WEBVTT - Episode 4: “The Cave” 0:00:12.119 --> 0:00:14.800 At the end of the last episode, a source told 0:00:14.880 --> 0:00:18.280 us about a guy named Mike allegedly at a dance 0:00:18.320 --> 0:00:22.240 with Dana and a sinking feeling she had that Mike 0:00:22.680 --> 0:00:27.040 was going to do something very bad to Dana. And 0:00:27.080 --> 0:00:29.240 while you can't spend much time in the world of 0:00:29.280 --> 0:00:32.720 true crime without learning that you should definitely listen to 0:00:32.800 --> 0:00:37.200 your gut. A sinking feeling is not evidence of wrongdoing, 0:00:37.880 --> 0:00:41.720 and it means nothing in the scope of Dana's murder investigation. 0:00:42.680 --> 0:00:48.080 At best, it's hearsay. If my source would have stopped there, however, 0:00:48.479 --> 0:00:51.040 we could write off the information as coming from an 0:00:51.120 --> 0:00:54.520 over excited teenager wanting to be caught up in the 0:00:54.600 --> 0:01:04.720 drama of a local murder. But she didn't. Who told 0:01:04.760 --> 0:01:05.960 you his name was Mike. 0:01:06.160 --> 0:01:09.039 Just some other people that kind of knew her, that 0:01:09.080 --> 0:01:11.240 were a little bit younger than me, that were more 0:01:11.280 --> 0:01:14.160 of her age. They told me because I had been 0:01:14.200 --> 0:01:17.360 telling him to watch out for this guy, that something's wrong. 0:01:17.840 --> 0:01:19.759 And then I think it was a guy that knew 0:01:19.800 --> 0:01:22.800 and Mike he said that, uh yeah, he said, she 0:01:22.800 --> 0:01:26.280 she is missing. You know, some guy named Mike was 0:01:26.280 --> 0:01:29.960 with her that night. And then I, you know, asked him, well, 0:01:30.000 --> 0:01:31.720 what did he look like And then they told me 0:01:31.760 --> 0:01:33.920 I said, yeah, that's the guy. I think he was 0:01:33.959 --> 0:01:35.480 going to kill her. And then next thing I know, 0:01:35.680 --> 0:01:39.000 and I said, well, they found her. And they found 0:01:39.000 --> 0:01:42.319 her a few miles from that wonderland cave in Bella Vista. 0:01:45.319 --> 0:01:48.040 My source wound up talking to a few other friends 0:01:48.080 --> 0:01:51.680 from Bella Vista voicing her concerns about Dana and that 0:01:51.920 --> 0:01:56.240 night she supposedly saw her. And I need to point 0:01:56.240 --> 0:01:59.440 out there was more than one person of interest the 0:01:59.480 --> 0:02:03.680 bcs SO looked at named Mike, and Mike McMillan told 0:02:03.720 --> 0:02:06.920 me I worked at the cave, but not until years 0:02:07.000 --> 0:02:10.880 after Dana went missing, when I turned twenty one. No way, 0:02:11.200 --> 0:02:12.239 I was there that night. 0:02:15.480 --> 0:02:18.840 So they said, well, they hang out at the hill. 0:02:18.840 --> 0:02:22.920 What's that And they said it's up there at Bella Vista. 0:02:23.040 --> 0:02:25.320 They said, you go up there and you go past 0:02:25.360 --> 0:02:29.120 that grocery store about two or three miles and then 0:02:29.160 --> 0:02:31.760 there'll be a little dirt road off to the left 0:02:31.840 --> 0:02:34.840 right before you go up a hill. So I drove 0:02:34.880 --> 0:02:36.720 out there and I seen this little road. It's like 0:02:36.760 --> 0:02:39.920 a Friday or Saturday night because that's where they said 0:02:40.200 --> 0:02:42.720 people her age and then kids from grabbing hung out. 0:02:43.120 --> 0:02:46.079 So I drove out there. I guess they partied out there. 