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Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio News.

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Speaker 2: Hi, I'm Jason Kelly and I'm Alex Rodriguez on this

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Speaker 2: episode of The Deal.

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Speaker 1: Paul Rabel. All right, Paul Rabel, Alex.

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Speaker 2: Is I dare say an a Rod or the a

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Speaker 2: Rod of the lacrosse world.

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Speaker 1: I mean this guy.

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Speaker 2: You talk to anyone in the lacrosse world, they know

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Speaker 2: who he is. But here's the next step that he took.

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Speaker 2: He not only played the game, then he created his

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Speaker 2: own league when there was another league in existence. Can

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Speaker 2: you even imagine that?

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Speaker 1: Hell? No, he is so impressive.

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Speaker 3: But Jason, when you and I co founded this program

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Speaker 3: to Deal right this podcast a couple of years ago, and.

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Speaker 1: You said, what is the perfect guest look like?

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Speaker 3: Yes, Paul, and I don't think I would ever say

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Speaker 3: this about anyone else but Paul. He reminds me of

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Speaker 3: a combination of these three folks, Adam Silver, Roger Goodell,

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Speaker 3: and Tom Brady.

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Speaker 1: He's an athlete, He's a champion. It's awesome. He's unbelievable.

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Speaker 2: And what's interesting is he's done some really big deals

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Speaker 2: over the course of his career. One of the things

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Speaker 2: that's also really interesting about him is he knows that

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Speaker 2: even six years in, this is a nascent league. It's

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Speaker 2: got to make big moves, bold moves in order to

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Speaker 2: secure the media rights, in order to grow the audience,

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Speaker 2: in order to grow the game. They're looking ahead to

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Speaker 2: the twenty twenty eight Olympics when lacrosse is going to

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Speaker 2: be a part of it. So a lot of runway

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Speaker 2: for lacrosse as a game. And I mean, you can't

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Speaker 2: bet against Paul Rabel.

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Speaker 1: You definitely can't. I would never do that either, would you.

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Speaker 3: So here's a guy that has big belief, big ambitions,

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Speaker 3: and the tireless work ethic and surrounding himself with great people.

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Speaker 1: I think he's gonna win big here on this episode

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Speaker 1: of the Deal.

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Speaker 2: Paul Rabel, all right, we like to start the show

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Speaker 2: by having the guests introduce themselves and what they do,

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Speaker 2: So go ahead.

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Speaker 1: First of all, I love your show. Thank you.

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Speaker 4: I am co founder and president of the Premier Lacrosse League,

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Speaker 4: former professional athlete. I'm a writer, I'm a producer, and

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Speaker 4: I'm an investor.

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Speaker 2: And did you come to all of those just organically

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Speaker 2: or is this what you set out to do?

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Speaker 1: Is this what you imagined you'd be doing? No, absolutely not.

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Speaker 1: I Actually, most of my.

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Speaker 4: Adolescence into adulthood, I've just been hyper focused on the

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Speaker 4: task at hand and trying to be the best at that.

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Speaker 4: So for most of my life it was lacrosse so

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Speaker 4: much that I didn't even realize that the professional league

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Speaker 4: while I was playing in high school in college was

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Speaker 4: dying on a vine. I just wanted to win a

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Speaker 4: high school championship, and then in college just win a

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Speaker 4: college championship. I wanted to win four of them, and

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Speaker 4: I came up short. Most of the time, you come

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Speaker 4: up short on those big goals that you set for yourself,

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Speaker 4: but there's no way of getting those big goals if

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Speaker 4: you don't set them. I would consider myself project based.

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Speaker 4: As a worker, I like to think that I can

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Speaker 4: drive pound for pound a lot of value, intellectual curiosity

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Speaker 4: and focus at any moment on any side screen. So

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Speaker 4: if that's the movie business, I want to first understand

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Speaker 4: its history. If that's being a great writer, I know

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Speaker 4: it comes down to practice and reading other great writers business,

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Speaker 4: same thing. So no long goal of saying, hey, I

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Speaker 4: want to do a bunch of stuff, because most people

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Speaker 4: would say, hey, if you're gonna do a bunch of

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Speaker 4: things you're not gonna be good at anyone.

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Speaker 3: Right, this whole concept about not whine and shallow but

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Speaker 3: narrown deep, it sounds like you do it very well.

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Speaker 3: My question is, when you were in high square, college

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Speaker 3: or even in the pros, when was that moment that

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Speaker 3: you said, uh, huh, this is what I want to

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Speaker 3: do next.

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Speaker 4: Well, it came at an inflection point where I was

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Speaker 4: just about to bail on pro lacrosse because my rookie

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Speaker 4: wage was sixty five hundred dollars. I was drafted number

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Speaker 4: one to the Boston Cannons in two thousand and eight.

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Speaker 4: I had just played in front of fifty five thousand

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Speaker 4: fans at Chollette Stadium in a National Championship game against Syracuse,

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Speaker 4: and my first game into the pros was in front

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Speaker 4: of about four hundred fans at a backfield at Rutgers University.

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Speaker 4: So yeah, that was sort of That was the little

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Speaker 4: did I know business reaction like, huh, that doesn't seem

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Speaker 4: to work out. But my immediate reaction, as any twenty

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Speaker 4: two year old who's looking to advance their lives and

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Speaker 4: careers are now on their own without the support of

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Speaker 4: the university of parents, I had to get a job.

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Speaker 4: So I get a job as an analyst for a

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Speaker 4: real estate firm called Cassidy and pinkered. I did that

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Speaker 4: for seven months, and then I left because I realized

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Speaker 4: that I wasn't and finished with pro lacrosse. And I

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Speaker 4: knew in my heart of hearts that if I wanted

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Speaker 4: to be the greatest lacrosse player ever, which was just

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Speaker 4: my goal, I don't believe I am that that I

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Speaker 4: needed to go all in and not be distracted by

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Speaker 4: wages or income and that type of stuff. If you

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Speaker 4: go all in and anything, I believe figures itself out.

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Speaker 2: So I want to pick up on something you said

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Speaker 2: because I'm seeing a little some parallels here. It's my

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Speaker 2: job to sort of do a little pattern recognition as

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Speaker 2: a journalist. And you know, I have two people who were,

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Speaker 2: you know, widely considered the best at the game that

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Speaker 2: they've ever played, certainly among the best of the game

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Speaker 2: that they ever played.

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Speaker 1: And so Alex talks a lot.

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Speaker 2: About, you know, these moments where you realized, oh, I

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Speaker 2: can only be a professional athlete.

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Speaker 1: I could be a top tier professional athlete. Yeah, he

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Speaker 1: obviously had that.

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Speaker 2: I mean, you had that moment what with your high

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Speaker 2: school coach or was it before.

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Speaker 3: Probably fifteen sixteen, I thought I saw a real vision.

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Speaker 3: Always say back the future, you see that blurry picture.

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Speaker 3: The picture started getting more clear once I went back

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Speaker 3: to back years to play in the US Olympic team

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Speaker 3: and playing for the US Olympic team, it wasn't just Miami.

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Speaker 3: It was the greatest players across the whole US. And

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Speaker 3: I looked around as a rising junior, I was like, hey,

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Speaker 3: I can hold my own. And then when I went

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Speaker 3: back as the only you know, those only rising junior,

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Speaker 3: everybody else was rising seniors.

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Speaker 1: The following year I came.

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Speaker 3: Back, I said, holy smokes, like these guys that are

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Speaker 3: my age, they look like kids because I was so

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Speaker 3: used to playing with kids older than me. That's the

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Speaker 3: moment ago, I have a real path to the big leagues. Yeause,

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Speaker 3: when was that moment for you?

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Speaker 1: Yeah?

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Speaker 4: There was a midfielder at Landon, which is sort of

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Speaker 4: the one of the top perennial high schools in Maryland,

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Speaker 4: and they ranked number one in the country and lacrosse.

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Speaker 4: For you know, as long as I was playing, and

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Speaker 4: his name is Peter Lammitdy, and I would study the

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Speaker 4: way that he played, even the way that he cradled,

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Speaker 4: the way that he'd run and shoot on the run,

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Speaker 4: and when I was out practicing on my own, I

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Speaker 4: wanted to not only.

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Speaker 1: Get his skill set, but beat him.

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Speaker 4: And there we used to have this base state tournament,

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Speaker 4: which sounds similar to what Alex was referring to. If

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Speaker 4: you made the base state team, you were among the

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Speaker 4: best high school lacrosse players in Maryland. And then there

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Speaker 4: was another one in New York and the two would play.

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Speaker 4: It was called Empires in New York. So I was

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Speaker 4: on the field with Peter and then him and I

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Speaker 4: essentially going back and forth. I came home that day

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Speaker 4: going all right, I'm here, I've got a chance to

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Speaker 4: be the best midfielder in the state. That mindset carried

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Speaker 4: me all the way through my career. When I was

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Speaker 4: signed to go play at Johns Hopkins and I was

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Speaker 4: a freshman, I would look at Kyle Harrison, Greg Pizer,

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Speaker 4: and Matt Rakowski, the top three midfielders on the team,

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Speaker 4: and I would just practice every single day to acquire

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Speaker 4: what I saw them doing and ultimately beat them. You know,

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Speaker 4: I grew up playing Rex sports. We don't see much

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Speaker 4: Rex sports today, right, And I'm sure, we'll get to

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Speaker 4: that in a second.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: I mean because just to be I mean, I think

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Speaker 2: it is interesting for you to hear this as a

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Speaker 2: lax dad, which.

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Speaker 1: You know that I am.

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Speaker 2: I mean, the infrastructure that exists today did not exist

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Speaker 2: when you were coming.

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Speaker 1: You weren't playing travel pros and cons of both.

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Speaker 4: It's incumbent on leaders at the premier lacrosse league to

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Speaker 4: what I would say, revitalize REX Sports. So that means privately,

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Speaker 4: out of our balance sheet, invest in it. You create

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Speaker 4: a shift in momentum by making something that you're investing

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Speaker 4: in cool, which I think is part of the challenge

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Speaker 4: you're talking about eleven, twelve, and.

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Speaker 1: Thirteen year olds.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, and what I learned in the business world is

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Speaker 4: most people aren't like Alex and I that want to

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Speaker 4: be the best of the best.

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Speaker 1: That's like sort of one percent. A lot of people

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Speaker 1: just love to play sports.

