I was not walking away from the reason why I 0:05:51.040 --> 0:05:54.000 started on the path in the first place. Was there 0:05:54.040 --> 0:05:57.560 a moment with Hamilton where you thought, Okay, this actually 0:05:57.680 --> 0:06:00.720 is going to succeed. It is I don't mean artistically, 0:06:00.800 --> 0:06:03.480 that this is going to be bigger? Like, was there 0:06:03.520 --> 0:06:04.920 a point you're like, oh, this this is going to 0:06:05.000 --> 0:06:08.039 work now. I don't remember the exact day, but it 0:06:08.080 --> 0:06:12.280 was pretty soon after we opened on Broadway, and you know, 0:06:12.320 --> 0:06:15.760 we had the confirmation of those box office receipts, you know, 0:06:15.839 --> 0:06:18.080 you had you had the confirmation of the of the 0:06:18.279 --> 0:06:22.200 record breaking advanced sales. Because that that's what that's what 0:06:22.279 --> 0:06:24.960 matters in the commercial theater and the commercial theater, commercial 0:06:25.000 --> 0:06:28.360 success is what matters. And once we were confirmed that 0:06:28.400 --> 0:06:31.440 it was going going to be that, I had to 0:06:31.480 --> 0:06:37.719 wait until then because the business is littered with great 0:06:38.000 --> 0:06:42.159 art and artists that were not appreciated or celebrated in 0:06:42.200 --> 0:06:46.360 their time. You know, Stephen Sondheim is known, you know, 0:06:46.680 --> 0:06:50.159 um revered as one of the great may possibly the 0:06:50.360 --> 0:06:56.479 greatest songwriter for the American theater. You know, he's brilliant. 0:06:56.720 --> 0:07:00.320 And most to Sondheim shows, including shows like West Hide 0:07:00.360 --> 0:07:04.440 Story and these shows were not successful in their original run. 0:07:05.200 --> 0:07:07.000 They ran a year, a year and a half some 0:07:07.160 --> 0:07:09.600 of them, you know, a lot of them. They just 0:07:09.680 --> 0:07:11.960 people just didn't they weren't feeling them in their time. 0:07:12.000 --> 0:07:13.960 So I didn't know if Hamilton would fall into that 0:07:14.080 --> 0:07:16.880 category even once we went to Broadway, so I had 0:07:16.920 --> 0:07:19.760 to wait with my fingers crossed. Now, I'm sure you've 0:07:19.760 --> 0:07:24.800 heard this many times. I saw Hamilton's first at the Public, 0:07:25.320 --> 0:07:28.120 and then I saw it several times because Lynn Manuel 0:07:28.160 --> 0:07:29.720 Miranda actually wrote for me when I was at the 0:07:29.720 --> 0:07:32.200 New York Times. But I remember being there at the Public. 0:07:32.400 --> 0:07:35.320 You came out and there was a ripple in the 0:07:35.320 --> 0:07:37.960 audience and people said, oh my god, that guy is 0:07:37.960 --> 0:07:40.520 a star. I don't mean you're out shining the production, 0:07:40.600 --> 0:07:43.000 but there's just something about when you came out. I 0:07:43.040 --> 0:07:45.840 think people just kind of felt, I don't know, there's 0:07:45.840 --> 0:07:48.040 a kind of electricity that you don't often feel at 0:07:48.040 --> 0:07:50.560 the theater for you. Was there that kind of personal 0:07:50.640 --> 0:07:54.440 validation right away? Well, I mean, thank you for saying that. 0:07:54.480 --> 0:07:59.360 I think that as a young person, the only way 0:07:59.400 --> 0:08:04.000 you really build self esteem is you got to prove 0:08:04.120 --> 0:08:07.280 certain things to yourself. You know, we all have an 0:08:07.320 --> 0:08:11.280 idea about what we're capable of, what we might be 0:08:11.360 --> 0:08:14.160 capable of if someone just gave us the opportunity. If 0:08:14.200 --> 0:08:17.400 we just had the chance to show, to prove, I 0:08:17.440 --> 0:08:20.640 think I could be a contender, you know. And it's 0:08:20.680 --> 0:08:25.840 all theory until you make something, or until someone invites 0:08:25.880 --> 0:08:29.120 you to make something, you know, it's it's all conjecture. 