0:02:46.360 --> 0:02:50.720 It was like an open field and there were four 0:02:50.800 --> 0:02:56.160 people out there. There was three guys and another girl. 0:02:57.120 --> 0:03:00.560 And I get out of the car and it's that 0:03:00.800 --> 0:03:05.240 same guy Mike again, this other guy that I knew 0:03:05.360 --> 0:03:08.640 that was a little a little younger than me, Diana's ages, 0:03:08.800 --> 0:03:13.160 and then this kind of longheaded blondish girl. And I said, oh, 0:03:13.200 --> 0:03:17.320 I said, do y'all know Dana Stidham. Didn't she go 0:03:17.520 --> 0:03:21.560 missing around here somewhere? Those guys didn't say that that 0:03:21.680 --> 0:03:25.760 they were drinking beer, you know, out of cans. She says, yeah, 0:03:26.000 --> 0:03:28.679 I'll tell you what. You better leave here right now, 0:03:28.800 --> 0:03:32.320 because if you don't, she says, the same thing's going 0:03:32.400 --> 0:03:33.240 to happen to you. 0:03:34.240 --> 0:03:36.880 I asked my source the name of the girl on 0:03:36.920 --> 0:03:40.520 the hill as we'll call her. As it turns out, 0:03:40.800 --> 0:03:44.920 she's someone Dana knew very well and was seen by 0:03:44.960 --> 0:03:50.800 several witnesses with Dana that night she disappeared. Unfortunately, I 0:03:50.840 --> 0:03:57.920 can't interview her. She died some time ago. After our conversation, 0:03:58.200 --> 0:04:02.160 I spoke to a detective and related this information. The 0:04:02.240 --> 0:04:06.200 detective knows this source how she can ramble, and how 0:04:06.240 --> 0:04:08.480 tempted I might be to write off what she says 0:04:08.520 --> 0:04:13.720 as hyperbolic nonsense. But the detective stressed to me, quote, 0:04:14.320 --> 0:04:20.160 don't discount what she tells you. After that warning from 0:04:20.160 --> 0:04:23.719 the girl on the hill, my source became unsettled. 0:04:23.960 --> 0:04:25.960 And I went and got in my car and left. 0:04:26.200 --> 0:04:27.840 I was like, I got to get out of here, 0:04:27.880 --> 0:04:29.719 because I don't know what they're going to do, you know. 0:04:30.240 --> 0:04:32.720 And I went and told a few more people about it, 0:04:33.560 --> 0:04:36.640 and they just said, well, the guy that was with 0:04:36.839 --> 0:04:40.039 Dana that night, he's friends with some dirty cops, so 0:04:40.520 --> 0:04:42.760 you don't want to get involved in it because they 0:04:42.839 --> 0:04:47.960 might do something to you. So about fifteen years ago, 0:04:48.360 --> 0:04:51.600 I knew a die work the Shriff's office that I 0:04:51.760 --> 0:04:53.320 talked to a little bit about it. 0:04:53.839 --> 0:04:58.039 I verified that she had told others about this. What 0:04:58.200 --> 0:05:00.880 she relayed to me next is the mo most disturbing 0:05:00.960 --> 0:05:05.400 part of her account. And you'll hear a name bleeped up. 0:05:06.360 --> 0:05:08.880 It's the name of a police officer. 0:05:09.960 --> 0:05:14.440 What I understand is that Dana went out to man 0:05:14.480 --> 0:05:19.520 cave in Bella Vista that night. The men decided they 0:05:19.520 --> 0:05:22.800 were going to trade off girl friends, and they was 0:05:22.839 --> 0:05:25.640 going to have a sex party, and that they got 0:05:25.760 --> 0:05:28.960 ended up getting in a fight and a lover's quarrel 0:05:29.000 --> 0:05:34.400 broke out, and that that Stidham girl got cut and 0:05:34.480 --> 0:05:37.839 that told him to put her in his car or 0:05:37.880 --> 0:05:43.520 his truck, take her and bury her. 0:05:44.560 --> 0:05:47.800 Previously on Paper Ghosts, Yes. 0:05:47.600 --> 0:05:50.280 It was a young guy close to his age of 0:05:50.400 --> 0:05:54.000 the policeman and he really felt like he may have 0:05:54.040 --> 0:05:54.400 done it. 0:05:55.200 --> 0:05:59.440 You don't have an intact body, but they found there 0:05:59.480 --> 0:06:02.640 was a knit on the collarbone that they felt like 0:06:02.960 --> 0:06:06.800 was from a knife. Now, whether she was stabbed, you know, 0:06:06.839 --> 0:06:07.360 in the neck. 0:06:08.640 --> 0:06:13.120 Something in my mind told me that this guy is 0:06:13.200 --> 0:06:17.279 fixing to kill this girl. Oh my god, this is 0:06:17.360 --> 0:06:18.480 some kind of a murder. 