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Speaker 4: It's fun, it's competitive, you learn, you interact with your friends,

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Speaker 4: there's social status.

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Speaker 1: There's a lot of peer pressure on young boys and

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Speaker 1: girls right now, and.

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Speaker 4: So REX sports is the lowest barrier opportunity to learn

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Speaker 4: all these skills. So that has been impinged by you know,

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Speaker 4: privatized sports over the last ten to fifteen years.

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Speaker 2: You know, from our history together, I'm an existing fan,

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Speaker 2: I'm a lacrosse dad, I'm a collegiate lacrosse player in

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Speaker 2: my household.

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Speaker 1: And so we crowdsourced, like what do these guys want

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Speaker 1: to know?

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Speaker 2: And interestingly enough, one of the questions that kept coming

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Speaker 2: back was this idea of accessibility to the game. And interestingly,

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Speaker 2: these are you know, these are college players who you know,

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Speaker 2: we're fortunate to play the game growing up, but they're

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Speaker 2: also really smart future business people and they see that

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Speaker 2: for the game to grow, you've got to grow the

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Speaker 2: top of the funnel too, in terms of the players

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Speaker 2: and the fans.

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Speaker 1: So how do you do that?

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Speaker 4: Well, Kevin Durant, Rich Climb and our investors out of

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Speaker 4: thirty five V and when they came in, they said,

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Speaker 4: let's build a property together, just solve this problem. So

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Speaker 4: we launched Street Lacrosse. And Kevin and I both grew

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Speaker 4: up in the DMV playing hoops. Because you have the

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Speaker 4: access to a court outside of every neighborhood like you

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Speaker 4: do a baseball diamond, and I believe that you're going

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Speaker 4: to get more participants and you also get more fans

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Speaker 4: because through osmosis, you see a baseball diamond, you go cool,

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Speaker 4: I know what that is when I just see it

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Speaker 4: on TV. How many people still in the grand scheme

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Speaker 4: of things around the world know what lacrosse is and

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Speaker 4: looks like. So Street Lacrosse said, let's take what we

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Speaker 4: have and make something out of it. So we built

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Speaker 4: a version of the game with just a stick and

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Speaker 4: a tennis ball can be played on any surface, but

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Speaker 4: we focus on basketball courts, and we want to invite

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Speaker 4: communities of all shapes and sizes in any look from

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Speaker 4: around the country because we're good at promoting and capturing

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Speaker 4: that media to say, oh, I don't have to have

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Speaker 4: a helmet, gloves, elbow pads, cleats and sign up for

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Speaker 4: my club team to play this game, and I want

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Speaker 4: more sticks and hands. Top of funnel is like is everything,

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Speaker 4: and lacrosse stereotypically has this image as if it's this

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Speaker 4: Northeast private school sport. Ironically, it is the first team

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Speaker 4: sport of North America, indigenous game and it was played

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Speaker 4: without pads and the sticks were shaped from hickory tree.

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Speaker 4: So what happened along the way is I think what

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Speaker 4: you've seen America evolve into from class to race to accessibility,

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Speaker 4: and we are not different than hockey or golf. In fact,

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Speaker 4: we have more black and indigenous players in our league

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Speaker 4: than both of those pro leagues. However, we have reputational challenges.

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Speaker 4: The sport that I left out is actually American football.

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Speaker 4: It's an expensive sport to play, but in the early

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Speaker 4: nineteen hundreds a couple presidents really liked it, so they

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Speaker 4: went the path of working with local government to subsidize

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Speaker 4: our equipment. So when we played pee wee football, we

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Speaker 4: didn't have to play for a helmet. If you have

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Speaker 4: to pay for pads to play football, you're going to

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Speaker 4: see participation or what we have today, the NFL won't

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Speaker 4: be what it is today. And so understanding the participation

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Speaker 4: game is important. And then the last thing is understanding

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Speaker 4: the entertainment game. Because none of us sit around and

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Speaker 4: talk with Dana White about mixed martial arts participation. They've

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Speaker 4: bought an entertaining product. They're a gladiator sport, and so

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Speaker 4: you can't draw a business model, which is I think

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Speaker 4: what our processors did wrong in MLL around number of

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Speaker 4: participants to number of attendants and viewers on screen you've

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Speaker 4: got to work both angles right, all.

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Speaker 2: Right, So let's pivot to arguably the biggest deal that

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Speaker 2: you do, which is you decide which I can't even

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Speaker 2: describe to you, but because you're going to get the

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Speaker 2: magnitude of it wild, the idea of starting an entirely

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Speaker 2: new league, win a league exists. So it's literally a

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Speaker 2: Rod saying, Hey, Steinbrenner's this has been great. I'm going

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Speaker 2: to go start my own league, though, and we'll see

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Speaker 2: you down the line. Tell us about that moment when

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Speaker 2: you and your brother Mike decide to do that.

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Speaker 4: Well, it was about ten years into my professional across careers,

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Speaker 4: so I'd been learning about the business of sport along

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Speaker 4: the way in the business media because I didn't want

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Speaker 4: to be arrant in the approach. My brother is a

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Speaker 4: serial entrepreneur, so we had the chops between the two

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Speaker 4: of us and the diversity around what we had learned,

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Speaker 4: his on the management and financial structuring side and me

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Speaker 4: on the media, marketing and athletics side. So I say

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Speaker 4: that because if pro lacrosse was working, I would have

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Speaker 4: built a strategy much like we see a lot of

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Speaker 4: professional athletes doing in the Big four sports of owning

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Speaker 4: a team one day. It's far more difficult and challenging

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Speaker 4: and a lot of easier ways to make money than

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Speaker 4: starting a new league, especially in the face of an

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Speaker 4: existing one.

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Speaker 1: So we study it. We studied it, study.

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Speaker 4: We actually first went the private equity route to get

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Speaker 4: a bunch of overhead capital to acquire the existing league.

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Speaker 4: Because sports are full of context, we knew that lacrosse

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Speaker 4: not just in its twenty years prior to pro history,

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Speaker 4: but at thousands of years of history. Starting from scratch

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Speaker 4: was going to be really difficult to capture that narrative.

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Speaker 4: But I wanted to own twenty years of pro lacrosse history,

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Speaker 4: even if the wages were low and there wasn't a

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Speaker 4: lot of network games. We ended up putting together an

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Speaker 4: offer for about thirty five million dollars, which was a mixture.

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Speaker 1: Of cash and stock. And this is for Major League lacrosse.

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Speaker 4: Every team was losing money, the league was losing money

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Speaker 4: at the top co. This was in twenty seventeen, so

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Speaker 4: it was before like the real craze that we see

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Speaker 4: here today around pro sports. And I'm not sure whether

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Speaker 4: they were trying to negotiate or if they were really

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Speaker 4: like and some of this is my stuff that I've

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Speaker 4: learned to unpack in therapy and sports psychology as a

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Speaker 4: as an athlete grown up, you're told that you're dumb,

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Speaker 4: dumb jock, And I think if I put on my

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Speaker 4: empathetic hat, you walk into a room with a bunch

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Speaker 4: of seasoned business executives. Right, Jim Davis bought New Balance

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Speaker 4: for fifty grand has built it into a multi billion

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Speaker 4: dollar empire. He owned four of the teams.

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Speaker 1: What is this athlete doing walking in here? What does

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Speaker 1: he know? He hasn't own abilities? Now hard, this is

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Speaker 1: I can feel the nodding by the way hunting event.

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Speaker 4: Yeah right, And so however that process, they didn't say shoo.

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Speaker 4: They said, okay, let's go into what the entrepreneurs listening

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Speaker 4: is a data room. So we went into diligence, and

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Speaker 4: we learned about the business, and we learned more about

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Speaker 4: what didn't work and why because there wasn't a lot

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Speaker 4: that was working. We had a few more attempts at

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Speaker 4: striking a deal. The Achilles heel of Major League lacrosse

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Speaker 4: myself included. Of the two hundred and fifty players or so,

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Speaker 4: ninety five percent of us were under a one year deals,

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Speaker 4: so sort of like you know, a team getting picked

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Speaker 4: up overnight out of Baltimore moved Indianapolis. There was a

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Speaker 4: moment in time where we knew, oh, we could actually

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Speaker 4: start a new league and sign all the players overnight,

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Speaker 4: and our investment strategy had to shift from private equitya

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Speaker 4: comes in and buys a distressed asset and fixes it

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Speaker 4: to venture. So then we rent a whole new fundraising

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Speaker 4: path to start what now is the poll And we

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Speaker 4: struggled because how can you value something doesn't exist? So

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Speaker 4: we at first put together a safe note, which is

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Speaker 4: essentially a simpler version of convertible note.

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Speaker 1: We went out to market and people are like, I

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Speaker 1: get it.

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Speaker 4: But since nineteen ninety, about two hundred pro sports leagues

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Speaker 4: have started with a one percent success rate, and that's

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Speaker 4: based on making it.

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Speaker 1: Beyond three years. So I know. We've talked a lot

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Speaker 1: about spring football.

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Speaker 4: It's a decent business, but it turns over because the

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Speaker 4: cost structures too heavy. They get a million people watching

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Speaker 4: a game. You can figure that out, but it's just hard.

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Speaker 4: There's been a huge moat around pro sports for decades

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Speaker 4: because of broadcast cable, and then once that gets democratized

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Speaker 4: through streaming in the Internet and social media, the attention

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Speaker 4: economy opens up to nascent stage sports like the UFC,

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Speaker 4: MLS and WSLWNBA. All this over the last thirty years.

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Speaker 4: So we couldn't get the term sheet signed. We decided

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Speaker 4: to go a price round, went to rain Ventures. I

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Speaker 4: want to give a shout to Colin Neville was on

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Speaker 4: our board. Now, Colin played lacrosse at Yale. That's why

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Speaker 4: he took the meeting, but he will admit he had

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Speaker 4: the same thought like, we'll see anyway. That meeting was

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Speaker 4: scheduled for thirty minutes whent about two and a half hours.

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Speaker 4: They were still hesitant. Incomes Drew McKnight, who now runs

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Speaker 4: Fortress Investment Group, and he played lacrosse at EVA and

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Speaker 4: he loved it.

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Speaker 1: He saw the same thing like, hey, if this is.

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Speaker 4: Working at the high school level, college level was once

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Speaker 4: an Olympic sport, it's the fastest growing on the participatory side,

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Speaker 4: ages nine to eighteen boys and girls.