0:08:29.560 --> 0:08:32.160 And what Lynn did for a room of people, for 0:08:32.240 --> 0:08:35.679 a room of mostly black and brown people, was he 0:08:35.720 --> 0:08:39.000 gave us the evidence of what was of what we 0:08:39.080 --> 0:08:43.600 suspected about ourselves. He let us prove it firstly to 0:08:43.640 --> 0:08:47.040 ourselves that we are capable of more than we are 0:08:47.080 --> 0:08:51.439 being asked to do most of the time. And yes, 0:08:51.559 --> 0:08:55.680 and then we got to stand on stage and show 0:08:56.520 --> 0:08:59.520 little black and brown children who looked like us, that 0:08:59.600 --> 0:09:02.640 same thing. And we got to show a little you know, 0:09:02.840 --> 0:09:05.600 not for nothing, we got to show little white kids too, 0:09:05.960 --> 0:09:10.199 what you know that that you know? I say, of course, 0:09:10.240 --> 0:09:13.600 I was very lucky to have the education that I 0:09:13.600 --> 0:09:16.199 had at Carnegie Mellon University, for instance, you know, where 0:09:16.280 --> 0:09:18.920 where the majority of my classmates were white. But you 0:09:18.960 --> 0:09:22.640 know who also benefited from my presence at Carnegie Mellon University. 0:09:22.880 --> 0:09:26.840 My white classmates also benefited from a diverse environment, from 0:09:27.080 --> 0:09:32.720 from sharing across you know, cultural boundaries, and having friends 0:09:32.760 --> 0:09:35.559 and collaborators that don't only look like them. So it 0:09:35.600 --> 0:09:37.600 was it's a really it's a gift that Lynn has 0:09:37.640 --> 0:09:41.880 given the world this show. So we want to talk 0:09:41.880 --> 0:09:45.840 about Christmas albums, let's do it. And I want to 0:09:45.840 --> 0:09:50.800 know first what Christmas music did you have growing up? Yeah, 0:09:50.840 --> 0:09:52.920 I grew up in the album era, so I remember 0:09:53.000 --> 0:09:55.000 the Christmas albums we had that got pulled to the 0:09:55.000 --> 0:09:57.400 front of the stack. What what was your Christmas music 0:09:57.440 --> 0:10:01.360 growing up? The one that left the biggest impression on me. 0:10:01.960 --> 0:10:04.480 I have to say, I hope your audience is aware 0:10:04.600 --> 0:10:07.559 of it because it's a it is a classic. I 0:10:08.040 --> 0:10:11.840 grew up in Philadelphia at the time where you know, 0:10:12.000 --> 0:10:14.439 in Philly you couldn't get bigger than Boys to Men. 0:10:14.720 --> 0:10:16.960 I went to the same high school as Boys to Men. 0:10:17.080 --> 0:10:20.559 They were older than me, but Boys to Men was huge. 0:10:21.120 --> 0:10:25.080 You know. They they dressed like us, they talked like us, 0:10:25.280 --> 0:10:28.400 They they wore us, you know, on the national stage. 0:10:29.040 --> 0:10:31.800 And at one of their peaks that you know, peak 0:10:31.920 --> 0:10:34.559 power for them, they put out this beautiful Christmas record. 0:10:34.559 --> 0:10:36.760 If you have not heard it, go listen to it. 0:10:36.760 --> 0:10:41.080 It is it is like it's a shining example of 0:10:41.880 --> 0:10:44.560 R and B. Yes, that's rhythm and blues, but there's 0:10:44.559 --> 0:10:46.640 that joke and dream Girls, you know, rough and black. 0:10:46.840 --> 0:10:49.440 I mean like it is, it is, you know, the 0:10:49.520 --> 0:10:54.560 black contribution. Part of our contribution to American culture in 0:10:54.559 --> 0:10:57.160 this and music is R and B. It's one of 0:10:57.200 --> 0:11:00.800 our contributions. And yeah, this is it's just a beautiful record, man. 0:11:00.840 --> 0:11:04.640 So the Boys to Men album was like the first 0:11:04.840 --> 0:11:08.319 Christmas album that was mine, that wasn't my parents, you know, 0:11:08.320 --> 0:11:11.520 because my parents were listening to the Jackson five and 0:11:11.559 --> 0:11:13.680 they were listening and that King Cole of course, and 0:11:13.679 --> 0:11:16.920 they were listening to you know, the classics in that way. 0:11:16.960 --> 0:11:19.800 But if you were coming of age at any point 0:11:19.880 --> 