0:06:19.520 --> 0:06:22.560 My name is em William Phelps. I'm an investigative journalist 0:06:22.640 --> 0:06:26.000 and author of more than forty true crime books. This 0:06:26.160 --> 0:06:29.120 is season four of Paper Ghosts. 0:06:29.800 --> 0:06:44.640 The Ozarks. 0:06:47.440 --> 0:06:50.960 Cold case work for me has always been about gathering 0:06:51.000 --> 0:06:55.120 as much information as I can without judging it or 0:06:55.160 --> 0:06:58.840 allowing any bias to seep in. I collect the data, 0:06:59.160 --> 0:07:03.279 do some fact and see what shakes out. And before 0:07:03.320 --> 0:07:06.159 I decide on a line of inquiry, I like to 0:07:06.200 --> 0:07:10.040 know as much about a case as possible. Far beyond 0:07:10.360 --> 0:07:15.440 the public record, so I kept calling people and reviewing 0:07:15.600 --> 0:07:19.480 all the documentation, which, let me tell you, amounts to 0:07:19.560 --> 0:07:24.160 a mountain of police interviews, witness statements, official reports, and 0:07:24.360 --> 0:07:28.960 various other documents associated with the case, some thirty odd 0:07:29.080 --> 0:07:34.239 years old. All these sex party people, my source mentions 0:07:34.680 --> 0:07:39.680 that crowd Dana hung around well for maybe obvious reasons, 0:07:40.280 --> 0:07:42.840 none of them wanted to speak to me about what 0:07:42.920 --> 0:07:47.960 they knew. Make of that what you will. I asked 0:07:48.040 --> 0:07:52.160 Dana's mother, Georgia Stidham, about the now deceased girl on 0:07:52.200 --> 0:07:55.600 the hill. I've bleeped out her name, but that's who 0:07:55.680 --> 0:07:59.560 we're referring to in this exchange. And it's clear that 0:07:59.600 --> 0:08:03.160 Georgia remembers her very well. 0:08:03.320 --> 0:08:06.200 And did she ever mention or did you ever meet up? 0:08:07.640 --> 0:08:08.000 Yes? 0:08:08.040 --> 0:08:10.440 And you do not want me to tell you what 0:08:10.520 --> 0:08:14.000 I think of Tell me I think the bitch had 0:08:14.040 --> 0:08:16.800 a lot to do with it, and that a bitch 0:08:16.880 --> 0:08:20.720 is exactly what she was. She came in and told 0:08:20.760 --> 0:08:24.760 me that she was only nineteen and she was working 0:08:24.840 --> 0:08:29.320 with Dana down there at the store, and now she 0:08:29.480 --> 0:08:33.199 was still in school and everything. But she had one 0:08:33.440 --> 0:08:37.640 son that lived with her mom and dad. And she 0:08:38.440 --> 0:08:42.760 was lying all the way through. She was married and 0:08:42.840 --> 0:08:46.000 she had the one son. That was the only truth then. 0:08:45.960 --> 0:08:48.640 It So what kind of person was she? Was she 0:08:49.240 --> 0:08:50.000 a drug at it? 0:08:50.080 --> 0:08:50.600 Was a bitch. 0:08:51.800 --> 0:08:53.320 I got that she was a bitch. 0:08:53.520 --> 0:08:54.040 She was. 0:08:54.880 --> 0:08:59.480 She was smart mouthed, and she wanted to be a 0:08:59.520 --> 0:09:03.600 big and doing things, I guess, and she couldn't quite 0:09:03.760 --> 0:09:04.600 carry it off. 0:09:05.400 --> 0:09:08.320 Was she into drugs? Dope that sort of thing? Yes, 0:09:08.679 --> 0:09:10.120 what kind of drugs? 0:09:10.920 --> 0:09:13.280 All kinds from what I've understood. 0:09:13.880 --> 0:09:15.720 Do you think she was dealing drugs too? 0:09:16.200 --> 0:09:16.520 Yes? 0:09:16.720 --> 0:09:19.959 I know she was dealing. Dana had told. 0:09:19.720 --> 0:09:23.400 Me that the Girl on the Hill, along with two 0:09:23.440 --> 0:09:26.960 other girls Dana knew, were said to be muling drugs 0:09:27.000 --> 0:09:31.600 from Texas into Arkansas, information I found in a police 0:09:31.640 --> 0:09:36.719 report and an interview with her. In my experience, at 0:09:36.760 --> 0:09:41.240 this level of drug dealing, transporting quantities of dope over 0:09:41.280 --> 0:09:45.720 state lines a federal offense which can get you decades 0:09:45.720 --> 0:09:51.240 in prison, the stakes become very high. Could Dana have 0:09:51.360 --> 0:09:54.679 seen something she wasn't supposed to and. 0:09:54.760 --> 0:09:58.360 She'd lie in line, lie just to get Diana out. 0:09:59.160 --> 0:10:01.880 Diana was on her writer, her house. 