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Speaker 1: Why can't we figure this out the pro level.

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Speaker 4: So he actually wrote our first term sheet personally, not

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Speaker 4: out of Fortress, knowing that hey, this might help get

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Speaker 4: as you know, an actual term shoot over the goal

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Speaker 4: line we brought it to Rain, Rain said.

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Speaker 1: We'll do it.

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Speaker 4: Drew came on as a personal investor. That was our

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Speaker 4: first seed round, but it was not enough to run

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Speaker 4: the first season. They were like, we got to put

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Speaker 4: some triggers in front of this and then we can

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Speaker 4: go do a Series A. And that was get a

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Speaker 4: network deal, sign the players to MoU's at the time,

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Speaker 4: because we were all still under our MLL contracts MOUs

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Speaker 4: in this case, memorandum of understanding, right, so it was like,

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Speaker 4: this is what we're going to do, and if.

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Speaker 1: You're meaning the players will commit yep. Okay.

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Speaker 4: So we had them UNDERMUS and then they said court

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Speaker 4: some sponsors.

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Speaker 1: We were able to get those three done. That led

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Speaker 1: to our Series A.

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Speaker 4: Income Joe Tie, who I consider the godfather of lacrosse,

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Speaker 4: co founder of Ali Baba runs the Brooklyn Nets, also

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Speaker 4: played lacrosse at Yale.

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Speaker 1: We had conversations with him going back to twenty sixteen

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Speaker 1: on this.

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Speaker 4: But Joe, as many like really top tier executives, they

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Speaker 4: want to stay out of the crossfire, especially if it's unnecessary.

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Speaker 4: So he knew that this was going to be a

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Speaker 4: little bit of a heated battle out of the gates.

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Speaker 4: And wanted to see as if Mike and I could

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Speaker 4: get out, and once we did, he came on, and

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Speaker 4: we've had subsequent rounds and brought on folks like Arctoscia,

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Speaker 4: Churning Group.

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Speaker 1: Right and Paul.

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Speaker 3: Before you get into like those blue chippers, going back

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Speaker 3: to the safe note, can you share or at least

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Speaker 3: what you could share, what were the terms on that

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Speaker 3: note versus when you brought in CIA and Churnin Group

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Speaker 3: and others.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Well, what you do is you put a.

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Speaker 4: Cap on the convertible note and you say like, okay,

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Speaker 4: look we want to raise I'll give you ballpark numbers.

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Speaker 4: We weren't raising away from three to ten million bucks

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Speaker 4: so that we can build the structure of this company.

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Speaker 4: We don't know what the valuation is and that's why

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Speaker 4: you put a cap on. How it converts, and so

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Speaker 4: then you agree around like what the cap is, or

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Speaker 4: you disagree. That didn't work. So our price round was

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Speaker 4: like we raised X amount of dollars, but I can

401
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Speaker 4: give you ballpark around when it's multiple since about fifteen

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00:20:01,160 --> 00:20:03,600
Speaker 4: x sixteen x since our Wow, those who came in.

403
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Speaker 1: The seed round, So it was a low valuation.

404
00:20:06,480 --> 00:20:09,720
Speaker 4: But again we hadn't brought in any revenue yet, and

405
00:20:09,800 --> 00:20:13,919
Speaker 4: you think about the nearest comparisons, probably TGL that has

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Speaker 4: been selling teams at really high prices.

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Speaker 1: Which is the new golf concept.

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00:20:18,960 --> 00:20:22,879
Speaker 4: Yeah, run by Mike who's his former NBC executive ran

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Speaker 4: the Golf Channel's great dude. He has been able to

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00:20:26,160 --> 00:20:29,040
Speaker 4: tell a really good story and also pull on case

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Speaker 4: studies of other leagues since then to say, hey, this

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Speaker 4: is what it's worth without playing a match yet, right,

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00:20:35,760 --> 00:20:38,280
Speaker 4: which is extraordinarily difficult to do and really high risk

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Speaker 4: because in the end, like we're all playing the long game,

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Speaker 4: the PLL is not going to be my last business, right,

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Speaker 4: you know.

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Speaker 2: So you're going in as an athlete, you've got to

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Speaker 2: tell a story that says not just I think there's

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Speaker 2: a lot of potential here, but like I know what

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Speaker 2: I'm doing. Like, how did you convince people that you

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Speaker 2: know this was the right path forward?

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00:21:02,359 --> 00:21:02,679
Speaker 1: Well?

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Speaker 4: I looked at the history of inflection points in pro sports,

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Speaker 4: and you go all the way back to Major League Baseball,

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Speaker 4: and we asked the question too, like why are team

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Speaker 4: sports home and away while they have stadiums, what are

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00:21:13,240 --> 00:21:17,919
Speaker 4: the revenues tied to such Baseball and nearly nineteen hundreds

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Speaker 4: was a ticket sales business a lot of games. For

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Speaker 4: that reason, it became an RSN media business, and then

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Speaker 4: it became a concessions business merchandise business. But you play

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Speaker 4: one hundred and sixty two games, a lot of games.

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Speaker 1: He's aware, I'm just making sure s yeah.

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Speaker 4: So so you get to a business that was built

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Speaker 4: around very much. So even even the day to day

435
00:21:40,600 --> 00:21:42,920
Speaker 4: worker was born in New York City and lived their

436
00:21:42,920 --> 00:21:46,240
Speaker 4: life in New York City. And there's so much community

437
00:21:46,280 --> 00:21:49,000
Speaker 4: that actually lives today right, And it's important to get

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Speaker 4: that right in pro sports. If you look at what

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00:21:51,280 --> 00:21:54,439
Speaker 4: the turning point was the NFL for Pete Roselle in

440
00:21:54,480 --> 00:21:58,119
Speaker 4: the nineteen sixties, it was deciding to go on broadcast cable,

441
00:21:58,600 --> 00:22:02,120
Speaker 4: which seems like, oh, home run. Wasn't the case then

442
00:22:02,240 --> 00:22:05,159
Speaker 4: because the worry was in a ticketing business. If you

443
00:22:05,280 --> 00:22:07,120
Speaker 4: broadcast games, people won't.

444
00:22:06,960 --> 00:22:07,919
Speaker 1: Go, they won't show up.

445
00:22:07,960 --> 00:22:10,480
Speaker 4: They jumped the TV faster and Major League Baseball did.

446
00:22:11,200 --> 00:22:13,760
Speaker 4: I think the NBA and David Stern and Adam Silver

447
00:22:14,480 --> 00:22:17,520
Speaker 4: in the eighties and nineties better than anyone else, has

448
00:22:17,600 --> 00:22:22,760
Speaker 4: created culture and entertainment and this connectivity around the NBA

449
00:22:22,960 --> 00:22:27,520
Speaker 4: that is star led for team sports. So what we

450
00:22:27,600 --> 00:22:30,240
Speaker 4: said is like, okay, cool, this is twenty seventeen.

451
00:22:30,280 --> 00:22:31,200
Speaker 1: We're raising money.

452
00:22:31,640 --> 00:22:34,159
Speaker 4: I'm a testament to this as an athlete that's built

453
00:22:34,160 --> 00:22:36,600
Speaker 4: a profile because those wages didn't change, by the way,

454
00:22:37,080 --> 00:22:39,720
Speaker 4: but my income did. Because I got sponsors signed up,

455
00:22:39,720 --> 00:22:41,919
Speaker 4: because I started a YouTube channel, a podcast, I was

456
00:22:41,920 --> 00:22:45,639
Speaker 4: active on social. I knew modern media what I felt

457
00:22:45,640 --> 00:22:48,040
Speaker 4: better than anyone else. So I was like, these are

458
00:22:48,080 --> 00:22:50,919
Speaker 4: the leagues of X, Y, and Z. We're going to

459
00:22:50,920 --> 00:22:52,560
Speaker 4: be the league of digital. And that's why you're going

460
00:22:52,640 --> 00:22:57,080
Speaker 4: to invest. We know how to leverage the new attention economy,

461
00:22:57,520 --> 00:23:01,280
Speaker 4: we know how to storytell. Our large business unit at

462
00:23:01,280 --> 00:23:02,879
Speaker 4: the poll from day one is going to be our

463
00:23:02,880 --> 00:23:06,399
Speaker 4: production house because right now every team and league outsources

464
00:23:06,920 --> 00:23:09,720
Speaker 4: media and marketing. We're gonna take that inside. We're gonna

465
00:23:09,720 --> 00:23:13,240
Speaker 4: make us fast and more agile. And we believe we're

466
00:23:13,280 --> 00:23:17,680
Speaker 4: not building CrossFit or slam ball, which are new sports

467
00:23:17,680 --> 00:23:20,439
Speaker 4: really from scratch. This is a sport that already has

468
00:23:20,480 --> 00:23:22,399
Speaker 4: product market fit. Our job is to get it to

469
00:23:22,440 --> 00:23:24,080
Speaker 4: the red zone and then over the goal line.

470
00:23:24,160 --> 00:23:25,800
Speaker 3: So just to expand on that a little bit, if

471
00:23:25,800 --> 00:23:27,720
Speaker 3: you go back a little bit, Paul, tell us a

472
00:23:27,720 --> 00:23:30,359
Speaker 3: little bit about the two or three things that you

473
00:23:30,440 --> 00:23:33,840
Speaker 3: thought that the prior league that you played in was underachieving,

474
00:23:34,400 --> 00:23:36,800
Speaker 3: and what was your thesis to the investors, besides what

475
00:23:36,960 --> 00:23:39,199
Speaker 3: you just mentioned with the media, that you can do

476
00:23:39,240 --> 00:23:42,720
Speaker 3: better and ultimately build a successful, sustainable business.

477
00:23:43,040 --> 00:23:45,320
Speaker 4: Number one is your most important part is your network.

478
00:23:46,359 --> 00:23:50,480
Speaker 4: You have to have a media company, not only invested, which,

479
00:23:50,520 --> 00:23:52,439
Speaker 4: by the way, one of our board members is David O'Connor,

480
00:23:52,440 --> 00:23:54,000
Speaker 4: who used to be a partner at CA, was running

481
00:23:54,080 --> 00:23:55,600
Speaker 4: MSG at one point and now is co founder of

482
00:23:55,720 --> 00:23:56,520
Speaker 4: Arctos YEP.