0:11:23.360 in the nineties, it's nostalgic too, and the same way 0:11:23.400 --> 0:11:27.440 that Mariah's is nostalgic. You know, it reminds you of 0:11:27.480 --> 0:11:32.080 a certain kind of pure R and B. You know, 0:11:32.240 --> 0:11:36.599 that was not over sexualized, and it's like there's like 0:11:36.640 --> 0:11:39.600 a wholesome quality to it. Who knew that the nineties 0:11:39.679 --> 0:11:43.240 had had a wholesome patina, but you listen to that, 0:11:43.240 --> 0:11:46.240 that album and you'll hear it. Well, I'm older than you, 0:11:46.360 --> 0:11:48.640 So for us, it was I think Ray Charles, I 0:11:48.679 --> 0:11:51.040 don't know if you know his Christmas album, I don't 0:11:51.080 --> 0:11:53.800 know the Ray Charles Christmas album. Oh you gotta get 0:11:53.800 --> 0:11:57.160 the Ray Charles Christmas House is what is um? Baby 0:11:57.160 --> 0:11:59.160 It's cold outside? Is that? Or was that a single? 0:12:00.080 --> 0:12:02.040 That was a single? But usually when you buy it now, 0:12:03.080 --> 0:12:05.280 I think with Betty Carter, that's right. They tack it 0:12:05.360 --> 0:12:08.760 on the end, and that's a great version. It's the 0:12:08.840 --> 0:12:12.480 only version I know. Baby. It's people, you know, for 0:12:12.559 --> 0:12:14.559 good reason, they are trying to get that song canceled. 0:12:14.640 --> 0:12:17.240 But but you can't cancel Betty Carter and Ray Charles, 0:12:17.280 --> 0:12:19.959 give me a break. No. No. Part of the problem though, 0:12:20.000 --> 0:12:22.360 is these you know, you've done your own albums, You've 0:12:22.360 --> 0:12:24.960 written a lot of your own songs, you've taken on 0:12:25.000 --> 0:12:28.880 some classics. But when you do Christmas songs, they're so 0:12:29.600 --> 0:12:33.120 locked in people's memories. It's just so much attached to it. 0:12:33.480 --> 0:12:35.520 I just want to talk a bit about how do 0:12:35.559 --> 0:12:37.360 you sit down and say what am I going to 0:12:37.440 --> 0:12:39.400 bring to this that people are gonna remember? Are they 0:12:39.440 --> 0:12:42.200 just gonna have Andy Williams going through their head? How 0:12:42.200 --> 0:12:45.360 did you do that with both albums, but mainly this album, Well, 0:12:45.360 --> 0:12:49.319 we had the practice of having done it once before, 0:12:49.880 --> 0:12:53.400 and that that first Christmas album was very challenging number one, 0:12:53.440 --> 0:12:57.560 because we were so limited in our resources at that time. 0:12:57.600 --> 0:13:00.440 That was the first album I made post hand. So 0:13:00.480 --> 0:13:02.240 I made it I think the summer that I left 0:13:02.320 --> 0:13:06.320 Hamilton and me and my manager we just really didn't 0:13:06.360 --> 0:13:09.520 We didn't know anybody. We were not really in the 0:13:09.640 --> 0:13:12.080 music industry yet, you know, so we we were very 0:13:12.160 --> 0:13:15.680 limited in our budget and in our resources. And so 0:13:15.840 --> 0:13:19.400 when you're limited in that way, of course, parameters are 0:13:19.320 --> 0:13:24.480 always great for art. Intention is important. Intention becomes very important. 0:13:24.520 --> 0:13:26.679 And I was I was like, okay, well, what we 0:13:26.760 --> 0:13:30.440 don't have in bells and whistles, you know, we have 0:13:30.600 --> 0:13:33.439 to come from a sincere place, which is harder than 0:13:33.480 --> 0:13:36.360 it sounds, because you think, you know, I'll just I'll 0:13:36.400 --> 0:13:38.800 sing Silent Night and I'll sing these Oh Holy I'll 0:13:38.800 --> 0:13:41.240 sing these songs that I've known them my whole life. 0:13:41.600 --> 0:13:45.840 But you go, when I go to listen back, nobody's 0:13:45.880 --> 0:13:50.040 more critical on on my voice than I and it 0:13:50.160 --> 0:13:53.800 just didn't sound honest. It took it. I recorded that 0:13:53.960 --> 0:13:57.600 first album probably at least two full times, you know, 0:13:57.720 --> 0:14:01.640 just