0:10:02.160 --> 0:10:05.160 And you're talking about when that night. 0:10:06.480 --> 0:10:12.199 I ended up verifying this with three other sources. Next, 0:10:12.640 --> 0:10:16.679 I needed to understand what Georgia thought about Mike McMillan. 0:10:17.520 --> 0:10:21.960 Detectives Danny Varner and Mike Sidoriac would not let go 0:10:22.120 --> 0:10:26.960 of Mike. Detective Sidoriac had told the reporter quote, we 0:10:27.080 --> 0:10:30.679 want to show that our victim was in McMillan's vehicle, 0:10:32.080 --> 0:10:35.760 referring to that hair found in Mike's truck, which, along 0:10:35.800 --> 0:10:39.720 with one of Dana's hares and George's DNA, had been 0:10:39.760 --> 0:10:45.199 submitted for testing. If you recall, in a previous episode, 0:10:45.559 --> 0:10:48.800 the BCSO was focused on the idea that if Mike 0:10:48.880 --> 0:10:53.800 McMillan had stolen Dana's grave marker, then that behavior somehow 0:10:54.120 --> 0:10:59.079 spoke to his guilt. So when you heard about Mike 0:10:59.160 --> 0:11:02.600 McMillan making the grave marker from your daughter's grave, what 0:11:02.720 --> 0:11:03.760 was your first thought? 0:11:04.120 --> 0:11:05.679 That he was a little chicken shit? 0:11:06.440 --> 0:11:07.440 Why chicken shit? 0:11:08.120 --> 0:11:11.920 He went down there and he took something from a 0:11:11.960 --> 0:11:14.600 little dead girl, and I didn't like it a little 0:11:14.640 --> 0:11:18.679 thing anyway. I don't like Mike McMillan, and I can't 0:11:18.800 --> 0:11:20.000 stand his parents. 0:11:20.480 --> 0:11:21.560 Why do you think he did it? 0:11:22.640 --> 0:11:26.720 Because he's chicken shit? And that's just the truth of it. 0:11:27.520 --> 0:11:29.480 He thought it might him look big. 0:11:30.120 --> 0:11:33.600 If Mike McMillan had been involved in Dana's murder. I 0:11:33.600 --> 0:11:35.720 think the last thing the guy would want to do 0:11:35.800 --> 0:11:38.880 is steal the marker from her grave. If he was 0:11:38.920 --> 0:11:42.800 feeling nostalgic or upset, or, as Georgia said, wanted to 0:11:42.840 --> 0:11:45.560 show off, well, that would make more sense to me. 0:11:46.800 --> 0:11:50.119 Law enforcement seemed to be taking advantage of this situation 0:11:50.400 --> 0:11:53.920 in order to keep someone in their crosshairs, and that 0:11:53.960 --> 0:11:58.640 person was Mike. Still, they weren't the only ones who 0:11:58.679 --> 0:12:01.400 thought Mike knew war than he was saying. 0:12:02.080 --> 0:12:04.040 Did you ever consider him a suspect? 0:12:04.600 --> 0:12:07.959 Yes, I still think you knew who it was for 0:12:08.080 --> 0:12:25.240 a deadder and everything else, and I probably always will. 0:12:25.400 --> 0:12:28.680 When new information from a case comes in, I compare 0:12:28.720 --> 0:12:32.679 it to what I've learned up until that point. A 0:12:32.720 --> 0:12:36.400 new thread can pop out of nowhere and things can 0:12:36.480 --> 0:12:42.360 start to make sense or not. Sidoriak and Varner would 0:12:42.440 --> 0:12:46.880 dialed into Mike McMillan, but they also continued interviewing scores 0:12:46.920 --> 0:12:51.040 of other people. Mike eventually married and moved far away 0:12:51.040 --> 0:12:55.079 from Bella Vista. Here's his ex wife who we met 0:12:55.240 --> 0:12:58.360 in the last episode and so when you guys, you know, 0:12:58.440 --> 0:13:01.880 as the time went on, did law enforcement ever contact 0:13:02.040 --> 0:13:02.520 him again? 0:13:03.040 --> 0:13:06.200 Yes, they actually came and interviewed me first. 