483
00:23:56,760 --> 00:23:59,280
Speaker 1: Brilliant Doc o'kind love Doc.

484
00:23:59,280 --> 00:24:01,680
Speaker 4: As everyone knows, and Doc told us about a few

485
00:24:01,760 --> 00:24:03,960
Speaker 4: years ago, the most difficult thing to do in sports

486
00:24:04,040 --> 00:24:07,159
Speaker 4: is get a media rights deal. Most of those two

487
00:24:07,280 --> 00:24:09,280
Speaker 4: hundred leagues that I had mentioned from the nineties that

488
00:24:09,320 --> 00:24:12,119
Speaker 4: started all the way through, they're in revshare deals or

489
00:24:12,200 --> 00:24:17,000
Speaker 4: time buyse We were a revshare partnership with NBC Sports

490
00:24:17,040 --> 00:24:19,440
Speaker 4: when we first launched. Why would they give us a

491
00:24:19,480 --> 00:24:23,240
Speaker 4: media rights deal? It's not tested yet, and so the

492
00:24:23,320 --> 00:24:28,080
Speaker 4: former league really struggled with that chicken and egg theory,

493
00:24:28,200 --> 00:24:30,119
Speaker 4: which is you sort of need a network to develop

494
00:24:30,160 --> 00:24:32,639
Speaker 4: an audience and score rating, but they have all the

495
00:24:32,720 --> 00:24:36,080
Speaker 4: leverage until you score rating and then whether it's entertainment,

496
00:24:36,359 --> 00:24:41,560
Speaker 4: which I always referenced Seinfeld to Cheer where Seinfeld got

497
00:24:41,560 --> 00:24:44,280
Speaker 4: its first pilot, big rating on the heels of that

498
00:24:44,480 --> 00:24:49,560
Speaker 4: fifty million audience, and so entertainment you test new shows.

499
00:24:50,040 --> 00:24:53,359
Speaker 4: We don't really see pilots anymore based on lead ins.

500
00:24:53,720 --> 00:24:54,200
Speaker 1: Sports.

501
00:24:54,359 --> 00:24:56,399
Speaker 4: With a great network, you get a good lead in,

502
00:24:57,080 --> 00:24:59,520
Speaker 4: you get introduced to a new audience, which is really

503
00:24:59,560 --> 00:25:01,679
Speaker 4: important for a sport like lacrosse. So we knew we

504
00:25:01,720 --> 00:25:04,960
Speaker 4: needed to get that and we might have to fight

505
00:25:05,720 --> 00:25:09,240
Speaker 4: to get that and really dig in as a network

506
00:25:09,320 --> 00:25:13,520
Speaker 4: partner to drive viewership. And that's what NBC noticed, and

507
00:25:13,640 --> 00:25:16,280
Speaker 4: they decided to invest into the production.

508
00:25:16,760 --> 00:25:17,640
Speaker 1: We did a revshare.

509
00:25:17,800 --> 00:25:20,600
Speaker 4: It was a profitable business at the time, which three

510
00:25:20,680 --> 00:25:23,439
Speaker 4: years later led to that media rights deal with the

511
00:25:23,480 --> 00:25:24,480
Speaker 4: Gang at ESPN.

512
00:25:25,440 --> 00:25:27,840
Speaker 1: So one of the things that fascinates me and Alex

513
00:25:27,880 --> 00:25:28,480
Speaker 1: has this too.

514
00:25:29,640 --> 00:25:33,320
Speaker 2: You just have this ability and willingness to just walk

515
00:25:33,440 --> 00:25:38,960
Speaker 2: in to these meetings with these massive executives and just

516
00:25:39,040 --> 00:25:42,560
Speaker 2: be like, here, I am, I've got this idea, I

517
00:25:42,640 --> 00:25:43,280
Speaker 2: believe in it.

518
00:25:43,600 --> 00:25:44,280
Speaker 1: You should too.

519
00:25:45,280 --> 00:25:48,240
Speaker 2: Let's do that and then you're so, where does that

520
00:25:48,640 --> 00:25:53,159
Speaker 2: engine come from? Because that's different. That's different from like

521
00:25:53,240 --> 00:25:54,200
Speaker 2: being good on the field.

522
00:25:54,280 --> 00:25:56,640
Speaker 4: I think that, you know, I had mentioned the stereotype

523
00:25:56,680 --> 00:25:59,320
Speaker 4: that I felt for most of my career and still

524
00:25:59,320 --> 00:26:00,200
Speaker 4: do at times.

525
00:26:01,080 --> 00:26:02,040
Speaker 1: You don't have that.

526
00:26:02,160 --> 00:26:05,240
Speaker 4: When you meet with sports executives, they love they love it,

527
00:26:05,280 --> 00:26:08,400
Speaker 4: they understand that. And sure, another thing that we had

528
00:26:08,400 --> 00:26:10,480
Speaker 4: to work on that the former league didn't have is

529
00:26:10,520 --> 00:26:13,000
Speaker 4: get real corporate partners in that are willing to spend.

530
00:26:13,000 --> 00:26:15,320
Speaker 4: And we had Gatorade and Adidas in Capital one in

531
00:26:15,359 --> 00:26:18,679
Speaker 4: our first year and now it's stretched like Ticketmaster and

532
00:26:18,720 --> 00:26:23,119
Speaker 4: cash App and Progressive and so many different categories. Now,

533
00:26:24,200 --> 00:26:27,320
Speaker 4: going into those meetings is hard. But when you sit

534
00:26:27,359 --> 00:26:29,320
Speaker 4: with Jeff Carney, who was one of the three Jeffs

535
00:26:29,359 --> 00:26:34,199
Speaker 4: at Gatorade, who knows what it's like to sit for

536
00:26:34,240 --> 00:26:37,200
Speaker 4: a meal with Abby Wombox, Aerena Williams and Michael Jordan.

537
00:26:37,359 --> 00:26:40,680
Speaker 4: They know that work ethic. Yeah, I don't feel pressure there.

538
00:26:40,680 --> 00:26:45,439
Speaker 4: I actually feel welcomed. I feel community. But make no mistake,

539
00:26:45,520 --> 00:26:49,239
Speaker 4: I think what we've learned and you go next, is that,

540
00:26:50,359 --> 00:26:52,040
Speaker 4: oh man, we can defy odds.

541
00:26:52,840 --> 00:26:54,440
Speaker 1: If we were to look at the.

542
00:26:54,400 --> 00:26:57,120
Speaker 4: Percentages of becoming a Major League baseball player, a professional

543
00:26:57,160 --> 00:26:59,919
Speaker 4: acrosse player, or an international player in whatever sports. Love

544
00:27:00,200 --> 00:27:03,199
Speaker 4: it's under one percent. So when you do it, you

545
00:27:03,240 --> 00:27:05,520
Speaker 4: sort of trick your mind into believing that you can

546
00:27:05,560 --> 00:27:09,360
Speaker 4: manifest in anything. And I believe in manifestation, by the way,

547
00:27:09,520 --> 00:27:12,160
Speaker 4: So that's not enough on its own.

548
00:27:12,440 --> 00:27:14,840
Speaker 1: You've got it and do the work. And so man,

549
00:27:14,920 --> 00:27:16,200
Speaker 1: I study.

550
00:27:16,320 --> 00:27:18,439
Speaker 4: I study you guys before even walking in here, and

551
00:27:18,440 --> 00:27:20,480
Speaker 4: I know both of you, so I think it's just

552
00:27:20,480 --> 00:27:23,360
Speaker 4: so important to come prepared. And that's another sport attribute. Yeah,

553
00:27:23,359 --> 00:27:24,480
Speaker 4: I mean does that resonate with you?

554
00:27:24,560 --> 00:27:26,640
Speaker 1: I mean, what's your mindset when you go in Well,

555
00:27:26,680 --> 00:27:27,600
Speaker 1: I think it's two things.

556
00:27:27,640 --> 00:27:29,600
Speaker 3: I think Paul and I are not afraid of the work,

557
00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:33,400
Speaker 3: and the numbers will tell you that over our long careers.

558
00:27:33,920 --> 00:27:35,840
Speaker 3: But the other thing is we've proven that we're able

559
00:27:35,880 --> 00:27:38,199
Speaker 3: to surround ourselves, check the ego at the door, and

560
00:27:38,240 --> 00:27:39,720
Speaker 3: surround ourselves with the best.

561
00:27:39,600 --> 00:27:40,439
Speaker 1: Minds in the world.

562
00:27:40,880 --> 00:27:43,600
Speaker 3: So when you go and talk to these titans, that's

563
00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:47,280
Speaker 3: exactly what they've done. Now, they have fancier degrees, they

564
00:27:47,520 --> 00:27:49,959
Speaker 3: have better returns and all that, but when you look

565
00:27:50,000 --> 00:27:52,800
Speaker 3: at our resume or you look in at a LinkedIn account.

566
00:27:52,880 --> 00:27:55,000
Speaker 3: We're looking at a trajectory, right, and when you look

567
00:27:55,040 --> 00:27:59,040
Speaker 3: at Paul's trajectory, it screams champion. Right from the time

568
00:27:59,080 --> 00:28:02,440
Speaker 3: you're in college to where you are today, it's been

569
00:28:02,520 --> 00:28:04,800
Speaker 3: like this. No, it hasn't been straight up, I'm sure

570
00:28:05,000 --> 00:28:07,520
Speaker 3: for both of us we've had this, but we're not

571
00:28:07,560 --> 00:28:09,159
Speaker 3: afraid of the work. We surround ourselves with the right

572
00:28:09,200 --> 00:28:11,080
Speaker 3: people and we're never going to give up until we

573
00:28:11,119 --> 00:28:14,320
Speaker 3: win the title. And I think that's what they recognize.

574
00:28:14,520 --> 00:28:16,640
Speaker 3: And the other part is we're talking about sports. We're

575
00:28:16,680 --> 00:28:19,480
Speaker 3: not talking about gas and oil or something that's really

576
00:28:19,520 --> 00:28:22,520
Speaker 3: like not as sexy. Everybody will take the meeting a

577
00:28:22,720 --> 00:28:25,439
Speaker 3: because your Paul b because you're doing something big and bold,

578
00:28:25,920 --> 00:28:28,680
Speaker 3: and see you and Mike have a real thing here.

579
00:28:28,760 --> 00:28:29,760
Speaker 1: Why not? Why not?