top to bottom, because it it I had to 0:14:01.679 --> 0:14:05.520 hear the sincerity, and when it goes Christmas, it can 0:14:05.520 --> 0:14:09.280 go Sacharin. It can go corny real quick. You know, 0:14:09.320 --> 0:14:11.680 there's something about I don't know, the lights and the 0:14:11.720 --> 0:14:14.559 trees and the presence that you know, we yeah, it 0:14:14.600 --> 0:14:16.760 just it just goes corny. And I just didn't want that. 0:14:16.880 --> 0:14:19.800 So anyway, we built on that with this record. Having 0:14:19.840 --> 0:14:23.520 recorded that album and then performing those songs live for 0:14:24.000 --> 0:14:27.800 a few years now, we didn't have that that same challenge. 0:14:28.200 --> 0:14:30.200 I can hear it right away, you know. When I 0:14:30.720 --> 0:14:34.000 go to start these songs. Always what I do when 0:14:34.040 --> 0:14:36.400 I'm covering any song, if it's a jazz song or 0:14:36.400 --> 0:14:39.800 a pop song, I started that original melody. I try 0:14:39.880 --> 0:14:43.480 not to start at one of the covers that I've heard. 0:14:43.520 --> 0:14:46.480 I try to find the original version and let me, 0:14:46.600 --> 0:14:48.920 let me learn that original melody, let me hear what 0:14:48.960 --> 0:14:53.440 those initial instincts were from the writer and from the composer, 0:14:53.920 --> 0:14:56.200 and then we take it from there. We you know, im, 0:14:56.400 --> 0:15:00.440 it's always a collaboration. I may have idea is but 0:15:01.040 --> 0:15:07.560 Tommy King as a brilliant pianist who was instrumental in 0:15:07.600 --> 0:15:10.760 that first album, that first album. People talk all the 0:15:10.800 --> 0:15:13.640 time about the piano solo on my favorite things. That's 0:15:13.680 --> 0:15:18.720 all Tommy King. That's just his beautiful mind and talent. 0:15:19.080 --> 0:15:21.120 But he we worked with Tommy again on this and 0:15:21.160 --> 0:15:24.960 then also we took the now, all these years later, 0:15:25.000 --> 0:15:28.720 the resources and the and the budget we've we've been 0:15:28.760 --> 0:15:32.040 able to wrestle from the record company, and we were 0:15:32.080 --> 0:15:35.720 able to make something that sounded a little fuller, a 0:15:35.720 --> 0:15:38.600 little more joy a lot more joyful. Actually, we took 0:15:38.760 --> 0:15:42.480 all the things we'd learned making mister m that that 0:15:42.560 --> 0:15:45.320 original album that I have outu and we you know 0:15:45.640 --> 0:15:48.640 call got the band back together as it were, and 0:15:49.200 --> 0:15:52.040 made this one on the new album you do uh 0:15:52.160 --> 0:15:54.560 it's beginning to look a lot like Christmas, and you 0:15:54.600 --> 0:15:56.960 do it in a very different way. Now people know 0:15:57.040 --> 0:16:00.800 that song from Bing Crosby, they know it from Perry 0:16:00.840 --> 0:16:03.120 Como I think did a big version of Michael Boublet 0:16:03.120 --> 0:16:06.720 of course. So yeah, so when you sat down to 0:16:06.760 --> 0:16:08.920 do it, what were you what were you thinking? Were 0:16:08.920 --> 0:16:10.520 you thinking I can't do it like them? Or just 0:16:10.600 --> 0:16:13.560 like get them out of my head? Somehow we went 0:16:13.680 --> 0:16:16.000 we went back to that original arrangement and we and 0:16:16.080 --> 0:16:19.520 we recorded it that way. And then this one I 0:16:19.560 --> 0:16:22.760 have to give you know, hats off to Joey. Joseph 0:16:22.760 --> 0:16:26.440 Abat my producer. He heard that bassa, he just heard it. 0:16:26.520 --> 0:16:27.880 He was like, Leslie, you know, can we try it 0:16:27.880 --> 0:16:30.440 in a bassa? And I'm sure you know, I'll try 0:16:30.440 --> 0:16:34.000 it anyway. And so the band we had a trio 0:16:34.120 --> 0:16:36.680 in the studio that day, all COVID safe, we'd all 0:16:36.720 --> 0:16:40.320 taken our taken our tests, and we were all you know, 0:16:40.680 --> 0:16:43.400 separated in the studio. We you know, we never got 0:16:43.440 --> 0:16:46.680 within six feet of one another. But something locked in 0:16:46.720 --> 0:16:50.400 with the bassa and we know enough now to trust 0:16:50.600 --> 0:16:54.960 those Quincy calls goose bumps. You know, God's lightning rod, 0:16:55.640 --> 0:16:57.320 you know, I mean, you know, when you when you 0:16:57.360 --> 0:16:59.920 get a little bit of that goes a long way. Man. 0:17:00.040 --> 0:17:02.600 If you get if you there's that's something to follow. 