0:13:06.960 --> 0:13:08.040 They took him. 0:13:08.280 --> 0:13:11.640 They had him for like six or eight hours, showed 0:13:11.679 --> 0:13:14.640 in pictures, you know, the hole graphic how they do it, 0:13:15.320 --> 0:13:18.120 and he was pretty shaken up after that because it's 0:13:18.160 --> 0:13:21.880 not something you want to see. So little background. My 0:13:22.080 --> 0:13:24.520 step dad was a chief of police in the town 0:13:24.559 --> 0:13:28.280 where we lived, so I grew up around law enforcement 0:13:28.360 --> 0:13:31.040 and all that. They showed up at my work, two 0:13:31.160 --> 0:13:35.760 detectives and asked to speak to me. They asked me 0:13:36.000 --> 0:13:40.360 if Mike had any kind of personal possessions at the 0:13:40.440 --> 0:13:44.079 house that had like pictures of ex girlfriends and things 0:13:44.160 --> 0:13:46.160 like that, and I'm like, well, yeah, I mean everybody 0:13:46.200 --> 0:13:48.320 kind of has something like that from high school that 0:13:48.400 --> 0:13:52.000 you kept your notes in or your little momentos. And 0:13:52.040 --> 0:13:54.040 they were like, oh, well, have you ever seen this 0:13:54.200 --> 0:13:58.920 perse and this, And I'm like no, And they asked 0:13:58.960 --> 0:14:02.360 if they could take it, and I was young and 0:14:02.600 --> 0:14:05.520 naive and I told him yes. So they went to 0:14:05.559 --> 0:14:10.240 my house and got that box. They interviewed Mike shortly. 0:14:09.880 --> 0:14:13.680 After that, and he was shaken up about them coming again. 0:14:14.320 --> 0:14:18.240 Was just playing these pictures that they said Ordina out 0:14:18.280 --> 0:14:20.440 in front of him. It would shake anybody yet, but 0:14:21.120 --> 0:14:22.680 he's like, I didn't do it. I don't know if 0:14:22.680 --> 0:14:23.200 it did it. 0:14:23.640 --> 0:14:26.760 You know, I was able to obtain the recording of 0:14:26.880 --> 0:14:31.720 this marathon interview. Detective Danny Varner begins. 0:14:33.880 --> 0:14:41.120 She shouldn't hear about the skeletal The folks still don't know, 0:14:42.080 --> 0:14:43.800 but got there do. 0:14:48.760 --> 0:14:52.040 The audio in that previous clip has degraded over time, 0:14:53.000 --> 0:14:57.600 but Detective Varner says, little old skeletal remains and that's it. 0:14:58.160 --> 0:15:02.120 Her folks still don't know. Well, but God does, don't 0:15:02.200 --> 0:15:07.840 he And Mike McMillan responds, Yeah, he does. That's what 0:15:08.440 --> 0:15:13.320 I am counting on. Werner then used a carefully chosen 0:15:13.560 --> 0:15:17.560 tactic by trying to align Mike with the harshest criminals, 0:15:17.760 --> 0:15:22.040 strategically in my opinion, to scare him. 0:15:22.440 --> 0:15:27.080 Like we interview people all the time, We've interviewed murderers, 0:15:27.440 --> 0:15:34.080 ripest murderers, child molestors, and watching you here today, you've 0:15:34.120 --> 0:15:38.480 got the gestures in that seat and you're cool. I 0:15:38.520 --> 0:15:40.680 won't say you're I'm playing right, man. You're cool. 0:15:41.440 --> 0:15:45.160 You've learned to live with this and it's been your lifestyle, 0:15:45.960 --> 0:15:50.560 and it makes it easy by the way you talk, 0:15:51.360 --> 0:15:55.040 and by your way you deny your. 0:15:54.960 --> 0:15:59.080 Our man, they accuse him. They put tremendous pressure on 0:15:59.200 --> 0:16:03.440 Mike to admit he killed Dana, but he continues to 0:16:03.520 --> 0:16:07.960 say what he has always said, even interrupting them at 0:16:07.960 --> 0:16:09.920 times to stand up for himself. 