580
00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:33,760
Speaker 4: I'd add to it one more thing that Alex had

581
00:28:33,800 --> 00:28:37,640
Speaker 4: me think of, which is in the startup community, they'll say,

582
00:28:37,640 --> 00:28:41,440
Speaker 4: what's your unfair advantage? Our unfair advantage is that I

583
00:28:41,440 --> 00:28:44,200
Speaker 4: had a relationship with the players. I can't run a

584
00:28:44,280 --> 00:28:47,640
Speaker 4: league and play in a league against myself, And the

585
00:28:47,760 --> 00:28:52,880
Speaker 4: unfair advantage was, okay, you could have hypothetically a few

586
00:28:52,920 --> 00:28:55,600
Speaker 4: other folks come in and pitch starting a pro lacrossely,

587
00:28:55,720 --> 00:28:58,760
Speaker 4: but they don't have the players. It's all for nothing, right,

588
00:28:59,200 --> 00:29:01,880
Speaker 4: So in any line of work, what's your unfunded advantage

589
00:29:02,080 --> 00:29:02,720
Speaker 4: table stakes?

590
00:29:02,720 --> 00:29:04,640
Speaker 1: You have to be a subject matter expert.

591
00:29:05,000 --> 00:29:08,080
Speaker 2: But that relationship with the players is a critical one.

592
00:29:08,160 --> 00:29:10,800
Speaker 2: I mean, it's interesting because you've now sat on both

593
00:29:10,800 --> 00:29:13,240
Speaker 2: sides of the table of like being an athlete being

594
00:29:13,240 --> 00:29:16,200
Speaker 2: an owner. You know, you were essentially doing both at

595
00:29:16,240 --> 00:29:19,200
Speaker 2: the same time. Well, Alex said it, and it's not.

596
00:29:21,160 --> 00:29:25,520
Speaker 2: I think it's actually really really underrated in the entertainment world,

597
00:29:25,600 --> 00:29:28,080
Speaker 2: which is what we're in as a pro athlete, or

598
00:29:28,800 --> 00:29:30,840
Speaker 2: you know, if you're in cinema and you're an actor

599
00:29:31,120 --> 00:29:35,480
Speaker 2: or even a writer, is being humble and having a

600
00:29:35,560 --> 00:29:39,360
Speaker 2: level of self awareness and being kind to your peers.

601
00:29:39,400 --> 00:29:43,960
Speaker 2: That actually doesn't exist everywhere. But the people that I

602
00:29:44,160 --> 00:29:47,800
Speaker 2: try to surround myself with have that. They also have

603
00:29:48,280 --> 00:29:51,080
Speaker 2: the freedom to check me when I get over my skis.

604
00:29:51,720 --> 00:29:53,000
Speaker 2: I notice Alex has that.

605
00:29:53,880 --> 00:29:56,320
Speaker 4: And you know, now an owner of the Timberwolves, you

606
00:29:56,360 --> 00:29:59,959
Speaker 4: probably have a really natural and authentic way about going

607
00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:02,400
Speaker 4: and talking to the players on the team. And that's

608
00:30:02,600 --> 00:30:06,240
Speaker 4: different than traditional sports owners. You know, where there is

609
00:30:06,280 --> 00:30:10,680
Speaker 4: a pretty clear and distinct wall between ownership and players,

610
00:30:10,720 --> 00:30:12,800
Speaker 4: and that's why a lot of times unions started.

611
00:30:13,800 --> 00:30:16,040
Speaker 3: Let me add this, I think what Paul and I

612
00:30:16,080 --> 00:30:17,960
Speaker 3: can do very well is we can be the bridge

613
00:30:18,360 --> 00:30:22,680
Speaker 3: between institutional capital and the athletes because we now know

614
00:30:23,200 --> 00:30:25,960
Speaker 3: how they both think. Yeah, and that is really I

615
00:30:26,000 --> 00:30:29,600
Speaker 3: want to underscore that because, especially as an owner of

616
00:30:29,640 --> 00:30:32,880
Speaker 3: the Timbles and the Lynks, I see how valuable it

617
00:30:32,960 --> 00:30:36,040
Speaker 3: is to have empathy for the players to understand how

618
00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:37,960
Speaker 3: difficult it is today. It's never been harder to be

619
00:30:37,960 --> 00:30:40,680
Speaker 3: an athlete in today's world. At twenty twenty four. Thank

620
00:30:40,800 --> 00:30:44,360
Speaker 3: god social media wasn't around. I got myself in enough trouble. God,

621
00:30:44,960 --> 00:30:46,880
Speaker 3: you know, with social media it was in the heyday

622
00:30:46,920 --> 00:30:49,240
Speaker 3: when I played, it would have been that much more challenging.

623
00:30:49,320 --> 00:30:52,200
Speaker 3: So having empathy for the today's player, I think is crucial.

624
00:30:52,400 --> 00:30:55,920
Speaker 4: And sometimes empathy is just sitting with emotions and not jurisdicting,

625
00:30:56,000 --> 00:30:59,560
Speaker 4: which is you know, as executives, is what you feel

626
00:30:59,560 --> 00:31:00,160
Speaker 4: like is now.

627
00:31:01,880 --> 00:31:03,680
Speaker 3: One question when you think, I love what you're thinking,

628
00:31:03,680 --> 00:31:05,960
Speaker 3: But when you're describing what you did, which is beautiful,

629
00:31:05,960 --> 00:31:08,680
Speaker 3: and this what makes you kind of Paul one of

630
00:31:08,800 --> 00:31:12,760
Speaker 3: one is Adam Silver is the same way. He's just

631
00:31:12,800 --> 00:31:17,080
Speaker 3: a tremendous commissioner. Any commissioners or leaders out there domestically

632
00:31:17,120 --> 00:31:20,120
Speaker 3: ori internationally that you look and study to see how

633
00:31:20,160 --> 00:31:21,200
Speaker 3: you can apply to your league.

634
00:31:22,360 --> 00:31:26,680
Speaker 4: Adam is a friend, is a mentor. I try to

635
00:31:26,680 --> 00:31:30,760
Speaker 4: get with him a couple times a year. He is

636
00:31:30,920 --> 00:31:35,520
Speaker 4: absolutely that. Whether it's Adam, whether it's Jimmy Pittarro, whether

637
00:31:35,520 --> 00:31:40,000
Speaker 4: it's Don Garber. The best executives I've noticed in sports

638
00:31:40,080 --> 00:31:44,240
Speaker 4: and sports media, they have velocity, you know, but it's

639
00:31:44,240 --> 00:31:47,280
Speaker 4: not just returning your email or your text fast. It's

640
00:31:47,480 --> 00:31:53,480
Speaker 4: doing it thoughtfully. And I think that to your point,

641
00:31:53,760 --> 00:31:56,560
Speaker 4: when you're a senior executive, your job is to keep

642
00:31:56,600 --> 00:32:00,600
Speaker 4: the wheel going. You know, talent really matters. You can't

643
00:32:00,640 --> 00:32:04,200
Speaker 4: forget what business you're in. You know, we run the PLL.

644
00:32:05,000 --> 00:32:07,200
Speaker 4: We have to think about and spend a lot of

645
00:32:07,240 --> 00:32:11,240
Speaker 4: time with our players. Is that revenue driving You could

646
00:32:11,400 --> 00:32:15,080
Speaker 4: like throw dotted lines to such, sure, but it's the

647
00:32:15,280 --> 00:32:17,560
Speaker 4: essence of what you do. So I think being able

648
00:32:17,600 --> 00:32:20,720
Speaker 4: to understand that is of utmost importance.

649
00:32:32,720 --> 00:32:34,680
Speaker 2: One of the things that strikes me is that both

650
00:32:34,720 --> 00:32:38,360
Speaker 2: of you are quite evolved, and I also know have

651
00:32:38,480 --> 00:32:43,480
Speaker 2: done a lot of work on yourselves. You talk pretty

652
00:32:43,480 --> 00:32:47,880
Speaker 2: openly about being in therapy. You've talked about that a

653
00:32:47,880 --> 00:32:50,880
Speaker 2: lot as well. How has that changed you? And I'm

654
00:32:50,880 --> 00:32:52,720
Speaker 2: going to turn it on this guy too, but how

655
00:32:52,760 --> 00:32:55,000
Speaker 2: has that changed you as a leader?

656
00:32:56,520 --> 00:32:59,320
Speaker 4: It's a great question. I asked Alex about this in

657
00:32:59,360 --> 00:33:07,160
Speaker 4: the past because my concern about originally about sports psychology

658
00:33:07,160 --> 00:33:10,200
Speaker 4: and therapy is that it would make me soft. And

659
00:33:10,240 --> 00:33:13,880
Speaker 4: now I think about the soft masculine and how that's

660
00:33:13,960 --> 00:33:16,920
Speaker 4: the most powerful version of ourselves where we can be

661
00:33:17,000 --> 00:33:20,800
Speaker 4: empathetic and then also turn up the dial on our competitiveness.

662
00:33:22,120 --> 00:33:23,880
Speaker 1: And it's not a light switch.

663
00:33:24,920 --> 00:33:27,560
Speaker 4: So I had to learn that because I wanted to

664
00:33:27,600 --> 00:33:30,400
Speaker 4: be the A Rod of lacrosse. I wanted to be

665
00:33:30,440 --> 00:33:33,280
Speaker 4: the MJ of Lacrosse. I wanted to be you know

666
00:33:33,320 --> 00:33:37,640
Speaker 4: what Tom Brady was, And I see these fierce competitors,

667
00:33:38,160 --> 00:33:42,480
Speaker 4: fierce and you know on the cover of the book

668
00:33:42,480 --> 00:33:46,760
Speaker 4: that runs in at direct odds with understanding or having

669
00:33:46,800 --> 00:33:49,640
Speaker 4: perspective around losing being okay or part of the process,

670
00:33:49,760 --> 00:33:55,520
Speaker 4: and we will heal, we will actually grow. So it

671
00:33:55,600 --> 00:33:58,000
Speaker 4: was a challenge for me to get into it and

672
00:33:58,040 --> 00:33:59,520
Speaker 4: then once and I want to give a shout out

673
00:33:59,520 --> 00:34:03,960
Speaker 4: to my sports psychologists, formerly doctor John Elliott. Once I

674
00:34:04,000 --> 00:34:06,800
Speaker 4: got into sports psychology and understood that actually know it's

675
00:34:06,800 --> 00:34:09,000
Speaker 4: a superpower and you're not going to lose that and

676
00:34:09,080 --> 00:34:13,200
Speaker 4: kind of that metaphorical dial versus switch, and that you're

677
00:34:13,239 --> 00:34:16,279
Speaker 4: going to become a better leader, which is what helps

678
00:34:16,360 --> 00:34:21,319
Speaker 4: teams win, it was just all in for me from there.