0:17:03.080 --> 0:17:05.040 And I'll tell you when we when we recorded the 0:17:05.080 --> 0:17:09.200 Perry Como version, it wasn't no goosebumps. It sounded fine, 0:17:09.280 --> 0:17:11.280 it sounded nice, but yeah, you're like, uh, do we 0:17:11.320 --> 0:17:13.760 need another version? And it had we had Joseph not 0:17:14.000 --> 0:17:17.040 had the bossa idea, the song probably wouldn't have made 0:17:17.080 --> 0:17:20.080 the cut to the record. But once we locked into 0:17:20.160 --> 0:17:23.840 that bossa, you get the goosebumps, and you know, we 0:17:23.960 --> 0:17:27.639 found the right key, and you study, it's beginning to 0:17:27.840 --> 0:17:36.520 look a lot like Christmas and everywhere you go ain't 0:17:36.520 --> 0:17:41.240 gonna look at the five and ten listening once again, 0:17:42.720 --> 0:17:48.920 candy canes and silver lanes or glow. It's speaking and 0:17:49.080 --> 0:17:51.520 to look a lot, you know, like when once that 0:17:51.640 --> 0:17:55.639 bossa rhythm kicked in, and just different instincts. You know, 0:17:55.680 --> 0:17:58.359 I get different instincts as a singer, as an artist, 0:17:58.400 --> 0:18:00.920 and um, I don't judge those things, you know, I don't. 0:18:00.920 --> 0:18:04.000 I don't judge those I think art, when it's working, 0:18:04.600 --> 0:18:08.240 it exists on a conscious and a subconscious level. So 0:18:08.280 --> 0:18:11.679 there's things when when you're in flow, there's things you're doing. 0:18:11.920 --> 0:18:17.399 You're bringing up childhood stuff, your childhood inspirations and instincts. 0:18:17.160 --> 0:18:20.800 It's you know, we're made up of so much stuff. 0:18:20.840 --> 0:18:24.239 So it flows down in the bassa and we do it. 0:18:24.320 --> 0:18:27.040 You know, I don't know not much. Three or four times, 0:18:27.359 --> 0:18:30.479 you know, with the musician's top to bottom it works, 0:18:30.720 --> 0:18:33.639 and then I do come back and record the vocal 0:18:33.680 --> 0:18:36.040 a few more time until I like it. And that 0:18:36.200 --> 0:18:38.800 once it went into the bassa field. The next thing 0:18:38.920 --> 0:18:41.760 was just to really figure out the phrasing of each 0:18:41.800 --> 0:18:44.760 one of it because it's the different time signature, So 0:18:45.080 --> 0:18:47.680 the phrasing has to change in a way that feels natural, 0:18:47.840 --> 0:18:50.080 in a way that doesn't ever take you out of it. 0:18:50.160 --> 0:18:54.080 Because people have a version of that tune that that 0:18:54.080 --> 0:18:56.119 that sits really well with them. If you're going to 0:18:56.200 --> 0:18:58.080 take them out of that groove, if you're going to 0:18:58.119 --> 0:19:00.640 take them out of that zone, you to make sure 0:19:00.640 --> 0:19:03.480 it goes down just as easy. We'll be back with 0:19:03.560 --> 0:19:10.600 Leslie right after this break. Here's more of Bruce Hedlum's 0:19:10.640 --> 0:19:14.480 conversation with Leslie Odom Jr. The other song I want 0:19:14.480 --> 0:19:16.120 to ask you about, and it was on your first 0:19:16.200 --> 0:19:18.600 Christmas album before we come back to your second one, 0:19:19.320 --> 0:19:22.199 was the Christmas Song because I can't think of a 0:19:22.200 --> 0:19:26.200 song that has a more authoritative version than the Nat 0:19:26.240 --> 0:19:30.640 King Cole. Yeah, and that's a high, high bar. How 0:19:30.640 --> 0:19:33.080 do you tackle something that Nat King cold it? Well, 0:19:33.080 --> 0:19:36.840 we when we went in to get our record deal 0:19:37.280 --> 0:19:40.120 and went into ask Curve to meet with Stephen Greenberg, 0:19:40.200 --> 0:19:42.560 we said we wanted to make the kind of music 0:19:42.600 --> 0:19:45.560 that Nat King Cole might make today, and we didn't 0:19:45.600 --> 0:19:48.040 we didn't really know what that meant. But we knew 0:19:48.040 --> 0:19:52.480 it sounded good and we knew you know, it got 0:19:52.520 --> 0:19:55.320 a to give you money. Yeah, that's all it needed 0:19:55.320 --> 0:19:59.760 to be. I think really we once we made mister, 0:20:00.160 --> 0:20:02.280 you know, that album of all original music, I looked 0:20:02.280 --> 0:20:04.679 at Joseph and I was like, we That's why intentions 0:20:04.680 --> 0:20:07.280 are important. The intention. That was our intention from the 0:20:07.400 --> 0:20:10.560 very beginning. Even we did, you know, we didn't know 0:20:10.600 --> 0:20:12.439 how we were going to get there. We didn't quite 0:20:12.480 --> 0:20:16.040 know what that meant. But that's what we've been after, 0:20:16.200 --> 0:20:20.720 and so I learned a lot. It was challenging, you know, 0:20:20.720 --> 0:20:24.040 but I've learned a lot trying to be Nat King Cole. 0:20:24.480 --> 0:20:26.600 Kind of the first thing you learned is that I'm 0:20:26.640 --> 0:20:28.920 never going to be Nat King Cole. You know, he 0:20:29.520 --> 0:20:35.520 was everything he was in He synthesized his time, everything 0:20:35.560 --> 0:20:38.040 about his time made him. Do you know? There was 0:20:38.080 --> 0:20:44.160 a something radical about Nat because to be that unflappable, 0:20:44.520 --> 0:20:49.040 to be that cool in the midst of the climate 0:20:49.080 --> 0:20:53.120 of this country, to come in that package beautiful yes, 0:20:53.240 --> 0:20:56.240 handsome yes, but a dark skin brother, you know, because 0:20:56.280 --> 0:21:00.240 there's racism and then there's colorism too in America that 0:21:00.440 --> 0:21:05.040 you know, even within the spectrum the evil spectrum of racism, 0:21:05.480 --> 0:21:08.280 that if you were light you were treated better than 0:21:08.320 --> 0:21:11.199 if you were dark. You know, that's that's sort of 0:21:11.240 --> 0:21:16.879 built into the horror show of our history. And for 0:21:17.160 --> 0:21:22.120 Nat to find his cool, to find his his footing 0:21:22.200 --> 0:21:24.320 and his confidence in the midst of all that, you 0:21:24.359 --> 0:21:28.399 know that that's radical. He was a unicorn, and he was, 0:21:29.480 --> 0:21:33.960 in his own way an iconoclassed, you know, an activist 0:21:34.200 --> 0:21:36.719 just by existing, you know, you let us know what 0:21:36.760 --> 0:21:40.520 was what was possible if you dared to be excellent anyway. 0:21:40.760 --> 0:21:43.680 So but for me, I live in a different time, 0:21:44.320 --> 0:21:47.840 a different country, has formed me, the same thing does 0:21:47.880 --> 0:21:51.920 not apply. I had a really astute coach tell me 0:21:52.080 --> 0:21:56.560 once about sort of my this cool affect that I 0:21:56.680 --> 0:21:59.439 was putting on at one point, because we try to 0:22:00.160 --> 0:22:02.879 later our heroes, you know, I was so I was 0:22:02.920 --> 0:22:04.840 trying to early on in my career, trying to be 0:22:04.920 --> 0:22:07.560 some version of Sammy Davis Junior Slash and at King 0:22:07.640 --> 0:22:11.040 Cole Slash, you know, these guys. And he said, it's 0:22:11.080 --> 0:22:16.040 not gonna work on you. He said, because it is 0:22:16.160 --> 0:22:18.719 very clear to me, it's very apparent to me that 0:22:18.760 --> 0:22:22.000 you've been loved your whole life, Your parents loved you, 0:22:22.040 --> 0:22:24.840 didn't they I said, yes they did. He said, yeah, 0:22:24.840 --> 0:22:29.399 it shows you got you gotta work harder, you have 0:22:29.440 --> 0:22:32.000 to pull from a different place. He said, what those 0:22:32.040 --> 0:22:35.760