0:16:10.640 --> 0:16:11.800 And you know, we got you, man. 0:16:12.720 --> 0:16:15.280 It's gonna look a lot better on you. You just say, listen, 0:16:15.720 --> 0:16:16.280 I don't do it. 0:16:17.880 --> 0:16:18.520 I think you did. 0:16:19.680 --> 0:16:23.000 If you put me into afore you getting wrong and. 0:16:23.040 --> 0:16:26.520 Somebody get away, then Danny Varner does something we don't 0:16:26.560 --> 0:16:30.800 expect upstanding officers to do. He lies. 0:16:31.800 --> 0:16:32.760 I don't think so much. 0:16:34.880 --> 0:16:36.280 I don't have somebody else to think. 0:16:36.320 --> 0:16:39.240 A pan in her car, Well, you got somebody else 0:16:39.280 --> 0:16:40.160 getting little murder. 0:16:41.480 --> 0:16:46.040 The BCSO did not have Mike's fingerprints inside Dana's car. 0:16:46.520 --> 0:16:51.320 They had no fingerprints. In fact, lying, however, is totally 0:16:51.360 --> 0:16:55.040 within the boundaries when you're interviewing a suspect, and I 0:16:55.120 --> 0:17:00.520 understand why detectives sometimes do it. This of you was 0:17:00.520 --> 0:17:04.040 conducted close to the time Mike willingly gave his blood 0:17:04.040 --> 0:17:07.880 and hair for DNA comparison. As I stated in an 0:17:07.920 --> 0:17:11.560 earlier episode. People like to put a face on evil. 0:17:11.960 --> 0:17:15.240 It helps them deal with the pain and loss. But 0:17:15.320 --> 0:17:20.280 as Mike McMillan told me, they decided that I had 0:17:20.320 --> 0:17:22.080 done this and that was it. 0:17:23.440 --> 0:17:23.879 Both of you. 0:17:28.720 --> 0:17:34.520 I agree with that it's been none. And Andrew tell 0:17:34.600 --> 0:17:36.359 us michaelcmillan that if you get it. 0:17:38.440 --> 0:17:41.280 Varner then gets into the grave marker Mike was arrested 0:17:41.280 --> 0:17:41.880 for stealing. 0:17:42.960 --> 0:17:48.480 Tell us how long he was after at the cemetary. Oh, 0:17:48.880 --> 0:17:51.800 it's been five minutes. It's been five hours. 0:17:52.680 --> 0:17:53.240 What do you think? 0:17:55.480 --> 0:17:59.879 It doesn't matter this night, of course, had been years before. 0:18:01.080 --> 0:18:04.400 As the interview continues, they talk about how Mike's alibi 0:18:04.880 --> 0:18:07.760 fell apart when they interviewed the girl he claimed to 0:18:07.800 --> 0:18:11.159 have been with that night. They talk about how the 0:18:11.200 --> 0:18:14.760 truck Mike drove was his dad's and it fit the 0:18:14.800 --> 0:18:19.080 description they had of the person parked behind Dana that morning, 0:18:20.000 --> 0:18:26.080 evidence that was all highly circumstantial at best. They then 0:18:26.119 --> 0:18:30.000 focused on a picture of Dana they found inside Mike's house. 0:18:30.960 --> 0:18:43.760 Oh there, sure, I'm taking out? Oh good, okay, Well, 0:18:43.800 --> 0:18:45.800 I know I screwed up. I'm taking a little mark 0:18:45.880 --> 0:18:49.480 or do, but I don't get where all the rest 0:18:49.520 --> 0:18:52.399 of the ship comes from. 0:18:52.680 --> 0:18:54.480 I mean, I understand it's just a little town and 0:18:54.920 --> 0:18:59.560 get one of the things that I don't understand. How 0:19:00.359 --> 0:19:02.520 even after I walk in and say, hey, look I did, 0:19:02.640 --> 0:19:05.280 I'm sorry they did. You know I was stupid for 0:19:05.400 --> 0:19:08.080 doing it. That's mitly what happened. 0:19:08.160 --> 0:19:10.879 Mike asked me whether or not I who took the marker, 0:19:10.880 --> 0:19:14.760 and I said, yeah, I did, And he said, well, 0:19:14.760 --> 0:19:15.560 hold on, we need to. 0:19:15.520 --> 0:19:20.440 Read your rus I remember that perfectly because that's important 0:19:20.440 --> 0:19:21.840 to me. I got arristed that day. 0:19:23.200 --> 0:19:27.679 Throughout this entire interview, they kept ratcheting up the pressure 0:19:27.720 --> 0:19:31.520 on Mike. At one point, they raised the idea of 0:19:31.720 --> 0:19:36.639 capital felony murder charges, which brought in the possibility of 0:19:36.720 --> 0:19:41.560 the death penalty. This approach, which potentially crosses a line 0:19:41.680 --> 0:19:48.280 into intimidation, was specifically