679
00:34:21,360 --> 00:34:22,920
Speaker 1: So I was doing therapy like twice.

680
00:34:22,640 --> 00:34:26,160
Speaker 4: A week every week for seven years, and it became

681
00:34:26,239 --> 00:34:29,880
Speaker 4: like practice, and like practice going back to what we

682
00:34:29,960 --> 00:34:31,520
Speaker 4: do in sport. When we love in sports, you can

683
00:34:31,600 --> 00:34:37,520
Speaker 4: feel yourself improve and learn about psychology, and that psychology

684
00:34:37,560 --> 00:34:39,440
Speaker 4: on the business side has been a big unlock for me.

685
00:34:40,560 --> 00:34:45,040
Speaker 4: What I've learned the difference therapeutically between being an athlete

686
00:34:45,200 --> 00:34:48,919
Speaker 4: and a business person is this, in sports, you can

687
00:34:49,040 --> 00:34:53,759
Speaker 4: win with sheer willpower and effort and strength, and it's

688
00:34:54,280 --> 00:34:55,800
Speaker 4: designated to do such.

689
00:34:56,040 --> 00:34:58,239
Speaker 1: Yeah, like we're going to square.

690
00:34:57,920 --> 00:34:59,839
Speaker 4: Off, one of us is going to win, in one

691
00:34:59,880 --> 00:35:03,040
Speaker 4: of is going to lose. So Mike comes into play.

692
00:35:04,320 --> 00:35:08,239
Speaker 4: In business, that's the absolute wrong idea. You don't want

693
00:35:08,239 --> 00:35:11,280
Speaker 4: to go into a partnership where you won the deal

694
00:35:11,800 --> 00:35:14,080
Speaker 4: and the other person feels really bad because guess what,

695
00:35:14,200 --> 00:35:16,839
Speaker 4: that partnership ain't going to renew, right, and you want

696
00:35:16,880 --> 00:35:19,440
Speaker 4: to be in the renewal business. And I know that

697
00:35:19,560 --> 00:35:21,440
Speaker 4: we've discussed that before, so I'd be curious what any

698
00:35:21,400 --> 00:35:21,919
Speaker 4: you think of it.

699
00:35:22,080 --> 00:35:23,960
Speaker 1: No, I always say the ninety percent.

700
00:35:23,800 --> 00:35:26,759
Speaker 3: Rule, right, if you know, in order to get a deal,

701
00:35:26,880 --> 00:35:28,879
Speaker 3: both sides, I feel have to hurt a little bit

702
00:35:28,920 --> 00:35:29,680
Speaker 3: and win a little bit.

703
00:35:29,760 --> 00:35:29,840
Speaker 4: Right.

704
00:35:29,960 --> 00:35:31,680
Speaker 3: It can be like all one side, or that'll be

705
00:35:31,680 --> 00:35:34,439
Speaker 3: the last deal. But let me bring you inside because

706
00:35:34,480 --> 00:35:38,520
Speaker 3: I agreed with everything you said about the stigma around

707
00:35:38,520 --> 00:35:39,600
Speaker 3: therapy or on sports.

708
00:35:40,040 --> 00:35:41,120
Speaker 1: And we've come a long ways.

709
00:35:41,160 --> 00:35:43,480
Speaker 3: I mean we're now twenty twenty four, but bring you

710
00:35:43,560 --> 00:35:46,080
Speaker 3: back about call it twenty years back into our club.

711
00:35:46,080 --> 00:35:48,120
Speaker 3: I was when George Steinberner was still running the team.

712
00:35:48,320 --> 00:35:51,000
Speaker 3: So George Steinberner says, I want to introduce Chad. He

713
00:35:51,200 --> 00:35:56,440
Speaker 3: is a very very good sports psychologist. His office will

714
00:35:56,480 --> 00:35:59,600
Speaker 3: be right next to mine. Come see him anytime. Okay,

715
00:36:00,080 --> 00:36:02,480
Speaker 3: two years we had zero people walking that run.

716
00:36:02,560 --> 00:36:02,880
Speaker 1: Wow.

717
00:36:03,239 --> 00:36:05,319
Speaker 3: So then he reintroduced him and he said, hey, I

718
00:36:05,320 --> 00:36:09,840
Speaker 3: want to introduce Chad. He did is a reintroduce. Reintroduced Chad.

719
00:36:10,120 --> 00:36:13,319
Speaker 3: He's a performance coach. Twenty three out of twenty five

720
00:36:13,320 --> 00:36:15,640
Speaker 3: of us went in there. But Chad is such a

721
00:36:15,640 --> 00:36:18,799
Speaker 3: great guy became still a very close personal friend and

722
00:36:18,840 --> 00:36:22,160
Speaker 3: an integral part of a two thousand and nine championship team.

723
00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:25,359
Speaker 3: But talk about how you label something and the way

724
00:36:25,440 --> 00:36:30,120
Speaker 3: to go around it goes from psychologists to performance coach. Yeah, athletes,

725
00:36:30,160 --> 00:36:31,960
Speaker 3: we bought into performance coach, and.

726
00:36:32,280 --> 00:36:35,480
Speaker 4: That's just also underscores culture, which is set at the

727
00:36:35,520 --> 00:36:41,200
Speaker 4: top and mister Steinbrenner's focus on and his belief and

728
00:36:41,239 --> 00:36:43,400
Speaker 4: how that could help the team.

729
00:36:43,640 --> 00:36:46,960
Speaker 2: How do you apply all these lessons that you have

730
00:36:47,120 --> 00:36:52,840
Speaker 2: learned to what feels like a critical moment? Maybe there

731
00:36:52,840 --> 00:36:54,720
Speaker 2: are a lot of critical moments, but this one feels

732
00:36:54,800 --> 00:36:57,400
Speaker 2: like a critical moment in the business of lacrosse. Like

733
00:36:57,960 --> 00:37:01,400
Speaker 2: you're looking ahead to twenty eight in the Olympic. You've merged,

734
00:37:01,400 --> 00:37:04,480
Speaker 2: as you said, the PLL and the MLL, you've absorbed

735
00:37:04,520 --> 00:37:06,480
Speaker 2: the league that you essentially usurped.

736
00:37:07,719 --> 00:37:09,320
Speaker 1: What needs to happen now?

737
00:37:10,000 --> 00:37:12,359
Speaker 2: Things are trending the right direction, But what are those

738
00:37:12,440 --> 00:37:14,719
Speaker 2: key decisions you have to make? Are the key things

739
00:37:14,719 --> 00:37:15,960
Speaker 2: that need to happen next?

740
00:37:16,080 --> 00:37:17,759
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, a few highlights.

741
00:37:17,800 --> 00:37:21,000
Speaker 4: So when we launched our league, we were wholly owned,

742
00:37:21,120 --> 00:37:24,680
Speaker 4: still our single entity. We changed to a touring model,

743
00:37:24,680 --> 00:37:26,919
Speaker 4: which is part of what got to send the door

744
00:37:26,920 --> 00:37:29,600
Speaker 4: with these investors unique. And so we looked at the

745
00:37:29,640 --> 00:37:32,560
Speaker 4: UFCF one tennis golf and said, okay, if you can

746
00:37:32,600 --> 00:37:35,560
Speaker 4: bring all of your teams and descend upon a major

747
00:37:35,560 --> 00:37:39,160
Speaker 4: market city and a professional venue one time a season,

748
00:37:40,200 --> 00:37:42,200
Speaker 4: then you're going to flip the supply and demand curve

749
00:37:42,239 --> 00:37:45,320
Speaker 4: because lacrosse fans aren't as big as basketball, football, or

750
00:37:45,360 --> 00:37:48,000
Speaker 4: soccer fans in America. So we have a different model.

751
00:37:48,040 --> 00:37:51,080
Speaker 4: I'll come back to that. If you looked at what

752
00:37:51,120 --> 00:37:53,279
Speaker 4: we did from a media standpoint, we were able to

753
00:37:53,280 --> 00:37:56,160
Speaker 4: grow year of a year double digits. Since we've launched

754
00:37:57,160 --> 00:37:59,440
Speaker 4: and own and operated social and digital and now with

755
00:37:59,480 --> 00:38:02,640
Speaker 4: our media deal with ESPN, we hare to raise great capital,

756
00:38:02,719 --> 00:38:06,360
Speaker 4: support our players and new business initiatives like we just

757
00:38:06,400 --> 00:38:10,480
Speaker 4: talked about for us as we look into now getting

758
00:38:10,520 --> 00:38:13,160
Speaker 4: lacrosse back into the Olympics in twenty twenty eight. If

759
00:38:13,200 --> 00:38:18,120
Speaker 4: those are the goalposts, how does this league transform into

760
00:38:18,520 --> 00:38:22,239
Speaker 4: a top six team sports league in North America And

761
00:38:22,320 --> 00:38:26,080
Speaker 4: what that transformation may look like. Is no longer tour

762
00:38:27,040 --> 00:38:29,279
Speaker 4: And if you think about what we had talked about

763
00:38:29,320 --> 00:38:31,520
Speaker 4: we worked with Major League Baseball and still does with

764
00:38:31,760 --> 00:38:36,120
Speaker 4: team sports leagues. It's community and so we are working

765
00:38:36,200 --> 00:38:39,880
Speaker 4: pretty actively on dual scenarios, continuing to build out the

766
00:38:39,920 --> 00:38:43,680
Speaker 4: Holy owned model that's tour based with our teams in

767
00:38:43,760 --> 00:38:47,360
Speaker 4: home markets and going to those home markets, expanding our schedule,

768
00:38:47,400 --> 00:38:50,239
Speaker 4: which is in our business called tonnage, which means you

769
00:38:50,280 --> 00:38:52,640
Speaker 4: get more hours on television, which helps your media right

770
00:38:52,680 --> 00:38:56,920
Speaker 4: steal to then path two, which is selling our teams.

771
00:38:56,920 --> 00:38:59,480
Speaker 4: We have eight of them, and if you have great

772
00:38:59,520 --> 00:39:04,400
Speaker 4: owners in markets like Minnesota, like down in Utah, like

773
00:39:04,440 --> 00:39:08,239
Speaker 4: we have in New England, the crafts are investors and

774
00:39:08,280 --> 00:39:10,680
Speaker 4: you find the right ownership group with the package of

775
00:39:10,719 --> 00:39:13,279
Speaker 4: owning a venue with other sports properties that they can

776
00:39:13,320 --> 00:39:17,960
Speaker 4: cross promote against effectively their lead INDs. As I had

777
00:39:17,960 --> 00:39:21,640
Speaker 4: talked about the value of networks. That's a real path

778
00:39:22,080 --> 00:39:24,480
Speaker 4: and it doesn't stop at eight. If we choose that

779
00:39:25,239 --> 00:39:28,279
Speaker 4: shift maybe to a trade association model or with Don

780
00:39:28,280 --> 00:39:31,239
Speaker 4: Garbage in MLS which you maintain a single entity. And

781
00:39:31,320 --> 00:39:34,359
Speaker 4: he had Soccer United marketing and owners came in. They

782
00:39:34,360 --> 00:39:36,440
Speaker 4: owned the right to their team and up and their

783
00:39:36,480 --> 00:39:38,160
Speaker 4: pro out of position of forty one percent of some

784
00:39:38,640 --> 00:39:43,279
Speaker 4: which owned US and Mexican soccer rights. Our version of

785
00:39:43,480 --> 00:39:47,439
Speaker 4: call it some marketing is women's lacrosse ownership. We own

786
00:39:48,040 --> 00:39:51,920
Speaker 4: the largest media company called TLN Youth Lacrosse Investing. We

787
00:39:52,000 --> 00:39:54,640
Speaker 4: have these other properties that are really valuable and big

788
00:39:54,680 --> 00:39:57,239
Speaker 4: in addition to just owning a team. So that's how

789
00:39:57,239 --> 00:39:59,759
Speaker 4: that model could flex. And then you go from eight

790
00:39:59,800 --> 00:40:02,759
Speaker 4: to ten to twelve to fourteen to sixteen, and you're

791
00:40:02,840 --> 00:40:06,000
Speaker 4: really leaning into community in real estate, where if I

792
00:40:06,040 --> 00:40:10,880
Speaker 4: think about what makes sports high multiple businesses, enterprise businesses,

793
00:40:10,920 --> 00:40:15,160
Speaker 4: it's attention right through your partnerships and everything else I

794
00:40:15,239 --> 00:40:20,360
Speaker 4: talked about. It's revenue, so it's your corporate relationships, it's tickets,

795
00:40:20,360 --> 00:40:23,800
Speaker 4: it's merchandise, it's youth community and then real estate.

796
00:40:24,680 --> 00:40:26,920
Speaker 3: So Paul, when you think about that model, and you're

797
00:40:26,920 --> 00:40:29,799
Speaker 3: going kind of two different paths at the same time,

798
00:40:29,800 --> 00:40:32,280
Speaker 3: which I think is super smart to give you options

799
00:40:32,280 --> 00:40:36,399
Speaker 3: as an entrepreneur in five years, what do you think

800
00:40:36,480 --> 00:40:38,080
Speaker 3: is the north star and if you can have a

801
00:40:38,160 --> 00:40:41,480
Speaker 3: year way, what is the perfect comp that in the

802
00:40:41,560 --> 00:40:43,399
Speaker 3: league is doing that where they're hunting right now?

803
00:40:44,680 --> 00:40:47,759
Speaker 4: So for touring, our players will be full time and

804
00:40:47,800 --> 00:40:52,520
Speaker 4: living in markets, practicing every single day averaging six figures

805
00:40:52,600 --> 00:40:59,200
Speaker 4: in wages. We will be playing instead of fourteen weekends

806
00:40:59,239 --> 00:41:04,840
Speaker 4: of the year upwards of twenty four. If it's individually owned,

807
00:41:05,680 --> 00:41:08,680
Speaker 4: then we'll have our players in those markets. Their salaries

808
00:41:08,719 --> 00:41:12,440
Speaker 4: are passed through to team owners. They have their venues

809
00:41:12,480 --> 00:41:15,560
Speaker 4: that they're part of. The tonnage moves from fourteen to

810
00:41:15,600 --> 00:41:19,120
Speaker 4: twenty four weekends, which is looking like probably forty eight

811
00:41:19,239 --> 00:41:24,120
Speaker 4: upwards of eighty games, and that's a really good business

812
00:41:24,120 --> 00:41:29,719
Speaker 4: for us. From a breath of properties. We're entering a

813
00:41:29,760 --> 00:41:33,560
Speaker 4: new rights negotiation. Our four year deal with ESPN goes

814
00:41:33,600 --> 00:41:37,319
Speaker 4: through twenty twenty five. I think the media environment is

815
00:41:37,360 --> 00:41:41,440
Speaker 4: really exciting. People look at what would often be considered

816
00:41:41,480 --> 00:41:44,880
Speaker 4: the best business model over the last sixty years in America,

817
00:41:44,960 --> 00:41:50,040
Speaker 4: the cable bundle, as an indictment on media companies. They're

818
00:41:50,080 --> 00:41:53,640
Speaker 4: just losing that frothy business model which used to have

819
00:41:53,680 --> 00:41:55,600
Speaker 4: one hundred and ten million. But they're in the business

820
00:41:55,680 --> 00:42:00,000
Speaker 4: of content ownership, content licensing, and distribute.

821
00:42:00,960 --> 00:42:02,520
Speaker 3: I have one on that. So, Paul, when you think

822
00:42:02,560 --> 00:42:04,759
Speaker 3: about it, I just want to get it. I'm thinking

823
00:42:04,800 --> 00:42:07,359
Speaker 3: of you like if I'm an investor, right, so I'm

824
00:42:07,400 --> 00:42:10,879
Speaker 3: literally pitching you like you're looking for my capital even

825
00:42:10,880 --> 00:42:14,160
Speaker 3: though you're not in five to seven years. Is it

826
00:42:14,200 --> 00:42:18,960
Speaker 3: fair to say that you're either something like the NBA model, Yeah,

827
00:42:19,080 --> 00:42:20,480
Speaker 3: or something like the UFC model.

828
00:42:20,680 --> 00:42:24,120
Speaker 1: Yes? Is that fair? Yeah? And I think both both

829
00:42:24,239 --> 00:42:26,240
Speaker 1: paths are really valuable. I agree.

830
00:42:26,280 --> 00:42:30,400
Speaker 4: You know, the UFC sold to Endeavor as they staged

831
00:42:30,480 --> 00:42:33,160
Speaker 4: up for about four billion, and then Bob and will

832
00:42:33,320 --> 00:42:36,280
Speaker 4: Iger just bought Angel City at a two hundred and fifty

833
00:42:36,280 --> 00:42:38,719
Speaker 4: million dollar post. So I think it would probably be

834
00:42:38,840 --> 00:42:44,919
Speaker 4: NWSL or UFC. And I believe our enterprise value as

835
00:42:44,960 --> 00:42:47,799
Speaker 4: a league will be in the multi billions over the

836
00:42:47,840 --> 00:42:48,640
Speaker 4: next five years.

837
00:42:48,760 --> 00:42:52,359
Speaker 1: Where is it today? Approximately under one billion. I can't

838
00:42:52,360 --> 00:42:55,799
Speaker 1: give you more than that. That's fair number.

839
00:42:58,480 --> 00:43:01,319
Speaker 4: But look sports sports leagues and teams on average trade

840
00:43:01,360 --> 00:43:04,280
Speaker 4: for eight to ten times revenue, right, And the reason

841
00:43:04,280 --> 00:43:08,080
Speaker 4: why is all that we had just discussed. Warren Buffett

842
00:43:08,080 --> 00:43:12,879
Speaker 4: calls them monopolies because of scarcity. That's that and what

843
00:43:12,920 --> 00:43:16,120
Speaker 4: the technologists would say. Our LTV is thirty plus years.

844
00:43:16,880 --> 00:43:19,600
Speaker 4: You know, you get someone into a game, you get

845
00:43:19,600 --> 00:43:21,840
Speaker 4: them to be a Yankees fan, it lasts a lifetime.

846
00:43:22,560 --> 00:43:25,600
Speaker 4: That's way different than even the streaming business. LTV For

847
00:43:25,680 --> 00:43:27,200
Speaker 4: those who are lifetime value.

848
00:43:27,239 --> 00:43:27,680
Speaker 1: There you go.

849
00:43:27,800 --> 00:43:31,239
Speaker 4: So you figure out how much getting Alex to be

850
00:43:31,280 --> 00:43:34,040
Speaker 4: a fan of the PLL is worth to us from

851
00:43:34,040 --> 00:43:37,520
Speaker 4: a revenue standpoint, and then you do what's called a

852
00:43:37,560 --> 00:43:41,160
Speaker 4: customer acquisition cost analysis, so you build your CAC. How

853
00:43:41,239 --> 00:43:43,719
Speaker 4: much then would it cost me from a marketing and

854
00:43:43,800 --> 00:43:48,200
Speaker 4: investing into getting Alex? And is that a profitable difference? Right?

855
00:43:48,800 --> 00:43:49,000
Speaker 1: Right?

856
00:43:49,040 --> 00:43:52,000
Speaker 4: So if we're running a software business, which kind of

857
00:43:52,000 --> 00:43:54,000
Speaker 4: talking about would be intimidating to walk into a room

858
00:43:54,040 --> 00:43:56,239
Speaker 4: because it's not our cup of tea like sports was,

859
00:43:56,880 --> 00:43:59,400
Speaker 4: then I would be pitching our next round of financing

860
00:43:59,560 --> 00:44:01,680
Speaker 4: around how how low our CAC is and how big

861
00:44:01,719 --> 00:44:04,640
Speaker 4: our LTV is, and then you just pour it on

862
00:44:04,760 --> 00:44:07,799
Speaker 4: customer acquisition. We're in that stage right now where we

863
00:44:07,880 --> 00:44:10,399
Speaker 4: have a good idea around where we need to spend

864
00:44:10,440 --> 00:44:13,680
Speaker 4: on awareness and casual sports fans. There's two hundred and

865
00:44:13,680 --> 00:44:16,440
Speaker 4: sixty million in the US. When we launched the PLL,

866
00:44:16,520 --> 00:44:18,759
Speaker 4: we had fifteen million lacross fans in the US. Now

867
00:44:18,760 --> 00:44:22,000
Speaker 4: we have forty six million, scorting to an MRI Simmons report.