designed to scare Mike into a confession, 0:19:49.760 --> 0:19:58.040 but Mike kept insisting that he did not kill Dana. 0:19:59.560 --> 0:20:01.760 To get me contend to something mindy and do it, 0:20:03.800 --> 0:20:07.879 which is all at all? Could you take her for 0:20:08.000 --> 0:20:08.480 a rise? 0:20:08.720 --> 0:20:13.439 Love Warner got into the polygraphs they had given to 0:20:13.600 --> 0:20:17.880 over a dozen people by that Mike had taken one 0:20:18.240 --> 0:20:23.200 during the early days of the investigation, and passed years later, 0:20:23.520 --> 0:20:28.000 he took a second one. During the second polygraph, he 0:20:28.160 --> 0:20:31.840 was asked if he was with Dana the day she disappeared, 0:20:32.080 --> 0:20:35.480 if at the time Dana was killed, he did anything 0:20:35.640 --> 0:20:39.760 to cause her death, and was he present when Dana's 0:20:39.800 --> 0:20:44.400 body was left in that creek bed. Mike answered no 0:20:45.000 --> 0:20:51.240 to each question. In the official report, the polygraphist said 0:20:51.480 --> 0:20:55.919 the results created quote such a pattern as to indicate 0:20:56.280 --> 0:20:59.920 he was deceptive in answering all of the relevant questions. 0:21:01.000 --> 0:21:03.720 When asked about his responses and how he'd scored on 0:21:03.760 --> 0:21:09.360 the test, Mike said, quote, sometimes I think I did 0:21:09.440 --> 0:21:15.840 kill Dana, but I know I didn't. The polygraph examiner 0:21:15.880 --> 0:21:20.240 concluded that, in his opinion, Mike was responsible for the 0:21:20.359 --> 0:21:26.520 death of Dana Stidham. During his interview with Sidoriak and Varner, 0:21:26.840 --> 0:21:30.520 the two detectives brought up that failed polygraph. 0:21:31.000 --> 0:21:33.080 How can they help? If I asked him, you can't. 0:21:35.000 --> 0:21:35.880 The same questions. 0:21:40.119 --> 0:21:42.760 I didn't have anything to do with Ames Todham's dead. 0:21:44.200 --> 0:21:47.560 If you were to read press reports only about Mike McMillan, 0:21:47.760 --> 0:21:50.800 you'd walk away feeling that he was hiding something and 0:21:50.880 --> 0:21:55.760 possibly committed this crime. But listening to him in these interviews, 0:21:55.960 --> 0:22:00.159 how direct and sharp, he is not one bit nervous. 0:21:59.800 --> 0:22:05.760 It clear he is emphatically denying any involvement this, mind you, 0:22:06.119 --> 0:22:08.560 As he is poked and prodded and accused of it 0:22:08.680 --> 0:22:12.879 over and over for years and years, he sticks to 0:22:12.920 --> 0:22:18.919 his story and never waivers. They thought they could break me, 0:22:19.359 --> 0:22:24.320 Mike told me when I interviewed him. Throughout the police interview, 0:22:24.560 --> 0:22:30.280 Mike continues to repeat himself, I didn't. 0:22:29.960 --> 0:22:33.359 Have anything to do with things. Tom's dead. Did you 0:22:33.359 --> 0:22:51.680 ever do anything by yourself? Took dance Jim. 0:22:59.720 --> 0:23:03.520 Such benign questions which have very little to do with 0:23:03.680 --> 0:23:08.120 evidence and everything to do with tunnel vision and closing 0:23:08.160 --> 0:23:15.040 a case. I obtained the FBI report from the hair 0:23:15.080 --> 0:23:19.840 blood analysis, the only forensic evidence in Dana's case. The 0:23:19.920 --> 0:23:24.280 BCSO says it has, and here's a quote from it. 0:23:25.240 --> 0:23:28.879 The DNA sequences from the hair and specimen from Georgia 0:23:28.960 --> 0:23:34.600 Stidham are different. Therefore, Dana's dittum can be eliminated as 0:23:34.680 --> 0:23:39.760 the donor of the head haair found inside Mike McMillan's vehicle. 0:23:42.160 --> 0:23:45.480 The BCSO had no forensics to back up what I 0:23:45.520 --> 0:23:50.640 would call a very weak, circumstantial case against Mike McMillan. 0:23:51.520 --> 0:23:56.400 The case, including the second polygraph, which Mike allegedly failed, 0:23:56.840 --> 0:24:01.480 was sent to the district attorney. Mc millan has never 0:24:01.520 --> 0:24:07.200 been charged. But why after trailing him and pressing him 0:24:07.359 --> 0:24:12.840 for years. The simple answer is they had no evidence 0:24:12.920 --> 0:24:17.400 against him, because no matter how much the BCSO believed 0:24:17.480 --> 0:24:21.280 that Mike McMillan had murdered Dana, they didn't have any 0:24:21.560 --> 0:24:26.760 tangible proof to support such an accusation or make it stick. 0:24:28.280 --> 0:24:33.399 Here's former Benton County Prosecutor Nathan Smith, whom you've heard 0:24:33.640 --> 0:24:34.879 in previous episodes. 0:24:35.680 --> 0:24:39.600 Sometimes in cases there's too many suspects and they all 0:24:39.640 --> 0:24:40.960 look good, right. 0:24:41.440 --> 0:24:43.000 Part of the problem with that is if you have 0:24:43.080 --> 0:24:46.360 one or two other pretty good suspects, that's almost by 0:24:46.400 --> 0:24:50.400 definition reasonable doubt. And so when you have multiple suspects 0:24:50.840 --> 0:24:54.840 out there from a time where it was difficult to 0:24:54.960 --> 0:24:58.479 collect the kind of evidence we get today routinely, that 0:24:58.520 --> 0:25:02.520 could be a problem. I can't imagine the pressure in 0:25:02.640 --> 0:25:06.000 nineteen eighty nine, nineteen ninety to make an arrest, to 0:25:06.160 --> 0:25:10.320 make the arrest, and I actually think looking back that 0:25:10.600 --> 0:25:13.280 the investigators who worked on it at the time probably 0:25:13.320 --> 0:25:16.640 should be commended for not making you an arrest simply 0:25:16.720 --> 0:25:20.480 because if the evidence isn't there, you don't want to 0:25:20.520 --> 0:25:21.840 start the process. 0:25:22.400 --> 0:25:26.679 Now, just stepping back a minute too, the murder scene 0:25:26.800 --> 0:25:32.040 or where the body dumps sight, so, was there evidence there, 0:25:32.640 --> 0:25:35.639 any type of evidence that could lead to somebody like, 0:25:36.080 --> 0:25:39.880 is there something to test if you know, you develop 0:25:39.920 --> 0:25:40.800 a good suspect. 0:25:41.800 --> 0:25:43.720 Well, I guess at this point I've got to be 0:25:43.760 --> 0:25:45.840 careful not to, you know, get out in front of 0:25:45.880 --> 0:25:49.359 the skis of the actual investigation. But certainly anything that 0:25:49.400 --> 0:25:54.160 we have today it becomes easier and easier going forward 0:25:54.840 --> 0:25:57.080 to do those kinds of testings. Now that the real 0:25:57.160 --> 0:25:59.840 issue is if you're referencing DNA or whatever, unless you 0:25:59.840 --> 0:26:03.240 just say, in a normal case, is was their DNA 0:26:03.280 --> 0:26:06.920 evidence preserved that can be tested today? Do you remember 0:26:07.000 --> 0:26:09.399 nineteen eighty nine that wasn't a thing people were doing, right, 0:26:09.400 --> 0:26:12.360 They didn't think about doing that. So I think it's 0:26:12.680 --> 0:26:15.560 really going to be just leaning into the facts more 0:26:16.000 --> 0:26:19.240 and trying to uncover any additional information. 0:26:25.840 --> 0:26:29.080 Although Mike McMillan somewhat faded from the public picture as 0:26:29.119 --> 0:26:32.560 a suspect, the BCSO were still searching for a piece 0:26:32.560 --> 0:26:36.600 of evidence that could tie him to the murder which 0:26:36.640 --> 0:26:40.919 they would never find. And yet the entire time the 0:26:40.960 --> 0:26:45.760 BCSO was pursuing Mike McMillan, there was a different suspect. 0:26:46.080 --> 0:26:49.560 They had their eye on, a guy unknown to the public, 0:26:49.960 --> 0:26:54.159 a much better suspect who was being looked at once again, 0:26:54.240 --> 0:26:59.400 when all of a sudden, Dana's case took a remarkable turn. 0:27:06.720 --> 0:27:11.439