868
00:44:22,200 --> 00:44:26,279
Speaker 4: That's in just five years of operating. So we'll do this,

869
00:44:26,280 --> 00:44:29,400
Speaker 4: this this all the way through LA twenty eight. Which

870
00:44:29,560 --> 00:44:32,360
Speaker 4: one more stat When I started playing, there were eighteen countries.

871
00:44:32,400 --> 00:44:33,439
Speaker 4: Now there are ninety two.

872
00:44:33,760 --> 00:44:43,040
Speaker 1: Wow, all right, we're going to do our rapid fire now.

873
00:44:43,400 --> 00:44:47,480
Speaker 1: A lot of pressure, a lot of pressure. Keep it tight. Okay,

874
00:44:47,800 --> 00:44:52,640
Speaker 1: all right? What's one word to describe your deal making style? Compassionate?

875
00:44:53,560 --> 00:44:57,640
Speaker 3: What's more important to you? Instant gut or data gut?

876
00:44:57,760 --> 00:45:02,400
Speaker 1: Who's your dream deal making partner? Mark Cuban? Good one?

877
00:45:02,560 --> 00:45:05,200
Speaker 1: What's the best deal you've ever made? The next one.

878
00:45:06,560 --> 00:45:09,000
Speaker 1: What's the best piece of advice you've received on deal

879
00:45:09,080 --> 00:45:09,840
Speaker 1: making your business?

880
00:45:10,640 --> 00:45:13,840
Speaker 4: I think actually from Alex and making sure that everyone

881
00:45:13,920 --> 00:45:17,000
Speaker 4: feels a little pain and they also see the big

882
00:45:17,040 --> 00:45:19,560
Speaker 4: picture of why they're letting go of something for something

883
00:45:19,640 --> 00:45:20,120
Speaker 4: much bigger.

884
00:45:20,800 --> 00:45:23,480
Speaker 3: What's the worst piece of advice? And don't say Jason,

885
00:45:23,520 --> 00:45:27,400
Speaker 3: please win the deal, Win the deal, Win the deal.

886
00:45:28,640 --> 00:45:30,600
Speaker 2: What's your hype song before you go into a big

887
00:45:30,640 --> 00:45:31,640
Speaker 2: meeting or negotiation?

888
00:45:32,000 --> 00:45:34,840
Speaker 4: I fall back to nineties rock honestly, Like I listened

889
00:45:34,840 --> 00:45:39,840
Speaker 4: to Rage against the Machine before workouts. Still, but before

890
00:45:39,880 --> 00:45:42,359
Speaker 4: a meeting, like I didn't listen to Rage walking into this?

891
00:45:42,560 --> 00:45:45,640
Speaker 1: Okay? I try, yeah, I try.

892
00:45:46,000 --> 00:45:50,080
Speaker 4: You know what I'll say that try to listen to

893
00:45:50,120 --> 00:45:55,400
Speaker 4: something that has to do with the meeting in advance. Huh,

894
00:45:55,480 --> 00:46:00,920
Speaker 4: I countlessly, whether it's interviews or pitches. I've picked up

895
00:46:01,000 --> 00:46:04,920
Speaker 4: something in the last minute walking into the door that

896
00:46:05,040 --> 00:46:06,920
Speaker 4: was seminal to closing it interesting.

897
00:46:07,920 --> 00:46:10,680
Speaker 3: Take lacrosse out. There's only one sport you can watch

898
00:46:10,680 --> 00:46:11,760
Speaker 3: for the rest of your life.

899
00:46:11,960 --> 00:46:14,840
Speaker 1: Which one is it? I'd call it football, but the

900
00:46:14,840 --> 00:46:15,880
Speaker 1: English Premier League.

901
00:46:16,719 --> 00:46:18,840
Speaker 2: Okay, what team do you want to see win a

902
00:46:18,920 --> 00:46:23,360
Speaker 2: championship more than any The Boston Cannons my first team,

903
00:46:23,480 --> 00:46:26,640
Speaker 2: first team and revived now for the New York Blo.

904
00:46:27,280 --> 00:46:30,040
Speaker 3: A fun fact about yourself that your colleagues will be

905
00:46:30,080 --> 00:46:31,320
Speaker 3: surprised to hear about.

906
00:46:33,680 --> 00:46:36,920
Speaker 1: I'm a failed musician. Ooh, that's a good one.

907
00:46:36,960 --> 00:46:39,680
Speaker 4: I've always wanted to play. I've tried to play the piano. Well,

908
00:46:39,760 --> 00:46:41,440
Speaker 4: you used to get lessons when I was younger. I've

909
00:46:41,440 --> 00:46:43,279
Speaker 4: tried to pick up the guitar as an adult, watch

910
00:46:43,320 --> 00:46:46,520
Speaker 4: YouTube videos. Just haven't been able to get the and

911
00:46:46,560 --> 00:46:49,239
Speaker 4: even drums, like as an athlete. I'm embarrassed to say,

912
00:46:49,239 --> 00:46:51,080
Speaker 4: because you think we're really well coordinated, I just can't

913
00:46:51,120 --> 00:46:55,200
Speaker 4: figure out the multi movements of music. So you guys

914
00:46:55,239 --> 00:46:58,839
Speaker 4: can bet that it won't be musician in there.

915
00:46:58,920 --> 00:47:03,920
Speaker 1: At some point. Paul Rabel failed musicians next time on

916
00:47:04,000 --> 00:47:07,239
Speaker 1: the Deal. This has been really fun. Thank you, thank

917
00:47:07,280 --> 00:47:12,120
Speaker 1: you good. I started sweating on the rapid Fire.

918
00:47:12,280 --> 00:47:15,319
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, listen, pressure and its psychology.

919
00:47:15,360 --> 00:47:18,000
Speaker 4: Man, I learned that too, by the way, is that

920
00:47:18,360 --> 00:47:22,240
Speaker 4: you know your body. You feel nerves in big moments.

921
00:47:22,960 --> 00:47:24,879
Speaker 4: And I remember John Elliott tell me it's a good thing.

922
00:47:25,600 --> 00:47:27,960
Speaker 4: He's like, if you're not feeling it, he was like, whoa.

923
00:47:28,600 --> 00:47:29,080
Speaker 1: I thought.

924
00:47:29,520 --> 00:47:31,879
Speaker 4: He was like, no, no, don't say nervousness. That means

925
00:47:31,880 --> 00:47:35,239
Speaker 4: you're not prepared. Nerves are bodies as athletes were walking

926
00:47:35,360 --> 00:47:35,680
Speaker 4: on the field.

927
00:47:35,719 --> 00:47:36,279
Speaker 1: He heats up.

928
00:47:37,000 --> 00:47:41,319
Speaker 4: That's our muscle fibers and twitching beginnings so that when

929
00:47:41,320 --> 00:47:43,239
Speaker 4: a defender is coming at me to take my head off,

930
00:47:43,280 --> 00:47:44,920
Speaker 4: I can react and dodge by him.

931
00:47:45,040 --> 00:47:45,400
Speaker 1: Yeah.

932
00:47:45,960 --> 00:47:49,240
Speaker 4: And that's just the feeling that you're feeling, right, And

933
00:47:49,560 --> 00:47:53,719
Speaker 4: that was a change of framing, which if I didn't

934
00:47:53,719 --> 00:47:56,200
Speaker 4: give that answer on one of those rapid Fire questions,

935
00:47:56,239 --> 00:48:00,880
Speaker 4: I'm sure it's like frame differently and always optimistically.

936
00:48:01,280 --> 00:48:04,879
Speaker 1: M beautiful here the man. Thank you so much, Thanks

937
00:48:04,880 --> 00:48:05,160
Speaker 1: you guys.

938
00:48:11,520 --> 00:48:15,319
Speaker 5: The Deal is a production from Bloomberg Podcasts and Bloomberg Originals.

939
00:48:15,719 --> 00:48:18,800
Speaker 5: The Deal is hosted by Alex Rodriguez and Jason Kelly.

940
00:48:19,280 --> 00:48:24,640
Speaker 5: Our producers are Anamazarakus, Stacy Wong, Lizzie Phillip, and Victory Veyees.

941
00:48:25,200 --> 00:48:29,160
Speaker 5: Original music and engineering by Blake Maples. Our managing editor

942
00:48:29,239 --> 00:48:33,200
Speaker 5: is David E. Ravella. Our executive producers are Jason Kelly,

943
00:48:33,680 --> 00:48:40,160
Speaker 5: Brendan Francis Newnham, Jordan Opplinger, Trey Shallowhorn, Kyle Kramer, Andrew Barden,

944
00:48:40,600 --> 00:48:45,000
Speaker 5: Kelly Laferrier, and Ashley Hoenig. Sage Bauman is our head

945
00:48:45,040 --> 00:48:50,680
Speaker 5: of podcasts, Additional support from Rachel Scaramazzino and Elena Los Angeles.

946
00:48:51,440 --> 00:48:55,360
Speaker 5: Joshua Devaux is our director of photography. Rubob Shakir is

947
00:48:55,400 --> 00:48:59,840
Speaker 5: our creative director. Art direction is from Jacqueline Kessler. Casting

948
00:49:00,080 --> 00:49:04,840
Speaker 5: by Julia Manns. Our associate producer is Natasha Abbilard. Camera

949
00:49:04,880 --> 00:49:09,839
Speaker 5: operation by Ryan Cavatero, Jesse Ridner and Suma Hussein. Our

950
00:49:09,840 --> 00:49:13,400
Speaker 5: gaffer is Alex Brown, and our grip is Max Garstak.

951
00:49:14,080 --> 00:49:18,040
Speaker 5: Our production assistant is Gabriella Demataes. Katia Vanoy is our

952
00:49:18,120 --> 00:49:22,000
Speaker 5: video editor. Listen to the Deal on Apple Podcasts, Spotify,

953
00:49:22,280 --> 00:49:25,080
Speaker 5: or wherever you get your podcasts. You can also tune

954
00:49:25,120 --> 00:49:28,640
Speaker 5: into the Video Companion on Bloomberg Originals and on Bloomberg TV.

955
00:49:29,360 --> 00:49:30,160
Speaker 5: Thanks for listening.